Well, do we have anything to talk about off the weekend? I think
we do as we come in on the Fight Freaks Unite recap podcast here as
part of the Big Fight Weekend podcast feed. I am the somewhat competent,
somewhat capable host. He is our insider from his Fight Freaks Unite substack as
well as Big Fight Weekend dot Com. Dan Raphael, my goodness, hope
Mother's Day weekend was good as we come off the weekend and we got boxing,
we got action, We've got we've got controversy, even we've got much
to discuss here on the show. First of all, Dan, off the
weekend, how you feeling? How are things? I'm probably feeling a lot
better than Ishmael Barroso, m and or Tony Weeks right about now, although
we haven't heard at the time you and I are recording from or maybe Stephen
Butler or Stephen Butler, which does Stephen Butler know that he's in Canada or
in California or where he is after what happened to him in the top ranked
main event. So so much to go over. A little nostalgia, a
little news, little nostalgia here on the podcast, A lot to recap.
Thank you for finding us, however you've done so social media link. Dan
does such a fantastic job of helping promote and we do as well off of
Big Fight weekends social channels. However you found out about us, Thank you.
Make sure you're following subscribing great content. Again. We preview coming into
the weekend, usually out overnight Thursday into Friday. We recap off the weekend
fight Freaks to night recap on Sunday night into Monday. So here we are
getting ready to start another week. All right, yeah, go ahead in
an interview this week. Yes, and we've got a special guest coming up.
The WBC one forty pound King reaches Progray here for a full one on
one conversation with Dan. You did a phenomenal job and I'll mind propping you
up teasing this if you were with us on Friday. Here the payoff where
Pro Gray is talking about why he signed with match Room Boxing when he had
other offers and opportunities. What's maybe out there? Dan has done some follow
up after the conversation on what's maybe out there for a unification title fight,
etc. But it's fair to say, as the kids like to say,
because you've got a son and I've got the daughters. The kids like to
say it's popping, it's popping. It's popping at one forty right now,
and a Regis program is one of the reasons why it's popping at one forty.
Well, you will hear from him on the podcast. Yeah, it's
popping at one forty Regis. Look, I love I love interviewing Regions Program've
interviewed him several times over the years. You know, to me, he's
one of the guy and a lot of fighters are like this, but not
all of them. My Regis falls into the category of guys who just tell
you what they think. Yeah, there's no bullshit, yes, uh,
they just you know, you ask a question. I feel like you get
an honest answer. How he's feeling at the moment and doesn't really be us
around it too much. If he doesn't really want to talk about a topic,
you know, he just will. You know, I said, i't
really want to talk about it, and you know, but I respect the
way he handles himself. And by the way, if it's popping at one
forty with the Regis, we're going to talk about that showtime card which was
three h fights at one forty that had different levels of excitement and or pop
or not pop. Yeah, by the way, I was just motioning at
you because I them out of the NFL world again working with the Tampa Bay
Buccaneers, and so many times the coaches in particular try to say nothing.
They go to great links to say nothing, stock answers, cliches, don't
want to get bulletin board material to the opponent. So much of professional sports
is that. In a lot of ways, it is refreshing when somebody speaks
their mind and gives you an honest answer. I love that. I love
the candor. Yes. In boxing, half the point of promoting your event
is to talk shit and give the opponent bulletin board material. When a guy
says bad things and I'm gonna knock your block off, right, Yeah,
this is kind about your mom or your girlfriend and your wife or you know,
try to not get too personal. But we've all heard the terrible back
and forth between fighters, and sometimes it makes for a more interesting promotion.
Sometimes it's irritating, like it was in the case of the build up to
the Benavides Plant fight, at least in terms of my opinion. But one
of the reasons I like covering boxing, and I've covered other sports. I
mean, in my earlier days, I covered I have covered some NFL,
I've covered Major League Baseball events, I've covered major college basketball things along those
lines. In boxing that the fighters, the trainers, the promoters, the
managers, the TV guys, even they they they'll talk and they and you
know they some of them are completely full of shit, but it makes for
a good quote and you kind of got you gotta fact check them sometimes.
I have never had a problem doing that. But the personalities, let's say,
much more come out and are much more media friendly than it is necessarily
in major professional sports. So if you are covering the NFL and you're working
with the tam Tampa Bay Bucks, and when he was playing, you wanted
to talk to Tom Brady, for example, that's a complicated thing. You
gotta go through this, you gotta go through that. There's a lot of
top fighters if I need to talk to them, I mean, I I
respect the boundaries within the context of the promotion. So if a guy's getting
like put it like this, Devin Haney fights Lomachenko next week. If this
was out of training camp and not in the concept of promotion. And I
wanted to talk to Devin Haney about something, I would call him on the
phone or I would send him a text message or whatever, and it wouldn't
be an issue. I could done that with Ryan Garcia, with Tank Davis,
with any which, by the way, is how you got Joe Goosen
on the podcast a couple of weeks ago. Is because you reached out to
him and but you found him and he was wanting to come on and give
you some honest answers and it was great stuff. But that's what's great about
not just me, but lots of people that are involved in reporting and writing
and talking about boxing have extensive phone lists and rolodexes, etcetera, and contact
information and you don't have to go through thirty five layers of pr people and
all that to to deal with the people. And if they don't want to
talk to you, you know, they'll say, you know, no thanks,
which is fine. They have every prerogative to do that, but it's
it's a much more for all the nonsense it does go on on the sport
of boxing. In terms of as a reporter dealing with the subjects. Like
I said, fighters promoters, managers, television folks, you know, commission
people. It's a it's a lot easier just to get in touch with them,
to make the call, you know, and to make the email or
the text message and h and narrow it down, and you're gonna enjoy Regis
program in that regard coming up here in a little bit. By the way,
rate us and review us on Apple podcast in particular, several of you
have done that. Dan again is admonishing to the audience. If you love
us, help us out. It does help us out with the algorithms that
are out there. It'll move us up on the podcast charts. By the
way, if you rate us and review us, and some of you here
in the month of may have been doing that, so keep that up.
Okay, let's get into it. Let's start with the Showtime PBC card where
the main event fight was won by Roli Romero over is Yeah one marks one
in quote marks we're not writing allegedly one fights stopped in the ninth round.
It is the buzz off of the weekend in terms of controversy. Should that
fight have been stopped by veteran championship referee Tony Weeks, you can already tell
by Dan's comment, and I'm letting you know too that we are part of
the legions. And Dan, by the way, blasted away on social media
and we were retweeting you right away with a great with a great point about
this and about the referee in the stoppage Tony Weeks, because he was the
referee of Corrals and Castillo, which he was letting go until the death apparently,
well I'm exaggerating, I'm using hyperbole. Am I allowed to do that
on the podcast? He was allowing brutality to go on where Coralis has got
a swollen shut eye and has been knocked down twice in the same round,
and he hasn't stopped the fight and allows Corralis to do what he did.
And then we get to Saturday, we fast forward to May the thirteenth,
twenty twenty three, and he jumps in between the fighters there and I thought
it was very telling. And you're gonna pick it up from here. Mar
Ronalo and al Bernenstein had I think America and the world's universal reaction what or
in Espanola would be kay as in what in span what that's a stoppage?
The fight is over all, right? Pick it up from there. I
mean you actually have to pick it up a little further, a little earlier
in the fight. First of all, let's just cut to the chase.
It was a pretty bad fight overall. I mean, that's not Tony Weeks
this fault. I mean, you know, I think that Israel Barroso and
roll Romero both respected each other's power so much that they were very wary of
taking anything of significance. And Roly Romero frankly said as much in the lead
up, says, I know he can crack and you know, based on
the way he performed against Servant to Davis, very cautiously. You know,
the Rolie show is ROLEI building up the fight. I've come to realize that
the ROLEI show doesn't translate when the bell rings. Unfortunately, it just when
he stepped up to a different level of opponent. It just hasn't really translated
to big entertainment value. So this fight with Barroso, which you know a
lot of people were critical of in the first place for even being for the
WBA Junior welterweight title, partly because you have role coming off of a knockout
a year ago to Davis in the lightweight division. You have Barroso, who
you know is a hard working veteran. But you know, really, let's
be honest about I have nothing against Broso. I feel bad about what happened
to him on Saturday. He really didn't have that much business being in a
world title fight. You know, he was posted Rollie fight quo. He
got stripped to the title because he felled the drug test. It was just
a big mess from the from the beginning. But all respect to everybody and
Bob, they salvaged the event. They made the fight fair enough. They
can't help if it's a good fight a bad fight. We all kind of
expect it would be a pretty good fight. I think I actually made the
comment TJ when we were doing our Kimricer was the podcast or on our bet
Us show. I said, if it's a long fight, it's probably a
bad fight, because my feeling was they wouldn't they would be being cautious one
another. And that was really the case. All right. So Barroso uh
uh knocks rolling down in in the what the third round? Not not you
know, uh not not a clean, clean knockdown, but it was into
the ropes, and you know, it was a good shot. All right,
it was a big time left. Yeah, it was a good shot.
So now you get further into the fight. And as as kind of
bad as the fight was very little punch out. But but Barroso, the
forty year old guy who looks like as we joked about in the posters and
the photos, looked like he's about seventy Okay, he's winning the fight,
right, He's ahead on going into the into the into the ninth round.
He's ahead on all three scorecards appropriately so anywhere from four points to one point.
But you know, I felt like the probably the right scorecard was seventy
seven seventy four going to that now. I will say this though, I
personally scored round one ten to ten, which I'd probably do three times a
year, because like, literally, you know, Rolie, I think was
landed like one punch and bars like two punches and night. I have to
confess I was not glued to this and watching every round like you work,
because I was doing other work on the site and putting up the Janabek knockout
win. I was working on your undercard fight stories. I was only sort
of being able to pay attention on your card. Do you believe Barroso was
winning the fight that ninth round. You're saying, yes, absolutely, I
didn't have it as wide as as Steve Weisfeld, who was one of the
judges he had at seventies seventy three. And by the way, have all
the respect in the world for Steve weisfeldt I have said for a long long
time he's probably the best single judge in boxing. But it's okay. You
know, the point is, there was very There was no dispute that Barroso
is winning the fight. However you had it. He had it by one
point two points, three points. He's winning, He's got the knockdown,
he's growing more punches, he's landing more punches. Whatever. Okay, So
now we get to the ninth round, and what happens in the ninth round,
TJ. You get a knockdown scored against Barroso because Rolie lands like a
decent shot, but then basically with the right hand I believe it was the
right hand essentially pushes him down with the right hand. Yes, there was
no real punch that landed. He lands on the floor. You're like,
oh, yeah, it's a slip or a trip or a push or whatever,
and suddenly Tony Weeks is counting. So that was the first terrible move
by Tony, and he exacerbated it. Turned out it didn't matter that knockdown,
which was a bullshit knocked down anyway, and the videos were very clear
as day that it was not a real punch that caused him to go to
the mat. And I guess, technically speaking, the commission could have recommended,
you know, they have a replay official could have asked they had the
round come to an end without a knockout, They could have asked Tony,
hey, you know, I don't remember who the replay official was. Oftentimes
it's Jane eighty. He'll say to the revenue, you might want to look
at that again, or the you know, the executive director might say that,
and then Tony could take a look at the replay and hopefully would have
made the determination that it was the wrong call and ruled it to be a
slipping that wouldn't have cost a point. In any event, it didn't matter
because then the fight ended later in the round. Okay, Roly Romero lands
a decent shot. Barrosa goes to the ropes. He looks tired, you
know, he's forty, it's been a you know, it's been not a
grueling fight, but you know he's in the ninth round. He hasn't gone
you know, rounds like that in a while against a good puncher like Roly
Romero. And then all help breaks lose TJ and I still can't believe what
I witnessed. And I'm sure any boxing fan that was watching that show was
probably scratching their head as they're listening to this's going Yeah, that was just
fucked up. Man. So he does hit him with one shot, he
goes to the ropes. Now he throws what three more punches, and then
like after like two and a half of those punches, Tony Weeks steps in
and stops the fight. Those shots did not land. Tony Weeks was in
the wrong position. Hold on. Tony Weeks was in the wrong position.
He was behind Rolie Romero. So he sees him throwing punches, but he
cannot unless he's fucking Superman see through him with his head three, So he
doesn't know if the punches are landing, and Barroso is firing back. He's
not a fenceless dan. He's firing back, and Weeks has to see that
point, Barroso, while he's taking those or not taking them, but while
Romero is throwing those three punches, fight stopped at for basically two and a
half of them are thrown because it was he kind of got in there like
while the other punch was still being fired. You are correct, Barosso threw
back, I believe, a left hand, and the fight was stopped on
nothing. If you're stopping boxing matches for that, why does boxing exist.
That means you're not allowed to hit your opponent. But Romaro did not hit
the opponent. I mean and again, and I know we're here, we're
now about twenty four hours after the fact as we record this, And I
said it even last night to people that were texting me who I was talking
to as I was writing my story about the fight. I'm not being emotional.
I'm not being hyperbolic. I'm just knee jerk reaction. I have.
Actually I wasn't at the time, and now as we were here a day
later, I've spent some time thinking about it. TG. I have been
watching boxing for over forty years of my life. I'm fifty two years old,
been watching boxing since I was about seven eight nine years old, so
about forty four years something like that. I've been covering boxing professionally from living
from my main source of income and for my job for the better part of
twenty three plus years. I've been ringside for probably literally a thousand fights.
I have watched probably twenty five thousand fights in my life. I can't think
of a worst stoppage in my entire life. And I'm again, I'm not
being hyperbolic because literally nothing happened to cause the stoppage. And what really irritates
me more now, everybody makes a mistake. I get that, and I
mean, I'm not gonna say that. You know, we shouldn't one hundred
percent vilify Tony Weeks. I want to make that very clear. He's probably
going to be a Hall of Famer one day. He's had a remarkable career.
He's been involved as a referee some incredibly important fights and great fights and
the stalwart of Nevada boxing, and he's been one of the best referees in
the world for a very very long time. Has he lost the step at
this point? I mean, again, to be honest, Yeah, now's
I don't know Tony well, but I've at him many times We've chit chatted,
said a load to each other. How you do him? Pat on
the back. I've seen him a thousand times at fights. Ran into him
one time at the Boxing Hall of Fame and sat in bullshit with him.
Who was there with my boy, the late grade Steve Smoger, and we
had a nice conversation. Anyway, I always like Tony, so this is
not in anything a personal thing, but the way he handled that fight last
night was just not good. But here's the most important thing, and this
is what I can't shake and what irritates me and makes me really frankly sad
Ishmael Barroso, whatever you think about his warrant, whether he warn't it to
be in that fight for the world title or not, he is forty years
old. He's obviously near the end of his career. He was winning the
fight handily against a twenty seven year old guy who was a heavy duty favorite.
He's winning the fight, had him on the deck, He's cruising essentially
to a apparently through nine rounds, he's winning handily, and now that is
taken away from him, and he is forty years old, and the likelihood
of him getting another opportunity at this stage, at that level, is not
good. So his entire whatever's left of his career, the arc has completely
changed because of a poor, arbitrary, agreable judgment decision from a referee.
And it was so it was such a bad move. And what made it
even worse was the fucking audacity for the Commission and not Tony himself. I'm
sure it was the commission that recommended this to Tony that they wouldn't even go
on showtime to be accountable to Jim Gray an interview, you know, and
you know they don't want to make quote unquote Jim. You know, it
was a tough, tough interviewer, probably because they don't want him to quote
unquote make them look bad, when in fact, they made themselves look bad.
Because I actually had a brief text exchange with Jim, who I'm friendly
with, after the fight, and I joked to them, I said,
you're not gonna make them look bad. What you're gonna do is you're gonna
put your microphone in Tony's near his mouth. You're gonna ask him, respectfully,
Tony, let's take a look at the end of the fight. Gonna
look at that, you know, fifteen seconds of video and you're gonna ask
him, Tony, did you see any punch's land And the answer has to
be no, because no punches did land if we live in a reality world.
So they took away a crowning moment and achievement of Ishmael Barroso's career gave
him an unnecessary loss at an age of forty, where the chances of him
to get another chance like this are very, very small, and that is
a fucking shame. Okay, well, I got a couple of points on
this, so number one. At the time we're releasing this, Tony Weeks
has still not said anything to anybody, And to me, I understand part
of it is in the heat of the moment. Maybe they want to talk
to him, etc. But to me, he needs to be accountable for
why he did what he did and maybe now he realizes horrifically I shouldn't have
done it. So there's my take on that. Go ahead. It is
common practice after a boxing event in Nevada. I can't speak about this in
other locations, but I know it for a fact in Nevada. I've seen
it. I've talked to people about it. They'll go to a corner of
the arena, maybe a dressing room maybe whatever. And the folks that are
there that are involved with the commission, that's the inspectors, then the director,
whatever commissioners are on hand, the referees, you know, all the
people that are involved, and they will do a debrief right there, so
it's everything's fresh and everbody's buddy's mind and they'll talk about what, you know,
good, bad or ugly, whatever happened they'll discuss. So I'm sure
that they went through that process last night, after this event, and I
wouldn't be surprised because you know, this is just a normal practice. If
there's anything that's even remotely controversial of good or bad, whatever, it wouldn't
be surprised if Tony Weeks, you know, takes a ride over to the
commission office tomorrow and goes into the office and sits with Jeff Mullen, the
executive director, and maybe another referee or a commissioner or whatever in an informal
sort of way and just take a look at it. They'll look at the
video and have a conversation about it, you know, whether anything comes to
that or not, you know, I don't something should something should come of
that, including them making public statements about good, bad, or different,
and we know it's bad about what they're doing. So let's bring this just
and we're going to move along to other things as we want to get to
reach this program as well. But let's bring this around to a couple of
things. Again. I work in the NFL world. This is the case
in the NFL. It's the case in Major League Baseball, the NBA,
and the NHL. So those are team sports. The officials that are involved
are not readily made available to the media after a call, a terrible pass
interference call in a big playoff game, or a terrible charge call in an
NBA playoff game, or strike or ball or outer safe in baseball, the
media who we are, we're not able to get to them, except in
the exception of a pool reporter that at times, if there's a controversial situation,
we'll be able to go talk to the head referee, the crew chief
in Major League Baseball, the crew chief of an NHL or NBA officiating team
and ask them a question or even a couple of questions, including a follow
up about something controversial that is, essentially, what did you see on that
call? And what is the rule and let him explain it. And that's
the extent of it. It's not a grilling, it's not a cross examination.
That's it. So it's just interesting that it's different in every sport.
Well you also generally speaking, I just want to know from you. In
boxing, they don't even have a pool reporter thing after the fight that's set
up. It's different commission to commission in the country, but it's not really
set up right where anybody from the ringside media can go and ask why did
you stop that? Stinking My recollection is that has happened occasionally, Okay,
there have been times. I'll give you a great example. On the night
that the massively controversial decision I believe it was the Timothy Bradley Manny Pack Yale
first fight. Who's I forget the off top of my head, which the
judge was it had that her in this scorecard? Was it? Don't know.
It was just one of the worst, you know, again, to
me, probably one of the single worst two or three decisions I've ever seen.
I still remember that night. I'm doing National sports radio on Fox Sports
Radio. On that Saturday night, I'm the national host. I came on
the air as the show began and said, I have been watching and following
and been around boxing for the better part of thirty five years. That's the
worst decision I've ever seen. I came on the National Sports Everything Show and
said that about that night, while you're looking up who that judge was in
any event one of the and it's happened happened a few times that night.
They knew that was such a controversial call that The executive director of the Nevada
State Athletic Commission at that time was Bob Bennett, who retired a couple of
years ago and was replaced by his deputy, which is Jeff Mullen, who
is now the executive director of the Commission. Bob Bennett came to ringside to
address the press about the scuorecard in question. I believe maybe I'm thinking of
the wrong fight, but there was definitely a hugely controversial Vegas fight where it
was so egregious in the views of most people at ringside, in terms of
the television announcers as well as the ringside media that he came and made the
comments to them, but they he was protecting his own people. Now like
you were talking about with professional team sports, there is the Major League Baseball
League Office, the NFL League Office. They'll oftentimes on a Monday, after
a controversial play in a football game, whatever it is, the league office
will make a statement. They'll review it. It's not instantaneous, but they'll
make some kind of comment. So in this instance, the Nevada Commission,
in essence, is the the body that would be akin to the League office
in that situation. And I believe it is incumbent on the Nevada State up
Letic Commission. It doesn't have to be Tony, but it should be somebody
above him at the commission, that is his boss at the commission, that
at least addresses it. You can't just leave it out there, you know,
stinking for days and days and days. You got to address it.
And you know, if they don't do that, that's a problem. And
the other thing that's always unfortunate is you know what happens. You know,
there's gonna be another fight. There's a big show next week with a you
know, Devin Hani and Vassel Lomachenko, important fight on disputed lightweight championship.
There's a bunch of fights on that card, other world title fights. Are
we gonna Are we gonna see Tony Weeks work on that show next week?
Great question. I'm gonna say there's probably it. I'd say there's a decent
chance we don't see Tony on that show. We're certainly not in one of
the future fights. Because those officials, to my recollection, they will be
officially assigned this coming Wednesday when the Commission has their monthly meeting. That's the
same meeting where they're going to address the positive drug test at Alberto Puyo and
go through their normal agenda items. Fancy some Friday fun at Leopardstown Race Course,
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and again we don't want to go to look. He's a World Championship
referee and has been for thirty years. He's worked World Championship fights over the
last two or three years. Tony Weeks, we're talking about in Las Vegas
with the likes of Terence Crawford and Oscar Valdez, every all kinds of all
kinds of fighters. But for whatever reason, a step slow, like you're
talking about reaction time, whatever was going to make one want to make more
good about this. One more point about this, because I saw so much
of this on Twitter and on other social media. It was a bad call.
We all acknowledge that. I do not believe, however, a singular
moment that the people are suggesting that somehow Tony Weeks was corrupted and was somehow
bending over backwards tonight, you know, because Rolly Romero is the house fighter
and they wanted to win. I want to make it one clear, not
for two seconds, one second and half a second, a millisecond. Do
I believe there's any element of Tony Weeks being corrupted. What we often joke
about is there's a difference between incompetence and corruption, or stupidity and corruption.
This is more about stupidity on what was done than it is corruption. This
was just a terrible call, Okay, So a little context, and I
want this for you. You're saying maybe worst of all time. I went
back to two things, and I wrote about this on Big Fight Weekend,
dot com plug plug plug go read. I wrote a lot about this,
and I don't you know again, I have been around it. So two
references are the Meldrick Taylor Julio saysar chav is ending, because that's the all
time controversial stoppage ending in the final seconds of a fight that Meldrick Taylor was
about to win. We know this. He was ahead on the cards,
he was about to win, and it was stopped with two seconds left.
So that's the all time most controversial one. Whatever you think about. So
I know of another one, which was four years later. Lennox Lewis's first
pro loss as heavyweight champ to Oliver McCall Manchester, England, is on a
one punch knockdown in the second round. He got hit right on the chin,
right on the buttons, as the fight analyst and trainers and fighters always
say, got up WOBBLI and Jose Garcia. Jose Guadalupe Garcia is the WBC
Mexican referee that was standing and he's very small. Lewis is very huge.
He's standing down at about waist level, rib level counting up at Lewis.
He actually counted to nine with Lewis still standing in front of him. He
counted seven, eight, nine, Dan Rayphael and then he looked at him
and then he just waved it's over and he grabbed Lennox Lewis around the waist
and the ribs didn't even know. No, no walk this way, no
put your gloves up. So those are the two that I would reference on
Star Crazy Stoppages go ahead. The reason why this is way way worse than
either of those is because in the other fights you mentioned Chavez, Meldrick Taylor,
Lennox Lewis against Oliver McCall one and chab Az Taylor one. There was
a knockdown that occurred. The referee then took their time, looked at the
fighter, made an assessment, whether you like the assessment or not, and
elected to stop the fight. Now we could have a whole separate podcast discussing
the Chavez and Taylor fight. The fact of the matter is Meldrick Taylor did
not respond. He looked the other way, bleeding like a you know,
like his face is all swelled up. He'd been dropped. It was even
though he's winning the fight. It's a grueling, grinding, brutal, fucking
fight. So again, you can disagree with Richard Steele's assessment, but he
assessed it and he stopped the fight. And in the case of the Lennox
Lewis Oliver McCall fight, once again, big knockdown on the chin. He's
up. He may not be, you know, in perfect condition, but
some might feel he was perfectly capable of continuing. But again you can disagree
or you can agree, but the referee made an assessment decided to stop the
fight on a knockdown. In the case of what happened on Saturday with Barosso
and Romero. In the case of what was happening there at that in that
sequence in the ninth round. First of all, the referee knows that the
previous eight plus rounds there was no real punishment inflicted on either guy knockdown of
rolling notwithstanding, and now you see what's happening here. There was no assessment
other than he felt like he had to stop the fight because of punches that
were thrown but literally did not land. Clear as day on a replay,
Tony was in the wrong position. He stopped it, presumably because he thought
punches landed that he actually didn't see ye, you know it just he What
can I tell you? It was to me, That's why it rises to
the level of far worse than those two. At least in those two examples,
there were knockdowns and the referee was assessing the situation after a knockdown.
In this case, there was no knockdown and had been no punishment previous the
Lewis case at the time. Jim Lampley went crazy on the HBO call.
So did Larry Merchant going crazy, and I believe George Foreman was with him
that night. I always thought that the Lenox Lewis knocked out call was actually
no, I didn't really think that was a big that was in that Controversially.
The only thing about it though, is it's the heavyweight champ. It's
one punch, and are you gonna give him a chance to at least defend
himself for grab on, etc. We'll talk more about that. He never
gave the chance. He waved it off. Okay, so we've spent a
lot of time on that. Oh and I know what else I was gonna
say. Immediately, fighters were on social media, George campbos Is saying it
even Dame time. Even Damian Lillard, the Portland Trailblazer, All Star,
All Everything scoring guard who's a huge boxing fan, he weighed in about how
awful it was watching the fight live from wherever he was seeing it. And
so, you know, this is a big deal. And we'll see what
the fallout is from this. We'll see if Tony Weeks is working this weekend
or what the Nevada Commission says. We in conclusion, and then we're going
to the rest of this card. We're gonna get to Regis program coming up
in just a few minutes. We as the boxing media, the boxing fans
and observers. We deserve some kind of comment and there needs to be some
accountability on why that was done. And one more, the WBA can step
in here too and say we believe this was unfair if they want to,
and I'm sure you're gonna run this down as well, and maybe they order
them to fight again at some point in the near future because Barroso deserved a
better outcome than what happened. W BA. Certainly the w BA could do
that. I tend to doubt they will, and I'll say the reason and
I don't know that for sure they have. They're dealing with the Playo situation.
They've got a promise to the winner, which was Romero, that he
must fight the mandatory, which is O'Hara Davies. They've got other things going
on, but more significantly a rematch with did with Romero and Barroso after how
bad the fight was. I just don't think Showtime wants to spend the money
on that. They've got a lot of other fights to do. I'm showing
a limited budget with which to do it, that that fight won't come cheap,
and there's really really no public demand for it. If you will.
I just I mean you never say never. I mean we've seen worset rematches,
I suppose, over the years, but that just seems like this is
it's not meant to be a rematch. Who cares. I mean, you're
upset about the decision. You just wish they would have done the right thing.
It just the whole thing. It's just a disaster. It stinks,
it smells okay. Rest of that card, Rancis Bartholomy ends up winning and
also Sims, Kenneth Sims and Occupade off. That might have been the best
fight of the entire weekend. Your thoughts real quick to wrap that card before
we move on. Well, I don't know about might of it definitely was
the best fight of the weekend, not even close, but as far as
Okay, So Barthelomy in war As that was the co feature, didn't really
quite understand why that was co feature position when the other fight on paper was
a better fight and it was for higher stakes because it was an eliminator in
any event, Look, Barthelomy was the old war horse, two time or
two division title holder coming off a knockout loss to Gary Antoine Russell, looking
to get back on the track. He got Warez, who had had an
upset loss, who had won three in a row, was a much younger
guy. He's like a twenty three year old kid. Barthellamy's like thirty seven.
So you know, it's the the essence of a crossroads fight. And
you were wondering, you know, which guy is gonna be able to impose
their style. Is it gonna be Warres as aggression or Barthellamy sort of let's
try to stink him out kind of way he fights. And the problem with
Warez is that he had any time he's letting his hands go and and being
active and throwing shots and coming forward, he was you know, doing a
number on him. He was winning big sections of those rounds. The problem
was he could not consistent with that. He stopped too much, he admired
his work. He would suddenly get caught up in sort of just you know,
not doing anything, and the activity level would would go down dramatically,
at which point, you know, Barthellamy could take advantage. He had pretty
good head movement and you know, put his punches out there and was able
to do that more consistently than Warez and Warres. When he goes back and
watches that video, He's going to kick himself because that fight was there for
the taking. He just could not stay consistent by keeping busy. It wasn't
like Barthelmy was hurting him or doing damage or anything. He just, you
know, Warres just you know, I don't, for lack of a better
word, I would He wasn't lazy, he just didn't. I don't think
he understood what was going on in the fight. No, I'll help you.
No sense of urgency. He did not have a sense of I'm losing,
I gotta change this up. I gotta step on a gap. And
and the corner was telling him the right things. As I was listening to
the corner dialogue, They're telling him, don't leave this to the judges.
Let's go get him, step on it, pick up the pace. They
were telling him the right stuff to do, and he couldn't do it.
So Barthelmy gets out of there, you know, with a competitive decision,
but a rightful victory. And you know he I'll looking like this, and
this is not always the case in certain fights. It's hard for me to
say that Barthelomy won the fight. I'm more look at it like Warrez lost
the fight. That makes sense, ye, But good for Barthelomy. He
keeps the keeps the chain moving. He comes back from the victory or from
the rather the knockout against Gary Anton Russell. What I did find kind of
interesting was Barthellomy in the interview after the fight saying, you know, he
would much prefer to have a rematch with Gary Antoine Russell then even if somebody
offered him a title shot. So that's like a pretty big statement from a
fighter, particularly Barthelmy, whose goal for the last several years. Remember he
had won a title at thirty one, a title at thirty five. His
goal is to become the first ever three division title holder from Cuba. So
for him to say he'd rather have the rematch with Gary Antoine Russell instead of
opportunity to win a title and another weight class, that's tells you how big
that loss was to him. So you know, I'm not never been a
big Barthelomy fan, But he got the job done. Warez did not get
the job done. And you know, the old vet beats the young kid.
And as far as you want to talk about the Kenneth Sims and Illet,
but Bear aka duff Okay number one, you put that right into the
conversation for Fight of the Year. It probably won't win, but it was
on that level. We've talked about a bunch of outstanding fights that there have
been this year. That's just another one to add on the list. We
went Frombor, we went through that stretch and like you know, February March
where there seemed to be like the year candidate, like pretty much every week
he had the great fight between who was at Toronto and Erica Hernandez, and
we had Navarette and Leah Wilson, and I think there was was it a
Lee Wood against Mauricio Lara, and there was just a whole bunch of them.
I have to go back and look on my list, but this was
this was a tremendous battle. This was I thought that I thought the guys
on the Showtime broadcast said exactly what I was sort of thinking. I think
was al Bernstein and Abner on the commentary, Basically we're saying, you have
the tier Achmadov and Kenneth Sims both doing exactly what they wanted to do,
employ the exact style they wanted to and that's what made it a great fight
because they were both able to do what their plans were and then the other
one was able to do it back then what they wanted to do. So
they both were fighting at a very high level, both having success, and
it just made for a great fight. Sims was more of a you know,
I mean not to say that he didn't land and be aggressive a little
bit, but he was more countering. Akmadov was more coming word. They
both did a great job in that fight. I tipped the hat to both
and that was a great battle. I always have thought of Kenneth Sims as
a guy who had a huge amount of talent but somehow could never have it
all come spelling out, come, you know, come to the forefront.
I thought he did that last night. Finally kind of realized some of that
potential. And you gotta have you you got to feel bad for Akmandob because
he's now got three decision losses. He certainly could have won the fight last
night. It was that close, you know, it could have gone either
way. He could have been a draw. Frankly. His other loss was
the previous fight to Playo in the vacant world title fight. That was a
split decision. A lot of people thought he'd won that fight, and then
you'd go back a couple of years earlier, he had to fight for the
WBA's secondary one forty title against Mario Barrios. I was at that fight,
and I and many of us at ringside thought Akmadov got completely hosed that night
on the decision. He's got three decision losses for w BAE hundred forty pound
titles that easily he could have won the fight, and he's now got three
losses against them. And you know, if you gotta you kind of gotta
feel bad for the guy. But on the other hand, you gotta feel
thrilled for a kid like Kenna sims. He's not really a kid anymore.
I mean, he's twenty nine years old. This was a big moment for
him. He's now put himself in position to be involved in some much bigger
fights in this very talent rich hundred forty pound way class. And I'll be
honest, the worst thing in the world wouldn't necessarily be to see him have
a rematch now. Kenna said afterwards he wants a title fight. This was
an eliminator, but it wasn't an eliminator to make him number one and be
the mandatory. Obviously, the WBA A hundred key said he wants the winner
of the main event, which was rolling Romero. That is probably unlikely in
the immediate future because that w B A belt. As I mentioned before,
it's backed up with other stuff going on. Whether the situation with Playo was
going to get ironed out with his hearing, with whether there might be a
you know, whatever happens. If there's any kind of rulings about a rematch
potentially with Barosso and Romero, then there's the O'Hara Davis mandatory that's sitting out
there. So that title is is going to be in play for other fights
for the time being. But I would encourage everybody as brutal and horrible as
the main event was for a lot of different reasons and the war as in
Barthelomey fight, not a terrible fight, but just an average fight. The
real gem was Kenneth Simms Jr. Against Bethier Achmandov. Go find it,
go watch the replay, go on showtime on de band. We'll find the
replay on your DVR when they replayed in the next couple of days. Just
a tremendous, highly enjoyable, highly entertaining fight. No dead spots in the
fight starting round one through twelve. I guess the only thing it lacked there
was no knockdowns or true drama, but just a really bad as fight between
two very strong, willed and big hearted guys going at it with skills well
set in summation there. Let's move on to the top rank ESPN card,
which was in Stockton, California, which saw Jason Maloney win a less than
enthusiastic twelve round decision. How do you like that for the verbiage? As
he won over Astrolabbio, the Filipino fighter gets the decision, gets his world
title. You called it. You and I kind of went back and forth.
I kind of liked astrolabby maybe to get the win the Philippine fighter for
that title, but as it turns out, Maloney gets the decision win.
Then in the main event, as we both expected, I think everybody expected
Jannabeca lib Cannoely. We went into this fight asking would he be spectacular?
Would he get there quickly? He did against Steven Butler and bombed him out
in the second round. And by the way, as you're about to make
your comments here, we had the opposite in that fight watching it live because
you were on the showtime card where referee veteran championship referee Jack Reese of California
let Stephen Butler not only get knocked down a second time hard and let the
fight go on. But then Jannabeck delivered a brutal two left hook two shots
to the head that are troublesome, and Butler slammed his head the right side
of his head on the ground, and you were really concerned that Jack Reese
didn't stop it quickly enough. Dan Raphael the opposite end of the spectrum of
Tony Weeks. All right there, I said a lot, give me your
thoughts on the ESPN top ranked card before we get to Regis program coming up
rough night for the referee in both main events and both guys who have been
great referees for many many years, but unfortunately both had shitty knights for opposite
reasons. But in terms of that fight, I think this might be the
time where we mentioned that I was six and oz on our bet Us Pick
show, uh nailing all of the winners, the methods and the overrunners on
all three of the title fights. So there you go. I was I
was four and one. I did. The only one that I didn't pick
and oh you know what, the one five and one. The only one
that I got wrong was Astrolabbio, but I had the over in that,
so we did pretty much whisked out and took the money line. Anyway,
so I did well. I just I thought he would win. I didn't
know how, and he didn't end up winning. But anyway, but any
event on the ground fight on the res point, clearly Butler is wobbly and
he maybe could have stopped that fight, Dan ra Rayfield, now that you've
watched it after the first knockdown, but he certainly could have stopped it after
the second knockdown. Your thoughts real quick? Okay, Well, let's go
in order. I'm gonna go back to the Maloney fight because I started that
first of all. That was the kind of fight where I feel like,
even though Asha Labio lost the fight, and I didn't think it was when
I went back and watched the scores, uh, and I'd heard that the
ESPN commentitter thought it was a very wide scorecard and then it becomes a majority
decision. I felt like the scores were definitely too close, that Maloney clearly
was the winner. With the length, with the jab, with the foot
movement, with just sort of you know, make it kind of befuddling Ashal
Labio at times. You know, he's a good puncher, but he can
never find the way to land it. I mean, it's like my old
pal from ESPN, Teddy Allis, would always say, you know, if
you've got the firepower, that's good, but you got to find a way
to deliver it. And his delivery system, uh, you know, basically
all of his his firepowers left in the garage, so to speak, because
he couldn't land it. But I do think that's the kind of fight where
ashe Labio could improve and learn from and that he still might have a future
to win a world title down the road, that that was maybe just a
bad style for him and he might have hopefully learned something. But in the
case of Maloney, third times the charm, what can you say he got?
You know, he lost a heartbreaker against Emmanuel Driguez in the World Boxing
Super Series and abandoned white title fight a few years ago. He got you
know, a run over like a like a train, you know, hitt
in a something on the train tracks against Noia in a way with a big
body shot in the title opportunity. Noia in a way vacates all the belts,
moves up. He gets this opportunity, so you gotta be happy.
The Maloney's, by the way, nicest guys in the world. Him and
his twin brother Andrew, just just good people, good team. Howardton to
be anything but thrilled for them. And as he made the point afterwards,
it's only a part one of what they hope is a big week for the
Malone team. Because he won this world title. Saturday, his brother Andrew
fights for a Jinger Band away title on the undercard of Lomachenko and Devin Haney.
And there's a good chance that you'll come this time next week you'll have
the twin brothers, Jason and Andrew both having world titles. I guess the
first twins since Charlowe has had titles at the same time they had theirs in
the same way class In any event, Jason Mooney gets to win, good
for him. It's the titles are now being filled. They vacated all of
them when in a way went up, and now you have Maloney filling this
WBO belt. He had Takuma in a way in a way's younger brother who
won one of the vacant titles on a card in Japan a few weeks ago,
and the other two are still vacant, but it's starting to get filled
up and we'll see what happens going forward in the weight class. All right,
on the main event? Where can I start on this one? As
terrible to night as Tony Weeks had in the most terrible stoppage I've talked about
seeing maybe in my entire time of watching boxing, both as a fan and
observer as well as a journalist, I can't say that Jack Reeses was the
worst non stoppage I have ever seen. But he was awfully braven there.
First of all, tip of the cap to the balls and the heart and
the guts that Stephen Butler had. I didn't give him a chance to win
this fight. I thought he would get run over. He did, but
he didn't quit man, No quitting that guy, no doll. He got
to give him credit for showing the heart that he did. He kept getting
up. His legs were all fucked up from the first knockdown. He could
barely I mean, Jack rees ton him walked this way, walked that way,
the guy could barely fucking take two steps without falling. And even in
the commentary, andre Ward said, he is out on his feet and that's
exactly what it looked like. And yet the fight continued. Dan, I
cannot believe that they ookay, they let the fight go on. I mean,
like you said, they absolutely could have stopped the fight after the first
lockdown. I'm glad that they gave him a chance. I mean, it's
a world championship fight, it's professional boxing, that's part of the job description.
Then there was another moment in the fight where he went down again in
the second round and borderline slip, exhaustion, whatever, but he called it
a slip. They could have maybe even called out a knockdown. Dude,
there could have been four knockdowns. He called that one a slip. But
you can tell when Butler got up from the supposed slip, his legs were
messed up. He couldn't really do anything as far as get his equilibrium together.
And then comes the second official knockdown. That's a booming knockdown. You
know he got up now Jack Rees said to him, are you okay?
And you could clearly hear on the audio Stephen Butler said I'm good. I'm
good, And no, you weren't good because you're saying it's kind of like
walking. He's walking to the left away from the action. Yeah, you're
good if you walk over here, Raphael, as long as you're not getting
near Janetbeck, you're still good. I've seen guys on a Friday night,
drunk off their ass and penn station in New York City walking straighter lines.
Steve. I mean, he was his legs were completely gone. And then
you know, I'm Jannabeck. By the way, It's not like he's a
soft puncher. The guys, you know, got a tremendous left hand,
and he hits him with the uppercuts and with the with the straight shots.
I mean, his head's all over the place it was, and then he
hits him again and he falls down too, like fucking missiles. I mean,
look, terrible, terrible judgment on that fight. And I've always admired
Jack Reese for a lot of reasons. Is the way he handles fights,
because he lets the fights go to their natural conclusion. He's not over officious.
He gave for example, Tyson Fury, where ninety nine point nine percent
of the referees would stop that fight after the twelfth round knockdown that he suffered
in the first fight against Deante Wilder, where he's laying down and his legs,
you know, his eyes are closing and his knees up in the air.
That's an automatic stoppage to many, many, many, many referees.
Jack did the right thing. I actually had an extensive interview about that situation
for a piece I wrote prior to the rematch between Wilder and Tyson Fury.
So he made the right call there at this time around man, he was
just way too brave for his own good, for for for Stephen Butler's good
and Stephen Butler, you know, he was a warrior. He wasn't going
to quit. And Jack he was too late on the trigger. And look,
what Jack did is way more dangerous than what Tony did. Tony may
have deprived Barosso of a potential victory and a crowning achievement and all the things
we talked about about snuffing out the greatest moment of his career and changing the
true directory of his career. But the guy he's not going to die.
You know. Butler was in a position where he could have taken enough punishment,
we could have seriously been injured. And we're not over and we're not
over exaggerating here. I'm not because because, for example, we saw Patrick
Gay rest in peace, take a vicious shot and his head slam on the
mat and he never regained consciousness and died a few days later after that.
So to think that, yes, we were laughing a few moments ago,
to think this was not serious stuff when Jannebec laid him out with the left
and he fell hard on the right side of his head, it could have
been much more serious in that moment. And so you're right. The old
axiam in boxing of better a punch too soon than a punch too late does
stand in so, but in the case of twenty weeks, there's got to
be a punch that lands. There's got to be there was no because there
was no punch, an attempted punch or two too soon that did not land.
As we go back to kidding about it, but there you go,
all right, one quick comment from you, then we're onto Regis Progray and
you're one on one conversation. Jannabeck called everybody out except for the late Marvin
Hagler. The late Carlos Monzone and anybody else moving forward. What do you
give me, Give me a gauge, what do you think is realistic for
him in the next fight or two of a big magnitude because he did his
part, he got his big knockout look. He called out two specific names,
and I love the fact that he called it out. He said it,
he said it in English. All good there, you know, so
the fans and the press and everybody evolved could understand clearly what he was saying.
You could understand the emotion in his voice. He called out Canelo Alvarez.
I can't blame him. That has these zero chance of happening. Kennello
is a super middleweight. He's the undisputed champion. No one's dictating to him,
and all due respect to Jannebeck, he doesn't bring anything to the table
financially. He's not a mandatory it's it's a different promoter, you know,
it's uh, you know, just not gonna happen. Kennello is not tied
to anybody promotionally. He could theoretically pick him and maybe do a deal with
top Rancor or wherever. But this there's zero is going to come of that,
but you gotta gotta can't knock the hustle. Put it like that.
So the other guy called that was Jermalis Jamaral Charlo, the WBC's middleweight champion,
a highly unlikely fight to happen. And I say that because while Charlo
has not fought, it'll be two years coming up in a couple of weeks
that he hasn't had a boxing match. He is allowed to take an optional
defense when he comes back, if the WB sticks to its previous ruling,
and then if Carlos Adamis Adamas rather wins his upcoming interim titled Defense. The
ruling from the WBC said that both Charlo and Adamas could take in her fights
and they'd have to fight next. So a Damas has his fight coming up
in June, and then Charlo will have his whenever he comes back, presumably
sometimes before you know this summer. I can assure you that he's not going
to be picking Jannebeck to fight off of a two year layoff for that kind
of fight. It's just highly highly unlikely, particularly across promotions and across networks
where it's one thing for the people with Showtime and Golden Boy in the Zone
and PBC to get together and work and get a tank. Davis Ryan Garcia
done because there was gargantuan amounts of money and a huge fight. Jannebeck against
Charlo is not a huge fight in terms of the money it would generate.
So you know, he's not going to get those fights. He's not going
to get a fight probably with a guy like say Triple G. I just
don't see TRIPLEG wanting to fight his fellow Kazak. That's a big factor,
I believe, forget about and by the way, TRIPLEG is forty plus.
He's not going to go mess around with a young stud like that. You
know what the middleweight division, as we joked around about in the previous you
know, it's like you say you're the best middleway. That's kind of like
being the heavyweight champ of the Bahamas. You know, good for you,
but it doesn't mean anything. So I'm not sure. I don't believe there
is a big fight for him at the moment. Is there a top name
at one fifty four that's about to move up? Is there is he gonna
go to sixty eight, which is you know, not the deepest at the
moment, even though, uh, you know, because Canello has already beating
so many of the top guys there. You know, it's it's really it's
a tough call. You just have to hope it's going to be a situation
like what happened with this fight where top rank was left to look at the
writings of the WBO which he holds the belt, look at their top you
know, ten or fifteen, and try to pick a guy that a is
willing to fight, comes for the right price and gets approved. Jennebeck's okay
with it, and try to make the best opponent possible. I mean,
they're just in a tough spot because if you're you're you're We know Jennebek is
a good amateur. We know he's been good pro even if he had some
trouble with Bentley and didn't look so good in the first defense. But what
he's done now is here's his resume. Knockouts against the am former secondary title
holder, knockout against Robert Brant, a secondary title holder one the interim title
was elevated, you know, won the enterm title by destroying Danny dignam in
like what one or two rounds, then had the defense against Bentley, where
he looked terrible but still won a clearer decision. And now this fight,
you know against Steven Butler, who he just you know, destroyed like a
ragdoll, not exactly murderers row of his world title type fights. So he
fights in a terrible weight class and good luck to him. What can I
say? I'll interject one thing, and then we're getting to your interview.
You know what would make a lot of sense, and it's boxing, and
nothing ever logical happens is tell oscar Deal La Joya and himI Mungia, get
your butt in shape, get down to one sixty where you were, where
you were the number one contender, and find a way to make that fight
because he's the WBO champion. Jana Beck, make that fight, and I'm
certain, I am certain that the top ranked people would be interested in that
fight because it would draw from the Mexican fan base, etc. Have the
fight in California, in Las Vegas, it would draw. That is something
that could maybe happen. But if the mismanagement of Mungia's career is going to
continue, then we don't even have that. Why can't even mentioned Mungia because
he's now fighting at superman, That's what I mean. And he has a
fight scheduled against which is not as good of an opponent as Jannetek would be.
At least Devin Chinko older perhaps whatever is a quantum leap from the garbage
he's been fighting. All Right, that's not gonna but I will say,
though you admire me for at least trying in theory, that's a good five
bonus points. That would be a very interesting fight. That would be something
where I would say, you know what, you know, it's going to
be a good fight. And Mungia was the number one ranked contender for at
least a year and a half or two years in the in the pre fight.
He didn't say it after the fight, but in the pre fight comments
that Jennebec made he talked about Mungia was a mandatory. He ran away from
me. Demitrius andre was the champion. I was interim champion. He he
ran eight pounds away for me to not take the fight. So there is
something to and I don't know if they're true. Well, look, ANDREI
was doing his thing. He was struggling with the way. I'm not gonna
say I love the fact that he left and didn't fight the guy, but
I kind of understand it. The mangia is just a straight thuk period and
the story mismanagement. Okay, with that, let's get to somebody that has
delivered in the ring. Enough build up, here we go. Regis pro
Gray in a recent conversation with Dan Midweek last week, off of his recent
title win WBC Junior welthaweight Championship victory. What's next for him? New deal
with match Room Boxing, et cetera. Dan and Regis covered all of that.
We get to that conversation now, I'd like to welcome into the podcast
this week. It's none other than the WBC Junior Weltaway Champion of the World,
the two time Junior Welteraway title holder, or Regis Progray. Regis,
welcome to the show. Thanks a lot for doing this. I think you're
the second time you've been on the show with us, so I appreciate it.
How you been going, have been a busy week for you? Yeah?
Man, been a busy week. Man Stone never stops going off,
you know, So I literally just woke off from like a thirty minute app
just to talk to you. So I am. I'm beyond honored for that.
I know what that's like, all right, So let's get into it.
You know the reason you're in the news. You were you have been
for the last couple of months. Really, in my mind anyway, probably
the most notable boxer in the world that's been on the free agent market,
that you were able to go with any promoter or any broadcaster and do your
thing. You know a much. You're fighting a great weight class. Obviously,
just won the WBC title at the end of last year, and so
here you are making the rounds. You decided to sign with Eddie Hernam Matchroom
Boxing. You made the announcement with Eddie in an interview. You were down
in Guadalajara, Mexico during the Canelo Alvarez John Ryder event, and that had
ian and made that big announcement. And now not only that you not only
was it announced that you would sign with nat Room, but you would have
your first title defense on June seventeenth at home in New Orleans. You would
take on the undefeated Australian fighter also with Matchroom, named Liam Paro. So
congratulations on that. Can you just just tell me just your feelings. I'm
just getting it out of the way. Like finally, you know what,
you took your time, you talk to the different outfits out there and came
to a decision. Is it a relief. Yeah, it's definitely a relief,
you know for my whole almost my whole career. Man, I feel
like I haven't been really promoted properly, you know, I feel I mean,
it's it's how many two time world champions you know out there right now?
It's I mean, of course they haven't, but um, you know
their profile is probably way big to mind. So now it's just like I
feel like I'm I'm gonna start getting the exposure that I really deserved. And
yeah, it's just it's just a kind of like a weight limp up my
show that you know, I'm done with. Of course I would sign with
like the prevail up they turned disrupt you know, all that was kind of
going on then you know, after that, everybody find out I was a
free agent. Then of course, man, man, my phone when once
people find out I was a free agent, my phone was blowing up.
What it is right now, Like my phone everybody people was out there saying
they managed me. People I don't even know they were talking about they manage
me all kinds of stuff. Man, it was just going It was just
like things were just kind of getting crazy. Um, you know. But
then you know, I talked to Eddie, I talked to Top Rank,
you know, people from like PBC reached out, and um, you know,
I just I felt I felt like the Eddie just had the better deal.
That's why I went with Metric. Do you feel a sense of relief
to get it over with and now you know when your next date is,
you know that you're gonna be with the same group for the next few fights,
et cetera. Yeah, exactly. Feel definitely relief. It's not a
you know, over the over my past few years of my career, it's
always been all right, I fight, and then what's going on? What
is supposed to happen next? Like you know, when am I gonna fight?
Who am I gonna fight? What network? What promoted? Like,
what is going on with my career? I don't know? So now I
just got that. That's a it's a big relief that now I know what's
my pad gonna be. You know, I have I think Eddie's gonna line
up the fights for me. He's gonna put me on the net. Just
everything is just kind of in order right now. All right, So before
we get into the more detail about your upcoming fighting, the decision making process
all that, I'd like to go back a little bit because last time I
spoke to you about things was right before you had your title fight against jose's
A Pado fighting for the WBC vacant title that you now have. That was
a really good fight back in November, day after the Thanksgiving weekend, actually
in California. You stopped him in a really good fight in the eleventh round,
won a tunnel for the second time. Just give me your general thoughts
on that performance. I mean, I can't imagine you it couldn't have been
any It probably couldn't have gotten any better than you would played it an exciting
fight, You get the knockout, you get in some rounds and uh and
and made a good payday and all that. Right. It would like you
said, Man, it couldn't have went any better. You know, I
think because you just like you said, it went rounds. We went eleven
rounds. I stopped to eleven round Um. You know it was in his
backyard, so I had a lot going against me. Um and Depato was
like I mean, for me, Zapatos probably, if not one of my
toughest, probably probably my toughest fight. And um, you know, I
went up there and I just felt super confident. I just I felt super
good about everything, and I went up there. I got the job done
against a Killerato is a you know, people don't Ada is a killer.
You know, he had all these big, top top knockouts, and you
know, he was really really good. And I went out there and I
stopped a bit. I feel like I solidified myself right now. Is probably
one of the best at one forty, if not the best at one forty
right now. Yeah, I mean I think obviously Josh Taylor as a champion.
You know, he did defeat you, albeit very closely, so some
might say him he's been out for a while, but certainly in the top
two. Let's say after you won the title, the WBC ordered you to
make a mandatory defense against Jose Ramirez, who had previously turned down the vacant
title fight against Jose Zapeta, and because he was getting married, he hadn't
have a good schedule, so he had to take care of business. And
my question for you is, when you won the belt, and they ordered
the fight. That seemed like maybe that might be the next fight. His
team said, we want, you know, to explain. It was supposed
to go to a purse bid, which would have been sixty five thirty five
in your favor as the champion. He said he wanted forty of a purse
bid, and therefore turned down the fight ended up fighting Richard Comey instead,
obviously a much lesser fight, at least in my mind, and I think
most fans and I was always kind of like perturbed by that because the sixty
five thirty five was only in the event it went to a pursepit. In
other words, if you sit down as business people and negotiate, there's no
percentage. You just come up with the number you're happy with, and vice
versa. Maybe it doesn't work out, but maybe it does. What were
your thoughts about him just using that five percent as a reason not to even
have a conversation, much less a purse but or negotiation. I mean,
listen, it's it's a clear duck. I feel like it's definitely a clear
duck no matter what I mean. I suppel the fight back in twenty eighteen.
It never happened. So now Jose Rare Mirrors back in two thousand eighteen.
It never happened, and it's just a clear duck. It's just like,
why would he even be allowed to be, you know, in that
position. He already turned down the fight was a paid up, and now
he turned down the fight will meet the fight. Like I said, people
a lot of fans don't even know, Like they're saying all kinds of stuff
about why that they're not given the five percent? Why didn't this he didn't
even accept he didn't They didn't even let it get that far. They just
said no off the top, you know. So it's just for me,
I think it's a clear like honestly, I don't think I would like right
now, in my head, I don't think that will ever fight on the
Rare Mirrors because it's just like it's always something that's always gonna come up.
They know, they know I'm a dangerous fighter, and I mean, unless
he just want to cash out and just retire you something like that. But
I don't think that he would ever want to fight because you had a chance.
And so now I saw that he was supposed to be a like order
to fight the dude, I'm fighting Leah Powell for an eliminator, Like why
you can fight for eliminated when you could have fought for the belt. It
just it's literally it makes no sense at all. I mean, he has
his he has his die hard Fresnel fans, of course, but like the
I think the overall people they know, like, like what is going on?
You know, And don't get me wrong, it's a small move on
his manager not to fight me. You know, it's definitely a small movie.
Go fight call me and you know whatever. But like, I just
want the fans understand that the it didn't even get to the purse bid,
Like they say, no before I even got there, Like they didn't even
they say, oh, they say about the money and stuff, I'll make
more. How would you know you didn't even get awful nobody never got off.
Well that's what I say, Rey, just I wasn't even gonna I
was gonna go even back one step the purse. But is only in the
event where the sides decide they can't make a deal or don't want to make
a deal and put it up for auction. My impression of this entire scenario
was there was never any actual discussion between your side or his side, and
it was just they just basically said on Twitter or in the press or whatever,
no fight. We're no, we're not gonna do it if we don't
get that percentage, like like a take it or leave it. I mean,
yeah, exactly, and it really, I mean honestly, there's five
percent make the difference? Like it really, I don't think five percent really
makes that different if they were serious about what we could have did the five
percent, but that even make a difference. They didn't even let it get
that ball. Soon they heard that, they were just like, no,
we out whatever. So I was like, all right, you know,
because I thought that I was gonna fight him next. That was my that
was in my head. I was I thought that after this it was gonna
be it was gonna be as a payda and and then after it was gonna
be Romorus. And then obviously it didn't happen, So I was just like,
what up? And then after I was supposed to be to and that
didn't happen either, So I was like, man, whatever, But I
just you know, I just felt like listen, I need to go to
now. I need to focus on me. I was worried about these fights,
not even focus on me and go find you know, a big promoter
that's low promoting. Listen, at least with Tiafimo, he ended up taking
a fight with the guy that beat you. So you can't really dog in
for that. I guess no, Yeah, but I was wondering about it.
When you became a free agent, you, like you mentioned earlier,
you had been with Probellum. Uh, they give you a couple of fights.
Uh, they closed up shop, they sold some of their assets or
you know, signed some of their contracts to this disrupt outfit, which has
been awfully quiet for the last few months since they made a grand announcement.
What was going on with you with them? In other words, how did
it end with you and Probellum Android Disrupted Disrupt Or did they try to make
an attempt to keep you? Did they just uh you know, release you
at your request or just release you because they wanted to? How did that
all come to a conclusion that made you a free agent? Point just we
just came in to agreement. Um that It's just like nothing that is,
I felt like nothing is going to happen, Like what is gonna come out
of it? You know? And I think I was. I know there
was there was releasing a lot of people, but I was like one of
the last people that actually got released. You know, obviously I think I
was, if I'm not mistaken, I think I was probably like one of
the only world champions at the company. So you know, of course they
want to they want to hold me longer. So but I was like one
of the last people that got released. And um yeah, I mean they
I don't know what was going on with them any any like animosity in the
release or was it all professional or was there any issues or it is just
it was all professional. I mean from I never really talked. So what
happened? Was they so they had they asked you to offer the fight they
offered me. They offered to fight. Um I think it was Jack Cato.
That was the only thing they had for me, is the Jack Cattero
fight. But um it was I think it was okay, money and stuff
like that, but at the same time, it was for me. I
want after I want my belt. My thing is I want to defend at
home. I have why I should defended my hometime New Waters, So that's
what I wanted to do. And on top of that, they didn't have
a network, so I'll be in the same position that I'm in right now.
I was like, all right, I'll fight. And it was supposed
to be in let me um in a fight, was supposed to be in
Saudi Saudi Arabia, and so like, all right, I just want to
belt. And now I got to go travel to Saudi Arabia to fight and
on no network. It just you know, for me, it just no,
it made no sense. I was like, no, I don't want
to do that. Why would I want to do that? Obviously, you
know I fight Jack Catterall. But I was like, I'm not gonna go
fight. I just want my belt. I want to fight at home,
you know, at least in the States. I mean, if it if
it's not at at home in New Orleans or Houston, it has to be
for me in the United States. So they wanted me to fight it Saudi
Arabia and then no type of network. It's like, I'll be in the
same boat that I'm I've been in. It just you know, basically just
like fight for money but no profile, right And I know at a boxer,
the profile is part of it because it helps you make more money down
the road after that. I understand that probably one of the things I found
interesting reach just about your free agency is that you basically ended up going through
the process on your own, in the sense that usually there's a manager to
guide the person. Now, I know you had been managed by Sam Katkowski
for quite some time. I actually saw Sam when I was out in Las
Vegas at the Tank Davis Ryan Garcia if I ran at him. I've known
him for years. We talked a little bit about it. Said, you,
guys, you know, just came to the decision that you decided to
part ways, no hard feelings. I guess I'm not sure necessarily believe that.
But what can you tell me about going through the process without a manager
and why split from a manager at the exact moment when you might actually need
the manager of the moment was going into free agency? Um? I mean,
well, I say about it without saying too much, it's like right
now, Yeah, it's just like right now, I just feel like,
man, like, do I really need Like I don't know if I really
needed a manager or not. That's all like, right now I'm going to
a free agency. Obviously, I feel like, you know, maybe a
manager could help me a little bit, you know, but is it is
it really worth Is it really worth it to have um, you know,
somebody taking a percentage of your money, and how much of a percentage of
your money are they're gonna take? And can you do the stuff yourself?
And I mean I feel like, you know, I feel like I do
feel like I'm telling you, I read a lot of books all the time,
and and I do want to know the business side myself. So I
want to be in a and I want to have the um the conversation with
the promoters myself. I'm meeting these guys, you know when I went,
you know, I met when in Vegas with Type Rank, I met with
Eddie myself. You know, I have an assistant, I help my lawyer,
of my coach, and that's I feel like, that's all I need.
You know. Now, I'm not telling I'm not telling nothing. The
young fighters don't have a manager. But as far as I you know,
right now, like I'm a I'm a two term world champion. I already
like things are kind of mapped out for me already, and I can tell
I can tell a promoter you know what I want basically already. So and
I want to learn this business myself, and you know with another thing with
the with Eddie what Matrium is like, I'm starting my emotions thing, so
I'm learning the business thing. I'm learning the business side of things myself.
And that's why I feel like, man, I don't I just feel like
I don't need one at this time. Now. Maybe I changed my mind
in a you know, down the line the future, but right now I
just felt like it just I just felt like I didn't need a management maybe,
like I think, maybe they could give me a little more money,
but it probably equals to the same thing once you pay them, right,
So does it matter? I mean, does it really matter? You know,
the numbers are what they're gonna be. You know that's all. Okay.
So you you made that decision, you went through the process you just
mentioned, you talked to Top Rank, you had PBC's interests, you obviously
had conversations and ended up signing with Matrium. And was there something specific?
In other words, I would think when a boxer's a fridgent, they're looking
at a number of things, the activity obviously, the money, What type
of opponents can they offer me if I get a bigger fight? Can we
really go to town and make it as big a profile event as possible.
Obviously Eddie, you know, has done huge events, but I don't know
if the money was the same. He doesn't seem to be that deep in
your weight class compared to other promoters. So I'm just curious when you were
making your checklist of these were the things that were most important to me,
what was it that made you say, Okay, natural is where I should
be. And they're obviously a good promoter. Nobody's disputing that, right right
right. Well, first off, the money activity, well really, I'll
tell you. I mean it's kind of out there. To Rank actually offered
me. They at first they wanted five fights, then they offered four fights.
Obviously it was more money than the three fights and stuff like that,
but it was more money at top rank, but it was it was between
those two. I went back and forth. It was like three or four
weeks, man, I went back. I would wake up and say,
all right, man, I'm going to tie rank. Called to Rank,
I'm going to tie rank, and then I would just go to sleeping like
man is matrim And literally I did that every single day for a long long
time. And what really came down to it. So I know with Todd
so Todd Rank, the first fight was gonna be August. It was.
It was supposed to be Barbosa in August. Not a bad fight after that,
not a bad fight, not a bad fight, not a bad fight,
Barbosa August. And then after they said maybe Ramirez and maybe like TiO
and maybe Josh Taylor. The problem all those people. Of course, all
those people, I want to fight Barboza or whatever, you know, that's
what but Ramiro and John Taylor, ta female. Of course I want to
fight those guys. But the thing is, I'm what I'm hearing is that
Ramirez has one more fight on a contract goal chalk rank. So what do
he fight me after that? I mean, he been he didn't want to
fight me all this time, So what do you really fight me? I
don't know, you know, I'm not gonna I'm not gonna guess it,
and just you know, go that way. And then he well then he
doesn't have a belt or nothing like that either, but still and the um
and then like a TiO TiO, maybe he has one more fighter espn two.
I don't know. I heard he kind of has, you know,
his deal is coming up with with esp in the top rank. Listen,
I'll just interject your t Female says a lot of things. My understanding is
T Female, he's not going anywhere after the Josh Taylor fight win or Lewis.
He's he just resigned with top rank, not that long ago. They
got him from right, right, But the point I was hearing other stuff
right, but then and then so it's and then the Josh Sailor thing.
He might go up to one forty seven. So with Eddie, you know,
he kind of mapped out a plan and I do want to I do
want to have the belts. I do want to get the belts, and
I think from what I understand, Eddie is um, you know, he'll
give me a few time of defenses to get some you know, some guys,
maybe some tough, tough, tough competition. But from what I understand,
Eddie is close to getting a deal done with Matias. I've heard that,
and yes, so I heard that too. It he told me that
already and then it's kind of out. So that's somebody who I want to
fight. And if you look at I think, besides myself, that's a
belt good who's the most dangerous in the division. It is Matias. That's
probably from the from for me as a die hard fan, if you really
want to see a good freaking fight, Regio's program against Sabrill and Matias,
there's a really good fight. There's no doubt exactly right. So he's already
he's supposed to be closing with him, and I think that at the end
of like not at the end of the year, but probably the beginning next
year, it'll probably be me and it'll probably be being but Tissot foot um
unified. I have a belt, he has a belt, and that's the
fight I want, you know. I feel like, of course he can
build his profile up a little bigger. He can get a few, like
two fights and build his profile up a little bigger. But I think that
me and him will have up a mega fight, a huge huse fight,
and then he has a belt, something that I do want to It'll be
a lot of money and he has a belt, so it's something that I
want so um, you know, that's why I went with match Rim.
Another thing with matt Rim, they literally told me like you're gonna fight next
There was like you're gonna fight in June, like, listen, if you
sign this. That's where we had to hurry up. There was like listen,
if you get this done, you already have a fight, don't No.
I was already no, no, no, I was already training.
I've been training the old time. Yeah, I've been training already. So
because I kind of done about it already, like Eddie, we met with
Eddie. Um now it was like I think it was last week. It
was like last Monday we met with him. And literally after that and you
just how people know when they hear this last Monday is the Monday before the
Canelo John Ryder, Yes, yes, exactly. So he was going to
Guala Howard, but he stopped the Houston just to have dinner with me,
and you know, we talked in we I'm not alive. He felt the
too. We didn't have a good conversation, We didn't have a good meeting.
You know. It was just like it was kind of like, uh,
you know whatever. Um And then after that I went one because I
knew something might happen and I was just like, man, let's you know
what, let's just get it done. Let's let's get this fight done,
because I do want to fight that they're already was playing this stuff him.
They're planning to be fighting in June in New Orleans. So it's like,
man, let's let's get this. Let's get this deal done, all right.
So I mean the possibility of the of the maybe the names like the
female Taylor Winner or or Ramirez or Barbois or whatever, that was interesting to
you, But in terms of what they had to offer you a naturum,
you obviously get the first fight with Paro. I don't think anybody's gonna look
at Paro and say he's not a good fighter, but he's not maybe on
your level necessarily. But besides that, the guys that it seems to me
as I look at the roster that Natural has. If he signs Mattias,
obviously that's gonna be a big fight for both of you guys. He has
Catterall now, who he just signed, that's obviously the top contender. They
have Richards and Hitchins, who's been making a lot of noise, he's undefeated.
Are those the sort of other than Montana Love is there who's maybe fighting
Richards and Hitchins this summer? Are those the sort of names that they like
penciled in and said, these are the kind of guys are gonna offer you.
Yeah, of course I don't think they pestled them, all of them
because it's only a three fight. Oh right, No, I don't mean
I know that. I'm just saying, but though, yeah, so really
it'll really it'll just be it'll be the second fighter, like all those names
will probably only be narrowed down to really like the second fight, because the
third fight, like I said, it shouldn't be Matias. Oh, if
it's not Matias, it shouldn't be somebody somebody else, like a big fight,
you know. So of course obviously we have all power roll next month.
Then after that it'll be somebody and then maybe we can hopefully we can
get them a Tias fight, right um so um. But and then but
another thing I signed with Eddie. Eddie, a lot of the promoters they
have, they have big eagles, right, they don't want to work with
other class like fighters exactly, Yeah, they do, right, But Eddie,
I feel like Eddie would pick up the phone if it's a major fight.
I say, Eddie, look I want Josh Tailor. Man, I
gotta get johs tail Let's make the Johs Tailor fight happen, Eddie. I
feel like Eddie as at least he's gonna try to make that fight happen.
He'll really really try. He'll like, he'll gonna call Bip, He'll call
Todd the Buffet. He'll like, Man, let's let's make this fight happen.
You know. So it's like I said it with the mental it's just
more It's just more freedom, you know. That's that's kind of it's sort
to Some people might say, you know, if you really really want to
tailor in the short term, and of course you don't know if he's gonna
win the fight come June against Tiafimo, they would say, why didn't you
sign with top Rank, because he would be he's with them. You could
definitely make that fight if you're all in the same umbrella. Well, it
was because the Toy Rank deal was just longer, I think I was.
It was just I feel like I was gonna get stuck in something long term.
Oka. And so if I after these three fights, I can still
go to right if I want, you know, fty street fights, I'll
be I'll be right in an fty street fights. I'll be right back in
the same boat again. I'll be a free agent. You know. Um,
if every hopefully everything goes well, I have I'll have three more fights.
If I get them with tears, I'll have another belt and I'll be
a free agent. So the thing is what my plan is that, Um,
I can go knocking on whoever's doing again with another belt and with three
more fights on my on my resume with a whole other belt. So guess
what the numbers they gave me. They're gonna be time Street. It's time
and you're obviously you're betting on yourself. My question is those three fights,
is there a time frame in which they're supposed to take place? By it
less than they Okay, well that's great because that means you're active. Um,
that's terrific. Let me, I want to wrap it up with this,
just just to talk because you do have a fight coming up. We
can't ignore Liam Paro. He's gonna be in the ring throwing punches at you.
Uh, just give me your general thoughts about Parlo. He really is
not I've seen him fight before, but he's only got the one win in
my mind that really resonated at all, which was the Brocks first run knockout.
He maybe a little bit of a lesser win against Alamar. What are
your thoughts about him as your first title defense. I didn't know, honestly,
man, I ain't do nothing about him, But I don't look.
No, I don't never overlook nobody, just because this is a huge fight.
Man, this I think this is gonna be a real big event in
the Wallace that night. You know, we got a lot of people coming
out, so I can't disappoint. I can't go out there disappoint nobody.
I definitely can't go out there and loose. So I mean, I'm training
just like it's on, you know, like like it's the best person in
the world and all the second best in the world that won for you.
I'm training just like that. So you know, I don't I don't know
nothing about him, but I mean I'm I'm training just like I always trained.
And one last thing, just your thoughts about you know you have fought
at home in New Orleans before, but it's been a while and not as
a newly minted champion. How excited are you just to be in the hometown.
I mean, I actually cover the fight New Orleans a long long time
ago. When Roy Jones box there, you know, it's a real underrated
fight city. It seems to me, Yeah it is. I mean the
boxing coach isn't there. I mean I was the like I was the first
world champion um from New Orleans and like since Winni Pastronto. Okay, so
that's a long time ago. You know he trained with Ali. Of course
your history just like ye, so he tried Ali and all of them.
So you know that was a long long time nineteen sixty something. Um,
So it hasn't been on the map for a long time. But you know
that's what that's what I'm here for. I'm going to bring it, you
know, bring it back again. I brought it back in twenty eighteen.
We did a big thing on ESPN, and so now it's just it's just
gonna be a whole I think it's gonna be a whole different level that was
even before I was the world champion. I'm a two time world champion and
my profile is way bigger, and I just feel like everybody just want to
help and everybody wants to kind of fill up this arena, and it's a
way big arena. It's I think it's it's just gonna be a great night
overall for the whole city. Well, I certainly wish you the best of
luck in the fight. Wish you lucking getting the bigger fights that you want
over the course of this new contract with Matt Roum. Congratulations on the deal
and thank you very much for joining me. Wish you the best of luck.
Regius Man, Thank you man, great stuff. As always, you've
been rolling along and in if the Matias fight, which you've been talking about,
you talked about on the preview podcast that maybe that's not the next fight
right in the matchroom deal, but maybe the third fight Matias comes on board
theoretically with Matt room to Zone defends the w what to help Me WBA version?
Which one does Mattias has the IBF version, Matis has the IBF fight.
Actually, Matis was on his social media in the last three days talking
about how how much he wants Program okay, and when he won the title
a few you know, several months ago, he even said in the post
fight unprompted, he wants to fight Program. So it the if you follow
the bread crumbs, if you will, the comments from regis my own reporting,
the things that that he's been saying. The fighter has been saying it
feels like he's going to close a deal with Mattrium, which is gonna mean
that again, not in the next fight, but certainly within the content.
Let's put it like this regises contract with Mattrium, he said, calls for
three fights less than a year, which means coming this coming summer, the
one that's coming up in June, another fight before the end of this year,
and then another fight probably that would be theoretically first quarter issh of next
year, and that would mean that, yes, in that third fight,
we could very well see if that deal is consummated. I love that.
That's a great matchup. I hope it happens, and you know, props
to both guys because they want to take a tough opponent. And let me
tell you, if you're a junior welterweight, with all due respect all the
other it's a very deep weight class, as was discussed at length on the
showtime card, and you can just look it down, pick any kind of
set of rankings wherever you choose to look at them. It's just a great,
great, greatly deep weight class. You can mix and match, you
know, ten fifteen sixteen eighteen. Guys come up with good matches, but
h Mattias against program my mind is probably from an entertainment point of view,
the best fight you can make in the weight class. Sign me up on
that one. I would like that quickly. Some news and then some nostalgian
we're done here on the podcast, you are reporting that they are locking in
here. It's not announced yet, but an IBF lightweight title eliminator. We
mentioned George Cambosis being none too happy with Tony Weeks's stoppage of the Romero Barroso
fight. Cambosa is gonna be back in the ring coming up. Give us
some quick update on that. So. I'd recorded quite a while ago that
they were doing a deal for him and Maxi Hughes from the UK from England
to have this IBF eliminator fight. It was going to originally be in Australia
and they were, you know, trying to work out the deal and get
the date squared away. As it turns out, from what I am told
now, the folks that work with Tim Zoo, No No Limit Boxing,
George Ros they now basically have a lockdown on pay per view in Australia from
the big providers for domestic fights, which means if you are George Cambosis fighting
in Australia, you can't be on their pay per view platform. Means you
can only be on their pay per view platform in Australia if you're not fighting
in Australia. So that fight with Hughes and Cambosis is now going to take
place in the United States. He has done a contract extension with Lou Debella,
his promoter, who is now going to co promote George with top rank.
This fight between George and Maxie Hughes is to be a top ranked ESPN
card and it will take place in the United States. It will be July
twenty second in Shawnee, Oklahoma, and you know, George is looking to
try to get back on the winning track after the back to back losses to
Devin Haney in their undisputed title fights, the first one to unify all the
belts, the second one obviously in the immediate rematch. Maxie is a bit
of a veteran from the UK. He's got some losses, but he's on
a real good run lately. He's got seven wins in a row or so.
He's you know, knocked off some decent opponents and look, that's not
a bad fight. And but the thing it tells me also is that when
your top rank and you're the promoter of fighters, at least for the time
being of Devin Any, you have Vacilly Loma Chenko, you also have other
fighters in the weight class. You've got your course Stevenson obviously, who's soon
going to be the rainmaker, it seems to me in that weight class you're
looking to load up with your talent at one hundred and thirty five pounds.
And if you've now done a deal to be the co promoter of George Cambos's
junior and and he's going to be on one of your one of your shows
working with Debella, that just another chip in your reserves because if you're going
this is something that every promoter understands, not sure if all the fans quite
get this. If you are the promoter of one of the lynch pins of
a division, the best thing you can do is also have the guys in
and around who can fight each other or fight him to create the action and
the activity in that weight class. And by getting a guy like Cambosis,
who is a reputable fighter who's been in some good fights, who was no
question of unified champion, and now he's part of your stable. You can
maybe make him hey there and by the way, it won't shock me if
he sticks with top Ring for a little while. Then maybe eventually he goes
to one forty and down the road we see a rematch between him and Tithemo
Lopez Good being one other nugget here, Liam Smith, what is believed the
British media is saying a back injury, a slight back injury for what it's
worth, in training, has postponed briefly the Chris you Bank fight, the
rematch of the knockout, the surprising upset knockout by Liam Smith when they fought
earlier this year. So you're reporting this, have they confirmed this? They
move out back announce it. Yeah, Boxer which is the promoter of the
of the fight, and they put on the first fight. Uh, they
announced it, they didn't announce the injury. I've read the same reports and
heard the same thing that it's some kind of as as William said in his
statement when the when the postpone was announced from June seventeenth to July first,
he called it a niggle. I guess that's a British like you got a
little bit of a problem. I've never really did. To me, I
got worried when I hear about when I hear the word back and minor,
I'm always to me, that's always us as a red flag because back injury.
So in the US injury vernacular in sports, we call it a tweak
or a twinge. They do seriously call it. What is that a niggle?
A niggle in my back? Ouch, babe, I can't train this
week. We got to move the fight back. So again they're again,
they're postponing it two weeks June seventeenth to July one. It's still going to
be Sky Sports box Office, a pay per view in the UK. Still
no definitive outfit for an American broadcast. The first fight was, of course
string on the zone in the United States. We'll see if they are able
to pick up the rematch or perhaps it will go elsewhere. In any event,
you know, not the worst thing ever. I mean, he never
likes sea fights get phoned. But his postponed. But as long as you're
able to get it back on track for two weeks later, and they're keeping
the rest of the card in the same schedule, so everybody's gonna be delayed.
You've got the undisputed women's super middleweight fight with Franchion Cruise on that card,
and some other notable, you know, somewhat notable fights on there too.
So two weeks not two weeks postponment, not a huge deal. July
first, now for that rematch in the UK, all right, without any
more delay. We've had a very busy show. Let's spend a couple of
minutes talking about the anniversary on this one. May fourteenth, the Sunday that
we're doing this. We've released it into Monday, two thousand and five,
almost twenty years ago, my man the Wink, Ronald Winky Wright, former
two division world champ Boxing Hall of Famers, scored arguably the most impressive win,
if not the biggest win of his career. You were there as he
beat Felix Trinidad. Now two days ago, we were popping up Trinidad's knockout
of William Joppy. You were there for that electric atmosphere. This was the
opposite. This was everybody thought Trinidad should win, and Winky dominated the fight.
You were ringside by the way. We have talked about this before on
the podcast I'm gonna prop up my friend Jason. My friend Jason listens to
us from time to time, Jason for work reasons. That week in two
thousand and five was in Puerto Rico, was in San Juan, and the
night of that fight, as he related to me, was just bonkers everywhere
in San Juan. They had to fight on in like a town square on
a big TV. They're waving the flags like you talked about at Madison Square
Garden when Trinidad fought there. And he said, as that fight wore on
because Jason lived here in the Tampa Bay area with me, and Jason got
to meet Winkie right through me. At one point he's like the wink put
it on him, and by like the ninth round, the tenth round,
they're throwing their flags down in this town square and leaving they knew it was
a shoutout. So there's my back half of that. You were ringside for
Winki's arguably biggest, most important win at least to that point in his career.
What about Yeah, well, for a couple of things, but number
one, Winky was a one division champion at junior middleweight undisputed back in the
day when it was three belts, with his two first big victory over Shane
Mosley followed by the rematch one junior middleway titles twice because he earlier had been
the WBO title holder at a time where it didn't carry the same kind of
weight as it did as it does now. Anyway, Look, that was
a big fight. That was That was a huge deal. A couple of
a little background of what was going on there. So yeah, Felix Trinidad,
he had beaten Joppy as we talked about last week. As I mentioned,
sometimes you're the windshield, sometimes you're the bug, and this fight against
Winky Tito was in fact the bug. But he beat Joppy obviously got knocked
out by Bernard Hopkins. Had one more fight after that and a homecoming against
Sharifi, which the anniversary also was a few days ago, a former title
holder just annihilated in in Puerto Rico, his last fight of his career in
his home country, home island. But after that fight against Shariq, he
had then retired for like two and a half years. You know, everybody
kind of thought he would come back, but you never knew for sure,
but he finally came back. He had the big win and a huge event
against Ricardo my worka very very popular, exciting, tremendous battle, but uh,
you know, dynamite action fight, but clearly Trinidad the winner. I
talked about the atmosphere of Madison Square Garden for the William Joppy fight. The
atmosphere for the Maorga fight was was bonkers also, I mean just on the
same level in many ways. I always remember the first bell ringing for that
fight and the entire crowd just standing up at the moment the bell ring in
any event, but he was going to come. He didn't retire after the
Myor fight. He came right back. That would the Miriorga fight was the
end of four October. He comes back for the Winkie fight in May of
oh five. He immediately wanted to fight Winkie right now. Nobody was calling
out Winkie right so you gotta respect Trinidad for doing that. And you know,
after that loss, he then retired for another long, long stretch for
like almost three years before he came back and had the final fight against Roy
Jones, which he retired for good after. But the Winky Right fight.
That was a WBC middleweight title eliminator. Winky Uh you know had moved up
from junior middleweight. He had had This was like the culmination of what was
a tremendous run for for the Winkster. Well, I've always he's always been
a fighter. I liked I liked him because even though he boxed, he
was not a big culture obviously, but he would stand in the pocket and
dare you to hit him. It was like, you know, Pernell Whittaker,
very very difficult to hit, always to the shoulders, old school tactician.
Yes. Yes, So he beat Shane Mosley, became undisputed, beat
him again in the rematch, then after the rematch when he moved up to
one hundred and sixty, and the next fight after the two Mosley fights,
where now he's involved. He's got an HBO contractor it's close to the HBO
contract. He's getting regular love. He's making seven figure pay days. He
goes up against Tito Trinidad. It's the main event on pay per view.
Obviously Trinidad is the A side, But that was like a pretty big deal
at the MGM. They had a big crowd. It was a you know,
a well received fight is my recollection. In terms of the public expectations.
You got the great boxer against the great brawler, but Tito was the
favorite. I honestly don't remember who I picked, but I'm quite certain whoever
I picked, I certainly gave Winky hell of a chance to win because that
jab and the fact that that he was such a consummate boxer and also was
known, you know, he had a pretty decent chin, and Trinidad was
a great puncher. But you know, I felt like, okay, this
might you know, be competitive. Whoever is gonna win? But then the
bell rang, my man, and this was I mean, all these almost
twenty years later, when people talk to me about what's the biggest wipe out
you've ever seen between two like star level pound for pound type fighters that didn't
have a knockout, it always comes to mind, is Winky Wright putting it
on Tito Trinidad for twelve rounds. Tito took a beating. His eye got
messed up in that fight. He took I don't remember what the copy box
stats where we could probably look that up, felt like ten thousand. Like
his head was like a fucking bobblehead by the end of that fight, just
bouncing around the line. I love. It was like Lionel Richie all night
long with that job. Pop pop pop pop pop after round after round,
scoring hitting and not getting hit. It was a clinic. It was a
clinic by the wink The scores of that fight one twenty to one oh seven
and two scores of one nineteen to one away and the only reason why Trinida
I didn't get the clean one hundred twenty was because he was docked a point
by the referee for a low blows at one point in round number nine.
Um, all take the back that Trinidad was docked the point, so he
didn't you know, it wasn't one oh seven on those other rounds. It
was as comprehensive as one sided, as big of an ass kicking, as
much of a beatdown as you could possibly have minus a knockdown, and by
the way, that propelled Winkie, who then went on He had a kind
of an easier fight in there, but then he had to fight with Jermaine
Taylor, which he kind of I scored at a draw for the middleweight championship.
They never had the rematch because of Winky's lunatic financial demands where we came
up with the terminology of the Winky Wright school of boxing business that I always
talked about back in the day, and I said, do with those chats
back in my early days at ESPN. And then he just had a few
more fights after that, the Quarte fight lost to Hops, lost wings.
But really the apex that we talked about this, like we talked about with
Canelo, What's what was the apex of his career? Like what at what
point do you look back on the Hall of Famer's career and say, on
that night he reached a very peak, the absolute apex of his career before
he started down. So let's say the other side of the mountain. And
in the case of Winky Wright, a Hall of Famer or I was proud
to vote for, he reached, in my opinion, the apex of his
career on that night twenty years ago, made fourteen, two thousand and five,
almost twenty years ago, when he rattled around Philip Trenand's head like a
bubblehead for twelve rounds and beat the great Trinidad easy. And I've and I've
talked to you about this before because as I cut my teeth early in my
career as a sports radio host in Tampa Bay with Winky based out of Saint
Pete's Boxing Club with Dan and the late Mike Birmingham, and this was their
first world champ. This was their guy. And I still remember this,
Dan Raphael I had Winky Wright in the studio with me talking to him on
a radio when nobody outside of Tampa Bay really knew who he was because he
was only fighting in Europe. He could not get a US fight contract.
He was fighting in Europe. He wasn't on TV in the United States at
all at times, and you talk about his lunacy with his financial demands at
times, he was fighting fights over in Europe and making like twenty thousand dollars.
Listen, he fought in Germany, he fought in England, Yes,
and France. He fought in Namibia, in Africa. Obviously, he had
fights in the United States. But he was the epitome, the road warrior.
He could not get the big fight. And yeah, and you have
to a tip of the hat to Shane Mosley, who was a competitor at
heart also when when he kept trying to get a big fight and Shane Mosley
was looking for a competent competition. He gave Winky Right the opportunity. Now
Winky had a belt, but Shane Mosley didn't have to do that fight by
no means. Shane Mosey was you know, was hot at that time.
He could have just done anything he could have you know, he didn't need
to have that fight as the point, I mean, he went in with
the IBF title, Shane had the other two, but he didn't have to
do it, and it became like a big deal. It was the first
undisputed title fight in the Jinger middleweight division for you know, many many years,
I want to say from memory correct, was almost like thirty years when
they finally fought, since he had been that element of a unification in that
weight class. And the thing about it was it was such a big win
that that again he had other accomplishment, but that that was the fight,
the win for a Winkie that in minds of many was like, yeah,
yeah, one hundred percent. We got to vot him in the Hall of
Fame because of his defensive prowess, because of the undisputed because of the rematch
win over Shane, but the Trinidad is the lynchpin victory of his entire career,
even bigger in many respects than what happened against Sugar Shane Mosley. But
Wink right, great fighter. Philip trinadd was a great fighter too. You
gotta give him prompts for taking the fight. I mean, I'll quote our
favorite fictional character, the Great Duke Evers from Rocky two. Should have had
that conversation with Tito Trinidad about before he signed that contract. He's all wrong
for us, baby. We don't need a man like that in our life.
Yeah, and Trinidad defied that and he took him on, and look
what happened. So, yeah, eighteen years ago, love the Wink and
the Wink still around in the Tampa Bay area, playing golf and going to
the big fights, et cetera, and enjoying life. And good for him
because he finally got those big flights. We didn't evention him. We don't
have time here. We're gonna get out of here. He beat Fernando Vargas
that night in an HBO main event in nineteen ninety nine, and they robbed
him of the decision that night. So Winky finally got some big paydays,
etc. And some recognition because of the of the skill he had and good
good for that, A happy ending on that, and some great nostalgia.
Listen, very busy show, my lord a ton here, rate us in
review us. By the way, if you enjoyed this, if you listened
all the way through, including hearing Regis Progray on with Dan earlier in a
one on one conversation, you don't know when We're gonna occasionally get some of
these conversations as we go along and put them up midweek in addition to the
weekend preview or the weekend recap that we have Friday and Monday. So if
you are rating us, reviewing us, and you're subscribing and following us,
then you will get content when it's up during the week, just like that
conversation. Great stuff all the way around. On the controversy with the Tony
Week, stoppage, the big win by Janabec, by Ko, everything that
we had here on the show. We got Hainy and Lomachinko later this week
to preview and talk about. So you're ready to have a good week.
You're all good? Yeah, we got we got that undisputed fight here in
the States we got the women, Katie Taylor moving up to one hundred and
forty for the undisputed championship fight against Cameron in the UK. So we got
two important cards and keep on moving along at what do we call it,
TJ. We call it fight season. It is fight season right now.
So thank you Dan, Raypheel, have a great week. All good.
Thank you my friend you bet TJ. Talcular brother. We will see you
soon on the Big Fight Weekend preview. Thank you all for finding us,
follow or subscribe Apple Podcasts, Google Podcasts, Spotify. This is the Fight
Breaks Unite recap as we go out here. But you want to be on
the Big Fight Weekend podcast week search us out, follow, subscribe, great
content here for now for Big Dan. I'm TJ. Reeves. Enjoyed the
week. Haney Lomachenko discussion later in the week right here on the Big Fight Weekend Podcasting