Speaker 1: Big Food and Beyond with Cliff and Bobo. These guys
Speaker 1: are your favorites, so like Shay Subscribe and raid It,
Speaker 1: lip Star and Righteous Yesterday and listening, Oh watchim always
Speaker 1: keep its watching.
Speaker 2: And now you're hosts Cliff Barrickman and James Boobo.
Speaker 1: Fay Bobo. How you doing today?
Speaker 3: Pretty good? Pretty good? How you doing? Cliff?
Speaker 1: I am excited. I could barely get any sleep last night.
Speaker 1: We have fantastic guests for you. You're gonna totally dig
Speaker 1: this one. I mean you already know who they are,
Speaker 1: but I cannot wait to announce it because there's a
Speaker 1: new Bigfoot film on the market. But you know the
Speaker 1: great thing about it, it's not really a Bigfoot film.
Speaker 1: This isn't about necessarily about sightings. It doesn't have talking
Speaker 1: heads like I saw the thing above the tree was
Speaker 1: a fat doll. It's not anything like. Yeah, this is
Speaker 1: an out of the ordinary Bigfoot film and I've seen
Speaker 1: it and I cannot recommend it highly enough. I know
Speaker 1: you've seen it. The name of the film is big Fur.
Speaker 1: It was made by a guy named Dan Wayne, and
Speaker 1: the center of the film, the subject of the film
Speaker 1: is a world renowned like award winning taxidermist named Ken Walker,
Speaker 1: and we have both of those gentlemen on the show today. Bubs,
Speaker 1: It's going to be a fantastic episode.
Speaker 4: Oh yeah, I watched that movie three times now. There's
Speaker 4: some twists and turns. I don't want to I have
Speaker 4: always questions I want to ask him. I don't want
Speaker 4: to wait too much about the plot because it's it
Speaker 4: takes some It's almost like the Tiger King should be
Speaker 4: called the Squatch King because it takes some dramatic turns.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it is. It is a fantastic film, and I
Speaker 1: cannot I cannot recommend it enough. Everybody in our audience
Speaker 1: really needs to see this. And you know, I'm not
Speaker 1: blowing smoke up anybody's skirt or anything. This is a
Speaker 1: fantastic film because it is out of the ordinary. But
Speaker 1: you know what, let enough of us talking. Let's get
Speaker 1: right down to it. Let's let's go ahead and introduce
Speaker 1: our two subjects today, and then they can tell you
Speaker 1: about the film. They can tell you about their accomplishments,
Speaker 1: and and then we have a ton of questions for them. So,
Speaker 1: Bobo and everybody else who's listening right now, I want
Speaker 1: you to meet Dan Wayne the filmmaker and Ken Walker
Speaker 1: the taxidermist. So, Dan and Ken, welcome to Bigfoot and Beyond.
Speaker 1: Who Ken you, I'm not a I'm not a hunter.
Speaker 1: I'm not a taxidermist, a fishionado. I don't go to
Speaker 1: the shows, I don't take I don't read the blogs
Speaker 1: or the maga. So, but you apparently are like the
Speaker 1: world's best and so at least in some years you've
Speaker 1: been awarded the world's best in taxidermy. Tell us a
Speaker 1: little bit that about that, like where did you begin
Speaker 1: and all that sort of stuff.
Speaker 5: Well, taxidermy is kind of, uh, it's kind of a
Speaker 5: cool occupation. You don't really find it, it seems to
Speaker 5: find you, uh, you know. And I've always been into
Speaker 5: anything nature. I mean, when I was a kid, they
Speaker 5: couldn't keep me inside. You know, when I was on
Speaker 5: the fishing dock, that's where I was from, you know, uh,
Speaker 5: dusk to dawn. I was out fishing day and night.
Speaker 5: You know, that's just where I was. And so, you know,
Speaker 5: becoming a taxi ormist was kind of a natural evolution
Speaker 5: to what I do because I was also an artist,
Speaker 5: you know, a sculpting artist. Three dimensional medium is my thing.
Speaker 5: And then of course, you know, I was used to
Speaker 5: follow my pops on moose hunting trips to feed the family,
Speaker 5: and I just fell in love with the nature and everything.
Speaker 5: So it was kind of a natural evolution, you know,
Speaker 5: it kind of kind of fell into it. And then
Speaker 5: over the years it turned out that, you know, I
Speaker 5: was able to I was able to actually reach some
Speaker 5: pinnacles in the tax army competition field. And so yeah,
Speaker 5: as of now, I've won the World Championships three times,
Speaker 5: twice in the recreation division and once in life size mammals,
Speaker 5: and I've won a ton of other stuff to a
Speaker 5: Master of Masters, judges choice best to Show, competitors choice
Speaker 5: best to show, and then a lot you know, the nationals.
Speaker 5: I won the Nationals and just stuff like that, and
Speaker 5: I travel all around the world. I went to China
Speaker 5: taught them how to do panda bears. So yeah, it's
Speaker 5: been a great journey. And then somewhere along the way,
Speaker 5: I bumped into I bumped into the sasquatch.
Speaker 1: Yeah. Now that's where the story kind of takes a turn,
Speaker 1: because I'm sure some of our listeners are thinking, wait,
Speaker 1: of a taxidermy bigfoot, don't you need like a dead
Speaker 1: animal to make a something. Why do we have a
Speaker 1: taxidermist on Well, Ken actually made a replica of a
Speaker 1: sasquatch and that's the basis of the entire film that
Speaker 1: Dan made. So why don't we throw out to Dan
Speaker 1: right now and say, Dan, why don't you tell us
Speaker 1: how you ran across Ken and what was the seed
Speaker 1: that produced the movie Big Fur?
Speaker 6: Well, you know, I was wanting to do a movie
Speaker 6: about taxidermy, and I started learning how to do it
Speaker 6: myself as kind of a hobby, and I found this
Speaker 6: forum on the internet and all the best taxidermists in
Speaker 6: the world were on this for him, and I pretty
Speaker 6: quickly got more interested in following along with these really
Speaker 6: bizarre characters than I was in learning how to do it.
Speaker 6: And I thought, there's I think there's going to be
Speaker 6: a really interesting documentary here, because to me, it was
Speaker 6: this kind of underappreciated art form. And that's what I
Speaker 6: set out to do, was, you know, show what's involved
Speaker 6: with taxidermy. And so I had a bunch of these
Speaker 6: guys I was following along just really interesting characters, and
Speaker 6: Ken was kind of at the top of that list.
Speaker 6: And part of the reason was because you know, he's
Speaker 6: pretty smart, and he's pretty funny, and you know, some
Speaker 6: of these guys just take themselves so seriously.
Speaker 2: And Ken, you know, it was more humble. You know,
Speaker 2: he's obviously one of the.
Speaker 6: Best, but but he just, you know, he had a
Speaker 6: great sense of humor. And interestingly, he's known for these
Speaker 6: recreations that he does. You know, these he did an
Speaker 6: Irish elk and and a panda and a saber tooth tiger,
Speaker 6: and you know, people talk about these things like, you know,
Speaker 6: they're they're really amazing, and they are because they are amazing.
Speaker 6: And so when it came time to kind of pull
Speaker 6: the trigger and get started, I really didn't know what
Speaker 6: the storyline was going to be, but I just kind
Speaker 6: of wanted to get the ball rolling, and so I
Speaker 6: sent Ken a message and asked him if he'd be
Speaker 6: interested in being, you know, part of a documentary. And
Speaker 6: then we talked on the phone and he was pretty
Speaker 6: into it. And you know, I knew he had a
Speaker 6: thing about bigfoot, but I didn't really know that much
Speaker 6: about it, and I'd never really thought twice about bigfoot.
Speaker 6: But then he told me he was going to build
Speaker 6: a Bigfoot and that's when I knew I found the
Speaker 6: story because there's going to be a middle, you know, beginning,
Speaker 6: a middle and an end, and I can follow him
Speaker 6: while he makes this thing and takes it to the
Speaker 6: World Championships. And so that's kind of how the whole
Speaker 6: seed started, this whole thing about Bigfoot.
Speaker 2: Though I really didn't know anything about Bigfoot.
Speaker 6: So as soon as I hung out from Ken, I
Speaker 6: started studying and learning about Bigfoot. And yeah, I didn't
Speaker 6: really realize there was this international interest, you know, not
Speaker 6: just Bigfoot, but all cryptids, and and I think that
Speaker 6: kind of set me down this kind of path about
Speaker 6: you know, mythology and what these things stand for, you know,
Speaker 6: in a more broad general sense.
Speaker 1: One of the things I was impressed about when I
Speaker 1: was watching bigfo is how much information Kim knew about sasquatches.
Speaker 1: I mean, had know the sasquatch by Chris Murphy in
Speaker 1: his hands. He knew about the compliant gait of the
Speaker 1: Patterson Gimlin film creature. He knows a lot about sasquatches. So, Ken,
Speaker 1: can you tell us how you started researching Bigfoot in particular?
Speaker 5: Once Well, I had two people come forward to me
Speaker 5: that told me about sasquatch encounters. And these were people
Speaker 5: that I trust inherently. I knew they weren't lying. One
Speaker 5: was a guy I worked with named Wade Pearson, and
Speaker 5: his grandfather had passed away, and before he did, he
Speaker 5: gave him his car. But he sat and told him
Speaker 5: how he was walking out of a logging camp in
Speaker 5: the middle of the night in British Columbia and bumped
Speaker 5: into a huge sasquatch and he literally went to town,
Speaker 5: got on a train and went home because he couldn't
Speaker 5: go back to tell the people what he had saw.
Speaker 5: And then the other guy is Ray Levor, a very
Speaker 5: famous taxi ermist. He's still alive. He's quite old, but
Speaker 5: he used to hunt the Brazoo River and before it
Speaker 5: was open he had the record alberta Bear trophy bear
Speaker 5: for many years. And he said that he found sasquatch
Speaker 5: tracks on a sandbar and he said they could not
Speaker 5: have been anything else. Uh, and the guy knows. So
Speaker 5: that got me investigating right away, because I thought, wait
Speaker 5: a minute, and so then I started quizzing every every
Speaker 5: hunter who came through my shop, and man, the stuff
Speaker 5: that I came up with was incredible. I go that
Speaker 5: the people told me. I didn't realize people I knew
Speaker 5: had seen them, but they just don't tell anyone. And
Speaker 5: then so I just I just soaked up all the
Speaker 5: knowledge I could. I tried to go to the most
Speaker 5: credible sources I could, you know, like Jeff Meldrum and
Speaker 5: people who take, you know, a scientific approach to it.
Speaker 5: And then of course, you know, you got to You've
Speaker 5: got to sort through a lot of stuff, but you know,
Speaker 5: and then I started looking for people myself out here,
Speaker 5: and it just went from there. So, yeah, I soaked
Speaker 5: up a lot of knowledge on it.
Speaker 3: What is the story? Was it? When you're a kid,
Speaker 3: you say saw it later?
Speaker 5: No, I saw it when I was I was actually hunting.
Speaker 5: If you go west of Edmonton, there's a when you
Speaker 5: hit the first main bush country, it's Blue Ridge White Court.
Speaker 5: And I went to Blue Ridge and crossed the river
Speaker 5: and then went down this old road we called the
Speaker 5: Simpson Timber Road. We used to hunt bears there and
Speaker 5: that country wasn't opened up at all. There was no
Speaker 5: side roads. And about twenty miles down that road, all
Speaker 5: of a sudden, I yelled bear because the bear run
Speaker 5: out of the bush. And I realized it's not a bear,
Speaker 5: it's a man. And this thing cleared the ditch one
Speaker 5: jump and it was up on the road and then
Speaker 5: it cleared the other ditch and then it ran up
Speaker 5: a steep hill without slowing down. And even the thing
Speaker 5: was running too fast to be human anyways. And I
Speaker 5: was like, who is this guy? Why is he dressed
Speaker 5: in black? Furry's going to get shot out here, you know.
Speaker 5: And it never sat right with me. And the guy
Speaker 5: with me said, is that a sasquatch? And I said, no,
Speaker 5: there's no such thing.
Speaker 2: Man.
Speaker 5: It had to be a man, you know. I have
Speaker 5: since gone back to the area, found the tree structures
Speaker 5: and talked to other witnesses in it's an area south
Speaker 5: of Kidney Lake and that's where they are. It's one
Speaker 5: of the one of the areas where they where there's
Speaker 5: encounters oh Man thirty years ago. So it made more
Speaker 5: sense that it was a sasquatch than it was a person,
Speaker 5: much more sense because everything about the sighting was not
Speaker 5: within human parameters. But you know, belief is a big thing.
Speaker 5: It forms your opinions. I know people who've seen sasquatches
Speaker 5: and still don't believe in them, you know. So there
Speaker 5: was that kind of hanging in the background, so I
Speaker 5: drew on that as far as an experience. Another time,
Speaker 5: I was walking through the woods and something hit me
Speaker 5: with a rock, and I thought, maybe a squirrel dropped
Speaker 5: a rock on me. Well, I know better now. I
Speaker 5: was in tom Hill Tower country, and I've got witnesses
Speaker 5: from there now too, So you know, I put a
Speaker 5: lot of pieces together from my past, and then of
Speaker 5: course I have all the new accounts coming in all
Speaker 5: the time from people that come through my shop. So
Speaker 5: I've been able to kind of weed through everything, you know,
Speaker 5: if I get you know, similarities, similar areas from people
Speaker 5: who don't know each other. And I've been able to
Speaker 5: get kind of a broad view of where the Sasquatch
Speaker 5: are in Alberta.
Speaker 1: About how many reports do you think you've collected, like
Speaker 1: since you started collecting these things?
Speaker 5: Four dozen?
Speaker 1: Okay, pretty good? And even in that small data set
Speaker 1: so far, you know, fifty or so reports, shall we say,
Speaker 1: patterns are already developing, is what I'm hearing from you.
Speaker 5: Oh yeah yeah. And also to like I sort through them,
Speaker 5: I really anything that could possibly give, you know, give evidence,
Speaker 5: like if somebody says they found tracks and you know
Speaker 5: two days ago. I mean I'm in my truck and
Speaker 5: I'm racing. You know, people say they found bones, people
Speaker 5: have shot and killed them. Those I try to follow
Speaker 5: those up as quickly as I can. And I mean,
Speaker 5: you guys all know the cier killed story that was
Speaker 5: on our taxidermy for him that that came up to be.
Speaker 5: And I was actually the first one to talk.
Speaker 3: To that guy. Well you were that was you? That
Speaker 3: was me?
Speaker 5: I was the guy. Yeah, no way, yeah.
Speaker 3: That was me.
Speaker 4: I was on the I went there to find the
Speaker 4: body with with Meldrum and Derek and them guys.
Speaker 5: Yeah, because I actually I was the one that I
Speaker 5: called Derek and I said, you know, get in touch
Speaker 5: with this guy and uh. And then I never heard anything.
Speaker 5: So then I ended up calling Tyler Huggins and I
Speaker 5: tried to get him on it. I said, you know,
Speaker 5: there's a possibility that you know, I'm two weeks behind
Speaker 5: the shooting.
Speaker 3: Uh.
Speaker 5: You know, I don't care who who proves it. I don't,
Speaker 5: I don't, I really don't care. I just want somebody
Speaker 5: to I have since had a chance to sit down
Speaker 5: with Justin and UH and talk with him and UH,
Speaker 5: And I mean I heard the original report. I have
Speaker 5: no doubt in my mind that it's it's real.
Speaker 3: Me too, no doubt. You know.
Speaker 4: You know Barkertina filmed four of them there a couple
Speaker 4: of years later, did you know that.
Speaker 5: Yeah, the thermal ones. Yeah, yeah, that was great.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 5: No, And they'll be in the area like it's just
Speaker 5: like the place where they call the Alberta habituation. Dan's
Speaker 5: not telling you, but I called a sasquatch in for him,
Speaker 5: and right where we were standing is the same place
Speaker 5: that the word is that Jeff Meldrum saw one, and
Speaker 5: he did see one as far as I'm concerned, and
Speaker 5: he saw a really nasty, mean one that nobody should
Speaker 5: be in there walking around. They don't know the backstory
Speaker 5: I do. And you know, they just hide more. They
Speaker 5: don't tend to change locations. They just tend to be
Speaker 5: more careful if they know people are in there looking
Speaker 5: for him.
Speaker 1: Stay tuned for more Bigfoot and Beyond with Cliff and Bobo.
Speaker 1: Will be right back after these messages. Bob, are you
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Speaker 3: So, Ken, can you tell us more about that Alberta
Speaker 3: habituation site? Yeah?
Speaker 5: Sure, you know, it's unfortunate that it got to be
Speaker 5: such a public spectacle because it was never meant to
Speaker 5: be that I was I was showing that and asked
Speaker 5: to keep it quiet because of course the trapper doesn't
Speaker 5: want his trap line being turned into a circus. So
Speaker 5: what had happened is once I realized these these creatures
Speaker 5: are out there, I started going through all of the
Speaker 5: people I know in my mind, and there's people, basically
Speaker 5: I know, people that are so knowledgeable that if there
Speaker 5: are sasquatches, these guys would know. So I went to
Speaker 5: a couple of really good friends of mine and I
Speaker 5: called him up and I said, look, I'm not crazy.
Speaker 5: Just listen to what I have to say. But do
Speaker 5: you have any accounts of sasquatches up in that country
Speaker 5: where you guys are? And the guy said, you're not
Speaker 5: going to believe this. I can't believe you're asking me
Speaker 5: that question. He says, I just had to go with
Speaker 5: my brother and pull all his traps. He says, he's
Speaker 5: being harassed by these things. And then he said, yeah,
Speaker 5: and they built a big nest that they were living in.
Speaker 5: He's found and he's seen seven of them, and just
Speaker 5: went on and on and so as soon as he
Speaker 5: said there was a nest and there was like and
Speaker 5: this was already in the winter, and there was scat
Speaker 5: all over the place, he said, the thing I had
Speaker 5: crapped about thirty times around the edge of this nest.
Speaker 5: I said, we need to go collect that. I says,
Speaker 5: it'll have DNA evidence. And I had a heck of
Speaker 5: a time getting them to draw map, but he finally did,
Speaker 5: and we went up there and that's when we found
Speaker 5: the I went in there and I found out where
Speaker 5: the area was, and we dug up the nest and
Speaker 5: I filled up five bags full of frozen scat. I
Speaker 5: videotaped that I have the videotape somewhere, but you know,
Speaker 5: this is how it kind of started. And then I
Speaker 5: started getting all of the accounts and what happened. And
Speaker 5: then I started exploring the area and myself, and there
Speaker 5: was another I got followed by one when I was
Speaker 5: in there on the river. Now, there were some hunters
Speaker 5: that got run out of an area. Now on the
Speaker 5: way out, they told the trapper don't ever go in there.
Speaker 5: They wouldn't say why, but they said, just watch those
Speaker 5: stone piles on the cliffs. And he said, you'll you know.
Speaker 5: So I went in there and I found the stone piles,
Speaker 5: and so I went farther down the trail. I looked
Speaker 5: for some tracks, and when I came back, when I
Speaker 5: hit the crossroads, something was had been standing there that
Speaker 5: stunk so bad that I could hardly breathe. And it
Speaker 5: was it smelt like rotten grass in a bag in
Speaker 5: a hundred degree weather, mixed with bo with vomit. I mean,
Speaker 5: it was just it was just an awful, offensive smell.
Speaker 5: And then then the breeze just took the smell away,
Speaker 5: and I realized whatever I smelt was standing right here.
Speaker 5: And then that's when all the hair started going up
Speaker 5: on my arms, on my back, on my neck, and
Speaker 5: I realized there was something watching me and real close.
Speaker 5: I've never felt like that, and so I brought another
Speaker 5: There was another guy that I had been talking to
Speaker 5: and he wanted to go in really badly with me.
Speaker 5: So I called up the trapper and they said, look,
Speaker 5: if you trust this guy, you know, go ahead. So
Speaker 5: I went in there. I brought the guy, and of
Speaker 5: course all the tree structures. The guy went kind of crazy,
Speaker 5: like there's so much stuff there to look at, and
Speaker 5: then down the road, I guess he a lot of
Speaker 5: people get delusions of grandeur. They think that they're going
Speaker 5: to be I don't know, Neil Armstrong walking on the
Speaker 5: moon because of something that they found, you know, And
Speaker 5: then they wanted all to themselves. And so he started
Speaker 5: going to other investigators and trying to bring them into
Speaker 5: the area, which I strongly advised him against. And so
Speaker 5: that area ended up becoming known whether through blogs. The
Speaker 5: very first survivor man Bigfoot, was filmed there, and of
Speaker 5: course another gentleman went in there and brought in doctor
Speaker 5: Meldrum and doctor Bindernagel, and yeah, the place turned into
Speaker 5: just exactly what the trapper didn't want it turned into
Speaker 5: a circus. Now that's just one spot. Luckily I didn't
Speaker 5: show the guy the other spots, because there's one spot
Speaker 5: in particular where if you go in there, there's bone
Speaker 5: piles where they've been eating, there's beds, there's shelters. They're
Speaker 5: literally there all the time. And I just found out
Speaker 5: two weeks ago that forestry found that spot too and
Speaker 5: they clear cut it. So that was kind of a
Speaker 5: loss really, But there's still all there's there's area, there
Speaker 5: was another area there given to the natives, and there's
Speaker 5: a lot of Sasquatch they winter in there, so that
Speaker 5: that won't be developed. So there's still quite a bit
Speaker 5: of country out there. I know where they are. But
Speaker 5: the place they call the Alberta habituation turns it into
Speaker 5: a bit of a circus sometimes with people going in there.
Speaker 3: You know.
Speaker 4: Yeah, Meldrem told me about that, and.
Speaker 3: He told me about you.
Speaker 4: He didn't say your name, but I was like, man,
Speaker 4: that guy had the spot. He got screwed because I've
Speaker 4: had the same thing happen. Like, take one or two
Speaker 4: people there and then they tell one or two people
Speaker 4: and it's you know, exponential and all of a sudden,
Speaker 4: it's it's on the internet and people are going to
Speaker 4: your spot and then it's ruined.
Speaker 5: Yeah. Well it was kind of fun because I found
Speaker 5: out that no matter how many people go in there,
Speaker 5: they're still there, and they seem to like to watch
Speaker 5: who comes and goes. You know what if I take
Speaker 5: my friends in there now, because it's not a big
Speaker 5: deal anymore. The trapper is actually sold that his part
Speaker 5: of the trap line in there. He still goes in
Speaker 5: that country, but you know, he's not involved anymore with
Speaker 5: the actual trap line, so it's loosened up a little bit.
Speaker 5: But I mean I took Dan in there, and what
Speaker 5: happens is they all seem to gather in there just
Speaker 5: before they go up in the mountains for the winter.
Speaker 5: You know, there seems to be a gathering place and
Speaker 5: that's why those big structures are there. This is my
Speaker 5: theory because the trapper told me they all show up
Speaker 5: around October and they leave as soon as the snow
Speaker 5: hits in November. And so Dan and I were up
Speaker 5: there at the beginning of November, and so I told Dan,
Speaker 5: I said, you know, we were drinking wine by the
Speaker 5: fire right at the berm there where. Doctor Meldrum saw
Speaker 5: the one, and I says, if I make a quick call,
Speaker 5: I says, likely one will come and check us out.
Speaker 5: You've got to do a quick call because you don't
Speaker 5: want want him to hear it twice. If here's a twice,
Speaker 5: he knows you're fake. Right, So I gave one of
Speaker 5: those wooloop calls and I told Dan, I said, you know,
Speaker 5: his dog didn't even raise its head. Dog Betty was
Speaker 5: curled up there, and I said, does your dog ever
Speaker 5: shake and pee itself and go crazy? He said no,
Speaker 5: And I said, well I don't have mystical magical powers
Speaker 5: over your dog, right, I said, okay, just wait. About
Speaker 5: ten minutes later, that dog and it was fixed on
Speaker 5: that ridge down down wind, looking right at that and
Speaker 5: it was trying to bark and it was just shaking.
Speaker 5: And I said, there's one on the ridge right now,
Speaker 5: crept up there and he's having a look at us,
Speaker 5: and now he's going to leave because he's busted and
Speaker 5: you don't like it. And within about five minutes, five
Speaker 5: to ten minutes, Betty had called him down, but it
Speaker 5: was there. You know, they sneak in to have a
Speaker 5: look at you.
Speaker 1: Now is that the general technique that you choose to
Speaker 1: use when you're doing field work as you go, just
Speaker 1: be a human for a little while and make a
Speaker 1: couple of noises that they might be interested in. Just
Speaker 1: and wait.
Speaker 5: Yeah, when I do the calls, like a lot of times,
Speaker 5: like when I took some girls girl tax at Ermist's
Speaker 5: and I had a girl from London with me and
Speaker 5: Alice Markham from Hollywood and a few other people, I
Speaker 5: just told him just to you know, just listen real carefully.
Speaker 5: And so I just did a quick call and right
Speaker 5: away you heard a branch break. I very rarely hear
Speaker 5: a tree knock in there, very rarely. If ever, they
Speaker 5: really like to whistle. You'll be walking along and all
Speaker 5: of a sudden, you know, you'll hear them. And I've
Speaker 5: been able to whistle back and have them answer me.
Speaker 1: So, Dan, you were at this place and you got
Speaker 1: to hear all this for yourself. What was your take
Speaker 1: on it? Well, you know, it's pretty weird. I mean
Speaker 1: it was dark. You know, my dog certainly freaked out.
Speaker 1: You know, I can't say I'm one hundred percent convinced
Speaker 1: there was a sasquatch there. That's something certainly freaked out.
Speaker 6: My dog and I spent more time in that area,
Speaker 6: you know, with Ken, but also without can. I camped
Speaker 6: there for a couple of weeks, and it was I
Speaker 6: was surprised that just how.
Speaker 2: Remote that area really is.
Speaker 6: You know, there's there's nobody there except the occasional logging
Speaker 6: truck or oil and gas truck. But you know, I
Speaker 6: was in there for a couple of days without seeing
Speaker 6: a single soul. And then another time Ken and I
Speaker 6: went with Dawn, one of the taxidermists that's in Big Fur,
Speaker 6: to go look at a siding that she had, which
Speaker 6: isn't very far from there, I mean by Canadian standards,
Speaker 6: it's just kind of like down the road. And you know,
Speaker 6: we took four wheelers in there, and yeah, that's a big,
Speaker 6: vast wilderness. It certainly wouldn't be hard for an intelligent
Speaker 6: animal to avoid humans back in there.
Speaker 5: Okay, well listen, I'll tell you something really cool. The trapper,
Speaker 5: like these trappers, they see things that we don't. You know,
Speaker 5: when we were digging up the nest for this gat,
Speaker 5: the trapper said, it goes, take a look at this,
Speaker 5: look at this. And I looked up and you know,
Speaker 5: the nests are always under a big tree, and this
Speaker 5: was under a big tree with big, big branches, and
Speaker 5: right about eye level. I'm about five eleven and right
Speaker 5: about my eye level, we're two branches about four feet
Speaker 5: of heart. You know, they they went into like a y.
Speaker 5: They both came out at an angle forty five degree
Speaker 5: angle from each other. There was two spots about eleven
Speaker 5: inches wide wore into the branches where something when it
Speaker 5: stood up, always grabbed in the same place like handgrips.
Speaker 5: Like he rocked back and forth. But you know, he
Speaker 5: spent a lot of time in that nest, and when
Speaker 5: he stood up, he grabbed the branches in the same place,
Speaker 5: and he actually wore the bark down and about two
Speaker 5: eleven inch wide handgrips. I would have never saw that,
Speaker 5: but the trappers they see everything. And he says, whatever
Speaker 5: was standing here always grabbed these branches in the same place,
Speaker 5: like out of habit, and its hand, its hand grips
Speaker 5: were about eye level with the five five eleven guy.
Speaker 5: So that was really interesting. And the other thing that
Speaker 5: happened is there was a there had been a trap
Speaker 5: set near that bed for whatever reason. What happens is
Speaker 5: everything from that bed inwards from that trap line. The
Speaker 5: traps were robbed. They were Martin boxes. And what they
Speaker 5: did is they have a con of bear trap for
Speaker 5: pine Martin and there's one kind of bait that the
Speaker 5: pine Martins touched it and nothing else does, so you
Speaker 5: keep the other animals out. And it's called Martin magic.
Speaker 5: It's basically rendered fish oil and skunk oil, and it's
Speaker 5: cubes of beaver meat soaked in skunk oil and rotten
Speaker 5: fish oil, and it's unpalable for most animals, but the
Speaker 5: Martins go into the traps. Well, the trapper told me.
Speaker 5: He says that the sasquatches cannot resist it. He says
Speaker 5: they chew the bark off the tree where he smears
Speaker 5: it on, and he says they take every piece of
Speaker 5: bait out of his traps. So they would take the
Speaker 5: trap out of the box and leave it hanging still set.
Speaker 5: They would reach up they would take the meat out,
Speaker 5: and he says, and every single time it did that,
Speaker 5: it put three rocks on top of the Martin box,
Speaker 5: and he thought somebody was jacking with them. Now, these
Speaker 5: guys have grizzly bears destroying sets all the time, and
Speaker 5: grizzly bears are protected and you're not allowed to harm
Speaker 5: them or haze them or anything like that. But every
Speaker 5: now and then a three thirty conniber gets set, you know,
Speaker 5: and whatever was stealing from these traps got caught in
Speaker 5: this three thirty connibear. Now, if you're three thirty, conniber
Speaker 5: is a body grip trap. It's if it gets on
Speaker 5: a bear or something like that, you know, something really strong.
Speaker 5: I'll get it off, but it kind of spooks them.
Speaker 5: But what ended up happening was whatever got its foot
Speaker 5: stuck in this trap pulled the hard and steel apart
Speaker 5: within thirty feet, which I've talked to people and they
Speaker 5: told me that's impossible. I mean, if you tied it
Speaker 5: between two tractors, you could do it. But whatever pulled
Speaker 5: this trap apart had to have had the strength of
Speaker 5: two tractors, you know. And so when the snow finally melted,
Speaker 5: I went out there, got on my hands and knees,
Speaker 5: and I collected a whole bag of hair from where
Speaker 5: this happened, including some with skin attached. I mailed that
Speaker 5: to John bindernakel got lost. Its vanished. There's no trace
Speaker 5: of it. Nobody can find it.
Speaker 3: It's gone because he passed away. Is that what happened?
Speaker 5: Well? Yeah, And Tyler was the guy who was chasing
Speaker 5: after it, and he said that he was a little
Speaker 5: confused about things around the end, but apparently he was
Speaker 5: supposed to have sent it to somebody who was looking
Speaker 5: for samples to test. Yeah, and then and basically Tyler knows.
Speaker 5: I told I sent Tyler after because once I, once
Speaker 5: I left my house, as far as I'm concerned, it
Speaker 5: was gone. I even I have a photograph of it.
Speaker 5: And it was a lot and I remember John called
Speaker 5: me and says, that's an awful lot of hair. And
Speaker 5: I said, yeah, but it was an unusual circumstance. And
Speaker 5: I told him what happened. Yeah, And that was that.
Speaker 5: And then that was you know. So I'm pretty careful
Speaker 5: with anything I call evidence nowadays.
Speaker 4: Never give away the whole never ever give away the
Speaker 4: whole sample of anything.
Speaker 3: Always keeps someing well.
Speaker 5: And that's there. And there's a trick. There's a part
Speaker 5: to that story because somebody or something came back after
Speaker 5: the snow melted and carried away that entire nest and
Speaker 5: sanitized the whole area. I just made it look like
Speaker 5: there was nothing there. And I assumed that the trapper
Speaker 5: was mad at me, because this guy's you know, if
Speaker 5: he gets mad at you're in trouble. And I thought
Speaker 5: maybe he was mad at me and he moved it.
Speaker 5: Because I don't know any creature other than people that
Speaker 5: will clean up after themselves. I've since gotten a lot
Speaker 5: of accounts of sasquatch actually doing that. But this thing
Speaker 5: came back. It knew that we had been messing with
Speaker 5: the site, and it sanitized. They cleaned it up, and
Speaker 5: I thought that maybe there was a chance that the
Speaker 5: trapper was mad at me and planted the hair there.
Speaker 5: This is why I didn't trust the sample one hundred
Speaker 5: percent at the time. I since talked to the trapper
Speaker 5: because he's the only one who could have gone back there.
Speaker 5: Nobody else knew where it was. And he said, I
Speaker 5: told you I'm never going back there again, you know,
Speaker 5: for his reasons. And so it was then I looked
Speaker 5: up and I found accounts of people seeing sasquatches leave
Speaker 5: nests and then coming back and finding the area have
Speaker 5: been cleaned up. You know, that was before I realized
Speaker 5: they were a hominid. I thought, you know, at that point,
Speaker 5: it was early. I thought they just might be some big, bumbling,
Speaker 5: lumbering ape out in the woods, which we all know
Speaker 5: they're not. And so so I didn't keep half the sample.
Speaker 5: I just sent it all and I said, if it's
Speaker 5: and I told I told John, I said, if it
Speaker 5: turns out to be you know, three different types of animals,
Speaker 5: just disregard it. Because I told him that I didn't
Speaker 5: trust the sample one hundred percent. But in hindsight now
Speaker 5: I had to having talked to the trapper and knowing
Speaker 5: that the story a little better, I gave away something
Speaker 5: I never should have.
Speaker 4: Yeah, I have a question for Dan when did you
Speaker 4: start filming this? Because I'm trying to, like talking to
Speaker 4: bind Naugle and some of these events I'm aware of,
Speaker 4: I'm trying to put it in a timeline. When exactly
Speaker 4: were you filming? Did you start like twenty fourteen?
Speaker 6: I first went up to Alberta in twenty thirteen, but
Speaker 6: I think it was it was about a year later
Speaker 6: that I went to that habituation area for the first
Speaker 6: time and it really kind of changed the course of
Speaker 6: the movie.
Speaker 1: Right.
Speaker 4: So, Ken, when he in the movie you say you
Speaker 4: found some of like DNA evidence, is that what you're
Speaker 4: referring to the stuff that disappeared with bender noggle.
Speaker 5: No, I actually the scat I had it tested. Now,
Speaker 5: they've been counting grizzly bears in Alberta, and the labs
Speaker 5: here for the Fish and Wildlife are experts at pulling
Speaker 5: DNA out of animal scat, and that's how they were
Speaker 5: actually counting the grizzly bears by doing genetic profiles on him.
Speaker 5: You know, they could say, oh, okay, this was this one.
Speaker 5: He was over here too. They used dogs to collect
Speaker 5: this scat, and I knew that they had this lab
Speaker 5: set up to pull the DNA out of scats. So
Speaker 5: I had five bags of it. So I happened to
Speaker 5: be doing work for some taxider. We work for the
Speaker 5: head of Foothills Enforcement at the time, and he was
Speaker 5: a really good guy and he knew I wasn't you know,
Speaker 5: he didn't think I was crazy. But I sat in
Speaker 5: his office and I told him, I said, look, these
Speaker 5: things are real and I have potentially have DNA evidence
Speaker 5: of them. And so I brought in a frozen bag
Speaker 5: of scat and I said, if you get you guys
Speaker 5: to test this, because I collected it from a nest site,
Speaker 5: you know it isn't like I mean, it looks like
Speaker 5: it looks like black bear or human crap, you know.
Speaker 5: And if I just found it anywhere, I wouldn't I
Speaker 5: wouldn't collect it. But the fact that it was thirty
Speaker 5: piles of it around a sasquatch nest, I figured, well,
Speaker 5: I've probably got a good chance, you know, I don't
Speaker 5: think it. So so anyways, he said, well, we'll tell
Speaker 5: you what this is. He says, we run it through
Speaker 5: gen Bank and it tells us every animal in the world,
Speaker 5: he says, So if this is chimpanzee, he said, we'll know.
Speaker 5: And I said, dude, I said, if it's chimpanzee, I says,
Speaker 5: make sure you charge me with mischief, you know. And
Speaker 5: I said, I said, I'm telling you right now, this
Speaker 5: is the real deal. And so anyways, I gave it
Speaker 5: to him, and now I was excited. I kept bugging him,
Speaker 5: like the you test it, And then finally I just
Speaker 5: gave up bugging him. And he said, they don't want
Speaker 5: to test it, and they think you're crazy. And I said, yeah, fine,
Speaker 5: just test it. Then I'm crazy. I'm crazy. Test it.
Speaker 5: But then I bumped into him about a year later
Speaker 5: and I said, did they ever test that? And he
Speaker 5: looked at me and he said, yeah, we did. And
Speaker 5: I said oh, and he said, well it came back inconclusive.
Speaker 5: And I don't know anything about DNA, so I just
Speaker 5: assumed they couldn't find DNA And I said, oh, I
Speaker 5: was hoping you'd find DNA in it. He said, no,
Speaker 5: that's not what I said. He said it didn't. It
Speaker 5: was inconclusive when we ran it through gen bank, it
Speaker 5: didn't match anything. He said, this is the this is
Speaker 5: actually the result you wanted. And I said really, And
Speaker 5: I said, so, you guys can't tell what it is.
Speaker 5: He goes, well, unless we sequence it, and he goes,
Speaker 5: that's expensive. He said, they're not going to do it.
Speaker 5: He said, but they were interested to know the story
Speaker 5: and where you found it and the circumstances. And I said,
Speaker 5: are they willing to put in writing that it could
Speaker 5: be what I said it is? He said no, they
Speaker 5: will never do that. I said, well, call me when
Speaker 5: they're ready to do that. And I could just tell
Speaker 5: by his reaction I was and everything else is that
Speaker 5: I think they you know, I realized, wait a minute,
Speaker 5: these guys know what this thing is now. They now
Speaker 5: they know that I'm onto it, and it kind of
Speaker 5: spooked me a little bit. I kind of wish I
Speaker 5: hadn't sent it in. I wish I'd sent it to
Speaker 5: somebody else. And you know, but he's retired now and
Speaker 5: he came into my shop here last year or the
Speaker 5: year before and he said, he smiled at me and
Speaker 5: he said, I watch the news for you every day.
Speaker 5: And I thought, that's that's a pretty good Uh. That's
Speaker 5: that's that's pretty good coming from him. So I think
Speaker 5: through this whole investigation, he himself may have learned something.
Speaker 1: Stay tuned for more Bigfoot and Beyond with Cliff and
Speaker 1: Bogo will be right back after these messages.
Speaker 3: Have you talked to him? The claim that killed one? Yep?
Speaker 4: What's the most the want you believe the most? That
Speaker 4: made the most sense to you that you heard someone
Speaker 4: say they killed the one?
Speaker 1: And why didn't they bring a body part back? Because
Speaker 1: I get asked that all the time.
Speaker 5: There was a legendary hunter in Alberta and he used
Speaker 5: to hunt sheep and unfortunately passed away a few a
Speaker 5: few years ago of cancer before I had a chance
Speaker 5: to talk to him about this subject. But it was
Speaker 5: his brother that was out. He was either berry picking
Speaker 5: or cone picking. Now, they pick up pine cones because
Speaker 5: they take them to the forestry and then they use
Speaker 5: them for planting seedlings and then they you know, tree
Speaker 5: planters come and put them back, and so they'll go
Speaker 5: out there and they get paid for these. Or they
Speaker 5: picked berries. But there's one spot that ties into the
Speaker 5: same area, but it's farther north where nobody goes in there.
Speaker 5: It's just too spooky. And that's where they were. And
Speaker 5: he turned around and there was a sasquatch standing with
Speaker 5: the kids, his kids or his kids. Yeah, So he
Speaker 5: he had, like everybody has a gun for bear protection.
Speaker 5: And so what he did is he shot the sasquatch
Speaker 5: and it screamed and freaked out and ran away. So anyways,
Speaker 5: he went and got his his cousin or his brother
Speaker 5: who was a legendary tracker, and they tracked this thing.
Speaker 5: And I know his son real well, and his son
Speaker 5: said they couldn't find it.
Speaker 3: Well.
Speaker 5: Then I talked to the trapper later, and the trapper
Speaker 5: knew this guy really well, and he looked at me
Speaker 5: and he said, he said, did they tell you that
Speaker 5: he didn't find it? And I thought, oh, wait, a minute,
Speaker 5: you know, And he said no, he said, that isn't
Speaker 5: the truth. And I said, you don't even have to
Speaker 5: tell me what happened. I said, I know what happened.
Speaker 5: I said, they got themselves into some trouble and I
Speaker 5: guess this thing. They went down a blind canyon and
Speaker 5: when they got into where there there was a bunch
Speaker 5: of them waiting for him, and he said they almost
Speaker 5: didn't make it out, but he just said that, yeah,
Speaker 5: they got they got ambushed. And the other the other
Speaker 5: story was our anecdote was there's a guy who lives
Speaker 5: right in town here and I've known him since for years.
Speaker 5: He's roughly the same age as me, and he was
Speaker 5: out hunting with his uncle and a place north of
Speaker 5: a place called Fawcett Lake by a lesser Slave Lake,
Speaker 5: and that's also an area of activity. Actually have a
Speaker 5: fishing wilife officer that relates accounts from there to me
Speaker 5: from the native community. But he said that he found
Speaker 5: these tracks, and he tried to tell his uncle that
Speaker 5: he found these giant people tracks, you know, and his
Speaker 5: uncle laughed at him. And so the next day they
Speaker 5: went by a bury patch and there was this what
Speaker 5: he thought was a giant black bear on the ground
Speaker 5: eating berries, and so he shot it with an old
Speaker 5: three to eight Norma magnum, and he says, this thing
Speaker 5: jumped up to his feet, he said, about nine feet tall,
Speaker 5: he says, and turned and looked at him, put his
Speaker 5: hands over the exit wound, and screamed at him and
Speaker 5: ran away. So he went and got his uncle, and
Speaker 5: his uncle took a look at the tracks. The blood
Speaker 5: grabbed the kid, threw him in the truck, never even
Speaker 5: picked up his camp, just drove out, never said a
Speaker 5: word to him, drove out. And that was odd. And
Speaker 5: so this guy is, you know, he always told me
Speaker 5: that if I would have followed it out, I found it.
Speaker 5: And I told him, I says, if you'd have followed it,
Speaker 5: they probably wouldn't have found you. For one thing. And
Speaker 5: he actually did see another one on the on the
Speaker 5: place we call the Big Stone Flats, and he took
Speaker 5: a shot at some milk, and he emptied his gun,
Speaker 5: and he said, after his gun was empty and he
Speaker 5: started to reload it, he said, the sasquatch broke cover
Speaker 5: and ran across the clearing. And he said that thing
Speaker 5: was smart enough to know his gun was empty.
Speaker 4: But when you said he found bone piles, like where
Speaker 4: they been eating meat. When I found bone piles before
Speaker 4: they were in they suffered. Like all the job bones
Speaker 4: were in one pile, all the rib bones were another,
Speaker 4: like femurs in another pile.
Speaker 3: Did you ever find anything like that?
Speaker 5: Well, I never got a chance to go in there.
Speaker 5: I was actually I've been working on the trapper to
Speaker 5: take me in there, and he was supposed to take
Speaker 5: me in there this year, and I just got word
Speaker 5: that they they must have found out they were in there,
Speaker 5: and they clear cut that area. And they'll do that
Speaker 5: if you report a sighting in an area, that area
Speaker 5: a lot of times will be clearcut within a few weeks.
Speaker 1: We ran into that down here. A woman filmed one
Speaker 1: in Roseberg in May of twenty nineteen, and she had
Speaker 1: nine minutes of footage of this thing, you know. And
Speaker 1: another gentleman who knows her, who actually put me in
Speaker 1: contact with her because he's kind of a big footer.
Speaker 1: He for some reason went and told the forest Service
Speaker 1: and when they went back to the spot, the entire
Speaker 1: area had been mowed down with brushogs. So yeah, if
Speaker 1: you get if you have a you know, I always
Speaker 1: think to myself, Like, man, if I had this pool
Speaker 1: on the river that I pulled salmon out of all
Speaker 1: the time, I wouldn't tell anybody about it. What are
Speaker 1: people thinking?
Speaker 5: That's about us hunters? We all know that about our
Speaker 5: hunting spots. We learned that a long time ago, you.
Speaker 1: Know, Oh yeah, yeah, yeah for sure.
Speaker 4: Hey, can I got a couple of part questions for
Speaker 4: you from the checking out with because job on some
Speaker 4: and teeth, how much would you be able to recreate
Speaker 4: from that?
Speaker 3: Like would you be able to go off of that?
Speaker 4: Like saying, like, you know, they have determined this thing
Speaker 4: could probably bipedal because of the spread of the jawbone
Speaker 4: and the way the molars are. How much could you
Speaker 4: recreate from a gigantophyticis what we found, a gigantopithecus teeth
Speaker 4: and job how much? How much could you recreate from that?
Speaker 5: Do you think, well, I actually actually looked at that
Speaker 5: job bone, and then all you have to do is
Speaker 5: just I have a gorilla skull here, and they're more
Speaker 5: quadrupedal obviously, and then of course you have the the human,
Speaker 5: which is bipedal. And if you look at the way
Speaker 5: the head sits on the neck in order for the
Speaker 5: esophagus to curl down properly, the jawbone has to be
Speaker 5: shallow in the front. It's straight up and down on
Speaker 5: a human. It tapers back quite a ways on the
Speaker 5: gorilla because the head comes straight out. Okay, Gigantopithecus, that's
Speaker 5: right in the middle. So basically what you have is
Speaker 5: you probably have the same thing as a sasquatch, a
Speaker 5: bipedal animal that can be quadrupedal sometimes of course, at
Speaker 5: least at least has a lower slung head when it
Speaker 5: does walk, just like you know, has that that forward,
Speaker 5: forward lean, that kind of slouch. So basically, if you
Speaker 5: look at you at the depth of the jaw bone
Speaker 5: right in the very front on the human, the gorilla,
Speaker 5: and then gigantipithecus is right in the middle, so it
Speaker 5: obviously held its head at a higher angle than a gorilla,
Speaker 5: but lower angle than a human. And bones tell you
Speaker 5: a lot, like like a lot, like I have skulls
Speaker 5: from you know, giant beaver's short face bears saber tooth cats,
Speaker 5: And it's amazing what you can figure out from just
Speaker 5: from looking at those skulls. It's it's and bones, it's
Speaker 5: just amazing damn.
Speaker 4: I mean, you're obviously somewhat intelligent to be a great movie,
Speaker 4: But how could you be not convinced that squatches are real?
Speaker 3: Actor all this?
Speaker 2: So you mean I'm only fully intelligent if I believe
Speaker 2: they're real.
Speaker 3: No, you don't have to believe together a scouted.
Speaker 1: No.
Speaker 6: Oh, you know, I love the whole idea of it,
Speaker 6: and it sure would be cool. I mean if they
Speaker 6: if we if they were you know, discovered, you know,
Speaker 6: in a way that that we could all accept it,
Speaker 6: like you know, a type specimen.
Speaker 2: I mean, how much you know, we would learn so
Speaker 2: much from them?
Speaker 3: Oh god, yeah, it's uh.
Speaker 6: It's hard for me to believe that so many of
Speaker 6: the sightings are are real, you know. I mean I could,
Speaker 6: I can believe that there's a certain number out there,
Speaker 6: but as you guys know, when you hang out with
Speaker 6: some squatchers, everything becomes sasquat.
Speaker 4: Oh god, yeah, we don't throw that out the window,
Speaker 4: just go yeah, I did to do?
Speaker 3: Is the five best ones, the five most convincing we
Speaker 3: talked to them. If one of those five is really
Speaker 3: and that's real.
Speaker 2: Right right?
Speaker 6: But then you know, there's there's just certain things that
Speaker 6: I you know, I struggle with like how many do
Speaker 6: there have to be to actually have enough genetic diversity that.
Speaker 2: There could be you know, a healthy population.
Speaker 1: Three hundred is what it is in Chetas. Oh really yeah,
Speaker 1: and there's certainly way more Sasquatches than three hundred.
Speaker 3: Well there you go.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean that's that's when I understand, at least,
Speaker 1: like with the big mammals, they start running at the
Speaker 1: genetic difficulties when the population drops about that number. Yeah,
Speaker 1: you know, he expanded about five hundred. You're still looking
Speaker 1: at a good sasquatch population even in the Pacific Northwest.
Speaker 6: I think, yeah, And you know that I don't think
Speaker 6: that's beyond the realm of possibility by any means. And
Speaker 6: I don't buy most of the arguments that people have,
Speaker 6: you know, when they try to say that they don't exist, like, well,
Speaker 6: I'm going to be found a body, you know, that
Speaker 6: kind of thing, doesn't That doesn't mean anything to me.
Speaker 2: So, you know, it is a it's a very compelling thing.
Speaker 4: You know.
Speaker 6: When I'm back here at home and I'm you know,
Speaker 6: doing my thing, I don't think that much about Bigfoot
Speaker 6: that I go back up to Canada and visit Ken
Speaker 6: and you know, within a you know, just a few
Speaker 6: hours of hearing him talk about it, you know, I
Speaker 6: always start to change my tune a little bit. He's
Speaker 6: very compelling and and he's got you know, really good,
Speaker 6: you know, intelligent arguments about it. So yeah, I wouldn't
Speaker 6: say I'm one hundred percent believer, but I'm I'm.
Speaker 3: Close, all right. I'll accept that.
Speaker 1: Stay tuned for more Bigfoot and Beyond with Cliff and Bobo.
Speaker 1: Will be right back after these messages.
Speaker 4: Hey, Ken, I was wondering when I was watching the movie,
Speaker 4: which again I want to recommend highly. You were doing
Speaker 4: measurements the recreate Patty the passion given film subject, and
Speaker 4: there's some discrepancy on measurements, you know, according to what
Speaker 4: lens was used. So how did you determine the sizes?
Speaker 5: Well, I had, of course to know the Sasquatch book
Speaker 5: and John Green's template is in there. And I'm not
Speaker 5: one to trust anything. I don't research or verify myself.
Speaker 5: So what I did is in one of the frames,
Speaker 5: you can see the bottom of Patty's foot. So what
Speaker 5: I did is I measured. I took that measurement, and
Speaker 5: I know that you can buy the cast of the foot,
Speaker 5: it's just under fifteen inches. And then basically I used
Speaker 5: that as a measuring tool and I extrapolated the length
Speaker 5: from the shin to the femur, the hip joint to
Speaker 5: the shoulder joint, across the shoulder joints and everything, just
Speaker 5: by using that fifteen inch or just under fifteen inch
Speaker 5: yards foot as a ruler. And my measurements came up
Speaker 5: exactly the same as John Green's chart that was done
Speaker 5: on the site. And so I basically I went off
Speaker 5: of John Green's chart in No the Sasquatch and because
Speaker 5: I verified it with the length of the foot, and
Speaker 5: then my own measurement chart.
Speaker 3: So you came out to like six or nine or
Speaker 3: seven to two something like that.
Speaker 5: Yeah, just just a round seven foot mark, maybe just
Speaker 5: a little under. And the distance between the whether the
Speaker 5: rump was twenty eight inches wide. Now, this is where
Speaker 5: I tell everybody how you can tell it's outside of
Speaker 5: human parameters is if the hips are twenty eight inches wide,
Speaker 5: those arms hung straight down. Now, if they hung straight down,
Speaker 5: they had to hang straight down from the center of
Speaker 5: the shoulder joint, which means the shoulder joint has to
Speaker 5: come out about you know, three or four inches on
Speaker 5: each side to get the center. So basically, by the
Speaker 5: time you're done, you're looking at thirty six inches from
Speaker 5: around thirty six inches from the center of one shoulder
Speaker 5: joint to the other one for the arms to hang
Speaker 5: straight down. So I told anybody, I says, grab your
Speaker 5: measuring tape, go into any gym and try and find
Speaker 5: the biggest guy in there and see if the center
Speaker 5: of his shoulder joints are three feet apart. Says, you
Speaker 5: gonna find it. You know, that's that's incredibly big. See,
Speaker 5: everything that I do is based on pivot points. Okay,
Speaker 5: where the where the joint is so, and there was
Speaker 5: some really strange things like the shin is shorter than
Speaker 5: the femur, which is ape. It's not a human parameters,
Speaker 5: it's ape. And the foot is longer longer than a human.
Speaker 5: So that means that when they if they're going to
Speaker 5: be using the compliant gait, when they have to step forward,
Speaker 5: that puts their in order for their foot to clear
Speaker 5: the ground. Because their shin is shorter and their foot
Speaker 5: is longer, it puts their shin bone parallel to the ground.
Speaker 5: So when it draws that leg forward, that shin is
Speaker 5: parallel to the ground, which people don't walk like that
Speaker 5: at all. They have a far sharper angle and a
Speaker 5: heel strike. And so because I was trying to wrap
Speaker 5: my head around why is that shin parallel to the ground,
Speaker 5: And that was why the arms were obviously longer, but
Speaker 5: the joints were in the right place like you always
Speaker 5: have because of physics. On arms, you have the same
Speaker 5: length from your forearms your upper arm before you hit
Speaker 5: the wrist, and everything was right, like there's no arm
Speaker 5: extensions for everything. But like all of the and I
Speaker 5: think Bill mun really was able to show that too
Speaker 5: in his analysis of the of the tape. You know,
Speaker 5: if if the shoulders line up, the hips don't line
Speaker 5: up with a human, If the hips line up, the
Speaker 5: shoulders don't line up with the human, if the feet
Speaker 5: line up, then nothing else lines up. And and that
Speaker 5: was actually what I had found too, just in using
Speaker 5: that that foot measurement as a as a ruler, you know,
Speaker 5: I found the same thing. So that's how I got
Speaker 5: my that's how I got my measurements for for the
Speaker 5: model I made. But I found that I could double
Speaker 5: check them onto John Green's chart, and that I found
Speaker 5: it was the same.
Speaker 3: What would you guess for the way, I think.
Speaker 5: The sasquatch are a lot heavier than people think they are.
Speaker 5: And I talked to actually, Adrian Erickson was the guy
Speaker 5: I talked to about this, and he's a hunter, you know,
Speaker 5: and you know, as hunters, we like when we shoot something,
Speaker 5: we want to know what it weighs. Okay, you take
Speaker 5: a like a big, a big grizzly bear is going
Speaker 5: to weigh eight nine hundred pounds. Okay, their their limb
Speaker 5: their limb limbs are a fraction to the size of
Speaker 5: a sasquatch, and that's where you know, it's your muscle
Speaker 5: and bone that adds up the weight. And of course
Speaker 5: they have an omnimoris for a stomach, like they have
Speaker 5: a lot of cavernous area in the center of a
Speaker 5: grizzly bear that the sasquatch doesn't have the same, and
Speaker 5: it's got a lot more muscle mass. So where you
Speaker 5: have a grizzly bear that would weigh, let's say, weigh
Speaker 5: nine hundred pounds, a sasquatch that was of the same
Speaker 5: size would probably be weigh upwards of twelve hundred pounds.
Speaker 1: You know, the model really is beautiful. Just a tremendous
Speaker 1: piece of art, is what it is. I'm lucky enough
Speaker 1: to have had it in the museum here and done
Speaker 1: a little photo shoot with our big foot model that
Speaker 1: we have in the shop, which is also very realistic,
Speaker 1: but in an entirely different way. It was really cool. Actually,
Speaker 1: it's really exciting, and I'm very very thankful to Dan
Speaker 1: to bring it by or sparks fly.
Speaker 3: When Murphy met Patty, there.
Speaker 1: Was definitely chemistry in the air.
Speaker 2: I got this eary eyed.
Speaker 5: Oh. I was just saying, did you see the model
Speaker 5: before or I put the skin on it when it
Speaker 5: was finished, like the sculpture of Patty before. Like I
Speaker 5: look at when I look back at the film and
Speaker 5: the photographs, I really consider I ruined her by putting
Speaker 5: that hide on, because if I could have just put
Speaker 5: a little more thought and get a little better hide
Speaker 5: on there, I think she'd have been a lot better.
Speaker 5: Because the model really was, that's underneath was really good.
Speaker 5: I think that a lot of that hair muted it.
Speaker 1: That's kind of that was kind of what I was
Speaker 1: going to go for for my next question here is
Speaker 1: because at the end of the day, your model is
Speaker 1: a piece of art. And I know how artists are.
Speaker 1: I mean, I'm a musician myself, my wife is an artist.
Speaker 1: They're never satisfied with what they do. Ever. But now
Speaker 1: looking back, after a few years have passed and you've
Speaker 1: created this amazing piece of art, what would you go
Speaker 1: back and tweak for the next model?
Speaker 5: Well, I would. I would put a lot more time
Speaker 5: into the head, the feet, and the hands, and I
Speaker 5: would I would pay a lot closer attention to the
Speaker 5: hair patterns and the hair length. That's what I would do.
Speaker 1: The patterns. That's interesting that that's a subtlety that someone
Speaker 1: like a taxidermist would have to pay attention to. That
Speaker 1: layperson like myself would never even think of.
Speaker 5: Yeah, well, the patterns, the patterns on the if you
Speaker 5: even look, if you look at the patterns and gimblin film,
Speaker 5: the patterns, the hair patterns are human. You know, if
Speaker 5: you see a guy with a harry back, you know
Speaker 5: how the hair kind of comes up and then falls
Speaker 5: to the sides. You know, it kind of goes up
Speaker 5: in like a fountain. Well that's the same thing, does
Speaker 5: the same thing on her like the and that's those
Speaker 5: are biological hair patterns that you can't fake with a
Speaker 5: dead cow hide. You know, there's a lot of things
Speaker 5: in that in that film that make it real to
Speaker 5: me that a lot of people haven't even analyzed yet.
Speaker 5: You know, I can just tell. One of the main
Speaker 5: things that convinced me was real was I could tell
Speaker 5: how heavy it was by when it was walking. You
Speaker 5: can see the weight because what it does is by
Speaker 5: swinging its arms, it actually uses weight momentum to carry
Speaker 5: itself forward. And unless you know anything about this, like
Speaker 5: you can see it. It's almost like a pendulum. You
Speaker 5: know how a pendulum or a gyroscope does that. You know,
Speaker 5: it moves in that manner. It's completely natural and flowing,
Speaker 5: and you can see that it's got momentum and it
Speaker 5: uses the momentum to save energy.
Speaker 1: Fascinating. Now, Dan, the film is out now, Is am
Speaker 1: I correct?
Speaker 5: It?
Speaker 2: Sure is.
Speaker 6: It was released last week and it's available to stream
Speaker 6: on demand on just about any platform where you can
Speaker 6: rent or buy a movie like iTunes and Amazon and
Speaker 6: Google Play and Fandango and Xbox and on and on.
Speaker 1: And I cannot recommend enough that everybody should see this movie.
Speaker 1: It is fascinating. It is very very much to do
Speaker 1: with sasquatches, but not as a centerpiece. It's more about
Speaker 1: the art form that recreated a sasquatch, and you can't
Speaker 1: recreate a three D vivid realistic mode of a sasquatch
Speaker 1: without going pretty deep into the anatomy and another features.
Speaker 1: It is just a fantastic movie and it's a lot
Speaker 1: of fun. I laughed out loud, and yeah, I laughed,
Speaker 1: I cried. It became a part of me.
Speaker 3: You know.
Speaker 1: It was amazing.
Speaker 4: You get to see some sweet nineties Canadian mullets that
Speaker 4: Ken sport, and.
Speaker 1: Yeah, holy god, Ken, you watch it.
Speaker 5: Hei you very much.
Speaker 6: If you go to the Big furmovie dot com website,
Speaker 6: there's links to purchase and all the social media links
Speaker 6: are on there too, and you can read a little
Speaker 6: bit about the movie and watch a trailer.
Speaker 1: So Dan and Ken, I cannot thank you enough for
Speaker 1: coming on and sharing your expertise Ken, and a little
Speaker 1: bit about the film that's just come out. Dan. It
Speaker 1: is fantastic and I cannot recommend it enough. I think
Speaker 1: all of our listeners should check this out. But thank
Speaker 1: you very much for taking time out and sharing just
Speaker 1: about all everything has been doing with us today.
Speaker 2: Well, thanks for having us that was fun.
Speaker 5: It's been a pleasure to be on here, and I
Speaker 5: hope to get a chance to meet you guys in
Speaker 5: person too.
Speaker 3: Yea, well, thank you.
Speaker 1: Very much, man. It was what a great conversation. Thank you,
Speaker 1: oh you will. Thanks all right, Bob, So there's another one.
Speaker 1: What a great conversation. That was just a fantastic episode.
Speaker 3: Oh it was.
Speaker 4: I mean, if you're looking for like some squatch slasher
Speaker 4: flick or horror movie, this isn't it. But if you
Speaker 4: want a great documentary, and you know, all I watch
Speaker 4: these documentaries. I watched, you know, several dozen every I
Speaker 4: mean I must watched fifty eight years sixty a year,
Speaker 4: and this was really good.
Speaker 3: I enjoyed it.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I get my wife sat down with me. She
Speaker 1: loved it because she's an artist and was so fascinated
Speaker 1: with the way he puts these things together. She sculpts,
Speaker 1: she paints, she does all these things, and she was
Speaker 1: intrigued the entire way. It's just a great film that
Speaker 1: I think has a wide appeal as well.
Speaker 4: All right, Cliff, thanks for getting Cannon down here. Those
Speaker 4: guys are awesome. I was a great movie. I'm glad
Speaker 4: I got to watch it. I recommend it to everyone
Speaker 4: out there to check out big fur and So until
Speaker 4: next time, thanks for listening, Hit like, hit share, enjoy
Speaker 4: the show, Tell you friends. If you don't like the show,
Speaker 4: tell your enemies. Until next week, keep it squatchy.
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