Speaker 1: Twenty third day of October twenty twenty four, allegedly according
Speaker 1: to that.
Speaker 2: Thing we call a calendar. And guess what this is,
Speaker 2: the O'Kelly effect.
Speaker 1: Now you could be hearing us on the live stream,
Speaker 1: of course at ocelly dot com radio and through your
Speaker 1: various radio apps. But then again you might also be
Speaker 1: watching the video, which I'm gonna release a little bit
Speaker 1: after the audio, and we're gonna need some visual elements tonight.
Speaker 1: But it is a Wednesday, the middle of the week,
Speaker 1: and we are broadcasting live on Ocelli dot com Radio.
Speaker 1: The video again not live, but it is being recorded.
Speaker 1: So you know, I'm not gonna make you look at
Speaker 1: my face too much tonight. We've got other issues and
Speaker 1: other images to discuss, for sure. Special show tonight. Why
Speaker 1: you know, it's kind of a I've done hundreds of
Speaker 1: shows on the JFK Assassination. Of course, I've done shows
Speaker 1: on many different topics, whether it be the news of
Speaker 1: the day, the historical events of this that the third thing,
Speaker 1: various writings, various films, film makers, etc. People that have
Speaker 1: created a lot of interesting material, whether it be academic
Speaker 1: or in the realm of entertainment. All of it barely
Speaker 1: relevant to tonight's discussion, but a grouping of shows absolutely
Speaker 1: various appearances with a lot of different authors and interesting people,
Speaker 1: even witnesses to history. Regarding the jfk assassination. This is
Speaker 1: kind of a unique thing. I've got a guy on
Speaker 1: who is an author. Indeed, you know, you could look
Speaker 1: for some older books like High Treason.
Speaker 2: You could look for that book. You could look for.
Speaker 1: Well, let's just stop talking about the ones that I
Speaker 1: don't want to talk about, and talk about.
Speaker 2: The ones I do want to talk about. And in fact,
Speaker 2: you know what, I'm going to.
Speaker 1: Hold up a couple of books real fast here, because
Speaker 1: visual aids are always helpful.
Speaker 2: And actually I'm going to hold up three books for you.
Speaker 1: Why because they are a set of three that I
Speaker 1: think is not just a required reading, but required viewing
Speaker 1: and an absolute necessity if you care to study the
Speaker 1: case in depth in any way, shape or form.
Speaker 2: The killing of a President.
Speaker 1: Now, this book is out there in softcover and hardcover
Speaker 1: form and has not currently in print, I don't think,
Speaker 1: but you know it was for a very long time.
Speaker 1: And again I don't care how you get it, you
Speaker 1: need it. What comes next, Well, there is the search
Speaker 1: for Lee Harvey Oswald, which, by the way, for years
Speaker 1: on Google. That was the book that I held in
Speaker 1: front of me when you know, I took a picture
Speaker 1: for some reason. I wanted something JFK related in front
Speaker 1: of me. In the very first interview I ever did
Speaker 1: about the case was on Lee Harvey Oswald.
Speaker 2: And guess what this is what I was holding up
Speaker 2: in front of me.
Speaker 1: And well, now to a book you can still get
Speaker 1: your hands on. And I am really happy when you
Speaker 1: can get your hands on this thing. And in fact,
Speaker 1: we might give you some special information about how to
Speaker 1: get a really special bookmark before we're all said and
Speaker 1: done tonight.
Speaker 2: And this one is much more current, absolute proof.
Speaker 1: And you know what between these the photographic information in them,
Speaker 1: you know, even if you didn't know how to.
Speaker 2: Read, I got to tell you.
Speaker 1: And oh, by the way, the special bookmark looks a
Speaker 1: little something like this. It is a ticket from the
Speaker 1: Texas Theater from nineteen sixty three, from a particular date
Speaker 1: in fact, I think. But anyway, we'll let Bob tell
Speaker 1: you about that.
Speaker 2: Oops, I spoiled it.
Speaker 1: Bob Groden is the guy with us now. He worked
Speaker 1: on the House Select Committee on assassinations as part of
Speaker 1: the group of people working on the photographic evidence the film.
Speaker 1: He showed the Supruder film to the world basically on
Speaker 1: The Roaldo Show in the nineteen seventies. That is a
Speaker 1: historic piece of footage. I'm very sure if you've ever
Speaker 1: looked at an on the case, you've looked at that
Speaker 1: piece of footage. I'm sure you've seen the Suppruter film.
Speaker 2: Okay.
Speaker 1: Indeed, he's actually responsible for I don't know, something like
Speaker 1: eighty percent of the most well known, recognizable and essential
Speaker 1: pieces of visual information that have been presented publicly. Oh yeah,
Speaker 1: also autopsy photos things like that. He's put out there too,
Speaker 1: in magazine form. In let's see, there were videos out there.
Speaker 1: I think there still are some videos floating around out there,
Speaker 1: although you got to be careful which copies you get
Speaker 1: and these books. Like I was just talking about magazines.
Speaker 2: Oh and you know what.
Speaker 1: He also used to get arrested in Dally Plaza. I
Speaker 1: think something like eighty times he got busted in Dally
Speaker 1: Plaza for doing what, oh, sharing information with people, setting
Speaker 1: up a table and saying here I am I happen
Speaker 1: to have photographic information. If you'd like to see it
Speaker 1: and giving presentations right there, just you know, a few
Speaker 1: feet away from what they call the Grassy Noll, or
Speaker 1: maybe on the Grassy Noole. Sometimes Bob was doing presentations
Speaker 1: right there in Deally Plasa kept getting arrested some years ago,
Speaker 1: but thankfully that's not the issue today. Oh and the
Speaker 1: last thing is that he's going to be at the
Speaker 1: Lancer Conference the twenty second of November, okay this year,
Speaker 1: and I.
Speaker 2: Am going to be mceing there. So I'm going to
Speaker 2: be hanging out with Bob.
Speaker 1: And I'm telling you right now, as I said on
Speaker 1: the Friday Night Calling show, I don't know last week,
Speaker 1: week before week before, you know what it's worth the
Speaker 1: price of admission right there, You're going to get to
Speaker 1: hang out with a guy who was on the hsca
Speaker 1: part of that investigation. Not going to tell you which part,
Speaker 1: and we're not going to delve into that tonight, but
Speaker 1: he was there on that you know, as part of
Speaker 1: that investigation. He definitely again helped the world see the
Speaker 1: Zupruter film, but I mean all kinds of stuff. Plus
Speaker 1: he's got a presentation to give in Dallas, and that'll
Speaker 1: be November twenty second to the twenty fourth of this
Speaker 1: year at the exactly at the Dallas Marriott Downtown. Okay,
Speaker 1: And if you go to Assassinationconference dot com you can
Speaker 1: get your tickets there. And oh, by the way, if
Speaker 1: you'd like ten percent off, Ocelli ten is a discount
Speaker 1: code you can use and get ten percent off of
Speaker 1: your tickets.
Speaker 2: Okay.
Speaker 1: But if you're going to go there in person or virtually,
Speaker 1: you can sign up at Assassinationconference dot com and I
Speaker 1: urge you to do so. If you haven't planned already
Speaker 1: to go, you should. And I gave out a bunch
Speaker 1: of names, by the way, this week on another show
Speaker 1: with Larry Hancock, which the audio is just starting to
Speaker 1: make its way out there, where I gave you a
Speaker 1: whole list of names. Oh, hold on a second. That
Speaker 1: does remind me that list of names. It just happens
Speaker 1: to be on the back of a limited T shirt
Speaker 1: I'm going to have with me in Dallas.
Speaker 2: And there's your list of names. Whoops, wait a minute, I.
Speaker 1: Might not have my Here we go with the blind guy.
Speaker 1: Can't run the audio in the video at the same time.
Speaker 1: Right anyway, for those of you listening on radio, you
Speaker 1: have no idea what's going on. But in the audio version,
Speaker 1: let me tell you, I'm holding up a T shirt
Speaker 1: which has a bunch of the names, which does include
Speaker 1: Bob Groden and myself, Carmin Savasano. Mike Swanson is kicking
Speaker 1: off the conference, Larry Hancock presenting virtually.
Speaker 2: We're not going to go there anymore.
Speaker 1: I've wasted enough time running my mouth. I have to
Speaker 1: talk to Bob Groden, and I'm going to focus on
Speaker 1: one one small area which is probably the most significant
Speaker 1: and important area when it comes to evidence and the visual,
Speaker 1: the film, the uh you know.
Speaker 2: The still pictures, all of it.
Speaker 1: I put this on the top of the list because
Speaker 1: the Bruder film and it's legitimacy. That's what I'm going
Speaker 1: to talk to Bob Groden about. But first I got
Speaker 1: to shut up and ask him how he's doing. Bob,
Speaker 1: how are you tonight?
Speaker 3: Doing well? Doing well? When you seem to be doing
Speaker 3: it fine?
Speaker 1: Thankfully, I'm happy to be here with you. This is
Speaker 1: the first time you've ever done this show. I have
Speaker 1: no idea how to to, you know, compress your introduction
Speaker 1: into something that would take me only a minute to do.
Speaker 1: I have to talk very fast, but I mean your
Speaker 1: guy with a huge background, and because you started working
Speaker 1: with this film and you ended up working with seemingly
Speaker 1: every photograph that touched the case over the decades now
Speaker 1: and indeed, wait a minute, is the twenty second?
Speaker 2: Also your birthday, by the way of November? Is that?
Speaker 2: Is that something I remember too?
Speaker 3: That's correct? I turned eighteen of the day it happened.
Speaker 3: So yeah, I was lucky. I was playing hookey from
Speaker 3: school that day and I heard the first reports on
Speaker 3: TV which changed very quickly. The fact that I heard
Speaker 3: the original reports which were the exact opposite of what
Speaker 3: they told us later on, That's when opened up my mind,
Speaker 3: that the fact there was something crazy going on here.
Speaker 2: Wow, and there you go. So I'm actually going to
Speaker 2: see you on your birthday.
Speaker 1: In Dallas this year, and an unfortunate one at that,
Speaker 1: although you know, the universe lines things up for a reason.
Speaker 1: We'll leave it at that, and you know, everybody can
Speaker 1: discuss and figure out all of the ethereal concepts themselves.
Speaker 1: Let's talk about a little bit about you though, I mean,
Speaker 1: how long had you been.
Speaker 2: Working with the Subruder film?
Speaker 1: What would you say is are the key things in
Speaker 1: your background when it comes to JFK stuff anyway, that
Speaker 1: you would present just a few bullet points, because, like
Speaker 1: I said, if I wanted to lay out a good biography,
Speaker 1: if I wanted to give a good introduction that covered
Speaker 1: everything with you, I'd be here for another half hour.
Speaker 2: So what do you think are the key points? Like
Speaker 2: Bob Roden who is Bob Roden Well.
Speaker 3: Who has worked with a photographic evens for annow sixty
Speaker 3: one years and as a brutal film came into my
Speaker 3: possession through a story which I'll tell you a little
Speaker 3: while right now, sufficing to say that I have my
Speaker 3: hands on the original film, which was a miracle, a miracle.
Speaker 3: Researchers in the case have wanted to try to find
Speaker 3: the film and look at it for years and years.
Speaker 3: It wasn't until twelve years after the assassination that I
Speaker 3: was able to release the film to the public. I
Speaker 3: had had it for several of the years, but I
Speaker 3: couldn't have I didn't have the opportunity to reveal it
Speaker 3: to the public. I was too afraid to Initially. I mean, here,
Speaker 3: we have the single most important piece of evidence in
Speaker 3: the case, and I couldn't show it to anybody. I
Speaker 3: was afraid to if somebody had found out, if the
Speaker 3: wrong person or people had found out, I would have
Speaker 3: been in the great deal of danger. So it worked
Speaker 3: out very well. Fate was on our side and a
Speaker 3: wrong river. I found out that I had the film
Speaker 3: because I showed it at a conference in Boston, and
Speaker 3: he called me up and asked if I would be
Speaker 3: willing to show the film on his show, and I said, yeah,
Speaker 3: if you wanted to show it, I certainly am, and
Speaker 3: we got together in New York and we transferred to
Speaker 3: the film onto videotape and we just showed the film
Speaker 3: on the Good Night America. There were three segments to
Speaker 3: the show. The first one was Raquel welsh Able People,
Speaker 3: the second one was a fellow who was dealing with
Speaker 3: the bermuted a triangle, and mine was the third. And
Speaker 3: that was the highest rating that Haraldo ever got, was
Speaker 3: the Zappruter film segment, and he repeated it again and
Speaker 3: that got even more so. The film itself is what
Speaker 3: got the case open, and that's a whole story, which
Speaker 3: I'll tell you in a little while. That's certainly part
Speaker 3: of the story.
Speaker 1: And it's remarkable in that up to that point, right
Speaker 1: outside of it being shown in the courtroom in New Orleans,
Speaker 1: right because District Attorney Jim Garrison had the pointed the
Speaker 1: film and it was shown, you know there, and it
Speaker 1: had been seen in still versions. There was the still
Speaker 1: version that was printed in the warrant commission. These black
Speaker 1: and white frames in in one of the volumes, so
Speaker 1: you could actually look at the frames in black and
Speaker 1: white form. Really not that clear, uh, but clearer than
Speaker 1: anything that you know was out there, because there wasn't
Speaker 1: anything out there.
Speaker 3: Uh.
Speaker 1: And then after that even there was bootleg versions that
Speaker 1: traveled around, went to universities. But these things were terrible.
Speaker 1: I mean I had my hands on one of those
Speaker 1: at one point, and uh, I mean there was a
Speaker 1: lot of whites involved in it. Seemed like a lot
Speaker 1: of missing elements. Other people talking about the muddy elements
Speaker 1: of it. I remember it looking at it, seeing it
Speaker 1: as almost transparent. When I actually held this thing and
Speaker 1: looked at the frames, it was like nothing. It was
Speaker 1: like a bad photocopy of a bad photocopy of a
Speaker 1: bad photocopy. But nonetheless it allowed people to see the
Speaker 1: film a bit, and a few of those bootleg copies
Speaker 1: traveled around in the late sixties and all the way
Speaker 1: up until you put a very good version up on
Speaker 1: Good Night America.
Speaker 3: Is that not true, Well, yeah, that's very true. What
Speaker 3: happened was when Jim Garrison subpoena the Zupporter film for
Speaker 3: showing in the courtroom during the quay Shaw trial. What
Speaker 3: they had was one that was purposely degraded. You could
Speaker 3: see the images, but you couldn't make out any detail.
Speaker 3: It was like visual mud. A copy was made of
Speaker 3: what he had and was bootlegged, which went around the
Speaker 3: country for years and years. But it was horrible. It's horrible.
Speaker 3: The copy that I showed at at the Boston conference
Speaker 3: was almost pristine, but it could have been better than
Speaker 3: it was. What happened was that Araldo's people wanted to
Speaker 3: slow it down so that they could so that I
Speaker 3: could comprehend what it was seeing, and I offered to
Speaker 3: make them a slowed down version of it. They didn't
Speaker 3: want to bother whether they want to take the time,
Speaker 3: So it would have been a lot clearer if they'd
Speaker 3: have shown what I would have given him to him
Speaker 3: to do. But you know it did. The job got
Speaker 3: out there, and all in all, it did change the
Speaker 3: history of the case. That's what got the case for you.
Speaker 2: Well, and that's the other thing.
Speaker 1: And I brought this up last night actually during a
Speaker 1: discussion where I said, look, you got to remember that
Speaker 1: they are often various events that come together to create
Speaker 1: a circumstance where something gets done. I talked about the
Speaker 1: ar RB and everybody points to the Oliver Stone film. Oh,
Speaker 1: by the way, Bob makes an appearance in JFK the movie,
Speaker 1: just saying he is in there briefly if you know
Speaker 1: where to find him, and I do. I'm not going
Speaker 1: to give it to you guys who knows. Maybe we'll
Speaker 1: use it as a trivia question and give something away
Speaker 1: around the time of the conference had head anyhow.
Speaker 2: But here's the deal.
Speaker 1: Yeah, you're showing the film, Okay, A general outcry from
Speaker 1: the public based on other congressional investigations, the Citizens Committee,
Speaker 1: these things came together to cause enough of a ruckus
Speaker 1: that we end up with the House Select Committee. In
Speaker 1: my mind, and you need all of those elements to
Speaker 1: come together, okay. And in the nineties, not just the
Speaker 1: Oliver Stone film, but the long standing campaign of release
Speaker 1: the files was definitely a pressure campaign that was going on.
Speaker 1: And I was living in New Jersey at the time,
Speaker 1: so I was very familiar with a guy named Bill
Speaker 1: Kelly and a few others who were actively involved in that.
Speaker 1: But there were people nationally and here comes Roaldo again
Speaker 1: in that case too. By the way, he had various
Speaker 1: people out there that were advocating for release the files.
Speaker 1: But it took that pressure, the public's outcry from the
Speaker 1: JFK film and a few other things to snowball. It's
Speaker 1: usually not just the one event, no matter what people
Speaker 1: point to. So I would say Bob that in effect,
Speaker 1: you even had a resonant effect in creating the HSCA
Speaker 1: in the first place, which you ended up then participating.
Speaker 3: Well, you hit the nail on the head. That's exactly
Speaker 3: what happened. When I show the film one good Night
Speaker 3: in America, a lot of people saw it for the
Speaker 3: first time. And what happened is a lot of people
Speaker 3: from Congress saw it, specifically the Virginia Congressional delegation. They
Speaker 3: contacted me, specifically Congressman Thomas Downing in Virginia, and he
Speaker 3: asked me to come to Washington to the House of
Speaker 3: Representatives and show my addit. It's not just the Zabruta
Speaker 3: film the zu Brut film, and they fell a much
Speaker 3: more film and a few others as well, and my
Speaker 3: entire slide presentation which took about two hours, and I
Speaker 3: showed him to that as representatives in to my absolute amazement,
Speaker 3: Constant Downing introduced legislation to reopen the case. It took
Speaker 3: a long time to think, about two years to do it,
Speaker 3: but eventually it did get open, and there was a
Speaker 3: second investigation, first being the Warrant Commission. The House House
Speaker 3: of Committed Assassinations went into far more detail. A Congressmant
Speaker 3: Downey had me. He asked me if I would be
Speaker 3: the typical consultant for the fully graphic Heavin was puty
Speaker 3: committee and it was critic full lifetime to do a
Speaker 3: lot of work. And the showing of this film A
Speaker 3: Good Night of America made more change to the issues
Speaker 3: of the assassination than anything else. I'm very very proud of.
Speaker 2: That, right.
Speaker 1: But again now look full credit to you, of course
Speaker 1: for participating in that. But I would say also the
Speaker 1: fact that there were other congressional investigations which were showing that,
Speaker 1: you know what, the US government might have been lying
Speaker 1: to us about a few things or hiding stuff you know,
Speaker 1: in various cases we had Watergate previous to this. I
Speaker 1: mean there is a general mood that started to come
Speaker 1: up that laid the groundwork for you to be able
Speaker 1: to come forward. So all of these things come together,
Speaker 1: and to my mind, you have to recognize that all
Speaker 1: of them participate in this. Now, I'm putting this aside,
Speaker 1: even though this in and of itself is worthy of
Speaker 1: discussion and coverage for the whole show. We could do
Speaker 1: two three hours on just this and not cover everything.
Speaker 1: But I need to get to something else here. I mean,
Speaker 1: you participated in this historical well historical influence, a campaign
Speaker 1: of influence which you were part of a big part of.
Speaker 2: And it does center on the Zubruder film.
Speaker 1: And we could talk about, you know, Abraham Subruter, the
Speaker 1: dress manufacturer, and how the film came. But let's put
Speaker 1: that aside for now. In the future, I'd love to
Speaker 1: do a very basic let's get the one oh one
Speaker 1: on this, Bob and talk about it. I would love
Speaker 1: to do that, but not tonight. And here's why a
Speaker 1: great many people are out there stating that this film
Speaker 1: is not legitimate, Bob. They will say that it's not
Speaker 1: a legitimate piece of evidence.
Speaker 2: In fact, there are people out there that say it's
Speaker 2: been fabricated.
Speaker 1: Now, I have said in the past that I see
Speaker 1: that the film has been altered at different times. In
Speaker 1: other words, there was damage to it, There were missing frames,
Speaker 1: there were things like that.
Speaker 2: That went on.
Speaker 1: And also, if you see a version of the film
Speaker 1: where it is kind of stable and you're able to
Speaker 1: follow it because it appears very steady, that's generally a
Speaker 1: version that came from you, Bob. You're the guy who
Speaker 1: stabilized it. In my mind, I think you're first, and
Speaker 1: the best stabilization.
Speaker 2: Came from you. So if you see an unstable version
Speaker 2: of that.
Speaker 1: Film where it does move around quite a bit more,
Speaker 1: you're looking at something that came from a version before
Speaker 1: you stabilized it, or most likely.
Speaker 2: But so I can say that it's been altered in
Speaker 2: that way.
Speaker 1: But there are people out there that take it a
Speaker 1: lot further and they say it's been manufactured. Things have
Speaker 1: been added, things have been taken away, They took out frames,
Speaker 1: there was a full stop of the limousine, all this stuff.
Speaker 2: Now, I don't want you to answer the.
Speaker 1: Specific charges necessarily, Bob, not at all, because again they
Speaker 1: have a list longer than my arm. Of those, you know,
Speaker 1: complaints and allegations about how the film is not legitimate.
Speaker 3: Uh, they explained to you why that happened. Okay, that'll
Speaker 3: that'll read it. There were two assassinations in quotes researchers
Speaker 3: who came up with this idea the Zip film is fake.
Speaker 3: Why because they have specific theories. The Zapprui film disproved
Speaker 3: their theories, so they attacked it. And as time went by,
Speaker 3: four and more people got involved with the concept. Though
Speaker 3: it's fate, it's fate, it's been altered, it has not
Speaker 3: been Let me explain the only damage to the film.
Speaker 3: The only thing that is if you consider retouching, is
Speaker 3: that there are two points in the film where there
Speaker 3: are missing frames. And the first, the first splice, takes
Speaker 3: place where there are two frames missing and two more damaged.
Speaker 3: The second one there are four frames missing and two
Speaker 3: frames damaged. They are no longer missing. They call them
Speaker 3: missing frames. But you have we had that book and
Speaker 3: in this let me take a minute to find it,
Speaker 3: and this I actually publish all the missing frames. They
Speaker 3: are no longer missing. These are the two splices right here,
Speaker 3: this splice here was being famous by Josiah Thompson in
Speaker 3: his book Six Seconds in Dallas. But that's because the
Speaker 3: very obvious one you can see the other one here.
Speaker 3: The splice is hidden within the shrubbery here and it's
Speaker 3: difficult to see. I'm the one who found this first splice.
Speaker 3: It was never advertised that it was there. And when
Speaker 3: I was working on the film earlier on, I had
Speaker 3: the original film in my hand, the actual camera original
Speaker 3: and as I was running it through my hand like this,
Speaker 3: I felt displice, the physical splice in my hand, and
Speaker 3: that's why I discovered it. Now everybody knows about it,
Speaker 3: but those are the only alterations to the film. Life
Speaker 3: magazine said that the junior lab technician did it by
Speaker 3: mistake when he was running down and making four by
Speaker 3: five transparency copies, that he accidentally closed something down on
Speaker 3: the film and tour it well. I find timicult to
Speaker 3: believe in the bay quarter of a million dollars for
Speaker 3: a twenty one second film and put in the hands
Speaker 3: of somebody who didn't know what they were doing, and
Speaker 3: they never released the name of the man who did it.
Speaker 3: But the point is this, there are specific issues that
Speaker 3: have to be faked. For some of the theories that
Speaker 3: other people have come up with, and it just got
Speaker 3: carried away. The Kennedy assassination is the biggest conspiracy in
Speaker 3: the history of the world. That's not enough for some people.
Speaker 3: They have to add additional co conspiracies along with it.
Speaker 3: And they're just enjoy the fact that they're saying that
Speaker 3: this Zubruta film was faked. Zubruta film is the single
Speaker 3: most important piece of evidence in the entire case. When
Speaker 3: they attack it, they're attacking the single most important thing
Speaker 3: that we've got, and the defenders of the Warring Commission
Speaker 3: must be laughing, then tushies off, because that film is legitimate.
Speaker 3: We can prove that, we can prove it, and I'm
Speaker 3: going to go into all those things for you today.
Speaker 2: Well, let me ask you this about.
Speaker 1: These specific theories really fast, because I know what one
Speaker 1: of them is right off the bat, and that is
Speaker 1: the limo stopping issue, right that's got to be it.
Speaker 1: That's got to be one of them, because they claim
Speaker 1: that frames had to be removed. Now, I don't even
Speaker 1: want to address that one.
Speaker 2: Usually because it is illogical.
Speaker 1: Okay, if you remove frames from a film like they claim, well,
Speaker 1: they must have removed a bunch of frames. It speeds
Speaker 1: up the film, It makes things go even faster, to
Speaker 1: a degree that I think these people don't understand what
Speaker 1: happens if you were to do something like that. And
Speaker 1: this idea that they have to force in this limo
Speaker 1: stop is because of eyewitnesses. Now I realize why the
Speaker 1: eyewitnesses are saying what they're saying. I understand it. And
Speaker 1: it does have to do with the malleable nature of memory.
Speaker 1: And I mean even the fact that Bill Newman was
Speaker 1: so close to the assassination, and for about twenty five years,
Speaker 1: the man stated that he thought Kennedy literally stood up
Speaker 1: in his seat, okay.
Speaker 4: And.
Speaker 2: Zero was shot up, yeah, and that his ear was
Speaker 2: shot yeah right, And you know this didn't happen.
Speaker 1: And he didn't realize that until he viewed the Zapruder
Speaker 1: film in the nineteen eighties, which was kind of crazy.
Speaker 1: He hadn't seen it on Araldo's Show with You, He
Speaker 1: hadn't seen it previously. And he was still stating at
Speaker 1: that time in the nineteen eighties. You know, over twenty
Speaker 1: years later he stood up in his seat. Now, that's
Speaker 1: not what he saw, that's what he interpreted and there
Speaker 1: was a problem. Other people did the same thing with
Speaker 1: this limo stop Bob and yeah.
Speaker 3: Things as you bring up an extremely important point at
Speaker 3: this stage, and that is the car did not stop.
Speaker 3: It didn't. This is a drawing of the entire motorcade,
Speaker 3: well not most of it anyway. There's the President's car
Speaker 3: right here, and people that are right behind it are
Speaker 3: in line with it. The President's driver, Mill Greer, put
Speaker 3: his foot on the brakes and slowed down. He was stopping,
Speaker 3: but he didn't stop. And as he did that, people
Speaker 3: from behind that were behind saw the lights come on,
Speaker 3: and other the cars in the back actually did stop.
Speaker 3: The car from the president did not. When they saw
Speaker 3: the cars slowed down and their cars stop, and they
Speaker 3: had seen the brake lights come on in the President's car,
Speaker 3: and they assumed that they all had stopped exactly.
Speaker 1: And that's the thing about the assumption because memory, look,
Speaker 1: information is constantly added to memory.
Speaker 2: It's not a recording device.
Speaker 1: So what happened is they saw these other cars stop
Speaker 1: and because of that, that gave them the idea that
Speaker 1: they all stopped. Indeed, like you said, Greer hit his
Speaker 1: and you can see in the film, by the way,
Speaker 1: in the Suppruiter film, you can see that the light
Speaker 1: comes on and he's tapping his break Okay.
Speaker 2: Now I've observed that I don't have the greatest vision.
Speaker 1: But if you take a little bit of time and
Speaker 1: study and look at the individual frames, a lot of
Speaker 1: them provided by Bob Groden, outside of the fact that
Speaker 1: again in the Warren Commission volumes they misprinted, they actually
Speaker 1: put one out of order in there, and all this
Speaker 1: other stuff.
Speaker 2: But they give you black and whites there. I'm told,
Speaker 2: even in.
Speaker 1: Those, you know, kind of bad black and white versions,
Speaker 1: you can see this break light. Okay, I know I
Speaker 1: can see it in Bob Groden's version. I know I
Speaker 1: can see it in many stills, and I have all
Speaker 1: the frames in various forms digitally. But the thing is,
Speaker 1: this is what the problem is. He almost stops. He
Speaker 1: does come to us slowing down because there's a bit
Speaker 1: of confusion, and other cars in the motorcade did indeed
Speaker 1: come to a complete stop.
Speaker 3: So some of the people who keep spreading this crap
Speaker 3: about the Zubrutter film being faked, they have two or
Speaker 3: three points of view that they bring up. One is
Speaker 3: it so many people said that the car stopped this
Speaker 3: is a lie. People said it was stop being only
Speaker 3: two people said it actually stopped, and they were not
Speaker 3: really in a position to really tell, so they held
Speaker 3: all that. They bring up all the time. The film's
Speaker 3: got to be fake because it doesn't show the car
Speaker 3: is stopping. The Zipbrut film, the nixt film, the much
Speaker 3: More film, the Bronze film, all of them show the
Speaker 3: car during the moment of the headshot. All of this stuff.
Speaker 3: The car never stops. And by the way, the people
Speaker 3: who say the film is faked and they cut out sections,
Speaker 3: they're saying it because it backs their theories. If the
Speaker 3: car had stopped for the two minutes I'm sorry, two
Speaker 3: seconds that they're saying, the thirty seven frames. If you
Speaker 3: didn't out thirty seven frames, everybody who's in the proground,
Speaker 3: in the background, whatever, within the car, if you stop
Speaker 3: the car keeps moving, it would jump. The people would jump.
Speaker 3: Because the film is eighteen frames per second. If you
Speaker 3: cut out thirty seven frames, that's two seconds it would jump.
Speaker 3: People are moving around the people within the car. It's ridiculous.
Speaker 2: A full second.
Speaker 1: Even if you're route one full second, Bob, you have
Speaker 1: people that are going to reach up and scratch their neck.
Speaker 1: You have people that are reaching into their pockets, people
Speaker 1: that are waving, and all of that stuff would jump
Speaker 1: all over the place. And what is their answer, Well,
Speaker 1: they took the crowd out separately and pasted it back in.
Speaker 1: I mean, my point about this is actually that the
Speaker 1: further you go down that rabbit hole, the more elaborate
Speaker 1: the solution has to become. You have to remove the crowd,
Speaker 1: paste it in separately. They say, Look, see the crowd
Speaker 1: doesn't even really move. They say, because it's been pasted
Speaker 1: in artificially and all these different things. But it just
Speaker 1: doesn't make logical sense. You'd have to reconstruct this thing
Speaker 1: in hole in order to get that effect. It's not
Speaker 1: a matter of removing frames. And indeed, if I were
Speaker 1: trying to create a slowing effect or a stopping effect
Speaker 1: for the car, I don't know, Bob, I would.
Speaker 2: Think you would want to add frames in.
Speaker 3: I'm just saying some One of the points is that
Speaker 3: they don't even tell you where they think it was done.
Speaker 3: They say it was done, I can't find it. You
Speaker 3: can see it if anywhere within the film.
Speaker 2: So let's move on.
Speaker 3: YEA. One other things that's saying the other major thing
Speaker 3: you're saying is that they say the film was cut
Speaker 3: because you can't see the prison's car come on to
Speaker 3: Elm Street from Houston up in this area right here,
Speaker 3: right now. The thing is this Abraham's recruiter's camera like this.
Speaker 3: It's a manually held camera. It's not like a video
Speaker 3: thing whereby it's constantly going because it's battery operated. There's
Speaker 3: a Fruiter camera just like this. In order to run it,
Speaker 3: you have to wind it up. You have to use
Speaker 3: the crank here to wind it up. And as you
Speaker 3: do that and you want a film, you hit the
Speaker 3: shutter release there you go, and then one down as
Speaker 3: it winds down and they snorre. You can hear the
Speaker 3: difference as it slows down. So cruiter had been filming
Speaker 3: for quite a bit before the person even got there.
Speaker 3: So the camera either stopped or was stopping, and he
Speaker 3: knew it, and he started to wind up. He took
Speaker 3: it away from his eye and started whinding it while
Speaker 3: it was down and he wasn't filming. That's when the
Speaker 3: car made the turn onto Elm Street. He saw that
Speaker 3: the car was there. Excuse me, They put it back
Speaker 3: up to the camera back up to his eye and
Speaker 3: started filming again byself. If he'd have kept filming the
Speaker 3: lead motorcycles and just had done the original beginning parts
Speaker 3: of this, since he didn't know where the motorcade the
Speaker 3: president's car was, he'd have missed the assassination completely.
Speaker 1: Well, there's that to consider, but it's also remember this
Speaker 1: for the listener, not for you, Bob. You know this,
Speaker 1: but it's a spring that we're talking about. There's a
Speaker 1: spring mechanism here. So there's a physical mechanism that winds
Speaker 1: down and actually, you know, over time, a lot of
Speaker 1: them become a bit inconsistent.
Speaker 2: Now that that.
Speaker 1: Particular camera maintained for a while, but eventually they become
Speaker 1: a little inconsistent. So for the concern that it may
Speaker 1: wind down one and two, the film was not very long.
Speaker 2: They didn't have an hour of tape here, you know,
Speaker 2: an hour of film inside of Yeah, so there was
Speaker 2: only a short amount.
Speaker 1: So he was trying to make sure that he actually
Speaker 1: captured again, not looking to capture the assassination because who
Speaker 1: knew that was going to happen.
Speaker 2: But again that's another argument people make. We're not going there.
Speaker 1: But if you don't know the assassination's happening, but you
Speaker 1: want to capture the president on film, He's not here yet.
Speaker 2: Let me wind it back up, make sure I'm ready,
Speaker 2: and here we go.
Speaker 1: So he was waiting to make sure so that the
Speaker 1: president would be in his field of vision, and when
Speaker 1: he was, it starts again, which is why the president
Speaker 1: suddenly appears in the film.
Speaker 2: Just that simple Okay, you're right, but yeah, go ahead,
Speaker 2: continue on though, please.
Speaker 3: There's a whole bunch of other things too, a lot
Speaker 3: of the stuff that Janet I have been working with
Speaker 3: and Jene discovered all this chat is my wonderful wife.
Speaker 3: By the way, this is a way of showing. Eight
Speaker 3: millimeter film is like this. When it's shot within a
Speaker 3: camera such as the Bruders, it's actually sixteen millimeters wide.
Speaker 3: It's called double eight. You shoot one side, you turn
Speaker 3: the film over and then you shoot the other side,
Speaker 3: so it's sixteen millimeters. Why okay, why is this important?
Speaker 3: Because if other named Adino Rugio only who worked for
Speaker 3: n Pick, a national photographic interpretation company, he had to
Speaker 3: when when they say when he said it brought the
Speaker 3: original Zapruter film to him that night for analysis. He
Speaker 3: had to go out and buy a eight millimeter projector
Speaker 3: to show it is this important the Napruiter film itself,
Speaker 3: the original film, which was in fact double eighth. I
Speaker 3: find it here. Well here it is coming out of
Speaker 3: a camera that's really looks like it's sixteen millimeters wide
Speaker 3: and gets slip when it's processed. Okay, right, Agel film
Speaker 3: itself would look like this, and it could not be
Speaker 3: this is it. This is actually from a copy of
Speaker 3: this bird film that was made before the film was
Speaker 3: slit right now, that is this whole movie stuff on
Speaker 3: the side. This is the assassination right now.
Speaker 1: This shows you Just to help you out with this,
Speaker 1: Bob here just for the listener's edification. Look, it's real simple.
Speaker 1: It runs sixteen millimeters all together, but only exposes half
Speaker 1: of that sixteen millimeters while that's being recorded. It goes
Speaker 1: from one spool to another, and when that happens, it
Speaker 1: runs all the way out. You take the now newly
Speaker 1: filled spool and reverse position with the now empty spool
Speaker 1: in the camera, which when you turn it over means
Speaker 1: now you're going to expose the other half of the
Speaker 1: sixteen millimeter film coming back through. Now, Bob just showed
Speaker 1: you visually what that looks like. Okay, but just in
Speaker 1: your mind think about this. So it is essentially way
Speaker 1: to record over the same sixteen millimeters twice, but you're
Speaker 1: only using half of the film half the first time,
Speaker 1: flip it over half the second time. Therefore you have
Speaker 1: one image kind of facing you know, in its proper
Speaker 1: orientation upward, and then you have another image and its
Speaker 1: other orientation facing downward. That is the way it would
Speaker 1: look if it was an unslit copy. And this is
Speaker 1: the way the film gets printed. They print it in
Speaker 1: sixteen millimeter form, and there it is. It's both of
Speaker 1: them together, which you can run through, to my understanding,
Speaker 1: you can run through certain projectors, but it looks terrible
Speaker 1: because you have this confusing double sided thing going on.
Speaker 1: But then what they do is they slit it in half,
Speaker 1: leaving only one side of sprockets, and then you take
Speaker 1: it and flip over the other piece and literally tape
Speaker 1: it together, so that.
Speaker 2: Now you have doubled the length of the film.
Speaker 1: That's the thing to keep in mind here that Bob
Speaker 1: just discot I'm trying to feel in a little more
Speaker 1: because sometimes people get lost on these explanations.
Speaker 2: Bob I mean, it's a simple thing.
Speaker 3: I understand that. I'm trying to that. That's the first
Speaker 3: half of the explanation. Why is it important Bruno, I'm sorry,
Speaker 3: Dino Brgioni, who worked and did a lot of this stuff.
Speaker 3: Right after the assassination, he was brought a film. They
Speaker 3: told him it was the original film. Well, the problem
Speaker 3: is he didn't have an eight millimeter projector until the
Speaker 3: film was slit. It was still sixteen no meters wide,
Speaker 3: and there's absolutely no one in the world that you
Speaker 3: get projected through like so there's no way you get
Speaker 3: projected through an eight milimeter projectors. Too wide film wouldn't
Speaker 3: fit into the projector. So he went out, he bought
Speaker 3: a projector and he showed eight meter film. The big
Speaker 3: problem that the people who say the film was fake
Speaker 3: have is a the fact that the original film sixteen
Speaker 3: millimeters wide, wasn't slit until the following week. So when
Speaker 3: Brugi only said he was dealing with the original one,
Speaker 3: he was only saying it because that's what they told
Speaker 3: him it was. It could not have been. When the
Speaker 3: film was in Dallas, Kodak processed another lad printed three
Speaker 3: copies of it. Those three copies were slit right away
Speaker 3: that day. The original film was not. Brugi only could
Speaker 3: not have projected the original film. So the issue that
Speaker 3: the fakers, the faker of backers are pushing is that
Speaker 3: since the film that Brugi only thought was the original
Speaker 3: doesn't show the car making the turn or the car stopping,
Speaker 3: it had to be a fake. It wasn't. This is
Speaker 3: very important to me because I took tremendous chance releasing
Speaker 3: the film in the first place. If I hadn't done it,
Speaker 3: no one would have seen it. I was very fortunate
Speaker 3: to be able to get away with doing it. The
Speaker 3: Live magazine in their first issue, their memorial edition like that,
Speaker 3: they published black and white frames of superior films, selected frames.
Speaker 3: Where did those come from? From? The eight millimeter original
Speaker 3: that had not yet been slit? And that was done
Speaker 3: in Chicago, but again not till the following week. And
Speaker 3: this it became very technical and it's really involved with
Speaker 3: if I ever do another book, and we go to
Speaker 3: much more detail about this. But when I've written, I've
Speaker 3: written eight books on the assassination. In those eight books,
Speaker 3: no one had ever brought up the concept of the
Speaker 3: film being faked. Because it's ridiculous. It could not. Then
Speaker 3: there are other issues too. An original film in the
Speaker 3: camera is what they call be wind. Now, what the
Speaker 3: b y means is that if you hold up the
Speaker 3: film and you see it, you're looking through the base
Speaker 3: of the film because the emotion would be facing the
Speaker 3: light source. Okay, so you're looking at it as be wind.
Speaker 3: There's a bruder film. Original is be wind. If you
Speaker 3: make a copy of it, it goes emotion to emotion
Speaker 3: and then it becomes a why it reads backwards to
Speaker 3: the other side of the film. So there's lots of
Speaker 3: reasons such as this that showed the film is legitimate
Speaker 3: and when a lot of the issues too that that
Speaker 3: they're saying, which I'm going into too much detail with,
Speaker 3: is that this is a prude film. This is from myka,
Speaker 3: it's Christine, it's in beautiful shape. It's that's nice copy.
Speaker 3: The defenders of the or or the feel that that
Speaker 3: go after the film that attack it, they're dealing with
Speaker 3: something that's absolute visual mud too. It's it's it's as blood,
Speaker 3: if not worse than the so that the yeah that
Speaker 3: the Garrison had it's not very clear and it's junk.
Speaker 3: What they're saying, is that they see a hole hand
Speaker 3: painted in in the baculum. Prison said, well, they're not.
Speaker 2: Well, that was the That was the next thing. I
Speaker 2: was going to confront you with, Bob, and I want
Speaker 2: you to attack this.
Speaker 1: Uh.
Speaker 2: They have this whole theory about the black spot on
Speaker 2: the back of the head where they say it's been
Speaker 2: literally and it does look strange in some prints. I
Speaker 2: got to be honest with you, it does look strange.
Speaker 2: But do I think it's been faked?
Speaker 1: No, But I don't know how to explain why this
Speaker 1: happened or you know that there's a lot of interesting
Speaker 1: anomalies that come up, by the way.
Speaker 2: In film, especially in this process.
Speaker 1: There's a lot of things that can occur with light,
Speaker 1: with exposure, with the camera, with the lenses, et cetera,
Speaker 1: et cetera.
Speaker 2: But it does look weird.
Speaker 1: The back of JFK's head at a certain point looks
Speaker 1: so solid that it does appear almost like somebody colored
Speaker 1: it in, And a lot of them point to that, Bob,
Speaker 1: is there something easy you can give us to knock
Speaker 1: that down.
Speaker 3: Yes, my Mark, Jenet and I weren't in the museum
Speaker 3: in Indiana, and they had a piece of hard work.
Speaker 3: That's what it looked like. I'm I'm going to look
Speaker 3: at this. This a damn. This is the area that
Speaker 3: would be considered the prison's hair on a Zibruter film.
Speaker 3: And this is the hole in the back of his head.
Speaker 3: If you do Densitomoy readings on this as opposed to this,
Speaker 3: it's going to be different. That's what you would expect.
Speaker 3: Mention when you see, right, that's the answer. Now you
Speaker 3: have JFK absolute proof there. Yes, there are specific frames
Speaker 3: of the Zaprui film Fames three thirty five and three
Speaker 3: thirty seven, the two clear frames, the only clear frames
Speaker 3: on the back of the prisident's head after the headshut. Okay,
Speaker 3: this is a blow up of frame three thirty seven.
Speaker 3: Missus Kennedy is looking right at the exitum of the
Speaker 3: Act of the President said in three five and three
Speaker 3: thirty seven. The uh that is in profile and you
Speaker 3: see the evlsteria that was described by all the doctors.
Speaker 3: Now one thing I'm watching to be pleased be aware of.
Speaker 3: I know you are, but anyone who's watching they should know.
Speaker 3: I'm not saying that Oswald acted alone. I'm saying it
Speaker 3: was a conspiracy. Oswald, based on the evidence, had nothing
Speaker 3: to do with it. I'm on the same side as
Speaker 3: the people who are saying the film is big fakes,
Speaker 3: but they're doing it wrong, and they're taking the evidence
Speaker 3: that proves that we're right and just ignoring it. And
Speaker 3: that's absolutely dangerous. It's thing with this, I just get
Speaker 3: away with it.
Speaker 2: And that's the thing. They're literally undermining one of the
Speaker 2: most important pieces. And we can draw a lot.
Speaker 1: I mean, if you see a good copy of this,
Speaker 1: and I don't mean you, Bob, because you've seen the
Speaker 1: best versions of this film.
Speaker 2: But the truth is, if you see this very.
Speaker 1: Closely, carefully and you're able to view it in its
Speaker 1: best form, I can literally see blood splash on Jackie
Speaker 1: Kennedy's face.
Speaker 2: I can see her react and flinch to it.
Speaker 1: Okay, and this is not the best possible filming that
Speaker 1: was done, But when you look at the best possible
Speaker 1: copy of this, you can see a lot of details,
Speaker 1: the reflections of things in the hood of not the
Speaker 1: hood in the body, in the paint of the car.
Speaker 1: You can see things on the rear trunk of the
Speaker 1: car that are reflections. Okay, there's a lot of detail
Speaker 1: that can be seen if you see a good copy of.
Speaker 3: This Jackie Jackie climbs out on the trunk of a
Speaker 3: car and piece of a piece of the skull, right,
Speaker 3: you can really see and once again, you know, copies
Speaker 3: that I have are made directly from the original and
Speaker 3: they're flawless, just flaws. The stuff that they're looking at
Speaker 3: is like multi generation exactly. There's a technique call they
Speaker 3: call it four K, which means it deals with the
Speaker 3: amount of resolution within a frame. They got a garbage
Speaker 3: copy of the film, and they had a four K
Speaker 3: copy of garbage and that's what they're dealing with, and
Speaker 3: it's it's ridiculous. I have when we spoke before about
Speaker 3: my my d d ds, before we started doing all this.
Speaker 3: These are two DVDs which I have. This one is
Speaker 3: a full documentary on the Kennedy case. It has the
Speaker 3: highlights of all the films, has explusive interviews from the
Speaker 3: Dallas doctors and things of that nature. This one has
Speaker 3: intact versions of all the films and the assassinations. In fact,
Speaker 3: the total of one hundred and twenty two between the
Speaker 3: Moti Kaid and the assassination and the investigation. These are
Speaker 3: cooler copies than anyone else's got, and they're available and tremendous.
Speaker 1: Let me say something about that. Before you're done talking
Speaker 1: about that they are available. I want you to tell
Speaker 1: people where to get them, but I'm going to tell
Speaker 1: people why to get them.
Speaker 2: And here's the thing.
Speaker 1: It's not just that the headshot and the events of
Speaker 1: the murder are memorialized in the Subruder film. You can
Speaker 1: see this in the Knicks film. You can see this
Speaker 1: in the much More film. And now there's also a
Speaker 1: couple of others in there that people often do not mention.
Speaker 1: The Bell film, for instance, shows the headshot. A lot
Speaker 1: of people never mentioned that, and I know why. Look,
Speaker 1: it's very very hard, even with you enhancing the Bell film,
Speaker 1: it's very hard hard to make out things on it
Speaker 1: because of the way he shot the film. And there's
Speaker 1: yet another film on there that that shows the headshot.
Speaker 2: And which one is that?
Speaker 3: Bob, Well, the next film shows it, right, Nix much
Speaker 3: More Side of the Street.
Speaker 2: Oh jeez, yeah, no problem at all. I'll just continue
Speaker 2: on with what I was saying.
Speaker 3: Know what happened with my my my my phone went
Speaker 3: off of my year m sorry, oh no, no problem. You. Okay,
Speaker 3: all right, there's a lot of the next film. We'll
Speaker 3: talk about that too, But well, there's a lot of
Speaker 3: things that showed the supporter film is genuine. Right, they're
Speaker 3: saying that that it's been fake. And the reason why
Speaker 3: the uh, the reason why the uh, the film had
Speaker 3: to be spliced at the point where the where they
Speaker 3: can't begin after the turn. Well, there is something that
Speaker 3: happens in film that doesn't happen in videotape. That's called
Speaker 3: flash frame. You had mentioned before that there's a spring
Speaker 3: tension on the Zubruiter camera when you start filming. It
Speaker 3: takes a fraction of a second to get up to
Speaker 3: running speed. So the first frame is given more light
Speaker 3: and it includes it's called a flash frame. This is
Speaker 3: a section of the A side and A side of
Speaker 3: the Zapruter film. This is the regular exposure. This is
Speaker 3: the first frame. You see how much brighter it is.
Speaker 1: And that's because it actually travels through the gate slightly slower,
Speaker 1: therefore has a greater amount of exposure to light.
Speaker 2: Is that correct?
Speaker 3: There you go. So the point of the matter is
Speaker 3: that same type of flash frame occurs at the first
Speaker 3: frame when the car comes into view. There's just one
Speaker 3: more piece of evidence that's genuine, it's legitimate. There is
Speaker 3: when you see the Zuppruter film the way I presented
Speaker 3: within the book, you're getting to see more detail.
Speaker 2: Yeah, there's more detail.
Speaker 3: And right, Ray, Ray Ray, let me call you. I'm
Speaker 3: doing a radio show.
Speaker 2: Right now live. This is what happens when we record live, folks.
Speaker 3: I'll go right back a little while, Okay, I thank you,
Speaker 3: thank you, all right.
Speaker 2: No problem, Bob, go ahead, continue. Sorry, I forget where
Speaker 2: I even was.
Speaker 1: Well, you were explaining after the flash frame, right that
Speaker 1: that's present, and then you were going to explain something
Speaker 1: else after that. The legitimacy passed the flash frame, which
Speaker 1: is shown right after the turn, which reveals to you
Speaker 1: that this was obviously the start of the film once
Speaker 1: again with the spring and.
Speaker 2: All of that.
Speaker 3: So you would not have the flash frame if in
Speaker 3: fact it had been edited to duplicate with it Veray
Speaker 3: cut out there. The flash frame is the key. Most
Speaker 3: people don't even know the flash frames even exist. But
Speaker 3: I've been in the emotion picture industry doing this kind
Speaker 3: of stuff for thirty five forty years now, and I
Speaker 3: know what to look for. The point of the matter
Speaker 3: is that I can't explain the emotional reasons why people
Speaker 3: really have to attack the film. There's only actually about
Speaker 3: a half a dozen of them. But we've we've got
Speaker 3: one one character who's assisting the film is faked, who
Speaker 3: says he knows it's faked because you only see one
Speaker 3: Secret Service agent jump on the back of the car
Speaker 3: on the truck. There only was one right u Hill.
Speaker 3: This guy for some reason believes that there were two
Speaker 3: of them back there, and they edited it out to
Speaker 3: cut the other off the truck of the car. Why
Speaker 3: only Heaven knows. If you're going to fake the film,
Speaker 3: and you can see this very clearly in the book,
Speaker 3: you're going to cut out any part of the film
Speaker 3: that challenges the official fiction. If you're even do it,
Speaker 3: you're going to cut out the frames that show the
Speaker 3: back of the head. At three thirty five and three
Speaker 3: thirty seven, the doctors all said that the head wound
Speaker 3: in the back of the prison, said was a lost
Speaker 3: outwards who was just the skull was out. They part
Speaker 3: it looked like a volcano. You see that and the
Speaker 3: Zapruda film, they would have cut those things out. They
Speaker 3: cut out the fact that the president was thrown to
Speaker 3: the rear when he was hitting the head, showing that
Speaker 3: the shot came from the front. They don't. It's right there,
Speaker 3: all right. Why would we leave that in? It cuts
Speaker 3: something else out. You can ask the defenders of the
Speaker 3: film if they know what they're doing I'm talking about,
Speaker 3: they'll back it all the way. For the people who
Speaker 3: attack it, the one question you can ask is Quibono,
Speaker 3: who profits? Won't do it? There's no value to it.
Speaker 1: The only Devil's Advocate issue I can give you, and
Speaker 1: I can give it to you and then knock it
Speaker 1: right down, Bob without a problem is that some people
Speaker 1: might say it was specifically done to add confusion, to
Speaker 1: make sure that okay, you don't have the official story,
Speaker 1: but also the real story of the conspiracy is hidden
Speaker 1: this way too, and therefore you have a document which
Speaker 1: does not support any story properly. And then I say, well, look,
Speaker 1: there's a couple of problems here, and one of them
Speaker 1: is you'd also have to fake a polaroid.
Speaker 2: That kind of goes along with.
Speaker 1: It, because you know, there was this lady there that
Speaker 1: was using a polaroid camera, and I got to tell you,
Speaker 1: polaroids are probably the last thing that anybody who works
Speaker 1: with photographs ever wants to work with photographically because they're horrible.
Speaker 1: You know, you literally have chemical spray all over the
Speaker 1: damn thing. I mean, they're nice for what their purpose was,
Speaker 1: you know, in the time that they were popular and
Speaker 1: all that, for home use.
Speaker 2: But to try and do something with that, to try
Speaker 2: and alter it, oh my goodness.
Speaker 1: I mean, I don't even want to think about the
Speaker 1: kind of project it would take to alter that.
Speaker 2: And I'm talking about Mary Mormon's photo. Those are polaroids originally.
Speaker 3: So Mary and Mormon is a very close friend of
Speaker 3: both of us, of Jan and myself, and I've had
Speaker 3: in my hands when I worked for the ass Assassin's
Speaker 3: Committee two of the three pictures she took on Elm Street.
Speaker 3: The third one was given to a police officer who
Speaker 3: destroyed it and it showed a six foot window with
Speaker 3: nobody in it. Okay, anyway, I have a copy in
Speaker 3: the book that shows Mary Mormon's picture taken from a
Speaker 3: first day copy negative done at Channel FAA, the Channel
Speaker 3: TV channel in Dallas, and it shows very clearly the
Speaker 3: home on the back of the head that the people,
Speaker 3: the people who were attacking the film just ignore right.
Speaker 2: Well, and that to me is the key, because you
Speaker 2: would again have to work with that. Okay, look, if.
Speaker 1: You take a look at what's out there on the internet,
Speaker 1: sure it's inconclusive, but that's because of the nature.
Speaker 2: Of the copy of being a copy, being a copy
Speaker 2: being a.
Speaker 1: Copy, and then the digital process which makes them of
Speaker 1: it even further. So you can't use that all right, Fine,
Speaker 1: what about the other films that corroborate the Zapruder film.
Speaker 1: Some of these guys even get into an explanation where
Speaker 1: those have been altered too, and that is just the
Speaker 1: level of insanity. I can't match up. So let's knock
Speaker 1: it all down. You can't possibly have accomplished this, in
Speaker 1: my mind, as fast as they did broadcast the much
Speaker 1: More film shortly after the assassination. That was broadcast. Okay,
Speaker 1: that was one of the few things that actually made
Speaker 1: it to broadcast, So that went out there. We know
Speaker 1: it's been memorialized. Come on, now, they made the much
Speaker 1: More film match up to this right away. I thought
Speaker 1: it took all the way through the weekend with all
Speaker 1: these stories to get it all done, right, So you've
Speaker 1: got a problem here. Anyway, The point is. I mean,
Speaker 1: I think those are the key points that people go to.
Speaker 1: You know, well, what you don't believe the CIA.
Speaker 3: Would do this?
Speaker 2: Absolutely, I do. Could they have do we have evidence?
Speaker 3: You know? But they did?
Speaker 2: Right.
Speaker 3: I just realized what I was talking about before on
Speaker 3: the phone running this particular it's called screwball. The person
Speaker 3: who attacks the film okay, uh says he can tell
Speaker 3: his face because the cigaret service guard Roy Killiman, is
Speaker 3: sitting next to the driver. He jumps out of the car,
Speaker 3: but it doesn't show it. He sit in the car
Speaker 3: all the way to the hospital. He never left. This
Speaker 3: guy comes up with stuff out of his you know what. Yeah,
Speaker 3: and Uh not only can get into names any of
Speaker 3: these people, because it's just crazy. Some of these people
Speaker 3: believe the garbage that they're saying. Other people know that
Speaker 3: they're lying. It's hard to tell sometimes which is which.
Speaker 3: But some people have pretty good credentials in other areas.
Speaker 3: But do you know what the f stop is?
Speaker 1: I would love for you to explain it best. I
Speaker 1: read about it, and you know, I have a basic idea,
Speaker 1: but I would love for you to explain it because
Speaker 1: you bring it up on almost every interview.
Speaker 2: I love it.
Speaker 1: You always say, you know, they don't know an F
Speaker 1: stop from a bus stop. That's one of your favorite phrases.
Speaker 3: But just grab my line.
Speaker 2: I grabbed your line. But can you explain it to
Speaker 2: people though, because I have had that question, ask to
Speaker 2: me what is in F stop?
Speaker 3: So please let me explain to you that a friend
Speaker 3: of mine said, nobody knows photography. I only know it
Speaker 3: was video table blah. But so the F stop is
Speaker 3: the size of the aperture that allows more or less
Speaker 3: light in to the raw stock or unexposed negative. You
Speaker 3: mentioned it. I'll mention myself too. The people who are
Speaker 3: attacking this's a Bruta film don't know and have stopped
Speaker 3: from a bus stop. And it's absolutely absolutely key to
Speaker 3: know that. People have claimed that they all I've been
Speaker 3: in the film business for twenty years doing what working
Speaker 3: in the office, filling out paperwork. You know, they don't
Speaker 3: know the techniques, They don't know what to look for.
Speaker 3: One thing that I nearly forgot to mention is in
Speaker 3: there's a Bruder film, there's a Bruti film itself. The
Speaker 3: camera original has information in the picture area and on
Speaker 3: the left hand side it's got pictures between this rocket holes, yes,
Speaker 3: which are not within the so called regular picture area.
Speaker 3: The original film has that information between this rocket holes.
Speaker 3: All the jubigates do not. The one that grew Brunoni
Speaker 3: and Brugioni and the others have dealt with did not
Speaker 3: have the information between the projects right, and therefore they
Speaker 3: were not working with the original film. There's there's that simple.
Speaker 2: Right now.
Speaker 1: Just to explain this again to somebody who might not
Speaker 1: understand the sprocketal, what happens here is that there is
Speaker 1: a kind of a an imperfection here where light is
Speaker 1: being exposed onto a part of the film that's not
Speaker 1: meant to capture image. It's there to be you know
Speaker 1: what it is the sprockets, right, The crockets are supposed
Speaker 1: to grab it and carry it through the projector or
Speaker 1: carry it through the camera as it's being run through.
Speaker 1: And that's not an area that's meant to capture image.
Speaker 1: But the thing is it's a little bit of skew somehow.
Speaker 2: And therefore it's getting exposed that's not supposed to happen.
Speaker 2: And you'll find variations in this because people have taken
Speaker 2: other versions like they they've taken basically Suppruters camera, but
Speaker 2: not Supruters camera one just like it, and you'll get
Speaker 2: different exposures in those Sprocket holes, sometimes right where it
Speaker 2: doesn't go all the way over, it goes only a
Speaker 2: little bit over, or not at all, and things like that.
Speaker 3: So, yeah, these these are the Sprocket holes I'm waiting too, right,
Speaker 3: those are the things. There's a clause that goes to
Speaker 3: the camera and then to the projector that stabilizes and
Speaker 3: holds the film in the right position that's on the
Speaker 3: original on Subruters camera. Doesn't happen in all cameras, but
Speaker 3: happened on is when it's actually image being captured on
Speaker 3: the film between there, right and again, I have to
Speaker 3: waste so much time dealing with why we know the
Speaker 3: film is real and why it's not, and why it's
Speaker 3: important is because it shows what actually did happen and
Speaker 3: what they're trying to say. People who attack the film
Speaker 3: say it doesn't show it actually happened. It shows on
Speaker 3: the thing right, as you mentioned before, if they were
Speaker 3: to cut out the two seconds that they're talking about,
Speaker 3: everybody in the car would jump from point A to
Speaker 3: point B right as the president would be going from
Speaker 3: this to this in one frame instead of a series
Speaker 3: of frames.
Speaker 1: Exactly when you remove frames in between, you know, movements,
Speaker 1: you're going to have what appears to be super fast movements.
Speaker 1: You know that used to be something they did as
Speaker 1: a special effect in a very basic way for films
Speaker 1: where you were creating an image where somebody you know moved,
Speaker 1: they were able to run, you know, twenty feet in
Speaker 1: less than a second.
Speaker 2: How could you do that?
Speaker 1: You could remove a bunch of frames and in less
Speaker 1: than a second they are twenty feet in another direction.
Speaker 2: No problem. That's the type of effect you would get
Speaker 2: by removing frames.
Speaker 1: And that's what you have to remember here. I mean,
Speaker 1: I'm really explaining this in the layman's way, best way.
Speaker 1: I know that you know all the technical things and
Speaker 1: you actually understand film, which again is a whole different
Speaker 1: thing from what we see in video and digital.
Speaker 2: Versions, et cetera.
Speaker 1: So absolutely right, all of this having been said, Bob,
Speaker 1: is this does this cover the main keys you think
Speaker 1: for what people should know regarding this Zebruder film fakery idea?
Speaker 2: Or is there one more thing?
Speaker 1: Or should we be looking to you in Dallas for
Speaker 1: a presentation, because my understanding is this might come up
Speaker 1: during your presentation in Dallas.
Speaker 3: Will you know again you bring that up, That's an
Speaker 3: important point. Two. There are a whole bunch of other
Speaker 3: issues that we can be spending time dealing with, and
Speaker 3: we don't get to even talk about those who have
Speaker 3: to spend so much time dealing with this craziness that
Speaker 3: comes up on in the minds of people that really
Speaker 3: don't know what they're talking about exactly. That all these
Speaker 3: people are already they have taken technical issues that they're
Speaker 3: they're familiar with in other areas that don't deal with
Speaker 3: the mechanics of the film. There's a brutor film is,
Speaker 3: which is that absolutely, there's no question about it. You
Speaker 3: couldn't fake it. Do what you did. There's a there's
Speaker 3: an issue called jump cut, which is if you had
Speaker 3: this guy here and somebody else over there that looked
Speaker 3: like him, you could eliminate the frames in between and
Speaker 3: spice one to the other and get a jump cut.
Speaker 3: That does not occur in the film at all. There's
Speaker 3: nobody like that. There aren't that many people on the
Speaker 3: far side of the street. One of the researchers who
Speaker 3: came up with the idea of the film is faked
Speaker 3: shows that all the people standing in the crowd on
Speaker 3: the north side of Elm Street are all cardboard cutouts.
Speaker 3: Really one of the people who are really there? Where
Speaker 3: are they again? The Supreme film, the Knicks film, the
Speaker 3: much More film, and the Bronson film. We have those four.
Speaker 3: The fifth one of the Oliver film, who was taken
Speaker 3: by the FBI, We've never seen it. I've released all
Speaker 3: the others. I've released one hundred and twenty two films
Speaker 3: of the assassination, the motorcade and follow up the investigation.
Speaker 3: I even released shouldn't get into this, but I'm even
Speaker 3: released in absolute proof the autopsy photographs of the President,
Speaker 3: which are not yet released officially won't be these is
Speaker 3: supposed to be released in twenty thirty nine. How we
Speaker 3: don't think there were be released even then.
Speaker 2: Yeah, good good luck on that.
Speaker 1: As we watched the cane kicked down the road. Even
Speaker 1: with the assassination records review board, I am not holding
Speaker 1: my breath for that release date. I wanted to just
Speaker 1: touch on one other thing, you know, I'd love to
Speaker 1: spend time talking about a lot of things with you,
Speaker 1: Bob that we did not touch upon tonight.
Speaker 2: And I'm just going to bring up one of them, which.
Speaker 1: Is a great feature and Absolute Proof there was a
Speaker 1: role of film apparently taken where we now for the
Speaker 1: first time see some images that had never been seen
Speaker 1: by anyone before as far as I know, of a
Speaker 1: surgical theater and someone being operated.
Speaker 2: On in that book. And you got it off of
Speaker 2: a role of film that had not been developed for many,
Speaker 2: many years.
Speaker 1: And indeed you had a hard time even pulling images
Speaker 1: out in the first place.
Speaker 2: But you've actually created a set of.
Speaker 1: Images in this book that I would love to spend
Speaker 1: a full show discussing with you what is it we
Speaker 1: see in here? What's going on? Maybe you could get
Speaker 1: people a hint. And another good reason why this it's
Speaker 1: an expensive book. But it's expensive because it's very expensive
Speaker 1: to print high quality copies of photographs, my friends, And
Speaker 1: that's what you have is high quality photographs throughout this book.
Speaker 1: And you know, Bob will tell you how many. And
Speaker 1: of course he's got the other two big books which
Speaker 1: released plenty of photos before this. But this is one
Speaker 1: of the very unique things in the book, Absolute Proof.
Speaker 1: Would you mind just telling people what that is or
Speaker 1: a little bit about it?
Speaker 3: The killia of President and the search for le Harvey
Speaker 3: Oswald and before that kind of trees and then the
Speaker 3: k I've written eight books on the case. Absolute Proof
Speaker 3: is the only one that's still really available. I was
Speaker 3: the first non authorized person initially to see this approver.
Speaker 3: I'm sorry. The ontopsy photographs I've seen and handheld the
Speaker 3: originals in the National Art gives the originally one hundred
Speaker 3: and fifty two pictures. There's only fifteen of them left.
Speaker 3: I published them all in the book. There's one photograph
Speaker 3: that's not supposed to exist. I think this is what
Speaker 3: you're talking about. It's a black and white. The size
Speaker 3: of film is called one's one piece of film, and
Speaker 3: there's a series of images on that. They're all pretty
Speaker 3: much the same image, but they start under exposed, instead
Speaker 3: of getting brighter and brighter, to get worse and worse
Speaker 3: until you can't even see anything. There is not any
Speaker 3: inventory in the archives or in the warr commissioner anything
Speaker 3: like that that explains these pictures. They show the president
Speaker 3: from about mid thigh up to over the top of
Speaker 3: his head, and we're looking at him from the left side,
Speaker 3: and he's lying on the table. This is supposed to
Speaker 3: be something which doesn't even get explained. There are a
Speaker 3: lot of pictures that are missing, but this is the
Speaker 3: only thing that's not supposed to exist, which does I
Speaker 3: have no way of explaining how or why. But I
Speaker 3: publish all the pictures that I could, including the autopsy pictures.
Speaker 3: I felt it was important to see it because when
Speaker 3: you see the condition of the prisons said and compare
Speaker 3: it to what the government said, completely different.
Speaker 2: Absolutely.
Speaker 3: Two situations, one for the Warring Commission, one for the
Speaker 3: House Assassinations Committee, where they had artists drough the drawings
Speaker 3: of the presidents. The first was done for the Warring
Speaker 3: Commission by Philliam Skipper Roberg, and mister Roberg was not
Speaker 3: allowed to see the prison's body, was not allowed to
Speaker 3: see the autopsy photographs. They just told one to put there.
Speaker 3: The second was for the House Assassinations too many. They
Speaker 3: hired an artist. Her name was I to docs Maloney,
Speaker 3: the official name she uses professionals justide docks. Janet came
Speaker 3: across a saying she she she left something uh in
Speaker 3: a report tweety. When she was asked about the drawings,
Speaker 3: she said that she made the drawings to illustrate the
Speaker 3: conclusions of the medical panel, not what they actually showed.
Speaker 3: You need to repeat that. Yeah, but I can't do
Speaker 3: it as well as you just did. Did we able
Speaker 3: to hear that, chuck?
Speaker 2: Oh no, I heard it. Yes, absolutely, the conclusions of
Speaker 2: the medical panel not frustrated. Yeah, that's what was illustrated.
Speaker 3: Yes, she did what they told her to do. And
Speaker 3: there was another thing too, during one of the meetings
Speaker 3: that was going on, where Michael Boden, who was the
Speaker 3: head of the medical panel, said to her, Ida, you
Speaker 3: can do better than this. You didn't like the fact.
Speaker 3: Now in my book, which you've seen, showing the pictures
Speaker 3: of the back of the prison's body, right, there are
Speaker 3: two holes in his back. The House committee never once
Speaker 3: mentioned that, but sure to hear.
Speaker 2: Well.
Speaker 1: It's funny because in the docs images, what we have
Speaker 1: here is a bunch of missing information. It does look
Speaker 1: to me like she must have seen the photos, but
Speaker 1: clearly she left out tons of information. And the funny
Speaker 1: part to me is that these people, some of them
Speaker 1: claim to be you know, photographic acts words, don't realize
Speaker 1: that they're looking at a drawing at number one and
Speaker 1: number two make statements like look at how much more
Speaker 1: cleaned up he is in these in these images, and
Speaker 1: it's very funny. It's not just cleaned up, it's literally
Speaker 1: redacted by her drawing. But you're showing us something different
Speaker 1: in the back. And then I have something else to
Speaker 1: show you.
Speaker 3: But go ahead. This is the president his back right.
Speaker 3: The Warrick Commission said that the entrance hole of the
Speaker 3: bullet was in the back of the President's neck. Who
Speaker 3: pushed this, Gerald Ford? Yes, but he did it to
Speaker 3: clarify the image. There is no hole in the back
Speaker 3: of the president's neck, none at all. There are two
Speaker 3: holes in his back, the entrance wound from the depository
Speaker 3: or somewhere from behind, and the ais of wound from
Speaker 3: the throat wound, right next to each other. This one here,
Speaker 3: the larger of them, which is too large to be
Speaker 3: a carcano bullet hole it the front and his bank
Speaker 3: just below that is the engine would with a uh oh,
Speaker 3: hey what they call it a abrasion collar. That's it,
Speaker 3: thank you, you can rememh And they spoke for me,
Speaker 3: no problem, I'll help you.
Speaker 1: Uh.
Speaker 3: The second one, what the House Committee did is that
Speaker 3: EI dogs draw the bank, eliminating the engine would but
Speaker 3: showing the agent would name calling it the entrance.
Speaker 2: Woold right, yeah, no, it was amazing what was done there.
Speaker 1: Uh And and the thing is, look, I've had I
Speaker 1: had a decent copy, and I wish I still had them,
Speaker 1: But I lost my copy of the what I would
Speaker 1: call the fox set, which which was made from a
Speaker 1: very good copy at the time. I could see a
Speaker 1: lot of detail in those that I've never seen anywhere.
Speaker 1: At no offense to you, even Bob, but even in
Speaker 1: your book, I had a very good copy that was
Speaker 1: better than even what I see in your book at
Speaker 1: one time, because it was allegedly made from there was
Speaker 1: a contact a negative made at one point, and mine
Speaker 1: was made from that negative. Initially, you know, when those
Speaker 1: photos started to circulate, they were just photos, and then
Speaker 1: someone created a negative. Well, that negative supposedly generated my copy,
Speaker 1: and I had eight x tens and I was very
Speaker 1: proud of that copy, but my ex wife didn't allow
Speaker 1: me to keep them anyway.
Speaker 2: But there was a lot of detail in those photos.
Speaker 2: What's that.
Speaker 1: Well I would love to have if there's some way,
Speaker 1: I mean, look, I don't know what it would cost
Speaker 1: you or whatever, but if there's a way I could
Speaker 1: acquire another set of those, Believe me, I'd love to
Speaker 1: have them.
Speaker 3: Fox pictures were taken and they were black and white, yes,
Speaker 3: and they were taken by an FBI agent named Fox,
Speaker 3: and that's where they came from. White and white, mind
Speaker 3: and color.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 1: But my but my set, Yeah, my set still contained
Speaker 1: a lot of information though about I loved that set. Anyways,
Speaker 1: I want to show you what it was I was
Speaker 1: going to ask you about, which wasn't that photo. But
Speaker 1: these images you see where we have doctors in Yes,
Speaker 1: you see what I'm talking about now. And I'm probably
Speaker 1: a little out of focus here, but I assure you, guys,
Speaker 1: if you get the book, this is one of the
Speaker 1: things that right there is why you need to get
Speaker 1: this book.
Speaker 2: This is just two of the pages.
Speaker 1: There's multiple pages of this, and there's doctors appearing to
Speaker 1: you get ready for surgery here.
Speaker 3: Yes, indeed, those pictures were taken of Lee Harvey Oswald
Speaker 3: on the operating table when they're trying to save his life.
Speaker 3: This is after he shot, before he died. The last
Speaker 3: pictures of him in life are taken their life of
Speaker 3: him being alive, right, and the first shots of them
Speaker 3: when he died. And the thing that nobody even knew
Speaker 3: they even existed, and I came across them some years ago.
Speaker 3: The films had not even been processed yet, they hadn't
Speaker 3: even been developed. I took them to the only place
Speaker 3: in the world it's still processed that type of film,
Speaker 3: and we gone processed. And the thing is they were damaged.
Speaker 3: It's was like more than a dozen years after they
Speaker 3: were taken, and they had been heat damaged, water damage, whatever.
Speaker 3: And when we processed them, there was no image at
Speaker 3: all on the burnt y nothing. I came up with
Speaker 3: an idea of using a food called Farmer's reducer, which
Speaker 3: ruminates to what they call a dmax or the really
Speaker 3: dark blacks of the pictures. We put onto a computer
Speaker 3: generated processing machine and brought out eighty nine pictures, the
Speaker 3: most important ones I put into the book.
Speaker 2: Right, And I just wanted to say that that is
Speaker 2: images that we had never seen before.
Speaker 5: Now.
Speaker 1: It's funny because if you're telling me these were basically
Speaker 1: acquired by you in well, you were working with them
Speaker 1: in nineteen seventy eight, about fifteen years after the assassination.
Speaker 3: Much later.
Speaker 2: It's much later.
Speaker 3: These were much later.
Speaker 2: Okay.
Speaker 3: One of the doctors unauthorized took the pictures the authorities
Speaker 3: at the hospital confiscated them and never processed them. They
Speaker 3: were given by the doctor to the people at the hospital.
Speaker 3: The person at the hospital had them, gave them to
Speaker 3: a friend of mine who gave them to me, and
Speaker 3: I had them processed. And that's why we're even to
Speaker 3: have it. It was like forty years after or something
Speaker 3: much later, right.
Speaker 2: Then, two thousand and three or so.
Speaker 1: Then like maybe twenty years ago you were working with
Speaker 1: these then by that, okay, I just want to clarify that,
Speaker 1: because I wasn't sure. But the interesting thing here, though,
Speaker 1: is that these are images nobody's ever seen before. There
Speaker 1: are also images of Oswald's autopsy in there. There are
Speaker 1: images from the Zubruta film, the various other films that
Speaker 1: are in there, the analysis of it. And like I
Speaker 1: showed you earlier that that ticket from the Texas Theater,
Speaker 1: here we go. I put it in plastic. I put
Speaker 1: in one of those protected plastics, but from the Texas Theater.
Speaker 1: That's an actual ticket from the days.
Speaker 2: Look at that.
Speaker 1: See now he's got a string of him there and
Speaker 1: he's going to include one of those as a bookmark
Speaker 1: in absolute proof for as long as well supplies last, right.
Speaker 3: Okay, they're good. They getting rare and rare as time goes, but.
Speaker 2: Well they would help you exactly, So keep that in mind.
Speaker 1: And all the information to be able to acquire Absolute
Speaker 1: Proof is going to be in the show notes with
Speaker 1: the with the podcast or if you're watching this video, Uh,
Speaker 1: you'll be able to see it below, and you'll be
Speaker 1: able to contact Janet grow or Bob Roden one or
Speaker 1: the other uh directly and get.
Speaker 2: The book from the author.
Speaker 3: Uh.
Speaker 1: Now there are other books available too, but they are
Speaker 1: not in print. Absolute Proof is still kind of readily available.
Speaker 4: Uh.
Speaker 2: If you go to the conference, though, I'm willing to
Speaker 2: bet you'll be able to get a hold of all
Speaker 2: three books.
Speaker 1: And you just have to ask, right if if you
Speaker 1: contact Janet Claire twenty nine, Okay, spell this out j
Speaker 1: A n E T C l a I R two.
Speaker 2: Nine at gmail dot com.
Speaker 1: Janet Claire twenty nine, Okay, one more time j A
Speaker 1: N E T C l a I R two nine
Speaker 1: at gmail.
Speaker 2: Dot com, you can get in touch with her and
Speaker 2: figure it out. Eighty dollars to buy the book twenty
Speaker 2: to mail it in the US. If you live somewhere
Speaker 2: outside of the us.
Speaker 1: Different arrangements might have to be made because postageink going
Speaker 1: to be twenty bucks.
Speaker 2: But otherwise, yeah, you can start there. I would advise
Speaker 2: you get.
Speaker 1: A hold of all three of the big books if
Speaker 1: you can, the magazines that Bob has put out, other
Speaker 1: books Bob has put out, uh you know, for for instance,
Speaker 1: High Treason, the first one, not the second one.
Speaker 2: High Treason.
Speaker 1: Is a good book, you know, because because I had
Speaker 1: personal interactions with the guy who was a co author
Speaker 1: years at one time.
Speaker 2: And uh, anyway, you and I will talk another time
Speaker 2: about that.
Speaker 1: Okay, maybe not suitable for air anyway, it is what
Speaker 1: it is. Uh, But yeah, so High Treason. Yes, also
Speaker 1: Bob has co authored a couple other pieces. But I
Speaker 1: advise strongly that if you're serious about the case, and
Speaker 1: you're interested in getting the information for yourself and studying
Speaker 1: the visual information, you need those three big books. You
Speaker 1: need the two videos that Bob showed you, Okay, and
Speaker 1: you can get a lot of other stuff that has
Speaker 1: Bob Groden's name on it, because, as we've said here,
Speaker 1: look he got a six decade now long plus history
Speaker 1: working with the photographic evidence, and on his eighteenth birthday,
Speaker 1: happy birthday again, Bob on the twenty second, which I'll
Speaker 1: be able to say to you in person when I
Speaker 1: see in Dallas. Guess what that's the day the president
Speaker 1: was assassinated in Dealey Plaza. But meanwhile, will be in
Speaker 1: Dallas myself and Bob Brodon. I'll be the MC Bob
Speaker 1: is going to talk to you about Guess what films
Speaker 1: and photos and what is the title of your presentation?
Speaker 3: You have a title yet not really Essentially, what it
Speaker 3: comes down to is that it's dealing with the legitimacy
Speaker 3: of the Zubruter film. I'm wasting so much time, but
Speaker 3: it's so important. This is my legacy for crying out.
Speaker 3: I could have ended up in jail. I could have
Speaker 3: been shy, I could have who knows, and you know
Speaker 3: the story in Daley Plaza. I got to Dally Plaza,
Speaker 3: I started to up to people about this. The city
Speaker 3: of Dallas ticket to me eighty four times.
Speaker 2: Oh I had my number wrong though.
Speaker 3: Twice because they didn't want this information. Now, let me
Speaker 3: give one last description on the book if I can sure.
Speaker 3: The book has got a thousand pictures in it, literally
Speaker 3: a thousand pictures, about seven hundred of them have never
Speaker 3: been released before. The entire book is on acid free
Speaker 3: semi glass paper, so it'll never fade, never yellow. I'm very,
Speaker 3: very proud of it. Of the e books I've written,
Speaker 3: this is as good as all the others put together.
Speaker 1: Thank you, absolutely, But look, I'm telling you guys now,
Speaker 1: I don't care if you find it used. If you
Speaker 1: pick it up from Bob directly, I strongly advise you
Speaker 1: to get the other two as well. They are a
Speaker 1: three volume compendium of the best photographic evidence that you're
Speaker 1: going to get your hot little hand without having to
Speaker 1: go out and chase things down for about thirty years, Okay,
Speaker 1: I'm just telling you that's what it would take you
Speaker 1: probably to assemble these things yourself, if you were to
Speaker 1: go and get decent copies of various things. I mean,
Speaker 1: I have a hell of a time even getting press
Speaker 1: photos at this point, right, But we've been through all
Speaker 1: that before on the show. I'm extremely happy. Thank you
Speaker 1: Bob Goroden for you know taking Now, we took more
Speaker 1: than an hour. I'm sorry, but we can't compress this
Speaker 1: into an hour, to be honest with you. But I
Speaker 1: look forward to seeing you in Dallas, which again the
Speaker 1: Lancer Conference will be from the twenty second to the
Speaker 1: twenty fourth at the Dallas Marriott Downtown.
Speaker 2: Okay, so you'll be able to attend there.
Speaker 1: And if you go to Assassination Conference dot com and
Speaker 1: use the discount code Ocelli ten, you'll get ten percent
Speaker 1: off of your ticket. Also, student prices are available. I
Speaker 1: advise you to go there in person, but if you can't,
Speaker 1: you can attend virtually. And Bob Groden is definitely worth
Speaker 1: the price of admission all by himself. So with that
Speaker 1: all having been said, I'm done for tonight. We didn't
Speaker 1: take commercials or anything, but hey, what are you gonna do?
Speaker 1: It is what it is, and I'm glad that you
Speaker 1: could join me. I'm merely o'celly. All of you are
Speaker 1: indeed the effect. Robert Groden was my guest, and look
Speaker 1: down below either in the video or in the podcast
Speaker 1: description to follow through and get yourself a copy of
Speaker 1: Absolute Proof or anything else you can by contacting Bob
Speaker 1: Groden and following up on the photographic evidence in the
Speaker 1: JFK assassination.
Speaker 3: Thank you, Chuck for all right.
Speaker 6: Much revelation through Conversation dot com, Radio Chili dot com.
Speaker 5: The War State by Michael Swanson explains the great national
Speaker 5: transformation that took place and put the Kennedy presidency in
Speaker 5: the context of the times, and reveals never before published
Speaker 5: information about the Cuban missile crisis. President Kennedy would not
Speaker 5: have been assassinated if he had been president two hundred
Speaker 5: years ago. His assassination took place in the context of
Speaker 5: the Cold War and the rise of the national security state.
Speaker 5: Before World War II, the United States was a continental republic.
Speaker 5: In the decade that followed, it became an imperial superpower.
Speaker 5: Generals such as Curtis LeMay not only wanted to invade Cuba,
Speaker 5: but knew that there were short range missiles on the
Speaker 5: island arn't with nuclear warheads that they could not destroy
Speaker 5: because they were on mobile launchers. Their invasion could have
Speaker 5: led to a Third World War, and they wanted to
Speaker 5: go to war anyway. The War State by Michael Swanson
Speaker 5: reveals why, and we'll show you what President Kennedy was
Speaker 5: up against.
Speaker 2: For more information, the Warstate dot.
Speaker 7: Com yo Yolas Doug Campbell, host of the Dallas Action
Speaker 7: podcast presented by Wall Street Window, and you are listening
Speaker 7: to the o'chilly of quickt revelation through conversation.
Speaker 2: Go ahead, Colin about the DAFA assassination. Right, well, what
Speaker 2: do you want to know?
Speaker 6: Dye Bakers wild claim Oswald girlfriend he knew Ruby and
Speaker 6: Barry answer weapons.
Speaker 2: I imagine I could claim I have four wheels. It
Speaker 2: doesn't make me a wagon.
Speaker 6: But okay, Oswal was on the building and trying to
Speaker 6: prevent the leader of John Kennedy.
Speaker 2: Come on now, is a.
Speaker 3: Real effort on the day of pay assassination.
Speaker 1: Go to Amazon dot com enter Judith Baker in her
Speaker 1: own words. You'll get the results for a digital copy
Speaker 1: of a book where Walt Brown utilizes her own words
Speaker 1: and the known evidence in the case to get at
Speaker 1: well a different perspective. Let's say you can get Judithbary
Speaker 1: Baker in her own words from the author himself, signed
Speaker 1: if you request it by contacting doctor Brown at ki
Speaker 1: as jfk at aol dot com. It's a fun book
Speaker 1: and it actually dissects the many, many fantastic claims.
Speaker 2: Judith very Baker in her own words, Thank you for
Speaker 2: all the great information.
Speaker 3: Do you like history?
Speaker 8: Real history that you were never taught in schools? Why
Speaker 8: the Vietnam War, nuclear bombs and nation Building in Southeast
Speaker 8: Asia by author Mike Swanston, with new documentation never seen
Speaker 8: before that will open your eyes to events that led
Speaker 8: up to this. Why the Vietnam War, Nuclear Moms and
Speaker 8: Nation Building in Southeast Asia nineteen forty five through nineteen
Speaker 8: sixty one. Get you a copy today at Amazon dot com.
Speaker 8: Why the Vietnam War by author Mike Swatson.
Speaker 4: You get ready for you tell me about ship.
Speaker 5: Ship with.
Speaker 9: My Nat scrape h.
Speaker 3: Nuclear holocaust. You know what uranium is right?
Speaker 2: You think of nuclear weapons and other things like lots
Speaker 2: of you know what uranium is right?
Speaker 3: Things things that dona with urims leaving some broad things.
Speaker 2: Nuclear holocaust.
Speaker 9: You know what uranium is right?
Speaker 2: I didn't Nuclear Holocaust