Speaker 1: Broadcasting from Studio A here at Proven Winners, Color Choice Shrubs.
Speaker 1: It's time for the Gardening Simplified radio podcast and YouTube
Speaker 1: show with Stacy Hervella, me, Rick weisst and our engineer
Speaker 1: and producer Adrianna Robinson. Well, Stacey, I loved the story
Speaker 1: of Goldielocks and the Three Bears, Goldilocks trying to pick
Speaker 1: between the porridge, the chairs, and the bed that isn't
Speaker 1: too hard, too soft, too hot, whatever it may be.
Speaker 1: And I guess the direction I'm going here is that,
Speaker 1: to a degree, we do the same thing in our gardens.
Speaker 1: We look for plants that aren't too small, too big,
Speaker 1: just right. And I wish I had a dime for
Speaker 1: every time someone has walked up to me in the
Speaker 1: garden center and said, I want a plant that grows
Speaker 1: to three feet tall and then stops and doesn't grow
Speaker 1: anymore all the time.
Speaker 2: Three mon I'd love to live in your magical fantasy.
Speaker 2: It's not true because I do love huge plants. We
Speaker 2: know this. I've talked about it on the show. I
Speaker 2: love huge plants. But that doesn't mean that there's not
Speaker 2: a place for these so called just right plants, especially
Speaker 2: for people who maybe aren't so familiar with the broad
Speaker 2: range of options or just want, you know, one simple choice.
Speaker 2: And I think that to me, I'm glad you said
Speaker 2: three feet because I feel like that's kind of the
Speaker 2: sweet spot for people.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it is the sweet spot. But you know, it's
Speaker 1: important to note that plants have motives. Plants either want
Speaker 1: to grow or vine or flour and produce seed or whatever.
Speaker 1: They're not just simply growing for our benefit and enjoyment
Speaker 1: and stopping at three feet. Yet it's fun to go
Speaker 1: down the road of trying to determine are there some
Speaker 1: plants out there that kind of fill that bill that,
Speaker 1: just like Goldieloe would say, are just right plants that
Speaker 1: maybe don't have to have plant supports, which is another
Speaker 1: pet peeve of mine, by the way, because when you
Speaker 1: go out and you shop for plant supports, it's tough
Speaker 1: to find good quality plant supports.
Speaker 2: Good quality and good looking or at least, you know,
Speaker 2: which is to say, kind of nondescript. You don't really
Speaker 2: want to draw attention to the fact that your plant
Speaker 2: needs support. But some plants do need support. I mean,
Speaker 2: you know, peenies. Look how much people love them and
Speaker 2: they forgive them needing support.
Speaker 1: We all need support now and then. But just right
Speaker 1: plants are great for repetition in the landscape. The principle
Speaker 1: of three depths foreground, background, but the middle ground separates
Speaker 1: the front from the rear, pulls everything together, gives you
Speaker 1: an interesting layered view. So the obvious physical property of
Speaker 1: a plant is its form. And we don't always think
Speaker 1: of the mature or ultimate siloette of a plant, and
Speaker 1: yet we should when we place them in a landscape.
Speaker 1: And Stacy, I wanted to mention to you right off
Speaker 1: the bat that I personally believe in my landscape too.
Speaker 1: An example of a just right plant would be the
Speaker 1: Celtic pride Siberian cypress.
Speaker 2: That is a great plant. Now that is a bit shorter,
Speaker 2: but that is a plant that is almost fool proof.
Speaker 2: No matter where you put it, that thing is going
Speaker 2: to look great. It's going to do what you intended
Speaker 2: to do. Yeah, and just look amazing all you around
Speaker 2: because it's evergreen.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's a favorite of mine, of course. Also, I
Speaker 1: think the consummate just right plant in the landscape, my
Speaker 1: opinion would be Spyria's. Spyrias just fill the bill. They
Speaker 1: do a great job. They can fit in just about anywhere.
Speaker 1: Of course, they provide us great foliage color, rounded. Our
Speaker 1: horizontal shapes are less dramatic than those with vertical shape.
Speaker 1: Of course, vertical Any plants that are vertical really call
Speaker 1: for our attention. We've talked about that before. They are
Speaker 1: exclamation points. But Spyria really does a great job a
Speaker 1: nice rounded habit without pruning. And of course I love
Speaker 1: the yellow foliage of let's say, candy corn, because it's
Speaker 1: perfect to combine with blue flowers, whether they be perennials
Speaker 1: or annual.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, Spyria are such an interesting plant. I
Speaker 2: definitely have had my times of snobbery towards Spyrea. You know,
Speaker 2: it's just kind of like, oh, it's just like a
Speaker 2: gas station plant. But honestly, the proven winners to double
Speaker 2: play Spyria really turned my opinion on them around, and
Speaker 2: especially at this time of year. And it's the kind
Speaker 2: of thing that like, if you were to read a
Speaker 2: description or read the tag, if you're in the garden
Speaker 2: center and you hear oh fall, you know in spring,
Speaker 2: foliage emerges bright orange or bright red, You're just like, okay, yeah,
Speaker 2: that's cool. When you see these things in the landscape
Speaker 2: right now. They are glowing. It is almost like a bloom,
Speaker 2: a first bloom, because they are going to go on
Speaker 2: to flower. And so Spiria, I think are definitely one
Speaker 2: of those plants that there's more than meets the eye.
Speaker 2: People are initially attracted to that super toughty rounded look.
Speaker 2: They say, oh, you know what, I have a spyria.
Speaker 2: It looks great, grows round, I don't have to do anything.
Speaker 2: It's really pretty. When at flowers, I want more of that.
Speaker 2: And the thing is, there is so many more spirias,
Speaker 2: so you don't just have to settle for the same
Speaker 2: ones that you have. They also go together great exactly.
Speaker 1: So I think that that's a plant that fits the bill,
Speaker 1: one that I've really had to learn to like because
Speaker 1: I didn't really care much for it. Maybe you can
Speaker 1: sell me on it, Stacey. And that is inkberry holly
Speaker 1: or gembox. Yeah, and I'd kind of put that in
Speaker 1: the same description.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I would too. So this gembox inkberry holly is
Speaker 2: something that it's an evergreen. It is a native species
Speaker 2: I like sclabra. It's called inkberry holly because back in
Speaker 2: the Revolutionary War they actually did use the fruits to
Speaker 2: write letters to make it to write letters, and so
Speaker 2: it's found abundantly throughout the East Coast, which of course
Speaker 2: makes sense for the Revolutionary War. And so we actually
Speaker 2: sell these as a native alternative to boxwood, because not
Speaker 2: everyone wants to grow a boxwood. People have different, you know,
Speaker 2: reasons they may not like them. And this looks a
Speaker 2: lot like a boxwood, but it's a native species and
Speaker 2: it has white flowers in mid to late spring, which
Speaker 2: are actually quite attractive. But really the main thing that
Speaker 2: makes gembox different than other ink very hollies that are
Speaker 2: out there on the market is that it branches to
Speaker 2: the ground. So if you were to see inkbery holly
Speaker 2: in the wild, it gets kind of leggy, and that's
Speaker 2: just a term for when plants get tall but kind
Speaker 2: of bear at the base. And that's perfectly fine in
Speaker 2: the woods, but that's not what people want from these
Speaker 2: just right plants in their landscape. So this naturally grows
Speaker 2: with that nice tight boxwood type shape, but flowers and
Speaker 2: is amenable to pruning, and it's native, so it's kind
Speaker 2: of a cool and interesting plant. It is not the
Speaker 2: reason that I would maybe not quite say, I feel
Speaker 2: like an important part of the just right equation here,
Speaker 2: the Goldilocks equation is wide adaptability, and this is a
Speaker 2: plant that is not especially drought tolerant. I can tell
Speaker 2: you this because I have attempted to grow it and
Speaker 2: failed because again I don't really water. I'm willing to
Speaker 2: get some water at the beginning. But if you were
Speaker 2: to find this plant in the wild, it's growing in
Speaker 2: like almost swampy ok you know, deep woods area where
Speaker 2: the soil is pretty much always at least moist, if
Speaker 2: not wet. So just right definitely in terms of the
Speaker 2: way it looks, but not quite as adaptable as what
Speaker 2: I think a Goldilocks plant should. Because we're trying to,
Speaker 2: you know, pitch these plants to the people who are like, whoa,
Speaker 2: there's way too many plants out there. Just give me
Speaker 2: like five that I can go and look at, and
Speaker 2: I'll pick one.
Speaker 1: I knew you'd educate us on the on this plant,
Speaker 1: and thank you for doing that. Boxwood is a plant
Speaker 1: that I also would put in that category. We're going
Speaker 1: to go down a little of plants in segment four
Speaker 1: today that are Goldilocks just right plants, and maybe one
Speaker 1: or two of them would fit for you. When I
Speaker 1: look at spring bloomers to Stacey throughout the years looking
Speaker 1: at what has happened with flowering crab trees and how
Speaker 1: Lollipop and Showtime and other cultivars again have well basically
Speaker 1: been bred to be just right in size as opposed
Speaker 1: to overpowering.
Speaker 2: And you know, aside from the size themselves, I mean,
Speaker 2: you can't ever go wrong with a crab apple, you know,
Speaker 2: if you're looking for a small tree. You know, sometimes
Speaker 2: I say about plants, they're just ubiquitous, like everybody has them.
Speaker 2: They get a little boring. I don't know if it's
Speaker 2: possible to be tired of crab apples. They are just
Speaker 2: so entirely lovely. Honestly. If they have one drawback, it's
Speaker 2: the deer.
Speaker 1: I agree, I myself can become tired of boxwood. I
Speaker 1: have to be.
Speaker 2: Don't come to my garden then fuck again.
Speaker 1: That's from unloading hundreds.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, you know. I know you've got your own
Speaker 2: well earned prejudices about plants in the garden, and I
Speaker 2: will give you those happily excellent.
Speaker 1: Well, let me give you a nursery rhyme that I've written.
Speaker 1: A nursery rhyme lima a rick once upon a time,
Speaker 1: Rex the landscaper listed some plants pen to paper. This
Speaker 1: one too big, this one too slight. But this one here,
Speaker 1: I guess, is just right. I'm not gonna need shears
Speaker 1: to taper. But someone stole his lunch, ate, his bread,
Speaker 1: and had taken the tools from his shed. He stepped
Speaker 1: this very bad day on a rake lying in his
Speaker 1: pathway and fell into his planting bed. Along came his friend,
Speaker 1: Goldie Flocks. See what I did, Yes, I do, thank you.
Speaker 1: Together they had some good talks. She got them straightened out.
Speaker 1: A friendship they would sprout, he realized, Goldie Flos rocks.
Speaker 1: So they planted some plants in their prime that they
Speaker 1: knew would look good all the time. Not too big,
Speaker 1: not too small, they were just right above all. A
Speaker 1: happy end to this nursery rhyme.
Speaker 2: Oh that was lovely. That need some illustrations.
Speaker 1: Yeah, maybe I should start writing kids books.
Speaker 2: Yes, I think you got a good start.
Speaker 1: Well, just write plants. Let's see what Stacy has on
Speaker 1: her mind in Plants on Trial. That's coming up next
Speaker 1: here on the Gardening Simplified.
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Speaker 2: Choice Shrubs with over three hundred and twenty five unique
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Speaker 2: welcome back to the Gardening Simplified Show where we're talking
Speaker 2: goldilocks plants. It's right. They're not too small, they're not
Speaker 2: too big. They are just right. Now. This isn't to
Speaker 2: say that there's not a spot for small and very
Speaker 2: big plants. There are, Yeah, definitely. And I have the
Speaker 2: whole gamut from seedums that barely grow to an inch
Speaker 2: high in my garden all the way up to you know,
Speaker 2: silphium and the like, which get to be ten feet
Speaker 2: tall or more. I probably don't have in my art
Speaker 2: a lot of these so called just right plants I've got,
Speaker 2: but that doesn't mean that there's not a place for them.
Speaker 1: Yeah, but not everybody likes porridge either, that's true. I
Speaker 1: have porridge for breakfast every morning. At least I call
Speaker 1: it porridge. It's cooked oat brand with some blueberries.
Speaker 2: You know, I'm sound very happy about it.
Speaker 1: No, I'm not. I do it for my cholesterol.
Speaker 2: They're like, I have porridge very morning. Any hopefully it
Speaker 2: is at least just right doing something good for you.
Speaker 2: But yeah, so there's room for all of these plants.
Speaker 2: But I understand again there's so many choices out on
Speaker 2: the market that when it comes time for someone, especially
Speaker 2: if you know they are working on something in their landscape,
Speaker 2: they're replacing a plant. They're just looking to add a
Speaker 2: little bit more color. They're not looking for our list
Speaker 2: of all time favorite perennials or you know, all of
Speaker 2: this kind of stuff. They want just this nice, tidy
Speaker 2: short list of plants, and we're going to go over
Speaker 2: that more. And you know, that's really in many ways
Speaker 2: what we're all about here at Proven Winner's Color Choice Shrubs.
Speaker 2: We do have a lot of smaller kind of groundcovery shrubs,
Speaker 2: and we have some that are actually very very large
Speaker 2: ten feet or more. So we have something, but most
Speaker 2: of them really are in this kind of Goldilocks zone
Speaker 2: of roughly three to five feet tall and wide. And
Speaker 2: another really important fact part of the of the Goldilocks
Speaker 2: equation for me multiple seasons of interest. Yes, you know,
Speaker 2: a Goldilocks plant should not be a plant that just
Speaker 2: looks fabulous for you know, two weeks, and then the
Speaker 2: rest of the year you're just like whatever. You know.
Speaker 2: That's why I wouldn't give Forcythia, for example, a Goldilocks
Speaker 2: Plant award, because as fabulous as it is right about now,
Speaker 2: come on, what do you do in for me the
Speaker 2: rest of the year, you know you're not And it
Speaker 2: doesn't really have a lot of good forms. So we're
Speaker 2: looking for the kinds of things that we know appeal
Speaker 2: to people. These nice, tidy forms, useful three to five
Speaker 2: foot size, and I think that size is really important.
Speaker 2: And the reason that Rick and I I think have
Speaker 2: both kind of settled on this size is that the
Speaker 2: three to five foot range works so well with a house. Sure,
Speaker 2: it's like the exact right size if you have a
Speaker 2: one story, if you have a two story house, it's
Speaker 2: not going to overwhelm. It plays nicely with other plants.
Speaker 2: It just really works well for the way that we
Speaker 2: tend to live. So I had a huge list. I
Speaker 2: had to think long and hard about it, and I
Speaker 2: finally came up with today's plant on trial. It is
Speaker 2: wine and spirits. Why Geila, Oh, I can see why okay,
Speaker 2: so our listeners may potentially be familiar with wine and
Speaker 2: roses white Gela, which was actually one of the very
Speaker 2: first proven winner's color choy shrubs way way back in
Speaker 2: the nineteen nineties. They found it at a nursery in
Speaker 2: the Netherlands. And it's crazy to think now because these
Speaker 2: dark foliage with pink flower white gela have just become
Speaker 2: garden cannon, right. They're just people know them. They're so
Speaker 2: ubiquitous now that it's hard to imagine that there was
Speaker 2: a time where people saw wine and roses and went, oh,
Speaker 2: my gosh, what is that? And wine and spirits. I
Speaker 2: don't know if the answer is right there in the
Speaker 2: name or not, but wine and spirits is very much
Speaker 2: like wine and roses, except that instead of having the
Speaker 2: pink flowers, it has white flowers. That's where the spirits
Speaker 2: come from. And the foliage I think so on the
Speaker 2: wine and Roses and the wine and Roses family, because
Speaker 2: we have spilled wine, we have very fine wine. So
Speaker 2: you can get the wine and roses look in really
Speaker 2: any size from a small ground cover to a medium
Speaker 2: size to the full wine and roses which is about
Speaker 2: four to five foot, so all of those can be
Speaker 2: just right depending on your exact situation. But Wine in
Speaker 2: Spirits Whygela, it was developed right here in West Michigan
Speaker 2: and by Megan Mattia, our plant breeder. It is the foliage,
Speaker 2: you know, I think the Wine and Roses foliage is
Speaker 2: really it's got like a lot of kind of purply
Speaker 2: red in it, and Wine and Spirits is almost black,
Speaker 2: like it's got a deep purply black and it just
Speaker 2: contrasts so beautifully with the flowers. And come late spring,
Speaker 2: early summer, that's about Windhygela bloom just absolutely covered in
Speaker 2: these white flowers and the contrast is great. So the
Speaker 2: thing that makes this just right, besides the fact that
Speaker 2: it does indeed get to be three to five feet
Speaker 2: tall and wide, so we got the goldilocks size there,
Speaker 2: is that you're gonna love those flowers when they come out,
Speaker 2: and then even when the flowers finished, because this is
Speaker 2: not a reblooming Whitela. I did think about doing a
Speaker 2: sonic gloom reblooming Whygela instead, but I really felt like
Speaker 2: the foliage for me, made Wine and Roses a little
Speaker 2: bit more of a GOLDILOCKX plant because you're getting a
Speaker 2: lot more foliage interest out of it, you know, beyond
Speaker 2: the time that the whitejela are actually blooming, so that
Speaker 2: foliage will carry it through. And the other thing I
Speaker 2: really liked about this compared to some of our sonic blooms,
Speaker 2: which are beautiful. You know, if you were to see
Speaker 2: those in bloom in the garden center, you're going to
Speaker 2: see a lot of like crazy intense pink color. And
Speaker 2: the pink color is beautiful, but if you have a
Speaker 2: red brick house, you may not be such a fan
Speaker 2: of these bright pink whigelas. So I feel like wine
Speaker 2: and Spirits, is that one of those plants you don't
Speaker 2: have to worry you do? I have to think about, Wait,
Speaker 2: how is this going to look in front of my house?
Speaker 2: And if you like the look of bright pink with
Speaker 2: your red brick, by all means, go for it. I've
Speaker 2: got no judgment here whatsoever. But I did like how
Speaker 2: this has sort of that safer and more reliable color
Speaker 2: scheme that's literally going to look good no matter what
Speaker 2: color your house is.
Speaker 1: I'd call it elegance.
Speaker 2: It is elegant. It's got like a kind of yeah,
Speaker 2: formal wear kind of vibe like black. It is like
Speaker 2: a black tie. Yeah, And I think another really important
Speaker 2: thing about this, A lot of people are familiar with
Speaker 2: Why Jela. A lot of people love Whygela. They have
Speaker 2: a strong nostalgic connection to it, remembering it from you know,
Speaker 2: when they were kids at Grandma's And so I think,
Speaker 2: you know, if someone were just to be looking for
Speaker 2: a plant to add to their landscape or garden this year,
Speaker 2: and they might say, oh, I'd love Whyjela, but I'm
Speaker 2: not going to pick a Wigeela because they're just too
Speaker 2: big and you're living in the past there, Because Whyjela
Speaker 2: have come a long way since Grandma's time, and now
Speaker 2: they do have maybe not quite as neat and tidy
Speaker 2: as Spyria, but they definitely have more of these neat,
Speaker 2: rounded shapes.
Speaker 1: Absolutely.
Speaker 2: So it's really just a new kind of perspective and
Speaker 2: a new look for Whyjela that you can bring into
Speaker 2: the garden rather than just you know, the big ten
Speaker 2: foot by ten foot old fashioned Whigela that Gramma head.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and these cultivars like my mo own a Midnight
Speaker 1: Sun or the cultivar you're talking about today too, look
Speaker 1: fabulous in containers in the garden.
Speaker 2: Yeah, definitely, And this would be a great choice. For example,
Speaker 2: if you do find it, Yeah, it's gonna look amazing
Speaker 2: on the floor in the garden center. But it would
Speaker 2: also be fun to put in a decorative container in
Speaker 2: your house just for some foliage interest. And then you
Speaker 2: can always plant it at the end of the season
Speaker 2: and just put it straight away into the ground. So
Speaker 2: it's an interesting plant. You know. I did think I've
Speaker 2: already done Midnight Sun why Jila as a plant on trial,
Speaker 2: but that is also a strong contender for me for
Speaker 2: a goldilot's plant. I did it not that long ago,
Speaker 2: but this is a plant that you really have to
Speaker 2: see to believe. I don't want to take away from
Speaker 2: Wine and Spirits moment in the spotlight here, but I'll
Speaker 2: tell you I love that Midnight Sun why Jila, and
Speaker 2: we'll put a link to it. Adriana will throw some
Speaker 2: photos into the YouTube version so you can see that
Speaker 2: and make your own decision. Actually, they grow great to get,
Speaker 2: so you could definitely you don't have to doesn't have
Speaker 2: to be an either or another great thing about Whyjeila
Speaker 2: dear resistant quite dear resistant, so an important factor for
Speaker 2: many of us, not all of us, but even if
Speaker 2: deer are not an issue for you, yet they certainly
Speaker 2: could be coming down the line. You never know when
Speaker 2: suddenly it's going to be an issue. Now. Also a
Speaker 2: good heartiness zone range on wine and spirits by Jeila
Speaker 2: four to eight, So that's definitely covering the majority of
Speaker 2: North America, temperate North America where it can grow successfully
Speaker 2: without a problem. Again, it's three to five feet tall
Speaker 2: and wide. Now, this is a full sun plant. So
Speaker 2: some Whaijela. Rick was mentioning the Mimonai series, those are
Speaker 2: variegated with white and green foliage. Because of all of
Speaker 2: that white in their foliage, they are going to be
Speaker 2: more shade talerant overall. White Gela is a full sun
Speaker 2: plant with those couple of exceptions, but definitely for wine
Speaker 2: and spirits. If you want that best dark foliage color,
Speaker 2: if you want the most flowers on the plan, it's
Speaker 2: going to be very important that you give it at
Speaker 2: least six hours of bright sun every day and it's
Speaker 2: gonna bloom probably late spring early summer. I kind of
Speaker 2: think of why Gila as like the transitional flowering shrub
Speaker 2: that goes that brings you kind of from spring to
Speaker 2: early summer because into.
Speaker 1: The month of June. It feels like June to me.
Speaker 2: It kind of has like spring vibes going into summer,
Speaker 2: so it's kind of a fun transitional plant. Like I said,
Speaker 2: this particular one does not rebloom, but I think that
Speaker 2: the foliage more than makes up for it. And it's
Speaker 2: a great plant for a hedge if you need a
Speaker 2: kind of hedge or you're doing a grouping of plants.
Speaker 2: It is a fine specimen plant if you only need
Speaker 2: to plant one. Its shape really lends itself to all
Speaker 2: sorts of different applications in the landscape as well as
Speaker 2: in the garden, because I think this is the kind
Speaker 2: of plant that is actually very worthy of a flower garden.
Speaker 2: If you have a flower garden, I.
Speaker 1: Think there's no question in my mind this is a
Speaker 1: Goldie locks just right plant.
Speaker 2: Well, I'm glad truly, and you can decide for yourself,
Speaker 2: because that's what Plants on Trial is all about. To
Speaker 2: check us out on YouTube, you can see all the
Speaker 2: pictures there, or of course go to proven Winner's Color
Speaker 2: Choice dot com and you can learn even more about
Speaker 2: it there, and it will be in your local garden
Speaker 2: center this spring if you want to see it in person.
Speaker 2: We're gonna take a little break. When you come back,
Speaker 2: we're opening up the garden mail leg so please stay tuned.
Speaker 2: At Proven Winner's Color Choice Shrubs, we know that a
Speaker 2: better landscape starts with a better shrub. Our team of
Speaker 2: experts tests and evaluates all of our flowering shrubs in
Speaker 2: evergreens for eight to ten years to ensure they outperform
Speaker 2: what's already on the market. For easycare, reliable, beautiful shrubs
Speaker 2: to accentuate your home and express your personal style, look
Speaker 2: for Proven Winner's Shrubs in the distinctive white container at
Speaker 2: your local garden center, or learn more at proven Winner's
Speaker 2: Color Choice dot com. Greetings gardening friends, and welcome back
Speaker 2: to the Gardening Simplified Show, where spring is in full
Speaker 2: swing here in Michigan at least. I know some of
Speaker 2: our listeners in warmer climbs are like spring, it's practically
Speaker 2: summer over here.
Speaker 1: Yeah, you know, you talk about wine and spirits. Uh
Speaker 1: with Gilla, I'm gonna stop whining about winter and the weather.
Speaker 1: It's spring is here.
Speaker 2: Spring is here. But you know, I don't want to
Speaker 2: complain about the weather. But I mean, this is gardening,
Speaker 2: so we have to say a little something. I just
Speaker 2: you know, I feel like we have yet to have
Speaker 2: one of those days where you're like, this is a
Speaker 2: nice day. You know, it's definitely the weather's been improving.
Speaker 2: It's certainly nice enough to be outside and working. But
Speaker 2: I feel like usually by now we've had at least
Speaker 2: one of those days where you're just like, it's spring
Speaker 2: and I am so glad to be alive. I mean,
Speaker 2: it's spring and I am glad to be alive. But
Speaker 2: you know, I just don't have that like buoyant feeling
Speaker 2: just yet, just yet. I'm whold out. They'll they'll still
Speaker 2: come on, but I feel like normally we'd have one
Speaker 2: by now.
Speaker 1: Shorts weather short.
Speaker 2: They definitely have not had any shorts weather yet, at
Speaker 2: least here in West Michigan. So we actually last week
Speaker 2: talked about native ours, a rather controversial topic, and got
Speaker 2: a little bit of feedback from people who maybe had
Speaker 2: a little bit of a negative reaction to that, which
Speaker 2: is to be expected anytime we dive into a controversial topic,
Speaker 2: a very emotionally fraught topic like native plants and native ours.
Speaker 2: But one listener, Barbara wrot Us, and I wanted to
Speaker 2: read her comment. She says it was refreshing to listen
Speaker 2: to the Native Oars episode this week. I love the
Speaker 2: idea of a campaign to elevate how important insects are
Speaker 2: to our gardens. Since people love birds, it could start
Speaker 2: with how and why birds need these insects and insects
Speaker 2: need host plants, shrubs and treats. My interest in having
Speaker 2: a more native and native ours in my garden happened
Speaker 2: when I learned about how chickadees only feeds as babies
Speaker 2: caterpillars and needs six thousand to nine thousand caterpillars to
Speaker 2: feed the clutch.
Speaker 1: Wow.
Speaker 2: Maybe the campaign could be about birds or caterpillars for chickadees.
Speaker 2: I love that And I love that too because you know,
Speaker 2: I said this last week when you were talking about eight overs.
Speaker 2: I garden for insects because I love insects and seeing
Speaker 2: a variety of insects in my garden is what I
Speaker 2: like the most. Yeah. Sure, I love all the flowers
Speaker 2: and the color and the texture and all of that
Speaker 2: is great. But to me, like where I get really
Speaker 2: excited is if I can go out to a plant
Speaker 2: and it is just covered in like ten different types
Speaker 2: of insects. Like that is what gets me going, and
Speaker 2: that is why when a wren chose my yard to
Speaker 2: build a nest into my stoveall woodworking nesting box, I
Speaker 2: mean I literally cried because it meant so much to
Speaker 2: me that and wrens are also insectivorous like a chickadee,
Speaker 2: that there was enough in my yard to feed them.
Speaker 1: So yeah, and Stacey for me working in the backyard
Speaker 1: this past week recognizing that the various woodpeckers that I
Speaker 1: love to watch have moved on from the suet cakes
Speaker 1: that I would hang out for them in winter to
Speaker 1: the trees and they obviously are busy searching for insects.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's a great thing to see. So thank you
Speaker 2: for your comment. A Barbara, and we had a question
Speaker 2: also related to last week's episode about something that was mentioned.
Speaker 2: This is from Judy in Manitoba, Canada, USDA Zone three.
Speaker 2: She has an ice ballet Asclepius, which is one of
Speaker 2: the plants that Mike Connor talks about. It as a
Speaker 2: white milkweed in my perennial garden and it's the only
Speaker 2: plant that becomes infested with aphids because it is a
Speaker 2: host for monarch caterpillars. How do I deal with the aphids.
Speaker 2: Just using a strong jet of water doesn't take care
Speaker 2: of them for long. I've tried a spray of soapy water.
Speaker 2: Still nothing. What can I use to deal with the
Speaker 2: aphids without harming any stage of the monarch life cycle?
Speaker 1: Well, I have the answer, But why don't you go ahead.
Speaker 2: And find the answer. We should hear it from you.
Speaker 1: Well again, coming from the garden center industry, would I
Speaker 1: use something you know you'll you'll read on the internet
Speaker 1: people will recommend using name. I would not use name.
Speaker 1: It's going to affect them, definitely, not exactly even spino set,
Speaker 1: but insecticidal soap so in this case, uh Judy mentions
Speaker 1: some soapy water. But insecticidal soaps are potassium salts of
Speaker 1: fatty acids, and the way they work is their contact insecticides.
Speaker 1: So essentially they're able to penetrate the waxy coating of
Speaker 1: the outer shell of an aphid. It does not have
Speaker 1: residual on the plant. It is a contact control that
Speaker 1: affects the outer body of those aphids. So I would
Speaker 1: strongly encourage getting an insecticidal soap that's labeled for that
Speaker 1: per is considered trying it.
Speaker 2: That's that's interesting. Idea. I was also going to potentially
Speaker 2: suggest ladybugs. And you know the thing is, when if
Speaker 2: you are going to release ladybugs, you darn well better
Speaker 2: have a good aphin population for them to start eating
Speaker 2: when they come out of that bag. Otherwise they're all
Speaker 2: just going to move away because there's nothing for them
Speaker 2: to eat. So really, when you have a super intense
Speaker 2: aphed infestation like this, that would be the perfect opportunity
Speaker 2: to release those ladybugs. And yes, it's absolutely true that
Speaker 2: their larva, they're younger stage, eat far more insects, far
Speaker 2: more aphids than the ladybugs themselves do the adults. But
Speaker 2: they'll still, you know, you'll start to establish that population
Speaker 2: in your garden and they'll do a number on it.
Speaker 2: And that's why I would recommend ladybugs over something like
Speaker 2: praying mantis or something like that, because the praying mantis
Speaker 2: will potentially eat the monarch larva if they're able to
Speaker 2: get that, So I feel like that's one that will
Speaker 2: take care of your issue. I would also say, you know,
Speaker 2: as far as this the soap, as far as regular
Speaker 2: water goes, I have found when you need to do
Speaker 2: that for aphids, you kind of this is gross. Sorry,
Speaker 2: but you kind of got to rub them with your
Speaker 2: hands and squish them all around. Just knocking them off
Speaker 2: the plant isn't enough because aphids are essentially perpetually reproducing.
Speaker 2: Aphids can actually be borne pregnant with the next crop
Speaker 2: already ready to go and hatch out on your plant.
Speaker 2: So even if you you know, just do this so
Speaker 2: the water thing, there's still babies on there that you
Speaker 2: haven't gotten. So I find you got to really kind
Speaker 2: of rub at them. It's not for the faint of heart,
Speaker 2: but it does work.
Speaker 1: And that's why I like the contact control of insecticidal soap.
Speaker 1: Now that said, don't use it if the butterflies are active, Yeah,
Speaker 1: but they're not yet. If they're not yet active and
Speaker 1: you have the aphids, I think it's an alternative.
Speaker 2: Yeah, definitely, definitely.
Speaker 1: Heidi's writing to us, we experience the higher than usual
Speaker 1: amount of deer damage in our garden this winter. Welcome
Speaker 1: to the party, Heidi. That's not in here. I'm just
Speaker 1: saying that because munching on our roses and hygd ranges
Speaker 1: was to be expected, munching our hugh curas to within
Speaker 1: an inch of their lives has also happened before, however, Yucca,
Speaker 1: that couldn't have been a pleasant experience. But as you
Speaker 1: can see in the picture that Heidi sent, they were persistent.
Speaker 1: Now we're faced with the problem of trying to get
Speaker 1: them looking decent again. They're actually not a favorite, but
Speaker 1: they add so much winter interest. I agree, Heidi. I
Speaker 1: have them in my landscape that we'd hate to lose them.
Speaker 1: Any suggestions on how to rejuvenate. Were located in southeastern
Speaker 1: British Columbia, Canada, Zone six B. Heidi, I am in
Speaker 1: the exact same zone that you are here on the
Speaker 1: lake shore of Lake Michigan here in West Michigan A
Speaker 1: six B. I have my yuccas in front, and yes,
Speaker 1: this winter it was a long winter and the deer
Speaker 1: destroyed my yukkas. I mean, the foliage is so fibrous
Speaker 1: it cannot taste good. It cannot. But they were hungry
Speaker 1: enough where they destroyed them. I've had this happen before.
Speaker 1: Your plants, if well established, are going to bounce back.
Speaker 2: Yeah. So what you're going to see, if you're joining
Speaker 2: us on YouTube to see the pictures of what Heidi
Speaker 2: is seeing, is they haven't damaged the yucca like they
Speaker 2: would a hydrange or hegro where they munched the whole
Speaker 2: thing down. No, what they've done is just munched the
Speaker 2: leaf tipsy. So yeah, torn at it. So the really
Speaker 2: important thing about a yucca that makes them look so
Speaker 2: good in our landscapes is that they are very spear like,
Speaker 2: that they have that very sharp point, and that's what
Speaker 2: gives them all of that great architectural presence in the garden.
Speaker 2: And now they just look like they've had a really
Speaker 2: bad haircut. The bad news, I guess, is that that
Speaker 2: foliage will never go back, that will not suddenly develop
Speaker 2: a new point. So what you're gonna have to do
Speaker 2: if you don't want that foliage around is just cut
Speaker 2: it off at the base. Now, that's Yuka are tough
Speaker 2: as nails. I mean, I don't know if we mentioned
Speaker 2: that in our plants you can't kill episode, but we
Speaker 2: probably should have because you cannot kill a yuka. I
Speaker 2: mean you pretty much sort of like flooding it out
Speaker 2: for like days on end. You are not going to
Speaker 2: be able to kill a yucca. So I would recommend
Speaker 2: that you get your pruners out, or maybe you can
Speaker 2: even tear them. Maybe that will be easier. And cut
Speaker 2: those damaged leaves off at the base. You may find
Speaker 2: that you are left with very little at the end
Speaker 2: of that process, but no big deal. It will be
Speaker 2: just fine and it will absolutely come back. Yuccas have
Speaker 2: a huge storage root that keeps all of that energy
Speaker 2: for them to you know, be able to revive, so
Speaker 2: there's really nothing that is going to set it back
Speaker 2: that bad. And in fact, you know, one of the
Speaker 2: things that I do this is kind of maybe sound
Speaker 2: a little bit crazy, but I actually when I want
Speaker 2: to control yuka, I will actually just take a sh
Speaker 2: sharp spade and plunge it in the ground and cut
Speaker 2: off the top of my yuca and that will kind
Speaker 2: of knock it back to a smaller one, but it
Speaker 2: will come out. You know, by the end of the season,
Speaker 2: you'll have a new plantlet to replace that one, and
Speaker 2: then that can That can be a way to do
Speaker 2: that too. That's a way that I manage them so
Speaker 2: I don't have to dig them up and disrupt the garden.
Speaker 2: But I also they don't get too big and start
Speaker 2: shading out their neighbors.
Speaker 1: The approach I take is I just let nature take
Speaker 1: its course and they recover from it and part of
Speaker 1: the reason I do that is because they're so shredded
Speaker 1: right now. I want the deer to feel guilty when
Speaker 1: they walk by. It's like, what have you done?
Speaker 2: All right, well, let me know if you get a
Speaker 2: picture of that. I'd like to see the guilty look
Speaker 2: on their faces. All right, We're going to take a
Speaker 2: little break. When we come back, we're going to continue
Speaker 2: our conversation about Goldilock's plants, so please stay tuned. Thanks
Speaker 2: for listening to the Gardening Simplified Podcast, brought to you
Speaker 2: by Proven Winners Color Choice Shrubs. Our award winning flow
Speaker 2: orange shrubs and evergreens are trialed and tested by experts
Speaker 2: with your success in mind. Learn more at Proven winnerscolor
Speaker 2: Choice dot com.
Speaker 1: Welcome back to the Gardening Simplified Show. Today for branching news,
Speaker 1: we'll go down the list of plants that are Goldilocks
Speaker 1: plants just right, not too big, not too small, and
Speaker 1: would like to share some of those with you. Stacey,
Speaker 1: I wanted to mention right off the top was reading
Speaker 1: a perennial plant survey. A recent survey said Echinasia, Salvia,
Speaker 1: and Hosta are the top three favorite perennials among respondents.
Speaker 1: Does that surprise you not in the least. Yeah, same here.
Speaker 1: And of course when you talk about just right, hostas
Speaker 1: have to be on the list. There are so many
Speaker 1: different cultivars they fill a space. Hostas really seem in
Speaker 1: my mind to fill that role, especially in shade of
Speaker 1: being that just right size.
Speaker 2: Especially if you don't have to hear, especially if you don't.
Speaker 2: But yeah, yeah, they I mean, hostas are such a
Speaker 2: go to plant because very much like you were talking
Speaker 2: about with boxwood or the gem box ink, very holly,
Speaker 2: they're just always at home. You know, you never really
Speaker 2: have to worry about a hosta looking too garish or
Speaker 2: you know, two out of place. That's just like they're
Speaker 2: kind of a can't fail plant that just always looks good. Yeah.
Speaker 1: I was online doing some reading and I saw an
Speaker 1: article the eleven perennial plants that you should not plant,
Speaker 1: and I'm like, hmm, this looks interesting, so I open
Speaker 1: it up. The first plant recommended not to plant was kudzu,
Speaker 1: and I'm like, does anybody really buy kudzu?
Speaker 2: Can you even buy c can you even buy it?
Speaker 2: But you know what, people will find it and they'll say, oh,
Speaker 2: the flowers are so pretty and then they'll dig it
Speaker 2: up from the woods or whatever and bring it home,
Speaker 2: and probably is worth mentioning that you should not do that,
Speaker 2: because no, you won't find it at garden centers.
Speaker 1: All right, Well, let's run through the list with some
Speaker 1: editorial comment to give you an idea of some of
Speaker 1: these types of plants. Stacey, you know, I love ornamental grasses,
Speaker 1: but for some people they're just too big, too much maintenance,
Speaker 1: too much work. I recommend you plant annual grasses like
Speaker 1: the Cultivars skyrocket, beautiful, just the right size, not too big,
Speaker 1: not too small. Another one would be a pennacetum lemon squeeze.
Speaker 1: Nice controlled shape in that ornamental grass and looks beautiful
Speaker 1: again when combined with blue flowers like cats me on
Speaker 1: the peta, which is the landscape plant of the year,
Speaker 1: because again controlled size doesn't get out of control.
Speaker 2: But I think one ornamental grass that I would recommend
Speaker 2: for people who are maybe not so fond of it
Speaker 2: or worried about the work h Kana kloa Japanese forest grass,
Speaker 2: very low main I agree, Yeah, that's one that you know,
Speaker 2: it doesn't have a lot of the liabilities of other
Speaker 2: ornamental grasses. Always beautiful. It's just it's so soft looking,
Speaker 2: and I've tried to grow it, but it needs a
Speaker 2: lot more water than I'm willing to give it to
Speaker 2: get established. But once you have a nice patch of
Speaker 2: that o hard to beat.
Speaker 1: That plant fits the criteria perfectly. You're right, people love sunflowers.
Speaker 1: Take a look at sun Credible. The annual yellow sunflower
Speaker 1: stays nice and short, big flowers, gorgeous. I think that
Speaker 1: fills the bill. Tuscan sun a perennial sunflower Heliopsis that's
Speaker 1: on the list. And then Stacy again, being an old school,
Speaker 1: old school garden center guy, it still never ceases to
Speaker 1: amaze me the advancement in plants like old fashioned plants
Speaker 1: like lilacs or mock orange, the cultivars today, how they
Speaker 1: fill the bill, so to speak, of being a just
Speaker 1: right plant.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and you know, also having that multiple seasons of interest.
Speaker 2: You know, not only are the flowers fabulous, but the
Speaker 2: fragrance is so so amazing. And then if you have
Speaker 2: something like our a new Illuminati sparks variegated one, you're
Speaker 2: also getting a lot more foliage interest through the rest
Speaker 2: of the season.
Speaker 1: Love that plant. High ranges of course, tiny tough stuff.
Speaker 1: We bit grumpy. We've talked about that on the show before.
Speaker 1: Firelight Tidbit would be another one. And I even throw
Speaker 1: into the mix the cascading hydranges only because again they
Speaker 1: you know, they're they're not going to get really really
Speaker 1: large and you can kind of let them flow where
Speaker 1: they want to go. For me, I consider that a
Speaker 1: plant that is just right poll petit rosa Sharon tater
Speaker 1: tot arborvitie and then with annuals I love and not
Speaker 1: because it's our subject today, but Goldilocks rocks.
Speaker 2: Biden Biden's is a good plan.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, and I think.
Speaker 2: You're for you know, I like too, So that's if
Speaker 2: you're not familiar with us. It's kind of a yellow
Speaker 2: daisy like flower and a lot of people love that
Speaker 2: look of those you know, cheerful so it kind of
Speaker 2: goes along with the sun credible sunflower. You can definitely
Speaker 2: have like those cheerful flowers. They make great cut flowers
Speaker 2: all summer long.
Speaker 1: Many Vista supertunias, and I'm saying the mini vista supertunias
Speaker 1: love that plant. Many different varieties or colors available to you.
Speaker 1: Baby tut umbrella grasses Cyparis love that because when I've
Speaker 1: grown the standard ones, they've kind of exploded out of
Speaker 1: the pot and that way.
Speaker 2: Yeah, they definitely can. And you know, if you live
Speaker 2: in an area with a lot of wind, some of
Speaker 2: the really tall ones, if you have a bad storm,
Speaker 2: can definitely suffer some damage, where if you've got these smaller,
Speaker 2: more compact ones, you don't have to worry about it.
Speaker 1: Absolutely. Of course, bud Lea, We've talked about bud Lea before,
Speaker 1: but Pugster or lo and behold again, it's going to
Speaker 1: fit this Goldie loox just right category.
Speaker 2: Oh wait, I want to go back to the Cyparis
Speaker 2: the beta tet for a second, because I just realized
Speaker 2: if you are looking for a plant to put into
Speaker 2: a fabulous ceramic container that has no drainage, these are
Speaker 2: a great choice. You know a lot of times people
Speaker 2: will do that as a gift. They'll not think about it.
Speaker 2: A lot of those ceramic containers without drainage are intended
Speaker 2: to be a cash po where you put something else
Speaker 2: inside it and then lift it out to water it.
Speaker 2: And you're just stuck with this. You're like, I'm not
Speaker 2: going to rest drill in this thing because I could
Speaker 2: break the whole thing. These cyprus or papyrus are a
Speaker 2: perfect choice. They will grow absolutely with no drainage and
Speaker 2: do really really well.
Speaker 1: So something to considered and a real thriller in the
Speaker 1: center of the container. Question about it, father, gia or
Speaker 1: gilla however you want to pronounce it, and we've talked
Speaker 1: about that before. A favorite of mine. I would classify
Speaker 1: it as a just right in size plant. Boxwood, Like
Speaker 1: I mentioned, why all the boxwoods, But I guess people
Speaker 1: like boxwoods and of course would sprinter. You get the
Speaker 1: deer resistance.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean that's an important part of boxwood. But
Speaker 2: I will say for myself, I have a lot of
Speaker 2: boxwood in my yard and it's partly from deer resistance
Speaker 2: because of the deer. But honestly, for me, why all
Speaker 2: the boxwoods is because they I use them for structure
Speaker 2: in my garden. So I am not one of those
Speaker 2: tidy gardeners that the plants can't touch and everything is
Speaker 2: sitting in its own little unique toughet. My garden is
Speaker 2: like a jungle, and that's the way I like it.
Speaker 2: I like everything knitted together. I like everything competing and riotous. Yeah,
Speaker 2: I like it like that. But the nice thing is
Speaker 2: by imposing structure with the boxwood, I can get away
Speaker 2: with all of that. My yard doesn't look quite so chaotic.
Speaker 2: When I impose the structure, it's like quite so chiatic.
Speaker 2: There's still some chaos, you know. When you impose the
Speaker 2: structure with a boxwood, it lets you get away with
Speaker 2: a whole lot more sure. And the great thing too,
Speaker 2: boxwood is both sun and shade tolerant. So I have
Speaker 2: my half of my front yard which is shady, and
Speaker 2: half of my front yard which is sunny, and I
Speaker 2: can have boxwood on both sides and they're still going
Speaker 2: to do equally well. So it's a nice way to
Speaker 2: kind of bring some cohesion throughout my entire yard on
Speaker 2: a plant that yeah, goldilocks, because it just always looks good.
Speaker 2: I mean almost always.
Speaker 1: I'm glad you mentioned that and use the word cohesion
Speaker 1: because that's what these plants do. They kind of pull
Speaker 1: everything together. We talked about four ground background. If they're
Speaker 1: repeated throughout the landscape, they help provide some of that cohesion.
Speaker 1: So that's really great. Hugh. Kuras are another plant that
Speaker 1: I would put in this classification. See hack and a
Speaker 1: cloa love that exactly. The new asters that are available today,
Speaker 1: I mean asters to me, just say fall. I love
Speaker 1: that feels like New England Fall. Love Asters. But the
Speaker 1: new varieties, the Crush series, they just stay more controlled
Speaker 1: in size and if you love fall in the color
Speaker 1: that comes with fall. Some of these new cultivars of asters,
Speaker 1: I recommend you try growing.
Speaker 2: Yeah, great choices. I love them.
Speaker 1: Color Blaze, Colius Gerbera, Daisies, meteor shower, Verbina. Here's a
Speaker 1: plant that's nice and controlled. It's been bred that way.
Speaker 1: It's now pretty much sterile. That's a great plant. Lantana
Speaker 1: is another annual that I would throw in. You know,
Speaker 1: if you're living in California, I could grow to the
Speaker 1: size of a shrub. But here in the North, in
Speaker 1: the Midwest, well, our winters and our weather pretty much
Speaker 1: keeping keeps that plant in small. You mentioned the seedums,
Speaker 1: rock and low rock and grow rock and round all
Speaker 1: great plants. Jack Frost, heart leaf, Brunner Brunera. Love that
Speaker 1: plant too. So there's a real role for these plants
Speaker 1: in the landscape. We're gonna call them goldilocks plants, you
Speaker 1: call them whatever you want. But Stacy, the fact that
Speaker 1: they're just right really fills an important foundation in the
Speaker 1: structure of the landscape.
Speaker 2: Absolutely, and you know, at the bottom line the end
Speaker 2: of the day, what matters is that you like the plan.
Speaker 2: That's what makes the plant just right. And so even
Speaker 2: though we've kind of given you these parameters, you know,
Speaker 2: this spring, as you head out to the garden center,
Speaker 2: give yourself time to just walk around and see what
Speaker 2: catches your attention, because the plant that's just right is
Speaker 2: the one that you actually like.
Speaker 1: It's true, and I'll have porridge again tomorrow morning. Thanks
Speaker 1: for tuning in the Gardening Simplified Show. Thank you Stacey,
Speaker 1: thank you Rick, thank you Adriana, Thanks to you. Thanks
Speaker 1: for watching on YouTube, listening to our radio show, and
Speaker 1: listening to the podcast. Have yourself a great week.