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Speaker 1: At a book.

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Speaker 2: If you'd like to be able to listen to the

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show without ads and have full access to bonus content,

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that's an option. To find out how, please go to

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Dogmanencounters dot com forward Slash podcast. If you listen to

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last Friday Night Show episode six nineteen, you heard tonight's

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guest Wiley Birou come on and talk about a pretty

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darn unnerving dogman encounter he had. Well, he had so

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much to share with us that night on that show

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that I didn't have enough time to ask him questions

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about that experience. So I asked him if he'd be

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interested in coming back on to answer those questions, to

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do a Q and A basically, and he agreed, So

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here he is back to do that. Hevn said all that,

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Thanks again so much for coming back, Wiley. I appreciate it.

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Speaker 1: Hey, Vic, it's no problem, my pleasure. How you doing today?

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Speaker 2: Doing good? But more importantly, how are you?

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Speaker 1: I'm doing excellent. We got a lot of snow here

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in New Jersey. I've been shoveling out the driveway. I

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shoveled out my neighbor's driveway. But other than that, we're

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doing really well.

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Speaker 2: Well, that's good as long as you can say that

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that's a great thing.

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Speaker 1: Wiley.

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Speaker 2: For anyone who missed episode six nineteen, please give us

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a brief bio in yourself.

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Speaker 1: All right. So I grew up in New Jersey, and

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ever since I was a little kid, my mother took

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me I'm hiking across the street. I grew up in

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a preserved area, which was a thirty six thousand acre

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part preserved for wildlife, which is pretty It's one of

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the largest expansions of preserved land with the highest density

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of population surrounding it. So growing up in New Jersey,

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I was actually really lucky to have the outdoors just

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right at the tip of my fingertips. So I was

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able to explore and go hiking as a kid, which

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really drew me into like pursuing a career towards the outdoors.

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So after high school, I went to a wilderness school

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in Washington State where I learned to survive in the outdoors.

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The experience was really amazing. The experience was about a

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year long, and after the year long survival program, I

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ended up moving back to New Jersey. I did AmeriCorps,

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where I volunteered all around the country helping different people

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during natural disasters, wild forest firefighters, and basically doing other

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service based projects around the country. So that's not nature oriented,

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but giving back to people is just something else that

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I'm very passionate about. So I did amer Corps and

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then I ended up wanting to move back to Washington State.

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And when I moved back to Washington State, I ended

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up getting my four year degree in wildlife biology and

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forest management. While I was in Washington State, I did

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a bunch of hiking, mountaineering, backpacking, and it was just

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absolutely incredible. But I eventually moved back to New Jersey,

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where I became an arborist. I learned all the tree

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species here in New Jersey, I learned how to take

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care of all the plants and shrubs, and you know,

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doing the grind in New Jersey was just rough. And

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I eventually moved back to Oregon. I moved back to

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Oregon in twenty twenty five and I became a wild

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and forest firefighter. And I actually just recently moved back

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to New Jersey. So basically, throughout my life since I

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was eighteen, I've just been pursuing a career involving the

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outdoor and also service based projects, like, I really love

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giving back and that's kind of what drew me to

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becoming a firefighter. Firefighting you get to be in the

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outdoors and you get to like really help people. So,

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to make a long story short, that's where I'm at today.

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I'm back in New Jersey. I'm looking for work. But yeah,

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that's a little bit about myself. I'm really into the

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outdoors and I really like to give back.

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Speaker 2: Listening to you talk about all the things you've done

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and do, it's clear that you're as nice and benevolent

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as the day is long. I'm really impressed. I really am.

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Speaker 1: Oh, thank you, Vic, thank you. Yeah, helping people is

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what makes the world turn around. If you have a

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chance to help somebody or something, even if it's a plant,

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do it because that helps the world go around.

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Speaker 2: You're a good man. Like I told you before, I

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just hope you never change. For anyone who missed that

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show Friday night, please give us a quick rundown of

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your encounter now.

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Speaker 1: Sure thing. So, I had been on a seventeen day

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camping trip. I had a bunch of vacation time saved

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up from working in the tree service industry. I'd been

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working in the tree service industry for about three years,

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and if I didn't use my vacation time, it wasn't

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going to roll over or I wouldn't be able to

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get to use it. So in right before January, I

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decided to go on seventeen day camping trip to Florida.

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While I was in Florida at the time, I was

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in a really intense relationship. I thought I was with

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the girl that was going to marry. We were planning

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on having kids, getting married, and just having a whole

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life together. But anyway, it ended up in a big

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broken heart. So she actually dumped me while I was

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on the trip, and one thing led to another. I

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was just super heartbroken. This was a first some I

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had to like move back into my parents' house in

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my thirties, and it was really a difficult situation. And

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one evening I was I was having a moment. I

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was just feeling the feelings and I was here alone

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at my parents' house and I decided to go on

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a walk into the forest at night without a flashlight

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because this is where I grew up, Like the forest

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out here is my serenity. I come out. I go

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into the forest to find peace. But at this moment

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in time, I wasn't in the best head space, and

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I went into the forest right across the street from

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my house, this thirty six thousand acre preserve which has

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a has a recorded Bigfoot sighting. But you know, that

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was not my concern at the moment. I just wanted

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to go out into the forest. There's this spot out

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there called Devil's half Acre, and it's basically it's an

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unknown spot. Like you could look up Devil's half Acre

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and the Saralands. I'm sure you'll find something, but there's

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not too many people that know where it is. I

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think I might be the one person who actually knows

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the location today who lives in Illsborough. But there's no

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trails that take you there. It's off the beaten path,

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so anyway, it's not a far walk from my parents' house.

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It's basically a ten minute walk through the forest. And

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after going to the Wilderness School in Washington, I got

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really used to hiking at night without a flashlight. The

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more you hike at night, the better night vision gets,

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and I'm always trying to practice that. So I went

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out into the forest at night with a broken heart,

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really mourning this whole relationship, not really exactly knowing how

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to express my emotions and stuff. So I had one

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of those moments where you look at the sky and

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scream why me. So I was out there just having

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a moment, letting go, and all of the sudden I

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heard a growl and the growl was clearly a canine,

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which just caught me off guard because after studying wildlife biology,

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you really learned the habits of canines and just wasn't

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the typical place that you'd hear a canine of that size.

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So I'm out there and like sure in the forest

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where I was, I know there are fox dens and

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stuff like that, but the growl that I heard was

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so low and scary that clearly I decided I need

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to leave. When you're in the forest by yourself with

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no flashlight and something growls at you, it's really unsettling.

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And this forest growing up next to it it's my home.

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So I've I grew up kind of feeling like I

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was king of the forest here. Nothing could really bother me,

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and if there's anything out there, they would respect me.

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So I went out into the forest with a broken heart,

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and I was just being loud and obnoxious and kind

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of disrespectful to whatever is out there. This park is

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closed at night, there's no access to people can't access

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it during the evening. So people going out into the

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forest and being extra loud, it's just, uh, it doesn't

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really happen often. So I'm out there, I hear a growl,

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and immediately I knew I need to leave, So I

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just I got up and I started trying to make

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my way out of the forest as fast as possible.

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So as I'm coming out of the forest, there's a

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road you have to cross to get into a field.

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There's where my parents' house is located. There's a one

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neighbor by my parents' house and a field, and I

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basically the mountain side is on the other streets other

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side of the street. So I'm coming down out of

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the forest off of the mountain. I crossed the street

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into the field and I start making my way towards

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There's a couple of green belts that lead to another field.

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So there's a field that I'm crossing into a green belt,

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and another field than my neighbor's house and then my

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parents' property. So I'm coming down out of the forest

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and I cross the street and I get into this

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field and I'm make my way through the green belt

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and I get into the next field, and I hear

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whatever was growling at me was following me, and I

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could hear it coming through the woods kind of in

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the direction that I'm coming in, and that really kind

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of freaked me out because that's just not typical animal behavior.

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So basically that scared me to my wits end, and

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I ended up running through the field and I make

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it to the green belt that leads to my parents' property,

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and I make my way over to the door that

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I would enter to get into the room that I'm

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staying in, which is the room that I'm saying in

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is basically a photography studio. There's two buildings on my

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parents' property, the main house and this old Amish barn

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that my dad turned into a landscape architecture office and

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a photography studio. So right now, while I'm in between places,

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I'm staying in my parents' photography studio, and at that

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time I was as well. So I'm getting through this.

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I ran through the field and I'm coming through the

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green belt to go into my property, and I make

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my way through my property and I go into the

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door and I leave the door open, and I kind

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of just listened to see what was following me. And

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I can hear something big coming through the field and

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it's panting, and I got really kind of nervous. I

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was nervous the whole time. But this canine clearly canine.

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I thought it was a bear at first. Well, I

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didn't think it was a bear, but it looked like

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a bear. And this creature walks basically right in front

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of me through my parents yard. I could just see

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the shadow of it, silhouetted and whatever it was like,

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it was huge, and I could hear it breathing as

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it walking right past my door. And it goes across

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my parents' yard into the next field and I look

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at it sit down in the field and it's doing

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a weird growl and bark and it was making noises,

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and I decided to whistle at it. And when I

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whistled at it, it stopped making the noises and it

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registered my whistle and then it continued with this growl. Meanwhile,

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I can see it in the field over sitting canine like,

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and it starts growling and barking and it did this

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crazy the growl bark that turned into a howl. And

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after studying wildlife biology for so many years, like my

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name is Wilie and coyotes are kind of my spirit animals,

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so I've actually done some coyote research. I've fed coyotes

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from my hand. I also got a chance to do

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wolf research and Idaho and I got to track wolves

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with this amazing researcher. So I'm very familiar with canines,

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and this was a canine that I'd never heard before,

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and it struck me, it struck me to be something different,

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and the sound it made was just unlike anything I've

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ever heard, and just being in that situation where we're

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getting stocked by an animal from a distance like that,

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it's just not like any other animal behavior. And for

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the next couple of weeks afterwards, which was really really unusual,

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because I had no idea what exactly I was looking at,

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except that my intuition told me that this was not

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a wolf, not a coyote. And I had heard of

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dog man before, and that's exactly what my intuition was saying,

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like this is not something normal, this is you know.

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I was in denial, but there's nothing else that could

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have been other than a dog man in my opinion.

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So basically, the next couple of weeks afterwards, I had

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these really weird dreams where something was looking at me

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through the window and it freaked me out so much

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I tried covering the windows. The windows in this room

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had no shades, and I started locking the doors every night,

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which I've never done before. And I actually just moved

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back here from Oregon and I haven't had any weird

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feelings and I haven't had the sense that I need

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to lock the door. But so that was just like

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a really really reaction from the experience that I had,

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and that's basically what I had. That's my dog man experience.

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I had something tracked me and follow me from the forest,

243
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which is just really odd animal behavior. I've been in

244
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close proximity to mountain lions, and I've been stalked by

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a mountain lion, but the difference between being stalked by

246
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a predator like that is their stealth like the mountain lion.

247
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I didn't realize there was even stalking me until the

248
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last second order we made eye contact. This creature, whatever

249
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it was, was stalking me and letting me know that

250
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it was stalking me. It was keeping a healthy distance away,

251
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but it clearly was escorting me out of the forest,

252
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which was I knew and not normal animal behavior. And

253
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so this experience like really freaked me out and I

254
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ended up looking up a dog man. I looked up

255
00:16:59,240 --> 00:17:01,720
anything I could. I did a bunch of research on

256
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dog man after this experience, because my intuition was telling

257
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me that this had to be a dog man and

258
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that's how I found your podcast. And after listening to

259
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your podcast, I heard a few other encounters that were

260
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that took place in the same county, and that just

261
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kind of verified it. Literally, there was a gentleman that

262
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was on your show that I think was probably only

263
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a few miles away. So I kind of led me

264
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to believe that I might be in a dog man

265
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hot spot. And also after that fact, my parents saw

266
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something weird. I told my parents about the encounter and

267
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they kind of laughed at me. But literally, within that

268
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same week, my mom saw two canine figures. She thought

269
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they were deer at first, but when she was inspecting

270
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them looking at them, she realized those weren't deer, that

271
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the hair was way too dark and she realized that

272
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they were canine canines out there, some kind of canine.

273
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She didn't know what they were she but they, she said,

274
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they're as big as dogs. And when she noticed them,

275
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they noticed her, and they dashed away like lightning, faster

276
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than any animal she'd ever seen. And like maybe a

277
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week later, my dad witnessed the same two creatures that

278
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were when my mom saw them. They were in the

279
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back of our property. When my dad saw them, they

280
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were on the outer edge of one of the fields,

281
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and the same thing happened. My dad saw them and

282
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they noticed him, and my dad said they they ran

283
00:18:30,960 --> 00:18:33,039
like faster than an the animal he'd ever seen. And

284
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my parents called me up and they're like, hey, Wiley,

285
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we saw a dog man. And they were kind of

286
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joking about it, and they told me there what they saw,

287
00:18:42,000 --> 00:18:45,960
and yeah, so they were kind of joking about it.

288
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They don't really believe that they saw a dog man,

289
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but they definitely saw something that, you know, got their attention.

290
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And after my mom saw that, she started taking pictures.

291
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She found one picture of like a giant canine track

292
00:18:59,440 --> 00:19:03,359
right outside of our our barn, and our barn door

293
00:19:04,039 --> 00:19:06,839
has a cat door in it, and right in front

294
00:19:06,839 --> 00:19:10,960
of the cat door was this gigantic canine track in

295
00:19:11,000 --> 00:19:15,079
the snow. And uh yeah, So, like I don't think

296
00:19:15,079 --> 00:19:18,200
my parents really believe what they saw, but like, deep down,

297
00:19:18,240 --> 00:19:20,960
I think they know there's something out here that's strange,

298
00:19:21,000 --> 00:19:23,319
because every once in a while they'll tell me this,

299
00:19:24,160 --> 00:19:25,880
not every once in a while, like once they told

300
00:19:25,920 --> 00:19:28,920
me they saw a track and they saw canines. But

301
00:19:29,920 --> 00:19:33,839
that's basically all the activity that I've had that they've had.

302
00:19:33,960 --> 00:19:36,160
I've been in organ this whole time, but since I've

303
00:19:36,200 --> 00:19:38,720
been back, the few days i've been back, I haven't

304
00:19:38,759 --> 00:19:42,319
had any activity. But that's kind of what happened. To

305
00:19:42,359 --> 00:19:44,720
sum it up, Yeah, that's a lot.

306
00:19:44,920 --> 00:19:49,839
Speaker 2: It really is. A dog mean encounter can teach you

307
00:19:49,839 --> 00:19:53,359
a lot about yourself when all said and done with

308
00:19:53,400 --> 00:19:56,839
regards to that encounter, of course, would you say that

309
00:19:56,920 --> 00:19:59,680
the bulk of what you learn from it? Would you

310
00:19:59,720 --> 00:20:02,839
say the bulk fit was outward or inward?

311
00:20:05,119 --> 00:20:10,200
Speaker 1: I would say it was. That's a that's a good question.

312
00:20:12,759 --> 00:20:19,799
Speaker 3: Well, basically, uh, I would say it was somewhat bold because, uh,

313
00:20:22,799 --> 00:20:27,720
basically I started researching the creature and heard a lot

314
00:20:27,799 --> 00:20:31,640
more encounters that seemed very credible.

315
00:20:32,200 --> 00:20:37,720
Speaker 1: But you know, it did seem to test my feelings

316
00:20:37,720 --> 00:20:43,880
and emotions. And you know, after having experience an experience

317
00:20:44,000 --> 00:20:49,680
like that, I I've never really felt scared to live

318
00:20:49,720 --> 00:20:52,200
where I've lived like this, this forest here in New

319
00:20:52,279 --> 00:20:55,160
Jersey has always been my sanctuary, my safe space, and

320
00:20:55,200 --> 00:20:59,119
I've never really like felt too nervous. But after having

321
00:20:59,160 --> 00:21:03,640
that encounter, I I was honestly scared to like go outside,

322
00:21:03,960 --> 00:21:06,279
and where I'm staying at right now, you have to

323
00:21:06,319 --> 00:21:09,200
go outside in order to use the bathrooms and stuff

324
00:21:09,240 --> 00:21:13,880
like that. So after having that encounter, really it really

325
00:21:14,160 --> 00:21:18,039
kind of gave me PTSD. For a while, I wouldn't

326
00:21:18,440 --> 00:21:21,920
leave the door unlocked and I was trying to cover

327
00:21:22,000 --> 00:21:24,160
up the windows because I was having these vivid dreams

328
00:21:24,160 --> 00:21:28,160
that something was watching me. But you know, moving back

329
00:21:28,200 --> 00:21:31,200
to New Jersey and moving out of my parents' house,

330
00:21:31,319 --> 00:21:36,920
that PTSD sort of simmered away. But yeah, it was

331
00:21:36,960 --> 00:21:40,319
definitely a little bit of both internal and external, because

332
00:21:41,079 --> 00:21:43,400
it was internal at the moment because I was like

333
00:21:44,200 --> 00:21:48,720
terrified of my parents' property for a while. And I

334
00:21:48,720 --> 00:21:52,480
would say it's also external because I dove into this

335
00:21:52,559 --> 00:21:55,119
topic and just started doing so much research and now

336
00:21:55,160 --> 00:21:58,279
I believe that there's definitely something out there, so a

337
00:21:58,279 --> 00:21:59,119
little bit of both.

338
00:22:00,200 --> 00:22:04,319
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's how it normally goes. And sometimes the only

339
00:22:04,319 --> 00:22:06,920
way you can learn certain things about yourself is by

340
00:22:06,960 --> 00:22:09,039
having a profound experience like the one.

341
00:22:08,920 --> 00:22:09,799
Speaker 1: That you had that night.

342
00:22:10,440 --> 00:22:13,559
Speaker 2: With that in mind, and with that being said, what

343
00:22:13,759 --> 00:22:17,000
surprised you most about what you learned about yourself after

344
00:22:17,039 --> 00:22:17,480
having that.

345
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Speaker 3: Encounter probably the fact that I have a craving for more.

346
00:22:26,119 --> 00:22:31,440
Speaker 1: I want to learn more about the subject. I'm definitely

347
00:22:31,839 --> 00:22:34,319
I would like to have a better sighting. You know,

348
00:22:34,440 --> 00:22:36,640
you better watch out for what you wish for. But

349
00:22:36,680 --> 00:22:41,759
at the same time, studying wildlife biology and tracking lousive animals,

350
00:22:42,359 --> 00:22:44,799
the fact that there's something that could be unknown out

351
00:22:44,799 --> 00:22:47,559
there just really intrigues me, and I want to learn more.

352
00:22:48,960 --> 00:22:51,400
I'm not really out here to prove it that anything

353
00:22:51,440 --> 00:22:54,359
is real or that exists. I really want to unpay

354
00:22:54,400 --> 00:22:57,240
these creatures the respect that they deserve and give them

355
00:22:57,279 --> 00:23:00,799
their space. But I definitely want to learn more. And

356
00:23:01,119 --> 00:23:04,480
you know, after having a scary situation like that, you

357
00:23:04,480 --> 00:23:08,920
would think that maybe I'd be intimidated to learn more,

358
00:23:09,319 --> 00:23:13,240
But just after so many life experiences that I've had,

359
00:23:13,279 --> 00:23:16,400
I realized, like sometimes pushing your comfort zones and doing

360
00:23:16,440 --> 00:23:21,599
something that scares you makes you stronger in the long run. So, like,

361
00:23:21,920 --> 00:23:26,880
though though this topic is unnerving and I don't really

362
00:23:26,960 --> 00:23:30,559
know what to think about the behavior of this creature,

363
00:23:30,960 --> 00:23:34,720
I am interested to learn more, especially after hearing people's

364
00:23:34,799 --> 00:23:38,759
encounters and stories. You know, you hear some that are

365
00:23:38,880 --> 00:23:42,880
obviously aggressive, and then sometimes you hear some that aren't.

366
00:23:43,119 --> 00:23:47,160
You know, mine mine was kind of unnerving and aggressive

367
00:23:47,240 --> 00:23:50,599
because when I had the chance to whistle and like

368
00:23:50,759 --> 00:23:54,640
kind of interact with the creature, I didn't get a warm,

369
00:23:54,759 --> 00:24:00,960
fuzzy like vibe. I got a growl and a howl,

370
00:24:01,640 --> 00:24:05,720
and it was clearly trying. It was clearly an aggressive

371
00:24:07,599 --> 00:24:12,519
behavior that it was trying to display. So with that said, uh,

372
00:24:12,880 --> 00:24:16,720
I think these are apex predators and you should always

373
00:24:16,759 --> 00:24:20,279
give your give these give animals their space. So it's

374
00:24:20,319 --> 00:24:23,880
just a touchy subject, you know, It's really difficult to

375
00:24:23,920 --> 00:24:26,799
figure out how to go about even trying to research

376
00:24:26,839 --> 00:24:29,599
something like this, and the research that I do is

377
00:24:29,640 --> 00:24:35,319
basically just for my own enlightenment. I'm you know, I

378
00:24:35,359 --> 00:24:38,920
don't really want to prove any any of these cryptos

379
00:24:38,920 --> 00:24:41,559
are real, so but I do want to know more

380
00:24:41,599 --> 00:24:43,799
about these creatures, and I would love to be able

381
00:24:43,799 --> 00:24:47,559
to study them. I'm fascinated by all nature and wildlife,

382
00:24:47,559 --> 00:24:50,960
and these creatures exist, you know, they're here, they're part

383
00:24:51,039 --> 00:24:57,240
of nature. So yeah, that's what really surprised me the most.

384
00:24:58,079 --> 00:25:01,559
Speaker 2: Well, it's obviously you have a lot of curious You're

385
00:25:01,599 --> 00:25:05,359
obviously very intelligent, you love the outdoors, you love nature.

386
00:25:05,400 --> 00:25:07,880
It's only natural that you try to find out all

387
00:25:07,920 --> 00:25:11,039
you can about these guys. So yeah, that doesn't come

388
00:25:11,079 --> 00:25:16,279
as a surprise. Now, you just mentioned respect, and obviously

389
00:25:16,480 --> 00:25:20,079
you'd be the last person to ever intentionally disrespected dog men.

390
00:25:20,319 --> 00:25:24,240
But have you ever thought about the possibility that that

391
00:25:24,359 --> 00:25:27,039
dog men vocalize the way it did when you're listening

392
00:25:27,079 --> 00:25:29,920
to it just outside your door that night, because of

393
00:25:30,000 --> 00:25:32,880
you going into what just might have been its home,

394
00:25:33,279 --> 00:25:35,319
or it might have considered to be its home, i e.

395
00:25:35,480 --> 00:25:44,680
The Devil's half Acre and yelling why me, Uh.

396
00:25:43,440 --> 00:25:45,559
Speaker 1: Yeah, I definitely think that I had something to do

397
00:25:45,640 --> 00:25:51,759
with it. You know, if these animals are out there

398
00:25:51,799 --> 00:25:54,799
and they're apex predators and they look at humans like

399
00:25:55,359 --> 00:26:03,480
you know, you know, what are big bodies of meat

400
00:26:03,720 --> 00:26:08,480
that can pretty easily be taken down I'm sure it was.

401
00:26:09,799 --> 00:26:14,440
Who knows what kind of hunting patterns I was disrupting,

402
00:26:14,880 --> 00:26:17,720
or any kind of piece I was disrupting. I'm sure

403
00:26:17,799 --> 00:26:22,319
these things don't really appreciate humans coming into their territory

404
00:26:22,559 --> 00:26:25,119
and being loud and disruptive. I don't think any animal

405
00:26:25,160 --> 00:26:30,200
would would appreciate that. Probably no human would either, So I,

406
00:26:30,680 --> 00:26:33,240
you know, it makes sense that I would get a

407
00:26:33,279 --> 00:26:35,720
reaction like that based off of how I was feeling

408
00:26:35,759 --> 00:26:38,160
and how I was acting and how loud I was being.

409
00:26:38,440 --> 00:26:40,680
Typically when I go into the forest, I try to

410
00:26:40,960 --> 00:26:44,359
keep a calm, a calm mind, and I try to

411
00:26:44,359 --> 00:26:47,599
be respectful and quiet and listen to the forest and

412
00:26:47,880 --> 00:26:51,599
usually have great positive experiences. But right that day I

413
00:26:51,640 --> 00:26:56,559
was I was I wasn't doing that at all. I

414
00:26:56,599 --> 00:27:01,880
was going out there with my feelings emotions. It's just

415
00:27:01,920 --> 00:27:04,319
interesting that, you know, I went out there and expressed

416
00:27:04,359 --> 00:27:08,480
these emotions and had another an emotional experience too. So

417
00:27:09,119 --> 00:27:11,839
it's weird that how that works. But I think if

418
00:27:11,839 --> 00:27:14,039
anyone went out there and was being really loud and

419
00:27:14,079 --> 00:27:17,279
abrasive and doing something wrong at that time of night,

420
00:27:17,880 --> 00:27:22,400
that they would have a similar experience. And there was

421
00:27:22,440 --> 00:27:24,400
another day where I went out there, and I had

422
00:27:24,440 --> 00:27:27,279
two little puppies and I went out. I went out

423
00:27:27,359 --> 00:27:29,799
hiking at night the sarlands with the puppies, and the

424
00:27:29,960 --> 00:27:32,880
whole time I didn't go very far. I like literally

425
00:27:32,920 --> 00:27:35,839
went on the first loop of the trail, and the

426
00:27:35,920 --> 00:27:38,559
whole time I was out there, my puppies were just

427
00:27:38,920 --> 00:27:42,960
cowering in fear, just whimpering, and uh, yeah, I turned

428
00:27:43,000 --> 00:27:45,759
around quick. But yeah, when you grew up in an

429
00:27:45,839 --> 00:27:49,240
area and you consider it your home, you kind of

430
00:27:49,319 --> 00:27:52,839
like feel like there's nothing out there that can harm you.

431
00:27:53,039 --> 00:27:56,359
But the reality is when you go out into the forest,

432
00:27:57,359 --> 00:28:00,599
you're out of your element to a certain extent, you know,

433
00:28:01,119 --> 00:28:04,480
I mean not out of our elements, but we as

434
00:28:04,559 --> 00:28:08,720
humans live in a little bubble. We're not living a

435
00:28:08,759 --> 00:28:14,640
primitive style of life, and you know, so like, yeah,

436
00:28:14,960 --> 00:28:17,119
I feel like it's really important to respect the animals

437
00:28:17,200 --> 00:28:18,559
that call that their home.

438
00:28:19,559 --> 00:28:21,440
Speaker 2: It it'd be nice if we were in charge, but

439
00:28:22,279 --> 00:28:24,680
in most cases we're not. And that's all there is

440
00:28:24,720 --> 00:28:28,079
to it. Like you just said, now, you just mentioned

441
00:28:28,079 --> 00:28:31,119
the negative feelings that you had that night, and when

442
00:28:31,160 --> 00:28:34,559
we spoke for the first time, you told me about

443
00:28:34,559 --> 00:28:38,359
the negative energy that you're putting off at the Devil's

444
00:28:38,400 --> 00:28:42,440
half Bacre. But before this all happened, you knew about

445
00:28:42,480 --> 00:28:46,000
dog men? Did you know about the tendency for negative

446
00:28:46,000 --> 00:28:48,240
emotions like that to tend to draw them in.

447
00:28:49,319 --> 00:28:53,759
Speaker 1: Absolutely not. I'd heard about dog man because I'm into

448
00:28:53,799 --> 00:28:57,839
the bigfoot subject, but I never gave it like two cents.

449
00:28:57,880 --> 00:29:00,319
I never really thought much into the subject until I

450
00:29:00,359 --> 00:29:03,599
had this encounter. So also, growing up in New Jersey,

451
00:29:03,599 --> 00:29:06,599
it's so densely populated, you kind of feel like there's

452
00:29:07,000 --> 00:29:13,759
no predators out here. Cat fox. I think we have bobcat.

453
00:29:13,960 --> 00:29:16,599
I believe we do have mountain lion out here. I've

454
00:29:16,640 --> 00:29:20,319
seen sign, I've seen scat. But you know, if you

455
00:29:20,440 --> 00:29:22,720
ask a wildlife biologists in the area, they're going to

456
00:29:22,759 --> 00:29:25,200
say there's no mountain lions, and there's no wolves, and

457
00:29:25,240 --> 00:29:28,720
there's no big predators. The biggest predator probably they'd say

458
00:29:28,720 --> 00:29:33,920
it's our coyotes. I'm not really afraid of coyotes, And

459
00:29:34,279 --> 00:29:36,039
when I went out there, I was kind of thinking,

460
00:29:36,119 --> 00:29:38,920
I'm top predator and I have nothing to worry about.

461
00:29:39,000 --> 00:29:42,960
But I was quickly humbled. That's for sure. When you're

462
00:29:43,119 --> 00:29:47,480
when you're outside without a flashlight in the forest and

463
00:29:47,559 --> 00:29:51,720
you hear something gral at you flips that switch really quick.

464
00:29:51,880 --> 00:29:53,960
So I went from feeling like I was king of

465
00:29:54,000 --> 00:30:00,640
the forest to extremely vulnerable, like I could be taken

466
00:30:00,680 --> 00:30:03,519
out quick. So that's those are the vibes I was feeling.

467
00:30:03,519 --> 00:30:06,559
And I was not expecting that at all, to say

468
00:30:06,559 --> 00:30:07,480
the least.

469
00:30:08,160 --> 00:30:11,519
Speaker 2: Well, you had no reason to expect it. Why do

470
00:30:11,519 --> 00:30:13,960
you think that dog man responded to your whistle the

471
00:30:13,960 --> 00:30:14,559
way it did?

472
00:30:16,000 --> 00:30:21,880
Speaker 1: Oh, that's a really interesting question, because I wasn't expecting

473
00:30:21,920 --> 00:30:26,599
it to react to my whistle whatsoever. But you know

474
00:30:27,480 --> 00:30:31,519
it was, it was following me. I heard it close

475
00:30:31,759 --> 00:30:35,119
when I was in the forest yelling into the sky whimy.

476
00:30:36,720 --> 00:30:39,079
I heard it not too far away at that point.

477
00:30:39,119 --> 00:30:41,920
It had to have been like thirty feet. It was

478
00:30:41,920 --> 00:30:45,839
a close growl. Like Devil's half acre is literally half

479
00:30:45,880 --> 00:30:48,559
of an acre. So the Devil's half acre is this

480
00:30:48,640 --> 00:30:50,640
boulder field out in the middle of the forest. There's

481
00:30:50,680 --> 00:30:54,839
a creek that leads to Devil's half acre. Basically, there

482
00:30:54,920 --> 00:30:56,880
was rocks in the creek that get bigger and bigger

483
00:30:56,880 --> 00:30:59,720
and bigger until you can't hear the see the creek anymore.

484
00:30:59,720 --> 00:31:01,079
You could just hear it and they call it the

485
00:31:01,160 --> 00:31:05,200
Rumbling Rocks. But this there's a huge boulder field where

486
00:31:05,240 --> 00:31:09,599
there's boulders that are the size of school buses, huge

487
00:31:09,720 --> 00:31:13,640
boulders like mountain esque features right here in New Jersey.

488
00:31:14,000 --> 00:31:16,680
People that grew up in Hillsborough don't even know that

489
00:31:17,200 --> 00:31:19,640
there are mountainous features like that in this town. So

490
00:31:20,079 --> 00:31:26,079
Devil's half Acre, it's pretty hidden. But yeah, I was

491
00:31:26,160 --> 00:31:30,880
not thinking that I would be really disturbing anything out there.

492
00:31:31,079 --> 00:31:34,480
I you know, any wild animal too that could be

493
00:31:34,519 --> 00:31:37,519
out there. I would think that me yelling into the

494
00:31:37,559 --> 00:31:40,880
sky like I was so aggressively would have scared it away.

495
00:31:41,119 --> 00:31:45,319
You know, animals typically are afraid of humans and don't

496
00:31:45,640 --> 00:31:49,440
want anything to do with humans, even predators like mountain lions.

497
00:31:49,599 --> 00:31:54,599
They evolved to not hunt humans and typically if they

498
00:31:54,680 --> 00:31:58,240
hear a human, they're gonna leave. Same with bears, same

499
00:31:58,240 --> 00:32:01,640
with most predators. So I was out there thinking I

500
00:32:01,720 --> 00:32:04,799
was totally safe and totally fine, and here in a

501
00:32:04,839 --> 00:32:06,519
growl like that really caught me off guard.

502
00:32:07,519 --> 00:32:09,599
Speaker 2: Well, you didn't have any reason to think that anything

503
00:32:09,680 --> 00:32:12,319
like that was going to happen, So you can't be

504
00:32:12,359 --> 00:32:16,000
faulted for that. Do you know how the place got

505
00:32:16,000 --> 00:32:19,839
its name. How the Devil's half Acre are in that name, That's.

506
00:32:19,599 --> 00:32:23,319
Speaker 1: A great question. No, I do not know how Devil's

507
00:32:23,319 --> 00:32:28,079
half Aer got its name. I always wondered. That's definitely

508
00:32:28,119 --> 00:32:30,880
something I need to research, but I have no idea.

509
00:32:30,960 --> 00:32:34,839
But I'm sure there's a reason for it. Definitely. I

510
00:32:34,880 --> 00:32:37,880
think in the Sara Lens there are some secrets. Like

511
00:32:37,920 --> 00:32:40,240
you look at this forest and you just get an energy.

512
00:32:40,960 --> 00:32:45,599
There are some things out there, and it has a

513
00:32:45,839 --> 00:32:48,720
kind of a foreboding vibe to it, but at the

514
00:32:48,759 --> 00:32:53,160
same time, it's really inviting. It's a really beautiful place

515
00:32:53,200 --> 00:32:56,119
and a beautiful space. It's one of my safe spaces,

516
00:32:56,240 --> 00:32:59,720
so you know, knowing that there could be things lurking

517
00:32:59,720 --> 00:33:02,559
out there is a little unnerving. But at the same time,

518
00:33:02,640 --> 00:33:04,119
I feel like if I go out into the forest

519
00:33:04,160 --> 00:33:08,920
with a good headspace, I'll be fine. But I do

520
00:33:09,160 --> 00:33:10,920
not know how it got its name, and I would

521
00:33:10,920 --> 00:33:13,599
be I would love to know if anyone in New

522
00:33:13,680 --> 00:33:16,279
Jersey has heard of Devil's half Acre and has any

523
00:33:16,279 --> 00:33:19,240
idea of its history, I would I'm definitely interested.

524
00:33:20,319 --> 00:33:22,599
Speaker 2: We don't know how it got that name, but I

525
00:33:22,599 --> 00:33:25,039
can guarantee you this. I'm sure it's not for a

526
00:33:25,079 --> 00:33:27,240
reason that's going to give us a warm and fuzzies.

527
00:33:27,640 --> 00:33:28,319
That's pretty much.

528
00:33:29,640 --> 00:33:32,400
Speaker 1: Yeah. I think there's like a some sort of history

529
00:33:32,400 --> 00:33:35,920
of like places being named devil and having some sort

530
00:33:35,920 --> 00:33:39,279
of sort of like negative history to it. So it's

531
00:33:39,359 --> 00:33:42,039
kind of interesting that there's like a place named Devil's

532
00:33:42,039 --> 00:33:45,079
half Acre right across the street. I have no clue

533
00:33:45,119 --> 00:33:48,319
why it's named that, but you know, I do know

534
00:33:48,400 --> 00:33:54,000
that it has a it did have a large Native

535
00:33:54,000 --> 00:33:58,160
American presence. Like when you're hiking through the Sarlans often

536
00:33:58,200 --> 00:34:04,599
you'll find tree Bend and I've actually found petroc glyphs

537
00:34:04,720 --> 00:34:07,880
that were carved on top of a boulder. And it's

538
00:34:07,960 --> 00:34:13,800
really cool because I'm uh. These petroc glyphs were found randomly,

539
00:34:14,480 --> 00:34:16,679
and in order to get to the top of the boulder,

540
00:34:16,679 --> 00:34:19,239
I had to climb a tree. I climbed a tree

541
00:34:19,320 --> 00:34:20,760
with a few of my friends to get on top

542
00:34:20,800 --> 00:34:22,639
of this boulder and there are all these petroc glyphs.

543
00:34:22,719 --> 00:34:25,840
And this was in high school, and we all put

544
00:34:25,880 --> 00:34:29,360
our own carved, our own names and pictures around the

545
00:34:29,400 --> 00:34:33,239
petrick lyfts. But I was never able to refine those

546
00:34:33,239 --> 00:34:35,280
petroc glyphs. I know exactly. I kind of know the

547
00:34:35,320 --> 00:34:37,679
general area where I did find them, but I haven't

548
00:34:37,679 --> 00:34:39,280
been able to find them again. But there is a

549
00:34:39,360 --> 00:34:43,800
large Native American presence and not now, but there was

550
00:34:43,880 --> 00:34:48,760
a large Native American presence in these in this forest.

551
00:34:49,239 --> 00:34:50,880
I don't know if that has anything to do with it,

552
00:34:50,920 --> 00:34:53,440
but I do know that there are a lot of

553
00:34:53,480 --> 00:34:59,159
dog Man's sidings near cemeteries Native American cemeteries. I don't

554
00:34:59,159 --> 00:35:02,199
know if there is a American cemetery across the street,

555
00:35:02,239 --> 00:35:06,119
but you can find tree bends and stuff like that.

556
00:35:06,119 --> 00:35:09,000
Speaker 2: That sure does sound like a neat area, It really does.

557
00:35:10,280 --> 00:35:12,360
Could you feel it in your chest when the dog

558
00:35:12,400 --> 00:35:15,320
Man made those vocalizations after you whistled at it?

559
00:35:16,199 --> 00:35:19,559
Speaker 1: I did not. I did not, And I have felt

560
00:35:19,559 --> 00:35:24,000
that sensation before, so I know what you're talking about.

561
00:35:24,039 --> 00:35:27,119
But no, I didn't feel it in my chest. So

562
00:35:28,519 --> 00:35:33,599
I don't think that's like says anything in particular. But yeah,

563
00:35:33,719 --> 00:35:36,119
I was definitely able to hear it, but it didn't

564
00:35:36,360 --> 00:35:40,000
like vibrate my core or anything like that. But it

565
00:35:40,039 --> 00:35:44,400
was and it wasn't like crazy loud, but it was

566
00:35:44,440 --> 00:35:47,719
definitely directed towards me, and it was and a very

567
00:35:47,719 --> 00:35:53,599
aggressive growl bark, howl. But no, I didn't vibrate my chest,

568
00:35:53,639 --> 00:35:55,880
and neither did the growl. But the growl did like

569
00:35:56,320 --> 00:35:56,800
scare me.

570
00:35:57,800 --> 00:35:59,840
Speaker 2: Oh, I'm sure it got your moodor running. I don't

571
00:36:00,039 --> 00:36:04,239
out that at all. Did anything you witnessed or experienced

572
00:36:04,280 --> 00:36:06,760
that night as your encounter was playing out to give

573
00:36:06,800 --> 00:36:09,719
you the impression that it might have been a spiritual creature.

574
00:36:13,400 --> 00:36:17,199
Speaker 1: Nothing really made me think it was a spiritual creature.

575
00:36:18,440 --> 00:36:20,880
As far as I'm concerned, it was a flesh and

576
00:36:20,920 --> 00:36:25,679
blood creature. I can hear it moving through the woods,

577
00:36:25,920 --> 00:36:28,880
I could hear it stepping on leaves and sticks. I

578
00:36:28,880 --> 00:36:32,519
could hear it breathing, I could hear it howling, I

579
00:36:32,559 --> 00:36:36,000
could hear it barking. But I didn't do anything out

580
00:36:36,039 --> 00:36:39,960
of the norm that a normal flesh and blood creature

581
00:36:40,000 --> 00:36:44,679
would do. I do believe in spiritual entities, and I

582
00:36:44,760 --> 00:36:47,639
do believe that maybe some of these cryptids do have

583
00:36:48,639 --> 00:36:53,760
some kind of paranormal behavior, But in this circumstance, I

584
00:36:53,760 --> 00:36:59,199
didn't witness or experience anything out of the usual. Basically

585
00:36:59,320 --> 00:37:03,679
just the normal flesh and blood got type of behavior.

586
00:37:04,079 --> 00:37:07,480
So there was definitely a creature that was physical that

587
00:37:07,599 --> 00:37:11,639
was following me. And growling at me. So no, no paranormal,

588
00:37:13,159 --> 00:37:14,039
nothing paranormal.

589
00:37:14,960 --> 00:37:18,000
Speaker 2: Well, it's a mixed bag. Some people see and experience

590
00:37:18,119 --> 00:37:21,199
things that convince them that the dog men they encounter,

591
00:37:21,960 --> 00:37:24,800
they're convinced that they must be spiritual beings from the ether.

592
00:37:25,079 --> 00:37:27,079
But then other people they're convinced that they have to

593
00:37:27,079 --> 00:37:30,360
be just flesh and blood creatures with no special abilities.

594
00:37:30,400 --> 00:37:33,119
So yeah, like I said, it's a mixed bag.

595
00:37:34,400 --> 00:37:39,440
Speaker 1: With what you just said, I mean, if dog men,

596
00:37:39,519 --> 00:37:43,440
if you know, if they're seen around Native American cemeteries

597
00:37:43,440 --> 00:37:45,639
and they're protecting that, I feel like that would be

598
00:37:45,679 --> 00:37:50,719
more of a spiritual entity because you hear that off

599
00:37:50,880 --> 00:37:56,000
over and over and over and no, no normal wildlife,

600
00:37:56,559 --> 00:38:01,719
wild animal would do that. That's just that is paranormal behavior.

601
00:38:01,760 --> 00:38:05,679
And you know, there is there obviously was a large

602
00:38:06,159 --> 00:38:10,760
Native American presence here, so like you know, maybe there

603
00:38:10,880 --> 00:38:14,480
was some sort of spiritual connection, but from what I experienced,

604
00:38:14,800 --> 00:38:20,760
I didn't experience anything unusual. But who knows, who knows?

605
00:38:21,719 --> 00:38:23,639
Speaker 2: Well, as you know, there are so many things about

606
00:38:23,639 --> 00:38:26,239
these guys that we just don't know. All we can

607
00:38:26,280 --> 00:38:28,679
do is guess at and we're never going to know

608
00:38:28,760 --> 00:38:31,880
more than likely. But that's just one of the many

609
00:38:31,920 --> 00:38:36,280
things that makes these guys so interesting. It really is. Now,

610
00:38:36,880 --> 00:38:39,880
let me qualify this by saying, I'm not being critical

611
00:38:39,920 --> 00:38:42,400
of you with this next question here. I'm just curious

612
00:38:42,440 --> 00:38:46,639
about this. Before you had that encounter, you said you

613
00:38:46,679 --> 00:38:50,760
already knew about dog men. With that in mind, why

614
00:38:50,760 --> 00:38:52,559
do you think it took you so long to connect

615
00:38:52,559 --> 00:38:56,599
the dots as that encounter was playing out and realize

616
00:38:56,800 --> 00:38:59,400
what it was right away the moment that you saw it.

617
00:39:00,360 --> 00:39:03,960
Speaker 1: Well, you know, I had briefly heard of dog man,

618
00:39:04,199 --> 00:39:07,159
Like I'm like one of those people that has to

619
00:39:07,159 --> 00:39:10,360
see it to believe it. I had heard well, living

620
00:39:10,360 --> 00:39:14,360
in Washington, I had heard many bigfoot encounters and stuff

621
00:39:14,400 --> 00:39:18,880
like that, and I really was skeptical, especially studying wildlife biology.

622
00:39:19,039 --> 00:39:21,920
So I have a I just have a scientific based mind,

623
00:39:21,920 --> 00:39:24,760
and I try to be skeptical until I can find

624
00:39:24,800 --> 00:39:27,639
some sort of proof that leads me to believe that

625
00:39:27,760 --> 00:39:31,599
maybe there is something out there. So I studied. Uh,

626
00:39:31,760 --> 00:39:34,599
I've I've had close encounters with the wolves. I know

627
00:39:34,679 --> 00:39:37,039
what they sound like, I know what their footprints look like.

628
00:39:37,079 --> 00:39:39,360
I can I can tell you the difference between a

629
00:39:39,400 --> 00:39:43,599
wolf scat and I'm fox scat, and I've also been

630
00:39:43,679 --> 00:39:46,960
around plenty of coyotes. I when I was in the

631
00:39:47,000 --> 00:39:49,440
Wilderness school, I did this little research thing where I

632
00:39:49,440 --> 00:39:52,480
camouflaged myself and I sat in the bushes along a

633
00:39:52,559 --> 00:39:55,039
coyote trail and I would just hide and I'd wait

634
00:39:55,039 --> 00:39:57,039
for the coyotes come by. And there were a few

635
00:39:57,079 --> 00:39:59,960
times where they literally and they knew I was there,

636
00:40:00,119 --> 00:40:02,400
and they came up right to me and sniffed me

637
00:40:02,440 --> 00:40:07,679
and found me. I've also fed a coyote out of

638
00:40:07,679 --> 00:40:11,559
my hand. I was doing park work in Washington State

639
00:40:11,559 --> 00:40:13,800
and there's this park and every once in a whiles

640
00:40:14,039 --> 00:40:17,679
while you'd see coyotes when you're shutting down the park.

641
00:40:17,880 --> 00:40:20,000
And I used to always have bags of beef jerky,

642
00:40:20,039 --> 00:40:21,679
so every once in a while there's some jerky towards

643
00:40:21,719 --> 00:40:24,920
the coyotes, and eventually they came really close. After a while,

644
00:40:24,960 --> 00:40:28,719
they got close enough that they'd eat out of my hands. So,

645
00:40:28,760 --> 00:40:32,039
to make a long story short, I've had a lot

646
00:40:32,039 --> 00:40:36,400
of experience with coyotes, foxes, and wolves, and this was

647
00:40:36,480 --> 00:40:40,599
a This wasn't a coyote or a wolf. There are

648
00:40:40,599 --> 00:40:44,880
no wolves in New Jersey. This wasn't a desiccated dog,

649
00:40:45,519 --> 00:40:49,119
it's just the animal behavior that it displayed was just

650
00:40:49,559 --> 00:40:53,320
totally out of the norm of any canine I've ever experienced.

651
00:40:53,320 --> 00:40:56,519
But my intuition told me right away it was a canine.

652
00:40:56,559 --> 00:40:59,440
I could tell by the gral, I could tell by

653
00:40:59,480 --> 00:41:02,119
the bark. And then when it when I it was

654
00:41:02,159 --> 00:41:06,119
walking past my door and I was trying to basically

655
00:41:06,480 --> 00:41:09,559
listen and hear and see everything that I could, Uh,

656
00:41:09,760 --> 00:41:12,320
I was trying to see what was stalking me. I

657
00:41:12,360 --> 00:41:16,079
was able to see the outline of it basically, and

658
00:41:16,280 --> 00:41:19,239
it was it looked like a canine. It was as

659
00:41:19,280 --> 00:41:23,119
big as a bear, looked like a canine. And my

660
00:41:23,280 --> 00:41:27,320
intuition when like, all right, if this isn't a wolf,

661
00:41:27,320 --> 00:41:29,800
this isn't coyote, this isn't a dog, this has got

662
00:41:29,800 --> 00:41:33,360
to be a dog man. Because you know, I am

663
00:41:33,480 --> 00:41:37,119
very open minded. I don't believe humans have discovered everything

664
00:41:37,159 --> 00:41:41,119
on this planet. I think there's a lot unknown. So

665
00:41:41,840 --> 00:41:46,280
with my open mindedness, I was I just did the

666
00:41:46,320 --> 00:41:49,760
process of elimination. What else could it be? A dog man?

667
00:41:51,280 --> 00:41:56,000
So also the dreams that I had, I didn't even

668
00:41:56,000 --> 00:41:59,320
really like I had the experience that like in the

669
00:41:59,360 --> 00:42:01,639
back of my I was thinking maybe it's a dog man.

670
00:42:02,239 --> 00:42:07,480
But the dreams I had every single night were so vivid,

671
00:42:07,719 --> 00:42:10,920
and basically I was seeing a wolf look through my window,

672
00:42:11,159 --> 00:42:14,000
standing up on two legs, which was really strange. It

673
00:42:14,079 --> 00:42:16,960
was only a dream, but that only made me feel

674
00:42:17,760 --> 00:42:19,320
I don't know, I don't know. It made me feel

675
00:42:19,320 --> 00:42:23,360
like it had to have been a creature that no

676
00:42:23,400 --> 00:42:28,239
one really knows. So yeah, with my experience and my

677
00:42:28,400 --> 00:42:31,920
encryptid interests, I kind of alluded to the fact that

678
00:42:32,159 --> 00:42:34,559
it could possibly be a dog man. And my intuition,

679
00:42:34,800 --> 00:42:37,440
which is usually right, told me it was a dog man.

680
00:42:37,719 --> 00:42:41,840
So like, I think, without a doubt, that's what I saw.

681
00:42:42,880 --> 00:42:46,000
Speaker 2: That makes two of us. And you're just being pragmatic

682
00:42:46,039 --> 00:42:48,639
by just not jumping to the conclusion that it was

683
00:42:48,679 --> 00:42:51,239
a dog man. They gave you every reason to jump

684
00:42:51,280 --> 00:42:54,599
to that conclusion. But yeah, you're just being practical by

685
00:42:54,679 --> 00:42:58,639
not doing that. And that's understandable. That's respectable. It really is.

686
00:42:59,480 --> 00:43:01,800
Speaker 1: And that's when I started like looking into the subject.

687
00:43:01,840 --> 00:43:05,960
I was like, I, my intuition is saying that this

688
00:43:06,000 --> 00:43:11,119
is not a normal creature, and I started looking into

689
00:43:11,119 --> 00:43:13,559
the dog man subject, and that's where I found your podcast,

690
00:43:13,639 --> 00:43:18,159
and that's where I started hearing encounters, and to my surprise,

691
00:43:18,199 --> 00:43:22,320
there had been other encounters and sightings in the same county,

692
00:43:22,920 --> 00:43:25,880
let alone, like not even a few miles away. So like,

693
00:43:26,280 --> 00:43:29,239
after having that experience and hearing those encounters, are really

694
00:43:29,360 --> 00:43:31,480
kind of verified in my head that what I saw

695
00:43:31,639 --> 00:43:35,239
was definitely a dog man, especially after hearing my parents

696
00:43:35,760 --> 00:43:37,960
see these weird canines in the back of our yard

697
00:43:37,960 --> 00:43:40,599
and stuff. So if there is a dog man, I

698
00:43:40,599 --> 00:43:42,480
know there's more than one.

699
00:43:42,599 --> 00:43:45,199
Speaker 2: And that gets me. The fact both of your parents

700
00:43:45,199 --> 00:43:47,679
have had dog me and encounters of their own, but

701
00:43:47,760 --> 00:43:50,159
they still don't want to cross that line and admit

702
00:43:50,519 --> 00:43:52,960
that they're out there unbelievable.

703
00:43:53,840 --> 00:43:56,800
Speaker 1: I know, I know it's unfortunate, but you know, what

704
00:43:56,840 --> 00:43:58,559
are you going to do. You can't teach it old

705
00:43:58,599 --> 00:43:59,480
dog new tricks.

706
00:44:00,119 --> 00:44:03,599
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's true. That's a good point. You said that

707
00:44:03,639 --> 00:44:06,159
you had those bad night tiers for two weeks after

708
00:44:06,199 --> 00:44:09,079
you had that encounter. Have you had any sense?

709
00:44:10,280 --> 00:44:15,320
Speaker 1: Uh no, not. So Basically, after I had that encounter,

710
00:44:15,360 --> 00:44:17,559
I had night terrors all the way up until I

711
00:44:17,599 --> 00:44:22,880
moved out, and eventually I moved in with a new girl,

712
00:44:23,079 --> 00:44:26,039
which was great because I had just gotten out of

713
00:44:26,039 --> 00:44:30,320
this terrible relationship, and I was I'm an arborist, so

714
00:44:30,519 --> 00:44:35,199
I was the lead arborous and trainer for my company,

715
00:44:35,239 --> 00:44:37,880
and they were like, oh, there's this new girl that's

716
00:44:37,920 --> 00:44:40,199
gonna be working there, and I was training her and

717
00:44:40,199 --> 00:44:42,360
we hit it off and ended up dating for years

718
00:44:42,400 --> 00:44:43,920
after and she's still one of my best friends in

719
00:44:43,960 --> 00:44:50,239
the whole entire world. But yeah, no, I didn't think so, oh.

720
00:44:50,119 --> 00:44:53,840
Speaker 2: Thank goodness for that. You heard the same call several

721
00:44:53,880 --> 00:44:56,440
times after the night when you had your encounter. But

722
00:44:56,760 --> 00:44:59,119
how close were those new calls to you when you

723
00:44:59,199 --> 00:45:00,199
heard them?

724
00:45:00,599 --> 00:45:07,320
Speaker 1: All? Right, So these fields are probably like one acre each.

725
00:45:07,360 --> 00:45:09,880
Field that's by my house is probably about it an

726
00:45:09,960 --> 00:45:15,880
acre each. So when it crossed through my neighbor's yard

727
00:45:15,960 --> 00:45:18,760
into the green belt into my yard, it had it

728
00:45:18,840 --> 00:45:22,960
was probably forty feet away from me. So I'm looking

729
00:45:23,000 --> 00:45:28,119
at a shadow just across the grass of my yard.

730
00:45:28,159 --> 00:45:31,760
It like cross in front of this pinoak, and that

731
00:45:31,840 --> 00:45:34,920
had to be forty feet away, and it went another

732
00:45:35,119 --> 00:45:38,000
forty fifty feet into the field. So I had a

733
00:45:38,039 --> 00:45:42,280
good one hundred feet of it crossing into my property,

734
00:45:42,320 --> 00:45:45,559
passing the pin oak, and then another fifty feet into

735
00:45:45,559 --> 00:45:48,559
the field. So it was close it was close. I

736
00:45:48,559 --> 00:45:51,320
could hear its foot feet hitting the ground. I could

737
00:45:51,360 --> 00:45:55,519
hear it breathing. When it was in the field, it

738
00:45:55,559 --> 00:46:01,000
was probably seventy five feet away tops. I could see it, uh,

739
00:46:01,559 --> 00:46:04,679
sitting like a canine like you know how dogs sit

740
00:46:05,280 --> 00:46:08,079
and they're just like you're like, good boy, sit like

741
00:46:08,159 --> 00:46:12,159
it was sitting like that my mind's eye. It was

742
00:46:12,199 --> 00:46:15,119
sitting like that facing me. I couldn't really tell because

743
00:46:15,159 --> 00:46:18,400
it was just barely silhouetted, like you could see that

744
00:46:18,480 --> 00:46:22,400
there was like this dark canine. But when it was

745
00:46:22,440 --> 00:46:27,159
sitting up, it looked like it was about four five

746
00:46:27,239 --> 00:46:30,480
feet off the ground, but from seventy five feet away

747
00:46:30,480 --> 00:46:33,920
in the darkest hard to gauge, but that's how far

748
00:46:33,960 --> 00:46:37,280
it was. And that's where it started. That's when I

749
00:46:37,320 --> 00:46:40,800
whistled to it and it started growling, did a growl

750
00:46:41,599 --> 00:46:45,079
it it growled and the growl turned. The growl turned

751
00:46:45,119 --> 00:46:48,639
into a bark, which turned into a howl. It was very,

752
00:46:48,760 --> 00:46:51,880
very bizarre. I've never heard of canine do making noise

753
00:46:51,960 --> 00:46:54,280
like that, but it was really obviously it was a canine.

754
00:46:55,239 --> 00:46:57,480
Speaker 2: Yeah, I was way too close for comfort that night,

755
00:46:57,519 --> 00:47:00,000
it sounds like, but I guess I didn't make myself

756
00:47:00,039 --> 00:47:02,679
so very clear, and I apologize for that. No, when

757
00:47:02,719 --> 00:47:05,079
I was asking how close those calls were Tea, I

758
00:47:05,159 --> 00:47:07,119
was talking about the new ones, the calls that you

759
00:47:07,199 --> 00:47:10,400
heard after the night that you had that first encounter.

760
00:47:12,679 --> 00:47:14,480
Speaker 1: Uh, what do you mean by the calls I heard

761
00:47:14,960 --> 00:47:17,199
after I heard that encounter When.

762
00:47:17,079 --> 00:47:18,920
Speaker 2: We spoke for the first time, I thought you said

763
00:47:18,920 --> 00:47:22,559
that you heard other calls maybe in the distance after

764
00:47:22,599 --> 00:47:25,679
that night when you had that first encounter, like maybe

765
00:47:25,719 --> 00:47:27,679
it was coming back around or something.

766
00:47:28,000 --> 00:47:31,159
Speaker 1: Yeah, I heard it a couple more times, very very

767
00:47:32,880 --> 00:47:35,880
not often. I heard it maybe one or two times after,

768
00:47:35,960 --> 00:47:38,000
and then I never heard it again. I also heard

769
00:47:38,039 --> 00:47:41,800
it one or two times beforehand, but I didn't really

770
00:47:41,800 --> 00:47:44,800
know what to think beforehand, and I actually forgot about

771
00:47:44,840 --> 00:47:47,920
that until you asked me this question. But yeah, I

772
00:47:47,960 --> 00:47:52,320
heard it around literally like one or two nights after,

773
00:47:53,119 --> 00:47:57,239
and it was just basically the same growl bark that

774
00:47:57,320 --> 00:48:01,039
I heard. It was weird because, like I swear, I

775
00:48:01,079 --> 00:48:03,599
heard that on the same gral bark before or even

776
00:48:03,679 --> 00:48:06,679
had this encounter, and that kind of like set and

777
00:48:06,719 --> 00:48:09,159
alarm in my head. But yeah, afterwards, I heard it

778
00:48:09,199 --> 00:48:14,079
like literally once or twice. That's it. And then I

779
00:48:14,119 --> 00:48:16,079
never heard it again, but I did have those like

780
00:48:16,599 --> 00:48:18,800
every night afterwards. I would feel like it was looking

781
00:48:18,800 --> 00:48:22,360
through my window, which was weird, and I had no

782
00:48:22,480 --> 00:48:24,440
idea that that was like a common thing that dog

783
00:48:24,519 --> 00:48:27,840
men do until I started listening to your podcast. It

784
00:48:27,880 --> 00:48:30,400
was weird because, like you know, I had this experience

785
00:48:30,480 --> 00:48:32,719
and I didn't know anything about the dog man topic.

786
00:48:32,800 --> 00:48:34,960
I just heard about it, and I was very skeptical

787
00:48:35,000 --> 00:48:38,000
of the whole entire situation. So then I have this

788
00:48:38,159 --> 00:48:41,719
experience and I didn't really know what to think about it.

789
00:48:41,760 --> 00:48:44,960
I didn't know how to feel about the whole situation.

790
00:48:45,079 --> 00:48:47,360
But it gave me nightmares and I was terrified, and

791
00:48:47,639 --> 00:48:51,679
my nightmares were of this like crazy big ten foot

792
00:48:51,760 --> 00:48:55,320
canine looking ducking down standing on two legs, looking through

793
00:48:55,320 --> 00:49:00,239
my window, and like the picture of it basically, if

794
00:49:00,239 --> 00:49:04,320
you could, less cartoonish, but like it looked like a

795
00:49:04,440 --> 00:49:07,480
star Fox with a longer star Fox from the video game,

796
00:49:07,519 --> 00:49:11,519
with a longer snout and bigger ears, basically the typical werewolf.

797
00:49:12,199 --> 00:49:17,840
But yeah, I haven't heard the noise since, but I

798
00:49:17,840 --> 00:49:22,280
haven't been living here. I moved out shortly after, and

799
00:49:23,639 --> 00:49:25,159
i'd been living in New Jersey for a while, and

800
00:49:25,199 --> 00:49:27,039
then I moved back to Oregon. So this is my

801
00:49:27,400 --> 00:49:31,559
I've been back for about a week now and I'm

802
00:49:31,599 --> 00:49:34,920
in the same place, so I'm keeping my ears open.

803
00:49:35,360 --> 00:49:38,400
But I have not heard anything since. And I only

804
00:49:38,400 --> 00:49:41,719
heard it like briefly, like maybe one or two times

805
00:49:41,800 --> 00:49:47,599
after the fact. That was sort of while I was

806
00:49:47,800 --> 00:49:50,280
just beginning to like come to the grips that maybe

807
00:49:50,280 --> 00:49:52,280
I'd seen a dog man. It took me a little

808
00:49:52,280 --> 00:49:55,639
while to like really accept that fact until I started

809
00:49:55,639 --> 00:49:59,239
listening to your show and Encounters. Like I was trying

810
00:49:59,280 --> 00:50:01,800
to say, I didn't realize that that was a frequent

811
00:50:01,840 --> 00:50:04,960
thing that dogmen did, was look through windows at people,

812
00:50:05,280 --> 00:50:07,639
until I started listening to your podcasts. But before I

813
00:50:07,679 --> 00:50:10,840
ever even had that realization, I was having bad dreams

814
00:50:10,840 --> 00:50:13,639
of this canine looking at me through the windows and

815
00:50:13,679 --> 00:50:17,920
it was really unsettling. And I'm I'm very comfortable in

816
00:50:17,920 --> 00:50:20,719
the outdoors. Like I said, I've been on I've been

817
00:50:20,760 --> 00:50:23,840
a Prince survival instructor for fifteen years. I've been on

818
00:50:23,920 --> 00:50:27,280
survival trips out in the bush in Washington State with

819
00:50:27,320 --> 00:50:30,039
nothing but my hands. The longest survival trip I did

820
00:50:30,119 --> 00:50:33,400
was eight weeks with nothing but my hands, and you know,

821
00:50:33,400 --> 00:50:35,800
I spent a lot of time in the forest and

822
00:50:35,960 --> 00:50:42,079
I went a sleeping bag just on the ground. So yeah,

823
00:50:42,320 --> 00:50:45,760
this was a new subject and a new fear that

824
00:50:45,840 --> 00:50:50,119
I had an experience, and so usually I'm comfortable with

825
00:50:50,199 --> 00:50:53,039
the outdoors, but after having that experience, I was really

826
00:50:53,079 --> 00:50:57,000
shooking and I would lock the door. You know, I'm

827
00:50:57,039 --> 00:50:58,719
out in the middle of nowhere, so there's really no

828
00:50:58,920 --> 00:51:01,280
reason to lock the door, but I just had a

829
00:51:01,320 --> 00:51:04,280
feeling that something could open it and come in and

830
00:51:04,480 --> 00:51:07,079
eat me. It was really unsettling. I don't know if

831
00:51:07,079 --> 00:51:11,760
anyone's had a feeling like that before, but if they have,

832
00:51:12,039 --> 00:51:16,599
they might understand the idea of something with claws opening

833
00:51:16,719 --> 00:51:18,840
up the door and coming in. But yeah, I was

834
00:51:19,719 --> 00:51:23,639
worried that there's a dog man that would eat me,

835
00:51:24,400 --> 00:51:26,679
and I just would have these vivid dreams of it

836
00:51:26,760 --> 00:51:29,840
opening up my door with its raccoon like hands and

837
00:51:29,880 --> 00:51:33,119
coming in. And ever since I moved out, I never

838
00:51:33,159 --> 00:51:36,000
had that fear again, and since I've been back, I

839
00:51:36,039 --> 00:51:39,599
haven't had any fear since, so it's kind of strange.

840
00:51:39,639 --> 00:51:43,079
But now that there's a bunch of fresh snow on

841
00:51:43,119 --> 00:51:45,079
the ground, I'm definitely trying to go tracking.

842
00:51:46,199 --> 00:51:48,480
Speaker 2: Well, it goes without saying, I'm so glad you're able

843
00:51:48,519 --> 00:51:52,119
to enjoy the woods again, Thank goodness for that. That

844
00:51:52,360 --> 00:51:56,440
does make me wonder, though, almost all the things that

845
00:51:56,480 --> 00:51:58,719
you've done in the woods you did before you had

846
00:51:58,800 --> 00:52:02,320
that dog man encounter, talking about being an arborist and

847
00:52:02,320 --> 00:52:05,320
going to the survival school and everything else like that,

848
00:52:06,199 --> 00:52:07,960
if you would have had that dogged me an encounter

849
00:52:08,039 --> 00:52:10,239
before you did any of those many things that you've

850
00:52:10,280 --> 00:52:13,679
done in the woods, you think there's a possibility that

851
00:52:14,599 --> 00:52:17,119
encounter would have derailed your interest in going out and

852
00:52:17,159 --> 00:52:18,039
doing those things.

853
00:52:19,800 --> 00:52:23,599
Speaker 1: Oh man, that's a great question. I don't know because

854
00:52:23,639 --> 00:52:26,360
I was so young when I started that. I was eighteen,

855
00:52:27,119 --> 00:52:33,400
and one of my first experiences in the Pacific Northwest

856
00:52:34,639 --> 00:52:38,039
at such a young age involved the cryptid experience. It

857
00:52:38,079 --> 00:52:42,280
didn't happen to me, but someone in the wilderness school

858
00:52:42,280 --> 00:52:45,519
that I went to had a a run in with

859
00:52:45,559 --> 00:52:49,039
a bigfoot the first night that we were camping on

860
00:52:49,079 --> 00:52:51,320
the property at the wilderness school that I went to,

861
00:52:51,559 --> 00:52:55,960
and they left the program the next day. So that

862
00:52:55,960 --> 00:53:01,159
didn't determine from continuing the wilderness School. In fact, I

863
00:53:01,599 --> 00:53:04,960
kind of thought the person was lying I didn't really

864
00:53:04,960 --> 00:53:07,039
know what to think at the time. I'd never really

865
00:53:07,039 --> 00:53:12,079
even heard of bigfoot. But I don't think so. I think.

866
00:53:12,360 --> 00:53:14,880
I think I believe we are all part of nature,

867
00:53:15,320 --> 00:53:19,480
and nature it's so therapeutic, important and important for us

868
00:53:19,480 --> 00:53:22,400
to have a connection to nature. I don't think anything

869
00:53:23,840 --> 00:53:26,639
could or would deter me from that. You know, if

870
00:53:26,679 --> 00:53:28,880
it's our time to go, it's our time to go.

871
00:53:28,920 --> 00:53:32,599
And I'm trying to accept that right now to help

872
00:53:32,679 --> 00:53:35,119
with the fear when I'm out at night or when

873
00:53:35,119 --> 00:53:37,440
I'm out in the forest alone, because like anytime i'm

874
00:53:37,440 --> 00:53:40,199
out in the forest one, I do have my guard up,

875
00:53:40,440 --> 00:53:43,920
you know, after these experiences, Like it's not like I'm

876
00:53:44,000 --> 00:53:50,639
roaming through the forest like lollygagger around joyful, not just

877
00:53:50,679 --> 00:53:53,400
with no wit, just I keep my wits to me

878
00:53:53,440 --> 00:53:57,159
and I'm always paying attention, you know. I you never

879
00:53:57,320 --> 00:54:00,320
know what can ever happen. Anything can happen when you're

880
00:54:00,360 --> 00:54:02,480
out in the forest, so it's always good to have

881
00:54:02,519 --> 00:54:06,920
your guard up to some extent. But I feel like

882
00:54:06,960 --> 00:54:10,280
I would have still done the wilderness school, but it's

883
00:54:10,360 --> 00:54:12,639
really hard to say. I don't know. If I was

884
00:54:12,679 --> 00:54:15,840
younger and I had that experience, who knows how I

885
00:54:15,840 --> 00:54:19,199
would have reacted. But right now, at this age, I'm

886
00:54:19,239 --> 00:54:22,000
thirty six, I'm not going to let anything keep me

887
00:54:22,039 --> 00:54:23,199
out at the forest.

888
00:54:24,480 --> 00:54:27,639
Speaker 2: Good Man, And I'm so glad it didn't happen before

889
00:54:27,639 --> 00:54:30,320
you did all those things, because, yeah, and by the

890
00:54:30,360 --> 00:54:32,119
odd chance it would have frightened you out of the

891
00:54:32,119 --> 00:54:34,920
woods for good. That would have been a really big shame.

892
00:54:35,360 --> 00:54:38,360
It really would have been. You've had more than one

893
00:54:38,440 --> 00:54:41,960
sasquatch encounter, Wiley, in addition to your dog me an encounter.

894
00:54:42,400 --> 00:54:45,079
Please tell us about the sasquatch encounter that shook you

895
00:54:45,119 --> 00:54:46,119
at most.

896
00:54:47,400 --> 00:54:53,000
Speaker 1: Okay, so I've I've had a few sasquatch encounters. And

897
00:54:53,559 --> 00:54:56,760
it's funny because when I told you about them, you

898
00:54:56,800 --> 00:54:59,800
said that you think that I'm on their radar, which

899
00:55:00,920 --> 00:55:03,199
I don't think I'm on the radar. I think I've

900
00:55:03,239 --> 00:55:06,800
just spent a significant amount of time in the outdoors

901
00:55:06,880 --> 00:55:09,320
because for the amount of time that I've spent the outdoors,

902
00:55:09,360 --> 00:55:12,960
I've had very few encounters and like they're pretty minimal.

903
00:55:13,440 --> 00:55:16,760
They weren't anything crazy. But like, the scariest encounter I

904
00:55:16,800 --> 00:55:19,199
had with the bigfoot was when I was living in

905
00:55:19,360 --> 00:55:24,920
Washington State, basically in Capital Forest. Capital Forest is a

906
00:55:25,039 --> 00:55:29,119
it's a forest near Olympia, Washington that's like basically on

907
00:55:29,199 --> 00:55:33,039
outskirts of the Olympic Peninsula. So it's a it's a

908
00:55:33,079 --> 00:55:37,079
big forest. There's elk, the salmon run goes through the

909
00:55:37,159 --> 00:55:42,199
creeks all throughout the forest. There's mountain lions, black bear,

910
00:55:43,480 --> 00:55:49,199
and you know the occasional bigfoot siding. So I was

911
00:55:49,800 --> 00:55:53,840
my landlord was the grandson of Charles Limberg, which is

912
00:55:53,920 --> 00:55:55,639
kind of cool. I don't know if anyone's heard of

913
00:55:55,679 --> 00:55:58,960
Charles Limberg, but I know the whole Limberg family. Due

914
00:55:59,000 --> 00:56:02,760
to living on this guy's property, he ended up being

915
00:56:02,760 --> 00:56:05,000
a really close friend. We still talk to this day.

916
00:56:05,039 --> 00:56:08,519
In fact, I just moved back to New Jersey and

917
00:56:08,599 --> 00:56:10,199
right before I moved back, I was staying on his

918
00:56:10,280 --> 00:56:13,679
property again for a few weeks just before I left.

919
00:56:13,920 --> 00:56:17,960
But anyway, the Lindberg son, I'm on his property or

920
00:56:18,360 --> 00:56:21,639
Limberg grandson, I'm on his property, and he's got eleven

921
00:56:21,679 --> 00:56:28,119
acres in Washington State. It's really uh rural. It's a

922
00:56:28,239 --> 00:56:32,800
pretty bumble out there. There's a lot of animals, and

923
00:56:33,159 --> 00:56:35,840
his property's kind of open, like there's a there's a

924
00:56:36,199 --> 00:56:38,320
you know, he's got a grassy meadow with a garden,

925
00:56:38,840 --> 00:56:41,519
and like, at the end of the grassy meadow is

926
00:56:42,440 --> 00:56:45,519
the tree line, and I found a game trail that

927
00:56:45,599 --> 00:56:47,800
led into the tree line, and I had a hammock.

928
00:56:48,320 --> 00:56:51,920
So I set up the hammock. And because I would

929
00:56:51,920 --> 00:56:57,719
see Elk every week driving back from the property going

930
00:56:57,719 --> 00:57:01,679
into Olympia, and so I thought, maybe this could be

931
00:57:01,719 --> 00:57:04,400
an Elk game trail. I dodn't really know, but it

932
00:57:04,440 --> 00:57:06,639
was a game trail for sure. So I got this

933
00:57:06,679 --> 00:57:09,039
little four foot step ladder and I hung my aut

934
00:57:10,000 --> 00:57:12,199
hammock tent that I just got. I got this cool

935
00:57:12,480 --> 00:57:16,719
hammock that had like a mosquito net and a rain fly,

936
00:57:17,800 --> 00:57:20,320
and I hung it up seven feet above this game trail.

937
00:57:21,039 --> 00:57:26,039
So I ended up falling asleep, and at some point

938
00:57:26,079 --> 00:57:28,239
throughout the night, I was woken up by something like

939
00:57:28,320 --> 00:57:31,480
poking me, and I clearly woke up. It was as

940
00:57:31,519 --> 00:57:33,400
if something like your friend was poking you, and it

941
00:57:33,440 --> 00:57:35,960
was like wake up, wake up. And I woke up,

942
00:57:35,960 --> 00:57:38,280
and I kind of like was in a daze. I

943
00:57:38,360 --> 00:57:40,679
was in a deep sleep, and I woke up to

944
00:57:40,800 --> 00:57:43,800
my hammock swaying back and forth, and I could hear

945
00:57:43,880 --> 00:57:48,119
something like close by, basically probably the thing that was

946
00:57:48,119 --> 00:57:51,039
poking me. But I made sure to hang my hammock

947
00:57:51,239 --> 00:57:53,880
like high enough above the ground that if at elk

948
00:57:54,199 --> 00:57:58,679
with antlers walked on this game trail, its antlers wouldn't

949
00:57:58,719 --> 00:58:01,000
hit me. It was a good steven feet above the ground.

950
00:58:01,880 --> 00:58:04,719
So anyway, I was woken up to something poking me,

951
00:58:04,800 --> 00:58:09,000
and I'm swaying back and forth, and at that moment,

952
00:58:09,079 --> 00:58:13,599
my heart sunk. I was like freaked out, like what

953
00:58:14,800 --> 00:58:17,920
the heck was that? And I could hear something breathing,

954
00:58:18,400 --> 00:58:21,440
and all of a sudden, I tried to unzip my hammock,

955
00:58:22,119 --> 00:58:24,599
and when I'm unzipping it, it was really loud. I

956
00:58:24,639 --> 00:58:26,199
tried to do as quiet as possible, and it was

957
00:58:26,320 --> 00:58:30,639
just like I was like no, And as soon as

958
00:58:30,639 --> 00:58:36,199
I unzipped it, whatever poked me stamped his ground, stamped

959
00:58:36,199 --> 00:58:40,320
his foot on the ground and went wow, like just

960
00:58:40,440 --> 00:58:43,519
yelled at me. And I at that moment, I had

961
00:58:43,519 --> 00:58:47,199
a fight or flight feeling, and I knew I had

962
00:58:47,239 --> 00:58:50,719
to get out of there, so I I tried to

963
00:58:50,760 --> 00:58:52,960
make my way out of the hammock, and I remember

964
00:58:53,920 --> 00:58:57,079
getting out of it and grabbing it like monkey bars

965
00:58:57,119 --> 00:59:00,079
and swinging and then trying to let go and I

966
00:59:00,079 --> 00:59:01,800
put my feet couldn't touch the ground, and I end

967
00:59:01,880 --> 00:59:07,760
up landing on my behind. And as I was walking

968
00:59:07,920 --> 00:59:10,639
like out of the forest, really really scared, knowing that

969
00:59:10,679 --> 00:59:13,960
there's something behind me. I was close enough to the

970
00:59:13,960 --> 00:59:16,440
house that I lived on and I had seven roommates

971
00:59:16,480 --> 00:59:18,320
at the time, and one of my roommates that lived

972
00:59:18,320 --> 00:59:20,079
in the basement was a gamer, and he would say

973
00:59:20,159 --> 00:59:21,840
up really late playing video games, and he had a

974
00:59:21,840 --> 00:59:25,400
pitple and he let his pipple out as I was

975
00:59:25,440 --> 00:59:27,559
coming out of the forest, and the piple was like

976
00:59:28,480 --> 00:59:30,840
it was a fearless dog. It would chase mountain lion,

977
00:59:30,880 --> 00:59:32,960
it would chase barry. This guy would let the door

978
00:59:33,000 --> 00:59:34,559
open at two in the morning and the dog would

979
00:59:34,599 --> 00:59:36,800
just chase animals into the forest and then come back

980
00:59:36,840 --> 00:59:40,079
when it was ready. So like I'm coming out of

981
00:59:40,079 --> 00:59:41,840
the forest and he opens the door and I'm like,

982
00:59:41,920 --> 00:59:45,920
oh no the dog, and the dog immediately noticed the

983
00:59:45,920 --> 00:59:49,039
commotion started like kind of grunting and walking towards me

984
00:59:49,079 --> 00:59:51,239
in like an aggressive sort of way. And I'm like

985
00:59:52,119 --> 00:59:55,360
talking to the dog like easy boy, easy, it's me.

986
00:59:55,880 --> 00:59:58,880
It's me Wiley, Like I'm saying that, and the dog

987
00:59:59,000 --> 01:00:02,840
tucked its tail its legs and started whimpering and decided

988
01:00:02,880 --> 01:00:05,800
to come up to me, and it put its head

989
01:00:05,960 --> 01:00:09,679
in between my legs and escorted me to the front door,

990
01:00:09,920 --> 01:00:13,559
which was just amazing, honestly, Like I was terrified and

991
01:00:13,599 --> 01:00:16,280
knew there's something in the forest, and the dog reacted

992
01:00:16,360 --> 01:00:20,800
instantly to what was back there. I've never seen this

993
01:00:20,880 --> 01:00:23,559
dog cower and fear like this. It was a pit

994
01:00:23,679 --> 01:00:27,159
bull that was fearless, but yeah, escorted me back to

995
01:00:27,199 --> 01:00:29,039
the house and I went inside and I left the

996
01:00:29,119 --> 01:00:36,639
dog outside, and that was probably the scariest asquatch experience

997
01:00:36,679 --> 01:00:43,599
I had. I don't know what that was. I kind

998
01:00:43,639 --> 01:00:47,199
of thought about it many many times after the fact,

999
01:00:47,239 --> 01:00:49,639
and I came to the conclusion that there is nothing

1000
01:00:49,639 --> 01:00:51,719
it could have been other than a bigfoot due to

1001
01:00:51,760 --> 01:00:55,159
the fact there are tons and tons of bigfoot sightings

1002
01:00:55,239 --> 01:00:59,719
that come out of the Capitol Forest, and I don't

1003
01:00:59,760 --> 01:01:01,920
think I think I would have known it if it

1004
01:01:02,000 --> 01:01:05,920
was an elk If it was elk Antler's kind of

1005
01:01:05,960 --> 01:01:09,039
brushing against me, like what I felt were fingers poking

1006
01:01:09,079 --> 01:01:12,280
me and what I heard was a yell on its stomp,

1007
01:01:12,480 --> 01:01:14,760
and just the fact I don't think a dog would

1008
01:01:14,840 --> 01:01:18,320
cower like it did if there was an elk or something.

1009
01:01:18,320 --> 01:01:23,039
An elk usually traveling packs, They're not usually walking around

1010
01:01:23,039 --> 01:01:26,559
the forest alone. But that was the scariest bigfoot encounter.

1011
01:01:27,000 --> 01:01:29,679
It wasn't the most vivid bigfoot encounter I had. I've

1012
01:01:29,880 --> 01:01:32,840
I've actually seen one face to face in Florida, and

1013
01:01:32,880 --> 01:01:38,239
I saw I heard one doing vocalizations in Olympic Peninsula

1014
01:01:38,280 --> 01:01:41,239
and then I got I saw it at the very

1015
01:01:41,280 --> 01:01:45,159
top of the ridge, silhouetted, and it ducked down when

1016
01:01:45,159 --> 01:01:48,280
I saw it. But so I've had multiple big foot encounters,

1017
01:01:48,280 --> 01:01:51,559
but for the amount of time I spend in the forest,

1018
01:01:52,400 --> 01:01:55,519
those encounters are far and few between. But I think

1019
01:01:55,519 --> 01:01:57,760
they're out there, and I've seen footprints, and I've seen

1020
01:01:57,920 --> 01:02:01,719
plenty of sign For example, I seeing trees that are

1021
01:02:02,119 --> 01:02:06,800
flipped upside down with their roots exposed. I've seen that

1022
01:02:07,199 --> 01:02:11,760
probably ten different times hiking throughout the forest in Washington State.

1023
01:02:12,800 --> 01:02:16,400
Speaker 2: Yeah, after having all those experiences with sasquatch, you're definitely

1024
01:02:16,440 --> 01:02:17,840
on the radar in my opinion.

1025
01:02:19,159 --> 01:02:20,920
Speaker 1: What do you mean by that? Pick? What do you

1026
01:02:20,960 --> 01:02:24,360
mean I'm on the radar? I don't think so. Well.

1027
01:02:24,400 --> 01:02:27,800
Speaker 2: It seems like when someone keeps on having encounters with Sasquatch,

1028
01:02:27,840 --> 01:02:29,880
it's almost like they tend to just know when you're

1029
01:02:29,880 --> 01:02:32,760
in their area, and it seems like for certain people

1030
01:02:32,800 --> 01:02:35,239
they just try to seek you out. Not all the time,

1031
01:02:35,760 --> 01:02:38,000
but when you have that many encounters, it sure does

1032
01:02:38,079 --> 01:02:41,599
seem like they're trying to, at least to some capacity,

1033
01:02:41,760 --> 01:02:44,960
seek you out, and that's why you keep on having experiences.

1034
01:02:45,519 --> 01:02:48,800
Speaker 1: Well, I think like for the amount of time that

1035
01:02:48,840 --> 01:02:52,079
I've spent in the forest, the three encounters that I've had,

1036
01:02:52,559 --> 01:02:55,159
they were all in different places. One was in the

1037
01:02:55,159 --> 01:02:57,679
Olympic Peninsula, one was in Capitol Forest, and then one

1038
01:02:57,719 --> 01:03:00,519
was in Florida. So like, I really I do believe

1039
01:03:00,559 --> 01:03:03,920
that these were all different individuals and I don't think

1040
01:03:03,960 --> 01:03:09,440
they were seeking me out. But I did have the encounters,

1041
01:03:09,440 --> 01:03:12,360
and I do feel like they were able to sense

1042
01:03:12,480 --> 01:03:16,079
my energy. I don't know if like there's something about

1043
01:03:16,079 --> 01:03:19,800
the energy frequencies that they pick up on and they'll

1044
01:03:20,440 --> 01:03:25,960
let themselves be seen by certain individuals. I think that's

1045
01:03:26,039 --> 01:03:28,920
the best case scenario home with me, but don't I

1046
01:03:28,920 --> 01:03:30,800
don't think I'm on their radar, and if I am,

1047
01:03:31,480 --> 01:03:35,400
maybe there's some sort of paranormal aspects of these creatures.

1048
01:03:35,440 --> 01:03:37,480
But who knows, right?

1049
01:03:38,239 --> 01:03:42,119
Speaker 2: Yeah, who knows, that's right? Which encounter do you think

1050
01:03:42,159 --> 01:03:44,559
about more often? Your dog me an encounter or that

1051
01:03:44,679 --> 01:03:47,880
sasquatch encounter you just told us about where you're in

1052
01:03:47,920 --> 01:03:48,400
the Hammock.

1053
01:03:50,119 --> 01:03:56,639
Speaker 1: Well, I uh, I would say the Hammock one I

1054
01:03:56,679 --> 01:04:00,960
think about the least because I didn't really see anything.

1055
01:04:01,480 --> 01:04:03,880
I was only able to feel something, which was kind

1056
01:04:03,880 --> 01:04:06,679
of crazy because like if it was a bigfoot, that

1057
01:04:06,800 --> 01:04:11,039
means I was touched by a bigfoot. But I don't

1058
01:04:11,039 --> 01:04:13,239
think of that one as much as the encounter I

1059
01:04:13,239 --> 01:04:17,440
had in Florida with a big foot. The encounter I

1060
01:04:17,440 --> 01:04:21,480
had in Florida, I got to stand Basically, we had

1061
01:04:21,519 --> 01:04:24,320
a moment I was standing in front of one, face

1062
01:04:24,360 --> 01:04:27,079
to face with a thousand women flashlights shining at it,

1063
01:04:27,239 --> 01:04:29,519
and we were able to look at each other and

1064
01:04:29,639 --> 01:04:33,119
kind of just like I zoned out, like trying to

1065
01:04:33,119 --> 01:04:36,599
figure out what this creature's intentions were as it was

1066
01:04:36,679 --> 01:04:39,599
swaying back and forth looking at me. And that's the

1067
01:04:39,639 --> 01:04:42,079
one I really think about the most because just this

1068
01:04:42,280 --> 01:04:45,480
behavior I when I was standing in front of it

1069
01:04:45,480 --> 01:04:48,800
with a thousand women flashlight, I just couldn't tell what

1070
01:04:48,840 --> 01:04:51,559
its intentions were. I couldn't tell if they're positive, if

1071
01:04:51,559 --> 01:04:54,880
I was in danger, or like what it was thinking.

1072
01:04:54,920 --> 01:05:02,480
But it was clearly checking me out and swaying back

1073
01:05:02,519 --> 01:05:05,079
and forth and really vigorously looking at me, And I

1074
01:05:05,199 --> 01:05:07,760
just have no idea what that means. Typically when I

1075
01:05:07,800 --> 01:05:12,000
see an animal or human, I could read their body language,

1076
01:05:12,000 --> 01:05:15,599
but this animal's body language was something that I wasn't

1077
01:05:15,960 --> 01:05:20,360
able to read. It was definitely fascinated with me, and

1078
01:05:20,519 --> 01:05:23,880
I kind of I don't know. I wasn't by myself.

1079
01:05:23,960 --> 01:05:26,000
I had a friend with me. He wasn't able to

1080
01:05:26,039 --> 01:05:30,280
see it. But yeah, if I was by myself during

1081
01:05:30,280 --> 01:05:33,440
that situation, who knows what would have happened. Like it's

1082
01:05:33,480 --> 01:05:35,840
interesting because like it looked like as if it was

1083
01:05:35,880 --> 01:05:39,039
sizing me up. It was like swaying back and forth,

1084
01:05:39,119 --> 01:05:42,559
like looking at me very intently, and as soon as

1085
01:05:42,559 --> 01:05:44,400
I had a friend kind of walk up to me,

1086
01:05:44,880 --> 01:05:47,599
it balanced so like I don't know if it was

1087
01:05:47,679 --> 01:05:50,360
like I'm not going to take on to people, or

1088
01:05:50,440 --> 01:05:53,199
this is too risky for me or what. I have

1089
01:05:53,239 --> 01:05:55,000
no idea. I don't know if it didn't want my

1090
01:05:55,039 --> 01:05:58,920
friend to see it, because my friend didn't see it,

1091
01:05:59,119 --> 01:06:03,360
so me and whatever it was had this experience face

1092
01:06:03,400 --> 01:06:06,440
to face, just me and it. But if I was alone,

1093
01:06:06,480 --> 01:06:08,280
who knows how that would have played out. It's really

1094
01:06:08,360 --> 01:06:11,360
interesting to think about. But you know, I know there

1095
01:06:11,360 --> 01:06:13,039
are a lot of people that are alone and have

1096
01:06:14,599 --> 01:06:18,920
experiences with the bigfoot and get out of that situation

1097
01:06:19,039 --> 01:06:24,000
and scaped. So who knows, But that the experience in

1098
01:06:24,039 --> 01:06:27,519
the hammock isn't like what I think about most, and

1099
01:06:27,599 --> 01:06:30,280
the dog encounter to the dog man encounter isn't like

1100
01:06:31,599 --> 01:06:34,400
something that I think about often, especially when I was

1101
01:06:34,440 --> 01:06:37,000
living in Organ. When I was in Organ, I was

1102
01:06:37,039 --> 01:06:41,519
mostly like focused on bigfoot. I know there are dog

1103
01:06:41,599 --> 01:06:44,039
man encounters out in the Olympic Peninsula. I heard when

1104
01:06:44,079 --> 01:06:48,880
recently on your show, But uh yeah, I just wasn't

1105
01:06:48,960 --> 01:06:51,800
thinking about dog man as much. Now that I'm back

1106
01:06:51,840 --> 01:06:55,400
in New Jersey, back in living in the same space

1107
01:06:55,519 --> 01:06:57,519
that I was where I had the encounter, It's definitely

1108
01:06:57,559 --> 01:06:59,440
on my mind more. But I just haven't had that

1109
01:06:59,480 --> 01:07:03,760
intuition that there's anything out there right now. So I

1110
01:07:03,760 --> 01:07:05,000
hope that answers your question.

1111
01:07:05,960 --> 01:07:08,760
Speaker 2: That does and you being back there that would tend

1112
01:07:08,760 --> 01:07:11,280
to make you think about it a lot more. I

1113
01:07:11,400 --> 01:07:13,800
get it. Well, it's about time for us to get

1114
01:07:13,840 --> 01:07:16,000
out of here wildly. But before we do, do you

1115
01:07:16,000 --> 01:07:17,679
have any clothes and comments you want to put out

1116
01:07:17,679 --> 01:07:18,239
their forests?

1117
01:07:19,440 --> 01:07:25,039
Speaker 1: Yeah? Absolutely. I just want people to think about the

1118
01:07:25,159 --> 01:07:28,840
energy that they have before they go into the wild spaces.

1119
01:07:30,079 --> 01:07:32,280
You know, before I go into the wilderness, I try

1120
01:07:32,280 --> 01:07:36,679
to set my intentions and I try to put positive

1121
01:07:36,800 --> 01:07:39,840
energy out there. And if I, if I had, if

1122
01:07:39,840 --> 01:07:42,760
I've learned anything from these experiences, going out into the

1123
01:07:42,800 --> 01:07:46,239
wilderness without a flashlight and being super emotional isn't the

1124
01:07:46,280 --> 01:07:49,039
safest thing that you could do. So if anyone is

1125
01:07:49,079 --> 01:07:51,920
ever going out into the deep forest, just try to

1126
01:07:51,960 --> 01:07:54,239
set your intentions and put positive vibes out there, and

1127
01:07:54,239 --> 01:07:57,440
I think that can go a long way. That's about

1128
01:07:57,440 --> 01:07:58,719
it for me, Dick. Thank you.

1129
01:07:59,559 --> 01:08:01,960
Speaker 2: Oh you're welcome, And like I told you before, I

1130
01:08:02,039 --> 01:08:05,719
really do like the way you think. You're a good man. Well,

1131
01:08:05,800 --> 01:08:08,119
having said that, thanks again so much for coming back

1132
01:08:08,159 --> 01:08:10,320
on to do this Q and A. Thanks again so

1133
01:08:10,440 --> 01:08:12,880
much for just coming on in the first place to

1134
01:08:12,920 --> 01:08:15,519
tell us about your encounter. I really appreciate it.

1135
01:08:16,279 --> 01:08:18,199
Speaker 1: I thank you so much. Vic, It's been my pleasure.

1136
01:08:18,960 --> 01:08:21,079
Speaker 2: Oh you know, you're welcome. It's been a good time.

1137
01:08:21,800 --> 01:08:24,239
Thanks again so much, and have a great night.