WEBVTT 1 00:00:00.200 --> 00:00:03.480 We're outside the travel Agency, a cannabis store that's got 2 00:00:03.520 --> 00:00:04.280 everyone buzz them. 3 00:00:04.360 --> 00:00:05.879 I walked it, I felt like I was in the 4 00:00:06.000 --> 00:00:08.359 elite of the skies, like I'm about to get elevated 5 00:00:08.400 --> 00:00:11.039 and lifted in the best way. Got the important essential things. 6 00:00:11.080 --> 00:00:13.640 I need sleep, So tinctures salves to relax my body, 7 00:00:13.720 --> 00:00:16.120 right the best New York flowers. 8 00:00:16.199 --> 00:00:18.280 Come down to the travel Agency and see for yourself. 9 00:00:18.320 --> 00:00:20.399 Freeze only by adults age twenty one an older. Keep 10 00:00:20.440 --> 00:00:22.039 out of reach of children and pets. In case of 11 00:00:22.079 --> 00:00:25.399 accell ingestion or over consumption, contact the National Poison Control Center. 12 00:00:25.559 --> 00:00:26.559 Consumer responsibly. 13 00:00:28.559 --> 00:00:31.399 Wait the Lucky land Slots. You can get lucky just 14 00:00:31.480 --> 00:00:32.359 about anywhere. 15 00:00:33.200 --> 00:00:36.079 It's your captain speaking. We've got clear runway and the 16 00:00:36.079 --> 00:00:38.039 weather's fine, but we're just gonna circle up here a 17 00:00:38.079 --> 00:00:41.320 while and get lucky. Oh no, nothing like that. It's 18 00:00:41.399 --> 00:00:44.000 just these cash prizes add up quick, So I suggest 19 00:00:44.000 --> 00:00:46.039 you sit back, keep your trade table up right, and 20 00:00:46.280 --> 00:00:47.200 start getting lucky. 21 00:00:48.000 --> 00:00:50.799 Play for free at Lucky landslops dot com. Are you 22 00:00:50.960 --> 00:00:54.600 feeling lucky? No purchase necessary void We're prohibited by Law 23 00:00:54.679 --> 00:01:03.119 eighteen plus. Terms and conditions apply. See website for details. 24 00:01:00.439 --> 00:01:01.320 To a Canadian. 25 00:01:10.519 --> 00:01:13.959 You are now listening to True Murder, The Most Shocking 26 00:01:14.040 --> 00:01:17.079 Killers in True Crime History and the authors that have 27 00:01:17.120 --> 00:01:24.719 written about them Gaesy, Bundy, Dahmer, The Nightstalker DTK. Every week, 28 00:01:24.879 --> 00:01:28.719 another fascinating author talking about the most shocking and infamous 29 00:01:28.760 --> 00:01:32.760 killers in true crime history. True Murder with your host, 30 00:01:33.159 --> 00:01:35.640 journalist and author Dan Zupansky. 31 00:01:45.280 --> 00:01:47.680 Good evening. This is your host Dan Zupanski for the 32 00:01:47.719 --> 00:01:50.920 program True Murder, The most Shocking Killers in True Crime 33 00:01:51.040 --> 00:01:54.439 History and the authors that have written about them. On 34 00:01:54.560 --> 00:01:58.640 January twenty third, two thousand, already battered by an ice storm, 35 00:01:59.159 --> 00:02:02.640 the rural Obama resort town A mentone was about to 36 00:02:02.640 --> 00:02:07.760 be struck by an even more terrifying freak catastrophe. Hurtling 37 00:02:07.840 --> 00:02:11.599 down the highway in a Lincoln Town car was Heyward Bissele, 38 00:02:12.560 --> 00:02:16.800 a four hundred pound madman on a murder rampage. Ramming 39 00:02:16.879 --> 00:02:20.120 the pickup truck of Don and Rhea Perch, Bistle lured 40 00:02:20.199 --> 00:02:23.039 Don Perch onto the road, running him down with his car. 41 00:02:24.039 --> 00:02:27.840 Bissiles next targeted the home of James and Sue Pumphrey. 42 00:02:28.439 --> 00:02:31.599 After stabbing James Pumfrey in the stomach, Bissele was thwarted 43 00:02:31.639 --> 00:02:34.800 by two family dogs who gave their lives to protect 44 00:02:34.800 --> 00:02:38.319 their owners. Their sacrifice bought the Pumphreys enough time to 45 00:02:38.319 --> 00:02:40.879 get a gun and scare off Bissele, who didn't know 46 00:02:40.919 --> 00:02:45.479 the weapon was actually inoperable. When Bessel was finally stopped, 47 00:02:45.840 --> 00:02:49.680 police discovered that he wasn't alone. Occupying the passenger seat 48 00:02:49.680 --> 00:02:53.400 beside him was the mutilated, partially dismembered body of his 49 00:02:53.520 --> 00:02:58.199 pregnant girlfriend, Patricia Ann Booher. In February two thousand and two, 50 00:02:58.319 --> 00:03:01.280 Missile pled guilty but in sine and was sent to 51 00:03:01.319 --> 00:03:04.319 prison for life. Was he really crazy? Or was he 52 00:03:04.360 --> 00:03:07.199 crazy like a fox turning it on and off to 53 00:03:07.280 --> 00:03:10.840 try to beat a death sentence for Boor's murder. The 54 00:03:10.960 --> 00:03:14.840 subject of our program this evening is a book called 55 00:03:14.879 --> 00:03:19.560 Blood Highway. With my guest, a journalist and author Sheila Johnson. 56 00:03:19.680 --> 00:03:22.080 Welcome back to the program, and thank you to agreeing 57 00:03:22.120 --> 00:03:24.800 to this interview. Sheila Johnson, Well, thank you. 58 00:03:24.879 --> 00:03:26.719 It's a pleasure to be back with you again. 59 00:03:27.400 --> 00:03:29.280 Well, it's a pleasure for our audience. And this is 60 00:03:29.439 --> 00:03:34.199 one wild, wild story, if I must admit, of many 61 00:03:34.240 --> 00:03:37.360 wild stories, this one really is really up there. I'm 62 00:03:37.400 --> 00:03:40.439 telling you this is a great one. Anyway, Let's talk 63 00:03:40.639 --> 00:03:43.800 a little bit about the resort town and Mentone and 64 00:03:43.879 --> 00:03:48.479 Alabama really set the stage for this incredible story. Tell 65 00:03:48.560 --> 00:03:52.400 us a little bit about Mentone, pardon me, where it's 66 00:03:52.439 --> 00:03:56.439 located geographically to the big center that we might be 67 00:03:56.520 --> 00:03:59.759 more familiar with, and tell us what it is that 68 00:04:00.080 --> 00:04:01.960 uh makes it a resort town as well. 69 00:04:02.599 --> 00:04:06.080 Well. It's up in the far northeast corner of this state, 70 00:04:06.759 --> 00:04:09.599 and it's a little mountain resort town. It's in the 71 00:04:10.240 --> 00:04:14.199 on the highest point in that area, and it's pretty 72 00:04:14.199 --> 00:04:19.240 close to Chattanooga, Tennessee, and it's also close to fairly 73 00:04:19.279 --> 00:04:23.319 close to Atlanta, you know, Birmingham. It's sort of centrally 74 00:04:23.360 --> 00:04:28.199 located there. But it's been a resort town since way 75 00:04:28.240 --> 00:04:32.160 back in the eighteen hundreds and trains would come and 76 00:04:32.319 --> 00:04:36.399 bring people down for the summer to spend the summer 77 00:04:36.439 --> 00:04:38.800 in the mountains up there. And it's it's very quaint. 78 00:04:38.879 --> 00:04:43.920 It has all sorts of really neat cabins and little 79 00:04:43.959 --> 00:04:48.639 stores and it's just a super place. It's got a huge, big, 80 00:04:48.680 --> 00:04:52.319 old fashioned hotel, the Menton Springs Hotel is up there, 81 00:04:52.439 --> 00:04:58.399 and and several other which is really nice things, and uh, 82 00:04:58.560 --> 00:05:01.319 no one in that area was prepared for anything like 83 00:05:01.399 --> 00:05:05.720 this to ever happen. The police, that very small police 84 00:05:05.759 --> 00:05:09.800 force up there. There's three small towns kind of clustered 85 00:05:09.800 --> 00:05:14.759 together menton, Hammondville and Valley Head, and they're all extremely small, 86 00:05:15.720 --> 00:05:20.800 and the police forces from those three towns all, you know, 87 00:05:20.879 --> 00:05:23.519 kind of more or less work together and they depend 88 00:05:23.639 --> 00:05:29.120 on the County Alabama police to help them, to the 89 00:05:29.160 --> 00:05:33.000 county sheriff and people like that when they need help. 90 00:05:33.600 --> 00:05:36.959 They're very seldom need help though, because things like this 91 00:05:37.199 --> 00:05:40.360 just don't happen in places like that. But on that 92 00:05:40.399 --> 00:05:45.720 particular night, it happened wide open and nobody was ready 93 00:05:45.720 --> 00:05:46.160 for it. 94 00:05:47.319 --> 00:05:50.560 Now, tell us a little bit about this other storm 95 00:05:50.600 --> 00:05:55.040 that we talked about, this free catastrophe. Tell us about 96 00:05:55.079 --> 00:05:59.279 the storm itself and what it actually entailed in terms 97 00:05:59.279 --> 00:06:02.720 of the difficulty for the citizens. What what all was 98 00:06:02.759 --> 00:06:04.079 involved in this storm. 99 00:06:05.439 --> 00:06:08.800 Well, it was an ice storm, which we have down 100 00:06:08.839 --> 00:06:11.800 in this part of the country every so often, and 101 00:06:11.839 --> 00:06:17.199 there was a layer of ice all over everything, on 102 00:06:17.240 --> 00:06:21.000 the trees, on the power lines, on the on the roadways, 103 00:06:21.920 --> 00:06:26.240 and it made travel just extremely difficult. There were people 104 00:06:26.279 --> 00:06:29.240 off on the sides of the road that had spun 105 00:06:29.319 --> 00:06:33.160 out and gone off into the ditch. All over the county. 106 00:06:33.720 --> 00:06:38.439 Power lines were down everywhere, and trees were across the 107 00:06:38.439 --> 00:06:41.879 the highways, and in one of those little towns they 108 00:06:41.879 --> 00:06:44.600 had a tree on top of a patrol car, so 109 00:06:44.720 --> 00:06:48.879 that that left them a car short that night. And 110 00:06:49.000 --> 00:06:51.199 it's it's the kind of thing that just you know, 111 00:06:51.279 --> 00:06:56.079 totally snarls services and travel everything makes it very dangerous. 112 00:06:56.920 --> 00:06:59.759 And I've not figured out to this day how Hayward 113 00:06:59.759 --> 00:07:03.879 Best will manage to drive all the way down from 114 00:07:03.920 --> 00:07:08.040 Ohio into this part of the country where the ice 115 00:07:08.079 --> 00:07:11.519 storm caught up with him and not have a wreck 116 00:07:11.639 --> 00:07:16.079 somewhere along the way. But in that huge Lincoln, he 117 00:07:16.560 --> 00:07:21.720 managed to just barrel on through and didn't ever run 118 00:07:21.759 --> 00:07:25.800 out of the road. He finally got stopped, but he 119 00:07:25.839 --> 00:07:29.040 never had a wreck, and I still don't understand how 120 00:07:29.079 --> 00:07:30.720 he managed to avoid. 121 00:07:30.399 --> 00:07:36.800 That right now, unlike your book, which I really like 122 00:07:36.879 --> 00:07:39.639 the way you set it up, and many books are 123 00:07:39.680 --> 00:07:44.199 written different ways in terms of contacts, in terms of 124 00:07:44.519 --> 00:07:46.839 when things occur and when do you reveal them in 125 00:07:46.879 --> 00:07:49.560 the book, so fund it very interesting. But unlike that, 126 00:07:50.720 --> 00:07:55.399 let's try to create some character, put a face on 127 00:07:55.439 --> 00:08:00.759 the characters here before we get to the incredible rampage 128 00:08:00.800 --> 00:08:04.920 that this Hayward Bistle went on this one day, Let's 129 00:08:04.920 --> 00:08:11.199 talk about first Patricia Anne Boer. Maybe you can even 130 00:08:11.199 --> 00:08:14.040 describe her size, because we're going to be talking about 131 00:08:14.040 --> 00:08:17.279 Hayward Bissel and at the time, on January twenty thirty, 132 00:08:17.279 --> 00:08:22.040 two thousand, he was a four hundred pound, huge hulk 133 00:08:22.079 --> 00:08:25.000 of a man. And tell us about Patricia Anne Boer 134 00:08:25.040 --> 00:08:27.680 a little bit about her background and who she was. 135 00:08:28.920 --> 00:08:31.279 Did she have any history of mental illness? Tell us 136 00:08:31.279 --> 00:08:34.919 a little bit what really what Patricia Anne Bour was 137 00:08:35.039 --> 00:08:36.720 like and where she came from. 138 00:08:37.320 --> 00:08:43.159 Well, Patricia was a tiny, tiny little girl. She was well, 139 00:08:43.200 --> 00:08:45.320 she was a grown woman, but she was just, you know, 140 00:08:45.399 --> 00:08:48.960 slightly over five feet tall, which made it really ironic 141 00:08:49.159 --> 00:08:52.679 that she ended up as the girlfriend of somebody like 142 00:08:52.759 --> 00:08:57.840 Hayward Vessel, because the size of difference was just incredible, 143 00:08:57.960 --> 00:09:00.200 you know when you saw pictures of them to get there. 144 00:09:01.000 --> 00:09:04.879 And she had had a pretty rough upbring and she 145 00:09:05.080 --> 00:09:12.200 was a very well liked girl, but her family situation 146 00:09:12.480 --> 00:09:16.240 had not been good, and she she was not mentally 147 00:09:16.320 --> 00:09:22.799 ill herself, but she was a special education student. I 148 00:09:22.840 --> 00:09:27.440 think she was more slow than anything else. But she 149 00:09:27.799 --> 00:09:32.639 always did her best, and she tried to you know, 150 00:09:32.759 --> 00:09:36.320 work and do anything she could find to do, and 151 00:09:37.000 --> 00:09:40.200 tried to please everybody around her. And I think a 152 00:09:40.240 --> 00:09:42.840 lot of the time she felt like that was all 153 00:09:42.919 --> 00:09:46.320 she really did, was try to please other people, and 154 00:09:46.360 --> 00:09:50.039 that nobody cared much for her. So whenever Bissel came 155 00:09:50.080 --> 00:09:53.000 along and showed her just a little bit of attention 156 00:09:53.720 --> 00:09:57.440 that it was terribly flattering to her, and she fell 157 00:09:58.000 --> 00:10:01.279 right for him, you know, right away. But I think 158 00:10:01.399 --> 00:10:05.799 by the time they left up there on the trip 159 00:10:06.080 --> 00:10:09.480 down here, which was to see his parents in Florida supposedly, 160 00:10:09.559 --> 00:10:12.679 but they never got that far. But I think by 161 00:10:12.720 --> 00:10:15.240 that time she was beginning to pull away from him 162 00:10:15.320 --> 00:10:20.000 just a little bit. And ironically, she had learned that 163 00:10:20.080 --> 00:10:23.720 she was pregnant just a few days before this happened. 164 00:10:24.440 --> 00:10:27.840 And nobody has ever known whether she got around to 165 00:10:27.879 --> 00:10:32.159 telling him about it or not. We don't really know, 166 00:10:33.039 --> 00:10:35.759 and I would suspect that she might not have told 167 00:10:35.840 --> 00:10:36.320 him yet. 168 00:10:37.879 --> 00:10:41.120 Now it's an interesting story about Patricia Anne. Like you say, 169 00:10:41.759 --> 00:10:43.919 we can't really you know, some of these terms aren't 170 00:10:43.919 --> 00:10:46.000 so good anymore. But say, for a better lack of 171 00:10:46.080 --> 00:10:47.960 better term, she was kind of slow, she was kind 172 00:10:47.960 --> 00:10:50.759 of naive. It was a small woman that looked very 173 00:10:50.840 --> 00:10:55.159 very young, very young despite her age, and I guess 174 00:10:55.159 --> 00:10:58.240 it seemed that she was fairly inexperience at least, not 175 00:10:58.320 --> 00:11:02.200 a very confident woman that successful in life, will say. 176 00:11:03.399 --> 00:11:08.039 But anyway, at the time that she met bissel Or 177 00:11:08.120 --> 00:11:12.480 shortly after, she was making relationships. She was making some progress. 178 00:11:12.559 --> 00:11:16.000 She was with sort of a friendship club through the church. 179 00:11:16.240 --> 00:11:19.440 So that's important. Later when you say that she became 180 00:11:19.480 --> 00:11:22.519 to a realization, it would seem by the time she 181 00:11:22.600 --> 00:11:25.759 was pregnant and the supposed trip. So tell us a 182 00:11:25.799 --> 00:11:29.360 little bit about what she was doing at this church 183 00:11:29.480 --> 00:11:32.480 and what she was getting from that sort of new 184 00:11:32.519 --> 00:11:36.320 community and new sort of new people in her life. 185 00:11:36.440 --> 00:11:40.279 Well, she had started making friends and the name of 186 00:11:40.320 --> 00:11:44.480 the club was the Friendship Club, and she was well 187 00:11:44.600 --> 00:11:48.279 liked there, and she wasn't there to chance she could. 188 00:11:48.360 --> 00:11:51.600 She enjoyed the church suppers and things like that in particular, 189 00:11:52.440 --> 00:11:56.360 and the pastor commented at her funeral on how much 190 00:11:56.399 --> 00:11:59.320 she enjoyed that and how she could really put the 191 00:11:59.320 --> 00:12:03.200 food away. Tiny little girl her size, but she was 192 00:12:03.279 --> 00:12:05.720 just beginning to make friends, and I think she was 193 00:12:05.759 --> 00:12:09.080 beginning to get some support from the people at the 194 00:12:09.159 --> 00:12:12.240 church and the other people around her that was given 195 00:12:12.360 --> 00:12:16.279 her maybe enough confidence to feel like she might be 196 00:12:16.360 --> 00:12:20.000 able to break things off with him. I think she 197 00:12:20.120 --> 00:12:23.679 was really dependent on him for so much, and she 198 00:12:23.879 --> 00:12:27.000 was beginning to maybe work her way past that and 199 00:12:27.360 --> 00:12:32.120 feel a little more worthwhile and self confident. But I 200 00:12:32.159 --> 00:12:35.240 don't think that really had anything to do with what 201 00:12:35.440 --> 00:12:39.279 eventually happened to her. But that may be, you know, 202 00:12:39.519 --> 00:12:42.440 that might account for my belief that she had not 203 00:12:42.600 --> 00:12:44.279 yet told him that she was pregnant. 204 00:12:45.240 --> 00:12:49.840 Right now, tell us about Whistle. Tell us about his life. 205 00:12:49.840 --> 00:12:52.240 You did a great job of uncovering a lot of 206 00:12:52.279 --> 00:12:56.279 information about Heyward. He was in the military, So tell 207 00:12:56.360 --> 00:12:59.200 us go back as far as you can to paint 208 00:12:59.200 --> 00:13:02.120 a picture of this because it's very very important to 209 00:13:02.200 --> 00:13:06.200 this story, as people listeners will attest to once they 210 00:13:06.639 --> 00:13:09.279 heard this whole story, and essential to the book. So 211 00:13:09.279 --> 00:13:12.200 tell us about Hayward Bistle in his early life, and 212 00:13:12.759 --> 00:13:15.840 just continue with giving us a background on Heyward Bistile. 213 00:13:17.120 --> 00:13:21.960 Well, like Patricia, he he had a rough time sometimes 214 00:13:22.000 --> 00:13:26.080 in his youth. His father, I think was really strict, 215 00:13:26.440 --> 00:13:29.080 and he had a head injury when he was young, 216 00:13:29.519 --> 00:13:33.279 and then I think he claimed that he had seen 217 00:13:33.399 --> 00:13:38.480 visions a time or two after that. But uh, the 218 00:13:38.559 --> 00:13:43.159 military was really a good thing for him that he 219 00:13:43.240 --> 00:13:46.440 really cared a lot about because like a lot of 220 00:13:46.480 --> 00:13:52.200 people that have paranoid schizophrenic tendencies, he was extremely neat 221 00:13:52.240 --> 00:13:55.559 and tidy, and that military way of life just agreed 222 00:13:55.600 --> 00:13:59.840 with him right to the his degree, and he enjoyed 223 00:13:59.840 --> 00:14:04.039 the work that he did in the military. He I 224 00:14:04.080 --> 00:14:08.679 think was a truck driver, vehicle maintenance, something of that nature. 225 00:14:09.320 --> 00:14:11.279 It's been a long time and I remember a lot 226 00:14:11.320 --> 00:14:13.799 of thanks about him that there's a lot more impressive 227 00:14:13.919 --> 00:14:17.480 than that. But after he got out of the military, 228 00:14:18.360 --> 00:14:25.799 he began having some mental and emotional issues and started 229 00:14:25.879 --> 00:14:31.279 seeking treatment at the different VA clinics and just ended 230 00:14:31.360 --> 00:14:33.840 up going from one to the other to the other, 231 00:14:34.120 --> 00:14:36.879 and none of the doctors appeared to have ever compared notes. 232 00:14:37.840 --> 00:14:42.480 And I think that a lot of over medication part 233 00:14:42.480 --> 00:14:45.120 of the time, and then having his medication taken away 234 00:14:45.159 --> 00:14:50.320 from him later is what tipped him on over the edge. 235 00:14:50.559 --> 00:14:55.240 But uh, his life, you know, never really was very 236 00:14:55.240 --> 00:14:59.080 successful after he left the military, so that was kind 237 00:14:59.080 --> 00:15:01.240 of the height of his accomplishment. 238 00:15:02.759 --> 00:15:05.120 Now you talk about because I think this is important 239 00:15:05.159 --> 00:15:08.120 to the defense of insanity that we talked about in 240 00:15:08.159 --> 00:15:13.879 the introduction. You say that there was a concussion or 241 00:15:14.000 --> 00:15:16.000 head injury when he was young, and then you talk 242 00:15:16.039 --> 00:15:21.320 about visions. So was he properly and officially diagnosed with 243 00:15:23.320 --> 00:15:28.720 say hallucinations or that he had a head injury that 244 00:15:28.840 --> 00:15:32.679 might produce some sort of side effects or symptoms. Was 245 00:15:32.720 --> 00:15:35.879 that or was this later that they talked about this 246 00:15:36.080 --> 00:15:39.720 was this confirmed? And what exactly was the diagnosis at 247 00:15:39.720 --> 00:15:42.559 that time from that head injury. 248 00:15:43.639 --> 00:15:46.320 Well, I don't think he really had much medical treatment 249 00:15:46.360 --> 00:15:49.159 at the time from the head injury. I think they 250 00:15:49.240 --> 00:15:53.679 just looked at it as a childhood accident and didn't 251 00:15:53.759 --> 00:15:56.919 seek treatment of any kind. And I don't know if 252 00:15:56.960 --> 00:16:00.120 that contributed to his condition later on or not, But 253 00:16:00.200 --> 00:16:06.360 I don't believe that he really started getting worse until, 254 00:16:06.480 --> 00:16:11.320 you know, a few years before this murder. I think 255 00:16:11.360 --> 00:16:15.480 he gradually worked up to it and didn't show that 256 00:16:15.600 --> 00:16:18.879 many symptoms of anything as long as he was in 257 00:16:18.919 --> 00:16:22.840 the military, and then afterward, you know, he he just 258 00:16:22.960 --> 00:16:28.480 increasingly got gradually worse, and because he was seeing so 259 00:16:28.559 --> 00:16:33.159 many different doctors and going to so many different clinics. 260 00:16:34.559 --> 00:16:36.440 I think, you know, like I said that it was 261 00:16:36.600 --> 00:16:40.720 it's more a case of mental illness developing and then 262 00:16:41.320 --> 00:16:45.039 slipping through the cracks as far as being correctly treated. 263 00:16:45.799 --> 00:16:48.679 Right, well, well, you know that is a source of debate, 264 00:16:48.720 --> 00:16:50.679 and that's the debate that goes on in the book 265 00:16:50.720 --> 00:16:53.360 and and the trial itself too, is whether he really 266 00:16:53.440 --> 00:16:57.600 wasn't saying was he faking insanity? Did he have mental illness? 267 00:16:57.799 --> 00:17:00.080 And and learned the ropes as so that when he 268 00:17:00.120 --> 00:17:03.440 went on his rampage he could then fall back on 269 00:17:04.400 --> 00:17:08.160 like certainly he had some form of mental illness, but 270 00:17:09.039 --> 00:17:13.839 the question will be was he mentally ill during the 271 00:17:13.880 --> 00:17:16.680 commission of this crime spree here? 272 00:17:16.839 --> 00:17:22.359 So I think that I think that he learned to 273 00:17:22.440 --> 00:17:25.759 tell the psychiatrist what they wanted to hear, to the 274 00:17:25.759 --> 00:17:29.279 point that he would get whatever medication he wanted. But 275 00:17:29.400 --> 00:17:31.759 he very much learned to tell them what they wanted 276 00:17:31.799 --> 00:17:36.359 to hear. But then he was also going downhill pretty 277 00:17:36.359 --> 00:17:40.720 fast at the same time. So you know, fiction may 278 00:17:40.759 --> 00:17:45.400 have turned into truth right right now? 279 00:17:45.559 --> 00:17:49.559 Tell us what the relationship between Patricia and Bour and 280 00:17:50.240 --> 00:17:52.880 Hayward Bistle was like. I mean we talked about that 281 00:17:53.039 --> 00:17:57.200 maybe a couple of years later. But tell us what 282 00:17:57.319 --> 00:18:00.519 it was characterized by. What was Hayward bistile like in 283 00:18:00.720 --> 00:18:06.839 a relationship with a woman, in this case Patricia anboer Well. 284 00:18:06.960 --> 00:18:10.279 I think he wanted somebody that he could just totally 285 00:18:10.400 --> 00:18:17.039 control and dominate, and he would very often make her 286 00:18:17.079 --> 00:18:20.400 think that she wasn't good enough, for smart enough, for 287 00:18:20.519 --> 00:18:24.759 pretty enough. And it was just pretty much a case 288 00:18:24.839 --> 00:18:28.880 of of him wanting somebody that would, I I guess, 289 00:18:28.920 --> 00:18:32.720 feed his ego and make him feel superior. He had 290 00:18:32.759 --> 00:18:37.000 been married, and he and his wife had broken up 291 00:18:37.079 --> 00:18:41.440 because he was just so dissatisfied with her housekeeping and 292 00:18:41.640 --> 00:18:45.359 things like that. He wanted everything just so all the time. 293 00:18:45.480 --> 00:18:48.920 And and I think his wife was a very normal 294 00:18:48.960 --> 00:18:52.599 person who was was not a hundred percent perfect all 295 00:18:52.640 --> 00:18:57.680 the time. And then he wanted Patricia to you know, sort. 296 00:18:57.480 --> 00:19:00.359 Of lucky cast people. 297 00:19:00.400 --> 00:19:02.519 What's the weirdest place you've gotten lucky? 298 00:19:02.839 --> 00:19:03.240 Lucky? 299 00:19:03.480 --> 00:19:05.759 In line at the Delhi I guess, ah, in my 300 00:19:05.839 --> 00:19:09.440 dentist's office more than once. Actually, do I have to say? 301 00:19:09.519 --> 00:19:09.720 Yes? 302 00:19:09.759 --> 00:19:10.039 You do? 303 00:19:10.279 --> 00:19:12.720 In the car before my kid's pta meeting? 304 00:19:12.920 --> 00:19:14.559 Really, yes, excuse me? 305 00:19:14.599 --> 00:19:15.680 What's the weirdest place. 306 00:19:15.559 --> 00:19:18.680 You've gotten lucky? I never win and tell well. 307 00:19:18.519 --> 00:19:19.119 There you have it. 308 00:19:19.119 --> 00:19:22.319 You could get lucky anywhere playing at Lucky landslots dot com. 309 00:19:22.319 --> 00:19:23.599 Play for free right now? 310 00:19:23.799 --> 00:19:25.960 Are you feeling lucky? No, we're not necessary void were 311 00:19:26.160 --> 00:19:27.680 my law eighteen plus terms and conditions of plus se 312 00:19:27.680 --> 00:19:28.359 webster details. 313 00:19:28.839 --> 00:19:32.319 With Lucky Land Slots, you can get lucky just about. 314 00:19:32.119 --> 00:19:35.920 Anywhere, Dearly beloved, we are gathered here today. Has anyone 315 00:19:35.960 --> 00:19:37.319 seen the bride and broom? 316 00:19:37.519 --> 00:19:37.880 Sorry? 317 00:19:38.200 --> 00:19:39.160 Sorry, we're here. 318 00:19:39.359 --> 00:19:41.240 We were getting lucky in the limo when we lost 319 00:19:41.279 --> 00:19:41.759 track of time. 320 00:19:42.519 --> 00:19:45.319 No Lucky Land casino with cash prizes that add up 321 00:19:45.359 --> 00:19:46.559 quicker than a guess registered. 322 00:19:46.839 --> 00:19:48.960 But in that case, I pronounce you lucky. 323 00:19:49.640 --> 00:19:52.960 Play for free at lucky landslots dot com. Daily bonuses 324 00:19:53.000 --> 00:19:55.720 are waiting. No purchase necessary, boid, We're prohibited by long 325 00:19:55.759 --> 00:20:00.000 eighteen plus terms and conditions applying see website for details. 326 00:20:00.359 --> 00:20:04.960 Be there to give him somebody that he could criticize, 327 00:20:05.039 --> 00:20:09.720 and somebody that would do what he said, and somebody 328 00:20:09.759 --> 00:20:10.599 he could control. 329 00:20:10.640 --> 00:20:15.359 In other words, Okay, so he's a controlling person. Was 330 00:20:15.400 --> 00:20:20.039 he a violent person? Is there any confirmed cases of 331 00:20:20.119 --> 00:20:22.279 violence against his girlfriend? 332 00:20:23.279 --> 00:20:28.119 Well, there's nothing that was definitely confirmed, but some of 333 00:20:28.119 --> 00:20:33.880 her church friends had strongly suspected that he might have 334 00:20:34.039 --> 00:20:37.680 been slapping her around a little bit occasionally, to the 335 00:20:37.720 --> 00:20:39.880 point that they tried to talk to her about it 336 00:20:40.599 --> 00:20:44.960 and she was acted really fearful to say much of 337 00:20:45.000 --> 00:20:50.640 anything to them, but they believed that he was maybe 338 00:20:50.680 --> 00:20:51.720 abusing or some. 339 00:20:53.559 --> 00:20:56.240 Now during this period of time that he has a 340 00:20:56.240 --> 00:21:00.960 relationship with her, does he is he on uh prescription 341 00:21:01.079 --> 00:21:04.279 from a a psychiatrist and what kind of I if 342 00:21:04.319 --> 00:21:07.319 he is, what kind of drugs is he being prescribed? 343 00:21:07.359 --> 00:21:10.920 And for what I we talked about paranoid schizophrenia depression? 344 00:21:11.799 --> 00:21:14.440 Is is that uh? Was he being treated in that 345 00:21:14.519 --> 00:21:19.079 two two year in that relationship W for with those medications? 346 00:21:19.440 --> 00:21:23.279 Yeah, he was. He was under several different courses of 347 00:21:23.319 --> 00:21:27.079 treatment during that time because he was going from clinic 348 00:21:27.160 --> 00:21:32.720 to clinic and getting different medications, and they were never 349 00:21:32.799 --> 00:21:36.759 sure exactly how many different things that he had taken, 350 00:21:37.599 --> 00:21:40.839 but he he had a whole raft of of medication, 351 00:21:41.240 --> 00:21:45.839 different types, and his behavior would sort of depend on 352 00:21:45.960 --> 00:21:48.920 what he was having and whether it was what he 353 00:21:48.960 --> 00:21:52.480 really needed or what he had just made somebody believe 354 00:21:52.559 --> 00:21:57.119 that he might benefit from and the the thing that 355 00:21:57.160 --> 00:22:00.880 tipped everything off was a trip to the doctor and 356 00:22:01.640 --> 00:22:06.000 he got pronounced well enough that she took him off 357 00:22:06.039 --> 00:22:10.000 his medication and it was like a week later that 358 00:22:10.920 --> 00:22:12.640 things went wrong. 359 00:22:14.400 --> 00:22:16.519 Well, there was something that I read, it's a little 360 00:22:16.519 --> 00:22:19.119 bit later in the trial. It talked about that he 361 00:22:19.519 --> 00:22:25.680 was dealing with an outpatient doctor treatment and they discontinued 362 00:22:25.759 --> 00:22:29.480 or recommended he could discontinue his antipsychotic medication. But he 363 00:22:29.759 --> 00:22:36.759 was receiving antidepressants prozac and another one or maybe anti 364 00:22:36.799 --> 00:22:41.000 anxiety and depression, which is much different than an antipsychotic drug. 365 00:22:41.039 --> 00:22:44.119 I would say, Well, it was an antipsychotic drug being 366 00:22:44.200 --> 00:22:46.079 discontinued that tripped him over. 367 00:22:46.920 --> 00:22:50.319 Yeah, that's what happened, right, It. 368 00:22:50.319 --> 00:22:52.599 Was his outpatient clinic doctor. 369 00:22:53.680 --> 00:22:58.880 Right. So, so really to add something to your your 370 00:22:59.079 --> 00:23:04.119 argument and belief, he really was. He successfully went through 371 00:23:04.119 --> 00:23:07.559 the military, was honorably discharged. He had really fit well 372 00:23:07.599 --> 00:23:09.880 with him. They had nothing but good reports for him 373 00:23:10.359 --> 00:23:14.839 about him. He really had no history of violence up 374 00:23:14.880 --> 00:23:18.839 to this point. Well, there was certainly no serious violence. 375 00:23:18.880 --> 00:23:24.400 Right right, Yeah, Yeah, he had not really ever done 376 00:23:24.440 --> 00:23:28.599 anything until this point. And after he got taken off 377 00:23:28.640 --> 00:23:35.200 that antipsychotic medication. He started hearing voices and all sorts 378 00:23:35.240 --> 00:23:41.720 of things that would make him suspicious paranoid, and the 379 00:23:41.799 --> 00:23:45.920 voices would tell him to do the things that he 380 00:23:46.039 --> 00:23:50.880 ended up doing. And it's just I think that he 381 00:23:51.000 --> 00:23:54.720 was genuinely mentally ill at the time he committed the crime, 382 00:23:55.799 --> 00:23:59.319 and apparently he still is to this day. He may 383 00:23:59.359 --> 00:24:03.200 have gotten some better, But I looked up a picture 384 00:24:03.240 --> 00:24:06.519 of him on the Georgia Board of Corrections website, which 385 00:24:07.240 --> 00:24:09.839 any of the listeners can can do that if they'd 386 00:24:09.920 --> 00:24:14.160 like to see, and and he had that same old 387 00:24:15.119 --> 00:24:18.160 stare right into the camera that he had the first 388 00:24:18.200 --> 00:24:22.920 time I ever saw him. So he looks very much 389 00:24:23.039 --> 00:24:25.839 like he has, you know, in the past. 390 00:24:27.119 --> 00:24:30.160 Now we'll get into your participation in this one, which 391 00:24:30.200 --> 00:24:32.759 I had set to you in our correspondence. I said, 392 00:24:32.799 --> 00:24:35.279 what I found very interesting and I always find interesting, 393 00:24:35.359 --> 00:24:38.599 is when the journalist enters into the story, he just 394 00:24:38.640 --> 00:24:43.359 adds that more personal personal touch to it, and a 395 00:24:43.400 --> 00:24:46.359 little more even more interesting too, when the author enters 396 00:24:46.359 --> 00:24:48.720 in and has a role in this. So we'll talk 397 00:24:48.720 --> 00:24:52.440 about that as well. But let's talk about the actual 398 00:24:52.599 --> 00:24:56.279 January twenty third, two thousand, Like you say, you find 399 00:24:56.279 --> 00:24:58.200 it hard to believe that this guy could even drive 400 00:24:58.319 --> 00:25:01.839 down these icy street because the trees were falling, and 401 00:25:02.640 --> 00:25:05.680