WEBVTT 1 00:00:01.120 --> 00:00:05.120 Preparation is making sure that everything you would do is 2 00:00:05.200 --> 00:00:09.880 aligned with the strategic goals, the strategic priorities that are 3 00:00:09.919 --> 00:00:11.160 relevant to this person. 4 00:00:15.839 --> 00:00:18.679 You're listening to the Audible Ready Podcast, the show that 5 00:00:18.719 --> 00:00:22.519 helps you and your teams sell more faster. We'll feature 6 00:00:22.559 --> 00:00:25.039 sales leaders sharing their best insights on how to create 7 00:00:25.079 --> 00:00:28.199 a sales engine that helps you fuel repeatable revenue growth. 8 00:00:28.519 --> 00:00:31.280 Presented by the team at Force Management, a leader in 9 00:00:31.359 --> 00:00:33.920 B to B sales effectiveness. Let's get started. 10 00:00:36.359 --> 00:00:39.479 Hello and welcome to the Audible Ready Sales Podcast. I'm 11 00:00:39.560 --> 00:00:42.479 Rachel klepp Miller and joining me for our episode today 12 00:00:42.600 --> 00:00:45.000 is our own Timkato. Hi, Tim, Hello Rachel. 13 00:00:45.000 --> 00:00:46.640 What a fun topic we have today. 14 00:00:47.119 --> 00:00:50.320 Yes, today we are going to dive into the value 15 00:00:50.320 --> 00:00:54.359 based conversation. We talk a lot about making sure you're 16 00:00:54.399 --> 00:00:59.079 getting higher in organizations, elevating those sales conversations. You know 17 00:00:59.159 --> 00:01:01.520 you need to do it, but what is the motion 18 00:01:02.039 --> 00:01:06.000 that you need to remain focused on that in every conversation. 19 00:01:06.680 --> 00:01:09.680 So Tim's going to help us dive into that today. 20 00:01:10.040 --> 00:01:13.519 I think first, Tim, let's just level set with how 21 00:01:13.640 --> 00:01:15.760 I know if I'm too low in a company. 22 00:01:15.879 --> 00:01:19.319 Yeah, Well, let's start off with a premise you are. 23 00:01:21.680 --> 00:01:25.719 Everybody experiences this and once again, rachild, this is not 24 00:01:25.760 --> 00:01:28.519 a new concept, right. We've been talking about this as 25 00:01:28.599 --> 00:01:30.719 long as I know. I've been around in selling, and 26 00:01:30.760 --> 00:01:32.840 that goes back to the seventies, and I'm sure it 27 00:01:32.879 --> 00:01:37.480 was there before. But we've learned some things over the years, 28 00:01:37.519 --> 00:01:41.400 and then some other things have changed in terms of expectations. 29 00:01:42.000 --> 00:01:43.879 So one of the things I want to start to 30 00:01:44.000 --> 00:01:49.200 level set is let's reframe this. For years, when we 31 00:01:49.319 --> 00:01:53.280 talked about calling higher or elevating your call, it was 32 00:01:53.480 --> 00:01:57.760 almost like an exercise and org chart exercise. I'm at 33 00:01:57.799 --> 00:02:00.159 this level. I want to get to this level. I 34 00:02:00.200 --> 00:02:03.840 got to get to this level, and sales managers and 35 00:02:03.959 --> 00:02:07.799 people would be chasing that holy grail of calling on 36 00:02:07.879 --> 00:02:11.960 that senior executive. But what we figured out is there's 37 00:02:12.000 --> 00:02:14.280 a lot of risk in that. We see it as 38 00:02:14.280 --> 00:02:17.719 there's risk in not getting there, and everybody understands that one. 39 00:02:18.159 --> 00:02:20.680 But you know what, there is risk in getting there 40 00:02:21.039 --> 00:02:24.400 if you're unprepared. A lot of data has been written. 41 00:02:24.439 --> 00:02:28.719 You could get there and fail and guess what, you're 42 00:02:28.759 --> 00:02:32.520 never getting back. So it's not just call on someone, 43 00:02:33.319 --> 00:02:37.759 it's make sure that when we talk elevating your selling 44 00:02:37.879 --> 00:02:40.680 you're calling. I believe it's not as much about an 45 00:02:40.800 --> 00:02:44.560 org chart, Rachel, as it is about influence. Am I 46 00:02:44.719 --> 00:02:50.560 interacting with the people that influence the company's strategic priorities 47 00:02:51.120 --> 00:02:55.759 executing their goals? And if I am, then what we've 48 00:02:55.840 --> 00:02:59.960 learned over the years is how do I position myself 49 00:03:00.360 --> 00:03:05.560 my company as relevant to their business issues. We've learned 50 00:03:05.599 --> 00:03:07.800 a lot over the years, Rachel, not only what works, 51 00:03:08.000 --> 00:03:11.080 but what does not. And I think what everybody understands 52 00:03:11.159 --> 00:03:13.520 is what does not is for me to give that 53 00:03:13.639 --> 00:03:18.840 senior level executive and overview my stuff, my product, that's irrelevant. 54 00:03:18.879 --> 00:03:22.719 But we haven't figured out why right. And then we say, well, 55 00:03:22.800 --> 00:03:26.080 we've got to be more focused on business issues. Well 56 00:03:26.120 --> 00:03:28.840 what are the business issues? And they say, well, we 57 00:03:28.919 --> 00:03:32.199 can lower your costs and we think that's the message, right, 58 00:03:32.639 --> 00:03:34.800 But what we forget to do is figure out from 59 00:03:34.840 --> 00:03:38.159 their view, so why does that matter. I'm trying to 60 00:03:38.199 --> 00:03:41.199 grow my business. I'm trying to grow in new markets. 61 00:03:41.240 --> 00:03:44.879 I just did three acquisitions, so I appreciate the fact 62 00:03:44.919 --> 00:03:47.840 you're lowering my cost but that's not my issue right now. 63 00:03:48.159 --> 00:03:50.919 And Ding, Ding, guess what you're not relevant to? Me. 64 00:03:51.560 --> 00:03:53.879 So at some point we get around one of the 65 00:03:53.919 --> 00:03:57.240 lower cost maybe I'll remember this, but right now, thank 66 00:03:57.280 --> 00:03:59.479 you very much, really appreciate it. I got a team 67 00:03:59.479 --> 00:04:01.199 over there that you got to go spend some time 68 00:04:01.240 --> 00:04:04.240 with to lower the cost. My focus is elsewhere. So 69 00:04:04.960 --> 00:04:08.639 let's level set on this, Rachel. It's not about calling 70 00:04:08.680 --> 00:04:12.199 on a level that's got a title. It's about calling 71 00:04:12.240 --> 00:04:16.160 on influence of the strategies and priorities of the business. 72 00:04:16.759 --> 00:04:19.639 That's where we want to go with the discussion. 73 00:04:19.639 --> 00:04:21.959 Right, And you want to make sure that when you're 74 00:04:22.199 --> 00:04:26.959 having those conversations, relevancy is at the forefront. You know, 75 00:04:27.040 --> 00:04:30.959 everybody listening sells a lot of different things. They're having 76 00:04:31.040 --> 00:04:35.680 different value conversations, but there are some main things that 77 00:04:35.800 --> 00:04:39.439 when you're elevating your sales conversations to those layers of 78 00:04:39.519 --> 00:04:42.720 influence that those people are going to care about. 79 00:04:42.800 --> 00:04:42.959 Right. 80 00:04:43.040 --> 00:04:45.759 You threw out some They're like, I just merged with 81 00:04:45.879 --> 00:04:48.240 a company, I have these priorities. 82 00:04:48.839 --> 00:04:52.000 There's probably some big buckets that you're going to want 83 00:04:52.000 --> 00:04:57.240 to look for to ensure that you're consistently elevating those conversations. 84 00:04:57.800 --> 00:04:59.920 Yeah, you know, and it's not hard to find them 85 00:05:00.480 --> 00:05:03.439 if you take the time, because here's my thing, you know, 86 00:05:04.079 --> 00:05:07.560 when you we talked about it's getting access to those 87 00:05:07.600 --> 00:05:10.800 with influence, even that is not the goal to me. 88 00:05:10.920 --> 00:05:14.480 The endgame is return access. I'm doing this to make 89 00:05:14.519 --> 00:05:18.199 sure that I can continue to position our value, show 90 00:05:18.199 --> 00:05:21.839 what we can do help influence their ideas of what 91 00:05:22.000 --> 00:05:24.639 they're influencing. Right, So we're trying to do that. But 92 00:05:24.680 --> 00:05:26.839 it's return access and we'll get into that in a 93 00:05:26.839 --> 00:05:30.120 little bit more. But what's going to cause me to 94 00:05:30.199 --> 00:05:34.319 get return access, initial access and then return access to 95 00:05:34.519 --> 00:05:39.480 those that are influencing or dictating the strategic direction of 96 00:05:39.519 --> 00:05:43.439 their organization, Well, I better be relevant to whatever that 97 00:05:43.519 --> 00:05:47.439 strategic direction is aimed at. Are they finally at the 98 00:05:47.480 --> 00:05:50.639 point of their digital transformation journey that's been going on 99 00:05:50.720 --> 00:05:53.680 for twelve years already where they're now looking at AI 100 00:05:53.839 --> 00:05:57.319 and saying, is this the thing that we've been missing along? 101 00:05:57.639 --> 00:05:59.519 I'm trying to figure out how I justify on my 102 00:05:59.600 --> 00:06:02.600 board that we spend all this money on this thing 103 00:06:02.959 --> 00:06:05.319 and I can't show a whole lot of results other 104 00:06:05.399 --> 00:06:07.639 than we've spent a lot of money on tools and 105 00:06:07.680 --> 00:06:12.959 systems and security and now maybe this can offer something different. Well, 106 00:06:13.000 --> 00:06:17.519 I better have some value relative to that. So when 107 00:06:17.519 --> 00:06:19.439 you talk about how do you find it? I think 108 00:06:19.600 --> 00:06:23.279 practically it's do our due diligence before we go into 109 00:06:23.319 --> 00:06:24.959 the call. We're singing you do is going to that 110 00:06:25.040 --> 00:06:28.519 call and not be relevant to this person's priorities. So 111 00:06:28.759 --> 00:06:31.120 I might be able to find it just by doing 112 00:06:31.160 --> 00:06:36.800 research on the organization. I might understand it because we 113 00:06:36.920 --> 00:06:40.000 deal with other organizations that are similar, that are dealing 114 00:06:40.040 --> 00:06:44.720 with similar things, so we can interpret this organization has issues. 115 00:06:45.160 --> 00:06:47.279 But I think it's always best if we could find 116 00:06:47.319 --> 00:06:51.199 something specific. Do we have partners that understand what the 117 00:06:51.240 --> 00:06:54.680 priorities of those executives are? And then Rachel, our old friend, 118 00:06:54.720 --> 00:06:58.160 the champion, can they give us some insights, not just 119 00:06:58.240 --> 00:07:01.560 about the company. I want to know about this person. 120 00:07:02.160 --> 00:07:05.920 What was she brought in to do, what is her focus? 121 00:07:06.399 --> 00:07:10.160 What is she making moves to do? That's what I 122 00:07:10.279 --> 00:07:14.319 want to understand. And then once I understand that, the 123 00:07:14.360 --> 00:07:17.079 next thing I could do to prepare to be relevant 124 00:07:17.079 --> 00:07:19.920 and compelling is to have a point of view tied 125 00:07:19.920 --> 00:07:21.959 to that problem. See. One of the things I think 126 00:07:21.959 --> 00:07:24.639 we make a mistake in Rachel that we've learned over 127 00:07:24.680 --> 00:07:27.439 the years. We try and get access to the power 128 00:07:27.600 --> 00:07:31.879 the influencers, so that we could show them the value 129 00:07:31.920 --> 00:07:35.680 of our solutions. Let them know we're experts in our solution. 130 00:07:36.720 --> 00:07:39.040 What have we learned. They don't care about that. They 131 00:07:39.079 --> 00:07:41.879 expect it that we're going to talk about it. They've 132 00:07:41.920 --> 00:07:45.240 experienced a lot of bad selling, but that's not what 133 00:07:45.279 --> 00:07:47.879 they care about. They care about are you an expert 134 00:07:47.879 --> 00:07:51.839 in my problem? So just the mental pivot of I'm 135 00:07:51.879 --> 00:07:55.439 not here to be an expert in my solution our industry. 136 00:07:55.720 --> 00:07:58.759 I'm here because we deal with the organizations that have 137 00:07:58.839 --> 00:08:03.040 your exact issue, and as a result, we have a 138 00:08:03.120 --> 00:08:07.160 point of view about that. It's not just this, it's 139 00:08:07.199 --> 00:08:09.439 this other thing. Now where do I get that point 140 00:08:09.439 --> 00:08:13.240 of view? Well, hopefully from your product team, your marketing team, 141 00:08:13.720 --> 00:08:16.800 the founder, the innovators, whatever it was. But have a 142 00:08:16.959 --> 00:08:21.279 unique perspective that causes that customer to think, this is 143 00:08:21.319 --> 00:08:24.759 about my issue, but we hadn't thought about it that way, 144 00:08:25.519 --> 00:08:29.680 and that's actually rather interesting and compelling. Let's take your 145 00:08:29.720 --> 00:08:33.279 point of view and apply it to my situation. Now, 146 00:08:33.320 --> 00:08:37.159 what you're doing is you're being relevant to them, and 147 00:08:37.200 --> 00:08:40.440 what makes you really compelling is if they get some 148 00:08:40.519 --> 00:08:44.200 insights about their business they didn't have before as a 149 00:08:44.240 --> 00:08:47.000 result of dealing with you on these podcasts, Rachel, you 150 00:08:47.000 --> 00:08:49.679 and I have talked many times about the metaphor of 151 00:08:49.759 --> 00:08:53.840 going to a specialist physician. Right. I don't expect them 152 00:08:53.879 --> 00:08:55.720 to go there and tell me what the other people 153 00:08:55.759 --> 00:08:59.600 told me. I expect to get some expertise. And so 154 00:08:59.720 --> 00:09:02.720 when they start asking me questions, do an exam point 155 00:09:02.759 --> 00:09:06.320 things out, do tests. I'm learning some things about me 156 00:09:06.480 --> 00:09:09.799 and I am leaning in big time, right. And it's 157 00:09:09.840 --> 00:09:12.679 the same thing when we get to those folks that 158 00:09:12.759 --> 00:09:16.720 have power influence over the strategies. Do we position ourselves 159 00:09:16.759 --> 00:09:20.200 as experts on solving that problem? Do we have a 160 00:09:20.279 --> 00:09:23.559 compelling point of view that causes them to think a 161 00:09:23.559 --> 00:09:26.480 little bit different? And then can we start to engage 162 00:09:26.519 --> 00:09:29.320 with them on how does that point of view play 163 00:09:29.360 --> 00:09:33.480 out in their world? And what insights are we trying 164 00:09:33.519 --> 00:09:38.039 to help them understand. And that's what that's what we're 165 00:09:38.039 --> 00:09:41.720 really looking for, their perspective on the point of view 166 00:09:41.840 --> 00:09:45.279 on the problem that's relevant to their world. Now, they're 167 00:09:45.360 --> 00:09:48.639 learning something, and if they learn something and it plays out, 168 00:09:49.120 --> 00:09:51.200 guess what's going to happen? They're going to ask you 169 00:09:51.279 --> 00:09:54.399 back in Yeah, that's where the return access. 170 00:09:54.000 --> 00:09:57.679 Comes, and it's continually having that point of view throughout 171 00:09:57.720 --> 00:10:00.360 the sales process to make sure that you once you're 172 00:10:00.440 --> 00:10:01.440 up there, you stay up. 173 00:10:01.399 --> 00:10:03.519 There, right absolutely. 174 00:10:03.919 --> 00:10:06.519 And then you had mentioned at the top the preparation 175 00:10:07.279 --> 00:10:10.200 for those higher level conversations versus maybe the ones you're 176 00:10:10.240 --> 00:10:13.399 having when you first get into an organization. Talk a 177 00:10:13.440 --> 00:10:17.000 little bit more about what that preparation should look like 178 00:10:17.240 --> 00:10:18.519 and how it's different. 179 00:10:19.120 --> 00:10:21.919 Yeah. Yeah, Well, first of all, I've already given a 180 00:10:21.919 --> 00:10:25.200 few clues. It's about their problem, not your solution. It's 181 00:10:25.240 --> 00:10:28.360 about having that point of view that you can articulate. 182 00:10:28.559 --> 00:10:30.879 But there's some other things there, Rachel. One of the 183 00:10:30.879 --> 00:10:34.879 first times I even remember learning about champions or someone 184 00:10:34.919 --> 00:10:37.399 that could sell on your behalf is I had one 185 00:10:37.440 --> 00:10:40.320 many years ago. I was calling a Ford Motor company 186 00:10:40.360 --> 00:10:44.080 for my company and I was twenty eight years old, 187 00:10:44.519 --> 00:10:47.720 and I had this person that was great, definitely a champion, 188 00:10:48.000 --> 00:10:51.200 no question about it, But at the time I was 189 00:10:51.240 --> 00:10:54.799 frustrated with him because I was getting hammered by my management. 190 00:10:54.840 --> 00:10:58.600 Even back then, right early eighties. You're not calling high 191 00:10:58.639 --> 00:11:01.279 you ought to be calling on this person that person, 192 00:11:01.759 --> 00:11:04.440 and I'm like, yeah, I'm asking my guy, hey, can 193 00:11:04.480 --> 00:11:06.919 you give me an introduction there? And you know what, 194 00:11:06.960 --> 00:11:10.080 he told me, Rachel, You're not ready yet. You're not 195 00:11:10.159 --> 00:11:12.639 ready yet. And I'm like, was because I'm twenty eight 196 00:11:12.679 --> 00:11:16.120 you know? No, no, no, you don't know the protocol, 197 00:11:16.279 --> 00:11:18.679 you don't know how to position when we do. And 198 00:11:18.759 --> 00:11:21.519 it took two years and finally, you know, he said, 199 00:11:21.519 --> 00:11:24.120 I'm going to bring into this meeting and you and 200 00:11:24.120 --> 00:11:26.080 I are going to prep for that. I said, does 201 00:11:26.120 --> 00:11:28.960 that mean I'm ready? He said, well, mostly, but I 202 00:11:29.480 --> 00:11:32.440 want to make sure that you're ready. So a lot 203 00:11:32.440 --> 00:11:36.480 of preparation in the flow of the meeting, who was 204 00:11:36.559 --> 00:11:39.039 going to be there, how we were going to tee 205 00:11:39.080 --> 00:11:42.600 it up if I'm there with somebody else, almost orchestrating 206 00:11:42.799 --> 00:11:46.320 the roles to make sure that we're laying out the 207 00:11:46.360 --> 00:11:50.639 premise of why we're there and in that role that 208 00:11:50.759 --> 00:11:54.639 champion way back then told me, this person gets called 209 00:11:54.679 --> 00:11:58.120 on all the time by sales organizations. He takes about 210 00:11:58.159 --> 00:12:01.720 ten percent of those meetings. He has an expectation of 211 00:12:01.759 --> 00:12:04.519 what will occur in the first five minutes, he's got 212 00:12:04.559 --> 00:12:07.639 an expectation of what will occur in the next fifteen minutes, 213 00:12:07.960 --> 00:12:10.279 and he's got an expectation of where this is going 214 00:12:10.360 --> 00:12:13.200 to end. So you and I are going to orchestrate 215 00:12:13.279 --> 00:12:17.919 this accordingly. And he knew people from my company were 216 00:12:17.960 --> 00:12:20.080 going to be coming in because it was forward right, 217 00:12:20.679 --> 00:12:24.679 and he said, it's your job, Tim to make sure 218 00:12:24.720 --> 00:12:28.960 they all play their roles. So preparation is knowing what 219 00:12:29.159 --> 00:12:32.440 the big issue is in aligning everything you do towards it, 220 00:12:32.799 --> 00:12:37.120 but even orchestrating the introduction, the how you're going to 221 00:12:37.120 --> 00:12:38.919 set it up, how you're going to share that point 222 00:12:38.960 --> 00:12:42.320 of view, the discovery that's going to go on afterwards. 223 00:12:42.759 --> 00:12:45.799 And there's one last piece, Rachel. We don't always know 224 00:12:45.919 --> 00:12:49.000 this one, but we've come to learn it's really important. 225 00:12:49.519 --> 00:12:53.720 Where is that influencer in their organization. Where is that 226 00:12:53.919 --> 00:12:57.600 senior level person in the life cycle of dealing with 227 00:12:57.679 --> 00:13:02.000 this problem, because we know so their focus is on 228 00:13:02.159 --> 00:13:05.960 different things. Is it early in the life cycle they 229 00:13:06.000 --> 00:13:08.200 know they've got a problem, or they've got an issue, 230 00:13:08.320 --> 00:13:12.120 or it's become a priority, and that senior level influencer 231 00:13:12.159 --> 00:13:15.519 is spending all their time framing what are the outcomes 232 00:13:15.559 --> 00:13:18.840 we want? What is this thing intended to do? Maybe 233 00:13:18.879 --> 00:13:21.840 all the way down to defining budgets and a team 234 00:13:21.919 --> 00:13:25.679 to work on it, very highly engaged up front. If 235 00:13:25.759 --> 00:13:28.960 we can talk to them in that time period with 236 00:13:29.080 --> 00:13:33.000 our point of view, what influence we can create on 237 00:13:33.080 --> 00:13:36.879 how that initiative goes? The problem is, Rachel, more often 238 00:13:36.919 --> 00:13:40.399 than not that part of their process of dealing the 239 00:13:40.440 --> 00:13:43.320 life cycle of the problem, we don't know about it. 240 00:13:43.320 --> 00:13:46.200 It's going on. When do we typically find out about it? 241 00:13:46.519 --> 00:13:50.200 The project team that was given all that direction and perspective, 242 00:13:50.639 --> 00:13:53.559 they're now working on it. But here's the thing, guess 243 00:13:53.559 --> 00:13:56.879 where the senior executive is now. They're onto something else. 244 00:13:57.360 --> 00:14:00.519 They've already given their guidance to the team. They assume 245 00:14:00.559 --> 00:14:03.320 the team is running with it. So it's almost like 246 00:14:03.399 --> 00:14:06.480 this trough. It's like an inverted you. They're really highly 247 00:14:06.519 --> 00:14:09.120 engaged upfront, they kind of go away in the middle, 248 00:14:09.600 --> 00:14:12.080 but then they re engage at the end, Rachel, And 249 00:14:12.120 --> 00:14:14.639 why do they re engage? Then they want to check 250 00:14:14.759 --> 00:14:16.759 not only to make sure the team came back with 251 00:14:16.840 --> 00:14:20.360 a solution that they were looking for, but more importantly, 252 00:14:20.720 --> 00:14:22.720 they want to know did they come back with a 253 00:14:22.720 --> 00:14:26.200 solution that's still relevant to today's priorities. I know what 254 00:14:26.279 --> 00:14:28.600 I told you six months ago, and it looks like, 255 00:14:28.639 --> 00:14:31.039 you did a great job finding that, but that's not 256 00:14:31.080 --> 00:14:34.200 our big issue now, it's something else. So why do 257 00:14:34.279 --> 00:14:37.639 I say this is part of preparation? Are they early? 258 00:14:38.080 --> 00:14:40.519 If so, I got to double down on my point 259 00:14:40.559 --> 00:14:43.799 of view to help influence the way they see that problem. 260 00:14:44.080 --> 00:14:47.759 Are they in the middle right? What they're doing is 261 00:14:47.919 --> 00:14:50.960 at best checking in to make sure the direction is right. 262 00:14:51.600 --> 00:14:54.600 We can't be in there trying to position our point 263 00:14:54.639 --> 00:14:57.720 of view when they think the project's already going. There's 264 00:14:57.759 --> 00:15:01.759 a different rhythm for that meeting, and that is to 265 00:15:01.799 --> 00:15:05.879 share insights on progress, to talk about maybe something that's missing, 266 00:15:06.240 --> 00:15:09.399 something new that has emerged that we didn't know about 267 00:15:09.440 --> 00:15:13.039 six months ago. And then at the end, this is 268 00:15:13.080 --> 00:15:16.639 the piece. A lot of times, Rachel, people miss they think, wow, 269 00:15:16.679 --> 00:15:18.759 I got my project. I'm working with the project team, 270 00:15:18.840 --> 00:15:23.840 we were selected, were in contracts, this thing's done. Perfect 271 00:15:23.879 --> 00:15:29.759 time to double check with the influencer, economic buyer, senior 272 00:15:29.799 --> 00:15:33.679 executive to make sure is this thing that was a 273 00:15:33.720 --> 00:15:36.720 priority a few months ago still a priority relative to 274 00:15:36.720 --> 00:15:40.519 today's issues. Now. We almost always can see that, Rachel, 275 00:15:40.879 --> 00:15:43.200 but they don't always see it, and their team doesn't 276 00:15:43.200 --> 00:15:47.519 always see it. We've all unfortunately been part of that call. Hey, 277 00:15:47.600 --> 00:15:49.960 what you did was great, but we've had a few 278 00:15:50.000 --> 00:15:54.279 other things come up and the deal slips. It's preparation. 279 00:15:54.519 --> 00:15:58.200 Where are they at in their cycle, and let's prepare accordingly. 280 00:15:58.600 --> 00:16:01.120 It's not a one size fit. It's all for a 281 00:16:01.200 --> 00:16:04.679 senior executive conversation. So you kind of have to know 282 00:16:04.759 --> 00:16:06.919 what's going on with them, where are they at in 283 00:16:07.000 --> 00:16:10.519 their cycle, what's our point of view, what's the discovery 284 00:16:10.559 --> 00:16:13.320 we drive accordingly? I know I covered a lot there, 285 00:16:13.399 --> 00:16:16.720 but yeah, it's really because that's where we've messed. 286 00:16:16.519 --> 00:16:19.200 Up, right, right, And you know, you can make a 287 00:16:19.240 --> 00:16:23.519 lot of missteps when you're trying to elevate your sales conversation. 288 00:16:23.600 --> 00:16:26.000 You know, you mentioned one at the top, going too early, 289 00:16:26.440 --> 00:16:28.960 and I would think summarizing what you just said and 290 00:16:29.000 --> 00:16:33.279 then not preparing for the right type of conversation given 291 00:16:33.759 --> 00:16:36.120 where we are in the life cycle of everything. Are 292 00:16:36.120 --> 00:16:40.200 there other mistakes that you've seen sellers make when they're 293 00:16:40.240 --> 00:16:42.000 trying to elevate those kinds. 294 00:16:41.799 --> 00:16:44.840 Yeah, well you know again one of them. Yeah, I 295 00:16:44.840 --> 00:16:47.320 guess it all kind of falls under not being prepared 296 00:16:47.879 --> 00:16:52.559 but seeing it as a checkbox in their qualification thing. Right, 297 00:16:52.600 --> 00:16:55.399 I just want to get there once and not having 298 00:16:55.559 --> 00:16:59.159 a purpose for the call that's meaningful to that executive. 299 00:17:00.000 --> 00:17:01.960 I mean, it doesn't take them very long to know 300 00:17:02.080 --> 00:17:05.480 that who am I dealing with here? In fact, ask 301 00:17:05.519 --> 00:17:08.960 yourself this, what's the conversation they're going to have with 302 00:17:09.039 --> 00:17:12.559 my champion after this call is over? Are they going 303 00:17:12.640 --> 00:17:15.519 to say, Wow, that was a great person to bring 304 00:17:15.559 --> 00:17:17.960 in here. Their company really knows what's going on, but 305 00:17:18.119 --> 00:17:21.279 they could really help us here. Or is the conversation 306 00:17:21.440 --> 00:17:24.680 the other end of the spectrum. Why did you waste 307 00:17:24.720 --> 00:17:28.359 my time with that? Don't ever bring someone like that 308 00:17:28.839 --> 00:17:32.160 in front of me again? What are we supposed to 309 00:17:32.200 --> 00:17:35.519 do with all that? And I think that's a lot 310 00:17:35.559 --> 00:17:40.640 of time the outcome unfortunately, when we're all about just 311 00:17:40.720 --> 00:17:43.640 have the executive meeting and that takes all kinds of forms. 312 00:17:43.920 --> 00:17:46.720 Great chel Back when I started so on the thing, 313 00:17:46.759 --> 00:17:49.960 we always said, well, my president, my CEO is going 314 00:17:50.039 --> 00:17:52.440 to be in town. They'd really like to stop by 315 00:17:52.480 --> 00:17:54.920 and see you. You know, I don't have time for that. 316 00:17:55.440 --> 00:17:59.200 What's the reason, what's going on? What's your expertise? It's 317 00:17:59.240 --> 00:18:02.359 always great I can have somebody do that positioning because 318 00:18:02.400 --> 00:18:05.079 remember this, Rachel, here's The other thing we know, when 319 00:18:05.119 --> 00:18:07.160 do most of us try and gain access to them 320 00:18:07.400 --> 00:18:10.799 when they're in that trough of engagement, they're not engaged anymore. 321 00:18:11.240 --> 00:18:14.240 All the research on calling on senior executives said the 322 00:18:14.240 --> 00:18:17.440 same thing. The only way you're going to get access 323 00:18:17.480 --> 00:18:20.920 to them only way like it works ninety five percent 324 00:18:20.920 --> 00:18:23.359 of the time, whereas everything else is a hit rate 325 00:18:23.400 --> 00:18:26.519 of about five to seven percent. Don't send them a book, 326 00:18:26.960 --> 00:18:29.799 don't get them tickets to the big game, don't take 327 00:18:29.839 --> 00:18:34.680 them to the no no, no, no. Someone they trust 328 00:18:35.079 --> 00:18:38.839 recommends that they meet with you. Whether that's you know, 329 00:18:38.880 --> 00:18:41.920 now we're back to the power of champion our networking. 330 00:18:42.440 --> 00:18:45.799 Someone they trust says, this is an issue you're dealing with, 331 00:18:46.160 --> 00:18:48.519 and you got to meet with these people over here. 332 00:18:49.160 --> 00:18:53.119 They're the best in the world at this ninety plus 333 00:18:53.160 --> 00:18:55.880 percent of the time, I think the last research was 334 00:18:55.960 --> 00:18:59.559 ninety five percent. That executive will take that meeting and 335 00:18:59.640 --> 00:19:02.680 then and we've got to align what we do accordingly, 336 00:19:03.079 --> 00:19:06.160 not just getting a check. You know, like we called 337 00:19:06.200 --> 00:19:09.640 on them so I could get by my opportunity coaching 338 00:19:09.720 --> 00:19:14.359 deal review session. Did you get with the executive? They say, yes, 339 00:19:14.720 --> 00:19:16.839 that's not what I want to know, what did you 340 00:19:16.920 --> 00:19:20.079 learn from that meeting? What did they learn? What's your 341 00:19:20.119 --> 00:19:22.880 next meeting with them? What are the top two or 342 00:19:22.880 --> 00:19:25.720 three things we need to focus on with them? That's 343 00:19:25.799 --> 00:19:28.880 what I want to know. Unfortunately, Rachel, those meetings go bad. 344 00:19:28.920 --> 00:19:31.440 So when you want to know, what's the mistake, it's 345 00:19:31.559 --> 00:19:34.400 it's kind of a version of not preparing, but not 346 00:19:34.480 --> 00:19:40.240 preparing correctly and probably being misguided in what the purpose 347 00:19:40.279 --> 00:19:43.599 of that meeting is or the endgame. The endgame is 348 00:19:43.640 --> 00:19:47.599 to influence the influencers thinking and help them see we're 349 00:19:47.680 --> 00:19:53.680 highly relevant and compelling. Relevant meaning we are seen as 350 00:19:53.720 --> 00:19:57.119 experts in the problem they have, relevant to what's going 351 00:19:57.160 --> 00:20:00.359 on with them right now, and compelling. We got point 352 00:20:00.359 --> 00:20:02.240 of view or a way of looking at it that's 353 00:20:02.319 --> 00:20:05.079 different than where they might have been thinking about it 354 00:20:05.240 --> 00:20:09.880 or that they've heard conventional thinking, and it's intriguing to them. 355 00:20:10.200 --> 00:20:13.720 That's the outcome that gives us a lot of things 356 00:20:13.720 --> 00:20:14.160 to think about. 357 00:20:14.200 --> 00:20:16.400 I love that concept of the you right. 358 00:20:16.960 --> 00:20:21.200 And if you were to give people listening a one takeaway, 359 00:20:21.880 --> 00:20:24.799 is it preparation? Is it the tailoring of the message 360 00:20:24.920 --> 00:20:26.680 to that point in time? 361 00:20:26.759 --> 00:20:29.799 What would your words way? I think, well, it's preparation 362 00:20:29.920 --> 00:20:34.279 and execution, right. But I think preparation is making sure 363 00:20:34.599 --> 00:20:39.480 that everything you would do is aligned with the strategic goals, 364 00:20:39.599 --> 00:20:43.440 the strategic priorities that are relevant to this person. That's 365 00:20:43.480 --> 00:20:47.359 our value proposition. We're experts in this. That's the whole 366 00:20:47.440 --> 00:20:51.240 be relevant side, be compelling. Have a point of view 367 00:20:51.359 --> 00:20:54.559 or perspective on that. It's not here's what my platform 368 00:20:54.599 --> 00:20:56.200 will do to be able to help you with that. 369 00:20:56.519 --> 00:20:59.839 It's here's what we've learned about that problem and the 370 00:21:00.039 --> 00:21:03.400 three or four challenges organizations have, and the three or 371 00:21:03.440 --> 00:21:05.880 four things you got to put in place to avoid that. 372 00:21:06.000 --> 00:21:08.920 I'm not talking about my platform. I'm talking about your 373 00:21:08.960 --> 00:21:12.440 world and your issue, and so it's be ready to 374 00:21:12.480 --> 00:21:15.799 give that. Very few selling organizations have a point of 375 00:21:15.839 --> 00:21:18.720 view on the problem. Like I said, they'll go in 376 00:21:18.759 --> 00:21:21.400 and say, hey, we can lower your risk, we can 377 00:21:21.480 --> 00:21:24.279 lower your costs, we can help you drive revenue. They 378 00:21:24.359 --> 00:21:29.119 don't finish the conversation. The conversation is, we can lower 379 00:21:29.160 --> 00:21:32.720 your risk because of the breaches you've had over the 380 00:21:32.799 --> 00:21:37.400 last five years. We can drive more revenue because you 381 00:21:37.519 --> 00:21:40.599 lack the ability to access data in a timely way 382 00:21:40.960 --> 00:21:42.920 to be able to make good decisions to pivot in 383 00:21:42.960 --> 00:21:46.519 the marketplace. So it's tying it back to the things 384 00:21:46.519 --> 00:21:50.480 that are strategically relevant. It's not just showed the business value. 385 00:21:50.799 --> 00:21:53.480 It showed the business value tied to their strategies and 386 00:21:53.559 --> 00:21:56.559 priorities one hundred percent. You know, one of the things 387 00:21:56.599 --> 00:21:58.720 we talk about, Rachel is what do they have in 388 00:21:58.759 --> 00:22:04.599 common level. You say, okay, they care about revenue, cost 389 00:22:05.079 --> 00:22:09.079 and risk. Yes, right, but that can put you on 390 00:22:09.119 --> 00:22:13.599 a slippery slope to assume, like a persona based selling approach. 391 00:22:14.079 --> 00:22:17.279 They've got this title, therefore they must care about these things. 392 00:22:17.799 --> 00:22:21.200 That's not guaranteed, especially in today. You know, you might 393 00:22:21.240 --> 00:22:24.240 be way off and you never get access again. What 394 00:22:24.400 --> 00:22:27.079 they care about one hundred percent of the time their 395 00:22:27.119 --> 00:22:31.400 growth strategies and priorities. So I would say it's better 396 00:22:31.559 --> 00:22:34.839 to not make a call unless you got some confirmation 397 00:22:34.960 --> 00:22:36.960 on those things first. That's preparation. 398 00:22:37.519 --> 00:22:38.920 Yeah, that's it. That's it. 399 00:22:39.359 --> 00:22:43.079 Lots to think through today, Tim. We tackle this topic frequently, 400 00:22:43.279 --> 00:22:46.640 but there's always a lot of angles around it. 401 00:22:46.720 --> 00:22:49.440