WEBVTT 1 00:00:00.080 --> 00:00:03.879 This is Dan Caplis and welcome to today's online podcast edition 2 00:00:03.960 --> 00:00:05.879 of The Dan Caplis Show. Please be sure to give 3 00:00:05.960 --> 00:00:08.240 us a five star rating if you'd be so kind, 4 00:00:08.320 --> 00:00:11.599 and to subscribe, download and listen to the show every 5 00:00:11.679 --> 00:00:15.519 single day on your favorite podcast platform. Our next guest 6 00:00:15.599 --> 00:00:17.000 fighting very effectively for. 7 00:00:16.960 --> 00:00:19.239 The American Way. Let's go straight to the VIP line. 8 00:00:19.280 --> 00:00:22.120 Welcome Congressman Gabe Evans. Feels good to say that to 9 00:00:22.160 --> 00:00:25.879 The Dan Caplis Show. Congressman, how are you doing good? 10 00:00:25.879 --> 00:00:26.719 How are you doing today? 11 00:00:27.120 --> 00:00:29.399 Very very well? Thank you for that, and hey, grateful 12 00:00:29.399 --> 00:00:32.000 for the time. I know you are absolutely buried and 13 00:00:32.280 --> 00:00:34.439 you're getting off to a very fast start there. But 14 00:00:35.359 --> 00:00:39.119 having been a black Hawk helicopter pilot, I just know 15 00:00:39.159 --> 00:00:43.640 you have invaluable insight into what you can see and 16 00:00:43.799 --> 00:00:46.759 not see at night flying in a situation like this, 17 00:00:46.880 --> 00:00:49.560 So anything you could share there would be appreciated. 18 00:00:50.759 --> 00:00:52.399 Well, first of all, I mean, this is just an 19 00:00:52.439 --> 00:00:56.200 absolute tragedy what happened out at Reagan National Airport in Washington, 20 00:00:56.240 --> 00:00:59.439 and so our hearts go out to the friends, the family, 21 00:00:59.479 --> 00:01:02.560 and of course the victims who perished in that accident. 22 00:01:02.920 --> 00:01:05.280 You know, I spent almost ten years flying black Hawk 23 00:01:05.280 --> 00:01:08.760 helicopters here in Colorado and overseas in the combat zone. 24 00:01:08.799 --> 00:01:12.359 I was a black Hawk helicopter pilot and Command company commander, 25 00:01:12.400 --> 00:01:15.760 air mission commander, and Aircrew Training Program commander. So I've 26 00:01:15.799 --> 00:01:18.879 seen this from a few different perspectives and spent a 27 00:01:18.879 --> 00:01:21.200 lot of time flying around, you know, in and amongst 28 00:01:21.079 --> 00:01:24.359 a Denver's airspace, which is top five upmost busy airports 29 00:01:24.400 --> 00:01:27.640 in the nation. And so, you know, as the news 30 00:01:27.680 --> 00:01:29.840 started to come out about what happened, I had a 31 00:01:29.840 --> 00:01:31.799 couple of thoughts to go through my head. First of all, 32 00:01:31.840 --> 00:01:35.359 this is happening at nighttime under night vision goggles. Night 33 00:01:35.439 --> 00:01:38.280 vision goggles is actually one of the most challenging modes 34 00:01:38.319 --> 00:01:42.599 of flight for rotary wing aircrews. Right now, your normal 35 00:01:42.719 --> 00:01:45.439 vision is about one hundred and thirty degrees top of autumn, 36 00:01:46.000 --> 00:01:48.319 and from left to right it's about two hundred degrees. 37 00:01:48.480 --> 00:01:51.879 Your field of view, your standard issue night vision goggles 38 00:01:52.319 --> 00:01:54.400 are like looking through toilet paper tubes. It's about a 39 00:01:54.439 --> 00:01:57.400 forty degree field of view, which means that even under 40 00:01:57.480 --> 00:02:02.079 night vision goggles, your field of view is like less 41 00:02:02.079 --> 00:02:04.760 than ten percent of what it is. I know right now, 42 00:02:04.799 --> 00:02:06.799 with all of us just looking normally around and you 43 00:02:06.879 --> 00:02:09.080 lose a little bit of depth perception also with the 44 00:02:09.199 --> 00:02:14.080 night vision goggles. So in dense airspace like what's around 45 00:02:14.520 --> 00:02:18.560 Reagan National Airport, even if that Blackhawk helicopter crew is 46 00:02:18.680 --> 00:02:21.240 talking to air traffic control, which it sounds like it was, 47 00:02:21.840 --> 00:02:24.479 and air traffic tells them, you know, be advised of 48 00:02:24.599 --> 00:02:28.599 company traffic, it's entirely possible that that crewe just because 49 00:02:28.599 --> 00:02:33.879 of the limitations of night vision technology, potentially misidentified which 50 00:02:33.919 --> 00:02:35.759 aircraft they were being advised of. 51 00:02:37.000 --> 00:02:41.520 Congressman gave Evans her guest. Now, Congressman, I assume they 52 00:02:41.759 --> 00:02:44.719 need to be wearing these night vision goggles for training 53 00:02:44.759 --> 00:02:49.199 purposes because it seems like a dangerous restriction in that 54 00:02:49.319 --> 00:02:50.400 kind of busy airspace. 55 00:02:51.719 --> 00:02:54.599 Yeah, so it sounds like what was happening is a 56 00:02:54.719 --> 00:02:58.919 check ride. So to be a helicopter pilot for the 57 00:02:59.000 --> 00:03:03.000 United States Army is years of work and training and 58 00:03:03.039 --> 00:03:05.759 there is a long laundry list of tasks that you 59 00:03:05.879 --> 00:03:09.039 have to be proficient and responding to. It's actually called 60 00:03:09.039 --> 00:03:12.159 a CTL commander's task list. And when I was an 61 00:03:12.159 --> 00:03:15.599 Aircrew Training Program commander, I was the officer that had 62 00:03:15.680 --> 00:03:20.319 oversight of those commander task lists and everybody who flew 63 00:03:20.599 --> 00:03:22.680 on my aircraft to make sure that they were meeting 64 00:03:22.759 --> 00:03:25.240 all of those different criteria. All the way I make 65 00:03:25.280 --> 00:03:29.000 sure somebody meets that criteria is once a year, they 66 00:03:29.039 --> 00:03:32.680 have to sit down for a pretty exhaustive examination that 67 00:03:32.719 --> 00:03:36.639 includes both oral knowledge written knowledge, and then you actually 68 00:03:36.719 --> 00:03:38.759 have to go out and put it into practice flying 69 00:03:39.439 --> 00:03:42.759 with an instructor pilot and show that you still have 70 00:03:42.879 --> 00:03:45.520 the technical and tactical proficiency to be able to employ 71 00:03:45.560 --> 00:03:50.400 the aircraft. So, if that's what's happening on this particular flight, 72 00:03:51.360 --> 00:03:55.639 this is a It's one of the most complex missions 73 00:03:55.639 --> 00:03:58.240 that there are, and it's designed to be complex because 74 00:03:58.280 --> 00:04:01.120 this is the test that proves they're not you're capable 75 00:04:01.240 --> 00:04:03.120 of effectively employing that aircraft. 76 00:04:03.759 --> 00:04:08.000 Wow. And at that point, Congressman, because obviously the pilot 77 00:04:08.039 --> 00:04:11.879 and whoever's testing the pilot, they know their visions restricted. 78 00:04:12.159 --> 00:04:15.840 Are they relying on air traffic control at that point? 79 00:04:17.399 --> 00:04:19.720 And so this is where this is where we're all 80 00:04:19.759 --> 00:04:22.040 in on one team. When you're up in the air, 81 00:04:22.079 --> 00:04:24.160 you know, we would brief this every time we took 82 00:04:24.199 --> 00:04:26.519 off of once we get into the air. The only 83 00:04:26.560 --> 00:04:29.600 thing that matters is physics, and so we all have 84 00:04:29.680 --> 00:04:32.399 to work together as a team. Pilots, you're true chiefs 85 00:04:32.639 --> 00:04:35.959 in the backseat, air traffic control other airmen who are 86 00:04:36.000 --> 00:04:38.800 also flying and operating in that same airspace. And so 87 00:04:39.519 --> 00:04:44.720 it's an incredibly complex system. And realistically, the United States 88 00:04:44.759 --> 00:04:48.839 has done a fantastic job of managing all of the 89 00:04:48.879 --> 00:04:51.279 things that could go wrong and all of the human 90 00:04:51.439 --> 00:04:55.120 error that could intrude into a situation like that with 91 00:04:55.240 --> 00:04:58.160 a program that's been around and refined really for the 92 00:04:58.240 --> 00:05:02.399 last half half century called Crew Resource Management, and it 93 00:05:02.480 --> 00:05:07.319 is a formalized training program that is designed to make 94 00:05:07.360 --> 00:05:10.800 sure that pilot's, aircrew, air traffic controllers are all able 95 00:05:10.839 --> 00:05:15.879 to work together, exchange mission critical information, conduct airspace surveillance, 96 00:05:16.240 --> 00:05:18.879 and then check and crosscheck each other so that accidents 97 00:05:18.879 --> 00:05:22.120 don't happen, even when you're operating in a dynamic, high risk, 98 00:05:22.199 --> 00:05:25.600 rank structured environment. And so we really do have an 99 00:05:25.600 --> 00:05:29.639 exceptional track record of safety in aviation. But even so, 100 00:05:29.879 --> 00:05:34.639 it's still an incredibly complex environment to operate in, and 101 00:05:34.839 --> 00:05:38.360 just a couple of seconds of loss of concentration or 102 00:05:38.439 --> 00:05:42.120 focusing on the wrong thing still can unfortunately result in 103 00:05:42.160 --> 00:05:43.319 these terrible tragedies. 104 00:05:43.600 --> 00:05:46.240 Congressman Gabe Evans kind enough to be with us hee 105 00:05:46.240 --> 00:05:49.879 a black Hawk helicopter pilot during his years of service 106 00:05:49.879 --> 00:05:53.000 to the country. Now, sir, how fast would you guess 107 00:05:53.040 --> 00:05:55.600 that helicopter was moving at the time. 108 00:05:56.439 --> 00:05:59.240 The typical cruising speed for a Blackhawk helicopter is one 109 00:05:59.319 --> 00:06:03.519 hundred and twenty nine. We measure speed in knots air speed, 110 00:06:04.560 --> 00:06:06.639 not as like one point two miles an hour, so 111 00:06:07.399 --> 00:06:10.000 depending on your altitude, somewhere around one hundred and thirty 112 00:06:10.000 --> 00:06:13.279 miles an hour. Now, I have not ever personally flown 113 00:06:13.279 --> 00:06:16.360 in the Washington DC airspace and a black Hawk helicopter, 114 00:06:17.000 --> 00:06:20.319 so it's possible that there could be air speed restrictions 115 00:06:20.319 --> 00:06:22.720 when you're flying. It sounds like there's a rotary wing 116 00:06:23.120 --> 00:06:26.839 corridor that follows the Potomac. It's possible that there is 117 00:06:26.879 --> 00:06:30.160 an air speed restriction, But typically the Blackhawk helicopter is 118 00:06:30.160 --> 00:06:32.600 operated between eighty and one hundred and twenty knots, so 119 00:06:33.439 --> 00:06:35.560 ninety two one hundred and thirty one hundred and thirty 120 00:06:35.600 --> 00:06:36.439 five miles an hour. 121 00:06:36.879 --> 00:06:38.720 And I don't know if you've seen the new angle 122 00:06:38.879 --> 00:06:41.480 video that it new to us. You probably saw it before. 123 00:06:41.519 --> 00:06:46.040 That's just being made public that appears to show the 124 00:06:46.519 --> 00:06:49.920 helicopter flying straight at the plane. For I thought one 125 00:06:50.000 --> 00:06:53.519 reporter said, twelve or thirteen seconds, have you seen that angle? 126 00:06:53.519 --> 00:06:54.839 And if so, what do you make of that? 127 00:06:56.319 --> 00:07:02.000 So I haven't seen that angle, And really there's what 128 00:07:02.160 --> 00:07:04.519 initially pops to mind is, again, there are so many 129 00:07:04.519 --> 00:07:06.759 different things that you have to monitor when you're flying. 130 00:07:07.720 --> 00:07:11.120 The division of labor in the cockpit is typically one aircraft, 131 00:07:11.199 --> 00:07:14.480 one pilot who's operating the aircraft. They're the ones whose 132 00:07:14.480 --> 00:07:18.920 hands are on the control. They're controlling air speed, altitude, pitch, 133 00:07:19.040 --> 00:07:21.480 yaw roll, all of the things that you're doing to 134 00:07:21.519 --> 00:07:25.480 actually fly the aircraft. Then you have the non flying pilots, 135 00:07:25.519 --> 00:07:30.240 so they're monitoring radios, they're monitoring airspace, they're thinking ahead 136 00:07:30.240 --> 00:07:32.800 to whatever the next step is in the mission. And 137 00:07:32.839 --> 00:07:36.480 then you have your back seaters, your crew chiefs, who 138 00:07:36.519 --> 00:07:40.759 are continuing to provide a variety of other tasks, things 139 00:07:40.800 --> 00:07:44.199 like airspace surveillance. If you're carrying a load, they're in 140 00:07:44.279 --> 00:07:46.439 charge of the cargo. If you're in a combat situation, 141 00:07:46.480 --> 00:07:49.040 they're in charge of the machine gun. So that whole 142 00:07:49.079 --> 00:07:53.279 crew is working together to be able to operate that 143 00:07:53.319 --> 00:07:59.639 aircraft and again under night vision goggles dense airspace, the 144 00:08:00.160 --> 00:08:03.360 risk of what we call, you know, target fixation or 145 00:08:03.399 --> 00:08:06.800 tunnel vision, focusing on one thing instead of being able 146 00:08:06.800 --> 00:08:10.399 to maintain your scan and your situational awareness is something 147 00:08:10.439 --> 00:08:12.720 that's an ever present risk. And not just for pilots. 148 00:08:13.120 --> 00:08:15.639 You know, again, we're a team with air traffic control. 149 00:08:16.399 --> 00:08:18.600 They can see a lot of the same things that 150 00:08:18.639 --> 00:08:22.279 we see through what it's called a transponder, which allows 151 00:08:22.319 --> 00:08:26.759 air traffic control to specifically and uniquely identify aircraft, be 152 00:08:26.879 --> 00:08:29.399 able to see their altitude, be able to see their speed, 153 00:08:30.160 --> 00:08:33.519 and so it really is a team to be able 154 00:08:33.559 --> 00:08:36.039 to safely operate in the national airspace system. 155 00:08:36.440 --> 00:08:38.679 And my last two questions, you've been so generous with 156 00:08:38.720 --> 00:08:41.240 your time, and you have this unique expertise, so we 157 00:08:41.279 --> 00:08:43.559 want to try to tap it all. Speaking of air 158 00:08:43.639 --> 00:08:47.440 traffic control at that point, to you, as a layman, 159 00:08:47.559 --> 00:08:50.159 I would think that air traffic control would be screaming 160 00:08:50.639 --> 00:08:53.080 at both of those pilots and would have some type 161 00:08:53.080 --> 00:08:56.080 of process in place. And wouldn't there be an onboard 162 00:08:56.120 --> 00:08:59.440 collision alert system on the Blackhawk as well as on 163 00:09:00.120 --> 00:09:02.440 commercial airline So. 164 00:09:02.480 --> 00:09:05.639 That system is called t CAST Terminal Collision Avoidance system. 165 00:09:06.039 --> 00:09:08.759 It's installed on all the airliners. It's required to be 166 00:09:09.600 --> 00:09:13.519 the limitation with t casts, so t caass can see 167 00:09:13.559 --> 00:09:17.159 all of these other transponders. To operate in the airspace 168 00:09:17.240 --> 00:09:20.759 that's around these busy airport's Class B airspace, you are 169 00:09:20.799 --> 00:09:25.840 required to have a transponder on and operating as an 170 00:09:25.879 --> 00:09:30.000 airliner is coming in for landing. However, it's the aircraft 171 00:09:30.080 --> 00:09:32.960 is facing an airport where there are of course lots 172 00:09:32.960 --> 00:09:36.399 of other planes taking off and landing, and so the 173 00:09:36.519 --> 00:09:41.720 sensitivity of TEA casts actually steps down because you know, 174 00:09:41.759 --> 00:09:43.559 you don't need the system freaking out and telling you 175 00:09:43.600 --> 00:09:45.559 there's a bunch of planes ahead. Well, yes, I know 176 00:09:45.600 --> 00:09:48.360 that I'm going to land at the airport, so at 177 00:09:48.559 --> 00:09:53.320 below about one thousand feet and then around five hundred feet. 178 00:09:53.519 --> 00:09:56.559 There are designs in the TCAST system where it steps 179 00:09:56.600 --> 00:09:59.840 down its sensitivity just so it's not blaring at the 180 00:10:00.039 --> 00:10:03.279 pilots as they're executing this critical mode of flight, you know, 181 00:10:03.399 --> 00:10:04.279 landing in an airport. 182 00:10:05.200 --> 00:10:09.120 And thank you. That's really interesting and something I'd never 183 00:10:09.159 --> 00:10:12.600 heard before. Final question, why would there be a black 184 00:10:12.600 --> 00:10:18.240 cop training mission at night between these three major airports Dallas, Reagan, Baltimore. 185 00:10:19.519 --> 00:10:21.240 We had to do that all the time here in 186 00:10:21.279 --> 00:10:24.840 the Denver air space. Interesting, if you are going to 187 00:10:24.919 --> 00:10:28.360 operate that aircraft, you know, for myself as a pilot 188 00:10:28.360 --> 00:10:30.799 in command, once I take off, I mean you're almost 189 00:10:30.840 --> 00:10:35.519 like a a ship's captain. You have a tremendous breadth 190 00:10:35.559 --> 00:10:37.519 of authority to be able to do whatever it is 191 00:10:37.519 --> 00:10:40.960 that you deem necessary to protect the lives of your 192 00:10:41.679 --> 00:10:45.120 crew and respond to any emergencies or contingencies. And so 193 00:10:45.279 --> 00:10:48.879 that just what we call airmanship, good decision making. That 194 00:10:49.039 --> 00:10:52.000 airmanship is something that's evaluated. And so if you're going 195 00:10:52.039 --> 00:10:54.720 to be operating in you know, the Denver metro area, 196 00:10:54.759 --> 00:10:57.279 you're going to be operating in the Washington DC area, 197 00:10:57.960 --> 00:11:01.279 you know, moving VIPs. That's a mission set that I've performed. 198 00:11:01.679 --> 00:11:04.759 You have to be able to show your competence to 199 00:11:04.799 --> 00:11:07.039 be able to perform in that environment. And there's really 200 00:11:07.080 --> 00:11:10.840 no other alternative to evaluate your mission effectiveness other than 201 00:11:10.879 --> 00:11:12.399 to actually go out and fly the mission. 202 00:11:12.960 --> 00:11:16.600 Well, thank you so much, Congressman for sharing your expertise. 203 00:11:16.600 --> 00:11:18.840 I've got to tell you, you know, I around a 204 00:11:18.879 --> 00:11:21.240 lot of expert witnesses. I watch a lot of on TV, etc. 205 00:11:21.720 --> 00:11:24.200 I've never heard anybody explain these things better than you 206 00:11:24.360 --> 00:11:26.879 just did. So thank you for being here today and 207 00:11:26.919 --> 00:11:28.399 look forward to the next conversation. 208 00:11:29.639 --> 00:11:31.840 Well, I really appreciate it. Thanks for the time, and 209 00:11:31.879 --> 00:11:33.840 again our hearts go out to the friends and the 210 00:11:33.840 --> 00:11:34.960 families and the loved ones. 211 00:11:35.039 --> 00:11:38.080 Amend that you take care, sir that his Congressman gave Evans, 212 00:11:38.080 --> 00:11:42.720 who obviously has been a black Hawk helicopter pilot, appreciate 213 00:11:42.759 --> 00:11:44.919 his expertise. You're on the Dan Kapla Show. 214 00:11:46.519 --> 00:11:48.919 And now back to the Dan Taplas Show podcast. 215 00:11:49.679 --> 00:11:52.399 We usually come back with music. I don't know what 216 00:11:52.480 --> 00:11:54.919 that was. Is there an industrial accident back there or 217 00:11:54.960 --> 00:11:56.000 what something. 218 00:11:55.720 --> 00:11:58.200 That I'm interesting? You might say that it's the song 219 00:11:58.279 --> 00:11:59.039 is called Helicopter. 220 00:11:59.480 --> 00:12:04.240 Okay, see hey do they have an English version? 221 00:12:04.639 --> 00:12:04.799 Oh? 222 00:12:04.840 --> 00:12:06.399 That was it? Oh it was that kind of an 223 00:12:06.480 --> 00:12:09.759 English proto punk band. Gotcha, Kelly would hate this music. 224 00:12:09.799 --> 00:12:11.120 So I'm glad alexis here right now. 225 00:12:11.600 --> 00:12:15.080 It's I have been murdered. Well, and thank you Kelly 226 00:12:15.080 --> 00:12:17.759 off today. Thank you Alexa for being here. Thank you 227 00:12:17.799 --> 00:12:20.720 to Congressman Gabe Evans who joined us in the last segment. 228 00:12:20.919 --> 00:12:23.799 And I was saying to the congressman. You know, I 229 00:12:23.799 --> 00:12:26.039 work with a lot of great top experts from around 230 00:12:26.039 --> 00:12:29.080 the country in my lawn job, and obviously watched these 231 00:12:29.120 --> 00:12:33.039 experts on TV. These aviation guys, I've never heard better 232 00:12:33.600 --> 00:12:36.320 than we just heard in that last segment with Gabe Evans, 233 00:12:36.360 --> 00:12:39.919 who's an expert operating Black Hall helicopters. He's piloted them 234 00:12:39.919 --> 00:12:43.759 for years, including here and overseas, and he just added 235 00:12:43.879 --> 00:12:47.600 so much insight into you know, what it's like in 236 00:12:47.639 --> 00:12:51.519 the cockpit, particularly in those kind of situations. So if 237 00:12:51.559 --> 00:12:52.879 you get a chance, if you didn't hear it, go 238 00:12:53.000 --> 00:12:55.840 back in the podcast, Texter Dan Wild. Gabe Evans is 239 00:12:55.879 --> 00:12:59.120 a stud So glad you got elected. Great interview. Dan. 240 00:12:59.120 --> 00:13:03.279 If the TCA system or whatever downgrades near airports, well 241 00:13:03.279 --> 00:13:05.559 then we've got to keep army helicopters in night vision 242 00:13:05.600 --> 00:13:09.120 goggles away. Someone said, common sense. I learned so much 243 00:13:09.120 --> 00:13:11.600 in that interview, and what Congressman Evans was telling us 244 00:13:11.720 --> 00:13:17.080 was that, you know, these warning systems, collision warning systems 245 00:13:18.279 --> 00:13:21.320 are downgraded in sensitivity as you get closer to that 246 00:13:21.399 --> 00:13:24.480 airport runway because there are so many other planes there 247 00:13:24.519 --> 00:13:27.080 and they don't want the pilot being bombarded with these 248 00:13:27.159 --> 00:13:31.559 warnings because the warnings are triggered by transponders on other aircraft. 249 00:13:31.720 --> 00:13:35.840 So fascinating to know that. Not not very comforting, I 250 00:13:35.879 --> 00:13:39.399 think for anybody, but fascinating to know that Dana plane 251 00:13:39.440 --> 00:13:41.480 just hit them all in Philly. Text are correct. That's 252 00:13:41.480 --> 00:13:44.440 what the headlines have been. Now we're seeing some headlines 253 00:13:44.519 --> 00:13:48.200 saying near mall, some headlines saying further from all. Everybody's 254 00:13:48.200 --> 00:13:53.000 saying a small plane. The fireball that's visible in the video. 255 00:13:53.120 --> 00:13:55.759 Then if it's a small plane, single engine, small plane, 256 00:13:55.759 --> 00:13:58.919 the big fireball, I'm guessing is because of what it hit. 257 00:13:59.480 --> 00:14:03.039 You know, must have hit cars or something else with accelerant, 258 00:14:03.159 --> 00:14:05.559 you know, with some type of fuel to have that 259 00:14:05.639 --> 00:14:09.480 big of fireball. But apparently single engine, small plane and 260 00:14:09.559 --> 00:14:12.080 having grown up Ryan, I mean literally just off the 261 00:14:12.159 --> 00:14:15.279 end of the runway at Midway Airport in Chicago on 262 00:14:15.360 --> 00:14:20.320 the southwest side. Plane crashes, not major commercial crashes, but 263 00:14:20.440 --> 00:14:24.399 plane crashes just seemed like a fairly kind of routine thing, 264 00:14:24.480 --> 00:14:29.960 normally small planes. But there was that one big commercial crash. 265 00:14:30.000 --> 00:14:32.320 You would know this because you're like, you're like the 266 00:14:32.360 --> 00:14:37.440 original AI but that crash south side of Chicago, bunch 267 00:14:37.440 --> 00:14:39.840 of Watergate figures were on all right, Yeah, that was 268 00:14:39.840 --> 00:14:42.320 on the flight path to our house. If that plane 269 00:14:42.320 --> 00:14:44.320 had stayed in the air another second or two, it 270 00:14:44.320 --> 00:14:47.039 would have been right there. But what year was that, 271 00:14:47.360 --> 00:14:50.639 because yeah, that was the one big commercial crash in 272 00:14:50.639 --> 00:14:51.240 our neighborhood. 273 00:14:51.240 --> 00:14:54.840 I remember there was a Northwest Airlines crash in Detroit 274 00:14:55.320 --> 00:14:57.279 and only one little girl survived. 275 00:14:57.360 --> 00:14:58.279 Everybody else died. 276 00:14:58.320 --> 00:15:01.480 Her mother had covered her, her mother's charred body had 277 00:15:01.519 --> 00:15:02.919 protected the little girl. 278 00:15:02.679 --> 00:15:05.000 And she lived. She's in her thirties now, maybe forties. 279 00:15:05.039 --> 00:15:07.440 Man. We were so close to the end of the 280 00:15:07.480 --> 00:15:10.639 runway that literally, if we were flying in, family would 281 00:15:10.679 --> 00:15:12.120 come out on the back porch to wave. 282 00:15:12.519 --> 00:15:15.720 So I remember you remember when you tried to sit on. 283 00:15:15.679 --> 00:15:17.320 The right side of the plane because then you could 284 00:15:17.360 --> 00:15:18.519 see our house down there. 285 00:15:18.879 --> 00:15:21.399 Did you see Wayne's World the movie? I must have. 286 00:15:21.840 --> 00:15:23.200 There's a there's this great scene. 287 00:15:23.200 --> 00:15:27.399 I think it's Chicago, Illinois, and Wayne and Garth are 288 00:15:27.440 --> 00:15:29.440 literally right we were talking. They're on their car watching 289 00:15:29.480 --> 00:15:34.720 the planes fly overhead. So but I know it's true 290 00:15:34.320 --> 00:15:36.480 the question that I had, and I'm so glad that 291 00:15:36.480 --> 00:15:38.320 you asked, and thank you for doing that. Dan was 292 00:15:38.519 --> 00:15:42.000 so in Chicago. You've got o'haran Midway two airports. Yeah, 293 00:15:42.080 --> 00:15:45.200 Detroit only has one. We're we're talking here, and I 294 00:15:45.320 --> 00:15:48.159 just flew into Dullest to go to the inauguration. There 295 00:15:48.159 --> 00:15:54.080 are three three major airports, all within striking distance triangulated 296 00:15:54.080 --> 00:15:56.720 from one another, Dullest, Reagan in Baltimore, which isn't that 297 00:15:56.759 --> 00:16:00.279 far away either, And Representative Evans underscored to us, Yeah, 298 00:16:00.360 --> 00:16:02.279 you got to be able to fly black Hawk helicopter 299 00:16:02.360 --> 00:16:03.080 under those conditions. 300 00:16:03.159 --> 00:16:06.039 Yeah, I thought that was one of the really interesting 301 00:16:06.080 --> 00:16:09.320 things he said. Everything was actually but that they, as 302 00:16:09.360 --> 00:16:12.360 I understood him, they make it a point to go 303 00:16:12.480 --> 00:16:17.159 out into those most challenging environments to train because you've 304 00:16:17.200 --> 00:16:20.240 got to have that airmanship ability. And it is when 305 00:16:20.279 --> 00:16:22.240 you think about it, Ryan, right, I mean, what happened 306 00:16:22.279 --> 00:16:25.159 the other night completely preventable, cannot be allowed in America. 307 00:16:25.679 --> 00:16:27.720 But the fact that we have all these aircraft in 308 00:16:27.759 --> 00:16:29.840 the air all the time, and it's been how many 309 00:16:29.879 --> 00:16:32.399 years now since we've had a major disaster now, way 310 00:16:32.399 --> 00:16:36.000 too many near misses. Yeah, and obviously the system needs 311 00:16:36.000 --> 00:16:38.320 to be upgraded, but almost a miracle that we don't 312 00:16:38.360 --> 00:16:39.039 have more of this. 313 00:16:39.120 --> 00:16:41.440 But how much of this blame lies at the feet 314 00:16:41.480 --> 00:16:44.480 of Pete Budha Judge, who was horribly unqualified for that 315 00:16:44.519 --> 00:16:46.200 position Department of Transportation. 316 00:16:46.320 --> 00:16:49.200 We all know that, and he was a DEI hire himself. 317 00:16:49.240 --> 00:16:51.120 He was a mayor of South ben Indiana, had no 318 00:16:51.240 --> 00:16:54.720 experience in the field. We had not enough air traffic controllers. 319 00:16:54.759 --> 00:16:56.879 This is being widely reported. Then this is to blame 320 00:16:57.159 --> 00:17:00.399 one person was doing two persons people's jobs. Feel very 321 00:17:00.440 --> 00:17:02.840 bad for our air traffic controllers. But the question remains, 322 00:17:03.120 --> 00:17:07.000 why were they turning away qualified white male applicants just 323 00:17:07.039 --> 00:17:08.720 because they couldn't make diversity. 324 00:17:08.359 --> 00:17:10.640 Highers, Which is as I'm sure you intended, the perfect 325 00:17:10.680 --> 00:17:14.039 transition into our next guest, because this is a guest 326 00:17:14.079 --> 00:17:16.640 you probably have not heard anywhere else. Grady Block Mountain 327 00:17:16.680 --> 00:17:20.240 States Legal Foundation. They are not newcomers to this. They 328 00:17:20.240 --> 00:17:22.279 have had a class action suit in the works for 329 00:17:22.319 --> 00:17:25.799 a while representing I think over a thousand folks who 330 00:17:25.839 --> 00:17:28.440 wanted to be air traffic controllers and say they were 331 00:17:28.480 --> 00:17:32.000 denied because they're white. And so this lawsuit it's been 332 00:17:32.039 --> 00:17:34.960 certified for class action status. Will get the details after 333 00:17:35.000 --> 00:17:37.279 the break, but it comes down to this, right listen, 334 00:17:37.319 --> 00:17:40.279 It may well be that the most qualified air traffic 335 00:17:40.319 --> 00:17:43.480 controller in America. That one individual the pinnacle of the 336 00:17:43.519 --> 00:17:47.759 profession may be black, maybe a woman, maybe Latino, maybe white, 337 00:17:47.799 --> 00:17:50.559 maybe whatever. But the point being that when it comes 338 00:17:50.599 --> 00:17:53.519 to that position, or any position, it should not be 339 00:17:53.599 --> 00:17:56.359 based on race, as doctor King said, it should always 340 00:17:56.400 --> 00:18:00.240 be based on merit. But clearly, and whether it's a 341 00:18:00.240 --> 00:18:01.920 direct cause here or now, we don't know. We'll left 342 00:18:01.920 --> 00:18:06.039 to find out over time. But clearly, the left, clearly 343 00:18:06.079 --> 00:18:09.559 the left has been in many ways, many many ways, 344 00:18:09.920 --> 00:18:12.480 including legalization of drugs, and we have no idea if 345 00:18:12.519 --> 00:18:15.839 that was a factor here has been lowering the standards 346 00:18:15.839 --> 00:18:19.160 in America, lowering the standards of competence, lowering the standards 347 00:18:19.160 --> 00:18:22.559 of performance. That has to be replaced across the board. 348 00:18:22.599 --> 00:18:23.839 You're on the Dan Kapla. 349 00:18:23.640 --> 00:18:28.519 Show, you're listening to the Dan Kaplis Show podcast. 350 00:18:29.759 --> 00:18:35.880 I would say that I'm so sorry. Oh maybe people 351 00:18:35.920 --> 00:18:47.279 are getting detect children. I don't understand. I'm so sorry. 352 00:18:47.440 --> 00:18:50.599 I wish I could do something that it can I 353 00:18:50.680 --> 00:18:55.359 don't know what to do. I'll try everything. 354 00:19:00.359 --> 00:19:04.559 Yeah, Selena Gomez so deeply disturbed there. Well, one thing 355 00:19:04.640 --> 00:19:08.039 she could do is be grateful that President Trump is 356 00:19:08.160 --> 00:19:14.440 removing criminally legals, because criminally legals prey on everybody, including 357 00:19:15.240 --> 00:19:19.480 other people here illegally. Hey, let's go to the VIP line. Here, 358 00:19:19.559 --> 00:19:23.279 we've got Grady Block with us, very very important guests 359 00:19:23.279 --> 00:19:27.400 from Mountain State's Legal Foundation on this lawsuit, which has 360 00:19:27.440 --> 00:19:29.880 been important from day one, but now has taken on 361 00:19:29.960 --> 00:19:33.119 this added importance in view of the horror the other 362 00:19:33.240 --> 00:19:35.839 night in Washington, d C. Grady, Welcome to the Dan 363 00:19:35.920 --> 00:19:36.599 Kapla Show. 364 00:19:38.240 --> 00:19:39.799 Hey, Dan, thank you so much for having me. 365 00:19:40.279 --> 00:19:43.960 Well, this to me, both as a lawyer, talk show host, 366 00:19:44.000 --> 00:19:48.440 and American citizen, etc. Is so fascinating and important. Would 367 00:19:48.480 --> 00:19:51.440 you please give people an overview of this class action 368 00:19:51.640 --> 00:19:55.279 case pertaining to air traffic controllers and people who wanted 369 00:19:55.359 --> 00:19:55.920 that job. 370 00:19:57.559 --> 00:19:58.119 Absolutely. 371 00:19:58.279 --> 00:20:01.279 So, it's kind of an interesting case back to the 372 00:20:01.440 --> 00:20:05.960 late Obama Biden administration. So we are representing nearly one 373 00:20:06.000 --> 00:20:10.000 thousand members of this class that were discriminated against by 374 00:20:10.799 --> 00:20:15.559 their race by that administration. And basically what happened is, 375 00:20:15.599 --> 00:20:17.880 you know, they were wanting to be air traffic controllers. 376 00:20:17.920 --> 00:20:19.839 They went to school, they did all the right things, 377 00:20:20.599 --> 00:20:23.160 They graduated from a program that had nearly one hundred 378 00:20:23.160 --> 00:20:26.400 percent success rate, and placement for being an air traffic controller. 379 00:20:26.960 --> 00:20:29.279 And what happened was there was a class about a 380 00:20:29.319 --> 00:20:32.200 thousand people and the Obama Biden administration looked at it 381 00:20:32.200 --> 00:20:33.599 and said, you know, this looks a little bit too 382 00:20:33.599 --> 00:20:36.279 white for us, so we're going to revise all the 383 00:20:36.319 --> 00:20:38.640 metrics for getting into this. Instead of going with the 384 00:20:38.680 --> 00:20:41.680 program that they used to do, they switched to a 385 00:20:41.680 --> 00:20:47.880 different questionnaire that effectively gerrymandered the hiring pool. So these 386 00:20:47.920 --> 00:20:51.160 thousand people that were representing were excluded because of this 387 00:20:51.400 --> 00:20:54.920 new test that they implemented that essentially just discriminated people 388 00:20:55.119 --> 00:20:56.519 against them for their race. 389 00:20:58.079 --> 00:21:00.119 It's so wait a second, you're telling me you've got 390 00:21:00.160 --> 00:21:04.440 this pool of applicants generally considered qualified. It's where they'd 391 00:21:04.480 --> 00:21:07.119 drawn from in the past, largely to fill these air 392 00:21:07.119 --> 00:21:11.559 traffic control jobs. And that the is it the Obama 393 00:21:11.640 --> 00:21:15.319 Biden administration that then came in and changed the game 394 00:21:15.440 --> 00:21:18.720 because they didn't like the skin color of the applicants. 395 00:21:20.200 --> 00:21:23.160 That's exactly right. So this was back in twenty twelve, 396 00:21:23.240 --> 00:21:26.200 twenty thirteen when all this happened. We actually filed the 397 00:21:26.200 --> 00:21:28.240 suit in twenty fourteen, so this goes back quite a way. 398 00:21:28.279 --> 00:21:30.319 It's been going on for quite some time, but that's 399 00:21:30.359 --> 00:21:34.440 exactly what happened. They had a very qualified pool and 400 00:21:34.519 --> 00:21:36.519 they didn't like the color of their skin, so they 401 00:21:36.599 --> 00:21:39.680