You're listening to the Mind over Murder podcast. My name is Bill Thomas.
I'm a writer, consulting, producer, and now podcaster. I am now
trying to use my experience as the brother of a murder victim to help other
victims of violent crime. I'm working on a book on the unsolved Colonial Parkway
murders and I'm the co administrator of the Colonial Parkway Murders Facebook group together with
Kristin Dilley. My name is Kristin Dilley. I'm a writer, a researcher,
a teacher, and a victim's advocate, as well as the social media
manager and co administrator for the Colonial Parkway Murders Facebook page with my partner in
crime, Bill Thomas. Welcome to Mind of a Murder. I'm Kristin Dilley
and I'm Bill Thomas, and we are joined today by author John Glatt,
here to talk to us about his book The Doomsday Mother, Laurie Vallo,
Chad day Bell, and the of an American Family. John, thank you
so much for joining us today. I had pleasure. Thanks for having me
go ahead and start by telling our listeners a little bit about your educational and
professional background. How did you get into writing true crime. My backgrounds in
journalism Back in England, I dropped out. I was a dropout. I
dropped out of school and worked from music publisher. You might be able to
see this build. That's my first job. I worked from music publisher.
I did tea and coffee and runs the post office. And I decided that
I wanted to get into writing. So I managed to get into a local
newspaper in South London and went from there and then I used that as a
stepping stone to come over to America in eighty two and been here ever since.
Was the writing thing something that you were always interested in as a young
man? Oh? Yes, yeah, and I love writing or something I
enjoyed doing. I liked I'm very curious, I liked asking a lot of
questions and finding things out, and journalism to me was the perfect occupation.
Absolutely it was. So what then attracted you to the field of true crime?
Because it really does take a very special type of person to be able
to deal with the depravity that comes with the true crime field. What happened
for you? Why actually started? My first book was on rock and Roll
as an unauthorized biography of Bill Graham, in fact, the Fillmore East and
West and that whole concert promotion business. That was my first book, and
then I did a couple of other books. I did one on River Phoenix,
I did one on the royal family of Monaco. And then I had
a friend, a very good friend, who was writing true crime books for
Saint Martin's in New York, and he kind of husband me into it,
and they gave me a trial twenty five years ago. And my first book
was an anthology of priests that killed. The second book was an anthology of
it's called Evil Twins, about cases of twins, either one killing the other
or killing other people or whatever. And I went from there really that,
and after that I was pretty well been doing true crime since. But I
have to stop you for a second, John, that's quite a turn.
In other words, I also worked in the music business for a number of
years. But that's quite a turn from Bill Graham to priests who killed.
I know I'm skipping a step or two there. That's a pretty dark left
turn. Don't you think some kind of segue, isn't it. Yeah?
It listen to say that Bill Graham couldn't be evil, But he also did
a lot of good things. Yeah, for those obviously very different subjects,
but both interests me. Really, it's finding out the story. I love
just finding out the real story, and that's what wrapped me about it,
especially about Bill Graham, because I interviewed a lot of people that knew him
rock bands from the times and the sixties and whatever to get to know him,
as try and get to know of this person because unfortunately he died by
the time I started. I'm just very curious and I wanted to explore more.
And it's the kind of same formula I use in true crime books.
I try to speak to as many people as possible and trying to get different
views on what happened, what the person was like, and put them all
together. And that actually does speak to my next question, which is,
other than telling the facts of the case and the story of the crime,
what other goals do you have in mind when you set out to write a
book about a case. And it sounds like one of them is get to
know who these people were, But do you have other goals that you set
out to do? Yeah, I obviously wanted to write an interesting book which
will keep the readers finishing towards the end or would that would be If I
didn't do that, it wouldn't really work. But you just want to find
out. I I like to find out what made people do it. I'm
not askin' I don't pretend to be, you know, to explain why people
do what they do. I just want to present as much facts as possible
and let the reader make up their own mind about what happened. And so
then how do you pick the cases? These days? There's so much interesting
to a crime, and you've had a great deal of success. How do
you choose the cases you choose to write about? And I think they have
to interest me. Obviously, they have to interest the publisher. If the
publisher doesn't think the book will do well, they're not gonna have me to
do it. I mean that there's a two prompted sword day. But there's
a lot of things that really interest me. For instance, the Doomsday Mother.
I live up in the Catskills and I was at a local bart talking
to some friends. I've never heard about this story, by the way,
and a friend of mine started telling me about it. So it's all these
people, they're just disappearing off the face of the earth. It's like very
weird, warm and based murder that seems to be going on, and I
went straight home and started researching it. And this was right at the beginning.
Basically, it's where are the children and Laurie and Chad Wastin in Hawaii
fending off dateline reporters and a local East Idea home. So I've been there
at the beginning and went from there and I published to light the idea and
told me to go ahead. I felt like the book came out. And
I think it's just because it's been and everybody's radar for so long, but
I felt like the book came out really quickly. I was like, oh
my gosh, how was there a book about this already? I'm so excited.
It's great. I was so psyched when I saw it. And I
know you're very much on top of the most recent cases. I'm in the
true crime section at Barnes and Noble all the time, and you can't go
into that section without seeing at least a couple of your books. So I'm
always excited every time I see anyone. No. I worked on this for
about eighteen months actually, and obviously with the trial, new stuff coming out
every day, I'm riveted to listening to the audio because I couldn't afford to
go to the trial for two months, however long it's going to be.
But there's a lot of new stuff coming out for the trial which I wish
I could have added to the band. Maybe I can do an update to
do that. I'd like to. But I got very lucky in that I
had Chad day Bo's preliminary hearing. So a lot of the testimony from the
FBI and the detectives about when they found the children's bodies in Dabel's garden came
out at the preliminary hearing and it started made a lot of sense. Right.
I can see there were things that I hypothesized when I was writing that
now with the trial, I can see that I was definitely on the right
line. Are there things now that are coming out, John that you're shocked
by? Because when I read summaries of what has transpired, and you're obviously
a lot closer to the details than most people would be. But as more
information comes out, I just find myself rocked back in my chair. These
people are sick, Yeah, especially with lex Cox, Laura Laurie Vella's brother.
Yesterday I'm his dispent today listening to the cell phone. They trapped his
cell phone, GPS, WiFi and they marked him on the days that Tiley
disappeared was last known Society and JJ And you can see he's moving from his
apartment next door to Laura's in Rexburg, Idaho, and then to Chats to
bury the body. And it all makes perfect sense now, And it amazed
me just how much they could find out about him. And it's really been
for me, having done the book, really riveting to listen to this testimony.
What would you say, are some of the most surprising things that you
learned about Laurie and Chad and these sort of weird shared beliefs that they had
in common as you completed research for the book. What were some of the
shockers? It amazed me how many people were under their spell. Really,
there were a lot of people that believe Chad Dabo was a prophet, and
they followed everything he did. They read the books, the podcasts and everything,
and they really believed he was for real. And one hundred and forty
four thousand that he told Laurie they were going to leads for the Second Coming,
It just blew my mind. That people really believe this, and it's
incredible in this day and age that they didn't ask more questions, but they
went along with it. And it may like past lives, reincarnations and ever
they believed in all that, But that to me was a real shocker.
I think. Yeah, it does sound like though, in reading about the
Mormon Church, that there is a history of people within the Mormon Church kind
of self declaring as prophets, in other words, naming themselves as prophets.
Yeah. I mean, there's been some pretty horrendous murders I think involving the
Mormon Church, and I think they're very embarrassed about this because they've distanced themselves
as much as possible from this case because it's very bad complicity for them,
I think. So there's that facage of it, the part that I'm always
the whole thing. I'm fascinated by the whole thing. So I guess I
can't really say the part that I'm most fascinated with. But I was so
curious how Alex Cox ended up as involved as he was in the case.
Is it because he was so weirdly and maybe a little eckerly attached to his
sister or was it a predilection for violence or was it something else? What
do you think caused him to get as involved as he was. I think
if he heard the testimony by Laura's younger sister, Summers Shifflet. She talks
about I think Alex had some kind of accidents as a teenager and it did
something to his brain, and she said he never really grew up after that.
He was just a teenager and when he became a man, he still
process thoughts like a teenager. I think that had something to do with it.
I think one of the interesting things in my book was I got although
I couldn't name her, Laurie's best friend at Eisenhower High School in California,
she gave me an interview where, you know, they were very they were
inseparable, and she said in twelfth grade, they were having a sleepover and
Nori became very emotional, flung her arms around her and said that Alex,
who was like I think four or five years older at the time, Alex
was trying to have sex with her and she didn't know what to do,
and her friend didn't know what to do or what to tell her son.
It was never mentioned again, but the friend told me, because her mother
was a teacher, that if she just wishes that she could have told the
grown ups what was going on, because maybe it may might have changed everything.
That's just hypothesis, but that was my theory that they had a very
close relationship. And do you think that Alex became essentially a follower of Chad.
He believed everything Chad told him. Chad and Laurie. Melanie Gifts says
that in her testimony, Alex believed everything he believed in past lives, and
Chadd had told him that he'd been particularly selected for this life to be the
protector of Laurie, that he had to protect her from evil, and that's
what Alex thought. He was a warrior in this way. I mean,
look at Joe Ryant third husband, Tyler's mom when he tasted him. Basically,
Alex tasted him while Laurie looked on with time while they had a visitation.
Alex was always getting He was a violent person. I think too,
that part of the book was absolutely insane to me. I was sitting there
shaking my head when it came out that Laurie and Tyedy. We was sitting
in a car watching it all happens. Pretty scary there, really is.
And I spoke to Joe Ryan's lawyer, very interesting, and he told me
that it affected Joe and did something to him. He has began, he
developed heart problems and everything, became an alcoholic and died pretty pretty young.
And the lawyer thought it was a direct result of being tasered like that.
Yeah, I was going to ask your thoughts on that. Could we can't
technically a hundred percent lay his stath at chat and Laurie's hands, but it
sounds like we can indirectly put it there via Alex exactly. Yeah, the
taser. But there's a lot there's been a lot of talk about whether Laurie
could have been involved in his death. He definitely gave talks where she said
that he was a candidate to be murdered for what he'd done to the kids.
And then at the same time, I'm very suspicious that Alex's death,
which seems awfully convenient. He's effectively acted as an enforcer or Laurie and has
been directly involved in the deaths of two of her husband and then Alex conveniently
dies. Yeah, I'm very suspicious there. I wonder if it was suicide
because he died. I think after hearing that they were about to exhume Tammy
Dayville's body, and I think two days before he'd driven all the way to
Mexico to buy some drugs and things. I'm not sure what pharmaceutical drugs there
were, but he brought them back to Zulema and he had the same kind
of thin stuff coming out of his mouth Tammy did. In fact, they
were talking about that yesterday at the trial, asphyxiation, But I don't know.
I personally wonder if Alex his heart gave way because he knew it was
going to I was going to come down on him, and I think at
that time he also didn't know where Laurie was. Laurie and Chadd had just
disappeared for why he without telling anyone, And I think Zulema had said that
they were worried that they were the fool guys and they were going to take
the heat for what Chad and Laurie had done. I think it was all
coming back to Alex. But my god, if he if he hadn't died,
it would that would be really interesting. How did Laurie and Chad's beliefs
differ from those that are espoused by the Preparion of People and the LDS Church.
If you had to categorize where they differed, what would you say is
the biggest point of difference. I'm not a Mormon. I don't really know
the church. But what I'm talking to some of people that followed Chad in
the beginning and then got they separated because they couldn't. But he was just
out there and they didn't believe in one hundred and forty four thousand the Church
of the Firstborn. It was something that's against the Mormon religion. And then
he did things about how he and Laurie were sealed in a Mormon is in
a chapel or whatever. But that's what they would never do is heresy.
So I think that the Mormon Church, any believers, didn't want anything to
do with Chad and Laurie at that point. One of the things that we
talked about on Mind over Murder recently is that how strange I thought it was
that they went off to Hawaii, as if that was on the other side
of the world. Now, I lived in Hawaii when I was a kid.
My dad was an able officer, and it was further away then than
it is now, because when we were kids, there were no satellites in
Hawaii felt like a very isolated place. This is back in the nineteen sixties.
But I couldn't quite figure out if that was their version of running away.
They didn't even leave the Fifty States. It wasn't like they went somewhere
where there was no opportunity to be forced to come back to the US to
face trial or whatever, someplace without extradition. But they end up on a
beach in Hawaii months after the disappearance of her children, weeks after the death
of his wife. If I'm not mistaken, Yeah, doesn't it seem incredibly
naive that they thought that going to Hawaii would be enough to move them off
the radar in Idaho and Nevada naive? Definitely. My theory is Laurie's parents
always went to Hawaii. They loved Hawaii. Laurie spent as a child,
she was taken to Hawaii, she fell in love with it, and obviously
she moved to Hawaii with Charles Valo JJ andentily for I think few four years.
So there was always something about Hawaii that Laurie loved, and I think
it was part of her romantic dream with Chad to get married on the beach
in Hawaii. And I understand in fact, I think she'd married Joe Ryan
on a beach in Hawaii. That's when I was as lawyer. In fact,
so I think that there was naivety, but that's where she felt that
she needed to be with Chad. And of course the wedding was exactly two
weeks that two weeks after Tammy died November the fifth, twenty nineteen. I
interviewed the say priests, but the clergyman that married them, very interesting take
on it. Yeah, and he couldn't believe it. He said, they
couldn't wait. Usual league couples are getting married. They want to take that.
They want to get their full hours worth of the marriage. He said,
they couldn't wait to leave. They were out of there about forty minutes
later. Wow, he was quite pleased, I think. And the photographer
interviews said they were very strange. Yeah, oh my gosh, in what
way were they strange from the like, from the photographer's point of view,
they were behaving like teenagers or and he's in his early fifties, she's late
forties. Then I think and they're all over each other. And I think
if you've seen the pictures, so he's not the guitar, but then the
Hawaiian instrument is the ueah. That was all faked obviously, and the champagne
wasn't real champagne. When we were preparing for today's interview, Kristen said something
funny, which is they describe Laurie as being very atrabuna with a long blonde
hair and so on. Chaddy Belt is at That's an average looking guy.
He's not a movie star, handsome or anything like that. Right. Is
it the charisma that puts him across and connects him with so many people?
What do you think it is? John? Yeah, I think he was
charismatic. People told me he was. He could give these talks with the
visuals of a North Korea and nuclear forces Kim yongum and talk about the end
of the world, and he had this kind of charisma. And I think
for Laurie, she had very low self esteem. I think it fed into
telling her she was a goddess and he was going to say they were going
to save the world together. I think he knew how to feed into her
ego in that way, and I think to chat he was a womanizer.
He'd been married to Tammy. I heard from their friends in fact that there
was They didn't really have much of a sex life. He was always complaining
about it, and he had a couple of relationships with followers of his book
by telephone. These affairs by I think he saw Laurie fawning over him and
just attractive blonde and just thought, this is who I want to be with
this. He just fell in love with the way she looked. And what
was interesting when they met, he was vastly overweight, very dumpy, double
chimber. A few months of Lorrie, she gave him a total makeover.
You must have lost a lot of weight when you see the pictures laid out.
I think she gave him a makeover. But they were obviously in an
odd couple, but I think they fed into each other the sort of gasoline
and oil they ignited in this horrible, disgusting way. You're listening to Mind
over Murder. We'll be right back after this word from our sponsors. We're
back here at Mind over Murder. You characterize him in the book as almost
been like a cult leader. Do you feel like that's the correct term for
him. Yeah, definitely. I spoke to guy called Rick Ross, who
is a cult expert. I've interviewed him for a few of my other books.
He's very helpful, and he talked about it as being a cult of
two basically Chad and Laurie, and he said it's definitely a cult, you
know, in his that mentality, And there were more people. Obviously,
there was Melanie GiB Melanie gudro, Zulemma, Alex, there was a whole
group around them, and more names I heard during the trial which I've never
heard of before. So it was obviously bigger than just two. But it
was definitely a cult that he was leading. I think delusional in that they
think that beyond the cult leadership and focus that seems to come mostly from Chad
and his writings, they really think they were going to be able to leave
a trail of dead bodies everywhere they went and get away with it. I
presumed they did. They did. They got away to Charles Valor and Arizona.
The police did investigate and they called it they thought it was a self
defense, which was ridiculous. And that's one of the things we watched the
videos of them Alex, Laurie and Tylely being interviewed by the police there.
It's pretty really interesting, especially Tyly. In fact, I don't know.
I don't think she bought what her mother was selling at all. She was
very sassy. Everybody said she would call her mother out a lot, but
they supported that. Charles Vallo had come with a baseball bat and everything,
and as far as I see, Charles Vallo was a great husband. He
couldn't believe what Laurie had turned into, and there was going to be an
intervention. I think Charles Vallow and Laurie's brother Adam, they were going to
do an intervention with the parents, and that's when Laurie discovered what was happening
with emails, and Charles had even sent an email to Tammy talking about it,
and that's when he had to die. I think, yeah, I
think they obviously thought they would get away with it, and they did for
a while. I think they would have gone away with it to a certain
extent if Chad hadn't sent that email to Tammy when they were obviously burying entirely
and he said there's raccoon, so I've been burning limbs, and that emailed
the smoking to talk about it at the trial yesterday, and that's what obviously
set That's where they found the kids. Otherwise and they think they would have
found them. Do you think that either of them would have resorted to this
type of violence without the other good question. I really don't know, I
said at the beginning, impossible to know. If they hadn't met each other,
maybe they just he would have gone carrying on writing his books and she
would have been just going through more husbands and a lot more people would be
alive today. So it's really hard to know. I think. Do you
think that darkest impulse to actually kill people that are standing in the way,
do you think that comes more from Chad or from Laurie. I think Chad.
I mean they were in his way. He didn't want the kids there,
they would go, He didn't want them around. Laurie wanted Laurie to
himself. They had to get away, he had to. I think they
had to kill their spouses for insurance. That's what they were looking at.
A million dollars for Charles value. And Laurie didn't know that he'd actually changed
the beneficiary to Kay Woodcock, his sister, until after they killed Charles,
and then with Tammy I was reading today he got like about I think three
hundred and eighty thousand dollars pay out from insurance they paid him, and this
is what he was spending in Hawaii, So I think that was a motivation
to the money. I mean for the others, I think Laurie and maybe
Alex, it was like when they introduced the concept of zombies, and these
people are turned it being inhabited by zombies and the only way you could written
was to kill the body and that would free them spiritually, So you were
doing the best thing you can for them. And I think that's probably what
Alex believed. He probably believed that he was freeing jj and entirely by killing
their bodies so their spirits could escape. It's bizarre to me. It really
isn't horrific the Chad books. Does this zombie thing show up in any of
his earlier writing or was this a newer creation that he came up with as
an excuse to kill off all of these people that were standing in their way.
Let's be honest. I read one of his books and I don't read
anymore. It has done badly written out. I wouldn't recommend him as an
author, but I understand the zombie thing was quite late. He introduced that
later on, and that was his way. I think of getting rid of
Tidy and JJ because they were in his way. He didn't want them around.
It's a flexible set of belief saying all the time. With him,
I think I just love the way that he had a definite date for the
end of the world. I think by some twentieth was it twenty twenty or
he was sitting in jail when that happened and the world did end. I
just would have loved to have seen his face that day. That definitely would
have been something I would have wanted to be a fly on the wall for
it. Definitely. Okay, So, as an English teacher, I am
always interested in the writing process for any author that we interview. So can
you tell me a little bit about your process. I've been trying to convince
my students all year that they need to outline before they write a books.
They're either going to prove me right or you're going to prove me wrong.
Which is it going to be. I spent two or three months doing a
complete timeline of everything it can run to two or three hundred pages single space.
An incredibly aimal on this, but the timeline is the way it works.
I can write through that and you can see things that you wouldn't seem
Ordinarily the coincide. My early books, I didn't really use a timeline except
for maybe there was some event that I really wanted to get into detail.
But for the last few years I do a complete timeline of everything, and
it's really paid off, I think because you can see things much more clearly.
Because I had so much research for this. Say, this whole room
was just full of files and every thing, and to have to remember where
everything was without a timeline will be impossible. I was going to say,
it really pays off for this book, just in terms of very so much
to this case that I remember when we first started hearing about it, we
were like, who died when and where and under what circumstances. It was
so helpful to get your book and to finally see it laid out in order.
I was like, oh, that's the order it happened. Now it
very much helped. Yeah, it's hard to get your mind around it.
In my new book, which is about the Murdochs, in South Carolina.
I'm just more complicated. I think really I had probably had a lot more
than I had on Laurie Valo for that one. The research it really was
confusing. Timeline would be the only way you understand that. And we do
want to talk to you about that very much because we are so interested in
the Murdoch case. As you put together the timeline, and I know you're
very research driven, does it come to mind that there's even more research required?
Do you see gaps in the people that you've talked to? Are the
people that you'd like to talk to? Absolutely? I see a timeline.
I'm going through it. I think I've got to find I've got more questions
I want to ask and things. So a timeline is very good for that.
And I try and get as many people as I can to talk and
that's very important. But the timeline is invaluable when getting seeing things from different
perspectives and getting the right questions. How many different levels of agreement will you
have? You mentioned a moment ago that there was a friend of Laurie's that
obviously you interviewed, but didn't want to be cited by name. So how
do you so you work that in but under the pseudonym. But you provide
the information without clearly stating who it is. Yeah, I use a pseudonym
and then I put in parentheses not her real name. When you're reading the
book, you know that it's not. I don't like using a source,
said I like to real person. But she was obviously I connect him a
lot of people on social media, and they did not want their names coming
out as being close to them. So you have to go along with that
and understandable too. I think are you able to obscure enough detail those so
that we can't figure out who or why happened to be? I think people
this school friend. I think her friends probably could work it out actually,
but for the reader probably less of a chance of figuring out, oh,
that's actually who went to high school with Laurie. Unless you had a class
photograph or something. You went through everybody, But no, I know,
I expect their privacy. They talked to me on the understanding that I wouldn't
give their real names. How many people did you end up interviewing for this
book? Do you think? Oh, god, probably fifty or sixty.
Wow, I'd have to look through a lot. Yeah, we're so excited
about your upcoming book on the Rodock murder is because we have been covering it
a lot here on Mind Over Murder. That too, is such a super
complex case, like you were saying a few minutes ago, tell us a
little bit about it ahead and give us the elevator pitch on it and tell
us when it's coming out. You give us all the details, and we're
so excited to hear about it. I'm not going to give you too many
of the details. I want to say. I've got a lot of new
stuff in there, a lot of good interviews, and I don't want that
to come out before the book comes out. That it was lucky because I
finished the book and then the publisher left two I have two chapters at the
end for the trial, which I you know, so I covered the trial
totally in that. So that was a good ending. That was a very
complicated book, and there's so many different facets of it. And it's not
just Alex Murdoch, it's the whole history of the Murdoch family. Ridge is
in the fourteenth District and South Carolina, and they really ruled it, you
know, like medieval kings in a way, and they go around to themselves.
And I spent three weeks down there last year again talking to people and
everything, getting the real fuel of it. And it's just a very fascinating
case, I think, totally different than this running fair. They're both fascinating,
but very different. It sounds like there's just so much to the murder
case, and there are decades upon decades of corruption and political influence peddling,
and it's unbelievable how much has gone on with that family and that law firm.
Yeah, there were a law unto themselves and they got away with it
for years. But if it really hadn't been for Pool and that the boating
accident Dream was drunk he crashed the boat and killed Malory Beach, this never
would have had come out or anything. That was what really sparked everything,
and they couldn't really hide it any longer. Had you submitted the manuscript for
the book by the time it came out that Stephen Smith was being exhumed,
how did you feel about that? No, I think that the book had
gone suppressed by then. I didn't meet Sandy his mind who I went to
a benefit to raise money for the headstone in Columbia that's when I first went
in there, so I met his mother, Sandy, I met his sister,
who's really sweet, and then it meant a lot to them to find
out what really happened, because they know that Stephen was murdered, and yet
they couldn't get anybody to take it seriously. It was all pushed under the
carpet and hushed up. So at long last, there's a chance of finding
out, you know what really happened. Now. The Doomsday Mother, your
Laurie Valo Chad Day book came out on Saint Martin's Press. Is your next
book, Tangled Vines coming out under Saint Martin's as well? Yes, it
is. All my true crime books, I'm proud to say have come under
Saint Martin's Press. I've been with them for over twenty five years now,
so I'm very proud of that. How does that happen? By the way,
most authors we know move around, Yet you've been with the same house
for all of these years. Absolutely, because they say it's a very good
relationship with my editor, Charles Spicer and his staff, and it works really
well. I think I like working for them and they seem to like me,
So it's good. As I said, I'm in the true crime section
of Barnston Ebold most every weekend, and your books are never out of print,
They're always there, so I'm always excited when a new one comes out.
And so when I was paging through and I saw, oh, John
Glatt's got another new book coming out in August, I was like, Okay,
we absolutely have to see if we can get him to come on,
and we do want to have you back when Tangled Minds releases. This has
really being great talking to you. I do want to ask one more thing
with regard to the Murdoch case. Do you think Gloria Saderfield's case should be
given another look? Absolutely? I just read Obviously the murder case has now
been resolved. He's but a sadder field case. I just read this afternoon.
I think he's through his lawyer. He's given a reply to the Nautiless,
and Nautiless was the big insurance company, and he's now admitting that the
dogs didn't push Glorious at a Field down the stairs. He made that up,
and that she was you can't remember if she wasn't, if she was
there to work or not, which would have invalid the whole insurance thing that
just came out. I just read that today, in fact involving there's all
these financial cases. I think there's like a hundred different things against him.
There there's a lot more coming out, and the same judge, the same
prosecutor, and everything is going to be a lot to watch. Such an
amazing case and the level of corruption, it just goes deeper and deeper.
It's quite amazing. Yeah, it's taken the whole of Hampton down anyway.
I think the lawyers and the police are under investigation. It's just a very
corrupt system that's been like that for so many years. It is nice to
finally see some of that dirt coming up finally say now that tangled vines is
about to go to us, what are you working on now? Are you
able to share any of that? Are you going to keep it under wraps
for a little bit. I'm taking the summer off. I haven't really stop
books for a while, so I think I need a few months off,
get a fresh air, and everything come up for air. I picture a
whiteboard somewhere John, where you've got all these ideas for your next book after
the summer, and you're well deserved time off. Right, it's right there.
I'll let the records show that John is turning the camera and showing us
his white board appears to be more of a bulletin board with ideas and pictures.
I noticed you didn't zoom in, though, so we couldn't tell quite
what you were working on. So what are you going to do this summer
while you have the time off? I don't know, look for different ideas,
and I'm doing something for doing grating car who's the editor of Vanity Fair.
His website airmail. They commissioned me. I've written a piece about a
murder that happened in Swinging London in nineteen sixty seven. That's coming out in
a couple of weeks. I think that's something I've been working on, and
I'm looking around for other ideas. It's a fun background, although once again,
you're working on a murder. You said you're up in the Catskills.
Whereabouts? Do you know? Woodstock is thirty five miles west of Woodstock?
Bellski Center live in. That nearest town is Margaretville. I don't know where
are you based. I'm in Virginia and Bell is in Connecticut. Right,
Yeah, the book is The Doomsday Mother Laurie Vallo, Chad Jay Bell and
the End of an American Family by John Glatt, currently out in stores,
available on Amazon and wherever you get your books. And we're looking forward to
having John back to talk to us about Tangled Vines when that releases in August.
That's going to do it for this episode of mind Over Murder. Thank
you so much for listening. We'll see you next time. Mind Over Murder
is a production of Absolute Zero and Another Dog Productions. Our executive producers are
Bill Thomas and Kristin Dilley. Our logo art is by Pamela Arnois. Our
theme music is by Kevin McLeod. Mind Over Murder is distributed in partnership with
Coral Space Media. You can follow us on Facebook, Twitter, or Instagram.
You can also follow our page on the Colonial Parkway Murders on Facebook,
and finally, you can follow Bill Thomas on Twitter at Bill Thomas five six.
Thank you for listening to mind Over Murder.