Speaker 1: Most of the country just celebrated to founding by blowing
Speaker 1: stuff up. So here's a reminder that the USA is
Speaker 1: not the greatest country in the world. We stop being
Speaker 1: a full democracy a decade ago. The world now files
Speaker 1: us under a flawed democracy label. The Make America Great
Speaker 1: Again crowd has simply redefined great to mean something antithetical
Speaker 1: to every measure of a healthy society.
Speaker 2: We spend more.
Speaker 1: On healthcare than any nation in history, but yet we
Speaker 1: die three point seven.
Speaker 2: Years younger for just for that privilege.
Speaker 1: A mother is more likely to die giving birth here
Speaker 1: than in nearly any other rich country on Earth. Our
Speaker 1: infant mortality sits near the bottom of the developed world.
Speaker 1: One in five American kids is poor, while the top
Speaker 1: fifth takes home more than five times what the bottom
Speaker 1: fifth ever sees, and we rank thirty six of thirty
Speaker 1: eighth wealthy nations for child wellbeing. A child here is
Speaker 1: more likely to be killed by a gun than anything else,
Speaker 1: at a rate of thirty three times Australia's and seventy
Speaker 1: seven times Germany's. More sixth in child literacy, fourteenth in
Speaker 1: adult literacy, twenty fourth in numeracy, twenty sixth.
Speaker 2: In math, and tenth in science.
Speaker 1: The people who could fix that either flat out refuse
Speaker 1: or just send strongly worded letters. But we're number one
Speaker 1: in plenty of things. We cage more of our own
Speaker 1: people than any democracy on earth, and hold about a
Speaker 1: third of all the incarcerated women on the planet. We
Speaker 1: leave the world in defense spending in children killed by firearms,
Speaker 1: and most adults here believe in a Jewish wizard. Believe
Speaker 1: that a Jewish wizard will save them. So that's what
Speaker 1: great means in practice. The most prisoners, most dead kids,
Speaker 1: least educated, most spent on weapons, and least on a
Speaker 1: safety net, and the biggest share of a population that
Speaker 1: believes in magic.
Speaker 2: So was the USA ever really great?
Speaker 1: The constitution was built to exclude more than fifty eight
Speaker 1: percent of the population, written to serve a narrow slide
Speaker 1: some older white men. So no, I don't think that
Speaker 1: we can make a case that we were ever great.
Speaker 1: But what we what we did do, was slowly and
Speaker 1: consistently progress towards greatness. The last ten years has been
Speaker 1: a steady regression, and it's keeping America horrible. If you
Speaker 1: disagree with us about white Christian nationalism, about what white
Speaker 1: Christian nationalism has done to this country. Then please call
Speaker 1: in because the show starts. Now, what's up? He then's
Speaker 1: how y'all doing? I'm a godless engineer and today is
Speaker 1: July fifth, twenty twenty six, and we want to welcome
Speaker 1: you all to the Atheist Experience and thank you guys
Speaker 1: for joining us today. I'm your host, Godless Engineer John,
Speaker 1: and joining me today is Jim. How are you doing
Speaker 1: there today, Jim?
Speaker 3: I'm doing pretty good. I apologize for the background noise,
Speaker 3: but the the long guy just showed up.
Speaker 4: So he was he's supposed to show up Friday because
Speaker 4: he normally shows up on Saturday. But yeah, he's here now,
Speaker 4: so I may have to I'll have to duck out
Speaker 4: and pay him in just a second.
Speaker 3: But you know, or not doing pretty good. Finally fully employed,
Speaker 3: So that's always a good thing, you know. Arguing with
Speaker 3: people on the internet about whether or not their God
Speaker 3: exists always.
Speaker 1: Fou Oh yeah, I mean it seems to be like
Speaker 1: a constant thing on the Internet these days, is arguing
Speaker 1: with people about God or some kind of supernatural magical
Speaker 1: belief and how we can't expect, you know, a god
Speaker 1: to save us from you know, the hellscape that we
Speaker 1: seem to find ourselves in right now.
Speaker 3: Yeah, there are no good arguments for God. They're all horribly,
Speaker 3: horribly bad.
Speaker 4: But I've also started arguing with Christians about whether or
Speaker 4: not the Trinity exists, because let's face what the Trinity is.
Speaker 4: No matter how you sit, three equals one, and of
Speaker 4: course that makes it as sense.
Speaker 3: Right. There's just nothing about any of this that makes
Speaker 3: any kind of sense about the Christian belief So I
Speaker 3: just I don't understand why anybody is believes in this God.
Speaker 3: It just makes an s suze no.
Speaker 1: You know, honestly, I'm beginning to like every conversation I have.
Speaker 1: I'm totally bumfuzzled about, you know, why people still continue
Speaker 1: to believe.
Speaker 2: So just to get you know, some some caveats.
Speaker 1: Out of the way at the beginning of the show
Speaker 1: here The Atheists Experience is a product of the Atheist
Speaker 1: Community of Austin, a five O one C three nonprofit
Speaker 1: organization dedicated to the promotion of atheism, critical thinking, secular humanism,
Speaker 1: and the separation of religion and government. This means that
Speaker 1: you can give us a tax frednation as many as
Speaker 1: you want, in fact, and know not only that it
Speaker 1: is going to a good cause, but also it helps
Speaker 1: you too, and to let her I know we are
Speaker 1: try streaming tonight.
Speaker 2: Sorry, I just got there, we go.
Speaker 1: I just got accepted up on the TikTok side of
Speaker 1: the stream. But we are try streaming tonight. So a
Speaker 1: big shout out to our viewers over on TikTok and
Speaker 1: YouTube mobile. If you are watching us on TikTok tonight
Speaker 1: and you'd like to talk to us, then request to
Speaker 1: join and we'll bring you up on the stage, but
Speaker 1: please make sure that you are over eighteen years of
Speaker 1: age before doing so. So with that out of the way,
Speaker 1: we have a number of callers already lined up, so
Speaker 1: do you have an eye on which one you'd like
Speaker 1: to take first?
Speaker 5: There?
Speaker 4: Jim, Well, I think we can definitely show that the
Speaker 4: God of the Bible is evil, oh by his own rules.
Speaker 2: I do want to emphasize for people both.
Speaker 1: Well on YouTube, both the vertical and the horizontal stream
Speaker 1: over there on YouTube, you would like to contribute to
Speaker 1: any of the conversations that we're having today, be sure
Speaker 1: to send in those superchats. We will be addressing super
Speaker 1: chats near the end of the show, and so if
Speaker 1: you want our take on something, or you want your
Speaker 1: opinion to be heard, please go on ahead and send
Speaker 1: in those super chats. So we've got Jeremy up first
Speaker 1: that we're going to talk to. What's up there, Jeremy,
Speaker 1: how you doing?
Speaker 2: How's it going to that's going pretty good? What are
Speaker 2: you up to today?
Speaker 6: They're Jermy, Well, I'm just wondering. So let me ask
Speaker 6: you both. Do you both believe that God?
Speaker 7: Do you believe in God or in a God?
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's why this is the atheist experience. If I
Speaker 1: was not an atheist on the atheist experience, that would
Speaker 1: be kind of antithetical to the show topic.
Speaker 3: Right, Okay, understood.
Speaker 7: So how can you believe he is evil if you
Speaker 7: don't believe him to exist?
Speaker 1: Well, well, it's the character that's portrayed and Holy Books
Speaker 1: that we're saying is evil.
Speaker 6: So you believe this character to be fiction is evil?
Speaker 3: Yeah, you can always you can always say that fictional
Speaker 3: characters are evil. Right. I don't see anybody running around
Speaker 3: saying Sarron is a good guy, right.
Speaker 4: I Mean that's just as part of talking about a
Speaker 4: fictional world as if it's real, and we do that
Speaker 4: all the time.
Speaker 3: So there's no problem here at all.
Speaker 7: Yes, Well, one thing, it just really burns me up
Speaker 7: whenever I see so many people getting caught up on well,
Speaker 7: if God, you know, was good, then he wouldn't let
Speaker 7: this happen or that happen. And you know he's called
Speaker 7: evil people.
Speaker 6: Sauch as yourselves.
Speaker 7: But I really would like to just push back on
Speaker 7: that and say, you know, I think we're forgetting that.
Speaker 6: That Satan exists as well. If you're going to believe
Speaker 6: that God exists.
Speaker 7: And so many people get hung up.
Speaker 6: On well, why would God let this happen, that happen,
Speaker 6: say is evil and Satan exists?
Speaker 3: What do you believe that your God is on nepotent,
Speaker 3: all powerful?
Speaker 6: I believe my God is love.
Speaker 7: I'm not a Let me just not a question.
Speaker 3: Thank I did not ask that question. Please answer my question.
Speaker 8: You believe.
Speaker 6: I believe is okay?
Speaker 3: Well, so could you answer the question? You don't believe
Speaker 3: your God is omnipotent.
Speaker 7: I don't believe in the God that you you guys
Speaker 7: are talking about.
Speaker 1: I'm not Christian, okay, hold on, no, no, well no,
Speaker 1: so it doesn't matter if you're Christian nationalists, because Christian
Speaker 1: nationalists are barely Christian in the first place.
Speaker 2: So I can I read?
Speaker 6: No?
Speaker 1: Okay, well no, so so can I Can I read
Speaker 1: all the statement for you? Hold on, Jeremy, are you there?
Speaker 1: Can you hear me?
Speaker 2: Okay?
Speaker 1: Can I let me let me read a statement off
Speaker 1: to you real quick, and I want you to tell
Speaker 1: me whether or not this is God or if it's Satan.
Speaker 1: Can can you do that for me?
Speaker 3: Yeah? Okay? Uh.
Speaker 1: The statement is one should strive to act with compassion
Speaker 1: and empathy toward all creatures in accordance with reason. Now
Speaker 1: does that sound like Satan or is that God?
Speaker 7: It's probably Satan.
Speaker 3: It's probably okay?
Speaker 1: Oh, good, good on you, because yes, that is tenant
Speaker 1: number one of the Satanic Temple. Now what part of
Speaker 1: that would you consider to be evil?
Speaker 7: I believe that that Satan never said that, and I
Speaker 7: believe that whoever worships Satan is just literally just taking
Speaker 7: words from God and saying, okay, Satan said this.
Speaker 3: Well we're going to.
Speaker 7: Say Satan said this, okay, another Satanic temple, Like, I
Speaker 7: don't believe anything that they have to say.
Speaker 2: Okay, do you believe what the Bible says?
Speaker 3: I believe parts of.
Speaker 2: The Bible you believe you. Okay, so you cherry picked
Speaker 2: the Bible.
Speaker 6: That's my right to do. So you can call it
Speaker 6: cherry picking.
Speaker 2: Well, did did God inspire the Bible?
Speaker 1: Or is God responsible for the Bible?
Speaker 6: Let me ask you a question, just one question.
Speaker 1: No, no, this is this is not how this no? No,
Speaker 1: hold on, I'll let you ask you for a second.
Speaker 1: You don't, I'll let you ask your question here in
Speaker 1: a second, Jeremy. If you can't, if you can't follow
Speaker 1: the ship that like like the host the hosting guidance here,
Speaker 1: then you know we can.
Speaker 2: We can move on. We get plenty of other callers.
Speaker 1: Go okay, I'm going to read a statement to you,
Speaker 1: and I want you to tell me if God said
Speaker 1: this or if Satan said this.
Speaker 7: Okay, okay, But if I don't believe Satan said it,
Speaker 7: then what's the point of of you've been asking? No?
Speaker 1: No, no, well no, it's either God. I'm giving you a choice.
Speaker 1: It's either God said it or Satan said it, and
Speaker 1: I want you to pick pick which one. Okay, okay,
Speaker 1: all right. It says now, go and attack the Amalekites
Speaker 1: and devote to destruction, utterly destroy all that belongs to them,
Speaker 1: do not spare them, but put to death men and women,
Speaker 1: children and infants, oxen and sheep, camels and donkeys. Now,
Speaker 1: this is telling a group of people to go and
Speaker 1: kill children, infants, and women. Do you figure that that
Speaker 1: is God or Satan?
Speaker 8: God said it?
Speaker 2: God said it? So you earlier, I want to go back.
Speaker 1: You've characterized God, your God, is being a god of love,
Speaker 1: but then you've also characterized God as telling people to
Speaker 1: go and stab children and infants and women in the
Speaker 1: face or in the chest or however you want to
Speaker 1: execute these children and infants. You've claimed that your God
Speaker 1: is a god of love, but then you seem to
Speaker 1: brand things that are actually loving, like compassion and empathy
Speaker 1: and all that as not being loving, but as being
Speaker 1: Satan or Satanic. And then you know this right here
Speaker 1: is somehow loving, Like how is it loving to stab
Speaker 1: a child in the face?
Speaker 7: Do you believe in Satan?
Speaker 2: No, that doesn't matter. Can you please answer my question.
Speaker 7: You're bringing up something that Satan said as a form
Speaker 7: of an argument towards me and my argument.
Speaker 1: So no, right, believe I've pulled one verse from your Bible.
Speaker 1: I've pulled one verse from your Bible that you claims
Speaker 1: representative of an all loving God, and that verse includes
Speaker 1: God telling his people to stab babies in the face.
Speaker 1: And I'm wanting to know why you would think that
Speaker 1: that is somehow a loving act by a loving God.
Speaker 7: I don't because I simply just don't believe in that characterization.
Speaker 1: Okay, well what characterization would you call it? On First
Speaker 1: Samuel fifteen, verse three.
Speaker 7: I would just like to know if God showed himself
Speaker 7: to you both, would you believe in it?
Speaker 1: I would, I would believe he existed. I would not
Speaker 1: worship him.
Speaker 7: Okay, Okay, that's fine. You can't see oxygen, but you
Speaker 7: believe it's.
Speaker 9: Keeping you alive. Goodbye?
Speaker 8: What?
Speaker 2: Oh? But he fucking ran? He ran quick like there
Speaker 2: was a Okay.
Speaker 1: First of all, that felt like an impossible conversation because
Speaker 1: one he seems to be, you know, pulling his God
Speaker 1: belief from the buffet of Christianity as opposed to, you know,
Speaker 1: sticking with established theologies. He's decided to construct his own
Speaker 1: DIY version of God.
Speaker 2: And that's always really.
Speaker 1: Tough to you know, have a discussion with, because they
Speaker 1: literally just arbitrarily pick which things are good and which
Speaker 1: things are bad.
Speaker 3: Yeah, Well, I was kind of wanting to get into
Speaker 3: like one Corinthians thirteen four nasheate right, where we get
Speaker 3: a definition of what love is. Love is patient kind
Speaker 3: does not havevy, envy, Envy and jealous here kind of synonyms.
Speaker 3: And then we get Exodus thirty four to fourteen. Do
Speaker 3: not worries for bening God. For the Lord whose name
Speaker 3: is jealous is ahealous God. I would love to have
Speaker 3: him to have justified his belief in God that way.
Speaker 3: But I mean, yeah, and then you doing me who
Speaker 3: said it no wonder?
Speaker 10: Now?
Speaker 1: Yeah, I hope that we can we can actually ask
Speaker 1: somebody that particular question, because I would like to know
Speaker 1: what their take is on the definition of love versus
Speaker 1: what they think God's love is. But all right, uh,
Speaker 1: we do have plenty of callers lined up, So do
Speaker 1: you want to go ahead and get to the next
Speaker 1: one there?
Speaker 2: Jim ahead, All right.
Speaker 1: Next up, we've got Courtney calling in from Florida.
Speaker 2: What's up, Courtney.
Speaker 1: I'm so sorry you're in Florida, but I'm glad that
Speaker 1: you're calling in today.
Speaker 9: What do you mean it's beautiful down here?
Speaker 2: Yeah, I can't mention it on this show. Yeah, all right, so.
Speaker 1: Courtney here, yep, we got you.
Speaker 11: Yeah, it's beautiful down here. Fourth of July yesterday, lots
Speaker 11: of fireworks. It was a great, beautiful, beautiful day, beautiful weekend.
Speaker 4: Yeah, and the local neighborhood fireworks take into account that
Speaker 4: there might be veterans with PTSD near you or did
Speaker 4: you guys just not care?
Speaker 3: No, we didn't care.
Speaker 5: We just ended.
Speaker 3: That's what I thought.
Speaker 11: Got them off too. Yeah, they were out there.
Speaker 3: I said veterans. I said veteran.
Speaker 4: I specifically said veterans with PTSD, not just veterans, because
Speaker 4: I am also a veteran. I do not have PHSD,
Speaker 4: but I know veterans friends of mine who have PTSD,
Speaker 4: for whom the fireworks, uh can trigger their PTSD quite easily.
Speaker 4: So yeah, so yeah, you know that's typical. So anyway,
Speaker 4: you want to ask us where we get our morals from?
Speaker 3: Right, we had a good time. We had a good time.
Speaker 4: Good for you. So where do you where do you
Speaker 4: we get? Where do if you get morals from? I
Speaker 4: got mine from a cracker jack box? What does it matter?
Speaker 3: Where do you? Where do you get your morals from?
Speaker 11: If you if you don't get I get my morals
Speaker 11: from the Bible.
Speaker 3: So if you really get your morals from can I
Speaker 3: buy your daughter? If you don't get can I buy
Speaker 3: your daughter? What's that? Can I buy your daughter? Can
Speaker 3: you buy my daughter?
Speaker 5: Wall?
Speaker 11: It is, it's actually opposite of that.
Speaker 1: Wait, wait it depends. Did you just say it depends?
Speaker 1: Like what does it depend on the price tag? Like
Speaker 1: are you going to negotiate? Like do you want to
Speaker 1: open up like a line of negotiations or something.
Speaker 11: It's actually it's the opposite of that of the Bible.
Speaker 11: You're supposed to give a dowry to somebody that wants
Speaker 11: to marry your daughter.
Speaker 4: No, no, so I said, is twenty one seven through eleven.
Speaker 4: Let me quote you that. Let me quote your Bible
Speaker 4: for you. Exaid it's twenty one seven through eleven.
Speaker 3: If a man sells his daughter to be a female servant,
Speaker 3: she shall not go out as the male slaves do.
Speaker 3: If she doesn't please her master, who has married her
Speaker 3: to himself, that he shall let her be redeemed.
Speaker 4: Yeah, I shall have no right to sell her. Yeah,
Speaker 4: So that's selling. That is literally selling a daughter into slavery.
Speaker 4: Your Bible says that you can do it.
Speaker 11: Is it slavery or is it just.
Speaker 3: Being married slavery? It's the words that uses, if a
Speaker 3: man sells his daughter to be a female slave, she
Speaker 3: shall not go out as the male slaves do. So
Speaker 3: not only can you sell your daughter into a slave,
Speaker 3: she's got a whole different set of rules that men do,
Speaker 3: and she can't go free like a like if you
Speaker 3: had sold your son. If you sell your son, and
Speaker 3: your son can go free if he's Jewish, but not
Speaker 3: your daughter, is that moral? Would my daughter be Jewish? Also?
Speaker 3: It's a yes or no question. It's a yes or
Speaker 3: no question. Is that moral? Is it moral to sell
Speaker 3: your daughter into slavery where she cannot be redeemed, she
Speaker 3: can't get out of it. That's called bearriage. No, slavery
Speaker 3: is what we're talking about.
Speaker 11: Slavery is what you're talking about. We're talking about marriage.
Speaker 11: That's what you first know.
Speaker 3: I'm literally, I'm reading to you what the Bible verse
Speaker 3: literally is it says, quote, if a man sells his
Speaker 3: daughter to be a female slave, she shall not go
Speaker 3: out as the male slaves do. Oh yeah, that's not marriage,
Speaker 3: that's slavery.
Speaker 9: Yeah, that is slavery.
Speaker 3: But she is good, she is getting fucked.
Speaker 11: He's getting what somebody is getting banged, somebody's tucking her.
Speaker 3: Yeah, that's what slavery is.
Speaker 4: She has no choice, you know what we creat Yeah,
Speaker 4: that's slavery and rape. Your your Your morals are bat
Speaker 4: in a thousand here, aren't they?
Speaker 3: You want to continue on her when you're agree that
Speaker 3: the Bible.
Speaker 4: Is a horrible place to get morals from, and that
Speaker 4: we are more moral as a modern society, that things,
Speaker 4: all forms of slavery are bad things, all forms of
Speaker 4: rape are bad.
Speaker 3: Is better than anything your Bible will produce? Or do
Speaker 3: you want them to keep kicking you out on this one?
Speaker 11: You're saying that, So you're saying that my Bible says
Speaker 11: that slavery and rape is okay.
Speaker 4: Yes, yes, I just read you the exact verse. It
Speaker 4: says that slavery and slavery of women.
Speaker 3: I got more slavery verses that will show you that
Speaker 3: chattel slavery is absolutely okay by your Bible.
Speaker 1: All right, yeah, well, sot me, Courtney, Courtney, do you
Speaker 1: recall Well, hold on, so, Courtney, do you remember, do
Speaker 1: you recall the story of Jacob before he got.
Speaker 2: Renamed into Israel?
Speaker 1: Enlightened me Okay, So Jacob is strolling through uh you
Speaker 1: know the area at that time, and you know, he
Speaker 1: basically passes I forget what is what his name is, uh,
Speaker 1: the father's house, right, and and of course he sees
Speaker 1: the uh probably seven year old girl and then.
Speaker 2: A fourteen year old girl right.
Speaker 1: And he sees them and he's like, hey, I want
Speaker 1: to purchase that older girl right there.
Speaker 2: I believe that would have been Leah.
Speaker 3: Right.
Speaker 1: So the father was like, okay, you can work for
Speaker 1: seven years to purchase my daughter. And then, you know,
Speaker 1: he works for seven years and then the father actually
Speaker 1: gives him the younger daughter and he doesn't realize it
Speaker 1: until the morning after he rapes her and is married
Speaker 1: to her, and so he has to work for another
Speaker 1: seven years in order to buy the other daughter. Now,
Speaker 1: do you see this as as him selling his daughters
Speaker 1: to a man, And do you think that there is
Speaker 1: any situation or there there's any indication in the text
Speaker 1: that the girl's consent was ever considered.
Speaker 3: If I was.
Speaker 11: In that situation, is that when you're asking no, no.
Speaker 1: No, I'm asking you if God's text the the the
Speaker 1: man that God chose to base his hold hold on,
Speaker 1: hold on Courtney. I'm asking you if if the god
Speaker 1: that wrote the Bible chose the man to base his
Speaker 1: entire special group of people off of bought his two
Speaker 1: wives who came with two concubines, right, did did he
Speaker 1: buy them or did he uh, you know, ask their
Speaker 1: consent and marry them?
Speaker 3: I don't know.
Speaker 11: The Bible is something that is something that I understand
Speaker 11: why you don't understand it? Back then men were men
Speaker 11: and they used to cut up.
Speaker 3: Well, you're okay with slavery, You're okay. You're saying that
Speaker 3: slavery and rape are okay, you're okay with those? Yes, Yes,
Speaker 3: it is, yes, because the Bible that we're giving you
Speaker 3: black letter word for words, straight from the Bible, and
Speaker 3: you're agreeing with it.
Speaker 8: Giving they're trying to that's what you say.
Speaker 3: They're trying to. They don't believe in Jesus.
Speaker 11: Yeah, and even the Old and even the Old Testament, some.
Speaker 8: Of these things that they're bringing up.
Speaker 3: I don't mind them. I really you don't mind being
Speaker 3: able to sell your daughter into slavery so she can
Speaker 3: get raimed.
Speaker 2: Wow.
Speaker 3: Ye, And you're going to try and claim that your
Speaker 3: morals are better than ours. We're not talking about marriage.
Speaker 3: There's no word marriage and Exodus twenty one seven through eleven.
Speaker 3: Look it up yourself. I'm sure you've got a Bible
Speaker 3: right there next to you. Flip it open, read it.
Speaker 3: Do you have children? It doesn't matter. I would never
Speaker 3: ever sell my daughter. I would never ever obey this
Speaker 3: particular quote from the Bible. Ever you and no, I
Speaker 3: would not. I do not want, nor do I would
Speaker 3: I need any type of dowry for her.
Speaker 4: That's just selling her into that's still selling her into slavery.
Speaker 3: So you have no, I don't have children, it's irrelevant. Yeah,
Speaker 3: the Bible says if a man sells his daughter, sells
Speaker 3: his daughter to be a female slave. That's what you're
Speaker 3: dream kill. You're saying, is that's okay?
Speaker 5: No?
Speaker 11: Modern day Oh no, modern day slavery is fucking chains
Speaker 11: and whips and all.
Speaker 3: You want to You want to go there, we can
Speaker 3: go there. Go ahead.
Speaker 1: Well, I was yeah, I was just going to say
Speaker 1: that that you're you're making courtney. Are you listening to
Speaker 1: us at all? Or are you having a conversation with
Speaker 1: your wife?
Speaker 5: Oh no, you're a speaker.
Speaker 10: I can hear you.
Speaker 1: Oh no, I understand that. I was just making if
Speaker 1: I was going to be talking. I just wanted I
Speaker 1: wanted him to be like, sorry, I'm not sure how
Speaker 1: to respond.
Speaker 2: To you, because are you a he or a she?
Speaker 2: Or are they? Like I'm not sure?
Speaker 11: Oh no, oh no no, no, no, no, no no.
Speaker 11: We're not going for a liberal babble.
Speaker 9: For liberal.
Speaker 12: Like.
Speaker 1: For one thing, ma'am, I am not a liberal. I'm
Speaker 1: a leftist for one. For two, I just want to
Speaker 1: actually be able to refer to him accurately. Otherwise, I'm
Speaker 1: just gonna go with whatever my intuition gives me, and
Speaker 1: I'm gonna call uh Courtney as she and whoever you
Speaker 1: are he.
Speaker 13: Oh, that's fine, you can call him a she, but
Speaker 13: I know.
Speaker 3: He has a dick.
Speaker 1: Okay, that doesn't actually distinguish the fact.
Speaker 8: Yeah.
Speaker 4: So anyway, let's let's go back to the Bible. Let's
Speaker 4: open our bibles. Grab your Bible and please open it.
Speaker 4: Tax it is twenty one versus twenty through twenty one, And.
Speaker 3: Let us read. If a man try his slave with
Speaker 3: a rod, and he dies under his hand, he shall
Speaker 3: surely be punished. Notwithstanding if he gets up after a
Speaker 3: day or two, he shall not be punished for he
Speaker 3: is his property, and that the word the Hebrew word
Speaker 3: for property.
Speaker 4: There actually is also the Hebrew word for silver, so
Speaker 4: you can also translate that as money.
Speaker 3: So what you just said, again, here we are with
Speaker 3: an atheist teaching you what's in your bible. You just said,
Speaker 3: slavery is whips and chains and beating slaves, And here
Speaker 3: we have the Bible saying you can do that, and
Speaker 3: you're okay with that. You're okay with slavery.
Speaker 8: Actually if it's you too, he said, especially.
Speaker 3: If it's us. Yeah, So you're okay with slavery. We
Speaker 3: got that. So you're a moral monster by today's standards.
Speaker 3: You are a moral monster. How does that? How does
Speaker 3: that make you feel?
Speaker 4: Knowing that you are an evil person by modern standards?
Speaker 3: Puns you guys both in fucking chains?
Speaker 5: Oh?
Speaker 1: Will you do you normally think about putting two men
Speaker 1: in chains for your pleasure?
Speaker 11: It's for my advancement, not my pleasure, your advancement.
Speaker 2: Are you going to advance on me?
Speaker 3: There?
Speaker 2: But that sounds real crapy to me.
Speaker 4: Yeah, also sound sounds sounds sounds a little gay.
Speaker 1: So now, Courtney, I'm wondering you say that you get
Speaker 1: your morals from the Bible.
Speaker 2: Can you tell me now.
Speaker 3: What we're quoting our game? Our game is quoting the Bible.
Speaker 3: You're the one threatening to put us in chains, So
Speaker 3: let's get it right. Yeah.
Speaker 4: Yeah, So let's continue opening our Bible, shall we? And
Speaker 4: continue on with the Bible lesson where can you get
Speaker 4: your slaves from? That is answered in Leviticus chapter twenty five,
Speaker 4: forty four through forty six. As for your male and
Speaker 4: your female slaves whom you may have, of the nations that.
Speaker 3: Are around you.
Speaker 4: From them, you may buy buy male and female slaves.
Speaker 4: So you're okay with buying slaves, You're okay with shattle slavery.
Speaker 3: You are a moral monster.
Speaker 2: Ping fifty points for jim My.
Speaker 13: God does not think I'm a monster. For one and
Speaker 13: two you are well.
Speaker 3: No, if you think you can buy your slaves whom
Speaker 3: you may have from the nations around you, and you
Speaker 3: think it's okay to beat them as long as they
Speaker 3: don't die within three days, then no, your Bible is
Speaker 3: not a moral monster. And that's also I said, by
Speaker 3: today's standards, where we have abolished slavery, we have abolished
Speaker 3: all forms of slavery, because slavery is evil and wrong.
Speaker 3: Guess what that makes you evil and wrong?
Speaker 9: You didn't abolish shit.
Speaker 3: You're just your intellect. Your IQ is just falling by
Speaker 3: the moment as I read you from your Bible.
Speaker 2: Yeah, so I'm wondering.
Speaker 1: We've read to you a few things that are Courtney,
Speaker 1: Can you actually establish, using your god given understanding of
Speaker 1: morality or your your divine command?
Speaker 2: Uh, that slavery is bad?
Speaker 5: Is that? Not where it came from?
Speaker 11: Is the Bible not where slavery is bad came from?
Speaker 14: Now?
Speaker 3: You can you?
Speaker 1: But can you give me book, chapter verse of where
Speaker 1: it says that slavery is bad in the Bible?
Speaker 3: Nope? You can't.
Speaker 2: No, I mean because it's not there.
Speaker 1: But I'm wondering if you have it, maybe I missed it.
Speaker 4: Okay, Yeah, I'm giving you chapter and verse. Do us
Speaker 4: the same courtesy of giving us chapter in verse.
Speaker 11: I'm not getting all my.
Speaker 3: You can't give us chapter and verse because we studied
Speaker 3: the Bible. You, that's why we know there's ships in
Speaker 3: here the Bible.
Speaker 9: I'll look it up.
Speaker 15: I'll look it up.
Speaker 13: I'll look it up.
Speaker 11: Where you want to study the Bible?
Speaker 3: Nope, study the whole thing.
Speaker 1: Hey, Jim, do you want to put money down on
Speaker 1: if they bring up Galatians three twenty nine.
Speaker 4: Oh, no, that we'll try and bring up Galatians for
Speaker 4: twenty nine. That's not going to work for them.
Speaker 3: There's nothing in the New Testament that works for them,
Speaker 3: because we'll just bring up the fact that Paul converts
Speaker 3: a slave to Christianity and sends that slave back to
Speaker 3: his master as a slave. Paul is perfectly okay.
Speaker 4: Slavery was perfectly fine at the time that the Bible
Speaker 4: was written, and was for quite some time after as well.
Speaker 4: And you just can't get around that this is just
Speaker 4: and these these laws aren't even unique to the Bible.
Speaker 4: They're just the standard laws that existed in the Levant
Speaker 4: at this time. So you know, in the Middle East,
Speaker 4: they're not even newer, new or unique.
Speaker 8: They're unique to the Bible.
Speaker 9: They're they're not.
Speaker 1: I'll tell you that.
Speaker 3: You know there there Eleron.
Speaker 1: You know that there are other cultures outside of Judaism
Speaker 1: and Christianity in the ancient Near East, Right, I.
Speaker 11: Think Judaism was the only ones that actually supported no.
Speaker 13: Accident twenty one sixteen. Anyone who kidnapped another and sells
Speaker 13: him must be put to death.
Speaker 3: You are correct, very good, and we know about that one.
Speaker 3: Guess what you have a problem with I've already read,
Speaker 3: so you can't. Yes, slavers are a bad thing, and
Speaker 3: slavers are outlawed by the Bible. The problem is.
Speaker 10: That Exodus twenty one seven through eleven, if a man
Speaker 10: sells his daughter to be a female slaves, that that's
Speaker 10: not a slaver doing that, that's a dad doing that.
Speaker 10: And then you it also specifically said, as I've already said,
Speaker 10: and you apparently forgot Leviticus twenty five forty four through
Speaker 10: forty six, as for your male and female slaves whom
Speaker 10: you may have, of the nations that are around you.
Speaker 10: From them, you may buy male and female slaves. So no,
Speaker 10: you're not buying them from slavers, You're buying them from
Speaker 10: other people.
Speaker 1: Yeah, And I would like to point out that that
Speaker 1: particular section, if you actually do the exe Jesus on it,
Speaker 1: it's actually talking about kidnapping your fellow Israelite and selling
Speaker 1: them into slavery.
Speaker 2: It is not.
Speaker 1: It is not talking about the foreigners from which you
Speaker 1: may purchase slaves. The foreigners from which you may purchase slaves.
Speaker 1: They could have been kidnapped they I mean, the Israelites
Speaker 1: really don't care about what happens in other countries. But
Speaker 1: also there's prisoners of war. Do you think the prisoners
Speaker 1: of war should be able to be sold into slavery?
Speaker 13: The Bible has to say that's what I'm seeing. No,
Speaker 13: let me think I just studied loved guests like I
Speaker 13: just got done good. Exactly what Bendicotte I'm talking. I
Speaker 13: know exactly what Leviticu.
Speaker 5: I know what it says. Now.
Speaker 3: Would I sell my daughter?
Speaker 13: My daughter's twenty one, And let me tell you what,
Speaker 13: if I sold her, I'd sell her to a rich ass.
Speaker 5: Man, because then she'd be living high.
Speaker 3: You can't sell her, ma'am. You have no rights to
Speaker 3: do anything except what your husband tells you.
Speaker 1: Courtney Courty's Courty's wife just said she'd sell her daughter
Speaker 1: to Jeffrey Epstein. Like, that's just crazy shit right now?
Speaker 1: Would I sell my daughter to Jeffrey Epstein? The fucking
Speaker 1: course I would. I'd get a pretty penny for that.
Speaker 4: I just can't believe that in twenty twenty six people
Speaker 4: are saying they would sell their daughters into slavery.
Speaker 3: It just makes no sense to me.
Speaker 1: You know what does no no, When you factor in
Speaker 1: there from Florida, that actually makes a whole lot of
Speaker 1: sense right there.
Speaker 4: Oh well, yeah, we can't speak much we're from We're
Speaker 4: in Alabama, so.
Speaker 1: You know, I mean yeah, I mean I totally expect
Speaker 1: somebody here in Alabama to be like.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I totally sell my daughter into slavery.
Speaker 1: Like Soll Courtney, it seems to me like us as
Speaker 1: atheists have a better handle on what is and is
Speaker 1: not moral, and you seem to be hanging your hat
Speaker 1: on God and it just seems to get you into
Speaker 1: a weird predicament where you're selling your daughter to Jeffrey Epstein,
Speaker 1: who has the better moral foundation.
Speaker 13: Again, never want should I say I would sell my
Speaker 13: daughter Jeffrey Epstein was Jeffrey.
Speaker 1: Was Jeffrey Epstein Rich go jumping a fucking rapist.
Speaker 13: That's exactly what you get from fucking liberal jackasses that
Speaker 13: got no fucking.
Speaker 3: Ball to their own and they got Okay, so let's
Speaker 3: get off slavery for a minute and let me ask you.
Speaker 3: Do you guys work on Sunday?
Speaker 13: Conservative?
Speaker 16: Do you do you work on Sundays? Do you work
Speaker 16: on Sundays? Do you work on Sundays. I get her word,
Speaker 16: he say, Now she's a.
Speaker 1: Christian conservati you and know if she's a Christian Conservative,
Speaker 1: she doesn't work their gym.
Speaker 3: All right, I'm sorry, I know you don't work. You
Speaker 3: only exist to be a sexual plaything for your husband.
Speaker 4: So, hubby, do you work on Sundays?
Speaker 13: Tonight?
Speaker 1: You?
Speaker 3: Yeah?
Speaker 4: Anyway, that's that's not really the answer to the question
Speaker 4: I was looking for.
Speaker 3: Do you work on Sundays?
Speaker 13: Your boyfriend, do.
Speaker 3: You work on Sundays?
Speaker 13: Well, what's your question?
Speaker 3: Do you work on Sundays?
Speaker 13: Absolutely? Do not work on Sundays? Really, Holy Day on
Speaker 13: the seventh day?
Speaker 3: Right, so you've never worked on some.
Speaker 7: Well?
Speaker 13: Hold on, Courtney's wife did tell you I will defend
Speaker 13: my God against you any day of the week.
Speaker 11: I don't care.
Speaker 3: You're doing a horrible job of it. You're agreeing that
Speaker 3: your God is evil.
Speaker 1: Guess what, Courtney Courtney's wife, Courtney Courtney's wife. What can
Speaker 1: I call you Courtney's wife? What can I call you
Speaker 1: other than Courtney's wife? Because I don't like labeling women
Speaker 1: by being owned by their husband. Rachel, Rat, Rachel, Hi, Rachel.
Speaker 1: I'm wondering, do you do you guys like to like
Speaker 1: go out to restaurants or something like that, like a
Speaker 1: good after church meal.
Speaker 5: No, we don't we cook, okay, do you like?
Speaker 2: Do you do you cook food on Sundays?
Speaker 17: Right now?
Speaker 13: We like food on Sundays. But according to the Old Testament,
Speaker 13: you're not supposed to eat on Sundays and you're not
Speaker 13: supposed to eat on leavened bread.
Speaker 1: Okay, and you don't do either of those things.
Speaker 13: Everybody eats on Sunday. When Jesus died on the cross,
Speaker 13: all of that was washed away for one and two.
Speaker 3: No, no, no, hold.
Speaker 1: On, Rachel, Rachel, can you you've got a Bible there,
Speaker 1: don't you?
Speaker 3: I do we go to teach in the Bible again?
Speaker 1: Yeah, Rachel, I want you to. Can you turn in
Speaker 1: your Bible to Matthew five?
Speaker 2: Rachel? Can you turn in your Bible to Matthew five.
Speaker 3: In front of me?
Speaker 2: Okay? That's fine?
Speaker 11: A meat though it looks wis oh Alice is my song?
Speaker 1: And I sell him to a hearty Well, gee, are
Speaker 1: they talking about selling people now?
Speaker 2: Like this is crazy?
Speaker 4: They're talking about there, They're they're back to to they're
Speaker 4: okay with selling people into slavery.
Speaker 3: Matthew five.
Speaker 2: Right, yep, Matthew five.
Speaker 1: Now I want you to go down to verse seventeen
Speaker 1: in Matthew five.
Speaker 13: I don't like your cockiness, sir. Where are you?
Speaker 3: We know the Bible better than you.
Speaker 4: We're running the atheists are teaching you what's in your Bible,
Speaker 4: and we're also pointing out what's evil and wrong about it,
Speaker 4: and you're just going, yeah, we're okay with it because
Speaker 4: it's in the Bible, because you have no thinking power
Speaker 4: of your own.
Speaker 3: Yeah, go ahead, Look, tell John tell us about Matthew
Speaker 3: seventeen through what is it nineteen?
Speaker 2: Yeah, okay, Yeah, Well, I was letting Rachel read it.
Speaker 1: Rachel, could you read to us, please, verse seventeen and eighteen.
Speaker 13: Think not that I am come to destroy the law
Speaker 13: or the prophet.
Speaker 3: I am not.
Speaker 13: Come to destroy, but to fulfill for their le that
Speaker 13: that death barely. I say unto you, till heaven and
Speaker 13: earth pass one jot or one little shall in no
Speaker 13: wise pass from the law, will all be fulfilled. Whosoever
Speaker 13: therefore shall break one of these least commandments and shall
Speaker 13: teach men, so he shall be called the least in
Speaker 13: the Kingdom of Heaven.
Speaker 3: But who, yes, ever ye you've got to meet of it.
Speaker 3: So what is in a tittle?
Speaker 13: I don't know. I haven't studied Matthew yet. Why don't you,
Speaker 13: Why don't you fill me in? Fill my brain?
Speaker 4: Because you know what a stroke basically a stroke of
Speaker 4: the pat, not a single stroke of the pat, not
Speaker 4: a a tea will go on across that, I will go,
Speaker 4: will go undotted is basically what they're saying.
Speaker 3: It is you can't change even a stroke of the
Speaker 3: of the Old Testament.
Speaker 4: So you just said that these laws aren't it existens
Speaker 4: anymore because of some new covenant.
Speaker 3: And yet it.
Speaker 13: Doesn't say anything about the Old Testament. It says the commandments,
Speaker 13: which there what.
Speaker 5: Do you think? No?
Speaker 13: Do you know your tests?
Speaker 17: No?
Speaker 1: No, no, it's not the ten Commandments. It's God's commandments,
Speaker 1: all six hundred and thirteen of them.
Speaker 13: And when Jesus came, all of that was washed away.
Speaker 3: Matthew seventeen through nineteen disagrees with you?
Speaker 13: Not okay, you don't have to agree with me, because
Speaker 13: I'm honestly, I really care.
Speaker 2: You're not Rachel.
Speaker 3: Y'all called us.
Speaker 13: I'm starting to understand that you guys. All you guys
Speaker 13: care about is taking Christian conservatives and bashing the hell
Speaker 13: out of them. No, and when they won't bowed down and.
Speaker 11: Agree with you.
Speaker 1: No, no, Rachel, Rachel throwing Rachel right, Rachel, I need you
Speaker 1: to explain something to me real quick.
Speaker 2: Can you do that?
Speaker 13: I sure, why not? But you're just going to that
Speaker 13: other dude's going to just laugh at me, or he
Speaker 13: might be a girl, just laugh at me, and then
Speaker 13: you're going to throw another Bible.
Speaker 5: No.
Speaker 1: I just need you to explain to me, like part
Speaker 1: of your thought process is that. Okay, all right, that's fine. Okay,
Speaker 1: So you say that Jesus washed all of the commandments away,
Speaker 1: but then we just had you read Rae says, I've
Speaker 1: not come to abolish.
Speaker 13: The laws all of our sins. He washed all of
Speaker 13: our sins away. The Old Testament was abolished, the ten
Speaker 13: Commandment stay no, no, so the old hold on, Rachel, Rachel,
Speaker 13: you are the wall that follow the bar Bible hardcore.
Speaker 3: You know what.
Speaker 2: Okay?
Speaker 1: So, Rachel and Courtney, I feel like maybe you guys
Speaker 1: need to look up some commentaries on these verses because
Speaker 1: y'all are just totally outside the realm of reasonable on
Speaker 1: these particular verses, especially with the fact that you say
Speaker 1: that the Old Testament was abolished when Jesus died on
Speaker 1: the cross because he washed away or sins or whatnot. So,
Speaker 1: but then you just read how Jesus said that he
Speaker 1: did not come to abolish the law. The law is
Speaker 1: the six hundred and thirteen Commandments as laid out in
Speaker 1: the Old Testament. So it can't be that he abolished
Speaker 1: the Old Testament but also kept the Old Testament. That
Speaker 1: is breaking the law of non contradiction, which is a
Speaker 1: basically law of logic there, So I think that maybe
Speaker 1: you need to get a handle on that. Also, next
Speaker 1: time you call in, fewer margaritas.
Speaker 3: Are we still alive on air?
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, fuck.
Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, this is all your support of selling your
Speaker 4: children into slavery is on YouTube, and we'll be for
Speaker 4: as long as YouTube is around.
Speaker 11: Apparently we're alive on our course.
Speaker 3: Of course, children's shut it, not us. We were shocked.
Speaker 3: You said it's.
Speaker 2: Fucking six point fifteen in Florida right now, Guys, like,
Speaker 2: what the fuck you.
Speaker 11: Can't even afford by children?
Speaker 1: Okay, I'm not I've got I've got engineer money. I
Speaker 1: don't want to buy your children, but I have engineer
Speaker 1: money buddy. So anyways, Rachel and Courtney, I hope, I
Speaker 1: hope you you guys drink some water and drink and
Speaker 1: get some food to soak up that alcohol. But I
Speaker 1: think that we're going to move on to our next callers.
Speaker 9: Okay, that's all right, guys.
Speaker 2: All right.
Speaker 3: How can we be attacking conservative conservative Christians when all
Speaker 3: is reading their Bible to them?
Speaker 1: Jim, listen, the Old Testament was abolished, but also it
Speaker 1: is not not abolished.
Speaker 2: Okay.
Speaker 1: I mean, I don't know if they were like doing
Speaker 1: shots while they were on the air, but like they
Speaker 1: started off fine and then eventually got to the part
Speaker 1: where they were like, you know what, you can't afford
Speaker 1: my daughter.
Speaker 4: Yeah, either they were drinking or they were so livid
Speaker 4: at being kicked around by their own Bible and taken
Speaker 4: to task by people who read and study the Bible.
Speaker 4: I mean, I have nowhere near your level, gee, but
Speaker 4: I do read to study it and I'm getting better
Speaker 4: at it.
Speaker 3: But alls we're doing is reading the Bible, guys. Yeah.
Speaker 1: Please, we would love to see some super chats if
Speaker 1: anybody has had like experiences with you know, anybody that's
Speaker 1: trying to argue with them while inebriated. We'd love to
Speaker 1: hear some of those stories through superchats if if y'all can. Also,
Speaker 1: if you would like to ask us any questions about
Speaker 1: any of the things that we're talking about today, feel
Speaker 1: free to send in those super chats. We'd love to
Speaker 1: see them. We do have a healthy cue. So are
Speaker 1: you ready to get to the next one? There, Jim, Absolutely,
Speaker 1: let's do it all right. So we've got Glenn in Australia.
Speaker 1: Hey there, Glenn, how you doing today?
Speaker 8: Yeah, I'm a good man.
Speaker 6: Thanks, I was.
Speaker 8: Next to I'm sitting here at sixteighteen I am, and
Speaker 8: I'm freezing my ass up.
Speaker 4: Yeah, on the other side of the world where it's
Speaker 4: not winter. For those of you who don't know it's winter,
Speaker 4: I'm just heading medication.
Speaker 8: Oh take it now, take it later, take it now,
Speaker 8: take you later. Anyway, there's so two assholes that the
Speaker 8: report or let me tell you. I'll tell you what
Speaker 8: modern based slavery is. I spent ten years overseas and
Speaker 8: going into South America as well. Okay, you want to
Speaker 8: see modern based slavery?
Speaker 3: Yeah, oh, I know it exists.
Speaker 8: I mean.
Speaker 3: Multiple forms it exists, right right, Hey.
Speaker 8: I'll tell you one thing. From the Ukraine up through
Speaker 8: Hungry Romanian, second Slovakia, all their assholes then that the
Speaker 8: one container through there's a levy tie. I don't want
Speaker 8: to set your PPSP off there.
Speaker 4: Oh, I don't have any I never made it into combat,
Speaker 4: so I was very fortunate don't have any.
Speaker 8: Well, I wasn't in a combat round myself, more like
Speaker 8: police officers. And let me tell you. There was a
Speaker 8: gunman there holding a dead I dated it dead for
Speaker 8: three weeks. And that's what modern fucking bassed baby is
Speaker 8: to those two assholes. You know, man, I'm sitting there
Speaker 8: picturing you. I said, yes, that's what you get for
Speaker 8: rib mother fuckers.
Speaker 1: Yeah, well, I I understand your frustration there, Glenn, But
Speaker 1: you said that your stepson said before he sorry, sorry to.
Speaker 5: Hang on.
Speaker 8: And real quick, that asshole doesn't know your ship about me.
Speaker 8: He's gonna I'm gonna get my tenderloine, tenderlines, underworks, muscle
Speaker 8: mos fucking flavor, learning your meat. Hell, get some fucking
Speaker 8: strip line. Okay, okay, we're right, but anyway, anyway, God,
Speaker 8: there's a reason why people want to believe in God.
Speaker 8: It's because they've gotten nothing.
Speaker 6: Else to hold for.
Speaker 1: Well, I think that you probably need to call the
Speaker 1: Recovering from Religion Foundation to take care of that.
Speaker 3: That.
Speaker 1: Or there's also Grief Beyond Belief. That's another organization out
Speaker 1: there too. There's several different secular organizations that can that
Speaker 1: can help with that kind of of issue.
Speaker 18: But I mean you said that, yeah, Well I meant
Speaker 18: is that religion was formed by men, so the people that.
Speaker 8: Had nothing could be able to grasp onto something to
Speaker 8: believe in. That's what I mean, you know what I mean?
Speaker 2: Okay, Yeah, I got you.
Speaker 1: Sorry, just trying to process me you're saying here, I
Speaker 1: mean so, so, I mean I understand.
Speaker 2: I guess I could understand how that might be appealing.
Speaker 8: A lot of believers.
Speaker 3: Steps.
Speaker 8: So, see, months before he died, he died of been
Speaker 8: testing on pneumonia and he said to me, yeah, he
Speaker 8: said to He said to me, he goes, you know,
Speaker 8: I hadn't do any other night, and I was flying
Speaker 8: for his space and I went, oh man, he takes
Speaker 8: me must rings and what you and he goes, no,
Speaker 8: he goes, he's flying for his space and it got
Speaker 8: hard to break and then he goes, I end up
Speaker 8: past space.
Speaker 3: And I come to a room.
Speaker 8: And there was the foak sitting at the desk writing
Speaker 8: on a piece of paper, and he goes, oh, you
Speaker 8: have a right, and the rope turned around to give
Speaker 8: them the pen, and he goes, it was me. I'm
Speaker 8: to prinis writing this story.
Speaker 1: Okay, right, I don't I don't understand. Well, I don't
Speaker 1: understand why this should make you believe in God. Like
Speaker 1: these anecdotales, they don't.
Speaker 5: He.
Speaker 8: Per se is thought, but in us he's to continue
Speaker 8: out in the story.
Speaker 1: Okay, I'm so sorry, Glenn. I'm having trouble following like
Speaker 1: your story and how it relates to believing in God.
Speaker 8: I don't believe in.
Speaker 5: What what we saw.
Speaker 8: He didn't have believe in God. But the thing is
Speaker 8: the dream that he had he was his own being.
Speaker 2: Do you give me no, I'm not following. I'm so sorry.
Speaker 4: So it sounds like you're saying that that, Uh let
Speaker 4: me let me just take the story to you, just
Speaker 4: to make sure that I'm following here. You're trying to
Speaker 4: have a very he fluent outer space. He found the room, said,
Speaker 4: and in the room was one guy writing writing a
Speaker 4: story and saying that he was done.
Speaker 8: Yeah, he goes, Oh, your garage is now you'll turn
Speaker 8: into tennis writing sword.
Speaker 3: Okay, So how does that how does that relate to God?
Speaker 8: He he sort of said that he was strong himself,
Speaker 8: he was designed being is not gone. We write write
Speaker 8: in Indians.
Speaker 3: Okay. So what if if somebody had a dream just
Speaker 3: before they died and only it's Gandah, an Indian God?
Speaker 3: What does that have to do? Would that prove that exists?
Speaker 8: I would postbly say that is a matter of one
Speaker 8: of the dreams called bens.
Speaker 3: Oh. So if it's Gandash, it's a want a dream.
Speaker 3: But if it's the Christian God, it's not. But it wasn't.
Speaker 8: It wasn't, Dog, It was much that son sitting at
Speaker 8: the disk right in the boat.
Speaker 5: Right.
Speaker 4: But you're saying they should make you believe in God,
Speaker 4: and I'm asking if we switch it for the Christian.
Speaker 3: God, does that make me?
Speaker 8: Yeah, I actually believe more in the hind Dogs Christian gods.
Speaker 3: Okay, all right, so it should make us believe in God.
Speaker 8: No, no, no, I'm not trying to stay believing dog.
Speaker 7: Yeah.
Speaker 8: Like it's like I'm tryn't explain it. You know, it's from.
Speaker 2: Well hang on, So so if I'm.
Speaker 8: If I'm making peat, if I'm making tea, and I
Speaker 8: haven't been as scoring that top, and I got, oh,
Speaker 8: should I have to go scoring that?
Speaker 5: Come?
Speaker 9: Well?
Speaker 8: South?
Speaker 3: Right?
Speaker 1: So, Glenn, I know that you've been hanging on for
Speaker 1: a while here, but I don't really see how we
Speaker 1: can have a very productive conversation over this, because like
Speaker 1: I kind of feel like you have such an amorphous
Speaker 1: sort of definition of God that you're defining God into
Speaker 1: this you know, undefinable thing that where it's it's both
Speaker 1: everything and nothing at the exact same time. So I mean,
Speaker 1: I like, unless you can make it less, you can
Speaker 1: unless you can make a coherent argument for how your
Speaker 1: anecdotal experience here actually proves that God exists.
Speaker 2: And I don't think that we can really continue.
Speaker 8: It's because it was actually put the two blurred said, well,
Speaker 8: I'm outsciting actually believes is the God?
Speaker 3: Okay?
Speaker 8: You the thing like you've seen the stories and stuff like.
Speaker 6: That, and you know, I like it's sort of it's question,
Speaker 6: you know.
Speaker 1: So So Glenn, I think that that we're probably going
Speaker 1: to move on because we do have a healthy cube
Speaker 1: of people. And I get that you were calling for
Speaker 1: truth Wanted and I I next, you know, if you
Speaker 1: really want to talk to the guys on Truth Wanted,
Speaker 1: I would definitely try to call in nearly immediately when
Speaker 1: the show starts.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I believe it's probably around what like two two
Speaker 2: thirty pm Central?
Speaker 3: Say it's work, Yeah, is it?
Speaker 5: Oh?
Speaker 3: Truth Wanted?
Speaker 2: Ye, truth Wanted? Yeah, yeah, all over Central.
Speaker 8: Yeah, he does to two degrees similar ideas.
Speaker 1: Yeah, okay, okay, all right, well, hey Glenn, you have
Speaker 1: a great morning, uh, and the rest of your day
Speaker 1: in the future, and I will I will talk to
Speaker 1: you later.
Speaker 3: Okay.
Speaker 8: Yeah, it was first bond and all this.
Speaker 2: Yep, I got you.
Speaker 3: Oh my god.
Speaker 1: All right, see lady Glenn. All right, interesting calls so far.
Speaker 1: Anecdotal stories always kind of like miss me, uh because
Speaker 1: there's like no way for us to actually prove anything there.
Speaker 1: But it also didn't sound like he had anything to prove.
Speaker 1: He was just wanting to sort of soapbox a little bit.
Speaker 3: I agree.
Speaker 1: Yeah, all right, Well, what we are going to be
Speaker 1: heading directly through on these live on these calls, I
Speaker 1: do want to remind everybody that you can send in
Speaker 1: your super chats and you can interact with any of
Speaker 1: these calls. Put in your two calls, your two cents
Speaker 1: on any of these. We would love to hear from
Speaker 1: the audience on these, So definitely send in those. And
Speaker 1: trust me, I definitely don't hate Guy Fieri with a passion.
Speaker 1: So if you want to, you know, don't, just don't
Speaker 1: mention Guy Fieri in your.
Speaker 2: In your figure.
Speaker 1: It's like a red button thing, like, don't mention that anyways.
Speaker 1: Uh So we've got Marco, just one more thing.
Speaker 3: We will read your super chat so you can make
Speaker 3: it say all kinds of ridiculous things as long as
Speaker 3: it doesn't violate any of our rules, like we can't
Speaker 3: mention a living political figure things like that that would
Speaker 3: get us in trouble as a nonprofit organization. But if
Speaker 3: you want us to say ridiculous things like if you
Speaker 3: want to hear God bless engineers say he loves Guy Fieri,
Speaker 3: a big enough super chatt will gave him to do it.
Speaker 2: All right, So we got Marco calling in.
Speaker 1: It's definitely not one to talk about Guy Fieri, but
Speaker 1: is one to talk about God.
Speaker 2: What's up there, Marco? How you doing?
Speaker 9: Oh?
Speaker 3: I got it?
Speaker 5: Yes, I had to call in and I saw the
Speaker 5: title of your God is evil, and I just thought
Speaker 5: that was a most unbelievable title to ascribe to the
Speaker 5: to the God of the Bible. But as I was
Speaker 5: waiting to get on queue, I uh and do my
Speaker 5: little thing in there, which apparently have to do, I
Speaker 5: was cut off, and you didn't hear the tail end
Speaker 5: of the It wasn't even more. I was calling in
Speaker 5: about but the tail end of the conversation you're having
Speaker 5: with the lady there. I think you're a Matthew seventeen,
Speaker 5: and about the job title. And I just could not
Speaker 5: understand John and tittle. I could not understand how possibly
Speaker 5: that had anything to do with the God being evil?
Speaker 5: Like so what I wanted to just say all that
Speaker 5: I got the tail end of it. I caught, but
Speaker 5: I very clearly it's not a mystery if the Old
Speaker 5: Testament law, as Paul goes on to explain, was has
Speaker 5: been fulfilled and replaced by the grace and the law
Speaker 5: of Christ.
Speaker 1: Well so he Marco, Marco, Yeah, Marco, if I can
Speaker 1: ask when when I'm when you're out on the road
Speaker 1: and you stay within the speed limit, are you fulfilling
Speaker 1: that law?
Speaker 5: When I stayed within the speed limit? Am I fulfilling
Speaker 5: the law, yes, of course.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, Okay, So does does that go away once
Speaker 1: you like you fulfill it and everybody else can treat
Speaker 1: it like the autubon.
Speaker 5: You have again you said the god of the Bible.
Speaker 5: I'm telling you very clearly, as Paul points so, there
Speaker 5: has been a change of the grace has replaced the
Speaker 5: six hundred and thirteen laws that were obeyed in the
Speaker 5: Old Testament. I mean, we can't get any more clear
Speaker 5: than that.
Speaker 1: Right, So, Marco, how do you know what sin is
Speaker 1: if it's not the six hundred and thirteen commandments of
Speaker 1: the Old Testament, which honestly you're you're you're arguing between
Speaker 1: Paul and Jesus. Jesus says that it doesn't go away,
Speaker 1: that it all applies, and so you're just you're pointing
Speaker 1: out an argument between Jesus and Paul.
Speaker 5: There, But no, because when I didn't, when I didn't,
Speaker 5: when I didn't shave this morning, I did not commit
Speaker 5: the breaking the law once O, when I shaved this morning,
Speaker 5: I didn't break the law that they would have broken
Speaker 5: if they did that. Okay, there's a whole rack.
Speaker 1: When you do shave, you do break the law and
Speaker 1: you probably deserve hell because you shaved.
Speaker 5: No, no again, Now don't understand. Here's the thing you
Speaker 5: ask them being within the limit, and where do we
Speaker 5: see where sin is? Now, go to Galatians and list
Speaker 5: all the sins of the flesh there. It's they're all
Speaker 5: listed there, so it's no.
Speaker 1: Yeah, so that's specifically sins of the flesh, which is fine.
Speaker 3: But what what do we what?
Speaker 2: What can you define sin for me?
Speaker 5: Go to Galatians?
Speaker 2: Listen, can you define what sin is for me? Not
Speaker 2: tell me what it like? What what's the the enumerated
Speaker 2: like this is a sin? That is a sin? Just
Speaker 2: what is the the concept sin?
Speaker 5: What is it? I think we all know what sin is.
Speaker 5: It's breaking or not following the commandment of God.
Speaker 1: Okay, now where do we find the commands of God?
Speaker 5: We go and we go to the We're no longer
Speaker 5: in the Old Testament. We're in a New Testament. We're
Speaker 5: not arguing.
Speaker 2: Okay, do you follow the ten commandments?
Speaker 5: Yes, you follow the ten commandments, but not those.
Speaker 1: Are in the Old Testament. But Marco, those are Old
Speaker 1: Testament that you actually don't.
Speaker 5: And they're carried over, sir, into the New Testament and
Speaker 5: Paul addresses them.
Speaker 2: Where does it say that all of those are laws of.
Speaker 5: Following the rituals? The customs are in place anymore. This
Speaker 5: is not a mystery.
Speaker 1: So so where is that thing that hold on for
Speaker 1: the ten Commandments? You say it's only the ten Commandments.
Speaker 1: I don't see anywhere. Can you give me book chap
Speaker 1: reverse of where it specifically carves out the ten Commandments
Speaker 1: as being the super special ones.
Speaker 5: That's not what the issue was. You were saying that
Speaker 5: because of the fact that the John and Tittle he
Speaker 5: has fulfilled, but it's been replaced by.
Speaker 2: Their So do you have your Bible?
Speaker 5: I don't, but I have my phone. Go ahead, Okay, Well.
Speaker 2: So sorry, I was just gonna I was going to
Speaker 2: read it to you.
Speaker 1: It's Matthew matth It's mattheween.
Speaker 3: Through nineteen, Matthew five or seventeen through nineteen.
Speaker 1: Yeah, five, seventeen, nineteen, okay, yeah, So in that it
Speaker 1: specifically has a couple of eschatological statements in it, namely
Speaker 1: that heaven and Earth will pass away, right and then
Speaker 1: until all is accomplished. Now, Jesus hasn't actually accomplished everything
Speaker 1: that he says that he was going to right, because
Speaker 1: the accomplishing everything comes at in his second coming, right,
Speaker 1: because Jesus still has to come.
Speaker 3: Correct.
Speaker 5: Well, there's still an accomplishment that's going to be done
Speaker 5: to the millennium kingdom. Yes, that's correct. However, just to
Speaker 5: your point, okay, what you're asked, let me ask your
Speaker 5: question for you. In Galatians three, what Paul is saying
Speaker 5: is that the Old Testament law was like a guardian
Speaker 5: or tutor, and it's completely a temporary system that is
Speaker 5: in place until Christ arrived. Now Christ has come, we're
Speaker 5: no longership. We're justified by faith. That's a difference.
Speaker 3: Let me ask you this, who should we take as
Speaker 3: the better source of authority, Jesus Christ or Paul.
Speaker 5: Paul had the encounter.
Speaker 3: It's not an answer to the question, which which do
Speaker 3: we are you saying that we take we should take
Speaker 3: Paul's word over Jesus's words as.
Speaker 5: The authority mistaken. No, all, I'm trying to point out,
Speaker 5: as you're mistaken. They're not arguing. There's nothing in conflict there.
Speaker 5: Paul has gone off and explain that with Christ we
Speaker 5: are a new Yes, but.
Speaker 3: That's not what Jesus says. That's not what Jesus says. Literally, Jesus,
Speaker 3: Paul is in conflict with what Jesus says, and you
Speaker 3: can't make it knock because it's very very simple language.
Speaker 1: Like we get so, Mark, we can ask you a
Speaker 1: very simple question. Mark, we can ask you a very
Speaker 1: simple question. Here, has heaven and earth passed away?
Speaker 5: Heaven and earth has not passed away yet, and that
Speaker 5: will be at the end of the right.
Speaker 1: So heaven and earth has not passed away. So it
Speaker 1: seems according to Jesus himself in Matthew five seventeen to nineteen,
Speaker 1: that not a single job, not a stroke of a pen,
Speaker 1: will disappear from the law, and then the until everything
Speaker 1: is accomplished is eschatological. This is a consensus among a
Speaker 1: Hebrew Bible or not sorry, not Hebrew Bible, but New
Speaker 1: Testament scholars that that's an eschatological statement about the second
Speaker 1: coming of Jesus. So Jesus here is laying out that
Speaker 1: the that the Old Testament law is not going to disappear,
Speaker 1: that he did come to fulfill it, but he fulfilled
Speaker 1: it through like so that you can have salvation. So
Speaker 1: the only difference that's being pointed out here is that
Speaker 1: you no longer have to like stay in shield. Right,
Speaker 1: you can go on ahead and go to heaven because
Speaker 1: He's provided you that salvation. That's the difference. Here's the
Speaker 1: that's a difference being made, not a difference.
Speaker 5: Serve guys, you're misunderstanding. And the Old Testament God has
Speaker 5: said I will give you a new covenant, is already
Speaker 5: talking about a new covenant in the Old Testament.
Speaker 1: No, no, yes, yes, so so. But but but you're
Speaker 1: missing what the new covenant is. Sorry for I keep interrupting,
Speaker 1: But the new the new Covenant is not like changing
Speaker 1: all of the things that are that God considers the sin.
Speaker 1: The new Covenant is a way to attain salvation. Right,
Speaker 1: So Jesus provides that new covenant by being that that
Speaker 1: sacrifice on the cross, so that all you need to
Speaker 1: do is believe in him. That's true, But that doesn't
Speaker 1: change the fact that the that the Old Testament commandments
Speaker 1: are still in effect. Those are the things that God
Speaker 1: considers to be sin.
Speaker 5: What you're missing here is that he doesn't consider it
Speaker 5: to be sin anymore. If you don't follow the you
Speaker 5: must shave, you must not put the statoo on your
Speaker 5: arm or whatever. Not what what does Jesus say that
Speaker 5: what you're completely missing is this is that we're just by.
Speaker 5: For example, when let me get I'll just tell you
Speaker 5: here with it, just just immute to the second if
Speaker 5: I can tell you. So, Paul summarizes what Jesus summarized
Speaker 5: in Galatians life. He basically says that in a single command,
Speaker 5: love your name as yourself, fulfill everything. And Jesus said
Speaker 5: to him, he said, what is the law of the prophets?
Speaker 5: What can it all be summarized? And Jesus said, love
Speaker 5: your neighbor as yourself, Love your God with all your heart.
Speaker 5: He's basically saying within that everything from the Old testamentause
Speaker 5: you can be summarized.
Speaker 2: No, no, no, that's not what it means. So so
Speaker 2: I let you talk.
Speaker 1: I let you talk there, Marco. So Marco, the the
Speaker 1: love your God with all your heart. Now it would
Speaker 1: it be very loving, like showing love to your God
Speaker 1: if you disobeyed, like the only set of commandments that
Speaker 1: He's given you.
Speaker 5: Again, that's not what you were saying earlier. You were
Speaker 5: saying that it was something to do with the fact
Speaker 5: that God is evil. And then you went to Matthew
Speaker 5: seventeen I'm just trying to tell you that, and you're
Speaker 5: not listening to this. What I'm trying to tell you
Speaker 5: is that, oh.
Speaker 4: You didn't fall, you didn't follow the conversation. Sorry, so
Speaker 4: the conversation just to bring you up today because he
Speaker 4: said you missed something, and I think this is kind
Speaker 4: of where where you and Ge are miscommunicating. So they eventually,
Speaker 4: when we got to finished, you know, kicking their teeth
Speaker 4: in with the Bible versus about slavery, they finally said, well,
Speaker 4: the Bibles, that's the Old Testament, not the Day Testament.
Speaker 4: So they changed the subject to Old Testament versus Due Testament,
Speaker 4: which is when Ge.
Speaker 3: Hit him in the face with Matthew seventeen through nineteen,
Speaker 3: which is still kicking you in the face because it's
Speaker 3: Jesus saying that, and you're still trying to say that
Speaker 3: Paul changes what Jesus said. Jesus is really really clear
Speaker 3: about what he says here.
Speaker 5: No, Jesus himself said the entire law the profits can
Speaker 5: be summarized with the love of your neighbor as yourself.
Speaker 3: That's what it is.
Speaker 5: It all translates into that, Well, Paul is saying, what.
Speaker 3: Does Jesus being by What does Jesus mean by neighbor?
Speaker 5: That was a question asked of him. He said, who
Speaker 5: is my neighbor? And he gave the parable of the
Speaker 5: Good Samaritan. That's your neighbor right there.
Speaker 3: So if you're supparsed to love your neighbor and your
Speaker 3: neighbor is equivalent of the good Samaritan, why does God
Speaker 3: also say that you can buy your slaves from the
Speaker 3: nations around you. That doesn't sound very loving. And then
Speaker 3: he says you can beat them, so you're beating foreigners. No, no,
Speaker 3: how does Jesus get away with saying that that love
Speaker 3: your neighbor as yourself is the summary of the Old Testament?
Speaker 5: Okay, First of all, slave in the Old Testament was
Speaker 5: not something that God condoned or place in the world.
Speaker 5: He tolerated it like you tolerate a worse and a
Speaker 5: lot of other things, and that lived back.
Speaker 3: Then do you want to bet?
Speaker 5: What?
Speaker 3: Then? Do you want to bet?
Speaker 4: So let's turn, let's open our bibles once again to
Speaker 4: live at a guess twenty five forty four forty six.
Speaker 3: As for your male and your female slaves whom you
Speaker 3: who may have exactly in a world he can slavery,
Speaker 3: condone slavery.
Speaker 5: He didn't condonateside slavery.
Speaker 3: He said, you can have slaves.
Speaker 5: May I just speak for thirty seconds. He gave them
Speaker 5: rules to live by in a world that was way
Speaker 5: different and a world that had slavery it was going
Speaker 5: to be in place. He gave them such strict rules
Speaker 5: up and including to the point where the slave master
Speaker 5: could be put to death if he had done something.
Speaker 5: It was rules that the other nations will look.
Speaker 3: Do you want that one? You want that chap and verse?
Speaker 3: Because I have it up to it's as long as
Speaker 3: that slave doesn't diets in three days now.
Speaker 5: The point I'm telling you is that in the Old Testament,
Speaker 5: slavery was a reality. He didn't institute a God did
Speaker 5: not create it. He tolerated. He gave them a set
Speaker 5: of rules that you were to follow when you're going
Speaker 5: to do it, you slaves, make it a master serve relationship,
Speaker 5: what have you? And it wasn't marketing. Treat love your
Speaker 5: neighbor as yourself. Obviously, you're not going to mistreat somebody
Speaker 5: to commandments love your neighbor as yourself. You're supposed to.
Speaker 2: Marco, can you help me understand something. Sure, go ahead, Okay,
Speaker 2: So I get that you're you're trying to play at
Speaker 2: this apologetic of of God was simply thought, I'm trying
Speaker 2: to give you guys slavery truth. Go ahead, okay.
Speaker 1: So no, I I understand you're trying to give us
Speaker 1: your what you think is the truth, and you're but
Speaker 1: this is a common apologetic that God tolerated it. But
Speaker 1: I just want to explain from my perspective, and maybe
Speaker 1: you can explain to me like where I'm wrong.
Speaker 2: Possibly right.
Speaker 1: Uh, So this is my perspective whenever the God just
Speaker 1: tolerated slavery comes up. It's my understanding that the Christian
Speaker 1: God is defined by being omnipotent, omni benevolent, and omniscient,
Speaker 1: meaning that he knows that slavery is bad. He's omnipotent,
Speaker 1: so he has the power to change that, and he's omniscient.
Speaker 1: Uh let's see, omniscient, omnipotent, omni benevolent. So God is
Speaker 1: good all the time, and all the time God is good. Right,
Speaker 1: So those are the three things that kind of define
Speaker 1: God in that particular aspect. So when we turnal, I'm
Speaker 1: sorry what he is, We're not. No, No, I get
Speaker 1: that's what I was describing. I was describing God. There,
Speaker 1: I was describing God. So that that's how God has
Speaker 1: described Now, when you tell me that God was merely
Speaker 1: tolerating slavery because that's just something that he couldn't affect,
Speaker 1: it seems like, you know, he made the choice to
Speaker 1: tolerate it because he had the ability to stop it.
Speaker 1: He's omnipotent, meaning that he had He's all powerful, so
Speaker 1: he could definitely stop it. But also he issues a
Speaker 1: number of very arbitrary commands in the six hundred and
Speaker 1: thirteen Commandments that are merely there just for his own
Speaker 1: personal whim, just.
Speaker 2: Because he likes it.
Speaker 1: Like there's we talked about the whole shaving of the
Speaker 1: face earlier, you know, cutting your beard, cutting your hair.
Speaker 1: There's also having guard railings on top of your house,
Speaker 1: don't eat shrimp, don't wear mixed fabrics. All of these
Speaker 1: things are like small, minor arbitrary things that God requires.
Speaker 1: And you're trying to tell me that God would rather
Speaker 1: stroke his own ego for the first three commandments and
Speaker 1: his in his giant commandment list. The ones that survive
Speaker 1: to the New Testament that you yourself agreed are the
Speaker 1: ten commandments to follow are the only commandments to follow
Speaker 1: because you think that Jesus and Paul are on the
Speaker 1: same page with that. You're trying to tell me that
Speaker 1: one of the first three commandments that he issues couldn't
Speaker 1: have been don't own slaves. That's just out of his
Speaker 1: wheelhouse when he has don't wear mixed fabrics, don't have
Speaker 1: delicious seafood like you're telling me that that's just out
Speaker 1: of God's ability.
Speaker 5: No, because slavery in itself back then, like a master
Speaker 5: serve relationship. The slaves was dependent on the master. Both
Speaker 5: of them needed to survive. They have to produce.
Speaker 2: No no, no, no, not dependent owns. They were owned.
Speaker 2: They were owned by the master.
Speaker 1: Yes, but not just dependent. Children are dependent hold on marco.
Speaker 1: Children are dependent. Slaves are owned as property.
Speaker 5: In a world that had slavery back then, he tolerated
Speaker 5: it like he tolerated divorce until Jesus came and said
Speaker 5: no more divorce. Guys trying to judge THESS.
Speaker 2: So God is not omni.
Speaker 5: He is and he also didn't come down when Ted
Speaker 5: Bunny was great emergency.
Speaker 3: If he's not, If he's why can't why can't he
Speaker 3: make rules? Has done own people free will to take
Speaker 3: what's in your mind? Why is it?
Speaker 4: Why is it okay for your God to tell people
Speaker 4: to not eat shellfish, but he can't tell them not
Speaker 4: to own people.
Speaker 5: What I was just telling you the guy was he
Speaker 5: asked me about his omnipotence, and the fact is that
Speaker 5: in the free will world, he's not going to exercise
Speaker 5: that where he's going to restrict us. For no, no, no,
Speaker 5: no no.
Speaker 4: Free will doesn't get you out of the omnipotent problem,
Speaker 4: doesn't get you out of the problem of evil at all.
Speaker 3: So let me explain to you why free will doesn't
Speaker 3: get you out of this. Right. So, God, being omnipotent,
Speaker 3: could anytime evil is about to happen to somebody, however
Speaker 3: you care to define it, they automatically get teleported to
Speaker 3: a saferim where no evil can happen to them. God
Speaker 3: could have done that, and his omnipotence, God could have
Speaker 3: created a world will where that happened. He failed to
Speaker 3: do so.
Speaker 5: The thing I wanted to give the example, if I
Speaker 5: can just talk for thirty seconds, is, for example, when
Speaker 5: Ted Bunny is going to go and commit his horrible murders,
Speaker 5: that God doesn't come out of the sky and say
Speaker 5: some aunted No no, no, no, no.
Speaker 4: No, definitely no, that's what we're talking about. Yeah, we
Speaker 4: agree God should do that if he, if he was moral.
Speaker 5: Here's the classic dilemma that no, no, here's so, look,
Speaker 5: I can actually respond to your when he can. I
Speaker 5: just you've been can I just for thirty seconds? If
Speaker 5: I can just say something, you're God will not come
Speaker 5: Now what was I going to say here? Because you
Speaker 5: keep interrupting, I don't have a chance to make the
Speaker 5: point over here. So the thing that you're going, uh,
Speaker 5: no you don't because I haven't made the point and
Speaker 5: I just lost my train of thought now because it's
Speaker 5: just so many interruptions.
Speaker 4: So your point is that let me let me give
Speaker 4: you your point because I know what it is, because
Speaker 4: I've been doing this for a really long time and
Speaker 4: your argument is nothing new. Okay, And you're going to
Speaker 4: say that Ted Bundy, God will not come out of
Speaker 4: the sky and tell God tell Ted Bundy to stop
Speaker 4: doing that so to not go kill people. And God's
Speaker 4: not going to do that because here's texts pretty well.
Speaker 5: No, no, here's the here's the point I want to make,
Speaker 5: and one of the atheist dilemmas that you have is
Speaker 5: this God is tolerant and he allows things to go on.
Speaker 5: And then you say, why does he lets this to
Speaker 5: go on?
Speaker 3: Why does he?
Speaker 5: And then when he does judge and it's time for
Speaker 5: judgment and he and he renders the judgment, then you're like,
Speaker 5: oh my gosh, what a terrible God. How could he
Speaker 5: judge this? How could he do this? So on the
Speaker 5: one hand, he doesn't judge, he's bad. On the other hand,
Speaker 5: when he does judge and it's time to judge, he's bad.
Speaker 5: So they can't be any of.
Speaker 2: Marco, let me, can I make it? I understand? I No, right, Marco,
Speaker 2: you made explain it's a numb one.
Speaker 1: But yeah, yeah, can I can I explain that that
Speaker 1: the judgment park where we're.
Speaker 2: Critical of God for the judgment.
Speaker 1: Yes, okay, So the critical part when it comes to
Speaker 1: the judgment of God is when he unnecessarily applies judgment
Speaker 1: to a certain demographic.
Speaker 2: So like I'm thinking, of course, first Amuel fifteen one
Speaker 2: through three.
Speaker 1: But you know we've already mentioned that one. We could
Speaker 1: go to numbers thirty one, seventeen to eighteen.
Speaker 2: Have you ever read that one?
Speaker 3: Yeah?
Speaker 5: I read the whole Bible. I'm sure you. Why don't
Speaker 5: you I don't know what off I have? Why don't
Speaker 5: you start to say it? I all know exactly where
Speaker 5: it is or what you're talking about.
Speaker 1: Ahead right so here, I don't. I don't have it
Speaker 1: pulled up, but I can pull it up really quick
Speaker 1: for you. It's numbers thirty one, seventeen to eighteen. Now,
Speaker 1: I know that a lot of times people want to
Speaker 1: hear context, so I'll give you the context. Essentially, the
Speaker 1: Israelites were race mixing with another group of people, and
Speaker 1: God didn't like that, and so God punished the Israelites
Speaker 1: with some kind of sexual thing like.
Speaker 2: A disease or something like that.
Speaker 1: And then later on God was still not happy enough
Speaker 1: happy with the outcome, so he has the Israelites, led
Speaker 1: by Moses, go into the Midianites group of people and
Speaker 1: utterly destroy them, right, And it gets to the point where,
Speaker 1: like they don't utterly destroy everything in there. So Moses
Speaker 1: gets mad because that's not what God asked for. He
Speaker 1: asked for utter destruction, and so, further clarifying what God meant,
Speaker 1: Moses says, so, now kill all the boys as well
Speaker 1: as every woman, who has known a man. But spare
Speaker 1: for yourselves every little girl who has not known a man. Right,
Speaker 1: And God goes through painstaking detail of up these thirty
Speaker 1: two thousand girls that are taken to either become wives
Speaker 1: against their will, to either become wives against their will,
Speaker 1: or to become future wives still against their will, because
Speaker 1: they didn't ask for consent. And so when we talk
Speaker 1: about applying this judgment or we criticize God for applying judgment,
Speaker 1: we're not talking about the general war that happens between
Speaker 1: groups of people at this time. Anthropologically, we can explain
Speaker 1: those things, but what we're talking about in these verses
Speaker 1: is very specifically, like why did God need all of
Speaker 1: the little boys killed, like stabbed in the face, and
Speaker 1: then also every woman stabbed in the face.
Speaker 2: You know, that kind of makes it sound like God
Speaker 2: is saying.
Speaker 1: That women after they have known a man, after they've
Speaker 1: slept with a man, are you know, just worthless. They're
Speaker 1: worthless pieces of rags or I believe it's chewed gum,
Speaker 1: is what some pastors say. And then the little boys,
Speaker 1: I mean, I can't imagine why you would go and
Speaker 1: stab little boys face. And then he talks about sex
Speaker 1: trafficking on a level that's far past Jeffrey Epstein in
Speaker 1: this situation.
Speaker 5: So hold on, I mean my response because you made
Speaker 5: your point about it. Can I just so you're talking
Speaker 5: about the verses in the Old Testament where he goes
Speaker 5: and destroy everybody, kill the babies and so on. So
Speaker 5: for that that what you're talking about for starters, and
Speaker 5: then the women that are left over here are to
Speaker 5: be wives. Okay, So first of all, if I could just.
Speaker 1: Read women little girls, hold on, hod just so that
Speaker 1: you're you understand they're little girls. So it's it's prepebescent
Speaker 1: and just after puberty.
Speaker 5: No, no, you're giving him marriage to thirteen fourteen, fifteen sixty,
Speaker 5: back then.
Speaker 3: Whatever it was.
Speaker 5: But the point is this. The point is first of
Speaker 5: all to do with the killing of everything. First of all,
Speaker 5: I'm gonna ask you a question, are you God? No?
Speaker 5: Am I God? No? Can you?
Speaker 1: I'm glad that you asked the question and then answered
Speaker 1: for me, because you don't know me.
Speaker 2: I could be God.
Speaker 5: Okay, well you'd be a lunatic in most institutions.
Speaker 3: Is how do you know why?
Speaker 5: On second institution?
Speaker 2: Sorry, I don't I don't want to get off on
Speaker 2: that okay, most I agree.
Speaker 5: I am not your guy, okay, okay, so okay, So
Speaker 5: therefore you cannot since you didn't create it. You can
Speaker 5: kill something if you want to, or raise it back
Speaker 5: up again. That's the first thing.
Speaker 2: Now, this is a disgusting line of.
Speaker 3: Yeah, you are defending selling bore, putting prefabescent girls only
Speaker 3: out of a population into sex slavery. That's what you're defending.
Speaker 5: If I could just just one second of here, So
Speaker 5: he kills all of the males and all the leney
Speaker 5: she does, and the reason is is because it would
Speaker 5: be a bloodsuity will continue to go on to the
Speaker 5: next generation.
Speaker 1: So, first of all, one clarifying note, he commands that
Speaker 1: the Israelites do the killing. So essentially it would be
Speaker 1: as if God were commanding you to stab a baby
Speaker 1: in the face. So Marco, if God came down and
Speaker 1: told you that you needed to stab a baby in
Speaker 1: the face, would you do it?
Speaker 5: Goes down into shield. He preaches the Gospel, all the
Speaker 5: Old Testament people there, including I don't think, and he
Speaker 5: leads captivity cap thinks.
Speaker 3: Question again. He's preaching the Bible down again. He's not
Speaker 3: wanting answer to questions. Are you answer the questions question.
Speaker 5: But I just did. I said God can take life,
Speaker 5: he can also resurrect life.
Speaker 2: Marco, do you know what question I asked you?
Speaker 5: I first we set up killing the boys, then we
Speaker 5: went to the to the girl. So once those girls.
Speaker 2: Okay, so yeah, you were you were talking, you were
Speaker 2: allowing attention to me My question.
Speaker 5: Marke wives market mark given in wedlock to the youth.
Speaker 1: Okay, You're just you're You're not even respecting the fact
Speaker 1: that I'm trying to talk and ask you a question.
Speaker 2: So I've muted you.
Speaker 1: Marca, all right, now My question is if you if
Speaker 1: God unequivocally came to you right now stood in. Let's
Speaker 1: say you're in your living room.
Speaker 2: I don't know. Let's say Jesus himself comes down as
Speaker 2: God as yahweh.
Speaker 1: However, you consider him and you unequivocally know that it's
Speaker 1: Jesus slash God, and he tells you, I want you
Speaker 1: to go next door and unlive everybody in that house,
Speaker 1: including the little baby boy that's there. I want you
Speaker 1: to stab that little baby boy in the face, and
Speaker 1: I want you to stab his mom in the face,
Speaker 1: and the dad I want you to kill, and then
Speaker 1: I want you to take that pewbstent thirteen year old
Speaker 1: child into your home so that you can then marry
Speaker 1: her later. If God came down and told you that,
Speaker 1: would you actually go and do that without questioning God.
Speaker 1: I'm gonna unmute you now so that you can answer.
Speaker 1: But I want you to answer that question, and.
Speaker 5: He creates the rock thing. Hello, what?
Speaker 7: Oh?
Speaker 5: You cut me off?
Speaker 9: Did you?
Speaker 5: Did you you hang up on me?
Speaker 18: No?
Speaker 1: No, No, you were muted and I was asking you
Speaker 1: a question. Did you hear the question or were you
Speaker 1: talking the entire time?
Speaker 3: Oh?
Speaker 5: I heard the question. I want can you very sparsely
Speaker 5: hear Okay, that's one way to sell it. What's the
Speaker 5: answer to my question? The answer to your question? Is
Speaker 5: it like asking a question can create a rock? That's
Speaker 5: every m The question is completely irrelevant. It's completely irrelevant.
Speaker 5: We're talking about I don't.
Speaker 1: Know if I'm asking you if God asked you to
Speaker 1: stab a baby in the face, would you do it?
Speaker 2: That's my question.
Speaker 5: He wouldn't ask me to do that. That we're no
Speaker 5: longer living under the possibility of feuding with our clients
Speaker 5: next door where there's going to be a blood.
Speaker 3: He asked Abraham to do that very thing.
Speaker 4: Andy's daughter was also sacrificed as well.
Speaker 3: So don't say he wouldn't do that, because he's done
Speaker 3: it twice.
Speaker 5: No talking about I'm not going to get a God's
Speaker 5: not going to visit me telling me to go stab
Speaker 5: somebody in the face.
Speaker 2: Oh do you know do you know the mind of God?
Speaker 5: Yes?
Speaker 17: I do.
Speaker 2: Oh, that's weird because the Bible says that nobody knows
Speaker 2: the mind of God. So which one's right? You were
Speaker 2: the Bible?
Speaker 5: Well, when you say the mind of God, I go
Speaker 5: to Scripture to get the mind of God. That's what
Speaker 5: I mean. So we can answer anything.
Speaker 3: I get that.
Speaker 1: But you have to understand I go to Scripture and
Speaker 1: I see that the mind of God is it's definitely
Speaker 1: in his willhouse to ask people to stab babies in
Speaker 1: the face and to rate fourteen year old children.
Speaker 5: So and like, here's the thing, here's the thing. They're
Speaker 5: now in heaven because Jesus went and preached all the
Speaker 5: captives of the Old Testament.
Speaker 3: He lets you keep making it worse. He just keep
Speaker 3: making it worse. Don't You're you're.
Speaker 4: Still defending God des sending pre pubescent girls into sexual slavery.
Speaker 2: They're not being heaven jlavery.
Speaker 5: They're not going to sexual slavery.
Speaker 3: Yes they are, that's what slavery is. They can't they
Speaker 3: can't deny their mastery, the use of their bodies.
Speaker 5: But who's talking about sexual slavery. They're given to as wives.
Speaker 3: There's no as slaves. We've already covered this. There's no
Speaker 3: such word. There's no language in there versus for wife.
Speaker 3: They are given as slaves.
Speaker 1: Yeah, there's there's literally no word in the Hebrew language
Speaker 1: for wife.
Speaker 5: And given as wives. You see, you're given as wife
Speaker 5: so God can take life.
Speaker 1: Okay, no, but but if you're so, hold on, Marco,
Speaker 1: I'm just wondering, do you have a functional understanding of consent?
Speaker 5: Yes, of course, I have a conceptual understanding of consent.
Speaker 2: No, no, no, but but okay, okay, I'm glad that
Speaker 2: you think you do.
Speaker 1: But when we talk about slaves like the girls, and
Speaker 1: in number thirty one, the girls have their family slaughtered
Speaker 1: in front of them, and they are taken by an
Speaker 1: invading force and they are divvied up amongst the Israelite
Speaker 1: men to be made into wives, do you see that
Speaker 1: as a violation of consent.
Speaker 5: No, you're going to be given into.
Speaker 2: That's fucking scary mark.
Speaker 5: As a single a woman, it's not like a woman
Speaker 5: of the eighties and independent woman. You can't survive without
Speaker 5: a husband. Back then, you don't.
Speaker 2: So it's okay to rape women. You need sons or
Speaker 2: you need to have to rape women.
Speaker 3: Yeah, he's he's once again defending slavery and into the wives.
Speaker 5: They're going to be No, there's certain rules you're going
Speaker 5: to have to respect, how you treat them. They're going
Speaker 5: to be provided for.
Speaker 3: They're not changed the fact they cannot say no to sacks.
Speaker 3: It does not change the fact they cannot say no
Speaker 3: to being married. That's the definition of a slave.
Speaker 5: World was married, everybody exactly. You're married back then, so
Speaker 5: answervive without being married. So outside of marriage, you can't survive.
Speaker 5: It just doesn't work.
Speaker 1: You need Okay, I'm glad that you're bringing this up there, Marco,
Speaker 1: because can I can I read some scripture to you?
Speaker 5: Well, go ahead, sure, okay, so but wait, wait, wait,
Speaker 5: you didn't answer my question. First, you didn't ask my question,
Speaker 5: if God, what was your create? Does he have the
Speaker 5: ability to take life? And he can also resurrect it again.
Speaker 5: If he can do that and you can't.
Speaker 3: All right, that has nothing to do.
Speaker 4: With more, has nothing to do with our conversation, nothing
Speaker 4: to do with our conversation.
Speaker 5: If he can take life, no.
Speaker 2: Hold on market.
Speaker 1: Let me answer your question, I feel Let me let
Speaker 1: me see if I totally understand your question.
Speaker 7: Here.
Speaker 2: You're saying that is it okay for God to take life.
Speaker 3: Everybody?
Speaker 1: Because I have the ability to take life, Jim has
Speaker 1: the ability to take life. We all have the ability
Speaker 1: to end somebody's life. So God is not special in
Speaker 1: that respect.
Speaker 2: But you're saying that God, you resurrect that.
Speaker 5: Maybe you believe that you are God, like you said earlier,
Speaker 5: maybe you do have some sort of mental deficiency.
Speaker 3: It has to do with the moral points for making
Speaker 3: or or it has only do with the moral points for.
Speaker 5: Making that point is made. You won't answer my question.
Speaker 5: You just said I can take life like God.
Speaker 1: Okay, I'm trying to clarify. I'm trying to clarify the
Speaker 1: question mark so I can answer you. I'm sorry, I'm
Speaker 1: hitting a little bit hard.
Speaker 5: Can you resurrect that life?
Speaker 3: Sir?
Speaker 5: Can you resurrect that life? Tell me? No?
Speaker 2: No, Well, well, I mean maybe possibly, depending.
Speaker 5: Going on for generation to generation. I handed it right
Speaker 5: there and there can you Now.
Speaker 4: He's he's on stuff that is completely irrelevant to the
Speaker 4: question of morals. Whether we could take a resurrect life
Speaker 4: doesn't mean anything, and he's basically saying we're all close
Speaker 4: of God, and God can trude us however you want.
Speaker 5: You are God, you take life. Can you resurrect life?
Speaker 5: Do you want to answer my question? Because he knows?
Speaker 1: No, No, No, I'm trying, Marco, got Jesus fucking Christ, Marco,
Speaker 1: I'm trying to answer your goddamn question, but you won't
Speaker 1: fucking shut up enough for me to ask the clarifying
Speaker 1: question so that you can give me Mark Marco, your.
Speaker 5: Partner interrupted, You're not me, sir. He interrupted you and
Speaker 5: came in.
Speaker 2: I just asked, no, no, you have not stopped talking.
Speaker 2: You have not stopped crashing out.
Speaker 1: So I don't think that God, like whether or not
Speaker 1: you create a life, does not give you the the
Speaker 1: the right to take a life. I don't think that
Speaker 1: anybody has the right to take a life.
Speaker 6: I have.
Speaker 1: I think that they have the ability to take a life, right, So,
Speaker 1: I mean, there's an answer to your.
Speaker 2: Question, I would say, no, he doesn't have a right
Speaker 2: to do it. See, you're still you're taking Jesus Christ
Speaker 2: are we? Is this our show, Marco? Or is this
Speaker 2: your show?
Speaker 5: Well, it's your show, and you really don't want to
Speaker 5: answer a question. Want to ask you something like, for example.
Speaker 2: I answered your question. Both of us answered your question.
Speaker 3: I don't you and I don't have both answered your question.
Speaker 5: We're not God and we can't resurrect it now to
Speaker 5: answer what I really called in a boat in the
Speaker 5: first place, because we were off on the John Tittle
Speaker 5: was the God of the Bible being evil as a
Speaker 5: ridiculous thing?
Speaker 2: Have you okay, I'm sorry, I'm you to j you, Marco.
Speaker 1: You're not just going to automatically pivot to the thing
Speaker 1: that you originally called in about when you spent thirty
Speaker 1: minutes like diverting off of apparently what you originally called
Speaker 1: in about. The one thing that I want to say
Speaker 1: to you, Marco before we let you go, because we
Speaker 1: do have other callers to get to, is I want
Speaker 1: to point you towards Deuteronomy twenty one, starting in verse ten,
Speaker 1: because this plays upon your whole idea that women were
Speaker 1: taken care of after being taken as a war bride. Okay,
Speaker 1: And it says when you go to war against your
Speaker 1: enemies and the Lord your God delivers them into your
Speaker 1: hand and you take them captive. If you see a
Speaker 1: beautiful woman among them, and you desire her and want
Speaker 1: to take her as a wife, then you shall bring
Speaker 1: her into your house. She shall shave her head, trimmer nails,
Speaker 1: and put aside her clothing for captivity. After she has
Speaker 1: lived in your house for a full month more and
Speaker 1: to father and mother, then you may go into her,
Speaker 1: which means put penis to vagina, just in case you're curious,
Speaker 1: may go into her, and then you are considered her
Speaker 1: husband and she is your wife. That's how you marry
Speaker 1: these war brides, as you rape them. It's describing rape
Speaker 1: in that situation. And if you are not pleased with her,
Speaker 1: this is the key part. If you're not pleased with her,
Speaker 1: then you are to let her go wherever she wishes,
Speaker 1: but you must not sell her for mone of your
Speaker 1: traders as a slave, since you have dishonored her. The
Speaker 1: dishonored her part is specifically talking about how you have
Speaker 1: raped her and even taken away her value. So your
Speaker 1: whole idea that these thirty two thousand little girls in
Speaker 1: numbers thirty one we're going to be taken care of,
Speaker 1: and this was somehow God's way of ensuring that they
Speaker 1: would have been taken care of. That's just simply not
Speaker 1: the case when in God's own rule book here it
Speaker 1: has a provision for these warring men to take these
Speaker 1: thirty two thousand girls, rape them after a month of
Speaker 1: keeping them in the house, and then just discarding them
Speaker 1: like a used rag. Okay, so, no, you don't know
Speaker 1: your Bible, you don't know what you're talking about, and
Speaker 1: you know what I've reconsidered. I don't think I'm gonna
Speaker 1: let you come back on any final thoughts there, Jim.
Speaker 4: No, Okay, well, I would like to point out numbers
Speaker 4: thirty six through sixteen. I won't read it, but basically,
Speaker 4: to sum up, if a woman before she marries makes
Speaker 4: a vow, makes a promise, or obligates herself to something
Speaker 4: in any way, her husband gets to forbid it and
Speaker 4: say no, you can't do that. That is also slavery
Speaker 4: and Marco, I'm sorry you're defending slavery and rape.
Speaker 1: Yep, I'd suggest doing some introspection about that.
Speaker 2: Anyways, see you later, Marco.
Speaker 1: We've got a lot of calls, and so I just
Speaker 1: I needed to get we need to get moving through
Speaker 1: these so that we can get done with them in time.
Speaker 1: This next call, though, I really want to take a
Speaker 1: back seat because I've talked to this person like two
Speaker 1: times now in the past few days, and I just
Speaker 1: I want to see Jim talk to him for maybe five.
Speaker 2: Or ten minutes.
Speaker 3: Oh no, is this a philbro H?
Speaker 1: No, it's definitely not a philbro all right, all right,
Speaker 1: So next up, we've got Popo call then from Puerto Rico.
Speaker 2: What's up there, Papa? How you doing?
Speaker 16: How are you doing?
Speaker 3: How you doing good? Doing good?
Speaker 2: Doing good?
Speaker 3: What's your proof for God?
Speaker 5: Okay, my proof for God is the following. But you
Speaker 5: have to be humble because it's a radical proof and
Speaker 5: all the oil humility. You can show you the evidence
Speaker 5: because it will change your life. And with something so
Speaker 5: radical that will change your.
Speaker 3: Life, we don't need the preamble. Make your argument. We
Speaker 3: don't need your preamble. Make your argument.
Speaker 5: I know people step back because of that. Okay, the
Speaker 5: argument is the following the University script agent. Therefore, if
Speaker 5: the university, stump digent and necessary be axis.
Speaker 3: Why do you lie to me? Let me deal with
Speaker 3: your contingency. The only, the only non contingent thing that
Speaker 3: he can prove exists is energy. Everything is dependent on energy.
Speaker 2: No, no, I promise you he's not.
Speaker 4: He's Oh, oh okay, he's a filbro egg, got it. Yeah, So,
Speaker 4: if you're going to if you're going, if you're going
Speaker 4: to say, and.
Speaker 3: If I agree to the sake of argument, that contingent
Speaker 3: things actually exist, everything depends on is contingent on energy,
Speaker 3: because because energy can either be treated nor destroyed, I
Speaker 3: don't need anything but energy. I don't need your God,
Speaker 3: and I can prove energy exists. So if you're going
Speaker 3: to claim that your God is that everything is contingent
Speaker 3: on your God, you first have to prove your God exists,
Speaker 3: which you can't do by simply saying my God exists,
Speaker 3: which is exactly what your argument is. Right, because I'm
Speaker 3: encountering your argument with it's energy is all I need
Speaker 3: as a contingent thing?
Speaker 5: No, no, no, no, no no, can you steal man
Speaker 5: my argument? What I just said?
Speaker 4: Yeah, it's a standard argument from contingency, right, what is it?
Speaker 4: Everything is contingent on something, That something is God.
Speaker 3: That is your argument.
Speaker 5: Oh no, that's not my argument.
Speaker 3: Yes, yes it is. I know this argument better than you.
Speaker 5: Okay, then you are not answering my argument. You are
Speaker 5: answering something else.
Speaker 3: No, I'm not. You were saying there is Your argument
Speaker 3: is that there is something that is contingent. Everything is
Speaker 3: contingent on the non contingent incondingent fact.
Speaker 5: Right, Oh, that's not my argument.
Speaker 3: Everything that.
Speaker 2: Sorry, I was just going to try to clarify.
Speaker 1: So what Papo or also known as Felix here says
Speaker 1: is that the universe is contingent and therefore direct, necessary
Speaker 1: being direct.
Speaker 2: So he's I don't agreeing with that.
Speaker 3: I'm sorry, there's no necessary thing being.
Speaker 4: I'm saying that energy is the necessary thing, and I
Speaker 4: can prove energy exists.
Speaker 5: Prove prove energies a necessary being or reality.
Speaker 3: I'm saying there's no such thing as a necessary being.
Speaker 3: You're saying there's a necessary thing, and you are just
Speaker 3: waving your hands saying it's a being, and I'm saying, no.
Speaker 4: You got to prove it's a being. I can prove
Speaker 4: it's perfectly natural. I can prove that energy exists. I
Speaker 4: can prove that it can't be created or destroyed.
Speaker 3: And I can prove that the entire universe depends on energy,
Speaker 3: is contingent on energy existing. So you can't prove that
Speaker 3: God exists. You can't even improve rely upon energy.
Speaker 5: Prove that energy is when the universe relies.
Speaker 3: On equals mc squared.
Speaker 6: Oh, prove that energy?
Speaker 17: I just did.
Speaker 3: E equals mc squared.
Speaker 5: So how that proves it?
Speaker 4: Because it's a basic law of physics. So this is
Speaker 4: physics one on one dude. You should have learned about
Speaker 4: the equals mc squared in high school?
Speaker 5: So how does that prove that energy necessary?
Speaker 3: Energy is the necessary thing because matter andevery this entire
Speaker 3: universe depends on it.
Speaker 5: So are you saying that, yes, always existed.
Speaker 4: As far as we know, energy cannot be created or destroyed.
Speaker 4: This is the first law thermodynamics? Again physics, So.
Speaker 6: Yes or no?
Speaker 8: Are you saying that energy, yesholes existed?
Speaker 5: Yes?
Speaker 4: I just said that, and the first law thermodynamics says that. Okay,
Speaker 4: prove it the first law thermo dynamics. You want me
Speaker 4: to improve basic physics, I can do that. I would
Speaker 4: rather send you to a whole bunch of physics lectures
Speaker 4: on YouTube, so you can go study the first law
Speaker 4: of thermodynamics.
Speaker 3: But the first law of thermodynamics is a fact, hence
Speaker 3: the word law. Okay, then you agree with me.
Speaker 5: No, I don't, because the firstlow was created in the
Speaker 5: Big Bang.
Speaker 3: No, you got to prove that the law of thermodynamics
Speaker 3: do not depend on the Big Bang. Neither does energy, right,
Speaker 3: because energy existed well and in the sense that we
Speaker 3: can say before it makes any kind of sense.
Speaker 4: When we're talking about before the Big Bang. And it
Speaker 4: also depends on your view of time, which we also
Speaker 4: don't know, So we don't know if time began in
Speaker 4: the Big Bang or if time existed before.
Speaker 3: These are all questions that physics has to determine.
Speaker 4: However, energy cannot be created nor destroyed, which means your
Speaker 4: God can't create it either.
Speaker 5: Okay, I'm going to prove it that the first law
Speaker 5: was created in the Big Bang. The first law existed
Speaker 5: after or before.
Speaker 4: The Big Bang before because energy existed before the Big Bang.
Speaker 5: Okay, prove it.
Speaker 3: I just did first law thermodynamics.
Speaker 5: So.
Speaker 2: Popoo papo.
Speaker 19: Uh.
Speaker 1: So the proof the proof for that is the fact
Speaker 1: that we do not experience energy being destroyed. Right, we
Speaker 1: cannot actually destroy energy. We've never seen energy be destroyed,
Speaker 1: so it only transforms in form. Right, That's what the
Speaker 1: inflation of the universe. It was a transformation of energy.
Speaker 1: It went from potential energy transforming into the inflation event.
Speaker 2: And there's several different ways in which that could have happened.
Speaker 1: So if you if you can disprove the first law
Speaker 1: of thermodynamics, then then it's incumbent upon you to provide
Speaker 1: that proof.
Speaker 2: Otherwise we have to go with what we currently know.
Speaker 1: And what we know is that energy cannot be destroyed
Speaker 1: nor created, so that that is the that is the
Speaker 1: establish thing. That's what's been established with proof already, all right,
Speaker 1: So if you have have something contrary to that, then
Speaker 1: you can give that to us.
Speaker 3: Okay, I'm going to prove it.
Speaker 5: The love termo dynamics came into being with the Big Bang, Mumpy.
Speaker 3: That's a claim that prove your clim No, it.
Speaker 5: Didn't exist before. Prove that it didn't exit before the
Speaker 5: big bank exploded.
Speaker 3: Prove you're you've tripled down saying the same thing over
Speaker 3: and over again and you haven't bothered to prove it. Now,
Speaker 3: when it comes to the first law, thromerynamics. I can
Speaker 3: read you the entire Wikipedia page if you really want
Speaker 3: me to to prove my point.
Speaker 5: But you have.
Speaker 3: But you saying that the first law thermodynamics only did
Speaker 3: not exist before the beginning of the universe doesn't make
Speaker 3: any sense because you can't back that up. Energy existed
Speaker 3: before the The energy can't be created or destroyed in
Speaker 3: order for the first law of thermodynamics to not exist
Speaker 3: before the universe. That means energy had to be created,
Speaker 3: and we know it wasn't. This is an obvious point.
Speaker 5: Before he'd exploded.
Speaker 3: There was no So the fact that so first of all,
Speaker 3: the fact that it exploded proves it.
Speaker 6: Energy.
Speaker 3: This said before the Big Bang. Otherwise there's nothing to do,
Speaker 3: nothing to explode, there's nothing to go bang prove it.
Speaker 3: The Big Bang proves it. Do you really want proof
Speaker 3: of the Big Bank? Because I can give you the
Speaker 3: proof that's right out of a Christian's book. Oh that's
Speaker 3: a claim.
Speaker 5: You're saying that energy was acuse prove energy was the cross.
Speaker 3: Of the Big Bang? Sure equals MC squared. Oh, prove it.
Speaker 11: I just did.
Speaker 3: I did have. I don't have to prove it because
Speaker 3: Einstein did when he said he equals mc squared. That's
Speaker 3: the proof. Do you know do you know what.
Speaker 2: Represents?
Speaker 1: Bang, Papo popo, do you know what E equals mc
Speaker 1: squared represents?
Speaker 3: Don't tell me, Oh Jesus Christ, you're trying to argue physics,
Speaker 3: and he don't even know what the equals mc squared is.
Speaker 5: I don't know.
Speaker 4: Energy equals mass times square the speed of light meaning energy.
Speaker 3: At the same time, I.
Speaker 2: Just did, you can convert.
Speaker 1: Hold on, So, Papa, Papa, you can convert between energy
Speaker 1: and matter. You can represent like mass matter, all of
Speaker 1: that as energy. And so that equation allows you to
Speaker 1: do that. And so that's why why we're saying that
Speaker 1: we've proven it with E equals mc squared, because for
Speaker 1: the big for the inflation of the universe, that energy
Speaker 1: is transformed into the matter that we have today, and
Speaker 1: that we can understand that transformation through that particular formula,
Speaker 1: and so like what we would need from you something
Speaker 1: that disproves that. But you know, Papa, I could already
Speaker 1: tell that we're we're kind of up ship Creek with
Speaker 1: a single paddle here, and we're just gonna be going
Speaker 1: around in circles. So I wanted Jim to experience, you know,
Speaker 1: your argument on his own for a bit.
Speaker 3: But there was no argument. I mean, it was just
Speaker 3: a contingency argument. And then he doesn't even understand physics
Speaker 3: well enough to.
Speaker 4: Actually have an intelligent conversation about anything.
Speaker 3: I mean, prove the first law of throno dynamics. I'm
Speaker 3: not a physics teacher, but I can read you the
Speaker 3: Wikipedia page, I can refer to you a whole bunch
Speaker 3: of really good YouTube videos that I'll explain it to you.
Speaker 4: But the first law of throne dynamics is pretty well
Speaker 4: settled physics. It's just true because of all of the
Speaker 4: evidence that supports it. And you're just going uh uh,
Speaker 4: and you have no other argument. You can't even support
Speaker 4: the argument that the contingent thing is a being. You're
Speaker 4: just waving your hands, going it's a being and you
Speaker 4: can't even.
Speaker 5: Prove that reality.
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, I am done.
Speaker 4: With Okay, you cannot prove anything, and he doesn't understand
Speaker 4: physics fall enough to have an intelligent conversation.
Speaker 2: Yep, So Popo, I'm gonna yep see you little.
Speaker 3: Paper all right for that? Gee, I owe you for this,
Speaker 3: by the way.
Speaker 1: Okay, so I've got about thirty minutes left here, we're
Speaker 1: going to try to get through these last few callers
Speaker 1: that we've got. I definitely want to try to get
Speaker 1: to everybody that we can. So the next person we
Speaker 1: have is Jace from from Ohio. There, Hey there, Jase,
Speaker 1: how you doing yeh, I'm doing pretty good.
Speaker 5: How you guys doing doing?
Speaker 2: All right?
Speaker 1: So you're saying that aliens are proof of God, and
Speaker 1: I'm just kind of curious how you square that square
Speaker 1: that issue?
Speaker 5: Yeah, absolutely so if you don't mind saying, give you
Speaker 5: my own backstory to how I found Christ through aliens?
Speaker 5: That's okay.
Speaker 3: Well, first of all, I don't really want to hear
Speaker 3: a story. We don't have time. Uh can you prove
Speaker 3: that aliens exist? Can I prove that they exist?
Speaker 5: Well?
Speaker 3: Going to my story?
Speaker 5: Okay, about my experience, Okay, it.
Speaker 3: Led me to, Uh, can we get a two minute timer? Please?
Speaker 3: Hold on, hold on, hold hold your horses there, We're
Speaker 3: gonna get put.
Speaker 4: We're gonna give you two minutes to give me your backstory,
Speaker 4: and then if you haven't gotten to the argument that
Speaker 4: aliens prove.
Speaker 3: God, we're just going to cut you off and go
Speaker 3: to the next callar. All right, you have two minutes.
Speaker 3: Can we get that two minute timer up there? It
Speaker 3: is go all right?
Speaker 5: Well, I was always into aliens and all that. When
Speaker 5: I was like five years old the Indian hockey, I
Speaker 5: got into the reptilian crazy stuff. So I had to
Speaker 5: I had to experience on my bed, close my eyes
Speaker 5: opened them. They're all around me. I cried out for
Speaker 5: Jesus Christ. They left, came across kill Jordan, a UFO researcher.
Speaker 9: He investigated these stories of.
Speaker 5: You being adducted, same situation I had. He became a
Speaker 5: Christian to that. If you want to look in the Bible,
Speaker 5: a lot of people, you know, a lot of people
Speaker 5: you know, claim the aliens are.
Speaker 3: In the Bible or whatever.
Speaker 5: Ancient religions all that document.
Speaker 3: These beings in the sky.
Speaker 5: We have them today. You see the White House consistently.
Speaker 3: You're done, all right, that's it. Your argument is that
Speaker 3: you had an experience you interpreted as aliens all around you.
Speaker 3: You cried out to Jesus Christ, and poof, they were gone. Yeah,
Speaker 3: So can you please explain to me, give me any
Speaker 3: evidence that your experience was actually real and not just
Speaker 3: a figment of your imagination.
Speaker 5: Yeah, I mean I was fully conscious the entire time.
Speaker 3: Yeah, people who are dreaming are often claimed to be
Speaker 3: fully conscious. Can you please give me any evidence that
Speaker 3: it would actually happened.
Speaker 5: Well, I remember that time and day that it happened.
Speaker 5: It happened on July sixteenth.
Speaker 3: Yeah, people who listen say the same thing. Can you
Speaker 3: give me any evidence that it happened?
Speaker 5: What is it?
Speaker 3: Yes? This is all common bs that people give to
Speaker 3: try and prove that something happened, and none of it
Speaker 3: it makes any difference because people who listen it will
Speaker 3: do the same thing. Right, So I'm not saying you're hallucinading.
Speaker 3: I'm just using that as an example.
Speaker 4: I didn't know what your personal experience was, but I'm
Speaker 4: looking for some type of evidence that your personal experience
Speaker 4: actually happened.
Speaker 3: And it's not just you interpreting events.
Speaker 5: Okay, I mean I know I was fully conscious. I
Speaker 5: mean it'sout like Telly as the story. I guess you know,
Speaker 5: I can't really give you the entire background though, you know,
Speaker 5: I just got I.
Speaker 3: Don't care about the story. I want the evidence. You
Speaker 3: don't have any evidence, do you. You don't have any
Speaker 3: evidence that aliens exist. You really don't want to go
Speaker 3: to the Bible because John and I have John in
Speaker 3: particular has been kicking people in the teeth with the
Speaker 3: Bible versus and we can continue to do that if
Speaker 3: you really want to, if you want, if you want
Speaker 3: what to be Round four, Round five of the Bible
Speaker 3: doesn't say what it's you think it says. But you
Speaker 3: haven't offered any evidence whatsoever. Uh that what you're you're
Speaker 3: saying is true?
Speaker 5: Well, can you prove to me that they don't exist?
Speaker 3: That aliens don't exist? They're making the claim. You're making
Speaker 3: the claim, buddy, you got to back it up.
Speaker 5: I mean, you have the government itself.
Speaker 3: Okay, I'm done. What about you, John?
Speaker 5: They aren't actually demons?
Speaker 3: Yeah, we're done.
Speaker 4: I'm getting to is how did I stay come back
Speaker 4: when you can actually prove something with actual evidence instead
Speaker 4: of just whatever your brain thought of.
Speaker 3: Thanks, So just real quick.
Speaker 4: I had the experience where I was in that half
Speaker 4: asleep mode where you can't move and would swear it.
Speaker 4: I had cats dancing tear on my feet and didn't
Speaker 4: do not own cats. That's the only evidence I have
Speaker 4: and I'm not saying or a cast or anything else
Speaker 4: going on.
Speaker 3: Then that's the way my brain worked. I've had weird
Speaker 3: experiences too. I'm not making fantastic clients. So all right,
Speaker 3: on to the next one.
Speaker 2: Okay, let's see. Yeah, it's kind of a toxic. Which
Speaker 2: one do you? Which one do you want to take?
Speaker 3: Well, let's let's end on a palate cleanser and keep
Speaker 3: Z for life.
Speaker 2: Okay, keep Z for last. All right, so let's go
Speaker 2: to William. What's up there, William?
Speaker 5: How you doing great?
Speaker 8: So the first thing I want to say is, like
Speaker 8: in the New Testament, it specifically says.
Speaker 3: There was an argument whether every Christian needs.
Speaker 5: To follow the Old Testament law, and then Act chapter.
Speaker 19: Fifteen, he said, no, you don't need to follow every
Speaker 19: Old Testament law, right, and Jesus says you do? Okay,
Speaker 19: Where where did Jesus say you need to follow every
Speaker 19: Old Testament law?
Speaker 3: Matthew? You five? Apparently you weren't paying attention. Matthew five?
Speaker 2: What is seventeenth through seventeen? Nineteen?
Speaker 3: Seventeen to nineteen?
Speaker 6: I heard you misquoting scripture?
Speaker 3: I heard that, So let's go. No, we're not misquoting
Speaker 3: a scripture. Let me read you scripture? Do you mind? John?
Speaker 17: Yeah?
Speaker 2: Good?
Speaker 4: So okay, Matthew five, seventeen through nineteen, word for word
Speaker 4: right out of the New International Version says quote, do
Speaker 4: not think that I have come to abolish the law
Speaker 4: or the prophets.
Speaker 3: I have not come to abolish them, but to fulfill them.
Speaker 4: For truly, I tell you, until heaven and earth disappear,
Speaker 4: not the smallest letter, not the small least stroke of
Speaker 4: a pen, well, by any means, disappear from the law
Speaker 4: until everything is accomplished. So that is exactly what the
Speaker 4: Bible says. And that is Jesus speaking, and Jesus saying
Speaker 4: that the Old Testament laws still exist.
Speaker 5: Right, So, yes, exactly so, so.
Speaker 15: For eximple Old Testiment law said Moses commanded the issue life. Right,
Speaker 15: So if we go by the law, it said Moses
Speaker 15: commanded Israelites. It is say Moses commanded the Midianites. And
Speaker 15: they say Moses commanded everybody who was going to become
Speaker 15: a Jew, and said Moses commanded the Israelites.
Speaker 5: So you can't take the law like if I were
Speaker 5: to give you.
Speaker 15: A document and I would say, my father commanded me
Speaker 15: to do this, and then you were to say, well,
Speaker 15: God commanded.
Speaker 5: Everybody, you know, that's what the Father commanded.
Speaker 3: The son.
Speaker 9: But I'm gonna finish.
Speaker 5: I'm a finished with this. So first of all, it
Speaker 5: said that that was for the Israelites.
Speaker 3: It didn't say it was for everybody.
Speaker 5: Second of all, if you want to call it the
Speaker 5: law and the law.
Speaker 15: God commanded them to eat the unclean animals. If the
Speaker 15: first five books is the law, they had all the
Speaker 15: animals when they came out.
Speaker 9: Of the Ark.
Speaker 15: When they came out of the Ark, they were commanded.
Speaker 5: To eat everything, not just the clean animals.
Speaker 3: Right, So you don't want you don't want to have
Speaker 3: a conversation about with me about what you could eat
Speaker 3: in the Bible because it's a security conversation and it's
Speaker 3: not going to help you because the ultimate answer is
Speaker 3: we don't know. It's unclear as to what you can
Speaker 3: actually eat in the Bible. So you don't want to
Speaker 3: do that one. But again, nothing you said actually refused that.
Speaker 3: All the laws in the Old Testament for anybody who's
Speaker 3: going to be a follower of Christ. And they were all.
Speaker 4: Jewish at the time most of this was written, right,
Speaker 4: Paul was only one preaching to the gentiles.
Speaker 3: So yes, you have to have all you have to
Speaker 3: follow all the laws. That's what this says.
Speaker 7: So the.
Speaker 5: Law, Mathew, So the law did the first five books
Speaker 5: include the law? Because in the law, Genesis will be
Speaker 5: part of the law. If Genesis is part of the law.
Speaker 6: Then and Genesis he commanded them to eat fruits and
Speaker 6: vegetables in the garden. If Genesis is a part of
Speaker 6: the law, when.
Speaker 15: They came out of the art, they would command it
Speaker 15: to eat unclean animals as well.
Speaker 4: If so, Genesis is not the only place where God
Speaker 4: commands people. Gives a list of things you can and
Speaker 4: cannot eat, right, So in Genesis nine to three, which
Speaker 4: is what you're talking about, yes, you could eat anything.
Speaker 4: In Leviticus eleven seven, in Deuteronomy fourteen one through twenty one,
Speaker 4: that's all Old Testament.
Speaker 3: God gives you a list of restricted diets.
Speaker 5: Now the issue, I can't give this to the world.
Speaker 3: Can give Yes, if you're going to follow Jesus Christ,
Speaker 3: who is a Jew, you also have to follow Jewish
Speaker 3: law Jewish only.
Speaker 2: Can I hold on?
Speaker 1: I want to provide some clarification here on this particular point.
Speaker 1: Is that okay, there William.
Speaker 3: Yes, sir, yes, sir, okay.
Speaker 1: I feel like you have a Bible and if you
Speaker 1: want to turn in your Bible. Galatians three twenty nine
Speaker 1: is the key verse here. And I know that this
Speaker 1: is Paul, but you know we've been referencing between Jesus
Speaker 1: and Paul and everything like that. But Paul says that
Speaker 1: if you belong to Christ, meaning Jesus, then you are
Speaker 1: Abraham's seed and heirs according to the promise. So it
Speaker 1: kind of seems like even to Paul, you're considered to
Speaker 1: be part of that group of people. You're directly descended
Speaker 1: from Aber hand.
Speaker 6: So that's so, that's just this is perfect because people
Speaker 6: doesn't don't get it right.
Speaker 5: So Abraham seed wasn't just Israel, right, Israel Israel is.
Speaker 6: A subset of Abraham. Abraham had Abraham.
Speaker 3: Had other children other than Jacob.
Speaker 18: No no, no, no no no no no no no.
Speaker 15: The twelve tribe that's after the twelve tribes would be
Speaker 15: a subset of Jacob. I'm talking about the super set, right,
Speaker 15: So Jacob.
Speaker 3: Had brothers, right, no.
Speaker 5: No, no, I'm sorry're right right, I got to say,
Speaker 5: I'm sorry. I sry. My mind is going somewhere else.
Speaker 6: But before but even before those twelve tribes, there were
Speaker 6: still there were still Hebrews, there were still Hebrews. So right,
Speaker 6: so Abraham was the Hebrew but he had other children.
Speaker 8: What he had it was his son Isaac, right, and
Speaker 8: there was Isaac.
Speaker 6: He also had that Muslims, right, Jacob, not Jacob Ishmail Ismail.
Speaker 6: So Ishmael was one of his descendants, and Isaac was
Speaker 6: another one of his descendants. And I don't remember how
Speaker 6: many children Isaac had, but oh, it was, it was
Speaker 6: it was Jacob and right soul, So that would mean
Speaker 6: that also came from Isaac.
Speaker 15: So Isaac was the one who was considered the son
Speaker 15: of problems. So that means that not only the Israelites
Speaker 15: would be the chosen people on Abraham, but also.
Speaker 8: The descendants of also.
Speaker 2: William.
Speaker 1: Yeah, so William William the So so there's two parts
Speaker 1: to this verse. The second part is kind of also
Speaker 1: key and can't be ignored.
Speaker 2: It says and heirs according to the promise, So like.
Speaker 1: If you're if you belong to Christ, then we're not
Speaker 1: talking about those other groups out there, We're talking about
Speaker 1: the ones that are heirs according to the promise.
Speaker 2: So they are heirs to all of this.
Speaker 1: So it's all connected to the Old Testament. So yes,
Speaker 1: the Old Testament laws are still applicable to Christians.
Speaker 8: Well, hold on, no, no, so what so what you're
Speaker 8: saying doesn't make sense?
Speaker 6: Is what you're saying just so, just based on what
Speaker 6: you said, air to the promise, So air to the promise.
Speaker 5: Don't mean that you fall the same laws. So so
Speaker 5: I have a let's say I got three children. I
Speaker 5: got three children.
Speaker 8: I tell one child, listen, what you got to do
Speaker 8: is you got to mop the floors.
Speaker 5: That's my daughters. Then I tell my sons, Yo, what
Speaker 5: you got to do is you got to take care
Speaker 5: of your mother.
Speaker 3: Right as to the promise.
Speaker 5: But they don't off fall the same laws.
Speaker 3: So for you to say that, oh, isn't the promise
Speaker 3: of this case referring to the Covenant, which would include
Speaker 3: all three hundred and some odd laws in the old customent, well,
Speaker 3: is to the promise that the So just my quick reaction.
Speaker 5: With I'm thinking about what you said. The covenant is
Speaker 5: the promise wouldn't be the Old Testament Covenant. The promise
Speaker 5: would be the New Testament would be I will pour
Speaker 5: out my sons into the New Testament.
Speaker 3: Covenant doesn't happen until after the Second Coming. No, no, no, no, no,
Speaker 3: we're gonna have to agree to disagreew in.
Speaker 5: That because I will pour out my spirit on your
Speaker 5: sons and daughters. That's the promise of the New.
Speaker 3: Covenant, right, you know what I'm saying, go ahead.
Speaker 2: No, I was just saying, eude, like I'm gonna pour
Speaker 2: out my spirit on you like that just sounds for us.
Speaker 5: Yeah, but I mean you might.
Speaker 8: I mean, listen, listen, that's that's the I don't.
Speaker 6: I mean, there's a there's a few so different people
Speaker 6: like different things. Some people like Gerbals in different places.
Speaker 1: Some people don't so to you and might sound well,
Speaker 1: I'm sure some people like hollo.
Speaker 4: No, I don't understand what this has to do with
Speaker 4: with everybody who is Jewish and Christian must follow the laws,
Speaker 4: because it's pretty clear we're reading you black letter and
Speaker 4: you're offering us your interpretation to fit your worldview, and
Speaker 4: alls we're doing is reading the Bible God, and it
Speaker 4: doesn't say.
Speaker 2: That changing the rules.
Speaker 6: So you just had the discussion about slavery, right now.
Speaker 15: So no, no, no, no, no, I said earlier on
Speaker 15: the day, you guys were talking about slavery, and one
Speaker 15: of the things that was brought up was well, you got.
Speaker 20: The nations and then you got Israel, so maybe you
Speaker 20: know you could buy it from the nation, but not
Speaker 20: necessarily buy from Israel. So the point I was getting
Speaker 20: at was that you guys have already.
Speaker 6: Acknowledged that God got different rules with different people.
Speaker 15: If the law says, it says there.
Speaker 6: Every time you read Exodus and Leviticus.
Speaker 15: And Deuteronomy, it always says and God told Moses to
Speaker 15: tell oh, shoot, I got go.
Speaker 9: Now I'm getting it. Call I've got to go.
Speaker 1: Now, Okay, damn, that was quick, all right, see you
Speaker 1: later there, William. So the important thing here that I
Speaker 1: guess I was trying to get to is that, I mean,
Speaker 1: you know, Paul has his contradictory thing about the whole
Speaker 1: commandments deal, whether or not those applied. But at the
Speaker 1: same time, it's rather awkward for me because I don't
Speaker 1: know how to I don't know how to understand sin
Speaker 1: unless that sin is encapsulated by the commandments, Like I
Speaker 1: just don't know what sin is, and it turns into
Speaker 1: this whole.
Speaker 2: Thing where you know, there's.
Speaker 1: We're just making up whatever we think God doesn't like,
Speaker 1: and I just I don't.
Speaker 2: Understand that.
Speaker 3: You have to accept contradictory things in order to read
Speaker 3: the Bible.
Speaker 2: I'm sorry, Jim, go ahead.
Speaker 3: I would say that it's so obvious when you actually
Speaker 3: start to read it and study it. Just on the
Speaker 3: concept of what can you eat? You have three verses
Speaker 3: in the Old Testament that dictate that. One says you
Speaker 3: need anything to others say you have a restricted diet.
Speaker 3: And yet the New Testament says you can eat anything
Speaker 3: unless you just It's not clear and simple as people
Speaker 3: want it to be, and they don't realize it. And
Speaker 3: once they have figured out what their dogma is and
Speaker 3: they fit the facts to it, that's all they want
Speaker 3: to hear.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm wondering, what would you care if we if
Speaker 1: we brought up our backup post to handle this last call,
Speaker 1: because I don't want them to be back there for
Speaker 1: nothing this entire time.
Speaker 2: And we've had so many great calls. Hey there, Ben,
Speaker 2: how you doing good?
Speaker 3: How are you guys doing?
Speaker 2: Yeah, doing pretty good. Have you enjoyed the show so far?
Speaker 3: Oh my gosh, some.
Speaker 21: Interesting and inspuriating callers, but it certainly seemed fun.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 1: Well, we do have our last collar to take today,
Speaker 1: and like Jim said, it's a palate cleanser. So we're
Speaker 1: gonna be talking to Z and we're talking about the
Speaker 1: difference between agnostic and atheist.
Speaker 2: How you doing there, Z?
Speaker 1: What's you up to?
Speaker 3: Yo?
Speaker 17: Yo yo?
Speaker 9: What's up?
Speaker 17: Guys?
Speaker 9: Finally on, finally on. Yeah, it's funny.
Speaker 17: I came across the channel just randomly, like the show
Speaker 17: before you guys, thanks for hanging around, Thank you for.
Speaker 9: Doing God serk, that's a joke. Oh wow, wow wow wow. Yeah.
Speaker 21: I grew out mission and created everything. This is God's
Speaker 21: work before that this would be happening.
Speaker 9: And ire with where we talked about this stuff quite.
Speaker 17: A bit, and uh, you know, there's this My dad
Speaker 17: is Jesus guy and his mom was a Pennycostal and
Speaker 17: so like they wrote her off as crazy because some
Speaker 17: of her thoughts were crazy, and I also want to
Speaker 17: give us but she's an amazing woman. And my mom
Speaker 17: was definitely an atheist and she passed away about ten
Speaker 17: or eleven years ago.
Speaker 9: So I want to give a shout and I want to.
Speaker 17: Give a shout out to all the callers, because you know,
Speaker 17: everybody's got their own thing going on, and they're all
Speaker 17: humans and it's tough to being a human sometimes and
Speaker 17: I think everybody is trying to make sense of it all.
Speaker 9: And I appreciate you too.
Speaker 17: For really like really getting down to business when it
Speaker 17: comes down to the yo, are.
Speaker 9: You guys kidding me? Are you really thinking music?
Speaker 5: Like?
Speaker 17: Are you really into this? But like, hey, that's what
Speaker 17: you were taught you were a green pencil was yellow
Speaker 17: from the age of whatever zero, I guess or one
Speaker 17: day like you might think that that green pencil was
Speaker 17: yellow or whatever. It was my thought eupimism. I think
Speaker 17: it's well.
Speaker 9: But yeah, so I got some really interesting things to say.
Speaker 5: For me.
Speaker 17: I actually just had a experience with pretty guy hard
Speaker 17: Catholics in their late seventies eighties. They also have big
Speaker 17: gatherings for people that are muslim a Native Americans. They
Speaker 17: accepted me being agnostic basically or whatever.
Speaker 9: They didn't even ask me what I was.
Speaker 3: But and.
Speaker 17: Yeah, so my question is is, like, so when it
Speaker 17: comes to agnostic and atheism, what do you guys think
Speaker 17: about Like when energy is.
Speaker 9: You know, seems godly, you know, is that.
Speaker 17: Meant I don't I don't want to go in It's
Speaker 17: not a mental illness, it's a mental Oh.
Speaker 4: I'm not sure what you're asking because atheists and agnostic
Speaker 4: are terms that have nothing to do with energy.
Speaker 17: Yeah, so, I guess for everybody out there, I just
Speaker 17: wanted to like say, like, yeah, like, I don't think
Speaker 17: it's wrong for any of these people to think what
Speaker 17: they think, but like they think.
Speaker 3: You don't think it's wrong for people to think it's
Speaker 3: okay to sell their children into slavery.
Speaker 9: I think that's wrong, and I think yeah, so so.
Speaker 3: Yeah, well thank you for that.
Speaker 4: By the way, it's nice, like I said, it's gonna
Speaker 4: be a power cleanser. But so it's not okay for
Speaker 4: everybody to think whatever they want to think, so that
Speaker 4: that's not true.
Speaker 17: Yes, I sided to tact over even how ridiculous is
Speaker 17: it to even believe in the Bible something that was
Speaker 17: written two thousand years ago when we as humans have
Speaker 17: evolved so much even just since uh you know it
Speaker 17: was July or two hundred and fifty years but how
Speaker 17: much we've evolved since then.
Speaker 9: You know, it's just unbelievable. It's unbelievable. What do you
Speaker 9: guys think about that?
Speaker 21: Well, I mean I think certainly there's a lot of
Speaker 21: old books, uh there there could be a passage or
Speaker 21: two in the Bible that is sensible and reasonable. I
Speaker 21: think like don't murder people is generally like widely accepted belief.
Speaker 21: But I think if you're trying to base your entire
Speaker 21: life around a document from that that long ago, probably foolish.
Speaker 14: You may miss some things or be misinformed about the world.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 9: Yeah, And it's like I guess, like I just cannot.
Speaker 9: I guess you're you're you're you're trying to.
Speaker 17: Help people out, but I are seeing that you guys
Speaker 17: are being a little bit argun into kis and maybe, like.
Speaker 4: I hope we're being more than a little bit argumentative.
Speaker 4: It's the whole point of the show.
Speaker 1: Yeah, turn out this argumentation game, the league game across this.
Speaker 17: So, like I guess, yeah, so like I remember this
Speaker 17: when I was like sixteen, you know, and that's been
Speaker 17: some decades back, and like I remember atheists being argumentative
Speaker 17: and being like I don't really like that part about it,
Speaker 17: you know, but like I see one, Well, I know.
Speaker 4: A lot of atheists who aren't argumentative at all. They
Speaker 4: live their lives out ever having a single argument about it.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 14: Well, I think it's something as.
Speaker 21: As we do this show, and we have several other shows,
Speaker 21: and then we do a lot of other stuff at
Speaker 21: the Free Thought Library in Austin. In all of the
Speaker 21: like activism that I've done and work that I've done
Speaker 21: in the past, I think like different strategies and for
Speaker 21: different means and different capabilities for different memes. I think
Speaker 21: some people are really good at arguing. I think some
Speaker 21: people are really good at kind of deconstructing arguments and
Speaker 21: being an advocate in the public. But then there's other spaces.
Speaker 21: Some people are really good at having more compassionate conversation
Speaker 21: and deconstructing thoughts and taking times, and I think all
Speaker 21: of those are equally valid. So I appreciate, like sometimes
Speaker 21: this kind of show isn't for everybody, But we do
Speaker 21: have other programming where our hosts we tell our hosts
Speaker 21: to try to sit down and kind of deconstruct the
Speaker 21: arguments and kind of cool things down a little bit more.
Speaker 3: I think.
Speaker 17: One thing, So that's going to blow all y'all's minds
Speaker 17: that everybody's still listening that we're air raft.
Speaker 3: So I hope I get to hold onto.
Speaker 5: Some of it.
Speaker 9: You guys ready for this? You never heard of we Board?
Speaker 3: Yeah, they're fake? What about them?
Speaker 9: I was only thirteen or fourteen, and.
Speaker 17: This is I didn't prove God at all, but disproves energy,
Speaker 17: and I guess to kind of like proves where some
Speaker 17: people go after they die, possibly or just energy.
Speaker 3: But you know how you know how wig boards work, right,
Speaker 3: they're the worst.
Speaker 9: I don't know. I've never used.
Speaker 17: Whenever I was, I was like thirteen years old, and
Speaker 17: my friend and his sisters were really into it.
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's whatever push it.
Speaker 4: It's whoever pushed it to shuttle thing around, is the
Speaker 4: answer you get, because there's I mean, Hasbro made them.
Speaker 17: He asked the Wigi board to prove itself. There's like
Speaker 17: a ton of articles online I looked up one time.
Speaker 3: Yeah, and and and the Ouiji board is fake. There's
Speaker 3: there is no evidence that the supernatural actually, oh there
Speaker 3: we go, holy spirit board and John's got one right there.
Speaker 9: To prove itself. And it literally threw us.
Speaker 3: It doesn't it doesn't. Yeah, that's what our minds aren't blown.
Speaker 3: And uh, you know, because boards aren't a thing.
Speaker 1: This one says communic This one says communicate directly with
Speaker 1: Jesus Christ, because obviously you need a Ouiji board in
Speaker 1: order to communicate with Christy that again. There, I'm sorry,
Speaker 1: my my middle of my sentence interrupted the beginning of years.
Speaker 2: That's my bad.
Speaker 1: Uh anyways, uh ze, So I'm not exactly sure if
Speaker 1: we're actually talking about the topic that you actually call
Speaker 1: it in for.
Speaker 2: But you know, I don't know.
Speaker 1: We we We've got to read super chats and then
Speaker 1: I've got to get out of here.
Speaker 2: So any final thoughts there.
Speaker 9: Then I listened to an hour of incredibleness.
Speaker 17: Now I can kind of understand where you guys are
Speaker 17: coming from, and I thank you for being the voices
Speaker 17: of reason, and I think you are pretty You're pretty reasonable.
Speaker 9: That is terrible. I cannot believe I never read the Bible.
Speaker 17: I cannot believe the Bible said that stuff, and like
Speaker 17: people actually worshiped it or worshiped all that stuff.
Speaker 9: It's just weird.
Speaker 2: It's totally crazy.
Speaker 1: There's a hey, maybe pick up some choice choice Bible
Speaker 1: verses and see how horrible it is. Sometimes it's just
Speaker 1: kind of an interesting thing to just be knowledgeable about.
Speaker 1: At least I think that it's pretty cool. But anyways,
Speaker 1: we're going to let you go there, Zee. I hope
Speaker 1: you have a fabulous rest of your day and we
Speaker 1: coming up and we'll talk to you later.
Speaker 2: Okay, have a good one, go tak you care everyone
Speaker 2: you too, cee see. Oh right, man, that was a
Speaker 2: good show today, I was.
Speaker 1: I mean, we started off with some drunk couple and
Speaker 1: we ended with you know, oiichi board, So that was
Speaker 1: pretty awesome.
Speaker 4: That covers the gamut, and we end up with a
Speaker 4: bunch of Christians defunding slavery, defunding sexual assault, defending being
Speaker 4: evil as being okay because God says it, which is
Speaker 4: problematic because God has on at least two occasions told
Speaker 4: people to go kill their children. Now on one occasion
Speaker 4: he goes, psych no, don't do it. But in some
Speaker 4: ways I think that that's probably as baden.
Speaker 1: There's a there's actually a sophisticated biblical argument, you know,
Speaker 1: that points out that God actually required the Israelites to
Speaker 1: sacrifice their firstborn children, and so like there's I mean,
Speaker 1: that's actually in the Bible where they God directly commands
Speaker 1: that of them. So it's like you can't even be
Speaker 1: like they were doing horrible things like sacrificing their babies.
Speaker 1: It's like the Israelites were doing that too.
Speaker 3: I've heard some arguments from scholars saying that they're not
Speaker 3: sure that the whole psych don't do it bit is
Speaker 3: actually original. It was added later because it made God
Speaker 3: look like a real evil ass.
Speaker 6: Home.
Speaker 3: Well, Sacrice, yeah, I've argument.
Speaker 21: Yeah, what I'm always fascinated by when talking about like
Speaker 21: the people just accepting these what we would consider atrocious things,
Speaker 21: is this weird redefinition of that which is good is
Speaker 21: that which glorifies God. I think if you start heading
Speaker 21: down that path, it becomes the justification for anything, because
Speaker 21: at that point, as long as you're quote unquote glorifying
Speaker 21: God and like.
Speaker 14: Then we're we're we're really not.
Speaker 21: Using the same language when we talk about like that
Speaker 21: which is good or that which is bad, that which
Speaker 21: causes harm. It just makes communication difficult. Just so it
Speaker 21: really does very fundamental.
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, because we're no longer talking about you know, morals,
Speaker 3: We're not talking about things that can benefit society and
Speaker 3: make us all better, and slavery does not do that.
Speaker 1: So all right, well we do have some super chance
Speaker 1: to read off before we leave out. I'll start off
Speaker 1: here with and Chris the donut Fiend. I have to
Speaker 1: say I love that username. It's so fun to say.
Speaker 1: But and says, divine command theory is always used to
Speaker 1: justify sociopathic behaviors, and yeah, I mean it really, it
Speaker 1: always is because it's easy. It's an easy thing for
Speaker 1: them to accept, and you know they're already pre trained
Speaker 1: to just accept whatever God says.
Speaker 21: Yeah, and like Plato sore and carecterguard, like there's so
Speaker 21: many people from hundreds of years ago that we're dealing
Speaker 21: with that exact question and that issue of the divine
Speaker 21: command theory, and like we're still dealing with it today,
Speaker 21: all right.
Speaker 1: And then the next chat is Kelly Shecher forty nine
Speaker 1: to thirty seven that says nine ninety nine saying thanks
Speaker 1: for the show, Thank you so much there, Kelly. And
Speaker 1: then we've got Kelly Laughlin who sent in a super chat, Yeah,
Speaker 1: send a super chant saying Godless Engineer will be speaking
Speaker 1: at the tenth annual ARCon counter protest next week July twelfth.
Speaker 1: Other speakers include Seth Andrews No Illusions. Also, Kelly will
Speaker 1: be speaking there too, Godless Granny. If anybody out there
Speaker 1: knows Godless Granny's going to be speaking, Mandisa Thomas is
Speaker 1: going to be speaking there. It's just it's gonna be
Speaker 1: a great number of people that are going to be there.
Speaker 3: Fantastic, that's really all.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 1: Then we've got Carl Grimes, who says, send in a
Speaker 1: super chapter five dollars, saying, Deuteronomy twenty one ten happened
Speaker 1: to my mother. We weren't allowed to leave the home.
Speaker 1: Grandmother nearly died. Aren't Christians just the worst? I'm so
Speaker 1: sorry that y'all had to experience that. That's that's horrible.
Speaker 1: Let's see, not the Bible, Jason sent in a super
Speaker 1: chapter two dollars, saying.
Speaker 2: Stop yelling at us, I'm so sorry.
Speaker 1: And then not the Bible Jason sent in another five
Speaker 1: dollars super chat sand what call could be more important
Speaker 1: than speaking the word?
Speaker 2: I mean, obviously it was.
Speaker 1: It was that witnessing to a bunch of atheists he
Speaker 1: had he had to take that call.
Speaker 21: I mean, I think if someone called it with the
Speaker 21: winning lotto numbers, I would consider that thing important.
Speaker 3: Oh, absolutely, yeah it was.
Speaker 2: Maybe it was Jesus. It was like, dude, I got them.
Speaker 21: Oh my gosh, you wanted like a convincing evidence for
Speaker 21: at least the supernatural capabilities of the Bible. Put some
Speaker 21: winning lottery numbers that it's like on August fifth, twenty
Speaker 21: twenty six, this will be the one.
Speaker 3: Any phone call from from my partner is far more
Speaker 3: important than.
Speaker 1: So so Ben and Jim, I'm wondering for the Holy
Speaker 1: Spirit of Jesus Christ Ouiji board. Can you guess what
Speaker 1: the little wigi wedge is?
Speaker 3: Is it a cross?
Speaker 14: I'm going to get it is across?
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, exactly.
Speaker 1: It's also made my Holy Spirit games uh not Hasbro,
Speaker 1: which is a little disappointing, but.
Speaker 3: I don't think they used to.
Speaker 2: Yeah, but that's gonna be our show for today.
Speaker 1: It's been an awesome show, very very filled with a
Speaker 1: lot of good conversation. We hope that you will subscribe
Speaker 1: to the Atheist Experience here as well as tune in
Speaker 1: next week when we're gonna have even more fantastic conversations.
Speaker 1: And so yeah, I guess that's it today. Thank you
Speaker 1: so much man for backing us up.
Speaker 21: I appreciate you guys bringing me up and having me
Speaker 21: on And for everyone else out there, also check out membership.
Speaker 21: You can check out at atheist type andcommunity dot org.
Speaker 3: We have membership.
Speaker 14: If you support and like what the ACA is all
Speaker 14: about and what we do.
Speaker 21: That's a way to not just support the channels which helps,
Speaker 21: but also support us directly.
Speaker 14: And you can also check out our really cool merch
Speaker 14: it's somewhere up wrong hand. I'm new at that.
Speaker 1: Yeah, you know, I'm really bad about this during because
Speaker 1: I totally forgot to read off the stuff right after
Speaker 1: the first call.
Speaker 2: But I do want to say thank you so much
Speaker 2: to the crew on the back end.
Speaker 1: They're making it possible today. That's totally my bad for
Speaker 1: not calling y'all out earlier. Y'all are so awesome back there.
Speaker 1: Thank you guys for sticking around making a great show today,
Speaker 1: and it's just it's been great and y'all have really
Speaker 1: put forth the hard work all.
Speaker 2: Day to day. So thank you guys for that so much.
Speaker 1: But I also want to let everybody know that you
Speaker 1: can too become one of those attractive crew members, or
Speaker 1: you can be a guest on one of the shows,
Speaker 1: or you can eventually become a host. We're always looking
Speaker 1: for people interest in being part of our production, so
Speaker 1: you can email Volunteer at atheistdashcommunity dot org to get involved.
Speaker 14: And you will get to have a meeting with me.
Speaker 21: Of all Peaple, I'm also the volunteer coordinator, So check
Speaker 21: us out if you think this is really cool or
Speaker 21: you want to get involved in some other ways. We
Speaker 21: have stuff in person at the building. We have folks
Speaker 21: working on it. They've just been digging in ever since
Speaker 21: we did our twenty for our fundraisers. So further shout
Speaker 21: out to the crew and are the folks working for
Speaker 21: us and they do so much work and every volunteer helps.
Speaker 14: Whatever time you can give it goes towards helping us
Speaker 14: do this.
Speaker 2: Definitely.
Speaker 1: All right, Well, thank you everybody for a great show today,
Speaker 1: and I guess we will see y'all next week.
Speaker 5: Right away.
Speaker 12: To start already, y'all, to stop listen the bull shit
Speaker 12: everyone around you, buy the shy.
Speaker 8: Welcome David.
Speaker 5: Y'all.
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