1 00:00:01,560 --> 00:00:06,879 You're listening to the Paranormal UK Radio Network and this is six Degrees of John 2 00:00:06,960 --> 00:00:45,840 Keel. Hello and welcome to the six Degrees of John Kiel podcast. I'm 3 00:00:45,880 --> 00:00:53,159 your host Barbara Fisher. Tonight I'm talking with Carly Lapham Latham Latham. See 4 00:00:53,920 --> 00:01:02,320 I told you i'm professional people, I really am Latham. And she goes 5 00:01:02,399 --> 00:01:07,200 by the village to row which on Instagram. She's a very interesting person. 6 00:01:07,400 --> 00:01:17,799 And we had just been talking about what's haunted houses or people or both, 7 00:01:17,879 --> 00:01:23,879 and so why don't you jump in with your haunted house story, my haunted 8 00:01:23,959 --> 00:01:27,760 house story. I am really excited for this because I just had a phone 9 00:01:27,760 --> 00:01:33,040 call with my realtor. The house in question is for sale at the moment. 10 00:01:33,319 --> 00:01:36,280 I'm not gonna say where, because if you buy that house, like, 11 00:01:36,840 --> 00:01:41,640 that's on you, buddy, you know, So that's that's not my 12 00:01:41,760 --> 00:01:47,159 problem anymore. But I would say that I am someone that has always been 13 00:01:47,799 --> 00:01:53,359 sensitive, but I lacked the information and the understanding of what was going on. 14 00:01:53,879 --> 00:02:00,519 So like I can look back at my life and pinpoint several several times 15 00:02:00,680 --> 00:02:06,000 when I felt like I wasn't alone, Like I had experiences that I couldn't 16 00:02:06,040 --> 00:02:13,759 explain but I was raised Mormon, so I was raised in a very black 17 00:02:13,800 --> 00:02:19,319 and white this is what's real, this is what's not religion, And as 18 00:02:19,360 --> 00:02:25,400 a result, when I had these experiences, I almost always would chalk them 19 00:02:25,479 --> 00:02:30,919 up to anxiety like that that it was the only way that I had to 20 00:02:30,000 --> 00:02:35,439 interpret what was going on. Is I would be alone in a room and 21 00:02:35,520 --> 00:02:40,280 be feeling watched and I had no explanation for it other than I must have 22 00:02:40,360 --> 00:02:46,000 watched too many horror movies. You know, Like I am an anxious person 23 00:02:46,120 --> 00:02:52,000 that runs in my family. So like that's that's logical, right, So 24 00:02:52,560 --> 00:02:59,879 fast forward to my adult years. I left the Mormon religion, which is 25 00:02:59,879 --> 00:03:04,759 a whole thing. Yeah a thing. It's a big thing. Yeah, 26 00:03:04,879 --> 00:03:07,000 it's a big thing. It was hard on my family, It was hard 27 00:03:07,080 --> 00:03:12,759 on a lot of the people that I was friends with. It's the reason 28 00:03:12,800 --> 00:03:16,719 that I'm not active on Facebook is because I have a Facebook account. But 29 00:03:16,840 --> 00:03:22,680 Facebook is where all of my Mormon people live, and so I just I 30 00:03:23,960 --> 00:03:28,879 know that strategically going on Facebook is good for me, but I avoid it 31 00:03:28,919 --> 00:03:32,319 at all costs. So it is fair, you know, Facebook is kind 32 00:03:32,319 --> 00:03:38,479 of an ick place anyways. So I left the Mormon religion. And within 33 00:03:40,879 --> 00:03:46,159 a couple of years, I moved to Florida. And I had lived in 34 00:03:46,240 --> 00:03:52,960 Texas essentially my whole life. So like we're talking born into this religion, 35 00:03:53,520 --> 00:03:58,520 left it, and then left my home state behind in a very short amount 36 00:03:58,520 --> 00:04:02,319 of time. Okay, So I got to Florida, and I am fully 37 00:04:02,360 --> 00:04:08,439 an atheist at this point. I don't believe in anything. If you know 38 00:04:08,520 --> 00:04:13,919 anything about Mormonism, it is that they teach that that is the one true 39 00:04:14,000 --> 00:04:17,480 church, and they actually will actively tell you if this isn't true, nothing 40 00:04:17,680 --> 00:04:24,439 is. So like I worked through that conditioning. I had that moment where 41 00:04:24,439 --> 00:04:28,879 I was like, this religion, this story that I've been told my entire 42 00:04:28,959 --> 00:04:33,560 life, there's no basis in reality. This isn't real. I don't have 43 00:04:33,839 --> 00:04:38,879 to stick with this, right And it was huge for me because I had 44 00:04:38,920 --> 00:04:46,319 always been very unhappy within Mormonism. I did not fit in like I'm here 45 00:04:46,360 --> 00:04:49,519 on this podcast. Do you think that I fit in with Mormonism? Like 46 00:04:53,120 --> 00:04:57,680 I didn't fit in there. I didn't really fit in super well with my 47 00:04:57,759 --> 00:05:01,720 family, like I've always been a little bit odd, you know. And 48 00:05:02,319 --> 00:05:11,560 so I'm moving into this house and almost immediately I started noticing strange things that 49 00:05:11,680 --> 00:05:15,959 like I felt my whole life, but they were really amplified in this house. 50 00:05:15,199 --> 00:05:20,439 Like one of the first nights that I was alone, which was very 51 00:05:20,480 --> 00:05:27,360 few and far between. I at the time, I was a military spouse. 52 00:05:28,240 --> 00:05:36,800 I my ex was working for SpaceX, and so like my entire existence 53 00:05:38,160 --> 00:05:45,279 was being a stay at home mom to my kids to be there while he 54 00:05:45,439 --> 00:05:50,120 was out taking care of business. Right, other military spouses and even SpaceX 55 00:05:50,160 --> 00:05:54,240 wives will say the same thing. There's not a lot of flexibility in our 56 00:05:54,319 --> 00:06:01,040 lives because we tend to just like revolve around what's happening with our spouses at 57 00:06:01,079 --> 00:06:05,399 the time. Right, So I didn't get a lot of time to myself. 58 00:06:05,480 --> 00:06:10,519 I was alone very rarely, and so in the house in Florida, 59 00:06:10,639 --> 00:06:15,319 I started having these moments where I was alone for the first time and I 60 00:06:15,480 --> 00:06:21,959 was getting really it wasn't even like jumpy. It was more like it was 61 00:06:23,000 --> 00:06:26,399 almost like when you're watching a horror movie and the main character knows that she's 62 00:06:26,439 --> 00:06:30,079 being watched and is like looking around and there's like there's a bad guy lurking 63 00:06:30,120 --> 00:06:33,240 around the corner. Right. It's that type of feeling, except that I 64 00:06:33,360 --> 00:06:38,079 really was alone and so I'd be looking around my house and being like, 65 00:06:38,720 --> 00:06:43,800 I don't understand what the problem is. But it was intensified to a degree 66 00:06:43,839 --> 00:06:47,560 that I had never felt before. So it even got to the point where 67 00:06:47,879 --> 00:06:53,240 I was afraid to be in the main house by myself. So if I 68 00:06:53,319 --> 00:06:59,360 was alone, which again, I live to be alone. I love I 69 00:06:59,480 --> 00:07:03,759 love my and I love I love when the house is to myself, like 70 00:07:03,839 --> 00:07:08,759 I thrive in alone time. I don't like. I don't like it when 71 00:07:08,800 --> 00:07:12,720 my house is too loud or too crowded or too busy, which is hilarious 72 00:07:12,759 --> 00:07:15,120 because I homeschool my kids, so it's always all of the above, right, 73 00:07:16,720 --> 00:07:21,519 But I would go into my bedroom and I was scared to the degree 74 00:07:21,560 --> 00:07:26,720 that I was locking myself in my bedroom and just like kind of hanging out 75 00:07:26,800 --> 00:07:30,279 there and watching TV in bed until my kids would come home. Right, 76 00:07:31,600 --> 00:07:36,879 So this is happening. And then meanwhile I meet these new friends in the 77 00:07:36,920 --> 00:07:43,439 neighborhood I had joined. I homeschool my kids, so before we moved to 78 00:07:43,439 --> 00:07:46,079 Florida, I did a lot of research on homeschool groups, on trying to 79 00:07:46,120 --> 00:07:50,920 find ways for us to get involved in the community so it wouldn't be as 80 00:07:51,000 --> 00:07:56,040 hard of a transition as you know, it's a pretty big move. So 81 00:07:57,439 --> 00:08:03,319 I met these women and they started talking about birth charts and things that I 82 00:08:03,480 --> 00:08:07,959 was like, Okay, I like, I'm a little bit familiar, but 83 00:08:07,000 --> 00:08:11,399 I also don't know because keep in mind, I'm an ex Mormon. Mormons 84 00:08:11,399 --> 00:08:16,680 don't talk about any of those things ever. Ever X Mormon atheist at this 85 00:08:16,800 --> 00:08:24,199 point, Okay, So I am forever fucking gout my feet, like it 86 00:08:24,319 --> 00:08:28,000 is just a rite of passage. I will injure my feet in the most 87 00:08:28,079 --> 00:08:33,480 bizarre and ridiculous manners ever. Ever, Like, I don't have a single 88 00:08:33,600 --> 00:08:39,840 story that I like that's that makes sense. No, it's the dumbest stories 89 00:08:39,320 --> 00:08:43,000 that lead me to injuring my feet. So this particular day, I'm walking 90 00:08:43,080 --> 00:08:48,440 up the stairs and I stubbed my big toe and that's ridiculous. But I 91 00:08:48,440 --> 00:08:52,360 remember at the time being like, oh, you know, and then just 92 00:08:52,440 --> 00:08:56,320 going about my day. I took the kids swimming, we went for a 93 00:08:56,360 --> 00:08:58,759 walk around the neighborhood with our new friends. We're doing this, We're doing 94 00:08:58,799 --> 00:09:05,200 that. I put the kids to bed, I at my My ex at 95 00:09:05,200 --> 00:09:11,639 the time was working night shifts, so he was gone, so I like 96 00:09:11,720 --> 00:09:16,600 tucked the kids in and I am laying in bed, and my foot starts 97 00:09:16,600 --> 00:09:20,519 to hurt so bad, Like it's just getting worse and worse and worse. 98 00:09:20,519 --> 00:09:24,840 And the longer that I sit there, the worse the pain is becoming. 99 00:09:24,879 --> 00:09:28,600 And I'm like, I you know this is this is ridiculous. I my 100 00:09:28,799 --> 00:09:31,679 fucking clumsy ass, right So I'm like, okay, I'm gonna get up. 101 00:09:31,679 --> 00:09:35,840 I'm gonna get some ibuprofen. My bedroom was on the second story, 102 00:09:35,840 --> 00:09:39,919 so I opened the door to my bedroom and there was like a little hallway 103 00:09:41,240 --> 00:09:45,120 and a landing area. So I take a few steps down the hallway. 104 00:09:45,240 --> 00:09:48,639 I'm almost to the landing area, and I just get hit by this wall 105 00:09:48,759 --> 00:09:54,440 of fear. So I stood there and I was like, I don't know 106 00:09:54,440 --> 00:10:01,480 how to process what I'm feeling right now, because I was I was aware 107 00:10:01,519 --> 00:10:05,759 that I was more afraid than the situation warranted, because I'm like looking around 108 00:10:05,799 --> 00:10:09,960 and I'm like, I'm alone. I'm alone right now. I put my 109 00:10:09,080 --> 00:10:15,279 children to bed, like they are in their bedrooms. There is no reason 110 00:10:15,600 --> 00:10:20,080 for me to feel this afraid. And so I tried to take another step, 111 00:10:20,159 --> 00:10:24,679 and the fear just intensified to the level that I was like, I 112 00:10:26,519 --> 00:10:28,960 don't know what to do here. So I went back into my bedroom and 113 00:10:30,000 --> 00:10:33,759 I was like, I guess I'm just gonna wait this out, like, 114 00:10:33,600 --> 00:10:37,159 you know, what do you even do here? So, like that night 115 00:10:37,200 --> 00:10:43,320 was dramatic. And then the next day I had mentioned this to my new 116 00:10:43,320 --> 00:10:48,360 friends because it just was such a bewildering experience for me that like I didn't 117 00:10:48,399 --> 00:10:54,480 have any way to logically explain what had happened to me, Like, yes, 118 00:10:54,840 --> 00:10:58,519 I am prone to anxiety. I've always been prone to anxiety, but 119 00:10:58,720 --> 00:11:03,799 I've never had had that experience where I was rooted to the spot petrified for 120 00:11:05,519 --> 00:11:11,919 seemingly no reason. Right, So you had none of the anxiety thought loops, 121 00:11:13,480 --> 00:11:16,039 none of the anxiety thought loops. Right, Oh, that I'm so 122 00:11:16,120 --> 00:11:18,840 glad you about that doesn't feel right. It didn't feel right, but there 123 00:11:18,879 --> 00:11:24,799 also wasn't a reason for it to feel wrong. Like, you know, 124 00:11:24,879 --> 00:11:28,399 I do have anxiety thought loops when I'm alone, but they always take a 125 00:11:28,519 --> 00:11:33,960 very specific pattern, Like I could tell you exactly what I worry about when 126 00:11:33,960 --> 00:11:37,720 I'm alone, and that night, none of those things were happening. It 127 00:11:37,919 --> 00:11:43,320 just was my foot hurt so bad, and I was like looking at my 128 00:11:43,440 --> 00:11:50,200 empty house and being like I don't understand, like what is happening to me 129 00:11:50,480 --> 00:11:56,039 because there is no reason to feel this way, and like there were no 130 00:11:56,159 --> 00:12:00,919 traumad other than the move, which you could count as traumatic, but like 131 00:12:01,279 --> 00:12:03,799 it really wasn't that bad, you know what I mean, Like, yeah, 132 00:12:03,240 --> 00:12:07,639 it was sad, it was really hard to leave my home, it 133 00:12:07,720 --> 00:12:11,960 was hard to leave my friends, but it wasn't like a traumatic move. 134 00:12:11,159 --> 00:12:18,440 So I mentioned it to my friends and they started encouraging me to have a 135 00:12:18,480 --> 00:12:22,399 psychic that they know come to my house and clear it. And it was 136 00:12:22,480 --> 00:12:28,159 really resistant to the idea for a little while because I was like I don't 137 00:12:28,159 --> 00:12:35,279 believe in that. That's perfectly logical, you know, yeah, yeah yeah. 138 00:12:35,320 --> 00:12:37,639 So I was like, I don't know, that seems like a stretch, 139 00:12:37,879 --> 00:12:43,799 Like I've always been anxious, Like I'm sure, I'm sure that there's 140 00:12:43,840 --> 00:12:50,039 some explanation. But one one of like another night, I was laying in 141 00:12:50,080 --> 00:12:54,919 my bed and I was like, what if what if my kids experienced something 142 00:12:54,080 --> 00:12:58,279 like that? And I was like, you know, I don't know what 143 00:12:58,440 --> 00:13:03,879 happened to me. I don't I can't explain why I felt this level of 144 00:13:03,919 --> 00:13:07,919 fear, but I am an adult. What if my kids had that same 145 00:13:09,000 --> 00:13:15,000 experience? And then I was like, okay, that was hard for me. 146 00:13:15,799 --> 00:13:18,919 I'm in my thirties. I'm thirty five now, so I probably was 147 00:13:18,039 --> 00:13:22,559 like I don't know earlier thirties, right, Like, if it made that 148 00:13:22,679 --> 00:13:26,919 level of an impact on me, what would it do to my kids? 149 00:13:26,440 --> 00:13:33,440 So that was the motivating factor to call this woman to my house, and 150 00:13:33,600 --> 00:13:37,519 that alone was an entire experience because she came over and she's blessing my house 151 00:13:37,559 --> 00:13:43,000 with holy water, She's calling archangel Michael, like she's saying these prayers, 152 00:13:43,120 --> 00:13:48,559 these rights that I am not familiar with because I was raised Mormon, and 153 00:13:48,559 --> 00:13:52,480 Mormons don't have the archangels, they don't have holy water, they don't do 154 00:13:52,639 --> 00:13:56,080 they don't even really talk about ghosts. So like all of this, and 155 00:13:56,120 --> 00:14:01,200 I'm just following her through my house and my eyes are like wide as fucking 156 00:14:01,279 --> 00:14:09,159 saucers. I'm like, okay, okay. But then she sat down with 157 00:14:09,200 --> 00:14:11,159 me in my living room and she was like, I would love to do 158 00:14:11,200 --> 00:14:16,399 a reading with you, and she pulled out some oracle cards, and mind 159 00:14:16,440 --> 00:14:22,159 you, by this point, it's been like maybe a month and a half. 160 00:14:22,840 --> 00:14:26,080 It hasn't been a whole lot of time in Florida, So the friends 161 00:14:26,279 --> 00:14:31,519 who referred this woman don't know all that much about me. And I say 162 00:14:31,559 --> 00:14:37,320 that because like, i am like open to a degree, but I'm also 163 00:14:37,720 --> 00:14:43,200 very hard to get to know. I am very I'm like a weird mixture 164 00:14:43,200 --> 00:14:46,960 of open and closed off. Like you're gonna have a few good conversations with 165 00:14:48,000 --> 00:14:50,200 me and then it's just gonna be like, what happened. That's weird. 166 00:14:50,399 --> 00:14:54,639 And I'm like, I know, sorry, Like I don't know what to 167 00:14:54,639 --> 00:14:58,279 tell you about that, but so and I say that not as like a 168 00:14:58,600 --> 00:15:03,080 cautionary tale, but to say that this woman sat down in front of me 169 00:15:03,799 --> 00:15:09,120 and told me things about myself that like I hadn't even told some of my 170 00:15:09,279 --> 00:15:16,240 very closest friends. There was literally no way that she could have known these 171 00:15:16,240 --> 00:15:20,720 things about me. She was telling me deeply personal details about my thoughts and 172 00:15:20,759 --> 00:15:26,720 my feelings, and I was like, what the fuck. Yeah, I'm 173 00:15:26,759 --> 00:15:31,879 sorry, I've had that happen with with psychics, ye readers, And it's 174 00:15:31,919 --> 00:15:37,600 just like but I wait, wait, how did how how did you know 175 00:15:37,639 --> 00:15:41,279 that about me? Though? You know, like like yeah, I'm still 176 00:15:41,320 --> 00:15:46,240 stuck on. I barely admit this to myself. How do you like what? 177 00:15:48,679 --> 00:15:52,399 You know? It was that level of So she stopped mid reading and 178 00:15:52,480 --> 00:15:56,159 she reached into her bag and she handed me a deck of her own cards 179 00:15:56,240 --> 00:15:58,879 and was like, they're telling me that you're going to need these. These 180 00:15:58,919 --> 00:16:02,759 are going to be important for you, right. And it's like a movie 181 00:16:02,879 --> 00:16:04,240 moment when I say it like that, but like if you were there, 182 00:16:04,320 --> 00:16:07,639 in reality, it was like awkward as shit, because if people get be 183 00:16:07,720 --> 00:16:11,519 presents, I don't know what to do with them, and so I'm just 184 00:16:11,679 --> 00:16:15,679 like, thank you. It's awkward. It's awkward. You know, it's 185 00:16:15,720 --> 00:16:19,440 awkward, especially if it's a stranger. Then it's like one hundred times off. 186 00:16:19,799 --> 00:16:26,360 Yeah, a stranger who's just told you about very very detailed, very 187 00:16:26,480 --> 00:16:30,799 personal details about your life. Right, And then she's just like, here 188 00:16:30,879 --> 00:16:32,879 you go, you're gonna need these. I'm like, what the fuck? 189 00:16:33,120 --> 00:16:34,960 Like what do I even do with these? I don't know what these are. 190 00:16:36,360 --> 00:16:41,159 It was a deck of angel cards by Dorian Virtue. I don't have 191 00:16:41,200 --> 00:16:44,279 them anymore because I gave them to a friend. I don't know if you 192 00:16:44,279 --> 00:16:48,440 can tell this about me, but I'm not super religious. I use them 193 00:16:48,440 --> 00:16:51,200 for a really long time, and then I passed them on to one of 194 00:16:51,200 --> 00:16:56,080 my best friends because they seemed better suited for her. But either way, 195 00:16:56,360 --> 00:17:00,039 it was a big It was a big turning moment for me. So now 196 00:17:00,039 --> 00:17:04,000 I had these cards and I was like, awesome, I don't know how 197 00:17:04,039 --> 00:17:08,960 to use these, and so like it really wasn't like like I wasn't getting 198 00:17:10,039 --> 00:17:12,359 like instruction or anything. I just was like, Okay, well, I'm 199 00:17:12,400 --> 00:17:18,119 gonna shuffle these cards and I'm gonna pull one and I'm gonna see what happens. 200 00:17:18,240 --> 00:17:21,279 And then every time I was pulling them, I had a little journal 201 00:17:21,319 --> 00:17:23,799 and I was writing on the card and what the guide book said and how 202 00:17:23,839 --> 00:17:27,599 I thought it fit into my life. And I kind of taught myself how 203 00:17:27,640 --> 00:17:36,559 to read like that, which then opened the door for mediumship and more hauntings, 204 00:17:37,079 --> 00:17:45,599 because yes, because they they all go together. But my like looking 205 00:17:45,640 --> 00:17:48,400 back on it now, like from wearing sitting out, I don't live in 206 00:17:48,400 --> 00:17:52,839 Florida anymore, but I can look back at that time period of my life 207 00:17:52,880 --> 00:17:55,680 and be like, yeah, all of these things needed to happen for me 208 00:17:55,839 --> 00:18:02,519 to be in that exact moment ready to understand and to receive the information that 209 00:18:02,559 --> 00:18:07,759 I was going to be given because if that same experience had happened in my 210 00:18:07,839 --> 00:18:11,079 house in Texas, even as an ex Mormon, I would have been a 211 00:18:11,119 --> 00:18:15,480 fresh ex Mormon and been like, no, sorry, I don't believe in 212 00:18:15,519 --> 00:18:19,319 that. That's just like a weird it's a weird coincidence. And now I 213 00:18:19,359 --> 00:18:26,680 believe in all sorts of crazy shits. It's like just like the rest of 214 00:18:26,759 --> 00:18:29,519 me. I know, I know. I like to say I'm a skeptical 215 00:18:29,599 --> 00:18:34,480 believer. Now I'm like Molder and Scully combined because I go to the logical 216 00:18:34,559 --> 00:18:38,920 side first, and if I can't disprove it, then I move into the 217 00:18:40,160 --> 00:18:45,480 okay, what could it be? Area? But yeah, that house was. 218 00:18:47,000 --> 00:18:51,079 It's the ongoing debate is it the person or is it the house? 219 00:18:51,759 --> 00:18:55,960 And in my case, I think it's both. I think I've always been 220 00:18:56,119 --> 00:19:00,759 a little bit more aware, a little bit more attuned. I think I 221 00:19:00,880 --> 00:19:04,440 think I can't tell you for sure, but I think that when I was 222 00:19:04,480 --> 00:19:10,160 little, I saw something that scared me enough that I've like shut down that 223 00:19:10,359 --> 00:19:15,880 part of my senses because I don't see. Occasionally I hear, but very 224 00:19:15,960 --> 00:19:21,200 rarely, so like I have a very limited skill set with which I can 225 00:19:21,240 --> 00:19:25,680 communicate with the other side, and that works for me, you know, 226 00:19:26,039 --> 00:19:29,960 I'm not, so it makes it a little bit more frustrating sometimes if I'm 227 00:19:30,000 --> 00:19:33,319 trying to figure something out and it's like, you know, you're talking to 228 00:19:33,359 --> 00:19:37,200 someone shouting at you while your eyes are closed and ears are plugged. But 229 00:19:38,640 --> 00:19:44,319 it's still it's still satisfying in a way. But like I can, I 230 00:19:44,400 --> 00:19:48,480 can look back at my life and be like, was this were you really 231 00:19:48,519 --> 00:19:53,359 afraid? Or was that potentially a ghost interacting with you and you perceived it 232 00:19:53,559 --> 00:19:59,480 as fear because there's no way to explain why, because if you can't see 233 00:19:59,480 --> 00:20:03,119 and you can't here, and you only feel someone in your space, it's 234 00:20:03,200 --> 00:20:07,039 like jarring, you know, mm hmmm, and there's clearly no one and 235 00:20:07,039 --> 00:20:11,000 there's clearly no one else, right, That's yeah, it's it's a huge 236 00:20:11,039 --> 00:20:18,319 one. Yeah, yeah, it's it's uncomfortable. So yeah, it's I 237 00:20:18,359 --> 00:20:22,720 think I've always been predisposed, But once I moved into the house in Florida 238 00:20:22,839 --> 00:20:26,640 and I kind of had that jolt of like waking up and being like, 239 00:20:29,640 --> 00:20:33,440 Okay, so Mormonism is not real, but apparently ghosts are a thing, 240 00:20:33,759 --> 00:20:37,400 and like working through all that and opening my mind and kind of stepping into 241 00:20:37,440 --> 00:20:42,160 the person that I always was, or I was always meant to be in 242 00:20:42,200 --> 00:20:48,720 like a weird way, but like all kind of figuring it out as I 243 00:20:48,759 --> 00:20:52,839 go. Right. So, the next thing that happened is I broke my 244 00:20:52,880 --> 00:20:59,960 foot. So again too, we got two foot stories in the same sitting. 245 00:21:00,680 --> 00:21:03,759 My origin story involves a lot of feet, which is uncomfortable for all 246 00:21:03,799 --> 00:21:10,720 of us. No, but I one of my kids dropped it. Seriously, 247 00:21:10,759 --> 00:21:12,759 was like a nickel size amount of milk, and I walked past it, 248 00:21:12,799 --> 00:21:15,400 and I was like, I should wipe up that milk. And then 249 00:21:15,440 --> 00:21:19,640 I got busy doing mom things and you skid it on it. That's exactly 250 00:21:19,640 --> 00:21:25,440 what happened. I skid on it. I I fractured the bones on the 251 00:21:25,440 --> 00:21:27,039 top of my foot, and I broke our arts. I didn't break, 252 00:21:27,079 --> 00:21:32,200 I tore the muscles and the ligaments. Apparently. It was very close to 253 00:21:32,440 --> 00:21:37,480 like being one of those foot injuries that like you're fucked, you know. 254 00:21:37,000 --> 00:21:41,200 It was like you're just gonna be like that forever. Yeah, there was 255 00:21:41,240 --> 00:21:44,319 an actual name for it. I can't remember what it was called anymore, 256 00:21:44,359 --> 00:21:49,799 but I my doctor always gave me this pain scale question based on pennies, 257 00:21:49,920 --> 00:21:53,599 and I just like every time I went there, I forgot everything that he 258 00:21:53,680 --> 00:21:56,559 told me, because he was always like, since the last time you were 259 00:21:56,599 --> 00:22:00,480 here, on a scale from one two hundred penn how many pennies do you 260 00:22:00,559 --> 00:22:04,480 have left? And I was like, I'm bad at answering one to ten 261 00:22:04,559 --> 00:22:10,119 pages word problem, you know what, Like yeah, like look at me. 262 00:22:10,279 --> 00:22:15,559 I'm not made for math. I'm not a math person. And I 263 00:22:15,599 --> 00:22:18,279 would try to describe what I was feeling, and he was like, no, 264 00:22:18,400 --> 00:22:22,440 just to answer the questions, like but I don't understand this. I 265 00:22:22,480 --> 00:22:25,680 don't know what you want from me. But so I broke my foot. 266 00:22:25,720 --> 00:22:29,640 I spent several weeks in a cast. I it was right before Halloween, 267 00:22:30,960 --> 00:22:36,400 and so I started watching ghost hunting shows naturally, and that's what you do 268 00:22:36,440 --> 00:22:38,680 when exactly that's what you do when you break your foot right before Halloween, 269 00:22:38,799 --> 00:22:42,079 right like I couldn't. It was also during COVID, so this is twenty 270 00:22:42,119 --> 00:22:47,599 twenty. I my foots my foot's in a boot, my right foot, 271 00:22:47,720 --> 00:22:51,920 and so you can't drive when your right foot's in a boost, Like there 272 00:22:52,079 --> 00:22:56,119 just is nothing to do. So I start watching these ghost hunting shows, 273 00:22:56,119 --> 00:22:59,319 and I was like, why is this explaining my life to me? Like 274 00:22:59,359 --> 00:23:06,680 the more watching, the more stories I'm hearing and people describing feeling entities around 275 00:23:06,720 --> 00:23:11,400 them, I'm like, what the fuck? Like I was sorry what it 276 00:23:11,440 --> 00:23:15,519 was? I'm like, is that are you explaining my life to me right 277 00:23:15,559 --> 00:23:18,440 now? Like what is even happening? So I like it was the first 278 00:23:18,440 --> 00:23:23,680 moment where like I had a psychic come to my house, Like I understand 279 00:23:23,680 --> 00:23:26,880 how this. So I had a psychic come to my house to clear it 280 00:23:26,920 --> 00:23:30,279 because it was haunted as shit. And then I'm still like in this moment 281 00:23:30,319 --> 00:23:37,839 of like wait a second, what And so've I've learned to read cards by 282 00:23:37,880 --> 00:23:45,480 now I'm reading tarot and oracle like fairly confidently. And I saw a paranormal 283 00:23:45,519 --> 00:23:49,839 investigator out in Florida post on Instagram like I'm going to do this investigation. 284 00:23:51,640 --> 00:23:55,759 Here is this taro spread if anybody wants to pull any cards ahead of my 285 00:23:55,839 --> 00:24:00,400 investigation, like here it is, you know, here it is. See 286 00:24:00,400 --> 00:24:03,279 what you get? And so I was like, well, what else do 287 00:24:03,319 --> 00:24:06,960 I have to do right now? My foot's broken, you know, and 288 00:24:07,000 --> 00:24:11,319 I have a I have a deck that's one of my favorites to use for 289 00:24:11,640 --> 00:24:17,359 mediumship. It's called art History Tarot for Past lives. It's a deck specifically 290 00:24:17,599 --> 00:24:22,000 made to help you tune into your past lives, but it works very well 291 00:24:22,039 --> 00:24:26,880 for mediumship. So I had that deck and I was like, sure, 292 00:24:27,079 --> 00:24:32,400 I'm going to give it a go. So I followed the prompts and I 293 00:24:33,559 --> 00:24:37,480 wrote it up and later I heard back from him and he was like, 294 00:24:37,519 --> 00:24:41,160 that actually was you know? That was there was some accuracy there, and 295 00:24:41,200 --> 00:24:45,599 I was like, sweet, this is something I didn't know that I could 296 00:24:45,599 --> 00:24:51,000 do, but now I know this, and it ended up being a really 297 00:24:51,000 --> 00:24:56,720 great relationship. I met that person. It's Eric ghost Hunter. South ghost 298 00:24:56,759 --> 00:25:00,839 Hunter of South Florida. Was a part of a or is a part of 299 00:25:00,839 --> 00:25:03,960 a paranormal team or party paranormal, so I got to know a lot of 300 00:25:03,960 --> 00:25:08,279 them. I pulled from them ahead of pulled for them, ahead of some 301 00:25:08,359 --> 00:25:12,559 other investigations, and I went out into the field with them a lot and 302 00:25:12,599 --> 00:25:18,440 I would pull cards while they were using their devices. And that's probably my 303 00:25:18,519 --> 00:25:23,000 favorite thing still to this day, because like, I miss doing that a 304 00:25:23,039 --> 00:25:30,000 lot because it really is cool to sit there and most of the time if 305 00:25:30,079 --> 00:25:36,680 I am pulling cards for a haunting, I will, almost to an obnoxious 306 00:25:36,680 --> 00:25:41,400 degree, say I'm not sure about this. But and I do that not 307 00:25:41,640 --> 00:25:48,279 because I doubt myself, but because the logical part of my brain will not 308 00:25:48,519 --> 00:25:56,039 shut itself off until I have given myself permission to say, to process, 309 00:25:56,359 --> 00:25:59,920 to verbally process this information that I have no way of knowing. Right. 310 00:26:00,119 --> 00:26:03,720 So, like, if you're with me on an investigation, I will say, 311 00:26:03,000 --> 00:26:07,240 I will tell you what the cards mean, and then I will say, 312 00:26:07,279 --> 00:26:10,160 I'm not sure about this, but this is what I think. And 313 00:26:10,839 --> 00:26:14,319 you know, occasionally it rubs people the wrong way, which is why I 314 00:26:14,359 --> 00:26:18,119 now give my disclaimer that I'm like. It's not that I think I'm like 315 00:26:18,839 --> 00:26:22,160 making it up. It's just I'm hardwired for that black and white thinking. 316 00:26:22,440 --> 00:26:27,799 I'm not the gray area doesn't come easily to me. So if I'm stepping 317 00:26:27,880 --> 00:26:33,039 into the gray area willingly, I have to give myself that caveat that I 318 00:26:33,079 --> 00:26:40,599 could be wrong, right, But but it was and still is really rewarding. 319 00:26:40,880 --> 00:26:45,079 When I am sitting there like sprawled in the fucking dirt sometimes, or 320 00:26:45,240 --> 00:26:48,440 like I'm usually on the floor. I almost never sat at the table. 321 00:26:48,519 --> 00:26:52,000 Why, I don't know, I'm just on the floor. I have cards 322 00:26:52,039 --> 00:26:57,440 everywhere, and I'm spouting what could be nonsense, like I could be pulling 323 00:26:57,480 --> 00:27:02,920 stories out of my ass. I tell them what I think that my cards 324 00:27:02,920 --> 00:27:06,680 are saying, and then they play back the EVP recorders and there's some sort 325 00:27:06,720 --> 00:27:10,839 of confirmation for the words that I've just said. And that's the moment that 326 00:27:10,920 --> 00:27:22,559 I'm like this though this, Yeah, I love this. Yeah. I 327 00:27:22,640 --> 00:27:27,079 like the idea that you're sprawling on the floor too. I still read sprawled, 328 00:27:27,480 --> 00:27:30,720 so you know, that's that's how I've been doing my research for my 329 00:27:30,759 --> 00:27:36,720 book. I'm sprawled sprawld me. So yeah, I feel like if you 330 00:27:36,960 --> 00:27:41,640 are a neurodivergent person or just like any kind of cool person, you're gonna 331 00:27:41,640 --> 00:27:47,599 sprawl yourself on the floor because things make more sense on the floor. Yes. 332 00:27:48,119 --> 00:27:51,240 Plus it's easier for the cats and dogs. Hell, easier for the 333 00:27:51,240 --> 00:27:55,640 cats. For the dogs. You can make little piles all around yourself like 334 00:27:55,680 --> 00:28:00,960 a fortress of information. Yep, yep, yes, yeah, this book, 335 00:28:02,000 --> 00:28:04,559 that book, the other book, the notes, things, the notepads, 336 00:28:04,640 --> 00:28:08,359 Hey give me my pen backs. That's usually a cat or a dog 337 00:28:08,960 --> 00:28:15,000 exactly, a dog who likes to eat highlighters. You know it's wild. 338 00:28:15,319 --> 00:28:22,680 Yeah yeah, so you so you went on these these uh ghost investigations, 339 00:28:23,200 --> 00:28:33,920 and you were finding out information from those areas, from the from the houses. 340 00:28:34,359 --> 00:28:38,640 Yep. So I was getting information from the houses. And I feel 341 00:28:38,640 --> 00:28:42,720 like every investigation that I went on, or every opportunity that I had to 342 00:28:42,799 --> 00:28:51,039 pull kind of just helped me refine this skill set. And what ended up 343 00:28:51,079 --> 00:28:57,480 happening is that when things would happen in my own house, which did start 344 00:28:57,519 --> 00:29:03,039 to escalate, the more aware I was, the more activity was going on 345 00:29:03,079 --> 00:29:07,720 around me. And that does bring into question again It's another bit of a 346 00:29:07,759 --> 00:29:11,079 gray area from is it the person, is it the house? Is it 347 00:29:11,200 --> 00:29:17,920 the situation? Is it some combination of all of the three. But along 348 00:29:18,839 --> 00:29:26,440 the lines, I ended up doing research with some friends about my house, 349 00:29:26,519 --> 00:29:33,839 the property itself, and it turns out that it was right along the trail 350 00:29:33,359 --> 00:29:41,759 of a battle trail where soldiers or civilians. It really was like it. 351 00:29:41,880 --> 00:29:45,960 I had other people describe the energy of my house being like a railroad station, 352 00:29:45,119 --> 00:29:48,920 where it was like it wasn't the same set of spirits, it was 353 00:29:48,960 --> 00:29:52,240 people coming and going, which matched up with what I was feeling because it 354 00:29:52,400 --> 00:29:56,119 was not the same energy every night. It was like some days I would 355 00:29:56,160 --> 00:30:02,039 wake up with a woman, some days this, some days that it just 356 00:30:02,279 --> 00:30:07,880 was like an unsettling knowing that you weren't alone. So I learned to ask 357 00:30:07,119 --> 00:30:12,920 what was happening, because understanding what's happening, even if I can't see it, 358 00:30:12,960 --> 00:30:18,880 removes an element of fear from the table for me. So like having 359 00:30:18,920 --> 00:30:26,079 this experience, like most of my experiences involve me sleeping, So like I 360 00:30:26,400 --> 00:30:30,440 do have ADHD, So like during the day, I have ADHG and I 361 00:30:30,480 --> 00:30:33,640 have three kids that a homeschool, So like you know, getting getting you 362 00:30:33,680 --> 00:30:38,279 know, getting my attention during the day is not like the easiest thing not 363 00:30:38,400 --> 00:30:41,839 to mention, like the million and one projects that I'm constantly doing. So 364 00:30:41,880 --> 00:30:47,000 like when I'm awake, I'm on the go, I'm distracted. I'm not 365 00:30:47,240 --> 00:30:51,680 easy to like, hey, I'd like a word with you, right But 366 00:30:51,880 --> 00:30:56,200 at night, all my guards drop and that would be the opportunity that the 367 00:30:56,240 --> 00:31:00,880 ghosts would have to like step up and be like, hey, I was 368 00:31:00,920 --> 00:31:04,680 just wondering if maybe you wanted to hear this terribly sad story about me. 369 00:31:06,119 --> 00:31:11,960 And what I started doing is I would wake up in the moment. It 370 00:31:12,000 --> 00:31:15,799 was always scary because you don't ever want to wake up feeling like somebody's standing 371 00:31:15,799 --> 00:31:18,599 by your bed, right, And that's the way it feels to me, 372 00:31:18,720 --> 00:31:23,440 is like an actual living person is by my bed. It's the moment where 373 00:31:23,480 --> 00:31:26,559 Michael Meyer. You open your eyes and Michael Myers is standing over you, 374 00:31:26,839 --> 00:31:33,880 right. And I learned to calm myself down, like I would have a 375 00:31:33,920 --> 00:31:37,279 mental checklist and be like, the doors are locked, the alarms turned on, 376 00:31:37,440 --> 00:31:41,200 my dog's not barking, my kids aren't awake, like there's nobody here, 377 00:31:41,599 --> 00:31:45,000 right, And then the next morning I would ask my cards about it 378 00:31:45,039 --> 00:31:48,359 and be like, well, who was this person? And I would get 379 00:31:48,400 --> 00:31:52,200 information about who they were, and then I would say, okay, well 380 00:31:52,200 --> 00:31:55,720 what did they want? Like what was so important? Like what did they 381 00:31:55,720 --> 00:32:00,119 want to tell me? And I learned to start getting bits and pieces of 382 00:32:00,400 --> 00:32:04,519 these spirits lives. And at the time, what I was doing is I 383 00:32:04,519 --> 00:32:08,519 would go onto my Instagram and I would do little installments of this was my 384 00:32:08,640 --> 00:32:13,839 experience, this is the spirit. Here's a follow up breeding because I'm still 385 00:32:13,880 --> 00:32:17,559 thinking about the spirit. I haven't done anything like that in a while, 386 00:32:17,640 --> 00:32:22,759 but I just I haven't really had the opportunity for a hot minute here, 387 00:32:23,519 --> 00:32:30,440 But it was a moment of like I had the awareness that ghosts are real. 388 00:32:30,519 --> 00:32:34,839 Whatever you want to call a ghost, whatever you think that a ghost 389 00:32:34,920 --> 00:32:40,079 is, the energetic imprint of another human is real. And then I had 390 00:32:40,079 --> 00:32:47,480 the process of learning what works for me to communicate because I have done some 391 00:32:47,640 --> 00:32:55,319 of the traditional mediumship classes and they just my brain doesn't process information the same 392 00:32:55,359 --> 00:33:00,920 way that most of it's being taught. And it could be the way that 393 00:33:00,960 --> 00:33:04,160 my brain chemistry works, It could be a lot of different factors, and 394 00:33:04,240 --> 00:33:09,279 it could also just be that the way that I learned was through feeling and 395 00:33:09,440 --> 00:33:13,440 imagery, and that is the way that my medium ship works. So I 396 00:33:13,839 --> 00:33:16,720 need both of them to give you, like a clear description of what I 397 00:33:16,759 --> 00:33:24,200 think is happening. I'm not always entirely accurate, like, but I am 398 00:33:24,519 --> 00:33:31,559 accurate to a point. That's you know, that's the best you can ask, 399 00:33:31,880 --> 00:33:37,440 really, that is perfectly accurate. Yeah, Yeah, well you know 400 00:33:37,599 --> 00:33:42,640 that's it's it's just how that works. It is, Yeah, it's how 401 00:33:42,680 --> 00:33:46,000 it works. So, yeah, I had a lot, a lot of 402 00:33:46,039 --> 00:33:51,799 experiences in Florida. I actually kind of miss it, especially now that we're 403 00:33:51,880 --> 00:33:54,440 we're in October right now when we're recording, and like, you know, 404 00:33:55,319 --> 00:34:00,839 there definitely is part of me that are like I miss getting haunted, you 405 00:34:00,880 --> 00:34:07,039 know. But so now I am. I am living with my parents now, 406 00:34:08,440 --> 00:34:15,440 I am in the process. I'm separated now, so I you know, 407 00:34:15,519 --> 00:34:19,480 that process is happening. So I'm in a very different space now, 408 00:34:20,320 --> 00:34:23,800 and there just isn't a lot of opportunity for that type of thing. There's 409 00:34:23,840 --> 00:34:28,599 not like I know there's haunted stuff around where I live, but I'm just 410 00:34:28,760 --> 00:34:37,039 like it's different now. Yeah, yeah, yeah, So you've written a 411 00:34:37,079 --> 00:34:45,440 book I have to write about. So right now I have two different books 412 00:34:45,440 --> 00:34:50,440 out. I have a novel out. It is called a Collection of Eyes, 413 00:34:50,599 --> 00:34:57,000 and my book is about a woman who is stalked by a serial killer. 414 00:34:58,599 --> 00:35:01,880 Hey, that's uplifting. It's so fun. It's so fun. So 415 00:35:04,280 --> 00:35:08,400 this book started as a birthday present for my best friend. Her name is 416 00:35:08,480 --> 00:35:13,360 Joy. If you are on Instagram, you can find her at the Wild 417 00:35:13,760 --> 00:35:20,920 Underscore. Her story in like historian but her and she lives in England. 418 00:35:21,079 --> 00:35:30,239 So I wanted to do something for her birthday. But I don't remember what 419 00:35:30,280 --> 00:35:31,480 was happening. But I couldn't send her a box at the time. So 420 00:35:31,840 --> 00:35:35,519 I was like, I'm gonna write her something, and I wrote her this 421 00:35:35,639 --> 00:35:42,639 short story. And if you have ever met Joy, she is fierce and 422 00:35:43,079 --> 00:35:51,280 just so brave, and she has done so much to help me before and 423 00:35:51,400 --> 00:35:57,559 after I got my PTSD diagnosis. She was helping me sort through the mess 424 00:35:57,599 --> 00:36:00,639 that was my life, right like she was. She was one of the 425 00:36:00,679 --> 00:36:05,679 people that not the only person, but she was one of the people there 426 00:36:07,280 --> 00:36:13,639 that saw everything that I was up against and was like, I'm here and 427 00:36:13,679 --> 00:36:19,320 I'm going to help you through this. And so I based the character of 428 00:36:19,400 --> 00:36:24,719 my story on the on Joy as this like tough final girl. She's been 429 00:36:24,760 --> 00:36:29,639 through it, She's come out the other side stronger, right. So it 430 00:36:29,719 --> 00:36:36,960 started as this short story and she was facing down the man who kidnaps her 431 00:36:37,000 --> 00:36:39,360 basically you know that in the first few paragraphs, if that's not a spoiler, 432 00:36:39,920 --> 00:36:50,719 she survives their initial encounter. And what I did is I fell in 433 00:36:50,760 --> 00:36:53,599 love with the character. I fell in love with the storyline, and Joy 434 00:36:53,840 --> 00:36:57,280 was like, I love this so much, it should be a full book. 435 00:36:57,440 --> 00:37:00,360 And I was like, oh, okay, how do I Like, 436 00:37:00,400 --> 00:37:05,639 I'm already done, what do I do from here? So what I did 437 00:37:05,800 --> 00:37:13,119 is. I took that as an opportunity to explore explaining the way that PTSD 438 00:37:13,239 --> 00:37:17,559 feels to me, So my descriptions in the book will not be the way 439 00:37:19,039 --> 00:37:24,159 experiencing PTSD feels to everyone. But at the time, I was having a 440 00:37:24,199 --> 00:37:30,639 really hard time with nightmares. To a lot of people with PTSD experience, 441 00:37:30,920 --> 00:37:35,840 and if you've never had a I usually refer to them as trauma dreams. 442 00:37:35,840 --> 00:37:39,840 So if you've never had a trauma dream, it's not like a regular nightmare. 443 00:37:40,320 --> 00:37:47,639 It feels more real than that. It feels like the biggest reference that 444 00:37:47,679 --> 00:37:52,199 people make are when you're a soldier and it feels like you're back in battle, 445 00:37:52,239 --> 00:37:54,920 but there's not a lot of references for the people who were not in 446 00:37:55,000 --> 00:38:01,119 battle. Right, So my story thing nothing like what was in my book 447 00:38:01,159 --> 00:38:05,840 happened to me, But it's it's not that at all. It just was 448 00:38:05,880 --> 00:38:10,880 that I was looking for a way to express the feelings that were drowning me 449 00:38:12,159 --> 00:38:15,800 at the time, and I wanted to do it in a way that I 450 00:38:15,880 --> 00:38:21,079 didn't have to talk about what happened to me because I just still don't. 451 00:38:21,079 --> 00:38:25,480 I don't want to talk about it like you talked about it with your therapist, 452 00:38:25,760 --> 00:38:30,840 exactly if you if you were exactly if you're talking about it in therapy, 453 00:38:30,880 --> 00:38:35,239 if you're talking about it and you're safe with your safe people and you 454 00:38:35,280 --> 00:38:39,840 are still struggling. I turned to writing, and so I had this initial 455 00:38:39,880 --> 00:38:45,159 idea, and then I was like, what would it be like to watch 456 00:38:45,360 --> 00:38:51,119 a like we already know she survived, she is a final girl from the 457 00:38:51,159 --> 00:38:54,079 beginning pages, But what's it like after that? And that's what I went 458 00:38:54,119 --> 00:38:59,079 in with the rest of the book to explore was was the after effect. 459 00:38:59,079 --> 00:39:02,199 And of course there's twin and turns, and there's ghosts, and there's spice, 460 00:39:02,440 --> 00:39:07,840 because that's just who I am as a person. But the intent there 461 00:39:08,599 --> 00:39:19,199 was to showcase the resiliency of human being a human and experiencing something that shatters 462 00:39:19,280 --> 00:39:23,440 your idea and your expectation of the world, and then learning how to put 463 00:39:23,480 --> 00:39:28,760 yourself back together, because that's the part that there's not a lot of people 464 00:39:28,800 --> 00:39:32,800 who are like, guess what, your world just got rocked? Like you 465 00:39:32,800 --> 00:39:37,400 know, it's like it's either the before or the well after that we get. 466 00:39:37,519 --> 00:39:40,960 It's not the people who are sitting in the middle of the mess and 467 00:39:42,000 --> 00:39:45,360 being like I just I don't know how to feel better. I don't want 468 00:39:45,400 --> 00:39:51,119 to feel like this. I miss who I was before, but I don't 469 00:39:51,159 --> 00:39:55,280 know how to feel better. And yeah, I like I am better now. 470 00:39:55,400 --> 00:39:59,880 I'm like, am I am? I healed? No, but like 471 00:40:00,159 --> 00:40:01,320 I'm in a better place than I was now when I wrote it. But 472 00:40:02,519 --> 00:40:08,840 the act of writing it really was therapeutic for me because I got to give 473 00:40:09,039 --> 00:40:15,920 all of my symptoms to a fictional character. But the act of doing that 474 00:40:16,119 --> 00:40:20,960 really allowed me to look at it and see, like, because you know, 475 00:40:21,000 --> 00:40:23,719 there are days when you wake up and you're like, I should I 476 00:40:23,719 --> 00:40:28,159 shouldn't still be struggling with this, or like, you know, it's the 477 00:40:28,199 --> 00:40:31,280 thoughts that once you have a mental illness, they don't they get better, 478 00:40:31,280 --> 00:40:36,679 but they don't necessarily go away. That's like you should be over this by 479 00:40:36,719 --> 00:40:42,239 now, you're being over dramatic. You're imagining how bad this was. It's 480 00:40:42,280 --> 00:40:46,400 those thoughts like that that when they weren't mine anymore, and when they belonged 481 00:40:46,440 --> 00:40:50,800 to a fictional character, I was able to look at it and be like, 482 00:40:51,119 --> 00:40:54,840 God, damn, look at me. Go you know, im Peter 483 00:40:54,960 --> 00:41:00,440 what. I didn't face a serial killer, but I'm doing a pretty fucking 484 00:41:00,519 --> 00:41:07,079 good. Yeah, yeah, so that is my That is my first novel. 485 00:41:07,599 --> 00:41:17,639 I don't write a lot of happy things, but why, but why 486 00:41:17,920 --> 00:41:23,880 there's always an element of happiness to it. But I whether it's ghosts or 487 00:41:24,119 --> 00:41:31,159 whether it's my writing, I appreciate the happy moments. And I think it's 488 00:41:31,199 --> 00:41:37,079 hard for some people who aren't curious about humanity or like human nature in the 489 00:41:37,119 --> 00:41:42,840 way that I am, because it's like, I think that all emotions are 490 00:41:42,880 --> 00:41:46,559 meant to be felt. I think that the good emotions and the bad emotions, 491 00:41:46,599 --> 00:41:52,079 and I think that sometimes the delicate weaving of the two are what it 492 00:41:52,159 --> 00:41:55,960 means to be human. It can't all be good and it can't all be 493 00:41:57,079 --> 00:42:01,239 bad, because then what's left if everything good, than what makes anything special? 494 00:42:01,639 --> 00:42:07,360 You know? It's like, do I want to have PTSD and feel 495 00:42:07,519 --> 00:42:10,920 the lowest of the lows as often as I do? No, not at 496 00:42:10,920 --> 00:42:19,320 all, you know. But also I can recognize that when I'm having a 497 00:42:19,360 --> 00:42:22,880 bad day, it makes me appreciate the good days that much more because I 498 00:42:23,079 --> 00:42:29,800 do know, I do know what it's like to feel those depths, and 499 00:42:30,960 --> 00:42:34,840 I try to write from that perspective too, and that I don't use a 500 00:42:35,079 --> 00:42:37,800 ton of descriptive language. I'm trying to get a little bit better at that, 501 00:42:38,000 --> 00:42:44,320 but I write in a way that lets you imagine how it feels to 502 00:42:44,400 --> 00:42:49,159 be in that situation. So if you read my book, it's scary because 503 00:42:49,239 --> 00:42:52,239 you feel like you are having the emotions that she is feeling. It's not 504 00:42:52,440 --> 00:42:58,840 that my wording is super scary. It's just it's you're putting yourself in somebody 505 00:42:58,840 --> 00:43:05,079 else's shoes for a while. I love monks. Yeah, Yeah, it's 506 00:43:05,119 --> 00:43:08,760 a safe way to learn things. It's a safe way to experience things that 507 00:43:08,800 --> 00:43:15,199 are outside of your experience. And if you have actual empathy when you read, 508 00:43:15,920 --> 00:43:23,039 you can't help but get into the shoes of whichever character is being written 509 00:43:23,039 --> 00:43:30,159 about, you know, and you experience with them their life and the way 510 00:43:30,239 --> 00:43:37,760 that they cope with awful shit, you know, just just terrible. I 511 00:43:37,800 --> 00:43:43,760 mean, you know, one of the things about being an author is you 512 00:43:43,800 --> 00:43:46,000 come up with these characters and you love them, but then you put them 513 00:43:46,039 --> 00:43:54,280 through awful, terrible things. Yeah, because because if you don't, who's 514 00:43:54,320 --> 00:44:02,199 going to read it. The point is to is to see what people endure 515 00:44:02,400 --> 00:44:08,320 and then come back from right or yes or they they surpass yes, what 516 00:44:09,400 --> 00:44:14,760 they beat are faced with, yet they beat the odds and it makes you 517 00:44:14,880 --> 00:44:19,239 feel like you can beat the odds too. And that's like that That's what 518 00:44:19,400 --> 00:44:22,400 literature, That's what stories do for us, is that it gives us, 519 00:44:23,679 --> 00:44:29,159 even if it's like a fucked up kind of role model, it's still someone 520 00:44:29,280 --> 00:44:32,519 to be like, you know what, if they can survive this, I 521 00:44:32,559 --> 00:44:37,360 can fucking get through this. You know it even't like it doesn't matter that 522 00:44:37,400 --> 00:44:43,199 it's not real. And that that is something that my friend Joy that my 523 00:44:43,320 --> 00:44:45,760 book is based off of. She would tell me a lot when I was 524 00:44:45,760 --> 00:44:50,679 still in Florida, was like, pick a fictional character. It doesn't have 525 00:44:50,800 --> 00:44:53,840 to be a perfect character. It just needs to be someone that you look 526 00:44:53,920 --> 00:44:59,320 up to, someone that you can find some hope in. Right, And 527 00:45:00,280 --> 00:45:02,679 this was before I started writing. But for me it was Sherlock Holmes, 528 00:45:02,800 --> 00:45:09,079 Robert Jowney Junior, Sherlock Holmes and P. T. Barnum from the Greatest 529 00:45:09,079 --> 00:45:12,960 Showman in the movie, not in real life, because he was the piece 530 00:45:12,960 --> 00:45:15,400 of shit in real life. Let me just say, oh, he's terrible. 531 00:45:15,639 --> 00:45:17,159 It was terrible to me. He was kind of terrible in the movie 532 00:45:17,199 --> 00:45:21,920 too, but like in the Moon, not as terrible. But the aspect 533 00:45:21,960 --> 00:45:28,039 of the movie that got me was that he thinks of the impossible things and 534 00:45:28,079 --> 00:45:30,960 he doesn't let logic tell him why it won't work. And so by the 535 00:45:31,039 --> 00:45:37,440 time I was already practicing this exercise, I already had PTSD. I didn't 536 00:45:37,440 --> 00:45:42,320 have the diagnosis yet, but I was unwell. I was not a healthy 537 00:45:42,599 --> 00:45:47,119 person, right, And so I was being told to look to fictional characters. 538 00:45:47,159 --> 00:45:52,440 And that is something that I've done my whole life. I've always read, 539 00:45:52,960 --> 00:45:58,000 read stories, and I've immersed myself in these fictional worlds. And now 540 00:45:58,079 --> 00:46:04,159 I've just learned to adapt what's in my mind onto pages. So like odds 541 00:46:04,239 --> 00:46:09,320 are you won't read the happiest stories from me, Like they're they're they're gonna 542 00:46:09,440 --> 00:46:14,880 end well and I build in happiness, but they're that's it's not the point 543 00:46:14,880 --> 00:46:19,360 of my writing, because it's not the point of my existence. Like I 544 00:46:20,239 --> 00:46:24,840 don't like I love I love rom comms, I love Happily Ever afters. 545 00:46:25,079 --> 00:46:32,400 It's just I am more interested in the people who have been through the trenches, 546 00:46:32,480 --> 00:46:35,599 so to speak, and have come out and be like, you know 547 00:46:35,639 --> 00:46:37,760 what, you're a little bit weird and you're a little bit fucked, But 548 00:46:37,760 --> 00:46:39,280 you're my kind of people, So come on, let's go. You know. 549 00:46:39,519 --> 00:46:47,760 It's the Yeah, it's it's that. And recently it's been allowing me 550 00:46:47,880 --> 00:46:53,880 to explore hauntings and the pair normal in a new way as well, because 551 00:46:54,239 --> 00:47:00,000 I had a lot of freedom to explore that when I was in Flora. 552 00:47:01,199 --> 00:47:07,360 I had people around me that I could go out and explore with. But 553 00:47:07,599 --> 00:47:12,639 I also, like, I have a hard time going new places by myself, 554 00:47:12,920 --> 00:47:16,239 and it's not a PTSD thing. That's the way that I've always been. 555 00:47:16,519 --> 00:47:23,639 I find new places really really intimidating and really scary, and I love 556 00:47:24,039 --> 00:47:29,920 experiencing new things and I love going new places, but I have a really 557 00:47:29,960 --> 00:47:35,239 hard time getting there myself. So like if I was like, I've never 558 00:47:35,280 --> 00:47:37,280 been to this place before and I want to go, it will take me 559 00:47:38,559 --> 00:47:44,440 a long time to work up to doing it right. But in the aftermath 560 00:47:44,760 --> 00:47:51,400 of having PTSD, sometimes that's a lot worse. And sometimes it's hard for 561 00:47:51,440 --> 00:47:53,639 me to go to the grocery store, you know, or to do things 562 00:47:53,719 --> 00:48:02,199 that are easy for other people to do. Because I am from Texas. 563 00:48:02,400 --> 00:48:08,079 I'm a Texan. Texans love our grocery store called AGB okay, Like, 564 00:48:08,320 --> 00:48:13,519 yeah, yeah, Texans, all Texans love chibhib is my favorite place. 565 00:48:14,079 --> 00:48:16,239 I go to AGB sometimes, not even to buy stuff, just because I 566 00:48:16,400 --> 00:48:20,559 like AGB. Right, It's like I don't have a lot of places here 567 00:48:20,599 --> 00:48:24,079 and HB is my place. But there have been times when going to the 568 00:48:24,079 --> 00:48:29,719 grocery store was more than I could handle. I have had recently, I 569 00:48:29,760 --> 00:48:32,800 had a panic attack in Target and I was feeling fine when I got there, 570 00:48:32,840 --> 00:48:37,880 but everything was loud and there was just too much happening at once, 571 00:48:38,440 --> 00:48:42,880 and I like, I left the store. I paid for my stuff, 572 00:48:42,880 --> 00:48:45,840 but I didn't get half of it. And it's it's those moments where I'm 573 00:48:45,920 --> 00:48:52,599 like, I want to explore more. I want to explore the paranormal more, 574 00:48:52,639 --> 00:48:54,199 but how do you do that when you're afraid to leave your house? 575 00:48:55,960 --> 00:49:06,280 Enter fiction? Yeah, so it's you know, writing has done a lot 576 00:49:06,320 --> 00:49:12,639 for me. On an alternate side of that, I have been exploring more 577 00:49:12,800 --> 00:49:16,719 about the paranormal through writing because, as I mentioned before, I live with 578 00:49:16,719 --> 00:49:22,320 my parents, who are lovely, very supportive in taking me and my kids 579 00:49:22,360 --> 00:49:30,320 and my pets into their house. But it's not like what I do isn't 580 00:49:30,360 --> 00:49:36,480 necessarily like like we don't talk about it, you know. So it's just 581 00:49:36,599 --> 00:49:42,400 like, and in my current situation, it's easier for me to put those 582 00:49:42,400 --> 00:49:45,440 things into a world of fiction than it is to be like, this is 583 00:49:45,480 --> 00:49:49,320 what I do, because I could be like, look, i've written a 584 00:49:49,360 --> 00:49:55,800 book. Yeah, so ye, writing has given me the keys to freedom 585 00:49:55,920 --> 00:50:02,599 in a way that I didn't expect and I wasn't anticipating, Like it wasn't 586 00:50:02,599 --> 00:50:09,119 necessarily on my bingo card for my life to like end up where I am. 587 00:50:09,679 --> 00:50:15,920 I would have liked to avoid the severe mental damage. But I also 588 00:50:15,239 --> 00:50:20,960 can look at the trajectory that my life has taken and the lessons that I've 589 00:50:21,039 --> 00:50:24,760 learned talking to ghosts and investigating and all the different things that I've learned how 590 00:50:24,760 --> 00:50:30,440 to do, and from where I'm at now, I can also see that, 591 00:50:30,519 --> 00:50:34,400 like is it unfortunate? Yes, I can. I can give myself 592 00:50:34,440 --> 00:50:38,519 that sympathy that, yeah, it sucks to be where I am. But 593 00:50:38,679 --> 00:50:44,519 also I didn't lose any of those things. I'm just translating them in a 594 00:50:44,519 --> 00:50:50,400 different way than I used to, so like it's different, yeah, but 595 00:50:50,480 --> 00:50:54,559 I'm proud of it, you know. I like where I'm at. Yeah, 596 00:50:54,639 --> 00:51:00,599 Now do you do readings from a distance still, I mean, do 597 00:51:00,639 --> 00:51:07,360 you so pull cards, you know, for other people or other investigators? 598 00:51:07,960 --> 00:51:13,239 I will if you I do for investigators, and I will for people. 599 00:51:14,760 --> 00:51:22,239 I don't charge, which is like counterproductive. But I have had a really 600 00:51:22,280 --> 00:51:27,159 big problem with scam accounts on my page, So it just is not something 601 00:51:27,239 --> 00:51:35,400 that, like, with what was happening in my personal life, it wasn't 602 00:51:35,400 --> 00:51:38,280 sustainable for me to try to be like, no, that's not me, 603 00:51:38,480 --> 00:51:42,079 that's not me, that's not me. You should buy this from me, 604 00:51:42,159 --> 00:51:45,880 but this isn't me, you know. It's like I removed that from the 605 00:51:45,920 --> 00:51:53,480 table for my own mental health, where like the the scam accounts that I 606 00:51:53,599 --> 00:51:57,880 was facing, like it got real bad for a while, but the scam 607 00:51:57,920 --> 00:52:02,599 accounts that I was dealing with the worst of it coincided at a time when 608 00:52:02,639 --> 00:52:07,480 my personal life was also at very rocky points. So for me, it's 609 00:52:07,599 --> 00:52:13,960 not that the scam accounts themselves are this bad. It's just that it puts 610 00:52:14,000 --> 00:52:19,559 my mind into a place where things were that bad. So I don't do 611 00:52:19,639 --> 00:52:23,599 personal readings. I will, Like if you messaged me and you're like, 612 00:52:23,639 --> 00:52:27,599 hey, can you help me with this, I will. I don't charge 613 00:52:27,599 --> 00:52:31,159 for them, and that way I could keep up going. It's just not 614 00:52:31,239 --> 00:52:34,960 me. Just don't worry about it because it's not me. And if you 615 00:52:35,000 --> 00:52:40,079 are investigating and you would like help, I do investigate from a distance. 616 00:52:40,159 --> 00:52:46,039 I love to do that. I'm happy to do that literally anytime. I 617 00:52:46,119 --> 00:52:52,800 work with a couple of friends Scottie the Medium he's on TikTok and Melissa the 618 00:52:52,800 --> 00:52:58,400 ghost doctor, who's on Instagram and on TikTok, and we do most of 619 00:52:58,440 --> 00:53:04,760 our work from a distance to so hopefully more in the future. But yeah, 620 00:53:05,199 --> 00:53:07,719 that's you really just have to like, if you message me, I'm 621 00:53:07,760 --> 00:53:12,159 pretty good at responding to my messages. I don't catch all of them, 622 00:53:12,599 --> 00:53:15,280 but I'm pretty good at responding in my messages. And that is something that 623 00:53:15,320 --> 00:53:20,280 I love to do and I really missed doing, especially where I'm at right 624 00:53:20,320 --> 00:53:25,719 now. It's just like it's that like I can't advertise it too much because 625 00:53:25,960 --> 00:53:31,039 yeah, yeah, yeah, oh mom, that's just my friend the witch. 626 00:53:31,119 --> 00:53:37,199 You're gonna go talk to the ghost exactly. Yeah. You know that 627 00:53:37,239 --> 00:53:45,519 graveyard down the road, there's ghosts waiting. I told him i'd be there 628 00:53:45,519 --> 00:53:52,480 by midnight. Yeah, that's not gonna say. Yeah, So you know, 629 00:53:52,679 --> 00:53:55,280 but that that is how to do it. If you, I will 630 00:53:55,320 --> 00:54:01,920 add the the extra warning that I normally get people in the way that I 631 00:54:02,039 --> 00:54:08,920 read taro is more for what's going on with you mentally emotionally. I don't 632 00:54:09,159 --> 00:54:13,559 do fortune telling. So if you come to me and ask if you will 633 00:54:13,599 --> 00:54:16,599 ever find love or are you going to get this job? Can I ask 634 00:54:16,639 --> 00:54:20,679 that question in my card? Yes? Will the answer be what you want? 635 00:54:21,159 --> 00:54:28,280 Probably not? So, yeah, I understand, you know, Yeah, 636 00:54:28,559 --> 00:54:32,800 it's I'll do my best to give you the correct answer. But if 637 00:54:32,800 --> 00:54:37,119 you come to me asking about your love life, I'm probably gonna tell you 638 00:54:37,199 --> 00:54:42,039 why you think you're not worthy of being loved if I'm being if I'm being 639 00:54:42,079 --> 00:54:44,800 perfectly honest, like, that's what it's gonna come down to. It's not 640 00:54:44,840 --> 00:54:46,239 that you haven't met the right person. It's that you feel like you don't 641 00:54:46,239 --> 00:54:52,840 deserve the right person. So well, but that's true, and ye's actually 642 00:54:52,840 --> 00:54:55,599 a useful answer. It is a useful answer, but people don't always want 643 00:54:55,599 --> 00:55:00,159 the useful way. People don't want the useful answer. People want the the 644 00:55:00,199 --> 00:55:05,440 live TikTok readings that or the videos that say he left you and he's going 645 00:55:05,519 --> 00:55:10,920 to come back and I don't do that kind of reading. Yeah, I 646 00:55:10,960 --> 00:55:23,000 know. Yeah yeah. So when you when you think about to row cards, 647 00:55:24,800 --> 00:55:32,400 how much of it did you learn from traditional to row sources like books? 648 00:55:35,039 --> 00:55:38,639 Not necessarily the little tiny booklet that they give you, which is whatever 649 00:55:38,679 --> 00:55:43,639 it is, It is what it is. Let's just I love those well 650 00:55:43,679 --> 00:55:47,760 to an extent, to an extent, yeah yeah, but but how did 651 00:55:47,800 --> 00:55:51,679 did you learn it from books? Or how did what is your method? 652 00:55:52,400 --> 00:55:58,559 So I did learn it from books, I I think. Actually, I'm 653 00:55:58,559 --> 00:56:00,039 pretty sure that this is my first hair right here. It's just like a 654 00:56:00,039 --> 00:56:05,800 basic yeah, right orway. So I had the Oracle cards first. So 655 00:56:06,079 --> 00:56:12,519 I the Angel Deck by Dreene Virtue, and I started by shuffling and asking 656 00:56:12,880 --> 00:56:15,119 what do I need to know today? And I would just pull one card, 657 00:56:15,440 --> 00:56:20,320 and then once I was feeling like I was understanding the one card, 658 00:56:20,360 --> 00:56:25,599 I moved on. So now my daily pulls are wild. I never know 659 00:56:25,679 --> 00:56:29,719 how many cards are gonna come out. Like, I still do the same 660 00:56:29,719 --> 00:56:31,400 thing. I'm like, what do I need to know today? And I, 661 00:56:31,480 --> 00:56:34,800 you know, I pull and however many cards comes out comes out. 662 00:56:36,320 --> 00:56:43,119 But I used bitty taro is. It's a big account, but I got 663 00:56:43,159 --> 00:56:46,599 her guide book and I actually have it on my little trunk over here. 664 00:56:46,639 --> 00:56:53,280 The pages are literally falling out of the book. So I use a blend 665 00:56:53,440 --> 00:57:00,000 of intuition and the basic card meaning in that I enjoy diferencing what the card 666 00:57:00,079 --> 00:57:06,800 actually means. I like, I like getting decks made by artists, and 667 00:57:06,840 --> 00:57:12,079 I like reading their guide books because sometimes what they mean for the card is 668 00:57:12,159 --> 00:57:15,880 different than the traditional card. Yes, two of my favorite examples of this 669 00:57:16,079 --> 00:57:22,079 are the I think it's called the hurt taro. It's really beautiful. I'll 670 00:57:22,119 --> 00:57:24,960 send you a picture after this, and then the Horror Taro, which I've 671 00:57:24,960 --> 00:57:30,360 been using a lot recently, and the meetings are different, the wording is 672 00:57:30,400 --> 00:57:37,360 different, and it changes the traditional meetings. So I will When I was 673 00:57:37,360 --> 00:57:40,960 first learning how like, I would pull cards and I would look up the 674 00:57:42,000 --> 00:57:45,519 cards meetings, and I would get my journal and I would write the card. 675 00:57:45,960 --> 00:57:50,559 I would write the keywords or whatever I was taking away from the meaning, 676 00:57:50,719 --> 00:57:54,760 and then I would write how it applied to me so or how I 677 00:57:54,800 --> 00:58:00,920 saw it applying to me in my life in that moment. So those are 678 00:58:00,920 --> 00:58:05,079 all packed, but those exist somewhere. There's just journals of me being like 679 00:58:05,280 --> 00:58:09,800 I pulled the three of swords today, you know whatever. And so now 680 00:58:10,519 --> 00:58:16,559 I read Taro in a combination of the two because I don't need the guide 681 00:58:16,559 --> 00:58:22,239 book. I like the guidebook because sometimes little phrases will pop out at me, 682 00:58:22,400 --> 00:58:24,880 so like I enjoy I enjoy it when that happens because I'm like, 683 00:58:24,880 --> 00:58:28,960 oh, I didn't think about that way to go, you know. But 684 00:58:29,159 --> 00:58:32,960 it's it's a blend of both for me, and I know people that will 685 00:58:34,000 --> 00:58:37,840 look more at the imagery or will that stick to the core energy of the 686 00:58:37,880 --> 00:58:43,679 card or this or that. But I think that that's what makes reading Taro 687 00:58:44,039 --> 00:58:49,159 so fun is that it is subjective. There's no right or wrong way, 688 00:58:50,079 --> 00:58:55,159 and my method isn't necessarily right. It isn't necessarily wrong either. It's a 689 00:58:55,199 --> 00:59:00,400 little it's a hodgepodge of all sorts of different things, and it looks different 690 00:59:00,400 --> 00:59:05,199 from day to day. Sometimes I'll pull my cards out and be like, 691 00:59:05,280 --> 00:59:07,239 oh my god, okay, I get it, and I'll put them away, 692 00:59:07,480 --> 00:59:10,920 and then the next day I'll do the exact same thing, and I'll 693 00:59:10,960 --> 00:59:14,599 be like, oh, I should look that card up, and I'll look 694 00:59:14,639 --> 00:59:16,440 it up, and I'll have a whole detailed, you know, journal like 695 00:59:16,480 --> 00:59:22,800 I used to do it. Just it just kind of depends. But that 696 00:59:22,000 --> 00:59:27,639 is one thing that when I was learning to read Taro, I also was 697 00:59:27,639 --> 00:59:30,000 in a lot of Facebook groups, which I'm I said, already, I'm 698 00:59:30,039 --> 00:59:32,679 not on Facebook a ton, like I have a Facebook page, I'm just 699 00:59:32,719 --> 00:59:37,280 not super active on there. But in the Facebook groups, they would always 700 00:59:37,280 --> 00:59:39,840 be like, if you're not reading on intuition, then you're not a real 701 00:59:39,880 --> 00:59:44,360 reader and so and I'd be like, okay, I guess I'm not a 702 00:59:44,400 --> 00:59:47,679 real reader then you know, okay, but I'm over here with my guide 703 00:59:47,679 --> 00:59:52,480 books and being like fuck, yeah, yeah, yeah, look look at 704 00:59:52,480 --> 00:59:54,000 that ten of cubs. I didn't see that one coming, you know. 705 00:59:54,320 --> 01:00:01,039 It's like it's it's I just I just think that it's such a personal tool. 706 01:00:01,719 --> 01:00:07,239 And it's like I love how mainstream and how popular Taro has gone, 707 01:00:07,280 --> 01:00:10,639 because like I can go to Barnes and Noble and buy a new Tarot deck 708 01:00:10,679 --> 01:00:14,920 if I really want to, Like, they're there even in my like small 709 01:00:14,960 --> 01:00:20,880 Texas town, there are there's a spirituality section. I love how accessible it 710 01:00:20,920 --> 01:00:25,519 is, but I also don't love that there are so many people out there 711 01:00:25,639 --> 01:00:30,480 that are like this is the way to read taro or like and this is 712 01:00:30,519 --> 01:00:37,519 the only way. And again you can follow my life trail back and be 713 01:00:37,639 --> 01:00:39,199 like, she just doesn't like to be told what to do because the way 714 01:00:39,199 --> 01:00:45,480 she grew up, And that's absolutely true. I don't like it if you 715 01:00:45,559 --> 01:00:47,199 tell me what to believe, I will immediately say no, thank you. 716 01:00:47,400 --> 01:00:53,119 I don't like that. And it applies to my spiritual practice too, and 717 01:00:53,159 --> 01:00:58,800 that I have. I used to share a lot more of my practice on 718 01:00:58,840 --> 01:01:01,079 my page. If you go back far enough, it was only taro. 719 01:01:01,400 --> 01:01:06,159 It was spelled candles, it was bind rooms, it was things like that. 720 01:01:06,400 --> 01:01:13,119 And I really pulled a lot away from that, partially because what was 721 01:01:13,199 --> 01:01:17,880 happening in my personal life mixed with the scam accounts just made it to where 722 01:01:17,960 --> 01:01:22,039 I was like, this is important to me. This is important enough to 723 01:01:22,079 --> 01:01:27,519 me that I'm not gonna share this all of the time. And it's been 724 01:01:27,599 --> 01:01:31,840 hard finding like my footing on, Like I have this public platform, the 725 01:01:31,840 --> 01:01:35,480 fuck am I going to do with it? If I'm no longer the village 726 01:01:35,480 --> 01:01:37,960 Taro witch, you know, like that name is still there, but I 727 01:01:38,039 --> 01:01:47,320 go by Carly dot Latham now on Instagram and it's I missed the days when 728 01:01:47,400 --> 01:01:55,599 I could just be like my full, witchy self. But also I appreciate 729 01:01:55,800 --> 01:02:01,320 that now it is more private to me, that those moments aren't. I'm 730 01:02:02,760 --> 01:02:07,480 I never I'm not one to manufacture the moment. So if I've posted about 731 01:02:07,519 --> 01:02:09,079 it, or if I'm talking about it, it's because it happened, or 732 01:02:09,119 --> 01:02:13,679 it's because it's on my mind. It's not just like I have to do 733 01:02:13,719 --> 01:02:21,719 something today, you know. But I do feel like my relationship with spirituality 734 01:02:21,760 --> 01:02:25,599 and with the tools that I prefer were damaged along the way. I mean, 735 01:02:28,119 --> 01:02:31,440 there's not a lot that PTSD doesn't affect once you've been diagnosed with that, 736 01:02:32,440 --> 01:02:36,320 and not even just that, but I could say mental health in general. 737 01:02:36,519 --> 01:02:42,280 It's it's not like I wanted that to be like the pocket that wasn't 738 01:02:42,320 --> 01:02:45,239 touched and it could just be like this happy, safe space, but that 739 01:02:45,840 --> 01:02:49,360 I don't want to use the word tainted, but that's the way it feels 740 01:02:49,400 --> 01:02:55,559 to me, like that my spiritual practice was tainted by the events that went 741 01:02:55,599 --> 01:03:00,440 on in my life. And so like now again I'm leaning into the writing, 742 01:03:00,679 --> 01:03:07,599 but behind the scenes, I'm also working on rebuilding my personal relationship and 743 01:03:07,639 --> 01:03:13,559 my personal practice because it got derailed so much in the process that like, 744 01:03:14,440 --> 01:03:19,840 it's it's a weird one. It's a weird one to talk to people about 745 01:03:19,880 --> 01:03:23,119 because that was the essence of my page for so long, and I've kind 746 01:03:23,119 --> 01:03:28,079 of been like drifting in the wind for a for a long time. For 747 01:03:28,119 --> 01:03:31,639 like the past year or so, I've been trying to find like where what 748 01:03:31,719 --> 01:03:36,679 do I do? What do I do with this platform that I've built, 749 01:03:37,559 --> 01:03:40,320 with these things that I'm so passionate about, And the answer for me has 750 01:03:40,400 --> 01:03:45,280 been writing. It doesn't mean that it's going away, it doesn't mean that 751 01:03:45,320 --> 01:03:49,599 I'm not going to share these things about my life. It's just I've learned 752 01:03:49,760 --> 01:03:53,400 new tools to channel that information so much in the way that, like, 753 01:03:53,519 --> 01:03:59,119 if you had been following me for any amount of time and you read my 754 01:03:59,199 --> 01:04:04,960 captions, they are usually fairly deep on whatever is on my mind at the 755 01:04:05,000 --> 01:04:10,960 time. You know, I kind of I go all in for it. 756 01:04:11,000 --> 01:04:16,039 And you'll find that in my writing too, is that I don't write happy 757 01:04:16,079 --> 01:04:19,320 things. And it's not that I'm not a happy person. It's just that 758 01:04:19,360 --> 01:04:26,079 there's so much to explore if you give your self permission to see what's hidden 759 01:04:26,199 --> 01:04:29,880 just beyond the veil, or if you turn the lights off and you get 760 01:04:29,880 --> 01:04:33,039 comfortable with the monsters that are in the dark. You know, there's a 761 01:04:33,039 --> 01:04:36,880 whole world out there, and not all of it is scary. It's just 762 01:04:36,920 --> 01:04:43,679 that we're trained to believe that these things are bad. So I am retraining 763 01:04:43,719 --> 01:04:51,199 myself to have hope and to believe in magic and to see the unknown possibilities. 764 01:04:51,320 --> 01:05:00,000 It's just the things that I love were tangled up in my mental illness. 765 01:05:00,039 --> 01:05:08,320 Yeah, yeah, that's that's yeah, I understand that a lot. 766 01:05:08,480 --> 01:05:12,719 Yeah, I was. I was involved in a court case and you know, 767 01:05:13,119 --> 01:05:15,599 I got pointed at by a lawyer who said she's a witch. She's 768 01:05:15,639 --> 01:05:19,599 a witch. Even her own mother doesn't talk to her. You know, 769 01:05:19,960 --> 01:05:26,360 that'll that'll harden you. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But then you know, 770 01:05:26,800 --> 01:05:30,000 after that was over, I still, you know, had PTSD and 771 01:05:31,360 --> 01:05:33,840 bad dreams about it. But you know, I was like, well, 772 01:05:33,880 --> 01:05:39,159 I was outed, Yeah, so I might as well do something with it, 773 01:05:39,519 --> 01:05:43,920 might as well. Yeah, So I do understand, though, it 774 01:05:43,960 --> 01:05:53,400 does feel like what you were doing to help people is then held against you. 775 01:05:53,960 --> 01:06:00,559 Yeah, And that's just that's just not a good feeling at and it 776 01:06:00,840 --> 01:06:04,559 it does make it feel tainted. It does. Yeah, I was having 777 01:06:04,559 --> 01:06:11,079 that conversation with a friend of mine because it's not like it's not like I'm 778 01:06:11,079 --> 01:06:15,360 not proud of what I've accomplished, and it's not like I don't recognize that 779 01:06:15,679 --> 01:06:19,199 like I love what I do. I show up every day almost every day 780 01:06:20,000 --> 01:06:25,400 because I love what I do. It's just like there is an element of 781 01:06:27,920 --> 01:06:32,679 I like I there's no going backwards. I think that's what it is, 782 01:06:32,679 --> 01:06:39,039 is that, like I desperately I want to go back in time. I 783 01:06:39,159 --> 01:06:43,079 want to be in the space that I was in before all of these things 784 01:06:43,159 --> 01:06:48,000 happened, where it just was like this is you know, this is what 785 01:06:48,079 --> 01:06:50,719 I'm sharing, this is what I'm good at. I'm going ghost hunting, 786 01:06:50,719 --> 01:06:54,679 I'm doing all those things like that is where I want to be. But 787 01:06:54,719 --> 01:06:59,400 that's not where I am. And the things that have happened in between have 788 01:06:59,639 --> 01:07:05,480 just made like it does. It feels tainted. It feels like it feels 789 01:07:05,480 --> 01:07:12,039 like I am reaching for a person's dreams who doesn't exist anymore. And you 790 01:07:12,079 --> 01:07:15,280 know what I mean, like it is a past version of me. So 791 01:07:15,320 --> 01:07:19,920 we were talking about me haunting my own house. I forgot we were going 792 01:07:20,000 --> 01:07:24,119 to talk about this, but this is the perfect transition. It's it's yeah, 793 01:07:24,199 --> 01:07:26,639 this is going in a circle. It is going in a circle. 794 01:07:26,679 --> 01:07:31,280 This is the perfect transition because my when I lived in Florida, it was 795 01:07:31,360 --> 01:07:36,480 the first time that I had the space and the freedom to really explore who 796 01:07:36,559 --> 01:07:43,559 I am without outside eyes looking in on me, without my family being like, 797 01:07:43,760 --> 01:07:45,920 you know, you're pretty fucking weird or like, you know, they 798 01:07:45,920 --> 01:07:48,599 would never say that to my face, but they say it with their eyes, 799 01:07:48,679 --> 01:07:53,920 so message received, you know, like h it's things like that, 800 01:07:54,000 --> 01:07:58,480 where Like, it was really hard for me to move there because I've I 801 01:07:58,559 --> 01:08:01,480 lived in Texas my whole life. I'd never lived more than a car rides 802 01:08:01,599 --> 01:08:06,440 away from my family. But once I was removed from that situation, I 803 01:08:06,559 --> 01:08:14,480 had this enormous experience and I was able to grow so much. Right so 804 01:08:15,360 --> 01:08:21,159 a core part of my identity was built in my haunted house in Florida. 805 01:08:21,560 --> 01:08:29,000 Right. So I made the decision to move back in with my parents, 806 01:08:30,399 --> 01:08:34,279 And it was not an easy decision. It was a decision that I made 807 01:08:34,439 --> 01:08:40,640 knowing that I would be breaking my own heart in some ways, and I 808 01:08:40,720 --> 01:08:46,720 did. I cried, and I mourned my life in Florida for months. 809 01:08:46,800 --> 01:08:51,920 I'm actually like rite about my one year anniversary of moving here, and I 810 01:08:53,000 --> 01:08:58,039 still feel like I am going through the grief process like I had. I 811 01:08:58,079 --> 01:09:01,359 had a really good life in Florida. I had really good friends, but 812 01:09:01,439 --> 01:09:08,439 it wasn't healthy and I needed help to regain my health, and there was 813 01:09:08,960 --> 01:09:13,079 a bunch of other big factors at play. But I made the choice to 814 01:09:13,079 --> 01:09:18,720 move back in with my parents, and recently my house in Florida is on 815 01:09:18,760 --> 01:09:26,560 the market now. I signed the paperwork to put it up and I was 816 01:09:26,640 --> 01:09:34,399 going through those emotions because while I had a lot of time to discover myself 817 01:09:34,880 --> 01:09:41,439 and who I am, I also had some of the worst experiences of my 818 01:09:41,520 --> 01:09:45,880 life in that house. So it was it was both all at once. 819 01:09:46,119 --> 01:09:51,079 And so when my house went on the market, it's something that I had 820 01:09:51,119 --> 01:09:55,920 been waiting for for a very long time. I've known that this was coming. 821 01:09:56,359 --> 01:09:59,279 It's you know, there were there was some logistics that needed to be 822 01:09:59,319 --> 01:10:02,159 worked out before or it could get put on the market, and so once 823 01:10:02,520 --> 01:10:10,039 once it went on, it was like I had a few days where I 824 01:10:10,079 --> 01:10:14,800 felt like I felt the depths of being like this is my home, though 825 01:10:15,079 --> 01:10:19,720 like this is my home I live with my parents. I can't even like 826 01:10:20,760 --> 01:10:26,960 I can't read cards outside of my room. Like I felt, I felt 827 01:10:26,960 --> 01:10:30,119 trapped, and I felt limited in a way that I don't like feeling. 828 01:10:30,359 --> 01:10:34,560 Because anybody who reads taro I will say that it's more of like an aid 829 01:10:34,600 --> 01:10:39,319 of sores energy where you're feeling like you're trapped and like there's no way out. 830 01:10:39,319 --> 01:10:42,600 There is a way out, it's just it doesn't feel that way. 831 01:10:43,239 --> 01:10:47,600 And so I was stuck in that moment where I was like, I really 832 01:10:47,640 --> 01:10:53,279 don't want to live here. I'm grateful that I have this safe space to 833 01:10:53,319 --> 01:10:56,640 come to and that I was able to recuperate here, but I don't want 834 01:10:56,680 --> 01:11:00,520 to live here. I missed my life, I missed my friend. And 835 01:11:00,760 --> 01:11:06,239 I cried so much that day. And it wasn't that exact day, but 836 01:11:06,359 --> 01:11:12,239 it was. It was around then and I had this dream and in my 837 01:11:12,399 --> 01:11:16,840 dream, my house was empty like it is right now. It wasn't like 838 01:11:16,880 --> 01:11:20,039 when I lived there, and it had furniture, it had my decorations and 839 01:11:20,119 --> 01:11:25,600 it had I used to paint the walls of that house. I would just 840 01:11:25,720 --> 01:11:29,199 like sometimes I was dressed, sometimes I was bored, but I painted like 841 01:11:29,239 --> 01:11:31,600 a flower mural on a wall, and I had a chalkboard wall, and 842 01:11:31,640 --> 01:11:35,920 I had a wall that was covered in yellow polka dots, and it had 843 01:11:35,920 --> 01:11:42,279 my personality. It had so much of my love poured into that house. 844 01:11:42,520 --> 01:11:46,600 And so in my dream, I was walking through my house and it was 845 01:11:46,680 --> 01:11:51,560 empty, and I could see that they had painted the walls, and I 846 01:11:51,640 --> 01:11:59,520 remember touching the walls and feeling the texture of you know, the whatever wall 847 01:11:59,520 --> 01:12:04,560 texture they put on. And the dining room was one of my favorite rooms 848 01:12:04,840 --> 01:12:09,039 in that house. It's where I filmed a lot of content for my Instagram 849 01:12:09,079 --> 01:12:15,800 page. It was like there was these shelves built and I had all my 850 01:12:15,840 --> 01:12:19,319 oddities on there, and it just was a room that I loved. The 851 01:12:19,399 --> 01:12:24,279 kids didn't really use that room. I loved the dining room. We didn't 852 01:12:24,319 --> 01:12:27,520 eat there. It just was a spot for me to like sit and do 853 01:12:27,640 --> 01:12:32,279 whatever, excuse me, do whatever. But there was a spot on the 854 01:12:32,319 --> 01:12:36,840 ceiling where when I painted that wall, I got dark blue on the ceiling 855 01:12:38,079 --> 01:12:41,319 and I never fixed it because it's my toxic trait. I don't know what 856 01:12:41,399 --> 01:12:44,239 buck. If you live with me, I am a paint of the ass. 857 01:12:44,279 --> 01:12:46,560 I will paint stuff and then I will leave it half finished for months 858 01:12:46,600 --> 01:12:53,079 until I finish it, or I will have these like it's not really manic, 859 01:12:53,159 --> 01:12:55,800 but for lack of a better word, I call it like manic when 860 01:12:55,800 --> 01:12:59,159 I'm painting flower murals on the walls, you know, and I do things 861 01:12:59,159 --> 01:13:01,359 like get paint on the seat and I just never go back and fix it. 862 01:13:02,159 --> 01:13:06,640 And I noticed in my dream that that spot had been painted over, 863 01:13:06,800 --> 01:13:13,119 and it made me so sad because it was I was like, I was 864 01:13:13,159 --> 01:13:16,920 like, it looks really nice. They painted that room was dark gray now, 865 01:13:17,079 --> 01:13:20,960 so they repainted it, but the house is still empty. But it 866 01:13:21,000 --> 01:13:26,279 was this moment where I do a lot of dream traveling, which we haven't 867 01:13:26,319 --> 01:13:29,640 gotten into, so that sounds like kind of out of left field. I'm 868 01:13:29,640 --> 01:13:31,399 sure your listeners will be through it anyways, though. But I do a 869 01:13:31,399 --> 01:13:35,039 lot of dream traveling, and those dreams feel different. It's not like your 870 01:13:35,079 --> 01:13:40,359 normal dream because you don't have that level of awareness. Like I was actively 871 01:13:41,000 --> 01:13:45,000 processing my emotions while I was standing in my house in Florida, and it 872 01:13:45,159 --> 01:13:48,399 was my house, no one else was living in there. It wasn't like 873 01:13:48,439 --> 01:13:54,159 a weird in between space. That was my house as it is right now, 874 01:13:54,720 --> 01:14:00,880 empty and freshly painted. You know, And so the next morning I 875 01:14:00,920 --> 01:14:05,079 woke up and what I usually do when I have these experiences is I will 876 01:14:05,439 --> 01:14:08,760 talk to a couple, I will talk it over with a couple of my 877 01:14:08,840 --> 01:14:13,079 friends, and then I'll usually grab my cards and be like, what was 878 01:14:13,119 --> 01:14:16,560 this? You know, Like, what did I just experience? So from 879 01:14:16,600 --> 01:14:23,399 what I've been able to tell, that was me astral traveling, like whatever 880 01:14:23,479 --> 01:14:28,960 language, whatever terminology you want to use. I missed my life and I 881 01:14:29,079 --> 01:14:34,439 missed my house, and I traveled back to it. I went there in 882 01:14:34,520 --> 01:14:38,640 my sleep, and I feel like I interacted with someone. I can't remember 883 01:14:38,680 --> 01:14:41,880 that one right now, but like that was the core of the moment that 884 01:14:42,000 --> 01:14:45,880 I didn't want to be here. I didn't want to be in this house. 885 01:14:45,960 --> 01:14:49,199 I wanted my space, I wanted my freedom. So I went back 886 01:14:49,279 --> 01:14:53,039 to the last place that I had it, which was my house in Florida, 887 01:14:54,319 --> 01:15:00,920 and I started talking about it and Jordan. Jordan Keith and I had 888 01:15:00,000 --> 01:15:05,760 been talking a lot recently about different ghost theories and what a haunting even is, 889 01:15:06,119 --> 01:15:13,600 and that led me to the most fascinating question to me, which is, 890 01:15:13,680 --> 01:15:16,520 if another person had been there, would they have been able to feel 891 01:15:16,640 --> 01:15:20,760 me there? Because you know how they say that, like when you move 892 01:15:20,840 --> 01:15:25,760 things around in a house or when there's renovations, it stirs the spirits up. 893 01:15:26,479 --> 01:15:30,560 My walls got painted, and I was sad about it. Me a 894 01:15:30,560 --> 01:15:36,319 living human, which just makes me wonder about so much about hauntings in general. 895 01:15:36,399 --> 01:15:41,800 I have a million and one different haunting theories. But in this particular 896 01:15:41,880 --> 01:15:46,800 instance, I am dying to know if somebody else had been there, would 897 01:15:46,800 --> 01:15:50,640 they been able to sense me? Would they have been able to feel the 898 01:15:50,720 --> 01:15:58,239 grief that I felt in knowing that I have to give up my home that 899 01:15:58,399 --> 01:16:02,520 like this. I know why I don't live there, I know why I 900 01:16:02,560 --> 01:16:06,079 can't move back there, but this is still my home, and I'm still 901 01:16:06,119 --> 01:16:15,640 sad about it, you know, Yeah, Yeah, it's really interesting I 902 01:16:15,720 --> 01:16:27,319 have. I have dreams all the time about my last childhood home and my 903 01:16:27,439 --> 01:16:31,920 ex mother in law's home which I lived in for a period of time. 904 01:16:33,920 --> 01:16:43,760 And I don't know if anybody, I mean, I know somebody's living in 905 01:16:44,359 --> 01:16:48,760 my old childhood home, but I know that my mother in law still lives 906 01:16:49,520 --> 01:16:58,800 in her home, and she has some of my letters and poems and writings 907 01:17:00,239 --> 01:17:05,000 away in her attic. She never gave them back. So that's a piece 908 01:17:05,000 --> 01:17:10,600 of you in her attic, uh huh huh, and her heart felt piece 909 01:17:10,680 --> 01:17:16,960 of you yeaheah, yeah, her house was already haunted. So I can't 910 01:17:17,000 --> 01:17:20,199 help but think, is there a part of me, you know, my 911 01:17:20,319 --> 01:17:26,920 twenty something year old self floating around up in that attic, around that box? 912 01:17:27,039 --> 01:17:30,399 Right? Yeah? It's like, yeah, if anybody could see me, 913 01:17:30,720 --> 01:17:35,239 it could could somebody see if if I walked into my house, if 914 01:17:35,239 --> 01:17:40,000 I wasn't me and I walked into my house, would I be able to 915 01:17:40,039 --> 01:17:45,079 feel that that piece of me, that part of me that still exists there. 916 01:17:45,640 --> 01:17:50,039 That's that's the question, and that that's what makes everything that what that 917 01:17:50,159 --> 01:17:55,479 we do so interesting, whether it's like you know, I write about it 918 01:17:55,520 --> 01:18:00,119 in a fictional sense now, but like it. It's that kind of curiosity 919 01:18:00,319 --> 01:18:03,680 for the way that the world works, and to say, what if, 920 01:18:03,800 --> 01:18:08,319 what if you're still in your mother in law's attic, What if twenty year 921 01:18:08,359 --> 01:18:12,079 old you is still really upset that you didn't get your poems back? What 922 01:18:12,199 --> 01:18:17,279 if the me that went through everything that I did in Florida is still there 923 01:18:17,920 --> 01:18:23,119 and still being like I'm here, what do you mean? I live here? 924 01:18:23,399 --> 01:18:28,079 This is my house. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, it's kind of 925 01:18:28,119 --> 01:18:31,880 like it. It's like the living version of the movie the Others exactly, 926 01:18:32,520 --> 01:18:39,000 yeah, exactly. And and if that's the case, WHOA I know that 927 01:18:39,039 --> 01:18:44,520 has a lot of implications. It's it's wild to me. Well, I 928 01:18:44,560 --> 01:18:46,880 started noticing when when I got to my parents' house and I didn't have the 929 01:18:46,960 --> 01:18:53,760 constant influx that I had when I was in Florida. I started to notice 930 01:18:53,920 --> 01:19:00,319 that the spirits that seek me out more often than not are women who have 931 01:19:00,399 --> 01:19:03,279 seen some shit or children sometimes, right, I don't. Every once in 932 01:19:03,319 --> 01:19:08,359 a while I get a man, but most of the time I get women 933 01:19:08,399 --> 01:19:12,079 who want to tell me what happened to them. And I started thinking about 934 01:19:12,119 --> 01:19:15,359 it because sometimes they're able to tell me all about their life, and they'll 935 01:19:15,399 --> 01:19:19,600 tell me what their childhood was like, and they'll tell me beyond the moment 936 01:19:19,680 --> 01:19:27,880 of pain. But I also have spoken to several spirits who seems to only 937 01:19:28,039 --> 01:19:31,279 exist in their pain. Like when I had asked about their childhood, it 938 01:19:31,319 --> 01:19:41,800 was like like like a fuzzy radio where it's like the coming in and out 939 01:19:41,800 --> 01:19:45,640 and then they loop around and they repeat the same message of this is what 940 01:19:45,800 --> 01:19:49,199 happened to me, This is what I'm feeling. I'm upset about this, 941 01:19:50,119 --> 01:19:56,159 and in the past I didn't necessarily disregard, but I didn't have a lot 942 01:19:56,199 --> 01:20:02,000 of experience with spirits who were like splintered. Like really, the the idea 943 01:20:02,000 --> 01:20:05,640 of the concept, the theory that a piece of your soul is stuck in 944 01:20:05,720 --> 01:20:10,640 that moment of pain, and it's not that you're unable to move on, 945 01:20:10,920 --> 01:20:14,680 it's just that you don't know that you're not in that moment anymore. So 946 01:20:14,880 --> 01:20:21,960 like mm hmm, you in your former in laws attic, it reasonably could 947 01:20:23,000 --> 01:20:28,399 be a piece of you. And maybe the reason why these spirits can't give 948 01:20:28,520 --> 01:20:31,680 more than that moment is because that's all that matters. That's all that's real 949 01:20:31,720 --> 01:20:34,159 to them, is that the rest of them is moved on, and for 950 01:20:34,199 --> 01:20:41,399 whatever reason, it's just this piece, this sliver of their life that impacted 951 01:20:41,439 --> 01:20:46,279 them so much that a piece of them is still reliving it, which sounds 952 01:20:46,399 --> 01:20:53,479 terrible and kind of sad, but that's why people like us exist to saying, 953 01:20:54,319 --> 01:20:58,720 Okay, what about that, then let's let's see if we can release 954 01:20:58,800 --> 01:21:01,479 that. That's not good good. Well, that's the thing that I learned 955 01:21:01,800 --> 01:21:12,079 in shamanic training was soul retrieval is that when traumas happen, sometimes a bit 956 01:21:12,119 --> 01:21:15,239 of the soul just just like I can't deal breaks up, I'm out of 957 01:21:15,279 --> 01:21:17,399 here. Yep, yeap, Like it depends. But what happens is that 958 01:21:17,680 --> 01:21:25,520 it gets stuck and then people, you know, wander around with pieces of 959 01:21:25,560 --> 01:21:30,359 themselves. Yes, exactly, and that's that can't be good. It can't 960 01:21:30,399 --> 01:21:34,479 be good. It can't be good. I like to reference Foldemort from Harry 961 01:21:34,479 --> 01:21:39,439 Potter with that with the horcruxes, because he did that on purpose, So 962 01:21:39,479 --> 01:21:42,840 that is that is a distinction. He did that to himself, and these 963 01:21:42,920 --> 01:21:46,880 cases are not like nobody is like, cool, I'm gonna do this. 964 01:21:47,000 --> 01:21:51,239 Sounds fun, you know what sounds great? Haunting my house in Florida forever? 965 01:21:54,079 --> 01:21:58,439 Oh yeah, yeah it is. It's just it's interesting to me, 966 01:21:58,640 --> 01:22:02,720 like what what does make a ghost? And there I'm sure that there's times 967 01:22:02,760 --> 01:22:04,960 in the past that I've been like, I'm pretty sure that this is what 968 01:22:05,039 --> 01:22:08,600 a ghost is, and now I'm like, I don't know. It could 969 01:22:08,600 --> 01:22:11,600 be so many different things. It could be so many different things, and 970 01:22:11,640 --> 01:22:14,520 it could be different things all at once just to make it more confusing. 971 01:22:15,399 --> 01:22:19,199 Yeah, I completely agree. We should we should do another episode just about 972 01:22:19,199 --> 01:22:25,079 ghosts and what we think they are? It would be fun. That's just 973 01:22:25,960 --> 01:22:31,079 it's such a can of worms and it is yeah, it's a uh yeah, 974 01:22:31,760 --> 01:22:36,720 yeah, it's a can of worms. And there's just there's so many 975 01:22:36,840 --> 01:22:43,520 theories. And I will say I am a skeptical believer, so I tend 976 01:22:43,560 --> 01:22:46,119 to believe things that I've experienced. And so, like, I had already 977 01:22:46,159 --> 01:22:53,119 been like noticing this pattern of like, you know what I'm I don't get 978 01:22:53,479 --> 01:22:56,520 people's loved ones who have passed on and been like, hey, can you 979 01:22:56,600 --> 01:22:59,319 tell so and so that I really love them and I missed them. No, 980 01:23:00,039 --> 01:23:01,560 I don't get ghosts like that. And I had already been like in 981 01:23:01,600 --> 01:23:05,000 the process of being like why is that? What is it about me that 982 01:23:05,079 --> 01:23:08,960 I'm like, like, what frequency do I shine on? That's like, 983 01:23:09,079 --> 01:23:11,960 hey, ghosts, tell me your most fucked up stories, because I want 984 01:23:11,960 --> 01:23:16,039 to hear them. I do to be fair, But you know, it's 985 01:23:16,079 --> 01:23:21,079 like, I don't know if I hadn't already been thinking about those things when 986 01:23:21,079 --> 01:23:27,479 I had that dream of my house in Florida, would I have entertained the 987 01:23:27,640 --> 01:23:32,319 idea that I had actually been in my house in Florida, Or would I 988 01:23:32,479 --> 01:23:38,560 just have logically assumed that I was homesick and I didn't like my situation, 989 01:23:38,880 --> 01:23:42,359 so I'm dreaming about it, you know what I mean. It's like it's 990 01:23:42,439 --> 01:23:45,640 those small differations in thought that like, it doesn't mean that both are not 991 01:23:45,760 --> 01:23:50,880 true because I was unhappy, I didn't want to be here, But that 992 01:23:50,960 --> 01:23:56,760 doesn't mean that I wasn't actually there either. Yeah, and that's the wild 993 01:23:56,840 --> 01:24:02,920 part to me. Yeah, and I will get of corroborating testimony that I 994 01:24:03,159 --> 01:24:09,840 certainly don't want to be in my ex mother in law's attic at all. 995 01:24:10,000 --> 01:24:13,119 No, that's the place I always dream about, Yep. I mean I 996 01:24:13,239 --> 01:24:15,199 dream about the rest of the house too, but the attic is but the 997 01:24:15,239 --> 01:24:20,680 attic, specifically the attic is where you have the tie to your belonging still 998 01:24:20,720 --> 01:24:27,239 in the attic. So that, Yeah, it makes perfect sense to me, 999 01:24:28,239 --> 01:24:30,840 exactly it does. But you know, I didn't want to go there, 1000 01:24:31,359 --> 01:24:38,760 so it may be that, you know, sometimes we just go where 1001 01:24:38,760 --> 01:24:44,520 we want or go where we were left. Yep. Yeah, I think 1002 01:24:44,560 --> 01:24:47,760 it can be both. Like I will say that I have I do not 1003 01:24:47,960 --> 01:24:51,680 know how to travel places on purpose. I've been trying to experiment with it 1004 01:24:51,760 --> 01:24:55,279 because like I'm like, well, I'm doing this more and more, I 1005 01:24:55,359 --> 01:24:59,680 might as well figure out how it works. I have no clue. I 1006 01:24:59,680 --> 01:25:05,560 have no clue, but it has been interesting once you were if you're willing 1007 01:25:05,640 --> 01:25:10,640 to open your mind to the possibility that some of these things could be real 1008 01:25:10,920 --> 01:25:14,119 and to just kind of track like it doesn't even have to be like, 1009 01:25:14,840 --> 01:25:15,760 well, tonight, I'm going to go to sleep and I'm going to go 1010 01:25:15,800 --> 01:25:20,319 to Bermuda or whatever like that sounds fantastic. First of all, I love 1011 01:25:20,359 --> 01:25:26,600 a beach, but it for me, it's almost more like, huh, 1012 01:25:26,680 --> 01:25:30,279 this thinking is happening. I should make note of it and see if there's 1013 01:25:30,319 --> 01:25:39,079 a pattern here and see see where it leads me. And my case, 1014 01:25:39,079 --> 01:25:42,039 I would never go to Bermuda because I'd get stuck there because you know the 1015 01:25:42,520 --> 01:25:47,479 triangle that you know. I just watched the like my compass has spinning, 1016 01:25:47,560 --> 01:25:51,960 I can't get home. I watch I watched The Adams Family yesterday, so 1017 01:25:51,960 --> 01:25:57,039 it was on my mind where Wednesday was like, nobody gets out of the 1018 01:25:57,079 --> 01:26:06,359 Bermuda triangle. But yeah, that's that is that That is me and hauntings 1019 01:26:06,399 --> 01:26:13,640 in a nutshell, that's I believe a lot of different things are possible. 1020 01:26:14,439 --> 01:26:17,159 I think that more things about hauntings are true than I am aware of, 1021 01:26:17,279 --> 01:26:20,479 than I know, than I probably will ever know. And I think that 1022 01:26:20,479 --> 01:26:25,800 that's true for most things. And I'm okay with that. I like I 1023 01:26:25,920 --> 01:26:34,560 like the unknown. I like exploring. I like I like theorizing and trying 1024 01:26:34,560 --> 01:26:39,800 to figure out what could be real, even if I'm a skeptical asshole for 1025 01:26:39,880 --> 01:26:46,239 half of it. Oh, you know, when I'm experiencing something, I 1026 01:26:46,279 --> 01:26:50,640 am skeptical. It's all that out. I sit there, you know, 1027 01:26:50,680 --> 01:26:55,520 there's a light in the sky and it's doing weird crap, and I'm looking 1028 01:26:55,560 --> 01:26:59,279 at it, going, uh, is it a plane? Is it not? 1029 01:27:00,119 --> 01:27:03,159 They a light's okay? Is it No? There's no strobe. Oh, 1030 01:27:03,199 --> 01:27:08,199 it's changing colors and it's doing a right angle turn. It's definitely not 1031 01:27:08,279 --> 01:27:11,920 a plane. Okay. You know, is it a drone? Because now 1032 01:27:11,960 --> 01:27:15,319 we have to worry about drone right? Oh? Yes, but they have 1033 01:27:15,399 --> 01:27:18,119 to have a specific light as well. So I'm like, what is it? 1034 01:27:18,119 --> 01:27:21,520 There's no noise, you know. So I sit there and I run 1035 01:27:21,680 --> 01:27:27,880 through all of these different things, and but when people tell me stories, 1036 01:27:28,119 --> 01:27:30,279 I don't do that because I'm like, I'm in the same way. No, 1037 01:27:30,439 --> 01:27:38,079 these these people have experienced something, and you know, I believe if 1038 01:27:38,079 --> 01:27:41,239 they're going to talk about it yep, in front of people, that they've 1039 01:27:41,279 --> 01:27:45,680 experienced it in the same way, Because what what benefit do you have from 1040 01:27:45,760 --> 01:27:49,439 talking about these things? Like, like I have stories that make me I 1041 01:27:49,920 --> 01:27:54,239 literally just told you that I dream traveled to my house in Florida, right, 1042 01:27:54,319 --> 01:27:57,119 But like I have wilder stories than that, And like, if I'm 1043 01:27:57,119 --> 01:28:01,199 willing to say that, it's because I I understand that it happened to me, 1044 01:28:01,439 --> 01:28:05,840 and I feel like other people deserve that same respect, where like I 1045 01:28:05,960 --> 01:28:12,680 might not understand what happened to you, but I will always try my best 1046 01:28:12,720 --> 01:28:17,720 to be open minded and to listen to your experience, because was it actual, 1047 01:28:17,720 --> 01:28:21,279 paranormal? Was it not? I don't know, but it happened to 1048 01:28:21,279 --> 01:28:28,680 you, and that makes it real. And that's the thing. If you 1049 01:28:28,840 --> 01:28:32,319 experienced it and it's real to you, then it is real. It's not 1050 01:28:32,479 --> 01:28:38,840 fake. It's not you know, like is there a muggle interpretation? Maybe 1051 01:28:38,880 --> 01:28:42,039 sometimes there is, Yeah, but that doesn't mean that it wasn't a real 1052 01:28:42,079 --> 01:28:49,119 event that you experienced exactly exactly. I am so the same way, because 1053 01:28:50,239 --> 01:28:58,359 I truly see no benefit in people just making up stories right like that, 1054 01:28:58,840 --> 01:29:00,720 well, especially in the hair, nor if you're gonna write it down and 1055 01:29:00,760 --> 01:29:05,039 get money for it. I'm right, yeah, Like I have yet to 1056 01:29:05,079 --> 01:29:12,319 be able to transform any of my like actual encounters onto paper because I'm so 1057 01:29:12,560 --> 01:29:15,920 obsessed with getting all the details right. And I'm like, who who would 1058 01:29:15,920 --> 01:29:24,880 subject themselves to this? This is terrible? This is absolutely terrible. But 1059 01:29:24,960 --> 01:29:30,760 yeah, and especially if you look at alien abductions or or hauntings or possessions, 1060 01:29:30,800 --> 01:29:33,600 which I'm a little bit on the fence about if I'm being perfectly honest, 1061 01:29:34,119 --> 01:29:40,319 there are so many cases that involve the strange and unusual that automatically get 1062 01:29:40,479 --> 01:29:47,239 cast with such suspicion and doubt that like, why would anyone get up here 1063 01:29:47,479 --> 01:29:51,439 and be like, this thing happened to me? Let me tell you all 1064 01:29:51,479 --> 01:29:58,640 about it, because you sound a crazy and do you really want to sound 1065 01:29:58,760 --> 01:30:06,359 crazy right public? You know, like the yeah, it's if it's like 1066 01:30:06,399 --> 01:30:11,520 a clear money grab, then I'm a little bit wary. But most people 1067 01:30:11,760 --> 01:30:15,880 aren't trying to do that, and most people are terrified when they're telling you 1068 01:30:15,920 --> 01:30:18,680 about what they've experienced. Some like they'll they'll be telling you stories and they'll 1069 01:30:18,680 --> 01:30:26,560 start shaking or really reliving it and choke up. Ye can't speak exactly. 1070 01:30:27,359 --> 01:30:32,079 Yeah, every everyone I've talked about who's had those intense experiences, there is 1071 01:30:33,000 --> 01:30:36,680 the truth right there in their voice and on their faces. Yeah. And 1072 01:30:38,520 --> 01:30:43,520 even though I don't post the video, I'm still looking at them exactly while 1073 01:30:43,760 --> 01:30:48,399 we're talking. Yep, and they're not they're not. They're not bullshitting. 1074 01:30:48,560 --> 01:30:53,399 You're telling the truth as they understand it, as they experience, as they 1075 01:30:53,479 --> 01:30:56,840 understand it, as they experienced it, which makes it real. And that's 1076 01:30:56,880 --> 01:31:00,000 another thing that I like to explore, but maybe not everybody does that. 1077 01:31:00,720 --> 01:31:04,720 Technically, that is the fabric of reality. It's because you experienced it that 1078 01:31:04,760 --> 01:31:11,239 means it is real. It's your reality. Yeah it's not, is it 1079 01:31:11,319 --> 01:31:15,279 everyone? Maybe not? But it's yours. It's yours. That is your 1080 01:31:15,399 --> 01:31:18,760 experience. And we are honored to be the people that get to hear those 1081 01:31:18,840 --> 01:31:26,119 experiences and whatever we do with them. I again, I haven't done any 1082 01:31:26,159 --> 01:31:30,279 of these readings for quite some time, but if I have had someone ask 1083 01:31:30,359 --> 01:31:33,960 me for a paranormal reading, I will. I will share the reading without 1084 01:31:34,000 --> 01:31:39,399 sharing any details and so basically I will say I was asked to do this, 1085 01:31:39,399 --> 01:31:42,960 this is what I've learned, but without giving any details about the person 1086 01:31:43,119 --> 01:31:47,640 or too much about the case itself, because to me, that moment is 1087 01:31:48,399 --> 01:31:50,960 private. And I even have people be like, no, no, you 1088 01:31:51,000 --> 01:31:55,640 can share all the details. You can give all of this, And sometimes 1089 01:31:55,720 --> 01:31:59,199 I share more on those ones if I'm like really sure, but it's like, 1090 01:32:00,079 --> 01:32:05,479 you know, it's it. It's an honor to hear any of these 1091 01:32:05,520 --> 01:32:11,800 stories. Like I miss being in the position where I heard more of them 1092 01:32:11,880 --> 01:32:15,840 and I got to interact more with them. But the ones that I've been 1093 01:32:15,840 --> 01:32:18,560 able to hear and the ones that I've been able to share have done so 1094 01:32:18,720 --> 01:32:25,720 much for me in opening my mind up. So like, even if you 1095 01:32:25,760 --> 01:32:29,479 want to look at the paranormal in that sense that like, okay, you 1096 01:32:29,520 --> 01:32:33,039 don't believe in ghosts, but what did you learn from the situation or if 1097 01:32:33,079 --> 01:32:38,359 this isn't paranormal, Like what did you think when you were feeling those feelings? 1098 01:32:38,640 --> 01:32:41,640 You know? I just I think that there's so much to be learned 1099 01:32:43,359 --> 01:32:49,680 by studying people's experiences period, whether it's supernatural, whether it's not supernatural, 1100 01:32:50,399 --> 01:32:56,279 and being one of those people that gets to hear this crazy thing happened to 1101 01:32:56,359 --> 01:33:00,239 me, What do you think about it? Is one of my favorite things 1102 01:33:00,279 --> 01:33:02,760 that I don't get to do as often anymore, but I really appreciate it 1103 01:33:02,800 --> 01:33:11,920 when I do. Yeah. Yeah, it fascinates me in a lot of 1104 01:33:11,960 --> 01:33:18,439 ways. It makes me feel hopeful in a way about reality that you know, 1105 01:33:18,680 --> 01:33:23,640 the reality I've been living in since I was a kid is not so 1106 01:33:23,840 --> 01:33:28,479 crazy. After all, there are other people moving through that reality, right 1107 01:33:28,600 --> 01:33:31,159 you know. They may not be moving through right at the exact place I 1108 01:33:31,880 --> 01:33:38,199 was at and am at, but they're in there, yep. And every 1109 01:33:38,239 --> 01:33:44,840 person I hear from who you know, then stabilizes there, you know, 1110 01:33:44,960 --> 01:33:51,079 after telling their story, I feel like just listening yep was helpful to them 1111 01:33:51,119 --> 01:33:55,199 and was healing to them. And that means a lot to me to be 1112 01:33:55,239 --> 01:33:59,279 able to say, you know what, you're not crazy? Yeah, yeah, 1113 01:33:59,319 --> 01:34:02,319 at all? It is. It's an important moment to be like, 1114 01:34:02,640 --> 01:34:06,640 yeah, thank you, because when you see the relief that they have, 1115 01:34:08,319 --> 01:34:15,279 it's just it's really nice. And I'm not always able to provide answers. 1116 01:34:15,960 --> 01:34:19,399 I'm always honest about it if I don't know, but you know, I'm 1117 01:34:19,439 --> 01:34:24,960 not always able to provide the answers. But what I am able to do 1118 01:34:25,399 --> 01:34:32,039 is to sit and listen and at least just hold space for the thing that 1119 01:34:32,159 --> 01:34:38,079 you experienced. And you know, there's definitely times when I haven't really had 1120 01:34:38,239 --> 01:34:42,760 much to say or like besides, like, whoa, I can't believe that 1121 01:34:42,840 --> 01:34:49,880 just happened, you know, but it still is. It's a really cool 1122 01:34:49,920 --> 01:34:57,880 part of being in this community is knowing that people trust you enough to come 1123 01:34:57,920 --> 01:35:02,199 to you with these bizarre stories and say this happened to me, and know 1124 01:35:02,359 --> 01:35:05,640 that you're not going to turn away and you're not going to tell them that 1125 01:35:05,680 --> 01:35:12,159 they're imagining it or that they're crazy, because they've probably been hearing that their 1126 01:35:12,199 --> 01:35:17,880 whole lives anyways, and the fact that they've approached you means that they've already 1127 01:35:17,960 --> 01:35:21,880 thought. Maybe not every time, but a lot of the time, people 1128 01:35:21,920 --> 01:35:25,560 have already thought about like what are they going to think about me if I 1129 01:35:25,600 --> 01:35:29,279 bring ghosts up right now? What are they going to think about me if 1130 01:35:29,319 --> 01:35:32,680 I say I'm pretty sure my house is haunted, or you know, things 1131 01:35:32,720 --> 01:35:40,560 like that. So just being someone that people feel comfortable coming to and saying 1132 01:35:41,760 --> 01:35:46,920 I experience something heavy, whether it's real life trauma or it's something supernatural and 1133 01:35:48,079 --> 01:35:55,920 just listening is It's big for me, and a lot of that translates into 1134 01:35:55,920 --> 01:36:01,640 my writing now. But at my core, what I love doing is exactly 1135 01:36:01,680 --> 01:36:08,960 this. It's talking ghosts, it's theorizing. It's helping people understand their experiences 1136 01:36:10,199 --> 01:36:14,359 in a new light if I can, and if I can't, then that's 1137 01:36:14,399 --> 01:36:21,079 okay too. But I like exploring people's memories with them and saying, you 1138 01:36:21,119 --> 01:36:24,479 know, well, how did that feel. I mean, that's like a 1139 01:36:24,640 --> 01:36:29,640 normal therapist question, but like you know, exploring it with cards or with 1140 01:36:29,680 --> 01:36:34,960 the metaphysical, or taking those moments and turning them into a story like I 1141 01:36:34,960 --> 01:36:40,439 did with my life, where it's like this isn't me anymore, but it's 1142 01:36:40,479 --> 01:36:44,199 it's all, as Jordan likes to say fingers. On the same hand, 1143 01:36:44,279 --> 01:36:48,119 it's it's exploration into the unknown. I'm just using different tools than I used 1144 01:36:48,159 --> 01:36:56,880 to, and it's it's an adjustment, but I love it. I agree. 1145 01:36:57,159 --> 01:37:00,920 I agree, that's the best part of having a podcast asked and I 1146 01:37:00,960 --> 01:37:05,840 love being able to say to people no, no, this this is real 1147 01:37:05,960 --> 01:37:11,239 and it's okay yep, and you will be okay, you will be okay. 1148 01:37:11,359 --> 01:37:15,119 It's gonna be hard, but you're gonna be okay. Yeah, yeah, 1149 01:37:15,199 --> 01:37:19,880 yeah, and yeah, I just I just feel like it's it's an 1150 01:37:19,880 --> 01:37:25,079 important thing to do. So yeah, here we are here, we are 1151 01:37:25,439 --> 01:37:30,520 doing it, yes, doing the thing, as we say in our family, 1152 01:37:30,600 --> 01:37:32,640 doing the thing, doing it right, not fucking up, and it 1153 01:37:32,720 --> 01:37:39,399 works. It just works. That's amazing. I love that doing the thing, 1154 01:37:39,800 --> 01:37:42,399 doing it right and it just works. I'm gonna use that now. 1155 01:37:42,600 --> 01:37:47,399 My favorite thing to say is, well, I say, feel the fear 1156 01:37:47,439 --> 01:37:53,520 and do it anyways. That's what I and that's what braves exactly. You 1157 01:37:53,560 --> 01:37:55,960 know what, you could be as scared as you want and you still do 1158 01:37:56,039 --> 01:37:59,560 the fucking thing and way to go. Even if it didn't work, you 1159 01:37:59,720 --> 01:38:02,239 did so yeah win, but did it even though you were skar did it 1160 01:38:02,960 --> 01:38:08,520 exactly it yep. Yeah, And that's that's the way to be. That's 1161 01:38:08,560 --> 01:38:16,479 the way to be. Yeah. Well, well, thank you so much. 1162 01:38:16,640 --> 01:38:20,359 I was looking forward to this. This is great, This was wonderful. 1163 01:38:20,560 --> 01:38:24,439 Thank you so much for talking to me. This has been a lot 1164 01:38:24,439 --> 01:38:28,960 of fun. It has been fun, and you're welcome back anytime. I'd 1165 01:38:28,960 --> 01:38:31,000 really love to talk ghost theory with you. Oh yeah, I love that 1166 01:38:31,079 --> 01:38:35,159 and yeah, yeah, yeah, that'll be fun. That would be super 1167 01:38:35,159 --> 01:38:41,000 cool. I would love that. So yeah, thank you, thank you. 1168 01:38:43,000 --> 01:38:45,359 Well that's all for this week's episode of the Six Degrees of John Keel 1169 01:38:45,520 --> 01:38:50,079 podcast. If you have any questions or thoughts about the podcast, or would 1170 01:38:50,119 --> 01:38:55,640 like to come and talk about your experiences of the paranormal, you can contact 1171 01:38:55,680 --> 01:39:01,199 us at six d JK six seven at gmail dot dot com. We promised 1172 01:39:01,319 --> 01:39:06,319 even answer you, and we are always happy to hear from you. Thank you,