WEBVTT 1 00:00:00.320 --> 00:00:05.400 Ask not what your country can do for you, ask 2 00:00:05.519 --> 00:00:07.360 what you can do for your country. 3 00:00:07.639 --> 00:00:11.400 Mister Garbaschoff, tear down this wall. 4 00:00:12.400 --> 00:00:14.800 It's the Ricchet Podcast with Stephen Hayward and I'm James 5 00:00:14.880 --> 00:00:17.399 Lilas and today we go to the Conservative Crossroads and 6 00:00:17.519 --> 00:00:21.079 dot to Rob Johnson, no Henry Olson. So let's have 7 00:00:21.120 --> 00:00:22.079 ourselves a podcast. 8 00:00:22.280 --> 00:00:25.239 And you took ten thousand dollars. That's a lot, and 9 00:00:25.359 --> 00:00:26.120 help them do it. 10 00:00:26.640 --> 00:00:26.879 You know. 11 00:00:26.960 --> 00:00:29.039 The other thing is, whistle blowers came to you as 12 00:00:29.079 --> 00:00:30.399 early as twenty nineteen. 13 00:00:30.519 --> 00:00:33.520 Let's look as early as twenty nineteen. 14 00:00:33.600 --> 00:00:36.880 Whistle blow don't talk over me early talking about in nineteen. 15 00:00:37.079 --> 00:00:41.880 It's my hearing pal. As early as nineteen, don't come. 16 00:00:41.960 --> 00:00:43.759 Whistle blowers came to well, I should call you a 17 00:00:43.799 --> 00:00:45.039 prisoner because you ought to be in jail. 18 00:00:45.560 --> 00:00:46.240 Welcome everybody. 19 00:00:46.240 --> 00:00:49.359 It's the Ricochet Podcast, number seven hundred and seventy six. 20 00:00:49.799 --> 00:00:51.000 Well that sounds patriotic. 21 00:00:51.280 --> 00:00:53.399 I'm James Lynx here in Minneapolis and I'm joined by 22 00:00:53.399 --> 00:00:56.200 Stephen Hayward and I presume California. 23 00:00:56.280 --> 00:00:59.240 Yes, and this is the Ricochet Podcast. 24 00:00:59.240 --> 00:01:00.719 You can join us at by the. 25 00:01:00.679 --> 00:01:02.640 Way and be part of the most stimulating conversations and 26 00:01:02.679 --> 00:01:03.640 community on the web. 27 00:01:03.679 --> 00:01:04.519 Why don't you go there? 28 00:01:04.879 --> 00:01:07.959 Well, not now, I mean you're you're you're leaning forward, 29 00:01:08.000 --> 00:01:11.359 elbows on the table, wrapped, waiting to see where this 30 00:01:11.400 --> 00:01:12.040 is all going to go. 31 00:01:12.280 --> 00:01:14.719 But you know, when we're done, amble over and see 32 00:01:14.719 --> 00:01:17.599 what all the fuss is about. Stephen? How are you today? 33 00:01:17.879 --> 00:01:19.799 How have things been? It's been two weeks. 34 00:01:19.879 --> 00:01:23.319 Last week I was I was flat with a with 35 00:01:23.400 --> 00:01:25.840 a stomach bug, not the stomach flu. There's no such 36 00:01:25.920 --> 00:01:29.879 thing as stomach flu. I don't think, I mean, you 37 00:01:29.920 --> 00:01:34.519 can't have influenza of the you know, the g I part. 38 00:01:34.760 --> 00:01:37.680 It was some bug, some neuro some campy, back to 39 00:01:38.000 --> 00:01:38.719 some something. 40 00:01:39.959 --> 00:01:40.159 Right. 41 00:01:41.159 --> 00:01:41.680 I'm fine. 42 00:01:41.920 --> 00:01:44.640 I'm still getting over a respiratory bug I caught a 43 00:01:44.640 --> 00:01:46.840 week ago. But I'm back up and fighting form and 44 00:01:47.000 --> 00:01:48.040 very happy about the news. 45 00:01:48.040 --> 00:01:50.519 This week just been. You know, I'm not tired of winning. 46 00:01:50.560 --> 00:01:51.560 I'll just put it that way. 47 00:01:52.239 --> 00:01:54.359 Well, let's go down those lists of winds as you 48 00:01:54.400 --> 00:01:57.560 see them. I'm sure some people regard them as mortal 49 00:01:58.280 --> 00:02:02.400 blows against the American experts. But with your sunny optimism, 50 00:02:02.560 --> 00:02:06.359 in your particular prism, what are the things that you 51 00:02:06.640 --> 00:02:08.080 what winnings do you like today. 52 00:02:08.759 --> 00:02:10.639 Well, I think the biggest story of the week, and 53 00:02:10.680 --> 00:02:13.080 I think you can't overstate how big it is is 54 00:02:13.120 --> 00:02:16.759 the Trump administration rolling back what's been known as the 55 00:02:17.000 --> 00:02:20.280 endangerment finding of the Opening. 56 00:02:20.759 --> 00:02:21.639 That would be the one. 57 00:02:21.759 --> 00:02:25.599 Yes, yeah, that's the most consequential thing that I've got 58 00:02:25.759 --> 00:02:26.199 to explain. 59 00:02:26.639 --> 00:02:28.800 Well, I mean, look, I used to be when I 60 00:02:28.840 --> 00:02:29.639 lived in Washington. 61 00:02:29.719 --> 00:02:32.000 I marinated in all the fine points of the climate 62 00:02:32.000 --> 00:02:34.479 policy and energy debate. And it's so and I want 63 00:02:34.520 --> 00:02:36.680 to avoid the technical details because it gets thick and 64 00:02:36.719 --> 00:02:39.319 boring in a hurry. But what's important is is that 65 00:02:39.360 --> 00:02:42.360 this was step one, now almost twenty years ago, essentially 66 00:02:43.000 --> 00:02:45.520 for the federal government to take over the entire energy 67 00:02:45.520 --> 00:02:48.439 system of the United States, and that meant nationalizing all 68 00:02:48.439 --> 00:02:51.319 the electric utilities. They never said that's what they were doing, 69 00:02:51.360 --> 00:02:53.000 but that, in effect is what was happening. 70 00:02:53.719 --> 00:02:55.400 And you know, I actually used to read through. 71 00:02:55.240 --> 00:02:57.800 These fifteen hundred page draft plans of the EPA and 72 00:02:57.840 --> 00:03:01.800 because I have a high threshold of pain, Well, so 73 00:03:01.840 --> 00:03:04.280 if the Trump administration has done is not merely a 74 00:03:04.319 --> 00:03:07.599 simple bureaucratic step. But to make a long story short, 75 00:03:07.639 --> 00:03:10.919 they've done patient work quietly over the last several years 76 00:03:10.960 --> 00:03:14.000 Will Biden was president to lay the groundwork to not 77 00:03:14.120 --> 00:03:18.319 only roll back the cornerstone of their power grab overpower 78 00:03:18.879 --> 00:03:21.319 good by that included our client standards, other things you 79 00:03:21.319 --> 00:03:24.719 and I have covetched about forever, but to make it 80 00:03:24.800 --> 00:03:27.520 stick legally. And that's very important, and that gets the 81 00:03:27.520 --> 00:03:30.919 way the bureaucratic wheels grind, and I think they are 82 00:03:30.919 --> 00:03:32.680 going to be able to make it stick. But to me, 83 00:03:32.840 --> 00:03:34.800 the most delicious part of all this is watching the 84 00:03:34.800 --> 00:03:39.840 press coverage. So the ABC Evening News said Trump rolls 85 00:03:39.919 --> 00:03:43.159 back the power of the United States to control the climate. 86 00:03:43.879 --> 00:03:45.199 That's what he said, Like, you know, we have a 87 00:03:45.240 --> 00:03:46.280 knob in the ebs. 88 00:03:46.400 --> 00:03:48.479 You do just control the climate by turning a knob, 89 00:03:48.520 --> 00:03:50.719 I mean, And you know, the New York Times is 90 00:03:50.759 --> 00:03:51.280 having a fit. 91 00:03:51.840 --> 00:03:53.319 I love their headline. 92 00:03:53.360 --> 00:03:57.159 Here is Trump allies near total victory in wiping out 93 00:03:57.280 --> 00:04:00.479 US climate regulation. And I thought, gosh, the Times that's 94 00:04:00.520 --> 00:04:03.919 like it's a bad thing, right, And the Time says 95 00:04:03.960 --> 00:04:05.680 that looks like they're going to be able to make 96 00:04:05.680 --> 00:04:08.520 the stick. Unlike other things Trump is doing, that may 97 00:04:08.520 --> 00:04:10.680 be reversed on day one by a democratic president. 98 00:04:11.120 --> 00:04:13.240 Now I'm just a little old Country hic moron up 99 00:04:13.240 --> 00:04:15.960 here in the fly flyover states. But to me, this 100 00:04:16.079 --> 00:04:21.040 is like reading a headline that says the Administration relaxes 101 00:04:21.120 --> 00:04:26.120 ban on flogistin there is a I mean, let's go 102 00:04:26.160 --> 00:04:27.439 back to two thousand and nine here, if I can 103 00:04:27.480 --> 00:04:29.279 read my notes. At two thousand and nine, which is 104 00:04:29.319 --> 00:04:33.480 when they began, the EPA found that carbon dioxide, which 105 00:04:33.600 --> 00:04:37.480 I hope I never have anything to do with, methane, 106 00:04:37.839 --> 00:04:40.399 and nitrous oxide, which of course that stuff you get 107 00:04:40.399 --> 00:04:42.319 at the dentist. It makes you feel better now, and 108 00:04:42.439 --> 00:04:45.560 three other greenhouse gases quote endangered the public health and 109 00:04:45.600 --> 00:04:48.560 welfare of current and future generations. So one of the 110 00:04:48.560 --> 00:04:52.000 Clean Air Act this was said, and then SCOTUS ruled 111 00:04:52.279 --> 00:04:55.519 a little while later that the agency could set the determinations. So, 112 00:04:55.560 --> 00:04:58.959 in other words, it's huge, huge power was lent to 113 00:04:59.000 --> 00:05:01.879 these people predicated on the science that all of these 114 00:05:01.879 --> 00:05:04.519 greenhose gases are going to cause changes in the climate 115 00:05:04.560 --> 00:05:06.560 that will be catastrophic, that will be expensive, that will 116 00:05:06.600 --> 00:05:08.920 kill people, that make the seas rise, all the rest 117 00:05:08.920 --> 00:05:13.879 of it, And that has been gospel ever since. Right, 118 00:05:14.720 --> 00:05:17.560 we are living in an era, as we've talked before, 119 00:05:17.680 --> 00:05:22.360 of the authoritative, settled science, all the things that people know, 120 00:05:22.439 --> 00:05:24.879 all the institutions that people trusted, all of the experts 121 00:05:24.879 --> 00:05:27.439 and the rest of it. All that credibility is being dismantled. 122 00:05:27.439 --> 00:05:29.800 And this is one piece of that. Now you're right 123 00:05:29.839 --> 00:05:32.560 about the hysteria. I mean, the Barack Obama be tweeted 124 00:05:32.600 --> 00:05:38.480 out that said that the endangement finding served as the 125 00:05:38.519 --> 00:05:42.040 basis for limits on tailpipe emissions. And I found that 126 00:05:42.079 --> 00:05:43.720 to be an interesting way to put it, because it's 127 00:05:43.759 --> 00:05:46.600 most of it's supposed to make people think, you know, 128 00:05:46.639 --> 00:05:51.560 of those huge, choking, horrible, stinky, dark clouds that come 129 00:05:51.600 --> 00:05:54.519 from the back of every car. Tail pipe emissions I'm 130 00:05:54.519 --> 00:05:57.279 guessing at this point are significantly cleaner than they used 131 00:05:57.279 --> 00:05:59.519 to be, in part because they have to be. But 132 00:05:59.600 --> 00:06:02.079 she remember back in the days of leaded gasoline when 133 00:06:02.079 --> 00:06:04.160 I was a child, I mean you would actually see 134 00:06:04.759 --> 00:06:07.160 you would see these anti pollution ads are the ones 135 00:06:07.199 --> 00:06:09.079 that had the fake Indian with the tear rolling down 136 00:06:09.120 --> 00:06:11.839 his cheek, and you would see fleets of cars and 137 00:06:11.879 --> 00:06:16.399 this massive dark smoke billowing from underneath them. 138 00:06:16.560 --> 00:06:18.000 I can still smell this stuff. 139 00:06:18.600 --> 00:06:21.040 Well, that isn't the case anymore so, finding saying that 140 00:06:21.240 --> 00:06:25.360 tailpipe emissions might not be the thing exactly that gets 141 00:06:25.360 --> 00:06:28.240 people all head up. And he also talked about power 142 00:06:28.279 --> 00:06:29.759 planned rules are going to be relaxed. 143 00:06:30.319 --> 00:06:36.240 Well, maybe we need more power plants, and maybe we 144 00:06:36.319 --> 00:06:38.720 need more nuclear plants, but he says it's just to 145 00:06:39.800 --> 00:06:41.879 the only reason is so the fossil fuel industry can 146 00:06:41.920 --> 00:06:42.560 make more money. 147 00:06:43.199 --> 00:06:45.800 Yeah, you know this recent cold snap we went through 148 00:06:45.839 --> 00:06:50.199 a couple of weeks ago, coal and oil save the day. 149 00:06:50.240 --> 00:06:52.199 You know, we actually don't generate any serious amount of 150 00:06:52.199 --> 00:06:54.399 electricity with oil anymore. It used to be fifty years 151 00:06:54.399 --> 00:06:57.000 ago twenty percent, but then oil got expensive, as we know, 152 00:06:57.040 --> 00:06:59.720 and we shifted to coal and natural gas. But in 153 00:06:59.720 --> 00:07:02.240 the North the East, where they have been blocking natural 154 00:07:02.279 --> 00:07:04.199 gas pipelines, they had to fire up a lot of 155 00:07:04.279 --> 00:07:07.040 oil and diesel power generators to keep the lights on 156 00:07:07.079 --> 00:07:07.959 and keep people warm. 157 00:07:08.160 --> 00:07:09.040 And they've been on. 158 00:07:08.959 --> 00:07:10.720 For I mean, I think I just read earlier this 159 00:07:10.759 --> 00:07:12.839 week that they finally in the New England shut off 160 00:07:12.839 --> 00:07:15.439 the last of the oil fired power plants they put 161 00:07:15.480 --> 00:07:20.759 online for emergencies. Steps the tailpipe thing, Oh gosh, I 162 00:07:21.120 --> 00:07:23.240 know all the statistics on this, and yes, emissions of 163 00:07:23.319 --> 00:07:25.399 some things are down almost one hundred percent from what 164 00:07:25.399 --> 00:07:28.519 they were fifty years ago. To dramatize it for listeners, 165 00:07:28.639 --> 00:07:32.160 I show students a slide, and you'll appreciate this because 166 00:07:32.160 --> 00:07:33.920 you're old enough as I am to have worked on 167 00:07:33.959 --> 00:07:36.120 a carburetor at one time in the line, Right, I 168 00:07:36.120 --> 00:07:37.639 always like to pop the hood and fiddle with the 169 00:07:37.639 --> 00:07:40.040 screwdriver and the carburetor. It probably made things worse. But 170 00:07:40.639 --> 00:07:43.360 we don't have carburetors anymore. We went to fuel injected engines, right. 171 00:07:44.079 --> 00:07:47.120 And another thing is that little flaps on our the 172 00:07:47.160 --> 00:07:49.160 gas tanks where we put the nozzle in. 173 00:07:49.240 --> 00:07:50.199 We didn't used to have those. 174 00:07:50.639 --> 00:07:52.959 Well, I show a slide to students when I go 175 00:07:53.000 --> 00:07:55.279 through all this, and I show on the left side 176 00:07:55.360 --> 00:07:59.199 a nineteen sixty seven Mustang parked in a driveway with 177 00:07:59.240 --> 00:08:01.639 the engine off, and on the riot, I'll show a 178 00:08:01.720 --> 00:08:05.240 late model or on two thousand and five Mustang driving 179 00:08:05.279 --> 00:08:07.040 down the highway at sixty miles an hour. And the 180 00:08:07.079 --> 00:08:09.600 trick question is which one of these cars is putting 181 00:08:09.600 --> 00:08:12.160 out more air pollution? And of course the trick answer 182 00:08:12.240 --> 00:08:15.279 is the Mustang parked in the driveway is emitting more 183 00:08:15.319 --> 00:08:18.839 pollution with its engine off than the Mustang driving down 184 00:08:18.839 --> 00:08:20.720 the road of sixty miles an hour with the engine on. 185 00:08:21.160 --> 00:08:25.519 Explain that way. Explain that counter intuitive example, Miss Well. 186 00:08:25.399 --> 00:08:28.279 The technical term was fugitive emissions. 187 00:08:28.439 --> 00:08:30.279 The reason we sealed up engines the way they are 188 00:08:30.319 --> 00:08:31.920 now that you can't get to him anymore, is to 189 00:08:32.000 --> 00:08:34.480 stop essentially gasoling from evaporating. 190 00:08:34.600 --> 00:08:35.600 It really was that simple. 191 00:08:35.639 --> 00:08:38.159 It used to be tons of place like La where 192 00:08:38.159 --> 00:08:42.919 I grew up, significant amount of you know, gasoline evaporating 193 00:08:42.960 --> 00:08:45.200 into the air from our old style cars from fifty 194 00:08:45.240 --> 00:08:47.480 sixty years ago. We have none of that anymore. And 195 00:08:47.519 --> 00:08:50.519 that's why SOMEMOG levels have fallen, depending on the city 196 00:08:50.559 --> 00:08:53.519 you're in, you know, by fifty sixty seventy percent. And 197 00:08:53.960 --> 00:08:55.399 I could say I can bore you silly, But I 198 00:08:55.440 --> 00:08:58.320 also stop there and say Obama doesn't know what he's 199 00:08:58.360 --> 00:08:58.919 talking about. 200 00:08:58.960 --> 00:08:59.559 As usual. 201 00:09:00.600 --> 00:09:02.759 Well, we're in a bit of a bind here because 202 00:09:02.840 --> 00:09:04.559 we say, well, you know, cars are cleaner today, the 203 00:09:04.559 --> 00:09:05.360 air is cleaner today. 204 00:09:05.399 --> 00:09:07.279 We don't need this stuff. A lot of the reasons 205 00:09:07.279 --> 00:09:09.919 that we have these advancements and we have cleaner engines. 206 00:09:09.600 --> 00:09:11.240 And the rest of it is because there has been 207 00:09:11.679 --> 00:09:13.720 the heavy thumb of the federal government pushing down the 208 00:09:13.720 --> 00:09:15.200 scale and telling everybody what they want. 209 00:09:15.240 --> 00:09:19.399 I mean, so we have to admit that probably. 210 00:09:19.039 --> 00:09:20.639 We would not have the progress that we do if 211 00:09:20.679 --> 00:09:22.279 it had been left up to the consumer or the 212 00:09:22.279 --> 00:09:23.120 industry itself. 213 00:09:23.679 --> 00:09:25.679 I mean, what are you gonna do? 214 00:09:26.159 --> 00:09:28.360 But the point is is that after you've done a 215 00:09:28.399 --> 00:09:31.799 certain amount of work, then the existence of the agency 216 00:09:31.799 --> 00:09:34.480 has to perpetuate itself and it has to justify itself. 217 00:09:34.519 --> 00:09:37.279 So you have ever more attempts to get cleaner and 218 00:09:37.320 --> 00:09:41.360 cleaner and cleaner and cleaner, which are incremental and small 219 00:09:41.600 --> 00:09:44.320 and petty in what they accomplish, but actually great in 220 00:09:44.960 --> 00:09:47.720 the impact that they have on driveability, on the shape 221 00:09:47.720 --> 00:09:49.919 of the cars, on survivability, and you know all of 222 00:09:49.919 --> 00:09:52.960 that stuff. So yes, I'm not gonna be one of 223 00:09:52.960 --> 00:09:55.000 those guys who say we should go back to where 224 00:09:55.000 --> 00:09:56.039 it was in sixty. 225 00:09:55.759 --> 00:09:57.519 Eight when they were dumping cadmium in the river. 226 00:09:58.759 --> 00:10:01.279 You could say that markets have aally would have fixed everything, 227 00:10:01.360 --> 00:10:02.360 and maybe that's so. 228 00:10:04.440 --> 00:10:04.679 False. 229 00:10:04.759 --> 00:10:07.840 Five, But we did clean things up. 230 00:10:08.480 --> 00:10:12.080 I mean, you remember ecology was oh yes, that's what 231 00:10:12.120 --> 00:10:14.279 it was called back then, and it had all the 232 00:10:14.399 --> 00:10:16.360 raiments and all the trappings of a religion as it 233 00:10:16.360 --> 00:10:19.840 does to this day. But it won, and it got 234 00:10:19.840 --> 00:10:21.960 a lot of stuff good, and it changed public consciousness. 235 00:10:22.000 --> 00:10:23.639 But we have never moved. 236 00:10:23.960 --> 00:10:28.519 It seems like we haven't moved at all in public consciousness. 237 00:10:27.759 --> 00:10:32.080 About the imminent demise of the late great planet Earth, 238 00:10:32.320 --> 00:10:33.519 right of spaceship birth. 239 00:10:34.519 --> 00:10:37.799 It seems like we're still back in seventy nine sixty nine, 240 00:10:38.080 --> 00:10:41.159 where people are protesting somebody dumping cadmium in the river. 241 00:10:42.000 --> 00:10:44.559 Well, I actually think there has been some changes in 242 00:10:44.600 --> 00:10:47.960 public opinion now. Of course, you're right, the climate cult 243 00:10:48.039 --> 00:10:49.879 or the environmental cult as I like to call them, 244 00:10:50.080 --> 00:10:52.360 the true believers still think the world's coming to an 245 00:10:52.440 --> 00:10:54.759 end tomorrow, and they get way too much press attention. 246 00:10:55.240 --> 00:10:56.919 I think for a variety of reasons, and I've looked 247 00:10:56.919 --> 00:10:58.559 at a lot of surveys on this, a lot of 248 00:10:58.600 --> 00:11:00.960 the public has been suffering from a while now from 249 00:11:01.519 --> 00:11:04.639 what I call apocalypse fatigue. Right, we we're hearing all 250 00:11:04.679 --> 00:11:07.120 this stuff, and that's one reason why. It's why I 251 00:11:07.159 --> 00:11:09.879 think it doesn't stick anymore. I think what you would 252 00:11:09.919 --> 00:11:12.000 say is, and again my sort of summary line on 253 00:11:12.039 --> 00:11:15.480 this is what regulation did was in a few instances, 254 00:11:15.559 --> 00:11:17.960 make us get after things we would have otherwise ignored 255 00:11:18.399 --> 00:11:21.360 and it's sped up technological change and development that was 256 00:11:21.399 --> 00:11:23.000 already in process in the marketplace. 257 00:11:23.039 --> 00:11:24.360 But most people don't know. 258 00:11:24.399 --> 00:11:26.840 For example, that a lot of kinds of air pollution 259 00:11:26.960 --> 00:11:30.120 were falling in the sixties pretty fast before the first 260 00:11:30.200 --> 00:11:33.120 Clean Air Act passed. That wasn't because companies wanted to 261 00:11:33.120 --> 00:11:35.639 be good. It's because they wanted to be more efficient 262 00:11:35.679 --> 00:11:38.679 in their resource use. They also face some lawsuits, you know, 263 00:11:38.720 --> 00:11:42.279 local nuisance suits and so forth, and so so. Regulation 264 00:11:42.399 --> 00:11:45.279 certainly has a role, but it's not the case. Well, 265 00:11:45.279 --> 00:11:46.759 I always put it this way. You know, it took 266 00:11:46.799 --> 00:11:48.840 the civil rights movement of the century to get to 267 00:11:48.879 --> 00:11:51.639 their milestones in the sixties with the Civil Rights Act. 268 00:11:52.080 --> 00:11:55.399 A lot of the environmental organizations problemed today weren't founded 269 00:11:55.480 --> 00:11:59.240 until after all that landmarkt legislation was passed in Congress 270 00:11:59.320 --> 00:12:01.279 and then mostly lived the just file lawsuits. 271 00:12:02.559 --> 00:12:05.200 Well, one of the unexpected results of this is the 272 00:12:05.320 --> 00:12:07.759 end of the stop start, stop start engine. I don't 273 00:12:07.799 --> 00:12:11.000 have one of those, Oh yeah, because I absolutely despise 274 00:12:11.039 --> 00:12:12.720 the idea, no matter how many people tell me that 275 00:12:12.720 --> 00:12:14.039 they're wonderful and efficient and the. 276 00:12:13.960 --> 00:12:16.200 Rest of it. Every time I drive in a car 277 00:12:16.240 --> 00:12:18.960 with one of those things. I just I just. 278 00:12:20.919 --> 00:12:24.679 First of all, the idea of legislating out of existence 279 00:12:24.720 --> 00:12:26.840 the American urged to put it in neutral and revit 280 00:12:27.240 --> 00:12:31.159 just because you can, just because you can. I mean, 281 00:12:32.080 --> 00:12:34.679 when I drove a stick, I used to just absolutely love, 282 00:12:34.840 --> 00:12:38.159 you know, just winding that thing up and then dropping it. 283 00:12:38.159 --> 00:12:39.480 It's unamazing. 284 00:12:39.679 --> 00:12:41.759 I mean, that's as American as using too much lighter 285 00:12:41.799 --> 00:12:43.399 fluid on your barbecue, which we should all. 286 00:12:43.399 --> 00:12:44.919 Do, absolutely so. 287 00:12:45.000 --> 00:12:47.600 And then it's overfilling your zipon and putting that in 288 00:12:47.679 --> 00:12:49.200 the pocket and getting one of those rashes. 289 00:12:49.440 --> 00:12:51.360 But yeah, gosh, it's great to be an American. 290 00:12:54.159 --> 00:12:56.639 Speaking of great Americans, we got Henry Olsen back, Henry 291 00:12:56.720 --> 00:12:58.919 Senior fellow with the Ethics and Public Policy Center. 292 00:12:59.039 --> 00:13:00.879 You can find his writings, oh, in. 293 00:13:02.559 --> 00:13:07.399 Countless places, the Washington Examiner, Commonplace, the Liberal Patriot, Brussels Signal. 294 00:13:07.919 --> 00:13:09.720 We'll have to ask him about Brussels here in a bit. 295 00:13:09.879 --> 00:13:11.559 You can also catch him on the air right here 296 00:13:11.600 --> 00:13:13.879 at Ricochet, thet On Audio Network, because he. 297 00:13:13.879 --> 00:13:16.720 Hosts Beyond the Polls and is of this year. 298 00:13:16.519 --> 00:13:20.679 He's launched a new series, Conservative Crossroads, and we'll talk 299 00:13:20.679 --> 00:13:21.759 a little bit more about that later. 300 00:13:21.759 --> 00:13:23.000 As well, Henry, welcome back. 301 00:13:23.240 --> 00:13:24.440 Well thanks for having me back. 302 00:13:25.000 --> 00:13:27.919 Well good, So here we are now, Kime. 303 00:13:28.080 --> 00:13:30.639 When we had you back on last but probably the 304 00:13:30.639 --> 00:13:33.120 president's poll numbers were higher than they are now. I 305 00:13:33.120 --> 00:13:36.039 think he's thirteen thirteen points underwater or something like that. 306 00:13:36.080 --> 00:13:37.799 Of course, Gallup is pulling out of that business. I 307 00:13:37.840 --> 00:13:41.120 don't know why is this accurate? Is this a reflection 308 00:13:41.440 --> 00:13:44.840 of a fickle public? Is this because of ice? What's 309 00:13:44.919 --> 00:13:46.039 driving the numbers at the moment. 310 00:13:46.399 --> 00:13:48.759 Yeah, I think there's a lot of things driving the 311 00:13:48.840 --> 00:13:52.799 numbers that First of all, the economy is not bad, 312 00:13:53.080 --> 00:13:56.600 but it's not rip roaring good, especially if you are 313 00:13:57.200 --> 00:13:59.519 the sort of person who had a difficult time in 314 00:13:59.559 --> 00:14:03.240 the Biden inministration. Real wages are still lower than they 315 00:14:03.279 --> 00:14:06.799 were when Joe Biden took office. Getting better, but you're 316 00:14:06.840 --> 00:14:09.360 still poorer on average than you were, and I think 317 00:14:09.360 --> 00:14:12.960 people expected a quicker turnaround. I think the sheer amount 318 00:14:13.039 --> 00:14:16.960 of chaos and action that is coming from the Trump administration, 319 00:14:17.480 --> 00:14:20.879 much of which is geared overseas, is sending a message 320 00:14:20.919 --> 00:14:24.080 he doesn't care about us, us being the marginal voter 321 00:14:24.200 --> 00:14:26.480 who can go either way. And then I do think 322 00:14:26.519 --> 00:14:29.399 that it's a case of people want the president to 323 00:14:29.480 --> 00:14:33.200 succeed on his objectives with immigration, but they think that 324 00:14:33.279 --> 00:14:35.919 the in the street, in your face, and all too 325 00:14:35.919 --> 00:14:40.480 often violent tactics, even if provoked, are a step too far. 326 00:14:40.519 --> 00:14:42.720 And I think the combination of those things is why 327 00:14:43.120 --> 00:14:46.039 the swing voter in America had swung toward him and 328 00:14:46.080 --> 00:14:48.720 now are currently swinging against second. 329 00:14:48.519 --> 00:14:49.200 Boitt is interesting. 330 00:14:49.320 --> 00:14:50.679 As much as we were told that we were done 331 00:14:50.720 --> 00:14:52.639 with foreign wars and entanglements and all the rest of it, 332 00:14:52.679 --> 00:14:55.679 We're going to be America first, But it's not as 333 00:14:55.759 --> 00:14:59.399 if we are engaged in protracted, long kinetic exercises in 334 00:14:59.399 --> 00:15:01.679 places with building of the sort that we had before. 335 00:15:02.960 --> 00:15:06.840 Is it possible for those people who are suspicious of 336 00:15:06.960 --> 00:15:11.519 foreign entanglements and or adventures still might be saying, hey, 337 00:15:11.639 --> 00:15:13.679 you know, if Cuba topples of its own court after 338 00:15:13.720 --> 00:15:15.639 we cut off the gas, maybe that's a good thing. 339 00:15:16.879 --> 00:15:19.639 You know, there's not a whole lot of support for 340 00:15:19.960 --> 00:15:23.919 long ground wars. There's not a whole lot of opposition 341 00:15:24.000 --> 00:15:27.039 in the Trump coalition to short victorious wars or the 342 00:15:27.080 --> 00:15:30.080 exercise of American power to stop the bad guys. And 343 00:15:30.120 --> 00:15:33.360 I think Venezuela was a perfect example of that Operation 344 00:15:33.480 --> 00:15:36.519 Midnight Hammer, and Iran was another example of that. And 345 00:15:36.720 --> 00:15:40.240 if they managed to topple or significantly reform the regime 346 00:15:40.279 --> 00:15:43.639 in Cuba without firing a shot, not only will jubilation 347 00:15:43.919 --> 00:15:48.720 be heard in South Florida, but I think most people 348 00:15:48.759 --> 00:15:50.639 who are open to voting for Trump would be very 349 00:15:50.639 --> 00:15:51.159 happy with that. 350 00:15:51.840 --> 00:15:54.399 Okay, Henry, I want to ask you about the Gallop 351 00:15:54.799 --> 00:15:57.960 decision to stop daily tracking polls. And I mean, I 352 00:15:58.519 --> 00:16:00.279 wonder is it just because some of the other people 353 00:16:00.320 --> 00:16:01.840 are doing it now that they don't need to anymore, 354 00:16:01.919 --> 00:16:05.120 or has it gotten more difficult or expensive or related 355 00:16:05.159 --> 00:16:08.960 to this, and or I observe that every recent president 356 00:16:09.000 --> 00:16:12.080 has landed in the low forties after a while, going 357 00:16:12.120 --> 00:16:14.159 back now at least to George W. Bush right, And 358 00:16:14.240 --> 00:16:17.679 I'm wondering now if that's a new pattern in American 359 00:16:17.759 --> 00:16:18.679 presidential approval. 360 00:16:18.720 --> 00:16:20.919 So the whole number is, it's not meaningless. 361 00:16:20.919 --> 00:16:23.519 I understand the correlations between low approval ratings and how 362 00:16:23.559 --> 00:16:26.240 you fare in the midterms. I wonder if this is 363 00:16:26.279 --> 00:16:29.360 the new normal in American presidential politics, whereas you know 364 00:16:29.440 --> 00:16:32.399 the other party doesn't like you, and so you're already 365 00:16:32.480 --> 00:16:34.600 you know, you're already down to fifty percent, and then 366 00:16:34.639 --> 00:16:39.039 the independence and the swing voters who pay attention at 367 00:16:39.120 --> 00:16:41.639 various levels, they defect in a hurry, and so everybody 368 00:16:41.720 --> 00:16:43.720 lands after a couple of years down around forty two 369 00:16:43.799 --> 00:16:44.799 to forty five percent. 370 00:16:45.799 --> 00:16:48.440 Now I think there's some, uh, there's some truth to that, 371 00:16:48.519 --> 00:16:51.320 but there's also I think the general fact that we 372 00:16:51.360 --> 00:16:55.960 haven't had a successful presidency in unambiguously successful presidency in 373 00:16:56.039 --> 00:17:01.159 many decades. So you've got Obama coming to power, saying 374 00:17:01.200 --> 00:17:03.559 that he's going to bring hope and change, and then 375 00:17:03.600 --> 00:17:07.000 he focuses his attention on things he didn't campaign on, 376 00:17:07.119 --> 00:17:11.319 leading to Obamacare, and you have President Trump's chaotic first 377 00:17:11.440 --> 00:17:15.359 couple of years. And then you have Joe Biden, who 378 00:17:15.359 --> 00:17:18.680 said he was going to bring normalcy back and instead 379 00:17:18.720 --> 00:17:22.440 he heightens the divisions and we have the highest inflation 380 00:17:22.519 --> 00:17:25.119 in forty years and the breakout of war. So you 381 00:17:25.200 --> 00:17:28.279 look and you say, why would you expect approval ratings 382 00:17:28.319 --> 00:17:31.799 over fifty percent when you actually look at the interplay 383 00:17:31.880 --> 00:17:35.000 between what these candidates said and did, and I think 384 00:17:35.000 --> 00:17:37.720 Trump is falling into that same a pattern. 385 00:17:37.799 --> 00:17:40.240 Yeah, well, all right, But the counter argument, though, Henry, 386 00:17:40.319 --> 00:17:43.759 is that Trump was almost re elected in twenty twenty 387 00:17:43.839 --> 00:17:48.279 even with the COVID disaster and impeachment, and Kamala Harris 388 00:17:48.359 --> 00:17:52.480 almost won in twenty twenty four despite inheriting the terrible 389 00:17:52.880 --> 00:17:55.960 record and ratings of Biden. So that's why I think 390 00:17:56.000 --> 00:17:57.759 that now maybe there's I have a look at the 391 00:17:57.839 --> 00:18:00.920 numbers the way you do, which you know you don't sleep. 392 00:18:00.720 --> 00:18:02.279 Because you're up all night looking at these things all 393 00:18:02.319 --> 00:18:02.839 over the world. 394 00:18:02.880 --> 00:18:05.519 We know this, But I'm wondering if that the numbers 395 00:18:05.559 --> 00:18:09.680 simply less not insignificant, but less meaningful than it used 396 00:18:09.680 --> 00:18:09.839 to be. 397 00:18:11.039 --> 00:18:12.960 I think what's true is that we have a much 398 00:18:13.039 --> 00:18:17.640 narrower event band, you know, and that is caused by partisanship. 399 00:18:17.720 --> 00:18:20.640 That if eighty five to ninety percent of people who 400 00:18:20.640 --> 00:18:23.839 are going to be polled are on one team or 401 00:18:23.839 --> 00:18:25.880