WEBVTT

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Hello, and welcome to Open Mind
UFO Radio. I am your host,

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Alejandro Rojas, and I have with
me Martin UFO News. Willis all right,

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finally I get the title I deserve. Is that? Do you like

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that one? I like that one? Again? Do you know a lot

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about the news, the UFO news
current UFO News? No, actually,

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but I still like the title.
I was gonna say, because that's not

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why we hired you for the job. You think we would. That would

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be the primary, you know,
qualification. But you're just a cool dude.

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We actually, which is a good
thing because that means that you're such

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a cool dude you don't even have
to have knowledge in the area that you

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know the job pertains. That's right. I just talked to talk, but

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you know, walking, I don't
know. That's kind of how it goes

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though, Like they say, it's
who you know. I mean, often,

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being a cool dude will get you
a job even if you don't know

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crap about what the job is that
you're supposed to do. That's right.

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Those who know doing those who don't
know teach. I think that's what it

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is. Something like that. I
heard something like that. Well, anyway,

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there you go. Showing off your
charm again, right there, That's

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what it is, all right.
So yeah, so the guest today.

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So I had a really good guest, but I don't anymore. Yes,

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you did so, and I won't
say who. I'm not going to necessarily

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disparage this person. Maybe I should
thinking about it, maybe, but I

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had a really good guest who is
a witness to a famous case. I

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won't tell you who this person had
contacted me. I'll just say this that

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the way that they canceled, if
you can call it that, at the

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last minute, was less than respectful. Yeah, les's an honorable This man

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has no honor. No. So
yeah, so I'm I've definitely got It's

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not good, not good at all. So you knows your listeners are gonna

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like, okay, who was it? I know you're going to be getting

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some email. But they do that
a lot because whenever I talk about someone

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who made me mad who, or
I talk bad about someone, I don't

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say their name mostly except for I
think you know, there's a couple of

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people Michael Horn. I will say
his name when I talk bad about him,

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but there's not many people that all
all. And you know, bless

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his heart. I don't know that
he's necessarily an evil person. We just

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disagree. But anyway, uh yeah, so you know that didn't work out?

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Well, say who? Yeah,
but I need you're not going to

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say the guests who it was.
No, I'm not going to say who

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it is. But I told oh
man, people might have heard that.

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What's it heard? What? Anyway? Yeah, cute, I'm gonna go

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beat that. By the way,
the first thing that we've had conversation where

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I'm gonna have to edit. Oh
no, yeah, okay, so but

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that's okay. Here's the first time
for everything. And I'm surprised we've gotten

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this far without me having to edit
something, because I've expected maybe you to

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slip up in other ways. But
anyway, my point is that, yes,

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and because I need to my listeners, I'm a daylight with a show,

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and I told them before that I
may go a couple of weeks without

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a show and they hate that and
they get mad, and I'm sorry,

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but you know, there was move
On the move On symposium we went to.

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There was also San Diego. I
went to San Diego to hang out

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on the beach for a week,
and I wasn't going to struggle to find,

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not like you, you were trying
to get a guest. I was

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like, screw that, I'm going
to the beach. Listeners be damned,

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and I hung out on the beach. That's all I did. Well,

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not true, because now I do
real estate, and some real estate stuff

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came up, so I did have
to do some work. But it's been

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a while since I've had a show, and I really wanted to do a

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show. It's going to come back
with a bang and have this great guest

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and get everybody excited, and it
was going to be wonderful. And then

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this guy he screwed me. He
screwed me and my listeners. You know,

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bad enough for me, but to
do this to my poor listeners.

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So I apologize that I'm a daily
with the show and my guest, though

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this week is a genius when it
comes to UFO news. Yes, ladies

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and gentlemen, my guest today is
Martin Willis. Yes, so we're just

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gonna blab for like an hour.
Cool, I suppose, And yeah,

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that's fine. I am excited to
do this, But what can I say.

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I'm not your your guest, you
know, I mean, I I'm

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second fiddle. But I'll do what
I can here. No, stop it,

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stop it before hey, stop before
you push pause or stop. Listener,

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people, we're gonna get into UFO
stuff. We have lots of good

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UFO stuff. Because now they're probably
like, oh yeah, they are just

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gonna blab and be boneheads this whole
time. But no, we're gonna talk

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UFO. We have good UFO stuff. Martin does know UFO news, we're

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just kidding earlier, and he does
have some good We do have some really

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interesting UFO settings to talk about.
So before we lose them all, why

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don't we just get into the UFO
news. Does that sound good? Yeah?

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I think we better quickly? Yeah, yeah, I think you're right.

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Okay, so uh go for it. What's the right story you got?

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Well? I think this is an
interesting one and it was posted rely

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by Roger Marsh and there's a video
involved as well. Tennessee Witness describes UFO

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as a orange line and this happened
at UH in Nashville, and there's a

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video of it. And I do
caution the person that's going to watch the

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video that there is some foul language
on the video, which seems to happen

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quite a bit when it comes to
people filming UFOs, and I understand because

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people are kind of like baffled,
what the heck is that? And they

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use other words. Yeah, it's
almost if someone sees a UFO, the

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knee jerk reaction is not to grab
the phone, it's to say what the

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f is that? And then grab
the phone and film if they if they

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have their wits about them, and
continue to say over and over again,

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what the f is that? Which
is the case in this film? That

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is and it isn't. It is
a pretty interesting video to watch, and

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I do encourage you to, you
know, if you can get by the

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language, of course, you can
watch it. And there is you know

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a lot of times you'll see on
these videos you can't really you know,

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an iPhone or whatever it is he
filmed it on. You know, it

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doesn't have all that great of quality
when it comes to it to nighttime sightings,

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but this definitely shows up. And
there's a couple of stills in there

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of this story you can check out
too. So the guy basically here's a

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quote from him. My first thought
was that it may be the moon behind

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a cloud cover or something like that, but it was directly above me at

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the time, and there was no
cloud cover at all that night. I

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still haven't thought of anything else it
might be. I couldn't make out the

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features of the object as it was
very dark and it was far enough away

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I couldn't see any details on it, but it did have lights on it,

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and he's filming it, and a
couple of hours before the sighting he

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started feeling uneasy. He did mention
that I've heard other people say stuff like

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that, and I don't know if
that's related or just quin coincidentally, and

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so this came out. I think
it was around midnight that he saw this,

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and so he films it, and
you know, he is talking the

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whole time he's filming it, and
then all of a sudden the object disappeared,

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which again you always hear a lot
of people say, and then he

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felt strangely calm and peaceful for the
rest of the night. Interesting. You

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know, I've heard of people saying
that, you know, like the Allagash,

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they felt like really tired afterwards after
they thought they just had a sighting,

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but it was more than a sighting. So it is interesting how people

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can say kind of the same thing
or so more things. They have these

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type of sightings. Yeah, this
is a weird one. Okay. So

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this was investigated by Jula Sheer and
field investigator Roy Messer of the Tennessee Move

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On and it's still closed as an
unknown, which they often do. Mm

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hmm. Yeah. And you know
what, there's a good point someone made

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in the comments here that the photo
that is taken of the daytime where someone

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he took a picture of his alleged
perspective does not match up with the video

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unless he zoomed in quite a bit, because the video dish seemed to show

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like a couple of radio towers to
the left of this bright, long,

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kind of orange light, and those
radio towers cannot be seen in the daylight

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image. So the radio towers also
often indicate that this is on a hill,

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So this object could be on a
hill. However, the object is

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a little bit higher. It's like
mid radio tower. It's not like,

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you know, on the bottom.
So I mean it could be something on

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a hill, but it's long and
bright. You know, a car is

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not going to look like that.
So this one is a big mystery.

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I'm glad that you brought this one
up because I forgot about this one.

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It's funny because I'll write these stories
and then I forget about them, and

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sometimes it's not till the end of
the year that I when I put together

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the best cases, that I remember
them. But yeah, this is a

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weird one. I don't know what
the heck this one is. And but

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it would be nice if someone could
go get a picture of the actual area.

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In fact, maybe we can email
the move On investigators and see if

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they can do that. But it's
a weird one. Yeah, no,

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they It could be the place where
he saw the the object or whatever it

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was, but at a different angle. In other words, he may be

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facing the wrong way, you know, Yeah, just turning the wrong way

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if there's mountains on the other side, or you're right, radio towers,

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so you know, the majority of
them are on a higher level, you

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know, like mountains and hills things
like that. Yeah, so this is

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a good one. Yeah, that's
it for me on this one though.

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Yeah. He did say he zoomed
into, though, and in the picture

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that he provided of the data,
it doesn't look like he zoomed in,

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so that could be the difference.
And on the horizon it looks like there

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are some hills, so maybe he
was just zoomed in a bunch when he

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took the video, and he's not
in this picture. That is a possibility,

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I think. So yeah, one
for people to check out. The

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other one is it my turn now? Oh yeah, true turn sweet.

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The other one I want to talk
about is one I just posted, and

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this is also a good one.
I think this one was a New York

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witness between Florida and Gosh, which
don't sound like they sound like countries or

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something, but these are, you
know, a couple of weird named towns

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in New York, Florida and Ghosh, Gosh. I'm not sure. I

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think it's yeah ghost. If it's
German, one of these German towns,

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you know, it would be Giche
more like giche. Oh really, I

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know that's really yeah. I think
that's how they pronounce huh. Yeah.

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It's pretty weird. But anyways.
This guy says he was driving with his

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girlfriend at nine between nine and ten
pm on August fourth when they saw this

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light. It was to their left. They describe a completely lit surface on

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a craft with blinking lights and if
you look at the video, that's kind

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of what you see it. If
you didn't know anybody better, you would

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think it was a disc with a
notch, and in that notch there's a

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blinking light, which is really weird. Now, So you just see this

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light and this guy is taking a
video of this. It's somewhat reminiscent of

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the Turkey videos. Some people may
remember there were these videos taken in Turkey

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that are pretty interesting and debated.
Now, those Turkey videos, unfortunately,

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I have a feeling might be a
reflection from the lens. It's there's a

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phenomena that happens with lenses, and
this guy had a big, you know,

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zoom lens attached to his camera where
a single point of light can reflect

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on the rim inside the lens and
where the rim and the lens has these

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notches, and it can create this
image that the Turkey video got with this

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distinct notch, and that's what was
captured, or that's what a lot of

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people feel, and some people have
demonstrated pretty well that that could be what

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happened in Turkey, however, and
this one has a distinct notch, but

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this one looks different. And the
other weird thing is the blinking the on

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and off light in the middle of
this notch. So this is a really

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weird one pretty strange. Yeah,
I think it's I think it's really an

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incredible looking whatever it is. Yeah, I mean it's a great video.

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And another one this doesn't really a
lot of There is a little bit of

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a language in this one too,
but anyway, it's uh. The one

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thing I did want to ask you, going back to the Turkey UFO that

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you just talked about, I think
that's fascinating, but didn't people say they

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saw that with the naked eye as
well. But the problem is all they

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saw was a point of light and
it's I mean, to me, the

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descriptions of that light fit a star, they fit like Venus or something.

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So that's the problem with that one. There were other sightings, and some

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people say, well, even if
it was that, there were other sightings,

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but sure, there's other sightings everywhere. That doesn't necessarily mean, you

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know, that phenomena that was captured
by Roger Lear by other people was not

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And you know, I looked into
this really I thought I'd be able to

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figure out what it was very quickly, and I wrote a story in Open

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Mind's magazine where I felt lots of
the theories didn't fit. So I was

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left thinking I don't know what the
heck this is. And finally, only

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like a year ago, some people
had sent me some information about this theory

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and that may fit about the reflection
inside the lens. But hmm, yeah,

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it does seem to that could be
what this is. But I would

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want to see, you know,
it's still in both cases, it's still

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a point of light that is in
the sky, and in this case there's

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a blinking going on. Yeah,
this one seems a little more involved than

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that to me, and the other
witnesses sound like it sounded like they were

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seeing it as well. And by
the way, that is pronounced gosh,

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oh gosh. Yeah. Yeah.
Another thing you pointed out about this video

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is what you're going to point out
again, no go ahead, is that

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this guy is, like if he's
listening, I don't know even if he

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is, he could he a little
bit nicer to his girlfriend and apparently mom,

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who was there, that's what you
mean. Yeah, Yeah, he's

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not very nice. Yeah, and
you know, maybe he's stressed out or

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something, but he doesn't treat them
very respectfully. He was telling them to

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shut up, and I was almost
for a second, I was thinking,

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Man, I hope that where you
don't hear any sort of domestic violence going

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on here. Yeah, and almost
suddenly that could be an issue. Yeah,

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he keeps telling him to shut up. But I don't know, a

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lot of us can be nicer to
our girlfriends at times, well vice versa

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more often, you know, we
sometimes we tell our loved ones to shut

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up a little too much. Maybe. Yeah, So maybe this video gives

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us all a chance to reflect on
our actions and how we treat the people

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we love. Yeah, especially if
you're seeing a UFO. Be nice to

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your witnesses. Yeah, but it
is a good video. They need them.

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No, it's really a great video. Really weird. Yeah, anything

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else? I felt like you were
going to say something else about it.

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No. I think it goes on
for a pretty long time. And there's

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also an object that does appear and
disappear, but you can't see it.

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They see it, but we can't
see it on the video. Some red

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object appears to the left of it, according to the eyewitnesses while they were

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talking. Yeah, very little information
seemed to come across with this video,

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so it is being investigated by the
local move on. This isn't another one

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from Roger Marsh, Director of Communications
for mofon. So this one's still being

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looked into and who what's got lots
of likes. I thought people would like

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this one because I just posted it. But it's just a really weird video.

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It's it's not besides a turkey video. I don't think I've ever seen

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anything like this video. And not
only that, it's very clear for an

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iPhone and a nighttime sighting right Unlike
the last video where you have to zoom

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in to see the object, this
one is just right there, right in

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your face. It's it's clear,
and it takes up a good part of

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the screen, so you can definitely
understand this person's excitement. One thing they

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did mention in this video where the
one of the girls mentioned, was is

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it possible it's a blimp? And
no, so that is a possibility,

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but the whole thing I think so
too. And he said, that's not

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a blimp. Shut up. No, he didn't say it like that.

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I think he did. Well.
She was bugging him because it sounds like

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she was worried they were going to
get hit that they didn't pull over far

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enough on the side of the road, I think, And so he's like,

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whatuit bothering? Me about that.
So yeah in New York. Yeah,

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so yeah, so that it's really
good. So other than you know

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that, there's not other necessarily news
I want to talk about, but there

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is something we've done recently I would
like to talk about and get your opinion

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on. I am all ears,
Okay, So I finally put together I've

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been telling people about this Open Minds
magazine and how we're kind of re launching

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it and doing it in a video
format and stuff like this, and we

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finally got it done, and I'm
so excited about it. And I'm really

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excited about this piece because essentially,
if you haven't watched it, and I

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know many of you listeners have not
listened to it, because I know how

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many listeners we have for the most
part, and I can see how many

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hits we have in the video.
Now, not to say that the video

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hasn't gotten a lot of hits.
It has, but it can't get more.

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And I just am very excited to
share this with my listeners and and

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to share this information. So the
video starts off where I explained what Open

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Minds Magazine is and how we're going
to start to look at this phenomenon,

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how the government and military and public
have reacted to it, and it's kind

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of setting the base. So talking
about how Project Blue Book, of course

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was the first investigation by the Air
Force, well that there were other projects

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involved, but that the Air Force
did look into all of this stuff and

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the Air Force said, essentially there
isn't anything to it. However, they

269
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the files themselves, of course,
tell a different story because a lot of

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these files are very interesting. You
know, they've said there's seven hundred and

271
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twelve or or you know, all
of these numbers of unknowns. That number

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is inflex because you know, depending
on different reports, you get different numbers.

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But there were hundreds of unknowns,
some of which were very very good.

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We've got one on our front page
actually too, if people look at

275
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the military section, one of the
best Blue Book unknowns. I like it

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because it's a bunch of police officers
from several different precincts who saw this UFO.

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But what's great about the nineteen fifty
two Washington sidings, which I cover

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here, is that, in particular
is that this was witnessed over the Capitol,

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so the most secure locations in the
United States, and they were witnessed

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by the Blue Book investigators Bluebook investigators
from the Pentagon raced over to National Airport

281
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in Washington, DC to go into
the control tower to see these objects being

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picked up on radar, to scramble
jets, to be there when the jets

283
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cannot catch the objects, and so
they were there. They were present the

284
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whole time. The best the reason
we have such detail on what happened there

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is because of Edward Rupelt's book who
was He was the man in charge of

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blue Book during this period of time, and he tells us in his book

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in detail what had happened. So
all of that, I think it's really

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important to show that the Air Force
did witness cases that they thought could be

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extraterrestrial, and that the Air Force
wasn't all on the same page to think

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that there was nothing to this.
And I end it with the idea because

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this is essentially blue Book. We've
all heard of blue Book, We've all

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looked at these old cases, So
this is the only episode that will address

293
00:24:57.440 --> 00:25:03.440
that sort of thing directly. But
I ended with that to set the base

294
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that they did continue to look into
UFOs and as they said when they closed

295
00:25:11.599 --> 00:25:18.240
Project blue Book, that the most
important cases were not going through book,

296
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blue book. They were going through
their regular procedures and why is that important?

297
00:25:23.559 --> 00:25:27.680
Because then we're going to get into
what were their regular procedures for reporting

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UFOs and what were some of these
really important cases that made it to the

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00:25:36.359 --> 00:25:48.319
most important methods of you know,
essentially really high important incidents, how they

300
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get reported, and why some UFO
cases have made it to that reporting system.

301
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So that's essentially setting the base for
this that it was a big deal

302
00:25:59.400 --> 00:26:03.519
to the Air Force continues to be
a big deal. And I think that

303
00:26:03.599 --> 00:26:07.839
this is a new era for this
because I don't think people have looked at

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00:26:07.839 --> 00:26:14.240
this in this detail or looked at
those issues so much. We get caught

305
00:26:14.319 --> 00:26:18.880
up in these real kind of fringe
conspiracy theories and stuff like that. Not

306
00:26:18.920 --> 00:26:33.599
only that, the idea of an
organization spinning information so they don't get embarrassed

307
00:26:33.599 --> 00:26:37.759
is par for the course these days. I think the average person is much

308
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more savvy about that. What do
you think, right? Yeah? And

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I think the government is much more
savvy about that as well. Well.

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And I think that the average person
is much more savvy about the idea that

311
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everybody does this. Oh that's interesting, Yeah, I mean everybody does it.

312
00:26:56.279 --> 00:27:02.960
Politicians, sure, government, I
mean every product. Unfortunately, I've

313
00:27:02.960 --> 00:27:07.359
been saying this that you know,
typically the commercials are false. You know,

314
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it's like it's okay to lie,
it's okay to spin. That's just

315
00:27:10.839 --> 00:27:17.160
kind of the culture. So I
think people can better understand that just because

316
00:27:17.200 --> 00:27:22.279
the Air Force said they weren't interested, doesn't mean they weren't and that can

317
00:27:22.319 --> 00:27:26.119
be demonstrated. Yeah, and you
know a lot of this when you go

318
00:27:26.279 --> 00:27:32.079
back to you know, nineteen forty
seven, when they first started investigating UFOs,

319
00:27:32.599 --> 00:27:37.839
we had just gotten through World War
Two, and everybody like took the

320
00:27:37.839 --> 00:27:45.279
government's word for one hundred percent face
value and you know, led us through

321
00:27:45.319 --> 00:27:51.839
the war safely and all that.
But as time went on, as time

322
00:27:52.039 --> 00:27:57.839
has gone on, there's just many
more cases where the government has either covered

323
00:27:57.839 --> 00:28:03.599
things up and has been found out
about it. So why not UFOs.

324
00:28:03.640 --> 00:28:10.559
It's something unexplainable and something that you
know, they say it's not a threat

325
00:28:10.599 --> 00:28:15.039
to national security, maybe because there's
never been any real threats to national security

326
00:28:15.039 --> 00:28:19.759
from a UFO, but still for
them to not be able to understand or

327
00:28:19.799 --> 00:28:25.240
to understand what's actually going on in
our skies, it's still like a mystery.

328
00:28:25.279 --> 00:28:30.519
We really don't know what the government
really thinks about it well, and

329
00:28:30.759 --> 00:28:34.160
you know, a couple we have
some interviews that are in there where we

330
00:28:34.240 --> 00:28:38.759
just get a few quotes from people
just to show that you know, there

331
00:28:40.160 --> 00:28:45.039
there are others who have observed this
and who understand it, and very credible

332
00:28:45.119 --> 00:28:48.559
people who are insiders when it comes
to the government. So we have Colonel

333
00:28:48.599 --> 00:28:55.240
John Alexander who was with Army Intelligence. We have Nick Pope, who of

334
00:28:55.240 --> 00:29:00.960
course worked for the UK Ministry of
Defense investigating UFOs. And the other person

335
00:29:00.039 --> 00:29:04.359
we have because I think someone who's
been doing great work in this area is

336
00:29:04.400 --> 00:29:10.119
Paul Dean. Dean who both of
us have. You've interviewed him so if

337
00:29:10.160 --> 00:29:15.519
I and I'll continue to. But
he is doing some great work and putting

338
00:29:15.559 --> 00:29:22.640
these pieces together. But you know, some people, and I don't know

339
00:29:22.680 --> 00:29:26.640
how well I think, I don't
know how you feel, because a lot

340
00:29:26.680 --> 00:29:30.960
of people will say, you know, oh, Colonel John Alexander and Nick

341
00:29:32.000 --> 00:29:34.400
Pope they're with you know, how
can you trust what they say? They're

342
00:29:34.440 --> 00:29:41.039
they're part of the hiding the information. And I don't believe that to be

343
00:29:41.119 --> 00:29:49.319
true having known them for many many
years now, both of them are have

344
00:29:49.480 --> 00:29:56.880
been especially nick instrumental and bringing credibility
to the idea that UFOs are real phenomenon.

345
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And the point is is if even
if they were some sort of part

346
00:30:10.359 --> 00:30:15.400
of some sort of disinformation, to
engage them or to discuss I mean,

347
00:30:15.559 --> 00:30:19.759
you've got to catch them in a
liar or something, which I don't believe

348
00:30:19.759 --> 00:30:25.640
has happened to this point. I
am not afraid to challenge either of them

349
00:30:26.079 --> 00:30:32.839
when I do my interviews, but
because it's not necessarily that I disagree with

350
00:30:32.880 --> 00:30:36.400
them, but I know people do, and I like to explore those ideas

351
00:30:36.440 --> 00:30:40.200
because I don't know how I feel
about some of those things. But I

352
00:30:40.240 --> 00:30:45.200
think that we can just do this
intelligently enough where we can put pieces together

353
00:30:45.599 --> 00:30:51.200
to put together more of a story
than what we currently have. And that's

354
00:30:51.240 --> 00:30:53.880
what I'm trying to do and to
get that across to people, because I

355
00:30:53.880 --> 00:31:00.200
think what's going to be really interesting
going forward is looking at these lesser own

356
00:31:00.240 --> 00:31:07.880
type of things, you know,
like these systems that were used to alert

357
00:31:07.279 --> 00:31:15.039
high you know, the command of
very important situations, and that they were

358
00:31:15.079 --> 00:31:21.559
in fact used for UFO situations.
Right, and I'm still going on today.

359
00:31:21.599 --> 00:31:26.599
I would guess can we talk more
about this, this, this whole

360
00:31:26.640 --> 00:31:30.519
flap during nineteen fifty two is Yeah, let's do because I wanted to ask

361
00:31:30.599 --> 00:31:33.480
you since you've watched the video and
I've been so immersed in all of this

362
00:31:33.599 --> 00:31:38.000
information for so long, did you
see Steph in there that you didn't know

363
00:31:38.079 --> 00:31:42.400
about? Yes? Well, first
of all, one of the things I

364
00:31:42.440 --> 00:31:45.799
didn't know about right off the bat, and I'm I'm gonna be honest with

365
00:31:45.880 --> 00:31:52.200
you, and that is the videos
that I've seen in the past and pictures

366
00:31:52.559 --> 00:31:56.960
about the UFOs over the Capitol.
I never realized that was just a reflection

367
00:31:56.079 --> 00:32:02.440
of the lampposts and how how so
that is something I learned in the video

368
00:32:02.559 --> 00:32:07.559
right off the bat to talk about
that, But how how does that happen

369
00:32:07.599 --> 00:32:12.839
where the light posts make the reflections
in the sky like that? Is that

370
00:32:12.920 --> 00:32:17.160
a camera? Yeah? So essentially
it's totally a camera lens thing. So

371
00:32:17.680 --> 00:32:23.799
what you're talking about is I mentioned
that there are no pictures or video from

372
00:32:23.839 --> 00:32:30.440
the nineteen fifty two Washington event.
There are alleged pictures and video, but

373
00:32:30.599 --> 00:32:37.279
none of those panned through. They
all have either been mistakes mistakenly you know,

374
00:32:37.440 --> 00:32:42.880
from nineteen fifty two or we're recreations. So for instance, all the

375
00:32:42.960 --> 00:32:47.960
videos are recreations from documentaries, and
the most famous picture, the when you're

376
00:32:49.000 --> 00:32:54.920
talking about it appears it's actually from
the sixties. Nightcap is the best source,

377
00:32:54.960 --> 00:32:58.799
and I think I'm pretty sure I
have a link in there to the

378
00:32:58.920 --> 00:33:02.599
Nightcap investigation. But if you go
into Nightcap, I think they've got the

379
00:33:02.599 --> 00:33:08.400
best examination of that photo. It's
not completely sure where the photo came from.

380
00:33:08.440 --> 00:33:13.160
People are pretty certain they've been able
to determine it's actually from the sixties.

381
00:33:13.759 --> 00:33:17.880
But it's actually not too difficult because
even if I tell you this now,

382
00:33:17.920 --> 00:33:22.279
you'll probably go aha. And once
I read this, I kind of

383
00:33:22.319 --> 00:33:27.640
did the same thing. They line
up perfectly with the lights. Look at

384
00:33:27.680 --> 00:33:31.680
the shape of the lights and then
look at the lamp posts below and you'll

385
00:33:31.680 --> 00:33:36.599
see they're exactly the same. So
it is reflectant or I think it may

386
00:33:36.680 --> 00:33:42.200
be technically refraction someone you can read
in the analysis, But it's the same

387
00:33:42.240 --> 00:33:46.440
thing that happened with like these Texas
videos and stuff. And I've got we

388
00:33:46.599 --> 00:33:52.440
get these videos of someone going down
the highway recording with their phone these ring

389
00:33:52.720 --> 00:33:59.119
lights, you know, or taking
a picture of this. Those lights are

390
00:33:59.200 --> 00:34:04.119
reflections of the highway lights. Typically
the highway lights are so bright you can't

391
00:34:04.160 --> 00:34:07.920
tell the configuration of the lights there. But usually those pictures, it turns

392
00:34:07.960 --> 00:34:14.239
out like those ring of lights are
exactly the same configuration as the highway lights.

393
00:34:14.239 --> 00:34:16.760
It's because of the reflection. It's
the same sort of thing that's going

394
00:34:16.800 --> 00:34:21.920
on here. Really bright lights just
can reflect in a lens and then appear

395
00:34:22.159 --> 00:34:25.519
elsewhere. So it's how you get
land flares and stuff like that. So

396
00:34:27.119 --> 00:34:31.400
yeah, So that one is not
to take away from the amazing story that

397
00:34:31.559 --> 00:34:36.679
it is, but that was just
one part of it that I have just

398
00:34:36.800 --> 00:34:42.039
taken for granted that that picture and
images were in effect the real You have

399
00:34:42.199 --> 00:34:49.320
one of the real UFO sightings.
But the thing goes along a lot longer

400
00:34:49.360 --> 00:34:53.239
than I expect that it has in
the Washington area, and you point that

401
00:34:53.320 --> 00:35:00.599
out in the video how it starts
and and you know the final I think

402
00:35:00.599 --> 00:35:06.960
it's pretty interesting that it was ongoing
even the night on July twenty ninth of

403
00:35:07.000 --> 00:35:10.639
the press the press conference they had. Yeah, and I think that's another

404
00:35:10.719 --> 00:35:16.320
thing that I think people UFO people
have seen this press conference. So essentially

405
00:35:16.360 --> 00:35:21.239
when the nineteen fifty two thing happened, and the Air Force witnessed the event

406
00:35:21.320 --> 00:35:24.320
happen. One of the jet pilots
then spoke to the press and said,

407
00:35:24.679 --> 00:35:28.960
you know, we chased these things, we couldn't catch them. That's where

408
00:35:29.000 --> 00:35:36.480
you get the famous photos of the
Washington Post where it says jet outpaced by

409
00:35:36.559 --> 00:35:40.920
saucer and then there's a quote in
there from the jet pilot. So the

410
00:35:40.960 --> 00:35:45.559
Air Force felt pressured then to make
a comment, so they had a press

411
00:35:45.599 --> 00:35:50.760
conference and General Samford, who was
a Director of Air Force Intelligence at the

412
00:35:50.800 --> 00:35:55.320
time, was a one to do
the conference. But, like Rupelt said,

413
00:35:57.000 --> 00:36:02.360
he didn't have a clue to what
the investigation was. He was not

414
00:36:02.519 --> 00:36:07.800
briefed on the investigation. The investigation
had only just begun, and so he

415
00:36:07.840 --> 00:36:12.800
didn't know what the investigation was.
But if you're just going to do a

416
00:36:12.840 --> 00:36:15.599
spin, you don't need to know. You just tell people what you want

417
00:36:15.679 --> 00:36:16.880
him to hear, which of course
is what the Air Force did a lot

418
00:36:16.920 --> 00:36:22.239
of when it came to UFOs.
So Samford comes out the interesting thing,

419
00:36:22.920 --> 00:36:27.000
and this is where people will recognize
the video, and that's what's fun because

420
00:36:27.000 --> 00:36:29.760
people know the video, but they
might not know what it's related to.

421
00:36:29.800 --> 00:36:32.719
This nineteen fifty two event, because
he does say, you know, in

422
00:36:34.280 --> 00:36:40.199
our investigations of UFOs, most of
them are not interesting, but some of

423
00:36:40.239 --> 00:36:50.480
these are some very credible people reporting
some incredible things. But that was part

424
00:36:50.519 --> 00:36:54.119
of this press conference. But he
did say that the Washington sidings were temperature

425
00:36:54.199 --> 00:37:00.760
most likely temperature inversions. However,
that only would playing the radar part of

426
00:37:00.760 --> 00:37:07.679
it, not the visual part.
Also, uh, the they had already

427
00:37:07.800 --> 00:37:12.320
ruled that out in their investigation because
right, they were aware of the inversions

428
00:37:12.519 --> 00:37:15.719
exactly, they were aware of the
inversions. They never mistook them for UFOs.

429
00:37:16.239 --> 00:37:21.559
Mm hmm. It just was a
good spin on yeah at the time,

430
00:37:22.000 --> 00:37:24.719
well, and it was it was
an answer that would appease everyone and

431
00:37:25.159 --> 00:37:32.719
hopefully deflate, you know, all
of the attention and make people the news

432
00:37:32.840 --> 00:37:39.199
cover the next story and get their
answers so they can move on. So

433
00:37:40.079 --> 00:37:45.760
yeah. So it's really interesting though
that now we have on YouTube to this

434
00:37:45.960 --> 00:37:52.280
day, you know, General Sanford
at this press conference making these statements,

435
00:37:52.920 --> 00:38:00.280
right, And I think it's pretty
interesting also that these pilots reported that,

436
00:38:00.159 --> 00:38:05.119
you know, as they got near
the objects, how they would disappear but

437
00:38:05.159 --> 00:38:08.000
still be there on radar. Now
to me that wouldn't you know, there

438
00:38:08.039 --> 00:38:14.800
wouldn't be any any other answer for
it, that it was, you know,

439
00:38:14.880 --> 00:38:19.519
a total unknown. I almost said
extraterrestrial, but I didn't. Yeah,

440
00:38:19.639 --> 00:38:22.199
right, I mean they saw these
things. That's the other thing.

441
00:38:22.239 --> 00:38:28.079
You don't temperature and versions, as
far as we know, do not floras.

442
00:38:28.159 --> 00:38:32.480
They don't make some sort of you
know, bright light. They don't

443
00:38:32.559 --> 00:38:38.840
emanate any bright light. So where
as these objects were and what's interesting,

444
00:38:38.920 --> 00:38:44.199
I mean really I think what would
be what's interesting another story or if someone

445
00:38:44.519 --> 00:38:50.800
maybe somebody's done this is to really
lay down all of the incidents where jets

446
00:38:50.840 --> 00:38:55.840
were scrambled after lights that were also
caught on radar and couldn't catch them,

447
00:38:57.079 --> 00:39:00.800
because it's happened many many other times. Helt covers these in his book.

448
00:39:00.920 --> 00:39:07.960
In fact, he said that I
can't during this flap, there was a

449
00:39:07.000 --> 00:39:10.679
really big case in San Diego where
that had happened at a military base as

450
00:39:10.719 --> 00:39:19.400
well. Wow, And so there
was a number of times that they just

451
00:39:19.440 --> 00:39:24.360
said that they were trying to chase
these things things and just could not gain

452
00:39:24.440 --> 00:39:30.559
on them basically at full at full
speed. Right, So was it?

453
00:39:30.639 --> 00:39:36.880
Yeah? So outpaced is like the
term they use so, yeah, this

454
00:39:36.960 --> 00:39:40.920
sighting is just so important for so
many reasons and and I think it's it

455
00:39:42.000 --> 00:39:47.519
lays down really well the importance and
I and what's great is having Nick Pope

456
00:39:47.519 --> 00:39:51.960
as a part of you know,
his comments in the video too, because

457
00:39:52.239 --> 00:39:55.679
I think he puts it really well
as to what the military would be thinking

458
00:39:55.719 --> 00:40:04.960
and and we're thinking when this took
place, right, And I had never

459
00:40:05.039 --> 00:40:08.719
heard of Major Dewey fournee either,
if that's how you say his name,

460
00:40:09.679 --> 00:40:19.239
of his involvement in this, but
didn't didn't RuPaul Edward RuPaul didn't he show

461
00:40:19.559 --> 00:40:23.280
up during a flat but he did
not witness it. Well, that means

462
00:40:23.360 --> 00:40:27.920
during one of the sightings, Yeah, the big sighting where the air Force

463
00:40:28.079 --> 00:40:31.599
saw what had happened, where like
you said, where the people went from

464
00:40:31.599 --> 00:40:37.639
the Pentagon to National Airport, he
was not there. Which is kind of

465
00:40:37.639 --> 00:40:42.519
funny because he talks about how he
went to Washington, DC a week prior

466
00:40:43.119 --> 00:40:46.480
for unrelated business. When he got
to his hotel, there were a bunch

467
00:40:46.480 --> 00:40:50.719
of reporters there and his friend had
to get him through all this crowd of

468
00:40:50.760 --> 00:40:54.960
reporters asking questions and they were asking
about UFOs. So there had been UFO

469
00:40:55.039 --> 00:41:00.400
sidings that were in the paper.
He was not aware. That day,

470
00:41:00.440 --> 00:41:04.000
called is Superior, said hey,
what's going on? They said, you

471
00:41:04.000 --> 00:41:07.679
know, you can go get briefed
at the Bowling Air Force Base where they,

472
00:41:07.960 --> 00:41:12.880
you know, were part of this
whole thing. They described essentially the

473
00:41:12.880 --> 00:41:15.280
same thing, jets being scrambled.
They couldn't catch them. Jets took forever

474
00:41:15.360 --> 00:41:21.079
because they weren't sure. I guess
they even wanted to go chase UFOs.

475
00:41:21.159 --> 00:41:27.679
But so the same kind of thing
happened. So he was supposed to stay

476
00:41:27.800 --> 00:41:31.079
and investigate, but because he was
there for unrelated business, he had to

477
00:41:31.079 --> 00:41:37.079
get an extension. It's kind of
a funny story about the bureaucracy. So

478
00:41:37.800 --> 00:41:42.239
he had to go to get permission
to spend the money to essentially have more

479
00:41:42.280 --> 00:41:45.320
money to stay in Washington, DC. And he had to go through all

480
00:41:45.320 --> 00:41:52.559
these bureaucratic you know, and back
then more so than now. You've got

481
00:41:52.559 --> 00:41:54.559
to go to the office. You
can't do this stuff online or you don't

482
00:41:54.599 --> 00:41:58.159
have a cell phone, so you've
got to find a phone. You've got

483
00:41:58.199 --> 00:42:00.000
to go to this office, go
to that office, back and forth,

484
00:42:00.280 --> 00:42:04.960
and it just wasn't physically possible.
He had to catch cabs to go here

485
00:42:05.000 --> 00:42:10.920
and there, and finally he just
they he couldn't get the paperwork approved and

486
00:42:12.000 --> 00:42:15.360
done on time, so he just
had to go back to Wright Patterson and

487
00:42:15.679 --> 00:42:22.039
so he was back there when this
all took place. He did fly immediately

488
00:42:22.239 --> 00:42:25.559
to DC after everything took place,
and then got briefed the next morning,

489
00:42:28.039 --> 00:42:31.159
so he was there for the press
conference. But he said it was just

490
00:42:31.199 --> 00:42:36.880
too much a cluster it really they
didn't even really get in a full investigation

491
00:42:37.039 --> 00:42:42.639
because it was just a mess that. You know, they have very few

492
00:42:42.679 --> 00:42:45.920
resources and you know, this is
where you get some insight, I think

493
00:42:45.000 --> 00:42:50.800
into what's going on here. They
have very few resources towards this, and

494
00:42:51.719 --> 00:42:57.119
they just wanted, you know,
as far as the PR part, to

495
00:42:58.639 --> 00:43:01.360
push it, shove it under the
rut. Now, was there a full

496
00:43:01.400 --> 00:43:07.239
investigation going on by this, Uh? You know, their regular reporting systems

497
00:43:07.280 --> 00:43:13.679
that go to whoever investigate these important
incidences. Probably, we don't have any

498
00:43:13.880 --> 00:43:19.480
evidence of that that I am aware
of, but probably. But who that

499
00:43:19.519 --> 00:43:27.039
went to and when is the hard
thing to know. But we do know

500
00:43:27.119 --> 00:43:30.719
other cases went to these places and
those cases are great, So that will

501
00:43:30.719 --> 00:43:39.400
be in future episodes of Open Minds
magazine the video version. Getting back to

502
00:43:39.440 --> 00:43:44.400
the scrambling of the jets, because
I'm stuck on that right. Yeah,

503
00:43:44.679 --> 00:43:49.360
now as you see, Yeah,
what do you suppose they would do if

504
00:43:49.679 --> 00:43:52.639
if they could actually catch them?
You know, is it just to observe?

505
00:43:52.880 --> 00:43:57.960
Is that what they're told to do? Well? I mean, in

506
00:43:58.000 --> 00:44:02.599
this case, it sounds like observe, because like they said, that's another

507
00:44:02.639 --> 00:44:07.559
interesting thing is that you know,
they they had the press and everybody leave

508
00:44:07.639 --> 00:44:12.920
the control pat tower once they saw
that they were getting these jets and these

509
00:44:12.920 --> 00:44:15.719
objects were there, because they really
felt we might get a close up look

510
00:44:15.719 --> 00:44:19.679
at a UFO. We might be
able to get to see what these things

511
00:44:19.760 --> 00:44:22.800
look like. Maybe we'll be able
to look into a window. Who knows,

512
00:44:24.079 --> 00:44:27.360
and they didn't want people to know. Who knows what they would have

513
00:44:27.400 --> 00:44:31.119
done at that at that point,
but yeah, it was too observed.

514
00:44:31.280 --> 00:44:37.400
Maybe they would have decided to,
I don't know, maybe to shoot one

515
00:44:37.480 --> 00:44:42.760
down so they could get an idea
of what it looks like. I guess

516
00:44:42.800 --> 00:44:46.519
at that point I would imagine And
it's kind of like what Nick talks about,

517
00:44:46.679 --> 00:44:52.719
is that they do demonstrate a threat. I mean, it's an unknown

518
00:44:52.800 --> 00:45:04.039
object with unknown motives. You know, in highly secure airspace. I think

519
00:45:04.519 --> 00:45:07.239
maybe they would have. But then
again, you know, you try to

520
00:45:07.239 --> 00:45:10.480
shoot at it, you could be
endangering all of the people on the ground.

521
00:45:10.840 --> 00:45:15.039
It could you know, what if
it blows up like the Deaths Star

522
00:45:15.719 --> 00:45:23.159
and you take out all of DC
accidentally because you shot this this flex capacitor

523
00:45:23.280 --> 00:45:30.760
that creates this huge mushroom cloud.
Yeah. No, it must be hard

524
00:45:30.800 --> 00:45:37.760
to be the decision person on this, right, like you know what to

525
00:45:37.840 --> 00:45:42.800
tell them to do, and you
know, I'm sure that I'm not sure,

526
00:45:42.840 --> 00:45:45.639
but I'm guessing that at the time
the president was alerted to this.

527
00:45:47.440 --> 00:45:53.039
Well, there is someone who commented
that they feel that they can see in

528
00:45:53.079 --> 00:46:00.480
the record the president was consulted on
this, but we don't know for sure,

529
00:46:02.119 --> 00:46:08.400
so because I guess that the people
there indicate that he possibly or probably

530
00:46:08.599 --> 00:46:16.039
was. But so, but that's
a yeah, really interesting question. Yeah,

531
00:46:16.079 --> 00:46:24.159
and so how long are you aware
that this flap go on over Washington?

532
00:46:24.639 --> 00:46:28.679
I know it said the twenty ninth, there was I think it began

533
00:46:28.840 --> 00:46:32.000
a few weeks ahead of time before
that in the general area, but within

534
00:46:32.039 --> 00:46:37.280
one hundred miles of Washington, DC, right, Yeah, I don't know

535
00:46:37.360 --> 00:46:39.159
for sure. I mean, nineteen
fifty two was a flap. He talked

536
00:46:39.199 --> 00:46:44.280
about fifty three. A lot of
this is in Rupelt's book, where he

537
00:46:44.320 --> 00:46:47.519
has talked about these flaps and how
long they last and everything. And like

538
00:46:47.599 --> 00:46:52.440
I tell people, Rupelt's book I
think is maybe one of, if not

539
00:46:52.559 --> 00:46:58.000
the most important books to read.
I think that if you're really starting in

540
00:46:58.039 --> 00:47:01.519
this field, that's the book where
you should. I think that gives you

541
00:47:01.599 --> 00:47:10.079
a good grounded perspective at what the
Air Force did and why, and from

542
00:47:10.239 --> 00:47:17.519
that you can kind of stem off
to other things. But yeah, it's

543
00:47:17.559 --> 00:47:22.280
all in his book. So DC. There's somebody else who made me aware

544
00:47:22.320 --> 00:47:25.559
of a book that they wrote about
Washington d C sightings, and they said

545
00:47:27.400 --> 00:47:31.679
they were kind of challenging me that
there weren't video or photographs. But I

546
00:47:31.840 --> 00:47:35.360
looked in that book, and I
don't know if he understood that. I

547
00:47:35.480 --> 00:47:38.920
just meant for that fifty two event. In fact, we have a sighting

548
00:47:38.960 --> 00:47:45.559
from Washington, d C recently that
we posted on the site. So there

549
00:47:45.599 --> 00:47:51.119
are other sightings and other things seen. But yeah, this person's book contends

550
00:47:51.159 --> 00:47:57.280
that, you know, it's been
one of the biggest sighting areas of anywhere.

551
00:47:57.480 --> 00:48:02.360
But he also, you know,
says he believes these are extraterrestrials that

552
00:48:02.400 --> 00:48:07.679
are visiting us too, and he
believes they're making contact and all of this

553
00:48:07.760 --> 00:48:14.599
other stuff. But yeah, I
guess you'd have to look at the record.

554
00:48:14.639 --> 00:48:16.280
I don't know for sure, you
know, how many sightings in the

555
00:48:16.360 --> 00:48:23.360
DC area. And essentially, what
my goal was is to demonstrate, and

556
00:48:23.679 --> 00:48:30.679
you know, I tell this to
other people, is that my goal is

557
00:48:30.760 --> 00:48:37.039
to make as strong a case as
possible for the legitimacy of this UFO research,

558
00:48:37.119 --> 00:48:44.400
but also to demonstrate more accurately what
happened. Because the media has a

559
00:48:44.440 --> 00:48:50.760
perception that the Air Force didn't take
the UFO seriously, nor did they investigate

560
00:48:50.800 --> 00:48:55.920
them after nineteen sixty nine, and
that's just not true. That many people

561
00:48:57.840 --> 00:49:02.920
in the Air Force believe that the
extra interrestrial answer could be what's going on,

562
00:49:04.480 --> 00:49:10.360
and that they took these cases very
seriously, as they should. But

563
00:49:10.480 --> 00:49:16.880
the question, the big question,
which a lot of people have feelings about,

564
00:49:17.159 --> 00:49:27.440
but I don't feel we have evidence
regarding is examining who was looking at

565
00:49:27.519 --> 00:49:32.320
what in the government and what they
determined. And that's what I think it's

566
00:49:32.519 --> 00:49:38.239
fascinating. I think it's fascinating Paul
Deine's work, of course, John Greenwald's

567
00:49:38.280 --> 00:49:50.280
work and others trying to get those
answers, and people like Nick Pope seemingly

568
00:49:50.519 --> 00:49:58.000
only has a little more information than
we do, same with John Alexander.

569
00:49:58.920 --> 00:50:01.760
But there could be information out there, and that's what we need to look

570
00:50:01.840 --> 00:50:07.440
for. And I think some of
the things like Paul Dean has found,

571
00:50:07.559 --> 00:50:15.639
which we will be highlighting in upcoming
episodes and stories, are not things that

572
00:50:15.719 --> 00:50:22.920
have been really discussed in this field
before, as far as who was looking

573
00:50:22.920 --> 00:50:28.440
at web right right. One of
the things that it does mention about one

574
00:50:28.480 --> 00:50:31.960
of the sites that I thought it
was pretty interesting on the object's speeds were

575
00:50:31.960 --> 00:50:37.519
clocked at first one hundred to one
hundred and thirty miles per hour, which

576
00:50:37.559 --> 00:50:45.280
was for an aircraft would be fairly
slow, and then speeds were clocked up

577
00:50:45.320 --> 00:50:50.880
to seven thousand miles per hour.
So of course they're going to investigate something

578
00:50:51.079 --> 00:50:55.320
like that, and you know that
can't be an inversion as well, that

579
00:50:55.360 --> 00:51:00.119
would speeds like that, I don't
believe. And one of the things that

580
00:51:00.280 --> 00:51:05.480
Nick makes a point of, and
Rupeelt and others, and I think that

581
00:51:05.599 --> 00:51:09.280
there's just a real misunderstanding. We
often use this term government and other people

582
00:51:09.320 --> 00:51:15.480
say this, but Rupelt's book demonstrates
this and to do Nick and I think

583
00:51:15.559 --> 00:51:21.400
John's comments, and it's something we
have to continue to remember, is that

584
00:51:22.280 --> 00:51:28.119
government, it's not like that is
one big organization. You know, let's

585
00:51:28.119 --> 00:51:31.599
have a government meeting and there's a
big table and everybody, Okay, what's

586
00:51:31.639 --> 00:51:36.400
going on here? And that that
there are multiple different departments. So when

587
00:51:36.480 --> 00:51:42.920
something happens such as Washington, DC, and I think Nick even says this

588
00:51:43.000 --> 00:51:46.599
in here in the video, is
that, you know, the first thing

589
00:51:46.639 --> 00:51:51.920
you're thinking is, okay, whose
is this? Is this right? You

590
00:51:51.960 --> 00:51:55.519
know that is this a navy thing? Is this a skunk works thing?

591
00:51:57.400 --> 00:51:59.840
You know, they're thinking more along
the lines of, okay, it's one

592
00:51:59.880 --> 00:52:01.920
of ours, one of our guys, is we just don't know about it,

593
00:52:02.119 --> 00:52:07.920
and we may never know about this
project because it's none of our business.

594
00:52:07.960 --> 00:52:13.119
And you know, but that's probably
what it is. So that's what

595
00:52:13.159 --> 00:52:15.920
they're thinking, first of all,
is that, you know, there's many

596
00:52:15.960 --> 00:52:19.840
different organizations doing different things. We
don't know what they're up to, but

597
00:52:19.880 --> 00:52:23.639
we know they're capable and I can
ask, but they may not answer.

598
00:52:25.039 --> 00:52:31.440
So that's the first thing they're thinking. So, but in this case,

599
00:52:31.639 --> 00:52:37.000
and that's what's great about this case
is that they're able to see that these

600
00:52:37.039 --> 00:52:39.599
things, Okay, wow, this
isn't you know, the Navy, this

601
00:52:39.679 --> 00:52:47.559
isn't DARPA or somebody else. This
is something that's beyond beyond that, because

602
00:52:47.559 --> 00:52:50.679
they're not gonna fly it over Washington, d C. First of all.

603
00:52:51.000 --> 00:52:53.199
Yeah, so there's a lot going
on where they don't know. And Nick

604
00:52:53.239 --> 00:52:57.480
Pope says, this a lot.
I don't know if other departments were doing

605
00:52:57.559 --> 00:53:01.079
other things. They probably were.
I've heard stories of other people doing this

606
00:53:01.199 --> 00:53:06.639
and that, but you know,
I don't have the information to say what

607
00:53:06.920 --> 00:53:10.840
others were necessarily doing. And just
like in the end of our story where

608
00:53:10.840 --> 00:53:16.679
we say showed this boat, talk
about this Bolander memo where he says that,

609
00:53:16.960 --> 00:53:22.800
you know, these cases having to
deal with national security go elsewhere.

610
00:53:23.960 --> 00:53:30.320
So there are other elsewheres and who
those are we don't know. And Nick

611
00:53:30.480 --> 00:53:36.800
is kind of akin to Rupelt where
he knows there were other elsewhees, but

612
00:53:37.400 --> 00:53:45.280
who they are he's not necessarily sure. So's it's just so very very complicated,

613
00:53:45.079 --> 00:53:50.119
and there's always the need to know
basis too. Yeah, there's always

614
00:53:50.159 --> 00:53:55.440
the need to know, there's always
budgets, there's always in fighting, there's

615
00:53:55.480 --> 00:54:01.679
always bureaucracy. There are all these
things that get in the way and cause

616
00:54:01.760 --> 00:54:06.880
all of these issues. So it
makes it, it would make it,

617
00:54:06.960 --> 00:54:14.320
I think, very difficult for any
one organization to handle all of that.

618
00:54:17.719 --> 00:54:22.840
So so yeah, so even if
we have these advanced research groups looking into

619
00:54:22.920 --> 00:54:27.519
it, I think our best case
scenario, most likely scenario, would be

620
00:54:27.920 --> 00:54:31.920
think tanks. That's kind of why
I called my first group UFO think tank.

621
00:54:32.039 --> 00:54:36.679
That that's often what happens is you
have groups that are kind of think

622
00:54:36.719 --> 00:54:44.400
tanks, that are policy advisors or
advisors who are able to say, you

623
00:54:44.440 --> 00:54:49.920
know, here's what might be going
on. But they're often the ones with

624
00:54:50.079 --> 00:55:00.519
the largest amount of information on given
subjects. However, often they they're private

625
00:55:00.119 --> 00:55:05.639
organizations, so they don't have to
share their findings or any of their information,

626
00:55:06.920 --> 00:55:12.559
which makes it very convenient then because
then they're not a subject to FOYA

627
00:55:12.960 --> 00:55:17.639
or anything like that. So and
that's what it might just come down to.

628
00:55:19.159 --> 00:55:22.360
It's interesting, Nick Pope told me
in Roswell, I don't know if

629
00:55:22.400 --> 00:55:27.360
I shared this with you or my
listeners. I was asking Nick Pope because

630
00:55:27.360 --> 00:55:32.559
I'm really interested about Project Condine.
Project Condinne was a report that was put

631
00:55:32.559 --> 00:55:45.360
together by the mod essentially and people
in the government interested in UFOs. It

632
00:55:45.480 --> 00:55:53.320
was a top secret investigation. People
like John. He's one of the witnesses

633
00:55:53.360 --> 00:55:59.320
at Rendelsham, John Burrows, he
talks about it a lot because they mentioned

634
00:55:59.480 --> 00:56:05.280
Rendell Sho. Now they speculated that
UFOs could be a plasma sort of phenomena,

635
00:56:06.039 --> 00:56:09.199
but they did acknowledge it as a
phenomena, but the UK often does.

636
00:56:09.480 --> 00:56:14.880
If you heard my talk at MUFON
about government UFO agencies, you would

637
00:56:14.880 --> 00:56:22.039
have heard that there too. But
what's interesting about Condon is that it's kind

638
00:56:22.079 --> 00:56:29.400
of they don't consult really any plasma
experts, and there's reading Condon, you

639
00:56:29.440 --> 00:56:36.599
get this idea that there's a lack
of thorough examinations of their theories. So

640
00:56:36.719 --> 00:56:40.320
I asked Nick Pope, why did
Project Condon, which eventually came out I

641
00:56:40.360 --> 00:56:44.760
think in twenty twelve. We didn't
find out get the full report till then.

642
00:56:45.440 --> 00:56:50.280
But why was the report put together? First of all? And second

643
00:56:50.320 --> 00:56:57.199
all of all, why is it
so shallow? Why aren't more experts consulted?

644
00:56:57.880 --> 00:57:02.880
They're speculating about a plasma phenomena,
yet we have no you know,

645
00:57:04.039 --> 00:57:07.960
indication that such a plasma phenomena exists. I mean, who are these scientists

646
00:57:07.960 --> 00:57:15.559
working on these theories of these plasma
phenomenons and why isn't there research on that

647
00:57:15.679 --> 00:57:21.280
in here, because that would be
pertinent and interesting to go down that road

648
00:57:21.480 --> 00:57:25.480
to you know, say that that's
what's going on. And Nick said,

649
00:57:25.639 --> 00:57:30.119
well, here's the thing, is
that that the report exists is really important

650
00:57:30.159 --> 00:57:37.800
because it's essentially UFO junkies. It's
people in the government and in intelligence who

651
00:57:37.880 --> 00:57:43.159
are interested in the UFO phenomena.
They think there's more to it, so

652
00:57:43.360 --> 00:57:51.400
they pushed for another investigation. The
problem was it's a top secret investigation,

653
00:57:52.320 --> 00:57:58.239
so you can't really you're very limited
on who you can consult because if you

654
00:57:58.360 --> 00:58:01.159
consult someone, you've just tip them
off that this investigation is going on,

655
00:58:01.960 --> 00:58:07.559
and you can't do that. So
you can't question someone about UFO scientists and

656
00:58:07.599 --> 00:58:15.880
otherwise because they're not in the loop
and they don't have clearances or they can't

657
00:58:15.920 --> 00:58:21.239
know about the investigation, so they
can't be part of it. So it

658
00:58:21.320 --> 00:58:27.159
can't be that thorough of an investigation
then, which is really funny because it's

659
00:58:27.239 --> 00:58:32.280
kind of the silliness of the bureaucracy, but it shows the limitations and the

660
00:58:32.320 --> 00:58:39.519
limitations of that then investigation. Now
John Burrows is saying that, you know,

661
00:58:39.559 --> 00:58:44.920
this is evidence that the UK government
knows that I was affected by a

662
00:58:45.039 --> 00:58:50.159
UFO and that is called my health
issue, caused my health issues. But

663
00:58:50.199 --> 00:58:52.559
the paper are all it does is
speculate, and it does speculate that that

664
00:58:53.039 --> 00:58:58.679
perhaps because John Burrows and people at
Reynoldstrom say they got close to one of

665
00:58:58.719 --> 00:59:04.360
these things, these balls of light, that this plasma phenomenon has some sort

666
00:59:04.400 --> 00:59:08.920
of radiation and that's how they got
health issues. But it's just speculation.

667
00:59:10.280 --> 00:59:15.960
There's no science added to that.
There's no you know, they don't and

668
00:59:16.039 --> 00:59:20.599
if you can go read it,
you could go download Project Condine and read

669
00:59:20.679 --> 00:59:24.760
it right now. So and I
review that in a story about John Burrows.

670
00:59:25.800 --> 00:59:32.079
But it's yeah, so it's it's
interesting, Now didn't the didn't the

671
00:59:32.119 --> 00:59:40.519
government award him his medical What am
I trying to think there was some type

672
00:59:40.559 --> 00:59:46.000
of lawsuit? So that's kind of
monumental, right, there actually isn't it?

673
00:59:47.280 --> 00:59:52.639
That there was issues They didn't admit
to issues. So that's the thing

674
00:59:52.920 --> 01:00:04.840
is that by giving John Burrows his
disability, which he's saying in the facto,

675
01:00:05.000 --> 01:00:10.760
they're acknowledging that I was my health
issues are related to a UFO,

676
01:00:13.199 --> 01:00:17.920
not necessarily. So essentially what happens
is it's not uncommon. And I've interviewed

677
01:00:17.920 --> 01:00:21.519
his lawyer and you could too.
I could get you in touch with him

678
01:00:21.559 --> 01:00:25.079
if you wanted to. So I
asked him about this. He said,

679
01:00:25.159 --> 01:00:30.360
it's not uncommon for people who work
in top secret areas to have things like

680
01:00:30.440 --> 01:00:38.119
medical records otherwise classified so they can't
be used when with the VA or something

681
01:00:38.199 --> 01:00:45.159
like that. However, what happens
is you go through a process where they

682
01:00:45.159 --> 01:00:52.880
can still approve your disability or approve
without giving doctors or others the files.

683
01:00:54.360 --> 01:00:59.880
And that's the process they went through. So all it did was then acknowledge

684
01:00:59.880 --> 01:01:06.239
he has an now whole issue that
may have been related to his military career,

685
01:01:06.719 --> 01:01:13.840
and so he was then awarded what
he was given. So that's all

686
01:01:13.840 --> 01:01:16.840
they're really saying. They're not specifically
saying anything. The strange part is,

687
01:01:16.960 --> 01:01:22.679
though, is that his lawyer I
can't remember his name right now, says,

688
01:01:22.719 --> 01:01:28.800
although it is not strange for this
to happen, it is strange because

689
01:01:30.320 --> 01:01:35.400
John Burrows was not any on any
classified detail, he was not working on

690
01:01:35.480 --> 01:01:39.760
any classified projects, there is no
reason for his medical records to be withheld.

691
01:01:40.199 --> 01:01:45.639
So that's a mystery that still exists. And I think that's a really

692
01:01:45.800 --> 01:01:52.639
important and strange mystery is why won't
they release John Burrow's medical records, which

693
01:01:52.679 --> 01:02:00.280
they haven't, And that is an
unanswered question still. So it us all

694
01:02:00.880 --> 01:02:05.480
allude to possibly having to do with
the Rendall scham Forrest. I mean,

695
01:02:05.519 --> 01:02:10.679
that's the only thing that makes sense, So it's all circumstantial. Going to

696
01:02:10.760 --> 01:02:15.760
the next step to say de facto, you know, it might be a

697
01:02:15.760 --> 01:02:22.320
little steep, but I think you
would have a hard time with convincing many

698
01:02:22.599 --> 01:02:27.679
of that letting in the mainstream,
But those who are familiar with the case

699
01:02:27.880 --> 01:02:31.599
and familiar with you know, it
does seem that that's the only thing in

700
01:02:31.639 --> 01:02:40.199
his military career that could warrant his
records being kept. So and that coupled

701
01:02:40.239 --> 01:02:45.960
with Project Condine, are they looking
into these plasma phenomena? Who knows?

702
01:02:46.239 --> 01:02:51.519
You know who is go ahead?
No, you go ahead? No.

703
01:02:51.719 --> 01:02:55.880
I was just saying, are the
other witnesses that also have their medical records

704
01:02:57.280 --> 01:03:00.719
with health as classified? I believe
that. And I can't remember the details.

705
01:03:00.719 --> 01:03:04.400
I would have to check, but
I believe that his buddy you know

706
01:03:04.440 --> 01:03:07.119
who was also out there, yeah, Penison. I believe his records were

707
01:03:07.119 --> 01:03:14.199
also withheld. Yeah, okay,
what were you going to say? I

708
01:03:14.360 --> 01:03:20.320
was gonna say, you know who
is looking into plasma phenomenon related to UFOs?

709
01:03:22.320 --> 01:03:27.639
No, the universe, guess if
you want no, no, no,

710
01:03:27.800 --> 01:03:35.960
forget it. The University of Norway. Oh, because of the hesdeline

711
01:03:36.239 --> 01:03:43.159
exactly because of the hesdelin lights and
so Muffon actually had erling Strand, who

712
01:03:43.199 --> 01:03:49.679
was a professor who is part of
the research into the plasma phenomena. He

713
01:03:49.840 --> 01:03:58.920
had some very very interesting things to
say. I'm sure that's that. That's

714
01:03:59.000 --> 01:04:01.559
up. I know we're we're getting
way, we're going around in different topics,

715
01:04:01.880 --> 01:04:05.679
but I think that, uh wow, I'm just really what's it called

716
01:04:06.039 --> 01:04:12.559
when someone up? I'm setting you
up? Okay, this is what it

717
01:04:12.599 --> 01:04:18.480
is? All right? Yeah,
but you got it. You're not You're

718
01:04:18.559 --> 01:04:23.239
supposed to be like you're supposed to
make it. I just want to do

719
01:04:24.199 --> 01:04:28.679
I know, but I wanted to
do one of these awkward moments. Yeah,

720
01:04:28.679 --> 01:04:30.599
those are fun. Yeah, that's
why I was kind of playing along

721
01:04:30.639 --> 01:04:34.079
because it's fun to do the awkward
thing. Yeah. So what I was

722
01:04:34.119 --> 01:04:38.239
setting up for you is like,
oh wow, what did he talk about?

723
01:04:38.559 --> 01:04:44.239
And I was going to say,
well, lucky for you and anybody

724
01:04:44.280 --> 01:04:47.159
else who wants to come to the
UFO Congress. I haven't even announced this

725
01:04:47.320 --> 01:04:54.679
yet, but Earling Strand will be
speaking at the UFO Congress in February.

726
01:04:56.280 --> 01:05:02.159
Yay. So a professor that is
conducting a UFO investigation as part of his

727
01:05:02.440 --> 01:05:10.000
university work. Now they do it
pretty much under the auspices of investigating a

728
01:05:10.000 --> 01:05:15.639
plasma phenomenon. However, he says
this is no plasma phenomenon. He doesn't

729
01:05:15.639 --> 01:05:19.159
believe that theory, which is I
think fascinating. That's one of the best

730
01:05:19.280 --> 01:05:28.119
takeaways I took from the Muffon conference
this year is that. Yeah. Interestingly

731
01:05:28.480 --> 01:05:33.800
enough, Irling Strand does not subscribe
to this plasma theory that Project Condine and

732
01:05:34.239 --> 01:05:41.039
others have put forth for some of
these UFO cases. Do you know if

733
01:05:41.079 --> 01:05:46.000
he stands alone in this or are
there other people that have the same opinion.

734
01:05:46.840 --> 01:05:50.840
That is a great question. He
did not answer that in his talk

735
01:05:51.039 --> 01:05:56.440
at the symposium. It's a great
question. I think for him, and

736
01:05:56.480 --> 01:06:03.039
it's a great question to ask him
at the UFO Congress February twenty seventeen.

737
01:06:03.400 --> 01:06:12.400
Yeah, UFO Congress dot Com.
Yeah, exactly. Yeah, and I'm

738
01:06:12.480 --> 01:06:15.159
excited about that because I'm going to
be there again. Really. Yeah,

739
01:06:15.199 --> 01:06:19.400
that's awesome looking forward to it.
Yep, it's so awesome that you come

740
01:06:20.920 --> 01:06:25.960
to that every every year. Now, that was a major goal of mine

741
01:06:26.320 --> 01:06:30.519
to get you there, and you
are going now, so that is really

742
01:06:30.559 --> 01:06:33.960
really cool. And so yeah,
you'll be able to see erling Strand there.

743
01:06:34.559 --> 01:06:41.960
Some of the other speakers at the
Moufon Symposium were Tony Angiola and Ben

744
01:06:42.039 --> 01:06:46.559
Moss. They talked about Socorro and
I'm going to have them on my show

745
01:06:46.639 --> 01:06:50.000
next week. So we've got it
scheduled. My show will be on time.

746
01:06:50.039 --> 01:06:57.679
People, we'll have another show next
week. Yeah. Great. Those

747
01:06:57.719 --> 01:07:02.159
two guys are fun. Yeah,
they're cool, and I'm really looking forward

748
01:07:02.199 --> 01:07:08.199
to hearing the show because I know, even if you know a lot about

749
01:07:08.280 --> 01:07:14.480
that show and you've spoken in the
past or read Ray Stanford's book, there's

750
01:07:14.559 --> 01:07:18.360
still some things that are going to
be revealed next week, right, I

751
01:07:18.360 --> 01:07:24.719
don't know, you must know more
than I do. Well, I'm guessing

752
01:07:26.639 --> 01:07:31.360
they have not promised me anything that
is groundbreaking and new, but it is.

753
01:07:31.599 --> 01:07:35.519
I mean, they know more about
the Siicoro New Mexico UFO sighting.

754
01:07:36.280 --> 01:07:42.679
In fact, the last administrator of
Project blue Book, Hector Kintania, who

755
01:07:42.760 --> 01:07:46.199
was a skeptic, he said that
the Siicoro New Mexico case was the best

756
01:07:46.280 --> 01:07:51.639
case and the only case he found
convincing during his tenure as the head of

757
01:07:51.880 --> 01:07:59.360
Project Blue Book. So yeah,
we'll talk all about this crazy Succorde case,

758
01:07:59.400 --> 01:08:01.719
but we will get into details that
others don't know. In fact that

759
01:08:01.760 --> 01:08:04.440
you know, they went into a
lot of stuff I did not know about

760
01:08:04.440 --> 01:08:09.360
the sucur O case, and so
I'm really excited to talk to them about

761
01:08:09.400 --> 01:08:15.239
it some more next week. Yeah, have them if you think of it.

762
01:08:15.399 --> 01:08:19.319
I would like to know more about
the symbol. Okay, the symbol

763
01:08:19.840 --> 01:08:26.680
was on the craft and lannie Zamora
was told to not reveal the symbol,

764
01:08:26.760 --> 01:08:32.720
the correct symbol because they were afraid
of any copycats. So they could they

765
01:08:32.720 --> 01:08:39.800
could find out if someone was a
copycat and would if they released the symbol

766
01:08:40.359 --> 01:08:45.159
for what lannie Zamora was supposed to
have seen, then they would know one

767
01:08:45.159 --> 01:08:48.720
way or the other wather, the
people would be telling the truth. So

768
01:08:49.079 --> 01:08:54.920
finally the real symbol is going to
be revealed. What was already revealed?

769
01:08:55.520 --> 01:08:59.000
Sorry, ready revealed? Okay you
know yeah, because Ray, I told

770
01:08:59.079 --> 01:09:01.720
you I didn't know anything about UFO
News. You were right. Yeah,

771
01:09:01.800 --> 01:09:06.840
Ray revealed that like a year or
two ago, but it's only been fairly

772
01:09:06.880 --> 01:09:12.159
recent that Ray wrote the story up
and revealed that story. I remember that

773
01:09:12.319 --> 01:09:16.439
because, yeah, I thought that
was fascinating. Yeah, I should know

774
01:09:16.520 --> 01:09:23.319
that because I do speak with Ray, Yeah, you do. Yeah,

775
01:09:23.600 --> 01:09:27.079
I talked to him and or he
mentioned in an email to me or something

776
01:09:27.119 --> 01:09:30.720
that Martin came to my house.
You got to come to my house,

777
01:09:30.840 --> 01:09:34.760
and I wish I could go to
lots of people's houses, but he was

778
01:09:34.880 --> 01:09:41.439
just so enamored with you. Oh
well, I'll tell you. He is

779
01:09:41.479 --> 01:09:45.399
an amazing guy, you know,
and I think he did a wonderful job

780
01:09:45.600 --> 01:09:50.039
on the book. It's I believe
there's stole some copies out there of his

781
01:09:50.079 --> 01:09:57.520
book. It's called Flying Saucers in
the Pentagon Pantry, The Lonnies and moor

782
01:09:57.560 --> 01:10:00.079
Case or something like that. I'll
bring it up. But that is definitely

783
01:10:00.079 --> 01:10:05.279
the best book, even Lonnie Samara
told his daughter that was the only real

784
01:10:05.479 --> 01:10:13.119
good story written about it from Ray
Stanford. Yep, yep, Yeah,

785
01:10:13.199 --> 01:10:17.199
raise the guy, and we'll be
plugging him a lot next week because Ben

786
01:10:17.239 --> 01:10:20.079
and Tony have gotten most of their
stuff. You know, they work with

787
01:10:20.199 --> 01:10:28.000
Ray. They kind of raise investigation
team. So yeah, so we'll talk

788
01:10:28.039 --> 01:10:30.960
about that. So is there anything
else you wanted to talk about, my

789
01:10:30.039 --> 01:10:36.760
friend? I think I'm pretty much
expended here. I can't think of anything

790
01:10:36.760 --> 01:10:42.840
else. I think I definitely want
people to check out the video that you

791
01:10:42.920 --> 01:10:47.399
have posted on the nineteen fifty two
UFO flap in Washington, DC. Very

792
01:10:47.479 --> 01:10:51.199
very well done, I got to
tell you, very nicely done, and

793
01:10:53.199 --> 01:10:57.960
you will definitely learn something. I
do believe. I think you will,

794
01:10:58.039 --> 01:11:00.079
and I, you know, think
this is a good piece to send to

795
01:11:00.239 --> 01:11:05.239
your skeptical friends. That's what we're
trying to do, because if you send

796
01:11:05.239 --> 01:11:14.560
this to a skeptic, I think
it just it very firmly demonstrates that this

797
01:11:14.640 --> 01:11:18.960
subject was not a joke to the
Air Force and that there, you know,

798
01:11:19.000 --> 01:11:24.319
there, there's something substantial here.
So and that's what I think we

799
01:11:24.319 --> 01:11:30.319
we wanted. What I'm trying to
do is to demonstrate even to mainstream media.

800
01:11:30.359 --> 01:11:32.840
In fact, I'm working on in
the next couple of days posting this

801
01:11:33.000 --> 01:11:39.800
story to Huffington Post that you know
this, Uh, there's a lot of

802
01:11:40.079 --> 01:11:45.880
pieces here that if you follow the
government story, uh that the official record,

803
01:11:45.439 --> 01:11:51.600
you see that there is some fascinating, mysterious stuff that went on that

804
01:11:51.760 --> 01:11:58.680
baffled even serious Air Force investigators.
M M. Yeah, it's a great

805
01:11:58.680 --> 01:12:02.479
one. Thank you, Thank you
very much. So if you want to

806
01:12:02.479 --> 01:12:09.520
stick around while I close it out, yeah, sure, So thank you

807
01:12:09.560 --> 01:12:14.039
for joining us again for another great
show. Wow. This Martin Willis guy

808
01:12:14.199 --> 01:12:18.079
is awesome. So he'll be back
next week hopefully, assuming he doesn't hurt

809
01:12:18.159 --> 01:12:25.479
himself or some or get sick or
something or have to go to the beach.

810
01:12:26.079 --> 01:12:28.880
But Martin is dedicated, so even
if he goes to the beach,

811
01:12:28.920 --> 01:12:33.159
he's still going to do an interview. So that's really cool, more than

812
01:12:33.239 --> 01:12:36.960
I can say for myself. Although
I was getting kind of wound up in

813
01:12:38.000 --> 01:12:41.720
stressed, so the beach did me
very good. I wish I was still

814
01:12:41.880 --> 01:12:46.359
there. In fact, so go
to Open Minds at TV to get all

815
01:12:46.399 --> 01:12:51.319
those news stories at Martin and I
talked about those two video stories especially,

816
01:12:51.439 --> 01:12:58.039
Go check those out the Tennessee one
that was actually posted September fourteenth, about

817
01:12:58.079 --> 01:13:02.520
a week ago, and then the
New York Cylinder UFO video which was just

818
01:13:02.600 --> 01:13:06.079
posted today. And let us know
what you think, you know, put

819
01:13:06.119 --> 01:13:10.479
in the comments, Oh Man Martin, you're right, this is cool,

820
01:13:10.720 --> 01:13:14.000
or a hundre, You're an idiot, this is stupid. You know whatever

821
01:13:14.079 --> 01:13:16.520
you want. I know you're gonna
post that, but no, people are

822
01:13:16.560 --> 01:13:20.159
pretty nice. But yeah, go
check it out and let us know what

823
01:13:20.199 --> 01:13:24.680
you think. They're really interesting videos, I think, and then please do.

824
01:13:25.239 --> 01:13:30.119
I would just be so overjoyed if
you would enjoy. I am so

825
01:13:30.199 --> 01:13:34.720
grateful that you all come and listen
to the show and enjoy the fruits of

826
01:13:34.760 --> 01:13:40.359
our efforts that way. So go
watch this YouTube video. It's called the

827
01:13:40.439 --> 01:13:45.800
Beginning UFO Encounters over Washington, DC. And I call it the beginning because

828
01:13:45.800 --> 01:13:49.840
it's the beginning of the Air Force
investigation, and it's the beginning of our

829
01:13:49.920 --> 01:13:58.279
investigation into who's investigating what and sharing
with people more than they know about the

830
01:13:58.399 --> 01:14:03.239
official record of the UFO investigations that
have gone on. So check that out.

831
01:14:04.039 --> 01:14:09.880
It's on our YouTube and it's on
our front page at Open Minds dot

832
01:14:09.880 --> 01:14:15.680
TV also the UFO Congress. So
I listed a bunch more speakers at the

833
01:14:15.800 --> 01:14:17.720
UFO Congress. In fact, let's
see if I could go over there real

834
01:14:17.760 --> 01:14:23.600
quick and tell you so. I
haven't even listed Erling Strand from Norway yet,

835
01:14:23.680 --> 01:14:29.119
so that's brand new information exclusive for
you all. But oh, this

836
01:14:29.319 --> 01:14:33.720
is cool, This is really cool, Martin. So I've got John Alexander

837
01:14:34.880 --> 01:14:38.399
speaking, and some people are like, oh, he spoke before. He's

838
01:14:38.439 --> 01:14:44.960
a debunker, he's a government stooge
man, but he's at he was with

839
01:14:45.119 --> 01:14:49.720
Army intelligence, and he's talking about
the com UFO encounters more complex than we

840
01:14:49.800 --> 01:14:56.640
can imagine. And he sounds like
a new age woo woo guy when you

841
01:14:56.800 --> 01:15:01.279
read his talk. He talks about
this. His presentation includes my first hand

842
01:15:01.399 --> 01:15:09.680
experience with a case so convoluted it
defies both explanation and common sense. Nonetheless,

843
01:15:09.720 --> 01:15:14.399
it is real and includes not only
my observation of a UFO, but

844
01:15:14.600 --> 01:15:21.359
spontaneous healing, plus sightings, recordings
of orbs, possible spiritual beings, and

845
01:15:21.560 --> 01:15:30.039
other phenomena. He's a disinformation agent. Isn't that crazy? That is really

846
01:15:30.079 --> 01:15:32.640
something? Wow? Yeah, So
John Alexander, who people think is you

847
01:15:32.680 --> 01:15:36.479
know, he's he's into UFOs.
Obviously he wouldn't be out talking about this

848
01:15:36.560 --> 01:15:41.640
stuff. So he's hard edged.
Yeah, he's hard edged, and he's

849
01:15:41.920 --> 01:15:45.479
a colonel. If people know colonels, colonels are like that, they're black

850
01:15:45.520 --> 01:15:47.720
and white. This is this,
and this is that, you know.

851
01:15:49.039 --> 01:15:54.199
But he's gonna be talking about this
wild case that he's never talked about before

852
01:15:55.199 --> 01:16:00.840
that included some very respectable people.
So oh, he's going to be talking

853
01:16:00.840 --> 01:16:04.199
about this amazing UFO encounter. I'm
really excited about it. David Marler is

854
01:16:04.239 --> 01:16:06.560
going to be speaking. He's going
to be speaking. We don't have it

855
01:16:06.640 --> 01:16:12.600
yet, so this is exclusive for
you all too. Brand new information about

856
01:16:12.800 --> 01:16:21.399
the nineteen forty two case over La
so the Battle of La Battle of La.

857
01:16:21.479 --> 01:16:27.920
Yes, he's got new photographs and
information of that. So another really

858
01:16:28.079 --> 01:16:34.279
fascinating camp case. Richard Dolan has
put together a new talk just for the

859
01:16:34.399 --> 01:16:40.760
UFO Congress. How cool is that? Wow? So he'll be speaking Noe

860
01:16:40.760 --> 01:16:45.119
Torres, will be speaking about the
real cowboys and aliens UFOs in the Old

861
01:16:45.159 --> 01:16:47.760
West. So this is afropocus.
We're in Phoenix. So he talks about

862
01:16:47.800 --> 01:16:53.960
these cases like from the eighteen hundreds, UFO cases with Cowboys C and UFOs.

863
01:16:54.239 --> 01:16:57.560
And then you all are familiar with
Paul stone Hill, so he'll be

864
01:16:57.600 --> 01:17:01.520
at the conference talking about Russia and
Eurasian stuff like that. We have a

865
01:17:01.520 --> 01:17:04.840
few more to list. We have
some surprises, of course as usual.

866
01:17:05.600 --> 01:17:10.399
But yeah, so now we have
most of our speakers listed for the Congress,

867
01:17:10.439 --> 01:17:14.159
a lot of them, So go
check that out at Ufocongress dot com.

868
01:17:14.199 --> 01:17:16.880
And of course, if you're planning
to come, be sure to reserve

869
01:17:16.960 --> 01:17:21.920
a room asap because any moment now
the rooms will probably be sold out.

870
01:17:23.479 --> 01:17:26.920
You'll be able to get on a
waiting list. But you know, and

871
01:17:26.960 --> 01:17:30.159
the other hotels really are nearby.
They're very easy to get to. The

872
01:17:30.239 --> 01:17:33.199
shuttle shuttle you back and forth.
But it's fun to stay in the host

873
01:17:33.239 --> 01:17:39.279
hotels. So oh, chet that
out. Wonderful place. Do you have

874
01:17:39.319 --> 01:17:42.640
a room? Very very relaxing.
Oh yeah, you bet, I do

875
01:17:42.880 --> 01:17:47.119
good. So UFO Congress dot com. So really exciting stuff, and of

876
01:17:47.119 --> 01:17:51.479
course we're gonna have a lot of
other great people. I'm very excited about

877
01:17:51.479 --> 01:17:56.640
it. In fact, two of
our speakers, Stanton Friedman and Kathleen Martin,

878
01:17:57.479 --> 01:18:00.600
just put out a new book and
will be available. It's called Fact

879
01:18:00.680 --> 01:18:05.399
Fiction and Flying Saucers. So they've
got a brand new book out and that

880
01:18:05.439 --> 01:18:11.479
will be available actually on Amazon,
I think maybe even today, but they'll

881
01:18:11.479 --> 01:18:15.600
be at the conference to sign and
sell those books as well. So lots

882
01:18:15.600 --> 01:18:23.199
of exciting stuff. Martin right,
yes, and I can't wait. Yeah,

883
01:18:23.279 --> 01:18:25.920
it's gonna be cool. And of
course you're going to be able to

884
01:18:25.960 --> 01:18:31.119
meet the one and only Martin Willis
at the conference. Also, don't forget

885
01:18:31.119 --> 01:18:34.640
to check out the Open Minds Video
portal, which you can find at open

886
01:18:34.640 --> 01:18:40.079
Minds TV, where we have the
lectures from the past conferences. We have

887
01:18:40.239 --> 01:18:43.000
all from twenty sixteen, but we
don't have all of them up, but

888
01:18:43.039 --> 01:18:46.119
we're posting more on a regular basis
and it's just a few dollars to have

889
01:18:46.199 --> 01:18:53.439
access to all of these super cool
video lectures, so really cool stuff.

890
01:18:53.840 --> 01:18:58.840
I want to say thank you to. Well, speaking of the Hanks,

891
01:18:58.880 --> 01:19:02.399
Micah Hanks, we have a story
from Micah Hanks that he wrote for the

892
01:19:02.439 --> 01:19:06.800
Paranormal Podcast, actually for Jim Harold, and Jim Harold was nice enough to

893
01:19:06.880 --> 01:19:14.600
let me post part of that story
on our website about satellites and mysterious satellites

894
01:19:14.680 --> 01:19:18.520
mysterious stuff in space. So Micah
Hank's really cool guy. He does a

895
01:19:18.560 --> 01:19:23.520
great Allian Report, great writer.
Love Micah. He's going to be at

896
01:19:23.560 --> 01:19:26.520
our conference too, He's going to
have a table. I forgot about that,

897
01:19:26.640 --> 01:19:29.960
so that's cool. But the reason
I thought of Micah you all probably

898
01:19:30.000 --> 01:19:33.560
know because I end with this.
Every show is at his brother, Caleb.

899
01:19:33.640 --> 01:19:39.239
They're both musicians, extremely talented musicians. And I want to thank Caleb

900
01:19:39.279 --> 01:19:44.359
Hanks for our great open and close
music. Often people ask where can I

901
01:19:44.439 --> 01:19:47.319
find his music? If you go
to the Open Minds radio page, you

902
01:19:47.359 --> 01:19:53.399
will see a link to his site
where he lets you download a lot of

903
01:19:53.439 --> 01:19:57.079
his original music for free. And
I love it. I think it's really

904
01:19:57.119 --> 01:20:00.840
really good. I think it's great
to get in while before. These guys

905
01:20:00.840 --> 01:20:03.840
are super famous, so we get
to know them. So thank you to

906
01:20:03.920 --> 01:20:10.159
Caleb Hanks. And finally, thank
you to you. Not you Martin,

907
01:20:10.640 --> 01:20:14.960
I know the listener. Yeah,
I already thanked you. I didn't I

908
01:20:15.000 --> 01:20:17.279
did I forget to thank you?
No, I remember you thanked me.

909
01:20:17.399 --> 01:20:23.800
Oh good, A couple of episodes
back couple. Well, thank you Martin,

910
01:20:24.119 --> 01:20:28.399
and yes, thank you to the
listeners. Thank you so much.

911
01:20:28.439 --> 01:20:32.159
Thank you to those of you who
said hi at the move On Symposium.

912
01:20:32.520 --> 01:20:36.079
Thank you to all of those that
I met on the beach that said hi

913
01:20:36.199 --> 01:20:43.560
there just kidding, but you know, although that makes me think, and

914
01:20:43.640 --> 01:20:45.760
I don't know if I should say
this. We'll see if I'll get some

915
01:20:45.800 --> 01:20:48.680
bad feedback. But I'm just thinking
of the beach and maybe we need to

916
01:20:48.680 --> 01:20:54.920
make some open mind swimwear. Of
course, first week came to mind,

917
01:20:55.039 --> 01:20:59.479
honestly, I got to be honest, was open mind bikinis, but also

918
01:20:59.720 --> 01:21:03.560
swim trunks would be cool too,
so and you know, one pieces for

919
01:21:03.680 --> 01:21:08.199
women if if they like that,
But that would be really cool, some

920
01:21:08.319 --> 01:21:15.840
open minded beach where huh I can
see that now, I'm sure you can.

921
01:21:15.399 --> 01:21:19.840
Yeah. I'm not even gonna say
anything. I'll get myself, I

922
01:21:20.119 --> 01:21:27.079
know, no, just like vague
shells are out. So but thank you

923
01:21:27.119 --> 01:21:30.840
all so much for listening. Say
it with me? Do you know what?

924
01:21:30.439 --> 01:21:38.600
You know what my last words are, right Martin? Not yet audios,

925
01:21:38.960 --> 01:21:45.680
jos audios. So let's say it
with me. Three two one audio

926
01:21:46.000 --> 01:22:45.279
smooth jot motion