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today wherever you listen to podcasts. Hello, everyone, and welcome to another
episode of Hardwood Knocks. This is Adam Fromwill here with my co host Dan
Favali on another episode brought to you by our sponsors bet Online, Dot Ag
and indeed, today we're gonna be talking about the Western Conference Finals, which
are now set after a somewhat stunning Game seven in which the Denver Nuggets stormed
away from the Los Angeles Clippers in Game seven and led to all sorts of
jokes on Twitter and all sorts of social media platforms about the Clippers collapse from
a three one lead. So we'll talk about that, we'll talk about where
the Clippers can go from here, we'll talk about the Nuggets Lakers series,
and then we're gonna get into a mailbag for everyone who is kind enough to
submit some questions for the tweet solicitation we sent out on the NBA math account.
But before we dive into any of that, Dan, how's it going.
I'm currently extremely distracted because Thor and Wade, my two puppies for first
time listeners, are literally just going at it like fighting behind me. So
if you hear that, I'm not running a fight club with animals, they're
just they're they're still in like that a whole stage. So we're gonna roll
with it. I'll play the mute button game as per usual, and I'll
edit out some of the background noise. But if you hear any fighting,
I promise that there are not. You know, there's not a fight club
going on here. I just was stupid and got it was pandemic brain,
I'm telling you, and decided to get two puppies instead of one. How
are you doing. I'm good, but I want to know who's winning.
Currently. They're both upright, which is like a big deal, and they
normally we read that this was healthy fighting because one of them always like exchange
submissions where they get on the ground. But when they're both like upright as
they are right now, they just like swipe out each other with their mouths
and they can get you know, they'll be pretty quiet right now, though
then they'll growling or whining or anything. So that's the best. That's one
the best kind of fighting. But if something happens, like if they cut
one another's throats up like I'm fine, not going to realize it because they're
being so silent right now. My two dogs, Aspen and Alder, are
hilarious playfighters because they like neither of them really knows how to dog, so
Aspen kind of just like towers over Alder and then Alder will give up and
just go go belly up on the ground and just kind of like accept that
she's going to get dragged around by her collar for a little bit. So
it's just like it's submission based fighting, I guess, but it seems like
they enjoy it. So yeah, dogs are weird. They are, and
they like your dogs are older than mine, so apparently they just don't grow
out of it and we have to place it. We hired a trainer and
they told us to let let them like go like at each other and that
that's how they learn boundaries and stuff. But it's especially for my wife,
like it's really hard for her to watch, and even me, like,
I'm just looking at it. I want to stop it unless I'm mad at
them, and then I'm rooting for one of them to really hurt the other,
except I'm not. I'm not really you know, I'd never do that
it's gonna say, yeah, you better not thorn. Wait are adorable?
Yeah, moving on, let's talk about actual adorable stuff. Basketball or Davy.
We can talk about Davy or basketball. Two mic go hand in hand.
I'm fine with either one. Let's go with the basketball. So you
mentioned the Clippers really quickly, and I'm I've normally tried to be more especially
within the past year, so more cognizant of what I'm tweeting when I'm like
dragging players are making fun of them, to make sure that it's not personal.
And you do have to weigh, particularly in this instance, the mental
gymnastics that go into operating inside the bubble. And when Paul George was kind
of, you know, vilified or crucified because he said he was dealing with
the anxiety or depression behind the scenes, and some people thought that was just
an excuse. You have to empathize with that to me, and I absolutely
do all of that aside, the Clippers deserve every single piece of poo being
thrown their way because they acted like a team that had accomplished way more than
they had. And I don't know if Paul George needs to be coached in
like answering questions, but it seems like everything he says makes it worse,
and I don't want to downplay the depression he's going through Montrose. Harold lost
a grandmother throughout all this was probably not in the best shape or at least
didn't have the stamina that he would normally would have had he been with the
team the entire time. I really feel for all of that, but this
is also a season long thing, and the Clippers, like this was a
terrible collapse. They were up three to one, they held double digit leads
I think in the final three games and blew them and in the fourth quarter
quiet Paul George score just as much as we did. Yeah, that's what
I was basically stumbling to say. So that's absolutely terrible, and I'm not
saying you need to overreact to it, but like, let's apt they can
absolutely just be criticized for this because this season is a failure. Where if
you would have said they lost in the second round in a seven game series
that they weren't up in or it was sort of this rock fight from start
to finish, Sure you were up three the one and you couldn't close,
that's a different thing. There. I think the two biggest issues are just
they're both related to perception, right, because it's it's the leaks that came
out after Game seven finished that the Clippers were exhausted, that they were so
tired there that some of their players couldn't play for longer stretches than just a
couple of minutes at a time against a team that's coming back from a three
one deficit for the second straight series, Like that's not really going to fly.
And then Paul George's postgame comments about how internally like they never believed that
this was a championship or bust season, Like, yeah, it's not like
he am fly or free agents in twenty twenty one or anything. Championship or
bust. Yeah, you said that the Clippers deserve and I believe the quote
was all the poo being thrown at them. And I think I think the
only way I would amend that is by saying all of the Clippers except Kauai,
because I think I'm willing to give him a pass in this series despite
the bad fourth quarter where he very much disappeared on the offensive end, because
he definitely seemed like he was playing as hard as he could throughout the postseason
run, and he said the right things about accountability and about how he and
the team need to be better going forward. After the game ended, it
seemed like he was the one who conducted himself the right way, which might
be because he's the two time champion and clear leader of the team. But
I'm willing to give him a pass here that I'm not necessarily willing to extend
to Paul George, who, while he was better in the second round,
still did not play up to his standard and made it worse for himself after
Game seven. I'm not willing to extend it to Montrese Harold, who,
despite the extenuating circumstances, was just not successful in his matchup with Nikola Yokich
or whoever else he was faced off against. And to Lou Williams, whose
bubble experience did not get off to the greatest start with the Lemon Pepper Wings
and didn't get better from there as he just completely missed so many of his
shots as he was invisible on the defensive end and was a large reason for
the collapse in Game seven. So there's a lot of criticism to go around.
I'm just I don't know that I'm willing to extend it too far in
Kawai's direction specifically, I'm with you. I think the probably the most salient
form of criticism for him would be and people have said this, and I
agree, I don't ever want to hear the Kawhi Leonard versus Lebron James debate
ever again. And it's Look, if you I still maybe he's in that
conversation for if you need one game, like that's how we've always spun it.
If you need to win one game, is he the player you want?
Or is that a Yannis? Is it a Lebron? But yeah,
when you blow a three one lead, the myth of the playoff legend goes
away pretty quickly, right, and look at Lebron has has his own playoff
fobles. But we've also seen kind of the limitations of Look, Kawai became
a fantastic playmaker. But like when he's having a night like Kawai would as
a score where his shots aren't I think it was he five of eighteen in
that game or whatever he was, and then he doesn't score in the fourth
quarter like his team would be elevated by his playmaking. If that's Lebron and
with Kawhi it's not and this you know, I just mentioned that conversation.
You need one game. This was the game and the fankily the Clippers had
three of those games. So I agree with going to that slamp, but
I also agree with you, like, no, this isn't on him,
and maybe the locker room needs to adopt more of a Kawhi Leonard approach.
I saw that. I can't remember who wrote this. I think it was
someone over at the Athletic or ESPN. I don't really remember, so I
apologize, but how they kind of had Blue Williams Beverly like Harold identity,
like this bravado because they were underdogs last year. And I don't necessarily think
that's problematic because I think what came with that bravado was not a sense of
entitlement, but like more of a work ethic. It's did they maybe adopt
the Marcus Morris and the Paul George stuff a little too much where that can
come off more as entitlement And I'm not trying to say any of them are
entitled, but like what Paul George said throughout this season basically and especially at
the end of the postseason like consistently just made things seem worse on their part.
But maybe you need to you know, is this a fault of Kauai,
like because the reports of this I know from John Hollinger of The Athletic
about how there were just reports that the locker room just totally wasn't in sync
and so you could say, like maybe they should have adopted more of the
Kawai model, But is it even on Kauahi and then Paul Georgia a little
bit, because those are the two guys you would normally look to to unify
a locker room and find that identity. I think it's a fair conversation to
have. My question to you is what is the reaction here? Is it
a one run it back entirely? And I'm not even talking about go out
and make a trade. You have Marcus Morris and Mantras Harold are free agents
to Michael Green is a player option that's going to be fascinating. Five million
dollars that's right around the mini MLI money this year. Are you running it
back in that form to where you're going to reinvest in this organization? Are
you looking at scenarios where you could upgrade the point guard position. And I
know people have mentioned Gore on Dragic as a free potential free agent, but
like, if you're only going to be working even with the non taxpayers mid
level, I don't know if that does it. And I say that because
the way he's played, I could see the heat being like, hey,
here's a one year, thirty million dollar offer and that's going to be the
equivalent of more or basically three years of the non tax players MLA. And
that's assuming you're working with that, because you would have to get rid of
both Morris and Harold just have a chance to be working with that full amount.
And so my question would them be do you then would you also consider
making a move that would be more drastic And the one that I'm just going
to dance around is and I'm just curious of what you would say to this.
If you're the Clippers, are you doing Patrick Beverley, Lou Williams,
Zoobots and Ronny McGruder for Chris Paul That is a trade that works financially,
And I'm just curious if you would consider doing something like that to maybe one,
it's definitely an upgrade at the point guard position. As much as you
know you love Patrick Beverley. Is can be fcy on defense when he's not
fouling In is in more shape. Lou Williams is going to be getting buckets
into his mid nineties. I would say around there or something. But he
even shot poorly in this series. And I think Zoobots is probably the biggest
loss of the four in this trade when you look at he is three years
left at basically around seven point three million a pop on average. I'm just
curious, if you're the Clippers, would you sid or something like that.
Yeah, if if something like that really is on the table, I think
you take it and try to capitalize on this window before George and Kawhi have
a chance to turn down their player options for twenty twenty two and potentially leave
in free agency. I don't think that you necessarily like go out looking for
something like that so much as hope that it falls into your lap, because
as constructed, this team should largely run it back. I can see them
letting Harold walk if he gets a big offer from the Toronto Raptors or from
someone else. I would bring back Marcus Morris Senior, who was fantastic for
this team on both ends for much of the postseason run and for the brief
amount of the regular season that he spent with them. But the rest of
the core I think is worth leaving intact. They should not be looking at
like blow it up scenarios where you're you're thinking about shopping Kawhi or Paul George.
If you can get that guaranteed superstar, and we're talking about like guaranteed
superstar, you do it because go all in while you can. But I
don't think that it's it's a situation where they need to be like, this
isn't working. We need to make changes. And even in that scenario,
one guide you're not trading because he's a top three player. And then even
Paul George still top fifteen. He's had struggles in the playoffs. The playoff
peeving is now it's just disastrous. So I'm totally with you there, and
like I think where you I think with Marcus Morris and Harold Morris, while
he did like kind of struggle in the beginning here like it did see him
and he didn't have the best closes of the postseason. Honestly, it's it
felt like at points in the bubble that he really kind of mastered the role
on offense and then what he could do for them defensively. The Harrold's contract,
his next deal is going to be fascinating to me. I would say
that you can if there are teams out there that really want him, and
maybe you could work out sign and trade scenarios. But then you get into
a situation where you're hard capped and can can that happen if you're taking on
money in a Harrold deal, plus you're resigning Marcus Morris. I don't know
if e'asible that is, I would just be wary of the cost of at
retaining Harel and a lot of people think that he lost himself money in the
bubble, so perhaps that's you know, perhaps that's accurate, and so his
next deal is going to be fascinating because I do largely the fault to you
that if you want that, you should run it back, and that you
shouldn't be actively looking for a scenario like the Chris Paul if it's on the
table, that maybe consider it. The Harold contract is the one that that's
just to hang up for me, is I think you have to be very
wary of what you're going to pay him moving forward. Yeah, I think
it ultimately boils down to if you are one hundred percent sure that you're getting
an upgrade at a position, then go for it. But this is not
a situation where they need to be taking risks around Paul George and Kawhi Leonard.
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know it's good. But they're not in the conference finals, even though they
probably expect it to be. That the Denver Nuggets are, and they're facing
the Lakers, who this is going to come off as criticism to the Nuggets,
but the Lakers were no doubt excited that this is the poll that they
got. And so before we get into the nuts and bolts of this series,
just at the top, who do you have? Yo? We both
picked the Clippers going into the last round and then reversed course for Game seven.
I'm going to risk that playing out again because I just I think that
that Yokich is going to give Anthony Davis and whoever else is guarding him a
lot of trouble. I have confidence in Jamal Murray's offense at this point,
I think that the depth of this Los Angeles team puts the depth of this
Denver team puts Los Angeles depth to shame. But the Lakers have been sitting
there waiting for the Nuggets to arrive on this stage. The Nuggets have fought
back from two different three one deficits in emotional, physical, gutted out series,
and I just I don't think that the energy, either physically or emotionally
is going to be there no matter how much they want it to be.
So I'm gonna go with the Lakers, and I'm going with the Nuggets in
seven purely because I need to stand by my Nuggets championship pay For the preseason,
to some degree, I've waffled too much and I got a compliment from
I was doing a radio show and one of the producers mentioned, like,
kudos to you for being one of the only people that picked the Nuggets to
win the title, and I was just like, this isn't a victory that
I was like, I do not deserve that with the amount of times that
I just not even just waffled, but outright went against them. But now
I'm going to try. Now I'm going to try and capitalize on that pick
and pick Denver and seven. And I think part of it is because of
their depth. And I get what you're saying, playing in the two seven
game series, having to erase three to one leads in these back to back
series, that's got to take a toll. The Lakers have Lebron and Anthony
Davis, who are arguably I would put Yoga above Anthony Davis, but there's
a chance I'm gonna ask you that later. I think what happens here though,
is there's a chance at Los Angeles has the two best players in this
series, which that's obviously problematic. I would still say Yoga is better than
the Macro, but looking at this series, you know there's gonna be Lebron,
and then there's a possibility that Davis is is another one. So as
I lose my train of thought with the fight club going on behind me here,
but the depth matters to me, and I have been impressed more with
the Lakers supporting cast pretty much all year than I thought I would when you
look at them on paper. But and it's in the playoffs specifically, there
has been like in a different player every game. It feels like where no
you can't necessarily count on Kuzma and KCP and I guess maybe you could count
on playoff Rondo, But like there's always been one or two players that really
rise to the occasion, and maybe that's the power of their depth. I
look at Denver's as just far more reliable when you're looking at the players they're
getting, you know, from Gary Harris, Michael Porter Junior coming off the
bench, knowing that you have a backup point guard like Monte Morris in this
race, and so the fact that they're deeper overall, and that I think
you would argue, even right down to Tory Craig's defense, that you know
you're going to get from from your supporting cast more so than you're the Lakers.
That's why I would pick them over Los Angeles. The matchup that is
going to be the determining factor though, to me, would be Look,
the Lebron thing is a wash, like he's going to put Paul millsapper Jeremy
Grant on him. It doesn't matter like Lebron is going to I feel like
pick apart this Denver defense. The Yokis Davis matchup is interesting to me because
you have to win that and you're not gonna win it. Defensively, this
is actually lower than I expected. But on the possessions in which Yokich guarded
Anthony Davis during the season, the Lakers had a one seventeen offensive rating,
which is still ridiculously high. You're probably going to see other looks where it's,
you know, Grant on him and or Millsap on him. Can you
actually do that? Though? If Lebron's also on the floor with the Nuggets,
it probably means you have to play Grant and millsapp at the same time,
which is definitely possible. But how many minutes can you get out of
that? What does that do to your offense? And then just offensively,
I don't think you know, I don't want to say that Davis can neutralize
Yokich, but you certainly don't hate the idea of putting Davis on Nicola Yokich.
And on the possessions in which Anthony Davis guarded Nicole Yokes during the regular
season, the Nuggets had an offensive rating as a team of ninety one point
two. That is mind meltingly low in general, but especially for just the
Nuggets. And that's going to be to me everything if you could win that
matchup in the aggregate, and it's going to have to be done on offense,
would be how I would argue it. You can be in good shape
otherwise, though, this could be a series in which Los Angeles actually runs
away with it, not just because you have Anthony Davis and Lebron James and
the two best players in the series, but also because you know, we're
throwing all of this on top of the fact, as you've already mentioned,
Denver just had not only went through two games, seven game series they will
raise two three to one. Deficis that has to be just mentally, emotionally,
physically draining in ways that I can't even fathom. We saw Jamal Murray's
face when after the first one he was told that he had to play again
two nights later, And yeah, I just I can't even imagine like going
through another tough seven game series and then having to face Lebron James and the
Los Angeles Lakers, And yeah, I mean, as important as that Anthony
Davis Nicole Yoki matchup is, and I tend to think it's going to be
more even than those regular season numbers indicated. Yokich is playing at such an
unbelievably high level right now, and I genuinely have no idea how you stop
him with only one defender or even with two given his passing vision. But
I think that if you're the Nuggets like that Lebron matchup is so fascinating because
we've always seen teams have to pick between letting Lebron pick you apart as a
scorer or a passer. But with this Lakers team in particular, I think
you have to make him into a passer and make that supporting Caspiat beat beat
you. You have to make Anthony Davis take a bigger offensive load than he
typically wants to and try to beat you single handedly. But do the Nuggets
have the personnel to do that, Because Jeremy Grant and Paul Millsap they're gonna
have, They're gonna have a lot of trouble keeping up with Lebron and the
possessions where Michael Porter Jr. Ends up on him. That's going to result
in roughly a four hundred offensive rating for the Los Angeles Lakers get I think
we're gonna see some Tory Craig on him, probably a lot of switching to
keep quicker players between him and the basket as best you can, but it's
that that's going to be the biggest challenge, and I think we will see
quite a few different looks from Mike Malone throughout this series. Yeah, the
Tory Craig wants a good mention because he was their most frequent defenders statistically on
Lebron James during the regular season, and Lebron shot four fifteen against him,
and so like, I don't think that's necessarily a harbinger of anything, but
I guess that's another body you can try and look at that point. If
it doesn't matter if he's not hitting his threes, if he's like making life
difficult on Lebron, he's just on the floor, and then you flesh out
your lineups around that. The other thing I'll say, too, is so
for Michael Porter Junior very quiet in Game seven, if he's going to come
off the bench, like he can really cook against some of those Lakers units.
But like, if he's on the floor when Davis and Lebron are at
the same time, like I feel like it becomes easier for Los Angeles to
target because you almost have just looking at those two guys specifically. I'm not
saying Michael Porter Junior will be on any of them, but you could.
Are you gonna be able to generate just switches more easily because if you can
attack Yokich in the pick and roll with Anthony Davis, or if then if
you can just run Lebron pick and roll with who's ever guarding Michael Porter Junior
or whoever Michael Porter Junior is guarding, that kind of gives the Denver Nuggets
two more vulnerable points. And so do you look at staggering like minutes stringently
where Michael Porter Junior is only playing when one or none of Lebron and a
d are on the floor, so basically just one of them being on the
floor. I don't know my overthinking that because maybe it just Denver has to
just go all offense everything. I also don't know. I'm just as you've
also mentioned too, which was something I was going to point out, it
feels like we're gonna get a lot of variety from Michael Malone, maybe more
so than usual in this series, and I'm really interested to see one what
he ends up doing, particularly is the series goes on and you're making adjustments,
and two how it ends up panning out. My other question to you
on this would be, though, how do you see the Lakers playing because
they went to the ad at the five model with against Houston because they had
to. First of all, took him too long to get there in my
opinion, but they had to. Do you stick with that or they because
you're going to see you know a lot of millsap Yokis minutes at the four
five or are you are we going to see a lot of dual big lineups
and then does that actually then benefit Denver? So before I answer that question,
I did just want to give a shout out to Michael Porter Jr.
Because after his ill advised postgame quote about wanting more touches and you know,
maybe we're giving the ball to Jamal Murray and Yokich too much. Who'd have
thought he wanted more shots of all people, The Nuggets could have cratered in
the locker room around that, but instead they reacted the right way, and
more importantly, Porter handled himself the right way after that. You know,
he got fewer touches following those remarks, and that did not stop him from
hitting a massive three pointer in Game five to keep the team alive. It
did not stop him from continuing to ex a bit all sorts of effort on
the glass, from playing at least more high energy defense. I hesitated to
say more effective defense, but he at least looked more engaged, and I
think it's it is a credit to him that he reacted to that, not
by disappearing, but by realizing that he needed to contribute in other ways and
then doing that. That was a big move for a rookie, and it
really helped spark that comeback. Yeah, I mean here, there were some
moments where he had like really good help defense in that second round series,
and so it's still I don't know that you could rely on that, but
maybe it does make him more playable in this series around. I mean,
look, they played him over fifteen minutes in Game seven, I believe,
when he wasn't even really scoring, and so the threat of him certainly matters.
Just someone who can I always forget how tall he is until I see
a defender closing out on him and he really hasn't released it yet, but
then he just shoots over them. Anyway, It's like, oh yeah,
Michael Porter Junior is like eight feet tall. The weight is finally over football
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all one word bet online. You're online sports book experts. What were your
thoughts on the lineup question now that I have were you? Yeah? So,
I think we've seen enough demonstrable evidence at this point that the Lakers are
at their best with Anthony Davis at the five, and that wasn't just a
product of a weird matchup with a funky Houston Rockets rotation. But that's how
they play best, you know. It allows them to get the most talent
on the court. It allows everyone to play to their most fundamental core strengths.
It works. I don't think we're going to see it, though,
because Davis is is hesitant to take on that role. I don't think he's
gonna want to be banging around with Yokich for the entirety of a what could
be a long series. And we're going to see minutes for JaVale McGee and
Dwight Howard that we just didn't see against Houston because Houston refused to play Tyson
Chandler for whatever reason. So yeah, I think that we will see more
of those dual big lineups, probably more than we should see them. And
if Frank Vogel does initially go with a Davis at the five lineup for a
significant chunk of Game one, then I'm going to have second thoughts about picking
this to go six games. I mean that's a fair point. So two
things before we kind of wrap up this Western Conference Finals preview, who the
who's the non star from each team that you're watching. I'll throw it to
you first with Denver. Who's a non star you're watching for that team?
You're gonna laugh, but it's Monte Morris for me. You know he's been
on He's been one of my favorite players for a while just because of the
way he plays. But I think that against this Lakers team, you have
to be able to win the reserve battle, and he is key to that
Denver bench. He can also play with the starters, and if he can
capitalize on a fairly weak guard rotation for the Lakers, just by avoiding making
mistakes, by setting up everyone by getting his own shots and hitting him efficiently,
that gives a huge spark because you have to win reserve verse, reserve
minutes, especially on those few stretches where Lebron is not on the court.
Yeah, that's a great point. I think mine would be Tory Craig,
if only because it feels like he might still get a majority of Lebron assignments.
And then if it's not Tory Craig, I guess it would be Jeremy
Grant. Like I wouldn't imagine we'd see too much Gary Harris there, so
just because of the sheer defensive workload that he'd be carrying. I go with
Craig. And look, if he's hitting like even if you can count him
to hit like one every one of his one one out of three from beyond
the arc, like one of every three of his three point attempts. That
might just be enough to just roll with him for lengthy minutes during this series.
And I guess maybe that's my I'm just very intrigued to see how in
this setting, how Denver you can probably get away with more stuff in the
postseason, maybe play it more conservatively, but you're gonna have to take more
gambles here. I'd think two cater to the offensive fit. And so I'm
more just intrigued by how Denver is gonna eventually go about defending Lebron. YEA,
who's your non star off the Lakers that you're watching. My initial answer
here is Vogel because of the rotation questions and where he's going to play Davis.
But if I have to pick a player, I think it's KCP,
who has has struggled a lot during the playoffs, which you know when we've
we've seen him struggle, we've seen him be invisible, and then you look
at the numbers and he's somehow shooting forty one point two percent on three pointers
while taking five per game, five point one per game. That has to
continue, and he can't be invisible, because I do think that this Nuggets
team is really going to prioritize getting the ball out of Lebron and Davis's hands
as much as possible. You know that Kyle Kuzma is going to be a
willing shooter. You can rely on Danny Green in postseason scenarios. If KCP
gives them another shooter on the perimeter who's going to demand defensive attention, they
get that much tougher to guard. And I think we're going to see him
having to deal with the Jamal Murray highlight reel on a regular basis. Yeah,
that's actually a really good way to look at it. I would have
Rondo just because the Lebron by the way, averaging under thirty five minutes per
game to the first two rounds of playoffs, which is actually pretty incredible hashtag
the Rockets failed. But the non Lebron minutes, whether it's going to be
five, eight, ten per game, like those are just so critical for
the Lakers, and he is going to be their best creator for everybody else
in those situations when Lebron isn't on the floor, and so if you can't
necessarily win those minutes. But kind of play them like dead. Even their
half court offense has struggled. Look, it's been lackluster for most of the
regular season even with Lebron on the court, fifty seven percent tile of half
court efficiency. It was like outside the teams like in this close to the
single digits, I believe when he was off the floor. And so that
just becomes a really big deal. And look, he played well through the
five appearances that he's made in the playoffs thus far, He's slashing fifty one
forty four from the floor. Can the shooting continue because the Denver's gonna leave
him open. Every team is still gonna leave Rondo open, and he's not
gonna hit those shots off the dribble. So that's that's still you know,
schemable. But if he's going to give you, you know, if he's
gonna hit those wide open threes to maybe where Denver has to even think about
defending him. And then again he helps you tread water without Lebron, that
makes this thing like super interesting. So I'm I can't believe that I'm talking
about in the year twenty and twenty, and I'm gonna be keeping my eye
on on Rondo. But here we are is a thing. But really I
think you can pick like any non Lebron and Davis players on the Lakers on
the Lakers team, and it's you can make a valid art. Well,
it's because of what I was saying before, where it's like I don't think
they have a consistent supporting cast, but they've consistently gotten a different member of
the supporting cast to step up, which helps. I did want to add
one note to what you were saying before. So the Nuggets have played fifty
two minutes this season when Anthony Davis is with Javan McGee on the court and
Yokich is also there, they're plus eighteen. So that's something to consider,
I think when there's not a large enough sample. I looked at it with
Dwight two, the Nuggets are minus four When Davis and Dwight are on the
court against Yokich, it's thirty five minutes. So there's that. But so
you're looking at let's just look at those net dual big situations with Yokich in
let's just say roughly ninety minutes of action, the Nuggets are a plus fourteen,
and so like that that's just might be something to that the Lakers are
going to have to consider us the series, whereas on is that perhaps they
can't win the dual big minutes when Yokich is on the floor for Denver,
because he's going to give you if you're in situations where he's able to defend
McGee or Dwight Howard and of Davis, or if you have one of them
defending him instead of Davis, that makes the Lakers just a little bit more
vulnerable. We are, by no means the first people to say that Davis
is best at the five. For sure, we'll be the latest. Are
you ready to so we're on the record once more. I have Nuggets and
Severn mostly out of sheepish stubbornness or just sheepishness, whatever you want to call
it. And I actually think that this is going to be a better series
than people are crediting. But maybe look if the if the Yoki Davis matchup
gets a little out of control until it's too far for the Lakers, that's
how I could see this really becoming a runaway series. Yeah, I'm gonna
stick with Lakers in six, but I think that those are going to be
competitive games, and that if you're picking the Nuggets, then you should because
they are every bit a legitimate contender. Let's dive into this mailbag, though,
so I'll go with the first question I'll take us through. This comes
from Steven Ahearn. He asks, is there another player who used to be
cringe worthy at three pointers but is now a sharpshooter just as much as smart?
Yeah? I mean, we have seen a history of those kind of
players developing over their careers. You know. You look at at like Rajon
Rondo who we were just talking about, where the first nearly decade of his
career he was in no way a quality three point shooter, but he's at
least been around or above the league average in the last handful of seasons because
he's worked on it. I think the most notable historic example is Jason Kidd,
who had absolutely no jumper to work with when he entered the league.
He shot twenty seven point two percent on threes as a rookie and consistently became
a forty plus percent shooter by the end of his career. There is evidence
of players being able to elevate that particular area of their game. I think
that virtually every NBA player is talented enough to do that it's just a question
of whether it makes sense for them to work on that particular facet of their
games versus others. So which is why we probably see more guards develop into
better shooters as their careers progress. But yeah, I mean, this is
in no way like some unprecedented leap from Marcus Smart. I think Jason Kader
is going to going to be the natural pick here. When you're looking at
historically someone else I'll throw out there, it would be Lebron James, even
just because he for the first part of his career it took him more than
a half it was closer to a decade to shoot above thirty four and a
half percent from three and now he's consistently since you know, so let's look
at it this way. So from two thousand and three to twenty eleven,
thirty two point nine percent from three and then since then this was his second
season with the Heat, so twenty twelve through now, even though he's been
under thirty five percent the past couple of years, during this time, he
still shot thirty five point eight percent from three and so that's not knockdown sharpshooter.
And I don't know that I would call Marcus Smart a sharpshooter just yet.
He did hit forty percent of us pull up threes during the regular season,
and he's shooting forty percent on catching shoot threes in the playoffs. We've
seen him decline in the playoffs two last year, after he had a good
three point shooting season, he shot subten percent in the postseason. So there's
a lot going on there. But I think that either of those might be
apt comparisons. And certainly the Lebron one totally a different type of player because
he was at least taking threes for most of his career, but the percentages
were just so shaky, you know, through the first seven seasons or so.
Yeah. We can also look at free throw percentage as an indicator of
shooting ability, you know. It's it's pretty commonly used when evaluating college prospects
to see if they have room to grow as a three point shooter, to
see if their three point percentage might be a little bit flukey. And with
Smart specifically, dating back to twenty fifteen sixteen, his sophomore season in the
NBA, he's been a seventy nine point five percent free throw shooter. Even
in college, he was at least competent from the line. As a freshman,
he shot seventy seven point seven percent as a sophomore seventy two point eight
percent. So even if the three pointers weren't there, when you bring into
the equation context and the demonstrated ability from the foul stripe, you know he
was a specially at Oklahoma State, and early on in his career he was
taking those more hero shots rather than playing within the flow of an offense.
As he's learned which shots to take, as he's gotten more comfortable operating within
the flow of the Boston offense, I think we're just starting to see those
those dormant skills starting to be realized. Let's move on to a question from
Chris Krause, friend of the Pod. Should the Sixers have signed Jimmy Butler
to the fifth year, passed on Al Horford, and brought back Julia Okrafre
to be their backup center? Oh wait, wrong room, But I'm going
to pose the question anyway. Yes, that's my answer, just a definitive
yes, Like obviously they should have brought back Jimmy Butler at this point,
like hindsight is twenty twenty, we all know that's how the saying goes.
But I mean, we've seen that this Al Horford experiment has not worked out,
and it's hard to imagine just how much more competitive this Sixers team would
have been with more years of Jimmy Butler, Ben Simmons, and Joel Embiid
growing together. I guess the better question would be, had they given him
the fifth year, would he still be in Philly? Because I still don't
feel like we fully understand whether it was a situation that they just didn't want
to pay him, or if he was just actually unhappy there wanted to be
in Miami. But if it actually was an issue of they didn't want to
give him the fifth year, well that's like objectively dumb. And I don't
even think that this isn't hindsight, like this is like that was just objectively
a bad decision at the time. If that was the case, Yeah,
yeah, I mean I've never gotten a sense that Jimmy Butler is a player
who needs to be in a certain city or with a certain organization so much
as he needs to win and he needs to be surrounded by people who share
that mentality, and maybe that was tough for him to deal with with Embiide,
who doesn't always keep himself in tip top shape, and with Ben Simmons,
who hasn't grown as some people have wanted him to, but winning is
the great panacea. And with another year together, who knows how far they
could have gone in the Eastern Conference playoffs. And I don't think it's in
any way unrealistic to think that he would have been there long term. We're
gonna actually stick with Jimmy Butler here, Sam Rapp says, Jimmy Butler TPA
by year, So let's start with his just gonna run through this. Start
with his rookie season in two thousand and twelve minus eight point six six TPA,
sophomore seventy five point four three, third year a one sixteen point eight
six. Next, the following season two twenty eight point three. The year
for that one ninety seven point three. That's two thousand and sixteen, two
thousand and seventeen three eighty four point eight, two, twenty eighteen two sixteen
point four, twenty nineteen one forty six point six. And then this year
he ranked ninth in TPA with two sixteen point six four. I believe that
was his second highest total in general, So Jimmy Butler has been it's kind
of been all over the place when you look at how often he's kind of
changed teams over the past two years, and he was dealing with injuries in
certain seasons. He's always just sort of been an impact player. And it's
funny that only his rookie year was he ever I tpa in net negative.
Yeah, and it is. It's fun to look at that progression too,
just because of what we know about his backstory and you know, just coming
coming to Marquette and thriving after experiencing homelessness, and you know, being the
thirtieth pick of the twenty eleven NBA Draft and only playing eight point five minutes
per game as a rookie and developing into this absolute full fledged superstar. So
you know, even if he's vacillated, he's vacillated within those upper echelons for
a while. Now. The next question comes from Syriac. Is RJ.
Barrett a real bust? Can we call anyone who is going through the New
York Knicks's developmental program a real bust? Or are they just like a bust
through sheer circumstance? But regardless, I mean, like We're talking about a
guy who averaged forty point three points in five revounds as a rookie playing for
just an atrocious team with ill fitting pieces that was giving him too many shots
and not supporting him. I'm hesitant to bury anyone after a rookie season,
but particularly given that context, I feel like it was hard to watch RJ.
Barrett with the Knicks this season in general. But it was also hard
to watch Barrett with the Knicks this season and not at least see flashes of
the potential that made him the third overall pick in the twenty nineteen draft.
Like you could. You could very clearly see the offensive talent just waiting to
be maximized with a more competent roster and staff around him. Look, the
I don't think you can came a bust. It's not even just the year
one stuff. They were just like, Hey, let's take this ball dominant
player whose jump shot is questionable and surrounded with a bunch of non shooters Like
that, I think it makes any sense from the start. It's that It's
as simple as that to me. And so if you put like, if
you put him in a different situation or just even let's keep him on the
Knicks, just surround with more shooting Mitchell Robinson, RJ. Barrett and three
actual shooters. I think he's in a much different situation. I don't think
he belonged on any of the all rookie teams. I people thought he was
snubbed, but he didn't belong there to me. And look, there were
some like he has just some nice like sort of methodical change of pace to
his game when he's when he's inside the yark that I actually thought that he
was a little bit better defensively, like really knew how to use his size
than I would have ever expected from him as a rookie, and particularly on
the Knicks. So he's not a bust by any means. But I do
think they run the risk of, I would say, at least curtailing his
value or sort of you know, just limiting his growth at least early on,
if they don't put more complimentary talent around him. He turned twenty in
June. I refuse to attach the bust label to anyone before they can legally
drink alcohol, just by rule. Next question comes from Paul Higham. He
asked, is there any precedence for the leap Murray has taken in the playoffs,
and how likely is it to be sustainable? Thanks for all the hard
work you guys, do we appreciate the last part. I have not done
enough research to have immediate names for these playoff leaps, even though we've definitely
seen players excel on expectedly in the past. But I don't even know if
it was that unexpected for Murray, Like there are elements of what he's doing
that are unsustainable. No one is going to shoot roughly seventy five percent on
poll up triples for a more sustained period, and that's hyperbolic, but only
barely. He's not gonna shoot close to fifty percent on threes in general long
term. But for a long time, we've seen this full package delivered in
these tantalizing flashes. He's always been a player who shoots the ball with extreme
confidence that is just utterly captivating. He has shown these these moments of brilliance
operating in pick and rolls and reverse pick and rolls with Nikolai Yokich. There
have been so many indications that this level of play was possible, and he's
now sustaining it better than we've seen throughout his career. So I don't think
that all of a sudden he's going to be this top ten, single handedly
series winning superstar. But I feel like these playoffs are are giving the Nuggets
more confidence that, yes, he can be that second piece to Yokich on
an actual championship winning team. Yeah. I actually looked for a while and
couldn't find apt comparisons. Two things that I think stand out is this doesn't
compare in the sense that Damal Murray's role with the Nuggets was already prominent,
But when you look at what happened with CJ McCollum, where he barely plays
during his sophomore regular season and then by necessity ends up getting a ton of
minutes through their five postseason performances and he really has a breakout, and then
that just ends up being a sustainable type of player that he is. And
the other thing that I'm drawn to is this is not postseason specific, but
look what happened to Victor Oladipo when he goes from Okac to Indiana and makes
that all NBA jump. I don't know if that proved sustainable, but the
extra responsibility that he was shouldering, coupled with I think just the progression of
time where that was his fifth season in the league and Jamal Murray's in a
similar circumstances, this is his fourth. This might all be it coming together.
And we saw even last year's playoffs like he he won them games.
They're also just Knights where he disappeared. And the fact that I think we've
seen more consistency from him in these postseason and then even when he wasn't necessarily
Let's look at Game seven in against Utah, like didn't have the most efficient
game, but he's They've also gotten more from him on defense, and so
I think what this is winding up being for Murray is a manifestation of what
he kind of already was, and he's just reaching a point where you can
do it more consistently. Do I expect this to be the level that he
plays at where you can say you know he's there are Knights where he's just
dead even in value with Yokis, like, I don't know you can expect
that during the during the regular season. I think even Game seven would be
a good example, just because of how Yokis was able to impact the game
even when he wasn't necessarily scoring at this highest clip, his defensive rebounding,
his passing is absurd. I also don't know that Denver's, especially during the
regular season, ever going to give Murray that type of influence over the offense.
He might be the CJ. McCollum type player in the sense where I
feel like McCollum is way more Importland, way more important to Portland once they
get to the playoffs, and I see Jamal Murray just looking at his value
as a similar player. Their styles are just so so different. He's a
better playmaker than CJ. McCollum is, but where he's just going to be
this hyper valuable player for them in the postseason, I think he's always going
to exceed his regular season value in these situations. I like that comparison a
lot. I do think that the rolling player ratings that we use at NBA
math are really telling for Murray because he's been you know, even though he
has or has had this reputation as an inconsistent but flammable scoring guard, he
has been very consistently inconsistent and that's reflected in his trajectory on those rolling player
ratings, because he tends to vacillate or between these these values that are pretty
the floor and the ceiling are pretty close to each other. But during the
bubble experience and during the actual playoff games just skyrocketing. And I think that's
what happens when, you know, you go from alternating between having one good
game and one bad game every set to having two good games and one mediocre
game. You know, we're seeing the inconsistency leave his game. That's the
biggest thing, you know, whether it's sustainable or not, just the fact
that that is going away is good news for the future. Our next question,
I agree with everything you say said just there. We'll wrap this up
with two one of which is a two part question, but is quick.
Lance Rodeo ask, can Yoki get a statue after the Nuggets win the next
eight games and has everyone submitted their application for the Nuggets bandwagon. I still
don't think. Look Yoki, if he's gonna have a statue in Denver,
it needs to be of I think, like him in the process of catching
the rebound with one hand and then throwing like one of those Waterfolo paths.
I was going to say the same thing, but it has to be like
the full court one. I don't know how you're going to mimic that,
Like, maybe you have to put the entire they have to make it a
statue of the entire court in front of him, so you could see another
player in a statue. That's who he's gonna hit. But that's the motion
I want to see, is the water polo pass if he gets a statue.
The other thing I'll add is I still don't think people buy into the
Nuggets as contenders. I think the Lakers are right to have been excited that
they pulled the Nuggets rather than the Clippers, at least on paper, But
given how Los Angeles has kind of just seemed dead in the eyes for so
long, maybe that's not actually true, but I do still feel like there's
a stigma against the Nuggets where they're considered these paper tigers more so than a
legitimate threat, which is an absolute wild thing to say, given that they're
in the conference finals. It's almost like the way people viewed Portland getting to
the conference finals a year ago, where it was like, well, you
know, good job, good effort, but this and this and this happened,
and now it's like, well, if the Clippers didn't collapse, and
you know, the Jazz had boy on Bogdanovich, and this wasn't you know,
a bubble with unprecedented circumstances. Are they in the conference finals? That's
what I feel like the actual prevailing sentiment is, whereas I actually feel like
it should be people trying to board the Nuggets bandwagon. I don't know who
could say they've always been here, because Nuggets stands have certainly not been here.
The expectation was not for them to go this far. I don't think
even people who picked them to win the title if they did, backed off
those stances. I'll raise my hand right now. So I don't know that
you know this is I think especially Nuggets fans, knew how good this team
was, but no one was picking them to get this far in the playoffs.
So I know that the statue question was at least somewhat tongue in cheek,
But I do think it's interesting to think about if Yokich is able to
deliver a title to this Denver organization that has never won a title. The
closest that they've come was in nineteen seventy six back in the ABA years,
when they lost in the finals. That they have not come within one series
of an NBA title. So if he is able to deliver that, then
all of a sudden, I think there is a very legitimate case to elevate
him above Danissel, above Alex English, above David Thompson, above Bobby Jones
as the absolute, unquestioned best player in Nuggets history. As for the bandwagon,
I think it's going to remain at least partially filled, but not full
for a while, just because you know they are very much going to enter
this series as in terms of popular perception at least as definitive underdogs, just
going against the NBA's most historic franchise or one of two most historic franchises against
a team led by Lebron James Like there, I don't think that, regardless
of how entertaining and impressive these last two series have been, I don't think
that there are people like lining up to jump on the Denver bandwagon, even
if they should be. So my follow up question to that to you,
Dan is how many wins does it take in this series to change that?
Like, if they win Game one, does the bandwagon fill up? Or
is there still this expectation that Lebron and the Lakers are going to win it.
It does it happen if they go up two oh two O would be
two oho, or if they win to the first three. I think that
would be that would just that would be where we have the bandwagon conversation.
That's fair. The last question is one you asked, but it spurred a
debate. You asked, is Jason Tatum a top ten player? It got
a slew of its own responses where they said, some of which were more
egregious than others, but the prevailing sentiment seemed to be he's either top fifteen
or top twenty, not top ten yet. I believe I had him at
number eleven for this past season when I ranked him for Bleacher Report. What
I think the factors that go into that is in a regular season, when
we get more Paul George, more joellenbad Maybe that's actually not a regular season
then, But Kyrie Irving's healthier, Kevin Durants there, Stephen Curry's healthier?
Is Jason Tatum in that top ten discussion, I'd probably be reticent to put
him there right now, but he is. He is close to me,
like he is just ridiculously close. Yeah, So I think, like if
we actually go through the names here, you know Lebron, James Kawhi,
Leonard Jannisana Da Cumbo, Stephen Curry, Anthony Davis, Nikolai Yokich, Luca
don Chich, and then I think the more interesting ones and James Harden as
well. In that unquestioned group that is one, two, three, four,
five, six, seven, eight names, I think. And then
the next two for me would be Damian Lillard and Kevin Durant, who I
just don't know where to place. Like, based on his history and his
reputation, he definitely deserves to be in that lock section, but I need
to see something post Achilles injury to actually have him in that lock group.
But that's that's ten names already, and then I think in that next tier
it's really crowded. We've got we've got Tatum, We've got Jimmy Butler,
We've got Chris Paul, We've got Paul George, Ben Simmons, Joe Lmbid,
Carl, Anthony Towns. There are a number of names who you can
at least make arguments for being placed ahead of those players who I mentioned at
the top. Tatum might be first in that group. At this point.
I think he's still just shy of the top ten. But I also think
you're fooling yourself if you don't think it's at least a discussion. Yeah.
Look, so where I think I would wind up. I think he needs
next season to actually get there unqualified amid this a full pool, and let's
just let's hope that we just have healthier star seasons. What I what I
will kind of say though, is well on he has the off the dribble
three pointer down, which is one of the most challenging but also probably the
most important shot I would argue in today's NBA, and he's hitting that.
He was above He's above forty percent in the PS comfortably, and he was
right around there for the regular season as well, was one of the most
efficient off the dribble three point shooters in the league. What, and we
know what he can do defensively too, Like he's probably gonna spend more time
on let's say the third best player than the first best player, but he
can really muck up things off the ball, and like you're like you can
like you if he switches like it's You're fine. So I think he's a
decidedly above average defender with I wouldn't be surprised if he made an All defense
team down the line. What's been most important to me is in the playoffs,
he's averaging four point three assist per game, and if that's like kind
of his new normal where yes, he's playing forty minutes to which actually his
forty minutes per game lead the playoffs, but he's at three point nine assists
per thirty six minutes, which is a pretty dramatic increase over the three point
two he averaged this past regular season. If you can see the uptick continue
to where he's going to be at four and a half close to five per
thirty six, like that might cement his status for me, And there's room
for him to have that type of role in Boston because you have Kemba,
but there's not really like that clear secondary facilitator after that, there's you know,
Marcus Smart, Gordon Hayward when he's healthy, Brad Wanamaker, but it's
more of this kind of committee thing and even just looking long term because Hayward
isn't on the books through next season right now, Wanamaker is a free agent
this year, like they're gonna need that, Like there's room for him to
be like that secondary go to guy as a passer, and I think that
he's shown that he can make the less obvious passes to be that guy.
We'll see if this is sustainable. We'll see if he has another you know
level to kick it up too. But if he does that, like that
is where I think he gets to solidify the top ten status, not just
in a season like the one we just had, but sort of unconditionally.
Well that in not getting blocked on game deciding dunk attempts in the playoffs.
Look, that's that's more of a freak bam out of bio things. My
wrist broke when I looked at that picture. If you look at the still
shot, it just broke, Like I don't know how he did that.
It's ridiculous. But that'll do it for us. We'll wrap it up here
sub an hour this time, unlike the past hour and a half to two
hour past we've been giving you, so I guess an apologies in order or
you're welcome. If you want to hear less of us please. As always,
though, remember to rate, review, and subscribe to Hardwood Knox on
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slash hardware Knox. And until next time, I leave you with the shout
out to the one the only should probably apparently be in the three point contest
next year, Marcus Smart. Let's call him the three and all the date
specialists like, maybe that's maybe that's how work you should go by, So
shout out to him. Nobody builds five G like Verizon builds five G because
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