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Speaker 1: You're listening to Petlifradio dot Com.

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Speaker 2: Well, well, well, good afternoon, everyone, and welcome to pet

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Life Radio's own Ask the Best with Doctor Jeff. I

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am your host for the next thirty minutes, Doctor Jeff Warber,

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here sitting and I know you're gonna hate to hear

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it again. Very sunny southern California. I think we're hitting

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eighty today. In fact, it's one of those weird days

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that they expect midday, which is kind of around now,

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it's gonna be at eighty degrees, but this evening is

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gonna go up to eighty four.

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Speaker 3: That's pretty unusual.

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Speaker 2: Very rarely do we get warmer at in the evening

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than we are midday. So but the good news is

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for those of us listening in the West that Mammoth

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has now about a seventy inch base, which is way

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better than the thirty five inchespace I was up there

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a couple of weeks ago. So we're finally starting to

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get some pretty good snow up there, and they're expecting

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snow over this weekend too, which.

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Speaker 3: Makes me very happy.

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Speaker 2: Anyway, just one it once again as we are sitting

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here at a beautiful one o'clock here in mid afternoon

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in Los Angeles on the West.

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Speaker 3: Coast, four o'clock back east.

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Speaker 2: I feel for you watching the news this morning and

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seeing what are they saying ten inches an hour, some

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insane amount of snow. So I feel for anyone having

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to battle that in the East, but I'm certainly glad

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that I don't live there anymore. And I want to

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thank our sponsors. We are working with Pet Health Network.

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We are working with pro Sense Pet Products, a great

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line of products that are basically veterinary quality products that

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you can find at the mass market level stores like Target,

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stores like Walmart, a lot of your drug stores as well,

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even some Kroger's. So if you really want to help

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do your pets a favor, do your wallet of favor,

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go check out some pro Sense products. So I want

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to hear from you. That's why I'm sitting here. I'm

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sitting here waiting to hear your phone calls. Get your

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messages here online at petlifradio dot com. You can call

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us live eight seven seven three eight five eight eight

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eight two and I'm here to answer your questions, so

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go ahead and ask. You can also join our chat.

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When you log onto pet Life Radio, you'll see at

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the bottom, it says click here to join the conversation.

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Go ahead and click and join the conversation. Just enter

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in as a guest, and we will love you to

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be here with us and kind of check us out

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and talk to us. Now, we had a really interesting

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case yesterday, and it brings to mind that which I

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will probably see you will all see a little bit

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more often. Come well whenever the weather does get better.

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But dog's running, dogs playing, dogs exercising. So one of

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my patients, a rather large pitbull, was at a dog

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park and he was playing with some other dogs, as

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they are prone to do at the dog parks. Hopefully

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you have dog friendly dogs if you're going to take

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your dog to a dog park. And the owner saw

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the dog with a one of these. They weren't many

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tennis balls. They were probably two thirds the size of

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a regular tennis ball. And he sees this tennis ball

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in his mouth, and he's talking to a friend, and

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the dog's running and playing with the ball, and he

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says to his friend, oh my god, hold.

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Speaker 3: On, I'm right back. I just got to get the

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ball out of his mouth.

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Speaker 2: In that minute, not even minute, in that second that

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he turned to look at his friend to say, I'll

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be right back. When he turned back around to walk

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towards his dog, No tennis ball gone finito, he says,

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oh my gosh, no, tell me, dog's name is Timber.

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Tell me you didn't eat the tennis ball. And sure

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enough he goes. He's looking all over the ground, he's

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looking maybe the dog kicked it. Maybe playbe the dog

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ran by and grabbed it. No tennis ball, So the

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dog's acting totally fine. So he brings the dog in

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and with that history that I think my dog may

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have swallowed this tennis ball. To swallow a tennis ball

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hole is actually a pretty good talent. So I put

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the dog on the X ray table and sure enough,

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sure enough, what do you see clear his day on

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this X ray is a tennis ball. I mean, the

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only thing that I've ever seen more clearly couple of

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things actually is once a dog that swallowed.

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Speaker 3: And it's so funny.

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Speaker 2: The detail was so clear that you could see it

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thirty six cents. You could see the quarter, you could

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see the dime, and you could see the penny just

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by size, and like subtle pictures, that's how amazingly clear.

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And the X ray was then I had a dog

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once who thought, I guess, by looking at too many

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commercials and watching the ever ready bunny, he thought it

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would do him some good to swallow two batteries.

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Speaker 3: And he did.

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Speaker 2: He swallowed two double A batteries. And boy, there is

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nothing that shows up more clearly on an X.

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Speaker 3: Ray than a battery.

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Speaker 2: And you can see these two batteries sitting right in

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the stomach as if they were placed there purposely to

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give this dog an extra charge. But then came yesterday's

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tennis ball. Not actually pretty clear picture. You could see

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the ball part right the rubber, You could see the

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fuzz outside of the circumference of the ball, and it

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was sitting there. And it's one of those things where

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we said to the owner, you know, we have really

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only one choice.

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Speaker 3: Here's the problem.

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Speaker 2: The problem is with a ball like that, or any

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foreign object in a stomach, that it's easier to get

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into the stomach than to get out in order. For example,

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if you have a single solitary object that is of

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substantial size, it's usually not helpful to try to induce

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vomiting just for that, because the object in the stomach

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has to line up exactly with the esophageal opening called

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the cardia, where the esophagus comes down into the stomach

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in order for it to come back up again.

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Speaker 3: And also some of the things that dogs are prone

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to liqu or chew.

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Speaker 2: Or swallow got down, that's great, but to get them

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back up might actually cause some of the irritation. That's

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why we say, if a dog gets into chicken bones,

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for example, do not absolutely do not induce vomiting, because

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you're lucky enough the thing got in there hole or however,

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didn't what the esophac is, didn't scratch the esophagus hopefully,

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but to make it come back up again the wrong way,

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you're looking for trouble to reach in. So that's why interestingly,

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when we have a single like a solitary object that

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we think we can get to come out, we usually

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advise that owners will feed their dogs a bunch of

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stuff like bulk, like give them a half a loaf

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of bread or something for a big dog, and hopefully

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the object will get sort of intertwined within the bread

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and then if you induce vomiting, then maybe it'll come up.

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And also the bread will act as a bit of

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a protectant But the other problem is that on the

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other end we have something called the pylorus. The pylorus

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is that part of the stomach. It's the outflow from

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the stomach itself to the do adenum, and that's an

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area where we've got to be very careful with because

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the pancreatic ducts right that supply the digestive juices from

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the execrine pancreas, the digestive part, the digestive enzyme part

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of the pancreas into the duodenum to help their digestive process,

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and the bio ducts all come into that area. So

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you got to be very careful because you don't want

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anything to happen to that area. Very difficult area to

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surgically repair, and you got to be very cautious because

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of those ducks. So you always have to ask yourself,

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if you're going to get something that's going to cause

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you the need to go in, would you rather take

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it out somewhere of in the intestine where it make

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it stuck in a very very challenging spot, or take

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it out of the stomach, which is less technically challenging

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by the way. So the only other option we could

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try to give them was going in with an endoscope

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and trying to grab the ball out. But the problem

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is the device that we use.

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Speaker 3: There are little grabbers. They look like little claws that.

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Speaker 2: When you couldn't possibly get them around this ball, but

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they don't have the strength to As soon as you're

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going to try to pull that ball out backwards in

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through the esophagus and you have to go through that

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muscular ring at the cardia of the stomach, that the

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ball is going to fall right out of the grabbers.

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So that's going to be an exercise in futility. So

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bottom line, today went into Timber's stomach sure enough took

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out this very very, very whole, undigested tennis ball. As

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I was telling the owners when they picked out, sorry,

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we know we did the surgery yesterday. He went home

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today and we told the owners that when they picked

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up this morning that that was probably one of the

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most expensive tennis balls.

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Speaker 3: They're ever going to find.

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Speaker 2: And that I asked them as we were discussing diet

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and certain things that we can do as for the

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next couple of weeks, and I totally advised them to

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take tennis balls out of the diet. I think that

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would be a wise thing, because one they certainly did

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not and do not want to go.

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Speaker 3: To this again.

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Speaker 2: Now one we did one more thing when we were

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in the stomach, and I'm going to recommend this as

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a definite as a gimme to anyone out there listening,

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especially if you have a female of one of these

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breeds we're going to talk about. Might be a little

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more challenging for male, and I'll give you tell you

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why in obvious reasons. But if you have a large breed,

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deep chested dog, and that could be anything from your

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very large like your new Fees, your Pyrenees, your Great

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day your Irish wolfhounds, to your large breeds, your Shepherd's,

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your Rottweilers, your Adobe's, your labradors, your Golden Retrievers, et cetera.

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There is a condition that if it's never happened to

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one of your dogs, you're lucky. But it does happen

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quite frequently, and that is called gastric torsion. The stomach

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bloats up and because of movement, because of many factors

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that were not even aware of, the stomach now turns

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three hundred and sixty degrees on its own axis.

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Speaker 3: And this is.

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Speaker 2: Very very dangerous. It is a deadly situation. It is

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a definite, true immediate emergency. Typically, well not typically, I

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would practice one hundred percent. If the dog doesn't pass

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on its own, it is a surgical emergency. There's really

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no way to de rotate the stomach. Many have tried

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different things, So the key really is you need to

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go in and what happens when the stomach gets turned

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on itself. The cascade of new problems and complications that

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occur with this are really frightening. Spleen gets engorged, blood

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supply to the stomach is affected, can be cut off,

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actually requiring depending on severity, The needs to remove part

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of the stomach, often to remove part of the spleen,

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if not all of I mean remove the spleen.

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Speaker 3: It's just a disaster.

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Speaker 2: So what we did with Timber yesterday, what I highly

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highly advise that anyone who's even having one of these

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breeds Spade so they're already under anesthesia in surgery, have

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that ventral midline incision having the dog fixed. That you

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opt if you are asked, and if you're not asked,

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you should ask for it. And that is g Doc

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while she is in surgery with her abdomen opened and

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you're doing the spae. Please PEXI the stomach, it's called

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a gastro PEXI. What we do typically, what we do

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is to the right side. We take that portion of

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the stomach as it's moving into the due denum due

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denum small intestine.

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Speaker 3: That's the right side.

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Speaker 2: The stomach enters on the left to cut across the

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body goes into the right side.

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Speaker 3: That you actually attach.

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Speaker 2: Permanently attach the stomach to the inside of the thorax,

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the chest cavity on that right side. I will explain

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why in just a minute, but we have to take

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our break. I want to thank once again. Meanwhile, I

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have not seen the phone ring eight seven seven three

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eight five eight eight A two, So I want to

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see that phone ring once again.

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Speaker 3: Eight seven seven three eight five eight eight A two.

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Speaker 2: If you were had a dog who bloated, had surgery,

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didn't have surgery, didn't make it. Whatever I want to

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hear from you, I'd love. We need to have our

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listeners understand the importance and the how important prevention can

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be with this condition. So stay tuned, don't go away.

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We'll be back in a minute. Here on pet Life Radio,

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ascibets with yours truly, Doctor Jack.

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Speaker 4: We'll be right back right after these messages.

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our animal friends, and will also be bringing.

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and what they're doing to promote a more humane world.

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Our own highly experienced staff and friends of the organization

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will also join us each week to share what they're

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up to in the animal world.

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Speaker 1: I hope you'll.

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Speaker 4: Humane every week on demand only on Petlfradio dot com.

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Speaker 8: Let's talk past, Let's come pet Talk About.

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Speaker 6: Life Radio, HETLFE Radio, CATLVE Radio dot com.

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Speaker 3: So welcome back.

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Speaker 2: You're here with doctor Jeff Warber here on Ask the

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Bets with Doctor Jeff on pet Life Radio and before

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the break we were talking about a very very serious

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condition that we unfortunately see all too commonly in the

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large breed deep chested dogs, and that is called gastric

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torsion GDV. It's called gas dilatation. That the stomach first

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gets big and volvuless, it turns around on itself, and

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it is severe because what it does is not only

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blocks off The reason why it's so dangerous is that

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when that stomach it is like taking a partially filled balloon.

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Speaker 3: Have someone hold all both ends, and then someone in the.

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Speaker 2: Middle twists it so you can see how it's blocking

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off any entry or exit.

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Speaker 3: So what happens.

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Speaker 2: What is one of the byproducts of digestion and the

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bacteria in our stomachs, it's gas. Well, typically that gas

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can go in or out either way comes out one end,

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it can go out the other end.

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Speaker 3: But when it.

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Speaker 2: Can't, it continues to be manufactured. And literally the stomach

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is getting bigger and bigger and bigger as it does,

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and the wall gets tighter and tighter, and the vessels

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coursing through that twisted portion start getting constricted. So now

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we lose blood supply, and the spleen gets engorged and

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parts of the stomach geting gorged and then start getting blue,

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and the stomach wall gets starts getting thin, and you

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can actually have a stomach rupture and when it does,

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or the spleen rupture, either way, it is a very

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painful demise and something that when you see or if

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you ever the classic, classic presentation is you go out

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for dinner. Your dog's left home inside or even outside

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the yard anywhere, and you come back and the dog

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starts to try and you notice your pet dry heaving, vomiting,

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trying him out, but nothing's coming out. And you kind

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of look at him and you watch and feel his abdomen,

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his lower abdomen, and it's getting bigger and bigger, almost

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tight like a druma. And the dog is getting very weak.

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His color is getting pale, we call it TACKI. His

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mucous membranes are drying up. He continues to try to vomit,

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nothing he's coming up. This is classic. This is get

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my dog into the car to the veterinarian hospital immediately.

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00:16:56,200 --> 00:16:58,480
And it's such a problem when we see it. And

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not every dog even that you get there on time,

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that has surgery. It's not automatic, instant survival even with

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successful surgery. There are conditions that we have for some

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other clots that are possible. We have reperfusion concerns, and

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that is where you have a blood supply that's been

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shut off and then you rapidly reopen this blood supply.

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That's called reperfusion. All of a sudden, these tissues are

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extremely rapidly being replenished with oxygen that we can get

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00:17:28,160 --> 00:17:30,880
the release of what's called free radicals, which is why

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00:17:30,880 --> 00:17:33,200
obviously we know a lot of us, maybe even some

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00:17:33,240 --> 00:17:36,200
of your pets, take antioxidants to gobble up these free radicals.

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But we can get a lot of free radical damage

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to very very important tissues like the heart from this

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reperfusion injury. We can also have the release of clots

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from the repairing and re establishing the normal anatomy of

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that stomach, sometimes having to take out the spleen in

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the process. So it's amazing the cascade of problems that

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00:17:57,839 --> 00:18:02,400
follow from the GDV, from the gastric bloat and torsion.

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00:18:02,640 --> 00:18:05,680
So what I recommend, and we offer it more than

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00:18:05,759 --> 00:18:07,960
offer it, we kind of insist on it that when

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we are doing space and we have that perfect sized

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00:18:11,440 --> 00:18:14,519
young dog on the table. It's of one of the

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00:18:14,599 --> 00:18:17,200
breeds at risk. We will tell the owner. You know what,

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00:18:17,519 --> 00:18:19,599
while we're in here, while we're doing the spay, we

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00:18:19,720 --> 00:18:23,759
really do recommend doing a pecksy. Let's attach the stomach

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to the inside of the body wall at the right

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side by the ribs, and by doing so that stomach

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00:18:31,039 --> 00:18:34,119
cannot tours. It could still bloat, but it can't tours,

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it can't twist because now the stomach is anchored to

358
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the body wall. And if you have any of these dogs,

359
00:18:41,359 --> 00:18:44,039
the large breeds, and you have not been in for

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00:18:44,119 --> 00:18:47,119
a spae yet. A female, I would absolutely, as I

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00:18:47,160 --> 00:18:50,279
said before our fifteen minute break, that you need to

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00:18:50,319 --> 00:18:52,880
talk to the veterinarian about doing this procedure.

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00:18:52,920 --> 00:18:53,119
Speaker 3: Now.

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00:18:53,279 --> 00:18:55,759
Speaker 2: The reason I mentioned earlier in the segment about males

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00:18:56,039 --> 00:18:58,440
is that though of course you should do it as well,

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00:18:58,640 --> 00:19:00,960
but I do recognize the fact that in a male,

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00:19:01,200 --> 00:19:03,319
to do it while you're in for the neuter is

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00:19:03,400 --> 00:19:05,200
much more of a stretch. I mean, when you're doing

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00:19:05,279 --> 00:19:07,640
a neuter, especially if you're using laser as I am,

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00:19:07,960 --> 00:19:09,920
all the surgery is being done in the scrotum. You're

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00:19:09,960 --> 00:19:13,119
not even making any cuts in the body wall, and

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00:19:13,559 --> 00:19:17,279
when you're doing it a neuter the traditional way, your incision,

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00:19:17,359 --> 00:19:21,960
your scalpel incision is a pre scrotal incision. It's right

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00:19:22,039 --> 00:19:24,640
on the top of the previews way back, just in

375
00:19:24,640 --> 00:19:27,440
front of the scrotum. Either way, you are nowhere near

376
00:19:28,039 --> 00:19:31,319
the abdomen. You don't need to cut into the abdomen

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00:19:31,480 --> 00:19:34,480
to do a neuter. So to ask an owner at

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00:19:34,480 --> 00:19:37,400
that point, the only common link you have is the

379
00:19:37,400 --> 00:19:40,200
fact that the dog is under anesesia. But other than that,

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00:19:40,519 --> 00:19:42,480
it's not really one and the same. At least with

381
00:19:42,519 --> 00:19:45,720
a female, you're extending incision cranily, meaning forward just a

382
00:19:45,759 --> 00:19:49,400
little bit, and you do your PECKSI so should you

383
00:19:49,440 --> 00:19:51,400
do it with a male even though you know, even

384
00:19:51,440 --> 00:19:54,240
though it's you're nowhere near. Yes, you got the anthesia

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00:19:54,319 --> 00:19:56,039
already paid for being done.

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00:19:56,440 --> 00:19:56,960
Speaker 3: Go ahead.

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00:19:57,240 --> 00:19:59,519
Speaker 2: And if you got one of these breeds and you

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00:19:59,559 --> 00:20:03,200
make the homolincision and just have your vet do it, it.

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00:20:02,799 --> 00:20:04,160
Speaker 3: Very much could save a life.

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00:20:04,200 --> 00:20:06,279
Speaker 2: Now, I don't know what your vet would charge for it,

391
00:20:06,519 --> 00:20:08,039
and I don't think that makes a difference. All it

392
00:20:08,039 --> 00:20:11,720
makes a difference is that whatever it costs you now

393
00:20:11,799 --> 00:20:16,240
as a young healthy dog. To add on that gastropexy.

394
00:20:16,400 --> 00:20:19,960
That's procedure that attaches the stomach to the body wall

395
00:20:20,240 --> 00:20:24,279
pails in comparison to what trying to save a dog

396
00:20:24,480 --> 00:20:27,519
from bloat would cost, because that one is going to

397
00:20:27,599 --> 00:20:30,799
run you into the thousands of dollars to do everything,

398
00:20:30,839 --> 00:20:33,359
I mean, from soup to nuts, the testing, the X rays,

399
00:20:33,400 --> 00:20:36,440
the decompressing, the surgery, the post out of care, which

400
00:20:36,480 --> 00:20:38,440
as I said, is very especially with the first seventy

401
00:20:38,440 --> 00:20:41,079
two hours after surgery. You know, we're very worried about

402
00:20:41,079 --> 00:20:43,720
the heart and the heart throwing what we call vpcs,

403
00:20:43,799 --> 00:20:47,880
getting heart rhythm irregularities. So you're in for a long haul.

404
00:20:48,160 --> 00:20:52,200
So to do something as a prophylactic procedure now when

405
00:20:52,240 --> 00:20:55,160
you're already paying for anesesia, boy, it's a no brainer,

406
00:20:55,319 --> 00:20:58,799
absolutely a no brainer. So again eight seven seven three

407
00:20:58,839 --> 00:21:01,240
eight five eight eight eight two. I just want to

408
00:21:01,279 --> 00:21:04,960
know if there's got to be knowing how sadly frequency

409
00:21:05,000 --> 00:21:06,359
we see this, and you know, we even see it

410
00:21:06,359 --> 00:21:10,359
in boarding animals. It's not always that the dog eats

411
00:21:10,359 --> 00:21:12,200
a big meal and then drinks a bunch of water

412
00:21:12,480 --> 00:21:14,839
and goes outside in place. I mean, it is true

413
00:21:15,200 --> 00:21:19,039
that if you ever took your dog's dry food. Poured

414
00:21:19,079 --> 00:21:22,960
the water that he would typically drink after eating onto

415
00:21:23,000 --> 00:21:25,480
the dry food and let it sit there for an

416
00:21:25,519 --> 00:21:27,839
hour or two. You would be amazed to see what

417
00:21:28,000 --> 00:21:32,640
happens to the volume, the meaning the size that is taken.

418
00:21:32,400 --> 00:21:35,000
Speaker 3: Up by that food. It probably triples.

419
00:21:35,400 --> 00:21:39,400
Speaker 2: So when a dog gobbles their food dry faster than

420
00:21:39,400 --> 00:21:42,160
they can chew, and then they take a couple of big, big,

421
00:21:42,160 --> 00:21:44,519
big gulps of water, and then they sit and do

422
00:21:44,599 --> 00:21:47,839
whatever they do, that ingestu that which is in the

423
00:21:47,839 --> 00:21:52,960
stomach has grown by leaps and bounds, which then predisposes

424
00:21:53,039 --> 00:21:55,359
them to bloat. And it could be something as easily

425
00:21:55,680 --> 00:21:58,680
as line down. You know that when we have animals

426
00:21:58,799 --> 00:22:01,599
here in the hospital. Let's say we're doing a procedure

427
00:22:01,640 --> 00:22:05,319
and they're lying with their right side down and they

428
00:22:05,400 --> 00:22:08,480
are whatever we're doing, we're doing teeth, we're taking a

429
00:22:08,519 --> 00:22:11,440
minor tumor off, but their right side is down, and

430
00:22:11,480 --> 00:22:14,720
now we want to flip them over to the left side. Now,

431
00:22:14,880 --> 00:22:17,519
the much easier way to do it would be to

432
00:22:17,640 --> 00:22:21,559
roll the dog on their backs from the right side

433
00:22:21,599 --> 00:22:23,920
being down, flop them over, legs go up in the

434
00:22:23,920 --> 00:22:25,920
air for a second, and then you put them to

435
00:22:25,960 --> 00:22:28,359
their other side where there now the left side is down,

436
00:22:28,559 --> 00:22:31,680
and we don't do that. Why because we get so

437
00:22:31,799 --> 00:22:35,400
nervous that if that stomach has any volume, think about it,

438
00:22:35,480 --> 00:22:37,440
the stomach may not turn with you. The stomach is said,

439
00:22:37,519 --> 00:22:40,000
gravity is doing its thing inside that chest cavity, in

440
00:22:40,039 --> 00:22:42,920
that abdominal cavity. That stomach is there. When you go

441
00:22:42,960 --> 00:22:45,279
to roll the dog, you're basically the stomach is staying

442
00:22:45,279 --> 00:22:48,000
stationary where it was and you've rolled everything else around

443
00:22:48,039 --> 00:22:51,880
the stomach. So the concern is you actually could induce

444
00:22:52,279 --> 00:22:52,920
a problem.

445
00:22:53,119 --> 00:22:56,160
Speaker 3: So what we do is we always.

446
00:22:55,920 --> 00:22:59,759
Speaker 2: Turn them chest down, so we take their feet, we

447
00:23:00,119 --> 00:23:02,839
tuck them under, and we roll them so instead of

448
00:23:02,920 --> 00:23:06,599
their back ever touching the table, it's from right side.

449
00:23:06,880 --> 00:23:10,720
We lean them over to their left, the stomach rolls

450
00:23:10,759 --> 00:23:12,720
over their chest and have them and kind of you know,

451
00:23:12,839 --> 00:23:15,759
roll over around the table, and then we put them

452
00:23:15,839 --> 00:23:18,960
to their left side down, And that way we don't

453
00:23:19,039 --> 00:23:21,720
run the same risk of having a problem with bloat

454
00:23:21,920 --> 00:23:25,000
or toursing with twisting the stomach. So anyway, that's a

455
00:23:25,039 --> 00:23:27,359
lot to digest. Pardon the pun, as we're talking about

456
00:23:27,400 --> 00:23:29,839
stomachs and bloats and eating. But if you have any questions,

457
00:23:29,880 --> 00:23:31,319
why don't you send me a text that has ever

458
00:23:31,319 --> 00:23:33,519
happened to you? If you've ever had a dog that bloated,

459
00:23:33,559 --> 00:23:36,200
I'd like to know. We'll share your story. Anyone whose

460
00:23:36,200 --> 00:23:38,400
story we use. Anyone who calls, anyone who writes in

461
00:23:38,599 --> 00:23:41,880
you get free pro Sense products sent directly to you.

462
00:23:42,359 --> 00:23:44,440
Speaker 3: So that's a cool thing. That's a good thing.

463
00:23:44,519 --> 00:23:46,200
Speaker 2: Let us know, dog or cat, We'll send you something

464
00:23:46,240 --> 00:23:48,519
out and this will hopefully prevent you from being so

465
00:23:48,640 --> 00:23:51,359
bashful and not giving us a call. So thank you

466
00:23:51,440 --> 00:23:54,440
for joining me here on Let's Talk Pets pet Life Radio.

467
00:23:54,759 --> 00:23:56,599
Ask the bets with Doctor Jeff. I'm your host, Doctor

468
00:23:56,680 --> 00:24:00,839
Jeff Werber, and we will be back here next Thursday,

469
00:24:01,480 --> 00:24:03,839
same bat time, same bat chand see you then.

470
00:24:04,240 --> 00:24:09,319
Speaker 4: Let's Talk Pets every week on demand only on Petlifradio

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00:24:09,640 --> 00:24:19,759
dot com.