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Speaker 1: What is up, Fellasiko's I am Dan Valley coming at

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you with the one, the only, this certified, fantabulous mister

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Grant hues he's getting ready to leave us for a

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little bit for vacation, but has agreed to do the

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NBA most confusing team's draft. We know you're all excited

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for it. Coming at you a full twelve hours earlier, then,

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I accidentally scheduled this live show for so Apologies to

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anyone who was waiting for us to be going live

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at two o'clock Eastern time in the morning. That's not

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when we were planning on going live. It was around

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two o'clock in me in the afternoon. A lot of

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just missteps on my end, Grant, As you said, I

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should probably start getting some sleep, but my question to you,

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I'm not so in my sleep deprived state. I will

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not forget this. How the heck are you doing? We

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need to know the answer.

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Speaker 2: I'm happy to be here. It feels like it's been

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a really long time. It because we didn't We haven't

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potted for a full week, is that correct? Is it

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more than that? It feels like almost two weeks. That's

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why it feels like a long time. I do feel

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like regular listeners would have immediately flagged the two am

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Eastern live stream start time and said that must be

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a mistake, because we're all well aware that that's several

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hours past my bedtime. There's no way I would appear

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on a live stream that's that late. If I did,

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it would be really unexciting because I would be unconscious.

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I would be asleep, which, you know, maybe that's something

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to put behind the paywall.

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Speaker 1: I don't know how often we need to do a podcast,

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but how often are you up past eleven pm? Your time?

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Speaker 2: No more than once a week, I would say, like that,

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and that's just how oft Well I could ask you

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the same question, but I know the answer. The time

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you were asleep before eleven pm? Oh like on purpose,

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not like you crashed out at four in the afternoon,

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And it doesn't care.

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Speaker 1: Uh. Probably when I used to have a bedtime, I

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was probably being bottle fed at that point. I have

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no idea, if.

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Speaker 2: You think about it, we really could we need to

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find a job where it's like a twenty four hour

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thing and we could just both hold the position and

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just work opposite twelve hours, you know, because I don't

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function outside of like normal working hours, and you only

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function outside of normal working hours, so there must be

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some way for us to exploit this. Should we do

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a twenty four hour live stream where it just we

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just tag in and tag out.

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Speaker 1: Twelve hours of each year, we do it in like

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four hour increments. We need to You got me thinking, though,

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is we need to do if we get a thousand

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more Patreon members the next month, Grant, we'll do a pod,

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a live stream podcast after midnight his time. I'm doing

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it anyway.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, easy light list for you.

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Speaker 1: We'll have to see what type of state he's in?

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Is he like? What does he consume to stay up

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past midnight?

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Speaker 2: I can't even imagine. I can't imagine. It wouldn't be pretty,

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it would Yeah, yeah, you know what, I'll commit to

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it though. A thousand more subscribers, I'm happy to I'm

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happy to debase myself by staying up late.

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Speaker 1: I guess debase yourself, Grant, the most Confusing Teams draft.

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Ideally we'd be doing this when Lebron post Lebron James's

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next decision, which should be coming imminently, maybe while we're

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recording this podcast. Probably not, I think most people think

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it'll happen sometime after the World Cup final, but enough

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stuff has happened that we can sit here survey the

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lay of the land, and even when we're kind of

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baking in, this team clearly doesn't feel like it's finished. Uh,

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there are other teams that are just confusing me, ever,

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living heck out of me. So is there anything as

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you went about this before we start going through our

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picks that is there a certain set of criteria that

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stands out to you? Or is it are these if

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you're going through when you've built your big board? Was

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the prevailing theme? This is a team that I didn't

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think made sense leading into the off season and they're

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still confusing me. Or has a lot of this stuff

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been transaction driven over the off season?

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Speaker 2: Great question? I think. I think the first thing is

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that it used to be easier to point to a

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team and say this one doesn't make any sense because

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that was just shorthand for well, they're they're not going

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for a championship and they're not tanking, and so that's

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so like, what's the plan. You know, the Raptors have

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occupied that space for.

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Speaker 1: A long time.

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Speaker 2: The Bulls kind of and lived in it for they

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were like the poster team for that type of things.

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You know, any any team that was like in the

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play in mix or whatever, and it just didn't feel

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like they were going for one or extreme or the other.

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You'd say, like, well, that's confusing. Why would you try

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to say it's different now? It's different now with the

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way the lottery odds are, like, there's there's certainly not

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a payoff for being abjectly terrible on purpose, or at

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least your odds are are not as favorable. And so

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I really found myself trying to avoid just the teams

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that are kind of in the middle, or at least

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not choosing them for that reason alone. Like there needed

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to be to answer your question more precisely, like there

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needed to be roster stuff that that struck me as

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ill conceived or like just unfinished, or you couldn't really

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find the sense of or just the way management is operating.

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I've got a team that has some ownership issues that

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are confusing to me. I'm sure they're on your list too,

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stuff like that. You know, it's all the basics, but

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it can't and it can't just be well, they don't

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seem to have it can't only be well, this is

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like a team that's going to finish between thirty two

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and forty two wins, So what's the point Because you

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could get away with that before, but I think you

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need to look a little harder. Now what do you

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think do you? Does that resonate with you? That was

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that an issue as you were putting your list together too,

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of like, oh, this is kind of different than it

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used to.

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Speaker 1: Be, right, and it's just so as like a spoiler,

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like the Chicago Bulls would not be high up on

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my big board. But what I did all also factor

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in is that a lot of this goes beyond just

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this coming season too. It's not about trying to figure out, okay,

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well we kind of understand what the Bulls are doing

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in the long term, or at least get like it's

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all right, new front office regime, so we understand what

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they're doing this year or what the overarching picture should be.

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Some of these teams you look at and a lot

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of it could be just awkward fit with players or

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on court stuff driven by all of that. But there

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are a couple of teams where it's not just what's

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the end goal this season, but what is the plan

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long term. They every team in theory all has the

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same endgame. But if you haven't acted like a team

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that's cobbled together any type of long term vision, and

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you're not clearly all in on winning next season, that's

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a I mean, it's a red flag or confuses the

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hell out of me. I call it more of a

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red flag than confusing. But it goes into the roster

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construction or the construction of a vision and the incoherence

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of it all.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I'd agree with that. I think if if I

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had to, if I divert from your methodology at all,

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it's that I did focus a little more on this

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upcoming season. But I do think if if something about

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your team is confusing in the short term, there's a

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really good chance that it's also like your big picture

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is kind of a mess too, because right, you know, yeah,

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because here we are three months from the start of

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the year, and if things are weird now, it's it's

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not like you're you know, this isn't a case where like,

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well I can see the vision of Team X. It's

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it's all confusing now, but like once things line up

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in twenty twenty eight, I get it. It's not. You know,

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usually it's it's kind of like systemically confused.

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Speaker 1: Honestly, it's probably never been harder to measure a team's

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longer term viability or trajectory, even if they're an established contender.

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It's sort of use windows just feel as if they're

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built to open and shut one a whim.

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Speaker 2: The flip side of that is, we're just lots of preamble,

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but we haven't talked in two weeks or whatever. I'm

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working on something ranking like trade ships, you know, and

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it's not it can't be like wemben Yama, but it's

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like the types of stuff you would use to acquire

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the next available superstar, right, So, like young players, or

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like draft picks and trying to rank draft picks, Like, okay,

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the Nuggets twenty thirty two, that's out there, you know

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that the Nets have. It's like, okay, that seems really choice,

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but that's so far away, Like the Nuggets could have

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gone through two competitive cycles by then, or even more

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than that. So does that mean like a twenty twenty

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eight pick is what you want? Or what about? So?

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I to your point, it's really hard to game out

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anything past a year or two at this point because

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just the way the lottery works, the way the aprons

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of affected team building, it's it's a you know what,

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confusing times we live in, confusing times, uncertain times.

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Speaker 1: I'm with you there, and because I'm a kind and

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generous person, I will give you the first pick of

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the most confusing teams draft.

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Speaker 2: So this was the first team that came to mind.

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It's the one that I tease a little bit. They

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have to be on your list. We've talked about them

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a little bit. I don't know if they justify the

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first pick, but first thought, best thought, the Portland Trail

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Blazers are a confusing basketball team to me.

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Speaker 1: You know how well I know that we're in lockstep.

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Is John Moran in a Blazers jersey is the front

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and center of our YouTube thumb now for this episode.

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We didn't go into this knowing what each other's big

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boards were, but I knew they would be a team

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that were on both of our lists, and I thought

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they would go first.

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Speaker 2: Overall, Okay, great, they have to be so this the

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Ja Morant of it all is part of it. I

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want to start though with there are a lot of

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things I like about this team, Like we both were

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Denny Avviapild. We think he's great, great contract. We like

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some of their young guards. We're never giving up on

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Scoot Donovan Klingen, Like there is a version of this

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team that has just built around young guys as an

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Ovidia that I think we like a lot, Like even

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some of their marginal moves like Brandon Carlson might be helpful,

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and like we're never giving up on young handsome and

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like what if Shade and Sharp becomes something, then maybe

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that deal turns out to be a pot. There's a

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lot to like, is all I'm saying, Like the defensive infrastructure,

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they're just a couple shooters away all that stuff. But

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starting from the very top with ownership, what is happening here?

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Like where will this? Is this a team that is

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now suddenly like a real threat to move because of

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what Tom Dundan has said about public funds and like

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basically telegraphing his feeling that hey, Portland, you're lucky I'm

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even here, Like that's a that's talk about red flags right,

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Like that is the ownership situation there kind of puts

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anything in place. So I don't know if confusing is

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even the right word. It's like ominous. You know, there's

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unstable concerning whatever you want to use, So start there,

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move down the list to Mike and nor is on

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like the least stable head coach contract we've ever seen.

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Speaker 1: Just it's he's one instantly.

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Speaker 2: Right, like what could go what could go wrong? Like

224
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surely there's no real reason why teams have forever avoided

225
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employing lame duck coaches, Like what you know? So there's that.

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Then you get to the roster. The jaw trade is crazy.

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We've talked about that plenty. He's kind of in the

228
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way of a lot of people. It creates a bunch

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of roster crunch issues. His effect on Danny Avdya feels

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like certainly negative, proved me wrong. I would love to

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be wrong, But that that doesn't Those two don't make

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a ton of sense together. This team hasn't added shooters,

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and they were twenty seventh and three point shooting accuracy

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last year despite getting up the fourth most in terms

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of share of their shots. Like, I don't, I don't

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know how you look at what happened last year and

237
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decide adding Jah Moran and not shooting is the solution.

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I We could go on, but like those are the

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sort of the pillars of like what I don't get

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about what's going on with Portland? Do you have anything

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to add to that? Would they have been your first pick? Yeah?

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Speaker 1: They would have been my first pick. And I think

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the Tom Dundan stuff only just adds to the confusion

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because it's it's not even just the are they still

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gonna be here in five years or whatever it's is

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he actually will? They were linked to some of these

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bigger names, including John Morant, but that was a value

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playing a vacuum, But it's are they gonna be willing

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to pay Denny Avia next summer? Is a renegotiating extent

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or even when he's up for a new contract and

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hits restrict unrestricted free agency? Like, what are going to

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be their limits when it comes to investing in players?

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We've seen their limits when it comes to investing in

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what surrounds the players, and it's not great. It's not

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great so far. The guard glut I was just insane

256
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to me. Now, I don't see how you caught to

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trade Chris Murray wasn't a big part of what they're doing,

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but to trade like two wings who can help you

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on defense? For John Morant, who nukes your spacing and

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hurts your defense, and you're also gonna play him with

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Damian Lillard, is what their early speculation sounds like. I

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don't know what that's like. I don't know what that

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says about what these teams core lineups are gonna be,

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because then it's you get into well, then one of

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Tamani Kamara or Drew Holliday is gonna be kind of

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left out in the cold, or you're gonna be playing

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smaller a lot. But oh, it's kind of harder to

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play smaller now that Jeremy Grant isn't there. And you

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also did resign Robert Williams the third, so you would

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assume between young handsome Brandon Carlson r W three and

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Donovan Klingon that you want more of a traditional big

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man rotation anyway. I And then just like, what does

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John Morant look like on this team? Have you done

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him a disservice on the court? You know, we're saying

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that John Morant comes in and complicates a lot of stuff.

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You've probably not put John Morant in his best on

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court situation just because you don't have the surrounding space

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and to capitalize on whatever he's able to provide in

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terms of rim pressure. I this it's just so interesting

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because they were one of the teams. I don't know

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if you could call him a feel good story. I

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thought Tiago's did great work after Chauncey Billups went through

283
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the whole indictment process, so like to kind of keep

284
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a stable baseline there. They were pretty strong defensively at

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points you saw just tons of growth from certain players.

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I like to go in this direction. I don't like

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the Jahn Morant was it just oh, he's so cheap,

288
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Like we're gonna roll the dice and hope it works out.

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The problem with that is, even if it works out,

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I don't really know what the ceiling of that kind

291
00:14:26,840 --> 00:14:28,759
of look like. What does the best case scenario of

292
00:14:28,799 --> 00:14:31,279
John Morant on this team look like? And finally, you

293
00:14:31,320 --> 00:14:36,000
mentioned Shandon Sharp and also Scoot Henderson. What's going on

294
00:14:36,240 --> 00:14:38,919
there and with Scoot specifically, is extension eligible and it's

295
00:14:38,960 --> 00:14:41,799
you could say, yeah, they definitely haven't seen enough to

296
00:14:41,919 --> 00:14:44,559
pay him, and I would agree unless the price is

297
00:14:44,679 --> 00:14:48,480
just so low. At the same time, you haven't built

298
00:14:48,519 --> 00:14:50,639
a team that makes it seem as if you're even

299
00:14:50,679 --> 00:14:53,639
invested in him in the slightest and you could make

300
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the same case for Shade and Sharp. And in addition

301
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to being part of why they feel confusing, is not

302
00:15:01,080 --> 00:15:04,039
just because we I look at what's in place and say, well,

303
00:15:04,080 --> 00:15:05,759
this is what they're clearly trying to move forward with

304
00:15:05,799 --> 00:15:07,960
this season. I look at it and say, there's no

305
00:15:08,080 --> 00:15:10,679
way that they can be done this offseason, right, is

306
00:15:10,759 --> 00:15:13,039
part of what my brain is saying. Yeah, I don't

307
00:15:13,039 --> 00:15:15,679
know whether that's true, but that's when you look at

308
00:15:15,720 --> 00:15:18,840
the roster. I think it's that's a reasonable conclusion to

309
00:15:18,919 --> 00:15:21,039
come to if you had no inside information on what

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the Blazers are planning.

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Speaker 2: Well, it's a charitable conclusion too, because you're assuming you're

312
00:15:25,519 --> 00:15:29,480
looking at it and saying, well, like, no, sane you know,

313
00:15:29,600 --> 00:15:33,000
decision maker would would stop here, right because for all

314
00:15:33,039 --> 00:15:38,080
the reasons we just went through. Do you think we

315
00:15:38,120 --> 00:15:41,240
can't know this? But do you think that acquiring Jah

316
00:15:41,279 --> 00:15:47,000
Morant was done with the idea of this is just

317
00:15:47,080 --> 00:15:50,000
a pure asset play. This is a by low guy

318
00:15:50,639 --> 00:15:53,080
that maybe plays well for us and we can turn

319
00:15:53,159 --> 00:15:55,519
him into something like is that maybe the move that

320
00:15:55,639 --> 00:15:57,639
needs to be made for stuff to make more sense here.

321
00:15:57,679 --> 00:15:59,759
Obviously moving him would make more sense, But like, do

322
00:15:59,759 --> 00:16:01,679
you think think that was the logic behind it, or

323
00:16:02,120 --> 00:16:04,559
do you think the Blazers looked at him and said,

324
00:16:05,000 --> 00:16:09,200
this is a guy that we can imagine being a

325
00:16:09,279 --> 00:16:14,320
core piece, like because John Moran is not a supporting player, right,

326
00:16:14,399 --> 00:16:16,240
Like that's one of the issues with him, is like

327
00:16:16,519 --> 00:16:18,759
he does not have a skill set that lends itself

328
00:16:18,799 --> 00:16:22,879
to being a skill set matched with sort of an

329
00:16:23,399 --> 00:16:26,679
ego or like a willingness to accept that type of

330
00:16:26,720 --> 00:16:29,320
role to be like a smaller time piece. It's like,

331
00:16:29,320 --> 00:16:30,840
if you have him on the team and he's playing

332
00:16:30,840 --> 00:16:33,000
like he's kind of in the middle of everything. So

333
00:16:33,080 --> 00:16:35,399
do you think which which of the two seems more

334
00:16:35,519 --> 00:16:38,399
likely to you as far as they're justification for adding him.

335
00:16:38,720 --> 00:16:41,240
Speaker 1: It has to be the former, because if you're saying

336
00:16:41,279 --> 00:16:43,679
the latter, what have you seen over the past three

337
00:16:43,759 --> 00:16:47,960
years that would make you think one that player has

338
00:16:48,000 --> 00:16:51,440
appeared at any point during that time or two this

339
00:16:51,519 --> 00:16:53,679
is someone who because he was so reliant on his

340
00:16:53,720 --> 00:16:56,519
athleticism and he's he is a really good passer, but

341
00:16:56,799 --> 00:17:00,240
because so much of his game was rooted in athleticism.

342
00:17:00,320 --> 00:17:03,519
Even if you rehabilitate his value. What does that window

343
00:17:04,079 --> 00:17:06,000
look like or does what we say at the top

344
00:17:06,039 --> 00:17:08,720
apply here to where these these windows are opening and

345
00:17:08,759 --> 00:17:12,400
shutting so quickly that even if it is for two years,

346
00:17:12,680 --> 00:17:16,319
But it's just I don't know, especially with the way

347
00:17:16,319 --> 00:17:18,279
his contract is. He is two years left, and so

348
00:17:18,319 --> 00:17:19,880
you kind of need to make a decision on him

349
00:17:19,880 --> 00:17:23,480
after this season the way the extension game works. Yeah,

350
00:17:23,720 --> 00:17:25,839
so I think it's where do you land on. I

351
00:17:25,920 --> 00:17:28,880
think it's kind of just stab in the dark. They

352
00:17:29,000 --> 00:17:32,440
viewed it as opportunism, and this was you know, if

353
00:17:32,440 --> 00:17:34,480
the alternative was Jalen Brown might have been a better

354
00:17:34,519 --> 00:17:37,759
fit or a higher end acquisition. He also, even though

355
00:17:37,759 --> 00:17:41,599
we criticized or were I guess we were more on

356
00:17:41,640 --> 00:17:44,559
the Sixers' side of that deal, he would have cost

357
00:17:44,599 --> 00:17:47,400
substantially more than what they gave up for jaw Rant,

358
00:17:47,519 --> 00:17:49,319
Like they didn't give up any draft equity for.

359
00:17:49,359 --> 00:17:51,960
Speaker 2: Him, right, I mean I lean more towards just the

360
00:17:52,039 --> 00:17:54,599
like the first the form, like the asset play, the

361
00:17:55,640 --> 00:18:01,359
potential upside measured against the low cost of adding him.

362
00:18:01,400 --> 00:18:04,519
Partly because like if you let's take the alternative, uh,

363
00:18:04,559 --> 00:18:07,240
if you thought that, you know what somewhere in here

364
00:18:07,359 --> 00:18:10,480
there's a core of jaw Denny Avdia and Donovan Klingen,

365
00:18:10,680 --> 00:18:13,200
Like we can. We can, especially if Clingon develops as

366
00:18:13,240 --> 00:18:18,079
a shooter, like I guess, But like I just don't

367
00:18:18,119 --> 00:18:21,759
see the Avdya jaw fit because I don't want to

368
00:18:21,759 --> 00:18:24,319
take the ball out of Avdya's hands. I want shooting

369
00:18:24,359 --> 00:18:26,039
around him and he gets to run the off. I

370
00:18:26,119 --> 00:18:29,920
just I believe that that's a more effective more effective

371
00:18:30,759 --> 00:18:33,640
maybe not Like if the the highest ceiling version of

372
00:18:33,680 --> 00:18:36,240
the Blazers is John Morant looks like he did five

373
00:18:36,319 --> 00:18:40,680
years ago and and he's like your your top ten

374
00:18:40,759 --> 00:18:43,319
MVP candidate. You build the whole thing around him with

375
00:18:43,319 --> 00:18:47,400
shooting in defense, Like sure, I would concede that's probably

376
00:18:49,000 --> 00:18:52,640
better than Avidya could make the team maybe, But I

377
00:18:52,720 --> 00:18:55,200
just don't. They're not they're not acting. They didn't just

378
00:18:55,240 --> 00:18:57,279
go out and find every shooter on the market, right

379
00:18:57,279 --> 00:18:59,359
they they Because if you really thought that, like we're

380
00:18:59,359 --> 00:19:01,440
gonna build a team around this guy or even just

381
00:19:01,519 --> 00:19:03,920
him and Obdia, you just go find shooting. So to me,

382
00:19:04,000 --> 00:19:05,960
it's just this is all it costs to get a

383
00:19:05,960 --> 00:19:08,440
guy that like there's a five percent chance he could

384
00:19:08,480 --> 00:19:10,720
be an All NBA player again, Like, I guess you

385
00:19:10,839 --> 00:19:14,119
just pay that right, and that's that leads to confusing

386
00:19:14,160 --> 00:19:16,359
teams because you're just like, well, we'll take him, but

387
00:19:16,400 --> 00:19:18,880
he doesn't make any sense in any way for us,

388
00:19:19,160 --> 00:19:21,240
and so that's how you end up the first pick.

389
00:19:21,559 --> 00:19:24,880
Speaker 1: We spend enough time on that, But what does we

390
00:19:25,119 --> 00:19:27,640
oh we were wrong about the Blazers look like? Like what

391
00:19:27,759 --> 00:19:30,599
has happened in you? Like? Because I think with some

392
00:19:30,640 --> 00:19:33,920
of these teams you could at least envision X happens

393
00:19:33,920 --> 00:19:35,839
and that's where we could be. It doesn't feel likely,

394
00:19:36,119 --> 00:19:37,960
but X happens, and it feels like we could be wrong.

395
00:19:38,000 --> 00:19:40,680
I keep trying to sit here and figure out, well,

396
00:19:40,720 --> 00:19:43,200
what are we missing? Because you can say all that

397
00:19:43,200 --> 00:19:46,400
stuff is fine about the value play on John Morant, okay, great,

398
00:19:46,599 --> 00:19:49,119
doesn't necessarily make him just because you think there's a

399
00:19:49,160 --> 00:19:50,920
five percent chance of be an All NBA player again

400
00:19:50,960 --> 00:19:53,720
doesn't mean that you've set up the ecosystem or the like,

401
00:19:53,799 --> 00:19:56,519
have the supporting cast to make that happen. So the

402
00:19:56,519 --> 00:20:01,640
theory of this roster right now feels jagged for sure.

403
00:20:01,799 --> 00:20:03,680
Speaker 2: I think I think the one way that it does

404
00:20:03,720 --> 00:20:05,640
make sense, and this is not a positive, but it

405
00:20:05,640 --> 00:20:08,160
could be something that teams maybe should think about more.

406
00:20:09,039 --> 00:20:11,160
Is because, as we've said, there just seem to be

407
00:20:11,200 --> 00:20:12,519
a lot of players that are kind of in each

408
00:20:12,519 --> 00:20:15,680
other's way. Here if forty of the roster is hurt

409
00:20:16,319 --> 00:20:20,200
basically all season, right, because then it's like if Scoot

410
00:20:20,240 --> 00:20:22,599
Scoots had plenty of injury problems, Dame was coming off

411
00:20:22,640 --> 00:20:24,880
the Achille who knows right, Robert Williams is not a

412
00:20:24,920 --> 00:20:29,160
reliable guy from a health perspective, Drew Holidays Old Like

413
00:20:29,519 --> 00:20:32,599
suddenly you're not sitting there thinking like how are we

414
00:20:32,640 --> 00:20:34,960
going to possibly play Scoot and Shade and Sharp Andrew

415
00:20:34,960 --> 00:20:37,039
Holliday and Dame Lollard and John Moran and like how

416
00:20:37,039 --> 00:20:38,640
does that all work? With Obdy and eating the ball?

417
00:20:38,680 --> 00:20:40,799
It's like, well, if four of those guys are hurt

418
00:20:40,839 --> 00:20:43,480
on any given night, suddenly the rotation makes a little

419
00:20:43,519 --> 00:20:46,240
more sense, just because it's like it's clearer who should

420
00:20:46,240 --> 00:20:48,920
play because you you just play your better players and

421
00:20:48,960 --> 00:20:51,279
you figure it like that element of it can make

422
00:20:51,319 --> 00:20:55,240
more sense. The overall build, which again is short on

423
00:20:55,319 --> 00:20:58,480
shooting and kind of lighter on forwards, and that whole

424
00:20:58,519 --> 00:21:01,920
thing that I don't know what the best. Like how

425
00:21:01,960 --> 00:21:03,480
you look at that and say, well, it could work

426
00:21:03,480 --> 00:21:06,279
out if this like there's just it's a weirdly built roster.

427
00:21:06,799 --> 00:21:09,839
The only positive is like it could just because of injuries,

428
00:21:10,359 --> 00:21:12,799
there wouldn't be quite as much overlap as there seems.

429
00:21:12,799 --> 00:21:14,559
There's definitely going to be Right now.

430
00:21:14,480 --> 00:21:17,559
Speaker 1: What is up, fellowsikos, You're listening to this episode right

431
00:21:17,599 --> 00:21:19,640
now thinking wow, it would be so cool if there

432
00:21:19,680 --> 00:21:20,640
were no ads on it.

433
00:21:20,759 --> 00:21:22,519
Speaker 2: We have the power to make this the last ad

434
00:21:22,559 --> 00:21:24,519
you ever hear. And that's not a threat, it's more

435
00:21:24,519 --> 00:21:26,799
of a promise. The best way to support the podcast

436
00:21:26,880 --> 00:21:28,680
is to join our Patreon, which you can do at

437
00:21:28,720 --> 00:21:31,680
patreon dot com. Slash Hardwood Knocks NBA tons of perks there.

438
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In addition to the promise of and not threat. Can't

439
00:21:34,119 --> 00:21:36,640
emphasize that enough of no more ads, which is a

440
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huge bonus. We're going to do a couple of Patreon

441
00:21:38,519 --> 00:21:42,400
subscriber only pods every month. You get access to our discord.

442
00:21:42,480 --> 00:21:44,480
You just get to be a bigger part of this community.

443
00:21:44,559 --> 00:21:47,519
You get our sincerest appreciation, which really can you put

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00:21:47,519 --> 00:21:49,240
a price on it? If you want to support the pod,

445
00:21:49,319 --> 00:21:50,960
that is the best way to do it. Thank you

446
00:21:51,000 --> 00:21:52,839
again as always for listening and for watching.

447
00:21:52,960 --> 00:21:55,759
Speaker 1: And now back to the show with the second pick

448
00:21:56,720 --> 00:22:02,200
in the most confusing NBA Teams Draft to select the

449
00:22:02,359 --> 00:22:07,680
Washington Wizards. I there's the Trey Young contract, which you

450
00:22:07,680 --> 00:22:09,640
know we want to talk about the Bucks coming to

451
00:22:09,720 --> 00:22:11,759
terms of Gary Trent Junior a year or two ago.

452
00:22:12,039 --> 00:22:14,640
It feels like this Trey Young deal was agreed upon

453
00:22:14,680 --> 00:22:17,240
as part of his trade to Washington to where he

454
00:22:17,319 --> 00:22:20,680
gets the four years, two hundred the max that he

455
00:22:20,680 --> 00:22:22,440
could the four year max basically he could have gotten

456
00:22:22,440 --> 00:22:24,160
from another team of four years and two hundred and

457
00:22:24,200 --> 00:22:27,599
twelve point nine million dollars after declining his player option

458
00:22:28,559 --> 00:22:32,920
given the market. That just doesn't make sense to me

459
00:22:32,920 --> 00:22:36,000
in a vacuum from a pure value perspective, I thought

460
00:22:36,039 --> 00:22:37,680
we were gonna reach a point. What do I keep

461
00:22:37,720 --> 00:22:39,200
saying every summer is when are we gonna reach a

462
00:22:39,200 --> 00:22:43,640
point where actual negotiations are happening with perceived stars? And

463
00:22:43,920 --> 00:22:46,839
what happens Victor Wamanyama takes a fifty million dollar discount

464
00:22:46,839 --> 00:22:49,319
like before, there's negotiation happening on Trey Young to the

465
00:22:49,359 --> 00:22:53,640
next contract. Wild to me, what still is confusing about this?

466
00:22:53,839 --> 00:22:55,039
And you could look at some of the other moves.

467
00:22:55,079 --> 00:22:57,880
By the way, good friend Chris Middleton, he's back. I

468
00:22:57,880 --> 00:23:00,880
would have probably preferred them to like lean more towards

469
00:23:00,920 --> 00:23:03,000
just a pure shooter. When you're looking at who else

470
00:23:03,039 --> 00:23:07,279
is on this roster, their big man rotation is now okay,

471
00:23:07,319 --> 00:23:11,400
getting off the Jaden Hardy contract fine. Getting DeAndre eighton

472
00:23:11,519 --> 00:23:15,000
eight million dollars backup five also fine. You have Alex

473
00:23:15,000 --> 00:23:16,480
hard and Anthony Davis, and you needed to give up

474
00:23:16,480 --> 00:23:20,000
second round picks to make it happen. The other thing is,

475
00:23:20,000 --> 00:23:23,000
when you're looking at investing in Trey Young at this level,

476
00:23:23,440 --> 00:23:27,160
you just drafted Aj Debantsa, who I think needs to

477
00:23:27,200 --> 00:23:30,519
be on the ball more often than Darren Peterson. This

478
00:23:30,599 --> 00:23:32,839
is the only viable alternative at this point. Maybe I'll

479
00:23:32,880 --> 00:23:35,920
prove wrong. Summer League is not a good gauge of that,

480
00:23:36,079 --> 00:23:37,640
just because all of these guys are going to be

481
00:23:37,640 --> 00:23:41,119
on the ball a ton. That being said, like Cam

482
00:23:41,200 --> 00:23:43,559
Boozer is a better shooter than Aj Debantsa is. Right now,

483
00:23:43,559 --> 00:23:46,559
when you're looking at like the three point stuff, do

484
00:23:46,599 --> 00:23:49,599
you trust Trey Young? There's something to be said about No,

485
00:23:49,880 --> 00:23:51,920
AJ doesn't need to be the number one option. He

486
00:23:51,960 --> 00:23:54,440
probably shouldn't be the number one option. He can be

487
00:23:54,559 --> 00:23:57,880
uplifted by funneling that usage towards someone else where, then

488
00:23:57,920 --> 00:24:00,559
he's gonna get a lot of the secondary looks. Is

489
00:24:00,599 --> 00:24:05,480
Trey Young the type of player that can function differently

490
00:24:05,839 --> 00:24:09,160
because when you look at the percentage of his team's

491
00:24:09,160 --> 00:24:11,680
on ball possessions he has used when on the floor.

492
00:24:11,880 --> 00:24:15,119
Since entering the league, he has never ranked lower than

493
00:24:15,240 --> 00:24:18,160
seventh in the entire league grant and he's only ranked

494
00:24:18,160 --> 00:24:21,279
outside the top five once when he was seventh, and

495
00:24:21,319 --> 00:24:23,400
I think that was this past year. By the way,

496
00:24:24,759 --> 00:24:28,319
Like what now you're adding Anthony Davis, it will presumably

497
00:24:28,359 --> 00:24:30,039
endo them mas Anty David still going to be there.

498
00:24:30,480 --> 00:24:32,720
He didn't get any He's he he's going to be

499
00:24:32,759 --> 00:24:34,960
extension eligible? Are you giving him one?

500
00:24:35,519 --> 00:24:35,759
Speaker 2: Does?

501
00:24:35,880 --> 00:24:38,440
Speaker 1: I don't think the eight and acquisition signals that, oh,

502
00:24:38,480 --> 00:24:40,519
we want to we're more likely to trade Anthony Davis.

503
00:24:40,519 --> 00:24:43,119
If anything, it signals do we want to play a

504
00:24:43,119 --> 00:24:47,160
lot of Alex Sar with another big type lineups? And

505
00:24:47,440 --> 00:24:49,640
if that is a default, what does that mean for

506
00:24:50,079 --> 00:24:53,079
a wing rotation that's fairly stacked at this point? When

507
00:24:53,119 --> 00:24:55,039
you look at debantsa when you look at having Keishon,

508
00:24:55,119 --> 00:24:58,319
George Black, Kulabaly still being there. Oh, Cam Whitmore's still

509
00:24:58,359 --> 00:25:00,400
on this team. So it was justin Champenny and we

510
00:25:00,480 --> 00:25:04,279
just brought back Chris Middleton. I am so confused by

511
00:25:04,319 --> 00:25:07,599
this shruster. Not in a way where I'm necessarily down

512
00:25:07,799 --> 00:25:10,240
on it, but I also just find myself looking what

513
00:25:10,279 --> 00:25:12,359
Trey Johnson was able to do in Summer League, and

514
00:25:12,400 --> 00:25:14,480
I kind of find myself wondering, well, how does he

515
00:25:15,119 --> 00:25:16,839
work into all of this? And if he works into

516
00:25:16,880 --> 00:25:20,119
all this, what does that mean for Bob Carrington. There's

517
00:25:20,759 --> 00:25:23,440
this roster is all over the place, even when you're

518
00:25:23,480 --> 00:25:27,319
looking at like just we probably get too caught up

519
00:25:27,359 --> 00:25:30,480
in timelines, but like, on the one hand, you have

520
00:25:30,680 --> 00:25:33,119
Anthony Davis and Trey Young taking up sixty plus percent

521
00:25:33,119 --> 00:25:35,000
of your cap, and on the other hand, you have

522
00:25:35,319 --> 00:25:37,759
the number one overall pick from this draft. You have

523
00:25:37,839 --> 00:25:40,440
Keishaan George who before he missed time last year, who's

524
00:25:40,480 --> 00:25:43,400
having a breakout campaign. You have alexar who's drafted number

525
00:25:43,400 --> 00:25:48,000
two overall two years ago. Is what is even with

526
00:25:48,480 --> 00:25:51,920
the idea of Okay lottery reformation, this team's been rebuilding

527
00:25:51,920 --> 00:25:53,720
for a minute now. They want to make a jump.

528
00:25:54,079 --> 00:25:56,160
I don't even understand what type of jump they're trying

529
00:25:56,160 --> 00:25:58,839
to make. Is it to just be in the the

530
00:25:58,880 --> 00:26:02,000
middle at this point? Did they internally just because they

531
00:26:02,039 --> 00:26:04,440
do have some of the name power, they have not

532
00:26:04,480 --> 00:26:07,640
necessarily transacted like a team that is desperate to be

533
00:26:07,720 --> 00:26:10,119
in the top six in the East per se. But

534
00:26:10,160 --> 00:26:12,559
you did just give Trey Young a quasi max and

535
00:26:12,559 --> 00:26:15,599
you have Trey Young and Anthony Davis just hashtag on

536
00:26:15,680 --> 00:26:20,920
this team. So I don't know honestly what the wizards

537
00:26:21,000 --> 00:26:23,680
Is short term game is, and you could even long

538
00:26:23,759 --> 00:26:26,640
term I still think right there are some clear core

539
00:26:26,720 --> 00:26:30,200
pieces in place, But do they view Trey Young and

540
00:26:30,279 --> 00:26:34,200
AD as one of those pieces? I honestly, Trey Young

541
00:26:34,559 --> 00:26:35,720
certainly seems like they might.

542
00:26:37,759 --> 00:26:42,240
Speaker 2: Well, if he's not, i'd sure like to know what

543
00:26:42,279 --> 00:26:45,119
they would have paid him. Isn't this this is kind

544
00:26:45,119 --> 00:26:51,000
of a wild sort of like turn about because I

545
00:26:51,000 --> 00:26:54,039
think we both were probably I don't know what the

546
00:26:54,079 --> 00:26:58,480
breakdown was, but we both liked the Young trade and

547
00:26:58,559 --> 00:27:01,240
the Davis trade to varying. He's like, I wouldn't say,

548
00:27:01,599 --> 00:27:03,400
don't let me put words in your mouth, but like

549
00:27:03,440 --> 00:27:05,720
in both cases, I was kind of like I think

550
00:27:05,720 --> 00:27:08,240
if that's the cost, you just do it. By the way,

551
00:27:08,400 --> 00:27:10,640
a lot more trades happening these days where that's the

552
00:27:10,720 --> 00:27:13,599
justification of it with so which maybe suggests that like

553
00:27:13,599 --> 00:27:16,559
that shouldn't be the cost. But were you there at

554
00:27:16,799 --> 00:27:19,599
like with with both Trey and Davis when they made

555
00:27:19,599 --> 00:27:22,559
those trades. It's like, yeah, man, I guess like that's

556
00:27:22,640 --> 00:27:25,240
just an asset you take for the for the price.

557
00:27:25,079 --> 00:27:27,200
Speaker 1: Which is why didn't we just say that when we

558
00:27:27,200 --> 00:27:28,920
were talking about John Morant with the Blazers.

559
00:27:29,839 --> 00:27:32,000
Speaker 2: Well that's why I kind of asked, like, I'm coming

560
00:27:32,000 --> 00:27:34,920
around to that perspective, but we went through I like, well, actually,

561
00:27:35,000 --> 00:27:37,319
this is just it's actively damaging maybe in a lot

562
00:27:37,319 --> 00:27:37,680
of ways.

563
00:27:38,000 --> 00:27:39,720
Speaker 1: No, you're not putting words in my mouth. I went

564
00:27:39,759 --> 00:27:41,440
back and forth with more on this at the time

565
00:27:41,440 --> 00:27:43,319
where I was like, no, these trades make sense as

566
00:27:43,599 --> 00:27:46,799
an opportunity, Like as a matter of opportunity. It's oh,

567
00:27:46,799 --> 00:27:49,200
if they go turn around and give them these massive deals,

568
00:27:49,279 --> 00:27:51,079
that's when you have questions and what did they do?

569
00:27:51,400 --> 00:27:55,680
Speaker 2: Guess what they got some questions? Yeah, I so the

570
00:27:55,759 --> 00:27:59,400
trading extension spun me all the way back around to

571
00:28:00,160 --> 00:28:03,519
this before. But like, this is just the same organization

572
00:28:03,640 --> 00:28:06,599
that gave Bradley Beal that contract, and this is just

573
00:28:06,640 --> 00:28:10,119
like this is this just feels like so right on

574
00:28:10,359 --> 00:28:13,920
brand for a team that we really thought was doing

575
00:28:13,960 --> 00:28:18,559
things a little more sensibly. So I would echo everything

576
00:28:18,559 --> 00:28:21,319
you said. I this in a lot of ways, this

577
00:28:21,440 --> 00:28:24,079
is more confused. This team is more confusing than Portland.

578
00:28:24,119 --> 00:28:27,039
It's just that like it's not quite at every level

579
00:28:27,039 --> 00:28:29,359
because the Dundon and the Morant pieces are just so

580
00:28:30,000 --> 00:28:36,119
like just confounding. But let's be looking. Let's let's try

581
00:28:36,119 --> 00:28:38,240
to give the Wizards the benefit of the doubt. I

582
00:28:38,240 --> 00:28:40,440
can't do it with the young extension. That's never gonna

583
00:28:40,440 --> 00:28:42,799
make sense. But like maybe there's some element of we

584
00:28:42,839 --> 00:28:44,920
got all these young guys, if any of them are

585
00:28:44,960 --> 00:28:47,359
any good, they'll be good enough to prove it in

586
00:28:47,400 --> 00:28:50,720
suboptimal circumstances. Look what Cooper Flag did in Dallas last year,

587
00:28:50,759 --> 00:28:53,680
Like you know, he kind of the role wasn't great.

588
00:28:53,880 --> 00:28:56,160
There weren't like a ton of veterans that like we're

589
00:28:56,200 --> 00:28:59,440
eating into his time and if anything, like he had

590
00:28:59,480 --> 00:29:02,480
to play it difficult role because they didn't have good alternatives.

591
00:29:02,480 --> 00:29:06,480
But if you just throw Debanza and Sar and Keishan

592
00:29:06,559 --> 00:29:09,839
George and Trey Johnson and you neglected to mention my

593
00:29:09,880 --> 00:29:12,880
guy Will Riley in the mix, and like just toss

594
00:29:12,880 --> 00:29:15,400
them all in there with Anthony Davis and like something

595
00:29:15,440 --> 00:29:18,640
emerges and it becomes clear organically, like who belongs and

596
00:29:18,680 --> 00:29:22,359
who doesn't and who fits whatever timeline you're on. That

597
00:29:22,400 --> 00:29:26,000
feels more like just that doesn't feel like a plan

598
00:29:26,200 --> 00:29:28,599
to me, Like that just feels like we cobble. We've

599
00:29:28,599 --> 00:29:32,279
thrown together guys all across the age bracket and we'll

600
00:29:32,279 --> 00:29:36,640
get what we get. And like, sure, in a world

601
00:29:36,680 --> 00:29:40,680
where being absolutely terrible doesn't pay, you might find something

602
00:29:40,720 --> 00:29:44,200
that gets you on the most optimistic end of things

603
00:29:45,119 --> 00:29:47,640
out above the plane or something. I don't think that's

604
00:29:47,640 --> 00:29:52,319
happening the East is crazy, but like you don't get

605
00:29:52,400 --> 00:29:55,799
to if things work out here, it will feel more

606
00:29:55,920 --> 00:30:00,440
like happenstance than an organized sort of effort to get

607
00:30:00,440 --> 00:30:04,559
this team to wherever it's trying to go. I feel

608
00:30:04,599 --> 00:30:11,160
like the Debanza pick provided them cover to go to

609
00:30:11,240 --> 00:30:13,200
Trey Young and say, hey, whatever we agreed to, like

610
00:30:13,240 --> 00:30:16,400
we didn't contemplate we were gonna have this potentially generational guy.

611
00:30:16,519 --> 00:30:19,240
We're kind of going in a different direction, here's twenty

612
00:30:19,279 --> 00:30:21,759
five million a year with like a team option on

613
00:30:21,799 --> 00:30:26,240
the third. Godspeed if you can go beat this somewhere else,

614
00:30:26,279 --> 00:30:30,000
Like circumstances changed, you understand, and if he walks, he walks,

615
00:30:30,039 --> 00:30:31,799
it didn't cost you anything to get him like that,

616
00:30:32,160 --> 00:30:36,160
the doubling down whether it was being I do you

617
00:30:36,200 --> 00:30:39,640
believe that the reporting that like the Wizards were afraid

618
00:30:39,720 --> 00:30:42,039
somebody else was gonna put you like That's just the.

619
00:30:41,960 --> 00:30:45,000
Speaker 1: Only team I could think of is because they traded

620
00:30:45,000 --> 00:30:47,920
for Julius Randle was the Nets would they have preferred to?

621
00:30:48,200 --> 00:30:52,559
But if they guards right, who went off in the

622
00:30:52,559 --> 00:30:55,559
summer League and then they drafted Mikel Brown Junior, So

623
00:30:55,759 --> 00:30:57,759
I think that would have possibily would have come off

624
00:30:57,759 --> 00:31:01,319
the table. I don't see another team that this. This

625
00:31:01,480 --> 00:31:04,400
is just like the Bucks had suitors for Gary Trent

626
00:31:04,480 --> 00:31:07,279
Junior and sign in trades potentially at this four year,

627
00:31:07,319 --> 00:31:08,680
sixty four million dollar number.

628
00:31:08,960 --> 00:31:11,400
Speaker 2: This, so then you're what you said initially was right,

629
00:31:11,519 --> 00:31:15,039
is this was agreed to at the time of the trade, which.

630
00:31:16,119 --> 00:31:18,880
Speaker 1: Oh, you don't see that happen where one player gets

631
00:31:18,920 --> 00:31:23,519
salary dumped only to turn around and then sign a

632
00:31:23,599 --> 00:31:25,240
near ax deal. With them.

633
00:31:25,400 --> 00:31:27,680
Speaker 2: The market just told you what he was worth, and

634
00:31:27,720 --> 00:31:30,240
it wasn't fifty million dollars a year. It was dead.

635
00:31:30,319 --> 00:31:33,480
It was basically dead Corey Kispert's contract and dead money,

636
00:31:33,680 --> 00:31:36,440
which six and one half done the other Like if.

637
00:31:36,279 --> 00:31:39,839
Speaker 1: You McCollum won the Hawks a playoff game, he really did,

638
00:31:40,200 --> 00:31:41,039
he really did.

639
00:31:41,440 --> 00:31:43,759
Speaker 2: I might like this team better if CJ. McCollum were

640
00:31:43,799 --> 00:31:48,079
on it instead of Tree Young, certainly at his new contract. Yeah,

641
00:31:48,119 --> 00:31:50,920
it doesn't make a ton of sense. Yeah, Phil Barksdale

642
00:31:50,920 --> 00:31:52,920
feel like Washington went on a shopping spree on Facebook

643
00:31:52,960 --> 00:31:54,720
marketplace a little bit, a little bit.

644
00:31:55,279 --> 00:31:57,839
Speaker 1: The one difference I will say between them and Portland is,

645
00:31:57,880 --> 00:32:03,079
at least in theory Trey Young and Anthony Davish Phil

646
00:32:03,200 --> 00:32:05,920
needs where was they didn't have a floor general of

647
00:32:05,960 --> 00:32:08,440
the future and if you wanted Alex Are to play

648
00:32:08,440 --> 00:32:12,799
alongside a more physical big man done in Portland, it's

649
00:32:12,839 --> 00:32:16,160
I don't know what I think job Rant exacerbates the

650
00:32:16,200 --> 00:32:18,400
problems they were supposed to address. When you're looking at

651
00:32:18,440 --> 00:32:21,480
the shooting, that's damning with fame praise for Washington, but

652
00:32:21,480 --> 00:32:23,799
but it's also different because I do look at this

653
00:32:23,920 --> 00:32:26,599
roster and it's not even Portland. I'm pretty sure is

654
00:32:26,960 --> 00:32:30,839
going to be disappointing just because of the makeup of

655
00:32:30,920 --> 00:32:35,039
the team with washing Art. Yeah, I can't fathom what

656
00:32:35,240 --> 00:32:38,559
this team divisions itself being enough to know whether they're

657
00:32:38,599 --> 00:32:41,000
going to be disappointing or exceed expectations.

658
00:32:41,279 --> 00:32:44,359
Speaker 2: Yeah, I agree, all right, I got an I got

659
00:32:44,400 --> 00:32:47,680
another pick here. It's a little bit of a different

660
00:32:49,960 --> 00:32:52,240
type of team because I think those two were I

661
00:32:52,240 --> 00:32:54,119
think the Wizards probably would have been my second pick

662
00:32:54,160 --> 00:32:57,319
as well. So I'm gonna go Dallas Mavericks. This is

663
00:32:58,599 --> 00:33:03,039
it's a bizarre roster can struction. It's just the powerful.

664
00:33:03,039 --> 00:33:05,720
I mean, I'm gonna forget some. But you have Cooper Flag,

665
00:33:06,079 --> 00:33:09,119
you traded for Santi Aldama. Naji Marshall's probably best used

666
00:33:09,160 --> 00:33:11,920
as a for PJ Washington. Same there, Klay Thompson is

667
00:33:11,920 --> 00:33:14,000
a is a for at least do me a favor.

668
00:33:14,079 --> 00:33:16,319
Speaker 1: Just name the team players on this team who aren't

669
00:33:16,480 --> 00:33:18,880
best suit forward Kyrie Irving?

670
00:33:20,279 --> 00:33:23,240
Speaker 2: Right sure, yeah, I don't know. Right. Defensively is can

671
00:33:23,240 --> 00:33:27,240
you hold up so a million forwards? Not a lot

672
00:33:27,279 --> 00:33:30,039
of point guard depth behind Kyrie Irving because Brandon Williams

673
00:33:30,079 --> 00:33:32,640
has not comeback yet. I feel I think that's someone

674
00:33:32,680 --> 00:33:37,200
they should definitely want to keep around if they can. Uh,

675
00:33:37,640 --> 00:33:40,319
Center seems fine, but you've got Derek Lively's health, you've

676
00:33:40,319 --> 00:33:43,480
got Gafford kind of underperforming. It's just a lot of fours,

677
00:33:44,039 --> 00:33:47,400
and it does, again feel like a roster setup. That

678
00:33:49,119 --> 00:33:52,960
I mean, it's it's not designed to make things easier

679
00:33:53,000 --> 00:33:55,759
functionally for Cooper Flag again two years in a row.

680
00:33:55,799 --> 00:33:58,799
Now we're going in where it's like, I just I

681
00:33:58,799 --> 00:34:03,279
don't know that it's it's it's it doesn't feel like

682
00:34:03,359 --> 00:34:06,559
trial by fire, like on purpose, because like why would

683
00:34:06,559 --> 00:34:08,320
you do that too? You know what I mean? Like

684
00:34:08,599 --> 00:34:11,079
it feels like they're making it deliberately hard on him,

685
00:34:11,280 --> 00:34:13,079
but I don't know how deliberate that is. It's just

686
00:34:13,119 --> 00:34:16,079
this is a weird collection of players and it doesn't

687
00:34:16,079 --> 00:34:19,280
seem to suit a Flag all that well. I do

688
00:34:19,320 --> 00:34:22,639
think if Irving is healthy, you get a lot more

689
00:34:22,639 --> 00:34:24,920
reps where he's playing off of somebody, and maybe you

690
00:34:25,079 --> 00:34:28,440
then get to see the defensive ceiling that everybody thought

691
00:34:28,480 --> 00:34:31,360
was an absolute given. If flags lyft on offense isn't

692
00:34:31,400 --> 00:34:33,400
quite as high. And we come out of this coming

693
00:34:33,519 --> 00:34:37,079
this following year thinking even more highly of him right,

694
00:34:37,079 --> 00:34:40,800
because well, we've seen him exceed expectations as an offensive playmaker,

695
00:34:40,800 --> 00:34:43,159
as an on ball guy, and then the defense showed

696
00:34:43,239 --> 00:34:45,400
up second year, and then we're primed to put him

697
00:34:45,400 --> 00:34:48,400
on all NBA teams this third year or whatever. If

698
00:34:48,400 --> 00:34:51,679
he doesn't do that this season, then you're still relying

699
00:34:51,679 --> 00:34:55,000
on Kyrie Irving to be healthy and productive for most

700
00:34:55,039 --> 00:34:56,639
of this year and to be on the team. Because

701
00:34:56,639 --> 00:34:59,400
he still profiles as a trade candidate. There's plenty of

702
00:34:59,400 --> 00:35:03,119
teams that could u him. So this is more strictly you.

703
00:35:03,079 --> 00:35:05,280
Speaker 1: Think Portland takes a look, kicks the tires.

704
00:35:07,840 --> 00:35:10,880
Speaker 2: I mean, you know again, he just he fits a

705
00:35:10,960 --> 00:35:13,599
tight So yeah, that this is this is a more

706
00:35:13,719 --> 00:35:16,239
narrow thing. But as I was going through the rosters

707
00:35:16,840 --> 00:35:19,559
around the league, this one just just jumps out of me.

708
00:35:19,719 --> 00:35:22,760
Is why why is it built this way? Like if

709
00:35:22,760 --> 00:35:25,039
they drafted more as Johnson too, who like I don't,

710
00:35:25,079 --> 00:35:25,480
I don't.

711
00:35:25,360 --> 00:35:29,280
Speaker 1: Know, that's the what seems just as a fit with

712
00:35:29,360 --> 00:35:33,360
Cooper Flag, I think it's terrible. And then also I

713
00:35:33,400 --> 00:35:36,280
don't that is the you don't necessarily make that pick

714
00:35:36,320 --> 00:35:38,440
because it's at the best fit with Cooper Flag. I mean,

715
00:35:38,559 --> 00:35:40,880
Brydon Burry's and that's bot I think would have been

716
00:35:40,960 --> 00:35:44,400
the right call there. That being said, the Santi aldomitrate

717
00:35:44,480 --> 00:35:45,920
is the one that I still just can't That was

718
00:35:45,960 --> 00:35:48,239
my well, what is going You can talk your stuff,

719
00:35:48,239 --> 00:35:50,480
all right, if they think Marcus Sasser is going to

720
00:35:50,519 --> 00:35:55,199
provide some shooting and not gonna get trucked. Defensively, they're

721
00:35:55,280 --> 00:35:58,119
another team and maybe they're just a suit they're assuming

722
00:35:58,159 --> 00:36:00,719
that they'll go about more of their business in the

723
00:36:00,760 --> 00:36:02,440
middle of the season. But they're another team where this

724
00:36:02,639 --> 00:36:06,159
just sort of feels unfinished because you're every I would

725
00:36:06,159 --> 00:36:11,119
echo everything you said. I like, defensively, they're gonna be

726
00:36:11,199 --> 00:36:13,880
huge and pretty versatile when you look at the guys

727
00:36:13,920 --> 00:36:15,119
that are on the roster.

728
00:36:15,119 --> 00:36:17,320
Speaker 2: Right, we said that exact thing last year, too, right,

729
00:36:17,400 --> 00:36:19,480
it was I remember when we talked about Dallas. It

730
00:36:19,559 --> 00:36:21,800
was like, they're gonna rebound the shit out of the ball.

731
00:36:21,840 --> 00:36:24,199
They're gonna be big at every position, they're gonna defend.

732
00:36:24,400 --> 00:36:26,679
The offense is gonna suck, and maybe they win forty

733
00:36:26,679 --> 00:36:29,880
games that way. It's like the personnel's kind of different,

734
00:36:30,079 --> 00:36:33,079
but it's also kind of the same. Like going in

735
00:36:33,119 --> 00:36:36,039
I can imagine we might say very similar things about Dallas,

736
00:36:36,119 --> 00:36:38,119
except Kyrie Irving will be there, Like you know what

737
00:36:38,119 --> 00:36:42,880
I mean, they kind of have recreated the same problems

738
00:36:42,920 --> 00:36:45,880
they faced last year, but with just some new personnel.

739
00:36:45,800 --> 00:36:47,480
Speaker 1: Right, and they haven't like do they They were so

740
00:36:47,519 --> 00:36:50,880
they were twenty sixth in offensive rebounding last year? Is

741
00:36:50,920 --> 00:36:53,519
that like something that you see them improving upon with

742
00:36:53,519 --> 00:36:55,159
this but like something al Dama's not gonna give you

743
00:36:55,199 --> 00:36:57,119
much of that, maybe more as Johnson helps you there

744
00:36:57,639 --> 00:37:03,280
a little bit, but it's confusing. The one thing I

745
00:37:03,320 --> 00:37:05,400
have wondered, and I don't know if this puts their

746
00:37:05,400 --> 00:37:09,000
off season a better light, but if you're incredibly concerned

747
00:37:09,119 --> 00:37:13,000
about the health of Derek Lively moving forward, does that

748
00:37:13,079 --> 00:37:15,960
help explain the off season a little bit more?

749
00:37:17,199 --> 00:37:19,360
Speaker 2: I mean a little bit. But it's not like a

750
00:37:19,400 --> 00:37:21,920
lot of these fours that we just listed are also

751
00:37:22,000 --> 00:37:25,239
potential fives, you know, Like I think if I mean,

752
00:37:25,280 --> 00:37:27,840
maybe Johnson, I can't claim to have watched a heck

753
00:37:27,880 --> 00:37:30,280
of a lot of college basketball this year, but maybe

754
00:37:30,320 --> 00:37:32,719
Johnson is someone they view as I don't know, in

755
00:37:32,840 --> 00:37:34,880
like a Colin Murray Boyle's mold where it's like he's

756
00:37:34,880 --> 00:37:36,800
not really a five, but he can do it, you know,

757
00:37:36,880 --> 00:37:39,800
like like Murray Boyle's is. If Johnson is anywhere close

758
00:37:39,840 --> 00:37:41,679
to the defender of Murray Boyles is like, then I

759
00:37:41,840 --> 00:37:44,239
retracked everything I said. You have your center. He's not

760
00:37:44,239 --> 00:37:46,599
a power forward all that stuff, but it doesn't seem

761
00:37:46,599 --> 00:37:50,559
like that's the profile for him. I do agree that

762
00:37:51,000 --> 00:37:53,280
this seems like a situation you can trade yourself out

763
00:37:53,320 --> 00:37:56,119
of because teams will be interested in Washington and Marshall.

764
00:37:56,159 --> 00:37:57,800
I think as long as you're not trying to get

765
00:37:57,840 --> 00:38:00,199
first back or anything like that, you can clean up

766
00:38:00,239 --> 00:38:03,239
the roster that way. But they're not out a wings

767
00:38:03,280 --> 00:38:06,679
here like Max Christy and Caleb Martin. I guess who

768
00:38:06,679 --> 00:38:08,639
really like is kind of a forore even might add

769
00:38:08,679 --> 00:38:12,920
him to the pile of power forwards. Really, so Marcus Sasser,

770
00:38:13,000 --> 00:38:15,039
i'd like, is he you can use him as a

771
00:38:15,039 --> 00:38:19,000
combo guard? I guess I just I don't know. It's unbalanced.

772
00:38:19,000 --> 00:38:23,280
Speaker 1: There's a lot on Kyrie Irving being healthy and then

773
00:38:23,679 --> 00:38:27,199
Sergio de la Area gonna be good right away. There's

774
00:38:27,199 --> 00:38:29,679
a lot of that happening here, and I guess maybe

775
00:38:30,039 --> 00:38:33,559
that speaks to when you're looking at Sergio, Oh, we'll

776
00:38:33,679 --> 00:38:37,119
have the runway or maybe they'll give Marcus Sassar more

777
00:38:37,159 --> 00:38:40,000
agency than he ever had in Detroit because Massiu Jerry,

778
00:38:40,079 --> 00:38:43,280
by way, the moves that made sense. Hiring Massiu Jerry,

779
00:38:43,639 --> 00:38:46,440
sure firing Jason Kidd. I won't claim to know enough

780
00:38:46,440 --> 00:38:48,239
about what Dusty May is gonna bring as a head

781
00:38:48,239 --> 00:38:50,159
coach just yet. We'll dig into that like before the

782
00:38:50,199 --> 00:38:55,440
season starts. Those are all fine. I just this roster

783
00:38:56,000 --> 00:38:58,920
offensively specifically again and then also just getting ready to

784
00:38:59,159 --> 00:39:01,800
even if Kyrie Irving is playing, aren't you getting ready

785
00:39:01,800 --> 00:39:03,960
to kind of pull your hair out at why as

786
00:39:04,039 --> 00:39:07,719
Cooper flag like your two or your three? Yeah?

787
00:39:07,800 --> 00:39:10,519
Speaker 2: Yeah, dijita vous a little bit. We were asking the

788
00:39:10,519 --> 00:39:11,559
same questions last.

789
00:39:11,400 --> 00:39:15,119
Speaker 1: Year with the fourth overall pick, my second overall pick

790
00:39:15,239 --> 00:39:18,119
in the most confusing teams NBA draft. I feel like

791
00:39:18,199 --> 00:39:20,400
you're gonna be able to guess where we're going with this,

792
00:39:20,800 --> 00:39:22,079
the New Orleans Pelicans.

793
00:39:22,199 --> 00:39:23,119
Speaker 2: So are the comments.

794
00:39:25,199 --> 00:39:30,639
Speaker 1: Here's the thing I don't understand, like the let's start here,

795
00:39:30,840 --> 00:39:33,800
this is not They're not confusing in the sense that

796
00:39:34,400 --> 00:39:37,559
we have to sit here and demand that they should

797
00:39:37,559 --> 00:39:40,000
have traded everybody at this point. I think that's a

798
00:39:40,039 --> 00:39:41,880
reasonable thing to say, is they should have held some

799
00:39:42,000 --> 00:39:46,880
kind of fire sale grant. Their transactions this year have

800
00:39:47,039 --> 00:39:52,280
been basically exercising Karla Makovich's team option, declining Kava Luni's

801
00:39:52,280 --> 00:39:55,159
team option, and re signing DeAndre Jordan on a two

802
00:39:55,239 --> 00:39:57,360
year deal not a one year deal, so that they

803
00:39:57,400 --> 00:40:00,440
would get They were so worried about the market that

804
00:40:00,480 --> 00:40:02,599
he had that they had to give him two guaranteed years,

805
00:40:02,599 --> 00:40:05,400
which more power to him being a great locker room presence.

806
00:40:05,559 --> 00:40:09,480
And that is believable because remember what happened in Brooklyn,

807
00:40:09,800 --> 00:40:12,360
where not only did Kyrie and Kevin Durant force the

808
00:40:12,400 --> 00:40:15,920
Nets to sign him, they both took Kyrie took less

809
00:40:16,159 --> 00:40:19,599
and Durant lowered his uh like he took an incentive

810
00:40:19,599 --> 00:40:23,000
based structure so that the Nets could overpay DeAndre Jordan.

811
00:40:23,079 --> 00:40:26,159
So this is not There is a precedent for needing

812
00:40:26,159 --> 00:40:28,719
DeAndre Jordan in the locker room apparently. I'm not saying

813
00:40:28,760 --> 00:40:32,159
it's good, but there is a precedent for it. What

814
00:40:32,320 --> 00:40:34,880
is I saw and she's no longer employed by the team,

815
00:40:35,039 --> 00:40:37,000
but I saw. Teresa Witherspoon had a quote the other

816
00:40:37,079 --> 00:40:39,199
day about like, yeah, if they finally give the keys

817
00:40:39,239 --> 00:40:42,480
to Zion Williamson, and I'm in my mid like, well,

818
00:40:42,519 --> 00:40:45,840
hold up, that's that's not the way that this roster

819
00:40:46,000 --> 00:40:48,400
is built. There's okay. If de Jontay Murray's there and

820
00:40:48,400 --> 00:40:50,840
Trey Murphy's they're okay, fine, Like you've Jeremiah Fears and

821
00:40:50,880 --> 00:40:54,159
Derek Queen. That is the antithesis of trying to build

822
00:40:54,159 --> 00:40:57,079
around Zion Williamson. I'm not saying they should have traded

823
00:40:57,159 --> 00:40:59,239
him for pennies on the dollar if there's no value there,

824
00:40:59,280 --> 00:41:01,760
But at the same time, I'm kind of saying, what

825
00:41:01,920 --> 00:41:06,079
is like pick a I want to say pick a lane,

826
00:41:06,199 --> 00:41:08,199
but I don't even know like what laying they're in

827
00:41:08,639 --> 00:41:11,480
right now. It's not even like they're just they're careening,

828
00:41:11,960 --> 00:41:14,880
like from side to side or they've already gone off

829
00:41:14,880 --> 00:41:18,400
the cliff. I don't look at like they don't. If

830
00:41:18,440 --> 00:41:20,800
you point to anyone on this roster, or trying to

831
00:41:20,800 --> 00:41:23,119
point to anyone on this roster and say, who is

832
00:41:23,119 --> 00:41:26,800
our north star, the person that's gonna guide us our

833
00:41:26,840 --> 00:41:30,599
decisions moving forward, the closest you get to an answer,

834
00:41:31,199 --> 00:41:34,400
it's still Zion Williamson. It can't be like Trey Murphy

835
00:41:34,440 --> 00:41:36,800
fits everywhere, but he's not high enough end to say

836
00:41:36,960 --> 00:41:39,519
that's the guy that's gonna direct like kind of how

837
00:41:39,519 --> 00:41:41,719
we flesh out the rest of our roster and now

838
00:41:41,760 --> 00:41:45,599
if you wanted to go whatever this current direction is

839
00:41:45,599 --> 00:41:48,519
is my god, did you need to acquire more shooting

840
00:41:48,559 --> 00:41:50,840
than you have on the roster right now? There is

841
00:41:51,480 --> 00:41:55,559
Trey Murphy and that's it, Like if you if we

842
00:41:55,559 --> 00:41:59,559
want to go, we want to talk about it. Herb Jones, Yeah,

843
00:42:00,519 --> 00:42:04,280
Jordan Poole before he got to New Orleans. So that's

844
00:42:04,440 --> 00:42:07,360
just like they were better when de Jontay Murray came

845
00:42:07,360 --> 00:42:10,360
back next season and so having that kind of organizer type,

846
00:42:10,360 --> 00:42:12,519
but where where does that even fit into what we

847
00:42:12,719 --> 00:42:17,159
just have Derrek, Queen, Enzion Williamson and Jeremiah Field Fears,

848
00:42:17,519 --> 00:42:21,079
all three of whom can cannot shoot. I don't want

849
00:42:21,079 --> 00:42:23,239
to say that about Jeremiah Fears, but he's not He's

850
00:42:23,239 --> 00:42:26,039
nowhere near a knockdown shooter. His game is pride on

851
00:42:26,480 --> 00:42:28,800
I can get to the basket and my liveable when

852
00:42:28,800 --> 00:42:33,039
I'm in the lane. I don't know what this team

853
00:42:33,440 --> 00:42:35,320
is trying to do. And this this is kind of

854
00:42:35,360 --> 00:42:37,559
an extension of do you remember this was like a

855
00:42:37,599 --> 00:42:40,679
month before the trade deadline this past year where it

856
00:42:40,719 --> 00:42:42,679
came out I think was Chris Haynes had the report

857
00:42:43,000 --> 00:42:47,119
that the Pelicans were basically closer business and little did

858
00:42:47,320 --> 00:42:49,880
we know that he was also talking about the offseason

859
00:42:50,280 --> 00:42:50,840
as well.

860
00:42:51,960 --> 00:42:55,519
Speaker 2: I mean, the core issue here seems to be it's

861
00:42:55,559 --> 00:42:58,159
at the top, right, it's the ownership management thing, Like

862
00:42:58,239 --> 00:43:02,159
Joe Dumars and Troy Weaver get put in. It's true Weaver, right,

863
00:43:02,239 --> 00:43:04,199
that's who that's who's there kind of him and Dumars

864
00:43:04,199 --> 00:43:07,199
are splitting the gig? Do I have that right? I

865
00:43:07,280 --> 00:43:17,199
know what It's like everything you said is right about

866
00:43:17,199 --> 00:43:19,320
how the roster makes no sense. I would even add

867
00:43:19,360 --> 00:43:21,599
that it used to be that you had to build

868
00:43:21,639 --> 00:43:24,679
such a specific team around Zion that it like no

869
00:43:24,800 --> 00:43:28,280
roster could make sense with Zion and without you know,

870
00:43:28,480 --> 00:43:30,039
so that was always a huge challenge with him. Now

871
00:43:30,079 --> 00:43:31,880
it's like you still have to do that. He still

872
00:43:31,880 --> 00:43:33,840
probably is there North Star, only he's not good enough

873
00:43:33,840 --> 00:43:36,760
to justify being built around in that way.

874
00:43:36,920 --> 00:43:37,480
Speaker 1: Good news.

875
00:43:38,079 --> 00:43:41,440
Speaker 2: The Pelicans aren't trying to build anything. They're not doing anything,

876
00:43:41,559 --> 00:43:47,400
so so like the inaction is confusing because it well,

877
00:43:47,480 --> 00:43:50,239
let's let's let you speak for the Pelicans right now,

878
00:43:51,039 --> 00:43:54,599
do you think they believe that this roster is good enough?

879
00:43:55,000 --> 00:43:57,320
Or is it a situation where it's like or it

880
00:43:57,440 --> 00:44:00,199
makes sense and has upside and whatever, or there is

881
00:44:00,199 --> 00:44:04,679
a situation where, like the ownership management situation is so

882
00:44:04,800 --> 00:44:07,440
out to lunch that it's like we're not even like

883
00:44:07,559 --> 00:44:10,840
making calls. We're all like Joe Dumars has like has

884
00:44:10,880 --> 00:44:13,920
passed his expiration data as a decision maker and it's

885
00:44:14,039 --> 00:44:16,840
just like we're not doing anything because we're just collecting

886
00:44:16,840 --> 00:44:19,000
a check and whatever. You know what I mean, Like,

887
00:44:19,119 --> 00:44:21,719
is it just everybody is asleep at the wheel or

888
00:44:21,760 --> 00:44:22,039
is it do.

889
00:44:22,039 --> 00:44:25,119
Speaker 1: You think Troy Weavers at that point of you could

890
00:44:25,119 --> 00:44:27,039
make that case for Joe Dumars and Gail Benson, But

891
00:44:27,039 --> 00:44:29,079
do you think Troy Weavers that like don't you think?

892
00:44:29,159 --> 00:44:31,760
Speaker 2: Well, but is he empowered to do anything? Maybe is

893
00:44:31,800 --> 00:44:32,599
the sub question?

894
00:44:32,679 --> 00:44:34,119
Speaker 1: Je Bay is on this team, so why not?

895
00:44:35,480 --> 00:44:39,079
Speaker 2: I just this is why it's confusing. I don't even know, Yeah,

896
00:44:39,119 --> 00:44:41,559
we don't know what they think about this team, Like.

897
00:44:41,480 --> 00:44:45,440
Speaker 1: Well, they're acting as if they are they're acting they're

898
00:44:45,480 --> 00:44:47,719
not necessarily acting as if they think they're good. They're

899
00:44:47,760 --> 00:44:53,159
acting as if they believe they already have the big

900
00:44:53,199 --> 00:44:55,960
picture talent in place, and both by the way, both

901
00:44:56,079 --> 00:44:59,119
vantage points would be wrong. You're not good. And I

902
00:44:59,519 --> 00:45:02,840
thought there Queen and Jeremiah Fears were fine last year.

903
00:45:02,880 --> 00:45:04,639
They each had their bright spots, and I think I'm

904
00:45:04,719 --> 00:45:07,239
higher on Queen than Jeremiah Fears at this point, I

905
00:45:07,239 --> 00:45:09,400
don't look at any one of them and say, that's

906
00:45:09,400 --> 00:45:12,119
like a potential cornerstone right there. Maybe they are, but

907
00:45:12,159 --> 00:45:14,880
you don't have enough information and so you don't even

908
00:45:15,000 --> 00:45:17,360
have so forget if we throw if we give them

909
00:45:17,360 --> 00:45:19,760
the benefit of the doubt and say, and I'm not

910
00:45:19,800 --> 00:45:21,559
prepared to give them better for the doubt. But let's

911
00:45:21,639 --> 00:45:24,320
hypothetically say they're not sitting there thinking they are good.

912
00:45:24,760 --> 00:45:27,639
They know that they don't measure up to the rest

913
00:45:27,639 --> 00:45:31,559
of the Western Conference. They are then sitting here kind

914
00:45:31,559 --> 00:45:36,639
of like thinking Detroit Pistons before, like their breakthrough season,

915
00:45:36,679 --> 00:45:38,360
not last year, but the year before, where it's like,

916
00:45:38,480 --> 00:45:39,800
you know, we haven't been good yet, but there's no

917
00:45:39,840 --> 00:45:42,920
reason to do anything nuclear to sell off guys, or

918
00:45:42,960 --> 00:45:46,519
to go consolidate into someone who might be our face

919
00:45:46,559 --> 00:45:49,360
of the present, or to pair with Zion or to

920
00:45:49,400 --> 00:45:53,320
pair with Maybe they fear uh, fear Fear Fear, feel

921
00:45:53,719 --> 00:45:59,119
about Fears or Queen with you need like, But that's

922
00:45:59,159 --> 00:46:02,480
wrong too because you don't have like, You don't have

923
00:46:02,559 --> 00:46:05,559
that blue chip talent that you could definitively say and

924
00:46:05,559 --> 00:46:07,960
that's not This doesn't mean that every move needs to

925
00:46:07,960 --> 00:46:10,400
be geared towards we either need another star or we

926
00:46:10,440 --> 00:46:13,679
need this super high end youngster. But you gotta do something.

927
00:46:14,039 --> 00:46:16,559
And if you believe that Jeremiah Fears and Derek Queen

928
00:46:16,559 --> 00:46:19,119
are the future, let's just let's just assume they believe

929
00:46:19,199 --> 00:46:23,000
that is why do you not have more shooting on

930
00:46:23,000 --> 00:46:26,599
this roster? Why are you not working the Like Anthony

931
00:46:26,639 --> 00:46:29,039
Simon's went for six point three million dollars six million

932
00:46:29,039 --> 00:46:30,440
dollars year. I'm not saying he would have taken that

933
00:46:30,480 --> 00:46:32,719
to go to New Orleans, but like, you could have

934
00:46:32,840 --> 00:46:37,760
got out there and done something anything. Their financial situation,

935
00:46:37,880 --> 00:46:42,079
I wouldn't say is enviable, but they're not so close

936
00:46:42,119 --> 00:46:45,159
to the tax. They're eight point four million dollars beneath

937
00:46:45,159 --> 00:46:49,199
the tax. That is, you could have signed somebody better

938
00:46:49,239 --> 00:46:51,280
than DeAndre Jordan. You could have gone out and tried

939
00:46:51,320 --> 00:46:55,280
to make a trade without attaching meaningful draft equity to

940
00:46:55,599 --> 00:46:58,400
the assets. That were going out. I just don't. I

941
00:46:58,400 --> 00:47:00,480
don't get any of this, and I would have this

942
00:47:00,519 --> 00:47:04,199
isn't I don't want to veer into just do something territory.

943
00:47:04,519 --> 00:47:07,840
But wouldn't you have been more encouraged if they just

944
00:47:07,920 --> 00:47:11,480
took the jah Morant type package or Tray Young type

945
00:47:11,519 --> 00:47:13,960
package for Zion, because then you can point to, you

946
00:47:14,000 --> 00:47:16,480
know what, Oh, they're fully invested in Queen and Fears.

947
00:47:16,519 --> 00:47:18,000
I don't know if I feel good about it, but

948
00:47:18,079 --> 00:47:20,360
at least they're showing that that's what they're fully invested in.

949
00:47:20,400 --> 00:47:23,239
Speaker 2: I was gonna say, I think the moment he had

950
00:47:23,920 --> 00:47:27,320
positive value, if that ever happened at any point this

951
00:47:27,360 --> 00:47:29,760
past season, they should have traded him. But well, you

952
00:47:30,280 --> 00:47:33,079
I think you're right that the moment Zion had neutral value.

953
00:47:33,400 --> 00:47:36,679
They should have moved him, just because it organizes your

954
00:47:36,679 --> 00:47:39,880
team in a way that like, you're probably wrong, But

955
00:47:39,920 --> 00:47:41,519
then you do get to say, all right, it's Queen

956
00:47:41,559 --> 00:47:43,440
and Fears and we're going to figure it out around

957
00:47:43,440 --> 00:47:46,719
these guys, and we can we can make roster decisions

958
00:47:47,280 --> 00:47:50,840
with them at the center of it. Speaking of which,

959
00:47:50,840 --> 00:47:54,079
who's playing center for this team? That's another confusing aspect.

960
00:47:55,000 --> 00:47:56,239
Speaker 1: Andre Jordan, right, thank you.

961
00:47:56,320 --> 00:47:58,360
Speaker 2: Right, yeah, what about the other forty six and a

962
00:47:58,400 --> 00:48:03,079
half minutes of the game, Like it's fine, oh, perfect, great, Yeah,

963
00:48:03,159 --> 00:48:05,000
that was a problem. That's been a problem since time

964
00:48:05,039 --> 00:48:08,480
I memorial. The Pelicans to me feel like, do you

965
00:48:08,480 --> 00:48:12,199
ever have like a like a just like a basic

966
00:48:12,280 --> 00:48:15,880
office job that maybe like there's a it's like a

967
00:48:15,920 --> 00:48:18,559
branch office and there's like a middle manager in charge,

968
00:48:19,119 --> 00:48:22,199
and morale sucks, like the person in charge doesn't really

969
00:48:22,199 --> 00:48:25,719
have any power, is not motivated to improve anything, and

970
00:48:25,760 --> 00:48:29,559
like the copier doesn't work. It's like one out of

971
00:48:29,599 --> 00:48:32,880
every three days the copier works, and it's like we

972
00:48:32,960 --> 00:48:35,679
need this fixed, and everybody's like I don't want to

973
00:48:35,719 --> 00:48:37,920
fill out the work order, like I just it's just

974
00:48:38,039 --> 00:48:40,559
fuck it. We'll just we'll get through it. Like that's

975
00:48:40,599 --> 00:48:42,800
what the Pelicans feel like to me, where like nobody's

976
00:48:42,880 --> 00:48:46,400
motivated or empowered to actually do anything, and so you

977
00:48:46,559 --> 00:48:50,880
just kind of like zombie walk along and and don't

978
00:48:50,920 --> 00:48:56,599
have any like any incentive to or ambition to change

979
00:48:56,599 --> 00:48:57,639
anything or fixtion.

980
00:48:57,760 --> 00:49:00,239
Speaker 1: But what's interesting is that there are they in a

981
00:49:00,280 --> 00:49:03,800
position to even think that way, because it's not like

982
00:49:03,880 --> 00:49:06,440
the if we're talking about I guess Portland's at the

983
00:49:06,480 --> 00:49:08,760
top of the list now when you're talking about relocation.

984
00:49:08,880 --> 00:49:11,519
But New Orleans is the team, and I'm not advocating

985
00:49:11,519 --> 00:49:13,519
for it, but that is the market that is pointed

986
00:49:13,559 --> 00:49:16,760
to as if relocation, like there shouldn't be a basketball

987
00:49:16,760 --> 00:49:19,440
team in New Orleans. And so if you're is that

988
00:49:19,480 --> 00:49:22,079
what you're trying to do, fast track yourself out out

989
00:49:22,119 --> 00:49:22,360
of here?

990
00:49:22,360 --> 00:49:24,840
Speaker 2: In a major league situation where ownership is trying to

991
00:49:24,840 --> 00:49:28,280
tank the teams, it gets, it gets moved if you

992
00:49:29,239 --> 00:49:29,639
have to.

993
00:49:29,559 --> 00:49:32,599
Speaker 1: Be I would be curious to know what Pelicans fan

994
00:49:32,679 --> 00:49:35,639
out there is reasonably high on this team to the

995
00:49:35,679 --> 00:49:38,280
point that show me the pathway to the Pelicans being

996
00:49:38,280 --> 00:49:41,719
a top eight team in the Western Conference next season.

997
00:49:41,840 --> 00:49:44,760
It does not exist. It does not exist.

998
00:49:45,880 --> 00:49:49,960
Speaker 2: It's it's yeah, it's it's I mean, hasn't the like

999
00:49:50,159 --> 00:49:54,639
the main the overarching issue with New Orleans for however

1000
00:49:54,719 --> 00:49:58,000
long been that like it's not the top priority of ownership.

1001
00:49:58,079 --> 00:50:00,559
It's because the Saints. It's the Saints that mat and

1002
00:50:00,880 --> 00:50:04,840
the Pelicans get like reduced staff or like staff pulling

1003
00:50:04,840 --> 00:50:07,320
double duty for both organizations, and they're just like the

1004
00:50:07,360 --> 00:50:09,960
little brother that no one's paying attention to isn't like

1005
00:50:10,000 --> 00:50:11,400
that's that feels like.

1006
00:50:11,760 --> 00:50:14,800
Speaker 1: Tick to that this team makes no sense and is

1007
00:50:14,880 --> 00:50:15,760
confusing as hell.

1008
00:50:16,199 --> 00:50:19,280
Speaker 2: Right, yeah, well, nobody's it. I don't know what else

1009
00:50:19,320 --> 00:50:22,639
to say. This is like I think the first comment

1010
00:50:23,519 --> 00:50:27,119
Rome said, uh, there's nothing confusing about the Pelicans. They're

1011
00:50:27,159 --> 00:50:30,199
a terrible team. Like, yeah, maybe we've overthought it a

1012
00:50:30,199 --> 00:50:33,639
little bit. They are just bad. Okay, is it my pick? Yea,

1013
00:50:34,159 --> 00:50:38,960
Pelicans are on my list for sure. Okay, Uh, let's go.

1014
00:50:39,280 --> 00:50:43,440
Let's go Phoenix Suns here. Oh, this is enough.

1015
00:50:43,480 --> 00:50:46,519
Speaker 1: You're trying to insinuate that giving up a twenty thirty

1016
00:50:46,519 --> 00:50:48,400
three first round pick for the right to pay Miles

1017
00:50:48,440 --> 00:50:52,079
Bridges is in Well, Dan, it's not.

1018
00:50:52,079 --> 00:50:54,280
Speaker 2: The first bullet point on my list of notes, but

1019
00:50:54,360 --> 00:50:56,880
it is the first sub bullet right under Bridges trade.

1020
00:50:57,199 --> 00:51:00,800
There's giving up twenty thirty three first is right there. Uh,

1021
00:51:01,400 --> 00:51:05,239
that's that's another one where I've mentioned how, like Washington,

1022
00:51:05,639 --> 00:51:07,440
we were kind of like, all right, things are making

1023
00:51:07,480 --> 00:51:09,960
sense here. For a brief moment last year it seemed

1024
00:51:09,960 --> 00:51:13,320
like the Suns were, to our surprise, like functional and

1025
00:51:13,440 --> 00:51:16,280
had made some good decisions. And I mean, I I

1026
00:51:16,320 --> 00:51:18,199
don't know how you've we've talked a little bit about it,

1027
00:51:18,239 --> 00:51:22,800
like Colin bless by, Colin Gillespie a new contract, great,

1028
00:51:23,719 --> 00:51:26,719
Jordan Goodwin great, happy with that too, Mark Williams don't

1029
00:51:26,760 --> 00:51:31,000
love it, but not a crippling number there. Uh. Their

1030
00:51:31,039 --> 00:51:34,320
return on Kevin Durant seemed fine, like Dylan Brooks played

1031
00:51:34,320 --> 00:51:36,920
pretty well for them. Mala Watch has looked like pretty

1032
00:51:37,039 --> 00:51:39,760
darn interesting in summer League. He's hitting threes like.

1033
00:51:39,719 --> 00:51:42,400
Speaker 1: He's humble, did you see it? Humble as hell? Where

1034
00:51:42,400 --> 00:51:44,920
he's talking about no such there's no such thing as

1035
00:51:44,960 --> 00:51:48,559
being too good for summer league. Automatically love him.

1036
00:51:49,639 --> 00:51:52,360
Speaker 2: Can we you know what, can we make you trash

1037
00:51:52,400 --> 00:51:55,760
your pick based on no? No, No, I will not, I

1038
00:51:55,800 --> 00:51:58,280
will not. Let's take an official stance right now. I think,

1039
00:51:58,360 --> 00:52:00,440
come on, Malawatch is like he's it needs to be

1040
00:52:00,519 --> 00:52:02,480
one of our guys. I think I think it's not

1041
00:52:02,559 --> 00:52:07,159
too late. He's he has the official Hardwood Knocks endorsement.

1042
00:52:07,360 --> 00:52:08,719
He's he's he gets it.

1043
00:52:08,840 --> 00:52:11,840
Speaker 1: But now it's this team used to have that endorsement,

1044
00:52:12,400 --> 00:52:14,519
like last year was the oh we were so wrong

1045
00:52:14,559 --> 00:52:16,840
about them, and that they played hard and they they

1046
00:52:16,880 --> 00:52:20,000
had non bigs offensive rebounding and they they were gritty

1047
00:52:20,039 --> 00:52:22,159
on defense, and like, what is Dylan Brooks doing is

1048
00:52:22,159 --> 00:52:24,440
to look at Jordan Goodwin's locking people up and it's

1049
00:52:25,320 --> 00:52:28,400
it's not the fault of the players that we're here,

1050
00:52:28,480 --> 00:52:31,159
but it's just it's tough to make them. I can't

1051
00:52:31,159 --> 00:52:35,320
give them the Hardwood Knocks over arching stamp endorsement stamp

1052
00:52:35,480 --> 00:52:37,760
just because of like the Miles you might be on

1053
00:52:37,880 --> 00:52:38,599
Mute Grant or.

1054
00:52:38,880 --> 00:52:41,599
Speaker 2: Phoenix Phoenix as a team because Bert's over here whining

1055
00:52:41,639 --> 00:52:45,760
he doesn't like the Suns either. No, Phoenix as a

1056
00:52:45,760 --> 00:52:48,760
team doesn't get it. But but Malawatch has the stamp.

1057
00:52:48,840 --> 00:52:51,400
We'll come up with an official stamp. We like him,

1058
00:52:51,519 --> 00:52:52,480
doesn't mean it's to be great.

1059
00:52:52,920 --> 00:52:55,000
Speaker 1: He plays more minutes this year. Him or Mark Williams.

1060
00:52:56,800 --> 00:52:59,920
Speaker 2: I mean, I really hope it's Malwatch. But also I

1061
00:53:00,119 --> 00:53:02,119
really like oh so a Gadaro too, So.

1062
00:53:02,199 --> 00:53:05,440
Speaker 1: That's not That's another thing they That's not the question.

1063
00:53:05,599 --> 00:53:07,960
I was a factory, Mark factory in Mark Williams's injury

1064
00:53:08,000 --> 00:53:10,760
history and probably the investment you have in malea Watch

1065
00:53:10,800 --> 00:53:13,360
long term, I'm gonna pick this. He's our guy. The

1066
00:53:13,400 --> 00:53:15,679
answer is Mile Watch Grant. You know what you hesitated,

1067
00:53:15,840 --> 00:53:18,480
that's disappointing. Yeah, I mean, I just well because I'm

1068
00:53:18,519 --> 00:53:21,039
a little reticent to suggest the Suns will make the

1069
00:53:21,119 --> 00:53:23,400
right decisions. That's right, he didn't go to Michigan State,

1070
00:53:23,440 --> 00:53:26,639
so that he did not it really I want to

1071
00:53:26,679 --> 00:53:34,079
make this more complicated, but the glaring like red light

1072
00:53:34,239 --> 00:53:37,719
of giving up that twenty thirty three first to bring

1073
00:53:37,760 --> 00:53:40,920
in Miles Bridges for Royce O'Neil and Grayson Allen and

1074
00:53:40,960 --> 00:53:44,000
that whatever worst of the worst of the worst twenty

1075
00:53:44,079 --> 00:53:47,480
nine pick whatever it was, like I would take the

1076
00:53:47,559 --> 00:53:52,199
picks out. I'm not trading, uh, Grayson Allen and Royce

1077
00:53:52,199 --> 00:53:56,960
O'Neil for Miles Bridges, like start there, right. And then

1078
00:53:57,599 --> 00:54:00,159
I'm also because part of the reason, not just like

1079
00:54:00,199 --> 00:54:02,440
the Miles Bridges of it all is just like I

1080
00:54:02,440 --> 00:54:03,800
think you and I are both like I'm not trading

1081
00:54:03,840 --> 00:54:04,199
for that guy.

1082
00:54:04,280 --> 00:54:06,199
Speaker 2: You're not giving me that guy like that. I just

1083
00:54:06,280 --> 00:54:09,719
I don't want him on the team. That's one this

1084
00:54:09,719 --> 00:54:12,840
this Sun's team like had middling offensive performance because it

1085
00:54:12,920 --> 00:54:15,119
shot the three like pretty well, and you just gave

1086
00:54:15,199 --> 00:54:17,119
up two guys that you could rely on to do

1087
00:54:17,159 --> 00:54:19,679
that for one that you can't. And then on top

1088
00:54:19,719 --> 00:54:23,320
of that, the pick where this was kind of your like,

1089
00:54:23,840 --> 00:54:26,400
of course it's your Alaska's, it's the furthest out you

1090
00:54:26,400 --> 00:54:29,880
could move. Now to give that up just tells me

1091
00:54:30,000 --> 00:54:33,760
that like much like the Wizards, it's kind of like, oh,

1092
00:54:33,840 --> 00:54:35,840
you did just kind of show us who you are again,

1093
00:54:36,000 --> 00:54:38,079
like you had you had a moment there where we've

1094
00:54:38,119 --> 00:54:41,840
thought things were being done sensibly and now it's nope,

1095
00:54:42,039 --> 00:54:44,559
we're willing to just fire this pick, you know, into

1096
00:54:44,559 --> 00:54:49,199
space and we'll just continue having no outs, you know,

1097
00:54:49,280 --> 00:54:52,920
for for for Miles Bridges, For Miles Bridges, it's crazy.

1098
00:54:53,000 --> 00:54:54,119
Don't trade with Charlotte.

1099
00:54:54,559 --> 00:54:56,719
Speaker 1: That's that's where I'm miss Yeah, that's the moral of

1100
00:54:56,760 --> 00:55:02,320
the story for for Phoenix. Yeah, look, if you there

1101
00:55:02,559 --> 00:55:04,440
probably would have been if we were sitting here and

1102
00:55:04,480 --> 00:55:07,119
they didn't do really any They brought back cong Lesbie resign,

1103
00:55:07,159 --> 00:55:10,440
Mark Williams resigned, Jordan Goodwin, they're banking on common mile

1104
00:55:10,480 --> 00:55:13,280
Watch getting better. I don't know that we would have

1105
00:55:13,440 --> 00:55:15,920
criticized them heavily. We would have said, yeah, this is

1106
00:55:16,039 --> 00:55:17,639
they were in the middle of the Western Conference, Like,

1107
00:55:17,679 --> 00:55:20,800
it makes sense that they didn't fire their best trade

1108
00:55:20,840 --> 00:55:23,039
chips that were left unless there was this name that

1109
00:55:23,119 --> 00:55:25,199
made sense that could elevate them into a different tier

1110
00:55:25,199 --> 00:55:28,239
in the West. I think some Suns fans might have said,

1111
00:55:28,440 --> 00:55:30,079
we want to see them do more. They were talking

1112
00:55:30,079 --> 00:55:32,719
about how happy they were with this past season, which

1113
00:55:32,760 --> 00:55:36,400
is like, yes, they did surprise people, but like at

1114
00:55:36,400 --> 00:55:38,320
the end of the day, they were a first round

1115
00:55:38,360 --> 00:55:42,920
playoff stepping stone, and so not taking a bigger swing

1116
00:55:43,199 --> 00:55:46,199
would have been disappointing to some. The alternative of doing

1117
00:55:46,239 --> 00:55:49,719
nothing beats the quote unquote big swing that they just took.

1118
00:55:49,760 --> 00:55:52,239
Because this is a team and I've said this many times,

1119
00:55:52,719 --> 00:55:54,719
maybe he will prove me wrong on the basketball court

1120
00:55:54,719 --> 00:55:57,360
in Phoenix. I think Miles Bridges is one of the

1121
00:55:57,400 --> 00:56:00,559
biggest empty calorie guys in the league, not the single

1122
00:56:00,559 --> 00:56:03,679
biggest one. You were just hovering around the bottom five

1123
00:56:03,719 --> 00:56:07,239
in first chance offense, So forget about the offensive rebounding opportunities.

1124
00:56:07,480 --> 00:56:10,199
This is not someone I've seen things about like he's

1125
00:56:10,199 --> 00:56:12,199
a little bit better passer than you think, and he's

1126
00:56:12,239 --> 00:56:15,519
gonna give them some like dribble penetration. It's not going

1127
00:56:15,559 --> 00:56:18,960
to be a Charlotte was just better statistically without him

1128
00:56:19,079 --> 00:56:22,880
on both sides of the ball. So trading for him

1129
00:56:22,960 --> 00:56:26,679
is one I the off court stuff, the felody, domestic violence,

1130
00:56:26,760 --> 00:56:30,239
him pleading no contest like that is that that should matter.

1131
00:56:30,960 --> 00:56:33,079
But if you move that aside and look at the

1132
00:56:33,079 --> 00:56:36,840
basketball element, if you wanted to trade for him, okay,

1133
00:56:37,400 --> 00:56:40,480
to give up your best trade chip to do it

1134
00:56:40,519 --> 00:56:43,159
makes zero sense. And it's like you said, it's the

1135
00:56:43,159 --> 00:56:46,360
Wizards kind of maybe re revealing who they were. But

1136
00:56:46,400 --> 00:56:49,719
in this case, it's what made you think like, at

1137
00:56:49,800 --> 00:56:52,480
least with the Wizards, there was an there had to

1138
00:56:52,519 --> 00:56:55,599
be an urgency because you were slow playing it maybe

1139
00:56:55,639 --> 00:56:59,840
for too long for Ted Deansis's liking Phoenix just we

1140
00:56:59,840 --> 00:57:04,360
were just exited in a miniature era of just awful

1141
00:57:04,480 --> 00:57:08,119
vibes where they mortgaged everything to the hilt and got burned.

1142
00:57:08,360 --> 00:57:10,360
And so you decided to do more of it for

1143
00:57:10,440 --> 00:57:15,039
what the right to maybe finish sixth in the Western Conference,

1144
00:57:15,079 --> 00:57:18,000
which I think if most people did their Western Conference

1145
00:57:18,039 --> 00:57:20,679
tiers right now, they're not gonna beat the Timberwolves or

1146
00:57:20,719 --> 00:57:22,639
the Nuggets, or the Spurs or the thunder. Are they

1147
00:57:22,639 --> 00:57:24,480
gonna be ahead of the Lakers or the Rockets. So

1148
00:57:24,559 --> 00:57:29,599
like we're already talking seventh type territory like this is

1149
00:57:29,599 --> 00:57:32,159
they're confusing in the sense that I don't know. Were

1150
00:57:32,159 --> 00:57:34,159
they so high on their own supply that they thought

1151
00:57:34,199 --> 00:57:38,159
Miles Bridges is the difference between what and what like

1152
00:57:38,199 --> 00:57:40,599
between where they were and maybe flirting with fifty winds

1153
00:57:40,679 --> 00:57:42,119
because there's no way that's the case.

1154
00:57:42,599 --> 00:57:47,719
Speaker 2: No. I wish that I could have thought about nominating

1155
00:57:47,840 --> 00:57:50,599
them for this because I don't love the Mark Williams

1156
00:57:50,639 --> 00:57:52,440
move and been like, whoa, well, what about Mala watching

1157
00:57:52,480 --> 00:57:54,639
a guitaro and then not done it because that's not

1158
00:57:54,679 --> 00:57:57,519
sufficient and yet here and the Bridges move is just

1159
00:57:57,559 --> 00:57:59,559
like I can't. I can't get there on any level.

1160
00:58:00,199 --> 00:58:02,079
Who's your next pick? All right?

1161
00:58:02,320 --> 00:58:06,320
Speaker 1: So I think this is gonna enrage some people. I'm

1162
00:58:06,320 --> 00:58:08,920
gonna go with the Los Angeles Lakers on my list.

1163
00:58:09,920 --> 00:58:13,159
I actually do not It's risky, but I don't have

1164
00:58:13,199 --> 00:58:16,079
a problem with the money they gave Walker Kestler one

1165
00:58:16,119 --> 00:58:18,840
hundred and thirty million dollars just first starting caliber center

1166
00:58:18,840 --> 00:58:22,239
who is statistically can be a transcendent like rimp protector

1167
00:58:22,280 --> 00:58:27,000
and defensive base sure. Giving up control of four first

1168
00:58:27,079 --> 00:58:31,559
round picks to outright two swaps insane, insane. I don't

1169
00:58:31,599 --> 00:58:34,559
care that you Lukanchich on your team. He's not signed

1170
00:58:35,119 --> 00:58:37,800
that deep to when those picks are going to convey,

1171
00:58:38,159 --> 00:58:41,159
then to go out, and when we're in a market

1172
00:58:41,280 --> 00:58:45,440
where you have Norman Powell who just made an All

1173
00:58:45,440 --> 00:58:48,960
Star team, couldn't get more than one guaranteed year. Mam

1174
00:58:48,960 --> 00:58:51,679
who gets four guaranteed years. I like Mamu. I think

1175
00:58:51,679 --> 00:58:53,119
the deal is a little rich. I like Mama four

1176
00:58:53,159 --> 00:58:55,800
guaranteed years. Quentin Grimes who need to sign the qualifying

1177
00:58:55,840 --> 00:59:01,119
offer last year, four guaranteed years, Colin Sexton two guaranteed years,

1178
00:59:01,679 --> 00:59:05,559
which wouldn't you have rather just had Marcus Smart back?

1179
00:59:05,599 --> 00:59:09,519
Based on what your team needs? What is this team's identity? Also,

1180
00:59:09,559 --> 00:59:13,000
here's another question, what are they doing at backup five?

1181
00:59:13,159 --> 00:59:15,519
I get the JJ Reddick probably didn't like DeAndre Ayton.

1182
00:59:16,159 --> 00:59:18,320
DeAndre Ayton is a backup versus DeAndre Ayton as a

1183
00:59:18,320 --> 00:59:21,119
starter when you also lost Jackson Hayes. What is the

1184
00:59:21,159 --> 00:59:23,320
plan here? Is it to downsize with Vando? Is it

1185
00:59:23,360 --> 00:59:25,559
to use Mama with the five? Because I got news

1186
00:59:25,920 --> 00:59:28,800
for people that's not gonna fly. You don't have like

1187
00:59:28,880 --> 00:59:31,639
Desire Williams signing. I really liked that. Being linked to

1188
00:59:31,639 --> 00:59:35,199
matist Thibele makes sense them being linked to Jonathan kaminga

1189
00:59:35,280 --> 00:59:37,000
and being willing to give up a twenty thirty two

1190
00:59:37,039 --> 00:59:39,760
swap to make a sign and trade happen. No, that

1191
00:59:39,800 --> 00:59:44,000
doesn't make any sense. I they're confusing because for a

1192
00:59:44,039 --> 00:59:47,760
team that needs to operate as if they're trying to

1193
00:59:47,800 --> 00:59:51,519
maximize Luka Doncics's window, they feel like they chose this

1194
00:59:51,639 --> 00:59:55,760
weird middle build that the end result. I'm open to

1195
00:59:55,760 --> 00:59:57,800
the idea they might be better during the regular season

1196
00:59:57,800 --> 01:00:03,840
reason Luca remain healthy. Sure in the playoffs, I don't

1197
01:00:03,880 --> 01:00:05,800
see a team right now that can win more than

1198
01:00:05,840 --> 01:00:07,880
a single playoff series. And if I had to guess

1199
01:00:08,800 --> 01:00:10,800
we're gonna do, you should subscribe to our patron because

1200
01:00:10,800 --> 01:00:13,280
we're gonna be doing the Superstar Trade Draft at the

1201
01:00:13,360 --> 01:00:17,119
end of this month. I don't think. I honestly think

1202
01:00:17,159 --> 01:00:20,159
this is the off season that is putting Luca's future

1203
01:00:20,400 --> 01:00:22,880
in LA like it's the now in the coffin. This

1204
01:00:22,960 --> 01:00:27,280
is gonna be another two season thing, Max, because this roster,

1205
01:00:27,840 --> 01:00:31,760
what is there? I don't I keep seeing they they

1206
01:00:31,840 --> 01:00:35,480
rebuilt this roster in the image of Luka Doncic. How

1207
01:00:36,360 --> 01:00:39,039
was Luka Doncics blindfolded and just pointing at names on

1208
01:00:39,079 --> 01:00:41,159
a board and that's what you did. I don't like,

1209
01:00:41,440 --> 01:00:43,800
how is this team if it was rebuilt in the

1210
01:00:43,800 --> 01:00:48,079
image of Luka Doncic aside from getting Walker Kessler, where's

1211
01:00:48,119 --> 01:00:50,519
the evidence that, Like, how is Colin sext and someone

1212
01:00:50,519 --> 01:00:53,000
who is in the image of Luke? Why is we're

1213
01:00:53,079 --> 01:00:54,840
quite and grinding him so tight when he was in

1214
01:00:54,920 --> 01:00:58,119
Dallas that yeah, we needed to bring him, bring him on.

1215
01:00:58,360 --> 01:01:01,679
I don't And by the way, way this this franchise

1216
01:01:01,760 --> 01:01:05,199
might be the best in the league at watching the

1217
01:01:05,320 --> 01:01:09,559
complete opposite and decide like happening in the playoffs and decide, yo,

1218
01:01:09,599 --> 01:01:12,119
we don't really need like true wings, like those are

1219
01:01:12,280 --> 01:01:13,079
that important.

1220
01:01:14,239 --> 01:01:20,519
Speaker 2: I mean, I don't know how long the list of

1221
01:01:20,679 --> 01:01:23,239
players in the league is.

1222
01:01:23,400 --> 01:01:26,559
Speaker 1: I forgot about it. Yeah, that's Cavanloney who couldn't get

1223
01:01:26,559 --> 01:01:28,119
into Pelicans rotation.

1224
01:01:28,559 --> 01:01:32,039
Speaker 2: Ye great locker room presence, can't. I don't think you.

1225
01:01:32,039 --> 01:01:35,599
Speaker 1: Can play them anymore Looney or DeAndre Geordan.

1226
01:01:36,760 --> 01:01:39,039
Speaker 2: I mean that's a it's gonna go down to the wire.

1227
01:01:39,440 --> 01:01:41,480
That might depend on if if somebody gets a game

1228
01:01:41,519 --> 01:01:44,840
at the end of the year. Uh, I don't. It

1229
01:01:44,880 --> 01:01:47,719
does seem like Luca put his thumb on the scale

1230
01:01:47,760 --> 01:01:50,960
for Walker Kessler yes, I mean, like I think, I

1231
01:01:51,000 --> 01:01:53,159
think that has to be a factor. I just don't

1232
01:01:53,159 --> 01:01:56,960
think you should ever let like Lebron's a bad GM.

1233
01:01:57,000 --> 01:02:00,239
Like the players are terrible at this, the guys because

1234
01:02:00,280 --> 01:02:02,039
they don't think about it in terms of like, well,

1235
01:02:02,079 --> 01:02:04,519
if we do this, not only are we paying him

1236
01:02:04,519 --> 01:02:06,320
the money, we're giving up all the assets that we

1237
01:02:06,360 --> 01:02:08,840
would need to have the flexibility for other moves to

1238
01:02:08,840 --> 01:02:11,000
make this team better down the line, like Luca's not.

1239
01:02:11,079 --> 01:02:14,239
I don't think, I mean, I'm just I'm just totally speculating,

1240
01:02:14,280 --> 01:02:16,400
but like, I don't feel like players think about those

1241
01:02:16,400 --> 01:02:19,000
things like the actual cost of going go get the

1242
01:02:19,039 --> 01:02:22,360
guy that I like, and whether Kessler's the right guy

1243
01:02:22,440 --> 01:02:24,800
or not remains to be seen. Like I think, I

1244
01:02:24,840 --> 01:02:27,400
think the center depth issue is a massive problem, partly

1245
01:02:27,440 --> 01:02:29,960
because you can't count on him to necessarily be healthy.

1246
01:02:30,000 --> 01:02:32,199
I know he had like it's a shoulder injury so

1247
01:02:32,360 --> 01:02:34,599
that it had surgery. Whatever. It's not like he has

1248
01:02:34,679 --> 01:02:38,000
chronic like calf streams or whatever. But still the Senate

1249
01:02:38,000 --> 01:02:39,599
def behind him is terrible. I don't think you can

1250
01:02:39,599 --> 01:02:41,760
play MoMu as a backup center and get away with it.

1251
01:02:41,800 --> 01:02:46,159
Speaker 1: And by the way, Walker Kessler has averaged over thirty

1252
01:02:46,199 --> 01:02:48,440
minutes a game once and it was the season in

1253
01:02:48,480 --> 01:02:51,199
which he played five games. Yeah, and he's thirty minutes

1254
01:02:51,239 --> 01:02:52,880
the season he played in fifty eight games, and then

1255
01:02:52,920 --> 01:02:55,039
he's in the twenties. I'm not saying he can't do it,

1256
01:02:55,400 --> 01:02:57,760
but they treated it as like a sure thing, and

1257
01:02:57,800 --> 01:03:02,320
even through the lens of to take riks Risks with

1258
01:03:02,440 --> 01:03:05,920
Luca on board. Sure, that was an insane cost that

1259
01:03:05,960 --> 01:03:08,960
they gave it, Like the draft, the money you can

1260
01:03:09,000 --> 01:03:11,159
get me on board with that, don't have the four years,

1261
01:03:11,159 --> 01:03:14,079
one hundred and thirty million dollars feels based off the

1262
01:03:14,119 --> 01:03:17,360
track record, but you are it is an investment in

1263
01:03:18,079 --> 01:03:20,079
what you believe he can do, and so are the

1264
01:03:20,079 --> 01:03:22,719
first round picks. But if the alternative is just I

1265
01:03:22,719 --> 01:03:24,880
get to keep control of those four picks and not

1266
01:03:25,079 --> 01:03:29,679
have Walker Kessler, Yeah, what just be the Mitchell Robinson

1267
01:03:29,719 --> 01:03:32,360
team at that point, Like if that was the opportunity cost?

1268
01:03:32,679 --> 01:03:36,079
Speaker 2: Yeah, So I think like there are some elements here

1269
01:03:36,119 --> 01:03:39,480
that you can see the logic. I think in like, yes,

1270
01:03:39,559 --> 01:03:41,840
we understand the type of team you should build around

1271
01:03:41,880 --> 01:03:43,920
Luka Dancic because the MAVs did it and they made

1272
01:03:43,920 --> 01:03:47,199
the finals. Like it and so okay, Austin Reeves is

1273
01:03:47,199 --> 01:03:49,840
in the Jalen Brunson role, except he's making ten x

1274
01:03:50,199 --> 01:03:51,280
whatever Jalen Brunson was.

1275
01:03:51,519 --> 01:03:53,440
Speaker 1: Yeah, he took like five million less.

1276
01:03:53,280 --> 01:03:58,559
Speaker 2: Than nine point seven head And I yeah, you go

1277
01:03:58,639 --> 01:04:01,039
get Kessler because that's you. You got to have that

1278
01:04:01,199 --> 01:04:04,920
center position, the room rolling guy, the paint protector, got

1279
01:04:04,960 --> 01:04:07,880
to have that. But like, there's unless you really think

1280
01:04:07,960 --> 01:04:11,840
Zion Williams is gonna fill this role, and I'm with you,

1281
01:04:11,880 --> 01:04:14,239
like for the price, you absolutely sign him for that,

1282
01:04:14,639 --> 01:04:16,280
or if you think Quentin Grimes is up for this.

1283
01:04:16,760 --> 01:04:22,840
I don't see the defensively versatile athletic combo forwards and

1284
01:04:22,880 --> 01:04:27,239
wings that will make threes and defend, Like I just

1285
01:04:27,280 --> 01:04:30,440
that element is just not present here. So that's really,

1286
01:04:30,840 --> 01:04:33,039
as much as anything why this team is confusing, because

1287
01:04:33,039 --> 01:04:35,239
you seem to understand some of the pieces of what

1288
01:04:35,239 --> 01:04:39,199
a Luka Doncicch led team should be, but you really

1289
01:04:39,239 --> 01:04:42,960
glossed over, maybe like the core element of what you've

1290
01:04:43,000 --> 01:04:45,000
got to have to make this whole thing work. So

1291
01:04:45,639 --> 01:04:49,000
I agree, and I haven't really thought about the is

1292
01:04:49,079 --> 01:04:52,719
this pushing Luca out? But in the sense that, like, so,

1293
01:04:52,760 --> 01:04:56,199
how do you improve this team now without moving some

1294
01:04:56,239 --> 01:05:00,639
of your key pieces for like not and not getting

1295
01:05:00,679 --> 01:05:02,679
back the best player in any of those deals because

1296
01:05:02,679 --> 01:05:04,320
you know Sweeten like.

1297
01:05:04,239 --> 01:05:08,519
Speaker 1: And also watch off their non Luca players has positive

1298
01:05:08,639 --> 01:05:13,159
trade value right now? Austin Reeves maybe like that. Let's

1299
01:05:13,159 --> 01:05:17,320
just say, Austin Reeves, does Walker Kessler have positive trade

1300
01:05:17,360 --> 01:05:20,000
value on this deal? I would say, TBD, Well, you're

1301
01:05:20,000 --> 01:05:22,320
not getting back what you gave up for Walker Kessler.

1302
01:05:22,559 --> 01:05:23,039
No you're not.

1303
01:05:23,599 --> 01:05:27,239
Speaker 2: You're not getting Yeah, I I I don't know, so yeah,

1304
01:05:27,360 --> 01:05:30,440
I agree, they're on my list too. All right, we

1305
01:05:30,519 --> 01:05:35,719
gotta get another team here. Dang, I think you took Amine,

1306
01:05:35,760 --> 01:05:37,079
so I got to go off the board here.

1307
01:05:38,719 --> 01:05:40,960
Speaker 1: You only had a list of three teams.

1308
01:05:40,719 --> 01:05:44,920
Speaker 2: At six, that's right, we boke All six of mine

1309
01:05:45,280 --> 01:05:49,360
were on your list. Let's see. Well, I mean, do

1310
01:05:49,440 --> 01:05:50,679
you want to talk about the Warriors?

1311
01:05:50,719 --> 01:05:51,000
Speaker 1: I could?

1312
01:05:51,119 --> 01:05:56,400
Speaker 2: I mean, because at at a base level, they're trying

1313
01:05:56,440 --> 01:05:59,280
to maximize Steph Curry. This is all old news. They're

1314
01:05:59,280 --> 01:06:03,960
trying to maximize Steph's prime, and the hope in achieving

1315
01:06:04,000 --> 01:06:06,719
that rest so on Lebron James choosing them. And if

1316
01:06:06,719 --> 01:06:09,960
he doesn't, how can you go into this season saying

1317
01:06:10,039 --> 01:06:13,000
anything better than what happened last year is possible, and

1318
01:06:13,119 --> 01:06:14,920
last year was not nearly good enough. There was that

1319
01:06:15,000 --> 01:06:17,079
one play in game where I was like, oh, and

1320
01:06:17,119 --> 01:06:19,320
I'll treasure it forever because it was a great STEPH game.

1321
01:06:19,519 --> 01:06:22,880
Steve is never gonna stop talking about it. How like

1322
01:06:22,920 --> 01:06:24,960
that was our reminder of what it felt like. That

1323
01:06:25,039 --> 01:06:29,119
was that was pure basketball. That's all you got really,

1324
01:06:29,880 --> 01:06:35,639
So I don't think you could say it's I don't know.

1325
01:06:36,119 --> 01:06:38,280
Really what's happened here is like the heart, it keeps

1326
01:06:38,320 --> 01:06:40,400
winning over the head, which I'm fine with because that's

1327
01:06:40,440 --> 01:06:42,800
how I think about the Warriors. But if you don't

1328
01:06:42,840 --> 01:06:45,920
get Lebron, what is your argument going into this season

1329
01:06:45,960 --> 01:06:48,280
that anything will be different and that we will be

1330
01:06:48,760 --> 01:06:51,599
that that better, better things can happen than we saw

1331
01:06:51,679 --> 01:06:52,159
last year.

1332
01:06:52,760 --> 01:06:56,480
Speaker 1: Is Jimmy Butler having a half season off is going

1333
01:06:56,519 --> 01:06:58,360
to be fresh and you catch lighting at a ball,

1334
01:06:58,400 --> 01:07:02,119
I'm not even and Jacksville London Brok's able to contribute, right,

1335
01:07:02,280 --> 01:07:04,960
which I will say about Yaxville. So after he played

1336
01:07:04,960 --> 01:07:07,119
twenty seven plus minutes against the Knicks the other night,

1337
01:07:08,079 --> 01:07:11,760
he was out there in between timeouts during Miami Toronto

1338
01:07:11,960 --> 01:07:15,840
summer League basically like holding the T shirt toss. He

1339
01:07:15,880 --> 01:07:17,679
was throwing the T shirts out in the street clothes,

1340
01:07:18,000 --> 01:07:20,639
so that that dude gets it. And I think that's

1341
01:07:20,639 --> 01:07:22,559
where at least one first place Rookie of the Year

1342
01:07:22,639 --> 01:07:24,320
vote alone, I just want to throw it out there.

1343
01:07:24,679 --> 01:07:27,639
That's that's the pathway. And by the way, the reason

1344
01:07:27,639 --> 01:07:29,920
I don't find them confusing is this has been their

1345
01:07:29,960 --> 01:07:31,760
stick for a while, is we will be.

1346
01:07:31,639 --> 01:07:33,719
Speaker 2: Well, we're just used to it though, We're just that

1347
01:07:33,719 --> 01:07:35,519
doesn't mean it's not like illogical.

1348
01:07:36,599 --> 01:07:38,719
Speaker 1: Yeah no, you're well, yeah, all right, you're right. So

1349
01:07:38,800 --> 01:07:42,679
just because I understand their their irrationality doesn't make it rational.

1350
01:07:42,719 --> 01:07:46,119
Yeah that makes sense. Yeah, but it's hasn't it been

1351
01:07:46,119 --> 01:07:48,440
the same song and dance basically every summer for the

1352
01:07:48,440 --> 01:07:50,440
past since they won the title. Words, we're kind of

1353
01:07:50,480 --> 01:07:52,760
sort of linked to this one big name, and we

1354
01:07:52,760 --> 01:07:55,519
weren't really all in because with Lebron it's are we

1355
01:07:55,559 --> 01:07:58,039
sure they're like ready to give him the non text mL.

1356
01:07:58,480 --> 01:08:01,280
Speaker 2: I mean, if that's a sticking point, we gotta have

1357
01:08:01,320 --> 01:08:02,039
a conversation.

1358
01:08:02,800 --> 01:08:06,559
Speaker 1: So they're confusing. But they've been confusing for a while,

1359
01:08:06,599 --> 01:08:08,719
and maybe that's what makes them not as confusing to

1360
01:08:08,760 --> 01:08:12,119
me is that they seem very content to just let

1361
01:08:12,159 --> 01:08:14,440
this ride off into the sunset while being mediocre, and

1362
01:08:14,480 --> 01:08:18,000
they're gonna, you know, let it ride out with Steph,

1363
01:08:18,039 --> 01:08:20,479
and that's I guess they've earned that right with four titles.

1364
01:08:20,479 --> 01:08:23,720
But they can't come out and just say then they

1365
01:08:23,800 --> 01:08:25,760
kind of have in so many ways said it, But

1366
01:08:25,800 --> 01:08:28,560
you can't come out and just say, yeah, we're not

1367
01:08:28,600 --> 01:08:30,800
trying to win titles anymore, like this is just that

1368
01:08:30,840 --> 01:08:33,279
would be too expensive and too risky and we'd mortgage

1369
01:08:33,279 --> 01:08:36,119
too much of our future for an abridged window that

1370
01:08:36,359 --> 01:08:40,880
might not even end up panning out. But the fact

1371
01:08:40,920 --> 01:08:42,880
that Steph is just when he's playing, is still very

1372
01:08:42,920 --> 01:08:44,720
clearly like a top ten to twelve player in the.

1373
01:08:44,760 --> 01:08:47,680
Speaker 2: League is well, and even if he is not, it's

1374
01:08:47,720 --> 01:08:50,960
it's like he's top five in giving you the feelings

1375
01:08:51,039 --> 01:08:53,359
you want to feel, you know, if you're a Warriors fan,

1376
01:08:53,720 --> 01:08:58,039
it's just like you're just every every like little you know,

1377
01:08:58,800 --> 01:09:02,640
three possession scoring streak in a row is just like

1378
01:09:03,319 --> 01:09:06,640
just scratches that little itch of like, hey, hey remember

1379
01:09:06,680 --> 01:09:09,600
when this was like remember when things were this way

1380
01:09:09,640 --> 01:09:12,880
all the time? And that's enough, honestly, I think for

1381
01:09:13,000 --> 01:09:16,119
like the vast majority of Warriors fans, but I nominated them,

1382
01:09:16,119 --> 01:09:18,479
so I have to concede that, like, from a purely

1383
01:09:18,520 --> 01:09:20,600
logical perspective, what they've done for the last like two

1384
01:09:20,720 --> 01:09:23,159
or three years, it's just like, this isn't This isn't

1385
01:09:23,199 --> 01:09:25,239
how a normal team should be operating.

1386
01:09:26,000 --> 01:09:27,479
Speaker 1: No, I'm with you there. I didn't want to get

1387
01:09:27,479 --> 01:09:30,159
your thoughts though on someone posts this in the discord

1388
01:09:30,199 --> 01:09:33,479
and now I can't find it. Okay, so I can't convert,

1389
01:09:33,520 --> 01:09:37,720
so kill Haws and our discord posted Lebron James. Oh no,

1390
01:09:37,800 --> 01:09:39,359
this is it turns out that it did not happen,

1391
01:09:39,399 --> 01:09:41,159
so I'm not going to bring it up. Never mind, then,

1392
01:09:41,199 --> 01:09:45,239
but are you still clinging to Lebron James? Using the

1393
01:09:45,399 --> 01:09:47,920
meaningful basketball is sort of a clue that, oh, maybe

1394
01:09:47,920 --> 01:09:50,159
he really is considering I mean, I'm not.

1395
01:09:50,439 --> 01:09:52,239
Speaker 2: I feel like when I said that to you, you

1396
01:09:52,359 --> 01:09:54,039
really were like, this is this?

1397
01:09:54,039 --> 01:09:57,359
Speaker 1: I haven't like Grant. I've done podcasts in radio spots

1398
01:09:57,399 --> 01:09:59,439
where I've brought up that moment as that I was

1399
01:09:59,479 --> 01:10:02,159
so short was Cleveland or bust and then my co

1400
01:10:02,319 --> 01:10:05,920
host comes in just with this like baseless bread crumb

1401
01:10:06,000 --> 01:10:08,000
that I'm now clinging to and.

1402
01:10:08,000 --> 01:10:10,920
Speaker 2: I mean it's it's it's good to believe, it's it's

1403
01:10:10,960 --> 01:10:16,239
important to believe in something. I think. Uh I I

1404
01:10:16,279 --> 01:10:20,399
am less sure that it's gonna happen than I was

1405
01:10:21,279 --> 01:10:23,560
initially when like, oh my god, they're gonna do They're

1406
01:10:23,560 --> 01:10:26,479
gonna do a d and Lebron Like that's that's that's

1407
01:10:26,479 --> 01:10:29,000
how it's gonna work out. Like if you force me

1408
01:10:29,079 --> 01:10:31,840
to give a percentage likelihood on Anthony Davis and Lebron

1409
01:10:31,880 --> 01:10:33,600
being on the team next year. At that time when

1410
01:10:33,600 --> 01:10:36,479
that news was just breaking out of been like sixty five,

1411
01:10:37,319 --> 01:10:41,640
it's like overwhelmingly likely. Don't know what, you would never

1412
01:10:41,680 --> 01:10:45,119
bet against it, you'd be a fool. But now it's like,

1413
01:10:45,720 --> 01:10:49,039
it doesn't seem like Davis is going anywhere. I will say,

1414
01:10:49,199 --> 01:10:51,760
like getting Lebron still seems We talked about it off

1415
01:10:51,760 --> 01:10:53,840
air a little bit. The Warriors make as much sense

1416
01:10:53,880 --> 01:10:56,399
as anybody. Like Cleveland's a sentimental pick. If I had

1417
01:10:56,439 --> 01:10:58,800
to guess, I would just say Cleveland because I don't

1418
01:10:58,840 --> 01:11:01,680
know if it just yeah, he's gonna go finish where

1419
01:11:01,720 --> 01:11:04,079
he started, like that kind of thing. But I think

1420
01:11:04,079 --> 01:11:07,159
the Warriors to me are like second or third most likely,

1421
01:11:07,159 --> 01:11:09,039
and it may maybe the gap isn't even that big

1422
01:11:09,079 --> 01:11:12,680
between one and two and three and then getting Lebron.

1423
01:11:13,199 --> 01:11:16,359
I do think if if they are finally ready to

1424
01:11:16,439 --> 01:11:19,239
like put some chips on the table, maybe the next

1425
01:11:19,279 --> 01:11:21,840
guy that gets you know, itchy to leave a big

1426
01:11:21,840 --> 01:11:25,000
star is like maybe the Warriors are higher on my

1427
01:11:25,119 --> 01:11:27,960
list of teams I'll extend with or want to steer

1428
01:11:27,960 --> 01:11:30,720
myself too, because like Lebron is there, and that's more

1429
01:11:30,880 --> 01:11:33,039
enticing than just like well Steph in half a season

1430
01:11:33,039 --> 01:11:34,159
of Jimmy Butler and.

1431
01:11:34,039 --> 01:11:38,439
Speaker 1: Like you're talking about a Bronni consolidation trade is sure.

1432
01:11:38,560 --> 01:11:40,159
Speaker 2: Yeah, whatever you have to give up to get him,

1433
01:11:40,520 --> 01:11:42,399
I think I think you probably do it. No.

1434
01:11:42,439 --> 01:11:44,119
Speaker 1: I know, if I was the Warriors, I was just

1435
01:11:44,119 --> 01:11:47,000
try and trade for him. Right now, it's just sort

1436
01:11:47,000 --> 01:11:49,640
of a like.

1437
01:11:49,600 --> 01:11:52,920
Speaker 2: A ransom situation, like just like do you ever want

1438
01:11:52,920 --> 01:11:55,319
to see him again? Play with him every day?

1439
01:11:55,319 --> 01:11:56,680
Speaker 1: Do you ever want to see him outside of the

1440
01:11:56,720 --> 01:11:59,520
G League? You're gonna you're design with us.

1441
01:12:00,079 --> 01:12:01,600
Speaker 2: I like, Mike, don't leave you on the phone with

1442
01:12:01,640 --> 01:12:05,359
like one of those voice disguisers, like we have your boy.

1443
01:12:07,359 --> 01:12:09,960
You know what you need to do? Uh Yeah, I

1444
01:12:10,279 --> 01:12:16,000
don't know. I I hope they get Lebron. I don't

1445
01:12:16,039 --> 01:12:17,319
know how likely it is anymore.

1446
01:12:17,479 --> 01:12:19,399
Speaker 1: I don't Hey, look, this is why you subcribe to

1447
01:12:19,439 --> 01:12:22,039
our Patreon for more on bias takes Like I hope

1448
01:12:22,079 --> 01:12:23,399
the Warriors get Lebron.

1449
01:12:23,800 --> 01:12:26,119
Speaker 2: I mean, isn't that Isn't that more fun than Cleveland

1450
01:12:26,159 --> 01:12:27,720
unless you live in Cleveland, and then you're.

1451
01:12:27,600 --> 01:12:30,680
Speaker 1: Like I would say, with the exception of Miami, any

1452
01:12:30,720 --> 01:12:33,319
spot is more fun than Cleveland. Just because I don't

1453
01:12:33,680 --> 01:12:37,960
think he meaningfully improve there's that word improves their championship

1454
01:12:38,000 --> 01:12:42,960
equity and poetic like the poeticism of it. You can't

1455
01:12:43,279 --> 01:12:46,159
like the emotional component. I can't argue against it. I

1456
01:12:46,199 --> 01:12:48,359
just want to see something new with him, and if

1457
01:12:48,359 --> 01:12:51,680
you want another title with just a different team I have.

1458
01:12:51,840 --> 01:12:54,760
I've had people come up to me normal that's the

1459
01:12:54,800 --> 01:12:56,600
only place I go. Not a brag, but like at

1460
01:12:56,600 --> 01:12:58,840
the gym and when they try to invariably talk to

1461
01:12:58,920 --> 01:13:01,520
me about the NBA. I don't like Lebron. He just

1462
01:13:01,520 --> 01:13:04,560
plays for whichever team he wants and like Jordan was

1463
01:13:04,600 --> 01:13:07,920
undefeated in the finals, could be times Lebron got to

1464
01:13:08,000 --> 01:13:11,079
the finals and like winning a championship with all these

1465
01:13:11,119 --> 01:13:15,119
different franchises is incredibly difficult. So I would I want

1466
01:13:15,199 --> 01:13:18,159
him Golden. To see him play with Steph I think

1467
01:13:18,159 --> 01:13:20,119
would be high up on my League Pass rankings. But

1468
01:13:20,199 --> 01:13:24,239
I would love to see him go to Minnesota or Denver. Yeah,

1469
01:13:24,319 --> 01:13:25,880
it would be there's a lot of big Oh right,

1470
01:13:26,159 --> 01:13:29,039
he's a basket He's a real basketball sick go. Speaking

1471
01:13:29,079 --> 01:13:32,720
of Grant though, with the what is this the eighth pick, Yeah,

1472
01:13:32,800 --> 01:13:35,279
I'm going to go to one of Lebron James's potential

1473
01:13:35,279 --> 01:13:37,680
teams that has also kind of been ruled out as

1474
01:13:37,720 --> 01:13:40,640
one of no longer his potential teams, the Denver Nuggets.

1475
01:13:41,800 --> 01:13:45,760
I do find it interesting that in a summer in

1476
01:13:45,800 --> 01:13:51,560
which Nicoliokich has so far declined to extension for reasons,

1477
01:13:51,840 --> 01:13:53,920
we could talk about the financial reasons. Right now. He

1478
01:13:53,960 --> 01:13:56,960
can get the Donovan Mitchell Special, which would be four

1479
01:13:57,079 --> 01:14:00,640
years and two hundred and seventy seven plus millionllion dollars,

1480
01:14:01,239 --> 01:14:03,800
or he could wait next year and if he wants

1481
01:14:03,800 --> 01:14:05,920
to sign a full five year contract that could be

1482
01:14:05,920 --> 01:14:08,520
worth three hundred and fifty three point two million is

1483
01:14:08,520 --> 01:14:10,560
the projected total. By the way, that number is going

1484
01:14:10,600 --> 01:14:12,600
to go down because the NBA salary cap projection is

1485
01:14:12,680 --> 01:14:14,600
just keep being lowered. I love how people are still

1486
01:14:14,800 --> 01:14:16,680
some people are still using like the ten percent year

1487
01:14:16,680 --> 01:14:19,880
over year. That's not it's not happened anymore. But he

1488
01:14:19,920 --> 01:14:23,640
hasn't signed an extension, which last year that raised eye brows.

1489
01:14:23,840 --> 01:14:26,560
It should be raising eyebrows no matter what you think

1490
01:14:26,560 --> 01:14:30,079
he might be saying publicly. There was that that Serbian

1491
01:14:30,119 --> 01:14:32,279
interview that we also where he has said he wants

1492
01:14:32,319 --> 01:14:35,560
to retire in Denver. I don't I don't doubt those intentions.

1493
01:14:36,600 --> 01:14:42,119
You've done basically jack shit. You lost Tim Hardaway.

1494
01:14:41,800 --> 01:14:45,359
Speaker 2: Junior high Jones, Dan, what are we doing?

1495
01:14:45,399 --> 01:14:48,239
Speaker 1: You brought back Tias Jones and so that just leads

1496
01:14:48,239 --> 01:14:50,439
me to say, oh, you still need a backup point guard.

1497
01:14:51,439 --> 01:14:54,039
You signed Diallo and is are we but okay? Cool?

1498
01:14:54,039 --> 01:14:55,760
But like Spencer Jones is it? Is he part of

1499
01:14:55,760 --> 01:14:58,680
the planet anymore? And you still have the big note

1500
01:14:58,720 --> 01:15:01,279
here is Peyton Watson slowing around in the restricted free

1501
01:15:01,279 --> 01:15:04,880
agency market. Now I'm not criticizing or saying the Nuggets

1502
01:15:04,880 --> 01:15:07,319
are confusing because they haven't paid him yet. This is

1503
01:15:07,359 --> 01:15:09,560
how RFA works. The way the Pistons are playing with

1504
01:15:09,680 --> 01:15:12,439
Jayleen Duran is perfect. I know there are other teams

1505
01:15:12,760 --> 01:15:14,359
like the Nets and the Clippers that have been interested

1506
01:15:14,399 --> 01:15:17,319
in Peyton Watson, but there's been no offer sheet and

1507
01:15:17,359 --> 01:15:19,239
so everything has to run through the Nuggets.

1508
01:15:19,239 --> 01:15:19,399
Speaker 2: Now.

1509
01:15:19,399 --> 01:15:24,239
Speaker 1: Anyway, I'm looking at this and thinking, you bring back

1510
01:15:24,279 --> 01:15:28,039
Peyton Watson? Is that just enough? Are we also assuming

1511
01:15:28,079 --> 01:15:30,520
that they're not gonna like there was the report from

1512
01:15:30,560 --> 01:15:34,399
the Steinline that well, they're not obligated to cut money

1513
01:15:34,439 --> 01:15:37,039
if they go into the second apron. They're inside, They're

1514
01:15:37,079 --> 01:15:39,640
like right at the second apron at this moment, they're

1515
01:15:39,640 --> 01:15:43,760
not there, but they're pretty close. Peyton Watson's getting even

1516
01:15:43,760 --> 01:15:45,560
if you think he gets less than Christian Brown, he's

1517
01:15:45,560 --> 01:15:47,840
not getting less than twenty million right to start.

1518
01:15:48,159 --> 01:15:49,079
Speaker 2: It would be shocking.

1519
01:15:49,800 --> 01:15:52,840
Speaker 1: So you're a repeater team who's blowing past the second

1520
01:15:52,880 --> 01:15:57,439
apron to field the same core that lost in the

1521
01:15:57,479 --> 01:16:02,680
first round. I'd call schnet on that. So something afoot

1522
01:16:02,760 --> 01:16:05,399
has to be happening here. But what is it? And

1523
01:16:05,520 --> 01:16:07,520
do the Nuggets come out of this? Is there any

1524
01:16:07,560 --> 01:16:10,520
scenery in which the Nuggets exit this off season and

1525
01:16:10,560 --> 01:16:14,119
you feel better about this team than you did entering

1526
01:16:14,199 --> 01:16:18,720
last year. And I'm struggling to find the I mean,

1527
01:16:18,760 --> 01:16:21,600
I like, hey, Trayvon Brazil drop thirty five yard right

1528
01:16:21,640 --> 01:16:25,239
and he was my guy. But to be with all sincerity,

1529
01:16:25,720 --> 01:16:27,960
I don't know what's going on here, but for a

1530
01:16:27,960 --> 01:16:30,760
team that I'm not saying they needed to do something reckless,

1531
01:16:31,000 --> 01:16:33,279
trade everybody. Because you and I have talked at length,

1532
01:16:33,720 --> 01:16:35,960
it's easy to say, well, just trade Jamal Murray or

1533
01:16:36,000 --> 01:16:38,239
Aaron Gordon for who and how do you how does

1534
01:16:38,279 --> 01:16:41,039
that make you better? But in an off season, in

1535
01:16:41,039 --> 01:16:45,079
a summer, when it doesn't seem like Nicolaiokich is gonna commit,

1536
01:16:45,640 --> 01:16:49,760
like formally commit to you in the future, like for

1537
01:16:49,800 --> 01:16:52,920
this to be what's happened so far, or even just

1538
01:16:52,960 --> 01:16:55,880
bringing back Peyton Watson or running it back in general,

1539
01:16:56,520 --> 01:16:57,560
it feels unsettling.

1540
01:16:59,039 --> 01:17:02,479
Speaker 2: I was, you know, I've been thinking lately that so

1541
01:17:02,520 --> 01:17:07,319
for a while there the sort of examples of what

1542
01:17:07,399 --> 01:17:09,880
the second apron Era was going to do to team

1543
01:17:09,880 --> 01:17:14,159
building were Boston, who stripped it down and maybe still

1544
01:17:14,239 --> 01:17:16,039
the Jayalen Brown trade is kind of like the final

1545
01:17:16,119 --> 01:17:19,880
move of like this is what happens or the thunder,

1546
01:17:19,920 --> 01:17:22,479
but then the thunder just kind of managed it well enough,

1547
01:17:22,760 --> 01:17:25,159
like there are still a little ways away from the

1548
01:17:25,239 --> 01:17:28,119
real pain. I'm starting to wonder if maybe Denver is

1549
01:17:28,159 --> 01:17:31,039
actually the team that you see the Like this is

1550
01:17:31,119 --> 01:17:33,960
quint essentially what happens when you win a championship and

1551
01:17:34,000 --> 01:17:38,319
things get expensive and there's just over the ensuing years,

1552
01:17:38,319 --> 01:17:41,000
there's just the degradation and talent as your own players

1553
01:17:41,039 --> 01:17:43,199
cost more and you try to hold it together and

1554
01:17:43,239 --> 01:17:46,279
you make these cost cutting moves that everybody hates. But

1555
01:17:46,479 --> 01:17:50,560
like this is where you end up, which is they

1556
01:17:50,600 --> 01:17:53,319
have to make a move, and it's kind of impossible

1557
01:17:53,359 --> 01:17:56,560
to imagine them in the aftermath being better, where it's

1558
01:17:56,600 --> 01:17:59,680
just you keep running into it's hard to stay even

1559
01:17:59,720 --> 01:18:03,359
as good as you were, because if you're even if

1560
01:18:03,359 --> 01:18:06,439
you're selling off pieces and trading picks or whatever, like

1561
01:18:06,920 --> 01:18:09,640
it's just like over time, and it's not a long time.

1562
01:18:09,680 --> 01:18:12,279
It wasn't that long ago they won the title. You

1563
01:18:12,479 --> 01:18:15,520
just you just kind of slowly by degrees, have to

1564
01:18:15,560 --> 01:18:18,239
tear yourself apart. And like, in some ways that's more

1565
01:18:18,279 --> 01:18:20,479
painful than what Boston had to do, or like what

1566
01:18:20,560 --> 01:18:23,399
the Thunder may eventually have to do, because it's just

1567
01:18:23,760 --> 01:18:27,640
there's a hopelessness attached to it, and like an inescapability

1568
01:18:27,680 --> 01:18:31,560
attached to it. It's it's kind of bleak, right because, like,

1569
01:18:32,439 --> 01:18:34,880
paint me the scenario where we go into this season

1570
01:18:34,920 --> 01:18:38,000
saying Denver actually has a better chance to advance a

1571
01:18:38,039 --> 01:18:40,319
long way than they did last year, and what's that

1572
01:18:40,399 --> 01:18:44,960
look like? It's just what I mean, right, they might

1573
01:18:45,000 --> 01:18:47,000
get out of the first but like their profile as

1574
01:18:47,039 --> 01:18:51,079
a more serious contender. It's just like Peyton Watson takes

1575
01:18:51,079 --> 01:18:52,880
a leap, they keep him, they pay what it costs,

1576
01:18:52,880 --> 01:18:55,680
they take he takes a leap, and they're willing to

1577
01:18:55,720 --> 01:18:59,640
pay massive repeater tax. Like they haven't acted like a

1578
01:18:59,640 --> 01:19:02,039
team that ever been willing to do that. So I

1579
01:19:02,239 --> 01:19:05,439
just it is they do now feel to me like

1580
01:19:06,239 --> 01:19:09,560
the team you'd point to, like say you're criticizing your

1581
01:19:09,600 --> 01:19:12,960
team or any team for doing what the Celtics did

1582
01:19:13,000 --> 01:19:15,840
last summer or like those kinds of moves. He's like,

1583
01:19:15,880 --> 01:19:17,640
do you want to end up like Denver where it's

1584
01:19:17,680 --> 01:19:21,359
just like you just slowly degrade and there's no you

1585
01:19:21,439 --> 01:19:25,960
just don't have the ability to like improve yourself like that.

1586
01:19:25,960 --> 01:19:28,720
That seems worse than what Boston went through because I

1587
01:19:28,800 --> 01:19:32,279
like looking forward, like Boston seems like like a hopeful place,

1588
01:19:32,319 --> 01:19:34,039
like we don't like that trade, but but you know

1589
01:19:34,079 --> 01:19:36,039
what I mean, it feels like Denver is just like,

1590
01:19:36,199 --> 01:19:36,800
what do you do?

1591
01:19:37,359 --> 01:19:40,159
Speaker 1: I do think part of it, though, is and we're

1592
01:19:40,199 --> 01:19:42,680
pointing to one move here is so yes, there has

1593
01:19:42,720 --> 01:19:46,479
been that slow degradation. But last years a perfect example.

1594
01:19:46,880 --> 01:19:49,760
Looking back, even if we ended up being too low

1595
01:19:49,840 --> 01:19:51,359
or I was, I don't remember where you ended up

1596
01:19:51,359 --> 01:19:52,600
on it. So I want to put words in your mouth.

1597
01:19:52,880 --> 01:19:54,720
Even if I ended up being too low on the

1598
01:19:54,800 --> 01:19:58,640
Cam Johnson for Michael Porter Junior twenty thirty two first

1599
01:19:58,720 --> 01:20:04,760
round pick deal, that was your last best bullet on

1600
01:20:04,800 --> 01:20:07,600
the trade market, and that's what you did. Is that

1601
01:20:07,680 --> 01:20:11,199
acceptable when framed through that view? And the answer is

1602
01:20:11,199 --> 01:20:12,960
just no. I thought Cam Johnson was fine for them

1603
01:20:13,000 --> 01:20:15,239
last year by like, he didn't start out too great,

1604
01:20:15,239 --> 01:20:16,800
but by the end of the playoffs he was one

1605
01:20:16,800 --> 01:20:19,119
of their most trustworthy guys. And he still ended up

1606
01:20:19,159 --> 01:20:21,399
the percentages from three we're still pretty hot, and he

1607
01:20:21,439 --> 01:20:23,560
just had moments where's, oh, okay, I see the vision here,

1608
01:20:23,920 --> 01:20:26,359
but now we're talking about, oh, are they gonna need

1609
01:20:26,399 --> 01:20:28,039
to like just dump him because we know they're not

1610
01:20:28,039 --> 01:20:30,039
going to go this far into the second apron and

1611
01:20:30,079 --> 01:20:32,319
by the way, for a team that you don't think

1612
01:20:32,359 --> 01:20:34,439
can make it out of the conference, No, you shouldn't

1613
01:20:34,439 --> 01:20:36,680
be like twenty million dollars into the second apron or

1614
01:20:36,680 --> 01:20:41,119
whatever it is. That's a fact. So it's not. Yes, again,

1615
01:20:41,159 --> 01:20:43,000
there was sort of the gradual decline from them, and

1616
01:20:43,039 --> 01:20:45,000
they had some injuries crop up. But it's also I

1617
01:20:45,039 --> 01:20:49,199
don't know that they've maximized the opportunities that were before

1618
01:20:49,199 --> 01:20:51,079
them since they won the title. I don't think they

1619
01:20:51,079 --> 01:20:54,439
have it all. They didn't negotiate with Jamal Murray at all,

1620
01:20:54,560 --> 01:20:56,399
Like if we want to hammer the Wizards for Trey

1621
01:20:56,439 --> 01:21:01,720
Young or the Spurs for Darren Fox, certain teams where

1622
01:21:01,800 --> 01:21:03,600
you have the margin for error where it's no, you

1623
01:21:03,600 --> 01:21:06,119
shouldn't have done that. But look at the Spurs because

1624
01:21:06,119 --> 01:21:08,119
so many of the guys are on their their rookie scales,

1625
01:21:08,199 --> 01:21:12,840
or Wemby's just not gonna take the escalator language in Washington.

1626
01:21:12,880 --> 01:21:15,920
You just haven't paid anybody yet. So not that it's

1627
01:21:16,399 --> 01:21:18,520
a good move, but it's, oh, we can stomach this.

1628
01:21:18,920 --> 01:21:21,279
You knew you were gonna get progressively more expensive. And

1629
01:21:21,279 --> 01:21:24,399
what was the market for Murray now? I'm not if

1630
01:21:24,439 --> 01:21:26,760
he wanted to explore the open market. I'm not saying

1631
01:21:27,239 --> 01:21:29,560
just from running the team the way things are working

1632
01:21:29,640 --> 01:21:32,600
right now, like they're just even Aaron Gordon on his extension,

1633
01:21:32,680 --> 01:21:35,279
I think he's invaluable to this team. He's also probably

1634
01:21:35,279 --> 01:21:38,159
more valuable to the Nugget than any other team in

1635
01:21:38,199 --> 01:21:41,199
the league. And so to not negotiate harder on those

1636
01:21:41,199 --> 01:21:44,520
types of deals when it was like the climate isn't

1637
01:21:44,520 --> 01:21:46,880
necessarily what it is now, but it had shifted enough

1638
01:21:46,880 --> 01:21:50,600
to people thought the Aaron Gordon extension, it feels as

1639
01:21:50,640 --> 01:21:52,800
if people were mostly okay with they might have acknowledged, oh,

1640
01:21:52,840 --> 01:21:55,239
the back end of that could be rough. The Jamal

1641
01:21:55,319 --> 01:21:58,600
Murray deal, it was actually viewed until this season is

1642
01:21:58,640 --> 01:22:01,159
worse than it is now, Like people are, oh, you

1643
01:22:01,239 --> 01:22:03,520
might have net positive value or be a slightly met

1644
01:22:03,560 --> 01:22:06,760
positive So there's just been too many missteps or missed

1645
01:22:06,800 --> 01:22:10,680
opportunities there and now I don't know how you get

1646
01:22:10,680 --> 01:22:12,960
better is the answer. Like that's why they're confusing and

1647
01:22:13,359 --> 01:22:16,039
the fact that they've done so, Look, who's the best

1648
01:22:16,039 --> 01:22:19,199
shooter on Like, Okay, it's not Jamal Like aside from

1649
01:22:19,279 --> 01:22:23,159
Jamal Murray and Nikole Jokic, you have Cam Johnson. Like

1650
01:22:23,159 --> 01:22:24,840
I get is that enough shooting? I guess in an

1651
01:22:24,880 --> 01:22:27,479
offense when the Kohle Jokic, it doesn't matter, You're just

1652
01:22:27,520 --> 01:22:28,359
gonna be top three.

1653
01:22:28,720 --> 01:22:31,199
Speaker 2: It's depth and defense, depth and defense for them, like

1654
01:22:32,600 --> 01:22:35,479
nice too. Yeah, yeah, I mean, yeah, I don't know.

1655
01:22:35,840 --> 01:22:38,760
The thing is, like I guess, sort of implicit in

1656
01:22:38,800 --> 01:22:40,880
what I've been saying of like, this is what happens

1657
01:22:40,880 --> 01:22:43,640
if you just try to hold it together. Uh. In

1658
01:22:43,680 --> 01:22:47,680
the apron era, if they had done the opposite and

1659
01:22:47,800 --> 01:22:51,560
moved Murray or or played hardball with Gordon, like, we

1660
01:22:51,680 --> 01:22:53,640
might be in a situation where it's like Yokic isn't

1661
01:22:53,640 --> 01:22:56,239
even on this team anymore because he's just like forget it,

1662
01:22:56,319 --> 01:22:58,199
you know, like I can't win here. You guys are

1663
01:22:58,199 --> 01:23:00,640
going in a different direction by trading all these players

1664
01:23:00,640 --> 01:23:04,199
that I view as integral to our whole operation, and

1665
01:23:04,279 --> 01:23:06,600
you force him out sooner it's kind of I mean,

1666
01:23:06,640 --> 01:23:08,439
I don't know. And in a roundabout way, this is

1667
01:23:08,479 --> 01:23:12,600
just illustrative of the corner that the apron era sort

1668
01:23:12,640 --> 01:23:14,880
of allows you to paint yourself into where there isn't

1669
01:23:14,920 --> 01:23:18,000
like a good way. There's no there's no like there's

1670
01:23:18,000 --> 01:23:20,720
a way that doesn't hurt in some fashion to to

1671
01:23:20,880 --> 01:23:23,439
sort of go forward after you've been successful and you

1672
01:23:23,479 --> 01:23:26,479
have expensive players because they were good and helped you

1673
01:23:26,520 --> 01:23:28,439
win at a high level, Like this is just where

1674
01:23:28,479 --> 01:23:29,000
you end up.

1675
01:23:30,000 --> 01:23:32,199
Speaker 1: Do you think Wemby's painted Yokic into a corner where

1676
01:23:32,199 --> 01:23:34,079
now he yes, he's gonna need to take a pay cut.

1677
01:23:34,399 --> 01:23:36,439
Speaker 2: I mean, I know you guys talked about this a

1678
01:23:36,479 --> 01:23:41,199
little bit, but like I I my suspicion is that

1679
01:23:42,800 --> 01:23:46,760
I wasn't surprised that Wemby did what he did. If anything,

1680
01:23:46,800 --> 01:23:49,239
I was surprised he didn't take an even bigger discount.

1681
01:23:49,319 --> 01:23:52,920
I gotta believe this was the largest discount he felt

1682
01:23:52,960 --> 01:23:56,279
he could take without incurring the wrath of like every

1683
01:23:56,279 --> 01:23:57,039
other player.

1684
01:23:56,880 --> 01:23:59,560
Speaker 1: The players Union, yeah, which already wasn't happy by it, right,

1685
01:23:59,760 --> 01:24:03,000
Which I think that's what this was. This is off

1686
01:24:03,039 --> 01:24:04,520
topic a little bit, but we got a lot of

1687
01:24:04,880 --> 01:24:09,039
pushback from that, saying like, why are we criticizing what's

1688
01:24:09,039 --> 01:24:12,319
happening with the Bucks and Gary Trent Junior? But why

1689
01:24:12,359 --> 01:24:14,560
isn't it salary caps or a convention with what Jalen

1690
01:24:14,600 --> 01:24:17,439
Brunson and Victor Woman Yama did. I just wanted to

1691
01:24:17,479 --> 01:24:19,159
point out I didn't know that that was a thing.

1692
01:24:19,199 --> 01:24:21,039
It was a more common response than I thought, and

1693
01:24:21,119 --> 01:24:24,199
some people were like, pretty I don't want to use

1694
01:24:24,199 --> 01:24:27,079
the word hostile, like they were pretty passionate about it. One.

1695
01:24:27,159 --> 01:24:29,920
I think the bigger difference is those players were already

1696
01:24:29,960 --> 01:24:32,680
under contracts with these teams, and Jalen Brunson's case, he

1697
01:24:32,720 --> 01:24:35,319
took the maximum allowed to him at the time. There's

1698
01:24:35,359 --> 01:24:38,039
no the The issue is, and now, if we find

1699
01:24:38,079 --> 01:24:40,960
out that the Spurs and Wemby or the Knicks and

1700
01:24:41,079 --> 01:24:45,760
Brunson have an agreement in place, you sign something like

1701
01:24:45,840 --> 01:24:49,640
when you're like inking these contracts or electronically signing these

1702
01:24:49,680 --> 01:24:52,359
contracts that said there is no other agreement in place.

1703
01:24:52,399 --> 01:24:55,439
It's apparently a big stipulation when you're signing minimum deals specifically,

1704
01:24:55,760 --> 01:24:57,920
which is what Gary Trent Junior was on. And the

1705
01:24:57,960 --> 01:25:00,920
other thing is that Gary Trent Junior then proceeded to

1706
01:25:01,000 --> 01:25:04,119
get like Victor O Miyama had a Gary Tran Junior

1707
01:25:04,159 --> 01:25:07,840
signed a three year minimum deal or something, and he

1708
01:25:07,920 --> 01:25:09,760
just said like, yeah, this is not what I'm worth.

1709
01:25:09,800 --> 01:25:11,399
I could make more, but I'm signing this three year

1710
01:25:11,439 --> 01:25:14,640
minimum deal. There's actually nothing wrong with it. Like Wemby

1711
01:25:14,760 --> 01:25:17,399
is saying I'm taking this for the life of this deal.

1712
01:25:17,680 --> 01:25:20,199
It's still technically the maximum allowed or close to it.

1713
01:25:20,199 --> 01:25:22,800
It just doesn't have the hypotheticals in this. The same

1714
01:25:22,840 --> 01:25:25,439
thing with Jalen Brunson, like the Gary Trang Junior when

1715
01:25:25,439 --> 01:25:29,279
he did get paid, Jalen Brunson and Victor Miyam are

1716
01:25:29,319 --> 01:25:33,199
being paid below market money. Let's say characters jug got

1717
01:25:33,239 --> 01:25:35,720
way above his market value. So like, that's just I was.

1718
01:25:36,520 --> 01:25:39,840
I don't they seem like apples and oranges situations to

1719
01:25:39,920 --> 01:25:42,920
be either all looped under the same umbrella of is

1720
01:25:43,239 --> 01:25:45,520
like do players need to take less? Or like, is

1721
01:25:45,560 --> 01:25:47,199
this a way to gain the system in the case

1722
01:25:47,239 --> 01:25:49,319
of the bucks, so that if you're good and you're

1723
01:25:49,359 --> 01:25:51,560
trying to maximize the window, can you get guys who

1724
01:25:51,600 --> 01:25:54,079
are implact players to come in a lower number. But

1725
01:25:54,560 --> 01:25:56,600
I was surprised that it was more of a common

1726
01:25:56,680 --> 01:25:59,760
refrain than I had. Honestly, I hadn't even thought about, well,

1727
01:25:59,760 --> 01:26:02,720
what's the why isn't what Wemby's doing or what Jolen

1728
01:26:02,720 --> 01:26:04,920
Brunson did salary cap circ convention.

1729
01:26:05,600 --> 01:26:08,720
Speaker 2: I yeah, I think it's kind of apples and orangesy.

1730
01:26:08,920 --> 01:26:13,560
It's also kind of like when what about ism is

1731
01:26:13,640 --> 01:26:16,359
taken to like an even stupid or extreme where it's like,

1732
01:26:16,399 --> 01:26:19,159
well but how about this, like why aren't you That's

1733
01:26:19,199 --> 01:26:22,199
like they're not the same. It's Gary Trent's situation is

1734
01:26:22,680 --> 01:26:26,239
he's being paid far more than he is worth after

1735
01:26:26,279 --> 01:26:30,199
taking deals that one of them was maybe like it's

1736
01:26:30,760 --> 01:26:34,039
a player last year, yeah right, so and and whereas

1737
01:26:34,079 --> 01:26:37,079
like a player sacrifice, like it's I get it, Like

1738
01:26:37,159 --> 01:26:40,479
I guess, I guess on some level they share the

1739
01:26:40,560 --> 01:26:44,560
fact that a player is taking less than he could get.

1740
01:26:45,119 --> 01:26:49,520
But unless you're willing to show how Brunson and Wemby

1741
01:26:50,079 --> 01:26:52,680
are like gonna be made whole or more than whole

1742
01:26:52,720 --> 01:26:54,880
on the back end with some other deal that's already

1743
01:26:54,880 --> 01:26:57,199
been agreed to, this is not the same thing, right

1744
01:26:57,319 --> 01:26:59,840
even if so, let's let's not just signing a below

1745
01:26:59,840 --> 01:27:03,720
more market value, it's a contract. It's doing that knowing

1746
01:27:03,720 --> 01:27:06,359
that you will be paid above market or paid in

1747
01:27:06,479 --> 01:27:09,600
some other way as a result of taking that deal.

1748
01:27:10,000 --> 01:27:12,239
Speaker 1: And maybe that becomes an issue with Jalen Brunson on

1749
01:27:12,279 --> 01:27:14,960
his next deal, But when he's extension eligible next summer,

1750
01:27:15,760 --> 01:27:17,640
the Knicks probably give him a max deal unless he's

1751
01:27:17,640 --> 01:27:20,239
want to take less can you sit there and say definitely,

1752
01:27:20,279 --> 01:27:22,119
Like Jallen Brunson isn't a max player, why would you

1753
01:27:22,119 --> 01:27:22,439
get right?

1754
01:27:22,640 --> 01:27:26,760
Speaker 2: Yeah, It's like it's such a difference of degree, Like

1755
01:27:26,800 --> 01:27:30,680
if Jalen Brunson had a terrible year going into when

1756
01:27:30,720 --> 01:27:32,880
he's eligible to sign his next contract, you'd still be like,

1757
01:27:33,319 --> 01:27:34,720
he's still worth it. You know.

1758
01:27:36,119 --> 01:27:38,079
Speaker 1: The Bucks went through this a little bit with Bobby Porus,

1759
01:27:38,039 --> 01:27:40,840
and we even saw the Clippers with Nicholas Batoom when

1760
01:27:40,840 --> 01:27:43,000
those guys ended up signing deals though they were at

1761
01:27:43,079 --> 01:27:46,039
least a round market value, right, we're looking at this garage,

1762
01:27:46,119 --> 01:27:48,840
at the four guaranteed years that way above market values.

1763
01:27:48,880 --> 01:27:51,359
The issue I didn't mean that they're else there. I

1764
01:27:51,399 --> 01:27:53,039
have one more team on my list. Do you have

1765
01:27:53,079 --> 01:27:53,680
another team?

1766
01:27:54,000 --> 01:27:55,840
Speaker 2: I could like vamp and pick one, but let's just

1767
01:27:55,880 --> 01:27:58,039
talk about your last one. Uh.

1768
01:27:58,119 --> 01:27:59,880
Speaker 1: I'm surprised we haven't talked about them yet, But maybe

1769
01:27:59,880 --> 01:28:01,399
the bar solow that we didn't.

1770
01:28:01,159 --> 01:28:06,119
Speaker 2: Think as well. I mean, this is I don't want

1771
01:28:06,159 --> 01:28:07,560
to cut you off, but this is one where it's

1772
01:28:07,560 --> 01:28:09,119
like you could just make the case that they're bad

1773
01:28:09,159 --> 01:28:11,560
and stupid and it's not that confusing and we're used

1774
01:28:11,600 --> 01:28:12,680
to it, but go ahead.

1775
01:28:12,720 --> 01:28:16,560
Speaker 1: Look anytime that like your big offseason move outside of

1776
01:28:16,560 --> 01:28:20,359
the draft is waving Demard rozen and then potentially stretching

1777
01:28:20,399 --> 01:28:22,399
his salary so that you can make sure you're not

1778
01:28:22,399 --> 01:28:26,840
in the luxury tax for a twenty something win team. Fireworks, Baby,

1779
01:28:27,199 --> 01:28:31,000
I don't Here's here's the thing. I don't actually know.

1780
01:28:31,119 --> 01:28:33,439
This is why they're being taken Solow. They're still confusing

1781
01:28:33,439 --> 01:28:35,239
as hell because I don't understand the theory of this

1782
01:28:35,239 --> 01:28:38,199
team and the I felt so bad for Kings fans.

1783
01:28:38,279 --> 01:28:39,880
I didn't watch a ton of him in Summer League,

1784
01:28:39,880 --> 01:28:42,319
but there was a game where I, like Darius A.

1785
01:28:42,399 --> 01:28:44,760
Cuptry just not looked like he was engaged at all

1786
01:28:44,840 --> 01:28:46,680
the defensive end or anything, and I was just like,

1787
01:28:47,199 --> 01:28:49,680
oh my god, Kings fans need like some type of

1788
01:28:49,720 --> 01:28:53,239
a reprieve from this shit show. You can't write them

1789
01:28:53,239 --> 01:28:55,319
off based on that. I like Nee Clifford still like

1790
01:28:55,319 --> 01:28:58,640
the maxim right, no good. Find Dylan Cardwell, who was

1791
01:28:58,720 --> 01:29:02,479
pissed after one of the games, which if you're gonna

1792
01:29:02,479 --> 01:29:04,119
get mad after some of league, I respect it.

1793
01:29:04,520 --> 01:29:06,600
Speaker 2: You have that guy has to be on this team

1794
01:29:06,880 --> 01:29:09,079
like to just to make sure there's always going to

1795
01:29:09,119 --> 01:29:12,399
be a pulse. He absolutely provides that, Sorry, go ahead.

1796
01:29:14,000 --> 01:29:15,680
Speaker 1: What you could sit here and say is what did

1797
01:29:15,720 --> 01:29:17,439
you want them to do? The answer is going to

1798
01:29:17,479 --> 01:29:20,800
be blow it up. Do any of their individual players

1799
01:29:21,439 --> 01:29:24,520
have value in a vacuum? And that's fair, that's why

1800
01:29:24,520 --> 01:29:28,039
they're being taken so low. But they talked about a

1801
01:29:28,079 --> 01:29:30,960
lot as just what Scott Perry's vision for this roster

1802
01:29:31,079 --> 01:29:33,600
is going to be moving forward. I still have no

1803
01:29:33,720 --> 01:29:37,560
idea what that vision entails. And if we're sitting here

1804
01:29:38,119 --> 01:29:41,520
in the middle of July and we know that they're

1805
01:29:41,560 --> 01:29:44,840
not planning anything bigger, just because you did waive to

1806
01:29:45,000 --> 01:29:47,680
Martos and you couldn't find a trade candidate for him,

1807
01:29:48,000 --> 01:29:49,880
or the plan wasn't to then use him and trade

1808
01:29:49,920 --> 01:29:53,880
it his full number, Like I thought the precious Chua

1809
01:29:54,000 --> 01:29:56,720
deal was fine two years and eleven million bucks and

1810
01:29:56,760 --> 01:29:59,159
he had played some really good minutes for them. Time

1811
01:29:59,199 --> 01:30:02,319
will tell what whether Darius A. Cuff Junior was the

1812
01:30:02,399 --> 01:30:05,880
right pick. It's just you know that they're not trying

1813
01:30:05,880 --> 01:30:08,039
to be good and that they're they've kind of boxed

1814
01:30:08,079 --> 01:30:11,800
themselves into a corner. But I look at this team,

1815
01:30:11,960 --> 01:30:15,920
I'm just like, what is actually going on? Like what

1816
01:30:15,920 --> 01:30:18,159
what is the identity. First of all, they don't have

1817
01:30:18,199 --> 01:30:20,920
a defensive identity. I don't know, like forget about what

1818
01:30:20,960 --> 01:30:22,520
is their offensive identity.

1819
01:30:22,680 --> 01:30:26,680
Speaker 2: It's it's I mean to me, what's happening here, if

1820
01:30:26,680 --> 01:30:28,439
you want to be as nice about it as possible

1821
01:30:28,479 --> 01:30:30,520
is they're kind of just waiting it out because I

1822
01:30:30,520 --> 01:30:33,439
don't think. I don't you can't trade Levine for anything,

1823
01:30:34,600 --> 01:30:37,239
at least right now. Maybe that changes if he is

1824
01:30:37,279 --> 01:30:40,079
great in the first half and somebody's willing to pay this,

1825
01:30:40,239 --> 01:30:43,039
you know, half of his his salary after the trade

1826
01:30:43,039 --> 01:30:47,239
deadline or less than that. Actually, Sabonis, I don't think

1827
01:30:47,279 --> 01:30:49,960
has positive trade value like Kegan Murray of all people,

1828
01:30:50,640 --> 01:30:53,840
like was untouchable a couple of years ago, And but

1829
01:30:53,920 --> 01:30:56,039
I don't know if he has positive trade value, Like

1830
01:30:56,079 --> 01:30:59,600
he has to play himself into like being tradeable, and

1831
01:30:59,600 --> 01:31:01,960
I don't think want to trade him just as a

1832
01:31:02,000 --> 01:31:04,880
threshold issue. I think you're just kind of waiting for

1833
01:31:04,880 --> 01:31:07,199
some of these contracts to get closer to their conclusions,

1834
01:31:07,239 --> 01:31:11,520
and like that's not the You certainly cannot cannot attach

1835
01:31:11,880 --> 01:31:14,600
draft assets to move off of these bad contracts that

1836
01:31:14,640 --> 01:31:17,439
you stuck yourself with. You just have to sit there

1837
01:31:17,439 --> 01:31:21,239
and wear it until until they're movable for something that

1838
01:31:21,279 --> 01:31:26,520
doesn't compromise your future. So like, it's it's confusing how

1839
01:31:26,520 --> 01:31:29,960
they got here. It's confusing how they empowered the people

1840
01:31:30,439 --> 01:31:33,359
that contributed to getting them here, Like Doug Christy is

1841
01:31:33,359 --> 01:31:34,239
still the coach.

1842
01:31:34,199 --> 01:31:35,039
Speaker 1: Like I don't like.

1843
01:31:35,199 --> 01:31:40,560
Speaker 2: I guess maybe maybe the logic there is like we

1844
01:31:40,720 --> 01:31:43,720
know we can't do anything, so why go get Like

1845
01:31:43,760 --> 01:31:45,920
it doesn't even matter who the coach is. Like that

1846
01:31:46,239 --> 01:31:48,239
feels kind of crazy to me because you do have

1847
01:31:48,279 --> 01:31:51,319
a rookie in a cuff that, in theory is gonna

1848
01:31:51,359 --> 01:31:55,520
be like he's got the keys, I think, so you

1849
01:31:55,640 --> 01:31:58,199
definitely want like a better developmental environment for him. But

1850
01:31:59,159 --> 01:32:01,880
this is just sort of mess. It's it's confusing as

1851
01:32:01,920 --> 01:32:05,880
to what's confusing is like how did it get this bad?

1852
01:32:06,640 --> 01:32:09,760
That's that's that's hard to fathom because it took so many,

1853
01:32:10,000 --> 01:32:13,239
so many great contributors over so many years to put

1854
01:32:13,239 --> 01:32:14,079
them into the condition.

1855
01:32:14,239 --> 01:32:15,960
Speaker 1: What was the inflection point for them? Do you think

1856
01:32:16,000 --> 01:32:18,239
it was the decision to move on from Mike Brown

1857
01:32:18,279 --> 01:32:20,199
and everything sort of snowballing from there.

1858
01:32:21,520 --> 01:32:24,600
Speaker 2: I I don't know that Mike Brown would have saved this,

1859
01:32:24,880 --> 01:32:25,399
you know, I.

1860
01:32:25,319 --> 01:32:28,960
Speaker 1: Think, but think about what that led to the relationship

1861
01:32:29,000 --> 01:32:29,840
with dearon Fox.

1862
01:32:30,279 --> 01:32:33,680
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, if you really wanted to go back,

1863
01:32:33,800 --> 01:32:36,800
it might just be the Halliburton for Sabonis trade, because

1864
01:32:36,840 --> 01:32:40,520
they've made a decision at that point that like the

1865
01:32:40,600 --> 01:32:42,760
type of player we believe we should be led by

1866
01:32:42,880 --> 01:32:46,800
is Fox and then Sabonis, and so we will then

1867
01:32:46,840 --> 01:32:50,159
surround them with Derozen and Levine and that type. And

1868
01:32:50,199 --> 01:32:54,840
like maybe if you just picked Tyre's Halliburton, you build differently.

1869
01:32:55,079 --> 01:32:55,479
I don't know.

1870
01:32:56,359 --> 01:32:58,840
Speaker 1: I didn't honestly, I didn't see the Tyre's Haliburton trade

1871
01:32:58,880 --> 01:33:01,000
coming up. I'm sure King's fans really appreciate you.

1872
01:33:00,960 --> 01:33:04,399
Speaker 2: And that, I mean, that was terrible at the time. Sorry.

1873
01:33:04,640 --> 01:33:06,479
Speaker 1: Can I provide a peak behind the curtain though, of

1874
01:33:06,520 --> 01:33:09,279
your loyal of your actual respect for the King.

1875
01:33:09,319 --> 01:33:09,920
Speaker 2: Absolutely.

1876
01:33:10,279 --> 01:33:13,159
Speaker 1: We have a new merch line that is going to drop,

1877
01:33:13,199 --> 01:33:17,640
hopefully shortly, and Grant and the test merch that is

1878
01:33:17,680 --> 01:33:20,600
being sent to him as we speak, hopefully there They

1879
01:33:20,600 --> 01:33:23,000
are team themed, So that's your little peak behind the curtain.

1880
01:33:23,359 --> 01:33:26,479
Grant picked four teams and the Kings were one of them.

1881
01:33:26,640 --> 01:33:26,840
Speaker 2: Yeah.

1882
01:33:26,840 --> 01:33:29,000
Speaker 1: I didn't follow up in the moment when I when

1883
01:33:29,039 --> 01:33:31,000
I actually wish we wanted passure. I was just like,

1884
01:33:31,119 --> 01:33:32,800
is this like a bit are you kidding?

1885
01:33:33,000 --> 01:33:36,119
Speaker 2: It's a great design. Sorry, sorry, I love great design.

1886
01:33:36,520 --> 01:33:41,199
The logo it works perfectly because it's because the lettering

1887
01:33:41,479 --> 01:33:43,800
makes sense. It like looks a lot like the logo,

1888
01:33:43,920 --> 01:33:47,239
like the actual King's script and logo on first look.

1889
01:33:47,239 --> 01:33:49,520
I don't want to give too much away, but it

1890
01:33:49,840 --> 01:33:51,520
jumped out of me like that's a good one, and

1891
01:33:51,560 --> 01:33:52,920
so I had to have it. I you know, I

1892
01:33:52,960 --> 01:33:55,920
don't discriminate. I'm not listening. My anti King's bias does

1893
01:33:55,960 --> 01:33:58,119
not extend to good logos.

1894
01:33:57,680 --> 01:34:00,239
Speaker 1: And and we've established that you are a fashion used

1895
01:34:00,279 --> 01:34:03,159
to too, absolutely, I mean look good, feel good.

1896
01:34:03,439 --> 01:34:03,640
Speaker 2: Look.

1897
01:34:05,760 --> 01:34:08,359
Speaker 1: So just to get us to ten teams, I want

1898
01:34:08,359 --> 01:34:12,119
to nominate another one very quickly. I'm kind of balancing

1899
01:34:12,399 --> 01:34:14,319
back and forth. I think some people are gonna pick

1900
01:34:14,359 --> 01:34:16,960
the pistons. I want to talk about that.

1901
01:34:17,560 --> 01:34:19,720
Speaker 2: Well, so let's real quick, let's pick them, because I

1902
01:34:19,720 --> 01:34:22,439
do I did. I did kind of have them out

1903
01:34:22,479 --> 01:34:23,920
of the corner of my eyes. I was looking at

1904
01:34:23,960 --> 01:34:27,319
just a list. Is what's confusing about them? I don't

1905
01:34:27,319 --> 01:34:29,760
think anything's confusing to me about how they're handling Jalen Duran,

1906
01:34:29,760 --> 01:34:32,199
because I think this means they're drawing an appropriately hard

1907
01:34:32,239 --> 01:34:34,479
line on what they're willing to pay him. That part's fine,

1908
01:34:35,279 --> 01:34:38,079
just the it's kind of been a few years of

1909
01:34:38,119 --> 01:34:40,960
this issue of like just put the right kind of

1910
01:34:41,000 --> 01:34:43,840
support staff around kid Cunningham, you know. And we can't

1911
01:34:43,840 --> 01:34:47,359
be that critical because they won sixty games, But is

1912
01:34:47,359 --> 01:34:51,760
that a lot? It seems like a decent number, you know,

1913
01:34:51,960 --> 01:34:54,239
it didn't amount youer than seventy four, but still fier

1914
01:34:54,319 --> 01:34:58,439
than seventy four, but more than more than fifty nine. Uh,

1915
01:34:59,199 --> 01:35:02,279
it just you. So Tobias Harris goes out like they've

1916
01:35:02,359 --> 01:35:04,520
chosen John Collins. I'm doing this off the top of

1917
01:35:04,560 --> 01:35:08,000
my head. I should have our transaction lists open here?

1918
01:35:08,039 --> 01:35:10,920
Speaker 1: Who are the other Isaiah Joe? They get in there right,

1919
01:35:11,600 --> 01:35:13,000
which ends up confused.

1920
01:35:12,600 --> 01:35:16,079
Speaker 2: For them essentially swapped out Isaiah Stewart, which I'm okay with,

1921
01:35:16,279 --> 01:35:18,199
especially after some of that reporting that like he was

1922
01:35:18,199 --> 01:35:21,239
pissed off about his minutes in the playoffs and Paul

1923
01:35:21,319 --> 01:35:24,279
reid Is was playing over him and it's a lot cheaper,

1924
01:35:24,319 --> 01:35:25,159
So I'm fine with that.

1925
01:35:25,640 --> 01:35:28,159
Speaker 1: I also think, so here can I give you what

1926
01:35:28,319 --> 01:35:30,520
I think might be a hot take is I am

1927
01:35:30,560 --> 01:35:33,840
more confused at this point by the Miami Heat that

1928
01:35:33,920 --> 01:35:36,279
I am the Detroit Pistons. I ultimately would have settled

1929
01:35:36,319 --> 01:35:38,239
on the Miami Heat because, well.

1930
01:35:38,039 --> 01:35:40,720
Speaker 2: But you fully understand why the Heat did what they did.

1931
01:35:40,760 --> 01:35:41,960
It's just a bad decision.

1932
01:35:42,880 --> 01:35:45,359
Speaker 1: No, it's a bad decision. But then what have they done? Like?

1933
01:35:45,399 --> 01:35:45,479
Speaker 2: What?

1934
01:35:46,239 --> 01:35:47,960
Speaker 1: Like? How have they made it make sense that we're

1935
01:35:47,960 --> 01:35:51,039
just gonna have no ball handlers? Then why did you negotiate?

1936
01:35:51,279 --> 01:35:54,439
What's confusing is why didn't you negotiats? Again, it was

1937
01:35:54,479 --> 01:35:57,199
a market of two teams. Why weren't you negotiating harder

1938
01:35:57,239 --> 01:36:00,239
in the honest trade. But for the Pistons, here's what's

1939
01:36:00,239 --> 01:36:02,520
confusing about them. Nothing I'm with you, Nothing about the

1940
01:36:02,600 --> 01:36:05,239
Jayleen dur and stuff. I actually think he's John Collins.

1941
01:36:05,279 --> 01:36:08,199
I'm not. I'm surprised that Isaiah Stewart had so little

1942
01:36:08,760 --> 01:36:12,159
value on balance, But I actually like John Collins for

1943
01:36:12,199 --> 01:36:14,600
this team because he's a higher volume three point shooter

1944
01:36:14,920 --> 01:36:16,960
and so you can play him next to Jayleender and

1945
01:36:17,239 --> 01:36:19,000
if you want, he's a higher volume pree point shooter

1946
01:36:19,079 --> 01:36:21,359
than even Tobias Harris. I think this team will miss

1947
01:36:21,760 --> 01:36:24,359
what becomes confusing about this team is they seem to

1948
01:36:24,399 --> 01:36:27,920
be making a big bet on spacing, improved spacing and

1949
01:36:28,000 --> 01:36:31,000
internal development. I'm fine with the spacing aspect of I

1950
01:36:31,039 --> 01:36:34,239
think going from Tobias Harris and Isaiah Stewart to John

1951
01:36:34,279 --> 01:36:38,039
Collins and Isaiah Joe that's a spacing upgrade, right like.

1952
01:36:38,359 --> 01:36:40,520
Speaker 2: Yeah, And if you think Kevin Hurder is going to

1953
01:36:40,600 --> 01:36:45,840
be better, which apparently the Pistons do, based, yeah, do you.

1954
01:36:45,800 --> 01:36:48,800
Speaker 1: Need contracts to trade? But that that is confusing? Yes,

1955
01:36:49,600 --> 01:36:51,800
I do believe. What's even so you you then make

1956
01:36:51,800 --> 01:36:55,319
the Karris Lavert trade. What what is confusing is they

1957
01:36:55,319 --> 01:36:58,319
don't have the internal development part is I don't look

1958
01:36:58,359 --> 01:37:02,479
at this roster and say, between Donnish, Jenkins or even

1959
01:37:02,520 --> 01:37:06,560
Asar Thompson, is that secondary ball that primary secondary ball

1960
01:37:06,560 --> 01:37:09,439
handler in place? My answer to that is still no.

1961
01:37:09,600 --> 01:37:12,600
And so that leads me to believe they're so far

1962
01:37:12,680 --> 01:37:14,119
under the tax right now? Are they waiting for the

1963
01:37:14,159 --> 01:37:17,039
Jalhen Duran thing to settle so that they could then

1964
01:37:17,279 --> 01:37:19,359
Is there another move in play here? Because their off

1965
01:37:19,399 --> 01:37:23,079
season does feel anti climactic. But actually, don't think that's

1966
01:37:23,199 --> 01:37:26,279
confusing when you do look at what the logic of

1967
01:37:26,319 --> 01:37:28,399
these moves would be I think that they have improved

1968
01:37:28,399 --> 01:37:31,479
the spacing and I don't know that they've weakened Yeah,

1969
01:37:31,479 --> 01:37:33,359
And I would say they probably haven't. Like Karris Lavert

1970
01:37:33,520 --> 01:37:35,560
was not a huge part of what they were doing

1971
01:37:35,640 --> 01:37:39,560
last year. So have they weakened the secondary creation around

1972
01:37:39,640 --> 01:37:44,000
Ky Cunningham. The answer is no, it does. The confusing

1973
01:37:44,039 --> 01:37:46,439
part is, well, what are you have to be waiting

1974
01:37:46,479 --> 01:37:48,840
for something? Because the grand theory of this team can't

1975
01:37:48,880 --> 01:37:51,680
be like, well, yeah, we're gonna sign John Collins, bringing

1976
01:37:51,720 --> 01:37:53,880
Isaiah Joe, bring back Jalen Durnham, like now we're ready

1977
01:37:53,920 --> 01:37:55,680
to win the championship.

1978
01:37:55,880 --> 01:37:58,520
Speaker 2: Right, And I think too maybe you're right that, like,

1979
01:37:58,600 --> 01:38:03,119
if there's anything confusing here, it's I it's maybe procedural,

1980
01:38:03,279 --> 01:38:06,520
just because like it to illustrate, like if they had

1981
01:38:06,520 --> 01:38:09,279
already agreed to terms with Jalen Durant and then still

1982
01:38:09,319 --> 01:38:13,800
hadn't done anything to address the lack of improved secondary playmaking,

1983
01:38:13,840 --> 01:38:16,600
that would feel a little weirder. And then maybe even

1984
01:38:16,640 --> 01:38:19,560
then the argument would just be, like, you know, contrary

1985
01:38:19,560 --> 01:38:22,760
to our hardballing Jalen duran Uh, we think he's got

1986
01:38:22,800 --> 01:38:25,479
even more secondary creation in him after the breakthrough he

1987
01:38:25,560 --> 01:38:27,640
made last year as an offensive player. Like, I don't

1988
01:38:27,640 --> 01:38:30,079
know that that would feel kind of kind of like

1989
01:38:30,119 --> 01:38:34,680
a weird uh double talk, but it is, I guess

1990
01:38:34,720 --> 01:38:38,279
because the Duran stuff sort of needs to resolve before

1991
01:38:38,319 --> 01:38:41,119
they go do something else. Like maybe that explains some

1992
01:38:41,279 --> 01:38:46,079
of it, but they couldn't. Just doesn't outside of outside

1993
01:38:46,079 --> 01:38:48,640
of Kate Cunningham in the postseason. Yeah, and they didn't

1994
01:38:48,680 --> 01:38:50,600
go get anybody else that can create a shot.

1995
01:38:51,239 --> 01:38:53,279
Speaker 1: No, I mean, Gary Harrison, Torrian Princes aren't going to

1996
01:38:53,319 --> 01:38:56,760
do that for you again. Yeah, they'll prove the creation

1997
01:38:56,920 --> 01:39:01,199
for you. So they're they're lightly confusing, but I'm actually

1998
01:39:01,199 --> 01:39:05,000
personally more confused. Bye, Miami, that's fair. Do you have

1999
01:39:05,039 --> 01:39:07,319
anything else that you'd like to get to before we

2000
01:39:07,399 --> 01:39:08,680
skidaddle out here?

2001
01:39:08,840 --> 01:39:10,960
Speaker 2: So we can skidattle. Great to speak to you again.

2002
01:39:11,079 --> 01:39:12,640
Let's not do two weeks. Well, we might have to

2003
01:39:12,640 --> 01:39:13,760
be two weeks off because don't want.

2004
01:39:13,640 --> 01:39:16,479
Speaker 1: To apologize for anyone who's coming here at two o'clock

2005
01:39:16,560 --> 01:39:19,000
am Eastern time, why we're not live.

2006
01:39:19,199 --> 01:39:26,800
Speaker 2: Hope you had a great pay good night, sleep well,

2007
01:39:27,319 --> 01:39:30,239
good luck, Yeah, good night and good luck. Thanks everybody

2008
01:39:30,279 --> 01:39:32,800
for listening, for watching. Remember to rate, review, and subscribe.

2009
01:39:33,039 --> 01:39:34,600
Tell your friends, tell your ammies, look forward to that

2010
01:39:34,640 --> 01:39:36,680
merch We're gonna be dropping soon. Dan tease it, so

2011
01:39:36,680 --> 01:39:38,520
I'm gonna talk about it a little bit more. The

2012
01:39:38,560 --> 01:39:41,000
best way though, to support the podcast. If you like

2013
01:39:41,039 --> 01:39:43,920
what you're hearing, please consider becoming a Patreon member at

2014
01:39:43,920 --> 01:39:47,239
patreon dot com. Slash Hardwood Knocks NBA number one way

2015
01:39:47,239 --> 01:39:49,119
to support us, number one way to have more input

2016
01:39:49,119 --> 01:39:51,000
on what we do. We're gonna we'll have a couple

2017
01:39:51,000 --> 01:39:55,640
of episodes to subscribers only every month. The aforementioned UH

2018
01:39:57,239 --> 01:40:00,880
Trade candidate Superstar Next Superstar Trade Candidate will be one

2019
01:40:00,880 --> 01:40:04,720
of those. Get all these episodes ad free will be

2020
01:40:04,760 --> 01:40:07,920
that bonus content I mentioned discounts on merch access to

2021
01:40:07,960 --> 01:40:10,680
our discord links for that in the YouTube and podcast description.

2022
01:40:11,039 --> 01:40:14,319
I think that covers it. Thanks to everybody who commented,

2023
01:40:14,399 --> 01:40:19,039
for everybody that was here twelve hours before yet out

2024
01:40:20,920 --> 01:40:22,920
shouts Frank milikin apologies, Jared Allen