WEBVTT

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Hey, everybody, welcome to coming
out pods. It's been a minute.

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Hi, Hello, how have you
been pause for response. Great, it's

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good to be back. I'm doing
a queer root shout out today that I

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know was close to Nicole's heart.
Shout out to you if your queer root

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is Lisa Bonet. Lisa Bonett,
of course, first burst on the scene

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with The Cosby Show, then God
pretty much her own spin off. Yeah,

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this is we're talking. We're talking
mid eighties. Some of you are

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way too young to remember these things, but Lisa Bonet is someone who I

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say, she's Rachel Weissing, which
is my term when somebody is getting even

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more gorgeous with age. So yeah, no matter what age you are,

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I'm certain Lisa Bonet is on your
radar. And shout out to you if

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you're a little bit older and she
was perhaps a queer root. Y'all.

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I am here today with Tahishia Timmans. Hello, Hi, Hello, how

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are you? I am good?
We've already been chatting a little bit.

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It has been lovely to meet you. Tahishia works for herself and we are

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leaving that vague and she has a
whole bunch of like impressive titles and whatnot.

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But we we're not We're not gonna
name drop. We're not gonna humble

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brag our way through this. If
it comes up, it comes up.

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But she is I could already tell
a delightful human being. And I'm excited

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to learn more about you. Thank
you. I'm so embarrassed right now.

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I'm embarrassed every time I do these
intros. If it's any consolation, I've

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done like three hundred episodes, and
every time I start, I forget how

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to talk. So it's you're in
good company, Tayushia. How do you

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identify for the folks at home?
Yes, so I use she her pronouns,

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and I identify as queer. And
that's been a journey just to like

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get to the queer right the queue
because when I actually came out, uh,

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there wasn't really a queue that was
in use. Queer was a bad

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word. And yes, so I'm
on the queer. I'm I'm the queue.

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And it has to do with really
two things. I love all people,

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and I'm sexually attracted to all people. You know, men, women,

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non binary people, people. Uh, if you identify as a person,

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I'm probably attracted to you, but
then there's another flip to that.

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I also sometimes have no sexual attraction
to anyone or anything or like you know,

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I'm very asexual leaning many times.
So queer was the uh when when

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queer started being acceptable for use,
I was like, that is me because

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it's always in flux. I feel
like I'm always growing, changing and feeling

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certain ways I looked at well,
maybe I was CPO sexual, like maybe

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I'm attracted to like knowledge or romance
or now because I'm none of those things

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other than I don't know what happens
all of a sudden, I am just

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like attracted to people, and I
don't even have a type, though my

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family would probably say, like,
you have a type, but I really

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don't because I keep ward to things
like the visual, right and then the

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internal absolutely. So, do you
ever have the thing where you will meet

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someone initially and not feel like it's
like, oh, this person seems nice,

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but there's no there's no like physical
or romantic or sexual attraction. But

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then at some point it's like a
it's like a switch will flip based on

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like maybe you've known them a certain
length of time or something. This something

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that I that has happened to me
several times, and I've often wondered if

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I might be on the DEMI spectrum. Like I feel like if I were

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younger, I would maybe use that
label, but at this point, I'm

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like, I'm not in the market
for anymore labels, but I wonder if

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does that ring no? And so
that was why DEMI didn't really resonate with

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me, because it's either there and
like, so an ex partner of mine

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met them at a bar like and
was asexual, had no sexual attraction to

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anyone, and my best friend at
the time was like, is this a

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real thing for you? Because for
a while you were just throwing your ass

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everywhere right Like I was like I
would walk up to people and be like,

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I, we are going to do
it tonight, but not use that

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language. So when I when it
just kind of like and it had nothing

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to it wasn't lesbian bed death or
like anything like that. No, these

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things ebb and flow, yeah,
yeah, yeah, And it was kind

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of if you know, like in
being in the community, the community is

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often small, and so when you're
shifty, when you shift like that,

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people are just like your full of
nonsense. Sometimes because I would be like

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I'm just not attracted to anyone.
I'm so sorry that you're attracted to me,

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and maybe I'm not attracted to you
and I'm not faking it or anything

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like that. And so I had
run into I met this new person and

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I was like, holy wow,
like all of my all of my lady

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parts are tingling around you, like
what is up with me? And I

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said it to them. I was
like, I have not been attracted to

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anyone in like two years from a
sexual perspective, and like I just want

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to jump on you, and like
this is like so new. So yeah,

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and so we dated for a little
bit and uh yeah. So for

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me, queer really is this sort
of umbrella for how I feel sexual attraction.

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I relate to a lot of that, and I do think, for

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the record, there are some people
who are very sort of like even keel

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their whole lives with their not only
with their like libido, but with their

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who they tend to be attracted to. And then there are many people who

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that fluctuates and that can depend on
any number. I mean, you know,

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what's the we shed all of our
skin cells or whatever it is every

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seven hours. It's like yeah,
and like hormones changed through as you get

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older and stuff like that. So
I think it is very common for people

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to feel different levels of sexual attraction
or who they're sexually attracted to. And

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it's something that we don't talk about
that much, especially within the queer community,

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because that idea of something being a
phase is so demonized because a lot

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of us got told that, so
we're afraid to acknowledge when our own attractions

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change because we don't want to feed
into that myth. And it's just like

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it's a whole, it's a big
mess. But I love hearing I love

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you talking about that because I think
that that is probably true for a lot

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of us. I think that's natural. Yeah. I think also in today's

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world where everything is so rushed and
you're juggling so many things in your head,

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the reality is sex is another thing, right, and like they can

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be a complication and sometimes I wonder
if that piece turns off to allow space

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for other things. Oh my god, I really relate to that. Yeah,

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And again I know that's not everybody. Like I have friends who are

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very sexually forward people, so they
could be like diffusing a bomb and if

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someone walks behy in the background,
they'll still be like, hey, what's

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up. But like for me,
like if if my focus is on something

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else that the sexuals, like I'm
not like craving another person in my life,

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Like I'm not looking today at all
right now. And I know a

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lot of my friends like don't fully
get that. And I'm just like,

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I have so much other stuff that
is preoccupying my thoughts that it is not

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it's not part of the pyramid currently, Like I don't think that's permanent,

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but right now, it's just not
it's not there. It is Oh my

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gosh, that is so so not
acknowledged right Like that sounds like a little

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shame with that. There is a
little yeah, yeah, so much shame

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with that. And and for those
who have partners or people THEREWI who identify

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as asexual, there's all this questioning
of what do you mean? How can

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you wi or two just friends?
And I think there is a deeper relationship

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that forms when you have a love
that's a little bit stronger than a friendship

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with a partner who recognizes that asexuality
is a sexual orientation itself. Yes,

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yes, And I do think that
we push sex a lot as a way

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to like, I don't know how
to communicate well with you, so I'm

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gonna fuck you to show you that
I love you. But that's not love.

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So and if you don't have the
space for having a real, valid

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and respectful relationship, I think we
try to use sex as the tool,

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right. Like there's so many movies
where people get into trouble and they're like,

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you're mad at me, but look
how sexy I am. Don't you

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want to have like, don't you
want to get on me? And that's

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for heterosexual and like queer movies.
The sex is like the oh, well,

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you know that person is in the
community if they if they have sex

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with you, versus just like why
can't you just be flirty or have a

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like you know, that is the
proof, Like you know. I had

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a really great conversation about this with
a guest a couple months ago where we

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were talking of about again that kind
of like shame or guilt of like if

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you are and we both identify I
believe she identified as a lesbian. I

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identify as lesbian, And we talked
about that sort of where you feel like

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you have to be like I'm so
like, look, I'm like sexy,

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and like open and like all this
stuff. And even I did it when

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you and I were talking off Mike
shout out to an artist named Ivy J

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and her song Strawberry Lotion, But
I said you were like, it's a

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sexy song, and I heard myself
say, I was like, good,

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we need more sexy songs. We
have all these tender songs. We need

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set. Like even I'm giving that
narrative because I think with women we do

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get sort of that thing lesbian bad
death was mentioned, but like that thing

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where it's like, oh, it's
like so emotional, but like with gay

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men, it's like all sex and
like primal and animalistic. And right now

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we're in this period where I feel
like queer women are trying to be like

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we also of sex, and look
how sexy we are and how forward,

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and you feel kind of guilty if
you're not in that sort of in the

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mix with all of that. And
I did it myself, even though I

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try to push against that narrative,
so like, yeah, it's just God.

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And I get jealous because I don't
think heterosexual people don't worry about all

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this shit so much like be representative
of their people of Oh my goodness.

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Okay, So so we've laid a
good foundation. But let's we're gonna go

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way way back in time. So
where does everything start for you? What

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do you consider your coming out story? Yeah, oh my gosh. Uh

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So I kind of feel like I've
been coming out, Like I'm a chronic

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coming out person because when it comes
to like my identity, like facets of

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my identity, right, so,
like I feel like I've gotten so used

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to sharing intimate pieces of myself,
you know, I've been coming out about

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my sexual identity, my disability,
Like I'm actually disabled. I was in

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an accident and have some mobility issues
being autistic late diagnosis, coming out about

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that. I'm also Jewish. People
don't know that or realize that. So

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sometimes people will say stuff and I'll
say, well, actually my mom is

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Jewish or you know what are you? Well, my dad is black and

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my mom is the Eastern European white
identifying I guess visually. And so I

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also grew up poor. People don't
realize that you know all types of things.

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But yeah, when it comes to
my sexuality, I think I came

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out twice when I was younger,
and so to my friends, I was

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like thirteen or fourteen, and this
is like in the eighties. My parents

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are hippies. They are like free
love and so open. So I never

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didn't I never had an experience of
not knowing queer people in my life,

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Like we were surrounded by activists and
advocates and you know, people who were

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fighting for the rights of others.
So it didn't seem odd to me at

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thirteen or fourteen and be like,
you know what, I really I have

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this crush on this person and I
think I like them the way that you

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know. And it happened to be
a young girl, and so I came

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out to my friends and they were
just like whatever, so he should like

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I think it was just another thing. Well, because I was a weird

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kid too, Like I was the
kid who was like, you know,

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let me tell you all these facts
about you know, all these different like

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things that I was were special interests, yes, and then, but I

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didn't tell my mom, Like looking
back, I didn't tell my mom back

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then because one like at thirteen or
fourteen, I wasn't thinking sex, like

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I was just thinking I just like
I just want to be around you and

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I want to call you girlfriend,
like you know, we're calling each other

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like like heterosexual couples were doing.
And then when I was seventeen, I

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came out to my mom and my
mom had a reaction that I wasn't expecting

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and she was terrified. She was
terrified for me. She was frightened,

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she was upset, and it was
a completely different view of my mom than

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I had up to that point.
My mom was my light of like,

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this is how you have to be
in the world as someone advocating for people.

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My mom was like on the front
lines of AIDS, activism and homelessness

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in the eighties, so she was
always fighting for something. So when she

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said to me and her and I
have talked about this before, so I

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don't have an issue sharing this.
She said to me in that moment,

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why would you want or choose to
be gay bi sex? What are you

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lesbian when you're already black as a
woman. Yeah, And when I say,

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my heart felt crushed because two things
happened, I thought, Wow,

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she thinks actually being queer or being
gay is a bad thing, And this

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is not something I had seen because
my mom had gay friends. Her best

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friend was a lesbian, And I'm
thinking, Wow, she doesn't think they

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should actually be doing that. And
I also realized my mom didn't really think

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that it was a good thing to
be black or a woman in our world,

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like you can't change that people will
see you as black and that you

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present as a woman, and we
didn't say present back then. Sure,

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but she was terrified of like who
will harm you? And I had no

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compassion for her, like with that, And one thing I will say I

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wish I had done differently back then
was had a little bit compassion. But

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I was seventeen so recognized, oh
that's a bad yes, So I'll recognize

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that at seventeen, I probably wasn't
very forgiving. Those seventeen year olds today

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are super smart and they are super
aware of who they are internally, So

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at seventeen, back then, I
wasn't forgiving. And I was very angry

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at her. And you know,
she said to me, don't tell your

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dad because your dad will be so
upset and he'll be disappointed. And so

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I didn't tell my dad, and
then organically my dad just kind of knew

208
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because like my mom, you know, she it wasn't like she was like,

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you know, you can't be gay
here or anything that that it was

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just the disappointment that the and the
fear that she had. Yeah, yeah,

211
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and so and I. When I
finally had a conversation with my dad

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about it, he was like,
well, why would I care? And

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then he said something. He was
like, you know, who hasn't slept

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with someone who is the same as
then I have? And that was something

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I didn't know. And so my
dad like bolstered me up, like what's

216
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the deal, what's the big deal
here? Like people back then, he

217
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was saying stuff like, hey,
sometimes we love who we love him,

218
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We're attracted to who we are attracted
to, And it was like nothing for

219
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him. My mom was actually the
one who was more worried. But my

220
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dad also does not have a good
societal sense, so he was just like

221
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who cares like, but my dad
was always out there by kind of who

222
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cares about everything? So I love
both my parents. They're amazing. But

223
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my mom was probably more into the
social the society piece and influenced by oh

224
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oh yeah, it sounds like,
yeah, that fear that parents have comes

225
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out in a way that I don't
think they realize how damaging that is for

226
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us. Oh my gosh, I'm
personal. That feels and like, yes,

227
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it comes from a place of love
and concern, but it's still a

228
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rejection, like it's just like,
oh god, yeah, that's it's tough.

229
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Well and wildly enough. When my
own child came out to me at

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a young age, my first response
which I look and I had talked to

231
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my mom and I said, I
slapped my hand for this, I said,

232
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well, how do you know?
And then like reflecting after it came

233
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out my mouth, it was so
like automatic because I was really curious as

234
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someone who didn't really think, like, you know, I automatically went to

235
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sex right when they came out to
me, and I was like, well,

236
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you seem too young to be bank
good sex right, like instead of

237
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well, I would never ask a
heterosexual person, how do you know you're

238
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here? And so and it's not
even about sex if you really think about

239
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it, it's about attraction, and
so I like, really, you know,

240
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I it's like, oh my gosh, I am a queer person,

241
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like asking another person like what And
it was it was that was when I

242
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grew compassion for my mom. I
was like, this is how someone who

243
00:19:12.960 --> 00:19:21.599
could seem so awake and aware could
misstep. So this is the thing though,

244
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like and I've had this conversation with
so many guests who feel guilty.

245
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They'll be like, I grew up
in the most like liberal household, and

246
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I don't know why I was afraid
to come out, and when I finally

247
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did, my parents were like amazing
about it, and I don't know.

248
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And it's like, you can have
your own individual experience. Your family can

249
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be amazing. But we're not growing
up in biospheres like we are or biodomes.

250
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Rather, we are in society,
and we absorb, especially when we're

251
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younger, this messaging of like this
is wrong and be scared of this,

252
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and this is different, and this
is gonna make your life harder. And

253
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so it's like, yeah, there's
no amount of familial or like your inner

254
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circle acceptance that is going to block
out the general kind of global consensus that

255
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this is like different and something to
be concerned about. So yes, And

256
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you know, I look at the
different reactions for my mom and my dad,

257
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and sometimes I wonder if it is
also the burden of raising children that

258
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mothers tend to get saddled with.
So I'm sure, you know, I

259
00:20:34.880 --> 00:20:38.240
want to say it's the gentleman who
used to be on the Daily Show.

260
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He has a stand up and he
talks about how like dads, like dads

261
00:20:44.400 --> 00:20:48.480
will run away and preserve themselves,
but like moms like throw themselves on the

262
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fire. So because like you know, and he has a little skit about

263
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that, and it's really true.
Because I felt like, you feel so

264
00:20:56.680 --> 00:21:00.480
invested in I can understand why my
mom felt like she had a bigger steak.

265
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She was probably like I went through
like twenty seven hours of labor with

266
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you, Like, no one's getting
harm you my product I've put out there

267
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with so much attention and love.
So and my dad was just like,

268
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eh, you know you love who
you love. Good luck, You're you're

269
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an adult now, like why do
I care? So and my mom to

270
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this day is still like, how's
my baby? Like yeah, and my

271
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Dad's like she's not a baby.
So and I'm turning fifty one. So

272
00:21:36.839 --> 00:21:42.160
yeah, it's so sticky. The
parents stuff. Never oh god, let's

273
00:21:42.160 --> 00:21:47.559
not get into parents stuff that could
be its own up. Yeah, she

274
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said, as she was currently dealing
with parents stuff in her own life.

275
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So now in terms of so you
come out to your friends at like thirteen

276
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and they're like very but for you, it sounds like first awareness crushes were

277
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same sex, but were you also
then having quote unquote more mainstream crushes on

278
00:22:12.640 --> 00:22:19.000
God? Like, I'm always curious
for folks who have attraction to multiple people

279
00:22:19.759 --> 00:22:26.640
how that sort of maps out,
because if you're just if if you're you're

280
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a little gay kid and you're like
freaking out, but you kind of like

281
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know what's You're like, oh no, uh oh. But if you're having

282
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attraction to multiple people, what do
you what do you do with that?

283
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You know what I mean, like, do you I don't know if I'm

284
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making sense, No, you are. And so I am probably not a

285
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great example of this because I do
feel like my attractions are pretty equal.

286
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So I had I had a boyfriend
in high school. I also had a

287
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fake girlfriend in high school because back
then, so you figure, it's like

288
00:23:06.240 --> 00:23:10.079
nineteen ninety she was my best friend, and I also used to let people

289
00:23:10.079 --> 00:23:11.960
believe she was my girlfriend when they
would be like, oh, you're a

290
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lesbian and you're always hanging around with
this person, and I wouldn't deny it

291
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and she and she came up to
me actually at one point in high school

292
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because I was a year ahead of
her, and she said, can you

293
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stop like like not denying that we're
a couple. Can you like just say

294
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we're best friends, like because you
know, I love you and we've and

295
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like, you know, there was
not a sexual attraction there. I'm still

296
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really good friends with her. And
I realized the harm I was doing because

297
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I was so okay with it and
so supported that, whereas like I it

298
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wasn't that I you know, I
wasn't outing her or anything. I just

299
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was just like, you know,
oh yeah, yes, we are close,

300
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and I just didn't deny it or
dating. She's like, you're leaving,

301
00:24:02.079 --> 00:24:07.480
sir? Did I have to stay
here and deal with homophobia and all

302
00:24:07.519 --> 00:24:14.839
of this? And I just sort
of had easy ignorance to it, And

303
00:24:14.920 --> 00:24:21.319
so it was pretty much like an
equal sort of attraction. I will say

304
00:24:21.480 --> 00:24:26.119
from an emotional connection piece, I
did once, or at first, I

305
00:24:26.240 --> 00:24:33.680
used to lean into did I have
stronger emotional connections with women or women identifying

306
00:24:33.759 --> 00:24:37.640
folk? And I thought that was
true, But it's not necessarily true.

307
00:24:37.720 --> 00:24:44.359
As I've gotten older, I've seen
that some of the stereotypes out there are

308
00:24:44.759 --> 00:24:48.920
that men are not as emotional,
that men are not caregivers, and they

309
00:24:49.160 --> 00:24:53.680
are and they can be. And
it has to do with socialization and will

310
00:24:53.720 --> 00:25:00.480
you allow them to have that space
even like when I said Dad's Russian,

311
00:25:00.519 --> 00:25:03.039
I'm sure if the house was on
fire, my dad would rush in.

312
00:25:03.279 --> 00:25:08.279
But you know, I think it's
some of that piece. And so if

313
00:25:08.319 --> 00:25:14.480
I were to say I was like
demisexual or sapio sexual, like in any

314
00:25:14.519 --> 00:25:18.839
of those areas, it would be
I do like people that have the access

315
00:25:18.920 --> 00:25:26.119
to their emotion because when I've been
attracted to actually not when i've but the

316
00:25:26.160 --> 00:25:33.039
people i'm attracted to tend to be
you know, maybe a little like I'm

317
00:25:33.079 --> 00:25:37.680
going to access my emotions and I
meditate or like, you know, I'm

318
00:25:37.720 --> 00:25:41.599
into the I know about diversity in
equity and inclusion, and I don't have

319
00:25:41.680 --> 00:25:47.920
to teach them anything. Yeah.
Yeah, that said, I do have

320
00:25:47.960 --> 00:25:53.240
an ex who is a raging Republican. Wow the time two of them,

321
00:25:53.480 --> 00:25:57.920
so, oh my goodness, at
the time that did y'all were dating or

322
00:25:59.599 --> 00:26:03.680
yeah, So I'm thinking I have
an ex husband who's a Republican, and

323
00:26:04.039 --> 00:26:12.200
I have a ex girlfriend who is
Republican and also in the and also a

324
00:26:12.240 --> 00:26:18.519
police officer. So yes, So
which is interesting because like, how did

325
00:26:18.559 --> 00:26:22.880
I compartmentalize all of those pieces and
that's what I was wondering if at the

326
00:26:22.960 --> 00:26:27.000
time. Yeah, no, I
mean, wow, that's so interesting.

327
00:26:27.319 --> 00:26:32.599
That's really interesting. Oh my god, I feel like I want to know

328
00:26:32.640 --> 00:26:34.519
more about that. But we'll see
if we'll see it becomes up organically,

329
00:26:34.559 --> 00:26:38.680
because I don't want to jump ahead. But so I think for a lot

330
00:26:38.720 --> 00:26:45.240
of people who are queer or bisexual, tand sexual, they kind of naturally

331
00:26:47.200 --> 00:26:52.839
in most cases will be dating the
opposite sex first because that is easier or

332
00:26:52.880 --> 00:26:56.680
not. I'm so sorry. I
don't mean easier like you took the easy

333
00:26:56.759 --> 00:26:59.759
route. I mean that's more accessible
to you. Like that is what is

334
00:26:59.759 --> 00:27:03.519
presenting itself to you, Like guys
are going to ask you out in school

335
00:27:03.599 --> 00:27:07.200
as opposed to like in the eighties, girls aren't going to be as readily

336
00:27:07.279 --> 00:27:12.440
asking girls out. So if you
are genuinely attracted to guys as well,

337
00:27:14.039 --> 00:27:18.759
it feels like that is something that's
gonna happen first, and then there's good

338
00:27:19.200 --> 00:27:22.079
as that sort of Am I in
the ballpark of that, Yeah, I

339
00:27:22.119 --> 00:27:26.000
think you're right with that. The
only thing that probably worked against me was

340
00:27:26.039 --> 00:27:32.960
I went to a very white high
school, and I think that that was

341
00:27:33.039 --> 00:27:37.200
why I was I was never asked
out in high school. I like,

342
00:27:37.400 --> 00:27:42.119
I my entire like twenties thirties,
I was teens. I was like,

343
00:27:42.200 --> 00:27:48.240
I must not be attractive to like
men because I went to a very white

344
00:27:48.920 --> 00:27:53.079
high school. We grew up,
so my parents moved when I was in

345
00:27:53.119 --> 00:27:57.200
the eighth grade to a richer area. We moved out of Patterson, New

346
00:27:57.279 --> 00:28:02.759
Jersey, to Clifton, which is
was that was back then called the Great

347
00:28:02.759 --> 00:28:07.240
White Elephant because it was maybe white
and so it was one of maybe my

348
00:28:07.559 --> 00:28:12.559
freshman year. I think they were
like, I could count on one hand

349
00:28:12.839 --> 00:28:18.200
how many other people of color period
were in the school I went to go

350
00:28:18.319 --> 00:28:22.039
in Westport, Connecticut. So I
am on, yeah, I feel like,

351
00:28:22.480 --> 00:28:26.920
yep, yep, yep, yep. So I think even if I

352
00:28:26.960 --> 00:28:30.960
had wanted to date a white boy
back then or what into or I said,

353
00:28:30.960 --> 00:28:34.039
white boy, but that's mainly what
was there. Even if I wanted

354
00:28:34.079 --> 00:28:37.839
to data guy, I don't think
that it would have been cool for them

355
00:28:37.839 --> 00:28:41.680
to date me. Though I did
date a guy in high school. He

356
00:28:41.759 --> 00:28:45.279
was actually younger than me and my
neighbor and that was nat like. We

357
00:28:45.319 --> 00:28:48.880
didn't meet in high school. I
knew Hi from the day. Oh okay,

358
00:28:48.960 --> 00:28:52.279
yeah, because you had mentioned having
a boyfriend, so that was more

359
00:28:52.599 --> 00:28:56.960
a off campus connection. Yes,
okay, I guess, okay, that

360
00:28:57.000 --> 00:29:02.359
makes more sense. Yeah, so
he he like they say, once you

361
00:29:02.559 --> 00:29:06.279
know someone, then you know it's
slightly different. He didn't see me as

362
00:29:06.359 --> 00:29:11.680
black, he didn't see me as
like bisexual, he didn't see any of

363
00:29:11.720 --> 00:29:15.440
that. He was just like,
this is this neighborhood kid who I know

364
00:29:15.839 --> 00:29:22.559
from like the neighborhood. So yeah, girl next door. Yeah, he

365
00:29:22.640 --> 00:29:26.559
used to sneak over when my like
because I had a room above like my

366
00:29:26.640 --> 00:29:30.000
parents porch, and so yeah,
I had a separate entrance, so he

367
00:29:30.000 --> 00:29:34.400
would sneak over my senior year,
we get up to no good. This

368
00:29:34.440 --> 00:29:40.279
is Dawson's Creek. This is literal
Dawson's Creek. I love this. Okay,

369
00:29:41.119 --> 00:29:45.200
okay, this is also tracking more. It feels like on why your

370
00:29:45.240 --> 00:29:55.000
mom maybe had that reaction if you're
in this like wealthy white neighborhood, Like,

371
00:29:55.079 --> 00:29:57.640
oh, we weren't wealthy. We
lived we were like the last block,

372
00:29:59.119 --> 00:30:02.359
right. Someone came to the neighborhood
and they were like, oh,

373
00:30:02.400 --> 00:30:04.599
you live on the bad side,
and then oh that makes sense, and

374
00:30:04.640 --> 00:30:07.880
I was like, back then,
I wouldn't have seen it as a microaggression.

375
00:30:07.920 --> 00:30:11.519
But now I look back and I'm
like, oh, you're terrible.

376
00:30:11.720 --> 00:30:17.519
That's maybe just an aggression. Aggression
think of that. But no, sorry,

377
00:30:17.559 --> 00:30:19.279
I didn't mean your family, but
I mean, like, if that's

378
00:30:19.559 --> 00:30:25.359
you're surroundings, like, and then
that instinct of your mom to not add

379
00:30:25.480 --> 00:30:32.920
another layer of quote unquote difference onto
already having to like be swimming upstream with

380
00:30:33.000 --> 00:30:36.880
some of that, and again,
not like not to justify it, but

381
00:30:37.000 --> 00:30:40.880
just to like where she's coming from
in terms of like, oh, fear

382
00:30:41.079 --> 00:30:45.279
one hundred percent. And now as
I've gotten older and I realize all the

383
00:30:45.319 --> 00:30:52.319
things at play when we talk about
systemic oppression and you know how capitalism and

384
00:30:52.359 --> 00:30:57.240
finances plays into that poverty, all
those layers, I have more compassion for

385
00:30:57.279 --> 00:31:03.519
her. And when you have kids, I think you also have a little

386
00:31:03.559 --> 00:31:07.720
bit more compassion because I do sort
of look at my two kids and I'm

387
00:31:07.720 --> 00:31:11.359
like, a lot of effort went
into you don't do anything like don't get

388
00:31:11.440 --> 00:31:15.359
hurt, Like I don't want to
see that. Yeah, you incimated those

389
00:31:15.480 --> 00:31:19.200
for almost a year, you know, like, don't fuck up that body.

390
00:31:19.240 --> 00:31:26.559
I made exactly make good choices,
which should be for you. But

391
00:31:26.799 --> 00:31:30.880
obviously I'm putting myself on you,
like make good choices that preserve you.

392
00:31:30.960 --> 00:31:34.599
I think that's a good I think, yeah, I think that's a very

393
00:31:34.640 --> 00:31:45.559
common parental line of reasoning. So
when when ish did you start also dating

394
00:31:45.839 --> 00:31:52.079
women or people who are non binary
people identified as women, And was that

395
00:31:52.240 --> 00:31:56.799
something that you just like when you
were younger that you always sort of assumed

396
00:31:56.880 --> 00:32:00.839
what happened because you had these attractions
or once or did you just think like,

397
00:32:00.880 --> 00:32:04.839
well, I'm also attracted to men, so I'm probably just gonna end

398
00:32:04.920 --> 00:32:10.279
up dating men because that's what society, This is what I always want.

399
00:32:10.440 --> 00:32:16.039
I always sound like I'm like Diane
Fosse when I talk to non lesbians,

400
00:32:16.079 --> 00:32:21.359
because I'm like, now, if
you are also attracted to men, what

401
00:32:21.599 --> 00:32:32.680
is that Like? It's just so
so for myself. I didn't really think

402
00:32:32.720 --> 00:32:37.240
about it because honestly, I didn't
ever think I would get married. I

403
00:32:37.960 --> 00:32:43.960
thought I would one day be a
parent, but for very selfish reasons,

404
00:32:44.319 --> 00:32:47.480
like I was like, I think
I could do this better than my folks

405
00:32:47.480 --> 00:32:52.079
did, and like, you know, that's one of the reasons why some

406
00:32:52.119 --> 00:32:55.039
people have kids, and that's not
the greatest reason they have kids. But

407
00:32:55.079 --> 00:32:59.359
I always felt like I was very
caring, so I saw that as something

408
00:32:59.400 --> 00:33:04.240
in the future or I started.
I can think of probably when I was

409
00:33:05.079 --> 00:33:07.680
I wasn't in college, and I
just think it was because I wasn't dating

410
00:33:07.720 --> 00:33:14.079
anybody after high school. I didn't
have like I had. I had a

411
00:33:14.160 --> 00:33:19.240
boyfriend for a little bit, but
he wasn't actually in the US. He

412
00:33:19.440 --> 00:33:23.079
was over at desert store, like
he was a marine. And he was

413
00:33:23.160 --> 00:33:28.200
also someone from the neighborhood back when
I lived in Patterson in the eighth grade,

414
00:33:28.680 --> 00:33:31.400
like my mom, Yes, my
mom ran into him and she was

415
00:33:31.480 --> 00:33:35.680
like, I ran into this friend
of yours from when you were in grammar

416
00:33:35.680 --> 00:33:37.680
school. You guys should hang out. He's gonna be leaving to go to

417
00:33:37.720 --> 00:33:43.720
the to basic training. So I
ended up hanging out with him. I

418
00:33:43.880 --> 00:33:46.519
had a crush on him in the
seventh grade and like I'm like, oh

419
00:33:46.599 --> 00:33:52.039
my gosh, like he's so cute, sto like. And so he was

420
00:33:52.240 --> 00:33:57.079
my first after high school boyfriend and
we had a long distance relationship. And

421
00:33:57.119 --> 00:34:00.960
I'm sorry to say, Ralph,
I cheated on you back then, like

422
00:34:00.039 --> 00:34:04.440
but it was like one night stand, so don't worry about it. It

423
00:34:04.519 --> 00:34:07.559
was like making out with girls,
and like, I think I slept with

424
00:34:07.599 --> 00:34:12.320
a couple of guys, but I
didn't actually sleep with a woman or have

425
00:34:12.440 --> 00:34:19.360
sex with a woman until it's probably
twenty twenty or twenty one. I had

426
00:34:19.400 --> 00:34:24.960
a girlfriend before this person, but
she was not out. She was oh

427
00:34:25.000 --> 00:34:30.639
my gosh, wow. She was
like maybe fifteen twenty years older than me,

428
00:34:30.639 --> 00:34:35.679
and she was it out to her
family and wow, yeah okay,

429
00:34:35.960 --> 00:34:40.800
and like interesting, yeah, and
so like, we didn't really do much

430
00:34:40.800 --> 00:34:46.559
stuff until the best friend who I
who had back in high school and who

431
00:34:46.639 --> 00:34:51.360
was like, hey, who stops, you know, stop pretending we're girlfriends.

432
00:34:52.480 --> 00:34:58.119
We were at a diner and there
was this beautiful girl who came in

433
00:34:58.360 --> 00:35:01.039
and I was like, oh my
gosh, I love her, like her

434
00:35:01.079 --> 00:35:07.280
so much. And my best friend
was so much braver than me in all

435
00:35:07.360 --> 00:35:08.840
things. She was like, yeah, let's go and talk to her.

436
00:35:09.239 --> 00:35:15.199
And the girl said she wasn't interested
in Looking back, I realized she wasn't

437
00:35:15.239 --> 00:35:17.280
interested in me. She was probably
interested in my friend. But she was

438
00:35:17.320 --> 00:35:21.599
like, oh, I go to
Henrietta Hudson's in New York. Yeah,

439
00:35:21.719 --> 00:35:24.159
And she's like, I'm usually there
these days, and I bagged my best

440
00:35:24.159 --> 00:35:29.440
friend to go with me. She
went with me. The girl wasn't there

441
00:35:29.519 --> 00:35:32.440
on the day we went, deep
disappointment for me. But there was another

442
00:35:32.519 --> 00:35:37.800
girl I met who happened to be
my very first girlfriend who I lived with

443
00:35:37.039 --> 00:35:44.079
Wow, yes, who ended up
taking me to where I actually live right

444
00:35:44.119 --> 00:35:50.599
now. I met her and did
I know nothing about like queer protocol,

445
00:35:50.760 --> 00:35:54.440
lesbian vertical any of that stuff.
Don't even think she could possibly be on

446
00:35:54.480 --> 00:35:59.719
a date with someone. I've got
my friend who's like, send her a

447
00:35:59.760 --> 00:36:02.639
dree And I'm like, oh,
yeah, because you know, I'm underage.

448
00:36:04.360 --> 00:36:07.480
But back in New York, back
then, like you know, New

449
00:36:07.559 --> 00:36:15.599
York didn't care. Yeah, going, So I'm doing this like very like

450
00:36:15.840 --> 00:36:20.079
you know, heteronormative. I'm gonna
send a lady a drink type of thing,

451
00:36:20.360 --> 00:36:23.760
and I send her a drink and
we actually we sent them both drinks

452
00:36:24.039 --> 00:36:30.360
and say we go over there and
start talking to her and like and we

453
00:36:30.519 --> 00:36:35.320
just connect and kick it off from
hit it off from then, of course,

454
00:36:35.320 --> 00:36:39.000
she gets a little she gets a
little backlash from the girl, who

455
00:36:39.679 --> 00:36:43.280
I learned later they were on a
date, because I was like, why

456
00:36:43.280 --> 00:36:45.400
does your friend always hate me?
And she was like, well, like

457
00:36:45.559 --> 00:36:50.480
remember, like you know, like
that was actually a date, and so

458
00:36:50.719 --> 00:36:54.280
I'm a better queer person now,
I'm like, oh, two people together

459
00:36:54.320 --> 00:36:59.840
are intimately talking. I'm probably not
gonna I'm not gonna be like, hey,

460
00:37:00.639 --> 00:37:04.599
like, yes, you you poached
her. Essentially, I did knowing

461
00:37:04.639 --> 00:37:07.800
it that it was on her because
you didn't know, and she did know

462
00:37:07.840 --> 00:37:10.480
and she went for it. So
that's more. Well, you know what

463
00:37:10.519 --> 00:37:14.880
she said to me, She said, well, I wasn't sure it was

464
00:37:14.920 --> 00:37:20.320
a date because they worked together.
That's the most queer statement of all times.

465
00:37:20.480 --> 00:37:22.920
Yeah, like is it is it? Is it drinks or is it

466
00:37:23.039 --> 00:37:27.719
drinks? Yeah? I mean this
is our community. We know we have

467
00:37:27.719 --> 00:37:31.480
an issue with this. So let's
all just sort of put it out there

468
00:37:32.480 --> 00:37:37.679
clearly concisely. Let's we pride ourselves
on her communication skills. Let's put those

469
00:37:37.719 --> 00:37:44.199
to use. Yes, absolutely,
on the person I'm dating. Now.

470
00:37:44.400 --> 00:37:47.760
She's very clear with you know that
you live together, right, you're pretty

471
00:37:47.760 --> 00:37:54.039
sure you're dating. No, we
don't live together. We are, we're

472
00:37:54.079 --> 00:38:00.440
just dating. We're just dating.
We do not live together. I've lived

473
00:38:00.440 --> 00:38:02.920
with people in the past, but
I don't live with the current person.

474
00:38:02.960 --> 00:38:08.119
And I thought that they were so
brave in they came up to me and

475
00:38:08.159 --> 00:38:14.000
were like is this seat taken?
And I was like classic, and I

476
00:38:14.039 --> 00:38:15.719
was like, nah, you could
sit here. And then I proceeded to

477
00:38:15.840 --> 00:38:21.599
ignore them completely because I thought they
just wanted to sit, and then they

478
00:38:21.679 --> 00:38:24.000
kept talking to me and then they
were like, you know, I'm trying

479
00:38:24.039 --> 00:38:29.719
to connect here. There it is, Oh okay, that's what. Yes,

480
00:38:29.840 --> 00:38:31.519
Yes, they did everything right.
It's like you don't have to come

481
00:38:31.559 --> 00:38:34.719
out of the gate and be like
I thought you were hot, so I

482
00:38:34.719 --> 00:38:37.960
wanted to sit next you. That's
a little maybe coming on strong, but

483
00:38:37.039 --> 00:38:39.960
it's perfect to be like is this
seed taken? And then like oh they're

484
00:38:39.960 --> 00:38:44.639
not getting this. Now I'm going
to be clear, but like say,

485
00:38:44.679 --> 00:38:47.880
I'm trying to connect with you.
Is that's the A plus A plus.

486
00:38:47.920 --> 00:38:52.960
I really like how that went down. Yes, she gets an A plus

487
00:38:52.480 --> 00:39:01.760
for all days. That's great.
So, okay, this woman who you

488
00:39:01.800 --> 00:39:10.840
read at Henrietta Hudson's that is the
first relationship that's like you you consider like

489
00:39:12.039 --> 00:39:20.239
I am in a relationship. I'm
in it. It's sexual like it's not

490
00:39:20.400 --> 00:39:23.880
just like oh I'm like I'm crushing
on you, Like it's a it's a

491
00:39:23.960 --> 00:39:32.079
relationship that I'm in. I ended
up living with her moving uh like and

492
00:39:32.159 --> 00:39:40.840
really I have to say that person, Okay, the first person who breaks

493
00:39:40.880 --> 00:39:45.280
your heart, who is the safe
sex with you, is like someone you

494
00:39:45.360 --> 00:39:52.159
remember forever. And I remember we
broke up and I just thought I could

495
00:39:52.199 --> 00:39:58.159
not go on and I consciously did
not want to date a woman again because

496
00:39:58.199 --> 00:40:01.400
I felt like it was so and
that is probably where the myth in my

497
00:40:01.480 --> 00:40:05.760
mind of emotional connection came from.
I was like, I'm not going to

498
00:40:05.840 --> 00:40:09.360
feel like that again, and I
was young. I don't want to feel

499
00:40:09.360 --> 00:40:14.400
like that again. I think I'll
just date guys because I felt like there

500
00:40:14.480 --> 00:40:17.440
was some distance there. But I
also was younger when I dated guys,

501
00:40:17.639 --> 00:40:21.199
and I didn't date a lot of
guys. I think I dated like three

502
00:40:21.239 --> 00:40:24.280
guys before I dated her. And
I've actually, over time dated more women

503
00:40:24.320 --> 00:40:31.599
at this point or non binary people
or transgender people than men. That doesn't

504
00:40:31.639 --> 00:40:42.119
mean I don't date men though,
but like I remember just feeling like devastated,

505
00:40:42.760 --> 00:40:47.480
like and it was around the fact
that so we break up, like

506
00:40:47.599 --> 00:40:52.480
I want to say, like middle
of the nineties, so mid nineties,

507
00:40:52.480 --> 00:40:58.480
we break up after being together for
five years, which is a decent not

508
00:40:58.719 --> 00:41:00.840
forever, Like I know, there's
a lot to be a doubt there who

509
00:41:00.840 --> 00:41:05.239
have been together since they were eating. Yeah, but for a first relationship

510
00:41:05.320 --> 00:41:08.199
and when you're young, like five
years, that is an eternity. It

511
00:41:08.280 --> 00:41:15.440
felt like an eternity I wanted and
what I wanted where we started to part

512
00:41:15.480 --> 00:41:22.000
ways. I wanted to plan for
a future that had too many Do you

513
00:41:22.039 --> 00:41:27.599
remember the term breeder for heterosexual people? Still use breeder because it makes me

514
00:41:27.719 --> 00:41:31.440
laugh and it pisses them off so
much. I am guilty of still using

515
00:41:31.519 --> 00:41:38.840
breeder. So I'm probably twenty four
when I break up. When we break

516
00:41:38.920 --> 00:41:43.760
up, and I all of a
sudden, I don't know why at twenty

517
00:41:43.800 --> 00:41:45.480
three, twenty two, which was
older than my my mom had me.

518
00:41:45.639 --> 00:41:49.840
My mom was very young when she
had me. I start thinking about,

519
00:41:49.880 --> 00:41:53.480
like what's a little person and how
much I would love to have a little

520
00:41:53.519 --> 00:41:59.559
person. And I start talking about
this with her and she's like, we're

521
00:41:59.599 --> 00:42:02.639
not like and that was her statement. She's like, we don't. You

522
00:42:02.679 --> 00:42:08.800
don't want those things that leaning into
like breeder mentality and I and I'm just

523
00:42:08.840 --> 00:42:13.639
like, like, I put I
guess if I you know, and so

524
00:42:13.840 --> 00:42:16.800
we do end up like not being
together. And that was pretty really the

525
00:42:16.840 --> 00:42:22.880
reason, like I wanted all the
things that quote were those are only for

526
00:42:22.000 --> 00:42:27.480
heterosexual breeder people, like we can't
have those things. We're fun, we're

527
00:42:27.599 --> 00:42:30.199
queer, like we're out here just
having fun. And I didn't. I

528
00:42:30.280 --> 00:42:35.280
went to the house and I went
to like like old people things, and

529
00:42:35.320 --> 00:42:39.159
I was we were ahead of your
time because now that's the lesbian stereotype is

530
00:42:39.280 --> 00:42:45.480
like baby, how like domest like
that is so in. That feels like

531
00:42:45.519 --> 00:42:53.039
such an early nineties problem to have
because now it's all about the getting married

532
00:42:53.079 --> 00:42:57.440
and having babies, and like every
storyline on TV is like these lesbians are

533
00:42:57.480 --> 00:43:00.679
trying to have a baby. Like
it's just like it's done so turn since

534
00:43:01.280 --> 00:43:07.760
the early nineties when it was like
breaking all of those those norms. It's

535
00:43:07.800 --> 00:43:12.400
really interesting. Yeah, that was
not something that you did. And I

536
00:43:12.440 --> 00:43:17.159
felt very much like why am I
the only And I was thank goodness.

537
00:43:17.239 --> 00:43:23.519
I mean I did end up having
kids, obviously, but thank goodness that

538
00:43:23.800 --> 00:43:27.559
like I didn't have a kid at
twenty three. I had a kid at

539
00:43:27.639 --> 00:43:31.199
twenty five, not that much later, But why, I why? I

540
00:43:31.360 --> 00:43:36.280
felt such a longing for that,
I don't know, and it felt very

541
00:43:36.880 --> 00:43:39.400
like I don't even know what was
going. It was definitely hormone driven because

542
00:43:39.440 --> 00:43:43.960
like I because that's like your fertile
time, right, like in your early

543
00:43:44.079 --> 00:43:49.239
twenties, like they say, like
early twenties to thirties is when like Shiper's

544
00:43:49.320 --> 00:43:52.679
fertile and it's the safest and all
those things. So something kicked in and

545
00:43:52.719 --> 00:43:55.920
I was like, oh, I
want a baby, like and she was

546
00:43:57.039 --> 00:44:00.639
like no. And you know,
from the sense of freedom and being able

547
00:44:00.679 --> 00:44:07.559
to and like capital that's disposable,
children take that away very quickly. Oh

548
00:44:07.639 --> 00:44:09.480
yeah, that's the best way to
lose your freedom. I believe this is

549
00:44:09.559 --> 00:44:15.599
having a two mile yes, but
it definitely was in high uh, Like

550
00:44:15.760 --> 00:44:21.119
I was in high gear with that, and I you know, it probably

551
00:44:21.159 --> 00:44:24.360
would not have been the thing for
us to do because there were less resources,

552
00:44:24.400 --> 00:44:30.119
but I definitely I wanted and like, in all honesty, if we

553
00:44:30.159 --> 00:44:31.480
could have made a baby together,
I was like, I want to have

554
00:44:31.480 --> 00:44:34.920
a baby with you, with your
eyes and like all this, like you

555
00:44:34.920 --> 00:44:37.800
know, which is like makes me
a little but sad that we can't.

556
00:44:38.000 --> 00:44:40.880
What we could do that designer babies, right, I know A couple that

557
00:44:42.119 --> 00:44:45.840
kind of like matched up who their
donor was. So we do have that

558
00:44:45.960 --> 00:44:51.280
option now, but back then it
wasn't. And it was a what do

559
00:44:51.360 --> 00:44:55.679
they call that? Some of those
things that are irreconcilable differences, and so

560
00:44:55.840 --> 00:45:00.639
that's what that was. But it
felt painful, and I was like,

561
00:45:00.679 --> 00:45:05.400
I'm only going to date guys moving
forward because they won't hard me Like this

562
00:45:06.320 --> 00:45:10.639
not true either, not true at
all. But also was your desire to

563
00:45:10.920 --> 00:45:16.239
like I want to have a baby? Was that also driving you more towards

564
00:45:16.360 --> 00:45:20.920
day and guys? Or was that
sort of like put on the shelf because

565
00:45:21.000 --> 00:45:23.760
of the heartbreak and you were like, okay, I'm not I think it

566
00:45:23.920 --> 00:45:31.119
probably was a little piece of it
because like full transparency, the person who

567
00:45:31.199 --> 00:45:35.880
moved me out of the apartment is
the person I have my kids with,

568
00:45:36.400 --> 00:45:44.920
so sure it must have been in
there as a driver. So yeah,

569
00:45:45.079 --> 00:45:51.239
and you know, and it wasn't
just the like I I have to say,

570
00:45:51.559 --> 00:45:54.719
this is my kid's dad, and
like I did love him, I

571
00:45:54.760 --> 00:45:59.960
did, ye, not the same
way, but I was definitely sexually attracted

572
00:46:00.199 --> 00:46:04.440
to him, which for me is
a big piece, right, So like

573
00:46:04.840 --> 00:46:10.199
having some asexuality in there, But
what was interesting was when when we started

574
00:46:10.239 --> 00:46:15.320
to break up years later, one
of the things that came out and counseling

575
00:46:15.480 --> 00:46:19.159
was he was like, I never
thought that you actually liked me as a

576
00:46:19.199 --> 00:46:21.679
man like. He's like, I
was always waiting for you to be like,

577
00:46:21.760 --> 00:46:24.320
I met a woman and I'm gonna
leave or I'm going back where I

578
00:46:24.400 --> 00:46:29.320
came from, because I'd come from
that community. He said, I never

579
00:46:29.519 --> 00:46:36.360
felt like you were emotionally connected to
me, like I always felt like,

580
00:46:36.599 --> 00:46:42.519
you know, it was I wasn't
like the person that you wanted to be

581
00:46:42.679 --> 00:46:45.880
with, And he said, and
I always feared that you would leave me,

582
00:46:46.760 --> 00:46:52.880
so which surprised me. Surprised me
because my kids, like I like,

583
00:46:52.960 --> 00:46:57.440
we were so open about my sexuality. I did not to remember there's

584
00:46:57.480 --> 00:47:02.039
no cue then I identified as bisexual. His family that like I my kids

585
00:47:02.119 --> 00:47:07.960
knew that I had been with a
woman like and so I think that probably

586
00:47:07.000 --> 00:47:13.280
added to so you're thinking it's in
like the back then, there wasn't a

587
00:47:13.320 --> 00:47:21.800
lot of support for partners of people
who like may be have some some blocks

588
00:47:21.920 --> 00:47:25.639
or attraction to the same sex.
And so I'm sure that probably was scary

589
00:47:25.840 --> 00:47:31.159
and it probably was a little terrifying
for him, like what he was like

590
00:47:31.199 --> 00:47:35.199
there, that would be something I
can't offer for you. I can't offer

591
00:47:35.360 --> 00:47:39.000
that community like a woman would,
and so you know, it was it

592
00:47:39.079 --> 00:47:45.199
was interesting to go through that experience
with him and realize like the fear on

593
00:47:45.239 --> 00:47:50.679
both sides, right, Like lesbians
when they date bisexuals or queer people say

594
00:47:50.679 --> 00:47:53.920
they date other people will sometimes say, well, you know you're you can't

595
00:47:53.960 --> 00:48:00.039
trust this group, But then also
eat men feel a similar way. Sometimes

596
00:48:00.280 --> 00:48:05.159
that's so interesting. I give him
credit though, for being that open and

597
00:48:05.239 --> 00:48:08.840
vulnerable about it, because I do
think that the stereotype is like more I

598
00:48:08.880 --> 00:48:14.599
mean, God, the thing of
lesbians and their fear with bisexual women is

599
00:48:15.000 --> 00:48:16.840
We've talked to me and my former
co hosts. I've talked about this so

600
00:48:17.119 --> 00:48:22.159
much on the podcast because I as
lesbian who dates mostly bisexual women, I

601
00:48:22.239 --> 00:48:25.360
just think, like, for Fox's
sake, can we put that aside?

602
00:48:25.440 --> 00:48:31.199
Like can we stop with that?
But that is the stereotype with the fear,

603
00:48:31.280 --> 00:48:35.840
And then I feel like the stereotype
for men dating bisexual women is very

604
00:48:35.880 --> 00:48:37.920
ego driven and like I'm not worried
at all, Like now that she's with

605
00:48:38.039 --> 00:48:43.599
me, like she's got all this, she's never gonna So I appreciate a

606
00:48:43.639 --> 00:48:47.679
man actually speaking to that fear because
I don't feel like we hear that very

607
00:48:47.679 --> 00:48:53.920
often the other way around. So, yeah, he feels very evolved in

608
00:48:53.920 --> 00:48:59.119
that sense of like yeah, yeah, And I have to say I think

609
00:48:59.159 --> 00:49:02.719
he was very evolved in that sense. He's very aware of like his emotions

610
00:49:02.719 --> 00:49:07.840
in that sense. And it was
like it was an AHA moment to me

611
00:49:08.000 --> 00:49:15.400
because I think men sometimes get this
portrayal. Heterosexual men are portrayed as like

612
00:49:15.639 --> 00:49:21.920
not being aware and not being able
to be harmed, and men are.

613
00:49:22.159 --> 00:49:25.840
They are just as emotional vulnerable creatures
as we are, and we don't embrace

614
00:49:25.920 --> 00:49:31.280
that and allow them that. Like
I listen to my son who's eighteen,

615
00:49:31.360 --> 00:49:36.519
and he'll talk about like his friends
and his friends. So we'll talk with

616
00:49:36.559 --> 00:49:37.800
each other, and I'm like,
wow, they're to evolved. They're talking

617
00:49:37.840 --> 00:49:44.039
emotions, they're talking supports, and
like he calls me into things, like

618
00:49:44.199 --> 00:49:47.400
calls me out when I'm being like
not, you know the greatest emotionally,

619
00:49:47.960 --> 00:49:53.639
And I just I love that we
are allowing men to do this, yeah,

620
00:49:53.679 --> 00:49:58.800
because their mental health needs it,
Like right, like if you suppresse

621
00:49:58.880 --> 00:50:05.440
your emotions, you're just you're you're
harming half of the population by saying like,

622
00:50:05.519 --> 00:50:07.480
oh, be strong. And my
son was the one he said to

623
00:50:07.519 --> 00:50:10.800
me, he said, you know, men have to be strong. They

624
00:50:12.079 --> 00:50:15.199
like, it's not the barbies field. But I remember he pointed out to

625
00:50:15.239 --> 00:50:19.480
me, like how come there's no
fat models on the target wall when he

626
00:50:19.559 --> 00:50:23.599
was little, or like why do
sport people? Yeah, he was like

627
00:50:23.639 --> 00:50:27.440
all the men are fit and there
were women who were, you know,

628
00:50:27.480 --> 00:50:31.480
because we were getting into like body
awareness then, and like he was like,

629
00:50:31.519 --> 00:50:35.159
how come the women have different shapes, but all the men are very

630
00:50:35.199 --> 00:50:38.360
fit, and so we put a
lot on guys and we think that they

631
00:50:38.400 --> 00:50:43.159
don't feel similar ways. And being
the mom of a son helped me to

632
00:50:43.360 --> 00:50:47.000
realize that because I always just thought
I have a brother who's very emotional and

633
00:50:47.000 --> 00:50:52.599
I should have known that. But
and then even it's saying who's very emotional

634
00:50:52.719 --> 00:50:54.880
right, like is almost like a
microaggression, like, oh, you're going

635
00:50:54.920 --> 00:51:00.719
against the norm by being emotional,
Like we're just people with emotions. Yes,

636
00:51:00.039 --> 00:51:04.400
I know. Well we're used to
that being levied as an insult against

637
00:51:04.480 --> 00:51:07.719
us as women, so we feel
what we say to somebody else like that's

638
00:51:07.719 --> 00:51:09.639
probably an insult, right, because
whenever someone says to me like, well,

639
00:51:09.760 --> 00:51:14.119
you're really emotional, it's like you
immediately are like defensive a pathy.

640
00:51:14.360 --> 00:51:20.199
No I'm not, oh god,
so but no, you had mentioned thinking

641
00:51:20.239 --> 00:51:22.079
that you were never going to get
married, did you? Were you married

642
00:51:22.480 --> 00:51:27.920
to the to the guy who was
then you did? Okay, oh my

643
00:51:28.000 --> 00:51:35.480
gosh, in the most wild way. We flew to so I only we

644
00:51:35.559 --> 00:51:38.960
worked together when I worked at a
bookstore briefly, and we worked together,

645
00:51:40.239 --> 00:51:46.840
and he helped move me out of
my place that I lived with her because

646
00:51:46.840 --> 00:51:50.760
he had a car that was big
enough to accommodate the things I had to

647
00:51:50.760 --> 00:51:54.719
move. He was a coworker who
had a truck, and we hung out.

648
00:51:54.800 --> 00:52:01.920
We like and and we had been
sexually into each other what up dating.

649
00:52:01.960 --> 00:52:05.400
I wouldn't even call it dating.
I would just call it like two

650
00:52:05.440 --> 00:52:08.079
weeks of chronic sex, right,
And then we decided we would get married,

651
00:52:08.360 --> 00:52:14.239
and we flew to love because we're
wild and such a lesbian story though

652
00:52:15.800 --> 00:52:25.440
he's a lesbian, Yes, he
immediately lesbian. This is astounding. The

653
00:52:25.480 --> 00:52:30.360
only difference is, you know,
are you whole with man? And so?

654
00:52:30.880 --> 00:52:34.280
Oh yeah, run off the Vegas. We get married. He's in

655
00:52:34.320 --> 00:52:40.400
a totally different socioeconomic background for me
too. His parents are like, yeah,

656
00:52:40.599 --> 00:52:45.079
they they have like they belong to
a country club and they have a

657
00:52:45.159 --> 00:52:51.920
boat, and like he is a
Republican now. When I knew him,

658
00:52:51.960 --> 00:52:57.599
he was an NPR listener, like
played in a hardcore band, like Okay

659
00:52:58.280 --> 00:53:04.239
Bury Aware bookstore. Yeah, I
got it. I think money makes I

660
00:53:04.280 --> 00:53:07.039
hate to say this. The more
money you have, yeah, and the

661
00:53:07.079 --> 00:53:10.320
older you get, the more you
worry about the material things you have to

662
00:53:10.400 --> 00:53:15.920
lose. And I think the Republicans
found a space in the eighties and eighties,

663
00:53:16.000 --> 00:53:21.000
nineties and two thousands. I don't
know how fiscally aware they are now,

664
00:53:21.519 --> 00:53:24.400
but they pushed that you will say
fiscally if you go with us,

665
00:53:24.519 --> 00:53:28.760
where the Democrats weren't really I know
this isn't a political discussion, but they

666
00:53:28.800 --> 00:53:32.239
weren't that great at that. So
I think coming from a Republican family and

667
00:53:32.280 --> 00:53:37.079
being the outlier, that the kids
were the outliers, it was easy to

668
00:53:37.079 --> 00:53:43.159
go back to that once you started
to advance in career and you earn more

669
00:53:43.239 --> 00:53:51.880
things you start. Yes, so
I am not a Republican just so everybody

670
00:53:51.960 --> 00:53:53.639
out there. No, I felt
that was quite clear. Yeah, just

671
00:53:53.719 --> 00:54:04.559
in the way. Yeah wow,
Okay, So post divorce, what what

672
00:54:04.639 --> 00:54:12.719
was your take in general on like
women's men dating at all? Like you're

673
00:54:12.880 --> 00:54:19.719
raising kids, now that's a whole
another like what yeah, well, you

674
00:54:19.760 --> 00:54:22.639
know, so as a single mom
raising kids. I was also getting a

675
00:54:22.679 --> 00:54:29.000
master's back then, and so like
I didn't like, remember, I don't

676
00:54:29.039 --> 00:54:31.400
know if we talked a little bit
about like when you have like a space

677
00:54:31.440 --> 00:54:35.199
in your brain for things, I
didn't even have a space in my brain

678
00:54:35.280 --> 00:54:38.440
for like oh for sure. And
so it was like convenience people that I

679
00:54:38.519 --> 00:54:43.280
ran into. Okay, So I
dated another nurse who happened to be a

680
00:54:43.280 --> 00:54:47.000
guy. That was the first person
I dated, And I probably would not

681
00:54:47.280 --> 00:54:52.719
have been dating if we weren't like
like they what did they say? College

682
00:54:52.760 --> 00:54:55.280
and work are the places that people
meet partners and if you don't, if

683
00:54:55.280 --> 00:54:59.239
you don't meet anyone there, like
maybe you're not going to meet anyone.

684
00:54:59.320 --> 00:55:04.880
So it dated a coworker for a
little bit. Realized that as he was

685
00:55:05.000 --> 00:55:07.480
getting more interested in like, let's
like move in together, I didn't want

686
00:55:07.480 --> 00:55:12.400
that, like I didn't want to
go back to ever like kind of being

687
00:55:12.480 --> 00:55:19.639
like that with someone and then dated. So my car got broken into.

688
00:55:19.760 --> 00:55:24.159
I'd broken up with this person.
My car got broken into, and the

689
00:55:24.480 --> 00:55:30.000
officer who came out happened to be
a woman. This is the this is

690
00:55:30.039 --> 00:55:35.719
the Oh my god, yes,
yes, so the officer who happened to

691
00:55:35.760 --> 00:55:40.280
come out happened to be a woman, and like her energy was just like

692
00:55:40.360 --> 00:55:45.440
I was, like I hadn't really
run into police that often, and like

693
00:55:45.559 --> 00:55:51.320
that was my re entry back into
the queer community because they were imashed in

694
00:55:51.400 --> 00:55:57.239
the LGBTQ community. Started going back
and in fact, I'd been in Philly,

695
00:55:57.440 --> 00:56:00.079
like near Philly, the Philly area
in South Jersey for years and just

696
00:56:00.119 --> 00:56:04.159
didn't go out in Philly because I
went out in New York when I was

697
00:56:04.239 --> 00:56:07.280
at the height of like hanging out
and going to bars. And so now

698
00:56:07.360 --> 00:56:13.960
I'm rediscovering places with them, and
I just I don't think I dated,

699
00:56:14.000 --> 00:56:16.639
I date any guys after that.
No, I think I've dated guys like

700
00:56:16.760 --> 00:56:21.599
after that. But yeah, so
that was sort of like the like,

701
00:56:22.159 --> 00:56:25.719
oh, go back into the community. Yeah. So and there you're coming

702
00:56:25.719 --> 00:56:30.320
out as a mom, right,
like, oh, sure, that's a

703
00:56:30.320 --> 00:56:36.000
whole another coming out, yes,
because you know that that is a piece

704
00:56:36.039 --> 00:56:39.400
that I learned that they coming out
as a mom. Like, there's many

705
00:56:39.400 --> 00:56:45.360
people who don't like to date parents, right and then you're like a large

706
00:56:45.400 --> 00:56:51.079
section that doesn't like to date or
back then didn't like to date parents.

707
00:56:51.119 --> 00:56:57.960
Because sure, I think there's this
only focus that happens sometimes with women and

708
00:56:58.199 --> 00:57:02.039
kids are like there. I don't
want to say they're a time suck gonna

709
00:57:02.079 --> 00:57:06.400
come first, though, yes,
I mean they're gonna come first. I

710
00:57:06.480 --> 00:57:10.119
should come first. Yeah, So, oh wow, you have had to

711
00:57:10.119 --> 00:57:15.679
do a ton of coming outs and
different Yeah. Yeah, well, because

712
00:57:15.719 --> 00:57:22.360
I think people assume when you are, I'm like to and depending on how

713
00:57:22.559 --> 00:57:28.360
I'm showing up, sometimes I'm a
little more feminine presenting, sometimes you're masculine

714
00:57:28.480 --> 00:57:32.159
presenting. I think there's an assumption
if you're in a queer bar or a

715
00:57:32.559 --> 00:57:37.800
gay bar, like, you might
not have kids, right like, and

716
00:57:37.840 --> 00:57:44.199
that lesbian is the only identifier for
women. You could be bisexual, you

717
00:57:44.239 --> 00:57:49.000
could be queer like. So there's
a lot of coming out that happens on

718
00:57:49.079 --> 00:57:54.239
the other letters. So yeah,
oh well that I mean, it never,

719
00:57:54.639 --> 00:58:00.480
it never ends, it never yeah. Yeah, and do you want

720
00:58:00.519 --> 00:58:04.079
to talk at all? I mean
this is adjacent, but do you want

721
00:58:04.079 --> 00:58:09.360
to talk at all about You mentioned
the late diagnosis, the autism diagnosis later

722
00:58:09.400 --> 00:58:15.960
in life. Yeah, because that's
I mean, again, that's potentially a

723
00:58:16.000 --> 00:58:20.239
coming out, Like is that we
also totally don't have to talk about it

724
00:58:20.239 --> 00:58:22.320
at all. But I'm just thinking
about when you know, just saying all

725
00:58:22.360 --> 00:58:28.199
of the different or you'd mentioned disability, which can be a coming out,

726
00:58:28.239 --> 00:58:30.559
but this is all yeah, and
we don't have to talk about any of

727
00:58:30.599 --> 00:58:34.639
this. I just want to give
you the opportunity if that. Yeah,

728
00:58:34.679 --> 00:58:37.119
so I was a late diagnosis.
I want to say it's been five or

729
00:58:37.199 --> 00:58:42.280
six years now, but it was
always there, Like it was probably some

730
00:58:42.440 --> 00:58:47.639
of the motivators between the fluidity and
my sexual identity, some of the ways

731
00:58:47.639 --> 00:58:54.840
I think about things. And I
will say that in workspaces, the idea

732
00:58:55.480 --> 00:59:04.199
that people can be autistic and function
and you know, like also have emotions.

733
00:59:04.280 --> 00:59:07.480
I think there's this myth that autistic
people are not empathetic. I'm probably

734
00:59:07.519 --> 00:59:13.199
overly empathetic. That's the other side
of it, which we don't talk about

735
00:59:13.320 --> 00:59:17.440
enough. Like autistics can be very
empathetic and overly emotional, and so I

736
00:59:17.440 --> 00:59:22.920
would find myself like cheering up or
like wanting to get involved in ways that

737
00:59:22.119 --> 00:59:29.880
probably neurotypical people don't. And so
that was a coming out. You know,

738
00:59:30.519 --> 00:59:36.320
there was a time when neurodiversity was
not was seen as something to hold

739
00:59:36.360 --> 00:59:43.480
you back. I remember there was
a nurse who had been very transparent when

740
00:59:43.480 --> 00:59:49.920
she first got hired with struggling with
ADHD and there and I was at a

741
00:59:50.000 --> 00:59:53.559
leadership level at that point, and
people kept saying like, ugh, I

742
00:59:53.599 --> 00:59:59.000
don't know if this person is going
to be able to work here because you

743
00:59:59.039 --> 01:00:02.000
know, what if like ADHD that
like you know, and there's so many

744
01:00:02.079 --> 01:00:08.199
people with ADHD now oh my yes, and somebody undiagnosed like we it's just

745
01:00:08.599 --> 01:00:14.360
and it's so like the idea of
disclosing and that word has so much like

746
01:00:15.000 --> 01:00:20.400
R behind it because that it comes
like that you would have disclose indicates something

747
01:00:20.440 --> 01:00:24.280
is negative because it's like otherwise why
is it a disclosure? Like but yeah,

748
01:00:24.400 --> 01:00:30.440
it's just like and yeah, And
so I think in the healthcare field

749
01:00:30.519 --> 01:00:37.760
there's an ignorance to the non visible
intersections of identity, whether that be your

750
01:00:38.199 --> 01:00:47.199
LGBTQ plus, whether you're neurodivergent,
whether you you know, perhaps are a

751
01:00:47.519 --> 01:00:51.000
parent, right, and you don't
want to bring that into the mix.

752
01:00:51.400 --> 01:00:58.760
There is so much bias, uh
for the things that they can't visually say.

753
01:00:58.880 --> 01:01:06.880
There's this assumption at all everyone is
like the norm. And so I

754
01:01:06.960 --> 01:01:13.360
remember thinking, like do I even
share because I had a learning disability when

755
01:01:13.400 --> 01:01:16.159
I was younger? Do I even
share about this? Not autism at that

756
01:01:16.159 --> 01:01:20.639
point, but a learning disability?
Like how I navigated through that? And

757
01:01:20.679 --> 01:01:24.599
I'm sure this person is sharing because
they might need some accommodations, and we

758
01:01:24.800 --> 01:01:30.800
have to accommodate those who disclose,
right, So from a legal perspective,

759
01:01:31.679 --> 01:01:40.719
so it's to me, it's interesting
how all of this overlaps into society and

760
01:01:40.800 --> 01:01:46.360
internally, right, because the more
intersections you have, the more it impacts

761
01:01:46.400 --> 01:01:52.239
your mental health and your wellness the
way people interpret that. Right, So,

762
01:01:52.079 --> 01:01:58.840
if I can be authentically myself for
three of my identities, but two

763
01:01:58.920 --> 01:02:00.840
of them I have to hie all
the time, I'm still doing the mental

764
01:02:00.880 --> 01:02:05.519
work, Like if I have to
hide that I'm queer and I have to

765
01:02:05.559 --> 01:02:08.440
hide I'm autistic, but I'm okay. But you love me as like a

766
01:02:08.480 --> 01:02:14.360
woman and a black person and maybe
a mother, Like how is that?

767
01:02:14.639 --> 01:02:17.719
How how does that harm me?
So? And how do we like,

768
01:02:17.800 --> 01:02:24.320
how do we get workplaces to see
that? If you're going to engage in

769
01:02:24.320 --> 01:02:30.599
inclusion, right, that means all
identities. You can't be holistic exactly.

770
01:02:30.639 --> 01:02:35.119
Y yeah, because people are people. They're not like a pie chart of

771
01:02:35.159 --> 01:02:39.000
their different Yeah. Yeah, I
don't think we're quite there yet with it's

772
01:02:39.039 --> 01:02:44.400
definitely be heard not yes. So
I love those companies that are like,

773
01:02:44.840 --> 01:02:47.559
we are leaning in against prejudice and
we want to do DEI And here's what

774
01:02:47.599 --> 01:02:52.000
we want to focus on. We
want to focus on race, right,

775
01:02:52.199 --> 01:02:54.679
and we want to focus on gender. But we don't know if we want

776
01:02:54.679 --> 01:03:01.679
to focus on sexuality because we don't
know if we're ready for that. Yeah,

777
01:03:01.800 --> 01:03:06.519
that might be a bit much.
Yeah. Yeah, but if you

778
01:03:06.599 --> 01:03:08.760
open the doors, you can't be
like, oh you can't come in.

779
01:03:09.159 --> 01:03:16.960
So yeah, oh good, that's
the opposite. Yep. It's it really.

780
01:03:17.199 --> 01:03:21.719
It is exhausting thinking about we've come
so far, but we still have

781
01:03:21.840 --> 01:03:27.519
like so far Togo, because the
intersectionality is that piece of the puzzle that

782
01:03:27.599 --> 01:03:31.519
we again have not mastered yet and
speaks going all the way back to the

783
01:03:31.559 --> 01:03:37.360
beginning, speaks to your mom's fear. It's like, so now, all

784
01:03:37.440 --> 01:03:42.239
of a sudden we have to count
up the number of our differences, and

785
01:03:42.320 --> 01:03:45.800
then what are we going to create
privilege based on people who only have like

786
01:03:45.039 --> 01:03:50.800
two differences based versus people who have
six? Like then that's we're still doing

787
01:03:50.880 --> 01:03:55.559
the same thing. Like it's so
it's so complicated, and we're all intersectional

788
01:03:55.599 --> 01:04:02.119
people whether yes, exactly like because
and we're all kind of biased. So

789
01:04:02.760 --> 01:04:06.960
and that is why I named the
company that started out as sort of a

790
01:04:08.000 --> 01:04:14.320
side hustle and enjoy conscious bias because
we create our conscious right, our conscious

791
01:04:14.360 --> 01:04:19.360
existence, that's all done by us, but there's also conscious bias and unconscious

792
01:04:19.360 --> 01:04:24.239
bias. Right, So if we
can consciously think about these things, what

793
01:04:24.280 --> 01:04:28.400
could we shift and change and how
much healthier could we be if we could

794
01:04:28.599 --> 01:04:33.159
kind of like lean into those spaces
because I kind of think like our health

795
01:04:33.199 --> 01:04:39.079
and it's showing up in our health
now. The more that we pull out

796
01:04:39.159 --> 01:04:42.800
identities and say, well, it
used to be that, you know,

797
01:04:42.880 --> 01:04:46.360
these were the ways that we kept
people oppressed. Well, now that we're

798
01:04:46.360 --> 01:04:49.320
open to those things, well,
let's oppress people in a different lay.

799
01:04:49.400 --> 01:04:53.159
Yeah, We've just found new ways
to do it. Because the system and

800
01:04:53.199 --> 01:04:57.440
the infrastructure is what the problem is. It wasn't like the problem was this

801
01:04:57.599 --> 01:05:05.519
specific way that It's like the whole
in foundation is the problem. So so

802
01:05:05.840 --> 01:05:12.679
you know, we we've wandered around
and I love it. I love it.

803
01:05:12.719 --> 01:05:15.760
I love it well as we as
we wrap up, do you want

804
01:05:15.800 --> 01:05:19.280
to like shout out your your company
that and like and what you are doing

805
01:05:20.079 --> 01:05:25.159
now and just like yeah, just
anything else that we haven't covered, I

806
01:05:25.199 --> 01:05:30.079
wanna I want to hear about.
Yeah. Yeah. So over the years,

807
01:05:30.119 --> 01:05:33.519
I went from you know, being
a nurse to working for a publishing

808
01:05:33.519 --> 01:05:36.960
company where I started like thinking about, you know what, how could I

809
01:05:38.000 --> 01:05:41.480
make a bigger impact? And that
was really when I started thinking about things

810
01:05:41.519 --> 01:05:46.519
like DEI getting different certifications and so
what I what I try to do with

811
01:05:46.599 --> 01:05:56.920
my company is focused on how can
we see this inclusion and diversity and and

812
01:05:57.000 --> 01:06:03.559
equity from a wellness perspective? Like
are you are you looking at this need

813
01:06:04.119 --> 01:06:11.320
for your employees from their health because
we know mental health is a huge impact.

814
01:06:11.760 --> 01:06:16.239
We know that mental health impacts our
physical health, Like are you creating

815
01:06:16.280 --> 01:06:21.440
psychological safety? If you're working for
an organization, you will spend the bulk

816
01:06:21.480 --> 01:06:29.320
of your day working for that company
versus working with it. With yourself?

817
01:06:29.440 --> 01:06:35.880
Right, So should not companies think
about the health of their employees as well

818
01:06:35.920 --> 01:06:40.280
as the DEI piece, Right,
They go hand in hand. And I

819
01:06:40.360 --> 01:06:44.119
find that they want to do workshops
and they want to say okay, like

820
01:06:44.159 --> 01:06:48.800
they bring a speaker in and the
speaker bubbles up feelings. But what resources

821
01:06:48.840 --> 01:06:54.679
do you have after rebubble up this, after it becomes like a discussion,

822
01:06:55.159 --> 01:07:00.000
do you have something wellness? Do
you recognize the identities that you're talking about

823
01:07:00.039 --> 01:07:04.119
out? What like? Are you
ready to really engage in thoughtfulness and create

824
01:07:04.159 --> 01:07:10.880
psychological safety and spaces for people to
be safe? You want them to say

825
01:07:10.920 --> 01:07:15.280
to them, now go out and
be authentic, yea, the resources?

826
01:07:15.840 --> 01:07:21.519
Are you prepared? So I try
to get companies to or individuals even I

827
01:07:23.320 --> 01:07:27.159
do coaching, so I try to
get people to think about like, you

828
01:07:27.159 --> 01:07:30.559
know, let's have a let's have
let's let's let's look up and also zoom

829
01:07:30.760 --> 01:07:35.639
and are you ready for engaging in
this? I think that's why DEI has

830
01:07:35.679 --> 01:07:42.000
gotten not a great name because we
haven't really mapped out like, yeah,

831
01:07:42.280 --> 01:07:45.440
you can. You can start people
talking about this, but if you don't

832
01:07:45.480 --> 01:07:50.840
offer them resources and the support when
issues arise and realize that, yes,

833
01:07:50.960 --> 01:07:56.880
you will become innovative, but you
will be innovative once you have a way

834
01:07:56.960 --> 01:08:01.199
to recognize and keep voices safe.
You're not being a well company. You're

835
01:08:01.280 --> 01:08:04.920
kind of being unhealthy to your employees. So that's what that's what I kind

836
01:08:04.920 --> 01:08:09.480
of do. Yeah, because I
think d I. You know, it

837
01:08:09.599 --> 01:08:14.639
became a buzzword and a lot of
companies used it cosmetically as like a fresh

838
01:08:14.639 --> 01:08:17.319
coat of paint and it's like there's
termites in these walls, Like you can't

839
01:08:17.359 --> 01:08:21.279
just paint over the ship, like
we gotta deal with that. So yeah,

840
01:08:21.479 --> 01:08:28.840
I love the termites in the walls. So yes, So where could

841
01:08:28.880 --> 01:08:32.199
people then find you if you if
you want to be found like and your

842
01:08:32.239 --> 01:08:36.479
company and all of that. Yes, So they can find me on my

843
01:08:36.520 --> 01:08:45.600
website www dot conscious by us uh
spelled b y u s dot com linked

844
01:08:46.920 --> 01:08:51.119
Yes, now it makes sense,
right, I got it. I got

845
01:08:51.199 --> 01:08:57.600
it. They can find me on
LinkedIn. They can find me on Instagram

846
01:08:57.760 --> 01:09:01.000
if they find my personal page,
it's so and goofy on Instagram, so

847
01:09:01.199 --> 01:09:08.239
please take it with a lighthearted you
know. And on Instagram, we post

848
01:09:08.279 --> 01:09:13.920
Monday through Friday, different stuff like
little little like pop ups about like some

849
01:09:13.960 --> 01:09:16.000
of it's cheesy. Some of it's
cheesy. I will say I do a

850
01:09:16.039 --> 01:09:19.239
woke Wednesday, and I know people
are like, well who says woke?

851
01:09:19.560 --> 01:09:24.520
But I'm old. I'm a Generation
xer, so I can use that.

852
01:09:25.560 --> 01:09:30.199
Come for me, don't what's this? No? Please? I look,

853
01:09:30.680 --> 01:09:35.319
we are not an agist podcast.
Well you know what you know, it's

854
01:09:35.319 --> 01:09:39.439
always so so funny to be like
yeah, and I'm putting out there and

855
01:09:39.479 --> 01:09:41.800
like come for me if you want. But like, secretly, I'm like

856
01:09:42.039 --> 01:09:46.520
really a scared child, so like
like I hate when I get like scary

857
01:09:46.560 --> 01:09:50.680
comments on anything I post, like
you know, like like trolls, you

858
01:09:50.720 --> 01:09:55.600
know, please don't troll me.
No trolling. And also, yeah,

859
01:09:55.600 --> 01:10:00.600
people are the scariest demographic because they're
hopelessly hippen cool and when they make us

860
01:10:00.600 --> 01:10:03.800
feel not been cool, that's very
hurtful. So young people, please,

861
01:10:04.600 --> 01:10:11.239
yes, be mindful mind by your
elders. Be mindful of your elder who

862
01:10:11.359 --> 01:10:15.840
sometimes make missteps because the language is
also new for it changes so quickly.

863
01:10:15.199 --> 01:10:20.279
Yes, the language is new for
us. My kids were like they were

864
01:10:20.319 --> 01:10:25.680
like, don't say anything silly or
that's going to get you canceled. And

865
01:10:25.880 --> 01:10:31.000
I we can be honest silly now
that's not okay, Well, it would

866
01:10:31.039 --> 01:10:35.600
be embarrassing to them because they are
the hippies most they're like the most awesome

867
01:10:35.600 --> 01:10:39.720
people ever. You said eighteen,
and I was like, oh, yeah,

868
01:10:39.800 --> 01:10:43.680
that's a scary age. That's like
the coolest age. Yes, my

869
01:10:43.760 --> 01:10:50.039
youngest is eighteen and my oldest is
twenty six. Say okay, and I

870
01:10:50.079 --> 01:10:55.680
feel like I still look good,
Like yeah, you said your age and

871
01:10:55.720 --> 01:10:59.760
I was like, oh I did
not that, So yeah, yeah I

872
01:10:59.800 --> 01:11:02.319
think. And so wait, which
is the Instagram? What's the Instagram handle

873
01:11:02.439 --> 01:11:06.560
for the one? So the Instagram
so you can find me on Instagram at

874
01:11:06.560 --> 01:11:14.279
conscious by us two it's under and
so same moniker. But if they were

875
01:11:14.319 --> 01:11:18.239
to type in like Tahisha Timmons,
it would it would lead to the personal

876
01:11:18.279 --> 01:11:27.119
page, which is the potentially just
be aware, be aware, excellent and

877
01:11:27.359 --> 01:11:30.840
if I'm not the sacred. There
was one more thing that you wanted to

878
01:11:30.880 --> 01:11:34.479
sort of like give a shout out
to before I wrap up, So yeah,

879
01:11:34.520 --> 01:11:38.279
do you want to Yeah, go
ahead, yeah, yeah, So

880
01:11:39.119 --> 01:11:45.119
I there are some voices out in
social media Instagram LinkedIn, who I just

881
01:11:45.199 --> 01:11:53.399
think are just queer powerhouses. So
Adrian Marie Brown. She's a poet,

882
01:11:53.560 --> 01:12:00.720
she's an activist writer, like love
her, goddess to me, I'm probably

883
01:12:00.760 --> 01:12:06.000
not using the correct identifiers for them. Family, How who helped me so

884
01:12:06.199 --> 01:12:10.319
much? Thought leader out there in
the tech field. I had a lot

885
01:12:10.359 --> 01:12:16.800
of negative thinking when I first decided
to kind of like explore what it would

886
01:12:16.800 --> 01:12:23.119
be like to be really active in
this community. And then there's two allies

887
01:12:23.359 --> 01:12:30.239
that I just love and so Amanda
Amanda Seals, the actress and comedian.

888
01:12:30.640 --> 01:12:33.920
She is kicking ass right. I
love her so much. I went to

889
01:12:33.960 --> 01:12:39.319
her stand up show last year and
she was just like, how we as

890
01:12:39.359 --> 01:12:45.159
marginalized people cannot come together and just
be the global majority we are, including

891
01:12:45.239 --> 01:12:49.359
the LGBTQ plus community, like black
people, we need to like stop being

892
01:12:49.359 --> 01:12:51.920
homophobic. And I was just like, I love you, I love you.

893
01:12:51.960 --> 01:12:59.760
I wish you were queer. I
don't mean that. She feels very

894
01:13:00.199 --> 01:13:03.319
like you're saying like an ally,
like very adjacent, yes, a powerful

895
01:13:03.439 --> 01:13:10.800
ally. And then someone who I
work with, Melania Johnson. She's a

896
01:13:10.920 --> 01:13:16.239
coach. She has a coaching group
called Be Smart Coaching, and she also

897
01:13:16.279 --> 01:13:20.279
works for an organization. And when
I say she's and I call her an

898
01:13:20.279 --> 01:13:25.840
ally. I'll call her into the
ally space because other queer folk, where

899
01:13:26.119 --> 01:13:31.279
she is like just a powerhouse,
will say bring her because she will and

900
01:13:31.319 --> 01:13:35.680
she's not queer. Bring her because
she is so passionate about her voice,

901
01:13:36.119 --> 01:13:41.079
because as a black woman, she
gets it, like you know, we

902
01:13:41.119 --> 01:13:46.800
can have empathy across and I just
she's fantastic, fantastic. Wow, that's

903
01:13:46.800 --> 01:13:51.880
thank you so much. Thank you
for doing that. And then, as

904
01:13:51.960 --> 01:13:58.800
you know, the podcast is at
coming Out Pod on both Twitter and Instagram.

905
01:13:58.880 --> 01:14:03.399
I am at Lauren on Twitter,
learn underscore flows on Instagram. What

906
01:14:03.479 --> 01:14:06.439
else, y'all? How do we
usually do these wrap ups? Thank you

907
01:14:06.520 --> 01:14:13.680
so much to all of my patrons. Uh, if you have not ever

908
01:14:14.399 --> 01:14:19.079
rated or reviewed the podcast, it's
never a bad time to give all five

909
01:14:19.119 --> 01:14:27.000
star rating on iTunes or on Spotify
Mobile. But yeah, just thank you

910
01:14:27.039 --> 01:14:31.159
all so much for listening. It
was so great to meet you to Yujia.

911
01:14:31.279 --> 01:14:35.000
This was such a fun conversation.
Thank you for going all over the

912
01:14:35.039 --> 01:14:41.479
place with it and with me.
I truly I really appreciate that. And

913
01:14:41.640 --> 01:14:47.640
yeah, y'all I will I will
see you next month. Bye.