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Speaker 1: I want to welcome everyone back to the Pekingona Show.

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We are here for a new series. How are you doing,

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Thomas very well?

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Speaker 2: Thank you.

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Speaker 1: Well. This is actually a request that I got during

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one of my Sunday live streams. Somebody said that you

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always talk about how California used to be like white

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America was, it was like the pinnacle of white America,

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and that it was destroyed on purpose and it became

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it is what it is now and that was done

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on purpose. So you know, the idea is you try

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to go over the history and explain exactly how that happened.

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Speaker 2: Well, I mean it's two things. I mean, there's there's

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a demographic situation, and there's dysfunction in that regard and

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you know a kind of cultivated anarchy. But it's also

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the California is also just not a blue state. It

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didn't one day become a blue state in nineteen ninety two.

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That's not nothings work that it'd be like given twenty

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twenty eight, it's declared Illinois is now a red state.

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It's as red as Texas. It can never be flipped.

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And that's just how it is. You know, I don't

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accept that that's preposterous and plus just the the facts

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don't bear that out. Whenever there's a plebiscite, because I mean,

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California's got an unusual constitution, you know, that's why they

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pulled these plebiscites like somehow. Every time there's you know,

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a social issue put to an open vote, you know,

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whether it's what the regime ephimistically calls gay marriage, whether

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it's affirmative action, there's always like a raw majority against it.

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So California is just like a rabidly liberal, safe blue state.

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But when people go to the polls, they always like

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vote this stuff down, and then the night Circuit steps

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in to reverse the plebiscite. I mean, like what so

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how does that work? You know? And it the reason why.

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You know, not only were Reagan and Nixon products of

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the California plago culture, but even like resistance types and

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fringe people like the Butchers, that was like their heartland.

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Like Tommy Mesker was in Los Angeles really until the

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SPLC went after him because of the unfortunate incident with

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with Ken Miski and that uh mugulta Sarah guy who

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you know, lost his life when incident of this fight.

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It was kind of like a nothing thing, you know.

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I mean it was young guys being foolish, you know,

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on both sides of that conflict, and a guy lost

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his life unfortunately, and you know, the local authorities swept

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in and and and and Morris D's like smelled proverbial

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carry on, the feast on and a way to make

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money off of the misery of others, which he was

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never going to pass up. And uh, you know Metzker

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was was uh, he he had to protect himself, you

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know from this this law fair uh that was being

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deployed against him. So you end up moving to Indiana.

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But you know he's the reason why, you know, like

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he made his home in Los Angeles, because that's that's

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fertile ground for those kinds of politics. And even of

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this day, like I realized that, you know, you can't

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extrapolate what a political culture is in terms of its

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substantive tenor you know, from the street or the prison yard.

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But somehow like California is like it's unbelievably like racial eye.

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He's in the penal system on the street in a

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way like that'd be unheard of in Chicago. It's like

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Chicago being like massively segregated. So it's like, so California

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is basically like the Sweden of the United States, but

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on the street, like people only be aligned by race,

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and like if you talk to some guy across the

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racial divide, like you've got a problem, you know you're

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gonna get like regulated for it. Like that's interesting. I

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don't see that's possible, but you know something is that

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and I I'll get into the substance of our discussion

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in a minute, But I don't know why people take

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this at face value. It's like you wouldn't you know

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if MSNBC tells you that Vladimir Putin is some like

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dangerous mad man, or if they tell you that Donald

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Trump is is you know, a rapist or whatever ridiculous

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you know in vile cap they're they're favoring any at

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any given moment. It's like you wouldn't believe that, but

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you believe it when they just declare that California is

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insurmountably blue, Like why would you believe that? Plus, it's

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just not an electoral politics works. There aren't just quote

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safe states, So it's like we're not going to campaign

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in Texas or we're not going to campaign in California

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because it's safe. That's not how you run a campaign.

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You know, like if Reagan had done that, he wouldn't

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have slept the country. Like, you know, you just don't

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challenge in these major and essential electoral prizes because they're

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safe states. I mean, that's obvious horse trading. It's obvious

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that you know, there's a combination of of the technology

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and the ability to add great data in real time

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and you know, kind of changing parameters within the political

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culture at federal level at a bunch of things like this.

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So like after the Cold War, it's like, well, we're

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basically gonna take We're gonna take certain like electoral college

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prizes off the table and like only fight in certain states.

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That's part of horse trading. Like we get texted this,

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you get California. I mean, this is this is obvious,

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you know, and especially in the case of California, Like

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I very much got Chicago in my DNA, but you know,

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I got on a deep roots here, Like my my

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folks are from what'son I mean, like my mom was

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long gone, but my dad and my mom was from

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from Los Angeles, and I my early life, I spent

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a lot of time there, you know, and so it's

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not just academic to me. You know, like I saw

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what southern California was like in the eighties, you know,

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I mean it wasn't. It wasn't like people claim it was,

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you know, and I was there throughout the nineties too,

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I mean not with much regularity. Like the last time

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I was out there was was two thousand, but I

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mean it was the same deal. I mean, there's weird

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stuff there. There's definitely a lot more kind of open

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vice and things than you'd find in Chicago or like

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in the South. But this idea that it's some like

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that it's a great big Berkeley or that it's or

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that it's like Eugene, Oregon, and like that's ridiculous. You know,

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it's incredibly racialized. It's incredibly segregated. You know, the people

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there have a very law and order of sensibility, especially

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considering the kind of unless you're talking about, uh I,

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they're talking about East Lare, and unless you're talking about

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some of these like day one white hoods, or unless

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you're talking about what remains like blacks southern California, which

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is ceasing exists. I mean, it's it's a fact. I'm

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not talking to some shit like unless're talking about a

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hoods like that, like people don't know when or trust

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their neighbors, Like it's you know, it's not at all

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of people claim it is. So I figure we could

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probably make it a three part series. Like today, I

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want to get into the kind of history of how

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California became California, because that's important, you know. I I

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was going to discussion the other day about Wisconsin, because

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Wisconsin is an unusual state. You know, like on the

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one hand, like on the one hand, they'll they'll go

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for Bernie, you'll go for Trumps. Is like protest gestures.

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But it's like the same population that goes for both.

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And they you know, they abolish the death penalty when

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I was basically unheard of. They were founded by a

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bunch of Bavarians essentially, I mean, I'm in the culture there.

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I don't mean like this the governmental apparatus, a lot

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of whom were kind of the eighteen forty eight refuge

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got to the refugees of eighteen forty eight. You know,

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so they've got they had a peculiar ideological persuasion. You know,

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in California from day one, it was very very racialized,

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you know, and there was a there was a number

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there was there was a successive incidents of secession movements

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during the war between the States, and there was concern.

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There's concern that a bunch of free soilers who were

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for all practical purposes like rabid white nationalists and uh,

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some of these some of these Spanish people both people

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literally descended from Spaniards, you know, as well as uh

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as well as like Mestizo people, you know who who

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owned land in southern California who remained after the Mexican War.

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There was concern that they were going to click up

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and they were just going to tell the federal government

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to go to hell and say like we're we're our

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own territory, now come get us. You know, this is

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not a state that is a heritage of tolerance or

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multiculturalism in the way the term is bandied today or

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of you know, love for the federal government. You know.

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And and even if that was true, you know, again,

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like let's say everything that was alleged is true, that

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California just can never be flipped. It is always blue

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because of Mexicans. So Hispanics love Chris senile old white

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ladies like Nancy Pelosi, they love like they love like

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vulgar yentas like Barbara Boxer, Like really they don't want

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their own people running things, you know, I mean, if

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what they say is true, you'd have something like young

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like uh, you know, something young basically like socialists, like

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Mexican guy whose whole thing was you know, like justice

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for like the farm workers, and probably some kind of

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weird pastiche of liberation theology, Catholicism and that kind of

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like crusading evangelical sensibility that that tends to be. I mean,

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not not in terms of sexual stuff or social matters,

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but in terms of economic matters, like left wing, Like

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that's that's who California will be full of in terms

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of its garment. If what was being alleged was true,

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it wouldn't be some, it wouldn't be some like zombiefied

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hag white lead, you know, like who everybody despises. You know,

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like that's ridiculous. So I you know, I'm trying to

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disabuse people of those notions. But yeah, with with that

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background laid will, we'll kind of get started the key

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to kind of California's existence is a state. You know,

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it was the Mexican War when Mexico City was charactured

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by Windfield Scott. He was the commander on the ground

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and the Mexican War was formative in all kinds of ways.

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Stonewall Jackson, he was an artillery officer on the ground

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there and he you know this, this is basically where

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the guys who came to make up the the corps

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of the Confederate Army like learn how to fight with

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combined arms. You know. Winfield Scott, Jefferson Davis, Zichary Taylor,

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Stonewall Jackson, Winfield Scott and Jefferson Davis became real rivals

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in ops like way back then. And Winfield Scott, of course,

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he essentially defected to the Union cause if you want

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to look at it that way, and he was responsible

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for he died very shortly after the onset of hostilities

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and even sixty one, but he played a key part

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in devising the Union battle plan in terms of you know,

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mobilization and devising with this limit instructure and things like that.

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But this kind of politically, California was a microcosm after

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the Mexican War of the political divide that developed between

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the Democrats, which were then the Jacksonian Party and the Whigs.

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And we're gonna get into what that means and a

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lot of and California to day is the legacy of

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that in real terms, not in terms of the propaganda narrative.

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But when Mexico City fell on September fifteenth, eighteen forty seven, like,

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the end result was that Mexico, Mexico is essentially required

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to seceed like more over half of its territory, including

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the present day including was present day California and Nevada, Utah,

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most of Colorado, New Mexico, Arizona, and a small part

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of Wyoming. You know, I mean Mexico after after it

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achieved in the times from Spain. I mean, it was,

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it was, it was, it was, It was setting itself

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up to be a major power. You know, people forget that,

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like Mexico today is basically like a rump state. Okay,

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the American delegation and President Polk, and Polk was actually

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a really good president and serious historians have started crediting

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him with that. Polk was a protege of Andrew Jackson, Okay,

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and he was very much like a Jacksonian executive, you know,

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he he viewed, uh, he viewed the kind of like

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white warrior Yaleman Rys as like the backbone of this country.

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He viewed the president as having a special mandate because

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he's the only nationally e lookeed representative like uh. He

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had contempt for Congress. He he thought, you know, the judiciary,

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he had nothing to say on on trying to restrain authority,

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expressly delegated the Article two. But he was a great man,

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and he he he basically accomplished all of his objectives

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in a single term. See he said when he took

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off when the other bobus, he said he would not

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run for any more for a second term. He would

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not seek in compancy, and he didn't just a great president.

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But Polk realized, like, we can't impose a totally draconian

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peace on these people we've you know, the Mexicans. He's like,

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we've gotta we got to compensate them somehow. I'll tell

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the US government paid in Mexico fifteen million dollars in

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in in the literal language of the of the peace

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agreement quote in consideration of the extension acquired by the

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boundaries of the United States and the then the government

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also like it that Polk's administra, like I said, satisfied,

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like publicly held debts like oh, the Mexican government by

237
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American citizens. Okay. So I mean on the one hand,

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Mexico became like a rump state, like almost fiefdom of America.

239
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But I mean they were compensated, you know, it just

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wasn't poke. Uh. And Polk realized too, like a lot

241
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of these Southern officers, I mean, God love them like

242
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they're my own forebears. But uh, he realized there was

243
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a potential of these guys like putting their boot on

244
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the heels of Mexico's neck and and basically you know,

245
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basically like ruling like like like you know, like uh

246
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like occupation warlords. And He's like, we can't, we can't

247
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have it, you know. And uh, Winfield Scott was, Ah,

248
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it was a very impressive guy and a great general officer.

249
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I mean, I've got no love for his politics, but

250
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you know it and he commanding general, especially in those

251
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days where you know, command control was truly in situ.

252
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You know, you need it, you needed that, you needed

253
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a president who had the actual authority behind is his

254
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dic tos, the you know, to kind of bring that

255
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power to bear the UH. But the UH, the piece

256
00:17:29,119 --> 00:17:34,440
of h Guadalupe Hadelgo Ken went to paper on a

257
00:17:35,759 --> 00:17:40,680
nineteenth of UH. It was finally ratified in the nineteenth

258
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of May eighteen forty eight. Like I still he's ended,

259
00:17:43,799 --> 00:17:45,599
you know with with the fall of Mexico City. But

260
00:17:45,640 --> 00:17:48,279
it was months later that this treaty was hatched out.

261
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Nicholas Trist, who for practical purposes, was kind of the

262
00:17:52,720 --> 00:17:55,960
first Secretary of State, like in the Department of State

263
00:17:56,000 --> 00:18:02,839
as we think of it. He was sent down there

264
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as Polk's representative to Liais with Winfield Scott. What he

265
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ended up doing was Polk, as well as the military establishment,

266
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he wanted to Trist to push way harder from more

267
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territorial concessions. Trist didn't do that, But initially Polk said

268
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he was willing to pay the Mexican's thirty million dollars

269
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the compensation. Trist literally had that number, okay, which honestly

270
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is like splendid negotiation. But Tris kind of became persona

271
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on grata subsequently. But Trist's associated with a lot of

272
00:18:55,400 --> 00:18:59,319
know nothings in natives types. It's interesting, you know, and

273
00:18:59,440 --> 00:19:04,039
a lot of these guys. Trist it wasn't he kind

274
00:19:04,039 --> 00:19:07,839
of played both sides of the aisle, because on the

275
00:19:07,839 --> 00:19:10,200
one hand, like he paid lip surge to these guys

276
00:19:10,640 --> 00:19:17,440
who wanted to expand slavery westward, and presumably a lot

277
00:19:17,440 --> 00:19:21,880
of these same elements, particularly the military establishment, who are

278
00:19:21,920 --> 00:19:24,519
almost st all Southerners, you know, who are part of

279
00:19:24,519 --> 00:19:28,960
this kind of court group of officers who won the

280
00:19:28,960 --> 00:19:34,039
war in Mexico, Like, presumably they wanted to expand slavery, like,

281
00:19:34,519 --> 00:19:37,400
you know, deep into what had been Spanish America as well,

282
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you know. And H. Trist was unwilling to get behind that,

283
00:19:44,880 --> 00:19:49,119
Like he stood on business for like slaveholders' rights, and

284
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like he was a slaveholder, but he came down on

285
00:19:53,000 --> 00:19:55,400
the side of the free soilers if we cannot expand

286
00:19:55,440 --> 00:20:01,519
this westward, you know. And I think that with a

287
00:20:01,599 --> 00:20:07,400
source of some of the tension. And Poke Poke struck

288
00:20:07,559 --> 00:20:10,440
very much kind of the same sort of compromise in

289
00:20:10,559 --> 00:20:13,359
terms of what he was willing to publicly advocate for

290
00:20:14,559 --> 00:20:17,759
and like to understand the history of the West, the

291
00:20:17,799 --> 00:20:20,519
American West, like you've got to take that into account,

292
00:20:21,400 --> 00:20:23,160
you know. The degree to which it was kind of

293
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a fight between these Jacksonians who basically wanted to make

294
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the West like an extension of the American South and

295
00:20:36,720 --> 00:20:41,640
this kind of like agrarian slave empire, and these free

296
00:20:41,640 --> 00:20:45,720
soiler types were basically allied with big business, you know,

297
00:20:45,839 --> 00:20:49,359
and what became like the kind of new Republican Party

298
00:20:50,920 --> 00:20:54,480
around mister Lincoln, which was kind of like the vestigial

299
00:20:54,519 --> 00:20:58,839
elements of the Whigs. You know, they didn't they opposed

300
00:20:58,880 --> 00:21:03,240
to slavery, but they but not for like the reasons

301
00:21:03,559 --> 00:21:06,759
that uh, like Quakers were that these creators like John

302
00:21:06,799 --> 00:21:09,440
Brown tape evolutionists were One of the reasons they were

303
00:21:09,440 --> 00:21:12,440
opposed to is because they were very hard line white nationalists.

304
00:21:12,720 --> 00:21:16,400
They didn't want like non white people. Uh they've even

305
00:21:16,440 --> 00:21:21,440
slavery is like this degenerate practice, you know, in no

306
00:21:21,559 --> 00:21:25,279
sol measure because they involved like recent mixing and things like.

307
00:21:25,400 --> 00:21:27,920
These are the people, these are the political factions that

308
00:21:27,960 --> 00:21:33,480
were like fighting for dominance in California, Like like progressives

309
00:21:33,480 --> 00:21:36,960
were nowhere to be found. They didn't exist, you know.

310
00:21:39,880 --> 00:21:44,960
So that that's relevant to our discussion here because it's like, okay,

311
00:21:45,000 --> 00:21:48,640
I mean, if you're gonna claim that like New York

312
00:21:48,839 --> 00:21:53,799
is is like a progressive heartland, that's overstated too, for

313
00:21:53,839 --> 00:21:57,160
all kinds of reasons. But I'll accept it because you

314
00:21:57,319 --> 00:22:04,079
do have that culture in New York and Boston, throughout

315
00:22:04,119 --> 00:22:09,519
New England dating back to literally this the early seventeenth century.

316
00:22:09,799 --> 00:22:13,640
It doesn't exist in California, you know, yet you're supposed

317
00:22:13,680 --> 00:22:17,359
to believe that. I guess one day in the nineteen seventies,

318
00:22:18,640 --> 00:22:22,160
this became the dominant culture. And now it's just now

319
00:22:22,160 --> 00:22:25,039
it's just ironclad and insurmountable. It's not other things work,

320
00:22:26,000 --> 00:22:29,279
you know, and this stuff doesn't matter. You know. People

321
00:22:29,680 --> 00:22:34,200
they developed these conceits, I guess because they I bibe

322
00:22:34,200 --> 00:22:42,400
what they're told by regime adjacent median things that somehow

323
00:22:42,599 --> 00:22:45,960
precedent is just wiped away. After nineteen eighty nine or something,

324
00:22:46,000 --> 00:22:51,559
and after the Cold War, you know, the enduring conventions

325
00:22:51,559 --> 00:22:54,279
and any given locale just like don't matter like that.

326
00:22:54,279 --> 00:22:57,000
That could not be farther from the truth. That's it's

327
00:22:57,039 --> 00:23:00,240
not political life. That's not all things worked. You know.

328
00:23:02,279 --> 00:23:06,119
History bleeds into the present in all kinds of ways,

329
00:23:06,839 --> 00:23:11,720
you know, and especially especially when we're talking about political

330
00:23:11,759 --> 00:23:14,880
cultures and the kind of nuances they're in. I mean

331
00:23:14,880 --> 00:23:17,200
that that's why we have an Electoral College. It's not

332
00:23:17,319 --> 00:23:21,359
it's not. It's not some weird conspiracy or whatever. You know,

333
00:23:21,799 --> 00:23:26,160
the Walmart chopper types think like nor is it something

334
00:23:26,160 --> 00:23:28,839
that the federal governments like thinks of some great thing.

335
00:23:29,240 --> 00:23:33,039
They had no choice, you know, because otherwise it's not

336
00:23:33,039 --> 00:23:35,119
going to be there's going to be a legitimacy gap,

337
00:23:35,359 --> 00:23:39,200
you know, a mile wide if if such things aren't abided,

338
00:23:40,000 --> 00:23:43,200
you know. And the reason why those things exist is

339
00:23:43,200 --> 00:23:49,960
on grounds and historical imperatives. But moving on, Tryst had

340
00:23:50,000 --> 00:23:53,880
been he'd been on liaison to Cuba, and he spoke

341
00:23:53,920 --> 00:23:56,279
fluent Spanish, and he seems they have an affinity kind

342
00:23:56,279 --> 00:24:00,880
of for for Spanish peoples, you know, both like the

343
00:24:00,000 --> 00:24:03,960
the Spaniards themselves as well as you know, some of

344
00:24:04,000 --> 00:24:10,839
their mixed race and indigenous charges and things. And there's

345
00:24:10,920 --> 00:24:16,279
speculation that both at the time and subsequent, some of

346
00:24:16,359 --> 00:24:18,519
which is used us as a laudable thing, some of

347
00:24:18,559 --> 00:24:22,920
which is very punitive that you know, he sympathized with

348
00:24:22,960 --> 00:24:25,640
the Mexicans more than he cared about with Polk wanted

349
00:24:25,720 --> 00:24:28,799
and Whinfield Scott wanted him to get done, you know,

350
00:24:29,440 --> 00:24:32,839
so he found a way to basically like let the

351
00:24:32,920 --> 00:24:37,759
Mexicans preserve especially you know, these these military types who

352
00:24:37,759 --> 00:24:40,640
were sitting at the negotiating table. He allowed them to

353
00:24:40,680 --> 00:24:43,599
like retain some of their honor as officers and as men.

354
00:24:44,079 --> 00:24:49,000
Well also, uh, you know, managing the managing to save

355
00:24:49,559 --> 00:24:53,200
the Poke administration literally half of the expenditure that they've anticipated.

356
00:24:53,640 --> 00:24:57,839
It's interesting to speculate, and I think that's probably true. Okay,

357
00:24:58,839 --> 00:25:08,920
but the uh but yeah, he didn't uh he and

358
00:25:10,000 --> 00:25:13,640
book book paulk and Winfield Scott were not at all happy,

359
00:25:15,519 --> 00:25:19,559
and subsequently Christ's ordered to leave Mexico and he refused.

360
00:25:19,559 --> 00:25:22,559
He just stayed there. He wrote a he wrote a

361
00:25:22,599 --> 00:25:26,200
sixty five page letter back to Washington. Like how anybody

362
00:25:26,200 --> 00:25:28,119
could write a sixty five page letter in those days

363
00:25:28,200 --> 00:25:34,160
is incredible, But that's what he did. And uh he

364
00:25:34,200 --> 00:25:40,119
outlined his reasons from staying in uh staying in theater,

365
00:25:41,279 --> 00:25:48,599
and uh he spared uh he he he didn't have

366
00:25:48,680 --> 00:25:50,799
the opportunity to go to ways to explain, you know

367
00:25:51,880 --> 00:25:56,799
how he'd h executed a brilliant negotiation, you know, and

368
00:25:57,000 --> 00:26:00,880
uh managed to bargain down, saying it anna to accept

369
00:26:00,960 --> 00:26:05,160
you know, only fifteen million dollars in compensation for the concessions.

370
00:26:06,279 --> 00:26:15,319
But you know the uh so all told Polpe uh

371
00:26:16,400 --> 00:26:20,759
had wanted, uh the concessions to extend to specifically include

372
00:26:20,799 --> 00:26:27,079
Baja California. Trist had drawn the line, you know, and

373
00:26:27,319 --> 00:26:29,680
and and and presumably this is one of the reasons

374
00:26:29,680 --> 00:26:34,319
why Santa Anna had been so amenable. He took the

375
00:26:34,400 --> 00:26:38,079
line directly west from Yuma to Tijuana and San Diego

376
00:26:38,440 --> 00:26:42,559
instead from Uma south to the Gulf of California, which

377
00:26:42,680 --> 00:26:46,119
left all of Baja is part of Mexico. And that

378
00:26:46,319 --> 00:26:52,640
that's really what infuriated Polpe. Okay, but you know, you

379
00:26:55,160 --> 00:26:57,160
a great diplomat. I mean, don't get me wrong. I

380
00:26:58,000 --> 00:26:59,920
think Tris was compromised. If you want to look at

381
00:26:59,920 --> 00:27:03,880
it in those terms, absolutely, but you can't. You can't.

382
00:27:03,880 --> 00:27:06,119
Second guy said diplomatic as to what he says, is

383
00:27:07,000 --> 00:27:13,519
is a key concession that you know, you're the opposing

384
00:27:13,599 --> 00:27:17,880
party will won't you know, uh, it considers to be

385
00:27:18,119 --> 00:27:21,240
you know, non negotiable. You've got to defer in some

386
00:27:21,480 --> 00:27:24,160
measure to or diplomatic corps. You know, even if you're

387
00:27:24,160 --> 00:27:27,319
a very even if you're a very hands on executive,

388
00:27:27,400 --> 00:27:32,200
and and any wartime executive is going to be hands on.

389
00:27:33,119 --> 00:27:36,240
You know, so just as a complicated figure like I

390
00:27:37,440 --> 00:27:39,680
forgive me if that was seemed like a boring tangent.

391
00:27:39,759 --> 00:27:44,039
It's actually important not just for the subject on the

392
00:27:44,119 --> 00:27:48,440
table today, but just understanding American diplomatic history. And you know,

393
00:27:48,599 --> 00:27:52,119
Mexico is in It's what happens in Mexico remains important

394
00:27:52,359 --> 00:27:54,200
for all kinds of reasons. I mean, we're dealing with

395
00:27:54,279 --> 00:27:58,119
that today, and it's it's a key the key issue

396
00:27:58,279 --> 00:28:07,279
upon which mister Trump's uh, you know campaign for the

397
00:28:07,400 --> 00:28:19,240
presidency in twenty sixteen and today is is hinged. But yeah,

398
00:28:19,480 --> 00:28:26,240
the uh, you know, it's important to to understand the

399
00:28:26,319 --> 00:28:28,319
degree to which kind of the war between the States,

400
00:28:28,839 --> 00:28:31,079
and we're gonna we'll get into the the experience of

401
00:28:31,160 --> 00:28:34,759
California in the American Civil War, but you know, the

402
00:28:34,839 --> 00:28:38,920
West wasn't the war from the States changed everything in

403
00:28:39,039 --> 00:28:43,039
what was then kind of the established United States of America,

404
00:28:43,519 --> 00:28:47,160
with you know, the westernmost boundary of the actual United States,

405
00:28:47,279 --> 00:28:49,480
like not being much beyond where I'm sitting right now.

406
00:28:52,440 --> 00:28:58,079
It Arizona was a Confederate territory, but at some of

407
00:28:58,160 --> 00:29:05,880
the final battles in the Western skilled into the American Southwest.

408
00:29:07,519 --> 00:29:13,000
But California wasn't really they weren't impacted in the same way,

409
00:29:14,079 --> 00:29:17,680
you know. So it's almost like things even after the

410
00:29:17,759 --> 00:29:19,839
Civil War amendments and even after a lot of this,

411
00:29:21,319 --> 00:29:24,799
a lot after the radicals were able to impose reconstruction

412
00:29:24,920 --> 00:29:33,359
on the South, you know, and even even during the

413
00:29:33,480 --> 00:29:36,799
period people view as either alternatively, you know, the Gilded

414
00:29:36,839 --> 00:29:42,240
Age or or the Long Depression you know, from like

415
00:29:42,279 --> 00:29:45,920
the eighteen seventies to around the turn of the century,

416
00:29:47,440 --> 00:29:53,880
like the stuff that was happening in sociological terms in

417
00:29:56,519 --> 00:29:58,880
and the rest of the country like wasn't really impacting

418
00:29:58,960 --> 00:30:02,440
the West, you know, it was it was like remote

419
00:30:02,480 --> 00:30:08,119
to them, you know, and it didn't really like the

420
00:30:08,240 --> 00:30:11,039
battle lines were still between the people who'd been kind

421
00:30:11,079 --> 00:30:16,839
of like wig you know, wig slash Republicans, you know,

422
00:30:17,480 --> 00:30:22,359
free soiler types and these Jacksonian Democrats who again were

423
00:30:22,599 --> 00:30:29,000
basically who were basically Confederates in all but name, you know.

424
00:30:30,440 --> 00:30:33,440
One of the and the thing that kind of both

425
00:30:33,480 --> 00:30:38,359
held in common was this like highly racialized view of politics.

426
00:30:39,799 --> 00:30:43,599
You know. We'll get into this in a minute because

427
00:30:43,640 --> 00:30:48,279
it bears on one of the significant secession movements that

428
00:30:49,880 --> 00:30:51,759
some of these parts of the Nights in California tried

429
00:30:51,799 --> 00:30:55,640
to try to get off the ground. You know, it

430
00:30:55,759 --> 00:31:00,240
was literally illegal for blacks to settle an Oregon, you know,

431
00:31:01,279 --> 00:31:04,480
and that was a free soiler imperative. It wasn't racist

432
00:31:04,559 --> 00:31:06,680
Confederates who were implementing that stuff.

433
00:31:07,839 --> 00:31:08,000
Speaker 1: You know.

434
00:31:08,480 --> 00:31:11,079
Speaker 2: The reason why for it, and it wasn't filming around it.

435
00:31:11,160 --> 00:31:17,039
Bit was because there was concern about you know this uh,

436
00:31:17,359 --> 00:31:23,319
this Indian like native population, you know, developing a real

437
00:31:23,519 --> 00:31:27,720
enmity with a black population that you know, presumably a

438
00:31:27,759 --> 00:31:31,720
potential to swell and was significant demographic and that wasn't unfounded,

439
00:31:32,240 --> 00:31:35,720
like there'd been violent incidents between black folks and between

440
00:31:35,799 --> 00:31:36,759
Indians and Oregon.

441
00:31:37,440 --> 00:31:37,599
Speaker 1: You know.

442
00:31:37,720 --> 00:31:40,799
Speaker 2: But it's also you know, the Oregonians, they weren't gonna

443
00:31:40,839 --> 00:31:42,920
like turn Oregon and it's some like most like some

444
00:31:43,079 --> 00:31:48,960
dysfunctional like multicultural state, you know, and they it meant

445
00:31:49,039 --> 00:31:52,880
nothing to them if people you know this, uh this

446
00:31:53,039 --> 00:31:55,880
was an eighteen forty, eighteen fifties, you know, the like

447
00:31:55,960 --> 00:31:58,799
the that the post developed decade after the Mexican War.

448
00:31:59,160 --> 00:32:00,960
It meant nothing to them. If people tried to sell

449
00:32:01,039 --> 00:32:04,640
them on like abolitionists moralizing, you know, like what is

450
00:32:04,799 --> 00:32:07,519
so what that that means nothing to us. You know,

451
00:32:07,640 --> 00:32:10,480
that's that's that's your problem and your dysfunction, a little

452
00:32:10,519 --> 00:32:13,759
corner of the country where you know, you can't you

453
00:32:13,839 --> 00:32:16,440
can't come to terms over slavery. What was that have

454
00:32:16,519 --> 00:32:17,039
to do with us?

455
00:32:17,640 --> 00:32:17,799
Speaker 1: You know?

456
00:32:17,960 --> 00:32:22,720
Speaker 2: That was the degree to which the West Coast was

457
00:32:22,799 --> 00:32:26,839
kind of this remote place. I mean that that carried

458
00:32:26,880 --> 00:32:29,640
on to after World War Two. You know, so again

459
00:32:29,680 --> 00:32:34,559
it's like where where where this supposedly like rapidly progressive

460
00:32:34,599 --> 00:32:38,559
California come from. I mean one day it appeared spontaneously

461
00:32:38,680 --> 00:32:40,839
in the seventies. I mean, that's that's not other things work.

462
00:32:44,119 --> 00:32:52,079
But the key to this stuff too, for context, it

463
00:32:52,200 --> 00:32:56,240
was the presidential election of eighteen forty four, and this

464
00:32:56,480 --> 00:32:58,799
was this was key to kind of how the battle

465
00:32:58,839 --> 00:33:01,480
lines ended up being droven on in in the war

466
00:33:01,559 --> 00:33:07,319
between the States, as well as California's potegal culture. Polk

467
00:33:08,279 --> 00:33:12,119
ran as again as a as a Jacksonian Democrat against

468
00:33:12,160 --> 00:33:17,079
Henry Clay, who's the Whig candidate. And it's important at

469
00:33:17,119 --> 00:33:19,359
the end of the Whigs were because the Whigs became

470
00:33:19,440 --> 00:33:22,119
the Republican Party, okay, like the new Whigs, and that

471
00:33:22,359 --> 00:33:25,599
the difference between the old Whigs of you know, the

472
00:33:27,759 --> 00:33:30,920
the Revolutionary War era, you know, and and the guys

473
00:33:30,920 --> 00:33:33,680
who called themselves the Whig Party of the mid nineteenth century,

474
00:33:36,200 --> 00:33:38,440
between the between the eighteen thirty eight and fifties, like

475
00:33:38,519 --> 00:33:41,960
they were like they they were, they were one half

476
00:33:42,039 --> 00:33:46,160
of this was called the second party system. Okay. And

477
00:33:46,359 --> 00:33:51,000
for presidents uh ran on on the Whig ticket is Way,

478
00:33:51,119 --> 00:33:58,680
Henry Harrison, John Tyler, Zachary Taylor, and Willard Fillmore, Daniel Webster,

479
00:33:59,359 --> 00:34:03,920
rufus Chow, William Seward, John Quincy Adams, Henry Clay like

480
00:34:04,000 --> 00:34:08,519
these these were these were also like their most prominent

481
00:34:09,840 --> 00:34:16,320
standard bearers, but the way basic support. Again they were entrepreneurs,

482
00:34:16,400 --> 00:34:24,280
They professional people, hardcore Protestants, particularly Evangelicals who disproportionately settled

483
00:34:24,320 --> 00:34:28,880
California and the urban middle class. Uh it had almost

484
00:34:28,960 --> 00:34:34,199
no backing from unskilled laborers and poor farmers and even

485
00:34:34,280 --> 00:34:39,119
guys even like agribusiness types in those days.

486
00:34:39,599 --> 00:34:39,760
Speaker 1: You know.

487
00:34:39,880 --> 00:34:43,920
Speaker 2: So this again, this this was and they basically uh,

488
00:34:45,679 --> 00:34:48,159
they had they at the time, they'd claimed that they

489
00:34:48,199 --> 00:34:50,960
were like the descendants, like the Hamiltonians. They'd say that,

490
00:34:51,039 --> 00:34:53,320
like we're like the Federalists. You know that this is

491
00:34:53,400 --> 00:34:58,920
the day one Republican Party, okay, for all practical purposes,

492
00:35:00,000 --> 00:35:05,559
and they viewed California as essential to a lot of

493
00:35:05,639 --> 00:35:09,119
their ambitions, you know, when aside from the fact that

494
00:35:10,320 --> 00:35:14,199
you know, again they had what we consider white nationalists sensibilities,

495
00:35:14,960 --> 00:35:18,920
like they viewed they viewed the Confederate cause, and some

496
00:35:19,039 --> 00:35:21,320
of these they were in is like holding back the country.

497
00:35:22,480 --> 00:35:27,639
You know, something that's also lost in this shuffle. You know,

498
00:35:27,800 --> 00:35:34,360
until until after World War Two, Republicans were high protectionists,

499
00:35:34,960 --> 00:35:37,800
you know, and the Whigs believed in that high protectionism.

500
00:35:38,559 --> 00:35:42,039
You know, they wanted to jealously guard American domestic markets,

501
00:35:42,039 --> 00:35:45,119
and they wanted they wanted to protect and subsidize American industry.

502
00:35:45,599 --> 00:35:48,519
It was the Suns who were the free traders, you know,

503
00:35:49,480 --> 00:35:54,760
as anybody who's like, if you're if your economy is

504
00:35:54,800 --> 00:35:59,960
dependent on what amounts to like a one crop paradigm

505
00:36:01,000 --> 00:36:05,079
figuratively or literally, you know, as the Confederacy did, like

506
00:36:05,199 --> 00:36:07,719
you're like, you're you're going to be a free trader

507
00:36:07,760 --> 00:36:13,280
of a sort, okay, but this, you know, I this

508
00:36:13,440 --> 00:36:19,360
is important because I've run across people, including guys like

509
00:36:19,440 --> 00:36:21,400
Paul Johnson, who in some ways is the good His

510
00:36:21,480 --> 00:36:24,280
story in in other ways. He he seems they have

511
00:36:24,360 --> 00:36:27,360
real blind spots. You know, he's if you read like

512
00:36:27,480 --> 00:36:30,119
his History of the American People, which is kind of

513
00:36:30,199 --> 00:36:35,239
like his rebuttal to Howard's in ridiculous, you know, garbage,

514
00:36:36,280 --> 00:36:38,280
but in some way that's a good book. But then

515
00:36:38,360 --> 00:36:41,960
he like he'll talk about the subject before us today

516
00:36:42,000 --> 00:36:44,280
it'll be like, oh, well after after, after that, we're

517
00:36:44,400 --> 00:36:47,159
in the States. You know, the Republicans became progressive. It's

518
00:36:47,199 --> 00:36:49,159
like that that didn't happen. What are you talking what

519
00:36:49,239 --> 00:36:51,719
are you? What are you talking about? You know, it's

520
00:36:53,039 --> 00:36:55,360
I think it's one part ignorance, one part people's taking

521
00:36:55,440 --> 00:36:58,920
out face value. And maybe people just don't like outside

522
00:36:58,960 --> 00:37:02,119
the culture, like don't stand like if you're I'm not

523
00:37:02,199 --> 00:37:04,320
like I don't shade to anybody, but if people were

524
00:37:04,440 --> 00:37:08,800
like a immigrants, recent immigrant stock, or like people don't

525
00:37:08,800 --> 00:37:12,239
really understand like the center of Protestanism from within, they

526
00:37:12,239 --> 00:37:14,800
don't really understand what I'm talking about, like a gut level,

527
00:37:14,880 --> 00:37:17,400
and like why some of these claims are ridiculous. I

528
00:37:17,440 --> 00:37:22,159
think that's part of it. But you know, mother things too,

529
00:37:22,280 --> 00:37:27,480
and this is key people like polk Uh like manifest destiny,

530
00:37:27,599 --> 00:37:30,760
it wasn't it's like like Mother Jones types, like I said, oh,

531
00:37:30,840 --> 00:37:33,159
manifest destiny. You know, this this this, this is an

532
00:37:33,239 --> 00:37:37,320
example of you know, white white paternalism and imperialism. Like

533
00:37:37,400 --> 00:37:41,039
manifest destiny was an actual policy orientation. It wasn't just

534
00:37:41,199 --> 00:37:48,760
some it was. It wasn't like abstract conceptual phenomenon or

535
00:37:48,920 --> 00:37:51,960
like some sort of election year slogan. You know. It

536
00:37:52,280 --> 00:37:55,480
was literally like we are going to we're going to

537
00:37:55,639 --> 00:37:58,719
murk the Spanish Empire and everybody else in this hemisphere.

538
00:37:59,519 --> 00:38:02,440
We are going to conquer the entirety of what used

539
00:38:02,440 --> 00:38:05,639
to be Spanish America, like we're going to become you know,

540
00:38:05,880 --> 00:38:10,559
essentially like the overlords of the Americas. That's what it was.

541
00:38:11,519 --> 00:38:16,840
And the Whigs were die hard against that, you know,

542
00:38:18,239 --> 00:38:20,400
and this was a real dividing line between them and

543
00:38:20,440 --> 00:38:26,480
the Jacksonians, you know, because that kind of thing, like

544
00:38:26,840 --> 00:38:30,480
perpetual war for perpetual peace is always banned for business,

545
00:38:30,679 --> 00:38:36,079
like we've talked about before. That's why economic explanations for

546
00:38:36,159 --> 00:38:41,320
warfare never make any sense. But it's also if your

547
00:38:41,360 --> 00:38:46,360
whole notion is, you know, bringing the capital base of

548
00:38:46,440 --> 00:38:52,360
America into the looming twentieth century, like you can't have

549
00:38:52,400 --> 00:38:55,679
the public proffers being plundered by a bunch of Southern

550
00:38:55,800 --> 00:38:59,079
generals who want to live as Cardillos by conquering Guatemala,

551
00:38:59,400 --> 00:39:06,920
Like you can't have it, you know. And uh, this

552
00:39:07,119 --> 00:39:10,639
was a real this is a real clash of uh

553
00:39:11,639 --> 00:39:18,320
of values and an ideologies at a conceptual level, you know.

554
00:39:21,079 --> 00:39:26,960
And plus two, I mean, if you're an emission of

555
00:39:27,039 --> 00:39:31,599
conquests and policy terms, I mean, that's that's that's gonna

556
00:39:31,679 --> 00:39:35,199
lead to a kind of globalism, you know. And and

557
00:39:35,440 --> 00:39:38,559
and there's always gonna be some kind of essential market

558
00:39:38,599 --> 00:39:43,360
integration there, even if it's you know, not in like

559
00:39:43,400 --> 00:39:45,760
the neoliberal sense of what we view as you know,

560
00:39:45,960 --> 00:39:48,039
free trade, which isn't really free trade, you know what

561
00:39:48,119 --> 00:39:54,280
I mean. You know, if if your model for prosperity,

562
00:39:54,960 --> 00:39:58,599
as was the that of the Whigs and and the

563
00:39:58,800 --> 00:40:05,119
Republican the sentence was, you know, came in with the

564
00:40:05,159 --> 00:40:10,960
American system, it's uh, you know again it's it's based

565
00:40:11,000 --> 00:40:16,000
on protective tariffs, you know, high protectionism, federal subsidies for

566
00:40:16,079 --> 00:40:19,360
the constructive infrastructure, you know, kind of like the Japanese

567
00:40:19,400 --> 00:40:22,400
system is, and the German system was until until America

568
00:40:22,519 --> 00:40:27,880
destroyed it. Support for national banking. And obviously this was

569
00:40:27,960 --> 00:40:31,719
something that you know, like like horrified the Jacksonians. You know,

570
00:40:31,800 --> 00:40:35,039
they they viewed, they viewed banking as a way of

571
00:40:35,320 --> 00:40:43,639
uh robbing uh agrarians of of other other personally held capital.

572
00:40:45,159 --> 00:40:53,800
You know, modernization, meritocracy, law and order, checks on majority rule,

573
00:40:54,639 --> 00:40:59,000
you know, this stuff. All this stuff put them totally

574
00:40:59,079 --> 00:41:05,000
at odds with the with with the Jacksonian Democrats, you know,

575
00:41:05,119 --> 00:41:10,960
and that this was kind of the political crucible that

576
00:41:11,119 --> 00:41:20,440
created California's political culture. I mean arguably arguably the Whig

577
00:41:20,559 --> 00:41:23,360
Party of the of the of the mid nineteenth century.

578
00:41:23,719 --> 00:41:28,400
It literally emerged in opposition to Jackson and then later

579
00:41:28,559 --> 00:41:31,400
like the republic their Republican Party was like the committee

580
00:41:31,440 --> 00:41:35,719
to elect president like Abraham Lincoln for pragigal purposes. And

581
00:41:35,840 --> 00:41:39,519
if we accept that their Wig four bears were basically

582
00:41:39,719 --> 00:41:46,679
like the official opposition to Andrew Jackson, you know, the smaller,

583
00:41:48,760 --> 00:41:51,159
the smaller constellation of parties, you know what was called

584
00:41:51,159 --> 00:41:54,960
the National Republican Party, the Anti Masonic Party, which was

585
00:41:55,000 --> 00:41:59,480
a real thing. Uh disaffected Democratic Republicans, which is with

586
00:41:59,519 --> 00:42:05,000
the Democrat as used to call themselves. The Federalist Party,

587
00:42:05,159 --> 00:42:07,519
which was by then defunct as well as you know

588
00:42:07,639 --> 00:42:11,400
again like a not in substantial proportional like know nothing type,

589
00:42:12,239 --> 00:42:19,480
you know it. And that's important too, Like when we

590
00:42:19,599 --> 00:42:27,159
think of at least uh, like when when we think

591
00:42:27,199 --> 00:42:30,400
of like the American old right, like we're talking of

592
00:42:30,559 --> 00:42:33,320
these are the guys we're talking about, like when we're

593
00:42:33,360 --> 00:42:36,320
not talking about a much like neo Confederates, you know,

594
00:42:36,400 --> 00:42:38,679
like we're talking about a bunch of guys who basically

595
00:42:39,480 --> 00:42:44,760
we're uh, we're Hamiltonian nationalists, you know, and who were

596
00:42:44,880 --> 00:42:49,800
like opposed to you know, Jeffersonian sensibilities, guys like the spies,

597
00:42:50,039 --> 00:42:54,199
you know, like Jacksonian populism, you know, and and and

598
00:42:54,960 --> 00:42:58,239
and and who are basically you know, like white nationalists,

599
00:42:58,280 --> 00:43:01,400
despite like falling like solidly into like you know, the

600
00:43:01,599 --> 00:43:10,880
Union camp as it existed, uh, you know during the

601
00:43:11,000 --> 00:43:13,039
post war years, you know, like the guy w's when

602
00:43:13,079 --> 00:43:17,800
hard demandel after the failed impeachment of Johnson and the things.

603
00:43:17,840 --> 00:43:22,480
You know, this is really interesting and it you know,

604
00:43:22,639 --> 00:43:27,360
this is uh again, this is this is the foundation

605
00:43:27,559 --> 00:43:32,400
of this is the foundation of California's political culture, you know.

606
00:43:33,119 --> 00:43:38,519
And I wanna how long are we been going for? Yeah?

607
00:43:38,519 --> 00:43:39,960
I want to get a little bit into like the

608
00:43:40,079 --> 00:43:43,719
war between the states, like in and how that impacted California,

609
00:43:43,880 --> 00:43:48,000
like with the time we got left. Let me let

610
00:43:48,039 --> 00:43:55,880
me see where I'm at here. A yeah, a key

611
00:43:55,960 --> 00:44:00,199
to this too, you know. After the Treaty of Headlo,

612
00:44:00,360 --> 00:44:04,639
this is a this is there's people who dropped like

613
00:44:04,719 --> 00:44:13,679
conspira almost conspiratorial uh narratives about this. But the Treaty

614
00:44:13,760 --> 00:44:18,920
of Guade Blue Pandalago was ratified on February second, eighteen

615
00:44:19,000 --> 00:44:25,639
forty eight. You know, America absorbed California, you know, and uh,

616
00:44:26,400 --> 00:44:33,760
the remainder of of these this Mexican territory that became Arizona, Nevada, Colorado, Utah.

617
00:44:35,199 --> 00:44:39,679
But uh, literally a week before the formal annexation of

618
00:44:39,719 --> 00:44:43,639
the area, like massive gold reserves were discovered in California,

619
00:44:44,719 --> 00:44:47,400
you know, and then this and this legitimately happened Like

620
00:44:47,480 --> 00:44:52,159
it wasn't. This wasn't why like Triste uh proceeded the

621
00:44:52,159 --> 00:44:55,480
way he did. Polk didn't know about this, Like like

622
00:44:55,599 --> 00:45:02,000
nobody knew about this. Okay. This totally altered the state's

623
00:45:02,039 --> 00:45:05,960
demographics and finances. So there was like a massive influx

624
00:45:06,280 --> 00:45:12,880
of people in California, you know, not just not not

625
00:45:13,039 --> 00:45:15,199
just a bunch of not not just a bunch of

626
00:45:15,280 --> 00:45:18,719
guys from you know, back east, you know, and like

627
00:45:18,800 --> 00:45:22,599
what's now the Midwest and what was uh and and

628
00:45:23,000 --> 00:45:25,679
what wasn't is the South. We had like a bunch

629
00:45:25,679 --> 00:45:28,199
of immigrant populations show up there. You know, you have

630
00:45:28,280 --> 00:45:30,239
a bunch of like Europeans, you know, you had a

631
00:45:30,280 --> 00:45:33,360
bunch of Asians you've been trickling in, like especially Chinese.

632
00:45:34,320 --> 00:45:38,280
This caused real problems, okay. And this caused, uh, like

633
00:45:38,360 --> 00:45:42,239
among other things, it caused like a massive backlash against

634
00:45:42,280 --> 00:45:45,239
non white immigration, you know. And again this is one

635
00:45:45,239 --> 00:45:48,480
of the founding aspects of California is we do not

636
00:45:48,639 --> 00:45:50,000
want non white immigrants here.

637
00:45:50,800 --> 00:45:50,960
Speaker 1: You know.

638
00:45:51,079 --> 00:45:53,760
Speaker 2: This is not New York, this is not Chicago. We

639
00:45:53,960 --> 00:46:00,480
do not want this, you know, for like just just

640
00:46:00,559 --> 00:46:05,760
for just understand, like the scale of this. Between between

641
00:46:05,800 --> 00:46:09,159
the time of annexation in eight and forty eight and

642
00:46:09,239 --> 00:46:12,559
eighteen seventy, the population of San Francisco and the day

643
00:46:12,559 --> 00:46:15,519
of annexation was was around five hundred people. By eighteen

644
00:46:15,559 --> 00:46:18,800
seventy it was one hundred and fifty thousand, you know,

645
00:46:18,880 --> 00:46:22,280
since this was unprecedented, okay, you know, and this and

646
00:46:22,360 --> 00:46:29,559
this idea that people were happy about, you know, a

647
00:46:29,639 --> 00:46:32,960
bunch of like like you know, alien element. It's like

648
00:46:33,000 --> 00:46:35,440
streaming in there and that just like streaming in there,

649
00:46:35,480 --> 00:46:38,039
but to like try and extract goal that they viewed

650
00:46:38,079 --> 00:46:41,599
as theirs. I mean this people were really really really

651
00:46:41,719 --> 00:46:49,079
mad you know at and this also California then obviously

652
00:46:49,599 --> 00:46:54,320
as tensions, you know, during the Buchanan administration, you know,

653
00:46:54,400 --> 00:46:56,280
if you can was it, I think you can was

654
00:46:56,280 --> 00:46:58,599
probably the worst president we've ever had other than Biden.

655
00:46:58,719 --> 00:47:01,039
I mean, like Biden is king shithead and he will

656
00:47:01,079 --> 00:47:05,639
like never be dethroned. But but Buchanan was a terrible president.

657
00:47:06,239 --> 00:47:09,559
And Buchanan was pretty openly gay, which is interesting too

658
00:47:09,760 --> 00:47:12,159
because like I mean, I think I think it's a

659
00:47:12,159 --> 00:47:15,840
combination of conceptual and literacy and just like nobody wants

660
00:47:15,880 --> 00:47:17,920
to claim him because he was a shit executive. But

661
00:47:18,880 --> 00:47:22,320
like I it's it's it's it's amazing how like how

662
00:47:22,440 --> 00:47:26,039
none of the like none of these simpletons uh in

663
00:47:26,159 --> 00:47:29,079
academ like they just say, pretend that wasn't the case

664
00:47:29,159 --> 00:47:31,719
or something, you know, Uh, But I find that kind

665
00:47:31,719 --> 00:47:37,880
of interesting when in any event, you know, even even

666
00:47:37,960 --> 00:47:41,679
early on it Becan's administration, it became clear that there

667
00:47:41,760 --> 00:47:44,800
there was gonna be some kind of crisis you know

668
00:47:44,880 --> 00:47:50,000
between north and South, and the Union had like eyes

669
00:47:50,119 --> 00:47:55,360
westward to California because it's like, okay, like these these gold,

670
00:47:55,719 --> 00:47:57,679
this gold we're pulling out of the ground, is is

671
00:47:57,800 --> 00:48:00,760
gonna is what's gonna like fun like our war chest.

672
00:48:01,760 --> 00:48:06,760
You know. So California took on this outsized importance, you know,

673
00:48:09,480 --> 00:48:15,639
and California court history suggests that there was like this

674
00:48:15,920 --> 00:48:21,679
massive like volunteers from uh west of the Rockies to

675
00:48:21,800 --> 00:48:24,480
fight for the Union. That's really not true. Like there

676
00:48:24,519 --> 00:48:32,440
were some but you know Democrats from inception again Jacksonian Democrats.

677
00:48:32,800 --> 00:48:39,199
They dominated California like from inception from day one. The

678
00:48:39,320 --> 00:48:45,440
issue was though that uh Southern Democrats were a minority

679
00:48:45,800 --> 00:48:48,400
in the state. I mean, they weren't like a small minority.

680
00:48:48,440 --> 00:48:53,440
They were probably like fort you know of the of

681
00:48:53,519 --> 00:48:58,679
the Jacksonian element, but they were the minority. And Northern

682
00:48:58,719 --> 00:49:02,280
Democrats they generally they either like typically back the Union

683
00:49:02,400 --> 00:49:06,239
or they were like neutral, you know. So this this divided, uh,

684
00:49:07,599 --> 00:49:15,440
this divided the Jacksonian vote. And this basically this this

685
00:49:15,559 --> 00:49:18,760
is what basically like handed California to the to the

686
00:49:18,840 --> 00:49:22,960
whigs of slash Republicans who then like reigned for all time,

687
00:49:23,719 --> 00:49:26,239
you know, until literally one day he was declared that

688
00:49:26,559 --> 00:49:29,559
this is no longer the political culture. You know. And

689
00:49:29,679 --> 00:49:32,679
for clarity to like California didn't quote go purple. It

690
00:49:32,760 --> 00:49:35,840
wasn't this like phase where it's like, Okay, things are changing,

691
00:49:36,719 --> 00:49:40,480
you know, uh, preferences are changing, you know, the Democrats

692
00:49:40,519 --> 00:49:43,000
and generationally it was literally like one day, it's just

693
00:49:43,119 --> 00:49:49,800
this is how it is, you know, for context, uh,

694
00:49:53,320 --> 00:49:55,920
for contacts. Yeah, all those Southern Democrats were a minority.

695
00:49:57,599 --> 00:50:02,719
They were a majority in Tulane County, San Joaquin, Santa Clara, Monterey,

696
00:50:03,119 --> 00:50:07,039
and in San Francisco and San Francisco. In the eighteen fifties,

697
00:50:07,039 --> 00:50:11,960
they had a succession of mayors who were removed either

698
00:50:12,039 --> 00:50:15,559
on trumped up charges or in substance of charges of corruption.

699
00:50:17,320 --> 00:50:20,360
They had huge problems. It was called the vigilance committees,

700
00:50:20,760 --> 00:50:23,360
like literally like vigilantism, who said, like, you know, we're

701
00:50:23,400 --> 00:50:27,119
not we're we're not going to abide the mandates of

702
00:50:28,679 --> 00:50:32,079
or the mayoral office or the sheriff, you know, whether

703
00:50:32,119 --> 00:50:35,639
it's on you know, no matter no matter what the

704
00:50:35,760 --> 00:50:37,159
issue is, you know, Like it was it was a

705
00:50:37,280 --> 00:50:43,239
kind of a. It was the kind of gangsterism people

706
00:50:43,320 --> 00:50:47,519
associate with, uh with New York City and the era,

707
00:50:47,679 --> 00:50:50,119
but it wasn't being guided by some equivalent in Tammany Hall.

708
00:50:50,199 --> 00:50:53,239
It was just like guys like you know, at street level,

709
00:50:53,559 --> 00:50:56,880
like basically like making themselves like a power into themselves.

710
00:50:56,960 --> 00:51:02,960
It's crazy, but you know it was. Uh. It was

711
00:51:04,079 --> 00:51:07,920
like like San Francisco was uh was the outlier. But again,

712
00:51:08,039 --> 00:51:11,280
like the way they were the outlier was because they

713
00:51:11,320 --> 00:51:13,000
were they were a bunch of they were a bunch

714
00:51:13,039 --> 00:51:15,639
of like redneck as Jacksonians. They weren't like an outlier

715
00:51:15,760 --> 00:51:18,159
because they're like, oh, we're a bunch of progressives and

716
00:51:18,199 --> 00:51:20,000
we don't you know, we're not keen to this kind

717
00:51:20,039 --> 00:51:23,400
of like these uptight wigs you know, trying to like

718
00:51:23,480 --> 00:51:26,159
impose their will on us. So that's I don't know

719
00:51:26,159 --> 00:51:28,199
what I mean wrong. Like San Francisco is a repository

720
00:51:28,280 --> 00:51:30,719
of ship and it is full of like it is

721
00:51:30,760 --> 00:51:34,159
felt like degenerates and like some humans and ship like today,

722
00:51:34,239 --> 00:51:36,000
like it absolutely is Like I'm not saying that's not

723
00:51:36,079 --> 00:51:38,679
the case, but it's like my my point was that

724
00:51:39,840 --> 00:51:43,159
you know, if if people are looking for like deep

725
00:51:43,400 --> 00:51:45,440
roots and the stroke of record ing for that, like

726
00:51:45,480 --> 00:51:49,960
they're not there, Like what happened to San Francisco is

727
00:51:50,119 --> 00:51:53,760
a it's like a port town, I think, I think

728
00:51:53,840 --> 00:51:59,719
frankly like the the like warm permanent war mobilization and

729
00:51:59,800 --> 00:52:03,400
then like really fucked it up, you know, because that's

730
00:52:03,480 --> 00:52:07,119
that never ends well for a community that becomes a

731
00:52:07,760 --> 00:52:11,199
you know, a hub of a of military basing. Like

732
00:52:11,239 --> 00:52:13,519
I'm not I'm not trashing service people, but that's just

733
00:52:13,559 --> 00:52:20,239
a fact. But that uh but that this dynamic between

734
00:52:20,480 --> 00:52:25,480
uh northern and southern Democrats in California, that's what allowed

735
00:52:25,519 --> 00:52:28,000
Lincoln to carry the state. Albeit he carried it by

736
00:52:28,039 --> 00:52:34,079
a very slim margin, but he was uh But but

737
00:52:34,239 --> 00:52:39,719
unlike most unlike most, like non slave holding states like

738
00:52:40,000 --> 00:52:42,239
uh Land didn't win a wrong He didn't win out

739
00:52:42,280 --> 00:52:45,679
my right majority. He won California by plurality, which is

740
00:52:46,320 --> 00:52:55,840
highly significant. But this uh but, following their admission to

741
00:52:55,960 --> 00:53:01,599
the Union, these tensions UH created uh. I mean, they

742
00:53:01,679 --> 00:53:10,320
they created a real popsibility of uh of parts of California.

743
00:53:10,360 --> 00:53:12,960
They're trying to achieve a separate statehood. They're trying to

744
00:53:13,039 --> 00:53:19,559
secede altogether. You know, there's there's a number of attempts

745
00:53:19,599 --> 00:53:22,840
in the eighteen fifties, and I none of which came

746
00:53:22,920 --> 00:53:26,880
to like open combinate at scale, but I mean they

747
00:53:26,920 --> 00:53:30,159
were they. I mean it was a serious thing. And

748
00:53:32,000 --> 00:53:35,360
in eighteen fifty nine the last there's pass was called

749
00:53:35,360 --> 00:53:38,920
the Peico Act, and it was it was passed by

750
00:53:38,960 --> 00:53:44,800
the California state legislature and it was signed by Governor Weller,

751
00:53:45,320 --> 00:53:52,639
Jerry B. Weller. It proposed a territory of Colorado, which

752
00:53:52,679 --> 00:54:00,159
would basically include uh, you know, northern California, part to

753
00:54:00,199 --> 00:54:06,519
southern California, parts of Colorado, and parts of Oregon as

754
00:54:06,679 --> 00:54:12,039
uh it is essentially like its own, its own territory

755
00:54:12,239 --> 00:54:15,280
that you know, did not have formal status as a state,

756
00:54:15,480 --> 00:54:18,440
but did you know, have like some rights at law,

757
00:54:18,559 --> 00:54:20,400
but that the federal government would have had like no

758
00:54:20,599 --> 00:54:23,360
power over a way like the Commerce Clause or anything else.

759
00:54:24,320 --> 00:54:30,679
You know. Senator Milton Latham was a strong advocate of it.

760
00:54:30,800 --> 00:54:35,559
So this had legs. Okay, What tanked it was, uh

761
00:54:36,039 --> 00:54:39,840
the secession crisis following the election of Lincoln. And when

762
00:54:39,880 --> 00:54:48,400
it became clear like what was underway, Lathan and the people,

763
00:54:48,559 --> 00:54:51,639
uh like the real persons behind it realized like, well,

764
00:54:51,760 --> 00:54:54,880
we really want to get lumped in with, you know,

765
00:54:54,960 --> 00:54:58,239
the Confederate secessionists, and you know, before we know it,

766
00:54:58,320 --> 00:55:02,159
we're gonna we're gonna find themselves like you know, down

767
00:55:02,320 --> 00:55:11,000
range of of Union guns. But that didn't that didn't stop, uh,

768
00:55:12,400 --> 00:55:19,440
the San Francisco Jacksonians though, months later, at the beginning

769
00:55:19,440 --> 00:55:22,880
of eighteen sixty one, you know, as the actual secession

770
00:55:22,960 --> 00:55:29,079
crisis set in visa visa South, the San Francisco Secession is,

771
00:55:30,719 --> 00:55:37,000
they tried to separate California, Oregon from the Union. Like

772
00:55:37,079 --> 00:55:40,960
they wanted to do this forcibly and carve out what

773
00:55:41,079 --> 00:55:46,280
they called the Pacific Republic. And this was one of

774
00:55:46,360 --> 00:55:49,199
the reasons this kind of sensibility had been floated before.

775
00:55:49,280 --> 00:55:52,679
And that's one of the reasons why Oregon had their

776
00:55:54,440 --> 00:56:00,199
like a highly like racialized code of laws. Because I

777
00:56:00,360 --> 00:56:04,360
believe even among the I mean, I mean, I don't

778
00:56:04,400 --> 00:56:06,679
I don't believe, I know, I mean, even among the

779
00:56:06,920 --> 00:56:11,639
mainstream playbo establishment, there was sympathy for these kinds of propositions.

780
00:56:12,280 --> 00:56:15,760
But they were they were willing to become strange bedfellows

781
00:56:15,840 --> 00:56:19,559
with these like Jacksonian Confederate types in San Francisco, but

782
00:56:19,679 --> 00:56:21,840
they were not going to allow we're going to become

783
00:56:21,920 --> 00:56:24,159
like a slave state that was then like flooded with

784
00:56:24,440 --> 00:56:28,960
uh you know, like blacks in bondage or otherwise, and

785
00:56:29,360 --> 00:56:31,599
all the what they received is like these pathologies that

786
00:56:32,480 --> 00:56:37,320
you know characterized them the South. So this is this

787
00:56:37,480 --> 00:56:42,239
is really uh, this is this is really interesting, I think,

788
00:56:42,360 --> 00:56:49,079
and and and really important. Like I hope, uh, we

789
00:56:49,199 --> 00:56:53,559
will We're coming up on the hour, man, I'll uh,

790
00:56:54,719 --> 00:56:57,360
I'll get into the nuts and bolts of uh, because

791
00:56:57,360 --> 00:57:00,320
I'm sure what people want really is of like the

792
00:57:00,400 --> 00:57:05,039
hard and fast data relating to electoral patterns like in

793
00:57:05,079 --> 00:57:07,840
the twentieth century to the present. I'll get into that

794
00:57:08,000 --> 00:57:12,280
next time. I just this was this was an important background,

795
00:57:12,320 --> 00:57:14,000
I think. So I hope people wouldn't find it boring.

796
00:57:15,960 --> 00:57:20,199
Speaker 1: No, I think the history. I think most people just

797
00:57:20,280 --> 00:57:23,000
don't know the history of like the West, and you know,

798
00:57:23,119 --> 00:57:25,840
they know, oh gold Rush and everything. Yeah, yeah, yeah,

799
00:57:26,639 --> 00:57:29,880
get getting deep into it. You know, people don't know.

800
00:57:30,559 --> 00:57:30,719
Speaker 2: You know.

801
00:57:30,920 --> 00:57:34,239
Speaker 1: While you were talking, I was like remembering that like

802
00:57:34,360 --> 00:57:37,920
as late as like nineteen seventy nine, it was illegal

803
00:57:38,079 --> 00:57:41,000
for like a gay person to be a public school

804
00:57:41,079 --> 00:57:43,760
teacher in California.

805
00:57:44,360 --> 00:57:47,840
Speaker 2: Yeah, and even even in Illinois. Like people here are

806
00:57:47,880 --> 00:57:50,280
pretty despite we're seeing the news, people here are pretty

807
00:57:50,400 --> 00:57:53,280
like socially conservative. We didn't have any laws like that,

808
00:57:54,239 --> 00:57:57,719
but like California did wild supposedly either, like the liberal heartland.

809
00:57:58,039 --> 00:58:01,199
Like this doesn't make any sense, you know, and it's like,

810
00:58:01,440 --> 00:58:07,159
uh the uh yeah, you know. And it what's like

811
00:58:07,280 --> 00:58:09,800
my friend Anthony, I mean you know Anthony, Yeah, I

812
00:58:09,840 --> 00:58:12,719
mean like he Anthony Romonto. Yeah, what's like he if

813
00:58:12,760 --> 00:58:15,519
he and I become pretty good, pretty good buds, and

814
00:58:16,519 --> 00:58:18,719
he was nice enough to take us, me and him

815
00:58:18,760 --> 00:58:22,079
not to eat in Portland, you know. And he, I mean,

816
00:58:22,119 --> 00:58:25,519
he grew up in LA. He's about your age if

817
00:58:25,599 --> 00:58:26,800
he was the one in me. He grew up in

818
00:58:26,960 --> 00:58:30,119
LA in the seventies and eighties, you know. And he's like,

819
00:58:30,920 --> 00:58:34,119
it was massively segregated. And that's like what I remember

820
00:58:34,280 --> 00:58:36,360
like a little later, you know, like the early to

821
00:58:36,440 --> 00:58:40,800
mid eighties, Like it was it was massively segregated, you know,

822
00:58:41,639 --> 00:58:43,840
even by and I'm and I'm from Chicago, and it's

823
00:58:43,880 --> 00:58:46,599
like this jumped out at me. You know, it's like

824
00:58:47,400 --> 00:58:53,119
it's crazy that what people suggest. It's sort of the

825
00:58:54,400 --> 00:58:57,079
like in in its cultural DNA, you know, and what

826
00:58:57,760 --> 00:59:00,480
it's this idea that oh no, you know, it's this

827
00:59:00,639 --> 00:59:03,920
kind of permanent uh that you know that the Democrats

828
00:59:03,960 --> 00:59:06,199
are just the ruling party in California because that's how

829
00:59:06,239 --> 00:59:09,599
it is. That's not how it is, that not at all.

830
00:59:10,239 --> 00:59:13,559
But yeah, well I'll, I mean, I'm already coding the

831
00:59:13,679 --> 00:59:17,679
data for to properly discuss, you know, the next kind

832
00:59:17,679 --> 00:59:19,760
of aspect of this. So yeah, well, I don't know

833
00:59:19,760 --> 00:59:21,559
how you want to play it moving forward. I mean,

834
00:59:21,639 --> 00:59:27,079
I'm I'm obviously on Friday, my dad there, We're gonna

835
00:59:27,199 --> 00:59:31,440
observe Thanksgiving on Friday, probably, I mean not probably, definitely,

836
00:59:31,559 --> 00:59:33,320
Like that's when I was gonna cook a turkey, but

837
00:59:34,599 --> 00:59:38,840
I I got reservations at at a really good restaurant.

838
00:59:40,039 --> 00:59:43,199
But because it may like other than other than that,

839
00:59:43,440 --> 00:59:45,719
we can. I'm ready to go any time this week

840
00:59:45,840 --> 00:59:48,159
even if yeah, okay, yeah, so.

841
00:59:50,519 --> 00:59:54,559
Speaker 1: Yeah do you plugs and yeah, well isn't it?

842
00:59:55,199 --> 00:59:57,639
Speaker 2: Yeah? For sure? Man. The best place to find me

843
00:59:57,840 --> 01:00:01,440
is on substick. It's real on this seven seven seven

844
01:00:01,480 --> 01:00:04,599
dot subsec dot com. I'm trying to throw more free

845
01:00:04,679 --> 01:00:08,760
content up there, you know, especially more like video content

846
01:00:08,840 --> 01:00:12,079
and stuff. You can always find me on my website.

847
01:00:12,760 --> 01:00:16,320
Which has a newsfeed, so whenever I upload anything new

848
01:00:16,440 --> 01:00:19,920
like it pops up there regardless that we're it's it's

849
01:00:20,039 --> 01:00:23,519
just number seven h O AS seven seven seven dot com.

850
01:00:24,480 --> 01:00:29,199
I'm on social media at Capital R E A L

851
01:00:29,840 --> 01:00:34,440
underscore number seven h O M A S seven seven

852
01:00:34,519 --> 01:00:37,400
seven dot com. Like you go to my website, you'll

853
01:00:37,400 --> 01:00:41,079
find my Instagram and like other shit I'm into on

854
01:00:41,239 --> 01:00:45,360
Telegram as well. I got like a Mersed brand and uh,

855
01:00:45,559 --> 01:00:47,800
we just drop some like winter hats and stuff. So

856
01:00:48,679 --> 01:00:50,920
if you want, like, if you want like winter gear,

857
01:00:51,079 --> 01:00:54,480
like we have that now. So if I can, if

858
01:00:54,519 --> 01:00:59,000
I can be a show, like, I recommend you buy

859
01:00:59,159 --> 01:00:59,960
one of our winter.

860
01:01:01,719 --> 01:01:04,400
Speaker 1: Don't worry and I'll link to it as I always do.

861
01:01:04,880 --> 01:01:05,800
Speaker 2: Yeah, thanks great man.

862
01:01:06,039 --> 01:01:08,199
Speaker 1: Yeah, like appreciate it.

863
01:01:08,599 --> 01:01:08,800
Speaker 2: Yeah.

864
01:01:09,880 --> 01:01:12,320
Speaker 1: I want to welcome everyone back to the Pecanana Show.

865
01:01:13,199 --> 01:01:17,719
Thomas is here to to part two of our series

866
01:01:17,920 --> 01:01:21,440
on California. How are you doing, Thomas, I'm.

867
01:01:21,320 --> 01:01:27,679
Speaker 2: Doing well, repard to I'm going to continue discussing the

868
01:01:27,800 --> 01:01:33,320
sociological factors they created California and some of the historical

869
01:01:33,400 --> 01:01:36,760
imperatives that shape its potical culture. You know, they're in

870
01:01:36,800 --> 01:01:38,639
the final part. I'll get into some of the data

871
01:01:38,679 --> 01:01:46,920
I coded about you know, post war electioneering and things,

872
01:01:47,000 --> 01:01:50,280
and why the claim that's alleged about it being you know,

873
01:01:50,400 --> 01:01:55,280
a permanent blue state is cav I know that's kind

874
01:01:55,280 --> 01:01:57,360
of what people are waiting for. But this is important

875
01:01:58,360 --> 01:02:02,480
and for for not just for context, but you know,

876
01:02:02,519 --> 01:02:04,559
if you're like, you really gonna understand that California is

877
01:02:04,559 --> 01:02:07,519
an outside significance, not just because of the electoral votes

878
01:02:07,559 --> 01:02:13,559
that it holds. You know, John F. Kennedy. Kennedy's election

879
01:02:13,719 --> 01:02:15,559
was a really really big deal and it was far

880
01:02:15,639 --> 01:02:18,719
more significant than Leg Obama's election. I mean, Obama was

881
01:02:18,760 --> 01:02:21,280
like the equivalent of an industry plant anyway. It was

882
01:02:21,320 --> 01:02:23,760
a kind of a fake candidate, Like don't gonna be wrong,

883
01:02:23,840 --> 01:02:26,639
like Obama actually did of a ground organization. And Obama

884
01:02:26,880 --> 01:02:30,599
is like a very cunning campaigner, unlike unlike Missus Harris

885
01:02:30,639 --> 01:02:35,719
and unlike unlike President Shithead. You know, he like he

886
01:02:35,800 --> 01:02:38,280
wasn't like a totally fake candidate in that regard, but

887
01:02:39,679 --> 01:02:41,800
him being just this kind of like random immigrant guy

888
01:02:43,519 --> 01:02:47,119
who was you know, being promoted within the kind of

889
01:02:47,159 --> 01:02:50,400
broader narrative of wokeism. Like it's really not that remarkable,

890
01:02:51,159 --> 01:02:54,360
Like Kennedy, like this, this Irish Catholic guy being president

891
01:02:54,440 --> 01:02:56,639
in ninety sixty. That was that was a really big deal.

892
01:02:57,920 --> 01:03:01,159
But it's also what's no about that is that was

893
01:03:01,199 --> 01:03:04,280
like the last hurrah, like the East Coast establishment, unless

894
01:03:04,320 --> 01:03:07,519
you count the Bushes, and I really don't, because the

895
01:03:07,599 --> 01:03:11,880
Bush family really made their fortune in Texas, you know,

896
01:03:11,920 --> 01:03:15,239
and they they they've got like East Coast roots, but

897
01:03:15,320 --> 01:03:17,840
they're they're not part of like the East Coast establishment.

898
01:03:18,320 --> 01:03:21,599
And that really was the center of the political universe

899
01:03:21,599 --> 01:03:25,360
in America until the seventies. Man, and then after that,

900
01:03:26,599 --> 01:03:29,440
you know, there was Johnson and I you know, Johnson

901
01:03:29,480 --> 01:03:33,840
went down in Flames, and arguably in sixty four he

902
01:03:34,000 --> 01:03:40,559
was running against like a lame duck in gold Water,

903
01:03:41,079 --> 01:03:43,800
but the fact that he was on the ticket at

904
01:03:43,840 --> 01:03:48,079
all was significant because he was this Southern guy, you know,

905
01:03:48,519 --> 01:03:52,719
in post reconstruction, like the South, I mean, the South

906
01:03:52,880 --> 01:03:57,440
was never not significant in electoral college terms, but they've

907
01:03:57,480 --> 01:04:01,360
very much been like marginalized. But then so subsequently you

908
01:04:01,440 --> 01:04:04,840
get Nixon from California, you get Carter from the South,

909
01:04:05,079 --> 01:04:08,320
you get Reagan from California, you get Clinton from the South,

910
01:04:08,760 --> 01:04:11,880
you get Bush, who's a you know, like a text

911
01:04:12,000 --> 01:04:16,199
like a Southwest guy for all practical purposes, you know,

912
01:04:16,239 --> 01:04:18,840
it's the governor of Texas. You know, you get Clinton

913
01:04:18,920 --> 01:04:22,960
to the Southern guy like this, Like the Southwest became

914
01:04:23,119 --> 01:04:27,559
like the new like the center of the political universe. Okay,

915
01:04:28,079 --> 01:04:31,880
in California like started shooting ahead of New York. It's

916
01:04:31,960 --> 01:04:37,119
not just the most populous state, you know, but also

917
01:04:37,280 --> 01:04:40,719
kind of like the center of high tech, like the

918
01:04:41,280 --> 01:04:46,760
terrestrial economy during World War Two, Like people don't understand

919
01:04:46,800 --> 01:04:49,360
that agree to which there was this like like savage

920
01:04:49,440 --> 01:04:54,559
hostility to capitalism. And that's onely that capipal in Rooseveld

921
01:04:54,599 --> 01:04:57,440
and in power, and it wasn't just it wasn't as

922
01:04:57,519 --> 01:04:59,840
New dealer as you thought that way, like arguably other

923
01:04:59,840 --> 01:05:04,079
th the social engineering stuff, like Roosevelt basically appropriated Hewey

924
01:05:04,199 --> 01:05:09,239
Long's platform, you know, and and Long in the American context,

925
01:05:09,480 --> 01:05:12,239
longs that we'd consider like a radical right wing populist.

926
01:05:12,719 --> 01:05:15,599
I mean, like yeah, like he he was a socialist

927
01:05:15,679 --> 01:05:21,239
in terms of his like redistribute redistribution schemes, and it's

928
01:05:21,320 --> 01:05:24,480
like a state tech scheme. But that's the way everybody

929
01:05:24,599 --> 01:05:27,679
thought in the nineteen thirties. So I go to getting it.

930
01:05:27,719 --> 01:05:32,199
It's like a cross the entire spectrum. Like basically like

931
01:05:32,320 --> 01:05:35,320
would would characterize everybody's politics was like a hatred of

932
01:05:35,400 --> 01:05:39,079
big business and a hatred of Wall Street, like World

933
01:05:39,079 --> 01:05:42,960
War two kind of change that accidentally because Roosevelt obviously

934
01:05:43,119 --> 01:05:45,199
he had to go all in with like making nice

935
01:05:45,519 --> 01:05:49,880
not just with Wall Street, but also with these guys

936
01:05:49,920 --> 01:05:54,400
who you know, were at the helm of these of

937
01:05:54,480 --> 01:05:59,440
these terrestrial like valuated manufacturing firms, you know, particularly these

938
01:05:59,519 --> 01:06:03,199
nascent like aircraft firms, you know, and uh, people who

939
01:06:03,239 --> 01:06:05,000
are on the forest model to make you know, like

940
01:06:05,119 --> 01:06:07,880
war materials and these industries that could be converted you

941
01:06:07,960 --> 01:06:13,159
know to you know, to to wartech manufacturers and things.

942
01:06:13,960 --> 01:06:21,920
And this was this was centered in California, Okay, and subsequently,

943
01:06:22,760 --> 01:06:26,079
like California became kind of like the hyper capitalist like hub,

944
01:06:26,960 --> 01:06:30,199
you know. And I emphasize this not just because it's

945
01:06:30,239 --> 01:06:33,239
the key to understanding like California is important and it's powerful,

946
01:06:33,599 --> 01:06:35,760
and also why they kind of like after the Cold

947
01:06:35,840 --> 01:06:40,000
War and you know, and and and the subsequent like

948
01:06:40,400 --> 01:06:43,840
information revolution and the financialization of the economy, like the

949
01:06:43,880 --> 01:06:47,079
reason why California inherited that like high tech mantle, like

950
01:06:47,159 --> 01:06:49,239
for the reasons I said, So that's a get another

951
01:06:49,280 --> 01:06:52,159
reason why this idea that California is like just like

952
01:06:52,320 --> 01:06:57,159
rabidly socialist uh political culture like that cap like that

953
01:06:57,280 --> 01:07:01,519
that doesn't make any sense, you know, Like don't get

954
01:07:01,559 --> 01:07:04,440
me wrong, they're like the they're not just kidding about

955
01:07:04,960 --> 01:07:08,719
the you know, the taxation scheme and and then they're

956
01:07:08,800 --> 01:07:12,119
killing your capital base like like outright you know. But

957
01:07:12,239 --> 01:07:15,239
that that always to like what I'm getting at is

958
01:07:15,280 --> 01:07:18,000
that that's not organic, Okay, Like it's not it's not

959
01:07:18,079 --> 01:07:20,679
something that came from the bottom. And it's not because

960
01:07:20,719 --> 01:07:24,719
the California voters like slip like slew the perial Golden

961
01:07:24,800 --> 01:07:27,199
goose because they just like rose up one day and

962
01:07:27,199 --> 01:07:29,000
they're like, yeah, we're not going to tolerate this anymore.

963
01:07:29,119 --> 01:07:31,519
Like we you know, we want we want this absurd

964
01:07:31,679 --> 01:07:35,079
tax rate and and we we we hate McDonald douglas

965
01:07:35,159 --> 01:07:37,760
and we hate Silicon Valley like like none of it,

966
01:07:38,480 --> 01:07:41,400
you know, like it. I mean that that's we'll get

967
01:07:41,400 --> 01:07:43,039
into more of this in part three because some of

968
01:07:43,119 --> 01:07:45,960
that was two to like the the fibrication of the

969
01:07:46,119 --> 01:07:49,679
of you know, the managerial elite like from the high

970
01:07:49,760 --> 01:07:53,559
tech and manufacturing sector and that that was a huge thing.

971
01:07:53,679 --> 01:07:55,559
And like some of the people like Burnham didn't really

972
01:07:55,599 --> 01:07:59,679
foresee like Seawright Mills, He's probably a little he's probably

973
01:07:59,679 --> 01:08:03,079
a little left wing for some people's tastes. I think

974
01:08:03,119 --> 01:08:05,480
he was an important sociologist and in some ways I

975
01:08:05,519 --> 01:08:09,440
think he had inside Burnham didn't. But you know, Burnham

976
01:08:09,599 --> 01:08:12,079
and Burnham wasn't incorrect in is that. But really from

977
01:08:13,599 --> 01:08:15,480
really until the end of the Cold War, although by

978
01:08:15,519 --> 01:08:18,960
the close of the eighties, like this was changing. There

979
01:08:19,039 --> 01:08:24,079
there wasn't there was an integral aspect to the managerial state.

980
01:08:24,920 --> 01:08:28,479
You know, the guys who in policy planning were else

981
01:08:28,560 --> 01:08:32,520
the guys who you know worked for big companies in

982
01:08:33,239 --> 01:08:36,319
advisory roles or CEO roles, you know, like Reverend manicon

983
01:08:36,359 --> 01:08:39,560
Era was like the case in point. Okay, So there's

984
01:08:39,600 --> 01:08:41,800
this there's this kind of like rotation of elags from

985
01:08:41,800 --> 01:08:45,119
like the public to the private sector. And like applied

986
01:08:45,239 --> 01:08:49,760
technology was king in terms of what had clout as

987
01:08:49,800 --> 01:08:53,039
well as what you know, could could kind of compete

988
01:08:53,079 --> 01:08:56,479
for subsidies and things, you know, And it was it

989
01:08:56,560 --> 01:08:59,199
wasn't just it wasn't just defense contractors either. I mean,

990
01:08:59,239 --> 01:09:00,800
it was a general Now we used to be called

991
01:09:00,800 --> 01:09:05,600
like general technology firms, you know, telecom obviously, but slowly,

992
01:09:05,680 --> 01:09:10,960
with surely, you know, like political managers and private sector managers,

993
01:09:11,039 --> 01:09:14,479
they came like started coming from different places, you know,

994
01:09:14,600 --> 01:09:17,079
and and increasingly like there was less of this kind

995
01:09:17,079 --> 01:09:21,600
of like incestuous like cross pollination, you know, and then

996
01:09:21,640 --> 01:09:24,159
by the nineties it was kind of complete, you know,

997
01:09:24,159 --> 01:09:27,079
and that's not accidental either. Then suddenly like oh, California

998
01:09:27,159 --> 01:09:30,000
is no longer you know what it's been for one

999
01:09:30,079 --> 01:09:33,079
hundred and forty years, Like now it's you know, now

1000
01:09:33,239 --> 01:09:38,640
now it's this like radically progressive you know, kind of

1001
01:09:38,720 --> 01:09:42,560
kind of like socialist experiment that can never ever go

1002
01:09:42,680 --> 01:09:46,119
republican again. Like that's like like of emphasizing this stuff

1003
01:09:46,159 --> 01:09:51,560
to demonstrate why and kind of totality of circumstances terms

1004
01:09:52,039 --> 01:09:53,920
like what's the legs about it is not possible. But

1005
01:09:54,680 --> 01:09:58,159
we're going to continue first a bet on, you know,

1006
01:09:58,239 --> 01:10:00,159
in the same vein as in the first episode, and

1007
01:10:00,319 --> 01:10:02,239
that people seem to respond well to that. So I

1008
01:10:02,279 --> 01:10:05,640
don't think it's gonna bore them, but I mean it's important.

1009
01:10:05,800 --> 01:10:08,079
I'm not just you know, this isn't just like a

1010
01:10:08,199 --> 01:10:11,960
hobby of mine or something that they drop, you know,

1011
01:10:12,239 --> 01:10:14,960
factoid heavy nerdives or something like it's it's essential to

1012
01:10:15,840 --> 01:10:19,000
understanding kind of like my thesis. And we'll get into

1013
01:10:19,039 --> 01:10:25,159
that part three. But anyway, I think we left off

1014
01:10:25,239 --> 01:10:27,720
last time. We're talking about these guys like Winfield Scott

1015
01:10:27,920 --> 01:10:31,760
and Zachary Taylor and Jefferson Davis and the Mexican War

1016
01:10:31,920 --> 01:10:34,920
and how the Mexican War and President Polk who's an

1017
01:10:34,960 --> 01:10:38,079
underrated president. You know that this was kind of like

1018
01:10:38,159 --> 01:10:43,920
the day one experience of California, you know, and and

1019
01:10:44,159 --> 01:10:46,640
and there were there was a profoundly like economic imperative

1020
01:10:46,720 --> 01:10:51,560
behind California's capture. You know that that that wasn't the

1021
01:10:51,600 --> 01:10:54,199
whole story. You know, like there was like like we

1022
01:10:54,319 --> 01:10:57,600
talked about, I I've got nothing about love for the Confederacy.

1023
01:10:57,640 --> 01:11:00,039
I've got nothing about love for the South. And I

1024
01:11:00,079 --> 01:11:03,880
mean they're they're like my people, you know, like ethnic

1025
01:11:04,000 --> 01:11:08,239
and sectarian terms. But there was there was a very

1026
01:11:08,319 --> 01:11:12,520
thirsty element among them who who believed in manifest destiny. Okay,

1027
01:11:12,680 --> 01:11:16,039
like California was kind of the gateway to that, like

1028
01:11:16,199 --> 01:11:18,760
literally you know, because a lot of these guys they

1029
01:11:18,880 --> 01:11:23,000
wanted to essentially replace the Spaniards and and same themselves

1030
01:11:23,119 --> 01:11:26,159
kind of as as this as this boss element over

1031
01:11:26,239 --> 01:11:32,319
this formerly Spanish American slave empire. Like quite literally, that's

1032
01:11:32,359 --> 01:11:38,079
not some sort of dystopian Mother Joanes kind of narrative

1033
01:11:38,159 --> 01:11:41,439
or something like. That's true, not passing real judgment on

1034
01:11:41,520 --> 01:11:45,760
that that would have went a dysfunctional outcomes. But you know,

1035
01:11:45,920 --> 01:11:49,800
not not for not for reasons of a purely ethical

1036
01:11:49,920 --> 01:11:56,279
nature or anything like that. But you know, even before

1037
01:11:56,279 --> 01:11:58,039
the war, when the States kicked off, it kind of

1038
01:11:58,079 --> 01:12:00,479
became clear that that that wasn't gonna be abide it.

1039
01:12:00,560 --> 01:12:04,399
And then you know, the the California Golden Rush, I

1040
01:12:04,439 --> 01:12:05,680
think we got in. I think that's about where we

1041
01:12:05,760 --> 01:12:08,199
left off. The California Golden Rush, you know, change everything

1042
01:12:08,359 --> 01:12:10,800
and for all time. It meant that, you know, the

1043
01:12:10,920 --> 01:12:15,079
federal government was going to be deeply insinuated into into

1044
01:12:15,159 --> 01:12:19,119
California's fortunes and in terms of its infrastructural development, in

1045
01:12:19,239 --> 01:12:22,439
terms of its political assimilation, you know, like all of that.

1046
01:12:23,039 --> 01:12:27,199
It's so when the gold Rush, California was like fast

1047
01:12:27,279 --> 01:12:30,600
tracked for a lot of like nass and infrastructure, Okay,

1048
01:12:31,119 --> 01:12:35,640
from like the eighteen fifties until like really until like

1049
01:12:36,000 --> 01:12:44,079
the nineteen fifties and sixties. Okay, the uh there was

1050
01:12:44,119 --> 01:12:49,680
this there's this giant logistics firm and this guy named

1051
01:12:49,760 --> 01:12:53,880
John Butterfield. He got a federal contract to carry mail

1052
01:12:54,039 --> 01:12:58,159
overland from Memphis and Saint Louis, you know, which was

1053
01:12:58,239 --> 01:13:01,199
kind of the that's kind of like the westernmost frontier

1054
01:13:01,279 --> 01:13:04,119
of truly developed America, you know, like the South and

1055
01:13:04,159 --> 01:13:06,319
the like the near South and the Midwest, like near

1056
01:13:07,199 --> 01:13:11,520
near in Proxi terms where I am, and so like

1057
01:13:11,640 --> 01:13:14,960
twice a week, these uh, these stage coaches that had

1058
01:13:15,039 --> 01:13:18,680
run through Prestonal passed so Yuma to the Pacific coast,

1059
01:13:18,720 --> 01:13:22,039
and like he had paid, it would take twenty to

1060
01:13:22,199 --> 01:13:25,680
twenty five days, which was like rapid in those days.

1061
01:13:29,159 --> 01:13:33,399
The Russell Major and Woodell Company, they were another like

1062
01:13:33,640 --> 01:13:40,680
big logistics firm right before the Civil War. They they

1063
01:13:40,800 --> 01:13:43,479
carried something they had a fleet to something like six

1064
01:13:43,600 --> 01:13:52,000
thousand wagons and oxen like all told they were they

1065
01:13:52,000 --> 01:13:53,600
were all they were like a big rival to Pony

1066
01:13:53,680 --> 01:13:58,079
Express also, but eventually like they they kind of developed

1067
01:13:58,119 --> 01:13:59,920
their own like niche and and they were they were

1068
01:14:00,039 --> 01:14:03,199
wing more like freight rather like what we consider to

1069
01:14:03,279 --> 01:14:06,920
be like freight, you know, rather than like like letters

1070
01:14:06,960 --> 01:14:10,880
and telegrams and stuff like that. But you know this

1071
01:14:11,159 --> 01:14:13,119
was this was like an her of you know, not

1072
01:14:13,319 --> 01:14:17,359
just because you know, there wasn't like the kind of

1073
01:14:18,039 --> 01:14:21,960
concentrated necessity you know, to serve like a discrete market

1074
01:14:22,079 --> 01:14:24,520
like that. But you know this this was being like

1075
01:14:24,640 --> 01:14:28,279
rapidly subsidized, you know, like the like like washing them

1076
01:14:28,359 --> 01:14:31,560
like haded sites in California as like a literal gold knight,

1077
01:14:32,279 --> 01:14:34,720
you know, after the at the discovery of these like

1078
01:14:34,840 --> 01:14:40,640
massive gold reserves. Samuel Morse, yes, that Morse, you know,

1079
01:14:40,720 --> 01:14:43,239
they get the architect of Morse code. You know, he

1080
01:14:43,319 --> 01:14:48,880
was like an early telecom like pioneer obviously you know

1081
01:14:49,039 --> 01:14:53,439
the uh like wiring up uh like like why why

1082
01:14:53,840 --> 01:15:01,399
he got thirty thousand dollars appropriated for the Washington Baltimore

1083
01:15:01,800 --> 01:15:05,039
like uh like telegraph line, which was like an incredible

1084
01:15:05,119 --> 01:15:07,720
like fortune in those days, you know, and like the

1085
01:15:08,119 --> 01:15:11,800
it was that line was first used. It transmitted cable

1086
01:15:11,920 --> 01:15:16,399
like by it transmitted by cable between the wig and

1087
01:15:16,479 --> 01:15:20,520
the and the Democratic Republican conventions and in the eighteen forties,

1088
01:15:21,119 --> 01:15:22,760
which is kind of wild, that was like the first

1089
01:15:23,039 --> 01:15:26,399
uh that that was like the first like news wire

1090
01:15:26,560 --> 01:15:30,399
between and you know conventions. You know, so like people

1091
01:15:30,479 --> 01:15:33,960
had both situated at both locales, could could like be

1092
01:15:34,119 --> 01:15:36,279
advised of what was happening. You know. That's why we

1093
01:15:36,359 --> 01:15:39,000
talked about literally the news wire, you know, like that

1094
01:15:39,600 --> 01:15:42,479
that term like never thought of favor for whatever reason,

1095
01:15:43,199 --> 01:15:49,560
you know, and so the so the uh Morris died

1096
01:15:49,640 --> 01:15:53,039
in the early eighteen seventies and memory serves, but you know,

1097
01:15:53,119 --> 01:15:56,119
like they him and his firm got like a huge

1098
01:15:56,159 --> 01:16:00,319
amount of public money, so like wire up California and

1099
01:16:00,439 --> 01:16:03,439
like before I mean, it's nothing like a twentieth century obviously,

1100
01:16:03,800 --> 01:16:05,279
or the twenty firth century in terms of like a

1101
01:16:05,359 --> 01:16:07,760
lobbying and like modern lobbying as we think of it,

1102
01:16:07,880 --> 01:16:10,720
that really didn't come into existence. So like Grant administration,

1103
01:16:11,199 --> 01:16:14,159
like this idea of like I'm a I'm a businessman

1104
01:16:14,560 --> 01:16:16,399
or I am or I'm some Wall Street type and

1105
01:16:16,479 --> 01:16:19,359
I can I can just approach Congress and like make

1106
01:16:19,439 --> 01:16:21,720
my case and be like yeah, I need you know,

1107
01:16:21,760 --> 01:16:25,239
I need thirty thousand dollars, which I adjusting for inflation.

1108
01:16:25,479 --> 01:16:27,840
I mean that's that's like tens of millions of dollars today.

1109
01:16:28,520 --> 01:16:31,960
You know that you know this idea, you can just

1110
01:16:32,039 --> 01:16:35,680
kind of like approach congressman or senators or approach the

1111
01:16:35,800 --> 01:16:39,119
cabinet like the secretary the Interior or something of a

1112
01:16:39,479 --> 01:16:41,800
of an incoming president, and it's like make your pitch

1113
01:16:41,960 --> 01:16:45,119
for for subsidies, like I was basically unheard of. It's

1114
01:16:45,319 --> 01:16:50,239
just like something you could do, you know. So but

1115
01:16:50,359 --> 01:16:52,720
I mean if you but if you had business in

1116
01:16:52,840 --> 01:16:56,359
California relating to the infrastructure, like like basically like like

1117
01:16:56,479 --> 01:17:01,960
watching it like shovel money at you you know, and

1118
01:17:02,039 --> 01:17:06,119
that that that's hugely significance, man, hugely significant, you know,

1119
01:17:06,199 --> 01:17:10,119
and like a telegraph, it quickly became like indispensable to government,

1120
01:17:10,279 --> 01:17:14,119
you know. And this is also the uh, this is

1121
01:17:14,239 --> 01:17:16,479
uh this is also the origins of the Associated Press,

1122
01:17:16,760 --> 01:17:20,439
you know, like AP, like the AP news wire started

1123
01:17:20,520 --> 01:17:23,680
in eighteen twenty seven, which is insane, you know, and

1124
01:17:24,359 --> 01:17:28,840
originally originally it was it was it was local in

1125
01:17:28,920 --> 01:17:33,000
New York, you know, but then they like like AP

1126
01:17:33,399 --> 01:17:37,920
started like utilizing the fact that California is going wired up,

1127
01:17:38,079 --> 01:17:40,800
you know, to to literally be able to like disseminate

1128
01:17:40,880 --> 01:17:44,359
like coast to coast news like how look like how

1129
01:17:44,479 --> 01:17:47,800
validated news was? Is is an open end question. You know,

1130
01:17:47,880 --> 01:17:52,000
like fake news isn't like a new thing. But you know,

1131
01:17:52,159 --> 01:17:55,199
like all this like what what President Polk's angle and

1132
01:17:55,199 --> 01:17:57,720
all this was, and aside from like the obvious and

1133
01:17:57,840 --> 01:18:01,640
this is hugely important too, you know, Texas was always

1134
01:18:02,319 --> 01:18:04,960
basically what the reason on the reason the federal government

1135
01:18:05,079 --> 01:18:06,960
had its site so much in California and it was

1136
01:18:07,000 --> 01:18:10,600
like salivating that's what they'd wanted Texas to be. You know,

1137
01:18:11,600 --> 01:18:14,199
like like Texas is a it's just like a bounty

1138
01:18:14,319 --> 01:18:19,560
of of of natural wealth in the New world. You know,

1139
01:18:19,720 --> 01:18:22,960
like it's it's incredible. You know, it's got, it's got,

1140
01:18:23,000 --> 01:18:27,279
it's got the it's got the commodities and and the

1141
01:18:28,239 --> 01:18:32,000
and the convertible energy resources of like ten countries you know,

1142
01:18:32,079 --> 01:18:35,560
like to this day, like it's it's insane. But you know,

1143
01:18:35,680 --> 01:18:38,600
Texas is always problematic. In Texas of course also like

1144
01:18:38,720 --> 01:18:41,920
joined the Confederates. You know, we weren't there yet, you know,

1145
01:18:42,920 --> 01:18:46,720
during Pokes administration, but I mean the Texans basically wouldn't

1146
01:18:46,720 --> 01:18:50,479
play ball, and like Texas political culture there there was

1147
01:18:50,520 --> 01:18:53,520
always these problems. I mean, those those kind of endoor

1148
01:18:53,560 --> 01:18:55,720
to this day, although it's different now. I mean in

1149
01:18:56,000 --> 01:19:01,000
obviously Texas is no longer they they've lost their they've

1150
01:19:01,000 --> 01:19:04,119
they've lost the stones as it were, for any kind

1151
01:19:04,159 --> 01:19:07,479
of like rebel political culture. And they're they're so deeply

1152
01:19:07,560 --> 01:19:14,279
insinuated into into the military industrial apparatus that they'd be

1153
01:19:14,359 --> 01:19:16,479
kind of like a thinkable today. But you know, but

1154
01:19:16,560 --> 01:19:19,479
Texas has always typing on its own program, you know,

1155
01:19:19,520 --> 01:19:24,680
and it's always there, and there was like discrete power

1156
01:19:24,800 --> 01:19:29,600
bases there, you know, particularly related to what became like

1157
01:19:29,680 --> 01:19:36,600
agribusiness and stuff. You know, so people like Pope they

1158
01:19:36,640 --> 01:19:39,279
were looking at California and saying, like, you know, well

1159
01:19:39,479 --> 01:19:42,680
this we can we get basically like make California and

1160
01:19:42,720 --> 01:19:45,680
whatever image we want, you know, and we can allocate

1161
01:19:45,680 --> 01:19:48,279
it to resources and stuff we want, you know, and

1162
01:19:48,359 --> 01:19:51,920
we're not gonna like brush up against this uh like

1163
01:19:52,159 --> 01:19:55,239
established power there, you know, and we're not gonna we're

1164
01:19:55,279 --> 01:19:56,760
not gonna be have to deal with like a house

1165
01:19:56,800 --> 01:19:59,399
of political culture and you know, such that we can

1166
01:19:59,520 --> 01:20:02,640
like convince able to move there. You know, they're gonna

1167
01:20:02,640 --> 01:20:05,600
credit us with with kind of creating this utopia where

1168
01:20:05,680 --> 01:20:08,560
like everything's wired up. You know, you got you've got

1169
01:20:09,880 --> 01:20:12,119
you know, you've got like electricity it's another huge thing

1170
01:20:12,680 --> 01:20:14,239
and I'll get to that in a minute. Was like

1171
01:20:14,359 --> 01:20:18,479
literally wiring up California electricity and like farmhouses and residences,

1172
01:20:18,520 --> 01:20:20,520
which is like a herd of its scale, you know,

1173
01:20:20,600 --> 01:20:23,680
basically like making California is like attractive as possible. And

1174
01:20:23,760 --> 01:20:25,720
then like when people like when even when these when

1175
01:20:25,760 --> 01:20:32,000
these day one pioneer types arrived there, you know they'll

1176
01:20:32,399 --> 01:20:34,800
they'll have like you know, they'll look at Washington. It's

1177
01:20:34,840 --> 01:20:38,000
like this benevolent agent. You know, they've made this possible.

1178
01:20:38,479 --> 01:20:40,920
And I'm sure that people like listening or watching right now,

1179
01:20:40,960 --> 01:20:42,720
they're making the connection that like this is a lot

1180
01:20:42,840 --> 01:20:45,039
like how Walt Disney thought, and they're right, it is

1181
01:20:45,159 --> 01:20:49,840
no way to that in a minute. But you know,

1182
01:20:50,319 --> 01:20:57,760
the uh, the Pokes interesting too because he he was

1183
01:20:57,960 --> 01:21:02,039
he was like this genius polymath. He was an expert mathematician.

1184
01:21:04,520 --> 01:21:10,119
He was born in North Carolina. He migrated the Tennessee,

1185
01:21:10,439 --> 01:21:16,720
served in Congress, he was Speaker of the House, he

1186
01:21:16,880 --> 01:21:21,960
was governor for two years. And but but he was

1187
01:21:22,039 --> 01:21:24,800
also he was also like an old school Southerner, like

1188
01:21:24,880 --> 01:21:27,520
you know what a plantation. He was a slave owner,

1189
01:21:27,920 --> 01:21:30,239
like he was part of what you know this the

1190
01:21:30,319 --> 01:21:33,399
Confederacy's ops, you know, the rice that we called the

1191
01:21:33,520 --> 01:21:36,800
slave power. But again, he was like this high speed

1192
01:21:36,880 --> 01:21:39,359
mathematician and this kind of like polymath and like he

1193
01:21:39,399 --> 01:21:47,840
had a deep understanding of technology, you know, but he's

1194
01:21:47,920 --> 01:21:49,880
kind of casts like this. He's kind of cast as

1195
01:21:49,920 --> 01:21:54,199
like this stodgy, like old guy who represented this kind

1196
01:21:54,239 --> 01:21:58,840
of reactionary tendency, you know. And yeah, I mean it's

1197
01:21:58,880 --> 01:22:01,279
not totally false, but that that's kind of like the

1198
01:22:01,359 --> 01:22:05,520
wrong takeaway from Polk and his administration, you know. And

1199
01:22:06,840 --> 01:22:10,399
he uh, he was an acolyte of Andrew Jackson. I

1200
01:22:10,399 --> 01:22:12,159
can't remember we got into that or not so much

1201
01:22:12,199 --> 01:22:16,760
of that. People called him young Hickory, so he had credibility.

1202
01:22:16,800 --> 01:22:19,760
It's like this kind of like populist uh, like white

1203
01:22:19,880 --> 01:22:22,000
Yaloman type, you know. And that's one of the reasons

1204
01:22:22,039 --> 01:22:24,119
why he was like so effective, you know, because like

1205
01:22:24,199 --> 01:22:27,119
he actually was those things. It wasn't it wasn't just

1206
01:22:27,439 --> 01:22:31,039
this kind of like fake narrative around him. A remarkable guy.

1207
01:22:31,800 --> 01:22:35,159
You know. I'm a big fan of him, as people

1208
01:22:35,279 --> 01:22:38,279
probably discerned, and I don't think he's a president people

1209
01:22:38,319 --> 01:22:45,119
read about her anymore, but you know, at uh, people

1210
01:22:45,199 --> 01:22:47,840
like Paul Johnson playing that Pope was the first president

1211
01:22:47,880 --> 01:22:51,840
who was killed by the office, you know, and he

1212
01:22:52,000 --> 01:22:55,319
kept uh he screwags. They kept a diary, and it

1213
01:22:55,439 --> 01:22:58,279
was clearly like the stress and the workload was killing him,

1214
01:22:59,279 --> 01:23:04,399
you know. And at kind of the most like obvious

1215
01:23:05,159 --> 01:23:08,680
inflavorant instance of that is Wilson, what I mean, poke, also,

1216
01:23:09,079 --> 01:23:11,479
like the pressures these guys were under are incredible, like

1217
01:23:11,520 --> 01:23:14,319
even today, even kind of an empty suit like Obama,

1218
01:23:14,479 --> 01:23:15,880
like he've made a lot of the fact that you know,

1219
01:23:15,960 --> 01:23:17,640
like in a few years, like all his heroin gray

1220
01:23:17,720 --> 01:23:21,560
and stuff, you know, like it's it's like an exhausting

1221
01:23:22,359 --> 01:23:25,319
role even now when there's all kinds of advantages and

1222
01:23:25,399 --> 01:23:28,479
you're basically a pr man and not like a real executive.

1223
01:23:29,199 --> 01:23:34,159
You know. That's why when I mean obviously a lot

1224
01:23:34,199 --> 01:23:37,760
of the stems from a kind of debased hostility to

1225
01:23:37,840 --> 01:23:41,920
the man. But with the world media outlets and not

1226
01:23:42,439 --> 01:23:46,119
not just American ones, they talk about how like awful

1227
01:23:46,199 --> 01:23:48,760
quote awful Putin looks. It's like, well, he's a guy

1228
01:23:48,840 --> 01:23:53,199
in his seventies. I think he probably beat cancer because

1229
01:23:53,239 --> 01:23:55,640
I'll see all the indications point to that. And the

1230
01:23:55,960 --> 01:24:00,359
Russians are notoriously close to the chest about health problems

1231
01:24:00,399 --> 01:24:03,319
with anybody, let alone their leadership. But you know, he's

1232
01:24:03,359 --> 01:24:06,159
a war executive and the pressures that man is under

1233
01:24:06,319 --> 01:24:10,119
are unfathomable. I think ust are margably good considering all

1234
01:24:10,159 --> 01:24:13,239
of that. But that's nothing of a tangent forgive this.

1235
01:24:13,800 --> 01:24:15,359
Speaker 1: But the.

1236
01:24:18,239 --> 01:24:20,600
Speaker 2: The kind of key to all this that I just suggested,

1237
01:24:22,039 --> 01:24:24,960
I mean, obviously, like the gold Rush happened immediately after

1238
01:24:25,600 --> 01:24:29,600
the Mexican War, and a lot of these ideas at

1239
01:24:29,680 --> 01:24:34,920
scale kind of ossified in the aftermath of of the

1240
01:24:35,720 --> 01:24:40,039
of the Guadalupe Hidalgo Treaty. But Pope, Pope, Pope wanted

1241
01:24:40,039 --> 01:24:42,880
to go to war in mexicoaks he wanted California, Okay,

1242
01:24:44,079 --> 01:24:46,159
Like the men who actually fought the war, you know,

1243
01:24:46,239 --> 01:24:50,680
guys like Jackson, Guys like Zagary Taylor, guys like Stowall Jackson,

1244
01:24:50,800 --> 01:24:54,840
not Andrew, guys like Winfield Scott. I mean, they had

1245
01:24:56,039 --> 01:24:58,239
they had a sense of like white man Southern honor

1246
01:24:58,279 --> 01:25:02,279
about it, obviously, and you know they had they had

1247
01:25:02,279 --> 01:25:05,119
they had like a warrior's mentality about it, you know,

1248
01:25:05,199 --> 01:25:08,840
and a lot of uh, you know, these manifest destiny types. Also,

1249
01:25:08,960 --> 01:25:12,479
they viewed it in like nakedly theological terms, and there's

1250
01:25:12,520 --> 01:25:13,800
nothing wrong with that. It's one of the things that

1251
01:25:13,880 --> 01:25:15,920
made America strong. I mean, that's one of the things

1252
01:25:15,920 --> 01:25:18,920
that makes our people strong, like you know, white dissenters.

1253
01:25:20,119 --> 01:25:23,840
But uh, that was not Polton in popelond California, Okay,

1254
01:25:23,960 --> 01:25:28,439
because he was. He was kind of like Wilson and

1255
01:25:28,520 --> 01:25:30,720
kind of like Eisenhower in this regard like what everybody

1256
01:25:30,760 --> 01:25:33,520
thinks like Wilson or I politically, that's not what I'm

1257
01:25:33,560 --> 01:25:37,800
getting at. Like they they had serious foresight in terms

1258
01:25:37,840 --> 01:25:44,720
of infrastructural potentials and you know, the exploitability of nature's

1259
01:25:44,800 --> 01:25:50,880
bounty and as well as you know how America's incredible

1260
01:25:52,800 --> 01:25:58,720
wealth could translate into applied technology and in industry and things.

1261
01:26:00,920 --> 01:26:03,000
And that's also why you know, I can't remember I

1262
01:26:03,159 --> 01:26:06,199
mentioned this before. Pope Pope promised only served one term,

1263
01:26:06,279 --> 01:26:09,359
and he did. And I think that's part of why.

1264
01:26:10,199 --> 01:26:12,720
You know, back in those days, like medical treatment wasn't

1265
01:26:13,239 --> 01:26:16,720
what it is today. I mean, Pope was not particularly

1266
01:26:16,760 --> 01:26:22,000
good health. I I when when he he he was

1267
01:26:22,039 --> 01:26:25,119
a war executive who won. He was a conquering hero.

1268
01:26:25,960 --> 01:26:29,520
America got Mexico. He was able to lock in basically

1269
01:26:29,640 --> 01:26:32,399
these kind of key infrastructural projects. Like I think it

1270
01:26:32,479 --> 01:26:35,760
was basically like mission accomplished. And I the younger people

1271
01:26:35,800 --> 01:26:39,039
don't really understand this, I don't think, but it was

1272
01:26:39,119 --> 01:26:40,720
on the slight on them. There's no way they would

1273
01:26:40,800 --> 01:26:42,640
And I plan to be around for a minute. I'm

1274
01:26:42,640 --> 01:26:45,800
not like planning to die. But I do have like

1275
01:26:45,880 --> 01:26:49,239
more time behind me than in front. And I do

1276
01:26:49,439 --> 01:26:53,000
understand now why people, especially men, when they're like okay,

1277
01:26:53,079 --> 01:26:55,920
mission accomplished, it's kind of like their body almost gives out,

1278
01:26:56,760 --> 01:27:00,319
you know, like it's it's interesting. I'm not trying to

1279
01:27:00,319 --> 01:27:04,960
be morbid, but it's significant when we're discussing the the

1280
01:27:05,119 --> 01:27:09,479
kinds of personages and historical imperatives that we are. But

1281
01:27:12,039 --> 01:27:16,319
you know, the uh, you know. And again there's a

1282
01:27:16,399 --> 01:27:20,960
lot of cap around the Mexican War. There's a lot

1283
01:27:21,000 --> 01:27:23,880
of historians, a lot of traditional historians kind of cast

1284
01:27:23,920 --> 01:27:27,399
the Mexicans with a bunch of fools, and people who

1285
01:27:27,439 --> 01:27:30,359
aren't don't have a charitable view of of Polk or

1286
01:27:30,880 --> 01:27:33,399
or the Confederacy or the South or white people. The

1287
01:27:33,520 --> 01:27:36,319
viewpo were just kind of like this greedy opportunist. Other

1288
01:27:36,399 --> 01:27:39,640
people like Howard's in types. They claim, well, obviously there

1289
01:27:39,720 --> 01:27:43,359
was fore knowledge of California's gold wealth and so that

1290
01:27:43,520 --> 01:27:46,199
this was this was like based like an economic heightst

1291
01:27:46,319 --> 01:27:48,399
like none, none of those things are true, Like that's

1292
01:27:48,640 --> 01:27:51,640
the demonstrably false, like this was what it appears to be.

1293
01:27:53,600 --> 01:27:56,399
And that's we got into the whole issue with the

1294
01:27:57,119 --> 01:28:08,199
negotiation between between Larkin and and Slowed and this kind

1295
01:28:08,239 --> 01:28:15,279
of informal contingent that was based in Monterey, that that

1296
01:28:15,399 --> 01:28:17,520
then managed to low ball the Mexicans and pay them

1297
01:28:17,560 --> 01:28:21,119
only half would have been allocated for you know, these concessions,

1298
01:28:21,520 --> 01:28:24,239
which originally was slated at thirty million dollars then had

1299
01:28:24,359 --> 01:28:29,159
you know, fifteen million. But it's you know, but when

1300
01:28:29,199 --> 01:28:33,239
Mexico's actually treated pretty generously, you know, they were they

1301
01:28:33,439 --> 01:28:39,159
were compensated there there a lot of their debts were repudiated.

1302
01:28:39,239 --> 01:28:42,079
And in Mexico then is now had a terrible reputation

1303
01:28:42,279 --> 01:28:45,399
for accruing massive public debts and then just simply like

1304
01:28:45,960 --> 01:28:52,239
welshing on them. And somehow that tracks like with Mexicans.

1305
01:28:52,279 --> 01:28:54,720
And I'm not trying to like trash like like Spanish

1306
01:28:54,760 --> 01:28:57,039
people or something, but it's just funny to think about.

1307
01:28:59,600 --> 01:29:06,720
But uh, the U and also too, and we'll move

1308
01:29:06,760 --> 01:29:08,760
on from this in a minute, but this is important.

1309
01:29:09,359 --> 01:29:13,199
You know, the Mexican government was was violently anti American.

1310
01:29:14,399 --> 01:29:18,199
You know, it's that that wasn't just some sort of

1311
01:29:18,319 --> 01:29:20,520
rationale and in books as the causes. But you know

1312
01:29:20,600 --> 01:29:23,560
that is true, and some people seem to forget that

1313
01:29:23,960 --> 01:29:27,560
because they do Mexico is albeit you know, of the

1314
01:29:27,640 --> 01:29:29,199
in the era. I mean, they do it, you know,

1315
01:29:29,319 --> 01:29:33,239
possibly as corrupt and stuff and the way that unfortunately

1316
01:29:34,000 --> 01:29:37,720
a lot of political cultures based on the Iberian model are,

1317
01:29:38,640 --> 01:29:40,319
but they viewed it as basically this kind of like

1318
01:29:40,399 --> 01:29:44,920
European colonial power that was uh that that was fighting

1319
01:29:44,960 --> 01:29:48,960
a race war against the Apache, and so they they

1320
01:29:49,520 --> 01:29:51,720
they for some reason in their mind it's like, well, no,

1321
01:29:52,239 --> 01:29:55,479
you know, how how in America and how especially the

1322
01:29:55,520 --> 01:29:58,319
American South and Mexican not be friendly. They were serious.

1323
01:29:58,359 --> 01:30:01,319
There was serious enmity there, and the Mexican's hated America

1324
01:30:01,560 --> 01:30:07,319
like their government. I mean, I don't it's outside the scope,

1325
01:30:07,359 --> 01:30:12,079
but one of the reasons why, like Mexican people and whites.

1326
01:30:12,279 --> 01:30:14,359
I mean, yeah, there's tensions there, as there always are

1327
01:30:14,479 --> 01:30:18,239
between peoples, but they do get along better than than

1328
01:30:18,319 --> 01:30:22,680
other populations like on the street, in in in square

1329
01:30:22,800 --> 01:30:25,359
life than ever. And that's an interesting topic, but obviously

1330
01:30:25,359 --> 01:30:28,800
it's outside the scope. But I I don't believe that

1331
01:30:28,920 --> 01:30:31,640
Mexican people and some like a biting hatred of America.

1332
01:30:31,800 --> 01:30:34,479
You better believe that their government did, you know. And

1333
01:30:35,359 --> 01:30:38,439
and that kind of divide between I mean, there really

1334
01:30:38,640 --> 01:30:42,279
was like a chasmic distance between like the ruling caste

1335
01:30:42,359 --> 01:30:44,960
in Mexico and like the common manner woman like that.

1336
01:30:46,640 --> 01:30:50,119
Speaker 1: That's what really screwed it up when when it became

1337
01:30:50,399 --> 01:30:53,840
blatantly communist, Oh yeah, became that much more hostal.

1338
01:30:55,000 --> 01:30:58,840
Speaker 2: No in Mexico is a screwy. We're getting ahead of ourselves.

1339
01:30:58,880 --> 01:31:01,079
But even like the Zimmerman Telegram, a lot of that

1340
01:31:01,199 --> 01:31:04,119
was cap Like, I don't it's not like the Mexicans

1341
01:31:04,159 --> 01:31:06,720
are imminently going to like assault the Southwest. But the

1342
01:31:06,880 --> 01:31:09,239
very fact that I mean, I mean Wilhelm was was

1343
01:31:09,319 --> 01:31:14,720
not a good ruler and just not a good guy

1344
01:31:14,920 --> 01:31:17,960
in all kinds of ways. But I and I'm no stupid.

1345
01:31:18,079 --> 01:31:21,239
I mean he he was always saying stupid things, you know,

1346
01:31:21,279 --> 01:31:24,600
whether it was like firing off a cable to Paul Krueger,

1347
01:31:25,520 --> 01:31:28,199
to antagonized the British for no reason or you know,

1348
01:31:28,399 --> 01:31:31,319
sending off the Zimmerman Telegram. But but the fact that

1349
01:31:31,399 --> 01:31:33,600
the Mexicans were receptive to that, I mean that kind

1350
01:31:33,600 --> 01:31:36,279
of speaks for itself, you know, like the I mean,

1351
01:31:36,319 --> 01:31:39,000
the Mexican government today doesn't like America and vice versa.

1352
01:31:40,199 --> 01:31:41,800
I mean, I realized they got like a fake government.

1353
01:31:41,880 --> 01:31:44,199
Now they got to say dumpy Yenta lady. I mean

1354
01:31:44,239 --> 01:31:46,840
it's it's it's like a combination like hertel shit and

1355
01:31:48,199 --> 01:31:54,079
and you know, big big money interests of a transnational

1356
01:31:54,760 --> 01:31:58,720
sort and like like security state interests. I mean, she's

1357
01:31:58,800 --> 01:32:01,800
not like the real there, but with the reason why

1358
01:32:01,920 --> 01:32:05,000
she always like mouths these stupid platitudes about you know,

1359
01:32:05,119 --> 01:32:07,560
like evil weighty and evil Yankee to I mean that

1360
01:32:07,720 --> 01:32:10,760
that that's got deep roots there. You know, it's not

1361
01:32:11,479 --> 01:32:14,399
it's it's not some like new thing or whatever. But

1362
01:32:18,600 --> 01:32:22,039
the and the and it's all too we'll move on

1363
01:32:22,119 --> 01:32:24,760
in a minute. But for the military hounds on deck

1364
01:32:24,880 --> 01:32:26,840
or are gonna be watching, and this is important too.

1365
01:32:28,600 --> 01:32:33,319
You know, the the Mexican Wars and specifically the assault

1366
01:32:33,399 --> 01:32:35,960
on Mexico City that was like the first real use

1367
01:32:36,039 --> 01:32:38,239
of combined arms in the sense we think of it. Yeah,

1368
01:32:38,239 --> 01:32:40,640
I know, field artillery, it existed for a long time,

1369
01:32:40,760 --> 01:32:47,119
but that coordination between you know, artillery and the infantry

1370
01:32:47,199 --> 01:32:50,600
element and that kind of like advance of fire in

1371
01:32:50,720 --> 01:32:55,920
Closewitzian duc Trintal terms, those are the first time that

1372
01:32:56,039 --> 01:33:00,319
have been that. It's that had been practic this and

1373
01:33:00,479 --> 01:33:03,960
and you know at scale, you know, and and especially

1374
01:33:04,640 --> 01:33:06,439
it was it was, it was. It was certainly and

1375
01:33:06,479 --> 01:33:09,319
into a first impression in America. And that one of

1376
01:33:09,359 --> 01:33:12,079
the reasons why the Confederates were so tough. It's not

1377
01:33:12,199 --> 01:33:14,520
just because of you know, like the the kind of

1378
01:33:14,600 --> 01:33:18,079
warrior culture of of of the American South which still

1379
01:33:18,119 --> 01:33:20,520
exists today, is because these guys are all cut their

1380
01:33:20,560 --> 01:33:23,399
teeth fighting the Mexican War, you know, with what was

1381
01:33:23,479 --> 01:33:26,560
then cutting edge wartech man, you know, like they and

1382
01:33:26,640 --> 01:33:29,640
this was splendidly executed. And that was it was guys

1383
01:33:29,680 --> 01:33:33,479
like Zachary Taylor and guys like Stonewall, you know, who

1384
01:33:33,560 --> 01:33:37,880
were like leading company level elements, but like Winfield Scott.

1385
01:33:38,560 --> 01:33:42,520
It was Winfield Scott really planned that operation, you know.

1386
01:33:44,760 --> 01:33:47,239
And uh Robert E. Lee was a captain on the ground.

1387
01:33:48,720 --> 01:33:53,319
McClelland was there, Grant Jefferson Davis, who was a it

1388
01:33:53,439 --> 01:33:56,199
was a full colonel. It's literally like a who's who

1389
01:33:56,399 --> 01:34:00,079
of you know, the men who commanded forces. And in

1390
01:34:00,119 --> 01:34:07,039
the War between the States, it was also uh Scott's

1391
01:34:07,079 --> 01:34:12,520
when Jeld Scott's army. It was the first amphibious assault

1392
01:34:12,680 --> 01:34:18,319
ever mounted by US forces on March March ninth, eighteen

1393
01:34:18,439 --> 01:34:21,600
forty seven, at Vera Cruz. And it was carried. It

1394
01:34:21,720 --> 01:34:24,720
was it was it went off without loss, with with

1395
01:34:24,840 --> 01:34:28,399
like no no attrition on on the side of American forces.

1396
01:34:28,479 --> 01:34:30,840
So it's the Mexican War was important a lot of reasons.

1397
01:34:30,840 --> 01:34:32,880
And I think people way you look at it, it's

1398
01:34:32,920 --> 01:34:36,439
kind of like this this nothing thing, or they look

1399
01:34:36,439 --> 01:34:38,960
at it like the War of eighteen twelve contra the

1400
01:34:39,279 --> 01:34:42,439
Revolutionary War or something. I mean, Warring twelve is important too,

1401
01:34:42,560 --> 01:34:45,720
but they it's it was really important. It's own right

1402
01:34:45,960 --> 01:34:50,000
for oh all kinds of reasons. But yeah, I I

1403
01:34:50,079 --> 01:34:56,520
realized I gotta pick up the pace. But but you know,

1404
01:34:56,720 --> 01:35:02,960
just don u on its in in in brass texts terms,

1405
01:35:03,279 --> 01:35:07,359
just in in value neutral terms and in a political terms,

1406
01:35:08,000 --> 01:35:11,199
California wasn't even greater prize than Texas, you know, like

1407
01:35:11,319 --> 01:35:14,520
not not accounting for the things that were precluding the

1408
01:35:14,600 --> 01:35:21,520
full kind of realization of territorial potential or exploitation they

1409
01:35:21,560 --> 01:35:25,640
were in depending on we fall on judgments, I suppose,

1410
01:35:25,720 --> 01:35:34,560
but California the name it's it's it's it's got a

1411
01:35:34,640 --> 01:35:38,399
name that's like resident in fantasy, like it's Providence. I

1412
01:35:38,520 --> 01:35:43,119
mean it was named after this imaginary island in this

1413
01:35:44,680 --> 01:35:48,359
kind of like epic romance by or Donat's name on

1414
01:35:48,520 --> 01:35:55,520
Talvo that was published like right around fifteen hundred and

1415
01:35:55,640 --> 01:35:59,359
Hernan Cortes has uh like like new knew of it

1416
01:35:59,680 --> 01:36:16,479
and would references and at uh, I guess I thought

1417
01:36:17,680 --> 01:36:22,199
like at first true, like permanent settlement by the Spaniards

1418
01:36:22,239 --> 01:36:25,560
didn't begin until the seventies sixties, like a settlement at scale.

1419
01:36:25,600 --> 01:36:28,680
I mean you know of of of you know, of

1420
01:36:28,800 --> 01:36:34,479
both sexes and of you know, like a yaleomanry as

1421
01:36:34,479 --> 01:36:35,920
we'd think of it, you know what I mean. Before

1422
01:36:36,000 --> 01:36:39,880
then it was it was Franciscan missions, and it was

1423
01:36:40,039 --> 01:36:43,399
uh freebooters and and like pirates, you know, like Partez

1424
01:36:43,439 --> 01:36:45,520
Himsel was, but he was like a warrior like pirate,

1425
01:36:45,640 --> 01:36:50,479
like freebooter, you know, and uh, the Franciscan missions between

1426
01:36:50,520 --> 01:36:53,800
San Diego and San Diego were San Francisco and San

1427
01:36:53,840 --> 01:36:58,359
Diego were ubiquitous. You know, the uh the Catlic Church

1428
01:36:58,560 --> 01:37:03,640
owned a huge amount of California until the Spanish crown

1429
01:37:04,880 --> 01:37:12,000
and then later you know, these various uh charter companies

1430
01:37:12,439 --> 01:37:17,680
began like the besting Rome like of its holdings. But uh,

1431
01:37:18,520 --> 01:37:21,279
you know there California has got an incredibly rare climate.

1432
01:37:22,720 --> 01:37:26,439
The fertility of its soil was basically like unheard of.

1433
01:37:28,239 --> 01:37:35,439
People had never seen anything like it. The range natural

1434
01:37:35,560 --> 01:37:44,039
resources is literally boundless. You know, everybody wanted a piece

1435
01:37:44,079 --> 01:37:47,520
of it. The Russians had formed a plan like the

1436
01:37:47,920 --> 01:37:53,439
Czarist Russia at the beginning of the nineteenth century, they

1437
01:37:53,560 --> 01:37:58,159
formed a plan to establish permanent settlements in California at

1438
01:37:58,159 --> 01:38:01,800
the mouth of the Columbia River and also in Hawaii.

1439
01:38:01,920 --> 01:38:03,840
They want to do the same thing, like Hawaii is

1440
01:38:03,880 --> 01:38:07,960
going to be like their springboard. Basically, like nothing came

1441
01:38:08,000 --> 01:38:11,399
of it for a lot of reasons. And you know,

1442
01:38:11,479 --> 01:38:15,279
by the close of the by the close of the

1443
01:38:15,880 --> 01:38:18,680
the nineteenth century, I mean, Russia was was very much

1444
01:38:18,800 --> 01:38:22,199
like uh, like like the sick man of Empires. But

1445
01:38:23,319 --> 01:38:28,079
this wasn't just fantasy, like you know, this just to

1446
01:38:28,119 --> 01:38:31,119
get an idea like how much it was coveted, you know,

1447
01:38:32,600 --> 01:38:34,640
and we're gonna go ahead of ourselves one of this too.

1448
01:38:36,560 --> 01:38:40,359
It wasn't totally insane, like it was to pretend that like, oh,

1449
01:38:40,479 --> 01:38:43,840
the Germans are coming to kill us. It wasn't totally

1450
01:38:43,880 --> 01:38:47,680
insane to postulate that the Japanese would want California to

1451
01:38:48,640 --> 01:38:51,359
I mean, obviously, like there would have there were a

1452
01:38:51,479 --> 01:38:53,920
bunch of there's about half of it dozen like preconditions

1453
01:38:54,199 --> 01:38:57,840
that would have needed to kind of be splendidly realized

1454
01:38:57,880 --> 01:39:01,479
before japan couldn't even count like they had in operational terms.

1455
01:39:01,960 --> 01:39:04,960
But you better believe that was one of their kind

1456
01:39:05,000 --> 01:39:07,199
of like that that would have been like the jewel

1457
01:39:07,239 --> 01:39:10,199
in the crown of like ultimate objectives for for like

1458
01:39:10,239 --> 01:39:15,119
a victorious like Japanese empire, you know, because it would

1459
01:39:15,119 --> 01:39:22,439
have had to have been you know, the uh. One

1460
01:39:22,439 --> 01:39:25,199
of the things that ruf the Russian ambitions.

1461
01:39:27,399 --> 01:39:27,680
Speaker 1: Was that.

1462
01:39:29,840 --> 01:39:32,399
Speaker 2: When relations between the United States and the United Kingdom,

1463
01:39:33,000 --> 01:39:40,960
which didn't really mend until, you know, until the first

1464
01:39:42,000 --> 01:39:47,279
decade of the twentieth century, but in the eighteen twenties,

1465
01:39:47,359 --> 01:39:50,880
the US Navy and the Royal Navy basically collaborated to

1466
01:39:51,039 --> 01:39:57,279
cut to cut off the Russian Navy's like Pacific Fleet

1467
01:39:59,199 --> 01:40:05,000
from being able to uh access the sea lanes that

1468
01:40:05,079 --> 01:40:08,039
needed to in order to realize these ambitions it had

1469
01:40:08,119 --> 01:40:10,800
in the West coast of the New World, you know.

1470
01:40:11,000 --> 01:40:14,520
And that's I mean, what really took Russia out of

1471
01:40:14,560 --> 01:40:18,079
the out of the game as as a maritime power

1472
01:40:18,239 --> 01:40:21,960
that was able to project transcontinentally was the Russo Japanese War.

1473
01:40:22,119 --> 01:40:24,920
Like the Japanese literally like slaughtered and sank the Russian

1474
01:40:25,000 --> 01:40:29,079
Navy and in nineteen oh five. But that was such

1475
01:40:29,079 --> 01:40:31,479
a big deal, not just because it was you know,

1476
01:40:31,600 --> 01:40:35,720
the not just because it indicated that Japan had arrived

1477
01:40:35,760 --> 01:40:41,279
as a world power comparable in the power projection capability

1478
01:40:41,279 --> 01:40:48,239
into the European naval forces, but also until then, the

1479
01:40:48,560 --> 01:40:51,840
Russian the Imperial Russian Navy was was a serious threat.

1480
01:40:53,239 --> 01:40:57,079
It had serious threat potential, you know, to whoever was

1481
01:40:58,399 --> 01:41:06,159
likely to be situated as opposing force to it. And

1482
01:41:08,880 --> 01:41:12,640
that's one of the things that in bolden Polk, because

1483
01:41:12,640 --> 01:41:19,520
after the eighteen twenties he was basically being told by

1484
01:41:19,640 --> 01:41:25,720
many would know, look like the Spanish slash Mexican hold

1485
01:41:25,840 --> 01:41:33,920
on in California, Oregon is is feeble at best, which

1486
01:41:33,960 --> 01:41:40,880
it was, and what really steal the deal? A guy,

1487
01:41:40,880 --> 01:41:45,439
even Wilkes, he was a young officer. He was a

1488
01:41:45,479 --> 01:41:51,319
lieutenant or a yeah, I think it was a lieutenant.

1489
01:41:51,359 --> 01:41:53,359
I can never remember, like what the what the naval

1490
01:41:53,399 --> 01:41:55,920
equivalent is of an army captain, because like a naval

1491
01:41:56,039 --> 01:42:00,079
captain is like a colonel, but uh, we're also some

1492
01:42:00,239 --> 01:42:03,359
kind of junior officer of the US Navy. And uh

1493
01:42:04,319 --> 01:42:08,239
in eighteen forty one, you know, half a half a

1494
01:42:08,319 --> 01:42:12,399
decade before the Mexican War, the Strategic Survey was commissioned

1495
01:42:12,479 --> 01:42:15,239
of the Eastern Pacific and what came to be kind

1496
01:42:15,279 --> 01:42:17,680
of the focus of it, like as it got underway,

1497
01:42:19,199 --> 01:42:23,960
was you know with San Francisco and then the entire

1498
01:42:24,079 --> 01:42:28,359
like San Francisco region, you know, and and how it

1499
01:42:28,439 --> 01:42:31,760
was literally like a gold mine and how it was

1500
01:42:33,520 --> 01:42:36,359
you know, it was like an essential it had it

1501
01:42:36,479 --> 01:42:39,640
was an essential capture, you know, if America was going

1502
01:42:39,720 --> 01:42:43,560
to become a if America is going to become a

1503
01:42:43,960 --> 01:42:47,399
like a truly like self contained like continental power, like

1504
01:42:47,479 --> 01:42:51,000
the idea like superpower is obviously didn't exist, and it

1505
01:42:51,159 --> 01:42:54,239
was contemplation then, but like it's fascinating to read, like

1506
01:42:54,319 --> 01:42:57,039
what Wilkes like put the paper and you just like

1507
01:42:57,119 --> 01:43:00,960
the impressions of these guys were worldly people. You know,

1508
01:43:01,039 --> 01:43:03,319
like a lot of these guys had been around the

1509
01:43:03,359 --> 01:43:06,119
world even though we had like they'd basically been like

1510
01:43:06,239 --> 01:43:09,560
all through like the Spanish Empire and stuff. Uh, you

1511
01:43:09,640 --> 01:43:13,760
know it. They talked about California like it's like freaking

1512
01:43:13,840 --> 01:43:15,960
shagro lot or something, which I guess it kind of is.

1513
01:43:16,279 --> 01:43:19,479
But we're gonna time. We got Okay, we're going for

1514
01:43:19,479 --> 01:43:21,680
about forty two minutes or I'll pick up the pace

1515
01:43:23,279 --> 01:43:25,239
if I'm being boring or repetitive, like let me know,

1516
01:43:25,600 --> 01:43:34,600
but it's a it's all good, okay, good deal. This

1517
01:43:34,920 --> 01:43:38,880
huge boom Like by by the eighteen eighties, California had

1518
01:43:38,880 --> 01:43:42,359
about a quarter million people. You know. It was uh,

1519
01:43:44,000 --> 01:43:50,079
it was rapidly becoming the financial and cultural hub you know,

1520
01:43:50,239 --> 01:43:53,640
of the West, which at that time was still like

1521
01:43:53,720 --> 01:43:59,920
wide open space. Obviously even is there really is Like

1522
01:44:00,079 --> 01:44:06,680
the eighteen eighties, knob Hill was a knob Hill was

1523
01:44:06,760 --> 01:44:10,479
a was like Beverly Hills o the day, but even

1524
01:44:10,560 --> 01:44:13,800
more so there was like you had mansions that were

1525
01:44:13,800 --> 01:44:17,039
worth a million dollars, which is basically like a billion

1526
01:44:17,119 --> 01:44:19,439
dollar house like in today's money, Like I think it's

1527
01:44:19,479 --> 01:44:21,520
point to people a lot. They can't really contact the

1528
01:44:21,640 --> 01:44:24,600
wealth if you were like a millionaire in like the

1529
01:44:24,720 --> 01:44:28,680
eighteen sixties or eighteen eighties, it's like unfathomable. It's not

1530
01:44:28,840 --> 01:44:31,640
just like being a rich guy or like these guys

1531
01:44:31,720 --> 01:44:35,720
like Andrew Carnegie, like the like the power they had,

1532
01:44:35,840 --> 01:44:39,119
Like these guys literally were uh like masses the universe,

1533
01:44:39,760 --> 01:44:44,840
you know, like they could like they like like world

1534
01:44:44,920 --> 01:44:47,439
leaders and like gravel before them, you know, like they

1535
01:44:48,800 --> 01:44:52,039
they owned like double digit percentages of like the GDP.

1536
01:44:52,640 --> 01:44:53,760
Like that's like unfamomable.

1537
01:44:53,880 --> 01:44:54,000
Speaker 1: Now.

1538
01:44:54,359 --> 01:44:56,119
Speaker 2: Like even a guy like Elon Musk I've got like

1539
01:44:56,199 --> 01:44:58,560
tremendous respect for and I just think he knows a

1540
01:44:58,600 --> 01:45:02,039
lot of like awesome stuff, even like I like him,

1541
01:45:02,199 --> 01:45:06,279
is like nothing in compared to the the kinds of

1542
01:45:06,359 --> 01:45:10,359
wealth accrued by these guys, and in in percentage terms

1543
01:45:10,399 --> 01:45:11,159
and stuff.

1544
01:45:11,760 --> 01:45:13,960
Speaker 1: And n in like nineteen eight, nineteen o nine, JP

1545
01:45:14,079 --> 01:45:15,520
Morgan paid off the American debt.

1546
01:45:16,000 --> 01:45:18,560
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, there you go. And he was he was

1547
01:45:18,640 --> 01:45:22,319
probably he was definitely like one of like the top

1548
01:45:22,399 --> 01:45:25,560
five like most important men on this planet, like Morgan. Uh,

1549
01:45:26,680 --> 01:45:28,560
I mean basically like I mean World War One basically

1550
01:45:28,600 --> 01:45:31,159
started because because of uh, it was like Morgan's firm

1551
01:45:31,239 --> 01:45:33,319
that it's that like at todder to Wall Street, and

1552
01:45:33,359 --> 01:45:36,000
it was it was JP Morgan that essentially called up

1553
01:45:36,000 --> 01:45:39,520
the White House and demanded Wilson like fixed this because

1554
01:45:39,560 --> 01:45:42,279
they had debt that wasn't gonna be serviced because they

1555
01:45:42,359 --> 01:45:45,239
got sold the Billy Goods by the British Crown. I mean,

1556
01:45:45,319 --> 01:45:47,000
I think we got into that our World War One series.

1557
01:45:47,039 --> 01:45:49,800
But yeah, it's like unfathomable. And and this this guy,

1558
01:45:49,880 --> 01:45:53,319
this new money he was concentrating in California. You know,

1559
01:45:53,720 --> 01:45:59,920
it's but something else that was happening. A lot of

1560
01:46:00,079 --> 01:46:05,800
people attribute the decadence of California to post war stuff

1561
01:46:05,880 --> 01:46:11,880
and Coulter Comfin and what they kind of improperly describe

1562
01:46:11,880 --> 01:46:15,239
as cultural Marxism and like low and precedes that that's

1563
01:46:15,279 --> 01:46:20,880
like a that's like a whole different issue. What was

1564
01:46:20,920 --> 01:46:25,560
called Barbary Coast euphemistically, it was basically that it was

1565
01:46:25,600 --> 01:46:32,000
basically California Red Light District. For context, because for the

1566
01:46:32,039 --> 01:46:34,479
geography contexts, I look this up. I mean, I know

1567
01:46:34,560 --> 01:46:37,119
that garea California reasonably well, but I'm not like I

1568
01:46:37,199 --> 01:46:38,800
was never truly lead local there. You must spend a

1569
01:46:38,800 --> 01:46:44,359
lot of time there. But the Barbary Coast like as

1570
01:46:44,359 --> 01:46:47,199
a red light district and like as a as a

1571
01:46:47,279 --> 01:46:50,319
community area as we call in Chicago. It was bounded

1572
01:46:50,319 --> 01:46:58,119
by Broadway, Kearney, Montgomery and Pacific Avenue, and its primary

1573
01:46:58,720 --> 01:47:02,920
revenues came from you know bars and taverns, but like

1574
01:47:03,079 --> 01:47:07,039
gambling joints and like dance halls that were basically just

1575
01:47:07,119 --> 01:47:13,479
like whorehouses, and there's like a burgaining uh trade, not

1576
01:47:13,720 --> 01:47:16,920
just for like teenage girls and adult women, but like

1577
01:47:17,079 --> 01:47:20,439
men as well as like kids, like really awful stuff

1578
01:47:23,000 --> 01:47:29,840
basically like a smartest bort of like Detancy. It was

1579
01:47:29,880 --> 01:47:33,800
William Randolph Hurst who shout all that down, which is fascinating,

1580
01:47:33,920 --> 01:47:39,119
and this he plays an essential role in in the

1581
01:47:39,199 --> 01:47:42,399
kind of rehabilitation of like the capitalists and the public mind.

1582
01:47:42,760 --> 01:47:46,039
And incidentally, filmed Citizen Kane is all about that, if

1583
01:47:46,039 --> 01:47:49,239
you read between the lines. But reading a little bit

1584
01:47:49,359 --> 01:47:53,439
ahead of ourselves. The first like actual like strip joint,

1585
01:47:53,600 --> 01:47:56,439
like it's been like peep shows and stuff obviously going

1586
01:47:56,520 --> 01:47:59,159
back like as long as there were like people in America,

1587
01:47:59,279 --> 01:48:02,640
but like a dedicated like strip bar you know like

1588
01:48:02,800 --> 01:48:06,119
newdi bar, Like the first one in America was at

1589
01:48:06,159 --> 01:48:09,680
the corner of Kearney in California and it opened in

1590
01:48:09,720 --> 01:48:15,239
eighteen eighty five. You know when this became uh, this

1591
01:48:15,359 --> 01:48:18,920
became something California was known for, like especially in San Francisco.

1592
01:48:19,000 --> 01:48:23,720
It wasn't only a port city, but you know it

1593
01:48:23,840 --> 01:48:26,640
kind of had like Alaska demographics early on. It's because

1594
01:48:26,680 --> 01:48:30,319
of like all the all the eighteen forty nine minors,

1595
01:48:30,840 --> 01:48:33,199
you know, so you had this like majority male population

1596
01:48:33,279 --> 01:48:35,159
of kind of rough hun guys, like a lot of

1597
01:48:35,199 --> 01:48:39,119
boomer fue in trouble with the law honestly and stuff.

1598
01:48:40,199 --> 01:48:43,920
You know. The women who were there, like the like

1599
01:48:44,000 --> 01:48:47,439
the young and youngish women who were there were disproportionately prostitutes.

1600
01:48:48,319 --> 01:48:50,520
I call them prostitutes. And I know that these like

1601
01:48:50,960 --> 01:48:53,800
figgy like wiki editor types in all either house, Like, no,

1602
01:48:53,880 --> 01:48:56,800
they're sex workers. Like now you're not you're not working

1603
01:48:56,880 --> 01:49:00,079
at sex if you say your pussy year prostitute. If

1604
01:49:00,079 --> 01:49:02,720
you like sling dope, you're not like an unlicensed pharmacist,

1605
01:49:02,760 --> 01:49:06,239
you're the dope man. You know that this really really

1606
01:49:06,279 --> 01:49:08,199
really bothers me. I Like I've had to like check

1607
01:49:08,279 --> 01:49:10,119
people in real life when they use that term, and like,

1608
01:49:10,159 --> 01:49:16,960
don't don't ever use that term. But where was I, oh,

1609
01:49:19,640 --> 01:49:22,359
you know, in these days, there wasn't a you know,

1610
01:49:22,399 --> 01:49:24,960
there wasn't like real like like as we think of

1611
01:49:25,079 --> 01:49:28,039
like a law enforcement that's a night that's a mid

1612
01:49:28,119 --> 01:49:32,720
nineteenth century innovation. It arrived in the East Coast first obviously,

1613
01:49:33,760 --> 01:49:36,319
but really until like the turn of the century, it

1614
01:49:36,479 --> 01:49:39,880
wasn't this ubiquitous thing, you know, and like this idea

1615
01:49:40,000 --> 01:49:42,159
that there's just like this police force kind of going

1616
01:49:42,199 --> 01:49:45,159
around looking for people committing crimes and like shaking down

1617
01:49:45,319 --> 01:49:50,000
the local whorehouse or the local you know, uh or

1618
01:49:50,039 --> 01:49:53,079
the local like poker den, the local opium den like that.

1619
01:49:53,439 --> 01:49:57,439
That wasn't the thing, you know. I find it fascinating

1620
01:49:57,439 --> 01:49:59,880
because people think like the police had this like permanent

1621
01:50:00,159 --> 01:50:02,640
perennial thing. They think the police or like the stars

1622
01:50:02,760 --> 01:50:05,079
or something like they do like the national state, like

1623
01:50:05,119 --> 01:50:08,520
the Westphalian state. They think it like has always existed,

1624
01:50:08,680 --> 01:50:11,680
it can never not exist, and it's like it's like

1625
01:50:11,880 --> 01:50:14,079
time or matter or the weather. And I try to

1626
01:50:14,119 --> 01:50:16,199
explain to them, like no, you don't, like like the

1627
01:50:16,279 --> 01:50:18,439
police aren't like one of the elements like get your

1628
01:50:18,520 --> 01:50:22,920
head out of your ass. But but point being, there's

1629
01:50:22,960 --> 01:50:27,760
this psychotomy in California, you know, and honestly, I mean

1630
01:50:27,800 --> 01:50:29,760
that's part of the creative destruction of capitalism.

1631
01:50:29,800 --> 01:50:29,920
Speaker 1: You know.

1632
01:50:29,920 --> 01:50:34,319
Speaker 2: It was like vice, you know, because I'm not I'm

1633
01:50:34,359 --> 01:50:38,520
not falling back on Marxist trophes or something about a

1634
01:50:38,920 --> 01:50:42,600
capitalism like assaults the soul. And but I mean when

1635
01:50:42,640 --> 01:50:45,359
anytime you have people with money to spend, especially when

1636
01:50:45,399 --> 01:50:49,239
you have like a heavily male population, Like men aren't

1637
01:50:49,239 --> 01:50:51,039
any more prone to sin than women, but there's certain

1638
01:50:51,119 --> 01:50:53,119
kinds of stuff that's bad for you that men like

1639
01:50:54,520 --> 01:50:56,119
I think we can all agree on the next we're

1640
01:50:56,119 --> 01:51:00,199
all adults here, and that tends to the demand that

1641
01:51:00,359 --> 01:51:02,960
kind of thing as well as people willing to make

1642
01:51:03,000 --> 01:51:06,680
it available. That there's there's like a minuet between those

1643
01:51:06,720 --> 01:51:12,399
two tendencies. But so I'm getting as well describing this

1644
01:51:13,039 --> 01:51:15,000
isn't to say, like, see, things have always been this

1645
01:51:15,119 --> 01:51:17,399
way on the West Coast. I'm not saying that at all.

1646
01:51:17,600 --> 01:51:20,359
I mean that's true, but there there was a tremendous

1647
01:51:20,439 --> 01:51:24,880
backlash against it, and California became known going in part

1648
01:51:24,920 --> 01:51:27,439
to these guys like hers to build entire careers out

1649
01:51:27,520 --> 01:51:33,199
of out of kind of like cleaning up vice and things.

1650
01:51:33,800 --> 01:51:37,199
But this kind of this kind of crusading like moralist

1651
01:51:37,279 --> 01:51:42,600
culture that was very much based in congregational Christianity, specifically

1652
01:51:42,760 --> 01:51:47,279
Methodism from day one, like took roote in California, and

1653
01:51:47,359 --> 01:51:49,199
the only thing really comparable is kind of like the

1654
01:51:49,319 --> 01:51:52,319
church culture of the South. You know, it's this idea

1655
01:51:52,439 --> 01:51:55,520
that this idea that California was always this kind of

1656
01:51:55,560 --> 01:52:01,720
like massive uh like then of ill repute that was

1657
01:52:01,720 --> 01:52:03,520
always different from the rest of the country, and it's

1658
01:52:03,520 --> 01:52:12,079
always had this kind of like tolerance for for debased passions,

1659
01:52:12,159 --> 01:52:15,079
particularly of a sexual nature and things that wasn't true

1660
01:52:15,079 --> 01:52:19,359
at all, like if anything, people were I mean, it's

1661
01:52:19,359 --> 01:52:22,239
not only a culture of extremes, but in some ways

1662
01:52:22,279 --> 01:52:25,600
like people were like way more uptight in r which

1663
01:52:25,600 --> 01:52:28,119
I'll get into an episode three. We're in r like

1664
01:52:28,199 --> 01:52:29,680
way more uptight a that kind of stuff than in

1665
01:52:29,720 --> 01:52:32,439
the Midwest. Like it plays like shy town. It's very

1666
01:52:32,520 --> 01:52:35,600
much below Bard. You don't see it, but everybody knows

1667
01:52:35,680 --> 01:52:38,000
about it and there's not people like crusding against it.

1668
01:52:38,840 --> 01:52:41,600
That's that's like a California thing and a Southern thing.

1669
01:52:42,159 --> 01:52:45,439
I'm not putting shade on other culture, but you know,

1670
01:52:45,600 --> 01:52:48,600
the the point is that if California is like anywhere,

1671
01:52:48,760 --> 01:52:54,319
it's like the South, it's it's not this, you know,

1672
01:52:54,840 --> 01:52:57,319
it's not what people think it is. You know, it's not.

1673
01:52:57,479 --> 01:52:58,960
It's not It's not a bunch of people who think

1674
01:52:59,039 --> 01:53:02,079
like Berkeley liberals, is what I'm getting at, you know.

1675
01:53:02,760 --> 01:53:04,640
And even even where the even where the even where

1676
01:53:04,640 --> 01:53:07,439
the institutionalized vice comes from there, it doesn't come from

1677
01:53:07,439 --> 01:53:12,199
the places people think it does. But but yeah, it was.

1678
01:53:12,279 --> 01:53:17,520
It was basically William randolf Hurst who became this like

1679
01:53:17,760 --> 01:53:24,680
anti kind of vice crusader during the progressive era, and

1680
01:53:24,800 --> 01:53:28,159
like what immediately preceded it, you know, Hearst Also he

1681
01:53:28,239 --> 01:53:33,920
was the first real like newspaper like magnate he he

1682
01:53:34,399 --> 01:53:37,159
he founded the San Francisco Examiner, which was like a

1683
01:53:37,319 --> 01:53:41,159
huge paper, which like I remember it was a huge

1684
01:53:41,199 --> 01:53:42,640
paper still like when I was a kid and like

1685
01:53:42,680 --> 01:53:49,039
a teenager. You know. The uh, Hearst has sank eight

1686
01:53:49,199 --> 01:53:54,720
million dollars into it to compete basically with like the

1687
01:53:54,840 --> 01:53:57,680
top like East Coast media brands you know, which again

1688
01:53:57,800 --> 01:54:00,800
that was beyond like a princely sum in those days.

1689
01:54:03,680 --> 01:54:10,199
He people claim he helped start the Spanish American War.

1690
01:54:11,319 --> 01:54:13,560
I mean, you know, Heurris was obviously considered the father

1691
01:54:13,640 --> 01:54:18,039
of yellow journalism and Citizen Kane. Like you know, it's

1692
01:54:18,079 --> 01:54:20,119
obviously he spoking about Herst, and it paints him and

1693
01:54:20,159 --> 01:54:22,079
some ways as a monster would also paints him. It's

1694
01:54:22,119 --> 01:54:24,840
kind of just like it's just kind of like godlike

1695
01:54:24,960 --> 01:54:27,119
figure almost like I don't know if people are familiar,

1696
01:54:27,399 --> 01:54:30,640
if you yourself are, if you're familiar with the glass

1697
01:54:30,760 --> 01:54:34,640
bes by Ernesty Junger, like like Hearst was like Zapperoni

1698
01:54:34,800 --> 01:54:36,520
was kind of like Walt Disney. He meets like William

1699
01:54:36,600 --> 01:54:40,479
Randolph Hurst. That's why like I think of him. But

1700
01:54:41,439 --> 01:54:45,880
you know Hurst, uh he uh he ran this uh

1701
01:54:46,479 --> 01:54:54,239
incredibly hostile and Bellacho's copy against the uh the Spaniards.

1702
01:54:57,600 --> 01:55:01,960
He uh endorsed political assassination of America's and of quote

1703
01:55:02,000 --> 01:55:08,039
America's enemies, and he backpedaled when people criticized him for

1704
01:55:08,119 --> 01:55:09,760
it's like, oh, this was only this was only a

1705
01:55:09,880 --> 01:55:12,079
mental exercise, but it was like obvious he was talking

1706
01:55:12,119 --> 01:55:17,039
about like assassinating, like assassinating the Spanish leadership. It's just

1707
01:55:17,199 --> 01:55:24,319
kind of like crazy, reckless stuff. But he Uh, he

1708
01:55:24,479 --> 01:55:28,760
hated McKinley. President McKinley so like some of his ops

1709
01:55:28,840 --> 01:55:35,720
like tried to blame him for the the assassination of McKinley. That, uh,

1710
01:55:35,840 --> 01:55:42,079
it's a very very interesting guy and obviously too like

1711
01:55:42,119 --> 01:55:49,520
when World War One arrived that California got with another

1712
01:55:49,600 --> 01:55:56,880
infusion of capitalization by way of public subsidies. But sorry,

1713
01:55:58,920 --> 01:56:04,520
that really that really built it as an essential hub

1714
01:56:04,640 --> 01:56:11,359
of military industrial power, and it also made it even

1715
01:56:11,399 --> 01:56:15,279
more cephilidic because you had this mass of soldiers, sailors,

1716
01:56:15,479 --> 01:56:20,279
marines and the camp followers that attend that you know,

1717
01:56:20,359 --> 01:56:24,840
there was a whole army of prostitutes and all kinds

1718
01:56:24,840 --> 01:56:30,039
of other incidental goodies like drugs and gambling and alcohol,

1719
01:56:30,560 --> 01:56:32,840
which I've always been with us even't used to be

1720
01:56:33,079 --> 01:56:38,399
promoted over your smartphone. But you know, sometimes people convince

1721
01:56:38,479 --> 01:56:41,640
themselves that these are new things because they want to

1722
01:56:41,680 --> 01:56:45,000
idealize the past. It's like what progressives do in reverse,

1723
01:56:45,079 --> 01:56:50,000
Like progressives are symboltons, you think that, like the thing

1724
01:56:50,079 --> 01:56:52,960
that the future is, like the Jetsons, you know, like

1725
01:56:53,279 --> 01:56:57,760
like they're they're kind of bourgeois like nominal ops or

1726
01:56:57,800 --> 01:57:01,199
people who who think that like the asked, was the flintstones.

1727
01:57:02,600 --> 01:57:07,399
It's fucking returned. But even though it does seem like

1728
01:57:07,439 --> 01:57:10,000
a natural stopping place, and I keep going like I'm

1729
01:57:10,000 --> 01:57:13,479
gonna it's it's gonna be, I'm gonna have to like

1730
01:57:13,560 --> 01:57:16,239
interrupt the kind of next phase of what I wanted

1731
01:57:16,279 --> 01:57:19,000
to talk about. Yeah, I I'm sorry didn't get to

1732
01:57:19,000 --> 01:57:21,399
as much as I wanted today. I promised episode three,

1733
01:57:21,600 --> 01:57:23,880
like I'll I'll wrap this up and I'll get to

1734
01:57:23,960 --> 01:57:28,359
the meat of like data and things about blue California.

1735
01:57:30,000 --> 01:57:32,960
Speaker 1: Okay, all right, no problem at all. Do some quick

1736
01:57:33,039 --> 01:57:35,319
plugs and uh, we'll finish this up.

1737
01:57:36,159 --> 01:57:40,680
Speaker 2: Yeah, certainly you can find me on social media at

1738
01:57:41,479 --> 01:57:45,640
Capital r e A L underscore number seven h O

1739
01:57:45,840 --> 01:57:52,000
M A S seven seven seven. I. I recently started

1740
01:57:52,079 --> 01:57:55,079
using my own name, like my my Christian name on

1741
01:57:55,239 --> 01:58:03,560
social media, my government name because X terrorizes me when

1742
01:58:03,800 --> 01:58:07,279
I have a post that like catches fire and like

1743
01:58:07,399 --> 01:58:10,319
the algorithm goes nuts and says I'm doing heat things

1744
01:58:10,399 --> 01:58:14,800
and it got triggered somehow and or activated and saying

1745
01:58:14,880 --> 01:58:17,399
that my name was like a heat word or something.

1746
01:58:17,520 --> 01:58:19,880
So I put in my government name. So like if

1747
01:58:19,920 --> 01:58:22,079
they say that again, it's like, well, how can I

1748
01:58:22,199 --> 01:58:23,840
how can I? How can my government name be a

1749
01:58:23,960 --> 01:58:30,720
hate word? But yeah, so what's the same. It's the

1750
01:58:30,800 --> 01:58:34,960
same alt it just displays different. But best place to

1751
01:58:35,079 --> 01:58:37,880
find my work product and to just kind of get

1752
01:58:37,920 --> 01:58:41,039
acquainted because we've got a pretty active chat there. Two

1753
01:58:41,479 --> 01:58:46,439
is on substack. That's where my podcast is and all

1754
01:58:46,520 --> 01:58:48,439
kinds of other good stuff. That's also kind of where

1755
01:58:48,479 --> 01:58:52,520
I announced, like when I'm organizing meat meet ups and

1756
01:58:52,680 --> 01:58:57,640
fun things. It's real capital R E A L. Thomas

1757
01:58:58,000 --> 01:59:05,279
seven seven seven that's substacked. I'm on T Graham. I've

1758
01:59:05,359 --> 01:59:08,720
got my own website. It's number seven each one as

1759
01:59:09,079 --> 01:59:12,439
seven seven seven dot com. I mean my Instagram, I'm

1760
01:59:12,479 --> 01:59:15,439
on Telegram. I'm all over the place just seeking you.

1761
01:59:15,520 --> 01:59:17,319
She'll find all.

1762
01:59:17,279 --> 01:59:21,119
Speaker 1: Right, Thank you, Thomas. I appreciate it. Until part three. Yeah, man,

1763
01:59:22,159 --> 01:59:25,680
I want to welcome everyone back to the Pekingana Show. Thomas.

1764
01:59:25,720 --> 01:59:26,760
It seems like it's been a while.

1765
01:59:26,880 --> 01:59:28,840
Speaker 2: How have you been doing I've been all right, man.

1766
01:59:29,039 --> 01:59:30,279
Happy New Year to everybody.

1767
01:59:31,560 --> 01:59:33,720
Speaker 1: Happy New Year. Yeah, we're doing this on New Year's Day.

1768
01:59:33,840 --> 01:59:37,840
We are going to uh close out the California series,

1769
01:59:38,039 --> 01:59:39,720
so jump right in.

1770
01:59:40,960 --> 01:59:46,600
Speaker 2: Seeking a look at Pappy Cannon's book State of Emergency

1771
01:59:49,399 --> 01:59:55,439
from I think I think it dropped around twenty eleven

1772
01:59:55,560 --> 02:00:03,199
twenty twelve, somewhere around there. The context is his book

1773
02:00:03,319 --> 02:00:08,560
on World War Two. It's a good kind of at

1774
02:00:08,680 --> 02:00:13,640
a glance volume. It's kind of like the cliff notes

1775
02:00:13,760 --> 02:00:17,399
version of a lot of stuff Harry Elmer Barnes wrote about,

1776
02:00:17,439 --> 02:00:24,960
and JB. Taylor and people like that. But the endnotes

1777
02:00:25,000 --> 02:00:28,439
that very useful, and some then even utilizing it for

1778
02:00:29,960 --> 02:00:36,600
some things. But the canon obviously, he was somebody who

1779
02:00:36,680 --> 02:00:41,520
was always kind of raising the proverbial alarm bells about

1780
02:00:41,640 --> 02:00:46,319
the immigration crisis, which is well placed, but he missed,

1781
02:00:46,520 --> 02:00:49,159
he misdiagnosed what was going on in California. And I

1782
02:00:49,359 --> 02:00:53,159
think to this day people continue to like they talk

1783
02:00:53,239 --> 02:00:56,640
about I mean, first of all, they claim that like

1784
02:00:56,920 --> 02:01:00,159
California is liberal because of Hispanics. That's not true. When

1785
02:01:00,159 --> 02:01:03,520
we're gonna get into that, that's not why. But also

1786
02:01:03,880 --> 02:01:06,800
they talk about California almost like it's a giant ulster

1787
02:01:07,039 --> 02:01:09,560
or something like. What I mean by as they talk

1788
02:01:09,640 --> 02:01:12,479
about it, you can included like, oh, there's this core

1789
02:01:12,640 --> 02:01:17,159
population of Mexicans like identify with Mexico. That's really not

1790
02:01:17,279 --> 02:01:24,039
what's going on, you know, and like like traditionally Spanish California. Yeah,

1791
02:01:24,159 --> 02:01:27,840
they're not particularly assimilated. Like yeah, they're very much kind

1792
02:01:27,840 --> 02:01:32,560
of like hood local in their perspective, but they they

1793
02:01:32,640 --> 02:01:35,600
don't want to be part of Mexico. There's not guys

1794
02:01:35,680 --> 02:01:39,800
in like East La who are acting like the provos

1795
02:01:39,840 --> 02:01:42,760
in nineteen seventy and trying to like cultivate ties with

1796
02:01:42,880 --> 02:01:46,359
Mexico for some political union. Like it's not happening. And

1797
02:01:46,439 --> 02:01:51,520
if anything, even in hoods where like people mostly speak Spanish,

1798
02:01:53,560 --> 02:01:55,880
like people come over the border are kind of like

1799
02:01:55,920 --> 02:01:58,680
look down upon, you know, I mean like that's even

1800
02:01:58,720 --> 02:02:02,039
to this day. I mean, uh so, like that's not

1801
02:02:02,079 --> 02:02:04,880
what's happening. You can't look at the situation as again,

1802
02:02:05,039 --> 02:02:08,640
like something where it's like a giant ulster or like

1803
02:02:08,760 --> 02:02:11,760
a Bosnia situation where it's like there's kind of like

1804
02:02:12,000 --> 02:02:16,159
organic migration of like Mexicans and oh, you know Mexico

1805
02:02:16,239 --> 02:02:20,760
is reabsorbing California. That's that's not happening, and if it was,

1806
02:02:20,800 --> 02:02:24,920
it'd be playing out totally differently. But that's also why

1807
02:02:26,039 --> 02:02:30,840
it's cap the claim, oh California is liberal because of Mexicans.

1808
02:02:30,880 --> 02:02:32,720
It's like I mean, like I was saying, so so

1809
02:02:33,000 --> 02:02:36,680
so Hispanics love Barbara Boxer, you know, and like the

1810
02:02:37,720 --> 02:02:40,680
something Buchanan was saying was you know, like after I mean,

1811
02:02:40,720 --> 02:02:42,680
John McCain was like a total piece of shit, but

1812
02:02:42,720 --> 02:02:44,600
he was also just like a fucking idiot and like

1813
02:02:46,520 --> 02:02:52,159
you know, he was his kind of idiotic uh Poluca

1814
02:02:53,399 --> 02:02:58,479
stand in campaign contra Obama. I remember, Like that's that

1815
02:02:58,520 --> 02:03:00,279
was kind of the peak of the narrative, Like like

1816
02:03:01,000 --> 02:03:05,199
white California is done. It's like, well, apparently it's not

1817
02:03:05,479 --> 02:03:07,880
man because much of them a dislike the people who

1818
02:03:07,960 --> 02:03:14,960
represent you know, my own tribes demographic, like Gavin Newsom

1819
02:03:15,079 --> 02:03:17,520
is almost certainly gonna be like the nominee in twenty

1820
02:03:17,600 --> 02:03:20,000
twenty eight, and that guy's like as that guy and

1821
02:03:20,039 --> 02:03:22,399
his wife for like his old money in California is

1822
02:03:22,800 --> 02:03:25,720
as it comes. You know, this is very very fake,

1823
02:03:25,920 --> 02:03:28,640
is my point. You know, like it's not like the

1824
02:03:28,680 --> 02:03:33,079
way people talk. You'd think that Mexico is making like

1825
02:03:33,239 --> 02:03:38,279
sovereign territorial claims on like California, and that like Caesar

1826
02:03:38,439 --> 02:03:41,800
Chavez type guys were popping up and demanding access to government,

1827
02:03:41,920 --> 02:03:44,319
Like nothing like that is happening, and that's one of

1828
02:03:44,359 --> 02:03:48,560
the ways you know that this is fake. And like,

1829
02:03:48,640 --> 02:03:51,279
don't get me wrong, there's like definitely a capital flight

1830
02:03:51,359 --> 02:03:54,199
from California and they've lost like a huge number of

1831
02:03:54,279 --> 02:03:58,760
like white people, but anybody who can is leaving California,

1832
02:03:59,560 --> 02:04:04,520
and which inter thing too. You know, I make the

1833
02:04:04,640 --> 02:04:07,640
point of you know, I emphasize the point a lot.

1834
02:04:08,680 --> 02:04:13,079
That's a mistake to try and like extrapolate from what

1835
02:04:13,279 --> 02:04:16,000
goes on in the street or in the penitentiary or

1836
02:04:17,039 --> 02:04:20,479
you know, to like broader political demographic tendencies. But it

1837
02:04:20,520 --> 02:04:24,199
does tell you something. You know, Whites and Mexicans on

1838
02:04:24,279 --> 02:04:28,680
the street in California like click up very heavily, and

1839
02:04:29,199 --> 02:04:33,640
California is hyper racialized, and like both Serranos and whites

1840
02:04:33,720 --> 02:04:36,239
like look at blacks as like they're ops. I go

1841
02:04:36,319 --> 02:04:39,359
as far as to say they actually hate them, you know.

1842
02:04:42,439 --> 02:04:47,920
And South Central interestingly, you know, California see Council, Like

1843
02:04:48,000 --> 02:04:51,760
they don't call it South Central anymore. They really kind

1844
02:04:51,880 --> 02:04:54,920
I've been trying to like wipe its reputation out of

1845
02:04:55,000 --> 02:05:00,319
existences like this kind of failing black hood you know,

1846
02:05:00,560 --> 02:05:04,920
in the middle of LA. I mean that's kind of

1847
02:05:04,960 --> 02:05:09,520
another issue. But you know, what's now South Los Angeles,

1848
02:05:10,359 --> 02:05:14,159
Like basically within fifteen years it lost like forty percent

1849
02:05:14,239 --> 02:05:17,119
of their black population, you know. I mean that's the

1850
02:05:17,239 --> 02:05:24,359
real ethnic cleansing in my opinion. But the you know,

1851
02:05:24,640 --> 02:05:26,119
like we were talking about the other week, and I'll

1852
02:05:26,159 --> 02:05:28,600
get into the brass texts of data and things.

1853
02:05:28,880 --> 02:05:31,359
Speaker 1: In a minute. What can I can I can I

1854
02:05:31,439 --> 02:05:34,920
jump in real quick? Yeah, of course was that a

1855
02:05:36,079 --> 02:05:42,000
I mean I've heard stories of Mexicans basically going in, yeah,

1856
02:05:43,680 --> 02:05:47,600
armed to clear out parts of South Central and to

1857
02:05:47,760 --> 02:05:50,399
chase blacks out like it is an open war.

1858
02:05:50,920 --> 02:05:53,640
Speaker 2: I mean, I don't know, it's possible, like all. What

1859
02:05:53,800 --> 02:05:57,119
I do know is this even like seriously racialized, like

1860
02:05:57,279 --> 02:06:01,720
white guys they click up. It's not just convenience, like

1861
02:06:01,800 --> 02:06:08,039
them in the Serenos have this weird affinity and they

1862
02:06:08,159 --> 02:06:13,520
both like really really really have bad feelings towards the blacks.

1863
02:06:13,680 --> 02:06:16,520
And it's not like that here, you know, like racist

1864
02:06:16,600 --> 02:06:20,640
as we are in Chicago. Even dudes in the game,

1865
02:06:20,680 --> 02:06:23,640
even like white dudes who gang bang, and even in

1866
02:06:23,680 --> 02:06:26,960
the early nineties, like when things were really bad, you

1867
02:06:27,079 --> 02:06:29,960
generally don't find dudes who like hate blacks, even if

1868
02:06:29,960 --> 02:06:32,079
they don't like associate with them, and even if they

1869
02:06:32,239 --> 02:06:36,079
like respect the color line kind of rigidly. So I mean,

1870
02:06:36,159 --> 02:06:40,439
I I guess my point is it's I don't except

1871
02:06:40,439 --> 02:06:43,760
the California is one day being super liberal everything else aside,

1872
02:06:44,319 --> 02:06:47,479
when you've got this like profound enmity between people's like

1873
02:06:47,560 --> 02:06:50,479
that just that doesn't happen, you know, like that that's

1874
02:06:50,520 --> 02:06:55,600
just not the way things are. And I think too,

1875
02:06:56,000 --> 02:06:57,319
I think one of the things that kind of killed

1876
02:06:57,359 --> 02:07:01,199
the fortunes of black folks in California, I mean, the

1877
02:07:01,399 --> 02:07:04,880
LA Riots. It wasn't despite the way I mean now

1878
02:07:04,960 --> 02:07:07,600
people just don't talk about it, which is interesting. I mean,

1879
02:07:07,680 --> 02:07:12,680
like regime people and adjacent media elements. But you know,

1880
02:07:12,720 --> 02:07:16,399
the LA Riots were basically blacks becoming like ebk's like

1881
02:07:16,479 --> 02:07:18,960
they went to war with everybody. Like It's not like

1882
02:07:19,039 --> 02:07:23,039
it was some like you know, colored revolt or whatever.

1883
02:07:23,079 --> 02:07:24,800
I mean, that kind of shouldn't really happen anyway, But

1884
02:07:24,880 --> 02:07:27,079
it is like very nakedly like black folks on the

1885
02:07:27,159 --> 02:07:31,479
warpath and that really scared a lot of people, would

1886
02:07:31,479 --> 02:07:34,840
also like radicalize a lot of people. And like after that,

1887
02:07:36,439 --> 02:07:38,199
it's kind of like the gloves came off. I mean,

1888
02:07:38,199 --> 02:07:40,239
I know, you got this like random black lady who's

1889
02:07:40,680 --> 02:07:42,800
like the mayor of Los Angeles, but that but that's

1890
02:07:42,840 --> 02:07:47,159
fake as fuck, you know, like California's got they do

1891
02:07:47,279 --> 02:07:49,920
not have like a friendly relationship with their black population,

1892
02:07:51,000 --> 02:07:55,800
you know, and a lot of that. Uh, but that's

1893
02:07:55,880 --> 02:07:57,800
also too, you know. I mean that's one of the

1894
02:07:57,920 --> 02:08:02,199
reasons like when people try and painted with something like Reconquista,

1895
02:08:03,439 --> 02:08:06,119
there's not some like equivalent of the Watts Riots, where

1896
02:08:06,199 --> 02:08:09,880
like Spanish people like went berserk and started like burning

1897
02:08:09,880 --> 02:08:12,880
shit down, like that never happened, and like it's not

1898
02:08:12,920 --> 02:08:16,239
about to happen. I mean, not that that's the metric,

1899
02:08:16,359 --> 02:08:20,960
but it's okay. If if if Mexicans are supposedly these

1900
02:08:21,039 --> 02:08:24,439
guys with like conquest on their mind, who you know

1901
02:08:24,520 --> 02:08:27,039
again are basically like the you know, the provos of

1902
02:08:27,199 --> 02:08:29,319
the of Latin America, who are trying to like turn

1903
02:08:29,399 --> 02:08:34,279
California to Mexico. Why aren't they doing that, you know, like, uh,

1904
02:08:35,439 --> 02:08:40,039
it doesn't really play out and it's a different like

1905
02:08:40,119 --> 02:08:42,279
it's a different culture like these these a lot of

1906
02:08:42,279 --> 02:08:44,600
these La guys too, I mean, their families have been

1907
02:08:44,640 --> 02:08:47,880
there for like a century and a half. Like the

1908
02:08:47,960 --> 02:08:50,800
fact they don't really identify with America, okay, but they

1909
02:08:51,319 --> 02:08:53,399
don't like want to be part of Mexico either. I

1910
02:08:53,479 --> 02:08:54,439
mean it's like its own.

1911
02:08:54,319 --> 02:08:57,239
Speaker 1: Thing, you know, Like they're sort of like they're sort

1912
02:08:57,279 --> 02:08:59,319
of like the Tajanas in Texas.

1913
02:09:00,119 --> 02:09:03,000
Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, I mean, don't get me wrong. Like in

1914
02:09:03,119 --> 02:09:06,079
East La, it's very much like a proletarian culture and

1915
02:09:06,159 --> 02:09:11,479
it's very rough culture, you know, but it's it's like

1916
02:09:11,560 --> 02:09:15,079
its own thing, man. You know, like uh, and I

1917
02:09:15,159 --> 02:09:19,640
do have. I haven't been out there in a long time,

1918
02:09:20,079 --> 02:09:23,800
you know, since like two thousand. But as a kid,

1919
02:09:23,960 --> 02:09:26,079
I was like around this ship, you know. I mean

1920
02:09:26,119 --> 02:09:27,479
like I spent a lot. I spent a lot of

1921
02:09:27,560 --> 02:09:30,560
time in La and in like Ventura, ox nart In,

1922
02:09:30,680 --> 02:09:33,279
and you know, like it's not like my point of

1923
02:09:33,279 --> 02:09:34,960
the time, I was just like going to like Orange

1924
02:09:35,000 --> 02:09:39,960
County or something, you know, like I I I was.

1925
02:09:40,039 --> 02:09:43,479
I was around like Sokale like Mexicans. You know. I

1926
02:09:43,520 --> 02:09:45,640
could play like ball with them and stuff, you know,

1927
02:09:45,960 --> 02:09:47,680
and like skate with him and ship. You know, I

1928
02:09:47,760 --> 02:09:49,920
got to know somebody these guys like reasonably well. And

1929
02:09:51,680 --> 02:09:54,600
it was I mean I realized the nineteen eighties were

1930
02:09:54,600 --> 02:09:58,479
a lot different, But you know that well, for our purposes,

1931
02:09:59,239 --> 02:10:05,880
it's it's material, but it's also just you know, I'll

1932
02:10:05,880 --> 02:10:10,199
get into our dad in a minute. But you know too,

1933
02:10:12,359 --> 02:10:14,079
I can't remember who made the point. It might have

1934
02:10:14,159 --> 02:10:16,800
been Ron Onnes. They made it for a different the

1935
02:10:16,920 --> 02:10:24,000
conducting booked it was different. But from this nineteen sixties onward,

1936
02:10:24,680 --> 02:10:26,800
like the early sixties I'm talking about, like Kennedy era,

1937
02:10:28,600 --> 02:10:33,039
both houses of the state legislature were usually Democrat, at

1938
02:10:33,159 --> 02:10:37,680
least by narrow majority, but they weren't particularly liberal. You know.

1939
02:10:37,840 --> 02:10:41,760
So this idea that uh oh, you know, if the

1940
02:10:41,840 --> 02:10:45,720
Republican Party dies in California, then everybody's liberal, like that

1941
02:10:45,800 --> 02:10:51,399
doesn't track either, you know, like you had you had

1942
02:10:51,600 --> 02:10:56,520
you had these name mestizo people who are not remotely

1943
02:10:56,640 --> 02:10:58,720
liberal in their outlook, and you had these guys who

1944
02:10:58,840 --> 02:11:03,039
worked in you know, like machine shops and stuff that

1945
02:11:03,119 --> 02:11:05,520
kind of served the aerospace industry. Like a lot of

1946
02:11:05,560 --> 02:11:08,680
those people they vote Democrat because like their union ship

1947
02:11:08,880 --> 02:11:10,680
Steward is like, yeah, this is who we vote for,

1948
02:11:11,960 --> 02:11:15,359
you know. So that's that's kind of like a false

1949
02:11:15,479 --> 02:11:18,359
vinear too, because like the supposedly the metric of what's

1950
02:11:18,399 --> 02:11:21,359
going on in California is like who's voting for Republicans?

1951
02:11:22,439 --> 02:11:26,319
You know? And I I don't know, Schwarzenegger is a

1952
02:11:26,359 --> 02:11:29,279
total idiot, but he uh, you know, the the way

1953
02:11:29,359 --> 02:11:33,800
he got elected was basically he was basically a single

1954
02:11:33,840 --> 02:11:40,199
issue campaign and people were outraged at was it Davis,

1955
02:11:40,439 --> 02:11:50,319
Gray Davis or was it somebody else? But who Wilson

1956
02:11:50,359 --> 02:11:53,520
are Great Davis? I can't remember. But the big issue

1957
02:11:53,560 --> 02:11:57,720
with Schwartzegger's campaign was he was, you know, I'm gonna,

1958
02:11:57,920 --> 02:12:01,760
I'm gonna, I'm gonna repeal the I can to repeal

1959
02:12:01,800 --> 02:12:05,119
the statute that allows illegal aliens to get driver's licenses.

1960
02:12:05,439 --> 02:12:08,399
So then suddenly like people like swarm to Schwarzenegger is

1961
02:12:08,439 --> 02:12:11,720
like their candidate, you know. And I mean so supposedly,

1962
02:12:13,319 --> 02:12:15,159
you know that. I mean, why would that even be

1963
02:12:15,199 --> 02:12:18,359
an issue of California after ninety two? Is is like

1964
02:12:18,439 --> 02:12:23,359
this irridentist like Hispanic Paradise. That's basically like it left

1965
02:12:23,399 --> 02:12:26,760
wing is Swedened. I mean, like that doesn't that doesn't

1966
02:12:26,800 --> 02:12:29,880
make any It doesn't describe a political culture that actually exists,

1967
02:12:31,000 --> 02:12:35,119
you know. And I think what's most kind of damning.

1968
02:12:36,760 --> 02:12:39,960
Speaker 1: Is, uh, by the way it was Gray Davis.

1969
02:12:40,159 --> 02:12:43,399
Speaker 2: Okay, Okay, yeah, yeah, thanks, ML's sleepy, like forgive me.

1970
02:12:46,119 --> 02:12:51,920
But the uh, you know, the referendum votes are really

1971
02:12:52,039 --> 02:12:55,159
kind of what tells us that this narrative is false.

1972
02:12:55,319 --> 02:12:58,800
And you know Proposition one eighty seven that's kind of

1973
02:12:58,840 --> 02:13:01,000
like ominously named consider.

1974
02:13:01,600 --> 02:13:04,560
Speaker 1: Oh I know, I remember that. When that happened, I

1975
02:13:04,680 --> 02:13:07,000
was like, oh, that they did that on purpose.

1976
02:13:07,920 --> 02:13:10,560
Speaker 2: Yeah, so Prop onety seven it was. It was also

1977
02:13:10,680 --> 02:13:15,840
known by the political action committees that devised it as

1978
02:13:15,880 --> 02:13:19,800
the SOS Initiative Save Our State. So this is in

1979
02:13:19,960 --> 02:13:24,520
nineteen ninety four, supposedly after like the new majority is

1980
02:13:25,119 --> 02:13:33,760
controlling political processes, only the democratic shifts it. Uh. It

1981
02:13:33,880 --> 02:13:41,760
was basically the harshest legislative regime in the country that

1982
02:13:41,920 --> 02:13:45,840
would have deprived the illegal aliens of like all health

1983
02:13:45,880 --> 02:13:50,560
services other than you know, like emergency care, public education,

1984
02:13:51,520 --> 02:13:56,840
you know, social services. Like basically it basically precluded anybody

1985
02:13:56,840 --> 02:13:59,720
who couldn't prove they were a citizen from availing themselves

1986
02:13:59,760 --> 02:14:04,840
if they any of any of any social welfare aspects

1987
02:14:05,319 --> 02:14:09,520
at the state level, you know. And uh, this passed

1988
02:14:09,960 --> 02:14:16,000
by supermajority on November eight, nineteen ninety four. I mean, uh,

1989
02:14:16,479 --> 02:14:20,640
it was over five million votes about three and a

1990
02:14:20,680 --> 02:14:25,079
half millions, I mean about a fifty nine percent majority.

1991
02:14:25,439 --> 02:14:29,840
But what's most significant it was only the Bay Area

1992
02:14:30,000 --> 02:14:33,720
that opposed it. And I mean the Bay Area is

1993
02:14:33,800 --> 02:14:36,119
not urban in the kind of I mean in the

1994
02:14:36,199 --> 02:14:39,199
conventional sense I under the semny Europeans like to visit it.

1995
02:14:40,119 --> 02:14:44,479
So basically, you've got California with prop Oneity seven. You

1996
02:14:44,560 --> 02:14:50,119
got California from the Oregon border to San Diego. You

1997
02:14:50,199 --> 02:14:54,199
could drive from tip to tip, and every single county

1998
02:14:54,239 --> 02:14:59,560
you'd passed through voted for prop Oneity seven. With the

1999
02:14:59,640 --> 02:15:02,960
accept of like San Francisco and Berkeley, like that's that's

2000
02:15:03,039 --> 02:15:07,079
freaking insane, you know, like that's that's an absolute landslide,

2001
02:15:07,960 --> 02:15:11,479
you know. And and again too, we're not I don't

2002
02:15:11,520 --> 02:15:16,640
accept this notion that, you know, a majoritarian consensus in

2003
02:15:16,680 --> 02:15:19,960
counties is meaningless if they're quote like a rural or flyover.

2004
02:15:20,319 --> 02:15:24,119
That's this cap. But it would tell us something if

2005
02:15:24,359 --> 02:15:29,840
LA had come out against one eighty seven. But LA

2006
02:15:31,359 --> 02:15:36,520
fifty six percent voted, yes, you know, and it's like, okay,

2007
02:15:36,560 --> 02:15:38,720
that was thirty years ago. But the whole point is

2008
02:15:38,840 --> 02:15:42,279
nineteen ninety two was when it was declared that as

2009
02:15:42,359 --> 02:15:49,479
of now California is permanently blue, you know. So then uh,

2010
02:15:50,279 --> 02:15:54,760
the Supreme Court steps in and reverses it, you know.

2011
02:15:56,439 --> 02:15:59,600
But the follow up two years later was Prop. Two nine,

2012
02:16:00,720 --> 02:16:07,039
which was euphemistically branded the California Civil Rights Initiative, which

2013
02:16:07,119 --> 02:16:10,239
basically it was basically like the quota ban that was

2014
02:16:10,319 --> 02:16:13,800
floated by people like Jesse Helms like federally, but it

2015
02:16:13,880 --> 02:16:20,399
went further and it amended the California Constitution. It prohibited

2016
02:16:20,520 --> 02:16:29,880
like any state government institution from considering identitarian categories like race, sex, ethnicity,

2017
02:16:30,520 --> 02:16:34,000
national origin. Like they had to be like totally blind

2018
02:16:34,200 --> 02:16:40,600
in their hiring, in their contracting and allocation of education resources,

2019
02:16:40,719 --> 02:16:45,000
college admissions. And this was a big deal. It was

2020
02:16:45,120 --> 02:16:50,360
authored by these two sociologists, these two academic types, you know,

2021
02:16:50,360 --> 02:16:54,840
and they did that because that way opponents of it

2022
02:16:54,920 --> 02:16:57,079
couldn't come out and see like, well this is a cynical,

2023
02:16:57,799 --> 02:17:01,200
xenophobic ploy. It's like no, they really dotted their eyes

2024
02:17:01,360 --> 02:17:06,600
and crossed the baverbial teas. This was the first referendum

2025
02:17:06,680 --> 02:17:11,399
on affirmative action, like true referendum. You know. It passed

2026
02:17:11,479 --> 02:17:16,600
with fifty five percent, and once again, like the entire

2027
02:17:16,840 --> 02:17:19,760
state like went for it. You know, it was the

2028
02:17:19,840 --> 02:17:25,399
same basic breakdown as Prop one eighty seven. You know,

2029
02:17:25,559 --> 02:17:28,200
so it's like so what so what exactly is happening here?

2030
02:17:29,520 --> 02:17:38,120
You know, And the the recourse of the open borders crowd,

2031
02:17:39,200 --> 02:17:41,399
you know, was to shop around for a federal judge

2032
02:17:42,879 --> 02:17:51,840
who'd repudiated and uh Pete Wilson. Pete Wilson was willing

2033
02:17:52,159 --> 02:17:56,680
to fight in the in the federal courts, but when

2034
02:17:56,719 --> 02:18:00,920
Gray Davis replaced him, like like they is basically just

2035
02:18:01,200 --> 02:18:05,040
uh he basically with the appeal died just by like

2036
02:18:05,120 --> 02:18:12,000
refusal to take action on it, you know. And so

2037
02:18:12,200 --> 02:18:17,120
once again, I remember at the time and people were

2038
02:18:17,200 --> 02:18:24,319
still banding this a decade later, during like Obama's campaign,

2039
02:18:25,159 --> 02:18:27,479
like oh this this was the last gasp of white

2040
02:18:27,479 --> 02:18:30,040
America and conservatives It's like, what the hell are you

2041
02:18:30,159 --> 02:18:33,000
talking about? Like you it's like every time one of these,

2042
02:18:33,879 --> 02:18:36,399
every time one of these referendums comes up, it passes

2043
02:18:36,479 --> 02:18:40,399
by super majority, and basically, you know, basically like the

2044
02:18:40,520 --> 02:18:44,559
Ninth Circuit intervenes to like undo the mandate. I mean,

2045
02:18:44,639 --> 02:18:49,559
like that's not you know, and of course too, I

2046
02:18:49,639 --> 02:18:53,239
mean obviously, like a like a substantial number of Hispanics,

2047
02:18:53,440 --> 02:18:57,920
like voted for these initiatives, you know, like this idea

2048
02:18:58,040 --> 02:19:02,559
that oh, Hispanics will to compete with illegal aliens for

2049
02:19:04,319 --> 02:19:08,399
you know, for for for jobs, and they're totally cool

2050
02:19:08,520 --> 02:19:12,040
with wages being bottomed out, and they're totally fine with

2051
02:19:13,040 --> 02:19:16,879
you know, paying property taxes to you know, to provide

2052
02:19:16,959 --> 02:19:21,559
like daycare and grade school for for random people who

2053
02:19:21,600 --> 02:19:24,920
grass that border. Like why, that's ridiculous, you know, I

2054
02:19:25,000 --> 02:19:31,159
mean it's you know, so it and that's what should

2055
02:19:31,200 --> 02:19:35,799
have been that that's what should have like allowed people

2056
02:19:35,840 --> 02:19:38,959
to allow the verbical scales to fall from their eyes.

2057
02:19:40,559 --> 02:19:42,479
You know, even even if you're one of these deluded

2058
02:19:42,559 --> 02:19:46,239
people who thinks that like the Republican Party is something

2059
02:19:46,319 --> 02:19:51,719
like synonymous with like white American opinion, or even if

2060
02:19:51,719 --> 02:19:57,639
you think that the way to you know, diagnose the

2061
02:19:58,479 --> 02:20:01,879
the political culture of any cal is like by how

2062
02:20:01,959 --> 02:20:05,360
the Republican Party's doing. I mean, that's that's fucking ridiculous.

2063
02:20:05,479 --> 02:20:12,520
But even if the rebuttal as well, what's the alternative metric?

2064
02:20:12,639 --> 02:20:15,440
It's like, well, in California, it's right here because they've

2065
02:20:15,479 --> 02:20:22,520
got this constitutionally mandated referendum structure or system. So there

2066
02:20:22,600 --> 02:20:29,319
you go, you know, like we talked about when last

2067
02:20:29,360 --> 02:20:33,879
week convene, you know, for to talk about this series.

2068
02:20:34,000 --> 02:20:41,479
It was from nineteen fifty two to nineteen eighty eight,

2069
02:20:44,520 --> 02:20:48,280
every presidential election but one went Republican, and more often

2070
02:20:48,280 --> 02:20:52,920
than not it was a landslide, you know, and then suddenly,

2071
02:20:55,079 --> 02:20:59,440
suddenly after nineteen eighty eight, you know, the Republicans always lose,

2072
02:20:59,520 --> 02:21:02,959
the always lose California in the presidential election, and it's

2073
02:21:03,079 --> 02:21:06,399
always by ten points or more. Like that's not a

2074
02:21:06,440 --> 02:21:11,159
statistical impossibility, obviously, But that doesn't really make any sense,

2075
02:21:12,079 --> 02:21:16,799
you know, because there was no there was no there

2076
02:21:16,840 --> 02:21:20,799
was no transition period. It's just like one day this change, supposedly,

2077
02:21:21,719 --> 02:21:26,159
and not only did it change, but it's like now

2078
02:21:26,360 --> 02:21:30,440
California can never be a swing state. It's just always blue.

2079
02:21:31,159 --> 02:21:34,280
You know, it just can never be flipped. You know.

2080
02:21:34,399 --> 02:21:39,040
That's not that that doesn't make any sense. You know,

2081
02:21:42,000 --> 02:21:47,079
there's a obviously, California is like the single greatest electoral

2082
02:21:47,239 --> 02:21:52,959
prize if you had an actually competitive system, like no

2083
02:21:53,040 --> 02:22:01,440
matter how solidly in like actual organic Termsfornia was aligned

2084
02:22:01,520 --> 02:22:08,799
in partisan capacities. Obviously, in an actually competitive system, you

2085
02:22:09,280 --> 02:22:12,799
campaign your ass off in California to try to flip it,

2086
02:22:13,440 --> 02:22:15,959
because anywhere can be flipped, even if it's just a

2087
02:22:16,040 --> 02:22:19,280
single issue like this idea that oh, this is a

2088
02:22:19,360 --> 02:22:23,360
safe state, so it can't be flipped. That ridiculous, that's Soviet,

2089
02:22:24,399 --> 02:22:27,719
you know, like why it metaphysically he can't be flipped?

2090
02:22:27,920 --> 02:22:32,959
Like what does it even mean? You know, the people

2091
02:22:32,959 --> 02:22:43,959
should be smarter about that shit. You know, it's and

2092
02:22:44,040 --> 02:22:48,680
the only you know, and again too, I mean, like

2093
02:22:48,799 --> 02:22:52,399
I said, Schwarzenegger was an idiot, but the and he

2094
02:22:52,479 --> 02:22:56,840
is an idiot, but uh, you know, the whole the

2095
02:22:56,920 --> 02:23:02,319
reason why, like his his campaign and his ultimate election

2096
02:23:03,319 --> 02:23:05,719
that was that was like the big Republican comeback. And

2097
02:23:05,840 --> 02:23:09,319
again like the only thing that campaign was built on

2098
02:23:09,799 --> 02:23:14,200
was like single issue immigration concerns, man, you know. And

2099
02:23:14,280 --> 02:23:16,639
so it's like and then every time something like this happens,

2100
02:23:17,520 --> 02:23:19,879
whether it's Prop twenty seven, whether it's Prop two nine,

2101
02:23:20,120 --> 02:23:22,079
whether it's you know, at Middle East, you know, he's

2102
02:23:22,079 --> 02:23:26,159
an idiot, but like somebody like Schwarzenegger getting elected, or

2103
02:23:26,200 --> 02:23:29,000
whether it's you know, a sudden like massive upstick and

2104
02:23:29,159 --> 02:23:32,000
like support for Trump, like it's, oh, this is the

2105
02:23:32,120 --> 02:23:37,079
last gasp of white America and conservatives. It's like every

2106
02:23:37,200 --> 02:23:39,520
ten years, there's like another last gasp. I mean, like

2107
02:23:39,600 --> 02:23:42,600
I don't, you know, and like I said, I don't

2108
02:23:44,559 --> 02:23:48,239
I stipulate that there's been this like massive capital flight,

2109
02:23:49,479 --> 02:23:54,520
but such that there is any so that there is

2110
02:23:54,600 --> 02:24:01,520
like any any, any equity remaining in California. It's you know,

2111
02:24:01,719 --> 02:24:04,520
it's it's it's the it's the vestigial white population that's

2112
02:24:04,559 --> 02:24:06,440
responsible for that. I mean, it's just like a fact.

2113
02:24:07,159 --> 02:24:10,200
I don't if if if they if they truly get

2114
02:24:10,319 --> 02:24:13,600
chased out, there's kind of no more California. You know,

2115
02:24:15,639 --> 02:24:18,239
nobody really wants that to be with self fulfilling prophecy,

2116
02:24:18,440 --> 02:24:23,879
like they don't, you know, And obviously they don't because again,

2117
02:24:24,040 --> 02:24:30,639
like it's not, it's not, it's not, it's not. It's

2118
02:24:30,680 --> 02:24:34,680
not some Spanish guy who's you know, talking about a

2119
02:24:34,760 --> 02:24:40,879
more dignified life for migrant farm workers, who's he's like,

2120
02:24:41,000 --> 02:24:45,399
he's like leading the California Democrats. It's uh, it's Gavin Newsome.

2121
02:24:45,479 --> 02:24:49,760
He's like a caricature of a caricature of some douchey

2122
02:24:50,440 --> 02:24:56,600
old money you know, uh, social registered type. You know.

2123
02:24:56,760 --> 02:25:01,319
So I mean, none of this really by the metrics,

2124
02:25:03,959 --> 02:25:06,559
by by its own metrics. It doesn't. It doesn't track

2125
02:25:06,680 --> 02:25:19,879
with anything, you know, and I, uh, yeah, the uh,

2126
02:25:24,840 --> 02:25:30,959
that's the that's the core of a that's the core

2127
02:25:31,000 --> 02:25:35,200
of the issue. And it's also to something that peak.

2128
02:25:35,280 --> 02:25:38,120
I don't I don't know what. I've had a hard

2129
02:25:38,200 --> 02:25:47,200
time finding meaningful data sets on this. But in in

2130
02:25:47,280 --> 02:25:50,639
the later nineties through I think about two thousand and three,

2131
02:25:54,280 --> 02:25:59,120
about one hundred thousand self identified white Californians were leaving

2132
02:25:59,200 --> 02:26:05,360
a year, and people claim this is what was responsible this,

2133
02:26:05,639 --> 02:26:12,799
this is primarily responsible for Asians capturing a bigger slice

2134
02:26:12,799 --> 02:26:18,799
the verbial demographic pie in terms of overall relative population numbers.

2135
02:26:21,840 --> 02:26:27,319
But uh, that seems to have stabilized. I mean, California

2136
02:26:27,319 --> 02:26:35,520
is still hemorrhaging people. But it's also these these minority

2137
02:26:35,639 --> 02:26:41,600
populations as they're called, you know, they're they're not monolithically

2138
02:26:41,719 --> 02:26:48,000
left wing like quite the contrary, you know, and uh,

2139
02:26:49,959 --> 02:26:56,239
if you look at in terms of income and assets,

2140
02:26:57,920 --> 02:27:00,639
you know, I I find it hard to believe that

2141
02:27:02,000 --> 02:27:07,200
a bunch of Taiwanese and Koreans and Japanese Americans in

2142
02:27:07,319 --> 02:27:13,159
California are really really enthusiastic about, you know, voting for

2143
02:27:14,280 --> 02:27:19,399
some like permanent you know, social justice regime out there.

2144
02:27:21,360 --> 02:27:25,079
You know, it's just not it just doesn't track man

2145
02:27:25,479 --> 02:27:31,719
And maybe I think this is somewhat difficult for people

2146
02:27:31,799 --> 02:27:37,000
to fully grasp who haven't spent time there, because it

2147
02:27:37,120 --> 02:27:40,000
is a strange state culturally and in every other way.

2148
02:27:40,120 --> 02:27:46,799
But you have to spend time at a fully grass

2149
02:27:46,959 --> 02:27:51,639
But it's not a liberal state culturally. You know, it's

2150
02:27:51,760 --> 02:27:58,360
very segregated, it's very there's a very sharp there's a

2151
02:27:58,399 --> 02:28:03,639
very sharply defined distance between people who are well off,

2152
02:28:03,719 --> 02:28:07,719
and we're not far more so than here for example.

2153
02:28:09,440 --> 02:28:23,040
You know, So any any kind of effort reconfigure or

2154
02:28:23,120 --> 02:28:28,040
social engineer the political culture there, I it would right

2155
02:28:28,120 --> 02:28:32,239
much be an edifice that isn't really propped up by

2156
02:28:32,280 --> 02:28:37,200
anything but rhetoric and jerrymandering, which will take you fairly

2157
02:28:37,360 --> 02:28:41,959
far in at the state level in a corrupt system.

2158
02:28:43,479 --> 02:28:49,719
But it's not, it's not it's not sustainable, and it's

2159
02:28:49,840 --> 02:28:56,719
it's certainly not some spontaneous development, you know. And the

2160
02:28:56,840 --> 02:29:01,360
point I make, that's all that Jay Burden about this

2161
02:29:01,600 --> 02:29:07,319
on our West Radio Free Chicago episode. I don't I

2162
02:29:07,360 --> 02:29:12,040
don't understand whether Republican Party still exists like that? Why

2163
02:29:12,159 --> 02:29:15,959
why does it premnier league exist. You know, that's not

2164
02:29:16,159 --> 02:29:20,319
really precedented in America for the for for party systems,

2165
02:29:21,479 --> 02:29:24,959
you know, to exist in perpetuity. I mean, just like

2166
02:29:25,639 --> 02:29:28,440
it doesn't really have a context anymore, like the Republicans don't.

2167
02:29:30,879 --> 02:29:35,000
But even if that weren't the case, it really doesn't

2168
02:29:35,000 --> 02:29:38,760
have a context in California, you know. So again, that's

2169
02:29:38,799 --> 02:29:45,360
a really piss poor metric for trying to discern the

2170
02:29:45,559 --> 02:29:50,799
mood of the culture in terms of political values. If

2171
02:29:50,920 --> 02:29:53,840
if like your your canary in the mind, for verbially

2172
02:29:54,040 --> 02:29:56,280
is like how the Republicans are doing, I mean that

2173
02:29:56,360 --> 02:29:59,360
that doesn't really mean anything. You know, like if I,

2174
02:30:00,760 --> 02:30:03,719
if I live in a truly battleground state, I'd vote

2175
02:30:03,760 --> 02:30:09,479
for Donald Trump, but I fucking hate the Republicans, and

2176
02:30:09,520 --> 02:30:15,959
I'm by by the by American standards, I'm pretty right wing, Okay,

2177
02:30:17,639 --> 02:30:20,399
I'd uh, I'd rather have a root canal than like

2178
02:30:20,520 --> 02:30:24,040
vote for the Republicans, you know, like they're Vegas like it,

2179
02:30:26,079 --> 02:30:30,280
So that that doesn't really tell us anything. And and

2180
02:30:30,399 --> 02:30:32,680
plus two, I mean even beyond that, beyond any kind

2181
02:30:32,680 --> 02:30:38,159
of like ethical objection, like what are the like, like,

2182
02:30:38,200 --> 02:30:40,920
what are the Republicans done for California? Like the nomine

2183
02:30:41,040 --> 02:30:45,000
idiots like Schwarzenegger, they don't. You don't even get like

2184
02:30:45,120 --> 02:30:48,360
tash relief from them in California, you know, like any

2185
02:30:48,399 --> 02:30:51,280
time that they don't, they don't have the stones too,

2186
02:30:55,719 --> 02:31:01,920
they don't like like like again, I mean Wilson, he

2187
02:31:02,360 --> 02:31:06,639
mounted like a kind of token challenge when the Federal

2188
02:31:06,760 --> 02:31:14,040
Circuit overturned overturned Prop onety seven. But I mean they

2189
02:31:14,079 --> 02:31:15,959
don't even like deliver on that stuff. They don't even

2190
02:31:16,000 --> 02:31:20,719
go through the motions. So it's like even if you know,

2191
02:31:20,840 --> 02:31:27,840
even if you were inclined to be like a GOP loyalist,

2192
02:31:28,000 --> 02:31:30,559
like there's no percentage in that in California because they

2193
02:31:30,600 --> 02:31:33,799
never deliver on anything, you know, so you're better off,

2194
02:31:35,840 --> 02:31:38,239
you know place like Tom Metzger said, Like when Metzger

2195
02:31:39,319 --> 02:31:42,319
during his brief career even like running for Congress and stuff,

2196
02:31:42,319 --> 02:31:44,639
and he actually did pretty well. It's an interesting story

2197
02:31:44,680 --> 02:31:47,280
in its own right, but you know, Metzger generally ran

2198
02:31:47,280 --> 02:31:49,399
as a Democrat because like what difference does it make

2199
02:31:49,479 --> 02:31:51,360
it doesn't you know.

2200
02:31:53,879 --> 02:31:53,920
Speaker 1: It?

2201
02:31:56,440 --> 02:32:01,079
Speaker 2: So yeah, it's it's a very it's very it's very

2202
02:32:01,120 --> 02:32:07,239
imprecise and as far to say dishonest, you know, now

2203
02:32:07,280 --> 02:32:11,520
that I expect a lot of integrity from it's kind

2204
02:32:11,559 --> 02:32:20,079
of superficial sociology that supposedly deciphers the meaning of electoral

2205
02:32:20,200 --> 02:32:24,239
patterns and things, you know. But in the case of California,

2206
02:32:24,280 --> 02:32:30,280
it's particularly dishonest to invoke the Republicans as anything other than,

2207
02:32:32,159 --> 02:32:36,680
you know, the official opposition. But it also.

2208
02:32:38,159 --> 02:32:41,440
Speaker 1: I was reading the other day and I can't remember

2209
02:32:41,479 --> 02:32:43,120
who it was. It might have been like William Lynn

2210
02:32:43,319 --> 02:32:46,000
Bill nd or someone like that was saying he does

2211
02:32:46,639 --> 02:32:48,799
I think he was saying he doesn't think that, like

2212
02:32:49,200 --> 02:32:52,000
you can even have a circulation of elites, like a

2213
02:32:52,120 --> 02:32:56,600
new class of people ruling until the dollar falls. So

2214
02:32:56,760 --> 02:32:59,120
you asked, like, how does the republic you know, why

2215
02:32:59,159 --> 02:33:02,280
do we still have the Republican? I mean, can anything

2216
02:33:02,399 --> 02:33:10,559
really change until there's a like a drastic a drastic

2217
02:33:10,799 --> 02:33:14,680
cause something like a dollar failure, which has never happened.

2218
02:33:14,719 --> 02:33:16,600
And Stormy says it's not going to happen.

2219
02:33:17,360 --> 02:33:19,920
Speaker 2: I agree with that, Like people talk about how there's

2220
02:33:19,920 --> 02:33:23,600
going to be like a punctuated event like the crash

2221
02:33:23,639 --> 02:33:25,840
of twenty nine like that that wouldn't happen. And again,

2222
02:33:26,200 --> 02:33:30,840
it's the systems too rubberized, and information awareness and and

2223
02:33:31,440 --> 02:33:34,920
you know this literally like the velocity of data like

2224
02:33:35,000 --> 02:33:37,959
to precluded. No. No, I I agree with the fact

2225
02:33:38,040 --> 02:33:45,680
that I I understand. I understand exactly why there's it's

2226
02:33:45,760 --> 02:33:48,799
like a closed circle, you know, like the circulation of

2227
02:33:48,840 --> 02:33:51,360
the legs as it were. But like this like this

2228
02:33:51,559 --> 02:33:54,120
like totally out of date branding, like oh, this is

2229
02:33:54,159 --> 02:33:57,440
the Republican Party. All the Republicans were was the committee

2230
02:33:57,479 --> 02:34:01,280
tooilect Abraham Lincoln that they became like the America First Party,

2231
02:34:01,440 --> 02:34:05,360
like post reconstruction, like the party in Northern industry, and

2232
02:34:05,479 --> 02:34:09,239
then they became like the Cold War Hawk Party, which

2233
02:34:09,319 --> 02:34:11,399
didn't make a lot of sense in legacy terms. But

2234
02:34:11,479 --> 02:34:13,760
it's like why are we still talking in these terms?

2235
02:34:14,639 --> 02:34:16,479
You know, like it doesn't it doesn't really make sense.

2236
02:34:16,559 --> 02:34:19,719
I mean, diddo, how did how?

2237
02:34:19,920 --> 02:34:20,040
Speaker 1: How?

2238
02:34:20,120 --> 02:34:22,159
Speaker 2: Like in the UK is like the Labor Party, like

2239
02:34:22,200 --> 02:34:24,440
what what? What are like the laborers are they representing?

2240
02:34:25,399 --> 02:34:27,239
You know, it's you'd think that there would have been

2241
02:34:27,319 --> 02:34:32,239
like a rebranding or they in America they do a

2242
02:34:32,280 --> 02:34:34,920
way because America because the like Repulicans aren't a party,

2243
02:34:35,559 --> 02:34:37,559
you know, Like, I mean there's that too. You would

2244
02:34:37,639 --> 02:34:41,360
think that, especially after you would think that after Wrule

2245
02:34:41,399 --> 02:34:43,799
War two, especially after the Cold War, you'd think that

2246
02:34:43,840 --> 02:34:47,760
it'd be like, Okay, here's the president, you know, here's

2247
02:34:47,799 --> 02:34:51,239
like his loyalists. This is like the ruling coalition, and

2248
02:34:51,319 --> 02:34:54,000
this is the opposition, Like why are they the Democrats

2249
02:34:54,120 --> 02:34:58,520
like that? That's what's herded. You know that there are

2250
02:34:58,520 --> 02:35:02,079
a bunch of people like Andrew Jack really like I

2251
02:35:02,879 --> 02:35:03,200
take some.

2252
02:35:03,239 --> 02:35:08,200
Speaker 1: Exception of that, but well, and well they it seems

2253
02:35:08,319 --> 02:35:13,399
to just be holding onto ideology. So you the party

2254
02:35:13,479 --> 02:35:17,600
adopts an ideology, whether it's a good ideology or not,

2255
02:35:17,719 --> 02:35:22,920
whether it's coherence or not, and that keeps that keeps

2256
02:35:23,319 --> 02:35:29,559
a certain portion of the yea of the population on

2257
02:35:29,719 --> 02:35:31,959
one side or the other. Oh, we believe, you know,

2258
02:35:32,200 --> 02:35:37,120
we're fit, We're we're fiscally conservative, but you know, culturally

2259
02:35:37,239 --> 02:35:40,440
liberal over here in the Republican side and on the

2260
02:35:40,559 --> 02:35:43,280
Democrat side, you can be completely nuts and do anything

2261
02:35:43,360 --> 02:35:46,799
you want. It's just it seems like it's just to

2262
02:35:46,920 --> 02:35:51,879
keep people, you know, motivated, to keep this thing moving

2263
02:35:53,479 --> 02:35:54,200
in existence.

2264
02:35:54,319 --> 02:35:57,120
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's important, because it's not it's important not to

2265
02:35:57,200 --> 02:36:01,399
confuse people. So it's just familiarity that like sustains it.

2266
02:36:01,520 --> 02:36:05,120
But it I I think it's very strange. I mean,

2267
02:36:05,159 --> 02:36:10,760
that's one of the I I haven't published it yet,

2268
02:36:10,799 --> 02:36:13,120
but I did a write up on James Webb because

2269
02:36:13,319 --> 02:36:15,719
I reread his novel Field of Fire, which is one

2270
02:36:15,719 --> 02:36:20,159
of my favorite novels. The Web was an important guy

2271
02:36:20,239 --> 02:36:25,479
in the later Cold War, and he also he takes

2272
02:36:25,680 --> 02:36:31,399
uh like the center uh like Ulster Scott identity seriously

2273
02:36:31,520 --> 02:36:34,559
and I appreciate that. But you know, like Web like

2274
02:36:34,639 --> 02:36:37,200
ran as a Democrat, you know, like later like after

2275
02:36:37,239 --> 02:36:39,040
he left the Senate, because he's like, what is it?

2276
02:36:39,239 --> 02:36:41,440
Why why am I a Republican? Like why why would

2277
02:36:41,440 --> 02:36:44,200
a southern white guy like run as a Republican? It's

2278
02:36:44,280 --> 02:36:47,440
asine and like people understand what he was talking about.

2279
02:36:48,520 --> 02:36:52,399
And unfortunately is his campaign was kind of dead in

2280
02:36:52,479 --> 02:36:56,479
the water. I mean he I like what he did

2281
02:36:56,559 --> 02:37:00,360
in the Senate, but I he kind of lost way

2282
02:37:00,440 --> 02:37:03,959
I think in tactical terms subsequent. But he was but

2283
02:37:04,000 --> 02:37:07,360
he was absolutely right about that. You know, it's doesn't

2284
02:37:07,399 --> 02:37:11,239
it doesn't make any sense. It's you know, if I

2285
02:37:11,440 --> 02:37:14,520
I mean I'd never like I was talking to one

2286
02:37:14,559 --> 02:37:17,879
of the fellas we run the road. I mean like

2287
02:37:17,959 --> 02:37:20,840
I I'd never run for office. But if I did

2288
02:37:20,920 --> 02:37:23,280
ease where I'm at, I'd run as a Democrat, you know,

2289
02:37:23,319 --> 02:37:25,600
because that's just what you do here. You know, Like

2290
02:37:25,680 --> 02:37:28,559
does that mean I does that mean I'm suddenly like

2291
02:37:28,920 --> 02:37:34,639
I become like gay and like open borders, like you know,

2292
02:37:36,280 --> 02:37:40,120
it's a yeah, shit doesn't make any sense, but it's.

2293
02:37:40,600 --> 02:37:42,680
Speaker 1: Well, I mean, politics is supposed to be a tool.

2294
02:37:43,079 --> 02:37:45,280
So if you run as a Democrat, you're supposed to

2295
02:37:45,280 --> 02:37:48,120
be using a tool, wielding a tool. Why does a

2296
02:37:48,239 --> 02:37:50,280
tool have to have an ideology attached to it?

2297
02:37:50,719 --> 02:37:53,000
Speaker 2: Especially it's not even a party. I mean, it's like

2298
02:37:53,079 --> 02:37:57,520
the whole. You're a party if you have dues, paying members,

2299
02:37:58,159 --> 02:38:02,040
if there's some apparatus in place like enforces consensus. There's

2300
02:38:02,040 --> 02:38:04,840
an actual party manifesto and platform I and if you

2301
02:38:04,840 --> 02:38:07,040
don't abide it, you get kicked out of the party.

2302
02:38:07,799 --> 02:38:10,120
Like there's there's not like a Republican party, You're like

2303
02:38:10,159 --> 02:38:14,000
a Democrat party. I mean, arguably you can't have a

2304
02:38:14,040 --> 02:38:18,200
political party and in a system where there's single member districts,

2305
02:38:18,239 --> 02:38:23,440
you know, and and a winner take all like electoral paradigm,

2306
02:38:23,760 --> 02:38:27,079
because like how could you you know, it's the whole

2307
02:38:28,120 --> 02:38:34,600
as designed, you know, the the constitutionally mandated electoral system.

2308
02:38:34,680 --> 02:38:38,159
It's it's basically set up to like prevent the emergence

2309
02:38:38,200 --> 02:38:45,239
of parties. So yeah, there's that's why it's goofy as

2310
02:38:45,280 --> 02:38:48,680
hell when when these coach are cons and and and

2311
02:38:48,840 --> 02:38:52,840
these cringe fucking people just the Democrat Party, you see,

2312
02:38:52,879 --> 02:38:55,520
it's like what what is the Democrat Party? Like what

2313
02:38:56,479 --> 02:38:58,639
like who are just dues paying members? Like what's it's

2314
02:38:58,680 --> 02:39:02,479
what's its what's its official like platform? Like none of

2315
02:39:02,520 --> 02:39:05,399
these things exist, you know. It's just it's just like

2316
02:39:05,600 --> 02:39:09,680
Randos saying like, yeah, we're the Democrats, and in some way, yeah,

2317
02:39:09,879 --> 02:39:13,479
like what's called the Democrats they're they're like they're like

2318
02:39:13,559 --> 02:39:17,959
the official ruling party, you know, and the Republicans the

2319
02:39:18,040 --> 02:39:20,799
faux opposition. But it's like okay, so then say that,

2320
02:39:21,079 --> 02:39:23,959
like say that like again, like whoever the president is

2321
02:39:24,040 --> 02:39:27,479
and whoever is loyalists are okay, they're you know, this

2322
02:39:27,680 --> 02:39:30,399
is the ruling coalition, like be outside of that is

2323
02:39:30,440 --> 02:39:32,079
the opposition, you know.

2324
02:39:33,479 --> 02:39:35,840
Speaker 1: Yeah, and that also that also points to like how

2325
02:39:35,920 --> 02:39:39,000
you can't really have a party without an ideology, and

2326
02:39:39,120 --> 02:39:42,239
whenever somebody comes along with like okay, well here in ideology,

2327
02:39:42,319 --> 02:39:45,040
like the paleocons did, like in the early nineties, you

2328
02:39:45,159 --> 02:39:47,399
have to kick them out because it's like, no, we

2329
02:39:47,520 --> 02:39:50,040
can't have an ideology here. We have to be whatever

2330
02:39:50,159 --> 02:39:53,319
we need to be at this one from moment to moment,

2331
02:39:53,639 --> 02:39:58,799
which makes sense, Which makes sense in a in a

2332
02:39:58,959 --> 02:40:01,399
structure where you you're just trying to get elected and

2333
02:40:01,479 --> 02:40:03,680
you just want political power. But if you're actually going

2334
02:40:03,760 --> 02:40:05,879
to be a coalition like a party or something like that,

2335
02:40:06,200 --> 02:40:08,840
you're gonna need an ideology. So all ideology has to

2336
02:40:08,920 --> 02:40:09,600
go out the window.

2337
02:40:10,040 --> 02:40:11,879
Speaker 2: No, And that's what that was the reason for like

2338
02:40:11,959 --> 02:40:14,479
the coup against Nixon, you know, and I and that,

2339
02:40:14,559 --> 02:40:18,159
because that's exactly what Wallace did. Like wall Is basically forced,

2340
02:40:18,600 --> 02:40:21,559
which is incredible because he basically got like he basically

2341
02:40:21,639 --> 02:40:24,680
forced like Yankee Republicans like take on what he viewed

2342
02:40:24,680 --> 02:40:27,440
as like the essential aspects. So like the you know,

2343
02:40:27,920 --> 02:40:34,479
the Dixiecrat play like manifesto, albeit they were like moderated somewhat,

2344
02:40:34,639 --> 02:40:37,280
but like that's exactly what he did. And so then

2345
02:40:37,360 --> 02:40:39,200
like the deep state shit, it's pants and they're like

2346
02:40:39,280 --> 02:40:44,440
this cannot be allowed to happen. You know. Trump's a

2347
02:40:44,479 --> 02:40:47,239
little bit different, but it's it's the same tendency like

2348
02:40:47,319 --> 02:40:52,239
on display. But it's what I'm curious about. I mean,

2349
02:40:52,239 --> 02:40:56,079
this is a simlarly another show that I mean to

2350
02:40:56,440 --> 02:41:00,799
go straight too far afield from the top focus. But

2351
02:41:01,920 --> 02:41:05,200
you know, as there's this weird paradigm emerging where like

2352
02:41:05,319 --> 02:41:08,680
complex in independence, like true globalism on the economic side

2353
02:41:09,040 --> 02:41:12,399
is like the permanent reality, but in terms of self governance,

2354
02:41:12,879 --> 02:41:16,719
like it's it's all gonna be local and uh, you're

2355
02:41:16,760 --> 02:41:21,000
gonna see, you're gonna see, you're gonna see like cities

2356
02:41:21,040 --> 02:41:24,559
and even like at state level, like systems emerging where

2357
02:41:24,559 --> 02:41:27,280
they basically have like what amounts of a proportional representation

2358
02:41:27,479 --> 02:41:32,200
system and like all the name and you're you're're gonna

2359
02:41:32,200 --> 02:41:34,920
see the emergence like real party structures, even if they're

2360
02:41:34,920 --> 02:41:41,000
not called that. There's like echoes of that in a

2361
02:41:41,079 --> 02:41:45,120
lot of municipalities, which I pay more attention to because

2362
02:41:45,200 --> 02:41:47,799
like in Illinois it's weird, and like the outlying areas,

2363
02:41:47,920 --> 02:41:52,840
especially south, especially south and especially northwards like Detroit, we're

2364
02:41:53,040 --> 02:41:55,600
we're all kind of the same like sociological ecosystem and

2365
02:41:55,719 --> 02:42:00,959
like good ways in bed. But you know, there's there's

2366
02:42:01,200 --> 02:42:06,840
a kind of a di y and ethical secessionists, the

2367
02:42:08,559 --> 02:42:10,440
tendant see a foot Like I'm not saying people want

2368
02:42:10,479 --> 02:42:13,600
to like formally secede, but the fact don't they kind

2369
02:42:13,639 --> 02:42:17,319
of are. And there's a lot of that goes into that,

2370
02:42:17,479 --> 02:42:21,719
everything from what you know what technical like consumer technology

2371
02:42:21,719 --> 02:42:27,079
facilitates to traditional ideas about policing and law and order

2372
02:42:27,239 --> 02:42:31,479
kind of going by the wayside, and you know, people

2373
02:42:31,559 --> 02:42:33,760
being able to make money in non traditional ways. And

2374
02:42:34,280 --> 02:42:35,600
I mean that that. I mean, that's not my bread

2375
02:42:35,639 --> 02:42:38,120
and butter. That's what I'm trying to accomplish, and I

2376
02:42:38,760 --> 02:42:44,120
think that's going quite splendidly. I might add, but you know,

2377
02:42:44,239 --> 02:42:48,239
that's that's the future. So a lot of some of

2378
02:42:48,319 --> 02:42:50,040
this is going to take care of itself. But I

2379
02:42:50,239 --> 02:42:54,680
am the California thing because like I said, I it's

2380
02:42:54,799 --> 02:42:58,200
very positive especially among young people like zoomer people and

2381
02:42:58,440 --> 02:43:03,399
like a little younger like they they don't they they

2382
02:43:03,440 --> 02:43:05,399
look at legacy media is being totally full of shit.

2383
02:43:05,680 --> 02:43:08,120
You know, they're not susceptible to the bully pulpit, like

2384
02:43:08,280 --> 02:43:11,879
the what remains of it, But for some reason it's

2385
02:43:11,879 --> 02:43:17,000
still got the capacity these like legacy, this legacy apparatus

2386
02:43:17,079 --> 02:43:21,239
taken like in total, it's you know, it's it's it's

2387
02:43:21,319 --> 02:43:24,040
like man made weather. You know, that's the quote from

2388
02:43:24,079 --> 02:43:29,040
the movie. And people say, take a face to value, like, oh,

2389
02:43:29,520 --> 02:43:31,440
this is what the electro map is. You know, like

2390
02:43:31,520 --> 02:43:34,319
California is just like safe blue. It's like, no, it's not, man,

2391
02:43:35,200 --> 02:43:39,479
you've got stuff thinking that way. That's not reality, you know.

2392
02:43:41,440 --> 02:43:44,719
And uh, it's not just about like being right or

2393
02:43:45,280 --> 02:43:49,000
kind of like thumbing your nose at this, you know,

2394
02:43:49,120 --> 02:43:55,000
kind of pitiable, octogenary and tyranny. You know, it's important

2395
02:43:55,079 --> 02:43:59,559
because this this is built on an edifice of eve

2396
02:43:59,760 --> 02:44:03,639
fault elsehoods, you know, and that's that's that's what soulcial

2397
02:44:03,680 --> 02:44:05,639
nations and can say. With the Soviet Union, you'd be like,

2398
02:44:05,719 --> 02:44:08,239
it's not as that the Soul Union brutalizes people and

2399
02:44:08,360 --> 02:44:11,440
like it sends them to these artic death camps, or

2400
02:44:11,479 --> 02:44:15,040
that it punishes you for putting God over a man.

2401
02:44:15,159 --> 02:44:17,719
I mean that that's obviously that those are like very

2402
02:44:17,799 --> 02:44:21,760
evil things. But he's like it forces you to like

2403
02:44:21,840 --> 02:44:25,799
accept a lie. And if you accept a lies long enough,

2404
02:44:25,840 --> 02:44:27,520
and it's kind of like abide to them, like pretty

2405
02:44:27,559 --> 02:44:30,440
soon you start lying to yourself. You know, pretty soon

2406
02:44:31,040 --> 02:44:34,120
you kind of lose not just the ability but any

2407
02:44:34,239 --> 02:44:38,719
interest in you know, behaving as a rational adult. You know,

2408
02:44:38,799 --> 02:44:43,559
like even in the conversations you have yourself and that's

2409
02:44:43,840 --> 02:44:46,600
kind of that that's kind of the ultimate like self

2410
02:44:47,280 --> 02:44:54,440
conditioning towards slavery. You know. That's why I I I

2411
02:44:54,600 --> 02:44:57,440
hammer home the point about the twenty twenty steel It's

2412
02:44:57,479 --> 02:44:59,280
not because like I care as much about Donald Trump,

2413
02:44:59,319 --> 02:45:01,680
because I don't care aout Donald's from, you know, And

2414
02:45:01,760 --> 02:45:05,559
it's it's not because like I I care so much

2415
02:45:05,559 --> 02:45:12,360
about you know, arguing with like infertainment adult morons. It's

2416
02:45:12,440 --> 02:45:15,360
because you know, you you can't just like accept like

2417
02:45:15,479 --> 02:45:18,239
abject lies at face value or like act like it's

2418
02:45:18,280 --> 02:45:23,799
not important, because it is important, you know, categories of

2419
02:45:23,879 --> 02:45:27,440
minor categories of reality. I like this idea that like, well,

2420
02:45:27,479 --> 02:45:33,360
if i'm if you know, hypothetically counterfixedly, I'm an authority.

2421
02:45:33,440 --> 02:45:35,120
So I mean it's kind of like an event conceptual

2422
02:45:35,200 --> 02:45:37,879
reality is because it's it's a noble lie. Like no,

2423
02:45:38,079 --> 02:45:44,159
that's not acceptable, you know, and any no rational like

2424
02:45:44,239 --> 02:45:47,840
no rational adult like whatever is creed or race, but

2425
02:45:48,000 --> 02:45:53,079
especially a white person like not think that way even

2426
02:45:53,159 --> 02:45:56,559
for a minute. You know, it's not that's not the way.

2427
02:45:57,479 --> 02:46:00,399
That's not the way. Three men with a and see

2428
02:46:00,600 --> 02:46:05,159
think you know, but that was Yeah, we're kind of

2429
02:46:05,200 --> 02:46:06,920
like sermonizing. Man, I'm just like I said, I'm just

2430
02:46:07,120 --> 02:46:11,159
just really tired today. I don't even if you sound Wayne,

2431
02:46:11,319 --> 02:46:12,159
but it's.

2432
02:46:12,040 --> 02:46:15,840
Speaker 1: All, it's all good. I led the discussion. And you know,

2433
02:46:15,920 --> 02:46:18,120
one of the things you were when you talk about

2434
02:46:18,239 --> 02:46:24,239
like local more local kind of and regional politics. Usually

2435
02:46:24,959 --> 02:46:28,520
when you get more rural like around here, really the

2436
02:46:28,680 --> 02:46:31,159
only thing that people talk about when it comes to

2437
02:46:32,040 --> 02:46:35,360
the whole discussions about national politics or how it's going

2438
02:46:35,479 --> 02:46:38,799
to affect us is like, how how is it going

2439
02:46:38,879 --> 02:46:41,719
to interrupt our lives? How's it going to screw us up?

2440
02:46:42,280 --> 02:46:44,760
It's not like, oh, we want this done for us,

2441
02:46:44,879 --> 02:46:47,120
you know, we we need we need them to come

2442
02:46:47,239 --> 02:46:50,040
do this for us. No, it's like, how how is

2443
02:46:50,040 --> 02:46:51,360
this going to infringe upon us?

2444
02:46:52,239 --> 02:46:55,959
Speaker 2: What's something too? Yeah? No, And that's when I when

2445
02:46:56,000 --> 02:46:57,719
I was on in Baltimore, when I started out to

2446
02:46:57,760 --> 02:47:00,559
Harper's Theory on the weekends, that's like the way the

2447
02:47:00,639 --> 02:47:02,719
culture was, like I made friends with like the local

2448
02:47:02,799 --> 02:47:06,719
police and stuff like it. Verty much, you know, a

2449
02:47:06,760 --> 02:47:09,840
different way of life and I didn't make friends with

2450
02:47:09,920 --> 02:47:11,520
like the coppers because like I want to, I want

2451
02:47:11,520 --> 02:47:13,280
to hang out with flat boids because that way they

2452
02:47:13,399 --> 02:47:15,879
like they were used to seeing me and like my

2453
02:47:16,120 --> 02:47:19,680
lady friend and rather buddy, and they they you know,

2454
02:47:19,799 --> 02:47:24,120
they just it was just it's you know, politics of

2455
02:47:24,239 --> 02:47:26,639
a of a certain of its own of it of

2456
02:47:26,680 --> 02:47:29,639
its own type. You know. That's also why like I'm

2457
02:47:30,600 --> 02:47:35,319
I'm gonna start, you know, spending the winter months in Lynchburg,

2458
02:47:35,479 --> 02:47:39,879
because that's exactly yeah, that's exactly the kind of culture

2459
02:47:39,920 --> 02:47:44,600
I want to I want to cultivate. And I mean

2460
02:47:44,680 --> 02:47:48,559
it's I I like the South anyway because it's awesome,

2461
02:47:48,719 --> 02:47:51,879
but you know, that's that's the future. And like one

2462
02:47:51,879 --> 02:47:54,479
of the reasons when I write Amtrak is it's not

2463
02:47:54,559 --> 02:47:57,319
just because I'm I don't like flying and I feel

2464
02:47:57,360 --> 02:47:59,520
like Jacques who still's cat when I'm in a plane

2465
02:47:59,559 --> 02:48:03,559
and find out like it like terrorizes me. But but

2466
02:48:03,680 --> 02:48:05,600
if you like when you write the answer, that you

2467
02:48:05,680 --> 02:48:09,200
realize how much there still remains like vast amounts of

2468
02:48:09,280 --> 02:48:12,040
like this wide open space in America. And like even

2469
02:48:12,079 --> 02:48:16,479
with like even telecom and the electric I been truly

2470
02:48:16,639 --> 02:48:19,760
pick with is you know, like in America unlike in Europe.

2471
02:48:19,840 --> 02:48:25,360
I'm like in Japan, unlike in you know, Argentina. You know,

2472
02:48:25,479 --> 02:48:29,680
you the regime is like somewhat just like limited by

2473
02:48:29,799 --> 02:48:32,760
physical distance, by what it can do to you. I

2474
02:48:32,840 --> 02:48:35,680
mean obviously, unless you're doing crazy things or you know,

2475
02:48:35,799 --> 02:48:39,360
like like like like whipping up massive like pounds of

2476
02:48:39,399 --> 02:48:44,040
fentanyl or metama fetamine and like you know, like sticking

2477
02:48:44,120 --> 02:48:47,440
up like millions of dollars and ill gotten gains or something.

2478
02:48:48,040 --> 02:48:53,200
I mean, yeah, there's there are limits, and there's certainly

2479
02:48:54,479 --> 02:48:56,959
there's certainly acts no missions that will like cause the

2480
02:48:57,040 --> 02:48:59,159
regime to like go all out and come after you.

2481
02:48:59,319 --> 02:49:04,399
But I mean feeling those sorts of things, you know,

2482
02:49:04,479 --> 02:49:08,200
you can, you can, within reason, do what you want,

2483
02:49:08,520 --> 02:49:12,600
and it's basically like not gonna be worth it to

2484
02:49:12,719 --> 02:49:15,479
the state to like try and fuck with you, you know,

2485
02:49:15,600 --> 02:49:19,159
and like people, that's something they take for granted. I

2486
02:49:19,200 --> 02:49:23,280
don't think people realize how vast this country is, and

2487
02:49:23,360 --> 02:49:26,760
they do like intellectually, not really and they don't realize

2488
02:49:26,799 --> 02:49:31,399
that there's you know, like stress or one of the

2489
02:49:31,440 --> 02:49:34,879
few things I think Gregor stress Or said that was intelligent.

2490
02:49:36,760 --> 02:49:44,040
Despite a sympathy for arguably a sympathy for communism and

2491
02:49:44,120 --> 02:49:49,200
despite as uh kind of autocratic paradigm. You know, you

2492
02:49:49,440 --> 02:49:51,600
talk about like Europe of a thousand Flags and it

2493
02:49:51,680 --> 02:49:54,600
was like all about like kind of distributed to socialism,

2494
02:49:55,479 --> 02:50:00,360
and you know, there is I do unders stand the

2495
02:50:00,440 --> 02:50:03,520
appeal to that they're they're wrong. I think in there

2496
02:50:04,799 --> 02:50:07,760
in the way they can sceptualize economics, but that that's

2497
02:50:07,840 --> 02:50:11,000
not real far from what I'm trying to accomplish in

2498
02:50:11,079 --> 02:50:13,840
like ethical terms, you know, although it shakes out differently.

2499
02:50:14,239 --> 02:50:17,239
But yeah, no, that that's why these are exciting times, man,

2500
02:50:17,360 --> 02:50:22,559
because these objectives are being a reached. In twenty twenty

2501
02:50:22,600 --> 02:50:24,760
five is when I am gonna make you know, I'm

2502
02:50:24,760 --> 02:50:30,120
gonna I'm gonna snowbird down at Lynchberg. And that's that's

2503
02:50:30,200 --> 02:50:32,159
not just exciting because I like it down there and

2504
02:50:32,319 --> 02:50:36,000
our friends are there, but that's kind of gonna that's

2505
02:50:36,120 --> 02:50:38,280
kind of gonna be like my base of operations for

2506
02:50:38,360 --> 02:50:41,920
some of this stuff, you know, and like if you

2507
02:50:42,000 --> 02:50:44,600
build it like they will come, you know, like in

2508
02:50:44,680 --> 02:50:46,879
the in the like in the movie where Kevin Costner's

2509
02:50:46,959 --> 02:50:50,680
like playing baseball and the ghost to Shoeless Joe, I

2510
02:50:50,719 --> 02:50:55,280
can't remember what it's called but yeah, you know, yeah, yeah,

2511
02:50:55,520 --> 02:50:58,920
which which seems like kind of I as some people

2512
02:50:58,920 --> 02:51:00,639
think that's like a hokey movie, but like I like

2513
02:51:00,719 --> 02:51:04,719
baseball a lot, you know, and uh that that's actually

2514
02:51:04,760 --> 02:51:05,600
like a really good movie.

2515
02:51:05,719 --> 02:51:09,079
Speaker 1: But yeah, that's a wholesome. It's a wholesome story that

2516
02:51:09,360 --> 02:51:11,200
we don't really hear a lot about anymore.

2517
02:51:11,360 --> 02:51:14,559
Speaker 2: Yeah. No, and baseball is chill man, like it's and

2518
02:51:14,760 --> 02:51:16,799
like to me, the pigskin game is king. But I

2519
02:51:17,680 --> 02:51:20,159
especially when I'm i'll say, having a whole lot of

2520
02:51:20,159 --> 02:51:24,399
anxiety and stuff like right, uh, when I got back online,

2521
02:51:25,600 --> 02:51:29,360
like the twenty twenty baseball season, I I actually became

2522
02:51:29,440 --> 02:51:32,520
like a Red Sox fan too, Like the Red Sox

2523
02:51:32,600 --> 02:51:35,600
had an interesting lineup that year. But like watching baseball

2524
02:51:35,680 --> 02:51:38,639
like chills you out, at least I always thought, though

2525
02:51:40,000 --> 02:51:41,879
I mean, maybe not so much. You gotta wager around,

2526
02:51:42,200 --> 02:51:48,360
but I don't bet on sportsbook. But no, yeah, this

2527
02:51:50,200 --> 02:51:52,520
this was great, man, forgive me if it was those

2528
02:51:52,559 --> 02:51:57,079
two tangential. I'm kind of conversational, but I, like I said,

2529
02:51:57,120 --> 02:52:00,159
I my energy levels aren't quite recovered yet. All I

2530
02:52:00,239 --> 02:52:02,879
feel good. And last night was kind of a late

2531
02:52:03,040 --> 02:52:05,000
night going to New year's.

2532
02:52:06,760 --> 02:52:09,680
Speaker 1: All right, man, do some quick plugs. We'll get what

2533
02:52:09,840 --> 02:52:10,040
is it?

2534
02:52:11,479 --> 02:52:14,680
Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm kind of on hiatus from the pod because

2535
02:52:14,719 --> 02:52:18,520
we just wrapped up season two. I'm I'm gonna aim

2536
02:52:18,600 --> 02:52:22,719
to February first at the latest. It's probably gonna be

2537
02:52:24,000 --> 02:52:26,239
like the last week in January that like the season

2538
02:52:26,360 --> 02:52:31,840
three open earl drop. But in the interim, I'm recording

2539
02:52:31,920 --> 02:52:37,239
other stuff with other people's including you know, with the

2540
02:52:38,000 --> 02:52:43,680
stuff we're doing. But so oh so, my substack remains active.

2541
02:52:44,520 --> 02:52:48,280
It's real Thomas seven seven seven. That's substack dot com.

2542
02:52:49,760 --> 02:52:52,799
Other than that, hit up my website. That's like the

2543
02:52:52,920 --> 02:52:59,719
one stop location from my content. It's number seven h

2544
02:53:00,200 --> 02:53:04,799
seven seven seven dot com And you can find my

2545
02:53:05,120 --> 02:53:07,879
social media links and stuff there, like I'm on x,

2546
02:53:08,159 --> 02:53:11,799
I'm on an Instagram, I'm launching I launched a new

2547
02:53:11,840 --> 02:53:14,159
t gram channel. There's not gonna be like a discussion

2548
02:53:14,200 --> 02:53:17,239
aspect because I just get bumpbarded with like ops and

2549
02:53:18,760 --> 02:53:23,319
like gros, like porn, bullshit and other shit I don't

2550
02:53:23,559 --> 02:53:28,639
want to be available to. But I'm gonna start. I'm

2551
02:53:28,639 --> 02:53:30,920
gonna try, and I'm gonna I'm gonna start like uploading

2552
02:53:31,000 --> 02:53:34,000
some more like video content and a lot of that's

2553
02:53:34,040 --> 02:53:35,920
gonna find its way to the t gram channel, so

2554
02:53:36,120 --> 02:53:39,200
be where it's at. Yeah, that's all I got for Nomen.

2555
02:53:40,639 --> 02:53:42,680
Speaker 1: All right, thank you, till the next one.