WEBVTT 1 00:00:00.400 --> 00:00:03.640 The Projection Booth podcast is sponsored by Scarecrow Video. Try 2 00:00:03.640 --> 00:00:06.639 out Scarecrows run by mail service. Choose from over one 3 00:00:06.719 --> 00:00:09.119 hundred and fifty thousand films and get Blu rays, four 4 00:00:09.199 --> 00:00:12.759 k's and DVDs delivered directly to your door. Visit scarecrow 5 00:00:12.839 --> 00:00:13.800 dot com today. 6 00:00:19.199 --> 00:00:22.000 Oh geez bolts, it's showtime. 7 00:00:22.719 --> 00:00:24.679 People say good money to see this movie. 8 00:00:25.000 --> 00:00:27.640 When they go out to a theater, they want clothed sodas, 9 00:00:27.960 --> 00:00:31.280 pop popcorn in No monsters in the projection Booth. 10 00:00:31.440 --> 00:00:33.280 Everyone pretend podcasting isn't boring. 11 00:00:34.399 --> 00:01:16.359 Ut it off. 12 00:00:59.079 --> 00:01:02.759 Out set keys, I'm film for Helmut Kitner. 13 00:01:03.240 --> 00:01:04.959 Is this and his Manage for Lone? 14 00:01:04.959 --> 00:01:09.680 And this is Robert Nightad the can Lo, the land Snatched, 15 00:01:09.719 --> 00:01:11.000 bar as. 16 00:01:10.840 --> 00:01:12.200 As and al Seines. 17 00:01:12.239 --> 00:01:15.040 There's Peggy and the w As, Madeira Father and Oslaa 18 00:01:15.079 --> 00:01:17.000 and Keira as far As brother and Midliner. 19 00:01:19.079 --> 00:01:19.599 The small. 20 00:01:20.959 --> 00:01:24.799 Are scientists and dish wrestler, the Apish. 21 00:01:24.920 --> 00:01:30.000 The Priest for the Cloves for the Zebra for them 22 00:01:30.079 --> 00:01:32.000 Anger Division, Watch Good. 23 00:01:31.920 --> 00:01:38.120 Vision, don't Nova give Spanish. 24 00:01:37.560 --> 00:01:42.959 To so ohs. Next March to the of Us Joe Joe. 25 00:01:44.560 --> 00:01:45.879 Plato and the Man on. 26 00:01:47.400 --> 00:01:53.280 The American Raquiton Bason and a ropa robatics that's miskuchi 27 00:01:53.879 --> 00:01:57.439 and four swats and cases you have for Chetonville nats 28 00:01:57.680 --> 00:02:02.200 and onlook about the fim Helmut quite puts in and 29 00:02:02.280 --> 00:02:03.159 it's wheels together. 30 00:02:04.120 --> 00:02:07.400 That is their job wasn't goos, Yes, this is our 31 00:02:07.439 --> 00:02:14.240 started and the modern technique as lads one dimensions aren't 32 00:02:14.960 --> 00:02:24.000 and fang of the beasts. 33 00:02:20.680 --> 00:02:25.000 The eaters of the yacht an ambusying look labs. 34 00:02:24.639 --> 00:02:28.439 Whom I have on amps very h. 35 00:02:30.520 --> 00:02:40.039 Blamboss and that questions instrument mentioned schools for shun. 36 00:02:42.479 --> 00:02:45.120 One listening you have to pull it taifer stem the 37 00:02:45.199 --> 00:02:48.319 links and your dar and pressure off of the lower sus. 38 00:02:48.159 --> 00:02:49.479 In my cock the oil boss. 39 00:02:50.199 --> 00:02:53.879 That's imps and keys Schat said keys. 40 00:03:00.039 --> 00:03:03.080 Don't see. 41 00:03:03.120 --> 00:03:06.680 I'm Mskaphon yasim famous next to hat. 42 00:03:24.439 --> 00:03:27.159 Have I stuff, I'm not doing it and man, yeah, 43 00:03:28.120 --> 00:03:29.319 I give just Sason one fund. 44 00:03:33.520 --> 00:03:33.879 Let's go. 45 00:03:35.439 --> 00:03:45.039 Pla shark said Keith and high sis team outains her target. 46 00:03:50.479 --> 00:03:52.599 Welcome to the projection booth. I'm your host. Mike White 47 00:03:52.639 --> 00:03:54.479 joined me once again as mister Andrew Nettie. 48 00:03:55.159 --> 00:03:55.879 Thanks for having me. 49 00:03:56.719 --> 00:03:59.400 Also back in the booth is Ms Sam Digan. Hello, 50 00:04:00.599 --> 00:04:03.599 we continue November twenty twenty five with a look at 51 00:04:03.680 --> 00:04:08.240 Helmut With a look at Helmut Koitner's film Black Gravel. 52 00:04:08.400 --> 00:04:10.280 The film tells the story of a city outside of 53 00:04:10.319 --> 00:04:13.800 a US military base in Germany, where Robert Neihardt played 54 00:04:13.800 --> 00:04:16.959 by Helmut Wilt, is a black marketeer who runs into 55 00:04:17.040 --> 00:04:21.120 an old flame inga played by ingmar Zeisberg, who is 56 00:04:21.240 --> 00:04:24.560 now married to a major on the base. The film 57 00:04:24.639 --> 00:04:27.800 explores people on the fringes and a dark, gripping tale 58 00:04:29.000 --> 00:04:32.319 that the Oberhausen critics called the worst achievement by an 59 00:04:32.439 --> 00:04:36.519 established director in nineteen sixty one. We will be spoiling 60 00:04:36.600 --> 00:04:38.079 this film as we go along, So if you don't 61 00:04:38.079 --> 00:04:40.439 want anything ruined, to turn off the podcast and come 62 00:04:40.519 --> 00:04:43.920 back after you've seen the movie. Maybe just take a 63 00:04:44.000 --> 00:04:48.120 break afterwards, try to get out of a depressed funk 64 00:04:48.240 --> 00:04:50.399 that you'll be in after you see this movie. We'll 65 00:04:50.439 --> 00:04:52.519 still be here, We'll hold your hands, We'll give you 66 00:04:52.560 --> 00:04:55.199 a hug. You're probably going to need it. Andrew, when 67 00:04:55.360 --> 00:04:57.199 was the first time you saw Black Gravel? And what 68 00:04:57.399 --> 00:04:57.920 did you think? 69 00:04:58.879 --> 00:05:00.920 Our first one to say the ober hous And critics 70 00:05:01.000 --> 00:05:03.160 can go and get their fucking shinebox on this one, 71 00:05:03.360 --> 00:05:06.879 because this is an absolute knockout film. I think I 72 00:05:07.120 --> 00:05:11.240 first saw it when Radiance released it as part of 73 00:05:11.720 --> 00:05:14.360 a World Noir box set. I mean, I'm living in 74 00:05:14.439 --> 00:05:16.319 Berlin at the moment, and I was planning on my 75 00:05:16.439 --> 00:05:18.399 move to Berlin, and I was starting to try and 76 00:05:18.560 --> 00:05:23.240 watch more German cinema, particularly more German crime cinema, and 77 00:05:23.360 --> 00:05:27.199 I'd sort of watched a few earlier films, which we 78 00:05:27.240 --> 00:05:29.800 can talk about that later, in the sort of immediate 79 00:05:29.879 --> 00:05:34.439 nineteen forties nineteen fifties, and I was really impressed by 80 00:05:34.519 --> 00:05:36.879 this film. So it takes place in the nineteen sixties, 81 00:05:36.959 --> 00:05:40.079 so it's not a it's not a Troman film, it's 82 00:05:40.120 --> 00:05:43.800 not a rubble film, and it's not an early sort 83 00:05:43.839 --> 00:05:48.399 of German postwar noir. It's set in the early nineteen 84 00:05:48.480 --> 00:05:51.240 sixties when the economy is starting to take off and 85 00:05:51.360 --> 00:05:54.839 technically things are going really well, but everyone's still incredibly 86 00:05:55.680 --> 00:05:58.040 miserable and living under the threat of nuclear war. And 87 00:05:58.120 --> 00:06:02.360 it's such a pitch black, per effect noir that I 88 00:06:02.600 --> 00:06:07.240 just I was absolutely flawed, Yeah, absolutely flawed by this film. 89 00:06:07.279 --> 00:06:10.439 And I mean later on I sort of realized that Carltner, 90 00:06:10.560 --> 00:06:14.360 Bernard sorry, Helmet Cartner, the director, he had a complicated 91 00:06:14.519 --> 00:06:18.879 history and there were complicated politics around him and Germany, 92 00:06:19.000 --> 00:06:21.759 but he really knocked it out of the park with 93 00:06:21.920 --> 00:06:26.000 this one. And it's still really really unknown. I mean, 94 00:06:26.040 --> 00:06:28.839 I even talked to people here in Berlin in Germany 95 00:06:29.199 --> 00:06:32.600 who pride themselves on having having had a really good 96 00:06:32.680 --> 00:06:37.279 expanse of knowledge about crime cinema and German cina in particular, 97 00:06:37.279 --> 00:06:41.199 and very few of them have seen Black Gravel. It's 98 00:06:41.240 --> 00:06:43.920 a terrific film. I'm I'm incredibly impressed by it, and 99 00:06:44.199 --> 00:06:46.279 I think this is the fourth watch I've done on 100 00:06:46.360 --> 00:06:49.800 it for the Projection booth, and I still found it fascinating. 101 00:06:50.519 --> 00:06:51.639 And Sam, how about yourself. 102 00:06:52.519 --> 00:06:55.279 I actually watched it for the first time for this 103 00:06:55.439 --> 00:06:59.439 episode because, like Andrew pointed out, it really falls in 104 00:06:59.519 --> 00:07:02.600 this kind of in between zone. So if you're somebody 105 00:07:02.759 --> 00:07:06.319 like me who's written a lot about World War Two 106 00:07:06.439 --> 00:07:09.959 era German cinema, cinema in the forties, which are those 107 00:07:10.040 --> 00:07:13.319 rubble films, or that's the period when those rubble films fall, 108 00:07:13.519 --> 00:07:16.920 like up to the very early fifties, and I've also 109 00:07:16.959 --> 00:07:19.879 written a lot about New German cinema which starts after this. 110 00:07:20.480 --> 00:07:24.439 So this in between zone is kind of uncharted territory 111 00:07:24.560 --> 00:07:28.680 for me. But this is just amazing, like he said, 112 00:07:28.839 --> 00:07:34.519 pitch black, but also so incredibly beautiful, like the shot composition, 113 00:07:35.279 --> 00:07:40.920 the really incredible kind of expressionistic lighting, the bar sequences, 114 00:07:41.360 --> 00:07:44.279 Like there's nothing about this that I didn't love. 115 00:07:45.399 --> 00:07:49.360 I just love how well this story comes together, and 116 00:07:49.480 --> 00:07:53.839 that I mean, the metaphors play throughout so much of this. 117 00:07:53.959 --> 00:07:57.199 I mean, we begin this movie with the death of 118 00:07:57.240 --> 00:08:01.639 a dog and bearing that dog under this square. The 119 00:08:01.759 --> 00:08:04.240 murder of a dog, murder of a dog. Yes, and 120 00:08:04.519 --> 00:08:06.839 don't worry, folks, it's not a real dog. It's pretty 121 00:08:06.879 --> 00:08:10.079 obvious that it's a big stuffed animal type of thing 122 00:08:10.120 --> 00:08:12.319 when they throw it into the pit and you can 123 00:08:12.399 --> 00:08:14.959 see when it's laying there with the rock next to it, 124 00:08:15.079 --> 00:08:17.560 you can see the dog's eyes moving, so it's just 125 00:08:17.680 --> 00:08:21.279 laying there. It's a well trained dog. Don't sweat it it, 126 00:08:21.519 --> 00:08:23.680 you know, you hear the little yelping things, which is 127 00:08:23.680 --> 00:08:27.680 always rough for anybody who cares anything about animals. But yes, 128 00:08:28.000 --> 00:08:31.240 there is a dog quote unquote death at the beginning 129 00:08:31.360 --> 00:08:34.279 of this, but don't sweat it. But that goes through 130 00:08:34.840 --> 00:08:37.799 this whole movie and just plays so well with this, 131 00:08:38.000 --> 00:08:40.759 this whole idea of who knows that the dog is dead, 132 00:08:41.600 --> 00:08:44.559 that our main character has the collar from the dog. 133 00:08:44.759 --> 00:08:47.840 He kind of uses that to parlay back into the 134 00:08:47.919 --> 00:08:50.519 life of this former flame of his who shows up. 135 00:08:50.559 --> 00:08:52.600 He just kind of happens upon her on the road. 136 00:08:53.000 --> 00:08:56.200 She and her husband, this major are broken down, This 137 00:08:56.320 --> 00:09:00.399 whole idea of bearing things, bearing the past, the big 138 00:09:00.720 --> 00:09:04.399 pit that they have at this air base where they 139 00:09:04.480 --> 00:09:06.759 throw all of these things in here. I mean, it 140 00:09:06.960 --> 00:09:10.879 just plays so well into everything when it comes to 141 00:09:11.039 --> 00:09:13.600 the murder, or well, it's not even a murder later on, 142 00:09:13.759 --> 00:09:16.960 it's more of an accident that happens and really could 143 00:09:17.080 --> 00:09:20.399 have been avoided as far as some of the badness 144 00:09:20.519 --> 00:09:22.559 that goes on in this movie, but it just keeps 145 00:09:22.600 --> 00:09:24.480 getting worse and worse and worse. I mean, it's that 146 00:09:24.559 --> 00:09:26.639 whole thing that we talk about with film noir, and 147 00:09:26.720 --> 00:09:29.000 I keep wondering, like, is this a true film noir? 148 00:09:29.240 --> 00:09:31.639 Is this out of the date range? I don't really care. 149 00:09:31.759 --> 00:09:33.480 I'm not going to split hairs when it comes to this. 150 00:09:34.320 --> 00:09:37.080 It's so dark and there's so many bad things that happen, 151 00:09:37.279 --> 00:09:40.000 and it does fall into that whole idea of You're 152 00:09:40.039 --> 00:09:42.279 fucked at the beginning of it, You're even more fucked 153 00:09:42.279 --> 00:09:42.519 at the. 154 00:09:42.600 --> 00:09:42.919 End of it. 155 00:09:43.480 --> 00:09:47.879 And the end of this movie is incredibly dark, though 156 00:09:48.000 --> 00:09:50.799 not the release version, which just you know, kind of 157 00:09:51.000 --> 00:09:55.200 ends our main character driving out into the fog. We 158 00:09:55.320 --> 00:09:58.480 don't see what happens with inga. Yeah, everything's fine, but 159 00:09:58.559 --> 00:10:00.960 we'll definitely talk about those different versions of this as 160 00:10:01.000 --> 00:10:04.440 we go along. But yeah, I love how the Dog 161 00:10:05.080 --> 00:10:08.200 plays through this whole thing and just keeps coming back, 162 00:10:08.320 --> 00:10:11.000 and the idea of these secrets from the past. I mean, 163 00:10:11.320 --> 00:10:15.200 we were talking about Germany nineteen sixty one. We're talking 164 00:10:15.279 --> 00:10:20.240 about a occupation by the Americans inside of Germany. What 165 00:10:20.399 --> 00:10:23.320 this movie reminded me so much of was the Japanese 166 00:10:23.399 --> 00:10:26.600 films like Pigs and Battleships or even like The battles 167 00:10:26.639 --> 00:10:30.320 Without Honor Humanity. This whole idea of the occupying force 168 00:10:30.399 --> 00:10:32.960 of the Americans in the countries that they fought in 169 00:10:33.039 --> 00:10:36.399 World War Two, and just the muck that they make 170 00:10:36.480 --> 00:10:37.039 of everything. 171 00:10:38.000 --> 00:10:43.320 It's one of those openings where I first assumed that 172 00:10:43.600 --> 00:10:46.200 killing the Dog would just be kind of setting a 173 00:10:46.279 --> 00:10:49.039 really downbeat tone, but the fact that the dog keeps 174 00:10:49.120 --> 00:10:52.799 coming back and the way that the gravel that the 175 00:10:52.919 --> 00:10:56.720 main character is essentially stealing and selling on the black market. 176 00:10:57.200 --> 00:11:00.159 The way that that also functions in the plot, like 177 00:11:00.279 --> 00:11:03.639 the script is just brilliant, Like they thought everything through. 178 00:11:04.519 --> 00:11:06.480 Yeah, it's a bit like a Swiss watch, a well 179 00:11:06.559 --> 00:11:09.759 made Swiss watch, isn't it. The whole thing links together? 180 00:11:10.080 --> 00:11:12.799 What I going back to those comments, and I was 181 00:11:12.840 --> 00:11:15.480 thinking about other films because I mean, I remember I 182 00:11:15.519 --> 00:11:21.399 watched The Lost One nineteen fifty one. Yeah, with that, Yeah, 183 00:11:21.519 --> 00:11:26.159 Peter Laurey's only directorial, only directorial outing. There's another really 184 00:11:26.200 --> 00:11:29.919 good one by a director called Wolfgang Starter called The 185 00:11:30.080 --> 00:11:32.600 Murderers Are amongst Us That was nineteen forty. 186 00:11:32.360 --> 00:11:33.480 Six, a great one. 187 00:11:33.840 --> 00:11:36.919 Yeah, and then Roses for the Prosecutor nineteen fifty nine, 188 00:11:37.480 --> 00:11:40.000 and they all deal I mean, actually Roses for the 189 00:11:40.039 --> 00:11:42.919 Prosecutors a bit later, but those earlier ones they deal with. 190 00:11:43.120 --> 00:11:46.120 You know, Germany has just been completely smashed to pieces. 191 00:11:46.240 --> 00:11:52.600 It's everyone's traumatized. You know. What usually happens is that 192 00:11:52.720 --> 00:11:54.799 someone will bump but you can't get away from it. 193 00:11:54.919 --> 00:11:57.279 And someone will bump into someone on the street who 194 00:11:57.399 --> 00:12:01.200 they've either witnessed do something terror the war, or they 195 00:12:01.320 --> 00:12:04.399 might have done an atrocity with or just something horrific 196 00:12:04.480 --> 00:12:07.080 in the war that they're trying to sort of escape from, 197 00:12:07.159 --> 00:12:12.399 and this chance encounter leads them, leads them back into 198 00:12:13.360 --> 00:12:15.720 an association and a whole of things. They just don't 199 00:12:15.759 --> 00:12:17.759 want to have to deal with that. As you say, 200 00:12:17.799 --> 00:12:20.480 they're sort of bearing, and I think in a sense 201 00:12:20.559 --> 00:12:23.039 Black Gravel is very much like that. So there's this 202 00:12:24.039 --> 00:12:26.759 is Robert the truck driver who's got this And I 203 00:12:26.840 --> 00:12:31.720 love the way that Cartner sort of sketches these character 204 00:12:31.840 --> 00:12:37.600 backstories very gently. Like Roberts, he's driving gravel as part 205 00:12:37.720 --> 00:12:41.360 of this big expansion of a US airstrip on this 206 00:12:41.559 --> 00:12:44.039 US air base, and they're also, of course there's this 207 00:12:44.159 --> 00:12:48.159 whole black market trade in the gravel. He's been a pow, 208 00:12:48.480 --> 00:12:50.519 has been a soldier who was wounded in the war. 209 00:12:50.639 --> 00:12:52.879 You don't really find out a lot about it. He's 210 00:12:52.919 --> 00:12:56.919 on a road one night, stops at this car and 211 00:12:57.080 --> 00:13:01.759 this car is driven by this American major, and he 212 00:13:02.279 --> 00:13:05.519 discovers that the American major's German wife, as you say, 213 00:13:05.639 --> 00:13:09.879 is Inger, who again very lightly sketched background. She was 214 00:13:09.919 --> 00:13:12.559 I think a prostitute during the you know, in the 215 00:13:12.600 --> 00:13:15.559 immediate post war period, although it's not really clear, but 216 00:13:15.679 --> 00:13:18.519 there's some dark things in her life, and she's married 217 00:13:18.559 --> 00:13:22.679 this American and Inga and Robert used to have this relationship. 218 00:13:22.799 --> 00:13:25.519 Then they basically they've drifted apart. Now they've met each 219 00:13:25.559 --> 00:13:29.159 other again on this road outside this US air base 220 00:13:29.279 --> 00:13:33.320 in nineteen sixty one. And technically everyone should be happy 221 00:13:33.399 --> 00:13:37.480 because the worst of that fifties period is behind it. 222 00:13:37.720 --> 00:13:41.440 It's stable, the economy is starting to take off. We've 223 00:13:42.360 --> 00:13:45.919 comrade out Ardenauer, who's does you know, arch conservative Chancellor 224 00:13:46.039 --> 00:13:50.159 of Germany has done a good job of bearing any 225 00:13:50.279 --> 00:13:52.159 kind of effort to hunt down Nazis. 226 00:13:52.799 --> 00:13:54.240 Yeah, to his own benefit. 227 00:13:55.279 --> 00:13:57.919 That's another thing that's buried in this film. You know, 228 00:13:58.039 --> 00:14:01.399 that's another thing that's been bare it in Germany. So 229 00:14:02.759 --> 00:14:05.519 and things, and we've forgotten the war quote unquote, and 230 00:14:05.600 --> 00:14:08.960 things are moving forward, but of course you can't forget it. 231 00:14:09.000 --> 00:14:13.759 And there's all these new things that are at play here, 232 00:14:13.840 --> 00:14:16.879 these new alienations, the fact that we're still not happy, 233 00:14:17.000 --> 00:14:20.200 we're still miserable, that the occupation. We're really fucking shitty 234 00:14:20.279 --> 00:14:23.600 with these occupiers, the fact that we rely on them 235 00:14:23.679 --> 00:14:26.639 for money and they rely on us for alcohol, sex, 236 00:14:26.720 --> 00:14:30.360 and entertainment and we hate this relationship. And also this 237 00:14:30.559 --> 00:14:33.840 thing which you really noticed throughout the film, this constant 238 00:14:34.240 --> 00:14:38.200 roar of fighter jets from the nearby US air base, 239 00:14:38.799 --> 00:14:41.279 which is even when I think one scene where Robert 240 00:14:41.279 --> 00:14:44.639 and Inger are having sex for the first time after 241 00:14:44.720 --> 00:14:49.600 this very difficult period, sort of meeting each other again 242 00:14:49.679 --> 00:14:52.120 and she wants to stay with the American and he 243 00:14:52.279 --> 00:14:54.799 wants to sort of sleep with her, and they basically 244 00:14:54.919 --> 00:14:57.879 make love again, and you can hear the jets going 245 00:14:58.000 --> 00:15:02.000 overhead the entire time, and it's like this threat. So 246 00:15:02.120 --> 00:15:04.279 they've just come out of one war and they're just 247 00:15:04.399 --> 00:15:07.320 about to be another war potentially, and this war will 248 00:15:07.360 --> 00:15:11.240 be even more potentially devastating. And I mean, of course, 249 00:15:11.320 --> 00:15:13.360 this is happening at a time when, as you say, 250 00:15:13.720 --> 00:15:17.000 and as I say, Ardenow has taken over, he's in charge, 251 00:15:17.159 --> 00:15:20.679 he's it's all on board with fighting communism. The Nazis 252 00:15:20.679 --> 00:15:23.480 aren't the enemy anymore, it's the Communists. And I think 253 00:15:23.639 --> 00:15:28.559 Ardenow has just agreed to place nuclear weapons on German soil, 254 00:15:28.679 --> 00:15:31.879 so there's also that going on. So it's it's really 255 00:15:32.480 --> 00:15:36.519 it's it takes those earlier tropes from those earlier German Noirs, 256 00:15:36.559 --> 00:15:38.840 but it sort of gives them this early sixties makeover 257 00:15:38.919 --> 00:15:39.600 that I just love. 258 00:15:40.679 --> 00:15:44.240 I found it really fascinating to watch a film where 259 00:15:44.320 --> 00:15:48.039 the Cold War is so central, but like it's not 260 00:15:48.279 --> 00:15:51.720 what you would think of as a more traditional Cold 261 00:15:51.759 --> 00:15:56.200 War film, Like we have American military personnel, and we 262 00:15:56.440 --> 00:15:59.639 do have a CIA agent, but the whole thing is 263 00:15:59.799 --> 00:16:05.559 this tormented, romantic melodrama. And you know, as we keep 264 00:16:05.600 --> 00:16:09.480 saying noir or at least kind of post noir, but 265 00:16:09.840 --> 00:16:13.240 the fact that we're seeing how the Cold War in 266 00:16:13.519 --> 00:16:18.159 process is affecting these working class, everyday people and they're 267 00:16:18.279 --> 00:16:22.519 not spies the main characters, They're just people trying to survive. 268 00:16:23.519 --> 00:16:26.159 I think that was maybe my favorite part of this, 269 00:16:26.639 --> 00:16:31.080 is like how present the political themes are without being 270 00:16:31.480 --> 00:16:34.600 super central to the narrative in more obvious ways. 271 00:16:35.559 --> 00:16:38.879 It's the texture, the way that count my textures so 272 00:16:39.120 --> 00:16:41.960 much stuff. I mean, we'll get on shore, we'll get 273 00:16:42.000 --> 00:16:44.639 onto the claims about anti Semitism in the film and 274 00:16:44.679 --> 00:16:46.600 all of that, but the way that he just liars 275 00:16:47.759 --> 00:16:53.240 all this alienation and depression and tension that's in German 276 00:16:53.360 --> 00:16:58.399 society without having to construct these big, ornate signposts, you know, 277 00:16:58.480 --> 00:17:02.600 it's just their going through the film, every single fiber 278 00:17:02.679 --> 00:17:03.440 of the film. 279 00:17:03.600 --> 00:17:07.599 The fatalism, it's just sort of from the top down, 280 00:17:07.799 --> 00:17:10.720 like from the dog being killed to the discussion of 281 00:17:10.839 --> 00:17:15.759 bringing the warheads in, and the fact that like even 282 00:17:15.920 --> 00:17:20.640 the American character, the husband is not like he has 283 00:17:20.799 --> 00:17:24.519 some conventional kind of American stereotypes, but like even he 284 00:17:24.720 --> 00:17:28.160 isn't really happy either. He seems to love his wife, 285 00:17:28.400 --> 00:17:31.279 but spends a lot of his screen time talking about 286 00:17:31.400 --> 00:17:34.400 how dealing with the military is a pain in the 287 00:17:34.480 --> 00:17:37.920 ass and he wants to get transferred, and like, it's 288 00:17:38.119 --> 00:17:41.519 not a surprise that this movie got a little bit 289 00:17:41.599 --> 00:17:47.200 of a censorship slap back, because it's really confrontational, especially 290 00:17:47.279 --> 00:17:51.839 from a director who's mostly known for making like mainstream 291 00:17:52.039 --> 00:17:55.799 literary adaptations and that kind of cinema of quality stuff 292 00:17:55.880 --> 00:17:58.039 that the new Wave was always complaining about. 293 00:17:58.880 --> 00:18:01.119 It so reminds me sam of when we're talking about 294 00:18:01.240 --> 00:18:04.079 Jean Pierre Melville and just the way that the young 295 00:18:04.200 --> 00:18:07.759 Turks kept slapping down like, oh no, we distance ourselves, 296 00:18:07.880 --> 00:18:10.640 like that's you know, Melville, Renois, any of these great 297 00:18:10.680 --> 00:18:13.279 filmmakers where they're just like, no, no, that's old fashion. 298 00:18:13.559 --> 00:18:16.640 Now we're the new flavor. You should be paying attention 299 00:18:16.720 --> 00:18:20.039 to us, and these oberhusing critics just basically doing the 300 00:18:20.079 --> 00:18:22.599 same thing. It's like, oh, Quitner, he's been making movies 301 00:18:22.640 --> 00:18:26.000 since the forties. Ah, forget this guy. He's got nothing 302 00:18:26.079 --> 00:18:28.400 to say. And I know Quitner was also kind of 303 00:18:28.480 --> 00:18:32.039 hurting from he went over to the US, you know, 304 00:18:32.200 --> 00:18:35.480 kind of all like Old Fools and Renoir and these 305 00:18:35.519 --> 00:18:38.240 guys made two movies over there. I think he had 306 00:18:38.279 --> 00:18:40.920 a three picture contract, but he never finished up the 307 00:18:40.960 --> 00:18:43.519 third picture. I think he did not have a good 308 00:18:43.640 --> 00:18:46.319 time when he went to the US. And this might 309 00:18:46.400 --> 00:18:50.119 be yeah, exactly, especially these I did. 310 00:18:50.279 --> 00:18:52.079 I did, but that was ten years ago, but you 311 00:18:52.119 --> 00:18:52.880 were on vacation. 312 00:18:53.880 --> 00:18:56.440 But you know, he comes back and then this is 313 00:18:56.480 --> 00:18:59.319 one of the first movies that he makes, is Black Gravel, 314 00:18:59.839 --> 00:19:02.839 And yeah, the anti American sentiment that goes through this 315 00:19:03.119 --> 00:19:05.480 is you know, palatable, and I kind of love it. 316 00:19:05.839 --> 00:19:09.160 And yeah, the whole idea of major gains. He just 317 00:19:09.240 --> 00:19:12.240 seems to want inga as arm candy at these different 318 00:19:12.279 --> 00:19:16.960 events that he has to go to and uses what 319 00:19:17.240 --> 00:19:22.400 becomes the mystery. I suppose the murder, the accident that 320 00:19:22.559 --> 00:19:26.759 happens uses that whole cover up as a basically a 321 00:19:26.799 --> 00:19:29.680 bargaining chip with inga to be like, Okay, this didn't happen, 322 00:19:30.559 --> 00:19:34.079 and you're never going to mention this again, and you're 323 00:19:34.279 --> 00:19:36.480 going to just settle down with me and I don't 324 00:19:36.480 --> 00:19:39.039 want to hear any mention of this Robert character and 325 00:19:39.160 --> 00:19:41.400 just lays it all out like you are now in 326 00:19:41.519 --> 00:19:44.119 debt to me, like I have the keys to your future. 327 00:19:44.599 --> 00:19:47.960 So you better just like you know, straighten up and 328 00:19:48.000 --> 00:19:50.599 fly right, because now you're my property like you were 329 00:19:50.759 --> 00:19:54.640 my property before. You know, you're playing the great housewife. 330 00:19:54.720 --> 00:19:57.720 You're putting together all of the stuff in our apartment, 331 00:19:57.839 --> 00:19:59.880 the same apartment that looks the same as all of 332 00:20:00.119 --> 00:20:03.480 the other apartments on this Air Force base. But yeah, 333 00:20:03.559 --> 00:20:06.759 you better start playing by Marie Roles now, and really 334 00:20:06.799 --> 00:20:09.119 shows his true colors at that moment in the film, 335 00:20:09.400 --> 00:20:11.640 very late in the film, because before he's kind of 336 00:20:11.720 --> 00:20:14.640 like the benign like, oh, don't tell the major and 337 00:20:14.680 --> 00:20:16.359 we're going to go behind his back and he's not 338 00:20:16.440 --> 00:20:18.599 going to mind any of this stuff. He's never going 339 00:20:18.680 --> 00:20:21.160 to find out. Don't ask, don't tell, as they say 340 00:20:21.200 --> 00:20:25.200 in some military circles. And then boom, once that happens 341 00:20:25.240 --> 00:20:28.119 when she admits what is going on. Then he's like, oh, well, 342 00:20:28.160 --> 00:20:29.359 this is my opportunity. 343 00:20:30.039 --> 00:20:33.319 That part of it is crazy, especially because of how 344 00:20:33.400 --> 00:20:38.359 benign he seems. It also ties back into these discussions 345 00:20:38.440 --> 00:20:41.519 that Robert and Inga have where Robert says to her, 346 00:20:42.119 --> 00:20:45.440 this is just a different form of prostitution, like you 347 00:20:45.599 --> 00:20:49.759 are selling yourself to him for economic security and comfort. 348 00:20:50.559 --> 00:20:54.440 And I'm guessing that that probably was not a popular 349 00:20:54.640 --> 00:20:58.119 take in the early sixties, with its very kind of 350 00:20:58.240 --> 00:21:04.079 anti marriage sentiment and the fact that to me, their 351 00:21:04.200 --> 00:21:08.440 relationship as a married couple starts to kind of hinge 352 00:21:08.680 --> 00:21:13.119 on this scene where she comes home. They've been to 353 00:21:13.240 --> 00:21:16.319 this party where he gets really drunk and they're playing 354 00:21:16.400 --> 00:21:22.000 these ridiculous war games. But there's this really kind of 355 00:21:22.160 --> 00:21:25.640 depressing sequence where they're both drunkenly getting ready for bed, 356 00:21:26.400 --> 00:21:30.079 and she's looking at herself in the mirror taking off 357 00:21:30.119 --> 00:21:33.920 her makeup in a parallel to a scene of Robert 358 00:21:34.000 --> 00:21:36.039 doing the same exact thing. It's that sort of classic 359 00:21:36.119 --> 00:21:40.000 film noir looking at yourself in the mirror, questioning everything 360 00:21:40.039 --> 00:21:43.160 about your life, choices, and about who you are as 361 00:21:43.200 --> 00:21:47.160 a person. But while she's getting ready, on the verge 362 00:21:47.200 --> 00:21:51.200 of tears. He's going off on this whole monologue that 363 00:21:51.440 --> 00:21:54.319 makes it very clear that he is just talking at 364 00:21:54.400 --> 00:21:58.640 her and she's just kind of this body who's there 365 00:21:58.920 --> 00:22:02.559 as a wife, and he's not actually expecting any kind 366 00:22:02.599 --> 00:22:06.720 of conversational response, doesn't care what she thinks. She's just 367 00:22:06.799 --> 00:22:10.519 like a placeholder. And I think it's interesting how though 368 00:22:10.599 --> 00:22:13.960 he does seem so benign, you can start to see 369 00:22:14.079 --> 00:22:17.240 little signs of the shift in their relationship, or maybe 370 00:22:17.279 --> 00:22:19.880 not the shift, but like the truth of their relationship 371 00:22:20.559 --> 00:22:22.240 build in the second half of the film. 372 00:22:23.119 --> 00:22:25.559 So much of this movie is about artifice. I mean, 373 00:22:25.640 --> 00:22:30.079 the idea of the Robert has well, he's got his place, 374 00:22:30.599 --> 00:22:34.480 which is above a brothel, and he's got that great 375 00:22:35.119 --> 00:22:37.279 bedroom where he's got the poster and I don't know 376 00:22:37.319 --> 00:22:39.640 who that poster is of. It almost looks like Brigite 377 00:22:39.680 --> 00:22:42.640 Bardoux or somebody. But he's got so good above his bed. 378 00:22:43.240 --> 00:22:46.359 He basically kind of lives with Ellie, who's a prostitute. 379 00:22:47.599 --> 00:22:51.440 But he's got this hideaway that he tricks inga into 380 00:22:51.519 --> 00:22:55.000 coming to later on, and that's filled. It almost feels 381 00:22:55.039 --> 00:22:57.519 like a clubhouse or something. He's got all these posters, 382 00:22:57.599 --> 00:23:00.599 he's got this looks like a movie poster with a 383 00:23:00.640 --> 00:23:03.640 cowboy on it. He's got this Quincy Jones thing. I'm 384 00:23:03.640 --> 00:23:07.799 trying to remember. There's another musician that he's got kind 385 00:23:07.839 --> 00:23:10.720 of poster of there as well. But he's got this 386 00:23:11.119 --> 00:23:15.440 fake church that's outside, and he says that he painted 387 00:23:15.519 --> 00:23:18.920 it from a calendar. He just like likes this thing, 388 00:23:19.240 --> 00:23:21.440 and that so reminds me of the other church that 389 00:23:21.640 --> 00:23:25.000 is in here. There's a church scene where the priest 390 00:23:25.119 --> 00:23:28.799 is talking about Columbus and discovery and all these things. 391 00:23:29.200 --> 00:23:31.799 And at the end of that scene you see that 392 00:23:32.279 --> 00:23:36.039 the church is a multipurpose church that the altar turns 393 00:23:36.160 --> 00:23:39.480 around for the Protestant ceremony that's about to take place. 394 00:23:39.519 --> 00:23:42.319 They've got the Catholic version and then the Protestant version, 395 00:23:42.640 --> 00:23:45.000 and it's all just on like a I believe Sam. 396 00:23:45.079 --> 00:23:47.240 It reminds me of a lazy Susan the way that 397 00:23:47.359 --> 00:23:49.160 it turns there. I don't know if you've ever seen 398 00:23:49.200 --> 00:23:50.000 a lazy Susan. 399 00:23:50.279 --> 00:23:51.759 Now, please please describe one. 400 00:23:52.000 --> 00:23:54.279 I can tell you all about that, or you can 401 00:23:54.359 --> 00:23:57.319