1 00:00:05,080 --> 00:00:08,439 Speaker 1: What is up, fella, Siko's I am Dana Valley coming 2 00:00:08,480 --> 00:00:11,039 at you with what I think is the first NBA 3 00:00:11,119 --> 00:00:13,519 trade deadline primer from us that you will be listening 4 00:00:13,640 --> 00:00:17,519 or watching to, not including the Hawks, Washington Wizards, Trey 5 00:00:17,600 --> 00:00:20,519 Young trade reaction. We got up. We're on too. We're 6 00:00:20,559 --> 00:00:23,239 beginning with the Denver Nuggets. However, whatever order this is 7 00:00:23,239 --> 00:00:26,480 releasing in, Before we get started, I'd like to ask 8 00:00:26,519 --> 00:00:28,960 my certified fantabulous co host, mister Grant Hughes, how the 9 00:00:29,000 --> 00:00:29,440 heck are you? 10 00:00:30,039 --> 00:00:32,200 Speaker 2: I am more flexible than the Denver Nuggets will be 11 00:00:32,200 --> 00:00:34,600 at the trade deadline Dan, So that's not saying much, 12 00:00:34,799 --> 00:00:38,719 but so I guess that's good. Could be worse, Like 13 00:00:38,880 --> 00:00:40,679 maybe put it that way, could. 14 00:00:40,479 --> 00:00:42,640 Speaker 1: Be worse is always a nice thing to hear. Let's 15 00:00:42,679 --> 00:00:45,560 get into the Denver Nuggets' is trade deadline vitals? Would 16 00:00:45,560 --> 00:00:46,600 you like to take us through something? 17 00:00:46,600 --> 00:00:50,399 Speaker 2: Police? Certainly, they are about four hundred grand over the tax, 18 00:00:50,880 --> 00:00:54,679 so they can take back more money than they send out. However, 19 00:00:54,759 --> 00:00:57,000 they do not have any first round picks to trade. 20 00:00:57,799 --> 00:01:01,479 They can swap this year first rounder their twenty twenty 21 00:01:01,479 --> 00:01:04,599 six first rounder. Your mileage you may vary on that 22 00:01:04,640 --> 00:01:07,159 one as Denver, well, maybe it's a little more valuable 23 00:01:07,159 --> 00:01:09,799 now since all the injuries will result in their record 24 00:01:09,840 --> 00:01:13,359 being worse regular season wise, So that's not nothing. It's 25 00:01:13,400 --> 00:01:17,920 also not something spectacular. They can offer conditional swaps in 26 00:01:17,959 --> 00:01:21,319 twenty eight, thirty and thirty one. They have a couple 27 00:01:21,519 --> 00:01:24,920 trade exceptions worth at least putting on the radar six 28 00:01:25,000 --> 00:01:27,359 point nine million from the Michael Porter junior deal that 29 00:01:27,400 --> 00:01:30,480 expires in July and five point four million from the 30 00:01:30,519 --> 00:01:34,680 Dario Sarich trade that expired July as well. Yeah, I 31 00:01:34,680 --> 00:01:39,159 mean to have anything to show for just really impressive work. 32 00:01:40,480 --> 00:01:43,640 So Dan, that's That's the long and short of a 33 00:01:44,040 --> 00:01:50,359 Denver situation that is inflexible because they've been contending for 34 00:01:50,400 --> 00:01:52,640 a long time and because they've been willing to move 35 00:01:52,920 --> 00:01:58,000 distant future picks like the MPJ deal would be an 36 00:01:58,040 --> 00:02:01,719 example of. So not a lot to get through here 37 00:02:01,799 --> 00:02:04,319 other than maybe starting here, the first thing to talk 38 00:02:04,359 --> 00:02:07,760 about is their tax situation, because they're so close to 39 00:02:07,799 --> 00:02:11,759 getting under They're so close, except it's not that easy. 40 00:02:12,840 --> 00:02:15,280 If your concern is like, we would like to have 41 00:02:15,319 --> 00:02:18,240 the best team possible once everybody's healthy and we try 42 00:02:18,280 --> 00:02:20,439 to go on or run through the West, so like 43 00:02:20,479 --> 00:02:23,639 a full salary dump like you might otherwise see in 44 00:02:23,639 --> 00:02:27,919 the situation. Uh, not really in the cards. Most likely 45 00:02:27,960 --> 00:02:29,360 it would be disappointing if that's the way. 46 00:02:30,240 --> 00:02:31,599 Speaker 1: Isn't getting traded straight up? 47 00:02:31,759 --> 00:02:33,879 Speaker 2: That doesn't get you a first He had a game 48 00:02:33,919 --> 00:02:35,800 the other day as we're recording this. 49 00:02:35,960 --> 00:02:38,280 Speaker 1: I mean, like you got to strike while the iron's hot. 50 00:02:38,479 --> 00:02:40,840 Speaker 2: See if you can do anything there. Do you think that? 51 00:02:40,879 --> 00:02:42,879 I mean, the answer seems pretty obvious, like do you 52 00:02:42,919 --> 00:02:45,000 think they'll try to duckt the tax from four hundred 53 00:02:45,039 --> 00:02:45,599 grand above it? 54 00:02:46,120 --> 00:02:48,280 Speaker 1: Yes, but I do think we need to clarify why 55 00:02:48,319 --> 00:02:50,840 they're actually gonna duckt the tax. It doesn't and if 56 00:02:50,879 --> 00:02:53,159 we've said it, we were mistaken. I don't think we did. 57 00:02:53,280 --> 00:02:57,960 It's not to reset the repeater clock. It's because they're 58 00:02:58,039 --> 00:03:01,000 basically in the second Aprin next year. Like it's just 59 00:03:01,080 --> 00:03:04,159 guaranteed unless there's some major changes, even if you don't 60 00:03:04,159 --> 00:03:07,840 have yonas valent If you're keeping yonas Valentunis and or 61 00:03:07,879 --> 00:03:10,199 Peyton Watson, who's about to come up as well in 62 00:03:10,240 --> 00:03:13,080 the next season, you are almost assuredly a second Apron team. 63 00:03:13,639 --> 00:03:18,560 Speaker 2: And by the way, Peyton Watson looking increasingly like, oh no, expensive, 64 00:03:18,960 --> 00:03:22,680 that's right, expensive, increasingly like maybe he should have been 65 00:03:22,719 --> 00:03:25,120 the guy to get paid instead of Christian Brown. A 66 00:03:25,120 --> 00:03:26,240 lot of oopsie is happening. 67 00:03:26,479 --> 00:03:30,400 Speaker 1: Christian Brown recording this on Friday is probable for Friday's game, 68 00:03:30,439 --> 00:03:33,919 though he's coming back. He's coming back to show Peyton Watson. 69 00:03:33,680 --> 00:03:35,599 Speaker 2: Not his work cut out for him, if he's gonna 70 00:03:35,879 --> 00:03:38,680 eclipse what people have been seeing from Peyton Watson lately. 71 00:03:39,240 --> 00:03:41,639 Speaker 1: But the reason you ducked the tax if you're Denver, 72 00:03:42,520 --> 00:03:44,639 is yes, they have proven they will pay the tax. 73 00:03:44,719 --> 00:03:47,560 They've proven they will pay their own players. You duck 74 00:03:47,639 --> 00:03:50,080 the tax now because one, you're just so fucking close, 75 00:03:50,439 --> 00:03:53,439 but also you then get the revenue from the other 76 00:03:53,520 --> 00:03:55,560 teams that are paying into the tax. And if you're 77 00:03:56,080 --> 00:03:58,840 the cronkeys and you're just looking at this from a 78 00:03:58,879 --> 00:04:01,960 business perspective, you're about to go into the second apron 79 00:04:02,120 --> 00:04:06,879 and just pay gobs of tax next year, you want 80 00:04:06,919 --> 00:04:09,120 to get some revenue this year while you can it's 81 00:04:09,120 --> 00:04:11,319 feasible to get it this year. And so that's why 82 00:04:11,840 --> 00:04:15,199 I'd be fairly surprised if they don't duck the tax now. 83 00:04:15,560 --> 00:04:17,720 The scale at which they do it will be as 84 00:04:17,759 --> 00:04:20,160 part of a larger move or is it something you know? 85 00:04:20,160 --> 00:04:22,439 Are they so desperate that if you can't find someone 86 00:04:22,480 --> 00:04:25,920 to take on hunter Tyson alone, that you would attach 87 00:04:25,959 --> 00:04:28,879 a second round pick to him, like you're only is 88 00:04:28,920 --> 00:04:30,560 it their only second round pick? They could trade the 89 00:04:30,560 --> 00:04:34,240 twenty thirty two second round pick is I wouldn't put 90 00:04:34,279 --> 00:04:37,399 it past them because I think that's how Again, financially, 91 00:04:37,439 --> 00:04:40,759 speaking from an asset perspective, No, that's not the right 92 00:04:40,759 --> 00:04:45,040 thing to do. But because you are, like you're gonna 93 00:04:45,040 --> 00:04:47,399 be a repeater payer next year, you want to get 94 00:04:47,399 --> 00:04:49,279 the revenue this season while you can, And I think 95 00:04:49,319 --> 00:04:51,759 that's that's what we need to understand about their text. 96 00:04:51,800 --> 00:04:53,480 Is that no, just because they're out of the tax 97 00:04:53,519 --> 00:04:55,120 this year. No, they're not all of a sudden restarting 98 00:04:55,120 --> 00:04:57,879 the repeater clock. They need to do it for two seasons. 99 00:04:57,480 --> 00:05:00,560 Speaker 2: Right, Yeah, No, I think I don't know my reaction 100 00:05:00,600 --> 00:05:02,720 whenever I see we've had a couple of these. Actually 101 00:05:02,720 --> 00:05:05,800 we've spoiler. We've recorded other teams before you're hearing this, 102 00:05:05,920 --> 00:05:09,639 but sorry, hey listen, they can listen. This is the 103 00:05:09,680 --> 00:05:11,879 behind the paywall tier, right, so people get to know, 104 00:05:11,959 --> 00:05:14,240 like how this works. Is that not a thing? But like, 105 00:05:14,759 --> 00:05:17,920 if you're this close to the tax line and you're 106 00:05:18,000 --> 00:05:20,120 over it, I'm always kind of like you messed up 107 00:05:20,160 --> 00:05:22,279 somewhere because you see a lot of other teams that 108 00:05:22,319 --> 00:05:25,279 are like a couple hundred grand under and you're like, 109 00:05:25,279 --> 00:05:27,519 good job, fellas, that's like a very Miami heat thing 110 00:05:27,600 --> 00:05:30,480 to do, or like like other teams seem like they 111 00:05:30,519 --> 00:05:33,680 really count every penny. You can't be this close and 112 00:05:33,759 --> 00:05:36,839 then not get under that, that's just forget the like, yes, 113 00:05:37,120 --> 00:05:38,680 are you going to be over the apron? 114 00:05:38,800 --> 00:05:40,720 Speaker 1: But are you saying if they don't get under it, 115 00:05:40,720 --> 00:05:42,480 it's a failure. Are you saying they failed by not 116 00:05:42,600 --> 00:05:43,720 already being under it? 117 00:05:44,240 --> 00:05:48,399 Speaker 2: Both the bigger failure would be not getting under it 118 00:05:48,439 --> 00:05:51,120 now to me, But like because you've kind of something 119 00:05:51,160 --> 00:05:53,319 got weird if you're this close but you're not under. 120 00:05:53,199 --> 00:05:55,879 Speaker 1: It, Because so forget about how the Cam Johnson trade 121 00:05:55,879 --> 00:05:58,480 has panned out. But like the steps they took to 122 00:05:58,560 --> 00:06:01,560 get here, I would almost applau where it's okay, what 123 00:06:01,600 --> 00:06:03,079 was the thing we said, let's see how you use 124 00:06:03,160 --> 00:06:05,639 this additional flexibility by getting camp Johnson. You went out 125 00:06:05,639 --> 00:06:07,720 and you did the Jonus founcun his trade and then 126 00:06:07,759 --> 00:06:10,560 what they could have done is not signed Tim Hardaway 127 00:06:10,600 --> 00:06:13,319 Junior or Bruce Brown, who it turns out just in 128 00:06:13,399 --> 00:06:19,319 terms of being bodies are, but Tim Hardaway Junior certainly matters. Yeah, 129 00:06:19,480 --> 00:06:21,920 what would you be willing to wrap up the tax stuff? 130 00:06:22,720 --> 00:06:25,360 Peyton Watson has graduated from we're using him to duck 131 00:06:25,399 --> 00:06:27,360 the town that you're getting value if you're doing that, 132 00:06:27,680 --> 00:06:30,279 Oh yeah, you would absolutely, I think trade even though 133 00:06:30,319 --> 00:06:33,199 challeng Picket's important now too, I think you would move 134 00:06:33,240 --> 00:06:35,399 Picket if a team wants some Hunter Tyson for sure. 135 00:06:35,879 --> 00:06:40,800 Here's here is an interesting question. What if it's Julian Strawther. 136 00:06:42,279 --> 00:06:45,319 Speaker 2: I mean, I think obviously he's you would be more 137 00:06:45,360 --> 00:06:48,680 reluctant to move him than any of any of Like 138 00:06:48,720 --> 00:06:51,639 you just went through the Pickett TII de Ron Holmes. 139 00:06:51,680 --> 00:06:53,879 Speaker 1: I think, oh would you move those guys? 140 00:06:55,519 --> 00:06:57,600 Speaker 2: I think if your whole, if you count on the 141 00:06:58,000 --> 00:07:00,680 roster being fully held, like yeah, I think I think 142 00:07:00,720 --> 00:07:03,439 Strather is someone that and maybe Strather is someone that 143 00:07:03,720 --> 00:07:08,000 has enough value that moving him for somebody. What does 144 00:07:08,040 --> 00:07:10,600 he make? I mean nothing? 145 00:07:11,720 --> 00:07:16,120 Speaker 1: Getting under by more than four hundred thousand dollars, Well, 146 00:07:16,399 --> 00:07:18,720 that's the thing like, I think you can you could 147 00:07:18,720 --> 00:07:20,519 stomach losing any of those guys we've mentioned. 148 00:07:20,560 --> 00:07:24,519 Speaker 2: You can't. It can't be Watson obviously. Holmes, I don't know. 149 00:07:24,560 --> 00:07:27,079 Maybe would you be more willing to move homes than 150 00:07:27,279 --> 00:07:30,319 than Strather, just because if you assume Jokics is back 151 00:07:30,360 --> 00:07:32,240 healthy and then you got Valancies. 152 00:07:32,240 --> 00:07:34,839 Speaker 1: I don't know what's gonna happen with Jonas valentiunis after 153 00:07:34,839 --> 00:07:37,560 the season. It feels like he's just gone. Probably, so 154 00:07:37,920 --> 00:07:40,680 I rather have the cost controlled big there and then 155 00:07:41,199 --> 00:07:43,839 I don't I don't even think the Nuggets. No, they 156 00:07:43,879 --> 00:07:45,600 say this about Holmes too, but the fact that Julian 157 00:07:45,639 --> 00:07:48,319 Strather is now in year three, I don't think the 158 00:07:48,439 --> 00:07:52,199 Nuggets know what they have or understand how they should 159 00:07:52,279 --> 00:07:53,279 value Julian Strather. 160 00:07:53,399 --> 00:07:53,639 Speaker 2: He is. 161 00:07:54,000 --> 00:07:56,439 Speaker 1: I've seen games where it's he really feels like he 162 00:07:56,480 --> 00:07:58,920 could be an offensive firecracker, and it's all like even 163 00:07:59,000 --> 00:08:01,879 something on the ball, pops. I've watched games and it's, oh, 164 00:08:01,920 --> 00:08:03,920 he went to a four from the foul line and 165 00:08:03,959 --> 00:08:06,439 I felt like, I he like, what was he doing? 166 00:08:06,519 --> 00:08:09,879 So I would move? I would dumb Julian Strather if 167 00:08:09,879 --> 00:08:10,879 push came to show. 168 00:08:11,079 --> 00:08:13,800 Speaker 2: Yeah, I think another thing to think about this maybe 169 00:08:13,839 --> 00:08:18,319 isn't fair, but like it took Watson until a week ago, 170 00:08:18,439 --> 00:08:23,000 two weeks ago, I mean certainly told for the Nuggets 171 00:08:23,000 --> 00:08:26,680 to be like, oh, okay, obviously they didn't. They didn't 172 00:08:27,240 --> 00:08:29,439 who knows, who knows if what the negotiations were like 173 00:08:29,839 --> 00:08:33,240 on an extension for him, But like it took until now. 174 00:08:33,320 --> 00:08:35,279 And sometimes on a really good team where roles are 175 00:08:35,320 --> 00:08:37,360 super defined and like touches are hard to come by, 176 00:08:37,399 --> 00:08:39,639 it just takes longer for a young player to show 177 00:08:39,679 --> 00:08:42,000 you like what he might be able to do. So 178 00:08:42,039 --> 00:08:45,200 Strawther's a year behind in terms of of like development 179 00:08:45,200 --> 00:08:49,120 wise and contracts stuff, you'd be no. I think the 180 00:08:49,159 --> 00:08:52,480 reason I asked you about Holmes versus Strawther is like, 181 00:08:52,759 --> 00:08:55,159 I think those are the two that you could actually, 182 00:08:55,639 --> 00:08:59,120 you know, get you might actually get something you can't 183 00:08:59,120 --> 00:09:01,600 probably not get anything. You're just dumping the money. 184 00:09:02,279 --> 00:09:03,480 Speaker 1: I would. 185 00:09:04,080 --> 00:09:07,399 Speaker 2: I think if it's just this year, I might rather 186 00:09:09,080 --> 00:09:11,279 move Ah, that's so hard. I think I might rather 187 00:09:11,360 --> 00:09:12,960 move homes if it's just this year. 188 00:09:13,480 --> 00:09:16,279 Speaker 1: Well, you know that you're not gonna get homes back 189 00:09:16,360 --> 00:09:18,159 next year, right, It's how you get to move him 190 00:09:18,200 --> 00:09:18,480 this year? 191 00:09:18,519 --> 00:09:20,039 Speaker 2: And he come, No, I'm just thinking of like the 192 00:09:20,120 --> 00:09:23,960 Nuggets maximal competitive, Like I'm straw the might matter more. 193 00:09:24,120 --> 00:09:26,000 Speaker 1: Then you go yeah, then you just go with the 194 00:09:26,000 --> 00:09:29,240 big because if Yo Kich isn't healthy, what, there's no point. 195 00:09:29,000 --> 00:09:32,120 Speaker 2: In doing it well. And like Aaron, even if Valentnis 196 00:09:32,159 --> 00:09:34,559 is if he for the point, like yeah, Valentin is 197 00:09:34,559 --> 00:09:36,399 coming off the books whatever, But like Aaron Gordon can 198 00:09:36,399 --> 00:09:38,480 play center. Aaron Gordon has played center in the past. 199 00:09:38,519 --> 00:09:40,480 Like you're okay depth wise, I don't know. It's a 200 00:09:40,480 --> 00:09:42,440 tough call. You could talk to me one way or 201 00:09:42,480 --> 00:09:42,759 the other. 202 00:09:43,000 --> 00:09:45,559 Speaker 1: I can tell you're a professional podcaster because you segued 203 00:09:45,639 --> 00:09:48,759 us into the Peyton Watson talk. Graham, what do they 204 00:09:48,799 --> 00:09:51,639 do with Peyton? Now it's you. You could just say 205 00:09:51,759 --> 00:09:53,639 you keep him and you figure it out this summer 206 00:09:53,720 --> 00:09:57,480 stupid And that's probably the answer. But he's headed to 207 00:09:57,559 --> 00:10:00,759 restricted free agency. They could technically be in the second 208 00:10:00,759 --> 00:10:04,120 apron without him, depending on what happens with Jonas valentiunis 209 00:10:04,480 --> 00:10:06,919 how much are you will let and how much there 210 00:10:06,960 --> 00:10:08,919 will be teams with more money around. And I know 211 00:10:09,240 --> 00:10:12,679 people joke about free agency, including myself, turning into a farce, 212 00:10:13,159 --> 00:10:16,399 especially restricted free agency. This is my favorite. Who's who's 213 00:10:16,399 --> 00:10:18,919 the last RFA to get an offer sheeet grant? You 214 00:10:18,919 --> 00:10:19,240 know they. 215 00:10:19,279 --> 00:10:22,600 Speaker 2: Oh, Paul Reid yep. 216 00:10:23,120 --> 00:10:26,960 Speaker 1: So that's why it's funny. But Peyton Watson, especially this 217 00:10:27,080 --> 00:10:30,120 version of Peyton Watson. You look at, oh, some ball 218 00:10:30,159 --> 00:10:33,159 handling stuff, three pointer going down in a higher clip, 219 00:10:33,200 --> 00:10:35,480 the stuff he still does, disruptive defense, It's like, oh, like, 220 00:10:35,679 --> 00:10:37,440 that's a guy who can make plays at the rim, 221 00:10:37,559 --> 00:10:40,679 who can stick with guys on the perimeter. Someone's gonna 222 00:10:40,679 --> 00:10:43,559 give him an offer sheet. And I think if we 223 00:10:43,600 --> 00:10:45,360 were recording this at the start of the season, you 224 00:10:45,360 --> 00:10:47,039 could have said, well, maybe they could keep him for 225 00:10:47,159 --> 00:10:50,759 like something twelve to fourteen million annually. I don't think 226 00:10:50,799 --> 00:10:53,840 he's gonna get more than Christian Brown, but I think 227 00:10:53,879 --> 00:10:57,639 that we've entered like eighteen plus million dollars if he 228 00:10:57,759 --> 00:11:00,639 keeps this up. And I'm not saying score points a game. 229 00:11:01,039 --> 00:11:04,399 If this is just the season he has, we're firmly 230 00:11:04,559 --> 00:11:08,159 in like probably eighteen plus million dollar territory, right, which 231 00:11:08,200 --> 00:11:09,320 is less than Christian Brown. 232 00:11:09,360 --> 00:11:12,559 Speaker 2: To be clear, I'm I'm bumping on is he gonna 233 00:11:12,600 --> 00:11:13,840 get more than Christian Brown? 234 00:11:14,960 --> 00:11:16,519 Speaker 1: I mean, like, so you know what, the Bulls could 235 00:11:16,559 --> 00:11:19,000 have cap space, So you're right, there's definitely there's that's. 236 00:11:18,879 --> 00:11:22,200 Speaker 2: Well, yeah, I guess, like and the Wizards, I mean, 237 00:11:22,480 --> 00:11:22,840 why not. 238 00:11:23,000 --> 00:11:24,919 Speaker 1: Well, I was more so trolling the Bulls that they're 239 00:11:24,919 --> 00:11:27,080 gonna down Patrick Williams special. 240 00:11:27,159 --> 00:11:32,279 Speaker 2: But I mean at this point, like what does Brown 241 00:11:32,559 --> 00:11:34,159 do better than Watson? 242 00:11:34,240 --> 00:11:36,159 Speaker 1: I thought I thought you were gonna say it, what 243 00:11:36,200 --> 00:11:37,240 does Brown do for you? 244 00:11:37,879 --> 00:11:41,639 Speaker 2: Talk you by well, I mean it's kind of like 245 00:11:41,679 --> 00:11:44,080 an unfair thing because there are different positionally, and like 246 00:11:44,120 --> 00:11:47,240 maybe you trust Brown on smaller guards more. 247 00:11:47,720 --> 00:11:49,320 Speaker 1: I think it comes down to this for me, I 248 00:11:49,360 --> 00:11:51,759 shouldn't boil it down to it. Who do you trust 249 00:11:51,759 --> 00:11:54,759 to guard Anthony Edwards more, Christian Brown or Peyton Watson. 250 00:11:56,360 --> 00:11:58,720 Speaker 2: I mean, I guess it's Brown. I'm sure there's Nuggets 251 00:11:58,759 --> 00:12:01,080 fans some of them are screaming like, well, Watson's length 252 00:12:01,240 --> 00:12:04,120 just an athleticism matters more. But yeah, I thinks Brown 253 00:12:04,159 --> 00:12:06,320 has the track record, I guess in the consistency, and 254 00:12:06,360 --> 00:12:08,759 he's been in a larger role for longer. But if 255 00:12:08,799 --> 00:12:11,600 Watson really is I like, the the thirty nine percent 256 00:12:11,679 --> 00:12:14,000 three point shooting, it's low volume. But if Watson is 257 00:12:15,600 --> 00:12:18,120 league average or better from three, like that's just and 258 00:12:18,159 --> 00:12:20,519 like some of the in between stuff he's shown lately 259 00:12:20,720 --> 00:12:25,080 with with more opportunities. Watson looks, I that's like, you 260 00:12:25,200 --> 00:12:26,960 really can't let that guy go. I think, so, what 261 00:12:26,960 --> 00:12:29,480 are they gonna do with him? Why isn't this just 262 00:12:29,519 --> 00:12:34,120 a at worst like preserve the asset restrictive free agency, 263 00:12:34,240 --> 00:12:35,320 come on back situation? 264 00:12:35,360 --> 00:12:38,279 Speaker 1: Now? I think what gets interesting? And I'm not saying 265 00:12:38,320 --> 00:12:40,679 this is the reason you do it, but if he 266 00:12:40,759 --> 00:12:42,919 is now someone who can get you off of Zeke 267 00:12:43,000 --> 00:12:47,440 Nagy's contract, whereas the trade that we've thrown I'm not 268 00:12:47,480 --> 00:12:49,879 saying just that, but the trade that we have thrown 269 00:12:49,919 --> 00:12:55,279 out is Peyton Watson Zeke Nagy for iod Soon MoU 270 00:12:55,799 --> 00:12:59,519 or if you want to go a step above, what 271 00:12:59,600 --> 00:13:03,720 if you could now do a swap Peyton Watson Nausey 272 00:13:04,320 --> 00:13:07,039 smaller salary X throw it in there and you're getting 273 00:13:07,080 --> 00:13:07,679 Kobe White. 274 00:13:09,320 --> 00:13:15,120 Speaker 2: I would say, I think Watson has moved past the 275 00:13:15,200 --> 00:13:18,279 point of he's something we're gonna use to get off 276 00:13:18,840 --> 00:13:22,600 a contract for in nause that is like it's not 277 00:13:22,720 --> 00:13:25,600 good money, but it's all what is it? Seven million dollars? 278 00:13:25,600 --> 00:13:27,519 I know, I know the tax and apron stuff, so 279 00:13:27,559 --> 00:13:32,440 it's not really just seven next year. But like what 280 00:13:32,480 --> 00:13:35,960 if Watson is I mean, he's like a two way 281 00:13:36,039 --> 00:13:40,559 starter with athleticism and upside and like maybe some shot creation. 282 00:13:40,720 --> 00:13:42,720 Like that's not a guy you used to get off 283 00:13:42,919 --> 00:13:45,480 seven million bucks for next year, it's a guy you 284 00:13:45,559 --> 00:13:48,039 trade for. Like, yeah, we'll take two firsts after we 285 00:13:48,120 --> 00:13:51,120 signed this next deal, we'll take two first back. And 286 00:13:51,360 --> 00:13:54,600 I don't know, like right, like, am i I'm keeping him? 287 00:13:54,639 --> 00:13:56,240 Speaker 1: I don't know what I mean? And that could be. 288 00:13:56,360 --> 00:13:58,639 So let's talk about what Denver need. But I'm my 289 00:13:58,799 --> 00:14:03,039 default is I'm not looking. I'm not trading Peyton Watson 290 00:14:03,080 --> 00:14:05,440 because of his free agency, or I'm not trading Peyton 291 00:14:05,440 --> 00:14:07,879 Watson because it gets me off of Zeke Nasci. No way, 292 00:14:08,000 --> 00:14:11,600 I'm officially at that point. Yeah, yeah, what does Denver need? 293 00:14:11,840 --> 00:14:15,000 You look at this roster aside from healthier bodies? But 294 00:14:15,399 --> 00:14:17,519 oh wait, can I ask another awkward question? This this 295 00:14:17,600 --> 00:14:22,200 falls and needs I guess please, would you like, do 296 00:14:22,240 --> 00:14:24,960 you consider if the if the front office use it 297 00:14:24,960 --> 00:14:27,120 as well? How can we afford that they could just 298 00:14:27,159 --> 00:14:29,240 pay Watson and be done with it? But do you 299 00:14:29,279 --> 00:14:32,840 would all consider should we investigate like does Cam Johnson 300 00:14:32,879 --> 00:14:34,519 have any value left? Like are we more are we 301 00:14:34,559 --> 00:14:36,559 more prepared to pay Peyton Watson and Christian Brown? 302 00:14:36,639 --> 00:14:40,080 Speaker 2: Then that was one of my like one of my 303 00:14:40,200 --> 00:14:42,320 notes coming into this on my own docs, so you 304 00:14:42,360 --> 00:14:44,759 can't see it, but it's like, why aren't we like 305 00:14:44,799 --> 00:14:47,639 can we talk about It's funny, like we're both me 306 00:14:48,120 --> 00:14:52,720 like pretend like off the injury kind of throws it 307 00:14:52,879 --> 00:14:55,399 injury and it's like so, but then you would also say, 308 00:14:55,440 --> 00:14:58,279 like if we're talking about needs, which we are, you'd say, like, 309 00:14:58,440 --> 00:15:00,919 I'd be nice to have like a like MPG level 310 00:15:00,960 --> 00:15:03,399 shooter that we could really count, And like Cam Johnson's 311 00:15:03,399 --> 00:15:05,879 supposed to be that guy. So if you trade him 312 00:15:05,919 --> 00:15:08,600 because you're worried about tax and whatever, it's like, I 313 00:15:08,600 --> 00:15:12,320 guess if Watson doubles his volume and stays at this percentage, 314 00:15:12,360 --> 00:15:14,200 then you're good. But you know what I mean, like 315 00:15:14,559 --> 00:15:17,960 I think their needs still might be Now that's well 316 00:15:18,080 --> 00:15:21,440 backing up Denver's needs are just get healthy because I 317 00:15:21,440 --> 00:15:24,000 think we both agree that, like if they're fully stocked, 318 00:15:24,360 --> 00:15:27,240 it's it's it's the thunder who have been mortal for 319 00:15:27,279 --> 00:15:30,480 a month now and it's them, And then you you 320 00:15:30,519 --> 00:15:32,840 slot in Minnesota has been hotter than anybody. But I 321 00:15:32,879 --> 00:15:35,519 still like Denver better. Just if I got to pick one, 322 00:15:37,240 --> 00:15:43,039 maybe maybe shooting still, but I guess it's I don't know. 323 00:15:43,279 --> 00:15:45,679 Speaker 1: Who's the last player they had where the shooting could 324 00:15:45,679 --> 00:15:48,679 be folded into, like you, because they either have players 325 00:15:48,679 --> 00:15:52,159 who provide the defense or the high volume shooting. Who's 326 00:15:52,200 --> 00:15:55,799 the last guy that provided them with both in. 327 00:15:55,799 --> 00:15:58,879 Speaker 2: One as the Warriors earlier this year when he hit 328 00:15:59,080 --> 00:15:59,799 like eleven of them. 329 00:16:00,159 --> 00:16:02,279 Speaker 1: Gordon against the Thunder in the playoffs last year. 330 00:16:02,320 --> 00:16:06,039 Speaker 2: Yeah, there you go. Yeah, well, I mean right, I 331 00:16:06,039 --> 00:16:09,159 mean maybe again, Maybe that's Watson's value is if he 332 00:16:09,200 --> 00:16:11,120 could do both of those things going forward. I don't know, 333 00:16:11,120 --> 00:16:13,879 we probably should stop talking about Watson. We've already made them. 334 00:16:13,919 --> 00:16:15,759 Speaker 1: Well. I think this is your Maine too, because I 335 00:16:15,759 --> 00:16:17,639 would agree with you on the shooting. I could see. 336 00:16:17,679 --> 00:16:21,240 I like the idea of I like another ball handler here, 337 00:16:21,600 --> 00:16:24,240 Like it's cool that you could trust Peyton Watson to 338 00:16:24,279 --> 00:16:26,759 do some things, or you have Bruce Brown, but someone 339 00:16:26,840 --> 00:16:29,639 like even I would assume getting downhill, getting two feet 340 00:16:29,639 --> 00:16:31,440 in the paint, that type of guy, somebody who's gonna 341 00:16:31,440 --> 00:16:33,840 give you more than or you would expect to give 342 00:16:33,840 --> 00:16:36,279 you more than Jail and Pickett in a playoff series. 343 00:16:36,559 --> 00:16:39,759 Those are the two things I have circled. The problem 344 00:16:39,799 --> 00:16:42,440 is is that if you're not willing to move Peyton Watson, 345 00:16:42,919 --> 00:16:46,200 how are you dressing any of these needs? Because I 346 00:16:46,200 --> 00:16:50,080 don't think could you use swaps and Zeke Nausey's salary 347 00:16:50,279 --> 00:16:55,039 to get anybody. I don't know if swaps. Honestly, I 348 00:16:55,080 --> 00:16:57,080 think even if you weren't getting anybody, I don't know 349 00:16:57,080 --> 00:17:00,200 if that swaps or getting you off of the Zeke Nausey. 350 00:17:00,639 --> 00:17:03,399 Speaker 2: Well, maybe they do. If you go out as far 351 00:17:03,440 --> 00:17:06,440 as possible, which would be thirty and thirty one, I 352 00:17:06,480 --> 00:17:08,200 think you could find a team that might want to 353 00:17:08,240 --> 00:17:14,000 buy into the potential post Jokic prime section of Denver's future. 354 00:17:14,680 --> 00:17:17,319 So like, if you view Nausea as just dead money, again, 355 00:17:17,319 --> 00:17:20,839 it's not that much. If I'm like if I'm Brooklyn, 356 00:17:21,200 --> 00:17:24,160 or if I'm Washington or Utah or whatever, teams with 357 00:17:24,200 --> 00:17:28,279 a little bit of flexibility and a history of some 358 00:17:28,480 --> 00:17:31,599 in some cases wanting those distant shares of a team's 359 00:17:31,599 --> 00:17:35,119 potential downside, Like I'm taking nausea, I'm taking a seven 360 00:17:35,160 --> 00:17:38,200 million dollar hit next year for a shot at if 361 00:17:38,200 --> 00:17:41,400 they're like depending on the protections of swapping with Denver 362 00:17:41,480 --> 00:17:43,599 in like the twenty thirties, aren't you like that's I 363 00:17:43,599 --> 00:17:45,799 think that's worth it if you've got the flexibility. 364 00:17:46,359 --> 00:17:52,519 Speaker 1: Yeah, I I think we over romanticize the rights to 365 00:17:52,559 --> 00:17:55,039 those distant picks because the front officers who are trading 366 00:17:55,039 --> 00:17:57,240 for them probably understand that they're not going to be 367 00:17:57,279 --> 00:17:59,640 the front office. Yeah, we're exercising them, and that's that's 368 00:17:59,640 --> 00:18:02,079 the p and no in a vacuum. I agree with you, 369 00:18:02,559 --> 00:18:05,640 But I think that's why swaps alone wouldn't be enough 370 00:18:05,680 --> 00:18:08,000 to get off of contract. 371 00:18:08,000 --> 00:18:10,559 Speaker 2: Maybe not right because if it is a human who 372 00:18:10,599 --> 00:18:13,920 is employed making that decision, ultimately, like at the ownership level, 373 00:18:13,920 --> 00:18:16,279 you should do that. But if it's a general manager, 374 00:18:16,279 --> 00:18:19,759 they're not exactly incentivized to set the next guy up 375 00:18:20,000 --> 00:18:23,079 for a good draft pick potentially coming in. I mean, 376 00:18:23,279 --> 00:18:25,799 the nuggets are tricky. Well, let me ask you a 377 00:18:25,920 --> 00:18:27,559 more global question. I know we have a couple of 378 00:18:27,559 --> 00:18:31,400 other topics to hit here, but like of the teams 379 00:18:31,960 --> 00:18:35,799 that we they just seem like a team that duck 380 00:18:35,880 --> 00:18:37,799 the tax by moving off one of these two million 381 00:18:37,839 --> 00:18:42,720 dollar guys and attaching a something and call it good, right, Like, 382 00:18:42,799 --> 00:18:45,440 realistically this is not a team, Like, wouldn't you be 383 00:18:45,480 --> 00:18:48,200 shocked if if they're not trading Watson? I don't think, 384 00:18:48,279 --> 00:18:50,960 because that would logically would be something you'd consider normally 385 00:18:51,000 --> 00:18:53,640 with free agency approaching. But like that, I think that's 386 00:18:53,640 --> 00:18:55,599 off the table. And then after that it's like what 387 00:18:55,680 --> 00:18:56,480 are we talking about? 388 00:18:57,119 --> 00:19:00,720 Speaker 1: But with the RFA stuff, you could probably average signing 389 00:19:00,720 --> 00:19:04,319 trade scenarios. So that's also why you don't. The only 390 00:19:04,359 --> 00:19:06,920 reason I could think of is we think Spencer Jones 391 00:19:06,960 --> 00:19:10,039 is ready, We're gonna convert him, and that's how But that, like, 392 00:19:10,160 --> 00:19:11,319 is that more of a reason to get rid of 393 00:19:11,400 --> 00:19:13,039 Christian Brown at this point? I think it's just we've 394 00:19:13,039 --> 00:19:14,799 been so long since we saw Christian Brown play, it's 395 00:19:14,839 --> 00:19:17,759 kind of unfair. But to your point, the other issue 396 00:19:17,759 --> 00:19:19,559 you run into is even if you can do something, 397 00:19:20,160 --> 00:19:25,759 if the Nuggets are healthy, like how deep, like how much? 398 00:19:26,079 --> 00:19:27,759 How good does the player need to be so you 399 00:19:27,759 --> 00:19:32,000 have Aaron Gordon, Christian Brown, Jamal Murray, Nicole Jokic, Peyton Watson, 400 00:19:32,559 --> 00:19:34,440 Cam Johnson has to be in there are all just 401 00:19:34,559 --> 00:19:37,519 locks to be in the rotation, So you have to 402 00:19:37,559 --> 00:19:40,640 be better than like are you getting a seventh best 403 00:19:40,640 --> 00:19:42,359 player or an eighth best player when you're in the 404 00:19:42,400 --> 00:19:46,519 Spencer Jones, Tim Hardaway, Junior, Bruce Brown, Jonas Valencunas territory, 405 00:19:46,559 --> 00:19:49,920 it needs to be better than like most like the 406 00:19:49,960 --> 00:19:51,960 player you're getting, I think for it to be worthwhile 407 00:19:52,160 --> 00:19:53,960 needs to be better than most of those players that 408 00:19:54,000 --> 00:19:54,960 I just named. 409 00:19:55,039 --> 00:19:57,720 Speaker 2: Right and given the tools they have to like sweeten 410 00:19:57,799 --> 00:20:02,279 things which are few, Like how do you do? How 411 00:20:02,359 --> 00:20:05,519 is that even possible? Like maybe maybe like fit wise, 412 00:20:05,559 --> 00:20:08,400 you could find someone who's like roughly as valuable on 413 00:20:08,519 --> 00:20:15,160 balance as Brown or Hardaway Bruce Brown, But like it 414 00:20:15,200 --> 00:20:17,079 feels like it would be like, well, he's close to 415 00:20:17,119 --> 00:20:19,480 his good he's just different, like we want this box 416 00:20:19,559 --> 00:20:22,480 checked and we don't care about it'd be like lateral 417 00:20:22,519 --> 00:20:26,400 moves I think in most cases. So so yeah, like 418 00:20:27,319 --> 00:20:29,839 that's part of the reason is like it's hard to envision, 419 00:20:30,160 --> 00:20:33,799 beyond the tax ducking, what a move would look like. 420 00:20:33,839 --> 00:20:36,319 And if you don't think that nause is movable for 421 00:20:36,319 --> 00:20:38,200 for what Denver would be willing to pay to move him, 422 00:20:38,240 --> 00:20:40,759 then it's then it's you're making little lateral moves in 423 00:20:40,799 --> 00:20:45,440 your eight through eleven spots in your rotation maybe do. 424 00:20:45,400 --> 00:20:49,640 Speaker 1: You have any targets specifically that would be like, so 425 00:20:49,839 --> 00:20:52,480 I have I have a trade like throw logistics out 426 00:20:52,480 --> 00:20:54,440 the window, like don't say Luka Doncics or something, but 427 00:20:54,559 --> 00:20:56,319 just like anyone you think that fits some of the 428 00:20:56,359 --> 00:20:58,279 needs that we that we outlined. 429 00:20:58,680 --> 00:21:00,759 Speaker 2: I mean, if you brought it up and I was 430 00:21:00,799 --> 00:21:05,359 going to who's like the it's got to be what's 431 00:21:05,400 --> 00:21:08,160 Cam Johnson make twenty one this year, twenty three next? 432 00:21:08,200 --> 00:21:11,480 So who's like the nineteen ish or nineteen to twenty 433 00:21:11,519 --> 00:21:15,519 million dollar player that maybe has longer on his deal 434 00:21:15,759 --> 00:21:17,759 or something that you could turn Cam Johnson? 435 00:21:19,000 --> 00:21:22,359 Speaker 1: Who I don't know. I don't I would be curious 436 00:21:22,359 --> 00:21:25,000 as to what Cam Johnson's value is right. 437 00:21:24,880 --> 00:21:27,920 Speaker 2: Now, right right? I mean the contract's reasonable for like 438 00:21:28,000 --> 00:21:33,359 I think he still is a starter, like Jeremy Grant 439 00:21:33,359 --> 00:21:36,440 makes way too much that he's not under that like 440 00:21:36,559 --> 00:21:39,079 Kobe White again, but like what does Kobe White do 441 00:21:39,160 --> 00:21:41,039 for you if you're Denver? Because there's your other ball 442 00:21:41,039 --> 00:21:43,640 handler he makes less than Johnson? 443 00:21:44,440 --> 00:21:46,839 Speaker 1: Are you ever is he part? Does he ever have? 444 00:21:47,039 --> 00:21:48,480 He's not closing going to be a free agent. He's 445 00:21:48,519 --> 00:21:50,400 not closing, and then you have to pay him that's weird. 446 00:21:51,279 --> 00:21:53,279 Speaker 2: Well, maybe you do it because you're cleaning up next 447 00:21:53,319 --> 00:21:55,400 year's books two and you're saying some of that money's 448 00:21:55,440 --> 00:21:58,160 going to be allocated for Watson and his next deal. 449 00:21:58,920 --> 00:22:02,759 I don't know, it's it's all like trick. 450 00:22:03,480 --> 00:22:05,759 Speaker 1: I wonder. I think he's probably too cheap for them 451 00:22:05,799 --> 00:22:09,400 to be like vit Crachy would be good for Denver's. 452 00:22:09,440 --> 00:22:11,319 Like it's like a ball hand. He chucks a bunch 453 00:22:11,319 --> 00:22:14,559 of boxes on certain nights, depending on whether the shots falling. 454 00:22:14,920 --> 00:22:16,519 Speaker 2: What are you giving up to? Are you in a 455 00:22:16,640 --> 00:22:17,319 Johnson deal? 456 00:22:18,119 --> 00:22:20,039 Speaker 1: Oh? No, No, I wasn't saying I was in general 457 00:22:20,079 --> 00:22:24,480 at yeah, just in general, I mean Cam Johnson deal specifically? 458 00:22:24,599 --> 00:22:29,839 Do you trade him to No, that's tupid. Like what 459 00:22:29,839 --> 00:22:34,079 about Cam Johnson for for KCP and Cam Spencer? That'd 460 00:22:34,119 --> 00:22:34,759 be really funny. 461 00:22:34,759 --> 00:22:39,720 Speaker 2: He'd be coming back? Is Cam Spencer? Cam Spencer clearly 462 00:22:39,759 --> 00:22:42,680 the best like dollar for production value player in that group? 463 00:22:43,079 --> 00:22:43,200 Speaker 1: Right? 464 00:22:46,160 --> 00:22:49,519 Speaker 2: Yeah, we run into the same thing. Uh, Like again, 465 00:22:49,680 --> 00:22:52,559 I like Cam Spencer a lot, and CACP I would 466 00:22:52,599 --> 00:22:56,599 just assume would be better once back in Denver. Are 467 00:22:56,640 --> 00:22:59,880 either of them gonna get rotation minutes over Johnson? This? 468 00:23:00,680 --> 00:23:03,279 I don't know, maybe no, like that wud be hard 469 00:23:03,519 --> 00:23:04,720 something even here I'm. 470 00:23:04,559 --> 00:23:06,599 Speaker 1: Trying to think of, let's say you're willing to attach 471 00:23:06,680 --> 00:23:10,599 the twenty thirty two second first round swaps. I don't know, 472 00:23:10,920 --> 00:23:15,599 like what's the upgrade that you like, the realistic upgrade 473 00:23:15,759 --> 00:23:19,200 upgrade you'd be chasing in that salary range. That's what's 474 00:23:19,200 --> 00:23:22,119 tough because they have to be better then, because you 475 00:23:22,119 --> 00:23:24,440 could talk about there might be ones who're better defensively, 476 00:23:24,480 --> 00:23:29,640 but it comes with an offensive trade off there then it's. 477 00:23:29,160 --> 00:23:32,000 Speaker 2: With no sweeteners. It's like, yeah, I mean, I'm the 478 00:23:32,079 --> 00:23:34,119 cam Johnson thinks starts. The more you look at it 479 00:23:34,200 --> 00:23:36,119 kind of feels like a dead end. I don't know 480 00:23:36,160 --> 00:23:36,920 what they do there. 481 00:23:37,160 --> 00:23:37,599 Speaker 1: I don't. 482 00:23:37,640 --> 00:23:39,319 Speaker 2: I don't have a lot on this team, honestly, Like 483 00:23:39,359 --> 00:23:42,640 it's I think it's Picket or Tyson or whatever, and 484 00:23:42,680 --> 00:23:44,559 you duck the tax and you probably call it good, 485 00:23:44,799 --> 00:23:47,839 like I don't. I mean, maybe you want to free 486 00:23:47,920 --> 00:23:49,279 up money for Watson. 487 00:23:49,079 --> 00:23:52,119 Speaker 1: Well, and could you also if we're looking additively, kean 488 00:23:52,200 --> 00:23:55,359 Ellis is so cheap that is that twenty thirty two 489 00:23:55,480 --> 00:23:57,559 second enough to get you there with the Kings or 490 00:23:57,599 --> 00:24:00,839 can they do better a first round swap and that second. 491 00:24:01,119 --> 00:24:03,440 Speaker 2: Don't they have to do better than that? For Ellis? 492 00:24:03,559 --> 00:24:06,519 I would assume Elie's market will be pretty Uh. 493 00:24:06,880 --> 00:24:09,680 Speaker 1: They're not gonna get a first round pick for him standalone, though, 494 00:24:09,680 --> 00:24:10,279 do you think will? 495 00:24:10,319 --> 00:24:14,240 Speaker 2: They Probably not a real one. It could see, I 496 00:24:14,279 --> 00:24:16,920 could see like a one that turns into a couple seconds. 497 00:24:16,960 --> 00:24:20,839 Speaker 1: Maybe I'm contractually obligated to mention him for every team, 498 00:24:20,880 --> 00:24:24,920 but this salary range wise, he would certainly fit justin Champenne. 499 00:24:24,960 --> 00:24:27,640 If Washington looks and sees how many wings they have 500 00:24:27,680 --> 00:24:29,519 and decides, hey, we could we could move this guy. 501 00:24:31,680 --> 00:24:34,680 Speaker 2: I mean, yeah, I could see that. I have you 502 00:24:34,720 --> 00:24:36,200 did you bring up the soon MoU yet? 503 00:24:36,920 --> 00:24:39,960 Speaker 1: So I have a trade that evolves assummu? That's the 504 00:24:39,960 --> 00:24:42,319 one like it would have to be. So you're giving 505 00:24:42,759 --> 00:24:44,759 I'll say all the swaps, even though twenty twenty six 506 00:24:44,799 --> 00:24:46,440 doesn't matter. We could say all the swaps to make 507 00:24:46,519 --> 00:24:50,319 it sound splash. Here, all the swaps your second round pick, 508 00:24:50,880 --> 00:24:57,039 Doron Holmes, Zeke Nagy, Julian Strawther for Jallen Smith and 509 00:24:57,079 --> 00:24:57,839 Io Desumu. 510 00:24:58,319 --> 00:25:02,079 Speaker 2: Hmm, what there swaps against this? You're give him three 511 00:25:02,119 --> 00:25:04,440 swaps this year? Though? 512 00:25:04,519 --> 00:25:06,400 Speaker 1: The are the Bulls swapping with the Nuggets are really 513 00:25:06,440 --> 00:25:09,240 like two swaps. Oh right. 514 00:25:09,279 --> 00:25:12,599 Speaker 2: I was looking at the condition So the conditional twenty eight, 515 00:25:12,640 --> 00:25:14,000 thirty and thirty one's. 516 00:25:14,519 --> 00:25:17,880 Speaker 1: And those are conditional upon the Nuggets conveying their first 517 00:25:17,960 --> 00:25:20,680 round pick, like to okay sees that they have that 518 00:25:20,759 --> 00:25:22,000 pick availble to swap. 519 00:25:23,720 --> 00:25:26,160 Speaker 2: God, if we entered the era where it's like even 520 00:25:26,240 --> 00:25:29,359 swaps are like, I don't know, we'll see just because 521 00:25:29,440 --> 00:25:31,400 every tea. I guess the Nuggets are unusual in that 522 00:25:31,440 --> 00:25:32,640 they're so leveraged with pick. 523 00:25:32,680 --> 00:25:34,680 Speaker 1: So let's just let's frame it this way. Two swaps 524 00:25:35,039 --> 00:25:38,599 a second round pick. Zeke Nagy's contract is going out, 525 00:25:39,079 --> 00:25:42,759 and you're getting Holmes and Strawther as the Bulls, and 526 00:25:42,759 --> 00:25:44,599 you're sending out Jalen Smith and Iota Summu. 527 00:25:45,799 --> 00:25:49,720 Speaker 2: I think you probably, I think both sides probably do that. 528 00:25:49,759 --> 00:25:52,759 I mean again, it's the Bulls so like they rarely 529 00:25:52,759 --> 00:25:55,359 do what they should. I think the Bulls should do that. 530 00:25:55,960 --> 00:25:58,000 Speaker 1: I like the other thing you do if you were 531 00:25:58,039 --> 00:26:01,119 looking to consolidate salary, is that instead of Zeke Najy, 532 00:26:01,680 --> 00:26:04,359 if you think that Gordon's gonna play center in the playoffs, 533 00:26:04,759 --> 00:26:08,720 you'll get just healthy. You could trade Jonas Valentiunis instead 534 00:26:08,720 --> 00:26:10,119 of Zeke nag and then hope. 535 00:26:09,960 --> 00:26:12,200 Speaker 2: That then you and the team gets off the hook 536 00:26:12,240 --> 00:26:15,519 because that's fully non guaranteed next year, right the ten million. 537 00:26:15,880 --> 00:26:19,720 Speaker 1: For Yeah, and I don't think he wants to be 538 00:26:19,839 --> 00:26:21,000 in the NBA anymore. 539 00:26:21,039 --> 00:26:25,079 Speaker 2: Still, he's here begrudgingly after Maybe he just didn't want 540 00:26:25,079 --> 00:26:26,480 to be on the Kings. You ever thought of that? 541 00:26:27,240 --> 00:26:28,680 Speaker 1: Didn't seem like you wanted to be on the Nuggets 542 00:26:28,680 --> 00:26:30,720 at one point either, But I guess they was. 543 00:26:31,240 --> 00:26:32,920 Speaker 2: That was a weird stretch, Okay. I I kind of 544 00:26:32,960 --> 00:26:35,039 like that, and I like you get Smith adds a 545 00:26:35,200 --> 00:26:37,599 kind of a different element for them. For for Denver, 546 00:26:37,640 --> 00:26:40,359 I should say, and who is the other guy you're 547 00:26:40,400 --> 00:26:41,119 getting with Smith? 548 00:26:42,519 --> 00:26:42,640 Speaker 1: Uh? 549 00:26:43,920 --> 00:26:45,680 Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm in. I'm in on that for Denver. 550 00:26:45,759 --> 00:26:50,200 Speaker 1: Now here's would you like the would you like the problem? 551 00:26:51,200 --> 00:26:52,160 Speaker 2: I'd love the problem? 552 00:26:52,279 --> 00:26:54,599 Speaker 1: So the problem if you're the if you're the Nuggets, 553 00:26:54,599 --> 00:26:56,960 do you push to include Jonas Valentnis because you would 554 00:26:56,960 --> 00:27:00,160 be able to like because you're adding money in that trade, 555 00:27:00,440 --> 00:27:02,720 you're going into the tax by you're all of a sudden, 556 00:27:02,720 --> 00:27:05,440 like three million dollars into the tax rather than half 557 00:27:05,480 --> 00:27:07,039 a million dollars away from ducking it. 558 00:27:07,599 --> 00:27:12,119 Speaker 2: I would say you maybe, because like how many minutes 559 00:27:13,319 --> 00:27:16,680 is is Valentunis gonna play with Jokic in the postseason, 560 00:27:16,880 --> 00:27:19,759 Like if you think that's like one of your one 561 00:27:19,759 --> 00:27:23,240 of your weapons, you might hesitate, But I think realistically 562 00:27:23,680 --> 00:27:27,000 you'll get You'll play forty three minutes in all the 563 00:27:27,039 --> 00:27:29,400 games that really matter in the playoffs, and then Aaron 564 00:27:29,400 --> 00:27:32,240 Gordon probably plays some more of those, or maybe Valentunis 565 00:27:32,279 --> 00:27:35,960 is playing less than ten and Smith he's so right, 566 00:27:36,000 --> 00:27:38,319 so like you you would, He's not that big of 567 00:27:38,359 --> 00:27:39,759 a lot. He's not as big of a loss as 568 00:27:39,759 --> 00:27:40,519 it might seem. 569 00:27:41,000 --> 00:27:44,160 Speaker 1: You're actually still adding money in that trade by two 570 00:27:44,240 --> 00:27:48,960 hundred thousand dollars. Honestly, if I can get off Zeke 571 00:27:49,039 --> 00:27:53,519 Naugy like I'm doing it, and then it's just you 572 00:27:53,519 --> 00:27:55,319 know what you missed out on the revenue this year, 573 00:27:55,319 --> 00:27:58,279 and you Reckoncile, that's and you if you really wanted to, 574 00:27:58,440 --> 00:28:02,079 you could probably Well you're going three for two here already, 575 00:28:02,359 --> 00:28:04,400 So I'm gonna say you could just send like one 576 00:28:04,440 --> 00:28:10,640 of your someone would take Bruce Brown or Tim Hardaway Junior. Yeah, 577 00:28:10,680 --> 00:28:12,720 well you could just do a separate trade for Valentunis. 578 00:28:12,720 --> 00:28:14,400 Is it a trade that you get you a cheaper 579 00:28:14,440 --> 00:28:17,279 player or something, so you could still figure out wheys 580 00:28:17,440 --> 00:28:20,160 if you trade zechnology as part of this deal, it'd 581 00:28:20,160 --> 00:28:21,839 be easier to figure out how to get out of 582 00:28:21,839 --> 00:28:24,160 the tax. Honestly, then maybe if you trade Valentunis and 583 00:28:24,279 --> 00:28:27,839 only have that two hundred, like to shave the half 584 00:28:27,880 --> 00:28:30,880 a million dollars just because you're out of you unless 585 00:28:31,000 --> 00:28:32,799 just some team really wants to jail, like you're just 586 00:28:32,839 --> 00:28:35,839 sort of out of moves that you've traded every single 587 00:28:35,960 --> 00:28:36,880 like out of. 588 00:28:36,920 --> 00:28:39,720 Speaker 2: Moves is how I would describe Denver just generally speaking. 589 00:28:40,119 --> 00:28:43,440 Speaker 1: But I just made one you're welcomes how much? 590 00:28:43,759 --> 00:28:47,640 Speaker 2: Isn't there real value though, from Denver's perspective in just 591 00:28:47,799 --> 00:28:51,920 not bringing Valentunis back and earmarking the ten million dollars 592 00:28:51,960 --> 00:28:53,839 you would have paid him for the twenty five you're 593 00:28:53,839 --> 00:28:55,440 gonna have to give Peyton Watson. 594 00:28:56,720 --> 00:28:58,640 Speaker 1: For sure. So I'm saying, like, if you get off 595 00:28:58,640 --> 00:29:00,799 of his echnology and then you let I'm just saying 596 00:29:01,200 --> 00:29:04,079 this deal makes it harder for the Nuggets to get 597 00:29:04,119 --> 00:29:05,680 out of the tax. Is how are you getting out 598 00:29:05,680 --> 00:29:08,039 of the tax if you've now you could either move 599 00:29:08,079 --> 00:29:12,599 Oununus for a cheaper player or what like you've traded 600 00:29:12,680 --> 00:29:14,759 he not, but you have nothing to attach to anybody 601 00:29:14,799 --> 00:29:17,880 to say here and at that point, because they're at 602 00:29:17,920 --> 00:29:21,920 fifteen players right now, right and you're also want to 603 00:29:21,920 --> 00:29:25,039 convert Spencer Jones. So that's like the that's the challenge. 604 00:29:25,079 --> 00:29:26,759 I mean, I would do it. That's I just feel 605 00:29:26,759 --> 00:29:28,519 like that's I don't know if the Bulls would. I 606 00:29:28,519 --> 00:29:31,319 think the even with Denver's tax situation, I think the 607 00:29:31,359 --> 00:29:33,000 Bulls are the team here that would say no. 608 00:29:33,640 --> 00:29:36,279 Speaker 2: Yeah, maybe it's hard to say. I mean, one of 609 00:29:36,319 --> 00:29:38,160 the things we're running up against here when we're looking 610 00:29:38,200 --> 00:29:41,319 for like options for Denver is that it doesn't it 611 00:29:41,359 --> 00:29:43,920 feel kind of like, I guess Brown is really the 612 00:29:43,920 --> 00:29:45,920 player I'm talking about, Like, I don't know that other 613 00:29:46,000 --> 00:29:48,440 teams around the league value Christian Brown at the dollar 614 00:29:48,440 --> 00:29:50,640 amount the Nuggets are paying him. Does that does that 615 00:29:50,680 --> 00:29:52,480 seem fair? Like? I think I don't know. 616 00:29:52,480 --> 00:29:54,160 Speaker 1: And the other thing the other thing that we have 617 00:29:54,359 --> 00:29:56,960 and I totally forgot, is that he's poison pilled, so 618 00:29:57,039 --> 00:29:57,640 moving him as he. 619 00:29:57,720 --> 00:30:00,079 Speaker 2: He's not going anywhere. I'm just saying in general, like 620 00:30:00,519 --> 00:30:03,200 the Nuggets because of the way they've conducted business over 621 00:30:03,240 --> 00:30:05,079 the years. I feel like, I mean, Jamal Murray is 622 00:30:05,079 --> 00:30:08,240 an example of this, probably like they and Gordon. Gordon's 623 00:30:08,319 --> 00:30:11,279 kind of a universal fit enough that maybe he's that's 624 00:30:11,279 --> 00:30:14,319 his market value on that extension he signed. But like 625 00:30:14,359 --> 00:30:16,160 in general, I feel like the Nuggets and keeping this 626 00:30:16,200 --> 00:30:17,799 team together the way they have, they have a lot 627 00:30:17,839 --> 00:30:20,640 of guys that it's like they're being paid more than 628 00:30:21,000 --> 00:30:24,039 another team would be willing to pay them. Brown in particular, 629 00:30:24,039 --> 00:30:27,480 but yeah, he's going nowhere because the outgoing money is 630 00:30:27,519 --> 00:30:30,680 like well or in like four point nine or something, 631 00:30:30,759 --> 00:30:33,640 and then coming in it's like twenty one not happening. 632 00:30:34,079 --> 00:30:36,759 So I think, So, who are the players you're thinking 633 00:30:36,799 --> 00:30:38,640 of when you're saying that the Nuggets are paying them 634 00:30:38,640 --> 00:30:39,279 more than other team? 635 00:30:39,359 --> 00:30:40,240 Speaker 1: Is that Cam Johnson? 636 00:30:40,279 --> 00:30:40,440 Speaker 2: Now? 637 00:30:40,480 --> 00:30:42,880 Speaker 1: Is that where you're at? Because Murray Murray, I think 638 00:30:43,880 --> 00:30:46,400 other teams might be, like, Murray's having a hell of 639 00:30:46,440 --> 00:30:46,759 a year. 640 00:30:47,440 --> 00:30:50,920 Speaker 2: Let me pull up there. Zeke Zeke nag is seven. 641 00:30:51,680 --> 00:30:55,599 Speaker 1: Even player Aaron Gordon moving forward after this year is 642 00:30:55,599 --> 00:30:56,680 probably Yeah, that's what I mean. 643 00:30:56,799 --> 00:30:59,759 Speaker 2: So next year he's thirty two, then thirty four and 644 00:30:59,799 --> 00:31:02,440 a half than thirty seven, and those will be his 645 00:31:02,519 --> 00:31:05,720 age thirty one, thirty two to thirty three seasons, and 646 00:31:05,799 --> 00:31:07,839 already it's like pretty clear he can't make it through 647 00:31:07,880 --> 00:31:10,519 a full year and postseason healthy. So as much as 648 00:31:10,559 --> 00:31:13,559 I love him, he he's I'm just listen. It's not 649 00:31:13,640 --> 00:31:18,240 no judgment, just just saying I think maybe he is. 650 00:31:18,319 --> 00:31:20,720 I think Brown definitely is probably paid more than the 651 00:31:20,759 --> 00:31:23,960 market would pay Johnson I just said earlier, is it 652 00:31:24,200 --> 00:31:28,440 seems okay just because of the shooting track record? Yeah, 653 00:31:28,559 --> 00:31:31,640 Murray making fifty to fifty three, fifty seven the next 654 00:31:31,839 --> 00:31:34,440 three years after this one, Murray's not a thirty percent 655 00:31:34,480 --> 00:31:35,720 of the cap player, I don't think. 656 00:31:36,920 --> 00:31:40,079 Speaker 1: Two. Finally, just adjust my trade if you're Denver, isn't 657 00:31:40,079 --> 00:31:42,599 more palatable if you're attaching the stuff to his Ike 658 00:31:42,640 --> 00:31:46,039 Nagy to get Io desum Wu alone rather than getting 659 00:31:46,559 --> 00:31:47,960 Jalen Smith and Io Desummu. 660 00:31:48,400 --> 00:31:54,119 Speaker 2: Hmm. I think I think probably. But then the question 661 00:31:54,240 --> 00:31:58,519 is just where, like what Nause's impact is zero when 662 00:31:58,519 --> 00:32:00,960 they're fully healthy? What's just soon moves? Like? Is he 663 00:32:01,039 --> 00:32:04,440 gonna play fi? Yeah? 664 00:32:04,480 --> 00:32:06,160 Speaker 1: I was gobna say, because he probably eats into minutes 665 00:32:06,160 --> 00:32:10,039 for Brown Hardway Junior Strawther depending It's probably depending on 666 00:32:10,079 --> 00:32:11,119 the matchup thing. 667 00:32:11,240 --> 00:32:12,920 Speaker 2: Yeah yeah, I mean. 668 00:32:12,799 --> 00:32:15,359 Speaker 1: Honestly, the deal, if you want to save maximum money, 669 00:32:15,920 --> 00:32:18,640 you're gonna have to convert Spencer Jones after that. But 670 00:32:18,680 --> 00:32:21,319 that's what they're gonna want to do is attached Strawther 671 00:32:21,480 --> 00:32:24,000 to Nause. Hope he's viewed as like a mini sweetener, 672 00:32:24,119 --> 00:32:26,119 and then use the swaps and the second round pick 673 00:32:26,160 --> 00:32:27,599 and or maybe you keep. 674 00:32:27,680 --> 00:32:29,920 Speaker 2: You keep some of the swaps and stuff out of 675 00:32:29,920 --> 00:32:32,160 there since you have so little to move, like maybe 676 00:32:32,200 --> 00:32:34,799 you create enough flexibility with that stuff thing. 677 00:32:34,880 --> 00:32:37,319 Speaker 1: Well, for sure you keep this one. But if you're Chicago, 678 00:32:38,319 --> 00:32:40,799 you're just taking Strowther in a twenty thirty two second 679 00:32:40,839 --> 00:32:42,400 round pick to give up to Soon Moo and take 680 00:32:42,440 --> 00:32:42,839 on Nase. 681 00:32:43,039 --> 00:32:46,359 Speaker 2: That's like well if yeah, right, But if you're Chicago, like, 682 00:32:46,400 --> 00:32:49,279 how confident are you that Dessum Mouve's coming back? You know? 683 00:32:49,559 --> 00:32:49,880 Is he? 684 00:32:50,720 --> 00:32:54,400 Speaker 1: I think? Would you rather have Nause off the books 685 00:32:54,400 --> 00:32:56,599 for two more years or just let eye out to 686 00:32:56,680 --> 00:32:58,240 super Walk for well? 687 00:32:58,480 --> 00:33:00,799 Speaker 2: Right, okay, yeah, so the sweeteners still have to be there. 688 00:33:01,559 --> 00:33:03,359 I guess it just depends on their view of Strawther. 689 00:33:03,759 --> 00:33:07,200 Maybe they think Strawther is gonna be something I don't know. 690 00:33:09,759 --> 00:33:11,519 Speaker 1: Do you have anything else? Are you ready to take 691 00:33:11,559 --> 00:33:11,839 us out? 692 00:33:11,880 --> 00:33:15,160 Speaker 2: I think we very clearly exhausted our Denver Nuggets thoughts. 693 00:33:15,559 --> 00:33:20,200 Thanks everybody for listening, for watching. Remember rate review, subscribe, Share, 694 00:33:20,359 --> 00:33:22,640 Share with all your friends, with all your Nuggets fans, 695 00:33:22,880 --> 00:33:25,240 even though they probably like us or like I don't 696 00:33:25,240 --> 00:33:27,079 know what Denver is gonna do at the deadline. Maybe 697 00:33:27,200 --> 00:33:34,079 very little discord links for that in the YouTube podcast. Yeah, basically, 698 00:33:34,119 --> 00:33:37,119 like the takeaway here for me was you need to 699 00:33:37,160 --> 00:33:40,119 find ways to keep Payton Watson, and that probably means 700 00:33:40,160 --> 00:33:43,880 you should just trade everybody else. I hope I convey that. 701 00:33:45,799 --> 00:33:47,839 Shouts Frank no Keen. Apologies, Jared Allen