Speaker 1: This is Andrew Dibshago and you're listening to Unknown Origins Radio.
Speaker 2: There are things in this world beyond our current understanding, ghosts, spirits,
hidden truth that are waiting to be discovered, UFOs, extraterrestrials.
We are searching for the answers multiple dimensions, high strangeness,
and we won't stop until we find them. Conspiracies, government
cover roops. This is Unknown Origins Radio, and good evening everybody.
Speaker 3: Welcome to another edition of Unknown Origins Radio here on
the Dark Matter Digital Network. I'm Mark Johnson. Along with
me is our stalwarth co host mister Bruce Pearson. Hi
you tonight, Bruce, Fine.
Speaker 4: Mark, and we want to say good evening. Also to
back at Command Central Keith Rowland, who keeps keeps things
running for us back there.
Speaker 5: If it wasn't for Keith, we wouldn't be.
Speaker 4: Here, that's right, because he'd call the Federal marshals on
me and they come and drag me away.
Speaker 3: Well, well, you know, we tried out a brand new
promo tonight. What'd you think of that?
Speaker 1: Uh?
Speaker 4: I think I recognize somebody's voice in.
Speaker 3: There, somebody's maybe I don't know. It was good Mark,
some guy I drug off the street. But we'll try
that one out and we might we might play around
with it. I was getting kind of tired of the
old one, so we'll see what else we can come
up with.
Speaker 4: Very nice.
Speaker 5: So before we get.
Speaker 3: Started, we have a great lineup tonight, some great guests.
Just want to talk about real quick. There's a couple
of things happening. First and foremost, we want to put
a shout out to our good friend David Rowntree, who
is currently in the hospital. David got a bad brown
reck loose spider bite and on his foot and wound
up in the hospital. So he's doing well and he's
been posting online. So David, if you're listening, we wish
you the best and hope you get quickly recovered and
getting back out there. Just you know, we're boots next time.
Just remember that.
Speaker 4: Well, yeah, they can be very deadly. Having lived out
in the southwest of New Mexico and Colorado, they're much
more prevalent out there, of course than they are here.
But out there, as you and I talked before we
went on the air, it's the practice to make sure
you dump your shoes out before you put them on.
In the morning because that's where they like to hang out,
in dark, warm places, and they're much more venomous for
their size than even tarantulas are. So three bites by
one of them is definitely nothing to full around with.
We wish him a safe recovery because that's kind of
sketchy at that level.
Speaker 5: So yeah, hang in there, Dave, Yeah, David, definitely.
Speaker 3: You know, I just want to there are some new
news that came up this week, and you know, being
an astronomy nut that I am, I had to bring
this up. Just came out yesterday about NASA finally announcing
a new Earth size planet being discovered, Kepler four point
fifty two B, which is sixty percent larger than Earth.
But it's still in that one of those super Earth
or Earth like planets, but it's a it's circling around
a brighter scar, brighter star, and it's within the Goldilock
zone and to date it seems like the closest possible
replica of the Earth that we have found so far.
And you know, whether or not it has life is
totally undetermined, but it is a rocky planet, not a
gas giant, and within that perfect zone around a star
that's very similar to our own son. So hey, you know,
maybe we just found Vulcan.
Speaker 4: And how far away is it?
Speaker 3: Pray tell, oh, good lord, Now you don't want to
make me pull up that information.
Speaker 4: I'm not sure if you're going to give us a story.
You know, can I can I walk to it? Or
do I have to catch a bus?
Speaker 6: Uh?
Speaker 5: Yeah, you could take a bus.
Speaker 3: It would probably take you, you know, about one hundred
thousand years, but you know, just let us know what
it looks like when you get there.
Speaker 4: Well, every bus trip I've taken seemed like it did
take one hundred thousand years.
Speaker 5: So especially if you're taking the city bus.
Speaker 1: Uh.
Speaker 4: No, long distance transit on bus is not the most
fun way to go anyway. Yeah, I think that statistically,
we all know, even though the naysayers tend to discount it,
that there's no statistical way that there couldn't be life
on other planets. It's just a statistical and possible impossibility. Boy.
So that's interesting, and I think you'll see, as Richard
Hoglan has contest contended for an amount of time, the
NASA continually, you know, just keeps cracking the faust a
little bit. And let's a drop out here and a
drop out there, which is a conditioning process to soften
our transition into acknowledgment, whether it's acknowledging there's water on
Mars or so on and so forth, that you know,
they don't have any problem with it, and eventually they'll
acclimate the general public to the point where I think
that it'll be a kind of a non sequitur in
a non event to say, Okay, well there is something
going on. It certainly will be an event, but I
think that this is part of the process, the long
term process of a paradigm shift.
Speaker 3: Well, you know, speaking of processes, you know, I have
to mention this one too. This is my chuckle for
the week. Fox News came out with a report this
week that an earthquake of devastating proportions is eminent any
moment now on the West Coast. Okay, you know, they
did a big special on it. They had doctor Mitchell
who on there, and yeah, they're expecting a big earthquake
on this on the West coast.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 5: You know, being from California.
Speaker 4: You're always expecting always.
Speaker 3: We've been waiting for that damn earthquake for how many
years now? And you know this is speaking of someone
who has survived not one, but two major earthquakes where
I was sitting right on top of them. The last
one was the ninety four Northridge quake, and let me
tell you that one really got my attention. And and
you know, let's see, Ollywood's been making movies about it. Well,
there was just one out this summer, San Andreas, and
yet now Fox News is releasing this as like this
is a big story that nobody knew about.
Speaker 4: Well, all I can say is if all the cats
disappear one day, I'd be head nies at a rapid pace.
Speaker 5: The cats and the dogs.
Speaker 4: Oh yeah, the animals, absolutely, they all run out of
the house and disappear into the wilderness. That's one of
the most accurate predictors that something's on its way.
Speaker 3: Yeah, that's when, you know, just drop everything, get in
the car, and take off head east YEP as quickly
as possible. So anyway, how's how's you been doing this
last week?
Speaker 4: Busy and trying to weather you know, one hundred degree
high humidity heat and then it drops down thirty or
forty degrees, so uh, you know, the weather shifts. This
last weather shift here in in the Uh, in the
Great Delaware Valley. It has been nice because it cooled
down a little bit, but we had a we had
our share pretty hot and humid weather. But other than that,
you know, living the life, paying the taxes as it
were in wonderful tax New Jersey. So just hanging in there,
how about you.
Speaker 3: Well, pretty much the same, pretty much the same. But uh,
really looking forward to tonight's show, and I think, uh,
that'll be our queue to go right into it.
Speaker 5: Tonight.
Speaker 3: We have a couple of great guests and really excited
to talk with them because their case is at the
center of one of the earliest and most well known
alien abduction cases in the United States. Probably one of
the earliest ones was the Betty and Barney Hill case
in nineteen sixty four. But in nineteen sixty seven, Betty
Andreason had her own experience and it was documented in
the book by Raymond Fowler called the Andreasen Affair. But
that's not where the story ends. It seems like that's
only the beginning. So we're welcoming to the show tonight,
Betty Andreas and Luca and her husband Bob Luca, Betty
and Bob, welcome to the program.
Speaker 7: Well, thank you very much for happy to be here.
Speaker 4: Thank you if you having a son, well, and we
need to rewind you again, get real close to the
phone and speak up so the folks at home can
hear you nice and clearly. But thank you very much
for joining us this evening.
Speaker 3: Now, Betty, I'm going to that I read the Andreas
and Affair book many many years ago for the first time,
and i've been I reread it again recently, and you know,
that story alone was incredibly fascinating, and then yet finding
out that there's a lot more going on with your story,
I was wondering if you and Bob wouldn't mind, first
of all, for those you know, one or two listeners
who may not be aware of your story, just tell
us a little bit about yourself and maybe you started
a little bit to that first experience.
Speaker 7: Okay, Well, I married Bob and I have seven children
and life goes on, so there's quite a bit to
do all the time. Right now, we've been doing a
lot of radio shows to inform the people of the
Andreas and Affair, and we appreciate you having a son. However,
what happened was it was nice eighteen sixty seven and
my husband had an accident and he was in the hospital,
and so my mother and father came to stay with
me and my seven children. And at the time it
was evening, the kids were watching television. The power was on,
and suddenly a reddish orange light was flashing through the
pantry window and the lights all went out. So my
father thought it probably was the police or fire department,
so he rushed past me without me knowing, and he
went into the pantry area and I started out to
the kitchen. So it was really first my father was
the first one to see the beings coming intoward the home,
and he explained them as children, small beings that were
dressed in costume moon costumes. He felt, you know, the
thing is, at first he didn't want to say anything.
He remembered what he saw and everything, but he was
fearful of its social security being taken away from him.
So finally I said to him, Daddy, I'm going to
need to have some support with this. I mean, it's
a strange thing that happened, and I did need someone
there that also saw them, and so he did talk
with the investigators and tell them what had happened. But
meanwhile I was in the kitchen and standing there, and
the reddish orange light was flashing through the room, and
all of a sudden, five beings entered my home right
through the wooden door. And they're standing there before me,
and they looked very strange. They were about five feet
They had large heads, gray skin, big black scary eyes.
They were dressed in blue uniforms, tight fitting uniforms, and
they had a belt and a slash across their chest
that went to the back. And immediately I was thinking,
who could this possibly be? And I was thinking, well,
the Word of God says entertain the strangers, for it
may be angels unaware, And so this is what I
thought they were.
Speaker 5: Betty.
Speaker 3: I'm going to interrupt you just for a moment. I'm
going to let you know you are coming over very
very faint. And I was wondering, if are you and
Bob in separate.
Speaker 7: Rooms, nowhere in the same room.
Speaker 3: Would it be possible for you to talk on Bob's phone,
because I know he was coming through a little bit
clearer on that phone, and because we want to make
sure everybody can hear you clearly.
Speaker 1: Okay, well hold on for a second.
Speaker 7: Okay, how's this is?
Speaker 3: This?
Speaker 7: Better.
Speaker 5: Yes, that is much better. Thank you. Fine, So go
ahead and continue.
Speaker 3: You said that these beings came in the home with
the large black eye.
Speaker 7: Yeah, they're standing there, and you know, they look so
strange to me. But I just thought of scripture where
it says entertain the strangers put it, maybe angels unaware,
because this was an odd looking being to me standing
before me. And so anyway, the thing was, they sort
of gave me a feeling of peace and love. And
they were talking to me but through the mind, and
it was difficult to understand what they were saying. And
I thought they were saying that they were there for
something to eat, and so I went to the refrigerator,
got some meat, went to the stove, took out a
frying pan, started to cook some meat with him, and
they stepped back. The leader stepped back, kind of astonished,
and he again spoke to me through the mind. No, no,
we don't want something to eat like that, We want
knowledge tribe by fire, And I thought, well, what in
the world would that be, And the only thing I
could think of, well, the Bible has been around for
a long time, so it definitely had been tried by
fire for people to try and understand it, and so
I told him to come into the living room. We
went into the living room, and it was only the leader,
whose name was Quasca. He told me his name, and
three other beings beside him. The other being evidently had
gone over to where my father was and was standing
in the area that there was like a wall there
and it went into the pantry area, so he was
My father was in the back of the pantry wall
by the window when he had been looking out and
saw them coming down the hill. So anyway, we were
in the living room and I reached down for the
Bible that was on the end table, and when I did,
I could see my family, My mother and my children
were all sitting there as if time had stopped with them.
They weren't like a state of suspended animation. And I
reached for the Bible and passed it to the leader,
and when he held out his hand, I could see
he had three fingers. And he put the Bible in
his hand and he waved his hand over it, and
three smaller books appeared on top, and he passed them
to the three beings that were beside him. They held
them in their hand and they didn't turn the pages.
The pages automatically turned, and they it was like bright light.
I couldn't see any writing or print on those pages.
It just looked like bright light was flipping by, and
it seemed as if they were consuming whatever it was
with their eyes. Now the leader saw that I was
a little apprehensive, hensive with what was happening, and wondering
what was happening to my family that were sitting there
so still, And they took my daughter Rebecca out of
that state, and she stood up and she looked over,
but she could not move. And he then passed me
a thin blue book, and he said it was for
my initiation, that I should read it and look through
it for ten days, and after ten days it would
be gone. Well at that time, Becky had seen it
at the same time, but as I said, she could
not move. After that, I put the book down, and
he had me getting back with him, and we went
out into the kitchen and out through. I went out
through the wooden door right with him. I didn't feel anything.
It was just as if I was passing through air,
right through the wooden door into the porch and around
the corner somewhat and up the slight Incline Hill there
and there was a craft Betty.
Speaker 3: Before you continue, let me ask you a question when
this all happened, when your family would seem to be
frozen and then these beings come through the door, what
is your thought? Were you terrified? Were you comforted? I mean,
what kind of emotions were you feeling at that moment
in time.
Speaker 7: I was first shocked, I mean, to have them come
right through the door. And then the only explanation my
mind would come to it has to be an angel
or angels that came through, even though they did not
look like an angel, like you know the pictures you
see of the beautiful people with wings and so forth.
But that was my thought of it. And then all
of a sudden, there was a peaceful feeling and a
piece of a feeling of love that was present. And
that's what drew me to the understanding of a scripture
where it says entertain the stranger, where it may be
angels unaware.
Speaker 5: Okay, okay, yeah, all right, yeah.
Speaker 3: It's interesting that you change when you felt the love
and the peace come through. In some of these cases,
it just does seem like they are able to, I
want to say, manipulate emotions, but be able to focus
emotions so that people will calm down or be in
certain states when they take them right.
Speaker 7: But I was told there were seventy races there's any
planet Earth, So I mean there are going to be
some that probably are not doing the right thing.
Speaker 3: Bro probably not, just just like people. You know, there's
good bad everywhere you turn, even out in the slums
of the galaxy. So they took you outside through the
solid wooden door. You went through it like it didn't
even there. And what did the ship look like?
Speaker 7: Well, first of all, when we were outdoors, the leader
Quaska raised his hand, and when he did that, the
bottom part of the craft became trans parents and I
could see it like I was looking right through a window,
and there was this uh. These they were strange. They
were like big, huge crystal cut like glass balls on
the bottom, and they had stems attached to it that
came up, and on top was another crystal, smaller ball,
and then it had like two amateurs that came out,
and it carried a wheel, a glass crystal like wheel,
and around this there were three of those, and around
this was this kind of a tube that it evidently
moved upon and that's what I saw as far as
what the bottom of the craft looked like. After that,
he just lowered his hand and we went to the
front part of the craft. The door opened and we
went inside, and a couple of them just left to
go someplace in the craft evidently, and they kind of
left me standing there with maybe one or two for
a while. And then after that I was taken into
an upper room and I saw some just some details
of things. It was like a long table like and
it had these, i don't know, horns like on the
edges of each corner, and there was sort of a
it's kind of hard to explain everything that was fair,
but there was also a it must have been like
a camera that came out of the wall, because I
saw it come out as if it was watching everything.
After that they had taken me came back for me.
We went down these stairs and then into another room,
and when we passed I could see there was it was,
you know, I'm not machines. That kind of hard for
me to explain, but it was like a square and
the thing pulled out and it was like honey comb
cones indented in sections of this and there was I
guess they used that as some kind of a power
pot of their craft, because it seemed as if it
had like energy coming out of it. That was one
of the things that I saw of what the craft
looks like as well. But they had taken me aboard
and I was told that I was going to be
measured full light. So I was brought to a place
to change my clothes into a small garment that was
hanging in this small kind of strange looking room, and
it was just hanging in mid air. I changed my
clothes and put the on. I also had to be cleansed.
I had to get under a cleansing machine where it
rose up and then a light came down on me.
Speaker 3: When these were happening to you, they're doing these tests,
they're making you change clothes. What was going through your
mind at that point? And one of the questions I'm
really interested in knowing is did it feel like it
was real?
Speaker 5: Or well?
Speaker 3: Yes, it felt so, it wasn't it didn't have a
dream like quality, or it didn't feel like a like
an altered state of perception.
Speaker 7: No, No, it felt very real. Interesting, you know, because
within me, I thought, how can I get out of here?
You know I was. I was kind of frightened, even
though they weren't hurting me at all, But I mean
I was in a strange atmosphere, and you know anytime
you go where if something unusual a strange, you wonder
about it and you kind of feel shaky what's going
to happen next? And at that point I was told
by the leader that, you know, he was going to
measure me for light. And after I changed and was cleansed,
I was brought into another room and I was put
up on a table and as I lay there on
the table, he said he had this sort of like
a fanlike thing and he waved that over me. I guess,
measuring me for light. It had like a fan type
to it with tulipped things like on the end of it.
And as he waved it over my whole body and
down by my legs and feet and everything, he said, well,
he is going to have to measure me more because
I something about the light around my knee and back
of my knee. He had to measure me physically. And
I objected to that because he said he was only
going to measure me for light and that was it.
But he said he had to now measure me physically,
and that's when he started to check my whole body.
I'm laying on the counter there, and it was, you know,
it was stiff. I felt nervous, and that now he
was going to start to measure me other ways, yes, physically,
and so at that point what happened was he had
a needle and he wanted to measure me for procreation,
and he stuck the needle into my navel, but he
put his hand on my forehead, which took away a
great deal of the pain. So that made me feel better.
And I could feel the instrument, you know, in my
navel and around my stomach as it moved around. And
he said something to me about something missing, you know,
and I had had a hysterectomy, so that evidently I
told him I had a hysterectomy, and evidently that is
what he found was missing, unless he thought that there
was something more to it, that maybe they had put
something there, I don't know. After that, he also said
that he had to examine me further, and he put
another type of needle and he put it into my
left nostril, and when he did, I could feel it breakthrough.
But he had his hand on my forehead that was
taking away a great deal of the pain. You know.
At times this makes me so nervous because I remember,
as i'm telling you the things, I'm remembering what I
went through, and it is, I don't know, if you've
had anything really bad happen and you're brought back to
that same situation, often it makes you shiver almost, you know.
And so anyways, he placed the needle in my left
nostril and it went up. I couldn't feel it, and
hear it break through, but he took away the pain.
And when he withdrew then the long needle, there was
a little babie like thing on the end of it,
the little pickers and it like. And evidently what had
happened was at that time I didn't realize I had
had an earlier encounter where I had been implanted.
Speaker 3: So they were removing an implant that you were previously
aware of.
Speaker 7: Yes, exactly, yes. And after that, after that was finished
and everything, I had to go back out into the
other room and I changed back into my clothes and
they brought me into another room. We went past a
thing It looked sort of like an elevator, but you know,
it's hard to explain all the details because it was
so much that was happening, and I was so much
so nervous from the whole thing and scared at times
that it's hard to recall everything that was happening. But
they took me into another room, and this was like
a Quantt Hut type room. Now, at this time, there
were two smaller beings with me, but they were dressed
in silver suits, and when they had examined me, they
were also dressed in silver suits, and they wore white
gloves at that time. But when I went into this
other area, the ones, the two that were with me,
were dressed in silver suits. And in this Quantt Hut
type room, there were eight chairs and they seemed like
they were glass of plastic chairs. They had covers to
some of them, and they sat me in the very
first chair off to the left, and as I sat
in there, the hood came down. They put a thing
in my mouth first and put some sweet tasting I
don't know, a food or whatever, a liquid and it
tasted sweet, and I began to relax when that happened.
And then the whole chair filled up with water, and
I guess the beings fought. I mean, the investigators thought
that I was being put in this chair as we
were traveling along, so I wouldn't I would be able
to stand, what if the precires were or something. But
after that had happened, the the liquid came, you know,
came out of the chair, rained out of the air,
and the hood went up, and then I was taken
and I was put on in the middle of this
quant and room was like a black track, and one
of the being, small beings with silver suits, got in
back of me, and the other being got in front
of Betty.
Speaker 3: Before you continue, let me ask real quick, do you
feel that you lost consciousness at all while you were
in the chair.
Speaker 7: I think I may have, because it was just so
strange everything. It was filled up with water, with this gray,
liquidy water, and I'm fearful, you know, drowning from it.
But they gave me things that would make me be okay,
because I came out of it anyway, okay. And they,
as I said, once it went up, the liquid drained
and the hood went back up. To excuse me, and
I stood on this long track with one of the
beings in back of me, one in front, and we
moved along, and I could see the other chairs there
on the right hand side as well. But we moved
along and we were going past this It was sort
of like a quantt hot type long room. And we
just moved along on this black track. And what happened
was the beings took a black hood and they put
these black hoods over their heads, so they were like
in a silver suit with a black hood over their head,
and I had nothing, was just in the middle of them,
moving along, not even walking. I was just moving along
on this track. Somehow we went we're going ahead, and
we came up to it looked like a mirah. And
what happened was we moved into a tunnel that was
all black, and the only thing I could really see
very well was the silver suits. That gave me some
you know, something to hold onto, like you know, where
I was and everything. As we moved along on this
track in these this black tunnel or cave whatever it was,
I could see there were other entrances off to the
left and to the right because they were docker colored
as if they went into other areas. And as we
moved along, we kept on going up ahead, and we
came to an area that that seemed like also like
red atmosphere was there, and we moved into the red
atmosphere while we were on the track. As we moved
along in this red atmosphere, there were these strange buildings.
They were built, but there it was like open windows
and doors, and there were these strange red creatures there,
and they were climbing over the walls and in the windows,
and they had like for their head they had their
neck was like two stalks that came up and big
black eyes on the end of these stalks, and then
they sort of like what you'd think of frogs legs, uh,
you know, front pots of their legs would look that
looks like their arms and their legs were that way,
and also their fingers. Of these red creatures, strange red creatures,
and they were all over the place, and they were
looking at me, and uh, you know, and I wondered, well,
why didn't the beings give me something to cover my
head too, because it was it seemed as if these
these the beings in the silver suits with the hoods,
black hoods on their head were not to look at
these red creatures. And I thought, well, why why don't
I have was an eye provided with some kind of heads,
but I had to see it.
Speaker 5: Uh, did you see any type of my.
Speaker 7: Long, dark, dark hair that they figured that was enough?
Speaker 5: I guess did they?
Speaker 3: Did you feel any type of threat or menace from
these creatures?
Speaker 7: Well, there was something as if they were an army
of some kind. This is what was what went through
my head. I don't know if it was the being
that was telling me, but it seemed as if they
had them for a particular purpose, and one of the
purposes were something like an army for some reason. But
we moved on the track. It automatically moved, and we
moved out of the red atmosphere. It was a swirling
like door and it had red and it turned into
green as the door was swirling, and the track went
right through it. And we went right through the red
into a green atmosphere. And this was very surprising to
me because we were way up high and I could
see way way below excuse me, a green ocean, like
bright green ocean, and the atmosphere was green. It was
very strange, and we just moved along, and as we moved,
they again did not take those black hoods off. They
just stayed one in back of me, one in front
of me, and we just moved along this track. I
was able to see what was happening. I looked off
to the side, to the left hand side, because it
looked like there was some kind of crafts moving in
this atmosphere. And I've drawn pictures of everything that I
saw so that people can have a better idea, because
it's very hard to explain every detail of what the
thing was shaped like and looked like and so forth.
But we moved along and there was very little land
that came upward. I saw some vegetation, but very little there,
and it was all different colors. And as we moved
in this green atmosphere, we kept on moving along on
this track, and it was like it was kind of scary,
but I was very felt secure, like I couldn't fall,
even though I could look, and I could see this
green water underneath there, you know, like an ocean. And
as we moved along, we kept on moving, and I
could see off to the left hand side. After I
had seen that ship or whatever it was that passed by,
I saw a city and it was way way in
the back there a background like and it had domes
in the city and these like pointed like pinnacles, and
there were tracks running all through this city as well.
Although I was quite a ways away from the city.
It was off to the left hand side in the
distance that I saw this in the green atmosphere, and
as we continued on, we continued on as we passed
the city, and all of a sudden I saw to
the left there was this huge pyramid. But it was
a three sided pyramid. It was a reddish brown. Even
though the atmosphere was green, I could make out it
was a reddish brown, and it had white edgings to
the three sides. It was shaped more like it was
a bird, like a flat in the front, and then
it indented a little and went out to the point,
and then the other side indented a little and joined
the other point. So it was a three sided pyramid.
And on top of it was a huge head. It
looked like an Egyptian head was right on top of
the center of the pyramid. What was so strange was
Mark was also years later there was I guess Hoagland
had pictures of something on Mars where there was a
head or a faith. Yeah, yeah, well that's exactly what
that head looked like. It had the same kind of headdress,
and the head was just sitting on top of the
of the three sided pyramids. We moved along, kept moving along,
and as we did, it started to get brighter and brighter,
and the green started green. Atmosphere started to get a
little bit lighter, and it seemed more like a blue,
you know, like sky to me. As we were moving
along on this track, and at that point, all of
a sudden, I heard like tinkling and tinging sounds, music
like thought of sounds, and we were coming up to
these magnificent crystals that were hanging in mid air off
to the left, and they were just it was just
absolutely the most beautiful thing I've ever seen, just hanging
in mid air. And as we moved along, I was
watching this and at this point we were coming up
to something while we were on this black track, and
the thing is, I saw a bright, bright light shining
and as we are closer and closer off to the
right side, I saw something. I know this must sound
crazy and impossible to people, but if they were there,
they would see what I'm talking about. And it's hard
to explain exactly, you know, what had happened. It sounds crazy,
but it happened, and there's this huge bird that looked
like an eagle, or well I thought it was an
eagle with its wings down. And as we were on
this track and came closer and closer to it, we
came to some land like there, and the two beings
got off and took their hoods off. But they said
I had to go on, and so I went on.
And this huge bird I could see the wings down,
and the feathers were like moving like you know, fluffing out,
like little feathers all over the wings that were down,
and there was bright light. It was as if the
eagle was holding back these streaks of bright, bright light
all around. And when I got up to that point,
all of a sudden, it seemed it was getting so hot,
and there were spots of fire or light all over
the place. It seems as if I felt as if
I passed out, because the next thing I recalled was
there was this huge pile of gray clay or what
of dirt or whatever it was, and out of it
came a huge worm, a gray, huge worm. Now it
was still a bright bright light there, and at that
particular point I heard my name being called from the
bright light that was before me off to the side,
and it said Betty, Betty, and you know, I was
afraid because it was so strange. And the boy said,
you have seen and you have heard. Do you understand?
And I started crying and I said, no, I don't understand.
I don't even know why I'm here.
Speaker 1: What is this?
Speaker 7: I don't understand. And the boy said, the voice out
of the brightest, brightest light said I have chosen you
to show the world. And at that point I just
was thinking of the Lord Jesus that, you know, it
must be something with God or with the Lord Jesus
that was happening, because I just didn't understand all that
was taking place. And when I was told that I
was chosen to show the world, I asked, what is this?
You know? And after that, the next thing I remember,
I'm turned around and I'm going back, and the one
of the beings were in front of me and went
in back, and we just followed that same track. The
track just moved on its own. We went past the
crystal that beautiful like a gem in the air. We
went past those, kept going and off to the right
hand side. After I saw the city first, I saw
the three sided pyramid, and then I saw the city
and there was still large domes and pinnacles and black
like tracks going all over, as if that was their
transportation whatever, And we kept on moving. The beans had
put the hoods back on their head. One was in
front of me, one was in back of me, and
as we moved along, We're in this green atmosphere, so beautiful,
so comfortable, And then all of a sudden I could
see a swirling ball of green and red, and we
entered into the red atmosphere again, where the strange creatures
were all standing, crawling on the walls and everything. It
seemed as if the two beings had to have woods
on their heads when they were around these red creatures
for some reason. It was years later that I had
another experience and I found out why. But as we
moved through the red atmosphere again, I was brought through.
We went through like a mirror, and then went into
the We were in the tunnel, and I still could
see like there was other outlets in this big tunnel
or cave, whatever it was. And as we moved along
on the track, we came back into the quantcert hut
type room and I was set in another chair off
to the left, and they set me down and my
arms had to be on the handles of this chair
and I felt something sharck make and after that I
was taken out of that chair and we moved through
the area, and that's when after I was starting to
be taken home. But it was a strange experience. There
was so much that happened, and I get the shakes
even now when I'm having to tell about it, because
it feels as if I relive a little bit of
it each time, and it's very difficult to tell all
the information and the details of everything that happened.
Speaker 4: Well, Betty, that's that's an amazing story. And I have
to say, as I was just sharing with Mark, I mean,
you sound completely sincere and honest with it. It's as
you said, it's very hard for anyone to even imagine
you experience, saying that if they didn't go through it.
I have a bunch of follow up questions if I may,
and I was trying to write them down as you
went through it. Could we go back to and I'm
sure you've been asked these questions before, but I'm interested
in some of the nuts and bolts questions about your experience,
for example, this craft. When when you were taking aboard
this craft, do you have any idea of the size
of it? Because I know there's a lot of listeners
that want to ask these type of questions. Your your
diagram is very good in illustrating what you were explaining.
So if folks went onto your website, which is andreson
affair dot com, there are some uh drawings, black and
white drawings that you made and they helped describe the
three elements, the crystals in the in the bottom of
the craft, which was probably the propulsion unit. I think interesting.
As an aside, this actually mimics to some the configuration
that Bob Lazar described when he worked out at Harry
fifty one and he was able to see these back
engineered craft. Some of the other things that you related
to in my many years of research going back to
nineteen seventy six and Roswell the counter rotating segments of
the craft. Could you explain the color. Did it look
like it was metallic?
Speaker 7: Well, it looked metallic, but it could have been like
a glass like because it seemed as if they could
raise their hand and you know, you could see the
interior of it. They also told me at one time
that they used mercury in a gel to fly the craft.
And I guess since then there has been I think India,
I guess the Vermono or whatever you vedic texts, which
I had never heard of that ever before. But what's
so strange is just recently, this last two Thanksgivings, my
daughter was here. It was around Thanksgiving and she says, my,
uh Mick and I her brother have been trying to
figure out where the cellar door was to that house
in South Ashburnham outdoors and uh so I told her,
and then she said, as you mentioned how she was
out in. They were outdoors over by the Cement Foundation,
which is pot garage and pot and just an open
foundation at this particular house, and they found they found
mercury and they were playing with it. And I said,
what I said, mercury what I was so upset. She says, yeah,
we were putting it in our hands back and forth
and playing with it and everything. So the only thing
I could figure out what had happened was when the
craft had come to my home, it went over in
that area because it was dark in that area and
there were trees and everything, and there was that cement area,
so they must have stayed there when they put out
the lights of the whole area. And then they came
and they settled down on the back hill next to
the house. But I was surprised to hear that my children,
not only my daughter but the rest of my children
were playing with mercury that they found out there. Now,
I mean, that doesn't grow out on a.
Speaker 3: Cement, no, And I'm glad they didn't get sick from it, because.
Speaker 4: If you touch it, it's not well.
Speaker 7: They were yeah, well, I think what happened was evidently
either the craft leaked it or they let some out
and it doesn't have as much danger or something to
a person once it's been used or something. I don't know,
but I was totally shocked before Thanksgiving when my daughter
was here and mentioned that they had all played with it.
Speaker 4: Must have been Afford with the leaky radiator. Let's go
back to But you know, it's interesting that you should
say that now that you were told at the time
that it was mercury that they used to propel the unit.
Speaker 7: Mercury and some kind of gel.
Speaker 4: Well, this is very interesting because if you go back
to the the glock. The stories are surrounding the German Insleasia,
the German experimentation with the bell it was it's reported
that that attained a zero gravity effect by rotating a
mercury liquid mercury counter rotating that at super high speeds
within the containment. So you had two different systems going
in alternative directions, just as you related to the top
of the craft turned in one direction in the bottom
and another, and many other, many many other descriptions of
aerial craft that have been put forward for many, many
years report that you have this counter rotational effect. So
there's two things that corroborate with other stories, and this
is the torsional effect caused by a very heavy liquid
such as mercury or some type of liquefied lead may
have the properties to nullify the gravitational effect in the
same way that a gyroscope can cause that to happen.
So I find that interesting. Did you some other quick questions?
How much information did these beings give you on on
where exactly their planet was or where you were transported to,
and any other details technically on what you know what
this craft was about.
Speaker 7: How how I saw I saw the craft, and I
matter of fact, I drew down the pictures that you know,
what I saw and remembered. I drew down, and that
is Bob has put those on our Facebook so people
can actually see what the workings that I saw.
Speaker 4: And did you was it all one room inside the craft?
You mentioned that you were put on a table and stuff.
Could you explain the interior design of the of the
craft and what you experienced in there?
Speaker 7: Well? The thing was, first of all, I was I
was brought in and I waited there for a while
by myself, and I was brought up some stairs round
It seemed as if now I don't know how that was,
because the craft when I was standing there, I didn't
think it was that big. But I was brought around
some stairs and up into an upper room. And then uh,
after that, I was brought down again and into another area,
and I saw the the like a square thing that
had these honeycomb things with glass long stems with glass
on them.
Speaker 1: Uh.
Speaker 7: And I think that was some kind of an energy
power unit of some kind. And then I was brought
into a change into the change, the changing room, I
just had to stand on a rounded thing and the
light came down all around me. Then I had to
get into an odd shaped room like a V. The
floor was like a V, and then it rose up
with Uh. There was a garment just hanging in mid
air that I had to get into and put on.
Then from there I was taken again into I'm maybe
not getting all the details, but then I was brought
into the same outer area and into the room where
I was uh checked, you know, with the needles and everything,
and checked for light.
Speaker 4: What could you explain that though? When when you say
checked for light, do you understand what that means? I'm not,
you know, I'm not sure what checked for light meets well.
Speaker 7: And I was measured for light, it was like like, ah,
you know, measure It could have been measuring my spirit. Uh,
I don't know, but checked for light.
Speaker 1: Uh.
Speaker 7: They just moved it over At that time, I didn't
even think of it, just you know, they said they
were measuring me for light.
Speaker 1: Period.
Speaker 7: And they were moving this thing up and down my
body and over by my legs and and my knees,
and they said that on the back of my knee.
There was something. I don't know what it all meant,
but the thing was that they would have to measure
me physically, and I thought, you know, you told me
just Quaska said he was just going to measure me
for light, and now he's wanting to measure me physically,
and that's when those needles were used.
Speaker 4: And how many other beings were there besides this one individual?
Speaker 7: Oh, there were well, there were there were five beings
with Klasga when they first came into the house, and
then when we got into the into the craft, there
was like I remember about two and then I was
brought up into the upper room and then I was
taken down again and I was brought into the examining
room after I had changed and everything, and there was Quasga,
and I think there was two or three others they
as well.
Speaker 4: Well, I'm going to jump in right here because we're
gonna have to take our top of the hour break.
But when we come back, we want to talk to you,
and of course, Bob, you get in and talk to
you about not only what you experienced. They have a
lot of follow up questions about the world that you've visited,
but also what's happened to you folks subsequent to this event.
Because a lot of time has passed and a lot
of events have passed in your life and we want
to talk about that in detail. So Mark and I
will be back with you. Just hang tight, Mark, take
it away.
Speaker 3: Sure thing, Brucell, Everybody, don't go away. We'll be right
back after these messages, so stay tuned.
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Speaker 9: Oh what a day, What a lovely nay.
Speaker 6: Make sure you tune in every Monday night at ten
pm Eastern right here on the Dark Matter Radio Network
for Bill and Nancy Burns with Future Theater.
Speaker 1: Live Live Live.
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Speaker 2: Check out Futuretheater dot.
Speaker 3: Com and welcome back everyone to Unknown Origins Radio here
on the Dark Matter Digital Network, home of Art Bells
Midnight in the Desert, which will be airing again tonight
at midnight Eastern time, nine pm Pacific, So don't miss out.
It's wonderful having art back on the air after all
this time. Now we're talking with our guests tonight, Betty
Andreas and Luca and Bob Luca. And you know, Betty,
your story, you know, from that original first story, is
incredibly fascinating, and that's the one I know I'm most
familiar with. I think most people who have heard your
story or read the books have have understood that. But
that's really only the tip of the iceberg, isn't it
both yourself?
Speaker 7: Yes, yeah, definitely yes.
Speaker 3: And you did touch on something in there that that
I've always suspected and which seems to be the case
with a lot of people in your predicament, which you know,
in the early days, when the sixties, between your case
and the Hills case, you know, people thought of alien
abduction as a one time event that happened to somebody,
And it's really come out over the last few years
and with all of the experiencers such as yourself that
we've had the opportunity and the pleasure to interview, is
that these things not only happen more than once, they
seemed to have a pattern of happening your entire life.
Speaker 5: So is that the case with you, Yes, it.
Speaker 7: Most definitely is The very first one was at seven
years old. I was living in Leminster, Massachusetts, and I
was outside in a little hot that my brother had built,
and I was eating some crackers waiting for my friend
Eady to come over and play dolls with me. A
ball of light came in. I thought it was a
bumblebee zipped around my head. It struck me in the
forehead and I could see then it was light, and
I down I went, and I heard the voice say,
the wee little one is coming along fine. So evidently
they had their eyes on me for a long period
of time, and they said that very soon I was
going to be happy about something. Well it was later
on my parents moved to Westminster, Massachusetts at an old
farm house, and at the age of twelve, I had
another experience happened. I was sort of a tomboy and
I was into a lot of things. The bond had
some traps in it, and I wanted to see if
the traps worked. I had been up in the woods
saw a large hole by the Mountain Laurel, and so
I thought, I'm going to try that trap there. The
next day, when I went up there, the trap was gone,
but a being came out of the hole, and as
it came up, it looked almost like one of those
gray bees nests, you know, Wrinkley bee's nests, and all
of a sudden it was outstanding before me, and I
was really frightened at that time, and I stepped back
and I took the stones that I had picked up
in my pocket and threw it at it. When it did,
the stones hit something and just fell to the ground.
And it was just things happening all the time. It seemed,
you know, we're seven years old. This was at twelve
years old. And at that point the being touched a
button on his chest and a light came out out
and struck me again in the middle of my forehead,
right like sort of between the eyes. And down I
went and I could hear some talking from the thing
that hit me in the head, and it said more
or less that I had another year to go. And
after that they I heard the being talking with the voice,
and the thing was I couldn't understand what was happening,
but it just was. At that time. After I woke
up from all of this, a year later, I was
once again taking aboard the craft. It was I was
thirteen years old at that time, and I was going
up in the backwoods to check the garden and the
blackberries that were growing near it, and all of a sudden,
my attention I was on the stairs my father had built,
going up the first hill, and my attention was drawn
to the right, and I looked up in the sky
and it was the moon out, and I thought, oh,
that's strange, what is it doing out at this time
of day? And it got brighter and came closer and
close to me, and that's when I was picked up again.
And at that particular time, there's a whole experience that
I went through, and that's when they implanted their small
baby like devices that they.
Speaker 5: Would come and take out many years later.
Speaker 3: Now, now you know, unfortunately we've had Bob sitting in
the background fairly silent this all time. And Bob, we
really like to get you in here and tell your
story as well. Now, I guess could you tell about
how you two met and how did you know that
you shared an extraordinary connection?
Speaker 1: Sure, the way we met was rather unusual, to say
the least. I met Betty in nineteen seventy seven, and
that trip actually started in nineteen forty four, in nineteen
forty four, was during World War Two. I was five
years old, and I was on a swing set that
my uncles had built for me. My mom and I
were living with my grandmother because my dad and all
my uncles were in the military. So I was out
on my swings, typical little kid enjoying the day. And
I noticed a bright light in the sky, and it
was different than the sun because it was a whitish
bright light as opposed to a slight yellowish tinge to
our sun. And even as a little kid, I knew
something was unusual here. Well, this thing came closer and
closer and closer, and it finally stopped slightly above and
to the left of my swing set, and I could
see clearly it was a saucer shaped device or craft,
and it had a glass dome on top, and it
was small. As it tipped to the side, I could
see there were two little what I called then little
people inside. They were basically the typical gray as they
would be described today. A very fine light came out
of this craft, and it was about the thickness of
a pencil that and it struck me in the forehead,
and I was paralyzed. I could not move on that
swing set, and I heard a voice and they What
they told me, basically was that they were preparing something
that would be good for mankind in the future. And
they said that people like myself in the future would
meet other people that had seen them. They made it
clear that they had been all apparently spoken to many
many people, and that in the future we would meet
and not be frightened. And I was told that I
was not to tell anyone of this experience. Well, that's
kind of a hard thing, you know, to swallow was
a little kid. But years later, when I underwent hypnosis,
I got a little conformation. For one thing, During the war,
everyone had a victory garden, and the victory garden was
to the left of my swing side. Well, there was
an area of that garden where nothing would grow anymore,
and there's still one of my cousins alive today that
remembers that. Also, at one point they called in a
woman psychic that did psychometry, and she was very good.
She'd worked with local police, she'd actually worked for the
government tracking Soviet submarines back before we had satellites. And
she took my knife and from that described exactly what
happened to me. But she also said there were pipes
and vines off to the left and all, and I
thought I didn't remember any pipes and vines. So some
time later I was talking to my mom and she said, oh, yeah,
your grandfather had put up a grape a pipe arbor,
and of course there were grapevines there. Now I didn't
even remember this, so that was some confirmation for me.
Now Here I am at this time five years old
having an experience, while Betty had one at seven years old,
and it's in the same year. Then in nineteen sixty seven,
I was a young man. I was on my way
to the beach a beautiful sunny day, and I came
to an area known as a trap rock, and as
I crossed over the railroad tracks, I noticed there were
five men working on this railroad track that went into
the trap rock where they took the crushed stone out
and so forth, But none of them were working. They
were all looking up in the air. So naturally I
look up to see what's going on, and I was amazed.
I saw these two huge cigar shaped craft, very bright
like polished chrome in the sunlight, and it was there
wasn't a cloud in the sky.
Speaker 10: It was a.
Speaker 1: Beautiful clear day. So I pulled my car over to
watch this. Obviously, these are not aircraft. There's no wings,
there's no tail section, there's no noise, there's no contrail.
So I'm watching and these things from where I was.
They were headed toward New Haven, Connecticut. As they went
along side by side, a small saucer shaped object dropped
out of the belly of each one. One went off
toward new Haven, one went in the opposite direction. Meanwhile,
I sat there in my car and I watched until
everything was just totally out of sight. I thought, wow,
that was amazing. I start my resumed my trip to
the beach, and I get down the road a few
miles and this is a very rural area at the time.
There were no house in that area, and one of
these small craft was coming back. It came back toward me,
and it came down with a float like a falling
leaf motion, stopped a few feet off the ground to
the left hand side of my vehicle, and I just
stared at the da you know, because I mean, it's
just so unusual all of a sudden. Now all this
is conscious memory, all of a sudden, there was a
blinding flash of red light and the only way I
can describe the red, it was like a ruby ray laser,
very very intense red. And the next thing I know,
I was inside this thing and there were typical grays there.
They had uniforms. They had a red skin tight uniform
and there was a lightning bolt emblem on the left
side of the chest. And now I'm starting to get
little frightened. I was asked to remove my clothing and
I was put on a I want to say plexiglass
or glass table. I really don't know the material, but
it looked like plexiglass. And they examined me. They took
samples of my skin, they took samples from my nails.
They manipulated my joints, like my ankle, and I moved
my head back and forth. The only movement I really
had of my own free will was pretty much my eyes.
And now at this point, I'm scared. I'm wanting to
get out of there, and they're telling me, you know,
don't be afraid, We're not gonna hurt you. They're very
very calming, and I'm thinking to myself, yeah, that's very nice,
But I want to get out of here, because this
table there were no visible restraints, and yet it felt
like I had just been super glued right to that table,
no visible restraints at all. They then they took a
sperm sample, and not in a very pleasurable manner. Then
I was scanned from head to foot by something that
came out of the ceiling, and it's I can only
describe it as possibly like a modern X ray, only
emitted a pinkish white light, almost like a sparkler, and
only a light pinkish white, And that went from one
end of me to the other, back and forth, back
and forth. And when they were done with me, I
was put back in my vehicle and continued my ride
to the beach. Now it was eleven o'clock at that time.
I should have been at the beach about eleven forty five,
but almost three hours had passed by the when I
got to the beach. And for years I never knew
you know what happened to that time? You know, we're
or was I what went on? And then in nineteen
seventy seven, a friend of mine asked if I wanted
to take a trip with him. He was going to
look for work in some different states, and I said, yeah,
I'd like to do that. Well, this is unusual for
me because I was a very hard working guy. I
worked long hours and I was very much into my job.
I was a single guy. I was a service manager
for a car dealership. I was making a good salary.
I had a new car every three months, and you
know this is something that you don't want to blow. Well,
I don't know why, but I felt compelled to take
this trip and it was going to require a month.
So I went through my boss and I told him
I needed a month off and he said no.
Speaker 2: I went home.
Speaker 1: I thought about it over the weekend. I went back
in a Monday, I talked to my boss. I said, well,
I said, there's three things we can do. I said,
you can give me the time off. I can quit,
or you can fire me, but I'm going. So it
ended up he actually did give me the time off.
But again, it's very unusual for me. So my friend
Eddie and I had taken a trip that we had
gone down through Texas, California, and Washington State.
Speaker 3: Bob, let me just stop you just for a second there,
and I'm gonna say, Betty, be careful I think you're
you're so close to the phone you're breathing into it.
So you're, yeah, you're kind of breathing over Bob a
little bit there, But Bob continue, maybe just temporarily. Could
you also switch phones because that other phone is a
lot clearer?
Speaker 1: Okay? Cool? On how's this?
Speaker 5: Oh yeah, much better? Much better?
Speaker 1: Okay. Good. So we were on our way back to
Connecticut across the northern tier of the country and at
a rest area. I don't know why, but we just
decided its further moment to go to Florida. Now, this
is several thousand miles out of our way from going
back to Connecticut. We got to Florida and my friend
had a sister in law there. We pulled our camp
trailer up onto her property, and the second night we
were there, during the evening meal, she mentioned that she
had worked with a woman that had had a uf
all experience. Boy, that set bells off in my head
as wow, maybe here's somebody maybe I could talk to,
because the only people I ever told were my parents
and my best friend, who was a police officer at
the time. And you know, back in the sixties, I
didn't want to end up in an asylum if I
started talking about that. So I went down to where
Betty was working, and she wouldn't talk to me because
Ray Fowler, the books author, had told her that reporters
would more than likely you all over her and not
to say anything. Well, a really hard time convincing her
that I was not a reporter. We finally made a
date for the following day to go out for have
lunch together, and I've been having that lunch with her
ever since that time.
Speaker 2: That's a long lunch.
Speaker 1: Well, you know, it was really a blessing for me,
because I really didn't like keeping that, you know, closed
up for all those years, not being able to talk
about it, or being really afraid to talk about it.
And I think it was a relief for her too,
because here we could talk about what we each experienced
without being worried about ridicque or anything like that. Of course,
today it's different. People are a lot more aware, and
of course today we're both older and don't really care
whether people believe it don't believe it, because we know
the truth, We know what happened. And as far as belief,
you know, people used to believe the world was flat,
but obviously that had no effect on the globe. So
we you know, we've come to terms with that, and
we basically helped each other out through some of the
rough times early on. But what I never expected was
when the book came out, the Andreas and Affair Book.
In fact, it was even a little before it came out,
the government seemed to have taken quite an interest in us.
The first thing we noticed the house we were living
in was overflown by these black military unmarked helicopter and
by unmarked, I mean no tail numbers, no id numbers,
and they were pretty much qeuh ones. And later on,
about a year or so later than the blackhawks were
noticed over the house quite frequently. They were the black
hawk was fairly new then, the army had just got
b purchasing them. Well, we were at that house in
Meriden for approximately a year and the flights got so
frequent that one of the neighbors, who was a town councilwoman,
started to document the times and the altitudes of the
flights because they go over they'd rattle the windows in
the house. I mean, you knew when they were there.
We moved to another town and figured, well, you know,
that's that. With the helicopters, well, they moved with us,
and they became more and more frequent because now the
book was out and we were doing a tour to
promote the book. And here's what happened. The helicopters continued.
We got an IRS audit every year for the first
three or four years in a row. Our telephone got tapped,
we were followed by vehicles and I'll explain how later.
But I got the license plate numbers and when they
were run through the police computers, they turned out to
be unissued. So we'll take it a step at a time. Here.
On the audits with the IRS, it got so bad
that the CPA that we had got into shouting matches
with the IRS agents because he said this is pure
and simple harassment. They asked for documents that were older
than seven years, which I did not have to produce,
and one of the auditors said, you know, I told him,
is I'm not giving you these I don't have to,
and he said, well, we can audit your ex wife
and get the information we need. Well, at the time,
my ex wife and I didn't get along too well,
so I told him as well, you want to get
busy then, don't you. So she got audited. But the
other things that they did, they asked they would not
accept my canceled checks as proof of payment for water
sewer taxes, mortgage, the payments saving statements I had from
the banks. I had to go to the town and
get signed statements. I had to go to the banks
and get signed statements from bank officials. So this is
pure and simple harassment. Then the helicopters. The law federal
aviation regulations require a helicopter to maintain a minimum of
five hundred feet laterally between buildings. These things had come
over our house and I have pictures of them on
our website. They had come over our house at altitudes
of seventy five feet or so. This is totally illegal.
And I knew what they could see because I was
flying myself then and I'd flown over our house. So
I had a good friend at worked that was in
the military, and he asked me if I wanted to
have a little fun with him. I said sure. Well,
he built me an exact, full size replica of a
surface to air missile and I said, oh, this should
be interesting. So sooner and later we hear the familiar
huey now Hue. He makes a very distinct rotor noise.
So we could hear it was approaching our house from
the north and it was low. So we went out
the back of the house, which is the south side,
and we set up dis missile on a cement pad
that we had out there, and I told Betty, I said, well,
let's see if they're really looking at us or not.
I knew what he would see. And sure enough, as
he cleared the roof of the house where he could
see into the backyard, that helicopter flipped sideways and he
did an evasive maneuver. And I told Betty, I said,
you know, I thought about this guy's headed back for
a shower and a change of Now I love it.
Oh yeah, it was obvious they were looking at us.
Speaker 5: Oh yes, Now, in that time, you know, the I. R.
Speaker 3: S Is auditing you, and of course the helicopters are harassing.
But did any any point during that time did they
ever come around and say, yeah, we could make this
all go away if you just shut up.
Speaker 1: No, but there were threats. I'll give you two examples.
We were doing a lecture out in Phoenix, Arizona, and
I had many slides of the helicopters, and I was
talking about them at the time. Then there was an
intermission and a fellow approached me who was obviously to
me military. I mean he had shortcut hair, his shirt
was buttoned straight down the buttons in line with his
belt buckle, shiny black shoes, sharply creased pants. I mean
this guy had government written all over him. And he
just came up to me quickly. He said, We're only
sending the helicopter, so we don't have to hurt you.
I said, okay, fine. On another occasion, we were at
MIT doing a lecture and doctor Heinek rushed over to
Betty during a break when she was alone. He rushed
over to her and he said, stick to philosophy, leave
the military. Oddius. Well, he was telling her for me,
because at the time, I was pushing the military heart.
I mean I was calling the Pentagon, I was calling
Wright Patterson. I was trying to follow up every possible lead,
and I was harassing him somewhat, filing a lot of
Freedom of Information Act request. But the thing is, they
put us through such hell that even today I'm having
a problem today with the FBI because the Department of Defense.
Two computers from the Department of Defense, one belonging to
the Navy Space Weapons Systems Division and the other one
belonging to the Army National Guard, both computers under the
control of the Department of Defense, hacked my personal computer. Now,
I worked as a computer technician before we moved to
where we are now, and so I caught them. As
a matter of fact, the software I had was so good.
I have the exact time and date, I have the
ID number of the computers involved, I have the owners
of the computers involved, and I have the physical street
address of the computers involved. I wrote to the Department
of Defense and said I wanted to know why they
were into my computer. And the Inspector General of the
Army wrote back and he verified that the computers did
in fact belong to the Navy and the Army, and
in writing told me an investigation would be done. Well
this day, no investigation has been done. So I contacted
the United States Attorney General's Office and they said that
basically that it's a federal crime and that comes under
the jurisdiction of the FBI to investigate. So I contacted
the FBI. I sent them certified mail. Six months went by,
I get no reply at all, so I send them
another certified mail and it was returned to me unopened.
They would not claim it because they know what it is.
I'm pushing them to. I want to know why they
were my computer in the first place. Hacking a computer
is a violation of federal law. Otherwise they would not
be investigating the sports teams that were hacking each other's computers. Secondly,
that the violation of my personal privacy rights. So the
FBI thinks that just because they returned my mail and
to drop it, Well, that's not going to be the case.
And there'll be more coming up on that in the
next several weeks or so. But I want to mention
something interesting as far as the technology. A lot of
people had witnessed these helicopters, people that had come to
visit us, and all but the most startling thing. We
were doing some private lectures and we were in Connecticut
at the house of a psychologist, and there were about
twenty people there. Betty had just finished talking about her
experiences and I was no more than a minute into
talking about the helicopters, and suddenly the windows on a
house started rattling. You can hear the noise. The people
look out and everybody saw a low flying black helicopter
slowly circling the house. Okay, so coincidence. A few weeks later,
we were doing a lecture for a dentist in New Britain, Connecticut.
Betty finished her talk, I started on the helicopters. Boom,
you can hear the rotor blades. Same thing. Helicopter comes up,
slowly circles of house. Okay, that's a heck of a coincidence.
Except a few weeks later, when we were lecturing for
a contractor in Merriton, Connecticut, the exact same thing happened.
Speaker 3: So were these lectures taking place in your home or
were they taking place on the site.
Speaker 1: No, they were in the homes of these people, the psychologists,
the dentist, and the contractor, which were in different cities.
Speaker 3: So obviously they were able to tap in with listening
devices to know at which point you were getting ready
to talk, and then they would come in and harass you.
Speaker 1: They knew where we were at all times. We would
vacation in New Hampshire, they were in New Hampshire. We'd
vacation in Florida. They were in Florida in New Hampshire.
There was one incident that was kind of humorous. We
decided to tent one time instead of taking a trailer,
and we had a large one hundred pounds plus shepherd,
so we put up our tent in the Oxbow campground
in Hillsborough, New Hampshire. It was beautiful little place, and
I drove a stake in the ground and chained the
dog right in front of the tent door. Well, we
were there a few minutes and in comes our shadow
in an suv. The guy gets out. It's just about
getting dark, and he starts trying to put up a tent. Well,
obviously he'd never done it before. Because he couldn't do it.
He ends up swearing up a blue streak. I mean
we could hear him clearly because he was only about
twenty five thirty feet from us and sleeps in the
suv overnight keeping an eye on us. Apparently, so they
there were some humorous things like that. But another thing
that happened that I haven't questioned the FBI on Betty
and I when we're living in Connecticut. Neither one of
us is crazy about cold weather, so about three o'clock
in the morning, we went out. We went over to
my friend's house, who was kind enough to let me
park my travel trailer there. We hooked up the trailer
and off we went to port them. Well, we were
there for a few weeks. We got back and the
guys at work are telling me, Hey, Bobby said, you
know the FBI was here looking for you. I said,
are you sure? Oh yeah, they had photo ID. So
Betty and I go to the federal building in New
Haven and we walk in off the street. So the
agent does not know us, or he shouldn't have known us,
and we ask why they're at my job and why
they're looking for me, and they gave us a standard. Well,
we can neither confirm nor deny that agents were there,
although there are signed statements from people I work with
that are in a magazine article that Connecticut Magazine did
where the guys actually talked to the FBI agents and
they didn't know where we were. But the other interesting
thing while we're there, I said, well, you know, while
we're here, why you guys tap on our telephone? And
he said, well, he said, in this case, he says,
it's not us, it's air Force Intelligence. Okay, several months
later I get a chance to talk to Air Force
Intelligence and it's oh, no, we need a court order.
It's the FBI, it's not us. So this is the
kind of run around you get anytime you deal with
the government. The other thing they did to instill fear.
We were on our way to Florida and pulled off
in ninety five, went into a campground because I was tired,
and we figured, well, we'll stay there for the night.
Nobody knows we are there. The campground manager comes down
after we're there about forty minutes and says, Betty asked
for Betty, and he said, she said, your son called.
Now nobody knew where we were, including Betty's sons. Another occasion,
we had to fly to Chicago for a show and
we're in Harford, Connecticut. I go up to the desk
and the guy says, oh, mister Lucas already boarded the plane.
So I thought it was somebody with the same name.
I said, no, no, I'm mister Luca from Spring Street
in Cheshire, Connecticut. He says yeah, he says he's already
boarded the plane. So this is their way of letting
you know, you know, we know where you are at
all times, and it was supposed to I guess it
was supposed to strike us with fear, but it didn't work.
Another interesting thing, I've taken hundreds of pictures of these helicopters.
I sent two to Kodak in Boston and I had
him blown up to twenty by forty posters. I got
them back six weeks later in a mailing tube marked Washington,
d C. So somebody wanted to see what I photographed.
Apparently the other thing that I didn't mention While trying
to track down these helicopters, I contacted all the military.
I contacted the FBI, the CIA, the Federal Aviation Administration,
and the Federal Aviation Administration was real funny. I sent
them the pictures and all close up, so good shots,
clear shots of these helicopters, and I said, you know,
I want to know who wounds these. I gave them
the time of the flight, the date, the compass heading,
the altitude, no end numbers on them, right right. So
they wrote me back and said, well, we can't identify
them because there's no ID numbers. Well, duh, that's why
I wrote to them in first place.
Speaker 4: Yeah, like they didn't have a trans wonder on them
or anything else.
Speaker 1: Oh. Absolutely, I don't think those guys ever filed a
flight plan. And I was told I ended up talking
to a pilot that actually flew one of these helicopters,
and he said, because of the coating on them, their
coating is infrared and radar absorbing. And he said that
if they could fly right over an airport and if
the transplander's not on, the airport wouldn't know they were there.
So I thought that was kind of interesting. Now, the
worst thing that they ever did to us when we
lived in Cheshire, Connecticut, they broke well, they broke into
two of our homes. But when we were in Cheshire,
We're in bed. It's two o'clock or so, maybe later
in the morning, and I woke up to hear two
men talking. And at first, you know, I thought, did
I just wait out of a dream or something, But no,
I'm wide awake, and I look at the bottom of
the bed. We had that large German shepherd dog. He
got up and all his front legs spread out and
he went face down on the floor. So I thought, oh,
this isn't good. Something's wrong. So I reached in my
nightstand for where I kept the thirty eight, and I
was going to confront whoever it was. Well, the next
thing I know, it's morning and I got one wicked headache.
And Betty woke up and she said that she had
a terrible headache as well. So we got dressed, went
to work. Both feelings sounds like all of you. Well,
here's what happened. We came home and she said that
her right arm or her left arm was hurting her
all day. She's right handed, and I said, that's funny.
My right arm's been paining me all day. I'm left handed.
So we rolled up our sleeves and whatnot, and there
was about an inch to an inch and a quarter
black and blue mark. We're pretty much like where you'd
get a vaccination and with a puncture mark in the
middle on both of us.
Speaker 5: Yeah, or take blood.
Speaker 1: Well, you know, I think they might have put us
out with a gas type sleep agent through the window,
and then when they got in the house, they might
have injected us to keep us out longer, or like
you say, maybe taken. But I you know, I don't
know what happened, but I did ask our family doctor.
I said, what about if we go to the hospital
and have blood taken. He says, not too late, He's nothing,
nothing would show up. So that was about the worst
thing that they did.
Speaker 3: It's how well they knocked you out with gas and
of course which would get the dog too long enough
to those samples, and then of course you probably just
stayed asleep, Yeah, because the would knock you out further
because of unless you if you noticed any markings on
the dog.
Speaker 1: No, I never actually, we never thought to look. But
the kind of person I am in is somebody breaks
in my house in the middle of the night, I
would have plugged them. I mean, you know, I'm gonna
be real honest. I don't think people have any right
to do that. And if it was a government agent
or a crook or I wouldn't know the difference. So,
you know, they put their own people at risk in
that case. But they must have been darn sure that
we'd be out before they came in. Another house. We
had another place we lived in Connecticut. We were on
our way to do a lecture and we came back.
We were in a camp trailer when one hundred and
forty four acre campground was beautiful place. I come back
and we had a brand new thirty foot travel trailer
and it was all wrapped up with rope where the
door is. And what happened was somebody broke in while
we're going and my neighbor was kind enough to you know,
wrap rope around the things several times and tie it
off so the door couldn't be opened. The only thing
that was stolen were drawings Betty had done of the interior,
the propulsion system of the craft. Now there were firearms,
computer parts, jewelry, nothing was touched. Only those two documents
were missing. Well, this was a rural area, so I
had to call the state police to get a report
filled out so I could make an insurance claim. So
the state trooper came up and I told him what
we were involved with. I told him I suspected it
was government, and he was a pretty nice fellow he,
you know, he said, look, he said, if I find
something out, he says, I will let you know. So
I thought, well, that's nice. About a week later, I
go down to the office and there's a different trooper
there and I asked him where the trooper was that
I had talked to, and he said, he's been transferred.
I well, where is he transferred to? I don't know,
So that would have not struck me as hard as
it did if the same thing didn't happen with the FAA.
We had one individual who told me that what was
going on with the black helicopters sounded like a CIA operation.
He was so interested. I had talked to him at
the Federal Aviation General Aviation District Office in Boston because
they were the controlling agency for our area. This man
drove all away from Boston down to Connecticut to our
house to visit us on a Saturday, and he left
a note on my door. Unfortunately, Betty and I were
not home that weekend, so by Tuesday we were back.
I called the FAA office, I asked for the man
by name, and I was told he was transferred. So
this is no coincidence. These people do not want to
talk to us. I have a recording whenever I called
the Pentagon or any of the other right Patterson or
any of those places. I recorded the conversations, and I
have the calls that I made to the Pentagon where
he finally told me, nobody here is going to talk
to you, and that's the way it is today the FBI.
I think they're afraid to look into the Department of
Defense hacking my computer. It's a crime, it's totally illegal.
Otherwise they wouldn't be investigating the sports team's hacking. And
yet they won't even give me the satisfaction saying, well,
we can't look into it because of this, or maybe
the statute of limitations is run out. They won't even
talk to me. But what's going to happen, one way
or another, by hook or by crook or whatever. We're
going to get a face to face sit down with him,
and we're going to get to the bottom of it,
one way or another. I don't know how long it'll
take because they are not being cooperative at all, but
they owe me at least that much. And I haven't
pardon it.
Speaker 4: No, I don't mean to interrupt your guhads.
Speaker 1: No, that's right. I was just going to say that
after what they put us through and the age we're
now and the attitude we've gotten now, I want some answers,
and I think they owe us all right.
Speaker 4: I would like to follow up with you on a
couple issues here real quick. First of all, and Mark knowsis.
We're not going to go into my background, but I
mark this sounds strikingly familiar in many areas to the
situation I went through with the threats that I oh, yeah, well,
I went public on a very well documented case out
in close, New Mexico or Cannon Air Force Base about
twenty years later and got the threatening phone calls the
next night on a private cell phone. But having said that,
and having spent my career in the Coastguard Reserve in
public affairs and understanding and also being a pilot and
doing aviation documentaries all over the world, I have a
couple suggestions or I'd like to run some ideas by you.
First of all, I think the only way you're going
to out these people or get any response. I noticed
that you you did contact your state senator. Did nothing
came of that at this point. I'm sure he get
got stonewall too.
Speaker 7: Is that okay?
Speaker 1: Yeah, they gave him the same run around that I got.
Speaker 4: Well, they'll hide behind homeland security, national defense, or just
not even respond, which is the normal way to do it.
You know what if these Hueys are budget buzz buzzing
your house all the time for a long time. Here's
here's what I would suggest. Go out and get yourself
one of those twenty nine dollars twelve million candlepower rechargeable floodlights,
and the next time one of those jackasses come over
your house, pop it on and hit the pilot right
in the face with it. That's actually not illegal. It's
illegal to fly shine a laser at them, but that's
not illegal, and give him a face full of that
blinding light and hopefully the co pilot's got his hand
on the cyclic and a collective too.
Speaker 1: And we haven't had that problem in this house since
we moved to Virginia.
Speaker 2: Good.
Speaker 1: The helicopters have not bothered us here. So for whatever reason,
we moved here from Florida. And really there's only two
three times in the past few years we've seen helicopters
over here, So there, I think they've given up on
that aspect because it just wasn't working anymore.
Speaker 4: Now, have you been tailed recently? I mean your shadow
whoever following you. Has that happened recently?
Speaker 1: Not that I've noticed. Because See, when I was younger,
I used to build race cars and there was no
race tracks where I lived, so I used to do
all my racing on the street. So several times in
the past when we're being followed, I actually got behind
the cars that were following us and I got the
license plate numbers and I gave them to police Lieutenant
Larry Fawcett, and when he ran them, he's the one
that found out. You know, they came back as unissued plates, right,
So that's typically I think that's another reason they gave
up on that particular tactic as well.
Speaker 4: Well, you know here, here's one way to deal with that.
You just turn it right back on it. If you
if you're following, just turn on the camera on your cellphone,
walk right up to him, say what's your name? You know,
what are you doing here? I'm taping this. I want
you to be and just right in their face. They're
going to have to respond. Usually they turntail and run,
but now you've got it on video and the best
way to you know, to prevent yourself becoming a And
obviously if they were going to harm you or you know,
have a Karen Silkwood incident, that would have happened a
long time ago. I think the broader question that I've
had to ask myself with My situation is, you know,
I think it's a much different case because of the
history of yours than mine, just being able to document
a sighting. But so I'm not comparing the two. But
the question would be, all right, what exactly is so
important to them or so concerning to them that they're
trying to dissuade you from speaking about it all these
years later. And that's not a rhetorical question. I'm sure
you've asked yourself the same question many times.
Speaker 1: Oh sure, there's one thing that has stuck out in
my head. Now, all you're a pilot, right, yes, Okay,
when I was flying, I went to the I was
flying out of this small airport in Connecticut, and I
went to the airport and they had a brand new
I flew the Piper Tomahawk, the Warrior and.
Speaker 4: The other detail.
Speaker 1: Okay, right, I got into the Tomahawk was a fairly
new airplane. It only had about three or four hours
on it when I first started flying it. But anyway,
I went one day and I was doing my pre
flight and I pulled pulled the yoke back, and it
was allowed like a twang. Noise came out of the
fuselage and the elevator control was gone. Now miss, had
I been in the air yeah, you know, that would
not be a good situation. Well, I don't know, could
it could Could it have been coincidence, you know, could
have been just something mechanical in the airplane that wasn't
right to start with.
Speaker 7: Uh.
Speaker 1: To this day, I don't know, but I've often wondered
about that. It would have been at that time a
student pilot accident.
Speaker 4: Absolutely, and there are so many ways for that to happen,
you know, if you go back in many areas that
we've documented over the years, Uh, there's the statistical probability
that people involved in specific instances or investigations of having
a brain aneurysm or a heart attack or some unbelievably
rare cancer. Uh. Or you know, doctor Mackett hit by
a car stepping off a curb and you know these
type of things, or Vince Foster shooting himself with a
gun and the gun ends up, you know, twenty feet
away from you go go on and on. I think
I think that it is my impression at these levels
of this, this lack of authority, all bets are off
anybody's expendable. There is no sense of law or fair play.
You can't get the system to work in your favor. Clearly,
if you've got the IP address, the idea of the computer,
and you've got it corroborated, then the state attorney general,
at least in your state and the state of Connecticut
should pursue this.
Speaker 2: This is a.
Speaker 4: Legal matter that should be adjudicated in the courts at
the very least. And then to drop it, I mean,
it's it's beyond it's beyond frustrating. It's frightening to see
how out of control this has got. Well, and it's
scary too. People break it into your house. They you know,
it's an intimidation factor. You never know when the other
shoe's going to drop, and it could be lights out
for you or your wife because they're letting you know that.
I mean, when I had a guy on the phone
telling I mean, bullets are cheap, I said, are you
watching B movies? Are you kidding me? I mean, what
kind of silly nonsense is that? But they you know
what if, like you say, if you drive off the
road and a tie rod breaks and you end up dead,
dead is dead. It works, and bullets are cheap. So
I'm very intrigued by you know this on what is
the last incident or how recently have you had any
kind of harassment or any knowledge of it. Maybe that's
why your phones are so lousy tonight because they're being
tapped and the levels are down. So you know, high boys,
if they are listening, thanks for listening.
Speaker 1: In Fellas, that is quite possible. We have had some
strange occurrences at this house, but I don't I don't
know if I can connect them to the government or not.
There's just been some very strange things that have gone
on in the house. I have a motion sensor alarm
and abasement. Well, there's nobody down there, any alarm goes off.
I mean, I can't tell you a number of times
in the middle of the night I've run downstairs pistol
in hand, thinking I'm going to find somebody in the
basement and there's not a soul there nothing. Is it
something wrong with the alarm? I don't know. We've had
instances here where a flash of light to come down
the hallway in the house and light should not have
set off our smoke alarm, but it did.
Speaker 2: A lot of.
Speaker 3: Other people who have these types of experiences also seem
to experience what we would look at as like paranormal
type phenomenal.
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, yeah, absolutely on one occasion. The as you know,
Betty was also examined by a psychiatrist before the book
was published, and that psychiatrist had come back to visit
us a couple of years later and just to recheck Betty.
He arrived at our home about nine thirty, ten o'clock
at night and he was going to talk to her
for about an hour. Well, we'll make a long story. Sure,
he stayed till about five thirty in the morning, and
while he was there, there was a huge crash in
the kitchen and we went out and looked. There was
only the three of us in the house. We went
out and looked, nothing at all was moved, nothing was disturbed,
and fortunately the psychiatrists heard it for himself. Five p
thirty or so, he's leaving, getting ready to go back
to his hotel, and outside it's just, you know, barely light.
You could see over our house there was this huge
cigar shaped craft that extended a cloud I'm sorry, extended
well beyond our house is probably it looked like it
could have been a quarter mile long or so, and
unlike the other clouds, this was not moving with the
air currents. It was stationary right over the house and
on the very edge it was kind of a like
a thick cloud in the center, but the very edges
thinned out and you could see a little bit of
starlight in some part. Well, he finally turned around. He
looked at me and he said, did you see that?
I said, yeah, but I wasn't gonna mention it until
after you saw it first. I didn't want to give
him the wrong idea. Oh he's yeah. He's got several
degrees of medical doctor's a psychiatrist, he's got a degree
in aeronautical engineering. So I mean the man was highly
qualified for sure.
Speaker 4: Well, well, Mark has one more question, but we've got
to have you back because this is a fascinating story.
Speaker 3: Go ahead, Mark, I'm Bob and Betty. We just have
a few minutes left in the show. But I'm really curious.
I know you're still having the issues with the government
and the harassment, but what about the other experiences. Are
they continuing or.
Speaker 5: Have they stopped?
Speaker 7: Yes, I have had another experience with it, one that
was like a nineteen forty nineteen ninety four ninety five.
Around that time, but later years I went under regressive
hypnosis and what had happened. I was given a time
of waiting and rest.
Speaker 4: Did you switch falls again?
Speaker 7: Have cats? And now I know what took place?
Speaker 6: Well?
Speaker 5: And Bob, what about yourself?
Speaker 1: Not too much outside of the paranormal things that I mentioned,
he I have been left with something from them, which
I usually don't talk about. But I can see things
at times that are not there. I know this is
going to sound a little weird. It could be people,
it could be machines, it could be craft. And I
went to have my eyes thoroughly examined. I went to
my doctor, I went to the hospital. I had brain
scans done, I had brain my brain X ray and
all that, and they found nothing wrong. To my doctor's amazement,
he said, I was normal. But from time to time
I see these things, and I see them just as clearly,
you know, as I could see you if you were
standing three feet in front of me. I don't know
why this is, but it's something that I've been left with. Also,
I like to bring up before I get my mother
remember seeing a craft and seeing the inside of it.
But she was so frightened she'd never undergo regressive hypnosis.
I believe Betty's mother also had had experiences. It seems
like this runs in a family line.
Speaker 7: My daughter as well has had a lot of experiences.
Speaker 3: Yes, I've heard that a lot from other abductees that
we have talked with. It does seem to run in
families as well as lifetimes. Now we only have a
couple of minutes left yet, are you still doing lecturing?
Speaker 7: Yes, but right now we have been writing a book
about what has happened for the nineteen ninety four experience,
and it's more personal. We're letting people know exactly all
the different things that have happened to us, the paranormal
things that have in our family and everything that have
been going on, and especially this new experience I had
with the one. A lot of people keep on asking, well,
who is the one? Well, now I understand who it
is because I'll see experience I've gone through that would
be in a new book. We are lifting the veil.
Speaker 3: Lifting the veil, okay, now, the origin book the Andreas
and Affair. I think it's been released a couple of
different times over the years. It's certainly still available. Where
can people get a hold of the books on your cases.
Speaker 1: Yeah, the easiest way, in the best way really is
Amazon dot com.
Speaker 3: Okay, get an Amazon I know I picked up the
kindle version and I was reading that.
Speaker 5: Do you have books on your website as well? And
tell the folks, oh, yes, what your website is.
Speaker 1: I'm sorry I didn't hear you.
Speaker 2: I sai.
Speaker 3: Could you tell people where they can go to your
website and find more.
Speaker 1: Information Andreasaffair dot com And they will find pictures that
Betty has drawn of her actual experiences as they happen.
They will find drawings of the craft. They will find
the actual government documents where I caught them in our computer,
and the letters from the state Senator and the Army
Inspector General. All that is on the side.
Speaker 7: And also Raymond Fouler had done five books because there's
many different experiences within there, and I believe he still
has books for Sammy.
Speaker 3: Well, thank you very much, Bob and Betty for coming
on the show tonight. We really appreciate it, and we'll
definitely have to have you come back.
Speaker 1: Thank you so much for having us. We appreciate it.
Speaker 4: Well, we're going to have you back. There's a lot
more to talk about and a lot more detail to
go into it and explore many years of experiences. Thanks,
thank you.
Speaker 3: Folks, and thank you everyone for listening to Undow Origins Radio.
Tune in next Thursday at eight pm Eastern Standard time.
Speaker 5: Catch you all next week. Have a good one people,
Thanks guys.
Speaker 1: Be safe okay, thank you, Bye, buying out.
Speaker 4: Hi,