WEBVTT

1
00:00:00.680 --> 00:00:04.040
<v Speaker 1>Wear them fans that y'all, I don't know, but the

2
00:00:04.160 --> 00:00:08.320
<v Speaker 1>boots on the ground decide to boots. A secular leaning

3
00:00:09.000 --> 00:00:15.000
<v Speaker 1>organization from a Pride event, Flabergastic has the story Flabbergasted.

4
00:00:14.679 --> 00:00:17.839
<v Speaker 2>Recovering from Religion, an organization that provides peer support and

5
00:00:17.879 --> 00:00:20.320
<v Speaker 2>resources for people who are questioning and deconstructing from their

6
00:00:20.359 --> 00:00:22.800
<v Speaker 2>religious beliefs, had their attendants at a Pride event and

7
00:00:22.800 --> 00:00:25.600
<v Speaker 2>Saint John's Canada rescinded. Recovering from Religion originally had their

8
00:00:25.600 --> 00:00:28.199
<v Speaker 2>attendants approved in early June. Than a month later and

9
00:00:28.320 --> 00:00:30.760
<v Speaker 2>less than two weeks prior to the event actually taking place,

10
00:00:31.000 --> 00:00:33.600
<v Speaker 2>they were informed that their attendance was rescinded, citing concerns

11
00:00:33.640 --> 00:00:36.200
<v Speaker 2>that Recovering from Religion was not in strong alignment with

12
00:00:36.240 --> 00:00:38.600
<v Speaker 2>the focus of their event. In response, Recovering from Religion

13
00:00:38.640 --> 00:00:40.280
<v Speaker 2>reach out multiple times to clear up what they saw

14
00:00:40.280 --> 00:00:43.320
<v Speaker 2>as a misunderstanding of their intent and mission. Saint John's

15
00:00:43.320 --> 00:00:46.799
<v Speaker 2>Pride responded to a singular message expressing concerns with what

16
00:00:46.840 --> 00:00:49.560
<v Speaker 2>they saw as combative language and refuse have any direct

17
00:00:49.560 --> 00:00:52.039
<v Speaker 2>communication with Recovering from Religion from that point on, and

18
00:00:52.119 --> 00:00:55.119
<v Speaker 2>still giving little to no meaningful explanation for why Recovering

19
00:00:55.119 --> 00:00:57.679
<v Speaker 2>from Religion was no longer welcome. Despite that, the co

20
00:00:57.799 --> 00:00:59.679
<v Speaker 2>chair of Saint John's Pride found time to have an

21
00:00:59.679 --> 00:01:02.479
<v Speaker 2>interview with a local radio station once the situation became public,

22
00:01:02.560 --> 00:01:04.319
<v Speaker 2>in which they stated that RfR was not part of

23
00:01:04.319 --> 00:01:06.599
<v Speaker 2>their community and did not have a connection with their community.

24
00:01:06.840 --> 00:01:09.280
<v Speaker 2>Language being used by Saint John's Pride had led people

25
00:01:09.319 --> 00:01:12.319
<v Speaker 2>to be concerned the RfR was disinvited because their attendants

26
00:01:12.400 --> 00:01:15.640
<v Speaker 2>may not have been seen positively by religiously affiliated groups

27
00:01:15.640 --> 00:01:18.359
<v Speaker 2>and organizations. The story is from the Friendly Atheists. I

28
00:01:18.359 --> 00:01:20.560
<v Speaker 2>haven't met that on July fifteenth, twenty twenty five.

29
00:01:20.760 --> 00:01:25.519
<v Speaker 1>Oh what a tangle web we weave when we practice.

30
00:01:25.239 --> 00:01:26.319
<v Speaker 3>Stuff and stuff?

31
00:01:26.680 --> 00:01:29.840
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, I mean things, stuff and things, things and stuff.

32
00:01:29.959 --> 00:01:34.959
<v Speaker 1>This is insane. Oh MG. You know I have to

33
00:01:35.000 --> 00:01:38.719
<v Speaker 1>say this because, like you know, Recovering from Religion is

34
00:01:38.760 --> 00:01:41.519
<v Speaker 1>a foundation that partners with the ACA a lot, and

35
00:01:41.560 --> 00:01:44.480
<v Speaker 1>I know that we refer to them a lot, especially

36
00:01:44.640 --> 00:01:48.480
<v Speaker 1>on people on callin shows where people are calling in

37
00:01:48.799 --> 00:01:52.439
<v Speaker 1>looking for resources, especially in the process of their deconversion.

38
00:01:52.680 --> 00:01:59.760
<v Speaker 1>And you know, URFR has like great, wonderful different resources

39
00:01:59.799 --> 00:02:02.000
<v Speaker 1>that people can utilize in order to kind of help

40
00:02:02.040 --> 00:02:05.439
<v Speaker 1>them through the process, I mean a secular therapy project

41
00:02:06.280 --> 00:02:08.680
<v Speaker 1>also their call in line that they can do to

42
00:02:08.719 --> 00:02:12.360
<v Speaker 1>talk to people who are trained to work with folks

43
00:02:12.400 --> 00:02:17.000
<v Speaker 1>who are you know, going through their own deconversion. And

44
00:02:17.360 --> 00:02:19.919
<v Speaker 1>I know that one of the things that really hits

45
00:02:19.960 --> 00:02:22.919
<v Speaker 1>hard to meet specifically since I am you know, part

46
00:02:22.919 --> 00:02:25.560
<v Speaker 1>of the LGBTQI plus community as far as like an

47
00:02:25.599 --> 00:02:27.759
<v Speaker 1>allies concern and I work with them like in a

48
00:02:27.800 --> 00:02:31.800
<v Speaker 1>professional manner as a social worker. You know, I know that,

49
00:02:32.479 --> 00:02:35.400
<v Speaker 1>you know, just being privy to people who have you know,

50
00:02:36.719 --> 00:02:39.960
<v Speaker 1>come out to family and friends and all of a sudden,

51
00:02:40.120 --> 00:02:42.479
<v Speaker 1>you know, have been told just because they happen to

52
00:02:42.599 --> 00:02:49.560
<v Speaker 1>identify as lesbian, as gay, as trands, non binary and

53
00:02:49.599 --> 00:02:52.639
<v Speaker 1>the like, that you know, they have lost homes, they

54
00:02:52.680 --> 00:02:56.719
<v Speaker 1>have lost sheltered, they have lost you know, community, and

55
00:02:57.159 --> 00:02:59.520
<v Speaker 1>a lot of times, like you know, coming to a

56
00:02:59.560 --> 00:03:03.599
<v Speaker 1>space that is you know, secular was more inviting than

57
00:03:03.639 --> 00:03:07.000
<v Speaker 1>the ones who happened to be religious. Now I understand

58
00:03:07.080 --> 00:03:10.159
<v Speaker 1>that there are religious organizations and churches and things of

59
00:03:10.159 --> 00:03:13.759
<v Speaker 1>that nature who do embrace lgbt QY post community.

60
00:03:13.360 --> 00:03:14.639
<v Speaker 4>And I'm grateful for them.

61
00:03:15.080 --> 00:03:17.280
<v Speaker 1>But if we're going to be honest, that is not

62
00:03:17.319 --> 00:03:22.080
<v Speaker 1>in the majority, right, So it's kind of like sad that,

63
00:03:22.719 --> 00:03:25.080
<v Speaker 1>you know, a organization that has been around for a

64
00:03:25.080 --> 00:03:28.960
<v Speaker 1>long time, that has like multiple partners and also resources

65
00:03:29.000 --> 00:03:32.960
<v Speaker 1>to help people, you know, basically not only come out

66
00:03:32.960 --> 00:03:35.759
<v Speaker 1>of religion, but even like come out of the you know,

67
00:03:35.879 --> 00:03:41.599
<v Speaker 1>triggers that actually are against their own personal nature be

68
00:03:41.840 --> 00:03:44.520
<v Speaker 1>in this particular space with the point where they're disinvited

69
00:03:44.560 --> 00:03:47.919
<v Speaker 1>to a Pride event is actually appalling. And I do

70
00:03:48.000 --> 00:03:50.520
<v Speaker 1>apologize that I had to take some moments to say that,

71
00:03:50.599 --> 00:03:54.039
<v Speaker 1>but that was on my mind. Guys, I'm so sorry,

72
00:03:54.639 --> 00:03:57.319
<v Speaker 1>but no, I'm not sorry, but I just had to

73
00:03:57.319 --> 00:04:02.280
<v Speaker 1>get that out. Thank you for allowing me. But you know,

74
00:04:02.599 --> 00:04:08.639
<v Speaker 1>Fibergast that you introduce this segment, so I am curious

75
00:04:08.719 --> 00:04:12.039
<v Speaker 1>to get some of your thoughts on the story.

76
00:04:12.120 --> 00:04:14.120
<v Speaker 4>When you first, could you please.

77
00:04:14.000 --> 00:04:18.639
<v Speaker 2>Elaborate, So, I mean, yeah, basically, it's a situation where

78
00:04:18.920 --> 00:04:22.480
<v Speaker 2>a Pride event has looked at an organization and has

79
00:04:22.519 --> 00:04:25.959
<v Speaker 2>decided at first to include them and then to take

80
00:04:26.040 --> 00:04:28.759
<v Speaker 2>that inclusion away. And generally, in that kind of situation,

81
00:04:28.800 --> 00:04:31.519
<v Speaker 2>you would expect some sort of explanation and the biggest

82
00:04:31.519 --> 00:04:33.800
<v Speaker 2>problem here is that there hasn't been one. There's lots

83
00:04:33.800 --> 00:04:36.399
<v Speaker 2>of very good reasons to exclude someone, even if they're

84
00:04:36.519 --> 00:04:39.800
<v Speaker 2>a good organization, but the way that it was done

85
00:04:40.160 --> 00:04:43.120
<v Speaker 2>is suspect, especially that in a lot of the communication

86
00:04:43.240 --> 00:04:46.879
<v Speaker 2>that has been made public that the language around why

87
00:04:46.920 --> 00:04:51.399
<v Speaker 2>they're not included is out of concern of religiously affiliated

88
00:04:51.439 --> 00:04:54.800
<v Speaker 2>people not being happy about it, and that's a problem.

89
00:04:55.279 --> 00:04:57.040
<v Speaker 2>And then they also talk about things like, oh, well,

90
00:04:57.079 --> 00:04:59.120
<v Speaker 2>you're not part of the community. Well, who gets it,

91
00:04:59.120 --> 00:05:02.000
<v Speaker 2>aside is part sufficiently part of the community. I'm a

92
00:05:02.000 --> 00:05:04.879
<v Speaker 2>member of the queer community, and like, do you get

93
00:05:04.920 --> 00:05:06.879
<v Speaker 2>to say that I'm not because I don't fit into

94
00:05:06.920 --> 00:05:10.079
<v Speaker 2>your bubble? And but bud Light does apparently because one

95
00:05:10.079 --> 00:05:11.879
<v Speaker 2>of their sponsors was bud Light. Bud Light is a

96
00:05:11.920 --> 00:05:14.639
<v Speaker 2>more queer affirming organization as far as they're concerned than

97
00:05:14.839 --> 00:05:17.920
<v Speaker 2>recovering from religion. So like, it doesn't make any sense.

98
00:05:18.279 --> 00:05:20.800
<v Speaker 2>It's like they're post talk justifying it to make a

99
00:05:20.839 --> 00:05:25.439
<v Speaker 2>particular group or people or organization happy, And that's problematic

100
00:05:25.600 --> 00:05:29.839
<v Speaker 2>because no one is no group is more harmed by

101
00:05:29.920 --> 00:05:32.199
<v Speaker 2>really well, there's lots of groups hard by religion, but

102
00:05:32.319 --> 00:05:36.759
<v Speaker 2>religiosity harms the LGBTQ community far more than almost anyone

103
00:05:36.759 --> 00:05:40.160
<v Speaker 2>else does. There is so much harm caused to the

104
00:05:40.240 --> 00:05:43.800
<v Speaker 2>queer community as a result of religiosity. And if you

105
00:05:43.839 --> 00:05:47.680
<v Speaker 2>have an organization that focuses on helping people with the

106
00:05:47.720 --> 00:05:50.360
<v Speaker 2>trauma that explicitly comes from religion at a pride of it,

107
00:05:50.439 --> 00:05:52.519
<v Speaker 2>you're like, nah, we don't need you here. Like, are

108
00:05:52.519 --> 00:05:55.240
<v Speaker 2>you actually serving the best interest of that community? I

109
00:05:55.279 --> 00:05:56.319
<v Speaker 2>would say you're probably not.

110
00:05:56.639 --> 00:05:57.759
<v Speaker 4>I totally agree.

111
00:05:58.279 --> 00:06:01.439
<v Speaker 1>I mean, like we have seen, like you know, I've

112
00:06:01.600 --> 00:06:07.639
<v Speaker 1>I've participated in a few pride events, especially with another

113
00:06:07.839 --> 00:06:10.600
<v Speaker 1>oral nonprofit organization that I used to work for, and

114
00:06:10.959 --> 00:06:14.560
<v Speaker 1>I've seen, like you know, the religious sell its gather

115
00:06:15.040 --> 00:06:21.240
<v Speaker 1>to say that hey, you attendees who are LGBTQI plus

116
00:06:21.319 --> 00:06:22.959
<v Speaker 1>affirming or even.

117
00:06:22.759 --> 00:06:25.240
<v Speaker 4>Part of that community are all going to hell.

118
00:06:25.480 --> 00:06:27.199
<v Speaker 1>You know, I don't feel like I say, it's like

119
00:06:27.199 --> 00:06:29.439
<v Speaker 1>people like yelling and screaming at you and all this

120
00:06:29.480 --> 00:06:31.839
<v Speaker 1>other stuff. And they said, well, the Bible says, and

121
00:06:31.879 --> 00:06:34.480
<v Speaker 1>I said, yeah, the Bible also says to dash baby's

122
00:06:34.519 --> 00:06:35.560
<v Speaker 1>heads against stones.

123
00:06:35.639 --> 00:06:37.279
<v Speaker 4>How do you feel about that? Right?

124
00:06:37.920 --> 00:06:40.839
<v Speaker 1>So, like, let's not even go there about what the

125
00:06:40.879 --> 00:06:43.680
<v Speaker 1>Bible says. But you know, but at the same time,

126
00:06:43.800 --> 00:06:46.759
<v Speaker 1>it doesn't give anybody creatives to be hateful. So like,

127
00:06:46.800 --> 00:06:50.160
<v Speaker 1>when you actually have like this like organization that is

128
00:06:50.240 --> 00:06:54.399
<v Speaker 1>like geared to really help people like like navigate through

129
00:06:54.439 --> 00:06:57.120
<v Speaker 1>these particular things, it's just like absolutely crazy that a

130
00:06:57.120 --> 00:06:59.800
<v Speaker 1>Pride event wouldn't even allow them to be there for

131
00:07:00.199 --> 00:07:03.199
<v Speaker 1>reasons that make no sense. I don't know you, I

132
00:07:03.279 --> 00:07:05.000
<v Speaker 1>helped me out. What were your thoughts.

133
00:07:04.720 --> 00:07:06.839
<v Speaker 4>When you actually write this particular article.

134
00:07:08.120 --> 00:07:12.120
<v Speaker 5>Firstly, it was surprising to me that they don't know

135
00:07:12.160 --> 00:07:17.800
<v Speaker 5>who RfR is because I'm not specifically familiar with any

136
00:07:17.839 --> 00:07:22.240
<v Speaker 5>examples of their work, but I know generally what they're about,

137
00:07:22.319 --> 00:07:25.040
<v Speaker 5>and I, like the author of the article, would think,

138
00:07:25.160 --> 00:07:29.560
<v Speaker 5>would assume that that's exactly who you would want at

139
00:07:30.160 --> 00:07:32.800
<v Speaker 5>such an event, because like how many people and I'm

140
00:07:32.839 --> 00:07:35.120
<v Speaker 5>asking genuinely because I don't know, but like how many

141
00:07:35.120 --> 00:07:38.040
<v Speaker 5>people are attending their first Pride event every year, like

142
00:07:38.079 --> 00:07:41.279
<v Speaker 5>after first coming out or after first leaving religion or

143
00:07:41.319 --> 00:07:44.360
<v Speaker 5>being kicked out of their home and having their entire

144
00:07:44.480 --> 00:07:46.879
<v Speaker 5>like religion and their community and their support never gripped

145
00:07:46.879 --> 00:07:51.199
<v Speaker 5>away from them, and they are like literally in a

146
00:07:51.399 --> 00:07:55.680
<v Speaker 5>progressing sense or in an ongoing sense, I mean to say.

147
00:07:55.800 --> 00:07:57.360
<v Speaker 3>Recovering from religion.

148
00:07:57.720 --> 00:08:01.240
<v Speaker 5>And I would think that that's ex exactly who you

149
00:08:01.240 --> 00:08:04.600
<v Speaker 5>would want these types of events. That being said, Pride

150
00:08:04.639 --> 00:08:07.480
<v Speaker 5>events aren't for me. Like I've been to one and

151
00:08:07.519 --> 00:08:09.279
<v Speaker 5>it was a pretty gucci time, but like I was

152
00:08:09.319 --> 00:08:12.360
<v Speaker 5>there to like support like my friends and my partner

153
00:08:12.439 --> 00:08:14.879
<v Speaker 5>at the time, So like, I don't form an opinion

154
00:08:14.879 --> 00:08:16.639
<v Speaker 5>about who should and shouldn't be there.

155
00:08:16.920 --> 00:08:18.399
<v Speaker 3>I didn't form one and and I won't.

156
00:08:19.279 --> 00:08:21.000
<v Speaker 5>But I think about it, like if I was organizing

157
00:08:21.000 --> 00:08:24.040
<v Speaker 5>an event for like secular veterans, which is like a

158
00:08:24.120 --> 00:08:27.680
<v Speaker 5>label that I would claim, I would want RfR there

159
00:08:27.759 --> 00:08:29.480
<v Speaker 5>because I think that they do good work for people

160
00:08:29.480 --> 00:08:33.759
<v Speaker 5>that are secular that belonged to any other demographic. So

161
00:08:34.399 --> 00:08:37.679
<v Speaker 5>that's sort of where I landed it. They Perhaps it

162
00:08:37.840 --> 00:08:42.679
<v Speaker 5>seemed to the like organizers that RfR was coming off

163
00:08:42.679 --> 00:08:44.360
<v Speaker 5>as a sort of like do you have any idea

164
00:08:44.399 --> 00:08:48.000
<v Speaker 5>who we are? Sort of attitude, and that's that's unbecoming

165
00:08:48.000 --> 00:08:48.559
<v Speaker 5>of anybody.

166
00:08:48.559 --> 00:08:50.320
<v Speaker 3>It's not a good look. But at the same time,

167
00:08:50.440 --> 00:08:53.879
<v Speaker 3>like do they have any idea who RfR is? Like

168
00:08:54.440 --> 00:08:57.000
<v Speaker 3>that was that's how I felt like.

169
00:08:57.279 --> 00:08:59.679
<v Speaker 1>Reading, Yeah, I don't know, I don't I don't know

170
00:08:59.679 --> 00:09:02.200
<v Speaker 1>if they do. To be honest with you, like I

171
00:09:02.200 --> 00:09:05.480
<v Speaker 1>think this like a. I don't know, like a cursory

172
00:09:05.559 --> 00:09:09.080
<v Speaker 1>research would have just been like oh wow, these these

173
00:09:09.279 --> 00:09:12.480
<v Speaker 1>this organization is like really about, you know, affirming people

174
00:09:12.519 --> 00:09:15.440
<v Speaker 1>who happen to be part of the queer community, because.

175
00:09:15.159 --> 00:09:17.799
<v Speaker 4>I know that they are. I mean like I had, like.

176
00:09:18.200 --> 00:09:21.960
<v Speaker 1>A had gnawsy long conversations with doctor Darryl rhyd and

177
00:09:21.960 --> 00:09:25.879
<v Speaker 1>and also talk to Gail Jordan and Glenda her daughter,

178
00:09:26.000 --> 00:09:28.720
<v Speaker 1>and and you know, like and I mean like like

179
00:09:28.799 --> 00:09:33.080
<v Speaker 1>these they are super affirming when it comes to you know,

180
00:09:33.120 --> 00:09:36.480
<v Speaker 1>the LGBGQQ plus community, and they are They take a

181
00:09:36.559 --> 00:09:39.919
<v Speaker 1>lot of pride in that. So for like Saint John's

182
00:09:39.960 --> 00:09:43.840
<v Speaker 1>to say no, you're uninvited is like ridiculously But you know,

183
00:09:43.840 --> 00:09:46.159
<v Speaker 1>Fola Gas, I'm going to come back to you. I'm

184
00:09:46.159 --> 00:09:50.159
<v Speaker 1>going to ask a question and I want you to answer.

185
00:09:50.679 --> 00:09:55.879
<v Speaker 1>How can communities balance protecting vulnerable members from perceived harm

186
00:09:55.960 --> 00:10:00.840
<v Speaker 1>while uvoiding exclusion or gatekeeping then they hind your ally shit.

187
00:10:01.039 --> 00:10:04.159
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I think it's just like any other relationship, any

188
00:10:04.159 --> 00:10:08.320
<v Speaker 2>good relationship. Anyways, It's about communication, right. You can't treat

189
00:10:08.480 --> 00:10:10.879
<v Speaker 2>situations like this as a tender profile where you just

190
00:10:10.879 --> 00:10:14.279
<v Speaker 2>like skim through when you're doing your investigation and skip

191
00:10:14.360 --> 00:10:17.360
<v Speaker 2>or pass right. The kicker here is that the initial

192
00:10:17.360 --> 00:10:20.519
<v Speaker 2>communication here really did seem to go well. Like they

193
00:10:20.559 --> 00:10:22.440
<v Speaker 2>accepted them, they were excited about it. There was even

194
00:10:22.480 --> 00:10:25.000
<v Speaker 2>conversations between the religious organizations that were part of the

195
00:10:25.000 --> 00:10:28.960
<v Speaker 2>Pride event and RfR. They were fine. So what could

196
00:10:29.080 --> 00:10:32.200
<v Speaker 2>RfR really have done better when they were seemingly ghosted

197
00:10:32.240 --> 00:10:35.360
<v Speaker 2>out of nowhere? So like it's when you're asking the question,

198
00:10:35.639 --> 00:10:38.039
<v Speaker 2>how do we balance these things? We balance them by

199
00:10:38.240 --> 00:10:41.440
<v Speaker 2>making sure we're communicating properly, to make sure we understand

200
00:10:41.440 --> 00:10:44.159
<v Speaker 2>where people are coming from. If there's you know, doubt,

201
00:10:44.279 --> 00:10:46.840
<v Speaker 2>when sometimes doubt can be valid. And that is actually

202
00:10:46.840 --> 00:10:49.279
<v Speaker 2>an issue with with rfrs. As those who are familiar

203
00:10:49.320 --> 00:10:53.120
<v Speaker 2>with RfR knows how affirming RfR is. But if you

204
00:10:53.159 --> 00:10:55.440
<v Speaker 2>don't know RfR, that might not be so easy to

205
00:10:55.480 --> 00:10:58.519
<v Speaker 2>find out. And that's fair, that's valid. So you have

206
00:10:58.600 --> 00:11:02.799
<v Speaker 2>the communication, you have conversation, you ask them, you look

207
00:11:02.840 --> 00:11:06.120
<v Speaker 2>into it. You don't just swipe left or right or

208
00:11:06.159 --> 00:11:07.759
<v Speaker 2>whatever one it is on tender. I don't know how

209
00:11:07.799 --> 00:11:08.480
<v Speaker 2>spen enough time on it.

210
00:11:08.480 --> 00:11:13.240
<v Speaker 4>Apparently means left, I left right, aft.

211
00:11:13.120 --> 00:11:16.960
<v Speaker 1>Left or no whos left right?

212
00:11:17.320 --> 00:11:21.399
<v Speaker 5>I agree though, I think because the organizer that did

213
00:11:21.440 --> 00:11:24.480
<v Speaker 5>the radio interview that I think we're going to talk

214
00:11:24.480 --> 00:11:27.600
<v Speaker 5>about a little bit, Like he mentioned, like the way

215
00:11:27.679 --> 00:11:29.600
<v Speaker 5>the way he's talking, it sounds like he's just doing

216
00:11:29.639 --> 00:11:32.519
<v Speaker 5>the best his best to protect like queer entrance people

217
00:11:32.559 --> 00:11:36.440
<v Speaker 5>in I think his local physical community is how I

218
00:11:36.480 --> 00:11:39.000
<v Speaker 5>interpreted what he was saying, whether or not from our community.

219
00:11:39.320 --> 00:11:42.399
<v Speaker 5>So I think it's just true that, like he wasn't

220
00:11:42.399 --> 00:11:46.240
<v Speaker 5>sure who they were, he would rather like the consequences

221
00:11:46.279 --> 00:11:49.320
<v Speaker 5>of being cautious and being wrong and like getting a

222
00:11:49.360 --> 00:11:53.600
<v Speaker 5>false positive, Like just like when our ancestors were watching

223
00:11:53.639 --> 00:11:55.960
<v Speaker 5>for predators in the bushes, the consequences of a false

224
00:11:56.000 --> 00:11:58.360
<v Speaker 5>positive are a lot more dire than the consequences of

225
00:11:58.360 --> 00:12:01.320
<v Speaker 5>a false negative. So I think that's just what it was. Like,

226
00:12:01.360 --> 00:12:03.440
<v Speaker 5>if you don't know who they are, just say that

227
00:12:03.440 --> 00:12:06.120
<v Speaker 5>that's fine. Ignorance is no problem. But when you make

228
00:12:06.480 --> 00:12:10.200
<v Speaker 5>decisions virtuous of that ignorance. Hi, the Vatican, I'm looking

229
00:12:10.240 --> 00:12:13.759
<v Speaker 5>at you, that's when we have the problem.

230
00:12:14.000 --> 00:12:15.919
<v Speaker 6>You know, I see a lot of looking at the

231
00:12:16.000 --> 00:12:18.000
<v Speaker 6>Vatican slot.

232
00:12:18.240 --> 00:12:21.080
<v Speaker 2>You know what was almost like it's justified or something.

233
00:12:21.320 --> 00:12:23.600
<v Speaker 6>You know that far.

234
00:12:23.639 --> 00:12:26.879
<v Speaker 1>Right there, you know, don't don't give me star talk

235
00:12:26.919 --> 00:12:33.159
<v Speaker 1>by folicism, I get triggered real quick, like cringe anyway,

236
00:12:33.320 --> 00:12:35.759
<v Speaker 1>But like I want to ask this question to both

237
00:12:35.799 --> 00:12:38.360
<v Speaker 1>of you, like ELI want to start with you and

238
00:12:38.399 --> 00:12:40.320
<v Speaker 1>then flabbergasts that I want to come to you.

239
00:12:40.399 --> 00:12:42.600
<v Speaker 4>But what does transparency.

240
00:12:41.919 --> 00:12:46.799
<v Speaker 1>Look like and dialogue clay when difficult decisions like this

241
00:12:46.919 --> 00:12:50.519
<v Speaker 1>are made in the community spaces, especially during events centered

242
00:12:50.559 --> 00:12:51.919
<v Speaker 1>around inclusion and support.

243
00:12:52.360 --> 00:12:55.720
<v Speaker 5>Well, I think that undoubtedly there are people that live

244
00:12:55.759 --> 00:12:57.759
<v Speaker 5>in that area that we'll be attending that Pride event

245
00:12:57.799 --> 00:13:01.919
<v Speaker 5>that know who RfR is and because it was mentioned

246
00:13:01.919 --> 00:13:04.240
<v Speaker 5>that they're going to have their booth like off the

247
00:13:04.240 --> 00:13:07.279
<v Speaker 5>premises of the Pride event, but still nearby so that

248
00:13:07.320 --> 00:13:09.639
<v Speaker 5>people can get in touch with them if they happened

249
00:13:09.679 --> 00:13:11.840
<v Speaker 5>to be happened to come across them and want to

250
00:13:12.919 --> 00:13:14.840
<v Speaker 5>so they'll still be available. But I think there are

251
00:13:14.919 --> 00:13:17.399
<v Speaker 5>undoubtedly people who will be attending to know who they are,

252
00:13:17.440 --> 00:13:20.080
<v Speaker 5>and they are gonna want to know. They are gonna

253
00:13:20.080 --> 00:13:24.000
<v Speaker 5>want that transparency about like what actually happened here, Because

254
00:13:24.000 --> 00:13:28.039
<v Speaker 5>I agree with flabberg Acid that like it's it's super

255
00:13:28.159 --> 00:13:31.600
<v Speaker 5>strange if they just if they had initially like denied

256
00:13:31.919 --> 00:13:36.320
<v Speaker 5>their request to attend as a vendor because they didn't

257
00:13:36.320 --> 00:13:38.879
<v Speaker 5>know who they were fine that. I think that probably

258
00:13:38.919 --> 00:13:42.720
<v Speaker 5>would have been a lot less like turbulent if it

259
00:13:42.759 --> 00:13:45.559
<v Speaker 5>had just been an outright denial. But they approved it

260
00:13:46.120 --> 00:13:49.639
<v Speaker 5>and then came back later and was like, you know what, nevermind.

261
00:13:49.799 --> 00:13:51.840
<v Speaker 5>And I don't remember when it was mentioned, but it

262
00:13:51.919 --> 00:13:55.360
<v Speaker 5>was the.

263
00:13:53.759 --> 00:13:56.919
<v Speaker 3>The idea of being off putting, I think to.

264
00:13:58.399 --> 00:14:02.759
<v Speaker 5>Queer and trans led religious groups that might be attending.

265
00:14:02.799 --> 00:14:05.200
<v Speaker 5>They didn't want to be alienating to those groups, and

266
00:14:05.879 --> 00:14:08.399
<v Speaker 5>that was like, I think a primary justification given.

267
00:14:08.440 --> 00:14:11.840
<v Speaker 3>So I think the transparency is going to be important.

268
00:14:11.840 --> 00:14:12.600
<v Speaker 3>What does it look like?

269
00:14:12.679 --> 00:14:15.320
<v Speaker 5>I don't know because the two versions of the community

270
00:14:15.399 --> 00:14:18.759
<v Speaker 5>of the interaction that both RfR and Saint John's Pride

271
00:14:18.799 --> 00:14:22.320
<v Speaker 5>organizers are telling, these versions are already slightly different from

272
00:14:22.360 --> 00:14:25.480
<v Speaker 5>each other, so it's really difficult to tell at this

273
00:14:25.559 --> 00:14:28.440
<v Speaker 5>point what really actually was said or.

274
00:14:28.399 --> 00:14:30.759
<v Speaker 4>Have that's fair, What do you have? What are your

275
00:14:30.759 --> 00:14:31.679
<v Speaker 4>thoughts flabbergasted?

276
00:14:31.879 --> 00:14:35.759
<v Speaker 2>I think whenever we're talking about transparency, full transparency always

277
00:14:35.840 --> 00:14:39.679
<v Speaker 2>is the best transparency, and a pride event is meant

278
00:14:39.679 --> 00:14:42.200
<v Speaker 2>to represent the community as a whole, and so you

279
00:14:42.240 --> 00:14:45.360
<v Speaker 2>should be able to justify to that community why anyone

280
00:14:45.480 --> 00:14:49.080
<v Speaker 2>is or is not included, especially especially in a situation

281
00:14:49.159 --> 00:14:51.759
<v Speaker 2>like this, right, you should be able to demonstrate and

282
00:14:51.799 --> 00:14:55.480
<v Speaker 2>explain thoroughly. And it's interesting because in the article they

283
00:14:55.519 --> 00:14:59.399
<v Speaker 2>say that, oh, well, all of our board meetings minutes

284
00:14:59.440 --> 00:15:01.559
<v Speaker 2>are available, we have full transparency. You can go to

285
00:15:01.600 --> 00:15:04.240
<v Speaker 2>our board meetings. You need to read them. Well I have.

286
00:15:04.879 --> 00:15:08.240
<v Speaker 2>I've read all of their board meeting notes going back

287
00:15:09.000 --> 00:15:13.759
<v Speaker 2>nine months, seven months, eight months roughly, and no, they

288
00:15:13.759 --> 00:15:17.120
<v Speaker 2>don't have full transparency. Not only do not have full transparency,

289
00:15:17.240 --> 00:15:22.159
<v Speaker 2>RfR is the only organization that they actually name specifically

290
00:15:22.360 --> 00:15:26.360
<v Speaker 2>as a vendor. They mention when before they approved them, like, oh, yeah,

291
00:15:26.480 --> 00:15:29.519
<v Speaker 2>RfR is an organization, do some investigation before approving them.

292
00:15:29.600 --> 00:15:32.440
<v Speaker 2>Then they get approved a month later, they just state

293
00:15:32.639 --> 00:15:35.960
<v Speaker 2>RfR had their stuff rescinded it. That's all they said.

294
00:15:36.000 --> 00:15:39.159
<v Speaker 2>No justification, no explanation, And they're going to point to

295
00:15:39.159 --> 00:15:41.960
<v Speaker 2>their board meeting minutes like they have full transparency. They don't.

296
00:15:42.200 --> 00:15:44.159
<v Speaker 2>And that's part of the problem, right, Like if it

297
00:15:44.200 --> 00:15:45.679
<v Speaker 2>was in there and there was a justification or an

298
00:15:45.679 --> 00:15:48.080
<v Speaker 2>explanation that you could point to and explain and be like, oh,

299
00:15:48.120 --> 00:15:50.039
<v Speaker 2>this is why this is a conversation we had, This

300
00:15:50.120 --> 00:15:52.919
<v Speaker 2>is what someone said specifically that made us concern. They

301
00:15:52.919 --> 00:15:55.399
<v Speaker 2>don't have any of that. So what kind of transparency

302
00:15:55.399 --> 00:15:57.120
<v Speaker 2>should you have? You should have full transparency because you

303
00:15:57.120 --> 00:15:59.759
<v Speaker 2>should be able to justify these decisions on behalf of

304
00:15:59.799 --> 00:16:01.879
<v Speaker 2>the people that you are supposed to be representing, which

305
00:16:01.919 --> 00:16:04.840
<v Speaker 2>is in this case, the entire Pride, the entire queer

306
00:16:04.879 --> 00:16:07.200
<v Speaker 2>community of your area, and you did not provide them that.

307
00:16:07.720 --> 00:16:12.200
<v Speaker 6>Well, uh, chech and mate, may I say.

308
00:16:14.519 --> 00:16:15.720
<v Speaker 2>I thought about or something?

309
00:16:15.960 --> 00:16:17.720
<v Speaker 4>Yeah, like something like that.

310
00:16:18.000 --> 00:16:21.279
<v Speaker 1>Well, you know, guys, if you're interested, I do have

311
00:16:21.320 --> 00:16:25.919
<v Speaker 1>a final reflection about this whole shindik, if you will so.

312
00:16:26.159 --> 00:16:30.679
<v Speaker 6>As a secular humanist, we champion open dialogue, inclusion, and

313
00:16:30.799 --> 00:16:35.360
<v Speaker 6>freedom of conscious It's troubling to see an organization like

314
00:16:35.480 --> 00:16:40.279
<v Speaker 6>Recovering from Religion an ally that supports the LGBTQ plus community,

315
00:16:40.919 --> 00:16:45.799
<v Speaker 6>excluded from Saint John's Pride event without a clear evidence

316
00:16:45.840 --> 00:16:52.080
<v Speaker 6>face rationale. As Flabbergasted aptly pointed out, rfr's mission is

317
00:16:52.200 --> 00:16:55.799
<v Speaker 6>not to evangelize atheism, but to offer support to those

318
00:16:55.879 --> 00:17:02.480
<v Speaker 6>recovering from religious trauma, something many individuals have painfully experienced.

319
00:17:03.039 --> 00:17:07.200
<v Speaker 6>Their presence at Pride could have been healing and affirming

320
00:17:07.279 --> 00:17:12.519
<v Speaker 6>for attendees navigating identity and belief instead of the decision

321
00:17:12.599 --> 00:17:18.359
<v Speaker 6>to exclude them. It suggests a discomfort with non religious voices,

322
00:17:19.000 --> 00:17:24.480
<v Speaker 6>even when those voices advocate for equity, dignity, and compassion.

323
00:17:24.920 --> 00:17:29.519
<v Speaker 6>Pride is meant to be celebrated of authenticity and shared struggle,

324
00:17:29.880 --> 00:17:34.680
<v Speaker 6>a space where all who genuinely support the LGBTQ plus

325
00:17:34.720 --> 00:17:38.839
<v Speaker 6>community can come together. That includes people of faith, and

326
00:17:39.240 --> 00:17:43.440
<v Speaker 6>it must include those without it to do otherwise replicating

327
00:17:43.680 --> 00:17:47.640
<v Speaker 6>the very exclusion that Pride exists to overcome. How can

328
00:17:47.640 --> 00:17:52.119
<v Speaker 6>we ensure that exclusion inclusion rather at Pride isn't limited

329
00:17:52.160 --> 00:17:56.440
<v Speaker 6>to certain beliefs, but instead extends to all those committed

330
00:17:56.480 --> 00:18:00.680
<v Speaker 6>to equality, healing and human dignity. And I just want

331
00:18:00.759 --> 00:18:02.960
<v Speaker 6>to also point out to you, dear viewer, that if

332
00:18:03.000 --> 00:18:06.480
<v Speaker 6>you are looking for resources coming out of religion and

333
00:18:06.720 --> 00:18:09.680
<v Speaker 6>also need a space where it's safe and then you

334
00:18:09.720 --> 00:18:14.279
<v Speaker 6>can talk to people, especially if you are experiencing exclusion

335
00:18:14.559 --> 00:18:17.680
<v Speaker 6>because of non belief or even exclusion because you're part

336
00:18:17.720 --> 00:18:22.200
<v Speaker 6>of the LGBTQIA plus community, please visit Recovering from Religion

337
00:18:22.240 --> 00:18:26.400
<v Speaker 6>dot org. They have resources, they have support groups, They

338
00:18:26.440 --> 00:18:27.960
<v Speaker 6>even have a phone line that you can call in

339
00:18:28.000 --> 00:18:30.519
<v Speaker 6>and talk to a volunteer, and they can even point

340
00:18:30.559 --> 00:18:33.200
<v Speaker 6>you out to other resources that can assist you with

341
00:18:33.359 --> 00:18:34.480
<v Speaker 6>navigating the process.