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support me there. And I just want to thank everyone.

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It's because of you that I can put out the

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amount of material that I do. I can do what

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I'm doing with doctor Johnson on two hundred Years Together

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and everything else, the things that Thomas and I are

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doing together on kindinal philosophy, it's all because of you.

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And yeah, I mean, I'll never be able to thank

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you enough. So thank you. The pekan Yonashow dot com.

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Everything's there. I want to welcome everyone back to the

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Peking Yona's show. Kurt from Anelope Pills here. How you doing, Kurt?

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Speaker 2: Hey, I'm doing well. Thanks for having me having me back.

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I think I believe I was here a couple of

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months ago, although I can't recall precisely.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I've I've had three or four guys now from

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analopeil On. We always have good discussions because we're talking about, uh,

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you know one of my favorite topics, which is broadly

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speaking books, and uh, it's no different this time. So

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what's it is? It been a year now that you

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put you put out this book, Geibel's Battle for Brulin.

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Speaker 2: Battle for Ruin. It's been out for a while. It's

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it's been long enough that I've lost track of exactly

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where it is in the in the releases list, So uh,

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six months a year, I'm not sure exactly, but yeah,

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we've headed out for quite a bit.

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Speaker 1: Cool. Well, I'm glad to finally get to talking about

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it because the guys sent me a copy when it dropped,

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and yeah, immediately jumped into it because I think you

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guys are the ones who put it into English, right,

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I think the there was French version, there was obviously

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a Jarman version. How many other is that it is

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that the ones you're aware of.

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Speaker 2: I'm not sure off the top of my head, but

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this is definitely the first English version, or at least

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the first professionally done English version. That's the case with

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most of our translations. If there is an English version,

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oftentimes there will be one that's available online that's, you know,

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machine translated, something like that. Generally, if something's already in English,

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we won't bother with it unless it's something we think

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is really important to have republished for some reason.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, and this does tell a great story from the

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pen of the man himself. So why don't you give

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us a give us an introduction into you know, well,

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first of all, why did Antelope Hill think that this

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was so important to publish? And then you guys start

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getting into it.

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Speaker 2: Sure, well, we've had a few books on this sort

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of topic within sort of Third Reich studies or Third

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Reich literature. The time period of well, in between the

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beer Hall Putsch and the actual rise of power, it

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tends to get glossed over in popular history. What most

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people know about it is that there was the first

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attempt in twenty three with the beer Hall Putsch and

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Hitler gets arrested, and then he gets out, and then

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he comes to power. Sort of as simple as that,

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as far as most people are concerned. What they don't

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know as much about is the mechanics of exactly how

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that transpired, how they were able to come back from

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their leader being arrested for treason, the party being banned,

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large parts of it breaking off into splinter groups or

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local organization, or people just getting disheartened and going home,

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and then managing to whip it back into shape and

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actually rise to be the largest party in Germany. Of course,

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this was no easy task, and even before the beer

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hall push, It's worth keeping in mind that the NSDAP

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was basically a regional party. Its real strength was in

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Bavaria and almost nowhere else. They had some local party

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chapters in other places, but they were insignificant. The Bavarian

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party was really the core of it. Goebbels, of course,

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he actually he doesn't start off in Berlin or in Bavaria.

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His real claim to fame before he moves to the

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Berlin party is organizing in the Rhineland. The Rhineland, of course,

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was very heavily proletarian. It's the most industrial part of

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Germany was actually the scene of quite a few left

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wing uprisings in the twenties, and so that was its

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own whole battle, one that I'd like to do a

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book about sometime in the future, but sadly I haven't

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found anything good yet. So when he moves to Berlin,

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the party has already made sort of a comeback, It's

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exploded in popularity, right. But Berlin itself is sort of

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the crown jewel missing from the NSDAP's crown breaking into

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Berlin of course, just being the political capital, the forces

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of the state, of the security apparatus of the other parties,

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they're very strong in Berlin, and Berlin's also heavily proletarian

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as well. The left wing movements, they are very strong.

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Berlin is really seen as a red stronghold, and so

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coming in and cracking that. Uh, Obviously, they sort of

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select Goebbels because he's got a proven track record from

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his work in the Rhineland, and Berlin really becomes the

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toughest fight of all of them. And I think that's

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why we like to focus on the Berlin aspect of

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the Rise to Power. And uh, this is I think

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our our third or fourth book that's pretty heavily focused

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on Berlin as the scene of the heaviest political fighting

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in this time period.

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Speaker 1: Well, the you know, Berlin is normally described as like

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the political, economic, and cultural center of Germany. And yeah,

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at that time, the book points out that it wasn't

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a it wasn't a homogeneous city, but that is you know,

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when we talk about cities not being homogeneous, now we're

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talking about something much different. Berlin was mostly people except

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for people who had come in from the outside. Most

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of the people in Berlin were Germans, just from different

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parts of the country. Just like any any large country

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that has big cities, people from people from all over

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are going to flocks at them. That's correct, right.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, absolutely, Berlin is the political capital, of course, since

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eighteen seventy one seventy two, the capital of the United Germany.

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It transformed very rapidly, and it brought in people from

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all across Germany, like you noted, a lot of or

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an expanding proletariat, as well as of course political leads

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from all over, financial elites from all over also, the

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it was really the hub of national media, and Goebels

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points this out that the pace of the media environment

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in Berlin moves much faster than anywhere else, probably compare

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New York City somewhat in this respect, and that causes

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certain problems for them and also certain opportunities. But they

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really have to change their tactics to keep up with

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how fast paced Berlin as a city, and how the

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people there aren't really as rooted as in other places,

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even the Rhineland. Gogel's notes, well, the Ryeland was rapidly industrializing,

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rapidly growing, challenging in that way. Most of the working

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class in the Rhineland were sort of first or second generation,

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coming out of the peasant classes, whereas Berlin is being

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much more cosmopolitan, much more or bourgeois in certain ways.

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It's sort of a whole new world that he has

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to adjust to.

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Speaker 1: Well, when he gets there, he has to mobilize for support,

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and he describes like three groups supporters, bystanders, and opponents.

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He says, basically, supporters you're there for to offer them inspiration,

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Provocation is ord used for bystanders, and threats to opponents.

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Considering how revolutionary it was at the time, the Communist

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Party Deutschland was, probably how much bigger would you say

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it was at this point? Than the NSCAP was.

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Speaker 2: You know, I think they might have already eclipsed them

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in total numbers nationwide. But Communist support was heavily localized

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in the industrial areas, and Lynn was and was an

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industrial center itself, in addition to just being the political center.

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And in Berlin they were very powerful. When when Goebels

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shows up, at least by by his account and by

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some of the accounts and other books we published, the

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local n SDAP is like twelve guys in a basement.

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It's it's tiny, it's ineffective, and they're already in fighting

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with each other, really accomplishing nothing. It's by his account,

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barely anyone even knows that there's a Berlin chapter of

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the n SDAP. They still kind of regard them as

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a provincial party.

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Speaker 1: So basically what their their goal was is or his

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goal was polarized rhetoric that's polarizing, that mobilizes support through

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basically dividing. I mean, you have to basically become a

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partisan because, uh, the threat of communism taking over is

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is so strong at this point, especially since they have

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international support, that you're you have to seek to drive

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a wedge through people, and I guess nobody. Nobody did

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it better when it came to uh to writing and

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you know, using using language than Golibeles at that point.

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Speaker 2: Yeah. Absolutely. He talks a lot about how the first

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battle is sort of just to be noticed at all,

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and that they have to cross that bridge before they

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can even start convincing anyone or or driving support to

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the party. He's quite satisfied when the left wing press

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starts uh writing all kinds of of defamatory stories about

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them and accusing them of all sorts of criminal acts

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and all of that, and he just kind of laughs

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and says, well, at least they're talking about us, which

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is a sentiment I think it'll be pretty commonly understood

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by people on the right in the United States today.

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The most effective tactic that the media has used here

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is simply ignoring us. And it seems to have been

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the same for Gobles all these years ago.

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Speaker 1: On top of you know, for lack of a better phrase,

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propaganda and basically drawing attentions to themselves street violence was

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talk a little bit about the street violence that was

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happening at that time. I don't think, you know, those

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of us who come to with libertarianism all you really

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hear about when it comes to Wymar is inflation. It's

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all economic policy, and people just most people don't have

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an understand ending of just exactly how much revolutionary action

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was going on there, and even way before this, but

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you know this would be with him coming and becoming

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guy lighter, there was no way that it wasn't going

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to amp up by necessity.

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Speaker 2: Oh yeah, absolutely. He does talk quite a bit about well,

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there's sort of two different variants of street violence that

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take place in his narrative. There's the big clashes that

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they're usually at least somewhat prepared for, sometimes they even

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provoke it a bit, and then there's the sort of

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everyday street violence, so big ones. For example, there's a

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pretty action packed account of a meeting that they hold

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in I forget the exact name of it, but it

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was one of the venues that the communists themselves liked

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to use, and so when they rented it out, when

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the NSCAP rented it out, this, of course, the communists

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are incensed. They're you know, determined to go in there

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and throw them out and show them that they won't

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get their way in the red part of town. And

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this is where you get the big archetypal beer hall brawl,

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people throwing glasses and breaking chairs over each other's heads

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and that sort of thing, and it spills out into

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the street and the police get involved and all that

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kind of stuff. But sort of the more concerning thing

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as far as they were concerned was the sort of

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everyday attacks on their supporters, situations where communists or whoever

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else was determined to use violence again would simply attack

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a party member on his way home from work out

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in public, or ambush small groups of them when they

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were doing propaganda actions, that sort of thing, And it

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really he notes that this really wasn't something that was

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taking place early on, right when he got there. At first,

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their enemies were sort of content to laugh at them

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and belittle them and ignore them when they could, and

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this gave them enough of a chance to build up

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a solid core of wellve, dedicated men before the real

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violence started kicking off. And then sort of as soon

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as they as soon as their enemies belatedly realized that

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they weren't going away that easily, that's when the violence

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all started kicking off. That's when people started getting attacked

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in the streets ganged up on coming home from the

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bar at the end of the day, all that sort

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of thing. And they had guys in the hospitals constantly,

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even notes at times there would be Communist supporters in

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the hospitals who would then further attack. There are guys

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that were sent there and they were actually, out of necessity,

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had to either treat their own supporters at private homes

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with whatever resources they could scrape together, or post guards

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essentially in the hospitals to keep them from getting further abused.

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I mean, it really it escalated very quickly and all

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at once and turned into a very dire situation.

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Speaker 1: What was the legal reactions of this at the time.

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I mean, you basically have revolutionary violence in the street,

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and I guess I guess the big question that comes

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up is when you really start getting down to this

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is how you know, we know in the early twenties,

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people will get thrown into jail. Fear was drown and

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was drown in jail. But how are people staying out

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of jail? How are you able to have basically, you know,

248
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what is essentially militias in the street, And you know,

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I think people would just want to know about law

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and order at that time. How do you get away

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with this? If? How do you get past law and order?

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Speaker 2: Sure, well, you know. I think the primary reason is

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that law enforcement and investigative tactics and technology just really

254
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weren't there at this time period. They didn't have a

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mass surveillance state, didn't have security cameras, they didn't have

256
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anything really, and unless you had witnesses who could point

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out a suspect, or if the police managed to tain

258
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someone to find a weapon on them, that kind of thing,

259
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then largely nothing really happened. It's worth keeping in mind

260
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I think that this type of partisans street violence is

261
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really not something that any law enforcement group is really

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prepared to combat. When things get this radicalized, the point

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where enough people are committing enough violence in the streets,

264
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they're going to be overwhelmed. The investigative resources simply aren't there.

265
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The other thing I think is the German legal system

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at this time period, at least from what I can

267
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gather from these sort of accounts, you're not going to

268
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see the sort of what they would consider draconian punishments

269
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that you see mated out in the United States for

270
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this type of violence. Assaults don't land you in prison

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for five ten years. It's more like a fine and

272
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maybe a couple of months and they're out on the

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street again. The authorities in Germany at the time seemed

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very reluctant to sort of bring the boot down on

275
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this kind of stuff, even if they had had the ability.

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At most times, it's well a combination of selective enforcement,

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for example, sort of warrantless searches and raids on party

278
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headquarters and that sort of thing, and they have to

279
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be very careful. Firearms are something that will get someone

280
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in a lot of trouble in this time period, so

281
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most of them forget firearms and use other kinds of weapons.

282
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It's a a lot more fists and improvised weapons. Again,

283
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with like the beer hall brawl situations, no one is

284
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bringing guns to those. They're smashing each other upside the

285
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head with beer steins and that sort of thing that

286
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keeps a lot of heat off of them. But more broadly,

287
00:21:10,039 --> 00:21:13,400
the method that the police and the state tend to

288
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use is just going after the organizations themselves. Right. They

289
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sort of know who's organizing the violence, and when it

290
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gets out of hand, they crack down on the party itself,

291
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either by banning it outright or going after the leadership

292
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that sort of thing.

293
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Speaker 1: Yeah, I think when you start looking at exactly how

294
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they were able to pull this off. You know, I

295
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think one of the reasons that you publish a book

296
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like this is because a lot of people see that

297
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we're in much the same situation that they were. I

298
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have a tendency to combine it a little more with

299
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like the Spanish Civil War, what led up to the

300
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Spanish Civil War. But you know, I can definitely see

301
00:21:58,559 --> 00:22:01,599
parallels here, and I guess what a lot of people

302
00:22:01,599 --> 00:22:04,039
who would read this book is. And I've actually heard

303
00:22:04,039 --> 00:22:07,119
people say this is, you know, in the United States,

304
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the centers of power are the cities. And with this,

305
00:22:15,640 --> 00:22:19,839
with this guy who's been in the country for less

306
00:22:19,839 --> 00:22:24,279
than ten years getting the nomination to the Democrat nomination

307
00:22:24,640 --> 00:22:29,880
for the mayoral candidacy in New York City, people are like, well,

308
00:22:29,880 --> 00:22:33,319
we just can't give up on cities and everything. And

309
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I've actually heard people invoke this book. So, you know,

310
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one of the reasons we want to read history is

311
00:22:39,359 --> 00:22:42,480
we want to learn and see what can be done

312
00:22:43,079 --> 00:22:46,799
to solve situations that people have been in the past

313
00:22:46,880 --> 00:22:50,839
that are similar to ours. I mean, Honestly, when you

314
00:22:50,960 --> 00:22:52,680
when you look at this and you try to apply

315
00:22:52,720 --> 00:22:55,000
it to our situation, how would you even begin.

316
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Speaker 2: I guess that's the million dollar question, right.

317
00:23:00,039 --> 00:23:05,000
Speaker 1: With I fed posting, Yeah, yeah, yeah, of course it's.

318
00:23:06,880 --> 00:23:09,799
Speaker 2: Well, the main difference between our situation and their situation

319
00:23:10,400 --> 00:23:13,960
is that a city like Berlin had been largely taken

320
00:23:13,960 --> 00:23:16,720
over by you know, what you could term alien elements.

321
00:23:18,119 --> 00:23:23,839
They were hostile to German national feeling, hostile to the

322
00:23:23,920 --> 00:23:29,240
aspirations of the German people as a whole, but they

323
00:23:29,279 --> 00:23:32,440
weren't quite as alien as the forces that have taken

324
00:23:32,440 --> 00:23:36,279
over most American cities. That's sort of a whole other

325
00:23:36,480 --> 00:23:42,240
problem because the well, the issue in a place like

326
00:23:42,279 --> 00:23:48,559
New York is persuasion isn't really a tool that can

327
00:23:48,599 --> 00:23:53,119
bring about a serious change there, not in terms of

328
00:23:53,440 --> 00:23:56,960
something like local politics. I mean, is it is essentially

329
00:23:57,039 --> 00:24:01,640
an alien city at this point. Just to keep running

330
00:24:01,680 --> 00:24:04,599
with New York as an example, I think it's probably

331
00:24:04,599 --> 00:24:10,799
the most fitting. So the actual means of sort of

332
00:24:10,799 --> 00:24:18,240
political attack are necessarily different. Be very hard to sort

333
00:24:18,279 --> 00:24:20,440
of plant yourself in New York the same way that

334
00:24:20,519 --> 00:24:25,200
they that the NSDAP planted themselves in Berlin. And sort

335
00:24:25,240 --> 00:24:29,319
of staked out of claim could be done. It's possible

336
00:24:30,440 --> 00:24:32,759
even just to have a presence in the cities would

337
00:24:32,759 --> 00:24:40,480
be better better than having none. So, you know, I'm

338
00:24:40,480 --> 00:24:43,079
not sure how much relevance this would have to the

339
00:24:43,119 --> 00:24:50,359
actual to political activities in the cities today, but obviously

340
00:24:50,400 --> 00:24:52,759
at some point that has to happen. At some point

341
00:24:52,839 --> 00:24:56,839
the cities have to be reclaimed in some sense, and

342
00:24:56,880 --> 00:24:59,480
that's not going to happen without at least some local presence,

343
00:25:00,079 --> 00:25:06,480
without sort of showing the flag. But it is, it's

344
00:25:06,519 --> 00:25:09,079
a very difficult situation that we're in, and I'm not

345
00:25:09,119 --> 00:25:13,680
sure it's it's I'm not sure there's much that we

346
00:25:13,720 --> 00:25:18,000
could do in that respect. Now, I do think that

347
00:25:18,039 --> 00:25:24,359
the same tactics and the same understanding is still applicable

348
00:25:24,400 --> 00:25:30,359
to places of maybe secondary significance. Maybe not your your

349
00:25:30,400 --> 00:25:34,519
New York cities, maybe not your Washington d c's, but

350
00:25:34,559 --> 00:25:38,519
there's one hundred cities scattered all across the United States

351
00:25:38,559 --> 00:25:43,799
that are in dire need of some local action.

352
00:25:45,680 --> 00:25:48,240
Speaker 1: We know that they've been getting a lot of action

353
00:25:48,519 --> 00:25:52,400
from the revolutionary left, because that's usually the way. It's

354
00:25:52,440 --> 00:25:55,079
always the way it starts. It It never seems like

355
00:25:55,319 --> 00:25:59,599
revolutionary right. Revolutionary action from the right is always just

356
00:25:59,640 --> 00:26:05,559
responts things. Revolutionary action from the left sometimes it's sometimes

357
00:26:05,640 --> 00:26:09,319
the people who become the revolutionary right actually come out

358
00:26:09,319 --> 00:26:14,039
of the revolutionary left because they know exactly what's happening,

359
00:26:14,079 --> 00:26:17,880
and then they're like, Okay, well this isn't going to work.

360
00:26:18,519 --> 00:26:23,519
But yeah, just from my reading some older some books

361
00:26:23,559 --> 00:26:29,000
I've read about of a diary from an Austrian woman

362
00:26:30,119 --> 00:26:33,400
throughout World War One and then throughout the hunger the

363
00:26:33,400 --> 00:26:40,079
starvation Blockade, it just seems that once the city, once

364
00:26:40,119 --> 00:26:43,599
the city has taken over, the only way you're going

365
00:26:43,680 --> 00:26:46,880
to take it back is block by block. But also

366
00:26:47,279 --> 00:26:49,440
you have to take it has to be taken into

367
00:26:49,519 --> 00:26:54,039
consideration that the people who are doing that. Also, you

368
00:26:54,079 --> 00:26:55,720
know a lot of them are related to each other,

369
00:26:56,279 --> 00:27:01,720
seventh and eighth cousins, they're a you, they're a specific

370
00:27:05,000 --> 00:27:09,400
there are specific ethnicity, they share something in common. And

371
00:27:09,480 --> 00:27:12,880
I think that's probably, you know, the main reason that

372
00:27:12,880 --> 00:27:16,400
that the nsd AP could do what they did, And

373
00:27:16,559 --> 00:27:21,720
especially in a town like Berlin, you're you can only

374
00:27:21,839 --> 00:27:27,519
use fists and force and violence so much if you're

375
00:27:27,559 --> 00:27:32,680
not going to have cohesiveness when it comes to who

376
00:27:32,759 --> 00:27:37,279
you are and who who you're standing next to you,

377
00:27:37,519 --> 00:27:40,519
You're in a heap of trouble when you know you

378
00:27:40,680 --> 00:27:45,799
have you have diasporas that have come into your country

379
00:27:45,920 --> 00:27:50,720
and now overwhelmed certain areas. I mean Canada is like

380
00:27:51,839 --> 00:27:57,400
I've heard the like the province that Ontario, Ontario, the

381
00:27:57,480 --> 00:28:02,640
province at Toronto's and or the sexuals just been taken

382
00:28:02,680 --> 00:28:07,480
over by Indians. So you know, there was a There's

383
00:28:07,519 --> 00:28:11,839
a lots to take into consideration when you know, when

384
00:28:11,920 --> 00:28:15,200
you can look at Berlin and think, okay, well there's

385
00:28:15,240 --> 00:28:18,880
a whole lot of Bolshevik Jews who just poured over

386
00:28:18,960 --> 00:28:22,240
the border from Russia and other places. As pretty easy to.

387
00:28:22,240 --> 00:28:27,640
Speaker 2: Spot them, and they didn't have nearly the numbers if

388
00:28:27,680 --> 00:28:34,480
we're comparing to today, right between them and I guess

389
00:28:34,559 --> 00:28:38,759
the sizeable group of like white Russian emigres and other

390
00:28:38,920 --> 00:28:42,559
smaller groups. I mean, I don't have the numbers handy,

391
00:28:42,680 --> 00:28:45,240
but it can't have been more than ten percent, right,

392
00:28:45,279 --> 00:28:46,920
I would be shocked if it was even that many.

393
00:28:47,839 --> 00:28:51,640
Berlin was still a German city. It might not have

394
00:28:53,079 --> 00:28:55,880
had the same feeling as the rest of Germany, but

395
00:28:55,960 --> 00:28:58,359
it was still a German city, and that counted for

396
00:28:58,440 --> 00:29:03,400
a lot to them, to a political party whose core

397
00:29:03,680 --> 00:29:11,960
belief is the unity of all Germans as a national whole. Today,

398
00:29:12,039 --> 00:29:16,440
even our smaller cities are as bad as Berlin ever was,

399
00:29:17,160 --> 00:29:23,960
and that's sort of where I think any right wing

400
00:29:24,119 --> 00:29:26,680
revolutionary movement in this country is going to have to start.

401
00:29:29,319 --> 00:29:32,440
And of course, again pointing back to sort of the

402
00:29:32,480 --> 00:29:34,559
backstory of the book and the way they introduced it,

403
00:29:35,400 --> 00:29:38,279
the NSCAP didn't start in Berlin either. They started where

404
00:29:38,319 --> 00:29:42,240
they had more popularity among the masses, down in Bavaria

405
00:29:42,680 --> 00:29:45,960
and expanded from there into the Rhineland and other parts

406
00:29:46,000 --> 00:29:52,680
of Germany. They were smart about it, They had a

407
00:29:52,720 --> 00:29:55,839
good strategy. They adapted their message slightly for different areas.

408
00:29:58,519 --> 00:30:00,799
Of course, everyone's familiar with the the sort of northern

409
00:30:00,880 --> 00:30:05,319
branch of the party that had Gregor Strausser before his

410
00:30:05,680 --> 00:30:10,200
fall from glory as a major ideological voice up there,

411
00:30:11,759 --> 00:30:16,799
adapting to the local conditions in that region. And yeah,

412
00:30:16,880 --> 00:30:19,279
of course Berlin was sort of the last place that

413
00:30:19,359 --> 00:30:23,799
they went. They had at that point experienced leaders, they

414
00:30:23,920 --> 00:30:28,920
had resources that could sustain the party on a national level.

415
00:30:29,839 --> 00:30:33,400
They they didn't just jump right in there and think

416
00:30:33,480 --> 00:30:36,240
it was all going to work out, and of course

417
00:30:36,279 --> 00:30:41,920
it doesn't. Throughout the whole throughout the story of this book, basically,

418
00:30:41,960 --> 00:30:47,440
everything that can go wrong does go wrong, and the

419
00:30:48,759 --> 00:30:51,880
major story arcs that take place are them managing to

420
00:30:51,920 --> 00:30:53,759
figure it out and come back from it every time

421
00:30:53,880 --> 00:30:57,119
until eventually it sticks right. That's sort of the story,

422
00:30:57,279 --> 00:31:02,960
the part of it that is mostly missing in the

423
00:31:03,480 --> 00:31:07,000
common perception of what happens in Germany and this time period.

424
00:31:07,400 --> 00:31:09,200
There are a lot of ups and downs. There are

425
00:31:10,559 --> 00:31:14,920
minor crises that pop up that shake up the political

426
00:31:15,000 --> 00:31:20,000
scene a bit, and it's not really over until that

427
00:31:20,200 --> 00:31:25,920
last minute. There's even the sort of abortive communist uprising

428
00:31:26,039 --> 00:31:30,359
when they realize that the National Socialists are are going

429
00:31:30,480 --> 00:31:32,640
to win unless they do something about it that has

430
00:31:32,680 --> 00:31:37,599
to be put down, sort of a last ditch orgy

431
00:31:37,640 --> 00:31:41,799
of violence to try to stop them. It's really not

432
00:31:41,960 --> 00:31:45,599
over until that last moment where they finally sees power.

433
00:31:47,319 --> 00:31:50,079
Speaker 1: Yeah, do you do you guys have or do you

434
00:31:50,240 --> 00:31:52,519
know of a books that like?

435
00:31:53,079 --> 00:31:53,240
Speaker 2: You know?

436
00:31:53,319 --> 00:31:57,759
Speaker 1: Because the book starts out with Goebbel's talking about how

437
00:31:58,119 --> 00:32:03,720
he's in, He's in, We're in Elberfeld, and that that's

438
00:32:04,240 --> 00:32:06,799
basically at that time as a spiritual center of national

439
00:32:06,920 --> 00:32:11,599
socialism in Western Germany. That how you'd build that up,

440
00:32:11,680 --> 00:32:16,279
because that's that's pretty much I think where where we're at.

441
00:32:16,440 --> 00:32:22,039
There's much to be learned from this book, especially just

442
00:32:22,960 --> 00:32:28,640
inspiration and determination. But they, I mean, are we talking

443
00:32:28,680 --> 00:32:32,720
about would the second half of the Austrian Painter's book

444
00:32:32,799 --> 00:32:36,039
be be instructive to that? Or what?

445
00:32:36,279 --> 00:32:36,319
Speaker 2: What?

446
00:32:37,160 --> 00:32:37,920
Speaker 1: What's your opinion?

447
00:32:38,839 --> 00:32:40,839
Speaker 2: You know, I've really been looking for something that goes

448
00:32:40,880 --> 00:32:45,880
into this. Of course there's less written about it because

449
00:32:46,000 --> 00:32:51,440
it's sort of the first chapter of their comeback Berlin.

450
00:32:51,640 --> 00:32:55,839
Is this glorious triumph right the end of the story

451
00:32:55,960 --> 00:33:01,200
feeds directly into the seizure of power and the beginning

452
00:33:01,240 --> 00:33:04,759
of the Third Reich. It's been very difficult for me

453
00:33:04,839 --> 00:33:08,519
to locate something that goes into the or at least

454
00:33:08,559 --> 00:33:12,519
it provides a narrative account of the building up of

455
00:33:12,599 --> 00:33:16,839
the party in the Rhineland, in the East, in other

456
00:33:16,960 --> 00:33:20,359
areas outside of Bavaria when they first make that jump

457
00:33:20,559 --> 00:33:24,400
into trying to be a truly national party. So any

458
00:33:24,480 --> 00:33:27,559
listeners out there who have a lead on this, please

459
00:33:27,680 --> 00:33:28,079
let us know.

460
00:33:30,079 --> 00:33:33,640
Speaker 1: There's plenty. There's plenty out there on organization. Like I said,

461
00:33:33,759 --> 00:33:37,559
the Fearers the Fearer's Book, the second half is or

462
00:33:37,599 --> 00:33:40,640
the last part of it is pretty pretty good on organization.

463
00:33:41,519 --> 00:33:46,359
But the yeah, just basically what they what they went

464
00:33:46,440 --> 00:33:53,079
through in the smaller towns where that's where, Yeah, that's

465
00:33:53,440 --> 00:33:55,519
that's where people are going to be more open to

466
00:33:55,680 --> 00:33:57,799
the idea. I mean, these are these are people who

467
00:33:57,839 --> 00:34:04,160
suffered more with the blockades there. A lot of them

468
00:34:04,279 --> 00:34:09,360
suffered violence from hordes, from hordes that poured over the border.

469
00:34:10,360 --> 00:34:15,199
So it's you know, and you would think Berlin, especially

470
00:34:15,280 --> 00:34:20,480
what they went through, that it would be they would

471
00:34:20,519 --> 00:34:24,119
be more open to that kind of message there. But

472
00:34:24,480 --> 00:34:29,480
you also have the competing message of of Bolshevism at

473
00:34:29,519 --> 00:34:35,960
the time, which is also very you know, it can

474
00:34:36,119 --> 00:34:40,559
be very enticing to people who feel like they've been defeated.

475
00:34:42,559 --> 00:34:50,440
Speaker 2: Yeah. Absolutely, Although I do think goggles Gives Well reserves

476
00:34:50,599 --> 00:34:54,119
quite a bit of his disdain for the liberal parties

477
00:34:54,159 --> 00:34:58,880
as well. You know, the communists he sees as of

478
00:34:59,000 --> 00:35:02,760
course dangerous, but they're basically dangerous the way that like

479
00:35:02,880 --> 00:35:06,760
a wild animal is dangerous, right, you know, it's going

480
00:35:06,800 --> 00:35:12,840
to hurt you if you step into its den. He

481
00:35:13,519 --> 00:35:17,519
sort of in those scenarios. He kind of takes the

482
00:35:17,559 --> 00:35:22,000
position of, well, we're prepared to fight them, and we're

483
00:35:22,039 --> 00:35:24,239
going to go and fight them, and we're fairly confident

484
00:35:24,280 --> 00:35:27,199
that we can beat them because their only tool really

485
00:35:27,360 --> 00:35:29,679
is violence, and we know how to deal with violence.

486
00:35:31,679 --> 00:35:35,599
It's the the liberal parties and the sort of the

487
00:35:35,960 --> 00:35:39,440
media machine in Germany. Like I was already talking about

488
00:35:39,480 --> 00:35:44,639
Berlin as sort of the media capital, and these sort

489
00:35:44,679 --> 00:35:50,800
of I don't know how to characterize exactly the bourgeois

490
00:35:50,920 --> 00:35:54,199
type that's really prevailing in Berlin at this time period,

491
00:35:54,800 --> 00:35:59,119
just sort of very caught up in the ever changing

492
00:35:59,239 --> 00:36:04,000
day to day life of the capitol and don't really

493
00:36:04,519 --> 00:36:07,079
don't really care about these sorts of things, the sort

494
00:36:07,079 --> 00:36:09,920
of ones that see themselves as being above it all.

495
00:36:11,679 --> 00:36:13,639
These are the people who sort of give free reign

496
00:36:13,800 --> 00:36:19,639
for the basically liberal dictatorship that exists at this period.

497
00:36:20,280 --> 00:36:24,280
Two just sort of abuse the members of the party

498
00:36:24,440 --> 00:36:30,239
and let the police run wild on them. Of course,

499
00:36:30,280 --> 00:36:33,840
the one character that he really disdains above all others

500
00:36:34,000 --> 00:36:38,719
is the police commissioner, or I believe when it starts

501
00:36:38,760 --> 00:36:41,840
off he's deputy police commissioner, but he's basically in charge

502
00:36:41,880 --> 00:36:46,079
of the sort of political police or the interior police

503
00:36:47,400 --> 00:36:56,840
guy named Bernard Weiss was Jewish and obviously had a serious,

504
00:36:57,599 --> 00:37:02,199
serious grudge against the NSDAP and would basically just harass

505
00:37:02,400 --> 00:37:06,840
them with the with the interior police at every conceivable opportunity.

506
00:37:07,519 --> 00:37:14,599
At this whole feud with him relating to cartoons that

507
00:37:14,760 --> 00:37:19,440
they had made of him, like what's what's the word

508
00:37:21,000 --> 00:37:27,239
satirical cartoons about about Weiss? Uh. He ended up suing

509
00:37:27,440 --> 00:37:31,719
Goebbels for defamation a couple of times and losing. There's

510
00:37:31,800 --> 00:37:35,239
like two whole chapters that revolved just around this feud

511
00:37:35,360 --> 00:37:40,079
with the Jewish police chief. Whereas, Yeah, I think the

512
00:37:40,159 --> 00:37:43,000
communists don't get as much of a of a personal

513
00:37:43,360 --> 00:37:46,679
treatment in this account. It really is there. They are

514
00:37:46,760 --> 00:37:51,000
sort of the NPC goons that are just constantly coming

515
00:37:51,039 --> 00:37:51,559
after them.

516
00:37:53,239 --> 00:37:57,239
Speaker 1: Well, I think one of the more important things that

517
00:37:57,360 --> 00:37:59,320
he does in the book, and I think this is

518
00:37:59,400 --> 00:38:07,159
something that at uh anyone who's looking starting an organization

519
00:38:07,320 --> 00:38:12,360
or doing anything, is he really goes after the struggle,

520
00:38:12,800 --> 00:38:15,559
talking about the struggle, struggle and the sacrifice. So far,

521
00:38:17,840 --> 00:38:20,119
you have to talk about the early struggles and what

522
00:38:20,239 --> 00:38:23,360
you went what you went through. The heroes that came

523
00:38:23,480 --> 00:38:27,239
before you. And also you know, talk about the old

524
00:38:27,280 --> 00:38:32,760
Guard and how you know you're continuing their work, and

525
00:38:34,000 --> 00:38:37,800
you know you use that to seek and inspire, seek

526
00:38:37,880 --> 00:38:43,719
to inspire an honor and give people a sense of

527
00:38:43,840 --> 00:38:46,239
exactly what's you know, what's at stake here.

528
00:38:48,199 --> 00:38:55,000
Speaker 2: Yeah. Absolutely, it really is the sort of common heroism

529
00:38:55,400 --> 00:38:59,119
of the average party member or essay man that that

530
00:38:59,280 --> 00:39:03,400
kind of shines through here. I do think it really

531
00:39:03,480 --> 00:39:06,400
emphasizes how much of it would have been impossible without

532
00:39:06,440 --> 00:39:10,639
those people. Even at the beginning when he talks about

533
00:39:10,800 --> 00:39:16,000
having to really call these local groups of people who

534
00:39:16,159 --> 00:39:18,760
sort of either want to just be an idle talk

535
00:39:18,880 --> 00:39:25,079
shop or want to do in fighting, or want to

536
00:39:25,159 --> 00:39:33,280
constantly question orders or party directives. That sort of getting

537
00:39:33,360 --> 00:39:37,159
rid of those guys and keeping only the toughest men

538
00:39:37,760 --> 00:39:41,320
who were dedicated, who wanted to fight, who wanted to

539
00:39:41,679 --> 00:39:47,840
sacrifice themselves, how instrumental that was for their eventual victory.

540
00:39:49,679 --> 00:39:54,639
Speaker 1: Yeah. And also just the values that you've always shared,

541
00:39:55,280 --> 00:39:58,039
the values of the country, the values well not the country,

542
00:39:58,119 --> 00:40:05,960
but the people, the values the nation. And yeah, I

543
00:40:06,039 --> 00:40:09,920
guess what what the regime that's been in charge since

544
00:40:09,960 --> 00:40:16,039
World War Two is figured out is that the best

545
00:40:16,159 --> 00:40:19,840
way to make sure that that's not an issue is

546
00:40:20,000 --> 00:40:24,880
to either when you start talking about the past, what

547
00:40:25,000 --> 00:40:28,519
your you know, what your your ancestors did you know,

548
00:40:28,599 --> 00:40:31,960
you're not allowed to celebrate that or even brag about

549
00:40:32,000 --> 00:40:34,400
it because you didn't do it. It was them and

550
00:40:34,519 --> 00:40:38,039
they did it. And they're evil anyway because they either

551
00:40:38,159 --> 00:40:40,480
own slaves or they were okay with slavery, they were

552
00:40:40,519 --> 00:40:44,519
alive during slavery, they invented slavery. Whatever the hell these

553
00:40:44,519 --> 00:40:45,639
people want to talk about.

554
00:40:46,239 --> 00:40:49,480
Speaker 2: But right, right, it all has to be made a

555
00:40:50,000 --> 00:40:57,360
subject of deconstruction or critical analysis. Right, it's sort of

556
00:40:57,760 --> 00:41:00,800
heroism can't be allowed to to be a part of

557
00:41:00,880 --> 00:41:01,440
that narrative.

558
00:41:02,639 --> 00:41:06,760
Speaker 1: Yeah, the the Frankfurt school and the authoritarian personality, they

559
00:41:07,159 --> 00:41:10,440
laid that out perfectly. They said, if we allow, if

560
00:41:10,480 --> 00:41:15,039
we allow Americans to rely too much upon their past

561
00:41:15,199 --> 00:41:17,760
and look to their past too much, or brag about

562
00:41:17,800 --> 00:41:20,760
their past, or think that there's anything good in their past,

563
00:41:21,199 --> 00:41:23,440
well that's just going to lead them to fascism. So

564
00:41:24,119 --> 00:41:27,280
we need to make sure that they're looking forward to

565
00:41:27,599 --> 00:41:32,719
whatever progressive kind of worldview that that we're selling. And

566
00:41:32,880 --> 00:41:35,239
I think that a lot of people don't even realize

567
00:41:35,280 --> 00:41:40,039
that they're doing that. You know, whether you're whether you're

568
00:41:40,079 --> 00:41:44,480
a conservative, libertarian, or you know, whatever you want to

569
00:41:44,519 --> 00:41:47,320
call yourself. I think even some people you know, on

570
00:41:47,760 --> 00:41:50,239
the on the right side of the great divide, as

571
00:41:50,280 --> 00:41:53,719
the man would have, you know, talked about it, would

572
00:41:56,639 --> 00:42:01,400
they almost reflexively or they reflectively fall into that, and

573
00:42:01,400 --> 00:42:05,440
then they have to catch themselves and go back to

574
00:42:05,480 --> 00:42:09,760
it and go, no, No, our history, our history is rich.

575
00:42:10,519 --> 00:42:13,920
We did things that no one was ever able to do.

576
00:42:14,360 --> 00:42:16,239
And the reason we did that is because we share

577
00:42:16,280 --> 00:42:16,880
an identity.

578
00:42:18,840 --> 00:42:22,840
Speaker 2: Sure, yeah, yeah, you'll see oftentimes, I guess, like conservative types,

579
00:42:24,719 --> 00:42:29,360
even when they think they're taking a stand, they'll say

580
00:42:29,480 --> 00:42:34,280
things like, well, sure they own slaves, and you know,

581
00:42:34,360 --> 00:42:37,320
they genocided the Native Americans, and they did this and

582
00:42:37,440 --> 00:42:41,000
that and all that was bad. But and then they'll

583
00:42:41,039 --> 00:42:44,920
try to sort of rescue that by saying, you know,

584
00:42:45,119 --> 00:42:50,360
they made democracy, or it was better than what everyone

585
00:42:50,400 --> 00:42:52,599
else was doing at the time and they were all worse,

586
00:42:53,480 --> 00:42:56,239
or things of that nature. Stuff that automatically puts you

587
00:42:56,320 --> 00:42:59,199
on the defensive and puts you in the position of

588
00:43:01,119 --> 00:43:04,519
sort of deprecating your own history, your own culture where

589
00:43:04,559 --> 00:43:08,320
you came from and it really is. It's so ingrained

590
00:43:08,360 --> 00:43:11,679
in most people that I think sometimes they do, like

591
00:43:11,760 --> 00:43:14,199
you said, they sort of have to catch themselves when

592
00:43:14,239 --> 00:43:14,920
they start doing it.

593
00:43:16,480 --> 00:43:21,119
Speaker 1: Yeah, and the easiest one is that anybody, anybody can

594
00:43:21,159 --> 00:43:23,880
be an American, anybody can be a member of the nation.

595
00:43:24,639 --> 00:43:30,519
And while I you know, my obviously my ancestors came

596
00:43:30,559 --> 00:43:33,719
here later than the founders and everything, but you're always

597
00:43:33,760 --> 00:43:36,599
going to have some that are grafted in. But you know,

598
00:43:36,800 --> 00:43:39,519
really you can look at to a certain point, and

599
00:43:40,360 --> 00:43:43,960
I would say for the overwhelming majority, that point is

600
00:43:44,079 --> 00:43:47,519
probably the fifties going into the sixties and then heart Seller.

601
00:43:48,000 --> 00:43:51,599
Of course, we had an invasion in the eighteen eighties

602
00:43:51,679 --> 00:43:56,920
that you know, we're still trying to get over. But yeah,

603
00:43:57,159 --> 00:44:01,360
just saying that anyone can come here, and especially the

604
00:44:01,400 --> 00:44:03,599
way everything is set up now where there is no

605
00:44:03,880 --> 00:44:07,639
national where the national identity has been trying been written

606
00:44:07,719 --> 00:44:14,039
out of the out of education, out of conversation, out

607
00:44:14,079 --> 00:44:19,880
of the culture, then you're you're searching to get something back.

608
00:44:19,960 --> 00:44:23,599
And that's exactly you know, Greebel's talks about it in

609
00:44:23,639 --> 00:44:28,320
the book, that you when you're looking at the cultural

610
00:44:28,360 --> 00:44:34,119
and moral declay, decay of Berlin. You know, national socialism

611
00:44:34,360 --> 00:44:38,880
was was being pushed as a redemption to what what

612
00:44:39,079 --> 00:44:39,599
once was.

613
00:44:40,960 --> 00:44:48,519
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, it is sort of noteworthy, how uh, how

614
00:44:48,880 --> 00:44:52,119
sort of fectless. The conservatives in Germany at that time

615
00:44:52,199 --> 00:44:57,320
were sort of same kind of position as they take

616
00:44:57,400 --> 00:44:59,320
to us today. Actually, that's That's one of the things

617
00:44:59,320 --> 00:45:02,519
that I've said repeatedly about this book is that the

618
00:45:02,599 --> 00:45:08,199
most relevant part is the sort of diagnosis of conservatism

619
00:45:08,800 --> 00:45:13,320
that's sort of implicit in the actions that they take,

620
00:45:15,840 --> 00:45:20,239
always obsessed with social standing and prestige, which, of course

621
00:45:20,360 --> 00:45:25,599
Goebel's notes that that basically means approval by Jews because

622
00:45:25,639 --> 00:45:29,519
they controlled all the media channels that would make one

623
00:45:30,719 --> 00:45:34,639
prestigious or not, that would determine whether you were socially

624
00:45:34,679 --> 00:45:39,760
acceptable or whether you were a deplorable radical. And this

625
00:45:40,519 --> 00:45:42,960
basically let them lead the Conservatives around by the nose,

626
00:45:43,440 --> 00:45:47,360
and that the Conservatives were at times completely useless in

627
00:45:47,559 --> 00:45:52,400
preventing the sorts of abuses, the abuse of tactics that

628
00:45:52,440 --> 00:45:55,440
were used against the national socialists, and at times the

629
00:45:55,519 --> 00:46:01,800
Conservatives willingly joined in. Of course, especially relevant with the

630
00:46:02,360 --> 00:46:08,559
sort of last effort of staving off a national socialist

631
00:46:08,639 --> 00:46:14,239
government was the was a coalition between the Conservatives, the

632
00:46:14,599 --> 00:46:21,239
Center Party back then currently the CDU and and the Socialists.

633
00:46:21,280 --> 00:46:24,679
They actually teamed up to prevent the National Socialists from

634
00:46:24,760 --> 00:46:28,199
entering government, which, of course, if you look around today,

635
00:46:28,599 --> 00:46:31,719
is nothing new. This is going on in Germany right now.

636
00:46:32,159 --> 00:46:37,480
This has been going on in France for decades, and

637
00:46:37,559 --> 00:46:39,960
if the United States had a multi party system, you

638
00:46:40,000 --> 00:46:44,239
can bet it would be happening here. Yeah. The uh.

639
00:46:45,760 --> 00:46:49,760
Speaker 1: What you said about them just conservatives always one saying

640
00:46:49,920 --> 00:46:54,840
the basically they want to be patted on the head

641
00:46:54,880 --> 00:46:58,800
by whose ever in power, and yeah, we know that's

642
00:46:58,840 --> 00:47:02,800
been for a long time here. Yeah, it just makes them.

643
00:47:03,599 --> 00:47:07,760
It's the the old thing about how they they're always

644
00:47:08,360 --> 00:47:10,679
reaching out to the left and punching to their right

645
00:47:11,840 --> 00:47:15,920
where they they think that they've been so conditioned that

646
00:47:16,719 --> 00:47:20,840
anything that anything from the past where if it looks

647
00:47:20,920 --> 00:47:23,840
like it's to the right of you know, Ronald Reagan,

648
00:47:25,039 --> 00:47:28,280
then it's just then you have people on the right

649
00:47:28,320 --> 00:47:33,599
wing screaming Nazi and Nancy Semi and it's, uh, you know,

650
00:47:35,480 --> 00:47:38,519
it's just one of those things where you just want

651
00:47:38,599 --> 00:47:41,000
to break out the gifts of like Triggly, I just

652
00:47:41,079 --> 00:47:44,119
break out the gifts of triggly Puff and like purple

653
00:47:44,239 --> 00:47:47,159
hair at Sgaw's and say here, here you are, this

654
00:47:47,320 --> 00:47:51,480
is what you are just throwing, just throwing that out there.

655
00:47:52,840 --> 00:47:55,280
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, it's it's amazing because, of course, in

656
00:47:56,079 --> 00:47:59,800
Germany during this time, it was or should have been

657
00:47:59,800 --> 00:48:03,239
even more apparent or even more absurd to be a

658
00:48:04,079 --> 00:48:08,639
conservative who wasn't a radical, right they had watched the

659
00:48:09,760 --> 00:48:15,119
Social Democratic Party basically tear down the entire foundation of

660
00:48:15,159 --> 00:48:19,480
the German state over the past ten to fifteen years,

661
00:48:19,519 --> 00:48:24,400
depending on exactly what time period you're talking about, you know,

662
00:48:24,559 --> 00:48:29,760
overthrow the Kaiser completely take over the state essentially. I mean,

663
00:48:29,840 --> 00:48:34,119
it was a kudeta, and the Conservatives fifteen years later

664
00:48:34,239 --> 00:48:39,760
are basically defending that system, saying that the National Socialists

665
00:48:39,800 --> 00:48:45,159
are a threat to the realm. They are radical, they

666
00:48:45,239 --> 00:48:48,159
are you know, this and that and the other thing.

667
00:48:48,199 --> 00:48:52,880
They're dangerous basically for sort of belatedly responding to this

668
00:48:53,639 --> 00:48:59,159
totally illegitimate kudreta. And it's really just amazing because if

669
00:48:59,199 --> 00:49:03,079
you look at the United States in the same vein,

670
00:49:04,599 --> 00:49:07,880
of course, we didn't have an event quite as singular

671
00:49:08,159 --> 00:49:12,719
or traumatic as Germany's loss in the Great War and

672
00:49:13,039 --> 00:49:17,119
the subsequent revolution. But when you look at the speed

673
00:49:17,320 --> 00:49:21,960
at which things have changed, right like Donald Trump being

674
00:49:22,239 --> 00:49:25,280
the first, the first president to run on a pro

675
00:49:25,440 --> 00:49:32,199
gay platform, the absolute demographic catastrophe that's been building up,

676
00:49:32,559 --> 00:49:36,320
how rapidly everything is changing. And still you have conservatives

677
00:49:36,760 --> 00:49:40,159
who believe that it is too radical to oppose it

678
00:49:41,639 --> 00:49:43,880
even to a condition, to restore it to a condition

679
00:49:44,519 --> 00:49:47,920
of ten or fifteen or twenty years ago. Right, not

680
00:49:48,079 --> 00:49:52,079
much there's not much daylight in between the German conservatives

681
00:49:52,400 --> 00:49:56,039
of this time period and the American conservatives of today.

682
00:49:57,320 --> 00:50:00,119
Speaker 1: Back then, you could still look at the politician in

683
00:50:00,239 --> 00:50:05,039
Germany and say that they were for Germany. They they want,

684
00:50:06,000 --> 00:50:08,039
even if they were misguided, they want they wanted what

685
00:50:08,199 --> 00:50:10,719
was best for Germany. You can't even say that anymore.

686
00:50:10,760 --> 00:50:15,320
Here You're you're looking at you know what, what just

687
00:50:15,480 --> 00:50:20,440
came over two hours ago? Robert F. Kennedy Junior. I mean,

688
00:50:20,519 --> 00:50:23,239
this is a guy who is supposed to be like

689
00:50:24,440 --> 00:50:30,639
solving health problems. He's taking pictures with people holding up

690
00:50:30,800 --> 00:50:41,239
signs of hostages in Gaza. Where this isn't to call

691
00:50:41,360 --> 00:50:44,800
this a country. To call this well, you can call

692
00:50:44,840 --> 00:50:47,960
it a country, you can't call it a nation. It's

693
00:50:48,079 --> 00:50:51,320
just not a nation. A nation is a people, and

694
00:50:51,679 --> 00:50:56,360
people a nation has leaders who care about the care

695
00:50:56,400 --> 00:50:59,360
about the country. People can say whatever they want about

696
00:50:59,679 --> 00:51:03,800
about like John F. Kennedy and John F. Kennedy you know,

697
00:51:03,960 --> 00:51:07,360
looks like a you know, like a hardcore right winger.

698
00:51:07,840 --> 00:51:11,159
Now because he actually loved America. I mean, the guy

699
00:51:11,280 --> 00:51:13,559
loved women too, don't get me wrong, but the guy,

700
00:51:13,840 --> 00:51:18,400
the guy loved America and that right. Yeah, I mean

701
00:51:18,440 --> 00:51:24,199
I'm not head, but but the you know, we don't

702
00:51:24,239 --> 00:51:29,840
even have It's very easy to get black pilled if

703
00:51:29,920 --> 00:51:34,639
you're if you think that in any way, shape or form,

704
00:51:34,800 --> 00:51:38,920
like national politics is going to fix this. And it,

705
00:51:39,239 --> 00:51:43,000
like like we were talking about, this has to start

706
00:51:43,159 --> 00:51:46,360
in This has to start in one location, and it

707
00:51:46,480 --> 00:51:48,800
needs to spread, and it needs to spread like wildfire.

708
00:51:49,159 --> 00:51:53,280
You know, you need your you need your alber Elberfelds

709
00:51:53,320 --> 00:51:55,920
to pop up all over the place, and then you

710
00:51:56,000 --> 00:51:58,480
can start thinking about, Okay, where do we you know,

711
00:51:58,679 --> 00:51:59,639
where do we go from here?

712
00:52:01,320 --> 00:52:07,000
Speaker 2: M yeah, yeah, of course, just purely. The difference in

713
00:52:07,320 --> 00:52:10,360
like the way that the electoral system works does mean

714
00:52:10,400 --> 00:52:16,199
that there has to be tactical differences, but the core

715
00:52:16,559 --> 00:52:21,320
proposition of you sort of need to control space, right,

716
00:52:21,400 --> 00:52:25,679
you need to control territory, you need loyalty, you need people.

717
00:52:26,880 --> 00:52:35,119
That's what's necessary to accomplish anything. You know, the talk

718
00:52:35,239 --> 00:52:38,760
shop doesn't accomplish this stuff by itself.

719
00:52:40,320 --> 00:52:43,880
Speaker 1: A lot of things, a lot of narratives can be

720
00:52:44,079 --> 00:52:48,599
spun up, some things I think we can actually look

721
00:52:48,679 --> 00:52:53,960
at and agree can be done on like social media.

722
00:52:55,480 --> 00:53:00,679
But when it comes down to it, it's it's that's

723
00:53:00,760 --> 00:53:02,920
not where it's going to happen. You're just going to

724
00:53:03,000 --> 00:53:04,719
have to get off social media and you're gonna have

725
00:53:04,760 --> 00:53:07,840
to make things happen in real life. As dangerous as

726
00:53:07,920 --> 00:53:10,480
that is, you know, you're just you know, I mean,

727
00:53:10,679 --> 00:53:12,400
you're just going to basically have to decide you're a

728
00:53:12,480 --> 00:53:15,360
partisan and this is this is who you are now.

729
00:53:16,039 --> 00:53:18,119
And you know, if you really want to see real

730
00:53:18,239 --> 00:53:20,679
change in your life, it's probably going to cost you.

731
00:53:22,519 --> 00:53:27,599
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's that's certainly true. Even just to do what

732
00:53:27,760 --> 00:53:31,719
we've done at at anal Uphill has involved, you know,

733
00:53:31,880 --> 00:53:38,559
personal costs, sacrifices that have had to be made, negative

734
00:53:38,599 --> 00:53:41,400
consequences that have that have happened from that, and and

735
00:53:41,519 --> 00:53:46,039
all we do is publish books to really to really

736
00:53:46,039 --> 00:53:51,199
accomplish anything even even bordering on what the National Socialists

737
00:53:51,199 --> 00:53:53,280
were able to do, and in Germany in the twenties,

738
00:53:54,519 --> 00:53:59,239
that's a whole other can of worms. It is going

739
00:53:59,320 --> 00:54:06,039
to take it extremely dedicated, smart, brave people too to

740
00:54:06,119 --> 00:54:09,000
even begin to arrive at any kind of political solution

741
00:54:09,599 --> 00:54:14,079
until that point. Look what we're stuck with, right We

742
00:54:15,320 --> 00:54:20,119
have guys like Trump and and JD. Vance and these

743
00:54:20,280 --> 00:54:22,960
these other types that are sure. I mean, you can

744
00:54:23,079 --> 00:54:26,119
you can rightly say that they're an improvement over previous

745
00:54:26,199 --> 00:54:31,239
iterations in several respects, but they're not even close to

746
00:54:32,280 --> 00:54:36,519
to what would be necessary to bring a political revolution

747
00:54:36,960 --> 00:54:39,800
to the United States. And that's what's required, is a

748
00:54:39,880 --> 00:54:47,400
political revolution. Obviously, I don't mean by that a a

749
00:54:47,519 --> 00:54:50,639
violent revolution of the kind that some people salivate over,

750
00:54:52,599 --> 00:54:57,920
but it's it is worth noting that even a peaceful

751
00:54:58,000 --> 00:55:00,800
revolution like the one that the National Socialist led, that

752
00:55:01,000 --> 00:55:04,119
is one that is primarily obtained through peaceful political means,

753
00:55:05,079 --> 00:55:07,440
there was a lot of violence that was necessary even

754
00:55:07,519 --> 00:55:11,920
to just defend themselves as they were trying to carry

755
00:55:11,920 --> 00:55:13,880
out that that political revolution.

756
00:55:16,079 --> 00:55:21,920
Speaker 1: Yeah, strategy is really important, knowing exactly what you can

757
00:55:22,000 --> 00:55:26,320
get away with and you know. And also yeah, and

758
00:55:26,800 --> 00:55:30,039
I've said this for for a long time, you just

759
00:55:30,159 --> 00:55:33,159
have to do it legitimately. You know. The one good

760
00:55:33,320 --> 00:55:37,239
thing about about America and about a lot of the local,

761
00:55:37,880 --> 00:55:43,559
uh local polities, is it's easy to get elected and

762
00:55:44,719 --> 00:55:49,159
you can you run the right guy. You can get

763
00:55:49,199 --> 00:55:51,679
sheriffs elected, you can get mayors elected, you can get

764
00:55:51,920 --> 00:55:55,599
school boards elected. There's a lot you can do. And

765
00:55:58,840 --> 00:56:01,559
we that's the way it needs to be done in

766
00:56:01,679 --> 00:56:03,719
the United States. That's the way people want to see

767
00:56:04,239 --> 00:56:07,360
it done. You know, I was saying all throughout COVID

768
00:56:08,239 --> 00:56:09,880
was you know when people are like, well, you know,

769
00:56:10,280 --> 00:56:12,960
if they have mass vaccinations or something like that the

770
00:56:13,039 --> 00:56:17,599
government was going to do. Now thankfully they didn't try that.

771
00:56:18,880 --> 00:56:22,800
Then you know, your your local sheriff, you know, deputizing

772
00:56:22,880 --> 00:56:25,079
everyone in the town and lining up on the you know,

773
00:56:25,159 --> 00:56:28,119
on the county line and saying, you know, telling them

774
00:56:28,159 --> 00:56:33,000
you can't come here. You know, that is that is

775
00:56:33,480 --> 00:56:38,000
something that people will see, even even when the propaganda

776
00:56:38,079 --> 00:56:42,199
machine goes into spin, that is something that that regular

777
00:56:42,280 --> 00:56:46,960
people will see as legitimate over you know, putting together

778
00:56:47,000 --> 00:56:50,360
a posse to stop them. And it's possible to do

779
00:56:50,519 --> 00:56:51,840
in the United States.

780
00:56:51,599 --> 00:56:56,880
Speaker 2: So absolutely, and it's you know, that kind of thing

781
00:56:57,519 --> 00:57:02,079
might fall under the general banner of like civil disobedience,

782
00:57:03,639 --> 00:57:06,800
but that's the type that actually works, whereas the useless

783
00:57:06,840 --> 00:57:11,039
type of civil disobedience is just going out as some

784
00:57:11,280 --> 00:57:15,719
guy and you know, doing what liberals do, which is

785
00:57:16,000 --> 00:57:17,920
wave signs on the side of the road and that

786
00:57:18,039 --> 00:57:22,599
sort of thing that affects nothing. When it's like you said,

787
00:57:22,639 --> 00:57:25,119
like a local sheriff or something like that, or a

788
00:57:25,199 --> 00:57:30,239
local elected official of some type who's refusing to comply,

789
00:57:31,519 --> 00:57:34,840
then suddenly it's news. It's a crisis, it's something for

790
00:57:34,920 --> 00:57:37,800
people to get stirred up over and take sides. And

791
00:57:38,760 --> 00:57:42,000
as Goebel's kind of kind of talks about, that's really

792
00:57:42,039 --> 00:57:47,480
the prerequisite. You have to be noticed first before anything

793
00:57:47,559 --> 00:57:53,039
can happen. You have to get people activated or what

794
00:57:53,239 --> 00:57:59,320
was the word he used, provocation. Provocation has to take place,

795
00:58:00,199 --> 00:58:03,480
and it's a lot easier to do that when you're

796
00:58:03,480 --> 00:58:07,119
not a nobody and all. Echo what you said about

797
00:58:08,880 --> 00:58:12,599
just the importance of that, and also that it's not

798
00:58:12,920 --> 00:58:15,079
really as hard as people tend to make it out

799
00:58:15,119 --> 00:58:18,719
to be. And I know several examples off the top

800
00:58:18,719 --> 00:58:22,360
of my head of times when people on our side

801
00:58:22,400 --> 00:58:26,440
of things have actually taken this to heart and have

802
00:58:26,639 --> 00:58:29,760
taken local political action that has been effective, that it

803
00:58:29,800 --> 00:58:37,440
has resulted in people either winning elections or defeating local initiatives,

804
00:58:37,519 --> 00:58:41,400
getting on school boards, that sort of thing. It does happen.

805
00:58:43,760 --> 00:58:49,000
And if people can get organized enough around that sort

806
00:58:49,039 --> 00:58:53,880
of concept and dedicate enough of their time and money

807
00:58:54,000 --> 00:58:59,559
and intelligence and bravery, more of that can happen and

808
00:58:59,679 --> 00:59:00,360
needs happen.

809
00:59:03,000 --> 00:59:05,480
Speaker 1: Saying it, been saying it for you know a number

810
00:59:05,480 --> 00:59:08,280
of years. Now, That's that's the way things needs to

811
00:59:08,320 --> 00:59:11,559
be done. So all right, let's uh, let's cut it

812
00:59:11,639 --> 00:59:15,360
right there. Tell people about Analope Hill. Uh about you know,

813
00:59:15,480 --> 00:59:19,320
some of the latest releases and everything, and uh, I'll

814
00:59:19,360 --> 00:59:22,360
give my my discount codes so people can go there

815
00:59:22,400 --> 00:59:22,960
and check it out.

816
00:59:24,159 --> 00:59:26,679
Speaker 2: All right. Well, yeah, for those of you out there

817
00:59:26,719 --> 00:59:30,360
who may not deferd of us before, Analop Hill publishes

818
00:59:30,719 --> 00:59:35,920
historical literature, uh oftentimes new translations into English that have

819
00:59:36,039 --> 00:59:39,719
never been done before, or reprints of particularly significant works.

820
00:59:40,519 --> 00:59:43,679
We also publish original fiction, which has been a growing

821
00:59:43,719 --> 00:59:47,679
part of our catalog by current right wing authors, so

822
00:59:47,719 --> 00:59:54,360
you might find interesting. Our website is Analop Hill publishing

823
00:59:54,400 --> 00:59:57,760
dot com and if you head over there, you can

824
00:59:57,840 --> 00:59:59,960
check out our catalog. We put out a lot of books,

825
01:00:01,360 --> 01:00:06,519
typically two books every month, so there's something for just

826
01:00:06,559 --> 01:00:09,719
about everyone in that catalog. And I highly encourage you

827
01:00:10,280 --> 01:00:13,400
if you enjoy Pete's show, you'll definitely enjoy some of

828
01:00:13,400 --> 01:00:14,360
the things you can find there.

829
01:00:15,719 --> 01:00:18,960
Speaker 1: And use code Pete que get five percent off your orders.

830
01:00:19,119 --> 01:00:24,199
And usually you're going to order a large amount at once,

831
01:00:24,360 --> 01:00:29,079
so that the five percent will definitely definitely help. So Kurt,

832
01:00:29,280 --> 01:00:31,719
I appreciate it. Thank you very much, thanks for the talk.

833
01:00:32,639 --> 01:00:34,360
Speaker 2: Yeah, thank you for having me. This has been great.

834
01:01:00,320 --> 01:01:00,360
S