WEBVTT 1 00:00:00.160 --> 00:00:11.119 This is pod popular podcast for the people, The Great Love Debate. It's 2 00:00:11.119 --> 00:00:17.440 the Great Love Debate, the Great Love Debate. It's a Great Love Debate. 3 00:00:17.879 --> 00:00:22.079 Hi again, Everyone's Brian Howie. Welcome to The Great Love Debate, 4 00:00:22.120 --> 00:00:27.800 the world's number one dating and relationship podcast since twenty and fifteen. I got 5 00:00:27.839 --> 00:00:31.760 asked a question about an episode that I did a while ago, maybe a 6 00:00:31.839 --> 00:00:34.799 year, year and a half ago. It's one that I did when I 7 00:00:34.920 --> 00:00:39.479 stopped off in San Francisco, and I wanted to revisit that episode. It's 8 00:00:39.479 --> 00:00:42.119 not that I'm purely doing it as a rerun, but I thought it was 9 00:00:42.159 --> 00:00:47.719 an important question because I think it's the single best piece of advice that we 10 00:00:47.759 --> 00:00:52.399 can give the fellows around here, and we have heard it from so many 11 00:00:52.600 --> 00:00:57.399 of the women. So I want to revisit the episode for you guys because 12 00:00:57.439 --> 00:01:00.799 I think it matters, and I think it's the episode that got us more 13 00:01:02.039 --> 00:01:04.799 viral buzz than any episode we've done in a long long time, so it 14 00:01:04.920 --> 00:01:10.000 must be important. So I wanted you guys have a second crack to listen 15 00:01:10.000 --> 00:01:11.120 to it if you listened to before. If you have not, I think 16 00:01:11.120 --> 00:01:17.200 it's worth diving into again. I took another listen to it. I think 17 00:01:17.200 --> 00:01:19.200 I learned from my own episode about this, and I think it's something that 18 00:01:19.239 --> 00:01:23.519 I forget sometimes. I think it's really really important, and I think it 19 00:01:23.519 --> 00:01:26.680 would be whove me and a lot of other guys around here to listen to 20 00:01:26.719 --> 00:01:32.120 this every single day or week because it is. It matters, and I 21 00:01:32.159 --> 00:01:34.519 think we forget this, and I think it is the beginning of everything that 22 00:01:34.560 --> 00:01:38.719 we can learn to do better. So I want to dive into it one 23 00:01:38.719 --> 00:01:41.040 more time. I want you to listen. I want you to shoot me 24 00:01:41.079 --> 00:01:44.840 an email your thoughts on it to see if it is resonated all, if 25 00:01:44.879 --> 00:01:47.680 you agreed with it at all, or any other thoughts on it. Great 26 00:01:47.680 --> 00:01:52.079 lovedebate at gmail dot com. But here we go once again. This is 27 00:01:52.120 --> 00:01:59.280 the thing that matters. Fellas I am here in San Francisco, California. 28 00:02:00.599 --> 00:02:04.079 San Francisco, it's sort of like a I think San Francisco's like a Tale 29 00:02:04.079 --> 00:02:07.240 of three cities. So on one hand, it is, and as I 30 00:02:07.280 --> 00:02:12.159 look at my window here, Jesus, it is, by any reasonable standard, 31 00:02:13.280 --> 00:02:15.719 the most beautiful city in America and probably one of the most beautiful cities 32 00:02:15.719 --> 00:02:19.919 in the world. If somebody came here from I don't know, Sydney, 33 00:02:20.719 --> 00:02:23.080 which is one of the most beautiful cities in the world, and they came 34 00:02:23.080 --> 00:02:25.319 to America and they saw San Francisco. San Francisco is not quite Sydney, 35 00:02:25.439 --> 00:02:29.800 but people from Sydney would be like, huh, San Francisco's pretty fucking nice. 36 00:02:29.919 --> 00:02:36.960 And it is. From a distance, it's stunning. The landscape, 37 00:02:37.199 --> 00:02:40.599 the water, the hills, the architecture, it really really is. On 38 00:02:40.639 --> 00:02:44.840 the other hand, though, when you get into the the deep heart of 39 00:02:44.879 --> 00:02:47.599 it and go into the city, it's you know, parts of it are 40 00:02:47.639 --> 00:02:53.759 kind of disgusting. Filthy, crime, homeless, drugs, and too much 41 00:02:53.879 --> 00:02:57.680 of this otherwise amazing city has gone too far in the wrong direction. But 42 00:02:57.759 --> 00:03:01.120 we aren't here to give you a civics lesson or a political one. The 43 00:03:01.159 --> 00:03:05.439 third angle about this place, though, is that, for the second time 44 00:03:06.000 --> 00:03:09.080 in the nine year history of the Great Love Debate, we have named San 45 00:03:09.120 --> 00:03:15.400 Francisco as America's worst city to find love. So there's that. Put that 46 00:03:15.439 --> 00:03:19.599 on a sign and hang it from the Golden gate Bridge. But I did 47 00:03:19.680 --> 00:03:23.800 not come to San Francisco looking for love, nor to help the inhabitants find 48 00:03:23.840 --> 00:03:25.479 it. I have not done a live show here in about seven years, 49 00:03:27.039 --> 00:03:30.039 and I don't plan on it. This is not that fun. I want 50 00:03:30.080 --> 00:03:35.280 to talk about something more important than that, which should help at least the 51 00:03:35.400 --> 00:03:40.319 Fellas get to a place of love, even if this city is not that 52 00:03:40.479 --> 00:03:46.919 place. So I get asked a bunch what have I learned the most in 53 00:03:47.039 --> 00:03:53.039 doing this show and doing our tour for close to a decade, now close 54 00:03:53.080 --> 00:03:59.520 to a decade Jesus? And my answer usually comes down to two things. 55 00:03:59.560 --> 00:04:05.520 And I never quite realized how those two things are connected until about five days 56 00:04:05.560 --> 00:04:13.199 ago, a decade of doing this and I'm still realizing stuff and helpful stuff 57 00:04:13.240 --> 00:04:16.360 and hopeful stuff and interesting stuff and important stuff. I think, because what 58 00:04:16.480 --> 00:04:24.800 gets in the way of us finding what we want is usually just that us. 59 00:04:25.839 --> 00:04:31.279 So the first thing that I have mentioned many times that I have learned 60 00:04:31.360 --> 00:04:41.560 is that I had no idea how broken and angry and sad and lost so 61 00:04:41.680 --> 00:04:46.839 many men were or are so when I started doing this show, I thought 62 00:04:46.920 --> 00:04:53.600 dating relationships were fun and easy, and who wouldn't like dating and who wouldn't 63 00:04:53.639 --> 00:04:56.839 love girls? And girls, usually, at least back when we started the 64 00:04:56.839 --> 00:05:00.879 show, you can still call them girls. The more more or less like 65 00:05:00.040 --> 00:05:04.000 me. All good, right, good. I don't understand this dating stuff, 66 00:05:06.240 --> 00:05:12.399 and that's probably because most of my entire dating and relationship existence up until 67 00:05:12.720 --> 00:05:15.759 I don't know, twenty fifteen, I guess I sort of did it at 68 00:05:15.800 --> 00:05:24.519 like this five thousand foot overview level. I stayed just above that ikey emotional 69 00:05:24.560 --> 00:05:27.040 fray. I never really got into the muck of it all. Just like 70 00:05:27.079 --> 00:05:30.240 San Francisco, I dated like the postcard. I looked at the very best 71 00:05:30.319 --> 00:05:34.319 parts and stayed away from the tough, gritty parts. So I mean, 72 00:05:34.319 --> 00:05:39.759 if you ever come here and you visit Alcatraz and you go over there, 73 00:05:39.800 --> 00:05:42.000 you're like, oh my god, what a beautiful island. Look at the 74 00:05:42.040 --> 00:05:45.680 view, it might not be such a bad place to live because you're mentally 75 00:05:45.720 --> 00:05:48.480 ignoring or blocking the hard parts out of it that you're trapped there and doing 76 00:05:48.560 --> 00:05:51.720 time. That was me. That was the way I dated, at least 77 00:05:51.759 --> 00:05:55.680 emotionally. That's the way I handled all of it. And when I started 78 00:05:55.680 --> 00:06:00.720 doing this show and found so many men who were angry or sad or broken 79 00:06:00.959 --> 00:06:06.240 or damaged or lost, and at first I thought, what's wrong with these 80 00:06:06.240 --> 00:06:12.680 guys? Why aren't they enjoying the dating? Experience. But then, as 81 00:06:12.720 --> 00:06:17.199 I previously documented, after one hundred or sort of shows and a couple of 82 00:06:17.279 --> 00:06:25.800 years of therapy, I realized I am those guys. I just didn't want 83 00:06:25.839 --> 00:06:28.920 Sorry, I got distracted by San Francisco. I am those guys. I 84 00:06:29.000 --> 00:06:31.680 just didn't want to realize it. I didn't want to admit it, and 85 00:06:31.759 --> 00:06:38.120 I was equally broken. I guess I was emotionally unavailable and I was walled 86 00:06:38.160 --> 00:06:43.040 off from everything that wasn't fun or light or easy. I just kept it 87 00:06:43.639 --> 00:06:47.279 distant. And again, I get into this without it being any sort of 88 00:06:47.279 --> 00:06:50.399 expertise. I don't want anybody ever think that I or anybody else have any 89 00:06:50.399 --> 00:06:56.160 expertise on this stuff. Everything is just opinion and experience, which is based 90 00:06:56.439 --> 00:07:00.480 mostly on the opinions and experience that I've derived from thousands and thousand of you 91 00:07:00.519 --> 00:07:04.120 guys on the road or at one of our shows in the audience, or 92 00:07:04.160 --> 00:07:10.240 from doing this podcast. Your experience, generally speaking, has shaped my experience. 93 00:07:11.759 --> 00:07:16.000 But the second thing I learned is something where I think my experience will 94 00:07:16.040 --> 00:07:21.759 shape your experience that I think you can actually learn from me my relationship, 95 00:07:23.720 --> 00:07:31.040 my struggles, my weakness, my vulnerability, and I guess my failure. 96 00:07:31.600 --> 00:07:36.480 So now that I have your interest totally peaked and you want to get into 97 00:07:36.560 --> 00:07:40.120 all that, we're gonna get into all that. Not to step on a 98 00:07:40.160 --> 00:07:42.800 moment or be a tease here, but I take a quick break because San 99 00:07:42.800 --> 00:07:46.120 Francisco is a very expensive city and I have to pay for things around here, 100 00:07:46.759 --> 00:07:49.839 like this hotel. So break is coming a little bit earlier in the 101 00:07:49.879 --> 00:07:55.240 podcast that it normally does. But I'm going to ramble on uninterrupted after this, 102 00:07:55.360 --> 00:08:03.759 so we will be back in about sixty seconds right after this, and 103 00:08:03.800 --> 00:08:07.959 we are back. So we're talking about the second thing that I've learned from 104 00:08:09.000 --> 00:08:13.480 doing four hundred or so live shows in one hundred and thirty or so cities 105 00:08:13.480 --> 00:08:16.360 in a dozen or so countries, plus four hundred or so podcasts, and 106 00:08:16.360 --> 00:08:20.800 pretty soon the number of podcast episodes that I have done will pass the number 107 00:08:20.839 --> 00:08:24.160 of live shows. And the live shows had like a nineteen month had start, 108 00:08:24.519 --> 00:08:28.240 and I used to do like three or four or five a week, 109 00:08:28.160 --> 00:08:33.639 but I have slowed down, and slowing down. The good part of slowing 110 00:08:33.639 --> 00:08:39.919 down is that has given me the time to think and reflect and discover not 111 00:08:39.039 --> 00:08:41.200 just about you guys, but a little bit about myself, and what I 112 00:08:41.279 --> 00:08:48.600 discovered was that the thing that I failed to realize during so many relationships and 113 00:08:48.679 --> 00:08:54.720 over so many years, was that something that almost all men, we broken, 114 00:08:56.240 --> 00:09:01.120 angry, sad, distant, lost men, failed to realize. And 115 00:09:01.159 --> 00:09:07.320 that is why the communication breaks down. And it's not why or how you 116 00:09:07.440 --> 00:09:13.200 think. It's not that we don't have conversations, it's not that we don't 117 00:09:13.200 --> 00:09:22.320 say the words. It's really how we have them and how we receive them. 118 00:09:22.720 --> 00:09:24.440 So, guys, this is the most important thing I have learned. 119 00:09:26.120 --> 00:09:30.080 And ladies, if you tell more men this, it will, I assume 120 00:09:30.159 --> 00:09:33.919 help your cause tremendously. We got to share this information, so I mentioned 121 00:09:33.919 --> 00:09:37.399 it on the show before, but it mostly wasn't passing or in the context 122 00:09:37.480 --> 00:09:43.440 of me talk about something else. But thought it needed to have sort of 123 00:09:43.480 --> 00:09:48.039 as standalone spotlight and focus. So that's why I'm devoting all this to that. 124 00:09:48.399 --> 00:09:52.440 So, guys, when it comes to an argument, a disagreement, 125 00:09:52.559 --> 00:09:58.360 or even a simple discussion, a woman does not need to be right, 126 00:09:58.240 --> 00:10:05.480 but she does need to be heard heard capital hard, not always loudly, 127 00:10:07.320 --> 00:10:13.240 not always clearly, but at the very least heard. And that great love 128 00:10:13.279 --> 00:10:18.639 listeners is the heart of the matter and the crux of the communication disconnect. 129 00:10:20.600 --> 00:10:24.480 And I don't know why this is, but it is. And knowing this 130 00:10:24.080 --> 00:10:33.200 and working on this and adapting to this can change everything about everything. So 131 00:10:33.240 --> 00:10:39.080 what do I mean by heard? What I mean is not just sitting by 132 00:10:39.600 --> 00:10:43.000 while she is rambling on in its background noise and you're just trying to get 133 00:10:43.039 --> 00:10:50.240 through it or tuning out or half heartedly nodding or blankly staring while she speaks. 134 00:10:50.240 --> 00:10:54.720 It means what is she trying to say and why is she trying to 135 00:10:54.840 --> 00:11:01.440 say it? Or what is her response to what I say or did or 136 00:11:01.480 --> 00:11:09.159 asked and why was that her response? And there are about ten sort of 137 00:11:09.279 --> 00:11:13.639 subtenets to that premise she needs to be heard, yes, And I actually 138 00:11:13.639 --> 00:11:18.240 sat and I wrote them out because it's not just a like a single prong 139 00:11:18.399 --> 00:11:22.360 concept listen, and that's that. It's all fine, nice knee package. 140 00:11:22.519 --> 00:11:26.360 I heard you? All good. You have to study it and you have 141 00:11:26.399 --> 00:11:33.240 to study her and you have to dive into that what what is she saying 142 00:11:33.679 --> 00:11:37.519 or what is she trying to communicate to you? So first thing is it 143 00:11:37.559 --> 00:11:41.279 all starts with perspective. So clearly, if she is needing to be heard. 144 00:11:41.480 --> 00:11:46.840 She isn't seeing things as you do, because if she felt heard by 145 00:11:46.919 --> 00:11:50.000 you, you would already be on the same page and then you would move 146 00:11:50.039 --> 00:11:52.879 on to the next page and get somewhere. She's needing to be heard. 147 00:11:54.080 --> 00:11:56.480 She doesn't see it like you see it, because not everyone is going to 148 00:11:56.519 --> 00:12:01.919 see things as you do, not your colleagues, not your friends, and 149 00:12:01.039 --> 00:12:07.639 especially not the person you are with and hopefully love. Nor are they going 150 00:12:07.679 --> 00:12:11.960 to see them at the same speed or exact moment as you do. So 151 00:12:11.200 --> 00:12:18.240 light bulbs go off in different ways at different times in different lumens. Think 152 00:12:18.279 --> 00:12:22.159 about that when you're not seeing it as she does, and then when you 153 00:12:22.240 --> 00:12:26.120 do next. I think you always have to focus on the value of the 154 00:12:26.120 --> 00:12:33.120 bigger picture. Is tuning her out or shouting her down or having the last 155 00:12:33.120 --> 00:12:39.559 word is that really worth it? Because it could be something's totally minor and 156 00:12:39.600 --> 00:12:43.200 your need to have the last words suddenly mors into something much much bigger. 157 00:12:43.519 --> 00:12:46.360 And so maybe you got that last word, but that may actually be your 158 00:12:46.480 --> 00:12:50.480 last word with her, because she might have just clicked the light switch off 159 00:12:50.600 --> 00:12:54.960 on the two of you and not just for the night. So then you 160 00:12:56.000 --> 00:13:03.159 have to think about how your words or not caring about her words makes them 161 00:13:03.200 --> 00:13:09.000 feel and if whatever you're saying is worth them feeling that way, So maybe 162 00:13:09.039 --> 00:13:16.600 whatever she is saying is completely nonsensical or is completely beyond your frame of understanding, 163 00:13:18.000 --> 00:13:24.039 Oh well, mattered to her at least in the moment, at least 164 00:13:24.039 --> 00:13:28.240 when she was saying it, which means it absolutely needs to matter to you 165 00:13:28.639 --> 00:13:33.919 for a little more than a moment, because hopefully hearing her out is absolutely 166 00:13:33.919 --> 00:13:39.279 worth it to you as she is to you. You ever a girlfriend say 167 00:13:39.320 --> 00:13:45.799 I just need to talk or you need to let me finish, will you 168 00:13:45.879 --> 00:13:52.360 do? They do? She needs to talk and need to let her finish, 169 00:13:52.600 --> 00:13:56.360 so be it. It's a real thing. And then you have to 170 00:13:56.399 --> 00:14:01.759 think, what is the goal of saying your work words that they're so important 171 00:14:03.320 --> 00:14:09.519 that they shout her down or interrupt or dismiss what she is saying. What 172 00:14:09.559 --> 00:14:16.720 gets accomplished by you saying them? Is it satisfaction? Is it pride? 173 00:14:18.000 --> 00:14:20.840 Because generally doesn't get you anywhere, doesn't really help your cause, not with 174 00:14:20.919 --> 00:14:28.279 her and definitely not with a relationship. And so when you are hearing her 175 00:14:28.960 --> 00:14:33.960 because she wants to be heard, at the very least you are hearing her 176 00:14:33.039 --> 00:14:39.679 and beyond that. If you start there, she can feel loved and valued 177 00:14:39.120 --> 00:14:48.799 and appreciated at not necessarily your best moment the two of you or on your 178 00:14:48.840 --> 00:14:52.279 best day, and that's going to get you and her in the relationship to 179 00:14:52.320 --> 00:14:58.919 a far better place. And if you aren't hearing her and making her feel 180 00:14:58.960 --> 00:15:05.720 loved, valued and appreciated and safe every day, how can you improve that? 181 00:15:07.159 --> 00:15:11.519 So what steps can you take to avoid these? I just need to 182 00:15:11.559 --> 00:15:15.159 be heard, Like, how can you cut it off before it gets to 183 00:15:15.200 --> 00:15:16.759 that, to stop it before he gets to that place, to not ignore 184 00:15:16.799 --> 00:15:22.519 her or downplay her in whatever her situation is, even if that situation is 185 00:15:22.559 --> 00:15:28.559 so beyond comprehension you just don't understand what she's thinking or why she's thinking it. 186 00:15:28.840 --> 00:15:35.039 Oh, well, she's the girl. They're better than us, she's 187 00:15:35.159 --> 00:15:39.639 better than you. They just are their motherboards and we are light switches, 188 00:15:39.120 --> 00:15:45.799 guys. So on your most complicated day, you are probably not dealing with 189 00:15:46.039 --> 00:15:50.919 a fraction of the thoughts and feelings and emotions that she is, and you 190 00:15:50.960 --> 00:15:56.759 have to accept that and you have to be there for her. So then 191 00:15:56.799 --> 00:16:03.480 you ask yourself the question, what can I do differently to support her differently 192 00:16:03.200 --> 00:16:07.799 and better. And what questions can I ask of her on this moment, 193 00:16:08.039 --> 00:16:12.360 not right now, but when she calms down to help you understand the process. 194 00:16:14.279 --> 00:16:19.720 What is her thinking? And maybe you'll never understand, but you can 195 00:16:19.799 --> 00:16:26.360 understand one thing that her thinking and her process is just a whole lot different 196 00:16:26.600 --> 00:16:33.120 than yours. Good that's a good thing. Doesn't have to make sense to 197 00:16:33.159 --> 00:16:37.799 you. It has to make sense to her and that's good enough. And 198 00:16:37.879 --> 00:16:41.559 it might not make sense to her, but she'll get through that in her 199 00:16:41.600 --> 00:16:44.840 own time. This is about you and your reaction to her while she gets 200 00:16:44.840 --> 00:16:48.759 through it. So mostly it is what are the goals and what is the 201 00:16:48.799 --> 00:16:56.559 hopeful outcome of the situation or its conversation? And is making somebody feel bad 202 00:16:56.840 --> 00:17:04.559 intentionally or unintentionally just to quote unquote when or feel like you're right? Is 203 00:17:04.599 --> 00:17:10.799 it ever worth making somebody feel bad? And the answer is not. If 204 00:17:10.839 --> 00:17:14.920 you care about her, and not if you care about the two of you, 205 00:17:15.599 --> 00:17:23.359 she is worth it. So the argument, the disagreement, the conversation 206 00:17:23.480 --> 00:17:27.799 that you don't want to have it is worth it, so you have to 207 00:17:27.920 --> 00:17:33.799 have it. And if the conversation means you quiet down while she talks hear 208 00:17:33.920 --> 00:17:38.000 her, and I have definitely not always done this. I am probably the 209 00:17:38.079 --> 00:17:41.920 last person in the world to talk about as an example of this, but 210 00:17:41.960 --> 00:17:45.720 at least I realize that now, even if it took me way too long 211 00:17:45.720 --> 00:17:52.559 to realize that, I've definitely needed to do. This definitely matters. It's 212 00:17:52.599 --> 00:17:56.960 not about right, it's not about being rational. It's not about reason. 213 00:17:57.440 --> 00:18:03.200 You want rational in reason, don't date a woman. It is about being 214 00:18:03.240 --> 00:18:07.359 present for her when she needs to be heard and allowing that to happen. 215 00:18:07.519 --> 00:18:11.759 It's her fundamental right as your partner, and if you get that right, 216 00:18:14.240 --> 00:18:18.319 a whole lot more can go right for you and with the two of you 217 00:18:19.440 --> 00:18:26.319 together. So I hope that makes a little bit of sense. Hear me, 218 00:18:26.680 --> 00:18:29.279 and I think you will end up hearing her. So this is a 219 00:18:29.279 --> 00:18:30.759 little bit for the guys, but hopefully there's some women out there that be 220 00:18:30.759 --> 00:18:36.359 like, yes, we need to be heard. I don't know, shoot 221 00:18:36.400 --> 00:18:37.839 me an email, Great Love Debate at gmail dot com. If you've got 222 00:18:37.839 --> 00:18:44.119 thoughts on this, I'll hear you. I will listen to you next week. 223 00:18:44.559 --> 00:18:47.359 Finally, I know I've been teasing this for about a month now. 224 00:18:47.799 --> 00:18:52.839 The year end twenty twenty two Capper mail Bag, all of your thoughts, 225 00:18:52.200 --> 00:18:57.880 questions, issues, concerns, and situations wrapped up in one tiny Great Love 226 00:18:59.000 --> 00:19:03.519 mail Bag will be diving into all that. Please, as always, like, 227 00:19:03.759 --> 00:19:06.359 share, follow, and review this podcast. You reviews meet a lot 228 00:19:06.359 --> 00:19:10.440 in the podcasting ecosystem. Check out Great Lovedebate dot com. There will be 229 00:19:10.519 --> 00:19:14.680 at least one show going into our tenth season on sale very very soon, 230 00:19:14.759 --> 00:19:18.079 I will announce that. Check that out or follow us on our socials because 231 00:19:18.400 --> 00:19:22.480 as always at the Great Love Debate, we never stop making love. To 232 00:19:22.480 --> 00:19:33.680 see next time, the Great Love Debate. It's the Great Love Debate, 233 00:19:33.680 --> 00:19:37.640 the Great Love Debate. It's a Great Love Debate.