Oh boy, here we go again, another one for the books. Hey,
how are you? You know it's funny. I have talked about this
for years that our history is educated guests for the most part, and especially
when you start getting into civilizations that are a thousand years or older, we
don't know how many of these early people formed. We're talking Sumerians, we're
talking pre dynastic Egyptians. We we're talking the Maya, the China, Chinese,
and so forth and so on. A lot of these guys just appeared
on the scene completely formed. That's a huge problem for a lot of archaeologists,
Egyptologists, minus whatever you want to focus on. And it's a challenge
because there's no writing, you know, and we're just beginning to get a
sense of these cuneiforms, these clay tablets that go back thousands of years,
most notably the Sumerians, and they're descriptions of earlier civilizations that because our current
crop of archaeologists and scientists are not allowed or educated to go further than noted
and well documented kings and individuals, including civilizations, they don't accept it.
They don't accept the kings lists that go back ten twenty there's even evidence in
some of the Egyptian lists that are close to fifty thousand years in the past,
and that's just too much. And this is what's so frustrating about academia
and our current history. They need to see hard evidence well on Earth ancients.
We do our best to provide as much hard evidence as possible and research
and we got it today with my returning guest Matt Lacroix, who is going
to drill down into what he has discovered and continues to uncover in Turkey.
And I have only been to Istanbul a couple of times, which isn't really
getting out in the backcountry like go Beckley Tepe, places like darren Kuru,
Cappadocia. These are hundreds and a couple of places are close to eight hundred
one thousand miles excuse me, not a thousand, close to eight hundred miles
from Istanbul, and this is where the real research and excavations are going on.
Now. We all know about go Beckley Tepee, which was dated to
what nine five hundred BC, roughly twelve thousand plus years ago. It was
established and then oddly it was covered up, it was buried for some reason.
It was protected. Now there's another site that's a few miles from go
Beckley Teppey called Carahan Teppi. And when we had Hugh Newman and JJ Ainsworth
on the program, who have been there a few times, we're getting in
a sense that there's still a great deal of guesswork. And when Schmidt,
the archaeologist who discovered and excavated go Beckley teppe first revealed the carbon daty,
he basically tipped the worldline and see here, because it was so far it
was so far back, so ancient, that it was hard for the academic
world to adapt. Now. I still think there's a lot of people that
are questioning these dates and are very uncomfortable with going that far back. But
in our program today, Matt is introducing a new book that he co wrote
with Billy Carson called The Epic of Humanity. And in that book, he
goes back. According to the cuteiforms, these clay tablets that are written on
he goes back two hundred thousand years. And that's where we begin to,
strangely enough, correlate with people like Mario Bill Reps. Remember he's a mathematician
that goes back. I think he goes back actually more than two hundred thousand
years. And then we got our own doctor Mark Carlotto, who, through
the use of alignments of temples, pyramids, and ancient buildings, he goes
back I think pretty close to a couple hundred thousand years. Now, these
are insane dates. I am college educated, many of you are college educated.
I studied some anthropology classes. But you know, whenever we get Jin
day On here, That's why I love Jin. She's an archaeologist. She
becomes quiet and subdude when she starts hearing dates that are one hundred thousand to
two hundred thousand years in the past, four sophisticated buildings. How do you
get over this, Well, you have to get over it through hard evidence.
And I haven't announced to make just the last couple of days. Jindo,
our own archaeologist here at Earth Agients, has agreed to join Matt Lacroix
and his team to go to Turkey to study these artifacts and through testing and
data analysis, work to get some dates for these new ruins that are coming
to light. So when I hear that our own Gendeo going to Turkey and
working with Matt, and I really admire Matt and appreciate him. He's got
the energy that I had at his age to head out and start uncovering more
evidence of this early civilization that he's all excited about. So our program today
is the Epic of Humanity, and my guest is Matt Lacroix, and we're
gonna go for a couple of hours today because we're gonna talk about not only
where we left off when he was on the panel with Doctor, with Reverend
Jim Willis and Jendo and myself. We're gonna drill down deep to that,
and then we're gonna talk about this book that just came out. I mean
it just came out, what is it, a couple of weeks ago,
So the Epic of Humanity And by the way, you can now get it
on Amazon, so check it out and see what you think. So this
is what we're doing today. We're gonna do a deep dive on Turkey.
So hold on to your hats, savateurs. Is well organized, Everything flow
easily. It was a fantastic tour from beginning to end. To be honest,
I was shocked by the private visits. I could not believe that we
were lucky enough to experience those. That's from one of the many people who
do the Earth Ancients Grand Egyptian Tour every year. We're in our fifth year
and we're looking forward to our next program. That's this April twenty eight through
May fifth, and it is a tour of ancient sites and it's a private
tour with our host, Mohammed Imbry Him, who is a wonderful world class
post and tour guide. We have a few spots left and this is an
invitation to you to come out and join us in what can only be described
as a VIP tour of Egypt. These are private sites we go to for
the most part. This is a view of some of the most intriguing sites,
including the Great Pyramid, Hathor Temple, the Bent Pyramid, the Red
Pyramid, so much more, and then we cruise on the Nile. This
is a way to really take in the ancient past and from start to finish,
the food, the beverages and the environment is first class. For more
information, please go to Earthancients dot com forward slash tours all the informations there.
The Earth Ancients Grand Egyptian Tour April twenty eighth through May ninth. All
right, we've got a great show today. As always, we have interesting
topics, and I've invited Matt Lacrue back to the program. Not only does
Matt have a new book out called The Epic of Humanity. It's co written
by Billy Carson, but I wanted Matt to come back to give us the
kind of a deep dive on what's going on in Turkey. I have not
been to Turkey. We're doing our first Tour Earth Ancient Tour in August of
this year, and I'm looking. I mean, I've been to Istanbul,
but Istanbul is very modern and I didn't get a chance to go to go
back to the Tapy and so forth and so on. But I have invited
Matt back for a number of reasons. He's an exciting guy. He's passionate
like I am, about the ancient past, and he is taking Orthodoxy and
moving it beyond what we understand about ancient our ancient history, and giving us
a possible scenario for really exciting discoveries. So, Hey, Matt, welcome
back to Earth the Ancient. It's great to see you. Hey, Cliff,
it's great to see you again. I feel like this is like part
two, because we just had that other one we did, but truly,
it's an amazing way to come out of that show and then discuss even what
came out of that and these new discoveries that you brought up. So thanks
for having back on. Yeah, the panel was fun. I had a
lot of good positive comments. It's fun to have more than one person on
a panel. But as we discussed before we started, the time issues are
much tighter, So you know, before we start, Matt, I want
to get a little information about you. I mean I haven't had you on
by yourself for lee four years now, if not longer. Yeah, why
are you passionate about the past? What? What is it? I mean,
it's it like, oh, it's cool to look at new discoveries and
you're in Turkey, and Turkey's in ancient place and there's not enough feet on
the ground that are looking at stuff. But what is it for you?
Yeah? Who cares? Man? I mean, why why should we care?
Well, the funny thing about you asking that is that a lot of
my life I was interested in the in the idea of lost civilizations, and
I was fascinated by that concept. But I wasn't like a history nerd.
You know, you didn't walk up to me in the playground when I was
like twelve and be like Matt was the date on like when you know,
like Cortes conquered the astec Like I wasn't bad, Like that wasn't me.
I was like looking for crystals and rocks and I was, you know,
wonder. I was in awe and wonder of the stars above me and all
the kids. Everyone's like walking around doing their thing, and I was just
out out there staring around like and people. It felt very odd to me
that I felt very different than everyone else. I knew it very much.
Felt more like in my friend that I grew up with, Ryan would attest
to this, It's like it's like you don't know anything about being here.
It's kind of weird. It was an odd thing. It felt like more
like I was some kind of a tourist and I'm like I'm wide eyed and
I'm looking at everything, and I'm like out nature and I'm like blown away,
and everybody else is sort of like okay, And that's was my life
though. That was my life from a very young age. It's just being
completely unorthodox to everyone else. I was like a complete nerd. I didn't
have a lot of friends. I was usually spending most of the time out
in nature looking for rocks and crystals and gold and all kinds of things,
and I still do that now. I'm never like. In fact, there's
not that much difference between my passions from when I was young, except one,
not big one is that I've literally the embodiment of who I am and
my mission here. Literally, I feel like it is connecting the ancient narrative
of our lost civilizations and the origins of who we are in our consciousness,
these mysteries, these greater mysteries that encompass the totality of our existence here in
this reality. And that became far more than just an interest in something that
I was passionate about, but became something that I realized was more of a
voice inside me. It was more of like a fire that was burning,
that was something that I had to do, and there was nothing else that
I really could do. It was like that voice and that calling just became
stronger and stronger as I got a little older and into a different phases of
my life. And now it's to the point where I have to try to
go out of my way. And my wife will admit this to try to
do other normal things in life because I am so focused and obsessed with uncovering
these ancient mysteries. Yeah, we should also let our listeners know that congratulations,
you've just got married. I got married back in but but I mean
within the last twelve months. But come on, it's been it's been great.
She's an amazing woman. She's so beautiful. I feel very lucky to
have such a supportive, smart, just an incredible woman that is already driven
to want to explore the greater questions of things. Anyway, and that's really
part of what you want to share that path with. Yeah, that's that's
a perfect partner. You said something just now that I can relate to,
which is that I came back, I incarnated. I wanted to show people,
tell people, reveal the people that we are part of a much older
culture. Yeah. Do you have a sense of lifetimes in an earlier period,
perhaps not acknowledging them in dreams or whatever, but just because for me,
at a very very young age, I was like being kicked out of
Sunday School because I'm like questioning the Bible. Say, who's Jesus Christ?
Did he get out of here? Right? Get out? Of that exact
same thing happened to me too. It's crazy, you know, Kenny.
You say that because I was in Sunday School and I also got kicked out,
So it's funny that we walked a similar path in that way, Cliff,
But you're right. The way to describe it is this, as I've
been uncovering and connecting this narrative of from the Canaean form tablets and the Sumerians,
Acadians, Babylonians, Assyrians up through ancient stories around the world, whether
it's Vedic texts or ancient Aztec texts, it came it came more in line
with this understanding that there was something that need to be brought together. There
was an understanding there was a there was a story, a thread that had
gone around the world that had been lost, that had been fragmented into pieces
over time from catastrophes and conquerors and various other means that have come along and
just time itself. And for me, something spoke to me as being like
an ancient like an ancient librarian or sage or something like that. Because and
I say that not in a way to sound cool at all. I don't.
It's more of this fire within me of to literally dedicate every single thing
I have to these mysteries and protecting these ancient texts and the knowledge that's within
them, and where that comes from. It's the only thing that makes sense
to me is it has to come from some previous life that that was literally
what I did. And thus I guess, like you said, maybe we
come back for different reasons. We have many different lifetimes. We all have
a great tapestry we play in this grand scheme of reality. But what if
some of those lifetimes we had a very pivotal role at one point, and
then we come back to almost replay that role again in another life. And
I very much feel like that may be why I'm doing this and why maybe
some of these secrets are are connecting and becoming known in a way where it
almost seems more familiar than anything else. It's like remembering rather than learning for
the first time, yeah, or bringing it back as quickly as possible.
One of the interesting things that has been an issue for people is well known
as Graham Hancock and the hundreds of people that we have on the program each
week or every year, I should say, is the fact that we are
dealing with an orthodoxy that doesn't recognize earlier sophisticated cultures Atlantis, Limoria, you
can name it, the people who who perhaps had technology that is more earth
centered. And I'm dealing with this right now in my writings with the Maya,
the earlier Maya who did have an earth based, geomagnetic, tuloric filled
society built around a science that we're just discovering right now. This is a
huge problem. And what you're doing is great because you're revealing through your writing,
through your research, through your travel, uh, that there are earlier
civilizations. Why do we need to look at these people with a fine tooth
comb? Why? Why? Why should we care? I mean because I'm
curious. I just it's kind of a secondary question to you, but it's
important because why Well, the first thing to the way to answer that question
is the state is to first point out that this view we've have our of
our past in a linear way of slowly progressing from like stone tools and you
know, beating each other over the head with like the whole flintstone idea,
that concept that is like kind of silly, but the idea that that started
there, and then we've slowly gotten smarter and figured things out over time.
Is this model that is portrayed to us and nearly everything that we see.
And then so when people look back and they're like, what do I care
about history with some primitive people that or doing something in the jungle or somewhere
like, I don't care, Like what does that matter? Like there's nothing
I can learn from them. It could not be more of the opposite the
truth. It literally could not be more of the opposite of that statement in
literally every single way. And let me tell you why. The first thing
is that when we look at the ancient past, this linear progression from starting
in a primitive place to getting to where we are now and thinking where the
pinnacle of knowledge and different aspects like that, first of all, I think
is very very wrong. I think it's very very wrong. And secondly,
when we look at the history of how far back our story goes and the
levels of civilizations that have risen and fallen over time, looking at something like
the Yuga cycles out of the Hindu Yuga cycles, which point out that that's
literally the nature of the cyclical nature of our existence. Here you find that
our story is far more complex than we've been told and instead of being something
where those primitive hunter gatherers were very stupid back twenty thirty thousand years ago,
we're now looking at evidence that is emerging from Turkey in other parts of the
world, but especially like Vaughan that we're going to talk about, that is
showing us that there's an entire chapter of our story that is enormous and mysterious
and mythical and seems to have this origin point that we couldn't figure out,
but that the output was that all these giant civilizations were building temples and pyramids
and connecting to that, like you said, that great word, the energy
of the Earth. Love it that energy that flows through the earth that Nikola
Tesla figured out through magnetism, that energy. They already had figured that out,
so they embodied in everything they did. And so we look now where
we are with cars driving by everywhere in trains and planes flying over our head,
and were like, look at the pinnacle of all of our achievements.
And yet we can't even usually usually say a couple sentences without having some kind
of a slang word or using some grammar that's inaccurate. We're like, we
don't, We're not that well educated comparison comparatively to these poets of our past.
Go if you read something like John Taylor's book that I just a good
an example of this, Like, give me an example I spent. I
just did a podcast on this book two days ago. This is from the
eighteen hundreds, from man named John Taylor. In reading his words, you
realize that we've lost so much even from the eighteen hundreds, the way they
speak, the way they see the world, the way they value interaction and
respect, and the way they value all those things. That degradation has continued
to the point now where we no longer value our elders, we no longer
value our past, We no longer value the things that really matter, like
the Earth, are role in the universe, are the totality of reaching balance
and what all all these things can unlock. But that's why I think it's
so profound to go back to some of these earlier writers and some of these
earlier thinkers to remember what we've lost. And of course if you want to
go back for them, that you'll truly see it. Go back to read
read the ancient Sumerian tablets like read like the Auma Elish or octra Hasis or
Epic of Gilgamesh, the earlier versions, because though they were rewritten in other
in our later cultures. But what you find is the most beautiful form in
which they were describing our connection to everything, our connection to nature and the
source of of like what we think of as God, and the totality and
the fabric, this invisible fabric that exists all around us, that we're almost
invisible. It's almost invisible to us. Now we no longer look at it,
we no longer care about it, we no longer respect it the way
that we used to. And the ancients are trying when we're trying to tell
us all along. If you want to go back to the very almost ancient
text of all, they say that if we lose the balance and harmony we
have within ourselves the microcosm of the macrocosm, within the earth and nature and
within the universe, we literally become disconnected from the true sides of who we
are. And that is what the true biblical idea of hell is. An
angelic like divine being that starts at a place where it's connected to source.
It finds this way so lost eventually that it literally has no connection back to
it our current civilization. Right it's almost like a whisper in the wind of
what used to be long ago that we've forgotten, that we're almost trying to
listen to, like it's an echo, but we don't really know what it
is, and we're trying to rediscover it. And that voice from the past
that's kind of flowing on the wind that we hear is getting louder and louder
as the ancient past and these discoveries are merging. The old world is merging
with the new world coming together. Right now, we're finding that synergy of
energy. Finally, we're finding that awakening of consciousness and that flowering that's emerging.
And I truly believe that these discoveries at Lake Vaughn is that origin point
we've been searching for for thousands of years. Yeah, it's funny because you
know, when we had you on this panel, you were you definitely have
an affinity for Turkey, but it's gone beyond just an affinity. It appears
to be that you have found, through others research, a link to the
very very ancient past. Let's talk about your interest now. I want to
talk about this underwater temple at Lake Vaughan. What was the dates they came
up with on that, wasn't it something extreme? Well, first of all,
it was discovered those those temple temple walls in the in the temple foundations
that were left over was discovered underwater in Lake Vaughn had more than one hundred
feet deep. Okay, but only in twenty seventeen. You know, think
about how right now, if you go on forms or you're on anything ancient,
go Beckley Teppee and Karrahan Karahan Tepe are sort of everyone's talking about them
because they're shaking things up and they're changing our timelines. But those were found
during World War Two. These discoveries in Lake Vaughan, if people are wondering
why they haven't heard of them or why a lot of this seems brand news
because they are brand new. They're brand new discoveries in the scheme of history.
Like if you find a site like for instance, when they discovered Ayanis
in nineteen eighty nine, they didn't discover the temple. They discover the lower
megalithic walls way down below. Took them thirty years to find the temple,
thirty years to get all the way to the point where they could find that
Haldy temple with all those ancient symbols that we're gonna talk about. So even
if you make a discovery in some location, it doesn't mean that you find
the heart of what you're looking for right away, right And what you were
getting to your point about the discoveries is that I was confirming with conferring with
the megalithic expert of the world, Brian Forster, who's one of the experts
on this film, and he was I was asking him on like, Brian,
is this the only underwater megalithic temple wall that has megalithic precise blocks anywhere
in the world, because I can't find any other ones. He thought about
it for a minute and he's like, I believe that's the only one in
the world as well, which is already phenomenally fascinating because then you have something
that's in a place that doesn't exist anywhere else. But then then beds a
question, Well, okay, so it's not a primitive wall. I'm not
saying there's no other underwater stuff. We have plenty of stuff off Alexandria in
Egypt and other areas of Greece and so on. But how could you have
cliff a highly sophisticated megalithic temple wall that was clearly built over one hundred feet
underwater in Lake Vaughan. If our history that we're told with civilizations emerging out
of Mesopotamia is only six thousand years old, it doesn't make any sense if
you have over one hundred feet underwater. It would have had to predate the
lake levels of that lake, right, And that's exactly what they found.
It was fascinating to read. If anyone's curious to go read some very interesting
papers, go read about the underwater discoveries in Lake Vaughan and where they discuss
geologically and climatologically when the lake would have been low enough to be able to
build at that level. And some of the scientists were like throwing out dates
like fifteen thousand years ago because that's what the glacial minimum for when that lake
was as low as it was, which literally ties in exactly with the timeframe
of everything we're talking about now with this new timeline of history and these lost
civilizations. So who are the people who build I mean, because the photographs
that you present on your website of this ruin in Lake Vaughan is beautifully designed.
It's like really, you know, high tech or we don't want to
say machine because we can't tell if the stones were cut with a machine or
not. But nice tools though, like high end, yeah, really high
end. Beautiful bronze age not bronze age. Yeah, So what is this
suspicion in terms of an age for that, because we were talking about the
glacial melts into the river, that could be pre ice age or maybe at
the end of the younger dress you just suggested twelve fifteen thousand in the teens.
Sure older than that. Yeah, I actually think and I'm going to
make a definitive statement here as someone who studied every megalithic temple and every megalithic
site in the world that I can find, and every temple site too,
because we have to remember the early Sumerians with Arado and Shirupak, they didn't
build with megalithic stones. They specifically built with brick for a purpose that they
wanted that time. And it's actually describes in the tablets, and I'll paraphrase
it says they laid bricks in pure places and so they had a reason for
that for that. But that also makes us so any kind of brick structures
can't really survive unless they're buried under a massive amount of inundation layer of mud,
which is why ad Srupeks survive. However, in saying that, when
you excavate and go look at those sites, you don't see the remains of
there's no beautiful temple still like it's just all eroded with pottery and fragments of
cuneiform tablets. Right, it's so ancient, there's nothing really left in terms
of it. It's megali, it's nature of it, of its temples and
its structures, they're not really much left. So having said that, I
believe that ionis temple with the absolutely stunning recreation they put into it. The
University of Anchora is standbul out there, Vaughan University Professor pasaically phenomenal job.
Thank you from the bottom of my heart. You guys seeing that sight when
they first discovered it, Cliff, when they first uncovered the Holdy Temple at
Ayanis, it was like it looks like an apocalypse destroyed it. There's vitrification
marks strewn all over the walls, extreame melting and burning. Things are thrown
all over the place. It looks like a tsunami and then some kind of
corollass ejection heat event just destroyed that whole area, which is why they found
it such a enormous amount of sediment. But getting back to what you were
saying at the beginning, the discoveries under Lake Vaughan with this megalithic temple shows
us that there's a timeline here that is sterious because if Quebecley Teppe has been
radiocarbon dated further to the west as being eleven six hundred years old, it
begs the question on how old these temples could be though, because when we
look at the ancient Sumerian stories, this Christian Noah figure that is from the
original Sumeri, last Sumerian king of Sharrupak known as Untapishtam or Zaya Sudra,
you find that that's where the heart of that entire story came from. And
it's this epic of the last line of Sumerian kings and priests that were going
to be destroyed from this event, and they want one of them with his
family was warned and that's where the story comes from. But that's how that
family got from the Sumerian region over to Vaughan was from literally a catastrophe on
the earth, and it's very true. It's very well documented in at least
four different sets of tablets, the Epic of Gilgamesh, the Haitian Autrejasus,
the Legend of Itsubar, and there is even a couple others too that are
kind of obscure that described that that flood story in almost the exact same way,
with this seed of mankind being seed of mankind being preserved from an ancient
bloodline of the Sumerian king and his families, three sons and his and they
they are then the ones that we're finding these bizarre kings lists coming out of
Lake Vaughan from cliff Okay, That's what I mean is like this mythical kind
of Christian story that is like, of course, I think there's a lot
of it that's not accurate in the dating and all those things, but there's
this origin point back to the original Sumerian versions and all these Babylonian versions.
And then what you find is that makes this so like mind blowing is that
there's a site at around Lake Vaughan, at the southern end of the lake
called Cavistepe, and at that site there's a megalithic wall that's surrounded by the
more primitive Urartian work. And in that wall it has a translation cliff okay,
And in that translation it says, and I'm gonna paraphrase because I don't
have it right in front of me, but it says something like I King
Hike and Haldy built this great temple and this civilization and all these things.
And you see that, and you look up King Hike in Wikipedia. You
don't even need to go in deep d deep, it's anywhere. It's very
obvious. You find that. It says right in there that he literally was
a direct descendant of Japeth, who is a directed was one of the three
sons of Noah. The last Sumerian version of this Untapischtam. It's like the
whole story came full circle. The whole thing became a reality, from like
the myth and legend side to the archaeological evidence driven side the whole the two
things merged and we found these mysteries that just got deeper and deeper. That
was just the beginning. That was like the tip of the iceberg. For
how deep that mystery truly went. So to answer your question, though,
how old is it? I don't even think that those disasters that caused that
event that led to them going there and then building that. I don't even
think that was the last ice Age Younger Dryas twelve thousand years ago, which
is what I think destroyed Atlantis and all these others. I think it was
an entire event before that, which is how they were able to then pass
that Golden Age around the world, which was then destroyed by the Younger Dryis.
But that means that Ianis, I truly believe is the oldest and most
important temple in the world. And I think it's it's more than twenty thousand
years old. Yeah, I was. I was waiting for you to throw
that at me. Uh. It's interesting how the Sumerians chronicle these guys uh
in their in their writing, in their their tablets. But you are I
want to continue with this a little bit. Then we're gonna jump into this
book because it transitions very nice. And don't forget the new addition to the
team too. Yeah, we should mention that that Jindeo, who's been on
earth the ancients for years, has now joined Matt's team. Uh and uh,
so Jin Jin's a real deal archaeologists. She's done research and done studies
too. Yeah, she's an anthropolitic. Obviously, you have to be with
origins and you get archaeology. It's yeah, she's gonna be fun to It's
gonna be fun to hear what she has to say. But you're assembling this
group with the goal of what the goal is to have expertise from every single
possible area we can so that we're in when we're in a place that has
megalithic stuff and archaeology, we need to have people that are experts in megalithic
stuff and archaeology. When we're in the same place that has religious iconography and
ancient symbols that tie back to the origins of spirituality religion, we need someone
that has deep, deep knowledge in within from the church but has not from
within but has come out that has the biblical background, but also that spiritual
shamanic understanding, right, and then we also have to have people that understand
ancient texts, like me from the degree of where these names and where all
these stories come from, and where we can follow this thread. And so
that ended up emerging into five experts from around the world, myself, Billy
Carson, Brian Forrester, Jennifer do and now Paul Wallace as well, to
make five total to create this like a dream team. And I just want
to I want to go back though on what you had mentioned a minute a
second ago about Jennifer Dio. If anybody wants to watch that wonderful panel that
we did just recently that is on Cliff's channel and is on mine. It
was amazing because I had never met Jennifer. Cliff introduced me to her just
Ada Blue in that panel, and you'll see right in it like during the
process, I'm kind of like smiling, and I'm like, hmmm, because
you can. I've already figured it out very clear that Jennifer was the one.
She was the only archaeologist I ever met who's open minded in that way
to look at evidence that is from an academic and evidence driven place. She's
got a lot of experience, she's very smart, but she comes to the
place where she's not going to be rigid, just like every other archaeologist.
And so I feel very honored that Jennifer has joined the team and is willing
to help investigate this mystery to truly see if we can change history. So
that's what it's all about, bringing these together for a film that's gonna go
not only in Turkey, but we're we're working right now to see if we
can make it happen on another mysterious country in the Middle East that I can't
mention yet. But then we're gonna We're gonna include Peru and Bolivia as this
expedition around the world to to follow this mystery and try to see if we
can lead it back to the very origins of everything. Mm hmm. So
the goal is to have real solid uh content for this film. But the
secondary result of this research would be that you would be publishing in papers your
your work. Right, Yeah, let me get Let me explain that for
a minute, because it's important that people understand the scope of this is that
I parted ways. I was working at Gaya back in November up until November,
and I parted the part of Ways in Gaya with these new Discoveries and
started started my own company, oh my honest legacy Okay. That became the
entire foundation behind the film, the Discoveries everything. It was the engine behind
this and all this work, and so I'm doing that full time now with
bringing on a couple people soon, which is incredibly exciting, and we're gonna
be launching this as a media and discovery company to then go multiple times,
not even once in so far this year, we're scheduled to go to Lake
Vaughan and those sites two times. We're gonna be there for like a month
total. We're gonna be capturing, we're gonna be doing full surveys, no
digging, because we're not gonna break any laws or rules, but we're gonna
be doing measuring surveys. We're gonna take measurements of the stones. We're gonna
be doing everything we can that we're allowed to do to then go forward and
write a whole book on this going forward, and Jennifer might actually join me
in that book. We're still talking about it. But at least we're going
to be coming at this in the most academic way possible to present these this
findings with every single avenue of academic and I guess sort of like studying background,
sort of self studied background as well, the academic side sort of coming
together to try to see if we can prove that this is truly is accurate,
and so far the consensus is that, yes, this is not at
all what we've been told. This is not the Urartian civilization that we're showing
with these sites. It is from another completely different epic in history, and
now it's just about going and proving it. We're going to take a short
commercial break to allow our sponsors to identify themselves, and we will be right
back with my guest today, Matt Lacroix, discussing his newest book, The
Epic of Humanity. We'll be right back. You don't want to practition.
My guest today is Matt Lacroix. He is the author of the latest book,
The Epic of Humanity, co written with Billy Carson, and he is
doing some exciting research in Turkey, which is the topic of our discussion today.
I want to ask you about this because when go backly Teppie was first
revealed to be was it nine five BC? And then Carahan Teppee is I
don't know if it's older or not, few thousand years old, the same
thing they're built around. They're pretty close. Yeah, that was hard for
the community to swallow. It's just there's still I mean I remember, and
this is not that long ago. The Egyptologist was asked about Go Beckley Teppe
and he was like, what who, what, what is that about?
Which is scary because he knew he knew, I mean he knew. Yeah,
but this is what we're you're dealing with. You're dealing with a community
that just will not budge on a timeline with sophisticated cultures, and I mean
you're hoping to show them in the same kind of a context like here's Go
Beckley Teppe, but now we have an even earlier people from Turkey that were
much much more sophisticated. Because one of my big problems with Go Beckley Teppe
is, although it's great dating, it's very rudimentary. The sculptures are just
the t shape pillars are the only thing that is of an in trust to
me. I mean, I'm an artist, I'm a trained artist and sculptor,
and when I see the sculptures, I'm like, this is very crude.
These guys are like, you know, what do you think about that
compared to like some of the beautiful stuff at Lake Von though, well that's
what I was saying. The stone work and on this under water temple.
It looks like Humapuku or it looks like very sophisticated egypt temple work. So
it's like and that's the big problem with with a lot of alternative work,
is that you go way way back and you see extremely sophisticated machine cut stones,
sculptures. We can go spend a day on that, and then there's
a period where it recedes and then it picks up again. So and this
is where I think archaeology has a problem is that they are confused as to
where these timelines. And this is my big problem is the timelines are screwed
up exactly that and that, and that can not be more apparent with a
site called kef okay Kef Temple. It's called Kef Klesi, but I don't
use the word klesi because it means fortress. It's kind of like calling the
Great Pyramid of Za Kufu's pyramid because he had nothing to do with it.
So it's silly. But anyway, when you go to Kef, I've shown
on that and you've seen that giant box relief that has the winged gods and
all that, just like it's made of a basalt. It's like some of
the most beautiful work you've every ever seen the world. It's amazing, and
the symbols and iconography in that is so fine tuned in the layers of how
they did it, it's beyond comprehension. I'm of the opinion that I'm I
am skeptical that it was even done by hand. I don't understand how it
was done. I don't know megalithic stone expert has ever been able to explain
to me, especially something like that three by three by four foot giant basalt
box relief that is coursed a big part of all of this, But how
they could have carved that in literally like you've seen, it has layers,
that has three different layers that are have been carved into it with cost within
it. It's like mind blowing. How could they could do that? But
the point I'm trying to make is the reason I said all that about how
amazing it is is because that's how the archaeologists found felt when they found it.
When they discovered it, and that site was not found during ey honest,
it was like a whole other time period and it became sort of lost
and no one ever heard of it again. But it was found in nineteen
fifty eight nineteen fifty nine ish that time period they were in excavating and they
found that giant box relief with fragments and other things. And what's really sad,
and I talked to Jennifer about this too, and it's something that we're
reading and talking about for the film to discuss, is that there was archaeologists
that came in that established the narrative of Turkey before that, okay, and
then when these archaeologists came in to excavate, like kef above Adel Savez and
they found that they were amazed by it. They were they wrote pages about
this and about the icons and everything. But what was sad about it was
that they kept talking about the symbols and how the symbols that have been identified
earlier by the other archaeologists. It was like they were trying to mold to
it and it was difficult for them. They would say things like, well,
we've been told that this looks like a lance or a spear, but
it really looks a lot like the tree of life symbol on here as well.
It's like they're arguing with each other, but in a respectful way where
they're not overstepping there they're like discussing how well it doesn't really match, but
and they're trying to like make it bend so they'll be like, well,
the lance or the tree of life image, it's like one's a war symbol
and one's a symbol of like balance and harmony in nature and essention. Like
they literally couldn't be the more opposite symbols. But what that did is it
created this entire mentality to try to to try to take the entire teachings that
within that and try to weave it into the Urartian war empire that made primitive
Bronze age tools and all this stuff that had none of the artistic work.
The last point I want to make, Cliff, they mentioned how the interesting
thing is that they found nothing culturally is advanced with artwork or pottery or stonemasonry
anywhere else in the Urartian civilization. And instead of being like, well that's
strange, their answer was, well, I guess they figured it out.
It's like that was their answer. And I'm not putting down those archaeologists that
said that they're just doing the best they can. They're just trying to do
the best they can. It gives us the avenue to come in now and
to try to really lay this in the way that's evidence and objective driven.
And Jennifer has already looked at that and agrees with me that we're gonna we're
obviously not gonna go with the Urartian background here because it doesn't make any sense
any longer. And just like around the world, Cliff, whether it's the
Inca or of you know, Machu Picchu or Oea Tombo or Saskylaman there or
Tiwanaku and Pumapunku, it's the same thing. There's an older story in the
bottom and then a younger story on top. But you see that in Egypt,
you see that in Mexico, you literally see it everwhere in the world.
And that's the timeline that we need to get established so that we can
create this understanding of when things occurred and not lump it all together and get
it all confused like we are right now. Yeah, I'm gonna look forward
to hearing from you and of course Jenna, and on what you guys put
together and the outcome obviously the movie, the documentary and whatever books or white
papers that you release. One of the things. As a final note,
one of the things that I have come to realize is that the orthodoxy the
academic community is hindered in so many ways. And I got a wake up
call when I was introduced to doctor Edwin Barney Hard, who's a Mianist who
we we just did a tour with him in Chiapus, Mexico. He made
a statement that was profound to me, very very clear, very to the
point, which is that we only know and have only excavated about one percent
of the Maya world. We only have thirty known cities, and we know
there are literally hundreds of thousands of communities from Honduras to Yucatan the jungle like
lost right. And he said that, and he said, how in the
hell can we know so? And this is what I try to get across
to the listener is that science science, and these archaeologists are doing guess work.
This is our history. It's guessing. And to say that we know
conclusively about a culture that is over three thousand, five thousand years old is
not fair to the reader. And it's also unfair to alternative researchers like yourself,
like myself, like hundreds of other people that you know. How do
you feel about that going forward, and how do you work with the orthodoxy
that is rigid, unyielding in their understanding of previous early civilization. You know
how, if you've ever been in your life in many different situations, maybe
you've just been in a situation with people you know around you where maybe you
have an idea that is rejected by everyone else and you feel very isolated,
and it's like, am I sure I'm right about this? Or like how?
And then let's say instead, you like, maybe you meet a new
friend you're part of that group, and their friends like, guys, listen,
I've been studying this. Like everything he's saying is I think it's right.
You really should listen to what he's saying. And then a third friend
of that, maybe a group of six, right, is like, I
think he's right too, and then they like they walk over next to you,
and then before long everyone is like, yeah, I think maybe we
should look at this in a different way. And but you're like, wait
a minute, you guys just told me I was like ridiculous and silly six
months ago or whatever it is. I'm just there. This is a hypothetical
analogy, but that concept is basically archaeology that's archaeology. That's that's the whole
and mentality of archaeology. Are these academic moguls of their time, these these
heroes that have laid this foundation, and they're well studied, and they're up,
you know, sitting in a stiff room with a they're all like,
no, like, let that go. That's not that that's not the future
anymore. Archaeology is being done by young people around the world that are open
minded and you just want to undercover the truth now. And so you have
all these students that are part of academic universities that are like amazed by this
stuff. But they're waiting. Everyone's waiting for that tipping point to have all
those friends walk over to the other side of the group. And that's what's
happening, I believe right now, and I mean right now. Look at
something like it's a stepping stone thing. Look at something like we Beckley tepping
Krahan pushing that narrative back, finally being accepted a little bit. Then you
get things like Braham Hancock's Ancient Apocalypse getting the mainstream, start getting more understood
and accepted. All the stuff that's going on with the podcasts around the world,
and it's blowing all this stuff up. People like, all right,
let's look at this in a different light now. And then, now,
for the first time ever ever, you have in the light of having the
interest of being knowledge and getting at the truth, and people that have their
hearts in it and they're in put everything they have in this. You have
actual academics for the first time, archaeologists coming forth. They're like, we
need to look at this again. I don't know if we've been right about
this, sorry, but it's time we need to look at all of this
again. And then I think it's like that domino effect. You get a
couple academics, they start agreeing, and then all of it just flows the
other way. And I think we are right at that tipping point right now.
That was my next question is how do you hope to have the orthodoxy
buy into your your world. Let me tell you how we're gonna do it.
We have a whole plan the film. The film is gonna just be
this this obviously like kind of like the great It's like the dinner of the
day, the big big event, right, the big dinner, and where
the film is gonna be taking people in expeditions around the world and showing all
these things with expert it's gonna be incredible. But on the all the on
the other sides of that, there's still there's a breakfast, there's a lunch,
there's dessert. What I mean by that is we're gonna be going to
all these sites and we're gonna be doing surveys. We're gonna be doing all
this professional work that's not even part of the movie where it's like measuring everything,
looking at it from like the super nerdy scientific angle to your following protocol.
Right, We're gonna we're gonna hit this from every angle, films like
back behind the scenes, measurements and analysis and papers and books, and so
we're going to be tackling this from every side we can to try to bring
the world's attention to what looks like this great mystery that really whenever someone looks
at this, I've gotten very little pushback, and I think that's a good
thing. I would love if people would like to come back and challenge this.
But maybe it's one of those things, Cliff, where we've been searching
for some something. Collectively, a lot of us have been searching for something,
and it's coming together now to this point where it was. It was
an origin of knowledge that has been far more important and preserved in secret places
than we ever realize. Cliff, because the cross that is that Ionis and
and a site one of the hardest stones on earth, the first cross that
was lowered there by Haldy. This anuna God that's literally identical to end Lil
and Zeus and Greece. You see this, He's passing the cross and these
doorways of knowledge on how to reach ascension and all these things. But that
cross, that specific cross, the exact one, for my honest, just
so happens to Cliff become the exact cross that the Knights Templar were protecting,
and also the cross that then became the Vatican. That the number they'll cross
on the Vatican. The Pope what his cloak that he wears that cross,
and the British Royals have the same exact cross, from my honest, not
the Christian crucifix cross, but the Ionis cross. What it's telling us is
that there's an ancient, ancient story that's been protected here, that's been preserved
but has been not known about, and if anything, maybe it was lost
at one point and then over time, we're finding it, finding our way
back to it again. But I believe that the secrets that come out of
Ionis and the civilization I'm calling the Lost ra As civilization around that whole region
with Temple and Caavis and others, and the underwater stuff. The secrets that
come out of those incredible artifacts, reliefs, and these these symbols and the
ancient megalists and all the teachings that it embodies that then travel around the world
everywhere that becomes the core of nearly every law civilization. I truly believe that
when we unders when we finally uncover the mysteries of that. And I have
very interesting, very powerful people around the world that are interested in this and
are joining forces with me. But when we uncover the mysteries of this,
we will finally uncover the mysteries that has led us so far away from who
we truly are in our origins of the divinity of what mankind actually is.
Very cool. I was waiting for you to say, now, Elon Musk
just gave us half a billion, and we'll be Elon. But hey,
we're getting there. Let's let's put it that way. No, I'm serious
he's totally into this kind of stuff. He'd be a great sponsor. Yeah,
you know, before we before we transition into this new book. Uh,
do you have a place where people can send donations and reading. We're
bringing that up. I really appreciate that for anyone who wants to support the
film, because we're not trying to raise as much money as far the research
alone. It's right now, it's four countries. Now. I have not
mentioned one of those countries yet because I want to make sure we get that
secure at one hundred percent before I mention it. But one of them is
amazing. Like when I mentioned that people will go wild, so try to
think big. There somewhere that the outside world hasn't really seen. But when,
when When if people want to support this film, because honestly, we're
trying to do this with whatever we can. We're trying to come from this
from every angle we can, including crowds funding, right, and so if
people want to be a part of this, there's incentives that you can go
to the stage of Time dot com and go to the documentary page and once
you'll see if you scroll down with all the team members and the information and
the images of locations, you'll see a silver and a gold tier for people
that want to be part of this movement. It's not even the movie,
it's the movement. The film is part of a movement. And so if
you give one hundred dollars, you get to have your name on the website.
But if you give five hundred or more, you get to have your
name the credits of the film at the end. And that's and that's on
there right now. If you want to be a part of history. And
a lot of people are coming out of the woodwork people I never imagined.
It's almost turning into like a like like an Indiana Jones movie. It's very
cool. But I will say I really appreciate everyone that believes and supports in
this and if you want to be a part of that film, it just
keeps getting bigger and better, and it gives us more to do more that
we can have to make this into the most grand and incredible experience possible.
Excellent. So the stage of time dot com and then there's what you scroll
down, there's a donation, Yeah, there's a there's links you can contribute
and plenty of places for that like check it out. It's really I really
feel an honor. You'll see all the names on there, so if anyone
hasn't actually gone to look, I'm very diligent about putting those in. And
you'll see a lot of people I believe in the and put and it put
their some of their money and time into this. Excellent, excellent, all
right. I want to transition into this new book, The Epic of Humanity.
You co wrote it with Billy Carson. Yeah, and a great cover,
by the way, Thank you, thank you, Billy Carson. And
I I got to tell a little story, is that Billy came out to
visit me three and a half years ago, getting out four now out in
Maine where I nobody really knew me and I was starting out. I was
unknown and I didn't even have the I think I had just published The Stage
of Time or something like that before that, relatively recently, and Billy came
out and we were sitting on this beautiful ledge that sits over the ocean at
Portland Head Lighthouse. At anyone listening who's from Maine or in Hampshire, loveonill
that spot, beautiful spot. We're sitting there on the cliffs and I'm sitting
there with Billy, and we're we were there to do something for his network.
It wasn't even related to what I'm about to tell you at all.
We had no plan for that. Sitting there, We're having lunch, and
I'm like, Billy, we should write a book together. And I said,
we should write a book that's based on the epic of our entire story,
but lay it out with timelines, and would try to give evidence to
lay the whole thing, to create a complex timeline that helps the whole thing
unfold in a way where we can say, well, we're gonna place like
Shrupak. Here, what's the evidence that Shrupak actually existed at that time.
So the book is about our story and our struggles of almost being destroyed from
catastrophes and having the ancient stages then travel around the world and then create those
civilizations with that lost knowledge, which of course I feel like now derives back
to Lake Vond. But the book is a lot more than that, Cliff.
The idea was not just about telling our timeline and not just about telling
our story. It was something a lot greater in the purpose. And I
told Billy, I said, I said, you know, I put a
lot of ancient texts in my book The Stage of Time, my previous book,
and as I'm talking, you'll have a segment that's got a a segment
of excerpt from that text, and it's very powerful, and I have it
so you can, like, if you want to look up, if you
want to look up the outrahasis, you can go find where that is and
all that right, And I realized that perhaps that's the most important thing that
we've lost, is that if you want to go read the greatest teachings and
the greatest writings that have been left behind by mankind, how are you going
to know where to look? How are you gonna know on this internet full
of all this stuff and all these misdirections, like how are you gonna know
what to read? How you going to know what's important? And not that
we are the ones that are supposed to determine that, but so many other
people have already determined that long before me, on these amazing pieces of work
that are either the oldest things we have or are come from this time period,
that all can join together with these teachings and all these things, and
there's there's an enormous amount of them, whether it's Sumerian, Akkadian, Babylonian
tablets or or Egyptian texts like the Book the Dead, and others like Pyramid
texts to Gnostics texts and even Greek texts like the Timaeis and Critias and so
on. We have many, many others. We have Vadic texts and all
those others. But you realize that perhaps that's the most important thing all along,
is preserving the most important ancient teachings of all mankind and put them in
one place. And that is what we did with the Ethic of Humanity.
And we're prideful to say, and it did exceed the stage of time a
little bit, but I we're prideful to say that this has the most amount
of the ancient texts excerpts of any book in the world. And it'll give
people the opportunity to that wide variety of different things to then come back and
be like, have this totality of knowledge and understanding that then doesn't just come
from our words and trusting our words, but reading the actual words of the
ancients themselves. Yeah, it's got a lot of a great material. You
know, it's funny you just brought up Timeline and you feature a timeline of
your own creation that begins approximately two hundred thousand years ago. Yes, and
you get into the Anonachi and the fact that your belief is that we are
a hybrid civilization, we were actually planted here by a much earlier civilization,
and there's a lot of people that are beginning to talk about that but non
aliens. Though. I'm not a UFO alien guy, and I'm glad you
said that, because that's not I have a huge problem with the ancient alien.
I think they've destroyed the whole concept by basically anything that's not explainable was
ancient alien. I have a very different perspective around that, and I think
that's one of the reasons actually that a lot of powerful people and people interested
in this in a tangible academic way have come around me in this because we're
looking at this in more of a way of I think we haven't understood our
reality in the right way. The ancients have told us, all along with
it's ay gnostics, that this is really an illusion and that there's so much
more around us, and that perhaps what we are missing is understanding the multi
dimensional side that exists with us and any beings that are related to us in
a way that perhaps we haven't been looking closely enough about what are considered angels
and demons nearly enough right in the way of which that's been the influence all
along, and not this influence of a UFO with some green men coming down
to the landing and then creating us. Even though like that whole concept of
that whole concept doesn't make sense because when they show these ascended beings or these
beings that are related to us, they look exactly like us. Right,
So at one point we have to stop and be like, hmm, let's
look at this whole like gret alien narrative, and let's backtrack a little bit
and maybe look back at a different way to look at this. That's a
little bit more of really, If anything, Cliff, it only empowers us
in our role in importance in the universe in a way that's makes you feel
a lot more a part of something rather than being like, well, someone
randomly came here and they just wanted to play around with DNA, and hey,
poof, we came out of nothing. We came out of some like
Neanderthals like apes, and that's it. It's so much more complex than that
it's more of like a grand stage in the universe where we're playing out how
to exist in a physical body, but we are actually a multi dimensional consciousness
and these like ascended beings. But we get come back here and we're part
of this like grand stage of reality, like almost like a movie where we're
almost trying to find our way back. But it's part of this karmic system
where we have to live lifetimes of learning lessons and finding your way back to
where we began. It's actually quite beautiful, it really is. And I
think I think that if anything, we should be going outside and looking up
at the sun and just being like amazing that we have this existence. Thank
you, And that's really what it's about. The book has so many fun
dimensions. I want you to talk little bit about the clay cuneiforms, which
are featured in the very beginning. And one of the areas that just as
a complete disconnect for me, and it seems to be for academia, is
these Sumerian kings lists. And we also see it in Egypt too, and
the academic world uses it to identify known pharaohs. Yes, and here it's
the same thing with the Sumerian we know about really identical. It's like,
yeah, they're almost the same thing. Which is very interesting too, the
rains the reins of these like bloodline royals. But I want you to talk
a little bit about the fact that the Sumerians go back tens of thousands of
years, if not further it with some of these very very early kings,
and there's a disconnect with orthodoxy because it's like, well, wait a minute,
we can't have sophisticated cultures that go back ten fifteen to twenty one hundred
and fifty two hundred thousand years. What's the deal with that. I mean,
well, I accept it, but they don't. Well, the first
thing is having an anthropologist. Now we have to remember, let's look at
other anthropologists like Lloyd Pie They very distinctly found that the human brain doubled in
size two hundred thousand years ago. I'm not creating a two thousand year timeline
just because of the Sumerian king list. There's a lot of other factors in
place to create that timeline that is woven into that. The Sumerian king list
is just one of them, and that simply is the dynasties of the original
Sumerians those they're separated by a catastrophe that a new line of kings has to
take over the new world. It's very distinctly shown in the Legend of Atana.
If anybody would like to read the Legend of Atana, I wish I
had that on the read right now. I don't, but it's basically like
it goes into saying, well, there was a disaster on the earth.
Everything was destroyed, and then there was a new king that was chosen to
be the architect of the new world. It literally says that an architect of
the new world. His name was Aa, so it's called the Legend of
Atana, and he became the first king of Kish. Year was that Well,
that's the thing that we're trying to figure out is we have no idea
because we're told that that time period of Kish came from like four thousand years
ago in that Mesopotamian era but with the Syrian time. But what we're finding
is that no, no, no, no, no, hold on,
guys, let's look at Charupak. We found three distinct layers of civilizations there,
not one, meaning that if you were to look at a region like
Iraq, the Sumerians was like an ancient ancient legacy that had nothing to do
with the same language all of the Assyrians or Babylonians or Chaldaeans. Just because
they write in qneiform wedges does not mean it's the same language. I think
that. I don't think a lot of people know that. No, it's
important to understand because the Sumerians were like this mysterious ancient language. And I
want to use the paraphrase what Jen said. She said, you don't get
a fully cooked culture like the Sumerians out of nowhere. She said that,
and she's one hundred percent right. There's this like mysterio vious origins of the
Sumerians that they don't even state that they invented everything, because they literally invented
everything, and I mean like everything came from there. They invented writing,
the first writing, the first currency, agriculture, that building blocks of civilization,
laws and rules, metallurgy, astronomy, mathematics. You literally could go
on and on and on. It's almost like if you were to create a
civilization, you're like an angelic group of beings. You're like, Okay,
let's create a civilization here. What is necessary to do so well, we
will lower the divine laws and rules, and they actually had a name for
it. I haven't talked about this nearly enough, Cliff, and I'm glad
you brought this up. They call those set of rules that they lower like
the code of Hammurabi, where there's like moral laws and rules and how to
govern a society, the things needed to create a civilization. They called them
the mes m apostrophe s, the royal mes. They did and they discussed
how the mes, these these tablets would like the commandments like Moses. These
commandments would be on these tablets, and they would reside in a certain city.
Okay, they would reside in a certain city, and when they were
there in the royal library, these these like royal mes from the gods,
that city would be chosen to be the dominant city of the gods. And
it was Aridu for a long time, and eventually it moved over to uruk
Er and then eventually Shrupak and others. It moved and at one point it
talks about how Anana stole the meat from Aridu. Okay, it's wild.
Okay, you can go read what's called inky in the world order. You
find out that Anana was in charge of other civilizations in other parts of the
world, like maybe Iran, in parts of maybe Turkey and other areas.
But it's described how she stole it. She stole the me tablets and then
brought it to their patron city and they almost got in like a war over
it. It's really really fascinating. But the point I'm trying to make we
got down that long road is this was decided long ago. It was like
a blueprint for civilizations to then create them. But then the Sumerians were destroyed
by that catastrophe that flood, the First Deluge, and that's where the whole
Noah story with these bloodlined sons of like Vaughan comes from, because they were
then tasked with creating the new world. And but they but they had a
lot of tools that the Sumerians didn't have. They had the megalithic building style,
they had these teachings of ascension that were lowered at Ionis and others that
then passed around. And so what I see it as the story that makes
the most sense is that imagine three sons governed by divine gods. Anana became
Athena to the Greeks. She's right there. Imagine Enlil right there, who
became Halty is right there, and Ki's right there, and they're like these
like the they're like they're basically the eloheme of this count, deciding our fates.
And they say, Japath, Shem and Ham, you shall therefore go
about each part of the earth and create the new Golden Age. And Japith
is shown just in Christian. It's just like Christian Hebrew bloodlines. He's taking
over Europe. He's supposed to have Europe in Greece. And then you see
Shem is supposed to be in charge of Egypt, the Great Pyramids of Egypt,
which is exactly who John Taylor thinks in the eighteen hundreds built the Great
Pyramids of Egypt. The sons of Noah Shem. Really that is where these
This has led me down that rabbit hole. That has blown my mind because
I didn't have any evidence to support that until I found Cavistepi and these other
sites. But it was absolutely fascinating because I realized so then Cham the other
son was tasked with going through Iran in India Southeast Asia, and you're like,
whoa, so wait a minute, So this is supposed to go to
Europe with the ancient Greeks, and you find through to Timaeus and Critius that
during Atlantis there was a pro to Athenian civilization that rivaled Atlantis, one of
the greatest civilizations in Earth's history, that came out of Japithan Lake Vaughan in
Greece and to this day in Athens. If you go to Athens, Greece,
I would really like to add this to the film if we could,
is a possibility we might be able to. Let's see, okay, and
maybe or maybe just another trip. But if you go to Athens today to
prove this theory, there is a wall called the Picks Wall that is gigantic
megalithic wall, beautiful, beautiful, beautiful that it has the same indentations of
three levels on the stones as this teaching that comes from Lake Vaughan as well.
And I want to pull this up. I want to say very very
much thank you to the comment that someone left on my channel, because I'm
discovering things all the time, I'm learning things all the time. We don't
none of us all know everything. So this was pointed out to me that
in Greece there is the Greek equivalent of Noah is known as Dusa Lyon Italy
is the Greek equivalent of Noah in Greece, showing that the whole story connected
all through. And that's really where this has become wild, because you're you're
imagining, like, wait a minute, so Twinaku and pom pom Pu and
Bolivia the same symbols, same stonework, same cross. We're gonna take a
short commercial break and we will return with my guest today, Matt Lacroix,
discussing his latest book, The Epic of Humanity. I guess today Matt Lacroix
is coming to us from Colorado within the United States, and we're discussing his
latest book, The Epic of Humanity and his research in Turkey. That's what
I wanted to talk to you about because you actually show in this book Epic
of Humanity similar design features in Pumapuku and early Turkey and also perhaps construction.
Yeah, engineering that's very similar. It's literally it's not even similar. Clip
it's actually weird because let's take for a minute Leg Vaughan in eastern Turkey.
It's the largest Turkey lake in Turkey. It's over one thousand feet deep.
It's actually over fifteen hundred feet deep, incredibly deep. It's one of the
deepest lakes on Earth. And remember Easter Island, the Moai. There's this
obsession with a navel. Remember a navel into the earth. Okay. Meanwhile,
they're really bizarre thing because these are sun temples. By the way,
if anyone wants to know their solar sun temples, I honest is a sun
temple. Meanwhile, across the world, in South America, you have another
giant lake, high elevation lake that's over a thousand feet deep called Lake Kitty
Kaka. And both of those lakes are surrounded by volcanoes, like massive volcanoes,
and they all have basalt and andesite. In fact, the word andesite
comes from the word andes from South America. But they were building an aside
in Lake Vaughan. So it seems to me, Cliff, that the builders
of Lake Vaughan packed up graveled across the entire world to Lake Titi Kaka somehow
knowing everything about it, and then created almost a mirror of the exact same
civilization there that you're The khana symbol is from the step pyramid symbol from the
box relief of kef the the cross symbol is at is at Pumampunku, the
exact same cross, the same the same T shaped pillar that I'm calling the
ascension pillar that became the Gobekley pillar and Minorca pillar in Spain as well as
this this pillar we see in Puma Punku, but it's got other more jagged
edges to it. They added extra edges. I think it's a completion thing.
But then there's it's like goes on and on and on. It's like
they mimicked it, and then they created these civilizations to mimic around the world
and then taught all these things and then catastrophes came through and like wiped them
all out. Everything. He wiped them out. Like that's why Machu Pichu
I believe was originally built by the same group from Lake Vaughan, because if
you look at the descriptions of Haldy how he's shown in his descriptions, it's
identical to Ua Kosha, identical and it's not the same being as Kukocon and
Ketzaquata either, because they're feathered serpent beings that are about knowledge. I think
that's more like inky Thoth Viri Kosha seems to be like basically a direct mirror
of Haldy from Vaughan with these like lightning bolts and controlling being like a powerful,
powerful god that is also does end up passing a ton of wisdom and
knowledge. We have to look at this whole thing in a different light,
I think, going forward and understanding cycles and energy and things. But the
point I'm trying to make just before you jump in, is just to say,
like, this linkage is around the world, and it's profound. It's
profound, and that's why so many people are coming together to uncover this mystery.
Because it goes from Turkey to Saudi Arabia to India, to Egypt,
to South America to ball back Lebanon, to Greece, to Peru to Mexico.
It goes everywhere. Yeah, I think people are intuitively curious and they
are weeding about our history and going this, something's missing here, There's there's
missing links that we need to discuss. I want you to talk a little
bit about what you call the myth of Adappa. Sure, And the reason
I like this is because I am fascinated about the creation of homo sapien sapien
the various levels. And when you talk about Noah, we read about their
very amazing longevity three four, five, six, eight hundred years of age
or more sometimes, and these are unique beings that must have had a physiology
that was very hearty to last that long. So talk about that. I
think it's the idea of kind of merging these higher beings of us like like
us, but with a mortal being, and then you get kind of a
mix in between of a long longevity. But eventually, as that bloodline becomes
more diffused over time, our ages either either either somehow through manipulation. Because
it is weird, all of a sudden, we became kind of capped off
at one hundred and twenty. That is weird. I will say, there's
something odd there that needs to be looked at. But it's it's great that
you brought that up because it's important that you look at Let's look at the
Samarian king list, right. They say, this is what they say,
academics, Well, you're wrong about the age because you're you're wrong about the
number of what is considered the age of a shar shaar. A shar is
how they measure time in Sumer. They considered it in shar, so they
would be like, well, King Ubaratutu live for this many shars, and
then so academics are like, you guys, got that wrong. It's must
be like months, not years. It's impossible. There's a problem with that
though. There's another whole set of tablets called the Iraq List of Kings and
stages that came from a whole nother city called Iraq that has the same the
same kings, same thing mimicked from another time period another one. Then they
might not also know that there's another whole set of them as well from that
region called the Borocious King List. Borocious was the high priest of Marduk in
Babylon, not the New Babylon, the old Babylon. Babylon has an ancient
history too that's older than people think. Babylon was actually conquered and rebuilt in
a later time period as well. In the original Babylon, there were these
ancient lineages just like Sumer of these kings that really did rule that long.
And the evidence for that is just gore Genesis. It shows right in there,
Noah in there that was seven hundred years old. It's like we ignore
the Christian side too in the Hebrew side that literally mimic it. But okay,
like fine, you don't believe that. Let's add another whole one.
Let's add the Egyptian Turin King list from Egypt. Yes, okay, literally
identical. It shows these dynasties of pharaohs over time, and it shows Cufu's
group down the dynastic pharaohs. Later they're like a whole nother page. They're
like way down the list, right, but at the top is this like
original group like raw and all these others that are from completely different agents.
I mean, isn't Osyrus on that list and all these which they turned into
gods because they're so far back in antiquity. Well, I think it's I
think that the royal lineage of who was ruling was directly connected to them,
like there is a direct relation to that. But the Turing king list or
also knows the Egyptian king list mimics the same thing, mimics consumer mimics all
these texts with Well, it shows these enormous lineages of these ancient ancient Egyptian
rulers, and then the number gets less and less and lower in age till
it gets to the same ages that we are, and you're like, hmm,
it's kind of weird, right, how is that mimicking all around the
world? But yet, what does that mean? Well, it means means
that if that's true and the brain size jumped doubled in size two hundred thousand
years ago, and something happened with Homo sapient sapians, then and you add
up the entire Sumerian king list for rackalistic kings of sages, or the ferocious
king list or the Turing king list, and guess what you get? Two
hundred wisdom change two hundred thousand years ago. I know it's so you gotta
look at that. You can't ignore it. And that's why I put Sharu
Pak and error do in that timeline way up at the front. And then
if I was gonna add something to that which I need to now, I
would put Lake Vaughan and the error at Civilization. Probably would have to put
it something like I'm gonna get in trouble for this, but I probably would
have to put it at something like fifty thousand years ago. See, I'm
looking at the university professor listening to you is going like it doesn't make any
other sense. It didn't any other sense, like platistically wise, because for
instance, Edgar Casey, who I think was the only true channeler in the
world that I actually, like, really really respect in the way that he
did. He gave this age of fifty thousand years for Atlantis being created.
And also the Cuban geologist it Are All Day in Cuba, who is investigating
these underwater ruins off of Cuba that I did a whole episode with for Guy
Ancient Civilizations season five, he speculated that tectonic changes that could have led to
that being subducted would have had to have been fifty thousand years ago or so.
It's really interesting that these numbers keep coming up and correlating, because that's
why I said, I honest is at least twenty thousand years old, because
I think that that Lost Civilization chapter we're talking about, it ended at the
younger Dryas, didn't start there, ended there. That's when everything was destroyed
and repped. And so what I mean by that is like, well,
okay, so remember the date that Plato is given by Solon for when Atlantis
is destroyed is exactly the same date eleven six hundred years ago or eight in
that timeframe for when the Younger Rias shows this pulse water of massive events around
the Earth that flooded and subducted plates. It literally matches exactly. It means
that we can create a timeline. It means that lost civilizations all around the
Earth were systematically destroyed during the Younger Dryas. Okay, so that means that
they were destroyed at we'll call it twelve thousand years ago, but that means
that the whole lineage of when all of them existed was before that. That's
why I give this idea that, yeah, I think that was like this
fifty to potentially one hundred thousand year period of time that we created the most
magnificent structures on Earth and literally created a bond with Heaven on Earth with the
stars, and then forgot everything and forgot who we are. Yeah. I
have the same feeling that you do, that that there's the ancient civilizations not
only in Turkey, Egypt, but in the Americas and China and so forth.
Ye China Golden Age, and and there was something that wiped them out.
The big issue with Orthodoxy is that where's the evidence. I mean,
there's a famous story of Mark Lair and are talking to Robert Shaka, like
show me the potshards from I can give you the evidence, but I've already
come up with it. My feeling is that these buildings were there, they
were reused by the pharaohs and they put their cartoon sh on it. We
now know that Ramsey's the second was a example, yes, great example of
pyramids and making them his These guys had egos that were off the charts.
But make a few comments about that in terms of the antiquity and how we
identify these earlier places and how that fits into this book Epic of Humanity.
Well, we have evidence to We're having emerging edit evidence coming forward that is
supporting all of this in a way where let me provide that evidence. The
first is that when we study some of these structures in places around the world
that are showing that Telfale sign of not being from the culture that we're told
highly advanced, highly sophisticated, same types of things we see, we can
we can label them all and it's kind of map them out and I did.
I've done shows with Brian Forrester if you want to check it out,
where we literally discussed every single megalithic civilization around the world and try to like
categorize them all and catalog them all. Okay, that endeavor is something that
we need to go forward and take because it's becoming more apparent that that's not
that hard to identify. To be honest, if you know what you're looking
for, it's pretty obvious to see the difference. But having said that,
still, like, what's the evidence, Well, I want to give a
big piece of evidence or two big piece two big pieces of evidence. One
I'll say three. First, one is the stone that the hardness of the
stone, with the sophistication of what they've built and the and the tool marks
left behind show us that it wasn't bronze a tool and there was some kind
of tools they use to build them that we have no idea what it is.
That is like a foundation right now that we don't know what could have
made these scoop marks in Asthwan, We don't know what did that. We
don't know what made these saw marks in Abusir in Egypt, or these drill
holes in Peru and Bolivia that are perfect, literally perfect. We don't know.
If anybody wants to nerd out on one of those types of things,
go look at the altar at ianis that stone altar? Look right in the
bottom of the altar. Somehow they drilled these tiny holes to create like a
flower of life or sun symbol and the bottom. How could they have done
that? It's literally mind blowing to think that. But there's that, And
then we add on to that, these sites that we've now identified have extreme
vitrification and damage on them, spots where the rockets melted in a way where
it's non normal erosion. These indications that some extreme event heat event, all
water event like the sphinxing closure. That's what blew off of this whole thing
with Robert Bovall met up with a rubber shock and they said, that's not
wind erosion on the sphinx enclosure, proving that had been water. But it's
a desert. So when did it rain enough or flood enough to create that.
That's the kind of consensus we're getting at. But I want to add
the big one at the end that I don't feel like it's talked about nearly
enough. Cliff. I guess it's the sort of part of my brand to
talk about this, But when I've studied the most incredible megalithic aspects of these
civilizations. The most grand work they ever took on. Right, go from
Easter Island with the moai. Largest moai they ever created, never made it
out of the host rock, didn't have any cracks in it or anything.
So let's just separate that silly argument for a second. It never made it
out of the host rock. But not only is it the biggest, it
was three times larger than any existing moai on the island. Stay with me
here, unfinished left abandoned the quarry with several others as well, same like
they were about to take on something. This is the picture of the one
that's massive that's still not completely cut out of the quarry, like laying down.
Yeah they yeah, yeah. Now let's go to other places. Let's
go to say ballbeck Lebanon. Right, largest stones they ever created, over
twelve hundred, thirteen hundred and fourteen hundred tons, never made it out of
the quarry. They were being shaped and fitted and moved and they're literally still
sticking out of the ground like they're half out. And you're like, there's
another example. Let's go to Egypt. Got as one egypt largest obelisk ever
created by far by far was was being moved out of the rocks seven hundred
tons, and they were about to move it, and then they abandoned it.
And then and then archaeologists was like, no, no, no,
look there's a huge crack through the middle of it. That's why they abandoned
it. Or the fact that it's been fifty thousand years or whatever it was
since it was carved and earthquakes and events cracked it. So now add that
one I mean to be honest is zeb Tepi is thirty eight thousand years ago,
So that if you want to be honest, that's when I think Egypt
was first built. If we want to give dates, is that there's a
thing, there's a there's a place called Aindaro ain Dhara in Syria that gives
these ancient datings that kind of match with when we look at ancient Egypt with
Zebtepi on the wall for this thirty eight thousand year period. But anyway,
the point is, let's continue and let's go all the way around to China.
Now, let's go to the Yangshen Quarry in China, which what is
the single by far largest megalithic stone that was ever being moved everywhere in the
world. And I don't even mean by a little, by a lot.
The stone of the ancient quarry that was being moved, which we know is
non natural, has all the groove marks where they're cutting it. And then
there's other ones that are already fitted in place called stelez that that section,
that area, that stone, that giant yancient story, yancient quarry stone.
You see all the areas were about to be moved, all of them.
It's like very we could see it very clearly. They basically take these grooves
out underneath and they carve it out and they somehow like lift it out of
the host stone. However they did that, we've don't know. But in
all those examples of like the most supreme projects that these civilizations that all be
taken on, and I would argue perhaps it was all happening at the exact
same time right around the world. Is that when you see all these projects
that are of the most monumental scale possible, it means a couple of things.
One, it means that that civilization reached the height of its entire level
of sophistication. First thing, not not like weakening and disappearing. Two,
it means that the work that the work to stop happened suddenly and unexpected,
right. And three, it means that because they can never come back to
it, it means that they all died or like all were wiped out.
Those are the three ways to prove that theory of saying no, they had
actually reached the height of the Golden Age. And then the younger dryest events
were so extreme over a fifteen hundred year period, especially in the front in
the back end, which doesn't even include the older dryest That is a whole
other thing too, is another part of it too. But just imagine events
with tsunamis and massive volcanism and maybe cosmic impacts, but potentially a whole host
of things happening and literally causing that entire legacy of that group to be wiped
out. To all that was left, Cliff, were a few survivors in
sages and teachers from those civilizations that found all the indigenous groups around the world
that already knew how to survive because they lived in the indigenous like in basically
within nature, that then they had to teach them or they would discover the
remains, but had no idea how replicate it. Yeah, that's how I
see our history and our story. Yeah. I love that. Matt Lacroix,
we could speak for hours. We're really down to our final point here,
this new book, the Epic of Humanity. What do you want people
to get from the book and what's the what's the message? Because it's one
of many of your books, of course, this is co written with Billy.
It feels to me that it is funny because we're talking about this research
project in Turkey. It fits nicely with that. It does, it actually
doesn't, and you may not have intended that at all. My timeline doesn't
even need to change. I just need to add like they're as civilization into
it. I don't even need to anyway. The core is this humanity has
been governed for far too long to make us think that we're nothing and insignificant
in the universe. Whether or not it's through Darwinianism or just through any kind
of an academic mind or through the industrial age, various different reasons have come
into place that have very much engineered our mindsets to think that we're nothing and
they were part of an empty universe, and we're random, and that what
happens to us doesn't really matter, and that couldn't be further from the truth.
And really what the message in this book is the epic of humanity,
is for us to truly understand how epic our story is and who we truly
are, the struggles and strives that we've come through, these incredible epics that
that great descended masters have that barely survived and like taught other civilizations to carry
on. That story and message is so moving. It describes in the Entra
Haste as how when that first catastrophe is created to destroy the old world,
that the gods weeped at seeing humanity like destroyed, like they felt, they
felt like they'd made the biggest mistake they'd ever made. And it was this
moment where in time where we realized that we're obviously part of something great.
We're obviously part of something that's far more important than just the randomness of thinking
that we're not, that we're not a greater purpose than just the earth in
the universe. And I would like to leave people during this time of challenges
and time of transition into great ages, to remember to have that peace of
mind, to sit out in nature and stare up and realize that You're part
of the greatest story ever told, and you can be a hero in that
story whenever you want to be. But in the end, you're playing a
pivotal role no matter what in the progression of how that all unfolds. And
I feel greatly honored to be a part of the role that I'm playing to
help tell this story in the way that it was intended all along. M
I love that. Man. That's a great way to end our time together.
Give people contact information. You gave us the Stage of Time for this
documentary you're working on, but how can people learn more about you? Give
us your contact info? Check out my YouTube page at of course, Matthew
Lacroix, and the YouTube page the Stage of Time dot com. And we
will have an entirely new, massive social media campaign and branding run Ey Honest
Legacy. So who was listening to this, Get ready for new YouTube channel,
all new content for that. We're going to be creating this whole all
these discoveries and bring them all into another whole platform in addition to that the
ones that already exists. So get ready for just unbelievably exciting things. In
twenty twenty four, two Trips to Turkey, that other mystery country, Peru,
Bolivia, Egypt. I mean this, it's gonna be amazing. So
buckle up because this epic journey of doing all these incredible things and changing history
has truly just begun. Fantastic man, it's exciting to listen to you.
I love it when you are expressive, and this is all heartfelt material.
So congratulations and thank you. Thank you keeping up. Let us know and
we'll get you back on the program once you begin to expose some of these
findings to a larger audience. Thank you, Cliff. It's always a pleasure,
my friend. Let's let's connect again after I come back from Turkey.
Okay, definitely, thanks again, Matt, see you. Just before we
started, Matt was telling me that he will be posting the results of a
lot of their research and data analysis not only to his Facebook page, but
also to his website. And it gives me a great opportunity to have Gin
on his team because Jen and I communicate very closely on what she's considering good
stuff. And you know, it's funny. She as a trained archaeologist.
She goes by the book in terms of analysis, so that means you have
to get into very expensive research or labs, data labs where samples are taken
and they are you know, you're working with what they call clean rooms where
everything is sterle because you don't want to contaminate a sample, otherwise you won't
get an accurate date. And so I honestly don't know to what degree this
research is going to be done. When we talk about research, we can
also look to other parts of the world. You might remember our good friend
Marco Vigato. He works with INA, which is the Archaeological Community of Mexico,
and when he's doing his research on let's say, well Haaka Meetla,
that underground cavern and temple is being surveyed and scanned and they're using ground penetry
radar with the blessings and the cooperation of ENA. And this is really critical
because when you incorporate a local research organization that is validated through the country,
then you you can begin publishing your data with their blessing. And this is
where Jen really shines the brightest because she is a research archaeologist who has done
field work for ages and has spent a great deal of time in the Middle
East, and so it's going to be fun asking her and discovering what really
is the insight in the background and the revelations before it's published. And so
stay tuned for more information on Turkey because I think that we're going to get
some really really fun data on what is looking more and more like a very
very early civilization that goes back perhaps tens of thousands of years before the Sumerian.
So we'll have to see I mean, I have I mean I don't
want to get into the whole and Anaki thing because that is where we spin
off into another realm. But you know, when we have valid data,
we have evidence in temples, in buildings, in artifacts, then we can
say, okay, this is crystal clear and we have the evidence that we
need, so I can I expect to hear back from Matt and Jin and
other members of their team on this research. So I hope you enjoyed that.
That's exciting. That's exciting news, and I am always open to receiving
data from good research. So fun. Hey, if you are a fan
of Earth ancients, perhaps you might consider a vacation with us. We got
three tours coming up this year. We have Egypt April twenty eight through May
ninth. We have Turkey, first time in Turkey August fourteenth through the twenty
four and then we just announced we just posted Mexico. This is going to
be the Grand Yukatan Tour of all the pyramidal buildings and temples in Ukatan,
Mexico, November seventh through the eighteenth, and that is love. I haven't
been the Yukatan now in probably I want to say four years, it might
be actually five. But Yukatan is a wonderful place to see ruins, to
climb pyramids. It's really an adult playland. And we're gonna be connecting with
my old friend Mimo Gonzalez. I reference him to anybody who wants to see
Chichinitza because he works there. But I just heard that they have unveiled a
new portion of Ushmol, which is where the Pyramid of the Magician is and
Ushmol is magical, magical. So if you're interested in any of these sites,
go to Earthancients dot com, click on the tour button and you'll see
the itineraries for all three of those places. Now, this is probably the
last year we're gonna be able to hold our price down for Egypt, and
Egypt is magical. We not only go and see the major pyramids and the
Giza Plateau, we go to the Red and the Bent Pyramid privately without any
of the general public. And I've added a couple of new sites where we
get to see these monoliths, these monstrosities, fifty to seventy ton statues that
are not only beautifully carved, but it's really a question as to what the
tool to carve them from, granted was, we don't know because there's no
tooling marks. And there's greater speculation now about these because the Egyptians are allowing
outside scientific study and I'm waiting for some Germans research to come back that really
is shedding light into laser technology or some form of heat that can burn stone
as being the tools for carving these megalithic stones. Come out and join me.
We only take small people, small groups, twenty maybe thirty people.
We're about halfway full right now. We want to complete this so everyone can
have a blast. It is not to be missed. April twenty eighth,
May ninth from the Full light itinerary. Go to Earth Ancients dot com forward
slash tours on any of our tours. If you have any questions, send
me an email. Send it to Earth Ancients the number four of the letter
you at gmail dot com, and I'll get back to you. These are
not only wonderful experiences, they're very deeply spiritual. These are sacred places that
we go to. So we do a small meditative access point is called we
call it the intention work, so that you don't simply observe it visually,
you tap into it spiritually and physically, so that you get the full experience
that you'll never forget again. For more information, go to Earthagents dot com,
forward Slash Tours and check it out. All right, that's it for
this program. When I think my guest today Matt Lacroix, coming to us
from Colorado, USA, and as always, the team of Gail Tour,
Mark Foster and everyone who makes this thing happen. You guys rock, all
right, take care of be well, and we'll talk to you next time.
SHO show st