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Speaker 7: You are now listening to True Murder, the most shocking
Speaker 7: killers in true crime history and the authors that have
Speaker 7: written about them. Gacy Bundy e k Every week another
Speaker 7: fascinating author talking about the most shocking and infamous killers
Speaker 7: in true crime history. True Mure with your host, journalist
Speaker 7: and author Dan Zufanski.
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Speaker 8: way to hire. In today's world, where meeting people for
Speaker 8: the purpose of having sex with a simple click on
Speaker 8: your phone, a new type of gay sex called party
Speaker 8: and play or chem sex has become all the rage
Speaker 8: in the mainstream. Several young gay men were being found dead,
Speaker 8: appearing to have overdosed on the favorite sex drugs used
Speaker 8: at these Kemp sex parties in a city churchyard in
Speaker 8: East London. Was this what the Metro Police claimed it
Speaker 8: was a sex drug overdose or was there something more
Speaker 8: going on here? It would soon be discovered that a
Speaker 8: popular forty one year old Stephen Port, who had appeared
Speaker 8: on Celebrity Chef UK, would be arrested and charged with
Speaker 8: four of the young men's murders by overdosing them with GBH,
Speaker 8: the date rape drug, enough to kill them in and
Speaker 8: then raping them and leaving their bodies out in a churchyard.
Speaker 8: Since the conviction of a Celebrity Chef UK Stephen Port,
Speaker 8: the police are now reviewing fifty eight other mysterious deaths
Speaker 8: by overdose where the body was found dead in the
Speaker 8: same area of London. There are now seventeen police officers
Speaker 8: under investigation for not investigating the crimes because of their homophobia.
Speaker 8: Included are several of the personal letters convicted serial killer
Speaker 8: Stephen Port sent to his friend in penpal, Cody Lackey,
Speaker 8: which reveals what he claims happened to each of the
Speaker 8: victims and what really happened in these chem sex parties.
Speaker 8: You will also find out some of Port's personal details
Speaker 8: that you wouldn't expect to hear. The book that we're
Speaker 8: featuring this evening is The Grinder serial Killer Stephen Port,
Speaker 8: with my special guest journalist, author and co host of
Speaker 8: the radio program House of Mystery, Alan R. Warren. Welcome
Speaker 8: back to the program, and thank you very much for
Speaker 8: agreeing to this interview. Alan R.
Speaker 2: Warren, Well, thank you for having me. I appreciate it.
Speaker 7: Thank you very much.
Speaker 8: It's always a pleasure to have you on. Ellen. You've
Speaker 8: always have something very very interesting in terms of the
Speaker 8: cases that you do cover in your books, and this
Speaker 8: is no exception with The Grinder serial Killer. Incredible story.
Speaker 8: Now this story you take us to a place called Barking,
Speaker 8: which is a small city in East London in the UK,
Speaker 8: population one hundred and eighty seven thousand. So let's talk
Speaker 8: about Anthony Patrick Wallgate, twenty three years old. He's a
Speaker 8: student at the University of Middlesex. Tell us a little
Speaker 8: bit about Anthony Patrick Wallgate and how he comes to
Speaker 8: meet who we first he first believes is a person
Speaker 8: named Joe Dean. Tell us about the circumstances and how
Speaker 8: these people met Anthony Patrick Wallgate, and as I mentioned
Speaker 8: Joe Dean.
Speaker 2: Well, you know Anthony Wallgate. He was a twenty three
Speaker 2: year old fashion design student and he was in his
Speaker 2: second year and you know, an average kid and he
Speaker 2: but what he was doing was to survive for money.
Speaker 2: He would go on the Sleepy Boys app, which a
Speaker 2: lot of escorts, male escorts will go on there and
Speaker 2: advertise their service, and he would work that way, So
Speaker 2: that's kind of what he was doing. He would do
Speaker 2: it once or twice a week, depending on money, and
Speaker 2: that's how he met up with Joe Dene. Joe Dene
Speaker 2: approached him on the app and wanted to have him
Speaker 2: come spend the night and he was going to pay
Speaker 2: him for it. So so of course he took the
Speaker 2: job and all nighter would be eight hundred pounds. So
Speaker 2: that's that's a lot of money.
Speaker 8: M h. Now you talk about that. Just before that,
Speaker 8: he said to his roommate, to his friend, he said,
Speaker 8: just in case, he took down all the details where
Speaker 8: he was going to go, who is going to be with.
Speaker 8: He even put the name Joe Dean down. So he
Speaker 8: and he said to his friend, just in case I
Speaker 8: get killed. So anyway you talk about you talk about
Speaker 8: Wallgate meeting was supposed to meet this person, this person
Speaker 8: that he was going to be an escort for at
Speaker 8: ten pm at the Barking rail station. Now you talk
Speaker 8: about two days later, because this is June seventeenth, twenty fourteen.
Speaker 8: June nineteenth, early morning, police receive an emergency call. Tell
Speaker 8: us what was said in that emergency call.
Speaker 2: Well, yeah, it was a it's a nine to nine
Speaker 2: nine call, which is their version of nine to one one,
Speaker 2: so it's for it's for ambulance as well as the police.
Speaker 2: And man was on there saying that he was on
Speaker 2: his way to work and when he got out in
Speaker 2: his car, he noticed a body, a male body, sitting
Speaker 2: slumped up in the front just the front way of
Speaker 2: the of the apartment building he lived in. So he
Speaker 2: wasn't at the door, he was just beside it on
Speaker 2: the building itself, and it looked like he was passed out.
Speaker 2: So the caller was saying that he was worried that
Speaker 2: it might be a drug overdose or something like that
Speaker 2: because the area was known for that as well. It
Speaker 2: was a rough area. There was a lot of drug
Speaker 2: usage and and things close by, so that's how he
Speaker 2: reported it.
Speaker 8: Now, the police usually and in this case, wanted to
Speaker 8: know who this person was that was calling or when
Speaker 8: they asked him what his name was, what he what
Speaker 8: did he do? And is a reaction What did the
Speaker 8: police in turn do afterwards?
Speaker 2: Well, he he hung up, you know, and and so
Speaker 2: they would call him back, and he actually hung up
Speaker 2: twice on him. They had to call him back a
Speaker 2: couple of times because they wanted, you know, to know
Speaker 2: who he was and more about the circumstances, as they do,
Speaker 2: right if you've got a body, they want to know
Speaker 2: exactly what's going on. And so they just called him
Speaker 2: back two times. They stayed on him and to get
Speaker 2: his information. You know.
Speaker 8: Now when the police arrive, they discover this Anthony Wallgate,
Speaker 8: you say, sitting with his back against this apartment building wall.
Speaker 8: His shirt is pulled up, his zipper is open, looks
Speaker 8: like he's sleeping. However, what did the police find in
Speaker 8: terms of the what do they find with at the
Speaker 8: crime scene in terms of the body, that's significant.
Speaker 2: Well, you know, the significant part was that they found
Speaker 2: some They found a little bottle which GHB, which is
Speaker 2: the popular drug people take, and that was as well
Speaker 2: as they had a syringe in his pocket and he
Speaker 2: was overdosed. And one strange thing when you said the
Speaker 2: zipper was up, his underwear had been removed and put
Speaker 2: back on inside out, like backwards, and so that was
Speaker 2: another strange thing. And yeah, and the way his T
Speaker 2: shirt was pulled up around his chest, and so that
Speaker 2: in itself was kind of unusual. But because of the
Speaker 2: drugs they found, I think in their mind when they
Speaker 2: found him, he was just another overdose.
Speaker 8: You also include for the suspiciousness that police mightn't well,
Speaker 8: we'll talk about that later. What they overlooked was that
Speaker 8: there was fourteen bruises on the body and they just
Speaker 8: attributed this entirely, this the entire thing to an overdose
Speaker 8: of GHB. However, they the police did contact Stephen Port.
Speaker 8: They knew now that the person, this Joe Dean was
Speaker 8: actually a person named Stephen Port, because they had contacted
Speaker 8: him back after his emergency calls. Now, with that Stephen Port,
Speaker 8: when they actually went to question him, what did they
Speaker 8: find out about his initial story? And as a result
Speaker 8: of that initial story being different, what do they do
Speaker 8: police do?
Speaker 2: Well, you know, because the way he put it on
Speaker 2: the nine to nine to nine call was that he
Speaker 2: was just on his way out to work and he
Speaker 2: saw the body and he thought they might need help,
Speaker 2: and so he called them. So that was his, you know,
Speaker 2: initial story, But of course now they know when they
Speaker 2: when they called them back and brought them in, they
Speaker 2: had also checked the phone numbers and real life that
Speaker 2: the two had been in communication with each other. So
Speaker 2: the police knew that he had talked to Walgate and
Speaker 2: so they knew he lied about knowing him. So that
Speaker 2: put Port on kind of like he didn't know what
Speaker 2: to do, and so he had to change his story again.
Speaker 2: But eventually they knew that he had actually met him
Speaker 2: on the app and offered money for services, so they
Speaker 2: knew the two of them were together.
Speaker 8: Now it's one of the most incredible things I've read
Speaker 8: in any case, is this. And because we're not talking
Speaker 8: about the seventies, we're not talking about eighties. A lot
Speaker 8: of the books we're talking about the seventies, different attitude
Speaker 8: eighties still, the attitude that's not it was pervasive, and
Speaker 8: a different attitude today will say. We're talking about once
Speaker 8: they realized that they communicated for the purposes of sex,
Speaker 8: that they realized that he was in Stephen Port's apartment.
Speaker 8: But Stephen Port didn't mention that till it was pride
Speaker 8: out of him the charges that he does not become
Speaker 8: a suspect in regards to this Walgate, Anthony Walgate whatsoever. Instead,
Speaker 8: though he is charged for something else, tell us what
Speaker 8: he is charged with and what kind of sentence in
Speaker 8: real terms he receives for it.
Speaker 2: Yeah, you know, unfortunately, this is something happening in twenty fourteen.
Speaker 2: Just it's so close. Their attitude was just with just
Speaker 2: another overdose. It was maybe a gay sex thing or whatever.
Speaker 2: So they just sort of had this roll their eye,
Speaker 2: look at it attitude. And all they really did was
Speaker 2: charge him for really just lying to the police. You know,
Speaker 2: they have a different term for it, but in general,
Speaker 2: you lie to the police when they're gathering evidence, you
Speaker 2: can be charged. It would be an equivalent to a
Speaker 2: misdemeanor in the States. So we're talking at a one
Speaker 2: year sentence, and of course he didn't serve that. I
Speaker 2: think they give him eight months and that was because
Speaker 2: of some time he had done in prison, and then
Speaker 2: they let him out at three months and just made
Speaker 2: him wear one of those you know, bracelets on the
Speaker 2: lake so they can keep an eye on him. For
Speaker 2: the rest of the year. So it was really a
Speaker 2: slap on the wrist. But one thing that came from that,
Speaker 2: I will say was that he ended up losing his
Speaker 2: job because of that, and so he ended up having
Speaker 2: to when he got out go to work for a
Speaker 2: bus stop and he worked in like one of those
Speaker 2: little bus talk cafe canteen sort of places, you know
Speaker 2: when you're waiting for the greyhound bus. You know, they
Speaker 2: started little dishes. So he ended up doing that. So
Speaker 2: it changed his life in that way.
Speaker 8: Now, an incredible character that you introduce in this story
Speaker 8: is Barbara Denham. She's sixty seven years old. She's lived
Speaker 8: in the area for twenty eight years, and she does
Speaker 8: a daily walk with her Border Collie and she goes
Speaker 8: through again this pathway that she normally goes and it's
Speaker 8: the property of the Saint Margaret's Church. So tell us
Speaker 8: what she finds on this daily walk. August twentieth, twenty fourteen.
Speaker 2: Yeah, you know, in East Parking, it's a fairly busy,
Speaker 2: small little neighborhood, and so the Saint Margaret's Church and
Speaker 2: the churchyard and graveyard, it's kind of like the only
Speaker 2: park that you can kind of go to with your
Speaker 2: dog and let them loose, and she would like to
Speaker 2: let him off lead or leash, and so this was
Speaker 2: a perfect place to go, so that's why she went
Speaker 2: there all the time. So when she was there this time,
Speaker 2: she let her dog loose and he goes running as normal.
Speaker 2: But she noticed a man sitting against a little brick
Speaker 2: fence that runs through the church grounds, like near the park.
Speaker 2: And she was just walking around, clapping her hands and
Speaker 2: talking to her dog as the dog was doing what
Speaker 2: it did, and she noticed the guy had no movement, nothing,
Speaker 2: you know, the clapping, So she went right over beside
Speaker 2: him and it clapped and kind of yelled loudly and stuff,
Speaker 2: and realized that he wasn't moving a tall like there
Speaker 2: was no reaction. So she actually kind of tapped his
Speaker 2: toe with her toe her feet and noticed that the
Speaker 2: man he didn't respond, and he had blue sort of
Speaker 2: tint to his face, and so of course she had
Speaker 2: to call the police because it looked like he was
Speaker 2: dead or passed out or something that she couldn't figure out,
Speaker 2: and he was. He was dead. And so that was
Speaker 2: the first one.
Speaker 8: And she read in the paper Barbara a couple days
Speaker 8: later that this young man was twenty one years old
Speaker 8: and he had overdosed. And of course, like you say,
Speaker 8: this East London, this area is known for drugs. Now,
Speaker 8: three weeks later, the same person, Barbara is again. She
Speaker 8: wasn't deterred about walking her dog in the same places
Speaker 8: that she would walk before all these twenty eight years.
Speaker 8: So three weeks later, Barbara Denham is walking her dog again.
Speaker 8: What does she find this time in almost the identical place.
Speaker 2: He was the identical thing. It was another another young male,
Speaker 2: sitting in almost the exact same place. It was on
Speaker 2: the same side of the fence, not too far from
Speaker 2: where she had found the body. And it was the
Speaker 2: same thing, you know, and the same thing. He was dead,
Speaker 2: I mean, of course, of course her her initial thought was,
Speaker 2: oh God, not another one. It can't it can't be
Speaker 2: another one. And she went over to the body. The
Speaker 2: same thing the man had. He was dead and sitting
Speaker 2: against the same sort of thing too. He had a
Speaker 2: pair of glasses. He had much the same look as
Speaker 2: the first one.
Speaker 8: Yes, like very much posed after death.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, sost.
Speaker 8: This person's name was Gabriel Kovari, twenty two year old,
Speaker 8: and he moved to London from Slovakia, of course, to
Speaker 8: escape homophobia and persecution and discrimination. Ironically tell us about
Speaker 8: Daniel Whitworth, though again this story just keeps getting more strange.
Speaker 8: Where was Daniel Whitworth's body found.
Speaker 2: Well found? The thing is that they were both found
Speaker 2: pretty close to the same place. I think the biggest
Speaker 2: thing that was different was on Daniel Whitworth was from Kent,
Speaker 2: so he was English, and he was twenty one years old,
Speaker 2: and he was working as a chef. And the difference
Speaker 2: with him compared to Kavary was he actually had a
Speaker 2: suicide note attached to his body on his left hand,
Speaker 2: and in the suicide note he said that he had
Speaker 2: been with Kavari three weeks before and they were partying
Speaker 2: and doing drugs and Kari and having sex, and Kavari
Speaker 2: had overdosed and he felt really guilty and he couldn't
Speaker 2: live with himself anymore because he felt responsible for the
Speaker 2: young man's death. So he was basically committing suicide and
Speaker 2: saying sorry that I can't live with it anymore, sorry
Speaker 2: to his mother. All of this in it. But this
Speaker 2: is where it was really strange because in the note
Speaker 2: itself there was a ps or. By the way, and
Speaker 2: on it it said the guy I was with last night,
Speaker 2: don't worry what, he's not involved. He was just someone
Speaker 2: I met and had sex with.
Speaker 6: Yeah.
Speaker 8: Yeah. And the other part of this as well, again
Speaker 8: the horror flying aspect of is that the police took
Speaker 8: that suicide note and then contacted the parents and gave
Speaker 8: them a sample of that suicide note. Now, what did
Speaker 8: the parents say to the police once they looked at
Speaker 8: that suicide note and then what did the police do
Speaker 8: with that information from the parents.
Speaker 2: Well, you know, they were just one hundred percent sure
Speaker 2: it was not their kids writing. This is not his handwriting,
Speaker 2: This was not him, and so they left it that
Speaker 2: they said that to him, this is it's not him.
Speaker 2: The police didn't they didn't believe it. They just thought, well,
Speaker 2: these parents don't you know whatever. He just didn't. It's
Speaker 2: just what happened. So they ruled it as an overdose,
Speaker 2: just as they did with Kavari. And in the media,
Speaker 2: it's important that you know that they came out and
Speaker 2: they said there was absolutely no connection with the bodies
Speaker 2: that they had found in the park. They were all
Speaker 2: overdoses and none of them had any connection to each other.
Speaker 2: But just the note in itself on Daniel Whittwell and
Speaker 2: actually saying Kavari's name. Who's another body? There's a connection exactly, Yeah,
Speaker 2: you know it's you see, and that makes no sense
Speaker 2: at all why they would do that.
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Speaker 8: This is something that was found out later, but I
Speaker 8: think it's interesting to talk right now about this. Uh,
Speaker 8: Gabriel had a boyfriend of Spanish boyfriend, you write, and
Speaker 8: his name was thery Amando. Now during this time when
Speaker 8: this case really is got so many aspects of it
Speaker 8: involved social media obviously that this is very interesting. Why
Speaker 8: Stephen Port would contact online using an alias John Luck,
Speaker 8: Gabriel's Spanish boyfriend. Why did he do that again aspect?
Speaker 2: Yeah, he wanted to know everything that was go going
Speaker 2: on in the investigation. He wanted to know everything that
Speaker 2: Gabriel's boyfriend would find out or anything that he had heard.
Speaker 2: He was trying to stay in touch and involved and
Speaker 2: John Luck. He was pretending to be basically an American
Speaker 2: student that was living in London and that was kind
Speaker 2: of his alias. So he was very involved that way.
Speaker 2: He wanted to be keep an eye on everything that
Speaker 2: was going on around him and to make sure there
Speaker 2: was no suspicion.
Speaker 8: You write also about Whitmore's Whitworth's stepmother and talking about
Speaker 8: the state of the investigation into her son's death, even
Speaker 8: after the coroner again with the suicide note and the
Speaker 8: suspicious suicide note. What did Whitworth's stepmother find in terms
Speaker 8: of investigation by the police after her son was dead.
Speaker 2: Oh, she was shocked. She couldn't believe how they were
Speaker 2: just it was almost like ignoring it. They didn't have
Speaker 2: any compassion toward what had happened. And it's kind of
Speaker 2: it's really hard to explain. She puts it in a
Speaker 2: term of they were just nonchalant. They were just almost like, uh,
Speaker 2: you know, face it, he's overdosed. You know, that's just
Speaker 2: the way it is. And they just didn't want to
Speaker 2: hear anything about any sort of connection or any sort
Speaker 2: of foul play in any of this.
Speaker 8: Now you introduce a very very instrumental character in here,
Speaker 8: Jack Taylor and his family, his sisters. But first Jack
Speaker 8: Taylor twenty five years old, and he's a forklift operator.
Speaker 8: And this guy's different because he doesn't do drugs. In fact,
Speaker 8: he's never done GHB. He doesn't do drugs, in fact,
Speaker 8: he's anti drug But yet he uses Grinder, the gay
Speaker 8: hookup app to meet Steven Port. Now tell us what
Speaker 8: happens with Jack Taylor, how does he end up? And
Speaker 8: again then introduce two very very interesting characters, Jenny and Donna,
Speaker 8: his sisters.
Speaker 2: Yeah. Well Jack Taylor, like you said, he's forklift operator,
Speaker 2: working kind of hardware. And he was twenty five, so
Speaker 2: he was not really Stephen Port's type. He was a
Speaker 2: little bit old and a little bit too masculine for
Speaker 2: him in general, so that was kind of a weird thing.
Speaker 2: But they had he had been out partying. Jack Taylor
Speaker 2: was with friends and he met Port on grinder and
Speaker 2: decided they would they would hook up, drink and have sex.
Speaker 2: Now this isn't for money. This was not a a
Speaker 2: rent boy or anything commercial. It was just a meeting
Speaker 2: and a hook up. So and and like you said,
Speaker 2: and even in that messages that weren't going on between them. Uh.
Speaker 2: Port even asked him if he liked if he took tea,
Speaker 2: you know, like which is their code word. Are you
Speaker 2: into crystal? Do you do basically you know, drugs? And
Speaker 2: and he was, of course no. But they met up
Speaker 2: at the East Parking station at about ten pm and
Speaker 2: walked back to Port's place, and that that's how it.
Speaker 2: That's how they met and got together. Now, on this
Speaker 2: particular one, he was found in the same park, on
Speaker 2: the same fence, but on the opposite side, so kind
Speaker 2: of on the other side of the little brick fence
Speaker 2: that the other two bodies were found in the same
Speaker 2: sort of position. Now again, they put him to an
Speaker 2: overdose almost immediately, and it was the same sort of scenario.
Speaker 2: Shirt pulled up and had little jars of GHB on him,
Speaker 2: a needle. There was just the same similarities to look
Speaker 2: like an overdose. But there was two things that came up.
Speaker 2: One was the Pink Press, which was the London gay
Speaker 2: newspaper and website, had put out a warning to everybody
Speaker 2: that something is going on. These these men are turning
Speaker 2: up dead and be very careful and there's someone's killing
Speaker 2: gay men. And the police were denying it completely. And
Speaker 2: the two sisters that you mentioned, his two sisters were
Speaker 2: kind of not buying anything that was being said, and
Speaker 2: they complained and it took them for weeks to go in.
Speaker 2: I think it was two weeks before they decided we'll look,
Speaker 2: we'll take you down and we'll go through the CC film.
Speaker 2: And that's how they actually found going through the camera.
Speaker 2: If a lot of people that don't know London is
Speaker 2: all under camera, the city itself has tons of cameras
Speaker 2: and they call it CCTV. And so they went through
Speaker 2: the East Barking one and they found Stephen Port walking
Speaker 2: with Jack Taylor just after ten o'clock going back to
Speaker 2: Port's house. So that was how they made that connection
Speaker 2: with Port, and that was really kind of the turnaround
Speaker 2: where the police actually started to look at things from
Speaker 2: a different perspective, not just gay men out over sext
Speaker 2: and over dosing and dying in the park. That's the
Speaker 2: change the sisters is really what brought this case.
Speaker 8: Out, absolutely, and it's their insistence too, because as you
Speaker 8: write in the book, they're trying to convince the police
Speaker 8: and they push for being able to look at that footage.
Speaker 8: And without looking at that footage, Stephen Port would not
Speaker 8: have been identified at that point whatsoever, would you right?
Speaker 2: Right? And if it wasn't for them pushing because and
Speaker 2: the only reason that the police took them down, the
Speaker 2: only reason was because they wouldn't stop bugging them. They
Speaker 2: wouldn't stop coming in every day and calling them and
Speaker 2: bugging them. And so just for the sake of getting
Speaker 2: them off their back was their attitude is the reason
Speaker 2: they took them to go through the film. So again,
Speaker 2: that gives you a kind of an indication of where
Speaker 2: the police head was at. Whether it was anti gay, homophobic,
Speaker 2: or if it was just laziness on the police. I
Speaker 2: don't know.
Speaker 8: It's interesting too, because what lends credence to this discriminatory
Speaker 8: approach by police is that there was a coroner, Nadia person.
Speaker 8: These were open verdicts, which meant exactly you'd say, the
Speaker 8: open verdict means there's more questions need to be answered
Speaker 8: in able to conclude. And yet she says because of
Speaker 8: manual handling prior to deaths. This is incredible. We never
Speaker 8: mentioned this. One body was wrapped in a bed sheet
Speaker 8: and we're talking about suicide here. She also mentioned the
Speaker 8: sunglasses and the GHB bottles nearby. But the thing that's
Speaker 8: even more shocking is they were never she says, they
Speaker 8: were never tested for PRINCE or DNA, and we're talking
Speaker 8: two thousand and four, team twenty fifteen. Incredible.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's really it's kind of depressing. You really think
Speaker 2: the police were out there looking after us, or out
Speaker 2: there to protect and serve, and in this particular case,
Speaker 2: even with the corner leaving open verdicts so they can't
Speaker 2: even officially rule them as overdoses. The police released the
Speaker 2: media they were just overdoses. So they made that decision
Speaker 2: even without getting the corner to jump on board, because
Speaker 2: they couldn't because they needed other questions answered. They had
Speaker 2: too many questions in each one of these instead, and
Speaker 2: they would not give them an official ruling, so the
Speaker 2: police would just close it overdose, throw it on the
Speaker 2: closed file. So, like I said, if that was aimed
Speaker 2: at the homosexual community, or if that was aimed just
Speaker 2: because they were overworked and too many cases, or if
Speaker 2: they're lazy, you know, I sort of you know, I
Speaker 2: don't know. I hate to say it, but I sort
Speaker 2: of think it was a little bit more of the
Speaker 2: homophobic point of view. They weren't really interested in helping
Speaker 2: are go any further because they were gay.
Speaker 8: M hm. Now you write in the book and explain,
Speaker 8: and we haven't talked about it, and I was not
Speaker 8: aware of some of these things. Obviously, the chemsects and
Speaker 8: party in play. Tell us what the role of these
Speaker 8: drugs are GHB you know, a date rape drug which
Speaker 8: is known as a date rape drug, but you talk
Speaker 8: about other drugs like methamphetamine, crystal meth amyl nitrate, which
Speaker 8: is another interesting point that Jenny and Donna Jack Taylor's
Speaker 8: sisters were really alerted to that this was not an
Speaker 8: overdose since they knew that their brother had not done
Speaker 8: any drugs, but also that there was amyal nitrate, the
Speaker 8: evidence of poppers there as well, and an unused syringe.
Speaker 8: They thought, this is incredible, it's unused, and yet they're
Speaker 8: talking about an overdose. So what I'm asking is is
Speaker 8: that with that information and their efforts, the talk about
Speaker 8: the effects of these drugs and the relationship to this crime.
Speaker 2: Well, yeah, and what you have to understand and what's
Speaker 2: first of all, grinder and is a very popular app
Speaker 2: in England and it's in certain regions in the States.
Speaker 2: But on Grinder what there is is party and play
Speaker 2: or chem sex parties, and so you can actually elect
Speaker 2: to do that. So let's say that's what you want
Speaker 2: to do, So you can throw a chem sex party
Speaker 2: and market it on on Grinder, and people that belong
Speaker 2: to grinder will get notified of the parties that are
Speaker 2: close to where they live. If they're interested, they can,
Speaker 2: you know, sign up for it, so they'll get a
Speaker 2: notification there's a chem sex party or a P and
Speaker 2: P going on here, and you have to be there
Speaker 2: by a certain time because the doors close. They all
Speaker 2: get there the doors closed, they all get naked and
Speaker 2: they do a lot of combinations of these drugs and
Speaker 2: they have sex and it's a sex party. It's kind
Speaker 2: of taken the place of the old bath houses from
Speaker 2: the seventies and eighties in the gay community in England.
Speaker 2: It's huge and so and actually what Port was doing
Speaker 2: just so you know, he was actually going to these
Speaker 2: and he was known as a as a drug boy.
Speaker 2: He would be one or one of two or three
Speaker 2: people that would be at a party that would supply
Speaker 2: the drugs for everyone. So that's why he had so
Speaker 2: many drugs back in his apartment. It because he was
Speaker 2: actually doing these parties on the side. And and the
Speaker 2: main drugs like you mentioned amy nitrate or that was
Speaker 2: paupers and paupers. It's it's it's really meant for heart patients.
Speaker 2: It just it opens everything up, all the vessels and
Speaker 2: so it's it's popular for for anal sects because it
Speaker 2: relaxes everything and so what people do is they mix
Speaker 2: things like GHB to kind of you you were you.
Speaker 8: Were sorry, you were cut off after gh B. You
Speaker 8: mentioned the drugs that you included were GHB and other
Speaker 8: drugs they combined.
Speaker 2: Sorry, yeah, okay, So they mixed the drugs for different effects.
Speaker 2: So methodrone is one crystal meth g h B and
Speaker 2: Pauper's amy nitrate and they all do different things. You know,
Speaker 2: they either slow down or the crystal myth stops people
Speaker 2: from actually going to completion, so they can have sex
Speaker 2: for hours. So people would do different mixtures depending on
Speaker 2: what they were looking at. And that's why I said,
Speaker 2: and Port was supplying them with the drugs at these parties,
Speaker 2: and that's why he had so many drugs. He was
Speaker 2: kind of a party boy. M hm.
Speaker 8: Now it's very interesting you include obviously now they have
Speaker 8: Stephen Port. Now they have and you provide the questioning
Speaker 8: of Stephen Port. How do they go about approaching that
Speaker 8: and in this interview what does he deny? Does he confess?
Speaker 8: What is his approach to this interview from police?
Speaker 2: Well, he has different different approaches. He kind of was
Speaker 2: all over the place his general like, for instance, with
Speaker 2: even the first one he would he would mention that
Speaker 2: he would go out or that he wasn't doing drugs.
Speaker 2: They would do drugs and he would go into the
Speaker 2: shower and come back and the person would be and
Speaker 2: convulsing and having some sort of bad effect with the drugs,
Speaker 2: or did too many drugs. So in every case he
Speaker 2: was trying to point to he was just having sex
Speaker 2: or meeting up with these people and they were into
Speaker 2: the drugs, and they would get really into it and
Speaker 2: they would overdose, and he had nothing to do with it.
Speaker 2: He was just trying to get involved in it. And
Speaker 2: even in the letters I include later, you can see
Speaker 2: how in one of them he talks about each one
Speaker 2: of these deaths and he considers it at most he
Speaker 2: should have been convicted of manslaughter because you know, it
Speaker 2: wasn't his fault, and he should never been convicted of murder.
Speaker 2: And he's appealed in that direction as well. So that's
Speaker 2: kind of his point of His point of view is
Speaker 2: he never murdered anyone, right, He was just there with them,
Speaker 2: and they they chose to do the drugs, they chose
Speaker 2: to overdose, and it was it was all about their fault,
Speaker 2: and he was just there.
Speaker 8: He also blames the drug like you mentioned that instead
Speaker 8: of him being responsible for the distribution of the drugs
Speaker 8: or giving these people the drugs, that he blames it
Speaker 8: again on Daniel Whitworth's So just to add some again
Speaker 8: horror for the family. Now in this you mentioned in
Speaker 8: this questioning by police, he's denied, deny, deny, and not
Speaker 8: assume any kind of responsibility at all. Yet he goes
Speaker 8: to trial. At trial though you talk about other charges
Speaker 8: being added or other crimes related. So there's not only
Speaker 8: he is he up for first degree murder on the
Speaker 8: four murders, but also tell us about the other charges
Speaker 8: that he has included in that trial.
Speaker 2: Yeah, what happened was a lot of he was actually
Speaker 2: meeting up with other people. And I know in the
Speaker 2: trial there was a Muslim that came out and was
Speaker 2: taken home and drugged, but he escaped alive, and you know,
Speaker 2: he woke up he wasn't administered enough drugs, so he
Speaker 2: woke up during port assaulting him. And so there was
Speaker 2: there was quite a few people that had the same
Speaker 2: encounter but were not overdosed. They were basically given GHB
Speaker 2: and some of them were shot up with paupers and
Speaker 2: he would have sex with them. But some of them didn't,
Speaker 2: you know, they didn't they didn't die, And a lot
Speaker 2: of people didn't want to come out because, like even
Speaker 2: the Muslim, it's against its religion. So there was a
Speaker 2: lot of difficulties in that m You.
Speaker 8: Also talk about that there was witnesses you write that
Speaker 8: were never spoken to, like John Pape that he had
Speaker 8: contacted police. This has come out afterwards obviously, that he
Speaker 8: had contacted police about Kovari and he wanted to give
Speaker 8: them details before the murder, and he had volunteered. Police
Speaker 8: ignored his offer of help with anything like that. So
Speaker 8: there was people that they that they did not speak
Speaker 8: to that they could have in this case, and that
Speaker 8: came out as.
Speaker 2: Well, Oh yeah, yeah, you know, and once it hit
Speaker 2: the press and we we knew what was really going on,
Speaker 2: a lot of things came out that way. And so again,
Speaker 2: was it because the police were just being lazy and
Speaker 2: kind of going yeah, okay, you know, people would say
Speaker 2: something to them and they'd go yeah okay, and they
Speaker 2: just didn't want to bother with it. And was that
Speaker 2: because they were lazy or is it because they just
Speaker 2: didn't care about the gay community it's kind of a
Speaker 2: huge question.
Speaker 8: Now we talk about the trial October ninth, twenty fifteen
Speaker 8: in a famous courthouse, the Old Bailey, and the prosecutor
Speaker 8: is Jonathan Reese. And so he does a good job
Speaker 8: in this of outlining why Stephen Port is guilty, because
Speaker 8: this is not a slam dunk because of his denial,
Speaker 8: and it's a complex case because of the overdose nature itself.
Speaker 8: And this is why this has led to this entire
Speaker 8: story being quite twisted. Us about the prosecution of him,
Speaker 8: and where Peter makes the points to prove that Stephen
Speaker 8: Port is the murderer and of also the perpetrator in
Speaker 8: these other sexual assaults and as ministering drugs all of
Speaker 8: these charges, how does he approach that prosecution the points.
Speaker 2: I think the biggest thing was he really he really
Speaker 2: brought out all the other victims who were still alive
Speaker 2: and had been drugged and sexually assaulted by by Port.
Speaker 4: And.
Speaker 2: You know, it just it just was it was in
Speaker 2: common sense, it was right in the same alley, and
Speaker 2: you know, there was just too much in common in
Speaker 2: the placings where he was. And then the very first
Speaker 2: body that he had that he put outside of his
Speaker 2: house that he only got perting police justice from not
Speaker 2: telling the tr So when you laid it all out
Speaker 2: and all the evidence of the escorting and the communications
Speaker 2: and the video between them, it was just it was
Speaker 2: I think it was pretty pretty obvious and just laying
Speaker 2: it out, and they convicted them.
Speaker 1: M hmm.
Speaker 8: You say it was a seventh week trial November twenty third,
Speaker 8: twenty sixteen. He was convicted ten counts of administering drugs,
Speaker 8: four sexual assaults, three rapes, and the murder of these
Speaker 8: four men. And of course then comes the appeals. Tell
Speaker 8: us though, after this, with the media now being informed
Speaker 8: where they weren't informed before, and the victim's families outraged,
Speaker 8: tell us first about the appeals and whether they were successful,
Speaker 8: and then the other things that happen as a result
Speaker 8: of the truth coming out.
Speaker 2: Well, you know, the the appeal, of course, didn't happen
Speaker 2: until the eighteen to August of twenty eighteen. You know,
Speaker 2: he's forty six by then, and again, you know, he's
Speaker 2: trying to put it that he didn't do it and
Speaker 2: that it just didn't pass his documentation and all of
Speaker 2: the proof that they had, and you know, he was
Speaker 2: just saying that you know, he was too high and
Speaker 2: they were on drugs, and that it should have been
Speaker 2: manslaughter and it was self inflicted. But that, of course,
Speaker 2: the court didn't buy it, so his appeal was not granted.
Speaker 2: And later in the fall of twenty eighteen is when
Speaker 2: they decided to do an inquest and go through all
Speaker 2: of the deaths and start to write a report about
Speaker 2: what happened in the case and so, and like you
Speaker 2: were saying that seventeen members of the Metro Police Force
Speaker 2: had been reprimanded for not doing a job, they've also
Speaker 2: apparently given them more sensitive training on crimes and how
Speaker 2: they should be handled with the gay community and other minorities.
Speaker 2: And the other big thing was that you know, that
Speaker 2: park first of all, and the church ground was known
Speaker 2: as a cruising area for gays. It was also known
Speaker 2: as a place that a lot of people would go
Speaker 2: and buy drugs and even do drugs. And so there
Speaker 2: are fifty eight other cases that they've had to reopen
Speaker 2: go back in of deaths that were just ruled as
Speaker 2: an overdose in that park, in that area during those
Speaker 2: two years. That leads to another set of investigations. It
Speaker 2: looks like April of this year they're supposed to come out.
Speaker 2: Apparently the investigation is complete and will be released in
Speaker 2: sometime in April, so we'll see what happens from that
Speaker 2: and if anything gets changed or if anything really happens
Speaker 2: to anybody for letting such crimes go.
Speaker 8: Absolutely, And it's really interesting too because there was ironically
Speaker 8: something called the Equality Act of twenty ten. And this
Speaker 8: is something that on May twelfth, twenty seventeen, as you write,
Speaker 8: seventeen family members associated with the four victims, will the
Speaker 8: other victims, but four primary murder victims filed the lawsuit
Speaker 8: against Scotland Yard discrimination because of their sexual orientation because
Speaker 8: they were gay, and especially breaching this Equality Act of
Speaker 8: twenty ten and accusing them of gross negligence. And they
Speaker 8: say it started when then he was convicted only of
Speaker 8: perverting the course of justice. I thought that was a
Speaker 8: very ironic term as well. So tell us about this
Speaker 8: lawsuit against Scotland Yard by seventeen family members.
Speaker 2: Well, they're looking for compensation, you know, of over two
Speaker 2: hundred thousand pounds and they feel like the victims were
Speaker 2: failed and right from the beginning, and I don't have
Speaker 2: any doubt in their claims. You know, if they would
Speaker 2: have been looking out from the very first one on
Speaker 2: some of the other ones could have been saved, you know,
Speaker 2: And what are they going to find in this commission
Speaker 2: with these other cases that were bodies left in the park,
Speaker 2: you know, was he responsible for any others we found
Speaker 2: out about I think twelve in total that got away
Speaker 2: from him that he had drugged and sexually assaulted. So
Speaker 2: you know, at least that's a wide open door. And
Speaker 2: you know, it's interesting in some of the letters that
Speaker 2: I've got from Cody, who was his pen pal in Manchester,
Speaker 2: there's quite a bit in there about he still thinks
Speaker 2: he's going to get out. Really, he still thinks he'll
Speaker 2: be released. And when you look through it, he's still
Speaker 2: talking about being an escort, and he was actually explaining
Speaker 2: to Cody as Penfell how to go about doing it
Speaker 2: and what he should and shouldn't do. And I put
Speaker 2: one in there that was really ironic, right about don't
Speaker 2: let anybody. Don't take a drink from anybody, So any
Speaker 2: of your gowns or anybody you pick up, never drink
Speaker 2: anything that they give you. Always bring your own drinks
Speaker 2: because you can't trust them. They could put drugs in
Speaker 2: it was really ironic because that's how he was. He
Speaker 2: was he was committing his murders and crimes. M HM.
Speaker 8: Tell us about Cody Lackey and how you met him,
Speaker 8: and how it came to be that he corresponded with him,
Speaker 8: and why Cody.
Speaker 2: Cody's an unusual guy. He's very interesting. He met him
Speaker 2: through in the making of a documentary in the UK
Speaker 2: about a different case, and when we talked about these
Speaker 2: sort of cases and how he knew different things and
Speaker 2: different serial killers, and and he had been in prison.
Speaker 2: He's been part of the gang world for years, was
Speaker 2: in Wakefield, was in with a lot of really infamous
Speaker 2: serial killers, and he knew a lot of them and
Speaker 2: kept in communication and he still does and he still
Speaker 2: communicates with a lot of other people and anybody that's
Speaker 2: interesting to him. He knows how to write, he knows
Speaker 2: how to get a whole of people in prison. He
Speaker 2: knows people in prison and he connects with them and
Speaker 2: he communicates with him. So he's an interesting, interesting character.
Speaker 2: That's the least I can say. Very he's a he's
Speaker 2: a really different, different kind of way about him. He
Speaker 2: seems to be very involved with I think he feels
Speaker 2: at home with these serial killers, and he feels very
Speaker 2: much at peace with them, and for him, that's his family.
Speaker 2: And he's outside of the prison now, but that's he
Speaker 2: doesn't I don't think he feels comfortable being in general population.
Speaker 8: Mm hmm. You talk about to the well, you include
Speaker 8: some of the letters and so tell us this sort
Speaker 8: of the for for people that will read this, Well,
Speaker 8: what kind of correspondence? What what what is characterized by
Speaker 8: the correspondence? What do they discuss basically.
Speaker 2: Well, Cody's pretty upfront, you know. He asked him all
Speaker 2: sorts of questions, and he sends some things. He'll send
Speaker 2: them DVDs and uh and different things that they ask for.
Speaker 2: Gives the money for the commissary so they can buy things,
Speaker 2: and and and Stephen's Port Stephen Port's case. He would
Speaker 2: talk about the different foods he likes, different things he
Speaker 2: likes to do, talk about his prison life, how he's treated,
Speaker 2: what people are like in prison, the relationship that he
Speaker 2: developed with another prisoner, he's uh. He talks about the
Speaker 2: the murders themselves, and he still is convinced that he
Speaker 2: shouldn't be put away from murder, that they did it
Speaker 2: to themselves. And and he gives quite like I said,
Speaker 2: he gives quite the description on how to be a
Speaker 2: rent boy or a male prostitute, and tells Cody how
Speaker 2: to go about doing it and how to do it right,
Speaker 2: and the different steps and things you should and shouldn't do,
Speaker 2: and including take a drink. And you know, it's quite interesting.
Speaker 2: And if this book does as well, which is doing
Speaker 2: really well, it's part of that series of a twenty
Speaker 2: book series, so it's a limited size and I think
Speaker 2: I've included five letters or something like that, And if
Speaker 2: it does as well as it's doing, we'll put out
Speaker 2: a full book and include probably about fifteen or twenty
Speaker 2: of them, so that you have even a better kind
Speaker 2: of a view of what kind of a character is.
Speaker 2: He's quite childlike. He's almost like a twelve year old.
Speaker 2: He's really into comics and kitty sort of stuff. And
Speaker 2: if you look at the letters and the way he
Speaker 2: writes and draws little pictures and stuff like that, he's very,
Speaker 2: very childlike. Still, he doesn't seem like he's in his forties.
Speaker 2: And that's probably the biggest surprise people will get out
Speaker 2: of that.
Speaker 8: When you talk about that. He refers to the murders.
Speaker 8: It's not like a confessional. But Cody was surprised that
Speaker 8: he would speak while he was still on remand about
Speaker 8: any particulars of the crime at all, So and tell
Speaker 8: us a couple of the things that he did actually
Speaker 8: mention that again, Cody thought was surprising and not so wise.
Speaker 2: Well like yeah, like Cody said, you know, when you're
Speaker 2: still in trial, and you're still before you've even been convicted,
Speaker 2: and even after in your appealing, everything is being watched.
Speaker 2: So the letters are being read, the phone calls are
Speaker 2: being listened to, your visitors are being listened to when
Speaker 2: they're with you, Like, it's not there's nothing private. So,
Speaker 2: like you said, during those times, you never talk about
Speaker 2: the details of the crime. You just don't because anything
Speaker 2: can be used. And he was just like wide open.
Speaker 2: He would just talk about the cases. He would talk
Speaker 2: about going meeting them, going home with them. But he
Speaker 2: has a very innocent side to him. It's in the
Speaker 2: sense that he's like it really wasn't his fault. He
Speaker 2: was just going along with the guy, whoever it was,
Speaker 2: and it was all the guys. He was always the
Speaker 2: more innocent of them. And it's just not it's just
Speaker 2: not believable. It just isn't, especially if you see you know,
Speaker 2: his Facebook, his his fights, you see his grinder account
Speaker 2: and what he did. He used to wear a wig.
Speaker 2: Like the cover of the book, you see a picture
Speaker 2: of him when he's being interrogated without the wig and
Speaker 2: all that. But then I've also put a picture of
Speaker 2: him with his blonde wig on that he would put
Speaker 2: on Grinder in different and all sorts of apps, not
Speaker 2: just Grinder, So he had a completely different image, very
Speaker 2: very very unusual.
Speaker 8: And with this as well, even though he was disingenuous
Speaker 8: and untruthful in the police interview, and it provides for
Speaker 8: the reader as well, he does give an education of
Speaker 8: sorts of this sordid, secretive lifestyle of chem sex and
Speaker 8: party and play, doesn't.
Speaker 2: He Oh yeah, yeah, yeah. He explained it to the
Speaker 2: dues and the don'ts and what happens in them and
Speaker 2: and and it's really surprising because I think most people
Speaker 2: in mainstream society have no idea these things are going on.
Speaker 2: I think they'll be shocked. And every time I've talked
Speaker 2: about this or people read the book, there there seem
Speaker 2: to be more in shock about chem sacks, parties and
Speaker 2: that this is going on and going on to a
Speaker 2: large degree. This isn't just like some little one one
Speaker 2: one timer. This is a very very big thing going on,
Speaker 2: and it's really popular in England and it's really caught
Speaker 2: on on certain cities and the States as well.
Speaker 8: Right right, Yeah, it's an interesting phenomena that you're chronicle
Speaker 8: in this book. It's incredible in terms of the families
Speaker 8: and their lawsuit as well. What about the media, what
Speaker 8: was in the end how did the media present this?
Speaker 8: What was the tone of it in terms of outrage
Speaker 8: over the police treatment? How did they treat this in
Speaker 8: the media in the end?
Speaker 2: Yeah, in general in the UK it is BBC and
Speaker 2: the major media are pretty have taken a really hard
Speaker 2: stance against the police and even Scotland Yard for its
Speaker 2: own self. People don't realize how it operates in England,
Speaker 2: so they've been pretty hard on the Metro Police. So
Speaker 2: I think in essence, people were shocked, outraged and it
Speaker 2: all went one way and so there's really no defense.
Speaker 2: There's very little backlash for the police. I think that
Speaker 2: if anything, a lot of the Metro Police in London
Speaker 2: are just getting thrown under the bus by Scotland yard
Speaker 2: as an out and I guess that's just sort of
Speaker 2: the way politics goes. But with that being said, hopefully
Speaker 2: things are better in the future and they're handled better
Speaker 2: in the future, and they'll be watched for the next
Speaker 2: little while because it's very fresh in the minds over there,
Speaker 2: and this is something that's going on in the media
Speaker 2: and BBC and ITV to a large degree, it's being
Speaker 2: talked about, so it's not it's not being forgotten so
Speaker 2: quickly as a lot of other stories have been.
Speaker 8: And you and like you say, the expected date for
Speaker 8: the results of that results of that inquest into these
Speaker 8: deaths will happen this year. So again sustaining the story
Speaker 8: in the press this year, again, keeping the story in
Speaker 8: media and in the public eye.
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, because people are going to heads are going
Speaker 2: to roll when it comes out in April. There's going
Speaker 2: to be you know, some people are going to pay
Speaker 2: the price for it, and it's going to make a
Speaker 2: lot of media. It'll make huge splash over there. Not
Speaker 2: so much in the States because of the political world
Speaker 2: and everything going on captivating the news in the US,
Speaker 2: but in the UK it's a very big story and
Speaker 2: it's very important to them. Over there.
Speaker 8: And it's interesting too. You talked about that the police
Speaker 8: introduced new guidance for them to deal with chem sex allegations,
Speaker 8: and that's also you talked about the fifty eight cases
Speaker 8: of the GHB overdose during Steven Port's three year active time.
Speaker 8: So it's not like this a review of all the
Speaker 8: cases historically. It's specifically trying to connect it to possibly
Speaker 8: Stephen Port eight cases in that three year period where
Speaker 8: he was active and in and around the area. So
Speaker 8: they're not it's not a wild assertion or assumption. It's
Speaker 8: what they think that out of those fifty eight cases,
Speaker 8: they think there may be something, don't they.
Speaker 2: Oh for sure, and there was periods of months and
Speaker 2: areas that we don't know, you know, he was active
Speaker 2: and there's no nobody has come forward. Perhaps they're people
Speaker 2: that were murdered as well that didn't escape. So and
Speaker 2: with that many bodies being found of overdose, I think
Speaker 2: that they're there. They have to be responsible now, they
Speaker 2: have to come back and they have to show some
Speaker 2: initiative to doing something for the people that that actually
Speaker 2: died from from this awful killer.
Speaker 8: Absolutely well, it's been an incredible interview with you, Alan
Speaker 8: talking about the Grinder serial killer Stephen Port. For those
Speaker 8: that might not know about your podcast, tell us about
Speaker 8: House of Mystery and a website or Facebook page where
Speaker 8: they might look for your other work or contact you
Speaker 8: if they feel necessary.
Speaker 2: Well, I have my website, alanar Warren dot com, which
Speaker 2: is just about my books, and then I have the
Speaker 2: Something Weird Media website, and that's for the radio show
Speaker 2: House of Mystery. It's on a lot of the West
Speaker 2: Coast stations and podcasts, just on five days a week,
Speaker 2: and you can play it right from most sites or
Speaker 2: right from our website.
Speaker 8: Absolutely well, thank you very much, Alan, It's been a pleasure.
Speaker 8: I hope to speak to you again soon. You have
Speaker 8: a great evening.
Speaker 2: Good night you too, Thank you.
Speaker 4: Good night, Gretta.
Speaker 5: I have a bag that I found that I think
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Speaker 3: You've been so kind. You like a cup of coffee?
Speaker 4: What chance encounter I've been so lowly? I like can
Speaker 4: help you a new connection?
Speaker 6: I mean, Trent, where is an old lady a terrifying secret?
Speaker 1: This Friday?
Speaker 3: There's something you need to know about.
Speaker 4: Don't take the debate, just try to get rid of
Speaker 4: Greta starring Chloe Grace Monratts.
Speaker 5: In theater's Friday, Dta, I have a bag that I
Speaker 5: found that I think belongs to gotahdag.
Speaker 3: Oh, you've been so kind, you like a cup of coffee.
Speaker 4: What chance encounter?
Speaker 3: I've been so lowly?
Speaker 4: Like can help you a new connection?
Speaker 5: I mean, Trent, where is an old lady.
Speaker 4: A terrifying secret?
Speaker 1: This Friday?
Speaker 3: There's something you need to know about Brad.
Speaker 4: Don't take debate, just try to get rid of Greta,
Speaker 4: starring Ploeque Race Moratsda in theater's Friday. Gretta versus.
Speaker 5: I have a bag that I found that I think
Speaker 5: belongs to Greta hadag.
Speaker 4: Oh, you've been so kind, You're like a cup of coffee,
Speaker 4: A chance encounter.
Speaker 3: I've been so lowly.
Speaker 4: I I can help you a new connection?
Speaker 6: I mean, is an old lady a terrifying Secrett this Friday?
Speaker 3: There's something you need to know about Bretta.
Speaker 4: Don't take the bate, Just try to get rid of Greta,
Speaker 4: starring Ploeque Race Morats in theaters Friday,