Speaker 1: Welcome to Breeders Sin again.
Speaker 2: So we're pretty excited today. You know, we've been doing
Speaker 2: a lot of early breeding talk, trying to source some
Speaker 2: of the history of how we got to where we
Speaker 2: are today. We've talked about breeding techniques, we talked about
Speaker 2: a bunch of early eighties and nineties seed banks. We
Speaker 2: focused on Neville quite a bit because he was one
Speaker 2: of the largest seed banks in the eighties. And we're
Speaker 2: pretty excited today because we have the other largest seed
Speaker 2: bank of the eighties, the Super Sativa Seed Club, which
Speaker 2: was next to Neville, the biggest seed bank in Holland
Speaker 2: at the time, and lots and lots of famous strains
Speaker 2: like William's Wonder and Beatrix Choice and things of that
Speaker 2: nature came out of their seed bank. And we're lucky
Speaker 2: in that the founder is still alive and well and
Speaker 2: was excited to talk to us. So we want to
Speaker 2: bring you a couple stage interview with Correll, who is
Speaker 2: the owner and founder of the Super Sativa Seed Club,
Speaker 2: and we're going to be asking him a lot of
Speaker 2: questions about the eighties, the style they were doing things,
Speaker 2: how he got certain strains, and really all the areas
Speaker 2: of interest we can think of. So this is kind
Speaker 2: of like the second big piece to eighty seed banks
Speaker 2: and modern breeding, and we're pretty excited. So here it is.
Speaker 2: Prepare you sou.
Speaker 3: Okay, let's go.
Speaker 1: So you are Carl, it's pronounced.
Speaker 3: Carl, Gottle, Gottle Carl.
Speaker 4: Yeahl It's an absolute pleasure to meet you. You're You're
Speaker 4: a legend in this business and a lot of us
Speaker 4: would love, would love to have.
Speaker 1: This opportunity to speak with you. So I it's an honor.
Speaker 5: Okay, Okay, take it easy, man, I'm just a guy
Speaker 5: of flesh and blue.
Speaker 1: Yeah, same here.
Speaker 4: But it's really cool to be able to have this
Speaker 4: opportunity to ask you some questions about the history of SSSC.
Speaker 1: So where would you like to start?
Speaker 5: Yeah, maybe, Yeah, it's a long time ago already, of course.
Speaker 5: And nineteen eighty five we started, yeah, and those days, yeah,
Speaker 5: we were squalls and we were well like you are, man, really, yeah,
Speaker 5: we were activists and.
Speaker 3: Our idea was to.
Speaker 5: Yeah because in those days and all of it was
Speaker 5: not legal to grow, but it was like a little bit,
Speaker 5: it was not it was not a big deal to
Speaker 5: do it, and not not many people did it. And
Speaker 5: so yeah, we started to grow. And actually we learned
Speaker 5: about growing and their metal hell out lights from people
Speaker 5: who went to the States and they saw it there.
Speaker 3: Oh wow. Yeah.
Speaker 5: I worked in those days in a coffee shop and
Speaker 5: a friend of us he went to the States and
Speaker 5: and and.
Speaker 3: And he saw how how you guys did this?
Speaker 5: And nobody in those days did this in Holand, And
Speaker 5: so I thought, yeah, let's give it a try. And
Speaker 5: I think we'd we were the first in Holland to
Speaker 5: grow on the on the metal highlights.
Speaker 1: In those days, it was that's amazing.
Speaker 3: Yeah yeah.
Speaker 5: And then so we were we are we're looking to
Speaker 5: left close to the big horticulture centrum of Holland, the
Speaker 5: west Land because the Holands it is really we are
Speaker 5: the number one.
Speaker 3: In the world horticulture things.
Speaker 5: Yes, so I have we decided to start is the
Speaker 5: only problem we had.
Speaker 3: We didn't have any seats.
Speaker 1: Oh so how do how do you start sourcing your
Speaker 1: seats and your lines? What makes you choose what you do?
Speaker 5: Yeah, because the thing is, in those days the cannabis
Speaker 5: was only from the tropical countries and it was all
Speaker 5: seeded with a lot of seeds. So if you tried
Speaker 5: those seats and alland they didn't. They didn't didn't flowering
Speaker 5: time because we are quite new. And then those the
Speaker 5: certifty are from the ecuators and so we didn't have success,
Speaker 5: really not. And but one of the guys he went
Speaker 5: to the States, one of our friends, because we needed seeds,
Speaker 5: and he went to New York and he had to
Speaker 5: short and offense.
Speaker 3: I better I don't call the name because it's yeah, yeah,
Speaker 3: And then he said, now, man, we don't have seats.
Speaker 3: But he said, yeah, but I come from Holland and I.
Speaker 5: Came especially to you to to pick up some seats.
Speaker 5: And after one week he said, okay, okay, okay, we
Speaker 5: will give you some seats.
Speaker 3: And those were the William Wonder seats.
Speaker 1: So those came out of New York. Yes, that's fascinating, yes.
Speaker 5: And so then we started to grow those seats and
Speaker 5: then we will be had quite not a big success,
Speaker 5: but a little bit success. And after a while, the
Speaker 5: famous the screen man you've heard from, of course, and
Speaker 5: he came to live in Holland and and he contatacted.
Speaker 5: He contacted us because he thought, when I live in Holland,
Speaker 5: I have to be in touch with the seed guys.
Speaker 5: And those days, you had Neville seat bank and we
Speaker 5: were the second one, so there were basically two seat
Speaker 5: banks in the world.
Speaker 3: Sam and Sam.
Speaker 5: He came to we became in contact with him, and
Speaker 5: he told us, yeah, and I come here to live
Speaker 5: in Aland, but I don't have a place to grow
Speaker 5: and maybe you can help me or whatever. And he said,
Speaker 5: I have a nice collection of seats because he did
Speaker 5: a lot of breathing already in the state.
Speaker 3: And his number one thing was skunk number one. This
Speaker 3: was really the.
Speaker 5: Yeah, the first variety in the world that really somebody
Speaker 5: took the effort to him bred it and to to
Speaker 5: to to make a selection out of a big group
Speaker 5: and basically so we were very happy with those seats.
Speaker 5: And he had something from his private status as well,
Speaker 5: and he said, this is my private thing, but there
Speaker 5: are only twenty seats left. So yeah, he gave us
Speaker 5: some seats and those were the hay seeds.
Speaker 1: The hay seeds, so he told you some of the
Speaker 1: original hay seeds.
Speaker 5: Yes, yes, So he had twenty seeds and he gave
Speaker 5: ten to us, and he gave ten to to Neville.
Speaker 1: These were from the same batch.
Speaker 3: You were from the same bags. And I said, there's
Speaker 3: those seeds.
Speaker 5: They were already like ten years old, and he said,
Speaker 5: this is really we need to germinate them because because
Speaker 5: and I gave it to you because you understand how
Speaker 5: to do it, and so we can see the safety seeds.
Speaker 5: And we were not really we tried to hate but
Speaker 5: we did not like it because it took too long
Speaker 5: to flower and it was very small birds. And at
Speaker 5: the same time, we were very glad with the scream
Speaker 5: number one seeds because we were used to the fluffy
Speaker 5: sativas that were from South Africa, from Jamaica, from so
Speaker 5: we were really happy to see the big buds of
Speaker 5: the skirk number.
Speaker 1: One and it was.
Speaker 5: Really a lot of resin and a lot of smell,
Speaker 5: and but we decided to make a cross between skunk
Speaker 5: number one and the UH and one of the haze
Speaker 5: the hages we had left, and from this cross we
Speaker 5: made a big selection and it's then we were very
Speaker 5: happy to find one with correct correct the smell and
Speaker 5: the taste of the haze and and the butt structure
Speaker 5: of the skirt number one. So that was really happy
Speaker 5: that we could grow hazes with it. Yeah, and dig
Speaker 5: thick fat birds. And the nice thing about this. I
Speaker 5: still have this plant and it's now twenty five years
Speaker 5: old and we we still have it, and it's it's
Speaker 5: our flag ship thing, of course, and we have now
Speaker 5: based a lot of our crosses on.
Speaker 3: We made it with this old school hazes we call it, and.
Speaker 5: It's smell else like cat bis and it's really a dark,
Speaker 5: dirty taste, but it's it's a very uplifting high and
Speaker 5: it's really uh yeah, it's a really nice plant. It's
Speaker 5: very difficult to grow because if you make a mistake,
Speaker 5: if your room gets too hot, it starts to flower again.
Speaker 5: And it's really a matter of of yeah, it's it's
Speaker 5: it's it's.
Speaker 3: A difficult thing to do.
Speaker 1: I can't believe that that's still around.
Speaker 4: That's amazing, that's absolutely and you're still using it in
Speaker 4: your current breeding program.
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 5: And uh we stopped with the super Sativa seat clip
Speaker 5: after about five years because it was really too it
Speaker 5: became a little bit too successful.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I know what you mean.
Speaker 5: And in those days it was really yeah, we were
Speaker 5: a bit afraid of Ronald Reagan. The water and drugs
Speaker 5: was going on really strong in those days. So basically
Speaker 5: we quit the super Sativa seat club. But I I
Speaker 5: captain growing and doing doing cannabis in all different ways.
Speaker 5: And like three or four years ago my two sons,
Speaker 5: I have two sons their growers as well. That I
Speaker 5: let's do it again, man, Why don't you do it?
Speaker 5: Because everybody knows you and some people think you are
Speaker 5: the legend.
Speaker 3: So do it again.
Speaker 5: So we started again, and and yeah, there's now quite successful.
Speaker 5: And now in Holland we are also getting a situation
Speaker 5: of of legal growing because in Holland we have also
Speaker 5: always been on the forefront of the of the growing. Sure,
Speaker 5: but but yeah we lost a little bit because you
Speaker 5: guys are doing it very good of course now in
Speaker 5: the in the States and in the legal situation and
Speaker 5: and a lot of and a lot of states. So
Speaker 5: Holland caun't can't stay behind man, because we are the
Speaker 5: ones who we spilled out to do the cannabis thing. Yeah,
Speaker 5: and now we are lucky. We started a lobby in
Speaker 5: Holland and we also try to to change the law.
Speaker 5: We basically wrote a law together with the Dutch government
Speaker 5: and now there is going to be a big like
Speaker 5: a trial and the Dutch government has given out ten
Speaker 5: permits to grow legal for the Dutch coffee shops.
Speaker 3: Oh wow.
Speaker 5: And we were glad, we were lucky to want one
Speaker 5: of the pyramids, because one hundred and fifty people applied
Speaker 5: for the pyramid and only ten pyermits. So and like
Speaker 5: from one hundred and fifty people, one hundred didn't make
Speaker 5: it because the plan was not good enough and they
Speaker 5: were not because you need to do to to comply
Speaker 5: with a lot of rules, because you need to know
Speaker 5: about cannabis. You need to have the money you need
Speaker 5: to have to grow and a big skill. You need
Speaker 5: good contact with the coffee shops.
Speaker 3: And we all have this.
Speaker 5: So now we are very happy because then we can
Speaker 5: do our breeding really because we have done the breeding
Speaker 5: all always in the illegalea here. So you can imagine
Speaker 5: that it's for us difficult because we like to see it.
Speaker 5: But it's also a little bit difficult to see that
Speaker 5: people like exotic mic exoter genetics is really they can
Speaker 5: they can work in the legal situation now for over three,
Speaker 5: four or five years and you can see the results.
Speaker 4: And yeah, he has a lot of people making seat
Speaker 4: for him everywhere all over.
Speaker 5: Yeah, yeah, yeah, and yeah and then and hold on
Speaker 5: to we we still have the like the strains, difficult
Speaker 5: strains to grow.
Speaker 3: The special turb turb profiles, and.
Speaker 5: Yeah, that's what we want to go for something different
Speaker 5: because it's cookie.
Speaker 3: It's cookie everywhere nowadays.
Speaker 4: I surely hope you guys stick with some of the
Speaker 4: base old stuff because that's what we need. Nobody wants
Speaker 4: cookies anymore over here. Everybody's hired cookies.
Speaker 3: Yeah really yeah, because over here it's still new.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's still new over there, right, Like it's.
Speaker 5: And like a strange but also in a comic situation
Speaker 5: in that we we we went to the States to
Speaker 5: get the seats, then we grow, we did a lot
Speaker 5: of breeding and things, then we sold it back to
Speaker 5: the States, and now the States is doing very well
Speaker 5: and now we have to go to the States again to.
Speaker 4: So can help there in that situation because we have
Speaker 4: everything over here and you don't have to fly out
Speaker 4: to get it, you understand it.
Speaker 5: So that's that's nice that it's going all over the world.
Speaker 5: And the idea of of the Shuper Sativa seat clip
Speaker 5: was because we were very politically involved with Our idea
Speaker 5: was to to help the States. Is a little bit
Speaker 5: strange to say, but we were in this position that
Speaker 5: we could do the semi legal our things.
Speaker 3: And in those days you had a lot of people
Speaker 3: coming back from Vietnam.
Speaker 5: Those were our clients, you know, because they they ordered
Speaker 5: the seats from US, and they were the ones.
Speaker 3: Who really did a lot of Garelia farming.
Speaker 5: And in the California where it's still going in the
Speaker 5: same place where it's.
Speaker 3: Now all so our divas.
Speaker 5: When we sell the seats to a lot of different
Speaker 5: people in the US, there will be a lot of
Speaker 5: different a lot of refrigerating refrigerators stocked with seeds. So
Speaker 5: for the government, it's quite difficult to stop this, you know,
Speaker 5: because it's spreading everywhere, and and in those days you
Speaker 5: didn't have the Internet, and it's if you live in
Speaker 5: a certain city, okay, you can spread the seeds, give
Speaker 5: this to your friends, but it's a bit difficult when
Speaker 5: you live in California to to to make sure that
Speaker 5: also the people in tanks, US or Alaska. So we
Speaker 5: we our idea was to to spread it everywhere with
Speaker 5: the idea this is not going to stop anymore.
Speaker 3: Then.
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's it's a beautiful idea.
Speaker 4: It's like Johnny apple Seed modern day Johnny apple seed.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 5: And also we did we were not in for the money,
Speaker 5: because we we we did we we we really were
Speaker 5: in for the love of the plant and we still are.
Speaker 5: And of course the money was nice, but because our
Speaker 5: business model was a little bit strange, because people from
Speaker 5: the States had to send people money to the to
Speaker 5: Holland without knowing who who we are.
Speaker 3: And and and and then they had to twisters that
Speaker 3: we sent.
Speaker 5: The seeds back to them. Absolutely, in the first few years,
Speaker 5: people were a little bit reluctant to send us money
Speaker 5: because yeah, maybe who are we?
Speaker 3: Nobody knew.
Speaker 5: And so at one point people from High Times they
Speaker 5: came to came to interview ers because we weren and
Speaker 5: and and High Times, and they thought, oh man.
Speaker 3: This is really this is this is for real. Yes,
Speaker 3: so they make it.
Speaker 5: They made a nice cover story about us, and from
Speaker 5: those days it's really it really exploded.
Speaker 1: You yeah.
Speaker 3: Yeah, and then we got we go be cat like.
Speaker 5: People from all the from everywhere in the world ordering seats,
Speaker 5: and we thought this is really getting too big, and
Speaker 5: we quited this because it was getting a little bit
Speaker 5: out of hands.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, it got a little hot.
Speaker 5: Because and a lot of people from Japan from Australia,
Speaker 5: from Canada, from everybody to start to order seats because
Speaker 5: it was really the first We really were the first
Speaker 5: ones to do this and it was a big, big success,
Speaker 5: and we were.
Speaker 3: Robert CoML Clark.
Speaker 5: You know him as well, I think, oh yes, he
Speaker 5: told also always the wisest thing you did is quick
Speaker 5: with this.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 1: We saw what happened with Neville. We saw what happened it.
Speaker 5: Yeah, yeah, yeah, so it's really u and now now
Speaker 5: now yeah, yeah, we're still going strong and we are
Speaker 5: still loving the plants and we we are still very
Speaker 5: happy to to make combinations with the new things from
Speaker 5: the States with our old stuff, and a lot of
Speaker 5: things turned out very well because we like to have
Speaker 5: We like the layer taste, you know. Yeah, if we
Speaker 5: do something with hayes, we can keep the haze taste,
Speaker 5: but also we can.
Speaker 3: Combine it with like Aurelia glue or whatever.
Speaker 5: And it makes me really a thing that we like
Speaker 5: that it's not one taste, but a lot of different
Speaker 5: tastes in one variety. And yeah, and we are not
Speaker 5: so afraid of doing things like twelve each of flowering,
Speaker 5: because yeah, a lot of people are afraid to do
Speaker 5: this any days. It's difficult, but it's really worth waiting
Speaker 5: a few weeks extra.
Speaker 4: Americans are finally being more receptive to long flowering strains.
Speaker 1: As of the past.
Speaker 4: Maybe two or three years, I've noticed hazes are finally
Speaker 4: starting to pick up in the US, whereas they were
Speaker 4: never a staple here in Santa Cruz in the you know,
Speaker 4: late sixties, early seventies, mid seventies. But nowadays people want that,
Speaker 4: they want a little bit of that that trippy Colombian
Speaker 4: and yeah.
Speaker 5: Yeah, yeah, because we also we work together with age
Speaker 5: seeds as well, do you know, as oh yeah, oh yeah, yeah.
Speaker 3: That's what these are our friends as well.
Speaker 1: And they're really good company.
Speaker 5: They have they really have like these super strong shativas
Speaker 5: and and and and now like in in the legal
Speaker 5: situation and in the US, I do not understand why
Speaker 5: people are afraid to from a longer flowery time, because
Speaker 5: if you have the space to do this, I can
Speaker 5: imagine in the illegal situation, and you don't have much space,
Speaker 5: it's a bit yeah, of course, and I can imagine
Speaker 5: that you want to speed up things.
Speaker 3: In a little bit.
Speaker 5: But but what I have seen always is it takes
Speaker 5: four weeks longer to finish, but they yield and.
Speaker 1: Get there exactly more.
Speaker 3: Yeah, so at the end of.
Speaker 5: The day your results are exactly the same as when
Speaker 5: you grow short flowering varieties.
Speaker 3: Sure, because the big.
Speaker 5: The what we and hold on to always say, the
Speaker 5: modern Americans strange, they lack yield, they lack weight.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, absolutely.
Speaker 5: That's why we try to make crosses with the new
Speaker 5: American strains to to.
Speaker 3: Get to make plants with the bigger yields. Yes, because
Speaker 3: it's a TVs. You know how they how they flower.
Speaker 5: The birds are arm length and yes, and then the
Speaker 5: cookies you have a bird make if you don't have
Speaker 5: anything in another bird, it's nice, but it doesn't bring
Speaker 5: weight in the scale.
Speaker 4: Yeah, No, there's cookies is very low yielding. And yeah,
Speaker 4: the high doesn't last too long either. So a good
Speaker 4: haze hybrid with the cookies would be awesome, you know,
Speaker 4: bring much better Hi, the cookies that isn't there?
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 1: So I asked the questions for you, Do you.
Speaker 4: Have a lot of good a good memory for like
Speaker 4: where you source certain things or the history of certain
Speaker 4: strains that you put out.
Speaker 5: Not sure not Not that that's a bit of a problem,
Speaker 5: because did the old school has the clone. We still
Speaker 5: have and I'm in touch with in Canadia a lot
Speaker 5: of people they still have the free lamp Indiga.
Speaker 3: Yes, yes, it was very famous.
Speaker 5: Almost people told me that a lot of people from
Speaker 5: fifty sixty years old now that they started, when they
Speaker 5: started to smoke, they all started with Freeland Indiga.
Speaker 3: It was over. There was a really big thing. Yeah.
Speaker 5: Now today I talked with somebody from Canada and he
Speaker 5: knows a guy in the.
Speaker 3: US who still has the Beatrix Jewish and thirty three.
Speaker 5: And the thing is and in so many years, a
Speaker 5: lot of things happened, so to be honest, I lost
Speaker 5: a little bit track of.
Speaker 3: Where everything thing is now.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and and and in.
Speaker 3: Those days we'll be basically samk Man of us.
Speaker 5: He provided us with seeds and a lot of seeds
Speaker 5: we we we we just took from from the bags
Speaker 5: of wet that we that we yeah, that we bought
Speaker 5: in the coffee shops. And in those days, but we
Speaker 5: were we had the coffige in Amsterdam. We had the
Speaker 5: coffee shop. It was called Durban Poison, Yes, and the
Speaker 5: only sold cannabis from South Africa. Yes, So we made
Speaker 5: a lot of crosses with the Durban Poison because it's
Speaker 5: just South African is also it's far to the southern
Speaker 5: the world, so the flowering period is more or less
Speaker 5: the same as we have in Aland yes, this was
Speaker 5: very nice to make crosses between Skink number one Durban
Speaker 5: Poison and then and then we gave it a nice
Speaker 5: name and it was.
Speaker 3: Like our variety and it was not the deal because
Speaker 3: it was really.
Speaker 5: We took the seats from the backs and we grew them,
Speaker 5: and we we pollinated the one that we like best,
Speaker 5: and we had a new variety because in those days
Speaker 5: it was not really in breading. Yeah, we did not
Speaker 5: really do that because, to be honest to the month
Speaker 5: for our seats were so big that we even didn't
Speaker 5: have time to do this, you know.
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, I understand that.
Speaker 3: Yeah. So yeah.
Speaker 4: One thing that's been happening in the US the past
Speaker 4: maybe fifteen years since I've been around, I've noticed there
Speaker 4: is a and this is unfortunate, seriously unfortunate, but every
Speaker 4: two or three years, someone will come up and pretend
Speaker 4: to have a big collection of all the SSSC stuff, yeah,
Speaker 4: and then sell it and it's all fake.
Speaker 2: You know.
Speaker 4: It just happened to be a trix choice. Someone just
Speaker 4: popped up with fake be a trix choice. That's probably
Speaker 4: what you're referring to. That's not anyone's collections over here.
Speaker 3: You know who we at Trixation.
Speaker 4: Oh yeah, oh yeah, yeah we we We've studied your
Speaker 4: strains for so many years. The Williams Wonder clone is
Speaker 4: still out here, that that cloning is still available. Yeah,
Speaker 4: there's still seeds. Every once in a while you'll find
Speaker 4: Williams Wonder seeds that are pure Okay, thirty nine still
Speaker 4: around Freeland, still around.
Speaker 3: A famous one. Yeah yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 5: Because in Canada, I went to visit Canada and then
Speaker 5: the guy he showed me the Freeland Indiga, and then
Speaker 5: I was really like, there is of course a lot
Speaker 5: of things happened in all those years and is becoming
Speaker 5: better and better.
Speaker 3: And I was not really very proud to see the
Speaker 3: Freeland the Indiga.
Speaker 5: I was, I thought, this is not really but we
Speaker 5: like those days and these days, you know. But but
Speaker 5: I think it's more especially are the hate things, because
Speaker 5: the hate is really something something different, and it's also.
Speaker 3: For me as the owner of the SUPERSTITIVI clip.
Speaker 5: It's sometimes funny that people tell me things that I
Speaker 5: myself even thought, know, you know, sure, yeah you.
Speaker 3: Can imagine that because we had a lot of different varieties.
Speaker 5: And yeah, for us, it's different than then for for
Speaker 5: the collectors. You know, it's really but I really like
Speaker 5: it to hear that a lot of people are still
Speaker 5: trying to find the roots from cannabis, you know, because
Speaker 5: it's basically it's basically even Neville of course a little
Speaker 5: bit more than we did. And and because he was
Speaker 5: really the first one and he we were the second ones,
Speaker 5: and it's all heads for Neville. He's not anymore with
Speaker 5: us any you know.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I was friends with him.
Speaker 5: Yeah, yeah, yeah, it's a pity. But the nice thing
Speaker 5: is also that we we we we got some of
Speaker 5: his last work in clone form.
Speaker 3: Yeah, we have the Outback Hayes.
Speaker 5: Okay, that's the one he made in Australia when he
Speaker 5: lived in Australia.
Speaker 1: Yeah, can get Ian made all those for him?
Speaker 3: Oh yeah, I don't know.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, yeah, it was one of my good friends.
Speaker 1: We were all working together during that.
Speaker 3: Time, okay, okay, yeah yeah.
Speaker 5: And then we also go have the hate she um
Speaker 5: hm oh nice, yeah, yeah, it's and we have also
Speaker 5: the Annal five times had the real the clone that
Speaker 5: he he selected him from a lot of plans.
Speaker 3: I really don't know.
Speaker 1: Oh so like that is, I think it's the A
Speaker 1: five or five A.
Speaker 5: Five No, no, no, no, no, what the A five
Speaker 5: and five we all have?
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, yeah, but because the thing.
Speaker 5: I'm from a London in the south of Hollander, there's
Speaker 5: a group of people who still have all those things,
Speaker 5: and they yeah, and and and in the hate world,
Speaker 5: it's still a little bit nobody owns this.
Speaker 4: You know, yeah, of course, yeah, people think they do.
Speaker 3: This is like we are like.
Speaker 5: Activists, you know, we we think. I I don't believe
Speaker 5: in owning screens and.
Speaker 1: Owning absolutely I agree.
Speaker 3: Not everybody agrees with this, but no.
Speaker 1: Not everybody does agree with that.
Speaker 3: Of course.
Speaker 5: And I of course when somebody puts a lot of
Speaker 5: effort in him breathing a strain or working a strain
Speaker 5: like many years, then he can then I consider it
Speaker 5: that he owns it.
Speaker 4: Yeah, correct if it if it's if it's long, bread
Speaker 4: and selected and a lot of working into it.
Speaker 1: Right now, gorilla glue is going after everyone.
Speaker 5: Yeah, and also at the point, but when somebody is
Speaker 5: selling in a seat bank a regular seat. Yeah, then
Speaker 5: I own it that well, if he sells it, I think.
Speaker 1: Yeah, exactly if you're buying it, if you're buying the genetics.
Speaker 5: Right, yeah, because if you don't want to sell the genetics,
Speaker 5: you have to feminize it or whatever.
Speaker 4: And even then, I mean, if someone feminizes your your feminize.
Speaker 1: Seeds, then you're just ask it out of luck because
Speaker 1: you've sold it.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 5: Yeah, So so I'm not really busy in protecting the genetics.
Speaker 5: And and then maybe because I also want to ask
Speaker 5: you questions of course, yeah, because do you see do
Speaker 5: you see things happening in the States like that people
Speaker 5: are trying to protect strains or genetics.
Speaker 4: Yeah, people are trying to patent feminization techniques that they
Speaker 4: had nothing to do with creating. People are trying to
Speaker 4: patent strains as quickly as they can, trademark strain names
Speaker 4: like tochikush.
Speaker 3: But but but names. It's different things because.
Speaker 4: Yeah, but the plant varieties, we can't plant patent them yet.
Speaker 4: But there are many people at the forefront of that
Speaker 4: trying to get it the second that it happens, and
Speaker 4: it'll be a problem, it will definitely be.
Speaker 3: How what are they trying to do then, because and
Speaker 3: all on you have, like.
Speaker 5: Because we have a lot of horticulture flowers and everything,
Speaker 5: you can you can patent if you can, you can
Speaker 5: own this train as long as as it is different
Speaker 5: and a lot of expects than any other scrain.
Speaker 1: Sure.
Speaker 3: The second thing.
Speaker 5: You have to do is you have to be able
Speaker 5: to reproduce it, and that means if you have under
Speaker 5: seats of this strain, all the plants.
Speaker 3: Have to be the same uniforms, so ib L informed,
Speaker 3: and also the next time you show them have to
Speaker 3: be the same. Again.
Speaker 4: Yeah, I don't think anyone in the US, except for
Speaker 4: maybe CSI, Humble and a few others seven H seven
Speaker 4: seed Bank, there's only probably two or three people who
Speaker 4: are capable of even producing seed lines like that let alone.
Speaker 4: So I don't think many people are really going to
Speaker 4: be getting the patents. There's some breeders up in BC
Speaker 4: that have been doing it very seriously and big for
Speaker 4: a long time that'll probably be looking for that in
Speaker 4: their country.
Speaker 5: Because to give you an example, if you like in
Speaker 5: hold of we have a lot of big seat companies tomato.
Speaker 3: Seats and everything.
Speaker 5: Yeah, yeah, if you buy a kilo tomato seats you're
Speaker 5: buying fifty thousand seats, and if you grow those fifty
Speaker 5: thousand plants, they are all one hundred.
Speaker 3: Percent the same.
Speaker 1: Yeah, uniform UNI, and.
Speaker 3: There's not one marijuana straight around that it's unit for.
Speaker 4: Them, you know, No, it's and I don't know that
Speaker 4: marijuana can be brought to uniformity because environment takes such
Speaker 4: a big factor in expression.
Speaker 5: Yeah, and also of course because of the multi multi,
Speaker 5: multiple hybrids exactly. I mean, I know for sure that
Speaker 5: in the cookies there is something from us.
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, I guarantee it.
Speaker 5: And for sure there is some Skirk number one in it,
Speaker 5: except the screen ban always told me everything.
Speaker 4: I think we know exactly what cookies is now. It's
Speaker 4: very it's it's a simple, simple little thing. But to
Speaker 4: break it down to its base components, it's going to
Speaker 4: be something like skunk one after any one.
Speaker 3: Yeah, And I like it. I really like it. The
Speaker 3: smell and the taste, and I really.
Speaker 5: Want to say, good work guys who did to the
Speaker 5: guys who did it.
Speaker 1: It was an accident.
Speaker 5: But it is of course difficult to make this uniform
Speaker 5: because in the cookies, let's say the cookies that are
Speaker 5: maybe like twenty five different varieties.
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, easy, easy, sure.
Speaker 5: And those like the skunk number one is all is
Speaker 5: already those already have like five yeah right in it.
Speaker 4: Yes, And then you bring in more parents with all
Speaker 4: their backgrounds and grandparents, and.
Speaker 5: Then it's the hybridization is like there are one million swings.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think exactly.
Speaker 4: I try to keep it to the when in my work,
Speaker 4: I like to keep it to a baseline like a
Speaker 4: bass afghany or a base something.
Speaker 1: Like that, you know, and cross it to it may
Speaker 1: be a polyhybrid.
Speaker 4: So it brings that down dramatically, you know, like it's
Speaker 4: easier to breed and line breed from it into life.
Speaker 3: And the super City seats, we are not really putting
Speaker 3: putting a lot.
Speaker 5: Of efforts in and in breeding and everything because sure,
Speaker 5: what we like is when I buy seats, I like
Speaker 5: to do pheno hunting. Yeah, and pheno hunting. Yeah, that's
Speaker 5: a nice thing. When we make a cross with our race,
Speaker 5: then you will find a lot of different things and
Speaker 5: one of the plants is really something special, you know.
Speaker 3: Oh sure, and that's what that's what what I like.
Speaker 5: And did the big LPs, Yeah, they want they tried
Speaker 5: to sell to buy seas and then they think, then
Speaker 5: we have a uniform group. But I always tell them
Speaker 5: police man do pheno hunting and I look for a
Speaker 5: nice mother and grew from there.
Speaker 4: Yeah, because I have I have a quick question for you.
Speaker 4: There's been some myths and stories over the years. One
Speaker 4: of the stories that came up recently and someone made
Speaker 4: a seed company off of was UH saying that they
Speaker 4: were breeding for you in Virginia to make your skunk one.
Speaker 3: No, that's not true.
Speaker 1: That's not true. I didn't think it was true, but
Speaker 1: I had to ask because it's.
Speaker 3: One of the thing that is Sam the skring Man.
Speaker 5: He made the screwing number one, and he made him
Speaker 5: made it in California, and he was really the first
Speaker 5: guy in the world to UH, to to grow in
Speaker 5: a big greenhouse and to do real to do real breathing,
Speaker 5: you know. And and then basically the Scoot number one,
Speaker 5: the original one is there are basically two phenotypes and
Speaker 5: one with the with the pointed B and one with
Speaker 5: the round. And the smell and the taste, they were
Speaker 5: all really quite uniform. And that was his work. And
Speaker 5: in all and in those days, all the breathing was
Speaker 5: done with Skoot number.
Speaker 3: One because.
Speaker 6: Big but and it was really it's it's scoot number
Speaker 6: one in the eighties and nineties was in every plant.
Speaker 4: Can we ask you the history on Beatrice choice, because
Speaker 4: again you brought it up earlier and it's one that
Speaker 4: people like, Is there a certain history on it?
Speaker 2: No?
Speaker 3: Not really. The only thing is a bit. But to
Speaker 3: be honest, I really I even don't remember. There's been
Speaker 3: a long time. The course that we made. We made.
Speaker 3: The only thing is that we remember.
Speaker 5: We why we put the name on it that that
Speaker 5: that's what what I what was the name from? Yeah,
Speaker 5: because Beatrix is the queen of Holland, and so we
Speaker 5: thought in those days, like you like your tea shirt, man,
Speaker 5: we were like this in those days. In those days,
Speaker 5: and we had one Victor Barn Do you know Victor
Speaker 5: b Yeah. Yeah, that's a nice story to tell because
Speaker 5: in those days we had in Holland and Lockhat Affair
Speaker 5: and the lock Hit that was like the company who
Speaker 5: built airplanes. Yeah, yeah, yeah, and the lock Hit.
Speaker 3: So our the.
Speaker 5: Husband of our queen was Prince Bernard, and he was
Speaker 5: he was like a naughty guy. He was doing he
Speaker 5: had a lot of different wives and he was doing
Speaker 5: a lot of different things, and he made he made
Speaker 5: a deal with lock Heat and he said, I will
Speaker 5: make sure that the Dutch government is going to buy
Speaker 5: your airplanes.
Speaker 3: You have to pay me ten million dollar for this
Speaker 3: and lok.
Speaker 5: He he did that, but he has this this Prince
Speaker 5: Bernard had to use a fake name to open a
Speaker 5: bank account to put the to let Lock.
Speaker 3: He put this.
Speaker 5: Ten million dollar on his bank account and he used
Speaker 5: the fake name Victor Bard.
Speaker 1: Oh that's funny. I didn't know that.
Speaker 3: So that's was like a little bit like this with them.
Speaker 5: You know, I love that you're telling you that we
Speaker 5: can't go with Are you doing these kind of things?
Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, yeah, I'm very I'm I'm very politically active here.
Speaker 4: Our government is very especially in California. Certain areas of California,
Speaker 4: you're still very illegal. Like a lot of people don't
Speaker 4: know that, Like they think California, they think legal state.
Speaker 4: I'm in a part of California that's the Bible Belt.
Speaker 4: So despite any laws, our county has overridden the laws.
Speaker 1: And if you get caught growing, you're fucked. You go
Speaker 1: to fucking jail, you're done, you know. So we're still
Speaker 1: very politically if you're trying to fight a lot of that.
Speaker 4: Everything's still done very clandestine, black market in most of
Speaker 4: the states.
Speaker 3: Okay, yeah, I know, I know, I know.
Speaker 5: I'm very good friends with the people for Hamble Seats.
Speaker 5: Oh yeah, and they always tell me, Man, everybody thinks
Speaker 5: it's legal, but it's still it's it's not legal at all.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's scary, scary in some places.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 5: So now for me, the circle is a little bit
Speaker 5: wrong because I started this thing more or less, and
Speaker 5: now I'm very happy that that I'm part of the
Speaker 5: group that got to permit to grow.
Speaker 3: Legal in Hollands. You know.
Speaker 5: Yeah, for me, it's like, uh, the circle is wrong.
Speaker 2: All right. So what you just saw there was you
Speaker 2: saw the first part of our interview with Correl from
Speaker 2: Super Sativa Seed Club. Matt I wasn't unable to make it,
Speaker 2: and so Matt did the first one. We had a
Speaker 2: series of follow up questions and ideas, and so Correll
Speaker 2: was kind enough to come back and chat with us again.
Speaker 2: It's possible this might be ongoing, but for now we
Speaker 2: have a two part series. So the first was Matt,
Speaker 2: the second will be primarily me, although Matt might be
Speaker 2: in it for a minute, and after that we'll have
Speaker 2: some commentary where we talk about what we learned and
Speaker 2: what we were excited about hearing Matt and and a
Speaker 2: lot of others. You know, we read, we read the catalogs,
Speaker 2: We talk and talk about various things. But we're all
Speaker 2: a little younger to have actually experienced like basically you
Speaker 2: and the seed Bank kind of starting off like oh
Speaker 2: that's one okay, kind of like you know, you, you
Speaker 2: and Neville at the seed Bank, you two kind of
Speaker 2: started off what we consider to be like the modern
Speaker 2: seed era. Right like before you we were really curious
Speaker 2: as to like certain questions. You know, for instance, you
Speaker 2: know you you mentioned before when did you when did
Speaker 2: you first start seeing like Americans come in and bringing
Speaker 2: their seed lines like Skunk one and and the Durban
Speaker 2: or afghany one or these different things.
Speaker 3: Yes, we started in eighty five.
Speaker 5: And yeah, one year or so, this Sam, the Skreing Man,
Speaker 5: he came to Holland to live in Holland. And yeah,
Speaker 5: he wrote a letter because we were running an ad
Speaker 5: an advertisement in High Times magazine and Neville and the
Speaker 5: Seat Bank did it as well. So Sam told that
Speaker 5: when I go to Holland, I let's who copied those
Speaker 5: two guys, and let's talk about seats. And I told
Speaker 5: met the last time in those bays, we didn't have
Speaker 5: much seats. The only seats we had were from from
Speaker 5: backs of cheats maybe that we bought at the coffee shops,
Speaker 5: and it was all Sativa's.
Speaker 3: And so basically, Sam the skreing Man.
Speaker 5: Brought all the seats from the US to Amsterdam, and
Speaker 5: of course the next one was Robert o' clark and
Speaker 5: a friend of Sam screwing Man.
Speaker 3: And after the a few more came.
Speaker 5: And the nice thing about it is the seats came
Speaker 5: from the US to Amsterdam.
Speaker 3: Then we started to send it to the US again.
Speaker 5: And now it's again that we u looking to the
Speaker 5: US to buy seats again from from you guys. It's
Speaker 5: we were first more liberal than you were, yah, and
Speaker 5: eighty five that it never has been legal let go
Speaker 5: in Holland.
Speaker 3: But in eighty five in those.
Speaker 7: In the beginning, no, there's not a lot of people
Speaker 7: that knew about cannabis, and so basically we had we
Speaker 7: could do what we want because nobody knew about it,
Speaker 7: and nobody even.
Speaker 3: The police didn't really take They let they let us
Speaker 3: do what we wanted to do. You know, it's it's
Speaker 3: an empterdam. There were a few more. We're not brining.
Speaker 5: Of course he was really the first one with the
Speaker 5: seed bank, but he didn't it's international. It was for
Speaker 5: Holland and he was really Yeah, he's older than me
Speaker 5: as well. And he yeah, he also added the first
Speaker 5: the coffee shop in the first gross shop is it
Speaker 5: the posit products the positor, and then the coffee shop
Speaker 5: is the mellow yellow. And he's still around. He invented
Speaker 5: more or less not a Rick Simpson oil, but yeah,
Speaker 5: I don't know. He calls it Madie weed Maddy wheat oil.
Speaker 5: And yeah, he has a good He really does a
Speaker 5: lot of good work because he basically introduced to the
Speaker 5: Dutch patients how to make your own oil.
Speaker 3: He wants to teach the people how to do it.
Speaker 5: He wants that everybody is an independent and independent from pharmaceuticals.
Speaker 3: You need to make your own medicine. I don't fully
Speaker 3: agree with it. Yes, really he's still around.
Speaker 5: And come back to the question, Sam the screaming man,
Speaker 5: he's nearly the man who brought everything to Amsterdam.
Speaker 4: Really, did you have any interactions with keys hawker from
Speaker 4: Loveland seeds.
Speaker 5: No, no, no, he's how could he's older already? Yeah, no, no,
Speaker 5: no no, because the thing is they they tried to
Speaker 5: push the as we call it.
Speaker 3: The native basically growing your own backyard. And we were more.
Speaker 5: We thought the church is called the brain into wet
Speaker 5: and let's go indoors because we we we saw it.
Speaker 5: We saw it happening in the US, and we were
Speaker 5: we were readers of High Times magazine. We were lucky
Speaker 5: enough to having the American Bookstore in the so we
Speaker 5: went there every month to buy the newest copy. So
Speaker 5: we were sure what what in America was going on.
Speaker 5: And that's more or less how we started for US.
Speaker 2: Skunk one and Haze and those type of things are
Speaker 2: very very famous strains, and they kind of became like
Speaker 2: the backbone of what you guys were doing over there.
Speaker 2: For a while. He was a like to those things.
Speaker 2: At first.
Speaker 5: We were very happy, especially with with the scrinkl run,
Speaker 5: because we were not used to see these kind of
Speaker 5: big bits and stable genetics because yeah, you can imagine
Speaker 5: if you grow outdoors and all shativa strain from the Ecuador, Yeah,
Speaker 5: it doesn't f it flowers in December, and in December
Speaker 5: it's cold and rain and snow, so we didn't see
Speaker 5: we never ever had seen even the buds, you know. Yeah,
Speaker 5: so this was a big game change. And when he
Speaker 5: came with his uh stuff and especially the skill number
Speaker 5: one and the Hayes, he gave us ten seats, the
Speaker 5: last seat he saved from his favorite variety, and he
Speaker 5: gave the other ten seats to Neville. And yeah, we
Speaker 5: didn't pay too much attention to the Hayes because it
Speaker 5: was long flowering and only very very small bitch, and
Speaker 5: it was really we were so happy with the Skoo
Speaker 5: number one that we almost forgot about the hate. Luckily enough,
Speaker 5: we made crosses between the Skoot number one and Hayes, Yeah,
Speaker 5: because we had ten plans and yeah two two times
Speaker 5: we were vested by the police and they took all
Speaker 5: our hazes and we had only one left.
Speaker 3: Even I don't know anymore.
Speaker 5: If it was if it was a boy or a girl,
Speaker 5: but you already made the seats with the screen number one,
Speaker 5: and I still have a lot of seats that we
Speaker 5: made between crosses between our ten hases.
Speaker 3: I tried to germinate it, and it really doesn't work. Anymore.
Speaker 5: The problem was I kept them outside the refrigerator for
Speaker 5: ten years. I put them in a refrigerator and now
Speaker 5: I still have them.
Speaker 3: So maybe it'd be some of your listeners culture.
Speaker 5: Because in my opinion, the seat when there's only one
Speaker 5: sell a live still. Basically you could reproduce it. But
Speaker 5: if the government, I don't think they want to help
Speaker 5: us with it. If they find in a seat of
Speaker 5: a wheat in a pyramid in Egypt, yeah we'll make
Speaker 5: sure that this is going to work again. Yeah, but
Speaker 5: with cannabis seeds, I still we still have to finds.
Speaker 5: But who can help us? Because I think the even
Speaker 5: you know what I mean, culture from alive somewhere in
Speaker 5: those seeds still, and of course it would be nice
Speaker 5: to germinate it. I gave it to a few people
Speaker 5: who were called, well, we will manage because I know
Speaker 5: how to do it.
Speaker 3: But yeah, yeah, of course, yeah, but that's a pity
Speaker 3: of course. And I have to come back to your
Speaker 3: Urban poison.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 3: In those days we had an Amsterdam coffee shop.
Speaker 5: It was called the Urban Poison and the only thing
Speaker 5: they sold was weat from South Africa.
Speaker 3: I don't remember the names anymore, but the major thing.
Speaker 5: They sold urban poison, and so I mean we had
Speaker 5: quite a few crosses, you know, our first catalog with
Speaker 5: Dirman Piss because we bought we bought eat from them
Speaker 5: and we picked up seats. And together with skunk number one,
Speaker 5: all the crosses, all the crosses with skunk number one
Speaker 5: gave us more early flowering, bigger and a nice smell.
Speaker 5: So it was basically uh winter combinations. Even the screw number.
Speaker 4: One, well do you remember what any of the smell
Speaker 4: profiles of the different number ones that you popped back
Speaker 4: in the day were like, yeah.
Speaker 5: The the the skirt number one was really like the
Speaker 5: name tell the name taels at all it stinks.
Speaker 4: So back then it actually smelled like scums like North America.
Speaker 3: I really, to be honest, I never have smell smell
Speaker 3: the spring any mill.
Speaker 5: But it was more about that it was so strong.
Speaker 3: It was really strong. You know.
Speaker 5: Yeah, in my hate that I have, you can still
Speaker 5: smell in the back you smell the skunk, the strong
Speaker 5: smell of the screw number one. And together with with
Speaker 5: with the hazy to the like, there's a lot that
Speaker 5: the old school haze is very freaky plant because if
Speaker 5: you make an analysis of it, there is all.
Speaker 3: There's only a proof sheme, that's the only urpin that's
Speaker 3: in it.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and not.
Speaker 3: Too much as well.
Speaker 5: But if you smoke it, it's really distructed smell and
Speaker 5: taste that I.
Speaker 3: Have ever seen in wheat.
Speaker 5: Yeah, that's a big mister, and I'll know it about turpines.
Speaker 5: How is it possible that the plant with only one
Speaker 5: ur and not a lot of it can smell so
Speaker 5: strong and taste so strong?
Speaker 3: Yeah? Do you know the answer? I don't know.
Speaker 1: I don't know.
Speaker 2: So basically, when you first got it, it was skunk
Speaker 2: number one was an early finishing big bud, very pretty.
Speaker 2: It smelled like skunk. Did it smell like did it
Speaker 2: smell like citrus too? It was there?
Speaker 5: No, no, no, no not at all, No no, no,
Speaker 5: it was more the dark side of the like the earth, the.
Speaker 3: Woody.
Speaker 5: Yes, yes it was not no, no no, no, not
Speaker 5: any sweetness, no, not any any SATs in it.
Speaker 2: Because what we're familiar with as as younger people is
Speaker 2: skunk number one smells like floral. It smells sweet, it
Speaker 2: smells So you're saying that what what Sam brought over
Speaker 2: first is very different than what ended up being common
Speaker 2: in Europe later.
Speaker 5: Yes, the ideah because skret number one and there are
Speaker 5: still a lot of seats bank around and they they
Speaker 5: think or they they know. I don't know that they
Speaker 5: that they still have scooted number one, but that there
Speaker 5: is no scoo number one anymore.
Speaker 3: Did the only scoot number one that is around.
Speaker 5: It's very deluded, nothing to compare with with with the skunk.
Speaker 3: Number one anywhere.
Speaker 5: Maybe maybe when the screwing mena this is a he
Speaker 5: tells that I'm wrong, but I have never seen it.
Speaker 3: There is there is no scoon. There is no real
Speaker 3: skook number one anymore around.
Speaker 2: That's interesting because when he went there he gave seeds
Speaker 2: to you, He gave some seeds to Neville. It sounds
Speaker 2: like he gave some seeds to Bernard from Positronics Mellow Yellow.
Speaker 2: What was the what was the little was the community
Speaker 2: in Amsterdam? Then? Did everyone know each other? Yes?
Speaker 5: The thing is we didn't live in Amsterdam. We still
Speaker 5: don't be live in Amsterdam. And there wasn't The Ampsterdam
Speaker 5: scene was more about outdoor growing and then and and
Speaker 5: and and we we I think we were the first
Speaker 5: ones in Holland to grow indoors and and when Sam
Speaker 5: teached a lot of people how to grow in a greenhouse.
Speaker 5: And since Sam arrived and hold On, the people started
Speaker 5: to grow in greenhouses because you could do it without
Speaker 5: a lot of trouble, because nobody knew about how it
Speaker 5: smells and how it looks. And basically the first five
Speaker 5: years that Sam was around, a lot of greenhouse growing
Speaker 5: was going on, and he basically teached everybody and all
Speaker 5: how to do it.
Speaker 3: And we didn't grow in a greenhouse because in.
Speaker 5: Our opinion, we thought better to do it there was
Speaker 5: nobody can see it than nowhere.
Speaker 3: It's more safe to do it.
Speaker 5: But because at the end of the day, all the
Speaker 5: all the greenhouses were always always bursted. They could do
Speaker 5: one club maybe second group was alround. Because hold On
Speaker 5: is a small country and there is no countryside at all.
Speaker 5: The greenhouses are always close to a village, close to
Speaker 5: a town with a lot of people around all a
Speaker 5: lot of people living once mind.
Speaker 2: Half the country. It seems like you reclaimed from the sea,
Speaker 2: you know.
Speaker 3: Uh So.
Speaker 2: Besides Hayes and skunk, what else did you get from Sam?
Speaker 3: Uh? You know? We we did not get anything else.
Speaker 3: Neville he get he got like early.
Speaker 2: Pearl, early Pearl from rob b.
Speaker 3: Yeah, early Pearl and a few other ones.
Speaker 5: But also we were not we were not too much
Speaker 5: in touch with Neville because the Neville's approach was different.
Speaker 3: Than our approach.
Speaker 5: We were underground people and we were not really too
Speaker 5: fun to to receive a lot of people we don't
Speaker 5: know in our house. And then and in those days
Speaker 5: and Devel had the the Canabis Castle, and everybody more
Speaker 5: or less was welcome over that, and especially when you
Speaker 5: came with a lot of money to buy seats.
Speaker 3: Everybody was welcome.
Speaker 5: And we were always more like, let's let's try to
Speaker 5: keep it underground, and let's let's try to do it
Speaker 5: and in a more more or less safe way, because
Speaker 5: we were we didn't want to get cold, and we
Speaker 5: wanted to the one in this business for forever.
Speaker 3: You know.
Speaker 5: And Neville was more of that devil than he was
Speaker 5: like I don't know who came to his house anymore.
Speaker 5: I I really don't know.
Speaker 2: If he knew.
Speaker 5: I think so, yeah, because a lot of Americans in
Speaker 5: those days, they came to them, to them, and everybody
Speaker 5: was welcome.
Speaker 3: Never space we were more careful.
Speaker 2: To Besides am where were some other sources. And then
Speaker 2: the previous conversation you had with Matt, you told that
Speaker 2: a lot of stuff you got you were getting off
Speaker 2: seeds from buds out of coffee shops. Were there any
Speaker 2: other people or sources once you started making Super Sativa
Speaker 2: Seed Club? Were people coming to find you? And trace.
Speaker 3: They were? They were coming to but they couldn't find this?
Speaker 2: Okay?
Speaker 5: The only the only one who who could find this
Speaker 5: was uh and George Vantis and and the the chief
Speaker 5: and that five times.
Speaker 2: Steve step of course.
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, And.
Speaker 5: Those were the only three people who told us this
Speaker 5: because we were really like we knew what we were,
Speaker 5: We understood what we were doing, you know.
Speaker 2: So then that that leads me to another question. In
Speaker 2: your catalog, you have something called Oakland, Indica. Yeah, and
Speaker 2: I'm just curious as to where that where you got
Speaker 2: that or where it came from.
Speaker 3: You know, I.
Speaker 5: Don't know it because a few times because we had
Speaker 5: a lot of clients, of course, and we received a
Speaker 5: lot of letters in those days, and a few times
Speaker 5: people sent us seats, but not only a few times.
Speaker 5: And I think because Oakland, that it was somebody from Oakland,
Speaker 5: because in those days we got like a hundred letters
Speaker 5: every day, you know, and it was really fun.
Speaker 3: For us to read all those letters. And also we.
Speaker 5: We asked people to help us to to distribute the
Speaker 5: seats in the US, and we were just reading the
Speaker 5: letters and we thought, oh, this guy is a nice
Speaker 5: guy because he understands how it works.
Speaker 3: And so there was a really.
Speaker 5: Nice job for me to read all these letters and
Speaker 5: to answer them as well, because maybe even nowadays, you
Speaker 5: still get letters from people from from all days and
Speaker 5: they said a nice to see.
Speaker 3: You back, and do you remember that? We WoT isn't
Speaker 3: that from you? Of course, that's really really funny.
Speaker 5: And when we started again a few years ago, we
Speaker 5: got a letter from somebody and he says, now, yeah,
Speaker 5: nowadays mother nature is legal in the US.
Speaker 3: And that we really thought.
Speaker 5: A guy who writes a letter and says modern nature
Speaker 5: is legal.
Speaker 3: Now, you know, it used.
Speaker 5: To be illegal, but now we are happy that it's legal,
Speaker 5: and that those were the letters that we really liked,
Speaker 5: the people who understood.
Speaker 3: How crazy it is to make mother nature illegal.
Speaker 1: Yeah it is wild.
Speaker 4: Yeah, what you got about the Durban high flyer, Now
Speaker 4: that was one of your most famous lines. Uh, we
Speaker 4: still see it around the day. Do you have any
Speaker 4: memories surrounding it.
Speaker 5: Yeah, that's this was a very satifa, pure satifa, of course.
Speaker 5: And also because of Durban is so in the south
Speaker 5: of the world that is almost in the same latitude
Speaker 5: then Holland.
Speaker 2: This.
Speaker 5: But then so the flowering times they are more or
Speaker 5: less the same than our flowering time because we our
Speaker 5: our harvest. Our autumn starts in September. Yeah, and then
Speaker 5: also the the winter, the harvest that's getting coold. So
Speaker 5: we were lucky to have the urban flowering so early.
Speaker 2: The Durban was a very was the is the one
Speaker 2: sativa that's sort of an early finisher. Yeah, so it
Speaker 2: worked well in Holland.
Speaker 3: Yes, and and and and and the combination with.
Speaker 5: A bit of tie because the tie is a very
Speaker 5: very late flowering.
Speaker 3: Yeah. And then then it's finished show like half October
Speaker 3: or something.
Speaker 5: And that's nice for us, of course because in October
Speaker 5: sometimes when you're lucky, the weather is still good.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 5: But but o our main customers in the US, where
Speaker 5: were the people from California, The viet veterans, people that
Speaker 5: back from Vietnam. They started to do the really farming,
Speaker 5: and they really they made money with it as well.
Speaker 3: So they did. Did they send us a nice amount
Speaker 3: of money? Yeah? Yeah, I don't know.
Speaker 2: Well, I mean from our perspective, you know, back then,
Speaker 2: especially Indicas and things like that were pretty rare. And
Speaker 2: even though California and America there was there was you know,
Speaker 2: there was a lot of things going on. People didn't
Speaker 2: know each other. So really, like one of the most
Speaker 2: interesting things about what happened with you guys for us
Speaker 2: is that, you know, like you are saying before, a
Speaker 2: bunch of stuff flowed from America over the amps over
Speaker 2: to Holland. Yeah, and went everywhere in America. It went
Speaker 2: to the South, that went to the North, New York,
Speaker 2: it went to.
Speaker 3: The and that was our goal. That was our goal.
Speaker 5: That's why we did this because we thought in those days, yeah,
Speaker 5: there's no internet, so your your your friends lived close
Speaker 5: to you in the same town, so you can swap
Speaker 5: sweets with your friends, but it doesn't spread the whole country,
Speaker 5: you know. And then since we were starting, we got
Speaker 5: letters from everywhere Alaska, Texas, whatever. And then so we thought,
Speaker 5: when all the refrigerators in the States are filled with seats,
Speaker 5: it's a difficult thing to stop it.
Speaker 3: And there's this movement.
Speaker 2: What about the what about your what about the creeper
Speaker 2: or the kyber Pass.
Speaker 5: Yeah, the the creeper, the creeper, we called it the
Speaker 5: creeper because it was really the plant was not upright,
Speaker 5: but it was laying down more or less.
Speaker 2: Oh that's why I always assumed it was the high,
Speaker 2: but it was.
Speaker 3: No, no, no, no, no, it was not. It was
Speaker 3: not about the high.
Speaker 5: It was really about the more logic aspects of the
Speaker 5: of the of the plant. Because normally a plant is
Speaker 5: like more or less like a Christmas treet, but this
Speaker 5: one was like bending over and laying down, you know.
Speaker 5: And I still like this kind of plant plants because
Speaker 5: they gave you a big harvest, yea room for buds,
Speaker 5: you know, and h and then the the ki that
Speaker 5: was becrossed with in Afghani. I think because of Afghani
Speaker 5: and all that will be the Hush from Afghanistan was
Speaker 5: really very popular. And I don't know where because she's
Speaker 5: from that.
Speaker 2: You guys ever grow flowers for coffee shops or did
Speaker 2: you just focus on seeds?
Speaker 5: Yes, yes, yes, yeah yeah yeah because we did. We
Speaker 5: were growing for the coffee shops as well. Yeah yeah,
Speaker 5: because they liked our indoor wheat because it was quite.
Speaker 5: It was new, and in those days, we we were
Speaker 5: worrying a little bit about the fact that our wheat
Speaker 5: was green because people they were used to to buy
Speaker 5: marijuana was always brown, so half rotten wheat as we
Speaker 5: call it now, and our indoor marijuana was green. So
Speaker 5: we thought, oh, nobody's going to buy this because they
Speaker 5: don't because green. The only green marijuana we knew was
Speaker 5: that it was the native wheat and that was the
Speaker 5: wheat that we grew in our backyard and they didn't
Speaker 5: have birds. It was only leaves and it was green.
Speaker 5: So we were afraid that people thought our wheat was
Speaker 5: neither beat.
Speaker 3: So we tried to make it.
Speaker 5: We tried to make it brown to to to be
Speaker 5: able to to to sell it. But after a few
Speaker 5: and I don't know, maybe after a year, everybody, no, no, no,
Speaker 5: the green ones is the best one is much better
Speaker 5: than than the brown.
Speaker 3: Man no mind, don't worry about the color. Will we
Speaker 3: buy it anyway?
Speaker 5: So yeah, that was really that was a really funny
Speaker 5: thing that he really peop were really worried about the
Speaker 5: green corp.
Speaker 2: It really worried because it was so because The part
Speaker 2: about that is that everything was so new.
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, that's what knew. It was new.
Speaker 5: And the first since the milion that I saw in
Speaker 5: Holland that was somebody. And then one year we have
Speaker 5: we were lucky enough to have a good September in Holland.
Speaker 5: Normally it's raining in September already, but in.
Speaker 3: This September there was a lot of sun.
Speaker 5: So in the coffee shop where I worked, somebody came
Speaker 5: with a garbage bag full of big birds and they
Speaker 5: were not primmed at all, and I thought, where does
Speaker 5: this come from? Because we really didn't. It was the
Speaker 5: first time we saw a green tig bud plant. But
Speaker 5: this was also I think a durban poison or something
Speaker 5: that he was lucky to grow some urban poison seeds
Speaker 5: in a year that we had a very good, nice September,
Speaker 5: so the plant was to finish, and that was really
Speaker 5: the first time that I saw sin Sinzemdjia.
Speaker 3: That's because of that, it's been.
Speaker 2: You got into weed was by working in a coffee shop.
Speaker 5: Yes, I worked in a coffee shop when I was
Speaker 5: like eighteen years and nineteen years old, and then one
Speaker 5: of the our customers came to me and he said,
Speaker 5: I I am I. I'm a reader of High Times magazine,
Speaker 5: and I saw how they grew, how they grow plants
Speaker 5: already because at Rosendhal was one of the first to
Speaker 5: start all days, I think in the US. And this
Speaker 5: guy said, I bought a metal headlines lamp because we
Speaker 5: have a big horticulture center here in all of and
Speaker 5: in those days, the greenhouse grower they they used it
Speaker 5: to grow the metal airlines. And he went there to
Speaker 5: buy a lamp and he said, I want to grow
Speaker 5: and I want to start to use it. And I thought,
Speaker 5: I live in the spot house and let's do it.
Speaker 5: So that's how it started. Because this guy, he didn't
Speaker 5: he was a reader of High Times magazine. Saved in
Speaker 5: High Times, so we knew.
Speaker 2: So most of most of Super Sativa Seed Club's work
Speaker 2: was all done indoors, whether you were growing buds for
Speaker 2: coffee shops or whether you were making seed for.
Speaker 3: Your Yes, yeah we did.
Speaker 2: We did everything, kept it inside.
Speaker 3: Yeah, And that was all because of Yeah we did.
Speaker 3: It was too cold.
Speaker 5: It's too cold, and you know, and in a greenhouse
Speaker 5: it's the holand is too crowded to grow in a greenhouse,
Speaker 5: and it's no.
Speaker 3: Everybody got caught always in the greenhouse.
Speaker 2: And were growing is did you have garages? Were you
Speaker 2: growing in bedrooms?
Speaker 3: We had garages and we bought it.
Speaker 5: At one point we bought a house, especially with the
Speaker 5: lud and the no no, and I know those we
Speaker 5: were scuoters. You know what sculters are. Yes, And if
Speaker 5: you are a scoter, you always have a house.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 2: So you you squatted in the house and then you
Speaker 2: set up some lights, and you set up some rooms
Speaker 2: to do breeding and grow weed, and you sold the
Speaker 2: weed to the coffee shops and you sold seeds catalog.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 5: Yeah, And we were squat but we earned a lot
Speaker 5: of money.
Speaker 2: That's very cool.
Speaker 5: Yeah, but you we're not in it for the money man,
Speaker 5: because it was nice to have money to do that.
Speaker 5: A lot of money came to us, of course, but
Speaker 5: it was not really the hour and the.
Speaker 3: Basic thing.
Speaker 2: The funny thing for us is that now you know,
Speaker 2: there's so many seed companies in America and there's a
Speaker 2: lot of seed company in Europe and everything like that.
Speaker 2: But when when you guys started and when Neville started,
Speaker 2: there was really only you two. Yeah, that was easy,
Speaker 2: Like you said, if you went to positronics. If you
Speaker 2: went to Holland and went directly to certain coffee shops,
Speaker 2: maybe you could get some seed in order to order things.
Speaker 2: There was only two Yeah really, so that your your
Speaker 2: company's stuff and Nevill's company stuff got spread so far
Speaker 2: and wide.
Speaker 3: Yeah yeah, yeah. But but when NETL stopped, Sense she
Speaker 3: took over, took over, and they bought basically that's how
Speaker 3: Sense started.
Speaker 5: They bought NETLL stopped and then they started in the
Speaker 5: name Sensy Seats and Ben Drunk the one that's the
Speaker 5: guy who started. Is this is really a big, big
Speaker 5: thanks to Ben because he was really the guy with
Speaker 5: the biggest balls.
Speaker 3: You know, he went on very where we started, where
Speaker 3: we stopped.
Speaker 2: So do you think that did Neville sell his company
Speaker 2: to Ben and Allen because of the trouble he got in?
Speaker 3: I think so? Yeah.
Speaker 2: Did you were in the community back then? Were you
Speaker 2: ever we like, was it a small enough community that
Speaker 2: you were close to a lot of these people?
Speaker 3: Yes? Yet, But the thing is I said before, we
Speaker 3: were not really we were.
Speaker 5: We had our own group of people, and we were
Speaker 5: not we we didn't live in Amsterdam, you know.
Speaker 2: So so you didn't live in Amsterdam, you lived in different.
Speaker 5: Yeah, yeah, we lived in the Hague. That's good, that's
Speaker 5: close to Amsterdam.
Speaker 3: But so we.
Speaker 5: We we we we tryed to be to be honest,
Speaker 5: we tried to stay out of all those groups.
Speaker 2: Tried to keep your head and stay quiet.
Speaker 5: And yeah, yes, that's right the idea really and we
Speaker 5: were not like behaving like work stores or something. We
Speaker 5: were just we were just quoted running a cannabisy business.
Speaker 2: So how did how did how did like Jorge Servantes
Speaker 2: and Ed Rosenthal, how did they find you? Did they you?
Speaker 3: Yeah? Yeah, they centered the letter? Yeah they right, because
Speaker 3: in those days you wrote letters to people.
Speaker 2: Sure, yeah, you put.
Speaker 3: You put the stamp on the envelope and you put
Speaker 3: it in the mailbox.
Speaker 2: That was.
Speaker 5: Maybe it's a good idea that we go back to
Speaker 5: this kind of communication then.
Speaker 3: Because nobody can listen to it.
Speaker 2: Yeah did they did they? Did they bring seeds to
Speaker 2: or did they want to just come.
Speaker 3: Out and did No?
Speaker 5: But I have a nice anecdote about George Savantis because
Speaker 5: he came to visit us and he asked us to
Speaker 5: to show around, to show to show him the Dutch
Speaker 5: greenhouse because in those days, the Dutch greenhouse today they
Speaker 5: were growing under a metal on the HPS lights that
Speaker 5: we had greenhouses with ten thousand HPS lights in it.
Speaker 5: And he never he didn't ever see this, and so
Speaker 5: we gave him a tour and he came up. He
Speaker 5: showed up in the door with a nice T shirt
Speaker 5: Kanabis Usa, California.
Speaker 3: No, no, no, no, that's not how it goes. You
Speaker 3: have to put.
Speaker 5: Put on some different teachers, man, because we've done to
Speaker 5: the show you around in the greenhouse of riding.
Speaker 3: This T shirt and said, oh, why that is legal
Speaker 3: in Holand, isn't it. No, no, no, it's not legal
Speaker 3: at all. Everybody thinks it legal, but it's it's not legal.
Speaker 5: So we had to teach a little bit how to
Speaker 5: behave in Holland.
Speaker 2: We had the same We have the same issue in
Speaker 2: California where I live. When medical first happened twenty years ago,
Speaker 2: a lot of people thought it was legal, but it
Speaker 2: really legal. It was. It was kind of like Holland,
Speaker 2: it was permitted. You still get in trouble anytime.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 5: I know a lot of people from California and they
Speaker 5: still they always tell me it's still illegal, man.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, it's still illegal. It was still whether or not.
Speaker 2: The cop wanted to be nice to you. They could
Speaker 2: you any which way they wanted. And it was kind
Speaker 2: of the same about Holland I'm sure too. It all
Speaker 2: depended on the attitude.
Speaker 5: Yeah, yeah, And that's that's why maybe try to keep
Speaker 5: a little bit under granted because of TB wanted to
Speaker 5: go out and then I wanted to I'm I'm having
Speaker 5: a family and everything, and that's really.
Speaker 3: I'm not that type of guy who wants to be
Speaker 3: in the pictures me either.
Speaker 2: I feel you on that. So after you started breeding
Speaker 2: at Supersit TV Seed Club for a while and you
Speaker 2: realize that you got popular, did you start keeping a
Speaker 2: lot of breeding males and breeding females Like.
Speaker 5: Yeah, basically like a nice collection of males and females.
Speaker 5: And in those days, we did not do the feminized
Speaker 5: breeding that didn't exist yet, so it was not so
Speaker 5: very difficult to breeding that we did.
Speaker 3: So we we sometimes did a little bit in breeding
Speaker 3: and uh, but not too much.
Speaker 5: It was more we we we basically did pheno hunting
Speaker 5: and the best ones we liked we crossed with each
Speaker 5: other and and everybody.
Speaker 3: Was happy ready to see it.
Speaker 5: Because for for a lot of people our customers was
Speaker 5: it's either nothing or or something from Amsterdam that really
Speaker 5: gives one nice flowers, nice nice boots. And then the
Speaker 5: people sent us photos and sent us letters and they
Speaker 5: were really uh yeah, the photos.
Speaker 3: They they were really.
Speaker 5: Nice photos and everybody was happy.
Speaker 3: It was really nice.
Speaker 2: How many how many people were involved in your in
Speaker 2: your company?
Speaker 5: Yeah we have We were two people too, did and
Speaker 5: like four or five people helping us, like a little collective.
Speaker 3: Yeah yeah.
Speaker 2: At the biggest part of it, how many houses did
Speaker 2: you have or how many how many different places were
Speaker 2: you grown, like five.
Speaker 3: Six different places to grow.
Speaker 5: But we did not do that because in those days
Speaker 5: there were also people who are really five years or so.
Speaker 3: A lot of people that came into.
Speaker 5: The they rented big warehouses and put two hundred lamps
Speaker 5: in it.
Speaker 3: But we we.
Speaker 5: Did it on a smaller scale because we're all we
Speaker 5: were not growing that much weed were more growing seeds
Speaker 5: in those days.
Speaker 2: I mean, there's a there's a lot of you know,
Speaker 2: you could call them American seed companies these days that
Speaker 2: exist just like that. It's some basement, it's a few
Speaker 2: bedroom house.
Speaker 5: Yeah yeah, yeah, yeah, I can yeah, because I see
Speaker 5: a lot of people they they have some ploans and
Speaker 5: they make russes and and a new sheet company is born.
Speaker 2: Yeah, your skunk has yeah really old?
Speaker 3: Yeah?
Speaker 2: How long does it flower?
Speaker 3: For twelve weeks?
Speaker 5: And then the better do one week of thirteen weeks
Speaker 5: to thirteen is well?
Speaker 2: And how did it? I mean thirty five years old?
Speaker 2: I'm always fascinated by how things survive because for us
Speaker 2: in America, it seems like every five or ten years, Uh,
Speaker 2: the weed, the seed game reinvents itself and you can't
Speaker 2: get what you used to be able to get. So
Speaker 2: did it did it? Was it just so such a
Speaker 2: nice cut and there's such a nice plant that various
Speaker 2: people saved it and passed it around.
Speaker 5: Is it something that has been always in like two
Speaker 5: or three places? And like you said, it was more
Speaker 5: like a group of people you work with.
Speaker 3: And yeah, it's still.
Speaker 5: Around and and and we all we will let them.
Speaker 3: We have our mother plant.
Speaker 5: When it's like three or four months old, we take
Speaker 5: a new cut, we throw away the old plant, and
Speaker 5: we start from a bit a little clone again. And
Speaker 5: a few friends of me, of my they have it.
Speaker 5: And then yeah, because you can you can imagine in
Speaker 5: thirty five years there are lots of things happening. Really
Speaker 5: we are proud of We are proud of it to
Speaker 5: still have it, and we are now working on trying
Speaker 5: to to to breed it. We are working with a
Speaker 5: few American varieties because we like from those days. We
Speaker 5: like the big firm but with a lot of resin,
Speaker 5: but sometimes it lacks a little bit of flavor, a
Speaker 5: little bit of taste and smell.
Speaker 3: And now we are trying to put the smell.
Speaker 5: Of the girls to hate and the high preferable as well,
Speaker 5: and the taste into a new and into the American right.
Speaker 3: And that takes a while, but.
Speaker 5: It's really interesting to see a plant that grows like
Speaker 5: a cookie or something mm hmmm, American.
Speaker 3: Style and then with the old school hate, taste and smelling.
Speaker 3: That's that's the thing that we are working on. And
Speaker 3: maybe people some people tell, ay, why do you do this?
Speaker 5: You try to keep it like it is, But I
Speaker 5: want to because at the end of the day, a
Speaker 5: lot of people are on commercial these days, and it's
Speaker 5: nice to have a big held of course, but also
Speaker 5: the fluffy but is nowadays considered like the equality. A
Speaker 5: lot of people don't understand that at the end of
Speaker 5: the day correctly, but you put it in a paper
Speaker 5: and you smoke it, so it doesn't it isn't really
Speaker 5: a big deal.
Speaker 3: How the bit lose.
Speaker 2: I agree, the big deal and how it.
Speaker 3: Works, but you agree, and I agree. But a lot
Speaker 3: of people the I also want you know, yes.
Speaker 2: I mean, and the way that that social media works
Speaker 2: now a lot of times the only things that people
Speaker 2: see of different buds or pictures.
Speaker 3: Yeah, and so.
Speaker 2: Might look very ugly, even though it might work wonderfully
Speaker 2: and make you very happy and it might take great
Speaker 2: you can't tell that through the picture.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 5: Because because now if I if you have five, like
Speaker 5: five different varieties, four of them are American things, and
Speaker 5: one of them is.
Speaker 3: Va thing, and everybody says the Sativa things.
Speaker 5: We don't we want to we don't want to have
Speaker 5: it because it looks flints for us range.
Speaker 3: And especially because I'm sick to.
Speaker 5: Three early years old already so long and normally I
Speaker 5: think it's normal that the younger people like all the things,
Speaker 5: but we also want to show things from the past.
Speaker 2: I mean it, I mean, for instance, you know, it's
Speaker 2: really interesting because for us, skunk one, you know, to
Speaker 2: bring it back again is very very very different from
Speaker 2: what you experienced. I don't think I experienced Skunk one
Speaker 2: like you remember it time that we got a hold
Speaker 2: of it. What you remember was gone. Yeah, and that
Speaker 2: happens a lot where if you don't have old things,
Speaker 2: or people aren't saving old cuttings, or you can't get
Speaker 2: old seeds to sprout, then the way will remember something.
Speaker 2: It's just gone. How long ago you get excited again
Speaker 2: about maybe you could restart Super Sativa Seed Club in
Speaker 2: a new form.
Speaker 5: Yeah, yeah, we already started it, but we don't sell
Speaker 5: in the US anymore, because those are the wile days.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 5: Nowadays it's uh, it's not a good idea to sell
Speaker 5: something in the US from homes.
Speaker 2: No, not yet. It could change. We're slowly in that direction, but.
Speaker 3: I don't know.
Speaker 5: Have you ever heard of Ditch Passion, Yes, yeah, because
Speaker 5: we were together with Ditch Passion the digital friends, and
Speaker 5: they are there is really a very successful seat company,
Speaker 5: but they don't sell one seat in the US. And
Speaker 5: if you know that half of the visitors of the
Speaker 5: website comes from the US. Yeah, uh, we don't sell
Speaker 5: one seat today, you know it. Hopefully that will change
Speaker 5: in the next or so years. It looks like America.
Speaker 5: We're complicated in the US men that those federals and
Speaker 5: uh it's really not a good idea.
Speaker 3: And but maybe one.
Speaker 5: Day things change and then we can because because it's
Speaker 5: of course greaty that half of the visitors of a
Speaker 5: website it comes.
Speaker 3: From the US, comes from the US. Yeah, they want
Speaker 3: the vices, but we don't do it.
Speaker 2: Understand when uh so is is? Uh so? Basically you're
Speaker 2: making stuff for the Holland market.
Speaker 3: Now you're you're in market for European.
Speaker 2: You were talking in the in the previous interview you
Speaker 2: did with Matt you were talking about how you sort
Speaker 2: of like recollected some other hazes besides yeah.
Speaker 3: Because now I'm in a good position of course too.
Speaker 5: I know a lot of people, and I know all
Speaker 5: the hate hats from Europe.
Speaker 2: You know, No, I mean you're certainly of that generation
Speaker 2: that you know, we've known these people for decades.
Speaker 5: Yes, yes, and and and and then we are happy
Speaker 5: that a lot that the Hayes people always are the
Speaker 5: people who really understand how important it is to to
Speaker 5: save things. And there's still a lot of stuff around,
Speaker 5: you know, because we have like I have five different
Speaker 5: loans still and then other people. We we have the
Speaker 5: old school hates. We have the annal five times haes
Speaker 5: and they have the hate C and the hate A.
Speaker 3: And it's not the boy as everybody thinks.
Speaker 5: But because we have the girls and we have the
Speaker 5: outback hage, that's the last thing never made.
Speaker 2: So he's has the famous boy.
Speaker 5: Yeah, no, no, The thing is there is a lot
Speaker 5: of confusion going on always about the hases, boys and girls.
Speaker 5: But what we have is the haes A and A
Speaker 5: C and it's votabiles and it's really yeah. And and
Speaker 5: of course you have the A five and C five.
Speaker 5: I personally don't have it, but my friends have it.
Speaker 5: Then it's really but when we want to use it
Speaker 5: to make a cross or something, we can have it.
Speaker 5: But it's a group of people and everybody knows each other.
Speaker 5: It's from the South.
Speaker 2: But when you when you're talking about the girls that
Speaker 2: are A and C, you're not talking about A five
Speaker 2: or C five. You're talking about different there's different plans.
Speaker 5: Yeah, yeah, and it's really the especially the ace, the
Speaker 5: one I.
Speaker 3: Like best is the outbreack, the outback here, Yeah, because the.
Speaker 5: Outback hege is really the incense smell and it has
Speaker 5: the incense smell and it's it makes you high, totally high.
Speaker 5: It's really when you smoke it. Then then you think
Speaker 5: hm hmm, under stone at all? And a half an
Speaker 5: hour later you think where was I?
Speaker 3: I didn't know anything, but there was.
Speaker 2: That's a female you got from friends? Or is that
Speaker 2: a female seed we.
Speaker 3: We got we've got to uh yeah, yeah, I don't
Speaker 3: think you know them.
Speaker 5: She's called Miska mis Miska is a famous activist here
Speaker 5: in Europe.
Speaker 3: She's from France. It's a it's a it's a.
Speaker 5: It's an older lady and she's really an activist and
Speaker 5: she was the best friend of A Nevill and Neville
Speaker 5: gave this to her and since she passed away, she
Speaker 5: passed away. Yeah, she gives it to us also because
Speaker 5: he's old. He's quite old already. And then she it's like,
Speaker 5: what's send it? You gave it to somebody who knows
Speaker 5: who who can handle it, you know, who knows who
Speaker 5: knows how to to save it.
Speaker 2: Are you planning on doing some breeding with somebody doing breathing?
Speaker 5: Because we are now doing breeding, but that's feminized breeding
Speaker 5: because when you have two girls, there's no man there's
Speaker 5: no male, so you need you need to do feminize
Speaker 5: breeding and we have now we have two and still yeah,
Speaker 5: I think it's going to be a successful project because
Speaker 5: we we we When you're breeding, you have to stablish
Speaker 5: a few goals.
Speaker 3: Girls already not too much, but our goals are always
Speaker 3: the high, the smell, and the taste.
Speaker 2: Those are my top three.
Speaker 5: Yeah, it's nice when there is a lot of resin
Speaker 5: to be seen, but we don't go for a flowering
Speaker 5: time or something.
Speaker 3: No, no, because.
Speaker 5: Now we also can do someone breeding and legal situations,
Speaker 5: so then we don't have to worry about flowering time.
Speaker 5: Right because a lot of people DNA genetics you know
Speaker 5: them of course, yes, bybe they are also friends of us,
Speaker 5: and they said, yeah, it's nice what you're doing, but
Speaker 5: it's going to be a problem to sell those seats
Speaker 5: because in those nowadays, people don't want to spend twelve
Speaker 5: or twelve weeks thirty weeks waiting for their office anymore.
Speaker 2: It's changing, I.
Speaker 5: Think, I hope so, because when you're growing legal like
Speaker 5: you guys can do this there, why why should you
Speaker 5: bother about the flowering time?
Speaker 2: Yes? No, For a long time they were right, people
Speaker 2: didn't want things that went longer than eight to ten weeks.
Speaker 3: Yeah, because they have to run there.
Speaker 5: It's a bit of police and bit the police on
Speaker 5: their heels and to make sure that it comes in fast.
Speaker 2: But there's a lot of people now that are willing
Speaker 2: to do twelve, thirteen, even fourteen week strains if they're
Speaker 2: nice enough. People are getting excited about it.
Speaker 5: And also regarding Waight, the extra three weeks will give
Speaker 5: you forty percent extra weight, right. The best, but the
Speaker 5: best yielding varieties are the steep varieties. I mean, they
Speaker 5: all laugh a little bit about there's something making a
Speaker 5: little bit different about the new American strange.
Speaker 3: You like that. But they don't yield.
Speaker 2: No, No, there's a lot of them that don't yield.
Speaker 2: That's very true, of course. Yeah, so they don't, you
Speaker 2: know they so your your skunk haze. The haze in
Speaker 2: it is from one of the ten seeds that Neviles
Speaker 2: that Sam.
Speaker 5: There is nothing closer to the real haze than the
Speaker 5: screen caze that I have.
Speaker 2: Because most people, it seems like most people in Holland
Speaker 2: ended up using a lot of Nevill's hybrids of haze,
Speaker 2: and those would be a lot of the one the
Speaker 2: cuts that got saved. Yes, but as a result of
Speaker 2: that that that means that most haze is only from
Speaker 2: one or two plants. Yes, So you third, you have
Speaker 2: you have Hayes that's not even his, which is pretty exciting.
Speaker 5: Yeah, because the difference between our Hayes and Nevil's hases.
Speaker 5: Neville Nevill did all the his crosses with northern lights,
Speaker 5: and we did it at Skirn Gramer one m HM
Speaker 5: and northern lights that you can also see in like
Speaker 5: A five and C five and all those. It's all
Speaker 5: Hayes with northern light in it. And northern light is
Speaker 5: not really a plant with a nice taste. It's like
Speaker 5: a metallic a metallic taste, and it's.
Speaker 3: Really not.
Speaker 5: There are not the turps in the and the and
Speaker 5: and the crosses that never made are not so nice
Speaker 5: then the turps in the in the skring cases because
Speaker 5: the screen was really turpan.
Speaker 2: So we were ready that our line, our.
Speaker 5: Line is with Skirn gnumber one and Nevil's lines are
Speaker 5: with it with the northern northern.
Speaker 3: Lights and northern lights came from the US.
Speaker 2: Are there are there coffee shops and stuff like that
Speaker 2: where people can still get your skunk case on any
Speaker 2: kind of basis.
Speaker 3: Yes, yes, yes, yes.
Speaker 2: It's still available, like if people were to go to
Speaker 2: you can find it.
Speaker 5: Lucky, only a few people grow it because it's complicated
Speaker 5: to grow, really need to have your climate under control.
Speaker 5: And in an illegal situation, it's not so very easy
Speaker 5: because then you need to work with airco units, you know,
Speaker 5: because the skunk case, when the temperature rises above twenty
Speaker 5: eight the celsius, then they start to ruin the boots
Speaker 5: and that means then it cuts were very fluffy, and
Speaker 5: sometimes you get like ten branches and then you start.
Speaker 3: Yeah, and when this happens after eight weeks of flowering again,
Speaker 3: twelve weeks of flowering starts and then we're talking about
Speaker 3: antibiques and that's too much. And that's what.
Speaker 5: You really you really know, it's really a very difficult
Speaker 5: plan to grow. If you have too much nutrients, they
Speaker 5: start to right and to start to.
Speaker 3: Do crazy things.
Speaker 2: You do it the right way. It takes twelve or
Speaker 2: thirteen weeks.
Speaker 5: Yeah, and then the right is not one hour above
Speaker 5: twenty eight degree celsis, not one day when you have
Speaker 5: one day when your ARCO breaks down or something, it's gone.
Speaker 2: It's gone. So you what excites you about you your
Speaker 2: new your new venture with super Stativa Seed Club. Are
Speaker 2: you working, are you working with your son? Are you
Speaker 2: working with.
Speaker 3: I a little bit my son? Yeah, I have those
Speaker 3: and and and also.
Speaker 5: We are we are we are very close to get
Speaker 5: the permits to growing holand legal. Yeah, because now the
Speaker 5: the Ditch government issued ten permits to grow legal for
Speaker 5: the coffee shoption on and we were lucky enough to
Speaker 5: win the lottery.
Speaker 3: It was a lottery.
Speaker 5: Hundred and fifty people applied for the license and only
Speaker 5: forty went through the first round. Because you need to
Speaker 5: be able to grow a lot of wheat, you need
Speaker 5: to have money, you need to have the skills to
Speaker 5: do it, you need to have the conferents in the
Speaker 5: coffee shop.
Speaker 3: And we all have this.
Speaker 5: And then basically there were forty people left and then
Speaker 5: they made a lottery and we were lucky enough to
Speaker 5: win one of the ten pyramids.
Speaker 2: So when you win it, does that mean that at
Speaker 2: some point in the future, like Matt and I could
Speaker 2: fly to Holland and we could buy Superstitiva seed Club
Speaker 2: weed at coffee. Yes, and it would be branded and
Speaker 2: we know it was from you, and you threw it
Speaker 2: legal foracility, and then you'd sell it to like Damn
Speaker 2: Kring or somebody like that.
Speaker 3: That's the idea. Yes, that's the idea.
Speaker 2: That's very exciting.
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, that's the idea.
Speaker 5: It will take because now it's a government basement, so
Speaker 5: it takes a little bit longer.
Speaker 3: You can imagine.
Speaker 5: You're waiting, waiting, waiting, waiting one the one. Then a
Speaker 5: few weeks and a month we will get the permit.
Speaker 3: And then.
Speaker 5: It's very funny we do it in a peaceful way because.
Speaker 2: That's that's it's a lifetime of waiting for that. Huh.
Speaker 5: Yeah, because for me especially, it's very nice because then
Speaker 5: the stiricle is round, you know.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 4: Uh.
Speaker 2: California is the same way. It's just become legal. But
Speaker 2: a lot of money, a lot of rules, a lot
Speaker 2: of regulations, a lot of government involved, a lot of permits.
Speaker 3: Yeah, but we were.
Speaker 5: Lucky enough to have the example of Canada and the
Speaker 5: US to tell our government.
Speaker 3: If you want to make this.
Speaker 5: A success, they don't make the same mistakes as they
Speaker 5: did in Canada. So because in Canada, people from the
Speaker 5: black market it can't be involved in this. But here
Speaker 5: in Holland, we told the government without people from the
Speaker 5: black market, this is not going to be successful. No,
Speaker 5: the people from the black market, they know how to
Speaker 5: do it. And basically where there's the government can get
Speaker 5: information from, they can't. You can't read the information about
Speaker 5: these kind of things in the paper, So you need
Speaker 5: to talk with people from the black market. We basically
Speaker 5: help the government to make this happen.
Speaker 2: You did you work to suf government.
Speaker 5: Is wise enough to understand that they don't can do
Speaker 5: this without the black market.
Speaker 2: So then when if they make get legal, will you
Speaker 2: mostly be going in greenhouses like traditional.
Speaker 3: You'll do a cumbination of greenhouse and.
Speaker 2: Indoor growing an indoor growing.
Speaker 3: Again, it gave you it would be one hundred percent again again.
Speaker 2: Yeah, you call it bio over there.
Speaker 3: Now, that's bio here. Yeah, it's calling by bio.
Speaker 5: Yeah so yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2: So I mean, if if if you want to wrap
Speaker 2: it up here that that that's wonderful. I thank you
Speaker 2: so much for your time. It was wonderful to hear
Speaker 2: these stories.
Speaker 3: Yeah, that's keeping.
Speaker 1: You're an amazing interview man.
Speaker 2: You know your ship.
Speaker 1: I love it.
Speaker 2: All right.
Speaker 1: That concludes NASA's part of the interview.
Speaker 4: So right now, we're going to go over some of
Speaker 4: the highlights of the interview, things that we picked out
Speaker 4: and thought were very, very unique and otherwise important to highlight.
Speaker 1: So let's talk about some things.
Speaker 2: Well, probably in no particular order, but one of the
Speaker 2: really interesting parts for me was hearing him talk about
Speaker 2: the imported weed from South America, from South Africa and
Speaker 2: Durban and that you know, you and I have talked
Speaker 2: a bunch in the past about how we thought most
Speaker 2: of the Durban in Amsterdam came from what Mel Frank
Speaker 2: gave to Sam Skunkman.
Speaker 1: Sure we thought that's what proliferated most of what was
Speaker 1: being used.
Speaker 2: By right and so while certainly that that was proliferated
Speaker 2: over there and plenty of people sold it and bred
Speaker 2: with it, Sure now we find out that there was
Speaker 2: literally a durbin poison coffee shop. Then Correll and others
Speaker 2: were getting bag seeds from seated cannabis from Durban and
Speaker 2: using in their own work. So significantly widens the gene
Speaker 2: pool of what we thought, and it also could lead
Speaker 2: to where you know, Mel talked extensively about how his
Speaker 2: Durban was much more Annis, much more licorice in flavor
Speaker 2: and he's not sure why the Dutch breddit in the
Speaker 2: way that they did, but with that tidbit of information,
Speaker 2: it's possible that his was Anis and so there's an
Speaker 2: Anis side to Durbin. But then there's also a more
Speaker 2: terpenoline leaning Durbin that came from South Africa and was
Speaker 2: found in seeded weed. Yeah, and that could account for
Speaker 2: the vast differences between those two Durbin families. Yeah, because
Speaker 2: it's all kind of gotten the same classification. But as
Speaker 2: we know, just because it's from the same region doesn't
Speaker 2: mean it's no not whatsoever. So that was that was
Speaker 2: pretty amazing information because we've us and others have assumed
Speaker 2: for a long time, yeah, that most people were selling
Speaker 2: the same Durbin poison.
Speaker 1: Yeah, that was fascinating.
Speaker 4: One of the one of the points that I thought
Speaker 4: was really interesting, and it's something that's been kind of
Speaker 4: mythical ever since s SSC kind of you know, moved
Speaker 4: away from the scene. In that you know, there was
Speaker 4: a lot of rumors building up about why that happened.
Speaker 4: There were people coming out and saying I worked for
Speaker 4: SSSC and I was s SSC America or my uncle,
Speaker 4: you know, my uncle's bred certain lines for SSSC in
Speaker 4: Virginia or somewhere in America.
Speaker 1: I thought that was fascinating to hear that there were no.
Speaker 4: Americans involved in s s SC, because that's been a
Speaker 4: rumor that's built up and many a few at least
Speaker 4: companies have been started off that.
Speaker 2: Yeah. I mean, certainly there's more than more than one
Speaker 2: person has had claims of that level. So it was
Speaker 2: interesting to hear that while they did source stuff from America,
Speaker 2: like apparently, as we heard, Williams. Wonder came from New York,
Speaker 2: which is pretty cool. I had never heard that part before.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I had neither.
Speaker 2: And obviously he talked about all skunk coming from California
Speaker 2: and the Sam rob group you know, to them, but
Speaker 2: it does seem a little bit like Neville. They collected,
Speaker 2: they collected some things, and he it was pretty cool
Speaker 2: how he talked about people with straight write him letters. Yeah,
Speaker 2: that's how he met made most of his American connections
Speaker 2: was people like ed or whoever writing them letters and
Speaker 2: wanting to come see them.
Speaker 4: Can you imagine just being able to write in a
Speaker 4: letter being like, hey, I'd love to come visit, and
Speaker 4: all of a sudden Bam, you're there, You're at the king.
Speaker 2: Or people are sitting in seeds or buds. So America
Speaker 2: certainly contributed to what they had to offer, but apparently,
Speaker 2: I mean, he said, you know, all their breeding was
Speaker 2: done in five or six homes, basically, you know that
Speaker 2: type of thing. The other little tidbit that's not really
Speaker 2: like seed specific, but makes a lot of sense, was
Speaker 2: you know, when he talked about how easy it was
Speaker 2: to get busted in greenhouses because all of Holland is
Speaker 2: highly developed, and so a greenhouse is in a neighborhood. Yeah,
Speaker 2: living in Men, living in Mendocino County and anybody who
Speaker 2: lives in the western part of America, we're pretty spread out. Yeah,
Speaker 2: there's lots of remote rural areas. There's lots of places
Speaker 2: you can do things, you can buy property where you
Speaker 2: can get away with it. And it was pretty It
Speaker 2: was interesting when you think of a society that's so
Speaker 2: much older than ours and they've just populated every good
Speaker 2: part of the land. Yeah, and so there's really nowhere
Speaker 2: to hide. So for them in order to not get busted,
Speaker 2: it was I mean, he basically said it was like
Speaker 2: you were one and done. At most of those places.
Speaker 1: One of my favorite parts was when you were interviewing
Speaker 1: him and he was talking about maybe you can go
Speaker 1: over it a little bit more because you were doing
Speaker 1: the interview, but when he was talking about the green
Speaker 1: bud and not being able to sell green bud because
Speaker 1: it wasn't what they were used to.
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, if you see my face on the video,
Speaker 2: I think my eyes are probably as big as saucers.
Speaker 2: Because one of the things that's interesting in talking to
Speaker 2: like the you know what we've talked about is like
Speaker 2: the pioneer generation. Yeah, you know is you know, like
Speaker 2: Rob Clark and some of these guys that were writing
Speaker 2: the Bible for breeding, is just how new it all was.
Speaker 2: And so to think that in the mid eighties, as
Speaker 2: they first grew wed for themselves, that was the first
Speaker 2: time any of them had seen green bud. Yeah, because
Speaker 2: brown and gold or red or various kinds of cure
Speaker 2: or whatever that was the standard. There was no other
Speaker 2: comm have even known that it looked that way when
Speaker 2: it was fresh. Yeah. So they grow homegrown and it
Speaker 2: comes out the way homegrown does, and they're not even
Speaker 2: sure they're going to be able to sell it because
Speaker 2: no one's ever seen it.
Speaker 4: I'm sure they didn't even know if it would get
Speaker 4: them high when they first looked at it, if it
Speaker 4: was so different, you know, I mean.
Speaker 2: So that just goes to speak to the level of
Speaker 2: pioneering that they were trying to have to figure all
Speaker 2: this stuff out. The other part, that's just a little tidbit,
Speaker 2: but I found like endlessly amusing, honestly, is that obviously
Speaker 2: an American weed culture, we can kind of trace a
Speaker 2: lot of strains back. But then there's like a nickname,
Speaker 2: you know, where NL five skunk one doesn't stay that way,
Speaker 2: it gets nicknamed something else, sure something maybe this NL
Speaker 2: five Hayes gets nicknamed dogs or electric Bugaloo or whatever.
Speaker 2: And so you know, we have this whole countercultural thing
Speaker 2: in America of relating our strains the various pop culture
Speaker 2: stuff that's current for us, right, And so to hear
Speaker 2: that whole story about Victor Barne and the way that
Speaker 2: and the way that they whose name it was, and
Speaker 2: this hustle and how they had to have a name
Speaker 2: to deposit all these millions obviously not knowing holland you know,
Speaker 2: culture like that. I never had any idea that that
Speaker 2: was related to anything like that, but it does tie
Speaker 2: in to the fact that we people have always had
Speaker 2: kind of a knack to pick funny, tongue in cheek
Speaker 2: kind of names for week.
Speaker 4: Yeah, like choice, he said that was kind of like
Speaker 4: a fuck you to the Queen of Holland exactly.
Speaker 2: So yeah, I mean, so both those things, both those names.
Speaker 2: That tradition has continued throughout the decades. People are always
Speaker 2: coming up with clever plays on the culture that they're in.
Speaker 2: And so while you know, Holland weed culture and American
Speaker 2: weed culture is obviously quite different, it was pretty neat
Speaker 2: to hear that they should we share that sort of
Speaker 2: you know. And on top of that too, I'll just say,
Speaker 2: as a general sense, everything he said about his attitude
Speaker 2: towards weed and their approach towards things and all that, like,
Speaker 2: I pretty much agree with. I mean, it was obvious
Speaker 2: talking to him, his heart was in the right place.
Speaker 2: They were pretty countercultural people. They were trying to get
Speaker 2: away with it, they were trying to overgrow or change things.
Speaker 4: Yeah, and you know, my favorite part that endeared me
Speaker 4: to him was his lachhemism nature.
Speaker 2: You know, even for I mean, obviously there was a
Speaker 2: financial component for him, him and people doing what they
Speaker 2: were doing. But in a way it started a countercultural revolution.
Speaker 2: The reason why people are so interested in Super Sativa
Speaker 2: Seed Club is because so many legends exist of weed
Speaker 2: grown in Canada and America of those strains by people
Speaker 2: from them. So they played a pretty big role. Them
Speaker 2: and Neville are really the two groups that started spreading
Speaker 2: all this seed everywhere, and that that's pretty important because
Speaker 2: they laid the foundation for what came after. I mean,
Speaker 2: it's also it was also interesting because we've already you know,
Speaker 2: we always wondered but hearing how when they saw what
Speaker 2: happened to Neville and they saw green Merchant and they
Speaker 2: saw the international police pressure, that that's what made them
Speaker 2: decide to disband for a long time and not continue
Speaker 2: because they saw, you know, the price that a lot
Speaker 2: of these pioneers paid had to do this kind of stuff,
Speaker 2: you know, was was pretty intense.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 2: Another thing I want to mention just before I forget,
Speaker 2: and that this might be really pertinent because it's kind
Speaker 2: of experiencing a resurgence. But you know when he was
Speaker 2: talking about his skunk Hayes, Oh yeah, yeah, So first
Speaker 2: of all, that's another piece of evidence that you know,
Speaker 2: there was at least three people that seemed to get
Speaker 2: Hayes from Sam skunk Man when he came over to
Speaker 2: Holland the first time.
Speaker 1: Yeah, we have all in our yes and correct correct.
Speaker 2: And and you know they all, you know, their stories
Speaker 2: all are all similar. It was interesting to hear that
Speaker 2: that maybe there wasn't even that many Hayes seeds given out,
Speaker 2: you know. Uh, maybe that leads to the fact that
Speaker 2: he didn't bring over that that many. Yeah, and it
Speaker 2: was kind of hesitant, you know, and only wanted to
Speaker 2: give out so many before he could make his own
Speaker 2: breeding and increase it again.
Speaker 4: But if we were able to talk to him about it, it
Speaker 4: would it would actually answer a lot of questions. So
Speaker 4: hopefully in the future he'd be into it.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 2: And one thing that I think for all the modern
Speaker 2: Hayes freaks out there, because with the A five and
Speaker 2: C five sneaking out and a lot of people breed
Speaker 2: Cuban black Haze and n L five Haze, I think
Speaker 2: is having quite a bit of a resurgence as piff
Speaker 2: for church or different things like that. Is how we
Speaker 2: talked about how the skunk cage that they've had for
Speaker 2: thirty five years. If you grew it under you know,
Speaker 2: in American terms, eighty two degrees, you know, if you
Speaker 2: grew it cold, it only took about twelve twelve and
Speaker 2: a half weeks to finish, and it formed nice buds.
Speaker 2: But let it creep above eighty two for even an
Speaker 2: hour or two, and you've got a running long stativa
Speaker 2: twenty plus week. They would add another eight weeks a
Speaker 2: couple months, and so they you know, it was really
Speaker 2: interesting to hear that because there's a lot of people
Speaker 2: playing with hazes right now. Sure, and if that holds true,
Speaker 2: I wonder if people ran rooms in the low to
Speaker 2: mid seventies and we're militant about keeping it that low.
Speaker 2: There's a lot of people that run CO two in
Speaker 2: their rooms. There's a lot of data out there where
Speaker 2: you might run your room in the load mid eighties
Speaker 2: to get VPD, know, or to get more use out
Speaker 2: of your CO two and try to rapid fire. Yeah,
Speaker 2: and that might be the exact bad approach for running
Speaker 2: some of these old hazes.
Speaker 3: Yea.
Speaker 2: So maybe if you know people are listening and interested
Speaker 2: and you have hazes, try running them in the load
Speaker 2: of mid seventies and see if they form a little
Speaker 2: different and see if they finish faster, because the difference
Speaker 2: between twelve and twenty weeks.
Speaker 3: Is a lot.
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's tremendous.
Speaker 2: That is tremendous, you know. So it's also interesting in that,
Speaker 2: you know, maybe we can eventually get to work on
Speaker 2: some of his stuff over here. But most people's haze
Speaker 2: stuff comes from the plants that Neville found, and so
Speaker 2: it was crazy to hear that the skunk haze that
Speaker 2: he has is a survivor from Hayes seed that he found.
Speaker 1: Yeah, so it's not haze or hay C.
Speaker 2: It's not haze or it's hay C. It's another haze
Speaker 2: that is now trapped in genetics that maybe could be used.
Speaker 2: And a lot of these issues with haze are inbreeding
Speaker 2: because there's only a parent or two. So when you
Speaker 2: only have a couple parents being used and mostly c
Speaker 2: A is still way more rare to even use third
Speaker 2: parent adds a lot more genetics.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it sure does. That's a good direction and potential.
Speaker 2: So it's pretty interesting. Maybe, you know he's been talking
Speaker 2: about during that interview they're starting up the company again
Speaker 2: and they've got some initial work coming out. So that
Speaker 2: made me quite a bit more excited about anything that
Speaker 2: uses that plant because the other thing too relative to
Speaker 2: that plant is I thought his talk about how different
Speaker 2: skunk one was in the mid eighties when it first
Speaker 2: arrived than what it became later on, and a lot
Speaker 2: of people have considered that skunk one has been this
Speaker 2: consistent thing we're used to citrus or grapes or you know,
Speaker 2: maybe some cheese or funk. Yeah, but he said it
Speaker 2: was kind of rank when it came over.
Speaker 4: So that that does I wonder if that holds true
Speaker 4: to to stuff that Sam Dave had said about breeding
Speaker 4: out skunk, breeding out the actual skunk skunky smells, I should.
Speaker 2: Say, I mean, there's not that many people we should
Speaker 2: talk to that were growing skunk in nineteen eighty five.
Speaker 2: But yeah, the other interesting part about that is that
Speaker 2: obviously that skunk has that he talked about contains that
Speaker 2: raw more raw skunk one. Yeah, it's in addition to
Speaker 2: a double another haze. The other side of it is this,
Speaker 2: you know, maybe before it was hard selected in that
Speaker 2: direction that we're also familiar with.
Speaker 4: Yeah, it could be like closer to something like an
Speaker 4: Afghan haese that could be really ranked.
Speaker 2: Yeah, Yeah, I mean it was. It was interesting tidbit
Speaker 2: because you have so few people you can talk to
Speaker 2: about what was mid eighties skunk.
Speaker 1: One like, yeah, yeah, it's true. It's true.
Speaker 2: And he obviously bought it and bred it and sold
Speaker 2: it and it was a big part of his catalog
Speaker 2: and the years they were in operation. So hearing his
Speaker 2: opinion about how mid and late eighties skunk was vastly
Speaker 2: different than what came later was to me at least
Speaker 2: confirmation you know that that you know the state that
Speaker 2: things were in.
Speaker 1: I thought it was.
Speaker 4: It was pretty cool when I think we were talking
Speaker 4: about Friezeland Friesland, Indica, where he was very honest and
Speaker 4: said he wasn't really stoked with where he's seen Freezeland
Speaker 4: been taken now as it's been grown, in bred and
Speaker 4: FGM like, he wasn't really stoked with the current offering
Speaker 4: of Friezeland out there.
Speaker 2: I mean, you know, I understand from his perspective likestly.
Speaker 2: One thing that's certainly true is with Instagram and other
Speaker 2: forms going on these days, is that that's the way
Speaker 2: that a lot of people interact with a lot of cannaid.
Speaker 2: They never get to try so looks have become incredibly important. Yeah,
Speaker 2: you know. Uh, and you know, so you you go
Speaker 2: to the looks of some of those eighties and nineties
Speaker 2: strains pretty rough.
Speaker 1: Yeah, there's some of them a little rough.
Speaker 2: You know, it's pretty pretty rough. They might not be
Speaker 2: the most resonance, They might be kind of leafy, they
Speaker 2: might look kind of fugly. Yeah. Put that next to like,
Speaker 2: you know, some kind of very modern, very gorgeous looking plant.
Speaker 2: And by looks alone, it kind of looks like you're
Speaker 2: you know, you're drawn in squiggles or something.
Speaker 1: You know, it's like, sure, you.
Speaker 2: Know, but but it also reiterates that like you can't
Speaker 2: you can't look at effect with your eyes exactly. So
Speaker 2: it could be a super There's a lot of haze
Speaker 2: out there that's kind of ugly, but it works really good.
Speaker 2: I mean, there's a there's there's famous haze in New
Speaker 2: York that gets sold brown Yeah, and in modern times
Speaker 2: it's not very easy to sell brown weed.
Speaker 1: No, but that but that name. It also it tastes
Speaker 1: great and it works, that's true.
Speaker 2: So the smoke is great, you know the fact that
Speaker 2: it I mean, even so you know, uh, you know,
Speaker 2: we had this, we had this cut that. You know,
Speaker 2: my friend helped make that the chocolate diesel, right, yeah,
Speaker 2: and it and it was a combination of chocolate tie
Speaker 2: across to the ninety one and then cross the sourities. Yeah.
Speaker 2: It was crazy too, like he it was legitimate old
Speaker 2: like eighties chocolate tie smoll than types. Right, And eventually
Speaker 2: it got lost because it was super potent. It was
Speaker 2: like top super thie super cam. It knocked you on
Speaker 2: your ass, but it cured brown. Yeah, and people hated
Speaker 2: it for that look. That look even Keem four Kim
Speaker 2: four can sometimes cure to like a very light brownish.
Speaker 2: It still looks the resin and all that, and the
Speaker 2: butt itself looks amazing, but people don't like brown.
Speaker 1: The old clockwork Orange Mom was the same.
Speaker 4: We called it orange not because of the flavor, but
Speaker 4: it was more because of the actual color of the
Speaker 4: plant when it was done.
Speaker 1: You know, it was more of.
Speaker 4: A golden orange brown look to it. It was unique
Speaker 4: in that sense.
Speaker 2: But really, I mean, you know, you talked his interview
Speaker 2: is not that much different than what a lot of
Speaker 2: us have who have bred in various houses in various
Speaker 2: ways and tried to get away with it here and there.
Speaker 2: You know, and they were just grabbing the best stuff
Speaker 2: they could at the time. Some of them were straight strained,
Speaker 2: some of them were bag seeds that they found out
Speaker 2: a good weed and coffee shops. Yeah, is how a
Speaker 2: lot of breeding in America happened too later on as well,
Speaker 2: a bag seed has ruled the game for you know.
Speaker 2: And so it's cool that things are opening up and
Speaker 2: we can talk to people like that who have such
Speaker 2: a vastly different experience of starting. Then yah know, maybe
Speaker 2: we can get some more you know, if things open
Speaker 2: up a little bit more in America and over there,
Speaker 2: there could be some actual, like more closer collaborations. Yeah,
Speaker 2: because obviously there's been a lot of illicit flow back
Speaker 2: and forth between the Dutch and America and Canada. Yeah,
Speaker 2: but it would be neat to be able to one
Speaker 2: day to actually do it, Yeah, because we each have
Speaker 2: some pretty amazing things, and we have some different lines,
Speaker 2: and we have some things that segregated from each other
Speaker 2: over time. You know, you talk about him being able
Speaker 2: to go to Canada and there's there's some super sativa
Speaker 2: seed club stuff that still exists, sure, and they might
Speaker 2: be able to get it back.
Speaker 4: And then you know that brings me to another part though,
Speaker 4: was when I was talking to him, and this might
Speaker 4: have been actually a private conversation, but it was. It
Speaker 4: was talking to him about the people that have made
Speaker 4: whole companies off of selling illicit not not illicit, but
Speaker 4: like unreal reproductions of super Stativac Club, just to market
Speaker 4: on the name and move seeds fast. And when he
Speaker 4: was talking about resourcing genetics, that's going to be a problem,
Speaker 4: that is an actual issue now that so many people
Speaker 4: have made different Super Sativa Seed Club repros.
Speaker 1: And it's going to make sourcing a little harder for
Speaker 1: some of it.
Speaker 2: Well, we've talked about this on previous podcasts in the
Speaker 2: sense that it's really only the last maybe five or
Speaker 2: six years that there's been a massive resurgence and trying
Speaker 2: to find ancient and original beans. Yea, there was a
Speaker 2: big era where everybody wanted new, new yes, and the
Speaker 2: old stuff was most of the stories were pretty honest
Speaker 2: because nobody cared.
Speaker 1: Yeah exactly.
Speaker 2: Now now that things have legalizes and things have opened
Speaker 2: up and lots of people have kind of the same things,
Speaker 2: there's been this massive explosion of I found these seeds
Speaker 2: in my old connections dresser, my grandma's freezer, this my
Speaker 2: that these have been faithfully reproduced, and not just SSSC,
Speaker 2: but every old legendary line you can think of. There's
Speaker 2: dates associated with them. Some of them are super early,
Speaker 2: too early, and it makes it, Yeah, it makes it
Speaker 2: really hard to sift through ye and find the real
Speaker 2: because there's there. As people get more excited about weed
Speaker 2: and people get more excited about the history and stuff,
Speaker 2: they're gonna they're gonna want just like we do. They're
Speaker 2: gonna want to try some old pure lines. Yeah. I
Speaker 2: would love to dig through everything from the seed bank
Speaker 2: and SSSC now, being my age and knowing what I
Speaker 2: know now, it would be amazing to dig through all
Speaker 2: that and so and so people pray it's you know,
Speaker 2: it's kind of like the roadkill skug thing, where there's
Speaker 2: a there's a market demand for certain things now and
Speaker 2: so there's a market demand for old So hopefully some
Speaker 2: of his old stuff legitimately did exist.
Speaker 4: Yeah, but I know, I know a few reproductions are
Speaker 4: out there that are legitimate for some of them. But
Speaker 4: it just goes to say that it's cool that that
Speaker 4: people are getting so into researching cannabis to the point
Speaker 4: of really getting into provenance and stuff like that.
Speaker 1: So it combats that because.
Speaker 4: If stuff like that doesn't sell, if these if these
Speaker 4: guys who are doing these reproductions that you're it's pretty obvious.
Speaker 4: Usually when these guys are working invious.
Speaker 2: It might be obvious to us, it might be less
Speaker 2: obvious to others, depending on you know, how how in
Speaker 2: tune your scam dar is or whatever. But that's true.
Speaker 2: I do think that for most people, you know, there's
Speaker 2: a lot of strains. I'll be frank, like, I went
Speaker 2: to a lot of Amsterdam trips. I bought a lot
Speaker 2: of seed. Most of it was not keepers. Yeah, I
Speaker 2: did find some cool stuff, certainly, others found some elites
Speaker 2: that have survived to this day off the same lines
Speaker 2: that I bought. Yeah, but even back then it was
Speaker 2: a total crapshoot and there was there was a lot
Speaker 2: to not be impressed by. So, you know, him looking
Speaker 2: and being honest and being like, oh, there it.
Speaker 1: Wasn't it's not so nice.
Speaker 2: Yeah, but still if it is real. The cool part
Speaker 2: about it is is that opening up the gene pool
Speaker 2: and adding genes that have been lost over time and
Speaker 2: aren't being used. We have too much overuse too few
Speaker 2: lines in cannabis right now, So a lot of eighties
Speaker 2: and old things by themselves might not be all that great,
Speaker 2: but they could widen the gene pool and you never
Speaker 2: know what they might pop an out CROSSSS absolutely, you know,
Speaker 2: you know, we just you know CSI. Who knows where
Speaker 2: the ABC work will go. Yeah, that's still in its
Speaker 2: infancy as you start hybridizing it with things and adding
Speaker 2: those genes in and making polyhybrids with it. So to me,
Speaker 2: some of the most valid if anything from the eighties
Speaker 2: or early nineties survived, even if by itself it's not
Speaker 2: that great, it might have traits or things that you
Speaker 2: add into something really mbred you get something surprising.
Speaker 1: Yeah, you never know how terpenes will modify other terpenes
Speaker 1: with diolic expressions, you never know. And with new and
Speaker 1: novel expressions or maybe they weren't new in novel in
Speaker 1: the eighties, but they're back to being new and novel
Speaker 1: now and that we never know how that'll change and
Speaker 1: modify now.
Speaker 2: And you know, one of the things about breeding is
Speaker 2: you tend to get good results when you cross things
Speaker 2: that are very dissimilar to each other. And so taking
Speaker 2: something that hasn't been really worked with much since the
Speaker 2: eighties or early nineties, and isn't in a lot of
Speaker 2: this cush skittles, cookies, whatever blends of things. It might
Speaker 2: pop some new and cool things and that. So you know,
Speaker 2: all in all, I thought he was a wealth of information,
Speaker 2: absolutely super engaging and pleasant. He seemed like an older
Speaker 2: version of us, you know, he did. So that made
Speaker 2: it like really fun and relaxing to chat with him
Speaker 2: about everything. Sure, he seems willing to maybe do some
Speaker 2: more and so there's I'm sure there's a lot of
Speaker 2: history and experiences that he's seen that's right up our alley.
Speaker 2: So you know, no promises, but we'll see what comes
Speaker 2: of it. Yeah, And in closing it, I think I
Speaker 2: think we learned a lot. I think there was a
Speaker 2: lot of things that weren't very well publicly known that
Speaker 2: he clarified and so not only from a historical perspective,
Speaker 2: but for the current Uh, I think it was it
Speaker 2: was really it was really a good interview.
Speaker 3: H Yeah.
Speaker 4: I was really really stoked to be able to speak
Speaker 4: with him.
Speaker 2: It was.
Speaker 4: It was it was one of those few times where
Speaker 4: it's someone that you've always wanted to interview and speak to,
Speaker 4: and they weren't a complete disappointment.
Speaker 1: It was absolutely an honors.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it was great. It was great. So I hope
Speaker 2: everybody enjoyed listening to it. You know, it's a little
Speaker 2: bit strange. It's two part uh and uh. We'll see
Speaker 2: how things go, but we hope to be able to
Speaker 2: bring you some more of some of the pioneers in
Speaker 2: cannabis and there view on things and how we got
Speaker 2: to where we are. So, you know, thanks and peace everyone.
Speaker 1: Thank you.