WEBVTT 1 00:00:04.480 --> 00:00:05.240 Just excuse me. 2 00:00:05.360 --> 00:00:08.039 Let me ask another question. When do you want to 3 00:00:08.039 --> 00:00:10.000 make out? Who do you make out to? Sinatra? 4 00:00:10.119 --> 00:00:11.519 A mess? 5 00:00:12.800 --> 00:00:13.880 That's a stupid question. 6 00:00:14.119 --> 00:00:14.640 One question. 7 00:00:14.679 --> 00:00:15.119 Answer that. 8 00:00:15.400 --> 00:00:20.039 It's a relevant I won't to answer about you. 9 00:00:21.800 --> 00:00:22.320 I'm married. 10 00:00:22.359 --> 00:00:23.160 We don't make out. 11 00:00:33.200 --> 00:00:37.159 Well, it is December, and this is glop culture. It's 12 00:00:37.200 --> 00:00:39.520 a two man glop culture. Might be three now, we 13 00:00:39.560 --> 00:00:39.840 don't know. 14 00:00:40.000 --> 00:00:40.840 Now, we don't know. 15 00:00:41.039 --> 00:00:42.840 Now, we don't know. I'm John pod Hort's in New 16 00:00:42.920 --> 00:00:45.640 York and in Princeton, New Jersey. Is Rob Long, Hi, 17 00:00:45.759 --> 00:00:47.240 Rob John? How are you? 18 00:00:47.280 --> 00:00:48.280 Happy holidays? 19 00:00:49.000 --> 00:00:52.119 Happy holidays to you too, Just holidays. 20 00:00:52.759 --> 00:00:55.000 I think Conica starts on Christmas Day? 21 00:00:55.119 --> 00:00:58.439 Isn't it today? Around about? Yes, it's a late Conica. 22 00:00:58.799 --> 00:01:01.359 So we will all be so clebrating. So there's a 23 00:01:01.359 --> 00:01:04.760 little factoid for you. Interesting factoid for you. Because Honka, 24 00:01:04.879 --> 00:01:08.040 as you may know, extends eight nights and will be 25 00:01:08.120 --> 00:01:11.840 extending into January. The year twenty twenty five will be 26 00:01:11.920 --> 00:01:16.400 a rare year in which in the in the is 27 00:01:16.400 --> 00:01:18.560 it the Gregorian calendar is that we call it or 28 00:01:18.560 --> 00:01:19.400 the Julian. 29 00:01:19.640 --> 00:01:21.719 I think it's that we're in Okay. 30 00:01:21.840 --> 00:01:25.120 There will actually be two Honkahs in twenty twenty five. 31 00:01:25.760 --> 00:01:28.480 It's the end of the earlier Knka and then the 32 00:01:28.519 --> 00:01:29.920 beginning of the new Honkah. 33 00:01:29.920 --> 00:01:34.359 At the end, it's it's a bonanza of honicas. 34 00:01:34.959 --> 00:01:37.799 Yeah, some of us are hoping that there will be 35 00:01:38.120 --> 00:01:41.599 a miracle of the oil, just as as in the 36 00:01:41.640 --> 00:01:45.079 original honic As. You may know, the miracle Knica was 37 00:01:45.120 --> 00:01:48.879 that the oil burned for eight nights instead of one. 38 00:01:49.439 --> 00:01:51.879 Some of us are hoping that the oil will burn 39 00:01:52.599 --> 00:01:57.760 in on the ports of Iran for eight hundred nights 40 00:01:57.879 --> 00:02:01.560 from many many, never for many nights, as the Iranian 41 00:02:02.319 --> 00:02:06.719 capacity to export and produce and refine oil is destroyed. 42 00:02:06.879 --> 00:02:10.960 Now that Iran is entirely without defenses and should be 43 00:02:11.000 --> 00:02:13.960 punished for its monstrous behavior over the last forty five 44 00:02:14.039 --> 00:02:17.719 years and is in uh We and the Israelis and 45 00:02:17.759 --> 00:02:19.520 others have all kinds of good reasons to that. But 46 00:02:19.560 --> 00:02:20.599 you know what, I'm going. 47 00:02:20.439 --> 00:02:22.599 To political Rah, you are, you are, and you know 48 00:02:22.639 --> 00:02:24.439 what I just want to say. I wish everybody well, 49 00:02:25.879 --> 00:02:28.240 that's that's my thing. I wish everybody well, it's a 50 00:02:28.240 --> 00:02:29.400 happy holidays. 51 00:02:29.960 --> 00:02:31.439 Are you wishing the moll as well? 52 00:02:31.759 --> 00:02:35.759 I'm wishing the mill as well. I'm I'm here's here's 53 00:02:35.759 --> 00:02:38.560 what I am. I'm standing at the window. I've thrown 54 00:02:38.599 --> 00:02:41.719 open the window and I'm shouting down, boy boy, what 55 00:02:41.879 --> 00:02:44.439 day is it? And he goes, that's why it's Christmas days? 56 00:02:45.120 --> 00:02:47.680 And I said, and I'm saying to him, does the 57 00:02:47.879 --> 00:02:52.240 does the Greenes, the grocer or the poultry mongers still 58 00:02:52.280 --> 00:02:55.159 have the turkey in the window? And he says, give 59 00:02:55.159 --> 00:02:58.439 me the one as big as me. And I say, charming, delightful, lad. 60 00:02:58.560 --> 00:03:00.360 And that's that's that's the spirit that I'm in. 61 00:03:00.520 --> 00:03:03.719 But you know, why is the grocer open? Why does 62 00:03:03.759 --> 00:03:06.520 the butcher shop open on Christmas Day? What kind of 63 00:03:06.599 --> 00:03:10.599 monster has that shop open instead of celebrating Christmas with 64 00:03:10.759 --> 00:03:14.280 his family? How come we've never taken a turn down 65 00:03:14.319 --> 00:03:18.199 that road in a revisionist history of a Christmas. 66 00:03:17.719 --> 00:03:19.039 Carol because he's a Jew? 67 00:03:20.000 --> 00:03:22.680 Oh okay, fair enough now, I just want to say. 68 00:03:22.560 --> 00:03:25.080 That that would be like, boy boy, is the Chinese 69 00:03:25.159 --> 00:03:28.479 restaurant down the street open? You mean things such one 70 00:03:28.599 --> 00:03:29.360 delight why? 71 00:03:29.439 --> 00:03:34.680 Yeah? Yes, charming? That wonderful. Can I get some mushu pancakes? Please? 72 00:03:34.919 --> 00:03:37.479 I just get a duck pushu pancakes for the entire 73 00:03:37.599 --> 00:03:43.400 tidy Tim family cratches. They love twice cooked pork. 74 00:03:43.960 --> 00:03:52.360 I gonna have a nice vindalo, you know, speaking of 75 00:03:53.039 --> 00:03:56.520 interesting spinoffs, Oh, how about a spinoff? Now? 76 00:03:56.680 --> 00:03:59.520 Jonah uh Goldberg is not with us because he is 77 00:03:59.599 --> 00:04:04.560 caught in traffic. But Jonah as as as everyone who 78 00:04:04.599 --> 00:04:07.120 has now been built bored enough to listen to this 79 00:04:07.719 --> 00:04:11.039 podcast for I don't know twelve thirteen years knows, Jona, 80 00:04:11.080 --> 00:04:13.120 I have an unhealthy obsession with the television show The 81 00:04:13.159 --> 00:04:17.399 Odd Couple, So rob with a. Bashar al Assad having 82 00:04:17.439 --> 00:04:26.680 fled to Moscow in la uh On you know, December eighth, 83 00:04:27.439 --> 00:04:30.600 Bashar al Assad was asked to remove himself from his 84 00:04:30.720 --> 00:04:34.480 country of residence. Yes, that request came from his people. 85 00:04:35.639 --> 00:04:37.720 Deep down he knew they were right, But one day 86 00:04:37.759 --> 00:04:41.079 he also knew that he would somehow return to murder 87 00:04:41.120 --> 00:04:41.480 them all. 88 00:04:41.800 --> 00:04:44.959 Wells to go, Yeah, there was to go. 89 00:04:45.079 --> 00:04:47.480 He showed up at the Moscow apartment of his friend 90 00:04:47.600 --> 00:04:48.480 Edward Snowden. 91 00:04:48.839 --> 00:04:50.439 Now, are you just did you just invent this? 92 00:04:50.879 --> 00:04:51.120 Yes? 93 00:04:51.519 --> 00:04:53.639 Because okay, because I have to say that we have 94 00:04:53.680 --> 00:04:56.560 a listener a fan who's a writer, very fine writer, 95 00:04:57.279 --> 00:04:59.240 name is Eric Twardzik. And he just sent me. He 96 00:04:59.279 --> 00:05:04.360 sent me yesterday sick on my idea, Edward Snowden, but 97 00:05:04.480 --> 00:05:06.600 share all assade have to share an apartment in Moscow. 98 00:05:06.879 --> 00:05:08.879 Okay, you see that. Great minds think aike. 99 00:05:09.000 --> 00:05:10.759 And it's now And he had a title too, I'm 100 00:05:10.800 --> 00:05:15.439 giving him credit. Yes, two bedroom, one Baptist. 101 00:05:15.800 --> 00:05:16.519 Oh, that's good. 102 00:05:16.600 --> 00:05:17.160 It's pretty good. 103 00:05:17.240 --> 00:05:24.199 Right, that's good. Yeah, it is uh that this is 104 00:05:24.240 --> 00:05:27.680 the way it should go. Now we need we need 105 00:05:27.759 --> 00:05:31.160 Armando Yanucci, the author, the director of the Death of Stalin, 106 00:05:31.600 --> 00:05:36.720 Oh my God, to capture in full the world of 107 00:05:36.759 --> 00:05:37.480 the Assads. 108 00:05:37.720 --> 00:05:41.360 I find all that fascinating. I'm so interested in the 109 00:05:41.399 --> 00:05:44.199 TikTok of it all, just the actual specifics of it all. 110 00:05:44.360 --> 00:05:47.040 There's this moment and I can't I'm not really comparing 111 00:05:47.040 --> 00:05:49.480 these two situations, but I think that in terms of 112 00:05:49.480 --> 00:05:53.600 my interest, they are the same. I saw this this 113 00:05:53.639 --> 00:05:57.839 clip of Rudy Giuliani and he's saying, I don't have 114 00:05:57.839 --> 00:06:00.319 any money, I don't have a bank account, can't get 115 00:06:00.360 --> 00:06:02.800 any cab. Everything's tied up. I can't if I by 116 00:06:02.879 --> 00:06:05.959 hail a taxi cab. He's a very New York way 117 00:06:05.959 --> 00:06:07.480 to say it. But if if I call a cab, 118 00:06:07.639 --> 00:06:10.639 which of course yes, I have no way to pay them. 119 00:06:10.839 --> 00:06:13.040 I can't go to the bank because they can't get 120 00:06:13.120 --> 00:06:15.040 used the ATM card and there's no money in there anyway. 121 00:06:15.360 --> 00:06:17.879 I find that really fascinating, like that that that is 122 00:06:17.920 --> 00:06:21.120 what happens. And so but shir sad they left. I 123 00:06:21.120 --> 00:06:23.000 don't think there's like all the fift of roses. I 124 00:06:23.000 --> 00:06:25.240 think they could. They took what they could carry. They're 125 00:06:25.279 --> 00:06:28.480 like the czars, like the Czarists, right, yeah, and now 126 00:06:28.480 --> 00:06:32.720 he's in Moscow. At some point they're going to say 127 00:06:32.879 --> 00:06:35.079 you owe us, where's your rent? Where's your rent? 128 00:06:35.759 --> 00:06:36.240 Yeah? 129 00:06:36.360 --> 00:06:37.040 What are you going to do? 130 00:06:37.120 --> 00:06:41.079 I mean, where's the rent? I know it's very important. 131 00:06:41.160 --> 00:06:44.439 I you know, there is this novelist that you and 132 00:06:44.480 --> 00:06:48.800 I both are are fans of. Alan First, Oh yeah, 133 00:06:48.800 --> 00:06:52.800 of course, who has written these wonderful books about Europe 134 00:06:53.600 --> 00:06:56.399 in the nineteen series and nineteen forties while the war 135 00:06:56.519 --> 00:06:59.279 is going on, kind of spy novels whatever. He wrote 136 00:06:59.279 --> 00:07:04.040 one about Paris, oh yeah, which is called The Something. 137 00:07:03.759 --> 00:07:06.199 Of Night, The World at Night, The World at Night. 138 00:07:06.680 --> 00:07:08.879 And what what fascinated me about it is it's this 139 00:07:09.000 --> 00:07:12.319 portrait of this movie producer who is trapped in Paris 140 00:07:12.399 --> 00:07:16.279 when when the Nazis invade and has to sort of 141 00:07:16.319 --> 00:07:20.000 keep himself alive. And much of the book is dedicated 142 00:07:20.000 --> 00:07:22.600 to what it is like to live in a city 143 00:07:22.879 --> 00:07:27.839 where you have no money and you're starving and you 144 00:07:28.160 --> 00:07:31.879 don't have any money to go and buy yourself a sandwich. 145 00:07:32.959 --> 00:07:35.199 I mean, you have, but you have money, you just 146 00:07:35.319 --> 00:07:36.199 can't get to it. 147 00:07:36.519 --> 00:07:41.439 You can't get to it, and uh, it's across town, 148 00:07:42.199 --> 00:07:45.399 and you can't get across town because if you someone 149 00:07:45.439 --> 00:07:49.680 might ask for your papers. And the just the logistics 150 00:07:49.800 --> 00:07:57.560 of life an extremists is a is a genuinely fascinating subject. 151 00:07:57.800 --> 00:08:01.879 It all becomes you know, as you know, I'm I'm 152 00:08:01.920 --> 00:08:05.240 in seminary John, I'm studying, I'm taking Holy orders soon. 153 00:08:06.800 --> 00:08:09.279 And one of the most interesting things about I'm sort 154 00:08:09.279 --> 00:08:11.199 of fascinated by in the in the both the Hebrew 155 00:08:11.279 --> 00:08:14.079 Bible and also it's analog or it's a you know, 156 00:08:14.120 --> 00:08:16.959 it's part two. It's a little code of the New Testament. 157 00:08:17.879 --> 00:08:20.839 Is the idea of written of wealth is not a 158 00:08:21.759 --> 00:08:26.040 It's not a philosophical or abstract notion. It's a physical thing. 159 00:08:26.120 --> 00:08:26.480 You have. 160 00:08:27.639 --> 00:08:29.720 You have gold, and you hoard it, and it's heavy, 161 00:08:30.160 --> 00:08:32.240 and it's in bags and you carry it around with 162 00:08:32.320 --> 00:08:34.679 you and in your little purse, and you have to 163 00:08:34.720 --> 00:08:36.200 store it, and you to think about it, like we're 164 00:08:36.200 --> 00:08:37.840 you gonna put it, you gotta bury it, you gotta 165 00:08:37.840 --> 00:08:40.039 guard it. It's like a thing. And if I take 166 00:08:40.080 --> 00:08:43.080 it from you, you don't have it anymore. It's just that. 167 00:08:43.080 --> 00:08:47.440 That's just that, and so so gold and hoarding and money. 168 00:08:47.480 --> 00:08:50.360 It's everywhere. It's in It's in the Psalms everywhere. It's 169 00:08:50.360 --> 00:08:53.039 in Ecclesiastes everywhere. It's in the Proverbs, it's in the 170 00:08:53.120 --> 00:08:56.919 New Testament. Of course, Jesus talking about a lot, and 171 00:08:56.960 --> 00:09:00.519 we just don't have that. That idea doesn't exists anymore. 172 00:09:00.600 --> 00:09:02.799 It's so we don't. It's a piece of paper. But 173 00:09:03.120 --> 00:09:05.840 it must seem to you that if you're Bashir al Asad, 174 00:09:05.919 --> 00:09:07.679 that you just get in an airplane and you fly 175 00:09:07.799 --> 00:09:10.480 to Moscow, and that piece of paper still counts. And 176 00:09:10.519 --> 00:09:12.480 if your putin you're like, no, no, that paper doesn't count. 177 00:09:13.440 --> 00:09:16.120 Yeah. You know, it's funny because one of the best 178 00:09:17.240 --> 00:09:22.840 books ever written about America and economics and American history 179 00:09:23.039 --> 00:09:26.240 is by John Steel Gordon. It's called an Empire of Wealth. Oh, 180 00:09:26.279 --> 00:09:28.679 And one of the things that he describes in this 181 00:09:28.799 --> 00:09:33.360 really wonderful book is the transition to the modern economy 182 00:09:33.360 --> 00:09:38.080 that was represented by the idea that people came to 183 00:09:38.200 --> 00:09:43.120 accept that a piece of paper could stand in for 184 00:09:43.440 --> 00:09:49.200 something of ye could stand for that pile of gold. 185 00:09:50.320 --> 00:09:53.159 Right that it was. It was the representation of the 186 00:09:53.159 --> 00:09:57.519 pile of gold. And this was the big difference between 187 00:09:57.559 --> 00:10:01.399 the Jacksonians and the the people who were opposed to 188 00:10:01.519 --> 00:10:05.879 Andrew Jackson, because Andrew Jackson could not get into his 189 00:10:06.080 --> 00:10:12.039 head the idea of currency he could intellectually held. 190 00:10:11.799 --> 00:10:13.639 Doesn't make any sense. It really doesn't make. 191 00:10:13.519 --> 00:10:17.120 Sense, right, it doesn't make sense. It is the entire 192 00:10:17.320 --> 00:10:19.879 kem to the modern economy. 193 00:10:20.320 --> 00:10:22.840 Well, there's always that story. We always hear that story. 194 00:10:22.879 --> 00:10:25.200 But in the Fed, you know, they have they move 195 00:10:25.320 --> 00:10:29.440 gold in forklifts from locker to locker depending on the 196 00:10:29.519 --> 00:10:32.360 clothes that day and sort of the closing out the 197 00:10:32.360 --> 00:10:34.559 accounts at the end of the day. And it's just 198 00:10:34.600 --> 00:10:36.519 a stupid thing that I mean, the guy could like 199 00:10:36.639 --> 00:10:40.000 just I guess, sleep late or something or or or 200 00:10:40.080 --> 00:10:42.000 leave work early, and then some gold will be in 201 00:10:42.039 --> 00:10:46.399 the wrong locker and then technically some country could be insolvent. 202 00:10:46.960 --> 00:10:48.679 But it's really just moving the gold the right spot. 203 00:10:49.279 --> 00:10:52.720 I believe it's possible. Could it be possible that Jonah 204 00:10:52.759 --> 00:10:53.480 Goldberg is. 205 00:10:53.600 --> 00:10:54.720 Oh Joanah Goldberg? 206 00:10:56.399 --> 00:11:00.120 Is that Jonah Goldberg? I seel it's Jonah Goldberg. Have 207 00:11:00.159 --> 00:11:04.159 a little picture of a handset of a phone zoom, 208 00:11:05.200 --> 00:11:06.840 and I believe it's Jonah Goldberg. 209 00:11:07.519 --> 00:11:13.080 On I see. I was listening to that gold of 210 00:11:13.120 --> 00:11:15.039 a conversation and I didn't want. 211 00:11:14.879 --> 00:11:18.360 To you can't come, you can't come now and derogate. 212 00:11:19.120 --> 00:11:23.399 Yeah, he's not derogating, he's praising. He's praising this gold 213 00:11:23.440 --> 00:11:26.440 of a conversation. I think, Jonah, I do want to 214 00:11:26.480 --> 00:11:28.320 ask you how traffic is? 215 00:11:32.200 --> 00:11:37.039 Uh, traffic is ass cancer, Okay, traffic is terrible. 216 00:11:38.519 --> 00:11:40.440 So I'm gonna I'm gonna I'm gonna go back into 217 00:11:40.519 --> 00:11:44.000 the boy. So we have to go back into the 218 00:11:44.080 --> 00:11:48.799 glop memory banks to remember the day when our own 219 00:11:48.879 --> 00:11:53.960 Rob Long was daily driving from his apartment in Greenwich 220 00:11:54.039 --> 00:11:59.080 Village out to Eastern Long Island, far Eastern produced to 221 00:11:59.200 --> 00:12:03.840 produce a television show. And he drove himself every morning. 222 00:12:03.960 --> 00:12:08.600 You might think that a man of high a steam 223 00:12:09.080 --> 00:12:13.320 executive producing a major network sitcom would have a driver 224 00:12:13.440 --> 00:12:16.799 and a limo taking him no, but let me. 225 00:12:16.759 --> 00:12:20.519 Tell you, let me tell you. Yes, not only did 226 00:12:20.559 --> 00:12:23.320 I not have that, they the studio. They were very 227 00:12:23.399 --> 00:12:28.320 careful about saying we we won't pay for your uber 228 00:12:28.440 --> 00:12:29.600 more than twice a week. 229 00:12:30.879 --> 00:12:34.320 So Rob had a car. Rob out a car, and 230 00:12:34.440 --> 00:12:37.039 he was driving, and we were doing a blop in 231 00:12:37.240 --> 00:12:40.200 while he was in his car. He was crossing, I believe, 232 00:12:40.240 --> 00:12:44.039 going across the Williamsburg Bridge to get onto the B 233 00:12:44.200 --> 00:12:46.120 QUI to get onto the l I E to get 234 00:12:46.120 --> 00:12:50.039 out to Hicksville or wherever the studio was. Literally Hicksville, 235 00:12:50.080 --> 00:12:55.799 that's where we're talking. And then Rob is like, oh, 236 00:12:55.840 --> 00:12:58.720 holy hell, okay wait, I got to jump off. So 237 00:12:58.759 --> 00:13:01.399 it turned out while we were doing Rob got into 238 00:13:01.440 --> 00:13:04.279 a major traffic accident on Delancey Street. 239 00:13:04.600 --> 00:13:06.960 Well it was a major. I was sideswiped by a 240 00:13:07.039 --> 00:13:12.080 South Asian gentleman. And this is the I don't know what. 241 00:13:12.159 --> 00:13:13.919 His being South Asian has to do with this. 242 00:13:14.000 --> 00:13:16.879 Rob, Yeah, let me feel exactly, let me finish. I'll 243 00:13:16.879 --> 00:13:18.559 tell you the story. It really does. It's very It's 244 00:13:18.559 --> 00:13:23.639 germane I swear. So I was sideswiped and I got out. 245 00:13:23.720 --> 00:13:26.039 I yelled and screamed, and I was late and uh, 246 00:13:26.559 --> 00:13:31.399 you know, the podcast was ruined, as we say. And 247 00:13:31.440 --> 00:13:33.480 then I got to work, and this is this is 248 00:13:33.519 --> 00:13:39.480 now twenty seventeen, maybe twenty eighteen, a different era. It's 249 00:13:39.480 --> 00:13:41.279 hard to believe that I got out of I got 250 00:13:41.279 --> 00:13:43.120 out of the car I got and I got to work, 251 00:13:43.200 --> 00:13:45.039 and I was telling everybody what I was hit. And 252 00:13:45.080 --> 00:13:48.159 I said to I said, in the sort of tone 253 00:13:48.159 --> 00:13:51.279 of voice, and the guy hit me. He was like 254 00:13:52.000 --> 00:13:57.480 from India. And I looked with Daggers at the young 255 00:13:57.519 --> 00:14:00.000 writer on our staff who was South Asian from India, 256 00:14:00.399 --> 00:14:03.120 who's very very very good, a very funny guy, and 257 00:14:04.000 --> 00:14:07.080 I said, so, you know, I'm really gonna have to 258 00:14:07.120 --> 00:14:12.080 ask you to, you know, chip in to fix my car. 259 00:14:12.440 --> 00:14:15.200 And and and he said, I'm very very sorry what 260 00:14:15.200 --> 00:14:19.279 my people have done. You know, we're not a driving culture. 261 00:14:19.639 --> 00:14:21.279 And went on and on, and I realized and we 262 00:14:21.320 --> 00:14:23.080 all laughed and it was very fun. And the rest 263 00:14:23.080 --> 00:14:24.399 of the day I kept saying, yeah, I got in 264 00:14:24.480 --> 00:14:26.840 a car accident, and I would shoot Daggers at him 265 00:14:26.840 --> 00:14:29.279 and we'd all laugh. And I realized that that very 266 00:14:29.559 --> 00:14:35.159 joke would get me not just fired, but probably arrested. 267 00:14:35.799 --> 00:14:40.519 Yes, Yeah, and probably two weeks later I mean what 268 00:14:40.679 --> 00:14:44.039 you didn't. There wasn't much time between that joke. Yeah, 269 00:14:44.759 --> 00:14:46.399 when that joke could no longer be made. 270 00:14:46.600 --> 00:14:47.840 Absolutely absolutely. 271 00:14:49.000 --> 00:14:51.720 Let me talk to you today about Lumen. It's the 272 00:14:51.720 --> 00:14:55.519 world's first handheld metabolic coach. 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So if you want to take the 289 00:15:42.480 --> 00:15:46.399 next step and improving your health, go to lumen dot 290 00:15:46.559 --> 00:15:50.120 me slash glop to get fifteen percent off your lumen. 291 00:15:50.159 --> 00:15:55.720 That's lume n dot me slash glop for fifteen percent 292 00:15:55.759 --> 00:16:02.600 off your purchase. And thank you Luhman for sponsoring this episode. Okay, So, Jonah, 293 00:16:03.600 --> 00:16:12.320 I want to ask you an important question about America today. Yes, so, 294 00:16:12.559 --> 00:16:17.720 as you know, a healthcare ceo was shot and killed 295 00:16:17.720 --> 00:16:21.679 on a New York City street. An amazing dragnet was 296 00:16:22.759 --> 00:16:27.759 placed around to find the shooter, who was found yesterday. 297 00:16:27.840 --> 00:16:33.360 I guess as we're taping this Luigi Mangioni is his name. 298 00:16:34.039 --> 00:16:38.879 And not to get overly serious, but are you at 299 00:16:38.879 --> 00:16:43.240 all troubled by the fact that there are certain commentators 300 00:16:43.639 --> 00:16:47.960 on what I would call the anti Trump former right now, 301 00:16:48.080 --> 00:16:53.000 kind of like moderate left who seemed to be overly 302 00:16:53.200 --> 00:16:58.159 excited by the homo erotic nature of the photographs of 303 00:16:58.240 --> 00:17:01.519 Luigi Mangioni on an out inside in Hawaii with a 304 00:17:01.559 --> 00:17:02.120 six pack. 305 00:17:04.960 --> 00:17:07.400 I didn't think that this question was going to go 306 00:17:07.519 --> 00:17:08.400 to homo. 307 00:17:10.799 --> 00:17:14.160 Like well, if you knew who I was talking about, 308 00:17:14.160 --> 00:17:16.599 you would know why I went to homo eroticism. But 309 00:17:16.759 --> 00:17:19.240 I'm not going to name names, but in any case, 310 00:17:19.279 --> 00:17:23.279 that was the that that that was actually a key 311 00:17:23.319 --> 00:17:27.400 element of the reaction on the podcasting question. 312 00:17:28.880 --> 00:17:33.519 Yeah, so I missed that. I've seen a lot of 313 00:17:33.559 --> 00:17:41.160 asenine stuff said about this thing, and I'm utterly and 314 00:17:41.200 --> 00:17:45.079 completely appalled by it. And do you guys remember Fox 315 00:17:45.200 --> 00:17:47.279 used to keep this in the realm of pop culture 316 00:17:47.279 --> 00:17:51.160 of the moment you. Fox briefly had that series, the 317 00:17:51.200 --> 00:17:54.799 one like two seasons with Kevin Bacon and the guy 318 00:17:55.200 --> 00:18:02.400 who played Mark Antony from Rome, the British actor. And 319 00:18:02.519 --> 00:18:08.720 the British actor was basically a literature professor who convinced 320 00:18:08.759 --> 00:18:11.880 all these hot grad students and other people to become 321 00:18:11.960 --> 00:18:15.119 part of a stabby cult where they would just stab 322 00:18:15.160 --> 00:18:16.200 people all over the place. 323 00:18:16.319 --> 00:18:17.720 Yes, and I thought it. 324 00:18:17.599 --> 00:18:20.000 Was like the most ridiculous plot, but I found the 325 00:18:20.039 --> 00:18:25.000 show kind of weirdly compelling, and I think, like that's like, 326 00:18:25.400 --> 00:18:29.359 that's what this reminds me of, is this is people 327 00:18:30.519 --> 00:18:33.640 watching real events. I've been complaining about this since wrote 328 00:18:33.640 --> 00:18:37.519 my last book about like people following you know, events 329 00:18:37.559 --> 00:18:40.759 and politics, like it's a form of entertainment. And then 330 00:18:40.799 --> 00:18:42.359 you know, you root for the hero and you root 331 00:18:42.359 --> 00:18:44.240 against the enemy, and you don't care what happens to 332 00:18:44.240 --> 00:18:45.839 the enemy because all you wanted to hear to get 333 00:18:45.839 --> 00:18:49.119 the mcguffin. And here's this like family man who's shot 334 00:18:49.160 --> 00:18:52.240 in cold blood and they're these, you know, and there 335 00:18:52.279 --> 00:18:56.039 are thousands of people getting two message about it and 336 00:18:56.160 --> 00:19:00.279 thinking it's awesome. And that was before we saw the 337 00:19:00.319 --> 00:19:03.440 guys six pack ads. And I just think it's it's 338 00:19:03.559 --> 00:19:09.079 it's it's so friggin grotesque. Yeah, and I don't I 339 00:19:09.400 --> 00:19:11.559 don't think there's any defense of it. You can say, 340 00:19:11.599 --> 00:19:14.559 what do you want about how healthcare companies suck, that's fine. 341 00:19:14.960 --> 00:19:16.680 But like the one thing I'm thinking about writing about 342 00:19:16.680 --> 00:19:19.559 this tomorrow, the one thing I cannot friggin get my 343 00:19:19.599 --> 00:19:23.599 head around, is that these people think that if if 344 00:19:23.680 --> 00:19:29.079 healthcare wasn't run by capitalists, there would be no rationing 345 00:19:29.160 --> 00:19:32.839 of healthcare. And it puts me into this frame of 346 00:19:32.880 --> 00:19:36.960 mind like, gosh, you know, I really even hate thinking 347 00:19:37.000 --> 00:19:40.839 about this, but like, at some point someone's gonna shoot 348 00:19:40.839 --> 00:19:43.799 someone from the National health Care Service in Britain or 349 00:19:43.839 --> 00:19:47.720 a bureaucrat from Canada for denying coverage, and you're gonna 350 00:19:47.720 --> 00:19:51.960 see all these people go, well, that's different. It's not. 351 00:19:52.440 --> 00:19:55.000 It's just so friggin stupid and evil. 352 00:19:56.400 --> 00:20:01.200 I agree, you know, it's EA, that's wrong. But I 353 00:20:01.200 --> 00:20:04.200 guess I'm more struck by the number of people. I 354 00:20:04.240 --> 00:20:06.839 guess maybe my Twitter feed is different from everyone else's 355 00:20:07.200 --> 00:20:11.640 that are saying things like this doesn't add up. His 356 00:20:11.799 --> 00:20:13.960 arm is in a different position in the one photograph 357 00:20:14.000 --> 00:20:17.480 as it is in the other photograph or something. Those abs, 358 00:20:17.880 --> 00:20:21.880 how do you get those abs with that back injury? 359 00:20:23.160 --> 00:20:25.599 And you're like, okay, that's actually actually I don't have 360 00:20:25.640 --> 00:20:26.359 an answer to that. 361 00:20:26.559 --> 00:20:29.079 And by the way, we do we do have right 362 00:20:29.519 --> 00:20:32.279 presumptuum innocence. We don't know that he did it. 363 00:20:33.400 --> 00:20:39.759 We know that, Okay, what I mean to say. 364 00:20:41.000 --> 00:20:43.599 What I mean to say is that in a this 365 00:20:43.759 --> 00:20:47.759 is there are there are sort of forms and norms 366 00:20:47.799 --> 00:20:50.519 in relation to this. He was arrested in Nowton in Pennsylvania. 367 00:20:50.920 --> 00:20:53.279 He was carrying the same fake ID that the guy 368 00:20:53.319 --> 00:20:56.319 had at the hostel, that matched up with the photo, 369 00:20:56.359 --> 00:20:58.319 that matched up with the description and all of that. 370 00:20:59.000 --> 00:21:02.640 He's pled not guilty, he's fighting extradition, all of that. 371 00:21:03.119 --> 00:21:08.400 So that whole show, you had a manifesto. 372 00:21:08.480 --> 00:21:10.599 A manifest like we haven't we haven't read the MET. 373 00:21:12.039 --> 00:21:13.799 I understand he had a manifesto and he had a 374 00:21:13.799 --> 00:21:16.319 ghost gun, which looks remarkably like the ghost gun that 375 00:21:16.440 --> 00:21:16.920 was used. 376 00:21:17.240 --> 00:21:19.880 I mean, yes, I'm not saying what are you saying? 377 00:21:20.680 --> 00:21:25.240 Yeah, the paraphrase throw some circumstantial evidence is very convincing, 378 00:21:25.559 --> 00:21:28.400 as when you find the murder weapon, the I and 379 00:21:28.480 --> 00:21:29.359 the manifesto. 380 00:21:29.559 --> 00:21:32.759 But isn't that too perfect? 381 00:21:33.119 --> 00:21:36.039 I think that Emerson, I don't think that's Henry throw. 382 00:21:37.039 --> 00:21:41.000 Isn't it just oh, some thing some throws the line? 383 00:21:41.000 --> 00:21:43.519 Thing some circumstandial evidence is very strong. Is when you 384 00:21:43.559 --> 00:21:46.119 find a trout in the milk, and so I was 385 00:21:46.160 --> 00:21:46.960 paraphrasing that. 386 00:21:47.079 --> 00:21:50.359 I know you're you're so literate, that is you you 387 00:21:50.359 --> 00:21:52.720 you nailed me to the wall on that one in 388 00:21:52.799 --> 00:21:55.880 the car boy trout in the milk. But don't you. 389 00:21:55.839 --> 00:21:58.599 Find it strange? I mean, they found the murder weapon, 390 00:21:58.720 --> 00:22:01.359 and they found a manifest stow, and they found a 391 00:22:01.359 --> 00:22:05.920 ghost gun. Isn't it all adding up a little too much? Yeah, 392 00:22:06.400 --> 00:22:08.359 I'd be more believable they didn't find any of the 393 00:22:08.400 --> 00:22:10.680 I'd be more convinced that he did it. If they 394 00:22:10.720 --> 00:22:14.079 didn't find any evidence, they couldn't connect him to the crime. 395 00:22:14.279 --> 00:22:15.640 That's what That's my point. 396 00:22:15.720 --> 00:22:19.200 Listen, listen. I think that the problem with talking about this, 397 00:22:19.839 --> 00:22:22.880 and like our mind inevitably goes to jokes and things 398 00:22:22.920 --> 00:22:27.799 like that, is that, in fact, this may be one 399 00:22:27.799 --> 00:22:30.359 of the worst things that has ever happened. And I'm 400 00:22:30.400 --> 00:22:37.640 now not being hyperbolic because this is no because I 401 00:22:37.640 --> 00:22:41.880