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Speaker 1: Well, well, well, been looking fullward to doing this on

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the Fight Freaks Unite, a recap podcast. My goodness, do

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we have a lot to discuss. I am the somewhat's

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competent host TJ Reves, our insider. Fight Freaks Unite is

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his substack. Why have you not subscribed? You got to

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be on the substack on the newsletter because you get

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all kinds of tremendous content, including recaps written on the substack.

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He is Dan rayphiel A. Good to be back with

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you on the pod. Sometimes, you know, I say this

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all the time. Sometimes we gotta sell the show. Sometimes

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the show sells itself. This one is selling itself, folks.

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I'm just saying that in advance with the fights that

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we had in the outcomes this weekend in Vegas and Albuquerque,

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how are you? How are things?

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Speaker 2: I'm good? What a good weekend this was we and you.

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Speaker 1: Touched on it. You know, we got a couple of

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competitive fights, while they may not be mega fights, huge

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attention pay per view type fights, and lo and Behold

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or tease Boachuk can for Fight of the Year. Lao's

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knockout of Luis Alberto Lopez makes him a world champion

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and a candidate for Knockout of the Year. It delivered

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on both fronts and we're ready to recap those. Thank

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you for finding us. This is the recap pod off

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the weekend Sunday night into Monday. We also preview going

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into the weekend twice the Fun with Dan Raypiel every week.

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Preview Thursday night into Friday, recap coming off the weekend.

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All right, So, by the way, rate us, review us

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if you can, that will help us. Five star reviews

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always help Apple, Spreaker, Spotify, wherever you get podcasts, then

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you automatically get a new podcast. But it's out just

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like if you were following or subscribing, you got a

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ding later in the night on Sunday night or Monday morning,

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some kind of flash, some kind of notification new pod

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is up following subscribe. Okay, so full disclosure. I had

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traveled to Cincinnati, the Queens City, for the Tampa Bay

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Buccaneer preseason NFL football opener with the Bucks and the Bengals.

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So I did my work duties on Saturday night, and

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once those were over with, suddenly the Ortiz Boachuk fight

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was in the ring, and almost the same time probably

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about the eighth or the ninth round of that tremendous

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fight that you're about to recap. The Lopez Lao Iba

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featherweight title fight got underway, and in my case, I

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was able to watch much more intention intently and closely

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the Lopez lao fight. I have now relived Ortez and

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Boachuk via highlights. My goodness, let's begin right there with

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the Golden Boy main event. When I got Rayfield texting

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me while I'm on the team bus headed to the

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airplane with the Buccaneers about how great this fight was.

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I knew it was and I was keeping up with

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you on social media. Won a battle and Ortiz ends

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up getting the narrow decision despite being knocked down twice.

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What are your thoughts about that fight? And it's candadacy

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for Fight of the year.

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Speaker 2: It's it's it was. It was a tremendous fight. Not

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as surprise, by the way, I mean all the conversation

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not just between you and me, but lots of other

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people that talk about such things or right about such things.

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I couldn't find anybody that I saw, reporter, podcaster, YouTuber,

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you know fan that was looking forward to watching the fight.

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There was nobody that was involved in looking forward to

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this fight. Didn't didn't think anything other than the fact

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that it was going to be an action fight. Now,

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did they think it was necessarily going to be the

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fight of the year. Not necessarily, but it was a

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tremendous fight. The expectations that I had, I think that

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you had also were somewhat high, but to me, they

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exceeded the expectations. We knew that these two guys were

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come forward types of fighters, good chins, good power, you know,

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in their prime, stepping up against their best opponent. You know,

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I was all all geeked up for after hearing on

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the podcast interview. We had a couple of shows ago

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with Virgil artists who talked about how well they had

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known each other because when they were both being trained

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by many robolists, they sparred a ton of rounds together.

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When he was getting ready for the Mean Machine edges

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Kavelawski's fight, he had to Bocheck as his his main

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sparring partner, and he talked about how this is just

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gonna be violence. Basically there was he said, he literally

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said one of the coats was there's not gonna be

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any boxing and basically he was right. I mean, this

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was just an old fashioned, you know, tear up as

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they say, just forget the boxing, forget the science, forget

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the skills. This is gonna be grit, violence, determination, art,

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will big balls, whatever you want to say, Whoever wants

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it more, whoever can take it and dish it. And

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it was as close as it can be. And I

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know there's some people that are, you know, because I

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can't get through one fucking weekend DJ without somebody being

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pissed off about a scoring. I'm so sick and fucking

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tired of it. Like, can't we just watch the fights

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and acknowledge that sometimes there's great matchups and they're just close,

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and somebody's gonna win, somebody's gonna lose. And if you're

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the guy that happens to be the loser in the fight,

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you know, don't piss and moan about it. You made

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a great fight. Sorry. Boachuk's career is not in any

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way damaged by this loss, you know, does he take

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a slight step back, Yeah, maybe for the next fight.

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But though they're both winners, we're winners as fans. This

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is this is going to elevate both of these men.

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They're going to become bigger, more popular, and make better money.

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Better to better to lose in a fight like that,

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then win a fight that nobody gives a shit about.

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Speaker 1: And by and by the way, a rematch, if it

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does come about, is a very very intriguing rematch. Now

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if it happens again, now I have to say that again,

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wi Fi being what it was, I was not able

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to stream this. I caught up because again I'm under

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the bowels of the full disclosure, I'm under the bows

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of the stadium. We don't have great WiFi. Whatever. I

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caught up on the tweets, your tweet and many others

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saying that's a first round knockdown. That's a first round

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knockdown of boachuk on Orties, and that kind of set

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the tone for what was going to happen. But pick

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it up on that because it was not ruled a

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knockdown right away, but then instant replay came into a

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fact after the fact, so pick it.

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Speaker 2: Up on that. Okay. So the first round, and this

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was a very pivotal round, was other than that moment

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when he got knocked down, which ultimately was ruled a knockdown,

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but it was still a flash knockdown. He wasn't badly hurt,

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he wasn't all over the place, his legs were fine.

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It was the epitome of a flash knockdown. But accounts, however,

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when it was not ruled a knockdown, originally by the referee,

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Harvey Dock, who by the way, is one of the

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very best referees in boxing, but not everybody is one

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hundred percent, so he didn't rule it a knockdown. And

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other than that very brief moment that he was on

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the floor, and he didn't even stay down for more

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than just like one than two seconds, basically he won

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and kind of dominated the rest of the round. He

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landed a lot of good shots, he forced moow and

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shook back. He won the round handily other than the knockdown.

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But when it wasn't called a knockdown, you have to

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kind of obey with the referee ruled that he didn't

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rule it a knockdown, so you're not going to give

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him a ten eight round. So I scored a ten

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to nine round in favor of Virgil of Artise, like

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I think pretty much everybody must have done. Because it

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was not a very complicated round to score. So right

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off the bat, they're like, okay, you watch the replay, like, well,

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they should have called it a knockdown. He hit him

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with the right hand, wasn't a devastating shot, wasn't a

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hurtful shot. But in the end he did land the

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punch and the man touched the canvas, So that's a knockdown.

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But they didn't rule it that. So I'm still ruling

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my round ten to nine in favor of in favor

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of virtual ortise. So now fast forward. I believe it

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was after round number five. You could hear Harvey Doc say,

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and they spoke about it on the on the on

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the commentators that the commission had looked at the at

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the video and ruled that it was in fact a knockdown,

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and therefore they were they were reversing that score. So

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now you got to kind of go back and rescore

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year round. So you know, a knockdown is a pivotal

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thing in any kind of boxing mask. So now I

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have to go on mine. I'm literally scoring this on paper,

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like I'm at my desk and I'm writing it down.

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So I scratched and shit out and I'm writing ten

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eight in favor of boat Choke on that and then

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not to ten nine for Ortiz. So my maskt a

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little fucked up because we've already had, you know, three

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more rounds or four more rounds that have taken place.

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But nonetheless I figured it out because I can add

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ten to nine and ten and eights. So that changed

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the scoring at that point. But again Virgil was still

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pretty much winning the fight. Now it was putting that

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the scoring, whatever situation was going on, with that one

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particular moment in the first round, TJ. This was ball

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so the wall, actually this was these guys are just

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like a lashing each other with big punches I mean

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from with both hands, uppercuts and body shots. I mean

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just a tremendous barrage from both of these guys who

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were really showing a massive amount of grit. I mean

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the fact that they were able to both stand up,

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and that Boatchuk never went down in Virgil. You know,

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with his perfect record coming into this fight, he had

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won every one of his fights all by knockout, and

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Bochuk had only been the distance one time, had won

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twenty three of his previous twenty four fights that were

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victories by knockout. In the one fight that he lost

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was also by a knockout on his feet, by the way,

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against Brandon Adams, in a fight that Bochu was winning

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until Adams pot him with a nasty left hook. Look,

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this was a great fight, though, because they landed a

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lot of punches. They combined for over fifteen hundred punches thrown.

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This was not a waltz. This was not a boring fight.

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This was tremendous. This was real grit and what I

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kept thinking about TJ. And I actually thought about this

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because I asked Virgil about this on the podcast. This

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fight took place in the arena at the Mandalay Bay

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in Las Vegas, which is one of the best arenas

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that you can watch a fight, and they've been opened since,

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I want to say, like nineteen ninety nine, and they've

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done far fewer fights in recent years than they once

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did before they had merged their companies with the MGM,

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which now is putting all the fights pretty much at

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the MGM Grand and in later years in the Tmobile Arena.

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But when you think about this fight and its candidacy,

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as you called it for Fight of the Year, I

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started thinking about all the great fights that it took

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place in that same ring or in that same venue

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legendary fights. Now, this is maybe not on the level

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of Diego Corrals, Jose Lewis Castillo number one, or the

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first fight between Marco and Tonio Barrera and Eric Morales,

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two of the most epic fights in the last say

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thirty years or so. Same ring where Oscar de la

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Joya had a huge fight in a great fight against

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Fernando Vargas, And there's a whole ton of fights that

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took place, but this fight was so good it does

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take its place on that list that is high praise

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and big guessing, so controversy aside, whatever, it was just

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that kind of fight. It will be the kind of

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fight years and years from now where you might not

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remember who won the fight, like if you if you

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went out and spoke to twenty big boy like real,

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real legit diehard boxing fants. They all know that Barrera

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and Morales had a fantastic trilogy, But I dare say

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that if you pulled them not everybody would know off

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the top of their head. I can't even remember sometimes

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who won that fight, that first epic in Mandalay Bay.

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It's kind of now Gaddy.

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Speaker 1: They merged together a little bit. They meshed together after

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you've had three of them, right.

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Speaker 2: Because Gaddy Warded didn't take place at day. But like

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the first fight, a lot of people forget did Gaddy win?

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Did Ward win? I mean it just it doesn't matter

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because the fight is what overtook the result. That's what

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this was like.

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Speaker 1: Okay, so I'm curious again because you're at a better advantage.

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I knew what had happened when I came back and

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saw the highlights after. As it was going along, fifth

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round becomes seventh round becomes eighth or ninth round, easy

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to say now. But as it was going along, did

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you sense or Tease is going to wear him down

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and get to him, which is what you thought when

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we were talking on the bet Us show, Or did

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you think he's in real jeopardy of losing here? This

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can go either way? What were you thinking as we

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progressed into the later rounds of the fight.

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Speaker 2: So I thought the fight's on the table. This is

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a hard, close, tough fight that every time Virgil landed

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a big shot, You're like, oh, he's going to get

243
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him out of there. And then Botchuk would come back

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and he would land. You're like, oh, Virgil's in trouble

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now because of the first round, changing of the scoring

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of the knockdown. Now you get to the eighth round

247
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and Boatchuck lands another shot. That's a left hook that

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drops or tease. Again, not a hard punch, not a

249
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devastating punch. He basically touched his gloves to the ground.

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He wasn't even on the mat, but it counts as

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a knockdown. So he's now taken two knockdowns that are

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about as least violent a knockdown as you can get

253
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in boxing. One where it's like a clearly a flash

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knockdown he was not hurt at all in my opinion,

255
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and the second one where he gets clipped but he

256
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doesn't actually even go to the mat. He just touches

257
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his gloves down and they ruled it a knockdown correctly,

258
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but it still counts. So because of that fact, you're like, Okay,

259
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he's in trouble on the cards, even though he still

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seems to be imposing himself more physically on the opponent

261
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than Boachuk was on him. Now here's where things get

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a little bit nutty. Now the judges in the if

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you take a look at the official scorecards, specifically in

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the eighth round, because that was a round I'm looking

265
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at the scorecard or the eighth round, all three judges

266
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gave it to Bowachuk ten to eight. To my way

267
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of thinking, and I didn't know this until after the

268
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fight when I saw the scorecard. My thought was other

269
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than the knockdown in that round, especially right after the knockdown,

270
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because there was still a pretty good amount of time

271
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left in the round, or Tease came back like a

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house of fucking fire. Yes, was all over. Bochuk was

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battering him in the round, was pounding him around, was

274
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really really doing damage. And so to me, I didn't

275
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do this. I scored at a ten eight round. But I

276
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think any judge would have been within their rights to say,

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you know what, he made enough of a comeback from

278
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what was kind of a cheap knockdown to negate the

279
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extra point and score a ten to nine round.

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Speaker 1: And you often talk about this, and I love repeating this,

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and I've talked about this on other shows with you

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and have talked about this for decades of being a

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fight fan. Nowhere is it written that because there is

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in you're nodding while I'm saying it, because there is

285
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a knockdown in a round that it has to be

286
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a ten to eight round for the guy that scored

287
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the knockdown. That is not in black and white. It

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is subjective. So exactly what you said, something normally comes

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into play.

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Speaker 2: Normally it's going to be a ten eight round. And

291
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by the way, like I said, the judges all scored

292
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it that way. But if you were scoring at home,

293
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you know, you know, in your own like I'm writing

294
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it down like, and you did score that ten to nine.

295
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I don't think there's anything wrong with that. So in

296
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any event, after that happened, you know Robert Garcia, who

297
00:14:12,039 --> 00:14:14,440
is now is you know he Virgil had been with

298
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Robert then was with with the same team that Bochuk

299
00:14:19,039 --> 00:14:20,679
was with Manny Robliss. Now then he was back with

300
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Robert Garcia. But in the corner, you know, Garcia was

301
00:14:24,279 --> 00:14:26,840
was doing what Garcia does. He's a great quarterman. He's

302
00:14:26,840 --> 00:14:29,279
a great trainer, both in terms of his preparation his

303
00:14:29,320 --> 00:14:32,080
guys and also the motivation during the course of the fight.

304
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And if you take a look at the actual scorecards

305
00:14:34,480 --> 00:14:37,440
after that eighth round, you know, Virgil looks like he's

306
00:14:37,480 --> 00:14:40,960
in some trouble. You know, he's he's trailing on two

307
00:14:41,000 --> 00:14:45,279
score cards seventy seven seventy three and seventy six seventy four,

308
00:14:45,720 --> 00:14:48,440
and on another score card it's seventy five seventy five.

309
00:14:49,039 --> 00:14:52,600
So now you have the ninth round comes about, and

310
00:14:52,639 --> 00:14:55,799
that was after the ten eight round, and in the corner,

311
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Garcia is like, look, we need these rounds, right, we

312
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got to win.

313
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Speaker 1: That important just so clarify for me too. They don't

314
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know that he's behind.

315
00:15:02,879 --> 00:15:03,879
Speaker 2: No, no, they don't.

316
00:15:03,919 --> 00:15:06,600
Speaker 1: Just put together he's been knocked down a couple of

317
00:15:06,600 --> 00:15:09,519
times and that's why they're urging him starting the ninth round.

318
00:15:09,600 --> 00:15:10,960
We need these rounds go ahead.

319
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Speaker 2: Correct. So he was giving him big time urgencies. So

320
00:15:13,639 --> 00:15:17,480
in the in the ninth round, that that was you know,

321
00:15:17,519 --> 00:15:19,360
Garcia's ten or in the quarter you could tell, like,

322
00:15:19,799 --> 00:15:21,960
you know, he's a calm guy, but he raises his

323
00:15:22,039 --> 00:15:24,000
voice and he lets you know there's urgency. And that's

324
00:15:24,000 --> 00:15:26,360
what I think a good quarterman does. You don't want

325
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to alarm your fighter too much, but you want to

326
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make them damn sure that they know that you're serious

327
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when they say the corner person says, you got to

328
00:15:33,960 --> 00:15:35,960
win this round or we need this round, or whatever

329
00:15:36,200 --> 00:15:39,559
the case may be. So the way that Virgil won

330
00:15:39,600 --> 00:15:41,039
the fight, you asked me that I think he was

331
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in trouble, and the answer is, of course, yes, I

332
00:15:42,799 --> 00:15:45,519
thought he was in trouble. However, he's the one that

333
00:15:45,600 --> 00:15:49,919
closed strong. All three judges gave Virgil Ortiz rounds ten,

334
00:15:50,039 --> 00:15:52,480
eleven and twelve, as did I, and that is what

335
00:15:52,679 --> 00:15:56,679
changed him from being down on the score cards on

336
00:15:57,600 --> 00:16:01,559
two score cards to winning the fight close a majority

337
00:16:01,600 --> 00:16:03,720
one thirteen, one thirteen on one scorecard, which is how

338
00:16:03,759 --> 00:16:06,960
I actually ended up scoring the fight, and one fourteen

339
00:16:07,039 --> 00:16:08,720
to one twelve on the other two score cards. So

340
00:16:09,039 --> 00:16:12,279
I think it was you know, there was two clear

341
00:16:12,399 --> 00:16:15,159
rounds because of the knockdowns, one of them which didn't

342
00:16:15,159 --> 00:16:16,840
come till the fifth round, even though it happened in

343
00:16:16,840 --> 00:16:19,799
the first where you're definitely giving Boachuck those rounds and

344
00:16:19,840 --> 00:16:21,519
you should be giving them to him ten to eight,

345
00:16:21,600 --> 00:16:23,480
even though I felt like you could have given the

346
00:16:23,480 --> 00:16:25,759
eighth round ten to night. So that's in his favor,

347
00:16:26,120 --> 00:16:28,360
and I thought that, frankly, in those last three rounds,

348
00:16:28,399 --> 00:16:31,759
even though Virgil Ortiz did not score a knockdown, that

349
00:16:31,960 --> 00:16:33,480
Boachuk was gassed.

350
00:16:33,399 --> 00:16:35,879
Speaker 1: He had heart badly in the ninth. He had him

351
00:16:35,919 --> 00:16:37,279
hurt badly in the ninth, and.

352
00:16:37,679 --> 00:16:39,559
Speaker 2: Virgil had caught a second win and felt like because

353
00:16:39,559 --> 00:16:42,039
in around six seven eight, he kind of felt like

354
00:16:42,120 --> 00:16:44,399
Virgil is getting a little tired. He did get the

355
00:16:44,440 --> 00:16:47,440
second win, partly I think because Garcia was given it

356
00:16:47,480 --> 00:16:49,399
to him in the corner and he went out there

357
00:16:49,399 --> 00:16:51,960
and did what championship level top fighters do, and that

358
00:16:52,080 --> 00:16:55,159
is close the fucking show. Yeah, and that is what

359
00:16:55,200 --> 00:16:57,879
he did because he was able to win those rounds

360
00:16:58,519 --> 00:17:01,159
on all three scorecards and many other people who scored

361
00:17:01,279 --> 00:17:03,639
I saw on social media and my own and that's

362
00:17:03,639 --> 00:17:06,200
how he won. So when I hear all the negativity,

363
00:17:06,200 --> 00:17:09,160
oh he got rob Boatchruk, it's the same shit that

364
00:17:09,200 --> 00:17:11,599
we went through with Crawford and Madma. You don't get

365
00:17:11,640 --> 00:17:14,279
any benefit because you're the champion in this case, the

366
00:17:14,319 --> 00:17:17,920
interim champion. Particularly you know, Crawford was the favorite and

367
00:17:17,960 --> 00:17:20,359
he was like the quote unquote hometown home, you know,

368
00:17:20,400 --> 00:17:22,880
the house fighter if you will, with the Saudi's, and

369
00:17:23,079 --> 00:17:25,640
Ortez was that guy in this fight, even though he

370
00:17:25,680 --> 00:17:28,559
didn't have the belt. This was Golden Boys show. He's

371
00:17:28,599 --> 00:17:32,000
the American. You know, he's the bigger star, quote unquote,

372
00:17:32,200 --> 00:17:34,799
he's the guy with you know, the undefeated record, So

373
00:17:35,319 --> 00:17:36,839
you know he's maybe gonna get a little bit of

374
00:17:36,839 --> 00:17:39,240
that benefit of the doubt. But if you're in the

375
00:17:39,319 --> 00:17:41,319
other court, you have to know that that is going

376
00:17:41,400 --> 00:17:43,480
to happen, So you gotta be double on top of that.

377
00:17:44,640 --> 00:17:46,240
Speaker 1: And the other thing we always talk about is if

378
00:17:46,240 --> 00:17:48,200
you can end it, end it, And in that twelfth

379
00:17:48,279 --> 00:17:51,519
round he had him heard again again. It's easy to

380
00:17:51,559 --> 00:17:53,319
say after the fact all I thought he was going

381
00:17:53,359 --> 00:17:55,319
to get him out of there. Did you think live

382
00:17:55,759 --> 00:17:57,720
Ortiz is going to end all doubt and get him

383
00:17:57,759 --> 00:17:59,799
out of there or you sense.

384
00:17:59,599 --> 00:18:01,880
Speaker 2: That I didn't really sense that. Guys, I thought that

385
00:18:02,000 --> 00:18:04,160
bouch hook. You know, he showed a big heart and

386
00:18:04,240 --> 00:18:06,279
a good shin and I don't any I don't take

387
00:18:06,319 --> 00:18:08,960
anything away from his performance. And like I said, I

388
00:18:08,960 --> 00:18:11,359
scored the fight a draw, but I could if you

389
00:18:11,440 --> 00:18:13,559
said to me, Okay, Raphael, you have it a draw,

390
00:18:13,799 --> 00:18:15,519
but you gotta pick one guy to give it to

391
00:18:15,599 --> 00:18:17,359
one or the other, I would have given it to

392
00:18:17,440 --> 00:18:19,759
Ortiz because I felt like he might have done. If

393
00:18:19,799 --> 00:18:21,640
I have to make the decision even though I've got

394
00:18:21,680 --> 00:18:24,039
it even I'm gonna I'm gonna go in his favorite

395
00:18:24,039 --> 00:18:27,240
based on the number of closer rounds, I thought, uh,

396
00:18:27,279 --> 00:18:29,319
there was you know, I was mark shit on my paper,

397
00:18:29,400 --> 00:18:31,240
like you know, close round or why, you know, big round.

398
00:18:31,400 --> 00:18:33,920
I'd do my little uh you know, diagrams and shit

399
00:18:34,200 --> 00:18:37,480
and I and I would have had Virgil potentially winning

400
00:18:37,559 --> 00:18:40,400
another round on that. Uh. The the good thing is

401
00:18:40,440 --> 00:18:42,799
there was no wacky outlier score like we always have

402
00:18:42,880 --> 00:18:45,079
these fights, you know, where everybody thinks it's close, and

403
00:18:45,279 --> 00:18:47,319
you know, one judge has it, you know, seven five,

404
00:18:47,359 --> 00:18:49,599
and another judge has it seven five the other way,

405
00:18:49,640 --> 00:18:52,039
and then there's one, you know scorecard that's like eleven

406
00:18:52,039 --> 00:18:53,440
to one and you just want to, you know, just

407
00:18:53,559 --> 00:18:55,880
kill yourself. And at least in this fight, he had

408
00:18:55,920 --> 00:18:59,240
three you know, scorecards that mirrored one another the reality

409
00:18:59,279 --> 00:19:02,319
of the fight. Even if you're a gigantic Boa Chook supporter,

410
00:19:03,160 --> 00:19:05,680
you have to acknowledge this is a very close fight, yes,

411
00:19:05,839 --> 00:19:06,720
and he just did not.

412
00:19:07,440 --> 00:19:11,119
Speaker 1: And all three, as you said, all three judges in

413
00:19:11,200 --> 00:19:14,119
complete concert on the final three rounds, they all gave

414
00:19:14,160 --> 00:19:16,279
them to Ortiz. So there is where.

415
00:19:16,599 --> 00:19:18,920
Speaker 2: By the way, yeah, I know we rip on judges

416
00:19:18,920 --> 00:19:22,160
a lot, but the reality is uh. And again, every

417
00:19:22,240 --> 00:19:24,519
judge has had a scorecard here or there that you

418
00:19:24,519 --> 00:19:27,079
may want a question, but by but by in the

419
00:19:27,079 --> 00:19:31,359
bigger picture of things, generally speaking, Max de Luca is

420
00:19:31,359 --> 00:19:33,279
an excellent judge and has been for a long time.

421
00:19:33,359 --> 00:19:36,039
David Sutherland, same thing again. You want to quibble and

422
00:19:36,279 --> 00:19:38,160
find the score here there that you may, you know,

423
00:19:38,279 --> 00:19:40,680
disagree with dramatically. Fair be it? You know, so be it.

424
00:19:40,799 --> 00:19:44,160
Steve Weisfeld, I think, in my opinion, I've said this

425
00:19:44,200 --> 00:19:47,839
for a long time, he's literally the best judge in boxing. Like,

426
00:19:48,319 --> 00:19:52,319
there's rarely a scorecard from Weissfeld that I see that

427
00:19:52,319 --> 00:19:54,039
that that makes me scratch my head, or that I

428
00:19:54,039 --> 00:19:58,000
get upset about or whatever. I know. Steve Weisfeld, I've

429
00:19:58,000 --> 00:20:00,720
known him for a very long time. He is as

430
00:20:00,759 --> 00:20:04,079
good as it gets in judging. Uh. And so if

431
00:20:04,079 --> 00:20:07,359
he tells me it's one fourteen, one twelve, I believe it.

432
00:20:08,319 --> 00:20:08,759
Speaker 1: Uh.

433
00:20:08,920 --> 00:20:11,160
Speaker 2: You know again, I had at the draw, but I can't.

434
00:20:11,200 --> 00:20:13,680
You can sit with that. But the main thing, the

435
00:20:13,680 --> 00:20:17,640
bigger picture, by the way, is great fucking fight. I mean,

436
00:20:17,680 --> 00:20:19,559
we're gonna be talking about this fight, come de Let

437
00:20:19,599 --> 00:20:22,960
me just make one other comment. By the way, Tom Loeffler,

438
00:20:23,000 --> 00:20:26,839
who is the promoter for uh Seray Boachip, really pissed

439
00:20:26,839 --> 00:20:28,839
me off today when I was reading social media and

440
00:20:28,960 --> 00:20:31,519
Tom should fucking know better than this, but he just

441
00:20:31,559 --> 00:20:33,480
wants to put you know, he wants to make it

442
00:20:33,480 --> 00:20:36,079
like his guy got robbed. And he started giving the

443
00:20:36,119 --> 00:20:39,079
line the same bullshit as Eddie Hearn gave, you know

444
00:20:39,440 --> 00:20:42,480
in the Mage Mavn Crawford A you gotta take it

445
00:20:42,480 --> 00:20:44,079
from the champ. No, you don't have to take it

446
00:20:44,079 --> 00:20:46,119
from the champ. You gotta win seven fucking rounds or

447
00:20:46,559 --> 00:20:50,640
the direct was the man the Matthew the more points.

448
00:20:50,680 --> 00:20:53,559
And no, you don't get any kind of special treatment

449
00:20:53,599 --> 00:20:55,920
because you come in with a belt, particularly an interim

450
00:20:55,960 --> 00:20:58,960
belt number two, number three. This is the one that

451
00:20:59,000 --> 00:21:01,119
really irritated me. Even Hearn didn't do this because he

452
00:21:01,160 --> 00:21:03,519
didn't have anything to stand on when it came to that. Well,

453
00:21:03,599 --> 00:21:05,400
take a look at Virgil's face. He's the one that's

454
00:21:05,400 --> 00:21:07,160
all marked up. He's the one that's all busted up.

455
00:21:07,160 --> 00:21:08,519
He's the one that had to go to the hospital.

456
00:21:08,839 --> 00:21:11,240
So therefore we win. Now, fuck that, you don't do

457
00:21:11,359 --> 00:21:13,640
that because you don't score because you have an ugly

458
00:21:13,640 --> 00:21:15,640
face with a cut or because you have a bruise.

459
00:21:15,839 --> 00:21:19,519
You score because you've gone twelve individual three minute segments

460
00:21:19,559 --> 00:21:21,519
and you've given a score ten to nine, and to

461
00:21:21,599 --> 00:21:23,599
eight and to seven, whatever the case may be. How

462
00:21:23,680 --> 00:21:25,759
much damage you have on your face is not relevant

463
00:21:25,799 --> 00:21:29,799
to the scoring. It's it's indicative that you've taken some shots,

464
00:21:30,119 --> 00:21:31,160
but it doesn't.

465
00:21:30,880 --> 00:21:33,759
Speaker 1: Have necessarily extreme the only qualifiers. If it's extreme, if

466
00:21:33,759 --> 00:21:36,640
you've got a swollen, beat up face, bloody mouth, bloody nose,

467
00:21:36,640 --> 00:21:38,880
and the other guy's unmarked, then I think a lot

468
00:21:38,920 --> 00:21:40,799
of people reasonably look at that and go, hey, it's

469
00:21:40,799 --> 00:21:43,720
pretty easy to tell you that mark was not the case.

470
00:21:43,799 --> 00:21:45,079
That was not the case in this point.

471
00:21:45,160 --> 00:21:48,079
Speaker 2: Even if that's the case, it could happen a messed

472
00:21:48,119 --> 00:21:49,960
up I could happen with one punch that happened in

473
00:21:49,960 --> 00:21:52,519
the fourth round, and you were given the scores appropriately

474
00:21:52,559 --> 00:21:55,279
that because you caused that damage. But again, in this

475
00:21:55,319 --> 00:21:58,839
particular case, you know, Virgil had a little little markings

476
00:21:58,839 --> 00:22:00,440
on his face and a little bit of ruse, but

477
00:22:00,680 --> 00:22:02,599
he was not damaged. I mean, yeah, he went to

478
00:22:02,680 --> 00:22:05,240
the hospital because the commission wanted him to get checked out.

479
00:22:05,440 --> 00:22:08,359
But the facial damage, to tell me that's how you

480
00:22:08,359 --> 00:22:11,559
score a fight is absolutely ludicrous, all right, that is insane.

481
00:22:11,599 --> 00:22:15,039
Speaker 1: So he's grappling at things. What is the likelihood that

482
00:22:15,119 --> 00:22:17,079
we might see this again? And what would stand in

483
00:22:17,079 --> 00:22:19,160
the way in your opinion? Because it was good enough

484
00:22:19,200 --> 00:22:21,240
where I think the public would love to see it again.

485
00:22:21,440 --> 00:22:23,160
But what stands in the way or might we see

486
00:22:23,160 --> 00:22:23,480
it again?

487
00:22:24,319 --> 00:22:26,200
Speaker 2: Look, I don't think it's going to be the next fight.

488
00:22:26,559 --> 00:22:28,160
In fact, i'd be willing to wager won't be the

489
00:22:28,240 --> 00:22:31,400
next fight. Now that said, there'll always be some kind

490
00:22:31,400 --> 00:22:33,359
of demand on a fight like this to be a rematch.

491
00:22:33,400 --> 00:22:35,680
So whether it's a couple of fights from now or

492
00:22:35,759 --> 00:22:37,599
you know, a couple of years from now, these are

493
00:22:37,640 --> 00:22:40,480
still dies that are still relatively you know, a younger

494
00:22:40,519 --> 00:22:43,160
in their career. So yeah, I do think they'll there

495
00:22:43,240 --> 00:22:45,200
probably is a good chance we'll see a rematch down

496
00:22:45,240 --> 00:22:47,680
the line, But no chance in my opinion, is going

497
00:22:47,720 --> 00:22:52,559
to be next. And that's mainly because number one, there's

498
00:22:52,599 --> 00:22:55,160
gonna be a movement for other fights. Okay, so you know,

499
00:22:55,440 --> 00:22:57,880
sitting this is the subplot here to this whole thing.

500
00:22:58,400 --> 00:23:01,599
You got Oscar de Loy, who is Virgil's promoter. Their ringside,

501
00:23:01,680 --> 00:23:04,200
he's sitting with Turkey al Chik from Saudi Rabi, who

502
00:23:04,240 --> 00:23:07,279
has apparently stayed in the United States post the Crawford

503
00:23:07,279 --> 00:23:09,680
Magrima fight for the for the next one week. And

504
00:23:09,920 --> 00:23:11,839
you know, even before this fight took place, he spoke

505
00:23:11,880 --> 00:23:15,759
about wanting to do some fights involving Virgil Ortiz, and

506
00:23:15,880 --> 00:23:20,680
after his very public spat with Canelo Alvarez and Canelo

507
00:23:20,720 --> 00:23:23,880
basically disrespecting Turkey and Turkey telling him, you know what,

508
00:23:23,960 --> 00:23:25,799
I don't care. I don't want to do Crawford anymore.

509
00:23:26,319 --> 00:23:28,200
You know, I'm taking my ball and going home. You're fired.

510
00:23:28,240 --> 00:23:30,440
I quit. However you want to describe it. So now

511
00:23:30,680 --> 00:23:32,920
the fight that Turkey says he wants to make, and

512
00:23:33,000 --> 00:23:35,440
this was pending a victory by Virgil Ortiz, which he

513
00:23:35,480 --> 00:23:38,480
obviously came away with, he wants to do Arrence Crawford

514
00:23:38,519 --> 00:23:41,440
against Virgil Ortiz. Now, for my money, it may not

515
00:23:41,519 --> 00:23:43,599
be as big of an event obviously if he was fighting,

516
00:23:43,599 --> 00:23:46,920
if Crawford was fighting Canelavaras. But in terms of competition

517
00:23:47,079 --> 00:23:50,640
excitement within the weight class, you can't tell me. Terence

518
00:23:50,640 --> 00:23:53,599
Crawford against Virgil Ortiz wouldn't interest you, absolutely, So I

519
00:23:53,640 --> 00:23:55,799
think there's a pretty decent chance that that could happen

520
00:23:55,839 --> 00:23:57,519
if Turkey wants to do that fight. He's willing to

521
00:23:57,559 --> 00:24:00,519
pay Parence Crawford a kind of money he commands, and

522
00:24:00,640 --> 00:24:02,759
the same thing goes for a Golden boy in virgial Ortis.

523
00:24:03,720 --> 00:24:05,920
I have no reason why that wouldn't happen. They're doing

524
00:24:05,960 --> 00:24:07,759
business that in the United States, they're working with these

525
00:24:07,799 --> 00:24:11,640
different promoters. That's a big time fight, you know, interim

526
00:24:11,680 --> 00:24:15,480
title or whenever. That's you know, Virgil Ortiz in my mind.

527
00:24:15,680 --> 00:24:17,960
You know, he even said on the podcast he doesn't

528
00:24:18,079 --> 00:24:20,240
consider the interim title the real title. He actually made

529
00:24:20,279 --> 00:24:21,720
one of the greatest sons I've ever heard from a

530
00:24:21,720 --> 00:24:24,799
fighter in my twenty some years of writing about boxing.

531
00:24:24,799 --> 00:24:26,440
When he called the interim title. He's like, you're not

532
00:24:26,599 --> 00:24:29,519
You're not the real champion. He's like, you're the vice president, Yes,

533
00:24:29,720 --> 00:24:32,160
the president, you're the vice president. So I thought that

534
00:24:32,200 --> 00:24:34,480
was a great line. So he gets it, and I

535
00:24:34,559 --> 00:24:36,720
guarantee you that if he got offered a Tyres Crawford fight,

536
00:24:36,960 --> 00:24:39,599
he'd rather fight for the WBA title than worry about

537
00:24:39,640 --> 00:24:41,720
whatever situation is with his intern Don give me.

538
00:24:41,680 --> 00:24:44,440
Speaker 1: A quick take, because there's some that will say, hey,

539
00:24:44,480 --> 00:24:46,599
he got in there with a real guy. The previous

540
00:24:46,640 --> 00:24:49,759
two fights at one fifty four really didn't even last

541
00:24:49,799 --> 00:24:52,200
that long. One of them was a questionable stoppage as well.

542
00:24:52,480 --> 00:24:54,279
Now he got in there with a real guy and

543
00:24:54,319 --> 00:24:56,599
his punching power is not the same. And then you

544
00:24:56,720 --> 00:24:59,640
leap forward to how is he going to beat Terrence Crawford?

545
00:25:00,039 --> 00:25:02,799
If that's the case, how concerned would you be right

546
00:25:02,839 --> 00:25:05,759
now that Ortiz can punch hard enough to get Crawford's

547
00:25:05,799 --> 00:25:08,240
attention and have a legit shot in that fight real quick?

548
00:25:08,920 --> 00:25:10,640
Speaker 2: Well, I think that it's a real fight. I mean,

549
00:25:10,680 --> 00:25:12,839
obviously Terrence Crawford is going to be the favorite. He's

550
00:25:12,839 --> 00:25:15,680
going to be the favorite against anybody except maybe Canelo.

551
00:25:16,200 --> 00:25:18,559
But remember this, Terrence Crawford was in his first fight

552
00:25:18,599 --> 00:25:21,039
at junior middleweight. I mean, they're both guys that have

553
00:25:21,039 --> 00:25:22,960
come up through the weight classes. Terence Crawford was a

554
00:25:23,000 --> 00:25:26,160
champion at one thirty five. He was undisputed at one forty.

555
00:25:26,400 --> 00:25:29,359
Virgil was a prospect at one forty. He became more

556
00:25:29,359 --> 00:25:31,519
of a contender at one forty seven, where Terrence Crawford

557
00:25:31,519 --> 00:25:34,279
moved up. Remember, Crawford's older than him by about a decade.

558
00:25:34,400 --> 00:25:36,720
He's much further along in his career. But they both

559
00:25:36,759 --> 00:25:39,440
have been in similar weight classes. So in my mind,

560
00:25:39,559 --> 00:25:43,160
this is two really good junior middleweights who were probably

561
00:25:43,240 --> 00:25:46,880
at their best so far at welterweight. So I mean,

562
00:25:47,319 --> 00:25:49,160
I think that Vergil Ortiz, just because he didn't knock

563
00:25:49,160 --> 00:25:50,799
out Bochuck, I don't think that doesn't mean he can't

564
00:25:50,839 --> 00:25:53,359
knock out other junior middleweights. But again, Terrence Crawford's a

565
00:25:53,359 --> 00:25:55,759
different story. He's not a guy that takes a ton

566
00:25:55,799 --> 00:25:57,759
of clean punches, So you know, to me, it's not

567
00:25:57,799 --> 00:25:59,440
about can get a knockout, it's about can get can

568
00:25:59,440 --> 00:26:02,160
you win seven? Or and uh well, I would absolutely

569
00:26:02,200 --> 00:26:04,160
look at Crawford as the favorite, because that's what you

570
00:26:04,200 --> 00:26:05,799
do when a guy is pound for pound type of

571
00:26:05,839 --> 00:26:10,000
a fighter. But anybody that would sleep on Virgil Ortiz

572
00:26:10,000 --> 00:26:12,799
against Terrence Crawford is insane. In my opinion, It's a

573
00:26:12,799 --> 00:26:14,839
winnable fight, it's a great matchup.

574
00:26:15,319 --> 00:26:17,759
Speaker 1: So that's a tremendous one and Dance has put it

575
00:26:17,799 --> 00:26:20,240
down the list, not necessarily that it is gonna win

576
00:26:20,359 --> 00:26:22,079
Fight of the Year, but it definitely deserves to be

577
00:26:22,119 --> 00:26:22,839
in the conversation.

578
00:26:22,960 --> 00:26:24,240
Speaker 2: We still got a few months to go, you know,

579
00:26:24,319 --> 00:26:26,519
we do, and I do think still by the way,

580
00:26:26,519 --> 00:26:28,799
because of the because of the magnitude of the fight

581
00:26:28,839 --> 00:26:30,960
and how good it was, that there's still be a

582
00:26:31,039 --> 00:26:32,880
lot of people that will look at that great fight

583
00:26:32,920 --> 00:26:35,920
between Alexander Husk and Tyson Fury. Of course, as as

584
00:26:35,960 --> 00:26:37,200
a as a fight of the year.

585
00:26:37,319 --> 00:26:40,599
Speaker 1: That's tough to talk right now at the moment. Uh okay,

586
00:26:40,759 --> 00:26:42,319
so real quick the other two fights, then I want

587
00:26:42,319 --> 00:26:45,079
to get to this Angelo Leo one punch booming KO

588
00:26:45,599 --> 00:26:48,319
to win the ib featherweight title. Charles Conwell did not

589
00:26:48,400 --> 00:26:52,079
take long body punch knockout over Kahari Gray and also

590
00:26:52,200 --> 00:26:56,559
Kenneth Simms. I got an impressive showing a fifth round

591
00:26:56,599 --> 00:26:58,559
KO as well. Tell me something about each of them

592
00:26:58,599 --> 00:26:59,720
on the undercard.

593
00:27:00,119 --> 00:27:03,680
Speaker 2: Well first and foremost, both of these guys you know

594
00:27:03,680 --> 00:27:05,880
who are finally getting backed in the groove now that

595
00:27:05,920 --> 00:27:08,440
they've signed with Golden Boy. This was Conwell's second fight

596
00:27:08,480 --> 00:27:11,000
since he signed with Golden Boy after a long time

597
00:27:11,000 --> 00:27:13,160
out of the ring because of different issues with promoters

598
00:27:13,160 --> 00:27:15,920
and management and everything. Same thing with Sims. He was

599
00:27:15,960 --> 00:27:18,240
with pbc'd been off fifteen months. This was his first

600
00:27:18,240 --> 00:27:20,920
fight since he signed with Golden Boy. So it's good

601
00:27:20,920 --> 00:27:22,559
to see these two guys get back and their and

602
00:27:22,559 --> 00:27:24,799
they're still you know, on the younger side of things.

603
00:27:24,799 --> 00:27:27,400
They're both excellent contenders in their weight class. Both of

604
00:27:27,440 --> 00:27:29,440
them are ready as soon as they can get a

605
00:27:29,440 --> 00:27:31,920
bigger fight to be in a involved in a world

606
00:27:31,960 --> 00:27:34,680
title fighter, an eliminator, some name opponent. You know, you

607
00:27:34,680 --> 00:27:37,000
don't have to baby them. I mean, these are very

608
00:27:37,039 --> 00:27:40,599
good quality guys in terms of Conwell, twenty sixteen Olympian

609
00:27:40,680 --> 00:27:43,559
moves to twenty to zero with fifteen knockouts, still only

610
00:27:43,559 --> 00:27:47,880
twenty six years old. A really good strong, sturdy guy,

611
00:27:47,960 --> 00:27:50,759
good puncher, and he, you know, Kierri Gray, no one

612
00:27:50,880 --> 00:27:53,839
expecting anything. But as I've said to you numerous times,

613
00:27:54,000 --> 00:27:56,640
if you're match with that type of opponent, then do

614
00:27:56,680 --> 00:27:59,119
what you're supposed to do. Yep. And that's exactly what

615
00:27:59,319 --> 00:28:01,359
Charles Conwell that he took him out with a big,

616
00:28:01,400 --> 00:28:03,799
giant body shot in this ground. That was one of them.

617
00:28:04,240 --> 00:28:05,960
That was as good a body shot as you're gonna see.

618
00:28:05,960 --> 00:28:07,759
I mean, he got it. It was as you can

619
00:28:07,799 --> 00:28:10,279
almost feel it like watching it on the screen like,

620
00:28:10,319 --> 00:28:13,400
oh my god, what a shot. Uh, and he just

621
00:28:13,440 --> 00:28:16,359
had him down and crumpled on the deck, you know. Great.

622
00:28:16,480 --> 00:28:18,359
To his credit, he did get up to all fours,

623
00:28:18,720 --> 00:28:20,279
but you know he was all done in the ref

624
00:28:20,279 --> 00:28:22,240
counted him out, I mean, and he actually stayed down

625
00:28:22,240 --> 00:28:24,119
for another couple of minutes. A lot of times, you know,

626
00:28:24,119 --> 00:28:26,000
you see a guy he gets dropped here's ten and

627
00:28:26,000 --> 00:28:27,359
then he jumps up on his feet like, you know,

628
00:28:27,599 --> 00:28:30,119
pretending he was about to beat the count when you

629
00:28:30,160 --> 00:28:31,559
know he maybe didn't really want to go on. In

630
00:28:31,559 --> 00:28:34,319
this case, this was legit because the guy stayed down

631
00:28:34,359 --> 00:28:36,200
on the mat for another couple of minutes after that fight.

632
00:28:36,279 --> 00:28:38,880
So for conwell, you know, look he fights in that

633
00:28:38,960 --> 00:28:41,279
junior midleweight division also, so he could absolutely be in

634
00:28:41,319 --> 00:28:43,920
the same mix with all these these guys, and it's

635
00:28:43,920 --> 00:28:45,720
a very deep weight class. I'm not saying he's gonna

636
00:28:45,720 --> 00:28:47,799
get Terrence Crawford, but you know what they could do

637
00:28:47,880 --> 00:28:50,400
him in Boachuk. That's a great fight. If Virgil Ortiz

638
00:28:50,440 --> 00:28:51,839
won some of that, that's a good fight. If he

639
00:28:51,839 --> 00:28:54,319
doesn't get a Crawford fighter doesn't do rematch, and there's

640
00:28:54,319 --> 00:28:57,119
other people in that weight class. So good performance from Conwell.

641
00:28:57,160 --> 00:28:59,400
Good to see him back. He just fought a few

642
00:28:59,400 --> 00:29:01,559
months earlier, so it's a second fight in short order.

643
00:29:01,839 --> 00:29:04,000
And in terms of Kenneth Sims, a fighter who I've

644
00:29:04,039 --> 00:29:06,559
always been kind of high on. He's thirty years old

645
00:29:06,599 --> 00:29:09,119
now from Chicago. Now he's twenty one two to one,

646
00:29:09,599 --> 00:29:12,200
and this was one of those situations where Golden Boy

647
00:29:12,200 --> 00:29:14,279
had signed him. They got him an opponent, that opponent

648
00:29:14,319 --> 00:29:16,359
dropped out, they signed him with, they got another opponent

649
00:29:16,359 --> 00:29:20,200
for him, that opponent fell out. On Friday, they brought

650
00:29:20,200 --> 00:29:23,000
in Jonathan Romero, who has been training in Vegas on

651
00:29:23,119 --> 00:29:25,519
less than twenty four hours notice, and so he had

652
00:29:25,559 --> 00:29:27,920
been training for something else. I guess he already was

653
00:29:27,920 --> 00:29:30,680
done in terms of his medicals, and the commission approved him.

654
00:29:30,960 --> 00:29:33,279
He was fighting much heavier than he normally fights. This

655
00:29:33,319 --> 00:29:35,720
was a guy I actually went back and looked this up.

656
00:29:36,039 --> 00:29:39,359
In twenty thirteen, he pulled off a big uposite and

657
00:29:39,400 --> 00:29:41,799
won the IBF title out one hundred and twenty two pounds.

658
00:29:42,039 --> 00:29:44,519
I was at the fighting in Atlantic City, which I

659
00:29:44,519 --> 00:29:46,200
didn't even realize how I went and looked up his record,

660
00:29:46,279 --> 00:29:49,119
like shit, I was at that fight and when he

661
00:29:49,160 --> 00:29:50,960
won the title, but he held it for like six

662
00:29:51,000 --> 00:29:53,240
months and then he lost. But he came into this

663
00:29:53,279 --> 00:29:55,680
fight he had lost three fights in a row by knockout,

664
00:29:55,759 --> 00:29:58,279
all inside three rounds. So you're like, Okay, Sims is

665
00:29:58,279 --> 00:30:00,000
coming off the layof, but he's a much better fight.

666
00:30:00,160 --> 00:30:02,599
He's a much bigger fighter, not a big puncher, but

667
00:30:02,759 --> 00:30:05,920
he's not gonna have much trouble with Jonathan Romero, who

668
00:30:05,920 --> 00:30:09,279
you know basically is a guy that's done. But Romero,

669
00:30:09,519 --> 00:30:11,720
even though he took an absolute fucking Shalaki, showed a

670
00:30:11,720 --> 00:30:13,400
lot of heart, showed a lot of balls. They gotta

671
00:30:13,400 --> 00:30:15,160
give him credit. You know, he could have he could

672
00:30:15,160 --> 00:30:16,680
have been done after one round if you want to

673
00:30:16,680 --> 00:30:18,400
know him what has set a boot, But he hung

674
00:30:18,440 --> 00:30:20,799
in there. You know, after round four he was like

675
00:30:20,920 --> 00:30:22,440
the corner was like we're gonna stop. He's like, give

676
00:30:22,480 --> 00:30:25,319
me one more round, and he got his one more

677
00:30:25,359 --> 00:30:27,119
round and he got his ask kick for another round

678
00:30:27,279 --> 00:30:29,200
and then they finally waved it off. So kenn of Sims,

679
00:30:29,240 --> 00:30:32,359
he got five rounds in off that long layoff and

680
00:30:32,400 --> 00:30:34,839
now he's back in business. You know, props to Romero

681
00:30:34,920 --> 00:30:37,400
for taking the beating, but this was a no hope

682
00:30:37,480 --> 00:30:39,240
or type of fight. But the main thing here is

683
00:30:39,240 --> 00:30:42,279
now Simms, who's in the junior welterweight division. He's the

684
00:30:42,319 --> 00:30:45,559
mandatory in the WBA. That was a fight in his

685
00:30:45,599 --> 00:30:48,160
previous fight that he had one fifteen months ago to

686
00:30:48,200 --> 00:30:50,319
be to get that position, and it was a tremendous

687
00:30:50,319 --> 00:30:53,119
fight if you remember, it was on showtime and kind

688
00:30:53,119 --> 00:30:55,880
of stole the show that night, and they just put

689
00:30:55,920 --> 00:30:58,720
on him in ackmandof put on just a wonderful fight.

690
00:30:59,319 --> 00:31:02,200
And so now he's in great position. He's with Golden Boy,

691
00:31:02,200 --> 00:31:04,839
they're in that weight class. So his thought after the

692
00:31:04,880 --> 00:31:07,200
fight was, I want to fight either the winner of

693
00:31:07,240 --> 00:31:10,880
the fight that's upcoming between Arnold Barbosa and Jose Ramirez.

694
00:31:10,920 --> 00:31:13,279
That's a fight that hasn't been a formally announced but

695
00:31:13,400 --> 00:31:16,680
is supposedly taking place in late September, and if not that,

696
00:31:16,799 --> 00:31:19,880
he wants the mandatory, which would be against Jose Valenzuela,

697
00:31:19,920 --> 00:31:24,039
who just won that belt in the Crawford Nagrumov undercard

698
00:31:24,319 --> 00:31:28,079
the previous week out in LA when he bumped off

699
00:31:28,079 --> 00:31:30,480
and won the decision against Isaac Cruz. So you know,

700
00:31:30,720 --> 00:31:33,079
Kenneth Sims is in a great position. Another deep weight

701
00:31:33,119 --> 00:31:35,640
class can can hang with anybody. I don't know if

702
00:31:35,680 --> 00:31:37,279
he's gonna win the fights or he's gonna lose the fights,

703
00:31:37,279 --> 00:31:39,599
but he'll be competitive against any one hundred and forty

704
00:31:39,599 --> 00:31:43,519
pounds out there, and Golden Boy is gonna do you know,

705
00:31:43,839 --> 00:31:45,200
I think a good fight for him. So he's in

706
00:31:45,240 --> 00:31:46,880
a great spot. That was a good performance from him,

707
00:31:46,880 --> 00:31:49,640
a good performance from Conwell. Golden Boy's getting sneaky deep

708
00:31:49,640 --> 00:31:51,240
with their roster. Let me tell you that they're getting

709
00:31:51,240 --> 00:31:52,279
They've got very solid guys.

710
00:31:52,319 --> 00:31:54,480
Speaker 1: And again you qualified it. I mean they propped up

711
00:31:54,480 --> 00:31:56,480
a guy that's been fighting in a much smaller way

712
00:31:56,599 --> 00:31:58,720
to fight in this. He hung in, but SAMs gets

713
00:31:58,720 --> 00:32:00,480
the winning now makes himself for real. Love Listen.

714
00:32:00,559 --> 00:32:03,920
Speaker 2: I will say this, I'm not sure who specifically is responsible,

715
00:32:04,359 --> 00:32:06,599
and I know it was a mismatch, but this guy

716
00:32:06,640 --> 00:32:08,119
had been out of the ring for so long. This

717
00:32:08,240 --> 00:32:10,720
was their first fight with him. You really want to

718
00:32:10,759 --> 00:32:12,480
do right by your guy, you want to get him

719
00:32:12,480 --> 00:32:14,640
in the ring. So I have to tip the cap

720
00:32:14,680 --> 00:32:17,359
to everybody involved in Golden Boy, whether you like that

721
00:32:17,440 --> 00:32:19,799
fact that he fought Romero or not, the fact they

722
00:32:19,799 --> 00:32:22,000
were able to save this man's fight and get him

723
00:32:22,079 --> 00:32:24,319
paid and get him in the ring for the first

724
00:32:24,319 --> 00:32:26,480
time in fifteen months. They really went to the mat

725
00:32:26,519 --> 00:32:28,039
to try to get that done. And let me tell

726
00:32:28,039 --> 00:32:30,759
you something, I know this for a fact. To get

727
00:32:30,799 --> 00:32:33,759
an opponent passed in one day and then the Vada

728
00:32:33,799 --> 00:32:36,880
State Athletic Commission, that is not an easy task, correct.

729
00:32:36,920 --> 00:32:40,319
So credit to the folks at Golden Boy forgetting their guy.

730
00:32:40,359 --> 00:32:40,960
They're in the ring.

731
00:32:41,880 --> 00:32:44,599
Speaker 1: Okay. So now as we progress along, we have the

732
00:32:44,839 --> 00:32:48,160
ESPN top ranked main event, which you probably know by

733
00:32:48,200 --> 00:32:51,279
now if you're listening to this podcast. Boom goes the

734
00:32:51,359 --> 00:32:54,400
Dynamite with a booming left hand knock Out of the

735
00:32:54,480 --> 00:32:58,119
Year candidate shot from Angelo Leo, who now captures the

736
00:32:58,160 --> 00:33:01,839
IBF featherweight title with Luis Alberto Lopez. I know I've

737
00:33:01,839 --> 00:33:05,119
said this a couple of times before. It's easy to

738
00:33:05,200 --> 00:33:07,319
say after the fact, but I'm just giving you a peek.

739
00:33:07,400 --> 00:33:11,440
I was leaving you alone because the Ortiz Boachuk fight

740
00:33:11,480 --> 00:33:14,880
had ended, they had announced the decision, they're doing the interviews,

741
00:33:14,920 --> 00:33:18,200
the Lao fight is going on, so I left you alone.

742
00:33:18,279 --> 00:33:19,960
I had a couple of other people around me that

743
00:33:20,000 --> 00:33:24,559
could see my phone where I'm watching the Lao or

744
00:33:25,039 --> 00:33:27,359
Lopez fight, and they're asking me what's going on, and

745
00:33:27,400 --> 00:33:29,640
I'm filling them in. This is the top rank ESPN

746
00:33:29,720 --> 00:33:32,960
main event. The guy on the right has been an

747
00:33:33,000 --> 00:33:36,319
Albuquerque is an Albuquerque native and is now backfighting at

748
00:33:36,319 --> 00:33:39,079
home and he's going for a world title. And I

749
00:33:39,240 --> 00:33:43,240
said to one of those guys, as God is my witness,

750
00:33:43,400 --> 00:33:46,880
I said, he keeps catching Lopez with punches going in

751
00:33:47,279 --> 00:33:49,519
and maybe can knock him out with a big shot.

752
00:33:49,839 --> 00:33:51,839
That's the intrigue here. I said that to this guy.

753
00:33:51,839 --> 00:33:55,119
This is probably like about five rounds in. Sure enough,

754
00:33:55,559 --> 00:33:58,880
I'm battling through, getting off the bus, getting to the

755
00:33:58,920 --> 00:34:01,839
airplane with the Buccaneers to fly back from Cincinnati, and

756
00:34:02,119 --> 00:34:07,440
boom with the left hook, he lays out Luis Alberto Lopez.

757
00:34:07,519 --> 00:34:11,000
Double impact again scary. He slammed his head on the

758
00:34:11,039 --> 00:34:14,679
canvas and didn't move for two or three seconds. I

759
00:34:14,760 --> 00:34:16,719
still don't know, because I've seen the replay over and

760
00:34:16,719 --> 00:34:18,480
over again. Why did the referee feel the need to

761
00:34:18,519 --> 00:34:20,920
count if any if anytime you just wanted to say

762
00:34:20,920 --> 00:34:23,159
that's it, you could have said that's it. He's not

763
00:34:23,440 --> 00:34:25,639
moving Dan after the shot.

764
00:34:26,079 --> 00:34:28,199
Speaker 2: Wow, Okay, So I actually when you when I first

765
00:34:28,199 --> 00:34:30,199
saw that. I sort of agreed with you when I

766
00:34:30,239 --> 00:34:32,480
went back when I was writing my article about the

767
00:34:32,519 --> 00:34:35,840
fight and I rewatched it. I don't have a problem

768
00:34:35,880 --> 00:34:38,519
with the referee giving them account because Lopez was moving.

769
00:34:38,800 --> 00:34:40,599
I mean, he wasn't maybe more you know, like like

770
00:34:40,679 --> 00:34:42,880
Tyson Fury when he got dropped by Wilder in the

771
00:34:42,880 --> 00:34:45,000
first fight. He didn't move for like five six seconds.

772
00:34:45,000 --> 00:34:46,519
Then he started to move and the end then got

773
00:34:46,599 --> 00:34:48,679
right up right, So I mean, it wasn't that that

774
00:34:48,800 --> 00:34:53,519
kind of situation. But but uh, Lopez, he did start to, uh,

775
00:34:53,639 --> 00:34:56,119
you know, get off his back and kind of sit up.

776
00:34:56,320 --> 00:34:59,000
Then he rolled over onto his you know, on his side,

777
00:34:59,280 --> 00:35:01,440
ends up a ref game the opportunity ended up counting

778
00:35:01,480 --> 00:35:02,920
him out. So I didn't really see that to be

779
00:35:02,960 --> 00:35:06,320
a big problem in the end though, spectacular knockout, really

780
00:35:06,360 --> 00:35:09,920
good fight, very close fight. But finally and and and

781
00:35:10,239 --> 00:35:13,840
the ESPN crew spoke about this in in this fight,

782
00:35:13,880 --> 00:35:16,719
they've spoken about and passed Lopez fights there one hundred

783
00:35:16,719 --> 00:35:18,440
percent correct. We've all talked about it. When it comes

784
00:35:18,480 --> 00:35:22,480
to Lopez, he's so unorthodox. He throws his punches in

785
00:35:22,519 --> 00:35:27,039
weird ways, he doesn't keep his left hand side. It's

786
00:35:27,119 --> 00:35:29,840
just like it's a disaster waiting to happen. And finally,

787
00:35:30,519 --> 00:35:33,559
uh and and and Angelo Leo spoke about this after

788
00:35:33,559 --> 00:35:36,000
the fight about out. They've been working on his hook

789
00:35:36,000 --> 00:35:37,880
and working on his hook for a long long time,

790
00:35:38,159 --> 00:35:41,239
and they made him pay because before the knockout occurred,

791
00:35:41,800 --> 00:35:44,719
this was a very tight, closed fight. You had you

792
00:35:44,760 --> 00:35:48,519
had going into round number ten. You had Angelo Leo

793
00:35:48,599 --> 00:35:51,039
ahead eighty six to eighty five on two score cards.

794
00:35:51,280 --> 00:35:53,119
You had Lopez up by the same score on the

795
00:35:53,119 --> 00:35:55,559
other scorecards. So they're locked in a what at that

796
00:35:55,639 --> 00:35:58,280
moment is looking like a split decision with still uh

797
00:35:58,320 --> 00:36:01,440
you know, three rounds to go. And this was what

798
00:36:01,480 --> 00:36:04,639
I thought was interesting when they were in the middle

799
00:36:04,679 --> 00:36:06,960
of that round. This is just right before the knockout,

800
00:36:07,280 --> 00:36:10,320
they were in a clinch and the referee broke them apart.

801
00:36:10,440 --> 00:36:12,840
You know, they took a step back, and as soon

802
00:36:12,880 --> 00:36:16,840
as the fight resumed, the very first punch that Leo

803
00:36:16,960 --> 00:36:19,400
threw was the hook that connected, Like it was almost

804
00:36:19,440 --> 00:36:21,960
like Lopez didn't even expect him to throw a shot

805
00:36:22,000 --> 00:36:23,639
because they were just coming out of a break. They're

806
00:36:23,679 --> 00:36:25,280
gonna kind of mess around a little bit and then

807
00:36:25,280 --> 00:36:27,079
they're gonna get back in the action, but he didn't

808
00:36:27,119 --> 00:36:28,880
waste any time. He literally threw the hook on the

809
00:36:28,880 --> 00:36:31,159
first shot and caught him with his hands down clean

810
00:36:31,199 --> 00:36:33,639
as a whistle and just absolutely fucking flattened them in

811
00:36:33,639 --> 00:36:34,719
the center, basically.

812
00:36:35,440 --> 00:36:37,360
Speaker 1: Always devastating on the point of the chin with a

813
00:36:37,360 --> 00:36:37,880
big punch.

814
00:36:37,920 --> 00:36:40,159
Speaker 2: And I never really look, I mean angel Leo coming

815
00:36:40,199 --> 00:36:42,239
into this fight, he only had eleven knockouts and twenty

816
00:36:42,239 --> 00:36:45,719
four wins, so not knowing as a knockout puncher not

817
00:36:45,880 --> 00:36:48,000
you know, and look, anybody can can can knock a

818
00:36:48,000 --> 00:36:50,480
guy out of the guy doesn't see a shot. But

819
00:36:50,519 --> 00:36:53,599
certainly the more known puncher in this fight and again

820
00:36:53,800 --> 00:36:57,679
barely s barely a fifty percent knockout rate, was Lopez,

821
00:36:58,000 --> 00:37:01,119
but he'd scored some spectacular knockouts. The Colin fight springs

822
00:37:01,119 --> 00:37:04,639
to mind, and he was a big favorite in this fight,

823
00:37:04,760 --> 00:37:07,760
but the unorthodox nature of the way he fights it

824
00:37:07,920 --> 00:37:09,800
finally caught up to him and it was such a

825
00:37:09,800 --> 00:37:12,559
brutal knockout like it makes you wonder does he ever

826
00:37:12,599 --> 00:37:15,239
come back to this level again, Because they made mention

827
00:37:15,320 --> 00:37:17,280
this on the broadcast and I was thinking about it also,

828
00:37:17,920 --> 00:37:20,719
it was maybe not as harsh of a knockout. But

829
00:37:20,719 --> 00:37:23,199
it was reminiscent in the fact that here was a

830
00:37:23,199 --> 00:37:26,840
guy that had been a somewhat dominating champion and you

831
00:37:26,920 --> 00:37:29,199
saw the knockout and you're like, this guy might be ruined.

832
00:37:29,199 --> 00:37:32,000
And I was thinking about with Oscar Valdez knocked out

833
00:37:32,039 --> 00:37:35,000
Miguel Burchelt in a similar sort of way, And just

834
00:37:35,039 --> 00:37:38,199
by coincidence, it was Oscar Valdez who after the fight

835
00:37:38,280 --> 00:37:41,079
was over and ESPN's cameras were in the dressing room

836
00:37:41,280 --> 00:37:43,880
and they showed Lopez surrounded by his family. He was crying.

837
00:37:43,960 --> 00:37:46,599
It was a you know, it was a really uncomfortable

838
00:37:46,639 --> 00:37:49,679
scene to see he's with the family. But Oscar Valdez,

839
00:37:49,679 --> 00:37:51,599
who I guess his friendly with Lopez, was there trying

840
00:37:51,599 --> 00:37:55,360
to consul him about what had happened. But that's what

841
00:37:55,519 --> 00:37:57,440
you know, you know, we say it all the time.

842
00:37:57,480 --> 00:37:59,920
Sometimes you're the windshield and sometimes you're the bug, and this.

843
00:38:00,639 --> 00:38:04,199
Speaker 1: Sport is different. It can be over in an instant,

844
00:38:04,280 --> 00:38:07,039
and it was over right there, all right.

845
00:38:07,119 --> 00:38:09,280
Speaker 2: So the first he looked by the way he's coming

846
00:38:09,280 --> 00:38:11,519
into this fight, thinking, I mean, he's I mean, I

847
00:38:11,559 --> 00:38:13,400
think he was focused on his opponent. It wasn't like

848
00:38:13,440 --> 00:38:15,599
he was overlooking him. It was just that's how he fights,

849
00:38:15,599 --> 00:38:18,320
in that unorthodox manner. But he was talking about, like

850
00:38:18,360 --> 00:38:21,039
I'm going to get a unification against the winner of

851
00:38:21,039 --> 00:38:23,760
the fight that's being planned for later this year, the

852
00:38:23,800 --> 00:38:28,320
rematch between Rafael Espinoza and Robasi Ramirez in their WBO

853
00:38:28,320 --> 00:38:30,400
featherweight title fight, an easy fight to make given their

854
00:38:30,440 --> 00:38:33,039
top rank ties. He's thinking like, when THEI in away

855
00:38:33,079 --> 00:38:34,840
goes to featherweight, I'm going to be there for him

856
00:38:34,840 --> 00:38:37,840
with my belt to let him challenge me for the title,

857
00:38:37,960 --> 00:38:40,760
make a big money fight in Japan. And he's got

858
00:38:40,800 --> 00:38:44,079
grand plans and in an instant, they're gone because that

859
00:38:44,079 --> 00:38:47,559
ain't happening now. He may ultimately get a fight like that,

860
00:38:47,920 --> 00:38:50,079
but it's a long road back. And now angel Leo

861
00:38:50,159 --> 00:38:52,079
slides right into that position. He was going after the

862
00:38:52,079 --> 00:38:54,480
fight talking about how I want to get the unification.

863
00:38:54,719 --> 00:38:56,000
I'd like to fight in a way.

864
00:38:56,440 --> 00:38:58,760
Speaker 1: And off of that knockout, he's going to have some leverage.

865
00:38:58,760 --> 00:39:02,480
That's for sure. So well right now in my mind,

866
00:39:02,480 --> 00:39:06,199
and I was there for it. The Lucas body tremendous

867
00:39:06,360 --> 00:39:10,920
one to two knockout of Ashton silv resonates to me

868
00:39:10,960 --> 00:39:13,079
as the knockout of the year. Some will say, Anthony

869
00:39:13,159 --> 00:39:16,079
Joshua folding Francis in Ghanu in half, and you're gonna

870
00:39:16,079 --> 00:39:18,199
mention in Ghanu again a little bit later on here

871
00:39:18,199 --> 00:39:20,480
in the podcast that one's going to get mentioned for

872
00:39:20,559 --> 00:39:23,360
knockout of the year. Where does this Leayo? And maybe

873
00:39:23,360 --> 00:39:26,199
you've got another one. Where does this Layo knockout rank?

874
00:39:26,280 --> 00:39:28,920
Right now, sitting here in August for knockout of the year.

875
00:39:28,920 --> 00:39:29,440
What do you think?

876
00:39:30,559 --> 00:39:33,239
Speaker 2: Well, I mean my general rule of thumb, and I've

877
00:39:33,239 --> 00:39:35,079
been picking knock out of the year since I started

878
00:39:35,079 --> 00:39:37,239
working at USA today back in two thousand. I have

879
00:39:37,320 --> 00:39:39,119
done a knockout of the ear every single year since,

880
00:39:39,400 --> 00:39:41,159
you know, whether I was working there or I was

881
00:39:41,199 --> 00:39:44,000
at ESPN or I'm doing my own thing, and my

882
00:39:44,719 --> 00:39:47,719
thing first and foremost when I picked that is to

883
00:39:47,880 --> 00:39:50,480
sheer violence of the knockout. Same thing I think about

884
00:39:50,519 --> 00:39:52,000
when it's terms of the fight of the year is

885
00:39:52,599 --> 00:39:54,679
forget about whether it's a club fight, it's a world

886
00:39:54,760 --> 00:39:57,920
championship fight, it's the undisputed title fight, whatever is which

887
00:39:57,960 --> 00:40:00,480
one made you jump out of your seat more, which

888
00:40:00,519 --> 00:40:04,039
one was the more all my God type moment? And

889
00:40:05,079 --> 00:40:08,039
even though This fight was for higher stakes because it

890
00:40:08,079 --> 00:40:10,199
was for a world title. It was, you know, in

891
00:40:10,199 --> 00:40:13,360
front of the hometown, and Lopez was a big favorite,

892
00:40:13,360 --> 00:40:14,920
and he was also the guy that's been the road

893
00:40:14,920 --> 00:40:17,280
warrior and here he is and the other guy's hometown

894
00:40:17,280 --> 00:40:19,960
once again, that stakes were much beard in this fight.

895
00:40:20,360 --> 00:40:23,679
But from the just pure violence element of it, I

896
00:40:23,719 --> 00:40:25,440
still kind of guess I think I leaned towards the

897
00:40:25,440 --> 00:40:29,079
body fight because that was just a I mean, this

898
00:40:29,239 --> 00:40:30,880
was a rough heart. I mean, if you picked this one,

899
00:40:30,880 --> 00:40:33,079
I'm not gonna argue with you. Okay, it's not like

900
00:40:33,159 --> 00:40:37,519
I'm gonna I think you're crazy, But viscerally speaking for me,

901
00:40:38,360 --> 00:40:41,119
I think I still lean a little bit towards watching

902
00:40:41,320 --> 00:40:43,280
Ashton Silva get absolutely erased in that.

903
00:40:43,199 --> 00:40:44,800
Speaker 1: Fight because he went down face for.

904
00:40:45,039 --> 00:40:48,280
Speaker 2: They keep in mind, by the way, Ashton Silva had

905
00:40:48,320 --> 00:40:52,360
won every single second of the fight until this. In

906
00:40:52,400 --> 00:40:56,440
the fight between Lopez right and Leo, it can't come

907
00:40:56,480 --> 00:40:59,199
as a complete utter shock because it wasn't even up fight.

908
00:40:59,199 --> 00:41:02,199
They were both taking in shots, they were both competing,

909
00:41:02,239 --> 00:41:04,800
they were both winning rounds, they were both landing punches

910
00:41:05,039 --> 00:41:07,920
in the other one that I mentioned body and sylv

911
00:41:08,480 --> 00:41:11,800
sylv had he was dominated, and that Healy made a

912
00:41:11,800 --> 00:41:14,159
punch on the guy on the guy and suddenly.

913
00:41:13,800 --> 00:41:16,679
Speaker 1: And look the Joshua kale I realized. For our friends

914
00:41:16,679 --> 00:41:18,519
in the UK, they are much more partial to the

915
00:41:18,559 --> 00:41:21,880
Joshua Ko. It happened in Saudi Arabia. But that's a

916
00:41:22,039 --> 00:41:25,239
UK legendary heavyweight fighter right now in the modern era

917
00:41:25,280 --> 00:41:28,000
who just splatted Francis and Ganu. So it'll be a

918
00:41:28,000 --> 00:41:29,719
good debate. It'll be a good debate.

919
00:41:30,719 --> 00:41:34,000
Speaker 2: I think it's safe to say whatever, whatever the results are, however,

920
00:41:34,119 --> 00:41:36,519
whatever you may pick, or I may pick, or you know,

921
00:41:36,599 --> 00:41:39,400
the Ring magazine may pick, or the Boxing Writers Association

922
00:41:39,519 --> 00:41:41,360
of America may pick, or we don't pick a knock

923
00:41:41,360 --> 00:41:43,000
out of your actually now they think about it. But

924
00:41:43,079 --> 00:41:46,159
whatever outlet, you know, all the outlets picked their their

925
00:41:46,199 --> 00:41:49,199
awards at the end of their websites and youtubes and whatever.

926
00:41:49,679 --> 00:41:51,159
I think it's pretty safe to say that all three

927
00:41:51,199 --> 00:41:53,119
of those knockouts you just mentioned are going to be

928
00:41:53,119 --> 00:41:54,719
on the on those lists at the end of the year,

929
00:41:54,840 --> 00:41:57,039
whatever happen. And that's whatever happens going forward.

930
00:41:57,360 --> 00:42:00,920
Speaker 1: So Lao gets the big KO highlight moment for his

931
00:42:01,039 --> 00:42:05,360
career for sure. All right, you know, yeah, and he

932
00:42:05,400 --> 00:42:10,599
gets he gets a world title out of this, and this.

933
00:42:08,840 --> 00:42:10,880
Speaker 2: This is a bigger win than he you know, back

934
00:42:10,920 --> 00:42:12,920
when he won the WBO title at one hundred and

935
00:42:12,920 --> 00:42:16,079
twenty two pounds was obviously a pretty big deal, but this,

936
00:42:16,159 --> 00:42:19,039
to me is much bigger. That was a late replacement

937
00:42:19,039 --> 00:42:21,480
fight because he was supposed to fight Fulton but he

938
00:42:21,519 --> 00:42:24,519
had COVID. He ended up fighting the late sub Tremaine Williams,

939
00:42:24,559 --> 00:42:26,639
who he easily outpointed, and then he had to give

940
00:42:26,679 --> 00:42:29,239
Fulton the next shot and he lost a lopsided fight.

941
00:42:29,320 --> 00:42:30,679
He's kind of lucky he didn't fight him for the

942
00:42:30,719 --> 00:42:32,880
title in the first place, or we'd probably be talking

943
00:42:32,880 --> 00:42:35,800
about a one time one division title holder. But this

944
00:42:35,960 --> 00:42:38,400
was a bigger deal because it's a heavier weight. It

945
00:42:38,440 --> 00:42:41,679
was it was against the guy that I think at

946
00:42:41,679 --> 00:42:43,880
this point, coming into the fight, most people looked at

947
00:42:43,880 --> 00:42:47,039
Lopez as probably the number one fighter in the way class. Granted,

948
00:42:47,079 --> 00:42:49,599
featherweights had a lot of turnover and at the top

949
00:42:49,599 --> 00:42:51,400
and guys who've moved up and et cetera. So you're

950
00:42:51,400 --> 00:42:53,960
talking about a division you know where Ray Vargas who

951
00:42:54,039 --> 00:42:55,760
was there but had lost, even though it was at

952
00:42:55,760 --> 00:42:58,239
the heavier weight, you had Nick Ball who had just

953
00:42:58,599 --> 00:43:00,920
you know, won a world title. Now now you have

954
00:43:01,880 --> 00:43:05,000
Angelo Leo defeating Lopez for this title. And the other

955
00:43:05,039 --> 00:43:07,800
title holder was what he got a Raphael Espinozo probably

956
00:43:07,800 --> 00:43:11,039
the huge Upstez Ramirez. He got Brandon figurea of that

957
00:43:11,119 --> 00:43:13,320
interim title. But I think because Lopez had made a

958
00:43:13,320 --> 00:43:16,039
few defenses and had been more consistent, had been on

959
00:43:16,079 --> 00:43:18,159
the road, that most people looked at that as like

960
00:43:18,199 --> 00:43:20,159
he's the main guy right now in this way class.

961
00:43:20,199 --> 00:43:24,480
Speaker 1: Not anymore, not anymore, not after that shot. Okay, Lyndolfo

962
00:43:24,599 --> 00:43:27,159
Delgado on the undercard, tell me about him, and then

963
00:43:27,159 --> 00:43:28,880
we've got one other fight to recap, and then we've

964
00:43:28,920 --> 00:43:33,079
got some news and some Pernell Whittaker and heavyweight total nostalgia.

965
00:43:33,119 --> 00:43:33,519
Go ahead.

966
00:43:33,880 --> 00:43:37,079
Speaker 2: Lyndolfo Delgado is an interesting character here because I've never

967
00:43:37,119 --> 00:43:38,920
really sort of been sure like how far he's gonna go.

968
00:43:38,960 --> 00:43:41,840
He was an Olympian for Mexico in twenty sixteen. They've

969
00:43:41,840 --> 00:43:43,760
got him to a record of twenty one and zero

970
00:43:43,840 --> 00:43:46,760
now with fifteen knockouts, and he's been in some very exciting,

971
00:43:46,840 --> 00:43:48,840
entertaining fights. But I've sort of never really sort of

972
00:43:48,880 --> 00:43:51,199
believed in him as like, Okay, he's going to be

973
00:43:51,239 --> 00:43:53,960
a world champion, but he's on the at this point.

974
00:43:54,000 --> 00:43:56,599
He's whatever. I think is not relevant in terms of that,

975
00:43:56,639 --> 00:43:58,800
because he's going to probably get a shot at some point.

976
00:43:59,000 --> 00:44:00,800
He took out a very up in an opponent in

977
00:44:00,800 --> 00:44:03,840
Brian Flores, fellow Mexican who was also undefeated going to

978
00:44:03,920 --> 00:44:05,880
the fight, had one draw in his record. They put

979
00:44:05,920 --> 00:44:07,920
on a very nice fight that wasn't like fight of

980
00:44:07,920 --> 00:44:10,079
the year, but as an opening fight for the excellent

981
00:44:10,119 --> 00:44:12,000
main event that we saw, they put on a pretty

982
00:44:12,000 --> 00:44:15,039
good show. He got a knockdown in the third round

983
00:44:15,119 --> 00:44:19,800
on a nice right hand. Flores kind of put himself

984
00:44:19,800 --> 00:44:21,599
a little bit in a hole because he also got

985
00:44:21,599 --> 00:44:24,159
a point deducted later in the fight. In the end, though,

986
00:44:24,760 --> 00:44:27,079
it was a split decision, which I thought Delgado deserved.

987
00:44:27,079 --> 00:44:29,320
He won ninety six, ninety two, ninety five, ninety three,

988
00:44:29,320 --> 00:44:31,400
and then one of the judges on Floraes ninety six

989
00:44:31,440 --> 00:44:33,840
to ninety two. But this is a good, solid victory

990
00:44:33,840 --> 00:44:36,280
for him. It just keeps him undefeated and in the

991
00:44:36,280 --> 00:44:37,960
one hundred and forty pound weight class, where there's a

992
00:44:37,960 --> 00:44:39,599
lot of stuff going out. We were just talking about,

993
00:44:39,880 --> 00:44:43,000
you know, earlier about Kenn the Simms in that weight class,

994
00:44:43,039 --> 00:44:44,800
and and all the all the different guys in there

995
00:44:44,840 --> 00:44:48,000
about whether it's Ramirez and Barbosa, and now obviously you

996
00:44:48,039 --> 00:44:50,239
got ta Fimo lopezz with top rank is a champion.

997
00:44:50,480 --> 00:44:52,280
I mean, there's there's good fighters in this weight class.

998
00:44:52,280 --> 00:44:54,880
You know, we'll see what Devin Haney does moving forward.

999
00:44:55,119 --> 00:44:59,039
Point is, you know you still got Real Valenzuela, you

1000
00:44:59,079 --> 00:45:01,239
got Pitt bull Crue. I mean, this is a very

1001
00:45:01,320 --> 00:45:04,760
loaded weight class, and I'm not saying Delgado is at

1002
00:45:04,800 --> 00:45:07,239
the top of that weight class, but these guys all

1003
00:45:07,400 --> 00:45:11,119
need opponents, and he's got aspirations also, So it doesn't

1004
00:45:11,159 --> 00:45:12,840
seem to me that it's an outland to think to

1005
00:45:12,920 --> 00:45:15,119
think he might land one of these types of fights.

1006
00:45:15,159 --> 00:45:16,800
You know, Top rank is good at making those kind

1007
00:45:16,800 --> 00:45:19,119
of matches, moving their guys along. So it was a

1008
00:45:19,119 --> 00:45:21,320
good victory for him. And by the way, Flores, who

1009
00:45:21,320 --> 00:45:23,440
I had not really seen much of prior to that fight,

1010
00:45:23,960 --> 00:45:26,239
he didn't fight a bad fight. You absolutely can. He

1011
00:45:26,239 --> 00:45:28,400
didn't like ruin his career. It's not like he's done.

1012
00:45:28,519 --> 00:45:31,400
He got a tough, close loss to an undefeated olympian.

1013
00:45:31,760 --> 00:45:33,880
No reason why you know, go back in the gym,

1014
00:45:33,920 --> 00:45:35,960
work on your craft, and you know we'll hopefully see

1015
00:45:36,000 --> 00:45:37,719
him back in the ring in another solid matchup in

1016
00:45:37,719 --> 00:45:38,239
a few months.

1017
00:45:39,079 --> 00:45:41,519
Speaker 1: By one other fight that you have on our rundown,

1018
00:45:41,559 --> 00:45:44,039
it is the Fight Freaks Unit Recap podcast. After all,

1019
00:45:44,199 --> 00:45:47,920
that was the vacant IBF flyweight title from Friday night

1020
00:45:47,920 --> 00:45:51,000
in Mexico City, Mexico City, a zan for Promotions card

1021
00:45:51,519 --> 00:45:55,320
and on hell ayala is the winner. Rightfield goes deep, folks,

1022
00:45:55,400 --> 00:45:58,079
deep into the weeds to give you recaps an info.

1023
00:45:58,199 --> 00:46:00,000
Tell me more about this real quick from Friday.

1024
00:46:00,360 --> 00:46:02,599
Speaker 2: Well, probably it was not the deepest weekend of all time,

1025
00:46:02,639 --> 00:46:05,159
but this was an interesting fight. You have remember back

1026
00:46:05,159 --> 00:46:08,960
in December of last year, you had the very high

1027
00:46:09,000 --> 00:46:11,519
profile fightal list, as far as high profile can be

1028
00:46:11,639 --> 00:46:14,400
in the flyweight division. You had what was a very

1029
00:46:14,440 --> 00:46:19,159
anticipated fight between Jesse Bam Rodriguez and Sonny Edwards. They

1030
00:46:19,199 --> 00:46:22,519
were fighting in December to unify the WBO and the

1031
00:46:22,559 --> 00:46:25,880
IBF title and obviously Vam Rodriguez won the fight and

1032
00:46:25,960 --> 00:46:28,280
ultimately he vacated the titles and moved up and wait,

1033
00:46:28,719 --> 00:46:32,079
so this was the matchup that the IBF mandated between

1034
00:46:32,199 --> 00:46:36,800
Iala and a Filipino fighter named Dave Applelonario to fill

1035
00:46:36,880 --> 00:46:39,760
that vacancy, and they fought that fight in Mexico City.

1036
00:46:39,760 --> 00:46:41,880
It was on ESPN. It was a xand for Promotions

1037
00:46:41,880 --> 00:46:44,840
card and Zanfer works very closely with top Ranco over

1038
00:46:44,920 --> 00:46:47,559
the last number of decades, so they had this as

1039
00:46:47,599 --> 00:46:50,440
part of their ESPN plus offering. Uh. And it was

1040
00:46:50,480 --> 00:46:52,440
a fun fight, as you would expect when you see,

1041
00:46:53,239 --> 00:46:56,039
you know, a good raucous Mexican crowd. With the Mexican

1042
00:46:56,039 --> 00:46:58,840
flyweight they actually have developed a pretty good rivalry with

1043
00:46:58,880 --> 00:47:01,840
their Filipino counterpart. They put on a fun fight and

1044
00:47:02,199 --> 00:47:05,199
Ayala just beat the drum, beat the body like a

1045
00:47:05,280 --> 00:47:07,559
drum of this guy and ended up knocking him out

1046
00:47:07,599 --> 00:47:09,480
in the sixth round. But the body shots did it.

1047
00:47:09,920 --> 00:47:10,039
Speaker 1: Uh.

1048
00:47:10,159 --> 00:47:12,320
Speaker 2: And you know what, fly weight is one of those

1049
00:47:12,320 --> 00:47:15,480
weight classes where traditionally there's h you know, it's kind

1050
00:47:15,519 --> 00:47:18,159
of like feast or famous. Sometimes there's lots of interesting

1051
00:47:18,199 --> 00:47:21,719
fights and sometimes there's not. But having Ayala in the

1052
00:47:21,760 --> 00:47:25,199
weight class uh from Mexico, in a weight class that

1053
00:47:25,239 --> 00:47:26,639
does not get a lot of love. The other ones

1054
00:47:26,679 --> 00:47:29,599
are guys that are based sometimes in Asia. In this case,

1055
00:47:29,599 --> 00:47:33,079
we saw Anthony alas Cagua win a title in the

1056
00:47:33,159 --> 00:47:35,199
in the recent pass on one of the cards in Japan,

1057
00:47:35,239 --> 00:47:39,119
he'll be fighting Jonathan Gonzalez in their mandatory. So there's

1058
00:47:39,119 --> 00:47:41,119
a little action in fly weights. But angel Ayala, he

1059
00:47:41,159 --> 00:47:42,800
deserves a little props. He put on a good fight,

1060
00:47:42,840 --> 00:47:45,440
He scored a nice knockout, was exciting, uh, and he

1061
00:47:45,519 --> 00:47:48,400
showed UH that the Mexican boxers learned how to throw

1062
00:47:48,440 --> 00:47:49,599
body punches from the crib.

1063
00:47:50,960 --> 00:47:54,360
Speaker 1: My goodness. All right, So lots of recaps, A little

1064
00:47:54,400 --> 00:47:57,280
bit of news here before we get to the nostalgia.

1065
00:47:57,400 --> 00:48:00,679
Tell me more. I know boxing scene is reporting this.

1066
00:48:00,760 --> 00:48:05,360
You've done some digging this weekend. What about Nonito Donair

1067
00:48:05,480 --> 00:48:09,599
and Chaco Latito Gonzalez. What are we hearing about that one?

1068
00:48:09,599 --> 00:48:11,400
I know you're all intrigued whenever we bring up those

1069
00:48:11,400 --> 00:48:12,559
two names.

1070
00:48:13,440 --> 00:48:16,559
Speaker 2: Look, I wrote in one of my random Thoughts columns

1071
00:48:16,599 --> 00:48:19,000
just a couple of weeks ago, like I want to

1072
00:48:19,039 --> 00:48:20,960
see this fight. It was like, give me this old

1073
00:48:21,000 --> 00:48:23,119
man fight. And the reason that came up was because

1074
00:48:23,199 --> 00:48:26,719
Chocolatito Gonzalez had come back after a long layoff. He

1075
00:48:26,760 --> 00:48:29,039
had fought the fight in Panama. He had looked pretty good.

1076
00:48:29,320 --> 00:48:32,239
In doing so, he'd gotten a win and I was like, okay,

1077
00:48:32,280 --> 00:48:34,119
he's back in action. He had moved up to banda

1078
00:48:34,159 --> 00:48:35,880
weaight not fully at bandeweight. The fight was at one

1079
00:48:35,960 --> 00:48:39,159
hundred and seventeen pounds, but he knocked out Robert Barrera

1080
00:48:39,199 --> 00:48:41,360
in the tenth round. This was back on July twelfth,

1081
00:48:41,679 --> 00:48:44,079
and so Nonino Donaire, although he's been out of the

1082
00:48:44,159 --> 00:48:47,119
ring for a bit and hadn't fought since July of

1083
00:48:47,239 --> 00:48:49,000
last year. The fight that we were at when he

1084
00:48:49,039 --> 00:48:51,400
fought on the undercart of Arrow Spence and Terrence Crawford

1085
00:48:51,599 --> 00:48:54,719
and lost the WBC Bantamway title by a decision to

1086
00:48:54,719 --> 00:48:58,719
Alexandro Santiago. But Donaire has maintained since then that he

1087
00:48:58,760 --> 00:49:02,000
did plan to not retire at that point. And so,

1088
00:49:02,119 --> 00:49:05,000
if you have the name recognition of a Donair, a

1089
00:49:05,119 --> 00:49:07,159
first ballot Hall of Famer, was one world titles in

1090
00:49:07,239 --> 00:49:10,320
multiple weight classes, and your Roman Chocolate Tito Gonzalez, and

1091
00:49:10,360 --> 00:49:12,519
you don't have any welld title fight teed up, but

1092
00:49:12,559 --> 00:49:13,960
you want to have a big fight, you want to

1093
00:49:13,960 --> 00:49:15,639
make some money, You want to put on a fight

1094
00:49:15,679 --> 00:49:17,559
that people are going to be interested in. You're also

1095
00:49:17,559 --> 00:49:19,239
a future Hall of famer who's won titles in a

1096
00:49:19,320 --> 00:49:22,119
multitude of weight classes. You're talking about two of the

1097
00:49:22,159 --> 00:49:25,519
best small weight fighters in the history of boxing, between

1098
00:49:25,519 --> 00:49:28,920
Nonito Donair and Roman Gonzales. Roman Gonzalez at one time

1099
00:49:29,000 --> 00:49:32,079
was considered the pound for pound number one. Nondo Donaire

1100
00:49:32,400 --> 00:49:34,079
is a guy that has been involved in a fight

1101
00:49:34,119 --> 00:49:36,000
of the year. He's been the fighter of the year.

1102
00:49:36,239 --> 00:49:39,320
I mean, this is a very decorated guy, a very

1103
00:49:39,360 --> 00:49:42,639
well liked fighter. Both of them have great reputations among

1104
00:49:42,679 --> 00:49:45,760
the media, among the fans, among boxing insiders, and you

1105
00:49:45,760 --> 00:49:48,039
know what, they're at the end of their careers. They're

1106
00:49:48,039 --> 00:49:50,679
in their twilight and if you're going to still fight,

1107
00:49:51,320 --> 00:49:54,039
at least do it against somebody that is of that stature,

1108
00:49:54,400 --> 00:49:56,400
that is worthy of you being in the ring with them,

1109
00:49:56,559 --> 00:49:58,440
that is also at least in your age group. So

1110
00:49:58,519 --> 00:50:01,000
you're not fighting you know, I don't want to see Gonzalez.

1111
00:50:01,440 --> 00:50:04,280
I don't want to see Donato fighting guys who are like,

1112
00:50:04,559 --> 00:50:06,800
you know, fifteen twenty years younger. There were some conversation

1113
00:50:06,880 --> 00:50:11,000
about maybe dam Rodriguez fighting against Roman Gonzalez, who are

1114
00:50:11,239 --> 00:50:13,960
close to each other, they spar together, they both are

1115
00:50:14,000 --> 00:50:16,960
with also teaking boxing. Mister Honda, as a certain lover

1116
00:50:17,119 --> 00:50:19,400
his fighters, does not love putting them in together. Maybe

1117
00:50:19,440 --> 00:50:21,199
for the money, for the right event, if they both

1118
00:50:21,239 --> 00:50:23,000
wanted it, he would do it. But I think he

1119
00:50:23,000 --> 00:50:25,679
would much rather do a Donair against Gonzales where it's

1120
00:50:26,199 --> 00:50:29,079
more evenly matched, because I think, honestly nothing against Roman,

1121
00:50:29,119 --> 00:50:32,440
who I absolutely adore, But at this moment in time,

1122
00:50:33,239 --> 00:50:35,480
you can't tell me if you're making Roman Gonzalez against

1123
00:50:35,519 --> 00:50:38,039
Bam Rodriguez that where Bam is at the moment, he's

1124
00:50:38,079 --> 00:50:39,800
not going to be a very heavy duty favorite. And

1125
00:50:39,880 --> 00:50:41,559
I don't need to see Roman get beat up at

1126
00:50:41,559 --> 00:50:43,920
the end of his career, right. But if you want

1127
00:50:43,920 --> 00:50:45,440
to make a fight between him and Dona Air where

1128
00:50:45,440 --> 00:50:47,480
at least it's like they're on even playing ground, where

1129
00:50:47,480 --> 00:50:49,239
they're about the same age, and they have about the

1130
00:50:49,239 --> 00:50:51,719
same amount of you know, mileage on that old dometer,

1131
00:50:52,119 --> 00:50:55,199
you know what, give me the old man fight unless

1132
00:50:55,280 --> 00:50:57,119
you can rise and get one more big win, and

1133
00:50:57,320 --> 00:50:58,760
you know what, I think a lot of fans would

1134
00:50:58,760 --> 00:51:01,480
love to see it. They're great names, they've been exciting fighters,

1135
00:51:01,519 --> 00:51:05,000
big punchers, you know, great ambassadors for the sport, Guys

1136
00:51:05,000 --> 00:51:07,880
with great reputations, outside the ring. Uh so you know

1137
00:51:07,920 --> 00:51:11,159
what if if they're talking, you know, that's a good thing.

1138
00:51:11,159 --> 00:51:12,679
I would love to see that fight. I think that's

1139
00:51:12,719 --> 00:51:14,719
a very doable, makeable fight. It's a fight that I

1140
00:51:14,760 --> 00:51:17,599
can't imagine that one of the broadcasters wouldn't have some

1141
00:51:17,679 --> 00:51:20,719
interest in. Certainly. Uh uh, you know, if you are

1142
00:51:20,760 --> 00:51:23,159
doing boxing broadcasting, why wouldn't you want to do that fight.

1143
00:51:23,519 --> 00:51:26,000
It's not it's not going to cost gazillions of dollars,

1144
00:51:26,039 --> 00:51:27,840
but you're definitely gonna get some eyeballs on that fight.

1145
00:51:27,840 --> 00:51:31,760
And they're legendary names. So that's a fight that's being

1146
00:51:31,760 --> 00:51:33,599
discussed and nod You know, Denair was on the record

1147
00:51:33,599 --> 00:51:35,679
saying that they're talking about new Yaks. So what happened

1148
00:51:35,679 --> 00:51:36,840
by the end of this year. I think there's a

1149
00:51:36,920 --> 00:51:38,960
very good chance that I would The only way I

1150
00:51:39,039 --> 00:51:41,679
think it maybe wouldn't is if somebody drops some kind

1151
00:51:41,719 --> 00:51:44,559
of world title fight. You know, in Roman Gonzalez's lap,

1152
00:51:45,000 --> 00:51:48,280
we have we have Bamar Riggaz or something else. All Right.

1153
00:51:48,320 --> 00:51:51,280
Speaker 1: I mentioned a few minutes ago Francis and Ganu. Francis

1154
00:51:51,320 --> 00:51:53,719
a gan who's on my rundown because he's returning to

1155
00:51:53,960 --> 00:51:57,559
mixed martial arts and he's uh and he's fighting what

1156
00:51:57,920 --> 00:52:02,159
Renon Ferreira in the Professional Fighters League? All right, so

1157
00:52:02,840 --> 00:52:05,159
what why is this on the rundown here for boxing

1158
00:52:05,280 --> 00:52:08,280
just because of the names, because of and Ferreira.

1159
00:52:08,480 --> 00:52:12,000
Speaker 2: No, because Nigan who had made his presence known in boxing.

1160
00:52:12,400 --> 00:52:15,360
Here's a guy that came into the sport in terms

1161
00:52:15,440 --> 00:52:17,559
of boxing as a professional as opposed to in MMA,

1162
00:52:18,079 --> 00:52:20,960
and in his pro debut almost or should have in

1163
00:52:21,000 --> 00:52:24,719
many people's viewpoint, defeated the then heavyweight champion Tyson Fury.

1164
00:52:25,320 --> 00:52:27,440
Turned out to be a split decision. He scored a

1165
00:52:27,519 --> 00:52:30,760
knockdown against the champ, you know, in a very shocking situation.

1166
00:52:31,199 --> 00:52:33,360
Was a huge event. And then after that he got

1167
00:52:33,360 --> 00:52:35,920
to fight with Anthony Joshua, as we discussed earlier, got splattered.

1168
00:52:35,960 --> 00:52:37,840
But here's a guy in his first two pro boxing

1169
00:52:37,880 --> 00:52:40,440
matches thought the two biggest names in the heavyweight division,

1170
00:52:40,719 --> 00:52:42,559
you know, probably could have won the first one, that

1171
00:52:42,639 --> 00:52:45,440
didn't win the second one, but made the decision to

1172
00:52:45,480 --> 00:52:47,960
return to mixed Mars Larks. Now he's no longer with

1173
00:52:48,000 --> 00:52:50,119
the with the UFC off it that's you know, that

1174
00:52:50,239 --> 00:52:52,519
was a story from before before he got to fight

1175
00:52:52,559 --> 00:52:54,880
with Tyson Ferry where he had didn't want to do

1176
00:52:54,960 --> 00:52:57,079
a new contract and he ended up getting stripped of

1177
00:52:57,079 --> 00:52:59,519
their title at evyweight and left to come to boxing.

1178
00:52:59,840 --> 00:53:01,599
But this is not a surprise. I mean there was

1179
00:53:01,639 --> 00:53:04,400
always the conversation when he signed with PFL that when

1180
00:53:04,400 --> 00:53:06,280
he was done with his dalliance with boxing, he would

1181
00:53:06,320 --> 00:53:09,119
go back to the PFL and take on their champion,

1182
00:53:09,519 --> 00:53:11,239
like you said, Raynon Ferra. But the reason that's on

1183
00:53:11,239 --> 00:53:13,760
the rundown is because I think boxing fans have a

1184
00:53:13,800 --> 00:53:17,320
healthy respect for Niganu what he tried to do. I

1185
00:53:17,360 --> 00:53:19,639
know he was a very appealing personality, and I know

1186
00:53:19,760 --> 00:53:21,519
we cover boxing, but you know what, anytime you see

1187
00:53:21,559 --> 00:53:23,119
a guy that fought the heavyweight champ the way he

1188
00:53:23,159 --> 00:53:26,880
did and then took on Anthony Joshua, it's not worth

1189
00:53:26,880 --> 00:53:27,480
a couple of minutes.

1190
00:53:27,480 --> 00:53:30,639
Speaker 1: Also have it there because maybe this is an indication

1191
00:53:30,760 --> 00:53:33,000
that he isn't going to try boxing anymore. He made

1192
00:53:33,000 --> 00:53:35,760
his money, he got splatted in the second fight, and

1193
00:53:35,800 --> 00:53:37,840
now whatever's left he's going to do what he has

1194
00:53:37,920 --> 00:53:39,760
been doing now that he made his bag. As the

1195
00:53:39,840 --> 00:53:42,679
kids like to say on the two heavyweight fights.

1196
00:53:42,400 --> 00:53:44,280
Speaker 2: I think it will depend on maybe how this fight goes.

1197
00:53:44,280 --> 00:53:46,960
That fight's supposed to be on October nineteenth. It's a

1198
00:53:46,960 --> 00:53:48,679
pay per view in the United States, so that'll be

1199
00:53:48,679 --> 00:53:51,400
on an ESPN Plus. But I will say this, I mean,

1200
00:53:52,559 --> 00:53:55,079
people can mock Niganu for what he did in boxing,

1201
00:53:55,079 --> 00:53:56,880
because he you know, he tried to do what he did.

1202
00:53:57,360 --> 00:54:00,000
I have a huge, healthy respect for Niganu first seeing

1203
00:54:00,159 --> 00:54:03,440
him not only take the opportunity to do that and

1204
00:54:03,480 --> 00:54:06,639
make a couple of big events, but take it seriously.

1205
00:54:07,079 --> 00:54:09,280
Put obviously in an excellent performance against Fury. Now I

1206
00:54:09,360 --> 00:54:10,639
mean we started, he took it.

1207
00:54:11,199 --> 00:54:12,599
Speaker 1: To say, you use the word. He took it much

1208
00:54:12,639 --> 00:54:15,280
more seriously than Fury obviously did in training and preparing.

1209
00:54:15,400 --> 00:54:17,559
Speaker 2: Yeah, so that that's one of the things, Like I

1210
00:54:17,639 --> 00:54:19,760
look at the way he thought Fury and the and

1211
00:54:19,800 --> 00:54:22,440
the posters of that fight. Part it was because of

1212
00:54:22,480 --> 00:54:24,760
his preparation and being ready for the fight, but you'd

1213
00:54:24,800 --> 00:54:26,199
be less than honest. He didn't say. Part it was

1214
00:54:26,199 --> 00:54:28,239
because Fury just did not take it seriously at all.

1215
00:54:28,719 --> 00:54:30,800
And uh, and he paid the price, even though he

1216
00:54:30,880 --> 00:54:34,239
ended up getting the victory. So anyway, I just thought

1217
00:54:34,280 --> 00:54:35,800
it was I thought it was interesting when that was

1218
00:54:35,840 --> 00:54:37,800
out out and let's be honest. Also, there's not a

1219
00:54:37,880 --> 00:54:39,679
lot of other big news this weekend other than the

1220
00:54:39,679 --> 00:54:41,440
actual results of the fight that we're talking about, so

1221
00:54:41,639 --> 00:54:43,559
we try to present a little cross section of what's

1222
00:54:43,599 --> 00:54:46,280
going on. But I'll tell you what, TJ. I'm I'm

1223
00:54:46,280 --> 00:54:49,199
gonna root for Niganu just as a like I don't

1224
00:54:49,239 --> 00:54:51,760
buy pay per views on MMA, I might actually buy

1225
00:54:51,760 --> 00:54:54,039
this just to see Nigano. I interviewed him when he

1226
00:54:54,079 --> 00:54:56,159
was getting ready for the for the Joshua fight, right

1227
00:54:56,519 --> 00:54:58,000
or maybe in the Fury fight, I forget which one

1228
00:54:58,000 --> 00:54:59,840
it was, but I found it to be an incredibly

1229
00:55:00,000 --> 00:55:03,880
appealing personality, very very likable. Seeing other interviews with him,

1230
00:55:04,400 --> 00:55:06,400
I don't know how you cannot respect them like this guy.

1231
00:55:06,440 --> 00:55:08,480
And also, I mean, it's not anything to do with

1232
00:55:08,480 --> 00:55:12,199
his return to the field of his sport, but it's

1233
00:55:12,199 --> 00:55:14,880
hard also not to have feelings about it because in

1234
00:55:14,920 --> 00:55:17,719
the time period since the Joshua loss and the announcing

1235
00:55:17,760 --> 00:55:20,880
this fight, you know, he had a very young, you know,

1236
00:55:20,960 --> 00:55:24,639
infant or toddler son that passed that died. I mean, yes,

1237
00:55:24,719 --> 00:55:27,239
that's a devastating situation for him to go through, and

1238
00:55:27,280 --> 00:55:29,440
so I just wish him nothing but the best. YEP.

1239
00:55:29,559 --> 00:55:32,360
Speaker 1: And he's a he is a legend from UFC. He's

1240
00:55:32,440 --> 00:55:34,400
up there in age, so there's I mean, there's a

1241
00:55:34,440 --> 00:55:37,320
big appeal if you're a mixed martial arts fan. There's

1242
00:55:37,360 --> 00:55:41,039
no doubt about him. Okay, nostalgia to wrap it up,

1243
00:55:41,239 --> 00:55:42,960
I do not I say this all the time. I

1244
00:55:43,000 --> 00:55:45,840
do not believe this one. I remember the Perneto Whittaker

1245
00:55:45,920 --> 00:55:48,320
ko that we're about to talk about, but this card

1246
00:55:48,519 --> 00:55:51,519
was thirty four years ago. Tonight, as we do the podcast,

1247
00:55:51,559 --> 00:55:55,599
August eleven, nineteen ninety, Parnell Whittaker one round destruction of

1248
00:55:56,280 --> 00:56:01,360
Juan Nazario. And it's not just that sweet Pee Whittaker

1249
00:56:01,400 --> 00:56:03,079
won the undisputed title, but there were a couple of

1250
00:56:03,119 --> 00:56:07,159
other prominent names that were also on this card as well.

1251
00:56:07,880 --> 00:56:09,320
August of nineteen ninety.

1252
00:56:09,360 --> 00:56:12,800
Speaker 2: Do tell me more so, if this card was taking

1253
00:56:12,840 --> 00:56:15,000
place this weekend, it probably been like an eighty dollars

1254
00:56:15,000 --> 00:56:18,599
pay per view. That's what That's what happens in boxing

1255
00:56:18,599 --> 00:56:19,079
these days.

1256
00:56:18,920 --> 00:56:20,480
Speaker 1: Because we have eighty dollars pay per views with a

1257
00:56:20,480 --> 00:56:22,320
whole lot less than the names you're about to give go.

1258
00:56:22,599 --> 00:56:26,039
Speaker 2: That is correct. So basically this was a main events

1259
00:56:26,159 --> 00:56:29,559
they put on this triple header on HBO in in

1260
00:56:30,760 --> 00:56:34,400
Caesar's Tahoe in you know the resort up you know

1261
00:56:34,519 --> 00:56:38,440
in State Line, Nevada, Lake Tahoe and Prono Whittaker, who

1262
00:56:38,519 --> 00:56:40,599
the late great fighter Hall of Famer. I mean, anybody

1263
00:56:40,599 --> 00:56:43,400
that follows boxing or knows ing about Whitaker the exact

1264
00:56:43,440 --> 00:56:45,239
opposite of what you would refer to as a puncher.

1265
00:56:45,239 --> 00:56:48,079
I mean the slick, most you know, brilliant defense you

1266
00:56:48,159 --> 00:56:50,159
ever see this side of Willie Peppin and Floyd Mayweather.

1267
00:56:50,519 --> 00:56:54,360
I mean, just a brilliant, brilliant tactician. And the result

1268
00:56:54,360 --> 00:56:56,079
of this fight was utterly shocking. So by you know,

1269
00:56:56,119 --> 00:56:59,760
he comes into the fight as the WBC and the

1270
00:56:59,800 --> 00:57:02,199
IF champion in the lightweight division. Keep in mind this

1271
00:57:02,280 --> 00:57:04,840
is the three belt era one the Zario comes into

1272
00:57:04,840 --> 00:57:08,039
the to the fight as the WBA champion and their

1273
00:57:08,039 --> 00:57:10,280
meeting for the undisputed title. That's like a big deal, right,

1274
00:57:10,480 --> 00:57:13,280
I mean, that's that's uh correct, that's big stuff back then.

1275
00:57:13,599 --> 00:57:15,079
And I'll tell you how big it is is because

1276
00:57:15,119 --> 00:57:18,360
ever since Parnel Whittaker became the undisputed lightweight champion by

1277
00:57:18,360 --> 00:57:21,760
winning this fight, there hadn't been another lightweight champion three

1278
00:57:21,800 --> 00:57:25,440
belts or four belts since until Devin Haney did it

1279
00:57:25,480 --> 00:57:28,559
when he fought George Cambosis. That's a very long period

1280
00:57:28,599 --> 00:57:33,559
of time. Nonetheless, they went into this fight and you

1281
00:57:33,679 --> 00:57:35,679
figured it's going to be a boxing match. And the

1282
00:57:35,760 --> 00:57:38,920
shocker of all shockers is you have Pernel Whittaker, the

1283
00:57:39,000 --> 00:57:43,159
non puncher. Pernol Whitaker scores a first round knockout left

1284
00:57:43,199 --> 00:57:45,440
hand on the chin and the Zario I guess just

1285
00:57:45,480 --> 00:57:47,800
never saw the shot, and Parnel Whitaker, in the most

1286
00:57:47,880 --> 00:57:52,000
unlikely of fashion, becomes the undisputed champion. In his whole

1287
00:57:52,159 --> 00:57:55,440
entire career, Pernol Whittaker, I mean, he scored some knockouts,

1288
00:57:55,480 --> 00:57:58,079
but there's only two that are really kind of memorable.

1289
00:57:58,440 --> 00:58:01,760
One was this knockout because the stakes of becoming undisputed,

1290
00:58:02,199 --> 00:58:03,599
and the other one he got to fast forward a

1291
00:58:03,639 --> 00:58:06,039
number of years when he was in the welterweight division

1292
00:58:06,039 --> 00:58:08,760
and sort of winding down his career and he had

1293
00:58:08,800 --> 00:58:12,559
the gigantic fight title defense against Oscar de la Hoya

1294
00:58:12,599 --> 00:58:14,840
at stake and he's getting his rear end kick by

1295
00:58:15,159 --> 00:58:18,360
Diabelli s Artado and comes up clutch and scores a

1296
00:58:18,440 --> 00:58:20,800
knockout in the last round of the fight, which was

1297
00:58:20,840 --> 00:58:23,719
like an unheard of situation. I mean, so the two

1298
00:58:23,719 --> 00:58:26,159
big knockouts that he had, he scores a first round

1299
00:58:26,199 --> 00:58:27,800
knockout in that hur title knockout actually was in the

1300
00:58:27,840 --> 00:58:30,840
eleventh round. He was losing every round. Dala Hoya's ring

1301
00:58:30,920 --> 00:58:33,639
side watching his gigantic paid it and the title shot

1302
00:58:33,679 --> 00:58:35,719
go down the toilet and Paranel pulls it out with

1303
00:58:36,039 --> 00:58:38,679
the eleventh round KO. But the first round KO in

1304
00:58:38,719 --> 00:58:41,480
some ways was more impressive because he was still he

1305
00:58:41,559 --> 00:58:45,519
was in his prime at that point. He's going for undisputed, huge,

1306
00:58:45,599 --> 00:58:48,239
huge deal. So that was a very exciting knockout for Parnel,

1307
00:58:48,559 --> 00:58:50,760
not a guy known for those types of shots. Now

1308
00:58:50,800 --> 00:58:53,000
you mentioned the other guys on the cart, You've got

1309
00:58:53,519 --> 00:58:56,639
the late great Hector Camacho, who at the time was

1310
00:58:56,679 --> 00:58:58,960
thirty seven and zero. And now this was a time

1311
00:58:58,960 --> 00:59:02,079
when the WBO was a title, but nobody considered it

1312
00:59:02,079 --> 00:59:04,639
like the real title. Like they didn't even reference this

1313
00:59:04,679 --> 00:59:07,119
as a title fight on the broadcast. No, it wasn't

1314
00:59:07,119 --> 00:59:09,360
written like by that by any of the writers. It

1315
00:59:09,480 --> 00:59:12,360
was sort of just a third, second tier type belt. Nonetheless,

1316
00:59:12,360 --> 00:59:16,400
Camacho fat a fighter named Tony Baltazar defended that title

1317
00:59:17,119 --> 00:59:20,280
and won a twelve round decision. Not a particularly great fight,

1318
00:59:20,360 --> 00:59:24,039
great name obviously, but you know not it wasn't considered

1319
00:59:24,079 --> 00:59:26,480
at the time to be like an honest to goodness

1320
00:59:26,480 --> 00:59:29,199
world title fight because it just wasn't because nobody thought

1321
00:59:29,239 --> 00:59:31,679
about it was a low rent belt. But okay, he

1322
00:59:31,719 --> 00:59:34,199
was defending that belt and he won it. And now

1323
00:59:34,239 --> 00:59:35,800
you go to the other fight that was on the card.

1324
00:59:35,920 --> 00:59:39,639
We talk about big names. You have the main events staple,

1325
00:59:39,920 --> 00:59:42,679
which was Meldrick Taylor, and Meldrick Taylor had been one

1326
00:59:42,679 --> 00:59:45,400
of their great champions, Olympic gold medalists, had been you know,

1327
00:59:45,440 --> 00:59:47,519
one of the pound for pound guys, and dazzled been

1328
00:59:47,559 --> 00:59:50,119
on the networks on HBO. And the thing that was

1329
00:59:50,159 --> 00:59:53,239
not about this particular fight is that he's coming off

1330
00:59:53,280 --> 00:59:56,920
of the loss in fight number one against Chavez where

1331
00:59:56,920 --> 00:59:59,000
he got stopped with two seconds left in that very

1332
00:59:59,000 --> 01:00:01,079
famous fight, and they were this was sort of like

1333
01:00:01,119 --> 01:00:02,760
the beginning of trying to bring him back. He was

1334
01:00:02,760 --> 01:00:04,480
fighting now you count.

1335
01:00:04,320 --> 01:00:07,639
Speaker 1: Five versus what five months later after that dramatic, crazy

1336
01:00:07,800 --> 01:00:09,400
ending where he stopped in the last round.

1337
01:00:09,400 --> 01:00:12,920
Speaker 2: Correct, Well, the first fight was what February was six

1338
01:00:13,000 --> 01:00:13,440
months later.

1339
01:00:13,519 --> 01:00:16,000
Speaker 1: Right, he thought that March. They fought in March. They

1340
01:00:16,000 --> 01:00:18,159
fought in March of ninety after the Buster Douglas fight.

1341
01:00:18,199 --> 01:00:20,480
Speaker 2: Correct, Correct, because it was on Saint Patrick's Day weekend.

1342
01:00:20,480 --> 01:00:22,760
And now that was the loss. And now he's being

1343
01:00:22,760 --> 01:00:23,800
brought back in August.

1344
01:00:23,800 --> 01:00:25,800
Speaker 1: And by and by the way, just another little sidebar.

1345
01:00:25,920 --> 01:00:28,599
You look at Mildred Taylor's face and the bloody mouth

1346
01:00:28,639 --> 01:00:31,039
and the bloody nose, and you look at Chavez at

1347
01:00:31,039 --> 01:00:33,360
the end of that fight. That fight would to your

1348
01:00:33,400 --> 01:00:35,360
point what we're talking about earlier, that fight wouldn't lend

1349
01:00:35,400 --> 01:00:38,440
you to believe Taylor's won a decision. Of course, that's

1350
01:00:38,440 --> 01:00:39,400
a great example of it.

1351
01:00:39,440 --> 01:00:40,599
Speaker 2: Facial damage is nothing to do.

1352
01:00:40,639 --> 01:00:44,320
Speaker 1: It did not matter because Chavez got the stoppage. CONTROVERSI

1353
01:00:44,320 --> 01:00:47,480
as it was, I sidetracked. You continue on, Taylor's comeback

1354
01:00:47,559 --> 01:00:48,320
began right here.

1355
01:00:48,400 --> 01:00:50,719
Speaker 2: Go. Yeah, So he had fought the fight with Chavez

1356
01:00:50,800 --> 01:00:53,440
that was to unify two of the belts that wont Now,

1357
01:00:53,480 --> 01:00:55,239
because this was not a title fight, they weren't sure

1358
01:00:55,239 --> 01:00:57,320
where he was going. He's now fighting this fight about

1359
01:00:57,320 --> 01:00:59,400
one hundred and forty four pounds against a fighter named

1360
01:00:59,559 --> 01:01:03,159
Fremont who was a reputable type of opponent, kind of

1361
01:01:03,239 --> 01:01:05,079
journeyman ish but you know, had some losses, but a

1362
01:01:05,079 --> 01:01:09,239
sturdy guy. Anyway, Melgic won the ten round decision and

1363
01:01:09,320 --> 01:01:12,079
started like a short little I guess that was like

1364
01:01:12,119 --> 01:01:14,119
a big winning streak or anything like that. But as

1365
01:01:14,159 --> 01:01:15,679
they were trying to bring him back, and because remember

1366
01:01:15,719 --> 01:01:17,159
even though a lot of people look at the fight

1367
01:01:17,239 --> 01:01:20,599
against Meldric and Chavez say that's where Meldrick was done

1368
01:01:20,599 --> 01:01:23,840
and he was never the same again, which is arguably accurate.

1369
01:01:24,400 --> 01:01:27,280
But he did win another world title after that happened.

1370
01:01:27,360 --> 01:01:29,320
I mean, he you know, that's just the fact that

1371
01:01:29,360 --> 01:01:32,039
he did go on and win another championship. So he

1372
01:01:32,079 --> 01:01:34,480
went on a little bit of a winning streak here,

1373
01:01:36,000 --> 01:01:38,159
but not against the top top names. Although he did

1374
01:01:38,199 --> 01:01:41,199
beat like an undefeated Aaron Superman Davis, he did beat

1375
01:01:41,239 --> 01:01:44,800
an undefeated Luis Garcia like he wasn't just beating like nobody's.

1376
01:01:45,119 --> 01:01:49,199
He eventually won the WBA belt and then he petered

1377
01:01:49,199 --> 01:01:51,000
out a couple of years later when he got absolutely

1378
01:01:51,000 --> 01:01:53,960
destroyed by Terry Norris and Croissanto Espana. And that was

1379
01:01:53,960 --> 01:01:57,199
pretty much all she wrote. But this was for the

1380
01:01:57,239 --> 01:02:01,159
comeback after that legendary fight against Chavez in the loss,

1381
01:02:01,519 --> 01:02:03,360
this was the beginning of it. And like I said,

1382
01:02:03,360 --> 01:02:04,880
he got to win. It wasn't anything that you're going

1383
01:02:04,920 --> 01:02:06,920
to write home without, but he won pretty handily. You know,

1384
01:02:07,000 --> 01:02:08,639
it was a ten round in ninety seven to ninety

1385
01:02:08,639 --> 01:02:11,440
two on two scorecards, ninety eight ninety one on a third,

1386
01:02:11,480 --> 01:02:13,760
and people still at this point, you know, we look

1387
01:02:13,840 --> 01:02:16,679
back in the long view of history, but at the

1388
01:02:16,679 --> 01:02:19,039
time it was happening, there was lots of questions about

1389
01:02:19,039 --> 01:02:21,000
what is he going to have left And he won

1390
01:02:21,039 --> 01:02:22,760
the fight, and I think people thought, Okay, maybe he

1391
01:02:22,800 --> 01:02:24,719
can come back and you know, be a champion in

1392
01:02:24,760 --> 01:02:27,039
and do something, which he ultimately did win a belt,

1393
01:02:27,119 --> 01:02:29,960
but it was short lived. But the point here is

1394
01:02:30,320 --> 01:02:32,760
he got historical guys on the card. He got Whittaker

1395
01:02:33,119 --> 01:02:36,960
becoming the undisputed champ, he got Camacho who was still undefeated,

1396
01:02:37,400 --> 01:02:41,000
and he got Meldrech Taylor coming back after after the

1397
01:02:41,320 --> 01:02:43,199
legendary loss to Chavis.

1398
01:02:43,239 --> 01:02:46,880
Speaker 1: And by the way, on HBO premium cable, yes, but

1399
01:02:46,960 --> 01:02:49,559
not on a pay per view because it really didn't

1400
01:02:49,559 --> 01:02:52,280
exist in that form. It was more closed circuit. Pay

1401
01:02:52,280 --> 01:02:54,079
per view was just coming around in nineteen ninety you

1402
01:02:54,119 --> 01:02:57,400
got all three of those names that night thirty four

1403
01:02:57,800 --> 01:03:03,320
years ago. All right, move forward to two thousand and

1404
01:03:03,360 --> 01:03:06,719
six and Monday, August twelfth of two thousand and six,

1405
01:03:07,400 --> 01:03:11,760
you were ringside for a heavyweight title rematch and Oleg

1406
01:03:11,840 --> 01:03:17,119
moskaev ends up defeating Hassim Rockmand to win the WBC

1407
01:03:17,360 --> 01:03:22,639
Heavyweight Championship. What do we remember nostalgically about that night

1408
01:03:22,840 --> 01:03:24,599
in two thousand and six, eighteen years ago.

1409
01:03:25,000 --> 01:03:28,320
Speaker 2: This was a pretty wild situation. Just remember, first of all,

1410
01:03:28,719 --> 01:03:31,000
if you go back that you were talking about the

1411
01:03:31,039 --> 01:03:35,039
rematch between Oleg Maskat and Rockman. Six seven years before

1412
01:03:35,119 --> 01:03:38,480
they had the rematch for the WBC heavyweight title, they

1413
01:03:38,599 --> 01:03:41,599
fought in a non title fight on HBO in Atlantic City,

1414
01:03:42,079 --> 01:03:44,199
in an excellent fight when these guys were both you know,

1415
01:03:44,280 --> 01:03:49,239
still up and coming type heavyweights, and spectacularly, absolutely spectacularly,

1416
01:03:49,679 --> 01:03:52,559
Olegg Maskave knocked Hassim Rockman out of the ring onto

1417
01:03:52,599 --> 01:03:56,719
the arena floor. He literally fell basically in Jim Lampley's lap,

1418
01:03:56,920 --> 01:04:00,679
right right next to his lap on the broadcast now position.

1419
01:04:01,119 --> 01:04:03,360
At ringside. There was a riot that ensued with people

1420
01:04:03,400 --> 01:04:05,400
throwing chairs and stuff. It was absolutely a wild scene.

1421
01:04:05,480 --> 01:04:07,199
But Rockman got knocked the fuck out of the ring.

1422
01:04:07,840 --> 01:04:11,880
Now years later, Rockman has the WBC heavyweight title and

1423
01:04:11,880 --> 01:04:13,599
they're doing this fight. He was with Top Rank at

1424
01:04:13,599 --> 01:04:15,880
the time when they're doing the rematch, and they're doing

1425
01:04:15,960 --> 01:04:18,880
this rematch at the Thomas and Max Center in Las Vegas.

1426
01:04:18,679 --> 01:04:21,719
I you know, I traveled for that fight, and it

1427
01:04:21,760 --> 01:04:24,239
was the way that the fight was promoted, which was

1428
01:04:24,280 --> 01:04:26,400
I think one of the more ingenious sort of it

1429
01:04:26,400 --> 01:04:27,920
didn't do very well on pay per view because it

1430
01:04:27,960 --> 01:04:30,320
was sort of rejected because they weren't big names, wasn't

1431
01:04:30,320 --> 01:04:32,239
really worthy of necessary pay per view. Was the dead

1432
01:04:32,239 --> 01:04:35,000
of summer. I remember being I literally remember like being

1433
01:04:35,039 --> 01:04:37,840
one hundred and fifteen degrees in Vegas that that week

1434
01:04:37,920 --> 01:04:41,960
being out there. But they titled the fight America's Last

1435
01:04:42,000 --> 01:04:45,679
Line of Defense, and the reason was because Rockman. You know,

1436
01:04:45,800 --> 01:04:49,559
remember now it's it's normal, but back then, if you

1437
01:04:49,639 --> 01:04:51,800
didn't have at least one of the heavyweight champions as

1438
01:04:51,800 --> 01:04:54,639
an American, it was like it was not even conceivable. Right,

1439
01:04:54,840 --> 01:04:58,079
The Americans had dominated the heavyweight division since boxing was

1440
01:04:58,119 --> 01:05:03,159
basically created, but to become more and more Eastern European dominated.

1441
01:05:03,400 --> 01:05:05,559
So going into this fight, now we're talking about the

1442
01:05:05,559 --> 01:05:10,400
four belt era, and Rockman has the WBC title. But

1443
01:05:10,480 --> 01:05:13,920
she got Sergei Layakovich from Delarus, who's got the WBO title.

1444
01:05:14,199 --> 01:05:18,280
He got Nikolai Valuev from Russia, who's got the WBA title.

1445
01:05:18,559 --> 01:05:21,840
He got the legendary great Ukrainian Vladimir Klitschko, who has

1446
01:05:21,880 --> 01:05:25,360
at that time the IBF title. So olegg Maski is

1447
01:05:25,360 --> 01:05:28,159
from Russia. And the thing is okay. If he loses Rockman,

1448
01:05:28,480 --> 01:05:30,719
he's the America's last line of defense for a heavyweight champion.

1449
01:05:30,719 --> 01:05:33,679
If if Rockman loses, all four heavyweight title bots are

1450
01:05:33,719 --> 01:05:38,000
now controlled by by fighters from former Soviet Republic, you know, countries,

1451
01:05:38,239 --> 01:05:41,360
Russia and the others I mentioned. It's like inconceivable, and

1452
01:05:41,400 --> 01:05:42,960
they put out a hell of a fight, by the way,

1453
01:05:43,480 --> 01:05:46,719
and like always, what happened is astin Rockman. Other than

1454
01:05:46,760 --> 01:05:48,599
the one time he knocked out Lennox Lewis to become

1455
01:05:48,639 --> 01:05:51,400
the champion, the legit champion, he couldn't close the show.

1456
01:05:51,679 --> 01:05:54,679
Bucker got knocked out, you know, in a fight he

1457
01:05:54,719 --> 01:05:57,719
should have won. That he was winning, and that's all

1458
01:05:57,719 --> 01:05:59,239
she wrote. He got knocked out in the in the

1459
01:05:59,280 --> 01:06:01,400
twelfth round. All you do was kind of hanging on.

1460
01:06:01,440 --> 01:06:03,360
He was a head on one scorecard, he had been

1461
01:06:03,400 --> 01:06:05,920
trailing on two others because he had been you'd been

1462
01:06:06,000 --> 01:06:09,199
kind of fading as the fight went on, and it

1463
01:06:09,360 --> 01:06:12,440
was It wasn't a spectaculary knockout the way it was

1464
01:06:12,480 --> 01:06:13,800
when he got knocked out of the ring in their

1465
01:06:13,800 --> 01:06:17,079
first fight, but it was a conclusive enough victory in

1466
01:06:17,159 --> 01:06:19,039
terms of the way the knocking occurred that you're like, okay,

1467
01:06:19,320 --> 01:06:22,039
MASKIV just got this guy's number, and just it just

1468
01:06:22,079 --> 01:06:24,920
showed once again that Rockman as likable the guy he was,

1469
01:06:24,960 --> 01:06:26,920
and as fun of a fighter as he was to watch.

1470
01:06:26,920 --> 01:06:29,199
He just other than that lennyx flwis fight could not

1471
01:06:29,679 --> 01:06:32,000
close the show. He was making a second defense of

1472
01:06:32,039 --> 01:06:35,320
the WBC belt, and you know, it was one of

1473
01:06:35,320 --> 01:06:37,119
those things, I mean, there was I remember there was

1474
01:06:37,159 --> 01:06:41,840
definitely a somewhat of a split among the ringside media

1475
01:06:41,840 --> 01:06:43,920
and the broadcaster of who was winning the fight. My

1476
01:06:44,039 --> 01:06:47,800
recollection is I had Rockman slightly ahead, others had MASKIV

1477
01:06:47,880 --> 01:06:49,880
slightly ahead. In the end, it really didn't turn out

1478
01:06:49,880 --> 01:06:51,960
to make one bit of difference because he got knocked out.

1479
01:06:52,239 --> 01:06:55,960
I do remember Bob Aram, who promoted the show, lamenting

1480
01:06:56,039 --> 01:06:58,320
on a number of occasions afterwards how much money he

1481
01:06:58,360 --> 01:07:01,119
lost in this event because they put it on HBO

1482
01:07:01,159 --> 01:07:04,599
pay per view and it did very very little in

1483
01:07:04,679 --> 01:07:07,400
terms of the business and was basically rejected. I think

1484
01:07:07,440 --> 01:07:10,119
they it did maybe like fifty thousand buys. It was

1485
01:07:10,159 --> 01:07:12,400
a fight that, you know, I think he he talked

1486
01:07:12,440 --> 01:07:14,719
about needing like probably over one hundred to break even,

1487
01:07:15,480 --> 01:07:18,480
and they just got clobbered on this fight. But it was,

1488
01:07:19,079 --> 01:07:22,000
you know, it was an exciting heavyweight title fight and

1489
01:07:22,000 --> 01:07:24,119
and Rockman got knocked that once again by Maskiff.

1490
01:07:24,440 --> 01:07:26,719
Speaker 1: So what you're telling me is even eighteen years ago,

1491
01:07:26,760 --> 01:07:28,840
there was understanding that not every fight belongs on pay

1492
01:07:28,840 --> 01:07:31,440
per view, and this is an example, and there's a

1493
01:07:31,480 --> 01:07:32,480
spectacular and there were.

1494
01:07:32,360 --> 01:07:34,039
Speaker 2: Some other there were some other decent names on the

1495
01:07:34,039 --> 01:07:37,199
Showy had David Diaz in an interim lightweight title fight

1496
01:07:37,239 --> 01:07:40,440
against Jose Armando Santa Cruz Romberdo Soda who was a

1497
01:07:40,440 --> 01:07:42,599
popular fighter for a while, and one titles and a

1498
01:07:42,639 --> 01:07:44,719
couple of weight classes, and a good fight against Ivan vae.

1499
01:07:45,079 --> 01:07:49,760
He had a young Mikey Garcia who was not known

1500
01:07:49,760 --> 01:07:50,920
at the time. He wasn't on the pay per view,

1501
01:07:50,920 --> 01:07:52,559
he was just deep on the undercart he was in

1502
01:07:52,599 --> 01:07:54,719
a second professional fight. You know, would go on and win,

1503
01:07:55,079 --> 01:07:57,400
you know, titles in like four different weight classes and

1504
01:07:57,400 --> 01:07:59,280
be involved in some very big fights. So you know,

1505
01:07:59,320 --> 01:08:00,679
that's why you always got to pay attention to these

1506
01:08:00,719 --> 01:08:03,480
undercards when you see these promoters put them on. Those

1507
01:08:03,480 --> 01:08:05,199
are the future guys in the main events.

1508
01:08:06,039 --> 01:08:09,199
Speaker 1: Love it some good nostalgia there, and whenever it's the heavyweights,

1509
01:08:09,199 --> 01:08:13,679
we always seem to care more about about them, that's

1510
01:08:13,679 --> 01:08:15,480
for sure. By the way, I'm looking at the Rayfield

1511
01:08:15,559 --> 01:08:18,479
social media and go check out the photo of the

1512
01:08:18,479 --> 01:08:22,920
Triple Hitter, not the Triple Header with Pernell Whittaker, Hector

1513
01:08:22,960 --> 01:08:26,000
Camacho and Mildred Taylor fight poster that you have in

1514
01:08:26,039 --> 01:08:30,359
the Rayfield Collection. We are never We're always unabashed in

1515
01:08:30,479 --> 01:08:34,159
our accolades for the Rayfield Collection to have a poster

1516
01:08:34,239 --> 01:08:36,840
of the Triple Hitter h I. T. T. E. R.

1517
01:08:37,399 --> 01:08:41,119
Marketing for the three fight card that was now thirty

1518
01:08:41,119 --> 01:08:43,159
four years ago Sunday Night, August the eleventh.

1519
01:08:43,359 --> 01:08:44,840
Speaker 2: By the way, back to the heavyweight fight, there was

1520
01:08:44,880 --> 01:08:48,640
a lot of conversation after MASKV defeated Rockman that they

1521
01:08:48,640 --> 01:08:51,800
would try to make a unification fight between mask and Klitchkow,

1522
01:08:52,199 --> 01:08:54,119
and for different reasons done ended up happening. But that

1523
01:08:54,159 --> 01:08:56,479
would have been like a pretty big deal at the time.

1524
01:08:57,039 --> 01:08:58,479
And one of the other things, by the way, dealing

1525
01:08:58,560 --> 01:09:01,520
with with MASKIV from my perspective as a reporter, was

1526
01:09:01,520 --> 01:09:04,399
always fun, is that he was managed by Dennis Rappaport,

1527
01:09:04,439 --> 01:09:06,119
who was one of the biggest looney tunes in the

1528
01:09:06,159 --> 01:09:10,399
history of boxing, probably most famous for managing Jerry Cooney

1529
01:09:10,560 --> 01:09:11,960
back in the day when he thought Larry Hols. I

1530
01:09:11,960 --> 01:09:15,159
did go and check out the HBO twenty what is it?

1531
01:09:15,199 --> 01:09:18,880
The HBO Legendary Knights documentary on that fight between Holmes

1532
01:09:18,920 --> 01:09:20,960
and Cooney. There's a bunch of stuff in there about

1533
01:09:20,960 --> 01:09:23,399
the kind of character that Dennis Rappaport was. I always

1534
01:09:23,439 --> 01:09:25,239
got along good with the guy. To me, he just

1535
01:09:25,279 --> 01:09:26,800
cracked me up every time I talked to him. He

1536
01:09:26,880 --> 01:09:29,000
was he was so over the top and everything. But

1537
01:09:29,439 --> 01:09:31,479
you know, when when maskave was going strong and he

1538
01:09:31,520 --> 01:09:33,359
was near the top and I was dealing with you know,

1539
01:09:33,399 --> 01:09:35,560
Dennis passed a few years ago, but when I would

1540
01:09:35,600 --> 01:09:37,319
deal with them, he had a lot of people hated

1541
01:09:37,319 --> 01:09:40,239
the guy and maybe not the most honest business guy,

1542
01:09:40,279 --> 01:09:41,880
but I didn't do business with him, you know, I

1543
01:09:42,000 --> 01:09:44,319
was dealing with him for stuff on his fighters and

1544
01:09:44,359 --> 01:09:47,119
the guys he worked with. I always enjoyed are back

1545
01:09:47,119 --> 01:09:49,439
and forth. He was a hilarious to deal with. I

1546
01:09:49,479 --> 01:09:52,159
always found him to be very amusing to me. And

1547
01:09:52,560 --> 01:09:54,560
you know, he was one of the guys that when

1548
01:09:54,560 --> 01:09:57,880
you talk about characters in boxing, Dennis Rappaport was a

1549
01:09:57,960 --> 01:09:59,159
character in boxing for sure.

1550
01:10:00,359 --> 01:10:02,319
Speaker 1: Nostalgia on top of the nostalgia, I love it so

1551
01:10:02,600 --> 01:10:05,199
a great action that we have recapped. Again. If you

1552
01:10:05,359 --> 01:10:08,520
enjoy this, make sure you're following, subscribing, rating, and reviewing

1553
01:10:08,560 --> 01:10:12,399
us on Apple's Preaker Spotify. We come your way twice

1554
01:10:12,439 --> 01:10:14,359
every week previewing going into the weekend, and you've been

1555
01:10:14,399 --> 01:10:15,960
listening here to the fight for each to night recap.

1556
01:10:16,000 --> 01:10:19,800
Other than that, we're ready for another week Christian Mobili

1557
01:10:19,920 --> 01:10:21,920
main event later this week. We look forward to that

1558
01:10:22,000 --> 01:10:23,000
super middleweight contend.

1559
01:10:23,079 --> 01:10:26,199
Speaker 2: Let me say one thing about that. Yeah, just so

1560
01:10:26,239 --> 01:10:29,119
we're on the record, we talked about how we all

1561
01:10:29,159 --> 01:10:32,319
thought that the fight between Virgil Ortiz and Sara Bochuk

1562
01:10:32,359 --> 01:10:34,680
would be a good, excellent, exciting action fight.

1563
01:10:35,239 --> 01:10:36,560
Speaker 1: Uh huh, I'm.

1564
01:10:36,319 --> 01:10:41,239
Speaker 2: Telling you right now Mabilly and Devin Schenko, and you

1565
01:10:41,319 --> 01:10:44,359
never know exactly what's gonna happen, but I'm pretty pretty

1566
01:10:44,399 --> 01:10:46,039
sure that that's gonna be.

1567
01:10:46,359 --> 01:10:49,399
Speaker 1: Don't seal up, don't seal up the envelope with your

1568
01:10:49,439 --> 01:10:50,520
fight of the year yet.

1569
01:10:51,000 --> 01:10:53,199
Speaker 2: Yeah, exactly saying we're gonna have a lot to talk about.

1570
01:10:53,199 --> 01:10:55,680
I think after that one, because Devaco is never in

1571
01:10:55,680 --> 01:10:58,399
a bad fight, but Billy is in good fights. They're

1572
01:10:58,439 --> 01:11:01,520
both strong, they both have chins. I think, uh, it's

1573
01:11:01,560 --> 01:11:03,800
it's a it's a very very solid fight.

1574
01:11:03,920 --> 01:11:06,399
Speaker 1: There's a tease for the preview pod later on in

1575
01:11:06,439 --> 01:11:08,199
the week as we come away with the Big Fight

1576
01:11:08,239 --> 01:11:11,600
weekend preview. By the way, as we escape here, one

1577
01:11:11,680 --> 01:11:15,359
of us had Angelo Leo plus three point fifty on

1578
01:11:15,399 --> 01:11:17,960
the bet Us Show on the money line, chu ching.

1579
01:11:18,399 --> 01:11:20,800
I don't get them all right, but that left hook.

1580
01:11:20,880 --> 01:11:23,359
If you had Leo to win, not even by knockout,

1581
01:11:23,479 --> 01:11:25,840
just to win, you were cashing three and a half

1582
01:11:25,840 --> 01:11:26,159
to one.

1583
01:11:26,680 --> 01:11:27,960
Speaker 2: So how I guess I had my good one the

1584
01:11:27,960 --> 01:11:29,439
previous week. I mean, I think you had a loss,

1585
01:11:29,439 --> 01:11:30,760
but we had Bacoli on the big upside.

1586
01:11:31,039 --> 01:11:33,520
Speaker 1: You had Bacoli on the money line. I had him

1587
01:11:33,520 --> 01:11:36,119
by decision. I didn't cash, so I cashed one. I

1588
01:11:36,159 --> 01:11:39,680
think it was plus one eighty plus one. Angratulations, we're giving.

1589
01:11:39,840 --> 01:11:42,279
We're giving some advice out on the bet Us Show,

1590
01:11:42,319 --> 01:11:44,199
and it came through with Angelo Leo. If you were

1591
01:11:44,199 --> 01:11:44,760
on him for.

1592
01:11:44,720 --> 01:11:45,880
Speaker 2: That knockout, that was a good pick.

1593
01:11:46,239 --> 01:11:49,000
Speaker 1: Listen, my friend, have a good week. We're back with

1594
01:11:49,079 --> 01:11:51,760
more later in the week in the preview mode. Thank you,

1595
01:11:51,840 --> 01:11:56,279
Dan Rayfield. Yes, sir, there is our insider. Go subscribe

1596
01:11:56,319 --> 01:11:58,119
to his Fight Preach to Night substack as well, and

1597
01:11:58,159 --> 01:12:00,279
get on the newsletter. Get all the info at all

1598
01:12:00,319 --> 01:12:05,399
the nostalgia news, previews, recaps, and much more historical perspective.

1599
01:12:05,680 --> 01:12:07,600
For now, we are good. I'm merely TJ Reeves on

1600
01:12:07,640 --> 01:12:09,279
the Fight Preach to Night Recap podcast