WEBVTT 1 00:00:00.120 --> 00:00:00.200 You. 2 00:00:00.440 --> 00:00:05.879 Chilly Effect is sponsored by Wallstreet, Window dot Com and listeners. 3 00:00:05.759 --> 00:00:12.039 Liking Yeah now the most ervated noise in our media check. 4 00:00:13.800 --> 00:00:17.960 Fourth day of February twenty twenty six, allegedly according to 5 00:00:18.000 --> 00:00:20.800 that thing we call a calendar, and your humble host 6 00:00:20.839 --> 00:00:23.920 is here despite you know it taking I don't know 7 00:00:24.000 --> 00:00:27.960 two months to find two broken bones in an exam. 8 00:00:28.320 --> 00:00:30.920 But I'm not gonna talk about those details tonight. I 9 00:00:30.960 --> 00:00:34.399 got something better to go over. I've had some emails 10 00:00:34.439 --> 00:00:37.799 recently about the jfk assassination, and I'm going to cover 11 00:00:37.840 --> 00:00:43.119 those in a news program soon. So hold on, three 12 00:00:43.159 --> 00:00:45.399 of you coming at me from three distinct angles about 13 00:00:45.439 --> 00:00:48.119 a question that I'm not even going to cover tonight. Instead, 14 00:00:48.240 --> 00:00:51.759 we're gonna go over something very different with Larry Hancock. 15 00:00:52.000 --> 00:00:54.679 Of course, Larry is the author of many, many books, 16 00:00:54.679 --> 00:00:58.000 but the most relevant ones for tonight would be the 17 00:00:58.000 --> 00:01:03.759 Oswald Puzzle primarily, but also someone would have talked, okay, gee, 18 00:01:03.799 --> 00:01:07.400 what else comes to mind here? Well, there could be 19 00:01:07.920 --> 00:01:13.599 a few others of Larry Hancock's you know, repertoire of 20 00:01:14.760 --> 00:01:18.519 books out there that will go along with this jfk assassination. 21 00:01:18.599 --> 00:01:21.000 If you don't know about Larry's stuff. There will be 22 00:01:21.040 --> 00:01:22.799 a link there, and I also want you to check 23 00:01:22.840 --> 00:01:26.120 out his blog obviously, but we're going to focus on 24 00:01:26.159 --> 00:01:31.879 something specific that I find strange because factually we've learned 25 00:01:31.879 --> 00:01:36.799 over time quite a bit about Lee Harvey Oswald and 26 00:01:37.319 --> 00:01:39.799 how he was handled, how he was arrested, how he 27 00:01:39.879 --> 00:01:42.280 was put into lineups, and I find some of that 28 00:01:42.359 --> 00:01:46.280 work fascinating when it goes further. But some people have 29 00:01:46.319 --> 00:01:48.959 been asking me questions where it's like, will you please 30 00:01:49.040 --> 00:01:51.359 go and read some of the stuff that existed for 31 00:01:51.400 --> 00:01:56.200 a long time that nobody has taken down, because initially 32 00:01:56.879 --> 00:02:00.840 there was speculation we didn't have a lot of stuff 33 00:02:00.840 --> 00:02:04.480 from the Dallas police archives. At first, we had hearsay, 34 00:02:04.920 --> 00:02:08.919 We had reports given by a few people, and you know, 35 00:02:09.039 --> 00:02:11.319 the primary person in the room was dead, that being 36 00:02:11.400 --> 00:02:14.080 leeg Oswald. That was a problem. And then you had 37 00:02:14.159 --> 00:02:18.400 dishonest agents in there of various types, whether they be 38 00:02:18.520 --> 00:02:22.479 local or federal in my estimation, So you had these weird, 39 00:02:22.520 --> 00:02:25.360 scattered reports, and then you had what survived in the 40 00:02:25.400 --> 00:02:31.120 Warren commissioned volumes, and over time people did develop stronger, 41 00:02:31.680 --> 00:02:35.919 you know, much better back to evidence to explain what happened. 42 00:02:36.560 --> 00:02:39.120 When Oswald was being ushered in and out on live 43 00:02:39.199 --> 00:02:43.960 television while the hallways were filled chaotically with newspeople and 44 00:02:44.960 --> 00:02:48.080 Jack Ruby along with a whole bunch of other people 45 00:02:48.319 --> 00:02:50.479 right that were just filing in and out of the 46 00:02:50.560 --> 00:02:53.560 Dallas Safety Building there. You saw it on live TV, 47 00:02:53.719 --> 00:02:57.080 but you didn't see the interrogation in the Robbery and 48 00:02:57.120 --> 00:03:01.039 Homicide division. And Will Fritz with his note cap you know, 49 00:03:01.400 --> 00:03:05.439 his note taking capabilities that you know, people are still 50 00:03:05.599 --> 00:03:09.639 arguing over the fragmented, nearly illiterate, you know, notes of 51 00:03:09.680 --> 00:03:13.400 Will Fritz sometimes and who did take good notes, the 52 00:03:13.400 --> 00:03:15.319 guy who came from the post office, who by the way, 53 00:03:15.400 --> 00:03:20.960 was part time FBI guy. You know, the interrogation is interesting, 54 00:03:21.520 --> 00:03:23.719 but first get the groundwork out of a way, and 55 00:03:23.759 --> 00:03:26.719 then let's talk about what actually happened, because even the 56 00:03:26.759 --> 00:03:30.319 people that noted and quoted and everything else didn't seem 57 00:03:30.360 --> 00:03:33.080 to get all of that straight. And Larry's been writing 58 00:03:33.159 --> 00:03:38.639 recently about this and about the specifics and really giving 59 00:03:38.680 --> 00:03:43.199 you a sober look without getting into hyperbole or trying 60 00:03:43.199 --> 00:03:46.159 to fill out an agenda, to tell you about what 61 00:03:46.400 --> 00:03:49.960 was going on there. And again, this is only one aspect. 62 00:03:50.039 --> 00:03:53.199 This doesn't like definitively prove this or prove that, or 63 00:03:53.560 --> 00:03:58.680 just because Oswald said this, anybody could be lying, misrepresenting 64 00:03:59.199 --> 00:04:02.639 gaming the city situation, and you have to take all 65 00:04:02.680 --> 00:04:06.159 of that into account, given the chaos that was inside 66 00:04:06.199 --> 00:04:11.240 that room and just outside of it. But again, don't 67 00:04:11.280 --> 00:04:14.039 take it from me. Let's talk to Larry Hancock again. 68 00:04:14.599 --> 00:04:16.240 You know, if you want to take a look at 69 00:04:16.240 --> 00:04:19.240 the various works of Larry's on the case, fine, if 70 00:04:19.240 --> 00:04:20.639 you want to go look at his blog, if you 71 00:04:20.680 --> 00:04:23.319 want to look at the fact that almost anybody who's 72 00:04:23.360 --> 00:04:27.319 sane in the JFK community respects anything Larry has to 73 00:04:27.360 --> 00:04:31.120 say when he analyzes this stuff. What can I tell you? 74 00:04:31.160 --> 00:04:34.360 But anyway, Larry, there will be a link there and 75 00:04:34.399 --> 00:04:36.199 a link to your books and probably a link to 76 00:04:36.240 --> 00:04:39.920 the Oswald puzzle, which the update is coming pretty soon, right. 77 00:04:41.639 --> 00:04:44.600 Update should be out in April April excellent. 78 00:04:45.240 --> 00:04:47.160 Which, by the way, we're going to start doing a 79 00:04:47.160 --> 00:04:50.560 little video aspect to this show in April if I 80 00:04:50.639 --> 00:04:54.199 get my way, No big pressure. I mean, you know, 81 00:04:54.240 --> 00:04:55.839 if you want to hold up your books or something 82 00:04:55.879 --> 00:04:58.360 on camera, I think it'll be helpful though, And we're 83 00:04:58.399 --> 00:05:00.879 definitely going to go with Rumble as the main platform, 84 00:05:02.040 --> 00:05:06.360 just because YouTube just has too many rules and I 85 00:05:06.720 --> 00:05:09.199 want to be able to speak freely. So I may 86 00:05:09.199 --> 00:05:12.199 be on Rumble with the video thing in April, but 87 00:05:12.360 --> 00:05:14.600 no big deal. You'll just either decide if you want 88 00:05:14.639 --> 00:05:16.600 to turn on your camera or not, Larry, and then 89 00:05:16.600 --> 00:05:20.120 they'll just have to stare at me. Lucky Lucky then 90 00:05:22.000 --> 00:05:26.240 So anyway, always happy to have you. But but okay, 91 00:05:26.240 --> 00:05:29.079 so in April we'll see the Oshold Bustle updated. 92 00:05:29.800 --> 00:05:38.800 Yeah, sorry, go ahead, I'd say, no problem. 93 00:05:38.800 --> 00:05:41.720 I've done Rumble before seemed to be fine, so I'll 94 00:05:41.720 --> 00:05:42.519 look forward to it. 95 00:05:42.680 --> 00:05:43.160 There you go. 96 00:05:44.240 --> 00:05:46.600 No no big pressure or anything. So all right, where 97 00:05:46.600 --> 00:05:50.319 should we Let Let's let's again go for the context here. Okay, 98 00:05:50.639 --> 00:05:53.199 what are we talking about when it comes to interrogation 99 00:05:53.360 --> 00:05:57.240 and why is this relevant? Just to get us warmed up, Larry, 100 00:05:57.279 --> 00:05:59.639 I mean, let's let's go at it, you know, like 101 00:05:59.680 --> 00:06:02.079 as if we're actually studying something properly. 102 00:06:02.839 --> 00:06:09.879 Go ahead, Yeah, And although I mean, we do have 103 00:06:09.920 --> 00:06:13.680 several sources now that we can combine that we didn't 104 00:06:13.680 --> 00:06:17.600 have in the early days. We have Fritz's testimony to 105 00:06:17.680 --> 00:06:21.920 the Warrant Commission. We have a handwritten copy of his notes, 106 00:06:22.120 --> 00:06:24.560 which made me feel good about my writing. 107 00:06:25.079 --> 00:06:26.199 His is worse. 108 00:06:27.000 --> 00:06:31.560 We have the FBI report of the interrogation. We as 109 00:06:31.600 --> 00:06:35.879 you said, we have several sources, so we can kind 110 00:06:35.920 --> 00:06:37.839 of see what was common to all of them. 111 00:06:38.680 --> 00:06:40.319 But what we I think, what. 112 00:06:40.199 --> 00:06:42.839 We know, and what we're kind of looking at and 113 00:06:42.879 --> 00:06:46.639 what I'm looking at now is what did the interrogation 114 00:06:46.759 --> 00:06:51.079 look like? From Oswall's perspective. We always look at it 115 00:06:51.120 --> 00:06:56.000 from the other side. But if you step back and 116 00:06:57.199 --> 00:07:00.639 ask the question, what was he shown in terms of 117 00:07:00.680 --> 00:07:05.199 evidence against him? How strong a case did they make 118 00:07:05.279 --> 00:07:08.199 there right in front of him. Why was it with 119 00:07:08.560 --> 00:07:10.920 all the evidence they had in hand, they didn't. 120 00:07:10.680 --> 00:07:11.720 Push it on him. 121 00:07:12.279 --> 00:07:14.879 Why was it Fritz apparently did not push him to 122 00:07:14.959 --> 00:07:19.879 sign a confession the same way he did Frasier. Why 123 00:07:20.160 --> 00:07:22.680 was it that they did not read the charges against 124 00:07:22.759 --> 00:07:27.600 him to him to help force the confession standard procedure. 125 00:07:28.000 --> 00:07:31.600 A lot of things that you would expect from Fritz, 126 00:07:31.759 --> 00:07:35.600 which are typically Fritz. Everybody in Dallas said, you know, 127 00:07:35.680 --> 00:07:39.240 he did hard nosed interrogations, He pushed for confessions. 128 00:07:40.120 --> 00:07:41.199 He was really strong. 129 00:07:41.600 --> 00:07:44.759 And the interesting thing is, if you look at it 130 00:07:44.759 --> 00:07:48.720 from Oswell's perspective, maybe you get a different view as 131 00:07:48.720 --> 00:07:51.439 to how strong a case he thought. 132 00:07:51.480 --> 00:07:52.279 He had against him. 133 00:07:53.199 --> 00:07:56.360 And if you think Oswald didn't didn't do it, and 134 00:07:56.519 --> 00:07:59.160 was sitting there knowing he didn't do it, what's. 135 00:07:59.000 --> 00:08:00.319 Going through oswell it? 136 00:08:00.639 --> 00:08:02.959 Right, So let me interrupt you with just a few 137 00:08:03.040 --> 00:08:05.319 things that I think I would love to hear you 138 00:08:05.399 --> 00:08:10.560 touch on, which is, primarily, let's not forget the district's attorney, 139 00:08:10.600 --> 00:08:13.560 Wade is outside the door talking to the media right 140 00:08:14.720 --> 00:08:18.279 while this guy's being interrogated. He's certainly got to have 141 00:08:18.360 --> 00:08:21.120 some sort of influence on it. And as we've studied 142 00:08:21.120 --> 00:08:25.920 his record posthumously, you know, we find that maybe there 143 00:08:26.000 --> 00:08:28.199 was a little you know, tipping of the scales with 144 00:08:28.279 --> 00:08:31.079 a thumb now and then with this guy just saying 145 00:08:31.120 --> 00:08:33.519 if you take a look at the overturned convictions, et cetera, 146 00:08:33.879 --> 00:08:35.799 and the fact that he was saying, look, every time 147 00:08:35.840 --> 00:08:37.320 I go for the death penalty, I get it. And 148 00:08:37.360 --> 00:08:41.120 he's telling the media this, Okay, you know clearly right 149 00:08:41.159 --> 00:08:45.799 away that's interesting. What is his influence on the circumstance, 150 00:08:45.879 --> 00:08:50.559 one would wonder number one. Number two, the conspiracy advocate 151 00:08:50.720 --> 00:08:54.159 often points to this whole thing with the backyard photographs. Right, 152 00:08:54.720 --> 00:08:58.759 Oswald was shown this photograph. Well, there's a process by 153 00:08:58.799 --> 00:09:02.639 which that photograph was created. It had to be retrieved 154 00:09:02.639 --> 00:09:05.879 from the pain's house. So there's a timing element here 155 00:09:05.960 --> 00:09:08.960 that I think is completely You know, whether people want 156 00:09:09.000 --> 00:09:12.639 to argue for or against the backyard photographs, they often 157 00:09:12.799 --> 00:09:17.360 skip this entire episode or they try to utilize it 158 00:09:17.440 --> 00:09:19.960 in order to bolster their case one way or another. 159 00:09:20.480 --> 00:09:24.679 And I do mean that's everything from Boogliosi to you know, 160 00:09:24.799 --> 00:09:26.879 God help me. I think Judy Baker mentions it in 161 00:09:26.879 --> 00:09:31.000 her book. I mean, you know, here we go, there's 162 00:09:31.000 --> 00:09:33.320 something to this that I think a sober look at 163 00:09:33.440 --> 00:09:36.399 that photograph. Was it presented, how was it presented, When 164 00:09:36.600 --> 00:09:40.799 was it presented? And lastly, a very common element here, 165 00:09:40.879 --> 00:09:44.679 regardless who the suspect is, regardless who the police are, 166 00:09:45.159 --> 00:09:50.279 what about the interrogation technique itself. It's very lengthy. Some 167 00:09:50.320 --> 00:09:54.200 would say because of the importance of the injured parties. Okay, 168 00:09:54.240 --> 00:09:59.240 the importance of the murder victims. Therefore his interrogation is lengthy. 169 00:09:59.679 --> 00:10:03.840 But that lengthy interrogation is a technique in and of itself, 170 00:10:04.559 --> 00:10:09.320 and I don't often hear a real analyzation of the 171 00:10:09.360 --> 00:10:13.759 technique used to interrogate Oswalt, which is extremely important for 172 00:10:13.840 --> 00:10:17.000 his mindset, whether he's guilty or not, whether he thinks 173 00:10:17.039 --> 00:10:19.720 he's clever, whether he thinks he's an agent on assignment, 174 00:10:20.159 --> 00:10:22.279 or whether he's you know, the idiot that tried to 175 00:10:22.279 --> 00:10:24.960 get himself in the history books. As you know, Jero 176 00:10:25.039 --> 00:10:28.960 Posner likes to say, you know, either way, we have 177 00:10:29.039 --> 00:10:33.000 to look at this from a psychological perspective, because interrogation 178 00:10:33.600 --> 00:10:40.120 is a strategic, psychological and very often, you know, quite 179 00:10:40.279 --> 00:10:46.240 regulated sort of technique of an interaction where the cops 180 00:10:46.279 --> 00:10:49.879 have a way of doing things. They specifically do things, 181 00:10:49.879 --> 00:10:52.240 whether it's to put you in a chair with uneven legs, 182 00:10:52.720 --> 00:10:54.840 or to deny you water, or to make you ask 183 00:10:54.919 --> 00:10:57.720 for water, or to put pressure on you, or to 184 00:10:57.799 --> 00:11:01.519 offer you food. Every one of these is meant to 185 00:11:01.559 --> 00:11:04.200 be a strategic chess piece being moved on a board. 186 00:11:05.000 --> 00:11:08.679 And I don't often hear anybody talk about that. So 187 00:11:09.159 --> 00:11:12.639 those three elements, Larry, what do you think, am I 188 00:11:12.759 --> 00:11:15.879 you know, you know, just grasping a crazy straws here 189 00:11:16.399 --> 00:11:18.360 or or These are the things that have been lacking 190 00:11:18.440 --> 00:11:20.960 for quite a long time when people discuss this. 191 00:11:23.399 --> 00:11:25.080 Well, let's take them one at a time. 192 00:11:25.480 --> 00:11:30.320 The first Wade, you know, the district attorney talking to 193 00:11:30.360 --> 00:11:34.679 the press, is totally out of line for one thing, 194 00:11:34.720 --> 00:11:38.279 but again we are in Dallas, so okay. But I 195 00:11:38.279 --> 00:11:41.159 think the most interesting thing is the question of what 196 00:11:41.279 --> 00:11:44.159 evidence Wade would have seen at that point in time. 197 00:11:44.759 --> 00:11:49.159 Because he is talking so early in the process, that's 198 00:11:49.320 --> 00:11:52.440 there's no sign that he had talked and gone through 199 00:11:52.480 --> 00:11:54.879 the crime scene evidence that he had talked with the 200 00:11:54.919 --> 00:11:59.799 crime scene people. There's just no evidence at all that 201 00:11:59.840 --> 00:12:03.799 he had any body of materials to put into a charge. 202 00:12:04.240 --> 00:12:07.559 And that's a really important question because normally, when a 203 00:12:07.679 --> 00:12:11.200 DA you know, writes a charge, there's a reference to 204 00:12:11.240 --> 00:12:15.559 a body of information to support it. We actually know 205 00:12:15.879 --> 00:12:20.399 that the apparent, the original and this was tossed out 206 00:12:21.399 --> 00:12:25.639 charge against Oswald was simply going to be uh, killed 207 00:12:25.639 --> 00:12:29.679 the president in conjunction with the conspiracy against the government, 208 00:12:30.279 --> 00:12:33.360 you know, the conspiracy was going to be right there 209 00:12:33.360 --> 00:12:37.519 in the charge, and that was thrown out. So for 210 00:12:37.639 --> 00:12:42.360 one thing, we've got, we've got charges being written with 211 00:12:43.399 --> 00:12:47.039 no indication that there was a rigorous process, you know, 212 00:12:47.159 --> 00:12:50.440 a normal legal process of going what do we have 213 00:12:50.600 --> 00:12:53.480 let's write this into it how firm a case. Now, 214 00:12:53.559 --> 00:12:56.519 He's just out there talking, and that's Wade, that's what 215 00:12:56.559 --> 00:12:57.559 he does, right. 216 00:12:57.720 --> 00:13:01.759 But Wade is not speaking from a one percent fabricated 217 00:13:01.759 --> 00:13:06.559 imaginary position either. He's describing some evidence which has been 218 00:13:06.600 --> 00:13:10.159 collected to the press before he's even really had a 219 00:13:10.240 --> 00:13:12.279 chance to look at it. And on the other hand, 220 00:13:12.679 --> 00:13:15.840 in my estimation, he's speaking out a turn on the timeline, 221 00:13:16.000 --> 00:13:18.759 like literally speaking about having proof of him fired a 222 00:13:18.799 --> 00:13:23.120 weapon before the paraffin test was even performed, it seems 223 00:13:23.200 --> 00:13:25.039 like to me, or before you know, maybe when it 224 00:13:25.080 --> 00:13:28.559 was collected, but not when anybody tested anything. And that 225 00:13:28.879 --> 00:13:32.080 is interesting because he says, obviously he fired a rifle 226 00:13:32.120 --> 00:13:34.919 that day, which is based on what you know, what 227 00:13:34.960 --> 00:13:37.559 it's based on now. But the thing is, at the 228 00:13:37.600 --> 00:13:40.320 time he first makes that statement to the press, he 229 00:13:40.360 --> 00:13:44.600 couldn't possibly have seen the collected and analyzed evidence. On 230 00:13:44.639 --> 00:13:47.639 the other hand, he's not like making stuff up out 231 00:13:47.679 --> 00:13:53.000 of thin air. He's assuming you know, the positive or 232 00:13:53.120 --> 00:13:58.320 the you know, probative. In other words, he's presuming that 233 00:13:58.360 --> 00:14:00.919 he's got useful pieces of information out of tests that 234 00:14:00.960 --> 00:14:04.639 are still in progress, which is amazing to me. According 235 00:14:04.639 --> 00:14:07.159 to what I see on the timeline. But then again, 236 00:14:07.679 --> 00:14:09.840 I think at best we could say that Wade is 237 00:14:12.279 --> 00:14:17.639 not the most reliable measurement of the chronological events here 238 00:14:17.799 --> 00:14:20.120 when he's giving him to the press and what's actually 239 00:14:20.159 --> 00:14:23.840 been collected or confirmed behind the scenes. Is that fair? 240 00:14:26.159 --> 00:14:26.600 That's fair? 241 00:14:26.639 --> 00:14:29.159 And that's what I was really getting at is he's 242 00:14:29.279 --> 00:14:33.080 making affirmative statements out of some things that have been 243 00:14:33.120 --> 00:14:36.840 collected but not tested, and that could have been a 244 00:14:36.879 --> 00:14:40.200 real problem for him in a trial because the attorney 245 00:14:40.240 --> 00:14:43.879 could very well challenge, you know, let's look at the 246 00:14:43.919 --> 00:14:47.200 basis of your charge that you wrote. This man was charged, 247 00:14:47.759 --> 00:14:51.399 and we have you on tape making all these claims 248 00:14:51.440 --> 00:14:55.639 that now you can't prove, So let's just toss this out. 249 00:14:55.799 --> 00:14:58.720 You really didn't have the evidence that you said you 250 00:14:58.840 --> 00:15:01.080 had to charge him in the first place. Could have 251 00:15:01.120 --> 00:15:03.360 been a real problem if it had gone to trial. 252 00:15:03.440 --> 00:15:09.200 With him talking, he's talking about items of evidence that 253 00:15:09.360 --> 00:15:11.279 aren't provable at that point in time. 254 00:15:11.320 --> 00:15:12.600 They've just been collected. 255 00:15:13.159 --> 00:15:15.279 He thinks they're going to be proved, but as we 256 00:15:15.360 --> 00:15:17.679 now know, there are issues with almost all of them. 257 00:15:17.759 --> 00:15:19.120 So yeah, I agree, Chuck. 258 00:15:19.000 --> 00:15:21.519 He's he's way ahead of his time, and it could 259 00:15:21.519 --> 00:15:23.080 have been a problem in a real trial. 260 00:15:24.039 --> 00:15:27.000 Now the counter, Now the counter, I'm sorry, Larry, but 261 00:15:27.039 --> 00:15:29.759 the counter to that is very simple because it was 262 00:15:29.840 --> 00:15:33.279 proven later on through the Innocence Project that on many 263 00:15:33.320 --> 00:15:40.639 occasions the people in Wade's office either withheld or manufactured 264 00:15:41.039 --> 00:15:44.159 or lost, you know, evidence that they should have given 265 00:15:44.200 --> 00:15:46.639 to the defense because it would have been you know, 266 00:15:47.120 --> 00:15:49.360 if it undermines your case and you collected it, you 267 00:15:49.440 --> 00:15:50.799 have to offer it to the defense. 268 00:15:50.879 --> 00:15:51.080 Right. 269 00:15:51.919 --> 00:15:54.200 That's just you know, it's typical. There's a way of 270 00:15:54.240 --> 00:15:56.519 putting that. I forget how to put that in legal ease, 271 00:15:57.120 --> 00:15:59.679 but I mean, the fact is this guy manipulated the 272 00:15:59.720 --> 00:16:03.279 evidence on more than one occasion. That's why there were 273 00:16:03.360 --> 00:16:07.960 death penalties overturned posthumously, you know, after Weed was out 274 00:16:08.000 --> 00:16:12.399 of office and his successor was gone. Even so you 275 00:16:12.480 --> 00:16:15.240 got to say that it may be that he had 276 00:16:15.279 --> 00:16:17.480 confidence in it because he knew that even if it 277 00:16:17.519 --> 00:16:21.519 didn't fit, he'd make it fit, you know, which is 278 00:16:22.039 --> 00:16:23.480 a weird way to look at it, but true. 279 00:16:23.879 --> 00:16:25.639 Basically just standard practice. 280 00:16:25.960 --> 00:16:29.519 I mean, basically, I've done this before. This is the 281 00:16:29.559 --> 00:16:32.480 way we do things here, and we make it work. 282 00:16:33.039 --> 00:16:36.679 And in truth, you know, speaking if it were just 283 00:16:36.799 --> 00:16:40.000 a Texas crime, just stay Dallas crime and nothing else, 284 00:16:40.679 --> 00:16:44.320 there'd been no state level investigation, no federal you know. 285 00:16:45.399 --> 00:16:46.679 That's that's a good point. 286 00:16:46.879 --> 00:16:50.240 And maybe he just he wasn't thinking far enough the 287 00:16:50.320 --> 00:16:52.559 head to say think that he wasn't going to get 288 00:16:52.600 --> 00:16:55.360 away with his standard practices. 289 00:16:55.159 --> 00:16:55.879 Right right now. 290 00:16:55.879 --> 00:16:57.600 I just wanted to point that out. I mean, Larry, 291 00:16:57.600 --> 00:17:01.120 I'm sorry, but it's relevant because, like I said, after 292 00:17:01.200 --> 00:17:04.519 the long after the fact, long after the DA has 293 00:17:04.559 --> 00:17:07.279 his you know, stellar record with his death penalty convictions, 294 00:17:07.279 --> 00:17:11.079 et cetera. You know, here we go. Now, some people 295 00:17:11.079 --> 00:17:12.720 have bargained, well, he knew that he would never get 296 00:17:12.759 --> 00:17:15.400 the trial. I don't think Wade had any idea he 297 00:17:15.400 --> 00:17:19.200 would never get the trial, you know. But but Wade 298 00:17:19.279 --> 00:17:21.319 might have thought that he had control of things enough 299 00:17:21.400 --> 00:17:23.119 that one way or another, I'm going to get enough 300 00:17:23.119 --> 00:17:27.079 in there to convict this guy. It's a done deal. Now, 301 00:17:27.119 --> 00:17:29.960 what he was basing that on would be pure speculation 302 00:17:30.119 --> 00:17:34.160 on anybody's part. But I just point out that he 303 00:17:34.279 --> 00:17:37.039 is literally making public statements that you can line up 304 00:17:37.079 --> 00:17:39.759 to the you know what, the events as they're unfolding 305 00:17:39.759 --> 00:17:44.839 behind the scenes, and it's inconsistent all over the place. 306 00:17:45.079 --> 00:17:48.000 So you know, don't take Henry Wade's statements to try 307 00:17:48.000 --> 00:17:50.039 and prove something did or did not happen by the 308 00:17:50.079 --> 00:17:52.720 time he made that statement, is all I'm trying to 309 00:17:52.880 --> 00:17:54.440 establish here. Would you agree to that? 310 00:17:56.160 --> 00:17:59.920 Oh yeah, Wade is just doing what he always does. 311 00:18:00.640 --> 00:18:03.480 And I think that's an important point to make in 312 00:18:03.599 --> 00:18:04.119 all of this. 313 00:18:05.039 --> 00:18:10.640 People, the Dallas Police did what they normally did standard practice. 314 00:18:10.680 --> 00:18:13.640 They didn't necessarily do what we like for them to 315 00:18:13.720 --> 00:18:17.200 have done. They didn't necessarily do what we would consider 316 00:18:17.400 --> 00:18:22.519 acceptable practices today. They just did standard practice for the 317 00:18:22.599 --> 00:18:27.559 Dallas Police, which and you'll recall you probably recall this, 318 00:18:27.960 --> 00:18:32.519 Sherry Feist, who's a crime scene specialist and evidence specialist, 319 00:18:32.839 --> 00:18:35.680 took a look at their protocols and basically reached that 320 00:18:35.720 --> 00:18:39.640 same conclusion. No, it's not at all what would be 321 00:18:39.680 --> 00:18:42.759 acceptable to day, but it was standard practice for that 322 00:18:42.880 --> 00:18:43.640 day in time. 323 00:18:43.960 --> 00:18:46.079 Fair enough. But again, you got to put it in 324 00:18:46.119 --> 00:18:48.640 its place. That's when it happened, that's where it happened. 325 00:18:48.680 --> 00:18:51.599 So we were dealing with those circumstances. And the reason 326 00:18:51.680 --> 00:18:54.119 why this is relevant to the interrogation, by the way 327 00:18:54.480 --> 00:18:59.160 directly is because guess what that Robbery Homicide Division had 328 00:18:59.200 --> 00:19:02.799 behaved this way with that DA, with that regime, with 329 00:19:02.920 --> 00:19:06.039 that atmosphere in that place in time. So this is 330 00:19:06.079 --> 00:19:09.519 how they're handling Oswald. I'm just saying, it's a matter 331 00:19:09.640 --> 00:19:13.720 of posture. It's a matter of patterns of behavior that 332 00:19:14.240 --> 00:19:16.480 you wind up seeing and saying yourself, well, that doesn't 333 00:19:16.559 --> 00:19:20.440 quite seem right. You got to know what circumstances was 334 00:19:20.480 --> 00:19:24.720 occurring in and all of the previous standard operating procedure 335 00:19:24.880 --> 00:19:26.079 is relevant to this, right. 336 00:19:28.880 --> 00:19:29.799 Yeah. 337 00:19:29.359 --> 00:19:32.359 And another thing when we're talking about this, we also 338 00:19:32.480 --> 00:19:36.359 have to remember Oswald was in custody for quite a 339 00:19:36.400 --> 00:19:39.680 long time. Actually, I mean he was in custody for 340 00:19:40.079 --> 00:19:41.359 several hours. 341 00:19:41.000 --> 00:19:42.359 The evening assassination. 342 00:19:43.119 --> 00:19:47.519 He was in custody and subject interrogation the complete day 343 00:19:47.559 --> 00:19:48.839 of Saturday. 344 00:19:48.400 --> 00:19:49.759 And evening of Saturday. 345 00:19:50.279 --> 00:19:56.559 It was in custody and received further questioning on Sunday morning. 346 00:19:57.319 --> 00:20:00.279 So there's really plenty of time to bring us much 347 00:20:00.279 --> 00:20:04.160 pressure on Oswald as you want to. You know, It's 348 00:20:04.200 --> 00:20:06.720 not like I think sometimes people collapse this and say, 349 00:20:06.759 --> 00:20:07.599 well he was. 350 00:20:07.640 --> 00:20:10.279 Killed, well, not quickly. 351 00:20:10.599 --> 00:20:13.799 There was plenty of time for the interrogation process to 352 00:20:13.839 --> 00:20:17.920 be to be pursued, and I think put plenty of 353 00:20:17.960 --> 00:20:22.279 time to wear him down, to feed him evidence bit 354 00:20:22.400 --> 00:20:25.200 by bit, you know, building the case in front of him, 355 00:20:25.200 --> 00:20:27.000 which is often the police practice. 356 00:20:27.119 --> 00:20:29.319 You know, you don't you don't have to do everything 357 00:20:29.359 --> 00:20:29.839 at once. 358 00:20:32.000 --> 00:20:36.359 But as you remarked earlier, the one big variable that 359 00:20:36.480 --> 00:20:39.880 seems to be in play is that Fritz did not 360 00:20:40.200 --> 00:20:46.839 interrogate Oswald in the same fashion that matched his reputation. 361 00:20:47.480 --> 00:20:49.839 It was not a hard press. In fact, if you 362 00:20:49.920 --> 00:20:53.839 looked at at most of his questions, the vast majority 363 00:20:53.839 --> 00:20:58.039 of his questions, our background questions, there are questions that 364 00:20:58.079 --> 00:21:01.119 would lean more towards mode. 365 00:21:01.359 --> 00:21:03.680 Then they would Okay, we know you did this. 366 00:21:03.759 --> 00:21:06.680 Here's here's the rifle, here's the bag, here's the bullets. 367 00:21:06.799 --> 00:21:11.240 You know, here's the fingerprints signed the confession, which which 368 00:21:11.319 --> 00:21:15.119 is the way apparently they handle Frasier did not handle 369 00:21:15.160 --> 00:21:18.720 Oswell in nearly the same fashion. 370 00:21:20.440 --> 00:21:24.079 Right, and they had almost twelve hours in between his 371 00:21:24.319 --> 00:21:26.920 capture and the time that they hauld him before a 372 00:21:27.039 --> 00:21:30.640 judge to formally charge him. I think with Kennedy right, 373 00:21:31.000 --> 00:21:33.720 because it's at like one am or something where they 374 00:21:33.880 --> 00:21:37.359 at local time, I think where they actually had the 375 00:21:37.440 --> 00:21:40.680 charge read to him, where his response, I think was 376 00:21:40.759 --> 00:21:44.519 this is ridiculous, and then they haul them away, you 377 00:21:44.519 --> 00:21:46.640 know when they tell him that, and they had him 378 00:21:46.640 --> 00:21:49.039 in custody all that time. They're asking him questions like 379 00:21:49.440 --> 00:21:51.960 whose car is this? Why were you staying at a 380 00:21:52.039 --> 00:21:54.799 rooming house? You know, what time did you leave work? 381 00:21:54.880 --> 00:21:56.640 What time did you go into work? I mean, this 382 00:21:56.759 --> 00:21:59.759 is literally what's going on for these twelve hours, Like 383 00:21:59.759 --> 00:22:05.200 they're going back over seemingly unconnected questions just to establish 384 00:22:05.279 --> 00:22:07.839 a whole bunch of facts and see if they can 385 00:22:07.839 --> 00:22:10.000 trip them up and get them to lie about something 386 00:22:10.079 --> 00:22:12.920 stupid like you know, how often did you go to 387 00:22:12.960 --> 00:22:17.480 the painshouse? I mean, is that not a fair characterization? 388 00:22:17.599 --> 00:22:20.759 Or am I reading a role that is not a 389 00:22:20.799 --> 00:22:24.599 criminal investigation where you lay the rifle down and say, look, 390 00:22:25.160 --> 00:22:26.839 here's the picture of you with this rifle. 391 00:22:27.039 --> 00:22:29.519 Here's the rifle. Your prints are on the rifle. 392 00:22:29.559 --> 00:22:33.000 We've verified that by the way you carried it to 393 00:22:33.039 --> 00:22:34.880 work in a bag. Here's the bag. Your prints are 394 00:22:34.880 --> 00:22:37.960 on the bag. Sign the confession, you know, but you 395 00:22:37.960 --> 00:22:42.039 know that would be typical Fritz. But if you list 396 00:22:42.480 --> 00:22:45.160 make a list of what was not shown to Oswald, 397 00:22:45.480 --> 00:22:48.640 they show a picture of the rifle, him holding a 398 00:22:48.720 --> 00:22:51.160 rifle in the photo. They don't show on the rifle. 399 00:22:51.799 --> 00:22:55.480 They don't say, clearly, this is the rifle in the picture. Okay, 400 00:22:55.839 --> 00:22:59.680 fess up, it's yours. How can you deny it? You know, 401 00:23:00.039 --> 00:23:02.240