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<v Speaker 1>Justin Warsham is your nut cheese.

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<v Speaker 2>We talked about we've talked about money before with kids,

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<v Speaker 2>and and gosh, how you teach him and how they

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<v Speaker 2>learned money, and it's just an awful I.

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<v Speaker 3>Think of your example that you did with your kids

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<v Speaker 3>when an earlier time when we talked about this subject,

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<v Speaker 3>where you said that you basically translated your entire monthly

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<v Speaker 3>expenses and income into quarters to put it down on

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<v Speaker 3>like a smaller scale, but to make it tactile, and

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<v Speaker 3>then showed the kids, Okay, this is how much money

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<v Speaker 3>we make.

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<v Speaker 1>This goes to the house, This goes to food.

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<v Speaker 3>This goes to you know whatever, so that this is

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<v Speaker 3>how much is left left over us to play around with.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, I still don't know if they remember that. I

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<v Speaker 1>should ask that. I bet you they do. I would be.

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<v Speaker 3>I think you'd be, because I mean, look, you got

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<v Speaker 3>well he Calvin moved out again, right right, So he's

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<v Speaker 3>out on his own, but he has he ever had

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<v Speaker 3>more than what you would expect, right, Like, he's not

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<v Speaker 3>struggling financially because he's out, Like he's not doing the

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<v Speaker 3>thing that I at least did. I'll put myself like

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<v Speaker 3>I turned eighteen I got a credit card for Macy's

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<v Speaker 3>because why not couldn't afford a hundred dollars watch?

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<v Speaker 1>So I financed it for two years because that's what

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<v Speaker 1>smart people do. Gary, one hundred dollar watch turned into two.

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<v Speaker 3>Well, now I had a job at nine, Like it

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<v Speaker 3>wasn't like I didn't understand how to earn a buck.

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<v Speaker 2>Right, It's a weird thing. Money works in such a

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<v Speaker 2>weird way. I almost equate it to food in that

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<v Speaker 2>you got to teach people how to eat correctly, right,

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<v Speaker 2>But everybody's got to eat in this case, unless you're

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<v Speaker 2>living in some weird militant vegan cult. You're going to

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<v Speaker 2>have to use money at some point. So where you

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<v Speaker 2>get it from, how do you how do you keep it,

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<v Speaker 2>how do you use it wisely?

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<v Speaker 1>All that sort of stuff.

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<v Speaker 2>An article that you you found for us is whether

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<v Speaker 2>or not a parent should be giving money to a

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<v Speaker 2>kid for you know.

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<v Speaker 3>Talking money, Like basically I think the way like you

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<v Speaker 3>have allowance, right, which allowance I think has been I

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<v Speaker 3>don't know if it was always defined this way. I

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<v Speaker 3>feel like allowance has become almost like alimony to your kid,

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<v Speaker 3>Like you just give them money you know they're not

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<v Speaker 3>doing anything right, and then they get paid for chores.

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<v Speaker 3>And so this is coming from an argument between a

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<v Speaker 3>married couple where dad's like, I want the kid to

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<v Speaker 3>have pocket money, just roaming around money because he thinks

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<v Speaker 3>that's a good way for the kid to learn like oh,

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<v Speaker 3>I'm out of pocket money and to have their own money.

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<v Speaker 3>So if they want to get a candy bar at

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<v Speaker 3>the grocery store, well do you have enough money out

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<v Speaker 3>of your pocket to do it? But mom's like, well,

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<v Speaker 3>they need to earn the money. And he's like, great, well,

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<v Speaker 3>let's pay him for the chores, and she's like, no, No.

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<v Speaker 3>The chores they do is because they're a part of

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<v Speaker 3>the households the chores and in the experts that I've

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<v Speaker 3>talked to on this subject both have very valid merit,

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<v Speaker 3>and that Rachel Cruz, who's Dave Ramsey's daughter, she has

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<v Speaker 3>a great book called Smart Money, Smart Kids, and she

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<v Speaker 3>talks about having guidelines where you say, Okay, these are

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<v Speaker 3>things that you do because you live in this house

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<v Speaker 3>and you're a part of this family, and this is

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<v Speaker 3>how you contribute to the family. These are extra things

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<v Speaker 3>that you do that you get paid for, and these

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<v Speaker 3>are your chores that you would do for money kind

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<v Speaker 3>of a thing the above and beyond, above and beyond,

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<v Speaker 3>and that's up to you to decide. My favorite thing

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<v Speaker 3>which I'd love to brag about this right now, I

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<v Speaker 3>have a thirteen year old who has a job and.

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<v Speaker 1>He I love it.

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<v Speaker 3>No greater validation has come my way. And I only

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<v Speaker 3>say this out loud because in my experience being a father,

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<v Speaker 3>especially talking about father being a father to the public,

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<v Speaker 3>is you have to take these moments to brag because

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<v Speaker 3>trust me, the humbling is coming. My sixteen year old's

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<v Speaker 3>going to get some girl pregnant or something at that

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<v Speaker 3>level is coming my way. So I have to wallow

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<v Speaker 3>in this greatness because I used to also brag them

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<v Speaker 3>like I can't wait for them to be teenagers. I'm

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<v Speaker 3>going to thrive as a father, as a father of teenagers.

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<v Speaker 3>And it was horrible, horrible. I know you did tell you.

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<v Speaker 3>I know what.

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<v Speaker 1>I'm stupid. I'm stupid.

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<v Speaker 3>So anyway, he came to me when he was no joke,

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<v Speaker 3>he was about three and a half and he said, Dad,

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<v Speaker 3>can I we have like rocks in our landscaping and

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<v Speaker 3>they get scattered around and I let them to be

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<v Speaker 3>neat because I'm broken. And he said, can I go

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<v Speaker 3>put the rocks back where they go for some money?

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<v Speaker 3>And I said yeah, why and he said, because I'm poor.

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<v Speaker 3>And I told him the thing that I learned. I said,

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<v Speaker 3>you're not poor, you're broke a difference, I said, so,

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<v Speaker 3>but yeah you can.

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<v Speaker 1>And that kid went out.

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<v Speaker 3>There for three hours and just working as rocks and

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<v Speaker 3>he wasn't even four years old.

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<v Speaker 1>You pay a minimum wage, I in less than I

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<v Speaker 1>don't go. Yeah, I gave it.

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<v Speaker 3>I think I get him five bucks. I think it's

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<v Speaker 3>what I remember giving him, and uh and so. And

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<v Speaker 3>now he's grown up and he's got a job, and

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<v Speaker 3>a big reason why he wants to have a job

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<v Speaker 3>is because he has a problem saving money. He also

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<v Speaker 3>gets ten dollars a week from us, like they just get.

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<v Speaker 3>That's what he gets. And when you turn fifteen, in

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<v Speaker 3>my house, you bump it up to twenty five dollars

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<v Speaker 3>a week, because I learned from my older son. You

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<v Speaker 3>go out with your friends, you get a girlfriend, you

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<v Speaker 3>need some more walking around money that you can take

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<v Speaker 3>him out. But the older one doesn't have a job.

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<v Speaker 3>He does not have a job, and the younger one

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<v Speaker 3>loves to remind.

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<v Speaker 1>Him of that.

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<v Speaker 2>So the older one got a raise. Yeah, well he

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<v Speaker 2>didn't get a raise. Well you're talking about you just

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<v Speaker 2>told me when he turned fifteen. He got up to

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<v Speaker 2>twenty two weeks.

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<v Speaker 1>The younger one will get a raise when he turns fifteen.

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<v Speaker 1>Trust me.

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<v Speaker 3>The younger one has no he's been at this job

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<v Speaker 3>not even a week and a half, and he's already

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<v Speaker 3>made two hundred bucks.

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<v Speaker 1>He gets tips at this ice cream place.

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<v Speaker 2>He's gonna be like President Trump, but he's gonna be like, yeah,

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<v Speaker 2>I'll do that. I'll turn fifteen for nothing, maybe a buck.

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<v Speaker 1>You give me a dollar a year.

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<v Speaker 3>And it's funny because one of the things that they

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<v Speaker 3>talk about in this article that one of the psychologists

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<v Speaker 3>mentions is that you know the doubt there are downsides

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<v Speaker 3>to your kids having their own money because you can't

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<v Speaker 3>tell them what to do with it. That's part of

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<v Speaker 3>and that was my thing when I had My dad

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<v Speaker 3>made me get a paper out and I was making

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<v Speaker 3>four hundred bucks a month at nine years old. If

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<v Speaker 3>my mom was making something for dinner I didn't like,

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<v Speaker 3>I would literally order a pizza and just have it

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<v Speaker 3>delivered to the house.

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<v Speaker 1>And oh yeah, that was a brave man. I was stupid,

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<v Speaker 1>not brave. Stupid.

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<v Speaker 3>I thought, well, this is my money, and my and

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<v Speaker 3>my mom got angry and like went to my dad

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<v Speaker 3>and he's like, well, it's his money.

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<v Speaker 1>What are we going to do? Oh?

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<v Speaker 2>My dad would have backed up the moving van. Really,

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<v Speaker 2>you ought to go live in pizza Land. Pizza Land.

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<v Speaker 2>I think my dad was proud of it. You said

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<v Speaker 2>the difference between being poor and being broke. Yes, there's

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<v Speaker 2>a value in having those moments of brokeness where you

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<v Speaker 2>don't know what the next thing is going to be.

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<v Speaker 2>It's different if you're chronically poor like my parents. My

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<v Speaker 2>mom's family specifically chronically poor when they were growing up,

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<v Speaker 2>and I mean to the point where they lived basically

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<v Speaker 2>the only reason that they made it through is through

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<v Speaker 2>the generosity of family members and sometimes just friends that

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<v Speaker 2>they would live with other families. And it wasn't that

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<v Speaker 2>Grandpa didn't work hard. It's not that they weren't resourceful.

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<v Speaker 2>It's just that there was a time when it was

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<v Speaker 2>legitimately people were legitimately poor. Now, not to say that

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<v Speaker 2>people aren't any these days, it's just so much more rare.

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<v Speaker 2>People like to say that they're poor but then they

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<v Speaker 2>can't figure out why they're you know, sixty five inch television.

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<v Speaker 2>It doesn't pick up the same channels that everybody.

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<v Speaker 3>While you're breaking this down, in my mind, there are

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<v Speaker 3>two things. Is that I always like this phrase that

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<v Speaker 3>being poor as a mindset, being broke as a state

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<v Speaker 3>of being right. And so if you have to really

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<v Speaker 3>rewire your brain, if you have a and I would

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<v Speaker 3>equate this like I grew up with a very middle

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<v Speaker 3>class living and when my dad told me to read

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<v Speaker 3>Rich Dad, Poor Dad, it really opened my mind to

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<v Speaker 3>the of like there's a different way of looking at

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<v Speaker 3>your life in general, and where middle class puts their

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<v Speaker 3>money into liabilities, things that cost the money. Upper class,

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<v Speaker 3>wealthy people put their money into things that make them

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<v Speaker 3>more money, and that's how they become more wealthy. And

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<v Speaker 3>just having that little snippet is why I paid my

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<v Speaker 3>kids each one hundred bucks to read that book and

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<v Speaker 3>give me like a I did like a book report

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<v Speaker 3>interview with them, and I think, I hope it's helped them.

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<v Speaker 1>It seemed to have so far. But trying to make

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<v Speaker 1>an investment so that they'll cover your expenses once they

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<v Speaker 1>get you know, it's a long term play. It's a

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<v Speaker 1>long term money in the investment. But I the other part.

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<v Speaker 3>Was that I'm thinking, I wonder if we're about to

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<v Speaker 3>see this kind of evolution of what it is to

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<v Speaker 3>be poor, because life in general has become so luxurious

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<v Speaker 3>compared to what you know, my grandpa who grew up

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<v Speaker 3>in the Great Depression, right, the things that I get

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<v Speaker 3>to live with, you know, having a pretty fair to

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<v Speaker 3>mid level income, that compared to what he had having

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<v Speaker 3>no even if you account for inflation, it does not compare.

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<v Speaker 3>He was a cotton farmer in Texas, you know what

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<v Speaker 3>I mean. That was what his family did. His dad

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<v Speaker 3>had to go work on an oil rig in Texas

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<v Speaker 3>while him at five and his older brother at nine

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<v Speaker 3>basically farmed eighty five acres of cotton by themselves. Like

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<v Speaker 3>that's how little money they had. If I joked, what

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<v Speaker 3>if I had my kids take care of a four

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<v Speaker 3>foot by four foot garden in my backyard, There'd be

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<v Speaker 3>an emotional breakdown.

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<v Speaker 1>So I mean, for all the pluses, I don't know,

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<v Speaker 1>no fruit, they would kill all of it.

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<v Speaker 2>My So, like I said, both of my parents grew

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<v Speaker 2>up at times poor and broke, and that dictated how

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<v Speaker 2>they went about a how they went about their college education.

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<v Speaker 2>Dad became a chemist, Mom became a teacher, and they

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<v Speaker 2>for the most part, they worked all my life. Mom

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<v Speaker 2>took time off when she had kids, but then by

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<v Speaker 2>the time I was seven something like that, had gone

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<v Speaker 2>back to work. So I saw both parents constantly working,

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<v Speaker 2>and so they made plenty of money, but they never

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<v Speaker 2>flaunted it. They never gave us money willy nilly. It

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<v Speaker 2>was never money was never free in my.

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<v Speaker 1>Didn't get an allowance. What about allowance?

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<v Speaker 2>But but it was because I was doing things around

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<v Speaker 2>the house, okay, and there was a regular schedule of

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<v Speaker 2>things that I would I was to do, and then

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<v Speaker 2>I they would kind of pimp me out in a

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<v Speaker 2>weird way.

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<v Speaker 1>I'll say that differently.

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<v Speaker 2>They would tell neighbors like, hey, here's an able bodied

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<v Speaker 2>twelve year old to mow your lawn or take out

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<v Speaker 2>the garbage. Or there were neighbors around the corner. Missus

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<v Speaker 2>Gibbs was a widow and couldn't mow her lawn and

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<v Speaker 2>couldn't take out her garbage. So once a week I'd

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<v Speaker 2>go and I'd mow her lawn and I'd take out

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<v Speaker 2>the garbage, and she'd pay me four bucks or whatever

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<v Speaker 2>it was.

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<v Speaker 1>Did you hate it like a more than I can say, interesting,

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<v Speaker 1>more than I could tell. And she was a nice

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<v Speaker 1>one to your.

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<v Speaker 3>Parents and were like, oh God, why do I have

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<v Speaker 3>to do that? Of course I did, Oh okay, good

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<v Speaker 3>makes me feel better.

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<v Speaker 2>But there was a point when I realized that I'm

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<v Speaker 2>not doing it just for the four bucks.

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<v Speaker 1>I'm doing it to be a good neighbor.

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<v Speaker 2>And to you know, this was a woman who was

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<v Speaker 2>a teacher with my mother from at the time, and

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<v Speaker 2>then she moved across town. I got I got a

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<v Speaker 2>bike over there every time, and you know, sometimes when

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<v Speaker 2>I wasn't there, I'd have to ask a friend if

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<v Speaker 2>you would go, if he would go do it. So

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<v Speaker 2>I kind of learned that coordination part of it. But

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<v Speaker 2>they were My parents never owned a new car. They

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<v Speaker 2>they bought a.

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<v Speaker 1>Not a Cadillac.

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<v Speaker 2>They bought a Chrysler right after they got married with

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<v Speaker 2>some of the money that they had used to or

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<v Speaker 2>money with some of the money they got when they

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<v Speaker 2>got married. They bought a Chrysler. And my dad bought

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<v Speaker 2>a pickup truck. But that was back when the pickup

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<v Speaker 2>truck was like eight hundred and fifty bucks, and they

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<v Speaker 2>bought new cars. They rarely bought news cars or new cars.

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<v Speaker 2>It wasn't until they both retired and they moved and

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<v Speaker 2>they had all of this money. I don't mean all

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<v Speaker 2>of it, but they had money saved down.

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<v Speaker 3>Money saved up, and they didn't have expenses in the

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<v Speaker 3>way of kids that had activities or anything that they

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<v Speaker 3>needed to take care of. It was just them and

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<v Speaker 3>so for the risk was mitigated because they could decide

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<v Speaker 3>what their lifestyle was. When you have kids, your lifestyle

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<v Speaker 3>kind of is dictated by them a lot. I think

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<v Speaker 3>it can be, and now I think is much more

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<v Speaker 3>so than when we were kids. My parents didn't spend

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<v Speaker 3>money on stuff like I mean, outside of a thirty

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<v Speaker 3>dollars sign up fee for a little league.

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<v Speaker 1>They didn't buy me bats.

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<v Speaker 2>Any glove I used was a hand me down from

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<v Speaker 2>either my dad or from some kid down the street.

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<v Speaker 3>Remember the pop order teams had like these big shipping

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<v Speaker 3>crates filled with all the pads and helmets for everybody,

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<v Speaker 3>and that's what you got.

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<v Speaker 1>And they'd been around for twenty five years.

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<v Speaker 2>Yes, every kid that went through your town had more

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<v Speaker 2>mill shoulder pads before it smelled like it too.

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<v Speaker 3>And I was surprised they didn't have like the old

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<v Speaker 3>leatherhead helmets I still carry back in there somewhere. When

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<v Speaker 3>my kid played pop order football, I spent four hundred

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<v Speaker 3>dollars on helmets and shoulder pads.

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<v Speaker 1>It's unbelievable.

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<v Speaker 2>I mean when I talked to when I was at

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<v Speaker 2>a baseball fantasy camp, there's a bunch of guys there

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<v Speaker 2>whose kids, younger kids ten twelve, fourteen are now playing

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<v Speaker 2>travel baseball stuff. And I was laughing about, oh, yeah,

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<v Speaker 2>that's that's five hundred bucks you'll never get back. They're

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<v Speaker 2>like five hundred. We wish it was five hundred. You

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<v Speaker 2>know that they're paying twenty twenty five hundred dollars every season,

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<v Speaker 2>not just for a couple of bats for your kid.

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<v Speaker 2>You got three or four different uniforms that you are

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<v Speaker 2>responsible for as the parent. You got to coordinate travel,

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<v Speaker 2>you got to coordinate hotel stays, You got to in

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<v Speaker 2>some cases coordinate airfare to get your kids to some

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<v Speaker 2>tournament in Vegas or in Dallas or whatever. And it

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<v Speaker 2>just seems unbelievablecause how does a kid at that age

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<v Speaker 2>understand the sacrifice that you're making monetarily and you like.

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<v Speaker 1>Having contempt for them. I have to.

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<v Speaker 3>Next year when my younger son goes into the show

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<v Speaker 3>choir here in Burbank, it's like it's a big thing,

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<v Speaker 3>like it's the TV show Glee was based on this

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<v Speaker 3>high school choir. And I told my wife, I realized,

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<v Speaker 3>I'm going to be spending basically the cost of a

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<v Speaker 3>used car every year in donating to this program to

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<v Speaker 3>help fund it. Like it's bananas the amount of money.

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<v Speaker 3>And so I have to resist the urge to have

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<v Speaker 3>contempt for them, because there's no way that they understand

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<v Speaker 3>that that's how much money I'm giving.

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<v Speaker 1>No, and they don't. No, really should they like?

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<v Speaker 2>Well, And that goes back to the example that I

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<v Speaker 2>did when I put out you were talking about when

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<v Speaker 2>I tried to use a physical example to the kids

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<v Speaker 2>about how much money I made and how much money

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<v Speaker 2>it costs to live where we lived, and I used

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<v Speaker 2>a quarter for every.

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<v Speaker 1>One every I think it was a thousand. I think

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<v Speaker 1>you're right. It was a quarter for.

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<v Speaker 2>Every thousand dollars I brought in in a month, which

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<v Speaker 2>isn't a lot.

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<v Speaker 1>No, I'm going radio forgots.

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<v Speaker 2>So I'd lay that out and then i'd push these

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<v Speaker 2>quarters over there, and I'd push those quarters over there,

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<v Speaker 2>and I push those quarters over there, and I would

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<v Speaker 2>be I would I'd be left with like, instead of

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<v Speaker 2>fifty cents, I'd be left with like twenty dimesents. This

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<v Speaker 2>is what I got left to do everything else, which

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<v Speaker 2>includes your games, your see your movies, and all the luxury,

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<v Speaker 2>all that stuff. And I still don't know if they

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<v Speaker 2>get it.

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<v Speaker 3>You don't think they do. I do want to say

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<v Speaker 3>that this always comes up, and I love this. The

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<v Speaker 3>Harvard Grant study was the longest longitudal study in American

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<v Speaker 3>history where they've looked back, and the common thread that

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<v Speaker 3>they have with most successful business people and.

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<v Speaker 1>CEOs is that they did chores as a kid.

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<v Speaker 3>The experts that I talked to suggest that bare minimum,

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<v Speaker 3>You give some kind of an allowance to your kid,

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<v Speaker 3>bare minimum, so that they understand they have a limit

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<v Speaker 3>on their funds, and they start to work those neurons

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<v Speaker 3>in problem solving that as early as five, but definitely

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<v Speaker 3>by the time they're about ten. And then they say

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<v Speaker 3>that you can do like one dollar for every year,

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<v Speaker 3>for every week, so a ten year old will get

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<v Speaker 3>ten bucks a week from you in the form of

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<v Speaker 3>an allowance.

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<v Speaker 1>I'm behind that. I have a thirteen year old who

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<v Speaker 1>gets ten bucks a week.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, but he's gonna get a he's got a job,

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<v Speaker 2>he's doing great.

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<v Speaker 3>And then anyway, I was looking at this study and

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<v Speaker 3>this mom had this great comment where she said, my

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<v Speaker 3>mom always had this great line where she said, if

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<v Speaker 3>you're old enough to afford therapy, you're too old to

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<v Speaker 3>blame your parents for your problems.

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<v Speaker 2>I don't want to get that on a T shirt.

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<v Speaker 2>So much dusting, great stuff. Thank you appreciating