WEBVTT 1 00:00:00.280 --> 00:00:01.639 Welcome to the nonprofits. 2 00:00:01.919 --> 00:00:04.759 Well, it turns out that Texans aren't the only ones 3 00:00:04.799 --> 00:00:07.160 stirring up trouble. This week, in our third segment, we 4 00:00:07.200 --> 00:00:10.119 look at how federal agents are sharing in the atrocities. 5 00:00:10.400 --> 00:00:13.640 Attorneys from the National Immigrant Justice Center and the ACLU 6 00:00:13.679 --> 00:00:18.320 of Illinois have accused federal immigration authorities of unlawful arrests 7 00:00:18.359 --> 00:00:22.079 and constitutional violations in at least twenty two cases since 8 00:00:22.120 --> 00:00:26.120 the current administration's immigration crackdown began. The motion filed in 9 00:00:26.199 --> 00:00:30.480 Chicago alleges that ICE agents arrested individuals without probable cause, 10 00:00:30.800 --> 00:00:35.200 created warrants after detaining people, and violated the NAVA Settlement 11 00:00:35.240 --> 00:00:39.759 to twenty eighteen agreement meant to prevent warrantless arrests. Cases 12 00:00:39.759 --> 00:00:44.280 include a US citizen wrongly detained and workers arrested without warrants. 13 00:00:44.560 --> 00:00:47.880 Lawyers argue these actions breach federal law and the Fourth Amendment. 14 00:00:48.039 --> 00:00:51.359 ICE declined to comment the stories from the Chicago Sun 15 00:00:51.399 --> 00:00:57.439 Times by Adriana Cardona Maguidad on March fourteenth, twenty twenty five. 16 00:00:57.880 --> 00:00:59.840 So we'll start off by going to Jimmy here, Jimmy 17 00:00:59.840 --> 00:01:02.439 car and you give us some specifics on some of 18 00:01:02.439 --> 00:01:05.640 the individuals that have been affected by these improper arrests. 19 00:01:06.200 --> 00:01:10.560 Well, sure, now at this point have heard everybody should 20 00:01:10.560 --> 00:01:13.400 have heard, if you're paying attention, that American citizens are 21 00:01:13.439 --> 00:01:16.120 just being rounded up. People with permission to be in 22 00:01:16.120 --> 00:01:19.239 this country are being rounded up and being targeted to 23 00:01:19.319 --> 00:01:23.040 have their protected status if they're not yet citizens removed, 24 00:01:23.159 --> 00:01:28.120 if they're political prisoners. For example, the four hundred thousand 25 00:01:28.560 --> 00:01:33.519 Venezuelans that are being considered or a move that is 26 00:01:33.560 --> 00:01:37.000 now being blocked by one judge, but being considered to 27 00:01:37.040 --> 00:01:41.239 have their protected status removed. Abel Erosco or Tega, detained 28 00:01:41.239 --> 00:01:46.439 outside his home in suburban Lions in Chicago without a warrant. 29 00:01:46.959 --> 00:01:50.040 He was buying Tomali's. Well, that guy must be a criminal, 30 00:01:50.120 --> 00:01:54.879 right of course, of course, yeah, yeah, And then we've 31 00:01:54.879 --> 00:01:57.959 got I'm going to butcher this even though I've heard 32 00:01:57.959 --> 00:02:03.760 it before. Rumesak, the thirty year old Boston area graduate 33 00:02:03.760 --> 00:02:09.560 student who was arrested and detained, who really did nothing wrong. 34 00:02:09.680 --> 00:02:13.800 She wrote an op ed about the Palestinian conflict and 35 00:02:13.840 --> 00:02:16.840 in a pro Palestinian form, and of course she was 36 00:02:17.919 --> 00:02:22.439 detained by masked men who were unidentified. And then in Liberty, Missouri, 37 00:02:22.560 --> 00:02:28.039 twelve restaurant workers barricaded inside a Mexican restaurant. Well, they're 38 00:02:28.080 --> 00:02:31.039 restaurant workers in a Mexican restaurant. They must be illegal 39 00:02:31.199 --> 00:02:34.080 and they must be criminals, right, but they were. They 40 00:02:34.080 --> 00:02:39.280 were closed in by the Department of Homeland Security, who 41 00:02:39.360 --> 00:02:41.879 arrested them without a warrant. And so, you know, I 42 00:02:41.919 --> 00:02:44.960 think this is just the beginning. We're at risk and 43 00:02:45.199 --> 00:02:48.000 I am I am going to use some really harsh language, 44 00:02:48.000 --> 00:02:51.000 but I like to think in terms of extremes, because 45 00:02:51.000 --> 00:02:53.599 if we don't, you know, then we let those extremes happen. 46 00:02:53.840 --> 00:02:57.280 And it's because we didn't take it seriously enough. But 47 00:02:57.520 --> 00:03:00.960 you know, we could be facing a major genosid right 48 00:03:01.000 --> 00:03:04.520 here in the United States against light skinned brown people. 49 00:03:05.560 --> 00:03:07.840 And if those of us with a voice don't stand 50 00:03:07.960 --> 00:03:12.000 up and recognize this wrongdoing, we certainly could be enablers. 51 00:03:12.599 --> 00:03:14.000 And so that's what I have to say on that. 52 00:03:14.240 --> 00:03:19.879 Definitely, I saw the video of the Ramesa Osterk getting abducted. 53 00:03:20.360 --> 00:03:23.120 It was very disturbing and it was I'm sure it 54 00:03:23.159 --> 00:03:26.680 was an extremely traumatic experience. Even you know, even if 55 00:03:26.680 --> 00:03:29.199 they end up letting her go or whatever, it was, 56 00:03:29.400 --> 00:03:32.560 just that experience alone can cause long term trauma and 57 00:03:32.560 --> 00:03:34.000 it's very, very disturbing. 58 00:03:34.719 --> 00:03:37.560 I failed to mention, you know, when we were writing 59 00:03:37.639 --> 00:03:41.280 the script for this show, I didn't add the story 60 00:03:41.319 --> 00:03:44.080 that came out yesterday about the l Salvadorian man who 61 00:03:44.439 --> 00:03:47.520 was an American. He was here legally. I don't believe 62 00:03:47.560 --> 00:03:49.360 he was an American citizen yet. Oh no, he was 63 00:03:49.400 --> 00:03:52.400 an American citizen, but he was deported to El Salvador 64 00:03:52.520 --> 00:03:54.840 and put in one of the most one of the 65 00:03:54.879 --> 00:03:57.879 worst prisons that you could be in. And he was 66 00:03:57.919 --> 00:04:01.520 here on political asylum initially because he was in danger 67 00:04:01.560 --> 00:04:04.599 at El Salvador. I mean, and I hear that there's 68 00:04:04.639 --> 00:04:06.680 being there's no attempt at trying to get him back, 69 00:04:06.719 --> 00:04:07.879 which is a shady. 70 00:04:07.680 --> 00:04:10.080 Is Is he the one that had that already had 71 00:04:10.120 --> 00:04:13.479 a judge's order specifically forbidding that he'd be deported. 72 00:04:13.639 --> 00:04:17.800 Yes, yes, so I think I'm wrong on the citizen part. 73 00:04:17.839 --> 00:04:23.199 But uh, you know, nonetheless came here for protected underprotected status. 74 00:04:22.680 --> 00:04:28.279 Right you come You're fleeing a dangerous situation, and you know, 75 00:04:28.319 --> 00:04:32.639 you hear these stories about America, Land of the Free 76 00:04:32.680 --> 00:04:34.600 and home of the brave, and then you get here 77 00:04:34.680 --> 00:04:37.240 and then you're kicked out, even though you were here 78 00:04:37.439 --> 00:04:39.839 even though you did go through all the proper channels 79 00:04:39.879 --> 00:04:42.879 and everything. It's not it's it's it's frustrating. 80 00:04:42.920 --> 00:04:45.519 Helen. Could you expand on that idea a little bit. 81 00:04:45.639 --> 00:04:48.000 Are these arrests are they're illegal? 82 00:04:48.120 --> 00:04:48.279 Right? 83 00:04:48.519 --> 00:04:52.120 Is this is an illegal thing happening? If so, how so? 84 00:04:53.800 --> 00:04:56.759 Because you're even if you're here like a on a 85 00:04:56.800 --> 00:04:59.480 green card, or you're here as a student, or are 86 00:04:59.480 --> 00:05:01.800 you're here under protect a status, you are, you are 87 00:05:01.879 --> 00:05:04.759 under law that you can be here in the country legally. 88 00:05:05.720 --> 00:05:09.600 You can't be deported, You're you can't be arrested for 89 00:05:10.279 --> 00:05:13.560 just having legal status to be in the country. 90 00:05:13.920 --> 00:05:14.480 You know you're not. 91 00:05:15.120 --> 00:05:16.079 And that's the thing. 92 00:05:16.000 --> 00:05:20.120 That's so messed up about this. Like, I'm this is 93 00:05:20.240 --> 00:05:22.680 a side example, but my mom is still here on 94 00:05:22.680 --> 00:05:26.079 her visa, like she is an immigrant from pullback. Technically 95 00:05:26.160 --> 00:05:28.319 she's white, so I don't know how this is going 96 00:05:28.399 --> 00:05:28.920 to play out. 97 00:05:28.920 --> 00:05:33.600 And she's old, she could be sick, yeah, I agree, yeah. 98 00:05:33.240 --> 00:05:37.720 Yeah, yeah, but she could technically be deported. You know, 99 00:05:37.800 --> 00:05:40.480 if we said, if we're ever going to take this literally, 100 00:05:40.600 --> 00:05:44.480 she could be deported. But unfortunately, this is this law 101 00:05:44.639 --> 00:05:48.160 is racist as fuck, and I'm sorry, but it is, 102 00:05:48.480 --> 00:05:53.720 and they're focusing on the brown people because what happens 103 00:05:53.800 --> 00:05:56.959 under fascist governments. You know what happens under fascist governments. 104 00:05:57.160 --> 00:06:00.879 You blame minorities that don't have any power, and you 105 00:06:00.959 --> 00:06:06.639 villainize them, you start deporting them, and then when that doesn't, 106 00:06:06.920 --> 00:06:09.519 you know, cut the mustard you were moving. 107 00:06:09.639 --> 00:06:11.000 Then we move on to more. 108 00:06:10.839 --> 00:06:14.680 Extreme things that Jimmy alluded to. Now I don't want 109 00:06:14.720 --> 00:06:18.839 that to happen, obviously, but this type of crap that's happening. 110 00:06:18.959 --> 00:06:20.879 This what happened in other. 111 00:06:21.120 --> 00:06:22.959 Other parts of the world. 112 00:06:22.560 --> 00:06:26.959 You know, in the early to mid twenties century where. 113 00:06:26.800 --> 00:06:27.800 Things got really bad. 114 00:06:27.839 --> 00:06:33.480 Guys, I'm really bad, So I'm again it's kind of 115 00:06:34.199 --> 00:06:38.279 really really kind of stop like do protests and you 116 00:06:38.319 --> 00:06:42.000 should be doing your best to help your neighbor. 117 00:06:42.279 --> 00:06:42.480 You know. 118 00:06:42.560 --> 00:06:44.800 Again, if your person the privilege, you use your privilege 119 00:06:44.839 --> 00:06:47.480 to help somebody else, right, and it's gonna suck. It's 120 00:06:47.480 --> 00:06:48.920 not gonna be comfortable, it's gonna suck. 121 00:06:49.959 --> 00:06:52.279 It's kind of like one of those situations where you 122 00:06:52.839 --> 00:06:54.519 just can't believe that it's happening. 123 00:06:54.560 --> 00:06:57.920 I mean I kind of feel like like I'm struck. 124 00:06:57.720 --> 00:07:00.759 Like it's just like, really, is this really this, you know, 125 00:07:00.959 --> 00:07:03.959 because you imagine it this kind of thing happening, you know, 126 00:07:04.160 --> 00:07:07.360 especially when politicians get talking about each other and that 127 00:07:07.480 --> 00:07:09.800 kind of thing and they bring up this kind of stuff. 128 00:07:10.000 --> 00:07:12.560 But here we are. I mean, it's it's really it's 129 00:07:12.639 --> 00:07:16.439 really hard to argue that there's not horrible things happening 130 00:07:16.519 --> 00:07:19.160 right now. And it's just it's to the point where 131 00:07:19.439 --> 00:07:22.279 people that don't recognize with it. It's almost you almost 132 00:07:22.319 --> 00:07:25.720 think that it must be intentional. It must be you know, 133 00:07:25.839 --> 00:07:29.480 intent willful ignorance. Right, Jimmy, I want to go back 134 00:07:29.480 --> 00:07:31.920 to you a little bit here. Helen was talking about 135 00:07:32.439 --> 00:07:36.279 the arrests and the policy mandating these arrests. Do you 136 00:07:36.319 --> 00:07:38.120 and then I just want to get your opinion on this. 137 00:07:38.480 --> 00:07:40.720 Do you think this is part of that larger agenda? 138 00:07:40.759 --> 00:07:42.959 Do you think there's ulterior motives here? Do you think 139 00:07:43.040 --> 00:07:46.839 this is specifically a racially motivated thing, or do you 140 00:07:46.839 --> 00:07:50.319 think it's just a safety issue gone wrong, you know, 141 00:07:50.439 --> 00:07:54.439 improperly and and incompetently enacted. 142 00:07:54.199 --> 00:07:57.279 It It's got to be a racial issue because white 143 00:07:57.279 --> 00:08:01.040 people are not being rounded up or deported, White people 144 00:08:01.199 --> 00:08:05.399 are not being threatened, you know, they might be in 145 00:08:05.439 --> 00:08:10.519 other capacities but not because they're white, you know, American citizens, 146 00:08:10.800 --> 00:08:14.120 people with protected status, all those people that are being 147 00:08:14.160 --> 00:08:19.079 threatened or of Latino heritage period. And so I can't 148 00:08:19.160 --> 00:08:21.639 see this not being a racial issue. In fact, the 149 00:08:21.800 --> 00:08:26.079 judge that blocked the move to remove protected status from 150 00:08:26.160 --> 00:08:29.439 the I said four hundred thousand Venezuelans earlier, it's actually 151 00:08:29.480 --> 00:08:33.559 six hundred said that these this move was being done 152 00:08:33.720 --> 00:08:37.519 through a racial justification, and he sees that this is 153 00:08:37.559 --> 00:08:39.399 not right, you know, and the rest of us need 154 00:08:39.440 --> 00:08:42.000 to see that this is not right. You know, I 155 00:08:42.039 --> 00:08:46.120 think that these are racist justifications. And the point, it's 156 00:08:46.159 --> 00:08:48.639 to the point that I'm now looking at our own 157 00:08:48.759 --> 00:08:52.159 law enforcement, like I look at the Gestapo in nineteen 158 00:08:52.200 --> 00:08:56.840 thirties Germany. I mean, ice, ICE is now a tool 159 00:08:57.000 --> 00:09:01.519 for fascist minded people, and you know, it's where the 160 00:09:01.559 --> 00:09:07.279 brown coats now, right, yes, right, And so verification of 161 00:09:07.320 --> 00:09:10.120 citizen is not citizenship is not even required. They're just 162 00:09:10.240 --> 00:09:13.399 rounding them up. And you know, there was an immense 163 00:09:13.519 --> 00:09:17.600 amount of pressure on these law enforcement agencies, particularly the 164 00:09:17.600 --> 00:09:21.639 people doing the tactical acquisition of the so called criminals. 165 00:09:22.279 --> 00:09:26.159 As there is a pressure on people all across the government. 166 00:09:26.200 --> 00:09:30.200 It's why we saw this ridiculous email from our supposed 167 00:09:30.519 --> 00:09:35.000 King Musk saying you better justify you'd better justify what 168 00:09:35.039 --> 00:09:37.240 you've been doing last week. People are going, oh shit, 169 00:09:37.399 --> 00:09:39.840 I don't I think I'm doing a good job. Why 170 00:09:39.879 --> 00:09:42.519 am I being harassed? And so we're seeing ICE agents 171 00:09:42.559 --> 00:09:46.679 and federal law enforcement to avoid being targeted and laid 172 00:09:46.679 --> 00:09:51.759 off and remove themselves acquiescing to this larger effort, which 173 00:09:51.799 --> 00:09:53.480 is wrong. It's flat out wrong. 174 00:09:54.240 --> 00:09:57.039 It's wrong not only for the victims of the crimes, 175 00:09:57.039 --> 00:09:59.000 but it's wrong to put people in a position where 176 00:09:59.000 --> 00:10:01.399 they have to do that, you know, where their livelihood 177 00:10:01.480 --> 00:10:04.039 is at threat and maybe even worse for them, you know, 178 00:10:04.039 --> 00:10:07.919 for their situation if they're labeled as you know, a 179 00:10:07.960 --> 00:10:10.600 dissenter or a troublemaker or something like that. They're not 180 00:10:10.639 --> 00:10:12.279 just going to lose their job, They're going to lose 181 00:10:12.320 --> 00:10:14.679 their communities. They're going to lose their you know, in 182 00:10:14.720 --> 00:10:18.320 many cases, their family. And it's it's really tough to 183 00:10:18.399 --> 00:10:20.840 put somebody in a situation where you have to do 184 00:10:20.919 --> 00:10:24.519 something that you believe is immoral or you know, keep 185 00:10:24.559 --> 00:10:29.720 your family fed. It's it's really, I mean, it's it's 186 00:10:29.759 --> 00:10:31.440 it's hard to see an upside to this. I mean, 187 00:10:31.440 --> 00:10:36.000 obviously there's not, but clearly somebody is at least imagining 188 00:10:36.039 --> 00:10:39.440 an upside here. Speaking of that, Helen, I want to 189 00:10:39.600 --> 00:10:42.279 go back to you for a second. Here, According to 190 00:10:42.320 --> 00:10:46.840 studies cited by NPR, research indicates that immigrants commit less 191 00:10:46.840 --> 00:10:51.480 crimes than US born people. Economists ran A. Breminski of 192 00:10:51.480 --> 00:10:55.600 Stanford University found that since nineteen sixties, immigrants are sixty 193 00:10:55.600 --> 00:10:58.639 percent less likely to be incarcerated than US born people. 194 00:10:58.960 --> 00:11:02.879 They talk, he talks about incarcerations because that's where that's 195 00:11:03.000 --> 00:11:07.639 the stage of the process where they look into citizenship status. 196 00:11:07.840 --> 00:11:11.720 So immigrants are sixty percent likely to be incarcerated. There's 197 00:11:11.759 --> 00:11:15.840 also a state level research that shows similar results. Researchers 198 00:11:15.879 --> 00:11:18.919 at the Cato Institute, a libertarian think tank, looked into 199 00:11:18.960 --> 00:11:21.320 Texas in twenty nineteen, so we're back in Texas now. 200 00:11:21.480 --> 00:11:24.600 They found that undocumented immigrants were thirty seven point one 201 00:11:24.639 --> 00:11:28.000 percent less likely to be convicted of a crime. Beyond 202 00:11:28.080 --> 00:11:32.759 incarceration rates. Research also shows that there's no correlation between 203 00:11:32.840 --> 00:11:36.440 undocumented people and a rise in crime, rise in a 204 00:11:36.759 --> 00:11:38.679 rate of crime. Okay, I'm going to say that again. 205 00:11:38.919 --> 00:11:42.720 There is no correlation between undocumented people and a rise 206 00:11:42.759 --> 00:11:45.720 in the crime rate. Recent investigations by The New York 207 00:11:45.759 --> 00:11:48.519 Times and the Marshall Project found that between two thousand 208 00:11:48.559 --> 00:11:51.679 and seven and twenty sixteen, there was no link between 209 00:11:51.759 --> 00:11:56.080 undocumented immigrants and the rise in violent or property crime. So, 210 00:11:56.559 --> 00:11:59.039 as we found in earlier segments this week, we have 211 00:11:59.080 --> 00:12:02.120 a solution that does seem to address any kind of problem. 212 00:12:02.519 --> 00:12:04.840 I hate to keep going back to the racism trough, 213 00:12:04.960 --> 00:12:07.240 but if you have if if it looks like a 214 00:12:07.279 --> 00:12:12.000 bigotry and act quacks like a bigotry, it's probably bigotry, right, 215 00:12:13.080 --> 00:12:15.200 is it really? Is it really that simple? Is this 216 00:12:15.399 --> 00:12:19.039 just flat out racism or could there let's let's try 217 00:12:19.080 --> 00:12:22.720 to at least put ourselves in uh in the other perspective, 218 00:12:22.919 --> 00:12:26.080 Could there conceivably be some sort of legal or policy 219 00:12:26.120 --> 00:12:29.039 objective here, or is it just straight up racism? 220 00:12:29.759 --> 00:12:36.960 It's racism because if they were being honest and they 221 00:12:37.039 --> 00:12:40.360 were really looking at you know, you know, looking at 222 00:12:40.360 --> 00:12:46.320 this from is there a correlation between illegal immigration and violence? 223 00:12:47.159 --> 00:12:50.559 You know, problems with the economy because everybody always complaining 224 00:12:50.559 --> 00:12:52.519 about how, you know, immigrants are going to take my job, 225 00:12:52.600 --> 00:12:55.360 and you know, on all this type of stuff. No, no, 226 00:12:55.639 --> 00:12:57.840 stop it, stop it, sap stab it. 227 00:12:57.840 --> 00:13:01.200 It's racism. It's racism because the. 228 00:13:01.159 --> 00:13:03.960 Only people there paying attention to are having to be 229 00:13:03.960 --> 00:13:05.240 people from Latino. 230 00:13:04.879 --> 00:13:09.639 Countries, right yeah, so yeah, exactly, Venezuelan's right. 231 00:13:09.720 --> 00:13:10.600 Reality of it. 232 00:13:10.600 --> 00:13:12.879 That's a pretty big sample size right there. 233 00:13:13.720 --> 00:13:18.200 And so if that is your goal is to blame 234 00:13:18.519 --> 00:13:22.120 you know, people that have more melanin than you do 235 00:13:22.240 --> 00:13:25.039 and having to you know, come from a different country 236 00:13:25.080 --> 00:13:27.039 where they u still at different language than you, and 237 00:13:27.039 --> 00:13:29.559 you don't understand their culture because you know, you don't 238 00:13:29.600 --> 00:13:34.279 bother to learn anything or you or And the thing is, though, 239 00:13:35.159 --> 00:13:37.879 you know, when we're people are disgusted by what they 240 00:13:37.879 --> 00:13:41.200 don't understand, and they're discussed by differences, and if you 241 00:13:41.279 --> 00:13:44.000 don't have your critical thinking brain on and being like, 242 00:13:44.039 --> 00:13:46.360 you know, this was some you know, psychological priming and 243 00:13:46.360 --> 00:13:49.039 bullshit that was fed to me about people that you 244 00:13:49.080 --> 00:13:51.639 know are different than me, what you do is you 245 00:13:52.080 --> 00:13:54.080 jump to fe I don't understand this, so you jump 246 00:13:54.120 --> 00:13:56.519 to fear. You jump to discuss, and what do we 247 00:13:56.559 --> 00:13:58.360 want to do with things that discussed us? We want 248 00:13:58.399 --> 00:14:00.240 to push it away, don't want anything to do with it. 249 00:14:01.039 --> 00:14:04.159 And then you then you have the right to dehumanize 250 00:14:04.600 --> 00:14:07.960 another human being and now recognize that this is going 251 00:14:08.000 --> 00:14:11.120 to traumatize them. You aren't fucking up their lives. I'm sorry, 252 00:14:11.159 --> 00:14:14.159 I'm swearing. Not this pisses me off like this. 253 00:14:14.360 --> 00:14:16.799 Have done a great job of restraint up to this 254 00:14:16.879 --> 00:14:19.639 point so far I would have been I think there's 255 00:14:19.759 --> 00:14:21.000 much more swearing. 256 00:14:20.639 --> 00:14:21.399 That's deserved here. 257 00:14:21.440 --> 00:14:22.639 Now we should all be pissed off. 258 00:14:23.039 --> 00:14:27.639 Yes, there is a backlash effect of this too. And 259 00:14:27.759 --> 00:14:30.840 let's let's just sit here and think about those people. Okay, Like, 260 00:14:30.960 --> 00:14:35.120 let's just say that you are a Hispanic family living 261 00:14:35.159 --> 00:14:38.000 in the United States, Okay, and you're a father and mother. 262 00:14:38.120 --> 00:14:41.799 You're allowed to stay here with one parent, but your 263 00:14:41.840 --> 00:14:47.120 other parent gets deported back to El Salvador, Guatemala, you 264 00:14:47.159 --> 00:14:50.440 know Piccolatina country, Right. What does that do to that family? 265 00:14:50.679 --> 00:14:51.639 Yeah? Exactly? 266 00:14:52.279 --> 00:14:54.480 How are they going to feel about the country that 267 00:14:54.559 --> 00:14:57.320 they immigrated to looking for a better life to protect 268 00:14:57.360 --> 00:15:00.799 their family and a family member gets to poured it back. 269 00:15:01.080 --> 00:15:04.519 You know, the man that was sent to the L 270 00:15:04.600 --> 00:15:07.559 Salvador prison. The reason why we know for sure that 271 00:15:07.639 --> 00:15:11.279 he's in that prison is because his wife saw footage 272 00:15:11.279 --> 00:15:14.840 of that prison on TV covering the story of people 273 00:15:14.879 --> 00:15:18.200 being deported to El Salvador and saw him at the prison. 274 00:15:18.399 --> 00:15:19.279 That's disgusting. 275 00:15:19.480 --> 00:15:23.759 Yeah, yeah, that he was able to confirm right there. 276 00:15:23.960 --> 00:15:26.840 She didn't know where he was, suspected that he had 277 00:15:26.840 --> 00:15:29.720 been deported, but had no idea until she saw on 278 00:15:29.759 --> 00:15:32.879 TV that her husband was indeed in El Salvador, in 279 00:15:32.919 --> 00:15:34.519 a prison where he's in danger. 280 00:15:34.679 --> 00:15:37.120 Right, yeah, I mean that you would think that would 281 00:15:37.480 --> 00:15:39.639 they would at least give her that much, at least 282 00:15:39.679 --> 00:15:42.759 just tell him where, tell her where her husband is. 283 00:15:42.919 --> 00:15:44.279 No, it's just gone and disappear. 284 00:15:44.320 --> 00:15:47.360 And just just by happenstance was able to find that information. 285 00:15:47.679 --> 00:15:48.879 That's amazing, that's amazing. 286 00:15:48.919 --> 00:15:52.000 He's not considered a person, He's considered a problem. And 287 00:15:52.039 --> 00:15:55.039 that's the thing, because when you humans, she doesn't deserve respect, 288 00:15:55.080 --> 00:15:57.879 she doesn't deserve to know where her husband is. Because 289 00:15:57.919 --> 00:15:59.480 that's that's what racism does. 290 00:15:59.519 --> 00:16:01.200 This is what fascism dust. 291 00:16:01.320 --> 00:16:04.200 It tells you that certain other people are not people, 292 00:16:04.279 --> 00:16:06.840 they're a less than And that's why we're seeing this 293 00:16:06.919 --> 00:16:09.480 is why this I'm just so mad because it's so 294 00:16:09.919 --> 00:16:14.200 it's so terrible what it's happening. And I and again, 295 00:16:14.360 --> 00:16:17.039 like Scott, you were saying before, like, this is not America, 296 00:16:17.120 --> 00:16:19.679 this is un America, this is not the America that 297 00:16:19.799 --> 00:16:22.799 I had the idea of what especially coming from a 298 00:16:22.799 --> 00:16:25.960 family of immigrants both of my parents, you know, my 299 00:16:26.320 --> 00:16:30.399 mom is from Canada and my dad's dad is from Albania, 300 00:16:31.200 --> 00:16:34.200 so you know, and so when you have that perspective 301 00:16:34.480 --> 00:16:37.320 and you know of that melting pot and you know 302 00:16:37.480 --> 00:16:41.759 different people, you know, coming together, it's just heartbreaking that 303 00:16:41.759 --> 00:16:43.200 this is this is happening. 304 00:16:44.279 --> 00:16:47.039 I want to stick on the on the racism idea. 305 00:16:47.080 --> 00:16:48.879 I know it's difficult to talk about, so I really 306 00:16:48.919 --> 00:16:52.399 appreciate both of you having this conversation. I think this 307 00:16:52.519 --> 00:16:55.440 is I think it's good for people to be able 308 00:16:55.480 --> 00:16:57.320 to talk about this kind of thing in a in 309 00:16:57.320 --> 00:17:02.240 a relatively safe environment like we are here, especially because 310 00:17:02.240 --> 00:17:04.640 there's so many people that don't have that kind of 311 00:17:04.720 --> 00:17:07.920 environment where they can have this kind of discussion. So 312 00:17:07.960 --> 00:17:10.599 thank you both for that. But Jimmy, I wanted to 313 00:17:10.960 --> 00:17:15.720 ask you. We've talked many many times on the nonprofits 314 00:17:15.720 --> 00:17:21.279 on how conservative thought, both politically and religiously is very 315 00:17:21.319 --> 00:17:24.000 often tied to and there's tons of studies that show 316 00:17:24.039 --> 00:17:29.079 this is correlated to an authoritarian perspective, an authoritarian mindset. 317 00:17:29.440 --> 00:17:32.640 And we also know that those who have such an 318 00:17:32.680 --> 00:17:39.440 authoritarian mindset are very vulnerable to fear response. Okay, they're 319 00:17:39.599 --> 00:17:43.440 they're very They react very strongly to threats and to 320 00:17:43.759 --> 00:17:47.119 and and to fear based situations. Do you think that, 321 00:17:48.200 --> 00:17:52.039 I mean, obviously there's horrible racism happening, whether it was 322 00:17:52.079 --> 00:17:56.000 intended to be racism, or whether it's even worse racism 323 00:17:56.039 --> 00:18:00.720 of indifference. Do you think that this could be there 324 00:18:00.720 --> 00:18:05.519 could be some kind of political benefit for taking advantage 325 00:18:05.519 --> 00:18:07.559 of this kind of racism. And again, I want to 326 00:18:07.599 --> 00:18:11.559 stress I think almost that kind of racism is worse 327 00:18:11.799 --> 00:18:14.920 the racism of indifference. They're just playing along with the 328 00:18:15.039 --> 00:18:16.759 racism to get the votes kind of thing. Do you 329 00:18:16.799 --> 00:18:19.319 think that there's an aspect of that in the story here? 330 00:18:19.599 --> 00:18:22.440 Sure, I think the hate is being intentionally engineered. I 331 00:18:22.480 --> 00:18:27.839 think that it is being created to freeze the status quo, 332 00:18:28.640 --> 00:18:31.160 or well, first of all to change it, but now 333 00:18:31.200 --> 00:18:35.680 to maintain it. Right. I think that border security and 334 00:18:36.240 --> 00:18:42.119 economic problems, even though the economy was good and improving 335 00:18:42.720 --> 00:18:45.519 was the may were the major issues that people voted 336 00:18:45.559 --> 00:18:47.640 the way that they did, and because it was the 337 00:18:47.759 --> 00:18:50.359 it was under the they were under the impression that 338 00:18:50.799 --> 00:18:53.720 immigrants were the problem for a failing economy. But you 339 00:18:53.759 --> 00:18:57.559 know what, when you are not educated on how immigrants 340 00:18:57.920 --> 00:19:01.200 make any economy work, and how any economy works, and 341 00:19:01.240 --> 00:19:04.559 that it's actually in a good spot, better than when 342 00:19:04.799 --> 00:19:08.000 the president at the time took office, then you have 343 00:19:08.039 --> 00:19:10.680 a tendency to go along with the engineered hate. And 344 00:19:10.720 --> 00:19:14.119 I think that that's what's happening. I forget who said it. Boy, 345 00:19:14.240 --> 00:19:17.640 we love the uneducated. I doesn't matter who said it. 346 00:19:18.359 --> 00:19:20.720 But you know, it just goes to show you that, 347 00:19:21.000 --> 00:19:26.119 you know, having an uneducated mass or base, i should say, 348 00:19:26.400 --> 00:19:31.440 and keeping them that way by dismantling education outlets, dismantling 349 00:19:31.480 --> 00:19:35.599 the Department of Education and funding to schools right goes 350 00:19:35.640 --> 00:19:40.400 along with allowing this blame to be to be propagated, 351 00:19:40.440 --> 00:19:44.000 if you will. And so, yeah, I think that while 352 00:19:44.279 --> 00:19:48.799 there might not be people that are themselves racist, they're 353 00:19:48.839 --> 00:19:52.599 going along with the racism because it helps their position, 354 00:19:53.039 --> 00:19:56.720 their wallet, and their power. And so that's the unfortunate 355 00:19:56.759 --> 00:19:58.799 part about it. You know a lot of people have 356 00:19:58.920 --> 00:20:01.759 decided that racis is not a red line for them, 357 00:20:01.799 --> 00:20:02.519 and that's scary. 358 00:20:02.640 --> 00:20:06.000 Yeah, kind of like that callous indifference is really just 359 00:20:06.039 --> 00:20:07.839 not that's not part of a world I want to 360 00:20:07.839 --> 00:20:11.039 be in. And speaking of worlds that I'm not in, 361 00:20:11.559 --> 00:20:14.119 I want to tie in the religion. Again, we haven't 362 00:20:14.119 --> 00:20:16.160 really talked a lot about the original religion in this 363 00:20:16.599 --> 00:20:19.680 These stories are just so horrific that it's like half 364 00:20:19.680 --> 00:20:22.240 an hour before we can even get to the religion part. 365 00:20:22.319 --> 00:20:24.680 But I want to read a few quotes from a 366 00:20:24.759 --> 00:20:27.920 book that I'm sure you're all familiar with. Here, first quote, 367 00:20:27.920 --> 00:20:30.920 you shall also love the stranger, for you were strangers 368 00:20:30.960 --> 00:20:34.359 in the land of Egypt. That's from Deuteronomy ten nineteen. 369 00:20:34.559 --> 00:20:36.759 The alien who resides with you shall be to you 370 00:20:36.880 --> 00:20:39.799 as the citizen among you. You shall love the alien 371 00:20:39.880 --> 00:20:42.880 as yourself, for you are aliens in the land of Egypt. 372 00:20:43.119 --> 00:20:46.279 I am the Lord, your God. That's from Leviticus nineteen 373 00:20:46.319 --> 00:20:50.039 thirty four. Thus says the Lord of hosts, render true judgments, 374 00:20:50.319 --> 00:20:53.160 show kindness and mercy to one another. Do not oppress 375 00:20:53.240 --> 00:20:56.119 the widow, the orphan, the alien, or the poor, and 376 00:20:56.200 --> 00:20:58.880 do not devise evil in your hearts against one another. 377 00:20:58.960 --> 00:21:02.279 That's from Zechariah and seven nine through ten. Last one, here, 378 00:21:02.359 --> 00:21:05.559 let mutual love continue, do not neglect to show hospitality 379 00:21:05.599 --> 00:21:10.160 to strangers. For doing that, some have entertained, and for 380 00:21:10.279 --> 00:21:14.039 by doing that, some have entertained angels without knowing it. 381 00:21:14.440 --> 00:21:17.559 Remember those who are in prison as those who were 382 00:21:17.599 --> 00:21:20.599 in prison with them, those who are being tortured, as 383 00:21:20.680 --> 00:21:23.440 though you are being tortured yourself. And so, in other words, 384 00:21:23.680 --> 00:21:27.240 welcome them as your brothers, welcome them as among yourselves. 385 00:21:27.799 --> 00:21:30.400 And that's from Hebrews thirteen to one through three. So 386 00:21:30.720 --> 00:21:33.759 the Bible, obviously that was all from is especially relevant 387 00:21:33.759 --> 00:21:37.680 here because there's a huge overlap in those who are 388 00:21:37.680 --> 00:21:43.519 supporting these immigration policies and those who support the christ 389 00:21:43.640 --> 00:21:48.400 criminal Freian slip there, the Christian nationalist movement. And I'm 390 00:21:48.400 --> 00:21:51.319 going to ask this from both of you. Do these 391 00:21:51.319 --> 00:21:53.960 people actually read their own book? And why do you 392 00:21:54.039 --> 00:21:57.359 think pointing out the Unchristian nature of these policies does 393 00:21:57.440 --> 00:21:59.359 nothing to stem the tide of hate. We'll go to 394 00:21:59.440 --> 00:22:01.559 Jimmy first and then we'll finish with Helen. Well, they 395 00:22:01.559 --> 00:22:03.599 think they read their own book? And why is this 396 00:22:03.680 --> 00:22:06.240 not having an effect at large? 397 00:22:06.480 --> 00:22:09.920 Most Christians don't read their own books. Human beings are 398 00:22:09.960 --> 00:22:13.319 generally lazy, and if they have somebody standing at the 399 00:22:13.319 --> 00:22:17.039 front of their congregation holding the book, telling them, Hey, 400 00:22:17.079 --> 00:22:19.519 I read it for you. You know this is what it says. 401 00:22:19.920 --> 00:22:23.440