WEBVTT 1 00:00:00.160 --> 00:00:03.480 Oh hey, it's that little beetlegrub in your compost that 2 00:00:03.560 --> 00:00:06.960 you mistook for a dead human finger. Alli board just 3 00:00:07.080 --> 00:00:10.400 squirming toward one of the most exciting episodes of Ologies 4 00:00:10.439 --> 00:00:13.400 in the three year history of the show. I mean, 5 00:00:13.439 --> 00:00:17.960 we have rockstar ologists on every week, but celebs, I mean, 6 00:00:18.000 --> 00:00:21.679 we have a verifiable famous person on this week, and 7 00:00:22.000 --> 00:00:26.839 like what's next Vibology with Paula abdul Iconology with Missy Elliott. 8 00:00:26.879 --> 00:00:29.160 I mean, the sky's the limit. But before I sit 9 00:00:29.199 --> 00:00:33.240 down with our collective personal hero. Some thanks to patrons 10 00:00:33.359 --> 00:00:36.320 at patreon dot com sloshologies for submitting the questions for 11 00:00:36.399 --> 00:00:39.840 this episode, for every episode, and for supporting the show 12 00:00:39.920 --> 00:00:41.799 each and every day. If you want to join that, 13 00:00:41.960 --> 00:00:45.240 it's a dollar a month. Literally, twelve dollars a year 14 00:00:45.399 --> 00:00:48.520 gets you access to submit questions for over fifty episodes, 15 00:00:48.560 --> 00:00:50.960 so it's cheaper than a parking meter, folks. That's Patreon 16 00:00:50.960 --> 00:00:53.600 dot com slashologies. Also thank you to everyone rating the 17 00:00:53.640 --> 00:00:56.320 show and subscribing and spreading the word. It matters so 18 00:00:56.479 --> 00:00:59.280 much as do reviews, and I read all of your 19 00:00:59.320 --> 00:01:02.759 reviews because I love you back, such as this freshy 20 00:01:02.920 --> 00:01:07.000 from Carly who says pretty sure ologies cured my cancer, 21 00:01:07.400 --> 00:01:10.200 but for real though almost a year of chemo surgeries 22 00:01:10.239 --> 00:01:13.799 in quarantine, hearing a Tasmanian devil screech, or learning how 23 00:01:13.840 --> 00:01:16.359 not to lose a boat has been the highlight of 24 00:01:16.400 --> 00:01:20.599 my journey. You too can experience this enlightenment. No cancer necessary, 25 00:01:20.640 --> 00:01:23.439 says Carly. Carly, thank you and please continue to be healthy. 26 00:01:23.480 --> 00:01:26.079 And while we're here, big hugs to longtime listener Krista 27 00:01:26.079 --> 00:01:29.760 Evapado who just went through surgery last week. Okay, onward now, 28 00:01:29.840 --> 00:01:35.239 the title of this one is pedagogology and pedagogy. Pedagogy, 29 00:01:36.680 --> 00:01:41.239 what is it pedagogy? Pedagogy? Okay, the title of this 30 00:01:41.280 --> 00:01:46.840 one is pedagogology, and pedagogy means the method in practice 31 00:01:46.879 --> 00:01:52.239 of teaching. So theoretically this ology is the study of teaching. 32 00:01:52.400 --> 00:01:57.560 So learning to teach, to learn to communicate perhaps science, 33 00:01:57.760 --> 00:02:01.879 So to be a science communicator in sichom to calm 34 00:02:02.120 --> 00:02:04.840 some sigh, and there is maybe no one better on 35 00:02:05.120 --> 00:02:08.520 planet Earth to ask than the World Icon of Science TV. 36 00:02:08.879 --> 00:02:11.840 He graduated with a bachelor's mechanical engineering and worked at 37 00:02:11.879 --> 00:02:15.560 Boeing and has a zeal for all things scientific. He's 38 00:02:15.599 --> 00:02:18.639 the author of several books. He hosts several seasons of 39 00:02:18.680 --> 00:02:21.159 his own show on Netflix, and after wanting to be 40 00:02:21.719 --> 00:02:26.240 his generation's mister Wizard, he's been communicating science for decades 41 00:02:26.319 --> 00:02:28.599 and now we all would want to be him. So 42 00:02:28.680 --> 00:02:33.240 we chat about communicating science, the intersection of policy and conservation, 43 00:02:33.800 --> 00:02:42.479 the joy of discovery, gender fluidity, TikTok, masks, voting ties, monks, craters, 44 00:02:42.719 --> 00:02:46.800 and the F word with your hero and my pedagogologist, 45 00:02:47.240 --> 00:03:00.199 Bill freaking nine. 46 00:03:08.039 --> 00:03:10.639 Hi, Hi, Hi, greetings, greetings. 47 00:03:11.479 --> 00:03:13.520 I'm so excited to talk to you. 48 00:03:13.639 --> 00:03:14.439 Thank you for being. 49 00:03:14.319 --> 00:03:17.520 Here, well, thank you for having me here. 50 00:03:17.879 --> 00:03:21.599 I don't know how to do this interview because there's 51 00:03:21.680 --> 00:03:24.719 too many questions that I want to ask. 52 00:03:24.599 --> 00:03:26.680 So start with one of the first ones. 53 00:03:27.000 --> 00:03:30.080 Oh okay, so start with the first. Okay, that's a 54 00:03:30.080 --> 00:03:30.560 good idea. 55 00:03:30.759 --> 00:03:33.520 Yeah, well that wasn't really my idea. 56 00:03:34.639 --> 00:03:36.120 It's so nice to talk to you, and I had 57 00:03:36.120 --> 00:03:38.080 so much fun being on your podcast. I'm such a 58 00:03:38.159 --> 00:03:40.800 huge fan obviously, you know that huge chair. 59 00:03:40.879 --> 00:03:42.879 It's good. I'm a big fan of yours. 60 00:03:42.960 --> 00:03:44.159 Also. 61 00:03:45.439 --> 00:03:49.080 Okay, I'm just going to get right into it. You ready, yes, ma'am, Okay. 62 00:03:49.479 --> 00:03:52.360 I would like to know what a typical day is 63 00:03:52.479 --> 00:03:53.639 like for Bill Ny. 64 00:03:53.840 --> 00:03:56.840 Right now, A typical day is getting up and eating breakfast, 65 00:03:56.919 --> 00:04:03.479 which usually consists of some stone fruit from nearby grocery 66 00:04:03.479 --> 00:04:06.960 stores or the farmer's market which is nearby where I 67 00:04:07.000 --> 00:04:11.280 live here in Los Angeles. And then I get on 68 00:04:11.400 --> 00:04:12.240 calls like this. 69 00:04:13.919 --> 00:04:14.719 No, that's what I do. 70 00:04:14.840 --> 00:04:18.000 There's a lot of zooming that's a brand name, a 71 00:04:18.000 --> 00:04:21.800 lot of casting of pods. You know, we do Science Rules. 72 00:04:21.839 --> 00:04:25.160 You've been on Science Rules. We do Science Rules Coronavirus edition, 73 00:04:26.199 --> 00:04:31.040 and I do a little research for those. And there's 74 00:04:31.120 --> 00:04:34.560 always a lot of email associated with the Planetary Society. 75 00:04:35.120 --> 00:04:38.519 So Bill is the CEO of the Planetary Society, which 76 00:04:38.560 --> 00:04:43.279 is the world's largest and most influential nonprofit space organization. 77 00:04:43.439 --> 00:04:46.160 They quote introduce people to the wonders of the cosmos, 78 00:04:46.279 --> 00:04:49.480 bridging the gap between the scientific community and the general public, 79 00:04:49.800 --> 00:04:52.279 to inspire and educate people from all walks of life, 80 00:04:52.279 --> 00:04:55.600 and make voices heard in government and affect real change 81 00:04:55.839 --> 00:05:00.720 in support of space exploration. Nonprofit badassery, what's happening. 82 00:05:00.959 --> 00:05:04.079 So there's a lot of activity for me associated with that. 83 00:05:04.160 --> 00:05:08.720 Then at the end of the day, after a lot 84 00:05:08.720 --> 00:05:13.600 of often apples and peanut butter for lunch. Then I 85 00:05:13.680 --> 00:05:16.600 go for either a long walk of about four and 86 00:05:16.639 --> 00:05:20.959 a half miles or I ride my bike for about 87 00:05:21.079 --> 00:05:24.560 what is it, fifteen kilometers? So what is that some 88 00:05:24.839 --> 00:05:27.439 number in there ten milesthing like. 89 00:05:27.360 --> 00:05:31.040 That fifteen kilometers is nine point three miles, which is 90 00:05:31.079 --> 00:05:32.160 a lot of miles. 91 00:05:32.399 --> 00:05:34.480 And I go up the big hill, the hill here 92 00:05:34.560 --> 00:05:40.319 that separates Hollywood proper from like the valley, and I 93 00:05:40.439 --> 00:05:43.680 like totally live in the valley. And I found that 94 00:05:43.800 --> 00:05:48.279 doing these two activities every other day is good for 95 00:05:48.360 --> 00:05:49.399 the hips and knees. 96 00:05:50.000 --> 00:05:52.800 Oh, how about for ideas? Do you get a lot 97 00:05:52.839 --> 00:05:55.800 of ideas when you're cycling or when you're physically occupied? 98 00:05:56.759 --> 00:06:03.040 Uh? Yeah, you know this this idea of mindfulness where 99 00:06:03.079 --> 00:06:07.120 you're supposed to think about nothing. Oh would but that 100 00:06:07.279 --> 00:06:10.720 I could I think about things all the time? Yeah, 101 00:06:10.759 --> 00:06:13.759 And I hearkened to the story of this guy named 102 00:06:13.800 --> 00:06:16.920 William Friedman who was one of the code breakers in 103 00:06:16.959 --> 00:06:21.439 World War Two, and he says he encouraged the people 104 00:06:21.480 --> 00:06:25.600 that he worked with to just think about in the background. 105 00:06:25.879 --> 00:06:28.600 You're working on the problem all the time. You're always 106 00:06:28.680 --> 00:06:31.439 working on the problem. So yes, I'm always thinking about things. 107 00:06:31.480 --> 00:06:33.959 Ali, I don't doubt it. 108 00:06:34.120 --> 00:06:37.439 And right now, man, we are I'm in California. Everything 109 00:06:37.519 --> 00:06:41.279 is on fire, no sign of rain to come, the 110 00:06:41.360 --> 00:06:44.680 hurricanes hitting the Gulf of Mexico. In the US. We 111 00:06:44.759 --> 00:06:48.639 have got climate change big time. Yes. 112 00:06:50.040 --> 00:06:53.360 Do you ever wonder in all of this do you 113 00:06:53.399 --> 00:06:55.680 ever subscribe to any theories of this as one of 114 00:06:55.800 --> 00:06:58.279 many universes or just a simulation gone bad? 115 00:06:58.560 --> 00:06:59.680 Is that just giving out that it's. 116 00:06:59.600 --> 00:07:02.560 A similar gone bad is completely unreasonable to me? And 117 00:07:02.600 --> 00:07:04.959 I'll tell you why. Everybody. This gets back to our 118 00:07:05.000 --> 00:07:10.360 good friend Ocham's razor William of Akham, pronouncing it as 119 00:07:10.360 --> 00:07:13.959 best I can goes. You know, if you think about it, 120 00:07:14.040 --> 00:07:18.399 the simplest explanation for a phenomenon is probably the best. 121 00:07:18.839 --> 00:07:22.279 William of Auckham was a friar from Akham, Surrey in 122 00:07:22.319 --> 00:07:24.959 England in the late twelve hundreds, and I just look 123 00:07:25.040 --> 00:07:28.920 that up today. I always pictured Okham to look like 124 00:07:29.000 --> 00:07:31.959 some sort of Trent Reznor goblin holding a razor blade 125 00:07:31.959 --> 00:07:32.480 with his teeth. 126 00:07:32.519 --> 00:07:33.639 But no, he's just a. 127 00:07:33.600 --> 00:07:36.360 Monk who's like, hey, man, chill out. Simple answer is 128 00:07:36.360 --> 00:07:38.800 probably the deal. And then like went back to eating 129 00:07:39.079 --> 00:07:40.560 some unsalted porridge. 130 00:07:40.920 --> 00:07:45.000 So one explanation would be that we live. We're all 131 00:07:45.000 --> 00:07:49.160 in a giant video game, and our memories are implanted 132 00:07:49.199 --> 00:07:53.959 by the galactic over director, the god of the god 133 00:07:54.199 --> 00:07:57.800 of the video game, and everything that we do is 134 00:07:57.920 --> 00:08:01.160 prescribed by the rules of the video game game. And 135 00:08:01.360 --> 00:08:04.319 somebody's in charge. And what you think is reality is 136 00:08:04.360 --> 00:08:07.000 not reality because you're part of it. That's one explanation. 137 00:08:07.600 --> 00:08:09.920 Another explanation is we're not in a video game. This 138 00:08:10.040 --> 00:08:13.279 is actually the universe, and here we are. Yeah, it's 139 00:08:13.439 --> 00:08:16.879 just a lot more reasonable to me now. Whether or 140 00:08:16.920 --> 00:08:22.600 not there are other universes, there's a fabulous question. But 141 00:08:22.680 --> 00:08:26.360 apparently the only reason or the best reason, or the 142 00:08:26.360 --> 00:08:32.000 most compelling reason that there might be other universes multi 143 00:08:32.080 --> 00:08:38.080 verses is there's nothing to exclude that possibility. Okay, all right, 144 00:08:38.440 --> 00:08:40.759 we'll see or maybe it will be shown that you 145 00:08:40.799 --> 00:08:46.240 can never see that it's unknowable. Okay, all right, I'm 146 00:08:46.279 --> 00:08:48.600 still going to have coffee in the morning. 147 00:08:48.399 --> 00:08:52.159 And we still have to fix this big ball on 148 00:08:52.279 --> 00:08:53.360 fire that we live on. 149 00:08:53.759 --> 00:08:58.639 Yes, but these are worthy questions, you know, this thing. 150 00:08:59.039 --> 00:09:01.960 The two things that get us all all the time. 151 00:09:02.919 --> 00:09:07.279 Are are we alone in the universe? Are we the 152 00:09:07.279 --> 00:09:12.080 only sentient? Or whatever you call us contemplating our fate 153 00:09:12.159 --> 00:09:15.600 beings and where do we all come from? Where do 154 00:09:15.600 --> 00:09:17.600 we all get here? And I think the video game 155 00:09:18.080 --> 00:09:23.679 hypothesis is somebody trying to come up with how did 156 00:09:23.720 --> 00:09:26.840 we all get here? What is going on? And it 157 00:09:26.919 --> 00:09:30.360 is a fundamental and amazing question. I mean, I don't know, man, 158 00:09:31.080 --> 00:09:33.320 but I sure want to find out. I mean, this 159 00:09:33.480 --> 00:09:36.240 is you know, the premise in science everybody, and I 160 00:09:36.240 --> 00:09:38.279 know we have questions to get to Ali, I can't wait. 161 00:09:38.679 --> 00:09:41.720 Oh yeah, no, But the premise of the bit, as 162 00:09:41.720 --> 00:09:45.559 we say in comedy writing and science, is the premise 163 00:09:45.679 --> 00:09:50.480 is that the universe is knowable, that the cosmos is knowable, 164 00:09:51.440 --> 00:09:55.360 and that we can even ask that question is amazing. 165 00:09:55.799 --> 00:09:58.759 It fills me with reverence every day that we are 166 00:09:58.960 --> 00:10:03.600 made of the dust of stars and so we are 167 00:10:04.480 --> 00:10:08.480 at least one of the ways that the universe knows 168 00:10:08.840 --> 00:10:12.399 that it exists. Yeah, we are one of the ways 169 00:10:12.399 --> 00:10:16.320 the universe knows itself. That's really it's profound. People. 170 00:10:16.519 --> 00:10:21.519 Do you ever find that kind of existential rooting in 171 00:10:22.000 --> 00:10:22.879 science itself? 172 00:10:24.279 --> 00:10:29.240 Well, you've been on the Science Rules podcast I have. 173 00:10:29.360 --> 00:10:29.960 It's a great one. 174 00:10:30.039 --> 00:10:33.360 And I mentioned this as of course to promote my podcast, 175 00:10:33.840 --> 00:10:36.519 but also as a witness. If you ask Corey Powell, 176 00:10:36.559 --> 00:10:39.559 my co host, what's my favorite thing? And right now 177 00:10:39.559 --> 00:10:43.240 I'm mechanical engineer. Physics was how That's how I got here. 178 00:10:43.840 --> 00:10:48.159 But my favorite thing these days is evolution. Evolution explains 179 00:10:48.320 --> 00:10:51.919 is how we understand all of biology, all of life 180 00:10:51.960 --> 00:10:55.840 science is in the context or the lens of evolution. 181 00:10:56.639 --> 00:11:00.000 For more on evolution and some hot Charles Darwin gossip, 182 00:11:00.200 --> 00:11:02.360 see the Evolutionary Biology episode if you like. 183 00:11:03.039 --> 00:11:07.399 And So I think about science every day, all the time, 184 00:11:07.639 --> 00:11:09.720 and where did we all come from? And are we 185 00:11:09.759 --> 00:11:13.360 alone in the universe? I think about that all the time. 186 00:11:13.960 --> 00:11:16.799 On the topic of evolution, let's talk a little bit 187 00:11:16.799 --> 00:11:20.279 about yours. You are kind of proof that one's mutations 188 00:11:20.480 --> 00:11:24.279 are their superpower in that you are someone who's a 189 00:11:24.279 --> 00:11:27.919 mechanical engineer who is also gifted in comedy, and a 190 00:11:28.000 --> 00:11:31.159 lot of times people probably find themselves in one bucket 191 00:11:31.240 --> 00:11:32.679 or the other, but you were a bit of both 192 00:11:33.440 --> 00:11:36.559 and that kind of led to how you used your voice. 193 00:11:36.799 --> 00:11:40.799 Did you ever struggle with wanting to be a performer 194 00:11:40.960 --> 00:11:44.159 versus wanting to be an engineer? What was that like 195 00:11:44.240 --> 00:11:44.480 for you? 196 00:11:44.879 --> 00:11:48.320 Okay, let me just say, are you kidding? Yes, I struggled. 197 00:11:49.159 --> 00:11:54.480 Oh my goodness, did I struggle? So you guys, and 198 00:11:54.559 --> 00:11:58.320 I let me also back up one little thing. You know, 199 00:11:58.399 --> 00:12:04.879 you use the term gifted. I'm always concerned about the 200 00:12:04.960 --> 00:12:08.559 term gifted. I'm always concerned about the term talent. Okay, 201 00:12:08.840 --> 00:12:13.799 you know, I mean to me, Fred Astaire, you know talent. Okay, 202 00:12:14.840 --> 00:12:19.120 Bill Ny talent. I'm not sure you kind of lost 203 00:12:19.159 --> 00:12:24.799 me there, don't be so honest, but along this line, Yeah, 204 00:12:24.840 --> 00:12:29.879 So I what started it was everyone, you could say. 205 00:12:30.600 --> 00:12:33.000 I was a senior in college and the guy who 206 00:12:33.120 --> 00:12:37.480 had been my freshman roommate, Dave Lax. When we see 207 00:12:37.519 --> 00:12:40.559 each others, see each other at reunions, it's always great. 208 00:12:40.639 --> 00:12:42.799 Hey Dave, I love you, man, I love you. But 209 00:12:42.919 --> 00:12:45.919 he had gone into material science. I went in mechanical engineering. 210 00:12:46.159 --> 00:12:47.919 It's just like, you got to come see this. So 211 00:12:47.960 --> 00:12:50.919 I went to his house. They had this extraordinary technology 212 00:12:51.120 --> 00:12:57.120 in nineteen seventy seven, they had cable television. Yeah, and 213 00:12:57.200 --> 00:12:59.600 so I saw Steve Martin at the boarding House and 214 00:12:59.679 --> 00:13:02.840 boarding House as a nightclub in San Francisco, and he goes, look, 215 00:13:02.879 --> 00:13:04.559 this guy is just like you look at this His 216 00:13:04.679 --> 00:13:08.440 sense of humor is just like yours. Look at this guy, Hey, 217 00:13:08.600 --> 00:13:11.320 this guy. So then a year later, one of the 218 00:13:11.320 --> 00:13:16.759 Brothers Records sponsored the Steve Martin Lookalike Contest, and a different, 219 00:13:16.960 --> 00:13:20.320 completely different set of friends in a whole nother city 220 00:13:20.440 --> 00:13:23.879 Seattle pressured me to enter this contest, and I did, 221 00:13:23.960 --> 00:13:27.080 and I won. I mean due respect, I won. I 222 00:13:27.120 --> 00:13:29.720 did not win the national one. I did not advance 223 00:13:29.799 --> 00:13:33.759 beyond Seattle. The guy who won could play the banjo, 224 00:13:33.919 --> 00:13:37.320 and I guess objectively kind of looked like Steve Martin. 225 00:13:38.279 --> 00:13:42.159 But this led to people wanting me to be Steve 226 00:13:42.200 --> 00:13:46.840 Martin at parties because you're not of a certain age. 227 00:13:46.919 --> 00:13:51.320 But it is my claim that when Steve Martin released 228 00:13:51.320 --> 00:13:55.799 these first two albums, the whole world was laughing with him. 229 00:13:56.000 --> 00:13:59.120 The whole world was on board with his just people 230 00:13:59.120 --> 00:14:02.000 would call it absurd artist or just his point of view, 231 00:14:02.039 --> 00:14:05.360 which was deep irony. Anyway, then you start doing stand 232 00:14:05.440 --> 00:14:08.000 up comedy, start trying to do stand up comedy, you know, 233 00:14:08.000 --> 00:14:10.480 you start trying to write your own material. Meanwhile, I 234 00:14:10.519 --> 00:14:16.000 was working as an engineer. And then because everybody was 235 00:14:16.039 --> 00:14:20.360 talking about comedy early on, this is before Seinfeld, before 236 00:14:20.440 --> 00:14:23.840 Everybody Loves Raymond. Before all that, the head of the 237 00:14:23.960 --> 00:14:29.200 NBC affiliate station in Seattle, Chuck Jones, I guess was 238 00:14:29.240 --> 00:14:33.799 his real name, wanted to have a comedy show. So 239 00:14:33.919 --> 00:14:39.000 I had met these guys at comedy clubs over the 240 00:14:39.440 --> 00:14:43.679 couple years there, and I got invited to do a bit, 241 00:14:44.000 --> 00:14:46.559 and then one thing led to another and we had 242 00:14:46.559 --> 00:14:49.000 to fill six minutes, which is quite a while in 243 00:14:49.080 --> 00:14:52.679 yeah vision, And so ros Schaeffer, who's still a good 244 00:14:52.720 --> 00:14:54.639 friend of mine, said why don't you you could do 245 00:14:54.679 --> 00:14:58.559 that science stuff you're always talking about. So I did 246 00:14:58.600 --> 00:15:03.080 the household uses of nitrogen. I was Bill Ny, the 247 00:15:03.120 --> 00:15:06.120 science Guy, and was Ross who just blurted out Bill 248 00:15:06.200 --> 00:15:08.840 Ny the science Guy in a meeting, ah, and was 249 00:15:08.879 --> 00:15:10.840 you know. It was well received, so that there was 250 00:15:10.879 --> 00:15:15.159 pressure to do a science guy bid every few weeks, 251 00:15:15.960 --> 00:15:19.120 and I started doing it out doing it as kind 252 00:15:19.159 --> 00:15:23.360 of a magic thing, that is to say, not everything 253 00:15:23.399 --> 00:15:27.200 you see maybe was real. But then it occurred to 254 00:15:27.200 --> 00:15:29.200 me how cool it would be just to make it 255 00:15:29.240 --> 00:15:29.679 all real. 256 00:15:30.159 --> 00:15:32.919 Bill says that during the mid nineteen eighties, the Reagan 257 00:15:33.000 --> 00:15:38.519 administration opted to remove and not replace President Carter's solar panels, 258 00:15:38.679 --> 00:15:42.720 which was a megabummer to many environmentalists, and they also 259 00:15:42.919 --> 00:15:45.720 ended the push to have us convert to the metric system, 260 00:15:45.960 --> 00:15:48.399 which is why I had to ask a search engine 261 00:15:48.559 --> 00:15:51.879 how many miles fifteen kilometers is and why I'm not 262 00:15:52.000 --> 00:15:55.240 sure if it's kilometers or kilometers, and so I just 263 00:15:55.320 --> 00:15:58.840 had to look that up. Kilometers is American and kilometers 264 00:15:59.000 --> 00:16:02.480 is British. There's the same though, any frickin' whosal. The 265 00:16:02.519 --> 00:16:06.159 folks who produced the Seattle Today show hired are then 266 00:16:06.360 --> 00:16:08.879 thirty five year old Buddy Bill in nineteen eighty nine 267 00:16:08.960 --> 00:16:12.559 to make an educational video for the Washington State Department 268 00:16:12.600 --> 00:16:16.600 of Ecology and it was called Fabulous Wetlands and it 269 00:16:16.679 --> 00:16:17.480 was fabulous. 270 00:16:18.440 --> 00:16:20.840 So what is the wetland anyway? Well, you got land, 271 00:16:20.879 --> 00:16:23.480 you got water, and not that gobblegame. And that became 272 00:16:23.519 --> 00:16:25.840 a template for the Science Guy show. And then one 273 00:16:25.840 --> 00:16:29.159 thing led to another and the Children's Television Act where 274 00:16:29.200 --> 00:16:32.559 they had to station owners had to have three hours 275 00:16:33.120 --> 00:16:37.080 of educational television every week. Right, you mean we're going 276 00:16:37.159 --> 00:16:40.639 to stop our printing press for money? Yeah, we're going 277 00:16:40.720 --> 00:16:44.440 to stop printing money for three hours every week. I know, 278 00:16:44.639 --> 00:16:48.159 my goodness. But anyway, that's one thing led to another. 279 00:16:48.240 --> 00:16:52.440 But as far as quitting my engineering job, Man oh Man, 280 00:16:53.159 --> 00:16:57.200 I was working part time on a comedy show in 281 00:16:57.240 --> 00:16:59.960 Seattle that only would go six weeks at a time, 282 00:17:00.960 --> 00:17:04.200 and then you're unemployed for the next six weeks. You know. 283 00:17:04.279 --> 00:17:07.079 It was for a guy who was used to having 284 00:17:07.200 --> 00:17:09.759 a job. You know, I used to wear a tie 285 00:17:09.880 --> 00:17:11.759 to work, Ali, a straight tie. 286 00:17:12.000 --> 00:17:15.480 I can't help but imagine Bill wearing a straight tie 287 00:17:15.480 --> 00:17:18.160 to his day job and then coming home and changing 288 00:17:18.200 --> 00:17:21.160 into a bow tie like mister Rogers to teach science, 289 00:17:21.519 --> 00:17:24.640 or ducking into a phone booth like Clark Kent, changing 290 00:17:24.960 --> 00:17:28.759 only his tie but emerging clearly our nation science superman. 291 00:17:28.960 --> 00:17:31.359 I'll just tell you also, Ali, in those days working 292 00:17:31.880 --> 00:17:34.920 Boeing and then Sunstrand when I wore a tie, I 293 00:17:35.000 --> 00:17:37.480 also is just my thing. I also wore a shirt 294 00:17:39.720 --> 00:17:42.759 I didn't want to throw. I didn't want to scare anyone, 295 00:17:42.839 --> 00:17:49.079 you know. So anyway, quitting my job October third, nineteen 296 00:17:49.119 --> 00:17:53.960 eighty six was a real stopping and thinking. I mean, 297 00:17:54.960 --> 00:17:57.720 I had I set aside my end of the world money, 298 00:17:58.599 --> 00:18:00.359 which was five thousand dollars. 299 00:18:00.720 --> 00:18:02.039 It's a lot of money. 300 00:18:01.960 --> 00:18:05.000 It was, it was enough to pay I had a mortgage. 301 00:18:05.000 --> 00:18:08.279 I had a condo Condinium. I was like, you know, 302 00:18:08.319 --> 00:18:11.160 I was a young single guy in a condo, so 303 00:18:11.319 --> 00:18:15.240 I having a Volkswagen Bug. But you know, even then 304 00:18:15.599 --> 00:18:18.599 the world was changing so fast, and I realized if 305 00:18:18.640 --> 00:18:24.200 I left engineering for a year, I would be not unhireable, 306 00:18:24.279 --> 00:18:26.160 but it would be quite difficult for me to get 307 00:18:26.200 --> 00:18:28.519 back in it. Yeah, so you asked, was it an 308 00:18:28.559 --> 00:18:33.240 agonizing decision? But I was a young guy. People much 309 00:18:33.759 --> 00:18:37.480 they much more regret what they don't do than what 310 00:18:37.519 --> 00:18:40.359 they do. Yes, I mean, once in a while there's 311 00:18:40.440 --> 00:18:43.839 you know, problems, but most of the time we regret 312 00:18:43.920 --> 00:18:47.559 what we didn't do. So I quit my job and 313 00:18:47.640 --> 00:18:51.799 tried it, and then for another six years I worked 314 00:18:51.839 --> 00:18:55.960 part time as an engineer, but in traditionally it is 315 00:18:55.960 --> 00:18:58.559 called a contract engineer. That was a long answer to 316 00:18:58.599 --> 00:19:01.839 one of your questions. Was I agonized, of course? 317 00:19:02.599 --> 00:19:04.839 But you also did you not get a little bit 318 00:19:04.839 --> 00:19:07.799 of advice from it's some guy named Carl. 319 00:19:08.839 --> 00:19:13.200 Oh, Carl Sagan? Yes, okay, okay, some guy. So what 320 00:19:13.359 --> 00:19:14.359 happened everybody? 321 00:19:14.640 --> 00:19:14.720 Was? 322 00:19:15.240 --> 00:19:19.119 First of all, I was in high school in Washington, 323 00:19:19.240 --> 00:19:22.440 d C. And a guy who had graduated two years 324 00:19:22.480 --> 00:19:25.920 ahead of me, who had the same physics teacher said, 325 00:19:25.960 --> 00:19:27.880 you know, Bill, you ought to apply to Cornell. You're 326 00:19:27.920 --> 00:19:30.480 the kind of guy that would fit in at Cornell University. 327 00:19:31.759 --> 00:19:38.559 And you know, we love the word skepticism. Ali, but 328 00:19:38.640 --> 00:19:43.759 I was very skeptical of this claim, but nevertheless I applied. 329 00:19:43.839 --> 00:19:48.799 I had never visited the Cornell campus. I just in football, 330 00:19:48.839 --> 00:19:51.240 if you're familiar with I threw a hail Mary Pass. 331 00:19:52.519 --> 00:19:57.799 I typed the application on a typewriter, a manual typewriter, 332 00:19:58.240 --> 00:20:02.480 and I got in. I'd still to this day and amazed. 333 00:20:02.519 --> 00:20:05.359 The people I went to college with are so freaking smart. 334 00:20:06.000 --> 00:20:09.480 So yes, Bill got in and took some pretty cool classes. 335 00:20:09.759 --> 00:20:12.400 As a senior, I took one class from Carl Sagan, 336 00:20:12.799 --> 00:20:16.160 who was at Cornell, and it changed my life. It 337 00:20:16.240 --> 00:20:19.200 really did. So. The guy was so inspiring. He was 338 00:20:19.279 --> 00:20:20.759 all that as the kids say. 339 00:20:22.039 --> 00:20:25.519 So years after he graduated, Bill was making a Sunday 340 00:20:25.519 --> 00:20:29.480 morning educational TV show called Bill's Basement, and he got 341 00:20:29.519 --> 00:20:32.960 back in touch with his former Cornell instructor to ask 342 00:20:33.160 --> 00:20:34.079 a psicon question. 343 00:20:34.799 --> 00:20:37.640 I asked Carl Sagan about this, and he says, when 344 00:20:37.640 --> 00:20:39.799 you're doing these things, Bill, it sounds like an he 345 00:20:39.839 --> 00:20:43.799 called me, Bill sounds like a fine thing. But this 346 00:20:43.880 --> 00:20:48.000 is at my tenth college reunion, my tenth reunion, I 347 00:20:48.079 --> 00:20:50.839 had written a paper letter some of you may know 348 00:20:50.960 --> 00:20:55.079 this technology sounds like this and this is where you 349 00:20:55.119 --> 00:20:59.680 can store its plant based information story. And I wrote 350 00:20:59.720 --> 00:21:02.079 him all that are and his assistant arranged for me 351 00:21:02.119 --> 00:21:04.319 to meet with him for five minutes, and I told 352 00:21:04.359 --> 00:21:08.119 him about this thing called Bill. He says, focus on 353 00:21:08.200 --> 00:21:12.519 pure science. He said, kids resonate to pure science. That 354 00:21:12.599 --> 00:21:16.319 was a verb he used, and so I did. That 355 00:21:16.480 --> 00:21:21.000 was just outstanding advice and is one sentence out of 356 00:21:21.119 --> 00:21:24.079 the all the sentences I've heard over my entire life, 357 00:21:24.079 --> 00:21:26.599 and it was really cool advice. So if you watch 358 00:21:26.640 --> 00:21:30.640 the Science Guy show, it's all about pure science. Even 359 00:21:30.680 --> 00:21:34.720 the computer show is about the science or the mathematics 360 00:21:34.799 --> 00:21:40.240 or the fundamentals of computing rather than the state of 361 00:21:40.240 --> 00:21:43.160 that art in nineteen ninety seven or whatever it was. 362 00:21:43.680 --> 00:21:46.279 So Bill is still in touch with and Sagan and 363 00:21:46.359 --> 00:21:49.640 the Sagan kiddos were fans of Bill Ny the Science Guy. 364 00:21:49.880 --> 00:21:52.680 He still hangs out and has a beer and shoots 365 00:21:52.720 --> 00:21:55.039 the shit about our place and the cosmos with them, 366 00:21:55.359 --> 00:21:58.759 because that is the kind of casual redness that Bill 367 00:21:58.880 --> 00:22:00.079 Ny brings to the tape. 368 00:22:00.720 --> 00:22:04.640 All these remarkable circumstances have led me to where I am. 369 00:22:04.720 --> 00:22:07.880 And you know, each of these things is some crazy 370 00:22:07.920 --> 00:22:10.559 turning point in your life. Like you or you're doing 371 00:22:10.599 --> 00:22:14.920 an ologies podcast, You're crazy, You're a wild who knew? 372 00:22:15.200 --> 00:22:19.920 Who knew? I definitely think that you should take the risks. 373 00:22:19.680 --> 00:22:21.920 Cot bangs text your crash. 374 00:22:22.000 --> 00:22:25.440 This is likely not a simulation. Have you ever been 375 00:22:25.480 --> 00:22:27.880 part of any studies where they've tried to figure out 376 00:22:27.920 --> 00:22:33.200 generationally what generation gives a bigger shit about science and 377 00:22:34.039 --> 00:22:39.319 if it's related to their watching Bill Neida Science guy, Like, 378 00:22:39.400 --> 00:22:44.519 I feel like millennials care, maybe an older generation doesn't. 379 00:22:44.720 --> 00:22:47.480 If they had had a better Bill Nia Science Guide, 380 00:22:47.519 --> 00:22:49.880 do you think we would have an easier time with 381 00:22:50.000 --> 00:22:53.000 policy that would protect the earth? 382 00:22:53.759 --> 00:22:58.119 Well, I think we're about to see a fantastic turning point. Yeah, 383 00:22:58.200 --> 00:23:00.680 to your point. Not to make you all jealous, but 384 00:23:00.759 --> 00:23:02.480 I was at the foot doctor. 385 00:23:02.599 --> 00:23:04.599 Whoa exactly Yeah, okay. 386 00:23:04.559 --> 00:23:07.920 Back in the day when you could walk around, I 387 00:23:08.079 --> 00:23:10.759 was in Penn Station in New York City and this 388 00:23:10.880 --> 00:23:14.240 woman with a giant piece of luggage ran over my foot. 389 00:23:14.519 --> 00:23:16.400 Oh now, why didn't you get out of the way? 390 00:23:16.480 --> 00:23:20.359 Bill yeah. Well, so anyway, the toe is broken and 391 00:23:20.359 --> 00:23:24.559 crooked and all these exciting things. So anyway, I was 392 00:23:24.599 --> 00:23:27.119 in the doctor's office and he said, now this guy 393 00:23:27.319 --> 00:23:30.599 was my age, this doctor singer. He said, you wait here, 394 00:23:30.640 --> 00:23:33.839 and he brought in five people who work in his 395 00:23:34.079 --> 00:23:37.680 office and they're you know, young people, millennials who all 396 00:23:37.759 --> 00:23:40.920 watched The Science Guy Show. And they all said, the 397 00:23:40.960 --> 00:23:43.839 reason we're physicians and nurses is because we watched The 398 00:23:43.880 --> 00:23:46.599 Science Guy Show. I got choked up. I went, wow, 399 00:23:46.720 --> 00:23:50.319 you guys, you know, I mean, we made the show 400 00:23:50.400 --> 00:23:55.079 in a brick warehouse in Seattle. It's still there. And 401 00:23:55.240 --> 00:23:58.079