1 00:00:02,560 --> 00:00:06,879 Speaker 1: The Todd Herman show is one disapproved by big pharma 2 00:00:07,080 --> 00:00:14,240 technocrats in tyrone Sabrian ware from the high Mountains of 3 00:00:14,400 --> 00:00:22,199 Free America. Here's the Emerald City XI Todd Herman. 4 00:00:26,320 --> 00:00:32,119 Speaker 2: So I'm joined by writer, the omnipocent, omniscient, omniscient, the omissions, 5 00:00:32,159 --> 00:00:36,880 the omniscions huge presence in YouTube. He's a filmmaker and 6 00:00:36,920 --> 00:00:38,880 as you can see, heze a young man dressed far 7 00:00:38,920 --> 00:00:42,159 better than the old man, deeply to my embarrassment, but 8 00:00:42,280 --> 00:00:47,079 created a provocative video stating that Chris that that horror 9 00:00:47,119 --> 00:00:51,200 films are Christian, that may be more Christian than other films, 10 00:00:51,240 --> 00:00:53,320 and writer joins us, thanks for coming on. I appreciate you. 11 00:00:54,280 --> 00:00:55,600 Speaker 3: Yeah, I'm pumped to be here. 12 00:00:55,719 --> 00:00:58,560 Speaker 2: Awesome, Thank you very much. Let's start with some framing 13 00:00:58,560 --> 00:01:00,000 in this because I always I want to make sure 14 00:01:00,000 --> 00:01:02,759 sure that we are using the same terms. How do 15 00:01:02,799 --> 00:01:04,079 you define a horror movie? 16 00:01:05,879 --> 00:01:09,000 Speaker 3: Well, there's two things. There's I think when people think 17 00:01:09,000 --> 00:01:13,599 of the word horror movie, they think of mainstream, secular movies. 18 00:01:13,959 --> 00:01:17,480 And that's obviously the main objection people will have when 19 00:01:17,519 --> 00:01:21,920 I say Christians should be making horror movies, and so 20 00:01:22,280 --> 00:01:25,519 people will probably be thinking of you know the sau 21 00:01:25,680 --> 00:01:28,719 series where it's gore porn. Yeah, and they'll be thinking 22 00:01:28,920 --> 00:01:32,400 of movies like I'm thinking of American horror story where 23 00:01:32,400 --> 00:01:36,519 it's just over the top, completely blown out of proportion, 24 00:01:36,799 --> 00:01:40,480 just demonic stuff. And so that is not what I'm 25 00:01:40,519 --> 00:01:44,680 advocating for. And so what I'm talking about when I 26 00:01:44,719 --> 00:01:49,439 say Christian horror is I'm talking about a reframing of 27 00:01:49,480 --> 00:01:53,280 the way that horror has been approached. And so I 28 00:01:53,319 --> 00:01:58,359 think as Christians, we have probably more than anybody else, 29 00:01:59,599 --> 00:02:02,680 the ability to be able to talk about darker things 30 00:02:03,079 --> 00:02:05,239 because we have a foundation by which we can do 31 00:02:05,280 --> 00:02:09,280 it upon. So God talks about dark things in scripture, 32 00:02:09,319 --> 00:02:12,159 and so that's kind of where I made this connection 33 00:02:12,439 --> 00:02:15,560 of where since God is able to talk about the 34 00:02:15,639 --> 00:02:18,240 dark things, we should also be able to do that 35 00:02:18,400 --> 00:02:21,400 in art. But the way that it's currently being done 36 00:02:21,520 --> 00:02:23,360 needs to be reframed. 37 00:02:23,439 --> 00:02:27,240 Speaker 2: Yeah, and you get approached by people who will push 38 00:02:27,280 --> 00:02:30,840 back Scripturally. It was interesting to me because there's some 39 00:02:30,919 --> 00:02:34,759 commonality given what I do and what you do, and 40 00:02:34,840 --> 00:02:37,199 a lot of people will go to you. With Philippians four, 41 00:02:37,360 --> 00:02:40,199 verse eight, find their brothers and sisters, whatever's true, whatever 42 00:02:40,280 --> 00:02:44,639 is noble, whatever's right, whatever's pure, whatever's lovely, whatever is admirable, 43 00:02:44,759 --> 00:02:47,039 if anything is excellent or praise worth. They think about 44 00:02:47,080 --> 00:02:50,360 such things and people hit you with that, and you respond. 45 00:02:50,039 --> 00:02:55,400 Speaker 3: How well? I respond by saying, well, first, when God 46 00:02:55,520 --> 00:02:58,319 is saying those things, it kind of reminds me of 47 00:02:58,319 --> 00:03:01,360 when he's talking about God has not given us a 48 00:03:01,360 --> 00:03:05,360 spirit of fear in two Timothy. But he's not saying 49 00:03:05,840 --> 00:03:08,840 that we shouldn't be afraid, because fear is a natural 50 00:03:08,840 --> 00:03:11,199 part of being a part of this world. So what 51 00:03:11,240 --> 00:03:13,360 he is saying is to take confidence in me. I 52 00:03:13,400 --> 00:03:17,000 am your confidence, and so through that fear and through 53 00:03:17,039 --> 00:03:20,199 that pain, I will walk through with you in that pain. 54 00:03:20,599 --> 00:03:23,840 And so then coming back to Philippians four, verse eight, 55 00:03:24,400 --> 00:03:26,360 it is I would also say, it's like it is 56 00:03:26,400 --> 00:03:30,599 also true, lovely and good that God talks about Sodom 57 00:03:30,639 --> 00:03:34,039 and Gomorrah and the depravity that we see there in 58 00:03:34,080 --> 00:03:36,719 scripture with those men and the things that they were doing. 59 00:03:37,199 --> 00:03:40,280 And so it's kind of like that is the other 60 00:03:40,439 --> 00:03:41,199 side of the truth. 61 00:03:41,240 --> 00:03:41,879 Speaker 2: It is to. 62 00:03:41,960 --> 00:03:44,759 Speaker 3: Complete the whole picture, you need to talk about the 63 00:03:44,879 --> 00:03:47,919 dark things as well as the good things to get 64 00:03:47,960 --> 00:03:51,520 a complete picture. And so kind of like by ignoring 65 00:03:51,560 --> 00:03:54,080 the dark things and saying we can't talk about it, 66 00:03:54,080 --> 00:03:57,360 we can't look at it, we can't illuminate it. We 67 00:03:57,439 --> 00:04:00,639 are talking about half truths. And so I think that 68 00:04:00,719 --> 00:04:03,639 we need to be able to approach the darker things 69 00:04:04,039 --> 00:04:06,439 to get a whole picture, because that's what God does. 70 00:04:06,840 --> 00:04:09,840 Speaker 2: That's well said, This well said. Remember when the Sound 71 00:04:09,840 --> 00:04:13,680 of Freedom came out, And do you know how difficult 72 00:04:13,759 --> 00:04:17,680 it was for them to get that movie made? I mean, 73 00:04:17,800 --> 00:04:21,759 it was delayed something like two years. And then do 74 00:04:21,800 --> 00:04:27,199 you recall the insanity that the left had to leap 75 00:04:27,240 --> 00:04:29,920 in and say, oh, this is hyperventil ing. There's no 76 00:04:29,959 --> 00:04:33,720 such thing as this form of this trafficking. That's not happening. 77 00:04:34,639 --> 00:04:37,600 This is a right wing fever dream. And yet the 78 00:04:37,600 --> 00:04:42,680 people at Angel Studios persisted in that they made the movie. 79 00:04:42,800 --> 00:04:48,000 The movie was a worldwide hit, and it has legitimately 80 00:04:48,120 --> 00:04:54,319 changed discussion around Hollywood and around trafficking and children. And 81 00:04:54,360 --> 00:04:56,839 do you remember that fantastic line in that movie, God's 82 00:04:57,160 --> 00:05:01,959 Children are not for sale. It was a really cool 83 00:05:01,959 --> 00:05:05,000 way to bring the Gospel into this in a gentle 84 00:05:05,319 --> 00:05:10,160 and yet potent way. So Angels Studios is participating in 85 00:05:10,319 --> 00:05:12,879 changing culture and They've allowed us to become part of this. 86 00:05:13,040 --> 00:05:15,399 Do you know the movie King of Kings? The King 87 00:05:15,399 --> 00:05:18,680 of Kings. It is an animated program about the life 88 00:05:18,759 --> 00:05:23,319 of Jesus Christ. And this program is for families and 89 00:05:23,399 --> 00:05:25,959 young people. And I've talked to guys who are in 90 00:05:26,040 --> 00:05:29,199 ninth grade and they love this. They think it's one 91 00:05:29,199 --> 00:05:31,319 of the best explanations of the Lord that there is. 92 00:05:31,360 --> 00:05:34,120 Alex is watching it, I'm watching it. We're both going 93 00:05:34,199 --> 00:05:37,040 to give you separate reviews. Right now. You have an 94 00:05:37,040 --> 00:05:41,319 opportunity to become an Angel's Studio Guild member, so dig this. 95 00:05:41,360 --> 00:05:44,040 When you do that, you will get two free tickets 96 00:05:44,079 --> 00:05:48,680 to every Angel's Studio theatrical release. You can become part 97 00:05:48,720 --> 00:05:50,480 of the family that gets to look at all the 98 00:05:50,519 --> 00:05:56,160 fan created shows, and you will have a vote as 99 00:05:56,199 --> 00:06:01,360 to which stories they release next to continue to change culture. 100 00:06:01,639 --> 00:06:05,199 And it's not that your votes are ornamental. That's exactly 101 00:06:05,279 --> 00:06:07,240 how they're going to decide what they're released Thumbs up 102 00:06:07,279 --> 00:06:11,639 thumbs down from us. So get into this culture battle today. 103 00:06:11,720 --> 00:06:15,240 Visit angel dot com, slash Todd and join. Over one 104 00:06:15,279 --> 00:06:18,839 million Americans are taking back control over entertainment. Become a 105 00:06:18,879 --> 00:06:21,959 premium Angel Studios Guild member to watch The King of Kings, 106 00:06:22,439 --> 00:06:24,920 stream all fan created shows and movies, and get two 107 00:06:24,920 --> 00:06:30,240 free tickets to every Angel Studios theatrical release. That's Angel 108 00:06:30,279 --> 00:06:33,959 dot Com slash Todd. Angel dot Com slash Todd help 109 00:06:34,040 --> 00:06:37,120 us change culture with these guys. I really really am 110 00:06:37,160 --> 00:06:40,160 thankful for the invitation from them. So let me dive 111 00:06:40,240 --> 00:06:43,199 into a specific film. It's one of the few films 112 00:06:43,240 --> 00:06:48,480 I've seen where the audience was silent for silent and 113 00:06:48,519 --> 00:06:51,720 it wasn't because there was an depreciation of the film. 114 00:06:51,920 --> 00:06:53,920 There's two times this has happened. One was the secular 115 00:06:53,920 --> 00:06:55,399 movie and I can't remember the name of the film 116 00:06:55,439 --> 00:06:57,560 Bork was in. It's the only film she's ever done 117 00:06:58,319 --> 00:07:02,680 and it was a musical that ended in this shocking way. 118 00:07:02,720 --> 00:07:04,360 And I was in Seattle and people said, we looked 119 00:07:04,360 --> 00:07:07,120 that up, Alex. She's only done one movie, Brooke, and 120 00:07:07,319 --> 00:07:10,600 the other is that Dancer The Dark. Dancer the Dark, 121 00:07:10,639 --> 00:07:14,199 and the filmmaker created that to be polarizing. You either 122 00:07:14,199 --> 00:07:16,319 love the film or you hate the film, and it 123 00:07:16,439 --> 00:07:18,720 was walking out of there. We talked about that film 124 00:07:18,720 --> 00:07:22,839 for weeks, the horror film and maybe you don't think 125 00:07:22,839 --> 00:07:25,000 it counts as Horror is the Passion of the Christ 126 00:07:25,040 --> 00:07:28,439 by Mel Gibson. And I know people who watched that 127 00:07:28,480 --> 00:07:30,519 and were deeply bothered because they said, hey, this was 128 00:07:30,600 --> 00:07:37,040 violence porn, and I guess I disagreed. I was floored 129 00:07:37,240 --> 00:07:39,720 by the amount of violence that was in it, that 130 00:07:39,759 --> 00:07:42,519 they got away with using air make and that it 131 00:07:42,600 --> 00:07:46,480 was that. I loved the movie, but man, at the end, 132 00:07:46,959 --> 00:07:51,480 just like everybody else, I couldn't speak. Do you think 133 00:07:51,480 --> 00:07:53,720 that's do you think that's Christian horror? And if so, 134 00:07:53,839 --> 00:07:55,680 do you think it's horror? Do you think it's Christian horror? 135 00:07:55,680 --> 00:07:56,439 Do you think it was well done? 136 00:07:58,319 --> 00:08:01,920 Speaker 3: I remember watching that movie having the same reaction as 137 00:08:02,000 --> 00:08:06,439 you is. Yeah, No, it's completely blew me away, just 138 00:08:06,680 --> 00:08:11,120 the visceral nature of seeing the crucifixion. And I think 139 00:08:11,199 --> 00:08:14,680 even mel Gibson was like, we didn't even show all 140 00:08:14,759 --> 00:08:16,279 of it because it just would have been too much. 141 00:08:16,800 --> 00:08:20,600 So but even the depth that they went was insane, 142 00:08:21,279 --> 00:08:23,959 and I would say, looking back, yeah, I guess you 143 00:08:24,000 --> 00:08:27,399 could say it definitely tapped into the horror aspects with 144 00:08:27,879 --> 00:08:31,000 I think especially of like the Garden of Gethsemane when 145 00:08:31,079 --> 00:08:34,639 and then there's Satan who's portrayed as this pale woman 146 00:08:34,799 --> 00:08:38,360 with and it's like very weird. And then there are 147 00:08:38,360 --> 00:08:41,720 some demonic encounters there as well. When Judas he you know, 148 00:08:41,759 --> 00:08:44,360 he turns Jesus in and then he's walking around and 149 00:08:44,399 --> 00:08:46,759 he's like, what have I done? And then you know, 150 00:08:46,840 --> 00:08:50,360 these children walk up to him. It kind of appeared 151 00:08:50,360 --> 00:08:53,279 like they were demons disguised as children to torture him 152 00:08:53,279 --> 00:08:56,120 and oppress him, be like you've done bad things. Now 153 00:08:56,120 --> 00:08:59,559 you're in trouble. And so I think, looking back when 154 00:08:59,559 --> 00:09:02,679 I saw that, that definitely was like, Okay, whoa, Okay, 155 00:09:02,720 --> 00:09:06,759 that's intense. Yeah, but I think it conveys the gravity 156 00:09:06,799 --> 00:09:10,679 of the situation in a way that other Jesus movies haven't. 157 00:09:11,679 --> 00:09:15,480 Speaker 2: I firmly agree, and it's forever more changed how I 158 00:09:15,519 --> 00:09:19,720 talk about Christ and the Cross that and then realizing 159 00:09:19,840 --> 00:09:22,519 as I'm matured in faith that it wasn't quote just 160 00:09:22,679 --> 00:09:27,639 the physical torture that he had, the wrath of God 161 00:09:28,000 --> 00:09:30,799 sort in these cups poured out upon him not just 162 00:09:30,840 --> 00:09:32,960 for sins past, but every sin that we're ever going 163 00:09:33,000 --> 00:09:38,080 to commit. And the way they treated Christ's body, while 164 00:09:38,320 --> 00:09:42,200 remarkably gross and violence and Gibson did a good job 165 00:09:42,200 --> 00:09:44,480 of that you think about the wrath of God coming down. 166 00:09:44,519 --> 00:09:48,120 So what's another example for you that informs your recommen 167 00:09:48,159 --> 00:09:50,799 you're a filmmaker. You've just made a short film, and 168 00:09:50,960 --> 00:09:52,519 we'll link to that in the show notes to make 169 00:09:52,559 --> 00:09:55,480 sure people. I would love for you to support writer's 170 00:09:55,600 --> 00:09:57,879 work and to examine if you love it, share with people. 171 00:09:57,960 --> 00:10:00,360 But what's another film that you think express is this? 172 00:10:00,440 --> 00:10:00,679 Speaker 1: Well? 173 00:10:02,879 --> 00:10:07,600 Speaker 3: Hmmm, well, that's a tough one because if I pick 174 00:10:07,639 --> 00:10:09,720 a certain film, there's there might be a divide I 175 00:10:09,759 --> 00:10:13,960 would say, I would I would say this. Films that 176 00:10:14,000 --> 00:10:18,919 tell good stories will naturally have to borrow from the 177 00:10:18,919 --> 00:10:21,759 way that God tells stories because He's the master storyteller. 178 00:10:22,080 --> 00:10:24,159 And the way that he tells stories, it has you know, 179 00:10:24,240 --> 00:10:26,759 has the beginning, it has an end. Not I'm not 180 00:10:26,799 --> 00:10:30,200 talking about just like you know him or like history 181 00:10:30,200 --> 00:10:32,639 as a whole, like how he is just the storytelling 182 00:10:33,000 --> 00:10:35,720 how there's an arc, there's a character arc, and how 183 00:10:35,759 --> 00:10:39,240 he pulls us in and even with Jesus and his parables, 184 00:10:39,639 --> 00:10:43,519 he weaves in the truth and the narrative through uh 185 00:10:43,639 --> 00:10:46,600 these visual visual ways. You're imagining it and you're going 186 00:10:46,639 --> 00:10:50,159 through it, you're experiencing it and so in order for 187 00:10:50,320 --> 00:10:53,919 a story to be good, it has to follow certain patterns, 188 00:10:53,960 --> 00:10:58,600 and that's how God conveys stories. Even I'll use an example. 189 00:10:58,639 --> 00:11:01,559 I'm reading about David right now, know, and the and 190 00:11:01,639 --> 00:11:04,080 his his whole journey, and I'm being wrapped up in it. 191 00:11:04,080 --> 00:11:06,960 It's like, holy cow, the twist and turns. It's amazing. 192 00:11:07,440 --> 00:11:11,600 And so you're seeing David beginning from a nobody becoming 193 00:11:11,600 --> 00:11:15,799 a somebody and being pursued by the enemy Saul, and 194 00:11:15,919 --> 00:11:19,360 you see this beautiful friendship he has with Jonathan, and 195 00:11:19,360 --> 00:11:22,159 then you see how Jonathan dies, and I'm reading that 196 00:11:22,240 --> 00:11:25,720 and I'm like, not Jonathan. They have this beautiful friendship 197 00:11:26,159 --> 00:11:29,240 and it's just and it's like, it's amazing how God 198 00:11:29,320 --> 00:11:33,279 is able to hook you into this beautiful story. And 199 00:11:33,360 --> 00:11:37,480 so even I would say kind of like going off 200 00:11:37,480 --> 00:11:41,799 on a tangent here. But when people look at secular 201 00:11:41,840 --> 00:11:44,080 movies and they you know, I know, some Christians are 202 00:11:44,080 --> 00:11:48,159 probably a bit more weary of that than others. They'll say, 203 00:11:48,279 --> 00:11:52,000 you know, maybe we shouldn't watch secular things because I think, me, 204 00:11:52,120 --> 00:11:54,519 when I look at films that are good, a lot 205 00:11:54,519 --> 00:11:58,200 of them are secular. Because faith based movies aren't really 206 00:11:58,759 --> 00:12:02,879 getting traction, and they they don't follow the storytelling system 207 00:12:02,919 --> 00:12:05,000 that God has placed out for us. And even just 208 00:12:05,679 --> 00:12:08,720 storytelling in general, we think of the hero's journey or 209 00:12:09,039 --> 00:12:12,440 an anti hero and a negative character arc where it's 210 00:12:12,440 --> 00:12:15,120 going from good to worse, and we see the consequences 211 00:12:15,120 --> 00:12:18,159 and fallout, and so faith based media doesn't fall that. 212 00:12:19,120 --> 00:12:21,759 Faith based media kind of goes away from that because 213 00:12:21,799 --> 00:12:26,720 they're trying to convey a certain message. And I think 214 00:12:27,399 --> 00:12:30,360 conveying your message is great as long as it doesn't 215 00:12:30,360 --> 00:12:32,799 overpower the story and you tell it through the story. 216 00:12:33,600 --> 00:12:36,679 You think of here's a good example of a film, Braveheart. 217 00:12:37,080 --> 00:12:41,120 So with Braveheart you're thinking of William Wallace and how 218 00:12:41,159 --> 00:12:45,360 he's this kind of he is, this nobody knows about him, 219 00:12:45,399 --> 00:12:50,279 this highlander dude just out doing his thing, and along 220 00:12:50,279 --> 00:12:52,840 come the English and they are raping, they're pillaging, and 221 00:12:52,879 --> 00:12:55,519 this guy's like, Okay, we can't take this crap. We 222 00:12:55,559 --> 00:12:58,960 need to rise up and defend ourselves for God and 223 00:12:58,960 --> 00:13:02,879 for our fellow countrymen. And so we see this amazing 224 00:13:02,960 --> 00:13:08,799 journey of William Wallace rallying his fellow countrymen and fighting 225 00:13:08,879 --> 00:13:12,759 against the Englishman. And so through that story we see 226 00:13:12,960 --> 00:13:18,399 not only God's providence of the scotsmen getting and gaining 227 00:13:18,399 --> 00:13:21,519 their freedom, but we also see the effects of William 228 00:13:21,559 --> 00:13:26,120 Wallace himself and just his personal journey with Christ, and 229 00:13:26,159 --> 00:13:30,120 also with the experiences in the film. His wife dies, 230 00:13:30,679 --> 00:13:33,720 his brother, something happens to his brother, I believe, and 231 00:13:34,080 --> 00:13:38,440 he's going He's experiencing all these traumatic events and yet 232 00:13:38,480 --> 00:13:42,200 God sustains him through that. And so we can see 233 00:13:42,200 --> 00:13:46,720 on the wide scale and the individual level, how this 234 00:13:46,799 --> 00:13:50,120 story is able to connect with us personally. And I 235 00:13:50,159 --> 00:13:53,960 think that's I think it no matter if it's a 236 00:13:54,039 --> 00:13:57,320 Christian film or secular film, if it follows that and 237 00:13:57,440 --> 00:14:03,279 is able to emotionally bring us into the experience kind 238 00:14:03,279 --> 00:14:05,360 of how God does in scripture, then that is a 239 00:14:05,399 --> 00:14:09,320 good story. And so bringing it back the examples that 240 00:14:09,360 --> 00:14:12,080 I use are mainly from secular people because they're the 241 00:14:12,080 --> 00:14:15,519 ones that are doing that work. It's not perfect because 242 00:14:15,519 --> 00:14:18,039 they don't have the worldview that we have, but they're 243 00:14:18,039 --> 00:14:22,240 the ones doing it because faith based media has gotten 244 00:14:22,240 --> 00:14:24,320 into their own bubble and said we're not gonna do 245 00:14:24,360 --> 00:14:26,919 that stuff. We're going to preach the message and we're 246 00:14:26,919 --> 00:14:29,879 going to talk about Christ instead, yep. And so as 247 00:14:29,879 --> 00:14:31,039 a resu continue. 248 00:14:31,080 --> 00:14:34,120 Speaker 2: Yeah, and you're proposing that Christians need to invest in 249 00:14:34,159 --> 00:14:37,519 the horror genre, yes, and that we shouldn't ignore this, 250 00:14:37,759 --> 00:14:41,240 and I agree. You know, we've ignored a lot of 251 00:14:41,279 --> 00:14:47,200 things in society. And Satan he loves a vacuum, right, yeah, 252 00:14:47,200 --> 00:14:50,240 you know, science of horrors a vacuum. 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Ah'm I get that's true story, But 284 00:16:20,399 --> 00:16:23,879 that scene where he is dying and he's being unalived 285 00:16:23,879 --> 00:16:26,600 in a super violent way in Brave Hearts at the 286 00:16:26,720 --> 00:16:30,879 end and he comes upon peace, and you see that 287 00:16:30,919 --> 00:16:34,759 the faces of his friends and the crowd who are watching, 288 00:16:34,799 --> 00:16:37,320 and they're there with him, and he's laid out and 289 00:16:37,360 --> 00:16:44,159 he's being destroyed. And then he sees his wife, and 290 00:16:44,240 --> 00:16:47,720 his wife was unlived in a really cold and brutal way. 291 00:16:47,879 --> 00:16:49,960 And this is clear that she's that she's been allowed 292 00:16:50,039 --> 00:16:52,679 to come there by God. Uh and he has this 293 00:16:52,799 --> 00:16:54,720 peace and he is in fact, of course it's not 294 00:16:55,000 --> 00:16:57,039 it's not an accident that he's laid out as a 295 00:16:57,279 --> 00:17:00,159 you know, in the form of a cross. I don't 296 00:17:00,159 --> 00:17:03,039 know how many people get that imagery, you and I do. 297 00:17:03,159 --> 00:17:05,799 I saw that as imagery. I know that mel Gibson 298 00:17:05,880 --> 00:17:09,160 is a Catholic man, and I know he's also gone 299 00:17:09,279 --> 00:17:11,799 way off based sometimes it be the first to admit 300 00:17:11,839 --> 00:17:14,079 that drinking, et cetera, and being in Hollywood to do 301 00:17:14,119 --> 00:17:18,599 that to you is that when we as Christians invest 302 00:17:18,599 --> 00:17:23,880 in this, is that overt enough for an audience that 303 00:17:24,039 --> 00:17:26,920 is not Christian that they don't under I mean, they 304 00:17:27,000 --> 00:17:28,759 might be ethnically Christian if you know what I mean, 305 00:17:28,839 --> 00:17:31,960 or accidentally Christian or Christian by tradition, but certainly don't 306 00:17:32,000 --> 00:17:35,240 know the Gospel and absolutely don't have a world. A 307 00:17:35,319 --> 00:17:39,799 Christian worldview is that enough of God's word? Is it 308 00:17:39,920 --> 00:17:42,279 enough to suggest his presence? Or do we need to 309 00:17:42,359 --> 00:17:45,680 have scripture and God's word in these films in your mind? 310 00:17:47,440 --> 00:17:50,400 Speaker 3: Yeah, well, I think there are the two extremes. There 311 00:17:50,440 --> 00:17:53,240 are kind of with faith based where they've one side 312 00:17:53,240 --> 00:17:57,039 of the pendulum where it's all scripture references that I 313 00:17:57,079 --> 00:18:00,279 don't know why, but every faith based movie as a 314 00:18:00,359 --> 00:18:03,880 church scene, there's a girl, there's a dog or something 315 00:18:04,000 --> 00:18:06,559 like that, and then on the other end it's like, Okay, 316 00:18:06,559 --> 00:18:09,759 we're gonna only focus on the art. There's no message whatsoever. 317 00:18:09,839 --> 00:18:12,960 And so I think either extremes are not beneficial, so 318 00:18:13,000 --> 00:18:15,160 we need to be somewhere in the middle, or I 319 00:18:15,160 --> 00:18:18,079 mean there's even a bit of leeway, honestly, because certain things, 320 00:18:18,279 --> 00:18:21,359 certain films are going to tackle different aspects. So if 321 00:18:21,400 --> 00:18:24,559 you have a stronger message, that's totally fine, as long 322 00:18:24,599 --> 00:18:27,440 as it's not we're going to teach people about Jesus 323 00:18:27,519 --> 00:18:30,799 and just have the story on the sidelines. So that's 324 00:18:30,839 --> 00:18:33,880 when there's problems, and then you lose the character arc, 325 00:18:34,400 --> 00:18:40,279 you lose the value from just like the hero's journey. 326 00:18:40,559 --> 00:18:43,599 That's when you lose people's investment and they're kind of like, 327 00:18:43,640 --> 00:18:46,039 while you're preaching at me, so I'm not really interested 328 00:18:46,079 --> 00:18:50,200 in what happens next. And so that's where if the 329 00:18:50,319 --> 00:18:55,599 message overshadows the actual storytelling, then there's an issue. 330 00:18:56,119 --> 00:18:59,039 Speaker 2: You use the example. And it's interestingly another Jim Cavisa 331 00:18:59,079 --> 00:19:02,759 movie and The Sound of Freedom. Now that's interesting to 332 00:19:02,839 --> 00:19:05,000 me because I didn't recognize that as a horror film. 333 00:19:05,480 --> 00:19:08,000 We promoted it on my radio program and podcasts, and 334 00:19:08,359 --> 00:19:10,720 so I guess, full disclosure, we got paid to do that. 335 00:19:10,839 --> 00:19:15,559 But I still love the movie. I didn't recognize it 336 00:19:15,599 --> 00:19:20,160 as horror, but I'm curious, ay you do. And b 337 00:19:21,559 --> 00:19:24,000 I'm trying to recall the film if I felt that 338 00:19:24,200 --> 00:19:29,000 faith was really clear in that I mean, And so 339 00:19:29,079 --> 00:19:30,880 I mean, you tell me, because you use the example, 340 00:19:31,160 --> 00:19:33,440 do you think that has enough faith in it to 341 00:19:33,440 --> 00:19:35,960 help bring people to Christ? And why do you think 342 00:19:35,960 --> 00:19:36,720 it's a horror film? 343 00:19:38,720 --> 00:19:38,839 Speaker 1: Well? 344 00:19:38,880 --> 00:19:42,759 Speaker 3: I think first I used that as an example because 345 00:19:42,960 --> 00:19:46,519 the way when I'm tackling horror, I have to kind 346 00:19:46,519 --> 00:19:49,720 of bring it around to the presuppositions, because people immediately 347 00:19:49,720 --> 00:19:53,480 have issues with portraying darkness. And so I used that 348 00:19:53,559 --> 00:19:56,920 film as an example, not because it's horror per se, 349 00:19:57,440 --> 00:20:01,640 but because the concepts used in it are very taboo, 350 00:20:02,079 --> 00:20:07,160 very dark, disturbing, and when we are talking about films 351 00:20:07,240 --> 00:20:10,839 like horror that use darker aspects, I think it helps 352 00:20:10,880 --> 00:20:14,039 to be able to compare it to something that people 353 00:20:14,160 --> 00:20:17,359 are able to see more clearly, because horror as it 354 00:20:17,440 --> 00:20:21,960 is today is definitely more obscured and definitely a little blurry. 355 00:20:22,400 --> 00:20:26,440 So using Sound of Freedom, where it's talking about the 356 00:20:26,559 --> 00:20:29,680 protection of children who are being trafficked and having to 357 00:20:29,839 --> 00:20:32,759 destroy the evil men that are doing these things, I 358 00:20:32,799 --> 00:20:35,920 think it makes the message very clear that this is 359 00:20:36,039 --> 00:20:40,039 not just gore porn or this is not like being 360 00:20:40,119 --> 00:20:42,920 disgusting for the sake of being disgusting. They have an 361 00:20:42,920 --> 00:20:45,680 obvious message in there, which is, you know, we need 362 00:20:45,720 --> 00:20:47,680 to protect these kids, we need to defend them at 363 00:20:47,680 --> 00:20:50,359 all costs. But the way they do it is through 364 00:20:50,359 --> 00:20:53,839 this man who is discovering all these things and going 365 00:20:53,880 --> 00:20:57,400 on these operations to try and rescue these children. And 366 00:20:57,920 --> 00:21:00,839 I think through that it's kind of like how God 367 00:21:00,960 --> 00:21:04,279 is the ultimate protector and provider. This man is kind 368 00:21:04,319 --> 00:21:06,680 of embodying that and being like, I'm going to protect 369 00:21:06,720 --> 00:21:09,559 these kids. I need to protect them at all costs, 370 00:21:10,039 --> 00:21:14,119 And so you see his journey through that. And one 371 00:21:14,160 --> 00:21:16,359 of my favorite lines from that, which I just thought 372 00:21:16,799 --> 00:21:20,039 it was so awesome, was one of the one of 373 00:21:20,039 --> 00:21:21,799 the guys just asking them, hey, why are you why 374 00:21:21,799 --> 00:21:24,039 are you doing this? You know, they're at a at 375 00:21:24,079 --> 00:21:28,759 some sort of underground place in Mexico, and he's like, well, 376 00:21:28,920 --> 00:21:33,000 God's children aren't for sale, and so yeah, even through 377 00:21:33,119 --> 00:21:35,440 like even through all that, you can see, yeah, this 378 00:21:35,519 --> 00:21:38,160 is a Christian guy, Christian dude. But it's nowhere in 379 00:21:38,200 --> 00:21:39,839 the film preached at you. It's just kind of like, 380 00:21:39,880 --> 00:21:41,400 this is just who this character is. 381 00:21:41,680 --> 00:21:41,920 Speaker 1: Yeah. 382 00:21:42,400 --> 00:21:47,440 Speaker 2: So that was a tagline for the film too, right, Yeah, yeah, goosebumps. 383 00:21:47,680 --> 00:21:47,960 Speaker 1: Yeah. 384 00:21:48,039 --> 00:21:50,960 Speaker 2: I got to interview the director of that movie and 385 00:21:51,000 --> 00:21:54,559 that was very interesting, and he's he's seen a lot, 386 00:21:55,200 --> 00:21:57,680 clearly seen a lot. I guess I would have liked 387 00:21:57,680 --> 00:22:00,200 to see maybe more, just maybe one example or two 388 00:22:00,200 --> 00:22:02,839 examples of prayer in that. And you know, it's all 389 00:22:03,039 --> 00:22:04,880 always easy as a non filmmaker to go, oh, you 390 00:22:04,880 --> 00:22:07,240 should have done this, and I'm probably wrong. I want 391 00:22:07,279 --> 00:22:10,079 to talk about The Walking Dead. But first, and I 392 00:22:10,119 --> 00:22:15,400 don't know if you've seen this movie, Nefarious, so that's 393 00:22:15,440 --> 00:22:19,839 based on the and I we'll call the nefarious plots, 394 00:22:19,920 --> 00:22:24,000 and that was Steve Deese's book. Now to me and 395 00:22:24,079 --> 00:22:28,039 I see this describes as screw tape meets hannibal lecture. 396 00:22:28,039 --> 00:22:31,640 I've never seen that before. That's exactly right. Not necessarily 397 00:22:31,720 --> 00:22:34,920 horror because I don't know that there's much bloodiness in it, 398 00:22:36,200 --> 00:22:41,640 But to me, that was perhaps maybe the most effective 399 00:22:41,640 --> 00:22:47,079 thing I've seen at really explaining spiritual warfare from the 400 00:22:47,079 --> 00:22:50,359 point of view of a demon and a great twist 401 00:22:50,440 --> 00:22:53,640 ending we won't give away, but your response to that movie, 402 00:22:53,680 --> 00:22:56,599 you think that was effective and well done. And I 403 00:22:56,640 --> 00:22:58,039 don't know if you classified as horror. 404 00:22:59,599 --> 00:23:04,599 Speaker 3: Yeah, yes, it's kind of edging into that territory maybe, uh, 405 00:23:04,880 --> 00:23:08,039 psychological horror or at the at the very at the 406 00:23:08,119 --> 00:23:11,799 very least like a thriller. Yeah, I think, uh, there 407 00:23:11,839 --> 00:23:15,079 there are some parts that I think you could tell 408 00:23:15,319 --> 00:23:17,119 that it was a bit of a on, a bit 409 00:23:17,119 --> 00:23:19,920 of a shoe string budget or or some of the 410 00:23:19,960 --> 00:23:22,680 things kind of like could have done that a bit better. 411 00:23:22,799 --> 00:23:26,960 But I would say what the film mastered was the 412 00:23:27,039 --> 00:23:30,160 dialogue from the demon. It was there's some of those 413 00:23:30,200 --> 00:23:33,359 parts gave me chills. It was it was amazing. The 414 00:23:33,400 --> 00:23:36,920 actor who played the part, he's great, And then they 415 00:23:36,960 --> 00:23:39,680 also did such an amazing job of making you feel 416 00:23:39,680 --> 00:23:43,240 bad for the guy who's possessed, and you you can 417 00:23:43,279 --> 00:23:47,079 see like he's being he's going to eventually you know, 418 00:23:47,119 --> 00:23:50,599 he's on death row and he obviously doesn't want that 419 00:23:50,720 --> 00:23:53,759 to happen because you can see. Actually it's kind of 420 00:23:53,799 --> 00:23:55,960 like then it's the negative character arc where he went 421 00:23:55,960 --> 00:23:59,480 from uh this one, you know, point A and slowly 422 00:23:59,519 --> 00:24:02,680 going down because he allowed this, He opened a door 423 00:24:02,759 --> 00:24:06,039 for the enemy, and now this demon has possessed him 424 00:24:06,599 --> 00:24:08,519 and he's doing things that he doesn't want to do 425 00:24:09,079 --> 00:24:12,599 because he's invited that demon in. And so I think 426 00:24:12,880 --> 00:24:15,920 from that perspective where you're really getting inside the head 427 00:24:16,359 --> 00:24:18,960 of the person who is possessed, was very bone chilling. 428 00:24:19,720 --> 00:24:22,240 And just the dialogue between the two guys, between the 429 00:24:22,279 --> 00:24:25,200 investigator and the demon, Yeah, it was phenomenal. 430 00:24:25,319 --> 00:24:26,960 Speaker 2: Yeah, And there's a and I won't give it away 431 00:24:27,160 --> 00:24:29,880 because a lot of people have not seen it. There's 432 00:24:29,920 --> 00:24:33,440 a twist in the end where you're very very happy 433 00:24:33,480 --> 00:24:35,960 for one of the characters, very very happy they're saved, 434 00:24:36,039 --> 00:24:39,319 but then are they And because Satan doesn't give up, 435 00:24:39,319 --> 00:24:41,880 he'll come back on another form of attack. Hey, maybe 436 00:24:41,920 --> 00:24:43,880 I'll use your pride. Last time I used your fear, 437 00:24:43,960 --> 00:24:46,039 I use your lust. I'm going to use these things. 438 00:24:46,480 --> 00:24:50,640 When you establish actual corporate credits, you create a cloak 439 00:24:50,680 --> 00:24:55,359 over yourself. Actual corporate credit. You have a corporation that 440 00:24:55,440 --> 00:24:58,599 people would have to sue rather than you. And if 441 00:24:58,640 --> 00:25:01,799 you're doing your job right and you're exercising fiduciary duty, 442 00:25:02,079 --> 00:25:05,440 it's very difficult to pierce the corporate veil to go 443 00:25:05,519 --> 00:25:10,720 after an executive of a company. So big corporations, this 444 00:25:10,799 --> 00:25:13,359 is one of the things their CFOs do. They set 445 00:25:13,400 --> 00:25:15,880 up corporate credit. They steward that it grows a lot 446 00:25:15,920 --> 00:25:18,720 more quickly than personal credit. It becomes a lot more 447 00:25:18,799 --> 00:25:22,880 useful for managing cash flow and making investments and dealing 448 00:25:22,920 --> 00:25:25,599 with emergencies. So those of us who are small to 449 00:25:25,640 --> 00:25:29,200 medium sized business owners, here's what the banks do. They 450 00:25:29,200 --> 00:25:33,480 make it seem like they're extending its corporate credit because 451 00:25:33,480 --> 00:25:36,559 our debit cards say our business name on them, or 452 00:25:36,599 --> 00:25:39,279 our credit cards say our business na on But that's 453 00:25:39,319 --> 00:25:41,960 not corporate credit. That is personal credit because it's tied 454 00:25:41,960 --> 00:25:44,240 to your Social Security number. So how do you divorce 455 00:25:44,279 --> 00:25:47,039 the two. Well, one option is to hire a bunch 456 00:25:47,079 --> 00:25:50,519 of accountants and lawyers, tax lawyers. They can get that done. 457 00:25:50,680 --> 00:25:53,119 Or no one wants to do that. Do it on 458 00:25:53,119 --> 00:25:55,759 your own. No one has the time. Here's an easy way. 459 00:25:55,799 --> 00:26:00,720 It's a website gobisible dot com. Goo Bisible like business 460 00:26:00,759 --> 00:26:03,559 b I z A b l E. They will do 461 00:26:03,599 --> 00:26:06,079 this for you in seven easy steps. They handle ninety 462 00:26:06,119 --> 00:26:09,079 percent of the work that have you do a little 463 00:26:09,079 --> 00:26:11,720 bit on their website, but they handle everything else. I'll 464 00:26:11,759 --> 00:26:14,039 make you guarantee when you go to the website, which 465 00:26:14,079 --> 00:26:16,640 is go bisible b I z A b l E. 466 00:26:16,759 --> 00:26:19,599 Go Bisible, when you go to their website and sign up, 467 00:26:19,599 --> 00:26:22,000 they're going to give you a free, no obligation consultation. 468 00:26:22,079 --> 00:26:24,319 Here's my guarantee. You're going to learn something about your 469 00:26:24,359 --> 00:26:27,039 business and about corporate credit. You'll probably learn something about 470 00:26:27,039 --> 00:26:29,599 your business is credit rating because even if you don't 471 00:26:29,599 --> 00:26:32,119 have corporate credit, guess what, you have a credit rating, 472 00:26:32,160 --> 00:26:34,799 probably two of them and they're probably not great. So 473 00:26:34,920 --> 00:26:38,279 get that fixed as well. The website is go bisible 474 00:26:38,359 --> 00:26:42,359 b I z A b l E go bisible dot com. 475 00:26:43,079 --> 00:26:47,880 So let me talk about then the Walking Dead, because 476 00:26:47,880 --> 00:26:51,319 I saw you use this image in the video that 477 00:26:51,359 --> 00:26:54,759 we've shared with people where you make the case that 478 00:26:54,839 --> 00:26:57,519 the horror genre should be Christian, that we should be 479 00:26:57,559 --> 00:27:00,920 investing in this, and it's a nice of case you make. 480 00:27:02,000 --> 00:27:04,960 I started to watch The Walking Dead because some family 481 00:27:04,960 --> 00:27:07,319 members were and I thought it was going to be 482 00:27:07,400 --> 00:27:12,000 violence porn period zombie porn, and there was clearly some 483 00:27:12,119 --> 00:27:15,680 of that. I mean, it's very bloody, very gory. But 484 00:27:15,759 --> 00:27:20,039 I found myself in about the fourth or fifth season 485 00:27:20,359 --> 00:27:23,440 when they be when they started to introduce some moral 486 00:27:23,480 --> 00:27:26,519 dilemmas and then the character Nagan, who I rate as 487 00:27:26,559 --> 00:27:33,119 the greatest villain in sort of episodic TV history for 488 00:27:33,279 --> 00:27:36,720 many reasons. But there was this discussion with Rick Grimes 489 00:27:36,839 --> 00:27:40,519 of as they were building the quote New World, will 490 00:27:40,559 --> 00:27:45,839 my mercy or my wrath prevail? And this was in 491 00:27:45,880 --> 00:27:50,680 regard to Nagan, who was this terrible villain, great beautiful 492 00:27:50,680 --> 00:27:53,599 acting job within a beautiful but very effective, great acting job. 493 00:27:54,000 --> 00:27:57,279 And they've they've captured him and he's in jail and 494 00:27:57,319 --> 00:28:00,880 there's talk of hey death row and and Rick Crimes 495 00:28:00,920 --> 00:28:03,599 has this discussion with his friends and with himself, and 496 00:28:03,640 --> 00:28:06,359 it seems to me, by the way writer, it seems 497 00:28:06,359 --> 00:28:08,240 to me he's having it with God because he's having 498 00:28:08,319 --> 00:28:13,160 in visions and dreams, and he's given prophetic vision. He 499 00:28:13,359 --> 00:28:17,200 sees the future where Megan raises his son, not Rick, 500 00:28:18,640 --> 00:28:21,200 and he offers that thought, will my mercy or my 501 00:28:21,240 --> 00:28:26,079 wrath prevail? And that's something that we who fear the Lord, 502 00:28:27,279 --> 00:28:30,039 we better keep that in mind, because the Bible speaks 503 00:28:30,039 --> 00:28:32,519 of the last days and that wrath is going to 504 00:28:32,559 --> 00:28:34,720 be poured out. Those of us in the Book of 505 00:28:34,759 --> 00:28:37,200 Life one way or the other, pre trip, post, et cetera, 506 00:28:37,319 --> 00:28:40,240 were saved. But what do you make of the movie 507 00:28:40,359 --> 00:28:43,000 The Walking Dead? I mean, it's clearly horror. Rather the 508 00:28:43,079 --> 00:28:44,799 series The Walking Dead, it's clearly horror. 509 00:28:44,880 --> 00:28:50,039 Speaker 3: I think, yes, yeah, it really is. It's the reason 510 00:28:50,240 --> 00:28:53,839 I got turned onto that series was my parents introduced 511 00:28:53,839 --> 00:28:57,880 me to it because they said there are some amazing 512 00:28:59,680 --> 00:29:03,359 sitch situations that the characters go through that provoke you 513 00:29:03,400 --> 00:29:06,359 to wrestle with it and to try and figure out 514 00:29:06,400 --> 00:29:09,640 what you would do with that situation. And so as 515 00:29:09,680 --> 00:29:12,880 you're experiencing this with the characters, I would point to, 516 00:29:13,000 --> 00:29:18,039 like the first two seasons especially, you're experiencing all of 517 00:29:18,039 --> 00:29:21,359 these situations with the characters, and you're having to experience 518 00:29:21,400 --> 00:29:26,240 the pain and experience the situation of this is a 519 00:29:26,319 --> 00:29:29,200 difficult decision. Do I make it or do I not? 520 00:29:29,319 --> 00:29:32,920 Or is there another alternative? And so what the series 521 00:29:33,200 --> 00:29:37,359 did masterfully is they are forcing you to wrestle with 522 00:29:37,440 --> 00:29:41,200 this yourself. And so what they could have done is, Okay, 523 00:29:42,160 --> 00:29:46,599 Rick Grimes is encountering this little girl who's a zombie. 524 00:29:47,000 --> 00:29:49,839 If she bites him, he's dead. But and then they 525 00:29:49,920 --> 00:29:52,480 lecture about it. But that's not what they do. They 526 00:29:52,920 --> 00:29:55,480 play it out and Rick Grimes he's standing there like, 527 00:29:55,759 --> 00:29:57,400 what do I do. I have a gun, I need 528 00:29:57,440 --> 00:30:00,839 to defend myself, but this is a little girl, and 529 00:30:00,880 --> 00:30:04,480 so you're wrestling with that alongside him, which I think 530 00:30:05,079 --> 00:30:09,680 is masterful because now you're experiencing what he's experiencing, and 531 00:30:10,160 --> 00:30:14,240 even from a neurological level. Sarah Murray, who did a 532 00:30:14,240 --> 00:30:16,880 TED talk, she did a good job of talking about 533 00:30:16,960 --> 00:30:23,640 the psychological aspects of it, where you are physically experiencing 534 00:30:23,680 --> 00:30:26,799 it with the person on a psychological level and you're 535 00:30:26,799 --> 00:30:30,519 connecting with them emotionally. And so that's one reason why 536 00:30:30,559 --> 00:30:33,759 storytelling is so powerful and why I pointed to Walking 537 00:30:33,799 --> 00:30:38,000 Dead is because you're literally experiencing it with the characters 538 00:30:38,000 --> 00:30:41,000 step by step and so when they go through a breakup, 539 00:30:41,079 --> 00:30:43,359 you feel the pain. When there's a villain, you feel 540 00:30:43,359 --> 00:30:43,799 the terror. 541 00:30:44,039 --> 00:30:47,240 Speaker 2: Yeah, And I would point to some other moments in 542 00:30:47,240 --> 00:30:51,759 this series where where Rick and the team they defeat 543 00:30:52,039 --> 00:30:56,240 a series of very bad people and they go to 544 00:30:56,279 --> 00:31:00,720 a place that's called, Oh, it's the train state that's 545 00:31:00,759 --> 00:31:04,799 been they've been promoting to the world as a sanctuary, 546 00:31:04,799 --> 00:31:07,920 and that had a name for it. It's terminous, terminous. 547 00:31:08,680 --> 00:31:10,880 And they go to this train station and oh, it's 548 00:31:10,960 --> 00:31:14,880 protected and it's fenced and people have food and it's 549 00:31:14,920 --> 00:31:19,519 civil and they go in, they break in, you know, 550 00:31:19,799 --> 00:31:22,640 recon and it turns out, of course, this place is horrible. 551 00:31:23,200 --> 00:31:26,200 It is at that point the worst evil you've seen. 552 00:31:26,720 --> 00:31:30,119 They con people to come in, they make them comfortable, 553 00:31:30,160 --> 00:31:32,880 and then they unlive them, and then they consume them. 554 00:31:33,480 --> 00:31:35,920 And they come to realize this and they're just about 555 00:31:36,000 --> 00:31:42,480 unalived in a terrible, terrible Holocaust type way. They get out, 556 00:31:42,519 --> 00:31:45,039 of course, but they get out violently, and they get 557 00:31:45,119 --> 00:31:47,160 help from without, you know, you speak of the hero's journey. 558 00:31:47,200 --> 00:31:49,759 They were in the darkest cave, they got help from without. 559 00:31:50,440 --> 00:31:53,839 They escape, and then they they're confronted by the guy 560 00:31:53,839 --> 00:31:57,519 who ran that place in a church, and it is 561 00:31:57,559 --> 00:32:02,599 in a church where Ricky in a brutal fashion on 562 00:32:02,720 --> 00:32:06,359 a live as the leader of that you know that 563 00:32:06,519 --> 00:32:10,680 that movement, And as a viewer, I'm looking at that rider, going, Okay, 564 00:32:10,720 --> 00:32:16,559 that's it. That's they've defeated the the evil somewhere not 565 00:32:16,720 --> 00:32:20,039 far from there, not long. They took their skills they 566 00:32:20,160 --> 00:32:26,480 developed in defense of themselves and they became mercenaries. And 567 00:32:26,519 --> 00:32:28,880 this is when they met the people at Hilltop and said, sure, 568 00:32:28,920 --> 00:32:30,640 we'll give you some food, but we need you to 569 00:32:30,839 --> 00:32:36,200 neutralize this enemy called Megan. And they went in and 570 00:32:36,240 --> 00:32:39,480 they did that at night to people sleeping, and that 571 00:32:39,640 --> 00:32:43,039 was the turn. Now you're going to see the biggest 572 00:32:43,039 --> 00:32:45,200 evil you've ever seen in the form of Megan, who 573 00:32:45,279 --> 00:32:49,160 enjoys being evil. And to me, that was so much 574 00:32:49,599 --> 00:32:53,880 God's messages. This was righteous. These people were cannibals. That 575 00:32:54,000 --> 00:32:58,599 was righteous. Your son was just about destroyed by these men. 576 00:32:59,119 --> 00:33:01,119 And rick did a very violent thing with his teeth, 577 00:33:01,119 --> 00:33:05,480 and that was righteous. But that was not righteous. You 578 00:33:05,599 --> 00:33:09,599 snuck into a room and you unlive people. And so 579 00:33:09,799 --> 00:33:13,000 I can talk to full of Christians about this and say, 580 00:33:13,039 --> 00:33:15,880 this is an examination of us in a way absent 581 00:33:15,960 --> 00:33:18,480 God trying to build our own world. But was there 582 00:33:18,519 --> 00:33:20,960 anything from that that you took to be faith affirming 583 00:33:21,039 --> 00:33:23,440 in that series as you're pointed to it by your 584 00:33:23,480 --> 00:33:25,960 parents and as a well developed young Christian man, was 585 00:33:26,000 --> 00:33:28,759 there anything you took out of that to be affirming 586 00:33:29,039 --> 00:33:31,519 of our faith, our common faith in Christ. 587 00:33:35,119 --> 00:33:40,079 Speaker 3: Well, when I think of how here's one of the 588 00:33:40,119 --> 00:33:42,759 things I think of, which is the way that Rick 589 00:33:43,119 --> 00:33:45,599 pulls everyone together in a sort of team, in a 590 00:33:45,640 --> 00:33:49,519 sort of fashion, which I think you could say parallels 591 00:33:49,559 --> 00:33:52,680 to how we as Christians need to pull together to 592 00:33:52,680 --> 00:33:56,079 be able to make the kinds of films and stories 593 00:33:56,119 --> 00:33:59,680 that people will Enjoyah. So I think that might be 594 00:33:59,680 --> 00:34:03,720 a bit of a more abstract example, but I think 595 00:34:04,039 --> 00:34:08,000 some of these little details in shows like this there. 596 00:34:08,159 --> 00:34:10,719 I'd say that for me that show was very more 597 00:34:10,760 --> 00:34:12,800 and much more on a personal level where I'm seeing, 598 00:34:14,119 --> 00:34:16,960 like identifying with Rick and he's kind of in this 599 00:34:17,440 --> 00:34:20,159 new world where it's like there's all these new terrors 600 00:34:20,159 --> 00:34:24,800 and dangers, and especially connecting with his son and connecting 601 00:34:24,800 --> 00:34:28,159 with his wife and going through that with them. I thought, 602 00:34:28,400 --> 00:34:31,039 as like the family unit. I think for me, the 603 00:34:31,800 --> 00:34:34,039 journey together as a family that they had was one 604 00:34:34,079 --> 00:34:37,639 of the most powerful things as they're going through these experiences. 605 00:34:37,719 --> 00:34:40,079 And I won't give spoilers, but you know, there's some 606 00:34:40,199 --> 00:34:44,960 very tough things that eventually that Carl has to do 607 00:34:46,599 --> 00:34:50,239 and in order to like defend the people around him, 608 00:34:49,559 --> 00:34:52,000 and and there are some, you know, there's some very 609 00:34:52,360 --> 00:34:56,119 terrifying moments. And so I think on a very personal level, 610 00:34:56,960 --> 00:35:00,280 it's affirming to see these people going through this Ernie. 611 00:35:00,800 --> 00:35:04,119 You're growing with them, you're experiencing the trials and errors 612 00:35:04,159 --> 00:35:06,800 that they're going through, and as a person, you're developing. 613 00:35:07,280 --> 00:35:10,039 Speaker 2: And so yeah, yeah, I was gonna point to one 614 00:35:10,039 --> 00:35:12,800 thing because you just remind me this, Carl. There is 615 00:35:12,840 --> 00:35:14,840 a scene in one of the in one of the 616 00:35:14,840 --> 00:35:18,840 episodes where a character is called to sacrifice a limb 617 00:35:18,920 --> 00:35:24,639 of his son. Do you remember what I'm talking about it? Okay, 618 00:35:24,639 --> 00:35:27,559 I'll just give it away. It's a Rick is is 619 00:35:27,760 --> 00:35:30,119 Meagan is going to make Rick cut off Carl's hand? 620 00:35:31,679 --> 00:35:35,920 And okay, okay, and and and and that was so 621 00:35:36,000 --> 00:35:38,840 well acted. And I've heard this story that they were 622 00:35:38,920 --> 00:35:40,960 up for like forty eight hours and the guy who 623 00:35:41,000 --> 00:35:43,039 played me Egan was constantly picking on the guy who 624 00:35:43,079 --> 00:35:46,199 played Rick Grimes, you know, pushing him, being rude to him, 625 00:35:46,239 --> 00:35:50,800 staying in character, really just annoying him, and everybody was exhausted. 626 00:35:51,159 --> 00:35:53,679 But I've said to Christian friends, watch that and then 627 00:35:53,760 --> 00:35:57,039 step back and think about God and his son quote. 628 00:35:57,079 --> 00:35:59,960 I mean, all Rick had to do was cut his 629 00:36:00,079 --> 00:36:06,119 son's hand off, that's all. And then everybody lives and 630 00:36:06,280 --> 00:36:08,559 he couldn't, I mean, and Karl was trying to talk 631 00:36:08,639 --> 00:36:10,559 him into it. And then take that to the bigger 632 00:36:10,599 --> 00:36:14,039 picture of God's son and what Jesus went through and 633 00:36:14,039 --> 00:36:16,840 what that must have done to God the Father to 634 00:36:17,159 --> 00:36:21,039 be doing it, and then we as we believe in 635 00:36:21,039 --> 00:36:24,000 the try and God having it done to him. That 636 00:36:24,079 --> 00:36:28,000 was remarkable to me. The soap you use contains chemicals 637 00:36:28,039 --> 00:36:29,719 in all likelihood, Just pick up the next time you 638 00:36:29,760 --> 00:36:32,119 go buy the stink and stuff. Just look at the package. 639 00:36:32,760 --> 00:36:34,679 If you can't pronounce something in it, put it back 640 00:36:34,679 --> 00:36:37,880 and buy Alan's soap. It's really that easy, Or just 641 00:36:37,960 --> 00:36:40,679 do this. Do you know the practices of the company 642 00:36:40,719 --> 00:36:42,920 from whom you buy the soap? Do they care about 643 00:36:42,920 --> 00:36:45,239 all lives mattering? Do they care about life? Do they 644 00:36:45,280 --> 00:36:47,119 care about human life? Do they make their products here 645 00:36:48,480 --> 00:36:51,440 Alan's is made in America. It is all natural, there 646 00:36:51,440 --> 00:36:53,440 are no chemicals in it. It's made by a family 647 00:36:53,480 --> 00:36:56,320 with three generations of soap making expertise, and it has 648 00:36:56,360 --> 00:36:59,480 a mission far greater than providing you world class soap, 649 00:37:00,280 --> 00:37:03,159 that is to employ young people like Alan and Ian 650 00:37:03,639 --> 00:37:09,679 and Amy, people very very very severely affected by autism, 651 00:37:10,199 --> 00:37:12,599 Alan being the most extreme case, and that he truly 652 00:37:12,719 --> 00:37:16,440 is nonverbal, unlike Tim Waltz's kid, who actually is very verbal, 653 00:37:16,559 --> 00:37:20,400 not nonverbal. So go to Alan Soaps dot com slash todd. 654 00:37:20,400 --> 00:37:23,800 That's Alan Soaps dot com slash Todd. Use promo code 655 00:37:23,800 --> 00:37:25,639 Todd to get temper sent off all their products and 656 00:37:25,719 --> 00:37:29,079 feel better about washing your body. Alan Soaps dot com 657 00:37:29,119 --> 00:37:32,480 slash todd. Let me ask you about your work, because 658 00:37:32,679 --> 00:37:36,679 you're a young man clearly, do you feel God called 659 00:37:36,800 --> 00:37:39,800 you to be an I don't know that you're just 660 00:37:39,800 --> 00:37:42,159 gonna be a horror filmmaker or thrillers or maybe there's 661 00:37:42,199 --> 00:37:45,599 other genres you want to pursue, but a do you 662 00:37:45,639 --> 00:37:47,599 feel God called you to do that? And be how 663 00:37:47,599 --> 00:37:49,519 did He call you to do that? If that's the case, 664 00:37:49,519 --> 00:37:51,239 if you did feel like the Lord called you to do. 665 00:37:51,199 --> 00:37:57,000 Speaker 3: That, yeah, I do feel God has called me to 666 00:37:57,000 --> 00:38:00,480 be a filmmaker. I'm also a musician, so it goes 667 00:38:00,480 --> 00:38:06,280 hand in hand. And yeah, I think as as someone 668 00:38:06,360 --> 00:38:11,039 I see kind of the trajectory of faith based media, 669 00:38:11,199 --> 00:38:14,719 and I'm thinking that there's definitely a gap. There's a 670 00:38:14,760 --> 00:38:18,599 huge gap, actually, and that gap is between faith based 671 00:38:18,679 --> 00:38:22,320 media and then secular media. And so there's a wide 672 00:38:22,400 --> 00:38:25,480 range of things that we have yet to do as Christians, 673 00:38:25,519 --> 00:38:30,800 and especially you know, pointing to Hollywood with them going downhill, 674 00:38:31,199 --> 00:38:34,880 we have an opportunity, I would say, I mean definitely 675 00:38:35,119 --> 00:38:37,239 at this time, and then also in the next ten 676 00:38:37,320 --> 00:38:40,280 years and onward, we have a great opportunity to be 677 00:38:40,320 --> 00:38:43,239 able to enter into the space like we never have before, 678 00:38:43,320 --> 00:38:47,159 because people are looking for stories and characters that they 679 00:38:47,199 --> 00:38:50,280 can connect with, and faith based media, for the most 680 00:38:50,280 --> 00:38:53,079 part isn't providing that, and Hollywood isn't for the most 681 00:38:53,119 --> 00:38:56,280 part providing that either. And so we have an opportunity 682 00:38:56,480 --> 00:39:01,760 to make shows like Thinking of the Matrix, Walking Dead, Braveheart, 683 00:39:02,039 --> 00:39:04,360 all of the great movies that you think of. There 684 00:39:04,360 --> 00:39:06,440 are Christian arts who can make those one hundred percent. 685 00:39:07,119 --> 00:39:09,760 One person said in my comments that Christians are out 686 00:39:09,760 --> 00:39:12,719 of creative juice, when obviously that's not the case. There 687 00:39:12,719 --> 00:39:16,000 are people like Mel Gibson who are creating these amazing 688 00:39:16,039 --> 00:39:18,559 movies that have made hundreds of millions of dollars, if 689 00:39:18,599 --> 00:39:22,760 not billions, And so I think by telling a good story, 690 00:39:23,440 --> 00:39:26,039 that's kind of like he has made a lot of 691 00:39:26,079 --> 00:39:28,679 money by making a good story, and so people when 692 00:39:28,719 --> 00:39:31,800 they connect with those stories, it will be profitable and 693 00:39:31,880 --> 00:39:34,679 you'll be able to see the fruit of that story. 694 00:39:34,920 --> 00:39:37,599 And so I think we have a huge opportunity here. 695 00:39:37,800 --> 00:39:38,039 Speaker 1: Yeah. 696 00:39:38,119 --> 00:39:40,119 Speaker 2: Yeah, And I'm going to close off with one thing, 697 00:39:40,239 --> 00:39:44,599 and that's about the the Amazon series The House of David. 698 00:39:45,440 --> 00:39:45,599 Speaker 1: Yeah. 699 00:39:45,599 --> 00:39:49,599 Speaker 2: So that's done phenomenally well to me in my wife 700 00:39:49,639 --> 00:39:53,119 it was a slow start. We were I think three 701 00:39:53,119 --> 00:39:56,159 episodes into where we finally said, okay, we're buying in. 702 00:39:57,400 --> 00:39:59,320 And there's a fair bit of violence in that movie, 703 00:40:00,239 --> 00:40:05,719 and there's there they portrayed the giants you know in 704 00:40:06,039 --> 00:40:08,719 science fiction any way, and I think it's personally for me, 705 00:40:08,840 --> 00:40:13,119 it had great effects. It didn't seem cheaply made. It 706 00:40:13,159 --> 00:40:17,159 was I thought high production value. I thought high story value, 707 00:40:18,280 --> 00:40:20,679 and exploring the life of David. As you've been reading 708 00:40:22,760 --> 00:40:24,400 a if you watched that and b do you think 709 00:40:24,440 --> 00:40:28,000 that's a good indicator for faith based movies. 710 00:40:29,199 --> 00:40:32,599 Speaker 3: Yeah, I've seen it, Yeah, and I'd say it's definitely 711 00:40:32,760 --> 00:40:34,800 on the right track. I'd agree with you. The first 712 00:40:34,960 --> 00:40:36,719 you know, three episodes is kind of it was a 713 00:40:36,719 --> 00:40:39,599 bit slow. Yeah, there are some The main thing that 714 00:40:39,639 --> 00:40:42,079 I didn't like, probably about the first episode was the 715 00:40:42,119 --> 00:40:44,840 way they positioned God and and it's kind of like 716 00:40:44,920 --> 00:40:47,920 saying from what I recall it was their God or 717 00:40:47,920 --> 00:40:52,559 a kind of like lower yes yes. So that annoyed 718 00:40:52,559 --> 00:40:54,599 me a bit. It was like, just frame it how 719 00:40:54,599 --> 00:40:57,320 it is, don't do the don't do the thing, whereas 720 00:40:57,400 --> 00:41:00,719 like their God as if it's like some other thing, 721 00:41:00,960 --> 00:41:04,400 you know, as if there is another Yeah, right, So 722 00:41:04,440 --> 00:41:06,159 that was that was That was one of the things, 723 00:41:06,280 --> 00:41:09,480 is like, I don't like that. But then later on 724 00:41:09,599 --> 00:41:12,639 they kind of switched their tune kind of, so is 725 00:41:13,519 --> 00:41:15,679 that was? That was the only that was I mean there, 726 00:41:15,760 --> 00:41:17,760 I suppose there are a few other things you could 727 00:41:17,840 --> 00:41:20,599 nippick about, but the way they positioned God in the 728 00:41:20,639 --> 00:41:24,000 first couple episodes, that is it got me. 729 00:41:25,079 --> 00:41:29,199 Speaker 2: Oh oh uh, let me just out for your opportunity 730 00:41:29,199 --> 00:41:31,119 to tell me what's what people see in your short 731 00:41:31,159 --> 00:41:34,960 film that you've made and been inspired to make and 732 00:41:35,440 --> 00:41:36,239 pitch us on that. 733 00:41:37,840 --> 00:41:43,000 Speaker 3: Yeah, So the short film is an experimental exploration of 734 00:41:43,079 --> 00:41:46,639 a story that I'm currently developing. Where I wanted to 735 00:41:46,679 --> 00:41:49,519 see because I haven't really seen other Christians do this 736 00:41:50,480 --> 00:41:53,519 is what is it like to be inside someone's head 737 00:41:53,519 --> 00:41:56,719 when they are going through demonic oppression? And I wanted 738 00:41:56,760 --> 00:42:00,440 to see kind of He starts out on one level, 739 00:42:00,719 --> 00:42:03,039 and because of his belief system and the things that 740 00:42:03,119 --> 00:42:07,320 he thinks he cannot do, he slowly degrades because he 741 00:42:07,400 --> 00:42:09,519 has no light of Christ in his life, and he 742 00:42:09,599 --> 00:42:13,119 has because he doesn't know Christ, and because he's actively 743 00:42:13,199 --> 00:42:16,639 choosing against Christ, he is degrading and he has no 744 00:42:16,679 --> 00:42:18,880 other way to go but down. And so I wanted 745 00:42:18,880 --> 00:42:21,840 to explore that and be able to show kind of 746 00:42:21,840 --> 00:42:25,400 a cautionary tale of what happens when you open a 747 00:42:25,440 --> 00:42:26,920 door to the enemy and you have no way to 748 00:42:26,920 --> 00:42:30,639 close it. So that's, in a nutshell, that's what it's about. 749 00:42:30,920 --> 00:42:32,360 Speaker 2: Do we ever have no way to close it? 750 00:42:33,440 --> 00:42:35,840 Speaker 3: No, there is a way to close it. But this character, 751 00:42:36,400 --> 00:42:39,559 because the way I wanted to explore it was he 752 00:42:39,639 --> 00:42:43,039 actively chooses not to turn to Christ. He actively chooses 753 00:42:43,159 --> 00:42:44,840 and you know, this could be it's not going to 754 00:42:44,880 --> 00:42:46,639 be like and here's the part where he reads the 755 00:42:46,639 --> 00:42:52,199 scripture verse maybe, but you know it's like there's no, yeah, 756 00:42:52,280 --> 00:42:54,039 there's no. A horse comes charging in. 757 00:42:55,400 --> 00:42:58,239 Speaker 2: Kind misunderstood old pastor with the guitar and. 758 00:42:59,280 --> 00:43:04,840 Speaker 3: Yeah, you tune right there. Jesus is now with you. Yeah. 759 00:43:04,880 --> 00:43:08,199 I think kind of with Tolkien, how he wanted to 760 00:43:08,239 --> 00:43:10,920 stay away from the overt stuff. I kind of want 761 00:43:11,039 --> 00:43:15,519 to tell things more symbolically. So yeah, So I think 762 00:43:15,559 --> 00:43:17,800 if you can experience with the character and you see 763 00:43:18,920 --> 00:43:21,039 maybe the light in kind of a symbolic way, just 764 00:43:21,119 --> 00:43:24,360 kind of coming in and pushing away the shadows, then 765 00:43:24,400 --> 00:43:27,239 you can see how because he is able to because 766 00:43:27,280 --> 00:43:30,000 well not just because he's able, but because God has 767 00:43:30,039 --> 00:43:33,800 invited him and he is choosing to walk with the Lord, 768 00:43:34,039 --> 00:43:36,800 he is now able to overcome the darkness. But in 769 00:43:36,840 --> 00:43:38,840 this series he doesn't, and I wanted to show the 770 00:43:38,840 --> 00:43:40,360 consequences of that. Good. 771 00:43:40,480 --> 00:43:43,599 Speaker 2: Well, right, I appreciate you coming on, and it's good 772 00:43:43,639 --> 00:43:45,480 to know their young man serving the Lord in this 773 00:43:45,519 --> 00:43:48,119 way and that I think it's pretty clear that God 774 00:43:48,199 --> 00:43:49,920 calls you with a passion for this and the talent 775 00:43:49,960 --> 00:43:52,880 for it, and I agree with you if she'd invest 776 00:43:52,880 --> 00:43:55,000 in that space and appreciate you coming on Tod Hermit Show. 777 00:43:55,000 --> 00:43:57,360 Speaker 3: Thank you very much, right yeah, my pleasure. 778 00:43:57,960 --> 00:44:01,119 Speaker 2: This is a Todd Hermit show. Please go well, be strong, 779 00:44:01,239 --> 00:44:03,760 be kind, and make the affirmative choice to walk in 780 00:44:03,840 --> 00:44:04,639 the light of Christ.