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Speaker 1: People call this show every week asking why we don't

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believe in God, but the answer is obvious. We have

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no good reason to believe in a God. In fact,

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the universe looks exactly like what we'd expect if there

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were not a God running it. It's chaotic, indifferent, unusually cruel,

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and is bent on death rather than life. All of

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this is radically unexpected in the God worldview, unless the

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God is indifferent and cruel. Additionally, every version of God

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that accounts for these facts has been a God that shapeshifts,

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changes with culture, political powers, and moral frameworks. God seems

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much more like a human invention than an eternal truth.

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And every time humans have said God did it, scigns

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eventually proved that no, God did not do it. And

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here's how it actually works. This is why Nietzsche famously

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said God is dead, God remains dead, and we've killed him.

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I would add only one modification to this, stating God

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is dead, God remains dead, We kill them, and now

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it's time to bury the stinking, rotting blow corpse that's

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left behind. So get your shovel and join us, or

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call in to prove us wrong. The lines are open

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and the show starts now.

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Speaker 2: Welcome in.

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Speaker 1: Everybody.

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Speaker 2: Today is August twenty fourth, twenty twenty five. I am

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your host, justin You might know me.

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Speaker 1: Elsewhere is Deconstruction Zone, and joining me right now is

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my friend and co host, the Arkon of Algorithms, the

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Pontiff of Probability, the Duke of Bible Debunking, the Archbishop

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of Apostasy, and the Guardian of the Godless. Good to

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see a godless engineer. Oh no, we lost your audio.

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Speaker 3: Sorry I was muted.

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Speaker 4: Sorry.

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Speaker 3: I don't know if I'm all those things, but I

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will gladly wear those titles.

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Speaker 2: Well, I'm happy to be on a screen with you again.

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It's been a hot minute since we got to share

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a screen together, so I'm pretty excited about it.

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Speaker 3: Same here.

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Speaker 1: I think last time we ended up cooking on numbers

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thirty one. Who knows, maybe it was maybe it was

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meant to be. Well, we'll get to do even more

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cooking at number thirty one here tonight.

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Speaker 2: But before we get into our calls, let's get into

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some announcements.

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Speaker 1: The Atheist Experience is a product of the Atheist Community

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of Austin, a five o' one c three nonprofit organization

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dedicated to the promotion of atheism, critical thinking, secular humanism,

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and the separation of religion and government. Now, John, we

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have one theist online already, Benjamin, which you may and

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I've talked to before, says that the people who go

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to church don't have any idea what the Bible is

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even talking about. I'd love to bite into this particular conversation, Benjamin.

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Speaker 2: Can you hear us?

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Speaker 5: Yeah? Yeah, how you doing doing good?

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Speaker 1: Thanks for calin Benjamin. Benjamin, can you elaborate a little

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bit on what your thesis is?

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Speaker 6: Yeah?

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Speaker 5: So I went to toch earlier. Today, I do go

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to Toad and I do believe in odd but as

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far as the Trinity and stuff, I don't believe in

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that because that was added a lot later, which was

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kind of a bone to pick anyway, because they claimed

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that the Trinity has always been I'm like, no, I

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hadn't and in that when when Jesus was alive, Christianity

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didn't even exist, you know, they was all poet us.

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But yeah, I mean, it's uh. And I brought this

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up to them, and I also brought up the fact

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that they'd serry picked the Bible because they picked and

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choose what they wanted to put in it. In the West,

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they'd tried to burn and destroyed, and I saw as

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heresy and they which Honestly, a lot of you people

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have told me that my views are mainly heresy, but

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I'm anostic and that that hasn't existed in several hundred

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years anyway, and.

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Speaker 1: So I think that's what we're interested in talking about.

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It was, so let's let's get into that a little bit. John,

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What were you gonna say?

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Speaker 3: I mean, I was just I was just going to

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ask Benjamin, like, how do you know what is the

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true teachings of God or the true nature of God

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or whatever particular aspects of God that you say that

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you believe in or you think you know? How do

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you know those things?

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Speaker 5: Yeah? Well, I mean so experience. It is necessarily the

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first person, right, So I go off experience knowledge and

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life experience. But I can't demonstrate any of that to you. However,

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the problem that I went into with a lot of

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cists that I deal with is that either they don't

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actually know their Bible because the cleatsers don't cleat from it,

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and I mean they they pick a verotes, but they

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don't pleach the whole you know, they don't. They don't

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teach the actual Bible with the issue and you know,

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the like in mindset for I'm.

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Speaker 2: Not sure they answered the question. Maybe I didn't hear it.

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Speaker 1: I think what John was asking is, how do you

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know that your understanding of the Bible is somehow like

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the correct understanding and that the others have it wrong.

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Speaker 3: Did we lose him?

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Speaker 2: Maybe I don't hear him.

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Speaker 3: I don't know. Benjamin, are you there?

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Speaker 1: Apparently the demi urge took him. He gone, he gone,

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he's he's in the swamp. He's in the deep, deep

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deep swamp of Alabama. Okay, then one of the alligators

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got a hold of him. Well with that, then we

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got another caller in the queue. Let me read our

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announcements and we'll get our next caller into the queue.

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Maybe if if he comes back while we're doing the announcements,

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we can get him in. So let's give him an

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opportunity to reconnect, if possible, before we move on to

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the next caller.

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Speaker 2: I hate for him.

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Speaker 1: I have the wait in line all over again. But

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if you're listening, call in and we'll get you. We'll

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get you back in the discussion. If not, we've got

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to go on to Adam our next caller. But the

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announcements for the day we're happy to announce then. On

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August the twenty ninth, just a couple of days from now,

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the Atheist Community Austin will be hosting a presentation by

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Seth Andrews with an introduction by genetically Modified Skeptic and

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the Antibot. Join us at the Roundtable I'm Sorry the

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Round Public Library for an evening of pizza, conversation and

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critical thinking. Tickets are available right now at tiny dot

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cc ford Slash Evening with Seth. Please like the video

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and subscribe to the channel, enable notifications, and comment below

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on who your favorite caller. It is also another way

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to support the channel is by sending in superchats, So

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go ahead get your superchats in. We'll be reading your

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super chats as we get timed throughout the stream and

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then also at the end of the stream. It really

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helps us support the channel and it brings the audience

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into the conversation. If you're in the Austin area, follow

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us on meetup to keep up with community events. You

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can see what's going on at tiny cc forde slash

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ACA meetup. You can go to events like Philosophy under

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the Stars, game Nights and more. Also, you could join

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our weekly watch parties at the Free Thought Library on

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Sundays for live viewings of Talk Heathen and the Atheist

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Experience every Sunday, doors open at noon.

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Speaker 2: It's a great place for building community. And lastly, but

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certainly not at least, we want to send a big

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thank you to the crew who puts the show together

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for us every week.

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Speaker 1: We've got video operators, audio operators, note takers, call screeners,

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and chat maturators that make all of this possible.

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Speaker 2: There's a lot going on behind the scenes.

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Speaker 1: It's not just two talking heads on a screen shouting

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number thirty one at people. So thank you to everyone

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making the show possible. It really means to world, to

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myself and to the people watching. And Benjamin did come back,

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So I think Benjamin's connection is back with us. Benjamin,

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welcome back.

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Speaker 5: So I don't know what just happened. I was talking

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and then all of a sudden I disconnected for some reason.

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So I don't know what.

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Speaker 1: I suspect just that reception. It's okay. So so Benjamin,

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I think, what what?

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Speaker 5: What?

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Speaker 1: Godless engineer was asking, which I was looking for an

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answer to still is you're reading the Bible, you're coming

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up with an interpretation of the Bible, and you're saying

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that your interpretation of the Bible is somehow superior to others.

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What's the measuring stick or what's the tool that one

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could use to come to the conclusion that your interpretation

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is somehow better than somebody else's interpretation.

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Speaker 5: Well, so I'm not going to make a mistakes of

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what's a coach to triud to say and say because

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that doesn't that doesn't work. But I would say personal experience,

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just experience and general knowledge, you know, distovery personal experience

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that kind of time.

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Speaker 3: Well, what if I can ask what kind of personal

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experiences are you talking about? Like and and I will

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start there, like what what personal experience of yours has

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convinced you of your particular interpretation of your God?

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Speaker 5: Well, just well, that's kind of a complicated press to

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get into. I got a puppy, But basically, I've been

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burned and it didn't hurt me. I've been hung, I've

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been shot, I've literally died a few times and came back,

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been medically dead, and came back. I guess I guess

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I should say, are.

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Speaker 3: We talking.

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Speaker 5: Time?

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Speaker 3: Are we? Are you resputing.

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Speaker 5: Now? But that is a good joke. I mean I was.

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Speaker 3: Being half serious the way that you talk about yourself surviving,

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being shot, hung and all that, Like that's wood resputant

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went through. If I'm not mistaken there, I think he

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was also poisoned and maybe drowned as well. But you

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know what, there's time.

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Speaker 5: Oh yeah, drown me and almost ground so that yeah,

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I don't know if I was ever poisoned or not.

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Speaker 3: I mean, would you really know if you're if you're

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if you're immune to it and it didn't cook. I mean,

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was there anybody surprised after you having a meal? Sorry?

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I I'm we're getting off in the week.

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Speaker 5: Oh, I mean when I did, when I agmatically did,

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I mean I basically everything went black. My hearing cut off,

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my my sense here what.

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Speaker 2: Got cut off?

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Speaker 5: Man?

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Speaker 2: Huh is hearing your hearing cut off?

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Speaker 1: Okay?

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Speaker 5: Yeah, yeah yeah, so my hearing cut off, my senses

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set off, so everything went black and then I just

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woke up in the guardy. That's I mean, that's pretty much.

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And also let me ask you this, so so I.

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Speaker 2: Mean that that was similar to my experience.

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Speaker 1: Like, so, I've been dead before, and you know, everything

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went black and then I was just out of consciousness

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for a time and then I woke up somewhere else.

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Speaker 5: Right.

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Speaker 1: But to me, this evidence, the evidence you're talking about

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in my own experience, would lead one to believe that.

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Speaker 2: There is no God, there is no afterlife.

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Speaker 1: Like if we if we lose consciousness, we die medically

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and then it's just blackness. It would stand the reason

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that there there's nothing in the beyond.

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Speaker 5: We'll see. What's weird to me is I was actually

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standing over my body at one point, but uh, and

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and also I like I was literally standing over it.

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I could see my body, but then because I was

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in the middle of a concert, uh.

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Speaker 3: Benjamin, Benjamin, So I get that you you think that

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you were standing beside your body, but I'm just kind

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of curious how you can discern between like some kind

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of hallucinatory uh like uh experience that you had versus sorry.

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Speaker 5: What Well, So, yeah, you're arguing you know, basically scientific

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chemicals in my Brian from lack of loss and rest

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is a supernatural experience, right, I.

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Speaker 1: Mean, yeah, that's essentially Yeah, We know that to be

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the case because we can do it on purpose. We

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can cause it through d MT cybercill and deep brain stimulation.

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We can produce the exact SAMED experience that you're referring to.

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Speaker 5: Well, so I can I also have a remote viewing,

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which is basically the ability to use my brain to

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look and see like stuff that I'm not there physically

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looking at, but I can see, you know, stuff from

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a distance, and I use my brain to remember, you know,

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details of it.

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Speaker 2: Like you couldn't do it right now? Can you do

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it right now?

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Speaker 5: Possibly? Sure?

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Speaker 1: Can you do remote viewing and tell us something that's

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in our in godless engineer's room or something that's in

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our room that's not on camera?

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Speaker 5: Well, I mean I could try to do that. I

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mean that's I don't know if I'd be able to,

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I mean, both of us.

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Speaker 3: How long how long would that take? Like is it

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like a long process of you like meditating and like

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trying to view or it's.

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Speaker 5: No, I mean it just it just takes content trace

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clear in my mind and then I can basically sure

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pretty much anywhere.

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Speaker 2: And so I'm gonna I'm want to give you an item.

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Speaker 1: Let me know if you can come close to determining

256
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what it is just to the left of me on

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my desk, I have a very very specific item on

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my desk shelf. It can't be confused for anything else.

259
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There's nothing like it that you would find in an

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office that would be similar.

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Speaker 2: So, like any description even remotely close to what this

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thing is, I'd be willing to accept that you are

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viewing it remotely. Want to give it a shot? Tell

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me what's just left to me?

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Speaker 1: Is at not really?

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Speaker 2: It's metal? Is metal?

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Speaker 5: Is it? Let's see, I'm trying to see it. Sorry,

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let's see.

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Speaker 1: No, No, I'm sorry, completely different categories, not across.

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Speaker 5: I know it's some kind of.

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Speaker 2: Safe, right, It's not a safe like a shape.

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Speaker 5: No, I said a safe.

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Speaker 1: It's like, oh, the shape I would give it is

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more of a polygon.

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Speaker 5: Okay, yeah, I was. I was thinking that, and I

276
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knew it was something. I knew it was metal. But yeah,

277
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so that's that's kind of how my self works. I mean,

278
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I can visualize it didn't.

279
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Speaker 3: Work, No, Benjamin, Benjamin, it didn't work. You just scattered

280
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shot a bunch of shit towards Justin's way, and then

281
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none of it worked. Out and so now you're like, so, yeah,

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that's how it works. It just it's impeccable. I got it.

283
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Speaker 1: I mean to be sure, to be sure, I just

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want to make sure we're clear on this, prit.

285
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Speaker 5: But it's a polygon.

286
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Speaker 1: Well, to be sure, all of us have a metal

287
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rectangle in our office. It's typically what our computer is

288
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housed in. That's not what I was referring to. So

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I would need some sing more specific than like, oh,

290
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it certainly.

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Speaker 2: Isn't a triangle. What I'm what I'm referring to.

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Speaker 5: A right, I mean, so I thought you meant I

293
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thought you meant something in your womb with me, you said, right, Well.

294
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Speaker 1: I mean I'm in my office right now. So the

295
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room that I'm in has has a metal a metal device,

296
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but I wouldn't describe it as rectangular.

297
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Speaker 2: It's definitely a polygon.

298
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Speaker 5: Computer, right, Well, that's the thing computer I thought.

299
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Speaker 1: I specifically picked something that wasn't a computer because I

300
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assumed that you might guess a computer since it's going

301
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to be in all of our rooms since we're talking

302
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on a computer. Right, So the item that's sitting to

303
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the left of me, right, so the item is to

304
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the left of me.

305
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Speaker 2: Well, it's not a safe, but it is something.

306
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Speaker 5: It's you know, I said safe, not safe s a

307
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f E metal, but I don't know shit, I think.

308
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Speaker 1: Shape, oh shape, Well that's what I'm saying. It's not

309
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it's not a triangle.

310
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Speaker 5: Yeah, I mean that was my post guest, but I

311
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know it was metal. But remote doing this where you

312
00:16:12,320 --> 00:16:14,600
can use your mind to see self that you're not

313
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physically looking at, which I have.

314
00:16:19,440 --> 00:16:22,440
Speaker 3: Right Yeah, So I just want to kind of cut

315
00:16:22,440 --> 00:16:24,399
through a bunch of this bullshit that we're kind of

316
00:16:24,399 --> 00:16:28,279
waiting through right now, because studies have been done on

317
00:16:28,559 --> 00:16:32,200
remote viewing and uh, they've actually been detrimental to like

318
00:16:32,879 --> 00:16:36,200
police investigations and everything like that. There's actually never been

319
00:16:36,279 --> 00:16:39,399
any verified case, just like what we just witnessed here

320
00:16:40,120 --> 00:16:46,639
of actual remote viewing being accurate. So, but what you've

321
00:16:46,679 --> 00:16:50,679
demonstrated here is the failings of remote viewing. You haven't

322
00:16:50,679 --> 00:16:53,960
been able to remotely view a thing like I'm holding

323
00:16:54,000 --> 00:16:56,960
something in my left hand right now, and you're definitely

324
00:16:57,000 --> 00:16:58,440
not going to be able to guess what it is

325
00:16:58,519 --> 00:17:00,600
because nobody would be able to get that's what I'm

326
00:17:00,639 --> 00:17:03,919
holding right now. But if you think you can remote

327
00:17:04,000 --> 00:17:06,119
view and guess it, you know, give you a second

328
00:17:06,119 --> 00:17:08,759
shot here? Uh, you know, go ahead do it.

329
00:17:09,839 --> 00:17:13,440
Speaker 5: Well. I have actually do plenty of stuff, and I

330
00:17:13,519 --> 00:17:16,839
also have been able to look at people and know

331
00:17:16,920 --> 00:17:21,240
what they went through without even me asking them, for example.

332
00:17:22,039 --> 00:17:25,960
Speaker 3: To answer my question what we're closer and like, physically

333
00:17:26,000 --> 00:17:28,759
I'm closer to you than Justin is. So maybe that

334
00:17:28,839 --> 00:17:31,440
could be the case here for this remote viewing aspect.

335
00:17:31,799 --> 00:17:33,799
What am I holding in my left hand right now?

336
00:17:33,799 --> 00:17:36,359
Can you remote? You come into this with them?

337
00:17:37,480 --> 00:17:39,359
Speaker 5: I tant y'all with boats in Texas.

338
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Speaker 3: I'm in Alabama.

339
00:17:41,000 --> 00:17:42,799
Speaker 2: Shit, you guys might be neighbors.

340
00:17:44,200 --> 00:17:47,359
Speaker 5: Now, no, we're not neighbors. But how do you know?

341
00:17:47,559 --> 00:17:51,759
Let's see, because I live in a small town, I

342
00:17:51,920 --> 00:17:55,599
know well, actually it's tendency to bring that up because

343
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I've been here for over forty years and people don't

344
00:17:58,240 --> 00:18:01,279
realize how long I've been here of amens and saying

345
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but oh what else?

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Speaker 2: So let me just real quick, Benjamin.

347
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Speaker 1: The reason why we're kind of testing you a little

348
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bit on remote viewing is because the way a lot

349
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of remote viewing happens is people will like guess really

350
00:18:17,240 --> 00:18:22,200
generic items that may or may not posiblyly in a room,

351
00:18:22,359 --> 00:18:25,160
kind of like cold reading a crowd. In order for

352
00:18:25,359 --> 00:18:28,880
remote viewing to be validated, we would need like a

353
00:18:29,039 --> 00:18:32,480
specific instance, like there's something in my left hand, what

354
00:18:32,640 --> 00:18:35,559
is in my left hand or like that. That would

355
00:18:35,599 --> 00:18:37,920
be really good proof is if you actually gave us

356
00:18:37,960 --> 00:18:39,839
this specific description of the ideas.

357
00:18:40,279 --> 00:18:43,480
Speaker 5: Okay, right, so let me ask you this. So if

358
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I was in a womb, right and and somebody was

359
00:18:46,799 --> 00:18:50,119
walking down a stairway to the womb, and I guess

360
00:18:50,240 --> 00:18:53,079
you know, I say goal with glasses, and it's the

361
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goal with glasses. And then I say, you know your

362
00:18:56,279 --> 00:19:00,359
your bicycle ads, you're willing on your lights, so dummy

363
00:19:00,400 --> 00:19:02,240
hill and see as a lean on the white shoulder

364
00:19:02,319 --> 00:19:05,759
from a bicyle passident that just happened. And there's no

365
00:19:05,920 --> 00:19:07,839
possible way that I should have known any of that

366
00:19:08,680 --> 00:19:11,480
because I couldn't see who was coming down the staiway, right,

367
00:19:11,759 --> 00:19:15,119
So if I this stuff like that, does that count?

368
00:19:15,240 --> 00:19:18,000
Speaker 1: That's what we're asking, right, because like you're telling us

369
00:19:18,000 --> 00:19:20,079
something that you already did in the past that we

370
00:19:20,119 --> 00:19:21,400
have no way to investigate.

371
00:19:21,440 --> 00:19:23,119
Speaker 2: That's why we're asking you to do it now, right,

372
00:19:23,119 --> 00:19:25,000
because I can easily say I can say, listen.

373
00:19:24,839 --> 00:19:29,039
Speaker 1: John, I I'm not God, but I do have magical powers.

374
00:19:29,079 --> 00:19:31,720
In fact, just last week I went outside and I

375
00:19:31,759 --> 00:19:34,799
made all the rocks in my backyard levitate. Now listen.

376
00:19:34,880 --> 00:19:36,640
That would be really cool if it was true. But

377
00:19:36,680 --> 00:19:40,400
the reality is John has no way. But John doesn't

378
00:19:40,440 --> 00:19:43,400
have a way of testing that. That's just a story

379
00:19:43,440 --> 00:19:45,400
that I told, right. So the only way for us

380
00:19:45,440 --> 00:19:48,960
to come to the point where we believe you that

381
00:19:49,039 --> 00:19:51,680
you can remote view is if you can demonstrate it

382
00:19:51,720 --> 00:19:52,319
in real time.

383
00:19:52,599 --> 00:19:57,039
Speaker 5: Well, let me ask you this. If somebody has that mostnesis, okay,

384
00:19:57,839 --> 00:20:01,160
how could they tell whether that person that's in the

385
00:20:01,240 --> 00:20:05,440
storm or the storm is coming naturally because you could

386
00:20:05,480 --> 00:20:06,519
have hold.

387
00:20:06,519 --> 00:20:10,200
Speaker 3: What no, Well, hold on, Benjamin, I'm confused. One one.

388
00:20:10,240 --> 00:20:12,039
Did you say telekinesis?

389
00:20:12,440 --> 00:20:16,279
Speaker 5: I said atesis? But but what you decided would be at.

390
00:20:17,799 --> 00:20:19,480
Speaker 3: Mom What is is that?

391
00:20:20,079 --> 00:20:20,279
Speaker 5: Right?

392
00:20:20,759 --> 00:20:22,759
Speaker 3: And that's the ability to control storms?

393
00:20:23,680 --> 00:20:26,920
Speaker 1: That's what I thought. Yeah, at moesis ability to control

394
00:20:26,960 --> 00:20:30,799
weather the atmosphere with your mind. So I want to

395
00:20:30,799 --> 00:20:32,599
make sure we heard you correctly. Are you saying you

396
00:20:32,640 --> 00:20:34,359
can control the weather with your mind?

397
00:20:34,599 --> 00:20:37,759
Speaker 5: Well, I mean even if I could, I couldn't prove

398
00:20:37,799 --> 00:20:40,240
it because people would just pass it off as Apple.

399
00:20:41,559 --> 00:20:42,400
I wouldn't believe you.

400
00:20:42,559 --> 00:20:46,720
Speaker 1: Right now, listen, if you could make it rain outside

401
00:20:46,759 --> 00:20:48,960
of my house right now, I'm looking out a window

402
00:20:49,039 --> 00:20:50,680
right now. If you can make it rain out there,

403
00:20:51,079 --> 00:20:52,799
I'm joining your cult right now.

404
00:20:53,240 --> 00:20:54,039
Speaker 2: I'm signing up.

405
00:20:57,079 --> 00:20:59,759
Speaker 3: I've got I've got a money gun in here, so

406
00:20:59,759 --> 00:21:01,920
I can definitely make it rain in one kind of way.

407
00:21:03,000 --> 00:21:05,480
But yeah, that sounds like a Marvel with superhero power.

408
00:21:05,559 --> 00:21:08,400
That's that's storm from the Marvel. Are you are you

409
00:21:08,480 --> 00:21:10,759
fucking with us? I feel like I feel like you're

410
00:21:10,799 --> 00:21:12,519
fucking with this, Benjamin. Are you fucking with this?

411
00:21:13,079 --> 00:21:16,839
Speaker 5: No? I'm just saying like, if I was able, I mean,

412
00:21:16,920 --> 00:21:19,680
I'm just giving an example. If I was able to

413
00:21:19,720 --> 00:21:22,720
console the weather, nobody would be able to discern that

414
00:21:22,759 --> 00:21:25,960
from natural occurrences, right, I mean, let's.

415
00:21:25,720 --> 00:21:31,599
Speaker 3: Say, right, Benjamin, Benjamin, if it's Benjamin, If it's unfalsifiable, Benjamin,

416
00:21:31,599 --> 00:21:35,400
if it's unfalsifiable, then that makes it a pretty shit claim,

417
00:21:35,480 --> 00:21:38,240
right Like, there's no way for us to falsify whether

418
00:21:38,319 --> 00:21:40,480
or not you've been able to use your mental powers

419
00:21:40,519 --> 00:21:43,160
to conjure a storm. We're never going to be able

420
00:21:43,200 --> 00:21:45,240
to verify or not verify it.

421
00:21:45,440 --> 00:21:48,279
Speaker 5: Well, no, I wouldn't say that, but I would say

422
00:21:48,359 --> 00:21:50,920
that there would be certain stamps that you would have

423
00:21:51,000 --> 00:21:54,200
to take to verify it, because let's say the take

424
00:21:54,400 --> 00:21:57,799
ordin that I did make the way, and then you know,

425
00:21:57,920 --> 00:22:01,000
you could just say, oh, it's just wined by natural currencies. Right.

426
00:22:01,160 --> 00:22:03,480
But but if I'm able to do that with peaceably

427
00:22:03,920 --> 00:22:06,119
and make it weighing in the location where I'm at,

428
00:22:06,680 --> 00:22:09,839
that for the record, usually it has to be where

429
00:22:09,839 --> 00:22:12,720
I'm at. So like right now, I'm in I'm in

430
00:22:12,799 --> 00:22:15,599
my tail and it's cloudy all over and I'm you know,

431
00:22:15,680 --> 00:22:20,720
it's about to start waiting here. But lienerally it's stronger

432
00:22:20,759 --> 00:22:22,519
where I'm at than where I'm not at.

433
00:22:22,680 --> 00:22:28,480
Speaker 1: So, Benjamin, that's what we're saying, right, We're saying we

434
00:22:28,519 --> 00:22:31,000
would give you the benefit of the doubt. Like I'm

435
00:22:31,039 --> 00:22:34,079
I'm charitable enough, I will give you the benefit of

436
00:22:34,119 --> 00:22:36,160
the doubt if you can make it rain where I'm

437
00:22:36,200 --> 00:22:38,759
at right now. Like I told you, I'm not lying

438
00:22:38,799 --> 00:22:40,680
to you. I'm not going to say it was through

439
00:22:40,759 --> 00:22:43,440
natural causes. I'm saying you do it right now, and

440
00:22:43,480 --> 00:22:48,079
I'm a believer. Well, do you prefer silver or gold.

441
00:22:48,119 --> 00:22:49,559
I can make an idol in either one.

442
00:22:50,000 --> 00:22:53,759
Speaker 7: I don't I don't really care which one, but one, well,

443
00:22:54,039 --> 00:22:57,079
I mean even titles anyway, right.

444
00:22:57,200 --> 00:22:59,279
Speaker 2: But I mean I'm not a Christian.

445
00:22:58,759 --> 00:23:03,000
Speaker 1: I be following whatever. Your cult is not the Christian cult, right,

446
00:23:03,079 --> 00:23:06,519
So I guess it's like a new rain cult. I

447
00:23:06,559 --> 00:23:07,920
guess weather cult.

448
00:23:08,240 --> 00:23:08,759
Speaker 5: It's bail.

449
00:23:09,079 --> 00:23:12,000
Speaker 2: But yeah, you're bail. Okay, so we're talking the bail. Cool.

450
00:23:12,240 --> 00:23:13,680
Speaker 1: Well, you're the writer on the clouds.

451
00:23:14,359 --> 00:23:14,559
Speaker 5: Huh.

452
00:23:14,680 --> 00:23:25,599
Speaker 3: Okay, so is the rider on the storm? Oh damn, Benjamin, No, Benjamin, Benjamin.

453
00:23:25,720 --> 00:23:28,599
We've kind of run the gambit here today because we

454
00:23:28,680 --> 00:23:32,279
started off asking you, hey, how can you verify that

455
00:23:32,440 --> 00:23:35,319
your interpretation of your religion is the correct one and

456
00:23:35,359 --> 00:23:38,519
everybody else is wrong? And now we're on I have

457
00:23:38,640 --> 00:23:43,160
Marvel superpowers that can control the weather. I'm basically storm

458
00:23:43,240 --> 00:23:49,599
on the X men. I'm sorry, didn't you just say

459
00:23:49,599 --> 00:23:50,039
that you.

460
00:23:50,000 --> 00:23:53,440
Speaker 5: Can't do it?

461
00:23:53,880 --> 00:23:54,640
Speaker 2: Oh?

462
00:23:54,680 --> 00:23:57,200
Speaker 3: Okay, I'm sorry, you were talking like you could. Anyways,

463
00:23:57,480 --> 00:23:59,680
can you please, can you please just maybe we can

464
00:23:59,759 --> 00:24:02,799
re enter this before we have to go, and maybe

465
00:24:02,799 --> 00:24:04,720
we can get back to the original question that you

466
00:24:04,799 --> 00:24:07,440
still have yet to actually answer, And that's how do

467
00:24:07,519 --> 00:24:12,559
you discern that your beliefs about your God are true,

468
00:24:12,799 --> 00:24:16,359
and every other Christian that goes to church at least

469
00:24:16,640 --> 00:24:17,119
is wrong.

470
00:24:17,319 --> 00:24:20,880
Speaker 5: Okay, Well, if I was just to tell this out there,

471
00:24:21,440 --> 00:24:23,680
if I was to tell you that where you're at

472
00:24:23,720 --> 00:24:26,640
it's gonna wayne later today, would that be a prediction

473
00:24:26,759 --> 00:24:28,599
If I have no way to know where you're at,

474
00:24:28,880 --> 00:24:30,240
if it's unawayne.

475
00:24:30,240 --> 00:24:34,799
Speaker 8: You could just watch the weather report, ben Fuck Yeah,

476
00:24:34,880 --> 00:24:38,319
So like a future prediction of like sometime today it's

477
00:24:38,359 --> 00:24:41,599
going to rain, I don't think is interesting.

478
00:24:41,720 --> 00:24:43,759
Speaker 1: Like I need you to do it right now while

479
00:24:43,759 --> 00:24:45,440
there's no rain clouds overhead.

480
00:24:45,480 --> 00:24:47,079
Speaker 2: That would be interesting.

481
00:24:47,119 --> 00:24:50,240
Speaker 1: But also keep in mind that I don't think that

482
00:24:50,359 --> 00:24:54,119
this is unique because there are people in other religions

483
00:24:54,160 --> 00:24:57,799
who claim to do the same thing. So like, I'm

484
00:24:57,839 --> 00:25:01,519
aware that to you it is sound like super convincing

485
00:25:01,599 --> 00:25:04,039
that like, hey, I have a power because my God

486
00:25:04,119 --> 00:25:06,519
is real. But like, if you have this power and

487
00:25:06,559 --> 00:25:08,599
there's other people, like in the Hindu faith who have

488
00:25:08,640 --> 00:25:11,319
the same power, then you're The best you can possibly

489
00:25:11,359 --> 00:25:13,799
do is say that all of the gods are real.

490
00:25:14,440 --> 00:25:17,559
Speaker 5: Well, I mean you kind of flitting hairs with that,

491
00:25:17,680 --> 00:25:22,720
but the what so, what would be a good what

492
00:25:22,799 --> 00:25:26,480
would count as a good trediction in your mind tradition,

493
00:25:26,920 --> 00:25:29,079
So it has to be specific, and it has to

494
00:25:29,119 --> 00:25:33,359
be something that is that that would not be generally possible. Right,

495
00:25:33,440 --> 00:25:36,240
So if I if I say.

496
00:25:36,039 --> 00:25:40,000
Speaker 3: Ben ben Ben Ben ben Ben, what what Justin is

497
00:25:40,039 --> 00:25:43,599
asking for here is for you to literally snap your

498
00:25:43,599 --> 00:25:47,160
fingers like fucking Thanos right now, cause it to rain

499
00:25:47,240 --> 00:25:51,240
at his location, and then snap your fingers again like

500
00:25:51,319 --> 00:25:54,119
Santos and cause it to stop raining.

501
00:25:54,400 --> 00:25:56,799
Speaker 5: I don't know where he is. It's kind of hard

502
00:25:56,839 --> 00:25:58,839
to make it weigh in someplace if I don't know where.

503
00:25:58,880 --> 00:26:01,640
Speaker 1: It's a god as God knows where I'm at, and

504
00:26:02,200 --> 00:26:04,720
you don't have to know, just like you don't, like

505
00:26:04,799 --> 00:26:07,240
you don't have to have literal control over the weather.

506
00:26:07,319 --> 00:26:10,599
Your deedy gives you that control, right, so, like you

507
00:26:10,599 --> 00:26:13,039
don't actually need to know where I'm at. What I mean,

508
00:26:13,119 --> 00:26:15,799
you were able to astra project into my office apparently

509
00:26:15,880 --> 00:26:18,599
earlier kind of fixed if it didn't work, so like

510
00:26:18,880 --> 00:26:19,880
you know you could figure it out.

511
00:26:21,960 --> 00:26:27,519
Speaker 5: Okay, Well, just to give you all idea if I

512
00:26:27,640 --> 00:26:31,799
were a god, you know, if I was, you do

513
00:26:31,960 --> 00:26:34,640
realize it's not a good ideas for the human ways

514
00:26:34,680 --> 00:26:37,000
to test my patients right because I'm.

515
00:26:39,200 --> 00:26:42,039
Speaker 3: We're testing your patience, Benjamin, what are you going to

516
00:26:42,119 --> 00:26:44,559
do about it? I'm standing, I'm standing here with my

517
00:26:44,640 --> 00:26:47,359
hands up in the air cause it to lightning. But

518
00:26:47,480 --> 00:26:51,839
come thor come on right now, I'm testing your patients.

519
00:26:52,119 --> 00:26:52,759
Let's do it.

520
00:26:55,240 --> 00:26:57,880
Speaker 2: I mean, I'm literally drinking holy water while I blasph him.

521
00:26:57,920 --> 00:27:01,599
Speaker 1: God, you're breaking the water.

522
00:27:01,680 --> 00:27:02,839
Speaker 5: It's not holy water.

523
00:27:04,440 --> 00:27:06,880
Speaker 2: It's in a bottle that says holy water.

524
00:27:07,799 --> 00:27:14,920
Speaker 3: It's not holy water, holy water? So you do how

525
00:27:14,920 --> 00:27:16,319
do you know it's not holy water?

526
00:27:16,640 --> 00:27:20,160
Speaker 6: If I couldn't make it weighing where you're at, you

527
00:27:20,240 --> 00:27:23,440
can still just dispve it is scientific, because you.

528
00:27:23,480 --> 00:27:25,960
Speaker 5: Know I told you I wouldn't.

529
00:27:27,160 --> 00:27:29,279
Speaker 1: I already told you if you if you make it rain,

530
00:27:30,240 --> 00:27:32,480
if you make it rain right now where I'm at,

531
00:27:32,599 --> 00:27:35,400
I won't blame it on science or nature. I'll believe

532
00:27:35,400 --> 00:27:38,240
that you did it.

533
00:27:38,440 --> 00:27:38,599
Speaker 5: No.

534
00:27:38,720 --> 00:27:40,000
Speaker 2: That's why be so believable.

535
00:27:42,319 --> 00:27:43,920
Speaker 1: That's why I keep saying, if you make it rain

536
00:27:44,000 --> 00:27:46,960
right now, I'm joining your cult. Tomorrow, I'm I'm burning

537
00:27:47,000 --> 00:27:49,000
down all my silver and gold.

538
00:27:49,359 --> 00:27:52,359
Speaker 3: You know, Ben, what it's coming across, what it's coming

539
00:27:52,359 --> 00:27:56,119
across as right now, It's like, well, I have this

540
00:27:56,640 --> 00:27:59,960
atmospheric like power to make it rain as long as

541
00:28:00,000 --> 00:28:02,720
as I know what the weather is. I can predict

542
00:28:02,720 --> 00:28:03,119
the weather.

543
00:28:03,440 --> 00:28:09,279
Speaker 5: And I know what weather is, I mean being able

544
00:28:09,279 --> 00:28:11,640
to make it wayne whenever. But I still have to

545
00:28:11,680 --> 00:28:14,359
know where the guys that so I can make it

546
00:28:14,400 --> 00:28:15,319
waging there I can't.

547
00:28:15,319 --> 00:28:18,400
Speaker 3: But then you literally said you literally said, can I

548
00:28:18,480 --> 00:28:21,160
make a vague prediction that it will rain at some

549
00:28:21,359 --> 00:28:24,960
point around you in the future, And like that's apparently

550
00:28:25,000 --> 00:28:27,480
supposed to be some kind of magic things. I also

551
00:28:27,559 --> 00:28:31,200
want to point out, Ben Ben Ben, I want to

552
00:28:31,240 --> 00:28:36,519
point out that Deuteronomy eighteen ten through twelve explicitly prohibits

553
00:28:36,559 --> 00:28:40,359
you from practicing divination, sorcery, uh and any other kind

554
00:28:40,400 --> 00:28:42,160
of magical x man ships?

555
00:28:42,680 --> 00:28:43,440
Speaker 5: Is it right?

556
00:28:43,759 --> 00:28:46,920
Speaker 3: Quick check? Justin Am I wrong about that?

557
00:28:46,960 --> 00:28:47,440
Speaker 2: I'm aware?

558
00:28:47,640 --> 00:28:50,240
Speaker 5: No, I know what it says. I know what it says,

559
00:28:50,480 --> 00:28:52,920
and it doesn't. Okay, I'm included from that.

560
00:28:53,279 --> 00:28:56,000
Speaker 3: Oh you're special? Well yeah, thank you?

561
00:28:56,319 --> 00:28:59,839
Speaker 5: Why that verse? Well, I mean, have you ever dealt

562
00:28:59,880 --> 00:29:00,799
with the saber winds?

563
00:29:02,599 --> 00:29:02,799
Speaker 9: What?

564
00:29:03,279 --> 00:29:05,519
Speaker 5: Why did you think people burn them at the steak

565
00:29:05,920 --> 00:29:09,759
which is the Massachusetts when they did when they did

566
00:29:09,799 --> 00:29:11,759
the witch they used.

567
00:29:11,559 --> 00:29:13,839
Speaker 1: Just a second, Benjamin, we're trying to figure out what

568
00:29:14,400 --> 00:29:16,160
We're trying to figure out what you just said before

569
00:29:16,160 --> 00:29:18,480
you move on. Yeah, so you started talking about the

570
00:29:18,720 --> 00:29:21,440
Salemwiches follow or diverse.

571
00:29:21,799 --> 00:29:25,720
Speaker 3: The witch trials. Okay, so the Salem witch Trials, a

572
00:29:25,720 --> 00:29:29,200
bunch of scared men decided to burn women at the

573
00:29:29,240 --> 00:29:32,039
steak because they were afraid of them. What what does

574
00:29:32,079 --> 00:29:34,880
this have to do with the like, how are you?

575
00:29:34,920 --> 00:29:38,200
How does that factory into you being excluded because you're

576
00:29:38,200 --> 00:29:38,720
not a woman.

577
00:29:39,079 --> 00:29:41,160
Speaker 5: No, no, No, that's not what I'm meant. I was

578
00:29:41,240 --> 00:29:43,119
just bringing it up to the facts that they used

579
00:29:43,119 --> 00:29:48,759
that vers witch Trials. The the reason I'm excluded would

580
00:29:48,839 --> 00:29:51,720
be because I don't fall into that category that the

581
00:29:51,920 --> 00:29:55,279
verses for. So that's why I'm included. But also.

582
00:29:56,839 --> 00:29:58,559
Speaker 2: I heard category roses.

583
00:29:58,839 --> 00:30:01,839
Speaker 5: Can you say that no category of so so the

584
00:30:01,920 --> 00:30:05,000
category of people that that was written for, I don't

585
00:30:05,079 --> 00:30:08,680
phone under. That's what I said. That is that.

586
00:30:08,759 --> 00:30:13,000
Speaker 2: Also because you're you're not a witch, you're a warlock?

587
00:30:14,960 --> 00:30:16,720
Speaker 5: Will I mean I'm a god?

588
00:30:16,799 --> 00:30:19,799
Speaker 3: I feel like that's a distinction with a difference there, Benjamin,

589
00:30:20,559 --> 00:30:25,039
But you're a god? Did you say I'm a god? Okay, okay,

590
00:30:25,279 --> 00:30:27,839
I don't think so I can.

591
00:30:28,359 --> 00:30:33,920
Speaker 1: Can I a question for you, Benjamin, because I'm really

592
00:30:34,039 --> 00:30:38,440
deeply intrigued by the idea that you have a unique

593
00:30:38,440 --> 00:30:41,440
interpretation of the Bible. And we spent a little bit

594
00:30:41,519 --> 00:30:44,640
of time trying to determine why we should care about

595
00:30:44,680 --> 00:30:45,400
your interpretation.

596
00:30:45,599 --> 00:30:48,039
Speaker 2: But I don't know if we're going to make a

597
00:30:48,039 --> 00:30:48,839
lot of room there.

598
00:30:50,000 --> 00:30:52,519
Speaker 1: I think we've demonstrated what we need to there, but

599
00:30:52,720 --> 00:30:56,240
I'm trying to figure out. I'm curious, what is your

600
00:30:56,440 --> 00:30:59,680
unique interpretation of the Bible that nobody else has that

601
00:30:59,720 --> 00:31:00,640
we know about.

602
00:31:00,759 --> 00:31:01,720
Speaker 5: Do you really want to know?

603
00:31:02,279 --> 00:31:03,440
Speaker 2: I'd be glad.

604
00:31:03,160 --> 00:31:07,519
Speaker 5: To know you. Well, the human wace killed Jesus and

605
00:31:07,640 --> 00:31:10,440
slandered him, and then the castolate toats made him. This

606
00:31:10,599 --> 00:31:13,920
high guy added to Twinity Mound half the books and

607
00:31:13,960 --> 00:31:17,160
the manuscripts that told history of it. And now they

608
00:31:17,200 --> 00:31:19,759
sit there in their temples and they say, and they

609
00:31:19,799 --> 00:31:23,519
have different interpretations of trap, and they argue amongst themselves,

610
00:31:23,559 --> 00:31:26,240
and you're going to end up destroying yourselves anyway. And

611
00:31:26,279 --> 00:31:29,000
they sit there and say, oh, well, Jesus and God

612
00:31:29,119 --> 00:31:32,359
is also in person with this book book anyway. And

613
00:31:32,640 --> 00:31:35,759
then the Bible was posed in the first place.

614
00:31:35,519 --> 00:31:40,920
Speaker 3: Ben, Ben, what do you fucking believe? That's what we

615
00:31:41,079 --> 00:31:44,039
want to know. What is your interpretation. I don't want

616
00:31:44,039 --> 00:31:47,119
to know what kind of like backstory you've got for

617
00:31:47,599 --> 00:31:50,720
you know, the Christian history or whatever. I just want

618
00:31:50,720 --> 00:31:53,559
to know what you fucking believe. Okay, could you please

619
00:31:53,599 --> 00:31:58,480
tell us, like, what's your interpretation of your of your God?

620
00:31:58,640 --> 00:31:59,920
And why is it the true one?

621
00:32:00,240 --> 00:32:06,599
Speaker 5: Okay? Jesus is not God. Jesus was a messenger. In fact,

622
00:32:06,680 --> 00:32:10,599
he even says it himself. And God is not all

623
00:32:10,640 --> 00:32:14,759
good because if he was good, there was evil in

624
00:32:14,799 --> 00:32:17,160
the world in the first place. Now, also, I'm going

625
00:32:17,200 --> 00:32:20,079
to add to that, in order for you to recognize

626
00:32:20,160 --> 00:32:23,480
good and something, you have to have something to compare

627
00:32:23,519 --> 00:32:25,920
it to. So, no matter what amount of good is

628
00:32:25,960 --> 00:32:28,400
in the world, there's still going to be darkness and evil.

629
00:32:28,599 --> 00:32:30,240
You can't have one without other.

630
00:32:30,559 --> 00:32:35,559
Speaker 1: So in so, I think verse ninety says that God

631
00:32:35,640 --> 00:32:38,920
is good to all. Does that not not imply that

632
00:32:38,960 --> 00:32:40,119
he's good to everybody?

633
00:32:40,440 --> 00:32:42,240
Speaker 2: And James says that.

634
00:32:43,759 --> 00:32:45,079
Speaker 5: The Malachonics was good.

635
00:32:45,640 --> 00:32:48,680
Speaker 2: No, That's what I'm saying is there's passing in the Bible.

636
00:32:49,599 --> 00:32:53,359
Speaker 1: It seemed to state that he is good, but when

637
00:32:53,359 --> 00:32:56,240
we look at his behavior, it seems pretty clear that

638
00:32:56,480 --> 00:32:57,160
he's not good.

639
00:32:57,799 --> 00:33:00,720
Speaker 5: Right, Well, that was my point. There you go, You

640
00:33:00,839 --> 00:33:04,240
have told me my opinion of God, right, just to clarify.

641
00:33:04,319 --> 00:33:07,839
Speaker 1: Okay, so I think so the Bible passages that say

642
00:33:07,839 --> 00:33:11,480
that God is good, they're not necessarily true.

643
00:33:11,680 --> 00:33:12,960
Speaker 2: They're like euphemisms.

644
00:33:13,720 --> 00:33:16,240
Speaker 5: Well they're lives, but oh.

645
00:33:16,160 --> 00:33:18,519
Speaker 2: Fair enough, we agree. Then yeah, those are lies.

646
00:33:18,599 --> 00:33:20,200
Speaker 1: Yeah, the part where it says God is like in

647
00:33:20,240 --> 00:33:23,720
Mark ten eighteen, when you know Jesus says, why do

648
00:33:23,759 --> 00:33:24,440
you call me good?

649
00:33:24,480 --> 00:33:26,799
Speaker 2: No one is good but God alone. That's just a lie.

650
00:33:27,240 --> 00:33:28,440
So Jesus tells lies.

651
00:33:28,640 --> 00:33:31,240
Speaker 5: I would say, I can say that, I would says

652
00:33:31,279 --> 00:33:32,880
not all good, if he's good at all?

653
00:33:33,200 --> 00:33:38,200
Speaker 1: But sure I could agree, what percentage good do you

654
00:33:38,200 --> 00:33:40,759
think he is? Like fifty percent good, twenty percent good?

655
00:33:40,960 --> 00:33:48,160
Speaker 3: Forty Just pull a number out of my ass real quick, okay, forty?

656
00:33:48,480 --> 00:33:51,119
Speaker 1: I mean I would I would lower that to maybe

657
00:33:51,920 --> 00:33:54,079
twenty percent at best. But still, I mean, that's a

658
00:33:54,119 --> 00:33:56,839
pretty huge admission that you're willing to say God is

659
00:33:56,839 --> 00:33:59,160
only forty percent good and he's sixty percent evil.

660
00:33:59,480 --> 00:34:03,039
Speaker 5: I mean, I mean, you do realize that nostage, which

661
00:34:03,079 --> 00:34:05,799
I am technically a gnostic to it at least that

662
00:34:06,400 --> 00:34:09,239
that God was evil.

663
00:34:09,519 --> 00:34:11,119
Speaker 10: I mean, I'm not going to go into the whole

664
00:34:11,280 --> 00:34:15,440
spirit crap, you know, body trapping the spirit bullshit. But

665
00:34:16,880 --> 00:34:19,880
as far as God being evil, yeah, I definitely believe

666
00:34:19,920 --> 00:34:22,119
that because if you look at the wold and you

667
00:34:22,159 --> 00:34:25,719
look at the universe and everything else, everything is designed

668
00:34:25,760 --> 00:34:27,480
to kill us, not give as life.

669
00:34:27,920 --> 00:34:30,760
Speaker 5: Right, there's there's not a there's not a fountain downtown,

670
00:34:30,840 --> 00:34:32,840
the fountain of views that I could drink plumb and

671
00:34:32,880 --> 00:34:36,159
stay you young forever. You know this, this.

672
00:34:36,280 --> 00:34:39,480
Speaker 6: Idea of oh, whoever's believe in to me is in

673
00:34:39,480 --> 00:34:41,679
our parents. But I have ever last in life that

674
00:34:41,760 --> 00:34:45,320
would really suck. I mean I could.

675
00:34:45,719 --> 00:34:49,320
Speaker 5: I can tell you from experience. I mean, hell, I've

676
00:34:49,320 --> 00:34:51,199
been around a very wrong time and I can.

677
00:34:51,159 --> 00:34:54,480
Speaker 6: Tell you it really did sucks.

678
00:34:54,559 --> 00:34:56,679
Speaker 5: Like if you talk about it, if you're if you're

679
00:34:56,719 --> 00:35:00,159
around for decades and you look the same and no

680
00:35:00,199 --> 00:35:02,840
one knows how long you've been around. Not only is

681
00:35:02,880 --> 00:35:06,840
your societal you know, stuff is going to be different

682
00:35:06,920 --> 00:35:09,599
because you've been around so long, and society things is

683
00:35:09,639 --> 00:35:12,599
over time, and you're still forty fifty years in the past,

684
00:35:13,039 --> 00:35:15,320
which is in my case. By the way, Hell, I'm

685
00:35:15,360 --> 00:35:16,960
used to the the m eighties.

686
00:35:17,400 --> 00:35:21,440
Speaker 1: But yeah, I just want to put a bow on

687
00:35:21,559 --> 00:35:24,440
the conversation. Then, so you're suggesting that parts of the

688
00:35:24,440 --> 00:35:25,559
Bible aren't true.

689
00:35:25,599 --> 00:35:28,039
Speaker 5: Well, yeah, definitely. I mean, hell, the Bible has been

690
00:35:28,199 --> 00:35:33,320
often in sains for decades centuries, so people so want

691
00:35:33,320 --> 00:35:34,800
to spend on it all the time. What do you

692
00:35:34,840 --> 00:35:36,280
think interpretations are?

693
00:35:36,599 --> 00:35:36,920
Speaker 2: Sure?

694
00:35:37,000 --> 00:35:39,320
Speaker 1: So why would you trust the Bible as opposed to

695
00:35:39,639 --> 00:35:43,639
the Quran or Debadas, well as far.

696
00:35:43,480 --> 00:35:46,400
Speaker 5: As the Tanak and the Kawan and the Bible and

697
00:35:47,440 --> 00:35:50,360
you know, all these other books that it's playing, you know,

698
00:35:50,599 --> 00:35:55,440
sort of the same stuff. I'd think that if I mean,

699
00:35:55,599 --> 00:35:57,760
I could argue, if you can buy in all of

700
00:35:57,800 --> 00:36:00,920
those and put all of it into one, you might

701
00:36:01,000 --> 00:36:03,760
have a chance at that point if you can discern

702
00:36:04,320 --> 00:36:08,960
you know, who's who on that. However, because everything is

703
00:36:09,039 --> 00:36:13,159
separated and half of it has been destroyed, and you

704
00:36:13,199 --> 00:36:16,119
know my point I was talking about earlier. The SATs

705
00:36:16,199 --> 00:36:19,559
I go to. They have no idea about the missing books.

706
00:36:19,559 --> 00:36:21,719
They have no well they know about the books, me not.

707
00:36:21,840 --> 00:36:25,039
They don't count it as cannon, and they right, no,

708
00:36:25,320 --> 00:36:27,719
sit there and throw and then they don't please in

709
00:36:27,840 --> 00:36:28,679
the actual.

710
00:36:28,400 --> 00:36:29,800
Speaker 2: Bible, Benjamin, you don't.

711
00:36:29,840 --> 00:36:32,519
Speaker 1: You don't have to, you know, preach to me about

712
00:36:32,559 --> 00:36:33,920
the apocryphal books.

713
00:36:33,920 --> 00:36:37,280
Speaker 2: I agree with you. They were canonical to the early Christians.

714
00:36:37,639 --> 00:36:41,119
Speaker 1: They were canonical to the Church for the first seventeen

715
00:36:41,679 --> 00:36:43,079
until the seventeenth century.

716
00:36:45,159 --> 00:36:47,199
Speaker 2: So like, yeah, I'm with you, I'm with you.

717
00:36:47,800 --> 00:36:50,280
Speaker 1: But aside from that, what I'm trying to figure out

718
00:36:50,320 --> 00:36:52,119
is if we have this book that is so full

719
00:36:52,119 --> 00:36:55,440
of errors, so full of things that are incorrect, like

720
00:36:55,519 --> 00:36:58,039
what is the tool that we're using to figure out

721
00:36:58,079 --> 00:37:01,239
which parts are correct? And if a bunch of it's incorrect,

722
00:37:01,239 --> 00:37:02,880
why would I trust it at all? Why wouldn't I

723
00:37:02,960 --> 00:37:05,239
just throw it out and say, oh, this is another

724
00:37:05,679 --> 00:37:06,679
book of mythology.

725
00:37:07,320 --> 00:37:10,679
Speaker 5: Well, see, it's interesting you bring that up, because when

726
00:37:10,719 --> 00:37:13,800
I bought up that same point, they said, oh, well

727
00:37:13,840 --> 00:37:16,519
the books of Eno and all these other books alone,

728
00:37:16,599 --> 00:37:19,000
but this what we have here is white. And I

729
00:37:19,039 --> 00:37:21,559
didn't want to be an asshole and say, well, that's

730
00:37:21,639 --> 00:37:24,440
just you know, that's no, that's not how that works,

731
00:37:24,639 --> 00:37:26,880
you know. And uh I knew it was a I

732
00:37:26,960 --> 00:37:32,159
know it was a a thinking gearer, A I'll see,

733
00:37:32,239 --> 00:37:34,559
what the hell you gona call those, but I knew

734
00:37:34,599 --> 00:37:36,280
it was one of those, but I couldn't thank the

735
00:37:36,360 --> 00:37:38,840
damn name of it, so I couldn't really tell you

736
00:37:39,079 --> 00:37:42,039
what the name of it was. No, No, the uh

737
00:37:42,400 --> 00:37:44,880
SO saying that the book that what they have is

738
00:37:44,920 --> 00:37:47,280
white but the other stuff is wrong based on their

739
00:37:47,280 --> 00:37:56,079
opinion that that there we go atification fallacy. I believe, yeah,

740
00:37:56,320 --> 00:37:59,360
the so so. Basically when they said that, I was

741
00:37:59,440 --> 00:38:02,800
kind of done with them because I could sit here

742
00:38:03,159 --> 00:38:05,880
and say, you know, you don't have all the books,

743
00:38:05,920 --> 00:38:08,679
you don't have the full pitcher, which they don't. You know,

744
00:38:08,800 --> 00:38:11,320
no one really does now because it's too late to

745
00:38:11,360 --> 00:38:11,719
get it.

746
00:38:12,000 --> 00:38:15,480
Speaker 1: Essentially, sure, but yeah, but we're not here to argue

747
00:38:15,480 --> 00:38:15,920
about that.

748
00:38:16,039 --> 00:38:19,039
Speaker 2: We're we're not We're not We're not.

749
00:38:19,000 --> 00:38:21,920
Speaker 1: Concerned about the canon. That's not something we're concerned about.

750
00:38:21,960 --> 00:38:23,719
We can just agree with you there and move on.

751
00:38:24,480 --> 00:38:28,360
But listen, we spent some time talking, and we've had

752
00:38:28,440 --> 00:38:30,840
Adam waiting in the queue for a while being patient.

753
00:38:31,280 --> 00:38:33,679
So I want to make sure Adam gets a chance

754
00:38:33,760 --> 00:38:37,079
to come on and have a conversation with us. But Benjamin,

755
00:38:37,079 --> 00:38:38,679
you've been a lot of fun to talk to. Please

756
00:38:38,719 --> 00:38:41,239
do come back. It was very enjoyable for me. I

757
00:38:41,480 --> 00:38:43,639
hope it was enjoyable for you as well.

758
00:38:44,039 --> 00:38:47,800
Speaker 5: I mean I had fun you in Alabama, right, so

759
00:38:47,920 --> 00:38:50,559
you know how the weather is here anyway? I mean,

760
00:38:50,880 --> 00:38:55,679
but yeah, yeah, I don't. You know. I was trying

761
00:38:55,679 --> 00:38:58,159
to help these people out by pizzing them, but they

762
00:38:58,199 --> 00:39:00,760
have their own opinions and really, you know, and then

763
00:39:00,800 --> 00:39:02,840
they even said, oh, it just comes down to fate,

764
00:39:03,000 --> 00:39:05,000
which you know, again, I didn't want to be an ass,

765
00:39:05,280 --> 00:39:08,079
but that's what they literally said, like, oh, it comes

766
00:39:08,119 --> 00:39:10,440
down to face about what you believe, and goda YadA,

767
00:39:10,480 --> 00:39:12,880
got it. And I'm sending me here like, well, all

768
00:39:12,960 --> 00:39:15,840
that is is opinion. You know you don't all you

769
00:39:16,000 --> 00:39:19,679
have is basically taking it on its word blind face,

770
00:39:20,639 --> 00:39:21,559
definite end of that.

771
00:39:21,840 --> 00:39:27,280
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, Ben, Ben, I well I've got so we

772
00:39:27,320 --> 00:39:29,800
can go after this. But I've got the perfect solution

773
00:39:29,960 --> 00:39:33,199
for you. Okay, the next time you're going to a

774
00:39:33,280 --> 00:39:35,639
church or something like that and you want to convince

775
00:39:35,679 --> 00:39:38,960
people that hey, I know what I'm talking about. This

776
00:39:39,280 --> 00:39:42,280
is like what you believe is wrong and what I'm

777
00:39:42,320 --> 00:39:44,239
about to tell you is right. What you need to

778
00:39:44,239 --> 00:39:47,920
do raise your hand up in the air. Snap caused

779
00:39:48,000 --> 00:39:52,159
lightning to like fire off all around you and then

780
00:39:52,480 --> 00:39:56,320
unsnap and then have an eclipse go across the sky

781
00:39:56,719 --> 00:40:00,280
and then snap again, and you're like, believe me, mother fucker,

782
00:40:00,639 --> 00:40:04,559
And then they probably will they You'll start they'll start

783
00:40:04,599 --> 00:40:07,039
worshiping you. I mean, if you are, if you are

784
00:40:07,679 --> 00:40:11,159
the real world Marvel's version of Storm, then you know

785
00:40:11,239 --> 00:40:13,880
that should be an easy thing to do. You could

786
00:40:13,960 --> 00:40:16,360
top it off by remote viewing and being like, oh,

787
00:40:16,440 --> 00:40:19,559
I totally see what you know somebody is doing in

788
00:40:19,639 --> 00:40:22,280
the house down the street, and then you know they'll

789
00:40:22,280 --> 00:40:23,840
believe you. I'm just saying.

790
00:40:25,199 --> 00:40:27,719
Speaker 5: That. And then even if I even if I had

791
00:40:27,880 --> 00:40:29,840
liked me go all the way with me with clouds

792
00:40:29,880 --> 00:40:32,519
and storms and everything else, but in a few minutes,

793
00:40:32,679 --> 00:40:35,960
you know that they still would just dismiss it. I mean,

794
00:40:35,960 --> 00:40:39,199
I'd say, these people are so adoptinated. Even if I

795
00:40:39,239 --> 00:40:41,280
did do all that stuff, it would either stand the

796
00:40:41,320 --> 00:40:43,480
hell out of them or they would try to kill me.

797
00:40:43,599 --> 00:40:46,320
Speaker 3: Well you know, I mean right, I mean there's one

798
00:40:46,320 --> 00:40:48,679
of two options there, And I mean they either believe

799
00:40:48,719 --> 00:40:51,159
you or they you know, light yourats on fire on

800
00:40:51,199 --> 00:40:53,920
a steak. So I mean, just you know, roll that dice,

801
00:40:54,199 --> 00:40:55,039
roll for initiative.

802
00:40:55,039 --> 00:40:58,239
Speaker 1: But but listen, Ben, it was great to talk to you.

803
00:40:58,320 --> 00:41:00,519
We gotta we gotta move forward and the show, but

804
00:41:00,920 --> 00:41:02,480
thank you for being here and do come back.

805
00:41:02,800 --> 00:41:04,840
Speaker 6: Yeah, I'm tried to call on time.

806
00:41:04,920 --> 00:41:07,679
Speaker 5: I didn't know what time the show started, but it was.

807
00:41:08,360 --> 00:41:09,320
Speaker 3: Been yet raptured.

808
00:41:11,920 --> 00:41:14,239
Speaker 1: The weather might have came in and dropped his call.

809
00:41:14,280 --> 00:41:14,960
Speaker 2: It seems like.

810
00:41:15,239 --> 00:41:16,920
Speaker 3: You know, he you know what he probably did. He

811
00:41:17,239 --> 00:41:20,119
flicked his finger and that caused a storm to appear

812
00:41:20,280 --> 00:41:22,800
and like caused his call to drop. That's what happened.

813
00:41:23,039 --> 00:41:24,360
It happens to me every day.

814
00:41:25,000 --> 00:41:27,199
Speaker 1: Let's grab a couple of super chats and then we'll

815
00:41:27,199 --> 00:41:30,400
get Adam on the line. Well we can just rotate

816
00:41:30,400 --> 00:41:32,639
take turns. Here we've got a super chat from our

817
00:41:32,679 --> 00:41:33,800
friend cohoto Kun.

818
00:41:33,920 --> 00:41:35,519
Speaker 2: Great to see you. Thank you for the super chat.

819
00:41:35,559 --> 00:41:38,920
Speaker 1: It says Doug approves of eating your kids as long

820
00:41:38,960 --> 00:41:40,159
as their sour patch.

821
00:41:40,320 --> 00:41:40,519
Speaker 9: Kind.

822
00:41:40,920 --> 00:41:43,920
Speaker 1: Yes, I can confirm, as a profit of Doug the

823
00:41:43,960 --> 00:41:46,079
only kids you're allowed to eat our sour patch.

824
00:41:46,800 --> 00:41:49,840
Speaker 3: All right, are we How many are we reading? Just

825
00:41:50,000 --> 00:41:50,400
a few?

826
00:41:51,039 --> 00:41:53,920
Speaker 1: Let's go, let's down.

827
00:41:54,440 --> 00:41:57,159
Speaker 2: We'll end on doctor Joe's super chat.

828
00:41:57,480 --> 00:42:02,280
Speaker 3: Okay, cool, So next is Dasa's concubine, who says, today

829
00:42:02,280 --> 00:42:04,760
the prophets woke me and told me to don a

830
00:42:04,840 --> 00:42:08,480
leather mask with steel zippers. She then said that we

831
00:42:08,519 --> 00:42:12,599
would be making we would quote make pleasing aromas for

832
00:42:12,679 --> 00:42:16,159
the Lord. I cursed the day my dad, John the Baptist,

833
00:42:16,199 --> 00:42:16,559
sold me.

834
00:42:17,280 --> 00:42:20,280
Speaker 1: There's a lot of inside jokes happen in there, but.

835
00:42:22,280 --> 00:42:24,280
Speaker 2: You can YouTube Hadasa and find out.

836
00:42:24,679 --> 00:42:27,920
Speaker 1: Libra the Skeptic, thank you for the Supertestas Benjamin, I

837
00:42:27,960 --> 00:42:30,800
can tell when a storm is coming. It's called phantom pain.

838
00:42:31,400 --> 00:42:34,840
Now remote view what's in the room I'm in. I

839
00:42:34,880 --> 00:42:37,039
think you're the mail storm.

840
00:42:37,639 --> 00:42:38,079
Speaker 5: Yeah.

841
00:42:38,119 --> 00:42:41,199
Speaker 3: So I for everybody that was wondering what was in

842
00:42:41,239 --> 00:42:44,119
my left hand that I wanted him to guess, it

843
00:42:44,199 --> 00:42:48,960
was a bear, you know, I take the top bottle opener.

844
00:42:49,000 --> 00:42:52,599
Thank you, Han, but just in in my face. Yes,

845
00:42:53,000 --> 00:42:55,559
I got that as a present from somebody, from my wife.

846
00:42:57,400 --> 00:43:00,519
That's what I was holding. He would have not figured

847
00:43:00,519 --> 00:43:04,239
that out all right. Next from the liber skeptic, thank

848
00:43:04,280 --> 00:43:07,760
you so much for the super chat, says it's his

849
00:43:08,400 --> 00:43:12,400
fruits of the spirit with a bunch of laughy cry faces.

850
00:43:12,920 --> 00:43:15,239
Speaker 1: Indeed, you know what he had. At least he was

851
00:43:15,239 --> 00:43:18,719
pleasant to talk to. He had some of those spiritual fruits.

852
00:43:19,639 --> 00:43:22,480
Our friend Masthamchetier with a super chat. Thank you so much,

853
00:43:22,519 --> 00:43:27,440
says I predict Doug makes me as hard as petrified would,

854
00:43:27,519 --> 00:43:30,559
and indeed Doug would make you rock hard absolutely. In fact,

855
00:43:30,559 --> 00:43:33,079
they're watching over us, Doug and Sharon Stone behind me.

856
00:43:35,920 --> 00:43:39,039
Speaker 3: Next, Libro the Skeptic says, best way to start my

857
00:43:39,159 --> 00:43:43,159
workshift hearing this guy.

858
00:43:45,000 --> 00:43:47,679
Speaker 1: That's definitely a good form of entertainment. And last for

859
00:43:47,760 --> 00:43:50,079
now from our friend doctor Joe. Great to see your friend,

860
00:43:50,119 --> 00:43:54,039
says Color doesn't seem to understand idiom splitting hairs and

861
00:43:54,159 --> 00:43:58,079
testing my patients. Also, I'm in Austin now, o's ry.

862
00:43:58,239 --> 00:44:01,320
I knew you were in the Austin area. Actor Joe, Well, listen,

863
00:44:01,400 --> 00:44:04,800
you should stop in at the Free Thought Library and

864
00:44:05,079 --> 00:44:07,639
join some of the people that are like live watching

865
00:44:07,880 --> 00:44:10,280
the show. That'd be a lot of fun. I think

866
00:44:10,280 --> 00:44:12,519
that's our our last for now. We'll read more superchecks

867
00:44:12,639 --> 00:44:16,480
at the end. Let's get Adam into the show. And

868
00:44:17,000 --> 00:44:21,400
Adam is from Alabama. Again this this is a popular

869
00:44:22,199 --> 00:44:24,960
place to be appairly and Adam is asking, what is

870
00:44:25,000 --> 00:44:28,639
the purpose of this show? Nice, I'll let John go

871
00:44:28,760 --> 00:44:31,920
first because I've got some things to say.

872
00:44:32,079 --> 00:44:34,440
Speaker 3: Yeah, So, Adam, I mean, is that pretty much just

873
00:44:34,480 --> 00:44:36,320
what you want to ask is like, what's the point

874
00:44:36,320 --> 00:44:36,719
of all this?

875
00:44:37,039 --> 00:44:37,360
Speaker 5: Oh?

876
00:44:37,519 --> 00:44:41,119
Speaker 7: Yeah, and I could get in to you know, my

877
00:44:42,519 --> 00:44:47,039
in different kind of not necessarily in difference, but my

878
00:44:47,360 --> 00:44:51,119
position is there intelligence in the divine?

879
00:44:51,360 --> 00:44:55,519
Speaker 3: Okay, Well, so just to answer your initial question here,

880
00:44:55,559 --> 00:44:58,400
what's the purpose of the show. It is to you know,

881
00:44:58,880 --> 00:45:03,159
provide theists and other others out there that want to

882
00:45:03,159 --> 00:45:06,840
ask us questions, like both theists and atheists that want

883
00:45:06,840 --> 00:45:12,360
to call in and have conversations with atheists in the community. Uh,

884
00:45:12,599 --> 00:45:15,719
maybe they have questions that they need answered, or you know,

885
00:45:15,920 --> 00:45:20,000
like you heard earlier, just some you know, weird ideas

886
00:45:20,039 --> 00:45:23,000
about the religious belief and all this stuff. So, I mean,

887
00:45:23,000 --> 00:45:25,719
there's multiple reasons why people call in, and we're just

888
00:45:25,760 --> 00:45:29,840
sort of providing the opportunity for people to have a conversation,

889
00:45:30,159 --> 00:45:34,559
a nice civil conversation, usually with somebody that doesn't believe

890
00:45:34,599 --> 00:45:37,559
in God. So that's that's at least why I'm here.

891
00:45:37,800 --> 00:45:41,119
Speaker 1: Yeah, you know, the only thing I would add is, see,

892
00:45:41,119 --> 00:45:43,199
the only thing I would add is I think the

893
00:45:43,280 --> 00:45:48,239
show is important because for some people their introduction into

894
00:45:48,320 --> 00:45:54,039
critical thinking and or you know, rational thought processes is

895
00:45:54,079 --> 00:45:56,880
by watching a debate, like they've heard something all their lives,

896
00:45:56,920 --> 00:45:59,800
but they've never heard opposition to it, And we're providing

897
00:45:59,880 --> 00:46:03,320
up platform to give a robust debate from both sides

898
00:46:03,639 --> 00:46:06,159
of the aisle on the God concept. And I think

899
00:46:06,159 --> 00:46:08,159
for a lot of people these debates are really helpful

900
00:46:08,280 --> 00:46:12,519
informing their their critical thinking skills. And I also believe

901
00:46:12,559 --> 00:46:16,039
that people's beliefs are important because they act on their beliefs.

902
00:46:16,559 --> 00:46:20,119
And so we live in a society where people believe

903
00:46:20,159 --> 00:46:22,800
in God. They're going to act on these beliefs in God,

904
00:46:22,840 --> 00:46:25,199
and they're going to do things in accordance with their religion.

905
00:46:25,639 --> 00:46:28,599
And if they are harming others, then I think the

906
00:46:28,639 --> 00:46:31,159
best thing we can do is teach them how to

907
00:46:31,199 --> 00:46:35,119
think critically and move away from their harmful religious viewpoints.

908
00:46:35,440 --> 00:46:38,239
Speaker 2: Sorry to interrupt you them you would.

909
00:46:38,039 --> 00:46:43,199
Speaker 7: Say that all religious viewpoints are all? Say would you

910
00:46:43,320 --> 00:46:46,760
say that they're all Would you just say that bad

911
00:46:46,880 --> 00:46:48,920
beliefs or to that effect.

912
00:46:49,320 --> 00:46:55,519
Speaker 1: No, I don't think all religious views are hearently dangerous.

913
00:46:55,840 --> 00:46:58,679
Speaker 7: What that God believe? What that God believe? In the

914
00:46:58,760 --> 00:47:01,880
form of call, was he a Christian. I couldn't hardly

915
00:47:02,000 --> 00:47:07,880
telling like that rambled on for about forty so.

916
00:47:08,119 --> 00:47:08,719
Speaker 5: He might.

917
00:47:13,079 --> 00:47:16,960
Speaker 3: Out of Adam adam. Uh sorry is because he started

918
00:47:17,000 --> 00:47:20,079
getting louder when I was trying to interrupt him. So

919
00:47:20,639 --> 00:47:24,199
I mean, I get the you know, want to maybe

920
00:47:24,480 --> 00:47:27,119
uh talk about the previous caller, and I think he

921
00:47:27,199 --> 00:47:29,119
seemed to be Christian and everything like that, but he's

922
00:47:29,159 --> 00:47:32,119
not here to really defend himself or really further explain

923
00:47:32,559 --> 00:47:36,360
his marvel abilities. But so maybe we could, you know,

924
00:47:36,599 --> 00:47:39,360
kind of focus on what you want to talk about, uh,

925
00:47:39,480 --> 00:47:42,159
And I mean I'm kind of curious about.

926
00:47:41,960 --> 00:47:46,239
Speaker 7: That about about rather watch Paint Drive and listen to

927
00:47:46,280 --> 00:47:49,320
that boot again. But at any rate, you know, my

928
00:47:49,480 --> 00:47:55,000
position on is like an agnostic agnostic which has deals

929
00:47:55,039 --> 00:47:59,039
with the igism, which you know, God has come to

930
00:47:59,239 --> 00:48:03,679
ambig Einstein pretty much said the same, So I don't

931
00:48:03,719 --> 00:48:07,639
know how you could, you know, I think it's a

932
00:48:07,800 --> 00:48:13,079
term that could mean literally anything. But like the agnostic

933
00:48:13,239 --> 00:48:18,199
part is, I take that scientific neutrality as any hypositive

934
00:48:18,320 --> 00:48:23,159
senior dudes. And so therefore, to believe or disbelieve in

935
00:48:23,199 --> 00:48:28,039
a God, I think we have limited information. Like Ironstein said,

936
00:48:28,159 --> 00:48:32,320
it was like a child and a library filled full

937
00:48:32,360 --> 00:48:36,880
of books of different languages. A child can't understand but

938
00:48:37,039 --> 00:48:41,960
see some mysterious might perceive some mysterious order.

939
00:48:45,800 --> 00:48:46,159
Speaker 5: I think.

940
00:48:47,679 --> 00:48:49,400
Speaker 7: Okay, I know y'all like to talk.

941
00:48:50,159 --> 00:48:52,960
Speaker 3: Well, I mean, we we've been allowing you to talk, Adam,

942
00:48:53,039 --> 00:48:55,559
and I just wanted to get a word in edge

943
00:48:55,800 --> 00:49:06,559
was okay five minutes, y'all dream okay, Uh anyways, uh,

944
00:49:08,039 --> 00:49:12,039
you know, just coming from my perspective here, if I

945
00:49:12,039 --> 00:49:15,159
if I don't have like an active belief in a god,

946
00:49:15,519 --> 00:49:18,840
then that means that I don't actively believe in a god,

947
00:49:19,000 --> 00:49:21,920
which makes me an atheist. Now, I do characterize myself

948
00:49:21,960 --> 00:49:25,320
as an agnostic atheist. So it seems to me like

949
00:49:25,360 --> 00:49:28,639
you're trying to draw a distinction about this middle ground,

950
00:49:28,679 --> 00:49:31,480
pure middle ground of agnosticism, which I'm not trying to,

951
00:49:32,280 --> 00:49:35,239
you know, tell you how you should label yourself. I'm just,

952
00:49:35,519 --> 00:49:39,719
I guess, clarifying my misunderstanding with your position, because it

953
00:49:39,800 --> 00:49:42,519
seems like what you're saying is that like you're taking

954
00:49:42,559 --> 00:49:45,760
the very the null hypothesis there on whether or not

955
00:49:45,760 --> 00:49:48,239
a God exists, and that makes you like a pure agnostic.

956
00:49:48,280 --> 00:49:50,400
But I'm just kind of curious as to why you

957
00:49:50,400 --> 00:49:54,320
wouldn't classify yourself as an atheist because all that means

958
00:49:54,360 --> 00:49:56,559
is that you just don't actively believe in a god.

959
00:49:58,519 --> 00:50:03,480
Speaker 7: But about you allow me to extrapolaid up on my position.

960
00:50:03,880 --> 00:50:06,760
Seems like I can't talk for a minute at a time.

961
00:50:07,039 --> 00:50:09,960
Speaker 1: Well, I think he's trying to clarify your position, So

962
00:50:10,599 --> 00:50:13,000
he's not trying to interrupt you. It's just that in

963
00:50:13,079 --> 00:50:15,960
order for you to explain your position, sometimes we need

964
00:50:16,000 --> 00:50:18,679
clarification when you say things, and if you say a

965
00:50:18,679 --> 00:50:22,280
lot of things, then we end up having to take

966
00:50:22,280 --> 00:50:23,800
you all the way back to the point where we

967
00:50:23,840 --> 00:50:27,800
need a clarification. So conciseness is Helpfulward, I guess he's

968
00:50:27,800 --> 00:50:30,199
trying to figure out is it sounds like you might

969
00:50:30,239 --> 00:50:32,880
actually be kind of like an atheist as opposed to

970
00:50:32,960 --> 00:50:35,079
an agnostic, because do you believe in a god or

971
00:50:35,079 --> 00:50:36,079
do you not believe in a God?

972
00:50:36,440 --> 00:50:41,079
Speaker 7: I neither have say nor disbelief in a god. Atheists

973
00:50:41,239 --> 00:50:45,880
don't have a disbelief and intelligence in the design it Really,

974
00:50:46,000 --> 00:50:50,119
I think you should focus on the design aspect of it,

975
00:50:50,159 --> 00:50:52,239
because I don't know that you might not be able

976
00:50:52,280 --> 00:50:57,159
to directly observe, you know, a creator, especially if the

977
00:50:57,199 --> 00:51:01,440
creator existed outside the universe always, Yeah, I don't know.

978
00:51:01,559 --> 00:51:05,440
I think it's just beyond our comprehension as God. As

979
00:51:05,519 --> 00:51:06,840
one explain.

980
00:51:07,599 --> 00:51:10,159
Speaker 1: So if you if you don't believe in a God,

981
00:51:10,480 --> 00:51:14,199
that means you have disbelief in a god he said

982
00:51:14,199 --> 00:51:18,199
you you said you have no disbelief and no belief,

983
00:51:18,480 --> 00:51:23,320
but those are no actually two opposites, Like, if you

984
00:51:23,360 --> 00:51:26,079
don't believe in God, that means you have a disbelief.

985
00:51:26,400 --> 00:51:28,920
Speaker 7: And I know you'd like me to be an atheist,

986
00:51:29,039 --> 00:51:32,679
but no, I maintain neither faith nor disbelief.

987
00:51:32,880 --> 00:51:35,480
Speaker 1: So you're saying that if you don't, if you don't

988
00:51:35,480 --> 00:51:39,239
believe in a God, that means you're an atheist.

989
00:51:39,360 --> 00:51:42,519
Speaker 7: Can I finish speaking for like twenty seconds?

990
00:51:42,719 --> 00:51:46,639
Speaker 2: You know, Well, we're just trying to define a word.

991
00:51:47,159 --> 00:51:50,880
Speaker 1: No, right, like you see how like I'm responding to

992
00:51:50,920 --> 00:51:53,960
you in very short sentences, like very concisely.

993
00:51:54,000 --> 00:51:56,119
Speaker 2: I'm just trying to get the word defined before we

994
00:51:56,199 --> 00:51:56,519
move on.

995
00:51:56,719 --> 00:52:00,719
Speaker 1: Right, So what does it mean to a belief in

996
00:52:00,800 --> 00:52:02,679
something agnostic?

997
00:52:02,880 --> 00:52:08,000
Speaker 7: There's three physicians here agnostic and what see you use

998
00:52:08,159 --> 00:52:12,239
the term agnostic as an adjective if you say agnostic

999
00:52:12,480 --> 00:52:16,280
atheist or an agnostic theist you could be either an

1000
00:52:16,360 --> 00:52:20,719
agnostic atheist or an agnostic theist. That just means you're

1001
00:52:20,719 --> 00:52:24,199
not one hundred percent you say you're a gnostic athe

1002
00:52:24,480 --> 00:52:29,719
you're a gnostic fast then you're one hundred percent certain

1003
00:52:29,800 --> 00:52:30,639
of your position.

1004
00:52:30,880 --> 00:52:32,440
Speaker 5: And that's an adjective. Use.

1005
00:52:32,559 --> 00:52:37,039
Speaker 7: I'm talking about agnostic the noun. Yes, I'm very familiar

1006
00:52:37,119 --> 00:52:37,320
with that.

1007
00:52:37,320 --> 00:52:40,360
Speaker 1: That's why we're That's why we're defining the words, because

1008
00:52:40,960 --> 00:52:43,800
what it means to be agnostic, it just means to

1009
00:52:43,880 --> 00:52:51,159
be without without knowledge of the God. Right Ah in

1010
00:52:51,280 --> 00:52:55,880
Greek just means to be without and gnosis is the

1011
00:52:55,960 --> 00:52:59,039
knowledge you lack, the knowledge or the belief in a god.

1012
00:53:00,280 --> 00:53:03,199
Speaker 7: Sounds like a manipulating basic definitions.

1013
00:53:03,239 --> 00:53:03,880
Speaker 5: You want me to.

1014
00:53:03,840 --> 00:53:04,400
Speaker 7: Look it up.

1015
00:53:04,679 --> 00:53:07,519
Speaker 1: That's just that's just what it means.

1016
00:53:07,320 --> 00:53:08,639
Speaker 2: It's a Greek term.

1017
00:53:09,199 --> 00:53:13,400
Speaker 7: Now let's read the real Now, let's read the real definition.

1018
00:53:13,599 --> 00:53:17,199
Hold up, let me let me find the actual definition

1019
00:53:17,360 --> 00:53:22,599
of the word. This is ridiculous, okay, agnostic.

1020
00:53:21,960 --> 00:53:22,559
Speaker 5: For you here?

1021
00:53:23,119 --> 00:53:24,880
Speaker 2: If it comes from which language?

1022
00:53:25,079 --> 00:53:25,679
Speaker 5: A person?

1023
00:53:25,960 --> 00:53:29,079
Speaker 7: Again, I say this for like thirty seconds, will you

1024
00:53:29,159 --> 00:53:29,920
let it?

1025
00:53:30,000 --> 00:53:31,360
Speaker 6: I mean, come on, A.

1026
00:53:31,360 --> 00:53:34,880
Speaker 7: Person who believes that nothing is known or can be known,

1027
00:53:34,960 --> 00:53:37,000
of the existence or nature of God.

1028
00:53:37,119 --> 00:53:37,880
Speaker 5: No, that's not.

1029
00:53:38,239 --> 00:53:42,199
Speaker 7: And then a person who claims neither faith nor disbelief

1030
00:53:42,360 --> 00:53:46,320
in God. That's separated by semi colon. Those are two

1031
00:53:46,440 --> 00:53:51,119
different perspectives. I'm not the first. That's the second part

1032
00:53:51,159 --> 00:53:55,880
of that definition. A person who claims neither faith nor

1033
00:53:56,079 --> 00:54:00,679
disbelief in God or intelligence in the design. And I'm

1034
00:54:00,760 --> 00:54:04,599
adding the intelligence in the design because if you established

1035
00:54:05,000 --> 00:54:09,760
intelligence in the divine, then Adam stablished designer.

1036
00:54:10,119 --> 00:54:10,519
Speaker 3: Adam.

1037
00:54:10,800 --> 00:54:13,199
Speaker 7: I don't know why you think it's can I, Adam?

1038
00:54:13,400 --> 00:54:13,559
Speaker 5: Can?

1039
00:54:13,599 --> 00:54:17,119
Speaker 3: I ask a question real quick? Do you believe in God?

1040
00:54:19,000 --> 00:54:23,800
Speaker 7: I neither have faith nor disbelieve. Do you disbelieve God?

1041
00:54:23,960 --> 00:54:27,559
Do you disbelieve intelligence design? If you do, you may

1042
00:54:27,639 --> 00:54:29,920
be an atheist and not an agnostic.

1043
00:54:30,159 --> 00:54:34,320
Speaker 3: You know I can be both, do you I am?

1044
00:54:34,639 --> 00:54:38,480
I am both? Adam? Adam, I am both. I am

1045
00:54:38,519 --> 00:54:41,679
an agnostic atheist. I do not know whether or not

1046
00:54:42,320 --> 00:54:45,840
God exists, but I do not believe in one. So

1047
00:54:45,960 --> 00:54:49,760
that is what makes me an agnostic atheist. I get

1048
00:54:49,800 --> 00:54:52,519
that you want to play a dictionary game, and maybe

1049
00:54:52,599 --> 00:54:57,559
you're going to like the Stanford like, uh, philosophy dictionary

1050
00:54:57,679 --> 00:55:02,559
or whatnot? For what this specifically? An atheist in those

1051
00:55:02,639 --> 00:55:05,760
kind of conversations. But we're talking about a colloquial use

1052
00:55:05,840 --> 00:55:08,719
of these words. And in a colloquial use of these words,

1053
00:55:08,920 --> 00:55:12,599
agnostic means that you just simply don't know. Well, atheist

1054
00:55:12,800 --> 00:55:14,519
means that you don't believe.

1055
00:55:14,360 --> 00:55:17,719
Speaker 1: Right, And to be sure, in the dictionary, the definition

1056
00:55:17,880 --> 00:55:21,760
of disbelief is a lack of faith or the inability

1057
00:55:21,840 --> 00:55:25,000
or the refusal to accept something is true. So you

1058
00:55:25,079 --> 00:55:28,719
can't say that you are without faith, and then you

1059
00:55:28,800 --> 00:55:32,920
are also not disbelieving. If you are without faith, you

1060
00:55:33,079 --> 00:55:36,280
are disbelieving. So if you don't believe in a God,

1061
00:55:36,360 --> 00:55:38,280
that means you have a disbelief in God according to

1062
00:55:38,280 --> 00:55:38,880
the definition.

1063
00:55:39,599 --> 00:55:42,440
Speaker 7: All right, can I ask you guys a question? And

1064
00:55:43,960 --> 00:55:46,199
I think I can? Okay, I think I can. I

1065
00:55:46,280 --> 00:55:47,599
think I can, I think I can.

1066
00:55:47,960 --> 00:55:48,280
Speaker 5: Okay.

1067
00:55:48,360 --> 00:55:53,280
Speaker 7: Let's see here, So atheism is what a fact? Is

1068
00:55:54,440 --> 00:55:57,760
atheism a fact? To you guys? If so, have you

1069
00:55:57,960 --> 00:55:58,639
established that?

1070
00:55:59,320 --> 00:56:00,800
Speaker 3: Oh my god, I don't even know.

1071
00:56:02,079 --> 00:56:04,159
Speaker 2: Yeah, atheism is a lack of belief.

1072
00:56:05,800 --> 00:56:09,800
Speaker 7: You know, you you believe there's no intelligence in the design.

1073
00:56:09,920 --> 00:56:13,480
I know that you can't believe there's intelligence in the design.

1074
00:56:13,559 --> 00:56:14,400
Speaker 5: That's a claim.

1075
00:56:14,559 --> 00:56:17,960
Speaker 7: By the way, if you say, no intelligence in the design.

1076
00:56:18,079 --> 00:56:21,760
How you established that? You know, any claim has to

1077
00:56:21,800 --> 00:56:24,639
meet the burden if there's a burden, but burden of

1078
00:56:24,800 --> 00:56:27,239
proof is a legal term, it would.

1079
00:56:26,960 --> 00:56:28,320
Speaker 1: Be only we haven't made a claim.

1080
00:56:28,559 --> 00:56:32,599
Speaker 3: You're talking, yeah, Adam, We've yet to make a claim

1081
00:56:32,599 --> 00:56:36,199
about anything. You're the one that has been making claims,

1082
00:56:37,559 --> 00:56:41,320
just by the way you continuously like yelling in order

1083
00:56:41,360 --> 00:56:43,559
to like talk over us. I mean, I get that

1084
00:56:43,559 --> 00:56:46,480
that's like a Southern thing. I grew up in Deep South,

1085
00:56:46,800 --> 00:56:48,599
so I get that that's a Southern thing as a

1086
00:56:48,639 --> 00:56:50,719
way to get someone to shut the fuck up. But

1087
00:56:50,760 --> 00:56:52,719
we're not going to shut the fuck up because this

1088
00:56:52,840 --> 00:56:55,119
is our show. So like, you can scream all you

1089
00:56:55,159 --> 00:56:57,800
want to, but we got the mute button just saying bud.

1090
00:56:58,079 --> 00:56:58,679
Speaker 5: I like that.

1091
00:56:58,840 --> 00:57:02,719
Speaker 7: God James Walton YouTube channels where he's packing on y'all,

1092
00:57:02,719 --> 00:57:06,000
he's just getting started. I think that was really hilarious

1093
00:57:06,360 --> 00:57:09,440
because I've never heard of him down y'all are hacked philosopher.

1094
00:57:09,920 --> 00:57:11,880
Hacked philosopher, and.

1095
00:57:12,360 --> 00:57:15,960
Speaker 1: I'm not a philosopher. I don't even I don't even

1096
00:57:16,039 --> 00:57:18,760
attempt to engage in philosophy and less force too.

1097
00:57:19,440 --> 00:57:23,000
Speaker 7: What are your credentials? Do you have any credentials besides

1098
00:57:23,039 --> 00:57:27,079
this atheism to speak on this this littotopical shit I'll

1099
00:57:27,119 --> 00:57:28,280
get into each week.

1100
00:57:28,559 --> 00:57:31,559
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, I've you got a degree from a Bible

1101
00:57:31,599 --> 00:57:35,400
college and Masters of Divinity from a seminary. So I'm

1102
00:57:35,440 --> 00:57:39,400
particularly educated on the topic of the Bible, which is

1103
00:57:39,440 --> 00:57:41,280
why I know that it's not true, which is why

1104
00:57:41,320 --> 00:57:44,719
most of my live streams are about the Bible, not

1105
00:57:44,800 --> 00:57:45,719
about philosophy.

1106
00:57:46,519 --> 00:57:49,000
Speaker 3: And Adam, I'll pose the same question to you, what

1107
00:57:49,239 --> 00:57:52,199
credentials do you have to question our credentials?

1108
00:57:52,360 --> 00:57:53,199
Speaker 5: I am.

1109
00:57:53,679 --> 00:57:57,519
Speaker 7: I have my credentials the computer science, I have my

1110
00:57:57,639 --> 00:58:03,440
condition credentials and elect tronics of worked hardware software fortune

1111
00:58:03,559 --> 00:58:09,360
five hundred companies. I've also majored in philosophy at FSU,

1112
00:58:09,519 --> 00:58:12,760
who was junior level. I was a field service engineer

1113
00:58:12,840 --> 00:58:15,519
at the time and didn't need that. But yes, I'm

1114
00:58:15,599 --> 00:58:19,800
well over, far beyond qualified for you hacks. Do I

1115
00:58:19,840 --> 00:58:20,559
actually know.

1116
00:58:20,679 --> 00:58:22,559
Speaker 3: And prety we're hacks?

1117
00:58:22,679 --> 00:58:22,920
Speaker 5: Now?

1118
00:58:24,039 --> 00:58:27,079
Speaker 3: I've got no. Hey, hey, hey, Adam. Look, I've got

1119
00:58:27,119 --> 00:58:30,840
two engineering degreeses a computer engineering degree and a software

1120
00:58:30,880 --> 00:58:35,559
engineering degree, and I work on helicopters for the army

1121
00:58:35,800 --> 00:58:38,320
and I've been doing that for twenty years. I also

1122
00:58:38,400 --> 00:58:42,719
worked on Patriot missile systems. So guess what, get fucking wrecked, motherfucker,

1123
00:58:42,920 --> 00:58:47,679
because you don't have any more like authority to come

1124
00:58:47,719 --> 00:58:51,440
up here and question our ability to engage with the

1125
00:58:51,480 --> 00:58:54,039
audience on these questions. All right, I don't give a

1126
00:58:54,079 --> 00:58:57,920
fuck how much time you spent doing fortune five hundred

1127
00:58:58,639 --> 00:59:01,599
ball cuddling or whatever and the fuck you were doing like,

1128
00:59:01,679 --> 00:59:05,000
it really doesn't matter. We're up here, we're having discussions

1129
00:59:05,000 --> 00:59:10,039
with people on these topics. We are very much qualified

1130
00:59:10,039 --> 00:59:13,320
to do this because we are atheists and that's really

1131
00:59:13,360 --> 00:59:15,280
all it takes for us to be up here on

1132
00:59:15,320 --> 00:59:19,079
this stage interacting with people we don't believe in God.

1133
00:59:19,519 --> 00:59:22,119
You seem to be confused as to whether or not

1134
00:59:22,360 --> 00:59:25,840
you believe in God. So how about this, Maybe you

1135
00:59:26,039 --> 00:59:29,000
should go collect your thoughts or something like that so

1136
00:59:29,039 --> 00:59:30,599
that maybe you can read off a script and you

1137
00:59:30,639 --> 00:59:34,960
can read more than a few words a second. Because

1138
00:59:35,000 --> 00:59:38,159
that's my major problem with you right now is you've

1139
00:59:38,159 --> 00:59:41,079
got you know, the pacing is really slow, so it

1140
00:59:41,199 --> 00:59:43,480
takes a lot for you to get to your point,

1141
00:59:43,559 --> 00:59:45,760
and that's why we have to continuously interrupt you.

1142
00:59:46,079 --> 00:59:48,880
Speaker 1: Yeah, I would also add that having a background in

1143
00:59:48,920 --> 00:59:52,440
engineering isn't helpful for you, because not only is John

1144
00:59:52,480 --> 00:59:55,159
an engineer, so am I. I was in the I

1145
00:59:55,159 --> 00:59:59,000
was electrical engineer for twenty years before I started doing

1146
00:59:59,039 --> 01:00:02,199
what I'm doing now. So, like, your credentials don't really

1147
01:00:02,239 --> 01:00:05,400
get you any further than you thought they would, being

1148
01:00:05,440 --> 01:00:07,880
that both John and I have the same credentials plus some.

1149
01:00:08,360 --> 01:00:11,159
So like just doing a dick measuring contest of like

1150
01:00:11,280 --> 01:00:13,719
I was a really cool engineer for a while, isn't

1151
01:00:13,760 --> 01:00:16,840
really all that helpful. Like, in order to demonstrate that

1152
01:00:16,880 --> 01:00:20,119
God exists, you would need an actual argument, And it

1153
01:00:20,159 --> 01:00:22,000
sounds like you don't have an argument. It sounds like

1154
01:00:22,039 --> 01:00:24,320
you don't even know what you believe. It sounds like

1155
01:00:24,360 --> 01:00:26,480
you're just mad that atheists exists.

1156
01:00:26,800 --> 01:00:28,159
Speaker 5: And if I could say a.

1157
01:00:28,159 --> 01:00:31,239
Speaker 7: Word, y'all gone on here for ten minutes just now,

1158
01:00:31,280 --> 01:00:32,039
and I have you.

1159
01:00:33,639 --> 01:00:36,400
Speaker 3: We've only been on this call for seventeen minutes. What

1160
01:00:36,440 --> 01:00:38,119
the fuck are you talking about, Adam?

1161
01:00:39,920 --> 01:00:40,639
Speaker 2: We can go longer.

1162
01:00:41,719 --> 01:00:45,320
Speaker 7: For ten seconds before I was cut off, I spoke

1163
01:00:45,559 --> 01:00:47,840
like maybe five seconds.

1164
01:00:47,320 --> 01:00:48,440
Speaker 5: Before I was cut off.

1165
01:00:48,559 --> 01:00:50,159
Speaker 7: Just this, that's what y'all do.

1166
01:00:50,239 --> 01:00:51,159
Speaker 5: It's good when you can.

1167
01:00:51,320 --> 01:00:52,960
Speaker 3: I'm really tired of the meta on this.

1168
01:00:54,239 --> 01:00:57,480
Speaker 1: Yeah, it seems like the entire call is just meta,

1169
01:00:57,679 --> 01:01:00,800
Like there's no substance to this call. So I'm not

1170
01:01:00,800 --> 01:01:03,480
really sure that this call is a good use of

1171
01:01:03,519 --> 01:01:09,599
anyone's time, So we can reframe the call. Also, Adam,

1172
01:01:09,639 --> 01:01:11,519
I don't know why you're I don't know why you're

1173
01:01:11,559 --> 01:01:14,199
talking while I'm talking. Just so you're aware, like when

1174
01:01:14,199 --> 01:01:16,719
you're talking while I'm talking, people can't hear you, right,

1175
01:01:16,800 --> 01:01:19,960
So like you're welcome to do it, right, You're welcome

1176
01:01:19,960 --> 01:01:22,840
to talk while I'm talking, but like it's a waste

1177
01:01:22,840 --> 01:01:25,039
of your time, and like I actually want to hear

1178
01:01:25,079 --> 01:01:27,800
what you have to say. So in order for you

1179
01:01:27,840 --> 01:01:29,719
to talk in a way that I can hear what

1180
01:01:29,760 --> 01:01:32,400
you have to say, just count to ten, wait for

1181
01:01:32,440 --> 01:01:35,119
me to stop talking, then you can say your stuff. Now,

1182
01:01:35,199 --> 01:01:37,719
what I would love to happen is for you to

1183
01:01:37,760 --> 01:01:40,760
prevent like some kind of a case for why like

1184
01:01:40,880 --> 01:01:43,199
there should be a god or there could be a god,

1185
01:01:43,400 --> 01:01:45,440
or we should believe in a god, because that's actually

1186
01:01:45,440 --> 01:01:47,519
what the show is about. This show is not about

1187
01:01:47,519 --> 01:01:51,360
meta commentary on how you just don't like atheists, So

1188
01:01:51,519 --> 01:01:53,400
do you have an argument for God or no?

1189
01:01:53,719 --> 01:01:56,760
Speaker 7: I could speak more than a few seconds before I'm

1190
01:01:56,760 --> 01:02:00,880
cut off, but it doesn't be allowed. I want to speak.

1191
01:02:00,920 --> 01:02:05,519
You spoke for like five minutes straight talking about this

1192
01:02:05,599 --> 01:02:06,360
is hilarious.

1193
01:02:06,440 --> 01:02:07,320
Speaker 5: Are y'all clown?

1194
01:02:07,599 --> 01:02:09,119
Speaker 2: Ooops, my fingers slipped.

1195
01:02:09,559 --> 01:02:14,639
Speaker 8: Oh shit, my bad.

1196
01:02:16,159 --> 01:02:18,679
Speaker 1: Well with that, we've got We've got time for another caller.

1197
01:02:18,719 --> 01:02:22,639
We've got Maryland in the queue, and actually I think

1198
01:02:22,639 --> 01:02:26,559
I know who Marylyn is. We'll spring up Maryland and John.

1199
01:02:26,599 --> 01:02:28,679
Speaker 2: This doesn't be fun. Just in case you don't know

1200
01:02:28,719 --> 01:02:29,400
Maryland yet.

1201
01:02:29,679 --> 01:02:33,599
Speaker 3: Okay, I'm ready for Maryland, Marylynd wilcome in.

1202
01:02:34,320 --> 01:02:37,800
Speaker 1: Hey, Maryland, I love you.

1203
01:02:37,880 --> 01:02:39,920
Speaker 9: I'd be spending more super chats, but I think I

1204
01:02:40,039 --> 01:02:41,599
was banned from your channel again.

1205
01:02:42,360 --> 01:02:44,880
Speaker 2: Yeah, you probably said some stuff and got banned again.

1206
01:02:44,960 --> 01:02:46,119
Speaker 1: That's that's likely.

1207
01:02:46,320 --> 01:02:48,800
Speaker 2: Yeah, you can't talk about the Jews in my chat.

1208
01:02:49,239 --> 01:02:51,719
I don't know. You can't do Jewish space lasers, or

1209
01:02:51,760 --> 01:02:53,159
the moon is fake or.

1210
01:02:54,840 --> 01:02:58,199
Speaker 9: Ruin's not fake. But I did want it justin as God,

1211
01:02:58,480 --> 01:02:59,960
and that's what I wanted to talk about.

1212
01:03:00,360 --> 01:03:03,039
Speaker 1: I appreciate that it sounds like you've got a new

1213
01:03:03,119 --> 01:03:04,840
argument we haven't heard yet and want to lay it

1214
01:03:04,840 --> 01:03:05,519
down for us.

1215
01:03:05,639 --> 01:03:07,880
Speaker 9: Well, you don't think you're God, so I want to

1216
01:03:07,920 --> 01:03:08,400
know why.

1217
01:03:09,119 --> 01:03:12,400
Speaker 1: Well, see, I don't believe I have any attributes of God.

1218
01:03:12,719 --> 01:03:18,639
Like the attributes of God would be all powerful, all knowing, omnipresent.

1219
01:03:18,719 --> 01:03:20,400
Speaker 2: I don't seem to have any of those attributes.

1220
01:03:20,679 --> 01:03:23,559
Speaker 9: I think you're all powerful and with all the power

1221
01:03:23,559 --> 01:03:27,480
and authority, all knowing what exactly are you supposed to

1222
01:03:27,480 --> 01:03:29,960
be knowing? Like I believe we're all God and we're

1223
01:03:30,000 --> 01:03:33,760
all part of one body. So every individual has all

1224
01:03:33,800 --> 01:03:37,920
the knowledge that they know, so all together, all the

1225
01:03:37,960 --> 01:03:41,880
knowledge that is known and talked about is already known

1226
01:03:41,920 --> 01:03:46,239
by the whole collective. So God sort of does know everything.

1227
01:03:46,519 --> 01:03:50,280
Speaker 1: So John is going to have some questions. You know, Marilyn,

1228
01:03:50,280 --> 01:03:52,119
you and I've talked before. I kind of know what

1229
01:03:52,159 --> 01:03:55,320
you believe. You're a little bit on the christ consciousness level,

1230
01:03:56,400 --> 01:03:59,400
although you're not a Christian it, which is fine, but like,

1231
01:04:00,159 --> 01:04:02,119
let's talk a little bit, let's push a little bit deeper.

1232
01:04:02,599 --> 01:04:06,840
What in your belief system or what about your belief

1233
01:04:06,880 --> 01:04:10,480
system can we demonstrate to be true so that someone

1234
01:04:10,519 --> 01:04:12,760
like John and I can look at it and be like, oh, yeah,

1235
01:04:12,800 --> 01:04:14,480
this this maybe we should believe it too.

1236
01:04:14,760 --> 01:04:17,320
Speaker 9: Well, you are the image of God. So you can

1237
01:04:17,360 --> 01:04:19,440
look in a mirror and you can you can tell

1238
01:04:19,559 --> 01:04:23,840
you are a person. You are manifested into reality. You're

1239
01:04:23,880 --> 01:04:26,480
not just a spirit or a thought. You are actually,

1240
01:04:26,480 --> 01:04:29,239
I mean, Maryland was God and he had eyes and

1241
01:04:29,280 --> 01:04:30,679
ears and those right.

1242
01:04:30,559 --> 01:04:34,360
Speaker 3: Right, Maryland, how do you know what the image of

1243
01:04:34,360 --> 01:04:35,000
God is?

1244
01:04:35,440 --> 01:04:35,480
Speaker 5: Like?

1245
01:04:35,639 --> 01:04:36,800
Speaker 3: How do you how do you know that?

1246
01:04:36,920 --> 01:04:39,360
Speaker 9: Because Man came up with the image of God. So

1247
01:04:39,519 --> 01:04:43,000
if it came from man, then that's if that's what

1248
01:04:43,239 --> 01:04:43,920
man wants to do.

1249
01:04:44,400 --> 01:04:46,320
Speaker 3: Well, did do you see how that's circular?

1250
01:04:46,360 --> 01:04:46,599
Speaker 5: Though?

1251
01:04:47,000 --> 01:04:49,719
Speaker 3: Do you see how that's circular? Because you're saying Man

1252
01:04:50,599 --> 01:04:53,480
decided what God looks like, therefore we are in the

1253
01:04:53,519 --> 01:04:56,639
image of God. You're just that's that's circular in that

1254
01:04:56,719 --> 01:04:57,159
kind of way.

1255
01:04:57,320 --> 01:04:59,920
Speaker 9: But wouldn't that be kind of like idolizing the word

1256
01:05:00,119 --> 01:05:05,760
God and saying that that God is some something separate

1257
01:05:05,960 --> 01:05:09,480
from whoever created the word God and whoever made it

1258
01:05:09,559 --> 01:05:11,559
up and then it is and it came out of

1259
01:05:11,599 --> 01:05:15,119
their perceptions in mind and wrote it down and talked

1260
01:05:15,119 --> 01:05:15,599
about it.

1261
01:05:16,400 --> 01:05:23,119
Speaker 3: Well, so not so Maryland. If if, if God truly exists,

1262
01:05:23,519 --> 01:05:26,159
like any kind of God that created, do you maybe

1263
01:05:26,199 --> 01:05:28,639
I should ask that first? Do you believe that God

1264
01:05:29,079 --> 01:05:33,079
is a real entity that created everybody, or created this universe,

1265
01:05:33,159 --> 01:05:35,960
or has any kind of like active agency in this universe.

1266
01:05:36,159 --> 01:05:38,280
Speaker 9: I believe that God is the beginning in the end.

1267
01:05:38,559 --> 01:05:41,800
So I believe we always were and always will be.

1268
01:05:42,199 --> 01:05:46,400
So I don't believe there was a some sort of

1269
01:05:46,639 --> 01:05:49,280
we were. We were all known before the world began,

1270
01:05:49,760 --> 01:05:51,679
is what the Bible does. We're all known before the

1271
01:05:51,679 --> 01:05:55,239
world began. So if we were all so, true, maybe

1272
01:05:55,320 --> 01:05:55,840
we weren't.

1273
01:05:56,320 --> 01:05:59,039
Speaker 3: Well, well, since it seems like you're using the Bible

1274
01:05:59,199 --> 01:06:02,320
and that the Bible, typically you know, says that God,

1275
01:06:02,480 --> 01:06:05,360
you know, pre existed, you know the universe, and that God,

1276
01:06:05,480 --> 01:06:08,480
through Jesus, if you believe in the Gospel of John,

1277
01:06:08,960 --> 01:06:12,679
created everything, would you say that that would be accurate

1278
01:06:12,679 --> 01:06:16,199
to your beliefs that God uh pre existed the universe

1279
01:06:16,280 --> 01:06:21,920
and created the universe with his you know, his omnipotence.

1280
01:06:22,239 --> 01:06:24,840
Speaker 9: I believe we are all God. We are all God

1281
01:06:24,960 --> 01:06:27,679
because of God. So I believe we were always known,

1282
01:06:27,800 --> 01:06:30,119
we have always been, and always will be. I do not.

1283
01:06:30,440 --> 01:06:34,800
I don't agree to a beginning of creation. I'm not.

1284
01:06:35,079 --> 01:06:38,000
I don't believe in evolution. I believe we always were

1285
01:06:38,239 --> 01:06:40,599
and always will be. We are God. We are God.

1286
01:06:41,119 --> 01:06:43,239
Speaker 3: Well, okay, so how do you explain the fact that

1287
01:06:43,280 --> 01:06:45,679
the Earth is only four and a half billion years

1288
01:06:45,719 --> 01:06:49,159
old and that it formed at that point and then

1289
01:06:49,360 --> 01:06:53,840
there was a good to nine billion years before the

1290
01:06:53,920 --> 01:06:56,360
Earth formed? How do you how do you explain that

1291
01:06:56,679 --> 01:06:57,159
I am.

1292
01:06:57,000 --> 01:06:59,519
Speaker 9: A flat earther. I don't know where y'all even get

1293
01:06:59,559 --> 01:07:02,360
the capacit to be in your brain to even register

1294
01:07:03,679 --> 01:07:06,519
nine point eight million billion years.

1295
01:07:06,960 --> 01:07:09,480
Speaker 3: And I play million billion.

1296
01:07:09,800 --> 01:07:12,719
Speaker 9: Evidence of someone knowing something that.

1297
01:07:13,360 --> 01:07:16,599
Speaker 3: Rats Okay, Well, so what I can tell you as

1298
01:07:16,639 --> 01:07:19,119
far as the science goes, We've been able to analyze

1299
01:07:19,159 --> 01:07:22,519
their con crystals and we've been able to do radio

1300
01:07:22,920 --> 01:07:26,840
metric testing on them to determine that the oldest one

1301
01:07:26,960 --> 01:07:29,639
was formed like about four and a half billion years ago.

1302
01:07:29,719 --> 01:07:31,360
So that's how we know that the Earth is at

1303
01:07:31,440 --> 01:07:34,239
least that old. And the way that we know that

1304
01:07:34,320 --> 01:07:39,880
the universe first inflated about a little over thirteen billion

1305
01:07:39,920 --> 01:07:43,360
years ago is due to things like the red shift

1306
01:07:43,400 --> 01:07:46,760
of the planets as well as you know, we've been

1307
01:07:46,760 --> 01:07:49,320
able to take a picture of the cosmic microwave background

1308
01:07:49,400 --> 01:07:55,360
radiation and like just being able to measure that starlight,

1309
01:07:55,880 --> 01:07:58,440
you know, is also a pretty good indication of how

1310
01:07:58,519 --> 01:08:01,119
old you know, things can be in this universe. So

1311
01:08:01,440 --> 01:08:05,400
I'm just kind of curious as to like, why do

1312
01:08:05,519 --> 01:08:10,119
you deny the deep time that is represented by physical

1313
01:08:10,199 --> 01:08:12,519
evidence that we have in our reality.

1314
01:08:12,679 --> 01:08:15,280
Speaker 9: Well, I mean, that's all well and good, but I

1315
01:08:15,559 --> 01:08:19,279
believe the Bible to where we are sourced. The air

1316
01:08:19,439 --> 01:08:22,279
was here, the water was here, the ground and land

1317
01:08:22,399 --> 01:08:25,960
was here, The vegetation was even here. Plants were here.

1318
01:08:26,319 --> 01:08:27,640
Speaker 3: Were the stars there?

1319
01:08:27,640 --> 01:08:29,800
Speaker 9: The sun and the moon and the stars?

1320
01:08:30,199 --> 01:08:30,399
Speaker 5: Right?

1321
01:08:30,479 --> 01:08:34,079
Speaker 3: That doesn't make sense. But were the stars there? Were

1322
01:08:34,079 --> 01:08:34,920
the stars there?

1323
01:08:35,079 --> 01:08:38,079
Speaker 9: No, we are sourced. We were here before there was

1324
01:08:38,159 --> 01:08:40,840
life on the place, before there was the sun and

1325
01:08:40,920 --> 01:08:41,640
moon and stars.

1326
01:08:42,439 --> 01:08:46,159
Speaker 3: Okay, yeah, I get that. But do you agree that

1327
01:08:46,239 --> 01:08:48,359
the stars were there though?

1328
01:08:48,600 --> 01:08:48,720
Speaker 5: What?

1329
01:08:49,000 --> 01:08:51,920
Speaker 3: Right, like when the sun was created or whenever you

1330
01:08:51,960 --> 01:08:54,079
think the stars got put there? You think the stars

1331
01:08:54,399 --> 01:08:56,720
were created at the same time that we were correct.

1332
01:08:56,960 --> 01:09:02,000
Speaker 9: No, no, we're not at the same time. No not no,

1333
01:09:02,279 --> 01:09:05,439
we were made first and then and then all the

1334
01:09:05,520 --> 01:09:06,439
other stuff was made.

1335
01:09:06,640 --> 01:09:11,159
Speaker 3: Okay, that that further complicates everything that we experience in reality.

1336
01:09:11,439 --> 01:09:13,079
Do you know how fast light moves?

1337
01:09:13,359 --> 01:09:13,720
Speaker 5: Okay?

1338
01:09:14,000 --> 01:09:17,279
Speaker 9: Okay, no, because I feel like all this is indoctrination

1339
01:09:17,520 --> 01:09:20,560
and someone told you this and set it down your road.

1340
01:09:21,039 --> 01:09:25,000
Speaker 3: We can physically measure, we can Maryland, Maryland, Maryland. We

1341
01:09:25,079 --> 01:09:28,199
can physically measure the speed of light. And because we

1342
01:09:28,239 --> 01:09:30,880
can measure the speed of light, we can actually know

1343
01:09:31,239 --> 01:09:36,159
how long it takes light from distant galaxies and distant

1344
01:09:36,239 --> 01:09:40,520
stars to travel here, and like the nearest one. Uh,

1345
01:09:40,680 --> 01:09:45,479
totally debunks your entire idea of of like a young

1346
01:09:45,560 --> 01:09:48,000
Earth or of God creating things.

1347
01:09:48,199 --> 01:09:51,359
Speaker 9: I don't necessarily believe in a young Earth. I believe lose. Oh,

1348
01:09:51,640 --> 01:09:54,800
I don't know, man, I like it almost feels like

1349
01:09:54,920 --> 01:09:59,119
you believe in psyops just like the Christians, Like you

1350
01:09:59,279 --> 01:10:02,439
have stock On syndrome, just like the Christians, do you

1351
01:10:02,600 --> 01:10:05,119
have to have Stockholm syndrome?

1352
01:10:05,399 --> 01:10:08,319
Speaker 3: That No, I'm sorry, but the speed of light is

1353
01:10:08,359 --> 01:10:12,680
not is not a Stockholm syndrome thing. The speed of

1354
01:10:12,760 --> 01:10:15,960
light is something that you can measure. I'm sorry, I'm

1355
01:10:16,039 --> 01:10:19,479
muting you real quick, because this is not some kind

1356
01:10:19,479 --> 01:10:22,479
of Stockholm syndromey thing. This is speed of light is

1357
01:10:22,520 --> 01:10:25,159
something that we have measured, we can measure, and we

1358
01:10:25,239 --> 01:10:28,039
can know like how long it takes light to like

1359
01:10:28,159 --> 01:10:32,000
progress from distant stars. This is just hard math. Do

1360
01:10:32,079 --> 01:10:35,800
you think that math is somehow a Stockholm syndrome kind

1361
01:10:35,840 --> 01:10:38,920
of thing where math has been manipulated to give us

1362
01:10:38,920 --> 01:10:43,319
one number? Because like math is literally just measuring the

1363
01:10:44,039 --> 01:10:47,359
our reality. Like that's all it does. It's not biased

1364
01:10:47,399 --> 01:10:51,199
in one direction or another. Like it's just fucking math.

1365
01:10:51,279 --> 01:10:52,920
And that's what I'm talking about here.

1366
01:10:53,039 --> 01:10:53,880
Speaker 9: Okay, are you ready?

1367
01:10:54,079 --> 01:10:54,279
Speaker 3: Yeah?

1368
01:10:54,680 --> 01:10:56,640
Speaker 9: Hear me? I?

1369
01:10:56,439 --> 01:10:57,000
Speaker 5: I yeah.

1370
01:10:57,159 --> 01:11:01,079
Speaker 9: Math can totally be in the way that numbers like

1371
01:11:01,159 --> 01:11:03,840
you guys like to use. But I don't believe math

1372
01:11:04,000 --> 01:11:06,199
is the ways of numbers. I believe it's the ways

1373
01:11:06,239 --> 01:11:09,279
of order. Math is ordered, and there is an order

1374
01:11:09,359 --> 01:11:13,840
two things. Like the stuff you're talking about is semantic,

1375
01:11:14,199 --> 01:11:20,359
like there is a divide here within the human psyche,

1376
01:11:20,920 --> 01:11:25,439
some sort of division that that creates conflict that needs

1377
01:11:25,479 --> 01:11:28,800
to be resolved, and it's complete. It's just ignorance. I

1378
01:11:28,800 --> 01:11:31,760
don't necessarily feel like it's out of malice. More more.

1379
01:11:33,520 --> 01:11:35,880
Speaker 3: So, how is it, well, Maryland? So how is it

1380
01:11:35,960 --> 01:11:40,439
ignorant of me to take a basic equation of speed

1381
01:11:41,000 --> 01:11:46,039
times you know, distance or times uh, you know, some

1382
01:11:46,199 --> 01:11:49,600
other values in order to get the amounts of time

1383
01:11:49,840 --> 01:11:54,279
it would take four that photon to get here from

1384
01:11:54,600 --> 01:11:58,039
another star out in the Solar system. How, how is

1385
01:11:58,079 --> 01:12:01,640
that just ignorance on my part? It's literally just multiplying

1386
01:12:01,720 --> 01:12:05,600
one number against another number to get yet another number

1387
01:12:05,640 --> 01:12:09,039
that represents the amount of time it takes. That debunks

1388
01:12:09,079 --> 01:12:13,079
your entire position here. So like, I'm still not understanding

1389
01:12:13,479 --> 01:12:16,960
how that's somehow biased in any kind of way, or

1390
01:12:17,079 --> 01:12:19,319
like it's an indication of my ignorance.

1391
01:12:19,640 --> 01:12:22,439
Speaker 9: No, I'm not saying you're ignorant. I'm saying you're God.

1392
01:12:22,680 --> 01:12:25,239
Maybe that's your hobb maybe that's what you like to do,

1393
01:12:25,319 --> 01:12:28,000
but you shouldn't have to put it on other people

1394
01:12:28,319 --> 01:12:30,760
and make them believe it and make them.

1395
01:12:30,800 --> 01:12:33,720
Speaker 3: Maryland get on board, and Maryland, if I was an

1396
01:12:33,760 --> 01:12:37,239
all powerful God, I would snap my fingers right now

1397
01:12:37,279 --> 01:12:40,000
and make you stop believing this silly shit. If I

1398
01:12:40,239 --> 01:12:41,880
was a god, that's what I would do.

1399
01:12:42,399 --> 01:12:45,119
Speaker 9: Pretty over me. We're all God. No one can be

1400
01:12:45,159 --> 01:12:47,640
an idol. If everyone is God, you cannot tell me

1401
01:12:47,680 --> 01:12:49,359
what to do, just like I can't tell you what

1402
01:12:49,439 --> 01:12:52,399
to do. No one is above or below anyone. Hierarchy

1403
01:12:52,479 --> 01:12:53,880
is this thin competition?

1404
01:12:54,880 --> 01:12:57,680
Speaker 3: Yahweh is just another human that's walking around on Earth.

1405
01:12:57,760 --> 01:13:00,159
Is that what I hear you saying, is yahweh just

1406
01:13:00,199 --> 01:13:02,039
another human that's been walking around on Earth.

1407
01:13:02,159 --> 01:13:05,239
Speaker 9: I mean probably I wouldn't doubt it. Yeah, I mean

1408
01:13:05,279 --> 01:13:09,039
we all. I don't we're all God. I don't understand

1409
01:13:09,159 --> 01:13:14,399
why why we have to do this thing to make

1410
01:13:14,479 --> 01:13:15,640
it so grandiose?

1411
01:13:16,279 --> 01:13:18,079
Speaker 3: You mean, why do we have to do this thing

1412
01:13:18,239 --> 01:13:23,159
of analyze, critically analyzing the radical ship that you're saying,

1413
01:13:23,479 --> 01:13:27,079
because it doesn't make sense with reality. That's why. No,

1414
01:13:27,239 --> 01:13:28,720
I understand that you're not a Christian.

1415
01:13:29,079 --> 01:13:29,600
Speaker 1: Don't know.

1416
01:13:29,720 --> 01:13:32,920
Speaker 3: If you're not a Christian, then using the fucking Bible.

1417
01:13:32,640 --> 01:13:37,359
Speaker 9: Maryland reality true, Like you can disassociate from reality, but

1418
01:13:37,439 --> 01:13:40,319
reality isn't going to disassociate from you that stuff.

1419
01:13:40,319 --> 01:13:43,279
Speaker 3: Really you're not No, No, listen, if you're not part

1420
01:13:43,520 --> 01:13:46,439
of Maryland, if you're not part of an Abrahamic faith,

1421
01:13:46,680 --> 01:13:48,199
why are you using the Bible?

1422
01:13:48,439 --> 01:13:50,680
Speaker 9: Because God is real, Jesus is real?

1423
01:13:51,359 --> 01:13:56,000
Speaker 3: Doesn't answer my fucking question I was getting into this.

1424
01:13:56,119 --> 01:14:02,800
Speaker 1: Huh Yeah, sorry, John, I knew what was happening tonight. Merely,

1425
01:14:02,920 --> 01:14:04,279
do you believe that vedas are real?

1426
01:14:04,600 --> 01:14:05,079
Speaker 9: Vedas?

1427
01:14:05,079 --> 01:14:05,479
Speaker 5: What is that?

1428
01:14:06,000 --> 01:14:07,439
Speaker 1: Like Hindu scriptures?

1429
01:14:07,560 --> 01:14:08,039
Speaker 5: What is that?

1430
01:14:08,439 --> 01:14:10,680
Speaker 1: Do you believe in the Holy Text for other religions,

1431
01:14:10,920 --> 01:14:11,640
gods results.

1432
01:14:11,800 --> 01:14:15,680
Speaker 9: Well, I believe truth has no agenda. Truth has no agenda.

1433
01:14:15,800 --> 01:14:20,439
So any lie or any thought that doesn't inspire hope

1434
01:14:20,720 --> 01:14:24,399
is rooted in a lie. It's just there's a good

1435
01:14:24,520 --> 01:14:27,119
side and a way of doing things, and it's gathering,

1436
01:14:27,279 --> 01:14:29,680
and then there's a bad side that causes bad and

1437
01:14:29,680 --> 01:14:33,840
it's and hurt and scatters. I mean, child children get

1438
01:14:33,880 --> 01:14:36,319
into heaven. You have a mind of a child. I

1439
01:14:36,359 --> 01:14:39,279
feel like it's common sense. But for some reason people

1440
01:14:39,359 --> 01:14:41,880
distort good with bad and they want to mix the

1441
01:14:41,920 --> 01:14:47,640
two and say stuff that is flagrantly just evil, just bad,

1442
01:14:48,600 --> 01:14:52,680
intentionally unbalancing the situation, and think they are they have

1443
01:14:52,800 --> 01:14:56,399
done something to virtue signal about like they've done something good.

1444
01:14:56,680 --> 01:14:59,439
It doesn't add up in my mind. What people are

1445
01:14:59,479 --> 01:15:01,039
doing has to be got to ignorant.

1446
01:15:01,119 --> 01:15:03,239
Speaker 1: Sure, well, listen, Maryland, We've got just enough time to

1447
01:15:03,279 --> 01:15:04,319
take our last caller.

1448
01:15:04,560 --> 01:15:07,600
Speaker 2: I appreciate you coming up and chatting with us. I hope,

1449
01:15:08,039 --> 01:15:09,039
I appreciate hope.

1450
01:15:08,880 --> 01:15:11,279
Speaker 1: You having a good Sunday. We wish the best for you.

1451
01:15:11,600 --> 01:15:14,399
Speaker 9: Yes, I love you justin your God, I'm going to

1452
01:15:14,439 --> 01:15:15,520
get you and we're going.

1453
01:15:15,520 --> 01:15:15,840
Speaker 5: To get you.

1454
01:15:15,880 --> 01:15:20,039
Speaker 9: Everyone's going to get you.

1455
01:15:20,720 --> 01:15:21,399
Speaker 5: Bye, Marylyn.

1456
01:15:24,359 --> 01:15:28,239
Speaker 3: Well, oh, a restraining order? Maybe maybe Justin needs a

1457
01:15:28,279 --> 01:15:29,600
restraining order on Maryland.

1458
01:15:29,640 --> 01:15:30,079
Speaker 5: I don't know.

1459
01:15:30,800 --> 01:15:34,000
Speaker 1: We're going to grab our last caller and then finish

1460
01:15:34,359 --> 01:15:36,760
with what's left of our super chats. We've got a

1461
01:15:36,800 --> 01:15:41,840
theist Bill from Texas coming in saying that fine tuning

1462
01:15:41,960 --> 01:15:42,680
proves God.

1463
01:15:42,960 --> 01:15:45,399
Speaker 2: I would love to more know more about the fine

1464
01:15:45,399 --> 01:15:46,119
tuning argument.

1465
01:15:46,520 --> 01:15:46,720
Speaker 5: Bill.

1466
01:15:46,800 --> 01:15:49,479
Speaker 1: Do you think that the fine tuning argument points towards

1467
01:15:49,479 --> 01:15:51,239
a generic god or a specific God?

1468
01:15:52,359 --> 01:15:54,359
Speaker 2: Okay? Do you believe in a junioric god or a

1469
01:15:54,439 --> 01:15:55,159
specific God?

1470
01:15:55,439 --> 01:15:59,880
Speaker 4: By the way, I John Knows telling you godless Granny

1471
01:16:00,359 --> 01:16:03,359
as a friend, that is. I was just on her

1472
01:16:03,439 --> 01:16:07,720
show yesterday talking to doctor Rich Carrier about the fine

1473
01:16:07,760 --> 01:16:10,760
tune and we had a really nice discussion. So one

1474
01:16:10,760 --> 01:16:14,239
of the things I brought up was the strong nuclear force,

1475
01:16:14,399 --> 01:16:16,920
which you know, if it's off but two percent stronger,

1476
01:16:17,000 --> 01:16:19,359
you're not going to get. You get a periodic table,

1477
01:16:19,399 --> 01:16:22,119
but you don't get hydraged, which obviously is the stars

1478
01:16:22,279 --> 01:16:25,680
is important. If it's five percent stronger, you get you

1479
01:16:25,920 --> 01:16:28,399
don't get uh, you only get hydrogen.

1480
01:16:28,520 --> 01:16:32,720
Speaker 2: So is God all Bill? Bill's got all powerful I.

1481
01:16:32,720 --> 01:16:35,680
Speaker 4: Would think he's I would think he's pretty powerful because

1482
01:16:35,720 --> 01:16:38,520
I brought up to Richard that we have one hundred

1483
01:16:38,520 --> 01:16:41,720
billion galaxies with two hundred million stars, And I'll ask

1484
01:16:41,760 --> 01:16:43,720
you the same question, just yeah.

1485
01:16:44,319 --> 01:16:46,560
Speaker 2: But did God design physics?

1486
01:16:46,760 --> 01:16:46,960
Speaker 5: Yes?

1487
01:16:47,239 --> 01:16:49,800
Speaker 4: I think he did in mathematic.

1488
01:16:49,239 --> 01:16:52,840
Speaker 1: Okay, So did God design the parameters that would bring

1489
01:16:52,880 --> 01:16:53,520
about life?

1490
01:16:53,680 --> 01:16:56,680
Speaker 4: Yes, I believe he did the twenty five okay camera.

1491
01:16:56,800 --> 01:16:59,119
Speaker 1: So if that's the case, then God could have made

1492
01:16:59,159 --> 01:17:02,000
life anything. God could have said life is going to

1493
01:17:02,039 --> 01:17:06,760
be made out of, like mostly aluminum, Like, he could

1494
01:17:06,760 --> 01:17:07,720
have made it out of anything.

1495
01:17:07,840 --> 01:17:07,880
Speaker 5: Like.

1496
01:17:08,319 --> 01:17:11,880
Speaker 1: So the fine tuning argument isn't helpful, right, It doesn't

1497
01:17:11,880 --> 01:17:14,199
get you to a God, because a God can make

1498
01:17:14,279 --> 01:17:15,119
life out.

1499
01:17:14,960 --> 01:17:17,560
Speaker 2: Of literally anything. He set the rules, right.

1500
01:17:17,960 --> 01:17:21,039
Speaker 1: It just happens to be that the life permitting universe

1501
01:17:21,079 --> 01:17:25,119
we have right now has these particular properties. But we

1502
01:17:25,199 --> 01:17:27,319
have no way of knowing if it could be any different.

1503
01:17:27,319 --> 01:17:29,600
But we do know that if God was all powerful

1504
01:17:29,600 --> 01:17:32,600
and he authored this, then the fine tuning argument completely

1505
01:17:32,640 --> 01:17:35,279
fails because God could have made life out of literally anything.

1506
01:17:35,560 --> 01:17:37,239
Speaker 5: Well that's what Richard said, Yeah, I know.

1507
01:17:37,399 --> 01:17:43,760
Speaker 1: Yeah, so like like fine tuning would only be helpful

1508
01:17:43,800 --> 01:17:46,000
if we knew that this is the only way there

1509
01:17:46,000 --> 01:17:48,239
could be life, Like, if God had no other way

1510
01:17:48,279 --> 01:17:52,000
of creating life other than this way, then it would be.

1511
01:17:51,760 --> 01:17:53,279
Speaker 2: Maybe partially remarkable.

1512
01:17:53,600 --> 01:17:56,199
Speaker 1: But I think even at that it's not remarkable, right

1513
01:17:56,279 --> 01:18:00,439
because what we're what we're suggesting, is that we do

1514
01:18:00,520 --> 01:18:04,720
have life with the current configuration of physics. But the

1515
01:18:04,800 --> 01:18:07,960
reality is, like, I don't believe there is a start

1516
01:18:08,039 --> 01:18:10,279
of the universe. I don't believe the Big Bang is

1517
01:18:10,319 --> 01:18:13,800
like something from nothing. Like if you believe in an

1518
01:18:13,840 --> 01:18:18,760
eternal universe, well, there is an eternity of different universal

1519
01:18:18,800 --> 01:18:21,760
formations prior to this one, and probably none of them

1520
01:18:21,800 --> 01:18:24,600
had life, and it just happens to be that we're

1521
01:18:24,600 --> 01:18:27,840
finally in one formation that happens to have life.

1522
01:18:27,960 --> 01:18:30,960
Speaker 4: And I somewhat agree with you that you're familiar with

1523
01:18:31,079 --> 01:18:34,520
Roger Penrose's cyclical conformal cosmology.

1524
01:18:34,840 --> 01:18:38,239
Speaker 1: I'm only vaguely familiar with Penrose's theory. Well, and there

1525
01:18:38,439 --> 01:18:41,359
there are others who believe in a cyclical universe, you know,

1526
01:18:41,399 --> 01:18:42,560
like Sean Carroll, and.

1527
01:18:42,800 --> 01:18:46,279
Speaker 4: Yeah, exactly exactly, so that is a possibility. And Christians

1528
01:18:46,279 --> 01:18:48,640
have got personal they've got to stop talking about the

1529
01:18:48,680 --> 01:18:51,880
Klam cosm. Watch but you've heard it a million times.

1530
01:18:52,039 --> 01:18:54,600
I'm sure you're bored to tears with as i am.

1531
01:18:54,840 --> 01:18:58,720
There's better arguments, like the Paul exclusion principle, like the

1532
01:18:58,880 --> 01:19:02,359
fine structure constant, which is one over one thirty seven

1533
01:19:02,520 --> 01:19:06,640
that Richard Seinman said, every physicist should put this on

1534
01:19:06,720 --> 01:19:09,720
a wall and worry. And if this thing's not right,

1535
01:19:09,920 --> 01:19:12,359
then if it's four percent off, you don't get carbon,

1536
01:19:12,439 --> 01:19:14,359
and thus you don't get like So my question to

1537
01:19:14,399 --> 01:19:15,760
you guys, are you worried?

1538
01:19:16,359 --> 01:19:16,600
Speaker 5: Right?

1539
01:19:16,840 --> 01:19:18,359
Speaker 2: But the problem, no, I'm not worried.

1540
01:19:18,359 --> 01:19:20,319
Speaker 1: But the problem with the fine tuning argument is it

1541
01:19:20,359 --> 01:19:23,319
assumes that life was the goal, Like the fact that

1542
01:19:23,359 --> 01:19:28,239
life exists would only be unique if life was the goal,

1543
01:19:28,520 --> 01:19:31,000
and we have in order to assume that there was

1544
01:19:31,039 --> 01:19:32,920
a goal of the universe, we would have to assume

1545
01:19:32,920 --> 01:19:34,119
that the god existed already.

1546
01:19:34,159 --> 01:19:35,680
Speaker 2: So it becomes a circular argument.

1547
01:19:35,760 --> 01:19:38,199
Speaker 1: So like I give the a popular example, like if

1548
01:19:38,199 --> 01:19:40,119
I have a deck of cards and I throw the

1549
01:19:40,159 --> 01:19:42,880
deck of cards on the floor, the arrangement of each

1550
01:19:43,000 --> 01:19:46,520
individual card is it's like statistically impossible for it to

1551
01:19:46,560 --> 01:19:50,079
be that particular arrangement, But that's not actually meaningful.

1552
01:19:50,479 --> 01:19:50,960
Speaker 2: It would be.

1553
01:19:51,000 --> 01:19:54,119
Speaker 1: Meaningful if before I threw the cards down, I told

1554
01:19:54,159 --> 01:19:56,880
you what the arrangement would be, then it would be

1555
01:19:56,920 --> 01:19:59,560
super meaningful. You'd have to assume that I had some

1556
01:19:59,600 --> 01:20:02,960
sort of magic or mystical powers or a fixed deck

1557
01:20:03,319 --> 01:20:05,439
in order for me to guess the arrangement.

1558
01:20:05,520 --> 01:20:08,119
Speaker 2: Same thing with the universe. The universe just happens to

1559
01:20:08,199 --> 01:20:11,800
be an arrangement right now that permits life, but it's

1560
01:20:11,840 --> 01:20:15,159
not meaningful unless you believe that the universe had the

1561
01:20:15,199 --> 01:20:19,720
goal of creating life, then the fine tuning constants become meaningful.

1562
01:20:20,079 --> 01:20:23,239
Speaker 4: Well, Richard Fineman says, who was an atheist, that it

1563
01:20:23,319 --> 01:20:27,680
looks like God's pushing the pencil, but we don't know why.

1564
01:20:27,479 --> 01:20:30,399
Speaker 2: And let don't I don't care what he said though, like.

1565
01:20:30,560 --> 01:20:33,800
Speaker 4: Well, he's only like one of the greatestes of last century.

1566
01:20:34,640 --> 01:20:38,960
Speaker 1: I literally, I'm literally telling you why I don't believe

1567
01:20:38,960 --> 01:20:41,800
the fine tuning argument works. And you're bringing up somebody

1568
01:20:41,800 --> 01:20:44,760
else's quote, like I want you to address what I said,

1569
01:20:45,119 --> 01:20:47,039
that what some other guy said.

1570
01:20:47,319 --> 01:20:50,560
Speaker 4: Well, I see your point. You have a very good point,

1571
01:20:50,760 --> 01:20:56,000
but could I actually talk. Carbon has many ways to

1572
01:20:56,199 --> 01:21:00,680
go interact with other molecules twenty nine thousand ways. Bilicon

1573
01:21:01,000 --> 01:21:03,439
which is blowing on the periodic table could be a

1574
01:21:03,439 --> 01:21:05,920
good cant is a good candidate, but I don't think

1575
01:21:05,920 --> 01:21:08,800
it's as good as carbon. So it looks like there

1576
01:21:08,920 --> 01:21:12,359
was something behind this creation. Yes, it could have been

1577
01:21:12,560 --> 01:21:16,520
needed to make fetal, you know, because there's so many things.

1578
01:21:16,640 --> 01:21:19,239
Let me just give you an example. To create carbon

1579
01:21:19,319 --> 01:21:24,720
and nucleosynthesis in stars, you've got to get four heliumate

1580
01:21:25,000 --> 01:21:29,680
nuclei together with another helium nuclei to make a brilliant then,

1581
01:21:29,800 --> 01:21:31,640
but brilliant. But that's the fine.

1582
01:21:31,760 --> 01:21:32,600
Speaker 2: But this doesn't.

1583
01:21:33,199 --> 01:21:35,079
Speaker 1: But Bill, I want you to I want you to vote,

1584
01:21:35,119 --> 01:21:37,920
and I'm not gonna let you finish because what you're doing,

1585
01:21:39,479 --> 01:21:42,399
what you're what you're doing is you're you're ignoring the

1586
01:21:42,439 --> 01:21:45,640
admission that you just made thirty seconds ago. Right, if

1587
01:21:46,079 --> 01:21:49,439
if the fine tuning constants or whatever things you think

1588
01:21:49,439 --> 01:21:52,159
are finally tuned, that permits the universe we have now,

1589
01:21:52,600 --> 01:21:56,560
If those things aren't relevant because we haven't determined that

1590
01:21:56,560 --> 01:21:59,600
that was the goal of the universe, then just repeating

1591
01:21:59,640 --> 01:22:03,760
more of that is useless, like just continually repeating like, well, listen,

1592
01:22:03,880 --> 01:22:05,960
if this was different, then we wouldn't have what we

1593
01:22:06,039 --> 01:22:08,119
have now. Yes, you could do that till the cows

1594
01:22:08,119 --> 01:22:10,920
come home. But none of it is important until you

1595
01:22:10,920 --> 01:22:14,560
can demonstrate that the current formation of the universe was

1596
01:22:14,640 --> 01:22:18,840
the goal of the universe. Once you've attributed a goal,

1597
01:22:19,399 --> 01:22:23,119
then you can calculate how likely that goal is. But

1598
01:22:23,239 --> 01:22:25,680
you haven't been able to establish that the universe has

1599
01:22:25,680 --> 01:22:27,760
a goal yet. You're putting the cart before the horse.

1600
01:22:27,840 --> 01:22:32,039
Speaker 4: But the strong, the strong anthropic principle says that there

1601
01:22:32,279 --> 01:22:36,199
was a goal that to create carbon, and I literallyould

1602
01:22:36,199 --> 01:22:39,279
then take five seconds. A brilliant height, which is the

1603
01:22:39,359 --> 01:22:43,399
intermediate step between the final formation of carbon, literally takes

1604
01:22:43,399 --> 01:22:47,439
a split second. It's just remarkable. And I see your point, Richard.

1605
01:22:47,560 --> 01:22:50,239
If you look at the video which pop on Godless Granny,

1606
01:22:50,439 --> 01:22:54,720
he made very compelling points, just like you're making points.

1607
01:22:54,760 --> 01:22:58,319
But you've got to realize that there are theists since

1608
01:22:58,359 --> 01:23:02,640
Barrel and Tiplett, you know, six that have given pretty

1609
01:23:02,680 --> 01:23:06,359
good reasons to infer there might be a god.

1610
01:23:07,000 --> 01:23:09,359
Speaker 2: But we're asking you, we're not asking them, right.

1611
01:23:09,439 --> 01:23:11,840
Speaker 1: So in the argument that you've presented so far is

1612
01:23:11,840 --> 01:23:15,199
the fine tuning argument. And I've given you a really

1613
01:23:15,239 --> 01:23:19,199
good reason why the fine tuning argument fails. From my perspective,

1614
01:23:19,279 --> 01:23:22,159
it fails because in order for anything to be finely tuned,

1615
01:23:22,520 --> 01:23:25,399
we must determine that a it couldn't have been any

1616
01:23:25,399 --> 01:23:28,560
other way and still ended up with life, and b

1617
01:23:28,920 --> 01:23:31,560
that that was the goal. Like somehow the goal was

1618
01:23:31,600 --> 01:23:33,760
to get from point A to point B and we're

1619
01:23:33,800 --> 01:23:36,039
currently at point B. We don't know that to be

1620
01:23:36,119 --> 01:23:36,920
the case.

1621
01:23:37,119 --> 01:23:41,279
Speaker 4: Exactly, but there seems to be things that are so improbable,

1622
01:23:41,359 --> 01:23:46,359
like with paula exclusion principle that these electrons inhabit certain shells,

1623
01:23:46,399 --> 01:23:49,039
the two shells of a case show which is two,

1624
01:23:49,439 --> 01:23:50,560
then eight and eighteen.

1625
01:23:51,000 --> 01:23:56,720
Speaker 1: That I've addressed this, the improbability of something is useless

1626
01:23:56,800 --> 01:24:00,479
until you determine that that was a goal of something,

1627
01:24:00,600 --> 01:24:05,199
Like the goal of something is what establishes the improbability

1628
01:24:05,279 --> 01:24:10,479
is being meaningful, right, just something being improbable isn't isn't helpful.

1629
01:24:10,920 --> 01:24:13,279
So for example, like I'm sitting in a chair right now,

1630
01:24:13,600 --> 01:24:16,079
there are a billion other places I could be sitting

1631
01:24:16,119 --> 01:24:18,239
in a chair. The fact that I'm sitting in this

1632
01:24:18,359 --> 01:24:21,479
chair right now in this position has nothing to do

1633
01:24:21,560 --> 01:24:24,199
with fine tuning. It just happens to be the current

1634
01:24:24,239 --> 01:24:25,479
state of the universe.

1635
01:24:25,840 --> 01:24:28,880
Speaker 4: I understand that, But you've got to realize you're talking.

1636
01:24:28,600 --> 01:24:29,439
Speaker 5: The theist on this.

1637
01:24:29,640 --> 01:24:32,680
Speaker 4: You have theists listening to you, Christians listening to it,

1638
01:24:33,079 --> 01:24:37,439
and what these apologists do is like, for example, what

1639
01:24:37,600 --> 01:24:38,159
turned me on.

1640
01:24:38,159 --> 01:24:41,000
Speaker 1: With Luke bah But you're the apologist universe.

1641
01:24:41,119 --> 01:24:46,680
Speaker 4: Okay, Well that's that's a scary thought went on And

1642
01:24:46,720 --> 01:24:48,600
I've only been as for a moment.

1643
01:24:48,680 --> 01:24:52,119
Speaker 1: You came into the conversation saying that argue, the fine

1644
01:24:52,119 --> 01:24:53,560
tuning argument proves God.

1645
01:24:53,640 --> 01:24:55,119
Speaker 2: That means you're a theist.

1646
01:24:55,479 --> 01:24:58,880
Speaker 4: Yes, I've only been a theist for a month. Give

1647
01:24:58,920 --> 01:25:03,119
me some spac here, okay, but yes, the improbabilities, like

1648
01:25:03,239 --> 01:25:05,359
the cosmological concept is final.

1649
01:25:05,680 --> 01:25:09,800
Speaker 3: So so so Bill, I understand that you're that you're

1650
01:25:09,880 --> 01:25:12,800
using these large numbers, and I typically call this just

1651
01:25:13,000 --> 01:25:16,600
argument from large numbers because it it always whenever somebody

1652
01:25:16,600 --> 01:25:19,840
says these things, it always makes me think and and

1653
01:25:20,479 --> 01:25:22,319
usually it turns out to be correct. That you just

1654
01:25:22,319 --> 01:25:26,439
simply don't understand how probabilities work or how statistics work,

1655
01:25:26,840 --> 01:25:30,000
because you're mentioning these very large numbers. But when you

1656
01:25:30,039 --> 01:25:33,640
consider the sets that those large numbers are contained in,

1657
01:25:34,800 --> 01:25:37,239
they are this is the likelihood that it's going to

1658
01:25:37,319 --> 01:25:40,560
happen at any one point in time, not the likelihood

1659
01:25:40,560 --> 01:25:44,319
that it will happen at all. And so unless you're

1660
01:25:44,359 --> 01:25:48,840
positing this number the statistic is absolutely zero, then it

1661
01:25:48,920 --> 01:25:51,840
will happen given a large enough set, And when we're

1662
01:25:51,880 --> 01:25:55,439
talking about the universe, I feel like the set is

1663
01:25:55,479 --> 01:25:58,319
going to be large enough where it definitely will happen

1664
01:25:58,479 --> 01:26:02,600
at some point. It's just rare that it's going to happen.

1665
01:26:02,720 --> 01:26:04,680
And I feel like that is the main thing that

1666
01:26:04,760 --> 01:26:09,239
a lot of feists out there just don't understand whenever

1667
01:26:09,279 --> 01:26:13,159
they start bringing up probabilities. Unless you're positing a zero

1668
01:26:13,239 --> 01:26:15,680
percent chance, then it will happen.

1669
01:26:15,800 --> 01:26:15,960
Speaker 5: You know.

1670
01:26:16,079 --> 01:26:19,399
Speaker 4: That's a good argument, and I think that's one Richard made.

1671
01:26:19,439 --> 01:26:23,640
But you know, and I don't trust when they use

1672
01:26:23,720 --> 01:26:26,640
these large numbers. I do not trust any Christian about

1673
01:26:26,720 --> 01:26:31,880
pretty much anything. But the numbers are unimageable, like the

1674
01:26:32,119 --> 01:26:34,399
cosmological constant feed to take the.

1675
01:26:35,720 --> 01:26:38,680
Speaker 3: Right bill bill. But still again, unless you're saying that

1676
01:26:38,720 --> 01:26:42,800
it's a zero percent chance, then there then it will

1677
01:26:42,880 --> 01:26:47,199
one hundred percent happen. It's just what that improbability is

1678
01:26:47,239 --> 01:26:50,840
telling you is is how likely it is to occur

1679
01:26:51,079 --> 01:26:54,479
at any one single point in time in this set,

1680
01:26:54,800 --> 01:26:56,680
and when we're talking about the universe and how old

1681
01:26:56,720 --> 01:26:59,399
the universe is, and then you think about that, and

1682
01:26:59,439 --> 01:27:02,359
then how many times can chemical reactions occur, like in

1683
01:27:02,399 --> 01:27:04,560
a single second, in a single milliseconds and all of

1684
01:27:04,560 --> 01:27:07,319
a sudden, how many chemical reactions have occurred in the

1685
01:27:07,479 --> 01:27:10,560
entire universe up until this point right now? If you

1686
01:27:10,600 --> 01:27:14,319
take that set in you know, you unless you have

1687
01:27:14,439 --> 01:27:17,800
a zero percent chance of something happening, then one hundred

1688
01:27:17,800 --> 01:27:20,359
percent has happened at least once in that set, if

1689
01:27:20,399 --> 01:27:22,560
not twice. Have you heard of the pigeon hole?

1690
01:27:23,960 --> 01:27:25,039
Speaker 2: You know, not.

1691
01:27:24,920 --> 01:27:29,479
Speaker 3: Hypostles, but the principal pigeonhole principle? No, go ahead, Okay,

1692
01:27:29,600 --> 01:27:32,119
imagine a board that has twelve holes in it, right,

1693
01:27:32,399 --> 01:27:36,239
You've got thirteen pigeons. Okay, you're going to put one

1694
01:27:36,279 --> 01:27:40,000
pigeon in each hole. What's the likelihood that one of

1695
01:27:40,039 --> 01:27:43,239
those holes is going to have two pigeons? Pretty good,

1696
01:27:44,079 --> 01:27:47,000
it's one hundred percent. Like the likelihood that one of

1697
01:27:47,039 --> 01:27:49,279
those holes is going to have one is going to

1698
01:27:49,319 --> 01:27:51,960
have two pigeons. It's one hundred percent likely that it's

1699
01:27:52,000 --> 01:27:54,279
going to happen. Now, of course, we can do the

1700
01:27:54,319 --> 01:27:57,800
math on this, on the probabilities of any one particular

1701
01:27:57,840 --> 01:28:00,920
hole having that second pigeon. But the fact that there

1702
01:28:01,079 --> 01:28:03,199
is a second pigeon in one of those holes is

1703
01:28:03,239 --> 01:28:06,279
one hundred percent likely. And that's exactly what we're saying,

1704
01:28:06,319 --> 01:28:09,119
like about life and everything like that, and the fine

1705
01:28:09,119 --> 01:28:12,359
tending of this universe. Like I mean, it's just, uh,

1706
01:28:12,840 --> 01:28:15,520
you bringing up these big and small numbers as far

1707
01:28:15,560 --> 01:28:18,520
as probabilities go. It doesn't really move the needle at

1708
01:28:18,560 --> 01:28:22,520
all as to pointing towards a god because those things

1709
01:28:22,560 --> 01:28:25,720
would one hundred percent happen in this very large set.

1710
01:28:25,880 --> 01:28:29,159
Speaker 4: Well, I think I don't the apologist would say no

1711
01:28:29,640 --> 01:28:32,640
that when it's ten to the one twentieth, that's like

1712
01:28:32,800 --> 01:28:34,479
saying it's impossible that it.

1713
01:28:34,479 --> 01:28:35,840
Speaker 5: Would never have that.

1714
01:28:36,079 --> 01:28:40,000
Speaker 4: This expansion rate has to be too precise, too fine

1715
01:28:40,039 --> 01:28:42,079
too to happen by sham.

1716
01:28:42,239 --> 01:28:44,720
Speaker 3: But Bill, Bill, if I can ask you how many

1717
01:28:44,960 --> 01:28:47,439
so earlier at the beginning of the call, you brought

1718
01:28:47,520 --> 01:28:50,319
up the weak nuclear force, and you brought up the

1719
01:28:50,359 --> 01:28:53,840
fact that like if it was five percent different strong okay,

1720
01:28:53,840 --> 01:28:57,600
strong nuclear first force, if it was five percent different

1721
01:28:57,680 --> 01:29:00,840
than what one thing or another wondn't be able to form.

1722
01:29:00,880 --> 01:29:03,000
I can't remember exactly what you said it doesn't matter.

1723
01:29:03,319 --> 01:29:06,920
Speaker 4: But you get the period you don't even get periodic table.

1724
01:29:07,000 --> 01:29:10,119
You just get lonely high case right right.

1725
01:29:10,199 --> 01:29:12,479
Speaker 3: That's not my point. That's not my point here, Bill, Bill,

1726
01:29:12,520 --> 01:29:15,680
that's not my point here. I want, like, in terms

1727
01:29:15,720 --> 01:29:19,479
of numbers here, how many numbers on on the on

1728
01:29:19,479 --> 01:29:24,760
on the real scale here? Uh uh occur between negative

1729
01:29:24,800 --> 01:29:26,319
five percent and five percent?

1730
01:29:26,960 --> 01:29:27,640
Speaker 5: An infinity?

1731
01:29:28,199 --> 01:29:31,560
Speaker 3: Holy shit, really an infinity of numbers in there. So

1732
01:29:31,600 --> 01:29:35,800
you're telling me that there's an infinite amount of different

1733
01:29:35,800 --> 01:29:39,960
configurations of this universe that still produce the periodic table. Well,

1734
01:29:40,079 --> 01:29:40,560
fuck me.

1735
01:29:43,720 --> 01:29:47,880
Speaker 4: I'm saying you guys have good arguments, but you have,

1736
01:29:48,680 --> 01:29:50,920
like I said, I was the eightiest part of the

1737
01:29:50,960 --> 01:29:54,439
atheist bookook, So I took a stance. So I've got

1738
01:29:54,479 --> 01:29:57,119
to make a decision, you know, is the is it

1739
01:29:57,279 --> 01:30:01,399
more probable? I'm not saying this is improved. I'm just

1740
01:30:01,520 --> 01:30:04,600
saying it looks like there's so many herbles, there's so

1741
01:30:04,760 --> 01:30:07,039
many things that have to go right to have a

1742
01:30:07,199 --> 01:30:09,399
life permitting universe that.

1743
01:30:10,039 --> 01:30:13,479
Speaker 1: Again, none of that matters until you've determined that the

1744
01:30:13,479 --> 01:30:15,399
goal of the universe was to produce life.

1745
01:30:15,399 --> 01:30:18,439
Speaker 2: Because this is a preser. You keep begging the question.

1746
01:30:18,760 --> 01:30:22,520
Speaker 1: You have to demonstrate that the purpose is to create

1747
01:30:22,640 --> 01:30:27,600
life before you can calculate what the likelihood that somebody

1748
01:30:27,720 --> 01:30:29,439
setting out to do that could do it.

1749
01:30:29,640 --> 01:30:32,840
Speaker 4: Well, who can say that, what's the purpose of the

1750
01:30:32,960 --> 01:30:34,439
universe or God whoever?

1751
01:30:35,600 --> 01:30:38,159
Speaker 1: That's the point. The point is you would have to

1752
01:30:38,279 --> 01:30:41,720
demonstrate that the universe had a purpose to create life

1753
01:30:42,319 --> 01:30:44,800
before you can say, look, how rare it is that

1754
01:30:44,840 --> 01:30:48,760
the universe produced life, Because if the universe is timeless

1755
01:30:48,760 --> 01:30:52,279
and endless and is completely devoid of a god, it

1756
01:30:52,319 --> 01:30:56,640
would still produce life eventually. Like if the universe is

1757
01:30:56,720 --> 01:30:59,520
infinite in the past and the future, and the probability

1758
01:30:59,560 --> 01:31:03,359
of producing life as anything but zero, it will eventually

1759
01:31:03,399 --> 01:31:05,560
produce life no matter what it will happen.

1760
01:31:05,840 --> 01:31:08,880
Speaker 4: Well, what they say is, you know, the cyclical conformal

1761
01:31:08,960 --> 01:31:12,279
cosmology is what we have as one universe dies down

1762
01:31:12,319 --> 01:31:16,079
in the little charcoal or briskets of the dying universe

1763
01:31:16,159 --> 01:31:19,560
goes and pops a you our universe in But you

1764
01:31:19,680 --> 01:31:22,359
still have to have a universe generator, don't you.

1765
01:31:22,359 --> 01:31:24,239
Speaker 2: No, you don't have to have a universe generator.

1766
01:31:24,279 --> 01:31:28,119
Speaker 1: But there isn't adjusted point, right, So if you believe

1767
01:31:28,119 --> 01:31:31,119
in a cycle universe, where there's there's no beginning and

1768
01:31:31,319 --> 01:31:33,960
end of it, like it's just always existed and the

1769
01:31:33,960 --> 01:31:38,199
probability of life arising is anything but zero percent.

1770
01:31:38,520 --> 01:31:41,880
Speaker 2: That means it's a guarantee that life will arise eventually.

1771
01:31:42,439 --> 01:31:45,800
Maybe yeah, maybe yeah, I mean it's just mathematically true.

1772
01:31:46,039 --> 01:31:49,399
Speaker 1: If the universe exists forever and the probability is anything

1773
01:31:49,399 --> 01:31:52,119
but zero, then it has to produce life at some point.

1774
01:31:52,319 --> 01:31:54,079
Doesn't mean it's going to go on forever, but like

1775
01:31:54,119 --> 01:31:57,439
our galaxy is likely to collide with the Andromeda galaxy

1776
01:31:57,479 --> 01:32:00,880
in like four billion years. When that happens, hell, shit,

1777
01:32:00,960 --> 01:32:02,760
we could be completely wiped out and then there might

1778
01:32:02,800 --> 01:32:03,479
be no life again.

1779
01:32:03,760 --> 01:32:06,119
Speaker 4: But hete death of the universe is almost certain. These

1780
01:32:06,119 --> 01:32:07,159
starts are going to burn out.

1781
01:32:07,479 --> 01:32:09,960
Speaker 1: Well, I don't know that to be the case. Like,

1782
01:32:10,279 --> 01:32:13,239
the latest DESY data seems to suggest that the expansion

1783
01:32:13,840 --> 01:32:17,199
rate is slowing, like it's still accelerating obviously, but the

1784
01:32:17,239 --> 01:32:21,039
acceleration rate is lessening, right, Which if that's the case,

1785
01:32:21,079 --> 01:32:23,520
if they confirm it in the twenty twenty six readings,

1786
01:32:23,760 --> 01:32:26,239
that that really is the case, then it certainly could

1787
01:32:26,279 --> 01:32:29,319
be possible that we have a cyclical universe that eventually

1788
01:32:29,640 --> 01:32:34,079
gets drawn back in through gravity and then contracts and

1789
01:32:34,159 --> 01:32:35,319
expands endlessly.

1790
01:32:36,239 --> 01:32:38,159
Speaker 2: So but no matter what your.

1791
01:32:38,039 --> 01:32:40,920
Speaker 1: Model is, right, but whether you have like a rubber

1792
01:32:40,960 --> 01:32:43,760
band model or not rubber band model, if the universe

1793
01:32:44,000 --> 01:32:47,199
is around forever, then it's just a guarantee that life

1794
01:32:47,239 --> 01:32:49,960
will be produced at some point, would be, could be?

1795
01:32:50,319 --> 01:32:52,319
Speaker 2: Yeah, So yeah, Well, listen, we're.

1796
01:32:52,119 --> 01:32:55,880
Speaker 4: All threading water here because this is theoretical physics that

1797
01:32:56,560 --> 01:32:58,399
is pointing people to God.

1798
01:32:59,239 --> 01:33:02,399
Speaker 3: So I'm sorry, I'm sorry, I have to interrupt right here,

1799
01:33:02,439 --> 01:33:04,920
real quick, Bill, Bill, I have to interrupt because everything

1800
01:33:04,960 --> 01:33:07,640
that we've talked about so far has just been statistics

1801
01:33:07,760 --> 01:33:11,600
and not like theoretical physics necessarily, So like all of

1802
01:33:11,640 --> 01:33:15,680
your arguments are just basically, oh, there's this giant number

1803
01:33:15,920 --> 01:33:19,640
that when you take that as a a likelihood or

1804
01:33:19,640 --> 01:33:24,920
a probability of this universe existing, it is incredibly low

1805
01:33:25,079 --> 01:33:29,560
and is therefore just as well impossible. And what we're

1806
01:33:29,600 --> 01:33:31,760
trying to explain to you is that from a basic

1807
01:33:31,880 --> 01:33:36,800
statistics and probability perspective, you're just wrong about that because

1808
01:33:38,239 --> 01:33:43,640
due to how statistics and probability just works naturally, the

1809
01:33:43,800 --> 01:33:47,039
likelihood of life developing in a universe is going to

1810
01:33:47,039 --> 01:33:50,000
be one hundred percent, especially when we're already here to

1811
01:33:50,119 --> 01:33:51,319
be able to analyze it.

1812
01:33:51,399 --> 01:33:54,520
Speaker 4: Well, Okay, I understand what you're saying, but you're familiar

1813
01:33:54,600 --> 01:33:56,239
with the Discovery Institute.

1814
01:33:56,760 --> 01:33:59,840
Speaker 5: You know what's the being. So what they say is a.

1815
01:34:00,079 --> 01:34:03,800
Speaker 4: Protein form, the odds of these aminio acids coming together,

1816
01:34:03,840 --> 01:34:05,960
and you have the car reality problem where they all

1817
01:34:05,960 --> 01:34:07,039
have to be left handed.

1818
01:34:07,279 --> 01:34:09,600
Speaker 3: Okay, okay, but Bill, unless you're going to tell me

1819
01:34:09,680 --> 01:34:13,560
that it's a zero percent likelihood, then it really doesn't matter.

1820
01:34:13,560 --> 01:34:15,239
Speaker 2: Right, So Bill, I just want to make sure we're

1821
01:34:15,279 --> 01:34:15,760
clear on this.

1822
01:34:15,840 --> 01:34:19,239
Speaker 1: You keep saying that there's this thing, and the odds

1823
01:34:19,239 --> 01:34:22,359
of this thing happening is really high, and we've given

1824
01:34:22,359 --> 01:34:24,359
you a bunch of reasons why it doesn't matter what

1825
01:34:24,399 --> 01:34:27,159
the odds are. If the odds are one in fifty

1826
01:34:27,319 --> 01:34:30,479
or one in fifty trillion, it still is irrelevant. Like

1827
01:34:30,520 --> 01:34:33,640
the number of the odds is not relevant.

1828
01:34:33,800 --> 01:34:36,279
Speaker 4: Well, if this is so clear, and he says the

1829
01:34:36,279 --> 01:34:38,640
odds are ten to the seventy seventh and the amount

1830
01:34:38,640 --> 01:34:41,920
of protons universes, they so that's saying there's no chance.

1831
01:34:41,960 --> 01:34:43,600
Speaker 7: Basically, that's what these guys are saying.

1832
01:34:43,720 --> 01:34:47,119
Speaker 3: That's literally not it. No it's literally not saying that

1833
01:34:47,199 --> 01:34:50,359
there's no chance. It's just that it's rare. That's all

1834
01:34:50,399 --> 01:34:52,319
that says.

1835
01:34:51,560 --> 01:34:52,680
Speaker 6: Like dumb and dumber.

1836
01:34:52,800 --> 01:34:56,239
Speaker 4: So you're saying there's a chance, Remember what's the chances?

1837
01:34:56,720 --> 01:34:58,199
Speaker 6: Oh, it would be like.

1838
01:34:58,159 --> 01:34:59,119
Speaker 5: One in a million.

1839
01:34:59,279 --> 01:35:02,920
Speaker 3: So so the likelihood, so the no, you just I

1840
01:35:02,960 --> 01:35:05,520
feel like you just I've explained this before. So the

1841
01:35:05,640 --> 01:35:09,479
likelihood of it happening is one hundred percent, Bill, The

1842
01:35:09,600 --> 01:35:12,920
likelihood of it happening is one hundred percent. But the

1843
01:35:13,039 --> 01:35:16,560
likelihood of it happening at any one moment in time

1844
01:35:17,079 --> 01:35:20,239
is that percentage that you're bringing up. So we're not

1845
01:35:20,439 --> 01:35:23,680
saying that you know it's going to happen right now.

1846
01:35:23,960 --> 01:35:26,279
What we're saying is is that it will one hundred

1847
01:35:26,279 --> 01:35:28,960
percent happen at some point. That's what you're.

1848
01:35:28,840 --> 01:35:32,039
Speaker 4: Saying, one hundred percent you're saying, right.

1849
01:35:31,960 --> 01:35:33,239
Speaker 3: That's how likelihoods work.

1850
01:35:33,319 --> 01:35:37,439
Speaker 4: Yes, yeah, okay, So what I'm asking you John, if

1851
01:35:37,720 --> 01:35:40,920
in you're You've made a great argument, it's very compelling.

1852
01:35:41,159 --> 01:35:44,479
So why doesn't the Discovery Institute say, oh my gosh,

1853
01:35:44,640 --> 01:35:49,760
I heard John articulation, So what are we talking about?

1854
01:35:49,760 --> 01:35:51,199
Speaker 5: Why don't we use these numbers?

1855
01:35:51,560 --> 01:35:54,560
Speaker 3: So they're they're heavily So the Discovery Institute is a

1856
01:35:54,560 --> 01:35:58,479
heavily biased think tank that is definitely geared towards a

1857
01:35:58,640 --> 01:36:04,319
very creationist, fundamentalist sort of view of science and everything.

1858
01:36:04,479 --> 01:36:07,399
So you're you're just you're basically giving me a creationist

1859
01:36:07,479 --> 01:36:10,600
source here and telling me, well, why don't the creationists

1860
01:36:10,680 --> 01:36:13,960
admit this, because they're not going to admit that they're

1861
01:36:13,960 --> 01:36:19,359
going because the basic, uh playbook of creationism is to

1862
01:36:19,760 --> 01:36:23,399
twist the information into straw men so that it can

1863
01:36:23,520 --> 01:36:27,439
convince people of things that are not reasonable. That's any

1864
01:36:28,000 --> 01:36:31,159
creationist argument will fit that particular mold. And everything that

1865
01:36:31,199 --> 01:36:34,039
you said here as far as like the creation or

1866
01:36:34,199 --> 01:36:36,960
the Discovery Institute goes, is exactly that.

1867
01:36:37,560 --> 01:36:41,239
Speaker 1: Yeah, and admire by the way, who wrote the book obviously,

1868
01:36:41,239 --> 01:36:47,239
Stephen Meyer. Okay, but just Discovery Institute is not a

1869
01:36:47,239 --> 01:36:49,880
good representation of the science. So like, for example, my

1870
01:36:49,960 --> 01:36:51,840
friend doctor blind sent me a survey that was done

1871
01:36:51,880 --> 01:36:56,920
recently among like actual cosmologists about the fine tuning constants.

1872
01:36:56,960 --> 01:36:59,760
And the question is, in your opinion, what explains the

1873
01:36:59,800 --> 01:37:03,840
value values of physical constants of nature and the claimed

1874
01:37:03,880 --> 01:37:10,199
anthropic coincidences? And three percent of the respondents, Yeah, that's.

1875
01:37:10,000 --> 01:37:12,960
Speaker 5: What only that's what Richard said. So I believe you.

1876
01:37:13,239 --> 01:37:17,439
Speaker 1: Three percent of the respondents, which is only two claimed

1877
01:37:17,479 --> 01:37:20,520
that they believed it could be explained by an intelligent designer.

1878
01:37:20,840 --> 01:37:22,800
Speaker 2: The rest of them had different answers.

1879
01:37:22,840 --> 01:37:25,159
Speaker 1: In fact, the most popular answer was that their brute

1880
01:37:25,159 --> 01:37:28,520
facts and they need no further explanation. A twenty four

1881
01:37:28,560 --> 01:37:32,239
percent went to a multiverse principle to explain them, and

1882
01:37:32,239 --> 01:37:34,880
then their other explanations. But the bottom line is, like,

1883
01:37:35,159 --> 01:37:38,199
if you're just going to quote, like, well the Discovery Institute, well,

1884
01:37:38,399 --> 01:37:41,960
I'm not sure like just saying some other guy believes

1885
01:37:42,159 --> 01:37:45,239
that he agrees with me, isn't that helpful because like

1886
01:37:45,319 --> 01:37:48,359
the bulk of scientists, the bulk of physicists like agree

1887
01:37:48,359 --> 01:37:50,760
with John and I. Right, So it's I'm not sure

1888
01:37:50,800 --> 01:37:53,600
that like the appeal to poor authority is helpful.

1889
01:37:53,920 --> 01:37:57,359
Speaker 4: Well, that is very disserting that the guys that know

1890
01:37:57,520 --> 01:38:00,680
this stuff, that quirk and the option down in the

1891
01:38:00,760 --> 01:38:04,560
dynamics and stuff, these really detailed things, but which seemed

1892
01:38:04,600 --> 01:38:06,680
to point to that they know this better than we

1893
01:38:06,760 --> 01:38:07,680
will ever know it.

1894
01:38:08,319 --> 01:38:11,000
Speaker 5: Only three percent of like you said, like Richard said.

1895
01:38:10,960 --> 01:38:13,920
Speaker 4: I believe that this point is to God, So it's

1896
01:38:14,079 --> 01:38:16,960
very disconcerting and uh, probably.

1897
01:38:17,119 --> 01:38:23,720
Speaker 1: For us obviously. But listen, Bill, I think you've been

1898
01:38:23,800 --> 01:38:25,880
pleasant to talk to, but we're we're running up on

1899
01:38:25,920 --> 01:38:28,279
a time limit here and we've got to do some

1900
01:38:28,359 --> 01:38:30,039
things before we cut the show.

1901
01:38:30,399 --> 01:38:32,760
Speaker 5: Yeah, yeah, this has been great. You guys have been terrific.

1902
01:38:32,800 --> 01:38:35,000
Speaker 4: And I'm a big fan of John obviously. I think

1903
01:38:35,039 --> 01:38:37,239
he has such a great sense of humor. And and

1904
01:38:37,279 --> 01:38:40,560
by the way, it's the things on davilas Granny Theis

1905
01:38:40,560 --> 01:38:44,960
it's atheist refuge theass, so you can see somebody actually

1906
01:38:45,039 --> 01:38:47,640
knows what they're talking about to a great extent refuge

1907
01:38:47,680 --> 01:38:49,479
these So thanks guys, I'll see you later.

1908
01:38:49,640 --> 01:38:50,520
Speaker 2: Bye.

1909
01:38:50,520 --> 01:38:51,000
Speaker 3: Thanks Bill.

1910
01:38:51,640 --> 01:38:53,880
Speaker 1: We've got a handful of super Test to get through

1911
01:38:53,920 --> 01:38:58,039
and then we've got to uh conclude our show.

1912
01:38:58,119 --> 01:38:59,520
Speaker 2: We appreciate everyone that called in.

1913
01:39:00,239 --> 01:39:02,239
Speaker 1: It looks like our first troup chat is from our

1914
01:39:02,239 --> 01:39:05,239
friend Chad, and Chad says, where can I find a

1915
01:39:05,399 --> 01:39:07,960
list of the best anti theist arguments?

1916
01:39:08,479 --> 01:39:11,920
Speaker 2: Is there any agreed upon best sources? Thank you, Chad.

1917
01:39:11,960 --> 01:39:13,920
Speaker 1: This is a good question. I don't know if there's

1918
01:39:13,960 --> 01:39:17,439
a best source. Here's what I can tell you though,

1919
01:39:17,520 --> 01:39:21,920
for like anti theism I would ask which theists are

1920
01:39:21,960 --> 01:39:24,560
you trying to refute or which theism are you trying

1921
01:39:24,600 --> 01:39:27,960
to refute, because like, if you're trying to refute like

1922
01:39:28,000 --> 01:39:30,840
the Bible God, to me, the best sources just to

1923
01:39:30,880 --> 01:39:33,319
read the book, like literally just read the Bible from

1924
01:39:33,319 --> 01:39:36,680
front the cover, from fromt the cover, from from cover

1925
01:39:36,760 --> 01:39:40,279
to back. Uh, and you'll you'll have basically what you

1926
01:39:40,399 --> 01:39:42,520
need to say, Yeah, this God is silly.

1927
01:39:43,159 --> 01:39:45,920
Speaker 2: After that you can maybe read some other books.

1928
01:39:46,159 --> 01:39:49,039
Speaker 1: I can't actually promote other people's books on this particular

1929
01:39:49,079 --> 01:39:53,960
live stream, but I would I would engage with people

1930
01:39:54,119 --> 01:39:56,760
in the field of Biblical studies. And so if you

1931
01:39:56,800 --> 01:40:01,600
want to know more about the you know, how to

1932
01:40:01,640 --> 01:40:05,640
interpret different Bible passages that seem to be like it

1933
01:40:05,680 --> 01:40:09,159
would go against the theistic worldview. Look at the academics, say,

1934
01:40:09,159 --> 01:40:11,199
a lot of the academics that are writing commentaries on

1935
01:40:11,279 --> 01:40:14,279
particular passages are pretty darn honest, not that some of

1936
01:40:14,319 --> 01:40:16,920
them aren't, but you'll find a lot of honest, critical

1937
01:40:16,960 --> 01:40:21,039
commentaries on the Bible that will more or less indicate

1938
01:40:21,119 --> 01:40:24,039
to you like there's a problem here, let's talk about

1939
01:40:24,039 --> 01:40:25,159
this particular problem.

1940
01:40:25,840 --> 01:40:29,840
Speaker 3: Yeah. And for me on this uh, I really just

1941
01:40:30,399 --> 01:40:34,159
watch a lot of debate stuff because I can usually

1942
01:40:34,399 --> 01:40:36,600
pick up on, you know, what's a good argument, what's

1943
01:40:36,640 --> 01:40:40,720
a bad argument. I mean, I'm not trying to you know,

1944
01:40:40,800 --> 01:40:43,119
toot my own horn here about being able to discern

1945
01:40:43,159 --> 01:40:45,600
good arguments from bad arguments. But I feel like everybody

1946
01:40:45,600 --> 01:40:48,039
has as a good sense of what's convincing them and

1947
01:40:48,079 --> 01:40:50,840
what isn't, and so like I would, I would watch

1948
01:40:50,840 --> 01:40:53,800
some of the better, you know, debates out there on

1949
01:40:54,000 --> 01:40:57,039
whatever topic you're you're trying to look at. I wouldn't

1950
01:40:57,239 --> 01:40:59,960
necessarily look at quarrelsome debates or anything like that where

1951
01:41:00,199 --> 01:41:02,520
just people yelling at each other, but you know, some

1952
01:41:02,520 --> 01:41:07,239
some more structured or some more uh, you know, reasonable debates.

1953
01:41:07,279 --> 01:41:08,960
I mean you can find them out there on YouTube.

1954
01:41:09,039 --> 01:41:09,199
Speaker 5: Yeah.

1955
01:41:09,199 --> 01:41:10,760
Speaker 2: I think debates are really good for learning.

1956
01:41:11,239 --> 01:41:14,359
Speaker 1: We've got another superject from doctor Joe, Thank you so much.

1957
01:41:14,359 --> 01:41:18,399
After Joe says, I think ben is looking for logical fallacy,

1958
01:41:18,800 --> 01:41:20,680
maybe cognitive distortion.

1959
01:41:21,239 --> 01:41:21,920
Speaker 2: I agree.

1960
01:41:21,920 --> 01:41:24,840
Speaker 1: I think that's probably what oh Benjamin was looking for.

1961
01:41:24,960 --> 01:41:28,079
But you know, when you're on these shows, sometimes you

1962
01:41:28,279 --> 01:41:29,399
lose the words you need.

1963
01:41:30,000 --> 01:41:31,399
Speaker 2: You get kind of tongue tied.

1964
01:41:32,439 --> 01:41:36,039
Speaker 3: Yeah, and then next we've got Atlas who says, I

1965
01:41:36,079 --> 01:41:37,560
really enjoy listening to you both.

1966
01:41:37,680 --> 01:41:37,920
Speaker 5: John.

1967
01:41:37,960 --> 01:41:40,039
Speaker 3: It was great to meet you and Casey and nan

1968
01:41:40,079 --> 01:41:42,000
o'conn and I look forward to seeing you guys again

1969
01:41:42,239 --> 01:41:44,800
justin maybe I'll get to meet you someday. Great work, guys,

1970
01:41:45,159 --> 01:41:47,199
it was great meeting you there Atlas. I don't know

1971
01:41:47,239 --> 01:41:50,279
if Alice is still watching, but Alice it was. It

1972
01:41:50,319 --> 01:41:51,439
was really nice meeting you.

1973
01:41:52,000 --> 01:41:55,840
Speaker 2: And I'm I cannot pronounce his name.

1974
01:41:56,279 --> 01:41:59,159
Speaker 1: I am E t R eight er. Thank you so

1975
01:41:59,239 --> 01:42:04,399
much for the time that was says, Oh, I'm e trader.

1976
01:42:04,479 --> 01:42:06,239
Speaker 2: That's what it means, I'm e trader.

1977
01:42:07,159 --> 01:42:10,399
Speaker 1: Why is it that people like Adam, who can't even

1978
01:42:10,439 --> 01:42:12,560
do algebra often misquote Einstein?

1979
01:42:12,920 --> 01:42:15,319
Speaker 2: Do they think that makes them sound smarter?

1980
01:42:15,880 --> 01:42:18,439
Speaker 1: Well, the thing of it is, I'm not sure that

1981
01:42:18,960 --> 01:42:22,279
they think it makes them sound smart to misquote someone.

1982
01:42:22,319 --> 01:42:24,720
I think that in their mind they're quoting them correctly.

1983
01:42:25,239 --> 01:42:27,319
But you guys know, as well as anyone else you know,

1984
01:42:27,319 --> 01:42:29,239
at a lot of times when people are quoting the

1985
01:42:29,319 --> 01:42:33,600
science folk, they either misquote them or they attribute things

1986
01:42:33,640 --> 01:42:35,680
to them that they didn't say, and they just don't

1987
01:42:35,680 --> 01:42:37,880
know any better because they're not intimately familiar.

1988
01:42:37,960 --> 01:42:39,119
Speaker 2: They just heard it on the internet.

1989
01:42:39,359 --> 01:42:41,439
Speaker 1: They're repeating what they heard on the Internet, and they

1990
01:42:42,159 --> 01:42:44,640
don't know that they're making an error.

1991
01:42:45,319 --> 01:42:48,359
Speaker 3: Yeah, And I would also say that that's typically an

1992
01:42:48,439 --> 01:42:53,039
appeal to, you know, authority, or an argument from authority.

1993
01:42:52,920 --> 01:42:55,600
They think that just because they can say something that

1994
01:42:55,640 --> 01:43:00,520
they think Einstein said, that somehow disproves somebody. But you

1995
01:43:00,560 --> 01:43:04,159
know that's that's not the case at all. Next we

1996
01:43:04,319 --> 01:43:08,640
have Lord Beegers, who says, this wild and crazy guy

1997
01:43:09,239 --> 01:43:13,720
will lk kind of rules, low key, low key kind

1998
01:43:13,720 --> 01:43:14,159
of rules.

1999
01:43:14,159 --> 01:43:14,560
Speaker 1: Low ki.

2000
01:43:14,760 --> 01:43:15,239
Speaker 3: I gotcha.

2001
01:43:15,760 --> 01:43:17,399
Speaker 2: I'm not cool enough to know what that would have meant.

2002
01:43:17,399 --> 01:43:17,640
Speaker 5: Either.

2003
01:43:18,560 --> 01:43:23,520
Speaker 2: What's okay? Nobody on fire?

2004
01:43:23,600 --> 01:43:26,800
Speaker 1: Great to see you tonight, says the one Doug will

2005
01:43:26,840 --> 01:43:31,359
remain when Andromeda collides with us, for he grounds the universe.

2006
01:43:31,720 --> 01:43:36,840
My footstays firm, for it rests upon him Metamorphosism sixty

2007
01:43:36,920 --> 01:43:38,319
nine four twenty.

2008
01:43:39,720 --> 01:43:39,800
Speaker 5: A.

2009
01:43:40,039 --> 01:43:42,920
Speaker 1: Doug absolutely uh.

2010
01:43:43,079 --> 01:43:45,600
Speaker 3: And then finally tonight we have some kind of Dicky

2011
01:43:46,399 --> 01:43:48,600
who says a rumor has it that a math teacher

2012
01:43:48,640 --> 01:43:51,680
will be hosting talk Keithan on nine fourteen. If Bill

2013
01:43:51,760 --> 01:43:53,960
wants to call in and talk to him or I

2014
01:43:54,000 --> 01:43:59,439
mean them me or I mean them about probability. I

2015
01:43:59,439 --> 01:44:03,079
definitely said just that. I mean, I really kicked myself

2016
01:44:03,079 --> 01:44:04,840
in the butt every day because I didn't get my

2017
01:44:05,640 --> 01:44:08,720
bachelor's in mathematics because I was like three classes away.

2018
01:44:08,840 --> 01:44:11,600
I've only got a minor in it, So, like you know,

2019
01:44:12,319 --> 01:44:15,760
but definitely call in and talk to to Dicky there.

2020
01:44:16,000 --> 01:44:18,920
Speaker 1: I did not and do not have the mental fortitude

2021
01:44:18,960 --> 01:44:20,600
for that kind of nonsense, but I'm.

2022
01:44:20,439 --> 01:44:21,640
Speaker 2: Glad that people like you do.

2023
01:44:22,560 --> 01:44:22,880
Speaker 5: Also.

2024
01:44:23,279 --> 01:44:27,760
Speaker 1: Let's thank our backup post for the night, Jimmy. Let's

2025
01:44:27,760 --> 01:44:28,920
see that beautiful is there?

2026
01:44:28,920 --> 01:44:30,520
Speaker 2: We go, Jimmy.

2027
01:44:30,640 --> 01:44:31,439
Speaker 1: Great to see you.

2028
01:44:31,960 --> 01:44:37,159
Speaker 2: Hey, Jimmy, your thoughts on the show? Oh boy, what was.

2029
01:44:37,159 --> 01:44:39,319
Speaker 11: A fun one tonight? I don't know what was happening

2030
01:44:39,960 --> 01:44:42,479
by that third by the time the third call came.

2031
01:44:43,399 --> 01:44:46,560
So so Benjamin, I think was a good example of

2032
01:44:46,680 --> 01:44:50,880
how vague and how large your net needs to be

2033
01:44:51,319 --> 01:44:53,720
when you cast out your ideas in order for any

2034
01:44:53,760 --> 01:44:55,680
of them to make sense, right, I mean, you need

2035
01:44:55,720 --> 01:44:59,640
to really cast a pretty wide net. For example, his

2036
01:45:00,000 --> 01:45:04,319
remote viewing technique where he found a metal thing. I mean, hey,

2037
01:45:04,359 --> 01:45:06,600
that's proof, right, that's proof right there, he found the

2038
01:45:06,600 --> 01:45:09,479
metal thing in your office, so he must he must

2039
01:45:09,520 --> 01:45:12,159
be onto something. But yeah, I mean that is just

2040
01:45:12,199 --> 01:45:15,720
an example of how vague you have to be. And

2041
01:45:15,840 --> 01:45:17,920
thank you Benjamin for that. That was a fun call.

2042
01:45:18,000 --> 01:45:21,439
But man, I hope, I hope Benjamin can can get

2043
01:45:21,439 --> 01:45:27,720
a more sound story moving forward. Marylyn, Oh, poor, poor Marilyn. Oh,

2044
01:45:27,800 --> 01:45:30,760
my goodness. That was rough. That was rough, just all

2045
01:45:30,840 --> 01:45:34,039
the worst ways to describe. And that was a very

2046
01:45:34,079 --> 01:45:37,840
disjointed conversation. She was coming out of every coming at

2047
01:45:37,840 --> 01:45:41,039
you guys, every direction. The flat earth thing. You know,

2048
01:45:41,119 --> 01:45:44,319
I need something from flat earthers. I need you guys

2049
01:45:44,399 --> 01:45:49,039
to agree and define your right and left boundaries of

2050
01:45:49,079 --> 01:45:51,479
what a flat earth looks like, right, so that we

2051
01:45:51,479 --> 01:45:54,279
can figure some stuff out, like like does the Earth

2052
01:45:55,279 --> 01:45:58,039
is it partitioned on like the Atlantic Ocean or like

2053
01:45:58,079 --> 01:46:00,880
the Pacific Ocean? Like what's in the middle, because if

2054
01:46:00,920 --> 01:46:04,439
you take, for example, the African slave trade or the

2055
01:46:04,760 --> 01:46:08,640
attack on Pearl Harbor, those both could not have happened

2056
01:46:08,680 --> 01:46:10,640
if the Earth is flat. So I need to and

2057
01:46:11,039 --> 01:46:13,039
you can slice that a bunch of ways. So I

2058
01:46:13,079 --> 01:46:15,800
need to know where the middle, where the right and

2059
01:46:15,880 --> 01:46:19,520
left are, so we can figure that out. And Bill, yeah,

2060
01:46:19,560 --> 01:46:22,760
I don't have the mental fortitude for mathe either John

2061
01:46:22,840 --> 01:46:27,319
awesome job man. But but for Bill, like, we don't

2062
01:46:27,359 --> 01:46:31,079
have a model to compare our current circumstances too, so

2063
01:46:31,479 --> 01:46:35,239
we might actually not be that uncommon. We don't know

2064
01:46:35,319 --> 01:46:39,079
the size and scale when it pertains to geography and

2065
01:46:39,199 --> 01:46:42,359
time of the universe, so who knows. We could actually

2066
01:46:42,359 --> 01:46:46,319
be pretty common in the large grand scheme of things.

2067
01:46:46,319 --> 01:46:49,920
Then maybe there are some other conditions where life is possible,

2068
01:46:50,239 --> 01:46:53,279
not just our own condition. So something to think about, Bill,

2069
01:46:53,319 --> 01:46:54,439
But a really good call.

2070
01:46:54,640 --> 01:46:55,520
Speaker 1: I like that a lot.

2071
01:46:55,600 --> 01:46:56,119
Speaker 5: I like that.

2072
01:46:56,119 --> 01:46:58,279
Speaker 11: That was a good way to close the show. Guys,

2073
01:46:58,359 --> 01:47:01,560
thanks for letting me up here and give my thoughts.

2074
01:47:01,640 --> 01:47:05,319
I had a great, great time listening and learning in

2075
01:47:05,359 --> 01:47:05,920
the background.

2076
01:47:06,000 --> 01:47:08,199
Speaker 2: Well thanks sometime, Jimmy. All was great to have you

2077
01:47:08,279 --> 01:47:08,880
on the screen.

2078
01:47:09,439 --> 01:47:13,560
Speaker 1: And with that, friends, make sure we'll be here again

2079
01:47:13,640 --> 01:47:18,199
next week market on your calendars. Definitely thank Jimmy and

2080
01:47:18,279 --> 01:47:23,000
John for being here and four pm or sorry for

2081
01:47:23,159 --> 01:47:25,680
thirty pm Central Time Sunday. Next week we'll do it

2082
01:47:25,840 --> 01:47:27,840
all over again. I'm not going to be hosting next week,

2083
01:47:27,880 --> 01:47:30,880
but there's gonna be some lovely maybe I am hosting

2084
01:47:30,920 --> 01:47:31,880
next week. I already forgot.

2085
01:47:32,239 --> 01:47:34,920
Speaker 2: Make sure and be here though for no matter who is.

2086
01:47:34,840 --> 01:47:37,479
Speaker 1: Hosting, so you can get all of the conversations, it

2087
01:47:37,479 --> 01:47:38,640
should be a great time.

2088
01:47:41,640 --> 01:47:56,800
Speaker 12: Glad to start already. Stop the bully around you, guys, say.

2089
01:48:00,039 --> 01:48:00,439
Speaker 1: Mm hmm.

2090
01:48:00,920 --> 01:48:03,920
Speaker 3: Watch Talk Ethan live Sundays at one pm Central.

2091
01:48:04,000 --> 01:48:07,039
Speaker 1: Visit tiny dot c c slash y t t H

2092
01:48:07,159 --> 01:48:09,479
and call into the show at five one two nine

2093
01:48:09,600 --> 01:48:12,079
nine one nine two four two, or connect to the

2094
01:48:12,079 --> 01:48:22,359
show online at tiny dot c c slash call THH