WEBVTT 1 00:00:00.080 --> 00:00:03.000 Good trip to Kansas City, winning two out of three. 2 00:00:03.080 --> 00:00:05.280 Off today, back out of over the weekend in Chicago, 3 00:00:05.320 --> 00:00:07.519 then back home. But as you may know, there's been 4 00:00:07.519 --> 00:00:11.320 an effort to apply civil rights laws to someone other 5 00:00:11.359 --> 00:00:15.000 than African Americans, and that is to white males. I've 6 00:00:15.039 --> 00:00:17.679 said many times in many places that we white males 7 00:00:17.679 --> 00:00:21.359 had a good run, but it's over. It's done. Know 8 00:00:21.480 --> 00:00:23.920 your role, shut your mouth. But there are some who say, now, 9 00:00:23.920 --> 00:00:26.480 wait a minute, we should have merit. We should not 10 00:00:26.559 --> 00:00:30.359 have race and gender considerations or creed and making serious 11 00:00:30.399 --> 00:00:34.200 appointments or electing public officials. Electing public officials is one 12 00:00:34.240 --> 00:00:37.159 thing that's a voter deciding. For example, everywhere I looked 13 00:00:37.159 --> 00:00:40.280 as only women in high political office. We men are done. 14 00:00:40.359 --> 00:00:43.880 The three county commissioners, prosecutor's office, the sheriff's office, the 15 00:00:43.960 --> 00:00:46.960 chief of police, the chief justice of the High Supreme Court. 16 00:00:47.200 --> 00:00:50.479 Women are everywhere. Women are ubiquitous. I'm not sure I 17 00:00:50.479 --> 00:00:52.960 can spell it, but I can say it ubiquitous. But 18 00:00:53.200 --> 00:00:56.520 there's someone fighting against the idea that maybe the discrimination 19 00:00:56.679 --> 00:00:59.600 and civil rights laws apply to everyone, and that is 20 00:00:59.640 --> 00:01:01.799 that Zach Gotdisman is one of the lawyers in the 21 00:01:01.840 --> 00:01:04.719 lawsuit against the City of Cincinnati and which he alleges 22 00:01:04.760 --> 00:01:07.560 there are certain shall I use the term white lieutenants 23 00:01:07.599 --> 00:01:10.359 being treated unfairly because of the color of their skin. 24 00:01:10.719 --> 00:01:13.480 And Zach Godisman, welcome to the Bill Cunningham Show. And 25 00:01:13.480 --> 00:01:16.000 first of all, Zach, would you tell the American people 26 00:01:16.040 --> 00:01:18.959 the essence of your lawsuit against the city of Cincinnati. 27 00:01:19.280 --> 00:01:22.599 Thank you, Willie for having me on the lawsuit we've filed. 28 00:01:23.000 --> 00:01:28.719 I'm representing four white male Cincinnati police lieutenants who have 29 00:01:30.439 --> 00:01:35.920 their case focuses on the fact that there is disparate 30 00:01:36.000 --> 00:01:39.239 treatment if you're a white male lieutenant in the Cincinnati 31 00:01:39.280 --> 00:01:44.879 Police force. Preferred assignments are handed out to minorities and 32 00:01:44.920 --> 00:01:51.400 to female lieutenants. And the preferred assignments come with economic 33 00:01:51.480 --> 00:01:58.159 benefits over time, call out, pay police vehicle, to use 34 00:01:58.239 --> 00:02:02.640 the personal vehicle. And if you're a white male, you're 35 00:02:02.640 --> 00:02:05.760 frequently assigned to one of the bureau, one of the 36 00:02:05.799 --> 00:02:09.319 districts to just you know, be a relief commander. 37 00:02:09.759 --> 00:02:11.719 Well, everyone knows this is going on. I mean, this 38 00:02:11.840 --> 00:02:15.599 is true. However, is this like a form of reparations? 39 00:02:16.000 --> 00:02:18.680 Is this like saying okay, for a long time, white 40 00:02:18.680 --> 00:02:21.560 males had control of the police department directly and indirectly, 41 00:02:21.960 --> 00:02:24.000 and how do you respond to the argument. My producer 42 00:02:24.039 --> 00:02:26.439 Tony Bender brings it up as know your role, shut 43 00:02:26.479 --> 00:02:29.520 your mouth. Isn't this a form of reparations? And is 44 00:02:29.560 --> 00:02:30.120 that legal? 45 00:02:30.319 --> 00:02:32.759 I don't think I don't think so. I think we 46 00:02:32.800 --> 00:02:35.599 should start out with the idea that a law enforcement 47 00:02:35.680 --> 00:02:39.599 agency should follow the current law, and the current law 48 00:02:39.680 --> 00:02:44.520 prohibits discrimination based on race or based on gender. The 49 00:02:44.599 --> 00:02:47.759 fact is, the city of Cincinnati has remained entrenched and 50 00:02:48.199 --> 00:02:53.840 the idea is conceived in the eighties racial promotion consent decrease. 51 00:02:54.400 --> 00:02:58.240 They stuck to stubbornly, despite the fact that they openly 52 00:02:58.280 --> 00:03:02.199 acknowledged the law changed and those sort of race based 53 00:03:02.280 --> 00:03:06.400 promotion schemes were illegal, unconstitutional, and we had to fight, 54 00:03:06.840 --> 00:03:10.439 fight tooth and nail. Me and another attorney, Chris Weize, 55 00:03:10.960 --> 00:03:14.360 had been to court to challenge two different consent increase. 56 00:03:14.439 --> 00:03:17.599 One in the state court wanted the federal court to 57 00:03:17.639 --> 00:03:24.680 get those outdated, unconstitutional concepts removed from the police department 58 00:03:24.800 --> 00:03:27.479 so that they weren't utilized any further, and the city 59 00:03:27.520 --> 00:03:31.159 fought us all the way through. In fact, it's hard 60 00:03:31.159 --> 00:03:35.560 to believe, but the Department of Justice even challenged the city. 61 00:03:35.960 --> 00:03:39.719 The Department of Justice was on the side of the 62 00:03:39.800 --> 00:03:43.560 planets in those cases, saying that those race based and 63 00:03:43.639 --> 00:03:48.159 gender based promotion schemes had to be taken taken away 64 00:03:48.280 --> 00:03:50.199 because they were so plainly illegal. 65 00:03:50.479 --> 00:03:54.199 The officers filing this lawson like Robert Wilson, Patrick Cayton, 66 00:03:54.680 --> 00:03:58.439 Gerald Hodges, and Andrew Mitchell, didn't one of these individuals 67 00:03:58.479 --> 00:04:01.520 already have success getting us settlement a seventy five thousand 68 00:04:01.520 --> 00:04:05.240 dollars of public money because they suffered racial discrimination for 69 00:04:05.360 --> 00:04:07.560 being white. Isn't one of them already succeeded? 70 00:04:08.719 --> 00:04:13.919 That's right. The Lieutenant Mitchell was a plaintiff in the 71 00:04:14.080 --> 00:04:18.839 case with another then lieutenant who challenged the city's decision 72 00:04:18.959 --> 00:04:25.360 to create it a promotion spot for a gentleman. As Captain, 73 00:04:25.399 --> 00:04:30.319 Norris was promoted, and even though he'd scored had a 74 00:04:30.399 --> 00:04:33.920 lower score than both Schofield and Mitchell on a promotional 75 00:04:33.920 --> 00:04:38.399 eligibility exam, the city promoted him in front of both 76 00:04:38.680 --> 00:04:43.600 Lieutenant Mitchell and Lieutenant Schofield. Now istuately for Lieutenant Schofield, 77 00:04:43.639 --> 00:04:49.759 he's recently made captain and so his you know, Robert Wilson, 78 00:04:49.839 --> 00:04:54.000 another lieutenant at the time this initial charge was filed. 79 00:04:54.040 --> 00:04:55.680 He's been promoted to captain to it. 80 00:04:55.839 --> 00:04:58.920 So, Attorney Zach Gottessman, is there a way of objectively 81 00:04:59.000 --> 00:05:03.120 determining who's better, because sometimes subjectivity enters into it. But 82 00:05:03.399 --> 00:05:06.519 is it a merit? Can you objectively determine if a 83 00:05:06.600 --> 00:05:10.600 so called white male objectively does better on a test 84 00:05:10.800 --> 00:05:12.959 than a black male or a black female. Is it 85 00:05:13.000 --> 00:05:14.639 an objective way of determining this? 86 00:05:16.399 --> 00:05:16.839 There is? 87 00:05:17.040 --> 00:05:21.160 In fact, Ohio, the revised code provides for competitive exam 88 00:05:21.319 --> 00:05:27.279 for promotions. The promotions are different than preferred assignments, so 89 00:05:28.000 --> 00:05:33.600 the city has again tried to reduce the waiting or 90 00:05:33.639 --> 00:05:38.800 the amount of objective measurement in the promotional exam, opting 91 00:05:38.920 --> 00:05:43.279 for more subjective portions of testing, like a verbal assessment, 92 00:05:44.600 --> 00:05:48.600 different things where there's no objective right or wrong. And 93 00:05:48.639 --> 00:05:52.040 they've clearly done that. We have emails that have been 94 00:05:52.079 --> 00:05:55.000 gained to the discovery process that show they were doing 95 00:05:55.040 --> 00:05:59.560 that to affect the racial makeup of the promotion. Now 96 00:05:59.560 --> 00:06:03.560 it's abil of you with an overt statement that we're 97 00:06:03.639 --> 00:06:08.000 changing this just to affect the racial breakdown. And when 98 00:06:08.000 --> 00:06:11.360 it comes to excuse me, will I don't mean to 99 00:06:11.360 --> 00:06:14.040 talk over you. But when it comes to preferred assignments 100 00:06:14.600 --> 00:06:18.519 we have it's outlined in that complaint. It's too detailed 101 00:06:18.519 --> 00:06:20.680 to go through in this forum, but I'll tell you this. 102 00:06:21.800 --> 00:06:27.040 The officers with the street experience have something by which 103 00:06:27.120 --> 00:06:30.600 the community would benefit if they were put in charge 104 00:06:30.959 --> 00:06:34.560 of some of these preferred assignments. And the city suffers 105 00:06:35.079 --> 00:06:39.000 when the chief takes someone and promotes them based out 106 00:06:39.000 --> 00:06:42.560 of either their gender or their race and overlooks a 107 00:06:42.600 --> 00:06:46.519 white male lieutenant who has experience and the ability to 108 00:06:46.600 --> 00:06:51.959 do the job better and more thoroughly. And let's face it, 109 00:06:51.959 --> 00:06:55.240 shouldn't the police department just follow the law. 110 00:06:55.800 --> 00:06:58.120 That would be a novel concept. But I'm not sure 111 00:06:58.120 --> 00:07:00.720 about that. I have I have a quote here from 112 00:07:00.800 --> 00:07:05.319 the president of the Sentinel, which is the Black Cop organization. 113 00:07:05.439 --> 00:07:09.079 Why there has to be a black cop organization within 114 00:07:09.120 --> 00:07:12.000 the organization. I have no idea. The usefulness I think 115 00:07:12.040 --> 00:07:16.240 has long since passed. But nonetheless, the president of the Sentinels, 116 00:07:16.439 --> 00:07:20.000 Stuart Isaac, said this quote, we're scratching our heads because 117 00:07:20.079 --> 00:07:24.199 the math isn't mathing. Quote unquote, We're scratching our heads 118 00:07:24.240 --> 00:07:28.040 because the math isn't mathing. Quote unquote, what the hell 119 00:07:28.079 --> 00:07:30.079 does that mean? I got the math here. 120 00:07:32.600 --> 00:07:35.079 I don't know what that means. But you know, if 121 00:07:35.079 --> 00:07:38.720 we were going to do the math, we would start 122 00:07:38.759 --> 00:07:44.120 with how many lieutenants are there, and then of those lieutenants, 123 00:07:44.120 --> 00:07:48.480 how many are white males? So if you break down 124 00:07:48.519 --> 00:07:52.759 the forty lieutenants, I think the breakdown is there's fifty 125 00:07:52.879 --> 00:07:57.519 five percent of white males. When you apply the maths 126 00:07:57.680 --> 00:08:00.680 and do the mathing going forward, you'll see that the 127 00:08:01.920 --> 00:08:07.800 number of white males in preferred assignments is drastically less 128 00:08:08.160 --> 00:08:11.959 than the percentage as part of the whole. It's a 129 00:08:12.040 --> 00:08:14.920 notion called per capita, and I know that gives some 130 00:08:15.000 --> 00:08:16.759 people problems. 131 00:08:16.519 --> 00:08:20.000 Per capita and per starpies in a will. But nonetheless, 132 00:08:20.720 --> 00:08:25.120 you say here, of the CPD minority lieutenants, seventy nine 133 00:08:25.160 --> 00:08:30.519 percent received preferred assignments, minority lieutenant seventy nine percent. Of 134 00:08:30.560 --> 00:08:34.039 the female lieutenants, eighty nine percent were given preferred assignments. 135 00:08:34.879 --> 00:08:37.360 Isn't that mathing not in favor of the white males. 136 00:08:38.879 --> 00:08:42.919 That's exactly right. You know that shows the city's preference. 137 00:08:43.720 --> 00:08:47.080 Well, and the person making this decision is chief of police. 138 00:08:47.120 --> 00:08:49.720 Thigi is that correct, Teresa Thigi. 139 00:08:49.360 --> 00:08:53.120 That's correct, and ultimately is chief, she bears the ultimate 140 00:08:53.159 --> 00:08:56.000 authority to decide those personnel assignments. 141 00:08:56.320 --> 00:08:59.279 Well, according to the Sentinel courte currently there's only three 142 00:08:59.399 --> 00:09:02.240 female black lieutenants. I don't know how you come up 143 00:09:02.279 --> 00:09:05.440 with there's not preferential treatment when the system, by sharing 144 00:09:05.519 --> 00:09:08.600 numbers that created more opportunities for male whites. How do 145 00:09:08.639 --> 00:09:11.000 you respond to that one, sir? How do you respond 146 00:09:11.039 --> 00:09:11.360 to that one? 147 00:09:11.360 --> 00:09:16.000 Well, the way I would respond is, I think what 148 00:09:16.080 --> 00:09:19.480 we would all benefit from is to stop focusing on race. 149 00:09:19.919 --> 00:09:24.639 The pendulum has swung, you know, back and forth before. 150 00:09:24.759 --> 00:09:28.320 As you said that, you thought that we've the white 151 00:09:28.399 --> 00:09:29.200 male has had. 152 00:09:29.039 --> 00:09:30.240 A good run. 153 00:09:30.279 --> 00:09:34.919 But the time has passed. It's over. I think with 154 00:09:35.080 --> 00:09:39.399 the recent decisions from the Supreme Court that what we're 155 00:09:39.440 --> 00:09:43.519 all hoping for is that the pendulum swings back and 156 00:09:43.600 --> 00:09:47.039 stops in the middle where it doesn't favorable one favor 157 00:09:47.080 --> 00:09:50.080 one side over the other. We stop using race to 158 00:09:50.120 --> 00:09:52.679 divide us, and we stop using gender to divide us. 159 00:09:52.840 --> 00:09:57.879 That makes sense, there's no benefit. That don't make any sense. 160 00:09:57.960 --> 00:10:01.279 There's no benefits in that. Where I look in the 161 00:10:01.320 --> 00:10:05.320 major cities of this country, you probably can't find a white, 162 00:10:05.399 --> 00:10:08.360 straight Christian male with a search warrant. I look at 163 00:10:08.360 --> 00:10:11.559 the chiefs of police, et cetera. They're all, shall we say, 164 00:10:11.600 --> 00:10:17.039 persons of color or different orientations. And seemingly everyone is 165 00:10:17.080 --> 00:10:20.159 ignoring the US Supreme Court. Now, the US Supreme Court 166 00:10:20.200 --> 00:10:22.519 has said for years and decades, you can't do what 167 00:10:22.559 --> 00:10:26.039 the city is doing. But they're doing it anyway. They say, no, 168 00:10:26.120 --> 00:10:28.240 you're all and shut your mouth. We're in the city. 169 00:10:28.240 --> 00:10:30.279 We're gonna do what we want. If you try to 170 00:10:30.320 --> 00:10:32.600 work this out with city. The fathers and mothers in 171 00:10:32.639 --> 00:10:34.519 the city like the share of long and they have 172 00:10:34.639 --> 00:10:38.279 to have pair of alls. And what do they say, 173 00:10:38.440 --> 00:10:42.360 we have We have done that for years through the 174 00:10:42.480 --> 00:10:44.039 consent to Cree challenges. 175 00:10:45.240 --> 00:10:48.279 You know, it just falls on deaf ears. There's no 176 00:10:48.320 --> 00:10:52.120 one interested in making change of that nature in the city. 177 00:10:52.240 --> 00:10:54.559 Why our city is beholden to this pattern? 178 00:10:54.720 --> 00:10:57.720 Why? Well, what's the political motivation? What is it? 179 00:10:58.879 --> 00:11:01.960 I can't explain that. It's like I said to me, 180 00:11:02.080 --> 00:11:05.200 it seems like their goal should be to follow the 181 00:11:05.320 --> 00:11:06.720 law in this country. 182 00:11:06.840 --> 00:11:10.080 That makes no sense. Now, let me explain it to 183 00:11:10.159 --> 00:11:13.440 you this way. When the Democrats, even John Cranley and 184 00:11:13.519 --> 00:11:17.120 Charlie Lucan were in charge. They were like normal Democrats. 185 00:11:17.639 --> 00:11:21.559 By that, I mean they were working class individuals who 186 00:11:21.679 --> 00:11:26.159 cared about plumbers and bakers and bartenders and electricians and 187 00:11:26.200 --> 00:11:29.960 bus drivers. The Democratic Party now is controlled by the academics. 188 00:11:30.399 --> 00:11:33.200 They're the ones who are the hoy Toity types from Harvard, 189 00:11:33.639 --> 00:11:37.080 and they come into town with his ideas that American 190 00:11:37.159 --> 00:11:40.799 society needs to be completely shuffled, re ordered, and that 191 00:11:40.879 --> 00:11:43.799 too many of the Tom Striker types and the Larry 192 00:11:43.799 --> 00:11:46.080 Whalen types have been in charge for too long, the 193 00:11:46.240 --> 00:11:49.639 elder types, elder high school types, and they must stand 194 00:11:49.679 --> 00:11:53.840 down and allow other persons of different color, different race, 195 00:11:53.919 --> 00:11:57.080 different sexual orientation to get to take over. And they 196 00:11:57.080 --> 00:11:59.799 don't pay attention to the Supreme Court because they're not 197 00:12:00.120 --> 00:12:03.720 their account politically. And when the few lawsuits are filed 198 00:12:04.120 --> 00:12:06.559 eventually you know you're going to win, and they know 199 00:12:06.600 --> 00:12:08.799 you're going to win, but they're rather pay the seventy 200 00:12:08.799 --> 00:12:12.639 five thousand dollars in protection money rather than change to 201 00:12:12.720 --> 00:12:14.879 comply with the law. You know what I'm saying. 202 00:12:16.080 --> 00:12:19.799 Absolutely, that's proven true over and over again with although 203 00:12:20.480 --> 00:12:23.720 all the cases have been filed and resolved in the last, say, 204 00:12:23.840 --> 00:12:26.960 five or ten years. You know, nothing in this is 205 00:12:27.000 --> 00:12:31.279 intended to say that that ladies and men of the 206 00:12:31.320 --> 00:12:36.759 Cincinnati Police Department do this difficult job are unqualified for 207 00:12:36.840 --> 00:12:39.799 the current position they're holding. That's not what we're saying. 208 00:12:41.159 --> 00:12:45.720 What we are saying is that the city shouldn't predicate 209 00:12:46.279 --> 00:12:50.840 preferred assignments on what box you check. Instead, it should 210 00:12:50.840 --> 00:12:54.200 be based on your abilities and your experience and who 211 00:12:54.200 --> 00:12:58.679 would serve the public the best. And unfortunately, our city 212 00:12:59.039 --> 00:13:02.320 shines the light on other characteristics and it's more focused 213 00:13:02.320 --> 00:13:04.320 on things that should not matter. 214 00:13:05.399 --> 00:13:08.919 That's true, that's true. But you're saying that the three 215 00:13:08.960 --> 00:13:13.759 black female lieutenants and CPD are otherwise competent, but they 216 00:13:13.759 --> 00:13:17.080 should not have been there because objectively, they didn't score 217 00:13:17.120 --> 00:13:21.639 as high these four white male lieutenants on preferred assignments 218 00:13:21.639 --> 00:13:25.320 and other promotions. And you get the preferred assignments, then 219 00:13:25.360 --> 00:13:28.039 it's easier to get the promotion, So it's money, it's 220 00:13:28.080 --> 00:13:32.799 also long term retirement benefits, et cetera. But there's a 221 00:13:32.919 --> 00:13:36.039 sense that we don't have to follow the law because 222 00:13:37.200 --> 00:13:40.679 because of affirmative action or because of reparations. We don't 223 00:13:40.720 --> 00:13:42.759 have to follow the law when they're caught, they'll pay off. 224 00:13:42.879 --> 00:13:45.399 You have every indication the city's going to collapse on 225 00:13:45.440 --> 00:13:47.480 this thing, as they always do. They can't stand to 226 00:13:47.519 --> 00:13:49.080 go to trial because they're going to lose and pay 227 00:13:49.080 --> 00:13:53.919 more money. And so at some point you're gonna win, correct. 228 00:13:54.200 --> 00:13:57.279 Yeah, absolutely, Yeah, you know, it's just a matter of time. 229 00:13:57.759 --> 00:14:00.360 And hopefully said at some point, you know, do what 230 00:14:00.399 --> 00:14:02.759 we can to get the city to correct its course. 231 00:14:03.360 --> 00:14:08.879 That's our goal. But at this point my confidence at 232 00:14:08.919 --> 00:14:15.360 the city and the police administration will actually change. I'm 233 00:14:15.360 --> 00:14:18.279 not very confident that I'll be able to infectuate that change. 234 00:14:18.320 --> 00:14:21.200 It won't happen. Zach Gottessman, the attorney for the PLANEFFS, 235 00:14:21.240 --> 00:14:24.279 because when Liz Keating lost two or three years ago, 236 00:14:24.360 --> 00:14:29.799 and she was a white female, straight identifying as a Republican, 237 00:14:30.080 --> 00:14:32.159 she spent all the money, had all the endorsements, and 238 00:14:32.240 --> 00:14:34.279 she finished way out of the money. And at that 239 00:14:34.399 --> 00:14:36.879 point it was the academics and the liberal Democrats that 240 00:14:36.879 --> 00:14:38.840 have taken over the city. We know their view about 241 00:14:39.080 --> 00:14:41.679 race and gender. They want to exploit that for personal gain. 242 00:14:42.240 --> 00:14:44.919 I can't think of a party that's done more damage 243 00:14:44.960 --> 00:14:48.360 to black folks in the Democratic Party historically, in the forties, 244 00:14:48.399 --> 00:14:51.559 fifties and sixties. I mean, keep the black kids out 245 00:14:51.559 --> 00:14:54.720 of the schools. A century before that, importing the slaves 246 00:14:54.720 --> 00:14:56.679 as the Democrats that beat the hell out of them, 247 00:14:56.799 --> 00:14:58.960 rape the women. We're going to fight a civil war 248 00:14:59.000 --> 00:15:02.440 to keep them, keep them incarcerated as slaves. Democratic Party 249 00:15:02.440 --> 00:15:04.759 did all that, and after that failed, they created the 250 00:15:04.840 --> 00:15:08.120 ku Klux Klan, and the KKK came after black folks. 251 00:15:08.120 --> 00:15:11.000 Happened repeatedly, and now we're in a in the last 252 00:15:11.080 --> 00:15:15.480 forty forty to fifty years, it's adding, subtracting, multiplying, dividing 253 00:15:15.519 --> 00:15:18.840 by race. They and now they want to exploit more 254 00:15:19.240 --> 00:15:22.120 the school system and law enforcement because they're successful in 255 00:15:22.200 --> 00:15:24.639 doing so. And all black folks need to do is 256 00:15:24.679 --> 00:15:27.279 look around and saying, you've been promising all these things 257 00:15:27.279 --> 00:15:29.799 for the last fifty to one hundred years, how's our 258 00:15:29.840 --> 00:15:33.080 schools looking, how's our streets looking? And the Democratic Party's 259 00:15:33.120 --> 00:15:35.759 been in charge the entire time, and guess what, they 260 00:15:35.879 --> 00:15:39.600 keep electing more Democrats, almost like the Stockholm syndrome. Can 261 00:15:39.639 --> 00:15:40.600 you smell what I'm cooking? 262 00:15:42.720 --> 00:15:45.360 Exactly? Well, you know, there's some wise people on our 263 00:15:45.399 --> 00:15:48.120 Supreme Court, and what they said is the best way 264 00:15:48.159 --> 00:15:52.879 to end racial discrimination is to stop discriminating by race. 265 00:15:53.240 --> 00:15:56.799 That makes sense, That makes no sense. There's no benefits 266 00:15:56.840 --> 00:16:00.360 in that. There's no benefits in that. I mean, the 267 00:16:00.399 --> 00:16:03.879 Irish roly types make six figure salaries to keep the 268 00:16:04.000 --> 00:16:06.480 racial differences alive, and the last thing they need is 269 00:16:06.519 --> 00:16:09.559 a non racial based society, which was the dream of 270 00:16:09.559 --> 00:16:12.799 Martin Luther King junior. But the Democrats know where the 271 00:16:12.840 --> 00:16:15.639 benefits are and they're not going to They're not going 272 00:16:15.679 --> 00:16:18.519 to give up their racial discrimination. They simply Democrats won't 273 00:16:18.519 --> 00:16:21.279 do that. But theyn't keep other money. 274 00:16:21.360 --> 00:16:24.600 They promised. They promised if we indulged in these sort 275 00:16:24.639 --> 00:16:28.399 of policies and programs that things would improve, and I 276 00:16:28.399 --> 00:16:32.000 would suggest the record reveals that to be false. I 277 00:16:32.039 --> 00:16:35.399 think crime has not gone down, No dysfunction has not 278 00:16:35.519 --> 00:16:38.879 gone down. The use of these sort of policies has 279 00:16:38.960 --> 00:16:42.399 contributed to the dysfunction that plagued this in the city 280 00:16:42.399 --> 00:16:46.240 of Cincinnati, and it's getting by all accounts, seems to 281 00:16:46.240 --> 00:16:46.919 be getting worse. 282 00:16:47.080 --> 00:16:51.039 You're electing Democrats to try the other path, maybe possibly, 283 00:16:51.159 --> 00:16:54.080 but hadn't worked yet. We'll see what happens. Zach Goddessman 284 00:16:54.440 --> 00:16:59.120 Planeffs for these white males seeking justice and equality and fairness, 285 00:16:59.519 --> 00:17:02.039 and those are odd concepts. But Zach God has been 286 00:17:02.120 --> 00:17:04.359 once again. Thanks for coming on the Bill Cunningham Show, 287 00:17:04.359 --> 00:17:06.240 and Zach you're a great American. Thank you very much, 288 00:17:07.960 --> 00:17:09.759 You're the man. I'll just continue with more. Plus we 289 00:17:09.880 --> 00:17:12.599 continue to follow the Pardoner PG sitting failed. I have 290 00:17:12.680 --> 00:17:14.759 certain messages out to see if I can get them on, 291 00:17:15.240 --> 00:17:17.240 and I'm more than happy to do it. And we'll 292 00:17:17.240 --> 00:17:19.240 talk about that more on the other side after the news. 293 00:17:19.319 --> 00:17:22.279 On news radio seven hundred WLW. 294 00:17:22.400 --> 00:17:26.960 The riveting podcast What Happened to Delena'zar unravels the chilling 295 00:17:27.039 --> 00:17:31.240 mystery surrounding a woman's disappearance during the COVID nineteen lockdown, 296 00:17:31.440 --> 00:17:34.359 the internet sleuths who wouldn't let it go, and the 297 00:17:34.519 --> 00:17:37.000 dark subcultures and betrayals they unearthed. 298 00:17:37.359 --> 00:17:40.000 There were a lot of secrets that were very hard 299 00:17:40.039 --> 00:17:40.519 to find. 300 00:17:41.000 --> 00:17:44.559 Listen to What Happened to Delenazar on America's number one 301 00:17:44.599 --> 00:17:48.680 podcast network, iHeart. Follow What Happened to Delenazar and start 302 00:17:48.720 --> 00:17:50.839 listening on the free iHeartRadio app. 303 00:17:50.880 --> 00:17:53.839 Today is banking constantly a source of stress. 304 00:17:54.119 --> 00:17:57.839 Good news, You've got options, General Electric Credit Union, is 305 00:17:57.880 --> 00:17:58.279 where open? 306 00:17:58.960 --> 00:18:01.480 All right, let's get it on. Billy Cunningham, the Great American. 307 00:18:02.359 --> 00:18:06.319 I received several Texas early in the morning talking about 308 00:18:06.319 --> 00:18:11.359 PG Sittenfeld and getting pardoned by the President. And if 309 00:18:11.359 --> 00:18:13.079 you listen to me for a long period of time, 310 00:18:13.119 --> 00:18:15.160 you know that I have a big heart. I'm a 311 00:18:15.279 --> 00:18:20.079 practicing Roman Catholic of rote frates, and I think forgiveness 312 00:18:20.119 --> 00:18:24.319 and acknowledging other people's peccadillos and forgiving them as part 313 00:18:24.319 --> 00:18:27.519 of the process of getting better. And no point did 314 00:18:27.599 --> 00:18:32.039 I feel that PG. Sittenfeld belonged in federal prison for 315 00:18:32.079 --> 00:18:35.119 sixteen months. At no point that I believe that you 316 00:18:35.160 --> 00:18:38.480 and I are not safer if Martha Stewart's locked up 317 00:18:38.480 --> 00:18:41.839 in a West Virginia federal facility. We have that pass awkwards. 318 00:18:42.480 --> 00:18:45.839 I cannot imagine the millions and millions of dollars spent 319 00:18:46.680 --> 00:18:51.119 on the investigation of PG Sittenfeld resulting in his conviction 320 00:18:52.240 --> 00:18:56.359 on counts of bribery and extortion and then on the 321 00:18:56.400 --> 00:18:59.960 Sixth Circuit US Court of Appeals after serving four four 322 00:19:00.079 --> 00:19:02.640 and a half months in federal prison. Are you and 323 00:19:02.680 --> 00:19:04.559 I safer with him locked up for four and a 324 00:19:04.599 --> 00:19:08.599 half months? Huh? I don't think so, but they let 325 00:19:08.640 --> 00:19:11.759 him out six Circuit as tipping whether or not they're 326 00:19:11.759 --> 00:19:15.079 going to overturn the conviction. What he did was close 327 00:19:15.119 --> 00:19:17.319 to the line. Over the line, whatever it might be. 328 00:19:17.759 --> 00:19:21.960 Politicians raise money generally from those who benefit from their policies, 329 00:19:22.039 --> 00:19:25.480 one way or another. In fact, all three judges on 330 00:19:25.519 --> 00:19:29.160 the US Circuit Sixth Court of Appeals here in Cincinnati, 331 00:19:29.319 --> 00:19:31.920 which by the way, handles federal appeals from the state 332 00:19:31.920 --> 00:19:35.160 of Michigan, Ohio, Kentucky, Tennessee. It's called the Sixth Circuit. 333 00:19:35.519 --> 00:19:41.640 They review all the district court decisions in those four states. 334 00:19:41.799 --> 00:19:43.640 All three of them said in the two to one 335 00:19:43.799 --> 00:19:47.359 upholding the conviction that this is such a close case 336 00:19:47.480 --> 00:19:51.319 about First Amendment and other issues, the US Supreme Court 337 00:19:51.400 --> 00:19:55.079 needs to rule on this because it's so close to 338 00:19:55.119 --> 00:19:58.759 the line. And so are you and I safer having 339 00:19:58.839 --> 00:20:02.240 the FBI and the dh spend millions and millions and 340 00:20:02.279 --> 00:20:07.279 millions of dollars to catch individuals like PG Sittenfeld or 341 00:20:07.400 --> 00:20:09.680 Larry Householder? Are we safer with that kind of stuff? 342 00:20:09.680 --> 00:20:15.119 I don't think we're safer. It's using limited criminal federal 343 00:20:15.160 --> 00:20:19.400 resources and not going after fentanyl dealers or human trafficking. 344 00:20:19.440 --> 00:20:23.319 There's massive human trafficking, trafficking of young girls and boys 345 00:20:23.559 --> 00:20:25.799 happening as I speak right now in the Tri State, 346 00:20:26.519 --> 00:20:28.480 and they don't have the resources to go into that 347 00:20:29.640 --> 00:20:32.640 or that the importation of fentanyl and drugs and heroin 348 00:20:33.000 --> 00:20:37.960 cocaine into the Tri State. Don't have time for that 349 00:20:38.039 --> 00:20:41.279 because they're going after pg's Sittingfeld now should have gotten 350 00:20:41.319 --> 00:20:43.759 off scott free. I don't think so. It was convicted, 351 00:20:44.400 --> 00:20:47.400 but sending him to prison for sixteen months made no 352 00:20:47.480 --> 00:20:52.119 sense to me at all. And Tamai A. Dennard and 353 00:20:52.400 --> 00:20:54.640 Jeff past Or, two of the other council members hooked 354 00:20:54.640 --> 00:20:59.240 into this deal may blatant application to certain individuals to 355 00:20:59.319 --> 00:21:04.079 get cash, and those are no brainers. Toamay Denarid went 356 00:21:04.119 --> 00:21:06.440 to prison I think for about a year, and Jeff Pastor, 357 00:21:07.200 --> 00:21:09.400 I'm not sure where he is in the criminal justice system. 358 00:21:09.400 --> 00:21:12.359 I assume he served a sentence in both those cases. 359 00:21:13.039 --> 00:21:16.559 We better off having convicted those individuals locking them up, 360 00:21:17.079 --> 00:21:20.039 I don't think so. We're not safer with Toamaya Denard, 361 00:21:20.279 --> 00:21:22.319 who's now doing good work for those who have come 362 00:21:22.359 --> 00:21:24.480 out of prison, by the way, in a charitable group, 363 00:21:25.440 --> 00:21:28.559 and same thing with Jeff Pastor. He was a clown 364 00:21:29.400 --> 00:21:33.400 and clowns ought to be convicted. He was in a jet. 365 00:21:33.440 --> 00:21:36.359 The FBI undercover took him in a jet. I think 366 00:21:36.440 --> 00:21:39.599 from here to Miami and have him in the jet 367 00:21:39.680 --> 00:21:42.680 all wired up, talking about all the money he needs 368 00:21:42.720 --> 00:21:47.000 to for some project. Get him out of politics. Can't 369 00:21:47.039 --> 00:21:52.359 run again. They're gone, no problem. But same thing with 370 00:21:52.680 --> 00:21:56.839 Larry Householder. He's now. I think he's close to seventy 371 00:21:56.920 --> 00:22:00.759 years old, convicted of participating in a sixty million dollar 372 00:22:01.039 --> 00:22:04.200 paid a play scandal with the Ohio State House, trading 373 00:22:04.279 --> 00:22:08.359 donations from First Energy for a one billion dollar bailout. 374 00:22:09.000 --> 00:22:12.559 Along with his compatriot, they're Matt Borges. They happen to 375 00:22:12.559 --> 00:22:15.559 get in front of a sentencing judge and Cincinnati named 376 00:22:15.599 --> 00:22:19.319 Judge Tim Black, who hates white collar criminals. This guy 377 00:22:19.400 --> 00:22:22.839 is from Harvard and so he gave him twenty years 378 00:22:22.839 --> 00:22:26.599 in jail. Now there was life imprisonment for taking these bribes. 379 00:22:27.519 --> 00:22:30.160 Are we better off with Larry Householder and Matt Borge 380 00:22:30.240 --> 00:22:35.599 is locked up? Convicted? Okay, good, they were convicted, probation, 381 00:22:35.759 --> 00:22:38.440 whatever it is. Don't go, don't commit any more crimes. 382 00:22:38.440 --> 00:22:40.680 You can't be in office. Anymore, But no, we want 383 00:22:40.720 --> 00:22:45.400 to stroke these individuals twenty years, and Matt Borges's case, 384 00:22:45.440 --> 00:22:48.720 I think he got five years, as if we're safer 385 00:22:48.720 --> 00:22:51.839 with them locked up. There's forms of punishment, but yes, punishment, 386 00:22:51.960 --> 00:22:56.799 yes PG. Sittenfeld very close case, but to lock him 387 00:22:56.880 --> 00:23:00.920 up in a federal prison Martha Stewart's style makes no 388 00:23:01.079 --> 00:23:06.400 sense to me whatsoever. I understand that the lawyers for 389 00:23:06.559 --> 00:23:10.279 Matt Borches and Larry Householder I think his name is 390 00:23:10.279 --> 00:23:13.680 Steve Bradley comes to mind, is seeking a pardon for 391 00:23:13.720 --> 00:23:16.799 them too. And I think each have been locked up 392 00:23:16.839 --> 00:23:19.759 for a couple of years at this point, if not longer, 393 00:23:20.000 --> 00:23:23.200 and they had no no chance in Larry Householder is 394 00:23:23.240 --> 00:23:27.079 going to die in prison. Twenty years? Well, it's two years, okay? 395 00:23:27.119 --> 00:23:29.680 Would you be okay with one year? Two years? Have 396 00:23:29.759 --> 00:23:30.960 you been in prison before? 397 00:23:31.759 --> 00:23:31.960 Well? 398 00:23:32.000 --> 00:23:35.640 I have been. I've been in most of the jails 399 00:23:35.640 --> 00:23:38.519 of the Tri State. I've been in federal federal prisons. 400 00:23:38.960 --> 00:23:45.160 I've been in Lucasville, Chillicothee. It's ugly, it's bad, not good. 401 00:23:45.240 --> 00:23:48.559