WEBVTT 1 00:00:01.080 --> 00:00:04.240 Welcome to Hacking Your Leadership. I'm Chris and I'm Lorenzo. And Lorenzo. 2 00:00:04.280 --> 00:00:06.599 In this episode, I want to go over an article that I saw on 3 00:00:06.639 --> 00:00:12.480 Harvard Business Review. It's called five well intentioned behaviors that can hurt your Team. 4 00:00:12.759 --> 00:00:15.560 Well, we'll put a link to this article in the podcast description. 5 00:00:16.079 --> 00:00:19.199 And I liked it a lot because, you know, people become better over 6 00:00:19.239 --> 00:00:24.160 the years at kind of figuring out who the toxic leaders are, and they're 7 00:00:24.239 --> 00:00:27.199 they're identifiable. You can kind of avoid them. You can if you have 8 00:00:27.280 --> 00:00:30.160 the right leadership in place, you can kind of coach them up or out. 9 00:00:30.879 --> 00:00:34.079 But I think that there are a lot of leaders out there who are 10 00:00:34.320 --> 00:00:37.560 the exact opposite of that. They're not toxic at all. They're really well 11 00:00:37.600 --> 00:00:41.679 intentioned and and I would say good leaders, but they they want to do 12 00:00:41.799 --> 00:00:45.640 well, they mean well, and they still can cause problems on a team 13 00:00:45.679 --> 00:00:49.880 because of the way they decide to get involved or execute or help. And 14 00:00:49.920 --> 00:00:53.079 I think this is exactly what this article is about, is if you can 15 00:00:53.159 --> 00:00:57.079 kind of recognize some of these behaviors in yourself, then you might be the 16 00:00:57.079 --> 00:01:00.560 one this article is talking about. Yeah, I definitely think there's a lot 17 00:01:00.600 --> 00:01:04.040 of dialogue with leaders around with typically say like overuse of a skill or overuse 18 00:01:04.079 --> 00:01:07.000 of a thing. Sure, it's kind of like it's a strength of yours 19 00:01:07.200 --> 00:01:14.280 or most of the time it's extremely effective or impactful in a positive way, 20 00:01:14.599 --> 00:01:18.400 but it can lead to kind of some negative consequences if it's overused. But 21 00:01:18.439 --> 00:01:23.159 I think it's something that is really important that is discussed that we talk about. 22 00:01:23.519 --> 00:01:26.879 This article I think does a really nice job of highlighting some of what 23 00:01:26.920 --> 00:01:30.799 I think are some of the bigger ones that can happen quite often and really 24 00:01:30.920 --> 00:01:38.480 can over time lead to hurting the culture and to slowing down the ability of 25 00:01:38.519 --> 00:01:42.719 your team to be effective. And some of these things, I mean, 26 00:01:42.760 --> 00:01:46.000 it's they're interesting because they're kind of like some of them are like snowball things. 27 00:01:46.040 --> 00:01:49.159 We're like a little bit here and there, not really a problem, 28 00:01:49.439 --> 00:01:52.319 you know, a little bit. Over time, it can be annoying. 29 00:01:52.840 --> 00:01:55.840 But then if it becomes a part of just what's expected, once people start 30 00:01:55.879 --> 00:01:59.079 to realize that that this is something that just is here, it's not going 31 00:01:59.159 --> 00:02:00.680 to be addressed, it's not to be handled, or it's always done this 32 00:02:00.760 --> 00:02:06.200 way, and it becomes a part of the culture, then it really creates 33 00:02:06.200 --> 00:02:09.520 a bigger issue and problem because then it's ingrained versus just maybe a thing that 34 00:02:09.560 --> 00:02:15.280 a leader is either overusing or has well intentions have been doing incorrectly. When 35 00:02:15.319 --> 00:02:17.319 it becomes a part of how the team operates, then it really causes major 36 00:02:17.360 --> 00:02:23.719 issues. Yeah, that's spot on. The first the first element or behavior 37 00:02:23.759 --> 00:02:27.199 that a leader could be doing that is well intentioned, but they can go 38 00:02:27.599 --> 00:02:31.680 off the rails or they can actually hurt the team is sinking seeking constant agreement. 39 00:02:32.000 --> 00:02:36.439 And I've seen this in two different ways. I've seen this with leaders 40 00:02:36.439 --> 00:02:39.960 who will reschedule a meeting over and over and over again because the entire team 41 00:02:40.039 --> 00:02:44.400 can't be there and you know one person's missing, as opposed to just moving 42 00:02:44.439 --> 00:02:47.000 forward and getting that person up to speed later. I've also seen it in 43 00:02:47.080 --> 00:02:52.039 a in a you know, in conflict conflict resolution, where you have two 44 00:02:52.080 --> 00:02:55.199 people who are at odds and neither is inherently right or wrong. There's a 45 00:02:55.199 --> 00:02:59.120 lot of gray, there's a lot of subjectivity, and yet you're trying to 46 00:02:59.199 --> 00:03:02.439 make them both leaving a situation happy. As the leader, You're hoping that 47 00:03:02.520 --> 00:03:06.520 if you do your job right as a leader, then both of these people 48 00:03:06.719 --> 00:03:08.520 will leave the situation happy. And at the end of the day, it's 49 00:03:08.520 --> 00:03:12.840 not your job to ensure that both people are leaving the situation happy. It's 50 00:03:12.879 --> 00:03:16.840 your job to ensure that both the policies of an organization as well as your 51 00:03:16.879 --> 00:03:21.520 own personal value system of what's right and wrong are being followed. And if 52 00:03:21.520 --> 00:03:25.280 that means that one of your employees leaves the situation unhappy, what your job 53 00:03:25.319 --> 00:03:29.879 as a leader is to make sure they understand why the decision was made this 54 00:03:29.919 --> 00:03:32.680 way and align it with your values and align it with what the organizational rules 55 00:03:32.719 --> 00:03:36.560 are. And if they're still unhappy with that, that's honestly on them. 56 00:03:36.599 --> 00:03:38.960 It's not your job to get them to agree with you. It's your job 57 00:03:39.000 --> 00:03:43.360 to make sure they understand why it happened. It's on them to kind of 58 00:03:43.400 --> 00:03:45.680 make peace with it in their own mind. And if you're a leader, 59 00:03:45.719 --> 00:03:46.439 you need to be able to let that part of it go. Yeah, 60 00:03:46.599 --> 00:03:52.479 when I hear that, I immediately think of like that doesn't understand that conflict 61 00:03:52.520 --> 00:03:58.199 and healthy debate is absolutely needed in high performing teams. Yes, got to 62 00:03:58.400 --> 00:04:02.719 have the space is for people to disagree on a strategy, to talk through 63 00:04:02.680 --> 00:04:06.680 it, to have different perspectives to push back on one another and then to 64 00:04:06.879 --> 00:04:12.199 learn together and then at the end of it, to be able to find 65 00:04:12.199 --> 00:04:15.680 a common ground, be able to commit to another and move forward. But 66 00:04:15.719 --> 00:04:18.360 if you do not allow there to be that conflict, if you're constantly looking 67 00:04:18.399 --> 00:04:21.680 for agreement, if you're like, why can't you why can't you just figure 68 00:04:21.720 --> 00:04:25.680 it out, like like we're all in the same boat here, why can't 69 00:04:25.680 --> 00:04:28.959 we just make this happen? Like, if you're doing that type of thing 70 00:04:29.040 --> 00:04:32.160 and now not allowing the space for them, for people to have those types 71 00:04:32.199 --> 00:04:36.759 of again healthy debates and disagreements, then it can be really damaging to a 72 00:04:36.759 --> 00:04:40.000 team long term because then what they learn is to just say, like we'll 73 00:04:40.079 --> 00:04:42.920 just we'll go along to get along, right, and then there's no more 74 00:04:43.000 --> 00:04:46.199 pushback, and there's no more better ideas, and there's no more refinement of 75 00:04:46.199 --> 00:04:48.920 a strategy, and there's no more pushing, you know, to to really 76 00:04:49.000 --> 00:04:53.279 exceed you know, whatever it is that you're measuring, because everybody's just like, 77 00:04:53.319 --> 00:04:56.399 well, let's just we'll just do the easy thing, and then the 78 00:04:56.439 --> 00:04:59.600 easy thing will typically get you mediocre results at best. Yeah, you're completely 79 00:04:59.639 --> 00:05:04.240 right about that. I think when when I see this, Uh, it's 80 00:05:04.399 --> 00:05:08.839 the idea of It's not about not fighting, it's about making sure people are 81 00:05:08.839 --> 00:05:12.399 fighting fair. And so when when you see fighting amongst your team, and 82 00:05:12.360 --> 00:05:15.720 when I say fighting, I mean this disagreement, arguments, debate that kind 83 00:05:15.759 --> 00:05:18.839 of fighting as long as what's being and I used air quotes for the word 84 00:05:18.879 --> 00:05:24.319 attacked, as long as what's being attacked is the idea and not the person. 85 00:05:24.839 --> 00:05:27.560 That's where it becomes healthy. If you want to if you want to 86 00:05:27.759 --> 00:05:30.439 poke holes in somebody's idea, then great, but don't poke holes in them. 87 00:05:30.839 --> 00:05:33.399 And you know if you that that's the unhealthy part of it. When 88 00:05:33.399 --> 00:05:38.319 it when it devolves into that space, then you get you know, you 89 00:05:38.360 --> 00:05:41.000 get animalsity in a team that that needs to be fixed or there's some deeper 90 00:05:41.040 --> 00:05:46.560 issues there. But there's nothing wrong with picking apart ideas and poking holes in 91 00:05:46.600 --> 00:05:48.839 them and refining them and working as a team to get better as long as 92 00:05:48.839 --> 00:05:51.360 you have the psychological safety on a team. So again, it's not about 93 00:05:51.399 --> 00:05:55.560 not fighting, it's about fighting fair. The next thing that the article talks 94 00:05:55.560 --> 00:05:58.920 about is the concept of overprotecting the team. When I see this happen, 95 00:05:59.480 --> 00:06:02.800 I see it keeping on we're talking about well intentioned leaders here. You know, 96 00:06:02.879 --> 00:06:09.959 a well intentioned leader is someone who tries to give credit away from themselves 97 00:06:10.000 --> 00:06:14.120 and towards the team whenever something is done right, and to own the failure 98 00:06:14.160 --> 00:06:16.319 themselves as a leader, as opposed to blaming the team. In general, 99 00:06:16.680 --> 00:06:20.519 that's a good idea to do, but when it comes to overprotecting your team, 100 00:06:20.879 --> 00:06:26.920 it means taking on things as your fault or your responsibility that genuinely weren't 101 00:06:26.959 --> 00:06:29.639 yours. You know, we can fail as a team together. We can 102 00:06:29.680 --> 00:06:31.600 have the wrong strategy and fail, and as a leader, you want to 103 00:06:31.639 --> 00:06:34.439 own that and then you go over it in debrief with your team. But 104 00:06:34.519 --> 00:06:39.040 you own that as a leader. When one of your team members or a 105 00:06:39.079 --> 00:06:43.279 group of your team members actually fails without your involvement, if they do something 106 00:06:43.319 --> 00:06:46.439 they should have been doing, it's not your responsibility or your job to own 107 00:06:46.480 --> 00:06:49.680 that failure of them. It's your responsibility to hold them accountable for it in 108 00:06:49.680 --> 00:06:56.000 a way that is objective and fair and that allows them to understand why these 109 00:06:56.000 --> 00:06:59.720 things are happening the way they're happening, what the consequences are. Overprotecting your 110 00:06:59.759 --> 00:07:02.480 team just leads to them feeling like they can get away with the exact same 111 00:07:02.519 --> 00:07:05.839 thing over and over and over again, and and you never know when the 112 00:07:05.879 --> 00:07:11.199 next time they do it, we'll have farther reaching consequences then maybe the first 113 00:07:11.240 --> 00:07:13.120 time when it could have been kind of nipping the button. Yeah, And 114 00:07:13.160 --> 00:07:15.519 I think too, as the leader of a team, like you have the 115 00:07:15.560 --> 00:07:20.920 responsibility to kind of role model what the team you know, not only does 116 00:07:21.000 --> 00:07:25.399 from an outcome standpoint, but from like how you learn, how you move, 117 00:07:25.480 --> 00:07:28.879 how you get better together, how you accept feedback, how you have 118 00:07:28.959 --> 00:07:31.079 the humility to know there's things that you can always learn, Like you kind 119 00:07:31.079 --> 00:07:35.560 of become that representative in a lot of ways. And if you're constantly defending 120 00:07:35.600 --> 00:07:39.120 the team, which are also doing, is kind of putting a target on 121 00:07:39.160 --> 00:07:41.639 them, you know, Like I feel the part of it is like you're 122 00:07:41.639 --> 00:07:44.600 not helping the team if you're like, no, they're they're perfect, they 123 00:07:44.600 --> 00:07:46.759 do no wrong, they know exactly what they're doing, They're doing all the 124 00:07:46.800 --> 00:07:50.160 right work. Like no, Like you know you can absolutely accept, you 125 00:07:50.160 --> 00:07:54.639 know, when things are not going the way they should go, or when 126 00:07:54.639 --> 00:07:57.439 an outcome is not where it needs to be, and talk about the work 127 00:07:57.480 --> 00:07:59.720 that you're doing or the work that you need to commit to to get better. 128 00:07:59.759 --> 00:08:05.319 You know, having a conversation not too long ago about just you know, 129 00:08:05.040 --> 00:08:07.240 my team and things that we're working on, and it was like, 130 00:08:07.279 --> 00:08:11.920 you know, there's there's a point where, you know, two things can 131 00:08:11.920 --> 00:08:13.360 be true at the same time. One of them can be that there's things 132 00:08:13.360 --> 00:08:16.959 that we can get better at. But then the other thing can be that 133 00:08:16.040 --> 00:08:18.439 you know that I have a stance to be able to stand here and defend 134 00:08:18.480 --> 00:08:22.160 maybe some of the things, like you know, like that those two things 135 00:08:22.160 --> 00:08:26.079 can happen at the same exact time. I can definitely defend my team and 136 00:08:26.120 --> 00:08:30.240 definitely say like, well, here is the way that we're going, while 137 00:08:30.279 --> 00:08:33.759 also saying but there's opportunity here that we can get better at, or we 138 00:08:33.759 --> 00:08:35.559 can focus on, or we can refocus Like we have to own that we 139 00:08:35.600 --> 00:08:39.679 have to get better collectively. But I also think that you have to be 140 00:08:39.840 --> 00:08:46.279 comfortable with your team in sharing the larger picture of what's going on in an 141 00:08:46.360 --> 00:08:52.720 organization and sharing the things that you may have perspective on because you maybe running 142 00:08:52.720 --> 00:08:56.039 different circles as a leader, like keeping your team up to speed on what's 143 00:08:56.080 --> 00:09:01.919 going on and how they are collectively performing in that larger landscape. I think 144 00:09:01.039 --> 00:09:03.440 is really important as well to make sure that it's like, yeah, like 145 00:09:03.480 --> 00:09:07.000 we can feel really proud of the work that we're doing, but we also 146 00:09:07.039 --> 00:09:09.840 have to have an element of humility that we have things that we need to 147 00:09:09.879 --> 00:09:11.879 get better at. Right, that's perfect. The next thing the article talks 148 00:09:11.919 --> 00:09:16.399 about is this idea of getting results without learning. You know, we just 149 00:09:16.440 --> 00:09:20.440 talked about this a little bit in the in Our Culture Acronymic series when we're 150 00:09:20.440 --> 00:09:22.759 talking about recognizing behaviors, and you know, this is what I think about 151 00:09:22.799 --> 00:09:28.200 when I think about getting results without learning. It's it's almost inherent for leaders 152 00:09:28.240 --> 00:09:33.279 to want to learn from a from an outcome that was less than what was 153 00:09:33.279 --> 00:09:35.720 desired. The results come back, the scorecards don't look like they should. 154 00:09:37.039 --> 00:09:41.000 You're you know, you're struggling to fix something. You you want to learn 155 00:09:41.159 --> 00:09:43.159 why that's happening. But I think a lot of leaders don't necessarily take the 156 00:09:43.200 --> 00:09:48.879 same amount of time to learn from positive outcomes. And so when when you 157 00:09:48.240 --> 00:09:52.320 have results, whatever the results are, whether they're positive, negative, or 158 00:09:52.360 --> 00:09:56.440 neutral, you want to learn why they are, why they happened. If 159 00:09:56.480 --> 00:10:00.000 you failed, you want to learn why you failed. So that you can 160 00:10:00.240 --> 00:10:01.679 do that again. If you were very successful, you want to learn why 161 00:10:01.720 --> 00:10:05.639 you were very successful so you can replicate it. And if they were neutral, 162 00:10:05.679 --> 00:10:11.600 you want to see what behaviors actually tie into those results in a causal 163 00:10:11.679 --> 00:10:15.080 relationship, and which behaviors really had no bearing on the results, so that 164 00:10:15.120 --> 00:10:16.759 you can kind of fine tune your approach going forward. So you know, 165 00:10:18.120 --> 00:10:20.360 whatever the results are, there needs to be a learning from it, whether 166 00:10:20.399 --> 00:10:26.720 it's positive or negative. And if you recognize your team's results without any learning 167 00:10:26.799 --> 00:10:28.639 from it, if you hype up, hey, look at this scorecard, 168 00:10:28.639 --> 00:10:33.480 look at this result, not look at what these people did, look at 169 00:10:33.519 --> 00:10:35.519 how they executed, look at what their behaviors were. If you don't have 170 00:10:35.559 --> 00:10:39.759 the learnings go alongside it, all you do is recognize the results. And 171 00:10:39.799 --> 00:10:43.039 what you do is you start a culture of feeling like of your team feeling 172 00:10:43.080 --> 00:10:46.879 like that's all that matters to you is what that number is on paper, 173 00:10:46.240 --> 00:10:50.480 and then they will start focusing on that number rather than on what the behaviors 174 00:10:50.480 --> 00:10:52.720 are that are necessary to maintain it or replicate it. Yeah, I think 175 00:10:52.759 --> 00:10:56.559 this is one of those ones where, again, if you're you know, 176 00:10:56.639 --> 00:11:01.279 in the context of a good leader who may be causing you know, some 177 00:11:01.279 --> 00:11:05.120 some potential issues you know, culturally, as far as like behaviors that you 178 00:11:05.200 --> 00:11:07.919 have, getting the result and then just walking away and be like, hey, 179 00:11:07.960 --> 00:11:11.279 we got it, great job. You know, It's kind of like 180 00:11:11.320 --> 00:11:13.200 I'm going to assume that how you did it was the right way, and 181 00:11:13.240 --> 00:11:16.000 I'm going to assume that whatever you learned in doing this, you're gonna be 182 00:11:16.000 --> 00:11:18.799 able to apply in the future when it comes to the next thing that you 183 00:11:18.799 --> 00:11:22.360 have to go and focus on, and that could be really tough. I'm 184 00:11:22.399 --> 00:11:26.919 really big on asking specific questions when somebody says, okay, well, like 185 00:11:28.480 --> 00:11:31.320 talk to me about your approach to this, talk to me about how you 186 00:11:31.360 --> 00:11:33.440 get this work done, and then they tell me how they do it, 187 00:11:33.480 --> 00:11:37.559 and I say, okay, great, So now I'm the leader that you're 188 00:11:37.600 --> 00:11:41.200 teaching how to do this or I'm the employee that you're coaching on how to 189 00:11:41.200 --> 00:11:43.600 get better. What does that sound like? Like, tell me exactly, 190 00:11:43.679 --> 00:11:50.320 like I'm I'm the employee that has this opportunity to tell me how you have 191 00:11:50.399 --> 00:11:54.519 that conversation. And when you start to ask for the level of specificity in 192 00:11:54.639 --> 00:11:58.480 questions like that, you learn a lot. You learn are like are they 193 00:12:00.120 --> 00:12:03.440 doing the work? Are they is it easy for them to pull specific examples 194 00:12:03.480 --> 00:12:07.120 of how they're getting their work done? Are they learning as they go? 195 00:12:07.240 --> 00:12:09.480 Because then once you start to unpack, they say, great, so like 196 00:12:09.519 --> 00:12:13.080 what was the what was the learner was? What was the pivotal moment? 197 00:12:13.080 --> 00:12:16.799 What was the thing that helped you to change and get the get the result 198 00:12:16.840 --> 00:12:20.240 that you were looking for? If you start to ask specific questions, you 199 00:12:20.279 --> 00:12:24.480 know, a deeper layer than just the outcome, and people struggle with answering 200 00:12:24.480 --> 00:12:26.960 the question or it is they there's like, ah, you know, we've 201 00:12:26.000 --> 00:12:28.919 just implemented these great strategies. No, we're just doing the company plan. 202 00:12:30.159 --> 00:12:33.679 Well, okay, tell me how, Like how are you implementing the company 203 00:12:33.679 --> 00:12:35.320 play? Because I think a lot of people what is the company plan? 204 00:12:35.559 --> 00:12:39.159 Right exactly? You know what I mean? Like like walk me through that. 205 00:12:39.799 --> 00:12:41.919 When you start to see that they don't have the specificity, they don't 206 00:12:41.919 --> 00:12:46.440 have the examples, then you start to realize there's an element here where they're 207 00:12:46.480 --> 00:12:48.840 just chasing the number and they got the number and they left it alone, 208 00:12:48.919 --> 00:12:50.600 and there's there's no learning there, there's no skill that's there, there's nothing 209 00:12:50.639 --> 00:12:54.840 that's coming out of that that you're able to apply to the next thing. 210 00:12:54.000 --> 00:12:56.440 And that's really what you're trying to teach from a leadership standpoint. Right, 211 00:12:56.440 --> 00:13:00.399 they got the result in spite of their failures and not because because of it. 212 00:13:00.639 --> 00:13:03.679 How how high could they fly if they really did know the plan and 213 00:13:03.720 --> 00:13:07.320 they did they were able to execute. You know, sometimes it's just happenstance 214 00:13:07.320 --> 00:13:09.879 why you get a good result, and you know why. That is the 215 00:13:09.919 --> 00:13:13.559 next one in this article. It talks about being too involved or not at 216 00:13:13.600 --> 00:13:18.879 all. You know, I've said for a long time, one man's micromanager 217 00:13:18.960 --> 00:13:24.320 is another man's abandonment. You know, like this is this is defined by 218 00:13:24.360 --> 00:13:31.159 your by each individual person on your team. Some people want as little involvement 219 00:13:31.240 --> 00:13:33.240 from you as a leader as possible, and if they've earned that by their 220 00:13:33.279 --> 00:13:37.759 performance and their results, then your responsibility to give that to them. And 221 00:13:37.799 --> 00:13:41.360 some people want support and encouragement and more check ins and more involvement from you 222 00:13:41.360 --> 00:13:45.159 as a leader, even if you know in your heart that they have the 223 00:13:45.200 --> 00:13:48.720 ability to do this without you. Whatever that looks like between you and each 224 00:13:48.759 --> 00:13:52.159 person on your team needs to be worked out with you and that person on 225 00:13:52.200 --> 00:13:56.480 your team. You know, you if you are inherently a micromanager. You 226 00:13:56.559 --> 00:14:00.480 might actually have some people on your team who really like that, and they 227 00:14:00.600 --> 00:14:03.679 they perform well in an environment like that. You will undoubtedly have people who 228 00:14:03.679 --> 00:14:07.080 don't like that. And then if you're inherently more of a hands off person 229 00:14:07.159 --> 00:14:09.960 you want to kind of trust that might be coming from a really great place, 230 00:14:09.080 --> 00:14:11.679 but you'll have people who feel like they are not supported by you at 231 00:14:11.720 --> 00:14:18.000 all as a leader. This is really important to get the balance right because 232 00:14:18.000 --> 00:14:20.440 it's not about being too involved, it's not about being not enough involved. 233 00:14:20.600 --> 00:14:26.480 It's about either Either of these are well intentioned behaviors that can lead to, 234 00:14:26.679 --> 00:14:28.519 you know, poor performance and poor engagement in your team. Yeah, I 235 00:14:28.519 --> 00:14:31.200 love that. The only thing that I would add to that is being conscious 236 00:14:31.279 --> 00:14:35.960 of what are the parameters of both, like what are the parameters where someone 237 00:14:37.039 --> 00:14:39.960 does earn the ability to have more of that space and trust, like for 238 00:14:41.039 --> 00:14:43.320 yourself, you know, and the same thing of like what are the parameters 239 00:14:43.399 --> 00:14:46.480 of where you need to spend the time in the follow up and kind of 240 00:14:46.519 --> 00:14:50.759 making sure that things are going down the right path and then communicating that to 241 00:14:50.799 --> 00:14:54.480 everyone involved. Like that's the other piece of this is saying like Hey, 242 00:14:54.840 --> 00:14:56.120 you know, I want to make sure that you have accessibility to me. 243 00:14:56.159 --> 00:14:58.679 I want to make sure that I'm here for when you need me. Based 244 00:14:58.720 --> 00:15:01.480 upon body of work that I see and the behaviors that you have and the 245 00:15:01.480 --> 00:15:05.799 outcomes that you have. I'm gonna give you the space, you know, 246 00:15:05.960 --> 00:15:07.000 But that does not mean that I want to be absent. That does not 247 00:15:07.039 --> 00:15:09.000 mean that you cannot reach out to me. That does not mean that I 248 00:15:09.039 --> 00:15:11.000 want it. From time to time check in and follow up with you. 249 00:15:11.240 --> 00:15:15.519 But you're gonna see less of me because you're doing this level of work and 250 00:15:15.519 --> 00:15:18.120 these things are going on. And the same thing on the other side, 251 00:15:18.120 --> 00:15:20.120 which is like, hey, you know, I see that we have some 252 00:15:20.159 --> 00:15:22.919 opportunity here with some inconsistency here the things that we're working out. I'm gonna 253 00:15:22.919 --> 00:15:24.559 stay close. I'm gonna make sure that you know. I'm gonna valid it. 254 00:15:24.480 --> 00:15:28.720 It may feel like I'm micromanaging, and to be honest, I am 255 00:15:28.759 --> 00:15:31.240 a little bit because I need to make sure that we're getting down this path 256 00:15:31.320 --> 00:15:33.960 right. But as you show me that these things can be completed, as 257 00:15:35.000 --> 00:15:37.039 you show me that there's you know, the skill that's being built, and 258 00:15:37.120 --> 00:15:41.039 there's consistency and outcomes. I'm going to make sure that I give you some 259 00:15:41.080 --> 00:15:43.720 more of that space, so like, you know, we'll continue to have 260 00:15:43.720 --> 00:15:48.799 these conversations. But I think telling people that upfront also allows them to understand 261 00:15:48.799 --> 00:15:52.480 your intentions and allows them to kind of realize they can choose their own adventure. 262 00:15:52.519 --> 00:15:54.159 Yeah, that's that's that's spot on. The last one the article talks 263 00:15:54.159 --> 00:16:00.000 about is the idea of being everyone's friend. You know, I the first 264 00:16:00.080 --> 00:16:06.080 time that I had a leader who I tried to be their friend because that's 265 00:16:06.080 --> 00:16:07.799 what I like to do. I feel like I get along best with leaders 266 00:16:07.840 --> 00:16:11.799 when I have like a personal relationship with them. And I tried to be 267 00:16:11.879 --> 00:16:17.440 this person's friend, and it was very clear that they didn't want to be 268 00:16:17.480 --> 00:16:19.360 my friend. They wanted to be my leader. And that was that was 269 00:16:19.480 --> 00:16:22.679 almost hurtful at the beginning, Like it was very standoffish to me. I 270 00:16:22.720 --> 00:16:26.720 had a hard time kind of warming up to them. But the reason I 271 00:16:26.759 --> 00:16:30.120 was able to warm up to them over time was because I watched them interact 272 00:16:30.120 --> 00:16:33.600 with people and I watch their values at play and come to life, and 273 00:16:33.679 --> 00:16:37.360 I was able to kind of, you know, my kind of go to 274 00:16:37.480 --> 00:16:40.759 would be, hey, let's see how this person interacts with me on a 275 00:16:40.759 --> 00:16:42.679 personal level to be able to judge how effective they are as a leader, 276 00:16:44.000 --> 00:16:47.240 which is great from my own standpoint of whether I can trust them, but 277 00:16:47.240 --> 00:16:49.159 it actually doesn't tell me what kind of a leader they are. It might 278 00:16:49.240 --> 00:16:52.919 even hurt their performance as a leader. But if I can watch them as 279 00:16:52.919 --> 00:16:55.919 a leader and I can see their values you know, come to life, 280 00:16:56.039 --> 00:17:00.080 and watch the consistency of how they execute on those values, then I I 281 00:17:00.080 --> 00:17:02.960 don't need them to be my friend. I need to be able to rely 282 00:17:03.200 --> 00:17:07.400 on their leadership and how they will execute if I ever need them to come, 283 00:17:07.000 --> 00:17:10.319 you know, on my behalf and be able to show those values. 284 00:17:10.359 --> 00:17:12.359 So it was a tough one for me the first time this happened, but 285 00:17:14.519 --> 00:17:17.279 very quickly or over you know, maybe a thirty to sixty day period, 286 00:17:17.559 --> 00:17:19.200 I was able to realize that, you know what, the best leaders that 287 00:17:19.240 --> 00:17:22.200 I've had, I don't actually want them to be my friend. I think 288 00:17:22.240 --> 00:17:25.519 I do at the beginning, but what I really want is for them to 289 00:17:25.519 --> 00:17:27.799 be a good leader. And when you are trying to be a good leader, 290 00:17:29.839 --> 00:17:32.440 really stop yourself from trying to do that. From a standpoint of, 291 00:17:32.480 --> 00:17:33.960 hey, I want to get this person to like me because I want to 292 00:17:33.960 --> 00:17:37.920 be their friend. It's more I want this person to like me because they 293 00:17:37.960 --> 00:17:41.599 can trust in the consistency that I have of my leadership and my values. 294 00:17:41.720 --> 00:17:44.640 Yeah, I completely agree and with that it brings us to This episode is 295 00:17:44.680 --> 00:17:48.359 one minute Hack, but first a few works from our sponsors. All right, 296 00:17:48.359 --> 00:17:49.079 for this episode one minute Hack, here's what I want you to do 297 00:17:49.279 --> 00:17:52.079 again. We're going to post a link to the article in the podcast description. 298 00:17:52.319 --> 00:17:56.680 Read the entire article because it's really worth reading and go through these things 299 00:17:56.720 --> 00:18:00.640 and look and see if there's anything that you recognizing yourself. Are the things 300 00:18:00.640 --> 00:18:03.599 that you do that you you know as you read this through, you're going, 301 00:18:03.599 --> 00:18:07.319 oh, that sounds like something that I would do. And if that's 302 00:18:07.359 --> 00:18:08.759 the case, that's where you need to put your focus on the things that 303 00:18:08.799 --> 00:18:12.319 you might be doing to it that would inadvertently hurt your team when all you're 304 00:18:12.319 --> 00:18:17.240 doing is trying to help. Most leaders are well intentioned. Most leaders want 305 00:18:17.279 --> 00:18:19.000 to do well by their team, and if they're making these mistakes, they 306 00:18:19.039 --> 00:18:22.720 don't think that their mistakes. They think that it's what their team needs. 307 00:18:22.400 --> 00:18:26.359 But in small doses it might be fine. But if you if this is 308 00:18:26.400 --> 00:18:29.680 your go to. If any of these things is kind of like the knee 309 00:18:29.720 --> 00:18:33.359 jerk, and you know a place where you feel most comfortable in executing, 310 00:18:33.720 --> 00:18:36.839 that's probably the places you need to execute, or that's probably the places you 311 00:18:36.880 --> 00:18:40.400 need to revisit and look and see what you can do to kind of lessen 312 00:18:40.559 --> 00:18:42.000 the impact of that. And bring your team along for the ride too. 313 00:18:42.039 --> 00:18:45.440 As you're going through these talk to your team about what they think. See 314 00:18:45.440 --> 00:18:49.680 if you can validate your own feelings around this with people. You might get 315 00:18:49.680 --> 00:18:52.519 your team going, oh, thank goodness, you said this. We've been 316 00:18:52.559 --> 00:18:56.319 thinking this for years. If you're sure hearing that obviously that that's a problem, 317 00:18:56.599 --> 00:18:59.839 or you might think there's a problem when there isn't one. But again, 318 00:19:00.160 --> 00:19:02.599 your team along for the ride, go through these things and see if 319 00:19:02.599 --> 00:19:03.759 it's you know, something you might over index on. Yeah, I think 320 00:19:03.759 --> 00:19:07.400 it's a great Oneman hack. And I think the the ability to really do 321 00:19:07.440 --> 00:19:11.920 that element of self reflection is critical here and thinking about it because again, 322 00:19:11.319 --> 00:19:15.920 we will spend a lot of time usually in our heads around the opportunities and 323 00:19:15.960 --> 00:19:18.359 things that we need to fix, things that we get feedback on, but 324 00:19:18.519 --> 00:19:22.880 also really understanding like what are the things that we do well and that have 325 00:19:22.920 --> 00:19:26.680 we have well intentions of that may not be helping us get down the right 326 00:19:26.680 --> 00:19:32.119 path in the right way because the likelihood of those things kind of being called 327 00:19:32.160 --> 00:19:36.200 out or you know, getting feedback or coached upon or a lot like a 328 00:19:36.240 --> 00:19:40.359 lot less likely when they feel like it's the right thing to do, but 329 00:19:40.440 --> 00:19:42.039 are not actually helping to build a culture that you want to build amongst your 330 00:19:42.039 --> 00:19:45.319 team. Right, And remember, you know, in order for your in 331 00:19:45.440 --> 00:19:49.119 order for you to be promotable, your team has to be able to maintain 332 00:19:49.240 --> 00:19:52.359 what you've put in place in your absence. We just spoke about this on 333 00:19:52.400 --> 00:19:56.000 the on the on the last Thursday episode. Your team needs to be able 334 00:19:56.039 --> 00:20:00.799 to maintain it if you're doing these things. A lot of these things are 335 00:20:00.839 --> 00:20:03.440 the things that will absolutely prevent that from happening. There are things that will 336 00:20:03.519 --> 00:20:07.880 keep your team dependent on you as a leader as opposed to being able to 337 00:20:07.079 --> 00:20:11.160 you know, work in your absence or work as after you've moved on from 338 00:20:11.200 --> 00:20:14.079 the team. So it can it will only help you as well to make 339 00:20:14.119 --> 00:20:15.880 sure you're you know, kind of you figure out the balance on these things 340 00:20:17.000 --> 00:20:18.720 and you get it right absolutely, and with that it brings us to the 341 00:20:18.759 --> 00:20:22.079 end of this episode, this hacking your leadership. I'm Lorenzo and I'm Chris, 342 00:20:22.079 --> 00:20:23.279 and we'll talk to you all next time.