Speaker 1: Justin Warsham is your nut cheese.
Speaker 2: We talked about we've talked about money before with kids,
Speaker 2: and and gosh, how you teach him and how they
Speaker 2: learned money, and it's just an awful I.
Speaker 3: Think of your example that you did with your kids
Speaker 3: when an earlier time when we talked about this subject,
Speaker 3: where you said that you basically translated your entire monthly
Speaker 3: expenses and income into quarters to put it down on
Speaker 3: like a smaller scale, but to make it tactile, and
Speaker 3: then showed the kids, Okay, this is how much money
Speaker 3: we make.
Speaker 1: This goes to the house, This goes to food.
Speaker 3: This goes to you know whatever, so that this is
Speaker 3: how much is left left over us to play around with.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I still don't know if they remember that. I
Speaker 1: should ask that. I bet you they do. I would be.
Speaker 3: I think you'd be, because I mean, look, you got
Speaker 3: well he Calvin moved out again, right right, So he's
Speaker 3: out on his own, but he has he ever had
Speaker 3: more than what you would expect, right, Like, he's not
Speaker 3: struggling financially because he's out, Like he's not doing the
Speaker 3: thing that I at least did. I'll put myself like
Speaker 3: I turned eighteen I got a credit card for Macy's
Speaker 3: because why not couldn't afford a hundred dollars watch?
Speaker 1: So I financed it for two years because that's what
Speaker 1: smart people do. Gary, one hundred dollar watch turned into two.
Speaker 3: Well, now I had a job at nine, Like it
Speaker 3: wasn't like I didn't understand how to earn a buck.
Speaker 2: Right, It's a weird thing. Money works in such a
Speaker 2: weird way. I almost equate it to food in that
Speaker 2: you got to teach people how to eat correctly, right,
Speaker 2: But everybody's got to eat in this case, unless you're
Speaker 2: living in some weird militant vegan cult. You're going to
Speaker 2: have to use money at some point. So where you
Speaker 2: get it from, how do you how do you keep it,
Speaker 2: how do you use it wisely?
Speaker 1: All that sort of stuff.
Speaker 2: An article that you you found for us is whether
Speaker 2: or not a parent should be giving money to a
Speaker 2: kid for you know.
Speaker 3: Talking money, Like basically I think the way like you
Speaker 3: have allowance, right, which allowance I think has been I
Speaker 3: don't know if it was always defined this way. I
Speaker 3: feel like allowance has become almost like alimony to your kid,
Speaker 3: Like you just give them money you know they're not
Speaker 3: doing anything right, and then they get paid for chores.
Speaker 3: And so this is coming from an argument between a
Speaker 3: married couple where dad's like, I want the kid to
Speaker 3: have pocket money, just roaming around money because he thinks
Speaker 3: that's a good way for the kid to learn like oh,
Speaker 3: I'm out of pocket money and to have their own money.
Speaker 3: So if they want to get a candy bar at
Speaker 3: the grocery store, well do you have enough money out
Speaker 3: of your pocket to do it? But mom's like, well,
Speaker 3: they need to earn the money. And he's like, great, well,
Speaker 3: let's pay him for the chores, and she's like, no, No.
Speaker 3: The chores they do is because they're a part of
Speaker 3: the households the chores and in the experts that I've
Speaker 3: talked to on this subject both have very valid merit,
Speaker 3: and that Rachel Cruz, who's Dave Ramsey's daughter, she has
Speaker 3: a great book called Smart Money, Smart Kids, and she
Speaker 3: talks about having guidelines where you say, Okay, these are
Speaker 3: things that you do because you live in this house
Speaker 3: and you're a part of this family, and this is
Speaker 3: how you contribute to the family. These are extra things
Speaker 3: that you do that you get paid for, and these
Speaker 3: are your chores that you would do for money kind
Speaker 3: of a thing the above and beyond, above and beyond,
Speaker 3: and that's up to you to decide. My favorite thing
Speaker 3: which I'd love to brag about this right now, I
Speaker 3: have a thirteen year old who has a job and.
Speaker 1: He I love it.
Speaker 3: No greater validation has come my way. And I only
Speaker 3: say this out loud because in my experience being a father,
Speaker 3: especially talking about father being a father to the public,
Speaker 3: is you have to take these moments to brag because
Speaker 3: trust me, the humbling is coming. My sixteen year old's
Speaker 3: going to get some girl pregnant or something at that
Speaker 3: level is coming my way. So I have to wallow
Speaker 3: in this greatness because I used to also brag them
Speaker 3: like I can't wait for them to be teenagers. I'm
Speaker 3: going to thrive as a father, as a father of teenagers.
Speaker 3: And it was horrible, horrible. I know you did tell you.
Speaker 3: I know what.
Speaker 1: I'm stupid. I'm stupid.
Speaker 3: So anyway, he came to me when he was no joke,
Speaker 3: he was about three and a half and he said, Dad,
Speaker 3: can I we have like rocks in our landscaping and
Speaker 3: they get scattered around and I let them to be
Speaker 3: neat because I'm broken. And he said, can I go
Speaker 3: put the rocks back where they go for some money?
Speaker 3: And I said yeah, why and he said, because I'm poor.
Speaker 3: And I told him the thing that I learned. I said,
Speaker 3: you're not poor, you're broke a difference, I said, so,
Speaker 3: but yeah you can.
Speaker 1: And that kid went out.
Speaker 3: There for three hours and just working as rocks and
Speaker 3: he wasn't even four years old.
Speaker 1: You pay a minimum wage, I in less than I
Speaker 1: don't go. Yeah, I gave it.
Speaker 3: I think I get him five bucks. I think it's
Speaker 3: what I remember giving him, and uh and so. And
Speaker 3: now he's grown up and he's got a job, and
Speaker 3: a big reason why he wants to have a job
Speaker 3: is because he has a problem saving money. He also
Speaker 3: gets ten dollars a week from us, like they just get.
Speaker 3: That's what he gets. And when you turn fifteen, in
Speaker 3: my house, you bump it up to twenty five dollars
Speaker 3: a week, because I learned from my older son. You
Speaker 3: go out with your friends, you get a girlfriend, you
Speaker 3: need some more walking around money that you can take
Speaker 3: him out. But the older one doesn't have a job.
Speaker 3: He does not have a job, and the younger one
Speaker 3: loves to remind.
Speaker 1: Him of that.
Speaker 2: So the older one got a raise. Yeah, well he
Speaker 2: didn't get a raise. Well you're talking about you just
Speaker 2: told me when he turned fifteen. He got up to
Speaker 2: twenty two weeks.
Speaker 1: The younger one will get a raise when he turns fifteen.
Speaker 1: Trust me.
Speaker 3: The younger one has no he's been at this job
Speaker 3: not even a week and a half, and he's already
Speaker 3: made two hundred bucks.
Speaker 1: He gets tips at this ice cream place.
Speaker 2: He's gonna be like President Trump, but he's gonna be like, yeah,
Speaker 2: I'll do that. I'll turn fifteen for nothing, maybe a buck.
Speaker 1: You give me a dollar a year.
Speaker 3: And it's funny because one of the things that they
Speaker 3: talk about in this article that one of the psychologists
Speaker 3: mentions is that you know the doubt there are downsides
Speaker 3: to your kids having their own money because you can't
Speaker 3: tell them what to do with it. That's part of
Speaker 3: and that was my thing when I had My dad
Speaker 3: made me get a paper out and I was making
Speaker 3: four hundred bucks a month at nine years old. If
Speaker 3: my mom was making something for dinner I didn't like,
Speaker 3: I would literally order a pizza and just have it
Speaker 3: delivered to the house.
Speaker 1: And oh yeah, that was a brave man. I was stupid,
Speaker 1: not brave. Stupid.
Speaker 3: I thought, well, this is my money, and my and
Speaker 3: my mom got angry and like went to my dad
Speaker 3: and he's like, well, it's his money.
Speaker 1: What are we going to do? Oh?
Speaker 2: My dad would have backed up the moving van. Really,
Speaker 2: you ought to go live in pizza Land. Pizza Land.
Speaker 2: I think my dad was proud of it. You said
Speaker 2: the difference between being poor and being broke. Yes, there's
Speaker 2: a value in having those moments of brokeness where you
Speaker 2: don't know what the next thing is going to be.
Speaker 2: It's different if you're chronically poor like my parents. My
Speaker 2: mom's family specifically chronically poor when they were growing up,
Speaker 2: and I mean to the point where they lived basically
Speaker 2: the only reason that they made it through is through
Speaker 2: the generosity of family members and sometimes just friends that
Speaker 2: they would live with other families. And it wasn't that
Speaker 2: Grandpa didn't work hard. It's not that they weren't resourceful.
Speaker 2: It's just that there was a time when it was
Speaker 2: legitimately people were legitimately poor. Now, not to say that
Speaker 2: people aren't any these days, it's just so much more rare.
Speaker 2: People like to say that they're poor but then they
Speaker 2: can't figure out why they're you know, sixty five inch television.
Speaker 2: It doesn't pick up the same channels that everybody.
Speaker 3: While you're breaking this down, in my mind, there are
Speaker 3: two things. Is that I always like this phrase that
Speaker 3: being poor as a mindset, being broke as a state
Speaker 3: of being right. And so if you have to really
Speaker 3: rewire your brain, if you have a and I would
Speaker 3: equate this like I grew up with a very middle
Speaker 3: class living and when my dad told me to read
Speaker 3: Rich Dad, Poor Dad, it really opened my mind to
Speaker 3: the of like there's a different way of looking at
Speaker 3: your life in general, and where middle class puts their
Speaker 3: money into liabilities, things that cost the money. Upper class,
Speaker 3: wealthy people put their money into things that make them
Speaker 3: more money, and that's how they become more wealthy. And
Speaker 3: just having that little snippet is why I paid my
Speaker 3: kids each one hundred bucks to read that book and
Speaker 3: give me like a I did like a book report
Speaker 3: interview with them, and I think, I hope it's helped them.
Speaker 1: It seemed to have so far. But trying to make
Speaker 1: an investment so that they'll cover your expenses once they
Speaker 1: get you know, it's a long term play. It's a
Speaker 1: long term money in the investment. But I the other part.
Speaker 3: Was that I'm thinking, I wonder if we're about to
Speaker 3: see this kind of evolution of what it is to
Speaker 3: be poor, because life in general has become so luxurious
Speaker 3: compared to what you know, my grandpa who grew up
Speaker 3: in the Great Depression, right, the things that I get
Speaker 3: to live with, you know, having a pretty fair to
Speaker 3: mid level income, that compared to what he had having
Speaker 3: no even if you account for inflation, it does not compare.
Speaker 3: He was a cotton farmer in Texas, you know what
Speaker 3: I mean. That was what his family did. His dad
Speaker 3: had to go work on an oil rig in Texas
Speaker 3: while him at five and his older brother at nine
Speaker 3: basically farmed eighty five acres of cotton by themselves. Like
Speaker 3: that's how little money they had. If I joked, what
Speaker 3: if I had my kids take care of a four
Speaker 3: foot by four foot garden in my backyard, There'd be
Speaker 3: an emotional breakdown.
Speaker 1: So I mean, for all the pluses, I don't know,
Speaker 1: no fruit, they would kill all of it.
Speaker 2: My So, like I said, both of my parents grew
Speaker 2: up at times poor and broke, and that dictated how
Speaker 2: they went about a how they went about their college education.
Speaker 2: Dad became a chemist, Mom became a teacher, and they
Speaker 2: for the most part, they worked all my life. Mom
Speaker 2: took time off when she had kids, but then by
Speaker 2: the time I was seven something like that, had gone
Speaker 2: back to work. So I saw both parents constantly working,
Speaker 2: and so they made plenty of money, but they never
Speaker 2: flaunted it. They never gave us money willy nilly. It
Speaker 2: was never money was never free in my.
Speaker 1: Didn't get an allowance. What about allowance?
Speaker 2: But but it was because I was doing things around
Speaker 2: the house, okay, and there was a regular schedule of
Speaker 2: things that I would I was to do, and then
Speaker 2: I they would kind of pimp me out in a
Speaker 2: weird way.
Speaker 1: I'll say that differently.
Speaker 2: They would tell neighbors like, hey, here's an able bodied
Speaker 2: twelve year old to mow your lawn or take out
Speaker 2: the garbage. Or there were neighbors around the corner. Missus
Speaker 2: Gibbs was a widow and couldn't mow her lawn and
Speaker 2: couldn't take out her garbage. So once a week I'd
Speaker 2: go and I'd mow her lawn and I'd take out
Speaker 2: the garbage, and she'd pay me four bucks or whatever
Speaker 2: it was.
Speaker 1: Did you hate it like a more than I can say, interesting,
Speaker 1: more than I could tell. And she was a nice
Speaker 1: one to your.
Speaker 3: Parents and were like, oh God, why do I have
Speaker 3: to do that? Of course I did, Oh okay, good
Speaker 3: makes me feel better.
Speaker 2: But there was a point when I realized that I'm
Speaker 2: not doing it just for the four bucks.
Speaker 1: I'm doing it to be a good neighbor.
Speaker 2: And to you know, this was a woman who was
Speaker 2: a teacher with my mother from at the time, and
Speaker 2: then she moved across town. I got I got a
Speaker 2: bike over there every time, and you know, sometimes when
Speaker 2: I wasn't there, I'd have to ask a friend if
Speaker 2: you would go, if he would go do it. So
Speaker 2: I kind of learned that coordination part of it. But
Speaker 2: they were My parents never owned a new car. They
Speaker 2: they bought a.
Speaker 1: Not a Cadillac.
Speaker 2: They bought a Chrysler right after they got married with
Speaker 2: some of the money that they had used to or
Speaker 2: money with some of the money they got when they
Speaker 2: got married. They bought a Chrysler. And my dad bought
Speaker 2: a pickup truck. But that was back when the pickup
Speaker 2: truck was like eight hundred and fifty bucks, and they
Speaker 2: bought new cars. They rarely bought news cars or new cars.
Speaker 2: It wasn't until they both retired and they moved and
Speaker 2: they had all of this money. I don't mean all
Speaker 2: of it, but they had money saved down.
Speaker 3: Money saved up, and they didn't have expenses in the
Speaker 3: way of kids that had activities or anything that they
Speaker 3: needed to take care of. It was just them and
Speaker 3: so for the risk was mitigated because they could decide
Speaker 3: what their lifestyle was. When you have kids, your lifestyle
Speaker 3: kind of is dictated by them a lot. I think
Speaker 3: it can be, and now I think is much more
Speaker 3: so than when we were kids. My parents didn't spend
Speaker 3: money on stuff like I mean, outside of a thirty
Speaker 3: dollars sign up fee for a little league.
Speaker 1: They didn't buy me bats.
Speaker 2: Any glove I used was a hand me down from
Speaker 2: either my dad or from some kid down the street.
Speaker 3: Remember the pop order teams had like these big shipping
Speaker 3: crates filled with all the pads and helmets for everybody,
Speaker 3: and that's what you got.
Speaker 1: And they'd been around for twenty five years.
Speaker 2: Yes, every kid that went through your town had more
Speaker 2: mill shoulder pads before it smelled like it too.
Speaker 3: And I was surprised they didn't have like the old
Speaker 3: leatherhead helmets I still carry back in there somewhere. When
Speaker 3: my kid played pop order football, I spent four hundred
Speaker 3: dollars on helmets and shoulder pads.
Speaker 1: It's unbelievable.
Speaker 2: I mean when I talked to when I was at
Speaker 2: a baseball fantasy camp, there's a bunch of guys there
Speaker 2: whose kids, younger kids ten twelve, fourteen are now playing
Speaker 2: travel baseball stuff. And I was laughing about, oh, yeah,
Speaker 2: that's that's five hundred bucks you'll never get back. They're
Speaker 2: like five hundred. We wish it was five hundred. You
Speaker 2: know that they're paying twenty twenty five hundred dollars every season,
Speaker 2: not just for a couple of bats for your kid.
Speaker 2: You got three or four different uniforms that you are
Speaker 2: responsible for as the parent. You got to coordinate travel,
Speaker 2: you got to coordinate hotel stays, You got to in
Speaker 2: some cases coordinate airfare to get your kids to some
Speaker 2: tournament in Vegas or in Dallas or whatever. And it
Speaker 2: just seems unbelievablecause how does a kid at that age
Speaker 2: understand the sacrifice that you're making monetarily and you like.
Speaker 1: Having contempt for them. I have to.
Speaker 3: Next year when my younger son goes into the show
Speaker 3: choir here in Burbank, it's like it's a big thing,
Speaker 3: like it's the TV show Glee was based on this
Speaker 3: high school choir. And I told my wife, I realized,
Speaker 3: I'm going to be spending basically the cost of a
Speaker 3: used car every year in donating to this program to
Speaker 3: help fund it. Like it's bananas the amount of money.
Speaker 3: And so I have to resist the urge to have
Speaker 3: contempt for them, because there's no way that they understand
Speaker 3: that that's how much money I'm giving.
Speaker 1: No, and they don't. No, really should they like?
Speaker 2: Well, And that goes back to the example that I
Speaker 2: did when I put out you were talking about when
Speaker 2: I tried to use a physical example to the kids
Speaker 2: about how much money I made and how much money
Speaker 2: it costs to live where we lived, and I used
Speaker 2: a quarter for every.
Speaker 1: One every I think it was a thousand. I think
Speaker 1: you're right. It was a quarter for.
Speaker 2: Every thousand dollars I brought in in a month, which
Speaker 2: isn't a lot.
Speaker 1: No, I'm going radio forgots.
Speaker 2: So I'd lay that out and then i'd push these
Speaker 2: quarters over there, and I'd push those quarters over there,
Speaker 2: and I push those quarters over there, and I would
Speaker 2: be I would I'd be left with like, instead of
Speaker 2: fifty cents, I'd be left with like twenty dimesents. This
Speaker 2: is what I got left to do everything else, which
Speaker 2: includes your games, your see your movies, and all the luxury,
Speaker 2: all that stuff. And I still don't know if they
Speaker 2: get it.
Speaker 3: You don't think they do. I do want to say
Speaker 3: that this always comes up, and I love this. The
Speaker 3: Harvard Grant study was the longest longitudal study in American
Speaker 3: history where they've looked back, and the common thread that
Speaker 3: they have with most successful business people and.
Speaker 1: CEOs is that they did chores as a kid.
Speaker 3: The experts that I talked to suggest that bare minimum,
Speaker 3: You give some kind of an allowance to your kid,
Speaker 3: bare minimum, so that they understand they have a limit
Speaker 3: on their funds, and they start to work those neurons
Speaker 3: in problem solving that as early as five, but definitely
Speaker 3: by the time they're about ten. And then they say
Speaker 3: that you can do like one dollar for every year,
Speaker 3: for every week, so a ten year old will get
Speaker 3: ten bucks a week from you in the form of
Speaker 3: an allowance.
Speaker 1: I'm behind that. I have a thirteen year old who
Speaker 1: gets ten bucks a week.
Speaker 2: Yeah, but he's gonna get a he's got a job,
Speaker 2: he's doing great.
Speaker 3: And then anyway, I was looking at this study and
Speaker 3: this mom had this great comment where she said, my
Speaker 3: mom always had this great line where she said, if
Speaker 3: you're old enough to afford therapy, you're too old to
Speaker 3: blame your parents for your problems.
Speaker 2: I don't want to get that on a T shirt.
Speaker 2: So much dusting, great stuff. Thank you appreciating