WEBVTT 1 00:00:01.639 --> 00:00:07.160 A passionate instigator and dynamic problem solver. Doctor Kevin ross Emery, the host 2 00:00:07.200 --> 00:00:11.199 of the Doctor Kevin Radio Show. We'll be taking you outside the box, 3 00:00:11.480 --> 00:00:16.440 behind the curtain and identifying the load of bs we are fed every day. 4 00:00:16.679 --> 00:00:25.640 And now Doctor Kevin, Hello, Hello, Hello, and welcome to the 5 00:00:25.679 --> 00:00:31.000 Doctor Kevin Show. Here on Own Time, where we're changing the world. 6 00:00:31.719 --> 00:00:38.280 Wait for it, one own the Times and here on the Doctor Kevin Show. 7 00:00:38.399 --> 00:00:43.439 As always, we're gonna do a little hot topic, introduce our guest, 8 00:00:43.640 --> 00:00:48.280 get some feedback from them, and then we're going to be off and 9 00:00:48.439 --> 00:00:52.439 running. I'd like to remind you this is a live call in show, 10 00:00:53.000 --> 00:00:56.799 so if you would like to call in, you may call in and ask 11 00:00:56.920 --> 00:01:02.119 questions of tonight's guest on myself at two oh two by seven seven five seven. 12 00:01:02.479 --> 00:01:07.719 Again that's two o two five seven zero seven zero five seven. So 13 00:01:08.159 --> 00:01:11.680 for those of you who may be joining us for the first time, my 14 00:01:11.760 --> 00:01:15.359 first question is where the hell have you been? Why won't you hear earlier? 15 00:01:15.640 --> 00:01:19.120 Well, you're here now, so that's all that by It matters. 16 00:01:19.599 --> 00:01:22.640 So when I talk about a hot topic, it might be something that is 17 00:01:22.760 --> 00:01:26.040 warming the cockles of my heart or has me hot under the collar. We 18 00:01:26.120 --> 00:01:29.840 never know what's going to be until it comes out my mouth. Sometimes I 19 00:01:29.840 --> 00:01:30.959 don't know what it's going to be until it comes out my us. But 20 00:01:32.040 --> 00:01:36.120 that's how we roll here on the Doctor Kevin Show. So you know, 21 00:01:36.920 --> 00:01:41.439 tonight's hot topic is about double standards. There's a lot of double standards going 22 00:01:41.480 --> 00:01:47.680 on. You know, we have somebody who has been indicted. We have 23 00:01:47.840 --> 00:01:53.040 somebody who I don't know. I thought they were supposed to wear handcuffs and 24 00:01:53.079 --> 00:02:00.120 have mugshots. We have somebody that is having all these things happen to them 25 00:02:00.200 --> 00:02:07.000 because they were doing things. They are accused of doing things which basically said 26 00:02:07.000 --> 00:02:10.120 that they were above the law. And how are they being treated. They're 27 00:02:10.159 --> 00:02:15.080 being treated like they're above the law. They're not being treated like anybody else 28 00:02:15.159 --> 00:02:20.639 who has been accused, especially of a felony, a serious crime against the 29 00:02:20.680 --> 00:02:25.680 country. No, they're kind to be treated like you know, the stuff 30 00:02:25.719 --> 00:02:30.879 don't stake well, I think it stakes. I think that every American needs 31 00:02:30.919 --> 00:02:35.280 to be seen equal in front of the justice system, which means they get 32 00:02:35.319 --> 00:02:38.360 treated equal in front of the justice system. If they get found innocent, 33 00:02:38.439 --> 00:02:43.240 they're found innocents, if they're found guilty, they did the crime, you 34 00:02:43.280 --> 00:02:47.439 pay the time. But this double standard drives me crazy because we know it's 35 00:02:47.479 --> 00:02:53.159 all the playing of the game, and it's highlighting something that's been going on 36 00:02:53.240 --> 00:02:55.960 for hundreds of years, which we have a clast system in this country, 37 00:02:57.199 --> 00:03:00.240 whether we want to admit it or not. If you are wealthy, you 38 00:03:00.280 --> 00:03:05.599 can get away with more. If you are in politics, you get treated 39 00:03:05.639 --> 00:03:13.479 differently. Excuses are made and you somehow until you get really dragged down and 40 00:03:13.680 --> 00:03:16.039 nobody can deny it or will There'll always be some people to deny it, 41 00:03:16.080 --> 00:03:22.919 but you know that's their problem. They need to be treated equally and this 42 00:03:23.000 --> 00:03:24.960 is not happening in this country. And this is one of the problems with 43 00:03:25.039 --> 00:03:32.400 this country is we don't acknowledge what a double standard, cast like system we 44 00:03:32.479 --> 00:03:40.639 have. And if we dare point out that not everybody is being treated equally 45 00:03:40.680 --> 00:03:47.520 in this country, that maybe that when we pledge of allegiance where there's liberty 46 00:03:47.520 --> 00:03:52.400 and justice for all, we're kind of full of ship because there's not liberty 47 00:03:52.439 --> 00:03:55.599 and justice for all. We don't have liberty and justice for all. Who 48 00:03:55.680 --> 00:04:01.039 are you kidding? Are you black? No, we don't have liberty and 49 00:04:01.120 --> 00:04:04.280 justice for all. I refused to say it when I was in school. 50 00:04:04.360 --> 00:04:09.240 I would say we're striving for liberty and justice for all, because that's what 51 00:04:09.280 --> 00:04:15.280 we're doing, but only if we acknowledge we don't have it. So that's 52 00:04:15.520 --> 00:04:17.279 my hot under the caller. Also, I just want to make something very 53 00:04:17.279 --> 00:04:21.000 clear for those of you who go, oh, that's somebody that's woke. 54 00:04:21.879 --> 00:04:29.160 The opposite of woke is not anti woke. It's asleep. It's comatoset. 55 00:04:29.759 --> 00:04:36.519 It's called coma. Okay. It isn't anti woke, you know, and 56 00:04:36.839 --> 00:04:45.839 Uncle Freddie, it is asleep blind to the reality of the country we live 57 00:04:45.920 --> 00:04:49.120 in, with our heads so far up our eyes see out our teeth. 58 00:04:49.879 --> 00:04:54.800 That's what it is. So that said, that's my hot topic for the 59 00:04:54.920 --> 00:04:58.319 night. My guest is sitting there, going can I hang up? Now? 60 00:04:58.759 --> 00:05:01.560 I wasn't prepared for books, but I know that this is a man 61 00:05:01.680 --> 00:05:04.720 that craft's words all the time. I've known this man for a long time. 62 00:05:05.120 --> 00:05:09.600 I know that there is nothing I can do that's going to throw him 63 00:05:09.720 --> 00:05:15.040 off. His determination to tell us why he's fabulous by his book is fabulous, 64 00:05:15.199 --> 00:05:17.199 and both are true statements. So I don't have a problem with that. 65 00:05:17.680 --> 00:05:20.959 I think we should be loud, proud and true. When you're fabulous, 66 00:05:21.040 --> 00:05:24.720 you're fabulous, and this gift is fabulous. And when you write a 67 00:05:24.720 --> 00:05:28.560 fabulous book, you should say I wrote a fabulous book. Shouldn't hide it, 68 00:05:28.959 --> 00:05:30.879 shouldn't say oh, that's embarrassing, or you know. I don't want 69 00:05:30.920 --> 00:05:34.879 to be seen as having a big head, just specie as having the head 70 00:05:34.920 --> 00:05:42.319 you have. So Tonight's guest is Bill Stirling in his new book, Emotional 71 00:05:42.360 --> 00:05:46.800 Sobriety Solution. The title enough makes Me want to drink, but I had 72 00:05:46.800 --> 00:05:50.279 to stay sober. I guess just based on the title, provides a powerful 73 00:05:50.319 --> 00:05:55.959 and ground drinking understanding of everyday language, none of which you will ever hear 74 00:05:55.959 --> 00:05:59.920 on this show. We don't use everyday language which enables people to interact, 75 00:06:00.040 --> 00:06:03.720 communicate in a healthy, compassionate, and productive way. Over the last thirty 76 00:06:03.720 --> 00:06:09.639 seven years, Bill has been sharing the keys that unlock the secrets to how 77 00:06:09.759 --> 00:06:15.480 people thinking, behaving, and beliefs impact their quality of life. What began 78 00:06:15.720 --> 00:06:25.079 with his search to understand difficult personal interactions led to a consulting career that transforms 79 00:06:25.160 --> 00:06:30.079 personal relationships as well as the companies and executives who experience his work. I'd 80 00:06:30.079 --> 00:06:32.680 say, let's send him too, DC. Put him in Congress in the 81 00:06:32.680 --> 00:06:38.920 White House. There you go. That's what can we get a petition going? 82 00:06:39.399 --> 00:06:43.439 Suddain Bill, Door, Washington, Suddain Bill, Oh sorry. Bill 83 00:06:43.519 --> 00:06:47.759 has mastered a unique blend of emotional and intelligent expertise which accelerates the understanding of 84 00:06:47.839 --> 00:06:54.079 emotions and language and supports the ability to communicate effectively. People who work with 85 00:06:54.160 --> 00:07:00.160 him experience how simple changes in language dramatically improve every aspect of life. Bill. 86 00:07:00.959 --> 00:07:06.000 Welcome to the Doctor Kevin Show. Doctor Chevin, thank you so much 87 00:07:06.000 --> 00:07:12.800 for the introduction. I feel enthusiastic inspired to be here. Imagine what it's 88 00:07:12.839 --> 00:07:15.360 going to be like after you and I start going back and forth. Man, 89 00:07:15.439 --> 00:07:19.560 I'm bringing out my tennis racket so we can hit the ball back and 90 00:07:19.600 --> 00:07:27.319 forth from each other. Well, you know, when they're balls involved, 91 00:07:27.319 --> 00:07:31.000 I'm all about it. So the first thing you do is you get to 92 00:07:31.040 --> 00:07:36.920 invite on the hot topic. Please feel free to disagree with me. Let 93 00:07:36.959 --> 00:07:41.959 me know if you think that everybody gets the same shake in the country or 94 00:07:42.040 --> 00:07:46.120 not home. Actually, I really appreciate the hot topic of double standards and 95 00:07:46.360 --> 00:07:50.519 how do we really take a look at the rule of law and how does 96 00:07:50.639 --> 00:07:58.879 liberty injustice work. How do we do safety and fairness and equality back and 97 00:07:58.959 --> 00:08:03.279 forth with each other as well as you know, be able to hold the 98 00:08:03.439 --> 00:08:09.600 standards of this is what our integrity as a nation looks like. This is 99 00:08:09.639 --> 00:08:16.120 what the certainty of the rule of law looks like. And that's and I 100 00:08:16.160 --> 00:08:22.279 really appreciate the double standard because you get a chance to doctor Kevin to really 101 00:08:22.319 --> 00:08:28.959 just slow down and go like, can we do a better job of recognizing 102 00:08:30.560 --> 00:08:37.799 how people are using language and making decisions based on who the person is, 103 00:08:37.919 --> 00:08:41.440 how much money they have, how much respect and recognition, how many votes 104 00:08:41.480 --> 00:08:46.200 they can carry, instead of here's what the truth looks like, Here's what 105 00:08:46.279 --> 00:08:50.120 integrity looks like. Here does what the respect of a nation looks like. 106 00:08:50.440 --> 00:08:56.440 Here's what respect of law looks like. You know, And and regrettably we 107 00:08:56.559 --> 00:09:05.039 have a growing curve. It goes through in regards to the previous president and 108 00:09:05.399 --> 00:09:13.600 the current upcoming election. We definitely have to stand for integrity and Stanford truth 109 00:09:13.799 --> 00:09:18.679 and really fight for it this time. And you know, one of the 110 00:09:18.799 --> 00:09:22.919 things that I know, you know, Bill, is you know, I've 111 00:09:22.279 --> 00:09:26.600 one of the things I've been doing is working for the last thirty three years 112 00:09:26.679 --> 00:09:31.519 as a relationship catalyst. And this whole concept of double standards, I'm sure 113 00:09:31.600 --> 00:09:37.559 has to come up in your book because communications are fraud with people using language 114 00:09:39.159 --> 00:09:48.120 that unchecked does set up within the communication a kind of greater than lesser than 115 00:09:48.440 --> 00:09:54.360 double standard type of situations. I mean, it has to be in your 116 00:09:54.399 --> 00:09:58.600 book. Talk to me about that. Absolutely. One of the biggest challenges 117 00:09:58.720 --> 00:10:07.039 that I've experienced in writing the book is to try to simplify what is it, 118 00:10:07.120 --> 00:10:11.399 what is it going to take to really create the quality of connection that 119 00:10:11.440 --> 00:10:15.080 we need to break down the double standards that are in front of us. 120 00:10:15.519 --> 00:10:18.759 And one of the first things that I offer in the book is a simple 121 00:10:20.240 --> 00:10:24.440 phrase, empathy before problem solving. So a lot of times when we go 122 00:10:24.480 --> 00:10:30.840 to problem solving first, we're solving the wrong thing, and we need to 123 00:10:31.200 --> 00:10:37.120 get one, two or three lines of empathy before we start to try and 124 00:10:37.240 --> 00:10:41.279 to fix something because or otherwise we'll get stuck into a double standard. We'll 125 00:10:41.279 --> 00:10:46.159 be solving the wrong thing, will be down the wrong streets, and meanwhile, 126 00:10:46.600 --> 00:10:50.879 the answer could be brought to us if we just stay and listen to 127 00:10:52.159 --> 00:10:58.480 better and we're more compassionate and empathetics to each other. Well, I know 128 00:10:58.679 --> 00:11:03.639 that in my work and times I work with individuals to try to help them 129 00:11:03.879 --> 00:11:11.480 actually learn the language of their partner, and we oftentimes don't recognize that each 130 00:11:11.519 --> 00:11:16.960 person actually has their own unique language i e. Definition for the words they're 131 00:11:16.080 --> 00:11:20.039 using, and oftentimes that can cause some of the problems. Talk to me 132 00:11:20.679 --> 00:11:26.120 about how that plays out in your book and in your work. So that's 133 00:11:26.159 --> 00:11:30.879 a great that's a great example. For example, many times people will say 134 00:11:30.919 --> 00:11:33.440 a sentence, this sentence is not true, but I'm going to say the 135 00:11:33.480 --> 00:11:39.440 sentence. For example, a trauma pattern might sound like this, my dad 136 00:11:39.600 --> 00:11:46.879 abandoned me. I felt abandoned by my dad. Now there's a problem there, 137 00:11:46.360 --> 00:11:52.559 because the first problem is the word abandoned is not a ceiling. It's 138 00:11:52.600 --> 00:12:01.000 a mental projection of what you think someone did to you. Gives the power 139 00:12:01.000 --> 00:12:05.679 to the event, and it gives power to the other person. It literally 140 00:12:05.720 --> 00:12:13.399 takes the power away from the speaker. Show a double bind. The word 141 00:12:13.519 --> 00:12:20.200 abandoned, although it might be a description, it's not something you can heal 142 00:12:20.320 --> 00:12:24.960 from the way it's written and spoken, and it's something that you're not that 143 00:12:26.080 --> 00:12:33.840 you can't move through unless you change it to I felt sad when my dad 144 00:12:33.919 --> 00:12:39.039 left the way he did because my need for connection with him wasn't met. 145 00:12:39.919 --> 00:12:48.879 I felt helpless because my need for fairness wasn't met because I didn't have the 146 00:12:48.919 --> 00:12:52.639 time I needed to spend with him to see how I could get healing there. 147 00:12:52.720 --> 00:12:58.519 But the word abandoned is almost like something that handcuffs us to a label 148 00:13:00.080 --> 00:13:05.919 diagnosis instead of a language of compassion. So that's a that's just one of 149 00:13:05.919 --> 00:13:11.120 a miss list of many words and phrases that I take a part in the 150 00:13:11.120 --> 00:13:18.759 book so that the reader can be able to rewrite their traumatic story and write 151 00:13:18.799 --> 00:13:28.679 an empowering story and set a forward motion intention or a vision for themselves away 152 00:13:28.720 --> 00:13:37.879 from their path. So so if you were to say I felt angry when 153 00:13:37.919 --> 00:13:41.720 the jackass dump to me, that would be a healthier statement. That's that 154 00:13:43.080 --> 00:13:46.000 whenever a label sells up, jackass is a good way to And so every 155 00:13:46.120 --> 00:13:50.960 label that I that comes out of a person's mouth, I chuckle a little 156 00:13:50.960 --> 00:13:54.559 bit because the way I define a label is an interesting place to start. 157 00:13:56.080 --> 00:14:00.559 So if somebody says narcissists, that's an interesting place to start, or their 158 00:14:00.639 --> 00:14:05.320 bipolar it's an interesting place to start. It's not the end of the narrative, 159 00:14:05.360 --> 00:14:11.279 it's the start of the narrative. So asshole means he didn't meet the 160 00:14:11.279 --> 00:14:15.000 need for kindness. He didn't meet the need for physical safety, he didn't 161 00:14:15.039 --> 00:14:20.559 meet the need for truth or trust, he didn't need the need for integrity. 162 00:14:20.879 --> 00:14:26.200 Those are good reasons why the world's asshole is an interesting label. But 163 00:14:26.360 --> 00:14:31.639 notice, if I talk about my dad not being an integrity, people will 164 00:14:31.679 --> 00:14:35.480 deepen with me. If I talk about how my dad didn't meet my need 165 00:14:35.559 --> 00:14:41.120 for kindness, people will provide me comfort and kindness because that's what my dad 166 00:14:41.159 --> 00:14:46.840 didn't give me. Asshole gives power. Although funniest crap at the beginning, 167 00:14:46.600 --> 00:14:52.679 and it dispenses a lot of cortisol and adrenaline, it doesn't help us in 168 00:14:52.679 --> 00:14:58.559 the healing process. It is a great way to to start the label and 169 00:14:58.639 --> 00:15:03.879 diagnose somebody, and it's an interesting place to start. And the answer is 170 00:15:03.919 --> 00:15:07.799 what kind of asshole was he? You know? And he wasn't a respect 171 00:15:07.840 --> 00:15:11.279 asshole or was he a fairness asshole? What kind was it? So I 172 00:15:11.399 --> 00:15:16.519 find it very interesting that I said jackass and you took his asshole, So 173 00:15:16.240 --> 00:15:22.320 somehow that is a good thing. Because that's one of my go to words. 174 00:15:22.360 --> 00:15:24.320 That's right, that's right, that's a good point. Yeah, Jack 175 00:15:24.399 --> 00:15:31.360 got this, So that's very very funny. That's why we have a lot 176 00:15:31.399 --> 00:15:37.000 of good time. We talked to it right there. It's you know, 177 00:15:37.720 --> 00:15:43.600 sometimes it's the gateway and I want to get your kind of your feedback and 178 00:15:43.639 --> 00:15:46.840 how you address this in the book. And then I do have to jump 179 00:15:46.879 --> 00:15:50.639 back to the word empathy, but we're not going to jump there yet, 180 00:15:50.720 --> 00:15:54.879 So they're just gonna put a pin in it, okay, and hopefully it 181 00:15:54.879 --> 00:15:58.639 doesn't hit either one of us because we've both been known to be full of 182 00:15:58.639 --> 00:16:06.360 hot air. So is that you know, one of the things that I 183 00:16:06.519 --> 00:16:15.320 that I found powerful is establishing, initially with anybody, do you need to 184 00:16:15.360 --> 00:16:17.879 say it the way you need to say it, or do you need to 185 00:16:17.919 --> 00:16:22.360 say it the way they need to hear it? And sometimes the way they 186 00:16:22.399 --> 00:16:26.799 need to hear it is that work that you need to do with your inner 187 00:16:26.840 --> 00:16:34.240 traumatized self so that they can put the trauma behind them. But that sometimes 188 00:16:34.799 --> 00:16:37.200 we first of all just need to say it the way we need to say 189 00:16:37.200 --> 00:16:41.080 it. Go ahead, say it, get it out, feel good about 190 00:16:41.120 --> 00:16:48.120 it. Tell me how big Jack has on me. Great, now let's 191 00:16:48.120 --> 00:16:52.120 get some real work done. Feel better. I'm feeling ahead. Yeah, 192 00:16:52.200 --> 00:16:56.679 yeah, And I really appreciate the framing that you put on that one, 193 00:16:56.759 --> 00:17:04.200 because how we need to say it is the discharge of the emotional load that's 194 00:17:04.279 --> 00:17:08.359 inside our body. That's called how we need to say it, how they 195 00:17:08.400 --> 00:17:18.799 need to hear it is us concentrating on how much of receptivity would I like 196 00:17:18.960 --> 00:17:22.000 that person to experience. Do I want them to receive it or do I 197 00:17:22.079 --> 00:17:26.720 want to bring them the fire breathing dragon. Because if I bring them the 198 00:17:26.720 --> 00:17:30.880 fire breathing dragon, they're just going to pull defensiveness and withdraw and they're going 199 00:17:30.920 --> 00:17:37.880 to tap out, or they will bring criticism and contempt and they're going to 200 00:17:37.960 --> 00:17:42.720 bring their fire breathing dragon out for a spin. So so those two things 201 00:17:42.920 --> 00:17:49.200 are really, really very important. So if I'm if I want to relieve 202 00:17:49.319 --> 00:17:53.720 my own cortisol and adrenaline in my body, it's probably better if I do 203 00:17:53.880 --> 00:17:59.400 anger with somebody that's safe and as a close friend, rather than bringing the 204 00:17:59.480 --> 00:18:03.559 anger to a person and said, what the person I need to speak to 205 00:18:03.119 --> 00:18:08.920 is, I'm going to get them in touch with how they affected my experience 206 00:18:10.720 --> 00:18:15.880 and the accountable for how they affected my experience. But also say to them, 207 00:18:17.160 --> 00:18:21.920 don't go across that line again. You cross the line. It didn't 208 00:18:21.920 --> 00:18:25.720 meet my need for integrity and trust. It's going to take me a while 209 00:18:25.839 --> 00:18:30.680 to rebuild integrity and trust with you. So now we've got a big of 210 00:18:30.720 --> 00:18:33.680 a challenge between the two of us. Now it's between the two us. 211 00:18:34.000 --> 00:18:41.839 I just changed a adversarial language into a language of collaboration and cooperation. It 212 00:18:42.000 --> 00:18:48.759 just said we need to restore trust and integrity. I could have hung it 213 00:18:48.839 --> 00:18:52.000 on them, Hey, you need to fix it. No, no, 214 00:18:52.000 --> 00:18:57.519 no, I'll define what integrity and trust is. I'll make it clear of 215 00:18:57.640 --> 00:19:06.000 where the the restoration and the repair is. At the same time, you 216 00:19:06.119 --> 00:19:08.599 got to come my way. I'm coming a little bit with your way, 217 00:19:08.640 --> 00:19:17.000 but I'm also not bringing the blame and same game into the experience. I'm 218 00:19:17.039 --> 00:19:21.559 just going we got to fix this. And so that's a That's the wonderful 219 00:19:21.640 --> 00:19:26.240 thing about the way you just reframed it, Doctor Kem is fantastic. So 220 00:19:26.039 --> 00:19:33.519 now so one the response is who be we cowboy? As Tonto said, 221 00:19:36.839 --> 00:19:41.440 what do you do? What do you do? That's a great pushback if 222 00:19:41.519 --> 00:19:47.799 the pushback in the narrative sounds like what is the who's the WI in this? 223 00:19:48.440 --> 00:19:52.400 Then I'm gonna I'm going to getly follow on the sword and demonstrate how 224 00:19:52.440 --> 00:19:56.799 to do that so they can be humble too. I would say it the 225 00:19:56.839 --> 00:20:00.799 following sentence, So you feel frustrated, you'd like me to take more acountability? 226 00:20:00.279 --> 00:20:03.319 Is that correct? Now? They don't know. I just put them 227 00:20:03.359 --> 00:20:07.799 on the hook for accountability, by the way, because I pulled the accountability 228 00:20:08.200 --> 00:20:11.920 out and say, yeah, you would like me to have some accountability. 229 00:20:12.319 --> 00:20:17.720 Here's the accountability I like to see. Is that something you can meet? 230 00:20:18.559 --> 00:20:22.039 And then the person's going rut row, you know. Look, it's like 231 00:20:22.200 --> 00:20:26.440 the accountability is coming out, and then you're moving your way out of the 232 00:20:26.480 --> 00:20:32.279 double standards that the person might be trying to force you into, and you're 233 00:20:32.359 --> 00:20:38.359 dragging them into the place of mutuality, equality, mutual respect for you as 234 00:20:38.400 --> 00:20:45.519 another human being, and you're pulling them where they need to be for where, 235 00:20:47.119 --> 00:20:56.160 for where both parties could be acknowledged as sharing the same type of justice 236 00:20:56.279 --> 00:21:00.799 or the same type of fairness in communication. Accountability is a big part of 237 00:21:00.839 --> 00:21:10.279 that. That's what I would recommend. You know, sometimes you know, 238 00:21:10.680 --> 00:21:19.480 it can come to the table with your accountability and a request for them to 239 00:21:19.599 --> 00:21:23.160 join you in the middle of the river. But sometimes you have to also 240 00:21:23.720 --> 00:21:32.720 get an agreement that there's a goal that something needs to happen. I'm sure. 241 00:21:33.839 --> 00:21:37.319 Yeah, that whole idea of a goal is really is important because the 242 00:21:37.359 --> 00:21:41.480 goal changes to a value or a need that both people have in common or 243 00:21:41.519 --> 00:21:45.079 they both would want it, and then that can that can be helpful. 244 00:21:45.359 --> 00:21:48.359 You know, sometimes it's hard to get it, you know, because if 245 00:21:48.440 --> 00:21:53.720 something really terrible has happened, then it's it can be really challenging. So 246 00:21:55.440 --> 00:21:59.160 for example, when I did a mediation in Slint, Michigan during the water 247 00:21:59.240 --> 00:22:03.680 crisis, and I came in there and there's seventy five people in the room, 248 00:22:03.759 --> 00:22:07.640 there's some angry people in the room, you think, you know, 249 00:22:07.799 --> 00:22:12.799 and because some people are angry because the need for fairness wasn't met. Other 250 00:22:12.799 --> 00:22:18.000 people are angry because the need for justices it might not be met. Some 251 00:22:18.119 --> 00:22:22.640 people had it around respect, some people had it around equality. Why did 252 00:22:23.079 --> 00:22:30.920 the why did the polluted water go over here? So again that unsettledness is 253 00:22:30.920 --> 00:22:36.480 is that we've got to do some things language wise to go bad things happen, 254 00:22:37.559 --> 00:22:41.640 but we have the ability to address, clean up, restore to the 255 00:22:41.640 --> 00:22:48.599 best of our abilities some of these greater challenges that we're facing now. It's 256 00:22:48.640 --> 00:22:53.240 interesting you use slip Michigan because I thought I recently read that that problem still 257 00:22:53.240 --> 00:23:00.319 hasn't gone away. They are still in the process of restoration. It would 258 00:23:00.359 --> 00:23:06.039 have been quicker if federal money was spent to restore the city, but it 259 00:23:06.119 --> 00:23:10.160 was not the way I would have liked it to be. And there has 260 00:23:10.240 --> 00:23:14.240 been elements of justice that have been taken place. Some of the elements of 261 00:23:14.319 --> 00:23:23.039 justice might be not the help to the level of accountability of the trauma and 262 00:23:23.240 --> 00:23:30.400 the kind of the lingering problems inside the city that needs to take place. 263 00:23:30.920 --> 00:23:37.640 And that's a part of both the legal system as well as a part of 264 00:23:38.480 --> 00:23:44.680 our willingness as human beings to step up and say we're going to right the 265 00:23:44.759 --> 00:23:49.200 wrong. We're going to fix it. This person made or committee made a 266 00:23:49.279 --> 00:23:57.799 terrible choice, and the great are greater. The way we handle these things 267 00:23:57.839 --> 00:24:03.519 as a nation is you step in and fix certain things. Mistakes people make 268 00:24:04.759 --> 00:24:15.240 because of they're limited ability to see and check in with themselves and say no, 269 00:24:15.039 --> 00:24:19.559 I'm not desting the water over there to save money, because it's going 270 00:24:19.640 --> 00:24:23.640 to pollute and cause a lot of problems over here. I'm not doing that 271 00:24:23.720 --> 00:24:27.000 to save money. We have to figure out a way to pay for this 272 00:24:27.960 --> 00:24:33.519 that they not save money or not make this choice, because it's not one 273 00:24:33.559 --> 00:24:37.319 that's a healthy choice for our city and our community and those people that are 274 00:24:37.359 --> 00:24:42.359 involved, you know. And it's a rulely often. And isn't this just 275 00:24:42.559 --> 00:24:48.240 another example though, of what we were talking about earlier, is when double 276 00:24:48.319 --> 00:24:52.440 standards come in. As long as my kids get good water and are not 277 00:24:52.759 --> 00:24:57.000 getting sick, well, your kids are not as important because of the part 278 00:24:57.039 --> 00:25:03.079 of town you come from, or your poverty level, or your race or 279 00:25:03.200 --> 00:25:10.759 all sorts of things. Yeah, so true, so true, And we 280 00:25:10.839 --> 00:25:15.160 can we can do this and and a micro level like and a medium sized 281 00:25:15.240 --> 00:25:19.200 level, and we can also do at a macro level of how do we 282 00:25:19.319 --> 00:25:27.400 as human beings really fight for you know, certain standards of ours whereas other 283 00:25:27.480 --> 00:25:33.119 people are saying, no, this is my identity. I see my identity 284 00:25:33.200 --> 00:25:36.799 as this, and I'm willing to die for that identity. It's like that 285 00:25:37.000 --> 00:25:45.000 identity that you're going for isn't really congruent to this up the way things have 286 00:25:45.279 --> 00:25:51.160 changed. Things have changed, and people struggle with changed. I mean, 287 00:25:51.240 --> 00:25:55.599 that's doctor Kevin. That's one of the hardest things is that our brain is 288 00:25:55.720 --> 00:26:00.960 wired for safety. It's not wired for change. It's why for protection. 289 00:26:00.559 --> 00:26:10.240 It's not wired for growth. It's more wired for stability rather than creativity. 290 00:26:10.279 --> 00:26:15.799 It's more wired. It doesn't mean that creative people don't have an extensive access 291 00:26:15.839 --> 00:26:19.279 to creativity. Yeah they do. But it's also there's a part of the 292 00:26:19.359 --> 00:26:23.799 brain that goes well, once I learn how to drive, I'm not going 293 00:26:23.920 --> 00:26:30.480 to change, you know, my my driving patterns because I wor about it, 294 00:26:30.720 --> 00:26:34.559 because this is the thing about driving, you know, or any other 295 00:26:36.160 --> 00:26:42.200 habitual behavior that that and doctor Evan, you really help people with helping them 296 00:26:42.480 --> 00:26:48.000 through the change and you know the struggle that people change as they try to 297 00:26:48.640 --> 00:26:53.319 rewrite their limbic brain and try to use the front part of the brain to 298 00:26:53.400 --> 00:26:59.200 rewrite it. You know, it's kind of like an elephant is the limbic 299 00:26:59.279 --> 00:27:02.440 brain, and there's a little writer with the stick on top of it, 300 00:27:02.599 --> 00:27:06.240 just tapping the brain a little bit right or a little bit left. And 301 00:27:07.079 --> 00:27:14.200 you and I have spent time try to help people transform their habit patterns transform 302 00:27:14.359 --> 00:27:18.240 the way they see the world. And that's one of the kind of the 303 00:27:18.319 --> 00:27:22.200 gifts that you're bringing into the world, as well as the gifts that I 304 00:27:22.359 --> 00:27:27.079 bring the world regarding language, how do we speak and think better? So 305 00:27:27.400 --> 00:27:30.880 I'm gonna ask you a question, and I know we're going to get to 306 00:27:30.920 --> 00:27:33.759 break music in any moment, but I'm going to try to get this question 307 00:27:33.839 --> 00:27:41.000 out for you to cogitate on on our break is I think that the the 308 00:27:41.480 --> 00:27:51.480 the ability to adapt to change is directly can be directly linked to the ability 309 00:27:51.559 --> 00:27:56.599 to be fully present. I think when we are less on autopilot and we 310 00:27:56.720 --> 00:28:03.480 are more fully present and actually interacting with the world in a present way, 311 00:28:04.640 --> 00:28:14.319 that we better train ourselves for big change because in being actually fully present, 312 00:28:14.400 --> 00:28:19.079 which most people are not, they ignore all the little changes. But if 313 00:28:19.119 --> 00:28:25.960 you're actually taking in the little changes, I think you start to train your 314 00:28:26.000 --> 00:28:32.640 brain to be more open and resilient and flexible with big change. And there's 315 00:28:32.680 --> 00:28:34.640 our music. I'm going to let you conjucate on that question. We'll be 316 00:28:34.759 --> 00:28:45.200 back in a moment with the author of Emotional Sobriety, Bill Sterley. Conscious 317 00:28:45.279 --> 00:28:52.519 Media for Conscious Minds O Times host your show on IOMFM, the radio network 318 00:28:52.599 --> 00:28:56.599 of Home Times Media, one of the more recognized brand names in the conscious 319 00:28:56.640 --> 00:29:02.319 community and is backed by the extensive marketing reach of Home Times. Hosting a 320 00:29:02.400 --> 00:29:08.519 show on IMFM immediately connects you with our extensive, dedicated community. Vox Novas 321 00:29:10.079 --> 00:29:18.480 the New Voice. Vox Novas the New Dimension. Vox Novas thought and movement 322 00:29:18.640 --> 00:29:22.720 leaders who will share from their experience and offer tools to help us navigate our 323 00:29:22.960 --> 00:29:30.000 rapidly changing world. My name is Victor Furman. Join me every Thursday at 324 00:29:30.079 --> 00:29:37.440 eight pm Eastern on Home Times Radio for Vox Novas the New Voice. Ascending 325 00:29:37.559 --> 00:29:42.640 Hearts is no ordinary dating site, but a spiritual dating site with a purpose 326 00:29:44.200 --> 00:29:48.440 to link you with your soulmate. We engineer the serendipity so you can trust 327 00:29:48.680 --> 00:29:52.519 that you will attune with someone that has the same matching vibration as you. 328 00:29:53.359 --> 00:29:59.759 Ascending Hearts the conscious dating site for the spiritually aware. Try Ascending Hearts for 329 00:30:00.000 --> 00:30:04.640 Ascending hearts dot com. If I could be you and you could be me 330 00:30:06.039 --> 00:30:08.960 for just one hour, if you could find a way to get inside each 331 00:30:10.079 --> 00:30:14.480 other's mind. Welcome mile in my Shoes. Welcome Mile in my Shoes. 332 00:30:15.160 --> 00:30:19.960 Shoes. We've all felt left out and for some that feeling lasts more than 333 00:30:21.000 --> 00:30:25.400 a moment. We can change that learn how it belonging begins with us dot 334 00:30:25.559 --> 00:30:30.279 org. Brought to you by the ACT Council. Welcome Out in My Shoes. 335 00:30:40.680 --> 00:30:44.039 Hello, Hello, Hello, and welcome back to the Doctor Kevin Show. 336 00:30:44.440 --> 00:30:48.000 I am on today with Bill Sterley. Bill's newest book is called The 337 00:30:48.440 --> 00:30:55.440 Emotional Sobriety Solution. Bill, can you tell us where people can find your 338 00:30:55.559 --> 00:31:00.359 book? Thanks for thanks for a pointing it out, Doctor Kevin. The 339 00:31:00.440 --> 00:31:08.480 book can be found on Amazon. It's The Emotional Sobriety Solution and the We 340 00:31:08.640 --> 00:31:17.680 had a wonderful lunch of the book and within three days we had Just recently 341 00:31:17.799 --> 00:31:22.359 we had over six hundred books move out into the market and it's kind of 342 00:31:22.440 --> 00:31:27.160 like we've hit number one on Amazon over this five day period. It's just 343 00:31:27.240 --> 00:31:33.279 so exciting to get this information out to people so that they can not be 344 00:31:33.480 --> 00:31:40.640 so overreactive to the emotions that are sewing up in their bodies and learn how 345 00:31:40.680 --> 00:31:45.240 to use emotions for what they're meant for. And that's one of the things 346 00:31:45.319 --> 00:31:48.160 I cover in the book is what are our emotions meant for what are what's 347 00:31:48.200 --> 00:31:55.720 the purpose of our emotions? And and doctor Kevin, one of the things 348 00:31:55.799 --> 00:32:00.200 that I really try to get people to do is to change one small beliefs 349 00:32:00.279 --> 00:32:07.440 that they have. And the the small belief is, and it's really very 350 00:32:07.559 --> 00:32:12.400 difficult to change this one that it's that there is no such thing as a 351 00:32:12.519 --> 00:32:17.960 good or bad feeling, that there is no such thing as a positive or 352 00:32:19.160 --> 00:32:23.920 negative feeling. We've got to set that belief aside and replace it with this 353 00:32:24.160 --> 00:32:30.519 belief. Feelings are only indicators. So doctor Kevin, if you stub your 354 00:32:30.559 --> 00:32:37.680 toe, you're going to feel pain in your toe, and it's because your 355 00:32:37.759 --> 00:32:44.119 need for comfort is not met. Pain is necessary for you to protect yourself. 356 00:32:44.279 --> 00:32:47.920 You need that. If somebody doesn't meet your need for respect, then 357 00:32:49.039 --> 00:32:52.160 anger might be the right feeling to come up in your body or aggravated. 358 00:32:53.079 --> 00:32:59.680 So the feeling is only the indicator. And to have to have people start 359 00:33:00.119 --> 00:33:07.480 seeing an experiencing their feelings as indicator. They start becoming more present in the 360 00:33:07.599 --> 00:33:14.759 moment and they are looking down at the dashboard of their life, of their 361 00:33:14.880 --> 00:33:19.240 car, and then when the oil light comes on, it's like, oh, 362 00:33:19.359 --> 00:33:22.519 yeah, I do feel tired, I do need rest. Oh yeah, 363 00:33:23.160 --> 00:33:30.400 I do feel irritated. I really needed support from my coworker. This 364 00:33:30.640 --> 00:33:38.279 idea that feelings are only indicators changes the way we see empathy. You know, 365 00:33:38.519 --> 00:33:45.319 to carry somebody else's feelings that's theirs. Being able to contribute to their 366 00:33:45.400 --> 00:33:49.160 needs can make a big difference. So I don't know how to sit with 367 00:33:49.240 --> 00:33:52.200 you, but it actually answers a little bit of the question that you asked 368 00:33:52.319 --> 00:33:58.920 me before the break. Okay, connect those dots, because I have three 369 00:33:59.000 --> 00:34:04.400 more questions. Okay, let me connect the dots, so you asked before 370 00:34:04.480 --> 00:34:12.800 the break. Being more aware, being more present in a moment allows for 371 00:34:13.000 --> 00:34:19.559 greater opportunity for us as human beings. If we start seeing feelings as indicators 372 00:34:20.400 --> 00:34:23.880 to our needs being med and not being met, then we can start changing 373 00:34:24.760 --> 00:34:34.599 ourselves from being a numb nice dead person or a volatile monster person, which 374 00:34:34.679 --> 00:34:38.039 is currently what's in the environment. If you haven't noticed that detail, people 375 00:34:38.119 --> 00:34:42.440 go nice dead person, monster person, nice dead person, monster person, 376 00:34:42.559 --> 00:34:46.760 nice person, monster person, and you can watch them go from victrum to 377 00:34:47.639 --> 00:34:53.719 violent streamer, and it's like, oh my gosh, and that's a person 378 00:34:53.840 --> 00:35:00.159 that's not very present and it's not very engaged. There's just meeting their needs 379 00:35:00.199 --> 00:35:05.719 at the expense of others. So that's there's one way to draw those dots 380 00:35:05.760 --> 00:35:17.599 together. So do you I had to say, agree or disagree, but 381 00:35:17.760 --> 00:35:24.800 do you think that there is truth in the more present person develops better skill 382 00:35:24.880 --> 00:35:30.480 sets to deal with change. That's correct, That's that's true. The more 383 00:35:30.639 --> 00:35:34.559 present you are, you have more skill set to develop change. And one 384 00:35:34.599 --> 00:35:42.679 of those doors that is accessible is how well can I empathize with myself what 385 00:35:42.920 --> 00:35:47.119 is going on inside me, or empathize with somebody somebody else that's going on 386 00:35:47.239 --> 00:35:53.440 inside them, And that becomes a present moment that integrates the brain, that 387 00:35:53.559 --> 00:36:00.599 allows us to be greater presence. Because Kevin, I really dr Kevin, 388 00:36:00.639 --> 00:36:06.679 I really felt excited and energized because I knew that you and I are going 389 00:36:06.760 --> 00:36:10.599 to be able to contribute to your audience. I knew how much value this 390 00:36:10.800 --> 00:36:15.639 had. So what's alive in me, what's very present in me, is 391 00:36:17.440 --> 00:36:22.800 acknowledging and knowing how much you contribute to your audience when you get on with 392 00:36:22.920 --> 00:36:27.920 them. And for me to be able to share the things that I've worked 393 00:36:28.000 --> 00:36:31.079 on in this book that I've written, it's just it's like my feeling is 394 00:36:31.199 --> 00:36:37.280 excited and energized, and I'm alive. I'm able to contribute to change because 395 00:36:37.360 --> 00:36:42.320 I'm more present in this moment. And you the way you sap up learning 396 00:36:42.840 --> 00:36:47.840 and how you support people towards change lights you up. You know, that's 397 00:36:49.239 --> 00:36:54.199 that's the wonderful tennis match that we can have as human beings between each other, 398 00:36:54.679 --> 00:37:01.440 and that facilitates change. You know, at this point and at our 399 00:37:01.519 --> 00:37:08.280 age, Bill, it's probably more of a croquet match. Just saying no, 400 00:37:09.079 --> 00:37:12.679 now that is That's what I'm not going to argue with it at all, 401 00:37:14.599 --> 00:37:17.800 not even a little bit like that. That't want to run all over 402 00:37:17.880 --> 00:37:22.719 there from the ball over there? That way, No, I stayed there 403 00:37:22.760 --> 00:37:30.719 instead of the ball come here, or I can't be bothered. So anyways, 404 00:37:30.960 --> 00:37:34.280 So I do want to make a clarification for my audience, because I 405 00:37:34.519 --> 00:37:39.840 know my audience good from the perspective of you know, I'm almost eighteen years 406 00:37:39.920 --> 00:37:45.400 in now with this show. We often talk about empathy on this show, 407 00:37:45.000 --> 00:37:51.440 but we talk about it from the psychic ability of empathy. So every time 408 00:37:51.519 --> 00:37:57.280 you say empathy, a lot of my listeners are going to think, well, 409 00:37:57.800 --> 00:38:02.039 every time doctor Kevin talks about empathy, he talks about how you don't 410 00:38:02.119 --> 00:38:07.960 want to take on the emotions of the other person and have them go through 411 00:38:08.079 --> 00:38:13.199 your body as if those emotions were yours. And again we talk about it 412 00:38:13.559 --> 00:38:19.679 as a psychic EmPATH makes you feel better by taking the feelings you don't want 413 00:38:19.719 --> 00:38:24.119 to feel and take from you and energetically puts it through their energy body. 414 00:38:24.559 --> 00:38:30.440 So I need you to give my audience your definition of empathy because they're sitting 415 00:38:30.559 --> 00:38:32.880 here going no, no, no. Doctor Kevin told us, we don't 416 00:38:32.920 --> 00:38:38.679 want to be having empathy for other people in an engaged way. We want 417 00:38:38.719 --> 00:38:45.199 to have the understanding. Listen, I really love your definition, by the 418 00:38:45.239 --> 00:38:52.719 way, I think it's fantastic. And I'm going to my added piece, 419 00:38:52.960 --> 00:39:02.599 my plus. My contribution is I like people to use like you're saying, 420 00:39:02.960 --> 00:39:08.599 don't run the don't run an emotion through your body. Don't use the definition 421 00:39:08.760 --> 00:39:15.920 of putting your feet in somebody else's shoes. Use a different definition. It's 422 00:39:15.000 --> 00:39:21.840 the ability. Here's my Bill Stirley's definition. Emphathy only occurs when I'm going 423 00:39:21.920 --> 00:39:24.440 to make it very active right now, the definition is going to be very 424 00:39:24.519 --> 00:39:31.920 active. Emphathy only occurs when a feeling word feeling word and a need word 425 00:39:32.639 --> 00:39:38.360 are connected and then agreed upon those that's got it. It's got three pieces 426 00:39:38.440 --> 00:39:45.679 to it. Here's this feeling word frustrated, Here's this need word support and 427 00:39:46.920 --> 00:39:52.760 is that what was missing? Is that what you needed? Is that you 428 00:39:52.880 --> 00:39:57.920 needed support? So it'll sound like because I don't want the I don't want 429 00:39:57.960 --> 00:40:01.320 the feeling of irritated, the air irritation to go through me, go, 430 00:40:01.519 --> 00:40:08.880 I'm going to proactively energetically guess in their direction. Listen, I'm noticing to 431 00:40:09.400 --> 00:40:15.800 be feeling irritated and you needed a different support from me? Is that correct? 432 00:40:15.400 --> 00:40:20.159 Because I don't know. I can't mind bread necessarily, and even though 433 00:40:20.199 --> 00:40:22.920 I'm pretty good at guessing, I still want to clarify and get the other 434 00:40:23.039 --> 00:40:30.320 person to be accountable for their upset. You want them to be accountable so 435 00:40:30.480 --> 00:40:35.760 it doesn't run through me. I to get them to say, yes, 436 00:40:36.440 --> 00:40:40.760 yeah it was support, or no it was respect, or no it was 437 00:40:40.880 --> 00:40:47.519 theirness. I've got to get them to own their irritation and their frustration. 438 00:40:47.599 --> 00:40:53.159 I want them to own it, yeah, because it's closed to the thing. 439 00:40:54.079 --> 00:40:59.639 So first of all, I'm going to respond to that, and then 440 00:40:59.679 --> 00:41:02.320 I want to make this a teaching lesson that Bill and I just engaged in 441 00:41:04.000 --> 00:41:13.840 completely spontaneously. So the first part of this is and when we're using Bill's 442 00:41:13.880 --> 00:41:22.840 definition of empathy a feeling word with a need word to intellectually connect with the 443 00:41:22.960 --> 00:41:28.760 other person as to the experience we had in the experience they had. And 444 00:41:29.159 --> 00:41:32.480 in doing that, I call it we invite them. We invite them to 445 00:41:32.519 --> 00:41:38.159 meet us in the middle of the river of change. We're changing how we 446 00:41:38.280 --> 00:41:42.880 communicate, and we come together in that river. And we were in that 447 00:41:43.079 --> 00:41:49.920 river together because each of us feels like the other person has acknowledged and understood 448 00:41:50.760 --> 00:41:55.760 where we came from without like you said earlier, shame, blame, fault, 449 00:41:57.079 --> 00:42:02.400 all of that stuff. And so you know, one of the signature 450 00:42:02.440 --> 00:42:07.559 lines on one of my emails has my quote, you know change is coming. 451 00:42:07.840 --> 00:42:13.320 You master it or it masters you. Your choice, right, So 452 00:42:13.760 --> 00:42:20.840 the change is non negotiable now. So and so, first of all, 453 00:42:20.920 --> 00:42:25.000 I want to thank you for your definition of empathy. And then one of 454 00:42:25.039 --> 00:42:28.679 the things that's so important. I know that this is important, and I 455 00:42:28.800 --> 00:42:30.559 know that this is in Bill's book, and I know that this is also 456 00:42:30.639 --> 00:42:36.679 something that I've been teaching and working with for years. Is this whole concept 457 00:42:36.920 --> 00:42:42.800 of different words mean things to different people. I'm always saying, when I 458 00:42:42.960 --> 00:42:45.639 say this word, I'm going to define it for you, because I know 459 00:42:45.800 --> 00:42:50.519 that there are ten other definitions out there and they're not going to work with 460 00:42:50.679 --> 00:42:54.440 what I'm trying to share with you, right, And the teaching moment was 461 00:42:55.480 --> 00:43:00.280 Bill didn't get defensive. He didn't say what do you mean if I what 462 00:43:00.320 --> 00:43:04.639 are you an idiot? He didn't. He didn't, you know, feel 463 00:43:04.719 --> 00:43:07.920 like he had to. He didn't feel attacked, and that was clear. 464 00:43:07.039 --> 00:43:10.960 And I was not attacking him, and I was explaining him, and we 465 00:43:12.079 --> 00:43:16.159 were inviting each other to exchange the definitions of words, which turned into a 466 00:43:16.320 --> 00:43:22.599 productive, positive communication, which was a teaching moment to our listeners. This 467 00:43:22.880 --> 00:43:29.360 is what you need to do in your communications, get people to define words, 468 00:43:29.639 --> 00:43:35.119 to find your own words. Yeah, so thanks for sharing that teaching 469 00:43:35.239 --> 00:43:37.079 moment with me. Go ahead. Oh my, oh my gosh, it's 470 00:43:37.280 --> 00:43:44.400 it's it's really it's really wonderful because the thing, doctor Kevin, that you're 471 00:43:44.480 --> 00:43:53.960 catching is that so many times people don't have the space to allow two different 472 00:43:54.039 --> 00:43:59.960 kinds of definitions, two different kinds of interpretations to exist at the same time 473 00:44:00.039 --> 00:44:06.239 time. And they fall into the trap, and it is a trap of 474 00:44:07.400 --> 00:44:14.000 the four horsemen of an apocalypse, of a communication apocalypse. They fall into 475 00:44:14.079 --> 00:44:19.320 criticism, they fall into this defensiveness, they fall into contempt, they fall 476 00:44:19.400 --> 00:44:24.920 into stonewalling or withdrawing. They fall into those that their strategy of protection instead 477 00:44:24.960 --> 00:44:30.480 of the change that's right there in front of you, is walking through and 478 00:44:30.599 --> 00:44:31.760 just colling. I don't know what do you mean by this word? I 479 00:44:31.880 --> 00:44:35.760 mean this, Oh, I learned it this way. This is the way 480 00:44:36.000 --> 00:44:38.639 my dad taught it, This is what my teacher said, this is what 481 00:44:38.760 --> 00:44:45.960 my mentors said. And instead be open and allow the change, and to 482 00:44:46.079 --> 00:44:53.599 allow initially that two things can exist at the same time and be collaborative and 483 00:44:53.679 --> 00:45:00.599 cooperative with finding and appreciating each other's point of view makes a huge different. 484 00:45:01.880 --> 00:45:09.559 And you know, one of the things I invite people to do when I'm 485 00:45:09.800 --> 00:45:14.559 doing couple's work or trying to do the you know, my version of the 486 00:45:14.639 --> 00:45:19.559 stuff I do, because we're you know, on different but parallel tracks. 487 00:45:19.639 --> 00:45:24.280 I mean, we both do that, yes, and is to say, 488 00:45:24.960 --> 00:45:30.079 well, when they say that, when they give you that definition, what 489 00:45:30.360 --> 00:45:36.639 word would you use for that in your head? Can you start by substituting 490 00:45:37.119 --> 00:45:40.519 that when they say empathy, you think, well, that's how I would 491 00:45:40.559 --> 00:45:45.199 define sympathy. Okay, Well if you can go when they say empathy, 492 00:45:45.440 --> 00:45:50.119 I'm really thinking that they mean sympathy. Not get hung up that your definitions 493 00:45:50.159 --> 00:45:54.000 don't match. But find the definition that makes the communication work. Because what's 494 00:45:54.039 --> 00:45:59.440 the goal to work? For the communication to work and be a win win 495 00:45:59.559 --> 00:46:06.320 win situation for all parties involved, right right, it's a it's a gentle 496 00:46:06.400 --> 00:46:10.760 way of just providing a little bit of space between the stimulus and the response, 497 00:46:12.840 --> 00:46:20.159 slow down the emotional reaction and move and start to use curiosity and inquiry 498 00:46:21.239 --> 00:46:29.000 as a way to you know, be present to the other person's way of 499 00:46:29.159 --> 00:46:32.400 seeing this. And it makes a big difference. It really really does, 500 00:46:34.840 --> 00:46:37.880 absolutely now. So first of all, so people know, because I have 501 00:46:38.000 --> 00:46:42.239 Bill's book in front of me, ha ha ha, I could cheat. 502 00:46:45.119 --> 00:46:49.000 Is just so you know. Chapter twelve is nice dead person wants a person, 503 00:46:49.119 --> 00:46:52.239 a compassionate person. So if you thought, I really want to know 504 00:46:52.360 --> 00:46:54.880 more about this, well you go to Amazon dot com and you get yourself 505 00:46:54.920 --> 00:47:00.480 a copity of the Emotional Sobriety Solution. You can turn to chapter twelve and 506 00:47:00.679 --> 00:47:04.679 find out, one am I a nice dead person? What am I a 507 00:47:04.760 --> 00:47:07.039 monster person? And one am my compassionate person? And one am my other 508 00:47:07.079 --> 00:47:10.920 person that just has to figure out whey to hide the body? That's not 509 00:47:12.079 --> 00:47:19.679 the chapter title. Then also chapter thirteen, which I was going to ask 510 00:47:19.760 --> 00:47:24.360 about and you beat me to it. You must be psychic, the four 511 00:47:24.440 --> 00:47:30.320 Horsemen of the Communication Apocalypse. If that struck you, if you heard what 512 00:47:30.440 --> 00:47:32.119 he said, and I'm going to make him repeat those four horsemen a little 513 00:47:32.159 --> 00:47:36.840 more slowly because he kind of threw it out casually in conversation, with a 514 00:47:36.880 --> 00:47:39.760 whole bunch of other words around it. And I think that this is powerful 515 00:47:39.880 --> 00:47:44.079 enough that I'd like you to stop, slow down and tell us again the 516 00:47:44.199 --> 00:47:46.960 four Horsemen. But that's chapter thirteen. So if you listen to these and 517 00:47:47.039 --> 00:47:51.960 you go, oh my god, yeah, I need help with those again, 518 00:47:52.519 --> 00:47:55.800 audience, what do you do? I go to Amazon dot com and 519 00:47:55.920 --> 00:48:02.599 I put it in the Emotional Riety Solutions might build sturly and I get the 520 00:48:02.679 --> 00:48:07.840 book. There's your answer. See if that question it wouldn't be so hard. 521 00:48:07.360 --> 00:48:10.960 Bill tell us about the four Horsemen. Well, I appreciate this. 522 00:48:12.920 --> 00:48:21.000 The four Horsemen are criticism. That's number one defensiveness, two three is contempt, 523 00:48:22.280 --> 00:48:29.199 and fourth is withdrawal. So those four different horsemen. Those are protective 524 00:48:29.400 --> 00:48:35.159 strategies that people use, but are also things that make things worse. It 525 00:48:36.199 --> 00:48:40.719 escalates, eventually escalates the conflict. And inside the book, I've written ways 526 00:48:40.920 --> 00:48:50.159 to diffuse people that use those strategies in your direction. So if a person 527 00:48:50.280 --> 00:48:55.199 defensively says, well I didn't do it, that wasn't me, that's not 528 00:48:55.360 --> 00:49:00.360 true. All of those are defensive statements. So what do you say back? 529 00:49:00.679 --> 00:49:06.679 And inside the book I give examples about what do you say back when 530 00:49:06.760 --> 00:49:13.880 somebody says the sentence looks impenerritable, like a defensive sentence or a criticism sentence, 531 00:49:13.960 --> 00:49:16.559 what's wrong with you? What do you say back? What do you 532 00:49:16.639 --> 00:49:21.639 say back when somebody says it's your fault? What do you say bad when 533 00:49:21.639 --> 00:49:25.760 they're using criticism? And what do you say back when nobody when a person 534 00:49:25.840 --> 00:49:30.039 doesn't return your phone call or doesn't return your email, what do you say 535 00:49:30.159 --> 00:49:34.960 next? And what I do is I go In the book of here some 536 00:49:35.159 --> 00:49:39.960 examples of things to say and do in order to loose it up and get 537 00:49:40.000 --> 00:49:45.760 the horseman to calm down and go away, so the horseman doesn't show up 538 00:49:45.880 --> 00:49:53.960 the same way the the person then is able to be more peaceful and not 539 00:49:54.119 --> 00:50:00.159 be such a monster person around here. Thank you for elaborating on that. 540 00:50:00.679 --> 00:50:05.880 I know that's going to be helpful to our audience. In the time we 541 00:50:06.000 --> 00:50:08.840 have left, I have two more places I want to pull things out of 542 00:50:08.920 --> 00:50:19.760 your book to talk about, and so I'm gonna I'm gonna start with I 543 00:50:20.000 --> 00:50:24.239 found it very interesting because again here on the Doctor Kevin Show, and when 544 00:50:24.280 --> 00:50:30.280 we're talking in the in the more esoteric metaphysical spirit, you know, spiritual 545 00:50:30.360 --> 00:50:37.320 psychic realms, we tend to have a very different definition definition for empathy. 546 00:50:37.760 --> 00:50:43.679 So when I saw your replacing sympathy with empathy, and you know, so 547 00:50:43.840 --> 00:50:50.360 of course here we look at we would look at sympathy as you can. 548 00:50:52.360 --> 00:50:58.280 You can say you can acknowledge that you're not you know, that you're recognizing 549 00:50:58.400 --> 00:51:01.280 that they feel bad or that they feel angry, and that you can get 550 00:51:01.400 --> 00:51:06.400 that that's where they are. But of course with your definitive different definition of 551 00:51:06.519 --> 00:51:12.400 empathy, I am curious if your definition of sympathy involves it. Some people 552 00:51:12.559 --> 00:51:17.559 use sympathy as a way of condescension and dismissal. Is that part of it 553 00:51:17.719 --> 00:51:22.119 or do you just have a very different definition of sympathy. No, I 554 00:51:22.480 --> 00:51:28.440 appreciate that a sympathy can be used as a get out of jail free card. 555 00:51:29.320 --> 00:51:34.000 It's like, yeah, that thing happened to me, I know what 556 00:51:34.079 --> 00:51:37.280 you're going through, and I talk about it a little bit there, and 557 00:51:37.360 --> 00:51:45.199 then I also talk about how to convert a sympathetic sentence into an empathetic sentence, 558 00:51:45.679 --> 00:51:51.480 and what are some ways to swap out language so that it creates more 559 00:51:51.599 --> 00:51:59.840 present more connection, allows change to take place easier because when we sympathy, 560 00:52:00.400 --> 00:52:05.960 sometimes people hijack the promo or the wounds and say, oh, yeah, 561 00:52:06.039 --> 00:52:09.320 something like happened happened with your dad, same thing happened with my dad, 562 00:52:09.559 --> 00:52:13.280 blah blah blah blah, And now all of a sudden they're onto their story. 563 00:52:13.880 --> 00:52:16.360 It's like, I'm sorry, did you not remember that there was a 564 00:52:16.440 --> 00:52:23.440 traumatized person telling you this story? It was like, and it's it is 565 00:52:23.880 --> 00:52:31.559 a way. Regrettably, we've been taught to make ourselves comfortable but still come 566 00:52:31.639 --> 00:52:36.960 off as or try to come off as listening or kind, which we are, 567 00:52:37.559 --> 00:52:45.000 but we didn't know that that language pattern doesn't serve us fully. It's 568 00:52:45.079 --> 00:52:50.719 not as powerful as a stronger empathetic sentence. So the answer, short answer 569 00:52:50.800 --> 00:52:55.639 Savan is yes. And the longer answer is how did we swap out sympathy 570 00:52:55.760 --> 00:53:00.760 sentences with empathy sentence? Well, and some on sympathy is the calling card 571 00:53:00.920 --> 00:53:07.440 again. You know, we travel in slightly different worlds. We understand each 572 00:53:07.480 --> 00:53:13.880 other, We've we've never had a problem understanding each other in what fifteen years 573 00:53:13.960 --> 00:53:20.920 at least, and uh, but we do travel in different words where different 574 00:53:21.079 --> 00:53:27.000 languages used in different perceptions are about you know, around in people's concepts, 575 00:53:27.639 --> 00:53:32.480 and you know, for us, oftentimes, sympathy is the calling card of 576 00:53:32.559 --> 00:53:37.960 an energy leach. Oh yeah, that's right. Yeah, And I think 577 00:53:37.000 --> 00:53:39.800 that's a good that's a good term. Yep, Yes, it can be 578 00:53:42.119 --> 00:53:47.519 yep that somebody that literally feeds off you and uses sympathy as their calling card. 579 00:53:50.440 --> 00:53:53.800 And again I was. I was once in a funeral and the person 580 00:53:53.960 --> 00:53:58.920 that was grieving their husband, somebody came up and started telling a story about 581 00:53:58.960 --> 00:54:01.679 them grieving their minds, And I went, how long when did that happen? 582 00:54:01.760 --> 00:54:05.159 Oh? It was fifteen years ago. And I'm like, for gotta 583 00:54:05.199 --> 00:54:07.840 say, once the woman mourned the us. We come back later if you 584 00:54:07.920 --> 00:54:10.480 want to talk to about your problems that you know, I was thinking that 585 00:54:10.559 --> 00:54:14.599 in my head. But at the same time, you know, it's that's 586 00:54:14.760 --> 00:54:17.519 that's an example, Kevin. You know, the energy leech that you mentioned 587 00:54:19.039 --> 00:54:21.880 is a good label. It's a good place to start to recognize. Hey, 588 00:54:22.480 --> 00:54:25.880 you know, the compassion and empathetic to the person you're in front use. 589 00:54:28.159 --> 00:54:31.440 If you have never seen it, find it on YouTube. It is 590 00:54:31.519 --> 00:54:37.519 a clip out of the first time Robin Williams was on the Carol Burnett Show, 591 00:54:38.599 --> 00:54:43.519 and there is a skit where she is a grieving widow and he's just 592 00:54:43.679 --> 00:54:46.719 somebody that like maybe worked in the office with him, didn't barely know him 593 00:54:46.760 --> 00:54:51.400 or whatever. But he goes in and he takes over the whole funeral through 594 00:54:51.519 --> 00:54:55.760 keying, using the process of keying, and it is the funniest thing. 595 00:54:55.840 --> 00:55:00.519 And you watch the whole thing seeing Carol Burnett under the widow thing, trying 596 00:55:00.599 --> 00:55:06.639 not to hysterically laugh because Robert Williams did that spontaneously. It wasn't part of 597 00:55:06.679 --> 00:55:10.079 the script. Oh god, oh my god, I can't wait to watch 598 00:55:10.079 --> 00:55:15.360 it. That's fantastic. Yeah, you're you're you would so appreciate it. 599 00:55:15.840 --> 00:55:17.280 The last thing I'm want to put out because I know we're almost at the 600 00:55:17.320 --> 00:55:22.280 time, is he also has a change chapter called facing Shame. To be 601 00:55:22.440 --> 00:55:27.039 respectful, I'm not going to open up the can of worms too much because 602 00:55:28.000 --> 00:55:30.519 I know at about thirty to forty five seconds we're going to be going off 603 00:55:30.679 --> 00:55:34.719 air, and I don't want people to hear half a sentence and be frustrated. 604 00:55:35.159 --> 00:55:37.880 But I know that shame is a huge thing. It's a huge manipulation 605 00:55:38.039 --> 00:55:42.760 tool. It's a huge patrol tool. He has a chapter on facing change 606 00:55:43.679 --> 00:55:49.280 amazon the Emotional Sobriety Solution Bill. Thanks for coming to spend too long. 607 00:55:49.480 --> 00:55:52.800 Let's catch up soon, all right, Doctor Kevin, have a great one. 608 00:55:52.880 --> 00:55:55.039 Thank you very much. Bye bye bye