Speaker 1: Welcome to Destiny. Now here's your host, Cliff Dunning.
Speaker 2: Hey, this is Cliff, your host of Destiny. How you doing.
Speaker 2: Come on in, let's talk chat about good stuff. Hey,
Speaker 2: I want to remind you that if you haven't had
Speaker 2: a chance to listen to the best of Eric van
Speaker 2: Dankin's interview, I posted it recently. I also did something
Speaker 2: that I hadn't thought about. I did something for the
Speaker 2: first time. I used chat GBT to generate a graphic.
Speaker 2: I had this picture of Rish from Los Angeles, and
Speaker 2: I uploaded it into the AI system and I wrote
Speaker 2: a few and some specifics, and it came back with
Speaker 2: this amazing graphic of Eric looking down at us from heaven,
Speaker 2: along with some ets and some spaceships and some ancient
Speaker 2: sites that kind of supports this interview that I series
Speaker 2: of interviews over ten years that I pieced together in
Speaker 2: a best of program. So check that out. You should
Speaker 2: have it on your feed. And it's almost two hours
Speaker 2: and I edited it down. It could have easily been
Speaker 2: Jesus four or five hours, but I took the best
Speaker 2: of from him. And one of the early parts of
Speaker 2: that interview is Eric actually talking about growing up and
Speaker 2: how he was influenced by the Bible, but not just
Speaker 2: the religious part of it, more from an anthropological look
Speaker 2: and early man and how in his belief the the
Speaker 2: Bible describes how early man evolved and was created by aliens.
Speaker 2: So now, and one of the things that I appreciate
Speaker 2: about Eric's work is the fact that he was an
Speaker 2: explorer over anything else. I think what happened was he
Speaker 2: just got caught up, which a lot of people do
Speaker 2: when you go to places like bellbuck Lebanon, or you
Speaker 2: go to Egypt, the Giza Plateau that we talk about
Speaker 2: all the time, and seeing these pyramids up close and
Speaker 2: personal or any place else that has megalis how did
Speaker 2: they do it? How was the technology? I mean he
Speaker 2: even discusses in one interview Pumapuku and Tiwanaku, Bolivia. I mean,
Speaker 2: if you've ever been to that place, the stonework is
Speaker 2: cut with some form of technology we don't understand. So
Speaker 2: when you're observing this and he started going down in
Speaker 2: the late nineteen sixties to to South America, and he
Speaker 2: left his home in Switzerland to begin exploring. He was
Speaker 2: a research investigator, and he took great pride in his
Speaker 2: note taking and his belief in alien intervention was huge, huge,
Speaker 2: Now today we know that that's probably a little over
Speaker 2: emphasis on the alien side of it. And my belief
Speaker 2: and I've worked with elders and you've we've had people
Speaker 2: on the show who are indigenous individuals, Native Americans who
Speaker 2: believe that their ancestors worked with alien intervention. But I
Speaker 2: don't believe that the aliens. When I look at ancient aliens,
Speaker 2: it's between one and ten percent of one hundred percent.
Speaker 2: I think Arish was looking at it, but overdid it.
Speaker 2: He's looking at it from ninety percent to one hundred percent.
Speaker 2: That there's alien intervention in Earth's history. I think it's
Speaker 2: closer to two to ten percent, ten percent being the
Speaker 2: absolute most. And this is where you get these spinoffs
Speaker 2: and ancient Aliens, and it's fun, it's great fun to
Speaker 2: see these huge productions, which is not what ancient Aliens
Speaker 2: is now and in sixteenth or eighteenth season, eighteen years
Speaker 2: of that, and it's an industry. But really, if we're
Speaker 2: serious about it, it's not that aliens came down and
Speaker 2: were influencing us in that manner. It's more that we
Speaker 2: have lost part of our history. There is an advanced
Speaker 2: Earth human development that we only get bits and pieces
Speaker 2: of like the great if you ever go to Green
Speaker 2: come with us, by the way, come with us to
Speaker 2: our Sammath Daniel Grant Egyptian tour. We go and we
Speaker 2: not only walk around and interact with these pyramids, we
Speaker 2: actually go inside one of the great pyramids. We go
Speaker 2: inside of the Cufu Pyramid. And once you're in there
Speaker 2: and you're looking at these megalithic stones placed together in
Speaker 2: precision manner, in a precision manner, then you're like, Wow,
Speaker 2: those guys were amazing. It's not Aliens. It's just that
Speaker 2: we had another culture. Some say it's pre dynastic. It's
Speaker 2: not Aliens. It's just that we have a lost part
Speaker 2: of our history and we're doing we're working as fast
Speaker 2: as we can to unveil these people, unveil their science,
Speaker 2: and we're getting pieces of it. And it's really the
Speaker 2: most amazing challenge is that as our current science evolves
Speaker 2: and developed up, it allows us to discover these early people.
Speaker 2: And these early people were so sophisticated they were able
Speaker 2: to tap Earth's gravity, tap these tolleric energy sites, and
Speaker 2: over hundreds of perhaps thousands of years, develop a science
Speaker 2: around it and that science was able to create cutting tools,
Speaker 2: machines of some kind. There's actual wars like the Maha
Speaker 2: Barata War that were fought in Vomanas, which is the
Speaker 2: flying craft. So there's a history that were slowly unveiling.
Speaker 2: But I want to honor and I urge you to
Speaker 2: listen to arischvon Donegan's Life and Time series just came
Speaker 2: out look on your feed because he was an explorer.
Speaker 2: He was a research investigator who opened the door and
Speaker 2: influenced my self and many other people into wanting to
Speaker 2: know more about our past. So there you go. Hope
Speaker 2: you enjoy that program. Today's program is with a researcher.
Speaker 2: Her name is Linda shield Or. She's a psychotherapist. She
Speaker 2: has written a fascinating book called Ancestral Dreaming. And what
Speaker 2: makes this book very, very important is the fact that
Speaker 2: our ancestors, according to her, are trying to reach out
Speaker 2: to give us heads up on our own behaviors, our
Speaker 2: own tendencies that are not always positive, but also provide
Speaker 2: data about our history as a as a humanity, but
Speaker 2: also personally, how to heal the trauma that could be ours,
Speaker 2: but could be our grandparents and their great grandparents is
Speaker 2: and so forth and so on, and this is a
Speaker 2: way through dreaming and through meditation to connect with our ancestors.
Speaker 2: It's very very inspirational but also very cool to become
Speaker 2: more fulfilled as a human, as a as an individual,
Speaker 2: flesh and blood in this lifetime, so that we're more
Speaker 2: more fulfilled. And that's a big issue every year. We
Speaker 2: want to be more healthy, we want to be more fulfilled,
Speaker 2: we want to be more positive and successful. So today's
Speaker 2: program is ancestral dreaming, healed generational wounds through dream work.
Speaker 2: And my guest is Linda Yale Schiller. Hey, the semath
Speaker 2: annual Grand Egyptian Tour is coming up. We have Mohammad
Speaker 2: and Nohah e Braham with us. We're going to be
Speaker 2: visiting Tennis, Egypt, which is very very old. We don't
Speaker 2: know what happened there. It looks like a catastrophic event happened.
Speaker 2: It has megalithic structures, statues, and some large pieces strewed around. Muhammad.
Speaker 2: What do we know about Tennis? What makes it so unique?
Speaker 3: What we know about tennis unfortunately so little, but it
Speaker 3: is so little incoonveniar with the importance and the greatness
Speaker 3: of Tennis. But for us it is very high level
Speaker 3: of information. Number One, what we know that Tennis was
Speaker 3: a great center of knowledge in Incia Egypt. It was
Speaker 3: the big city receiving all the travelers and immigrants and
Speaker 3: visitors to Egypt from the northeast part of Egypt, they
Speaker 3: come across Sinai. The second thing about Tennis that there
Speaker 3: was a massive size timbil or I can call it
Speaker 3: big town. We call it Temble, dedicated to Amonra. This
Speaker 3: is Timble. This village, if I can call it this way,
Speaker 3: was completely pilt out of rose granite.
Speaker 2: From us one.
Speaker 3: You know what people don't know that there was more
Speaker 3: than twelve obelisks in Tennis, maybe more, but the remains
Speaker 3: some of them still in good condition, but all of
Speaker 3: them are laying on the ground. The one they took
Speaker 3: it to the Grand Museum, the one in front of
Speaker 3: the main gate of the Grand Museum is from Tennis,
Speaker 3: and the one in Tarrrisquare now is from Tennis. So
Speaker 3: there are about ten obelisks or eight obelisks still there
Speaker 3: at Tennis. So the story is very strange because we expected,
Speaker 3: even if the Temble was in bad condition, we expected
Speaker 3: more ruins to see more cat ORed blocks, but we
Speaker 3: found only few, but we found the biggest. By the way,
Speaker 3: there are remains of blocks weighing more than two hundred ton,
Speaker 3: and three hundred ton we found of a statue. According
Speaker 3: to the dimension of the foot, the statue would be
Speaker 3: more than fifteen hundred ton. The foot is like a
Speaker 3: car size.
Speaker 2: Wow.
Speaker 3: Okay, so we don't know what happened exactly. It must
Speaker 3: be something very strong hit tennis and hit that temple
Speaker 3: and it it caused great damage, like great exublusion happened
Speaker 3: inside the temple and caused that. All the pieces are
Speaker 3: scattered on a distance maybe like three or four kilometers wide.
Speaker 2: Amazing.
Speaker 3: When people go to tennis, they're going to feel the
Speaker 3: magic and they feel the dips of the history of tennis.
Speaker 2: Come on and join us. It's going to be April
Speaker 2: twenty eight through May tenth. For all the details and
Speaker 2: the itinerary, go to Earth Agents dot com Forward Slash Tours.
Speaker 2: We're introducing a new book today. It's called Ancestral Dreaming
Speaker 2: Healed Generational Wounds through dream Work. And my guest today
Speaker 2: is Linda Schieler. I enjoyed this book and I had
Speaker 2: to tell you that I don't always remember my dreams.
Speaker 2: But we're having Linda on today because we want to know.
Speaker 2: We want to find out how important it is to
Speaker 2: connect with our ancestors and how we can heal and
Speaker 2: how we can help them hill too. So let me
Speaker 2: tell you a little bit about Linda. She is a
Speaker 2: psychotherapist consultant. She wrote a She's written two other books,
Speaker 2: Modern dream Work and PSTD Dreams or PST Dreams. Actually
Speaker 2: kind yeah, it's kind of funny, and this is all
Speaker 2: excellent because we want to find out just how to
Speaker 2: contact the past and why it's important. So, Linda, welcome
Speaker 2: to Destiny.
Speaker 1: Great to have you, Thank you very much. Nice to
Speaker 1: be here, Cliff.
Speaker 2: Okay, the big question, how did you get involved in this?
Speaker 2: Because this is not typical And I have to say
Speaker 2: this that I although think that dreams are important. I
Speaker 2: know they're important. I can't remember my dreams because I
Speaker 2: don't pay enough attention. But so talk about how you
Speaker 2: launched into this.
Speaker 1: Sure, I'm going to lot pop right into that, but
Speaker 1: I want to just tell you, Cliff that you're in
Speaker 1: a very very good company for not remembering you And
Speaker 1: the thing you said right after that is one of
Speaker 1: the primary reasons why people don't remember their dreams, which
Speaker 1: is they don't pay enough attention to them, or it
Speaker 1: doesn't matter to them, because you know that added that
Speaker 1: will addage. We see what we're looking for. If something's
Speaker 1: important to us, we look for it and we pay
Speaker 1: attention to it, and if it's not, then we pay
Speaker 1: less attention to it unless it hits us over the head,
Speaker 1: as some dreams or nightmares do when they've decided that
Speaker 1: they've had enough of us not paying attention. So the
Speaker 1: best way, well two things. One is in our culture,
Speaker 1: dreams are not given the respect that they deserve. And
Speaker 1: as a matter of fact, in pretty much every native
Speaker 1: of an indigenous culture throughout the world, respect and attention
Speaker 1: is given to dreams as able to help us solve problems,
Speaker 1: heal medical issues, for tell future, have precognitive experiences connect
Speaker 1: with the spirit world, and the wise men and women
Speaker 1: and the shamans and the medicine people of pretty much
Speaker 1: every culture are those who are the best dreamers. And
Speaker 1: that's not by coincidence. And I'm just now reading an
Speaker 1: article about the Maori culture in New Zealand, and I'm
Speaker 1: reading because I'm actually I'm very excited. I'm going to
Speaker 1: be in New Zealand teaching dream work in the first
Speaker 1: weekend in March. So if anyone out there wants to
Speaker 1: go to New Zealand and live your dream and learn
Speaker 1: dreamwork at the same time, first weekend in March, I'll
Speaker 1: give you the links. But they talk about how important
Speaker 1: dreaming is in the Maoric culture and what they say,
Speaker 1: let mean if I can remember the acronym. They say,
Speaker 1: most of the research on dreams is done by what
Speaker 1: he calls it's an acronym in the acronym that uses
Speaker 1: weird Western European what's the eye? I can't remember the
Speaker 1: eyes for rich democracies. So and they the researchers said,
Speaker 1: this represents about twelve percent of the world's population, but
Speaker 1: most of the attention to dreams are only given by
Speaker 1: people who live in these Western, non indigenous, wealthier cultures,
Speaker 1: and they miss all the nuance of dreams. Hence, we're
Speaker 1: not taught about the importance of dreams. And as a therapist,
Speaker 1: I and none of my colleagues were taught how to
Speaker 1: do dream work in our schools of psychology or schools
Speaker 1: of social worker, schools of counseling and we should be
Speaker 1: because this is the best way and the fastest, most
Speaker 1: direct access to our deepest self, to our soul, to
Speaker 1: our unconscious and to the things that we almost but
Speaker 1: don't quite know in our conscious mind. So I recommend
Speaker 1: paying attention to dreams for the ability to access nonlinear
Speaker 1: ways of knowing. Right, we have our left brain linear
Speaker 1: waking mentality of what's out there in our quote unquote
Speaker 1: waking life, but there are worlds that we don't have
Speaker 1: access to with that left brain linear logic. And ironically,
Speaker 1: or maybe not ironically, the most scientific of science is
Speaker 1: catching up with indigenous folks. Quantum physics is all about
Speaker 1: knowing things in unusual ways that defy logic.
Speaker 2: So when you say indigenous cultures have traditions of working
Speaker 2: in the dreams state, is that noted? Is that, like,
Speaker 2: you know, documented in a way?
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, tons and tons and tons of research with
Speaker 1: Native American, with New Zealand, with Australia, with the Far East,
Speaker 1: with Middle Eastern. Pretty much every spiritual tradition and native tradition,
Speaker 1: including our Western spiritual traditions talk about the importance of
Speaker 1: dream work and have a place in Judaeo Christian and
Speaker 1: Muslim cultures. In sort of the Western world cultures of spirituality,
Speaker 1: dreams are given a lot of importance and attention, but
Speaker 1: they're sort of a subgroup and they're not the mainstream
Speaker 1: practice for most people.
Speaker 2: Right So, in the early parts of your book you
Speaker 2: give suggestions, which is classic, but have a notepad or
Speaker 2: a journal or some form of written paper and pen
Speaker 2: standing by so that when you have your dream, you
Speaker 2: wake up a little bit and write a couple of
Speaker 2: sentences down, or what is your suggestion for dream memory?
Speaker 1: The very best way to remember your dreams is to
Speaker 1: write them down. And mostly we only remember the dreams
Speaker 1: that we have at the end of a ram cycle,
Speaker 1: right so, and we also probably only mostly remember the
Speaker 1: dreams we have when we first wake up in the morning.
Speaker 1: But we know we have between five and seven ram
Speaker 1: cycles every night, which means we all have approximately five
Speaker 1: to seven dreams every night. We just don't remember them
Speaker 1: unless we happen to wake up them.
Speaker 2: Five to seven dreams, Yeah, are these must be significant
Speaker 2: dreams that just get buried in some kind of database.
Speaker 1: Well, we don't know exactly what they are if we
Speaker 1: don't remember them. Most of us remember if we're lucky
Speaker 1: one or two. I have one colleague who's been in
Speaker 1: my dream circle for twenty years, and she is amazing.
Speaker 1: She has this dream practice which somehow she manages to
Speaker 1: capture like between four and seven dreams almost every night,
Speaker 1: and she goes through a journal like every couple of
Speaker 1: months filling it with her dreams. She's an outlier. That's
Speaker 1: not the norm for most of us. Yeah, but when
Speaker 1: but when you wake up in the morning or in
Speaker 1: the middle of the night, if you can jump down
Speaker 1: everything you can think of that you remember from your dream,
Speaker 1: capture as much as you can because and the reason
Speaker 1: I say write it as opposed to like dictated into
Speaker 1: your machine, whatever your devices, is that as we write,
Speaker 1: we're activating our physical somatic body as well, and we
Speaker 1: trigger remembering of our unconscious self when we are using
Speaker 1: our physical body as opposed to just talking. And often
Speaker 1: I'll find in this and everybody reports us that as
Speaker 1: we're writing things down, we remember more than we thought
Speaker 1: we did before we started writing. So if you can't
Speaker 1: write for whatever reason, by all means at least dictated
Speaker 1: into your into your phone or whatever, but then later
Speaker 1: go back and transcribe it, and you'll probably find there's
Speaker 1: more detail than when you first spoke it.
Speaker 2: Talk about primers or starting sets that will help us
Speaker 2: remember our dreams. Now, I've heard that if we use
Speaker 2: intention as we're in bed, I would like to remember
Speaker 2: my dreams Tonight I need to dream about I have
Speaker 2: the feeling that this person is contacting me or whatever.
Speaker 2: I don't know. What are your suggestions for launching a
Speaker 2: dream work?
Speaker 1: Sure, so to have a dreamwork practice for starters, be
Speaker 1: aware that this is possibility and climb on board that
Speaker 1: it's important. If you say, ah, just a dream, you're
Speaker 1: going to be less likely to remember. But if you say, oh,
Speaker 1: dreams can really connect me with my higher self, with
Speaker 1: spiritual realm, with other people, with knowledge they're worthwhile remembering,
Speaker 1: you're going to be more likely to remember. That's that's
Speaker 1: for starters. And then what you're talking about, Cliff, is
Speaker 1: a practice called dream incubation, which is an yeah, which
Speaker 1: is an ancient practice of preparing before you go to
Speaker 1: sleep at night to put your mind and intention on
Speaker 1: what it is you'd like to dream about. And you
Speaker 1: can spend a few minutes or half an hour whatever
Speaker 1: you want, writing in your journal. What the dilemma or
Speaker 1: issue or question or desire is that you'd like to
Speaker 1: get more information about, to get some direction about from
Speaker 1: your dreams, and end that writing with as specific a
Speaker 1: question as you can, And the more specific your question,
Speaker 1: the greater likelihood that you will easily understand the message
Speaker 1: the dream has come to tell you. Because dreams come
Speaker 1: couched in layers of symbol and metaphor, and that's why
Speaker 1: we do dream work to peel back the layers so
Speaker 1: we understand sort of the symbolic and metaphoric meanings of
Speaker 1: the dreams. So the gift of doing good dream work
Speaker 1: is a gift of associations. So if you have a
Speaker 1: question you'd like to ask, or a departed relative in
Speaker 1: the case of talking about ancestors you'd like to hear from,
Speaker 1: be real specific about what it is. Rather than saying, oh,
Speaker 1: i'd like to connect with my ancestors, say my mom
Speaker 1: died last year and I miss her. I'd really like
Speaker 1: to have her visit me and invite her. So Mom
Speaker 1: will come and give me a hellout tonight while I'm sleeping,
Speaker 1: and your chances are going to be much higher that
Speaker 1: the exact question you've asked will be answered in a
Speaker 1: way you can understand it.
Speaker 2: I like that before we get into what you call
Speaker 2: the six calls from our ancestors, I want you to
Speaker 2: describe why it's important to reach out and what is
Speaker 2: ancestral healing in communication. I mean, I've talked to people
Speaker 2: who say, this is our history. Our ancestors did this
Speaker 2: quite regularly. The indigenous cultures are all about this. But
Speaker 2: why is it important to have this communication with ancestors.
Speaker 1: So some of us have ancestral lines that were pretty
Speaker 1: easy and happy and successful and well cared for. And
Speaker 1: if we were lucky enough to primarily have ancestors, parents, grandparents,
Speaker 1: great grandparents as far back as we can go, well
Speaker 1: basically had pretty good lives. They're probably at peace. On
Speaker 1: the other side, they might come to visit us with
Speaker 1: some blessings, with some gifts, with some wisdoms. But for
Speaker 1: many and I don't know if I can say most
Speaker 1: of us, but certainly many of us have in ancestors
Speaker 1: in our ancestral line who died in great pain, who
Speaker 1: died because of trauma, who died with unresolved wounds, And
Speaker 1: if that was the case, they are still stuck in
Speaker 1: the pain of the wound or the trauma that happened
Speaker 1: in their lives because they didn't have an opportunity while
Speaker 1: they were embodied to do the healing. So the gift
Speaker 1: that gives both ways in doing ancestral dream work is
Speaker 1: when we can contact or be contacted by our relatives
Speaker 1: who died with pain. And these are the ones who
Speaker 1: come through and say, please help me, I'm still suffering.
Speaker 1: The book is full of many, many stories of this,
Speaker 1: and many many exercises and things that we can do
Speaker 1: in our sleep, in our sleep or dream adjacent states
Speaker 1: like meditation or hypnotic states or trans or in our
Speaker 1: waking lives to create and send healing to those spiritual
Speaker 1: spirits who are still suffering and send the healing back
Speaker 1: into time and space so they can receive the healing
Speaker 1: they never got a chance to have when they were alive,
Speaker 1: finish their journey and pass over in peace to live
Speaker 1: with the one. However, you understand what happens when you die,
Speaker 1: and then what happens that's so beautiful is that that
Speaker 1: healing that we gave to our grandparents passes down the
Speaker 1: line to our parents and passes down the line to us.
Speaker 1: So rather than the message of pain and trauma and
Speaker 1: suffering being what's passed down from generation to generation. We
Speaker 1: can pass down the message of healing, resilience and hope,
Speaker 1: and then we pass that on to our children and
Speaker 1: our students and the people whose lives we touch.
Speaker 2: So this generation is embodied. And so you're saying, we
Speaker 2: have the power to reach in and heal our ancestors.
Speaker 2: I mean, how do we know that there's a problem
Speaker 2: with our ancestors? Is this the dream work someone's coming
Speaker 2: through and saying I'm in pain, I'm emotionally upset still,
Speaker 2: I mean.
Speaker 1: So there's a lot of different ways we might know
Speaker 1: that there is a problem that's happened in our family
Speaker 1: line and our family tree. And one of the best
Speaker 1: ways to have knowledge about your family is to make
Speaker 1: a family tree, to create what's called a genogram, and
Speaker 1: there are lots of templates online. There's a template in
Speaker 1: the book for making a family tree.
Speaker 2: I saw that.
Speaker 1: Yeah, And to ask your parents and your grandparents sooner
Speaker 1: rather than later, before the information dies and you can't
Speaker 1: get it. Who's who in the family, who has married
Speaker 1: to who, who has children? Where does everybody come from,
Speaker 1: and what were their lives like? And if you simply
Speaker 1: start asking your parents and your grandparents, and if you're
Speaker 1: lucky enough to have great parents grandparents who are still alive,
Speaker 1: they'd be usually more than happy to tell you. And
Speaker 1: if they're not more than happy, sometimes they'll still tell
Speaker 1: you anyway. If you can convince them how important it
Speaker 1: is to tell their stories before they're lost, you will
Speaker 1: learn things about your family history that you would never
Speaker 1: have known had you not asked, or you might already
Speaker 1: know or suspect, like you know that dad's mom died
Speaker 1: of a heart attack at forty seven years of age.
Speaker 1: I'm just making up a scenario. And there's a history
Speaker 1: of heart problems in the family, right, So it's like,
Speaker 1: oh aha, genetic history heart problems in a family. That's
Speaker 1: one thing we can track sort of the medical history,
Speaker 1: but then also what's the emotional and life lived history
Speaker 1: connected with heart attacks?
Speaker 2: Right?
Speaker 1: So, just for example, I'll just to share a personal story.
Speaker 1: My dad died of his third heart attack when he
Speaker 1: was forty seven. Forty Yeah, he.
Speaker 2: Was very very good young.
Speaker 1: Right, right, he was very very young, and my parents
Speaker 1: were divorced when I was about twelve years old, and
Speaker 1: my dad cheated on my mom, so he had a
Speaker 1: history of pain of the heart from an emotional standpoint
Speaker 1: and not being true to his heart for years and
Speaker 1: years before he had a physical symptom. So that's just
Speaker 1: one example of where the emotional story and the physical
Speaker 1: story come together. But you also will find as you
Speaker 1: go through family history it's like, Oh, you know Grandma's brother,
Speaker 1: how come we never see great Uncle Jack? What's wrong
Speaker 1: with him? Oh, we don't see uncle Jack, we don't
Speaker 1: talk to him. Well, why what happened? What's the story
Speaker 1: with great Uncle Jack? And how is that still relevant
Speaker 1: in our family? The question then is what are we
Speaker 1: still carrying in our lives today? It's actually not ours
Speaker 1: to carre it. We're carrying old stuff that belongs to
Speaker 1: generations past. And until we know if we're carrying stuff
Speaker 1: that isn't ours, we can't easily separate from it. So
Speaker 1: awareness then gives us the option of choice and of
Speaker 1: doing healing work. So that's why it's so important to
Speaker 1: trace this history. You can do it alive with your
Speaker 1: parents and grandparents. You can do it by incubating dreams.
Speaker 1: You can do it with automatic writing to see what
Speaker 1: comes through. Like many ways to do it.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I almost have a situation where most of my
Speaker 2: relatives of my grandparents have passed many years ago. My
Speaker 2: father passed away. I think my mother's she's ninety five.
Speaker 2: I don't think she remember. But you just said the
Speaker 2: key word. If they're not alive, you can use your dreams,
Speaker 2: you can use automatic writing and talking like that. I
Speaker 2: really like that. And you're saying some very important make it,
Speaker 2: some very important point to Linda, which is that this
Speaker 2: isn't just to heal the ancestors. This is to heal you.
Speaker 2: That's right, which I have not thought about. But that's
Speaker 2: the critical point. Where are the physical beings? And we should,
Speaker 2: you know, instill this knowledge to allow us.
Speaker 1: To heal right in the same way we inherit physical
Speaker 1: characteristics our selves and our personalities and the way we live.
Speaker 1: Our lives is affected by the environments we grew up
Speaker 1: in and how we were parented, and how our parents
Speaker 1: parented us is affected by who parented them and the
Speaker 1: environments they grew up in. So things can get repeated
Speaker 1: from generations past that are no longer actually relevant to
Speaker 1: our lives today, but we get parented and therefore internalize
Speaker 1: and act as if they were. Because this is what's
Speaker 1: getting passed along the family line.
Speaker 2: Wow. We're going to take a short commercial break to
Speaker 2: allow our sponsors to identify themselves, and we will return
Speaker 2: shortly with my guests today, Linda Sheeler discussing her new
Speaker 2: release Ancestral Dreaming, will be right back. This podcast is
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Speaker 2: Psychotherapist Linda Yale Schiller she has written a new book
Speaker 2: on ancestral healing. This is a look at reaching out
Speaker 2: beyond our known parentage, our known ancestors into the deep
Speaker 2: past and working with the gifts and the trauma that
Speaker 2: they suffered as well. So should we obviously be paying
Speaker 2: attention to physical health issues, mental emotional, spiritual issues that
Speaker 2: are bogging us down and may have an ancestral trail
Speaker 2: to focus on.
Speaker 1: Right whatever it is that you are blessed to do
Speaker 1: well with and have success within your life and have
Speaker 1: peace within your life, look and see if there are
Speaker 1: other people in the family who you know of who
Speaker 1: also have these gifts. If you're struggling with depression, or
Speaker 1: with anxiety, or with the after effects of trauma, how
Speaker 1: much of that is because of what actually happened to
Speaker 1: you that affected you in your life and your then
Speaker 1: emotional response to that. And of course somatic and soma
Speaker 1: and psyche are hand in hand, so semitic and physical effects.
Speaker 1: But look to see anybody else in the family have
Speaker 1: a history of fill in the blank? Is this pattern
Speaker 1: being passed along from generation to generation? And as a therapist,
Speaker 1: I can tell you most of the people I work with,
Speaker 1: and this is not blaming the parents by any mean.
Speaker 1: I'm a parent, so I'm not blaming the parents, can
Speaker 1: find connections between things that brought them into into counseling
Speaker 1: or therapy and things that their parents and grandparents also
Speaker 1: struggled with or went through.
Speaker 2: I love that. I want to talk about what you
Speaker 2: call the six calls from your ancestors, which is what
Speaker 2: you open the book in and I'm going to read
Speaker 2: him off and if you could explain him a little
Speaker 2: with a little more depth, I think it would be
Speaker 2: very helpful. The first one is I am here, you
Speaker 2: are not alone, which I thought. I have a very
Speaker 2: favorite grandfather who was almost reherrent to me, who passed
Speaker 2: away over twenty years ago. And when you say you
Speaker 2: are not alone, I could kind of feel that sense
Speaker 2: of him being around, But how do we work with that?
Speaker 1: Well, you know, I'm looking for something and I'm not
Speaker 1: going to find the quote I'm looking for, but I
Speaker 1: found a different quote. I'm holding the book here. Grief
Speaker 1: is a very powerful experience to have, and when we
Speaker 1: lose someone that we love, we mean we grieve and
Speaker 1: that's normal and it's natural, and we go through a
Speaker 1: lot of different stages of grieving, from the first week
Speaker 1: where in some traditions we sit shival for a week.
Speaker 1: The first month is called slow shehim, and then there's
Speaker 1: the first year, and what Western culture forgets to pay
Speaker 1: attention to is there's a second year two where things
Speaker 1: are not, you know, back to status quo yet. So
Speaker 1: we learn how to live with loss one way, shape
Speaker 1: or form. It becomes a way to help be a
Speaker 1: bomb or a salve for our grief. To know, even
Speaker 1: though the body and the physicality of the person we
Speaker 1: loved isn't here anymore, their essence and their soul is
Speaker 1: still with us. So if you connect with your grandfather
Speaker 1: and this might come through to you, and maybe it has,
Speaker 1: maybe it hasn't. If he's visited you in a dream
Speaker 1: as opposed to just having a dream about him. I
Speaker 1: think it's fifty three percent. The pure research, you know,
Speaker 1: study said fifty three percent of Americans said they had
Speaker 1: visitations from their departed loved ones in their dreams. And
Speaker 1: that's just the people who recognized that they were having
Speaker 1: a visit. So chances are probably even higher. But the
Speaker 1: knowledge that they're not really gone, they're still available is
Speaker 1: so comforting and so powerful. And there's that you're not alone,
Speaker 1: I'm still with you peace.
Speaker 2: How do we work with that, Linda? How do we
Speaker 2: work with a relative that you want to communicate with more?
Speaker 2: How does that? How do we launch into that.
Speaker 1: Several different ways? First is have the intention, have the desire.
Speaker 1: There's a wonderful fray a word in Hebrew. It's called
Speaker 1: coveanda and kavanaugh means intention and it comes from the
Speaker 1: root of the word le coven and kivun means direction.
Speaker 1: So a covena or an intention is pointing yourself in
Speaker 1: the direction that you want to go in. So you
Speaker 1: start with pointing yourself in the direction of wanting to
Speaker 1: be in touch with them, and then you can incubate
Speaker 1: a dream, inviting them to show up and capture whatever
Speaker 1: dream comes through. Even if you're not sure they showed up,
Speaker 1: keep trying until it becomes clear, or work with someone
Speaker 1: else or with a group to help unpack the dream,
Speaker 1: to find out the hidden places that we need help
Speaker 1: discovering that we can do on our own and in
Speaker 1: waking life. Have that intention of connection and look for
Speaker 1: it when you're in a quiet, peaceful place. Look for
Speaker 1: it when you're taking a walk down by the river,
Speaker 1: look for when you're listening to the birds singing in
Speaker 1: the trees. Look for it when you're swimming in the ocean.
Speaker 1: Look for it in a place, these liminal places right
Speaker 1: between earth and air and water, where spirit and matter
Speaker 1: are less clear cut, and often you'll find the voice
Speaker 1: or a sign or a synchronicity that lets you know, Oh,
Speaker 1: here they are, Here they are.
Speaker 2: Are they supposed to be our ancestors, supposed to be
Speaker 2: our counselors, are advice givers? Or are they there just
Speaker 2: to nurture?
Speaker 1: Depends on the ancestor. I think, just as in our lives,
Speaker 1: right there are people who are supposed to be accountants,
Speaker 1: and there's people who are supposed to be professors, and
Speaker 1: there's people who are supposed to be podcasters and not
Speaker 1: other people, right. I think it's the same with our ancestors. YEA,
Speaker 1: So my stepdad, Bud. All I have to do is
Speaker 1: say his name or think of him, and he's right
Speaker 1: here in the room with me. Nobody else in my
Speaker 1: life does that. He was the father of my adult life,
Speaker 1: is what my mentor. He read my first professional papers
Speaker 1: when I was a professor at Boston University and was
Speaker 1: writing for publication, because he was a professor as well.
Speaker 1: So in my life he was a mentor for me.
Speaker 1: And after his death he's been gone, I don't know
Speaker 1: twenty years now. Oh he's still here.
Speaker 2: Anytime I call him into place, consciously, not unconsciously when
Speaker 2: you're asleep. Is that what you're suggesting?
Speaker 1: In this particular case, he shows up in three different ways.
Speaker 1: One is he sometimes comes through in dreams on his own,
Speaker 1: well actually four. Two is when I'm awake sometimes I'll say, hey, Bud,
Speaker 1: what do you think of this? Three is he'll just
Speaker 1: show up. I can just steal his essence. And right now,
Speaker 1: for example, I can hear him like laughing, this great,
Speaker 1: great laugh that he has because he's sort of delighted
Speaker 1: that we're referencing him this way. Four is I we
Speaker 1: My daughter grew up thinking that dreams were very normal
Speaker 1: and talking to dead relatives was a really normal thing. Ah,
Speaker 1: So when she was little, and you know, all of
Speaker 1: us who are our parents, you know, there are things
Speaker 1: where we can get into power struggles with our kids
Speaker 1: if we're not careful. One of the best techniques I
Speaker 1: ever found was to tell my daughter, you know, ask
Speaker 1: Grandma and Grandpa what they think about this. You go,
Speaker 1: ask them now they're already dead, right. So she goes
Speaker 1: and I don't know if she dreams it or if
Speaker 1: she channels them or what she does, but she comes
Speaker 1: back the next morning with advice that I am totally behind.
Speaker 1: That I agree with. I Grandma said that I should
Speaker 1: do this or that, or Grandpa said that I should
Speaker 1: do this or that. I said, all right, what do
Speaker 1: you think She said that sounds good? I said, yeah,
Speaker 1: I agree with grandma.
Speaker 2: You know, I love to hear that, because I think
Speaker 2: some people might think you're crazy. You're asking dead people advice.
Speaker 2: You know, our Western morals are bleeding through, you know
Speaker 2: whatever that means. Or fundamentalism of religion may think you're
Speaker 2: working with the devil.
Speaker 1: Yeah, you know, if you had parents or grandparents who
Speaker 1: passed who were cruel or abusive, or really challenged or
Speaker 1: addicts or just didn't treat you well. I wouldn't send
Speaker 1: my kid to ask them for advice, So you know,
Speaker 1: you use your common.
Speaker 2: Sense too, exactly exactly.
Speaker 1: Unless they've done their healing work, and then that's a
Speaker 1: different story than you know. As Peter Levine, who wrote
Speaker 1: Waking the Tiger and as in Somatic Experiencing, talked about
Speaker 1: that a trauma healed is an earned blessing. So trauma
Speaker 1: healed is a great blessing for us, but trauma on
Speaker 1: healed continues to repeat itself.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I want to complete this sixth Jauls because I
Speaker 2: think they are so unique and really there is diverse
Speaker 2: as our listeners. So the next one is take these gifts.
Speaker 2: I like to hear about that.
Speaker 1: Yeah. So sometimes our ancestors come in the first one
Speaker 1: saying I'm here, You're not alone, right. They can also
Speaker 1: come through saying I have some gifts or some blessings
Speaker 1: for you that I'd like to offer you in your life.
Speaker 1: And those are always so special. They can be something concrete,
Speaker 1: they can be something with words, They can be an
Speaker 1: essence or felt sense it can also be in this
Speaker 1: category that sometimes our ancestor will come through here and say,
Speaker 1: you know, I have an apology to make to you
Speaker 1: that I did get a chance to make when we
Speaker 1: were alive. So I really want to say sorry for
Speaker 1: this X thing that happened between us. And that's a
Speaker 1: gifted blessing too.
Speaker 2: Yes, that's a huge gift, especially if you were devastated
Speaker 2: by them, whatever they said to you or the behavior
Speaker 2: that they presented.
Speaker 1: Yeah. One of my clients who had been struggling with
Speaker 1: her mom, who was sort of the epitome of not
Speaker 1: a good mom when she was growing up, and her
Speaker 1: mom would say things to her like I never should
Speaker 1: have been a mother, I'm a terrible mother. You know,
Speaker 1: you should have been born to someone else, like things
Speaker 1: like that. When she worked with her mother in spirit,
Speaker 1: her mother said to her, I'm really sorry I said
Speaker 1: those things to you.
Speaker 2: Oh my god.
Speaker 1: Yeah, And her mother said, here's what happened in my life.
Speaker 1: Her mother was orphaned when she was two years old
Speaker 1: and was brought up by sort of like a wicked
Speaker 1: stepmother kind of thing, like an aunt who really never
Speaker 1: wanted to have this additional child join her household. So
Speaker 1: she was brought up as an unwanted child and passed
Speaker 1: that message on to her daughter. But she didn't mean to,
Speaker 1: but she did because that's what she had known. But
Speaker 1: after she died, she said, I'm so sorry. Here's why
Speaker 1: I would say those things to you. Didn't really mean them.
Speaker 1: I really still love you and I always did.
Speaker 2: I mean that is for a child they have a
Speaker 2: parent berate them or whatever and then apologize. It's such
Speaker 2: a relief. That's a trauma for a child, right, and
Speaker 2: that's a relief too. So you're describing, yeah, a trauma
Speaker 2: release with a parent who is or a relative who's deceased,
Speaker 2: or a loved one who's deceased. That's powerful.
Speaker 1: And my client who I worked with around this, she
Speaker 1: was not a child. She was in her fifties when
Speaker 1: we did this work. But she was able to then
Speaker 1: bring that apology and healing message back to her younger
Speaker 1: self internally as a child, and pass it on to
Speaker 1: her daughter too.
Speaker 2: That's a fantastic story. Let's move on because we have
Speaker 2: a little bit of time. Let's see gifts and then
Speaker 2: let me help you heal.
Speaker 3: Right.
Speaker 1: Yeah, so the third one is number one. I'm still here.
Speaker 1: Number two, I have a blessing for you. Number three
Speaker 1: is I can send some over here where I am
Speaker 1: that you're struggling with something. You might have asked for
Speaker 1: help and they come through and say, I got some
Speaker 1: advice for you, or I got some help for you,
Speaker 1: I got some idea to you. I'm going to help you.
Speaker 1: That in a nutshell is it's like when I tell
Speaker 1: my kid, you know, ask Grandma what she thinks about this.
Speaker 1: It's usually something we've been, you know, struggling with, so
Speaker 1: ask Grandma for help kind of thing.
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's great. We already covered number four, which is
Speaker 2: please help me heal. Yeah. So they're reaching out from
Speaker 2: wherever they are, what dimension or after life or whatever,
Speaker 2: and saying I could use your help, and they must
Speaker 2: pick up that you are at a place where you
Speaker 2: maybe can offer some words of healing or some advice.
Speaker 2: Is that what you're thinking.
Speaker 1: That's a wonderful way of putting it, and a wonderful perspective.
Speaker 1: I think that if you're in a place where you
Speaker 1: hear them ask for help, or see or sense or
Speaker 1: feel whatever sense it's sensory modality it comes through for you,
Speaker 1: then probably they've picked you at the right time in
Speaker 1: your life to be able to offer some assistance.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 1: I like that, right, Because someone came to us as
Speaker 1: when we were teenagers, or when we were sewing our
Speaker 1: wild oats in our twenties, or struggling with making a
Speaker 1: living in our thirties, or whatever it was, and we
Speaker 1: didn't have much leftover to extend to the other side,
Speaker 1: that might not have been the right time for them
Speaker 1: to come.
Speaker 2: Yeah. And I haven't had a chance to look thoroughly
Speaker 2: through the book, but I would imagine you have case
Speaker 2: studies of people who are dealing with these calls in
Speaker 2: their own away. That's right, Yeah, which was really really impactful.
Speaker 2: Number five is this I'm looking at my trying to
Speaker 2: read my hand right here.
Speaker 1: I can help you think that read your hand ready.
Speaker 1: I remember it's.
Speaker 2: Old pain has not been healed. Well.
Speaker 1: Number five is a little different. That one's still connected
Speaker 1: to Number four. This old pain and this old trauma
Speaker 1: hasn't been healed. Number five is when the ancestors come
Speaker 1: through and they had a lot of conflict, enmity, hatred
Speaker 1: arguments in their waking life, and they're still holding the
Speaker 1: grudge and they want you to continue the grudge.
Speaker 2: Oh, they want you to be as angry and unhappy.
Speaker 1: As you kick up the ball, like the hat Fields
Speaker 1: and the McCoys, or the Montagues and the Capculates in
Speaker 1: Romeo and Juliet, like from generation to generation the Montagues
Speaker 1: and the Capitulates always fight each other, or the Hatfields
Speaker 1: and the mcgoys always shoot each other to ample in
Speaker 1: the book of something that happened along these lines, and
Speaker 1: in this circumstance, if you've got an ancestor coming here
Speaker 1: and say, you know, that side of the family, they're
Speaker 1: really garbage, and I want you to just own them.
Speaker 1: You know, they could come through and say something like
Speaker 1: that or I'm you know, paraphrasing. Of course, your job
Speaker 1: is not to say, oh, sweetie, you know, let me
Speaker 1: help you necessarily. I mean, they might not be amenable
Speaker 1: to help anyway. But here you need to have some boundaries.
Speaker 1: You need to say, wait a minute, no, the buck
Speaker 1: has stopped here. I'm not going to perpetuate ill will
Speaker 1: or enmity or hatred. And as a matter of fact,
Speaker 1: not only I'm not going to perpetuate it, I'm going
Speaker 1: to surround myself with light. I'm going to surround you
Speaker 1: with light, and I talk in the book about the
Speaker 1: sepher light, sapphire light of healing and protection. But I'm
Speaker 1: going to send you back to the source so you
Speaker 1: can finish your healing and get past this place where
Speaker 1: you're stuck in a grudge. So it's a slightly different
Speaker 1: relationship here with this type of ancestral visit.
Speaker 2: I mean, that's a powerful but very negative influence that
Speaker 2: you're the person who's dealing with. It's kind of hairy.
Speaker 1: Some families have people that they just don't talk to
Speaker 1: or are like, you know, the black Seeds of the family.
Speaker 1: They may or may not even know why if it
Speaker 1: was not from their like generation or lifestyles. Oh, in
Speaker 1: this family, you know, the Smiths of the black Seeds
Speaker 1: side of the family. Why, well, we don't know. They
Speaker 1: just always have them right. But we don't need to
Speaker 1: continue there. This could heal not only our own family lines,
Speaker 1: but potentially the world if everyone got behind this, because.
Speaker 2: That's so big here, We're going to take a short
Speaker 2: commercial break to allow our sponsors to identify themselves, and
Speaker 2: we will return shortly with my guests today, Linda Schieler
Speaker 2: discussing her new book Ancestral Dreaming, will be right back.
Speaker 2: I guess it is Linda Schiller. She has written a
Speaker 2: new book on our ancestors called Ancestral Dreaming, how to
Speaker 2: communicate with them and how to work with them for
Speaker 2: our own betterment, but also to understand what they are
Speaker 2: going through and have been going through in a traumatic fashion.
Speaker 2: It's so interesting to speak with you, Linda, because this
Speaker 2: is so natural for you to be communicating with these
Speaker 2: ancestors and having these clients that you're counseling to open
Speaker 2: to connect with the ancestors to get this data. It's
Speaker 2: so matter of fact, and I just I love it
Speaker 2: because it's so freeing for me to kind of think
Speaker 2: about my relationships and my non communication because I'm you know,
Speaker 2: maybe on a subtle level, I'm communicating with my ancestors,
Speaker 2: but I'm really not paying attention.
Speaker 1: Well, I'll tell you something, Cliff. The fact that you
Speaker 1: invited me to come here today and that you had
Speaker 1: enough interest in this topic to engage in a conversation about.
Speaker 2: It means you are on some level.
Speaker 1: And maybe this is you know, a foot in the
Speaker 1: door to wedge it open even further for you.
Speaker 2: I tell you right, Well, the dream part, I I
Speaker 2: really like the dream part because I I think I
Speaker 2: can get a lot out of it. The last calling
Speaker 2: is carry on my name. Yeah. Now that's and I'd
Speaker 2: like you to find that what that means.
Speaker 1: These are the ancestors that come to us and say,
Speaker 1: remember me. Tell your children, tell your grandchildren, tell your students,
Speaker 1: tell your other people in your life about my life,
Speaker 1: my struggles, my gifts in a spiritual and an intellectual
Speaker 1: in an emotional sense, and literally remember me. You know,
Speaker 1: use my dishes at Thanksgiving and tell your family these
Speaker 1: were Grandma, you know, Sylvie as dishes. You know this piece,
Speaker 1: this saw that I've inherited from My grandfather used to
Speaker 1: saw wood with this saw and still works and I
Speaker 1: keep it sharp in honor of his woodworking abilities. So
Speaker 1: we're instilling a remembrance and a continuity from generation to
Speaker 1: generation to generation. And that's part of what makes us strong,
Speaker 1: is feeling these connections we suffer from, particularly since COVID,
Speaker 1: but for even longer before that, what the Surgeon General
Speaker 1: called an epidemic of loneliness and being cut off from
Speaker 1: each other in our world. And we need to as
Speaker 1: best as we can create and re establish connection and
Speaker 1: affiliation and ties both with our families, our birth families
Speaker 1: and our families of origin, and with the broader community
Speaker 1: friends as family groups, as family. This is how we
Speaker 1: stay together in it as community. And we need community,
Speaker 1: whether it's related community or not related community in the world.
Speaker 1: So part of having community is remembering what our family
Speaker 1: gifts are physically and emotionally and passing those along so
Speaker 1: that we remember where we came from and where we
Speaker 1: want to go.
Speaker 2: That's great for recently departed and memories of you know,
Speaker 2: the family treat But what about ancient ancestors, right, how
Speaker 2: do we connect with them and carry on their existence?
Speaker 1: So do you have grandparents or great grandparents who were
Speaker 1: deceased who have anything that is a concrete memory or
Speaker 1: artifact from their lives.
Speaker 2: Yeah, my grandfather was a physician and he collected. His
Speaker 2: practice was during the Great Depression, Wow, And so they
Speaker 2: would trade. He's from part of Central California, so there
Speaker 2: were immigrants from China, India, and he would barter or
Speaker 2: they would barter very family heirlooms and things like that
Speaker 2: for treatment. So he I have all this stuff, but
Speaker 2: you know, I remember him. I was in his life,
Speaker 2: he was in my life. I wonder how much further back,
Speaker 2: I mean one hundred years, one thousand years, and how
Speaker 2: I can connect with them and perhaps they're reaching out,
Speaker 2: but I don't know them, you know what I mean.
Speaker 1: So a comment and then a question. The comment is,
Speaker 1: what a wonderful legacy from your grandfather of healing and
Speaker 1: making healthcare available to all, right, whether you can pay
Speaker 1: you or not. And how valuable these artifacts from China
Speaker 1: or India are, way beyond whatever their actual worth is.
Speaker 1: That's a symbol of your grandfather's compassion and goodwill and
Speaker 1: desire to help, and what a beautiful thing they have.
Speaker 1: And remember and to tell other people in your life,
Speaker 1: if you have kids, if you have partner, if you
Speaker 1: have cousins, whoever in your life is here saying this
Speaker 1: was your great what your grandfather got for taking care
Speaker 1: of people who didn't have money. What a nice thing
Speaker 1: to remember him by. Yeah, yeah, And then the other pieces.
Speaker 1: Do you know where your family comes from? You know,
Speaker 1: generations ago?
Speaker 2: What part of the world, Well, I mean he immigrated
Speaker 2: from Germany, Okay, and my mother's said on my father's
Speaker 2: side they're English, Okay, you know, but I mean I've
Speaker 2: on the test the family tree, but it only goes
Speaker 2: so far you know what I mean?
Speaker 1: Right, Well, depending on what you want, there's a couple
Speaker 1: of things you can do. One is you can do
Speaker 1: DNA testing. Right. You can go on ancestry dot com.
Speaker 1: You can go I okay, and you can go on
Speaker 1: twenty three in me and that'll take you as far
Speaker 1: as far as you can. And then if that doesn't
Speaker 1: give you the ancest the answers to the questions that
Speaker 1: go far enough for you incubate a dream. Yeah, do
Speaker 1: some writing about I'm really curious about the German side
Speaker 1: of my family or the English side of my family,
Speaker 1: and I really want to know more about who they were,
Speaker 1: and write that and dream on it night after night
Speaker 1: until you get a dream, and then peel back the
Speaker 1: layers of the dream. If it's not absolutely clear to
Speaker 1: tell you, Oh, from the English side of my face family,
Speaker 1: we had people who were carpenters. I'm just making this up.
Speaker 1: And you know some of the women on this side
Speaker 1: of the family were midwives and that you didn't know,
Speaker 1: but it came through somehow in the dream. We have
Speaker 1: time to tell you a quick story about that.
Speaker 2: Yeah, no, we got plenty of time.
Speaker 1: Oh okay, I know, so my daughter, Our daughter was
Speaker 1: born in China, right, so she's not biologically I read
Speaker 1: that iteah, yeah, and so And this is something a
Speaker 1: shout out for everyone who has adoption in their family anywhere,
Speaker 1: whether it's your kids or you, yourself, or another part
Speaker 1: of your family. So when you're doing ancestry, we're paying
Speaker 1: attention to the biological ancestry of wherever your child or
Speaker 1: relative was from, whether it's domestic or foreign adoption, as
Speaker 1: well as the ancestry from your family. So my daughter,
Speaker 1: he often will say things like I inherited this from
Speaker 1: my dad or I inherit this from you, and she'll
Speaker 1: say things, oh, yeah, I have a therapist for a mom,
Speaker 1: so that's why I know this. So that's why I
Speaker 1: do that, right, But she literally means inherited. She's not
Speaker 1: being metaphoric. She's now a young adult too, so but
Speaker 1: she knows enough to know. She was brought up. She
Speaker 1: was a year old when we brought her home from China,
Speaker 1: and so some of her likes and dislikes, her behaviors,
Speaker 1: the environment she grew up in is colored by who
Speaker 1: her parents are, the punts who raised her, my husband
Speaker 1: and I. So that's literally true. And in addition, we
Speaker 1: made sure we stayed connected with her Chinese heritage and
Speaker 1: her Chinese culture and did all sorts of things while
Speaker 1: she was growing up with an ongoing group of other
Speaker 1: girls who were adopted from China. We went back when
Speaker 1: she was ten years old, he visited. We even went
Speaker 1: back to her orphanage where she was before she was
Speaker 1: brought home to us. And I sort of joke and
Speaker 1: I say, that trip was worth ten years of therapy. Man.
Speaker 1: She got so much out of connecting with those part
Speaker 1: of her roots as well, and the connection with doing
Speaker 1: these like blood tests or saliva tests, twenty three and me.
Speaker 1: When she was eighteen, we gave her the gift of
Speaker 1: twenty three and ME for her birthday because she was
Speaker 1: really curious and interested. And she got a little bit
Speaker 1: here and there, you know, nothing too found. But then
Speaker 1: a few years later, she gets a Facebook message from
Speaker 1: this woman who says, I'm the mom of an adopted
Speaker 1: girl from China and I think you might be her cousin.
Speaker 1: Oh my god, right, And so what happened is they
Speaker 1: she's somewhat because there's a Facebook group for adoptees from
Speaker 1: China and they were on the same Facebook group. So
Speaker 1: long story short, it turns out that this girl and
Speaker 1: my daughter their grandmothers, they're Chinese grandmothers, were sisters.
Speaker 2: Oh wow, small world.
Speaker 1: Yeah, so there's another There's several layers of what it
Speaker 1: means to inherit and to remember and to pass on
Speaker 1: the memory of someone that last piece remember me, right?
Speaker 1: How do we remember and honor and honor the people
Speaker 1: who we learned from?
Speaker 2: And so I guess I'm just entuiting this right now.
Speaker 2: So if you're having some bleed through of somebody in
Speaker 2: crisis or trauma or wanting to communicate that isn't recognizable,
Speaker 2: that's where dream work would come in and you reach
Speaker 2: out and go, hey, hi, I'll have an intention to
Speaker 2: see who this person is in my in my past.
Speaker 2: I mean, I'm just making this up there, going if
Speaker 2: you had any cases like that, Linda, where you had
Speaker 2: client that could not discern who this person was that
Speaker 2: was trying to reach.
Speaker 1: Out, Yeah, so we want to say something and then
Speaker 1: answer that question with an example. If someone is having
Speaker 1: dreams of a dream figure who's in pain or suffering
Speaker 1: or trauma and they don't know who it is before
Speaker 1: going in to work on the dream and finding out
Speaker 1: more about who that person is and what aspect of
Speaker 1: themselves or their family, if an aspect that is, do
Speaker 1: take care to do the self protection. And there's a
Speaker 1: whole lot of exercises in the book about how to
Speaker 1: set your own boundaries, how to surround yourself with healing light,
Speaker 1: how to make sure that you don't get quote unquote
Speaker 1: contaminated by somebody else's stuff if you're working with pain
Speaker 1: and trauma, so make sure you do that first. But yes,
Speaker 1: I have an example of someone who I worked with
Speaker 1: who we've been working together for a while, and she
Speaker 1: had a family history of Holocaust survivors and people who
Speaker 1: did not survive the Holocaust as well, and we did
Speaker 1: a lot of work with her family history in that line.
Speaker 1: But then she had in addition, a dream where she said,
Speaker 1: I feel like there's a great deal of pressure on
Speaker 1: my chest and it's hard to breathe in the dream,
Speaker 1: and I don't know why, and it doesn't feel connected
Speaker 1: with any of the known family history that I have.
Speaker 1: So we did some dream work, some waking dream work
Speaker 1: with the dream, letting her kind of go back inside
Speaker 1: the dream while awake and seeing what she can discover
Speaker 1: through this process of dream work called the guy a
Speaker 1: method guided active imagination approach, which is a Jungian style
Speaker 1: of working. And what she came up with was, I
Speaker 1: think I was buried alive. I think I was a
Speaker 1: witch in a former life. Was that true? We don't know,
Speaker 1: but her felt sense was that this could have been true.
Speaker 1: And here in Boston, Massachusetts, were just a hop, skip
Speaker 1: and a jump from Salem, right where the witch Chials were,
Speaker 1: And we know that that's a true part of our history,
Speaker 1: particularly in eastern Massachusetts, but I'm sure many other places
Speaker 1: in the country as well. So we did the work
Speaker 1: as if this had been a lifetime of hers, whether
Speaker 1: or not we knew if it was. And after we
Speaker 1: did the work for a while, she never had those
Speaker 1: dreams of feeling hard to breathe, pressure on her chest,
Speaker 1: or being buried underground.
Speaker 3: Again.
Speaker 2: This opens up so many possibilities, this work that you're
Speaker 2: outlining in your book for healing, and I think people
Speaker 2: need to understand that just because we say trauma, it
Speaker 2: could be anything. It could be any type of issue
Speaker 2: that you're having. It could be a particular attitude that
Speaker 2: you need to clean up a little bit. And so
Speaker 2: you're being very direct by designing the book and calling
Speaker 2: an ancestral dreaming. But I think that there and you're
Speaker 2: writing in this book, there's a lot of work that
Speaker 2: should be considered. Is what you're suggesting in this work
Speaker 2: than just fantastic? I want to ask you another question,
Speaker 2: and then I want to get a couple of case
Speaker 2: studies that people can hear about that you can choose
Speaker 2: as we can complete our time together in the book
Speaker 2: you write. The original title of the book was bringing
Speaker 2: Home My Bones. Yeah, and I thought that was fascinating
Speaker 2: because you know, when you leave the planet, all you
Speaker 2: have left.
Speaker 1: Is the bones exactly.
Speaker 2: But talk about that a little bit, will you.
Speaker 1: Yeah, well, that was the title that came through to me,
Speaker 1: and I actually wrote a long poem with that as
Speaker 1: the title. And my publisher, though, in their wisdom, said
Speaker 1: no one will know what your book is about. If
Speaker 1: that's the title, you can put that in the chapter title,
Speaker 1: but we can't. We have to name the books so
Speaker 1: people know what it's about. So I, in their wisdom,
Speaker 1: you know, since this is the third book that Lil
Speaker 1: Webbon has published, I said, okay, I'll go with that,
Speaker 1: but exactly what you said, our bones are the scaffolding
Speaker 1: of our physical body, which then hold the container of
Speaker 1: our soul and spirit. Our bones have marrow inside of
Speaker 1: that and marrow holds literally our lifeblood. The stem cells
Speaker 1: that are used for healing and now with modern science
Speaker 1: can used to heal both ourselves and others are found
Speaker 1: in the marrow of our bones. So in many, many traditions,
Speaker 1: both Western and non Western, bones are revered. Bones are
Speaker 1: appreciated as holding life and spirit, and in the Hawaiian
Speaker 1: tradition it's called mana, which is the spirit of the person.
Speaker 1: One story that I told a friend of mine had
Speaker 1: been to Portugal and she went to a monastery, and
Speaker 1: the monastery was built on land. Something else was had
Speaker 1: to be re purposed. That was the cemetery, and they
Speaker 1: dug up the bones of the cemetery, and then monastery
Speaker 1: took them and used them to build the artifice of
Speaker 1: the monastery. So when you walk in, you walk into
Speaker 1: an archway full of bones, literally of bones, and the
Speaker 1: sign I guess over the the entrance says, you know,
Speaker 1: these bones are here, We're waiting for yours.
Speaker 2: That sounds kind of morbid, but there it is.
Speaker 1: But it's also these bones are part of the eternity
Speaker 1: of us and the title chapter of Ring Home My
Speaker 1: Bones that comes directly from the Judeo Christian Bible. We're
Speaker 1: in Genesis when Jacob and there's famine in the land
Speaker 1: and they have to go down to Egypt to get
Speaker 1: relief from the family, and all the brothers go. Joseph
Speaker 1: is already there, Joseph of the Code of Many Colors,
Speaker 1: He's already there. He's now sort of Pharaoh's right hand guy. He,
Speaker 1: by the way, is the most famous dreamer in the
Speaker 1: Bible because he the reason he's Pharaoh's right hand man
Speaker 1: is cle He interprets Pharaoh's dreams, which allows him to
Speaker 1: prepare for the famine. Right the seven Fat Sheep and
Speaker 1: the seven Lean Sheep. Probably some people are familiar with this,
Speaker 1: but anyway, when Jacob goes down with the rest of
Speaker 1: the family, he says, I'm going to die here, but
Speaker 1: bring all my bones back to Canan before you leave.
Speaker 1: And then later Joseph says the same thing, if I
Speaker 1: die here, bring home my bones as well. So there
Speaker 1: is something about the veneration of the bones and the
Speaker 1: connection of bones with spiritual homeland that is very powerful.
Speaker 1: Now we don't all live in the lands that our
Speaker 1: ancestors lived in, or on the land our ancestors lived
Speaker 1: in or are buried in. But can we imagine, can
Speaker 1: we do that metaphorically, if not literally, can we bring
Speaker 1: home the bones of our ancestors so that we are
Speaker 1: maintaining that physical spiritual connection. I sort of use that
Speaker 1: as one word with this lifeblood of our bones and
Speaker 1: our answer.
Speaker 2: I love that. It's funny because I think there's certain
Speaker 2: communities in Europe. These are Old World communities who bury
Speaker 2: their relatives under the house, yeah, or close by, so
Speaker 2: they had that connection. And we're talking, you know, about
Speaker 2: reaching out, and it might make it easier to reach
Speaker 2: our ancestors because they're so close and they're you know,
Speaker 2: their physical what's left of their physical formats nearby.
Speaker 1: Right. It's a very concrete reminder if your ancestors bones
Speaker 1: are like in the backyard, right. And in modern ways
Speaker 1: of burial, there's there's what's called green burial now, and
Speaker 1: there's also cremation, and I think a lot of people
Speaker 1: when they choose cremation, keep a little container of the ashes,
Speaker 1: even if they bury the ashes or disperse them over
Speaker 1: the sas somewhere little little container of ashes stays on
Speaker 1: the mate piece is a reminder.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, amazing. As we close, Linda, can you give
Speaker 2: us a couple of samples, examples, i should say, or
Speaker 2: case studies of clients who were able to connect with
Speaker 2: relative and have a a healing, a solution or whatever
Speaker 2: communication of some form.
Speaker 1: Yeah, let me just put my attention on that. Well,
Speaker 1: one is that I just I already told you about
Speaker 1: the woman whose mother said I should never have been
Speaker 1: a mother. I'm a terrible mother.
Speaker 2: That's a wonderful example. Yeah, yeah, I love that. Yeah.
Speaker 1: Let me think of another one of something a little
Speaker 1: bit of another flavor. Well, I'm going to give you
Speaker 1: two examples. One is my cat, right because cats are
Speaker 1: and our pets are are for babies too. Many people
Speaker 1: consider their their animals, you know, part of their family. Well,
Speaker 1: my cat, e Fie, was one of twins we brought home.
Speaker 1: This this sort of match that you actually can see
Speaker 1: them over my shoulder. I don't know if this is
Speaker 1: live or not, but yeah, there's a picture. This is
Speaker 1: this is this is the boys Effie and Many there
Speaker 1: were two and Many died a couple of years ago,
Speaker 1: and we have a little cat cemetery in the backyard.
Speaker 1: So over the years cats who have passed away we
Speaker 1: buried them in the yard and have put a little
Speaker 1: stone there. And one day the one who still left, Fie.
Speaker 1: A couple of weeks after many died, Fie got out
Speaker 1: of the house. We don't let him out much, really,
Speaker 1: We only let him on the death which is fenced
Speaker 1: because it's too much wildlife in the neighborhood. We get
Speaker 1: out one day and he made a beeline for his
Speaker 1: brother's grave and he started sniffing around and scratching at
Speaker 1: the dirt.
Speaker 2: Amazing.
Speaker 1: How did he know, I don't know, but it was
Speaker 1: so powerful.
Speaker 2: So he came off the deck in went to the
Speaker 2: actual ground area where the body.
Speaker 1: Well, he actually we opened the door to like bring
Speaker 1: in the newspaper or you know, take off the garbage
Speaker 1: is something, and he scooed it out so he didn't
Speaker 1: jump off the deck. He doesn't jump off the deck
Speaker 1: anymore than God he used to is he's all he's
Speaker 1: an old guy now.
Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah. The book's called Ancestral Dreaming. Heal generational wounds
Speaker 2: through dreamwork. I guess has been Linda Schieler. I I
Speaker 2: really enjoyed the work that you have done in this
Speaker 2: give our listeners a chance to learn more about you.
Speaker 2: What's your website and what's your social media contacts?
Speaker 1: Right, So my website is Linda yel Schiller dot com
Speaker 1: and that's spelled l I n d A y a
Speaker 1: e l s c h I l l e R,
Speaker 1: so that's all one word dot com. And on the website,
Speaker 1: you know, with the drop down menu, you can learn
Speaker 1: lots about me, and there's a page for publications. So
Speaker 1: all three of my books are connected to this website
Speaker 1: and you can click on. Each of them has their
Speaker 1: own website as well, so Modern Dreamwork, PTS Dreams, and
Speaker 1: Ancestral Dreaming, and the website for Ancestral Dreaming has a
Speaker 1: hyphen because that domain name was already taken, so Ancestral
Speaker 1: Hyphendreaming dot com. So you can learn more in detail
Speaker 1: about the books. I have Facebook page Linda Elschuler, I
Speaker 1: have LinkedIn. I show up on Instagram, even though I'm
Speaker 1: not sure how I do it sometimes.
Speaker 2: Yeah, we must have a YouTube channel because you're very outgoing.
Speaker 2: You do like little online seminars or anything.
Speaker 1: Oh, thank you well. I have things that have been
Speaker 1: taped and put on YouTube, so you can find me
Speaker 1: on YouTube. Not directly. My skill set doesn't extend to
Speaker 1: technological our media based things, so I'm very appreciative of
Speaker 1: people who can do the technical end of things. But
Speaker 1: I had a book talk a couple of two months
Speaker 1: ago when the book came out, and that's up on YouTube.
Speaker 1: They we've foun somebody in the audience filmed it, and
Speaker 1: a few other things. Other podcasts like yourself or up
Speaker 1: on YouTube as well.
Speaker 2: Okay, well, we're we have a YouTube channel for Destiny
Speaker 2: and you'll be definitely showing up there.
Speaker 1: So oh agreed, Benda.
Speaker 2: It's been a real pleasure having you on the program.
Speaker 2: Thank you for your time and continue success with this.
Speaker 2: I think it's a real nice addition to our ancestral connection.
Speaker 1: That's wonderful. Thank you. Well, I just thought of something.
Speaker 1: I have a substack.
Speaker 2: You started writing on a substack.
Speaker 1: Yeah, so you can find me on substack as well.
Speaker 1: I don't overwhelm people. It's the most. It's like once
Speaker 1: a month, but there's a bunch up here. If you
Speaker 1: want to take a look. You won't get an email
Speaker 1: like every you know, every week or anything from it.
Speaker 2: Good to see fantastic. Hey, continue success and thank you, thank.
Speaker 1: You same to you. A pleasure talking to you, Cliff.
Speaker 2: You can get a copy of Ancestral Dreaming on Amazon.
Speaker 2: Spent out about four weeks. Oh, spent out two months,
Speaker 2: came out in November, more than two months. It came
Speaker 2: out in November and the and we didn't get a
Speaker 2: chance to really get into the case studies. But the
Speaker 2: exercises in the book are easy and I'm going to
Speaker 2: try a few of them because I need to remember
Speaker 2: my dreams. I mean, dreams are away for your higher self,
Speaker 2: your soul, whatever you want to call, your your guides, whatever,
Speaker 2: to communicate, and sometimes they communicate in your waking hours.
Speaker 2: But it's much more challenging for me because we've got
Speaker 2: our minds on all kinds of things like work and
Speaker 2: kids and family, friends, things like that. You know. So
Speaker 2: Ancestral Dreaming heal generational wounds through dreamwork. Fun interview. Hey,
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Speaker 2: Forward slash Tours. All right, that's it for this program.
Speaker 2: I want to think my guest today, Linda Sheiler, has
Speaker 2: always the team of Gail Tour, Mark Foster and Fair Pavar.
Speaker 2: You guys rock all right, Take care every well and
Speaker 2: we will talk to you next time.