Speaker 1: Welcome to Destiny. Now here's your host, Cliff Dunning.
Speaker 2: Merry Christmas, Merry Christmas. While I think this is the
Speaker 2: first time we've done a Christmas Day podcast, well we
Speaker 2: recorded it a day before that, but whatever, it's Christmas Day.
Speaker 2: That's a tenth century medieval Christmas song about nine hundred
Speaker 2: years ago, actually closer to the thousand years ago. And
Speaker 2: you can tell by the instruments. They're very rudimentary, very
Speaker 2: earth laden, earthbound instruments would win and some drums. That's
Speaker 2: what they had back then. And that kind of is
Speaker 2: a fitting introduction to our program today, which is all
Speaker 2: about early Christmas and working with the spirits, working with
Speaker 2: the nature, and working with Gaya the planet. So I
Speaker 2: think it's fitting to have that early period piece to
Speaker 2: kind of give us the flavor of what we're gonna
Speaker 2: discuss today. Hey, Hi, this is Cliff, your host of Destiny,
Speaker 2: and I am excited to have our guests back today.
Speaker 2: Ellen Edward Hopmanshe is a pagan, a herbalist, also a
Speaker 2: kind of historian into what our ancestors did during the
Speaker 2: holidays and most notably the winter solstice or otherwise known
Speaker 2: as Christmas time. And this is important to understand because
Speaker 2: we've lost our connection to Gaya in many ways and
Speaker 2: to these spirits that are around and working with us.
Speaker 2: And during the holidays, it's really important to have some
Speaker 2: form of ritual that's either the mule log in our fireplace,
Speaker 2: the mule candle, which is burning a candle Christmas Day
Speaker 2: and then putting our energy into that for a good
Speaker 2: New Year and all the good things that happen. We
Speaker 2: want to also understand and work with the nature spirits.
Speaker 2: And this is something that my grandfather kind of handed
Speaker 2: down to me. He was a immigrant from Germany, and
Speaker 2: they had very traditional Christmas time. They had Christmas breads,
Speaker 2: nut breads, they made their own mead, and then we're
Speaker 2: talking in the early turn of the century. He was
Speaker 2: born in nineteen oh five, and so they practiced a
Speaker 2: different kind of commercial, non commercial Christmas where they all
Speaker 2: got together and they sang carols, and they made their
Speaker 2: own food and they made their own wreaths. But they
Speaker 2: also were very much attuned to the season changes. And
Speaker 2: what we're going to hear about today is just how
Speaker 2: important it is to have a ritual to understand that
Speaker 2: as the seasons change, you understand what happened. You just
Speaker 2: discuss it and then you move on and prepare for
Speaker 2: the new year. And we don't do that. We don't
Speaker 2: we simply just gather. We open presents. People are rushing
Speaker 2: around trying to get people presents. The presents are really
Speaker 2: secondary to acknowledging our place here on the planet. And
Speaker 2: as you'll hear in today's program, these simple rituals that
Speaker 2: are practiced are very, very powerful, and they are thousands
Speaker 2: of years old, and they really show that our ancestors
Speaker 2: were much more in tune to not only the seasons
Speaker 2: that are changing winter, spring, fall, summer, but that but
Speaker 2: that that there are spirits. There are good and they're
Speaker 2: not so good spirits. There are jokesters, and and we
Speaker 2: don't discuss this a great deal of today, but there
Speaker 2: are fairies, and there are unseen elementals. And we've talked
Speaker 2: about elementals. We've talked about beings that are just beyond
Speaker 2: our vision, perhaps dimensional beings that are here on Earth,
Speaker 2: that have been here as long as the Earth has
Speaker 2: been here. And what's important is to understand them, but
Speaker 2: more importantly, it's to take your energy and intend for
Speaker 2: a good year, to come, intend on a healthy future
Speaker 2: and healthy friends and family, intend on success, intend on
Speaker 2: a healthy guy at because if the planet's not healthy,
Speaker 2: we're not going to be healthy. So on this Christmas Day,
Speaker 2: we are thinking about our ancestors, we're thinking about the past.
Speaker 2: We're celebrating, but we're also understanding what we're missing and
Speaker 2: how to correct that with alters, with divination, with rituals,
Speaker 2: and with intention. So today's program is a Pagan's Christmas
Speaker 2: and my guest is Ellen Everett Hopman. It's a holiday,
Speaker 2: it's Christmas. I've never had a show that lands on Christmas,
Speaker 2: and I'm kind of excited about that because that's fun
Speaker 2: and it's the first time. And we're going to go
Speaker 2: to the ancient past this program, we're having the return
Speaker 2: of Ellen Hotman. She wrote a book last year. It
Speaker 2: came out. It's called The Sacred Herbs of Yule and
Speaker 2: Christmas Remedies, Recipes, Magic and Bruise for the Winter Season.
Speaker 2: And we touched on it just briefly last year and
Speaker 2: it is a fascinating book. It's very well researched. And
Speaker 2: if you don't know who Ellen is, she is a
Speaker 2: master herbalist. She's also a homeopath. She's been a Drink
Speaker 2: Initiate since nineteen eighty four. She's a founding member of
Speaker 2: the Order of the White Oak arch Judas and founder
Speaker 2: of the Tribe of the Oak, and a former professor
Speaker 2: of Gray School of Wizardry. And the thing that's important
Speaker 2: about talking with someone like Ellen is we're into this
Speaker 2: commercial scene, get your trigue, get the lights, have your
Speaker 2: friends over, and we're forgetting the fundamentals of the energy
Speaker 2: behind the winter Solstice, which is Christmas, and we want
Speaker 2: to talk about this. We want to bring this energy
Speaker 2: back and we're going to talk about the rituals that
Speaker 2: our ancestors practice around this time of year, and it
Speaker 2: has to do with the unseen world, and it has
Speaker 2: to do with the energy of seasonal changes and what
Speaker 2: that means to us as physical beings. So Ellen, welcome
Speaker 2: to Destiny. Good to see you again, and happy Solstice.
Speaker 1: Happy Yule and Kwanza and Hankhah and everything that's going on.
Speaker 2: There's a lot of holidays to mention during this time year,
Speaker 2: isn't there. Kwanzahnika and of course Christmas.
Speaker 1: Right, Yeah, everybody celebrates the light, the return of the light.
Speaker 1: The nice thing is that no matter where you are
Speaker 1: on the planet. We all experience the dark and then
Speaker 1: the return of the light. It's universal right, no matter
Speaker 1: what religion you are.
Speaker 2: One of the things I want you to touch on
Speaker 2: as we bring in our ancestors today is the fact
Speaker 2: that they were very much in touch with the spirits
Speaker 2: of the winter of the solstice. And in your book
Speaker 2: you talk about the act of spirits coming into the
Speaker 2: homes and leaving. What was the sense that our ancestors
Speaker 2: had of these nature spirits.
Speaker 1: Well, this is the darkest time of year, so the
Speaker 1: feeling was that these dark, dark energies that live underground
Speaker 1: emerge at this time of year because this is that
Speaker 1: the earth is dark, so it's they feel comfortable, the
Speaker 1: most comfortable time for them. So, for example, in the
Speaker 1: Greek tradition, you have these horrible little, cloven foot black
Speaker 1: elves that can invade the house, and so you have
Speaker 1: to be very careful. You have to make sure all
Speaker 1: the windows are shut, the doors are shut, no cracks.
Speaker 1: There's one problem though, the chimney, you know, and everybody
Speaker 1: had a chimney, right, so they can always come down
Speaker 1: the chimney. And this idea of spirits coming down the
Speaker 1: chimney is fairly universal. It's not just Santa Claus who
Speaker 1: comes down the chimney. There's a lot of a lot
Speaker 1: of you know La Bifanna, who's the Italian Christmas, which
Speaker 1: she gets in down the chimney because if everything else
Speaker 1: is closed, the only other opening is the keyhole. So
Speaker 1: it's a good idea to make sure you have a
Speaker 1: key in the keyhole because they can come in through
Speaker 1: the keyhole or down the chimney. So these elves, they
Speaker 1: only come around this time at the darkest time of year.
Speaker 1: You had to take caution. You could burn the herb
Speaker 1: hissop in your fireplace and that repelled them. And if
Speaker 1: things if weird things were happening in the house, like
Speaker 1: things were breaking on accountably or disappearing. I mean I've
Speaker 1: had that happen. You know, something that you always put
Speaker 1: in the same place, all of a sudden it's gone,
Speaker 1: you know, like what the heck. So you know that
Speaker 1: these elves are around. If it gets really bad, what
Speaker 1: you do is you take a strip of leather. And
Speaker 1: it's fascinating to me that this is both in the
Speaker 1: Greek tradition, it's also in the Scottish tradition. If you
Speaker 1: have a really bad infestation. You take a strip of
Speaker 1: leather and you burn that in the fireplace. And the
Speaker 1: Greek tradition it's all old shoes. In the Scottish tradition
Speaker 1: it's a piece of leather. But but you do a
Speaker 1: lot of protection spells. I guess you would say at
Speaker 1: this time, that's why we partly why we hang holly
Speaker 1: on the door. For example, Holly is a warrior plant,
Speaker 1: and because you know if you grab a bunch of holly,
Speaker 1: it's going to prick you, right, you hang holly on
Speaker 1: the door and that will prevent evil spirits from coming in.
Speaker 1: And there's just a lot like that.
Speaker 2: So how do we I mean, during that period of
Speaker 2: time we're communing with these spirits and being you know,
Speaker 2: bothered by them. What would the local shaman slash witch
Speaker 2: slash herbalists do? Would would she be available or he
Speaker 2: be available for consultations on issues regarding specific problems?
Speaker 1: Yeah, well, there are a lot of the herbs that
Speaker 1: are associated with Christmas. In the book, I have lots
Speaker 1: and lots of herbs, and I talk about the magical
Speaker 1: properties and the medicinal properties as well, But a lot
Speaker 1: of the Christmas specific plants like I said, Holly, there's
Speaker 1: just a lot of them. Bay Laurel is another one.
Speaker 1: In Rome, they would hang a wreath of laurel on
Speaker 1: the door, which symbolizes victory. You know. The victors in
Speaker 1: the Olympic Games were crowned with laurel wreaths, right, and
Speaker 1: they had poetry. I think they need to bring this back.
Speaker 1: They also had poetry competitions at the Olympic Games and
Speaker 1: they got a laurel wreath.
Speaker 2: You know.
Speaker 1: But by hanging a wreath on the laurel, you're saying
Speaker 1: it's a symbol of victory and strength, you know. So
Speaker 1: that's gonna scare away any any potential spirits. And there's
Speaker 1: I mean in the book I talk about a lot
Speaker 1: of these things. The spirit A lot of the spirits
Speaker 1: that want to attack the house are not that bright.
Speaker 1: So there are things you can do. For example, if
Speaker 1: you put an upside down calender. You know, calenders have
Speaker 1: holes in them. You put an upside down calender in
Speaker 1: front of the door, and the spirits will look at
Speaker 1: that and try to count the holes, and they'll get
Speaker 1: so preoccupied with because they can't count beyond two, so
Speaker 1: one two one, you know, And they'll get lost and
Speaker 1: then they won't come in the house, you know. Or
Speaker 1: you can throw things on the roof. That's another tradition.
Speaker 1: You know, balls of cake or bread or something, you
Speaker 1: throw that on the roof. I mean, there's a lot
Speaker 1: of that in the book. You know, how to protect
Speaker 1: the house.
Speaker 2: So I'm calling them nature spirits. But where there are
Speaker 2: specific names and specific problems with these entities, I mean,
Speaker 2: you're talking about their jokesters, is what it sounds like.
Speaker 2: But are there levels to these guys where somebody could
Speaker 2: get in real trouble if they don't get their act together?
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, where wolves are active at this time of year.
Speaker 1: This is one of the most active times for were wolves.
Speaker 2: Oh my god.
Speaker 1: And in the Eastern European tradition this is where wolf time.
Speaker 1: So fire magic is big at Christmas. That's why we
Speaker 1: have Christmas candles, Christmas bonfires. We put lights on the house,
Speaker 1: we put lights on the tree. That's all fire magic,
Speaker 1: which we remember from ancient times, which is also protective
Speaker 1: because remember, these nasty things they like the dark, and
Speaker 1: so we make it so it's not dark. But if
Speaker 1: you want to repel where wolves, you take ashes from
Speaker 1: the from the fireplace and you throw them on the
Speaker 1: entrance way, and that repair repels were wolves according to
Speaker 1: Eastern European tradition. But I think that that there's something
Speaker 1: much older going on there there. In the old times,
Speaker 1: it was probably embers lit embers that you would throw
Speaker 1: out in the snow, because again you're putting light out there,
Speaker 1: and that's going to prevent any of these dark entities
Speaker 1: from approaching.
Speaker 2: We're going to get into the mule log here in
Speaker 2: a second, but before we do, are there during the
Speaker 2: transition period, is there a time to have your your
Speaker 2: altar set up? And are there special practices that we
Speaker 2: would you know, divinations and other rituals that we would
Speaker 2: practice at the beginning of well where the right now
Speaker 2: we're in the saustice, which was a twenty first of December.
Speaker 2: Is there something leading up to the solstice that's very critical?
Speaker 1: Well, if you look at Newgrange in Ireland, which is
Speaker 1: five thousand years old, you look at Stonehenge, you know
Speaker 1: the solstice you could say it hasn't finished yet. It's
Speaker 1: about a five day period, so it's not too late
Speaker 1: to celebrate solstice. You can still do it. Really, the
Speaker 1: sun appears to stand still for roughly five days. So
Speaker 1: what you would do for a solstice ceremony is you
Speaker 1: would gather your friends and relatives and you would come
Speaker 1: into a room and you would make sure there was
Speaker 1: no light whatsoever, because what we're doing is you're honoring
Speaker 1: the dark because again this is the darkest time of year,
Speaker 1: so we're following the cycle of nature, which is dark
Speaker 1: right now. So you start in the dark, and then
Speaker 1: you talk about the past year, what happened during the
Speaker 1: wheel of the year. You know, what happened at solstice,
Speaker 1: what happened in the spring, what happened in the summer,
Speaker 1: what happened in the fall, what happened in the winter.
Speaker 1: You share stories, you might honor the earth, nature, the animals,
Speaker 1: you know, whatever you feel like giving. It's you give
Speaker 1: thanks basically in the dark. Everybody's in the dark.
Speaker 2: In the dark.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and it's really dark, because after about five o'clock
Speaker 1: it's completely dark. You know, you make sure you turn out.
Speaker 1: There's no electronics, you know, there's no Christmas tree, nothing,
Speaker 1: just dark and you're sitting there in the dark. And
Speaker 1: then when you're done with all that, one person lights
Speaker 1: a candle and then everybody in the room is holding
Speaker 1: a little candle, and then that first person lights the
Speaker 1: candle of the person next to them, and that person
Speaker 1: lights the candle of the person next to them, and
Speaker 1: then you go around the room and gradually the whole
Speaker 1: room is filled with light. Okay, And so it's the
Speaker 1: return of the sun. And you can even call out
Speaker 1: to the sun. I used to, I'm too old now.
Speaker 1: I used to get up before dawn, even if it
Speaker 1: was snowing in the dark, you know, and go up
Speaker 1: a hill. There was a bunch of people that I
Speaker 1: did this with every year, and we would wait for
Speaker 1: the sun to come up, and when the sun appeared,
Speaker 1: we would start chanting and singing and playing instruments. And
Speaker 1: that's another thing you can do just to welcome the
Speaker 1: sun back. And then we would go share gifts and
Speaker 1: have breakfast.
Speaker 3: You know.
Speaker 2: This was on Christmas Eve, Christmas.
Speaker 1: Solstice Solstice morning.
Speaker 2: The twenty first, Yeah, Solstice morning, okay morning, And anyways,
Speaker 2: the solstice happening is much more powerful in this artificial
Speaker 2: twenty fifth of December, which is supposed to be the
Speaker 2: day of Christ's birth.
Speaker 1: Yeah, the twenty fifth of December was chosen as a date.
Speaker 1: It has nothing to do with Jesus. He wasn't born
Speaker 1: on the twenty fifth of December. It's actually the birthday
Speaker 1: of the god Mithras, who's a god to fight, Okay,
Speaker 1: And so so the church did what they usually did.
Speaker 1: They co opted a pagan celebration to make Christmas because
Speaker 1: everybody was used to celebrating on the twenty fifth of December,
Speaker 1: so they just took that date. They took the holiday.
Speaker 2: One thing is funny though, and I want you to
Speaker 2: really briefly talk about this ellen which is a Saint
Speaker 2: Nicholas actually came in your book. He seems to understand
Speaker 2: these spirits. So Saint nick is actually a pagan priest.
Speaker 2: It seems like or a shaman of some kind. Who
Speaker 2: is who is? And I could have this wrong. He
Speaker 2: is banishing the dark forces in a way, because we
Speaker 2: see him in a number of different situations. Talk a
Speaker 2: little bit about Saint Nicholas.
Speaker 1: Well, he was an actual person. He was a bishop.
Speaker 1: I think I don't have my notes in front of me,
Speaker 1: but no, he was an actual person, and he was
Speaker 1: very generous. He was definitely a church He was a
Speaker 1: bishop or an archbishop, and he gave away his possessions
Speaker 1: his money to the poor and he was very famous
Speaker 1: for that. So he was a real guy. And in fact,
Speaker 1: archaeologists you can look this up just recently, they have
Speaker 1: his skull, so they were able to re create his
Speaker 1: face and guess what he looks like Santa Claus. Oh,
Speaker 1: my god, looks just like Santa Claus. Yeah, it's amazing.
Speaker 1: But no, he was very generous and for example, there
Speaker 1: was a very poor family that had daughters and they
Speaker 1: were so poor that the daughters would have had to
Speaker 1: go into prostitution because that would be the only way
Speaker 1: the family could survive. So he gave money to the
Speaker 1: family so that the daughters wouldn't have to do that. Wow,
Speaker 1: that was the kind of thing he did.
Speaker 2: So the image of him with the crampises, which are
Speaker 2: the kind of a spirit, is kind of a folk tale,
Speaker 2: and that's that's that's not true.
Speaker 1: Because Crampis is fairly new as I understand it. That's
Speaker 1: a new thing. It's not an ancient pagan thing. But
Speaker 1: Crampis is very useful at Christmas time for controlling children.
Speaker 2: Yeah. Actually, let our audience know that Crampus is this
Speaker 2: kind of an evil looking with horns, devil like figure
Speaker 2: who uh, spanks children to keep them in h in
Speaker 2: good good behavior. I guess I'm not sure quite what
Speaker 2: he does.
Speaker 1: But even worse, he will abduct children and put them
Speaker 1: in a basket that he carries on his back and
Speaker 1: he will ski away with them. So and and yeah,
Speaker 1: and he has a switch. And you know, I mean
Speaker 1: I was born in Austria. I lived in Germany as
Speaker 1: well when I was little. And you can always threaten
Speaker 1: kids around Christmas time, like hey, you know campus is
Speaker 1: gonna come, or you're not you know, you're not going
Speaker 1: to get any presents, you know whatever, and it works.
Speaker 2: They actually had in San Antonio this year they had
Speaker 2: a big Crampis festival, first time apparently, and it's kind
Speaker 2: of taking a route in the United States different places.
Speaker 2: It's huge in Germany and a yeah, and you can
Speaker 2: actually have somebody carved out of wood. I don't know
Speaker 2: how much it costs, probably expensive. A Crampis figure fascinating,
Speaker 2: very strange. Let's talk about the yule log, the creation
Speaker 2: of the yule log. When did that start and what
Speaker 2: is the purpose of creating the mule log?
Speaker 1: Okay, well, again this goes back to fire magic. It's
Speaker 1: part of the fire magic theme. But Yule log is
Speaker 1: a continuous fire that protects the home in the darkest
Speaker 1: part of the year. Same thing, Okay, so in medieval times.
Speaker 1: In ancient times, they would have had a whole tree,
Speaker 1: basically a giant log, and you just keep feeding it
Speaker 1: into the fireplace continuously during the dark time of year.
Speaker 1: So in France, the whole family would go out to
Speaker 1: cut down the log with ceremonial. In Norway's it was
Speaker 1: the father of the home. In England it was cut
Speaker 1: at in bulk or Candlemus, which is in February, and
Speaker 1: then put aside to dry for the year. In Serbia
Speaker 1: it had to be cut early on Christmas morning and
Speaker 1: then it was brought into the house by candle light
Speaker 1: in the evening. So but I mean, they're all everybody's
Speaker 1: doing the same thing. They're bringing this perpetual fire, and
Speaker 1: that's going to keep evil spirits from coming down the chimney.
Speaker 1: Although how Santa Claus bypasses on side, I guess it's
Speaker 1: more powerful. But so what you do is and and
Speaker 1: also if you I don't understand, if you cut a
Speaker 1: tree in the morning and then try to burn it
Speaker 1: in the evening, it's probably going to be pretty green.
Speaker 1: I don't know. I like the English version better, but anyway,
Speaker 1: so traditionally you would decorate the Yule log as you
Speaker 1: were dragging it to the house. You might sprinkle grain
Speaker 1: or wheat on it, and I have a whole chapter
Speaker 1: on that on grain. Grain itself is incredibly spiritual, very symbolic.
Speaker 1: It's the power of the sun and the growth of
Speaker 1: the warm half of the year, which is contained in
Speaker 1: the grain. So you put that on the Yule log.
Speaker 1: You might put bread on the mule log, a loaf
Speaker 1: of bread, because that's made from the grain. Of course,
Speaker 1: herbs like juniper, which is an herb of purification. Coins.
Speaker 1: After you bring the log into the house, everything that
Speaker 1: was riding on the log on the way into the house,
Speaker 1: like the bread and the coins and all that. Now
Speaker 1: it has magical power because it's got the power of
Speaker 1: the season, and you can give away the coins or
Speaker 1: eat the bread.
Speaker 2: We're going to take a short commercial break to allow
Speaker 2: our sponsors to identify themselves, and we will return shortly
Speaker 2: with my guest today, Ellen Everett Hopmann, discussing her holiday
Speaker 2: book The Sacred Herbs of Yule and Christmas. Will be
Speaker 2: right back.
Speaker 1: We wish you, I me Christmas. We wish you.
Speaker 2: I me Christmas, We wish you Christmass. Ellen Everett Hotman
Speaker 2: is my guest today and she is a pagan who
Speaker 2: has studied Winter Solstice rituals, mostly in Europe, but in
Speaker 2: other parts of the planet. And we're getting a sense
Speaker 2: of how our ancestors celebrated among spirits and also Gaya,
Speaker 2: this yule log could be a whole tree that they
Speaker 2: keep cutting and feeding into the fire. Is that what
Speaker 2: you're suggesting.
Speaker 1: You don't have to cut it, you just keep pushing
Speaker 1: it in as it burns.
Speaker 2: Oh so it's sticking out into the yeah, round of
Speaker 2: the fireplace?
Speaker 1: Right.
Speaker 2: Wow.
Speaker 1: You could also put alcohol sprinkle wine or vodka or
Speaker 1: something like that on it. And coins are solar symbols,
Speaker 1: so round coins, I mean, gold would be the ideal,
Speaker 1: but who has gold coins? And you know there's the
Speaker 1: chocolate ones I guess, but that's the symbol of the
Speaker 1: sun again. And what else In England? Oak would be
Speaker 1: traditional in France, cherry in Scotland, Birch, so depending on
Speaker 1: where you are. Yeah, so it's burned from Christmas Day
Speaker 1: until January fifth.
Speaker 2: Oh my god, So this is an ongoing. Yeah, it's
Speaker 2: an energy. Talk about the divination behind that, because in
Speaker 2: part of your book you say that you can take
Speaker 2: the ash from the yule log and place it at
Speaker 2: the entrance of the door to keep spirits away.
Speaker 1: Yeah, well, the you always keep some of the yule
Speaker 1: log and you can hide it in the eves of
Speaker 1: the house, you know, or just keep it somewhere because
Speaker 1: it's very protective. And of course if you need to
Speaker 1: repel were wolves, I would save some of the ash.
Speaker 2: That's the first time you've gotten into some scary stuff
Speaker 2: like where wolves ellen getting into a horror show here.
Speaker 1: Well, you know, it's the dark time of year, the
Speaker 1: wild hunt is flying across the sky, and you got
Speaker 1: witches coming down the chimney and were wolves at the door.
Speaker 1: I mean, in ancient times, this was a scary time.
Speaker 1: Imagine your fire goes out, your nearest neighbor is miles away.
Speaker 1: You know. It wasn't a joke.
Speaker 2: So people are imbuing this mulelog with their hopes and
Speaker 2: wishes and blessings, and it is becoming a healing and
Speaker 2: a piece of protection, is what it sounds like. Yeah,
Speaker 2: or these special times of year, right, Wow, that's amazing.
Speaker 1: It's all about fire magic. So just think of fire,
Speaker 1: whether it's an electric bulb, a candle, a fire in
Speaker 1: the fireplace, that ule lug, it's all the same thing.
Speaker 1: It's fire magic. You know, in ancient times they didn't
Speaker 1: have electricity, so any kind of fire, even just carrying
Speaker 1: lit coals around the house. In Scotland there's a tradition
Speaker 1: called saning, so when you move into a new house
Speaker 1: you have to purify the house and land. So you
Speaker 1: take lit coals, lit embers, you put them in a
Speaker 1: shovel and you walk around the house three times with
Speaker 1: that to purify the house. It's fire magic, that's what
Speaker 1: that is.
Speaker 2: People who don't have a fireplace, which I mean this
Speaker 2: is modern time, or if somebody in the seventeenth century
Speaker 2: live in an apartment, you talk about the mule candle,
Speaker 2: which is the same kind of a thing, but on
Speaker 2: a smaller scale. Describe that for us.
Speaker 1: Yeah, so again fire magic. It's part of the fire magic.
Speaker 1: But in England a mule candle was lit and burned
Speaker 1: all day on Christmas. Okay, in Scandinavia was lit on
Speaker 1: Christmas even burned all night. So in both cases you
Speaker 1: save the stub and then you can rub that on
Speaker 1: the plow, and you can also hide it somewhere in
Speaker 1: the house to protect the house from storms and again,
Speaker 1: and this fire magic just goes on and on and on.
Speaker 1: In Shetland, a Viking long ship is carried through town
Speaker 1: and then set on fire. In Scotland there's the burning
Speaker 1: of the Klavi, which is a wooden barrel filled with
Speaker 1: tar that is set on fire and rolled down the
Speaker 1: hill and everybody tries to get an ember from that
Speaker 1: for luck to put somewhere in the house. And in
Speaker 1: modern times, what do we do. We decorate the house
Speaker 1: with lights and we put lights on the Christmas tree.
Speaker 2: It's the same idea our ancestors. Would they get the
Speaker 2: candle from a shaman, a witch, a pagan, somebody who
Speaker 2: was kind of a nature connected to nature more than them,
Speaker 2: and that would be made by somebody with a special technique.
Speaker 1: No, I don't think so. Just a regular candle.
Speaker 2: Okay, no, because it's a certain time of year, that
Speaker 2: candle's imbued with certain energy, the thoughts, the feelings, the
Speaker 2: hopes and wishes.
Speaker 1: Well, it's the fire itself. It's not the candle so
Speaker 1: much as the fire. Yeah, and yeah, in some traditions,
Speaker 1: you leave a candle burning outside and that's supposed to
Speaker 1: be or in the window, and that's a symbol that
Speaker 1: tells neighbors that somebody's home and that you can come visit,
Speaker 1: or you can come inside if you need to get warm.
Speaker 1: You know, there's just a lot around fire that it's
Speaker 1: all to counteract the dark forces at this time of year,
Speaker 1: that's what it is.
Speaker 2: This is the first time I've heard about the candle,
Speaker 2: the old candle, so I definitely want to do that.
Speaker 2: I think for those of us who are not able,
Speaker 2: who don't have a fireplace, a candle's wonderful. And then
Speaker 2: to burn it all day that's easy to do. Is
Speaker 2: there any suggestions for rituals or divination of that candle
Speaker 2: that we should be thinking about.
Speaker 1: Well, be careful, just be careful.
Speaker 2: Where you put the candle, right, Yeah.
Speaker 1: I mean I used to. I used to do a
Speaker 1: candle vigil, I guess every month, but I had to
Speaker 1: go to work and the thought of leaving a candle
Speaker 1: burning in the house was a little much. So I
Speaker 1: finally figured out I could leave it in the bathtub,
Speaker 1: right because even if the cat knocked it over it
Speaker 1: wasn't going to catch anything on fire. Make sure the
Speaker 1: you know, the shower curtain is far from the candle. Yeah,
Speaker 1: but yeah, you could put it in the kitchen sink,
Speaker 1: or you could put it in the bathtub, and then
Speaker 1: you can go to work. That's what I used to do.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and again when it's burnt to the bottom, that
Speaker 2: that remaining candle symbol is a symbol for a good
Speaker 2: coming year.
Speaker 1: Yes, and protection and purification.
Speaker 2: Well, that's easy to do. Yeah.
Speaker 1: You can carry the stub in your pocket, or you
Speaker 1: can hide it somewhere in the house, you know, but
Speaker 1: ever you want. It's got that fire energy. It's fire
Speaker 1: is sacred. You know. In ancient Indo European tradition, the
Speaker 1: whole world was made of fire and water. Those were
Speaker 1: the two basic elements. Everything you looked at was a
Speaker 1: combination of fire and water, except in Scandinavia it was
Speaker 1: fire and ice. But it's the same thing, you know.
Speaker 1: So if you're working magic, water is very important. You
Speaker 1: can do water spells and fire is very important. But
Speaker 1: this time of year, it's fire.
Speaker 2: And obviously, and we're going to get into this shortly.
Speaker 2: If you have an altar, your candle should be around
Speaker 2: your other sacred objects. Right, talk a little quick briefly
Speaker 2: about the altar in light, Okay, to.
Speaker 1: Keep your keep the house from burning down. It's always
Speaker 1: a good idea if you're gonna do that, if you're
Speaker 1: gonna have a candle burning all day on the altar.
Speaker 1: It's nice to have a metal cauldron and you can
Speaker 1: put one candle in there or three candles in there.
Speaker 1: The number three is very important in Indo European thinking, Underworld,
Speaker 1: Middle World, Upper World, triple deities. You know, the number three, land, sea,
Speaker 1: and sky. Three candles is very nice. Or just one
Speaker 1: candle in a cauldron, a metal cauldron. Just be very
Speaker 1: cautious when you.
Speaker 2: Do that, you know, Okay, yeah, you're right. We don't
Speaker 2: have people burning their homes down. For those of you listening,
Speaker 2: there you go. There's an ancient tradition that Ellen's presenting
Speaker 2: to us. Get your candle out. Light it Christmas morning
Speaker 2: when you get up, let it burn all the way
Speaker 2: through the day and there.
Speaker 1: You Christmas Eve if you want.
Speaker 2: Yeah, so there you go. You got you have a
Speaker 2: sacred a sacred item to carry with you. I want
Speaker 2: to talk about something that I thought that was quite fun,
Speaker 2: which was weather divinations and predicting upcoming weather.
Speaker 1: Okay, so traditionally farmers, you know, most people were farmers.
Speaker 1: Farmers would pay a lot of attention to what was
Speaker 1: happening with the weather around youle For example, if you
Speaker 1: had a green Christmas or a warm winter, that was
Speaker 1: bad news. And because there was a saying, you know
Speaker 1: that if if you have a warm Christmas, the graveyards
Speaker 1: will fill up. And modern science they didn't know this,
Speaker 1: but modern science will tell you that you need the cold.
Speaker 1: Like I'm really grateful that we got snow last night.
Speaker 1: We haven't had here in Massachusetts. We haven't had a
Speaker 1: white Christmas in decades, but we've had very cold weather.
Speaker 1: Not cold enough. You really need ten degrees or colder
Speaker 1: ten below would be great. What it does is it
Speaker 1: kills off noxious insects, It kills off pathogens, disease germs.
Speaker 1: You know, it's good. Cold weather is good. So if again,
Speaker 1: if you had a warm Christmas, that was bad news.
Speaker 1: And I remember during COVID we had a very warm Christmas.
Speaker 1: Because I remember, it.
Speaker 2: Helps perpetuate disease processes and viruses and things like that. Exactly,
Speaker 2: it's not cold to kill them off.
Speaker 1: It also means that plants are not going to grow
Speaker 1: as well. If you have a lot of snow and
Speaker 1: a very cold Christmas or a very cold winter, plants
Speaker 1: are going to grow better. And again it's because the
Speaker 1: plants get attacked by the insects. If the insects aren't
Speaker 1: killed off, like the wooly adulged for example, that's attacking
Speaker 1: all the yew trees.
Speaker 2: Now.
Speaker 1: The only way to get rid of it is you
Speaker 1: need to have several days where it's ten below. And
Speaker 1: I can remember, you know, thirty years ago here in Massachusetts,
Speaker 1: we always had a week or two when it was
Speaker 1: ten below because the pipes would freeze. You know, that
Speaker 1: hasn't happened in you know, I haven't seen that in
Speaker 1: twenty thirty years. But that kind of cold is very important.
Speaker 1: So other kinds of divination. Unmarried women would go to
Speaker 1: the hen house. A lot of my friends. I live
Speaker 1: in western mass so a lot of my friends have
Speaker 1: hen houses. You go there on Christmas Eve, you tap
Speaker 1: on the door, and if a hen responds, that means
Speaker 1: that the woman will remain a spinster. But if a
Speaker 1: rooster crows, that means that she will marry and then
Speaker 1: New Year's which is coming up in just a few days.
Speaker 1: There's a British tradition called the flower of the well
Speaker 1: and that's the first water drawn from the well on
Speaker 1: New Year's when the sun hits. The first person that
Speaker 1: gets the first water from the well that brings a
Speaker 1: lot of luck. And if it's a woman, she will
Speaker 1: marry within the year. I guess women were more worried
Speaker 1: about getting married than men were. But the flower of
Speaker 1: the well was given to the cows to keep them
Speaker 1: healthy and to guarantee more milk. You could keep it
Speaker 1: in a bottle to protect the house. So other things
Speaker 1: they would look at is berries. If the holly bush
Speaker 1: had a lot of berries, that meant that the winter
Speaker 1: coming up was going to be very hard, because nature
Speaker 1: is always smarter than we are, and nature always knows.
Speaker 1: But um, I don't know. That's not really divination. If
Speaker 1: you want divination, there's a Polish tradition where hot wax
Speaker 1: was poured through a key over water. So you have
Speaker 1: a large key, you pour melted hot wax through the
Speaker 1: key into the water, and then you see what image
Speaker 1: appears in the water.
Speaker 2: One of the things I wanted you to talk about
Speaker 2: is that And you write this in your book divination
Speaker 2: for luck and friendship, and people would make specific kinds
Speaker 2: of cakes and puddings talk about that, which I follow
Speaker 2: just because we did that last year. We talked about baking,
Speaker 2: but I didn't know that they could make a pudding
Speaker 2: that would have those properties.
Speaker 1: It could be a pudding like a rice pudding. It
Speaker 1: could be any kind of a grain dish, because again
Speaker 1: grain is very symbolic. It holds the energy of the sun.
Speaker 1: It could be a cake cake.
Speaker 2: Is what would be the ingredients? Though, Allan, what would
Speaker 2: be when you're making a cake for friendship and for luck.
Speaker 1: Really it could be any cake. It could be any pudding.
Speaker 1: But what you're doing is you're doing divination for the
Speaker 1: coming year. So you have little symbolic tokens that are
Speaker 1: hidden in the cake. And it could be nuts. It
Speaker 1: could be like an almond. Whoever finds the almond has
Speaker 1: a lot of luck. Or it could be more specific,
Speaker 1: you know, like a coin, uh for wealth obviously you know,
Speaker 1: a symbol, a little piece of cloths. I mean, it
Speaker 1: could be anything. You just ahead of time you assigned
Speaker 1: meaning to these symbols, and then whoever gets the thing
Speaker 1: whatever it is that's there, that's the divination for their
Speaker 1: coming year.
Speaker 2: So I can see that with baking into the cake,
Speaker 2: a thimble, a coin of some kind or some other symbology.
Speaker 2: But what are we taught. How are we doing this
Speaker 2: with a pudding.
Speaker 1: Well, when you're making pudding, you know, it starts out
Speaker 1: liquid and then it solidifies. So while it's in the
Speaker 1: liquid state, you just stick it in there, okay, and
Speaker 1: then you dish it out or people serve themselves and
Speaker 1: whoever gets the symbol, whatever it is, it's their divination.
Speaker 2: You're a cook, Allan, So I'm not a cook. So
Speaker 2: tell give us an example of a pudding, is it
Speaker 2: because we don't have They didn't have chocolate like we
Speaker 2: have now. They had they made like fruit puddings or
Speaker 2: or rice puddings.
Speaker 1: Ice. Yeah, rice is very traditional rice pudding. There's all
Speaker 1: kinds of grain puddings, grain and honey, honey. But that again,
Speaker 1: honey is a solar symbol. It's golden grain holds the
Speaker 1: energy of the sun. You can hide a coin in there,
Speaker 1: you know. And I have recipes in the book.
Speaker 2: By the way, thank you for reminding me. Ellen has
Speaker 2: put in not only recipes, but all types of techniques
Speaker 2: to build your altar. What should be on the altar.
Speaker 2: We're going to talk about aultars here in a second.
Speaker 2: And she has recipes almost on every chapter. I think
Speaker 2: you have a recipe for something.
Speaker 1: For every herb. I have a lot of herbs in there,
Speaker 1: all the herbs asociated with Christmas. And for every herb,
Speaker 1: I give the magical properties, the medicinal properties, and a
Speaker 1: recipe so that you it's called kitchen witchery or hearth druidry.
Speaker 1: So what you do is you learn the magical properties
Speaker 1: of a particular herb or spice, and then you can
Speaker 1: make a dish that incorporates that herb or spice, and
Speaker 1: you can eat it or give it to somebody else.
Speaker 1: I mean, the recipes are in the book. You don't
Speaker 1: have to think this way, but if you want to,
Speaker 1: you can. And then that's it becomes a spell, it
Speaker 1: becomes a brew, you know, a magical brew or a potion.
Speaker 1: That's what.
Speaker 2: So the cook is intending for the recipient of this
Speaker 2: meal or brew drink to receive and enhancements.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and what's interesting is a lot of people do
Speaker 1: this and they don't even realize what they're doing. For example,
Speaker 1: in the south of the US, there's a tradition of
Speaker 1: at New Year's you have to have corn bread, you
Speaker 1: have to have beans, and you have to have greens. Okay,
Speaker 1: so what's going on there. Corn Bread is golden, which
Speaker 1: symbolizes gold. Beans symbolize coins. And then the greenery, whether
Speaker 1: it's collareds or kale or you know something green spinach,
Speaker 1: that symbolizes money. And so by serving that at New Year's,
Speaker 1: what you're doing is you're creating prosperity. You're invoking prosperity
Speaker 1: for the people that eat it. And you know that's
Speaker 1: a spell right there, that's a spell.
Speaker 2: Well, intending things to happen to the recipient of food.
Speaker 2: That's magic, right.
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's magic. And I give a whole bunch of
Speaker 1: recipes and drink recipes and food recipes, and I go
Speaker 1: through all the different herbs and spices and so you
Speaker 1: can pick them out and depending on what you need.
Speaker 1: If you need protection, if you need prosperity, if you
Speaker 1: need abundance, if you need love, you know, whatever it
Speaker 1: needs you need, and you make a dish.
Speaker 2: We're going to take a short commercial break to allow
Speaker 2: our sponsors to identify themselves, and we will return shortly
Speaker 2: with my guest today, Ellen Everett Hopmann, the Sacred Herbs
Speaker 2: of Yule and Christmas. We'll rejoin you shortly every Christmas.
Speaker 4: Baby rain Das is coming out to play. Cross is back, and.
Speaker 2: We're discussing how our ancestors celebrated winter Solstice in the
Speaker 2: resulting holiday known as Christmas thousands of years ago. This
Speaker 2: is all featured in a new book called The Sacred
Speaker 2: Herbs of Yule and Christmas. Give us a sample of
Speaker 2: what a new relationship food or drink would be. What
Speaker 2: would what would you make to create something like that?
Speaker 1: Well, in the book, I talk about the ancient historical
Speaker 1: meaning also of the foods and spices. For example, chocolate.
Speaker 1: Chocolate was a sacred drink. It was brought to the
Speaker 1: earth by the god Ketzikuadal, who's the feathered serpent, who
Speaker 1: brought it down on the rays of the morning Star.
Speaker 1: So it came from the sky world, and it was
Speaker 1: so sacred that only royalty and nobles were allowed to
Speaker 1: eat it or drink it. And we go to the
Speaker 1: stop and shopping, you know, and buy a bunch of
Speaker 1: powdered chocolate anytime we want or go to the seven
Speaker 1: to eleven and get a chocolate bar. I mean, in
Speaker 1: those in ancient times you must know this, with the
Speaker 1: maya and so on, chocolate was very very special. So
Speaker 1: the magical property that chocolate had was it enabled you
Speaker 1: to strengthen bonds of love between people and also between
Speaker 1: people and the gods. So the priest class, you know,
Speaker 1: that class of people were the ones who were drinking
Speaker 1: the chocolate. The common people were not allowed to touch it.
Speaker 1: So Mexican chocolate is really good. I have a recipe
Speaker 1: in there. So you put a little cinnamon, a little
Speaker 1: cayenne pepper, you know, you whip it to a froth
Speaker 1: and drink it. But when you're drinking, you know, share
Speaker 1: chocolate with somebody. And we still think of chocolate as
Speaker 1: being romantic.
Speaker 2: Yright yeah, yeah, and.
Speaker 1: That's because we have this memory, but we don't know why.
Speaker 1: But yeah, when you share chocolate at Christmas time, make
Speaker 1: a chocolate, a hot Mexican chocolate, and share it with people,
Speaker 1: and just remember that this is an ancient, ancient sacred
Speaker 1: drink and that it's forges bonds of love and communication
Speaker 1: between people and the gods, also between people and the
Speaker 1: gods and people and people.
Speaker 2: I love that. Yeah, yeah, I just got back from
Speaker 2: Mexico a few months ago and we were at a
Speaker 2: Mayan chocolate factory. It's Mexican, obviously, but it had the
Speaker 2: same tradition that the Maya had, which was the beans
Speaker 2: were crushed and used for various paste and things like that,
Speaker 2: as well as drinks. So I totally understand what you're
Speaker 2: talking about. Before we move on from the foods, can
Speaker 2: you give us an example of a Christmas dinner and
Speaker 2: all the rituals that would be placed within it. What
Speaker 2: would be the meal, what would be like other than vegetables.
Speaker 1: I have an entire long chapter on that where I
Speaker 1: go through all I mean, every culture does it differently, right,
Speaker 1: so depending on That's one nice thing about the book
Speaker 1: is that you know, if you have Danish ancestry or
Speaker 1: if you have Italian.
Speaker 2: In right, you go throughout Europe, don't you. Yeah?
Speaker 1: Yeah, so you can look up what Christmas dinner would
Speaker 1: look like traditionally. Oh, I just opened the book at random,
Speaker 1: and Scandinavian almond is hidden in a rice pudding served
Speaker 1: a Christmas. Whoever finds the almond must complete a task
Speaker 1: such as inventing a rhyme of thanks for the meal.
Speaker 1: In Ukraine, Poland and Russia, the Christmas dishes the grain
Speaker 1: pudding called kutiya from ancient Greek pukia, or boiled grain.
Speaker 1: It's maked with wheatberries, poppy seeds, honey, nuts, and spices,
Speaker 1: and I give the recipe. Grain symbolizes eternal life and rebirth.
Speaker 1: Poppy seeds are for fertility, the honey is for pleasure.
Speaker 1: The dish is shared with the livestock and poultry as
Speaker 1: well as the humans of the family for luck. The
Speaker 1: stickier the dish, the better, because the head of the
Speaker 1: family takes a spoonful and tosses it up. The number
Speaker 1: of grains of porridge that stick to the ceiling tells
Speaker 1: how many sheaves of grain will be collected that year.
Speaker 1: But I mean every culture does it, you know, differently.
Speaker 1: But what I do every year, and I'm an American,
Speaker 1: but I was born in Austria. But what I do
Speaker 1: every year is I make acorn cake. That's my big
Speaker 1: thing and people love it, they absolutely love it. But
Speaker 1: I collect the acorns in the fall. I process them.
Speaker 1: It takes about two weeks. They have to be leeched
Speaker 1: and the water is changed every day, and then I
Speaker 1: grind up the acorns. I put them in the oven,
Speaker 1: dry the gruel, the ground up acorns, and then I
Speaker 1: make them into flour.
Speaker 2: You cut them, you grind them down to powder.
Speaker 1: Right when I'm getting ready to make the cake. Then
Speaker 1: I grind it into powder. Before that, it's just a
Speaker 1: dry grule that I keep in the refrigerator. But the
Speaker 1: cake has lots of honey, which is very solar, you know,
Speaker 1: and good good luck. Also it has lots of eggs,
Speaker 1: which are again yellow and fertility right.
Speaker 2: And I do that.
Speaker 1: Every year and people absolutely love it. They just think
Speaker 1: it's the best thing ever. I think there's a recipe
Speaker 1: in here.
Speaker 2: For that acorn cake. Wow, I don't know. Can you
Speaker 2: buy acorn flour if you're not one two?
Speaker 1: Yes you can. Actually I've never bought it myself, but
Speaker 1: I understand that you can, apparently in Korean restaurants and
Speaker 1: then probably on Amazon.
Speaker 2: I would think, oh, Amazon has everything you're in.
Speaker 1: And you can also find acorn cake recipes online. Acorn cake,
Speaker 1: acorn cookies, acorn pancakes, you know. But that's the I
Speaker 1: always make acorn cake at Christmas.
Speaker 2: Sounds amazing. I expect to slice. At some point I
Speaker 2: want to talk about the rights for the goddess, describing
Speaker 2: the goddess in what this is, Why this is important
Speaker 2: because we've lost the understanding of God goddess, you know,
Speaker 2: because the Church doesn't recognize that anymore. But talk about
Speaker 2: the importance of that.
Speaker 1: Well, I want to say that I have I think
Speaker 1: seventeen books in print right now, but this one, The
Speaker 1: Sacred Herbs of Yule and Christmas, is the third book
Speaker 1: in a series. The first one was Sacred Herbs of Salon,
Speaker 1: which is Halloween, the second one is Sacred Herbs of Spring,
Speaker 1: and then Sacred Herbs of Yule and Christmas. In each
Speaker 1: of those books, I have a ritual for a goddess. Okay,
Speaker 1: so in the Halloween book it's a ritual for the Morigon,
Speaker 1: who's a triple goddess Celtic Irish triple goddess. Sacred Herbs
Speaker 1: of Spring, there's a ritual for the goddess Flora, who's
Speaker 1: the Roman goddess of flowers. And then in Sacred Herbs
Speaker 1: of Yule and Christmas, I have a ritual for the Callach,
Speaker 1: who is the goddess of Winter in Scottish tradition, she's
Speaker 1: the goddess of winter. In Irish tradition, she's the land goddess.
Speaker 1: So there are colliachs from different areas and they all
Speaker 1: have different properties. But for me, she's the goddess of winter.
Speaker 1: I do have Scottish ancestry. But the way you know
Speaker 1: that she has arrived is when the first snowfall comes.
Speaker 1: And we've already had our first snowfall. But when that happens,
Speaker 1: that means she's here. And so I wanted to honor
Speaker 1: her at yule Tide. And the only creation story that
Speaker 1: we have from Celtic tradition is about the Calliach, and
Speaker 1: the story is and she's the old woman or the
Speaker 1: old veiled one she's called, and the story is that
Speaker 1: she was walking through the water on the west coast
Speaker 1: of Scotland dropping stones from her apron, which is a
Speaker 1: polite way of saying dropping stones out of her vagina,
Speaker 1: and everywhere they fell an island formed. So she's literally
Speaker 1: creating the land as she walks. I mean, wow, big figure,
Speaker 1: you know.
Speaker 2: So she's a creator, She's a creator god exactly.
Speaker 1: And that's the only creation myth that we have.
Speaker 2: From Celtic tradition, and So how how do we honor
Speaker 2: her ah at the first snowfall?
Speaker 1: Well, you give thanks.
Speaker 2: That's so.
Speaker 1: The most important word is in any culture is thank you.
Speaker 1: But you can do a whole ritual. You could do
Speaker 1: it at solstice, you could do it at Yule, you
Speaker 1: could do it when the first snow falls. So I
Speaker 1: have first you create the altar. Cover the altar with
Speaker 1: a faded tartan cloth or thick wool, because that evokes winter.
Speaker 2: Right.
Speaker 1: Put objects that speak of the winter season, rocks, crystals,
Speaker 1: anything that reminds you of frost and snow, evergreen boughs,
Speaker 1: magical herbs of winter, and so on. And then you
Speaker 1: welcome in the goddess. And then I have a I
Speaker 1: just get I say. Your opening might look something like this.
Speaker 1: We are here to honor the gods and pay homage
Speaker 1: to the great Goddess of Winter. A kayak, the veiled
Speaker 1: one who haunts the frozen ground and frost rimmed branches.
Speaker 1: Her breath is the winter wind, her tears are the sleet,
Speaker 1: Her skin is the snowbound field, Great Hag of the
Speaker 1: gusty white rivers and fields. We honor you and welcome you.
Speaker 1: All nature pauses under your gaze, thank you for this
Speaker 1: time of rest and purification, and then you burn herbs. Now,
Speaker 1: in Native American tradition you burn sage, for example, or
Speaker 1: cedar to purify an area. But in Northern Europe, the
Speaker 1: traditional herb was juniper.
Speaker 2: Oh I like that smell. Yeah, dried juniper.
Speaker 1: Yeah. If you can get juniper, that's the European herb
Speaker 1: of choice. If you don't want to be breathing smoke,
Speaker 1: if you have lung issues, you can get the oil
Speaker 1: juniper oil, and you could put it with water and
Speaker 1: spray it around the room instead of the smoke. Then
Speaker 1: you have some kind of a fire. So if you're outside,
Speaker 1: it's going to be a bonfire. If you're inside, it's
Speaker 1: going to be candles, you know, in a cauldron for example. Okay,
Speaker 1: I don't know how much you want me to go
Speaker 1: through this, but.
Speaker 2: I want you to go through it somewhat thoroughly, because
Speaker 2: my next question would be what do we obtain by
Speaker 2: by acknowledging this winter goddess.
Speaker 1: Well, just like with a solstice ritual where you start
Speaker 1: in the dark and then you light candles and you
Speaker 1: bring back the light, you're honoring nature. Nature at this
Speaker 1: time it's cold, it's snowy, it's dark. She is the
Speaker 1: goddess of winter, you know, and she transforms into bridget
Speaker 1: or bride in the spring, So that's the spring face
Speaker 1: of the goddess. Right now, we're honoring the winter face
Speaker 1: of the goddess.
Speaker 2: So it's life sustaining patronage.
Speaker 1: Yeah. The death is just an illusion. Nothing dies, you know.
Speaker 1: It looks like nature is dead because all these bare branches,
Speaker 1: you know, but it's not dead, you know. And that's
Speaker 1: why we have partly why we have evergreens, that's a
Speaker 1: whole other story. That's why you have evergreens on the altar.
Speaker 1: But there's a sacredness to this time, just like there's
Speaker 1: a sacredness in the spring, and sacredness in the summer,
Speaker 1: and sacredness in the fall. Each season has its particular
Speaker 1: sacred aspect, you know. And it's also the old woman.
Speaker 1: This is something our culture has forgotten, you know. In
Speaker 1: ancient times, people who were old were valued because they
Speaker 1: knew how to survive, and they had been through many winters,
Speaker 1: and they knew how to heal the sick, and they
Speaker 1: knew how to take care of the animals and how
Speaker 1: to take care of the people, and you know, so
Speaker 1: they were valued. So you're also honoring that. You're honoring
Speaker 1: the gray hairs, you know, the old ones.
Speaker 2: Fascinating. As we conclude, Ellen, I want you to talk
Speaker 2: briefly about the importance of altars and in our modern society,
Speaker 2: with the internet, with our iPhones, with all this Wi
Speaker 2: Fi bombarding us, why is this ancient practice important to have.
Speaker 1: Yeah, well, I don't have a smartphone. I refuse to
Speaker 1: have one. I do have a computer obviously, but I
Speaker 1: always tell people turn off the phone, turn it off,
Speaker 1: you know. But like I said, each season has a
Speaker 1: sacred aspect. So this season we're honoring what's happening. What's
Speaker 1: happening the dark, crystal ice, snow, you know, anything that
Speaker 1: makes you think of that, evergreens that goes on the altar,
Speaker 1: candles for light, for candle, magic, for purification, that all
Speaker 1: goes on the altar, everything that goes along, you know,
Speaker 1: holly berries, laurel as I mentioned, whatever you think of
Speaker 1: that seasonal you could have little images of stags and
Speaker 1: you know, winter things. Okay, that's your altar, and that
Speaker 1: puts you in harmony with what's going on with nature.
Speaker 2: H oh I hear you, okay, don't forget.
Speaker 1: Nature, right. And then in the spring, the altar changes,
Speaker 1: the color of the candles changes. It might change to
Speaker 1: something softer like like pink or something. You put fresh
Speaker 1: flowers on the altar, things that remind you of spring, eggs,
Speaker 1: little images of rabbits or whatever, you know. And the
Speaker 1: and the spring goddess Flora, the goddess of flowers, and
Speaker 1: who's very misunderstood, as the ancients said, and I quote
Speaker 1: in my in my book The Sacred Herbs of Spring,
Speaker 1: they said, Flora is a very powerful goddess because if
Speaker 1: you don't have flowers, you're not going to have fruit,
Speaker 1: and you're not going to have wine. Right, You're not
Speaker 1: to have any of these things. So big, you know,
Speaker 1: you have to give thanks for the flowers. So it's
Speaker 1: a really big deal. So that's what you focus on
Speaker 1: in spring. And then in summer. Summer is when you
Speaker 1: actually have the first harvest, which is the harvest of herbs,
Speaker 1: so you might have herbs, dried herbs, fresh herbs, you know,
Speaker 1: a flowers also. And then in the fall, of course,
Speaker 1: is when we that's the end of the harvest and
Speaker 1: we start having the pumpkins the gourds, the grain, the apples,
Speaker 1: you know, and it just shifts. But everything that goes
Speaker 1: on the altar, and you always have candles because candles energize,
Speaker 1: you know, they bring it to life. But you're always
Speaker 1: you're always putting yourself in harmony with nature, is what
Speaker 1: you're doing.
Speaker 2: So you're tying your physical, mental, and spiritual self to
Speaker 2: nature by these divination items and also this altar, which
Speaker 2: is a representation of what you and what you're connecting to.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and you're saying that you're a part of it.
Speaker 1: You know, people I keep hearing about how people feel
Speaker 1: so lonely and they feel so cut off and isolated,
Speaker 1: and why why do they feel isolated when there's life
Speaker 1: is happening all around you. You know, there's animals, there's trees,
Speaker 1: there's plants, there's water, there's fire there.
Speaker 2: They forgot that if they're part of the earth, is
Speaker 2: what you're saying.
Speaker 1: Right, Yeah, I mean when I'm in all I have
Speaker 1: to do is look out the window. But I live
Speaker 1: in the country and I'm very grateful for that. But
Speaker 1: all I have to do is step out the door,
Speaker 1: and I'm at one with all of it, you know,
Speaker 1: And I never feel lonely. You know, all through COVID
Speaker 1: I was by myself here. I never felt lonely, never
Speaker 1: felt isolated. I went outside every day, made a point
Speaker 1: of doing that. The time when I feel cut off
Speaker 1: is when I go into the city and I'm surrounded
Speaker 1: by people and cement buildings and asphalt. Then I feel cut.
Speaker 2: Off real briefly. For those who are just coming up
Speaker 2: to speed with an altar, this can be a small
Speaker 2: table placed in would you say, a room that you're
Speaker 2: active in, or a room that you're inactive in.
Speaker 1: It could be anywhere. I have one in the bedroom
Speaker 1: that I look at, you know, when I wake up,
Speaker 1: when I go to sleep, I have a goddess alter.
Speaker 1: I have another one in the living room. I have
Speaker 1: one outside. Because you have to put food out for
Speaker 1: the fairies.
Speaker 2: Don't forget, oh the fairies. Yea, yeah, on all the.
Speaker 1: Holy days, make sure you put something out for them,
Speaker 1: because if you don't, they really act up. They start
Speaker 1: stealing things and messing around.
Speaker 2: So and it can also.
Speaker 1: Be directly on the ground. And if you look at
Speaker 1: the Mexican tradition, for example, the friend does around Halloween
Speaker 1: theos the old friends can be outside It could be
Speaker 1: on the ground, could be on a table, or it
Speaker 1: can be several layers. One layer on the ground, the
Speaker 1: next layer on a table.
Speaker 2: Did really Yeah? Okay? Yeah.
Speaker 1: They build altars outside or you can build altars inside,
Speaker 1: whatever you want.
Speaker 2: Okay. But the point you're making in this part of
Speaker 2: the book on alters is the fact that this is
Speaker 2: your acknowledgment that you are part of nature, that you're
Speaker 2: part of earth, and that you are wishing to connect
Speaker 2: by these divination and these intentional tools that you're using
Speaker 2: at your altar.
Speaker 1: Now you're just you're putting yourself in harmony. You're not
Speaker 1: going against life or against the the planet or against nature.
Speaker 1: You know, you're not pitting yourself. You know, it's the
Speaker 1: Victorians who told us that nature was what is it
Speaker 1: read in Tooth and Claw or whatever. It's not like that.
Speaker 1: Even guerrillas are sweet creatures there. You know nature. We
Speaker 1: are a part of nature. We need to get back
Speaker 1: to that.
Speaker 2: The books called The Sacred Orth of Yule and Christmas Remedies, Recipes,
Speaker 2: Magic and Bruise for the winter season. My guest today
Speaker 2: has been Ellen Hopman, and this is a fabulous book.
Speaker 2: It came out last year late last year actually, and uh,
Speaker 2: it is one that you need to have on your bookshelf. Uh.
Speaker 2: And she has put her heart and soul into this book.
Speaker 2: I had to tell you. The recipes alone are are fabulous. Ellen.
Speaker 2: Tell people how they can get ahold of you through
Speaker 2: your website.
Speaker 1: Yeah, if you if you want to communicate with me,
Speaker 1: the best way is to go to Ellenevertt Hoptman dot com.
Speaker 1: That's e L L E N E V E R
Speaker 1: T h O P M A N dot com. I
Speaker 1: also have an author page on Amazon. So if you
Speaker 1: put in Ellen Evertt Hopman author, or if you just
Speaker 1: google Ellen Hotman or google Ellen Evertt Hopman, all these
Speaker 1: things should come up. But Ellen Everett Hopman dot com
Speaker 1: you'll see all my books, and you'll see talks that
Speaker 1: I've given events coming up, and you can ask me
Speaker 1: a question if you want.
Speaker 2: To do you do a video? Are you on YouTube
Speaker 2: presenting how to cook or how to do divination? Anything
Speaker 2: like that?
Speaker 1: Well, I have just been convinced that I need a
Speaker 1: YouTube channel. I've never had one, so I'm going to
Speaker 1: be uploading a lot of my talks. But that's going
Speaker 1: to be in the new year.
Speaker 2: I'm on the same. I need to get my video
Speaker 2: up and running a little more thoroughly. Ellen, Happy holiday,
Speaker 2: Merry Christmas, and thank you for your time. This is
Speaker 2: been fun and there's so much more we could talk about.
Speaker 2: Like I said, every chapter is could be a podcast.
Speaker 2: So thank you for your time.
Speaker 1: Well, thank you, and Merry Christmas, Marl and Solstice and everything.
Speaker 2: At the mule all right, thank you and we'll get
Speaker 2: you back again. Thanks. I was feeling depressed regarding the
Speaker 2: yule log because there's so much energy around that. But
Speaker 2: a lot of us don't have fireplaces. I don't, and
Speaker 2: so the log the mule light is a great idea.
Speaker 2: And you know, I'm gonna go out and get a
Speaker 2: candle that will burn for a day. That's my divination
Speaker 2: that I'll that I'll do. And that's easy for you too,
Speaker 2: if you don't have a fireplace or a place to
Speaker 2: get a yule log, perhaps your fireplaces for decoration. Only
Speaker 2: a lot of people do that. So that was that
Speaker 2: was you know, important to hear all about our ancestors
Speaker 2: and how connected they are to the earth. You know,
Speaker 2: we've talked to people who are experts on nature, spirits
Speaker 2: and fairies and the elementals and how important they are.
Speaker 2: We didn't get into a whole chapter she had on those,
Speaker 2: you know. I mean, her book The Sacred Herbs of
Speaker 2: Yule and Christmas is just so packed with material and
Speaker 2: it's really it's really just a really really good reference
Speaker 2: for Christmas. So anyhow, I hope you enjoyed that. By
Speaker 2: the way, if you are wondering what to do next
Speaker 2: year in spring, you want to go away for a vacation,
Speaker 2: we have one spot left on our Rapnui tour. It's
Speaker 2: March fifty to the twenty third. We all meet in Santiago, Chili,
Speaker 2: and we have a meal together, kind of go over inventory.
Speaker 2: Then the next morning, on the the fifteenth, we fly.
Speaker 2: I think it takes about four hours to get to Raphanui,
Speaker 2: which is otherwise known as Easter Island, for a guided
Speaker 2: tour with doctor Edward Barnhardt. This is a very rare opportunity.
Speaker 2: He has gotten so popular we'll probably won't be able
Speaker 2: to work with him anymore because he's gonna be working
Speaker 2: with others. But if you are a fan of as
Speaker 2: like i am, he has surveyed the island and he
Speaker 2: will take us to parts of the of the terrain
Speaker 2: that no people most people don't get a chance to see.
Speaker 2: This includes the quarries where these Moi sculptures are cut
Speaker 2: out of. It includes a number of areas where there's
Speaker 2: grave sites as well as some unusual sculpture. So for
Speaker 2: more information go to Earthancients dot com, forward slash tours.
Speaker 2: All the details are there. If you have any questions whatsoever,
Speaker 2: send me an email. Send it to Earth Ancients the
Speaker 2: number four of the letter you at Gmail, and I
Speaker 2: promise they'll get right back to you. This is not
Speaker 2: to be missed. It's a rare opportunity. I've gotten a
Speaker 2: number of people will say, hey, Cliff, I can't go
Speaker 2: this year. We're not going to go back. I think
Speaker 2: this is the one and only chance we'll go to Rappahannui.
Speaker 2: There's always an opportunity to go with somebody else, but
Speaker 2: you want somebody who has an idea of the history
Speaker 2: of the of the sacredness of this place. So anyhow,
Speaker 2: more information Earth Ancients dot com, Forward slash tours. All right,
Speaker 2: that's it for this program. I want to think my
Speaker 2: guest today, Ellen Hopman, coming to us from Massachusetts. As always,
Speaker 2: the team of Gail Tour Mark Foster and everyone who
Speaker 2: makes this thing happen. Merry Christmas, all right, take care
Speaker 2: of be well, and we will talk to you next time.
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Speaker 4: Who not to.
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