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Speaker 1: Our atheists blind to the truth of God's existence? Are

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we suppressing the truth in unrighteousness? Is God clearly seen

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and understood from what he has created so that atheists

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are without excuse? Are we secretly believers but just want

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to deny Christ so that we can go on sitting.

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Our atheists really just mad at God because of church hurt.

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If you answered yes to any of these questions, then

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you might be experiencing a commonly known malady called cognitive dissonance.

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It was once thought that this ailment was incurable and

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that believers would experience chronic symptoms indefinitely.

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Speaker 2: But now there's hope.

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Speaker 1: The Atheist Experience is proud to announce dizen X. Dis

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an x is an over the counter weekly dose of

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reality to help you smooth out your mental contradictions. What's

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more is that dizn X is completely free to the public.

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Every Sunday night at five point thirty Eastern Standard time,

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and all you have to do is call the number

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on the screen. The lines are open and the show

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starts now. Welcome in, Friends. Today is September twenty one,

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twenty twenty five, only two days away from the rapture.

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I'm your host justin You might know me as Deconstruction Zone.

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I am pleased to introduce my co host for today,

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the Queen of Cadreceps, the champion of cellular secrets, the

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Mistress of mitochondria, the barrenness of biometrics, and a high

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priestess of homeostasis. She's a physiologist and the Deacon of Deconstruction.

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Please welcome Sarah from Leaving Faith.

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Speaker 3: Hi, thank you very much for having me, and that

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was an amazing intro. Thank you.

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Speaker 1: I am thrilled to be on the screen with you

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here today at XP And for those who like, if

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you know me, you probably have seen Sarah's channel around.

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But Sarah runs a channel doing deconstruction talk and she's

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of the very nice persue. So this this could end

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up being a good cop bad cop situation. Obviously, Sarah

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as a good cop, as we may or may not

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find out, depending on how the guests behave. But for

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those who don't know, she's TikTok famous at Leaving Faith

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and she's now on YouTube and now she's here, she's

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here in front of us and we're going to be

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taking some calls today and hopefully we'll get some calls

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that are right in your wheelhouse, your wheelhouse physiology. We

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may even get some calls wanting to talk about Hell.

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Speaker 2: Hell's a popular topic.

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Speaker 3: I do like talking about Hell.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, Actually it brings up good Hell kind of has

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a special place in your heart, and it kind of

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assisted in your deconstruction, which I think is why we

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talk about it so much.

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Speaker 2: For those who don't kind of don't.

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Speaker 1: Know your backstory, how does hell kind of play into

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how you came from being a dedicated, sold out born

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again Christian to a cold, rotten atheist.

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Speaker 3: It's very cold. I'm a very cold person. Yeah, So

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the kind of first domino for me to fall was

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around Hell. I think I had a lot of cognitive

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dissonance about what hell was and who went there, and

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was like, well, everyone I know in love is going

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to heaven, so I don't have to think that hard

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about it. And when someone I really cared about passed

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away and I didn't think that they had sort of

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met that standard of asking Jesus into their heart, I

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then really had to consider, now, hold on a minute,

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does it make any sense that he would be suffering

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for eternity? And so, yeah, through my whole deconstruction, process,

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and looking back now, I feel I feel really strongly

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about talking about hell because of I think the negative

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impact it has on us.

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Speaker 2: You know.

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Speaker 3: I think if you believe that you are so evil

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you deserve infinite punishment, that affects how you see yourself.

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And if you think everyone around you is bad, that

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affects how you see them too. So yeah, that's why

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I really love to talk about Hell.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, and you probably remember, like I, you know, when

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we were believers, it seems like there were so many

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people that were like making friendships and connections, but the

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real motive is to like, well, I need to witness

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this person, because once you think that your friends and

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family are going to hell, if they don't believe what

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you believe, it's I think it's hard to have genuine

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connection with them.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean, you know, I lost most of the

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friends that I had once I stopped believing. And part

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of the reason was just because we couldn't have a

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genuine friendship because all of our conversations were them trying

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to win me back, you know, and I just felt

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like a project instead of a friend. And I think

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that the way, especially evangelical Christianity is designed is that

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you know, everyone who's not a Christian is a lost soul,

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and it's your job to go help them, and that

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changes the nature of your relationship, no matter what.

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Speaker 2: That really does.

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Speaker 1: Anyways, I'm certainly glad to have you here tonight. I

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want to do the obligatory opening statement, and then we've

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got one caller in the queue. If you're thinking to yourself, no, no, no,

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Hell is completely logical and you two are insane, maybe

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you should go there. Then go ahead and call the

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number on the screen. We promise we won't bite your

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head off. There are other shows you can call into

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to get some of that content. We'll have a reasonable

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dialogue with you about your God and about Hell. And

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with that, The Atheist Experience is a product of the

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Atheist Community of Austin, a five' one c three nonprofit

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organization dedicated to the promotion of atheism, critical thinking, secular humanism,

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and the separation of religion and government. And with that,

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I would remind the callers that this is not a

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political talk show. If you call in wanting to talk

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about politics, I will drop you. This is an atheist

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talk show and we're going to be talking about atheist topics,

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religious topics things like that, and with that we've got

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looks like in the guests cute Terry isn't a believer,

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but has something on their mind. So we'll grab Terry,

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and then while we're talking to Terry, theis by all

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means call up, get yourself in line. Don't wait till

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the end of the show, because then we might not

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be able to get to you. So if you want

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to get into the show, please, by all means, go ahead,

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dilan now and talk to our lovely call screeners and

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then we'll get you on the show.

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Speaker 2: And with that, let me pull in Terry.

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Speaker 1: Terry from Vermont was raised Roman Catholic and says, now

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I agree with you guys more than I do. Theis

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that I come in contact with How you doing, Terry?

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Speaker 4: Hey, how's it going guys? Thank you for taking my home.

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Speaker 2: Hey Terry, what's your in your mind?

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Speaker 4: Well? I just wanted to say that I was a

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raised Roman Catholic and I've been to many many churches

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over the years, and I remember them saying, you know,

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read the Bible and you know you'll you'll find the truth.

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And what I found was more inconsistencies than they could

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shake a stick at.

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Speaker 1: I mean, yeah, that that was kind of my experience

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was the Bible itself seemed to be one of the

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largest barriers to believing the truthfulness and the validity of

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the Christian message. But I think even if you if

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you're not really like reading the Bible intently, just thinking

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about some of the concepts can get you to the

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same conclusion. Like Sarah was talking previously about how hell

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doesn't really make any sense, but there is heaven.

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Speaker 2: Heaven doesn't make any sense.

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Speaker 1: It certainly doesn't seem to square with any of our

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known physical laws, like where would heaven be? Can have

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we ever observed a completely immaterial realm where spirits are

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floating around?

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Speaker 5: Now?

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Speaker 1: Like, none of these things makes sense if you just

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think about them for a little bit.

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Speaker 4: Well, you know, I remember when Stephen Hanking meant the

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Pope I think it was nineteen eighty five or eighty six.

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He asked him a question. He said, is the universe infinite?

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And the Pope said yes, And Stephen said, well, then

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what room is there for your God? And the Pope

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didn't have an answer.

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Speaker 2: That's a good question, right. I know for me personally, I.

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Speaker 4: Engage with every time I engage in any sort of

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a conversation with Christians, they like to use circular arguments,

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and you know, they believe. There is a guy who said, well,

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what proof do you have? And they go to the Bible.

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I said, well, other than the Bible, what do you have?

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And they said that's all I need? And they just

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keep talking in circles, and no matter how you shoot

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them down, they don't seem to get it. They don't

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seem to understand that the Bible isn't proof because if

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you even look at the at the Christian religion or

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any religions, they go by a book and their books

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are faith. Their books are not proof.

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Speaker 2: Indeed.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I heard a really good explanation for that once actually,

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when I was deconstructing that belief is isn't just something

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you come to logically, but consider it more like a footstool,

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and so you have your belief and many things, there

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are many legs on your footstool. And so it's why

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when you when you talk to someone who has any

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type of religious belief, you know, describing one logical error

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isn't going to change that belief because it's not just

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logic that holds it up. You know, you have experiences

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and culture and family and psychology you know that are

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all holding up that belief. So even if you knock

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one of the legs out, you still have all those

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other legs holding it up.

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Speaker 4: Well, you know, it's funny. I thought that when the

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Jonestown massacre happened, I think it was in nineteen seventy

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eight or seventy nine, I would have thought that people

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would have gotten a clue. But now these television evangelists

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in their megachurches are making more money and fooling more

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people than ever. And I really don't it deboggles my

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mind to think how people could fall into that trap.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, well, I think if you're raised in it, like

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you were raised Catholic, right, I think if you're raised

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in it, it can be difficult to question what you

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were raised in. I know, for me, I grew up

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in a very religious background, even though my family wasn't

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super religious, and so there are a lot of things

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you just accept as true, right, so when you start

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to deconstruct that in your adult years, it's hard to

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throw it all away right at once. And if you

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if you never deconstruct, like if you just swallow the

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whole hog. Then there's really not a whole lot of

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limits as to what you won't swallow, Like if if

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if you're willing to buy a hook line and sinker,

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they can just keep adding more worms on that hook.

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I mean, there's not a lot of limits.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, I've I've tried. I've tried to believe, and I've

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tried to see what what was the payoff or what

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was the rationale or what was the logic, and just

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found that there really isn't much logic anymore. They say,

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you know, the Roman Catholics, I have to admit one

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thing about them. They if they can't explain something, they go, well,

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it's a mystery of face. Whereas typical Protestant or you know, Evangelicals,

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they'll talk in circles, you know, for hours, and it's

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it's just kind of funny. So I don't even bother

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getting into that. A few a few weeks ago, I

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was walking and I saw a couple of the Mormon

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missionaries and they asked if I wanted to hear the

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word of Jesus Christ, and they said no, I said,

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I'm a secular humanitarian. And they were totally stunned. They

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didn't even know what that was.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean, to be fair, we're not a huge

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percentage of the population.

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Speaker 2: Like in my life.

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Speaker 1: I can kind of, on one hand, like the atheist

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that I personally know Sarah is probably the same. I

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don't know if we're surrounded by a lot of people

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that are of this variety.

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Speaker 6: Yeah, for sure, I can't say.

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Speaker 4: I can't say that I'm an atheist, but I know

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darn will that I'm not a I'll put it to

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you this way. If there is a God, if it

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is not what they're telling me it is, it can't

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because what they're telling me does not make sense.

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Speaker 7: Right.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, we couldn't agree more. Oh sorry, go ahead, sir.

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Speaker 3: Well, I was just going to say, it would be

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very unjust for that God to expect you to worship

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and serve him if that God doesn't make any sense.

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You know, I've had many people in my lives tell

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me things like, well, you know, I don't get it either,

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but we just we just have to obey and worship.

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But I think it would be very unreasonable for God

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to create a situation where you can't understand him and

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he doesn't make sense, and yet somehow expect you to

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worship him, so I agree with you.

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Speaker 4: Well, I agree with you too. It's it just when

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you start. When you start, you call it deconstruction. When

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you start examining the evidence you got, and when I

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point out some of the inconsistencies, they go, oh, well,

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we don't do the Old Testament anymore. Now, this is

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what really really got me when when my wife joined

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this new church. It's a it's a very small local

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Baptist church. The pastor. One of the first things he

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said was Thomas Jefferson cut out parts of the Bible.

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If he didn't agree with it, then he cut out

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part of the Bible. He said, you have to accept

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the whole Bible. So one day I nailed him with this,

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with something in the Bible, and it was about circumcision.

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And I said, well, I said, you know, in the

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Old Testament it says you have to do it, and

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the New Testament says it doesn't. Oh, he says, we

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don't go by the Old Testament anymore. So you can

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see how they rationalize and justify anything to try to

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prove their point. And rather than actually prove their point.

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I thought he made himself look stupid.

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Speaker 1: I mean, that'll do it, right, when almost two thirds

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of your Holy book is the Old Testament, it's awfully

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silly to say, well, none of that's now relevant. Well,

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if the Old Testament says that you're going to circumcise

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your children forever, which it does in Ezekiel forty four

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and elsewhere like Deuteronomy thirty, if that's what it says,

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and then there's a two point zero, there's a patch update,

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and the patch up date says, ah, we were just

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joking about that circumcision forever.

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Speaker 8: Bit.

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Speaker 1: I mean, that's just a flat contradiction. God can't contradict himself,

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Like you can have updates, you can have changes of

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direction maybe, but you can't have straight contradictions.

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Speaker 2: God's not allowed to contradict himself.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, And because at that time, they were trying to

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get me to get baptized in the church and I said,

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I don't see the need for it, and they said,

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I don't see the need for religious ritual And they said, well,

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what do you mean what rituals? So I said circumcision

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and he just laughed and he said, oh, we don't

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do that anymore. It's in your book, you know, right right,

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you know, don't don't.

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Speaker 2: Try to blow.

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Speaker 4: Don't try to blow smoke because I read it and

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I know what it says.

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Speaker 8: Well.

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Speaker 1: The final thing too, that I'll say on circumcision is like,

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you know, even in the Western world, like we were

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raised that we need to be circumcised and baptized as babies.

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Speaker 2: Right, I was baptized as a baby.

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Speaker 1: I was circumcised as a baby, because it's just what

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Christians do, right, Which is really funny because the pulses

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in the New Testament, that is, if you take the

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marks of circumcision, Christ is of no use to you.

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So even on their own doctrine.

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Speaker 2: They have no idea what they're doing.

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Speaker 1: Like if if the New Testament clearly taught that you

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do not need circumcision, why does the Christian West insist

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on mutilating the genitals of little boys too in order

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to maintain a doctrine they don't believe in. Like they're

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so confused and tied up amongst themselves because they don't

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even read the book.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, well now they you see here in America, they

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win another route that nobody else has gone, and that

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is they say there's a medical benefit in which there isn't.

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What the United States is the only country that does

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that for medical reasons, and that's how they sort of

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skirt it around that they say, oh, well it's healthier,

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and or oh, I don't I want my son to

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look like my like like his father. Oh I don't

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want him to look different in the locker room. And

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they use one thousand and one excuses. And it reminds

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me just what they what the Christians do with the Bible.

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They'll make excuses for anything.

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Speaker 2: Right, that's true.

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Speaker 3: And I think what you were talking about baptism too,

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is such any example of how the Bible is not clear,

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even when we're simply looking at the New Testament, you know,

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which is supposed to be what we all use. Now.

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You know, if you ask a Christian do you have

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to be baptized in order to go to Heaven? You

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ask ten Christians and you might get ten different answers

325
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because it is contradictory. You know, what did Jesus say

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about it? What did John say about it? What did

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Paul say about it? Can you baptize someone as an infant?

328
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How does that work? What's happening when you do it

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as an infant? You know, there are some Christians who believe, no,

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you must be fully immersed, and you must be an adult.

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It's again, it's it's just not clear. And when something

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as significant as salvation as at stake, you would you

333
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would think the book would be crystal clear, but it's not.

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Speaker 4: Well, he is the the his his uh.

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Speaker 1: You know.

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Speaker 4: Our argument ended this way, and it got rather hostile,

337
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and I was very close to punching him out right

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in front of my own wife, Right in front of

339
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my own wife. He said, well, you were baptized the Catholic.

340
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I said, yes, I was. He says, well, that doesn't

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count because you could not give consent. We only baptized,

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you know, when you a person can give consent. I said, yeah,

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but you're circumcised. You two boys, and I'm sure they

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didn't consent always. Then it got really mad. He said,

345
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you have to do this because the Bible says so.

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I said, no, I don't. I'm not going to that's it.

347
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Speaker 8: I said.

348
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Speaker 4: This conversations over.

349
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Speaker 2: Yeah, we're glad that it didn't lead to fisticuffs.

350
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Speaker 1: We certainly don't want that for anyone.

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Speaker 4: Well, he's still a bigger than I am, so would

352
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the board gone well for me? But I was that

353
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irate I could not believe he was saying crap like this,

354
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you know, and justify his Bible, you.

355
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Speaker 1: Know right, Yeah, we've heard it all before for sure.

356
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Well listen, Terry, we really appreciate coming up.

357
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Speaker 2: And having a chat with us.

358
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Speaker 1: We're gonna keep the show moving right now, we don't

359
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have any callers in the queue. We do take atheists

360
00:17:22,599 --> 00:17:25,599
agnostic callers as well, but obviously we take priority over

361
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the THEIS callers. So now it's a good time to

362
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call in and Terry the best of luck to you.

363
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We're glad that you're using your rational faculties.

364
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Speaker 4: Well, thank you, guys. I mean I I appreciate. I

365
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try to catch you guys on YouTube every once in

366
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a while and when I can, and thanks you appreciate

367
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good work and I'm pulling for you.

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Speaker 1: Thank you so much.

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Speaker 2: Cheers, have a great day.

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Speaker 3: Guy, nice guy, super nice. I'm glad he didn't get

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himself hurt.

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Speaker 1: That we're trying to avoid that. We want to avoid

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the fights over religion, moving people out of it.

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Speaker 2: We've got a couple super chats.

375
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Speaker 1: Let's let's read uh some super chats and then if

376
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you're if you want to call in to the show,

377
00:18:10,519 --> 00:18:13,039
the number is on the screen. At least it was

378
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on the screen. I don't see it at the moment.

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There it is I five one two nine two four

380
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to two. You can call in, and I believe we've

381
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got one person in the queue right now. So if

382
00:18:27,400 --> 00:18:29,200
you want to call in, now's the time to do it.

383
00:18:29,319 --> 00:18:31,319
Let's read a couple of super chests. We've got one

384
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super chat from our friend Lou. Lou is a well

385
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known member in the community. Lou, welcome in, great to

386
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see you. Li says, love you both. Hey return the favor, Lou,

387
00:18:42,200 --> 00:18:45,599
we appreciate it. And we've got another super chat from

388
00:18:45,799 --> 00:18:48,519
s D a inventor. I think I said that name right,

389
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SD A seven Day Adventist Inventor. Is that that the name?

390
00:18:53,400 --> 00:18:56,160
It looks like there's a super thanks or a super chat.

391
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Speaker 2: I'll read it though.

392
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Speaker 1: It says, thank you XP for the free education on

393
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how to think and question. You set me free from

394
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mental prison that religion put on me.

395
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Speaker 2: I would have lived my life.

396
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Speaker 1: Missing out on the elegance of science.

397
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Speaker 3: Oh that's beautiful.

398
00:19:12,279 --> 00:19:15,559
Speaker 2: That is beautiful, Sarah, How did you deal with the

399
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stuff like that?

400
00:19:17,359 --> 00:19:20,480
Speaker 1: Because you know you're really into physiology, you know, the

401
00:19:20,640 --> 00:19:24,440
physical body, how did you deal with the difficulties of

402
00:19:24,559 --> 00:19:27,839
learning about the science of the body and evolution and

403
00:19:27,880 --> 00:19:30,240
things like that while you were still in the face.

404
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Speaker 3: You know, I think my faith definitely, for lack of

405
00:19:35,079 --> 00:19:38,759
a better word, evolved, Like when I was a kid

406
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and in really fundamentalist spaces, I didn't believe in evolution.

407
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But honestly, once I got into like high school and

408
00:19:45,640 --> 00:19:50,359
particularly college, I think accepting evolution didn't really bother me,

409
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Like it didn't particularly challenge my faith because I don't know,

410
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I guess it didn't seem to be a problem I

411
00:19:57,319 --> 00:20:01,279
had such I don't know, maybe like a magical view

412
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of God in that well, God can do anything, you know,

413
00:20:04,319 --> 00:20:07,200
and so yes, using our human tools, this is what

414
00:20:07,240 --> 00:20:10,039
we can measure, but that doesn't negate the power of God.

415
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And so I think it just I don't know, maybe

416
00:20:13,559 --> 00:20:15,960
it was cognitive dissonance, but I was really able to

417
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have kind of two compartments. You know, this is my

418
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God side of my brain and this is my science

419
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side of my brain. And you know, it really didn't

420
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bother me all that much because I loved science and

421
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I loved learning about it, and it was also like, well,

422
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but also God can violate any law of science if

423
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he wants to. So, yeah, I guess it didn't directly

424
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cause a problem for me.

425
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Speaker 1: I got that. Yeah, I think that's how most of

426
00:20:43,039 --> 00:20:46,559
us did it. There's like a god box, and anything

427
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goes in the god box.

428
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Speaker 3: Well, I mean you do have so many Like, when

429
00:20:51,920 --> 00:20:55,960
it's such a deeply held belief, any apologetic, even of

430
00:20:56,039 --> 00:21:00,759
really weak one, often satisfies you because you your brain

431
00:21:00,839 --> 00:21:03,279
needs you to keep believing this so badly, because it

432
00:21:03,279 --> 00:21:06,000
would cost you so much to examine it. So yeah,

433
00:21:06,039 --> 00:21:08,559
when you learn about how poorly the body is actually

434
00:21:08,599 --> 00:21:11,319
put together, it's okay because that was because of sin,

435
00:21:11,720 --> 00:21:14,440
right or whatever. Like, it's it's easy to find an

436
00:21:14,480 --> 00:21:18,160
apologetic to allow you to keep holding onto that dissonance.

437
00:21:18,599 --> 00:21:21,799
Speaker 1: Yeah, couldn't couldn't agree more. We've got two callers in

438
00:21:21,839 --> 00:21:23,680
the key. Let me grab the first caller. Looks like

439
00:21:23,720 --> 00:21:26,440
it's going to be Claude. I think I pronounced that

440
00:21:26,519 --> 00:21:31,799
name correctly from New York And yes, Claude's callscreen says

441
00:21:31,880 --> 00:21:35,240
hell and then garble, garble, mostly inaudible.

442
00:21:35,279 --> 00:21:36,400
Speaker 2: How are you doing, Claude?

443
00:21:36,640 --> 00:21:38,519
Speaker 9: Okay, Hi, that's usually how I speak.

444
00:21:38,960 --> 00:21:45,039
Speaker 7: Okay, So yes, the question online was should anybody.

445
00:21:44,720 --> 00:21:45,119
Speaker 9: Go to hell?

446
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Speaker 8: Right?

447
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Speaker 7: And so my point is that only those people who

448
00:21:48,480 --> 00:21:52,759
refuse to and willfully ignore their senses and to use

449
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their senses should go to hell, because hell for them

450
00:21:55,319 --> 00:21:57,200
would be a world where they have to use their

451
00:21:57,240 --> 00:21:59,680
senses and they can't get around it by use using

452
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blind Right, Well, that's.

453
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Speaker 3: What do you mean by use their senses?

454
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Speaker 7: People who don't investigate the world using the senses that

455
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they're supposed to Creator gave it and gave them. If

456
00:22:08,519 --> 00:22:10,640
they're not willing to look and see what's in front

457
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of them and just blindly say no, my God says

458
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something different, and you're not doing the thing that your

459
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God told you to do, which is to use your senses. Here,

460
00:22:19,920 --> 00:22:21,359
I'm supposedly giving your senses.

461
00:22:21,400 --> 00:22:22,359
Speaker 8: Why aren't you using them?

462
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Speaker 7: No one ever asked why don't they use their sentence, It's.

463
00:22:25,079 --> 00:22:29,039
Speaker 3: Like, okay, so you're saying that you actually don't accept

464
00:22:29,119 --> 00:22:32,400
the Christian ideology. You personally think that people who don't

465
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investigate the world around them they should go to hell.

466
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Speaker 7: Well, I'm just playing with the word hell. I don't

467
00:22:37,960 --> 00:22:40,119
believe there's a hell because I'm not religious. So, but

468
00:22:40,279 --> 00:22:43,599
if they believe there's a hell. Then those that don't

469
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use their senses to navigate and investigate the world are

470
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those who should go to hell in their world?

471
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Speaker 3: Well, certainly. I mean in many religions they are not

472
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asked to use their senses in that way. It's much

473
00:22:57,200 --> 00:23:00,079
more have blind faith is what they are, or have

474
00:23:00,200 --> 00:23:02,680
faith is what they are asked to do, rather than

475
00:23:02,720 --> 00:23:03,960
investigate right.

476
00:23:04,039 --> 00:23:06,519
Speaker 7: And to that end, I then was my other point,

477
00:23:06,599 --> 00:23:09,480
which is that all these people who say that we

478
00:23:09,599 --> 00:23:12,839
don't understand or they understand the will of God, the

479
00:23:12,920 --> 00:23:15,519
point is that nobody understands the will of God. Even

480
00:23:15,519 --> 00:23:17,839
God doesn't understand the will of humans because we have

481
00:23:17,880 --> 00:23:21,160
free will. So ergo if they say they understand God's well,

482
00:23:21,160 --> 00:23:24,880
they're putting themselves above God. Because God can know my will,

483
00:23:25,000 --> 00:23:26,480
so how would you know his will?

484
00:23:26,640 --> 00:23:26,920
Speaker 10: Well?

485
00:23:27,200 --> 00:23:29,880
Speaker 1: I think, and I could be wrong. I think most

486
00:23:29,960 --> 00:23:33,279
Christians when they're telling you the will of God, they're

487
00:23:33,319 --> 00:23:35,279
just reciding what the Bible says the will of God

488
00:23:35,359 --> 00:23:37,200
is right, or what they think the Bible says. I

489
00:23:37,240 --> 00:23:39,039
don't know, I could be wrong. I don't know too

490
00:23:39,079 --> 00:23:41,519
many Christians that can divine the will of God.

491
00:23:41,759 --> 00:23:44,480
Speaker 7: Well, they all claim they do. That's not what he wants,

492
00:23:44,519 --> 00:23:47,920
that's not what he means any well. The whole reason

493
00:23:47,960 --> 00:23:51,799
we have all these different favors of religion and Christianity

494
00:23:51,920 --> 00:23:54,759
is because this room for interpretation. How can I have

495
00:23:54,799 --> 00:23:57,440
a book of truth but yet everybody can make their

496
00:23:57,480 --> 00:23:58,799
own the interpretation of it.

497
00:23:58,920 --> 00:23:59,960
Speaker 8: That doesn't make any sense.

498
00:24:00,160 --> 00:24:01,720
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean, I think that's why you get the

499
00:24:02,240 --> 00:24:07,319
disconnect between Protestantism and Orthodoxy and Catholicism is you know,

500
00:24:07,440 --> 00:24:11,279
in those two branches they say, no, you're right, you

501
00:24:11,279 --> 00:24:13,960
can't determine, you can't interpret it, that the Church does

502
00:24:13,960 --> 00:24:17,599
that for you, versus in Protestantism. There is a lot

503
00:24:17,640 --> 00:24:19,799
more individuality in leeway.

504
00:24:20,160 --> 00:24:23,559
Speaker 7: Okay, but that just proves that it's up to individuals

505
00:24:23,599 --> 00:24:25,519
who want to say that they're the ones who can

506
00:24:25,559 --> 00:24:28,759
interpret the Bible best, buy any book best, and you

507
00:24:28,799 --> 00:24:32,240
should follow them, which just balkanizes and breaks up the

508
00:24:32,440 --> 00:24:34,519
thing that they claim they should have, which is a

509
00:24:34,599 --> 00:24:38,960
uniform entity or uniform group. So the whole bs about

510
00:24:39,039 --> 00:24:41,279
believing in a book of truths, but yet everybody has

511
00:24:41,319 --> 00:24:43,519
their own truth when it comes to the book, just

512
00:24:43,680 --> 00:24:46,359
leads nowhere to totological mindscrew up.

513
00:24:46,839 --> 00:24:49,480
Speaker 1: Yeah, we agree, we agree, well, listen, claud we appreciate

514
00:24:49,480 --> 00:24:52,559
you calling in. We're gonna move to the next caller

515
00:24:52,599 --> 00:24:54,880
in cube, but thanks so much for sharing with us.

516
00:24:56,079 --> 00:24:56,519
Speaker 2: Church friend.

517
00:24:56,720 --> 00:24:59,000
Speaker 1: I do know this, I don't believe in the hell.

518
00:25:00,000 --> 00:25:04,160
I personally don't want anyone going there. That's my vision.

519
00:25:04,920 --> 00:25:09,599
Speaker 3: Yes, my personal opinion is that it would be unjust

520
00:25:09,680 --> 00:25:10,559
for anyone to go.

521
00:25:10,680 --> 00:25:15,240
Speaker 1: Indeed, indeed, we've got another caller, Dalton in line. Let

522
00:25:15,240 --> 00:25:17,759
me grab our next couple of super chats. We'll pull

523
00:25:17,839 --> 00:25:20,599
Dalton right into the conversation. So Dalton, hold tight.

524
00:25:20,680 --> 00:25:22,480
Speaker 2: We will be up in about thirty seconds.

525
00:25:22,640 --> 00:25:25,160
Speaker 1: We've got a super chat for four and nine from

526
00:25:25,160 --> 00:25:28,440
our friend Adam Brown. Adam, great to see you in

527
00:25:28,480 --> 00:25:31,039
the livestream managed chat tonight, Adam says, Love and two

528
00:25:31,119 --> 00:25:33,640
dougites on the AXP tonight justin.

529
00:25:33,960 --> 00:25:34,519
Speaker 2: I hope you're.

530
00:25:34,440 --> 00:25:37,920
Speaker 1: Feeling better, Buddy rock hard for feel much better, Actually

531
00:25:38,000 --> 00:25:39,160
feel a lot better.

532
00:25:40,240 --> 00:25:40,960
Speaker 2: Appreciate that.

533
00:25:42,279 --> 00:25:44,359
Speaker 1: And Ashley, ash thank you so much for the five

534
00:25:44,400 --> 00:25:47,799
dollars super to, Ashley says, the perfect duo. Love you

535
00:25:47,839 --> 00:25:51,519
both well, Thank you, Ashley. We certainly appreciate that, and

536
00:25:52,079 --> 00:25:53,960
we're gonna hopefully we're going to get some good calls

537
00:25:54,000 --> 00:25:57,440
tonight that we can sink our teeth into poork Ramen.

538
00:25:57,799 --> 00:25:59,480
Thank you for the two dour super chat. Pok Raman

539
00:25:59,559 --> 00:26:05,759
says Justin go Browns. I said dog Pound Downtown all

540
00:26:05,799 --> 00:26:09,000
the way, all the way. And last one from John Paul,

541
00:26:09,000 --> 00:26:10,839
thank you for the ten dollars of predeceas Justin, I'm

542
00:26:10,839 --> 00:26:13,920
getting an accounting degree. I'll be a sophomore next semester.

543
00:26:14,000 --> 00:26:18,599
I'm considering changing to a double major in polysci and philosophy.

544
00:26:18,680 --> 00:26:21,119
I was wondering if he had an opinion on that. Well,

545
00:26:21,200 --> 00:26:27,319
I don't give career advice. However, However, I have met

546
00:26:27,400 --> 00:26:30,440
quite a few people with philosophy degrees, and my only

547
00:26:30,519 --> 00:26:32,920
advice would be the same. I was as I would

548
00:26:32,920 --> 00:26:36,839
give somebody for a theological degree, which is, do a

549
00:26:36,920 --> 00:26:41,640
legitimate degree first that will get you employment. So accounting

550
00:26:41,680 --> 00:26:44,160
would be a great step. Finish that degree, and then

551
00:26:44,200 --> 00:26:47,680
you can do another major, or do your political science degree,

552
00:26:47,680 --> 00:26:49,640
and then you can add philosophy on top of it.

553
00:26:49,960 --> 00:26:52,519
You can always minor in philosophy, you can always get

554
00:26:52,559 --> 00:26:56,799
your bachelor's and then do a master's in philosophy. There's

555
00:26:56,839 --> 00:26:59,079
lots of ways to get the philosophy. In My only

556
00:26:59,359 --> 00:27:03,559
caution would be try to do something that is employable first.

557
00:27:03,559 --> 00:27:05,559
Like when I went to school for theology. I went

558
00:27:05,599 --> 00:27:08,720
to engineering school first, and my dad was smart. He said,

559
00:27:08,799 --> 00:27:11,839
justin you can always do theology. Do your engineering degree

560
00:27:11,880 --> 00:27:14,599
first and then do theology. That way you have a

561
00:27:14,640 --> 00:27:17,880
good career if theology doesn't work out. And that was

562
00:27:17,880 --> 00:27:19,759
the best advice I could have been given it as

563
00:27:19,759 --> 00:27:21,920
a young person, and I would give that same advice

564
00:27:21,960 --> 00:27:25,640
to anyone who wants to get multiple degrees. Get the

565
00:27:25,720 --> 00:27:28,559
degree first that will land you a spot in the workforce,

566
00:27:28,720 --> 00:27:31,279
and then worry about the soft degree.

567
00:27:31,599 --> 00:27:32,519
Speaker 2: Anyway, it's best to.

568
00:27:32,559 --> 00:27:34,480
Speaker 1: Leck to you. I hope it goes well for you.

569
00:27:34,720 --> 00:27:38,039
Let's grab Dalton from the queue. Dalton from Texas is

570
00:27:38,119 --> 00:27:42,720
with us, and Dalton has a message about the upcoming rapture.

571
00:27:42,799 --> 00:27:46,799
Speaker 7: We're ready for Dalton, Oh boy, hija, and hey Sarah, I.

572
00:27:48,319 --> 00:27:50,799
Speaker 5: Would I how do y'all?

573
00:27:51,319 --> 00:27:52,119
Speaker 4: I was wondering.

574
00:27:52,720 --> 00:27:55,680
Speaker 5: I mean, I mean, it seems that there aren't a

575
00:27:55,720 --> 00:27:58,400
lot of Christian callers and they're all getting ready for

576
00:27:58,480 --> 00:27:59,119
the rapture.

577
00:27:59,119 --> 00:28:03,519
Speaker 1: Scared, well, they're intimidated by having Sarah on this stream.

578
00:28:03,559 --> 00:28:06,880
Now we've got a real big brain here. There's no way,

579
00:28:07,559 --> 00:28:08,880
no way they're going to be calling in.

580
00:28:10,359 --> 00:28:14,039
Speaker 3: Well, apparently the rapture is imminent, right, supposed to be Tuesday?

581
00:28:14,359 --> 00:28:15,039
Speaker 8: Supposedly.

582
00:28:15,200 --> 00:28:18,119
Speaker 5: Yeah, I was actually just wondering. I thought everyone would

583
00:28:18,160 --> 00:28:22,000
love to hear it too. You two were both at

584
00:28:22,039 --> 00:28:24,960
one point Christian, so I'm wondering if when you were

585
00:28:24,960 --> 00:28:28,599
both believers, did either of you have experience with like

586
00:28:29,039 --> 00:28:31,160
getting caught up in like rapture hysteria.

587
00:28:32,400 --> 00:28:38,359
Speaker 3: Let me tell you a story. Okay, when I was

588
00:28:38,480 --> 00:28:41,599
in elementary school and I went to VBS, right like

589
00:28:41,640 --> 00:28:44,519
we all did. We went to VBS Vacation Bible School

590
00:28:44,559 --> 00:28:48,799
for the uninitiated, and we had someone leading us in

591
00:28:48,880 --> 00:28:50,960
like songs at the end. And at the end of

592
00:28:51,000 --> 00:28:54,839
this particular VBS, she said, Okay, now we're going to

593
00:28:54,880 --> 00:29:00,000
do rapture practice. And rapture practice meant that she had

594
00:29:00,000 --> 00:29:02,319
I had like a little trumpet with her, and she

595
00:29:02,359 --> 00:29:05,559
would blow a trumpet and we would all jump in

596
00:29:05,640 --> 00:29:08,920
the air as high as we could, and that was

597
00:29:09,079 --> 00:29:16,839
our rapture practice. It was awesome. Sound very effective, Oh

598
00:29:16,920 --> 00:29:22,559
yeah exactly. But more seriously, like I did, I read

599
00:29:23,039 --> 00:29:27,640
all the Left Behind books. Also when I was oh gosh.

600
00:29:27,720 --> 00:29:30,880
Also in elementary school, I watched the movie A Thief

601
00:29:30,920 --> 00:29:34,240
in the Night, which it's like the seventies version of

602
00:29:34,319 --> 00:29:37,799
Left Behind, and it is graphic and a lot of

603
00:29:38,000 --> 00:29:40,640
death happens, and you should not show this movie to

604
00:29:40,680 --> 00:29:45,079
fourth graders. But here we are, so yeah. I mean,

605
00:29:45,200 --> 00:29:47,279
I was very sure the rapture was going to happen

606
00:29:47,319 --> 00:29:51,640
at some point. How soon depended on you know what

607
00:29:51,759 --> 00:29:55,480
age I was, But I definitely was convinced it was

608
00:29:55,519 --> 00:29:58,559
going to happen all the way until I stopped believing

609
00:29:58,640 --> 00:30:01,240
in my mid twenties.

610
00:30:00,480 --> 00:30:04,240
Speaker 1: Sarah, when most most young women had pictures like posters

611
00:30:04,279 --> 00:30:07,279
of Jonathan Taylor Thomas on their wall, did have Jonathan

612
00:30:07,680 --> 00:30:10,880
right next to right next to JT. T was Kurt

613
00:30:10,960 --> 00:30:13,359
Cameron in Left Behind.

614
00:30:13,839 --> 00:30:28,359
Speaker 3: I did not, never, never, at the blasphemy.

615
00:30:24,160 --> 00:30:27,400
Speaker 2: About you, Bud, so fair question. You know, my father

616
00:30:27,559 --> 00:30:30,000
was into raptus theology. He was all about it. He

617
00:30:30,000 --> 00:30:33,319
thought the end times was coming. He loved Left Behind series.

618
00:30:33,400 --> 00:30:36,359
Speaker 1: But my dad was also his form of biblical education

619
00:30:36,640 --> 00:30:40,279
was watching the Televangelist on Sunday, right, and so he

620
00:30:40,279 --> 00:30:42,400
he didn't have a lot of tools to work with,

621
00:30:43,359 --> 00:30:48,319
and he he finally moved out of this end times

622
00:30:48,359 --> 00:30:51,440
nonsense when he started going to a small Baptist church

623
00:30:51,480 --> 00:30:55,359
where the pastor that was teaching there actually had a PhD.

624
00:30:55,599 --> 00:30:59,839
He was a retired professor that ended up working at

625
00:30:59,880 --> 00:31:02,640
the church, and so he didn't do any of that

626
00:31:02,720 --> 00:31:04,960
left behind nonsense. And so I think going to that

627
00:31:05,039 --> 00:31:06,880
church was really helpful for him because he kind of

628
00:31:06,880 --> 00:31:11,440
got him out of that weird apocalyptical type of mindset.

629
00:31:11,519 --> 00:31:15,799
That being said, as a young person watching my dad,

630
00:31:16,160 --> 00:31:19,279
you know, kind of run through this theology track, I

631
00:31:19,359 --> 00:31:23,799
didn't find it appealing to me. It sounded silly. And

632
00:31:24,200 --> 00:31:25,720
the church that I was going to I went to

633
00:31:25,720 --> 00:31:27,759
a different church actually, when I became a Christian. The

634
00:31:27,839 --> 00:31:29,799
church that I was going to had a very different mindset,

635
00:31:29,799 --> 00:31:32,480
which is like, listen, if God wanted you to know

636
00:31:32,519 --> 00:31:34,319
when the rapture was, he would just tell you, so

637
00:31:34,359 --> 00:31:37,720
stop wasting your time and get busy doing what God

638
00:31:37,799 --> 00:31:38,839
actually wants.

639
00:31:38,559 --> 00:31:39,000
Speaker 2: You to do.

640
00:31:39,079 --> 00:31:41,440
Speaker 1: Get busy being like the hands and feet of Jesus

641
00:31:41,440 --> 00:31:44,000
on the earth right. And so this whole nonsense over

642
00:31:44,160 --> 00:31:47,000
like the Rapture is coming always seemed like a waste

643
00:31:47,079 --> 00:31:50,119
to me. And plus I had seen even in the

644
00:31:50,160 --> 00:31:52,640
short time that I was a Christian, as you know,

645
00:31:53,279 --> 00:31:56,160
a teenager to my younger twenties, I saw so many

646
00:31:56,319 --> 00:32:00,559
rapture predictions fail that I was like, yeah, the nonsense.

647
00:32:00,599 --> 00:32:03,079
Everyone's just wasting their time. So I never fell into

648
00:32:03,119 --> 00:32:07,240
the rapture nonsense, but I certainly was kind of, we'll say,

649
00:32:07,799 --> 00:32:08,680
surrounded by it.

650
00:32:09,599 --> 00:32:10,759
Speaker 8: I suspected as much.

651
00:32:10,799 --> 00:32:12,839
Speaker 4: Okay, I'm gonna get out of your hair now.

652
00:32:12,880 --> 00:32:15,279
Speaker 5: And Hope and Doug will and we'll get some nice

653
00:32:15,359 --> 00:32:18,240
Christians and to discuss. But I love you both, and

654
00:32:18,319 --> 00:32:19,200
y'all have a good day.

655
00:32:19,559 --> 00:32:21,960
Speaker 2: Hey, thank you, you have a great one. May the

656
00:32:21,960 --> 00:32:22,839
courts be with you.

657
00:32:23,480 --> 00:32:27,160
Speaker 1: And we do have another caller in the screen. While

658
00:32:27,160 --> 00:32:29,000
we're waiting for the caller to screen, I'm going to

659
00:32:29,039 --> 00:32:32,920
read through the announcements and then we'll see if the

660
00:32:32,960 --> 00:32:38,640
caller is ready from the screening. Available on Atheist dash

661
00:32:38,680 --> 00:32:41,880
community dot org are printable call in flyers.

662
00:32:42,160 --> 00:32:43,160
Speaker 2: You can post.

663
00:32:42,920 --> 00:32:47,720
Speaker 1: These with permission to community bulletin boards, local coffee shops.

664
00:32:48,160 --> 00:32:49,880
You can post them where.

665
00:32:49,720 --> 00:32:50,759
Speaker 2: You're in public places.

666
00:32:50,759 --> 00:32:53,240
Speaker 1: We're allowed to post them to let people know that

667
00:32:53,839 --> 00:32:57,440
they can call in and give us a free education

668
00:32:58,079 --> 00:33:02,599
on their God. Another way to support the stream is

669
00:33:02,640 --> 00:33:05,519
by sending superchats, so we read them during the stream,

670
00:33:05,559 --> 00:33:08,240
typically between guests. If we have any leftover, we read

671
00:33:08,240 --> 00:33:10,519
them after the stream, and it's a good way for

672
00:33:10,559 --> 00:33:13,680
the audience to interact with the hosts. If you like

673
00:33:13,759 --> 00:33:16,559
what we do, please consider supporting us also on Patreon.

674
00:33:17,079 --> 00:33:19,880
Giving to our Patreon ensures the ability to continue to

675
00:33:19,960 --> 00:33:23,839
produce this content. You can find Patreon at tiny dot

676
00:33:23,920 --> 00:33:28,359
cc four slash patreon AXP. It's tiny dot cc four

677
00:33:28,440 --> 00:33:32,079
slash patreon AXP and I think we've been here now

678
00:33:32,160 --> 00:33:36,960
for twenty seven seasons, twenty seven seasons of the Atheis

679
00:33:37,039 --> 00:33:43,440
Experience giving out free education and free doses of Dizen XO.

680
00:33:43,759 --> 00:33:45,480
We also want to send a big thank you to

681
00:33:45,559 --> 00:33:47,400
the crew that put on the show.

682
00:33:47,799 --> 00:33:49,599
Speaker 2: They do it every week, week in, week out.

683
00:33:49,599 --> 00:33:52,880
Speaker 1: We have video operators, audio operators, note takers, call screeners,

684
00:33:52,880 --> 00:33:55,599
and chat moderators. Thank you so much to the crew

685
00:33:55,720 --> 00:33:58,640
for making the show possible. It certainly wouldn't be possible

686
00:33:58,680 --> 00:34:02,480
without all the hands help to make the streams run

687
00:34:02,559 --> 00:34:06,000
smoothly on the technology that we have available to us.

688
00:34:06,279 --> 00:34:09,000
And with that, we've got a caller in the queue

689
00:34:09,000 --> 00:34:11,920
and another one queuing up after that looks like Ryan

690
00:34:12,280 --> 00:34:16,800
from Michigan. And Ryan appeared to be agnostic and wants

691
00:34:16,840 --> 00:34:20,039
to talk about their journey. We'll see if we can

692
00:34:20,079 --> 00:34:22,760
get them loaded up. I hit the talk button. Let's

693
00:34:22,800 --> 00:34:26,159
see if it pulls it in. Maybe there we go.

694
00:34:26,920 --> 00:34:29,360
If I hold, if I long press it, it'll it'll

695
00:34:29,400 --> 00:34:32,119
catch up. I think the internet browser was slow, fantastic.

696
00:34:32,360 --> 00:34:34,880
Ryan should be with us now. Ryan is, as far

697
00:34:34,880 --> 00:34:38,360
as I'm reading this correctly, an agnostic from Michigan and

698
00:34:39,079 --> 00:34:42,119
has something to say about their journey from is it

699
00:34:42,239 --> 00:34:47,400
theism to agnosticism or from atheism to being an agnostic?

700
00:34:47,679 --> 00:34:51,760
Speaker 10: I would say it's more atheism to agnosticism.

701
00:34:52,280 --> 00:34:56,480
Speaker 2: Okay, Well, what were the factors that led to this?

702
00:34:56,840 --> 00:35:01,159
Speaker 10: Well, for one, I just don't really like claiming things.

703
00:35:01,239 --> 00:35:04,320
And that's not like a defining fact, you know, like

704
00:35:04,679 --> 00:35:08,039
as like you know, like like one plus one is two.

705
00:35:08,360 --> 00:35:11,760
That's a defining fact. But like I don't know even

706
00:35:12,480 --> 00:35:16,039
God is real and God is not real. That's really

707
00:35:16,039 --> 00:35:18,760
a known fact at the moment. I mean, I have

708
00:35:18,960 --> 00:35:24,559
beliefs about it, but there's no answer. So, like I

709
00:35:24,599 --> 00:35:27,039
guess that was kind of agnostic in my whole life.

710
00:35:27,199 --> 00:35:30,960
I mean, I wasn't raised religious, and I was like,

711
00:35:31,199 --> 00:35:34,039
you know, obviously I had like religious people around, and

712
00:35:34,079 --> 00:35:37,320
I'm like, okay, that's cool. And I was like, you know,

713
00:35:37,760 --> 00:35:39,599
go on, sure.

714
00:35:39,639 --> 00:35:42,400
Speaker 1: So it sounds like you went from being an agnostic

715
00:35:42,440 --> 00:35:43,239
to an agnostic?

716
00:35:43,719 --> 00:35:44,440
Speaker 2: Have you heard that?

717
00:35:44,639 --> 00:35:46,280
Speaker 7: Thesm?

718
00:35:47,400 --> 00:35:50,400
Speaker 3: Like, both Justin and I we would call it ourselves

719
00:35:50,559 --> 00:35:56,840
agnostic atheists, that your your beliefs and your truth claims

720
00:35:56,960 --> 00:36:01,159
are are different things. So like, I don't believe in God.

721
00:36:01,239 --> 00:36:03,880
I don't think there is a God, and also I

722
00:36:03,920 --> 00:36:07,039
don't think I have definitive evidence to demonstrate that there

723
00:36:07,119 --> 00:36:09,840
is not a God. So I say, like, I'm agnostic

724
00:36:11,039 --> 00:36:13,400
because I can't know for sure. But if you were

725
00:36:13,440 --> 00:36:15,320
to ask me do I believe in God? My answer

726
00:36:15,400 --> 00:36:17,360
would be no. Is that kind of what you're saying

727
00:36:17,360 --> 00:36:17,920
where you are?

728
00:36:18,960 --> 00:36:20,039
Speaker 7: Yeah, I assume.

729
00:36:21,039 --> 00:36:25,199
Speaker 10: I mean it's not like I don't like technically believe

730
00:36:25,760 --> 00:36:30,039
in a god. I mean I don't know where things

731
00:36:30,039 --> 00:36:34,679
have been through, so.

732
00:36:32,960 --> 00:36:33,599
Speaker 2: You just don't know.

733
00:36:34,519 --> 00:36:35,039
Speaker 10: I don't know.

734
00:36:35,119 --> 00:36:39,559
Speaker 1: Okay, Well, fair enough, well Ryan, I mean, we're not

735
00:36:39,599 --> 00:36:42,280
here to force anybody into atheism, but we are here

736
00:36:42,320 --> 00:36:45,559
to have robust, hopefully discussions and or debates with people

737
00:36:45,559 --> 00:36:47,599
who do believe, and we do have one theist in

738
00:36:47,639 --> 00:36:50,599
the queue that I think wants to have such a discussion.

739
00:36:51,079 --> 00:36:52,840
So I want to move on to our next guest

740
00:36:53,320 --> 00:36:54,920
from the queue. But thank you so much for coming

741
00:36:54,960 --> 00:36:56,519
up and chat with it, Ryan, and best luck on

742
00:36:56,519 --> 00:36:57,039
your journey.

743
00:36:57,639 --> 00:36:57,840
Speaker 5: Yeah.

744
00:36:58,039 --> 00:37:01,000
Speaker 10: Sorry, I was going to talk about something else that, like,

745
00:37:01,039 --> 00:37:03,679
my brain breaks all the time. I forget everything I

746
00:37:03,719 --> 00:37:04,280
was going to say.

747
00:37:05,119 --> 00:37:08,360
Speaker 1: It happens. Yeah, stage fright. I'll get you a right

748
00:37:08,400 --> 00:37:10,920
cheers friend. You know, if you're not used to getting

749
00:37:10,920 --> 00:37:15,119
onto a call show, one piece of advice I could

750
00:37:15,199 --> 00:37:18,519
give people calling is to just jot down on a

751
00:37:18,559 --> 00:37:20,920
notebook a little bit of bullet points so you don't forget.

752
00:37:21,000 --> 00:37:24,079
It's super easy to think about here's the thing I

753
00:37:24,119 --> 00:37:25,719
want to say, and then soon as you're in front

754
00:37:25,760 --> 00:37:27,920
of the lights, you're like, I forgot what I was

755
00:37:27,960 --> 00:37:28,440
going to say.

756
00:37:28,760 --> 00:37:31,320
Speaker 3: Yeah, for sure.

757
00:37:32,000 --> 00:37:34,159
Speaker 1: Let me grab our theis from the queue. It looks

758
00:37:34,159 --> 00:37:39,000
like either is a Christian or named Christian from Arizona

759
00:37:39,360 --> 00:37:41,559
and says the reason I still have faith in God

760
00:37:41,679 --> 00:37:44,280
is that it's nice to think of loved ones having

761
00:37:44,280 --> 00:37:47,440
a place to go after they're gone. Is your name Christian?

762
00:37:47,559 --> 00:37:49,480
Speaker 2: Or are you a Christian? Which one is it?

763
00:37:49,559 --> 00:37:53,800
Speaker 8: In name only used to be used to consider myself

764
00:37:53,840 --> 00:37:56,719
a Christian, and then I did a deep dive into

765
00:37:56,800 --> 00:38:01,159
the actual scriptures and also what one of your shows

766
00:38:01,199 --> 00:38:06,199
that a friend turned me on to and officially deconstructed that.

767
00:38:06,400 --> 00:38:09,880
But I do still have faith. I believe in a

768
00:38:09,920 --> 00:38:13,760
god of well limited power. Excuse me, sorry about that.

769
00:38:13,920 --> 00:38:18,880
Speaker 1: Well, it sounds like maybe the belief that you have

770
00:38:19,079 --> 00:38:23,559
left over is like a vestigial type of a belief,

771
00:38:23,639 --> 00:38:26,079
right It says that you still have faith because it's

772
00:38:26,239 --> 00:38:28,800
nice to think that your loved ones will will go

773
00:38:28,880 --> 00:38:30,719
somewhere after death. Is that what I'm reading?

774
00:38:30,920 --> 00:38:32,800
Speaker 8: I mean, that's definitely a part of it when you

775
00:38:32,800 --> 00:38:35,880
see all of the suffering in the world, and you

776
00:38:35,920 --> 00:38:38,559
know that's why a god of limited powers really the

777
00:38:38,559 --> 00:38:43,119
only type of god I could believe in. By the way,

778
00:38:43,159 --> 00:38:46,599
the rapture practice things sounded adorable, I just wanted to

779
00:38:46,639 --> 00:38:51,559
talk about that. Said, there are a couple of scientific

780
00:38:51,639 --> 00:38:56,440
reasons why I think there may be a creator. One

781
00:38:56,159 --> 00:39:00,000
the idea of the heat death of the universe. Entry

782
00:39:00,119 --> 00:39:03,199
see the idea that everything is going to fizzle out

783
00:39:03,280 --> 00:39:04,920
and it's just going to be a cold and dark

784
00:39:05,039 --> 00:39:09,119
for an indetermined period of time, essentially, and yet no

785
00:39:09,159 --> 00:39:11,760
one can explain like where the fuel source came from.

786
00:39:12,159 --> 00:39:16,920
That confuses me. I don't really have a lot of

787
00:39:16,960 --> 00:39:22,920
confidence in the age of the universe, particularly because no

788
00:39:22,920 --> 00:39:25,920
one was there to witness this proposed expansion at the

789
00:39:25,920 --> 00:39:27,679
beginning of the Big Bang in the first place, so

790
00:39:27,719 --> 00:39:31,079
we have no idea how far out everything is. For

791
00:39:31,159 --> 00:39:33,960
all we know, everything could just be randomly bouncing around

792
00:39:33,960 --> 00:39:36,159
out there. I think I just recently heard from Neil

793
00:39:36,199 --> 00:39:38,880
Degrass Tyson we're eventually going to collide with another galaxy,

794
00:39:38,920 --> 00:39:39,559
for example.

795
00:39:41,400 --> 00:39:45,559
Speaker 3: Yeah. I mean that would be different though than like

796
00:39:45,760 --> 00:39:50,679
the universe at large could be expanding whilst individual galaxies

797
00:39:51,480 --> 00:39:54,039
you know, collide within it. So those would be two

798
00:39:54,119 --> 00:39:55,320
different concepts.

799
00:39:55,559 --> 00:39:58,000
Speaker 8: Oh sure, sure, that was just my one example.

800
00:39:58,079 --> 00:40:01,440
Speaker 1: Yeah. And well the other thing too, is is as

801
00:40:01,480 --> 00:40:04,440
far as we know, like, there wasn't not that longo.

802
00:40:04,480 --> 00:40:08,000
There's a conference of cosmologists and physicists and they actually

803
00:40:08,039 --> 00:40:11,440
did a survey during the conference of what they think

804
00:40:11,519 --> 00:40:15,159
the Big Bang says about, you know, the existence of

805
00:40:15,199 --> 00:40:18,360
things prior to the Big Bang, and the overwhelming majority

806
00:40:18,360 --> 00:40:21,920
of scientists commented on the poll that you know, the

807
00:40:21,960 --> 00:40:26,000
science of the Big Bang doesn't comment at all about

808
00:40:26,079 --> 00:40:28,760
there being nothing or what was prior to the Big Bang.

809
00:40:28,800 --> 00:40:31,639
It's just a theory about the expansion of the universe

810
00:40:31,679 --> 00:40:35,400
moving forward and more and more, you know, cosmologists and

811
00:40:35,400 --> 00:40:41,079
scientists are embracing the idea that the cosmos, even though

812
00:40:41,119 --> 00:40:44,599
the forum we have it now, may have been traced

813
00:40:44,639 --> 00:40:46,880
back to the Big Bang. That certainly doesn't mean that

814
00:40:46,920 --> 00:40:50,599
prior to the Big Bang there was literally nothing. Even

815
00:40:50,719 --> 00:40:53,559
in like Lawrence Kraus's book, he spends the whole time

816
00:40:54,039 --> 00:40:57,559
in chapter nine describing when he says something from nothing,

817
00:40:57,760 --> 00:40:58,920
he doesn't really mean nothing.

818
00:40:59,039 --> 00:41:00,159
Speaker 2: Nothing doesn't mean nothing thing.

819
00:41:00,559 --> 00:41:02,840
Speaker 1: And so there was a time when the Big Bang

820
00:41:03,000 --> 00:41:05,199
was like a new science that people would be like, oh, yeah,

821
00:41:05,199 --> 00:41:07,920
there was absolutely nothing, and then it gave rise to something.

822
00:41:08,239 --> 00:41:10,079
You know, matter, space, and time all came to an

823
00:41:10,119 --> 00:41:13,719
existence at once. That's not really the consensus that I'm

824
00:41:13,719 --> 00:41:17,159
seeing right now, especially not with the you know, the

825
00:41:17,159 --> 00:41:20,159
big movement in quantum physics. A lot of people are

826
00:41:20,159 --> 00:41:23,880
suggesting that, you know, there could be an eternal quantum

827
00:41:23,960 --> 00:41:28,280
field giving rise to matter for an indefinite period of

828
00:41:28,280 --> 00:41:30,719
time in the past and in the future, and I.

829
00:41:30,639 --> 00:41:33,840
Speaker 8: Have nothing against you know, there being something prior to

830
00:41:33,880 --> 00:41:38,199
what we know now, and even the possibility of multi versus.

831
00:41:38,239 --> 00:41:40,840
You know, it just seems like the more we learn

832
00:41:40,920 --> 00:41:45,280
about science, the weirder and cooler it gets. Like, uh,

833
00:41:45,480 --> 00:41:47,920
what is it called the blind split experiments? Something about

834
00:41:47,960 --> 00:41:51,000
the two particles behavior differently based on whether or not

835
00:41:51,000 --> 00:41:54,199
there's a physical Oh, double slip, thank you. Yeah. Yeah,

836
00:41:54,920 --> 00:41:56,079
reality is bizarre.

837
00:41:56,719 --> 00:42:01,559
Speaker 3: It certainly is. I mean, I absolutely agree that reality

838
00:42:01,639 --> 00:42:04,480
is wild, and we there are so many things we

839
00:42:04,519 --> 00:42:09,559
still don't know about it, and certainly agnosticism in the

840
00:42:09,599 --> 00:42:11,840
face of that makes sense to me. I mean I

841
00:42:11,920 --> 00:42:15,360
get the idea that is it possible that there is

842
00:42:15,400 --> 00:42:19,440
something that we just can't yet detect with science. I

843
00:42:19,440 --> 00:42:21,960
think that's a totally reasonable position.

844
00:42:22,360 --> 00:42:22,519
Speaker 7: You know.

845
00:42:22,559 --> 00:42:26,679
Speaker 3: I don't think there's anything in current science that says, oh,

846
00:42:26,800 --> 00:42:32,679
this is leading us to a conscious, sentient creator. But

847
00:42:32,800 --> 00:42:36,519
I absolutely agree that there's a lot we don't know yet.

848
00:42:36,679 --> 00:42:40,920
And you know, again, there's is it possible that there's

849
00:42:40,920 --> 00:42:43,320
something out there that we just aren't able to measure

850
00:42:43,559 --> 00:42:45,559
or describe? Yeah, for sure.

851
00:42:46,639 --> 00:42:46,880
Speaker 9: Yeah.

852
00:42:47,000 --> 00:42:49,639
Speaker 8: I had one question, you know, is it wrong or

853
00:42:49,719 --> 00:42:53,280
silly to hope that consciousness, even though there's no evidence

854
00:42:53,320 --> 00:42:56,880
for it yet, that consciousness might go on somehow.

855
00:42:57,320 --> 00:43:00,239
Speaker 3: It's not silly. I mean, I think it's such a

856
00:43:00,239 --> 00:43:05,400
a basic human instinct. You know, for most of human history,

857
00:43:05,480 --> 00:43:09,000
humans have had some sort of belief in an afterlife

858
00:43:09,000 --> 00:43:11,559
of some kind. And I think a huge part of

859
00:43:11,599 --> 00:43:14,960
that is trying to wrap your brain around non existence

860
00:43:15,400 --> 00:43:19,519
is just totally mind boggling. And so I think that's

861
00:43:19,599 --> 00:43:24,039
totally normal and a totally healthy thing. You're right, though,

862
00:43:24,079 --> 00:43:27,920
that we don't have any scientific reason to think that

863
00:43:28,400 --> 00:43:33,559
consciousness could exist without brain function, you know, we just

864
00:43:34,239 --> 00:43:37,199
you know, even when you talk about near death experiences,

865
00:43:37,280 --> 00:43:40,800
which I think are super interesting, Like I genuinely enjoy

866
00:43:40,880 --> 00:43:44,760
reading about near death experiences. You know, you're you're not

867
00:43:44,800 --> 00:43:50,199
talking about someone who has actually completely died and remained dead, right,

868
00:43:50,199 --> 00:43:53,440
We're talking about someone who has approached death and come back.

869
00:43:54,159 --> 00:43:57,360
And so even those, they still don't give us any

870
00:43:57,559 --> 00:44:03,079
empirical evidence that consciousness can exist without a functioning brain

871
00:44:03,159 --> 00:44:03,760
in some way.

872
00:44:05,000 --> 00:44:05,239
Speaker 8: You know.

873
00:44:05,320 --> 00:44:08,199
Speaker 3: So again, I think it's so human and so normal

874
00:44:08,960 --> 00:44:10,719
to want to continue to exist.

875
00:44:11,000 --> 00:44:13,960
Speaker 8: I really appreciate the feedback from both of you. I know,

876
00:44:14,039 --> 00:44:16,079
this is going to be helpful when I can rewatch

877
00:44:16,079 --> 00:44:19,960
it a few times, let it all think in and

878
00:44:21,320 --> 00:44:23,280
so understanding.

879
00:44:23,480 --> 00:44:24,760
Speaker 2: So let me ask you a question. Do you believe

880
00:44:24,760 --> 00:44:26,280
in evolution? Absolutely?

881
00:44:26,360 --> 00:44:30,760
Speaker 1: Okay, okay, so like it. I think evolution is one

882
00:44:30,760 --> 00:44:32,679
of those I'm going to call it a fact of

883
00:44:32,719 --> 00:44:35,880
science that is so firmly rooted it's hard for me

884
00:44:35,960 --> 00:44:38,679
to believe that so many people reject it nowadays. But

885
00:44:39,000 --> 00:44:41,719
I think the problem with evolution is, like if evolution

886
00:44:41,880 --> 00:44:44,400
is true, like if it's true that that really happened,

887
00:44:44,679 --> 00:44:49,199
I don't know how we square that with God creating

888
00:44:49,280 --> 00:44:52,639
human beings, right, because I think typically we think that, well,

889
00:44:52,800 --> 00:44:54,719
we're going to spend this after life with our loved

890
00:44:54,760 --> 00:44:57,800
ones because there's a God who took this time to

891
00:44:57,840 --> 00:44:59,360
create the planet for us and.

892
00:44:59,280 --> 00:44:59,840
Speaker 2: To put us on.

893
00:45:00,400 --> 00:45:03,679
Speaker 1: But if we just evolved from lower forms of life

894
00:45:03,800 --> 00:45:06,480
to where we're at today, it's hard for me to know,

895
00:45:06,599 --> 00:45:11,079
like how the God equation factors into that because it

896
00:45:11,119 --> 00:45:15,199
doesn't necessarily seem like if evolution is a mechanism that

897
00:45:15,280 --> 00:45:18,360
the God chose to give rise to humans, that he

898
00:45:18,440 --> 00:45:21,639
would have like implanted a soul or a spirit to

899
00:45:21,679 --> 00:45:24,440
live on. Right, at what point in our evolution history,

900
00:45:24,920 --> 00:45:26,079
did we have a soul?

901
00:45:26,280 --> 00:45:26,360
Speaker 7: Like?

902
00:45:26,400 --> 00:45:26,559
Speaker 4: When?

903
00:45:26,599 --> 00:45:28,000
Speaker 2: When did we get it? You know what I mean?

904
00:45:28,239 --> 00:45:29,280
I think we just lost them?

905
00:45:29,360 --> 00:45:34,519
Speaker 3: Oops oopsy, Well, thank you for calling you were so lovely.

906
00:45:37,519 --> 00:45:40,519
Speaker 1: But that is nowadays, more and more evolution is being

907
00:45:40,559 --> 00:45:46,360
accepted by Christians. And I took I took a class

908
00:45:46,440 --> 00:45:48,840
after I already graduated. I try to audit like one

909
00:45:48,840 --> 00:45:50,880
class a year because it's free for me. And I

910
00:45:50,960 --> 00:45:54,880
took a really fun class and the it was a

911
00:45:54,920 --> 00:45:57,639
class on the Book of Genesis and are the professor.

912
00:45:57,719 --> 00:46:02,000
The professor for the class was really into the Biologoist

913
00:46:02,039 --> 00:46:06,159
foundation and their kind of form of apologetic which accepts

914
00:46:06,199 --> 00:46:08,920
the science. They try to marry the Bible science together.

915
00:46:09,320 --> 00:46:12,599
And I mentioned that, like the idea of having a

916
00:46:12,639 --> 00:46:17,119
soul seems incompatible if we just evolved to what we

917
00:46:17,159 --> 00:46:21,199
are today, because like there's no real clear reason or

918
00:46:21,360 --> 00:46:23,880
rhyme to when there would and wouldn't be a soul

919
00:46:23,960 --> 00:46:26,800
That gets implanted like did homo hobblists have a soul?

920
00:46:26,960 --> 00:46:30,039
Speaker 2: Like where's the limit? It doesn't make any sense, right.

921
00:46:30,039 --> 00:46:32,760
Speaker 3: Well, I think it makes so much more sense if

922
00:46:32,800 --> 00:46:38,039
you are participating in more either like an Eastern religion

923
00:46:38,320 --> 00:46:42,280
or indigenous religion where it is not just humans who

924
00:46:42,360 --> 00:46:44,800
have souls. You know that there is some and I'm

925
00:46:44,840 --> 00:46:46,400
out of my depth, so don't quote me on this,

926
00:46:46,519 --> 00:46:51,360
but you know there's some type of spirit spiritualness to

927
00:46:51,679 --> 00:46:55,679
everything versus humans just being the select species that has

928
00:46:55,719 --> 00:46:56,079
a soul.

929
00:46:56,320 --> 00:46:56,719
Speaker 5: Yeah.

930
00:46:56,800 --> 00:47:00,480
Speaker 1: Yeah, Actually I could rock with that explanation much better

931
00:47:00,679 --> 00:47:04,960
than the Biblical or the Christian explanation because it was

932
00:47:05,000 --> 00:47:09,679
not a good one. Well, let me grab We've got

933
00:47:09,679 --> 00:47:11,920
a handful of superchests that came in during that chat.

934
00:47:11,920 --> 00:47:14,079
While I'm reading off the super chests, if you want

935
00:47:14,119 --> 00:47:17,360
to get into the discussion, the queue is currently empty,

936
00:47:17,480 --> 00:47:21,159
so first come, first serve in the call Q if

937
00:47:21,199 --> 00:47:23,360
you want to discuss the.

938
00:47:23,239 --> 00:47:25,519
Speaker 2: Bible or religion or.

939
00:47:27,159 --> 00:47:31,480
Speaker 1: Evolution, we'd love to have those discussions with you. We've

940
00:47:31,519 --> 00:47:33,599
got a doctor niney nine super chat from our friend

941
00:47:33,679 --> 00:47:38,239
Milf Wrangler. Mil Frangler says, the community really comes up

942
00:47:38,280 --> 00:47:46,280
with great, great handles. They've missed you justin on unapologetic

943
00:47:46,280 --> 00:47:48,719
glad to see you. Well, Milk, I'm sorry I couldn't

944
00:47:48,760 --> 00:47:51,239
be there, but thank you so much for you being

945
00:47:51,400 --> 00:47:54,440
there to watch the stream, and we really appreciate you

946
00:47:54,440 --> 00:47:57,159
supporting this stream as well. We also have a super

947
00:47:57,199 --> 00:48:00,360
chat from Arvin for four to nine says, my church

948
00:48:00,519 --> 00:48:05,480
used to do tribulation trials, haunted houses on Halloween, showing

949
00:48:05,599 --> 00:48:09,119
kids what the Antichrist slash God would do to people

950
00:48:09,280 --> 00:48:12,239
after the rapture. And yes, not far from where I

951
00:48:12,239 --> 00:48:14,880
grew up. There's the church that they do this every Halloween.

952
00:48:14,920 --> 00:48:18,119
It's called a Trip to Hell and what. Yeah, they

953
00:48:18,519 --> 00:48:21,280
have So it's a pretty large church. They have a

954
00:48:21,320 --> 00:48:26,400
pretty big wooded area and they go through the woods

955
00:48:26,440 --> 00:48:28,559
and they set up these stations.

956
00:48:28,079 --> 00:48:29,480
Speaker 3: In the woods.

957
00:48:29,840 --> 00:48:33,920
Speaker 1: They literally they're literally walking teenagers through the woods to

958
00:48:34,159 --> 00:48:38,320
various stations where they act out plays where people that

959
00:48:38,480 --> 00:48:41,559
you think are decent people get drug off to Hell.

960
00:48:42,000 --> 00:48:44,440
And then at the end, at the very end of it,

961
00:48:44,480 --> 00:48:47,599
they walk you through like this barn that's set up

962
00:48:47,679 --> 00:48:50,519
to like be Hell, and it like in it is

963
00:48:50,559 --> 00:48:51,280
like the most.

964
00:48:51,039 --> 00:48:55,039
Speaker 2: Horrific stuff possible, attempting to scare you. You don't want

965
00:48:55,079 --> 00:48:55,519
to go here?

966
00:48:56,159 --> 00:48:57,719
Speaker 1: Does it matter if you're a good person, If you

967
00:48:57,719 --> 00:49:01,199
don't accept Jesus, he'll torture you forever. And then then

968
00:49:01,239 --> 00:49:04,280
they march you to the church and try to get

969
00:49:04,280 --> 00:49:06,400
you to sign your life over to Jesus and ten

970
00:49:06,440 --> 00:49:07,760
percent of your gross incum.

971
00:49:08,079 --> 00:49:08,679
Speaker 2: So there's that.

972
00:49:08,960 --> 00:49:12,360
Speaker 3: Oh that's terrible. That's terrible. It's tough also really trying

973
00:49:12,360 --> 00:49:14,559
to bank on Halloween, Like you want to have a

974
00:49:14,599 --> 00:49:16,559
haunted house, but don't call it a haunted house kind

975
00:49:16,559 --> 00:49:16,840
of thing.

976
00:49:17,199 --> 00:49:19,880
Speaker 1: I know, right house.

977
00:49:20,039 --> 00:49:20,360
Speaker 8: Jeez.

978
00:49:21,400 --> 00:49:23,920
Speaker 1: I remember the first time I went to one of them,

979
00:49:23,960 --> 00:49:26,079
because this isn't the only church doing them, but I

980
00:49:26,440 --> 00:49:29,079
remember I was a Christian. When I went, I was like,

981
00:49:29,119 --> 00:49:31,760
I should check this out as a Christian. I was mortified.

982
00:49:31,920 --> 00:49:34,559
I'm like, there are children here, Like, children aren't meant

983
00:49:34,599 --> 00:49:37,639
to see this nonsense, Like a good God isn't going

984
00:49:37,679 --> 00:49:40,400
to send your ten year old to eternal suffering and

985
00:49:40,480 --> 00:49:43,679
torment because they didn't accept the gospel. But that was

986
00:49:43,760 --> 00:49:45,119
kind of the message they were preaching.

987
00:49:45,480 --> 00:49:49,480
Speaker 3: Ask me about Heaven's Gates House Flames.

988
00:49:50,760 --> 00:49:52,599
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, we've talked about that.

989
00:49:52,880 --> 00:49:55,760
Speaker 3: Uh huh, yep, yeah, no, they think a good God

990
00:49:55,800 --> 00:49:57,960
absolutely would do that to a ten year old.

991
00:49:58,639 --> 00:49:58,840
Speaker 7: Yeah.

992
00:49:59,400 --> 00:50:02,920
Speaker 1: I that was when I had my my born I

993
00:50:02,960 --> 00:50:06,920
became born again at my first experience at Heaven's Gates

994
00:50:06,960 --> 00:50:07,599
Hill's Flame.

995
00:50:08,000 --> 00:50:13,679
Speaker 3: You did, Oh I didn't know that. Oh, my God, Yeah,

996
00:50:13,920 --> 00:50:16,679
of course you did. It's it's a horrifying play like,

997
00:50:17,760 --> 00:50:18,440
of course you did.

998
00:50:19,239 --> 00:50:20,760
Speaker 2: All right, let me grab them for a super chat.

999
00:50:20,760 --> 00:50:23,519
Speaker 1: We'll get our next guest in here from Forum Galorum.

1000
00:50:23,519 --> 00:50:24,280
Speaker 2: Think you for the ten dollars.

1001
00:50:24,280 --> 00:50:26,360
Speaker 1: Super Chest says as a child, I would watch Benny

1002
00:50:26,400 --> 00:50:29,880
hit on TV for comedic purposes. He would punch, slap,

1003
00:50:29,960 --> 00:50:33,199
and whip congregants with it with his blazer jacket as

1004
00:50:33,199 --> 00:50:36,159
they came up for healing. Great for laughs. I couldn't

1005
00:50:36,159 --> 00:50:40,119
agree any more than this. And I don't know if

1006
00:50:40,159 --> 00:50:43,079
anyone has any favorite Benny Hint videos, but my personal

1007
00:50:43,119 --> 00:50:47,599
favorite is somebody who took his jacket slapping crusade outtakes

1008
00:50:47,800 --> 00:50:50,320
and match matched it up to let the bodies hit

1009
00:50:50,360 --> 00:50:54,639
the floor. And if you like rock music, I mean

1010
00:50:54,679 --> 00:50:58,559
you can get down to that. Oh all right, let's

1011
00:50:58,599 --> 00:50:59,960
go to ex call it And we got a Frank

1012
00:51:00,000 --> 00:51:03,679
Think from Georgia. And Frank says using the Bible as

1013
00:51:03,719 --> 00:51:08,079
a basis for deconstructing what's in your mind tonight, Frank.

1014
00:51:08,519 --> 00:51:11,039
Speaker 9: Yeah, I just I'm a big fan of of the

1015
00:51:11,159 --> 00:51:14,159
channel and big fan of of you, Justin and Sarah.

1016
00:51:14,239 --> 00:51:17,599
I've I've watched a lot of your content and uh

1017
00:51:17,480 --> 00:51:21,039
uh listen to some of your double study stuff, and

1018
00:51:21,159 --> 00:51:24,239
I just find the idea of using the Bible as

1019
00:51:24,280 --> 00:51:28,039
a basis for deconstructing is like really interesting and a

1020
00:51:28,079 --> 00:51:31,039
really cool sort of angle to take it. And so

1021
00:51:31,159 --> 00:51:34,280
I was just kind of wondering about like some first

1022
00:51:34,320 --> 00:51:38,159
of all, about building out sort of my reference, uh

1023
00:51:38,320 --> 00:51:42,000
you know, framework for like you know, different things I

1024
00:51:42,000 --> 00:51:45,639
can cite for these kind of discussions. And then just

1025
00:51:45,719 --> 00:51:48,639
like and I'm kind of leaning towards Sarah on this

1026
00:51:48,760 --> 00:51:51,400
other point about because you know, Sarah, you have such

1027
00:51:51,519 --> 00:51:54,000
a great way of talking about these these topics and

1028
00:51:54,400 --> 00:51:58,599
making it like non confrontational and accessible and just you know,

1029
00:51:58,599 --> 00:52:02,880
these are such emotionally charged discussions usually, So I just

1030
00:52:02,880 --> 00:52:05,480
wanted to sort of from justin get the perspective on

1031
00:52:05,719 --> 00:52:09,559
how to build out my knowledge base to be able

1032
00:52:09,599 --> 00:52:13,159
to have those discussions and then maybe just those discussion

1033
00:52:14,000 --> 00:52:16,719
strategies to make it more constructive.

1034
00:52:17,000 --> 00:52:20,719
Speaker 1: Yeah, well, you know, when it comes to having these discussions,

1035
00:52:20,760 --> 00:52:23,239
I think Sarah is the queen of trying to make

1036
00:52:23,280 --> 00:52:29,199
sure the discussions are constructive and cordial. But the advice

1037
00:52:29,320 --> 00:52:32,400
I would give is, in order to have these discussions,

1038
00:52:32,679 --> 00:52:33,480
you have to know.

1039
00:52:33,400 --> 00:52:34,639
Speaker 2: The Bible better than they do.

1040
00:52:34,960 --> 00:52:37,079
Speaker 1: And that's really what it comes down to. Most of

1041
00:52:37,079 --> 00:52:40,280
these people profess to be of a book like this

1042
00:52:40,480 --> 00:52:43,199
is the book. It is an errant, it is the

1043
00:52:43,239 --> 00:52:46,280
word of God, whether it's the Koran or the Bible

1044
00:52:46,559 --> 00:52:49,519
or some other book. That's where the key is. The

1045
00:52:49,599 --> 00:52:51,639
key is with the books. So if you want to

1046
00:52:51,679 --> 00:52:55,280
debate them on the points of their religion, or even

1047
00:52:55,320 --> 00:52:57,519
just have a discussion with them, and you don't know

1048
00:52:57,559 --> 00:52:59,480
what's in that book, they're not going to care what

1049
00:52:59,519 --> 00:53:01,320
you have to say say. But if you know the

1050
00:53:01,360 --> 00:53:03,840
book better than they do, and you can walk them

1051
00:53:03,960 --> 00:53:06,960
through the book and demonstrate not with your opinion, but

1052
00:53:07,039 --> 00:53:09,440
with the book, you can demonstrate clearly with the book

1053
00:53:09,440 --> 00:53:12,119
where the flaws are. While they may not come to

1054
00:53:12,159 --> 00:53:14,920
be in agreement with you right away, it'll at least

1055
00:53:15,119 --> 00:53:17,679
it'll at least start to gnaw away at their thinking

1056
00:53:17,719 --> 00:53:21,079
process if they're honest individuals, and they'll think about that later.

1057
00:53:21,119 --> 00:53:23,119
They'll think about that later when you're going down and

1058
00:53:23,159 --> 00:53:25,800
getting ready for bed at night, drinking their tea or whatever.

1059
00:53:25,840 --> 00:53:27,239
Speaker 2: They'll be yeah, you know what I mean.

1060
00:53:27,280 --> 00:53:29,559
Speaker 1: He was making a good point, and like, yeah, I

1061
00:53:29,599 --> 00:53:32,400
guess it does kind of make sense. And because the

1062
00:53:32,440 --> 00:53:35,559
reality is it's hard to convince somebody to come to

1063
00:53:35,599 --> 00:53:38,239
your side in the middle of a discussion, but they're

1064
00:53:38,280 --> 00:53:39,320
going to review it later.

1065
00:53:40,199 --> 00:53:44,559
Speaker 11: Justin I think actually an example, I'm sorry, I was

1066
00:53:44,559 --> 00:53:46,039
just going to say, I think justin he was also

1067
00:53:46,079 --> 00:53:48,519
asking for like some specific reference books, like what do

1068
00:53:48,519 --> 00:53:50,440
you have on your shelf that.

1069
00:53:50,639 --> 00:53:52,280
Speaker 1: I got a lot of things on my shelf. Let

1070
00:53:52,280 --> 00:53:55,400
me let me get you some of my favorites. Okay.

1071
00:53:55,559 --> 00:53:59,760
So for deconstruction, if if it's a Catholic, what you

1072
00:53:59,800 --> 00:54:02,440
want is the second or the third edition of the

1073
00:54:02,559 --> 00:54:06,719
Jerome Bible Commentary, really good, great academic source. And what

1074
00:54:06,760 --> 00:54:10,440
it's going to do, it's going to allow you to

1075
00:54:10,440 --> 00:54:13,199
look at the Bible through in academic resource. Because most

1076
00:54:13,199 --> 00:54:16,320
of what Christians believe about the Bible isn't what you'll

1077
00:54:16,360 --> 00:54:18,360
learn in seminary, it's not what you're going to learn

1078
00:54:18,360 --> 00:54:19,280
in Bible college.

1079
00:54:20,159 --> 00:54:22,119
Speaker 2: It's what they.

1080
00:54:21,559 --> 00:54:24,920
Speaker 1: Learn more through like the zeitgeist. Right, So in order

1081
00:54:24,960 --> 00:54:29,440
to break their thinking about well, this passage must mean this, right,

1082
00:54:29,559 --> 00:54:33,559
So most people think, for example, that the final Kingdom

1083
00:54:33,719 --> 00:54:36,519
in the Book of Daniel is in fact the Kingdom

1084
00:54:36,599 --> 00:54:39,639
of Rome, right, but so this particular this is the

1085
00:54:39,679 --> 00:54:42,000
second edition of the commentary, this was done in nineteen

1086
00:54:42,079 --> 00:54:46,159
sixty seven. In this commentary, this is a Catholic commentary.

1087
00:54:46,360 --> 00:54:49,760
They're stating in nineteen sixty seven that the field has

1088
00:54:49,840 --> 00:54:53,840
already shifted and almost nobody agrees that Rome is the

1089
00:54:53,840 --> 00:54:56,079
final kingdom, is actually the Kingdom of Greece, and that

1090
00:54:56,159 --> 00:54:59,519
all of the Book of Daniel is addressing the antiochen crisis.

1091
00:55:00,239 --> 00:55:02,800
That's a great commentary. If you want to dispel some

1092
00:55:02,920 --> 00:55:06,239
of these dumb notions about how to interpret Bible prophecy

1093
00:55:06,480 --> 00:55:09,360
from an academic lens, if they're not a Catholic, you

1094
00:55:09,440 --> 00:55:12,800
might want to try reading from the Oxford Bible Commentary.

1095
00:55:12,800 --> 00:55:15,440
It's a single volume commentary set. It's going to give

1096
00:55:15,440 --> 00:55:16,920
you a lot of the same stuff that you'll get

1097
00:55:16,920 --> 00:55:20,599
from the Jerome Bible Commentary. And then if you're like, listen,

1098
00:55:20,679 --> 00:55:22,920
I just want like a really good study Bible to

1099
00:55:22,960 --> 00:55:26,440
start with, I would probably turn to the new Oxford

1100
00:55:26,480 --> 00:55:32,079
Annotated Study Bible. You can get a fifth edition right now.

1101
00:55:32,880 --> 00:55:35,679
That being said, the sixth edition is right around the corner.

1102
00:55:35,719 --> 00:55:39,239
It's supposed to be out just before the end of December.

1103
00:55:39,320 --> 00:55:40,760
So if you can wait just a little bit, you'll

1104
00:55:40,760 --> 00:55:43,159
get the sixth edition, and it's going to be excellent.

1105
00:55:43,199 --> 00:55:46,519
It's going to have the new rebiased standard Edition, updated

1106
00:55:46,880 --> 00:55:50,760
for the translation, which I love that translation. The other

1107
00:55:50,800 --> 00:55:54,159
Study Bible you want want to consider is it's called

1108
00:55:54,159 --> 00:55:57,079
the Catholic Study Bible. This is one edition of the

1109
00:55:57,079 --> 00:55:59,280
Catholic Study Bible. You want to get the third edition.

1110
00:55:59,320 --> 00:56:01,960
Don't get the second edition. But I like this one

1111
00:56:02,000 --> 00:56:04,800
because it's got really good notes, and it's got a

1112
00:56:05,039 --> 00:56:07,199
margin for you to write your own notes in, and

1113
00:56:07,239 --> 00:56:09,559
the pages are thick enough that your ink won't bleed

1114
00:56:09,599 --> 00:56:09,920
through it.

1115
00:56:10,079 --> 00:56:11,760
Speaker 2: But those are really good places to start.

1116
00:56:11,840 --> 00:56:15,480
Speaker 1: If you want something after that, then I would start

1117
00:56:15,760 --> 00:56:19,679
recommending volumes that are much larger. The only other thing

1118
00:56:19,760 --> 00:56:24,239
I might recommend is this is the Jewish Annotated New Testament.

1119
00:56:24,280 --> 00:56:27,000
It's actually a commentary on the New Testament written by

1120
00:56:27,280 --> 00:56:30,800
by people that are actually in Judaism. And so if

1121
00:56:31,119 --> 00:56:33,199
you if you're looking through the New Testament and you're like,

1122
00:56:33,239 --> 00:56:36,199
this seems silly after I've read the Old Testament, don't worry.

1123
00:56:36,239 --> 00:56:38,440
It's not just silly to you. It was silly to

1124
00:56:38,480 --> 00:56:41,679
the Jews who heard it as well, and and here's

1125
00:56:41,960 --> 00:56:46,079
there's some some some lighthearted commentary on it. They don't

1126
00:56:46,079 --> 00:56:48,880
go too hard. They're pretty nice to their to their

1127
00:56:49,000 --> 00:56:52,480
Christian friends in this commentary, but they don't really hold

1128
00:56:52,519 --> 00:56:53,800
any any punches either.

1129
00:56:54,159 --> 00:56:56,400
Speaker 9: Yeah, and so I have a couple of examples of

1130
00:56:56,480 --> 00:56:59,559
just things that I've heard from sort of your streams

1131
00:57:00,239 --> 00:57:02,800
that I've sort of used in some of these discussions recently,

1132
00:57:02,960 --> 00:57:06,480
Like the curse of Jack and Ayah for the line

1133
00:57:06,519 --> 00:57:10,880
of Joseph right is something that most Christians like would

1134
00:57:11,360 --> 00:57:14,559
not be aware of, right, and they were all surprised

1135
00:57:14,559 --> 00:57:17,119
to be like, oh, well, you know Jesus's line goes

1136
00:57:17,159 --> 00:57:20,239
through Joseph, and like that's difficult. But also that you know,

1137
00:57:20,280 --> 00:57:21,280
the curse of Jack.

1138
00:57:21,119 --> 00:57:23,199
Speaker 5: Andia is like a you.

1139
00:57:23,079 --> 00:57:26,320
Speaker 9: Know why Joseph's line wouldn't even be eligible and then

1140
00:57:26,360 --> 00:57:29,119
you have to like sort of do this exceptionalism sort

1141
00:57:29,119 --> 00:57:32,599
of you know thing once you realize that. And then

1142
00:57:32,719 --> 00:57:34,880
the other thing was the you know, the way that

1143
00:57:34,920 --> 00:57:39,760
the septuagent translates Alma for the virgin birth right, And

1144
00:57:39,800 --> 00:57:42,320
I found I find that kind of stuff really interesting,

1145
00:57:42,400 --> 00:57:45,119
the fact that like, you know, the Greek translation we

1146
00:57:45,119 --> 00:57:48,840
we have, like the way that the KJV will translate

1147
00:57:48,920 --> 00:57:53,639
certain things sort of in ways that, uh, mislead the reader,

1148
00:57:54,000 --> 00:57:55,920
like you have that same issue with the subtu agent.

1149
00:57:56,320 --> 00:57:58,719
I find that kind of stuff really interesting. So I've

1150
00:57:58,760 --> 00:58:02,239
just I've been really enjoying your content and finding those

1151
00:58:02,320 --> 00:58:06,119
kinds of points really salient, and they get through somewhat

1152
00:58:06,559 --> 00:58:09,400
that it always feels like I'm kind of also browbeating

1153
00:58:09,440 --> 00:58:12,639
a little bit, like get that. I don't know where

1154
00:58:12,679 --> 00:58:15,960
you're getting some deep on it right right, but but

1155
00:58:16,000 --> 00:58:19,159
I appreciate it. I'm excited to look into the references

1156
00:58:19,159 --> 00:58:22,840
you've provided. And yeah, and Sarah like as as Justin said,

1157
00:58:23,039 --> 00:58:26,239
I find your your sort of style to be so

1158
00:58:27,000 --> 00:58:31,559
approachable and like, you know, constructive, and so you know,

1159
00:58:31,599 --> 00:58:34,239
I just any strategies from you, I'd be interested to hear.

1160
00:58:34,639 --> 00:58:35,000
Speaker 1: Yeah.

1161
00:58:35,079 --> 00:58:35,400
Speaker 9: Sure.

1162
00:58:35,840 --> 00:58:39,880
Speaker 3: I think if you want someone to understand you, you know,

1163
00:58:39,960 --> 00:58:44,960
you have to first understand them. And I think the

1164
00:58:45,159 --> 00:58:49,280
vast majority of people are trying to be good people,

1165
00:58:49,400 --> 00:58:52,280
and that's how I see them. You know, Yes, there

1166
00:58:52,280 --> 00:58:54,599
are some people who are mean for the sake of

1167
00:58:54,639 --> 00:58:57,159
being mean, but for the majority of people, they're at

1168
00:58:57,239 --> 00:59:00,360
least trying to come from a good place. And so

1169
00:59:01,639 --> 00:59:04,960
I want to find that good place and meet them there,

1170
00:59:05,360 --> 00:59:08,320
and then I think people will listen to what you

1171
00:59:08,440 --> 00:59:12,960
have to say more once they know that you understand

1172
00:59:13,039 --> 00:59:16,559
what they are saying. Right, So, and I think coming

1173
00:59:16,639 --> 00:59:18,679
from you know, if you used to be a Christian

1174
00:59:18,719 --> 00:59:20,960
and you're not any longer, it's a lot easier to

1175
00:59:21,000 --> 00:59:23,800
do because you can remember like, oh yeah, I remember

1176
00:59:23,840 --> 00:59:30,280
feeling that way, I remember experiencing that, and so I think, well,

1177
00:59:30,320 --> 00:59:33,159
as to put it simply, is empathy, right, because I

1178
00:59:34,320 --> 00:59:37,119
don't want to hurt people. I don't want people to

1179
00:59:37,159 --> 00:59:38,719
be mad at me, and I don't want to be

1180
00:59:38,800 --> 00:59:42,480
mad at them. And I do think that it's a

1181
00:59:42,599 --> 00:59:46,000
really cool, fun experience when someone comes at you really

1182
00:59:46,119 --> 00:59:49,480
angry and aggressive and you can find that point of

1183
00:59:49,519 --> 00:59:52,800
connection with them and remind them, hey, you're a human,

1184
00:59:53,000 --> 00:59:55,440
I'm a human, Like we actually have a lot more

1185
00:59:55,440 --> 00:59:59,039
in common than maybe you thought we did, and so

1186
00:59:59,320 --> 01:00:02,000
I think that's really gratifying. So yeah, I would just

1187
01:00:02,039 --> 01:00:05,719
say try to understand them first and try to connect

1188
01:00:05,800 --> 01:00:10,039
with them with the thing you all actually do have

1189
01:00:10,119 --> 01:00:10,639
in common.

1190
01:00:11,000 --> 01:00:15,079
Speaker 9: Yeah, you know, I think it's uh, there's a bit

1191
01:00:15,119 --> 01:00:18,480
of a balancing act because, like I, I do sort

1192
01:00:18,519 --> 01:00:22,519
of have personally my personal values are that like the

1193
01:00:22,559 --> 01:00:29,360
prescriptivism of like moral like of moral objectivity is like,

1194
01:00:29,440 --> 01:00:32,199
I think fundamentally harmful. Right, Like I think that to

1195
01:00:33,119 --> 01:00:36,760
adopt that worldview that like your that morals can be

1196
01:00:36,840 --> 01:00:39,280
dictated to you and that your sort of decision making

1197
01:00:39,599 --> 01:00:41,719
goes out the window, and it's more of a matter

1198
01:00:41,840 --> 01:00:44,760
of like finding the right citation and finding the right

1199
01:00:44,840 --> 01:00:48,360
sort of absolute moral authority to uh to get to

1200
01:00:48,480 --> 01:00:51,360
gets you into this place of just impass right. And

1201
01:00:51,880 --> 01:00:54,639
it's something that I'm really passionate about, like how to

1202
01:00:54,639 --> 01:00:57,639
to tell people that as as a as a moral

1203
01:00:57,880 --> 01:01:01,559
subjectivist or relativist, that that doesn't mean that it's not important.

1204
01:01:01,599 --> 01:01:04,800
I think that importance itself is a subjective thing. So

1205
01:01:05,480 --> 01:01:07,719
I think it's the only thing that can be important

1206
01:01:08,079 --> 01:01:10,440
is that you know, these are decisions that we have

1207
01:01:10,519 --> 01:01:13,440
to make and that they have to be derived from context.

1208
01:01:13,599 --> 01:01:17,280
But for people that have that ingrained in them, it's

1209
01:01:17,440 --> 01:01:21,159
like it's such a fundamental shift that I find it's

1210
01:01:21,199 --> 01:01:24,239
like it's hard to get them to like see that

1211
01:01:24,320 --> 01:01:27,360
as not an attack on their like basic moral sense

1212
01:01:27,760 --> 01:01:31,039
and telling them that their morals are are fundamentally wrong

1213
01:01:31,199 --> 01:01:34,719
or fundamentally broken, but at the same time, like I

1214
01:01:34,719 --> 01:01:39,480
think it's important for to deconstruct that worldview because you know,

1215
01:01:39,519 --> 01:01:42,880
we all have to try to understand and empathize with

1216
01:01:42,920 --> 01:01:45,880
each other to make to arrive at those your values

1217
01:01:45,880 --> 01:01:50,199
that you're talking about. So it's a it's a delicate thing.

1218
01:01:50,280 --> 01:01:52,960
But I really appreciate both of you in the work

1219
01:01:53,000 --> 01:01:54,599
that you do, and so I don't want to take

1220
01:01:54,639 --> 01:01:56,559
up too much of your time, and you might have

1221
01:01:56,639 --> 01:02:00,400
more interesting or controversial callers, but I'm just a big

1222
01:02:00,440 --> 01:02:02,960
fan of the show and both of you guys. So

1223
01:02:03,199 --> 01:02:05,119
I just wanted to call in since I saw you

1224
01:02:05,119 --> 01:02:07,719
guys were live and tell you I appreciate all the

1225
01:02:07,719 --> 01:02:09,280
work that you do and all the work that the

1226
01:02:09,280 --> 01:02:12,039
line does. And yeah, I just wanted to have a

1227
01:02:12,079 --> 01:02:12,679
second to talk.

1228
01:02:12,760 --> 01:02:14,039
Speaker 3: So thanks so much.

1229
01:02:14,079 --> 01:02:16,119
Speaker 9: I'll let you guys go, but I appreciate that. Yeah,

1230
01:02:16,119 --> 01:02:18,480
I appreciate the time. Thank you, guys, big.

1231
01:02:18,400 --> 01:02:21,599
Speaker 1: W Frank, best look on your on your deconstructing journey man.

1232
01:02:21,800 --> 01:02:25,920
Speaker 9: Yeah, I mean I'm I'm fully deconstructed. I mean it's

1233
01:02:25,920 --> 01:02:29,480
more more me trying to be a constructive advocate in the.

1234
01:02:29,480 --> 01:02:31,480
Speaker 1: Space, right right, right, Well, let us know if you

1235
01:02:31,519 --> 01:02:32,000
need anything.

1236
01:02:32,000 --> 01:02:33,440
Speaker 9: Okay, all right, thank you guys.

1237
01:02:33,519 --> 01:02:34,000
Speaker 2: Chris friend.

1238
01:02:34,119 --> 01:02:37,719
Speaker 1: All right, we've got Christian back with us. It looks

1239
01:02:37,719 --> 01:02:40,679
like they're connection dropped out, but Christian came back to

1240
01:02:41,079 --> 01:02:43,519
let's finish our discussion on evolution.

1241
01:02:44,559 --> 01:02:46,039
Speaker 2: Let me grab Christian from the.

1242
01:02:46,000 --> 01:02:47,880
Speaker 1: Call you and then we've we may and may not

1243
01:02:47,960 --> 01:02:51,559
have somebody coming up in the call screen after Christian. Christian,

1244
01:02:51,599 --> 01:02:52,199
welcome back.

1245
01:02:52,440 --> 01:02:55,599
Speaker 8: Thank you very much, and I appreciate you saying the

1246
01:02:55,679 --> 01:02:59,119
connection there was actually me having a senior moment. It's

1247
01:02:59,119 --> 01:03:02,079
a new phone, and my finger was on the power button,

1248
01:03:02,159 --> 01:03:04,119
and yeah, I just shut it off on you guys.

1249
01:03:04,119 --> 01:03:07,519
So I apologize, thank you for having me back. I

1250
01:03:07,559 --> 01:03:11,840
promise I used the time away productively. I made some

1251
01:03:11,920 --> 01:03:16,159
notes here and I wrote them down after rewatching what

1252
01:03:16,199 --> 01:03:19,119
you were kind of to share with me. So I

1253
01:03:19,159 --> 01:03:22,840
know we were talking about evolution and that you were

1254
01:03:22,880 --> 01:03:27,960
saying how evolution doesn't necessarily equate to a soul. Honestly,

1255
01:03:28,159 --> 01:03:32,239
souls and spirits don't make sense to me. Energy changing

1256
01:03:32,320 --> 01:03:35,719
forms does, if that makes sense, So happy to.

1257
01:03:35,679 --> 01:03:36,559
Speaker 2: Help me understand.

1258
01:03:36,760 --> 01:03:40,599
Speaker 1: Yeah, I thought that you previously said that you've believed

1259
01:03:40,880 --> 01:03:45,039
or you liked to believe because of the possibility of

1260
01:03:45,079 --> 01:03:46,440
your loved ones having like.

1261
01:03:46,400 --> 01:03:50,400
Speaker 2: A decent afterlife. Yes, absolutely, does that entail that you

1262
01:03:50,400 --> 01:03:51,119
would have a soul?

1263
01:03:51,320 --> 01:03:55,079
Speaker 8: I wouldn't use that word per se. I didn't know

1264
01:03:55,159 --> 01:03:58,239
how to describe it. I would say you would have consciousness,

1265
01:03:58,840 --> 01:04:02,119
what form like if there was a physical form that

1266
01:04:02,159 --> 01:04:04,920
would take I couldn't really say.

1267
01:04:04,960 --> 01:04:07,960
Speaker 1: So, what do you think would be living on or

1268
01:04:08,000 --> 01:04:09,679
do you think that the body gets resurrected?

1269
01:04:09,719 --> 01:04:12,079
Speaker 2: Like what's the what's the view here?

1270
01:04:12,199 --> 01:04:17,000
Speaker 8: I necessarily the body bodies seem pretty useless. Just the consciousness,

1271
01:04:17,000 --> 01:04:20,000
the essence of who you are. And by the way,

1272
01:04:20,000 --> 01:04:25,960
I don't think evolution resulted in humans specifically, or that

1273
01:04:25,960 --> 01:04:28,679
that was like a goal of evolution like some people

1274
01:04:28,800 --> 01:04:32,280
might infer. I think evolution just resulted in a beautiful

1275
01:04:32,280 --> 01:04:35,360
diversity of life. Humans aren't special in that regard. But

1276
01:04:35,400 --> 01:04:38,119
I also don't think eternal paradise is just for people

1277
01:04:38,199 --> 01:04:40,639
and you know, cute dogs. I think it's for all lives.

1278
01:04:40,679 --> 01:04:43,039
Speaker 1: Okay, so not just humans. What do you think of there, Sarah?

1279
01:04:43,280 --> 01:04:48,480
Speaker 3: Yeah, so everything that has ever been alive gets to

1280
01:04:48,840 --> 01:04:51,960
remain alive forever.

1281
01:04:52,280 --> 01:04:54,280
Speaker 8: Yes, absolutely, if it wants to, and.

1282
01:04:54,360 --> 01:04:57,360
Speaker 3: There you'd have a lot of things in play there

1283
01:04:57,400 --> 01:05:01,239
like that, So then if it wants to I mean

1284
01:05:01,400 --> 01:05:05,679
that would mean that every living cell or plant or

1285
01:05:05,719 --> 01:05:09,400
animal is capable of making a decision about whether it

1286
01:05:09,440 --> 01:05:12,159
wants to remain alive. And then there would have to

1287
01:05:12,159 --> 01:05:15,320
be some sort of mechanism by which that decision could

1288
01:05:15,320 --> 01:05:18,280
be made, and then that the effect of that decision.

1289
01:05:18,400 --> 01:05:20,239
That would be a pretty I mean, it's a pretty

1290
01:05:20,239 --> 01:05:22,920
complicated proposition.

1291
01:05:22,559 --> 01:05:26,039
Speaker 8: Interesting everything needing some sort of survival instinct and being

1292
01:05:26,079 --> 01:05:27,159
able to act upon that.

1293
01:05:27,440 --> 01:05:31,239
Speaker 3: Well, I mean generally, like we don't get to choose

1294
01:05:31,360 --> 01:05:33,679
if we are alive or not. I mean, I understand

1295
01:05:33,719 --> 01:05:37,079
we as humans have the capability of ending that, but

1296
01:05:37,239 --> 01:05:40,119
it's not like a moment by moment decision would you

1297
01:05:40,280 --> 01:05:42,559
like to be alive or not? You know, it's not

1298
01:05:42,880 --> 01:05:46,119
we can't just close our eyes and decide, you know,

1299
01:05:46,320 --> 01:05:49,320
we have to take a very specific action. So if

1300
01:05:49,360 --> 01:05:53,000
every living creature was to be given this choice, then

1301
01:05:53,039 --> 01:05:56,280
there would have to be some mechanism by which their

1302
01:05:56,360 --> 01:06:00,519
life could go on or be end did and then

1303
01:06:00,519 --> 01:06:03,239
something would have to do that. Like get it's a

1304
01:06:03,239 --> 01:06:06,880
hard system I think to justify.

1305
01:06:07,760 --> 01:06:10,000
Speaker 8: I guess it just comes from my perspective that all

1306
01:06:10,119 --> 01:06:12,840
life has value. You know, everything has seemed to have

1307
01:06:12,960 --> 01:06:14,000
something to contribute.

1308
01:06:14,239 --> 01:06:16,559
Speaker 3: Yeah, and I think that totally makes sense. It's just

1309
01:06:16,719 --> 01:06:21,039
the eternity part, the afterlife part, you know. I think

1310
01:06:21,239 --> 01:06:24,639
all life can have value and it doesn't need to

1311
01:06:24,679 --> 01:06:28,480
be eternal or infinite in order for that life to

1312
01:06:28,519 --> 01:06:29,119
have value.

1313
01:06:29,360 --> 01:06:32,400
Speaker 8: To quote the Late Great you know, Christopher Hitchins, it's

1314
01:06:32,440 --> 01:06:35,639
not like a celestial North Korea where you know you

1315
01:06:35,800 --> 01:06:38,280
have to stay there forever, like you have options.

1316
01:06:38,360 --> 01:06:40,320
Speaker 3: Yeah, then you have to have someone who's there or

1317
01:06:40,400 --> 01:06:44,400
something that's creating those options and directing those options. You know,

1318
01:06:44,519 --> 01:06:46,119
it's complicated, it is.

1319
01:06:46,360 --> 01:06:48,840
Speaker 8: Yeah, I definitely don't have all the answers for sure.

1320
01:06:48,960 --> 01:06:49,360
Speaker 3: I get that.

1321
01:06:49,559 --> 01:06:49,880
Speaker 2: Sure.

1322
01:06:50,159 --> 01:06:54,159
Speaker 1: I'm curious would you be of the opinion that getting

1323
01:06:54,239 --> 01:06:58,440
to participate in the after life would be like a

1324
01:06:58,440 --> 01:07:01,639
true dichotomy, like you either get to participate in the

1325
01:07:01,679 --> 01:07:04,239
afterlife or you don't, or is there an alternative like

1326
01:07:04,280 --> 01:07:07,039
you get sent to, like I don't know, a purgatory

1327
01:07:07,440 --> 01:07:10,039
or a hell or something like that.

1328
01:07:10,280 --> 01:07:12,320
Speaker 8: I think the comps. I'm so glad you asked that.

1329
01:07:13,199 --> 01:07:16,960
I think the concept of a hell is disgusting, and

1330
01:07:17,159 --> 01:07:20,800
purgatory never made sense to me, no, if there is

1331
01:07:20,840 --> 01:07:23,119
a loving creator, and I'm not going to assign a

1332
01:07:23,159 --> 01:07:25,480
gender to a creator, that seems stupid too. If there's

1333
01:07:25,519 --> 01:07:31,320
a loving creator, godisic. Oh, yeah, I got it. Okay.

1334
01:07:31,440 --> 01:07:35,400
If there's a loving creator and we are all all lives,

1335
01:07:35,400 --> 01:07:38,559
if we are all children of that loving creator, then

1336
01:07:38,920 --> 01:07:41,360
you know, yes, we're going to make mistakes if we

1337
01:07:41,480 --> 01:07:45,159
have absolute freedom, free will. But a true loving parent

1338
01:07:45,199 --> 01:07:48,079
would correct the child, would teach the child. But a

1339
01:07:48,119 --> 01:07:50,079
patience with the child hell is child abuse.

1340
01:07:50,840 --> 01:07:52,159
Speaker 2: Yeah. I couldn't agree more.

1341
01:07:52,440 --> 01:07:56,360
Speaker 3: Well, it sounds like you are in a really cool

1342
01:07:56,360 --> 01:07:59,079
place of trying to figure out what makes sense and

1343
01:07:59,239 --> 01:08:02,199
figure out what aligns with your own values, you know,

1344
01:08:03,159 --> 01:08:06,519
and I appreciate that you wouldn't want to worship a

1345
01:08:06,599 --> 01:08:09,920
god that would be cruel and that would be abusive.

1346
01:08:11,199 --> 01:08:13,840
So I yeah, I mean I get that. I think

1347
01:08:13,880 --> 01:08:15,800
it's sounds like you're in a really cool part of

1348
01:08:15,840 --> 01:08:16,359
your journey.

1349
01:08:16,479 --> 01:08:19,720
Speaker 8: I appreciate that. It's just I guess something I need

1350
01:08:19,760 --> 01:08:22,560
to cling on to. You know, the evils done by

1351
01:08:22,800 --> 01:08:27,880
the major organized religions, the things in scripture that justify them.

1352
01:08:27,880 --> 01:08:30,399
You know, I can have no part in any of that.

1353
01:08:30,760 --> 01:08:34,520
But I'd like to think I found maybe a happy

1354
01:08:34,600 --> 01:08:35,279
middle ground.

1355
01:08:35,680 --> 01:08:38,600
Speaker 1: Well, I mean, we're certainly glad that you were, that

1356
01:08:38,680 --> 01:08:42,600
you're deconstructing and moving into what we would call like

1357
01:08:42,640 --> 01:08:47,000
a healthier position. So certainly best of look on your journey,

1358
01:08:47,000 --> 01:08:50,119
and if you did anything, come and ask questions.

1359
01:08:50,319 --> 01:08:53,520
Speaker 8: I add one last thing, So the only other thought

1360
01:08:53,520 --> 01:08:55,880
I was at and kind of kind of the reason

1361
01:08:55,960 --> 01:08:59,239
why I felt the pool to come back to some

1362
01:08:59,520 --> 01:09:04,640
form of theism is that as a former apist, it

1363
01:09:04,680 --> 01:09:06,680
took me personally, and I know this isn't the same

1364
01:09:06,680 --> 01:09:09,319
for everybody. It took me personally to a very dark,

1365
01:09:09,800 --> 01:09:14,920
nihilistic place where nothing had meaning. And this kind of

1366
01:09:14,960 --> 01:09:15,600
helps with.

1367
01:09:15,479 --> 01:09:16,399
Speaker 9: That a little bit.

1368
01:09:16,600 --> 01:09:18,640
Speaker 8: That and medication and therapy.

1369
01:09:18,600 --> 01:09:21,720
Speaker 3: And hey, I will always plug therapy. And yeah, for

1370
01:09:21,800 --> 01:09:24,960
people who medication is beneficial for love it way to

1371
01:09:25,000 --> 01:09:27,119
take care of yourself, that's awesome.

1372
01:09:27,319 --> 01:09:28,840
Speaker 2: Yeah, mental health is important.

1373
01:09:28,880 --> 01:09:30,680
Speaker 8: Thank you so much for your time. I want to

1374
01:09:30,720 --> 01:09:32,199
I want to take up the whole here.

1375
01:09:32,880 --> 01:09:34,039
Speaker 3: We appreciate you coming on.

1376
01:09:34,880 --> 01:09:37,840
Speaker 2: Thank you so much. We appreciate you calling in cheers.

1377
01:09:37,840 --> 01:09:39,119
Speaker 8: Frank, you guys are great. Thank you.

1378
01:09:40,439 --> 01:09:43,920
Speaker 1: I do remember being in a similar spot after deconstructing

1379
01:09:44,159 --> 01:09:49,159
from Christianity, where I wasn't quite ready to let go

1380
01:09:49,479 --> 01:09:53,520
of some of the more some of the more pleasing

1381
01:09:53,600 --> 01:09:56,800
concepts of the religion, like getting to live forever and

1382
01:09:56,840 --> 01:09:59,800
seeing your loved ones again and things like that. I can,

1383
01:10:00,000 --> 01:10:02,479
I certainly understand where he's at right now.

1384
01:10:02,840 --> 01:10:05,399
Speaker 3: Yeah, for sure, I can't. I mean, it's so much

1385
01:10:05,439 --> 01:10:08,039
to give up, it is, it's such a I mean,

1386
01:10:08,079 --> 01:10:10,000
I think I was weird in that while it took

1387
01:10:10,039 --> 01:10:12,079
me a year to get there, like I lost all

1388
01:10:12,079 --> 01:10:14,680
of it all at once in like one moment, which

1389
01:10:14,720 --> 01:10:20,239
is weird. But I definitely struggled for a long time

1390
01:10:20,399 --> 01:10:22,920
with the idea of wait a minute, and I'm just

1391
01:10:22,960 --> 01:10:25,680
going to die. What do you mean I'm just gonna die?

1392
01:10:25,760 --> 01:10:29,680
That's terrible. So yeah, I can. I can really appreciate

1393
01:10:29,800 --> 01:10:33,039
how uncomfortable and painful and frustrating that is.

1394
01:10:33,359 --> 01:10:34,600
Speaker 2: Yeah, for sure, for sure.

1395
01:10:35,039 --> 01:10:37,640
Speaker 1: Well, we've got some super chats to read out. Thank

1396
01:10:37,640 --> 01:10:39,359
you so much for being here friends. We're going to

1397
01:10:39,399 --> 01:10:41,920
read out some super chats, and then we're going to

1398
01:10:41,960 --> 01:10:45,439
say hi to our friend who's been backing us up tonight. Meg,

1399
01:10:45,520 --> 01:10:47,840
thank you so much for the four ninety nine dollars

1400
01:10:47,840 --> 01:10:50,720
super chest says glad you survived the Great chili sauce

1401
01:10:50,760 --> 01:10:54,079
Apocalypse of twenty twenty five and Meg just man, I

1402
01:10:54,199 --> 01:10:56,600
tell you, I'm glad to be here and I didn't

1403
01:10:56,600 --> 01:10:57,680
get sauce raptured.

1404
01:10:58,399 --> 01:11:00,079
Speaker 2: I'm gonna be okay. Don't worry about me.

1405
01:11:00,399 --> 01:11:03,159
Speaker 1: And el teen thank you for the twin dour st

1406
01:11:03,239 --> 01:11:05,880
el team says, hey, justin to stop people from following

1407
01:11:05,920 --> 01:11:08,840
in your footsteps? Was all that hot sauce pain worth

1408
01:11:08,880 --> 01:11:12,000
being constantly hit on during your live Pretty sure there's

1409
01:11:12,039 --> 01:11:14,840
a correlation there. Asking for a friend and el teen,

1410
01:11:15,119 --> 01:11:18,119
you're not wrong. The positive correlation was, in fact there.

1411
01:11:18,159 --> 01:11:22,000
The more hot sauce I consumed, the more people came

1412
01:11:22,079 --> 01:11:25,239
up trying to get a piece of the deconstruction zone.

1413
01:11:25,920 --> 01:11:29,199
Speaker 2: And so if.

1414
01:11:28,720 --> 01:11:31,960
Speaker 1: You're sitting around the weekend lonely and you're thinking to myself,

1415
01:11:32,079 --> 01:11:34,600
I need to find some company to be around, you

1416
01:11:34,680 --> 01:11:37,039
might want to consider taking a few shots of hot

1417
01:11:37,079 --> 01:11:40,079
sauce up in your temperature and then visiting your your

1418
01:11:40,720 --> 01:11:45,640
your local social get together. And this this is not

1419
01:11:45,880 --> 01:11:50,439
dating advice, as I can tell you, is what happened

1420
01:11:51,359 --> 01:11:55,039
in my experience. It's amazing, Daisy, thank you for the

1421
01:11:55,039 --> 01:11:57,800
time says, do you think the odds of a generic

1422
01:11:57,880 --> 01:12:01,880
deity existing is better or worse then being dealt a

1423
01:12:01,960 --> 01:12:03,640
royal flush in poker?

1424
01:12:04,000 --> 01:12:04,680
Speaker 2: That's a good one.

1425
01:12:04,880 --> 01:12:08,640
Speaker 1: The odds are apparently six hundred and forty nine seven

1426
01:12:08,520 --> 01:12:12,680
hundred and thirty nine to one, and I thanks.

1427
01:12:11,920 --> 01:12:14,399
Speaker 3: You would possibly do the math right? How could you

1428
01:12:14,439 --> 01:12:17,279
calculate the odds of a generic deity existing? I have

1429
01:12:17,319 --> 01:12:17,880
no idea.

1430
01:12:18,359 --> 01:12:19,079
Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm with you.

1431
01:12:19,159 --> 01:12:21,479
Speaker 1: Actually, I don't know how you could possibly calculate the

1432
01:12:21,479 --> 01:12:25,840
odds since we have no mathematical way to relate something

1433
01:12:25,840 --> 01:12:29,479
we don't know exists. Yep, right, agreed, it's my odds

1434
01:12:29,479 --> 01:12:34,520
are with a royal flush, always bet on the house. Carlos,

1435
01:12:34,560 --> 01:12:37,760
thank you so much for sending out five atheists experience

1436
01:12:37,800 --> 01:12:41,319
gifted memberships, big w friend, and also for the three

1437
01:12:41,399 --> 01:12:44,680
hundred MX super gests is just enjoying this stream with

1438
01:12:44,760 --> 01:12:48,520
this these killing combo by the way, justin happy to

1439
01:12:48,520 --> 01:12:53,079
see the Browns one today. Hell Doug, Indeed, Carlos, thank

1440
01:12:53,119 --> 01:12:56,079
you so much for being here. And I'm lucky to

1441
01:12:56,119 --> 01:12:58,680
be a be able to share a screen with Sarah again,

1442
01:12:58,760 --> 01:13:01,079
and I'm glad that everyone was able to make it

1443
01:13:01,119 --> 01:13:04,920
to the show. And obviously go dog pound ecta fool.

1444
01:13:04,960 --> 01:13:06,800
Thank you so much for the two dar Superjest says,

1445
01:13:07,039 --> 01:13:11,920
Sarah time he is Sarah, not the like the Bob

1446
01:13:12,000 --> 01:13:17,279
Ross of our time period in the deconstruction zone.

1447
01:13:17,840 --> 01:13:20,239
Speaker 3: I'm just saying that's delightful. I'll take it.

1448
01:13:21,279 --> 01:13:24,720
Speaker 1: There's obviously some crossover there, Shadow slaves, Thank you for

1449
01:13:24,760 --> 01:13:28,399
the ten dollars. Superjest Sato says, according to Levitica's twenty ten,

1450
01:13:28,520 --> 01:13:32,520
would Jesus even survive until being born if Mary claimed

1451
01:13:32,520 --> 01:13:35,479
to be pregnant outside of marriage? Such a good point.

1452
01:13:35,640 --> 01:13:37,600
There's a couple things to consider here. First of all,

1453
01:13:37,680 --> 01:13:39,720
Jesus had to die because he knocked up his own mother,

1454
01:13:39,800 --> 01:13:42,920
and that's a violation in Leviticus either eighteen or twenty.

1455
01:13:43,680 --> 01:13:47,039
And also in Deuteronomy twenty two he knocked up a

1456
01:13:47,039 --> 01:13:49,680
betrothed woman, which means he gets the death penalty twice,

1457
01:13:49,680 --> 01:13:53,800
which means Jesus still has another crucifixion coming. As far

1458
01:13:53,840 --> 01:13:56,479
as I a sort of my tally is concerned.

1459
01:13:56,199 --> 01:13:59,800
Speaker 3: Okay, but to be clear, it's technically the Holy Spirit

1460
01:14:00,119 --> 01:14:01,600
that did the knocking up, right.

1461
01:14:01,880 --> 01:14:07,319
Speaker 1: I mean, it's difficult because if Jesus is God and

1462
01:14:07,359 --> 01:14:11,000
the Holy Spirit is God, and God is the Spirit,

1463
01:14:11,000 --> 01:14:14,119
and the Spirit knocked up Mary, then we can only

1464
01:14:14,159 --> 01:14:16,279
logically conclude that Jesus knocked up as a mother to

1465
01:14:16,279 --> 01:14:17,159
give birth to himself.

1466
01:14:17,239 --> 01:14:19,960
Speaker 3: Right, A equals be equals C. Therefore a equal C.

1467
01:14:20,399 --> 01:14:21,399
Speaker 2: I mean exactly.

1468
01:14:21,520 --> 01:14:25,359
Speaker 1: I could have said it better, Goddess of Rebels, great

1469
01:14:25,439 --> 01:14:27,640
name and thinking for the twenty five dollars super check,

1470
01:14:27,680 --> 01:14:30,600
God says, I'm curious if you have heard of the

1471
01:14:30,640 --> 01:14:33,800
Bible Study Fellowship. It's a Bible education program. I was

1472
01:14:33,920 --> 01:14:38,359
raised in trained to format sermons by ten years old,

1473
01:14:38,640 --> 01:14:41,920
how to analyze text in historical context, still not allowed

1474
01:14:41,920 --> 01:14:44,840
to speak English. I've never heard of this project, have

1475
01:14:44,920 --> 01:14:45,319
you there?

1476
01:14:45,640 --> 01:14:47,359
Speaker 3: No, I have no idea what that is.

1477
01:14:47,880 --> 01:14:51,520
Speaker 1: Yeah, when I was a kid, we were encouraged to

1478
01:14:51,920 --> 01:14:54,479
read the Bible, but I can't say much beyond that,

1479
01:14:54,560 --> 01:14:57,359
we didn't really have any tools. We're just told we

1480
01:14:57,399 --> 01:14:59,840
should we should know it. To be fair, I went

1481
01:14:59,840 --> 01:15:03,239
to to a really decent Catholic school growing up, and

1482
01:15:03,279 --> 01:15:05,520
they read the Bible with us in religion class. So

1483
01:15:05,800 --> 01:15:08,439
there are some Catholic schools where they they you just

1484
01:15:08,479 --> 01:15:10,399
need to listen to the priest, don't read the Bible.

1485
01:15:10,439 --> 01:15:12,560
You don't need to know what's in there. I went

1486
01:15:12,600 --> 01:15:14,399
to a really cool school where they actually read the

1487
01:15:14,399 --> 01:15:17,399
Bible with us, so I'm happy about that. And last

1488
01:15:17,399 --> 01:15:20,239
super chat from our friend Evan Rock. Thank you so

1489
01:15:20,319 --> 01:15:22,800
much Evan for the down ninety nine super chat. He says,

1490
01:15:22,840 --> 01:15:28,800
Hot Sauce hangover survival equals miracle of Doug. Doug gave

1491
01:15:28,920 --> 01:15:33,920
me strake. Indeed, we we survived the Hot Sauce Apocalypse.

1492
01:15:33,960 --> 01:15:40,560
Everything's okay, friends, No worries, No worries. Deconstruction zone is fine.

1493
01:15:40,640 --> 01:15:43,279
Speaker 3: I would have I would have, you know, died after

1494
01:15:43,319 --> 01:15:44,640
the first one.

1495
01:15:46,079 --> 01:15:48,279
Speaker 1: Not everyone's cut out for it. You have to have

1496
01:15:48,960 --> 01:15:53,319
the right stomach for it. With that, let's think our backup.

1497
01:15:53,600 --> 01:15:56,880
A godless engineer has been back here all night watching

1498
01:15:56,960 --> 01:15:57,479
the stream.

1499
01:15:57,560 --> 01:15:59,319
Speaker 2: How you doing, buddy, You know.

1500
01:15:59,319 --> 01:16:02,079
Speaker 12: I'm doing pretty good. A lot of great callers tonight.

1501
01:16:02,279 --> 01:16:05,880
It's been awesome sitting back just watching you two. You know,

1502
01:16:07,039 --> 01:16:08,479
you know, have your discussions with them.

1503
01:16:08,560 --> 01:16:11,359
Speaker 1: Any thoughts on some of the deconstruction talks. It seems

1504
01:16:11,399 --> 01:16:13,439
like we had quite a few people that were either

1505
01:16:13,880 --> 01:16:15,920
late or mid journey deconstruction.

1506
01:16:17,039 --> 01:16:18,399
Speaker 6: Yeah, I don't know.

1507
01:16:18,439 --> 01:16:20,520
Speaker 12: The one that stuck out to me was the weird

1508
01:16:20,560 --> 01:16:23,439
one where apparently if you're unobservant you get to spend

1509
01:16:23,479 --> 01:16:26,600
an eternity in hell. Like that was a little weird

1510
01:16:26,640 --> 01:16:31,560
for me. Honestly, I really like to talk about rapture.

1511
01:16:31,840 --> 01:16:34,119
That made me think of when I was in I

1512
01:16:34,159 --> 01:16:36,920
believe it was high school. I had turned on the

1513
01:16:36,960 --> 01:16:39,600
TV one day and it was in the middle of

1514
01:16:39,680 --> 01:16:42,560
the Left Behind movie, but it was right at the

1515
01:16:42,600 --> 01:16:45,560
part where they were doing all the newscasts, and so

1516
01:16:45,960 --> 01:16:49,000
I was sitting there thinking, oh shit, is this really happening.

1517
01:16:49,079 --> 01:16:52,039
What's going on? Did the rapture occur? And so like

1518
01:16:52,119 --> 01:16:54,279
I'm running around and I'm the only person in the house.

1519
01:16:54,399 --> 01:16:55,600
Speaker 2: I'm like, fuck, it happened.

1520
01:16:56,159 --> 01:16:58,760
Speaker 12: And you know, I go back and I look and

1521
01:16:58,800 --> 01:16:59,239
it's like.

1522
01:16:59,159 --> 01:17:01,479
Speaker 6: Oh, it's on Team T It's fucking left Behind.

1523
01:17:01,520 --> 01:17:05,039
Speaker 12: Okay great, And so like I just had like a brief,

1524
01:17:05,119 --> 01:17:08,520
like five minute freak out thinking that the rapture had happened.

1525
01:17:08,279 --> 01:17:12,800
Speaker 6: And I'm alone, and uh, it's like the world's.

1526
01:17:13,079 --> 01:17:16,159
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, it really was wild.

1527
01:17:16,239 --> 01:17:19,760
Speaker 12: But yeah, all the deconstruction talk, I mean it h

1528
01:17:19,920 --> 01:17:22,680
it brings me back to when I would h interview

1529
01:17:22,720 --> 01:17:26,079
people from my channel and talking about their deconstruction.

1530
01:17:26,520 --> 01:17:28,119
Speaker 6: Uh you know, journeys and.

1531
01:17:28,079 --> 01:17:29,960
Speaker 12: Uh, you know, there's a there's a lot there to

1532
01:17:30,600 --> 01:17:33,840
really unpacked and really uh that can really help a

1533
01:17:33,840 --> 01:17:37,039
lot of other people. Just hearing somebody's deconstruction story, knowing

1534
01:17:37,079 --> 01:17:40,079
that you're not like alone and whatever journey you're in,

1535
01:17:40,159 --> 01:17:42,159
that that can be very powerful for some people.

1536
01:17:42,319 --> 01:17:44,079
Speaker 1: Yeah, I can. Actually I don't know if I told

1537
01:17:44,119 --> 01:17:46,680
you this before, gee, but your channel is one of

1538
01:17:46,680 --> 01:17:49,920
the first atheist channels I ever subscribed to. Yours and

1539
01:17:50,000 --> 01:17:53,920
the Milwaukee Atheists and uh yeah, And I found it,

1540
01:17:54,319 --> 01:17:58,439
like really helpful that I wasn't the only one that

1541
01:17:58,439 --> 01:18:01,720
that was in that deconstru Like, oh, other people are

1542
01:18:01,760 --> 01:18:02,159
doing this.

1543
01:18:02,319 --> 01:18:03,439
Speaker 2: Like I know, I'm not crazy.

1544
01:18:03,479 --> 01:18:05,319
Speaker 1: I did the work, I put my homework in, right,

1545
01:18:05,479 --> 01:18:08,279
but I'm just glad I'm not the only one.

1546
01:18:08,960 --> 01:18:11,840
Speaker 12: Oh yeah. And I mean, like before I had my

1547
01:18:11,920 --> 01:18:14,159
YouTube channel, I had Facebook and so like I'd get

1548
01:18:14,199 --> 01:18:18,680
messages all the time where, you know, similar similar stories

1549
01:18:18,720 --> 01:18:21,720
about you know, helping people through deconstruction. So I'm just

1550
01:18:22,000 --> 01:18:23,880
I'm glad to be here and be a you know

1551
01:18:24,000 --> 01:18:25,199
that that anything that I.

1552
01:18:25,159 --> 01:18:27,439
Speaker 6: Do is a resource for people. That's that's fantastic.

1553
01:18:27,520 --> 01:18:29,520
Speaker 1: Well, we're certainly glad to have you and Sarah, we're

1554
01:18:29,560 --> 01:18:31,640
certainly glad to have you with us today as well.

1555
01:18:31,640 --> 01:18:33,000
Speaker 2: Thank you so much for joining.

1556
01:18:33,399 --> 01:18:36,119
Speaker 1: If you if you like Sarah's content, you can find

1557
01:18:36,159 --> 01:18:38,640
it if you're not really following at Leaving Faith, it's

1558
01:18:38,680 --> 01:18:41,960
the same handle on TikTok and on YouTube, and she

1559
01:18:42,079 --> 01:18:44,920
goes live regularly so you can you can interact with

1560
01:18:44,960 --> 01:18:47,159
her through the comments and whatnot through the live streams.

1561
01:18:47,319 --> 01:18:51,680
Her live streams are healing. My live stream you're chaos.

1562
01:18:52,239 --> 01:19:00,239
Her live streams different are healing. So if if if

1563
01:19:00,239 --> 01:19:03,039
that's your vibe, Sarah's the place to go. And with that, friends,

1564
01:19:03,039 --> 01:19:05,880
thank you so much for being here today. It's always

1565
01:19:05,880 --> 01:19:09,800
a pleasure getting to talk about these topics with the callers.

1566
01:19:10,039 --> 01:19:12,000
And we'll see you again same time next week, four

1567
01:19:12,039 --> 01:19:16,199
thirty Central time, five thirty Eastern time, same place.

1568
01:19:16,479 --> 01:19:17,640
Speaker 3: Thank you so much for having me.

1569
01:19:18,880 --> 01:19:31,119
Speaker 13: Glad it's day say start albay Stott around.

1570
01:19:35,600 --> 01:19:41,000
Speaker 1: Watch Talking and Live Sundays at one pm Central.

1571
01:19:41,119 --> 01:19:44,079
Speaker 3: Visit tiny dot c c slash y T T H

1572
01:19:44,239 --> 01:19:46,560
and call into the show at five one two nine

1573
01:19:46,680 --> 01:19:49,399
nine nine two four two, or connect to the show

1574
01:19:49,439 --> 01:19:52,640
online at tiny dot c c slash call thh