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Speaker 1: Girls are running the world and it's not going well.

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So called artists reimagine Confederate monuments and the many reasons

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why you shouldn't cheer for surrogacy. All that and more

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on The Kylie Cast. Hi everybody, and welcome to the

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Kylie Cast. I'm Kylie Griswold, Managing editor at The Federalist.

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Please like and subscribe wherever you get your podcasts. We've

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got a brand new channel exclusively for the Kylie Cast

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just listening to the show, be sure to check out

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the full video version on my personal YouTube channel or

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the Federalist channel on Rumble. If you'd like to email

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the show, you can do so at radio at the

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Federalist dot com. I would love to hear from you.

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I read an article this week that I can't stop

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thinking about, and in fact, it seems to have caught

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a lot of people's attention. It's a piece by Helen

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Andrews in Compact magazine called The Great Feminization, and in

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it she makes the case quite persuasively in my opinion

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that everything we would conceptualize as wokeness is the byproduct

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of a feminized society. En mass I mean, just think

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about it. Political correctness, identity, politics, the me too movement,

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cultural affirmative action, DEI, social emotional learning. All of it involves,

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in Helen's words, quote, prioritizing the feminine over the masculine,

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empathy over rationality, safety over risk, cohesion over competition end quote.

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This is in part explained by the general differences in

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how men and women approach conflict. While men are wired

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for war, they're primed to compartmentalize. They deal with conflict

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directly and swiftly. Women tend to be much more cooperative

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and risk averse. Instead of dealing with their competitors head

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on like men do, they tend to isolate or undermine

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them quietly and behind the scenes. Helen writes, quote, men

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tend to be better at compartmentalizing than women, and wokeness was,

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in many ways a society wide failure to compartmentalize. Traditionally,

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an individual doctor might have opinions on the political issues

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of the day, but he would regard it as his

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professional duty. To keep those opinions out of the examination room.

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Now that medicine has become more feminized, doctors wear pins

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and lanyards expressing views on controversial issues, from gay rights

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to gaza. They even bring the credibility of their profession

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to bear on political facts, as when doctors said Black

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Lives Matter protests could continue in violation of COVID lockdowns

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because racism was a public health emergency end quote. She

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observes that probably the most detrimental sector of this feminization

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is the legal profession, because, after all, we all lie

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on law and order and blind justice, a reliable legal

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system that can call balls and strikes against an impartial law.

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Helen says, quote to be blunt. The rule of law

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will not survive the legal profession becoming majority female. The

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rule of law is not just about writing rules down.

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It means following them, even when they yield an outcome

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that tugs at your heart strings or runs contrary to

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your gut sense of which party is more sympathetic end quote.

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It's a long article. There's plenty more to agree with,

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but readers also found some disagreements too. My colleague Joy

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Pullman is an author and the executive editor at The Federalist,

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and she wrote a response piece to Helen Andrews this

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week in The Federalist titled Western culture isn't feminized, It's transgender,

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and she joins me now to discuss Joy Welcome. Thanks

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so much for coming on the Kylie Gust. Thank you,

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Kylie Joy. I did want to highlight what I think

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was probably your favorite passage of Helen's article, and it

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was also mine. She wrote, quote, women can sue their

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boss is for running a workplace that feels like a

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fraternity house, but men can't sue when their workplace feels

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like a Montessori kindergarten. Naturally, employers air on the side

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of making the office softer. So if women are thriving

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more in the modern workplace, is that really because they

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are out competing men? Or is it because the rules

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have been changed to favor them? End quote. So I

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think you would largely agree with that sentiment, and I

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want to start by just asking you to detail what

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do you think are Helen's strongest points, Like what in

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this article do you agree with?

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Speaker 2: I actually would say that I agree with at least

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ninety five percent of her article. I just in mind

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kind of wanted to extend it and think about some

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of the language that she's using. So, for example, I

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kind of, I guess it's a little difficult for me

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to hear all of these really terrible things described to

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feminization when it's kind of only half of the story

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I really see, you know, so the things that she

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and in my response, I link to some work I've

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done kind of engaging with a lot of different people

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who have kind of made similar arguments over the past

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couple of years on the right kind of like the

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long house argument, for example, is a really popular sort

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of thing, and I do see a lot of those

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as being negative aspects of women. But what I see

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as missing and if you're going to use the word

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feminine or feminization but exclude all the positive things about

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what women do, I think that's where the problem for

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me comes in. And so I would just love for people,

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you know, to use more of a refined term, such

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as maybe toxic femininity to talk about you know, kind

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of these you know, girls gone bad sorts of things,

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these dynamics in our culture, because I think it is important,

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you know, to really talk about the other half of

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that what women do, that is good. There are actually

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a lot of feminine attributes that we're really missing in

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our culture and that are not only left out of

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the conversation, but a lot of you know, women's lives,

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everyday lives now. So I think we've just really lost

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a complete picture of what femininity means and what you know,

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the good parts of it could be. And I really

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think if we brought back more of those good parts,

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we would have less of the bad.

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Speaker 1: Yeah. So you right in your piece that society actually

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isn't feminine at all. Can you explain what you mean

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by that?

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Speaker 2: Well, I mean just when I look at around at

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our society, I do not see a feminine world. I

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see a world that is very hostile to women and

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two children who I kind of see as you know,

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one of the top concerns of a well adjusted woman

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is you know, how the children are doing right and

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part And I think in biologically speaking, psychologically speaking, a

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lot of the uniqueness about women as compared to men

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is because of our orientation towards children, you know, wherehereas men,

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you know, an inward orientation towards the home, towards children

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raising them. You know, while men tend to have more

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of an outward orientation, kind of more outward facing, if

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you would think of that. You know, so our society

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is extremely hostile to children and two women. You know,

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so if you look at for example, I mean, I

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think the kind of the just one thing that we

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never talk about or we pretend is a really good thing,

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is the sexualization of our culture. You know, walking around now,

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I'm just seeing naked women all the time, everywhere I go, billboards, everything,

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I mean, so I can't know.

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Speaker 1: I look.

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Speaker 2: I use Pinterest for example, you know, to get recipes, right, Like,

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I store my recipes on there, and so I'm flipping

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through it while my kids are watching. There are there

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are bra ads like every single page on my Pinterest,

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and they're not you know, I'm totally comfortable with bras.

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I like, you know, I wear them. I want to

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wear nice ones, you know, nothing wrong with that, but

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like these are basically what I would consider soft porn advertisements.

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Speaker 1: You know.

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Speaker 2: And I have a seven year old, you know, looking

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at me helping you in the kitchen, you know, with dinner,

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and she's seeing really straight aut pornographic stuff and that's

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completely wrong and there's no warning on it, and that

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I think that's just because it's become normalized. Other people

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don't see it as pornographic, but it really is. And

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that's just because you know, everybody's watching porn. Our culture

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is just really you know, transformed in that direction. But

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that is not a pro woman thing, you know, because

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really the value of women decreases when other women are

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putting out right, you know, the way that women get

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the commitment that we want, the security you know of marriage,

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the you know, a man to provide for us while

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we're vulnerable having children. You know, really we have to

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have this compact with other women that they're not going

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to be servicing you know, men sexually for free otherwise.

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You know, it really bids you know, down the price

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of reserving that for a guy and what you have

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to offer for him in a marriage. So that's you know,

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one of the things that I bring up in the article.

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I mean, our culture is really I mean treating women

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like men, basically saying in order for women to get

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a head in life or to be given any sort

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of recognition or honor, they have to neuter themselves with chemicals,

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you know, really mess with their you know, their emotions,

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their entire bodies, you know, dump themselves for full of

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synthetic hormones with the pill and all kinds of other contraception.

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Speaker 1: You know, there is zero regard.

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Speaker 2: Given for the fact that women are biologically different than

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men and you know, accommodations for you know, that sort

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of thing. Rather, you know, women are basically said, you know,

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freeze your eggs, you know, screw kids, you don't really

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want those, and just pushing to career, career, career, career

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is the only way that you give me value. I

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think that's inherently anti woll. It's sold to us as

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pro women, but I think it's deeply anti women because

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it negates who we are, as fertile, different than men

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beings in order to gain any sort of honor acceptance,

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you know, or you know, pats on the back.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, exactly. Well, and there's so many things we see

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regularly that are just I don't know how you sweare

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them with this idea that society, that feminization is just

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the best way to describe exactly what's happening in society. Right,

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So it's not feminine at all to look at a

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protest and see half naked women screaming in the phases

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of police officers. There's nothing feminine about that, or there's

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nothing in right, or when Helen writes about women prioritizing

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safety over risk, well, are women prioritizing safety over risk

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when they take chemical abortion pills prescribed to them by

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a telehealth practitioner that you could send them to the

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er and bleed out hemorrhaging, you know, because they might

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have an ectopic pregnancy that they don't know about or something.

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It's we've been told this is feminized because this is

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what feminism looks like, quote unquote, But there isn't anything

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feminine about it at all. And you talk a little

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bit about the fertility rates in your piece. I'd also

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just love to hear you talk a bit about other

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ways that we have just an anti child culture, you know,

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from abortion to not having children friendly events or you know,

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weddings or whatever else might fit into that category.

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Speaker 2: I loved your monologue last week, you know, for example,

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talking about the ghoulishness you know in people's yards that's

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completely anti children, right. You know, a couple of blocks

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from my home, we've got like this, you know, basically

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guy you know, in a noose, decapitated, you know, with

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all this blood dripping all around.

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Speaker 1: You know, my child?

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Speaker 2: What am I I'm not supposed to let my children

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play in the neighborhood, you know, where they live, so

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that they don't have to see terrifying things that haunt

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them in their sleep, you know. And I know, I

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mean I saw the replies on that. You know, people

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with dead and consciences, you know, sitting there is being like,

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what's wrong with you? You want to have a little fun? No,

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these people have warped consciences. They're not thinking about the children.

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You know, they're basically you know, putting themselves first over

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what if they had kids, you know, they would have

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a better I mean, some people can have kids and

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still be totally messed up and not great people, you know,

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but it does tend to have a refining effect on

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the majority of people, and people absolutely are less likely

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to put out that kind of gore and garbage. And

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that's just a really trivial surface example, you know, of

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our culture's kind of anti kid nature. But I really

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think just the fact that you know, women don't want

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babies nowadays. I think it's fifty percent you know, of

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women under fifty actively don't want children. That is almost

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unheard of in the history of humankind. You know, women always, always,

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always wanted children, you know some I mean to the

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you know, to the extent that there are you know, old, ancient,

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you know stories about women, you know, I mean it's

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it's kind of a trope, right, you know, woman gets

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a baby and then she ignores her husband, right, you know,

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the husbands have to compete with the baby for the

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wife's attention after the baby comes. And you know, so

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it is an innate biological, you know, female wired in

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sort of thing to want a baby. And so the

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fact that we have you know, and I and you

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know included among them, have you know, have been working

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on that defeminist you know, feministization process for myself, right,

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you know, but it is a real problem when you

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have a society where people treat babies as trash, disposable, disgusting,

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you know, all of these opposite of the the true natural,

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biological correct action of an actual female.

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Speaker 1: Yeah. Well, and in the piece specifically, Helen talks about

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the New York Times staff for instance, that I forget

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the year she used, but it was ten percent female

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and now it's like vastly more female staff at the

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New York Times and how that affects the way that

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people perceive things, because of course, no matter, no matter

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if you're reading The New York Times on a regular

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basis or not, it sets the terms of debates, and

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you know, it determines what's in the news and so

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on and so forth. But it's just interesting because then

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you'll you'll have corporate media, legacy media running articles. I

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think this was from the Times, although it may have

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been the Washington Post. So many of those are just

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indistinguishable in my mind at this point. But about you know,

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the Motherhood Penalty, where they're running a piece about how

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awful it is to be a mother and how women

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are just totally screwed once they have a baby, you know,

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and that's not a unique piece the artists calls about

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to rich tech bros.

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Speaker 2: You know, or the women who sold their eggs, you know,

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and have no one to live with for the rest

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of their life after their you know, their entire uterus

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dries up. You know, who are lonely. You know, they

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have no one to come home to but their dogs

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or potted plants. You know, who are staring at the

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second half of their life with nothing to look forward

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to besides freaking money. You know, that is absolutely a

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set of articles that could be run right that would

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be the mirror image of that, and then you can

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show you know, the woman a relief. They have someone

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to come home to, they have someone to snuggle with,

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they have you know, grandkids, games to go to, they

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have meaning in their life. They have people who need

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them and rely on them and love them and want

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them like no one else. And I mean that's you know,

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so I go off for work for a business trip,

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you know, I come home, you know, for the next week,

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I'm like the celebrity at home. The kids are all

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like all over me, mommy, mommy, mommy. And you can

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either take that as oh, that's so annoying, you know,

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or you can be like, wow, these people love me

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like nobody else. I'm such a rich person, you know.

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Rich in the world matters so much more than money.

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Speaker 1: Yes, yeah, well, I mean you can argue that it's

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what our modern culture would define as as feminine, but

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what it really is is feminist. It's their definition of

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this list.

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Speaker 2: Which is anti stand sex.

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Speaker 1: Yes, yes, they're wearing feminine as a skin suit, when

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really femininism is the antithesis to everything that is that

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is feminine. Your headline is pretty punchy. I want to know,

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what do you mean when you say that Western culture

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is transgender. Well, so, the the what.

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Speaker 2: I mean by that simply is that, you know, as

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we're discussing, you know, women are not pushed to act

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like women. They're pushed to act like men nowadays. But

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also the corollary is true, men are not pushed to

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act like men, they are pushed to act like women. Right,

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so we have this total swap we don't have we

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you know, we have the feminization of men, but we

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have the masculinization of women. And so that's why I

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say that our culture is transgender, because you know, if

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it was truly a feminine culture, I think we would

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see some of the good things about being feminine as

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well as the women.

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Speaker 1: But instead we only have.

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Speaker 2: The trashy garbage stuff about you know, women being bleached

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to both sexes, you know, and and you know then

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the masculinization being extended to women. So I think, rather

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than you know, we just have one sided equation here,

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which I think, whether that being a one sided kind

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of you know situation, we have a dual side, and

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we have a swap. And that's of course because the

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sex is live and balance with each other. We are

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a dynamic or interrelated. We can't have one without the other.

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Men are not to women as a fish is to

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a bicycle. And you know, men and women need each other.

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We can't get by without each other, and we have

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to figure out how to live together in happiness and harmony,

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you know, rather than being at war all the time.

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Speaker 1: Yeah. I want to put up a passage from your

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piece actually because this gets to that point, and I

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thought it was just really excellent. You write about a

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speech you delivered a year ago to the Ego Forum,

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and you write, quote, are we experiencing a cultural overfeminization?

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It looks to me like instead we have a swap.

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We have feminization where there should be masculinity, and masculinization

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where there should be femininity. Our women are pushed to

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act like men and are men to act like women,

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and the resulting social transgenderism makes everyone extremely unhappy, not

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to mention dysfunctional end quote. And then I love this part.

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Do we have too many weak men and unhitched women? Absolutely?

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So we're gone conclusion. I'd argue However, that's because our

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society has reversed men and women's roles, and in so

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doing abandoned both masculinity and femininity. We are not too feminine.

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Our women are not feminine enough, and our men are

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not masculine enough. I thought that was such a good point,

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and it just seems to be seems to me that

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what you're saying is that it's really a problem of

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disordering society. So these feminine traits would actually be good

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if they were rightly ordered toward child rearing, and but

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they're catastrophic when they're brought into the boardroom or brought

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to safety dominie men's instead of children a baby.

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Speaker 2: Say that again, I said, safety before risk is a

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good way to protect a baby. Yes, And to putting

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risk above safety is a good way for a man

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to protect his family. Right, he puts himself in front

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of the bullet, right, he goes and checks out the

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funny noise in the garage, et cetera, et cetera.

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Speaker 1: Yes, that's such a great point.

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Speaker 3: Is illegal immigration actually breaking emergency care? The watchdotaln Wall

357
00:17:04,400 --> 00:17:07,680
Street podcast with Chris Markowski. Every day, Chris helps unpack

358
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360
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for non emergencies like cold and flu because they have

361
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362
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turned into a system overwhelmed.

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00:17:22,079 --> 00:17:24,119
Speaker 4: Whether it's happening in DC or down on Wall Street,

364
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it's affecting you financially. Be informed. Check out the watchdod

365
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366
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or wherever you get your podcasts.

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Speaker 1: I also love that you bring it all the way

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back to the Garden of Eden. Helen talks a lot

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about how this overfeminization is unprecedented, and I mean, in

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many ways it is. You know, we have somewhat of

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a unique problem in twenty first century America in its

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current form. But at the same time, you know, there's

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nothing new under the sun, and men have been abdicating

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this leadership role and blaming women for the results since

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the very first man and woman, since the very first sin.

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I mean, it's this is not a new thing.

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Speaker 2: Well right, And I mean, so this is tricky I

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mean to talk about, but I think at the bottom

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line is if men really are supposed to be the leaders,

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the heads of the households, the heads of government, the

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heads of society. You know, if they really have that

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role naturally speaking, you know, then you know, a leader

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doesn't whine and refuse to take responsibility and blame shift,

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I mean, and so really men are abdicating their masculinity

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and their leadership role when they sit around and just

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whinge about how women are the problem. I agree that

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many women are a problem, and I agree that one

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have been socialized to be dysfunctional, you know, not helpful

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antagonistic to man. I understand that men have a very big,

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uphill legal and cultural battle, you know, in order to

391
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kind of like you know, a very you know, it's

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not going to be an easy, you know, kind of

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cake walk to kind of take the places that they

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believe are rightfully theirs and to kind of reverse the situation.

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And I do think that women need to be in

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partnership with them and helping, let you know, men with

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this task, just as we you know, are supposed to

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be in partnership with and helping men with every good thing.

399
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But at the same time, you know, where does the

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buck stop.

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Speaker 1: You know, anyone who is a.

402
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Speaker 2: Leader knows, I mean, I know in our society. This

403
00:19:22,279 --> 00:19:24,319
is messed up too, but right, you know, But but

404
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traditionally speaking a properly a well a siety with accountability,

405
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the leader takes responsibility for what, you know, other people's

406
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failures under his leadership or lack of leadership. And so

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if the men are saying, you know, it's right, you know,

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women are trying to be you know, the she boss

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taking you know, we're in the pants, blah blah blah. Okay,

410
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but you're letting them. And that's and so I mean,

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I don't in saying this, of course, I think there

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are stupid ways to go about writing that problem, you know,

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writing that problem, and there's smarter ways to do it,

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and I want men to do that in a smart way.

415
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But I just you know, I do think acknowledging and

416
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talking about the situation is the first step. But just

417
00:20:00,880 --> 00:20:02,920
sitting there is not acceptable. It's not going to get

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people anywhere.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, let's get into a little bit of what you

420
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think some of the right ways are to write the

421
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ship here because Helen offers a nuking anti discrimination laws

422
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as a good way to start reversing this trend. Because

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what happens is because corporations and other institutions are afraid

424
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of lawsuits. If it doesn't look like they have enough

425
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enough women on their employee roster, then they can be

426
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sued and lose just I mean, so many figures worth

427
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of money there have been. She detailed a number of

428
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companies that have fallen into this. I think Coca Cola

429
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was one, there were plenty of others. And so, of

430
00:20:38,160 --> 00:20:40,680
course you're always going to have this trend toward over

431
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hiring women so that you don't get sued. And so

432
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of course getting rid of some of these anti discrimination

433
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laws would help that because you would have more of

434
00:20:47,799 --> 00:20:51,480
a market correction there. But how else, how else do

435
00:20:51,519 --> 00:20:53,920
we fix not only the what she calls the overfeminization,

436
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but this transgender transgenderism of society that you that you

437
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talk about.

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Speaker 2: Well, I think one thing that could help is for

439
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people to back men who do masculine and courageous things

440
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that really get a lot of you know, females testyle

441
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whining and response. So, for example, take you know a

442
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very recent issue, you know, the Young Republicans group chat right,

443
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You know, those were a bunch of men basically making

444
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masculine jokes, and someone wanted to be a trader to

445
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them and you know, docs them, you know in the public.

446
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You know, I think you know, and so those men

447
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you know have been basically you know, turned on. I

448
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think they need to be backed the way same way

449
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that Elon Musk, you know, when he had some doxing

450
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of the young men that he was hiring for Doge.

451
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You know, he put out a public poll. He said, Okay,

452
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you know they said some stupid stuff. They're sorry for it,

453
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or if it was public, they wouldn't have.

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Speaker 1: Said it that way.

455
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Speaker 2: Should I rehire them? A majority of people that absolutely

456
00:21:40,480 --> 00:21:42,599
rehire them, right, And I think the same thing, you know,

457
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would be the way to treat the young Republican groups.

458
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Speaker 1: Text.

459
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Speaker 2: Obviously they do not actually support you know, putting people

460
00:21:48,759 --> 00:21:51,440
in ovens. They are not Hitler supporters. You know, those

461
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are jokes. And young men say, you know, just ridiculous

462
00:21:53,839 --> 00:21:55,519
stuff to each other all the time. You know, they

463
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tell their best friends, you know, they you know, they

464
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call them squear words, blah blah blah, all this ridicult

465
00:22:00,200 --> 00:22:02,119
stuff that they don't believe. And that's understood you know,

466
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in male culture. And so I think men really need

467
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to have the backing. They need to know that people

468
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have their back. If they're going to get out there

469
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and act like a men, act like a man, you

470
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know that people are not going to you know, turn

471
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on them and knife them for displaying basic male behavior.

472
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I mean, it's it's ridiculous, you know that young you know,

473
00:22:18,079 --> 00:22:20,200
men can be in trouble for making jokes like that,

474
00:22:20,519 --> 00:22:23,000
you know, while you know, we have powerful people. For example,

475
00:22:23,000 --> 00:22:24,839
in the Senate, there's all of these you know, concealed

476
00:22:24,880 --> 00:22:28,279
agreements about you know, actual sexual assault you know, done

477
00:22:28,279 --> 00:22:31,559
by Senate senators, congressmen and their staffers, you know, and

478
00:22:31,559 --> 00:22:33,680
nothing is happening to them. It's all being concealed, right,

479
00:22:33,920 --> 00:22:37,720
you know. So there's just a ridiculous hierarchy that basically

480
00:22:37,799 --> 00:22:40,319
needs to be you know, upended by people with power,

481
00:22:40,880 --> 00:22:43,920
backing people who you know, men when they behave like

482
00:22:44,000 --> 00:22:46,839
men when they're actually not doing anything wrong. And we also,

483
00:22:47,000 --> 00:22:49,359
you know, I think we do see some masculine kind

484
00:22:49,359 --> 00:22:51,400
of leadership out of the Trump administration that a lot

485
00:22:51,440 --> 00:22:53,559
more people need to kind of emulate, you know, when

486
00:22:53,640 --> 00:22:56,480
when they do something that's bold, you know that you

487
00:22:56,519 --> 00:22:59,480
know that is obviously good for people that has obviously

488
00:22:59,519 --> 00:23:01,480
a lot of court, but you know they you know,

489
00:23:01,519 --> 00:23:04,039
get the kind of attempted cancel culture sort of stuff.

490
00:23:04,039 --> 00:23:06,119
They just ignore it. They say you're stupid, and they

491
00:23:06,200 --> 00:23:08,240
move on. And that's really what should happen, you know,

492
00:23:08,279 --> 00:23:10,359
with other people, not just those who have the clout

493
00:23:10,440 --> 00:23:12,279
or the level you know of a JD. Vans or

494
00:23:12,319 --> 00:23:14,319
a Donald Trump, but the people who are under them,

495
00:23:14,359 --> 00:23:16,079
who are trying to put things to order, you know,

496
00:23:16,119 --> 00:23:19,119
in an aggressive way. Different For example, attorneys general of

497
00:23:19,119 --> 00:23:21,400
states are also you know, have taken on that mold.

498
00:23:21,640 --> 00:23:24,119
I think I think, you know, more governors, more state

499
00:23:24,200 --> 00:23:27,839
lawmakers really need to just be refashing themselves into you know,

500
00:23:27,880 --> 00:23:30,519
the masculine like you know, I don't care about what

501
00:23:30,559 --> 00:23:32,400
you're going to say. I care about the results here,

502
00:23:32,400 --> 00:23:33,920
and we're going to do them because we have the

503
00:23:33,960 --> 00:23:36,000
authority given to us by the voters kind of thing.

504
00:23:36,319 --> 00:23:38,160
And so, you know, more of that needs to be

505
00:23:38,160 --> 00:23:41,160
happening with Republican elected officials. And you know, the people

506
00:23:41,200 --> 00:23:43,240
who do that need to be backed by their voters,

507
00:23:43,240 --> 00:23:45,960
backed by their donors, back to you know, by whatever

508
00:23:46,000 --> 00:23:48,799
supporters of people. They need to be given jobs, et cetera,

509
00:23:48,839 --> 00:23:52,079
et cetera, so that you know, basically the you know,

510
00:23:52,119 --> 00:23:56,440
the the ability to take people down for taking masculine

511
00:23:56,440 --> 00:23:58,000
action evaporates completely.

512
00:23:59,200 --> 00:24:01,480
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think there's probably a role on a more

513
00:24:01,680 --> 00:24:05,839
interpersonal level too, you know, not the not the screw you,

514
00:24:05,880 --> 00:24:08,480
I don't care what you say when you're getting tisk tisked,

515
00:24:08,599 --> 00:24:10,680
you know, by the local Karen on your Facebook page

516
00:24:10,759 --> 00:24:14,039
or whatever, but more more so just normalizing rational responses

517
00:24:14,039 --> 00:24:16,400
to things, asking people follow up questions why do you

518
00:24:16,400 --> 00:24:18,960
feel comfortable saying that? Or you know, And there's a

519
00:24:19,000 --> 00:24:23,559
lot of workplaces where the crazy HR Karens, whether or

520
00:24:23,599 --> 00:24:25,440
not they're actually in an HR position, you know, just

521
00:24:25,559 --> 00:24:30,440
the more like Karen lefties feel very comfortable saying exactly

522
00:24:30,480 --> 00:24:33,480
what they think about anything and correcting anybody who says

523
00:24:33,480 --> 00:24:35,480
anything that they view as stepping, you know, a little

524
00:24:35,480 --> 00:24:38,200
over the line from a conservative perspective, or you know,

525
00:24:38,279 --> 00:24:41,920
a little too fraternity house ish, as Helen would say.

526
00:24:42,359 --> 00:24:45,240
But nobody feels comfortable pushing back on the Karens who

527
00:24:45,440 --> 00:24:47,039
push a little bit too far in the other direction,

528
00:24:47,200 --> 00:24:49,839
or who you know, say things that are anti religion

529
00:24:49,839 --> 00:24:52,200
at work, or things that are just like you know,

530
00:24:52,799 --> 00:24:54,599
that should be out of bounds from the other direction.

531
00:24:54,680 --> 00:24:57,319
And so I think just We've seen people model this

532
00:24:57,440 --> 00:25:01,640
really well lately, like watching Alibeth Stucky's Jubilee interview. The

533
00:25:01,640 --> 00:25:04,160
way that she challenges a lot of these you know,

534
00:25:04,279 --> 00:25:07,720
culturally feminine, preconceived ideas that are more tug at your

535
00:25:07,759 --> 00:25:12,559
heartstrings arguments rather than rational, rational discussion. I think is

536
00:25:12,599 --> 00:25:15,200
such a good model for people in their interpersonal life.

537
00:25:15,240 --> 00:25:16,640
You know, it doesn't just need to come from the

538
00:25:16,640 --> 00:25:18,519
top down. We like, we can fix this from from

539
00:25:18,559 --> 00:25:20,720
the bottom up, or at least at least make progress.

540
00:25:21,480 --> 00:25:24,119
Speaker 2: Well, that's so, I do think that this toxic femininity

541
00:25:24,279 --> 00:25:27,839
is largely created by you know, male acquiescence and refusal

542
00:25:27,920 --> 00:25:29,799
to kind of stand up and take you know, to

543
00:25:29,839 --> 00:25:32,599
take authority. Just so, I just think that more people,

544
00:25:32,640 --> 00:25:35,799
both men and women, need to practice and enforce just

545
00:25:35,880 --> 00:25:39,440
saying no to toxic females. Yeah, no, you know, I'm

546
00:25:39,440 --> 00:25:42,519
not you know, I'm not going to participate in this situation. No,

547
00:25:42,640 --> 00:25:44,400
I know, I disagree with you, and we can just

548
00:25:44,480 --> 00:25:45,799
leave it there, you know, if they keep it up

549
00:25:45,839 --> 00:25:47,880
saying no, I left it there, you know, just but

550
00:25:48,039 --> 00:25:51,119
practicing whatever, you know, forms of just saying no and

551
00:25:51,160 --> 00:25:54,240
sticking by your no and just refusing to allow their

552
00:25:54,359 --> 00:25:57,519
you know, ridiculous cluster b tactics to dominate the situation.

553
00:25:58,359 --> 00:26:00,279
You know, people, we need a lot more practice with

554
00:26:00,319 --> 00:26:02,559
that because I think kind of the lack of boundaries,

555
00:26:02,799 --> 00:26:06,039
the lack of social norm enforcement, you know that's going

556
00:26:06,039 --> 00:26:08,559
on just you know, it allows like kind of the

557
00:26:08,680 --> 00:26:12,039
chaos agents to have full reign of the public square.

558
00:26:12,079 --> 00:26:14,440
And so there needs to be a lot more people

559
00:26:14,519 --> 00:26:17,559
saying no and enforcing their no in whatever situation that

560
00:26:17,599 --> 00:26:20,200
you're in when somebody is being really toxic in you know,

561
00:26:20,200 --> 00:26:21,000
a feminine way.

562
00:26:21,559 --> 00:26:24,559
Speaker 1: Yeah, absolutely, Joy, great insights. Thank you so much for

563
00:26:24,680 --> 00:26:28,920
joining me. Everybody should go read Joy's article Western culture

564
00:26:28,960 --> 00:26:33,000
isn't feminized, It's transgender. Go give it a read. And Joy,

565
00:26:33,039 --> 00:26:35,440
I hope to have you back again very soon. Thank you.

566
00:26:41,960 --> 00:26:43,920
All right. Next up, there is a crazy story we

567
00:26:44,000 --> 00:26:46,119
need to talk about this week, which involves a new

568
00:26:46,480 --> 00:26:50,599
museum exhibit that features those Confederate statues that went away

569
00:26:50,640 --> 00:26:53,279
over the past few years. But they are back in

570
00:26:53,319 --> 00:26:55,519
a different form than they went away. And here to

571
00:26:55,559 --> 00:26:59,039
discuss that with me is my colleague and friend el Pernell.

572
00:26:59,160 --> 00:27:02,720
You've seen it before, you love her. Welcome l Hey, Kyleie,

573
00:27:02,799 --> 00:27:05,319
great to be back. She is the assignment editor at

574
00:27:05,319 --> 00:27:07,880
The Federalist, and she is also bringing with her a

575
00:27:08,000 --> 00:27:11,599
secondary special guest, which is a brand new addition to

576
00:27:11,640 --> 00:27:16,119
her family. I should clarify she got a dog, she

577
00:27:16,200 --> 00:27:18,319
got a puppy. Tell us about your dog.

578
00:27:18,440 --> 00:27:23,160
Speaker 5: L Yeah, you might see her interrupting our our recording here,

579
00:27:23,279 --> 00:27:26,000
so so I apologize. But we've got a little yellow

580
00:27:26,039 --> 00:27:30,720
lab puppy and she is absolutely wonderful, but definitely in

581
00:27:31,119 --> 00:27:33,359
the biting phase that they always warn you about. So

582
00:27:33,680 --> 00:27:36,319
we'll see how how far she lets me get before.

583
00:27:36,119 --> 00:27:38,880
Speaker 1: She interrupts me. Yeah, we'll see what we can do.

584
00:27:38,880 --> 00:27:40,799
But if you hear anybody chewing in the background, it's

585
00:27:41,039 --> 00:27:44,799
it's Skipper, it's not Lle. So ye. Yeah, I'm not

586
00:27:44,839 --> 00:27:46,400
going to call you a dog mom though, because that

587
00:27:46,480 --> 00:27:49,880
term offends me. So you're you're a dog owner. Now.

588
00:27:50,400 --> 00:27:53,519
Speaker 5: I like to say that dogs are are members of

589
00:27:53,559 --> 00:27:54,960
the family, but not children.

590
00:27:55,519 --> 00:27:58,519
Speaker 1: That's a great distinction. Yeah, at a very federalisty take.

591
00:27:58,599 --> 00:28:01,480
So way to just bring that in there. Yeah, well, oh,

592
00:28:01,519 --> 00:28:04,359
you wrote a piece this week. It's out today. It's

593
00:28:04,400 --> 00:28:09,279
about these new Wealth, these old Confederate statues, monuments that

594
00:28:09,319 --> 00:28:12,599
have been restored. I put that in quotes to a

595
00:28:12,680 --> 00:28:16,440
museum exhibit. Your piece is called left wing cultural revolutionaries

596
00:28:16,480 --> 00:28:21,440
are decapitating statues and calling it art. The statue in

597
00:28:21,559 --> 00:28:25,680
question is, well, it was formerly a statue of Stonewall Jackson,

598
00:28:25,759 --> 00:28:30,079
the Confederate leader, but the statue no longer looks like

599
00:28:30,119 --> 00:28:33,000
Stonewall Jackson. Can you fill us in on what exactly

600
00:28:33,039 --> 00:28:35,440
happened to this, what the exhibit entails, and just kind

601
00:28:35,440 --> 00:28:38,000
of describe the coverage of this museum exhibit.

602
00:28:39,119 --> 00:28:41,839
Speaker 5: Yeah, so a lot of people are probably familiar with

603
00:28:42,119 --> 00:28:46,720
the Roberty Lee statue that used to stand in downtown Charlottesville.

604
00:28:46,759 --> 00:28:49,519
It was voted to be removed by the city council

605
00:28:49,599 --> 00:28:53,160
several years ago, and there were a lot of people

606
00:28:53,240 --> 00:28:56,400
unhappy about that, and of course you have the Unite

607
00:28:56,440 --> 00:29:00,559
the Right demonstration. That's where you get the the very

608
00:29:00,559 --> 00:29:04,240
good people on both sides hoax from the media, and

609
00:29:04,319 --> 00:29:08,240
so so that Roberty Lee statue was removed. It was

610
00:29:08,359 --> 00:29:11,759
I think given to some kind of organization, and that

611
00:29:11,880 --> 00:29:15,119
organization ended up maybe it was a museum, ended up

612
00:29:16,000 --> 00:29:17,640
melting it down and.

613
00:29:17,720 --> 00:29:18,559
Speaker 1: Kind of in secret.

614
00:29:20,000 --> 00:29:23,640
Speaker 5: But then afterwards they broadcast this really kind of haunting

615
00:29:23,720 --> 00:29:26,400
video of his face which had, like I guess, been

616
00:29:26,400 --> 00:29:29,160
cut off of the rest of the monument, just glowing

617
00:29:29,319 --> 00:29:31,079
orange being melted down slowly.

618
00:29:31,920 --> 00:29:33,559
Speaker 1: Yeah, it was in secret, but it was also in

619
00:29:33,559 --> 00:29:36,680
the most grotesque way possible and seemed very intentional. There

620
00:29:36,720 --> 00:29:41,319
was no reason to decapitate the statue before then incinerating

621
00:29:41,359 --> 00:29:43,519
it and or melting it down, I guess, and then

622
00:29:43,559 --> 00:29:47,359
broadcasting that specific component of it that they literally got

623
00:29:47,359 --> 00:29:48,680
his head. How insane.

624
00:29:49,240 --> 00:29:51,359
Speaker 5: Yeah, it was secret until it happened, and it was

625
00:29:51,359 --> 00:29:52,920
in your face everything, right.

626
00:29:53,519 --> 00:29:54,599
Speaker 1: So, but a lot of people, I.

627
00:29:54,519 --> 00:29:57,920
Speaker 5: Think don't know that two blocks away from where the

628
00:29:58,000 --> 00:30:00,559
Roberty Lee statue stood, in what was formed known as

629
00:30:00,680 --> 00:30:03,400
Lee Park, there was a Stonewall Jackson statue and that

630
00:30:03,519 --> 00:30:05,799
was also removed by the city council. At the same time,

631
00:30:07,440 --> 00:30:09,559
there was also a Lewis and Clark statue, which was

632
00:30:09,680 --> 00:30:13,759
removed because it included a depiction of Sackageweya that was

633
00:30:14,079 --> 00:30:16,359
I guess, I don't know what was problematic about it,

634
00:30:16,400 --> 00:30:20,079
but that was removed too. But the Stoneall Jackson statue

635
00:30:20,559 --> 00:30:25,119
was given to a museum in Los Angeles, I think

636
00:30:25,200 --> 00:30:28,880
right before Glenn Youngkin became the governor of Virginia, and

637
00:30:28,920 --> 00:30:31,240
this museum has been holding on to it and gave

638
00:30:31,240 --> 00:30:37,079
it to this artist to play with essentially, and what

639
00:30:37,240 --> 00:30:40,680
she did to it was dismember it. So it's a

640
00:30:40,680 --> 00:30:45,640
statue of Donald Jackson riding his war horse, and she

641
00:30:45,799 --> 00:30:48,160
cut it up in little pieces. She started by cutting

642
00:30:48,240 --> 00:30:52,160
his head off, and if you look at the statue now,

643
00:30:52,279 --> 00:30:54,920
such that it is not only is it has its

644
00:30:54,920 --> 00:30:57,279
head been removed, but his face has been removed from

645
00:30:57,359 --> 00:30:59,599
its head. And so she chopped it up into these

646
00:30:59,640 --> 00:31:01,880
pieces and then she kind of melded them together into

647
00:31:01,880 --> 00:31:05,519
this grotesque like you've got a horse leg sticking out here,

648
00:31:05,640 --> 00:31:08,240
and then a man's head hanging kind of like on

649
00:31:08,319 --> 00:31:12,599
the top from the horse parts, and then you've got

650
00:31:12,640 --> 00:31:15,720
like the man's arm coming out of the other part

651
00:31:15,720 --> 00:31:17,759
of the horse. And so it's just this like mangled

652
00:31:17,799 --> 00:31:22,799
wreckage of a piece. And that is the centerpiece of

653
00:31:22,839 --> 00:31:26,359
this new exhibit in Los Angeles called Monuments, which also

654
00:31:26,440 --> 00:31:31,759
includes several other Confederate memorials and monuments, many of which

655
00:31:32,039 --> 00:31:36,640
still bear the markings that were left by demonstrators and

656
00:31:36,759 --> 00:31:40,039
rioters who threw pain on them, or graffeited them, or

657
00:31:40,079 --> 00:31:41,680
otherwise desecrated them.

658
00:31:42,200 --> 00:31:45,960
Speaker 1: Yeah. So when people talk about putting these monuments in context,

659
00:31:46,519 --> 00:31:50,240
the context now is that they're not being put in

660
00:31:50,279 --> 00:31:52,680
a place that's less public, where people can go and

661
00:31:52,720 --> 00:31:55,240
see them and read about the historical context of them.

662
00:31:55,519 --> 00:31:59,880
The quote unquote context for these monuments now is that

663
00:32:00,480 --> 00:32:04,160
the mob, the violent mob, mob, the demonstrators, the rioters,

664
00:32:04,279 --> 00:32:07,319
got the last word. They're completely defaced. One of them

665
00:32:07,359 --> 00:32:10,440
has its face completely bashed in. One of them says

666
00:32:10,480 --> 00:32:15,240
beware traders. They're covered in red paint. They're completely defaced.

667
00:32:15,440 --> 00:32:18,759
And it's just so sad and twisted that that's who

668
00:32:18,759 --> 00:32:21,799
got the last word on these. I want to highlight

669
00:32:21,839 --> 00:32:24,279
an excerpt from the piece you talked about. Kara Walker,

670
00:32:24,359 --> 00:32:29,480
the quote unquote artist of this Stonewall Jackson piece. But

671
00:32:30,960 --> 00:32:32,720
it said this, and I believe it was the New

672
00:32:32,799 --> 00:32:35,119
York Times coverage of it. I'm just going to put

673
00:32:35,160 --> 00:32:36,799
up an excerpt for people who are watching, but I'll

674
00:32:36,839 --> 00:32:39,960
read it for you too. It says, quote, she made

675
00:32:39,960 --> 00:32:42,319
the work at a foundry in upstate New York. The

676
00:32:42,359 --> 00:32:44,960
first step in the process, she said, was quote a

677
00:32:45,000 --> 00:32:48,519
really kind of gruesome beheading of the Jackson figure that

678
00:32:48,640 --> 00:32:52,240
she said left her unsettled, though some people present applauded

679
00:32:52,319 --> 00:32:55,000
as the head came up. She said, quote, I actually

680
00:32:55,279 --> 00:32:57,640
felt like it was such a violent act that I

681
00:32:57,680 --> 00:33:00,720
was really uncomfortable with it. End quote. But she felt

682
00:33:00,720 --> 00:33:03,680
there was no alternative. Quote. Again, I knew that what

683
00:33:03,720 --> 00:33:05,680
I was going to do was going to involve not

684
00:33:05,839 --> 00:33:08,759
having the head in its right place. She goes on

685
00:33:08,839 --> 00:33:13,920
to say that she chose not to visit Charlottesville to

686
00:33:13,960 --> 00:33:17,720
study the sculpture's past or recent context. Instead, she decided

687
00:33:17,720 --> 00:33:20,480
to treat its theme as a symbol of the pervasive

688
00:33:20,519 --> 00:33:23,559
ideology of the lost Cause of the South, and she

689
00:33:23,680 --> 00:33:28,519
says this was basically mine now my found object. She said,

690
00:33:28,599 --> 00:33:30,920
she resolved to treat it as quote, an object to

691
00:33:31,000 --> 00:33:34,400
be played with and contended with and wrestled with as

692
00:33:34,480 --> 00:33:38,640
an artist. I have so many, so many reactions reading this.

693
00:33:39,160 --> 00:33:43,039
The first is just the fact that she identifies how

694
00:33:43,160 --> 00:33:46,039
violent the act is of beheading this statue and ripping

695
00:33:46,039 --> 00:33:49,400
its face off. It's she understands the moral component of this,

696
00:33:49,759 --> 00:33:52,759
but proceeds with it anyway. And then it's so crazy

697
00:33:52,799 --> 00:33:55,319
to me that she she talks about the fact that

698
00:33:55,359 --> 00:33:59,480
she is intentionally not grappling at all with the context

699
00:33:59,519 --> 00:34:02,039
of this staff and is instead just using it as

700
00:34:02,079 --> 00:34:07,079
her personal racial justice play thing. And Al, I would

701
00:34:07,079 --> 00:34:09,079
love to hear your thoughts on that. Yeah.

702
00:34:09,119 --> 00:34:11,599
Speaker 5: So, I mean when we all were told back in

703
00:34:11,880 --> 00:34:15,239
twenty twenty and before that in twenty seventeen, when the

704
00:34:15,320 --> 00:34:18,960
Charlottesvield thing happened, that these Confederate statutes were just going

705
00:34:19,000 --> 00:34:20,480
to go to museums, I don't think this is what

706
00:34:20,519 --> 00:34:22,880
any of us had in mind. I wouldn't put it

707
00:34:22,920 --> 00:34:26,559
past some of these artists or organizations to have had

708
00:34:26,559 --> 00:34:28,719
this in mind from the beginning, but certainly was not

709
00:34:28,800 --> 00:34:30,039
what was conveyed to the public.

710
00:34:30,960 --> 00:34:33,960
Speaker 1: But you know, it's interesting.

711
00:34:34,079 --> 00:34:37,440
Speaker 5: So it's interesting that, yeah, she recognizes that it's violent

712
00:34:37,519 --> 00:34:40,079
and then says that she has to do it anyway.

713
00:34:41,199 --> 00:34:43,079
Speaker 1: And I think there's maybe some scary.

714
00:34:42,800 --> 00:34:48,320
Speaker 5: Parallels there for the ways that people who believe that

715
00:34:48,400 --> 00:34:53,559
America has not and perhaps cannot peacefully be rid of

716
00:34:53,599 --> 00:34:57,440
what they would consider its original sin, what they believe

717
00:34:57,639 --> 00:35:02,360
is violent but necessary to kind of excise the demons

718
00:35:02,400 --> 00:35:04,960
from our society, the way that she sees herself as

719
00:35:05,000 --> 00:35:06,840
doing with this statue.

720
00:35:07,039 --> 00:35:09,039
Speaker 1: You had a really great quote in your piece to

721
00:35:09,039 --> 00:35:11,079
that point, just to put a fine point on that,

722
00:35:11,119 --> 00:35:14,639
you say, quote the BLM industrial complex is predicated on

723
00:35:14,679 --> 00:35:18,119
the belief that America and Western civilization at large are

724
00:35:18,159 --> 00:35:22,480
a bourgeoisie that must be punished and punished collectively for

725
00:35:22,559 --> 00:35:25,559
the sins of capitalism and colonialism. If you don't believe me,

726
00:35:25,639 --> 00:35:29,280
go read Ibram Kendy. Punishments range from being passed over

727
00:35:29,360 --> 00:35:32,039
for college acceptance to being stabbed on a train. And

728
00:35:32,079 --> 00:35:34,679
of course that's a reference to Arena Zaruska, which was

729
00:35:34,719 --> 00:35:36,920
not a random act of violence. I mean it was,

730
00:35:37,000 --> 00:35:40,239
but the perpetrator who specifically called out the fact that

731
00:35:40,280 --> 00:35:43,280
he had gotten that white girl, this was racially motivated,

732
00:35:43,280 --> 00:35:47,000
clearly in his own words, this is violent, and it's

733
00:35:47,000 --> 00:35:50,840
a perfect parallel for the fact that like, this is violent,

734
00:35:50,880 --> 00:35:51,679
but it must be done.

735
00:35:52,400 --> 00:35:55,679
Speaker 5: Yeah, I mean, and so the things that you know,

736
00:35:55,760 --> 00:36:01,440
there are plenty of ways to legitimately critique the sins

737
00:36:01,480 --> 00:36:05,000
and the faults of the slaveholders, the South Civil War,

738
00:36:05,159 --> 00:36:07,320
you know, what have you, just as there are, by

739
00:36:07,360 --> 00:36:10,280
the way, with every moment of civilization since the Fall

740
00:36:10,400 --> 00:36:14,039
in the Garden. So there are legitimate critiques to be

741
00:36:14,039 --> 00:36:15,599
had there. But that's not you know, that's not what

742
00:36:15,679 --> 00:36:19,280
this is. The critiques that are being leveled here are

743
00:36:19,320 --> 00:36:23,320
the same exact critiques that are leveled against our you know,

744
00:36:23,360 --> 00:36:27,679
modern America and going back to the Founding so you have, like,

745
00:36:27,920 --> 00:36:31,880
the accusations against these Confederate generals, right, are that they

746
00:36:31,960 --> 00:36:37,199
defended a way of life that was intrinsically dependent on slavery,

747
00:36:37,239 --> 00:36:42,280
on racism. And that's the same accusation that's being leveled

748
00:36:42,320 --> 00:36:45,239
against America today. It's the same accusation inherent in the

749
00:36:45,280 --> 00:36:48,840
sixteen nineteen project against the America of the Founding fathers.

750
00:36:48,880 --> 00:36:52,000
And so if this is what they will do to

751
00:36:52,159 --> 00:36:57,159
representations of those who defended a racist society, you know,

752
00:36:58,000 --> 00:37:01,360
they would level the same accusations against our society today,

753
00:37:01,440 --> 00:37:07,400
against America for its entire lifetime. And so if they're

754
00:37:07,440 --> 00:37:09,800
willing to do that to the statues, you know, history

755
00:37:09,800 --> 00:37:12,840
shows us that when statues are destroyed, people always come next.

756
00:37:13,320 --> 00:37:16,199
Speaker 1: Yes. Sean Davis, the CEO of the Federalists, made this

757
00:37:16,280 --> 00:37:20,079
point very explicitly in a recent Senate testimony where he

758
00:37:20,119 --> 00:37:23,800
said it starts with censorship, it moves on to statues,

759
00:37:23,840 --> 00:37:28,400
and ultimately it ends with people, and it's not always racial.

760
00:37:28,480 --> 00:37:30,880
Like this is just how Marxism and all of this

761
00:37:30,960 --> 00:37:33,239
works itself out. But we saw that this happened with

762
00:37:33,320 --> 00:37:35,679
Charlie Kirk. I mean, this happens all of the time.

763
00:37:35,719 --> 00:37:40,000
It's not just the iconoclasm of metal and other materials,

764
00:37:39,800 --> 00:37:43,840
it is the takedown of people. I saw, Oh, go

765
00:37:43,880 --> 00:37:45,519
ahead to that point. But just before we move on.

766
00:37:45,840 --> 00:37:48,800
Speaker 5: You know, these statues obviously are not human beings. They're

767
00:37:48,840 --> 00:37:53,199
made of bronze, but they're symbols. And there is meaning

768
00:37:53,800 --> 00:37:56,880
for these Marxists in destroying these symbols. And I think

769
00:37:56,880 --> 00:37:59,239
there's a lot of things today that they would also

770
00:37:59,320 --> 00:38:02,960
view as as symbols. I mean, even even think of,

771
00:38:03,079 --> 00:38:07,440
like you know, the argument for reparations. You and I

772
00:38:07,480 --> 00:38:11,719
obviously have never owned slaves, would never own slaves, but

773
00:38:11,880 --> 00:38:15,440
because we share a skin color with people who did

774
00:38:15,559 --> 00:38:18,840
in the past, it is demanded of us that we

775
00:38:19,079 --> 00:38:22,320
pay the punishment. And so we are we're symbols in

776
00:38:22,400 --> 00:38:25,400
the same sense kind of as as these statues are.

777
00:38:25,440 --> 00:38:31,119
We are the the propitiary, you know, that is that

778
00:38:31,239 --> 00:38:34,440
is being asked to make the payment for the sins

779
00:38:34,440 --> 00:38:38,239
of the forefathers. So that I mean, so to see

780
00:38:38,239 --> 00:38:42,280
what they're willing to do to a statue, and to

781
00:38:42,360 --> 00:38:44,519
know that they believe the same things of you and I,

782
00:38:44,760 --> 00:38:47,719
purely because of our skin color and our you know,

783
00:38:48,000 --> 00:38:49,440
existence as Americans.

784
00:38:49,920 --> 00:38:52,960
Speaker 1: It's terrifying, right well, and we see that all the time.

785
00:38:53,000 --> 00:38:54,960
It's it. It does start with statues and moves on

786
00:38:55,000 --> 00:38:57,039
to people. But people are our symbols too. I mean,

787
00:38:57,239 --> 00:38:59,199
you know, Arena Zarutzska in many ways is just a

788
00:38:59,280 --> 00:39:02,519
symbol of white women. Charlie Kirk in many ways is

789
00:39:02,559 --> 00:39:06,800
a symbol of conservative Christians. You know, a lot this

790
00:39:06,960 --> 00:39:09,519
was said often during Donald Trump, all of the law

791
00:39:09,519 --> 00:39:12,239
fair and everything, and the assassination attempts against him. It

792
00:39:12,280 --> 00:39:13,800
was there after you. I'm just in the way, you know,

793
00:39:13,800 --> 00:39:17,480
in many ways, Donald Trump is the embodiment of MAGA

794
00:39:17,519 --> 00:39:20,960
Americans or MAGA extremists or whatever. Joe Biden and all

795
00:39:20,960 --> 00:39:23,119
the rest of the Democrats, you know, brand half of

796
00:39:23,159 --> 00:39:27,039
the country as and so you're so right about the

797
00:39:27,039 --> 00:39:30,519
symbols point. But the symbols don't even stop at material things.

798
00:39:30,519 --> 00:39:32,599
You know, it's not just flag burning and monument toppling.

799
00:39:32,639 --> 00:39:37,119
It's it's also taking out people who who personify these things.

800
00:39:37,119 --> 00:39:41,239
And that's a huge, huge problem. I want to put

801
00:39:41,280 --> 00:39:43,320
up a tweet to you included in your article. It's

802
00:39:43,400 --> 00:39:49,119
from our colleague John Daniel Davidson. Excellent tweet, he says.

803
00:39:49,440 --> 00:39:52,400
The New York Time writer says, the exhibit of defaced

804
00:39:52,400 --> 00:39:56,280
Confederate monuments quote faces down past and present hatreds with

805
00:39:56,480 --> 00:39:59,760
startling confidence end quote. But that's wrong because the exhibit

806
00:39:59,840 --> 00:40:03,920
is itself a manifestation of present hatreds, projected back into

807
00:40:03,960 --> 00:40:07,800
our shared past, flung forward at our posterity, and aimed

808
00:40:07,880 --> 00:40:11,920
directly at those alive today who would have preserved these

809
00:40:11,960 --> 00:40:15,599
monuments untouched. The entire exhibit is a monument to hatred

810
00:40:15,679 --> 00:40:19,639
in the present day of country and countrymen. I mean,

811
00:40:19,719 --> 00:40:24,920
John is absolutely right as usual. The exhibit is not

812
00:40:25,719 --> 00:40:27,559
just about you know.

813
00:40:28,320 --> 00:40:31,679
Speaker 5: The goal is not to put history in any kind

814
00:40:31,840 --> 00:40:34,079
of artistic or historical context.

815
00:40:34,440 --> 00:40:36,440
Speaker 1: The goal is to show subjugation.

816
00:40:37,480 --> 00:40:40,960
Speaker 5: It's the New York Times, I think described this as

817
00:40:41,000 --> 00:40:44,480
described the original statues as works of Jim Crow era propaganda.

818
00:40:44,840 --> 00:40:47,800
All that they've done is now reworked them into works

819
00:40:47,840 --> 00:40:51,800
of George Floyd era propaganda. The purpose is not to educate,

820
00:40:52,199 --> 00:40:56,559
it's not to provoke thoughtfulness, it's not to promote introspection.

821
00:40:57,440 --> 00:41:00,639
But the purpose is to say these have been conquered.

822
00:41:00,960 --> 00:41:05,320
We are the new conquerors. Culturally, ancient civilizations right used

823
00:41:05,320 --> 00:41:08,000
to put the heads of their enemies on pikes to

824
00:41:08,119 --> 00:41:13,719
warn of their worn others that they were victorious, or

825
00:41:13,760 --> 00:41:16,440
march their enemies, their captured enemies through the streets, and

826
00:41:16,440 --> 00:41:20,320
that's exactly what's happening here. It's impossible not to see

827
00:41:20,480 --> 00:41:23,920
the parallels with kind of those ancient heads on spikes

828
00:41:24,320 --> 00:41:28,719
versus you see Stonewall Jackson's faceless head hung on top

829
00:41:28,920 --> 00:41:31,039
of this kind of mangled statue.

830
00:41:31,239 --> 00:41:34,400
Speaker 1: Everyone should go read Elle's excellent piece. Left wing cultural

831
00:41:34,440 --> 00:41:38,920
revolutionaries are decapitating statues and calling it art on the Federalist, Elle,

832
00:41:38,920 --> 00:41:41,519
thanks so much for your commentary today. Tell Skipper thanks

833
00:41:41,559 --> 00:41:43,760
for your time and we'll have you back again soon.

834
00:41:44,079 --> 00:41:45,760
Speaker 2: Thanks for having us.

835
00:41:51,320 --> 00:41:54,440
Speaker 1: Last week, ABC's Dancing with the Stars hosted what they

836
00:41:54,480 --> 00:41:57,920
called Dedication Night, where each of the competing couples, which

837
00:41:57,920 --> 00:42:00,000
if you haven't seen the show, is a celebrity who

838
00:42:00,159 --> 00:42:03,480
paired with a professional dancer. They each dedicated their dance

839
00:42:03,519 --> 00:42:06,320
to a person or institution that had been influential in

840
00:42:06,320 --> 00:42:09,239
the celebrities life. Sounds like a sweet idea. One of

841
00:42:09,239 --> 00:42:12,440
the contestants Scott Hoying, a singer in the a cappella

842
00:42:12,480 --> 00:42:17,280
group Pentatonics, dedicated his dance to his husband Mark, but

843
00:42:17,320 --> 00:42:19,599
then revealed that the two of them are going to

844
00:42:19,679 --> 00:42:21,840
be Dad's take a look.

845
00:42:21,760 --> 00:42:23,360
Speaker 2: Marco star with you all excited?

846
00:42:23,480 --> 00:42:26,119
Speaker 1: Were you to be able to join Scott jury this week?

847
00:42:26,320 --> 00:42:28,039
I was so excited.

848
00:42:28,079 --> 00:42:30,760
Speaker 2: I'm Scott and Riley's biggest fan, so to have this

849
00:42:30,800 --> 00:42:33,159
moment with them felt like a dream come true. And

850
00:42:33,280 --> 00:42:36,679
failed to announce such big news with our pregnancy.

851
00:42:36,239 --> 00:42:38,119
Speaker 1: With our baby, it is something.

852
00:42:37,840 --> 00:42:39,760
Speaker 4: I will never forget for the rest of my life.

853
00:42:39,960 --> 00:42:42,039
Speaker 1: We have one more piece of news for you, what

854
00:42:46,000 --> 00:42:49,880
our is pregnant?

855
00:42:48,239 --> 00:42:48,480
Speaker 3: Dad.

856
00:42:49,920 --> 00:42:51,599
Speaker 1: Now, I know it can be hard for people to

857
00:42:51,639 --> 00:42:54,159
look past the joy on these two men's faces to

858
00:42:54,199 --> 00:42:57,320
think critically about what this kind of announcement actually means.

859
00:42:57,639 --> 00:43:00,400
After all, many people will make the argument that it's

860
00:43:00,440 --> 00:43:04,559
actually pro life, it's creating children, isn't it. Criticizing decisions

861
00:43:04,599 --> 00:43:09,880
like this is always met with accusations of homophobia, bigotry, hatred,

862
00:43:10,320 --> 00:43:12,800
and even the attack that if you're really pro life,

863
00:43:12,920 --> 00:43:16,159
you'll celebrate things like this. The exact same arguments are

864
00:43:16,159 --> 00:43:19,119
often made when it comes to in vitro fertilization commonly

865
00:43:19,159 --> 00:43:22,599
known as IVF. But IVF and surrogacy and anything else

866
00:43:22,639 --> 00:43:27,239
that commodifies human life are fraught with moral and ethical concerns.

867
00:43:27,360 --> 00:43:29,559
Here are just a few of the many reasons why

868
00:43:29,599 --> 00:43:33,119
Scott and Mark's pregnancy announcement is caused for sadness and

869
00:43:33,159 --> 00:43:38,679
not celebration. First, same sex surrogacy always intentionally deprives a

870
00:43:38,760 --> 00:43:41,639
child of his natural right to a mother and father.

871
00:43:42,000 --> 00:43:46,039
Framing the desires of adults as civil rights ends in

872
00:43:46,119 --> 00:43:50,960
denying children their natural human rights to a mom and dad. Second,

873
00:43:51,400 --> 00:43:56,559
surrogacy scars children with undeniable and unavoidable loss, and this

874
00:43:56,719 --> 00:43:59,159
loss is not unique to children who are commissioned by

875
00:43:59,159 --> 00:44:02,440
same sex couples. As Katie Faust of Them before Us

876
00:44:02,480 --> 00:44:06,159
often explains, surrogacy splits what should be one person in

877
00:44:06,159 --> 00:44:09,840
a child's life, his mom, into what she calls three

878
00:44:10,000 --> 00:44:14,280
purchasable and optional women. These include the genetic mom, or

879
00:44:14,320 --> 00:44:17,199
the one who supplies the egg, the birth mom, with

880
00:44:17,239 --> 00:44:20,400
whom the baby forms a primal and pivotal bond, and

881
00:44:20,559 --> 00:44:24,119
the social mom, who nurtures the child and satisfies his

882
00:44:24,239 --> 00:44:29,480
yearning for a mother's love. Third, surrogacy often exploits financially

883
00:44:29,599 --> 00:44:33,280
vulnerable women in order to satiate the desires of adult

884
00:44:33,440 --> 00:44:36,360
who want a maid to order baby. It's not naturally

885
00:44:36,400 --> 00:44:41,280
a pro woman exercise. Fourth, surrogacy enables abuse because although

886
00:44:41,280 --> 00:44:45,119
it often includes limited screening, it doesn't include a standard,

887
00:44:45,199 --> 00:44:49,119
strict vetting process that adoptive couples must undergo to ensure

888
00:44:49,159 --> 00:44:52,360
children's safety and security. As a result, some of the

889
00:44:52,360 --> 00:44:55,639
custom ordered children end up in the hands of pedophiles

890
00:44:55,639 --> 00:44:59,840
and other abusers. Surrogacy always includes the possibility of this. Fifth,

891
00:45:00,079 --> 00:45:03,880
surrogacy opens the door to eugenics because most surrogacy pregnancies

892
00:45:03,920 --> 00:45:08,000
are created through IVF, where doctors can grade embryo fitness

893
00:45:08,280 --> 00:45:12,039
and then discard lab created human beings who don't have

894
00:45:12,079 --> 00:45:15,519
the desired chromosomes or hair color or eye color. From

895
00:45:15,559 --> 00:45:19,760
the disposal of unwonted human beings, to the incompleteness of

896
00:45:19,840 --> 00:45:23,679
medical records, to the deprivation of half of a child's family,

897
00:45:24,079 --> 00:45:28,000
the ethical and moral problems with surrogacy are many, So

898
00:45:28,440 --> 00:45:31,320
don't let people scold you into cheering for surrogacy, and

899
00:45:31,400 --> 00:45:33,760
don't let them shame you and trick you into thinking

900
00:45:33,800 --> 00:45:36,920
it's pro life. It is not as dreamy and wonderful

901
00:45:36,920 --> 00:45:38,880
as it's cracked up to be. All Right, that's going

902
00:45:38,920 --> 00:45:40,639
to do it for me today. Thank you so much

903
00:45:40,679 --> 00:45:43,440
for tuning into this week's episode of The Kylie Cast.

904
00:45:43,880 --> 00:45:46,599
I will be right back here next week with more.

905
00:45:46,960 --> 00:45:50,199
Until then, just remember the truth hurts, but it won't

906
00:45:50,280 --> 00:45:57,480
kill you.