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on a free Q and A. Today, got a great
show for you. As always, there's always good news and
bad news out there in Cougar Country, especially during the
off season. I've said it many times. Look, these are
there's a great young man down at b YU there
really is. It's a unique and singular environment full of
good fruits. Uh and uh and and we we herald that,
we herald the heroes of the grid iron and on
the hardwood. But they do fall short, and sometimes they
fall short in such a way that makes you a
little bit uh, you know, disappointed or you know, just
taken back by some of the directions. So we're gonna
break it down. You heard the news yesterday about Parker Kingston.
We're gonna get into that and much more here on
your Utah ESPN Radio network. But we're also gonna talk ball.
We're also gonna talk basketball football, but we'll get into
some of the controversy that's swirling around Brigham right now
in Parker Kingston. So stay tuned, don't go anywhere. Lots
of news and notes to get to make sure you
keep the dial in at that one oh three nine FM,
dow and you Dot County, the ninety eight point three
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you all the all the news and odes coming out
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We appreciate it. When you do, you can follow me
on exit Crital Benjamin, follow us at ESPN the Fan
without further ado. Why don't we fire up to the
ESPN the Fans starting lineup and I can introduce you
to my co host and the rest of the star
start of cast. Joining is for this beautiful Thursday, February
twelveth edition of Cougar Sports. For and foremost the architect
behind the glass, the puppeteer, if you will, we got
Ronald the three man weaver stepping up to the mic.
Was up, Ronnie, what's up? Ben?
Speaker 2: You said it?
Speaker 4: I just want people to know we we didn't avoid
the Parker news. I know I got pinged. We found
out late in an interview in one of our shows.
I'm the architect of the show. I waited till today
so we have more time. I'm not gonna have a
press bind to talk about something that's not gonna give
us more time because we had literally five minutes of
our time left.
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, sorry, you know, like it broke right at
the end of the interview and we're like, okay, like
we got we got very little time fun of procession.
So we we we we were able to get it
all and we got more information now too. When something
breaks like this, you don't have a ton of information
and then you start to speculate. We got a little
bit more information now we'll delve into it here on
your Utah ESPN Radio Network. We got also Brett always
bring the Hammer Hammertime show. What's up Hammertime? Oh? Here
we go? There, there we go, and I ast you
we got you all right here. So this has happened.
Speaker 5: I think this is the third time now in the
last year of this show where we've had an unfortunate
allegation pop up. And you know me, the reason I
love sports because I love the positivity, I love the
fun I love getting to be away from the serious.
So I've decided from now on, going forward, my job
a new segment on this show.
Speaker 3: I haven't come up with the name for it. I
came up with it last minute.
Speaker 5: But I've just decided that going forward, I'm gonna bring
something positive to the table before we have to talk serious.
Speaker 3: If that's okay with them. Of course, we had a
little positivity. Give me that Oreo Oreo sandwich. I had
Oreo cookie baby.
Speaker 5: So I don't know how positive this is for this individual,
but it's pretty interesting for the rest of us. I
don't know if you guys have seen this, but we
saw something in the Olympics this week that I've never
seen before in the history of athletics.
Speaker 3: I don't know if you guys saw this.
Speaker 5: This has come from Norway's Storla Holme Lagrit. He won
the bronze medal in the twenty kilometer by athlone, and
in his post race interview from the Podum podium, he said,
and I quote, six months ago I met the love
of my life person and three months ago I made
the biggest mistake of my life and cheated on her.
So he announced to the world from the podium after
winning the bronze belt, didn't even win silver or gold.
He's like, well, I'm already a loser because I didn't
win gold, so I may as well just announce to
everybody that I cheated on my girlfriend. First of all,
PSA to everyone. There's something called oversharing, and if you
do it, or someone you know overshares, please share this
with him. We don't need to know this. We don't care.
And also, I don't think Look if I was cheated
on and the individual went and then just announced it
from the podium, I don't know that that makes me go, oh, you.
Speaker 3: Know what, You're so brave. You know what that makes
me think? Man, you can't keep anything to yourself.
Speaker 5: It's a good thing we're not together, because you would
have told everybody everything.
Speaker 3: So pretty incredible.
Speaker 5: Did this man use the podium at the twenty twenty
six Winter Olympics to tell everyone that he cheated on
his girlfriend? Also, you met the love of your life
and you cheated three months in that. I have a
lot of questions about the timeline, how in love you were.
I got a lot of questions about this guy, and
I don't think it's bravery. I think it's stupidity and that,
my friends, is hammer highlights brought to you.
Speaker 3: But you know, honestly, like when you go into like
and we're gonna talk about sexual TRANSGRESSI aggressions today, that's
what we're gonna talk about. I honestly did not plan that. Yeah. Well,
what I'm saying is like that you can ruin your
life through like if you didn't learn from a great
mentor like and they didn't instill fear into your heart
in some way, or you didn't learn through the scriptures,
or you didn't lose or didn't you didn't learn from
like other people making mistakes about sexual transgressions, you may
get yourself into a situation where you ruin your life,
right like those who don't learn history are doom to
repeat it exactly. It's like man, like I can't tell you,
like you know, young adulthood reading like the story of
David was a hero. David slayed Goliath. He was humble,
he was hungry, he was he was out there you know,
slay and beasts protecting the sheep. And then with his
faith he slayed the the goliath and then became king.
And then due to his lascivious nature, fell from grace
and essentially murdered someone so that he could obtain uh
a a a prize in his mind. Uh. And ultimately,
you know, it's just like if you can't learn through history,
I hope that you know, you know, we can, we
can stop having these conversations. But it is the it
is the nature of men. I guess that the natural
man is an enemy to God. And my heart goes
out to everybody that is impacted by this news.
Speaker 1: Uh.
Speaker 3: But let justice be served and grace be given by
the Almighty on the back end. But justice be served
in the temporal state. In my opinion, if Porker Kingston
is found guilty of this but innocent until proven guilty
as well, Let's welcome in AP Andrew Peterson to the show. AP.
How you living, buddy, I'm living. I'm living pretty good.
I count so many blessings.
Speaker 6: I will I count my many blessings and in my
life recently so so I got married like three months ago,
all right, so you get like newlywed.
Speaker 3: There's a new aur about. Wait, well, you get like.
Speaker 6: The newly weed ten pounds, right, I've gained like and
then I go on a cruise and I gain like
ten pounds there, and then my wife is pregnant, so
I gained like simpy the wait.
Speaker 3: And so I realized one.
Speaker 6: Monday, I am about to get bigger than I ever
have in my life, and I go for a run
to make myself feel better about it.
Speaker 3: That time, I'm going to make you feel better going.
Speaker 6: Well, it's the first time I've moved with any purpose
in like five years, okay, the first time I've run
the mile with the intention of running a mile. The
last time I ran the mile was it was in
high school and I ran like a five forty five mile.
So it's it's it's pretty good, it's pretty good. Well,
I get back from my mile run and I do
not feel good because my time was horrid time.
Speaker 3: It was like over eight and a half minutes. It
was not it was not.
Speaker 6: Going from five to forty five to like eight forty
five is not good, see I.
Speaker 3: And then I woke up, so I never had so fail.
Speaker 6: Well, okay, So so you feel a little bit down
about that and you're like, wow, we really got to
get back into shape. And then you wake up the
next morning and you feel way worse because you destroyed.
Speaker 3: Your back on the run. Brethren.
Speaker 6: If my advice to any listening that are currently still
in shape is to stay in shape and don't get
out of shape, and.
Speaker 3: Don't try if you've been out of shape, just go walk, hey,
Kyle Collins would tell you, Hey, just go for a walk.
Go for like an hour long walk. Don't do like
interval sprints. Don't go for a mile run. Just the
easier at least at least into it. Man, it's some
proper stretches.
Speaker 6: I stretched for like forty five seconds, and that that
was a good.
Speaker 3: Power walk is underrated. Like we get after it like
a good power walk. You'll get some high cardiovascular output
with a nice power walk. Da. I'm telling you, I'll
teach you the ways. I am not an aggressive worker
out anymore. I just don't do not do it. I
keep it keep it easy, keep it easy, taking it easy. Well,
ap appreciate you being here. Glad you're getting back into
shape as well. It's always difficult. It's always a difficult
thing to do. Shout up to Vic Craham on the
data aggregation and newsletter. Check out the rest of our
esp and the fans starting lineup. Appreciate everyone that's going
to be joining us today to give us some content
and conversation. We're gonna welcome into the show a slew
of guests. Darneld Dixon's going to join us at four
or five at the Daily Hill for a little cougar
beat action. Don't want to movese to that. We love
double D. Joe Holloway. He's going to talk about stats,
use as CPA and well strategiest over at Vanderwelt. We're
going to talk about some of the stats of the
day with him and get into the financial stat financial
stats as well. Preston and Garrett Handy a little Handy
and Handy sportscore. We're going to get a lawyer's opinion
on the Parker Kingston situation. All of the details that
have been currently reported and distributed. We'll tell you They're
gonna break down what the situation is from a legal
standpoint and what the next steps will be for Parker
Kingston who's currently being held without bail. Mark Johnson will
join us at five thirty for a little no the
Faux segment. Get your privacags ready for that by you
call it out of buffs basketball head to head in
the Marriott Center. So that'll be at five thirty and
we'll delve into as I mentioned, all the news and
notes of the day. That's your ESPN starting lineup, brought
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VIP products VP service VP discounts. When the news broke
about Parker Kingston yesterday, I penned a little piece on Twitter.
I'm going to read that to you right now. There
is some updates here, but I'm just going to kind
of give you my initial thoughts as I was perusing
through all of the info in conversing with individuals that
I trust regarding the occurrences leading up to Parker Kingston's arrest,
So I said this BAU wide receiver. Park Parker Kingston
was arrested in Washington County, Utah. He was charged with
first degree founding rape in connection with an alleged incident
that occurred on February twenty third, twenty twenty five, in
Saint George, just over just under a year ago. The
charge follows a year long investigation by the Saint George
Police Department, which included the collection and review of forensic evidence,
digital evidence, and witness interviews before the case was presented
to the Washington County Attorney's Office for charging review. The
length of the investigation, in my personal opinion, reflects the
reality that cases of this nature often take time to develop.
Investigators typically wait for lab results, analyze digital communications and
location data, and conduct multiple interviews before prosecutors determined whether
there is sufficient evidence to establish probable cause and s
and arrest warrant. We now know that those interviews, even
with Parker Kingston, did occur, and Parker Kingston claimed that
all sexual relations were consensual. So in this case, authorities
ultimately move forward with an arrest warrant, signaling that the
prosecutors okay, believe the evidentiary threshold has been met to
file charges and to arrest him. Kingston's currently being held
without bail. He will have an arraignment on Friday. At
that time, bail may be set and he may be
released at that time. I believe the reason why he
is held without bail is the prosecutors believe that he
is a flight risk. Now I don't know if that's justified,
but that's the reasoning behind it. But per some I've
spoken with, this fact does underscore how serious the court
is treating the charge at this early stage. And as
I mentioned, there's some bail determinations still to be sequenced out.
Pre Trialed attention without bail is generally reserved for serious
falony cases and could reflect the confidence some of these prosecutors.
The prosecutor has in the initial court proceedings. He's scheduled
to appear and we'll see how it plays out on Friday,
just a day away now from that. Brigham Young University
did acknowledge the arrest and issued the following statement. The
way you became aware today of the arrest, this was
yesterday of Parker Kingston. The university takes any allegation very
seriously and will cooperate with law enforcement. And then, due
to federal and university privacy laws and practices for students,
the university will not be able to provide additional comment
there is I'm trying to think of what other additional
news has dropped since then, but essentially what we know.
There was a few documents that were apparently distributed recently.
Police say Kingston went to the twenty year old woman's
residence Okay at this back in February twenty twenty five,
during the early morning hours of February twenty third, twenty
twenty five. Charging documents do not say how Kingston and
the woman knew each other, or if they were previously acquainted.
The woman told police that prior to his arrival and
during their online communication, she told Kingston multiple times that
she did not want to have sex with him, and
if that was the reason he wanted to meet up,
he should not come. She disclosed that she set clear
boundaries with Kingston prior to their meetup. The charges state
after arriving at the woman's residence, the two watch the movie.
While watching the movie, they began to engage in some
so you know, i'd say, you know, question mark sexual activity.
We do not know what that means. Okay, it says
some sexual activity. What does that mean? Is that kissing?
Is that necking? Is that heavy petting? Is that, you know,
some other sexual activity? You know, it's it's subjective there.
Kingston then started to fall asleep for the report, and
the women left the room to get ready for bed.
When she returned approximately fifteen minutes later, Kingston initiated sexual
activity again. She stated that she told Kingston to stop
several times and tried to push him off of her,
but he continued, the charges alleged. The woman reported the
alleged assault four days later to police after going to
Saint George Regional Hospital. Now we don't know the sequencing
of that. Either we don't know the dates, like how
soon after the alleged rape, how quickly she went to
Saint George Regional Hospital, but four days later she contacted
the police. Detectives with the Saint George Police Department then
got her digital and forensic evidence. They also conducted interviews
with the parties involved and other witnesses. The information was
then turned over to the Washington County Attorney's Office for review.
According to the County Attorney's Office, she met with the
Washington County Attorney's Office in June for another interview. When
Kingston was questioned about by investigators, he said all activity
with the woman was consensual. Based on communications obtained from
Kingston's cell phone after the incident, it can be inferred
that he went to her apartment with the intention of
having sexual intercourse. So there was obviously conversations had between
the two and his intent was to have sexual intercourse
with her. And I already mentioned the Brigham Young University comments,
But that's the I mean. Is there any other data
points that you're aware of? Ronald Brett always bring the
hammer ap any other notes.
Speaker 5: The one thing I do want to add is that
these so it says in its artically a reading from
the core documents were unsealed. So there's been a lot
of people saying, well, if b Yu knew about this,
why did they let it go on?
Speaker 3: YadA, YadA, YadA. It's very difficult to know who was
aware of what.
Speaker 5: The only contact we know about is that investigators interviewed
parties involved.
Speaker 3: We don't necessarily know who that was. But typically in
investigations like this, they're confidential, meaning that the only people
who have access to these documents and truly know about
the investigation are the investigators and the government parties involved.
So I've seen a lot of discourse on Twitter saying, people, Uh, well,
if b YU knew, why did they do something about this?
Speaker 5: Typically, investigators don't notify your employer or the university of
an impending investigation until that arrest has been made, So
we don't definitively know who, if anyone knew about this
investigation outside of law enforcement and those interviewed.
Speaker 3: Yeah, and and to that point, let's say there was
a report that was given to the school saying, hey,
you know, there's an investigation going on, and he could
you know, he's he's being investigative for rape, and at
that time does does school step in. I don't know
what the the processes are in place when there's a
report and there isn't necessarily evidence that is brought for
I mean, this is stealed documents that no charges are brought.
As the school say well you're being accused, you can
no longer attend school, then you're going off of accusations
and guilty at a lawsuit if it turns out he was,
well guilty guilty until proven innocent, you're guilty to prevent
because there's been someone that said that has accused you
of this, and even if it was if it was
a legal issue, it's like, hey, well he's under investigation,
but you know he hasn't been He has not been
you know, necessarily arrested for anything. Yet it's an investigation.
I don't know what the proper procedure is there is.
It pertains to b Yu, But b Yu, I think
through experience over the last thirty years, has taken more
of an approach of okay, just because someone is accused
of an honor code violation doesn't mean they are guilty.
They have in the past operated and I've seen it
many times in the post, Ernest L. Wilkinson era that
you are guilty until proven Edison right, that they you know,
the like I saw time and time again. I've had
people reach out to me about their anecdotal stories and
and I think they've realized that there wasn't really positive
fruits in that regard. It wasn't a good way to
approach honor code issues specifically, not legal issues necessarily, but
honor code issues. So any other other, any other notes
that we need to address, as far as the unsealed
documents or the the the data points that we are
aware of, guys.
Speaker 6: Any I think the other thing is b WA statements
said they became aware today.
Speaker 3: Yeah, exactly, and so well, I think that the haters,
that the people that don't like the church and don't
like BAU and they they're not going to believe anything
that but that is it's a cover.
Speaker 6: I don't know if that's been corroborated or or what
by law enforcement, but that is the statement that they
were made aware yesterday.
Speaker 5: Well, and had law enforcement come to the school officially
in an official capacity, why you would not be saying
we just found out about this.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 5: So I don't I don't think that's the case, because, honestly,
if if this was that big over the last year,
because again we hear rumors all the time, things we
don't know to be substantiated. I think somebody would have
heard about this even if it wasn't reported, and I
didn't hear anything rumors of any kind of So that's
what kind of makes me think that I don't know
how many people were involved here. But again we we
truly do not know outside of what is in these
documents that were unsealed yesterday when Parker was arrested.
Speaker 3: This as we I'll say about the entire incident. If
Parker Kingston raped this young lady, justice be served immediately,
maybe castigated, May he be receive his his uh, his
punishment immediately, and and it's going to be I mean,
this is serious. This is you know, five to fifteen
I mean years in prison or more. You're a registered
sex offender, and this in many ways can ruin you know,
he's he if he has found guilty, it's kind of
ruined some of his his temporal life. Now there's grace,
there is there's a path forward, there is there is
a redemption, and you can still live a long and
healthy and productive life. And I don't believe in ruining
people for their entire life. You know, there has to
be new, There's got to be more details. Given you
have to go through the judicial process, you need to
be judged before a jury of your peers, et cetera.
Like all of those things that need to happen, we
need more details. We need to know what happened, why
it happened, as many details as possible. Rape cases are very,
very difficult, Okay. There's a reason why high level rape cases.
Over the last twenty five years, there's been plenty of
rape allegations okay, and men exonerated okay, And there was
falsified claims and things that nature. That ary what could
be the issue. But if he has found guilty and
there is a burden of proof that shows that he
raped her, he needs to be dealt with. I am
a father of a young daughter two years. I can't
even imagine the grief that I'd be going through and
what type of justice I would want to in a
vigilante way try to wield. So my heart breaks for
everyone involved. You know, if I was a father of
a son who was arrested for felony rape. As a father,
I'd be where did I go wrong? How did I
not teach him? How how did I how did I
not you know, communicate to stay out of these situations? Right,
So I'm trying to put myself in an empathetic, sympathetic way,
into the shoes of everyone involved and trying to understand, Hey,
what happened, Why did it happen? But ultimately, I'm an
accountability guy, and there must be if he's if he
is held or if he is found guilty. Man justice,
I want it wielded, and I want to wield it swiftly,
and that accountability needs to be brought down in a
fierce and judicious manner in my opinion.
Speaker 4: So to give a little bit of more of the updates,
and again you have to make sure you got credible
time LISSNS source and this is Olivia keller Hert, who
is a reporter for KUTV News.
Speaker 2: She just lists outs to date.
Speaker 4: If you go to our Twitter page, I'm not gonna
list all the date she does say this Ben. She said,
it's some point in the time from Saint George p
D contact the b au Campus Police and they executed
search warrants. She's like, I've reached out to multiple people
at the university, including the chief of police, to ask
when was that no response yet, So at some point,
you know, because she put out that the Washington County
Police and the BYU she confirmed that with them, that
the BOU Campus police were aware of the allegations and
assisted the police Department of Saint George and gather information
and getting search warrants. I just didn't want that information
to be missed and that we don't know what those
dates are yet, but there are people who are asking
for that information about that.
Speaker 3: They they're they're they're trying to figure out the the
timeline of events when b YU or BYU police were made.
Speaker 5: No, right, we don't know what the law enforcement informs
the university because again it's it's very common practice for
law enforcement to be aware of this, but they don't
typically contact the university. Now they are BOU campus police,
so again we don't that's that's pretty close, but it
is normal for law enforcement.
Speaker 3: That point.
Speaker 4: There is one piece of information, you know, being that
she had said and that you know, we are looking
forward to for the future. She says, there are messages
previously of and again this was a sealed document of
her stating that she did not want to participate in
having sex. It sounds like they have information of Parker
afterwards and it can be inferred as it said in
the article. I'm interested to know when that information of
those messages and timelines will come out, because if she
has that evidence of stating I did not want to participate,
that is going to add another layer to.
Speaker 2: This this case if that were to be proven.
Speaker 4: Because they said that they have timeline messages of Parker's messages,
I'm waiting to see when those messages of her being
released with Parker from before of this meet up. Again,
and the point I want to make with this is
this sucks for everybody involved. My prayers to the woman,
the alleged victim, to Parker, to his family. I mean, look,
right like it sucks to hiss a parent to probably
have your you know, kid arrested and then you can't
see like, that's a tough thing, right, And I'm not
trying to minimize anything that happen, but for parents in
this situation, that's tough, right, Your son, your daughter, You
never want to see them go through anything hard. No
one wants to see that. But I do have to
say this been and this is going to be. I
hope this doesn't come off too harsh. The honor code
was broken, you know. And and I go back to
that again, you know last year with the Jake thing. Again,
I reemphasize if like that would that that's that That's
the biggest.
Speaker 2: Thing I notice here.
Speaker 4: If whatever this comes out, if you know, justin if
he did it, obviously the justice system and do process
will play it stuff out, which we have to let
But whatever it comes out to be.
Speaker 2: And Jake's was civil, this is criminal. You know from
what we're.
Speaker 4: Reading, there's gonna be some form of punishment because the
honor coat was broken.
Speaker 3: You know.
Speaker 4: So you're looking from a bus to point that standpoint.
Speaker 3: Understand that Parker Kingston is not going to be playing
football for b YU not Do I think he's going
to be playing college football this season.
Speaker 2: I would have to agree with that.
Speaker 3: Like I I don't. I don't think that that's that's
going to happen, and nor should it set your house
in order. And uh, but at the same time, like look,
you know, let let a juror peers and let the
judicial process play itself out and let's see what evidence
will be brought forth. And uh and I'm sure that
the media. This is a high profilecation, especially in the
state of Utah, and national media has taken it as well.
We've seen it on ESPN, We've seen it across to
even maybe NFL reporters, et cetera. Why because Parker Kingston
was an NFL prospect. Okay, he's a really good college
football player. He was the leading wide receiver coming back
for BYU. He was likely going to have a thousand
yard season next year. He was just shy this year. Yeah,
it's the potential was great. He was going to be
that guy, that dude for the b AU offense to
to to legion and be your punt return specialists as well.
Like he's dynamic, he's a great football player. And uh
and and and it's unfortunate, uh that poor decision making
has led to uh, you know, possibly possibly ruining his
not only his his his football career, but his temporal
life as he knows it now. Like I said, like,
there's always a path forward. And I think the world,
I think humans in general, I think we're forgiving when
there is contriteness and humbleness and learning through your failures. Right.
I think there's a there's a lot of grace there
amongst the human population for that, for that forgiveness. But yeah,
he's he's not he's not playing for b y U
and he's probably he's not playing college football. Uh. And
I don't know how how expeditiously a a trial can
be set for this, and when when a judge and
jury would would come to a conclusion on this. I
don't know how quickly this can be done or when
will it be done, But it needs to be done right.
It needs to be done in in the the proper
procedural manner, under the laws of the land. And I
think we we we all kind of uh you know,
in unison and say, hey, we're praying for all everyone involved,
and we want the right thing to happen going forward.
We want the right thing to happen for the victim,
the alleged victim, to her family, uh, for for Parker
and his family. We just want justice to be served.
We want truth to be brought forth. The truth shall
shall set you free. And uh, there's some yeah, there's
some some nuances here. Uh, there's no doubt there's there there.
We don't have all of the information right now, but
as it stands right now, like I said, the prosecutors
feel very confident. They haven't they had it, had the
evidentiary threshold had been reach to have they warrant uh
issued for his arrest. They feel confident in that. We'll
see how it plays out in the in the days
and weeks to come. Uh but uh our heartfelt prayer
prayers to everybody involved. But justice be served, and justice
be served swiftly, and may truth come come forth, because
I think that's all we're looking for right now. We
want pure transparency and unfortunately, in these rape cases, it
can many times become a he said, she said, situation.
You know that, And that's what we find. And it's
it's I mean, we'll have we'll have some people on
throughout the next couple of days and into the next
few weeks about these high profile cases. We have a
plethora of them to go through of alleged grape. Some
of them were were accused and found guilty and and
some of them were were found not guilty and exonerated.
And it's still even when you're exonerated, it's still it
still goes with you like people will remember and so
uh you hope it all turns out in my opinion
the justice, justice will be served in, truth will be
held up. That's what you hope. As much data and
information as we can have publicly from the media standpoint,
we'll go to break guys. But I wanted to remind
you guys, let's talk a little positivity here. We love
a little bit entertainment. That's why we talk sports. As
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Checking out today at royal Army dot com. One of
the things I think we all want to broach right
now is is the messaging that needs to be articulated
and ultimately the honor code enforcement. I guess of student
athletes that are the brand ambassadors of the university in
many ways, right when Brocko Mannhal called the student athletes
of BYU the flag bearers of the university. When you're
a flag bearer, what does that mean. It means you're
a face, You're a leader. You're supposed to lead out
in the right way. And probably too many times over
the years. I mean even when I was there at
BYUKA and even prior to arriving at b there was
a rape scandal in two thousand and four that I
don't know if you guys are aware of it. It
was massive, it was it was jarring. Now many of
these men, by the way, were exonerated. They ended up
finding out that you know, some of this was it
was consensual and but the lies were ruined. Right. It
was a high profile rape case. So you know this
has happened before, but you know, what should the messaging
be to the student athletes going forward. We've had three
high profile issues recently with honocode violations from high profile players.
You have to Jake Retslow situation with a civil rape
accusation UH premarital relations which is an Honor Code infringement UH.
And then you have the duy with Connard Davis Junior.
And now you have Parker Kingston, another high profile player
with a felony rape charge. This is not good. This
is not good for for for the institution that holds
itself in mission statements to a very high standard and
every student athlete and every student has to abide by this. Now,
when you're a flag bearer. When you are a flag bearer,
there is a higher standard. Okay, when you are getting
paid by the university on scholarship, and furthermore, when you're
getting paid from corporations through nil that are locally and
that are BYU advocates and corporate sponsorships, there is a
higher standard probably of behavior that needs to be held.
If you're employer, right, you represent right now as the
ESPN the Fan, Cougar Sports. We've been critical. Anything you say,
you know is a reflection of me. Yeah, you own
your own opinions, but it's also reflection on ESPN the Fan.
There are certain things that you have to you have
a standard of sc guidelines, yeah, SCC guidelines, and there's
certain things you can't do or else you're gonna be
held accountable for that. So it bakes the question what
what messaging are coaches, administrators, uh and others that are
involved in the athletic department saying to these student athletes.
Are they setting a tone of stringency. I don't want
a bunch of like fear mongering, right, but you have
to instill a little bit of like, look, this is
a serious thing. The honor code. In my opinion, I've
teld this time and time again. I've talked to my
friends about it. You know, my nephew's playing at BYU
right now. Okay, Danny or excuse me, Tommy, I mean
I'm talking Danny's his dad, right, Danny prasses. So I've
talked to Dan if like, look, the honor code, and
he grew up. You know around a lot of Latter
Day Saints, the Press family, not LDS, but he knows
kind of the stands of Hi'm like, look, the great
thing about the Honor Code is it should keep you
in a lane that that makes it so that you're
going to be temporarily successful. You want to grow up
real quick, sign up to be at BYU and play
sports and become an adult really quick, because it's going
to be about that action, that business. It's about business.
It's about getting work done. It's going to class, it's
going to football practice, it's lifting, it's eating, and then
staying out of trouble outside outside of like things like
a you know, like a professional would, right, and and
so I think there's so many positive temporal fruits to
the Honor Code. And I do believe in my opinion, Okay,
this is my philosophy. I think the temporal fruits in
this case are more important than the perceived righteous spiritual benefits.
A lot of people love to be righteous because I'm
looking good in front of Heavenly Father and Jesus. I'm
better than everybody. I'm righteous. There's a self righteous Ramiumpton
culture that is pervasive in many latter day saint homes. Okay,
I've seen it, I've experienced it. They just think they're
better than everybody else. I obey the word of wisdom
better than everybody else, and they believe they receive temporal
blessings before they receive blessings from it. I'm like, yeah,
doesn't make you any better. It doesn't make you any
better than anybody else. That some people need to touch
the hot pan to know that they don't want to
touch the hot pan, and other people can say, you
know what, I know, I don't want to touch that
hot band because I know it's not gonna have any
good benefit in my life. So to me, the Honor
Code is a safety net and it guides you so
that you have temporal stability and you don't have as
much chaos in your life. Look at the chaos that
Parker Kingston has brought into his life, the chaos that
Jake Redslock brought into his life, the chaos that Kennard
Davis Junior brought into his life because he did not
abide by the Honor Code. Instringency, and that's what I'm
talking about. You want to stay out of drama, You
want to stay out of trouble. The Honor Code is
a great way of doing that, and I do believe
we got to probably do a better job of communicating
to our student athletes that you are you are ambassadors
of the university, and the Honor Code is for your safety.
And it's also yeah, there is an you know, you're
you're representing our brand, you're representing our faith, and we
want you to abide by that. Not to say we
don't have Grayson and we don't want to forgive when
you fall short, but the standard, the bar is higher
than it is for others at the university. In my opinion.
Speaker 6: Well, I agree, and I have this to say. I
don't know how the Honor Code is enforced in the program.
I personally don't know. I'm not inside that program. But
I do think that there are some athletes who and
I want to stress this, I think the majority are
great people and and do very well. But I do
think that there is there's a portion of BYU student
athletes who do not think the Honor Code is a
serious thing, and I think there needs to be some
messaging that this is more than a piece of paper
you signed to be here, you actually have to live
by these standards. Okay, let's talk about something here. As
a normal student at b YU, which I am, the
tuition level, the tuition costs at BYU are significantly lower,
significantly lower than any other university. It could go to yep,
significant And in return, I am asked to live by
some standards, no doubt. And I think that's a fair
trade off because I am saving tens of thousands of dollars. Yes, Now,
if you're a student athlete, you're not just saving tens
of thousands of dollars in tuition.
Speaker 3: You still have to pay it. But you're getting paid
at b YU.
Speaker 6: And if we're to believe what's out there, and I do,
the price that you you're your value to be a
student athlete at b YU is pretty high. You get
paid well, not necessarily the best, but it's your market
rate and it's it's a handsome payment.
Speaker 3: And in return, you are asked to live by some standards,
no doubt. And it has to be more than a
piece of paper. It has to.
Speaker 6: This is to two rape allegations in a year for
a program, for any program is ridiculous.
Speaker 3: Yes, it's insanity.
Speaker 6: At BYU because you have signed those standards it's much.
It's a it's a bigger deal. It really is. Whether
that's right or not, it's a bigger deal. And so
I don't know what the enforcement levels are inside of
the programs, but I think the messaging needs to change
because you can't have this result and say that it
has to stay the same.
Speaker 3: Well, I think, I mean to your point about messaging,
Like I remember standing up as a missionary, for instance,
and citing certain things, right uh, you know, at at
zone conference, in district meetings and things of that nature.
These are like key tenets of missionary work and things
that know, on hollow hand, will stop the work from progression.
Moms may assemble County Wood, you know, all those things,
right uh. And like I think there we may need
to get into a point at BYU. You know, with
with all the things that you mentioned, all the temporal
benefits that you received by attending Brigham Young University, the
subsidization through ties and offering, and the education level is
very high, you know, what we need to start doing.
We may need to start reciting in honor code before class.
I hate to say it, but like you know, so
it's like embedded into your mind. This is this is
what you represent. When I had that that placard on
my chest as a missionary, you better believe, like a
number one, I felt empowered to go and preach the gospel. Right,
But also, how am I acting? How am I comporting?
Am I doing as Christ would? Does that make sense?
And I think there's a lot to be said about,
you know, being a BYU student and student athlete? Like
am I embodying what I signed up for? Am I
being a good example? You know? Because there is a
there's a it's important BYU has to, in my opinion,
take even a stronger more stringent stance on education of
what the honor Code's all about. Yeah, one hundred percent.
Speaker 5: I just whatever did or did not happen, it doesn't matter.
I hope and I and I say this primarily four
men because I am a man, But I just hope
everybody sees this and says, I I want to be smart.
I want to be smart number one, and I want
to be respectful. We were having this conversation beforehand.
Speaker 3: If if if something even feels like it might not
be consensual, I'm out. I'm out because not only almost
like I'm like, oh that she's not interested that's a
Bruce maygo. I'm like, I don't, I don't ever want
to Like we always say this, don't let it go
to a judge's decision. We say that in in UFC
and stuff.
Speaker 5: Right, like don't don't put yourself in a situation where
it can be he said. She said, and uh, you
bring up the point of like, well, you're being compensated,
keep the rules. It's more than that the rules are
not here for us to be able to say, ha ha,
we're the puppet master.
Speaker 3: We need to decide what choices you make. It's hey,
because look at all the cases.
Speaker 5: That we've had in the last year, none of them
were isolated incidents of somebody sitting.
Speaker 3: In their own room only bothering themselves.
Speaker 5: It's correct somebody else was affected by a choice that
was made. And we can hash all day about consensual
non consensual, but the point being you can't argue about
whether or not it was a Honor Code violation. It
absolutely was a violation. The question was whether or not
it was consensual. And so I just hope that maybe
some young men who were ibyu and who are on
the fence about you know, like I can get.
Speaker 3: Away with this, the honor Code, this, that, and the other.
Speaker 5: I hope they see this and they go, I just
want to be safe, and I want to be smart,
and I want to make good choices, and I don't
want to put any young woman in an uncomfortable position.
And that's why I'm gonna say, yeah, you know what,
the Honor Code may not be my favorite thing in
the world, but it keeps me safe and I don't
want to jeopardize my future. And I again, we don't
know whether this what is going to happen with Parker Kingston,
but to me, it doesn't matter. I hope every man woman,
I hope everybody sees this and says, you know what,
I just want to be smart and I want to
I want to do what's best for me in my future.
Speaker 3: No, I want to mom. The reason why I bring
up the temporal elements of this is because the students
of b YU are not stockaded as a student athlete would.
So like when I talk about the temporal nature of
it and being incentivized, and somebody like, look like you're
you're at the forefront, You're getting paid to represent the
university students. They're there like they're not getting paid to
be there, and you're on scholarship. You're on the Hinkley Scholarship.
I get it, Like, but they're not put forth in
a public light in front of millions of people saying like,
I represent b YU. Does that make sense? Nobody looks
at me, and well, I do. I do because I
know you and your part, But nobody is public said
one hundred percent. No, one's so Like when I talk
about the temporal nature of that, I'm saying, like, I
think student athletes have to be held to a higher
standards because of that. If you're a New York Yankee,
you have to dress a certain way. You can't. You
have to be clean shaven when you're in front of
the media. That's how it's always been. It's you're representing
an institution, a program, a business, and you don't have
to take the paycheck. You don't have to take it.
Are you already found that? One of the reason why A. J.
Debosa came to be yu y. He said, He's been
vocal like, hey, like, I like the honor code, right,
and you hope he lives up to it, right? You know,
I like the Book of Morning Class. You know? He
why because he wants to focus on the things that
actually return the best the best ROI for his life
and uh and so at any rate, I do think
it's important too to be much more aggressive and stringent
within the athletic department about what the Honor Code is
all about, because and really highlight you guys are ambassadors
and you're signing up to be a part of this institution.
And whether you're LDS or not LDS, it doesn't matter.
You're gonna be held to a higher standard.
Speaker 6: Well and not to not to you know, and insinuate
that there should be fear monitoring. But now you have
two data program points inside the program of what can
happen even if it is consensual, but you're breaking the
honor code. There's a reality, there's a market for this.
There is a market for this, the two data points
in a year. This is what happens, not maybe not
every When you.
Speaker 3: Say there's a market for this, what are you saying, Well.
Speaker 6: I'm saying at BYU, there is a market for exposing
an athlete.
Speaker 3: Oh yeah, yeah, as an honor code valley. Well, I
think there's an economy.
Speaker 6: I'm not saying a market for but I'm just saying
the likelihood that you will be exposed for breaking the
honor code, it's very high.
Speaker 3: Yeah, that's the point I'm trying to make. Yeah, even
if this let's turn out, let's say in your you
know what Hammertime was saying, if this turns out to
be a consensual, uh sex interaction between the alleged the
alleged twenty year old young lady in Saint George and
Parker Kingston, Let's say it comes out that way, there
was an incentive in some way, shape or form for
the for the young lady to expose him for an
honor code violation and alleged rape, just like there was
an incentive in the civil case with Jake Retslaw to
expose him even though there was you know, communication after
the the the purported rape, she wanted to hang out
with him again. You know, she stayed at his house
for an extended period of time after, Like, there was
an incentive for that. There's an economy for that. I guess,
I guess that's what That's what I'm saying.
Speaker 6: I want to be very clear, I am not insinuating
that's what's happened.
Speaker 3: How No, Yeah, and I know I'm not saying you
you are, but like at at at the at least
right that you at the very least, you're gonna expose
yourself to someone that is seeking some sort of gain
from you putting yourself in that situation.
Speaker 4: If I could hop in here, Ben and I just
think about this too, Like if you're a BYU athlete
or a student right in general, and especially for athletes,
you have a lot more to lose right now. Obviously, rape,
you know, you know, accused of alleged rapist is different,
but you're not at the universe of Utah. And I'm
gonna say this over the oware is you can't have
consensual sex and not have a reprimand if you're caught,
like that's just how it goes.
Speaker 2: Like Okay, let's say consensually.
Speaker 4: Okay, what's gonna happen If this is found out to
be consensual, He's now going to get suspended for how
many games?
Speaker 2: That's going to be the next thing.
Speaker 4: And like what Brett's pointing, what him and I were
talking about, is I learn it's kind of like the Gospel.
My testimony is I feel the spirit through other people's
testimony is validated often through other people's experiences that principle
applies to life. Ben, if you are now a student
athlete in there, whether you remember the church or not,
whether you whatever your reasons is, I'm not in your
I don't want to. I have nothing to do with
your dealings with God. I don't care to.
Speaker 2: But I will tell you this, which is a normal thing,
and it's an it's adult.
Speaker 4: Minded seeing your fellow man go through something that clicks
in my brain. If I do the same thing, I
could be in the same position. And that's just life
in general. Right, this should be a lesson now that
it's happened twice three times in the department, if you
go through something and if you are caught or if
something does happen, that you could also be subject to
the same thing. So I hope this is for anybody
student athlete, remember the church not that has thought about
maybe breaking the onticode after signing it. You know, whether
they are intentionally trying to do it or not. To
think twice now about this because now we've had both examples, right,
We've had someone out of the faith and someone of
the We've had two data points. Ben, you always tell
me something I've learned this lesson in my brain. I
need two or three data points.
Speaker 2: Well I have them.
Speaker 4: And I hope now that everybody in athletic department who
is an athlete understands that and sees it and just
will think twice. Maybe we do need to recite that. Look,
I came from my all boys school and we recited
to Creed every day before I went to class. Look,
maybe you recite the critionical look And that's not me
trying to be tongue of cheek and.
Speaker 2: Poke, but I'm being serious and remind you. But Brettna
had this conversation.
Speaker 4: Now that you've gone through this as athletic department and
you've seen your teammates, I am of the opinion of, like,
I want to go through that, so don't. I hope
that people just think twice now about what the consequences
could be of that, so they just don't put themselves
in that.
Speaker 2: And look, you could be doing nothing wrong.
Speaker 4: You could have a concent relationship with your girlfriend and
things right. But if you break you know a rule
that you have signed, there's going to be punishment. And
now that's the tough part is now Parker Kingston, whatever
the justice may be, if he did it, he'll go
away if he didn't feels consensual. He now has affected
his career, his football, this woman's family, his own family.
I want everybody to think about that going forward before
you make a decision, and look at the power of
social media is powerful. Ben Nothing we do now, regardless
you've been myself a p Brett, it's put on blasts
now in the world of twenty twenty six. And I
just want everybody to be cautious because what you say,
what you do, every tweet, every clip, now, everything behind
closed doors, it can affect your career for the rest
of your life.
Speaker 6: Well, it's true, and I just want I just think
that the reality is that I think there's a reality
that anyone that you're having like a one time hook
up with, which is what this seems to to and
Parker's mind is claiming to be it's a it's a
transaction that does not they do not have your best
interest at heart, and you are putting way too much
in their hands. And that's that is if if what
Parker is claiming is true, and I am not gonna
say that, there's just needs to they're just like Ron said,
you just need to be careful, especially when you sign
an honor code.
Speaker 3: Yeah, you mentioned the Olivia Kella hare tweet. So the
date of the alleged right with Parker Kingston. Let me
let me give like a quick you know, like closing
as it relates to the honor code. And I was
chatting with my buddy DP here he says, Look, if
you're gonna have a code and loudly and probably say
you have a code and hold yourself to a different
standard than yeah, it's it needs to be held to
a tighter and higher standard. Now I agree with that wholeheartedly.
Now what what you what happens when whenever you set
a bar that's high, those that dislike you are they
are primed and they they want to see you fail.
So if you're anti LDS or if you're anti b YU,
you're gonna find a way. And we've seen the incentivized
marketplace for this. Uh. I had boys go out to
the Salt Lake City and other places and if they
were in a interesting situation, guys, I'm like, you're gonna
get called out on this. Anybody that hates b YU,
you hates at the Latter Day Saints, They're they're gonna,
they're gonna call and report you for the Honor Code
violation that you're you're you're involved in, right, So I
do think there's an element that needs to be taken
account there, But like, yeah, if you're gonna set a
high standard and be proud about it, then there has
to be at least to me, it's about education. And
maybe some people would call it fear mongering, but there
has to be consistent messaging and a education about what
it is, what it means to be a bu y
U student athlete, and and you have to take a
very business like approach with it and hold them accountable.
And like I said, I don't necessarily want to be fearing. Look,
you're gonna ruin your life if you do this, if
you get in, if you if you engage in a
consensual sexual act with a woman, you're gonna ruin your
life because she could take that if it's too transactional,
she's gonna she's gonna go over to the Honor Code
and call you off, and she could coccuse you of
a rape. But that's really a serious situation, like that happens,
that can't happen. Does that make sense? So I don't
know exactly what the messaging needs to be but there
needs to be more education. DP goes on, I don't
even believe in some of the things that that the
Honor Code, you know, you know is asking there the
student athletes do. If you read through the Honor Code right,
you could be Christian, right and you could look at
it like no coffee, no tea is like I don't
believe in that, you know what I mean, like hot drinks?
Really come on, ease up, guys. So but you know,
he goes on. I do believe if you're gonna say
you're gonna do this, you should do it and be
held to it. Otherwise it's all fake, right, So if
you're gonna have a standard, try to live up to it.
I do think like it's very it's very nuanced, because
like it got to the point, guys, I'm telling you
where it became very sad. You sayical pharisyacal, like where
you're going to throw a stone at any sin and
you're gonna you're gonna publicly stockade student athletes. Do I
believe the foreign fashion in which we castigated and punish
Brandon Davis was the right way to do it, even
though he fell short because he had sex and had
a BA got a girl pregnant before the NCAA tournament
into in in twenty eleven. No, I don't don't think
it was the best way to approach that, Like that
was a consensual situation, right, like so yeah, like the
the details do matter to me and and the scriptures
say God look at upon the heart. I do think
intent is is is is is powerful? What was the intent?
And it's hard to judge intent. But I will say this,
much as I've spoken with the young men okay that
are in my my my sphere, and I talk to
them about intimacy and sexual relationships with with the opposite sex,
I tell them that you will feel empty. You will
do a disservice to your soul. I am telling you
if you transact your hormonal nature, meaning if you want
to get into if you just want some sort of
a release, and you transact that from a girl that
that that that just want it wants to be your boyfriend,
wants to marry you, like and you don't want anything
more than that than that transaction, you will be held
accountable in this life for the next and you're gonna
do a disservice to your soul. Now, I don't know
if that's a powerful enough message to get them to
stop or to like, you know, listen and not engage
in that stuff. But I'm telling you, man, there is
emptiness in that transaction. There is nothing enduring in that
nothing enduring. And so I like I am, I'm very
much you know, educationally based, but sometimes the fear mongering
of of of uh of a of a law of
Moses type of manner that changes behavior, like human nature
is what they are. Humans get get moved by incentives
or accountability. Baseline human nature. It's either an incentive or
it's accountability. The pure love of Christ and like we're
seeing another human as God would see them. Very few
people on earth know and experience that love and empathy
towards their fellow man. That's what the Sermon on the
Mount is all about. Christ was trying to teach us.
Very few really embody that what are we? We're tossed
to and fro by incentives and accountability. So sometimes you
maybe have to just get linear with it if you
want to avoid these things. So can I jump? Those
are my final thoughts on You bring up.
Speaker 4: A good point, I think, and I just want to
echo that, right, because I was talking about this last
night with my wife.
Speaker 2: Been you know, I have a daughter.
Speaker 3: You've met drewsy Bear.
Speaker 4: Anybody who's met drewsy love drewsey Bear, right, and if
that would happened to djerwsey Bear, I'm not gonna lie.
I might you might, I might not be spiritual, might
have to do some laying on of hands, you know, look,
because that's what that's a father speaking, right. But from
a standpoint, I remember this from a young age, and
I have three younger sisters, and I think this is
something that was drilled into me right in military parents.
They told me, you know, and taught me what the
consequences were of if a woman says no being in
the situation, even if it is consensual. They taught me
just both of that. Like I remember my mom came
to me at sixteen and had the whole bag. And
I'm being honest, I saying this, and I want people
to understand, like it's like, why do you have a
stuff about std A, condoms and all that. She's like,
I want you to understand the danger and the nature
of what could happen if you do such a thing
like the explaining the tea and maybe it was fear
monger right at sixteen're like, oh, I don't want to
you know, have a child at that age, right, But
what I learned being at that point of a young man,
and sometimes we have to teach this more. And what
they push was you need to understand who you are
as a man, your urges, where it's coming from, to
not make certain mistakes.
Speaker 2: Like the education.
Speaker 4: I think what you said is that, and I think
that is powerful teaching young men, letting them know, showing
them examples will.
Speaker 2: Help keep you out of that. It goes back to
my principal before.
Speaker 4: If I see someone else going to something like, okay,
you know, fear evil, avoid evil, right, I don't want
to participate in that because why would I want to
put myself in a bad situation. I think we have
to do a better job, not just with young men,
but all of our children, right, teach our daughters, Hey,
avoid this if you see this, right, these are the
things you do if you if this situation that comes.
But for as a young man that was taught right,
that had three younger sisters, It was drilled into my brain.
I think we need to do that too, are you
than our young men of like, there are consequences to
these things and you need to understand and if you don't,
you can be in these same situations not just if
you're accused, right if you were wrong, but also consentual.
I think both play a factor because of that, because
you bring up the Brandon Davies a consensual thing, and
still you can be publicly ridiculed because of that. I
think both of those matter because both are true. And
I just hope that that's the lesson of just don't
put yourself in a bad situation.
Speaker 3: What I'm trying to gain more clarity on it, and
we need to reach out to a few more sources here.
The date of the ELLECGT rape was two twenty three,
twenty twenty five. But was it reported to police or
did she report to Saint George's Regional Hospital on the
twenty seventh of February four days later? Does that make sense?
It did happen, I heard saying, and the article is
not super it's not clear. It's not clear of that.
Speaker 5: I do think it's saying that she went to the
police four days after, But in the article it says
that she went to the police four days.
Speaker 3: After after she'd been to the hospital. So don't know
when this is true. Yeah, so it's like four days
after an alleged rape and then you go to the
hospital and a rape kit is is is ultimately employed
and executed? Uh? That process? You know, I don't know
how forensic data is ultimately acquired through four days after
and how that works. Does that make sense? Typically you
want to do that immediately after in a an encounter
sexual encounter. So I don't know how that is ultimately
executed and how that that works. But I would like
more clarity on that so to to be determined. Hopefully
we get more data and more insight as it relates
to that. Uh that those particular elements of this case.
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