WEBVTT

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<v Speaker 1>O, Hey, what's up.

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<v Speaker 2>My name is Ben and I'm Nicole, and you're listening

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<v Speaker 2>to Wicked and Grim.

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<v Speaker 1>A true crime podcast morning. The following podcast contains content

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<v Speaker 1>and material intended for a mature audience listener discretion.

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<v Speaker 2>Welcome, Hello, gohen, what's up?

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<v Speaker 1>It feels a little different this time.

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<v Speaker 2>It feels different. We have like some serious cool shit

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<v Speaker 2>going on.

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<v Speaker 1>We're like we probably like, I don't know what was it.

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<v Speaker 1>We're probably at I'm seeing stumbling words. I don't even

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<v Speaker 1>know what to say. Oh my god, like eighty ish

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<v Speaker 1>to ninety ish listeners as of last episode, and as

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<v Speaker 1>of releasing this one, we're at almost six hundred of

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<v Speaker 1>you guys.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, it actually feels like a little bit. I'm almost

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<v Speaker 2>a little nervous.

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<v Speaker 1>Which is I mean, it's weird. I don't know what

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<v Speaker 1>to say. I don't know how to act. I'm just like,

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<v Speaker 1>you know, like buttoning up my shirt, making sure proper

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<v Speaker 1>for everybody. Okay, I don't know, probably not, but we'll

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<v Speaker 1>give your best.

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<v Speaker 2>We also probably had like twenty five hundred listens I think, right.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, we just hit twenty five hundred downloads, listens plays,

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<v Speaker 1>whatever you want to say on the last episode.

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<v Speaker 2>And and drum roll, please.

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<v Speaker 1>Can I do a drum rollogoo?

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<v Speaker 2>What are we at now?

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<v Speaker 1>Ten thousand, ten thousand, two hundred and six, to be exact.

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<v Speaker 2>That's freaking wild, It's crazy.

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<v Speaker 1>You guys have blown us out of the water this week.

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<v Speaker 1>Thank you so much for your support, and welcome to

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<v Speaker 1>everyone else who's tuning in. We appreciate you guys. We've

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<v Speaker 1>got messages comments of people actually binge listening listening days,

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<v Speaker 1>which makes me like terrified because I can't imagine I

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<v Speaker 1>should go back and listen to our first episodes.

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<v Speaker 2>Oh you were going to?

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<v Speaker 1>I haven't yet, but I can't imagine how we've changed

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<v Speaker 1>since then.

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<v Speaker 2>Already, Yeah, probably.

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<v Speaker 1>Remember those episodes where we had like bloopers left in

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<v Speaker 1>by accident.

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<v Speaker 2>There's only been a one, isn't there?

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<v Speaker 1>I think there's like two, isn't there? And there was

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<v Speaker 1>just one either way. All the new people went back

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<v Speaker 1>and just hurt us, like mess up royally.

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<v Speaker 2>So yeah, oh okay there because there was my my

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<v Speaker 2>complete shit shows.

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<v Speaker 1>Fire all the episode five.

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<v Speaker 2>In the Donals. I apologized about that. Oh that was

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<v Speaker 2>just a rocky road, a rocky road. Yeah, but no,

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<v Speaker 2>but honestly, they're binging. People are binging like seventeen episodes

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<v Speaker 2>in two days, which I was like, or even twenty

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<v Speaker 2>four hours.

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<v Speaker 1>I was like, yeah there was.

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<v Speaker 2>People said you did it in one day, like good work, Yes,

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<v Speaker 2>like you deserve a medal pat on the.

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<v Speaker 1>Back at least cheers to you, guys.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah. Our dog just loudly sighed she's tired.

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<v Speaker 1>Of our shit. Yeah, she's like, you guys don't deserve them.

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<v Speaker 2>Okay. And the other super cool thing, Ben, what are

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<v Speaker 2>you drinking?

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<v Speaker 1>I am drinking some juice from Cold Juicery.

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<v Speaker 2>So we have a discount code to share we do,

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<v Speaker 2>which is super awesome.

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<v Speaker 1>Before we get into the discount code though, for anyone

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<v Speaker 1>who's local, you know, Cold Juicery they make some pretty

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<v Speaker 1>dope juice.

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<v Speaker 2>So local as in Northern BC. Yes, yes, that's where

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<v Speaker 2>we're located in Prince George, BC. So Cold Juicery is

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<v Speaker 2>up at the Northern Sports Center, so like the UNBC gym. Yeah,

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<v Speaker 2>and you can just go in there to their juicery.

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<v Speaker 2>You don't have to be like part of the gym

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<v Speaker 2>or anything. And they have an awesome shop. And I

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<v Speaker 2>am legitimately obsessed with Cold Juicery. So the fact that

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<v Speaker 2>we I'm probably going to be the main one using

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<v Speaker 2>the fucking discount code.

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<v Speaker 1>Probably that's the only reason we became affiliates with Cold

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<v Speaker 1>Juicery is because it's a company that we are already.

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<v Speaker 2>Like, I think is dope.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, they're cool. We're totally down with supporting them and

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<v Speaker 1>having that little back and forth with them. So if

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<v Speaker 1>you order online, you can use Wicked fifteen and get

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<v Speaker 1>a discount from ordering their juices. Yeah, but again, it

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<v Speaker 1>is a local court.

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<v Speaker 2>The month of June.

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<v Speaker 1>Make sure you're Northern BC. Yes, for the month of June.

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<v Speaker 2>For the month of June, I'm just gonna say we're

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<v Speaker 2>drinking the Bold juice, which is actually one of my faves.

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<v Speaker 2>Apparently Ben is really enjoying it.

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<v Speaker 1>I kind of want to turn it into like a well, I'm.

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<v Speaker 2>Surprised that you haven't done that shit yet, orange carrot,

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<v Speaker 2>apple and lime. So it's like super good. We're boosting

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<v Speaker 2>our fucking immune systems.

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<v Speaker 1>Right now, we're being healthy.

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<v Speaker 2>We all need that shit right now, the healthy choice.

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<v Speaker 1>It's not bread in a bottle, it's not beer, it's

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<v Speaker 1>not whiskey.

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<v Speaker 2>Look at you. Yeah, you're like going up a class here.

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<v Speaker 1>With this I am sophisticated. I don't know if you

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<v Speaker 1>noticed when I drank this juice, I had my pinky.

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<v Speaker 2>In the air, you did. Yeah, So anyway, we'll put

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<v Speaker 2>a post up about it too. It's Wicked fifteen for

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<v Speaker 2>the month of June.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, go hit them up, go support them. They're a

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<v Speaker 1>great business. Okay, you ready for this?

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<v Speaker 2>I am so ready because okay, this is like one

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<v Speaker 2>of the requests. We have probably gotten the most to

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<v Speaker 2>do this case.

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<v Speaker 1>Yes, it is. And my mic is like sagging here,

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<v Speaker 1>so I'm sorry, kind adjust a bit. I got a

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<v Speaker 1>like actually I have a saggy mic. There's a pill

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<v Speaker 1>for that.

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<v Speaker 2>Oh god it I couldn't. I could not let that go.

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<v Speaker 2>So anyway, we have a on our like highlights in

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<v Speaker 2>our stories, a place where you can request cases that

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<v Speaker 2>you think we would cover really well or just sweet cases,

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<v Speaker 2>And this one like came up constantly, yes, and we're

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<v Speaker 2>doing it so yeah.

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<v Speaker 1>Well, and I just want to give you guys that

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<v Speaker 1>heads up. Like usually we like to tell the story

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<v Speaker 1>from the perspective of the victims, like as much as

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<v Speaker 1>possible we can, you know, because we don't want to

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<v Speaker 1>help promote serial killers.

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<v Speaker 2>And their ass whole life or an exactly.

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<v Speaker 1>But the scenario is a little bit different. It's going

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<v Speaker 1>to be from the other side of things. It is

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<v Speaker 1>going to be from the killer's perspective. This is the

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<v Speaker 1>case of Canada's worst random massacre in history. So we're

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<v Speaker 1>going to look at the events leading up and what

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<v Speaker 1>took place and like, what's in the account through his eyes?

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<v Speaker 2>The worst?

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<v Speaker 1>Did you say it is the most worst random massacre?

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<v Speaker 2>Random?

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<v Speaker 1>Yes, this is the story of the Shell Lake massacre. Okay,

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<v Speaker 1>I don't know if you guys are ready for this,

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<v Speaker 1>but I don't know. This is a tough one. So

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<v Speaker 1>take our warning at the beginning of this podcast, very

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<v Speaker 1>very seriously. Yeah, you consider yourself warned.

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<v Speaker 2>Okay, you just got really serious. Now, I'm like, do

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<v Speaker 2>I want to be.

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<v Speaker 1>Well, it's I mean, of course it is a murder case,

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<v Speaker 1>the massacre, but there is one specific spot in this

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<v Speaker 1>where it gets a little extra heavy.

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<v Speaker 2>Okay, let's do it.

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<v Speaker 1>So the story begins in a small village called Leask

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<v Speaker 1>I think that's how you say it, l e A

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<v Speaker 1>s K. It's just north of Saskatoon, Saskatchewan, and it

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<v Speaker 1>takes place in nineteen forty six.

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<v Speaker 2>Oh wow, Okay, I didn't realize this was quite that old.

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<v Speaker 1>Oh yeah, it's a while ago. It's a while ago,

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<v Speaker 1>but it's in the nineteen hundreds at least, so it's

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<v Speaker 1>not too long ago.

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<v Speaker 2>That's pretty long ago.

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<v Speaker 1>Well, I mean we were born like what forty two

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<v Speaker 1>years after this guy.

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<v Speaker 2>Was born, which is a long time.

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<v Speaker 1>So anyways, it starts in nineteen forty six with a

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<v Speaker 1>young boy named Victor Ernest Hoffman. He grew up in

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<v Speaker 1>an ordinary family of devout Lutheran Christians. Like other farmers

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<v Speaker 1>in the district, the Hoffman's practice mixed farming, which is

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<v Speaker 1>a practice of both growing hay and raising cattle. It's

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<v Speaker 1>kind of back and forth, right, Okay, there's a lot

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<v Speaker 1>of that around here too. Right.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I didn't know there was like a name to it.

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<v Speaker 1>Well, now you know, you've done did learn something today.

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<v Speaker 1>So they would follow the seasons, you know, the routine

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<v Speaker 1>of the season, hanging in certain seasons and moving the

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<v Speaker 1>cattle and all that sort of stuff. And it included

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<v Speaker 1>the occasional holiday, just like anyone who works in nine

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<v Speaker 1>to five, but it would usually revolve around the farm schedule. Right.

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<v Speaker 1>They worked pretty hard and when the farm allowed then

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<v Speaker 1>maybe they would take a little holiday if possible.

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<v Speaker 2>Farming is like a really tough lifestyle.

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<v Speaker 1>It is. You gotta be you got to be a

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<v Speaker 1>hard worker and you got to be tough.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah.

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<v Speaker 1>So now, of course, being religious, they also had Sundays

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<v Speaker 1>which was the Lord's Day and was primarily used for

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<v Speaker 1>church and worship. So it's your pretty standard family, especially

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<v Speaker 1>for in the nineteen forties, you know, Northern Canadian farming

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<v Speaker 1>family going to church, raising some kids, doing that whole

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<v Speaker 1>yet to me, yep, it's pretty pretty standard. So everyone

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<v Speaker 1>in this little district where they grew up in Leask,

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<v Speaker 1>the village and the surrounding area, they were all like

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<v Speaker 1>pretty much friends according to mister Hoffman, which.

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<v Speaker 2>Was it was a small town.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, it was considered a village, so it's pretty small.

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<v Speaker 1>I'm not too sure what a village consists of. I

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<v Speaker 1>think a village is like under four hundred people or

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<v Speaker 1>something like that.

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<v Speaker 2>That's pretty small.

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<v Speaker 1>So according to Victor's parents, everyone in the area were

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<v Speaker 1>civil and friends. And there's a quote here actually from

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<v Speaker 1>the father. We live in a nice district and the

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<v Speaker 1>people are very nice. We are well known here.

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<v Speaker 2>Everyone just fucking nice.

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<v Speaker 1>Everyone knows each other and everyone's just fucking nice. According

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<v Speaker 1>to Nicole, it's a very tight knit community. Let's put

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<v Speaker 1>it that way.

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<v Speaker 2>There you go.

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<v Speaker 1>So to his parents, Victor was an excellent farmer, hard worker,

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<v Speaker 1>and a responsible person. He didn't seem very different from

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<v Speaker 1>and the other kids around his age. He seemed healthy.

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<v Speaker 1>He was a bit quiet and shy, but he was

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<v Speaker 1>able to amuse and entertain himself easily, just like any

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<v Speaker 1>other kid going outside to play sort of thing. Right.

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<v Speaker 1>He did have one close friend, but he mostly kept

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<v Speaker 1>to himself. As I mentioned, he was kind of shy. Yeah,

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<v Speaker 1>so as he grew up, he did drink or smoke,

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<v Speaker 1>and though he wasn't overly religious, he did occasionally attend church,

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<v Speaker 1>mostly just to make his parents happy, mostly his dad. Okay,

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<v Speaker 1>so in grade nine he did begin begin missing school

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<v Speaker 1>a bit like many of us do, going through that

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<v Speaker 1>rebalance stage of life. Exactly.

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<v Speaker 2>I never had that.

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<v Speaker 1>I skipped school I think twice. Once was to go

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<v Speaker 1>the new system system of a down came.

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<v Speaker 2>Remember I knew you then.

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<v Speaker 1>And the other time was I wanted to go to

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<v Speaker 1>the dollar store. I don't think you are goodie too, shoes.

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<v Speaker 2>You're welcome to my parents. Really, I was amazing.

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<v Speaker 1>We're both pretty good kids.

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<v Speaker 2>Actually our parents. I feel like we're pretty lucky them.

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<v Speaker 2>Not like that, like we had the same parents. We

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<v Speaker 2>do not have the same parents.

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<v Speaker 1>My parents and your parents are lucky.

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<v Speaker 2>There you go.

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<v Speaker 1>You're welcome, mom and dad. Anyways, moving on from that

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<v Speaker 1>awkward conversation thing.

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<v Speaker 2>Oh gosh, that was good.

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<v Speaker 1>So he began missing in school a little bit, and

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<v Speaker 1>the principal questioned why Victor wasn't coming to school when

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<v Speaker 1>the odd time when he was missing it. His parents

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<v Speaker 1>and principal talked, and the principal said, Victor is is

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<v Speaker 1>no trouble. He's very good in school, or he behaves

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<v Speaker 1>good in school at least okay, and he had no

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<v Speaker 1>trouble and he would have no trouble going right up

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<v Speaker 1>to grade twelve and graduating high school.

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<v Speaker 2>Nice.

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<v Speaker 1>But Victor didn't really progress like the principal had expected

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<v Speaker 1>or his parents had expected. Around grade nine something went

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<v Speaker 1>wrong and another. There's a lot of quotes through this,

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<v Speaker 1>just so you.

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<v Speaker 2>Know, I love that though.

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<v Speaker 1>So here's a quote from his father. His father said,

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<v Speaker 1>as far as being smart, he was just as smart

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<v Speaker 1>as the rest of the boys. He used to work

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<v Speaker 1>here and fix bicycles for the neighbor boys. In what

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<v Speaker 1>they couldn't fix, he could.

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<v Speaker 2>Wow, that's actually like a compliment and a half.

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<v Speaker 1>It is. So he's he's he's got his head on straight.

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<v Speaker 1>He's he's a smart kid, and he he can work

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<v Speaker 1>with his hands. He's a hard worker. He's he's knowing

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<v Speaker 1>what he's doing. He's very what's the word I'm looking for, competent.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah.

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<v Speaker 1>So Victor continued to work in the farm and was

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<v Speaker 1>extremely good at whatever work he would do, and so

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<v Speaker 1>much so that he would even work on other farms occasionally.

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<v Speaker 2>Oh okay, he got recruited.

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<v Speaker 1>He did. He had a knack for figuring out a

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<v Speaker 1>lot of issues on farms, like how to plant the

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<v Speaker 1>seeds properly or hay the fields in a certain way,

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<v Speaker 1>because it's like you got lots of ruts or wet

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<v Speaker 1>spots and all this sort of thing, So figuring out

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<v Speaker 1>the lay of the land sort of thing. He had

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<v Speaker 1>no problem overcoming any obstacles out in the field like that,

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<v Speaker 1>whereas a lot of people had issues problem solving.

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<v Speaker 2>I've gone by farms and stuff, it's always really impressive,

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<v Speaker 2>like you see little patches of like where it's probably

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<v Speaker 2>too wet, and I'm like, oh, man, like they just

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<v Speaker 2>know they're feeling so well, that's impressive.

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<v Speaker 1>And Victor had no problem reading the field like that

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<v Speaker 1>and was able to figure it out no problem. So

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<v Speaker 1>he knew what he was doing when it came to

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<v Speaker 1>the field work. Little did his parents know, though, Victor

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<v Speaker 1>was struggling. And maybe it was because he was able

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<v Speaker 1>to hide it well. Or maybe it was because his

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<v Speaker 1>parents were distracted with the farm, or maybe it was

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<v Speaker 1>because they had six other kids taking up their time

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<v Speaker 1>as well.

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<v Speaker 2>That was wrong.

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<v Speaker 1>Well, either way, Victor, Victor was suffering alone. Let's put

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<v Speaker 1>it that way.

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<v Speaker 2>Mental health, we'll get into it.

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<v Speaker 1>Okay, we'll definitely get into it. Jumping ahead a little bit.

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<v Speaker 1>According to medical reports, Victor had actually been suffering here

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<v Speaker 1>it is from schizophrenic schizophrenia most of his life.

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<v Speaker 2>Okay.

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<v Speaker 1>Victor recounted an event from his childhood that here you

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00:13:48.799 --> 00:13:51.720
<v Speaker 1>ready for this, that he saw the devil when he

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<v Speaker 1>was just six years old.

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<v Speaker 2>Oh boy, holy shit.

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<v Speaker 1>Can you imagine being six years old face to face

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<v Speaker 1>with a devil? Oh my parts, Nope, I'm out, I'm sorry.

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<v Speaker 1>And then on top of it, hiding.

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00:14:05.559 --> 00:14:08.039
<v Speaker 2>That from your parting that for that long and stuff.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah no, thanks, Well, yeah, like you probably wouldn't feel

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<v Speaker 2>comfortable saying that, knowing that they were like religious and stuff.

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00:14:15.240 --> 00:14:17.679
<v Speaker 1>Right, Well, I would think, I like, from my perspective,

301
00:14:17.720 --> 00:14:21.159
<v Speaker 1>and I mean, I'm not schizophrenic by any idea or anything.

302
00:14:21.720 --> 00:14:23.360
<v Speaker 1>Maybe I am, I don't know, maybe you're a figment

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00:14:23.360 --> 00:14:29.240
<v Speaker 1>of my imagination. Shit. Anyways, from my perspective, I would

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00:14:29.240 --> 00:14:31.559
<v Speaker 1>think that like going to my parents or the church

305
00:14:31.639 --> 00:14:33.240
<v Speaker 1>or praying or something might be able to help me

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00:14:33.279 --> 00:14:33.879
<v Speaker 1>from the devil.

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00:14:34.320 --> 00:14:36.919
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, to tell your parents might be helpful. It's actually

308
00:14:37.000 --> 00:14:39.320
<v Speaker 2>surprising at that age that he could hide it from them.

309
00:14:39.639 --> 00:14:42.679
<v Speaker 2>I remember I would probably like kindergarten grade one, and

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00:14:42.759 --> 00:14:46.080
<v Speaker 2>I like prank called someone and I didn't last like

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00:14:46.120 --> 00:14:48.159
<v Speaker 2>a fuck an hour before I had to tell them,

312
00:14:48.200 --> 00:14:49.440
<v Speaker 2>and I was freaking out.

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00:14:49.600 --> 00:14:50.480
<v Speaker 1>The guilt got to you.

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00:14:50.559 --> 00:14:53.279
<v Speaker 2>But I was just like bawling, Oh my gosh, I'm

315
00:14:53.360 --> 00:14:54.039
<v Speaker 2>so sorry.

316
00:14:54.240 --> 00:14:56.279
<v Speaker 1>So I wouldn't you have to tell us what the

317
00:14:56.279 --> 00:14:58.360
<v Speaker 1>prank call involved. I've never heard the story before.

318
00:14:58.360 --> 00:15:00.639
<v Speaker 2>Oh it was nothing like I literally just the phone

319
00:15:00.639 --> 00:15:03.320
<v Speaker 2>and dialed numbers and then someone was like hello, hello,

320
00:15:03.519 --> 00:15:04.320
<v Speaker 2>and then I hung up.

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00:15:04.960 --> 00:15:05.440
<v Speaker 1>That's it.

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00:15:05.559 --> 00:15:07.159
<v Speaker 2>That's not even a prank call. But then I was like,

323
00:15:07.159 --> 00:15:14.559
<v Speaker 2>oh my god, I'm a terrible person. Wow. That is yeah, Laine, underwhelming,

324
00:15:14.919 --> 00:15:17.159
<v Speaker 2>it's very lame. But I couldn't even hold that in.

325
00:15:17.679 --> 00:15:18.120
<v Speaker 1>Wow.

326
00:15:18.399 --> 00:15:19.960
<v Speaker 2>So there you go. I wouldn't be able to hold

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00:15:20.000 --> 00:15:21.080
<v Speaker 2>in that I saw the devil.

328
00:15:21.320 --> 00:15:26.320
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, no kidding. Anyways, let's get back to the story

329
00:15:26.320 --> 00:15:27.600
<v Speaker 1>a bit here. I'm going to tell you what the

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00:15:27.600 --> 00:15:30.720
<v Speaker 1>devil actually looked like. Oh, I want to know the

331
00:15:30.759 --> 00:15:33.440
<v Speaker 1>creature stood. I'm going to refer to his creature devil

332
00:15:33.480 --> 00:15:35.120
<v Speaker 1>back and forth a little bit, depending on how I

333
00:15:35.120 --> 00:15:37.399
<v Speaker 1>wrote this. I'm sorry, that's fine. I was tired when

334
00:15:37.440 --> 00:15:40.320
<v Speaker 1>I wrote it, so that's fine. The creature or devil

335
00:15:40.480 --> 00:15:43.559
<v Speaker 1>stood about six feet tall. He was black as night

336
00:15:44.159 --> 00:15:47.279
<v Speaker 1>with a long tail. But this encounter wouldn't be the

337
00:15:47.320 --> 00:15:51.000
<v Speaker 1>only encounter with the beast. He would also begin to feel,

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00:15:51.320 --> 00:15:54.960
<v Speaker 1>in the middle of the night, at times of day,

339
00:15:55.919 --> 00:15:59.960
<v Speaker 1>random places wherever, that he was being seduced by both

340
00:16:00.200 --> 00:16:03.559
<v Speaker 1>Satan and God, being pulled one direction or the other.

341
00:16:03.679 --> 00:16:04.840
<v Speaker 2>Oh wow.

342
00:16:06.000 --> 00:16:08.240
<v Speaker 1>Yeah for a little six year old boy, and as

343
00:16:08.279 --> 00:16:09.600
<v Speaker 1>he's grown up to feel this sort of.

344
00:16:09.559 --> 00:16:12.440
<v Speaker 2>Shit, well yeah, that's like traumatizing.

345
00:16:12.480 --> 00:16:16.399
<v Speaker 1>Rely Oh, it's brutal. Sometimes he would even hear tapping

346
00:16:16.480 --> 00:16:19.399
<v Speaker 1>sounds and would wake up at night to a drumming

347
00:16:19.440 --> 00:16:21.399
<v Speaker 1>sound that would get faster and faster.

348
00:16:21.600 --> 00:16:22.759
<v Speaker 2>And that's the devil.

349
00:16:23.240 --> 00:16:25.679
<v Speaker 1>Well, I would most likely think so. Either that or

350
00:16:25.720 --> 00:16:28.000
<v Speaker 1>it's just some noisy neighbor with a drum.

351
00:16:27.799 --> 00:16:31.840
<v Speaker 2>Set like you. You don't have a drum set, but you

352
00:16:31.960 --> 00:16:34.039
<v Speaker 2>can be a noisy well, not even a neighbor to

353
00:16:34.080 --> 00:16:35.159
<v Speaker 2>live with you. You're noisy.

354
00:16:35.879 --> 00:16:39.200
<v Speaker 1>Thank you. I love you too. Wow, I loved you too.

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00:16:39.559 --> 00:16:43.840
<v Speaker 1>Appreciate it. So, when he was about ten, he began

356
00:16:43.960 --> 00:16:49.559
<v Speaker 1>having strange experiences and daily impulses to quote unquote kill

357
00:16:50.600 --> 00:16:55.720
<v Speaker 1>at ten at ten years old, okay, he would have

358
00:16:55.759 --> 00:17:00.679
<v Speaker 1>impulses to kill strangers, oh, my neighbors and even friends

359
00:17:00.919 --> 00:17:01.840
<v Speaker 1>when he would meet them.

360
00:17:02.159 --> 00:17:07.519
<v Speaker 2>Holy shit, I that's so little. Yeah, you should be

361
00:17:07.559 --> 00:17:09.079
<v Speaker 2>like making my pies.

362
00:17:08.759 --> 00:17:09.960
<v Speaker 1>And stuff making.

363
00:17:10.079 --> 00:17:15.319
<v Speaker 2>That's very specific, not like being visualized and killing people.

364
00:17:15.480 --> 00:17:17.759
<v Speaker 1>I'm pretty sure ten year olds these days are playing

365
00:17:17.920 --> 00:17:18.680
<v Speaker 1>fortnight and.

366
00:17:18.759 --> 00:17:21.799
<v Speaker 2>Texting and sit well, ten year old back then wouldn't

367
00:17:21.799 --> 00:17:22.200
<v Speaker 2>be doing that.

368
00:17:22.440 --> 00:17:26.480
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, no kidding. So, like I said, through all this,

369
00:17:26.599 --> 00:17:29.240
<v Speaker 1>he never told his parents about it, not once. He

370
00:17:29.279 --> 00:17:31.359
<v Speaker 1>didn't discuss any of his problems, and as far as

371
00:17:31.400 --> 00:17:33.960
<v Speaker 1>anyone knew he had, he was a normal child. He

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00:17:33.960 --> 00:17:36.160
<v Speaker 1>had a normal childhood, and he was maybe just a

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00:17:36.200 --> 00:17:36.960
<v Speaker 1>little bit shy.

374
00:17:37.119 --> 00:17:38.920
<v Speaker 2>I can't believe he could hold that shit in.

375
00:17:39.200 --> 00:17:42.240
<v Speaker 1>Okay, I can't hold in a fart, let alone anything

376
00:17:42.319 --> 00:17:42.599
<v Speaker 1>like that.

377
00:17:44.680 --> 00:17:48.680
<v Speaker 2>Oh well, maybe he was better at holden in his farts.

378
00:17:49.039 --> 00:17:51.720
<v Speaker 2>Maybe maybe, or no, he probably was worse at it.

379
00:17:51.799 --> 00:17:53.079
<v Speaker 2>I mean, because he was so good.

380
00:17:53.000 --> 00:17:56.759
<v Speaker 1>At this, oh one of the other who knows. Anyways,

381
00:17:56.799 --> 00:17:58.680
<v Speaker 1>he's a better man than I am. That's all I know.

382
00:18:00.079 --> 00:18:02.960
<v Speaker 1>So throughout all his impulses to kill, he never acted

383
00:18:03.000 --> 00:18:03.680
<v Speaker 1>towards them.

384
00:18:05.559 --> 00:18:07.559
<v Speaker 2>Well, at ten, I doubt he could even do it.

385
00:18:07.599 --> 00:18:09.799
<v Speaker 2>But okay, well, I.

386
00:18:09.759 --> 00:18:11.880
<v Speaker 1>Mean you never know. I mean, give a kid a gun,

387
00:18:11.920 --> 00:18:13.920
<v Speaker 1>you never know what's going to happen, right, especially a

388
00:18:13.960 --> 00:18:14.720
<v Speaker 1>farm kid. Right.

389
00:18:15.079 --> 00:18:17.599
<v Speaker 2>Well, yeah, he sounds smart and tough and stuff.

390
00:18:18.319 --> 00:18:21.359
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, but what he did do is he did direct

391
00:18:21.359 --> 00:18:23.160
<v Speaker 1>his impulses against animals.

392
00:18:23.160 --> 00:18:26.759
<v Speaker 2>Shit, I should have saw that coming. I have a

393
00:18:26.759 --> 00:18:27.440
<v Speaker 2>problem with that.

394
00:18:27.559 --> 00:18:28.079
<v Speaker 1>Yeah you do.

395
00:18:28.720 --> 00:18:31.720
<v Speaker 2>So my reaction was more intense.

396
00:18:30.680 --> 00:18:30.880
<v Speaker 1>Book.

397
00:18:33.039 --> 00:18:35.319
<v Speaker 2>Oh lord, I don't know if I want to hear

398
00:18:35.359 --> 00:18:35.759
<v Speaker 2>any of that.

399
00:18:36.000 --> 00:18:38.519
<v Speaker 1>But okay, once he caught a cat in a trap,

400
00:18:39.720 --> 00:18:44.119
<v Speaker 1>and he threw the trap and the cat inside a smokehouse. Nice,

401
00:18:44.400 --> 00:18:47.000
<v Speaker 1>and he left it there for three weeks.

402
00:18:47.200 --> 00:18:47.839
<v Speaker 2>Oh god.

403
00:18:48.039 --> 00:18:52.000
<v Speaker 1>Okay, but he did take it out and let it

404
00:18:52.039 --> 00:18:53.640
<v Speaker 1>go because he did feel bad.

405
00:18:54.440 --> 00:18:56.720
<v Speaker 2>What is a smokehouse? Okay, I thought that he was

406
00:18:56.759 --> 00:18:57.680
<v Speaker 2>like smoking it.

407
00:18:57.880 --> 00:19:01.839
<v Speaker 1>No, he didn't smoke. He just an inactive smokehouse.

408
00:19:02.119 --> 00:19:05.559
<v Speaker 2>A smokehouse, so he's just like holding a captive.

409
00:19:05.240 --> 00:19:09.160
<v Speaker 1>For three Yeah, he starved it, Oh my god, in

410
00:19:09.240 --> 00:19:12.799
<v Speaker 1>a cage for three weeks. A smokehouse though, basically, picture

411
00:19:12.839 --> 00:19:14.720
<v Speaker 1>like a little shed with like racks in it. You

412
00:19:14.720 --> 00:19:17.279
<v Speaker 1>can light a little fire inside and like smoke salmon.

413
00:19:18.839 --> 00:19:19.240
<v Speaker 2>Or something.

414
00:19:19.400 --> 00:19:21.480
<v Speaker 1>No, he didn't smoke the cat, but he did put

415
00:19:21.519 --> 00:19:26.000
<v Speaker 1>it in there without an active fire, So he did

416
00:19:26.000 --> 00:19:27.759
<v Speaker 1>feel bad for the cat, and he did let it go.

417
00:19:28.880 --> 00:19:31.160
<v Speaker 1>Even though he did let this one go though, because

418
00:19:31.160 --> 00:19:33.400
<v Speaker 1>he felt bad for the extended torture of the animal,

419
00:19:33.920 --> 00:19:38.200
<v Speaker 1>he did continue to kill. He would club cats, he

420
00:19:38.240 --> 00:19:41.079
<v Speaker 1>would stomp on them, hurt them in other ways. He

421
00:19:41.200 --> 00:19:48.079
<v Speaker 1>killed dogs, several hundred squirrels, and enjoyed hunting wild game.

422
00:19:49.039 --> 00:19:51.720
<v Speaker 1>Killing animals just straight up made him happy.

423
00:19:52.319 --> 00:19:52.920
<v Speaker 2>Wow.

424
00:19:53.480 --> 00:19:56.119
<v Speaker 1>I just want to address the hunting thing real quick,

425
00:19:56.119 --> 00:19:59.119
<v Speaker 1>because I do know hunting is like a controversial topic

426
00:19:59.160 --> 00:20:03.759
<v Speaker 1>for some people. I'm a hunter, I do hunt. I

427
00:20:03.799 --> 00:20:05.920
<v Speaker 1>have pulled the trigger on animals. I'm going to say

428
00:20:05.920 --> 00:20:09.240
<v Speaker 1>that right now. I do not enjoy killing animals.

429
00:20:09.880 --> 00:20:13.000
<v Speaker 2>Well, and it's done in the most humane way possible. Yes,

430
00:20:13.039 --> 00:20:15.400
<v Speaker 2>And I'm feeling like he probably well, I don't think

431
00:20:15.440 --> 00:20:16.480
<v Speaker 2>he did it that way.

432
00:20:16.519 --> 00:20:18.279
<v Speaker 1>Well, he may have done it in the most human

433
00:20:18.359 --> 00:20:21.400
<v Speaker 1>way possible. But when you talk to most hunters, and

434
00:20:21.440 --> 00:20:23.759
<v Speaker 1>I have had this conversation with hunters in the past,

435
00:20:24.240 --> 00:20:26.559
<v Speaker 1>if you talk to a hunter, ninety nine point nine

436
00:20:26.599 --> 00:20:30.400
<v Speaker 1>percent of the times, they're a decent human being. They

437
00:20:30.480 --> 00:20:34.279
<v Speaker 1>enjoy going out hiking, they enjoy going out camping, they

438
00:20:34.400 --> 00:20:38.279
<v Speaker 1>enjoy tracking the animal, calling the animal, the thrill of hunting,

439
00:20:38.720 --> 00:20:41.640
<v Speaker 1>the pride even when you do get something. But that

440
00:20:41.759 --> 00:20:44.559
<v Speaker 1>moment in having to pull the trigger and actually take

441
00:20:44.599 --> 00:20:47.400
<v Speaker 1>the life of an animal is the hardest thing you'll

442
00:20:47.440 --> 00:20:50.720
<v Speaker 1>ever have to do. It's not enjoyable. No hunter that

443
00:20:50.759 --> 00:20:55.519
<v Speaker 1>I have ever spoken to likes that part. You actually

444
00:20:55.599 --> 00:20:57.920
<v Speaker 1>asked me a few years ago how I can pull

445
00:20:57.960 --> 00:21:00.519
<v Speaker 1>the trigger on an animal. Do you remember what I said?

446
00:21:02.000 --> 00:21:03.839
<v Speaker 1>If I can think if I think about it, I

447
00:21:03.880 --> 00:21:05.000
<v Speaker 1>wouldn't be able to do it.

448
00:21:05.319 --> 00:21:06.759
<v Speaker 2>Oh okay, I don't remember.

449
00:21:07.559 --> 00:21:09.359
<v Speaker 1>It's it's it's not fun.

450
00:21:09.880 --> 00:21:13.720
<v Speaker 2>Yeah. So but then okay, but honestly, going to the

451
00:21:13.720 --> 00:21:18.160
<v Speaker 2>grocery store and stuff, like those animals still like died

452
00:21:18.319 --> 00:21:20.119
<v Speaker 2>right for you to be able to like eat them

453
00:21:20.160 --> 00:21:21.920
<v Speaker 2>and like nourish your body and stuff.

454
00:21:21.920 --> 00:21:25.079
<v Speaker 1>So it's like, yeah, it's hunting is more like a

455
00:21:25.160 --> 00:21:29.559
<v Speaker 1>as far as hunter's perspective. Yeah, it's a more sustainable

456
00:21:29.599 --> 00:21:33.079
<v Speaker 1>way of filling your freezer and a more humane way

457
00:21:33.119 --> 00:21:33.240
<v Speaker 1>of it.

458
00:21:33.359 --> 00:21:35.720
<v Speaker 2>And it's organic as shit because lord knows what.

459
00:21:36.079 --> 00:21:39.039
<v Speaker 1>Yes, and like one animal can feed a family for

460
00:21:39.079 --> 00:21:41.960
<v Speaker 1>a whole year, yeah, rather than multiple animals dying for

461
00:21:41.960 --> 00:21:44.000
<v Speaker 1>a certain parts. Anyways, that's a whole other conversation.

462
00:21:44.640 --> 00:21:47.759
<v Speaker 2>Okay, So the hunting, okay, maybe that's fine, but the

463
00:21:48.119 --> 00:21:51.279
<v Speaker 2>killing of the cats and the friggin dogs. Uh uh.

464
00:21:51.279 --> 00:21:53.839
<v Speaker 1>Well, my point is not that the hunting's fine. It's

465
00:21:54.160 --> 00:21:58.400
<v Speaker 1>hunt Like he enjoys killing the animals, so that's why

466
00:21:58.440 --> 00:21:58.960
<v Speaker 1>he hunts.

467
00:21:59.279 --> 00:22:01.079
<v Speaker 2>That's not tool Okay, that's not cool.

468
00:22:01.440 --> 00:22:02.960
<v Speaker 1>Like he enjoys pulling the trigger.

469
00:22:03.000 --> 00:22:05.880
<v Speaker 2>He enjoys t He's like satisfied by doing that.

470
00:22:06.039 --> 00:22:08.359
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, that's that's not a hunter.

471
00:22:08.720 --> 00:22:11.279
<v Speaker 2>Okay, I seehere, Okay, I see where we're going with this.

472
00:22:11.359 --> 00:22:13.839
<v Speaker 1>So finally, after five minute conversation.

473
00:22:13.920 --> 00:22:15.880
<v Speaker 2>Sorry, everyone was along for that ride.

474
00:22:17.279 --> 00:22:19.559
<v Speaker 1>Once he did actually beat up a younger boy and

475
00:22:19.599 --> 00:22:22.960
<v Speaker 1>he kept beating him like the fight's over, and he

476
00:22:23.079 --> 00:22:27.200
<v Speaker 1>kept punching, cap kicking sort of thing, and Victor actually

477
00:22:27.200 --> 00:22:29.279
<v Speaker 1>threatened the boy and told him not to tell anyone,

478
00:22:30.720 --> 00:22:35.480
<v Speaker 1>and the boy being fearful of the situation, and Victor obliged.

479
00:22:35.519 --> 00:22:37.200
<v Speaker 1>He didn't tell anyone about it.

480
00:22:37.279 --> 00:22:39.119
<v Speaker 2>Well, like what he went to his parents? And what

481
00:22:39.160 --> 00:22:41.039
<v Speaker 2>the hell did he say happened to him?

482
00:22:41.359 --> 00:22:44.319
<v Speaker 1>I don't know. I ran into a door.

483
00:22:47.279 --> 00:22:48.839
<v Speaker 2>So interesting.

484
00:22:49.880 --> 00:22:53.799
<v Speaker 1>So one day, while having breakfast, Victor began to hear voices.

485
00:22:55.039 --> 00:22:58.680
<v Speaker 1>He heard the devil calling to him, so he followed

486
00:22:58.680 --> 00:23:02.240
<v Speaker 1>the voice, and he followed it out and to that

487
00:23:02.319 --> 00:23:04.799
<v Speaker 1>he saw a figure standing before him that was about

488
00:23:04.880 --> 00:23:08.680
<v Speaker 1>six foot six tall six foot sixty inches tall, sorry,

489
00:23:09.160 --> 00:23:11.720
<v Speaker 1>that weighed about three hundred pounds and looked like a pig,

490
00:23:12.079 --> 00:23:15.240
<v Speaker 1>and it had no clothes on. Is that the devil,

491
00:23:15.799 --> 00:23:18.119
<v Speaker 1>I would assume. So he's described the devil a little

492
00:23:18.119 --> 00:23:21.759
<v Speaker 1>bit differently a few times, but this is a very

493
00:23:21.759 --> 00:23:24.759
<v Speaker 1>specific description that I have found. So the first one

494
00:23:25.200 --> 00:23:27.400
<v Speaker 1>and this one are two different ways he has described

495
00:23:27.400 --> 00:23:31.720
<v Speaker 1>the devil. Oh okay, it's a big pig like figure,

496
00:23:32.240 --> 00:23:37.880
<v Speaker 1>basically weird, ugly. Yeah. When he saw the figure, it

497
00:23:37.960 --> 00:23:39.880
<v Speaker 1>told him that he would have to that he could

498
00:23:39.960 --> 00:23:43.160
<v Speaker 1>make him very rich if he would only just bow

499
00:23:43.240 --> 00:23:48.400
<v Speaker 1>to him. Oh boy, like anyone. Though, Victor was reluctant.

500
00:23:48.559 --> 00:23:52.079
<v Speaker 1>He didn't bow to the devil, but eventually he did

501
00:23:52.160 --> 00:23:54.799
<v Speaker 1>kneel down on one knee, thinking this would make him

502
00:23:54.839 --> 00:23:57.200
<v Speaker 1>half as rich and still please the devil.

503
00:23:57.519 --> 00:23:58.680
<v Speaker 2>Oh goodness, he.

504
00:23:58.640 --> 00:24:01.799
<v Speaker 1>Didn't become rich, of course, maybe because the devil wasn't

505
00:24:01.839 --> 00:24:05.680
<v Speaker 1>real or but Victor thought it was because he refused

506
00:24:05.680 --> 00:24:10.039
<v Speaker 1>to actually fully bow to the devil. Since then, he

507
00:24:10.079 --> 00:24:14.799
<v Speaker 1>saw the devil about a total of twenty times. One time,

508
00:24:14.839 --> 00:24:16.599
<v Speaker 1>the devil even helped them pick berries.

509
00:24:16.640 --> 00:24:19.519
<v Speaker 2>Actually, oh my gosh, that's so random.

510
00:24:20.240 --> 00:24:22.960
<v Speaker 1>But the devil wasn't very good at it. I guess I.

511
00:24:22.960 --> 00:24:24.720
<v Speaker 2>Wouldn't be very good at picking berry either.

512
00:24:24.839 --> 00:24:27.079
<v Speaker 1>No, you wouldn't, oh, not picking. I thought you said

513
00:24:27.079 --> 00:24:29.160
<v Speaker 1>you wouldn't want to pick. I thought you were going

514
00:24:29.200 --> 00:24:30.480
<v Speaker 1>different way with that. I thought you're gonna say you

515
00:24:30.519 --> 00:24:32.559
<v Speaker 1>didn't want to pick berries with the devil. That's gonna

516
00:24:32.599 --> 00:24:34.680
<v Speaker 1>be like what it's a nice Sunday afternoon.

517
00:24:34.759 --> 00:24:36.680
<v Speaker 2>No, first, I'm not going to at picking berries, and

518
00:24:36.680 --> 00:24:38.680
<v Speaker 2>I wouldn't want to pick them the devil.

519
00:24:38.799 --> 00:24:41.119
<v Speaker 1>Could you imagine though, just like off in the field

520
00:24:41.200 --> 00:24:45.119
<v Speaker 1>picking berries with the devil? Okay, what berries do you

521
00:24:45.200 --> 00:24:48.319
<v Speaker 1>picture picking when you think of that. I don't know why,

522
00:24:48.359 --> 00:24:50.039
<v Speaker 1>but I just thought blueberries. All of a sudden, I

523
00:24:50.079 --> 00:24:54.160
<v Speaker 1>was like blueberries, just picking blueberries with the devil.

524
00:24:54.240 --> 00:24:58.599
<v Speaker 2>I think it went like strawberries. That's like really random

525
00:24:58.640 --> 00:25:03.240
<v Speaker 2>and weird. It is, anyways, not a memory as a child.

526
00:25:03.480 --> 00:25:06.839
<v Speaker 1>Well, if that's not unsettling enough, though, He also saw

527
00:25:07.079 --> 00:25:11.960
<v Speaker 1>disembodied cold hands several times. They were floating and they

528
00:25:12.000 --> 00:25:15.720
<v Speaker 1>would then feel and touch him on his neck and body.

529
00:25:16.920 --> 00:25:22.759
<v Speaker 1>So just floating hands that would just grope him basically cool.

530
00:25:22.880 --> 00:25:25.079
<v Speaker 1>I didn't say anything about sexually, but it would like

531
00:25:25.160 --> 00:25:25.880
<v Speaker 1>grope him.

532
00:25:26.160 --> 00:25:27.440
<v Speaker 2>That's awesome.

533
00:25:34.599 --> 00:25:40.759
<v Speaker 1>And not much can beat that. Oh gosh wow. Okay, anyways,

534
00:25:40.920 --> 00:25:43.160
<v Speaker 1>Shortly after he saw the devil, when he was young,

535
00:25:43.319 --> 00:25:46.440
<v Speaker 1>Victor also began to see what he would call angels.

536
00:25:47.119 --> 00:25:49.519
<v Speaker 1>They looked like human beings and they were mostly dressed

537
00:25:49.559 --> 00:25:52.720
<v Speaker 1>like women. One angel tried to actually protect him one

538
00:25:52.799 --> 00:25:55.119
<v Speaker 1>day and told him many times that he needed to

539
00:25:55.160 --> 00:25:59.359
<v Speaker 1>stop killing these animals, but then the devil attacked her,

540
00:25:59.759 --> 00:26:03.279
<v Speaker 1>and oh, yeah, it's kind of fucked up and claim

541
00:26:03.599 --> 00:26:06.599
<v Speaker 1>and he claims that he suddenly found himself standing there

542
00:26:06.599 --> 00:26:09.119
<v Speaker 1>with a sword in his hands. So the devil is

543
00:26:09.119 --> 00:26:11.759
<v Speaker 1>wrestling with an angel and Victor's standing there and with

544
00:26:12.119 --> 00:26:13.240
<v Speaker 1>a sword in his.

545
00:26:13.240 --> 00:26:17.640
<v Speaker 2>Hands, which is random.

546
00:26:17.799 --> 00:26:19.960
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, I did, Okay, let's move on.

547
00:26:20.240 --> 00:26:23.319
<v Speaker 2>He would somehow probably described that sword somewhere.

548
00:26:23.279 --> 00:26:27.319
<v Speaker 1>Well, if there even was one, okay, but whatever it was,

549
00:26:27.640 --> 00:26:29.839
<v Speaker 1>if there was anything in his hands or not. He

550
00:26:29.960 --> 00:26:32.960
<v Speaker 1>succumbed to the urge to attack another angel that was

551
00:26:33.000 --> 00:26:33.680
<v Speaker 1>beside him.

552
00:26:34.640 --> 00:26:36.200
<v Speaker 2>Oh he's attacking the angel.

553
00:26:36.200 --> 00:26:39.880
<v Speaker 1>The angel he for whatever urge he had. He didn't

554
00:26:39.920 --> 00:26:45.000
<v Speaker 1>want to, but that's the urge he had. Yeah. Occasionally,

555
00:26:45.119 --> 00:26:47.039
<v Speaker 1>God and angels would tell him that he could not

556
00:26:47.200 --> 00:26:51.519
<v Speaker 1>make plans because only God can do this for him.

557
00:26:51.799 --> 00:26:54.880
<v Speaker 1>So we're dealing like these are the sort of things

558
00:26:54.920 --> 00:26:57.640
<v Speaker 1>that's going through a young man's mind, like starting at

559
00:26:57.680 --> 00:27:01.119
<v Speaker 1>the age of six, and he's bill in school at

560
00:27:01.119 --> 00:27:02.200
<v Speaker 1>this point, like this.

561
00:27:02.160 --> 00:27:06.119
<v Speaker 2>Is He's like, it doesn't have any outlet, outlet to

562
00:27:06.200 --> 00:27:08.559
<v Speaker 2>be talking about this ship to anyone.

563
00:27:08.200 --> 00:27:10.839
<v Speaker 1>With and like right around now he's he's about the

564
00:27:10.839 --> 00:27:13.680
<v Speaker 1>age of fifteen, and he's also like, we're just getting

565
00:27:13.680 --> 00:27:16.920
<v Speaker 1>into this, but he's also obsessed with guns. He's getting

566
00:27:16.920 --> 00:27:17.880
<v Speaker 1>into guns now.

567
00:27:18.039 --> 00:27:19.240
<v Speaker 2>It's perfect combination.

568
00:27:19.519 --> 00:27:23.119
<v Speaker 1>So it's it's deep, it's dark, and it's it's.

569
00:27:22.960 --> 00:27:25.359
<v Speaker 2>So messy because back then too, like I don't know,

570
00:27:25.400 --> 00:27:27.759
<v Speaker 2>I feel like mental health or mountain illnesses is like

571
00:27:27.920 --> 00:27:31.519
<v Speaker 2>more of a thing that's like you could openly be

572
00:27:31.640 --> 00:27:36.920
<v Speaker 2>about now, yeah, and back then it's probably like even harder. Right, oh, definitely,

573
00:27:37.039 --> 00:27:38.960
<v Speaker 2>like not like almost frowned upon or whatever.

574
00:27:39.519 --> 00:27:40.519
<v Speaker 1>I'm sure it was your.

575
00:27:40.400 --> 00:27:45.240
<v Speaker 2>Shit together or whatever. So it's come a long way, thankfully, thankfully,

576
00:27:45.279 --> 00:27:46.319
<v Speaker 2>thankfully for sure.

577
00:27:46.480 --> 00:27:50.039
<v Speaker 1>Holy So, like I said, Victor was obsessed with guns

578
00:27:50.039 --> 00:27:52.960
<v Speaker 1>at this age, and he actually broke into a local

579
00:27:53.079 --> 00:27:55.839
<v Speaker 1>store and stole several guns and ammunitions.

580
00:27:55.880 --> 00:27:56.359
<v Speaker 2>Oh boy.

581
00:27:56.759 --> 00:27:58.839
<v Speaker 1>He was never actually caught, though he got away with it,

582
00:28:00.400 --> 00:28:04.440
<v Speaker 1>but his obsession got the better of him because at

583
00:28:04.440 --> 00:28:07.039
<v Speaker 1>the age of seventeen, he broke into that same story

584
00:28:07.079 --> 00:28:11.000
<v Speaker 1>again and a neighbor actually found ammunition that he had

585
00:28:11.039 --> 00:28:15.599
<v Speaker 1>stole and reported it to the police. He didn't serve

586
00:28:15.720 --> 00:28:18.119
<v Speaker 1>very long. He was only in jail for a couple

587
00:28:18.119 --> 00:28:20.880
<v Speaker 1>of days he did. It was only like a couple

588
00:28:20.920 --> 00:28:22.599
<v Speaker 1>of days of jail though, as far as I could find,

589
00:28:22.640 --> 00:28:23.599
<v Speaker 1>so it wasn't very long.

590
00:28:24.119 --> 00:28:27.640
<v Speaker 2>But they thought that he just still on ammunition, maybe

591
00:28:27.680 --> 00:28:32.559
<v Speaker 2>not guns too. Wait what the guy that reported him

592
00:28:33.079 --> 00:28:35.839
<v Speaker 2>did he say that he just stole like bullets and

593
00:28:35.839 --> 00:28:36.839
<v Speaker 2>stuff or like guns.

594
00:28:37.160 --> 00:28:40.359
<v Speaker 1>No, he found ammunition and reported him to be the thief,

595
00:28:40.519 --> 00:28:44.160
<v Speaker 1>and so they like, sorry, I.

596
00:28:44.160 --> 00:28:45.160
<v Speaker 2>Was not there. Okay.

597
00:28:46.599 --> 00:28:49.799
<v Speaker 1>So throughout this whole time, the devil kept appearing and

598
00:28:49.880 --> 00:28:52.480
<v Speaker 1>speaking to Victor, trying to get him to sell his

599
00:28:52.640 --> 00:28:56.880
<v Speaker 1>soul and threatening him that if he didn't follow his advice,

600
00:28:57.000 --> 00:29:01.039
<v Speaker 1>he would die a million deaths, like this is some

601
00:29:01.359 --> 00:29:02.039
<v Speaker 1>dark shit.

602
00:29:02.200 --> 00:29:03.559
<v Speaker 2>Well that's pretty terrifying.

603
00:29:04.319 --> 00:29:07.880
<v Speaker 1>Well I can't I starting at the age of six,

604
00:29:08.079 --> 00:29:10.599
<v Speaker 1>is what now been eleven years of this?

605
00:29:12.079 --> 00:29:13.240
<v Speaker 2>Eleven years?

606
00:29:15.519 --> 00:29:18.359
<v Speaker 1>Okay? So Victor also heard from like I said, God

607
00:29:18.440 --> 00:29:22.839
<v Speaker 1>and angels, and God actually promised him that he would

608
00:29:22.880 --> 00:29:25.359
<v Speaker 1>be taken to heaven if he could catch the devil.

609
00:29:26.079 --> 00:29:26.759
<v Speaker 2>Oh.

610
00:29:26.839 --> 00:29:29.119
<v Speaker 1>Victor tried a few times to catch the devil and

611
00:29:29.200 --> 00:29:31.480
<v Speaker 1>managed a few times, but the devil kept getting away.

612
00:29:32.000 --> 00:29:34.039
<v Speaker 1>Once he even had the devil, but he had to

613
00:29:34.079 --> 00:29:36.319
<v Speaker 1>let it go because apparently the stench was just so

614
00:29:36.559 --> 00:29:40.799
<v Speaker 1>bad he couldn't stand it. So he never did end

615
00:29:40.920 --> 00:29:43.160
<v Speaker 1>up actually catching that.

616
00:29:43.160 --> 00:29:44.680
<v Speaker 2>That's like really interesting.

617
00:29:45.319 --> 00:29:49.079
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, so when he was nineteen, he actually tried to

618
00:29:49.119 --> 00:29:54.279
<v Speaker 1>shoot the devil and he was also unsuccessful, which is

619
00:29:54.440 --> 00:29:55.599
<v Speaker 1>just messed.

620
00:29:55.720 --> 00:29:58.440
<v Speaker 2>I'm just like actually feeling like really bad for him.

621
00:29:58.720 --> 00:30:00.160
<v Speaker 1>Oh, he's going through so much.

622
00:30:00.160 --> 00:30:02.400
<v Speaker 2>Like I feel like really bad, like he needed help

623
00:30:02.480 --> 00:30:04.960
<v Speaker 2>that he wasn't getting definitely well.

624
00:30:05.000 --> 00:30:07.039
<v Speaker 1>He even said at one of these times, when he

625
00:30:07.079 --> 00:30:09.400
<v Speaker 1>tried to catch the devil and the devil escaped, the

626
00:30:09.440 --> 00:30:14.119
<v Speaker 1>devil took away Victor's magic from him. Whatever that even means.

627
00:30:15.000 --> 00:30:17.279
<v Speaker 2>Well, maybe it's like zest for life or something.

628
00:30:17.599 --> 00:30:21.920
<v Speaker 1>I don't know. So anyways, on the morning of May

629
00:30:22.000 --> 00:30:26.240
<v Speaker 1>twenty seventh, nineteen sixty seven, his mother heard a shot

630
00:30:26.480 --> 00:30:29.880
<v Speaker 1>and then another shot. She went outside to the fields

631
00:30:29.920 --> 00:30:35.480
<v Speaker 1>where Victor was and she was about halfway there and

632
00:30:35.599 --> 00:30:40.000
<v Speaker 1>she hears him shouting, I shot the devil. She pleaded

633
00:30:40.000 --> 00:30:41.920
<v Speaker 1>with him as she got closer. She's tried to get

634
00:30:41.960 --> 00:30:44.799
<v Speaker 1>closer and closer to him, like don't shoot, don't shoot,

635
00:30:45.039 --> 00:30:47.279
<v Speaker 1>And eventually she did get up to him, and she

636
00:30:47.359 --> 00:30:49.519
<v Speaker 1>got the gun away and took Victor back to the house.

637
00:30:50.640 --> 00:30:53.839
<v Speaker 1>That day was also a little bit different because he

638
00:30:53.960 --> 00:30:57.559
<v Speaker 1>was feeling physically ill from some chemical treatment processes they

639
00:30:57.559 --> 00:31:00.079
<v Speaker 1>would do to treating the grain on the farm. He

640
00:31:00.119 --> 00:31:02.279
<v Speaker 1>had like some burns and stuff on him, so it

641
00:31:02.319 --> 00:31:04.119
<v Speaker 1>could have made him even worse.

642
00:31:04.160 --> 00:31:06.240
<v Speaker 2>Who knows, right, Okay, I thought that was going to

643
00:31:06.319 --> 00:31:07.799
<v Speaker 2>go down worse, but okay.

644
00:31:08.000 --> 00:31:11.640
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, it seems like she could have gotten shot.

645
00:31:11.839 --> 00:31:15.160
<v Speaker 2>He was shooting his siblings or something and didn't realize

646
00:31:15.240 --> 00:31:15.799
<v Speaker 2>or something.

647
00:31:16.359 --> 00:31:19.799
<v Speaker 1>So anyways, a short while after they got back to

648
00:31:19.839 --> 00:31:22.480
<v Speaker 1>the house and he took off in a car and

649
00:31:22.559 --> 00:31:23.240
<v Speaker 1>just drove away.

650
00:31:24.279 --> 00:31:26.839
<v Speaker 2>Oh man, yeah, she needs to stop him.

651
00:31:26.960 --> 00:31:29.279
<v Speaker 1>Well she couldn't. Like she'd gone back to the house

652
00:31:29.319 --> 00:31:30.720
<v Speaker 1>and he just peeled out.

653
00:31:30.839 --> 00:31:31.359
<v Speaker 2>Oh boy.

654
00:31:32.319 --> 00:31:34.240
<v Speaker 1>So immediately as soon as he was gone, though, his

655
00:31:34.359 --> 00:31:36.920
<v Speaker 1>mother and father hid all the guns in the house

656
00:31:37.240 --> 00:31:40.319
<v Speaker 1>because something something's not right at this point. Clearly they

657
00:31:40.359 --> 00:31:43.240
<v Speaker 1>may have not known things are going wrong before, but

658
00:31:43.359 --> 00:31:45.720
<v Speaker 1>now shouting in the middle of a field, I just

659
00:31:45.720 --> 00:31:47.720
<v Speaker 1>shot the devil while firing shots off in the middle

660
00:31:47.720 --> 00:31:49.319
<v Speaker 1>of the air. Something's fucked up.

661
00:31:49.799 --> 00:31:51.319
<v Speaker 2>Something's not quite right here.

662
00:31:51.559 --> 00:31:54.279
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, so they hit all the guns, and thankfully they did,

663
00:31:54.279 --> 00:31:57.319
<v Speaker 1>because half an hour later Victor returned asking where the

664
00:31:57.319 --> 00:31:59.880
<v Speaker 1>guns are, saying, no one's going to get hurt, and

665
00:32:00.000 --> 00:32:02.599
<v Speaker 1>they didn't give him the guns. And he left again

666
00:32:03.279 --> 00:32:07.640
<v Speaker 1>and then came back again. And when he came back again,

667
00:32:08.039 --> 00:32:10.960
<v Speaker 1>he said he wanted to speak to the local pastor.

668
00:32:11.680 --> 00:32:15.640
<v Speaker 2>Oh geez, his poor parents are probably just like freaking out.

669
00:32:15.759 --> 00:32:17.640
<v Speaker 1>Oh I can't imagine that situation.

670
00:32:17.880 --> 00:32:19.920
<v Speaker 2>Oh man, that would be the most stressful shit to

671
00:32:20.000 --> 00:32:20.440
<v Speaker 2>deal with.

672
00:32:21.160 --> 00:32:25.160
<v Speaker 1>So the pastor came to see Victor that afternoon, amongst

673
00:32:25.200 --> 00:32:26.480
<v Speaker 1>all this stress.

674
00:32:26.200 --> 00:32:29.759
<v Speaker 2>I guess, well, of course, he probably fren sped his

675
00:32:29.839 --> 00:32:33.079
<v Speaker 2>ass there. Well, yeah, like, let's get this down to

676
00:32:33.119 --> 00:32:33.720
<v Speaker 2>business here.

677
00:32:33.839 --> 00:32:36.319
<v Speaker 1>Well, and just to kind of get a perspective on

678
00:32:36.359 --> 00:32:37.799
<v Speaker 1>the parents here, I do have a quote from the

679
00:32:37.799 --> 00:32:41.200
<v Speaker 1>father again at this point in time, and he said

680
00:32:41.559 --> 00:32:44.440
<v Speaker 1>that poor guy, I guess he called for help. I

681
00:32:44.440 --> 00:32:47.960
<v Speaker 1>guess he didn't know which way to turn. So he

682
00:32:48.119 --> 00:32:50.240
<v Speaker 1>just the pastor is where he.

683
00:32:50.279 --> 00:32:52.359
<v Speaker 2>Was going, right, So he's going the right way at

684
00:32:52.359 --> 00:32:54.880
<v Speaker 2>that point, yes, yes, So.

685
00:32:54.759 --> 00:32:56.920
<v Speaker 1>While Victor was talking to the pastor, his mom tried

686
00:32:56.960 --> 00:32:59.319
<v Speaker 1>to listen, but she couldn't hear much. The only thing

687
00:32:59.359 --> 00:33:01.200
<v Speaker 1>she did manage to hear was right at the end

688
00:33:01.240 --> 00:33:05.079
<v Speaker 1>of their conversation when the pastor was leaving, and Victor said,

689
00:33:05.319 --> 00:33:08.440
<v Speaker 1>and I quote, I'd like to kill mom.

690
00:33:08.880 --> 00:33:12.359
<v Speaker 2>Oh wow, that's shit that you don't want to hear

691
00:33:12.400 --> 00:33:12.960
<v Speaker 2>from your son.

692
00:33:13.160 --> 00:33:15.319
<v Speaker 1>No kidding, that's.

693
00:33:14.720 --> 00:33:16.200
<v Speaker 2>Oh, that's terrifying.

694
00:33:18.200 --> 00:33:21.240
<v Speaker 1>So the next day Victor was taken to the Saskatchewan

695
00:33:21.279 --> 00:33:24.519
<v Speaker 1>Hospital at North Battleford, which is one hundred and twenty

696
00:33:24.599 --> 00:33:28.799
<v Speaker 1>seven kilometers away. I mean, I props to them for

697
00:33:28.880 --> 00:33:31.039
<v Speaker 1>making it through the night. Yeah, like the next day

698
00:33:31.079 --> 00:33:33.599
<v Speaker 1>that I would have been like, yeah, I don't know

699
00:33:33.640 --> 00:33:35.400
<v Speaker 1>if I can stand next to my son who wants

700
00:33:35.400 --> 00:33:39.799
<v Speaker 1>to shoot me. Yeah. So anyways, they made it there

701
00:33:39.839 --> 00:33:42.599
<v Speaker 1>and the psychiatrist had found Victor to be quote unquote

702
00:33:42.640 --> 00:33:47.799
<v Speaker 1>schizoid in the state of acute schizophrenic reaction, and that

703
00:33:47.839 --> 00:33:49.279
<v Speaker 1>he needed to be hospitalized.

704
00:33:49.839 --> 00:33:52.559
<v Speaker 2>Okay, that's good, though Victor.

705
00:33:52.359 --> 00:33:55.000
<v Speaker 1>He was only getting worse at this point. He clearly

706
00:33:55.079 --> 00:33:57.440
<v Speaker 1>understood his own condition and how bad he was getting

707
00:33:57.440 --> 00:34:01.359
<v Speaker 1>because he voluntarily admitted himself, okay, to the clinic on

708
00:34:01.440 --> 00:34:03.880
<v Speaker 1>May twenty ninth, nineteen sixty seven.

709
00:34:04.160 --> 00:34:07.119
<v Speaker 2>Okay, awesome, that's good. That's a good step.

710
00:34:07.279 --> 00:34:11.400
<v Speaker 1>It is definitely is so when he was admitted, his

711
00:34:11.440 --> 00:34:16.079
<v Speaker 1>state became clear to psychiatrists quickly. He talked to himself periodically,

712
00:34:16.239 --> 00:34:19.599
<v Speaker 1>he laughed when he was alone. He was concerned whether

713
00:34:19.639 --> 00:34:22.559
<v Speaker 1>he was a boy or a girl, because he said

714
00:34:22.559 --> 00:34:24.760
<v Speaker 1>the devil put another brain in his body as a

715
00:34:24.800 --> 00:34:27.760
<v Speaker 1>special kind of punishment for refusing to sell his soul.

716
00:34:28.400 --> 00:34:28.760
<v Speaker 2>Wow.

717
00:34:28.920 --> 00:34:30.920
<v Speaker 1>And the brain was said to belong to a girl

718
00:34:31.000 --> 00:34:34.519
<v Speaker 1>named Denise, who now wanted to take over his body

719
00:34:34.599 --> 00:34:37.199
<v Speaker 1>in order for her to become herself. Again.

720
00:34:37.760 --> 00:34:39.840
<v Speaker 2>Wow, that's wild.

721
00:34:40.199 --> 00:34:44.599
<v Speaker 1>He also complained of stomach cramps and burning sensations, and

722
00:34:45.079 --> 00:34:48.920
<v Speaker 1>the hospital said he would masturbate daily, which I think

723
00:34:48.960 --> 00:34:51.559
<v Speaker 1>that's just a young man's thing. I don't think that's

724
00:34:52.679 --> 00:34:55.360
<v Speaker 1>anything to be concerned about. That's normal health, I think.

725
00:34:55.599 --> 00:34:58.079
<v Speaker 2>Okay, no comment.

726
00:34:58.719 --> 00:35:02.320
<v Speaker 1>Anyways, moving on. So, because of all this though, Victor

727
00:35:02.360 --> 00:35:08.159
<v Speaker 1>said he wanted an I quote eternity of death. He

728
00:35:08.280 --> 00:35:09.559
<v Speaker 1>just wanted it all to end.

729
00:35:09.920 --> 00:35:12.320
<v Speaker 2>Okay, Oh man, the poor thing. Really.

730
00:35:12.800 --> 00:35:16.000
<v Speaker 1>Uh it's just crazy what he's going through.

731
00:35:16.159 --> 00:35:18.840
<v Speaker 2>I can't that's so young because at this point, okay,

732
00:35:18.920 --> 00:35:21.800
<v Speaker 2>is he like seventeen there? M not sure.

733
00:35:22.000 --> 00:35:24.119
<v Speaker 1>Well, nineteen sixty seven are.

734
00:35:24.079 --> 00:35:25.159
<v Speaker 2>Oh that's older.

735
00:35:25.400 --> 00:35:28.760
<v Speaker 1>I think he might be twenty twenty one, somewhere in there.

736
00:35:28.880 --> 00:35:33.440
<v Speaker 2>Still quite young. Yes, oh boy, that's like quite the life.

737
00:35:33.599 --> 00:35:37.079
<v Speaker 1>It's I don't know if that is a life. Well yeah,

738
00:35:37.119 --> 00:35:41.719
<v Speaker 1>frig So he reported his visions and encounters to the doctors,

739
00:35:41.840 --> 00:35:43.880
<v Speaker 1>but he was told they weren't real and they were

740
00:35:43.920 --> 00:35:45.800
<v Speaker 1>only in his head. But of course, you know, Victor

741
00:35:45.800 --> 00:35:47.800
<v Speaker 1>fought that. He's like, no, like I fought the devil

742
00:35:47.800 --> 00:35:50.400
<v Speaker 1>one point, I touched the angels and touched the devil

743
00:35:50.400 --> 00:35:51.079
<v Speaker 1>like it's real.

744
00:35:51.360 --> 00:35:53.119
<v Speaker 2>It feels so real to him.

745
00:35:53.480 --> 00:35:56.280
<v Speaker 1>But he quickly came to realize that if he kept

746
00:35:56.320 --> 00:35:58.440
<v Speaker 1>saying this, he would never get out of the hospital.

747
00:35:59.079 --> 00:36:03.360
<v Speaker 2>Oh no, oh, so maybe they weren't handling this.

748
00:36:03.400 --> 00:36:06.400
<v Speaker 1>Right then, Oh, the hospital definitely wasn't handling this right.

749
00:36:07.480 --> 00:36:10.320
<v Speaker 1>We're getting into that. Don't worry, don't worry.

750
00:36:10.400 --> 00:36:11.079
<v Speaker 2>Yeah.

751
00:36:11.280 --> 00:36:16.480
<v Speaker 1>So he was diagnosed with schizophrenic disorder, chronic with uncontrolled

752
00:36:16.519 --> 00:36:20.920
<v Speaker 1>symptoms and severe social handicaps. He was started on a

753
00:36:20.960 --> 00:36:28.360
<v Speaker 1>series of twelve ECT twelve etcs, tranquilizers, occupational therapy, and

754
00:36:28.440 --> 00:36:34.239
<v Speaker 1>supportive psychotherapy. So to clarify, though, the ECT is electroconclude

755
00:36:35.199 --> 00:36:43.360
<v Speaker 1>electroconvulsive therapy also referred to as electro electroshock therapy. What so,

756
00:36:43.480 --> 00:36:45.679
<v Speaker 1>I did read up a little bit on electroshock, and

757
00:36:45.679 --> 00:36:48.119
<v Speaker 1>it's not as bad as movies portray it to be. Okay,

758
00:36:49.079 --> 00:36:52.000
<v Speaker 1>though it still is is not a good thing.

759
00:36:52.159 --> 00:36:54.519
<v Speaker 2>It's not what he needed, that's for sure, right.

760
00:36:54.599 --> 00:36:59.360
<v Speaker 1>Well, electroshock therapy it's a procedure to use to treat

761
00:36:59.400 --> 00:37:03.800
<v Speaker 1>like depression and maybe use for people have symptoms symptoms

762
00:37:03.840 --> 00:37:09.519
<v Speaker 1>of delusions, hallucinations, thoughts. It's electrical stimulation which lasts up

763
00:37:09.519 --> 00:37:13.440
<v Speaker 1>to eight seconds that produces a short seizure, but because

764
00:37:13.480 --> 00:37:20.159
<v Speaker 1>of anesthesia, the seizure actively doesn't like actually cause the convulsions.

765
00:37:21.280 --> 00:37:25.280
<v Speaker 1>It's not known exactly how the brain stimulates the treatment

766
00:37:25.480 --> 00:37:28.559
<v Speaker 1>like correlates between the two, but apparently it's like supposed

767
00:37:28.599 --> 00:37:32.920
<v Speaker 1>to help the brain chemicals or neurotransmitters or something. But

768
00:37:32.960 --> 00:37:35.400
<v Speaker 1>it's still it's usually like against people's will.

769
00:37:35.719 --> 00:37:38.159
<v Speaker 2>And it's I wonder, I don't.

770
00:37:37.960 --> 00:37:40.400
<v Speaker 1>Think so or if it is very rare cases, but

771
00:37:40.480 --> 00:37:44.559
<v Speaker 1>it's very controversial treatment. But it doesn't sound as bad

772
00:37:44.559 --> 00:37:47.840
<v Speaker 1>as movies make it seem. So sorry, I stumbled through

773
00:37:47.840 --> 00:37:51.119
<v Speaker 1>that that was like medical copy and paste.

774
00:37:50.960 --> 00:37:53.079
<v Speaker 2>Trying to read that we knew what you were saying

775
00:37:53.719 --> 00:37:55.960
<v Speaker 2>there so after.

776
00:37:55.760 --> 00:38:01.840
<v Speaker 1>His second etc. Treatment, there was improvement. He was more pleasant,

777
00:38:01.920 --> 00:38:03.599
<v Speaker 1>less withdrawn, but still delusional.

778
00:38:03.880 --> 00:38:08.280
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, but he's faking it, not.

779
00:38:08.199 --> 00:38:12.000
<v Speaker 1>Really, he's just not being as open and honest maybe,

780
00:38:12.880 --> 00:38:16.760
<v Speaker 1>but he's definitely not faking anything. So after his fifth treatment,

781
00:38:16.800 --> 00:38:19.639
<v Speaker 1>he was more cooperative and social and stated that his

782
00:38:19.840 --> 00:38:21.800
<v Speaker 1>ideas of seeing the devil and talking to them were

783
00:38:21.800 --> 00:38:25.199
<v Speaker 1>probably just his imagination. But he did say he still

784
00:38:25.199 --> 00:38:26.320
<v Speaker 1>had magic powers.

785
00:38:27.199 --> 00:38:28.199
<v Speaker 2>Those weren't going away.

786
00:38:28.400 --> 00:38:31.639
<v Speaker 1>No, no, ect can't take away the magic.

787
00:38:31.880 --> 00:38:33.840
<v Speaker 2>No, definitely magic powers. You're keeping those.

788
00:38:33.960 --> 00:38:38.440
<v Speaker 1>Yep. Dance magic dance. Sorry. Anyways, after his ninth treatment,

789
00:38:38.880 --> 00:38:42.719
<v Speaker 1>not much would changed, but he did claim like he

790
00:38:42.840 --> 00:38:48.760
<v Speaker 1>was his usual self. So his twelfth treatment he was

791
00:38:48.840 --> 00:38:51.440
<v Speaker 1>doubtful about all the devil and all the angel and

792
00:38:51.480 --> 00:38:54.480
<v Speaker 1>all that stuff. He still believed that at times the

793
00:38:54.480 --> 00:38:57.360
<v Speaker 1>Black Devil was with him, and he said that if

794
00:38:57.360 --> 00:39:00.679
<v Speaker 1>he was discharged, he would try again to catch and

795
00:39:00.719 --> 00:39:01.480
<v Speaker 1>destroy the devil.

796
00:39:03.280 --> 00:39:05.519
<v Speaker 2>So that doesn't seem like he's really healed at all.

797
00:39:05.719 --> 00:39:07.960
<v Speaker 1>Not really, he's not really at all.

798
00:39:08.039 --> 00:39:11.119
<v Speaker 2>Because yeah, that doesn't seem like that's really healed at all. Yea,

799
00:39:11.599 --> 00:39:12.679
<v Speaker 2>even remotely.

800
00:39:12.800 --> 00:39:15.760
<v Speaker 1>But in Victor's mind, he'd never been more ready to

801
00:39:15.760 --> 00:39:19.840
<v Speaker 1>go home and enjoy his life. So her main cooperative, pleasant, sociable,

802
00:39:19.920 --> 00:39:24.039
<v Speaker 1>all that sort of stuff. He was a little bit sclusive. Still,

803
00:39:26.000 --> 00:39:27.800
<v Speaker 1>they did let him out, let him out. They did

804
00:39:27.840 --> 00:39:29.159
<v Speaker 1>let him out.

805
00:39:29.079 --> 00:39:30.920
<v Speaker 2>Even though he was still saying that he was seeing

806
00:39:31.000 --> 00:39:31.519
<v Speaker 2>the devil.

807
00:39:32.280 --> 00:39:35.199
<v Speaker 1>Yes, what okay, so we're a little bit ahead here,

808
00:39:35.280 --> 00:39:39.679
<v Speaker 1>let me just catch up O. So killing was however,

809
00:39:39.719 --> 00:39:42.599
<v Speaker 1>still in his mind he thought of siblings as being dead,

810
00:39:42.760 --> 00:39:47.599
<v Speaker 1>killing his parents, classmates. To be clear, though, all these

811
00:39:47.639 --> 00:39:50.519
<v Speaker 1>times that he does want to kill, he doesn't want

812
00:39:50.599 --> 00:39:53.000
<v Speaker 1>to kill. It's just an urge to kill. It's not

813
00:39:53.039 --> 00:39:55.199
<v Speaker 1>that these people deserve to die or he wants to

814
00:39:55.280 --> 00:39:59.159
<v Speaker 1>kill him. It's just this overwhelming like sensation that he

815
00:39:59.280 --> 00:39:59.880
<v Speaker 1>needs to kill.

816
00:40:00.119 --> 00:40:03.639
<v Speaker 2>That's a lot of serial killers, yes, and murderers and stuff.

817
00:40:03.679 --> 00:40:06.920
<v Speaker 2>They'd have this urge, yes, and they act on it.

818
00:40:07.519 --> 00:40:09.840
<v Speaker 1>So he just knew he felt the urge to kill someone,

819
00:40:09.880 --> 00:40:12.440
<v Speaker 1>but he had no reason too, but it was there.

820
00:40:13.480 --> 00:40:18.119
<v Speaker 1>So the psychiatrist told Victor's father he was schizophrenic. Schizophrenic

821
00:40:18.159 --> 00:40:19.039
<v Speaker 1>but not too bad.

822
00:40:20.239 --> 00:40:23.800
<v Speaker 2>Fuck that yeah, holy frig he asked.

823
00:40:24.239 --> 00:40:26.239
<v Speaker 1>He asked the doctor how long until Victor be able

824
00:40:26.239 --> 00:40:28.400
<v Speaker 1>to come home? And the doctor said maybe a year

825
00:40:28.519 --> 00:40:32.079
<v Speaker 1>or two and he'll be as good as ever. However,

826
00:40:32.159 --> 00:40:35.239
<v Speaker 1>July twenty sixth, nineteen sixty seven, only two months after

827
00:40:35.280 --> 00:40:39.639
<v Speaker 1>he was admitted, Victor was discharged to his family. Why

828
00:40:41.000 --> 00:40:42.760
<v Speaker 1>I don't know, because the doctor's a dick.

829
00:40:43.480 --> 00:40:45.800
<v Speaker 2>Two months when at one point he told his father

830
00:40:45.840 --> 00:40:47.679
<v Speaker 2>that it was going to be like a year or two. Yep,

831
00:40:47.760 --> 00:40:49.360
<v Speaker 2>they probably just didn't want to deal with him anymore.

832
00:40:49.360 --> 00:40:49.719
<v Speaker 1>I don't know.

833
00:40:49.760 --> 00:40:52.800
<v Speaker 2>Probably I thought they couldn't do any better or whatever.

834
00:40:53.159 --> 00:40:57.800
<v Speaker 1>That's baloney, But this seems like it's a common theme

835
00:40:58.159 --> 00:41:03.280
<v Speaker 1>where just people aren't taken seriously, their conditions aren't taken seriously,

836
00:41:03.280 --> 00:41:06.800
<v Speaker 1>whether they should be released sooner or later. It seems

837
00:41:06.840 --> 00:41:11.000
<v Speaker 1>like just mental illness has never never taken as quite

838
00:41:11.000 --> 00:41:12.039
<v Speaker 1>as serious as it should be.

839
00:41:13.079 --> 00:41:14.800
<v Speaker 2>Well, especially back back in the day.

840
00:41:14.960 --> 00:41:18.400
<v Speaker 1>Oh definitely. So he was released with some medication though,

841
00:41:18.480 --> 00:41:21.679
<v Speaker 1>to be clear, to help him recover. You know, just

842
00:41:21.719 --> 00:41:24.400
<v Speaker 1>that little little good good in your system, right to go,

843
00:41:24.440 --> 00:41:27.880
<v Speaker 1>I'm sure, Oh exactly, a couple little you know, tic.

844
00:41:27.719 --> 00:41:29.960
<v Speaker 2>TACs and you're good solid.

845
00:41:31.039 --> 00:41:33.159
<v Speaker 1>So when he came home from the hospital, Victor knew

846
00:41:33.199 --> 00:41:36.119
<v Speaker 1>something was going to happen to him. Oh, gosh, like

847
00:41:36.199 --> 00:41:36.960
<v Speaker 1>right away.

848
00:41:37.719 --> 00:41:40.159
<v Speaker 2>Oh gosh, it's already just like a big mistake.

849
00:41:40.400 --> 00:41:42.480
<v Speaker 1>In the hospital, a patient even told him that he

850
00:41:42.519 --> 00:41:45.519
<v Speaker 1>was going to commit murder three weeks after being discharged.

851
00:41:46.079 --> 00:41:48.639
<v Speaker 1>The boy Victor thought must have had visions or something,

852
00:41:48.679 --> 00:41:52.039
<v Speaker 1>because Victor had visions and stuff too. Right, yeah, like

853
00:41:52.079 --> 00:41:55.840
<v Speaker 1>this this guy knows something. He believed him. He's like,

854
00:41:55.880 --> 00:41:56.880
<v Speaker 1>it's reading the future.

855
00:41:57.239 --> 00:41:58.960
<v Speaker 2>What's in my head right now? I'm like, how many

856
00:41:58.960 --> 00:42:00.239
<v Speaker 2>more cats are going to get.

857
00:42:01.719 --> 00:42:02.920
<v Speaker 1>Well, we're not looking at cats.

858
00:42:03.039 --> 00:42:04.800
<v Speaker 2>I know where we're done with the cats, but I

859
00:42:04.920 --> 00:42:06.480
<v Speaker 2>still can't get over the cats.

860
00:42:06.719 --> 00:42:08.639
<v Speaker 1>So he was glad to be home. It was hard

861
00:42:08.639 --> 00:42:10.280
<v Speaker 1>to get used to the farming again. You know, he's

862
00:42:10.280 --> 00:42:12.639
<v Speaker 1>a little bit weary entire, but he was. He was happy.

863
00:42:14.079 --> 00:42:18.199
<v Speaker 1>He started being without his medication about August eighth. Victor

864
00:42:18.239 --> 00:42:21.000
<v Speaker 1>felt like he was fine till August eleventh. Okay, and

865
00:42:21.039 --> 00:42:24.000
<v Speaker 1>this is only like two weeks after being discharged.

866
00:42:23.519 --> 00:42:26.039
<v Speaker 2>Right like that? Did they not say this medication was

867
00:42:26.039 --> 00:42:27.679
<v Speaker 2>like life for life?

868
00:42:27.920 --> 00:42:30.880
<v Speaker 1>I don't know. I don't think so. And I'm sure

869
00:42:30.920 --> 00:42:32.320
<v Speaker 1>back then they probably didn't even care.

870
00:42:32.559 --> 00:42:35.519
<v Speaker 2>No, no, you're good to go. If you feel okay,

871
00:42:35.599 --> 00:42:36.000
<v Speaker 2>you're good.

872
00:42:36.159 --> 00:42:39.760
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, And around August eleventh, when things didn't quite feel right,

873
00:42:40.239 --> 00:42:43.239
<v Speaker 1>Victor knew that something was up. He's like, I'm either

874
00:42:43.239 --> 00:42:45.000
<v Speaker 1>going to go to jail or back to that hospital.

875
00:42:45.119 --> 00:42:46.639
<v Speaker 1>And he didn't want to go back to that hospital

876
00:42:46.639 --> 00:42:51.920
<v Speaker 1>because he didn't like that electric electric shock therapy. So anyways,

877
00:42:52.360 --> 00:42:55.920
<v Speaker 1>every day after August eleventh, he would imagine killing someone again.

878
00:42:56.000 --> 00:42:59.119
<v Speaker 1>Oh no, he just wanted to kill He wanted to

879
00:42:59.199 --> 00:42:59.920
<v Speaker 1>kill his brothers.

880
00:43:00.159 --> 00:43:03.760
<v Speaker 2>Oh no, oh no, you know, but he didn't so oh,

881
00:43:03.800 --> 00:43:05.679
<v Speaker 2>I was just so, I just need to know who's

882
00:43:05.719 --> 00:43:09.400
<v Speaker 2>going to die? Is that too much to ask?

883
00:43:09.440 --> 00:43:13.519
<v Speaker 1>It's coming, It's coming. He confessed to his friends that

884
00:43:13.719 --> 00:43:18.000
<v Speaker 1>day that he wanted to kill somebody, and you know,

885
00:43:18.079 --> 00:43:20.440
<v Speaker 1>his friends are just like, you don't seem like the type.

886
00:43:21.760 --> 00:43:23.360
<v Speaker 1>That's it. You don't seem like.

887
00:43:23.280 --> 00:43:27.599
<v Speaker 2>The type, okay, but honestly, like, legitimately, your friends would

888
00:43:27.639 --> 00:43:30.480
<v Speaker 2>probably never think that. You would, like, if I admitted

889
00:43:30.480 --> 00:43:32.960
<v Speaker 2>something like that, I think my friends would be like, no,

890
00:43:34.159 --> 00:43:38.880
<v Speaker 2>I mean some leading up ship to it. Yeah, he

891
00:43:38.960 --> 00:43:40.440
<v Speaker 2>was in a mental facility.

892
00:43:40.360 --> 00:43:43.719
<v Speaker 1>But yeah, he just came out of a mental facility

893
00:43:43.840 --> 00:43:46.159
<v Speaker 1>and he's confessing to you he wants to kill someone,

894
00:43:46.199 --> 00:43:48.119
<v Speaker 1>and you're like, nah, you're not the type.

895
00:43:48.320 --> 00:43:50.960
<v Speaker 2>And yeah, you're just in there for kind of having

896
00:43:50.960 --> 00:43:53.079
<v Speaker 2>those urges and seeing the devil and weird shit.

897
00:43:53.199 --> 00:43:55.199
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, that's a little bit. That's a little bit sketch

898
00:43:55.280 --> 00:44:00.480
<v Speaker 1>right there. So yeah, Victor couldn't sleep though killing was

899
00:44:00.519 --> 00:44:04.239
<v Speaker 1>on his mind, thoughts that maybe he could kill might

900
00:44:04.320 --> 00:44:07.800
<v Speaker 1>bring him closer to the devil. Why that thought was there.

901
00:44:07.840 --> 00:44:09.760
<v Speaker 1>He didn't want to be closer to the devil, but

902
00:44:09.800 --> 00:44:12.800
<v Speaker 1>that thought was there.

903
00:44:11.960 --> 00:44:13.480
<v Speaker 2>So he couldn't get rid of it.

904
00:44:13.519 --> 00:44:15.880
<v Speaker 1>He couldn't shake it, couldn't shake it. Victor spent the

905
00:44:15.960 --> 00:44:18.440
<v Speaker 1>day of August fourteenth on the tractor, and at about

906
00:44:18.519 --> 00:44:20.639
<v Speaker 1>nine thirty pm that day, he lay on the couch

907
00:44:20.679 --> 00:44:23.679
<v Speaker 1>and fell asleep. His parents woke him up at about

908
00:44:23.760 --> 00:44:25.559
<v Speaker 1>nine thirty to go to bed, you know, get off

909
00:44:25.559 --> 00:44:28.199
<v Speaker 1>the couch, go to bed. But he couldn't fall asleep again,

910
00:44:28.760 --> 00:44:33.119
<v Speaker 1>and he began to imagine things so to keep himself occupied.

911
00:44:33.159 --> 00:44:35.960
<v Speaker 1>Instead of imagining these things and laying in bed, he

912
00:44:36.000 --> 00:44:37.800
<v Speaker 1>went to the garage and worked in the garage for

913
00:44:37.840 --> 00:44:40.719
<v Speaker 1>about an hour. Found he couldn't work anymore, you know,

914
00:44:40.760 --> 00:44:43.880
<v Speaker 1>he was too preoccupied in his mind and physically tired.

915
00:44:43.920 --> 00:44:47.880
<v Speaker 1>He's still recovering from the hospital. Right. Yeah, I was

916
00:44:47.920 --> 00:44:51.599
<v Speaker 1>about to say mental facility. That's not politically correct. My bad.

917
00:44:53.079 --> 00:44:55.079
<v Speaker 1>He paced up and down when suddenly he had a

918
00:44:55.119 --> 00:44:58.199
<v Speaker 1>strange feeling on the right side of his head. It

919
00:44:58.280 --> 00:45:00.840
<v Speaker 1>felt as if his whole body he had been cut

920
00:45:00.840 --> 00:45:07.119
<v Speaker 1>in half and something had left him. There was no pain, Wow,

921
00:45:07.199 --> 00:45:10.760
<v Speaker 1>it was more pleasure. And there was a very strong

922
00:45:11.000 --> 00:45:12.760
<v Speaker 1>impulse to kill.

923
00:45:14.639 --> 00:45:17.599
<v Speaker 2>Okay, like even stronger than the shit.

924
00:45:17.480 --> 00:45:20.320
<v Speaker 1>He was already dealing with, even stronger than before. With

925
00:45:20.400 --> 00:45:23.199
<v Speaker 1>this like, oh my gosh, be cut in half feeling,

926
00:45:23.280 --> 00:45:24.599
<v Speaker 1>it just overwhelmed him.

927
00:45:24.480 --> 00:45:26.519
<v Speaker 2>Because I'm like, keep working in the garage. That's good,

928
00:45:26.599 --> 00:45:27.280
<v Speaker 2>just keep your mind.

929
00:45:27.639 --> 00:45:30.519
<v Speaker 1>He didn't keep working in the garage. He gassed up

930
00:45:30.559 --> 00:45:33.840
<v Speaker 1>his car, Yeah, loaded up his twenty two caliber rifle,

931
00:45:34.480 --> 00:45:35.280
<v Speaker 1>and drove off.

932
00:45:35.519 --> 00:45:36.480
<v Speaker 2>Nice love it.

933
00:45:37.920 --> 00:45:40.960
<v Speaker 1>As he drove past lots of houses, he felt the

934
00:45:41.119 --> 00:45:43.760
<v Speaker 1>urge to stop at each one of them he passed,

935
00:45:44.840 --> 00:45:49.079
<v Speaker 1>so those lucky molphos was lucky moos, And every house

936
00:45:49.119 --> 00:45:52.239
<v Speaker 1>he passed, urge kept getting stronger. But he kept keeping

937
00:45:52.440 --> 00:45:53.400
<v Speaker 1>kept driving.

938
00:45:53.519 --> 00:45:55.039
<v Speaker 2>And this is like the night time, in the middle

939
00:45:55.039 --> 00:45:55.440
<v Speaker 2>of the night.

940
00:45:55.800 --> 00:45:56.920
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, this is about two in the morning.

941
00:45:57.000 --> 00:46:01.440
<v Speaker 2>Or see, okay, it's poor people so he ended.

942
00:46:01.320 --> 00:46:06.000
<v Speaker 1>Up coming to a farmhouse. Whether urge was particularly strong,

943
00:46:06.639 --> 00:46:09.480
<v Speaker 1>and the voice in his head told him, this is it.

944
00:46:10.360 --> 00:46:14.280
<v Speaker 1>This is where you have to go and do it.

945
00:46:14.320 --> 00:46:17.360
<v Speaker 1>So unlike those other houses, Victor turned into the driveway,

946
00:46:18.119 --> 00:46:23.039
<v Speaker 1>stopped his car, got out, picked up his gun, and

947
00:46:23.119 --> 00:46:24.719
<v Speaker 1>went inside.

948
00:46:24.920 --> 00:46:26.599
<v Speaker 2>I just had to like look away from you. It's

949
00:46:26.599 --> 00:46:28.880
<v Speaker 2>like a horror movie that you have to like look away.

950
00:46:28.639 --> 00:46:31.920
<v Speaker 1>From You're saying, I'm a horror movie, like a train wreck.

951
00:46:31.960 --> 00:46:35.559
<v Speaker 2>You can't look at me than what you're presenting. I'm

952
00:46:35.599 --> 00:46:38.039
<v Speaker 2>just like, I can't look. I can't look, even though

953
00:46:38.079 --> 00:46:39.280
<v Speaker 2>I need to be covered my ears.

954
00:46:40.239 --> 00:46:42.880
<v Speaker 1>So he approached the house of the gun, and when

955
00:46:42.920 --> 00:46:45.079
<v Speaker 1>he entered the house, he recognized the kitchen.

956
00:46:45.639 --> 00:46:48.320
<v Speaker 2>He recognized the kitchen he had seen it in a dream.

957
00:46:49.199 --> 00:46:50.559
<v Speaker 2>Oh weird shit.

958
00:46:51.760 --> 00:46:56.840
<v Speaker 1>But that thought was cut short. He was cut short

959
00:46:56.880 --> 00:46:59.039
<v Speaker 1>by the sound of a man shouting who is it?

960
00:47:00.159 --> 00:47:03.199
<v Speaker 1>Inside the house was the family known as the Peterson's.

961
00:47:04.000 --> 00:47:07.159
<v Speaker 1>The man who is speaking was the father, James Peterson.

962
00:47:08.760 --> 00:47:11.159
<v Speaker 1>And we're gonna end the episode here. We we're gonna

963
00:47:11.199 --> 00:47:15.320
<v Speaker 1>do a second part for this boom. So if you

964
00:47:15.320 --> 00:47:17.800
<v Speaker 1>want to hear the second part to this episode, we're

965
00:47:17.800 --> 00:47:20.639
<v Speaker 1>gonna drop it. We like tomorrow. We're not gonna make it.

966
00:47:20.800 --> 00:47:22.280
<v Speaker 2>Oh no, we can't make them wait a week.

967
00:47:22.320 --> 00:47:23.679
<v Speaker 1>That would be mean, to be brutal.

968
00:47:23.840 --> 00:47:24.840
<v Speaker 2>That'd be so rude.

969
00:47:25.079 --> 00:47:29.519
<v Speaker 1>So that is the whole leading up to the massacre.

970
00:47:29.840 --> 00:47:32.239
<v Speaker 1>Drop it on Thursday, Michelle Lake massacre.

971
00:47:32.840 --> 00:47:34.519
<v Speaker 2>What we could drop it on Thursday?

972
00:47:34.800 --> 00:47:36.880
<v Speaker 1>That's just me. We'll drop it tomorrow. We can do

973
00:47:36.880 --> 00:47:39.760
<v Speaker 1>it tomorrow. You really want to make them wait an

974
00:47:39.760 --> 00:47:40.320
<v Speaker 1>extra day?

975
00:47:40.360 --> 00:47:43.320
<v Speaker 2>Wow, you're making me look like an asshole. You're like one.

976
00:47:43.760 --> 00:47:47.320
<v Speaker 1>I mean, I gotta get some Brownie points anyway I can. Right,

977
00:47:47.440 --> 00:47:50.679
<v Speaker 1>you need points always. Brownie points are a good thing

978
00:47:50.679 --> 00:47:54.639
<v Speaker 1>to collect. Okay, So the next episode will be tomorrow

979
00:47:54.679 --> 00:47:57.400
<v Speaker 1>and it'll be the second part to this. And you

980
00:47:57.480 --> 00:48:00.000
<v Speaker 1>learned all about the backstory. Now it's into the murder.

981
00:48:00.280 --> 00:48:02.519
<v Speaker 2>Wow, shit's gonna go.

982
00:48:02.679 --> 00:48:05.480
<v Speaker 1>Dang it is so you guys, Thank you for being here.

983
00:48:05.519 --> 00:48:08.800
<v Speaker 1>Thank you for giving us so much support. The ten

984
00:48:08.960 --> 00:48:13.639
<v Speaker 1>thousand downloads, the like six hundred of you who are

985
00:48:13.679 --> 00:48:15.239
<v Speaker 1>actively listening. You guys are.

986
00:48:15.079 --> 00:48:19.480
<v Speaker 2>Insane, amazing people it love it, love it. Appreciate you

987
00:48:20.280 --> 00:48:22.880
<v Speaker 2>until Wednesday. Stay wicked. You