1 00:00:05,160 --> 00:00:10,199 The countdown is on to fight time. This is Big Fight Weekend. Now 2 00:00:10,519 --> 00:00:17,280 Here is your host Djwaves Well we get ready for a weekend and has a 3 00:00:17,399 --> 00:00:22,719 match room des own show in Las Vegas that has a junior welterweight eliminator fight 4 00:00:22,800 --> 00:00:28,640 featuring unbeat American Richard Hitchens. It has one of Dan Rayfield's top buspects, 5 00:00:28,679 --> 00:00:32,679 a super middleweight in Diego Pacheco, a women's world title fight, and more. 6 00:00:32,719 --> 00:00:36,159 We're ready to preview that. We've got fight news, We've got some 7 00:00:36,320 --> 00:00:41,840 outstanding Sugar Ray Leonard, nostalgia and more. It is the Big Fight Weekend 8 00:00:41,880 --> 00:00:45,439 preview podcast. I am the somewhat competent host TJ. Reeves. He is 9 00:00:45,479 --> 00:00:50,119 our insider. Hello Dan Rayfield from his fight for each tonight substack a Big 10 00:00:50,159 --> 00:00:54,200 Fight Weekend dot com. Are you ready to embark on the first weekend of 11 00:00:54,320 --> 00:00:57,240 April? Here we are. Hello, there, I am, and I 12 00:00:57,280 --> 00:01:02,280 will I will mildly correct you and say it's not just that Diego Bacheco is 13 00:01:02,320 --> 00:01:06,640 one of my top prospects. I gave him the twenty twenty three Prospect of 14 00:01:06,680 --> 00:01:10,719 the Year. He in my mind of that group of fighters that would you 15 00:01:10,760 --> 00:01:14,920 know, qualify not a It's not a hard and fast rule like you'd see 16 00:01:14,920 --> 00:01:17,640 in you know, Major League Baseball, where you have to vote for rookie 17 00:01:17,680 --> 00:01:19,280 ye, where it's a certain number appats, ratings, but just sort of 18 00:01:19,280 --> 00:01:23,359 the general criteria that I live by for the twenty some years I've been picking 19 00:01:23,400 --> 00:01:26,519 a prospect of the year. He was my number one guy. I think 20 00:01:26,519 --> 00:01:29,519 he's a world champion and waiting, and I'm excited to see him back in 21 00:01:29,599 --> 00:01:32,760 action this weekend on that card that matter was putting on. We shall see 22 00:01:32,799 --> 00:01:34,519 what he looks like coming up. Thank you for finding us. Make sure 23 00:01:34,599 --> 00:01:38,319 you rate us and review us. It's a new month. The ratings and 24 00:01:38,359 --> 00:01:41,959 reviews do help on Apple Spreaker Spotify, where everyone give us a five star 25 00:01:42,040 --> 00:01:46,640 review. Do that. Make sure you're following subscribing. As is always the 26 00:01:46,719 --> 00:01:49,400 case, I remind people that are not familiar with this, we try, 27 00:01:49,519 --> 00:01:53,640 we do our best to give you a preview going into the weekend, a 28 00:01:53,799 --> 00:01:57,719 recap coming off the weekend Sunday night into Monday. So be on this podcast 29 00:01:57,799 --> 00:02:00,959 feed, the Big Fight Weekend podcast feed for both of those. You and 30 00:02:01,000 --> 00:02:04,920 I have been doing this right at two years. By the way, now, 31 00:02:05,359 --> 00:02:07,000 I was going to say pretty Dillans. You say we try when I 32 00:02:07,360 --> 00:02:12,439 can't remember when it's been rare. Now we have vacation stuff coming up that 33 00:02:12,520 --> 00:02:15,719 you and I are going to talk about where literally there might Heaven forbid, 34 00:02:15,840 --> 00:02:22,680 peeps savages, there might not be a preview podcast on a select week or 35 00:02:22,719 --> 00:02:25,520 a recap podcast because somebody's going to take it. It could happen. It 36 00:02:25,560 --> 00:02:30,240 could happen this week where you had some issues with your technology. I did 37 00:02:30,240 --> 00:02:34,560 it. That's correct. We deliver for the peeps, and some would say 38 00:02:34,599 --> 00:02:37,599 you prefer it that way to just keep talking, but I have to rain 39 00:02:37,680 --> 00:02:38,840 you in every now and then. But yes, we'll do what we can. 40 00:02:38,960 --> 00:02:44,280 But there might be an occasion. I'm just saying coming over the summer 41 00:02:44,319 --> 00:02:46,599 months, because I'm headed to the basketball Final four, for example, So 42 00:02:46,639 --> 00:02:51,120 the college basketball blur is about to be over with the crowning of the national 43 00:02:51,159 --> 00:02:55,479 champion. So I now get a little exhale with that before the NFL and 44 00:02:55,520 --> 00:03:00,520 the college football in the fall. Yes, tons of boxing, but I'm 45 00:03:00,520 --> 00:03:05,560 just saying, as much as I thoroughly enjoy like every Thursday night into Friday 46 00:03:05,560 --> 00:03:08,159 and every Sunday night into Monday with Rayfael, I might be away for one 47 00:03:08,199 --> 00:03:10,960 of those episodes. You might be away for one of those episodes. Missus 48 00:03:12,039 --> 00:03:15,439 Rayfael and young Rayfield may drag you away. And it's okay, peeps if 49 00:03:15,439 --> 00:03:20,199 we're not there on an occasion later this But for right now, we do 50 00:03:20,199 --> 00:03:22,639 a pretty good job of that. With all of that out of the way, 51 00:03:23,120 --> 00:03:25,199 we've got a lot to get to in terms of news as well, 52 00:03:25,560 --> 00:03:30,840 because you've got an update on what's gonna happen with Sebastian Fundura and Tim Zoo 53 00:03:30,960 --> 00:03:35,280 and will there be a sequel and what's our timeline maybe looking like. But 54 00:03:35,360 --> 00:03:39,240 first let's get to this match Room Boxing des Own show in Las Vegas, 55 00:03:39,240 --> 00:03:46,719 where again Richardson Hitchens unbeaten at one hundred and forty pounds fights Gestavo Limos. 56 00:03:46,759 --> 00:03:49,479 You will be proud of me. I did look up that Limos is in 57 00:03:49,599 --> 00:03:53,080 Argentine. He is undefeated. What is he? Twenty nine to zero? 58 00:03:53,199 --> 00:03:55,840 What is my man? Rayfield always says, who's the twenty nine? Who 59 00:03:55,919 --> 00:04:00,520 are these guys that he's been beating as he gets ready out of fight Hitchens 60 00:04:00,520 --> 00:04:02,159 in the matching main event? All right, some thoughts from you on this 61 00:04:02,199 --> 00:04:08,800 one? I mean, you say who is he fought you're asked about Limos. 62 00:04:08,840 --> 00:04:11,960 You know, his biggest thing, and this is not unfamiliar to the 63 00:04:11,960 --> 00:04:14,719 guys that we talk about that are not Argentine, that are fighters that come 64 00:04:14,759 --> 00:04:16,920 from the United States, is that he's had some inactivity. That's been his 65 00:04:16,959 --> 00:04:21,199 biggest problem. Now he is coming off a fight in December, but before 66 00:04:21,240 --> 00:04:25,759 that December of twenty twenty three, and it was only a first round knockout 67 00:04:25,759 --> 00:04:29,279 against a journeyman kind of opponent. But before that he hadn't fought since he 68 00:04:29,439 --> 00:04:33,120 won an eliminator that put him in this position to fight for the final eliminator. 69 00:04:33,680 --> 00:04:38,399 He knocked out the former featherweight title holder Lee Selby, which was probably 70 00:04:38,480 --> 00:04:41,600 his best win so far. That was a fifth round ko and in March 71 00:04:41,639 --> 00:04:45,879 of twenty twenty two. So it's now twenty five months later with the one 72 00:04:45,920 --> 00:04:48,519 first round knockout in between, and he's back in action against Hitchens, and 73 00:04:48,600 --> 00:04:54,480 the winner between Hitchens and Limos becomes the mandatory number one challenger in the IBF, 74 00:04:54,600 --> 00:04:58,519 which means the winner, well it would be for Sybril Mattias, but 75 00:04:58,560 --> 00:05:01,959 obviously he's got the home town fight in Puerto Rico coming up in June against 76 00:05:02,120 --> 00:05:05,439 Liam Paro. So the winner of the Hitchens I mean, I'm sorry of 77 00:05:05,480 --> 00:05:11,360 the Mattias and Paro fight is going to have to fight the winner between Hitchins 78 00:05:11,399 --> 00:05:14,319 and Limos at some point. Now, Hitchins is a very interesting fighter from 79 00:05:14,319 --> 00:05:17,560 the standpoint that he's super skilled, tons of talent, Olympian, great background 80 00:05:17,560 --> 00:05:20,560 in the pedigree in terms of the amateurs, fought for Haiti in the Olympic 81 00:05:20,600 --> 00:05:24,319 Games. But he's from New York and he grew up with a lot of 82 00:05:24,319 --> 00:05:28,279 those New York you know fighters that are in and around in those gyms and 83 00:05:28,560 --> 00:05:31,240 knows all those guys you know, knows like Tia Fima, Lopez and Berlanga 84 00:05:31,319 --> 00:05:34,959 and a lot of the fighters that are from that same group. And you 85 00:05:35,000 --> 00:05:40,360 know, he is a very good technician, not the most exciting guy in 86 00:05:40,360 --> 00:05:43,120 the world, but he can box everybody's years off. Obviously, if you 87 00:05:43,160 --> 00:05:45,600 take a look at the fight he had in his most recent out, he 88 00:05:45,639 --> 00:05:49,480 fought josees Apated. This is the josees A Beta prior to being knocked out 89 00:05:49,480 --> 00:05:54,399 by Dolphin Smith. And he didn't get the knockout against Jose's Zipeta, but 90 00:05:54,480 --> 00:05:59,079 what he did was he won twelve out of twelve rounds on two score cards. 91 00:05:59,120 --> 00:06:02,160 He won eleven out of twelve rounds on the third and just made Zepeta 92 00:06:02,199 --> 00:06:04,879 look like he didn't belong in the ring with them, just completely took him 93 00:06:04,879 --> 00:06:08,879 apart, out boxed him, and just one going away. Didn't really take 94 00:06:08,879 --> 00:06:12,600 any punishment at all in that fight. In his fight before that, which 95 00:06:12,639 --> 00:06:15,560 at the time was considered like prospect versus prospect, who's going to take the 96 00:06:15,600 --> 00:06:18,800 next step, it was the undefeated Hitchins. This is in February of last 97 00:06:18,879 --> 00:06:23,199 year, against the undefeated John Bowsa, who was also a pretty good amateur. 98 00:06:23,360 --> 00:06:27,399 They fought at the Madison Square Garden Theater and Hitchins won a ten round 99 00:06:27,439 --> 00:06:30,519 decision in that fight, but he beat him up bad. I mean he 100 00:06:30,639 --> 00:06:33,519 dropped him twice. That fight could have been stopped at really, frankly, 101 00:06:33,560 --> 00:06:36,839 my view watching that fight probably should have been stopped and would have given Hitchins 102 00:06:36,879 --> 00:06:40,959 the knockout. But Hitchins is one of these guys who's got all sorts of 103 00:06:41,000 --> 00:06:44,720 talent, lots of skills, not a huge puncher, but really can box. 104 00:06:44,759 --> 00:06:47,720 Reminds me in like a small way of like a Floyd Mayweather from the 105 00:06:47,720 --> 00:06:53,639 stand. I don't want to say he's ployed, just you said, reminds 106 00:06:53,680 --> 00:06:57,480 you of Okay Qualify in the style because of the way he uses his jab 107 00:06:57,560 --> 00:07:00,639 the shoulder. He also was at time when he turned pro for the first 108 00:07:00,639 --> 00:07:04,879 several you know, first probably fourteen fights of his career something like that. 109 00:07:05,040 --> 00:07:10,199 He was promoted by Mayweather Promotions. He has trained with Floyd and like I 110 00:07:10,199 --> 00:07:14,000 said, he's a very very solid twenty six years old, which is still 111 00:07:14,000 --> 00:07:15,600 on the rise, seventeen and oero, and he's taken on a guy in 112 00:07:15,639 --> 00:07:19,040 Limos who again not the biggest name in the world, but you know, 113 00:07:19,120 --> 00:07:25,040 does have that big knockout against against Lise Albi, who granted was a featherweight 114 00:07:25,439 --> 00:07:27,560 title holder, but now he fought him and knocked him out in the one 115 00:07:27,639 --> 00:07:30,319 hundred and thirty five pound way class. But you know, it's it's a 116 00:07:30,959 --> 00:07:34,879 it's it seems on paper to be a good test for both guys as a 117 00:07:34,920 --> 00:07:38,120 matter of fact, and the winner is going to earn the title shot. 118 00:07:38,160 --> 00:07:41,240 That's why, because of the stakes in this fight, it's the main event 119 00:07:41,279 --> 00:07:44,959 because otherwise Pacheco has been headlining. You know, he headlined his last fight 120 00:07:44,959 --> 00:07:48,839 in his hometown in Los Angeles. And interesting about this particular card that matrim 121 00:07:48,879 --> 00:07:54,000 is doing. They will become the first folks to put on a boxing event 122 00:07:54,040 --> 00:07:58,319 at the Fountain Blue Resort that's in Las Vegas, which is a somewhat new, 123 00:07:59,079 --> 00:08:01,560 you know, and resort out there. So it's always nice to open 124 00:08:01,560 --> 00:08:05,279 a new venue for fights. Hasn't gotten a huge amount of publicity, but 125 00:08:07,000 --> 00:08:09,759 you know, because the matchups themselves that the opponents are not big names, 126 00:08:09,759 --> 00:08:13,720 even if they're like decent opponents. But you know, Hitchens and Pachecko are 127 00:08:13,879 --> 00:08:16,000 two of the better younger fighters in the sport, you know, much less 128 00:08:16,000 --> 00:08:20,519 the match room boxing stable. All right, so let's get right into Pachecko 129 00:08:20,600 --> 00:08:22,519 and his opponent. I have to confess again. This is where we defer 130 00:08:22,560 --> 00:08:26,920 to you. I don't know a lot about Sean McCalman, but tell me 131 00:08:28,000 --> 00:08:31,399 more. And is he a legit threat here in this super middleweight fight or 132 00:08:31,399 --> 00:08:35,240 are we looking for Pachecko to look spectacular here and then on to the next 133 00:08:35,240 --> 00:08:37,559 thing and maybe a big thing. Yeah, I mean I don't know about 134 00:08:37,559 --> 00:08:41,480 spectacular, he asked. Is it like a legit threat? Like I was 135 00:08:41,519 --> 00:08:45,799 looking at his record and I'm not going to downgrade Sean McCalman because I don't 136 00:08:45,960 --> 00:08:48,960 know much about him only from the standpoint of looking at his record, so 137 00:08:48,080 --> 00:08:50,440 look for what it's worth. He is undefeated, he's fifteen to zero, 138 00:08:50,759 --> 00:08:52,799 he has seven knockouts, and when you take a look on first of all, 139 00:08:52,840 --> 00:08:56,480 he's got, you know, pretty decent size. He's six foot tall. 140 00:08:56,039 --> 00:09:00,399 He's not like in his twenties, like early twenties like Checko is. 141 00:09:00,440 --> 00:09:03,679 He's thirty years old, not old Denver Colorado product. And if you take 142 00:09:03,679 --> 00:09:07,600 a look at the guys he's beaten, he has a win. Like for 143 00:09:07,639 --> 00:09:11,000 example, in August of last year, he beat in a fighter named Money 144 00:09:11,000 --> 00:09:13,799 Powell who when he signed was a good amateur and had a lot of hype 145 00:09:13,799 --> 00:09:18,240 behind him, hadn't really panned out, had one loss, and he won 146 00:09:18,360 --> 00:09:22,039 a pretty you know, clear cut eight round decision against him. But he 147 00:09:22,080 --> 00:09:26,639 hasn't fought any kinds of names. Maybe the most name that's known, but 148 00:09:26,679 --> 00:09:30,399 it's not because he's like a top fighter, but just because he fought everybody, 149 00:09:30,399 --> 00:09:33,279 and he's the brother a former world champion. He has a six round 150 00:09:33,320 --> 00:09:37,240 decision against von Alexander, who has fought everybody and has got a very hard 151 00:09:37,440 --> 00:09:39,679 head and doesn't get knocked out a lot, So you know, he's fighting 152 00:09:39,720 --> 00:09:45,440 those types of guys that you expect on the way up. So now he's 153 00:09:45,440 --> 00:09:48,320 stepping in with a guy who I just said to you was the number one 154 00:09:48,360 --> 00:09:52,159 prospect in boxing at least in my estimation at the end of twenty twenty three, 155 00:09:52,200 --> 00:09:54,039 in Diego Pacheco, who I think is a I said, a future 156 00:09:54,080 --> 00:09:58,440 world champion. He's twenty zero, was seventeen knockouts, got great height for 157 00:09:58,480 --> 00:10:01,519 that weight class at six foot four, good punching, cower cow. He's 158 00:10:01,559 --> 00:10:05,320 that tall. He's that tall for super milliy So look, he's gonna be 159 00:10:05,399 --> 00:10:09,840 I mean, he's only twenty three years old. When it's all said and 160 00:10:09,840 --> 00:10:11,720 done, Diego Pacheco, in my opinion, some day he's going to be 161 00:10:11,759 --> 00:10:15,559 a cruiserweight, you know when you know that's years down the road, but 162 00:10:15,559 --> 00:10:18,000 he's gonna he's gonna be in this in this super middleweight division for the time 163 00:10:18,039 --> 00:10:24,399 being. So clearly he's the big favorite. He's coming off his best victory 164 00:10:24,440 --> 00:10:26,559 of his career that took place. That was the homecoming fight that they had 165 00:10:26,559 --> 00:10:31,519 in Inglewood, California. He fought against Marcelo Cosras who fought for a world 166 00:10:31,519 --> 00:10:35,600 title. Who was the guy that dropped Edgar Berlanga in the fight where Berlanga 167 00:10:35,679 --> 00:10:39,879 suffered a torn biceps. Berlanga still went on to win the fight. He 168 00:10:39,960 --> 00:10:45,519 had fought Billy Joe Saunders in a tough fight, and Pachecko didn't struggle with 169 00:10:45,600 --> 00:10:48,039 him, just basically blew him out. I mean, he was dominating the 170 00:10:48,039 --> 00:10:50,399 fight and knocked him out in the ninth round and it was a very very 171 00:10:50,440 --> 00:10:54,000 outstanding performance. And frankly, when I'm doing my prospect stuff at the end 172 00:10:54,000 --> 00:10:56,600 of the year, you know, I waited till that fight was over because 173 00:10:56,639 --> 00:11:00,799 it was in late November, mid to late November when that happened. So 174 00:11:00,879 --> 00:11:05,039 when he did that to that caliber of opponent, combined with the other good 175 00:11:05,080 --> 00:11:09,519 performances he had had in twenty twenty three, plus the long term outlook of 176 00:11:09,559 --> 00:11:11,879 his career. Because I don't try to pick a prospect that's just like a 177 00:11:11,919 --> 00:11:15,159 guy that has a couple of decent wins. I'm talking about a guy that 178 00:11:15,200 --> 00:11:18,000 you when I make the prospect pick, in my mind, can this guy 179 00:11:18,039 --> 00:11:20,840 be in the Hall of Fame someday, you know? Or can this guy 180 00:11:20,879 --> 00:11:24,360 become like a legitimate long term champion. Now you have to go with what's 181 00:11:24,399 --> 00:11:26,279 in front of you. You know who the guys are available, but of 182 00:11:26,360 --> 00:11:28,960 the folks that were there in that in the running, in my mind, 183 00:11:30,000 --> 00:11:33,120 he was the guy that fit the bill. I think the checko, you 184 00:11:33,120 --> 00:11:35,720 know, probably should look spectacular against this fighter. Again, nothing against mccownvian, 185 00:11:35,759 --> 00:11:39,399 but you know, we're talking about a guy that I think has got 186 00:11:39,759 --> 00:11:45,679 serious, you know, pound for pound world championship level, serious legitimate possibilities. 187 00:11:45,679 --> 00:11:48,559 And he is the guy that when MATCHWMS signed all these young Americans, 188 00:11:48,960 --> 00:11:52,559 some of them haven't panned out. Some of them are still on the rise, 189 00:11:52,600 --> 00:11:54,919 and you know, maybe they'll get to that level like an Austin Williams 190 00:11:54,960 --> 00:11:58,240 for example. Some of them have not done anything like the you know Nikita 191 00:11:58,240 --> 00:12:01,799 Ababe White Chocolate, who's you know, still fighting and is still undefeated but 192 00:12:01,039 --> 00:12:05,399 is not fighting anybody worth the DAN and doesn't seem to care. And you 193 00:12:05,480 --> 00:12:09,080 got a guy like Pachecko who looks like he's the real deal. And we'll 194 00:12:09,120 --> 00:12:15,320 see a little bit more how real the deal he is if he performs on 195 00:12:15,320 --> 00:12:18,519 on this this card on Saturday. So I'm looking forward to seeing how he 196 00:12:18,559 --> 00:12:22,519 performs. I'm I mean in nothing against the main event with Limos and Hitchins, 197 00:12:22,519 --> 00:12:26,960 which is for stakes because of the eliminator, but just for my purposes 198 00:12:26,000 --> 00:12:31,759 of my own interests as a as a fan, I'm interested in both fights, 199 00:12:31,799 --> 00:12:35,440 but I'm more interested to see Pachecko because I find them the very exciting, 200 00:12:35,840 --> 00:12:39,159 very interesting, really good puncher and can also box. So I just 201 00:12:39,440 --> 00:12:43,679 I love watching this guy fight. And we'll see if Hitchins can can continue 202 00:12:43,679 --> 00:12:46,519 to take the next step in the near him civil World Championship opportunity. And 203 00:12:46,559 --> 00:12:48,759 we will make a mention that you and I will handicap these two fights on 204 00:12:48,799 --> 00:12:54,639 the bet Us Boxing show coming Friday one Eastern time for what we think on 205 00:12:54,759 --> 00:12:58,759 those all? Right? On the undercard, three more fights on that undercard 206 00:12:58,759 --> 00:13:03,879 in pluting a women's w vacant featherweight title fight with Sky Nicholson and Sarah Mafud 207 00:13:05,519 --> 00:13:09,960 scheduled for ten rounds, plus Gallia Phi, a flyweight that's in the match 208 00:13:09,000 --> 00:13:13,519 Room stable, and Mark Castro, a junior lightweight. They're all on the 209 00:13:13,559 --> 00:13:16,759 card. What are you intrigued by all of these? Does one stand out 210 00:13:16,759 --> 00:13:20,000 more than the other on the Matchroom undercard? Well, basically, what this 211 00:13:20,960 --> 00:13:22,480 is they're taking this, as you can tell by the way they've lined it 212 00:13:22,600 --> 00:13:28,080 up, is that they are putting together some of the top of the guys 213 00:13:28,120 --> 00:13:31,840 in their stable of what Eddie heard and his team considered their best prospects. 214 00:13:31,840 --> 00:13:37,159 They're putting them pretty much all together in that same you know, in that 215 00:13:37,200 --> 00:13:39,240 same group. So when you mentioned about y Fi for example, so he's 216 00:13:39,240 --> 00:13:43,679 the brother obviously of the of the other boxing brothers are putting Cal who was 217 00:13:43,679 --> 00:13:48,039 a former world champion Galal though. I think a lot of people think even 218 00:13:48,080 --> 00:13:50,679 though he's a little bit older for a prospect, he's already thirty one years 219 00:13:50,720 --> 00:13:52,960 old. I mean, but he's moving very quickly. But the reason is 220 00:13:52,960 --> 00:13:56,720 because he stayed amateur for a long period of time and he won the gold 221 00:13:56,759 --> 00:14:01,360 medal in the twenty twenty delayed Tokyo Olympics. They've got high hopes for him. 222 00:14:01,360 --> 00:14:03,360 They've moved along very quickly. He's looked good and you know, all 223 00:14:03,360 --> 00:14:05,519 his fights have been on his own on their show so far, I've seen 224 00:14:05,559 --> 00:14:09,879 every single one of them. He's fighting for a guy that only has six 225 00:14:09,919 --> 00:14:13,360 pro fights now but had all that amateur brackron. He's fighting real guys. 226 00:14:13,440 --> 00:14:18,200 They didn't start him off with like like bullshit four rounders against guys you're gonna 227 00:14:18,200 --> 00:14:20,200 just not got. He turned professional at ten rounder, and you know he's 228 00:14:20,200 --> 00:14:22,960 already won, you know, one of the regional titles as they move him 229 00:14:22,960 --> 00:14:26,120 along in the WBC rankings, so you know he's fighting a guy with a 230 00:14:26,120 --> 00:14:28,720 good record who I really don't be honest, don't know much about it twenty 231 00:14:28,759 --> 00:14:33,440 one and one, but you know, he looks like sometime in this year 232 00:14:33,759 --> 00:14:35,960 he's gonna probably be in the in the mix for either an eliminator or world 233 00:14:35,960 --> 00:14:39,320 title fight as long as he keeps on winning. So you know, I 234 00:14:39,360 --> 00:14:41,879 don't know if I call him a prospect just because of the age, but 235 00:14:41,879 --> 00:14:45,240 I'll tell you who is a prospect, and that's Mark Castro. Now, 236 00:14:45,240 --> 00:14:50,320 Mark Cashrow is a lightweight from Fresno area. He's a very exciting fighter to 237 00:14:50,360 --> 00:14:52,879 watch. But he was a tremendous amateur, you know, big time, 238 00:14:54,320 --> 00:14:58,399 big time amateur, has a bunch of wins in the amateurs against Keishaan Davis, 239 00:14:58,399 --> 00:15:01,120 for example, you know who. We all know what his status is 240 00:15:01,159 --> 00:15:03,279 as a professional these days. I had him as a prospect of thee A 241 00:15:03,279 --> 00:15:07,320 couple of years ago. But Castro is eleven to zero and he's taken on 242 00:15:07,399 --> 00:15:09,720 a pretty solid opponent in Abraham Montoya. Not a great opponent, but a 243 00:15:09,759 --> 00:15:13,240 guy that's tough as nails, and you know, we'll see what Cashro does. 244 00:15:13,240 --> 00:15:16,120 He's been fighting between like one hundred and thirty one hundred and thirty five 245 00:15:16,159 --> 00:15:18,879 pounds as he I think they're still trying to figure out what wake last he 246 00:15:18,919 --> 00:15:22,240 wants to truly go for. He's he's making thirty, but he's had a 247 00:15:22,240 --> 00:15:26,600 little struggles here and there, so sometimes he's fought in like at thirty five. 248 00:15:26,960 --> 00:15:30,600 You know, it remains to be seen where he's truly gonna be when 249 00:15:30,600 --> 00:15:33,240 it comes time to if he's actually gonna go and get a chance ay to 250 00:15:33,399 --> 00:15:35,440 fight for a title, for example. But the opponent that he's fighting has 251 00:15:35,480 --> 00:15:41,480 faced like other prospects and done Okay lost a decision to Gabriel Flores lost a 252 00:15:41,559 --> 00:15:45,799 decision to Andrea Sportes. Those are two names that the diehards may have heard 253 00:15:45,840 --> 00:15:48,799 of because of they were being brought up. But Castro was super exciting. 254 00:15:50,120 --> 00:15:52,960 You can tell how how well thought of he is because he he's friendly with 255 00:15:54,000 --> 00:15:56,240 the Canelo Alvares team and Canelo invited him to be in the camp, and 256 00:15:56,279 --> 00:16:00,840 Canelo liked him, and I in Cashro had like the first few of his 257 00:16:00,919 --> 00:16:04,639 fights of his career on remember when Canelo went through that stretch where he's fighting 258 00:16:04,639 --> 00:16:07,519 like every month. That felt like when he thought that, you know, 259 00:16:07,559 --> 00:16:10,679 the four times or four or five times in the Spanish year at the end 260 00:16:10,679 --> 00:16:12,240 of twenty twenty, in the beginning of twenty twenty one, right exactly. 261 00:16:12,279 --> 00:16:15,679 So Mark Cashall fought on all of those undercard primarily. You know, it 262 00:16:15,799 --> 00:16:18,039 was a joke. Like you know, I remember interviewing us. I said, 263 00:16:18,039 --> 00:16:21,360 Mark, you know, you realize you're not going to be fighting on 264 00:16:21,399 --> 00:16:23,120 every one of Canello's cards because he only got at some point in a fight 265 00:16:23,159 --> 00:16:26,000 once or twice a year. And you know, he laughed about it. 266 00:16:26,039 --> 00:16:29,559 But I'm just making the point that it tells you how highly thought of he 267 00:16:29,759 --> 00:16:33,480 was that Canelo and his team wanted him on their undercard, and so he's 268 00:16:33,519 --> 00:16:37,840 he's definitely a you know, a quality prospect. And you mentioned the other 269 00:16:37,879 --> 00:16:42,039 fighter that they're going to show, that's the women's title fight with with Sky 270 00:16:42,120 --> 00:16:45,519 Nicholson. Now she was an olympian also and she had the interim title. 271 00:16:45,519 --> 00:16:48,159 I'm not sure why she wasn't just elevated to the title, because the reason 272 00:16:48,159 --> 00:16:52,840 why that WBC title is vacant, and people listen to us, We've talked 273 00:16:52,840 --> 00:16:57,000 about this plenty of times. The wbcou would not allow the undisputed champion at 274 00:16:57,000 --> 00:17:00,759 the time, which was Amanda Serrano, have a boxing masch schedule for twelve 275 00:17:00,840 --> 00:17:06,559 rounds at three minutes, so she vacated the WBC title. Now, Sky 276 00:17:06,640 --> 00:17:08,319 Nicholson tried to make it out like she was trying to hide from her, 277 00:17:08,359 --> 00:17:11,720 which is absolutely patently ridiculous. But you know, she's trying to hype her 278 00:17:11,720 --> 00:17:14,640 something up. I get that. I've got no part with that. So 279 00:17:15,200 --> 00:17:18,279 she's fighting Mafoud, who is a very experienced fighter, for the vacant title. 280 00:17:18,599 --> 00:17:22,079 And you know, there's a lot of high oaks for Sky to win 281 00:17:22,119 --> 00:17:25,279 a world title, and she's not going to do it against Amanda Serrano. 282 00:17:25,319 --> 00:17:27,000 But certainly how's just going now, You're not going to get a shot at 283 00:17:27,000 --> 00:17:32,200 Serrana because she wants to fight twelve rounds. So but we'll see somebody gets 284 00:17:32,200 --> 00:17:34,400 a world title out of this fight. Food the veteran there's some good trash 285 00:17:34,400 --> 00:17:37,640 talk, by the way, in the build up for this too, for 286 00:17:37,759 --> 00:17:44,000 these for these ladies at at featherweight as well. All right, so that 287 00:17:44,119 --> 00:17:45,440 is the matchroom car. A pretty good fight, I guess, you know, 288 00:17:45,519 --> 00:17:48,960 I think so and well, I mean somebody comes out of it as 289 00:17:48,960 --> 00:17:52,880 a world champ too. So and so that's the matchroom card. There's also 290 00:17:52,960 --> 00:17:59,279 a title fight in Germany. Bachram martaz Elaiev will fight Jack Colek and this 291 00:17:59,440 --> 00:18:03,720 is for one of the belts that have been vacated for Jamel Charlo, the 292 00:18:03,799 --> 00:18:11,240 junior middleweight title holder. This is the IBF version obviously Tim Zu Sebastian Fundora 293 00:18:11,319 --> 00:18:14,000 that we're going to talk about more in a couple of moments. They fought 294 00:18:14,039 --> 00:18:18,200 for the WBO and WBC versions. This is the IBF one hundred and fifty 295 00:18:18,200 --> 00:18:22,599 four pound title. And why is this in Germany? Again? Clarify all 296 00:18:22,599 --> 00:18:26,559 this money one? Well, I mean col K was the mandatory challenger. 297 00:18:26,759 --> 00:18:29,759 I'm sorry, I take that back. It was Bachram who was the mandatory 298 00:18:29,839 --> 00:18:33,200 challenger for Charlot and they had put it off on a number of occasions where 299 00:18:33,200 --> 00:18:37,119 he took step aside. PBC put him on under cards to keep him active. 300 00:18:37,400 --> 00:18:41,799 To allow him Charlot to take other fights, and then it finally got 301 00:18:41,880 --> 00:18:47,680 to a point where the rubber hits the road. And this is post Charlot's 302 00:18:47,680 --> 00:18:49,720 lost to Canelo, where he didn't know what he was doing. Most people 303 00:18:49,720 --> 00:18:52,319 think he's not going to fight again at one fifty four, and it got 304 00:18:52,359 --> 00:18:56,839 to the point where the IBF ordered the purse bid. The purspit was scheduled, 305 00:18:56,079 --> 00:19:00,960 and like in the hours before the purse bid, Charlot vacated the title, 306 00:19:00,960 --> 00:19:03,359 which didn't come as a huge surprise. He just waited to the last 307 00:19:03,359 --> 00:19:07,720 minute to do it. And so that left Bachram having made very good money 308 00:19:07,720 --> 00:19:11,039 frankly for multiple step aside deals with PBC. I mean he made you know, 309 00:19:11,319 --> 00:19:14,000 he might have made a million dollars or more. It's certainly hundreds and 310 00:19:14,079 --> 00:19:18,960 hundreds of thousands just to step aside and fight other fights while waiting. Uh. 311 00:19:18,000 --> 00:19:22,039 And then when that title became vacant, the next leading guy in their 312 00:19:22,119 --> 00:19:25,480 rankings was col k who you know, he's okay, he's got He's been 313 00:19:25,480 --> 00:19:26,200 in the ring with some good guys. He does have a loss, for 314 00:19:26,240 --> 00:19:30,480 example, to Dmitri's andre H In any event, now they're fighting for the 315 00:19:30,920 --> 00:19:33,799 vacant title. You say, why is it in Germany? Because Jack colk 316 00:19:34,039 --> 00:19:38,079 Is is based in Germany and it was his promotional team that won the purse 317 00:19:38,119 --> 00:19:41,519 bit for the fight. So Bachram is Uh is going on the road to 318 00:19:41,559 --> 00:19:45,640 do this fight. And the thing about it is now Bachrum is a Russian 319 00:19:45,680 --> 00:19:49,440 fighter. He's been training in California. But the thing about this fight, 320 00:19:49,640 --> 00:19:55,119 which is highly unusual, I can't find any evidence anywhere that it's televised. 321 00:19:56,559 --> 00:20:00,359 So we know the revolution will not be televised, neither will Balkram and call 322 00:20:00,480 --> 00:20:03,319 Ka On a Saturday, right, Fiel's got to see the fight. I 323 00:20:03,319 --> 00:20:06,519 mean, hopefully somebody will put it up on YouTube. Maybe it'll be a 324 00:20:06,519 --> 00:20:10,079 stream on YouTube. I'm gonna actually, at some point between now and Saturday, 325 00:20:10,119 --> 00:20:11,559 when the fight's supposed to take place, I'm gonna look on the on 326 00:20:11,599 --> 00:20:15,039 the website, like on the Facebook page or whatever of the promoter. But 327 00:20:15,160 --> 00:20:19,519 sometimes they put up a stream or a link. But there's been nothing announce 328 00:20:19,559 --> 00:20:23,000 that I'm aware of. I haven't seen anything now. I can't be I'd 329 00:20:23,000 --> 00:20:26,960 be less than truthful that I've spent any time searching for it. But if 330 00:20:26,000 --> 00:20:29,400 they were sending out any kind of press announcement or anything about it. All 331 00:20:29,480 --> 00:20:32,240 right, I would have saw it, I suppose. All right, So 332 00:20:32,359 --> 00:20:36,400 that fight is Saturday afternoon US time, right, So because of Germany, 333 00:20:36,759 --> 00:20:38,559 the upshot is that that the winner of the fight, love him or hate 334 00:20:38,599 --> 00:20:41,319 him, is going to be a player at one fifty four because they're gonna 335 00:20:41,319 --> 00:20:45,599 have one of the belts. End of story. So that segues into the 336 00:20:45,640 --> 00:20:52,000 news, and the news is that the discussion has been ongoing, at least 337 00:20:52,079 --> 00:20:55,759 you know, in the media publicly about will there be a rematch for Tim 338 00:20:55,839 --> 00:21:00,640 Zoo and Sebastian Fundora the bloody gory two belt one and fifty four pound title 339 00:21:00,640 --> 00:21:04,240 fight one by Fundorra on the split decision back on Saturday night. All right, 340 00:21:04,279 --> 00:21:10,319 So Samson Lukowitz very active on social media and talking about this on the 341 00:21:10,359 --> 00:21:12,279 record, saying, okay, they will do the rematch, but it's not 342 00:21:12,400 --> 00:21:18,480 that simple. So Dan get into this a little more in particular about what's 343 00:21:18,519 --> 00:21:22,359 our timeline on when might we see a rematch? Fondora as the champ now 344 00:21:22,400 --> 00:21:25,880 and Zoo trying to get the belts back. All right, So when the 345 00:21:25,880 --> 00:21:29,960 fight ended on Saturday and they went to the postfight press conference. Members of 346 00:21:30,000 --> 00:21:33,400 the media that were at the press cards in the Timobil arena asked directly to 347 00:21:33,559 --> 00:21:36,920 Tim Zuo and to Sebastian Pandora, is there a rematch clause that are you 348 00:21:36,960 --> 00:21:40,920 gonna honor it if there is one? And both fighters deferred the client to 349 00:21:40,920 --> 00:21:44,559 answer that, and so therefore it went over to Samson, who was Fondora's 350 00:21:44,599 --> 00:21:48,680 promoter, and he was asked the same question, and Samson made an answer 351 00:21:49,039 --> 00:21:52,960 that was kind of words ouid like like he didn't really you know, he 352 00:21:52,519 --> 00:21:59,000 talked about it, but he didn't give a real specific response, basically saying 353 00:21:59,039 --> 00:22:02,000 that there was a verbal match clause, which I found to be highly unusual. 354 00:22:02,519 --> 00:22:04,720 But we need to maximize the money of the fighter. Most likely he's 355 00:22:04,759 --> 00:22:08,039 gonna have the way to fight, you know, regroup himself. Then maybe 356 00:22:08,039 --> 00:22:11,200 we can do it, but we need to take care of the business. 357 00:22:11,240 --> 00:22:14,400 Like, okay, that means you're trying to no offense to smite my good 358 00:22:14,400 --> 00:22:18,079 palace Sampson, who I've known for my entire career. When you talk like 359 00:22:18,119 --> 00:22:22,200 that, that means at least my radar goes off that you're trying to get 360 00:22:22,200 --> 00:22:23,799 out of the fight. You don't want to do the fight because in the 361 00:22:23,880 --> 00:22:26,440 ring after the fight was Errol Spence, who, whatever you think about, 362 00:22:26,440 --> 00:22:30,359 the match would probably bring him a pretty good amount of money. There was 363 00:22:30,359 --> 00:22:33,119 also the fact that in the day after the fight, the WBO, as 364 00:22:33,119 --> 00:22:37,720 we expected, ordered them to commence negotiations on Friday. That was like giving 365 00:22:37,720 --> 00:22:41,559 them their twenty day windows since he's the WBO mandatory even though he's the welterweight 366 00:22:41,640 --> 00:22:47,319 champion, he invoked his right as a WBO champion to become the automatic mandatory 367 00:22:47,359 --> 00:22:49,079 if you go up to the next weight class. So there was a lot 368 00:22:49,119 --> 00:22:52,079 of conversation, well about you're duck in the rematch, because let's be honest, 369 00:22:52,079 --> 00:22:56,240 I mean, if there was ever a fight that called for a rematch, 370 00:22:56,279 --> 00:22:59,880 a rematch clause or not, Sabasha vandor against Tim Zoo obviously did based 371 00:22:59,880 --> 00:23:03,160 on what happened in the fight. So I was glad to see this that 372 00:23:03,960 --> 00:23:08,039 earlier in the week after that that weird answer at the press cards. Samson, 373 00:23:08,480 --> 00:23:11,440 his publicist, sent out some comments from him, and I later spoke 374 00:23:11,440 --> 00:23:18,039 to him about it at length on the telephone. He basically clarified and said, 375 00:23:18,480 --> 00:23:22,640 we're you know, it's it's he explained the verbal part, which was 376 00:23:22,839 --> 00:23:27,119 because the fight between fundor and Zoo was made on such short notice twelve days 377 00:23:27,440 --> 00:23:30,599 that he said, we didn't have a We really didn't have time to get 378 00:23:30,640 --> 00:23:34,319 every single thing done in a paper contract. So he's a man of his 379 00:23:34,359 --> 00:23:37,960 word. That's his reputation in the business. That's how I found him in 380 00:23:37,960 --> 00:23:42,440 my dealings with him for almost twenty five years. And so they shook on 381 00:23:42,519 --> 00:23:45,359 it basically, and he said, we're going to honor that. So so 382 00:23:45,640 --> 00:23:49,519 by the way, I've heard this criticism, and we were talking about Zoo's 383 00:23:49,559 --> 00:23:55,319 team and inexperience and dealing with the cut and the whole thing on the accidental 384 00:23:55,359 --> 00:23:57,480 foul and should they have just said go to the cards. This is not 385 00:23:57,519 --> 00:24:02,160 going to get any better experience. And I've heard this point it out. 386 00:24:02,240 --> 00:24:06,359 I agree with this. I want your feeling this is more inexperience on Zoo's 387 00:24:06,440 --> 00:24:08,559 team's part, that they didn't have an in writing, saying to Fundorra, 388 00:24:08,680 --> 00:24:11,400 if you're going to be the guy, you're going to sign a one way 389 00:24:11,440 --> 00:24:15,680 rematch clause in the event that we don't win here on twelve days notice, 390 00:24:15,680 --> 00:24:18,319 and it's going to be in writing. And then it's up to Fundra to 391 00:24:18,359 --> 00:24:21,079 decide do you want to take the fight. So the fact that they didn't 392 00:24:21,119 --> 00:24:25,119 do that again, I think calls into question the people that are around him 393 00:24:25,119 --> 00:24:29,880 and handling him because of all the circumstances you just laid out. If it's 394 00:24:29,880 --> 00:24:32,559 not in writing, even if it is in writing in boxing, it often 395 00:24:32,599 --> 00:24:34,799 gets ignored. But it's apparently not in writing. What do you say to 396 00:24:34,839 --> 00:24:38,680 that? I say that you're not You're not wrong about that. Now. 397 00:24:38,720 --> 00:24:44,000 I have respect for the Timi Zoo team, but if I'm going to get 398 00:24:44,000 --> 00:24:45,799 anything in a piece of paper with my actual bout agreement, I'm going to 399 00:24:45,880 --> 00:24:49,039 be damn sure that that remat shit sign and that's part of it. I 400 00:24:49,039 --> 00:24:52,799 mean, you know that seemed like that would be a very important element. 401 00:24:53,279 --> 00:24:56,599 And I would say to the tim Zoo team, you are lucky that you're 402 00:24:56,640 --> 00:25:00,880 dealing with one of the more honorable people you would know with boxing and Samson 403 00:25:00,920 --> 00:25:03,559 Lukewitz, because there's a lot of far less honorable people that would tell you 404 00:25:03,559 --> 00:25:06,880 to go fuck yourself, and they would just leave you high and dry and 405 00:25:06,920 --> 00:25:10,759 not do the rematch, and you're on your own now. All that said, 406 00:25:11,440 --> 00:25:14,119 clearly, the rematch is worth a lot more money than it was the 407 00:25:14,119 --> 00:25:17,680 first time around because of what unfolded. I'm sure that will be a much 408 00:25:17,680 --> 00:25:21,839 bigger event if they have the rematch. Secondly, and this is important because 409 00:25:21,880 --> 00:25:26,599 in terms of the timing, Samson made it very clear that, as he 410 00:25:26,640 --> 00:25:30,000 said in his comment, my word is always equal to a sign contract. 411 00:25:30,000 --> 00:25:33,920 Tim Zoo, your rematch is ready when you are when he'll be ready. 412 00:25:33,960 --> 00:25:37,039 We don't know. Number One, he did take stitches because of that terrible 413 00:25:37,079 --> 00:25:40,519 gash. But the guy that seemed more damaged physically that's going to need longer 414 00:25:40,559 --> 00:25:44,160 to recover is Fundora because he had a badly broken nose. I saw the 415 00:25:44,160 --> 00:25:47,960 commission sheet that put him on suspension. He needs to have that cleared to 416 00:25:48,039 --> 00:25:49,640 the doctor, which would be normal anyway. But if he doesn't get the 417 00:25:49,680 --> 00:25:53,200 doctor clearance, he's suspended to at least September. I mean, he probably 418 00:25:53,240 --> 00:25:56,519 can get cleared before that. But even if he gets cleared and he can 419 00:25:56,559 --> 00:26:00,759 go before September, or even if it's not until September. And this is 420 00:26:00,799 --> 00:26:04,000 something that Samson and I spoke about an hour telephone conversation that Freddie Fundor, 421 00:26:04,039 --> 00:26:10,039 who was the father and trainer of Samson, I mean of Sebastian told Samson 422 00:26:10,279 --> 00:26:12,839 that my son is not going to fight whatever we do. He's not fighting 423 00:26:12,960 --> 00:26:17,839 until November. So if there's gonna be a Zoo rematch, you're looking at 424 00:26:17,880 --> 00:26:22,720 November, maybe December before the one more fight this year. And now, 425 00:26:22,799 --> 00:26:25,759 whether Zoo was gonna sit around and wait for that remains to be seen, 426 00:26:25,799 --> 00:26:27,759 as you know, he's wanted to stay busy. He didn't wait for the 427 00:26:27,880 --> 00:26:33,279 Charlo fight to get rescheduled because of his broken hand. He ended up getting 428 00:26:33,319 --> 00:26:37,319 the interim title and having fights in Australia between now and then. And then 429 00:26:37,319 --> 00:26:41,200 there's also the possibility that and Samson left this open again. He said it's 430 00:26:41,240 --> 00:26:42,799 up to Zoo, but if they if he wants to have an interim fight, 431 00:26:42,920 --> 00:26:45,920 that's okay with us also, which means if Zoo did that, it 432 00:26:45,920 --> 00:26:49,799 wouldn't be a total shock. If Fundora came back and did what thought Errol 433 00:26:49,799 --> 00:26:52,759 Spence that was sending next to him in the ring, which sounds and seems 434 00:26:52,799 --> 00:26:57,119 like the fight that PBC wants to make, and the WBO title which he's 435 00:26:57,160 --> 00:27:02,680 mandated to defend against Crawford will become vacant and Crawford could either fight for that 436 00:27:02,720 --> 00:27:04,680 BAGANTWN or Douche. Are you ready for me to make too much sense again? 437 00:27:04,880 --> 00:27:07,799 You like what I bring to the table? Are you ready? If 438 00:27:07,839 --> 00:27:11,200 I am Tim Zoo and the games are going on, we don't want to 439 00:27:11,200 --> 00:27:15,880 fight until November and PBC says, let's have the fight be against Eryl Spence 440 00:27:17,160 --> 00:27:18,519 and the WBO is not going to stand for that, and they're going to 441 00:27:18,559 --> 00:27:23,079 basically strip him at some point for not fighting Crawford. How about cut to 442 00:27:23,119 --> 00:27:27,880 the chase and Tim Zoo fights Terrence Crawford for the vacant WBO title. Much 443 00:27:27,920 --> 00:27:32,960 better fight, much more interesting fight. Am I making too much sense on 444 00:27:33,000 --> 00:27:36,079 our podcast? Again? Am? I think? I think that's a very 445 00:27:36,119 --> 00:27:41,240 interesting possibility, because you know, that is certainly something I could see potentially 446 00:27:41,240 --> 00:27:45,559 happening. Now. I think the fans would certainly be fine. I would 447 00:27:45,559 --> 00:27:48,039 be fine. I know that Zoo lost to fight, but you know what 448 00:27:48,119 --> 00:27:51,920 I had to draw first of all. Second of all, you can't look 449 00:27:51,960 --> 00:27:55,559 at the result and not It's not an excuse, it just the fucking reality. 450 00:27:55,720 --> 00:27:57,440 The man had blood gushing out of his fucking head for twelve rounds or 451 00:27:57,599 --> 00:28:00,880 you know rounds. Clearly that had an impact on the result, and he 452 00:28:00,960 --> 00:28:04,839 still made it a split decision and barely lost. And and to a lot 453 00:28:04,880 --> 00:28:07,640 of people it was a draw, and some people had Tim Zoo winning to 454 00:28:07,680 --> 00:28:11,359 fight. So there's no UH. I would have no quarrel whatsoever if, 455 00:28:11,359 --> 00:28:14,960 in fact, when it was all said and done, that Tim Zoo fought 456 00:28:15,000 --> 00:28:19,519 Terrence Crawford for I guess what would become the vacant WBO title because it belongs 457 00:28:19,519 --> 00:28:22,559 to Fundora now, but if he doesn't fight Crawford, it will get stripped 458 00:28:22,599 --> 00:28:27,240 based the WO follows their rules. Tim Zoo was obviously uh the former champion. 459 00:28:27,359 --> 00:28:32,559 He obviously did a pack of a job against him under very very stressful 460 00:28:32,559 --> 00:28:36,519 circumstances, more so than just a normal fight. And Crawford is the mandatory 461 00:28:36,799 --> 00:28:40,039 and so they could do and then then they get two nice fights out of 462 00:28:40,079 --> 00:28:45,119 it. You get you get Fundora against Spence, potentially you get uh Zoo 463 00:28:45,119 --> 00:28:48,880 against against Crawford. But I must say and and and nothing against Errol Spence. 464 00:28:49,480 --> 00:28:53,039 And I understand that that Fondora got the opportunity on short notice because of 465 00:28:53,079 --> 00:28:56,160 Keith Thurman's injury, even though he was coming off a knockout loss in his 466 00:28:56,240 --> 00:29:00,799 previous fight, but all knockout losses are not created equal. When he got 467 00:29:00,920 --> 00:29:03,240 knocked out by Brian Mendoza, he won every single second of the fight and 468 00:29:03,240 --> 00:29:08,160 then got stopped. That shit happens. ERL Spence A has never fought as 469 00:29:08,160 --> 00:29:12,240 a drenam middlew eight B will be coming off of about a year or so 470 00:29:12,400 --> 00:29:15,839 LNGF if the fight happens, probably a little longer than a year and three. 471 00:29:17,160 --> 00:29:21,519 He didn't just get knocked out by Terrence Crawford. He got obliterated. 472 00:29:21,599 --> 00:29:26,319 Yep, we were sneered. He got dropped three times and got badly, 473 00:29:26,400 --> 00:29:29,440 badly badly this year. By the way, he's had another eye surgery since 474 00:29:29,480 --> 00:29:32,559 then, two earlier this year that he would be coming off of. So 475 00:29:33,079 --> 00:29:34,839 I know what you're saying. I know, I don't think. I don't 476 00:29:34,839 --> 00:29:37,880 think it's again. I don't. I'm not trying to, like, you 477 00:29:37,920 --> 00:29:44,480 know, knock anybody in this sense. But I got no quarrel with Errol 478 00:29:44,519 --> 00:29:48,240 Spence. I love Erol Spence, but he does not warrant a WBC Junior 479 00:29:48,279 --> 00:29:53,079 Midleweight world championship opportunity having never fought in the weight class coming off of that 480 00:29:53,079 --> 00:29:56,359 that type of defeat, I'm with you. So, but again, these 481 00:29:56,400 --> 00:30:00,319 are all things that will play out. But the bottom line is these eyes 482 00:30:00,359 --> 00:30:02,720 are going to be tied together in some form of fashion. And I'd say 483 00:30:02,720 --> 00:30:06,400 this, TJ. Whatever happens if they do the immediate rematch, if there 484 00:30:06,440 --> 00:30:10,119 isn't an interim title fight, if there is interim title fights somewhere or somehow, 485 00:30:10,160 --> 00:30:12,480 some way, you gotta figure that that Sebastian Fundora and Tim Zuo, 486 00:30:14,240 --> 00:30:15,759 you know, run it back in some former fashion down the road, whether 487 00:30:15,799 --> 00:30:22,559 it's next or a little after that. Hopefully Tim Zuo and him get together. 488 00:30:22,559 --> 00:30:25,200 They just do the rematch in November. They would still have two fights 489 00:30:25,200 --> 00:30:26,359 this year. It's not the longest layoff in the world. Not a big 490 00:30:26,359 --> 00:30:30,240 deal. They both had injuries. I mean, what the heck? All 491 00:30:30,319 --> 00:30:33,559 right, stay tuned on that. Some more news here. We'll go quickly 492 00:30:33,640 --> 00:30:36,480 through some different news items. Then we're getting to the nostalgia that involves Sugar 493 00:30:36,559 --> 00:30:41,079 Ray Leonard and Marvelous Marvin Hagler anniversary. All Right, Golden Boy with the 494 00:30:41,079 --> 00:30:48,079 Devin Haney and Ryan Garcia main event fight coming in a couple of weeks, 495 00:30:48,119 --> 00:30:52,440 has now officially announced the undercard. Give us the official details real quick on 496 00:30:52,480 --> 00:30:56,119 that. So some of these fights at Golden Boy announced for the undercard do 497 00:30:56,200 --> 00:30:59,680 not come as much of a surprise. I had reported before. This was 498 00:30:59,680 --> 00:31:03,799 an now said Arnold Barbosa Junior, who is a junior welterweight contender undefeated that 499 00:31:03,079 --> 00:31:06,839 had become a free agent from top Ranks, signed with Golden Boy in February. 500 00:31:07,400 --> 00:31:08,920 Rather I take the back sign. Had a had his first fight with 501 00:31:08,960 --> 00:31:14,160 them earlier in the year, got to win, and now he's coming into 502 00:31:14,200 --> 00:31:17,039 the undercard for this fight to fight in the co feature against the Northern Ireland 503 00:31:17,039 --> 00:31:21,119 Belfast fighter Sean McComb. Not a big name to be quite honest, a 504 00:31:21,160 --> 00:31:22,599 little bit disappointing as a co feature, and no problem with to being on 505 00:31:22,599 --> 00:31:26,920 the card, but they really kind of, you know, lack for any 506 00:31:26,960 --> 00:31:30,599 kind of like serious, big time fight in the co feature. And you 507 00:31:30,599 --> 00:31:33,160 know, it's such a glaring situation when you look at this lineup and then 508 00:31:33,200 --> 00:31:37,799 you compare it to like what the Saudis are doing or or some other big 509 00:31:37,839 --> 00:31:41,640 time cards. Nothing again even or even what PBC did with the world title 510 00:31:41,640 --> 00:31:45,640 fights. They had just most reasonably here on this on this pay per view, 511 00:31:45,240 --> 00:31:48,640 this and they're charging seventy nine to ninety nine for this pay per view 512 00:31:49,559 --> 00:31:56,400 for Hani versus Garcia if you buy it on on on like PPV dot com 513 00:31:56,480 --> 00:32:00,359 or in demand your satellite if you're already at his own subscriber, they're getting 514 00:32:00,400 --> 00:32:04,039 sixty nine to ninety nine for it. So there is that aspect of it, 515 00:32:04,079 --> 00:32:07,880 but nonetheless it's it's pretty expensive for that type of show with a in 516 00:32:07,920 --> 00:32:12,559 my opinion, not a great undercard at all. But nonetheless it's Barbosa versus 517 00:32:12,599 --> 00:32:15,680 McComb and a ten rounder at Junior World Eate. They got beck to Bully 518 00:32:15,319 --> 00:32:22,519 Melkusiev against Pierre Dimbey in a super middlewhite fight. He's defending his regional belt 519 00:32:22,920 --> 00:32:25,079 in that cart or in that fight. And then you have the very exciting 520 00:32:25,119 --> 00:32:29,559 and fun fighter that's with Golden Boy, the junior bantaway John Scrappy Ramirez. 521 00:32:29,920 --> 00:32:35,680 He'll be fighting David Jimenez for the WBA's interim Junior Bantamway title. And I 522 00:32:35,759 --> 00:32:37,880 know here we go again with the interim title with the WBA. I hope 523 00:32:37,880 --> 00:32:42,599 it's not a trend. The claim is that Kazuto Ioka, who is the 524 00:32:42,720 --> 00:32:47,599 champion for whom Scrappy Ramirez has been the mandatory supposedly has some type of hand 525 00:32:47,640 --> 00:32:52,519 injury or arm injury. I actually when I heard that this fight was going 526 00:32:52,559 --> 00:32:57,279 to be taking place, I messaged with GILBERTA. Mendoza from the WBA yesterday 527 00:32:58,119 --> 00:33:02,200 and he said they were waiting for the medical report from the Ioka people before 528 00:33:02,240 --> 00:33:06,880 they would agree to approve it. I have not heard back whether they had 529 00:33:06,960 --> 00:33:09,720 or not, but Golden Boy announced in their press release that this was for 530 00:33:09,799 --> 00:33:13,920 the interim title, So I'm not sure if they've got that clarence from the 531 00:33:14,000 --> 00:33:15,640 WBA yet or not, or maybe they're jumping the gun, but that'd be 532 00:33:15,640 --> 00:33:20,480 a little disappointing because Iaoka and Ramirez that fight's been a long time coming, 533 00:33:20,480 --> 00:33:22,279 but so be it. And in the opening fight of the pay per view 534 00:33:22,319 --> 00:33:27,839 portion of the card, you'll have the newly signed Junior Midway who This is 535 00:33:27,839 --> 00:33:30,240 the fighter I meant that signed in February. That's Charles Conwell. He's the 536 00:33:30,319 --> 00:33:37,400 undefeated Cleveland fighter former United States Olympian won a WBC semi final eliminator back in 537 00:33:37,480 --> 00:33:43,599 November of twenty what twenty two. That was on the undercard when Regis Prograde 538 00:33:43,960 --> 00:33:49,279 won the title against the vacant title against Zapeida had a really good fight, 539 00:33:49,480 --> 00:33:52,599 but he was such such problems promotionally and managerial. He's been off for all 540 00:33:52,599 --> 00:33:57,799 this time. So he signed with Golden Boy in February and he's coming back 541 00:33:57,839 --> 00:34:01,200 to fight the well traveled let's call him and Nathaniels Gallimore, who always gives 542 00:34:01,200 --> 00:34:05,279 a good effort but just hasn't won much in a long time. He's like 543 00:34:05,319 --> 00:34:07,839 two and six in his last eight. I mean, I get it. 544 00:34:07,839 --> 00:34:10,559 It's a comeback. Let's shake the rust off and going with a guy that's 545 00:34:10,559 --> 00:34:15,360 probably gonna take you some rounds. Got a good chin. But what's good 546 00:34:15,360 --> 00:34:19,960 for Charles Conwall is not necessarily good for us the consumer understood, or a 547 00:34:20,000 --> 00:34:24,719 couple more things. This is interesting from the nostalgia slash News. The trunks 548 00:34:24,719 --> 00:34:30,480 that the late great Muhammad Ali war for the Thriller and Manila are up for 549 00:34:30,599 --> 00:34:34,599 auction. You, yes, you listening to us, including Dan Rayfield of 550 00:34:34,679 --> 00:34:38,760 the Rayfield Collection, can bid on this. The trunks are signed by Muhammad 551 00:34:38,800 --> 00:34:46,440 Ali. Sotherby's is doing the auction currently. The the is this the minimum 552 00:34:46,480 --> 00:34:51,719 bid? The current minimum bid is three point eight million. You gotta come 553 00:34:51,840 --> 00:34:54,760 large here if you want to leave that this already already has I think I 554 00:34:54,800 --> 00:34:59,360 looked at the website already had like five bids on it. So the thing 555 00:34:59,360 --> 00:35:02,159 that blows my mind mind is that the bidding has reached three point eight million 556 00:35:02,199 --> 00:35:06,320 dollars, but the reserve has not been yet, not been that, which 557 00:35:06,320 --> 00:35:09,800 means that the consigner has given a low the lowest price that they're willing to 558 00:35:09,880 --> 00:35:15,880 accept hasn't been reached yet, and it's not been rich maybe the number maybe 559 00:35:15,920 --> 00:35:16,880 it's four million, maybe it's four and a half million, whatever it is. 560 00:35:17,079 --> 00:35:20,239 The estimate on the subth to be's auction. Now, it's just the 561 00:35:20,320 --> 00:35:24,360 estimate doesn't mean anything because oftentimes certain lots will go for more than what the 562 00:35:24,400 --> 00:35:29,280 pre auctioned estimate is. But their estimate says between what five and six million 563 00:35:29,280 --> 00:35:31,760 dollars I think it was. So this is a major piece of boxing memory 564 00:35:31,760 --> 00:35:36,320 billion. You know how I love boxing memorabilia. I know you do you 565 00:35:36,360 --> 00:35:39,119 know the estimate between four and six million dollars. I mean, that's a 566 00:35:39,199 --> 00:35:42,679 pretty big amount of money. I have to say, if I won them, 567 00:35:42,679 --> 00:35:45,719 I'd probably try to wear them, even if they wouldn't fat are signed. 568 00:35:46,880 --> 00:35:52,679 I'm just curious, do you own in the collection a prominent signed pair 569 00:35:52,719 --> 00:35:55,079 of trunks, and if so, what is it? I'm just curious. 570 00:35:55,079 --> 00:35:59,159 Do you own a pair of Ali sign trunks? For example? It's hilarious. 571 00:35:59,199 --> 00:36:02,760 Actually the only a pair of trunks that I have is from the one 572 00:36:02,800 --> 00:36:07,880 time great prospect who I just saw lose yet again by knock, who I 573 00:36:07,920 --> 00:36:10,159 think is lost like sixteen fights in a row. Is the love child Joel 574 00:36:10,239 --> 00:36:13,800 Julio? Who are those who followed me back in the day. No, 575 00:36:14,119 --> 00:36:16,760 my love for him as a great prospect who never who has some So wait, 576 00:36:16,800 --> 00:36:19,559 you got some of his trunks? That you got a pair of his 577 00:36:19,559 --> 00:36:23,079 trunks at auction? Or what did you do his team years ago after one 578 00:36:23,079 --> 00:36:28,000 of his fights sent me a pair of his trunks signs and it's having my 579 00:36:28,039 --> 00:36:30,000 collection and so you might be wearing them outside to cut the lawn, is 580 00:36:30,039 --> 00:36:37,360 what you're saying at this point. The guy's got sixteen losses, you you 581 00:36:37,360 --> 00:36:40,039 can put him in the rotation to do something else. He's still fighting, 582 00:36:40,719 --> 00:36:45,239 right, But so anyway, the bidding INDs next weekend, not this weekend, 583 00:36:45,280 --> 00:36:50,800 but next weekend April twelfth for the Ali trunks, And just as a 584 00:36:50,800 --> 00:36:52,480 reference point, we talked about this off the air, But I'll just make 585 00:36:52,559 --> 00:36:57,719 mention that about a year and a half ago, the owner of the Indianapolis 586 00:36:57,719 --> 00:37:04,679 Colts, Jim Irsay, bought a Muhammad Ali WBC championship belt, not an 587 00:37:04,719 --> 00:37:07,559 authentic one that he wore in the ring, right, It was that was 588 00:37:07,639 --> 00:37:12,239 bestowed upon him. It is authentic, it just yeah, But I mean 589 00:37:12,280 --> 00:37:15,599 he didn't in the ring necessarily did he. It was a given premonial belt, 590 00:37:15,719 --> 00:37:19,199 wasn't it. No, No, if you let me tell you, 591 00:37:19,239 --> 00:37:22,840 I'll explain to you what it was. After he beat George Foreman, you 592 00:37:22,840 --> 00:37:24,000 know, in the Giant upset, in the Rumbo, in the jungle, 593 00:37:24,559 --> 00:37:29,559 he was given a WBC belt after the fact to signify that he had become 594 00:37:29,599 --> 00:37:31,599 the WBC champion. And that was the belt that was given to him. 595 00:37:31,639 --> 00:37:34,960 But he did not get it in the ring. He didn't wear it in 596 00:37:35,000 --> 00:37:37,519 the ring. It doesn't have his markings on it, it's not autographed, 597 00:37:37,599 --> 00:37:40,119 it doesn't have his picture. It's just the old school, you know, 598 00:37:40,280 --> 00:37:45,079 early nineteen seventies WBC title belt. And it's a cool piece of memorabilia. 599 00:37:45,280 --> 00:37:47,800 But you're saying, I think you told me he did like six million, 600 00:37:49,159 --> 00:37:52,559 six million. He got it four for that belt. I don't think that 601 00:37:52,559 --> 00:37:55,800 that that. I mean, it's all relative obviously in the pantheon of memorabilia. 602 00:37:55,840 --> 00:37:59,159 Though, if I was going to spend six million on a piece of 603 00:37:59,159 --> 00:38:01,679 boxing memorabilia, a million percent, i'd buy the autographed trunks from the maybe 604 00:38:01,679 --> 00:38:06,719 the greatest fight in the history of the sport. Compared to retro. The 605 00:38:06,760 --> 00:38:10,519 belt that wasn't that wasn't warned by Ali or signed by him, or doesn't 606 00:38:10,519 --> 00:38:15,960 have anything engraved about him on the belt, But I think it doesn't ersa. 607 00:38:15,119 --> 00:38:19,639 I think has Ali's rolled from Ali Fraser one. So I'm just saying 608 00:38:19,840 --> 00:38:22,719 a huge collection of it. It would not surprise me if Erse suddenly swoops 609 00:38:22,760 --> 00:38:28,840 in for these trunks. He's got money, tons of money. That's just 610 00:38:28,880 --> 00:38:32,960 speculation. But here's the other thing about that. H the the providence of 611 00:38:32,960 --> 00:38:37,719 this particular pair of trunks, it comes from the the collection of Bundini Brown, 612 00:38:37,800 --> 00:38:40,360 which is, you know, the Ali hype man who had a lot 613 00:38:40,400 --> 00:38:45,360 of his stuff over the years. And so you know, it seems to 614 00:38:45,360 --> 00:38:47,440 be based on what I was reading about in their auction listing. You know, 615 00:38:47,719 --> 00:38:53,000 absolutely as legit as you can get in terms of having photo things and 616 00:38:53,039 --> 00:38:58,159 having it been inscribed by Bundini Brown and you know it's the real deal. 617 00:38:58,159 --> 00:39:00,880 And like the Thrilling Manila. You know I have said to you, in 618 00:39:00,880 --> 00:39:04,639 my opinion, the most famous fight in boxing history is the Rumble in the 619 00:39:04,679 --> 00:39:07,760 Jungle, but the Thriller Mineral ain't too far behind, and it was a 620 00:39:07,840 --> 00:39:12,039 highly significant world championship fight, the last chapter of the great rival between Ali 621 00:39:12,079 --> 00:39:15,280 and Fraser. One of the great fights of all time. And if he 622 00:39:15,320 --> 00:39:17,800 got six million dollars, maybe we should start like a crowdfund and try to 623 00:39:17,840 --> 00:39:22,800 buy it together to buy the trunks. All right, One more news item 624 00:39:22,840 --> 00:39:30,239 that is Top Rank making announcements about a May eighteenth card that includes Giovanni Santition. 625 00:39:30,840 --> 00:39:35,719 We know that name because we were just talking what about Alexis Rochel last 626 00:39:35,719 --> 00:39:38,599 week and it was Santion that blew him out right with the knockout. So 627 00:39:38,719 --> 00:39:44,280 this is in and around the Emanuel Navaraate title fight on the eighteenth, and 628 00:39:44,320 --> 00:39:46,960 it also includes Richard Torrez as well, right on the Top Rank show. 629 00:39:47,000 --> 00:39:51,679 So give us the details here on what we're learning about this card. Yeah, 630 00:39:51,719 --> 00:39:53,239 so they announced the rest of the undercard. We already knew that Santan 631 00:39:53,360 --> 00:39:58,880 was on the show. Now, when Navarette and Barentchik fight in San Diego 632 00:39:59,000 --> 00:40:01,880 for the vacant w lightweight title, it was announced that Santiana would be on 633 00:40:01,880 --> 00:40:06,079 the undergard Santian is undefeated. Like you said, he has that big win 634 00:40:06,400 --> 00:40:08,199 against alessex Zroche. He was the underdog, but he just pounded him out. 635 00:40:08,400 --> 00:40:12,599 This was back in October, a very very big win for him. 636 00:40:13,320 --> 00:40:16,840 He is the number one contender in the WBO and he is from San Diego, 637 00:40:16,880 --> 00:40:20,320 so that's why he's on this card, mostly because he's gonna help seal 638 00:40:20,400 --> 00:40:22,760 some tickets locally for the show. But so they didn't have the opponent when 639 00:40:22,760 --> 00:40:25,599 they first announced that the fact that he was going to be on this event, 640 00:40:25,800 --> 00:40:31,119 but they did that today and he will be taking on Brian Norman Junior, 641 00:40:31,159 --> 00:40:36,599 who's an undefeated fighter, prospect ish type guy with top rank and he's 642 00:40:36,599 --> 00:40:37,760 gonna get a chance to sink or swim in this kind of fight. You 643 00:40:37,800 --> 00:40:40,840 know. They've they've debiaed him along over the last several fights since they signed 644 00:40:40,920 --> 00:40:46,000 him, and some people think very highly of him at the company. Others 645 00:40:46,039 --> 00:40:50,559 think he's not much at all, and he's kind of disappointing, but we're 646 00:40:50,559 --> 00:40:52,400 gonna find out for sure what is uh, you know what he can do 647 00:40:52,440 --> 00:40:54,760 because Santion, whatever you think about him, we know he's a real fighter. 648 00:40:54,840 --> 00:40:58,320 He's got some accomplishment. He's got the record, he's got the big 649 00:40:58,320 --> 00:41:01,960 win over over you know, the fight to Dad against Rocha and uh, 650 00:41:02,280 --> 00:41:07,480 and now he's got the chance to destroyed destroyed Roacha in that fight and as 651 00:41:07,480 --> 00:41:10,360 I recall, I mean beat him up and knocked him out. So very 652 00:41:10,400 --> 00:41:15,639 interesting twenty five and oh with nineteen knockouts, but he hasn't ever really fought 653 00:41:15,639 --> 00:41:19,639 anybody. He's twenty three, still a very young guy. Unfortunately, in 654 00:41:19,679 --> 00:41:22,960 his earlier fight this year, that took place just a couple of weeks ago 655 00:41:22,440 --> 00:41:27,760 on the undercard when Kolmatov had that great fight with ray Forth, he ended 656 00:41:27,840 --> 00:41:31,320 up because of headbutts. There was a no contest in his last fight, 657 00:41:31,360 --> 00:41:34,840 so he didn't get the full rowdy. That fight was stopped in the third 658 00:41:34,920 --> 00:41:37,079 round. But other than that, he's won all of his fights. But 659 00:41:37,119 --> 00:41:39,760 I must be honest, I mean, I know what Santion is and I've 660 00:41:39,880 --> 00:41:45,320 watched a lot of Brian Norman's fights since he's been with Top Break and they 661 00:41:45,400 --> 00:41:46,840 a lot of people have made him out and hype him up quite a bit. 662 00:41:47,280 --> 00:41:51,079 And I'm not saying that he's no good or that I'm like some super 663 00:41:51,079 --> 00:41:53,719 scout, but I just don't see it yet. I think he's looked pretty 664 00:41:53,719 --> 00:41:59,559 pedestrian, to be quite frank and uh, you know Santion Frankly, with 665 00:41:59,599 --> 00:42:02,239 his experience and the way he performed in that last fight and just his overall 666 00:42:02,239 --> 00:42:06,760 career in general, it might be exposure time for Brian Norman, who has 667 00:42:06,800 --> 00:42:10,079 looked in my mind extremely pedestrian in recent fights. And now he's stepping up 668 00:42:10,079 --> 00:42:14,480 to fight a serious opponent and we'll see if he can run see the occasion. 669 00:42:14,480 --> 00:42:16,679 If he can, great for him. And the obligatory sarcasm with the 670 00:42:16,760 --> 00:42:21,360 Richard Torres announcement, is he fighting against an opponent that can make it out 671 00:42:21,360 --> 00:42:25,239 of the second round. Torres, here's the problem that Top rank faced them. 672 00:42:25,239 --> 00:42:29,280 But I actually was talking to somebody from Top Rank about this exact situation, 673 00:42:29,719 --> 00:42:30,719 so he you know, they knew he was going to be on this 674 00:42:30,760 --> 00:42:34,679 card if he came through the fight the other night, you know, with 675 00:42:34,679 --> 00:42:37,280 no injuries and everything like that. So on the card that was on Friday 676 00:42:37,360 --> 00:42:42,760 Night. Last Friday Night, when Oscar Valdez defeated Liam Wilson in the main 677 00:42:42,800 --> 00:42:45,880 event, Richard Torres was on the undercard and he stopped the as I like 678 00:42:45,920 --> 00:42:51,599 to say, the well traveled journeyman Donnie Hainsworth in the first round. So 679 00:42:51,679 --> 00:42:54,199 he came through that fight with no problem. He's one of his fights by 680 00:42:54,239 --> 00:42:58,239 first round knockedout. He's only been deep into a fight once. That was 681 00:42:58,280 --> 00:43:00,280 a stoppage, but it went to the eighth round of an eight round fighting 682 00:43:00,320 --> 00:43:04,639 knocked out Curtis Harper back in his previous fight in December, so they put 683 00:43:04,679 --> 00:43:07,800 him on this card. But the problem they have is they don't want to 684 00:43:07,840 --> 00:43:09,440 overmatch him because he's still green. He still needs a lot of work. 685 00:43:09,480 --> 00:43:14,599 He's still very raw. But the powers there and they have a hard time 686 00:43:14,639 --> 00:43:16,719 finding the appropriate kind of opponents. And when they find a guy that identify 687 00:43:17,079 --> 00:43:21,960 as a guy they want to match him with, the price tag is extraordinary 688 00:43:22,000 --> 00:43:23,960 for that level of a fight. So they've got to find a balance between 689 00:43:24,280 --> 00:43:30,159 the type of opponent that they feel can help him improve and to make a 690 00:43:30,199 --> 00:43:32,440 real, you know, some kind of hal you know, halfway decent fight 691 00:43:32,800 --> 00:43:37,079 but also fit within a normal budget. You know, you're not going to 692 00:43:37,119 --> 00:43:39,719 be paying these guys, you know, fifty thousand dollars to fight him in 693 00:43:39,719 --> 00:43:44,159 an eight rounder. And a lot of times it's not just Richard Torrez, 694 00:43:44,199 --> 00:43:46,960 by the way, it's tons of heavyweight prospects when you get to this part 695 00:43:47,000 --> 00:43:51,480 of the career where they've got a whole bunch of like highlight reel knockouts, 696 00:43:51,519 --> 00:43:53,440 but they're not fighting anybody, and the promoter is trying to get them some 697 00:43:53,719 --> 00:43:58,119 rounds, which is what he needs more than anything. You got to find 698 00:43:58,119 --> 00:44:00,599 the right opponent, but you got to stay within a budge. It's very 699 00:44:00,679 --> 00:44:05,159 very difficult, and oftentimes the guy you finally get ends up making a much 700 00:44:05,159 --> 00:44:07,559 greater person than the prospect you're trying to build up. So I'm making the 701 00:44:07,639 --> 00:44:10,599 numbers up. But let's say they're paying Richard Torres, you know, ten 702 00:44:10,639 --> 00:44:15,599 thousand for the fight, his opponent may make fifteen thousand. It's just the 703 00:44:15,679 --> 00:44:17,719 nature of the game. So it's very very hard at this stage of his 704 00:44:17,840 --> 00:44:23,280 career, and other heavyweights of that ilk who find opponents that are the proper 705 00:44:23,280 --> 00:44:27,440 opponent but for the right amount of money. So they got their work cut 706 00:44:27,440 --> 00:44:29,719 out for them big time. And we're gonna get to the nostalgia in a 707 00:44:29,760 --> 00:44:30,880 second. But one more point here. You've brought this up, we'll re 708 00:44:30,920 --> 00:44:36,159 illuminate it here. Whenever he's around, you have questions about his size to 709 00:44:36,199 --> 00:44:38,920 fight at heavyweight? Is he ever going to be a big time contender when 710 00:44:38,960 --> 00:44:44,840 he's not as big as most of the elite heavyweights or the heavyweight contenders. 711 00:44:45,320 --> 00:44:49,440 So that's a question mark. Yeah, it's the height that it seems to 712 00:44:49,519 --> 00:44:52,639 me like he's he's like a stocky six to two and he goes like two 713 00:44:52,800 --> 00:44:55,880 thirty. But he just doesn't seem that big, like when you stand the 714 00:44:55,960 --> 00:45:00,280 next to like these count of men who are so much bigger. But maybe 715 00:45:00,280 --> 00:45:02,840 he'll develop. Maybe, Look, I know one thing he's I'd watch Richer 716 00:45:02,920 --> 00:45:07,440 Torre's throw punches at anybody any date because he's exciting and he's got a kind 717 00:45:07,440 --> 00:45:09,000 of a quirky personality. I enjoy him, So, you know, I 718 00:45:09,159 --> 00:45:12,360 like to see him develop. We'll see how it goes. And I certainly 719 00:45:12,360 --> 00:45:15,000 we love knockouts. We talk about that all the time. He's been delivering 720 00:45:15,039 --> 00:45:17,639 knockouts, but you gotta have have a little better. But I like him 721 00:45:17,639 --> 00:45:21,679 to be in a fight where our friends at that us don't tell us the 722 00:45:21,679 --> 00:45:24,840 over under is one and a half, right, exactly exactly if we go 723 00:45:24,920 --> 00:45:29,679 to if we go to handicap it all right, we have saved the best 724 00:45:29,719 --> 00:45:32,320 for last, if I do say so myself. April sixth, nineteen eighty 725 00:45:32,360 --> 00:45:37,320 seven, what is now thirty seven years ago. Saturday is the anniversary of 726 00:45:37,840 --> 00:45:45,519 arguably the greatest comeback win in a world championship fight, especially huge mega mega 727 00:45:45,559 --> 00:45:50,159 fight like this, when Sugar Ray Leonard came out of Let's clarify, you 728 00:45:50,199 --> 00:45:52,400 don't mean come back in the context of the bout. You mean a comeback 729 00:45:52,440 --> 00:45:55,559 from a long layoff retirement. I just yes, I mean come back in 730 00:45:55,639 --> 00:45:59,599 the long layoff. That's correct, not in the actual fight itself. But 731 00:45:59,679 --> 00:46:04,159 the Sugar Ray Leonard layoff was three years, but it was basically five years, 732 00:46:04,519 --> 00:46:08,800 and he scored arguably the signature win of his career. We could argue 733 00:46:08,800 --> 00:46:14,400 about that with the win over marvelous Marvin Hagler, defeating him in a twelve 734 00:46:14,480 --> 00:46:19,760 round controversial decision. Full disclosure, you and I are in agreement. We 735 00:46:19,840 --> 00:46:22,480 love Sugar Ray Leonard. So if you're a Leonard fan, of course you 736 00:46:22,519 --> 00:46:24,360 believe he won that fight. There are a lot of people that believe Marvin 737 00:46:24,400 --> 00:46:30,159 Hagler right. A lot of people believe that Hagler should have gotten that decision. 738 00:46:30,239 --> 00:46:34,320 I'm not among them. I believe that Sugar Ray Leonard won enough of 739 00:46:34,360 --> 00:46:37,599 the early rounds and did enough late in the fight, and most the most 740 00:46:37,639 --> 00:46:43,119 telling part was that Marvin Hagler seemingly broke everybody he fought, broke him down, 741 00:46:43,159 --> 00:46:45,559 physically stopped him, knocked him out, and he couldn't do it to 742 00:46:45,639 --> 00:46:49,840 Ray Leonard. And Leonard got his hand raised that night, April sixth, 743 00:46:50,039 --> 00:46:53,480 nineteen eighty seven. All right, Dan ray Field, way in some more 744 00:46:53,559 --> 00:46:58,159 on this. Well. First of I love Hagler and I love Leonard, 745 00:46:59,159 --> 00:47:02,400 but I will go to the grave. I'll argue anybody anytime anywhere. We 746 00:47:02,400 --> 00:47:04,960 can do it in a bar, we can do it in my house, 747 00:47:05,000 --> 00:47:07,400 we can do it in the street. But Sugar Leonard won the fight. 748 00:47:07,519 --> 00:47:09,920 End of story. I've scored the fight a million times, seven to five 749 00:47:09,960 --> 00:47:15,119 every single time. Not hard to score, in my opinion. When Marvin 750 00:47:15,119 --> 00:47:19,039 Hagler gives away literally the first four rounds, I don't think there's any way 751 00:47:19,039 --> 00:47:22,320 you can score that fight. Anything other than four nothing in favor of Ray 752 00:47:22,440 --> 00:47:24,400 out of the gate. And then there's other rounds where he clearly was the 753 00:47:24,440 --> 00:47:28,280 winner. There wasn't even rounds. Even when you gave Hagler rounds, they 754 00:47:28,280 --> 00:47:30,840 weren't even rounds that he was winning. Big a couple that he clearly won, 755 00:47:30,880 --> 00:47:32,519 but he wasn't like he was doing a lot of damage. And people 756 00:47:32,599 --> 00:47:36,519 can say all they want. Ray was waiting for the clapper, his quarter 757 00:47:36,679 --> 00:47:38,960 rather not the clapper. But you know Angelo Dundee shouting in the team thirty 758 00:47:39,000 --> 00:47:42,679 seconds and he would go to work to try to impress the judges. Well, 759 00:47:42,679 --> 00:47:45,559 guess what, that's boxing. You have to leave an impression on the 760 00:47:45,599 --> 00:47:47,000 judges, and they're human beings, and if you kick ass the last thirty 761 00:47:47,039 --> 00:47:50,280 seconds, it's going to be the last thing in their mind. And if 762 00:47:50,280 --> 00:47:52,039 all else is sort of equal or close to it, then you're gonna get 763 00:47:52,079 --> 00:47:54,679 the benefit of the doubt. And so he won the crowd, he won 764 00:47:54,719 --> 00:48:00,599 the judges. There is some truth, in my opinion that people were more 765 00:48:00,599 --> 00:48:04,000 focused on Ray because of the mere fact they were still standing after like four 766 00:48:04,079 --> 00:48:07,079 rounds, much less not laying on the deck because everbody thought he was gonna 767 00:48:07,079 --> 00:48:10,400 get drilled. You talked about the layoff. Now technically speaking, Ray fought 768 00:48:10,480 --> 00:48:15,239 Kevin Howard and looked terrible in the fight, to be honest, got knocked 769 00:48:15,280 --> 00:48:20,400 down, got knocked down in the fight, yet announced yet another retirement after 770 00:48:20,400 --> 00:48:22,599 the fight, like he's fit. So that fight, by the way, 771 00:48:22,960 --> 00:48:25,440 it's not easy to find. I've been looking anybody out there as a nice 772 00:48:25,440 --> 00:48:29,599 copy. I need the program, thank you very much. Uh you're talking 773 00:48:29,599 --> 00:48:31,760 about Leonard and what Kevin Howard? Right? Yes, sir, yes, 774 00:48:32,000 --> 00:48:37,400 Also to me in my head, give me five bonus points the Worcester Syntrum 775 00:48:37,480 --> 00:48:40,679 Right, Worcester, Massachusetts. Am I close with that site, the DCU 776 00:48:40,719 --> 00:48:46,079 Center and with anybody that's in New England basting anybody that's child. Uh, 777 00:48:46,159 --> 00:48:51,400 if you've got a program, the Rayfield collection needs the program. But he 778 00:48:51,519 --> 00:48:55,159 retired again after that fight. Remember everyone retired and said that's it again. 779 00:48:57,320 --> 00:49:00,000 So let's just backtrack. I'm just to put it in cont of how amazing 780 00:49:00,039 --> 00:49:05,119 what Ray did was he has the big mega mega fight that he wins the 781 00:49:05,119 --> 00:49:08,719 first fight against Tommy Hearns, becomes the undisputed welterweight CHAMPI in September of eighty 782 00:49:08,760 --> 00:49:13,199 one, one of the biggest fights in boxing. Comes back a few months 783 00:49:13,280 --> 00:49:19,119 later and in the in the Encore Fight Live HBO defended the title, knocks 784 00:49:19,159 --> 00:49:23,000 out Bruce Finch in three rounds, and after that fight he had the retirement. 785 00:49:23,239 --> 00:49:27,840 He had the eye problem. He doesn't fight again from February of nineteen 786 00:49:27,840 --> 00:49:30,480 eighty two till May of nineteen eighty four, so a little over two years. 787 00:49:30,800 --> 00:49:35,480 He comes back and fights Kevin Howard, looks horrible, gets the knockout 788 00:49:35,480 --> 00:49:38,119 in the ninth round, retires. As you said, yet again, so 789 00:49:38,199 --> 00:49:43,800 from May and eighty four to April of eighty seven, so basically three years 790 00:49:43,800 --> 00:49:47,599 more he doesn't have a fight. But from the nineteen eighty two Finch fight 791 00:49:49,039 --> 00:49:52,599 to the Haggler fight, as you said, it's five years with one shitty 792 00:49:52,639 --> 00:49:59,039 performance, right. He was supposed to get waxed in that fight. Absolutely, 793 00:49:59,360 --> 00:50:02,320 Hi, Hagler is mowing through the middleway division, including the all time 794 00:50:02,400 --> 00:50:07,199 classic with Hearns and knocking him out, and everybody believed. I still remember 795 00:50:07,239 --> 00:50:12,320 this building up here, that he was going to ko Sugar Ray Leonard. 796 00:50:12,599 --> 00:50:16,199 This was what he had been waiting for for years. Felt insulted when he 797 00:50:16,280 --> 00:50:22,119 invited him to that ceremony and retired after the Finch fight and said the fight 798 00:50:22,159 --> 00:50:28,000 with Marvin Hagler will never happen. Everybody believed, if you believed any scenario, 799 00:50:28,119 --> 00:50:30,679 you believe Hagler was going to tear through Sugar Ray Leonard, and it 800 00:50:30,760 --> 00:50:34,599 did not happen. It didn't happen. He did that announcement of the retirement 801 00:50:34,639 --> 00:50:38,760 with Hagler having invited him there. I love Sugar re Litter and I'm very 802 00:50:38,800 --> 00:50:43,880 privileged to have gotten an opportunity to work with Sugar in Litter as my broadcast 803 00:50:43,920 --> 00:50:45,920 partner for a number of boxing events that we did when I used to be 804 00:50:45,960 --> 00:50:50,719 the analyst when Epics did fights. So I've spent time with Raizo just I 805 00:50:50,800 --> 00:50:53,360 love them, love them. But that was a dick move. I mean, 806 00:50:53,400 --> 00:50:57,519 that really was a dick move. Now, meanwhile, as you said, 807 00:50:57,599 --> 00:51:00,320 Hagler is mowing down the division. He's beat like good names. He's 808 00:51:00,360 --> 00:51:04,280 beating you know. He beat d Ran, he beats Roll Dan, he 809 00:51:04,320 --> 00:51:10,159 beats Mustapha Hampshire. He has the classic with Tommy Hearns. Then he comes 810 00:51:10,159 --> 00:51:15,199 back in his fight after Hearns. Eleven months later, he fights John the 811 00:51:15,199 --> 00:51:21,280 Beast Mugabi in a brutal, very very difficult fight, a very very tough 812 00:51:21,280 --> 00:51:24,119 fight. He ultimately gets mcgabi on the eleventh round naka. But sitting in 813 00:51:24,159 --> 00:51:28,519 the audience that night was one Sugar Ray Leonard, and Sugar Ray Leonard, 814 00:51:28,559 --> 00:51:31,199 as the astute boxing person that he is, as he said, I saw 815 00:51:31,280 --> 00:51:37,199 things and he felt after observing that fight up close and seeing the apparent slippage 816 00:51:37,239 --> 00:51:42,719 in Marvin Hagler's game after such a dominating career, it was at that point 817 00:51:42,800 --> 00:51:45,400 he finally said, you know what, let's get it one now. It 818 00:51:45,440 --> 00:51:47,800 wasn't immediate, it's still That fight was in March of nineteen eighty six. 819 00:51:47,840 --> 00:51:52,519 It happened to be the very first event that was ever televised on Showtime on 820 00:51:52,599 --> 00:51:57,679 a brief tape delay. But it was eleven months later that he fought Marvin 821 00:51:57,679 --> 00:52:00,880 Hagler finally, and that was a fight that was built up as big as 822 00:52:00,880 --> 00:52:02,960 can be. Alt Dore Arena and Caesar's Palace, the classic venue of the 823 00:52:04,039 --> 00:52:07,360 nineteen eighties, and it's arguably the biggest fight of the era, I mean 824 00:52:07,519 --> 00:52:13,079 as big as Hagler. Hearns was when Ray finally and Hagler met I think 825 00:52:13,079 --> 00:52:16,639 it might have even been bigger than when when Ray and Hearns fought and when 826 00:52:17,000 --> 00:52:22,199 Hearns and Hagler fought. I mean, it's the quintessential well and keep in 827 00:52:22,239 --> 00:52:24,000 mind, I'm just thinking of this too, is what this as we do 828 00:52:24,079 --> 00:52:28,719 this in real time? Keep in mind that Leonard had lost to Duran but 829 00:52:28,760 --> 00:52:32,159 avenged it. He had beaten Hearns and then Hagler had knocked Herns out. 830 00:52:32,400 --> 00:52:37,239 So this was the last piece for the four kings. Who wins between the 831 00:52:37,280 --> 00:52:40,239 two of them because they had both beaten the other two guys leading into this 832 00:52:40,280 --> 00:52:45,960 fight, and it was worth mega millions for Marvin Hagler finally to cash in 833 00:52:45,360 --> 00:52:50,599 to fight Ray Leonard. But again, you and I are alike. If 834 00:52:50,599 --> 00:52:52,599 we had a Marvin Hagler fan, that would kind of break us in half 835 00:52:52,639 --> 00:52:55,960 here and say, you know, Hagler won, then that would be different. 836 00:52:55,960 --> 00:52:59,920 But you and I aren agreement, Sugar, Ray Leonard owned that knight 837 00:53:00,159 --> 00:53:02,679 and one this is though, So if you take a look ever, like 838 00:53:02,719 --> 00:53:06,599 on box Wreck, you can look up some stuff on the biggest fights like 839 00:53:06,639 --> 00:53:08,360 Dave, like the wiki of it and on the if you look at the 840 00:53:08,400 --> 00:53:13,400 Haggler Leonard entry at the bottom of that. They have a ton of the 841 00:53:13,960 --> 00:53:16,480 of the writers and the media how they scored the fight. And it's pretty 842 00:53:16,519 --> 00:53:20,760 amazing because a lot of these guys I know from having worked with them side 843 00:53:20,760 --> 00:53:23,159 by side it fights at times early in my career, but I'm looking down. 844 00:53:23,159 --> 00:53:27,320 So for example, Harold Letterman, who was the unofficial scorer for HBO, 845 00:53:27,679 --> 00:53:30,280 he scored the fight like I did, one fifteen to one thirteen for 846 00:53:30,400 --> 00:53:34,000 Leonard. And there was tons of guys. You know, one of my 847 00:53:34,119 --> 00:53:37,760 mentors, the great Michael Katz, a Hall of Famer, longtime boxing writer 848 00:53:37,840 --> 00:53:39,480 for the New York Times for the Daily News. For this fight he worked 849 00:53:39,480 --> 00:53:43,519 for the Daily News for many, many years. He had to fight for 850 00:53:43,599 --> 00:53:46,599 Leonard one seventeen to one eleven. I always respected Mike's scoring. But then 851 00:53:46,639 --> 00:53:51,880 you've got other guys who had it for Marvin Heckler. I respect Al Bernstein. 852 00:53:51,920 --> 00:53:53,960 Well, Al Bernstein had it one fifteen, one to thirteen for Marvin 853 00:53:53,960 --> 00:53:59,440 Heckler according to this listing. And you know, there's plenty of guys that 854 00:53:59,480 --> 00:54:01,840 you would would look at now. David Anderson, the legendary New York Times 855 00:54:01,880 --> 00:54:06,039 columnist, he scored the fight one fourteen to one fourteen. I'm just giving 856 00:54:06,039 --> 00:54:09,280 you a smattering of some of the people that are listening now. Ron Borges, 857 00:54:09,320 --> 00:54:12,880 who I've known for my entire career, worked in a million fights with 858 00:54:13,159 --> 00:54:16,480 consider him a friend. Obviously he's from Boston. Perhaps slightly biased towards Tagler, 859 00:54:16,639 --> 00:54:20,559 but nonetheless had Hagler also winning seven rounds to five. But you can 860 00:54:20,559 --> 00:54:25,079 find a whole bunch of guys that had similar or close scores for either either 861 00:54:25,119 --> 00:54:29,159 guy. Some draws one or two points one way, one or two point 862 00:54:29,159 --> 00:54:30,840 the other way. It was a very close fight. I always maintained that 863 00:54:30,840 --> 00:54:35,280 Sugar Ray Leonard won the fight. The fact that we could have this conversation 864 00:54:35,840 --> 00:54:39,679 so passionately thirty seven years after the fact shows you how significant of a fight. 865 00:54:39,719 --> 00:54:44,719 This was. Massive crowd, massive audience, massive money for the times. 866 00:54:45,000 --> 00:54:47,639 I mean even HBO just for the delay rights on the closed circuit, 867 00:54:47,840 --> 00:54:52,440 paid over three million dollars just for the delay rights. Now, that was 868 00:54:52,480 --> 00:54:54,719 the way before you know YouTube and streaming and things along those lines. That's 869 00:54:54,800 --> 00:54:59,079 right, that was back what I remember watching because again, they had these 870 00:54:59,119 --> 00:55:01,360 fights on Monday A lot of the time is a Monday night fight, and 871 00:55:01,400 --> 00:55:07,320 they showed it that next weekend on HBO. I remember watching the replay having 872 00:55:07,360 --> 00:55:09,880 already known the outcome, and people have to again appreciate you and I do 873 00:55:09,960 --> 00:55:14,599 this all the time. You mentioned no Internet, no YouTube, You did 874 00:55:14,639 --> 00:55:17,239 not have a way to see this. This was This was ESPN Sports Center 875 00:55:17,679 --> 00:55:22,719 and CNN Sports Tonight with Fred Hickman and Nick Charles showing you pictures, not 876 00:55:22,920 --> 00:55:28,679 moving pictures, showing you photos of the fight. And then the next weekend 877 00:55:28,719 --> 00:55:31,079 you got to see the replay of the fight for yourself. I know that 878 00:55:31,119 --> 00:55:35,360 we talk about the crazy amounts of money that some of these fights are generated, 879 00:55:35,719 --> 00:55:37,599 or the kind of money that guys like Canelo, you know the money 880 00:55:37,599 --> 00:55:40,639 that Canelo has made, or what Floyd and Manny made when they fought. 881 00:55:40,920 --> 00:55:44,679 But in nineteen eighty seven, the amount of money that was made by these 882 00:55:44,719 --> 00:55:49,599 guys was astronomical. Yes, that was guaranteed. That's not even to speak 883 00:55:49,599 --> 00:55:52,039 about what else he might have taken in twelve million on the guarantee, plus 884 00:55:52,039 --> 00:55:57,199 he got a percentage. Sugar Ey Leonard was making eleven million plus a percentage. 885 00:55:58,239 --> 00:56:01,280 Bob Aram said, the fight grow seventy eight million dollars. I believe 886 00:56:01,320 --> 00:56:06,920 it's an astronomical amount of money for that era. It's because you have to 887 00:56:07,079 --> 00:56:12,760 appreciate how big a deal Sugar Ray Leonard was in particular, and how white 888 00:56:12,920 --> 00:56:17,639 hot Marvin Hagler was off that Hearns ko and this was built up for months 889 00:56:17,880 --> 00:56:22,119 that they were finally going to fight in April. As far as non heavyweights, 890 00:56:22,159 --> 00:56:27,000 there was nothing bigger in the world in boxing than this fight and the 891 00:56:27,079 --> 00:56:30,960 way I conveyed enough. Whatever you think about who won, the reality is 892 00:56:31,000 --> 00:56:34,519 they put on a heck of a fight. Maybe it was like the all 893 00:56:34,559 --> 00:56:38,719 time classic slugfest, Like it wasn't Hagler Hearns or or Or or Leonard Hearns. 894 00:56:39,159 --> 00:56:44,719 But this was a really good fight at the highest level between two iconic 895 00:56:44,760 --> 00:56:46,840 figures, and it was the last, by the way, it was the 896 00:56:46,880 --> 00:56:50,760 last fight that Hagler ready, So they never fought again, never got a 897 00:56:50,800 --> 00:56:53,119 rematch, results, never put the gloves on again, turned down an eight 898 00:56:53,119 --> 00:56:58,880 figure pay day for rematch, basically told Aherman and Ray to go fund themselves. 899 00:56:59,159 --> 00:57:01,280 I still have one more image and I love to go back and rewatch 900 00:57:01,360 --> 00:57:05,960 this. Angelo Dundee very famous for a lot of his corner work with Ali 901 00:57:06,000 --> 00:57:08,639 and Leonard, very famous for being in Ray Leonard's ear with three rounds to 902 00:57:08,679 --> 00:57:12,199 go. You got nine minutes left, son, You're blowing it. You 903 00:57:12,280 --> 00:57:15,159 got nine minutes left. You're blowing it, is what he said to him 904 00:57:15,159 --> 00:57:17,559 in the corner. The HBO mikes, the closed circuit mics pick him up 905 00:57:17,559 --> 00:57:22,119 in the corner, saying, we got three minutes. We got three minutes. 906 00:57:22,239 --> 00:57:28,480 And so Leonard stands up and the crowd's roaring, and Richard Steele comes 907 00:57:28,519 --> 00:57:30,400 over and says, this is the last round of the fight. And the 908 00:57:30,440 --> 00:57:32,639 hair on the back of my neck is standing up while I'm talking to you 909 00:57:32,760 --> 00:57:36,320 right now, And Dundee says back to him, this is a new champ 910 00:57:36,400 --> 00:57:39,559 right here. Fire him up for that final round. That is I mean. 911 00:57:39,599 --> 00:57:43,599 Here we are thirty seven years later, I still remember that and I 912 00:57:43,639 --> 00:57:46,400 will rewatch it again. It's amazing. It's so good. I mean to 913 00:57:46,440 --> 00:57:52,239 see two not just great fighters, but like literally the best of their era 914 00:57:52,440 --> 00:57:55,000 together in a fight that had been demanded for so long. Now, if 915 00:57:55,039 --> 00:57:59,679 you wanted to take the slightly like negative look at it, you should say 916 00:57:59,719 --> 00:58:01,519 they shou had the fight years earlier, and they should have made everybody wait 917 00:58:01,559 --> 00:58:06,159 as long as it wasn't Hackler making him wait. But Ray Leonard, you 918 00:58:06,199 --> 00:58:07,599 know, was as great of a fighter as he was in many ways, 919 00:58:07,679 --> 00:58:10,639 was a great manager. He wasn't officially his own manager yet, you know, 920 00:58:10,719 --> 00:58:14,639 as his Mike trainer doing his work for him in terms of that business. 921 00:58:15,000 --> 00:58:19,000 But Ray is one of the smartest boxing minds, and he knew it 922 00:58:19,039 --> 00:58:22,000 was time that I can not only cash in and make a gargantrom out of 923 00:58:22,000 --> 00:58:24,920 money, but I'm gonna win the fight. I mean. Now, here's 924 00:58:24,960 --> 00:58:28,920 let me ask you this though. You said arguably the greatest win of his 925 00:58:28,960 --> 00:58:31,840 career. And one of the reasons why Ray is so such a revered fighter 926 00:58:32,280 --> 00:58:37,119 is because great fighters, if they're lucky to have one win of this level, 927 00:58:37,400 --> 00:58:40,119 it's its career making. If you look at the Ray Leonard career, 928 00:58:42,280 --> 00:58:45,880 you got Duran two, which to come back after the loss, and how 929 00:58:45,920 --> 00:58:49,360 he proved himself after and made him quit. They got Hearn's won with that 930 00:58:49,440 --> 00:58:52,320 great performance in the fourteenth round knockout, and then you have this one against 931 00:58:52,320 --> 00:58:55,320 Hagler, I mean, and when he won the title as a young fighter 932 00:58:55,320 --> 00:59:00,480 against the Hall of Famer and Wolf for beneath this. Yes, now those 933 00:59:00,480 --> 00:59:02,400 are big time wins. I would still put this one there, just for 934 00:59:02,480 --> 00:59:07,280 all the circumstances that we've spent the last ten minutes laying out, because I 935 00:59:07,679 --> 00:59:10,599 again say, you cannot convey enough, I mean, especially for you nubies 936 00:59:10,639 --> 00:59:14,960 egen zers to think again, Rayfiel always laughs at this. You think boxing 937 00:59:15,000 --> 00:59:17,079 began in two thousand and eight. This was going on in the eighties, 938 00:59:17,400 --> 00:59:22,719 and at that time everybody thought Marvin Hagler was going to destroy Ray Leonard off 939 00:59:22,719 --> 00:59:25,159 the three year layoff, because he had been a menace in the middleweight division 940 00:59:25,440 --> 00:59:30,159 for the better part of what about six years, five six years. Ray 941 00:59:30,239 --> 00:59:32,519 was moving off from welterweight. I mean he had never fought at middleweight and 942 00:59:32,599 --> 00:59:37,119 never fought a med He'd fought at welterweight or slightly over it. He fought 943 00:59:37,119 --> 00:59:38,559 and won a title at juamorm middleweight. But now he's going all the way 944 00:59:38,559 --> 00:59:43,800 to one sixty. And by the way, there was no rehydration clause. 945 00:59:43,880 --> 00:59:46,800 Bullshit, There was no catchweight nonsense. This was a straight one sixty fight. 946 00:59:47,280 --> 00:59:50,719 But the one thing about it was and Ray was really smart about this, 947 00:59:51,880 --> 00:59:54,480 negotiating for a twelve round fight, negotiating for a certain size of the 948 00:59:54,519 --> 00:59:58,519 ring rather than I think it was. He wanted there was eighteen by eighteen, 949 00:59:58,559 --> 01:00:00,679 but he got at twenty by twenty something. I forget the exact situation, 950 01:00:00,760 --> 01:00:04,360 but I would encourage anybody if they really want to know the ins and 951 01:00:04,400 --> 01:00:07,400 outs is to go and buy or rent or borrow or get from the library 952 01:00:07,440 --> 01:00:12,639 or whatever. The incredible book written by my good pal back in the day 953 01:00:12,679 --> 01:00:16,559 who died several years ago, but is the quintessential authoritative voice on the Four 954 01:00:16,639 --> 01:00:20,559 Kings fights. And that's the great George Kimball, who wrote the book The 955 01:00:20,599 --> 01:00:23,280 Four Kings, which chronicles he covered all nine of their fights at ringside. 956 01:00:23,360 --> 01:00:27,320 He chronicles every single one of those bouts has its own chapter, and he 957 01:00:27,360 --> 01:00:30,960 writes absolutely, incredibly beautifully about all the scenarios leading up to and what it 958 01:00:31,039 --> 01:00:36,280 took to make the fight, the aftermath to fight itself between between the Haggler 959 01:00:36,360 --> 01:00:38,400 and Leonard. And now that we're talking about it like this because the anniversary 960 01:00:38,440 --> 01:00:42,000 is coming up, I'm actually I think when I lay my head down to 961 01:00:42,039 --> 01:00:44,679 the pillow tonight, before I do so, and this is the true story. 962 01:00:45,039 --> 01:00:47,800 I keep that book in my nightstand drawer because I put it out every 963 01:00:47,880 --> 01:00:52,760 now and then when I just get so I'm a little milk and cookies and 964 01:00:52,840 --> 01:00:55,920 a little bedtime reading. I'm going to go George's book on the Four Kings. 965 01:00:57,039 --> 01:01:00,519 I'm going to go right to the chapter on Leonard versus Haggler. My 966 01:01:00,559 --> 01:01:04,679 sleepy time this evening. I love it. One more plug too, because 967 01:01:04,719 --> 01:01:08,360 I've plugged this before. We did a previous podcast interview with Brian Dugan, 968 01:01:08,679 --> 01:01:13,559 who you know, Irish writer who wrote an entire book about this fight, 969 01:01:13,800 --> 01:01:17,000 Super Fight, the making and the fight of Sugar Ray Leonard and Marmon Hagler. 970 01:01:17,119 --> 01:01:20,760 And if you go, I rarely plug this. If you go to 971 01:01:20,840 --> 01:01:23,800 our Big Fight Weekend YouTube page, you'll see the full interview that I did. 972 01:01:23,840 --> 01:01:29,239 I put the video interview up with Brian Dugan about this fight and about 973 01:01:29,280 --> 01:01:31,280 why he wrote about this fight a couple of years ago. So go check 974 01:01:31,280 --> 01:01:35,000 that out on the Big Fight Weekend YouTube page. I rarely send people to 975 01:01:35,079 --> 01:01:37,480 that, but go check it out. It's there. It's nostalgic. You'll 976 01:01:37,480 --> 01:01:40,039 love that. With that, my friend, I think we are good for 977 01:01:40,079 --> 01:01:45,159 this edition of the pod again. We're back at one Eastern time on Friday 978 01:01:45,199 --> 01:01:51,239 with the bet Us Boxing Show, Handicapping the Richardson Hitchin's main event with the 979 01:01:51,360 --> 01:01:57,000 Argentine opponent Gestavo Limos Diego Pacheco's the co feature will handicap both of those fights. 980 01:01:57,559 --> 01:02:00,760 And then while I am in Arizona at the basketball Final four, of 981 01:02:00,760 --> 01:02:02,760 course I will make time with brother ray Field and we will do the recap 982 01:02:02,800 --> 01:02:06,840 podcast coming off the weekend with whatever happens other than that. Are we good? 983 01:02:07,119 --> 01:02:08,679 Are we ready for the weekend? Are we good? I think we're 984 01:02:08,679 --> 01:02:12,679 good. There we go. There is the one and only Dan Rayfield. 985 01:02:12,760 --> 01:02:16,199 Check him out on the Fight Preach Unite substack again bet Us Boxing show one 986 01:02:16,199 --> 01:02:22,320 Eastern time Friday. We are part of the Big Fight Weekend podcast feed with 987 01:02:22,360 --> 01:02:24,360 the preview Fight Preach Unit Recap coming off the weekend. For now, we're 988 01:02:24,400 --> 01:02:29,119 good. Enjoy the weekend and we're back soon. You've been listening to the 989 01:02:29,119 --> 01:02:30,519 Big Fight Weekend preview podcasts.