WEBVTT 1 00:00:00.200 --> 00:00:00.760 Get value. 2 00:00:00.800 --> 00:00:03.120 You can't argue with at Tesco with their amazing club 3 00:00:03.160 --> 00:00:06.200 card prices. Serve up something special with our finest meal 4 00:00:06.240 --> 00:00:08.880 deal for two starring one main, two sides and dessert 5 00:00:08.880 --> 00:00:11.720 for only sixteen eu ro like succulent board be approved 6 00:00:11.759 --> 00:00:14.359 IRUs shinned to strip loin steaks with peppercorn butter or 7 00:00:14.400 --> 00:00:18.160 delicious Irish chicken parmegama served with creamy potato gritam and 8 00:00:18.320 --> 00:00:21.800 our mix of rainbow root vegetables, and enjoy Goozillionaire or 9 00:00:21.839 --> 00:00:25.239 Solder Caramel cheesecake. Can't argue with that shop in store 10 00:00:25.359 --> 00:00:28.839 or online Tesco. Every little helps available to the most doores, 11 00:00:28.879 --> 00:00:30.120 prices very and express. 12 00:00:30.440 --> 00:00:34.640 Oh hey, it's cauliflower rice which smells like farts and 13 00:00:34.759 --> 00:00:37.280 knows that you have your doubts, but it's excited to 14 00:00:37.320 --> 00:00:41.000 prove you wrong. Ally ward back with another episode of Oologies. 15 00:00:41.039 --> 00:00:44.119 This one's just light as a feather, nothing but wall 16 00:00:44.200 --> 00:00:49.200 the wall, behavior in biology, in trivia, and weirdness in history. 17 00:00:49.399 --> 00:00:52.000 Let's get into it, but first I want to thank 18 00:00:52.000 --> 00:00:55.399 you to everyone who buys ologies merch at ologiesmerch dot com. 19 00:00:55.399 --> 00:00:58.280 Thank you to everyone supporting on patreon dot com, slash ologies, 20 00:00:58.439 --> 00:01:01.039 and for everyone who tells friends or rates the show 21 00:01:01.159 --> 00:01:03.799 on iTunes or subscribes that keeps it up in the 22 00:01:03.880 --> 00:01:07.439 charts or reviews, which you know, I creep gently so 23 00:01:07.480 --> 00:01:10.280 I can pull a fresh catch each week, like this 24 00:01:10.319 --> 00:01:13.200 one from the Dusty Wrangler, who says, hearing how normal 25 00:01:13.280 --> 00:01:15.640 all these scientists are is making returning back to school 26 00:01:15.680 --> 00:01:17.879 a lot less intimidating, and that's just what I needed. 27 00:01:18.040 --> 00:01:20.319 One thing, though, Now every time I wash my hands, 28 00:01:20.439 --> 00:01:23.079 I do hear you whispering in my ear to milk 29 00:01:23.239 --> 00:01:26.319 my thumbs, and I only resent that a little bit. 30 00:01:26.560 --> 00:01:29.439 Thanks for the reminder. Thank you to the Dusty Wrangler 31 00:01:29.480 --> 00:01:32.319 for that, and all the reviewers, especially also to Mike 32 00:01:32.439 --> 00:01:35.840 the nighttime Nurse for listening and much more so for 33 00:01:35.959 --> 00:01:36.719 saving lives. 34 00:01:36.840 --> 00:01:39.879 We love y'all. Okay, plumology. Did you know? 35 00:01:39.920 --> 00:01:40.519 This was the thing? 36 00:01:40.640 --> 00:01:41.040 I did not? 37 00:01:41.359 --> 00:01:44.200 So. It comes from the Latin for down or for 38 00:01:44.400 --> 00:01:47.599 first beard, and later plume came to mean like a 39 00:01:47.680 --> 00:01:51.519 stream of smoke, so we're talking, oh manner of feathers, 40 00:01:51.840 --> 00:01:55.480 Oh feathers now. I have already covered ornithology. It came 41 00:01:55.480 --> 00:01:59.480 out in November twenty nineteen early adopter. Now in case 42 00:01:59.680 --> 00:02:02.560 anys have not found it go way on back you'll 43 00:02:02.560 --> 00:02:06.439 find ornithology. But I was thrilled when this ologist at 44 00:02:06.439 --> 00:02:09.719 the Natural History Museum of la suggested via email that 45 00:02:09.759 --> 00:02:13.599 there were many, many more subologies with feathered friends, including 46 00:02:13.960 --> 00:02:16.400 them dang feathers themselves. So I made haste to the 47 00:02:16.439 --> 00:02:19.800 museum one sleepy Wednesday afternoon, right before they closed for 48 00:02:19.879 --> 00:02:22.199 the day, and I met up with this ologist who 49 00:02:22.199 --> 00:02:25.400 was wearing a flowery blouse and a museum id on 50 00:02:25.479 --> 00:02:29.759 a dangling lanyard. And she got her bachelor's studying birds 51 00:02:29.759 --> 00:02:32.719 at UC Berkeley, and got her Masters from San Diego 52 00:02:32.759 --> 00:02:36.560 State and her PhD at Harvard, working on the genomics 53 00:02:36.639 --> 00:02:41.800 of bird feather colors and organismic and evolutionary biology. Now 54 00:02:41.879 --> 00:02:45.599 as a newish curator of Ornithology at the NHMLA. She 55 00:02:45.719 --> 00:02:47.879 met me at the entrance and then led me through 56 00:02:48.240 --> 00:02:52.039 the staff only behind the scenes, through the shuttered hall 57 00:02:52.159 --> 00:02:55.919 of dioramas now off limits to the public, past cases 58 00:02:56.000 --> 00:03:00.639 and cases of taxidermied specimens dating back a few hundred years, 59 00:03:00.840 --> 00:03:04.919 Through more doors to the archive of hundreds of thousands 60 00:03:04.960 --> 00:03:07.120 of birds in the museum's collections. 61 00:03:07.520 --> 00:03:09.000 Let me go get a step still one. 62 00:03:09.360 --> 00:03:10.960 Oh yeah, they go all the way up. 63 00:03:15.319 --> 00:03:17.360 I've got one and twenty two. 64 00:03:17.199 --> 00:03:20.800 Thousand, one hundred and twenty two thousand. 65 00:03:21.439 --> 00:03:22.439 You know you've been here a year. 66 00:03:22.879 --> 00:03:24.560 How do you get used to where everything is? 67 00:03:24.560 --> 00:03:27.080 Have you opened up each one of these? Opened up? 68 00:03:27.120 --> 00:03:29.280 All of them. They're like, de's only certain ones that 69 00:03:29.360 --> 00:03:31.879 I opened up over and over again. Yeah, yeah, because 70 00:03:31.879 --> 00:03:34.000 they're like, this is where the cool stuff is. 71 00:03:34.240 --> 00:03:36.759 And then we went to her bright and airy office 72 00:03:36.800 --> 00:03:39.840 and we took a seat before a few stuffed specimens 73 00:03:39.919 --> 00:03:42.240 in a tray waiting for us, and I asked her 74 00:03:42.439 --> 00:03:45.159 all the quilled questions that would rattle out of my 75 00:03:45.199 --> 00:03:47.719 dome as well as yours. So shake off the dust 76 00:03:47.759 --> 00:03:50.240 and get ready to soar the sky and learn about 77 00:03:50.280 --> 00:03:53.479 what makes a feather a feather, how they evolved, why 78 00:03:53.520 --> 00:03:57.879 they're important, that sounds, they can make the longest bird tail, 79 00:03:58.439 --> 00:04:05.360 some feather heists, sexual selection, gossip, peacock plumes, bird spotting, eridescins, 80 00:04:05.639 --> 00:04:10.639 the blackest black, tiny feathers, huge ones, dinosaur myths and mysteries, 81 00:04:10.680 --> 00:04:16.680 and more with feather researcher and professional plumologist, doctor Alison Schultz. 82 00:04:34.800 --> 00:04:37.680 Now you are a plumologist. 83 00:04:38.160 --> 00:04:41.839 Yeah, so I'm a plumologist. I study bird feathers and 84 00:04:41.879 --> 00:04:44.560 how they evolve, and kind of more specifically, I think 85 00:04:44.600 --> 00:04:48.839 about the colors of feathers, the structure, and the development. 86 00:04:48.920 --> 00:04:51.519 All of that is integral into the whole picture. 87 00:04:51.920 --> 00:04:54.040 This. I did not know this was an actual study, 88 00:04:54.079 --> 00:04:57.480 And when you emailed me, I was like fingers igniting 89 00:04:57.480 --> 00:05:00.639 the keyboard, like, oh yeah, I was so excited. So 90 00:05:00.680 --> 00:05:03.680 you're an ornithologist, and then plumology is kind of a 91 00:05:03.720 --> 00:05:05.120 subset of it, exactly. Yeah. 92 00:05:05.160 --> 00:05:07.079 So it's not actually the only thing I do, but 93 00:05:07.160 --> 00:05:09.399 it's probably one of my favorite things that I do 94 00:05:09.519 --> 00:05:13.879 because birds are bird. Feathers are amazing, They're beautiful, they're gorgeous. 95 00:05:13.959 --> 00:05:16.879 I mean, this is a very stupid question, just right 96 00:05:16.920 --> 00:05:17.399 off the top. 97 00:05:17.879 --> 00:05:21.160 Do any other living animals on the planet have feathers 98 00:05:21.160 --> 00:05:24.839 that our birds? No living animals? Okay, okay, Yeah, So 99 00:05:24.959 --> 00:05:26.800 actually we used to think that that was one of 100 00:05:26.839 --> 00:05:30.759 the defining characteristics of birds, was feathers, But once they 101 00:05:30.800 --> 00:05:34.839 started finding feathers in all of these non avian dinosaurs, 102 00:05:35.560 --> 00:05:38.680 that became not true anymore. So now we know that 103 00:05:38.720 --> 00:05:41.000 feathers evolved long before birds did. 104 00:05:41.560 --> 00:05:43.439 And all birds are dinosaurs. 105 00:05:43.480 --> 00:05:45.399 All birds are dinosaurs. Yes, that is true. 106 00:05:45.600 --> 00:05:49.680 That still like rocks me like living dinosaurs. 107 00:05:49.759 --> 00:05:52.560 Yeah, you know, it's one of my I participate in 108 00:05:52.639 --> 00:05:55.279 dino Fest. Now, you know, we have a table representing 109 00:05:55.360 --> 00:05:58.680 living dinosaurs. And it's funny to me how many of 110 00:05:58.720 --> 00:06:01.759 the like kids actually know that birds are dinosaurs and 111 00:06:01.879 --> 00:06:05.639 adult stone. So it's like the perspective is shifting, but 112 00:06:05.680 --> 00:06:08.240 we're not quite there yet. Now, what about her as 113 00:06:08.279 --> 00:06:08.639 a kiddo? 114 00:06:08.879 --> 00:06:11.000 Was she an anty bitty bird nerd? Did you always 115 00:06:11.040 --> 00:06:11.839 like birds? 116 00:06:12.160 --> 00:06:15.399 You know, I'm not one of those kids that grew 117 00:06:15.480 --> 00:06:19.839 up loving birds. I always loved animals, and I always 118 00:06:20.480 --> 00:06:25.000 loved biology, but I was like, actually a big cat lover. 119 00:06:25.600 --> 00:06:27.759 I used to go to the zoo, I loved zoo books, 120 00:06:27.759 --> 00:06:30.680 I loved documentaries. It wasn't really until college. I took 121 00:06:30.720 --> 00:06:33.600 this class Natural History of the Vertebrates, where we went 122 00:06:33.639 --> 00:06:36.000 on field trips every week and learned about birds. And 123 00:06:36.000 --> 00:06:38.759 then I took ornithology the next year and started doing 124 00:06:39.079 --> 00:06:41.399 field work and working in museums. And that's kind of 125 00:06:41.600 --> 00:06:43.720 that class was really what did it for me and 126 00:06:43.839 --> 00:06:45.319 what led to this whole career. 127 00:06:45.879 --> 00:06:47.759 And was there a moment in the class, like was 128 00:06:47.800 --> 00:06:50.959 there a particular chapter or like some kind of photo 129 00:06:50.959 --> 00:06:52.079 where you're like, hot. 130 00:06:51.920 --> 00:06:54.839 Diggity, this is really cool. Oh, that's a good question. 131 00:06:55.199 --> 00:06:57.639 I don't think it was like a chapter or photo. 132 00:06:57.800 --> 00:06:59.959 It was actually, I think more of a field trip 133 00:07:00.120 --> 00:07:03.959 when I could actually start to identify the birds myself 134 00:07:03.959 --> 00:07:05.680 with my field guides. So I think I remember the 135 00:07:05.680 --> 00:07:08.519 first one that I identified was a tricky one as 136 00:07:08.519 --> 00:07:11.120 a hermit thrush, and I was very proud of myself. 137 00:07:12.319 --> 00:07:15.600 What is it with birding? Why do you think bird 138 00:07:15.600 --> 00:07:18.560 people are so bird people? That's a great question. 139 00:07:19.079 --> 00:07:22.560 I think it's because, well, a birds are a thing 140 00:07:22.600 --> 00:07:24.639 that you can actually do all the time. Birds are 141 00:07:24.680 --> 00:07:27.319 all around us, and there are different ones everywhere. So 142 00:07:27.360 --> 00:07:29.839 it's like, once you get into it, you start realizing, 143 00:07:29.839 --> 00:07:31.959 oh my gosh, I can, you know, go to the 144 00:07:31.959 --> 00:07:33.439 beach and look at some birds, and I can go 145 00:07:33.439 --> 00:07:36.079 to mountains and look at different birds. There are also, 146 00:07:36.199 --> 00:07:38.279 you know, rare birds that show up at the same 147 00:07:38.480 --> 00:07:40.560 at some times. So I think there are a lot 148 00:07:40.560 --> 00:07:43.720 of people that like have a collector in them and 149 00:07:43.759 --> 00:07:48.079 that makes them really love kind of birding. And also birds, 150 00:07:48.720 --> 00:07:52.079 I think they're just fascinating creatures. They're so beautiful and 151 00:07:52.120 --> 00:07:54.839 they're so different than us in many ways. I think 152 00:07:54.839 --> 00:07:57.000 that draws a lot of people to them as well. 153 00:07:57.560 --> 00:08:00.480 It's kind of like Pokemon go with it just as 154 00:08:00.519 --> 00:08:01.319 just like Pokmon. 155 00:08:01.480 --> 00:08:05.639 Yeah, I wonder if there's something about people who like 156 00:08:05.720 --> 00:08:11.480 scavenger hunts and kind of augmented reality that love birding. 157 00:08:12.079 --> 00:08:12.600 Like I don't know. 158 00:08:12.639 --> 00:08:15.240 My friend Sarah m used to really be into geocashing 159 00:08:15.279 --> 00:08:17.199 and she's become an avid birder and she's always been 160 00:08:17.240 --> 00:08:19.879 that kind of adventurer, And I wonder if there's something 161 00:08:19.920 --> 00:08:22.759 about like going out to collect things but not actually 162 00:08:22.959 --> 00:08:24.079 killing them and taking them home. 163 00:08:24.360 --> 00:08:27.120 Yeah, yeah, I don't know, it could be. And you know, 164 00:08:27.120 --> 00:08:29.079 one thing about birds is you can go out and 165 00:08:29.120 --> 00:08:31.560 you are almost guaranteed to see birds no matter where 166 00:08:31.600 --> 00:08:33.159 you go, even in the middle of the city. You know, 167 00:08:33.200 --> 00:08:37.639 there's tons of species that we see here, and unlike mammals, 168 00:08:37.639 --> 00:08:39.720 for example, I mean, you might see some mammals like 169 00:08:39.759 --> 00:08:41.960 squirrels and things, but you're not going to see like 170 00:08:42.679 --> 00:08:46.320 sixty different species in one day, and most of them 171 00:08:46.600 --> 00:08:49.080 aren't active kind of you know, when we would be active, 172 00:08:49.120 --> 00:08:51.759 so you would mostly be seeing sign like scat or 173 00:08:51.840 --> 00:08:54.519 burrows and things like that not quite as satisfying. 174 00:08:54.639 --> 00:08:57.480 In my mind, looking at a turd isn't as satisfying 175 00:08:57.519 --> 00:08:58.080 as seeing a. 176 00:08:58.159 --> 00:09:00.759 Beautiful turd versus bird. Yeah. 177 00:09:00.879 --> 00:09:03.399 Yeah, I mean if there were tiny flying raccoons everywhere 178 00:09:04.039 --> 00:09:07.039 in different colors, can you imagine like a tiny flying 179 00:09:07.080 --> 00:09:08.000 passa that was. 180 00:09:07.960 --> 00:09:10.120 Like purple, that would be pretty amaze. 181 00:09:10.159 --> 00:09:12.399 Yeah, But as we have birds that are that, it's 182 00:09:12.559 --> 00:09:16.000 just why birds rule. So okay, feathers now is a 183 00:09:16.000 --> 00:09:17.639 feather like a modified hair? 184 00:09:17.799 --> 00:09:20.759 What's happening? That's a great question. There's somewhat related to 185 00:09:20.799 --> 00:09:23.279 hair since that they're made out of keratin and they're 186 00:09:23.360 --> 00:09:26.039 you know, an external structure that grows out of the skin, 187 00:09:26.159 --> 00:09:30.679 but they're actually much more related to scales. So yeah, 188 00:09:30.720 --> 00:09:34.000 So both feathers and hair are made out of keratin, 189 00:09:34.039 --> 00:09:37.159 but different kinds of keratin. There's this kind of keratin 190 00:09:37.240 --> 00:09:40.159 called alpha keratin that mostly makes up hairs and our 191 00:09:40.159 --> 00:09:44.919 fingernails and like mammalian structures, whereas beta keratin is what 192 00:09:45.039 --> 00:09:48.600 makes up bird feathers and actually more reptile scales and 193 00:09:48.639 --> 00:09:49.279 things like that. 194 00:09:49.519 --> 00:09:53.360 Okay, quick aside, Beta keratins are the proteins that make 195 00:09:53.480 --> 00:09:57.799 reptile and bird scales badass and tough and waterproof. But 196 00:09:57.799 --> 00:10:00.679 they are not to be confused with beta carot which 197 00:10:00.720 --> 00:10:03.440 is a pigment that makes fruits and veggies orange and 198 00:10:03.480 --> 00:10:06.279 which gets converted into retinol, and it keeps our skin 199 00:10:06.679 --> 00:10:10.080 and our eyes healthy. So that is beta carotene. We 200 00:10:10.159 --> 00:10:14.039 eat it with ranch dressing. Now, beta keratin again is 201 00:10:14.080 --> 00:10:18.759 in birdy scales and beaks and claws and feathers, which 202 00:10:18.960 --> 00:10:24.039 evolved from scales. Imagine something like an alligator scale splintered 203 00:10:24.080 --> 00:10:28.679 into thousands of fluffy shreds selected through millions of years 204 00:10:28.879 --> 00:10:32.159 of getting it on boom. You have feathers, Well, you don't, 205 00:10:32.240 --> 00:10:35.159 but birds do. So it's kind of like a scale 206 00:10:35.679 --> 00:10:38.320 just got elongated a little bit. 207 00:10:38.360 --> 00:10:41.080 Yeah, you know, they started at scales. If you think 208 00:10:41.080 --> 00:10:43.679 about it, birds actually still have scales on their feet. 209 00:10:44.519 --> 00:10:47.799 Oh yeah, yeah, and that's something that we forget. And 210 00:10:48.600 --> 00:10:52.799 feathers are such complex structures that we do think that 211 00:10:52.840 --> 00:10:55.519 they first started off as kind of very simple, like 212 00:10:55.720 --> 00:10:58.879 think of like a just a simple almost hair like structure, 213 00:10:59.039 --> 00:11:01.879 and then evolve these more and more elaborate structures. 214 00:11:02.639 --> 00:11:05.120 And so do you think that they were more like quills, 215 00:11:05.159 --> 00:11:06.639 like a porcupine. 216 00:11:06.200 --> 00:11:08.879 Quill no, they would have been soft. They would probably 217 00:11:08.919 --> 00:11:09.799 look a lot like fur. 218 00:11:10.440 --> 00:11:14.120 So a bunch of dinos had fur esque proto feathers, 219 00:11:14.240 --> 00:11:17.039 and they were stomping around like big fuzzy muppets. And 220 00:11:17.080 --> 00:11:21.879 even before Archaeopteryx, which was a raven sized feathered avian 221 00:11:21.960 --> 00:11:26.440 dinosaur long considered history's first bird flight, feathers were all 222 00:11:26.519 --> 00:11:30.240 over the place in dinosaurs. Also, while researching this aside, 223 00:11:30.399 --> 00:11:33.200 I accidentally found out, you want to hear something weird, 224 00:11:33.600 --> 00:11:36.679 the t rexers had wishbones. Nothing to do with feathers. 225 00:11:37.080 --> 00:11:39.080 I just think it's weird. Tea bones had big old 226 00:11:39.240 --> 00:11:41.039 honk and wishbones like a turkey. 227 00:11:41.200 --> 00:11:42.080 Oh life, y'all. 228 00:11:42.159 --> 00:11:45.120 Anyway, But the feathers came first, and then the flight. 229 00:11:45.600 --> 00:11:47.840 You know, feathers, you think of them as being really 230 00:11:47.840 --> 00:11:51.039 important for flight, which of course they are, but feathers 231 00:11:51.039 --> 00:11:53.840 of all long before flight did so they actually didn't 232 00:11:53.840 --> 00:11:56.440 evolve for flight. They were co opted to be used 233 00:11:56.480 --> 00:11:59.120 in flight. You can look at the microscopic structure of 234 00:11:59.120 --> 00:12:03.039 feathers and actually see the shapes of the pigment molecules 235 00:12:03.039 --> 00:12:05.320 in them that correspond to different types of pigments and 236 00:12:05.360 --> 00:12:09.039 how they're placed and so we actually can reconstruct what 237 00:12:09.080 --> 00:12:11.720 the probable color was of some of these dinosaurs. So 238 00:12:11.799 --> 00:12:16.720 for example, Microraptor, which is this really cool relative of 239 00:12:16.879 --> 00:12:20.320 early birds that had we think they had actually four wings, 240 00:12:20.360 --> 00:12:24.919 so both their front legs and their hind legs all 241 00:12:24.960 --> 00:12:27.519 had the flight feathers on them, so they probably use 242 00:12:27.600 --> 00:12:29.879 them all for flight. We think they're iridescent, kind of 243 00:12:29.879 --> 00:12:32.240 like a blackbird or starling or something like that. 244 00:12:32.559 --> 00:12:35.559 And that's based on the color of the kind of 245 00:12:35.600 --> 00:12:36.759 pigment capsules. 246 00:12:37.039 --> 00:12:40.399 Yeah, so it's based on how the pigment capsules are arranged. 247 00:12:40.519 --> 00:12:43.000 Oh my god. Yeah, the mechanisms of color and how 248 00:12:43.039 --> 00:12:46.080 they're produced. That's like one of my favorite topics of study. 249 00:12:46.480 --> 00:12:49.080 What did you think of the feather trapped in amber 250 00:12:49.559 --> 00:12:52.519 that was found like ten years ago. Someone bought a 251 00:12:52.600 --> 00:12:55.240 chunk of ambert like a market and they're like, holy smokes, 252 00:12:55.279 --> 00:12:56.360 this is a dinosaur feather. 253 00:12:56.480 --> 00:12:58.799 Dinosaur feather, you know, pretty much looks like a real 254 00:12:59.039 --> 00:13:03.679 regular feather. There's some very cool feathers that they found 255 00:13:03.720 --> 00:13:06.399 to be trapped in amber, and you know, found feathers 256 00:13:06.440 --> 00:13:08.840 that don't even look like modern feathers. 257 00:13:09.279 --> 00:13:11.360 Okay, So I looked at pictures and there's a ninety 258 00:13:11.480 --> 00:13:15.080 nine million year old tiny baby dinosaur tail and it 259 00:13:15.080 --> 00:13:18.120 looks kind of like if you encased a shaft of 260 00:13:18.159 --> 00:13:22.559 wheat in a block of fossilized ginger ale. So obviously 261 00:13:22.799 --> 00:13:26.080 they have evolved and changed over the millions of years. 262 00:13:26.320 --> 00:13:29.840 But all of this just makes the holy shit a 263 00:13:29.879 --> 00:13:33.440 seagull is a dinosaur so much clearer knowing that these 264 00:13:33.799 --> 00:13:38.720 paleo lizard scales got shreddy and long, thereby helping them 265 00:13:38.799 --> 00:13:39.399 take flight. 266 00:13:39.840 --> 00:13:42.360 But what what are feathers? Exactly? 267 00:13:42.840 --> 00:13:45.360 So walk me through the anatomy of a feather. There's 268 00:13:45.399 --> 00:13:49.159 like the main shaft almost like a leaf has a vein, 269 00:13:49.240 --> 00:13:50.720 and then the ones off the side. 270 00:13:50.759 --> 00:13:53.679 What's going on? Yeah, that's a good, good question. So okay, 271 00:13:53.720 --> 00:13:56.440 so our typical kind of feather structure when you think 272 00:13:56.480 --> 00:13:58.919 of what a feather looks like. So yeah, so the 273 00:13:58.960 --> 00:14:02.960 main shaft, we all that the racus and so that's 274 00:14:03.919 --> 00:14:05.879 you know, there's going to be this part that actually 275 00:14:05.919 --> 00:14:08.639 has all of these little branching structures and a part 276 00:14:08.799 --> 00:14:11.639 that's bare that's at the bottom, and that's what's going 277 00:14:11.720 --> 00:14:13.759 to be attached to the skin. You know, if you 278 00:14:13.799 --> 00:14:15.720 think of like a writing quill, that's where you would 279 00:14:15.879 --> 00:14:18.799 dip the ink in and use as you know, used 280 00:14:18.799 --> 00:14:22.120 to write with. And so those little branching structures off 281 00:14:22.120 --> 00:14:25.360 of the main shaft we call those feather barbs. Oh 282 00:14:25.399 --> 00:14:29.960 and each of those feather barbs actually has little branching 283 00:14:30.399 --> 00:14:33.360 shafts off of them. These are hard to see with 284 00:14:33.480 --> 00:14:35.480 the you know, your eye, but you actually can if 285 00:14:35.519 --> 00:14:40.960 you look really really closely, called barbules, and in many feathers, 286 00:14:41.080 --> 00:14:44.200 especially feathers that need to be strong, like flight feathers, 287 00:14:45.039 --> 00:14:48.240 the barbules also have these little tiny hooks that we 288 00:14:48.320 --> 00:14:51.240 call barbou cells that actually link them together. So think 289 00:14:51.279 --> 00:14:54.360 about if you find like a feather on the ground 290 00:14:54.600 --> 00:14:57.399 and you kind of break it, you know what I mean, 291 00:14:57.480 --> 00:15:01.679 Like you can split the different barbs zip it back together. Yeah, 292 00:15:01.799 --> 00:15:04.080 And so that's actually because you're actually making those little 293 00:15:04.080 --> 00:15:07.480 hooklets reattached to each other. So that's how feathers maintain 294 00:15:07.519 --> 00:15:08.159 their shape. 295 00:15:08.320 --> 00:15:11.000 And they're like little belgrowy kind of a hook exactly 296 00:15:11.200 --> 00:15:11.600 just like that. 297 00:15:12.159 --> 00:15:12.440 Okay. 298 00:15:12.440 --> 00:15:14.879 I always wondered obviously about that, because yeah, you can 299 00:15:14.919 --> 00:15:16.840 make a feather look like a hot mess so fast, 300 00:15:16.879 --> 00:15:18.679 and then you're like, JK, I'm all put together and 301 00:15:18.799 --> 00:15:21.080 you're like, whre do you go feather let's do a makeover? 302 00:15:21.480 --> 00:15:21.799 Yeah. 303 00:15:21.840 --> 00:15:25.639 How do you feel when you see feathers on costumes? 304 00:15:25.759 --> 00:15:28.799 And if you see like a vase full of peacock 305 00:15:28.840 --> 00:15:31.440 feathers like in a corner, do you have to go 306 00:15:31.519 --> 00:15:32.720 up and touch them? Or are you like, oh, what 307 00:15:32.879 --> 00:15:35.440 a tragedy that we're using those for decoration? How does 308 00:15:35.440 --> 00:15:38.480 a plumologist react to that? 309 00:15:39.000 --> 00:15:43.159 Well, I don't feel sad necessarily. I like them. I 310 00:15:43.159 --> 00:15:46.960 think they're beautiful. You know, birds they lose their feathers 311 00:15:47.039 --> 00:15:49.679 every year, often some you know, mini bird feathers. They 312 00:15:49.759 --> 00:15:51.639 will at least once a year, if not sooner. So 313 00:15:51.679 --> 00:15:56.120 it's not like birds are being harmed to get these feathers. So, 314 00:15:56.559 --> 00:15:59.720 you know, I don't really see anything wrong with using 315 00:15:59.799 --> 00:16:03.440 them in fashion or decor, especially like peacock feathers. I mean, 316 00:16:03.440 --> 00:16:06.120 those are some of the most elaborate feathers that you 317 00:16:06.120 --> 00:16:08.679 could think of. They're just so cool. So that's usually 318 00:16:08.720 --> 00:16:10.600 my reactions. Wow, those are super cool. 319 00:16:10.960 --> 00:16:14.919 So yes, peacock feathers just fall off of their butts 320 00:16:15.000 --> 00:16:17.720 once a year, and peacock farms just go around and 321 00:16:17.759 --> 00:16:20.080 pick them up off the ground, which is awesome, So 322 00:16:20.159 --> 00:16:20.759 we're done here. 323 00:16:21.480 --> 00:16:21.919 No we're not. 324 00:16:22.240 --> 00:16:25.240 My brain said, let's keep googling, so we did, and 325 00:16:25.279 --> 00:16:28.759 therein I found that peacocks are native to India and 326 00:16:28.919 --> 00:16:32.919 they're the national bird, so it's illegal to export peacock 327 00:16:32.919 --> 00:16:36.519 plumage from there. So most peacock farms are in China, 328 00:16:36.559 --> 00:16:40.039 and a lot of the birds are slaughtered and plucked, 329 00:16:40.279 --> 00:16:43.000 and their feathers are sold pretty cheap. So before you 330 00:16:43.039 --> 00:16:46.399 go purchasing a bundle off of wish dot com for 331 00:16:46.519 --> 00:16:49.919 like a buck apiece, or say a twenty five thousand 332 00:16:49.919 --> 00:16:53.399 dollars burbery trench coat made of peacock feathers, maybe do 333 00:16:53.519 --> 00:16:56.759 some research on the ethics and the origins. I'm talking 334 00:16:56.759 --> 00:16:59.000 to you, Anna Winter. Please don't be mean to me 335 00:16:59.320 --> 00:17:02.600 any pop cultural references to feathers, any feathers and movies 336 00:17:02.600 --> 00:17:06.319 that really annoy you. When you watch like cgi of birds, 337 00:17:07.039 --> 00:17:09.599 like in animated shows, are you ever like that's not 338 00:17:09.680 --> 00:17:10.400 what feathers look like? 339 00:17:11.359 --> 00:17:15.000 You know? I've actually been more impressed, especially lately, with 340 00:17:15.079 --> 00:17:19.480 how well feathers are represented, So I think animators are 341 00:17:19.480 --> 00:17:24.039 actually doing a pretty good job of like accurately representing feathers. 342 00:17:24.160 --> 00:17:26.000 Yeah, I feel like the people at Picks are probably 343 00:17:26.079 --> 00:17:28.920 hunkered down over encyclopedias. 344 00:17:28.160 --> 00:17:31.000 Of exactually, and you know they actually they'll come here 345 00:17:31.039 --> 00:17:33.720 to the museum and look at specimens so that they 346 00:17:33.799 --> 00:17:37.920 can accurately show how things really are, which is really cool. 347 00:17:38.119 --> 00:17:41.279 In terms of functions of feathers, can you walk me 348 00:17:41.319 --> 00:17:44.160 through some different varieties, like a menu of feathers? 349 00:17:44.799 --> 00:17:49.119 Yeah, so there are different feathers have many different functions, 350 00:17:49.119 --> 00:17:51.440 and one thing that makes them really interesting to study 351 00:17:51.599 --> 00:17:55.240 is that oftentimes they're doing these functions simultaneously. Let's think 352 00:17:55.279 --> 00:17:58.440 about this really complex structure and try and understand what 353 00:17:58.559 --> 00:18:01.920 it's doing and how it evolved. My specialty is in 354 00:18:02.079 --> 00:18:07.160 feather color evolution, and feather color itself has many different functions. So, 355 00:18:07.240 --> 00:18:11.359 for example, thermer regulation birds keeping warm. That's kind of 356 00:18:11.519 --> 00:18:14.640 you know, one obvious use of feathers. In fact, we've 357 00:18:14.640 --> 00:18:17.400 co opted it for ourselves. Yeah, I think about down jacket. 358 00:18:17.480 --> 00:18:20.119 Birds have that built in all the time that. 359 00:18:20.240 --> 00:18:23.759 Just does that trap air so that it retains heat. 360 00:18:23.720 --> 00:18:28.000 Exactly, So it's like having this really warm air blanket 361 00:18:28.079 --> 00:18:31.119 right next to your skin. Basically, birds can actually control 362 00:18:31.240 --> 00:18:34.920 how warm they want to be by either fluffing themselves 363 00:18:35.000 --> 00:18:37.880 up or having the feathers be more flat. So if 364 00:18:37.880 --> 00:18:40.160 you think about like a really cold morning, I was 365 00:18:40.200 --> 00:18:42.200 in Boston for a really long time, and so you 366 00:18:42.240 --> 00:18:44.359 know sometimes when it's snowing, you see bird outside and 367 00:18:44.359 --> 00:18:46.960 it looks like a little puffball. And that's because they're 368 00:18:46.960 --> 00:18:49.359 increasing how much warm air that they have next to 369 00:18:49.400 --> 00:18:51.200 their skin, which is pretty cool. 370 00:18:51.279 --> 00:18:53.880 Oh my god, I had no idea they could do that. Yeah, 371 00:18:53.920 --> 00:18:55.480 so they're like, watch this, I'm going to get cuter 372 00:18:55.599 --> 00:18:56.240 and warmer. 373 00:18:56.480 --> 00:19:01.400 Exactly, I'm adorable. I'm going to become almost a complacent sphere. 374 00:19:02.240 --> 00:19:04.839 So they have a combination of down like an undercoat, 375 00:19:04.880 --> 00:19:06.599 and then do they have flight feathers on top of it. 376 00:19:07.000 --> 00:19:10.039 Yeah, So there are different types of feathers, So downy 377 00:19:10.039 --> 00:19:13.680 feathers are one type of feathers, and those feathers they 378 00:19:13.680 --> 00:19:17.119 don't have like the central rachus in the same way 379 00:19:17.200 --> 00:19:19.400 that what we call a contour feather, which is a 380 00:19:19.400 --> 00:19:22.880 body feather has or a flight feather would have. And 381 00:19:22.880 --> 00:19:24.960 they also don't have all the little hooklets that are 382 00:19:24.960 --> 00:19:29.160 going to be hooking their feather barbes and barbules together 383 00:19:29.240 --> 00:19:31.240 because they don't need to be hooked together. It's actually 384 00:19:31.319 --> 00:19:34.599 better for them to be more unorganized, because they can 385 00:19:34.960 --> 00:19:37.400 trap air molecules more efficiently that way. 386 00:19:37.759 --> 00:19:40.279 So down on a bird is chaotic. 387 00:19:40.319 --> 00:19:40.599 Good. 388 00:19:40.960 --> 00:19:43.960 Ps some down jacket trivia because I think it's interesting. 389 00:19:44.160 --> 00:19:47.319 They were invented by a dude in nineteen thirty six 390 00:19:47.519 --> 00:19:51.480 named you ready for this Eddie Bower. That's right, the 391 00:19:51.720 --> 00:19:56.640 Eddie Bower. So Bauer almost died of hypothermia winter fishing 392 00:19:56.720 --> 00:19:58.960 and was like, hell, no, mister freeze, you have been 393 00:19:59.000 --> 00:20:02.319 thwarted in a jacket. So then he patented them in 394 00:20:02.400 --> 00:20:06.160 nineteen forty. But before we see all down is good, 395 00:20:07.319 --> 00:20:09.680 let's look at where that comes from. I thought maybe 396 00:20:09.680 --> 00:20:12.920 birds were like done with their down. I wanted to believe. 397 00:20:13.000 --> 00:20:16.640 And I hate to tell you this, but the best down, oh, 398 00:20:16.680 --> 00:20:19.400 this is so terrible, is taken from live birds. That 399 00:20:19.440 --> 00:20:21.799 does not feel good to the birds, which is why 400 00:20:22.119 --> 00:20:25.400 there are so many down alternatives on the market which 401 00:20:25.400 --> 00:20:28.240