1 00:00:28,600 --> 00:00:35,640 Speaker 1: Welcome to the Great Detectives of Old Time Radio from Boise, Idaho. 2 00:00:36,000 --> 00:00:39,600 This is your host, Adam Graham. In a moment, we're 3 00:00:39,640 --> 00:00:43,280 going to bring you this week's episode of drag Net. 4 00:00:43,759 --> 00:00:46,240 But first I do want to encourage you. If you're 5 00:00:46,359 --> 00:00:51,520 enjoying the podcast, please follow us using your favorite podcast software. 6 00:00:51,920 --> 00:00:55,000 Today's program is brought you in part by the financial 7 00:00:55,039 --> 00:00:59,079 support of our listeners. You can support the show on 8 00:00:59,119 --> 00:01:03,240 a one time based by Malini donation to Adam Graham 9 00:01:03,479 --> 00:01:07,519 peel box one five nine one three. That's peel box 10 00:01:07,879 --> 00:01:13,079 one five nine thirteen, Boise, Idaho eight three seven one five, 11 00:01:13,200 --> 00:01:16,879 and become one of our ongoing Patreon supporters for as 12 00:01:16,959 --> 00:01:20,400 little as two dollars per month. Just go to Patreon 13 00:01:20,560 --> 00:01:25,599 dot Great Detectives dot net. Now from January twenty fourth, 14 00:01:25,840 --> 00:01:29,200 nineteen fifty two, here is the Big Court. 15 00:01:37,760 --> 00:01:41,000 Speaker 2: The story you're about to hear is true. The names 16 00:01:41,040 --> 00:01:52,959 have been changed to protect the innocent. You're a detective sergeant. 17 00:01:53,480 --> 00:01:57,319 You're assigned to robbery detail. An ex convict is accused 18 00:01:57,319 --> 00:02:01,400 of robbery and murder. Four witnesses identify him as the killer. 19 00:02:02,200 --> 00:02:04,879 The man's arigned and municipal court and held a answer 20 00:02:05,680 --> 00:02:08,360 your job investigator. 21 00:02:17,199 --> 00:02:21,280 Speaker 3: Dragnet the documented drama of an actual crime. Well the 22 00:02:21,319 --> 00:02:24,759 next thirty minutes, in cooperation with the Los Angeles Police Department, 23 00:02:25,240 --> 00:02:27,400 you will travel step by step on the side of 24 00:02:27,400 --> 00:02:31,039 the law through an actual case transcribed from official police violence, 25 00:02:31,639 --> 00:02:35,599 from beginning to ends, from crime to punishment. Dragnet is 26 00:02:35,639 --> 00:02:37,520 the story of your police force in action. 27 00:02:42,479 --> 00:02:45,319 Speaker 4: It was Wednesday, March twelfth, was cold in Los Angeles. 28 00:02:45,360 --> 00:02:47,400 We were working the day Watch out of robbery detail. 29 00:02:47,800 --> 00:02:50,479 My partner's Ed Jacobs. The boss is Captain Didion. My 30 00:02:50,560 --> 00:02:53,039 name is Friday. We run away over from the office 31 00:02:53,039 --> 00:02:54,800 and it was ten forty three am when we got 32 00:02:54,840 --> 00:02:58,240 to the third floor at the Haul of Justice Municipal 33 00:02:58,280 --> 00:02:59,759 Court Department eighty two. 34 00:03:02,879 --> 00:03:04,560 Speaker 5: You see him, Joe, I think. 35 00:03:04,479 --> 00:03:06,599 Speaker 6: So yeah, that's him up front behind the d a stable. 36 00:03:06,719 --> 00:03:14,759 Speaker 5: Oh yeah, that's see. You want next year high? Oh hi, 37 00:03:14,879 --> 00:03:20,960 Friddy Jacobs pull up a chair. Yeah, thank you. Who's 38 00:03:20,960 --> 00:03:23,080 on the stand first? You know, victim's wife. 39 00:03:23,120 --> 00:03:28,960 Speaker 7: I think, oh, people pass the Saints Claire. 40 00:03:31,080 --> 00:03:32,960 Speaker 8: People ready in this case, to your honor, we'd like 41 00:03:32,960 --> 00:03:34,960 to proceed with number two, three, five, four, eight. 42 00:03:35,199 --> 00:03:37,680 Speaker 9: You've been proceed Is the defendant ready? 43 00:03:37,800 --> 00:03:41,400 Speaker 5: Defendant's ready, your honor called Agnes's Halloway, Agnes Holloway to 44 00:03:41,439 --> 00:03:45,080 the stand, Kay. 45 00:03:48,120 --> 00:03:50,159 Speaker 10: You just hollow I swear that the testimony are about 46 00:03:50,199 --> 00:03:52,159 to give him the matter of pending before this court. 47 00:03:51,960 --> 00:03:53,719 Speaker 5: Will be the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but 48 00:03:53,759 --> 00:03:57,680 the truth. To help to God, I do stay your name, please. 49 00:03:58,479 --> 00:04:07,400 Speaker 8: Holloway, calling your attention to the fourth day of March 50 00:04:07,479 --> 00:04:10,280 or this year. Missus Holloway, did you see the defendant 51 00:04:10,319 --> 00:04:12,800 in your place of business at two three oh one 52 00:04:12,800 --> 00:04:13,560 Mailer Avenue. 53 00:04:13,960 --> 00:04:16,399 Speaker 5: Yes? What time of day did you first see him 54 00:04:16,439 --> 00:04:17,079 at that location? 55 00:04:17,800 --> 00:04:19,040 Speaker 11: It was around ninety three? 56 00:04:19,519 --> 00:04:21,240 Speaker 5: Will you tell us what you saw the defendant? 57 00:04:21,240 --> 00:04:23,480 Speaker 12: Doll the purpose of the record, May we ask whether 58 00:04:23,600 --> 00:04:25,199 I was in the morning or the afternoon. 59 00:04:25,480 --> 00:04:28,399 Speaker 8: Was that in the morning or in the PM PM? 60 00:04:28,439 --> 00:04:30,240 Can you tell us what you saw the defendant do 61 00:04:30,399 --> 00:04:31,319 and what you heard him. 62 00:04:31,240 --> 00:04:33,959 Speaker 5: Say at that place you made before the holder at 63 00:04:34,000 --> 00:04:36,199 nine thirty? Please tell us what occurred? 64 00:04:36,639 --> 00:04:39,160 Speaker 13: Well, I came in about nine thirty is the place. 65 00:04:40,040 --> 00:04:41,560 He was already sitting there at the bar. 66 00:04:42,519 --> 00:04:43,000 Speaker 5: Continue. 67 00:04:43,480 --> 00:04:45,120 Speaker 13: I came in and sat down at the end of 68 00:04:45,160 --> 00:04:48,639 the bar. He was sitting about five stools from the door. 69 00:04:49,439 --> 00:04:55,040 Friend of mine, Doris Senway, she's here now. Doris was 70 00:04:55,120 --> 00:04:57,560 sitting near him. I would open and talk to Doris 71 00:04:57,600 --> 00:04:59,319 for a while. The man didn't say anything, he was 72 00:04:59,360 --> 00:04:59,959 just sitting there. 73 00:05:00,560 --> 00:05:01,879 Speaker 5: Did you see him drinking anything? 74 00:05:02,120 --> 00:05:04,279 Speaker 11: Yes, he was drinking scotch and soda. 75 00:05:04,600 --> 00:05:08,240 Speaker 5: You're the wife of George Holloway deceased. Is that correct? Yes? 76 00:05:08,720 --> 00:05:12,000 Speaker 8: Was he present then, baby Brenon. Was your husband George 77 00:05:12,000 --> 00:05:13,079 Holloway present. 78 00:05:12,800 --> 00:05:15,439 Speaker 5: At that time? Yes, he was tending the bar by that. 79 00:05:15,560 --> 00:05:18,399 Speaker 8: Do you mean that your husband, yourself and the defendant 80 00:05:18,439 --> 00:05:19,560 were the only person's present. 81 00:05:19,759 --> 00:05:22,720 Speaker 11: No, my friend or his family. Who was the sayer 82 00:05:22,800 --> 00:05:25,319 there too? I don't know who he had? He sat 83 00:05:25,360 --> 00:05:26,240 next to the defendant. 84 00:05:26,240 --> 00:05:27,439 Speaker 5: Could what the court? 85 00:05:27,519 --> 00:05:30,839 Speaker 13: Then, as we were ready to close the front door, 86 00:05:30,920 --> 00:05:32,319 my husband noticed the light. 87 00:05:32,199 --> 00:05:33,160 Speaker 11: And the men is worse. 88 00:05:33,319 --> 00:05:35,920 Speaker 5: I'll moved that go out? What her husband noticed as 89 00:05:35,959 --> 00:05:39,560 a conclusion of the witness? Didn't they go out? Well? 90 00:05:39,600 --> 00:05:42,399 Speaker 13: Anyway, my husband went back in to put the light out. 91 00:05:43,439 --> 00:05:46,399 Dori's friendly and I went out to the sidewalk. 92 00:05:46,600 --> 00:05:49,120 Speaker 11: So did the sayer, and the fellow did too. 93 00:05:49,399 --> 00:05:50,160 Speaker 5: The defendant did. 94 00:05:50,439 --> 00:05:50,639 Speaker 6: Yes. 95 00:05:52,160 --> 00:05:52,920 Speaker 5: In a minute, I. 96 00:05:52,879 --> 00:05:55,279 Speaker 11: Went back inside to see what my husband was doing. 97 00:05:55,319 --> 00:06:00,240 And the defendant followed me back in. I was about 98 00:06:00,240 --> 00:06:04,160 as far as the music machine. He put his arm 99 00:06:04,160 --> 00:06:08,399 around me, and he had a gun right here. He said, lady, 100 00:06:08,399 --> 00:06:09,160 this is a sticker. 101 00:06:09,800 --> 00:06:11,560 Speaker 5: Could you describe the gun yourself? 102 00:06:11,800 --> 00:06:13,439 Speaker 11: No, I just saw it looked like a pistol to me. 103 00:06:13,519 --> 00:06:14,600 I couldn't tell you to make her. 104 00:06:14,839 --> 00:06:16,680 Speaker 5: I moved that go out, if your honor please what 105 00:06:16,759 --> 00:06:17,319 it looked like? 106 00:06:17,639 --> 00:06:18,759 Speaker 11: I know it was a gun. 107 00:06:18,800 --> 00:06:22,120 Speaker 5: The motion movie denied you were inside the building when 108 00:06:22,160 --> 00:06:23,000 the defendant did that. 109 00:06:23,519 --> 00:06:26,600 Speaker 11: Yes, he said, took quiet, roll kill you? 110 00:06:26,959 --> 00:06:28,120 Speaker 5: And where was miss Fenwick? 111 00:06:28,160 --> 00:06:31,240 Speaker 11: Then she was out on the sidewalk talking to the sailor. 112 00:06:31,279 --> 00:06:34,120 I think Doris was expecting her husband to come on 113 00:06:34,160 --> 00:06:34,680 the street car. 114 00:06:34,759 --> 00:06:37,800 Speaker 5: I'm moved that go out. Miss Fenwick was out on 115 00:06:37,839 --> 00:06:40,959 the sidewalk. May stay in the balance, may go out. 116 00:06:41,519 --> 00:06:43,680 What did the defendant do after that? Missus Holloway? 117 00:06:44,160 --> 00:06:47,720 Speaker 11: He said, I will shoot you if you don't keep quiet. 118 00:06:48,680 --> 00:06:51,000 He made me walk backwards to where my husband was 119 00:06:51,040 --> 00:06:54,040 and I said, Johnny, this man has a gun. He says, 120 00:06:54,079 --> 00:06:54,839 this is a sticker. 121 00:06:55,120 --> 00:06:57,759 Speaker 13: And the man said shut up, and he made my 122 00:06:57,839 --> 00:06:58,879 husband put his hands up. 123 00:06:59,199 --> 00:07:01,480 Speaker 5: Were you in fear of the gun at that time. Oh, 124 00:07:01,560 --> 00:07:04,279 I didn't have anything. You did you believe the defendant 125 00:07:04,279 --> 00:07:05,399 would injure you with a gun. 126 00:07:06,040 --> 00:07:09,360 Speaker 11: I wasn't afraid. I said, well, it's uh hold up 127 00:07:09,399 --> 00:07:11,240 and we'll give him the money, and that's all there. 128 00:07:11,199 --> 00:07:16,800 Speaker 5: Is to it, all right. Continue, Well, when. 129 00:07:16,680 --> 00:07:18,439 Speaker 13: We got to the back room, my husband was trying 130 00:07:18,480 --> 00:07:21,319 to open the safe and he says, hurry up, I 131 00:07:21,360 --> 00:07:22,319 have your wife covered. 132 00:07:22,759 --> 00:07:23,720 Speaker 11: Try if you don't hurry. 133 00:07:23,879 --> 00:07:24,839 Speaker 5: The defendant said that. 134 00:07:25,160 --> 00:07:28,920 Speaker 13: Yes, my husband said, don't get nervous. You can have 135 00:07:29,120 --> 00:07:33,000 anything we have, but don't shoot it. Then my husband 136 00:07:33,199 --> 00:07:35,920 got the safe open and took. 137 00:07:35,720 --> 00:07:37,360 Speaker 11: Out the money bag and handed it to the man. 138 00:07:37,839 --> 00:07:41,160 The defendant. He grabbed it and then he shot my 139 00:07:41,240 --> 00:07:41,879 husband twice. 140 00:07:42,000 --> 00:07:45,839 Speaker 8: The defendant shot your husband twice. Yes, m you know 141 00:07:45,879 --> 00:07:47,560 what The contents of the money bag. 142 00:07:47,480 --> 00:07:49,759 Speaker 11: Were about a hundred and sixty dollars. 143 00:07:50,040 --> 00:07:52,519 Speaker 8: Any time did you give this defendant authority or your 144 00:07:52,560 --> 00:07:53,800 consent to take that money? 145 00:07:53,839 --> 00:07:56,480 Speaker 5: No, sir, the taking of the money was against your will. 146 00:07:56,560 --> 00:07:59,399 Is that correct? Yes? How soon after was it that 147 00:07:59,439 --> 00:08:01,000 the officer arrived at the location. 148 00:08:01,160 --> 00:08:02,920 Speaker 11: It's about seven or eight minutes after death. 149 00:08:03,160 --> 00:08:05,920 Speaker 5: Your husband was removed to the hospital. Yes, Do you 150 00:08:05,920 --> 00:08:07,079 know when your husband died? 151 00:08:07,519 --> 00:08:09,959 Speaker 11: He died on the seventh Friday, six o'clock. 152 00:08:10,079 --> 00:08:11,920 Speaker 5: You mean on the seventh of March of this year. 153 00:08:12,279 --> 00:08:13,920 Speaker 11: Yes, you say you Did. 154 00:08:13,839 --> 00:08:16,680 Speaker 5: You see your husband in the coroner's office? Biddy? 155 00:08:16,959 --> 00:08:20,000 Speaker 8: Did you see your husband after death in the coroner's office? 156 00:08:20,160 --> 00:08:20,240 Speaker 14: No? 157 00:08:20,319 --> 00:08:22,800 Speaker 5: I saw him in the hospital after death. Did you 158 00:08:22,800 --> 00:08:25,240 see your husband downstairs in the coroner's office? 159 00:08:25,399 --> 00:08:26,399 Speaker 11: No, when my son did. 160 00:08:27,160 --> 00:08:28,920 Speaker 5: Did you see your husband after death? 161 00:08:29,240 --> 00:08:34,200 Speaker 13: Yes, at the mortuary Monday the tenth, at the mortuary, 162 00:08:34,279 --> 00:08:36,360 and the person you viewed in death was the same 163 00:08:36,519 --> 00:08:36,879 Charles A. 164 00:08:37,000 --> 00:08:39,480 Speaker 5: Holloway, who you knew in life as your husband. 165 00:08:39,840 --> 00:08:40,039 Speaker 11: Yes. 166 00:08:40,919 --> 00:08:41,960 Speaker 5: Do you know Grace Thompson? 167 00:08:42,159 --> 00:08:43,840 Speaker 11: Yes, sir, she works for me and my husband. 168 00:08:44,000 --> 00:08:46,600 Speaker 5: Was she present at your place of business on this evening? Yes? 169 00:08:46,879 --> 00:08:49,360 When did she leave there? Do you know about? 170 00:08:49,519 --> 00:08:49,679 Speaker 8: Uh? 171 00:08:49,720 --> 00:08:51,240 Speaker 11: Five minutes to twelve midnight? 172 00:08:51,440 --> 00:08:53,879 Speaker 5: Can you fix the precise time when your husband was shot? 173 00:08:54,519 --> 00:08:56,320 Speaker 11: About five minutes after twelve. 174 00:08:56,159 --> 00:08:59,360 Speaker 5: Five minutes after twelve? How many times was the gun fired? 175 00:08:59,639 --> 00:09:00,000 Speaker 11: Twelve? 176 00:09:00,720 --> 00:09:04,559 Speaker 5: How close was begun to your husband? Charles Holloway must 177 00:09:04,600 --> 00:09:08,120 have been about two feet Do you know Marion Shaw? Yes? 178 00:09:08,840 --> 00:09:11,039 Speaker 8: Was she present on the premises that evening she was 179 00:09:11,080 --> 00:09:14,639 present at any you know MSUs sam Garber, Yes, was 180 00:09:14,679 --> 00:09:16,320 she present on the premises that evening? 181 00:09:16,440 --> 00:09:18,519 Speaker 11: Yes, sir, And that Sally was there too. 182 00:09:18,639 --> 00:09:19,039 Speaker 5: Uh. 183 00:09:19,080 --> 00:09:21,399 Speaker 8: I didn't know him though all the chief related that 184 00:09:21,480 --> 00:09:23,720 curred in the County of Los Angeles, State of California. 185 00:09:23,879 --> 00:09:27,759 Speaker 5: Yes, sir, across attend. 186 00:09:27,759 --> 00:09:28,799 Speaker 11: You may have a drink of water? 187 00:09:28,879 --> 00:09:35,159 Speaker 5: Please? Really would you like to rest awhile missus. 188 00:09:34,919 --> 00:09:37,559 Speaker 11: Halloway, Yes, rease, we'd. 189 00:09:37,399 --> 00:09:40,039 Speaker 9: Have a short recess before the cross examina are. 190 00:09:46,639 --> 00:09:49,559 Speaker 5: Joe? They had Yellier probably won't get to us for 191 00:09:49,600 --> 00:09:51,559 a while. You wanna gray her smoke? Uh, that's fine, 192 00:09:51,600 --> 00:09:52,600 on man, you think. 193 00:09:54,200 --> 00:09:54,679 Speaker 15: More than. 194 00:09:56,200 --> 00:10:02,879 Speaker 5: All that. What's your idea? Honestly though? And not to 195 00:10:02,879 --> 00:10:04,840 have him bound out with a period cord. No, I 196 00:10:04,840 --> 00:10:06,360 mean you think Saint Clare's the right man? 197 00:10:06,960 --> 00:10:07,320 Speaker 2: Got me? 198 00:10:08,240 --> 00:10:10,120 Speaker 5: He had just one good piece of physical evidence. I'd 199 00:10:10,120 --> 00:10:10,440 feel a. 200 00:10:10,440 --> 00:10:11,679 Speaker 2: Lot better about it. 201 00:10:12,519 --> 00:10:12,799 Speaker 5: Good. 202 00:10:12,960 --> 00:10:23,600 Speaker 16: Yeah, thanks, there you go, like, yeah, thanks, thank you. 203 00:10:25,159 --> 00:10:28,279 Speaker 8: How about Saint Clair's alibi? All the angles checked? Hi, 204 00:10:28,600 --> 00:10:31,559 all of 'em doesn't hold much water. Can't prove it toke, 205 00:10:31,600 --> 00:10:32,519 can't prove it's the truth. 206 00:10:32,639 --> 00:10:33,600 Speaker 5: Sure, hate these things. 207 00:10:33,600 --> 00:10:36,200 Speaker 16: I don't know which way to go for identifying witnesses, 208 00:10:36,200 --> 00:10:37,320 and you know how wrong they can be. 209 00:10:37,759 --> 00:10:39,440 Speaker 8: What about that sailor was supposed to be in the 210 00:10:39,480 --> 00:10:41,879 bar at the time and an homicide didn't do any good? 211 00:10:41,879 --> 00:10:44,080 Speaker 5: How about you fella well, samely or nothing? 212 00:10:44,159 --> 00:10:45,919 Speaker 8: Yet he was the only one who really got a 213 00:10:45,960 --> 00:10:47,879 close look at the killer besides the wife, I mean 214 00:10:48,559 --> 00:10:50,720 killer bumped into him when he ran out of the bar. Yeah, 215 00:10:51,440 --> 00:10:53,840 if anyone could identify the right man, the sailor could ran. 216 00:10:53,919 --> 00:10:56,039 Nobody at the bar saw him before that night. Nobody's 217 00:10:56,039 --> 00:10:57,679 seen him. Since he's not a trace of 'em. M 218 00:10:58,440 --> 00:11:01,320 sure our best bet we could find him. We might 219 00:11:01,360 --> 00:11:04,039 put a foundation under this thing, Yeah, put in it. 220 00:11:04,120 --> 00:11:06,919 There's just one problem. Yeah, it's a big navy. Where 221 00:11:06,919 --> 00:11:11,399 do we find him? 222 00:11:11,559 --> 00:11:14,399 Speaker 4: When fifty eight year old tavern owner Charles Holloway was 223 00:11:14,440 --> 00:11:17,080 shot and fatally wounded in a hold up on March fourth, 224 00:11:17,399 --> 00:11:20,799 there were five people in the immediate vicinity Holloway's wife, 225 00:11:20,840 --> 00:11:23,399 a waitress at the tavern, two women customers, and an 226 00:11:23,440 --> 00:11:26,799 unidentified sailor. Soon after the shooting, the scene of the 227 00:11:26,840 --> 00:11:30,000 crime was gone over thoroughly for all physical evidence. But 228 00:11:30,120 --> 00:11:33,440 besides the two fatal bullets. None was found. The preliminary 229 00:11:33,480 --> 00:11:37,519 investigation failed to yield any further leads. A search was 230 00:11:37,559 --> 00:11:41,639 started for the missing witness, the unidentified sailor the foreign. 231 00:11:41,639 --> 00:11:44,320 Known witnesses were brought down town, where they checked through 232 00:11:44,399 --> 00:11:47,200 volumes of pictures of ex convicts recently released from the 233 00:11:47,240 --> 00:11:50,480 state penitentiaries. All of them identified the mug shot of 234 00:11:50,519 --> 00:11:54,039 Harald Saint Clair, a recent parole from Chino, where he'd 235 00:11:54,080 --> 00:11:57,360 served time for armed robbery. Saint Clair was brought in 236 00:11:57,399 --> 00:12:00,639 immediately in question. He failed to establish an alibi for 237 00:12:00,679 --> 00:12:02,639 his whereabouts the night of the hold up and murder. 238 00:12:03,399 --> 00:12:06,320 He was arraigned in municipal court and not his preliminary hearing. 239 00:12:06,440 --> 00:12:09,000 The first prosecution witness, the wife of the murdered man, 240 00:12:09,039 --> 00:12:13,679 Agnes Holloway, singled him out as the killer. By experience, 241 00:12:13,720 --> 00:12:17,120 the working detectives found that identifying witnesses under the strain 242 00:12:17,200 --> 00:12:19,600 of being present at a horrible crime can often be 243 00:12:19,639 --> 00:12:23,600 mistaken in their identification. In this instance, there wasn't anything 244 00:12:23,600 --> 00:12:24,200 else we could do. 245 00:12:24,279 --> 00:12:25,120 Speaker 5: It was all we had. 246 00:12:25,919 --> 00:12:29,840 Speaker 4: Eleven eighteen am, the preliminary hearing resumed. The witnesses took 247 00:12:29,879 --> 00:12:32,399 the stand in turn, and all of them tabbed Saint 248 00:12:32,440 --> 00:12:35,480 Clair as the murderer, ed and I testified as the 249 00:12:35,600 --> 00:12:39,279 arresting officers. At three twenty five that afternoon, the prosecution 250 00:12:39,399 --> 00:12:42,440 rested the case for the people. Saint Clair's lawyer offered 251 00:12:42,480 --> 00:12:43,960 no defense for the time being. 252 00:12:47,120 --> 00:12:49,039 Speaker 5: Here, Honor, mister Alexander. 253 00:12:49,399 --> 00:12:51,879 Speaker 8: This time the people moved that case number two three 254 00:12:52,000 --> 00:12:53,879 five two nine be dismissed on the. 255 00:12:53,799 --> 00:12:56,440 Speaker 11: Grounds that it stakes in substance. 256 00:12:56,960 --> 00:13:01,600 Speaker 5: Two three five two nine. Is that correct? Yes, dismissed 257 00:13:01,639 --> 00:13:03,480 on the ground that it states in substance. The offense 258 00:13:03,519 --> 00:13:05,840 covered in the present case two. 259 00:13:05,600 --> 00:13:07,879 Speaker 8: Three five two nine covers the offense of robbery and 260 00:13:07,919 --> 00:13:10,519 assault with intent to commit murder under the present victim 261 00:13:10,559 --> 00:13:12,159 in our case here, Charles Holloway. 262 00:13:12,799 --> 00:13:14,559 Speaker 5: He was not dead at the time this case two 263 00:13:14,600 --> 00:13:16,159 three five two nine was filed. 264 00:13:16,600 --> 00:13:18,799 Speaker 8: Subsequent to its filing, he died and the murder count 265 00:13:18,799 --> 00:13:20,120 accomplished that complaint. 266 00:13:20,679 --> 00:13:22,559 Speaker 9: If the records showed that on the motion of the 267 00:13:22,600 --> 00:13:25,320 District Attorney in the case of People versus Herald Our 268 00:13:25,360 --> 00:13:28,200 Saint Clair number two three five two nine, that case 269 00:13:28,279 --> 00:13:34,200 is dismissed. Bearing to me that the offenses in the 270 00:13:34,240 --> 00:13:37,279 within deposition mentioned a withd COUMP one murder of felony 271 00:13:37,279 --> 00:13:40,120 and count two robbery of felony have been committed, and 272 00:13:40,159 --> 00:13:42,679 that there is sufficient cause to believe the within name 273 00:13:42,799 --> 00:13:46,519 defendant Harold our Saint Clair, guilty thereof. I orderably be 274 00:13:46,559 --> 00:13:49,000 held to answer to the same, leave be committed to 275 00:13:49,039 --> 00:13:51,159 the custody of the Sheriff of Los Angeles County, with 276 00:13:51,200 --> 00:13:52,080 out there. 277 00:13:54,639 --> 00:13:58,159 Speaker 4: In the seventeen days intervening between Saint Clair's preliminary hearing 278 00:13:58,200 --> 00:14:00,919 and his arragement in Superior Court, ed and I, along 279 00:14:00,960 --> 00:14:04,600 with Sergeant Stoner Beeson and Leo Tracy, continued our investigation 280 00:14:04,679 --> 00:14:08,279 of the case. Physical evidence to either prove or disprove 281 00:14:08,360 --> 00:14:10,480 the case against Saint Clair was not to be had. 282 00:14:11,440 --> 00:14:14,200 We concentrated on trying to find the all important missing 283 00:14:14,200 --> 00:14:17,840 witness to the killing, the unidentified sailor. We got out 284 00:14:17,840 --> 00:14:20,799 an APV along with special letters and bulletins for distribution 285 00:14:20,879 --> 00:14:23,960 to local Navy Yard commandants as well as Navy Department 286 00:14:24,000 --> 00:14:28,279 officials in Washington, requesting help in locating him. It went slow. 287 00:14:29,360 --> 00:14:32,360 The day before Saint Clair's Superior Court arrayment, we got 288 00:14:32,399 --> 00:14:35,919 our first lead, but not from where we expected. A 289 00:14:35,960 --> 00:14:39,279 two time robbery loser, Lester Jaffey, who bore a close 290 00:14:39,360 --> 00:14:42,080 resemblance to Saint Clair, was arrested at a check cashing 291 00:14:42,120 --> 00:14:44,840 agency on salth Hoover trying to pass a Ford's check. 292 00:14:45,559 --> 00:14:48,399 He had several prior arrests and convictions for burglary and 293 00:14:48,440 --> 00:14:50,840 ad w and a check of his package showed that 294 00:14:50,840 --> 00:14:52,080 he had violated his parole. 295 00:14:53,080 --> 00:14:53,720 Speaker 10: A thirty eight. 296 00:14:53,679 --> 00:14:56,399 Speaker 4: Caliber S and W revolver found on Jaffy was delivered 297 00:14:56,440 --> 00:15:00,159 to Rust Camp and Ballistics for examination in comparison. The 298 00:15:00,200 --> 00:15:03,039 next day, Monday, March twenty ninth, Saint Clair came up 299 00:15:03,039 --> 00:15:05,799 for his arrenement in Superior Court and and I were. 300 00:15:05,720 --> 00:15:17,720 Speaker 15: There, Saint Clair defend of his present ready or honor 301 00:15:19,159 --> 00:15:19,639 arraigned the. 302 00:15:19,559 --> 00:15:25,000 Speaker 5: Prisoner erld Ire Saint Clair. Is that your true name? 303 00:15:25,399 --> 00:15:26,759 That's right? Harold? 304 00:15:26,759 --> 00:15:29,720 Speaker 8: Are Saint Clair? By information number two three five four nine. 305 00:15:29,759 --> 00:15:32,200 You're charged in COUMP one with a crime of murder 306 00:15:32,320 --> 00:15:34,360 in that honor about March fourth of this year. You 307 00:15:34,399 --> 00:15:37,600 did wilfully, unlawfully and feloniously and with malice of forethought, 308 00:15:38,159 --> 00:15:42,080 murder one Charles A. Holloway, a human being, to this charge. 309 00:15:42,080 --> 00:15:44,399 How do you now plead gilly or not gilly? Not 310 00:15:44,600 --> 00:15:47,679 gilly in count two of the same information. Your charged 311 00:15:47,679 --> 00:15:49,840 with the crime of robbery in that honor about March 312 00:15:49,879 --> 00:15:51,879 fourth of this year, you did rob one Charles A 313 00:15:52,000 --> 00:15:54,399 Holloway to that charge. How do you now plead guilty 314 00:15:54,480 --> 00:15:55,080 or not guilly? 315 00:15:55,279 --> 00:16:02,360 Speaker 5: Not gilly? Joe better? Oh yeah, he's most thing to 316 00:16:02,440 --> 00:16:04,440 a phone call? I guess must be for you. Yeah, 317 00:16:04,519 --> 00:16:11,960 thanks that, gentlemen. Have you agreed on what day is 318 00:16:12,000 --> 00:16:12,840 convenient for trial? 319 00:16:13,440 --> 00:16:16,480 Speaker 8: No agreement is yet, your honor ys a phone call 320 00:16:16,519 --> 00:16:17,559 for you, Sergeant right here? 321 00:16:17,679 --> 00:16:23,679 Speaker 5: Okay, thank you Friday talking? Yeah, is that right? Yeah? 322 00:16:23,759 --> 00:16:28,279 Speaker 4: Okay, Russ soon as we finished here, Yeah, right bye. 323 00:16:29,440 --> 00:16:31,360 Speaker 5: Joe Alex here wants to know about a trial? Did 324 00:16:31,399 --> 00:16:32,559 any ideas well? 325 00:16:32,600 --> 00:16:34,320 Speaker 8: We better get all the time you can, Alex. We're 326 00:16:34,320 --> 00:16:36,279 gonna need it anything you say. What's the matter we 327 00:16:36,320 --> 00:16:38,679 got troubles? Well, just had a call from Russ camp 328 00:16:38,679 --> 00:16:41,720 and ballistics. Yeah, I figure we got a whole new 329 00:16:41,759 --> 00:16:42,360 case to build. 330 00:16:42,360 --> 00:16:44,960 Speaker 4: What do you mean, well, the man we've got, Saint Clair, Yeah, 331 00:16:45,039 --> 00:16:46,879 maybe he's taken the rap for somebody else. 332 00:16:57,399 --> 00:17:01,279 Speaker 3: You are listening to dragnet authentic stories of your police 333 00:17:01,320 --> 00:17:01,960 force and action. 334 00:17:10,480 --> 00:17:14,400 Speaker 4: March twenty ninth, Monday, four fifteen pm, after the arrangement 335 00:17:14,440 --> 00:17:16,839 of Harald Saint Clair in Superior Court at and I 336 00:17:17,000 --> 00:17:20,000 checked with Russ camp and Ballistics. He said he'd run 337 00:17:20,079 --> 00:17:22,440 tests on the thirty eight S and W revolver taken 338 00:17:22,480 --> 00:17:26,960 from robbery forgery suspect Leicster Jaffey the day before. Comparison 339 00:17:27,039 --> 00:17:30,359 microscopic examinations of test bullets fired from the gun taken 340 00:17:30,400 --> 00:17:33,039 from jaffe and the two slugs which had been removed 341 00:17:33,079 --> 00:17:36,880 from the body of tavern owner Charles Holloway maxed. After 342 00:17:36,960 --> 00:17:40,279 checking with Breton at the CII Bureau and Sacramento, we 343 00:17:40,359 --> 00:17:44,319 discovered new additions to Jaffey's long criminal record. We also 344 00:17:44,359 --> 00:17:47,160 found out his known mo corresponded closely to that of 345 00:17:47,160 --> 00:17:50,319 the man who robbed and murdered mister Holloway. At a 346 00:17:50,359 --> 00:17:53,079 special show up of both Saint Clair and Jaffey, the 347 00:17:53,160 --> 00:17:55,720 close resemblance of the two became apparent to the four 348 00:17:55,759 --> 00:18:00,680 identifying witnesses. They frankly admitted their mistake and positive identified 349 00:18:00,759 --> 00:18:04,759 Jaffey as the killer. Intensive investigation during the next three 350 00:18:04,799 --> 00:18:08,839 weeks uncovered enough evidence and testimony against Jaffey by associates 351 00:18:08,839 --> 00:18:11,440 and informers to give us a good foundation for a 352 00:18:11,519 --> 00:18:14,759 murder conviction, but we were still without a lead for 353 00:18:14,920 --> 00:18:19,640 one of our most essential witnesses, the unidentified sailor. The 354 00:18:19,680 --> 00:18:22,519 first suspect, Harold Saint Clair, was cleared of the charge 355 00:18:22,759 --> 00:18:25,480 but detained on a want from the Denver Police Department. 356 00:18:26,480 --> 00:18:29,960 After arrangement and preliminary hearing in municipal Court, the arraignment 357 00:18:30,000 --> 00:18:33,000 and Superior Court Lester Jaffey went on trial for the 358 00:18:33,039 --> 00:18:37,119 Holloway killing on June second. Doctor West, the autopsy surgeon, 359 00:18:37,200 --> 00:18:40,359 was first to be called by Assistant District Attorney Adolph Alexander. 360 00:18:41,039 --> 00:18:43,720 He stated the results of the autopsy on mister Holloway 361 00:18:44,039 --> 00:18:47,240 and testified as to the cause of death. John Mayer, 362 00:18:47,319 --> 00:18:50,119 the police surveyor, was next. He produced the various diagrammatic 363 00:18:50,200 --> 00:18:52,759 drawings of the murder scene. The third day of the trial, 364 00:18:52,960 --> 00:18:54,000 June fifth. 365 00:18:55,400 --> 00:19:00,799 Speaker 5: Garber Woman's com back on frenomous Holloway. Oh yeah, missus, 366 00:19:00,799 --> 00:19:14,799 Samuel Garber be seated. I'll see you to cross examination, 367 00:19:16,160 --> 00:19:16,880 Missus Garber. 368 00:19:16,920 --> 00:19:19,640 Speaker 12: At the time you testified against the former suspect, Carrol 369 00:19:19,720 --> 00:19:21,839 Saint Clair, you were just as positive then. 370 00:19:21,759 --> 00:19:22,319 Speaker 5: Were you or not? 371 00:19:22,839 --> 00:19:25,200 Speaker 12: If the whole up man who killed mister Holloway, was 372 00:19:25,279 --> 00:19:26,400 Harold Saint Clair. 373 00:19:26,519 --> 00:19:28,319 Speaker 11: Yes, I was, But I also say he didn't have 374 00:19:28,319 --> 00:19:29,000 the Saint type. 375 00:19:29,000 --> 00:19:32,240 Speaker 12: I you were absolutely sure about Harold Saint Clair, then, 376 00:19:32,279 --> 00:19:32,640 weren't you. 377 00:19:32,960 --> 00:19:34,000 Speaker 11: Yes, I guess I was. 378 00:19:34,400 --> 00:19:37,039 Speaker 12: And you identified Saint Clair and testified a number of 379 00:19:37,079 --> 00:19:39,640 times during that examination that Saint Clair was the. 380 00:19:39,599 --> 00:19:40,279 Speaker 5: Man's that right? 381 00:19:40,519 --> 00:19:41,680 Speaker 11: I said he resembled to me. 382 00:19:41,839 --> 00:19:43,319 Speaker 5: You said he was the man, didn't you. 383 00:19:43,480 --> 00:19:44,880 Speaker 11: I said, I thought he resembled to me. 384 00:19:45,039 --> 00:19:46,960 Speaker 12: You also said there was no doubt of it. Didn't 385 00:19:46,960 --> 00:19:49,400 you that the hold up man was mister Saint Clair. 386 00:19:50,400 --> 00:19:52,279 Speaker 11: Well, I guess, so, I don't know. 387 00:19:52,440 --> 00:19:54,640 Speaker 5: You don't know, No, I guess I don't. 388 00:19:54,640 --> 00:19:56,160 Speaker 11: I don't remember. I'm not sure. 389 00:19:57,079 --> 00:19:59,480 Speaker 12: Missus Garber, you sure you remember the man you saw 390 00:19:59,559 --> 00:20:00,880 sitting in bar that night? 391 00:20:01,319 --> 00:20:04,319 Speaker 6: Well, I don't know. I guess. 392 00:20:04,359 --> 00:20:05,039 Speaker 11: I'm not sure. 393 00:20:09,240 --> 00:20:12,240 Speaker 4: During the next two days, the other three identifying witnesses 394 00:20:12,279 --> 00:20:15,759 were called to testify, and, like Missus Garber, were badgered 395 00:20:15,799 --> 00:20:19,519 by the defense attorney unmercifully. Despite the efforts of Alexander, 396 00:20:19,559 --> 00:20:22,799 the prosecuting attorney, it was apparent the jury was being 397 00:20:22,799 --> 00:20:26,000 swayed heavily in favor of the defendant. Even the full 398 00:20:26,079 --> 00:20:28,119 day and a half ray Pinker from the crime lab 399 00:20:28,200 --> 00:20:30,559 spent on the stand seemed to have little effect in 400 00:20:30,599 --> 00:20:34,720 counteracting the damage done by the confused testimony. To prepare 401 00:20:34,759 --> 00:20:37,440 the jury for russ Camp's expert report and for the 402 00:20:37,480 --> 00:20:40,279 presentation of scientific facts about the lethal bullets and the 403 00:20:40,359 --> 00:20:42,839 murder gun found on Jaffy at the time of his arrest, 404 00:20:43,359 --> 00:20:46,480 Pinker and Assistant District Attorney Alexander gave the jury a 405 00:20:46,559 --> 00:20:50,319 thorough briefing on the fundamentals of ballistics. They also pointed 406 00:20:50,359 --> 00:20:53,160 out the scientific value of ballistics in determining the guilt 407 00:20:53,200 --> 00:20:56,759 or innocence of a defendant. On Thursday, June twelfth, russ 408 00:20:56,759 --> 00:20:59,720 Camp took the stand as a prosecution witness, and, under questioning, 409 00:21:00,160 --> 00:21:02,720 presented the findings of the various tests he'd run on 410 00:21:02,799 --> 00:21:03,880 the alleged murder weapon. 411 00:21:06,920 --> 00:21:09,319 Speaker 8: Just a Camp, some time after you had obtained People's 412 00:21:09,319 --> 00:21:12,000 Exhibit thirteen, did you fire a test bullet or several 413 00:21:12,039 --> 00:21:14,039 test bullets from it from the crime laboratory? 414 00:21:14,240 --> 00:21:14,559 Speaker 2: I did. 415 00:21:15,000 --> 00:21:16,960 Speaker 8: Did you make a comparison of any of those test 416 00:21:16,960 --> 00:21:18,400 bullets with Exhibits three and. 417 00:21:18,400 --> 00:21:20,799 Speaker 5: Three as the bullets which killed Charles Holloway? 418 00:21:20,920 --> 00:21:25,160 Speaker 8: I did. Now, in making your comparison and examination under 419 00:21:25,160 --> 00:21:27,839 the microscope, after you had completed the mechanical part of 420 00:21:27,880 --> 00:21:30,799 your work, and after you'd completed your examination of the 421 00:21:30,839 --> 00:21:33,880 observable and comparable sections of the fatal bullets with a 422 00:21:33,880 --> 00:21:37,519 test bullet fired from People's Exhibit thirteen, did you come 423 00:21:37,519 --> 00:21:39,160 to any conclusion with respect to the. 424 00:21:39,079 --> 00:21:42,599 Speaker 5: Holloway fatal bullets? Yes, I did, and what was that conclusion? 425 00:21:43,079 --> 00:21:44,160 The conclusion was. 426 00:21:44,039 --> 00:21:46,960 Speaker 12: That the fatal bullets, the Halloway fatal bullets People's Exhibit 427 00:21:47,039 --> 00:21:50,000 number three and three eight, were fire to the barrel. 428 00:21:49,759 --> 00:21:51,319 Speaker 5: Of People's Exhibit number thirteen. 429 00:21:55,039 --> 00:21:58,160 Speaker 4: After another hour of testifying, russ Camp left the stand. 430 00:21:58,720 --> 00:22:01,319 His ballistics report on the gun had made an impression 431 00:22:01,359 --> 00:22:02,920 on the jury, but we couldn't be sure it was 432 00:22:03,039 --> 00:22:05,720 enough to balance the set back the prosecution received from 433 00:22:05,759 --> 00:22:08,720 its own witnesses. As far as we were concerned, Jaffy 434 00:22:08,839 --> 00:22:10,960 was the guilty man, there wasn't a doubt about it, 435 00:22:11,279 --> 00:22:13,799 but the case against him was apparently inconclusive as far 436 00:22:13,839 --> 00:22:17,240 as the jury was concerned. The defense attorney obviously had 437 00:22:17,279 --> 00:22:19,960 heard about the unidentified sailor who was also present at 438 00:22:19,960 --> 00:22:20,440 the scene. 439 00:22:20,279 --> 00:22:20,799 Speaker 5: Of the killing. 440 00:22:21,400 --> 00:22:24,119 Speaker 4: He charged outright in the court that the district Attorney 441 00:22:24,200 --> 00:22:26,960 was purposely preventing the appearance of the unknown sailor as 442 00:22:26,960 --> 00:22:29,960 a witness and was concealing his identity as. 443 00:22:29,839 --> 00:22:30,720 Speaker 5: He told the jury. 444 00:22:30,839 --> 00:22:33,680 Speaker 4: The prosecution was afraid that the testimony of their alleged 445 00:22:33,759 --> 00:22:38,279 silent witness would damage its case. Meantime, our intensive search 446 00:22:38,319 --> 00:22:41,359 for the missing seaman was still under way. Despite half 447 00:22:41,400 --> 00:22:44,559 a dozen favorable prosecution witnesses, the case for the people 448 00:22:44,599 --> 00:22:46,680 appeared to be on the losing end going into the 449 00:22:46,680 --> 00:22:50,519 closing days of the trial. Tuesday, June seventeenth, one of 450 00:22:50,519 --> 00:22:53,400 the final defense witnesses was a missus Albert Dolan, who 451 00:22:53,440 --> 00:22:56,279 presented a fair alibi for Jaffy. She claimed Jaffy was 452 00:22:56,319 --> 00:22:58,359 at night school at the time of the Holloway killing. 453 00:22:59,119 --> 00:23:00,839 Speaker 12: Would you say of your own knowledge that on the 454 00:23:00,920 --> 00:23:03,119 night of March the fourth, mister Jaffie was at the 455 00:23:03,119 --> 00:23:05,079 school until midnight, Yes, he was. 456 00:23:05,720 --> 00:23:07,680 Speaker 5: When you left the school, did you go home alone 457 00:23:07,759 --> 00:23:08,480 or with somebody? 458 00:23:08,799 --> 00:23:10,880 Speaker 11: My husband and I grove home with mister Jaffies. 459 00:23:11,039 --> 00:23:15,279 Speaker 16: Anything else that you can remember? Let me think you 460 00:23:15,279 --> 00:23:17,680 sure read a convincing story. Uh, yeah, I wonder what 461 00:23:17,720 --> 00:23:20,440 the connection is? I No, you sure got plenty of them. 462 00:23:21,000 --> 00:23:22,559 What he figured Joe the jury. Do you think we 463 00:23:22,640 --> 00:23:23,119 got a chance? 464 00:23:24,039 --> 00:23:26,720 Speaker 5: I don't know, don't bet on it, Ed, Joe, Oh high, 465 00:23:27,039 --> 00:23:30,160 Hi gone bed. Couldn't be a lot better. It's getting 466 00:23:30,200 --> 00:23:33,359 that way. Just got a call from womanton O. It's squadron. 467 00:23:33,440 --> 00:23:35,880 Speaker 8: Oh what about say that we've been looking for We 468 00:23:36,000 --> 00:23:39,519 found him. 469 00:23:39,519 --> 00:23:41,799 Speaker 4: Before we left the courtroom, Ed and I briefed the 470 00:23:41,839 --> 00:23:45,440 Assistant District Attorney Alexander on the latest development. He put 471 00:23:45,440 --> 00:23:47,480 in a special order to the County jail for Harald 472 00:23:47,480 --> 00:23:50,000 Saint Clair. Ed and I went across the street and 473 00:23:50,039 --> 00:23:53,480 met with a long missing murder witness in the homicide squadroom. 474 00:23:53,519 --> 00:23:56,799 The sailor identified himself as Seamen first Class Roy Maslin. 475 00:23:57,319 --> 00:23:59,519 He told us that about three and a half weeks before, 476 00:23:59,839 --> 00:24:01,720 he'd happened to see a copy of the bullet and 477 00:24:01,759 --> 00:24:03,960 we'd gotten out on him. He checked with his commanding 478 00:24:04,000 --> 00:24:06,160 officer and was returned to the mainland from his post 479 00:24:06,160 --> 00:24:07,039 on Midway Island. 480 00:24:08,000 --> 00:24:09,079 Speaker 5: Three twenty two pm. 481 00:24:09,279 --> 00:24:11,759 Speaker 4: We returned to the courtroom along with Seamen first Class 482 00:24:11,799 --> 00:24:15,680 Roy Maslin and conferred with Assistant District Attorney Alexander. The 483 00:24:15,720 --> 00:24:19,200 first murder suspect Harold Saint Clair had already been brought 484 00:24:19,240 --> 00:24:22,599 downstairs to the courtroom from the county jail. He was 485 00:24:22,599 --> 00:24:25,240 placed at the opposite of the council table from the defendant, 486 00:24:25,599 --> 00:24:26,400 Lester Jaffey. 487 00:24:29,920 --> 00:24:36,880 Speaker 8: May we approach the bench, you're honor, Come forward, your honor. 488 00:24:36,960 --> 00:24:39,400 We've just now located a witness in this case. He's 489 00:24:39,440 --> 00:24:42,240 in the Armed services and must report back for duty tonight. 490 00:24:42,599 --> 00:24:44,799 May we have permission to call this witness out of turn? 491 00:24:44,920 --> 00:24:48,759 Speaker 5: Permission drafted? All right, let's. 492 00:24:52,000 --> 00:24:56,000 Speaker 10: Crazier right hand. Were you solemnly swear that the testimony 493 00:24:56,079 --> 00:24:58,000 are about to give him? The matter not pending before 494 00:24:58,039 --> 00:25:00,359 this court will beat the crew the whole truth of 495 00:25:00,440 --> 00:25:02,680 nothing but the truth, so helped of God. I do 496 00:25:03,000 --> 00:25:03,839 beg your name. 497 00:25:03,680 --> 00:25:06,920 Speaker 6: Please, Seeman first Class Roy Mason Night states name be seated. 498 00:25:13,920 --> 00:25:16,400 Speaker 8: Are you acquainted with a tavern cafe at twenty three 499 00:25:16,519 --> 00:25:18,440 or one Naylor Avenue, Yes I am. 500 00:25:18,839 --> 00:25:20,960 Speaker 5: Were you there on the evening of March fourth of 501 00:25:21,000 --> 00:25:21,480 this year? 502 00:25:21,839 --> 00:25:23,599 Speaker 11: Yes, I joed a few minutes before midnight. 503 00:25:23,720 --> 00:25:25,519 Speaker 8: Will you tell the court in your own words what 504 00:25:25,640 --> 00:25:27,079 happened on the premises that night? 505 00:25:28,200 --> 00:25:30,680 Speaker 7: Well, it's just a couple of mystery before midnight people 506 00:25:30,680 --> 00:25:31,319 who ran a place. 507 00:25:31,319 --> 00:25:32,279 Speaker 11: They said they were closing up. 508 00:25:32,319 --> 00:25:34,599 Speaker 5: So at a nightcap shot dice for the drinks of 509 00:25:34,640 --> 00:25:37,000 the sky next to me. I went, who was this man? 510 00:25:37,319 --> 00:25:39,480 I didn't know who it was. After you had your drinks, 511 00:25:39,519 --> 00:25:42,240 did you leave the bar? Yes? I did? Heah, the 512 00:25:42,240 --> 00:25:42,920 guy's stayed there. 513 00:25:43,680 --> 00:25:45,640 Speaker 12: I went out to the sidewalk and stood there talking 514 00:25:45,640 --> 00:25:46,960 with one of the gals I saw in the barn 515 00:25:47,000 --> 00:25:48,680 and heard a couple of shots fired on. 516 00:25:48,759 --> 00:25:50,720 Speaker 11: The inside of joint to scream and hollered or something. 517 00:25:51,039 --> 00:25:52,480 Speaker 8: Just going through the door to get inside of this 518 00:25:52,559 --> 00:25:55,240 man thing rush now hit me square on went down. 519 00:25:55,920 --> 00:25:57,720 Speaker 5: I remember of seeing him run down the street, saying God, 520 00:25:57,759 --> 00:25:58,400 I was thinking. 521 00:25:58,200 --> 00:26:01,680 Speaker 8: Of would you recognize this man if you said again, yes, sir, 522 00:26:02,319 --> 00:26:06,519 that man in this courtroom now, yes, your honor, please 523 00:26:06,559 --> 00:26:09,319 direct the defendant to stand alongside of mister Saint Clair, 524 00:26:09,400 --> 00:26:10,720 so that this witness. 525 00:26:10,319 --> 00:26:13,240 Speaker 7: May properly identify the man involved. Mister Jeff will you 526 00:26:13,279 --> 00:26:20,039 stand up, please stand to the right of Mtchison Claire. 527 00:26:21,640 --> 00:26:23,960 Will you step down from the stand please, mister Maslin 528 00:26:24,000 --> 00:26:25,640 and place your hand on the shoulder of the man 529 00:26:25,680 --> 00:26:27,039 who was in the bar with the other night. 530 00:26:26,960 --> 00:26:37,960 Speaker 5: Of March fourth. Yes, this is the man. 531 00:26:37,920 --> 00:26:49,279 Speaker 6: Jeffie fast Work soon really burned up. I guess he'd 532 00:26:49,279 --> 00:26:49,759 like to kill me. 533 00:26:50,400 --> 00:26:53,000 Speaker 5: You're not the only one, son. What way will they 534 00:26:53,000 --> 00:26:53,880 read him? The verdict? 535 00:26:54,839 --> 00:27:04,839 Speaker 2: Uh, the story you have just heard was true. The 536 00:27:04,960 --> 00:27:06,880 names were changed to protect the innocent. 537 00:27:07,440 --> 00:27:10,519 Speaker 3: On June twenty first, the jury retired to deliberate the 538 00:27:10,599 --> 00:27:22,599 case in a moment. The results of that deliberation, Lester 539 00:27:22,720 --> 00:27:25,640 Carl Chaffey was found guilty of murder in the first degree. 540 00:27:25,880 --> 00:27:28,200 He was executed in the lethal gas chamber at the 541 00:27:28,200 --> 00:27:33,839 State Penitentiary San Quentin, California. Exchange Clubs sponsor Crime Prevention 542 00:27:33,960 --> 00:27:36,480 Week to remind you that the fight against crime is 543 00:27:36,519 --> 00:27:49,640 your fight the year round. You have just heard Dragnet, 544 00:27:49,839 --> 00:27:53,799 a series of authentic cases from official files. Technical advice 545 00:27:53,880 --> 00:27:56,400 comes from the Office of Chief of Police W. H. Parker, 546 00:27:56,480 --> 00:28:00,440 Los Angeles Police Department. Heard Tonight where Barney Philip Big 547 00:28:00,480 --> 00:28:04,440 Pair and then Virginia Gregg. Script by Jim Mosic, music 548 00:28:04,480 --> 00:28:07,200 by Walter Schumann. Hell, give me speaking. 549 00:28:17,200 --> 00:28:20,279 Speaker 4: Next, It's David Harding and Counterspy on NBC. 550 00:28:27,640 --> 00:28:34,599 Speaker 1: Welcome Back. Well a very interesting episode and it does 551 00:28:34,680 --> 00:28:37,640 a good job at what it's supposed to do. Now. 552 00:28:37,680 --> 00:28:39,839 I know that there are people who will listen to 553 00:28:39,880 --> 00:28:45,240 this and see all of the instances where in terms 554 00:28:45,240 --> 00:28:50,880 of modern court procedure and modern police procedure, this looks 555 00:28:51,519 --> 00:28:55,440 a bit rough. Friday acted like it was a bit 556 00:28:55,480 --> 00:28:59,359 of a surprise that the defense attorney knew about the 557 00:28:59,400 --> 00:29:05,519 existence of the sailor. But in today's world, in a prosecution, 558 00:29:06,680 --> 00:29:09,599 this sort of information would be required to be given 559 00:29:09,640 --> 00:29:13,799 to the defense attorney as part of discovery. And of 560 00:29:13,839 --> 00:29:17,279 course the whole identification at the end in the courtroom 561 00:29:17,519 --> 00:29:23,200 was probably really prejudicial because you had the judge identifying 562 00:29:23,279 --> 00:29:30,680 which of the two men was the defendant, and the 563 00:29:30,720 --> 00:29:34,720 witness choosing between those two men coming right up to 564 00:29:35,680 --> 00:29:39,680 them in order to make the decision. But this wasn't 565 00:29:39,839 --> 00:29:45,920 meant to capture the way that law worked seventy years 566 00:29:45,960 --> 00:29:48,599 in the future. I mean, how would you even do that. 567 00:29:48,839 --> 00:29:52,880 This was meant to capture the realism of how courtroom 568 00:29:53,000 --> 00:29:59,079 procedures worked back in nineteen fifty two, and it does 569 00:29:59,119 --> 00:30:02,000 a good job with that. The one thing that really 570 00:30:02,039 --> 00:30:07,440 stands out is they used an effect to make the 571 00:30:07,480 --> 00:30:12,319 sound of a microphone that a witness might be speaking 572 00:30:12,359 --> 00:30:16,720 into or to capture the acoustics of the courtroom. It's 573 00:30:16,880 --> 00:30:22,319 interesting to hear, even as someone who doesn't regularly watch 574 00:30:22,400 --> 00:30:25,240 courtroom proceedings. But I have a little bit of an 575 00:30:25,319 --> 00:30:29,880 understanding of the law from my paralegal training days. Now 576 00:30:30,000 --> 00:30:34,759 it's just seeing how things evolved, and they were a 577 00:30:34,799 --> 00:30:39,759 lot more raw and less established in terms of the 578 00:30:39,799 --> 00:30:44,799 way that certain procedures were handled as well as the 579 00:30:45,559 --> 00:30:49,720 constitutional application. And it wasn't just the prosecutor. I mean, 580 00:30:49,759 --> 00:30:55,440 you had the defense attorney standing up and accusing the 581 00:30:55,480 --> 00:31:03,200 prosecutor of hiding an exculpatory witness. Today defense attorney can't 582 00:31:03,279 --> 00:31:06,279 just decide, you know, I think I'm going to accuse 583 00:31:06,440 --> 00:31:12,960 the prosecutor hot of hiding an exculpatory witness, because why not. 584 00:31:13,279 --> 00:31:17,400 Why wouldn't I do that? So this episode's an interesting 585 00:31:17,519 --> 00:31:20,640 window and to the way things were and went to 586 00:31:20,759 --> 00:31:23,720 some effort to go ahead and recreate that. We have 587 00:31:23,839 --> 00:31:27,119 a couple of comments regarding the Big Sorrow. First we 588 00:31:27,240 --> 00:31:31,759 go over to Spotify, where Karen rights this episode was 589 00:31:31,799 --> 00:31:34,519 such a lovely tribute to yar Bow and I appreciate 590 00:31:34,559 --> 00:31:37,119 your preempting of the cigarette ad. At the end, I 591 00:31:37,160 --> 00:31:40,759 recall listening to this episode before and feeling like that 592 00:31:41,000 --> 00:31:44,000 ad landed like a lead balloon after all that had 593 00:31:44,000 --> 00:31:46,920 come before it. Thank you for your show and commentary, Adam, 594 00:31:47,119 --> 00:31:50,680 I enjoy listening. Thanks Karen. To be fair, I do 595 00:31:50,839 --> 00:31:55,920 actually usually remove cigarette ads regardless, I do think it 596 00:31:56,400 --> 00:32:01,039 is tricky to have ads on an episode like this. 597 00:32:01,279 --> 00:32:05,039 It just it does tend to be the default. Now. 598 00:32:05,200 --> 00:32:09,960 There are certain times in old time radio programs where 599 00:32:10,000 --> 00:32:14,119 people will figure it's time to just go ahead and 600 00:32:14,200 --> 00:32:19,559 skip the ads, either the star or the host. Most 601 00:32:19,559 --> 00:32:23,400 of the Ben Crosby Christmas programs, I've heard the sponsor 602 00:32:24,240 --> 00:32:30,920 has actually gone ahead and deferred their commercial messages, and 603 00:32:30,960 --> 00:32:35,359 you'll have some occasions where sponsor realized that maybe not 604 00:32:35,440 --> 00:32:40,119 a good time to do live ads. I can see 605 00:32:40,160 --> 00:32:44,759 how the death of an actor would not be viewed 606 00:32:44,799 --> 00:32:49,079 as that sort of occasion by the sponsor. As I said, 607 00:32:49,160 --> 00:32:53,519 the sort of program that Web did you didn't hear 608 00:32:53,759 --> 00:32:57,720 or see quite a bit of. Although I've encountered quite 609 00:32:57,720 --> 00:33:02,160 a few episodes of programs that will pay tribute to 610 00:33:02,240 --> 00:33:06,279 an actor that died, it just was not the norm. 611 00:33:06,640 --> 00:33:14,279 In nineteen fifty one, over on YouTube, the m DG comments, 612 00:33:14,319 --> 00:33:17,000 I could feel their love for Romero and their genuine 613 00:33:17,039 --> 00:33:21,240 sadness relatable and moving. And then finally we have a 614 00:33:21,359 --> 00:33:27,200 comment from our listener survey over at Blueberry listener Rights. 615 00:33:28,079 --> 00:33:31,559 I love the introduction to the episodes and especially the 616 00:33:31,599 --> 00:33:35,880 old time episodes themselves, and that one comes from Eric. 617 00:33:36,039 --> 00:33:38,759 Thanks so much, Eric, appreciate you taking the time to 618 00:33:38,799 --> 00:33:42,359 fill out our listener survey. Well, now it's time to 619 00:33:42,400 --> 00:33:46,640 thank our Patreon supporter of the day. Thank you to Renee, 620 00:33:46,839 --> 00:33:52,160 Patreon supporter since December, currently supporting the podcast at the 621 00:33:52,200 --> 00:33:55,759 Detective Sergeant level of seven dollars and fourteen cents or 622 00:33:55,759 --> 00:33:58,839 more per month. Thanks so much for your support, Renee, 623 00:33:58,880 --> 00:34:02,160 and that will do it for If you're enjoying the podcast, 624 00:34:02,200 --> 00:34:07,359 please follow us using your favorite podcast software and be 625 00:34:07,440 --> 00:34:10,360 sure to rate and review the podcast wherever you download 626 00:34:10,400 --> 00:34:14,519 it from. We will be back next Thursday with another 627 00:34:14,559 --> 00:34:18,400 episode of Dragnet, but join us back here tomorrow for 628 00:34:18,599 --> 00:34:22,639 yours truly. Johnny d all Or where Thomas Thomas? Yeah, 629 00:34:22,639 --> 00:34:23,360 that's right, Ken. 630 00:34:23,400 --> 00:34:24,599 Speaker 2: What can you tell me about him? 631 00:34:24,679 --> 00:34:27,400 Speaker 14: Well, not everybody knew it, Johnny, but day he was 632 00:34:27,440 --> 00:34:29,920 a mouthpiece for the old Maretti mob That was some 633 00:34:30,079 --> 00:34:33,960 years ago when they started the big cleanup. Well, either 634 00:34:34,039 --> 00:34:36,639 Thomas couldn't or just playing wouldn't get him off the hook. 635 00:34:37,000 --> 00:34:39,679 Let him all go to jail and he settled down, 636 00:34:39,880 --> 00:34:41,639 retired in his home out Nillhurst. 637 00:34:41,679 --> 00:34:44,480 Speaker 2: Well he's certainly not there now, ken No, about a. 638 00:34:44,519 --> 00:34:47,400 Speaker 14: Year ago he suddenly sold his plays, packed up, moved 639 00:34:47,400 --> 00:34:48,280 out with somewhere. 640 00:34:48,360 --> 00:34:51,360 Speaker 5: Why you know, change of climate. 641 00:34:51,400 --> 00:34:53,079 Speaker 1: I guess what about him. 642 00:34:53,000 --> 00:34:55,480 Speaker 2: Johnny Ever hear at Charlie one way. 643 00:34:56,480 --> 00:34:59,079 Speaker 14: You getting he was one of Already's trigger. 644 00:34:58,840 --> 00:35:00,920 Speaker 5: Men, Arlie they called him. 645 00:35:01,079 --> 00:35:03,519 Speaker 8: You know where he is now? 646 00:35:03,880 --> 00:35:06,199 Speaker 14: Oh, they sent him up to Joliet Prison along with 647 00:35:06,239 --> 00:35:08,199 the rest of them. Off those boys are being the 648 00:35:08,239 --> 00:35:08,639 twink the. 649 00:35:08,639 --> 00:35:09,440 Speaker 1: Rest of that metric. 650 00:35:10,039 --> 00:35:13,880 Speaker 14: Oh wait a minute, Yeah, Casual Charlie and Snooty Wilson 651 00:35:13,880 --> 00:35:14,599 were released. 652 00:35:15,280 --> 00:35:18,440 Speaker 6: Yeah, and hey, that was. 653 00:35:18,440 --> 00:35:20,920 Speaker 14: Just about the same time that Thomas moved away from here. 654 00:35:21,320 --> 00:35:23,480 Speaker 8: If that means anything, maybe I got a hunch it 655 00:35:23,559 --> 00:35:24,360 means everything. 656 00:35:24,599 --> 00:35:27,079 Speaker 1: Hope you'll be with us then in the meantime. Send 657 00:35:27,119 --> 00:35:31,360 your comments to Box thirteen at Great Detectives dot yet, 658 00:35:32,000 --> 00:35:35,599 follow us on Twitter at Radio Detectives, and check us 659 00:35:35,639 --> 00:35:42,079 out on Instagram, Instagram, dot com, slash Great detectives from Boise, Idaho. 660 00:35:42,400 --> 00:35:44,280 This is your host, Adam Graham. 661 00:35:44,400 --> 00:35:44,960 Speaker 5: Sign and all