WEBVTT

1
00:00:06.719 --> 00:00:09.560
<v Speaker 1>Most of us, when looking at a character like Buffalo

2
00:00:09.560 --> 00:00:12.800
<v Speaker 1>Bill from the movie The Silence of the Lambs, probably

3
00:00:12.800 --> 00:00:15.800
<v Speaker 1>find him more than a bit creepy. But we also

4
00:00:15.839 --> 00:00:18.239
<v Speaker 1>go to sleep at night thinking there's no one in

5
00:00:18.280 --> 00:00:21.399
<v Speaker 1>the real world who do the horrible and terrible things

6
00:00:21.679 --> 00:00:26.920
<v Speaker 1>that Buffalo Bill did. Unfortunately, that's not the case, and

7
00:00:26.960 --> 00:00:30.480
<v Speaker 1>we're about to prove yet again that sometimes life is

8
00:00:30.480 --> 00:00:32.880
<v Speaker 1>more brutal and horrible than fiction.

9
00:00:34.600 --> 00:00:39.119
<v Speaker 2>I'm Nicole, I'm Ben, and this is Wicked and Grim,

10
00:00:39.159 --> 00:00:44.799
<v Speaker 2>a true crime podcast. Good morning. The following podcasts.

11
00:00:45.920 --> 00:01:10.280
<v Speaker 1>Semi audience listener, just question, is that much? Are you

12
00:01:10.359 --> 00:01:11.400
<v Speaker 1>really just drinking water?

13
00:01:11.519 --> 00:01:13.480
<v Speaker 2>I am, But I have a straw, so it's okay.

14
00:01:13.519 --> 00:01:15.640
<v Speaker 1>So that makes it better. Hey, it's like the equivalent

15
00:01:15.640 --> 00:01:16.000
<v Speaker 1>of beer.

16
00:01:16.519 --> 00:01:18.760
<v Speaker 2>Well not quite, but it makes me feel a little

17
00:01:18.799 --> 00:01:20.319
<v Speaker 2>bit happier because there's a straw.

18
00:01:20.439 --> 00:01:21.560
<v Speaker 1>You love your straws.

19
00:01:21.560 --> 00:01:24.680
<v Speaker 2>I do. Straws are dope. Although I broke this one,

20
00:01:24.719 --> 00:01:28.840
<v Speaker 2>I think, oh seriously, I was chewing it slightly earlier.

21
00:01:29.120 --> 00:01:30.799
<v Speaker 1>Cracked stress chewing.

22
00:01:31.159 --> 00:01:33.920
<v Speaker 2>Not really. It was more like there's a straw, I'm

23
00:01:33.920 --> 00:01:37.079
<v Speaker 2>gonna bite it, and I heard a crack. Oh it's

24
00:01:37.120 --> 00:01:37.920
<v Speaker 2>as simple as that.

25
00:01:38.319 --> 00:01:42.760
<v Speaker 1>Okay, Well, welcome. This is literally our last episode before

26
00:01:42.799 --> 00:01:45.120
<v Speaker 1>we're celebrating our second annivers.

27
00:01:44.599 --> 00:01:48.280
<v Speaker 2>A ring two years Wick and and Grim podcasting. That

28
00:01:48.359 --> 00:01:48.920
<v Speaker 2>is wild.

29
00:01:49.040 --> 00:01:51.000
<v Speaker 1>You would have thought like I honestly don't think I

30
00:01:51.000 --> 00:01:54.319
<v Speaker 1>would have thought that. Well, No, I would have. I

31
00:01:54.319 --> 00:01:55.799
<v Speaker 1>don't think I would have thought we would be here

32
00:01:55.840 --> 00:01:56.719
<v Speaker 1>by now, though.

33
00:01:56.519 --> 00:01:57.879
<v Speaker 2>Like you thought, we would have given.

34
00:01:57.760 --> 00:02:01.920
<v Speaker 1>Up possibly bucket we're done. Yeah, but no, this has

35
00:02:01.959 --> 00:02:05.719
<v Speaker 1>been like fun and enjoyable, and the connections that we've

36
00:02:05.760 --> 00:02:08.159
<v Speaker 1>made and the people that we have in our corner

37
00:02:08.280 --> 00:02:09.560
<v Speaker 1>is unbelievable. It is.

38
00:02:09.759 --> 00:02:13.719
<v Speaker 2>We've turned into a pretty successful indie podcast as far. Yeah,

39
00:02:13.759 --> 00:02:16.879
<v Speaker 2>I'm concerned so and it's been a blast this whole time.

40
00:02:16.919 --> 00:02:19.240
<v Speaker 2>And I still feel like we still don't know what

41
00:02:19.240 --> 00:02:19.919
<v Speaker 2>the fuck we're doing.

42
00:02:20.120 --> 00:02:22.759
<v Speaker 1>No, I feel like, yes, sometimes I'm even like I

43
00:02:22.800 --> 00:02:24.080
<v Speaker 1>know less what I'm doing.

44
00:02:24.039 --> 00:02:26.879
<v Speaker 2>You know less, just question everything everything.

45
00:02:27.000 --> 00:02:28.719
<v Speaker 1>I do, actually question more things.

46
00:02:28.919 --> 00:02:31.719
<v Speaker 2>So well, I'm glad we're still rolling. And thanks to

47
00:02:31.759 --> 00:02:33.639
<v Speaker 2>you guys for the support this entire time.

48
00:02:34.159 --> 00:02:35.800
<v Speaker 1>And you guys are awesome.

49
00:02:35.960 --> 00:02:38.479
<v Speaker 2>Speaking of thanking people, we have patrons to thank this week.

50
00:02:38.879 --> 00:02:43.280
<v Speaker 2>Signed up so I have not pre prepared reading the

51
00:02:43.360 --> 00:02:46.560
<v Speaker 2>names this time. I just realized Oh, so I'm gonna

52
00:02:46.560 --> 00:02:48.120
<v Speaker 2>fly by the seat of my pants and who luck

53
00:02:48.240 --> 00:02:49.719
<v Speaker 2>that I do get names correct?

54
00:02:49.879 --> 00:02:50.439
<v Speaker 1>You got this?

55
00:02:50.639 --> 00:02:54.800
<v Speaker 2>Okay? Fingers crossed. This week we had Emily Mueller sign up, nice,

56
00:02:55.000 --> 00:03:01.479
<v Speaker 2>Eric Ordway, Christina Branson, Kelseina Cole, and Jenna Neutral right on.

57
00:03:01.719 --> 00:03:03.240
<v Speaker 2>I really hope I got your names right.

58
00:03:03.280 --> 00:03:05.439
<v Speaker 1>It sounded like you fucking knew them right, like that

59
00:03:05.520 --> 00:03:06.560
<v Speaker 1>they were all your friends.

60
00:03:06.719 --> 00:03:09.280
<v Speaker 2>The key is confidence there you go. Key is just

61
00:03:09.520 --> 00:03:10.840
<v Speaker 2>fake it till you make it right.

62
00:03:11.199 --> 00:03:14.039
<v Speaker 1>Yeah. Actually I need to learn that sometimes a bit better.

63
00:03:14.560 --> 00:03:16.360
<v Speaker 2>But yeah, thank you so much for signing up. Over

64
00:03:16.400 --> 00:03:19.080
<v Speaker 2>on Patreon, you guys are going to be getting a

65
00:03:19.159 --> 00:03:22.680
<v Speaker 2>little extra coming in the next week or so, maybe

66
00:03:23.159 --> 00:03:25.919
<v Speaker 2>because we are doing a Wicked Box giveaway.

67
00:03:25.639 --> 00:03:27.520
<v Speaker 1>We are for our second anniversary. Yeah.

68
00:03:27.599 --> 00:03:29.280
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, Well it's just kind of coinciding because we've been

69
00:03:29.280 --> 00:03:30.039
<v Speaker 2>wanting to do it so long.

70
00:03:30.159 --> 00:03:31.840
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, it kind of all lined up at the same time.

71
00:03:31.840 --> 00:03:33.759
<v Speaker 1>We're like, this is perfect. It was meant to be.

72
00:03:33.960 --> 00:03:36.360
<v Speaker 2>It got delayed with stuff being shipped in, but now

73
00:03:36.400 --> 00:03:38.680
<v Speaker 2>we have it all. It's coming in this week. We're

74
00:03:38.680 --> 00:03:41.400
<v Speaker 2>going to do one public over on Instagram and facebooks.

75
00:03:41.400 --> 00:03:42.960
<v Speaker 2>You can go over there and have a chance to

76
00:03:43.000 --> 00:03:46.000
<v Speaker 2>win with some cool stuff inside this box and then

77
00:03:46.039 --> 00:03:47.280
<v Speaker 2>one specifically on Patreon.

78
00:03:47.400 --> 00:03:49.439
<v Speaker 1>So, and then we got some new merch drop in.

79
00:03:49.840 --> 00:03:52.159
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, to celebrate two years.

80
00:03:52.280 --> 00:03:53.960
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, are you going to share what it is? Of

81
00:03:53.960 --> 00:03:56.199
<v Speaker 1>course it's all drawn by Ben and done by Ben.

82
00:03:56.439 --> 00:03:59.159
<v Speaker 2>Yeah. Well we're doing we're taking the one Wicked year

83
00:03:59.159 --> 00:04:02.479
<v Speaker 2>design revamping that. So it's just going to say, uh,

84
00:04:02.680 --> 00:04:04.639
<v Speaker 2>we haven't decided just yet. That's the last one we

85
00:04:04.680 --> 00:04:06.599
<v Speaker 2>got to design. It's either stay Wicked or Wicked and

86
00:04:06.599 --> 00:04:09.719
<v Speaker 2>Graham or Wicked and Graham. And then we've got one

87
00:04:09.719 --> 00:04:14.680
<v Speaker 2>that says stay with like thirty thousand y's on it,

88
00:04:14.759 --> 00:04:16.879
<v Speaker 2>and then at the end it says Wicked Wicked and

89
00:04:16.920 --> 00:04:18.439
<v Speaker 2>then not Cool Carl.

90
00:04:18.959 --> 00:04:21.199
<v Speaker 1>Not Cool Carl. I'm humped for that one.

91
00:04:21.240 --> 00:04:24.680
<v Speaker 2>Actually, finally dropping that one, and finally to go along

92
00:04:24.720 --> 00:04:28.639
<v Speaker 2>with mister Bones, we have Missus Bones. Yeah, so head

93
00:04:28.639 --> 00:04:30.199
<v Speaker 2>on over to our red Bubble to check them out.

94
00:04:30.360 --> 00:04:32.120
<v Speaker 2>Coming tomorrow the.

95
00:04:32.079 --> 00:04:35.639
<v Speaker 1>Eighth, Yeah, Wednesday, right, yes, February eighth. And just like

96
00:04:35.720 --> 00:04:39.279
<v Speaker 1>backtracked slightly. So the Not Cool Carl is like we

97
00:04:39.399 --> 00:04:42.680
<v Speaker 1>had anything two or three episodes in a row or something.

98
00:04:42.720 --> 00:04:46.000
<v Speaker 1>We're literally like the freaking Douche Canoe was Carl or one.

99
00:04:46.199 --> 00:04:48.759
<v Speaker 2>I remember it was around Carl Tansler was one of them.

100
00:04:49.079 --> 00:04:51.399
<v Speaker 2>So it was in those episodes somewhereere we actually talked

101
00:04:51.399 --> 00:04:52.279
<v Speaker 2>about not cool.

102
00:04:52.079 --> 00:04:54.519
<v Speaker 1>Carl, Yeah, because there was quite a few Carls that

103
00:04:54.560 --> 00:04:57.480
<v Speaker 1>are like, yes city. Yeah, so that's where that kind

104
00:04:57.519 --> 00:05:01.399
<v Speaker 1>of came from. So yeah, yeah, that's exciting. Okay, and

105
00:05:01.399 --> 00:05:04.720
<v Speaker 1>then really really quickly, we'll post a photo on Instagram.

106
00:05:04.759 --> 00:05:06.800
<v Speaker 1>But we rescued a peppers.

107
00:05:07.000 --> 00:05:07.439
<v Speaker 2>We did.

108
00:05:08.199 --> 00:05:11.120
<v Speaker 1>Her name is Honey, Honey. She is like the sweetest

109
00:05:11.160 --> 00:05:12.439
<v Speaker 1>fucking thing in the whole world.

110
00:05:12.800 --> 00:05:15.040
<v Speaker 2>She needed a new home. We went to the SPCA

111
00:05:15.279 --> 00:05:18.160
<v Speaker 2>and she fit right in at home with Ripley. Ripley

112
00:05:18.199 --> 00:05:18.920
<v Speaker 2>needed a new friend.

113
00:05:18.959 --> 00:05:21.720
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, so we fought. We fostered her for a bit,

114
00:05:21.759 --> 00:05:23.600
<v Speaker 1>and yeah, it was unbelievable. It was like it was

115
00:05:23.639 --> 00:05:26.439
<v Speaker 1>meant to be, because yeah, Ripley hasn't been like thriving

116
00:05:26.639 --> 00:05:29.360
<v Speaker 1>being a solo dog. So yeah, this is gonna be

117
00:05:29.439 --> 00:05:32.839
<v Speaker 1>good for good for everyone involved. I think everyone's hearts and.

118
00:05:33.079 --> 00:05:34.360
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, so far, so good.

119
00:05:34.600 --> 00:05:36.480
<v Speaker 1>Yeah. Yeah, so we'll post a photo.

120
00:05:36.519 --> 00:05:38.800
<v Speaker 2>She's really sweet, one hundred percent. Go check it out.

121
00:05:39.519 --> 00:05:41.439
<v Speaker 2>Links right down below for those social media's, by the way,

122
00:05:42.079 --> 00:05:43.360
<v Speaker 2>on Instagram, all of it.

123
00:05:43.439 --> 00:05:45.199
<v Speaker 1>So are you ready to roll?

124
00:05:45.279 --> 00:05:46.480
<v Speaker 2>I am, what do you got for us?

125
00:05:46.800 --> 00:05:50.480
<v Speaker 1>Okay? So today we're going across to Poland and back

126
00:05:50.519 --> 00:05:52.959
<v Speaker 1>to the year of nineteen nine and nine, I mean

127
00:05:53.040 --> 00:05:55.920
<v Speaker 1>ninety eight. I wanted to say ninety nine so bad,

128
00:05:55.959 --> 00:05:57.040
<v Speaker 1>but it's actually ninety eight.

129
00:05:57.079 --> 00:05:58.920
<v Speaker 2>But the button okay, But why did you want to

130
00:05:58.920 --> 00:05:59.519
<v Speaker 2>say ninety nine?

131
00:05:59.560 --> 00:06:02.439
<v Speaker 1>I don't know if better in my brain flows better flows?

132
00:06:02.560 --> 00:06:06.360
<v Speaker 2>Okay. Quick side note here. One of my favorite numbers

133
00:06:06.399 --> 00:06:09.720
<v Speaker 2>of all time is nineteen ninety seven. Really, not because

134
00:06:09.759 --> 00:06:12.319
<v Speaker 2>it was a good year or anything. I just remember

135
00:06:12.480 --> 00:06:14.519
<v Speaker 2>as a kid being in like I think it was

136
00:06:14.560 --> 00:06:16.480
<v Speaker 2>like fourth grade or something. I don't know, but we

137
00:06:16.560 --> 00:06:17.879
<v Speaker 2>had to write the date at the top of our

138
00:06:17.879 --> 00:06:20.079
<v Speaker 2>assignments and stuff. Okay, and I remember when the new

139
00:06:20.160 --> 00:06:22.759
<v Speaker 2>year came in and it was writing nineteen ninety eight.

140
00:06:23.199 --> 00:06:24.839
<v Speaker 2>It just looked weird to me. I was like, and

141
00:06:24.839 --> 00:06:26.759
<v Speaker 2>then I wrote nineteen ninety seven right below it, and

142
00:06:26.759 --> 00:06:29.600
<v Speaker 2>I'm like, that number just looks satisfying.

143
00:06:29.639 --> 00:06:31.480
<v Speaker 1>So you want to be stuck in nineteen ninety seven.

144
00:06:31.600 --> 00:06:34.600
<v Speaker 2>I just like the look of the number nineteen ninety seven.

145
00:06:34.639 --> 00:06:36.879
<v Speaker 2>There's something there that's just I don't know, appealing.

146
00:06:37.600 --> 00:06:39.920
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, I actually feel like there's clothing brands that I'm

147
00:06:39.959 --> 00:06:43.720
<v Speaker 1>thinking about, or maybe it's nineteen seventy seven. I don't know. Anyway,

148
00:06:43.920 --> 00:06:45.040
<v Speaker 1>the seventy seven is too many.

149
00:06:45.040 --> 00:06:48.160
<v Speaker 2>Sevens ninety nine is okay because it's in the middle

150
00:06:49.000 --> 00:06:51.560
<v Speaker 2>and you have the one in the seven on either side, okay,

151
00:06:51.680 --> 00:06:53.879
<v Speaker 2>and the seven and one are similar, so a balance

152
00:06:53.959 --> 00:06:54.360
<v Speaker 2>is nice.

153
00:06:54.480 --> 00:06:56.160
<v Speaker 1>There you go. Now you got in weird fact.

154
00:06:56.920 --> 00:06:59.680
<v Speaker 2>I like the number in nineteen ninety seven, no specific

155
00:06:59.680 --> 00:07:02.519
<v Speaker 2>reason other than it's just looks it's satisfying.

156
00:07:02.600 --> 00:07:04.399
<v Speaker 1>Well, that was why I was like nineteen nine and nine.

157
00:07:04.519 --> 00:07:06.800
<v Speaker 1>That flows good. Okay. So we're going to talk about

158
00:07:06.800 --> 00:07:10.319
<v Speaker 1>the murder of Katasina Zawata. You ready, I'm ready? Do

159
00:07:10.319 --> 00:07:10.920
<v Speaker 1>you know about this?

160
00:07:11.160 --> 00:07:16.040
<v Speaker 2>I a little bit barely, Like I could give you

161
00:07:16.079 --> 00:07:19.240
<v Speaker 2>an elevator pitch and that's about it, Okay, not even hardly.

162
00:07:19.279 --> 00:07:21.560
<v Speaker 1>We're going a little deeper than an elevator pitch, I hope.

163
00:07:21.600 --> 00:07:22.000
<v Speaker 2>So.

164
00:07:22.000 --> 00:07:25.160
<v Speaker 1>So, at the time, Katasina was twenty three years old,

165
00:07:25.360 --> 00:07:28.439
<v Speaker 1>she was a university student and right at the start

166
00:07:28.480 --> 00:07:31.319
<v Speaker 1>of her life. But her start had already been a

167
00:07:31.319 --> 00:07:34.720
<v Speaker 1>bit rough around the edges. Her father died just two

168
00:07:34.800 --> 00:07:38.000
<v Speaker 1>years before she started university, and his death had a

169
00:07:38.120 --> 00:07:42.560
<v Speaker 1>huge impact on her. Her friends and classmates described her

170
00:07:42.600 --> 00:07:45.439
<v Speaker 1>as someone who was nice, but also someone who always

171
00:07:45.439 --> 00:07:48.680
<v Speaker 1>seems sad and a bit withdrawn. It sucks, I know,

172
00:07:48.800 --> 00:07:50.959
<v Speaker 1>isn't that just like, oh.

173
00:07:50.519 --> 00:07:54.000
<v Speaker 2>Those people are usually thinking of other people more than themselves.

174
00:07:54.160 --> 00:07:57.000
<v Speaker 1>Actually, yeah, yeah, she just like has a lot of

175
00:07:57.000 --> 00:08:01.319
<v Speaker 1>big feelings. Probably m h. Actually, since the death of

176
00:08:01.319 --> 00:08:05.120
<v Speaker 1>her father, Katasina had been suffering from depression, and it

177
00:08:05.199 --> 00:08:07.839
<v Speaker 1>was pretty clear that she was feeling the side effects

178
00:08:08.079 --> 00:08:12.040
<v Speaker 1>of that rippling through the rest of her life as well. Socially,

179
00:08:12.160 --> 00:08:16.040
<v Speaker 1>she was shutting down and academically she just couldn't seem

180
00:08:16.079 --> 00:08:19.920
<v Speaker 1>to pick a direction. She was attending university in Krackow,

181
00:08:20.439 --> 00:08:22.680
<v Speaker 1>but in the short time she'd been there, she'd already

182
00:08:22.800 --> 00:08:27.079
<v Speaker 1>changed her field of study three times. Honestly, Okay, I

183
00:08:27.279 --> 00:08:30.480
<v Speaker 1>just like saying something quick here. It is incredibly hard

184
00:08:30.480 --> 00:08:33.440
<v Speaker 1>to like at a young age because that's in your

185
00:08:33.559 --> 00:08:36.360
<v Speaker 1>early twenties. It's pretty young, and people are even making

186
00:08:36.480 --> 00:08:39.279
<v Speaker 1>those decisions in their late teens. To choose what you

187
00:08:39.320 --> 00:08:41.159
<v Speaker 1>want to do for the rest of your life.

188
00:08:40.919 --> 00:08:43.240
<v Speaker 2>Oh, one hundred percent, especially like you think of parents

189
00:08:43.240 --> 00:08:45.679
<v Speaker 2>asking little kids like, oh, you're twelve years old, what

190
00:08:45.679 --> 00:08:47.360
<v Speaker 2>do you want to do for the next I don't know,

191
00:08:47.639 --> 00:08:49.120
<v Speaker 2>seventy fucking years.

192
00:08:49.200 --> 00:08:51.960
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, So her changing because I think lots of times

193
00:08:52.000 --> 00:08:54.639
<v Speaker 1>people they get there and then they're attending some classes.

194
00:08:54.679 --> 00:08:56.720
<v Speaker 1>Oh it doesn't like feel that right, So I think

195
00:08:56.720 --> 00:08:59.080
<v Speaker 1>it's totally fine to just change how to kind of explore.

196
00:08:59.200 --> 00:09:00.200
<v Speaker 2>I have totally respect that.

197
00:09:00.919 --> 00:09:02.759
<v Speaker 1>So where was I here?

198
00:09:03.320 --> 00:09:03.600
<v Speaker 2>Oh?

199
00:09:03.639 --> 00:09:04.799
<v Speaker 1>Did I disuse my spot?

200
00:09:05.159 --> 00:09:05.960
<v Speaker 2>You did, didn't you?

201
00:09:06.360 --> 00:09:10.639
<v Speaker 1>Yeah? Oh yeah. She spent her first semester studying psychology.

202
00:09:11.559 --> 00:09:14.279
<v Speaker 1>Then she dabbled in history for a little while before

203
00:09:14.320 --> 00:09:18.159
<v Speaker 1>she found her feet and decided to study religious studies instead. Okay,

204
00:09:18.639 --> 00:09:21.279
<v Speaker 1>and that was a good first steps towards getting her

205
00:09:21.320 --> 00:09:23.879
<v Speaker 1>life back on track and settled. But it wasn't the

206
00:09:23.919 --> 00:09:26.919
<v Speaker 1>only thing that Katasino was doing to try to get

207
00:09:26.960 --> 00:09:31.840
<v Speaker 1>her life together. She was also in psychiatric treatment for

208
00:09:31.879 --> 00:09:32.559
<v Speaker 1>her depression.

209
00:09:32.720 --> 00:09:35.120
<v Speaker 2>Okay, well that's good. Seeking help is a really good thing.

210
00:09:35.200 --> 00:09:37.600
<v Speaker 1>Absolutely no one should be afraid of seeking help or

211
00:09:37.600 --> 00:09:38.480
<v Speaker 1>like feel shameful.

212
00:09:38.600 --> 00:09:39.000
<v Speaker 2>Agreed.

213
00:09:39.799 --> 00:09:41.799
<v Speaker 1>So she'd been going to a clinic for a while

214
00:09:42.159 --> 00:09:45.200
<v Speaker 1>and she was sticking with it, just pushing through. What

215
00:09:45.240 --> 00:09:49.200
<v Speaker 1>the end goal of getting better, right goal, And that

216
00:09:49.320 --> 00:09:52.559
<v Speaker 1>was what she was doing on November twelfth, nineteen ninety eight,

217
00:09:52.919 --> 00:09:54.279
<v Speaker 1>or supposed to be doing.

218
00:09:54.399 --> 00:09:58.120
<v Speaker 2>Oh no, whenever there's a date, some shits about to

219
00:09:58.159 --> 00:09:58.480
<v Speaker 2>go down.

220
00:09:58.519 --> 00:10:00.879
<v Speaker 1>Whenever date you dropped the dates, it's going down. We're

221
00:10:00.919 --> 00:10:03.559
<v Speaker 1>sure she had an appointment at the clinic and the

222
00:10:03.600 --> 00:10:07.759
<v Speaker 1>plan was to meet her mother there, but unfortunately, Katazina

223
00:10:08.080 --> 00:10:12.279
<v Speaker 1>never showed up. Her mother waited the clinic, hoping that

224
00:10:12.320 --> 00:10:14.600
<v Speaker 1>her daughter would show up or at least try to

225
00:10:14.600 --> 00:10:17.279
<v Speaker 1>get in contact with her right But a few hours

226
00:10:17.360 --> 00:10:21.279
<v Speaker 1>later it became painfully obvious that she wasn't coming.

227
00:10:21.759 --> 00:10:22.159
<v Speaker 2>Damn.

228
00:10:22.600 --> 00:10:26.519
<v Speaker 1>Something about this didn't sit right with Katasina's mother, and

229
00:10:26.559 --> 00:10:28.759
<v Speaker 1>she went straight to the police station to try to

230
00:10:28.799 --> 00:10:30.240
<v Speaker 1>file a missing person's report.

231
00:10:30.679 --> 00:10:32.919
<v Speaker 2>Well that's good, I like. I like that she actually

232
00:10:32.919 --> 00:10:34.840
<v Speaker 2>went forward with it right away, I know, rather than

233
00:10:34.879 --> 00:10:36.159
<v Speaker 2>thinking and it's.

234
00:10:36.240 --> 00:10:38.559
<v Speaker 1>Just making up shit in your head that actually went down.

235
00:10:38.720 --> 00:10:41.759
<v Speaker 2>It's very natural for everyone to make excuses, being like, oh, no,

236
00:10:41.799 --> 00:10:44.080
<v Speaker 2>it's probably this, or it's probably that. So I like

237
00:10:44.120 --> 00:10:47.799
<v Speaker 2>that she actually said, no, something's probably wrong. I should

238
00:10:47.879 --> 00:10:49.399
<v Speaker 2>go and report this right away.

239
00:10:49.559 --> 00:10:51.559
<v Speaker 1>And we said, we've mentioned this so many times, but

240
00:10:51.759 --> 00:10:54.279
<v Speaker 1>especially like in all these cases, a lot of times

241
00:10:54.320 --> 00:10:56.279
<v Speaker 1>shit does go so too when people don't listen to

242
00:10:56.279 --> 00:11:01.120
<v Speaker 1>their gout feelings. Right, So that her daughter was an

243
00:11:01.159 --> 00:11:04.159
<v Speaker 1>adult and she'd only been missing for a few hours,

244
00:11:04.759 --> 00:11:09.000
<v Speaker 1>the police didn't take Katsina's mother very seriously, and they

245
00:11:09.039 --> 00:11:10.759
<v Speaker 1>told her that she would have to wait a bit

246
00:11:10.840 --> 00:11:13.679
<v Speaker 1>longer to file the missing person's report.

247
00:11:15.039 --> 00:11:17.320
<v Speaker 2>I understand. I mean, it makes sense you can't just

248
00:11:17.360 --> 00:11:20.679
<v Speaker 2>be running after everything right away. But also in the

249
00:11:20.720 --> 00:11:22.840
<v Speaker 2>same context, it's like you should probably be listening to

250
00:11:22.840 --> 00:11:23.840
<v Speaker 2>the person filing.

251
00:11:24.440 --> 00:11:26.879
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, I know, and I was. I honestly wanted to

252
00:11:26.879 --> 00:11:30.600
<v Speaker 1>touch on this because we get that there's protocol, right,

253
00:11:30.679 --> 00:11:32.679
<v Speaker 1>and then a lot of people too that I'll go missing,

254
00:11:32.720 --> 00:11:35.559
<v Speaker 1>they do end up turning up, right, Yeah, But I

255
00:11:35.600 --> 00:11:39.559
<v Speaker 1>do feel like there's extenuating circumstances where maybe they do

256
00:11:39.679 --> 00:11:42.799
<v Speaker 1>need to take it seriously right away. For sure, Katsina

257
00:11:42.919 --> 00:11:45.279
<v Speaker 1>she was suffering from depression, right.

258
00:11:45.360 --> 00:11:47.840
<v Speaker 2>But the problem is, how do you differentiate I know,

259
00:11:48.039 --> 00:11:50.559
<v Speaker 2>those cases from the other ones, right, yeah, because those

260
00:11:50.559 --> 00:11:53.000
<v Speaker 2>are gonna be like the one percent I know.

261
00:11:53.159 --> 00:11:54.720
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, but lots of times too, if it's out of

262
00:11:54.840 --> 00:11:57.639
<v Speaker 1>character too, like she I thought her and her mom

263
00:11:57.679 --> 00:12:00.879
<v Speaker 1>were close and she'd never really gone. Singer would have

264
00:12:00.879 --> 00:12:02.120
<v Speaker 1>always checked in with her mom.

265
00:12:02.200 --> 00:12:04.240
<v Speaker 2>So I just I don't know that out of character

266
00:12:04.320 --> 00:12:05.440
<v Speaker 2>is a big one.

267
00:12:05.840 --> 00:12:08.480
<v Speaker 1>And because especially in like a missing person's case, those

268
00:12:08.519 --> 00:12:11.240
<v Speaker 1>first few hours are pretty like crucial. Oh yeah, like

269
00:12:11.440 --> 00:12:12.080
<v Speaker 1>very crucial.

270
00:12:12.159 --> 00:12:15.039
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, isn't it like the most like the first twenty

271
00:12:15.039 --> 00:12:18.039
<v Speaker 2>four hours is basically if you don't find him after.

272
00:12:17.840 --> 00:12:21.360
<v Speaker 1>That, every hour chances just decreased.

273
00:12:21.480 --> 00:12:23.960
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, it's like a statistical chance that every hour after

274
00:12:23.960 --> 00:12:27.279
<v Speaker 2>those first twenty four hours is like eventually it's a zero.

275
00:12:27.639 --> 00:12:31.799
<v Speaker 1>Yeah. So nonetheless, who really knows if anything was lost

276
00:12:31.879 --> 00:12:34.799
<v Speaker 1>during that time that the police refused the mother's report.

277
00:12:35.600 --> 00:12:38.919
<v Speaker 1>Things would, however, become a bit clearer on January sixth

278
00:12:38.960 --> 00:12:43.360
<v Speaker 1>of nineteen ninety nine, only unfortunately for Katasina and her mother,

279
00:12:43.799 --> 00:12:45.399
<v Speaker 1>it was not the good kind of news.

280
00:12:45.960 --> 00:12:46.360
<v Speaker 2>No.

281
00:12:47.360 --> 00:12:49.960
<v Speaker 1>A pusher tug boat called the Elk was out on

282
00:12:49.960 --> 00:12:53.519
<v Speaker 1>the Vistula that day when the captain noticed that something

283
00:12:53.639 --> 00:12:56.919
<v Speaker 1>was wrong. It sounded like something was jammed or caught

284
00:12:56.919 --> 00:12:59.919
<v Speaker 1>in the propeller, so he notified the crew and waited

285
00:13:00.240 --> 00:13:04.039
<v Speaker 1>for it to be cleared. All right, your look on

286
00:13:04.080 --> 00:13:09.559
<v Speaker 1>your face, this wasn't really anything that would alarm anyone.

287
00:13:09.759 --> 00:13:12.519
<v Speaker 1>It was all pretty routine. Things like that happened all

288
00:13:12.559 --> 00:13:14.879
<v Speaker 1>the time, and it was usually only some sort of

289
00:13:14.919 --> 00:13:17.960
<v Speaker 1>debris like tree branch, which the crew could clear in

290
00:13:18.000 --> 00:13:19.919
<v Speaker 1>the matter of a few minutes and everyone would be

291
00:13:19.960 --> 00:13:23.559
<v Speaker 1>on their mosy way. But today would be different. When

292
00:13:23.600 --> 00:13:25.759
<v Speaker 1>the crew opened the latch to go down to work

293
00:13:25.759 --> 00:13:29.840
<v Speaker 1>on the propeller, they were hit with a horrible stench.

294
00:13:30.960 --> 00:13:34.000
<v Speaker 1>Still not really knowing what they were about to get into,

295
00:13:34.519 --> 00:13:37.480
<v Speaker 1>they started untangling what looked like a large strip of

296
00:13:37.639 --> 00:13:42.080
<v Speaker 1>rubbery material out from around the propeller, but it wasn't rubber,

297
00:13:42.360 --> 00:13:44.799
<v Speaker 1>and it didn't take them long to realize what it

298
00:13:44.840 --> 00:13:48.960
<v Speaker 1>actually was. Once the crew had it free from the propeller,

299
00:13:49.320 --> 00:13:52.600
<v Speaker 1>a human ear was spotted, and it became all too

300
00:13:52.679 --> 00:13:55.360
<v Speaker 1>obvious that what they were looking at was a piece

301
00:13:55.440 --> 00:13:58.080
<v Speaker 1>of human flesh.

302
00:13:58.200 --> 00:14:00.279
<v Speaker 2>God, can you imagine going to work that day and

303
00:14:00.360 --> 00:14:04.399
<v Speaker 2>just being like, oh, lotti dootty dot wait, there's a body, well, just.

304
00:14:04.360 --> 00:14:06.279
<v Speaker 1>Being that shocked that you're like, oh, I gotta go,

305
00:14:06.399 --> 00:14:08.720
<v Speaker 1>like get these fucking tree branches out from the propeller

306
00:14:09.480 --> 00:14:12.279
<v Speaker 1>like every other day, and then boom, like you can't

307
00:14:12.279 --> 00:14:15.440
<v Speaker 1>expect shit, no, like you never know when something's just

308
00:14:15.440 --> 00:14:16.159
<v Speaker 1>going to go astray.

309
00:14:16.240 --> 00:14:18.120
<v Speaker 2>Well, how many people do you hear about going for

310
00:14:18.159 --> 00:14:20.000
<v Speaker 2>a walk in a park and discovering that shit?

311
00:14:20.080 --> 00:14:23.320
<v Speaker 1>Yeah? Oh, I actually really hope that would never happen

312
00:14:23.360 --> 00:14:28.399
<v Speaker 1>to me. I would freak, Yeah, I'd freak. So the head, arms,

313
00:14:28.399 --> 00:14:31.360
<v Speaker 1>and legs were gone, leaving behind what looked like the

314
00:14:31.399 --> 00:14:37.159
<v Speaker 1>skin of a woman's torso sewn together. Initially, all the

315
00:14:37.200 --> 00:14:40.000
<v Speaker 1>authorities had to go with was this piece of skin,

316
00:14:40.720 --> 00:14:42.840
<v Speaker 1>but they were able to collect a DNA sample and

317
00:14:42.879 --> 00:14:47.120
<v Speaker 1>trace it back to Katasina. Katasina was still a missing person,

318
00:14:47.360 --> 00:14:50.639
<v Speaker 1>and now with that particular part of her remains recovered,

319
00:14:51.399 --> 00:14:53.559
<v Speaker 1>it was safe to say she was dead.

320
00:14:53.799 --> 00:14:55.000
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, she was coming home.

321
00:14:55.200 --> 00:15:00.080
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, but the question remained how had she died and

322
00:15:00.120 --> 00:15:03.039
<v Speaker 1>who had done this horrible act to her. A week later,

323
00:15:03.120 --> 00:15:05.919
<v Speaker 1>and from that same river, her right leg was found,

324
00:15:06.519 --> 00:15:09.399
<v Speaker 1>and that was all anybody ever found of her. That

325
00:15:09.519 --> 00:15:12.559
<v Speaker 1>was all that was found left of the body. No head, like,

326
00:15:12.720 --> 00:15:17.879
<v Speaker 1>just basically this skin thing and her leg. That leg

327
00:15:18.240 --> 00:15:21.879
<v Speaker 1>did create a few more theories, though The investigators believed

328
00:15:21.879 --> 00:15:24.679
<v Speaker 1>that Katazina's body had been in the water when it

329
00:15:24.720 --> 00:15:28.720
<v Speaker 1>had been struck by the Elk's propeller, splitting her body

330
00:15:28.759 --> 00:15:31.600
<v Speaker 1>into many pieces and leaving a piece of her skin behind.

331
00:15:32.360 --> 00:15:37.159
<v Speaker 1>But upon or beyond further examination the remains of the

332
00:15:37.200 --> 00:15:39.960
<v Speaker 1>remains that theory easily went out the window.

333
00:15:40.440 --> 00:15:44.960
<v Speaker 2>They were able to tell some pre striking propeller.

334
00:15:45.759 --> 00:15:48.360
<v Speaker 1>Yes, yes, if that's.

335
00:15:48.120 --> 00:15:50.799
<v Speaker 2>A scientific word, pre striking propeller.

336
00:15:50.440 --> 00:15:53.320
<v Speaker 1>Bumpy stuff. Is that what you said, bumpy?

337
00:15:53.879 --> 00:15:57.679
<v Speaker 2>I don't know what I said. What did I say?

338
00:15:57.799 --> 00:15:58.559
<v Speaker 1>I don't even know.

339
00:15:59.120 --> 00:15:59.960
<v Speaker 2>He was very signed.

340
00:16:00.480 --> 00:16:02.120
<v Speaker 1>It was very It was like it showed that you

341
00:16:02.120 --> 00:16:03.759
<v Speaker 1>were very educated on the Yes.

342
00:16:04.039 --> 00:16:06.159
<v Speaker 2>Very articulate edumacation.

343
00:16:06.679 --> 00:16:11.120
<v Speaker 1>Yes, showing through it was found. So what was found

344
00:16:11.200 --> 00:16:14.759
<v Speaker 1>was that her skin was removed from her torso on purpose,

345
00:16:15.440 --> 00:16:18.720
<v Speaker 1>and her limbs and head had been cut off. So

346
00:16:18.759 --> 00:16:20.600
<v Speaker 1>this was not shit that the propeller did.

347
00:16:20.919 --> 00:16:23.879
<v Speaker 2>Okay, so this was literally just skin they pulled from

348
00:16:23.879 --> 00:16:24.360
<v Speaker 2>the propellers.

349
00:16:24.440 --> 00:16:28.720
<v Speaker 1>Yes, God, Yes, her skin had been cut and sewn

350
00:16:28.840 --> 00:16:32.200
<v Speaker 1>back together to make a body suit. It was almost

351
00:16:32.240 --> 00:16:35.240
<v Speaker 1>like a vest, perhaps meaning that it was more than

352
00:16:35.360 --> 00:16:38.840
<v Speaker 1>likely that her killer had made this to wear themselves.

353
00:16:39.080 --> 00:16:43.120
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, so here comes that buffalo bill portion.

354
00:16:43.519 --> 00:16:47.039
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, so treating it and sewing it back together just

355
00:16:47.159 --> 00:16:50.200
<v Speaker 1>didn't make any sense otherwise, like this fucker.

356
00:16:50.120 --> 00:16:53.879
<v Speaker 2>Was fucked fucked. Yeah, that's for sure.

357
00:16:54.120 --> 00:16:56.039
<v Speaker 1>Like I don't even know else to explain that. It

358
00:16:56.080 --> 00:16:57.879
<v Speaker 1>is so disgusting it is.

359
00:16:59.559 --> 00:17:02.840
<v Speaker 2>I'm I'm gonna be honest, I might be a little

360
00:17:02.879 --> 00:17:04.039
<v Speaker 2>bit desensitized to.

361
00:17:04.079 --> 00:17:06.759
<v Speaker 1>This case because of that movie.

362
00:17:06.480 --> 00:17:08.960
<v Speaker 2>Because of that movie, because I'm just having images of

363
00:17:09.119 --> 00:17:11.960
<v Speaker 2>like I'm having cinema images pop in my head.

364
00:17:11.839 --> 00:17:14.759
<v Speaker 1>Relevan than like you know, yeah, I'm not saying you're terrible,

365
00:17:14.799 --> 00:17:18.759
<v Speaker 1>but it's like it's terrible that these like terrible movies

366
00:17:18.799 --> 00:17:19.480
<v Speaker 1>do that to us.

367
00:17:19.559 --> 00:17:21.839
<v Speaker 2>Kind of yeah, no, I agree, yeah, but it's like

368
00:17:22.119 --> 00:17:24.960
<v Speaker 2>thinking about I can't really think of this as a

369
00:17:25.000 --> 00:17:26.079
<v Speaker 2>real case almost right.

370
00:17:26.000 --> 00:17:28.480
<v Speaker 1>Now, really, hey, oh well, there'll be a point where

371
00:17:28.480 --> 00:17:29.079
<v Speaker 1>I think you can.

372
00:17:29.240 --> 00:17:31.119
<v Speaker 2>I do hope I can, because I don't want to

373
00:17:31.480 --> 00:17:35.160
<v Speaker 2>just brush over Katasina. No, but yeah, right now, I

374
00:17:35.240 --> 00:17:39.000
<v Speaker 2>just I'm picturing Buffalo Bill the whole nine yards.

375
00:17:39.000 --> 00:17:43.559
<v Speaker 1>So yeah, So Katazina's case quickly turned into a case

376
00:17:43.680 --> 00:17:47.039
<v Speaker 1>on like any other in Poland, But that also meant

377
00:17:47.079 --> 00:17:49.720
<v Speaker 1>that the investigators had no idea where to start looking

378
00:17:49.720 --> 00:17:52.880
<v Speaker 1>for the person who'd done this to her. They interviewed

379
00:17:52.920 --> 00:17:55.599
<v Speaker 1>suspect after suspect, but it looked like they were all

380
00:17:55.680 --> 00:18:00.400
<v Speaker 1>out of luck when the most unbelievable thing happened in

381
00:18:00.480 --> 00:18:04.119
<v Speaker 1>May of nineteen ninety nine, just a few months after

382
00:18:04.200 --> 00:18:06.039
<v Speaker 1>Katizina's remains were discovered.

383
00:18:06.119 --> 00:18:07.559
<v Speaker 2>You got to say nineteen ninety nine.

384
00:18:07.599 --> 00:18:09.640
<v Speaker 1>I know, I actually noted that in my head, but

385
00:18:09.720 --> 00:18:12.319
<v Speaker 1>I was like, just keep going, just keep reading your notes,

386
00:18:12.400 --> 00:18:13.400
<v Speaker 1>don't get distracted.

387
00:18:13.880 --> 00:18:14.240
<v Speaker 2>Sorry.

388
00:18:15.599 --> 00:18:20.240
<v Speaker 1>So almost the exact same thing happened again. Really, this

389
00:18:20.400 --> 00:18:23.519
<v Speaker 1>time the victim was a man, and this time the

390
00:18:23.599 --> 00:18:27.359
<v Speaker 1>authorities already had somebody in custody. And I don't know

391
00:18:27.359 --> 00:18:29.119
<v Speaker 1>if this is how you're going to pronounce this name,

392
00:18:29.119 --> 00:18:31.839
<v Speaker 1>but I'm it's like Valdimir, Like I just can't. It's

393
00:18:31.920 --> 00:18:35.759
<v Speaker 1>spelled exactly the Harry Potter name. So I'm just Voldemort Valdimir.

394
00:18:35.880 --> 00:18:36.799
<v Speaker 1>It was Valdemart.

395
00:18:37.319 --> 00:18:38.880
<v Speaker 2>Valdemort isn't Harry Potter.

396
00:18:38.759 --> 00:18:40.799
<v Speaker 1>Okay, I think this is Valdemir. Then I'm getting their

397
00:18:40.880 --> 00:18:41.519
<v Speaker 1>names mixed up.

398
00:18:41.599 --> 00:18:42.079
<v Speaker 2>Yeah you are.

399
00:18:42.160 --> 00:18:44.519
<v Speaker 1>He's like the evil one though, right, Yeah, he.

400
00:18:44.480 --> 00:18:49.559
<v Speaker 2>Has no nose, right, that's him.

401
00:18:49.839 --> 00:18:55.319
<v Speaker 1>So this valdem I think Valdemir w was the son

402
00:18:55.480 --> 00:18:58.920
<v Speaker 1>of the murder victim, and he killed and scalped his

403
00:18:59.119 --> 00:19:03.079
<v Speaker 1>own vall. He then pulled the skin off his father's face,

404
00:19:03.440 --> 00:19:08.279
<v Speaker 1>made a mask and had been seen wearing Holy shit, Yes,

405
00:19:09.240 --> 00:19:12.000
<v Speaker 1>that is so he does have like evil Harry Potter

406
00:19:12.200 --> 00:19:13.160
<v Speaker 1>dude vibes.

407
00:19:13.359 --> 00:19:17.200
<v Speaker 2>No kidding, I'm looking at this though. So he did

408
00:19:17.200 --> 00:19:20.200
<v Speaker 2>this to his father, his father, and he did this too,

409
00:19:20.720 --> 00:19:22.599
<v Speaker 2>I mean as of right now. If he did do

410
00:19:22.640 --> 00:19:27.519
<v Speaker 2>it Katazina, they probably didn't know each other, probably a

411
00:19:27.599 --> 00:19:29.799
<v Speaker 2>random act, or he saw her and scoped her out

412
00:19:29.839 --> 00:19:33.680
<v Speaker 2>for something. So I don't see a connection for him

413
00:19:33.720 --> 00:19:37.559
<v Speaker 2>doing this to just women. I think it's just he's

414
00:19:37.640 --> 00:19:40.599
<v Speaker 2>just a sick individual and picks targets at random sort

415
00:19:40.640 --> 00:19:43.319
<v Speaker 2>of thing for who knows what reason. Yeah, it's not

416
00:19:43.400 --> 00:19:46.039
<v Speaker 2>a sex thing, I don't think, especially if he's doing

417
00:19:46.039 --> 00:19:46.480
<v Speaker 2>it to his.

418
00:19:46.400 --> 00:19:50.119
<v Speaker 1>Father, right well, yeah exactly. Oh gosh, yeah, he must

419
00:19:50.119 --> 00:19:51.920
<v Speaker 1>have just like despised his father.

420
00:19:52.039 --> 00:19:54.559
<v Speaker 2>Hey yeah, unless it's something that he did do and

421
00:19:54.599 --> 00:19:56.200
<v Speaker 2>his father figured out, or he just got mad at

422
00:19:56.240 --> 00:19:57.680
<v Speaker 2>his father and he just like, well I'm going to

423
00:19:57.720 --> 00:19:58.319
<v Speaker 2>do it to him too.

424
00:19:58.559 --> 00:20:00.680
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, but like that is some ra age and a half.

425
00:20:00.839 --> 00:20:02.839
<v Speaker 1>No shit, that is about as much rage I think

426
00:20:02.880 --> 00:20:06.640
<v Speaker 1>as someone could have on someone else. So for the investigators.

427
00:20:06.680 --> 00:20:10.640
<v Speaker 1>All this was too many similarities for the cases not

428
00:20:10.680 --> 00:20:13.720
<v Speaker 1>to be related, right, Yeah, of course, so Voldemir became

429
00:20:13.759 --> 00:20:17.839
<v Speaker 1>the main suspect in Katazina's case as well. But incredibly,

430
00:20:18.039 --> 00:20:21.759
<v Speaker 1>the investigators found no evidence to back that theory up,

431
00:20:21.799 --> 00:20:24.279
<v Speaker 1>and it turned out that it was just a coincidence.

432
00:20:24.839 --> 00:20:26.000
<v Speaker 2>What what really?

433
00:20:26.240 --> 00:20:29.000
<v Speaker 1>Yes? And it is it is just a coincidence? Yes?

434
00:20:29.400 --> 00:20:30.799
<v Speaker 2>Yes, wow, Okay.

435
00:20:31.319 --> 00:20:35.039
<v Speaker 1>Within the year, Katazina's case was out of suspects, which

436
00:20:35.119 --> 00:20:39.839
<v Speaker 1>meant which meant it was essentially dropped. Investigators continued to

437
00:20:39.880 --> 00:20:42.640
<v Speaker 1>work on the case in their own time, but not

438
00:20:42.759 --> 00:20:46.079
<v Speaker 1>with the same numbers of resources that had been dedicated

439
00:20:46.240 --> 00:20:49.359
<v Speaker 1>to it before, and it didn't look like anyone expected

440
00:20:49.559 --> 00:20:52.720
<v Speaker 1>to make any headway on it. But many years later,

441
00:20:53.240 --> 00:20:57.480
<v Speaker 1>many many years later, in twenty twelve, oh, they caught

442
00:20:57.519 --> 00:21:01.319
<v Speaker 1>a break when advances in technology gave new hope and

443
00:21:01.440 --> 00:21:05.480
<v Speaker 1>new life to the investigation. I fucking love when that happens,

444
00:21:05.519 --> 00:21:05.839
<v Speaker 1>to be.

445
00:21:05.720 --> 00:21:08.000
<v Speaker 2>Honest, so do I. But I'm really curious on what

446
00:21:08.079 --> 00:21:11.160
<v Speaker 2>sort of advances in technology would be able to dig

447
00:21:11.279 --> 00:21:17.119
<v Speaker 2>up mangled skin evidence from like ten year, twenty years

448
00:21:17.160 --> 00:21:17.920
<v Speaker 2>ago or whatever.

449
00:21:18.000 --> 00:21:19.880
<v Speaker 1>Well no, because yeah, it was like nineteen ninety eight,

450
00:21:19.960 --> 00:21:20.960
<v Speaker 1>so it's not really that.

451
00:21:20.920 --> 00:21:22.799
<v Speaker 2>Many years, okay, so it's like fourteen years ago.

452
00:21:22.880 --> 00:21:27.240
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, And I don't honestly specifically know. So Katasina's case

453
00:21:27.359 --> 00:21:31.119
<v Speaker 1>was formally reopened, her remains were actually exhumed, and a

454
00:21:31.160 --> 00:21:35.000
<v Speaker 1>second autopsy was conducted, all with the hopes of catching

455
00:21:35.039 --> 00:21:38.039
<v Speaker 1>her killer. So I don't really know the exact technology

456
00:21:38.039 --> 00:21:41.799
<v Speaker 1>that improved or what happened, but something.

457
00:21:41.640 --> 00:21:45.279
<v Speaker 2>There must have been some other DNA discovered on it

458
00:21:45.400 --> 00:21:45.839
<v Speaker 2>or something.

459
00:21:45.920 --> 00:21:48.880
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, I mean kind of around then and recently too,

460
00:21:48.880 --> 00:21:50.720
<v Speaker 1>a lot of advances have been made kind of in

461
00:21:50.759 --> 00:21:51.720
<v Speaker 1>science in that way too.

462
00:21:51.759 --> 00:21:53.400
<v Speaker 2>Oh yeah, well if you look at the last well

463
00:21:53.559 --> 00:21:57.319
<v Speaker 2>since we'll say two thousands, since the year two thousand, yeah,

464
00:21:57.359 --> 00:22:00.799
<v Speaker 2>to now, look how far technology has come. Yeah, not

465
00:22:00.920 --> 00:22:04.759
<v Speaker 2>only just in like crime scene investigation sort of stuff

466
00:22:04.880 --> 00:22:09.640
<v Speaker 2>and like DNA analysis, literally just technology all around.

467
00:22:09.759 --> 00:22:11.200
<v Speaker 1>Absolutely, how fast.

468
00:22:10.960 --> 00:22:15.920
<v Speaker 2>We can process information is so much more advanced that

469
00:22:16.000 --> 00:22:18.240
<v Speaker 2>it's like, okay, maybe it would be like let's get

470
00:22:18.279 --> 00:22:19.880
<v Speaker 2>a DNA test and it's going to take us ten

471
00:22:19.880 --> 00:22:21.680
<v Speaker 2>months to do this, whereas now it's like, yeah, I'll

472
00:22:21.680 --> 00:22:24.920
<v Speaker 2>have it done to you this afternoon, yeah, tomorrow. Not

473
00:22:24.960 --> 00:22:26.400
<v Speaker 2>to say if they are that fast, but we had

474
00:22:26.400 --> 00:22:27.960
<v Speaker 2>the capability to be that much faster.

475
00:22:28.319 --> 00:22:33.000
<v Speaker 1>Exactly. Yes, And this time around, the autopsy was able

476
00:22:33.039 --> 00:22:35.359
<v Speaker 1>to get a better idea of exactly what had happened

477
00:22:35.400 --> 00:22:39.480
<v Speaker 1>to Katasina before she died, and Noah gave the investigators

478
00:22:39.519 --> 00:22:42.519
<v Speaker 1>a better idea of who they were looking for. None

479
00:22:42.559 --> 00:22:45.160
<v Speaker 1>of it painted a pretty picture of her last moments

480
00:22:45.200 --> 00:22:48.640
<v Speaker 1>on earth. No I do actually find it weird, like

481
00:22:48.680 --> 00:22:50.640
<v Speaker 1>maybe I should have tried to dig deeper into that.

482
00:22:50.640 --> 00:22:53.039
<v Speaker 1>That's so much changed in those years, But I know

483
00:22:53.119 --> 00:22:55.640
<v Speaker 1>in that time a lot of shit did change. So

484
00:22:55.759 --> 00:22:59.839
<v Speaker 1>investigators described how the murder occurred in their official report,

485
00:23:00.200 --> 00:23:03.200
<v Speaker 1>and I'll read it. It's not very long. So it

486
00:23:03.279 --> 00:23:07.119
<v Speaker 1>is known that Katasina was tortured before her death. The

487
00:23:07.279 --> 00:23:10.440
<v Speaker 1>right limb over the ankle joint had been strapped to

488
00:23:10.519 --> 00:23:15.519
<v Speaker 1>something until finally, between December seventh and fourteenth of nineteen

489
00:23:15.559 --> 00:23:20.680
<v Speaker 1>eighty eight, the perpetrator chalked the victim or sorry, choked chalked,

490
00:23:21.000 --> 00:23:22.880
<v Speaker 1>choked the victim with a chain.

491
00:23:22.640 --> 00:23:25.279
<v Speaker 2>In nineteen ninety eight. Sorry, yeah, okay, you said eighty.

492
00:23:25.119 --> 00:23:28.960
<v Speaker 1>Eight oh, nineteen ninety eight. Before that, he had given

493
00:23:29.000 --> 00:23:33.359
<v Speaker 1>her drugs. He also broke her her femur and pelvis

494
00:23:33.359 --> 00:23:39.079
<v Speaker 1>by punching a barbell and bodybuilding plate into her. Stab wounds,

495
00:23:39.200 --> 00:23:43.200
<v Speaker 1>chop wounds, and lacerations were all discovered. He probably also

496
00:23:43.559 --> 00:23:46.960
<v Speaker 1>sexually abused her when she was alive and dead.

497
00:23:47.799 --> 00:23:50.119
<v Speaker 2>Wow what a piece of shit.

498
00:23:50.559 --> 00:23:54.920
<v Speaker 1>Yeah. So now remember too, she went missing on November twelfth,

499
00:23:55.039 --> 00:23:57.759
<v Speaker 1>nineteen ninety eight, and I'm all fucked up with my dates,

500
00:23:57.960 --> 00:24:01.240
<v Speaker 1>and they don't believe she was killed until December seventh,

501
00:24:01.839 --> 00:24:04.799
<v Speaker 1>or between December seventh and fourteenth, Like they're not even sure.

502
00:24:04.839 --> 00:24:06.759
<v Speaker 1>So that's like a month.

503
00:24:07.160 --> 00:24:07.640
<v Speaker 2>Wow.

504
00:24:07.960 --> 00:24:08.240
<v Speaker 1>Yeah.

505
00:24:08.359 --> 00:24:11.079
<v Speaker 2>Could you imagine if she was actually still alive for

506
00:24:11.160 --> 00:24:13.720
<v Speaker 2>that time and enduring all that. Well, I think she was,

507
00:24:14.039 --> 00:24:16.200
<v Speaker 2>but like, yeah, that's what I'm saying. If she was,

508
00:24:16.279 --> 00:24:17.839
<v Speaker 2>can you imagine what she was going through?

509
00:24:17.880 --> 00:24:19.960
<v Speaker 1>I know, fuck like hell on earth.

510
00:24:20.160 --> 00:24:21.279
<v Speaker 2>Yeah.

511
00:24:21.359 --> 00:24:25.119
<v Speaker 1>Her official cause of death was blood loss. But this

512
00:24:25.160 --> 00:24:27.279
<v Speaker 1>pot I literally have it here. But this poor woman

513
00:24:27.319 --> 00:24:30.720
<v Speaker 1>went through absolute hell during the time she was held captive.

514
00:24:31.400 --> 00:24:34.359
<v Speaker 1>Along with being tortured during the possible month that the

515
00:24:34.440 --> 00:24:37.440
<v Speaker 1>killer had had her, and the traces of sexual abuse

516
00:24:37.480 --> 00:24:40.839
<v Speaker 1>both before and after her death, it was highly likely

517
00:24:40.920 --> 00:24:45.000
<v Speaker 1>that the skin from Catazina's torso had been removed while

518
00:24:45.039 --> 00:24:46.440
<v Speaker 1>she was still alive.

519
00:24:47.000 --> 00:24:48.359
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, that's kind of what I was thinking. If her

520
00:24:48.400 --> 00:24:50.680
<v Speaker 2>death was blood loss, I was thinking either she was

521
00:24:50.720 --> 00:24:56.400
<v Speaker 2>probably a skinned alive or be she was being delimbed alive.

522
00:24:56.640 --> 00:24:59.559
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, which is almost too much to fathom, Like, that's

523
00:24:59.599 --> 00:25:00.000
<v Speaker 1>too much.

524
00:25:00.160 --> 00:25:02.720
<v Speaker 2>That would probably be one of the most excruciating oh

525
00:25:03.480 --> 00:25:04.880
<v Speaker 2>anyone could ever feel.

526
00:25:05.039 --> 00:25:09.519
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, I can't even imagine. In the following years, people

527
00:25:09.559 --> 00:25:12.559
<v Speaker 1>from all over the world, including the FBI and UN

528
00:25:12.960 --> 00:25:16.200
<v Speaker 1>would send experts and consultants in hopes of helping the

529
00:25:16.759 --> 00:25:20.119
<v Speaker 1>Polish authorities catch the man who'd done this to Katazina.

530
00:25:20.960 --> 00:25:24.279
<v Speaker 1>By twenty sixteen, everyone was on the lookout for a

531
00:25:24.319 --> 00:25:29.119
<v Speaker 1>man with sadistic tendencies, with a prior history with abuse

532
00:25:29.119 --> 00:25:32.960
<v Speaker 1>towards women, and someone trained in martial arts.

533
00:25:33.200 --> 00:25:34.119
<v Speaker 2>Well, whoa, whoa, whoa.

534
00:25:34.240 --> 00:25:35.640
<v Speaker 1>I'll explain this is that.

535
00:25:35.559 --> 00:25:38.240
<v Speaker 2>Because of the barbelle punching.

536
00:25:37.880 --> 00:25:41.720
<v Speaker 1>Thing, possibly the way in which she had been so

537
00:25:41.960 --> 00:25:46.720
<v Speaker 1>badly beaten and with such force led investigators to believe

538
00:25:46.720 --> 00:25:49.839
<v Speaker 1>that the killer was trained in mixed martial arts.

539
00:25:50.759 --> 00:25:51.119
<v Speaker 2>Really.

540
00:25:51.359 --> 00:25:53.960
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, so that was literally like on their sheet of

541
00:25:54.680 --> 00:25:56.279
<v Speaker 1>what they look for. Fuck.

542
00:25:56.599 --> 00:25:59.079
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, that makes this person even more disgusting.

543
00:25:59.279 --> 00:26:00.440
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, it's very disturbing.

544
00:26:02.279 --> 00:26:06.960
<v Speaker 2>Cool, Okay, generally along with martial arts, there is a

545
00:26:07.039 --> 00:26:11.039
<v Speaker 2>very big thing about you use this for self defense only.

546
00:26:11.480 --> 00:26:14.039
<v Speaker 2>There's a big respect factor in it. I mean a

547
00:26:14.079 --> 00:26:16.440
<v Speaker 2>lot of martial arts comes from like Japan or China,

548
00:26:16.519 --> 00:26:19.359
<v Speaker 2>right where honor and such is a huge part of it.

549
00:26:19.759 --> 00:26:21.400
<v Speaker 1>I knew you'd have to speak on this because for

550
00:26:21.440 --> 00:26:23.920
<v Speaker 1>people that don't know Ben, you was like in karate

551
00:26:24.039 --> 00:26:27.000
<v Speaker 1>for a long time. Yeah, I think a very long time.

552
00:26:27.079 --> 00:26:29.559
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, it was a national level competitor and yeah, yeah,

553
00:26:29.599 --> 00:26:32.680
<v Speaker 2>so I feel that one a little bit.

554
00:26:32.960 --> 00:26:34.640
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, so in many ways I knew that you think

555
00:26:34.680 --> 00:26:36.240
<v Speaker 1>that's very disturbing.

556
00:26:35.880 --> 00:26:37.279
<v Speaker 2>That's very very disturbing.

557
00:26:37.480 --> 00:26:42.440
<v Speaker 1>Yeah. So in some ways it was an almost expected profile,

558
00:26:42.880 --> 00:26:46.680
<v Speaker 1>but when it comes to potential murder suspect, sorry, it

559
00:26:46.720 --> 00:26:50.039
<v Speaker 1>was an expected profile. But then in other ways, there

560
00:26:50.079 --> 00:26:51.680
<v Speaker 1>was many things in there that were a bit out

561
00:26:51.680 --> 00:26:54.559
<v Speaker 1>of the ordinary, but not out of the ordinary enough

562
00:26:54.640 --> 00:26:57.359
<v Speaker 1>that investigators could use it to really narrow down the

563
00:26:57.400 --> 00:27:01.000
<v Speaker 1>list of suspects. But it was a profile that would

564
00:27:01.000 --> 00:27:03.519
<v Speaker 1>come together and make sense a year later.

565
00:27:03.680 --> 00:27:05.480
<v Speaker 2>A year later, Hey, I feel so.

566
00:27:05.559 --> 00:27:08.319
<v Speaker 1>Bad with these time gaps, Like the family just must

567
00:27:08.319 --> 00:27:09.759
<v Speaker 1>be in like freaking agony.

568
00:27:10.000 --> 00:27:13.400
<v Speaker 2>But the nice thing is is that they're not still

569
00:27:13.400 --> 00:27:16.279
<v Speaker 2>in a time gap. When a time gap comes to

570
00:27:16.319 --> 00:27:18.559
<v Speaker 2>an end, that means someone eventually got closure.

571
00:27:18.839 --> 00:27:22.119
<v Speaker 1>Yeah right, but still they hadn't waited long down time

572
00:27:22.160 --> 00:27:22.599
<v Speaker 1>for all this.

573
00:27:22.839 --> 00:27:25.079
<v Speaker 2>Oh yeah, no, I get don't get me wrong, Like

574
00:27:25.119 --> 00:27:26.759
<v Speaker 2>that's fucking horrendous that they had to go through that.

575
00:27:27.000 --> 00:27:30.400
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, but at least it ended exactly. And I wonder

576
00:27:30.440 --> 00:27:32.319
<v Speaker 1>if the mom, hopefully a mom was even alive to

577
00:27:32.519 --> 00:27:37.720
<v Speaker 1>have received that. In twenty seventeen, the investigators received a letter.

578
00:27:38.039 --> 00:27:40.599
<v Speaker 1>Exactly what was in that letter had been kept a secret,

579
00:27:41.119 --> 00:27:43.440
<v Speaker 1>but we do know that the letter suggested that the

580
00:27:43.480 --> 00:27:46.640
<v Speaker 1>authorities take a closer look at one man in particular,

581
00:27:47.680 --> 00:27:50.599
<v Speaker 1>and this man had actually been a person of interest

582
00:27:50.640 --> 00:27:54.440
<v Speaker 1>in the initial investigation, but not enough evidence was found

583
00:27:54.440 --> 00:27:59.000
<v Speaker 1>to convict him, Robert Ynchevsky. By then, Robert was a

584
00:27:59.039 --> 00:28:02.480
<v Speaker 1>fifty two year old man who loved martial arts and

585
00:28:02.640 --> 00:28:07.039
<v Speaker 1>was living in Crackow. And Robert had a dark background.

586
00:28:07.440 --> 00:28:10.839
<v Speaker 1>He'd grown up in a devoutly religious household with an

587
00:28:10.880 --> 00:28:14.079
<v Speaker 1>abusive father, and the side effects of that had started

588
00:28:14.119 --> 00:28:18.559
<v Speaker 1>to show when Robert was still quite young. As a child,

589
00:28:18.839 --> 00:28:21.839
<v Speaker 1>Robert was known to abuse cats and dogs, and that

590
00:28:22.000 --> 00:28:24.759
<v Speaker 1>abuse had only grown into the years that followed.

591
00:28:25.119 --> 00:28:27.359
<v Speaker 2>Always starts with the animal, not always, but it seems

592
00:28:27.359 --> 00:28:29.640
<v Speaker 2>like fucking every other case starts with the animals. I know,

593
00:28:29.759 --> 00:28:31.279
<v Speaker 2>poor fucking helpless animals.

594
00:28:31.319 --> 00:28:35.240
<v Speaker 1>I just hate that. At one point, Robert had been

595
00:28:35.279 --> 00:28:39.359
<v Speaker 1>working at the Krakow Institute of Zoology, that was until

596
00:28:39.400 --> 00:28:42.920
<v Speaker 1>he was fired. Robert had been looking after the rabbits

597
00:28:42.960 --> 00:28:45.839
<v Speaker 1>in the institute that day, but by the time he

598
00:28:45.880 --> 00:28:48.319
<v Speaker 1>went to hand over his shift to the next person,

599
00:28:49.039 --> 00:28:50.519
<v Speaker 1>all the rabbits were dead.

600
00:28:51.039 --> 00:28:52.960
<v Speaker 2>All of them, every single one.

601
00:28:53.119 --> 00:28:55.839
<v Speaker 1>Yep. Robert claimed that he had no idea what happened,

602
00:28:55.880 --> 00:29:00.759
<v Speaker 1>and the institute immediately fired his ass. Wow, okay, could

603
00:29:00.759 --> 00:29:02.119
<v Speaker 1>you like, what the fuck?

604
00:29:02.240 --> 00:29:04.799
<v Speaker 2>Hey, It's like being like, oh, I'm going into my

605
00:29:04.839 --> 00:29:07.039
<v Speaker 2>shift to flip some burgers today and after your shift

606
00:29:07.079 --> 00:29:08.839
<v Speaker 2>you're just walking out of the restaurant as it burns

607
00:29:08.880 --> 00:29:11.119
<v Speaker 2>to the ground. Yeah. I don't know what happened, very.

608
00:29:11.119 --> 00:29:13.359
<v Speaker 1>Much like he had one job of probably keeping the

609
00:29:13.400 --> 00:29:14.920
<v Speaker 1>rabbits alive and they all died.

610
00:29:15.119 --> 00:29:17.519
<v Speaker 2>Yeah wow, good job, Robert.

611
00:29:17.839 --> 00:29:21.160
<v Speaker 1>Yeah. So now for the next piece of information. And

612
00:29:21.200 --> 00:29:23.880
<v Speaker 1>there are mixed reports here, so some say while at

613
00:29:23.920 --> 00:29:27.839
<v Speaker 1>the institute, of zoology, Robert could observe and learned how

614
00:29:27.839 --> 00:29:31.400
<v Speaker 1>to peel away mammal's skin or the process of preparing

615
00:29:31.480 --> 00:29:35.160
<v Speaker 1>animal skins. And some say that previously to the zoo,

616
00:29:35.240 --> 00:29:38.039
<v Speaker 1>he had apparently worked in a dissecting lab where he

617
00:29:38.160 --> 00:29:42.440
<v Speaker 1>dealt with human corpses. So I don't know, take your pick,

618
00:29:42.480 --> 00:29:44.599
<v Speaker 1>I suppose, but either way it gave him the skill

619
00:29:44.640 --> 00:29:48.000
<v Speaker 1>to create a human body suit, as he did to Katasina.

620
00:29:48.799 --> 00:29:52.200
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, either of those sounds like it would be a

621
00:29:52.200 --> 00:29:54.559
<v Speaker 2>a background story for an evil villain in a comic book.

622
00:29:54.920 --> 00:29:58.880
<v Speaker 1>Oh, actually, one hundred percent. Yeah, one hundred percent. So

623
00:29:59.039 --> 00:30:02.400
<v Speaker 1>Robert also had a history of harassing women, spying on

624
00:30:02.440 --> 00:30:06.200
<v Speaker 1>his neighbors, and was known to war to wear women's clothing.

625
00:30:06.359 --> 00:30:08.960
<v Speaker 2>Oh so, not only was he an absolute douche Canoe,

626
00:30:08.960 --> 00:30:11.000
<v Speaker 2>he was an all around douche Canoe, got it?

627
00:30:11.079 --> 00:30:14.880
<v Speaker 1>Got it? Yeah, for the harassing women and spying on

628
00:30:14.920 --> 00:30:17.400
<v Speaker 1>the neighbor's part, not for wearing women's clothing.

629
00:30:17.559 --> 00:30:19.279
<v Speaker 2>I mean, you could wear women's clothing if you want.

630
00:30:19.359 --> 00:30:20.839
<v Speaker 2>He just sounds like an absolute douche.

631
00:30:20.960 --> 00:30:22.319
<v Speaker 1>Oh yeah, all of the above is.

632
00:30:22.640 --> 00:30:25.640
<v Speaker 2>Absolute douche who happens to wear women's clothing. Yeah, there's

633
00:30:25.680 --> 00:30:27.319
<v Speaker 2>nothing wrong with you wear whatever you want. I don't

634
00:30:27.319 --> 00:30:29.480
<v Speaker 2>give a shit. He's just a douche who does that thing.

635
00:30:29.720 --> 00:30:32.039
<v Speaker 1>And the women's clothing is only in there because like

636
00:30:32.519 --> 00:30:34.559
<v Speaker 1>that could kind of describe why he would want this

637
00:30:34.680 --> 00:30:36.000
<v Speaker 1>like women's body suit.

638
00:30:36.119 --> 00:30:39.519
<v Speaker 2>Right, Well, that's exactly how it played out for Buffalo Bill.

639
00:30:40.000 --> 00:30:42.279
<v Speaker 1>You're still on the Buffalo, Well, yeah.

640
00:30:42.240 --> 00:30:46.079
<v Speaker 2>That is literally the plot line of silence and lambs. Yeah,

641
00:30:46.160 --> 00:30:50.200
<v Speaker 2>Buffalo Bill was transgender. He was a male and he

642
00:30:50.240 --> 00:30:52.720
<v Speaker 2>felt like he should be a woman. So the reason

643
00:30:52.799 --> 00:30:56.279
<v Speaker 2>why he went out and skinned women was so he

644
00:30:56.279 --> 00:31:00.200
<v Speaker 2>could make a skin suit for him to wear. He

645
00:31:00.240 --> 00:31:02.839
<v Speaker 2>could feel like he was in the skin. He felt

646
00:31:02.880 --> 00:31:03.640
<v Speaker 2>like he should be in.

647
00:31:03.880 --> 00:31:06.279
<v Speaker 1>Right, And I do think that one of the reports

648
00:31:06.319 --> 00:31:09.440
<v Speaker 1>I read said that Robert was bisexual, so and I

649
00:31:09.440 --> 00:31:12.200
<v Speaker 1>think I forgot to put that in here. So after

650
00:31:12.240 --> 00:31:16.240
<v Speaker 1>the letter, investigators put eyes on Robert while they waited

651
00:31:16.279 --> 00:31:19.759
<v Speaker 1>to collect more and more evidence against him, right, and

652
00:31:19.839 --> 00:31:23.480
<v Speaker 1>what they discovered was pretty fucked up and would seal

653
00:31:23.559 --> 00:31:24.079
<v Speaker 1>his fate.

654
00:31:25.200 --> 00:31:25.720
<v Speaker 2>There we go.

655
00:31:25.839 --> 00:31:30.279
<v Speaker 1>There was one place that Robert, Robert would routinely visit.

656
00:31:31.039 --> 00:31:34.920
<v Speaker 1>Do you have any guesses? I think you should be

657
00:31:34.920 --> 00:31:35.599
<v Speaker 1>able to guess.

658
00:31:35.440 --> 00:31:39.880
<v Speaker 2>This probably the university where she was studying.

659
00:31:40.640 --> 00:31:41.240
<v Speaker 1>Her grave?

660
00:31:41.680 --> 00:31:44.039
<v Speaker 2>Her grave, her grave? How the fuck was I going

661
00:31:44.079 --> 00:31:44.599
<v Speaker 2>to guess that?

662
00:31:44.680 --> 00:31:45.759
<v Speaker 1>I don't know. I thought you might.

663
00:31:46.400 --> 00:31:47.920
<v Speaker 2>That's way out of left field.

664
00:31:48.680 --> 00:31:51.000
<v Speaker 1>She would routinely go and visit her grave site.

665
00:31:51.200 --> 00:31:54.839
<v Speaker 2>Really whoa? That is fucked up on.

666
00:31:54.839 --> 00:31:57.559
<v Speaker 1>Another really messed up? Yeah, really mess Wow.

667
00:31:57.599 --> 00:31:59.400
<v Speaker 2>I wonder why he would be visiting her grave.

668
00:31:59.559 --> 00:32:01.240
<v Speaker 1>Well, I don't don't know. He was probably like obsessed

669
00:32:01.279 --> 00:32:06.079
<v Speaker 1>with her, right, maybe I don't know.

670
00:32:06.079 --> 00:32:07.960
<v Speaker 2>But in which way was he obsessed with her? Was

671
00:32:08.000 --> 00:32:09.880
<v Speaker 2>he obsessed in mourning what he did to her?

672
00:32:10.319 --> 00:32:12.200
<v Speaker 1>Oh that could be Actually.

673
00:32:12.200 --> 00:32:15.319
<v Speaker 2>Was he like sorry for his actions? Was he obsessed

674
00:32:16.200 --> 00:32:18.480
<v Speaker 2>with her as a person and wished he didn't do that?

675
00:32:19.200 --> 00:32:21.599
<v Speaker 2>Was he obsessed with the power that he held over

676
00:32:21.599 --> 00:32:24.119
<v Speaker 2>her now even in life and death, being like, yeah,

677
00:32:24.200 --> 00:32:26.480
<v Speaker 2>no one fucking knows, I'm the one here standing over

678
00:32:26.519 --> 00:32:28.799
<v Speaker 2>your grave and still no one knows, Like.

679
00:32:29.039 --> 00:32:32.200
<v Speaker 1>Why I know, I don't think anyone really knows? That

680
00:32:32.359 --> 00:32:34.599
<v Speaker 1>is fuck and well I'll touch on that and again

681
00:32:34.599 --> 00:32:39.240
<v Speaker 1>in a secon in a sec fuck. So, after realizing that,

682
00:32:39.359 --> 00:32:42.160
<v Speaker 1>the authorities moved in on Robert and he was arrested

683
00:32:42.200 --> 00:32:46.160
<v Speaker 1>on October fourth of twenty seventeen. They also discovered a

684
00:32:46.160 --> 00:32:48.640
<v Speaker 1>few more things in his apartment. They found blood in

685
00:32:48.680 --> 00:32:51.880
<v Speaker 1>his bathroom, and it was never really said if it

686
00:32:51.920 --> 00:32:56.000
<v Speaker 1>was like Katerina's blood, but I think you can probably

687
00:32:56.039 --> 00:32:58.880
<v Speaker 1>assume that it was. And they also found his diary,

688
00:32:59.119 --> 00:33:02.799
<v Speaker 1>where he'd written a detailed account of how he'd murdered her.

689
00:33:02.920 --> 00:33:04.279
<v Speaker 2>Of course he fucking did.

690
00:33:04.480 --> 00:33:10.240
<v Speaker 1>Yep. So Robert was charged with aggorated murder with particular cruelty.

691
00:33:11.160 --> 00:33:15.160
<v Speaker 1>His entire defense hinged on him saying that he didn't

692
00:33:15.200 --> 00:33:19.440
<v Speaker 1>know Katerina Katerina, yeah, and had nothing to do with

693
00:33:19.480 --> 00:33:22.720
<v Speaker 1>her death, Like he didn't fucking know her, but yet

694
00:33:22.759 --> 00:33:26.160
<v Speaker 1>he's like visiting her grave on a routine basis, which

695
00:33:26.240 --> 00:33:27.920
<v Speaker 1>doesn't make any sense.

696
00:33:28.119 --> 00:33:29.119
<v Speaker 2>Kata Zina, isn't it.

697
00:33:29.440 --> 00:33:32.240
<v Speaker 1>I don't know, I think Katazine. Yeah, I'm saying her

698
00:33:32.279 --> 00:33:33.119
<v Speaker 1>name wrong all of a sudden.

699
00:33:33.200 --> 00:33:36.240
<v Speaker 2>Sorry, that's okay, it's sometimes it's it's difficult when you

700
00:33:36.279 --> 00:33:39.359
<v Speaker 2>start talking about another name from another language.

701
00:33:39.519 --> 00:33:44.279
<v Speaker 1>Yes, yeah, so that doesn't make any sense. No, he

702
00:33:44.319 --> 00:33:47.000
<v Speaker 1>doesn't know this person, but yet he's like visiting their grave.

703
00:33:46.880 --> 00:33:47.839
<v Speaker 2>And it's in his diary.

704
00:33:48.720 --> 00:33:51.240
<v Speaker 1>Yeah yeah, And there's blood in his bathroom.

705
00:33:51.400 --> 00:33:54.400
<v Speaker 2>Yeah again walking away from your shift at work and

706
00:33:54.440 --> 00:33:56.839
<v Speaker 2>at the building is burning down, being like that's what happened.

707
00:33:57.000 --> 00:34:00.559
<v Speaker 1>Such a good comparison there, Oh my gosh. So agencies

708
00:34:00.599 --> 00:34:03.480
<v Speaker 1>and institutions all over the world, not just in Poland,

709
00:34:03.519 --> 00:34:06.200
<v Speaker 1>were eager to see what would happen with this case,

710
00:34:06.960 --> 00:34:09.320
<v Speaker 1>and that tipped the scales. When it did eventually go

711
00:34:09.400 --> 00:34:12.599
<v Speaker 1>to court in twenty nineteen, an order was issue that

712
00:34:12.719 --> 00:34:16.159
<v Speaker 1>made the trial closed to the public, meaning that a

713
00:34:16.159 --> 00:34:19.079
<v Speaker 1>lot of the information and evidence that the prosecution had

714
00:34:19.119 --> 00:34:23.639
<v Speaker 1>against Robert had remained a mystery, including the actual outcome

715
00:34:23.760 --> 00:34:24.559
<v Speaker 1>of the case.

716
00:34:24.800 --> 00:34:25.920
<v Speaker 2>Oh even the outcome.

717
00:34:26.119 --> 00:34:29.840
<v Speaker 1>Yes, So what we do know is that the case

718
00:34:29.920 --> 00:34:33.880
<v Speaker 1>had gone to court and Robert remains in custody. From that,

719
00:34:34.119 --> 00:34:36.519
<v Speaker 1>we can say that he was at least found guilty

720
00:34:36.519 --> 00:34:40.840
<v Speaker 1>of something, presumingly in relation to Katazina, but we can't

721
00:34:40.880 --> 00:34:43.920
<v Speaker 1>say for sure or for how long he's expected to

722
00:34:43.920 --> 00:34:47.440
<v Speaker 1>be in prison for Robert had made several complaints of

723
00:34:47.480 --> 00:34:52.719
<v Speaker 1>abuse from the guards, but investigators, perhaps unsurprisingly, couldn't find

724
00:34:52.760 --> 00:34:56.880
<v Speaker 1>anything to back up his claims. For the rest of us,

725
00:34:56.960 --> 00:35:00.519
<v Speaker 1>who weren't the ones who were allowed in the court room,

726
00:35:00.639 --> 00:35:03.239
<v Speaker 1>it looks like we'll have to wait until Robert is released,

727
00:35:03.320 --> 00:35:06.360
<v Speaker 1>if ever, to find out exactly what he was found

728
00:35:06.360 --> 00:35:09.920
<v Speaker 1>guilty of and if he really did torture, rape, and

729
00:35:10.000 --> 00:35:14.920
<v Speaker 1>kill Katasina. That's also counting on Robert actually admitting to

730
00:35:15.000 --> 00:35:18.159
<v Speaker 1>his crimes if he's released, or if he's going to

731
00:35:18.199 --> 00:35:20.840
<v Speaker 1>continue to claim that he has no idea who she

732
00:35:21.079 --> 00:35:25.599
<v Speaker 1>was even after he visited her grave on routine basis.

733
00:35:25.960 --> 00:35:28.360
<v Speaker 1>To date, the case is considered one of the most

734
00:35:28.400 --> 00:35:30.760
<v Speaker 1>disturbing murders in Polish history.

735
00:35:32.119 --> 00:35:37.159
<v Speaker 2>Wow, that is very different that the court did not

736
00:35:37.239 --> 00:35:39.519
<v Speaker 2>issue any details even after deliberation.

737
00:35:39.719 --> 00:35:42.559
<v Speaker 1>And because he's an adult, right, that almost seems like

738
00:35:42.599 --> 00:35:46.519
<v Speaker 1>it was like an adolescent adolescence. Yeah.

739
00:35:46.639 --> 00:35:50.719
<v Speaker 2>Interesting. I mean, I actually honestly don't mind the idea

740
00:35:51.000 --> 00:35:57.480
<v Speaker 2>of their not being publicized court cases until afterwards, until

741
00:35:57.480 --> 00:35:58.639
<v Speaker 2>after sentencing and stuff.

742
00:35:58.719 --> 00:36:02.000
<v Speaker 1>Well, because media can actually, oh it can big time.

743
00:36:02.159 --> 00:36:04.639
<v Speaker 2>It can definitely. I mean, for example, as much as

744
00:36:04.639 --> 00:36:07.920
<v Speaker 2>it was entertaining for all of us the whole Johnny

745
00:36:07.960 --> 00:36:10.480
<v Speaker 2>Depp and Amber Herd case in like he was on

746
00:36:10.559 --> 00:36:15.320
<v Speaker 2>TV and ever, look how many people had opinions on everything.

747
00:36:15.000 --> 00:36:16.440
<v Speaker 1>Was that actually that entertaining?

748
00:36:16.760 --> 00:36:18.480
<v Speaker 2>I mean, it was entertaining for a lot of people.

749
00:36:18.719 --> 00:36:20.880
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, it was, but I mean it was also ridiculous,

750
00:36:21.159 --> 00:36:23.079
<v Speaker 1>that's all. I mean, if you found it entertaining, that's

751
00:36:23.079 --> 00:36:24.760
<v Speaker 1>totally fine, but it was also ridiculous.

752
00:36:25.519 --> 00:36:28.000
<v Speaker 2>Well how above and beyond people were going with it

753
00:36:28.039 --> 00:36:31.079
<v Speaker 2>sort of thing. Yeah, But I just I don't mind

754
00:36:31.079 --> 00:36:34.719
<v Speaker 2>that idea on keeping it quiet, not releasing too many details,

755
00:36:35.199 --> 00:36:38.079
<v Speaker 2>letting the court do its thing, and then after sentencing,

756
00:36:38.119 --> 00:36:41.719
<v Speaker 2>after finding out what occurred, then releasing things.

757
00:36:42.280 --> 00:36:45.360
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, because is this not going to I mean, maybe

758
00:36:45.360 --> 00:36:47.880
<v Speaker 1>they're going to release something eventually, but like if he

759
00:36:48.039 --> 00:36:49.880
<v Speaker 1>just comes out, are they not going to say anything

760
00:36:49.880 --> 00:36:51.840
<v Speaker 1>and then this day it's just like walk on the streets.

761
00:36:51.920 --> 00:36:56.360
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, no kidding. I think that there's almost like a

762
00:36:56.519 --> 00:36:59.960
<v Speaker 2>right for the public to know, you know, yeah, especially

763
00:37:00.079 --> 00:37:05.119
<v Speaker 2>if he does go walking free. Yeah wow, Okay.

764
00:37:04.800 --> 00:37:07.280
<v Speaker 1>I know it's a different between mind blowing, but it

765
00:37:07.320 --> 00:37:11.760
<v Speaker 1>is still like fairly fresh. So I'm I'm almost maybe

766
00:37:12.000 --> 00:37:13.960
<v Speaker 1>in my brain, I'm like, oh, well, maybe like COVID

767
00:37:14.000 --> 00:37:16.280
<v Speaker 1>screwed something up and there it's actually not even like

768
00:37:16.360 --> 00:37:19.199
<v Speaker 1>done yet, Like I don't know, who knows. I don't

769
00:37:19.239 --> 00:37:21.719
<v Speaker 1>know because this, I mean, he went to court, it

770
00:37:21.800 --> 00:37:24.599
<v Speaker 1>said in twenty and eighteen, and maybe things didn't finish

771
00:37:24.760 --> 00:37:28.000
<v Speaker 1>off before COVID hit or something. And I don't know,

772
00:37:28.039 --> 00:37:31.599
<v Speaker 1>that's just me being like to what's the word, like,

773
00:37:31.639 --> 00:37:34.159
<v Speaker 1>to overzealous there that it is going to come out.

774
00:37:34.199 --> 00:37:37.400
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, too hopeful, too hopeful, Yeah, gotcha.

775
00:37:37.639 --> 00:37:42.920
<v Speaker 1>Huh So, yeah, that is the brutal murder Katsina.

776
00:37:43.119 --> 00:37:44.400
<v Speaker 2>It sounds like he fucking did it.

777
00:37:44.800 --> 00:37:47.679
<v Speaker 1>Oh yeah, I mean it does sound incredibly like he

778
00:37:47.719 --> 00:37:48.000
<v Speaker 1>did it.

779
00:37:48.079 --> 00:37:52.159
<v Speaker 2>He wrote detailed accounts in his diary yeah, about committing it.

780
00:37:52.559 --> 00:37:55.079
<v Speaker 1>And that blood. I mean, it never even released if

781
00:37:55.079 --> 00:37:57.079
<v Speaker 1>that blood was hers in the bathroom, but I mean

782
00:37:57.079 --> 00:37:58.400
<v Speaker 1>I'm just assuming.

783
00:37:58.519 --> 00:38:02.000
<v Speaker 2>Even still if there were, there would be no noteworthy

784
00:38:02.039 --> 00:38:04.719
<v Speaker 2>reason to note if it was his own blood. So

785
00:38:04.760 --> 00:38:07.519
<v Speaker 2>it's clearly going to be someone else's blood. Yeah, because

786
00:38:07.519 --> 00:38:09.119
<v Speaker 2>I mean, how many times if you like, I don't know,

787
00:38:09.280 --> 00:38:11.239
<v Speaker 2>picked a hangnail and like, oh shit, and you're bleeding

788
00:38:11.239 --> 00:38:13.079
<v Speaker 2>in your own bathroom or stubbed your toe or who

789
00:38:13.079 --> 00:38:13.480
<v Speaker 2>knows what.

790
00:38:13.559 --> 00:38:15.800
<v Speaker 1>Right, Oh yeah, I was bleeding buckets the other day

791
00:38:15.800 --> 00:38:17.920
<v Speaker 1>when I was trying to get an am grown tone.

792
00:38:18.199 --> 00:38:19.960
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, clear, Yeah.

793
00:38:19.760 --> 00:38:21.239
<v Speaker 1>It was like a scene and a half in there.

794
00:38:21.360 --> 00:38:23.840
<v Speaker 2>Exactly. Bleeding in bathrooms is not an abnormal thing.

795
00:38:24.360 --> 00:38:26.840
<v Speaker 1>So but I mean, unless it wasn't like her blood,

796
00:38:27.039 --> 00:38:29.679
<v Speaker 1>unless it was someone else's, like he knows. Maybe, but

797
00:38:29.800 --> 00:38:32.719
<v Speaker 1>it could have even found more things about him being

798
00:38:32.880 --> 00:38:35.000
<v Speaker 1>even worse or doing this to other people.

799
00:38:34.760 --> 00:38:37.360
<v Speaker 2>Could have linked him to other crimes. Yeah, he could

800
00:38:37.400 --> 00:38:38.800
<v Speaker 2>be a serial killer.

801
00:38:38.960 --> 00:38:41.679
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, I mean, because that what he did was pretty

802
00:38:41.679 --> 00:38:43.639
<v Speaker 1>messed up, and it doesn't seem like that would be

803
00:38:43.840 --> 00:38:47.079
<v Speaker 1>the first case, the first thing that you would do.

804
00:38:47.039 --> 00:38:49.559
<v Speaker 2>To I don't think so. Usually you start off pretty small,

805
00:38:49.559 --> 00:38:52.800
<v Speaker 2>and he's skinned someone and turned them into a vest.

806
00:38:52.679 --> 00:38:55.719
<v Speaker 1>Skin them pretty much alive yet, So that's.

807
00:38:55.519 --> 00:38:57.760
<v Speaker 2>Pretty extreme to start right out from the get go.

808
00:38:57.960 --> 00:39:00.760
<v Speaker 1>I feel like he has to be a serial I.

809
00:39:00.679 --> 00:39:03.599
<v Speaker 2>Would assume so, But I mean you can't just assume

810
00:39:03.639 --> 00:39:05.639
<v Speaker 2>those things. You'd have to find evidence, right I know.

811
00:39:06.199 --> 00:39:07.480
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, Wow, that's.

812
00:39:07.400 --> 00:39:09.960
<v Speaker 2>Wild and it's crazy that there just happened to be

813
00:39:09.960 --> 00:39:12.159
<v Speaker 2>someone else who skinned their father's face.

814
00:39:12.400 --> 00:39:14.280
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, at this pretty much the same time.

815
00:39:14.199 --> 00:39:16.239
<v Speaker 2>And dumped the body in a similar fashion.

816
00:39:17.119 --> 00:39:18.719
<v Speaker 1>I don't know if they did dump the body. I

817
00:39:18.719 --> 00:39:20.199
<v Speaker 1>don't think I said they dumped the body.

818
00:39:20.199 --> 00:39:21.639
<v Speaker 2>Didn't you say that they got caught up in a

819
00:39:21.679 --> 00:39:23.239
<v Speaker 2>boat propeller the same way or something?

820
00:39:23.519 --> 00:39:25.880
<v Speaker 1>No, I don't think so. I think you just made

821
00:39:25.920 --> 00:39:26.199
<v Speaker 1>that up.

822
00:39:26.280 --> 00:39:27.679
<v Speaker 2>Oh, I thought you did say it.

823
00:39:28.320 --> 00:39:31.039
<v Speaker 1>Oh. I think it might have been for that case. Oh.

824
00:39:31.199 --> 00:39:32.880
<v Speaker 1>I didn't look into it too much, but I think

825
00:39:32.880 --> 00:39:35.880
<v Speaker 1>it might have been like the grandfather or something that

826
00:39:36.000 --> 00:39:39.159
<v Speaker 1>had turned him in. And I don't know if this

827
00:39:39.280 --> 00:39:42.280
<v Speaker 1>is legit, Like, I don't know, but there was some

828
00:39:42.920 --> 00:39:45.760
<v Speaker 1>I didn't research this enough, but there was one report

829
00:39:45.800 --> 00:39:48.480
<v Speaker 1>that basically said that he wore this mask like in

830
00:39:48.519 --> 00:39:51.559
<v Speaker 1>front of his grandfather, pretending to be like the dad

831
00:39:51.840 --> 00:39:57.880
<v Speaker 1>the fuck, which is real fucked no shit. Yeah, so

832
00:39:57.960 --> 00:40:01.679
<v Speaker 1>we're also hoping that that that Valdemir is also in

833
00:40:01.800 --> 00:40:03.079
<v Speaker 1>jail for like ever.

834
00:40:04.599 --> 00:40:05.159
<v Speaker 2>Wow.

835
00:40:05.480 --> 00:40:09.400
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, because if you can do that to your own dad.

836
00:40:09.039 --> 00:40:10.239
<v Speaker 2>To your own dad, to your.

837
00:40:10.159 --> 00:40:13.360
<v Speaker 1>Own grandpa, yeah, I mean his dad might have done

838
00:40:13.400 --> 00:40:14.599
<v Speaker 1>some ship to him, though we don't know.

839
00:40:14.719 --> 00:40:17.559
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, but that doesn't deserve fucking getting skinned.

840
00:40:17.800 --> 00:40:20.159
<v Speaker 1>No, it doesn't. But I just mean, like I was saying,

841
00:40:20.159 --> 00:40:21.679
<v Speaker 1>if you can do that to your dad, what could

842
00:40:21.679 --> 00:40:23.519
<v Speaker 1>you do to someone else? But then maybe the dad

843
00:40:23.559 --> 00:40:25.159
<v Speaker 1>actually did bad things and blah blah blah.

844
00:40:25.239 --> 00:40:29.000
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, maybe the dad aggravated him to the point that

845
00:40:29.079 --> 00:40:31.480
<v Speaker 2>he broke doesn't mean it's an excuse to break and

846
00:40:31.519 --> 00:40:36.880
<v Speaker 2>do those highness things. But yeah, heinous highness.

847
00:40:38.280 --> 00:40:42.719
<v Speaker 1>Heinous highness is like your highness. Yeah, oh my gosh,

848
00:40:42.800 --> 00:40:45.559
<v Speaker 1>we're we're really winning on this podcast today.

849
00:40:45.280 --> 00:40:46.519
<v Speaker 2>And I'm only drinking water.

850
00:40:46.679 --> 00:40:49.039
<v Speaker 1>Both of us are. Okay, maybe alcohol is like our

851
00:40:49.119 --> 00:40:51.239
<v Speaker 1>special power.

852
00:40:51.320 --> 00:40:52.800
<v Speaker 2>It's like Popeye in this spinach.

853
00:40:53.280 --> 00:40:56.039
<v Speaker 1>Yeah right, so like when we're not drinking alcohol, we're

854
00:40:56.079 --> 00:40:57.119
<v Speaker 1>just like fucking up.

855
00:40:57.559 --> 00:41:01.760
<v Speaker 2>Clearly. Is there anything we got to talk about before

856
00:41:01.760 --> 00:41:04.639
<v Speaker 2>we wrap this up? We didn't talk about the Wicked

857
00:41:04.639 --> 00:41:08.519
<v Speaker 2>Box giveaway, so we did social media sold on. Excuse me,

858
00:41:08.559 --> 00:41:11.039
<v Speaker 2>there we go social media where you can go check

859
00:41:11.079 --> 00:41:13.280
<v Speaker 2>it out Facebook and Instagram. There'll be some posts on

860
00:41:13.320 --> 00:41:16.480
<v Speaker 2>it and an exclusive one as well for patreons. There's

861
00:41:16.480 --> 00:41:19.199
<v Speaker 2>two available. Patrons have the option to win in both.

862
00:41:20.320 --> 00:41:23.599
<v Speaker 2>Just just a little heads up on that and what

863
00:41:23.639 --> 00:41:24.559
<v Speaker 2>else too?

864
00:41:24.679 --> 00:41:27.840
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, then merch and then we're also going to post

865
00:41:28.360 --> 00:41:31.039
<v Speaker 1>a photo of our new honey Honey dogo.

866
00:41:31.280 --> 00:41:35.599
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, so check all that stuff out, all those links

867
00:41:35.719 --> 00:41:38.599
<v Speaker 2>down below. If you feel up to it, you can

868
00:41:38.639 --> 00:41:40.360
<v Speaker 2>go ahead and rate us as well. I don't know

869
00:41:40.400 --> 00:41:42.039
<v Speaker 2>if anyone's out there rating us. We got a couple

870
00:41:42.039 --> 00:41:44.679
<v Speaker 2>of ratings recently and they were super nice, super kind.

871
00:41:44.719 --> 00:41:46.880
<v Speaker 2>So we really appreciate you guys for that. We read

872
00:41:46.920 --> 00:41:47.639
<v Speaker 2>every single one.

873
00:41:47.840 --> 00:41:49.039
<v Speaker 1>Oh yeah, we absolutely do.

874
00:41:49.320 --> 00:41:51.840
<v Speaker 2>So thank you so much for that support. That's incredible

875
00:41:51.880 --> 00:41:52.719
<v Speaker 2>and makes.

876
00:41:52.559 --> 00:41:54.119
<v Speaker 1>Our day, it really does.

877
00:41:54.280 --> 00:41:56.239
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, it's a good job on that episode, babe.

878
00:41:56.599 --> 00:41:59.480
<v Speaker 1>Thank you. It was actually at first it's kind of like, oh,

879
00:41:59.519 --> 00:42:01.960
<v Speaker 1>do I want to research this one? Like sometimes it's

880
00:42:01.960 --> 00:42:04.880
<v Speaker 1>just like it gets to your head and your I'd

881
00:42:05.000 --> 00:42:08.320
<v Speaker 1>rather like watch a Sunshine and Rainbow show than like

882
00:42:08.400 --> 00:42:11.719
<v Speaker 1>research this. But it was actually very It was very interesting,

883
00:42:11.800 --> 00:42:13.599
<v Speaker 1>and I kind of did a little bit of a

884
00:42:13.639 --> 00:42:17.079
<v Speaker 1>deeper dive in some spots, and I mean, it's horrible

885
00:42:17.119 --> 00:42:20.960
<v Speaker 1>what happened to her, just so unnecessary. But yeah, some

886
00:42:21.000 --> 00:42:25.920
<v Speaker 1>of the things in here are very different and like wow, yeah.

887
00:42:25.480 --> 00:42:27.639
<v Speaker 2>And thankfully I was actually able to separate the whole

888
00:42:27.639 --> 00:42:31.840
<v Speaker 2>Buffalo build thing in my head. Initially, I was like, oh,

889
00:42:31.880 --> 00:42:35.360
<v Speaker 2>I'm just just literally fucking picturing this Hollywood movie sitting

890
00:42:35.400 --> 00:42:39.320
<v Speaker 2>down watching TV. But no, it was very not very

891
00:42:39.320 --> 00:42:40.840
<v Speaker 2>long after that where I was like, Okay, this is

892
00:42:41.360 --> 00:42:42.920
<v Speaker 2>this is a real case. It is a real person,

893
00:42:43.239 --> 00:42:44.880
<v Speaker 2>a real situation, so and.

894
00:42:44.920 --> 00:42:47.559
<v Speaker 1>Just think about, Okay, this is a tay I'm so

895
00:42:47.599 --> 00:42:51.599
<v Speaker 1>sorry in events, but she is leaving her mom behind,

896
00:42:51.639 --> 00:42:54.519
<v Speaker 1>and her mom had already lost the dad. Oh so

897
00:42:54.679 --> 00:42:59.760
<v Speaker 1>the poor mom is like another real victim in this fuck. Anyway,

898
00:43:00.079 --> 00:43:02.559
<v Speaker 1>that that, I do apologize.

899
00:43:02.559 --> 00:43:04.960
<v Speaker 2>You just sprink a little bit of salt into that wound.

900
00:43:05.599 --> 00:43:07.159
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, yeah, not the good.

901
00:43:07.760 --> 00:43:10.760
<v Speaker 2>Well, on that note, thank you, we appreciate it for

902
00:43:11.280 --> 00:43:15.079
<v Speaker 2>sprinkling the assault on your wounds. I got another case

903
00:43:15.119 --> 00:43:18.800
<v Speaker 2>coming up next time. It's a little less sad. Yeah,

904
00:43:18.880 --> 00:43:21.400
<v Speaker 2>we asked our patrons to give us a case. It's

905
00:43:21.400 --> 00:43:23.880
<v Speaker 2>a little more light hearted. I mean it is still

906
00:43:24.119 --> 00:43:30.159
<v Speaker 2>crime based. So yeah, a little more less sad case

907
00:43:30.519 --> 00:43:31.239
<v Speaker 2>coming next week.

908
00:43:31.360 --> 00:43:33.480
<v Speaker 1>Here we go, so we have something to look forward to.

909
00:43:33.519 --> 00:43:35.880
<v Speaker 1>We have our second anniversary you look forward to, and

910
00:43:35.920 --> 00:43:38.280
<v Speaker 1>a not so sad case. Yes we're winning.

911
00:43:38.519 --> 00:43:41.639
<v Speaker 2>Yes it'll be a good one all right.

912
00:43:41.679 --> 00:43:45.280
<v Speaker 1>Well, until then, stay wicked.