Speaker 1: What's up everyone, and welcome back to the Epstein Chronicles.
In this episode, we're gonna pick up where we left
off with a Johanna Schoberg deposition. So let's just dive
right back in and pick up where we left off, Menager.
And then when you got into Manhattan, how did it
come to be that you were doing some sight seeing? Answer? Well,
they knew that I had never been, so I believe
Jeffrey asked the driver and Emmy just to drive me
around to see the Empire State Building. That's all I remember.
It was late, it was dark. It wasn't long, maybe
thirty minutes. Manager. When you got back to the house,
what happened? Answer? I walked in the front door, and
Golaine stuck her head over the grand staircase and asked
me to come upstairs into the living room. Menager. And
can you describe the living room? Answer? Oh, it was
very large and very formal. And Jeffrey and to her
and Virginia and Prince Andrew were there, Menager. And what
were they all doing when you came in? Answer? Just socializing.
I don't remember them doing it activity. It was just
being together, Menager. Was anyone unclothed. Answer no, Menager. Was
this the same room where Jeffrey had a desk? Answer
it could have been, but I can't remember. Menager. Did
you go to New York more than one time? Answer yes, Menager.
How many times did you go to New York? Answer
two times? Menager. This was the only time that you
met Prince Andrew in New York though? Answer yes, Menager.
When you came upstairs, where was Virginia sitting? Answer I
don't remember, Menager. Do you remember what she was wearing?
Answer no, Menager, she was already there when you got
back from sight seeing. Answer yes, Menager. Tell me what
happened with the caricature. Answer Golen asked me to come
to a closet. She just said, come with me. We
went to a closet and grabbed the puppet and the
puppet of Prince Andrew. And I knew it was Prince
Andrew because I had recognized him as a person. I
didn't know who he was, and so when I saw
the tag that said Prince Andrew, then it clicked. I'm like,
that's who it is. And we went down back down
to the living room and she brought it in. It
was just funny because he thought it was funny because
it was of him. Menager, tell me how it came
to be that there was a picture taken McAuley objection, Shoberg.
I just remember someone suggesting a photo, and they told
us to get on the couch, and so Andrew and
Virginia sat on the couch, and they put the puppet,
the puppet on her lap, and so then I sat
on Andrew's lap, and I believe on my own volition,
and they took the puppet's hands and put it on
Virginia's breast, and so Andrew put his on mine. Menager,
and this was done in a joking manner. McCauley objection Shoburg, Yes, Menager.
Do you recall a photo being taken of that event?
Answer yes, Menager, you've never seen that photo. Answer no, Menager,
you don't know whose camera it was. Answer no, Menager,
Virginia was sitting on a couch next to Andrew, not
in a big leather armchair. Answer maybe, I'm just trying
to remember how I remember it. Manager, to the best
of your recollection, you went and sat on Andrew's lap
correct answer yes, Manager on his knee. Answer yes, Menager,
and Virginia was not sitting on his knee. Correct answer.
I don't recall. I just remember I was. She might
have been on his other knee like Sanna. I don't remember. Manager.
After that, do you remember any other pieces of that
social engagement? Answer? No, manager. Do you know where you
went Schoberg? From there? I went to bed? Manager? Were
people drinking? Answer? No manager. Did you hear Glenn Maxwell
told Virginia to do anything while you were in that room? Answer?
No manager. Do you recall what happened the next day
in New York? Answer bits? I mean that was the
day I went to Victoria's secret. I went and walked
around by myself, and I went to a souvenir shop
and got a mug or something. That's all I recall. Menager,
Did you go anywhere with Virginia? Answer? Oh my gosh, yes,
we went to Phantom of the Opera? Manager. Who else went? Answer?
I think it was just she and I. I forgot
about that. Thank you for that memory, menager, it's my job.
Anything else you remember about that day in New York? Answer? No, manager.
You said you had given a massage to Jeffrey while
they were on their trip, or was it a subsequent trip.
Answer that trip, Menager? And how did that come to be? Answer?
Either he or somebody asked me to go and do it.
Someone showed me to the room, but I don't remember
who it was. Menager. Can you describe that room? Answer? Yes.
It was a high ceiling, dark red walls or dark
blue walls or dark blue carpeting or something. It had
a massage table set up in the middle, and there
was a large I want to say, like a fifteen
foot photo either photo or a painting of a naked girl. Menager.
Pornographic or artistic? Answer No, No, I wouldn't say pornographic,
more artistic Menager. Artistic? Was Galaine present during the massage?
Answer no? Manager did something about that particular massage session
stand out to you? Answer yes, that was when I
first was asked to squeeze and rub his nipples while
he pleasured himself. Manager. And did he say that's what
he was going to do? Answer he yes, he was
just very blunt about it. He said, rub my nipples,
I'm going to jerk off. I was like, no done, manager,
and you walked out? Answer I did, Manager? Were there
any repercussions for you were walking out. Answer amazingly, no,
knowing what I know now, I'm surprised I was ever
called back. But no, I just stood my ground and
walked out. I'm not comfortable with that. Menager. Do you
know personally whether anyone else has said that to him? Answer? No, manager.
Did anyone ever tell you that they had been in
a massage scenario? And told? No? Answer? No manager. Do
you recall when in your trip the massage occurred? Answer well,
it was not the day we landed. It must have
been the next day that we were there. Menager, Do
you remember anything else about Virginia from that trip other
than Prince Andrew thing and the Phantom of the Opera?
Answer well, we were getting ready to leave to go
to the airport, and we were waiting. She and I
sat on the steps in the foyer. I do remember
just kind of asking a few questions to try to
understand her role, because at that point now I knew
what he wanted from me in the massage, and but
she did not make it clear to me that she
was participating in that. So I was prodding gently to
see if there was anything happening that shouldn't have been,
because I was getting the impression that she was. She
told me she was seventeen. Manager, she told you she
was seventeen. Answer uh huh, Menager, How did that come up? Answer?
I asked her manager. Was anyone else present during the conversation?
Answer no, Manager. You mentioned in your earlier testimony that
she seemed orphan like answer yes, Menager, But you said
that was something you had said to miss McCauley. Correct
answer correct, Manager, that was not said at the time.
Answer right, No. At the time, I was getting an
impression that she did not have a family or had
walked away from her family, and it seemed to me,
you know, they had just sort of adopted her, not
as a child, but they would take care of her.
Men Did you observe anyone speaking to her as a
child like make up your bed? Answer no me. Did
you observe whether she was using drugs during that trip?
Answer no McCauley objection. Manager. Did you ever observe her
using drugs? Answer not that I recall, Menager. Did she
ever tell you that she was using xanax? Answer no, Manager.
Cocaine answer no manager. Ecstasy answer no, Menager, heroine answer
no Manager. When was the second trip you took to
New York. Answer later, maybe two thousand and five. I
don't know. I could look in the flight record. Menager,
that's all right. Answer I don't remember exactly. Manager, you
just recall it being several years so after. Answer yes,
several years later. Manager, And just so I'm clear, can
you just list for me the places you recall traveling
with Jeffrey. Answer yes, The first trip was New York
and the Virgin Islands, and then not again until around
two thousand and five. We went to New Mexico and
to New York City and the Virgin Islands. Manager. So
you were in New York twice and the Virgin Islands
twice and New Mexico once. Answer yes, Manager, anywhere else?
Answer no, Manager, were those primarily on the private planes?
Answer yes, Manager, you said you flew commercially once to
get back Answer yes, Manager. Do you recall any other
commercial flights? Answer he bought a couple of flights from
me when I wanted to go to New York for
personal reasons. One time I went to New York commercially
and I was there with friends, but I did go
over to his house while I was staying in the city.
Menager and that's not the trip to New York. Answer,
no separate. Manager. Would you characterize your relationship with Jeffrey
as friendly? McAuley objection witness, Yes, Manager, if you asked
him to buy you a ticket to New York, that
might be something that he would do. Answer. I never
asked him to do anything for me, but I told
him I was interested in something, and he always offered. Menager.
The second trip to New York, anything memorable about that?
The one, I'm sorry, the one that you mentioned that
was with Jeffrey. Answer. I do recall Nadia being there
while I massaged. She gave him a facial but nothing
sexual happened. Menager. And do you recall if Glane was
part of that trip or not? Answer? I remember her
being in New Mexico. Menager, What do you remember about
her being in New Mexico? And I remember she took
me to when they were building the ranch. They had
a little three bedroom home, just like a prefab house.
She took me over there, so we went for a
little walk. I remember she had two new puppies named
Max and Minnie, little Yorkis. And I want to say
that it was around Jeffrey's birthday when we were there,
but nothing. There was no like celebration or cake with candles.
It was just another day, Menager. You said the Virgin
Islands were a part of that second trip as well.
Answer yes, menager. And do you remember Golaine being part
of the Virgin Islands the second time? Answer yes, that's
when she called went to bed and kissed us all
on the head and called us her children. Menager. Who
were the other participants in that session? Answer that's who.
I don't recall who was there. I want to say
that Nadia was Menager, but Virginia was not there. Answer
Virginia was not there, Menager. Do you recall the point
in time in which Virginia went away? Answer sort of.
After the trip to New York. I was given her
phone number to call, and I remember one time I
tried to get a hold of her. Her boyfriend answered,
a boyfriend, I would assume, and he sounded like he
was high, and I couldn't find out where she was.
And then from there she was out of the picture. Manager.
Do you recall how long after the New York trip
that occurred? Answer? I would say it was probably within
a month or two. Manager. Did she tell you she
was working elsewhere? Answer no, manager. Did you ask her?
Answer no manager. Did you mention that she was a waitress?
Answer no, manager and worked at Taco Bell answer uh huh. Manager.
Did you speak to her boyfriend or a boyfriend at
any other time associated with her? Answer no. Manager. Did
you meet her boyfriend? Answer no, Manager her fiance answer no.
McAuley objection, manager, when you were on the plane with
Jeffrey Epstein during these two trips, he was present on
all of those flights, answer yes, manager. Did you observe
any sexual behavior happening on the plane? Answer no. He
told me a story of something that happened one time. Manager.
Did it involve Glenn Maxwell? Answer no, Manager. Did it
involve Virginia Roberts Answer no, manager, and you didn't see anything?
Answer no, manager. You did give massages to Glenn Maxwell
correct answer yes, Manager, on how many occasions? Answer maybe
somewhere between five and ten. Manager. Was that over the
course of the five years? Answer yes, Manager. Was there
at some point during that five years where Glenn Maxwell
was not around as much? Answer yes, manager. Do you
recall when that was? Answer in the middle manager, Did
you know why that might be? Answer no, Manager? Is
that about the time that you started seeing Nadia more frequently. Answer, yeah,
I guess she was probably in the picture more. Her
and Sarah both had kind of been around the most. Manager.
Did you observe Nadia or Sarah appearing to act like
Jeffrey's girlfriend? Answer Nadia, not Sarah? Menager? What did you observe? Answer?
She was just very loving kissing him. Menager. Did you
know how old she was? Answer? I didn't know. Menager.
So you gave massages to Gleine five or ten times?
Was there anything unusual about those massages? And just to
add here, Nadia Marsenkova allegedly was sold to Jeffrey Epstein
when she was just a little girl. So that's a
whole other story that at some point is going to
come out. Menager. You've been quoted in the press. Perhaps
is saying that she wasn't very picky? Answer about massage? Menager?
About her massages? Answer not like Jeffrey. I guess I
mean saying that meant that, you know, I would do
whatever I wanted to do in the massage, whereas Jeffrey
was like, do my foot, do my leg? He would
kind of narrate what he wanted. She just wanted a massage, so,
if that makes sense, menager, she may have been naked
under a towel. Answered definitely, in a regular massage fashion.
McCauley objection. Answer yes, Actually, I do recall an instance
where I was a massaging her and Jeffrey came into
the room and he did something sort of sexual to her,
whether it was fondling her or slapping her butt or something,
and she brushed them off like she was embarrassed. Manager,
So she never asked you to touch her in a
sexual manner correct answer no, Manager. And she did not
rub her breasts on you, for example, Answer no. McCauley objection. Manager,
did she demand that you perform oral sex on her?
Answer no, Manager. Did she not demand that you undress
during your massage? Answer no, menager. There was nothing from
her that was sexual during the massage that you gave her.
McCauley objection, and then schoberg answers correct, McCauley, do you
recall when was the last time you gave her a massage? Answer?
I don't recall. All right, folks, we're going to wrap
up that episode right here, and in the next episode
will pay Cup, where we left off. All of the
information that goes with this episode can be found in
the description box.