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Speaker 3: SEAPORTCOSH energy, dot E for fullties, and cs. Hey hey there,
Speaker 3: what's up. It's the bee that is trapped in your
Speaker 3: car that does not understand that you open the back
Speaker 3: window for it. Ali Ward, I'm here, amusing my mouth.
Speaker 3: I'm saying sounds to tell you about an episode that
Speaker 3: I have been hoping to do for about a year
Speaker 3: or so at least. So we're getting right into it.
Speaker 3: So this ologists got a master's in speech language pathology
Speaker 3: from Northern Illinois University and works as a pediatric speech
Speaker 3: pathologist for early intervention. That means tiny kiddos after her name.
Speaker 3: There are a bunch of letters m A, CCC, DASH, SLP.
Speaker 3: I had Google them to learn that they meant Master
Speaker 3: of Arts, Certificate of Clinical Competence in speech language pathology.
Speaker 3: It's very fancy and like the rest of the world
Speaker 3: doing nothing but bathing in hand sanitizer and looking at
Speaker 3: their phones. In the beginning of twenty twenty, I saw
Speaker 3: a video of a dog named Stella, a chocolate brown
Speaker 3: Healer mix, just asking to go to the beach using
Speaker 3: a talk buzzer, and life kind of slowed down. I
Speaker 3: wanted to melt into the floor and contemplate talking dogs forever.
Speaker 3: So I started following the Hunger for Words Instagram and
Speaker 3: I would hear this ologist and her partner shake training
Speaker 3: Stella with this expanding vocabulary. The day's finally here. I've
Speaker 3: been waiting this whole time. We have her onologies. It's happening.
Speaker 3: She's here, not Stella, the dog is not here. The
Speaker 3: speech language pathologist is okay. But first, I have an
Speaker 3: announcement for you. I'm gonna make this quick, but this
Speaker 3: one is really big, so please hold on to your
Speaker 3: one collective butt. I'm finally doing a live show, y'all.
Speaker 3: Why not? How bad could I screw it up? We're
Speaker 3: going to find out on May eighteenth, twenty twenty one.
Speaker 3: It's a virtual show. It's catching up with Dad board
Speaker 3: Ologies live, and it is featuring the return of our
Speaker 3: very first guest volcanologists, Jess Phoenix, and we're going to
Speaker 3: be catching up on volcanoes that have gushed molten rocks
Speaker 3: since I talked to her four years ago, how she
Speaker 3: felt about running for office. Where in the world. She
Speaker 3: has been hammering rock samples since she wrote a book.
Speaker 3: She's been on CNN a lot, so May eighteenth live.
Speaker 3: I might wear a ball gown. I might wear a
Speaker 3: tattered yellow sweater. We will address questions that we never
Speaker 3: got to, ones that we never thought to ask the
Speaker 3: first time. I will probably swallow my words about a
Speaker 3: Pixar short. I will definitely tell secrets and more. We
Speaker 3: will be tying up a lot of loose ends, and
Speaker 3: she will probably be addressing the Ologies community directly to
Speaker 3: tell you how awesome you are. Anyway, a lot of
Speaker 3: catching up to do. Tickets are twelve bucks or nine
Speaker 3: dollars if you're a patron. Links for the live show.
Speaker 3: Tickets will be writing the show notes. There's a limited
Speaker 3: edition shirt design too. I'm going to be doing some
Speaker 3: one on one meet and greets available to patrons only
Speaker 3: because I love them. You can join if you want
Speaker 3: Patreon dot com slash Ologies, but the live show is
Speaker 3: for everyone, So tickets in the show notes spread the word.
Speaker 3: May eighteenth Also, thank you to anyone leaving reviews. I
Speaker 3: read them all, and then I prove it by reading
Speaker 3: a still drippy wet one to you each week, such
Speaker 3: as this one. It's short aav VAA for three two
Speaker 3: one says unapologetically passionate about science. This is a safe
Speaker 3: place for nerds. A very short review, straight to the point.
Speaker 3: If you leave a review, I have read it, so
Speaker 3: keep leaving them. I love them. I shaish you.
Speaker 4: Well.
Speaker 3: Okay, so we're gonna get into speech pathology. Pathology comes
Speaker 3: from the Greek for disease. But as you will learn,
Speaker 3: communicating is really individual and it takes all forms. Sometimes
Speaker 3: it's a baby giving hand signals. Sometimes it's a dog
Speaker 3: named Bunny having an existential crisis on TikTok. But before
Speaker 3: you email me, this may not be the only speech
Speaker 3: pathology episode we ever do I don't know. This is
Speaker 3: a weird one because not only is speech pathology a
Speaker 3: huge field, as you're going to learn, but this ologist
Speaker 3: is probably the first human being in the world to
Speaker 3: have legit conversations in English with her dog. So this
Speaker 3: is not a normal episode. This is a weird episode,
Speaker 3: and there's no way it can be comprehensive in terms
Speaker 3: of all speech language pathology and therapy, and also canine
Speaker 3: cognition and cats who are pissed at you. So just
Speaker 3: consider this a mishmash grab bag of a little bit
Speaker 3: of both. So you're going to learn the difference between
Speaker 3: speech and language, how we communicate without words, if you
Speaker 3: should teach babies sign language. How patient is the right
Speaker 3: amount of patient when training a pet to speak? How
Speaker 3: speech language pathologists use different types of communication devices, contagious accents,
Speaker 3: pronunciation troubles, and a step by step manual to find
Speaker 3: out what is on your pet's minds. Perhaps so, prepare
Speaker 3: to tune in and speak out about your newfound love
Speaker 3: for language and communication with someone who has a hunger
Speaker 3: for words. Speech language pathologist and Spella's mom, Christina Hunger,
Speaker 3: m a CCC SLPI. First thing I always ask is
Speaker 3: if you could say your first and last name and
Speaker 3: your pronouns.
Speaker 4: Yes, my name is Christina Hunger and my pronouns are
Speaker 4: she and her great.
Speaker 3: And speech pathology. Oh, people are excited about this. People
Speaker 3: have wanted to hear this for so long. And I'm
Speaker 3: not even completely sure what the field encompasses, which is
Speaker 3: why I'm excited to talk to you. Can you tell me, like,
Speaker 3: what does this speech pathologist do?
Speaker 5: That is a great question.
Speaker 4: And speech pathology is such a rich, versatile field. We
Speaker 4: can work with anyone from a newborn all the way
Speaker 4: through the geriatric population. So it's a very, very wide field,
Speaker 4: but with the underlying themes of helping people communicate better,
Speaker 4: So helping people who have speech and language and swallowing
Speaker 4: disorders communicate and even eat and swallow to their fullest potential.
Speaker 4: So I've always worked as a pediatric speech pathologist, but
Speaker 4: there are people who work in the schools, in clinics,
Speaker 4: in hospitals, and nursing homes.
Speaker 3: I didn't realize that it goes kind of all ages.
Speaker 4: Yeah, so some people work with newborns who are in
Speaker 4: the NICU who were born too soon and their swallowing
Speaker 4: mechanism hasn't been developed yet, so the speech pathologist helps
Speaker 4: with feeding and supporting that. There are speech pathologists who
Speaker 4: work in nursing homes or in hospitals with people who
Speaker 4: have had strokes or who have dementia, Alzheimer's, Parkinson's. So
Speaker 4: it's a really cool field because you can really find
Speaker 4: your best fit job and really find a population that
Speaker 4: kind of speaks to you and that you can get
Speaker 4: excited about.
Speaker 3: Obviously, newborns aren't going out and giving speeches, but they
Speaker 3: of course need to use their soft ballad and tongue.
Speaker 3: I imagine, so is it about more than just making words.
Speaker 4: Yeah, So that's another misconception about our field, is that
Speaker 4: it's just speech sounds and it's just talking, and that
Speaker 4: is a really big part of our fields. But speech
Speaker 4: therapists are also the medical health professionals who help with
Speaker 4: feeding and swallowing disorders. So that's something that I had
Speaker 4: no idea about when I was even still in college
Speaker 4: studying communication sciences and disorders. I didn't even really fully
Speaker 4: realize that was part of our scope of practice until
Speaker 4: getting to grad school and until having a whole class
Speaker 4: about it. So it's definitely more than just speech sounds.
Speaker 4: There's feeding, swallowing, cognition. There's the whole difference between speech
Speaker 4: and language. So I worked with a lot of kids
Speaker 4: before they're even able to speak, working on their language development,
Speaker 4: which also surprises people that someone could see a speech
Speaker 4: therapist before they're even talking.
Speaker 3: Yeah, what is the difference between speech and language?
Speaker 4: So speech is just the actual verbal production of speech sounds,
Speaker 4: whereas language is the actual concept of the words and
Speaker 4: the meaning of the words. So someone can have perfect
Speaker 4: language development, but maybe they have a speech disorder in
Speaker 4: which they're pronouncing words a little bit off or they're
Speaker 4: making speech sound airs, or some people can have absolutely
Speaker 4: perfect speech but they have a language delay or disorder
Speaker 4: where it's really hard for them to learn certain language concepts,
Speaker 4: the meanings of words, and how to use them, but
Speaker 4: when they talk, it sounds absolutely perfect. So yeah, and
Speaker 4: I love working on the language aspect of things. And
Speaker 4: so I worked with a lot of kids who had
Speaker 4: some pretty severe disorders and disabilities which really impacted their
Speaker 4: language development and helping them say words through different ways
Speaker 4: in aac just using different adaptive devices to say words.
Speaker 5: If you're not able to talk with verbal speech.
Speaker 3: How much of talking is the tongue? I always wonder
Speaker 3: about that. How do we even know how to use
Speaker 3: this big, floppy, flippy thing in her mouth to make
Speaker 3: all the sounds?
Speaker 5: It's a great question.
Speaker 4: So that's actually something that is pretty like a hot
Speaker 4: topic in our field because there used to be a
Speaker 4: lot of people who thought just like tongue strengthening and
Speaker 4: how you position your tongue in your mouth was how
Speaker 4: we formed speech sounds. There was a lot of therapy
Speaker 4: focused on like oral motor exercises, which was just strengthening articulators,
Speaker 4: so the muscles that you're using to make sounds without
Speaker 4: pairing them with speech. But in recent years there's been
Speaker 4: a really big shift in the fields, and there's been
Speaker 4: this bigger awareness that focusing just on like the muscle
Speaker 4: movements without pairing it with a sound actually doesn't help
Speaker 4: as much as just treating the mechanism as a whole
Speaker 4: and treating as you're talking, in the whole process of
Speaker 4: making sounds, not just moving the muscles.
Speaker 3: What is an articulator, Well, I'm using a bunch of
Speaker 3: mine right now to tell you that they are structures
Speaker 3: that help a person who speaks form words. So the
Speaker 3: main ones are the lips, the roof of the mouth,
Speaker 3: the back of the roof of the mouth, your teeth,
Speaker 3: your uvula also known as the dingle dongle at the
Speaker 3: back of your throat that helps you not snort food
Speaker 3: up your sinuses. You also have a glottis which is
Speaker 3: the opening between your vocal cords, and of course the tongue,
Speaker 3: which is made up of four muscles and bring it
Speaker 3: to your creepy skull and then four more to move
Speaker 3: it around to help you do things like eat pudding
Speaker 3: and trash talk your sister in law.
Speaker 4: So it was this awareness that It's not just about
Speaker 4: how you can move the articulators. It's your brain telling
Speaker 4: the articulators what to do in the context of making
Speaker 4: a sound.
Speaker 3: And I'm wondering because I know I personally have interfaced
Speaker 3: with speech pathology because I had to go to a
Speaker 3: speech therapist when I was the little kid. Oh I remember,
Speaker 3: I didn't realize that that saying qq train was not
Speaker 3: the way you're supposed to say it. So side note
Speaker 3: that sound is called a voiceless palado aveolar sibilant africate,
Speaker 3: of course, also known as my sister and I went
Speaker 3: to a speech pathologist. But what drew you to the field?
Speaker 3: Did you have any personal experience with it?
Speaker 4: I didn't actually have any personal experiences with it, but
Speaker 4: I knew when I was in college I wanted to
Speaker 4: do something in a health related field, and I also
Speaker 4: was really interested in education. But I felt like careers
Speaker 4: that were strictly in the medical field or strictly in
Speaker 4: the education world, like teaching, just didn't quite fit what
Speaker 4: I was looking for. And a friend just recommended that
Speaker 4: i'd take a class in the Communication Sciences and Disorders major.
Speaker 4: She said, you know, I think you'd really be interested
Speaker 4: in this. It's fascinating and I didn't really know too
Speaker 4: much about speech pathology speech therapy, but as soon as
Speaker 4: I took my first intro class, I was absolutely hooked.
Speaker 4: I love this idea that there were professionals out there
Speaker 4: who could work with kids every week to help them
Speaker 4: gain communication skills and help them talk. And it was
Speaker 4: just like this light just switched on in my brain
Speaker 4: where I couldn't stop thinking about it. I shadowed speech therapists,
Speaker 4: just this realization that that's what I was really wanting
Speaker 4: to do.
Speaker 3: And now she's arguably one of the most visible speech
Speaker 3: pathologists in the world. Well, she isn't as visible necessarily
Speaker 3: as her pop Stella, who's typically the one on camera. Well,
Speaker 3: Christina's voice gently, patiently encourages Sella to express herself via
Speaker 3: a board full of buttons. That button, by the way,
Speaker 3: what is that called AACE A AAC.
Speaker 4: Yeah, so it stands for augmentative and alternative communication AAC,
Speaker 4: and that means using any other way to talk besides
Speaker 4: verbal speech. So, if we go back to the difference
Speaker 4: between speech and language, verbal speech is one way that
Speaker 4: we express language, but there are so many ways that
Speaker 4: people can say words. We can use sign language, we
Speaker 4: can type, can write, we can use gestures, we can
Speaker 4: point to pictures that symbolize a word. There are communication
Speaker 4: devices where you can push a button and the device
Speaker 4: says a word. So these are all different ways that
Speaker 4: we can say a word that just aren't verbal speech.
Speaker 4: And that's one of my absolute favorite parts of my
Speaker 4: field and what I've really gotten into now with Stella.
Speaker 4: But that's what I've loved most about being a speech therapist.
Speaker 3: And the buttons, did you use those with patients? Clients?
Speaker 3: Obviously before that? What type of situations are those used in?
Speaker 4: So the buttons that I used, I hadn't specifically used
Speaker 4: with kids, but pretty much these buttons are just really simple.
Speaker 4: You press down and it says a word that I
Speaker 4: had already programmed into it, like recorded my voice saying
Speaker 4: outside or play, for example. So I wanted to use
Speaker 4: some type of aac with Stella, and again that's just
Speaker 4: another way to say words. So I was thinking, if
Speaker 4: Stella's understanding words, I wonder if she could say words
Speaker 4: if she had a different way to say them, because
Speaker 4: she's obviously not developing the verbal speech skills like humans too.
Speaker 4: So I thought about my work with kids, and the
Speaker 4: devices that I used with kids, and I didn't think
Speaker 4: any of them were really the right size for Stella
Speaker 4: to hit with her paw, and so I just happened
Speaker 4: to find these buttons that are just recordable and that
Speaker 4: they were at the perfect size for Stella to hit
Speaker 4: with her paw. So I didn't use those specific ones
Speaker 4: with kids. But it's just a type of AAC.
Speaker 3: So these buttons are about the size of an English
Speaker 3: muffin or the easy button from the Staples commercials. But
Speaker 3: egg mcmuffins can't talk, and easy buttons are really hard
Speaker 3: to take apart and hack. And there are other recordable
Speaker 3: buttons sold as AAC devices, but they cost her one
Speaker 3: hundred and fifty dollars each. But the ones Christina found
Speaker 3: when Stella was just a little flupy droopy puppy were
Speaker 3: nineteen dollars for a four pack and they were made
Speaker 3: by Learning Resources. And my guess is that this company
Speaker 3: had no idea what happened overnight or how much business
Speaker 3: was about to boom. And they currently have twelve thousand
Speaker 3: reviews on Amazon, most of which are about people's stocks.
Speaker 3: At what point did you say, Okay, I'm just going
Speaker 3: to try this. What did Jake think about it? Can
Speaker 3: you take me back to like the first day that
Speaker 3: you're like, Okay, well we're going to use speech pathology
Speaker 3: to see what our beautiful dog would like.
Speaker 4: Yes, so some background and fell I've said it before,
Speaker 4: but I was really hugely obsessed with my field, and
Speaker 4: it was just this passion that I don't think a
Speaker 4: lot of people have the privilege of experiencing. I think
Speaker 4: a lot of people have jobs that they like, but
Speaker 4: it's not this burning passion within them.
Speaker 5: So Jake wasn't too.
Speaker 4: Surprised when I had this idea because he was used
Speaker 4: to me coming home from work and just gushing about
Speaker 4: the kids that I saw and what I was doing.
Speaker 4: And I would ask all these questions and ask him
Speaker 4: for his advice, and he's like, I don't know, you're
Speaker 4: the speech therapist. But I loved hearing these stories. So
Speaker 4: when I said, you know, I have this idea. You
Speaker 4: know how I work with kids and I teach them
Speaker 4: to talk using communication devices. What if Stella could say
Speaker 4: words if she had a device?
Speaker 5: I mean, why not? Right then?
Speaker 4: So I was really really excited about it, and I
Speaker 4: really don't think Jake was too surprised because I talked
Speaker 4: like this a lot about my field, so he was
Speaker 4: ready to see what was going to happen. He was
Speaker 4: really excited to give it a shot too. He's a
Speaker 4: pretty adventurous and curious person as well.
Speaker 3: What was the first button that you tried?
Speaker 4: I started with outside, and then just a few days
Speaker 4: later I added play and water as well. What I
Speaker 4: really noticed when I brought her home. I ordered the
Speaker 4: buttons like four days after she came home, so this
Speaker 4: was super early on and having Stella that I had
Speaker 4: this idea, and I was just thinking about how dogs
Speaker 4: understand words that we say to them, and how they
Speaker 4: already communicate so strongly with gestures and vocalizations. And I
Speaker 4: was thinking, you know, I work with kids right before
Speaker 4: they start talking, and they have all these language development
Speaker 4: skills that occur before words, and I saw so many
Speaker 4: of them in Stella, and I just kept thinking, if
Speaker 4: if she were a toddler, I would expect her to
Speaker 4: be starting to say words soon. So I tried these
Speaker 4: simple words outside, play, in water because they were already
Speaker 4: concepts that she was expressing through gestures and vocalizations. And
Speaker 4: research shows in humans a direct correlation between a child
Speaker 4: gesturing for a concept and then shortly after being able
Speaker 4: to say the word for it. You can picture a
Speaker 4: baby who raises his arms in the air to gesture
Speaker 4: that he wants to be lifted up, and then eventually
Speaker 4: learns how to say the word up for that concept.
Speaker 4: So I tried to pick words that Stella was already
Speaker 4: demonstrating gestures for communicating.
Speaker 3: So at this point, Stella was only about eight weeks old.
Speaker 3: So an outside button is something that a little potty
Speaker 3: monster definitely needs, for sure, But she was just so
Speaker 3: teeny tiny, could it? A little furry baby pas even
Speaker 3: pressed down on anything, just so little. When she started
Speaker 3: to get up and go toward the buttons and then
Speaker 3: hit you know, outside or player water, what was your
Speaker 3: first reaction?
Speaker 2: Oh?
Speaker 4: Well, actually Jake was the one who saw her first word.
Speaker 4: I didn't even see it, but he ran up and
Speaker 4: I was asleep and he recalled this story to me.
Speaker 4: I saw her say a word the next day outside,
Speaker 4: and I was so thrilled because it took weeks to
Speaker 4: get to that point. It wasn't like I just set
Speaker 4: the buttons down and she started pushing them. It didn't
Speaker 4: work right away, and I didn't know if it was
Speaker 4: going to work.
Speaker 5: So when I.
Speaker 4: Actually saw that she sat outside when she needed to
Speaker 4: go to the bathroom and she was standing by the door,
Speaker 4: I was just so thrilled that this was going somewhere,
Speaker 4: and that if she could start to say a few
Speaker 4: simple words, I wondered, like if she could continue learning
Speaker 4: more vocabulary.
Speaker 3: So a dog talking in this case English, asking to
Speaker 3: poo poo outside? So what is life? Is anything real?
Speaker 3: Nobody knows. If it had been me, I would have
Speaker 3: celebrated this by hijacking a barge and lighting cannons of
Speaker 3: illegal fireworks, and then I would have purchased a tr
Speaker 3: for myself to wear until the day I died. But
Speaker 3: Christina slightly more understated, a little more humble.
Speaker 5: So it was a really cool moment.
Speaker 3: How many words does she have?
Speaker 5: Now? She is using close to fifty words.
Speaker 4: Oh fancy, So that is something I never anticipated when
Speaker 4: I started this. I really just had the simple question,
Speaker 4: could Stella use a few different words to express some
Speaker 4: basic needs so that you know, we weren't sitting there
Speaker 4: trying to decipher her wines And I just wanted her
Speaker 4: to be able to be understood more and express herself
Speaker 4: to the best of her abilities, but I had truly
Speaker 4: no idea how far this would go, and probably how
Speaker 4: far it can go beyond what I've even done with
Speaker 4: Stella so far.
Speaker 3: Now, the average four year old knows about five thousand
Speaker 3: words in their native language, and as an adult, our
Speaker 3: vocabulary averages between twenty to thirty thousand words. We learn
Speaker 3: about one new word a day until we're middle aged,
Speaker 3: at which point I guess we finally have nothing to
Speaker 3: prove or nothing to say to anyone. If you listen
Speaker 3: to this podcast, you may have learned palado flee or
Speaker 3: sibilant effrocate or not. It's fine if you didn't. Now
Speaker 3: Stella keeps adding to her vocabulary, which means that the
Speaker 3: wooden board that acts as her sound drop palette has expanded.
Speaker 3: Do you have to figure out a way to put
Speaker 3: more buttons in places?
Speaker 5: Yes?
Speaker 4: So, the physical space needed to have all of these
Speaker 4: buttons is definitely a challenge. That's something that I'm really
Speaker 4: excited in the coming years to see as this just
Speaker 4: gains more momentum and technology develops more. How we can
Speaker 4: have more words available without taking up just a ton
Speaker 4: of For some context, Until recently, Jake and I had
Speaker 4: lived in some pretty small apartments in San Diego. We
Speaker 4: had this one bedroom apartment with a small living room,
Speaker 4: and half of it was taken up by this mass
Speaker 4: of board with thirty to forty buttons on it. I
Speaker 4: know she could probably learn even more words if we
Speaker 4: had the physical buttons and space for them.
Speaker 3: And I'm so curious, like, at what point language starts
Speaker 3: to be used kind of metaphorically. Have you seen the
Speaker 3: way that she uses the buttons change? Did she start
Speaker 3: from just going like hey, I gotta take a piss,
Speaker 3: please let me out? Like where have you been all day?
Speaker 3: I've been thinking about my own death. You know. Have
Speaker 3: you seen a change in her?
Speaker 4: Yes, it's been a crazy change, And again something I
Speaker 4: really didn't anticipate. But what I noticed was a lot
Speaker 4: of gradual changes over time and a lot of small
Speaker 4: milestones that I think a lot of people would miss.
Speaker 4: But because this was my job to observe this in
Speaker 4: children and to really know their language patterns and to
Speaker 4: understand language development, I was able to identify a lot
Speaker 4: of these milestones and really know the significance of how
Speaker 4: fascinating it was. So, for example, water, I initially thought
Speaker 4: She's just going to use this to request water when
Speaker 4: she's thirsty, or if I happened to miss that her
Speaker 4: water bowl is empty, she'll have a way to tell me,
Speaker 4: you know, easier way to get her needs met.
Speaker 5: And I was shocked when.
Speaker 4: Not that long after introducing water, she started talking about
Speaker 4: me watering my plants. So she was so really young
Speaker 4: at this point, and she would follow me from room
Speaker 4: to room as I watered my plants. And one day
Speaker 4: she just watched me with the watering can, sniffed it,
Speaker 4: and she ran over into another room and said water.
Speaker 1: Whoa.
Speaker 5: I know that.
Speaker 4: I talk about that in my book as one of
Speaker 4: the biggest like whoa moments. You know, she wasn't requesting water,
Speaker 4: her water dish was full, she didn't take a drink.
Speaker 4: She was simply just telling me, hey, that's water, like
Speaker 4: I'm noticing that, I'm pointing that out. And so that
Speaker 4: was really one of the first moments. And then eventually
Speaker 4: she started generalizing words to mean other things. So outside
Speaker 4: stop becoming just she needs to go in the bathroom.
Speaker 4: But she would tell me when she wanted to play
Speaker 4: outside or walk outside, or go to the park outside,
Speaker 4: or beach outside, and now she asks me and Jake
Speaker 4: question she says when she's happy or mad. She answers questions.
Speaker 4: It's really incredible.
Speaker 3: It would be rule to withhold from you the internet
Speaker 3: treasure that is Billy, a twelve year old domesticated short
Speaker 3: haired cat who has been trained Ala Stella. Between all
Speaker 3: of Billy's buttons to express things like cuddles and scratches water,
Speaker 3: there's one for catnip, which essentially makes her owner a
Speaker 3: drug dealer, and I love that. But that's not this
Speaker 3: feline's favorite. She has a different favorite button. So before
Speaker 3: Christina introduced the greater population to the use of AAC
Speaker 3: we used to know that a cat was mad because
Speaker 3: blood would seep from the wounds on our hands and
Speaker 3: our arms. But this is much more straightforward. And of course,
Speaker 3: a waggling tail is communication of happiness in a pup.
Speaker 3: We know what that means. A smiling human might be
Speaker 3: excited or content, But what if what if your hamster
Speaker 3: loved you and you knew it. I always am curious
Speaker 3: when she says that she loves you the button? How
Speaker 3: did you teach her? This is what it means when
Speaker 3: we say love you? And also, how many people just
Speaker 3: need those buttons in their relationships.
Speaker 4: Oh, that's a great question, I think. So as far
Speaker 4: as teaching Stella love you, I did just what I
Speaker 4: did with any other word, and I just modeled it
Speaker 4: when I would naturally say love you. So every time
Speaker 4: I was naturally saying love you to Stella, I also
Speaker 4: pushed the button for love you to show her this
Speaker 4: is how you can say this too, if you want.
Speaker 4: And so it was really just in the natural context
Speaker 4: of if I was petting Stella, if she came up
Speaker 4: and was being really affectionate towards me, I would model
Speaker 4: love you if I was really proud of her. So
Speaker 4: I think it's pretty impossible to know if she perceives
Speaker 4: love you in the exact same way that I do.
Speaker 4: But at the same time, it's also really hard to
Speaker 4: know if another human and perceives, you know, feeling like.
Speaker 5: Love in the exact same way as someone else.
Speaker 4: So I think based on her use of love you,
Speaker 4: she uses it a lot when she is wanting some affections,
Speaker 4: some scratches or belly rubs. She she uses it a
Speaker 4: lot when we've said no to a request, and then
Speaker 4: she'll come back and say love you. And then the
Speaker 4: word again that she's wanting.
Speaker 5: So that's been really funny.
Speaker 3: Oh my god, that's so adorably manipulative and I love it. Yep, really,
Speaker 3: but I really love you. I mean, how do you
Speaker 3: say no to that afterward?
Speaker 5: I can't. It's so hard to know.
Speaker 4: She does make it trickier just say no in those circumstances.
Speaker 3: Oh my gosh. I have so many questions from listeners.
Speaker 3: Is it okay if we just dive in? And I'm
Speaker 3: sure you okay, Sure, They're so just so many. Some
Speaker 3: of them are about canine speech pathology, some of them
Speaker 3: are about humanoid so they'll just kind of go back
Speaker 3: and forth. Is that cool?
Speaker 4: Yeah?
Speaker 3: But before we address your questions, a few words about
Speaker 3: sponsors of the show who let us toss money at
Speaker 3: a worthy cause, and this week Christina shows I Talk
Speaker 3: Autism Foundation, which donates communication devices and education on communication
Speaker 3: devices to artistic folks and families who need them, so
Speaker 3: you can learn more atalk dot org. Thank you, Christina,
Speaker 3: and to the following sponsors for making it possible to
Speaker 3: get more devices.
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Speaker 3: Okay, your questions for me to ask a person who
Speaker 3: asks dogs questions normal, So let's go back a few
Speaker 3: steps in her career. Let's start with some human language questions. Okay,
Speaker 3: a few people, Casey Broughton, Alia Meyers, and Bennett Gerber
Speaker 3: all wanted to know what is the most common source
Speaker 3: of speech impediments in your work.
Speaker 4: So if we're just talking about speech impediments like unable
Speaker 4: to produce a sound in a certain way, there's a
Speaker 4: lot of different potential idiologies. So some kids could have
Speaker 4: a phonological disorder in which they actually process two different
Speaker 4: sounds as the same sound in their brain. For example,
Speaker 4: are is a really common one where kids will hear
Speaker 4: like W, the W sound and R and that all
Speaker 4: is processed the same way in their brain. So it
Speaker 4: takes a lot of just having the child here words
Speaker 4: that start with W, words that start with R, and
Speaker 4: differentiating the speech sounds and then teaching the child how
Speaker 4: to produce the different sounds just on their own and
Speaker 4: then in words. So it can get a little complex,
Speaker 4: but a lot of it can be just this difference
Speaker 4: in processing or a difference in how they're actually moving
Speaker 4: their articulators when they're producing a speech sound, and just
Speaker 4: helping the child adjust that.
Speaker 3: So kids might be hearing different sounds. That might be
Speaker 3: one cause. But a ton of patrons like Brook Radliffe,
Speaker 3: Bonnie Shannon Miller, James Elizabeth Edwards, Melissa po, first time
Speaker 3: question asker, Emily Cookson, and first time or Kayla Smith,
Speaker 3: we're all on the same page asking about the origins
Speaker 3: of speech difficulties. A lot of people had questions about
Speaker 3: nature versus nurture, and Ashley Brace says first time question asker.
Speaker 3: Can speech impediments pop up after traumatic events? I lost
Speaker 3: my brother and ever since I've stuttered and tripped over
Speaker 3: my words, and a lot of people just wondering kind
Speaker 3: of where lisps and stutters and speech impediments might come from.
Speaker 3: And also is speech impediments the correct verbiage or have
Speaker 3: we updated that at all?
Speaker 4: Yeah, I mean speech impediment is still definitely used. To
Speaker 4: me that means like having trouble saying specific sounds. So
Speaker 4: that's you know, definitely okay to say for talking about
Speaker 4: this in a broader sense. And as for the trauma aspects,
Speaker 4: I've definitely seen that there can be a correlation between
Speaker 4: some trauma and stuttering specifically, so that in that case,
Speaker 4: like if I were to receive the child on my
Speaker 4: caseload and I knew that was going on, I would
Speaker 4: work in conjunction with a mental health professional too, because
Speaker 4: if that's the ideology of the stuttering in that case,
Speaker 4: the child would be better served focusing on that than
Speaker 4: the surface level of the stuttering. So that's something where
Speaker 4: in an intake form and during an evaluation, really figuring
Speaker 4: out where this could have come from, if it could
Speaker 4: be something like that, like trauma based or there's a
Speaker 4: lot of times where it's not based on a traumatic experience,
Speaker 4: there's a genetic component. Research shows there's just some slight
Speaker 4: differences in the brains of people who have speech sound
Speaker 4: disorders and different speech impediments. So there's not one specific cause.
Speaker 4: There's a lot of different factors at play, and that
Speaker 4: can come together in the right environment for kind of
Speaker 4: like a perfect storm sort of situation more pre disposed
Speaker 4: to developing a disorder.
Speaker 3: Okay, quick aside, So one thing that is amazing about
Speaker 3: language is how a last ticket is. And as a
Speaker 3: person who tries to ask shameless questions as much as
Speaker 3: I can, I am glad that I asked that. If
Speaker 3: you ever have questions about ableism and terminology, I highly
Speaker 3: suggest the style guide at the National Center on Disability
Speaker 3: and Journalism. I will link that on my website. A
Speaker 3: ton of helpful stuff on there. Also, my pals on
Speaker 3: Twitter who use the actually autistic hashtag have expressed a
Speaker 3: preference for identity first language, so I wanted to respect
Speaker 3: that and pass it on. Now, speaking of malleable speech,
Speaker 3: some patrons wanted to inquire a boot the nature of
Speaker 3: an accent, such as Reagan L. Hereford, Carl t Face,
Speaker 3: Auto Apocalypse Parks, Rebecca rene Q, Leah Darpol, Arianna Mattson,
Speaker 3: Scottish person Nouela a Chicago Ian Ivalie Sanchez not good
Speaker 3: at Spanish accent people Jake and Mark Casey and Southerner's
Speaker 3: Jamie Hales, lsuser and first time question asker Mark Harrington.
Speaker 3: There's a certain type of person who goes on vacation
Speaker 3: and comes back with an accent or starts talking like
Speaker 3: people around them. And what is a predisposition for that?
Speaker 3: Is that just theatrics or is that someone who has
Speaker 3: more musical intentions and that's how they it comes out
Speaker 3: of their mouth.
Speaker 4: I you know, I honestly don't know the answer to
Speaker 4: that one. And we talked about it in grad school too,
Speaker 4: in some of my classes. There's it's a kind of
Speaker 4: a hot topic of why this happens with some people
Speaker 4: and why it doesn't with others, And so, you know,
Speaker 4: there's some research that shows people who can live in
Speaker 4: an environment with a new accent for years and they
Speaker 4: still never take on the new accent. But other times
Speaker 4: people do. Yeah, they go on vacation and they come
Speaker 4: back and you're like, what happened?
Speaker 5: Sound like a different person.
Speaker 4: So I don't to my knowledge, I don't think there's
Speaker 4: a clear answer on that, and it's something that a
Speaker 4: lot of people are still wondering.
Speaker 3: So if your college roommate's boyfriend was one of those
Speaker 3: guys who came back from a week abroad speaking the
Speaker 3: Queen's English and you hated him, just calm down. So
Speaker 3: some researchers from UC Riverside published a study in attention
Speaker 3: perception in psychophysics that found that folks who adopt accents
Speaker 3: really easily. It's called the chameleon effect. They are not
Speaker 3: necessarily drama starved sociopaths, but rather the inverse. They tend
Speaker 3: to score higher on empathy and wanting to connect with people.
Speaker 3: I was reading one quote from an accent reduction coach
Speaker 3: and speech pathologist named Elana Shadioh who says that intonation, cadence, rhythm, inflection,
Speaker 3: word stress, tone, and pitch comprise a great part of
Speaker 3: what a listener perceives in a person's speech. They say,
Speaker 3: so empathy and musicality may both be a play with
Speaker 3: picking a back. Go figure. Now, let's address the question
Speaker 3: of why can't you roll your rs? Why can't you
Speaker 3: do it? I know that you think that I just
Speaker 3: saw directly into your soul. But actually a ton of
Speaker 3: people apparently have this issue, as evidenced by the number
Speaker 3: of patrons who pleaded for Christina's help, and I'm looking
Speaker 3: at you, kat h Evelyn, Alia Meyers's roommate, Broken Engine Sounding,
Speaker 3: Lisa Taylor, Jessica Jansen, Kasey Kaiser, who cites this inability
Speaker 3: as one of the biggest disappointments of their life, Diana Burgess,
Speaker 3: Michael Williams, whose wife makes fun of this non rolling
Speaker 3: our ability, first time question asker Eddie and Kristin. And
Speaker 3: there are also a lumps who also went through speech
Speaker 3: language therapy, Rebecca Kidder, Megan and Spencer Cup who were
Speaker 3: all bad at rolling ours. They all want to know
Speaker 3: can Christina fix them? I mean, of course she can't,
Speaker 3: And that kind of dovetails into a lot of folks
Speaker 3: head questions about if there is a trick to rolling
Speaker 3: ours in Spanish.
Speaker 4: I can't roll my ours in Spain, so that doesn't
Speaker 4: bode well for me as a speech therapist. But that's
Speaker 4: something that I struggle with too, So if anyone knows
Speaker 4: that trick, please let me know, because I've tried everything
Speaker 4: and I haven't been able to get myself to be
Speaker 4: able to do it.
Speaker 3: Well, Okay, maybe not, but I look this up for
Speaker 3: y'all and rolling ours. It's called an alveolar trill for
Speaker 3: crossword and trivia enthusiasts. But okay, so this skill is
Speaker 3: handy if you're speaking a tonne languages like Thie or Hungarian,
Speaker 3: some French, Portuguese. So rolling ours can totally be learned,
Speaker 3: unlike turning your tongue into a taco, and that is
Speaker 3: just cruel genetics. Either can or you can't. But ours,
Speaker 3: that's a skill. So I did some digging and I
Speaker 3: read one blog post that suggested you say the word
Speaker 3: butter and then ponder the word butter. Just by saying
Speaker 3: the word butter, you did a little tongue flutter. So
Speaker 3: that is the same thing as a rolled R, but shorter.
Speaker 3: So just relax the tongue and let it flip flop
Speaker 3: in your throat wind like butter, but longer. I'm not
Speaker 3: a speech pathologist, obviously, but dads do in her best
Speaker 3: my babies. Speaking of babies, a lot of you had questions,
Speaker 3: Courtney Jones, Miriam Lavender, Lane, first Timer, Margot Dennis, and
Speaker 3: Baloney Shoes, who wrote in quote our thirteen month old
Speaker 3: is amazing at communicating vs. Sign, but so many people
Speaker 3: have told me that it's hindering his learning speech. Am
Speaker 3: I totally fucking my kid up? Asked a person once
Speaker 3: again delightfully named baloney shoes. You know a lot of
Speaker 3: folks asked about sign language in babies and whether or
Speaker 3: not that ends up delaying their verbal speech. Are what
Speaker 3: are the speech pathology thoughts on.
Speaker 4: That sign language is excellent for babies. That is something
Speaker 4: I love talking about and I love seeing because what
Speaker 4: happens is, again the difference between speech and language is
Speaker 4: language is the concept of a word, an expressing words
Speaker 4: through any sort of means, But verbal speech is actually
Speaker 4: producing the sounds through your mouth and there's a lot
Speaker 4: of coordination that happens there. So babies are actually able
Speaker 4: to express these concepts earlier than their verbal speech skills develop.
Speaker 4: So what happens when you give babies an opportunity to
Speaker 4: express a word in a different way, like through sign language,
Speaker 4: where those motor systems have developed before the motor systems
Speaker 4: of their mouth, they can communicate more effectively and faster.
Speaker 4: So this means that babies are able to say words
Speaker 4: sooner with sign language than with verbal speech, and all
Speaker 4: of the research shows that it only can help their
Speaker 4: verbal speech development or it will stay the same, it
Speaker 4: will not hinder it. So it's actually really cool because
Speaker 4: research shows that any type of AAC so sign language
Speaker 4: can be a type of AAC, or a communication device
Speaker 4: can be a type of AAC incorporating that does not
Speaker 4: decrease the verbal speech. It actually increases all forms of communication.
Speaker 4: And that's because like success in one area just sparks
Speaker 4: success in all these other areas. So it's like the
Speaker 4: sooner kids are able to communicate and understand the power
Speaker 4: of these words, the more motivated and understanding they are
Speaker 4: of how this all works.
Speaker 3: So if you have a bibet, go ahead and try
Speaker 3: some sign language.
Speaker 5: Yes, it's so fun. It's just super cute too.
Speaker 4: I love seeing babies and they sign.
Speaker 5: More all done, milk.
Speaker 4: It's adorable and it's very helpful as well.
Speaker 3: And in terms of like American English Sign language, do
Speaker 3: you have any tips for adults acquiring sign language?
Speaker 5: Any tips?
Speaker 4: I took sign language in college and in graduate school,
Speaker 4: and it was just it was really fun.
Speaker 5: It was also I realized how challenging it was when.
Speaker 4: You're an adult learning this because I never realized how
Speaker 4: much awareness of my hands it took to figure out
Speaker 4: like what one hand was doing and how my fingers
Speaker 4: were moving together. So that was just really fascinating. But
Speaker 4: I mean, I highly recommend learning if you're interested. It's
Speaker 4: really fun.
Speaker 3: So I found a wealth of resources for anyone wanting
Speaker 3: to learn ASL or American Sign language on the website
Speaker 3: for the National Association for the Deaf, which had links
Speaker 3: to different programs and tips, and they offered this great background.
Speaker 3: It kind of like a pep talk light. The website says,
Speaker 3: like any spoken language, ASL is a language with its
Speaker 3: own unique rules of grammar and syntax, and to learn
Speaker 3: enough signs for basic communication and to sign them comfortably
Speaker 3: can take a year or more. Some people pick up
Speaker 3: signs more slowly than others, and if that's the case
Speaker 3: with you, they say, don't be discouraged. Everyone learns sign
Speaker 3: language at their own speed. Be patient, and you will
Speaker 3: succeed in learning the language. The rewards will be well
Speaker 3: worth the effort. Sign language classes can be found at
Speaker 3: community colleges, they say, universities, libraries, churches, organizations, clubs of
Speaker 3: the deaf, and lots of other places, and if you
Speaker 3: have someone in your life who is deaf, just imagine
Speaker 3: what it could mean to you both if you got
Speaker 3: out of your comfort zone by learning something new to
Speaker 3: bridge that communication. I'm literally just started tearing up just
Speaker 3: thinking about it. Or you never know when it might
Speaker 3: make a really big difference to a stranger. This morning,
Speaker 3: I got on a seven am flight and I happened
Speaker 3: to be sitting next to two lovely people, Elise and
Speaker 3: Chris Rodriguez. They were high school sweethearts together still and
Speaker 3: they both went on to become American Sign Language interpreters,
Speaker 3: so both are hearing, but it was really lovely to
Speaker 3: see them communicate with each other in silence on the plane.
Speaker 3: And they also told me about a friend of their
Speaker 3: SA who is deaf who can communicate in the sign
Speaker 3: language of I think seven different countries. So sign language
Speaker 3: very wonderful to learn. On the topic of sign language,
Speaker 3: Megan and Nico Parbusi both wanted to know what are
Speaker 3: your opinions on Coco the Gorilla. Meghan says there's still
Speaker 3: controversy around Coco's mastery of sign language versus Penny, her handler,
Speaker 3: projecting herself onto Coco, and so kind of what are
Speaker 3: the thoughts on making sure that humans aren't subconsciously cuing
Speaker 3: animals to speak in a certain way.
Speaker 4: Yeah, So, once I started teaching Stella to talk, I
Speaker 4: became really fascinated with any other experiences of inner species communications.
Speaker 5: So I read a lot about Coco.
Speaker 4: I read Penny Patterson's book, The Education of Coco multiple times.
Speaker 4: I watched videos of Coco, and actually i've I've connected
Speaker 4: with Penny Patterson now. She read my book book and
Speaker 4: had a lot of really great things to say about it,
Speaker 4: which was really cool for me. But I think Coco
Speaker 4: it was just fantastic. I think Penny did a great
Speaker 4: job teaching her, and I think when you actually go
Speaker 4: back and read the books that she's written, you can
Speaker 4: really see her thought process and all these again little
Speaker 4: milestones that were happening that create this larger movement and
Speaker 4: this larger understanding of what's going on. So I'm a
Speaker 4: big fan of Cocoa and Penny Patterson's work. I think
Speaker 4: she did a really excellent job.
Speaker 3: I still remember that story about how she blamed the
Speaker 3: kitten for ripping the sink out. Oh yeah, one of
Speaker 3: my favorites Coco, not Penny.
Speaker 4: Yeah, and I think too, just like when thinking about
Speaker 4: the human projecting, like the meaning or the queueing. That's
Speaker 4: something sing that's been really interesting with Stella is seeing
Speaker 4: how she communicates with people other than just me and Jake,
Speaker 4: And she talks when we're not in the room. She
Speaker 4: and calls out to us to say a message. She
Speaker 4: talks with other people. She talks completely independently. So if
Speaker 4: it was something where I had to be standing right
Speaker 4: there or you know, commanding her to say something, then yeah,
Speaker 4: that wouldn't be this true communication. It would likely just
Speaker 4: be cueuing. But the fact that she's been so independent
Speaker 4: with this and used words with all kinds of different
Speaker 4: people and all kinds of situations is really showing more
Speaker 4: of that true communication.
Speaker 3: Not just me, but a lot of listeners are curious
Speaker 3: how your work with Stella has influenced your work with humans,
Speaker 3: folks wanting to know where Sasha Mervin and Shale Lutwiler
Speaker 3: and first time question asker say who said about AAC
Speaker 3: devices that many neurodivergent and disabled people benefit from their use,
Speaker 3: but they aren't normalized, whereas everyone is excited about talking
Speaker 3: puppies and asked if Christina is looking for ways to
Speaker 3: use this platform to advocate for AAC devices as well.
Speaker 3: Say also asked do you think that Stella and her
Speaker 3: talking friends are having a positive influence on how people
Speaker 3: see humans that use AAC and a lot of folks
Speaker 3: just want to know how has this changed the way
Speaker 3: that you approach your work.
Speaker 4: I really hope that it has a positive impact on
Speaker 4: the field of AAC in general, and just people who
Speaker 4: use communication devices. I mean, this is something that for
Speaker 4: the first time in history, all of a sudden, there
Speaker 4: are thousands of homes around the world who are incorporating
Speaker 4: AAC into their daily lives with their pets. And this
Speaker 4: is something that you know, unless you know someone who
Speaker 4: uses a communication device or you're in the thing world,
Speaker 4: you wouldn't have a reason to know about AAC or
Speaker 4: to even think of it as an option or know
Speaker 4: kind of how to interact around it. So I think
Speaker 4: just the more awareness that we as a society have
Speaker 4: about different ways to say words, different ways to communicate,
Speaker 4: how to talk to someone with a device, how to
Speaker 4: teach through a device, I really just think it's going
Speaker 4: to make a big impact on the population of people
Speaker 4: who need devices, because suddenly so many more people will
Speaker 4: be aware of AAC and aware of when someone needs help,
Speaker 4: what they can do, and where they can go to
Speaker 4: get that help. So I do see this really inspiring
Speaker 4: a bigger movement in that area and just changing this
Speaker 4: consciousness and educating people about something that they might not
Speaker 4: have interacted with for another reason.
Speaker 3: But no matter how interesting we find language, not everyone
Speaker 3: in your household might care. First time question asker and
Speaker 3: big hunger for words Fan Courtney, as bock Wells wrote
Speaker 3: in we have tried teaching our cat Andre to use buttons,
Speaker 3: but God love him, he just does not care. Andre,
Speaker 3: You're not alone. Yeah, and you know Sophie Duncan has
Speaker 3: a question. Can all dogs be taught to use the
Speaker 3: speech buttons or our thumb? Dogs just inherently smarter than others.
Speaker 3: I'm not sure if Sophie has a dog or if
Speaker 3: Sophie doubts her dog. I doubt my own dog because
Speaker 3: she's she There are certain things we try to trade
Speaker 3: her on that she just has no interest in. But
Speaker 3: are they more incentivized to try to use the buttons
Speaker 3: because then they can say what's on their mind?
Speaker 5: You know?
Speaker 4: I think it's something that we're going to learn a
Speaker 4: lot more about as a lot more people continue to
Speaker 4: teach their dogs. My hypothesis is that every dog has
Speaker 4: this potential to learn, but there's probably a range of
Speaker 4: normal in dog language skills, just like there is with
Speaker 4: human language skills. Like every single human can talk and
Speaker 4: can express language and understand language. There's just this range.
Speaker 4: Even within the normal range, there's a range of the
Speaker 4: low end of normal the high end of normal. I
Speaker 4: think all dogs do have the potential. It just depends
Speaker 4: on their age, their environment, their health, all those types
Speaker 4: of things.
Speaker 3: Yeah, Crystal Roberts asked, my dog is almost nine, can
Speaker 3: he still learn to use the buttons? But it's really
Speaker 3: just give it a shot and see.
Speaker 5: Yeah.
Speaker 4: I mean, that's my best advice right now. I've seen
Speaker 4: a lot of people teach their older dogs. One of
Speaker 4: my friends taught her eight year old Chihuahua how to
Speaker 4: use some buttons and say some words, So that's been
Speaker 4: really fun to see. I've had other friends teach younger
Speaker 4: dogs who are one to three years old. This idea
Speaker 4: is so new in society and in the world that
Speaker 4: we're going to need a lot more information before we
Speaker 4: can really say with certainty what is and is impossible.
Speaker 3: Yeah, isn't it kind of bananas to think just a
Speaker 3: few years ago there were probably zero people doing this
Speaker 3: and now that there are thousands? Must does that blow
Speaker 3: your mind? Ever?
Speaker 5: Oh? Every day.
Speaker 4: I mean, it's just it's so crazy. It doesn't even
Speaker 4: feel real to me. It doesn't even feel like I
Speaker 4: started this, because it feels so normal to me, like
Speaker 4: I've been teaching Stello this for three years now, and
Speaker 4: now there's a bunch of other dogs doing it, and
Speaker 4: it just it just feels like it's a part of
Speaker 4: the world now. I forget that it wasn't just not
Speaker 4: too long ago, and it's still going to be brand
Speaker 4: new to millions of people.
Speaker 3: And a few people. Jordan Mitchell and Genevieve both asked
Speaker 3: for advice on training, and Jordan Mitchell says, like many
Speaker 3: other people during quarantine, we bought some buttons to teach
Speaker 3: our dog, but he is deathly afraid of them, and
Speaker 3: when I click it to teach him, he runs away,
Speaker 3: even though it's just a calm recording of my own voice.
Speaker 3: So how up do you ever see that? With Eddie dogs?
Speaker 4: So initially Stella she wasn't like terrified of them, but
Speaker 4: I don't think she was. She wasn't super like accepting
Speaker 4: of them right away. She at first she ignored them,
Speaker 4: and then she kind of got startled by them. But
Speaker 4: the more that I modeled words and just had it out,
Speaker 4: the calmer she became, and just the more normal it
Speaker 4: became for her to see these buttons in use. So
Speaker 4: for that, I would recommend just taking it slow. Starting with,
Speaker 4: you can just keep the button out and try to
Speaker 4: just stand by it, sit next to it. You don't
Speaker 4: even have to push the button yet if you don't,
Speaker 4: if that really really triggers your dog, it's about helping
Speaker 4: your dog see that this is calm and comfortable and safe,
Speaker 4: and just spending time near it, and as your dog
Speaker 4: is getting more comfortable just being around the buttons.
Speaker 5: And seeing that you're buy the buttons and it's.
Speaker 4: Okay, then introducing pushing it again in again a very
Speaker 4: calm way. You can pet your dog, provide some verbal reassurance,
Speaker 4: and hopefully that'll help your dog become a little more
Speaker 4: comfortable with them and not as startled and alarmed when
Speaker 4: they hear this sound that they maybe haven't heard before
Speaker 4: or weren't expecting. But I do have a lot of
Speaker 4: really great tips in my book. At the end of
Speaker 4: each chapter, I say some takeaways for what worked for
Speaker 4: us and what you can do at home, And then
Speaker 4: in the back of my book, I have a whole
Speaker 4: section on tips for teaching your own dog at home.
Speaker 3: Are you going to merchandise the buttons as well? Does
Speaker 3: that ever? Are you?
Speaker 6: Like?
Speaker 3: I have enough things on my plate right now, But
Speaker 3: is that something that you had to think about as
Speaker 3: a business model?
Speaker 5: Yes?
Speaker 4: So. Right when this all came out for the first time,
Speaker 4: it was the end of twenty nineteen and People magazine
Speaker 4: had written a piece about what I was doing with Stella,
Speaker 4: and it just went crazy nuts, like actually went viral.
Speaker 4: And from that point I was just flooded with people
Speaker 4: wanting to do a lot of things with me, create courses,
Speaker 4: create products, all types of things. And what I really
Speaker 4: wanted to do the most was to get the information
Speaker 4: out to people. And I wanted to share our story
Speaker 4: so that people understood where this came from and understood
Speaker 4: how they can see their own dogs communication potential and
Speaker 4: harness it. So to me, the information was most important.
Speaker 4: And then I did partner with Learning Resources, the company
Speaker 4: who made the original buttons that we used to create
Speaker 4: a talking pet starter set, which is buttons paired with
Speaker 4: activities that I wrote, so people know what to do
Speaker 4: with the buttons when you get them and how to
Speaker 4: start introducing them.
Speaker 3: Oh, what a great gift to someone gets a dog, like, yeah,
Speaker 3: have some buttons. That's awesome.
Speaker 5: Absolutely, Yep.
Speaker 4: My whole goal is just getting enough as much information
Speaker 4: out to people as possible to help them teach their
Speaker 4: own dogs.
Speaker 3: There's just so so many good questions. A couple more
Speaker 3: listener questions Audrey Rose Kalovic and Michael mccleoud. They both
Speaker 3: kind of asked if Stella has ever exhibited behavior that
Speaker 3: indicates this is in Michael's words, that she has a
Speaker 3: mental concept of the self, and you know, has she
Speaker 3: become self aware? And I think a lot of people
Speaker 3: have seen that funny video where she's like, who's this
Speaker 3: in the mirror? That's been such a marker for cognition
Speaker 3: in terms of primates and certain animals. Do you see
Speaker 3: Stella sort of having that kind of self reflection at all?
Speaker 4: Yes, So Stella talks about herself by saying her name Stella,
Speaker 4: and she'll differentiate between Stella, Jake and Christina. So that's
Speaker 4: been really fascinating to see. I was actually so surprised.
Speaker 4: I thought it was really intriguing that when I introduced
Speaker 4: our three names, I didn't know what would happen. I
Speaker 4: just wanted to try and see what would happen. When
Speaker 4: I gave her the chance to learn how to say
Speaker 4: our names, she used her name so often. It was
Speaker 4: so cute. It reminded me just of this toddler like
Speaker 4: being able to say their name for the first time.
Speaker 4: She would just walk over to the board and just
Speaker 4: repeatedly just Stella, Stella, Stella, Stella, Stella, and then eventually
Speaker 4: she started pairing Stella with what she would want to do,
Speaker 4: so Stella outside, Stella eat, Stella play, And it's been
Speaker 4: really funny recently, Stella will so now we live in
Speaker 4: a house and we have a backyard for the first
Speaker 4: time since she was really little, and it took some
Speaker 4: getting used to for her because she was always used
Speaker 4: to us in apartments having to take her outside on
Speaker 4: a leash. We were always with her when she was outside,
Speaker 4: and so now she's understanding that she can be outside
Speaker 4: by herself in the backyard, and she'll she'll talk about that.
Speaker 4: So sometimes she wants all of us to go outside,
Speaker 4: or she'll tell us to come outside with her. But
Speaker 4: other times she'll say things like Stella outside by, like
Speaker 4: she just wants.
Speaker 5: To go out on her own. Ouch.
Speaker 4: That's been really fascinating to see develop, and I absolutely
Speaker 4: think she has self awareness.
Speaker 3: Actually, Aaron Ryan wants to know, what do you say
Speaker 3: to the haters that argue that Stella doesn't really talk
Speaker 3: or doesn't understand what she's really doing. An Errans's ps
Speaker 3: big fan of Stella. But clarification, Yeah, so you know,
Speaker 3: how do you address people who might not understand how
Speaker 3: nuanced language is.
Speaker 4: You know, It honestly doesn't bother me too much because
Speaker 4: I've just accepted that this is a really new idea
Speaker 4: in the world, and it just takes time for people
Speaker 4: to see this, and it takes multiple people doing it,
Speaker 4: and it takes multiple different perspectives for it to really
Speaker 4: become cemented in society. And this like known fact or
Speaker 4: known theory that's happening. So it doesn't bother me too much.
Speaker 4: I just try to explain that, you know, I'm teaching
Speaker 4: Stella in all the same ways that I teach children words,
Speaker 4: and I use my expertise in language development to understand
Speaker 4: the milestones that were happening and know what to teach
Speaker 4: and when, And I mean this whole journey. I've been
Speaker 4: observing her progress and seeing what's working, what's not working.
Speaker 4: When she's learned a word based on the context that
Speaker 4: she uses it in, if she's able to say it
Speaker 4: independently or if she needs cues, if she's able to
Speaker 4: pair it with other words, she's able to generalize it
Speaker 4: to other meanings. So there's all these factors that are
Speaker 4: going through my brain as I'm observing her and keeping
Speaker 4: track of her development. So I think that's just something
Speaker 4: that other people don't know and don't see when they
Speaker 4: watch my videos. But you know, it's not their fault.
Speaker 4: They just don't have the same perspective.
Speaker 3: So the best armor against doubt or flack confidence, perseverance,
Speaker 3: and a lot of passion. Maybe some sweet doggye belly
Speaker 3: rubs also that's stout. Her has a great question, wants
Speaker 3: to know what your reasoning is for using your and
Speaker 3: your partner's name with Stella instead of mom dad. And
Speaker 3: do you judge pepeople who use mom dad on their.
Speaker 4: Oh gosh, no, I definitely don't judge people who use
Speaker 4: mom and dad. It just made sense for me to
Speaker 4: use Christina and Jake because we don't have any human children,
Speaker 4: so we weren't calling each other mom and dad.
Speaker 5: So Stella was.
Speaker 4: Already hearing us call each other Jake and Christina, you know,
Speaker 4: for a while before I even introduced those words. So
Speaker 4: I just thought it would be easier for her to
Speaker 4: use those words and use our names when she had
Speaker 4: already been hearing Jake and Christina, Whereas if I would
Speaker 4: have added mom and dad, that would have been a
Speaker 4: totally totally brand new words for her because we had
Speaker 4: just never used that in our vocabulary.
Speaker 5: But if people do refer.
Speaker 4: To themselves as mom and dad, even if they don't
Speaker 4: have kids, if they refer to themselves as mom and
Speaker 4: dad when they're talking to their dogs, then by all
Speaker 4: means use mom and dad. It's just about what you're
Speaker 4: own communication patterns are.
Speaker 3: That's a great point of whatever they hear, whatever they
Speaker 3: hear the most, probably Mau Mau pop pop dingis lover.
Speaker 3: Just let your dog in on those titles. Quinnwest, first
Speaker 3: time question asker, says, as a deaf adult who spent
Speaker 3: over a decade in speech therapy. Do you think that
Speaker 3: the field would ever be willing to stop promoting oralism
Speaker 3: on deaf children, now known as listening and spoken language.
Speaker 3: I know speech therapists could be necessary and do a
Speaker 3: lot of good, but I also know my community is
Speaker 3: hurt and I wasn't aware of this. But have you
Speaker 3: seen any attitudes changing. Do you have a particular way
Speaker 3: of working with people who are heard of, hearing or deaf?
Speaker 4: So I think that just comes from needing a lot
Speaker 4: of education, and I'm so thankful that I had some
Speaker 4: really great classes in college and graduate school that really
Speaker 4: educated us about deaf culture. And I do think there's
Speaker 4: a shift happening because I'm seeing more and more that
Speaker 4: people are having conversation with parents of children who are
Speaker 4: deaf about all of the different options instead of just
Speaker 4: throwing one option that the speech therapist might think is best.
Speaker 5: In that moment.
Speaker 4: But I think, I really do hope that there is
Speaker 4: this shift, because I know deaf culture is very celebrated
Speaker 4: and people are very proud to be part of it
Speaker 4: and to use sign language especially, So I do hope
Speaker 4: there is a shift. I think there is because in
Speaker 4: our education, which was just a few years ago, that
Speaker 4: I was in graduate school. We really did talk a
Speaker 4: lot about that and figuring out the best path forward
Speaker 4: for each person and each family, not making these assumptions
Speaker 4: or generalizations about the best path forward for communicating.
Speaker 3: Okay, side note, just for some context, some deaf and
Speaker 3: hard of hearing folks express feeling at odds with the
Speaker 3: field of speech language pathology. And I looked around, and
Speaker 3: I'm going to quote twenty fifteen paper titled the Cultural
Speaker 3: Gap Deaf Community and Speech Language Pathologists, published out of
Speaker 3: Portland State University, and the paper begins with the statement
Speaker 3: within the deaf community, speech language pathologists have been viewed
Speaker 3: as enemies. In the late nineteen twenties, deaf schools were
Speaker 3: only teaching children how to communicate orally, deaf students were
Speaker 3: punished for using sign language to communicate, the paper says,
Speaker 3: and this type of valuing spoken words over the language
Speaker 3: of signing, or valuing cochlear implants over being deaf or
Speaker 3: being hard of hearing, has been called oralism. So with
Speaker 3: more ways to express thoughts and opinions via social media,
Speaker 3: now issues like this can gain a wider audience and
Speaker 3: be addressed. And on that note, I also wanted to
Speaker 3: share that my friend Shannon Felts she had thoughts as
Speaker 3: her wonderful son, Aiden is on the autism spectrum, and
Speaker 3: she wanted to toss some praise at Aiden's speech therapist.
Speaker 3: And she wrote to me, one thing I think is
Speaker 3: really important to touch on is that speech is so
Speaker 3: much more than just parroting back. We don't think about
Speaker 3: how complex and difficult communicative speech is until it becomes
Speaker 3: a hurdle. And Shannon says, our speech pathologist has so
Speaker 3: much grace and patience, and it often feels like we're
Speaker 3: making zero progress, but the speech pathologist always reminds them
Speaker 3: how many steps it takes and keeps her sane in
Speaker 3: the process. And she continues, they are so much more
Speaker 3: than just a speech pathologist. They are also therapists for
Speaker 3: parents who are struggling, which I think is a really
Speaker 3: great acknowledgment. And so some people are visual, some people
Speaker 3: might be verbal. We're all different with different brains and
Speaker 3: interest and abilities, and we all deserve to communicate our
Speaker 3: thoughts and feelings and needs and be listened to. So
Speaker 3: it's not always easy for any of us, and patience
Speaker 3: and encouragement is key. And Christina really really stresses that
Speaker 3: in her book. But what else is not easy questions?
Speaker 3: I always ask the hardest thing about your work, hardest
Speaker 3: thing about your job right now? Has it shifted a lot?
Speaker 3: What's the most frustrating thing? It can be anything huge
Speaker 3: or petty.
Speaker 5: Let's see.
Speaker 4: I think if we're talking about just being a speech
Speaker 4: pathologist in general, I would say the hardest thing is
Speaker 4: not letting your job totally run your life. People who
Speaker 4: are speech therapists and who are in any helping profession,
Speaker 4: they obviously we all just want to help, and we
Speaker 4: all want to help to the best of our abilities,
Speaker 4: and sometimes it can be really challenging to separate work
Speaker 4: and life and understand that even if I'm doing my
Speaker 4: absolute best, there are factors that I can't control, and
Speaker 4: there's a lot that goes into a person's communication and
Speaker 4: their health and progress. So I think just taking it
Speaker 4: easy in that respect can be really challenging.
Speaker 3: Not doing a good enough job is the hardest thing.
Speaker 3: Oh my heart, I just love how much this human
Speaker 3: loves her work. And what about your favorite thing about
Speaker 3: speech pathology?
Speaker 4: Oh my gosh, it is so incredibly rewarding helping another being,
Speaker 4: whether it be dog right now, with stella or humans
Speaker 4: express themselves. I mean, I've worked with kids who went
Speaker 4: years without having a functional communication system until they were
Speaker 4: sixteen years old and got a communication device and said
Speaker 4: their first words. It just makes you so grateful for
Speaker 4: this skill that most of us have naturally. Being able
Speaker 4: to talk just really makes you thankful for communication in
Speaker 4: general and just wanting to help everyone have that power,
Speaker 4: because I truly can't imagine a life in which you're
Speaker 4: not able to say what's on your mind.
Speaker 3: I imagine that must be really what drove you into
Speaker 3: the field too.
Speaker 4: Absolutely, that's one hundred percent the most rewarding thing for
Speaker 4: me and my favorite part about our field.
Speaker 3: I wonder if it's ever weird for you to have
Speaker 3: your voice be so recognizable because talking to you, I'm like, well,
Speaker 3: of course this is Christina Humbers for us, because I've
Speaker 3: heard you a in the AAC buttons and just talking
Speaker 3: to sos Sella. Is that something that ever is weird
Speaker 3: for you to hear your own voice so much?
Speaker 4: It is weird, And just to know that there are
Speaker 4: so many people around the world who know of me
Speaker 4: and my dog.
Speaker 5: I don't think that's really fully hit me yet.
Speaker 4: It sometimes if we're out and about, Stella will get
Speaker 4: recognized a lot because she's a pretty distinguished looking dog.
Speaker 4: But that's always just so strange to me because pretty
Speaker 4: much everything has been via social media or the internet,
Speaker 4: so to actually have those in person experiences where people
Speaker 4: are recognizing us is really really strange.
Speaker 3: And it must be great too now to have a
Speaker 3: book out. So if people ask your advice in the
Speaker 3: comments section or when you're out and about at the
Speaker 3: hardware store, you know, it's just tell them it's all
Speaker 3: in my book.
Speaker 5: You can yes book exactly.
Speaker 4: It feels so good to be able to say that.
Speaker 4: I again, when this all went crazy at the end
Speaker 4: of twenty nineteen, people had so many questions, understandably, so
Speaker 4: I just wanted to be able to share all of it,
Speaker 4: and I didn't know how. So that's where writing a
Speaker 4: book came from, was just I want to be able
Speaker 4: to share all of this to all of you. So
Speaker 4: it feels really wonderful that people will finally be able
Speaker 4: to access all the information I've been thinking about and
Speaker 4: wanting to share for a while now.
Speaker 3: So having things on your mind and wanting to share them,
Speaker 3: that's what's all about. Whether it's through a screen or
Speaker 3: a sign or a tailwag or a soliloquy or a
Speaker 3: button or an expression, and keep asking patient people shameless
Speaker 3: questions any form, and of course listening to each other.
Speaker 3: As I warned you, this episode was barely able to
Speaker 3: scratch the surface of this ology because it's such a
Speaker 3: huge ology. And if you would like to learn more
Speaker 3: about Christina's work and her speech pathology and Stella and
Speaker 3: dog training, get your hands on her new book. It's
Speaker 3: called How Stella Learned to Talk. It's out literally today
Speaker 3: May fourth. We timed this on purpose, and if you
Speaker 3: buy her book in the first week of its release,
Speaker 3: you get a free video course. I look that up.
Speaker 3: She didn't tell me that. I just found that out myself,
Speaker 3: So get it sooner or later. I don't get a kickback.
Speaker 3: I just like to help you get free stuff. And
Speaker 3: it's a great read. I tore through it. I was
Speaker 3: reading it this week and it's really wonderful. It's a
Speaker 3: great read. Christina and Stella are at Hunger for Words
Speaker 3: on Instagram. Her website is Hunger for Words dot com,
Speaker 3: all spelled out. I'm at Aliward on Instagram and Twitter.
Speaker 3: Just one l and Allie We're at Ologies on Twitter
Speaker 3: and Instagram, and tickets for that live show catching up
Speaker 3: with Dad Ward on May eighteenth with volcanologists Jess Phoenix
Speaker 3: are going to be available. There's going to be a
Speaker 3: link in the show notes for you. And I'm not
Speaker 3: sure if this is the only time I'm ever going
Speaker 3: to do a live show. I don't know if we're
Speaker 3: going to do them quarterly or monthly. We're just kind
Speaker 3: of testing it out. So if you have ever wanted
Speaker 3: to do a live show, join on May the eighteenth.
Speaker 3: Get your tickets. They are twelve dollars or nine dollars
Speaker 3: for patrons. There are also limited edition shirts available for
Speaker 3: this inaugural show. Jarrett designed them. They feature some magma.
Speaker 3: I'm very excited. I love them. May eighteenth, so get
Speaker 3: your tickets now. There are links to all the stuff
Speaker 3: in the show notes and app on my website at
Speaker 3: aliwar dot com. Thank you patrons for supporting the show
Speaker 3: and sending in your questions. Thank you Aaron Talbert for
Speaker 3: adminting Theologies podcast Facebook group. Thank you and belated birthday
Speaker 3: to Witchy Woman. Shannon feltis her sister and you are
Speaker 3: that co host Bonnie Dutch and now Noel Dilworth and
Speaker 3: Susan Hale for helping with merch orders too. Thanks to
Speaker 3: Emily White of thewordery dot com for making transcripts for
Speaker 3: the show and Caleb Patton for bleeping them. Those are
Speaker 3: up on our website at aliwar dot com. Thank you
Speaker 3: to both mustachioed editors The Very Hunky Chart Sleeper and
Speaker 3: the Dino and Kitty Podcast. Kind Hearted Stephen Ray Morris
Speaker 3: of the per Cast and see Jurassic Right. They make
Speaker 3: this whole shebang with me each week. Nick Thorburn wrote
Speaker 3: and performed the theme music. And if you stick around
Speaker 3: until the end of the episode, I tell you a secret.
Speaker 3: And this week's secret will only matter to people who
Speaker 3: are on the West Coast probably, And I'm sorry, but
Speaker 3: there's this magazine called West Ways and it's the magazine
Speaker 3: that Triple A puts out if you remember, and I'm like,
Speaker 3: low key, it's my favorite magazine. I get so excited
Speaker 3: when it arrives in the mail. And there's a game
Speaker 3: where they hide a poppy somewhere in the magazine because
Speaker 3: that's caliborniy State flower and you you try to find
Speaker 3: this poppy. And I have read every single like an
Speaker 3: episode edition of west Way's Triple A's Magazine. And I've
Speaker 3: only found the poppy twice, and I'm like, how who's
Speaker 3: finding these poppies? Do they are? They really even hiding them?
Speaker 3: But every time, I'm like, this is the this is
Speaker 3: the issue. I'm going to find the poppy. And y'all,
Speaker 3: I found the poppy today.
Speaker 4: I was.
Speaker 3: I took it with me on the flight. I was
Speaker 3: leafing through boom spot of the pop felt good, okay, bybye.
Speaker 6: Pacodermatology, mombiology, rypto zoology, lithology, zoology, meteorology and pedatology, anthology, zeriology, seldology.
Speaker 1: What is the copy